Sex Can Be An Amazing Tool To Learn To Be More Yourself And RECEIVE Love

Here’s a letter from Beth with my answer – and it’s all around sex and how sex works in our brains, our hearts – and how it can illuminate our lives or shut us down…

Hi Rori,

A couple of things you have sent in the past couple of days have been exactly what I was used to doing with my first husband. One is what you describe in this email. It’s like you are looking into my past. The other was the one about trying to fill the quiet. I had extreme anxiety over the quiet and always tried to find something to say to fill it.

Needless to say, it was a strained and unhappy marriage that I stayed in miserably for 13 years before I moved out. I think that relationship was so toxic and so damaging to my self-esteem that it set the stage for the years to come. I left him in 1987 and have never had a successful relationship since, although I did get married two more times since then. To build up my self esteem I got into the habit of jumping in bed with every man that looked at me twice.

I shudder to think of my past and the habits I fell into. I was a virgin when I got married at 18 and was raised to protect my virtue, so the fact that I have slept with many men (I lost count but pretty sure it is over 50) is pretty horrific to me, and I still don’t trust myself. ( I also know I am very, very lucky not to have contracted an STD from any of these men because I also didn’t not practice safe sex. I know better but didn’t want to do anything to “ruin” what I hoped for every time I slept with someone) I just got out of a 6 month friends with benefits “relationship” that ended up breaking my heart once again.

I’d like to think if I had been educated in the way to communicate with a man that I wouldn’t have suffered so much all these years. I’m 56 now and still afraid I’ll never have a man that will love me the way I want to be loved. I have your “How to have the relationship…” book. I copied it off the internet after purchasing it last year and started to get into it and then once again got into a series of one nighters and a couple of heartbreaks while the book set in my bag untouched.

I am hoping this is the beginning of the end of my disastrous love life. There is a man that I have seen on the average of about once a month since meeting him in January. He calls every week to two weeks, sends the very occasional text message and when we are together treats me like a queen. I enjoy him very much and I COULD fall in love with him if the circumstances lend themselves to it. I am going to assume, being the expert that you are, that you are aware of the chemical changes in the body associated with sex and why that causes us women to fall into toxic relationships with men that don’t love us.

I have recently learned this for myself and decided that if I were to protect my heart and play my cards right, so to speak, that I needed to not fall into that trap again with this man. I know from my history that if I have sex with him that the dopamine and pitocin is going to take over and I will fall in love with him which could lead to another broken heart. I just don’t want to go there again. He is the nicest man I have ever met in my life. I could give you a couple of dozen examples of that but suffice it to say, I really have never known anyone like him, which I think is one of several reasons I have been able to say no to him. He seems to really like me, and he did try to sleep with me and I was very proud of myself to refuse. I told him point blank, “If you don’t want me to fall in love with you, then don’t have sex with me.”

I wouldn’t have said that to just any man. This one is really special. I’m in “like” with him at this point. If I never saw him again, I’d be a little sad but not devastated. Anyway, when I said that to him, he said, “It’s not that, we just need more time.” He has agreed with my no sex rule for now although he is clearly still wanting to and finds me very desirable. He is a very practical man and apparently has more self control than most men.

The big obstacle to overcome if anything ever comes of this is, he is 60 years old (a very young 60), never been married, never had children, I think has had little experience with women, just from the awkward way in which he talked to me in the beginning when he was still uncomfortable with me and from the obvious lack of experience in even the simplest of intimacy like kissing. That actually makes it easier to not sleep with him because I think if that ever happens, he will require a great deal of “teaching,” and I think he would be willing to learn but I am not going there until there is more promise of something to come. He is very happy and comfortable in his own skin and in the life he has carved out for himself.

He told me once, “if I ever complain about anything, kick me in the butt because I have nothing to complain about.” So for our friendship to progress to anything more, there is going to have to be something about me that he finds he can’t live without. I’d like to think maybe I’m the woman he’s waited for all of his life and that he’s just never known anyone he was that interested in since he was in his 20’s and had his heart broken by the woman he was supposed to marry that ditched him. I think it set him up to be a bachelor for all these many years.

I’m hoping that I’m going to learn to be the kind of woman that a man this nice would want to spend the rest of his life with because I really don’t want to die without having experienced true and satisfying love. I’m not sure how I first found you but I keep all of your emails. I just need to buckle down and study the tools you have given me.

In the meantime, I am still fighting the old me that would hop back in bed with my recent toxic relationship if he gave me any indication that he wanted me other than for sex. Even that is hard. I know he would sleep with me again. That is clear. The sex was great, at least for him, and he said I was “a lot of fun in bed.” (I’ve made having sex an artform which drives men crazy, but I rarely ever get comfortable enough to get much more out of it than just the momentary enjoyment of having someone hold me and touch me and want me.)

I have an open invitation to sleep at his house, with no pressure but I put the pressure on myself. I know him well enough to know that if I didn’t initiate it, it wouldn’t happen. He has always left it up to me. I realize now that the sex was a means to and end, with the end being, I got the snuggling and comfort of feeling cared about afterwards. At least he wasn’t the type that rolled over and turned his back on me, but he clearly doesn’t love me, at least not romantic love.

He cares about me as a friend. I had a verbal argument with myself tonight because I’m still tempted to go back. I could easily have gone there tonight and he would have welcomed me and shown me a lot of affection, but, with the understanding he still doesn’t want to be in love with me and never will.

So you can see, I am in a daily struggle with myself over what I could easily have that would end up going nowhere, and what MIGHT turn into the love that I have always hoped for. What makes it doubly hard is that I live a very difficult life with a seriously ill adult daughter, and poverty level income. Every day of my life is an emotional and financial struggle. That only makes me want to seek that momentary comfort of my friend even though I know it’s not what I really want or need.

Another very attractive part of this man who is my friend and might end up being my lover is that he is also financially secure, as well as the nicest man on the planet. I have never had a relationship with a man that was financially secure. I have ended up being the one doling out the money in most of these instances. This man wouldn’t dream of allowing me to take a dollar out of my pocket for anything. That has never happened to me.

So you see Rori, I am probably pretty typical specimen of how to do it all the wrong way, although with my sexual history I probably am on the extreme end of the spectrum. I truly want this downward spiral to end. I am hoping, with your help, and God’s, that I can turn my life around, stay out of the wrong bed, (my friend) and hopefully end up in the right one, whether that is this very nice man or not.

Oh yes, I’m not out looking anymore, just as you taught me not to do and so far have been able to not chase after this man but let him come to me when he is ready. I never call him and rarely text him, unless it’s in answer to something he texted and asked me about. So I’m already ahead of my old game. I know patience is a virtue and it will take a lot of that as well as a lot of self control to stay out of my old habits and form new ones.

I know this was long, but I wanted to tell you the beginning of my story. Hopefully one day I will be able to write you with the “end” of my story, being one of the princess who lived happily ever after. I just glad that I actually take the time to read your emails and keep them. I just have to buckle down and study so I can continue to change my ways.

Thanks for what I’ve learned from you so far!!

Here was my answer:

Beth – here’s the key for you in what you wrote:

I’ve made having sex an art form which drives men crazy, but I rarely ever get comfortable enough to get much more out of it than just the momentary enjoyment of having someone hold me and touch me and want me.

Men only care about how they’re affecting YOU – in other words, if you could work on your art form in a way that involves YOU relaxing into and experiencing pleasure, pleasuring yourself, using him and his body to get pleasure – this would all turn around.

I used sex much the same way as you for most of my life – and it wasn’t until I practiced doing NOTHING but breathing and experiencing orgasms and letting myself receive that I was able to transfer that feeling into everyday life.

Just practicing alone is terrifically helpful – and if you can handle practicing with a man (or woman) that would be even MORE helpful! Just look at it like that, and not as a WAY to get to anything.

Sex is a Tool, too – see the Sensual Meditation in my ebook….

Beth – can I post your letter and my answer on my blog (anonymously of course – give me a name if you like so you’ll recognize the post when it shows up…)

Love, Rori


Hi Rori,
I think it’s so great that you actually take the time to answer me. It just wraps up the whole package very nicely.

I would be happy for you to share my letter. If anyone can learn from me and avoid some of the terrible mistakes I’ve made or even just recognize they are making them, by reading about what I’ve done, then it’s worth having made the mistakes if it helps even one other person.

I don’t care if you use the name Beth. It’s pretty generic and could be anyone anywhere. So I’m not worried about it.

The one time I had a really great sex life with someone, I was completely uninhibited with him and of course, he turned me on like no other ever had. I don’t think I ever failed to orgasm with him. My problem has been, with most men I never really got close enough to someone emotionally to tell him what I want or need.

Always afraid if I was selfish I would turn him off. Afraid if I was that open that I would embarrass myself. I actually have some new insight into that thinking. My “friend” I just cut it off with, told me to play with myself explaining that the more I enjoyed myself the more he enjoyed me. Still I was afraid to tell him what he needed to do to make me orgasm because he, like most men I’ve been with, think they know what to do.

Us women are different and we don’t all react to the same things but I guess I was afraid to bruise his ego by telling him I wanted him to do something different. Also, I had a very hard time relaxing enough to do things that embarrassed me, which strangely enough only had to do with MY pleasure.

I did most anything for him, as I did will all the men I slept with. The last 2 or 3 times I slept with him, I started to guide him. The last time we had sex, he gave me the best orgasm of my life by doing what I’ve begged men to do to me in the past.

He finally listened. What I had always said was I wanted a man to make me beg, but I’ve never had a man that really wrapped his head around that and I never really pushed it or explained in detail what I wanted. My friend finally got it and drove me to a place I have never been before.

When it was over, I sobbed like a baby, partly because it was such an intense orgasm, the thing I had begged for and because, I knew it was the last time I would sleep with him, because he didn’t love me and I loved him.

So I learned more from this “relationship” as it was, about what to do in bed. He actually taught me things about myself I didn’t know and I learned to ask for what I wanted. Now I have to learn to translate that to a real relationship with someone I really love and trust. I don’t have someone like that YET but the man who I have been dating casually could end up to be the one. Whatever happens.

I know that to get what I want I have to do things differently. You are helping me learn to do that. I just heard the quote this morning,

“If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you always got, and you’ll always feel what you always felt”

Well, I intend to change what I’ve always done because I want something different than I always have had and I want to feel differently than I have always felt! It’s time for a new me.

As for practicing, I do practice by myself some. I don’t think I can handle practicing with someone else unless it’s someone I want to give my heart to. I get attached when the hormones kick in and I don’t need another heart break. I know myself well enough to know that is what would happen.

Feel free to use me as an example.

I thank you for your guidance.

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1,250 Comments to “Sex Can Be An Amazing Tool To Learn To Be More Yourself And RECEIVE Love”

  1. 1: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:24am

  2. 2: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Don’t know that I would want to use it as a tool

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:25am

  3. 3: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel squirmy reading this
    Too close for comfort

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:37am

  4. 4: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    I only enjoy sex when I’m in love with the man.
    This I know from 42 years of being sexually active. I have been in every configuration possible. I don’t need more research….

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:37am

  5. 5: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    I have learned a lot about my body and what it is capable of since my divorce. I never fully relaxed during sex before, not the way i do now. I trust myself more now and allow the sensations to consume me. I like the way it feels to really let go.

    BTW – I did get to meet the Drill Instructor – what a stud he was – lol Whew! We did not have any time alone – although he did invite me to come back onto base my myself one night, I did not take him up on it, but boy can a girl use that as a fantasy!!! hot, hot hot . . .

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:58am

  6. 6: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I use sex as a tool for my own expansion on a daily basis. I was not comfortable to do this until being with a man I fully trust.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:01am

  7. 7: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t like the sex as a tool and using him and his body to get pleasure. There’s so much more to it than that for me. :-( This is a very sad answer from Rori (for me). What about HIM? Using his body? :-( Men have feelings too and don’t like to be used anymore than we do. Use him for his money (he treats on dates), use him for his ability to please us sexually, use him for practice, use him…

    and per the last article, you don’t even have to be attracted to him. I struggled with that one but understood in some circumstances how what we’re attracted to can be harmful but…this is just like adding another layer to everything that made me uncomfortable about continuing to date a man that we’re not attracted to so we can practice.

    I don’t know, this is hitting the wrong nerve today. I think we have a much better chance of manifesting the relationship we want and deserve if we treat ourselves and the men in our lives as loving, beautiful human beings. We can’t, I don’t believe, find a connection by using men for anything. I really believe we have to feel our feelings, learn to trust those feelings, learn to act based on those feelings and allow a man to experience our feelings with us to form a deeper connection with him.

    I don’t believe we should be having sex because it is a tool to use when practicing with men. I think that’s setting women out to really hurt men (not to mention hurt themselves). If those men were just using our bodies for pleasure and practicing with us, we’d be so hurt and angry. I’m sure they feel the same way.

    I just don’t agree with giving advice to a woman who has struggled with sex as a way of finding love, to use sex as a tool…

    I don’t agree with it and don’t like it…at all. :-(

    And I’m going to have to stop writing about it before I say something I shouldn’t say here.

    This one does not sit well with me…it reminds me too much of the PUA work I’ve read.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:03am

  8. 8: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Wow interesting to see shut downs

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:05am

  9. 9: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    When I see that I feel leg tightening and queasiness

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:06am

  10. 10: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Lol omg !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:07am

  11. 11: Goddess LilyNo Gravatar says:


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:09am

  12. 12: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Well I Love the words there ‘Using him and his body to get pleasure’

    It finally CLICKED for me and made it okay to start going for what I want w sex. Ive felt stuck for soooo long. What a relief.

    This helped it helped it really helped. I finally get it so shd Does mean that so it IS ok to do that, to Ask for that focus on that, maybe even give some directions on that… Ahhh yes I can so do that ohhhh

    Heaven is coming to men , literally

    Sooo excited this opened me up more there. Validated me and gave me confidence….

    Thank you Rori you rock

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:11am

  13. 13: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel gleeful :)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:13am

  14. 14: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel scared too to be one that ‘gets’ it in a crowd of triggered ladies who don’t get it and are truggered

    I feel scared of being attacked

    I have an urge to yell at everyone so that they will be intimidated and refrain from attacking me

    Shackles up !

    So interesting !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:14am

  15. 15: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Wow!! Really????

    “I feel scared too to be one that ‘gets’ it in a crowd of triggered ladies who don’t get it”

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:17am

  16. 16: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    my assistant, who has been very supportive of me while i got over QZ, really really doesn’t like that i’m going to see him on Friday. She wants him to apologize on his knees, etc.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:23am

  17. 17: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yes Mercedes really . Lay off.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:23am

  18. 18: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t see that as ‘using a man’. A good man is so happy to give, in a lot of ways, that only seeing a woman happy is actually a reward for him.
    The best men I have dated/went out with and was physical with, made it all about me and they were only happy if they could please me.
    I am not selfish but the rest of it was just a bonus for them, at least that’s how it seemed.
    So, no, I don’t get triggered by that post at all.
    I would feel pretty peeved if I gave my body to a man and he would ‘feel used’. Why on earth would he?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:25am

  19. 19: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i don’t really want to be assumed or judged as triggered or not getting something just cuz i don’t have the same world view as someone else

    it must suck to need everything just-so according to what you see as right

    although, that’s me judging and making assumptions

    oooooooh what a trap.

    i think it would feel better to just shrug and take a nice deep breath instead.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:25am

  20. 20: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Most of the men I have been with hold back and try not to climax until they are certain that I have first – I’ve been told, and I believed them, that it was the best part for them – seeing me and feeling me and hearing me take my pleasure from them.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:28am

  21. 21: Radiant RisingNo Gravatar says:

    Popped in again, Mercedes thank you for articulating that. My sentiments exactly. I don’t think not feel popping in on the blog is good for me anymore. The advice and reactions to it just get hurled on me. It is *my* fault for *thinking* in such a way. What a load of hooey. Seems like all coaches do that. Including the Reiki teacher who crossed his boundaries with me and the teachers who tried to groom me for sex work. It is *my* opinions or *thoughts* bringing this on. Don’t ever question. Always second guess *yourself* but never the teachings because it is just coming from you anyways. Well I am through with questioning and second guessing *myself*.

    I am doing just fine in my love and dating life, thank you. I am new to the dating scene, because I did not want arranged marriage and wanted to experience falling in love and having the biggest say in who I spend my life with. I fought it all throughout my young adult life and am just now playing in the dating scene. I don’t have “the love that I want” not because of the *opinions* I hold on attraction and chemistry but because of what I just said above. I feel disappointed in Rori for questioning me like that, as all typical coaches seem to do, by making assumptions based on certain “patterns” rather than taking the time to verify the truth of the individual. Disagreeing with a teaching has nothing to do with “results”. This coaching is…just not for me. Yes I am “explaining” and that feels good. No more blog, and this spouting you can take to the sky as I am so done and do not care if this offends anyone. These teachings really sticks in my craw and I will post it. Ban me, put me in moderation, call me names or say that I am unfeminine who will never “get the love I want” I do not care. I feel this way of thinking and teaching (not addressing questions and just undermining the validity of those who ask) is harmful with a Capitol H. Good day.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:28am

  22. 22: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I actually had a joke going with my first boyfriend…he would always say: ‘please use me and abuse me’…jokingly of course. They love it, really.
    I can only see the unhealthy selfish ones being different..never had that experience.
    I once had a little affair with one of the hottest (and wealthiest) guys here (in fact, I just saw him again this weekend with a Model woman). I didn’t expect this but even he (who is used to getting a lot of female attention) was all about me. It was totally amazing…I felt guilty at the time. And now I would just smile and say ‘happy, thank you, more please’. Ha!!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:29am

  23. 23: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    And on top of that I’m triggered by something else you posted in the last thread, and I’m gona copy and process that here. This is not about you , or a fight. I want to use my personal space here to process MY patterns from my real life that get reflected in how I perceive the blog.

    Ps sorry this was just an experiment too to notice my ‘automatic’ communication, before I stop and choose my words.

    I intend tosh oft this communication, just noticing it now along with the tones of voices. ‘lay off’ sounded low like a movie character.. Wondering where I got it from ?

    There was also a pleasure in performing this way. My eyes feel slightly teary. There was a pleasure in running this script… Sooo interesting. Pffffu

    I may have seen someone do this and then there is pleasure when I do it since I’ve ‘gotten it’ now and get to experience ‘being them’ which wd be considered better than me for some reason.

    Perhaps I felt bad seeing the script run and putting myself in the ‘dominant’ position in the script feels pleasurable like yes I’m winning now… Hmmmm

    I feel guilty ! I feel excited . I feel worried…

    Worried I’ll ‘lose something’s by stopping these scripts that give me pleasure… The I got it… Maybe 8im American ? Pleasure


    Feeling through this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:31am

  24. 24: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve slept with 4 men, and only MyGuy was a selfish lover.

    I’ve concluded most men want you to get off. And more than 1x, if possible:)

    i get more triggered when they’ve been really workin hard and as a result have a hard time enjoying and reaching their own climaxes.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:31am

  25. 25: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    My triggers are repeated patterns for me that come off in my life. This situation sparked off one of those patterns for me.

    Its one of My Patterns, it has no reflection on the real life Mercedes Starla or anyone else. I don’t want to trigger anyone with this and was not planning on talking about it with anyone.

    It’s something that happens to me – getting triggered into this pattern – with regularity… And voila, it happened to me again here on blog .

    Hmmm I’m explaining this doesn’t feel quite good.

    I feel pretty seized up and terrified …

    How interesting

    Feeling through it

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:46am

  26. 26: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I dunno…I get a strong sense that sex is more pleasurable for BOTH of us when i’m using it as a tool to expand my emotional and physical self. I’m so in deep and juicy and it feels like his body is a tool of pleasure and I get so down into my primal body urges and physical sensations and I listen to what my nani is saying to me like “oh it feels best to move this way now” and the moans feel more real. And even now I am using it to expand my ability to feel emotion and sensation simultaneously and FEEL overwhelmed yet not GET overwhelmed and shut down. I am loving my overwhelmed feeling. This starts like little cherry bombs going off in my pelvis and grows and expands until it is fully putting off sparks right through my physical boundary.

    Now just imagine how this sex must feel for him. I don’t believe anyone can tell me his humanity is compromised in any way…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:46am

  27. 27: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I agree that most men will be very turned on by a woman having a good time
    And thats great
    BUT For me sex is about giving as well as receiving
    Actually, I feel the same about paying for dates too

    Give as well as take

    I CAN see where I have *overfunctioned* in the past, chased too hard, mothered, done it all, and thats not good, but neither is a complete sit back and just wait for stuff to come to you

    There has to be a happy medium, no?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:48am

  28. 28: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Cartoons are a way kids can pick up on social interaction, defending and putting others down, disrespecting etc… Hmmm

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:48am

  29. 29: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    Now that feels nice to read
    But, difference between you and Beth is that you are in a loving committed relationship

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:50am

  30. 30: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Yes, yes yes

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:51am

  31. 31: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Sigh. Yeah…It’s my own trigger.

    Bad girl.

    Selfish girl.

    My own judgements of self.

    The other day I actually ran this sentance through my head, during sex. Before a lady named rori ever posted it. “Mmm his pen1s is a tool for my pleasure.” and it turned me on. Way on. And it triggered a huge climax. And I did judge myself for that.

    This is coming up at the right time.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:54am

  32. 32: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    what is that please

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:55am

  33. 33: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘She contends that turning it on with anyone and everyone doesn’t really help us to date good quality men but really listening to our body when it shows us who/what we are attracted to is where the real potential for an amazing relationship comes from.’

    Hmmm and if it’s turned on to everyone then we cd still do this….

    If I turn it on e someone… It’s now turned on

    What if I turned in off w someone

    So don’t use my power of being turned on, let it happen without guidance or awareness or opening up from me…

    Then it be the being turned on to what I have opened up to before

    Why wouldn’t I use my huge lower of turn on?

    That feels bad and sad, like my power is not important

    Feels masculine, to not have that and ignore that huge power.

    And I notice I’m attracted to stiff like voice that reminds me of men I loved …

    I feel a bit panicked

    I want to ‘get’ the gift of my power of turn on fully.

    I fe afraid of this power.

    I feel afraid I’ll turn myself on to a man that feels ick

    I fe thrilled knowing I’m safe and that won’t happen, what will happen is glorious pleasure

    I feel terrified

    If I’m turned on to everyone…. Who won’t I be turned on to

    And if I’m not turned off to anyone…. People will think I’m icky and cheap for not being snobby

    They’ll think I’m dirty and diseased for hanging out w dirty diseased people


    What if I’m loved

    I love me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:55am

  34. 34: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, I actually agree with you.
    BUT…ever since I got here (US), I find that the best quality men actually get offended when I want to pay for anything. The guy yesterday didn’t know me from Adam and we went to a pretty nice place and it was NOT cheap..I felt bad and offeref to chip in.
    He started laughing and saying: ‘hey, you must be joking, that is my part and I thank you for taking the time to let me have such a wonderful evening’

    MrP did not let me pay for anything either even though he is always strapped…I realise after a while, if I offered, it was like I was taking away his manhood. So I stopped offering.

    Curly, OMG, he is old school in a major way. I offered change for the parking thing the other day and he actually jokingly snapped at me ‘I told you your money is not valid currency for me’ – and he once mentioned before, that a man who doesn’t pay at a date is just being disgusting (I found that pretty harsh language but they all seem to feel strongly about it).

    I stopped arguing..and realise that the currency the guys like is not my money, but clearly my company and my presence. I come from relationships where everything was always split 50/50…so believe me, this is unusual for me.
    But I do feel very much valued actually. And I never ask for anything or suggest expensive dates.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:57am

  35. 35: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I guess thats the difference between US and Europe

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:58am

  36. 36: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks ruth.

    I am also questioning, as I always do for stuff like this “Now that I am aware, and practicing this, would I practice the same way if I was CDing? I believe I would. Although, I trust myself not to abuse others in seeking my own pleasure. I would hardly seduce a man I didn’t care for, blow his mind with sensational sex and then drop him like “sorry, I was just using you for practice, i’m good now.”. :-p

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:59am

  37. 37: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Actually, I kind of enjoy being taken out nowadays and I am feeling far more relaxed when I see how much the men love it. When I am appreciative and tell them what a lovely time I had and so on, they thrive on it.
    I guess Sex is similar in some ways.
    It really is true that good men get a thrill out of giving, I can just see it all the time now.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:02pm

  38. 38: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Ahhhh clarity. I use the sex I am having to practice. Not just seeking sex to practice. At the same time, I believe if a woman is open with the man she could even seek sex for practice, if it could truly benefit her, and she is in an aware state of mind.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:03pm

  39. 39: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    It is certainly a different mindset
    I think we all like to give, male or female
    Its finding a balance, isnt it

    My tirggers with this post of Roris are different-its all about the using sex to get a cuddle and feel loved
    feels so icky to read and yet that was what I did for so long
    I feel so stupid and silly and worhtless

    Lots to heal

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:04pm

  40. 40: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Upset so cant type

    Might just sit with the feelings for a bit

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:05pm

  41. 41: TamNo Gravatar says:

    35 Ruth, yes I believe so…although the more old-fashioned types in Europe will also take the women out. I wonder when it all changed.
    I also don’t know how it would be in a longer term relationship over here, for sure things would change somehow….especially in a marriage and maybe with common bank accounts and so on. I guess it would blend more.
    Courtship is definitely different. Actually, I NEVER had a guy accept to split a check. Only one guy, but we had a competition and he won a drink – else he wouldn’t have either.
    I have been on a gazillion of dates here.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:05pm

  42. 42: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel terrified .

    I feel like winds are sweeping me


    I feel guilty and sad for having spoken that way.

    It was just wat I imagined, and it keeps me protected yes.

    And I don’t know what’s gona happen after. Perhaps an argument will escalate. But I feel in control. I feel braced and prepared to fight it out. No getting hit over the head wen I’m not looking.

    But it will probably have the same effect it has had in the past… Or will it ?

    I feel confused

    Sometimes I shut down. Sometimes I attack this way.

    I could change all this by being vulnerable

    Thank you Daria for expressing and noticing my pattern

    Yay !

    I’m still feeling scared and I love my fear

    How interesting ! I feel scared

    I’m feeling terrified

    I’m feeling overwhelmed

    I’m feeling like the floor blew open and huge winds are coming un and I’m covering my face…

    Ooh cool stuff

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:06pm

  43. 43: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I desire to not judge myself for seeking ways to move and feel that bring me top notch pleasure and ecstasy. I can do that. I also feel a little giggly because there are things I do that people may see as “giving pleasure” yet I see it as taking pleasure. I doubt the man would have complaints in regard to my “taking” pleasure and feeling turned on and up in this.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:07pm

  44. 44: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I also think that when a guy shows consistent effort, taking me out etc., after a while it feels good for me to do something for them, like cook or bring some food or wine or whatever.
    I prefer it this way because by nature I am not a ‘taker’, and it actually makes me feel great to give. So I don’t stop myself.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:08pm

  45. 45: TamNo Gravatar says:

    43, yes Glowstix, that resonates with me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:09pm

  46. 46: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Yeah. I hear you…Been there. I believe in you, you can heal these things!

    Love you!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:09pm

  47. 47: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I not – on the surface – worried about abusing others because I know time w me is a gift, like a blessing from the Virgin Mary.

    When I do get worried its my patterns fear of being attacked, guilt tripped, abandoned

    Yay for noticing !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:10pm

  48. 48: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    well, Tam, it goes back to does CD ing “work” in Europe
    Smile does seem to be managing it so far

    Yes, older chaps(late forties and on) do seem to expect to pay over here

    You know, I think I have a bit of a block on this as I have *always* made sure i have my financial independence
    And Im kind of having an issue with a man “paying for my company”.Bad associations.
    what an odd trigger, but it is one

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:10pm

  49. 49: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    thank you
    Its my old self esteeem issue yet again
    Gah, does this one ever go away

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:12pm

  50. 50: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Hell yeah that’s what’s magical about receiving, it allows for effortless giving that’s way more previous feeling than any effort full giving from my part…

    Ahh Daria I love you

    Mami I feel scared of these women’s criticisms !

    I’m here while you feel that way

    How interesting you feel that wa
    Ohh starting to feel better …

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:12pm

  51. 51: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    During the last couple years of marriage I used my sexuality to cry out for affection. I ended up feeling used up and abandoned. I also adopted an overtly sexual persona because I didn’t believe I could turn him on if I didn’t do this. I felt scared. Like he’d never sleep with me again if I didn’t do this. And I feel gross with these images in my head.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:13pm

  52. 52: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Stixy, I hear ya

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:15pm

  53. 53: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Gives me such enormous hope Stixy, to know one can come through this
    You did

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:16pm

  54. 54: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Nanny Cd texted me last night to ask to be official boyfriend and girlfriend ‘before he gets friend zoned ‘


    He still didn’t kiss me last nite

    But he’s been totally there for me , picking me up when I’m stranded late nite twice in a row, getting me food w most of his budget and less for him… Being sweet to me and saying I’m amazing and he wants to marry me…

    So I feel worried I’m gona get abandoned now after I give the no gf speech

    And I feel excited to to see what happens next

    Life loves me !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:17pm

  55. 55: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Trusting life does love you, and sending good energy your way for your speech.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:19pm

  56. 56: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel curious
    If you do the speech and he steps up and offers you a ring, will you take it

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:19pm

  57. 57: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I get triggers w my girl cuz we don’t take time out to sit in silence… That feels rich and restful and nourishing to me

    I feel scared to talk about this

    I wonder how I can talk about this

    I feel sad now

    I feel

    I feel detached

    I feel lost

    I love myself

    I love my sadness


    I love my :(

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:20pm

  58. 58: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – no, I don’t feel confortable at that level… We only kissed once… It was many dates ago, no sexual interactions…

    I think he’s got some kind of Christian belief system thing going on about that and I’m feeling lost as we haven’t fully talked about it

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:22pm

  59. 59: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Happy to be a beacon of hope ruth! I am special, but not that special. I believe it’s possible for anyone. I believe I am lucky, to have caught this before even more years, and layers were added. I can imagine all the layers that would be there if I never had become aware :S

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:22pm

  60. 60: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’m also Africa man will turn out to be bisexual and cheat on me w men. And get aids and give it to me.

    I want to heal this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:23pm

  61. 61: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Something else I discovered on my long road trip this week is that i have dozens of facial ticks – like expressions, but not really an expression – just a quick jerk of the left side fo my mouth – and they all have different meanings. I’ve noticed myself doing them before, but just ignored it, but on this long road trip where i relaxed and felt my feelings, I started to analyze and give mane to each of my ticks.

    The one I use when I suddenly think of GM and force him out of my mind is “Remorse” – like the death of someone I loved.

    I have one that I use when I am amused by soemthing i am thinking, but ti is not a smile – just a quick flash of amusement doused by mu next thought, whatever it is.

    It was interesteing to really focus on them when they would come and figure out the exact meaning. Realizing the one associated with GM was actually remorse was a huge breakthrough for me. Letting myself feel the grief for the loss of that love is going to be critical to my healing.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:23pm

  62. 62: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    *afraid not Africa

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:24pm

  63. 63: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    58,Daria, so in that case, would the no GF speech jut mean he carries on as one of your CDS for now.Or do you want him to step up?.I do feel a bit confused
    59.Stixy, well, I am almost twice your age, so a LOT of healing to do

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:25pm

  64. 64: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Wow Calypso – thank you for sharing… That self exploration and healing feels moving to me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:25pm

  65. 65: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ohh I just let the waves of fear and numbness wash thru

    Now I felt a lil tail none squeeze and a queasiness

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:26pm

  66. 66: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – yes he can continue dating me as a Cd, and maybe see what he thinks about us not getting closer sexually, as it’s starting to feel a little bored like and confusing for me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:27pm

  67. 67: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Ah, gotcha daria

    wasnt sure where this was on yor timeline

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:29pm

  68. 68: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks ruth! Yet…I find it difficult to believe you are close to 60!!

    Without inquiry…I see you as no older than 40. I guess this is a judgement based on pics and such.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:34pm

  69. 69: TamNo Gravatar says:

    48 Ruth, believe it or not every time it comes to paying I feel bad, so it does resonate with me.
    Perhaps deep down I feel unworthy.
    I don’t know.
    That feels sad.
    So I am triggering myself with this and hoping it heals…but I have had guys say to me ‘you deserve it darling’…which has helped 😉

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:36pm

  70. 70: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Im 48 Glowy
    oops, no Im not
    Im 47 till next May

    Oh dear

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:37pm

  71. 71: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    I am walking with you through these feelings around paying!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:39pm

  72. 72: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:



    I do that myself. Eek! What am I again? 30? No no not yet. Only 29 :-)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:40pm

  73. 73: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling scared my patterns are leading me down the wrong lane w my girl. She attacked me , twice , recently. Both in front of men.

    After a situation w one of her friends who attacked me a few days ago.

    I have a belief that I will just ‘let this go’ and then ruin the friendship by not saying anything and being nice to the lady moment where I withdraw and don’t feel safe anymore.

    That’s what it seems is happening with me with my Godsister.

    Also I have a belief girls may ‘hate’ in front of guys to make themselves look like the cool, dominant one, and that it is something to brush off and laugh at as insecurity.

    And that I unconsciously do this without meaning to or noticing it also . Do I ? I dono

    And I have a belief that people – like my girl – will have less respect once they see someone violate your boundaries and you don’t respond defensively.

    So when my gf friend attacked me that day, it opened the door for her to.

    She only did of before once, long ago

    And now I feel on guard

    It’s like a perpetual layer

    So now what ?

    I feel angry

    I feel scared to get in a physical fight w my friend

    I feel scared to get punched

    I feel worried to worry about my house windows

    Which I do when someone knows where I live and I have a conflict w them

    I love myself

    Thank you for writing this down

    I want to heal this

    Wanting to heal the fear of being punched

    The flash abd I want to close my eyes slow down feeling

    Then sad heart heavy sad heart want to cry so sad to not feel loved

    And anger

    The sad feeling slows me down and it feels horrible as I don’t feel safe to protect and defend myself feeling slow and sad

    I love my slow and sad feeling

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:42pm

  74. 74: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    ” Lay off.” Heehee…okay…

    To clarify for those who don’t need me to lay off: I wasn’t talking about a man feeling used if I (or anyone) get pleasure from his body. Men do love that. My man loves that. He’s very careful about making sure I’m satisfied long before he is. He’s the most amazing lover I’ve ever experienced and he is certainly a giver. No, I’m not talking about getting pleasure from a man’s body. I’m talking about taking Rori’s advice and actually “using him and his body to get pleasure” (her words, not mine). That’s terrible and disrespectful and wrong in my mind. Getting and giving pleasure is so much a part of being with a man. USING a man is disgusting to me. Receiving it when he gives it is quite another matter.

    ((((Ruth))))) You’re beautiful. You will heal. You are healing virtually every single time I see your posts. PUA, btw, is pickup artist. They are something else. I can’t really go into it all here (can but can’t bring myself to) but google them if you like. You’ll be amazed most likely.

    Radiant Rising: I’m so sorry for everything you had to go through. There are a lot of coaches out there who aren’t like that at all but yes…many who do take advantage and much worse (as what happened to you). Many who are very irresponsible in their advice and in their greed. I hope you are healing from all that happened. It sounds like you are. :-) My heart goes out to you.

    Starla – 19 – You ROCK!

    And for other ladies who just don’t “get it”…maybe Daria can help you…

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:42pm

  75. 75: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘I don’t feel good being talked to that way my nigga I’m not your prostitute’

    Wow good !

    Thank you Daria!

    More more

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:43pm

  76. 76: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Looking at the exact definition of Remorse, it is a strong feeling of guilt and regret . . . hmmm . . .

    Regret, yes i get that, but where is the guilt coming from? I feel it, I just don’t get it. Why do thoughts of GM make me feel this way? It’s like I keep thinking back to our relationship and the way things were and wishing I could get a do-over. I cringe when I think of some of the overfunctioning things I did that contributed to him running from “us”. maybe i feel remorse because I believe i helped kill our relationship and I so much wish I could change it, but I know I can’t. it feels heavy and pinchy in my chest.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:45pm

  77. 77: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I do feel unworthy of being paid for. Deep in the back of my head is where this feeling resides. If I move into my pelvis I feel centered and worthy of all the gifts life willing to bestow upon me.

    Then there is also a feeling of guilt. If he can’t pay for both of us, he can’t go at all and he wants to go. This feeling resides in my throat/chest. If I touch on my heart and again go deeper into my core I know I don’t have to bust this boundary for us to have a good night. We can both have fun doing something else.

    There is also fear there, tingling my skin. It says I am vulnerable to receiving resentment type energy. I canrub that away. He is free to feel angry if we can’t go. Though I don’t truly believe he will feel angry. If he does, I don’t have to see that as having resentment energy projected on me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:47pm

  78. 78: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    thank you mercedes
    I feel comforted

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:48pm

  79. 79: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    I understand; what Rory wrote and perhaps using was not the correct word, but be able to have s8x without expectations and enjoy it in the moment?

    Just be careful, unlike men we pay the consequences way bigger. I do not think I’m prego at all, but just here thinking if I was, I may have to have an abortion. I never had one, go through all the emotional issues etc. All by myself. I rather explore myself alone and when a serious unselfish man is in my life, then I will practice with him.

    “D” proved he is a very selfish man… and I do not want to deal with him for now. I learned my lesson, no sex if a man doesn’t love me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:52pm

  80. 80: TamNo Gravatar says:

    ‘And for other ladies who just don’t “get it”…maybe Daria can help you…’

    I am happy for you Mercedes, that you ‘get it’..though I am feeling unsure as to what you are getting, seems like permanent ‘defence’ based rants and not much else.

    Not even entertaining anymore, must skip them.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:52pm

  81. 81: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I can help anyone sure if you want help from me :) always

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:52pm

  82. 82: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I just googled

    One page was enough

    Actually my first reaction was to laugh

    and then

    I know men are diffrent to women but surely they must get tired of all that too

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:53pm

  83. 83: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Wait I’m entering into a fake smile pattern

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:53pm

  84. 84: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes – this feels annoying. I don’t want to be antagonized. Thank you.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:54pm

  85. 85: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel, yes we do invest more as well at times, I dont just mean about the pregnancy thing, but we get more involved I think

    I hope you are okay

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:54pm

  86. 86: TamNo Gravatar says:

    It feels….umm..fake actually and inauthentic. eek.
    All that advice and explaining and ranting…I used to be like that when I was deeply unhappy. Not going back there, even if I don’t ‘get it’.
    I get that much.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:57pm

  87. 87: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    I think I need to write an entire post on this (my words from above). I re-read it and believe 100%:

    “I think we have a much better chance of manifesting the relationship we want and deserve if we treat ourselves and the men in our lives as loving, beautiful human beings. We can’t, I don’t believe, find a connection by using men for anything. I really believe we have to feel our feelings, learn to trust those feelings, learn to act based on those feelings and allow a man to experience our feelings with us to form a deeper connection with him.”

    If I have time tonight, I believe I have the theme for my next article. It’s time for me to focus on that blog a little bit anyway. Sometimes I miss it. :-)

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:58pm

  88. 88: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Aha okay yay ! More patterns to notice… Thank you Daria

    Thank you all women here for the trigger

    Ok so when Really ? Came up what was I feeling in my. Vulner ability

    ‘oh no I’m being questioned I’m being attacked I’m not being understood… That feels bad , that feels scary, oh no I Wang to run away abd hide… I feel scared I feel sad very sad… I feel alone’

    I love all my feelings

    (((((( Daria ))))))

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 12:59pm

  89. 89: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel: This I can totally get on board with. If it’s what she meant and “use” wasn’t the right word, then I totally agree (as you said, as long as we are careful with our own feelings):

    “but be able to have s8x without expectations and enjoy it in the moment”

    LOVE that!

    Daria: I don’t like being antagonized either so you’re welcome and thank you too.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:01pm

  90. 90: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yay Daria

    Ohhhh I feel so sad

    And I feel achy tail none and tightened up Heart

    This feels too much

    How interesting to notice this

    Thank you Daria

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:02pm

  91. 91: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    No man the word USING was crucial there for me

    Using him and his body to get pleasures can do this

    Yes using him that’s correct men want that

    Oh yum oh fuchkin amazing rich rutness

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:05pm

  92. 92: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Dammit I want to feel understood and celebrated

    Foot stomp

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:06pm

  93. 93: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I get why I feel sooooo urrrgh-y about all that.

    Because why can’t I do it all at the same time?

    Why can’t I manifest the relationship I want, in that way…


    Use feeling messages…


    See his body as a pleasure tool…


    See him and treat him as a beautiful human being…


    Hold firm my boundaries….


    Lean back and receive…


    Say “I don’t want….”


    Believe I am a giving and generous and valuable person…


    on and on and on and on?

    Dam right! I want it all. Happy. More pls.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:09pm

  94. 94: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I have a problem with the word “used”, and its concept
    Feels controlling to me and disrespectful
    One “uses” objects, not people-well, thats how i feel anyway

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:11pm

  95. 95: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Let’s try an experiment, shall we? How about half of the women out here put this on their profile:

    “I want to use you and your body for my own pleasure”

    and the other half put this:

    “I enjoying receiving pleasure from a man who is loving and caring with me”

    And let’s keep track of how which profiles get the most one night stand proposals and which get the most high quality men who are interested in finding the relationship of THEIR dreams too.

    I’m absolutely positive the first comment will get the most responses.

    Or…wait…maybe we’re not actually supposed to TELL the men we’re using them????


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:11pm

  96. 96: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I feel amused. Highly :)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:12pm

  97. 97: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth: Exactly!!

    Glowstix: I believe anyone can have all that. As long as he’s aware of being used. Personally, I believe “receiving what he offers” is better than “using him” but it could probably go either way I guess. For me, it would all be about being honest with a man and hoping you find one who is willing to be used. Not receiving his offers. Used. In my experience though, communication and honesty is key so if he knows you’re using him and he’s good with it then I would imagine things could work out beautifully. Not the kind of man I want for me (a man who wants to be used and not received isn’t for me) but it could certainly be for others.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:16pm

  98. 98: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Men don’t have a problem with using a woman just for sex…they might do it honestly, or dishonestly.
    They might pay for it even.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:18pm

  99. 99: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I guess I would have be simply “using” him in order to be open about “using” him. Otherwise….It’s just a lie. Something someone decided I am doing, projected upon me, and hoped I would adopt as belief and open up about as truth.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:21pm

  100. 100: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GlowStix: I don’t mean you are doing it. I mean Rori is suggesting we do it. I don’t like the suggestion that women treat men this way. I don’t actually know of anyone on this blog using a man for anything (at least not from the comments I’ve read). I do know women who have used men in the past. But the advice is that we do it and I’m not comfortable with that advice at all. I’m pretty sure when I show J the advice he’ll agree. He’ll agree that men enjoy having their bodies used for sex and he’ll agree that the women in the past who have used him are no longer with him. I’m certain he’ll agree that using a man does not lead to a healthy relationship. All of this agreement will be coming from our own lives and our own experiences. Not from trying to project on others.

    I believe (somewhat…not a full on believer but a cautious believer and a full believer in karma so…) in the power of attraction. I believe that if we use people, we will be used. I also believe that’s okay…if that’s what we want. I personally have no desire for it in my life.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:26pm

  101. 101: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I talked to NannyCD. I felt giggly and turn away and even judging rolling my eyes blushing good and tight scared embarassed

    I wonder if that’s a ‘thrill’ Rori talks about about sharing my vulnerability

    Am I on the way to falling in love ?

    He said he’s gona kiss me more now.

    I told him breezily I don’t want to be a gf

    I’m judging him for being so slow to move things sexually

    I’m not shutting down

    Yay me babysteps

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:28pm

  102. 102: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks for clarifying, mercedes! Must be why it felt like a projection. It didn’t feel true for me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:32pm

  103. 103: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    98, Tam
    sure they do
    and surely women also do the same with men sometimes
    It happens
    Nothing wrong with it if between consenting adults who know the score
    Its not the way I want to go though

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:32pm

  104. 104: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so glad I’m healing and doing so well with not getting triggered by the word ‘used’ as I know how scared I can be of that trigger

    This seems si important tied to receiving,

    And how ‘taking’ is judged as bad and therefore reviving and using etc


    Yay for healing and bringing the true pleasure of honest using scared ecstasy, not distorted judged stuffed down using

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:32pm

  105. 105: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so triggered that my assistant/girl friend here at work doesn’t like at all what’s happening with QZ.

    But what’s triggering me is that it’s upsetting her. I feel really guilty making someone else have negative feelings.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:33pm

  106. 106: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Being very careful to specify…I use the sex as a tool. As an opportunity for expansion and growth. I don’t use the man himself. The man in my story is highly adored. And loved. Though I know I don’t say that, here, very often. With all
    my self focus and “I am loved” type talk.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:34pm

  107. 107: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yay for healing using

    More Daria

    I feel scared to use my brother to get the family and community I want harmonized

    I don’t know how to do this




    I want to heal all this

    It’s feeling a bit overwhelming

    I feel sad

    So interesting to notice this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:35pm

  108. 108: TamNo Gravatar says:

    105 Starla, you are not responsible for anybody else’s feelings. At all.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:35pm

  109. 109: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    well said Tam
    Starla, her feelings are her issue, not yours

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:36pm

  110. 110: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I do allow him to bring me healing and feeling and positivity, however. And could easily supply the term “use” here, and not feel ashamed of that.

    It is, after all, just a tiny word. It is the energy we apply to the word that matters most.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:36pm

  111. 111: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Well I will use my man

    ‘use him as he wants to be ised’ as Rori says

    I will receive his usefulness, his soul and not judge his giving by judging my using and receiving

    Dear men I can use you! I will receive you

    I am here for that

    Yay :)

    I love that I get this

    I feel scared seeing other people seem to not get it

    Get triggered about using people and triggered about takers instead of honoring

    Shutting down their receiver

    Yay Im not yay yay yay

    I’m the smart one again
    Oh it feels scary

    I want to heal this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:39pm

  112. 112: TamNo Gravatar says:

    We ‘use’ other people from the day we are born, however you want to word it, and they ‘use’ us.
    Is it always negative?
    I use a pan for cooking. Would the pan be offended if I told it ‘hey, I am only using you’.
    Trying to ‘get’ love from someone is also ‘using’ them for our needs.
    So if we all stopped having our needs taken care of and ‘using’ people in a co-existing kind of way, where do we end up?
    In a cave all alone.
    I don’t see it as a negative word, or an all exclusive word, like a bad thing.
    Infants ‘use’ their mother.
    Does that make them disgusting?
    ‘There is nothing bad unless thinking makes it so’

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:42pm

  113. 113: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I wish everyone was getting it with me :(

    I feel scared and windy and sad and overwhelm brain when I’m the one who gets it seemingly on my own and this seems to come up for me all the time

    And I ‘be quiet and say nothing’ the way stories advise ‘wise’ men and women to do and it Doesn’t feel good it feels judgemental and sad and I want to heal this


    Foot stomp I feel worked up and shouty and frightened and gonna tremble lip and cry !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:42pm

  114. 114: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GlowStix: I LOVE this:

    “I use the sex as a tool. As an opportunity for expansion and growth. I don’t use the man himself. ”

    I would totally be on board with advice like that to “Beth” or me or anyone else. That is beautiful and respectful and loving. And I’m positive most men would welcome it and would be happy to give to a woman with those feelings about it. :-)

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:42pm

  115. 115: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Yes daria! Thank you.

    He is rather useful 😉

    I am over here, myself, wondering…Why? It’s just a word! My energy would show I am not “using to gain and drain” I am “Using what is offered to me freely, to it’s fullest potential.”

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  116. 116: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    a pan is an object
    an infant knows no better
    as adult humans we have choices as to how we treat others

    yes, I hold my hands up
    I *have* used
    I have been used

    neither of those situations have ever felt good to me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  117. 117: TamNo Gravatar says:

    My friends ‘use’ me for company, a listening ear, someone to socialise with, to call when they need to talk. I do the same. It’s called give and take.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  118. 118: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel guilty as I know I’m not the only one who gets it

    I feel guilty for having the ‘alone’ trigger

    I judge my alone trigger as drama queen attention drawing

    I love my drama queen attention drawing

    Inauthentic ?

    I love my judgements and fears

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  119. 119: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel more solid seeing other women seemingly get it, yet I still feel defended drawing my coat up against the wind

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:45pm

  120. 120: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t like feeling that way, cold fingers

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:46pm

  121. 121: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    108 tam you’re right:) but she was there for me when my heart was broken over him.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:46pm

  122. 122: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    117 tam, no, thats not the same
    maybe its semantic, but *use* in this context for me means taking without giving back

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:46pm

  123. 123: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Ahh thank you! I’m all caught up in words and energies and “it doesn’t have to look ugly, like that!”. It’s all about the good feeling energy and sharing. Rather than just “gimme gimme gimme and you don’t matter as a human.”.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:47pm

  124. 124: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    I will always (well…not always…it’s something I still work on but I’ll try to always…) be willing to receive what other people are giving to me. I will not use them for anything. I will use what they give me. I will not use them. Receiving them as human beings. Receiving their offers. Offering love and compassion in return. Receiving and offering and loving. No using in my life where (as Ruth so perfectly put it) people are concerned.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:48pm

  125. 125: TamNo Gravatar says:

    122 Ruth, yes, so does that make a baby a mean person? Because right at the beginning of their life, they can’t give anything back – they do later, yes.
    The mother doesn’t mind being used because she loves the baby so much…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:48pm

  126. 126: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    “I feel more solid seeing other women seemingly get it, yet I still feel defended drawing my coat up against the wind”

    isn’t it tiring to be the self-appointed vanguard of this sort of thing on behalf of other women, suffering, scolding, and celebrating all based on how others act or think?

    i never wanted to be the hall monitor in school growing up, except for when i felt unaccepted by others. Then i totally wanted to bust their asses for not doing things ‘right’.

    sometimes i worry. but i should probably keep my mouth shut. but i’m hitting send anyway cuz i’m a loose canon or something…..

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:49pm

  127. 127: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GlowStix: 123 You ‘get’ me I think. :-) :-) :-)

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:50pm

  128. 128: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    No tam, it doesnt.They arent yet sentient beings who can make a rational decision.they just-are
    But it does make an adult a not nice person

    123 and 124

    yes, I relate to that
    I fel good reading that

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:51pm

  129. 129: TamNo Gravatar says:

    The word ‘use’ does not trigger me at all.
    Perhaps because I never felt that I ever ‘used’ anyone…maybe that’s why.
    Not sure, but yes, no triggers with the word use whatsoever.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:51pm

  130. 130: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i also drafted a ‘loose canon’ email to my own mother this morning. saying she needs to leave me alone unless she goes to therapy for being a pathological liar. i haven’t hit send yet cuz it’s fairly scathing and could probably use editing

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  131. 131: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Alos, if I have a totally scared patient to deal with, then, yes, I sometimes get used
    they cant think striaght and thats different
    But someone who uses deliberately-well, that desnt feel good at all to me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  132. 132: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Come to think of it, I also never felt ‘used’ by anyone, although I probably was in some ways…hm.
    I feel happy about that.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:53pm

  133. 133: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Starla: 126 – YUP!

    Ruth: I agree with you on the children thing. But I don’t think babies use people because they don’t know any better. I think they receive what is given (and they do it unconditionally…they do it perfectly). They give back love and laughter and kisses and hugs and coos and smiles…oh…babies don’t use their parents anymore than a woman receiving the love of her man uses him.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:53pm

  134. 134: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I can’t even bring myself to ask for gas money when I give people rides. I’m not a high risk using up peoples energy or being harmful hahah 😉

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:55pm

  135. 135: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Babies just are
    they havent had any opportunity to get messed up yet

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:56pm

  136. 136: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Well I’m gona be using to gain and drain haha literally

    Well as long as its honest this is a huge gift not only to the man but to life for me to honor and be this taking usung receiving energy

    The trigger w using is in ‘dishonesty’ and this hiding it’s exalted ness in honesty

    Okay w Nanny Cd

    I want to run away and find a man who’s more comfortable moving things along sexually

    I feel like if I don’t, I’ll be ‘baring with him’ and therefore overfunctioning

    And making myself resentful ‘you loser, I kept dating you even though you were like not even knowing how to move things along and I hung in there waiting for you to figure it out feeling all awkward and judgemental and icky and uncomfortable’ and you do This?

    Whatever this is

    In other words I feel like I’m making an effort

    Like I shouldn’t be w a man I judge this much

    And there’s more for me to explore here I don’t want to push him away

    I could talk to him about sexuality

    Will I ever get over how ‘lame’ thus is ?

    Is this something I can handle, his seemingly total sexual inexperience

    I like men who are experienced abc skilled at sex and moving forward sexually…

    Is this something I can open up with?

    I feel worried his libido would be low…

    I like the men who want to do it everyday

    I don’t get the impression he would want that, even if we were having sex.

    Thus is singing to talk about

    I’m staring to feel insecure, concerned

    The truth us I’m used to moving along sexually much faster than this, and this feels confusing and a bit off putting to me

    I don’t want to push him away as I really enjoy time with him and I feel genuinely card for abd loved Bd that feels lovely abd warm


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:56pm

  137. 137: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    133 mercedes

    it feels so good to see others agreeing with me, and i reeaaaalllly don’t want anyone else to chime in and say they agree, because i feel uncomfortable about it seeming like anyone is being ganged up on. well i think in this case it is a bit of ganging up… i guess it’s all perspective. um in any rambling case, thank you for taking time to validate me, and let’s please leave my comments and thoughts there and not expand on it because i didn’t say them so that people could agree and validate me at the potential expense of another (in this case, Daria), you know what i’m saying?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:57pm

  138. 138: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    I’m feeling what you’re throwing out there.

    I also think that everyone makes their own choices. I don’t have the kind of power it takes to “force” anyone to do something they truly don’t want to do.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:57pm

  139. 139: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    that sounds like a *next* to me

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 1:59pm

  140. 140: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I jive with most facets of the conversation. Aside from personal growth through sex being turned into something ugly. I don’t want that. And also whatever personal issues ladies have between each other. That’s none of my business.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:00pm

  141. 141: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Well if I was a masculine energy looking to give myself and not receive anything back as that conflicts with my masculine energy I would be Thrilled to find an energy that’s willing to receive me fully with enough respect to not give to me.

    It’s like finding a pussy to fuchk w my duck that won’t try to penetrate me herself… Just be the receiving pussy oh I know men love to Give that way haha they wouldn’t want a duck to come out and fuchk them haha well not masculine energy men

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:00pm

  142. 142: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    it will probablt really pee you off starla but I am loving your antsyness

    Ok,its not a word

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:02pm

  143. 143: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Starla: I understand. I was agreeing for me, not for ganging up and I’m sorry I gave that impression. I read what you wrote and it absolutely resonated with me. It wasn’t meant to be at the expense of anyone else. It was a good feeling in my heart to read it, that’s all.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:02pm

  144. 144: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Starla and Mercedes your words above resonate with me. I don’t like the idea of “using” anyone especially with something so sweet and precious. I see sex as a sacred act because it can create such happiness in a person’s life and such oneness with another human spirit. I also don’t like be painted with a broad brush of shut down or triggered.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:02pm

  145. 145: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Hey ladies – mercedes and starla – I’m not reading your posts about me. Hope you’re working out whatever’s triggered! If you want to communicate w me about something feel free to grab my attention… Otherwise feel free to use my posts for fodder!

    Thank you for your presence here … It feels great to have you here contributing and witnessing my healing

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:04pm

  146. 146: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I can’t help but wonder, Daria, if you see it as draining a man…It will be perceived as draining to him? Is it what you want, truly…All debate aside. You do attatch positive energy to “using what is useful” and could continue to attatch positive energy as seeing that as “filling up” a man instead of “draining”. I would feel uncomfortable to see all that positive energy assigned to the word/action go down the drain…So to speak. It is your reality though, and I don’t want to tamper with it.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:05pm

  147. 147: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    FW: 144 Well said.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:06pm

  148. 148: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’m not reading the posts because I think you’re triggered and misunderstanding me and my communications and intentions and I get the impression by skimming id feel really truggered like judged reading those posts and I don’t feel comfortable to ‘go there’ w my lil girl right now. So it feels better to skip and hope you are all getting healing and benefit from the posts as I am from posting mine…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:08pm

  149. 149: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Woops nevermind daria! your post 141…I get it. You get it. No worries :-)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:08pm

  150. 150: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Glowstix – men get literally drained of semen when they ejaculate…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:09pm

  151. 151: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ooops just saw 137

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:11pm

  152. 152: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    daria, there’s nothing scary to avoid in my comment to mercedes. in fact, probably 99% of the time you say that you’re not reading something I wrote about you, it’s something nice, defending you, validating you, etc.

    i don’t care if you don’t read it, but going out of your way to say that you’re not going to read it feels like a slap in the face. like how i feel when i overfunction with a man.

    the word ‘use’ doesn’t trigger me, because no words trigger me, unless they’re used to wrongly quote me/put ideas or words in my mouth. i have a piece of paper with the word ‘linguistics and language’ on it from a popular university that relieved me of a relationship with words that results in triggering.

    i often find myself getting irritated with people that splice hairs over semantics when the root concept is the same

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:12pm

  153. 153: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i don’t think i am explaining myself well because i’m sneaking in posting at work and i’m all rushed and i feel stupid and NOW i actually do feel totally triggered hehhhhhhhhhh

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:14pm

  154. 154: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    okay daria you probably won’t want to read this, cuz now i really am processing:)

    and really i shouldn’t be talking to daria at all, because i’m violating my own boundary.

    i did this with my mom for a long time. i’d say no we can’t have a relationship if things are like x, and then i’d give in and contact her and talk to her and seek validation


    love to me

    it’s okay little girl

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:15pm

  155. 155: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    He can ‘fill me up’ with it

    I feel more excited to step even more extremely and radically into this feminine space, seeing how triggering it seems to be for the commenters here (in my impression, it’s actually just some, but it’s playing into my pattern and might be related to how I create fulfillment of my need for significance) I get that there’s a big need for that energy to be embodied in the world and maverick me can do it yay.

    Also noticing more (defensive) words flowing to address situations w women where I felt frightened recently.

    Yay I’m feeling empowered and now to babystep to opened sand vulnerability from here

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:16pm

  156. 156: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    fw, the word use doesn’t trigger me at all, though.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:18pm

  157. 157: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    Now D was trying to get closed and I blew him off; I still have skeletons from the past… :(

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:21pm

  158. 158: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel totally lost and confused

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:22pm

  159. 159: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    is it my odd babbling, ruth? :)

    i’m acting kind of weird today…

    just noticing this about myself

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:24pm

  160. 160: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel: Are you okay? “Blew him off”. Is that what you did? Or did you step back for a minute because it felt right? I know about skeletons from the past though so I’m not trying to reframe anything if it doesn’t need it, just another perspective maybe??

    Ruth: What happened?

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:24pm

  161. 161: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel may I suggest looking how you can be soft. Maybe embracing a name for yourself that could slowly get into your subconscious? Different things about your words and even you pic leave me with a sense of aloofness related to you. I might be totally wrong so please ignore if this does not resonate with you.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:26pm

  162. 162: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Oh no Starla – ! Just started your post to me and I feel all shocked and upset that my saying that felt like a slap in the face…

    I more wanted to make it clear to the other posters that I wasn’t reading so they wd know that in case they they thought I was and felt upset seeing me not defend myself and —- just another pattern of perception I have frequently that got truggered into running…


    I wasn’t trying to have it come off as a slap to you or anyone.

    I genuinely don’t feel confortable reading right now though I feel kinda like I’m getting shot at with bullets from diff directions at the moment —- another frequent pattern of mine that’s being truggered now —–

    I feel sad

    I feel all frustrated cuz I want to communicate openly abd lovingly and also I feel like one of my eyeballs is gonna pop from the uncomfortableness of this for me

    My pattern is I will take a few more stabs in the heart before this gets calmer… I notice this pattern often w my mom

    And I’m really practicing not taking any (stabs on the heart by staying to hear stuff that feels bad after I felt bad )

    This is really rich for me w triggers to heal… So thank you so much for being here and interacting with me in any way you wish :).

    Whew. I was feeling numb a bit now a bit relieved I fee a bit unburdened

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:26pm

  163. 163: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – why do you see it as a next ?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:27pm

  164. 164: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Its almost bed time in the UK

    that feels like a good thing right now

    night ladies

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:28pm

  165. 165: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    “I want to communicate openly abd lovingly”

    Daria I say, please do.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:28pm

  166. 166: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Bahahaha @ 150

    I was so not taking you in such a literal way 😉 I stand corrected. I suppose if you look at it that way, I AM on the “gaining and draining” trian. Toot toot

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:29pm

  167. 167: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Daria, if he isnt meeting your needs sexually, then, you move on to the next CD, no?
    You seem to have plenty to choose from

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:29pm

  168. 168: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    I only just started reading and feel compelled to chime in here. First of all I prefer to see sex as a vehicle for me to go deeper within myself on all levels as well as connect more profoundly with K.

    Secondly, men and women are wired differently around this. For the most part, men like to look, and women like to be looked at. Men mostly like to touch, and women mostly like to be touched.

    And this is what is going on predominately during sex. So men get their greatest pleasure NOT by you doing whatever for them but by them being able to release great pleasure in you. The more pleasure you feel, the better they feel, and that they’ve created this for you…not much is better than this if anything.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:30pm

  169. 169: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    An I get triggered

    I feel so sad


    **Does access consciousness**

    Ohhhh I feel way better

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:32pm

  170. 170: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes; I got all defensive and said “have a nice life”

    then he said What? sometimes you say some weird Sh8t? What do you mean?


    I do these passive aggressive things some times; Now I catch myself doing them, and I step back. Before I was the queen of passive aggressiveness.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:32pm

  171. 171: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    daria, it’s all good. please do carry on and enjoy the processing:)


    i’ve learned a lot about effective communication, and while it sucks to sit and read/hear things that might trigger us, overall the communication is much more productive and beneficiary if you allow yourself to hear everything, like how rori suggests when a man is triggering us but not being abusive (cuz abusive = walk away), and THEN respond accordingly. To respond to what you think they’re going to say, or to respond to only the first few sentences, kind of robs *everyone* involved of a certain dignity. Though sitting there and listening to abusive words offers no dignity. So it’s about trusting yourself to know when you’re really being abused. Otherwise, you turn into the abuser inadvertently by being too afraid of losing your dignity that you rob the other of theirs in not letting them be heard.

    i’m sending brave vibes your way, sirens.

    and back to myself:)

    yummy brave vibes

    “i will not be triggered or baited. i am pure love” — Starla

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:33pm

  172. 172: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I am supposed to be going to bed so I feel a bit cross but
    I agree
    *up to a point*
    Recntly my man(after quite a ew years) has said to me that he loves to be stroked and have his hair stroked.
    This after several years of saying it was all about my pleasure(which, I will admit, I had trouble with for reasons I wont go into now)
    he LOVES to be touched too

    perhaps other men do too??

    Very tired, not making so much sense, but just wanted to say

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:35pm

  173. 173: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    And when I was / am in my masculine needy I like to look, and I like to touch…

    I felt a bit icky, lascivious, guilty abd desperate being in that energy

    No wonder Rori says men feel bad about themselves for their urges like that

    Now I can turn that on to myself, looking at me admiringly, touching me

    I want to practice this more

    Thanks Daria

    I feel intrigued and turned on

    I used to like looking up at the man as aloof and worship object


    I fel so desperate rootless and helpless that way… In a way a diff feminine abandon

    Everything is everything here I am now rooted in my female power w more leverage so to speak

    Learning how to worship me, touch me,

    Oh it feels overwhelming




    This article helped

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:38pm

  174. 174: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    FW yes other people have told me that; years ago a friend told me the her brother had a crush on me, and that I was kinda “mean” and Ignored him… Truth is I was totally unaware of his intentions. Sometimes I am just in my own little world.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:39pm

  175. 175: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel my humble opinion is love your passive aggressive self. I would even look for a way to kinda laught lovingly at her. I believe it will help reduce the pressure/seriousness of changing to being better. Our skeletons can be dressed up into dolls clothes.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:41pm

  176. 176: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Toot toot!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:41pm

  177. 177: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i wanted to text QZ about the westboro church thing (LOL! sucks for themmmmmm), but i didn’t.

    it still bothers me that i can’t just text him.

    i hate when i get all conflicted like this, because this energy is more harmful than just leaning forward itself.

    i still feel confused a lot about all this.

    but when in doubt, lean back. works like a charm;)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:43pm

  178. 178: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yes opening up the yang has a yin core abd the yin has a yang core so… Men can receive a touch when fully open, women can give a touch when fully open

    I suppose

    Yay D high 5

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:43pm

  179. 179: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Sometimes I am just in my own little world – I believe this is actually great. Just find a way to get into a dancing mood while you are there or thinking of things that make you happy. Even remembering little moments in your head where you were silly and can laugh at yourself.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:43pm

  180. 180: TamNo Gravatar says: feels confusing, like people actually say ‘use’ is the same thing as ‘abuse’ and it really isn’t, sorry.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:44pm

  181. 181: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Maybe Tam. I just don’t like the idea of it in relation to human relationships.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:45pm

  182. 182: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    @ 168: Dominique

    Well, Besides “D” who loves giving pleasure; other men from my past have been kinda feminine; “S” for example wanted me to be more aggressive and do more things to him, he was like a teenager in bed Bleh!

    Now I know why I am so hung up on “D” 😉

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:46pm

  183. 183: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – thank you for talking aboit this w me.

    yes and he’s been one of the most giving and consistent and stable and there for me CDs so far. He actually raised the bar on what I require .

    I don’t want to stop seeing him abd maybe I feel afraid to lose all that .

    I know I won’t I’ll get more

    Hmm I can feel my way through this

    No pressure on me

    Not way siding sex

    Not pretending

    I can feel scared and guilty and love my fear and guilt

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:47pm

  184. 184: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Might just be semantice but to me
    receive- accept what is freely given-no expcetations
    use-take what may be on offer but ignore any potential expectation as a result of that
    abuse-take with an intent to harm or hurt

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:48pm

  185. 185: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    FW – why? Maybe it could Help you to undo this trigger so you don’t see ‘using’ as bad.

    I don’t suppose you see the other side of the coin ‘helping, offering, or giving’ as bad.

    Perhaps ‘using’ is tied to ‘not appreciating’ in your belief system or tied to ‘dishonesty’

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:49pm

  186. 186: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – 172 – Of course I’m talking in generalities, yet I will still say that most men enjoy seeing and feeling us pleasured by them the most. This is the greatest pleasure though certainly not the only one.

    It doesn’t mean they don’t like or want to be touched or stroked or receive a blow job or some other sort of attention from us.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:50pm

  187. 187: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    should also say
    use-take even if not actually offered.Manipulate to get what you want

    Im tired
    will need to think more on this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:50pm

  188. 188: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel: Based on your comment 170, I’d say it looks like you are healing this. I wonder, if something like that comes out of your mouth before you’ve had a chance to think about (like passive aggressive remarks tend to do), when you catch it, could you apologize? Could you say “I wish I hadn’t said that. I didn’t mean it. I’m working on the part of me that says things I don’t mean but I’m not quite there yet. I’m sorry.”

    Would something like that feel good to you?

    I know for me, I’m working on listening with the intent to understand and not with the intent to respond. I’m not very good at it yet, but when I catch myself responding before they are done speaking, I pause and I apologize. To whoever I’m talking to. I’ve apologized at work and at home and a few times in social settings.

    I really want to change that part of me, but step one is noticing it. Step two is admitting it out loud. Step three is confessing that it is something I do but don’t want to do any longer and step four is apologizing for it.

    I have no idea if that’s what will really heal it, but it is what I’m doing right now to try.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:51pm

  189. 189: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    ooh well thats good daria


    TY dominique, I just didnt want any men to miss out on the touch thing.I was really surprised when i heard this from mine.he sounded so sad when he said he hadnt really been touched before(I washed his hair after that)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:53pm

  190. 190: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel – 182 – Yep, blech indeed. My ex was one of those, wanted me to stroke/tickle his back for HOURS. It was never enough. What a turn off.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:54pm

  191. 191: TamNo Gravatar says:

    181…well, the point is it feels kind of strange to me if we say we don’t like reality.. a bit like ‘I don’t like tht the sky is blue’ – makes no sense. It is all part of the whole.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:55pm

  192. 192: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    ooh mercedes thanks

    how to sort out the blurt

    really helpful, thank you

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:55pm

  193. 193: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    LOL! “how to sort out the blurt” I like that!!! :-)

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:56pm

  194. 194: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – I hear you on the semantics. Words can be important and their subtle or not so subtle meanings can be interpreted and misinterpreted which is what I think is going on here.

    I don’t like the word “use” myself when used in this context, yet I also think I know what Rori was getting at in her response to Beth which was already talked about.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 2:57pm

  195. 195: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    yes quite right dominique

    we do all have different interpretations
    and mine will be RIGHT off now as i feel gelatinous with fatigue
    Ive had quite a week, what with two maras and the rest
    Really must do the sensible thing and go to bed

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:00pm

  196. 196: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    If I receive abd there’s potential expectations flyer perhaps I will feel
    Uncomfortable or unsafe receiving

    If I am able to receive abd there is communication about expectations I can ( and will have to ) deal with it then

    The root of the expectations is the issue abd it can be healed or else come up as a deal breaker

    I am not responsible for others expectations, but they can mess up that persons vibe making it uncomfortable for me to open up and receive

    I feel a little sadness as there are ways I’m not being seen or honored when there’s expectations of me

    If I receive there may be sadness for me and guilt which is a cover for fear, I fear I will be blamed

    And it might be, the expectant person can have reason tp blame me now for their expectations

    So that shows the issue in the relationship dynamic

    Iw there’s ‘issues’ w this person it’s not safe to receive from them move away


    Good to see the issuesits ok ti address this and talk about it

    I want to feel safe to receive

    I can open up w anyone and assume they’re safe and if they show expectation s after I’ll know they’re not

    Ok that feels a bit like relief

    I feel a little sad

    Hmm I feel like a shift

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:01pm

  197. 197: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    Yeah Mercedes I did apologize; I said I was feeling worried and tense and need time to relax. Sorry…

    He said “OK” lol we both are like two kids… he is a Leo and I am an Aries, our “fights” last 2 seconds…

    I just want to get my period yesterday! ugh! then I wil go to clinic and get the “Essure procedure”

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:01pm

  198. 198: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Tam – Actually the sky is not blue, and I’m saying this totally to lighten the mood and not as as anything negative. I find it amusing that we have expressions such as these which technically are false. The sky reflects the blue end of the color spectrum back to earth to be viewed by our cones and rods in the eye and recorded by our brains as blue. Or something like this. Any scientists please feel free to correct my rudimentary knowledge about optics.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:02pm

  199. 199: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel: LOL! I’m an Aries too…it can be very noticeable sometimes….haha!

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:04pm

  200. 200: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    If I don’t address my fears ‘of his expectations’ then I will address then later

    It’s okay

    M I being dishonest ?


    Of abandonment ?

    Of ‘not getting’ ?

    I feel a lil uncomfortable

    If I felt worthy I would assume no expectations on his part

    That he benefits from being used.

    Of course he does !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:04pm

  201. 201: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘The sky reflects the blue end of the color spectrum back to earth to be viewed by our cones and rods in the eye and recorded by our brains as blue. Or something like this. Any scientists please feel free to correct my rudimentary knowledge about optics.’

    Or that could be total bullshit based on what another man or woman said.

    The sky i can sense w my eyes Os blue sometimes, or pink or gray or black or purple or orange .

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:07pm

  202. 202: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Well for me I do have triggers around the word used so seeing it used (haha) in this article liberated me to really use my men more directly for my pleasure which I had been holding back on for fear ( probably pot of my triggers around ‘using” as a part of that)

    But now I feel freed from that and empowered abd about to have an amazing sex life !

    And I think my men will like it, maybe not all, they’ll drop off and the ones who do like it will…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:11pm

  203. 203: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I now feel comfortable for men to pick me up from other men’s houses. Thanks to practice w tman and Znanny Cd.

    Now I want to get comfortable getting picked up from actual CDs… Not them seeing each other but my vibe while arranging it I am practicing not shutting down

    Yay babysteps

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:13pm

  204. 204: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Im such a gift to the world .

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:13pm

  205. 205: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    My fear is being prego and even though I am pro choice and like the option of abortion; I may want to keep the little monster, because I love kids. I had my son in early 20’s and thought my ex and I will be it, but no it wasn’t. Now my son is 14 and I don’t want to start over again, and I don’t know if “D” is the one…

    Not because I am not open to make him my “one” but because his pulling back and forth makes me feel like maybe he is not my one. So Since he is nice to me besides his ambiguity, I keep him around, but go on platonic dates with others.

    I just feel scared…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:14pm

  206. 206: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Yes. The colour of the sky adjusts according to many facetors. All boils down to perception in the end. And is’t that poignant…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:25pm

  207. 207: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:26pm

  208. 208: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Oops this convo w my mom felt tense

    Guess were not reorganizing the closet after all.

    I feel scared my stuff will get messed with.

    I have an accumulation of medical stuff there I care about

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:27pm

  209. 209: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel terrified

    I feel angry

    I feel sad

    I feel blamy towards others

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:28pm

  210. 210: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i didn’t respond to this guy’s fb messages cuz i was busy

    then he said “lame!”

    b*tch, yo mama’s lame and you don’t hear me complaining. get out of here.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:32pm

  211. 211: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling unsafe here now… Uhoh

    I feel tingly


    Making noise to drown out discussions complaining about me
    Danger !

    I may be attacked in the house

    Tummy lurch

    Tingles on back

    I may have to get out quickly in the cold

    I’m feeling panicked

    Tingly arm and tired


    ‘dad doesn’t like me’


    Thank you Daria

    Wow how interesting, I feel that ‘flush down’ feeling


    Wow that felt cool to notice myself feeling

    Now I feel sad a bit on face

    ***access consciousness

    I feel sad my mom and I are now upset

    I don’t know how to create connection and togetherness
    I want that
    Pull back dont go forward to give and take care of me..,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:35pm

  212. 212: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so angry being told to do stuff by myself ‘like I’m a servant’. I want to heal this

    Growing up I resented my mom for treating me like her servant

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:36pm

  213. 213: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Dominique re bracelet.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:41pm

  214. 214: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘mom this doesn’t feel honest. I can tell you’re upset. This feels bad to me. I feel sad being walked away from.

    I feel guilty you felt bad.

    I feel angry how stiff is made my responsibility
    And I have to deal with moods and people treating me bad ignoring me walking Way from me telling me things aren’t wrong when there’s a disconncect I feel pist and I feel so resentful of having tolerated that si many times.

    And I feel overwhelmed now and sad and hopeless

    ” I never get the love I want ”

    How interesting

    I want to heal this

    My other eyeball feels like exploding now

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:43pm

  215. 215: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    hugs to everyone who needs it right now:)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:47pm

  216. 216: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    This Access Consciousness feels super calming

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:48pm

  217. 217: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Starla :)


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:48pm

  218. 218: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes I so get you re this thread.

    What feels disturbing to me is the Biology issue has not been addressed.

    When we sleep with a man we produce oxytocin which bonds us to our partners the same as when we breastfeed our babies. We get bonded and attached.
    This is how we can end us with a bad toxic man for us.
    Beth is even now aware of this.
    Well done Beth for becoming aware and take 100% responsibility for stopping harming yourself in the way you have in the past.
    If a soul connection with a good man is what Beth wants then get that connection first BEFORE sex and both then make a spiritual conscious choice before choosing to be in a loving realtionship with sex, rather than friends with benefits casual sex.

    I feel saddened by this Advice like you Mercedes. :(

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:50pm

  219. 219: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    This ‘Blinking’ head disconnected from body slow motion perspective is what I get whe I feel wootied of being physically attacked

    I was just talking about it

    How interesting

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:53pm

  220. 220: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    It feels numb… And calculating /strategizing

    The voice in my head feels like its got my back and is planning out how to handle this for me

    My chest feels a bit caving in now

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:54pm

  221. 221: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    it just hit me

    i am the kind of person who will feel compelled to show love and get involved with someone’s life one way or another, even if i can objectively say (or my friends can…) that they’ve ‘wronged me.’ i will try to be a stonewall, but i can’t, because i love them.

    i never noticed this about myself explicitly before

    and i feel proud to have this quality

    i’d rather love and lose or ‘be the fool’ than be a doormat

    i feel so good loving

    i just follow my heart

    i forgive myself for judging me for all these years as a loser, when really, i’m just full of bunches of love

    ohhh i feel so good right now

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:55pm

  222. 222: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ladies you can get oxytocin without sex

    You can get strongly oxytocin bonded without sex

    It’s ok to get strongly oxytocin filled

    When this is natural and aware for a woman then she can care for herself and get ocytocined all the time

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:56pm

  223. 223: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    144: Femininewoman says:

    “Starla and Mercedes your words above resonate with me. I don’t like the idea of “using” anyone especially with something so sweet and precious. I see sex as a sacred act because it can create such happiness in a person’s life and such oneness with another human spirit. I also don’t like be painted with a broad brush of shut down or triggered.”


    It is a spiritual act to me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:58pm

  224. 224: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling impatient and frustrated… How interesting !

    I’m feeling numb

    I’m fding relaxing

    I feel sad and scared being here

    I want to run away

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 3:59pm

  225. 225: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I feel curious about that Daria.

    Breast feeding does this as does orgasm.

    What else does this in your opinion?

    And If I have sex with a man and orgasm with him I will become attached and bonded.
    And I personally do not want to get attached and bonded to a man who is not my conscious soul match.
    And it appears neither does Beth anymore.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:01pm

  226. 226: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    If other people want casual sex and to become bonded and attached or have fun sex that is none of my business and each to their own.

    What I do not like about this thread is that Beth wanted to get away from doing that.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:04pm

  227. 227: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Annie. I hear you too about bonding. It is spiritual for me as well though it wasn’t always.

    Much Love,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:05pm

  228. 228: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yay I’m the sacred receiving woman who is so sacred she receives and uses men as they wish to be used. One of the ones who DARES seeing the innocence in the receiving abd taking honoring that which those who don’t understand spit upon and fear.

    I honor my beautiful spirit self my sacred joy

    I feel so safe w the idea of it bringing joy into my life and that of those with me

    I love the oneness of spirit in dance where I’m using abd he’s being used oh honor and joy of feminine and masculine thank you

    For loving and honoring me

    I’m spirit in every movement every breath

    Every melted stone

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:05pm

  229. 229: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    “It’s ok to get strongly oxytocin filled”


    goes along with reminding myself it’s okay to love

    i don’t want to judge myself for loving OR for getting oxytocinized.


    ok off to the hair salon byeeeee

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:06pm

  230. 230: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    And have something different.
    She had become aware that what she was doing wasn’t serving her.
    And it appears to me that awareness was dismissed.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:07pm

  231. 231: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    When one is spirit always there is no casual

    I feel so not understood how frightening and distant that feels

    I can handle this feelings of vastness

    When one is oxytocin producing in their own there is no fear of bonding

    I’m an oxytocin fountain

    When one is dry and a man makes us spurt and we don’t know how to make ourselves flow, it might bring desperate bonding to him, when in fact were capable of ever flowing water

    20 second hugs give oxytocin bursts

    I’ll have one

    I feel detached still

    I love nu detachment

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:09pm

  232. 232: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    222: Daria says:

    “Ladies you can get oxytocin without sex

    You can get strongly oxytocin bonded without sex”

    Like I said Daria the only other way I know is breastfeeding.

    What other ways do you believe you are able to produce oxytocin with another person involved?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:10pm

  233. 233: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Also Daria I hear you that you believe it is ok for you and totally respect that is right for you.

    Myself, Mercedes and it would also appear Beth do not believe it is ok for us. We are not you.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:12pm

  234. 234: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – a 20 send hug produces it. I start counting hugging my mom, I can feel it as a small release sigh in my chest around 20 sec if I’m not in my head. It’s like a heart sigh expansion.

    It’s something we can do all the time, get ocytocined.

    Sometimes I feel it that ‘beaming’ feeling when I’m cared for

    Rubbing our breasts lightly in circles gets it produced…

    It’s fun to track it

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:14pm

  235. 235: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I’m with Orna and Mathew Walters on this one.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:14pm

  236. 236: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – don’t know what you’re taking about as far as it being ok, but I get the impression I’m not understood.

    I don’t believe there is such thing as casual sec for me, as I’m a spiritual person spiritually engaging in my life almost every moment (when I’m aware of myself)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:17pm

  237. 237: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – did you see my post on what produces oxytocin ?

    It’s being produced by us all the time. A good google search seeking that out might feel fun and give a better perspective of us

    I believe that much of Roris work – the being in feminine energy – is oxytocin producing. Kind of inducing in us a state of being consistently turned on, and ocytocined…

    The ‘open heart’ feeling is a dose of oxytocin right there…

    When one sees that they’re always producing oxytocin as they go about their lives, there may be less worry about it happening with a man, as it’s something familiar and comfortable

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:21pm

  238. 238: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Daria I have not read any evidence about ocytocin being produced in the ways you say.

    Have you any links.
    The only way i know is by breastfeeding, uterine contractions during childbirth and orgasm.

    Re casual sex. Not in a committed relationship. So fun sex no strings attached etc.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:23pm

  239. 239: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    If that is what you believe that is what you believe Daria.

    I do not share your belief.
    So feels best to agree to disagree with you on that one then.

    Feel happy to read any scientific links you have and an open to changing my beliefs in the future with evidence that backs it up.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:27pm

  240. 240: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Oxytocin is not something to fear

    It’s a wonderful hormone that we women can learn to produce consistently on our own, making us able to be turned on with abd around anyone abd making the world a soft cuddly lovely place

    The issue is when we don’t know how to produce it on our own, have it produced with a man, and think he’s the only way to produce it

    That is what sux, especially since we’re not seeing then the thousand other ways we can learn to produce it ourselves

    I think getting good at handling this oxytocin is part of a woman’s work of knowing herself in this lifetime

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:32pm

  241. 241: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – 218 – Though I mostly agree on what you say here, I don’t know that you need to establish a soul connection first before sex. Sometimes this knowing doesn’t occur until you have sex. AND you can create this at the same time as having sex.

    I do think most here would want to be some kind of special knowing whether you want to call it intuition or something else, and yes this can easily be confused when oxytocin has been strongly released.

    Awareness around all of this is key. Everything being learned here and elsewhere. And sure you can still be wrong, but I would rather risk having my heart bruised than wait around for something I may not know for sure feels like.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:33pm

  242. 242: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – please look for your own evidence and of course there is lots. The twenty second hug is most certainly from an online article about a study conclusion.

    I’m sure some attentive google research will reveal a broader picture of oxytocins common occurrence in our lives.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:36pm

  243. 243: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘casual’ feels disrespectful to me when directed to describe my experiences.

    Experiences outside of an agreed commitment are not by definition casual.

    Casual is like, that’s just casual, it just happens because the Case may be the Occasion and it’s just happened to be’ due to circumstance and pretty much implies


    There is an implication of non spiritual

    This is what feels so annoying to me, the idea that sex for me is not spiritual Smh

    That fuchked up honestly

    I don’t like that declared about me

    There’s lots of people having made a commitment agreement having sex they don’t see as sacred

    For me I’m sacred.

    My sex is sacred and my pee and shit are sacred

    And that is Real Talk


    when I pee I honor God

    How could I imagine my sex is un spiritual ?


    Quit trying to make it sound like my sexuality is less sacred than another’s

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:44pm

  244. 244: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Access Consciousness

    Ok I feel better a bit

    My sex is sacred that’s why I will use it w awareness to pleasure abd home me and my goddess self

    Whatever circumstance or occurrence and even if others call it ‘casual’ and they don’t get it or see my soul I am still having a sacred soul experience and drawing them towards having theirs too

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:50pm

  245. 245: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    How interesting… I feel angry… And I feel tight in my tummy

    I can handle feeling this

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:51pm

  246. 246: DariaNo Gravatar says:


    Cuz it is the ‘case’

    In this ‘case’


    If the case comes up

    Also implies ‘unimportant’


    What is the significance?

    That what you choose

    Choose it to be sacred

    Sacred nourishing of my sexuality

    You don’t have to believe any of that stuff about yourself

    Why am I having sex ?

    I choose

    To pleasure nourish and open up myself, always

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 4:56pm

  247. 247: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    They won’t listen to me mommie!

    Bug hugs

    That must feel bad

    I’m here for you

    I feel sad

    It felt scary


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:00pm

  248. 248: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Sorry for arguing here !

    Thanks everyone for being here !

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:01pm

  249. 249: Senior Lady VibeNo Gravatar says:

    @232: Annie says:
    “..What other ways do you believe you are able to produce oxytocin with another person involved?…”

    It can totally be done in the brain using the mind. Some women become very attached even in imaginary relationships.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:09pm

  250. 250: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    I have gotten hooked on oxytocin just by kissing… Can’t blame him he was a good kisser 😉

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:20pm

  251. 251: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    I remember a while ago having sex with a guy that well kinda wrote short stories (lol); he was very sweet and I could have fallen in love with him if we didn’t have sex after a few dates; now I am glad I did; being with a guy who c*m too fast is a big turn off.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:24pm

  252. 252: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve gotten hooked on oxytocin even without kissing.

    It happened when he picked me up off the floor…

    Has it ever happened to me without touching ?aynr could thru phone or Skype…,

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:29pm

  253. 253: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    243: Daria

    I like this;

    because I don’t like to feel that when I have sex with a man when I decide to do so as casual because there is no “commitment”; I love making love, I can be without if for months or years, but when I have it I want to feel it is close to heaven, even if the guy never calls again, or ends up breaking my heart. I want to feel I am receiving and giving something spiritual.

    If I have to remember a man and want to remember him for this; for his ability to bring me close to heaven with sex.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:34pm

  254. 254: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Haha I just got the short ‘stories’ reference :)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:48pm

  255. 255: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel – yay I feel got :) thank you for sharing …I relate… And I feel even more inspired ah I feel like my heart is stretching in a surprising way

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 5:50pm

  256. 256: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Each to their own.
    What I want now is what feels right for me at this moment in time
    What others want now is where they are at and is right for them at this moment in time.

    I now only want to have sex/make love in a loving committed realtionship once we have gotten to know each other with a man who has proven consistently with his actions that he cares about my heart and soul and who is compatible with me re child rearing, consciousness, and other issues that are deal breakers to me. My conscious soul partner.

    I want to know the man and him me and make a healthy conscious aware choice before I get hormonally bonded and attached to him.
    I don’t want my body used for sex like an object or to use another persons body for instant gratification based on unhealthy faulty chemistry. I am an all or nothing girl, there needs to be a conscious meeting of minds hearts and souls for me before I share my love and body.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:30pm

  257. 257: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Oxytocin does not control me! Yay! And yet I can feel bonded this way with the universe. Mmmm I am completely love bonded with the universe. And my necklace. Not really a man…Not just from having sex.I know that up and down. There is way more than sex in love bonding, for me. And I can experience the low withdrawl and not be freaked by that. I can allow my body to feel and that’s ok.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:32pm

  258. 258: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    Completely different subject:
    I put the F-ing profiles back on OKC and POF. Not Match–I ain’t gonna PAY for abuse.

    What is the deal with contacting men there, Do I always HAVE to wait till they write me/

    I will NOT “wink” or whatever it is on those sites.

    Is it OK to send a note saying “Nice photo with the sax” or whatever–just a random small compliment?

    That doesn’t seem the same as asking them out–more like locking eyes for 5 seconds than looking away.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:36pm

  259. 259: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    I feel good about feeling my feelings i thank Rori and some therapy for that and feel greatful. I also feel worried and concerned about other tips like circular dating and practicing (using) men concepts….has anyone here and i mean anyone been able to get married after following Rori’s circular dating tips and no boyfriend rule? I feel worried because I see a lot of females on here who are here often for the past like four years talking about who they just met, and nicknames of new guys they are dating. I am also one of them but Im beginning to feel scared, is this the result of circular dating? constant practicing, no husband? I feel scared in my stomach.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:37pm

  260. 260: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    cold regular dating, boyfriend, fiance, then husband traditional timeline actually be common for a reason? could circular dating be sedusing because I feel like im in control but really its just a bunch of rotating like clothes in a washer and a lot of nothing???

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:39pm

  261. 261: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    241: Dominique says:

    “Annie – 218 – Though I mostly agree on what you say here, I don’t know that you need to establish a soul connection first before sex”

    I don’t know if you do or not either Dominique.

    I only know I do now


    Like I said each to their own.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:40pm

  262. 262: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    My perception is a shortage of grown up men. Makes it hard. I am still here because I have been thrashing it out with ONE man, and at the moment it is OFF again. Not the fault of Rori’s advice.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:41pm

  263. 263: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    I feel bad i dont want to insult Rori. I just feel really really confused. I practiced my feelings with Peru man ill call him, and even though I had a negative whisper telling me i was dramatic even though I followed Rori about feelings to the T no judging all about me and healing, I dont regret that practice it was fantastic to my self growth. I just wonder whats happening here I dont see any testimonies of “girls I just got proposed to by one of my circular daters” …I wish I saw that sometime!! I feel frustrated

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:44pm

  264. 264: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    I have been reading a book called the Jane Austin Guide to Happily Ever After. In Jan Austin’s time they didn’t “date” at all, but what they did was close to circular dating. The woman was charming and accepted the attentions of the man as they were given. The man had to be careful not to pay TOO MUCH attention to a particular woman, because if he did that was considered a SIGN that he was considering her as a possible wife.
    Nothing was spelled out, but there were ways of discerning intentions. A man who PRETENDED to have serious intentions but did not was considered a scoundrel and could be ostracized from polite society. It is a very good manual on CD-ing.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:49pm

  265. 265: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    Miss bells come to think of it commiting to one guy whole heartedly doesnt work so you have a point. And Ive noticed the “giving” masculine energy girls with super commitment to their confused boyfriends leads to no marriage or a semi forced, semi “i love you but not in love with you, care enough not to hurt your investment” marriages-egh that sucks! so yeah the alternative doesnt feel promising either. I dont know i just want to throw my hands in the air. Maybe i feel scared to c date its so different to me, I even have trouble dating more than one guy even after a first date, I feel like im “potential cheating.” ladies please understand me I am judging only becaues i judge myself, I feel confused as to what my approach is for 2013. commiting to a guy hasnt worked anyway sigh…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:50pm

  266. 266: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Of course I can produce oxytocin on my own I said that all along I am able to give myself intense uterine contractions and orgasms no problem there.
    Also no problem If I decided to share mutual masturbation, me pleasuring myself and him pleasuring himself and making out with a man If I wanted in the getting to know each other stage.

    The hormonal attachment and bonding and problems would occur for me with full penetrative sex and orgasms from that.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:53pm

  267. 267: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    Certainly we MUST NOT COMMIT BEFORE THEY DO. When the right guy commits to US, it all works the way it should. It takes patience. Our modern sexual mores do complicate things, but the underlying story is the same as it ever was. That is how a woman that has been dead for over two hundred years can give good advice.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:53pm

  268. 268: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine–what stage of life are you in? There are major differences here between age groups.
    Are you fairly young?
    I’m an old broad myself…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:55pm

  269. 269: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    i also am afraid of all these sex issues. i feel angry that birth control is unhealthy and changes your body, and yet men dont have to. i feel angry that after sex, theres potential for a disease. i feel angry that if i have sex I could possibly be less attractive and he’ll want the next thing, I hate this. I feel angry that if i dont have sex, hell feel frustrated and…want the next thing as well. i feel angry that theres all these std’s to worry about i want to say that its too much to gamble and to stomp on sex and crush it with my high heel stilleto. I feel angry at my ex because he didnt take my v from me but its like it didnt matter i went the farthest ive ever gotten including being touched, gotten “down’ on and I touched his. Then hes too busy and his schedule is too full to stay as my bfriend. I feel angry. and I also miss him and i feel confused.. I cant figure out if it was all just to see how far hed go, or if he really had feelings like he said he did. could my grandma’s old school advise be true? ” its very very hard to get a man to marry you after sex, dont take my word for it just ovserve all the examples around”…and thats that i didnt even go all the way wow…

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 6:59pm

  270. 270: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    i cant figure out if he dropped me because he thought i was loose even though there wasnt sexual intercourse although there was a lot of other things. or if he dropped me because i was not loose enough? too uptight? i dont even know what spectrum im in i dont know anything right now. I feel so angry at him, and then he call two weeks later asking for better closure because it was all text messages. It like i broke up all over again, and i told him how much all this hurt me. He said we can be friends and then said he still has feelings for me. I feel so angry i told him NO.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:03pm

  271. 271: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I can’t touch on your side of the subject, sunshine. Just my own view… I seek deep love and bonding. Daily devotions for life. The creation of a family. Not a wedding or a ring. I have what I need with the man I am with. When the time comes that a ring and a proposal come up for me again…I will let you all know how I feel at that time.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:09pm

  272. 272: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    Miss Bells, Im 29. I feel so embarrassed right now talking about my ‘first boyfriend’ at freakin 29 but I had to go to some intense therapy i have gone through some tough history/childhood, first crush disasters, and confidence issues. i told myself whoa im gonna turn 30 i gotta get the first boyfriend in soon. hmmm i kind of wonder that because i never did (atleast an official one) i felt like i had to in order to explore Rori’s circular dating. its like i knew there was a chance it wouldnt work but i wanted to go through it and get that teenager experience in that i never did. but then i thought maybe it will, i really felt attracted to him. at first a dream guy, after some sexual practice he became toxic. Im not sure if i created that dynamic or if it was his doing. I feel determined to know everything and want explanations, but i feel i gotta just let it go. I feel frustrated when i go through something and not understand it because then i feel scared that it will happen again until i know everything:( but i wont.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:14pm

  273. 273: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Re casual sex I feel only able to go by how the dictionary defines it which is the general consensus.
    As any other definition makes no sense whatsoever to me.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:15pm

  274. 274: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I have been through that whole “way” of doing it. Sh1t just gets lost in the abyss. That huge gap between now, and wedding day, and the blank canvas beyond it can become anything…If you are unaware. If or when we get married it will be just another jewel to fit into the sparkling tapestry of my life. Not something I will do whatever it takes to achieve. Not something I feel much about, anymore, one way or the other.


    Thank you for this opportunity to touch upon this facet of my life, and see what it looks like today.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:18pm

  275. 275: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Honestly I skipped over this article and went ro comments, after the first few paragraphs….I felt it was hard to read and I didn’t really feel compelled to follow the process ..
    I guess I don’t “get it” and the blog has a catty feeling to it…ick

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:19pm

  276. 276: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    When people assert things but then when challenged on that assertion for evidence to back up that assertion and claim fail to do so It feels very difficult to take what they say seriously as I feel unable then to see any tangible substance behind what they assert. mmmm.

    Oh well it is what it is.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:23pm

  277. 277: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    Annie it is your vagina; do whatever you want with it lol

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:25pm

  278. 278: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    part of me even questions if im all about marriage. I dont know, i like my independance my own room, own space, own plans. however when i think about being with someone it feels nice. Just my own religious views but I guess if God likes marriage because he doesnt want anyone to be alone, then its gotta be a good thing. I love God he is only love and greatness, he wants the best. I believe if God wants love for me than I bet its great, i feel its gotta be great even if it means i wont have my safe space. I bet in the meantime I will just have faith it will, I dont want sex with more than one theres too much scary stuff out there, broken hearts, broken condoms, std’s uh uh no thanks… i feel like a prude and I like it :p I feel strong and fiery, like I can turn my back to what i dont like

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:25pm

  279. 279: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    268 miss bells I feel ick and eww reading ..”I’m an old broad myself ”
    It sounds masculine and self depreciating.
    I feel a grimace on my face as I read it….

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:25pm

  280. 280: shortlittleladyNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so proud of myself right now that I know I’m glowing from the inside out. I feel mushy and scared and excited all at once because of the events of today.

    I have been coming to roris blog for help for awhile now but this is the first time I’ve felt compelled to share myself.

    First, I’m a 28 year old single mother who recently left a relationship with a man who I did not know how to communicate even my very basic needs to. At the end I realized that I didn’t even enjoy him as a friend anymore so it ended.

    I am finding my way through cding slowly but surely because I feel ready to put myself out into the world again and with help from this blog I feel as if for the first time in my life I am finding out who this mysterious and wonderful women is that’s inside of me. I’ve unzippered my heart and with it has come all kinds of new feelings, emotions, sensations and yes, triggers.

    this last weekend I became triggered. I have been seeing a man,let’s call him LH for a couple of weeks and since I am putting roris tools to work for the first time in a relationship I feel excited and scared but its a good kind of scared. My trigger is sex and feeling as if I have to pick up the ball and I majorly overfunction. I was feeling very lonely, and sick, and just down in the dumps sat and I made the mistake of initiating in a drama txt session with LH. It did not make me feel good to do this. I felt downright icky but he handled it well.

    I think my trigger was that I have been chasing this last week and I can feel him pulling away from it and it scared me so today instead of continuing something that was making me feel iccky I just made myself felt so good to stop. Scary yes, but wonderful.

    Instead of messaging him to keep the ball rolling I just went silent unless he initiated contact and said something that made me feel. I’ve been doing great with my feeling messages and with sinking into my emotions instead of stuffing like I’ve done my whole life.

    LH picked up the ball and his last message for the night left me happy, and feeling light and airy and desired. It made me feel that as scary as trying something new is, the end result of these tools makes me feel fantastic and builds on my self pride. Oh and being called sweetheart by a man makes me feel like melting into a pile or goo and i actually told him how it made me feel. He started crashing his boat all over the place!!!

    Oh and btw Ialso told him that I didn’t feel comfortable bbeing exclusive with a man until a serious offer of marriage was on the table and I have been slowly meeting men who I am able to figure out pretty quickly whether or not they should be in my rotation since I’m paying more attention to how I feel instead of how I make them feel.

    I feel perfect. I feel powerful.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:26pm

  281. 281: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels disappointing when I felt open to learning more to see and understandd where others form their beliefs and perceptions from.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:28pm

  282. 282: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    lol, luzydel you too as I said each to their own.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:29pm

  283. 283: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    What is right for you is right for you and visaversa

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:30pm

  284. 284: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    Annie sorry i feel confused did i offend you? im not sure or if its someone else you mean, if so i feel very curious what is going on and what i said that triggered

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:31pm

  285. 285: AnnieNo Gravatar says:


    It feels good to hear your story.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:36pm

  286. 286: AnnieNo Gravatar says:


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:36pm

  287. 287: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine I do not feel offended by anyone.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:38pm

  288. 288: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine, You sound good in your processing. Keep up your beleifs and boundaries and keep growing and feeling and you will eventually learn what’s right for you! And age is just a number to feel rushed about. When you feel fully ready you can have all you desire :-)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:39pm

  289. 289: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    You look aware and inspiring! :-) Welcome to posting!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:40pm

  290. 290: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    thanks Glow stix that feels nice and good and encouraging:)

    i feel good right now like i have some of my energy, I just want to say I love christmas lights theyre beautiful. Their sweet and the glow of each color is powerful, I feel like christmas lights feel nice and warm and full of colors i love their power both as a kid and also now.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:53pm

  291. 291: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Aw that’s lovely Sunshine.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 7:59pm

  292. 292: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    I’m going to give you some space; I feel I created some unnecessary drama. I have been reaching out too much and it doesn’t feel good, I don’t feel feminine when I do that. I want to feel wanted as well… The ball is in your court: nite!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:02pm

  293. 293: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine – “like clothes in a washer.” lol

    I haven’t had time to read all your posts, I just loved that image : )

    And maybe that’s what they are –

    Somewhere I believe Rori says that when we circular date, we’re not supposed to be “looking” for our soul mate. One of the guys could turn out to be a good partner. Or we might meet him somewhere else. But CD-ing is about practicing the tools. Maybe it just keeps our heads and hearts clear for the guys who really are the right partners for us…

    Like washing laundry. Keeping it clean. I love it :-)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:11pm

  294. 294: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    Back in the day “broad” was a term of admiration, not derision. It may have started as a reference to broad womanly hips (good for child birth, a very dangerous activity.) But is came to mean a formidable woman who owned herself. An equal.
    And I LOVE being old!! At least old-middle. I may not care for the vicissitudes of extreme old age as much. We shall see.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:13pm

  295. 295: sunshineNo Gravatar says:

    haha thanks Teareana!! well ive processed a lot since that comment and i feel loosened up from some bent up feelings…hmmm maybe if i loose a sock its ok, i can always mis match! haha

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:16pm

  296. 296: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I like this article. It was raw truth, raw feeling -reality. I’m having a s3x issue in my new round of circular dating. I’m turning it down. And I’m going to embrace and give in to my feelings, and what I want, and don’t want. I’m going to just BE and open up and enjoy myself. I feel so nervous

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:16pm

  297. 297: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    And my partner will be an old dude. I don’t date very far from my age group. No younger than 48 and that is pushing it. To about 63 or 64. Any older and I am afraid I will lose them too soon.

    With HS, I already knew him and had a very old attraction. I didn’t know then what I know now. If i must start over, I’m writing this story MY way.

    P-town is great for gray singles.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:18pm

  298. 298: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I feel very feminine feeling nervous.

    My boy energy kicks in so quickly these days. It feels good to be in my feminine energy.

    I don’t need to say much when I am in my feminine energy! I realized when I’m doing a whole bunch of talking with a CD it’s my BOY energy talking. My Feminine energy prefers to smile and feel and explore and be touched and soothed with genuine words and feeling. Oh yes, and I love feeling feelings from a CD!!! I evoke shock, anger, tenderness, passion – and I CAN FEEL their feelings. I can only describe it as wow!!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:32pm

  299. 299: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Wow, this is crazy. I don’t know if my vibe has shifted or what. I feel about the same. Still processing the dregs of the SYG experience. But not overly so.

    Last night, I attended a CoDA meeting, with a friend who came along. It felt healing and powerful for both of us. And I *still* don’t feel really for a relationship.

    Yet, right about now, all these guys are suddenly telling me how they are still thinking of me. Is it Holiday fever, or what? Lol (and I don’t get the sense that they just want into my pants…this feels different. It feels like it is me they are thinking of, not just my booty. Lol)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:37pm

  300. 300: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t demand anything from my CDs. I find my own way to get my needs met. The most recent problem has been s3x. There are CDs who want to sleep with me and I feel so many different ways about it. . . but it’s about CHOOSING – and I am afraid of what I would choose. This is a time when I need to go deep into my feelings because I’m not understanding my choice. I feel angry about it, and I feel relieved about it, and I feel longing about it. And my choice makes no sense, but there I go in my head again. I feel I need to feel this honestly and feel it all out and not judge myself. I feel a STOP here. Yes, just STOP and feel. And when I feel, it feels right, even if the feeling is confusing and scary and crazy. I feel crazy, and for once in my life, it feels okay to be so all over the place with my feelings. I feel like I get it now. Don’t think.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:38pm

  301. 301: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve decided it’s a good idea (I know this is a “duh” thing, but still…) – it’s a good idea not to just do anything that a guy wants. Like don’t say “yes” just because you like him. Hey, he wouldn’t do that for you. Guys seem to have it easier when I comes to honoring their own boundaries, etc. (or maybe just most guys. Some also have trouble with being “yes men” and run into the same issues as we do when we do it.) but I think for women, it’s more biological, or something. When we like a guy – or at least when I like a guy – it feels so appealing to say yes and do things with him, even if it’s something I wouldn’t do otherwise. I don’t even *realize* that I’m compromising my boundaries and setting myself up to feel resentment. Talk about codependent.

    But awareness is the first step, right?

    The idea of saying no to something because it doesn’t suit me – and not worrying how he feels about it – is a pretty powerful thought. Maybe that’s why my vibe is up? I’ve been compromising a lot less and really looking out for número uno. So who knows.

    Oh yeah, I’ve also initiated a couple of positive interactions with other former dates. I don’t believe I want to date either of them again, so there is no “angle” to it. But it still feels kind of nice to just have light-hearted conversation – as much as they keep it going. And it’s nice to feel the goodwill. :-)

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 8:52pm

  302. 302: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Oxytocin is also produced in social settings. That’s why it feels great for me to spend time with other women – one on one, or in groups. I get my oxytocin on, and I don’t need a man to do it for me! : )

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 9:10pm

  303. 303: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Oxytocin is a social bonding hormone, and has many functions in humans. The strongest effect is with sex and with breast feeding. But it produced in smaller amounts at many other times. People who have shortages of oxytocin have a lot of difficultly with social relationships – all relationships. Not just romantic. It is very hard for them to function.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 9:13pm

  304. 304: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling so triggered …. My dad is treating me poorly and my mom defends it.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 9:18pm

  305. 305: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    I agree Tereana, men do seem so much more able to honor their boundaries. I’m finding myself feeling so much more comfortable doing the same, & speaking my feelings when I feel them being pushed on. It’s interesting to observe the responses I’m getting now that roles are reversing a bit. A mature person Will either backtrack a bit, honor where I’m at, or apologize. It feels so much lighter this way.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 9:40pm

  306. 306: IndigoNo Gravatar says:


    I don’t know if this is true for you, re: your assistant not liking the fact that you are getting together with QZ, but I sense the same thing from my family and friends, so I actually for the moment am keeping it hidden from them when I meet up with my ex.

    I don’t know if this is true for you and your assistant, but in my case I sense it is about extreme protectiveness, they saw me being hurt before and don’t want it for me again. I also sense there is an element of believing I am blindly wandering into a situation which is not good for me. I sense possibly they feel that they provided all this support for me when I needed it, and that I am undoing the healing that I did.

    In my case, it feels too difficult to explain the nuances, and I don’t want to feel judged or having to be explainy, but I don’t really like hiding a part of my life from them either.

    I sympathise with having people in your life not being supportive with you re-connecting to an old love.


    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 9:47pm

  307. 307: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Speaking of boundaries, I just had to block a man on my phone. His texts were getting pretty sexual…to the point of creepiness. Boundary set. *Wham* Yay my amazingly, protective, boy energy!

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:06pm

  308. 308: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve had sexual experiences that have brought me to tears. It felt like my heart was bursting open. I own those experiences. They were my own, & brought me so much closer to myself. I’ve had experiences that were much more physical, & at times even animalistic. It depends on the partner. One hasn’t felt less spiritual than the other, but each have honored something spiritual within myself. To me it all feels connected.

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 10:40pm

  309. 309: RadloveNo Gravatar says:

    As recently as Dec 11, R texted, “Please leave me alone. I don’t want you in my life anymore. Please respect that. I will no longer respond to ur messages or answer ur calls. Good bye.”
    That was in response to me saying I will love him eternally. I texted him two reflective texts last night. Two hours later, he texted at midnight, “Hey. Do you want to talk? R U around?”
    I felt thrilled this morning when I woke up to find those texts. I simply texted “Hi” in response, knowing he usually texts at night.
    Finally tonight he started texting me. All thru this I was feeling unsure what to say:
    R: Hey, what’s up?
    B: Hey
    R: What’s up?
    B: Umm good stuff. How r u?
    R: Huh? What do you mean good stuff? I am fine.
    B: Things are going really well.
    R: Nice. Glad to hear it. What’s going on?
    B: I started a business! I like my new house and housemate, too! What’s going on for you?
    B: I don’t get good cell reception here. I have my cell forwarded to my home phone.
    R: Is this a bad time?
    B: No, not at all. Just sometimes texts go thru right away and sometimes they don’t. I’m way out in the country.
    B: that’s why I got a home phone, because I barely get cell phone signal.
    R: Ok. That’s cool. So is text message no good?
    B: It works sometimes and not others…I have no control over it.
    R: Oh. Tell me about ur business, new house and housemate.
    R: Oh
    B: It’s a blogging system
    B: I live on a two acre horse farm with two horses. My housemate is really sweet and easy to get along with.
    R: I guess u r not getting my messages…
    B: Phone would work better.
    R: Oh. Tell me about ur business, new house and housemate.
    B: It’s a blogging system
    B: I live on a two acre horse farm with two horses. My housemate is really sweet and easy to get along with.
    R: Is ur business doing well yet?
    B: I just started at the beginning of December.
    R: Well, I’m glad to hear things r improving 4 u.
    R: Oh
    B: Anything new for you?
    • That’s it. No response. How am I to perceive this? What should my attitude be? Should I say anything in response? Wouldn’t it have been easier for him to just say, “Hey bitch, I utterly disrespect you!”?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:02pm

  310. 310: RadloveNo Gravatar says:

    As recently as Dec 11, he texted, “Please leave me alone. I don’t want you in my life anymore. Please respect that. I will no longer respond to ur messages or answer ur calls. Good bye.”
    That was in response to me saying I will love him eternally. I texted him two reflective texts last night. Two hours later, he texted at midnight, “Hey. Do you want to talk? R U around?”
    I felt thrilled this morning when I woke up to find those texts. I simply texted “Hi” in response, knowing he usually texts at night.
    Finally tonight he started texting me. All thru this I was feeling unsure what to say:
    R: Hey, what’s up?
    B: Hey
    R: What’s up?
    B: Umm good stuff. How r u?
    R: Huh? What do you mean good stuff? I am fine.
    B: Things are going really well.
    R: Nice. Glad to hear it. What’s going on?
    B: I started a business! I like my new house and housemate, too! What’s going on for you?
    B: I don’t get good cell reception here. I have my cell forwarded to my home phone.
    R: Is this a bad time?
    B: No, not at all. Just sometimes texts go thru right away and sometimes they don’t. I’m way out in the country.
    B: that’s why I got a home phone, because I barely get cell phone signal.
    R: Ok. That’s cool. So is text message no good?
    B: It works sometimes and not others…I have no control over it.
    R: Oh. Tell me about ur business, new house and housemate.
    R: Oh
    B: It’s a blogging system
    B: I live on a two acre horse farm with two horses. My housemate is really sweet and easy to get along with.
    R: I guess u r not getting my messages…
    B: Phone would work better.
    R: Oh. Tell me about ur business, new house and housemate.
    B: It’s a blogging system
    B: I live on a two acre horse farm with two horses. My housemate is really sweet and easy to get along with.
    R: Is ur business doing well yet?
    B: I just started at the beginning of December.
    R: Well, I’m glad to hear things r improving 4 u.
    R: Oh
    B: Anything new for you?
    • That’s it. No response. How am I to perceive this? What should my attitude be? Should I say anything in response? Wouldn’t it have been easier for him to just say, “Hey bi/tch, I utterly disrespect you!”?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:02pm

  311. 311: RadloveNo Gravatar says:

    Well thankfully, that fizzled into a moot issue. His texts weren’t coming thru. I just got a string of 4 texts from R:

    R: I’ll just talk to u another time.
    R: I had a new niece born.
    R: This doesn’t work very well.
    R: Are you getting any of these?
    B: I just got 4 texts in a row. Congratulations on your new niece!!! What’s her name?

    Monday, 17 December 2012 @ 11:19pm

  312. 312: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I feel afraid.
    So I was texting with Curly yesterday…and I freaked. And he noticed!!!
    I believe that is totally my fear of intimacy rearing its ugly head. In one of the texts he said that he would like me to give him some time…
    meaning, some time to get to know him and I will see that he is a good guy…so that was ok.
    And then came a text saying ‘it’s all about you’…all about me? Then I freaked for some unknown reason. And all sorts of thoughts went through my head, like ‘how can it be all about me’, ‘I don’t like it to be all about me’, ;why is he saying that’, ‘what does this mean’….and most loudly ‘noooo. I don’t want anything to be ‘all about me’.
    And then I stopped in my tracks because I realised that is old patterns…bad stuff…so what would I like instead? A man who is ‘all about him?’..well, I has MrP and he was all about himself. Is that what I like?
    I didn’t think so.
    Very interesting….
    Then he sent another text that REALLY freaked me out. And it’s pretty innocent but since I have a real problem imagining anything going on with this man on a physical level…he said ‘if I was there with you now I would give you a foot rub’.
    And I was freaking. Oh wow. How interesting.
    Firstly, I don’t like to talk about being touched…by someone I don’t know so well…I think that’s what it was. And then, I also really don’t like my feet being touched at all. And then I realised that all of this is perhaps unusual and a normal response might have been ‘that would be nice’…well, I just didn’t respond at all anymore.
    How can I heal my ‘scared rabbit state’….hm.
    I am sure it is not him, I would have felt similarly with other men who’d have made those comments.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:20am

  313. 313: TamNo Gravatar says:

    ..and promptly, after all that, I had a nightmare.
    I dreamt I had breast cancer and was in and out of hospital…it was awful.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:33am

  314. 314: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I feel triggered when I see semi-scientific conversations here when people have not educated themselves fully about the facts…in my field of work there are a lot of people claiming to know something when they never took the time to study the basics.
    Oxytocin is a hormone, as far as I understand and have read about it, that much like testosterone, can be produced by many, many ways. All the time.
    Apparently a ‘chat session’ with our friends makes us produce Oxytocin and we feel good, geta high from that.
    For example, did you know that men have Oxitocin too? Apparently in the same amounts as women but it is not an important ‘feel good’ hormone for the, testosterone is. And they don’t just produce more testosterone by sex/women activities, oh no, they produce it when solved a problem, fixing something etc.
    Very simplistic to make it all about sex and orgasms…and it isn’t.
    Oxytocin is even produced in us when we care for someone. Like, listen to them empathetically etc etc.

    To say we are ‘free of Oxytocin’ just because we don’t sleep with a particular man or don’t get bonded to a particular man is like saying ‘I can live without water’. Oxytocin, as far as I understand it (and I am not an expert, but I have read a bit on the subject), is what women need to function and decrease their stress levels. Oxytocin is being produced and consumed by our body every day….and it is one of our most important hormones, making us women…

    So please….

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:53am

  315. 315: TamNo Gravatar says:

    …and our bodies produce it even if we are just cuddling or listening or touching (all women – no exceptions)…and to say it only gets produced during sex is to discount all scientific evidence and research of the last 50 years or so…

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:56am

  316. 316: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    You are correct. Oxytocin is produced all the time. It behaves and is utilized by the central nervous system in a very similar way to seratonin.

    Uhhh…It’s too early for science lol But yeah…It’s not only produced during sex, orgasm, birth, and breastfeeding.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:19am

  317. 317: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Glowstix..thank you :)
    I was just beginning to feel icky about my rant..hehehe. I just like to stick to the facts and not the fiction… :)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:22am

  318. 318: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    It’s definitely nothing to fear. Especially when we can recognize the feelings that go hand in hand with it. We do have conscious awareness and free will 😉

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:29am

  319. 319: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I bonded to C purely through affection. We’ve never had intercourse/penetrative sex.

    It has been quite an intense practice in learning about my attachment system and the effects of attaching to an avoidant type. Ugh.
    And so worth it.

    By sinking deeply into my big, scary feelings, my body has adapted and they aren’t so overwhelming anymore, which also has the added benefit of increasing my capacity to feel the yummy feelings.
    I can take a few deep breaths and induce a full-body orgasm! I do this at work sometimes, just for kicks :)
    A soft caress can do it, too… I “decided” that I can allow just about anyone to have this effect on me. So the unexpected touch on the arm or caress to my lower back will set it off.

    I’m just too juicy and sexy to limit my pleasure capacity to one source! I’m realizing that under the layer of armor and fat is one of those radiant women that everyone in the room wants to be close to and feels good around. More and more I feel at ease in my body, at ease with life, I feel like I’m surrounded by a vast field of billions of points of light, all constantly responding to my being.

    I feel my mind, my heart, my womb, my guts, my p*ssy, my root…all connected and operating in harmony. I feel like I *am* the hum, I *am* the vibration of being, in total alignment with my deepest, truest self and my core and with the fundamental order of existence.
    I feel charismatic!

    I feel strong. I feel capable. I feel totally healed of the depression that debilitated me for YEARS.

    I feel delighted and surprised to notice all of this right now!

    An increased capacity to feel pleasure is the payoff for all of the riffing and diving in and sinking into and sloughing off the muck of judgments, beliefs, terrifying feelings, lies, trauma..whatevah.

    I feel wowed by my own awesomeness :)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:44am

  320. 320: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t want to stop!

    I feel vital! I feel vibrant!
    My fingertips are in love with the keys on the keyboard and every stroke feels like a lover’s caress.

    I wondered, what it might be like, to feel happy to simply be alive and I’m finding out!

    I feel it in my bones, all is well, all is well.
    Yes! Yes feels like a fountain of hot pink that rises up from my belly, up through my center and pouring through my hands, arms raised high above my head.
    My chest feels wide and open and responsive, like a trampoline..a soft place to land and play on,

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:51am

  321. 321: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Bamb – Welcome – and “freaking out” just means you need to know more about yourself and work on the parts that are “drama” instead of emotional. Just saying something “hurts” is drama. Please really work with the ebook (just click on the book cover in the sidebar) and practice with your Circular Dating – That’s what CDing is FOR! Practice and healing… Love, Rori

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:04am

  322. 322: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine: I don’t know if this helps but I have the relationship of my dreams and I credit a lot of it to leaning back and circular dating (and some feeling messages though not really that often). I don’t circular date anymore (sometimes I circular date myself but mostly J and I spend our free time together) but I do still lean back when I know I need to focus on myself for a bit. I use feeling messages when I believe they are necessary but I don’t use them in general conversation.

    In my opinion (might have read this somewhere and might have made it up, I don’t know), there are many degrees to circular dating and we grow and move through those stages as we grow closer and closer to a man and we continue to move through them until a man steps up to claim us.

    When I first started circular dating, I went on actual dates with other men. J hated it but I did tell him (not an actual “no boyfriend” speech but something similar) that I wasn’t ready to commit to him and that I needed to find out what I was looking for. Many times when he wanted to see me, I was on a date with another man. I was honest with him about this but not in a way meant to make him jealous…simply to let him know I wasn’t kidding, I was really dating other men. I didn’t want to give him the impression I was a girlfriend if I really didn’t want to be. I also didn’t want to feel like I was cheating on him. He could have walked away at any time…and sometimes I thought he was going to.

    Soon, he started filling up my time. He would make plans for us and I was spending every weekend out with him and most weeknights too. I still dated once in a while but nothing actually too romantic, I was getting to know other men while growing closer to J.

    After a time, I was only dating J but I was also circular dating myself (taking classes, spending time out shopping alone, getting my nails done, etc). I felt him pull away (or maybe just go off into his own little world needing his version of “me time”, I don’t know…but he was spending a lot of time playing video games and being somewhat crabby) and I would meet a guy friend of mine for coffee after class, etc. Once again, J hated this but…he got off the couch and started dating me again.

    Shortly after this, I was only circular dating myself but always open and smiling with other men, lots of flirting, etc. Never accepting dates or giving the impression I wanted to but being really open with other men.

    Eventually J asked me to move in (actually, he had asked me several times during my CD stage and each time I said no. He also tried giving me a key to his house and each time I gave it back. Even after I stopped circular dating, it took me a long time to feel ready to move it but he hung in there with me through it all). When I was ready I accepted. We had been dating exclusively for a long time at this point but I wanted to really be READY to move in because that was “it” for me (kind of like marriage is for some other women).

    Today, I have stopped the flirting, etc (although I am very friendly to both men and women when we meet and sometimes I think men take that as flilrting or hitting on them) and I make it very clear to any man who “hits on me” that I have a boyfriend and we are happily in love. I have zero patience for men who don’t take that seriously and I shut down any disrespect of my man or my relationship. J does the same with women although it took him a little longer to shut it down in a no-uncertain-terms way. He had some learning to do. :-)

    Now, we are not married and really have no desire to (probably never will but we’ve talked about how things could change and someday we might want that). Right now, we have a lifetime commitment with each other and a spiritual bond. Our plan is to spend the rest of our lives together. We have not gone to a church or a court house to legalize it but we are together for life.

    So…in other words…yes…there is someone here who has the relationship she wants by putting to use the tools Rori details (although circular dating I did – but didn’t have a name for it – before I knew of Rori because it just felt “right” to me. Leaning back I did some of pre Rori but really learned a lot more about it and started using it to feel my feelings after coming here. Feeling messages I completely learned from this site and probably never used them even once before I started getting Rori’s emails).

    Using men…I never did that one. I dated men I was attracted to and had fun with. The ones I would have been using even though I wasn’t attracted to them didn’t get a date two. I never paid for a date but I wasn’t using men to by my meals, I never ended up on a date where a man wanted me to pay. If I had I would have paid my share that night and he wouldn’t have made it to date two. I like to be treated on dates. :-)

    Anyway….long, long explanation of how I used the tools here and zero idea if that will help at all. LOL

    Much Love,

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:08am

  323. 323: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Driving in the snow feels so exhillerating, nerve wracking! So much fun!! I feel like a little kid :-)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:32am

  324. 324: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    The tone on the blog feels a bit different right now. Mostly we seem all supportive as usual. But lately it seems that a couple of women have come on to criticize us. As if all of us here on the blog, working to improve ourselves and our love lives are somehow flawed in a pitiable way.

    I didn’t read what Jessica had to say from the last thread – it sounded incendiary, from Rori’s response to her.

    I did read Sniff’s first comment, however.

    And Sniff, I feel happy for you. You grew up around men, and maybe that makes it easy for you. I’m glad you’ve found something that works. But my guess is that it’s not all peachy all the time – and that’s why you’re here.

    The part of your comment that made me feel resentment and bristled a little, because it sounded condescending to me, was the part about all the rest of us here “not having skills.”

    And I’m sorry – I don’t know how old you are. You sound very young. I personally am not terribly old, and only young according to older people;). But what I can tell you is that many of us (myself included) have skillz up the wazoo, as it were. We are skill masters (misstresses;). I have a ton of skills that have nothing to do with relationship, and many that exactly have to do with relationship. I also find it “easy” to be with guys sometimes.

    The issue here is not a matter of skills. In some ways, it’s a matter of trauma. Many of us were abused as kids, or neglected, or just didn’t get the love that we needed. Or maybe we were hurt later in life, and it’s tainted our experience of relationship. This blog is about HEALING. We learn techniques to help us heal. And when we are whole, then our relationships with work for us, and our “skills” will work for us.

    One thing we don’t need – or at least I don’t need – is your or anyone else’s pity. My experiences are mine, and they are real, and they are valuable exactly as they are. I don’t envy you. I don’t want what you have. I am on my own path, and it’s getting me where I need to go. And I really don’t need your pity, because at the end of it, I will choose, and I will be in exactly the right kind of relationship for me.

    We all come at it from different directions, and we find it at different times. I get that you were most likely being kind or charitable with your comments. But that’s not what this blog is about here. It is not about one person of their “way” being better than another. We are about learning and accepting ourselves and each other and tolerating our differences.

    Since you are new here, Sniff, I don’t want to sound too harsh. But I just want to educate you about what is really going on, that might not be obvious on the surface.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:33am

  325. 325: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I just did something really stupid or rock-stary, not sure yet. One of my Austrian friends posted a video of two very stupid women (kind of hot looking but also you could tell they were dense just by looking at them). They ‘mistook’ a sprinkler for a ‘rainbow’ machine and honestly were saying how they would love to have a rainbow machine. This was clearly not a spoof and dead-serious. Very funny. All the other Europeans remarked how funny that was, and that it’s no surprise the world is coming to an end and such comments….then, as this was rolling down, a comment was made by MrP, who just homed in on the looks (these were very young, maybe late teenage early 20’s women and they looked a bit dense…but made up)….comments
    ‘I don’t know what they are saying but it doesn’t really matter’ with a wink….OMG.
    That is so typical and so stupid and it just made me realise again how lucky I was to get away from him. Wow. If we had still been doing stuff together and I had seen that comment I’d have felt sooooo bad – and I have seen many others like it before and felt bad (he once commented on a friend of his’ daughter calling her a hottie and asking whether he could get her friend’s number, she was maybe 19…I find that very cringey).
    However, being impulsive, I put a comment underneath his saying ‘yeah, the more stupid the better!’.
    I just could not help myself. EEeeeek.
    But I am proud because I was wanting to write ‘for men like you’ or ‘they could move to Florida where the men match that level of IQ, close to zero’.
    But, phew, thank God I didn’t. It was close.
    I amused myself a little….but mainly I am just grateful to be away from this man…forever and ever.

    I compare that with someone like Curly, who also likes to check out beautiful young women and then says that this kind of woman doesn’t interest him at all as, he would rather be with someone who had substance and could talk to him, than women with all this faked up beauty and perfection which is unnatural and boring.
    Actually, most mature men I have met say the same thing. Poor MrP. I have compassion for guys who at over 50, seemingly haven’t learnt much and have to pose on dating websites with all the toys they had to sell and don’t even possess anymore.
    Poor love.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:42am

  326. 326: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Wow, I feel so strongly about ‘no way back’ with this man. I could not even CD him anymore. He just made me feel bad when making comments about beautiful women even when I was with him. Yikes.
    I don’t ever want to feel bad again.
    I want to feel like the prize and the yummy pie, not the consolidation prize when he couldn’t catch anyone else maybe.
    Now I know (remember!!) how it feels to be adored and cherished, I couldn’t ever go back there. Not even for a coffee date.
    Not even for a boat-trip or anything else.
    Not even if he was the last man on earth….hehe.
    What a turn-around in only three weeks.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:48am

  327. 327: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I’ll go out on a limb and say the last thing ANY of us wants is to be pitied.

    Here here Tereana. So beautifully said.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:57am

  328. 328: TamNo Gravatar says:

    ah, how cute. He ‘liked’ my comment and now asked me (using my pet name – bugger), what they were actually saying.
    I told him to go and buy some rainbow machines…hahahahahaha….

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:59am

  329. 329: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine, your posts do strike a chord with me

    Tereana, I am dying to ask what a “wazoo” is,But I agree with Stixy, excellent points well made

    Sounds like you are moving on nicely Tam

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:01am

  330. 330: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    In other news, tosay I am a complete morass of all sorts of unpredictable emotions

    It feels very unsettling as i dont know whats coming next

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:02am

  331. 331: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – Rori says when you are healing feelings show up. You might feel like you are falling over into a pit but when feelings starts coming up you are moving fprward.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:05am

  332. 332: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I hope so FW

    this ——–messy stuff does not feel good at all
    One minute I am in tears, then the next I want to rush off and do something really outrageous

    This does not feel like me

    But of course it is me, and my feelings

    I feel tight in the chest and panicked now

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:08am

  333. 333: TamNo Gravatar says:

    oh, I feel annoyed that communication channels are open again with MrP. Slightly amused but also like it’s a waste of my precious energy and now for him the game is on again and I can’t be bothered.
    No closure then but nothing else either.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:11am

  334. 334: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    In other news I just used a feeling message by test which I think worked

    I was feeling very jealous about something my man referred to in his past
    So I sat with the feeling for a while and didnt reply straight away
    I didnt know what to say and I was feeling scared of saying the wrong thing
    So I texted back that I had been feeling weird but that I felt okay now(which I did after a while)
    he sent a joky text and I felt scared again so didnt reply for a bit
    and then he really opened up, asking me to talk to him and to come back to him

    I just replied that my feelingswere all over the place today and that I was scared of saying the wrong thing

    For once he didnt react badly

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:12am

  335. 335: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Too much spam form me

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:12am

  336. 336: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    327- I have often asked myself the question. Do I just want to be pitied? And sometimes the answer is a flat and fast NO and other times its a, yes please someone notice me! Someone tell me it will all be ok, and that they are so sorry I’m dealing with certain things on my life..
    But now when I think about it, I feel stronger not being pitied, and when ppl do pity me I feel a tense angerous bolt go through me.. Like how dare you pity me…

    Humm this makes me feel all sorts of curious..

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:13am

  337. 337: TamNo Gravatar says:

    He was asking me if I had ever seen a commercial sprinkler before…how bizarre.
    I just replied that I am right now sitting on a combined harvester sorting the wheat from the chaff….as he used to tell me that once I am back in Florida the men will pursue me and I would need a combined harvester to sort that lot.
    He’ll get the message 😉
    He he he…. ‘bugger off, I am dating’….

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:15am

  338. 338: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    334- Ruth.

    That sounds wonderful! Happy for you!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:15am

  339. 339: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, you see…it works…so nice that you tried again!! Trooper!!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:16am

  340. 340: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    337- hahaha this makes me laugh!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:17am

  341. 341: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel amused reading about your conversation and metaphors tam

    Thanks Rebekah

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:17am

  342. 342: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    No one wants pity in the true sense. We crave empathy, understanding, support. A hug. Love.


    “awww you’re so clueless and broken and i’m really glad you have some lady here to help you understand how to be a woman..”


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:18am

  343. 343: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I also scolded him for assuming I had never seen a field sprinkler before (I am a country girl and he is a city boy)….hehehe…zero reply. He hates it when people get all clever on him and make him wrong (like any man would). Point is, I don’t care anymore, because I am done. No more authentic sharing, no more feeling messages…not with this one.
    I feel so free, like I can say what I want and don’t give a rats arse what he thinks…..
    Oh I love that feeling.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:19am

  344. 344: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    it works if i dont express my immediate feelings———yes

    have to wait and process until a slightly less negative feeling comes up

    My immediate feeling was Yuck
    If I had expressed that, well

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:19am

  345. 345: TamNo Gravatar says:

    oh he liked my comment…and a smiley face…hahaha…oh he is a pussy cat now!!
    I feel so amused.
    Sorry for spamming but this is hilarious…too funny.
    Well, whatever.
    He got the message.
    It can spur him on all he likes, I am DONE :)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:20am

  346. 346: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Go ruth woopwoop!

    The wazoo…A slang/metaphorical term for vagina.

    “I’ve got feeling messages out the wazoo!”


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:22am

  347. 347: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Yes Stixy
    I want empathy, not pity

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:24am

  348. 348: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    thanks stixy

    I prefer Foufie, but a wazoo sounds like a powerful thing

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:25am

  349. 349: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    That’s exactly how it was for me in the beginning. Feeling, waiting, expressing gently. After some time, (nearly 2 years for me! Buckle in 😉 )it will become easier to do in the moment and once that finally comes, before you know it you’ll be processing in real time.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:25am

  350. 350: TamNo Gravatar says:

    now he is complimenting me…some men are so funny. When they know that they have lost out, they start to row again. Oh how predictable.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:28am

  351. 351: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    342- GlowStix

    Umm yeah thats just nasty feeling when you read it…

    “No one wants pity in the true sense. We crave empathy, understanding, support. A hug. Love.”

    – this really makes me start to understand why I have tense feelings about ppl openly pitying me. It’s not the response I want or needed in the moment. There’s usually no empathy/understanding/support/or even love, when its been offered.. Just a pretense a show..

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:28am

  352. 352: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Oh yeah. I’ve got power out the wazoo too 😉

    I’ve only ever heard this term used in this way… “out the wazoo” for things you have an abundance of within you, and “up the wazoo” for things you are over-run with…

    “xmas gifts up the wazoo”. :)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:28am

  353. 353: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I must listen to that bit in Reconnect which says we can choose which feeling to feel out of the soup

    At the end of the day, this is all about me feeling better

    I cant feel much worse, I suppose
    so, the only way is up

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:29am

  354. 354: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Exactly!! Pity comes from a place of assuming “I am better than you.” And truly, none of us are better than anyone else. Some may be within more “ideal” circumstances…When it comes down to it we all are living a human experience and most of our core feelings would be nearly the same if living someone elses circumstances. With exception, of course. When we can say “I see how you are feeling, and I get it.” even if we wouldn’t feel the same…We are within empathy.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:35am

  355. 355: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth I don’t see it as spam. Sounds like processing that is building your awareness. It also sounds like you might have discovered his attention language. The space you created while sinking into your feelings before responding obviously changed your vibe. Your feelings were bouncing around but the words you choose communicated that you were taking responsibility for them.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:42am

  356. 356: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I feel like spamming, spamming, spamming.
    I was having a full blown convo with MrP on fb.
    The more rude I got, the more he complimented me. That just feels weird and counterintuitive.
    Now I told him to work on his spelling and punctuation and apostrophies….honestly, it feels like fun trying to wind him up – it is usually very easy.
    And he isn’t having it…or fighting back…I feel amused. Trying to get into my good books? too late and waaaaaay too little. But funny nonetheless.
    Gonna stop now though, got better things to do.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:42am

  357. 357: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – I don’t think “yuck” is a feeling. It seems to me like an expression to push an actual feeling away. Do you think you could put words to the in the moment feeling that is descriptive.

    “If you express correctly what has happened for you and how you feel and what you need and how you reacted that’s when change happen in a relationship. That’s when intimacy starts”.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:46am

  358. 358: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    354- GlowStix, Yes yes aww this is going to help me so much when trying to convey my understanding to N when he rants about work:) yay good stuff.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:46am

  359. 359: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    357 FW
    I will think on this one
    You could well have a point there

    Yuck is just a general horrible feeling, I suppose a bit like when Rori used “ick” but yes, maybe I need to look deeper

    Im not going to use it any more

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:49am

  360. 360: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    It felt like I got punched in the stomach. I feel like running away and hiding in a closet like a little girl.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:53am

  361. 361: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Actually, having thunk a bit more on it, using “yuck” feels a bit lazy
    More attention to detail required

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:54am

  362. 362: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ouch I feel crushed

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:57am

  363. 363: TamNo Gravatar says:

    I feel super amused, I had so much fun!!!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:58am

  364. 364: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel a bit anxious now
    Are you giving me examples or are you actually feeling those things you posted?

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:59am

  365. 365: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    I feel all shaky inside and that feels like running away and crying

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:59am

  366. 366: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – just throwing some things out there to recreate the moment that might jog your subconscious into going back into the feeling to identify exactly what the “yuck” was.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:00am

  367. 367: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    massive torrent of relief there

    Thank you FW

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:01am

  368. 368: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I felt angry
    I felt jealous
    And I felt afraid-and not good enough

    whoops more tears

    this isnt easy is it

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:03am

  369. 369: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    massive torrent of relief there

    PHEWWWWWW…………..It feels like a boulder just got pulled off my shoulder

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:03am

  370. 370: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Well, got to hand it to him, he is a good sparring partner verbally, if not a partner for anything else 😉

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:04am

  371. 371: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I feel Iam not moving forward as fast as I’d like..
    I do so much better when learning new things in a close personal sometimes face to face group, where I can ask as many questions as I want over and over and over if I need and not feel worried I will be chastised or no longer taken seriously, or worse become an annoyance..

    Aw fear of being an annoyance, feeling like Iam not worth the attention, my questions are not worth a response. My lack of self drives me to creat outcomes by toning myself down, not being the true me.
    I love my fear of being an annoyance, I know I only feel this way because that is how I see myself, I love my version of me.. I can grow beyond this.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:05am

  372. 372: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    thats enough for now
    I can only blame the streaming cold for red eyes for so long

    I dont think I would actualy be able to say ANY of that to him
    Its all negative , and quite likely to be perceived as criticism
    I suppose I have felt it though, which is a start

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:05am

  373. 373: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    I feel my heart drop to the ground. It feels awful. I feel so not enough. And I dont want to feel that way with you. Can you help me with this?

    This one I saved from Dominique but I suspect to share so much at once your guy might only be able to take it all in after he opens up a bit.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:06am

  374. 374: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Yes FW

    I do not feel that he would be able to take all that right now

    I just read Dominiques book
    This might be why I feel like a simmering cauldron of emotions today

    (Ive actualy just texted the latter to him)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:09am

  375. 375: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth you could say it. Or maybe dramatize like put you hand to your heart and say aaawww my heart.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:10am

  376. 376: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    and now I feel like eating an enormous quantity of food or drinking a load of gin

    Clearly I want an anaesthetic for the feelings

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:12am

  377. 377: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Honestly FW
    Its too negative and he would feel criticised
    thats one of his triggers

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:13am

  378. 378: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:13am

  379. 379: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Also maybe he doesnt *need* to know about the not good enough and all that
    It is my issue to heal
    its not his

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:14am

  380. 380: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – trying sandwiching things.

    First appreciate him spending time to listen to you and talking to you, let him know that you feel happy with him, then share what you might consider negative. Just that you have to be comfortable with the negative. Then close off with a positive.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:16am

  381. 381: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I dont think I do feel comfortable with the negative stuff
    It feels overwhwlming and i feel out of control and irrational and-unsafe
    And destructive like a nail bomb might be
    Or something

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:18am

  382. 382: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    He doesn’t need to know but speaking the truth transparently deepens relationships and helps to heal you. Otherwise they are churning around under the surface and you run the risk of spewing because they definitely leak out.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:19am

  383. 383: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth I believe identifying those that you are not comfortable with, jist noticing them and telling them thank you might help you.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:20am

  384. 384: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    383- thumbs up!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:22am

  385. 385: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Most of the time I feel too big and loud in a writinf based setting. This is good for me. I am learning to be big and loud in real life and love this about myself. And big and loud feeling, to me, I assume might actually just look like normal, vibrant girl talking at a reasonable volume lol It just FEELS so big and loud. Compared with what I have been my whole life, which is small and quiet.

    As I sit here I realize none of this has ever hindered men from being drawn and attracted to me. What it hindered was my ability to feel calm and good. Which brings up fear and anxiety. Which becomes toxic after turning to bitter and resentful.

    And yeah…Now i’m way down a rabbit hole. :-p

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:22am

  386. 386: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I am not expressing myself so well here

    If I have a very negative reaction to what was essentially a throwaway comment about his past, because of *my* issues around not feeling good enough-then does he need to know about that in detail?

    Lots of very powerful but negative stuff which is *my* baggage, and *my* stuff to heal

    I totally agree that I need to feel this and work through it.
    But does he need the full negative nasty processing in detail??

    I dont know

    Maybe I just need to share that I am feeling emotional or uncomfortable and am processing through this

    What do you think?

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:23am

  387. 387: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    383 FW

    yes, I feel safe with that one
    I think I can do that

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:24am

  388. 388: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    I feel fascinated with you right now…

    Perhaps releasing *gently* one nail at a time. Not aimed in any direction…Just, plop. Out. Over time, decompressing that “time bomb” feeling.

    I this visualization feels calming, to me at least.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:26am

  389. 389: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I remember, when I first started getting really into releasing my feelings I would say them as if I was fascinated with them, myself. And I was…like, “oh…I feel irritated…wow. Hmmm.”

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:28am

  390. 390: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    You have to:
    (1) like who you are
    (2) accept who you are, and
    (3) love yourself,

    …before you can expect to experience great success with relationships.

    When you let go of the need to control every word you say around a man, you start relaxing. You start feeling like you can just be YOU. You respond authentically to what he has to say.

    Mirabelle Summers

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:33am

  391. 391: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    I don’t personally share all that stuff with him. I get to pick, and choose what I share. Some things are just for me. Some things for just him. Some for me and my support group (you all) some things for all, and him.

    And in fact, picking and choosing for myself and feeling confident in those choices, and knowing they are right, because they are by me, for me, is a cornerstone of my self confidence.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:34am

  392. 392: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Moment by moment interaction being different, in that I process in real time, at this point. Mostly, what comes up, comes out. Unless I feel blocked. Which is a feeling all to itself. A stumbling, throat catch of words. Sometimes I’ll actually go “ahhh echhh ohhhf” stut-stutter lol

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:38am

  393. 393: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    GlowStix 385..

    Yes I feel like I am speaking too much, I have always practiced being seen and not heard. Growing up I was very good at this, and as I got older I clung to this as a security blanket.. Now I want to uncover and be seen lol

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:39am

  394. 394: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    thank you ladies
    Another thing I just thought about
    I used to be really quite good at creative writing, and even did English languae A level along side my three sciences which I needed for med school
    I then spent the next n number of years being told to stop using flowery language and get to the point concisely.
    To be fair, thats quite important in my job

    But it does mean that I might be a little more stuck in expressing feelings
    This is one reason I do Namowrimo each is helping to release that block
    (and I still sneak in the odd pretty word into a clinic lettr)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:41am

  395. 395: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Hmmm sometimes my block feels like a vacuum…Suspending my feelings outside and around me as they come up. It feels incredibly difficult to pull them back through me and up and out of my mouth. This kind of block produces palpable silence around me. The kind of silence that holds it’s breath and waits for my words to exhale. This feel…Ohhh…heavy in my head and tight in my belly and some kind of energy in the space around me and us. I believe this is what he referrs to when he says he can sense when something’s up. Heck yah he can! That sh1ts physical :-p

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:46am

  396. 396: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Ahhh ruth

    I love words! I wrote a 2 page journal entry using lovely words to express my love for words.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:52am

  397. 397: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Its physical all right

    I recall once being amazed at just how physical grief could be
    At the time I was in enough of a bad way to have totally depersonalised, and it was like observing myself from the outside

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:52am

  398. 398: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I love words too
    But I have bad writers block still

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 9:54am

  399. 399: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – ing you did it ! I feel teary ! Yay connection


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:03am

  400. 400: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, I’ve felt really moved reading your posts x

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:07am

  401. 401: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Right now I dont feel so much open as -raw
    My heart feels like a huge great red pulsating blob
    feels too much
    I feel too full
    I feel like I want to push it all away

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:08am

  402. 402: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Radlove from previous thread. Yes the relationship ending also led to the breakdown of other relationships which feels sad. I’ve continued them in ways I can but not like it use to be. But now I feel like actually it was those other relationships which probably held the one with my ex together for longer than it should have.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:10am

  403. 403: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I cant push it away cos it is part of me
    big heavy stone trying to rip through my chest wall
    Enough please

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:10am

  404. 404: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    FW from previous thread. Thank you for your hug.

    I’m going to take a card round to her and say hello.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:11am

  405. 405: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Sunshine, re circular dating. I understand your discomfort around dating more than one guy. I’m starting to date for the first time at 29. I have a lot of triggers I’m working through but so far so good. Before I’ve always been loyal to a guy right from the first kiss and had long term relationships. This has not served me. I’m learning so much about myself.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:12am

  406. 406: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I really do feel there is something to releasing words.. Not only are you noticing them and hopefully understanding them on some level but I feel like you are opening yourself up to not let them get to you. Kid if this makes sense, but like I just noticed an expectation I didn’t really realize I had, and then when the situation came up where I had the expectation I felt a release when I notice the expectation.. Ugg I don’t even understand myself what I’m trying to say lol

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:14am

  407. 407: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    So tonight ambulance cd texed to say he has no money until he is paid as he has overspent on his family thus weekend for Xmas. He didn’t ask me to pay, just said honestly that we would have to go somewhere cheap but he was looking forward to seeing me.

    I’m seeing cycle cd on Saturday night too.

    I thought 2cd would have disappeared a bit after I spoke my truth but he’s texting again. He feels clingy.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:15am

  408. 408: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Hot tears
    heart contracts
    Thinking of a bright blue, which seems to help
    have NO idea what I was just feeling, but I didnt like that much

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:15am

  409. 409: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Right, I feel like less of an alien now
    Hello Smile, and thank you
    Your CD ing seems to be going well.I feel inttrigues as to how this works in the UK
    Rebekah, releasing and letting go of stuff is good

    Im not sure if I feel better or not for that lot up there
    Maybe I will tomorrow
    it used to take about 48 hours for my therapy sessions to do anything and move me forward

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:18am

  410. 410: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth and tam re men paying for dates in uk… I had a 2 year relationship where he paid for everything. I was totally wined and dined. He was not well off though.

    Strummingman had no money. I had to pay for everything. I felt like his bank.

    The dates I have been on so far the guys have paid. Ambulance cd bought a bottle of wine which lasted the date which I felt great about as it meant I didn’t need to worry about the next round.

    The feeling I’m getting is that men like to take women out. Especially in the first few dates.

    I feel comfortable with offering, I dint feel comfortable with assuming but most good men at this point I feel would say no.

    This is just my experience so far.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:20am

  411. 411: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth re circular dating. I’ve been really honest with guys when they have asked about other dates I’ve been on. Because I’m online dating they almost ‘expect’ you to be going on other dates and talking to other guys.I guess as dates goes on another conversation might be had around this.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:23am

  412. 412: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    that is interesting Smile
    Just recently I have not immediately pulled my purse out to pay on two occasions and the person I was with just stepped up and paid
    Not sure how *i* feel about it
    I do earn a good wage you see

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:23am

  413. 413: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Ive never on line dated Smile

    maybe things have actually changed

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:24am

  414. 414: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – yes ! You Go ! For some reasons the posts w the feelings and the cauldron feel so… sexy !

    Omg ! It’s like amazing :) yay!

    I want to feel like a simmering cauldron of emotions.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:26am

  415. 415: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    399 Daria
    thank you

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:26am

  416. 416: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    Is it okay to have a relationship where we are devoted to each other but only see each other once or twice a week? because of busy lives and an hour of distance?

    is it possible to build a devoted relationship this way?

    in general, i am busy 3-5 nights a week and one weekend day.

    i don’t want to stop living my full life.

    i want a man who also has a full life in taking care of himself and is thrilled to see me when we have the time. i want an understanding that after our own lives (work, friends, self care and enrichment), we come first in each other’s lives

    but we only see each other 1 or 2 times a week.

    is this okay?

    seriously… is it?

    it’s what i need. i don’t want to stop going to dance rehearsals, reiki class, acupuncture/spa, etc., taking care of my house, going to the gym, going to bed early to get enough sleep during the week, focusing on my job, etc. i don’t. but i have the belief that if i don’t make forming a relationship my top priority, I am going to lose.

    I remember Rori said in targeting mr right to tell your girlfriends you don’t have time for them as a priority because you’re dating.

    please chime in!!!!!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:28am

  417. 417: VioletteNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth I love the discussion about how dating is different in the US and Europe. I’ve dated in both and I’ve wondered how to apply these tools there (I’m in the US now). It’s so interesting to me (:

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:29am

  418. 418: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Starla, I would ‘cross that bridge’ when I get to it.

    I have ruminated about these things so much and in hindsight it was always different when it actually happened, priorities change, lives change, people move.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:32am

  419. 419: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I really cant see why not
    It sounds like an ideal situation to me

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:34am

  420. 420: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Smile, hm….I never had that experience in the UK but then I had a bf most of the time and when I dated a litte, I probably used to get ‘the next round’ or ‘the next dinner’…I would just assume that is how it is…so maybe I was actually directing it towards that.
    Generally I also believe men like to take a woman out, for sure on the first few dates…I kind of had that experience in Europe too though less common there.
    Here it seems almost an insult to some men when I offer to contribute.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:34am

  421. 421: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Violette, I am in an older age group so may be out of date vis a vis dating in Europe

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:36am

  422. 422: TamNo Gravatar says:

    So Curly texted me and I wrote back that I was swimming at lunchtime.
    He said ‘are you teasing me, why don’t you send me a photo’
    No buddy. I wasn’t teasing you. I was telling you that I was swimming at lunchtime. And not a photoshoot either….grr.
    Well, he is a man after all, I suppose. Even if he is ancient.
    Feels weird. I get freaked out way too easily…I guess.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:36am

  423. 423: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Rori said that about girlfriends?

    ooh, Im not sure about that one at all
    feels wrong

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:37am

  424. 424: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Hi tam!

    Ladies I will post on my return! Off out now for a Xmas evd with friends

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:39am

  425. 425: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:



    Just wow…And (((hugs)))

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:39am

  426. 426: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Well, I don’t know but I do understand that a man can get fed up when we go out with our gf’s 6 days a week and have one night a week reserved for him…a man who wants to be with us that is.
    Just sayin’

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:39am

  427. 427: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I feel really amused and almost-well disbelieving
    I have said NOTHING remotely “fruity” on here
    But I have been texting and mailing naughty stuff all day!
    How the H8LL did you pick that up over the internet

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 10:42am

  428. 428: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Hi Starla, I feel like so much of that depends on you, & where you are in your life. The 1-2 days a week used to be ideal for me. Now it’s not. It feels okay to start off, but I want a progression toward spending more time together. Like you I have a full life, filled with things I’m passionate about. It’s a balance.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:15am

  429. 429: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Whoo! I’m collaborating with a perfomance artist, getting a dance piece together for the new year. This is one of my major dreams!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:18am

  430. 430: MelNo Gravatar says:


    “It feels overwhwlming and i feel out of control and irrational and-unsafe
    And destructive like a nail bomb might be”

    I think I would share this. This feels real and the reverse of blamey. It’s you owning your feelings, and it feels like whatever followed would be entirely personal and not simply negative.

    Like… Oh, I know this sounds irrational…. I FEEL irrational. I feel jealous for no reason, and that’s my stuff… but I still FEEL it. And I don’t want to.

    You are sooooooo sireny today Ruth!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:36am

  431. 431: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    How fabulous!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:48am

  432. 432: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Mel, No
    he would run a mile

    but thank you

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:49am

  433. 433: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I feel like writing some feeling messages to use for the rest of the days in December. And some scripts too. I’m advancing my Feminine Energy Marathon to the spoken (feeling) word now. No requests, no demands, no “conversation,” just responses and feeling messages.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:03pm

  434. 434: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I feel

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:04pm

  435. 435: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    Va va va va voom!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:05pm

  436. 436: MelNo Gravatar says:

    (((Ruth))) It’s funny, because I felt myself leaning forward reading your feeling messages… you had me hanging on your words. I did not feel like running away. At all. But yes, sometimes men need very small little bursts of feeling. At first….

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:07pm

  437. 437: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth how about not deciding what he “would” do and just focus on changing your dance steps as he does what he does.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:08pm

  438. 438: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Ahhh, the many layers of healing. I fell asleep last night totally embracing my awesomeness.Today I feel tired & edgy. My mother has an operation to remove the cancer from her breast tomorrow, & I’m half a country away. Ahhh. Sending so much love, & healing energy her way.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:12pm

  439. 439: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i am having a crazy food craving. that is all.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:12pm

  440. 440: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    “bursts of feeling”
    that feels okay

    FW.He reacts so badly to feeling messages that he wont talk for days
    he gets scared about feelings in general outside the rori stuff, if I go back

    I do feel that I should process this stuff inside me first

    Thrown out raw, as it is, as I feel, seems too much for him to handle
    well, I dint efen handle it that well, do i

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:14pm

  441. 441: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    436 Mel
    but you are in touch with your feelings
    Maybe he isnt
    I dunno, I do feel that I have to tread carefully
    This is all new
    Its okay for me to screamand rant and feel the feelings
    but not yet in his presence
    Before Rori I did express my full feelings(as best I knew how) and he withdrew
    so, baby steps for now
    Its not so much about him anyway really
    I just need to feel better

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:18pm

  442. 442: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    433 Love always
    Feminine energy marathon?
    I feel intrigued

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:19pm

  443. 443: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i am seeing a lot of negative beliefs to almost a stubborn extent, ruth. like you’re dead set on believing things won’t change, instead of believing that even the slightest tweak could produce a shift (believe me, girl, it can!)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:22pm

  444. 444: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    443 Starla
    Yes, i am stubborn, tis true
    But i DO think things can change, otnerwise I wouldnt be here
    its more change in ME first

    Im not trying to change him, or us
    Not yet

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:25pm

  445. 445: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Been badly burned by trying feeling messages before i got them properly
    dont want to have those really nasty interactions again

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:27pm

  446. 446: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    ooh i agree it’s change in you first.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:28pm

  447. 447: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I can be a bit too impatient and a bit too full on

    That is what I did “wrong”
    And i wsnt authentic enough

    I need to work on self, but i will keep doing the odd little neutral or nice FM as practice as I go along my own journey

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:31pm

  448. 448: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    445, i have been burned too trying some suggestions to the T. Like saying “i’m just a girl here…” to QZ always always rubbed him the wrong way. We do have to tweak according to our own personalities and situations. Daria suggested saying instead, “i’m the kind of girl who…” and that went over much better!

    practice and experiment:)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:32pm

  449. 449: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Starla, thats helpful


    Indeed one size does not fit all

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:36pm

  450. 450: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    this morning i realized that i had no right sending my mom a letter about her needing to get help for her psychological issues was absolutely not the way to go. i realized that the reason she triggered me so badly, apart from the fact that she’s my mom and she abandoned me, is that i have parts of her psychological issues in me that aren’t fully healed.

    and my therapist and i have been talking about confronting her to get her to leave me alone or shape up. but i think i should be talking to my therapist about the things i still do myself that i consider ‘bad’ behavior from her.

    what you don’t like about yourself triggers you.

    she is the closest thing i have to a mirror in this world.

    i feel lighter, like a burden is getting resolved.

    the resolution is through me (for now). me! i have the power to change and heal.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:39pm

  451. 451: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    “this morning i realized that i had no right sending my mom a letter about her needing to get help for her psychological issues was absolutely not the way to go.”

    should say “AND was absolutely not the way to go”

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:45pm

  452. 452: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Hey Starla
    the minute I realised that it was up to *me* how i choose to feel(I was 42) about my parents
    it felt so liberating
    They did what they did
    they did what worked for them at the time evn what they thought was best for me
    it might not have been, well, it wasnt
    But that was then, and this is now, and——-it doesnt matter
    They still try to replay the same patterns-like im so helpless and cant cope(FFS, I deal with peoples lives day in day out)
    But, actully, not my issue
    I bear no anger anymore
    they did aht they thought was best
    I look after me now and repsect their views but i dont have to live by them anymore

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:49pm

  453. 453: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    well ruth my mom is a pathological liar and manipulator and i’ve told her before we can’t have a relationship until she fixes this (this was 3+ yrs ago) and now she’s crossing boundaries and acting very unsettling toward me.

    i realized that what bothers me about her is still part of me. sometimes i do lie and manipulate (i’m not sure i’ve ever lied here or to anyone here, though! i feel safe here) when i feel unsafe, though when i was younger it was awful and out of control.

    i wish to heal this in myself.

    then i can worry about this same behavior in her

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:57pm

  454. 454: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    well, then you just need to distance yourself
    Family aint sacrosanct

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 12:59pm

  455. 455: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    oh god, i feel queazy, like nothing with QZ will ever work

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:02pm

  456. 456: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    Now stoppit
    Just have the coffee date and see what happens

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:06pm

  457. 457: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    454 i have been, and i communicated it too, but my mom is just a certain way. she’s been cyber stalking me and emailing me about the things she finds, and it’s creepy. she also has my grandma put the phone on speaker so she can hear what’s happening in my life (without telling me!), and then my mom emails me about the things she eavesdropped (“tell your best friend congrats on ________”)

    it severely disturbs me that she would rather go to these lengths than just see a therapist and quit being a pathological liar about everything.

    the final straw was when she called me in the middle of class in college to tell me she had a severe cancer. she was making it up for attention. i cried so hard when i thought my mom was going to die of cancer… a cancer that i am at risk for.

    the second final straw was while i was on the cruise with my family over the summer for the first time, I learned that my mom convinced my grandma (they live together because my mom won’t keep a job) to withdraw over a hundred thousand dollars and keep it in cash in the house!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    my mom is a liar and a thief!

    when she kicked me out of the house in high school, before she disappeared and i emancipated, she wrote my boss at the time a letter about how i abused her (i didn’t!!!!!) and ended the letter by saying if my boss needed to fire me now, she would take my job. the thing was, before my mom kicked me out, i was paying the rent……….. she kicked out her gravy train and then tried to take my job from me (which is really effed up — that job was all i had to stop me from starving to death and having to prostitute myself during high school to have a roof over my head)

    my boss let me read the letter and said she didn’t buy a word of it. whew. i was saved

    i did eventually end up homeless but i hung on for a couple of years before that happened. i called my mom, who was back in touch with me and admitted i hadn’t done anything wrong and living in my city again, to ask if i could sleep there one night. she said her boyfriend probably wouldn’t like that.

    later on she lived with a different boyfriend for many years. i visited once and he sexually assaulted me right in front of her. she was jealous, but that was the core of her being upset.

    i never went back

    over the years things got worse and worse.

    then she lied about dying of cancer


    i used to lie about being sick. i used to lie about why my bills weren’t paid. i used to lie about ANYTHING i felt necessary to keep people taking care of me and approving of me.



    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:11pm

  458. 458: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    456 ruth
    yes mum:)


    aw i feel a lot of love for you right now

    i can feel that you’re a good person and i feel blessed that you’re payin attention to me at the moment:)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:12pm

  459. 459: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Starla – I would think it doesn’t matter, it’s what works for you to see if this guy is for you for marriage , when yall live together.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:18pm

  460. 460: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    :: Protectiveness vs. Trust ::

    Sometimes we think our “job” as parents is to
    protect our children from ever experiencing pain.
    Parenting then becomes an endless series of
    warnings, both subtle and dire.

    This approach backfires as it disconnects children
    from their *inner* Guidance.

    When we allow them to risk the pain of skinned knees
    and bruised egos, they hone their ability to follow
    their Pleasure. When we don’t *impose* guidance on
    them, they learn to *seek* our guidance when they
    really need it.

    Riding bicycles one day with my daughter, I was
    about to warn her as she approached a patch of loose
    gravel, but something in me said, “Button your lip,

    My gut told me there was no serious danger, and she
    stood to gain more whole-body wisdom by *feeling*
    the looseness of the gravel than by being made to
    *think* about it.

    As your child discovers his or her world, notice
    when you’re about to offer advice, ask yourself
    whether it’s really necessary, and trust *your*
    Inner Guidance.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:18pm

  461. 461: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Oh Starla
    I know thay say Blood is thicker than water an all that but I dont buy it
    what I have read here makes ne feel angry and sad
    God, I had issues with my folks but that sort ofthing, well, i would walk away
    you dont need it in your life you really dont
    and dont feel guilty, you are just taking care of yourself and your future children xxx

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:19pm

  462. 462: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve never heard a guy in sex, ‘I was so mad, she was just using me for her own pleasure’

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:23pm

  463. 463: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I think you outgrew your mom starla

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:23pm

  464. 464: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    ‘That’s what Slacker Skills are all about – knowing where to invest your time, energy and attention for the full benefit of the vibration.  To only take action when it’s inspired. No matter how much sense it does or doesn’t make.  Otherwise, you’re not only wasting your time, but creating contrary energy that holds up your progress.

    Sometimes that inspiration takes us places we don’t expect or can’t explain.

    But following the feel good and tending the energy (rather than the action) is what it’s all about.’

    ~ janette Maw

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:28pm

  465. 465: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    yeah, i would never bring my future children around my mom. she is dangerous. when i was 9, we got into an argument about if i could go outside to play, and she put a razor to her wrists and said she was going to kill herself because i didn’t love her enough to want to stay inside.

    this is just one example of many.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:38pm

  466. 466: TamNo Gravatar says:

    462 Daria…very funny. Neither have I!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 1:47pm

  467. 467: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    462 Neither have I. I’m sure a woman can get plenty of one night stands that way….no issues there. Oh…she can also get booty calls and drunk texts and backup plan calls and even 2am doorbell rings. Plenty of men out there willing to sleep with a woman who’s using him. Plenty of them. I’ve actually seen evidence of it out here on the internet many, many times.

    Hopefully she doesn’t meet a man who started to have feelings for her when he found out he was being used. Hopefully she doesn’t decide she’s falling in love with him when she tells him he’s just being used. Hopefully the people involved have no feelings, emotions, love, concern or empathy for other human beings. If that’s the case, I’m sure all can work out for the very best and they, as a couple can last more than a week.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 2:01pm

  468. 468: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I would lean towards thinking that if a woman is ONLY using a man for sex, and desires no more than sex, then she might not be too worried that she’s only getting FWBs or one night stands. It’s what she is out to get.

    Rori is saying to shift your perspective of sex. To see that sex with a man can be a tool to heal ourselves if we know how to look at it the right way. If we’re contemplating sleeping with him, which OP seems to be doing, we can see it as beautiful, pleasurable and important to our process instead of something to be afraid of. She’s not advising women to go about harming men emotionally.

    Unless we are laying there like a wet carpet we ARE using a mans body to gain pleasure EVERY time we have sex. If a man is using sex to give us pleasure and we are receiving that we are using his body to gain pleasure. Would it feel better if I used the wort “utilize” instead? It’s all the same thing.

    It’s actually hard for me to wrap my brain around the concept of doing so maliciously. It doesn’t even compute! A woman capable of being malicious with sex and using men a)is unlikely to be on this site, and b) probably doesn’t need rori’s help in that area. She’s likely to have that down all on her own.

    This argument feels so…I dunno. Cyclical. Silly. Jumping right to the worst possible outcome, which is so unlikely it doesn’t even compute in my mind! And it feels like saying men need protection from a woman who might do this in this way.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 2:54pm

  469. 469: TamNo Gravatar says:

    468, exactly Miss Glowstyx 😉

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 3:01pm

  470. 470: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    last night i went to the salon and got my hair dyed and did and my eyebrows did….

    and i feel so beautiful

    the chemical peel made my skin look the best it’s ever looked

    my teeth are all white now:)

    i’m 5 sizes smaller from when i was with QZ

    he is gonna be SHOCCCCKKKKED. or maybe he just remembers me as beautiful since he always thought iwas

    and i’m curious to see what kinds of men talk to me now that i look closer to a ’10’ now than a ‘0’

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 3:05pm

  471. 471: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    I just canceled with a man who I’ve gone on two dates with. When the check came for dinner on our last date he looked at the check & let me know how much my total was. It was a huge turn off. He’s contacted me several times since then, & I just don’t feel inspired. I feel like I need a break.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 3:58pm

  472. 472: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:


    Take good care of yourself!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:07pm

  473. 473: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    movingmagic, seems like an opportunity to practice,

    “i feel confused right now… it feels so good when a man contacts me regularly and wants to see me, but i also feel bad paying on dates. i don’t need fancy things, but i’m just a girl here and it feels so much more romantic and relaxing when i don’t have to worry about this sort of thing..”

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:13pm

  474. 474: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:


    So often my masculine energy takes charge and gets me through the day. I decided to lean back, step away and give myself some space to enhance my siren-ness!
    What I began to notice (and feel) was that my feminine energy was minimal! I wanted to feel more. . . whether it was pain or joy or whatever. But to understand what caused my masculine energy to take over a situation, a conversation, a moment. I still don’t have the answer, but being in touch with my feelings was not enough! I need to feel my feminine energy. It has not been easy, and that is why the marathon. It’s a constant issue – getting out of my thoughts and into my feminine energy and feelings. So now I’m up to speaking in my feminine energy – seems like when I’m talking a lot I’m in my masculine energy . . . just learned that this week!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:41pm

  475. 475: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    Burning white and purple candles for clarity and understanding. Pondered the universe and guides earlier today and decided it is the same as my understanding of angels and G0d as a child. It felt good to understand that in my own personal way. I am opened to getting my needs met now. I have not been getting my needs met since HScd and I broke up and that feels wrong – imbalanced. I’m ready to open up to the universe again and receive the satisfaction and goodness of getting my needs met, all of them, including s3x . . . I cannot ignore that need anymore. It felt negative and closed when I did. That is why this article triggered me when I read it, but in a good way. It really helped me on journey this week.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 4:58pm

  476. 476: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    I went through Modern Siren again and reviewed my workbook notes. “stay warm, open and present”

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:00pm

  477. 477: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    Dating is
    seeing if you are on the same page
    and you are not invested or a participant (like in a marriage)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:01pm

  478. 478: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    QUESTION . . .

    How does a man feel needed?

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:04pm

  479. 479: ViNo Gravatar says:

    I find myself at a place where sex with MH doesn’t feel casual to me anymore. I feel very scared and tensed up. Rory wouldn’t beat me up for my tense unusual feelings around sex, so I won’t too :-)

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:15pm

  480. 480: ViNo Gravatar says:

    Actually ‘what would Rory say to me’ works as a tool for me and feels calming and always helpful, and as an alternative to my negative voice.. so I notice that my positive voice often sounds like Rory.. hehe.. I feel all giggly and embarrassed to write about it..

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:28pm

  481. 481: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Sorry Glowstix, for I don’t want to contradict you. I looked it up to be sure, for I questioned what I thought I knew it was. Wazoo is the butt or anus.


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:33pm

  482. 482: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    LoveAlways I believe when we ask him to do things for us then exuberantly show appreciation when he is done

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:42pm

  483. 483: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    ruth – 386 – please no sharing of process with him. doesn’t usually go well.


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:43pm

  484. 484: Popsicletoes53No Gravatar says:

    I think Rori’s advice was spot on… what a turn on for a man to turn you on… to me this is the epitome of leaning back.. In fact I am gonna try it.. leaning back and let it go.

    From my experiences… nothing turns a man on more than turning a woman on.. In fact most of the men I have known would rather give pleasure than receive it.. and when a women didn’t relax and let him guide her into ecstasy he felt like a failure. Sorry to all those who don’t agree with using a man’s body to attain an orgasm… in fact I think it compliments a man to allow him to turn you on that much.

    I have found in my sexual experiences I wanted to be in control.. that is why I gave pleasure so much.. and why it is easy for me to pleasure myself but so hard for me to let a man do it for me.. So now.. looking at it from his point of view… I was being masculine energy.. the giver when he really wanted to be the giver and me the receiver.. Oh yes men like to receive.. and do.. but I think it really is a huge boost to let him be the masculine energy… doesn’t mean you can’t but it does mean that he really likes it when we do.

    It is about giving up control…


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:50pm

  485. 485: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Tam, I feel unimpressed with sarcasm but hey ho.

    I did actually say I felt open to learning more.
    So please feel free to Educate me more if you wish, like I said I am open to learning more.
    Do you think you and others are also open to learning more or does it feel better to you to use sarcasm with words like pleassssssse and be closed?

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:54pm

  486. 486: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – I applaud you. Awesome opening up and processing. I understand it feel horrible, yet it does get to feeling better. YAY you!!!


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:55pm

  487. 487: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Yes Popsicletoes, yes!!! – 484


    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 5:56pm

  488. 488: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    316: GlowStix says:


    You are correct. Oxytocin is produced all the time. It behaves and is utilized by the central nervous system in a very similar way to seratonin.

    Uhhh…It’s too early for science lol But yeah…It’s not only produced during sex, orgasm, birth, and breastfeeding.”

    I believe that may be the case looking into it is SMALL amounts but not in BIG SURGES like AFTER/DURING orgasm breastfeeding and strong uterine contractions which are natures way of bonding a woman to a man and a woman to her child. Which also brings dopamine into play etc.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:02pm

  489. 489: Goddess LilyNo Gravatar says:

    481 Dominique, I was thinking the same thing.


    (((((Ruth))))) I agree with Smile and Mel. I am loving me some Ruth today!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:06pm

  490. 490: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    331: Femininewom says:

    “Ruth – Rori says when you are healing feelings show up. You might feel like you are falling over into a pit but when feelings starts coming up you are moving fprward.”

    That was very true for me FW and Ruth.
    It actually felt like an abyss at first especially with the anxiety that came up but then the feelings move forward and higher consciousness and awareness occured. The cycle repeated a few times with processing and the painful feeling becoming more bearable and quicker to shift and process.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:12pm

  491. 491: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    468: GlowStix.

    IF FWB is what a woman wants and is right for her I do not believe there is a problem if she really wants that and is able to handle it.
    It is my belief that for most it isn’t and they are not being honest with themselves and I fell in agreement with Orna ans Mathew walters on this one.
    And in Beths case she claerly states that FWB is not what she desires her words were. “I’m hoping that I’m going to learn to be the kind of woman that a man this nice would want to spend the rest of his life with because I really don’t want to die without having experienced true and satisfying love.”

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:21pm

  492. 492: Popsicletoes53No Gravatar says:

    Hey Starla,

    I don’t mean to pry about you and your mother but I wonder if some kind of codependent support group might help you as you learn how to detach from your mother… just a thought…

    I would be happy to recommend some great reading and helps.. I have been helped tremendously by that approach.. in my toxic relationships.

    Sometimes as Ruth said you have to detach… I learned that was detaching with love and you can get to the place where you are absolutely neutral about her behavior… it takes work but it is well worth it.. because the neutral stance does not judge it just detaches with love…

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:27pm

  493. 493: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    From Orna and Mathew walters.

    2. If you engage in sex as a “friends with benefits” situation – STOP! If you truly desire LOVE, then settle for nothing less than that. Energetically giving yourself to someone physically actually blocks you from receiving what your heart desires. (We have no judgement for those who aren’t looking for love to have sex, safe sex, with all those they feel safe with.)

    And for Beth that is what she states she desired LOVE.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:30pm

  494. 494: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I totally get the surrendering giving up control and receiving love from a man letting me give pleasure.

    It is just it needs to be the right man for me not any old Tom Dick or Harry who has proven that he will care for my heart with his actions as I am not able personally to compartmentalize sex and not get my heart involved.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:37pm

  495. 495: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    *me receive and him give pleasure.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:39pm

  496. 496: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    So if you aren’t looking for love and commitment and just want sex I would say go for it have fun and lots of pleasure.

    So to me the question is what are you looking for and wanting?

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:42pm

  497. 497: SensiouswomanNo Gravatar says:

    I am trying to change my posting name… lets see if this works… formerly *Popsicletoes*

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:45pm

  498. 498: LoveAlwaysNo Gravatar says:

    Im taking the quiz now

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 6:58pm

  499. 499: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I’m not sure if you’re still talking to me, annie? or the general board?

    For me, I handled FWB quite nicely when that was what I wanted. When I wanted more I said I was looking for more and felt accepting of whatever a man wanted and said about it. I have had struggles, yet this hasn’t been one for me. And the only 2 men I have ever fallen in love with have committed to me. One with 8 years of his life, and a ring, one with his heart and body. There was a third man in my teenage years who was gay. We loved each other no less, however, and still do.

    It’s not really up to anyone else to say if I am being “true to myself”. Nor do I remember using sarcasm? Maybe that wasn’t directed at me.

    Anyway…Don’t like being in my “brain” on here.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:06pm

  500. 500: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    When I feel respected and honored I feel Safe. And I feel comfortable to open up to connect and feel pleasure and joy.

    I can always respect and honor myself.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:10pm

  501. 501: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    498: GlowStixsays:

    “I’m not sure if you’re still talking to me, annie? or the general board?”

    Which post Glowstix are you referring too?

    “For me, I handled FWB quite nicely when that was what I wanted. When I wanted more I said I was looking for more and felt accepting of whatever a man wanted and said about it. I have had struggles, yet this hasn’t been one for me. And the only 2 men I have ever fallen in love with have committed to me. One with 8 years of his life, and a ring, one with his heart and body. There was a third man in my teenage years who was gay. We loved each other no less, however, and still do.

    It’s not really up to anyone else to say if I am being “true to myself”. Nor do I remember using sarcasm? Maybe that wasn’t directed at me.

    Anyway…Don’t like being in my “brain” on here.”

    No sarcasm was not directed at you.
    I feel unheard as I actually said If FWB and sex is what a woman really wants then it isn’t really a problem as each to their own. So I feel happy that worked for you. But believe MOST women do not really desire that and are not emotionally and hormonally ABLE to handle that. And
    IN BETHS case this is not what she clearly stated she desired.
    And then asked so the question is what do you want?
    Directed at the individual to honestly ask and answer themselves. Not to answer me per say.
    And then decide for themselves what action they think is in their best interest to match their desire.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:30pm

  502. 502: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Isn’t that why we are all here at the end of the day to individually reconnect with our higher selves and journey inwards, awaken, raise consciousness, heal from our unhealthy subconscious love imprint to discover what we all individually want and is right for us and to consciously choose something that is better an individually just right for us? Like Roris book says Have the realtionship you want.

    So here is wishing everyone the best in that journey and unique discovery. X

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:39pm

  503. 503: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Starla – oh, biggest hugs to you and your experience with your mom. That sounds just awful. So bad it would be like the worst reality tv show, ever. But it would get such good ratings. Ha! But seriously. I’ve always had a stressful relationship with my mom. She does try to improve herself, and she’s not actually a bad person or underhanded. Her worst offense is that she is often unaware of how she is behaving. But to me, all these experiences give us the opportunity to truly value ourselves. You were emancipated as a teenager. You definitely do value yourself! You rock!!!

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:46pm

  504. 504: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Starla, I agree that this would be an amazing opportunity to use a feeling message! I also feel like part of the process of circular dating is to honor our own feelings. I don’t feel very attracted to him, & in no way do I want to lead him on. Also, I have alot going on emotionally. Alot of fear, & sadness with my moms health issue.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:46pm

  505. 505: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Some men do and can be used by a woman for sex, and it can hurt them as well. It’s not as common, but some men have trouble trusting women about this. And usually it is more that the woman is after something else and using sex as a means to get that thing. So I guess “using for sex” is pretty harmless for a guy, strictly speaking. But using sex to get something else scares them, because they are so vulnerable. Their sex drive can overtake them and lead them into the situation without thinking. And the woman might be after money, prestige, or even use the man to get herself pregnant without his consent. And this is not that uncommon.

    It’s sad that some women will do this. But behavior like that is well-documented in both literature and real life….

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 7:49pm

  506. 506: AnnieNo Gravatar says:


    “Some men do and can be used by a woman for sex, and it can hurt them as well.”

    If a man was taking full responsibility for his own feelings on that one he would get to know the real woman first before getting to enjoy and have fun with her body.
    And put something on the end of it, if he wants to minimize risk of pregnancy
    It’s not rocket science.
    His feelings belong to him and he is responsible for them no one else.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:07pm

  507. 507: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I feel uninspired and irritated. Rigid and sharp and pointy.I feel sad and soft and mushy. I wil take care of you stix. Go home tomorrow and bask in aloneness and and relaxation.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:25pm

  508. 508: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Stretched thin and stopped short. I am doing too much here. The cure for doing too much, is doing nothing at all. Being in a home I own. Remembering I “owe” nothing right now.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:28pm

  509. 509: AntoniaNo Gravatar says:

    Sad to read all the mom stuff.. I was actually wondering to myself why I seem to be attracted to mysoginists basically.. And it occurred to that maybe I have a problem with women too bc of my mom.. She was in and out of 3 or 4 institutions when I was a child. I think or feel? I may have this in need to bond with someone over this but being with a man who doesn’t really like women it definitely not the answer. I’ve also managed to not have very close relationships with women I’m now realizing this maybe reason. It leaves me feeling pretty alone. I really want to heal this and trust and make some happy experiences to build a foundation on.

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 8:37pm

  510. 510: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Dominique, yea, thats what I thought too
    Dont share process

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:25pm

  511. 511: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    474 Love Always
    I am totally dependent on my masculine energy to deal with the (sometimes very difficult) work stuff.
    But yes, now is time to get back in touch with my femininity
    which I know is very powerful
    Sonetiems i feel afraid that it will swamp everything and stop me functioning
    same with the feelings really.
    they feel so out of control

    No——I mean *i* feel out of control feeling them

    I would like to thank all you lovely ladies for your kind and supportive comments as i blunder through this process xx

    Tuesday, 18 December 2012 @ 11:32pm

  512. 512: StarbrightNo Gravatar says:


    Wondering if the more comfortable you are with feeling your feelings the more comfortable your guy could feel with hearing them?

    Not sure if someone else or you already suggested this…I was reading earlier today, but may have missed some comments…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:06am

  513. 513: StarbrightNo Gravatar says:

    All of the getting more comfortable with sharing my feelings has been a long process for me. Would like to have done it faster, easier, however I’ve been making such progress even if it wasn’t particularly fast.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:17am

  514. 514: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Whoo, I feel a little bit giddy!

    I just sent a brief note to SYG. I really pondered over this a lot. But the deciding factor was the fact that this one thought/idea kept cycling back up into my consciousness, and it was distracting to me. Like it needed somewhere to go – and not just into a journal.

    So I wrote the short email. I basically said that he was a great guy, and a good catch, and would have made a really good boyfriend. But – and here’s where I think it was important. I needed to own my part in the situation. So I told him that I was the one who wasn’t ready.

    I wasn’t sure how I would feel when I hit “send.” I have an “undo” button that I could have used. But I felt good! So I let it go :-) now I can relax.

    Hey! I can let go and relax – that feels good : )

    Ah, like a deep sigh of relief

    a lot of tension just went out of my body….

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:19am

  515. 515: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie, I think you might have misunderstood me or read something else into what I wrote. I was not suggesting that we “take care of” our men or that we be responsible for their feelings. I am talking about real-world situations where women do in fact use men to further their own purposes. This can be good, and this can be bad.

    I personally know of cases where a woman has used a man to get her pregnant without his knowledge. And then later told him about it (like four years later). Think how out of control you would feel if this happened to you? (i.e. if you were a guy)

    In another situation, I had an almost-but-not-quite pregnancy scare. There had been unprotected sex. I was worried. And then what looked like it could have been a “positive” on a pregnancy test. I told the guy, and he came to see me. But he was mad because he seemed to think that I had “used” him and done it on purpose. When in fact, nothing could have been further from the truth. I would have been happy to be pregnant, if I was. But it wasn’t what I was trying to do. And it felt bad – really, really bad – to be looked at in that way. In truth, I was scared. Even if it was something I would have wanted, I was scared if it was true. And it wasn’t.

    My point is that guys think about these things. They are also human, as are we. The fact that they are guys just means that it happens differently for them.

    And this was a guy that I was just using for sex – nothing else ; ) I never thought about a relationship with him, and I definitely wasn’t out to have his kids! The part about using for sex wasn’t terribly harmful. But in general it may or may not be the best idea. As someone here observed – we as women bear the brunt of most of the consequences of sex.

    And that definitely makes it different for us than it does for them.

    Other than that, my comment still stands. I really don’t feel that it is necessary to explain or justify what I earlier wrote. And I don’t see why I should be the “bad guy” for defending men as having feelings, too. They do. And where I often go wrong is that I treat them differently – as if they didn’t have feelings. And that’s a huge mistake. Because it means I miss out on who they are, and that I’m not really able to have a relationship with them. It’s like trying to have a relationship with a cardboard box. It doesn’t work.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:39am

  516. 516: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    MovingMagic – 305: that’s such a beautiful description! I love the idea of it feeling “lighter.”

    Thank you, GlowStix (327)

    And Ruth, I think Dominique might have defined it for you. But it’s really just a turn of phrase. “Up the wazoo” is an idiom that just means you have more than you know what to do with. It’s not used in a dirty way, as the definition kind of made it sound. But yeah, basically I guess it has to do with what she said. lol

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:51am

  517. 517: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Starbright, yes absolutely spot on!
    thank you
    I *do* have to feel comfortable and able to handle my feelings before sharing them
    Otherwise its nail bomb territory

    Tereana, good point well made.Its too easy to forget when caught up in our own feelings that men have them too
    That was a timely remindr for me, thank you

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:57am

  518. 518: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    514: Tereana says:

    If a Guy chooses to have unprotected sex he is CHOOING to take that risk of pregnancy. No one forces him to do that.
    Like I said he is choosing whether he puts something on the end of it.
    He is not a victim in a helpless situation he has freewill.

    Accidents happen as no contraception is 100 % and also
    I don’t doubt that a few women may lie and say they are on the pill if they are wanting a baby so badly and have made a decision to be a single parent rather than no parent.
    That is why I said get to know the women first or if you do not know her character or GROW UP TAKE RESPONSIBILITY AND PUT SOMETHING ON THE END OF IT! He can’t control what the women does only what he does.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:05am

  519. 519: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    ((((((((((((((Antonia)))))))))))))))) welcome

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:03am

  520. 520: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Of course a man has feelings.
    As Rori says a grown up man doesn’t want or need us to moddycoddle him and his feelings. He is able to take care of them himself.
    He is 100% responsible for his feelings. As I am mine.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:52am

  521. 521: AnnieNo Gravatar says:


    “Some men do and can be used by a woman for sex, and it can hurt them as well. It’s not as common, but some men have trouble trusting women about this.”

    This feels good to be reminded of men like this so thank you Tereana.

    This shows me where a ‘man’ or in hindsight ‘manboy’ feels more apt in a case like this is at if he is saying this.
    It shows me that he is coming from a place of his wounded little boy not his grown up man and has not yet done the work in trusting himself and taking full responsibility for his actions and feelings so would not be a good bet for a healthy adult relationship.

    He is stuck in this place and this will be what he is subconsciously attracted to and attracting so the universe will keep sending him women like that until the lesson is learned, healing takes place and he is ready to move forward and make better more conscious healthy choices for himself.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:03am

  522. 522: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    The universe keeps sending us what we need over and over again until we learn the lesson.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:14am

  523. 523: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t know about going out w Nanny CD again. I feel trapped. I feel triggered.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:42am

  524. 524: TamNo Gravatar says:

    485, it wasn’t sarcasm, Annie, I just don’t like it when things are presented as facts that are actually not facts and plain wrong. I just felt annoyed at the persistence on what goes plainly against research and fact. My personal feelings because I get triggered by pseudo science, in my field of work people spread it all the time…without having gone through the pain of actually substantiating their statements by any evidence.
    My ‘please!’ is the way I expressed myself (imagine rolled eyes)…that’s all. Not sarcastic, at least not intentionally. I mean, I would likely have said the same thing if someone had said that the earth is flat….
    I don’t know much at all, I am learning all the time myself but anyway, this was about the hormone Oxytocin which is basically what we women run on…and doen’t need sex or breastfeeding to be produced at all, some other ‘activities’ can produce it also, in every woman – and in pretty high doses also, if I read current research correctly…so that was the point I was making. That’s all.
    But, you know, I might also be wrong, in 50 years time all this might be overthrown and bla bla so no, I am not going to bang on about it because we are always evolving…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 4:51am

  525. 525: TamNo Gravatar says:

    So now I am in a pickle with Curly.
    He is so keen on me and he really wants to be my boyfriend and I like him but I can’t get over the 24 year age difference and this is going to take a lot of dating and getting to know each other slowly, to see whether I can.
    It’s not even that I am totally repulsed or anything, he is very attractive and we really are on a wavelength with a lot of stuff and he spotted that sooner than me so he keeps saying that he wants to see me and treat me well and this and that. He makes all these plans to spend Christmas together and we could go away next year, here and there, and so on. I just listen…
    And I feel very good in his presence, very relaxed and happy. But I can’t get the ‘old man’ thing out of my head. At all.
    The only thing that made me feel better was that he said yesterday (before I had a chance to bring it up), that the age difference shocked him also and that he never ever dated someone with such a big age gap to him, and never thought he would.
    Well, then I could open up and said the same basically…it was a scary subject..and that I would need a lot of time to see if I can deal with it.
    So now what?
    He doesn’t push anything physical which is nice because I can’t go there…maybe never…I have no idea. We kissed a little and it felt nice until the thought ‘old man’ popped into my head and I then could not enjoy it anymore.
    How do I get over this, if at all?

    In the meantime my ex has reared his head again also, and the ChubbyAustrian has been in contact too.

    Wow. I feel challenged. It never happened to me that my brain/head is so adamant about ‘not going there’.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:18am

  526. 526: TamNo Gravatar says:

    ..and then he brings up the subject of children!!! The second time!!!
    I do not feel good about practicing making children with him, let alone contemplating having them!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:21am

  527. 527: TamNo Gravatar says:

    fear of intimacy hiding behind ‘age difference’? Hmmm.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:36am

  528. 528: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling curious about what any of us really mean or are looking for when we say we want a soul mate?

    I am quite certain that C is a soul mate. And, he is unavailable. We are compatible and doing well in other realities, and I’m quite clear our dance in this particular ‘now’ is to synch up ‘fantasy’ with ‘reality’. Bringing a little more of fantasy to reality, and vice versa.
    M, who I dated a few years back is a soul mate. And not compatible with me as a romantic partner.
    T and I had soul contracts, which we were consciously aware of, but not necessarily “mated”, and we were horribly incompatible.

    There are 13 ‘aspects’ of my soul group incarnated in the 3d physical experience, two who I know well and neither one of them are suitable mates for me. “We” set it up that way, for the broadest range of experience possible for maximum potential growth.

    I have at times, longed for the mythical “twin flame”, and my deepest inner guidance is that it is within, as an individuated aspect of my soul group. Really, a true soul mate, for me, is just about the last thing I want in a mate. It defeats the purpose of this experience as Belle, whose intention is growth, expansion, the embodiment of Christ/unity consciousness and to continually expand to allow for a greater and greater expression of Source/G0d through me and as me.

    Based on the sum of my life experience so far, I have asked for all “new” mates, souls I’ve never danced with before and am bound to by affection, vibrational affinity, common purpose. I want to feel trust, and trusted, loved, respected, to feel cherished, appreciated, liked, a healthy dose of erotic innocence and playfulness. I want to feel supported, nurtured and encouraged in my emergence as a self-realized human being desiring to achieve the fullest potential possible in this lifetime. I have dreams of interspecies harmony, of growing beyond mental constructs of “us” and “them” and inspiring others to do the same.

    So, sirens, I feel curious and wonder, when you say you want a “soul mate”, what is it you really want?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:17am

  529. 529: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    I had the strangest interaction with a man on POF yesterday. He is someone that I have seen on there before – we chatted a few times before I met JC and got off of the site for a couple of months, but he was always traveling and never asked me out.

    Anyway – i noticed on his profile that it said, “If you are a Pisces keep swimming!” and I just had to ask about that since I am a Pisces and his profile didn’t say that before.

    Wow – he launched into an attack about how Pisces women always disappear on him – including me! I kept my side of the conversation light and even said to him that it seemed like he was spoiling for a fight. i explained that i had gotten off the site to give a relationship a chance, but he was MAD – really intense about me leaving the site. WOW – I wished him well with the other zodiac signs and then blocked him. So much anger . . . he didn’t seem that interested in me before and we have never even met! Crazy . . .

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:21am

  530. 530: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    Wow. Conflicting internal stories.
    I feel unsettled and vulnerable.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:29am

  531. 531: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I see that what I am calling “soul mate” is an experience of someone who inspired/s profound and intense feelings and an experience of feeling “seen”.
    From a broader perspective, the term is meaningless to me. I’m going to stop using it.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:34am

  532. 532: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso I noticed myelf wondering “why block him”?

    Seems like there are some messages there:-

    1. Remain open. You just never know. A man might not openly express interest but we don’t know what is going on inside him.

    2. Was it an attack or was it just him venting his feelings of rejection and disappointment? Was telling him he was spoiling for a fight your way of shutting him down and invalidating his feelings?

    3. If he experienced disappearing Pisces women that is his life experience and would have built up a filter around that. Is it a mirror to look in to see if you generally walk away from men you don’t feel attracted to? Is it a lesson that men just might be able to deal with women who cdate?

    You just had to ask – says something about you and your curiosty. It might be a strength but can also be a weakness. Is it what draws you into masculine energy? Maybe cause you to be unwilling to take no for an answer? Causing you to ask for explanations or reconsiderations? Could he have looked at your reaching out as choosing him as second?

    Some really interesting things that could be looked at. Not to overanalyze but to look at to learn about yourself and in light of the 4 Rules.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:41am

  533. 533: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso – he didn’t seem that interested in me before

    Is this covering an underlying belief? How about a story you are telling yourself, being stuck in your head?

    What tools can you use to dismantle the limiting belief?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:43am

  534. 534: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Oh FW, I like those:
    Is this covering an underlying belief? How about a story you are telling yourself, being stuck in your head?

    What tools can you use to dismantle the limiting belief?

    I am wondering if I can dismantle the age difference limiting belief of whether I have to let that guy go. Hm.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:55am

  535. 535: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I did wonder if it was contempt, rather than sarcasm.
    Neither comes from someone who is open to learning.

    “My ‘please!’ is the way I expressed myself (imagine rolled eyes)…that’s all. ”

    Eye rolling is the ultimate form of contempt and is not ever done by someone is open to learning.

    I have no interest in engaging with anyone who rolls their eyes. It feels pointless and will only ever cause me harm.
    It is the biggest psychological way to try and get someone to shut up.
    An I am learning to not put myself in harmful situations
    it feels best to take loving action for myself and disengage with you Tam.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:05am

  536. 536: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    FW – all interesting things for me to think about – I appreciate your insights.

    One thing I;m sure you are right about is the limiting belief. I keep finding myself telling myself that GM never loved me. I don’t know why i do that – it’s hurtful and I actually don’t even believe that, so why do i say it to myself over and over? It’s mean and I need to be nice to me . . . It’s like I’m trying to toughen myself up, harded my heart again. I don’t want to do that – I lived that way for 2 decades while married.

    I blocked the guy because his anger was triggering me and I already have nightmares about my ex husband stalking and trying to hurt me – I do not have room in my fragile psyche for an angry man that I have never even met. I found myself shaking the last couple of times he emailed me – that does not feel good right before bed.

    I can admit I do walk away – a lot.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:05am

  537. 537: TamNo Gravatar says:

    534. Annie, sure, do whatever makes you feel good, totally understand.
    However, disengaging as being done by someone who is judging other people as ‘not open to learning’, strikes me as a person herself neither being open to learning, nor open to hearing other people’s point of view.
    I am open to hearing everybody’s view and don’t feel the need to disengage as long as it is not a personal attack or judgment. I did not attack and merely expressed my feeling (annoyed at hearing pseudo science thrashed about like fact). Judging someone as ‘not being open to learning’ is a personal attack, and defence based, and I wonder how that would make a man feel if we said that to him.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:14am

  538. 538: TamNo Gravatar says:

    ..and I don’t hold contempt for anybody at all, actually, I feel pretty surprised that my words could evoke such a strong reaction/trigger in someone.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:16am

  539. 539: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    As I feel myself growing I see him growing as well. Things are getting done that have long been over do and actions and thoughts have changed drastically in the way they are talked about,. It feels great to know we are both growing!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:17am

  540. 540: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    Hey ladies, thanks for the comments about my relationship with my mom.

    I haven’t actually seen her or spoken with her for more than 30 seconds in over 3 years. 3 years ago I told her we couldn’t have a relationship unless she quit her lying. She said she understood, and then she disappeared again. So now that she mooches off of, I mean lives with, my grandma, she’s been doing these weird bare minimum things to look like a caring mom.

    i’m sure she does care about me. i’m sure of it. but she is so extremely mentally ill (/full of her damn self… again, less than 50 years ago, she’d just be considered a 100% f*cking selfish b*tch) that EVERYTHING she does is motivated by looking good and getting approval of those immediately around her.

    So yeah, I have detached completely. I don’t even write her back, which gives her the chance to say to my grandma, “oh look, starla is so petty and immature.”

    i tried to tell my grandma about my mom but she won’t listen. even when other people are showing up to my grandma because my mom owes them money or deceived them, she won’t believe it!

    the rest of my family knows most of it now, so I feel relieved about that. They do have my back, and we don’t talk about her anymore.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:19am

  541. 541: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    “If you approach each new person you meet in a spirit of adventure, you will find yourself endlessly fascinated by the new channels of thought and experience and personality that you encounter.”

    – Eleanor Roosevelt

    Beautifully said, huh?

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:21am

  542. 542: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Starla, my mother is similar by what I read from you.
    After many years of making my life hell with her mental illness (which she presumably can’t control or maybe could with medicine but doesn’t want to), culminating with fraudulently clearing my bank account out….I decided to walk away from her.
    Since then, she does not speak with anyone from the family and just sends nasty letters to everybody….she is really gone off the rails and now everybody can see what I had to deal with since childhood.
    I don’t get satisfaction from it, in fact it makes me very sad, but walking away from her was the best thing I ever did. No going back.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:22am

  543. 543: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I feel the desire to only talk about me tho, Im not feeling any particular feeling other then maybe fear that I do not focus enough on myself and the things I am trying to learn and practice. I get lost in thoughts and questions and loose site of what my goal is. This feels daunting, overwhelming and unfair. I don’t want to feel limited, it feels like I’m being punished.

    Punished for being me, feels like.
    Not enough..

    Void of emotion in my body. Emptiness

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:24am

  544. 544: StarlaNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:26am

  545. 545: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    Today, when I have negative thoughts or anxieties come up, I am going to flip them to positive ones.

    This is my exercise today:)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:27am

  546. 546: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    It is so nice that my friends were there for me when i was heart broken, and it feels so good to see that they don’t want me to get hurt. it feels so good to have friends who care about my well being.

    and i am really blessed to have friends who trust me enough to want for me all the things i want for myself, regardless of any judgment that crosses their minds

    oh, and friends who just don’t have judgment!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:29am

  547. 547: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    Oooow Starla I wanna join! This feels like a fun challenge! Lol

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:34am

  548. 548: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Wow – I just got a phone call from the Drill Instructor! My son is not even there any more – he just called to chat with me and to see how my son is doing now that he is at home.

    He told me that when he shook my hand at the graduation, he felt like pulling me into his arms – sigh . . . that sounds lovely.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:37am

  549. 549: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    rebekah, feel free (of course!)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:51am

  550. 550: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    QZ and I are both so brave to be receptive to each other and drop all resentments and fears during our interactions. we both know there are things we need to talk about, and we are brave enough to put on our gentlest, sweetest faces to each other until that time comes

    awwwwwww we are SO brave

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:00am

  551. 551: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    Great guided meditation for letting go/forgiving/closure

    Has a weird title but the meditation realllly is great:)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:03am

  552. 552: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I feel outraged when anyone rolls their eyes.
    I feel psychologically attacked when people roll their eyes.
    I will honor my feelings always.
    Every cell in my body wants to attack that person back.
    I can choose if I do so or not and what is the best loving action for me to do.

    I have no control over others rolling their eyes which research states is contempt.

    I do not wish to engage with people who show me contempt. It is not in my best interest to do so.
    I feel disrespected I will not disrespect myself I will honor my feelings.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:13am

  553. 553: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels good inside to honor my feelings.
    I feel loved and cared for and calm and peaceful. :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:14am

  554. 554: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I have no control over others eye rolling and actions only over my own actions.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:15am

  555. 555: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Drama, drama, drama. Urgh.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:28am

  556. 556: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I love not knowing the reason why, guessing at the meanings behind things, guessing feels fun and exciting.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:28am

  557. 557: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    239: Annie says:

    It feels annoying to me when people claim I have done something which I clearly have not. And sometimes I feel rage building up inside me when others do this.
    Claiming that I have stated something as a FACT.
    When I clearly used the word BELIEF.

    A belief is not a fact.

    This is what I wrote.

    “If that is what you believe that is what you believe Daria.

    I do not share your belief.
    So feels best to agree to disagree with you on that one then.

    Feel happy to read any scientific links you have and an open to changing my beliefs in the future with evidence that backs it up.”

    I don’t like it when people make false claims about what I have said.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:31am

  558. 558: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    My beliefs are not fixed.
    I feel open to changing my beliefs.
    And accept others have different beliefs thoughts and feeling to mine.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:33am

  559. 559: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Feeling surprised and wonder if men run when we try to make them respinsibke for our feelings. Would never suspect a guy showing me contempt for expressing his views, feelings and opinions, more an honour that he shares them with me even if uncomfortable. Maybe that’s why all my CD’s come back time and time again. No drama with me. Maybe?
    That feels good!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:35am

  560. 560: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Other peoples projected thoughts are none of my business. They have nothing to do with me
    They belong to them.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:38am

  561. 561: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels good to me to take the loving action and do what is in my best interest and honor and take 100% responsibility of my feelings.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:42am

  562. 562: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    “wonder if men run when we try to make them respinsibke for our feelings.”

    they totally do! after a certain point they absolutely will

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:45am

  563. 563: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels good to follow my feelings, process, connect to my inner higher guidance and get to better feelings of calm peace and love rather than annoyance and outrage.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:46am

  564. 564: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    My body is beautiful, I love my curves and little boobies. I feel perfect just the way I am. I feel excited anticipation to better myself health wise. This challenge is exciting!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:49am

  565. 565: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels good to feel calm peaceful connected and loved.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:50am

  566. 566: AnnieNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:51am

  567. 567: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t want to roll my eyes.
    I don’t want to be in a realtionship or get involved with a man who rolls their eyes as research shows it is the biggest indicator for divorce.
    Thank you universe for the lesson of what I don’t want.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:58am

  568. 568: MelNo Gravatar says:


    Mr. A was grinning at me last night in the grocery store. I’m leaning over, grabbing some milk… he’s got this huge smile.

    Me: “That’s a cute smile! It feels nice to be smiled at.”

    Him:”I feel smiley. I don’t know how I got to feeling so chipper. I just noticed it. I feel so happy. Just a few moments ago, I was angry and annoyed and grouchy about work, but that’s all disappeared. I love coming home to you!”

    I love how he mirrors my feeling messages sometimes! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:59am

  569. 569: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    G smiles and rolls his eyes when I do cute and silly things. When I say ditzy things (all the time :-) ) and when he’s thinking really hard and fast at a solution for something. He rolls his eyes probably hundreds of times a day.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:02am

  570. 570: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    It did bother me at first and confuse me as I thought it was in contempt. Really though…It’s just something he does.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:03am

  571. 571: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    Haha the eye-rolling conversation is cracking me up!
    I feel giddy and laughter bubbling.
    Annie’s response reminds me of T. When I would roll my eyes at him, he would react in nearly the same exact way, even using some of the EXACT same phrases that Annie is using.
    When I roll my eyes at C when I feel anger, he looks at me and asks, “What’s on your mind, Miss Belle?”
    When we are playing we roll our eyes at each other and exaggerate it and get all goofy about it and we just laugh and laugh and laugh.
    It feels so good to be in relationship where ALL of me is loved and received.
    Thank you, universe, for the lesson in what I DO want :)
    Thank you for this illuminating experience, it really has served to allow me to see T in a whole new light and let that dream die a soft and gentle death.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:15am

  572. 572: NadiaNo Gravatar says:


    “I feel scared too to be one that ‘gets’ it in a crowd of triggered ladies who don’t get it and are truggered”

    Daria (#14), that felt really bad. I didn’t care for Rori’s response, either, but that was such a blanket statement that I instantly thought you were looking to intentionally trigger. Them were fightin’ words.

    I don’t join these conversations very often because they often don’t actually discuss Rori’s blog posting, so I’m disappointed to have wasted my time today.

    Thank you, Mercedes, for your thoughts.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:25am

  573. 573: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Nadia: Thank you…I very much appreciate that you noticed good things in what I have to say. Sometimes there is enough positive here to outweigh the negative…yet, I understand, sometimes there is not. In any case, I hope your journey leads you to the right places.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:37am

  574. 574: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Hey, everyone. I’ve been busy (i.e. back to normal here) no chance to visit Siren land lately. I’ll catch up on all past threads I missed and emails, and reply to anyone who commented to me soon as I can :) Must go again soon and get back to work, errands, writing, people work, etc.

    I feel intrigued that some here may be interpreting Rori’s use of the word “tool” in her description of how we relate to a man during sex as a negative word/concept? And I want to sound off about this as it would feel very good for me to do so. (Maybe this topic has already been talked out here, as I haven’t read the whole thread yet.) That word simply dovetailed for me right into the rest of what she was saying and always says so consistently. I thought nothing of it, and didn’t seem negative to me, so I felt surprised to see it come up as a topic with a bit of seeming friction (which is ok and good, just feels surprising to me). I hope this is as helpful for someone to read as it is for me to type it.

    It may be that word is simply one of the only words that come easily to her mind to express what she’s endeavoring to say here?

    I get it.

    When we focus on a man in the way of giving, trying to hold space for him as if he is the woman in bed, then we put ourselves into male energy. Men LOVE it when we use them (and their “tool(s)” lol) for our pleasure — whilst also being open, receiving, connecting, loving, feminine, leaned back, and so on, and letting our givingness occur simply as an inevitable result of all that… by letting our obvious pleasure in the moments shared with him, our open expression of it, and the wonderfulness of what he’s doing well at to also be part of what he is given by us, as we simply enjoy ourselves and let him enjoy us doing that!

    This is a major principle of leaning back and using Rori’s discoveries (Tools) about the Truth of human nature and how we are healthiest in ourselves and our relationship connections.

    I believe she was emphasizing something like this, not saying we should “use” a man in a bad way, or make him into an inanimate object or anything like that! Somehow that word “tool” or the phrase she used felt triggering for some? I apologize if my words may sounds triggering as well, and I don’t intend offensiveness here but only honesty: some of the comments about the word “tool” just make me wanna say, “C’mon Sirens, we know how Rori means this… we’ve been paying attention to her work. Why would anyone who knows Rori’s meanings enough to practice her Tools imagine that she means anything other than the same consistent and clear, mutually respecting, love-and-connection-filled, messages she always gives? What is your trigger or your filter on that word/concept, where do your assumptions come from, and what is that all about in YOU?! How would you describe how that word lands for you, what would that reveal for you, and what may this opportunity of triggeredness hold on your path of self-discovery? Since we know Rori well enough to know she is not suggesting we make men less-than or anything like that.”

    Yes, I get it. Makes total sense imo. Lean back into your own pleasure. Do things that feel good for you in the intimate moments (with abandon, enthusiasm, expressiveness, honesty, clarity, asking for what feels good and describing it). Do not ever “serve” any man in any way that doesn’t feel connected, clear, core and authentic to yourself, and pleasurable for you. (Wow this is huge for me!) Let him enjoy you enjoying yourself… so there’s no anxiety, no trying-too-hard, no sad/desperate/fake feelings in the air, no weird disconnectedness during the connecting, and no male energy from you.

    Our naturally-endowed shakti energy as women allows for plenty of opportunity for us to take initiative or be intense, on top, or whatever in bed, IF we don’t go into male energy as caretaker/givers, focusing on the other person (which is the original and essential meaning of the word “husband”)… we must focus on our own pleasure and allowing him and the experience, even the things we do ourselves in bed, to pleasure us.

    As Rori says, today’s men may like it when we caretake them and take the male role, but it will never lead to us being cherished and committed to. It will lead usually (always?) to them being bfwb’s, using us in a bad way (bc we are essentially using ourselves then blaming them for it), and seeing us as what I refer to as a jar of mayo or a jug of milk sitting in their fridge which they can take a swig from and leave behind whenever they like. They may like when we do their job for them, but it leaves them lazy and atrophied, not stepping up… and doesn’t do what my newly married guy friend (who just married my bf after she and I helped her do Rori Tools and what we here call Honest Communication) refers to as “when she needs me, it ACTIVATES me.”

    The woman who can lean back into her own pleasure without desperation to give give give in moments sexual connection will have a man’s heart, and he will feel *massively* gifted by us! He is MADE to want to to be used as a tool for a worthy cause! We are not made so, and our functionality, experience and existence flows in a different way! This is what I get from what Dominique teaches in her magnificent work as well, and this is Rori’s Tools played out in the sexual part of our relationship, same as in the other parts.

    That’s mostly all Rori’s trying to say imo (and more that maybe I don’t yet understand but will keep growing into).

    I wonder what these triggers are about for everyone who felt them, and why that word “tool” seems to feel so villainous? I feel intrigued, motivated and curious, and like this is a rich topic for me. I learn by typing and sharing my thoughts and feelings and what I see… so thanks for that opportunity here |smile|

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:39am

  575. 575: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Good point Ginger Sky
    I can identify quite a few triggers there for me, which I have alluded to here and on a previous thread (relating to previous sexual experiences when I was much younger)
    The word “use” does really trigger me badly

    Anyway, good evening ladies
    Happy Birthday to Tam

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:44am

  576. 576: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Gingersky, great post. Resonates with me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:44am

  577. 577: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so happy I am the weight I am. I desire not to look on myself negatively. I feel happy to be me, it’s wonderful to be me!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:49am

  578. 578: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    I felt a tight pang of pain in my chest reading about your relationship with your mom, Starla. I wanted to reach out and shower that little girl that you once were with affection and affirmation.

    I feel very grateful that you are on a healing and independent path… I feel that difficult people cross our paths as great teachers to teach us very advanced skills.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:53am

  579. 579: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: For me it wasn’t the word tool (although I don’t care for that concept either) so much as it was the phrase “using him and his body to get pleasure”. For me, it is horrible to use people for anything and it is ????? (I don’t know the right word but it’s not a positive one) to give advice to a woman who has struggled with trying to find love through sex…advice that says “use the man and his body for sex”. It’s like saying “do unto them what they have done unto you”. It’s like saying “humans and feelings don’t really matter, the key to getting over your struggles with sex is to use men for sex”. It’s not good advice in my opinion.

    Rori can believe and write what she wishes and I respect that…this is her blog and she’s certainly entitled to give whatever advice she deems appropriate. Sometimes, I just can’t bring myself to agree with her and when that happens, it feels good to let it out. I don’t think Beth or anyone else is served well by someone like me hiding an alternate point of view just because this is Rori’s blog. So…I spoke up….as did others…and, in my opinion, most of what was said was a good discussion. I believe it allowed Beth to see multiple sides to the advice and then, she is able to hopefully make a decision based on some good conversation about how she’d like to deal with the future.

    Keeping in mind, this is not therapy…Rori is not a therapist…there are many, many people right here on this blog who have good advice to offer as well who are not therapists…I think Beth will experience more of a benefit because of the discussion than if we had kept quiet and went along with something we didn’t agree with simply because Rori wrote it. I love Rori’s work…I don’t always agree with her advice…I almost never keep quiet about it when that happens. I believe if I did, that would make ME irresponsible and I don’t want to feel that way.

    I really don’t think it’s about a personal trigger for me though (can’t speak for others who felt the same way about the advice). I think it was about disagreeing that the advice was appropriate…especially for someone with Beth’s story.

    Anyway…that’s why I spoke up.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:53am

  580. 580: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #571 Nadia, wow. How could Daria’s words about how she felt be “fighting words”? They were her words, her feelings. Is she supposed to censor herself and limit her learning experience bc you find her words to be problematic? Of course not. They’re just her words.

    I am not afraid of a fight, and I will fight fair and with respect and wholesomeness, but I do not back down from conflict easily, and will not pursue it beyond what seems healthy and gently firm and honest. You brought up the “fighting words” concept, so “fight” well with me here now? I am happy to be your worthy opponent, though I know Daria can manage on her own just fine and learn what she desires to for herself from any moment in which he finds herself, lol.

    I am not responding to or trying to provoke you in order to “defend” her, but only bc you posted on a public forum which I share, and bc to me, your words are “fighting words” bc you brought in that concept and that energy — it is a mirror of you and noting to do with anyone else. (If you’d have said “Daria, your words feel like they make me want to defend myself, or like I want to fight bc to me they feel like fighting words, then I would have nothing whatsoever to say to you.)

    So if you’re still here, willing to drop the idea (judgment) that you are “wasting your time” bc the women here don’t say what you want them to say in the ways you prefer them to say it and as it “should” be in your mind, and if you are not afraid to be challenged to a learning duel with me, I say: This fight is in you, big time. It is not anywhere else.

    What is it in you that you are fighting with? Who are you fighting with in there (inside you)? What would make someone else’s honest feelings and words into “fighting words” for you? Esp when they are expressing something that person feels, and it was not about you?! How do you figure that to be a reasonable response? I am curious.

    Wow. I feel sorry that you don’t get your needs met here. I feel happy that this “fighting” energy you bring in does not get posted here much lately. That feels good. I feel happy for clarity in people and in myself, and for understanding some about the mirror we all see in everyday… I feel grateful… I feel like fighting with you and it feels like gusto and life-affirming honest challenge… like in jubilant martial arts. I feel a little shaky and that feels motivating.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:57am

  581. 581: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I’m so snuggly and fluffy lol I love feeling huggable and cute

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:58am

  582. 582: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: I don’t think Nadia is the one who “brought in that concept and that energy”….I think it was Daria herself and then me. I was very, very offended by Daria’s words.

    I understand if you are okay with Daria being the only one here who “gets it”, but I’m not…because it is simply untrue. There are a lot of things we all “get” but disagree with. I was insulted by Daria’s claim that I “don’t get it” when in fact, I simply don’t agree with it.

    Anyway…in Nadia’s defense…she isn’t the one who brought any energy here with those words. Daria did first and then me next…

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:02am

  583. 583: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    Moving Magic

    re: the guy who announced at the end of dinner what your share of the bill was: ICK!

    I would greatly admire you if you were able to use a feeling message here, though I don’t feel I would be able to :) I would be so thoroughly turned off.

    Wow, I feel as though there’s a reason Rori encourages women to receive when a man pays… it is so much easier to feel romantic! I can feel my romantic feelings flying out the window if a man wants to split the bill early on in the dating process, I sort of wave to them as they leave :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:05am

  584. 584: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Oh…and I also believe that many, many times words about how we feel are “fighting words”. I believe men see it that way too when we use our feeling messages to attack them the way feeling messages are used on this blog to attack other women.

    Even Rori herself told me once though that if I disagreed with her openly on her blog I needed to be able to handle other women attacking me (her words) because that’s what generally happens when someone speaks out against her. She knows it happens and doesn’t deny that. What I respect most about her is that, as long as we can handle it, she doesn’t censor our comments and she allows each of us to say what we need to say.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:05am

  585. 585: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    Vi (from previous thread)

    thank you so much for your advice :) that felt challenging to me, to see my mom as a beautiful human being despite how much she may be triggering me in the moment. I needed that, and it helped :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:07am

  586. 586: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I totally agree with you Mercedes, even in the areas where maybe I don’t directly agree… lol, this is SUCH a good topic and concept and thread, good for Beth and all as you said… much to learn here!

    I wonder what is in us to make it feel bad to “use the man’s body for pleasure” (the men I’ve been with just LOVE that so much and it is SO connecting, that I can’t imagine what could be bad about that and how it actually plays out ime)… and I so see what can be triggering for some about how Rori described it! I still see it landing for me as just Rori using what words were simple and not over-thought in order to express her idea of leaning-back and taking good care of us during sex. But somehow she struck on something that needs looking at for us, and maybe healing or clearing… there must be something in it for me in that way too, or I wouldn’t feel like replying.

    I have to go soon unfortunately, wish I could stay here.

    Thank you SO much for not hiding your words, and for saying what feels true for you! That is huge.

    This whole issue however lands for me as a side conflict and issue with words that were taken in a way they were not meant, and like we aren’t discussing what Rori was trying to say, but some unrelated and less rich conflict of perception that is way off to the side of what she’s trying to convey here… and that is my honest reply to your words as you have honestly replied to hers. Nothing personal meant to you. I love what Rori said, and I love that you are sharing honestly, and so articulately, connectingly, heart-fully and depthfully on what you see! Very well done and appreciated by me, thank you.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:09am

  587. 587: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    She started it . . . lol – we are all funny girls.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:15am

  588. 588: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso, I just spat out my(metaphorical) gin reading that

    woohoo.I feel amused!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:18am

  589. 589: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Indigo, haha! At the end of the date he tried going in for a kiss. I blocked it using my Jedi energy. I did use feeling messages with him, when he kept trying to schedule dates for the same night. He feels pretty feminine energy to me, & it doesn’t attract me. It does remind me to stay in my feminine, if I want to attract the masculine.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:21am

  590. 590: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: We’ll never really know what Rori meant if she doesn’t come out here and tell us. You have your perception of what she meant and I have mine…I’m certain she has her own as well. She does have a lot of advice about using men (practicing with them, dating them when you aren’t attracted and asking them to pay for the dates, etc) that I disagree with though so it is possible she meant something entirely different than what I read and that doesn’t mean I will agree with it. I agree with much of what she says and I disagree with some things. That’s pretty common for most people I think.

    As far as men liking it, you’ll have to review my earlier comments in this thread to see how I feel about that. I don’t want to go into it all here again but I will say that if you tell a man you are just using him for sexual pleasure…you’ll get plenty of sex and relatively zero chance at a long term relationship. Men have feelings too and most want to know they mean more to us than a way to sexual pleasure and they need to know it makes US happy to see them enjoying the sex as well…and it is NOT all about US using THEM. (I also don’t agree that the only way men enjoy sex is by knowing we’re enjoying it. I think that helps…a lot…I actually believe it is a HUGE part of it and I believe most men will not enjoy the sex unless they know we are enjoying it too…but I also think there’s more to it than that and they have needs as well that have nothing to do with us. They have things they like that have nothing to do with us. They have feelings and desires and wants and don’t wants and dislikes…all that have nothing to do with us). Again…my opinion. I don’t know of any men who are in long term relationships with women who are using them to get over some sexual issues they’ve dealt with in the past but…maybe there are lots. It doesn’t really matter to me, what matters to me is that I voiced how I felt about using people and about giving this advice to Beth.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:22am

  591. 591: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth . . . glad to be of service – lol

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:24am

  592. 592: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso: That’s not what I meant. :-(

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:25am

  593. 593: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    LOL Mercedes . . . i KNOW. I just got tickled and wanted to share. Do not frown at me . . . lol

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:29am

  594. 594: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    trying to schedule a date with persistence is the opposite of feminine energy

    i am very guilty of judging men as not masculine enough, which is actually VERY masculine of ME to do!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:34am

  595. 595: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #583 Mercedes, yes, all agreed and well-said imo, and important stuff to share here! Many thanks.

    I must somehow miss the attacks that occur here in the guise of FMs… haven’t noticed much of that. Maybe (and hopefully) that’s just women practicing how to do FMs and using them in moments of triggeredness here, Sirens practicing on Sirens… like men once practiced the Tango with each other in old Argentina! That feels good to me.

    And if desired, there is an amazing method for anyone who feels too triggered or like a comment isn’t what they want to read etc… it’s called SCROLLING DOWN, LOL! (Nadia?)

    (Yes, Nadia, I am picking at you today. It’s a rare moment for me I believe, but it does happen. More on that if you reply to me :) and promises of fairness and much respect to you from me if we engage.)

    We can pick what we want to read and reply to here (!), we don’t have to swallow the whole blog, gulp. People will disagree on many things, that’s the beauty of people.

    I don’t like the censoring thing. Yes, Mercedes, glad Rori doesn’t do that. Honesty is foundational for me, and without it everything crumbles. Yet it is a bIG challenge, and requires much work, diligence, sacrifice (on the surface anyway), and will bring up our triggers, consistently!

    (I don’t like to lie unless I’m saving someone’s actual life from a would-be killer/perpetrator (in which case I will lie well and pray to God for good skills in that area!)

    Oh how I wish to see a world and culture in which we can have ways of “fighting” and having conflict, difficult moments and words with each other etc, in ways where we don’t run, and can engage conflict articulately and with wholeness. That is one of the main things we work on here in the group where I live, and we’re trying to create protocols and methods for that (without making too many “rules” and restrictions, ego, methodology etc, commercial/promotional culture, and thereby straitjacketing and dis-authenticating the whole process). Maybe someday our work will be known and used in the world. This is what I work on a lot and is how I make my living right now fwiw.

    Yeah, Rori is a coach, not a therapist as far as I know… and I don’t put much stock in someone being a “therapist” as opposed to anything else we can be… I’ve been in or around that world (training, working, receiving) fairly extensively and have friends and family who work in that world a bit. We’re all just humans. Though I love learning and mastering things well, I don’t respect one person or level of learning over the other, or bow to “expertise” or education for it’s own sake (not saying you do, just bouncing off your words and sharing whatever comes up for me, which is what I like to “use” this blog for as a “tool” for my growth). If something works, it works. That is all for me.

    This is all so interesting. Thanks again for sharing and for your honestly spoken words, Mercedes.

    Here, we are our own therapist. This is self-work. Chosen by each individual and to the degree they desire, and with personal responsibility in the process! That is *awesome*.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:34am

  596. 596: StarlaNo Gravatar says:



    f*ck, i’m spamming.

    i ate a brownie and i’m rushed up on sugarrrrrrrrrrr

    i feel guilty for what i did to my body

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:35am

  597. 597: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i have a great therapist

    he makes a lousy dating coach

    most men do (for women) 😛

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:36am

  598. 598: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Regarding “rolled eyes” Tam. I encourage you to read Dr. John Gottman’s research. It was eye opening for me. The fact that you mention it suggests it is something you do in real life. It is a psychological trigger for most everyone. It changes the vibe. Even the vibe of the eye roller. Even if it is done in the imagination the receiver can feel it. I truly believe it can be life changing if everything connected to eye rolling is left behind. Even when my kids do it in a light hearted way it leaves me feeling myself wanting to lean forward to slap it off their faces. I encourage you to pay attention to people who do this and see what happens.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:40am

  599. 599: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Starla – I feel gross for what I just did to my body too! I don’t feel well, so i went for soup at lunch, but then I got distracted and ordered it in a bread bowl . . . the bread soaked up all the good chicken noodle soup broth, so of course, I had to eat the whole dang bowl . . . ugh – I feel wretched.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:41am

  600. 600: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Eek I feel guilty of wanting to relax the tools a little. I don’t want to say the words ‘I feel’ all the time. Only when I feel like u want to.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:43am

  601. 601: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so happy.

    I went round to my ex’s house last night – he said that he was feeling lethargic because of new medication he is on, but for me to come round anyway.

    For the first time in a long time, I did not internally roll my eyes at this, but opened my heart and felt empathy and understanding, and had no expectations whatsoever (thank you, Dominique :) )

    When I got there he came to the door and hugged and kissed me and then returned to his computer games which he was in the middle of. I made myself comfortable and set to the business of completely relaxing and luxuriating in the comfort of being in his house.

    After a while he came through and lay next to me and wrapped me in his arms. I just melted into him, I felt as if our hearts were for those moments safe in each other.

    I cleared all expectations of what I might have been anticipating and just felt open to receiving whatever he offered me and luxuriating in feeling appreciation for every tiny expression of affection.

    He leaned forward to kiss me to thank me for dinner (yes, I made him dinner because he wasn’t feeling well, but he’d treated me to a wonderful night on my birthday) and it felt like the crown jewels.

    What a wonderful night :)

    And now he has just contacted me to ask me if I wanted to learn a song (to sing) that he could practice with me. My favourite.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:44am

  602. 602: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I’m feeling great, eating cheese and crackers and drinking wine. I’m feeling festive! I have my cantle lit and the tree smells beautiful :)

    I feel alive!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:46am

  603. 603: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve read this post 3 or 4 times and I still haven’t found where Roris says to use a man.
    In fact, she only uses the word “used” once.

    “I used sex much the same way as you for most of my life – and it wasn’t until I practiced doing NOTHING but breathing and experiencing orgasms and letting myself receive that I was able to transfer that feeling into everyday life.”

    This is YOUR stuff.
    My bet is that there is something that really hurts in you about being used in the past, and if you can manage to go within and get into your feelings about it and riff on it instead of ranting about something Rori never even said, it might actually get healed.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:47am

  604. 604: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve noticed I feel disappointed when 2nd texes.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:48am

  605. 605: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    sounds nice Smile

    Starla and Calypso
    Please dont feel bad about what you have eaten

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:50am

  606. 606: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Belle – It says, ” if you could work on your art form in a way that involves YOU relaxing into and experiencing pleasure, pleasuring yourself, using him and his body to get pleasure – this would all turn around.”

    I believe that was the trigger.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:51am

  607. 607: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – tell it to my stomach . . . too much soggy bread in there!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:52am

  608. 608: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    RE 603 – Wow

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:52am

  609. 609: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    “using him and his body to get pleasure”

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:53am

  610. 610: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    606, calypso yeah that was where I got triggered
    Bread is good stuff you know
    Unless you are doing wheat/gluten free I suppose
    Lots of you on here do, dont you

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:54am

  611. 611: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I feel snuggled and comfy in my pjs

    I’m grateful for my world, Christmas songs and children’s high spirits.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:56am

  612. 612: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    I’m not doing any sort of diet, I just know when I eat too much and today is that day. I just kept eating the bread because i wanted the soup – they gave me enough bread for 3 people . . . the heavy sour dough kind. I need to go walk around for a while, but my head hurts and really I just want to lay it on my desk and whimper . . .

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:57am

  613. 613: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I love bread!

    Garlic bread
    Foccacia bread with rosemary
    Ciabatta bread dipped in oil and balsamic vinegar!

    Feels yummy to me :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:57am

  614. 614: BelleNo Gravatar says:



    “Even when my kids do it in a light hearted way it leaves me feeling myself wanting to lean forward to slap it off their faces. I encourage you to pay attention to people who do this and see what happens.”

    Again, YOUR stuff.
    I don’t feel triggered when people roll their eyes at me. The people I am intimate with don’t feel triggered when I roll my eyes at them.
    I have a grown son, and it never bothered me when he rolled his eyes at me (although I did get 9 kinds of bent out of shape when he said f*ck you, once and only once!).

    Again and again and again, I see so-called ‘coaches’ on this board call other people out, yet steadfastly refuse to own their own stuff.

    I feel intensity of sensation in my throat…ahh…nice, throat chakra opening.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:58am

  615. 615: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t feel lonely, I have lovely friends and family but I don’t feel complete.

    For Christmas day I feel a bit like I’m intruding on plans. I’ve felt this way for a few years now. It would feel great to have a husband and children of my own.

    This Christmas day I have a Christmas craft project planned, I’m cooking treats for family in boxing day and I’m going to start my keyboard lessons. I love looking after me.

    It’s a tough time at the minute, two of my close/immediate family members are terminally I’ll and critical.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:02am

  616. 616: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Ermmm..I am feeling triggered by some people having no sense of humour on here.
    I mean, really, if life was that serious, I’d have given myself a bullet a long time ago (big eye rolling going on). No, I never rolled eyes at anyone other than in a joky/lighthearted manner in ‘real life’ and suggesting I do is like me telling people what they do habitually when I have never even met them – nonsense. It is not up to me to mollycuddle people who don’t have a sense of humour. Actually, I don’t even need/want them in my life at all. I suggest lightening up is sometimes akin to opening the heart. It has helped me a lot not to feel offended at peoples idiosyncracies and maybe suggest that they mean it lighthearted rather than taking everything as an offence or even contempt. I roll my eyes in a joking manner when I want, because I am authentic and don’t need to hide. And I feel happy making jokes and being silly. Each to their own though, but being uptight is not my style. I mean, really is it any wonder men run from some women when they make a big drama out of two words? To me, not at all. I feel like running too.

    Strangely my sense of humour, lightheartedness and fun personality hasn’t repelled a man yet. Quite to the contrary.
    I have always been the dumpee, except for once when had to move away for job.
    Wonder how those people interpreting things to death sometimes and sitting on their high horses spewing their advicy stuff here, can say that for themselves. Would be interesting to know actually…

    Yeah, I lashed out because I felt like it. I am human too. And I roll my eyes when I want, thank you very much!!

    Because I can get away with it! Not everybody can… 😉

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:03am

  617. 617: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #589 Mercedes That feels interesting to learn about you. It seems you don’t really subscribe to Rori’s Tools entirely and perhaps you haven’t found them to work for you well.

    I see, and this was a big part of my first comment on this topic today, that Rori has explained what she means by things she says to a massive and very articulate, repeated, highly explanatory degree, in all her many dense and generous materials… which takes a lot of time for her. For her to be on here re-explaining to us with each and ever blog post would leave her with no life except blogging it seems to me, and she has done her work. It’s up to us to see try it and see what we get from it. Rori is always talking about how men have feelings too, that’s a huge part of her work… and if I were her, I’d say the same thing you’ve said to me here: “You’ll have to go back and read what I already wrote, bc I don’t want to explain all that again.”

    Yes, we all see what we see in whatever we look at… always.

    I don’t at all see anything in Rori’s materials that ever supports for us to “use a man for sexual pleasure”, UNLESS that feels clear for us and for him, and we have been honest about it with him. (Not to mention that most men ime would likely be most happy to oblige us in our need to use them for that, and would never feel used. If they are that kind, they ime usually state that and are also responsible for their actions and choices as are we.)

    I don’t personally find anything in any of Rori’s materials I’ve seen so far to constitute any references to “using” a man. To me and for me, in my view and perception of it all, she is teaching us to take personal responsibility for what we choose to do, to not be compelled unconsciously by unexamined triggers and needs, and to allow men to do the exact same in their choice of whether to take us out on a date. Men appreciate not being mothered and ungrounded by us taking that job from them and caretaking them regarding their own personal responsibility in my experience, unless they have issues and are not taking that responsibility or communicating clearly with themselves or us about their needs.

    (You will also “have to” (or I prefer to say you may) go back and read on past threads where I’ve talked on my strong practice of cooking for a man occasionally after he takes me out several times for dinner or any other place he spends money, how that’s part of my culture in the southeast US, how it can be engaged while still leaning back, so we’re not just getting taken out all time yet we can be able to return some of what he gives (but def to give always less than he gives, so as not to step on his masculine toes). Our obvious and expressed pleasure and our glad enthusiastic company for him is most of what he gets in return for his acts, though. Without this, it seems Rori’s Tools crumble so they may not do much for any woman who does not find these ideas to be true, and who doesn’t see inside them.

    If these ideas seem untrue for anyone and if they seem like “using” a man for dates etc, it makes me think of Evan Marc Katz’s approach instead of Rori’s, which fits better for some, depending what their issues and dating needs are, and how they tend to roll.

    Yes, if you are on here commenting and yet don’t really subscribe to the Tools, you are bound to get challenged and receive some disagreement from those who do, such as me, since that’s what we’re pretty much on here to do and why this blog exists (rather than as a platform for someone’s set and definite ideas that are in disagreement with the very ideas we’re on here to practice and to discuss)?

    It’s all fair. But in my mind that almost constitutes a valid reason for a person who has a differing methodology at such a basic level to start their own blog and coaching practice… instead of “using” Rori’s? (Which truly seems like a good case can be made for that as a form of definite “using” to me, much more than it would be to go on dates with a man and let him pay, as he chooses consciously as an adult to do.) I wonder what kind of “tool” this blog is for you? I feel curious about your reasons for being here if you disagree with so much of what Rori says? I’ll go back and read your comments again carefully to see if I can learn the answers to my questions and gain more clarity on this.. I will do my homework and look deeper and more fully into what you’ve already said and don’t wish to repeat (as I also suggest anyone do with Rori’s too if I have any influence there), as soon as I’m not waiting to leave for errands today here :)

    I’m just honestly sharing what I think and see about what you’ve said here.

    What do you think?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:04am

  618. 618: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Belle, let’s roll some eyes at each other, babe!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:05am

  619. 619: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Hi tam

    Happy birthday 

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:06am

  620. 620: TamNo Gravatar says:

    603 Belle, ditto. I feel sick if I see another rant making other people wrong all the time…urgh.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:07am

  621. 621: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Feeling confrontational. Rah!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:07am

  622. 622: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Smile!! And thank you for your lovely message!!! I had so so many friends congratulate me, so so nice!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:09am

  623. 623: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    You’re with your man at a restaurant, and your friends are with you. Your man asks a question like “Why is it always so crowded this time of day?”

    And you — the way you usually do — lean in and explain it to him. You say “Because…” and before you can even finish your sentence, your man waves his hand to you, dismissing you completely, and says — his voice loud — “Never mind!” Add a dash of eye rolling to his dismissal of you.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:10am

  624. 624: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    Moving Magic 589

    I think I know that Jedi energy of which you speak. I also feel as if I might know what you’re talking about with him feeling feminine energy to you.

    To me, a man feels feminine energy to me if he persists in his pursuit full steam ahead without picking up on my cues as to whether I’m responsive or returning his feelings. Rightly or wrongly, that’s how it feels to me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:10am

  625. 625: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    612 Sourdough

    I would request bread for my last meal on earth
    But, I do eat to much of it when its there calypso, so i kinda know what you mean
    Can you go for another walk?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:11am

  626. 626: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #610 Ruth, omg I always avoided going gluten free bc I thought the bread would taste crappy… and it doesn’t! I’ve had to become gluten free 2 months or so ago, and I was bracing for cardboard bread and feeling scared, and I’m finding the gluten free tastes great! (I make my own usually though (with Bob’s Red Mill).

    If only I’d gone gluten free years ago, I’d’ve not had all this damage in my body, but as mature as I am about eating what’s good for me, I was afraid. And now I’m slowly recovering, hopefully, and can heal my gut. I’m so ecstatic that it doesn’t taste bad! LOL!

    Glad to see you on here again! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:13am

  627. 627: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Every time you do anything, he’s ready with a roll of his eyes, a snide comment

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:14am

  628. 628: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Happy Birthday Tam

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:15am

  629. 629: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #623 FW This completely describes my life and most of my interactions with men, and esp NSM (with whom I am currently having yet more amazing closeness and changes with bc of leaning back etc… I am SO different now!)

    Thank you for posting this.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:16am

  630. 630: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #627 FW

    Yep. Right freakin spot on for me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:16am

  631. 631: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    Starla I can agree with your thoughts on judgment & it being masculine energy.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:17am

  632. 632: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Tam! Happy Birthday! |whistles, woo hoos, and confetti!| xo!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:17am

  633. 633: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes, btw I am merely turning the mirror around to you. See what it feels like and let me know, I am interested. xo

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:18am

  634. 634: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Ginger shy
    I dont want to speak for Mercedes, she can do that perfectly well for herself
    What I perceive though is that the two ladies co-exist and DO agree on many things.
    I know Mercedes does have her own blog as well
    For me, I find some of the Tools very difficult to apply over here in Europe-we discussed that a little earlier
    I actually think the principles of Roris tools are really sound, and I can see how overfunctioning does not woek.
    But, just as you have the thing about cooking a meal in your culture, so maybe over the pond, stuff like paying for dates, or circular dating may need to be adapted
    Not sure if that makes sense
    But I do take you point about interpretation of words and our own persoanl triggers

    I too am glad that there is not censorship in here

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:19am

  635. 635: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #603 Belle, I agree totally. Well-said!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:20am

  636. 636: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Hugs to you Smile

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:20am

  637. 637: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you FW

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:20am

  638. 638: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i do feel guilty for what i put in my body — i have insulin issues.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:21am

  639. 639: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    yay december bdays! happy bday!!!

    mine’s sunday:)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:23am

  640. 640: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Contempt, eye rolling, discounting the other person’s opinion, and showing disrespect are also extremely predictive of marriage failure. Men are especially sensitive to criticism, and criticism and harshness towards men is a high predictor of divorce. Living together has been shown to have no relationship to eventual marital success (and may even have a negative effect).

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:24am

  641. 641: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Ginger Sky

    Apologies for earlier typo of your name
    The bread would be one thing if gluten free, but its everything else too!
    I might see if we can get that bread here
    For sure it is easier to be Gluten free nowadays

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:26am

  642. 642: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Yeah, Ruth, thanks.

    I have a trigger on people disagreeing with anyone’s work on their own forum if it gets to the point of disagreeing with their most foundational concepts. Seems weird and out of place and like “using” to me. I’m not sure where it comes from or why anyone would even bother doing that and it makes me question. Nothing personal meant to you, Mercedes, just saying what I feel/see as you have here also. I’m getting in a hurry, still waiting for NSM to pick me up and it’s late for my errand and I’m getting triggered here about that and hurrying, hoping he’ll drive up soon lol. So I don’t have to call and check again with him!

    I lived in London in the past, and I wonder what it is that doesn’t work over the pond about the guy paying all the time. Is it bc they just don’t like it? Or bc the economy is tough and it’s financially a strain?

    Wow, I remember being there in UK where everything seemed pretty pricey. In my city here we have lots of free things to do that are fun (bc our economy has been expensive and tough here a long time and yet we have a serious need for fun stuff for various reasons, tourists, it’s a happy city etc)… and we can always eat a meal on our own then meet for a drink or dessert…? It seems intensely interesting to me how culture affects all this. Hmmmm. Thanks for sharing.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:30am

  643. 643: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    I just walked our 350,000 sq foot building as fast as I could and I feel sooooo much better! Even my headache is not as bad. I refuse to be sick! I’ve taken 3 packets of EmergeC since I staretd feeling bad yesterday evening. I will not be sick!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:31am

  644. 644: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, I didn’t notice that you typo’d my name, no worried anyway on that lol, thanks!

    Are you gluten free? Yes it is hard. Gluten can be in anything and not be on the ingredients list. Bleh. I wish you were here I would make you some bread lol.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:32am

  645. 645: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Ginger sky
    I havent actually dated over here for over 20 years, but it was the thing to go half and half
    Seemed fair to me at the time, and still does
    Now that I earn quite a decent wage, I havent had an issue with paying for all of the stuff if we go out
    But I can see how constantly doing that makes the man less of a man, in a way
    But expecting him to pay for everything feels wrong to me.Maybe its the way I was brought up, i dont know
    Ive got no issues with a man planning what to do , and wher to go, and I am fully on board about not chasing for dates as i might have done in the past
    THAT bit of leaning back makes perfect sense, even if it feels impossible to do sometimes

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:35am

  646. 646: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, can you order online from Vitacost there? They have Bob’s Red Mill flours (and maybe his bread mix too, I can’t use that one bc it has sesame) and other gf stuff at a discount somewhat. I thought Vitacost had a Euro warehouse too, but maybe I’m wrong. Are you in Britain?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:35am

  647. 647: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I also use King Arthur gf flours and mixes, yummy.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:36am

  648. 648: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: This is true: “That feels interesting to learn about you. It seems you don’t really subscribe to Rori’s Tools entirely and perhaps you haven’t found them to work for you well.” – I don’t subscribe to all of them but I have used enough of them to have an opinion on what does actually work for me vs what doesn’t. So yes…I don’t subscribe to them completely. I don’t think I subscribe to what any one person says “completely”. I’ve found it best for me to pick and choose what I do subscribe to and work with those things rather than trying to find someone who I agree with everything they say. I feel comfortable talking about that here at any given moment. I do subscribe to a ton of what Rori teaches and I have many times been a testament to that and probably always will be. At times, I disagree and feel just as comfortable being a testament to that as I do with the tools I love. I do also use my own blog to tell people what I think and what I believe and how I feel and about my life, etc. I find that to be a good place to be honest as well.

    As far as how it feels to have the mirror turned on me. I guess I don’t know. I like having these discussions so the mirror really doesn’t affect my feelings at all I don’t think.

    Belle: For me, it isn’t about me or something that happened to me in my past. It’s how I would like to see people in this world treated. What I wrote above “I think we have a much better chance of manifesting the relationship we want and deserve if we treat ourselves and the men in our lives as loving, beautiful human beings.” is what I truly believe and I’ve always felt this was a safe place to put into words and post what I truly believe.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:36am

  649. 649: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I do find Mercedes’posts very helpful at times
    She did the total lean back and CD to get wher she has, but she also sometimes provides another perspective on the Tools
    As you yourself did, Ginger Sky, with the example of a meal to be cooked in your culture

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:36am

  650. 650: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Yes, I am in Britain Ginger Sky(wales)

    we do get lots of gluten free stuff over here

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:38am

  651. 651: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    my mom is emailing me again

    i want to lash out at her.

    “Hi honey, did you get the packages I sent you?”

    First of all, I’m not your honey. You abandoned me multiple times and your idea of a relationship with me is to cyber stalk and eaves drop on me, instead of getting professional help so i can actually feel safe enough to have you in my life.

    Second of all, if you ever spoke with me directly, you’d know my apartment building office is actually closed, and i won’t get your packages for a while. It sucks that there are perishables in the stupid gift basket you picked out for me full of sugary crap that is going to exacerbate my chronic medical condition.

    Lastly, stop sending me sugary crap. I’ve told you for years that I shouldn’t eat it. I ate half a brownie this morning and feel like death.

    Go to therapy or leave me alone. Pick one.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:38am

  652. 652: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I am only *thinking* about gluten free
    I know it would help my running and IBS
    I dont have a medical reason for doing it, Im not coeliac

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:41am

  653. 653: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #645 Ruth, if you wanna know my take on it, I’d say you have triggers with not being okay with receiving and yes that’s something that you may feel better if you look into and heal, regardless of culture, or anything, period. If you wanna date well and turn that around?

    If it helps, I let men know I am happy to do free or inexpensive things, and I say this like a princess who is enjoying herself to the hilt. Not in an apologetic way. I like watching people, eating a light snack of something novel and fun, hearing free music, going to book reading clubs, being home in a group with friends, doing hobby-related things, and more. I let them know this in a way that doesn’t make them feel “bossed around” and I ask for a certain activity if they aren’t thinking if something (which usually gets their motor going on thinking of more things when they see how much I enjoyed myself).

    NSM called and nicely apologized for lateness, gotta run he’s here, love to all!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:41am

  654. 654: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    C just made a corny comment to me and I rolled my eyes at him, he laughed and said, “Your eyes are gonna get stuck like that!”

    Cite all the research you want, I go by personal experience.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:45am

  655. 655: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: I also agree with this 100% and believe that’s what I’ve done. I don’t know if Rori meant anything different than what I read and I can’t possibly know that because she can’t be here to clarify for me but I do believe I left it up to me to take what I get from it and then I also chose to comment on it:

    “For her to be on here re-explaining to us with each and ever blog post would leave her with no life except blogging it seems to me, and she has done her work. It’s up to us to see try it and see what we get from it. ”

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:46am

  656. 656: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    653 Ginger Sky(I keep typing shy,LOL)
    Well, I will certainly think on that one
    May well be true

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:46am

  657. 657: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I’m paying for the date timorrow, he hasn’t asked me too. I haven’t offered. But he shared he is down to his last few pounds as its nearly pay day and he overspent on Xmas. He shared he feels guilty about this. I have no problem receiving, but I don’t feel I want to follow not paying strictly. I earn a decent wage too and have no outgoings. I’ve experienced both types of relationships, over paying and totally receiving.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:49am

  658. 658: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Actually, hm, thats an interesting thought
    For me, and alot of my peers, a “date” DOES involve spending money
    It does feel refreshing to read of another way of doing it
    Come to think of it, when I lved in London you could do museums and art galeries for not very much(free now)
    “dates” here often just mean drinks and/or dinner

    Ooh, I LIKE that new perspective.Not that I am dating right now, but I like it

    Thank you Ginger Sky

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:49am

  659. 659: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    That is EXACTLY what mean, and i like this
    No Rules or Tools are inflexible, are they
    This feels good to read

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:51am

  660. 660: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    yeah i’m done with rules and more into ‘speaking up when something feels bad’

    esepcially BEFORE iw ould do it!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:54am

  661. 661: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: I’m answering your questions in pieces because that’s easier for me right now.

    “I’ll go back and read your comments again carefully to see if I can learn the answers to my questions and gain more clarity on this.. ”

    Comment 322 I believe will show a good testament to the tools I personally think will help a lot of women (my opinion only). Some I used before I knew Rori. Some I used before I knew Rori but learned so much more about once I found her. Some I learned completely from her. Some I know well but love coming here so I can be reminded of. All are a credit to what she teaches. I also have a link to this blog from my blog (and to Dominique’s beautiful blog among others) and also link to it anytime I reference a topic that began here (such as my most recent post). I’ve also written to her credit many times. I believe (again, my opinion) I do a good job of pointing people in this direction and praising the work Rori does that resonates with me.

    With regard to my blog though, I’m no longer all that interested in a coaching business. I toyed with it for a time and enjoyed the women I worked with but mostly I just like talking about things and am not that interested in developing coaching materials. I answer their emails when I receive them, I comment on my blog when they ask or state something. I have discussions anytime people want to talk through something with me. But…I don’t have the time to devote to an actual coaching practice and I don’t spend a lot of time on my blog anymore (mostly because I am unable to access it at work even during our slowest time of the year – like right now – and I’m rarely online at night because I prefer the life J and I have decided on together – which doesn’t account for too much time apart with me on the internet). Someday I may decide to pick it up again, who knows, right now, I don’t want to dedicate the time needed to grow a successful coaching business and I’m not all that interested in an online business…although, as I said, this could change as life progresses for me. At this time, I much prefer a more relaxed approach such as discussions on this blog.

    Ruth: Thank you! :-)

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:05pm

  662. 662: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I agree Ruth, I also feel comfy doing this because I’m ‘aware’ his energy is moving towards me not vice versa.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:05pm

  663. 663: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    oooh a famous national magazine is going to interview me soon.

    i feel proud

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:10pm

  664. 664: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    oooooooh Starla


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:14pm

  665. 665: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Aw ambulance cd sent a picture. It is basically a visual of my description in 602.

    I like the saying attract who your being.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:17pm

  666. 666: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you for your hugs Ruth

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:18pm

  667. 667: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:20pm

  668. 668: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    One of the absolute nicest things Rori ever said to me (after we had a discussion where we triggered each other over a difference of opinion…a SERIOUS difference of opinion…):

    “Mercedes – you rock – and the only image I hold in my mind about you is that of a fabulous woman. Love, Rori”

    It is from a conversation I will keep forever in my files and in my heart and mind.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:21pm

  669. 669: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    i wanna see rori triggered!!!!!!!!!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:22pm

  670. 670: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Starla: She’s just as sweet and caring and beautiful when she’s triggered as she is when she’s not. :-)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:23pm

  671. 671: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    I WANT TO SEE!!!!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:25pm

  672. 672: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    LOL! Well…I’m not going to post the exchange here because much of it happened over email and I’ll leave it up to her to share that if she wants.

    Feel free to try to trigger her though… haha!

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:27pm

  673. 673: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    To be honest though…she was so nice about it the only reason I really knew she was triggered was because she told me so. :-)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:28pm

  674. 674: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Ambulance cd wrote ‘one day…’ he was making forward plans.

    I love cdating. It keeps me in the present moment.

    I love visualising my perfect relationship.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:44pm

  675. 675: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    GingerSky: I just saw this comment…not sure how I missed it:

    “I have a trigger on people disagreeing with anyone’s work on their own forum if it gets to the point of disagreeing with their most foundational concepts.”

    I certainly hope that Rori’s one line above that I disagree with for advice (“using him and his body to get pleasure”) is not her most foundational concept. I’ve taken SOOOOO much more from her that feels foundational to me than the advice to use men… This just feels like one thing she said that I disagree with (her concept of using men to practice. I disagree with it very much but it is such a minor part of all she teaches…it’s ONE thing, not the foundation from what I get out of everything I’ve read and listened to). It doesn’t feel like the basic premise for what she teaches. I believe if it was I would have been gone long ago. For me, her work with CDating and leaning back and learning to explore and feel and work with our true feelings is much more foundational than the using other human beings part…

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:48pm

  676. 676: MelNo Gravatar says:

    Mr. A: “Can you help me change my relationship status on FB? I’ve been trying to do it, but can’t figure out the settings.”
    I wonder what motivated this? LOL

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:50pm

  677. 677: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    It’s been 2 days & I havent heard from CudG…
    He’s travelling to see his folks and will be gone for 12 days…
    He’s leaving on Sat…
    Even though he’s travelling a post date follow up is still expected right??
    I’ve been feeling UP & down lately…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 12:59pm

  678. 678: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    I feel uncared for, unwanted…
    I feel fearful…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:00pm

  679. 679: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    somebody talk to me…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:02pm

  680. 680: SmileNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:04pm

  681. 681: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    whats the matter Heart?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:04pm

  682. 682: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Cycle cd has read the book the secret. He noticed me using the word ‘feel’ and commented about my profile.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:05pm

  683. 683: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I read back

    Cud G has his own time line and there are no rules about a follow up on the date
    oit necessarily in his head darling, however much YOU want it

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:06pm

  684. 684: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Heart: It’s okay…I hate seeing you in pain here. :-( Men rarely do things on our timeline. A man may or may not call again but if he does, it will rarely be when we’re expecting it. This is a really good example of why Dominique teaches to release expectations. Can you shift your vibe and recognize love and caring in other areas of your life? And allow him to do with his what he will?

    I know how easy that is to write and how hard it can be to do. Are you meditating? If so, sometimes that helps me when I’m particularly sad. Sometimes it doesn’t though…I know…

    Anyway…no idea what I’m trying to say…I hear you, I see you and I want joy and peace for your heart right now.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:10pm

  685. 685: ruthNo Gravatar says:



    what did he say

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:10pm

  686. 686: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    He always writes 2-3 days later asking me out again…That was in the past and our date was weird
    but he’s travelling on Sat…
    Still..I can’t help but see this as -Omg he is not interested. It’s over!
    I feel a little devastated…
    Also..I’ve been walking around with an ache in my chest…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:12pm

  687. 687: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Sirens ….I feel awful…ick…
    I just want all this too heal…soon.
    I’m tired of obsessing over some man or the other…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:15pm

  688. 688: MelNo Gravatar says:


    Try to make up a “good” story if you are going to speculate on why you haven’t heard from him.
    1. He doesn’t want to scare you off
    2. He’s impatiently nibbling his nails, counting down the requisite 3 days he’s “supposed” to wait to contact you (as advised by his clueless man-friends) in order to not appear desperate…though he would call you this second if he were “allowed.”
    3. He’s dreamily wandering the malls, in an attempt to get his Christmas shopping done for his family, though he can’t get his mind off you…

    Most importantly, just try to busy yourself doing something you like and get your focus off him. Enjoy your life and he (or someone better) will want to be a part of it. :)


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:17pm

  689. 689: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    letting go of expectations….easier said than done…
    thanks though Mercedes…
    and Ruth…
    and Smile.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:18pm

  690. 690: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Heart: When J and I first started seeing each other we developed a sort of pattern of calling/texting that I became used to. At one point, he stopped (just literally stopped and said nothing about what or why). I (pre-Rori stuff) leaned forward and asked if something was wrong. He responded with “Just taking a slower approach to this”. It kind of stung (and I was embarrassed that I had asked anyway) but I let it go (responded with something lame in an attempt to be lighthearted but then I stopped too because what the hell are you supposed to say to something like that?). He reached out to me not long after and everything was just fine. I welcomed him back with fun and never really brought it up again. I was genuinely happy to have him calling and texting again and I let go of the part where he needed time away from us. He just needed to step back a little and as hard as that was, it was what he needed. It felt really weird to me (because I was having a great time and needed no ‘space’ yet) but…it was real for him. And because I was still someone he was interested in, he didn’t let it go for long.

    I hope you can open your heart to him having his own reasons for stepping back right now. My heart goes out to you.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:20pm

  691. 691: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Hey all. I hope my words didn’t feel uncomfortably direct or anything to you, Ruth, as I was hurrying out the door earlier.

    For me Rori’s work is about self-healing, with the improved connections with men as the platform, side-effect and reward for doing this work. Like if I was her, maybe I’d call it “Change Your Inner Self, Change Your Relationships.” Thank you Dr Daniel Amen 😉

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:22pm

  692. 692: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    No ginger sky ,, it was helpful thank you
    Food for thought

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:24pm

  693. 693: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    I love how the sparks fly when powerful women congregate :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:25pm

  694. 694: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    I have real issue with this
    When I have had a nice time with a man, I want to phone and contact MORE
    to talk to him about the fun we had, relive it
    it really throws me when he doesnt want to do the same, or worse, does the man cave retreat thing, which I never knew about before CC and Rori
    i can *know* about it all I like but it still hurts

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:26pm

  695. 695: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes, thank you for all your words and replies. I appreciate them very much and they feel very good to me :)

    No, the core concept of Rori’s work I refer to is not as you’ve asked, that of “using a man’s body to get pleasure.” It is the core concept of CDing and leaning back as Rori describes and teaches them do not in any way constitute us “using” a man for anything.

    I apologize I was less than clear on what I meant.

    Thanks for all the good discussion and good info from you, as well as honesty! That feels so valuable for me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:31pm

  696. 696: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I meant: It is that the core concept of CDing and leaning back as Rori describes and teaches them do not in any way constitute us “using” a man for anything.

    I see that as foundational for everything we do here. FMs and the whole nine yards, everything, deeply rests on that.

    And as Rori also shares, a woman who’s deeply into her Sirenness, who is shifted in her vibe and experienced at using the Tools (over time?) can even lean forward without being in male energy.

    Thanks again for the talk and sharing on this.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:36pm

  697. 697: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you GingerSky…I appreciate you hearing all that. Although she and I don’t always agree, I didn’t want my image to be that of someone who disagrees with Rori’s foundational concepts so wanted to clarify. I appreciate you taking the time to read.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:38pm

  698. 698: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    Hmmm…he’s leaving the country too..So i feel a little sad about that as well…and like He’ll forget about me..
    And our date was Not Great…but there was a connection there..
    And His Vibe is different…
    So I feel disappointed and thrown…

    I’m different…and he’s different…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:39pm

  699. 699: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    685, Ruth,
    he said it’s nice to meet someone who has a positive outlook in life etc and shows gratitude when we first started talking. When we met he picked up on it again and asked outright if my using of the word feel was deliberate. So I replied, yes once it was deliberate, now it feels natural. I didn’t want to say about the blog but I felt comfortable sharing I was a big believer of the law of attraction. To which he replied he had read the book. He said wow if you’ve managed to make it a way of life. I said I’d not read the book but Ive read enough to have a few things I try to incorporate into my life.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:39pm

  700. 700: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #237 Daria, thanks for all this on oxytocin etc, I agree and have experienced this as you describe.

    Also if my PEA levels rise (via chocolate, or supplements, pre-cursor foods etc) I feel no longer downhearted or needy for man-touch and man-attention/connection… going gluten free seems to have allowed me to be filled now with lots of my own good cuddly chemicals naturally. I’m bouncy, bubbly, laugh super-easily and more… I am naturally disarming and cute and funnier, not leaning forward like a graspy needy empty person as I used to… just like when I would get my internal chemistry up from falling in love or being with a man in some way. Even when I feel poopy, I feel great.

    I feel grateful.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:42pm

  701. 701: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I had to laugh when NSM picked me up earlier today. He was wearing his t-shirt that says “laid-back”. Lol that’s what I am now, laid-back in my lean-back, he he.

    What a different and amazing life. Feels healing.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:43pm

  702. 702: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes I believe you rock!!!!!

    Gingersky I am pretty direct. Always been. I also now like to try on being influenced by other people. People who I choose. I love improved connections with men so I like to try on new ways of thinking and being.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  703. 703: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Mercedes and Ruth…
    I’m going to try to not obsess…
    I just meditated….I feel better…
    And I’m going to let go off any dogmatic thinking for now…

    I really need to start cding soon.
    I feel out of feminine energy a couple of times with CudG….

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:44pm

  704. 704: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    You’re welcome, Mercedes. Thank you for the same! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:45pm

  705. 705: TurquoiseNo Gravatar says:

    Hi Sirens,

    I feel quite happy to share that things are going really well with Old friend CD. We are dating (not being just friends), not rushing into anything, but have amazing talks, he makes a lot of effort, always contacts me first, I haven’t even had a chance to reach out to him first. We are being very open and honest and sharing feelings. He wants to make plans, lots of plans to see each other and he is sooo open about how excited he is about our relationship. One thing he’s repeatedly shared is how good I make him feel about himself. That could come right out of one of Rori’s programs. It’s flirty and fun and light, but also feels exciting and new and fresh. He’s soooo positive and pleasant. Rarely complains about anything. I appreciate his zest for life.

    I had a nice time with Tom on Sunday, but have barely heard from him since. He asked about seeing me next weekend, which I’m open to, but in the long run it would be very hard for me to be happy in a relationship where you don’t talk everyday. So, I’m happy to keep him as a CD and spend some time with him, but it’s good to know that about him, to not have expectations in that area, and enjoy his company when I am with him.

    Today is my 39th birthday and I feel like a million bucks. My friend at work gave me a bottle of wine and brought in bagels, and my boss paid for lunch. I don’t have anything big planned tonight, probably dinner out with my girls who I love to pieces :) but some fun things to look forward to this weekend.

    I said numerous times I wanted to feel like the best thing that happened to someone else, and then realized I wanted to be the best thing that happened to ME, and here I am,…. feeling like both. :)

    I did run into Mr. Conversation yesterday and heard from him on the weekend on a fantasy football message board, and being completely honest, I do miss him. I wish things had worked out differently. I am still super attracted to him. But I get what Rori was saying about how what we are attracted to may not be good for us. It’s not that he’s a bad guy, he just didn’t want what I wanted, or me, enough.

    Being with old friend CD, he’s not as at first glance hot… he’s on the short side, grey hair and has a belly, but his smile lights up a room and he has the most gorgeous blue eyes, and I feel he will grow on me. He’s cute, just in a different way. My concerns with him is that he’s still legally married and has some health issues. He’s got a lot going on in his life. Which, is why CDing is awesome. Instead of getting all attached or planning a future, I’m enjoying the moment and do feel very happy to have someone special in my life for the holidays. I didn’t expect this to happen, at all.

    Chemist popped up on Sunday too, wanting to go to breakfast. I said i was sorry, already had plans, but was available later in the week. he said he’d love to see me, I’m so cute… but haven’t heard from him since. He’s a last minute plan kind of guy. I may not e available when he asks again! :)

    Hope everyone is doing really well! I still have a lot to finish up for Christmas, but do feel I have it all under control. I really love Christmas.

    Oh, and on a side note… my mom had us over for a birthday dinner with my sisters the other day, and it was so nice, and I felt the effort and love she put into it. It meant so much to me, and I told her I loved her. That’s not something we easily say to each other in my family. We feel it, just don’t always say it. I feel so…. serene, balanced, solid… just peaceful I guess, deep in side. I feel loved. I think I finally really love myself, it’s such an AHA moment! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:46pm

  706. 706: StarlaNo Gravatar says:

    gingersky, what is PEA level?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:47pm

  707. 707: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    FW: Awwwww….I totally smiled there!! :-)

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:47pm

  708. 708: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Have a fantastic day Turquoise!!!

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:49pm

  709. 709: TurquoiseNo Gravatar says:

    Oh, and Mr. Conversation and I didn’t talk, ran into each other at drop off, had some serious eye contact, both looked caught off guard and got in our cars and drove away. I feel sad we got to a place where we can’t even really say hi to each other… but I wanted way more than to just be friends, so guess it’s better this way. I’m not longing for him or feeling disappointed. Well, maybe still a little. His eyes just get to me. It’s emotional.

    But, happy I can stay focused on the fun and positive things happening in my life and getting ready for Christmas! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  710. 710: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    I’ve got a few men in my rotation and so haven’t logged on match for a while.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  711. 711: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    A POF guy just asked me to send him a pic to his phone because his Iphone does not get POF pics . . . I highly doubt that. I hate the suspicion I’m feeling, but that does not seem possible. I have an Iphone and have many friends with Iphones and they are quite compatible with POF.

    He didn’t give me his number and I’m not going to ask for it. I told him I could send him one of my POF profile pictures via phone if he’d like to text me first. Let him ask for my number.
    hat is this suspicion? I’m frowning . . . that’s not attractive, that’s not open . . . I think I’m in smack-down mode :/

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  712. 712: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Happppy Birthday Turquoise :) :) :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:52pm

  713. 713: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Turquoise I would at least think about saying hi to him and see how that feels internally. I believe I would have said hi.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:55pm

  714. 714: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    699 smile

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:56pm

  715. 715: BelleNo Gravatar says:


    I totally rolled my eyes at this…and am having a giggling fit now, thank you <3

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:57pm

  716. 716: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    :)and happy birthday

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:58pm

  717. 717: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Questions I would like to ask ambulance cd tomorrow on our second date… Advice welcome! 

    I feel curious about what you believe about marriage now you are separated…

    I want to know if he wants children… His profile wasn’t filled in for these parts…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 1:58pm

  718. 718: TurquoiseNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Mercedes and FW! I actually did say hi, but sort of to the air… he pulled up behind me at drop off and my daughter pointed him out to me. I believe I actually said… “OH!” and then “Hi” but it could have been directed at him the air, or even his daughter who did say hi back to me on her way into school. I don’t think I even breathed! He didn’t say anything just sort of gave a somewhat painful smile and got in his car too. The comments he made on the football blow were directed to me, but weren’t personal. It was because I was the number one team and he beat me to go to the playoffs. Which, I thought was kind of silly…. but maybe he was using that as an opening to see if I’d reply. I don’t know. I had been doing the I’m sorry, please forgive me, I love you, goodbye thing, just visualizing that over the weekend to let go of the connection I feel between us, to wish him well and that he’s happy. Also, to free myself. I don’t think about him anywhere near as much as I did at first, but it does hurt that he just cut me out of his life 6 weeks ago, with no contact. But, who am I to say why someone else does what they do or acts a certain way? It must have been what he thought was best, and I have to respect that.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:01pm

  719. 719: TurquoiseNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Ruth! Off to do some quick shopping and I’ll be on the blog later. :) Hugs everyone! It’s my birthday, please eat a sweet for me!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:02pm

  720. 720: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    Awwww, Heart…I’m so sorry to hear he’s leaving the country, I know how much you like him and that obsessing stuff can feel so bad, I know.
    Keep being good to yourself, you’re doing great.
    Sending you babysoft tender and gentle hugs.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:02pm

  721. 721: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    well- he asked for my #, so here we go. Just got a text from him – I guess I will reply wityh a pic of me smiling . . . . Not sure iof I will give him a CD name yet – see how it goes this evening. It’s girls night with my mom and some of my friends – margaritas, so if he startes a conversation, he can be the focus of our girl-talk for a while – lol.

    I’m feeling defensive and skeptical. I need to try to soften up . . . It’s so hard when I’m really still hurting so much – how do we protect our hearts from the pain of lost love and still be open to the possibility of something new? Tricky . . .

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:03pm

  722. 722: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Smile for all you know the LOA thing might be something you guys have in common and helps him to feel you get him and can speak his language.

    I would maybe wait until he brings up something then ask how he “feels” about marriage.

    With regard to children if he doesn’t have any, talking about his family could help identify how many nephews/neices he has and whether he enjoys them. It might help open him up to share if he wants. I wouldn’t ask directly as it might come across as an interview or unfeminine.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:03pm

  723. 723: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    6 weeks? Many guys start missing women so bad between 6 – 8 weeks that they come back.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:06pm

  724. 724: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Smile: I would totally ask those questions on a second date. What have you got to lose? The wrong-for-you answers could cause you to lose a lot if you wait too long to find out how he feels. Those questions seem spot on for something I would want to know early on. :-) In my opinion they are perfect and the timing is perfect. As a matter of fact, you could turn it into a game. “I get to ask you two questions that are very important for me to know and you get to ask me two questions that are very important for you to know. You go first.” 😉

    Fun little way to get to know answers to your important questions AND to find out what’s important for him to know about someone he’s dating.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:08pm

  725. 725: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:10pm

  726. 726: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth – Not a peep out of GM for a while now. I reached out to him to see if he wanted to get together for a beer to celebrate my son graduationg Boot Camp the weekend before I left to get him and he let me know he was out of town, but his messages were real short and felt cold, so I did not let myself contact him the whole time I was gone – normally I would have sent him pics of my son, but I know he could see them on FB anyway. Normally he would have contacted me about being proud, etc., but he didn’t. Something feels off. I’m leaning way, way back. I’m letting myself feel the pain of missing him. I’m not telling myself it doesn’t matter, because it does.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:14pm

  727. 727: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes I wouldn’t on a second date. It smacks of agenda as if you already have him pegged as marriage material. Why should he be so important? As if I have nothing else going on in my life or noone else. Nah. Not me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:15pm

  728. 728: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #658 Ruth, yes… I found the drinks and dinner thing got way boring and repetitive for me after the 80s when I was in my 20s and dating a lot sometimes (plus I’m a great cook and most restaurants don’t impress me much, I can do as well at home if I can get the ingredients lol). It just bores the heck out of me, and it feels nerve wracking to try and be charming, well-dressed, guessing what to wear and so on. And I’d get STUCK in bad dates which were costly for the man (while I knew he was not going to see me again), and would have less of a way to get out and get back home.

    I’m a person people want to confide in, and I’d have men telling me over dinner about their sex lives and problems, their mental illnesses, medical situations, griping a lot about how expensive the dinner is while we ate it, etc etc. To go somewhere we both know we’ll enjoy bc we talked about it, instead of just getting food all the time, is way more appealing for me… as well as less costly and nerve wracking, and easier to end the evening if one of us is miserable. If we order food, we both have to sit there and eat it. Bleh.

    I was once on a blind date a few years ago set up by one of my exes who was certain this guy would be for me. Omg we both could not wait to get outa there, no connection at all lol! But we had to force conversation till we ate all the wonderful semi-pricey food we had just ordered. I tried to dress stylishly and wear nice light makeup, and he hated any makeup and fashion, and told me so very directly that he thought I was too madeup. It was a disaster. Lol. If we’d gone elsewhere, we could have cut it short much easier after simple mutual discussion.

    I save food dates for someone I actually have gotten closer with and and when I know I have mutual connection we both feel excited and comfortable about, and it’s a big deal to cross that line for me most of the time. I do not see why men have to spend money all the time for dates. Creativity is more fun.

    What else do we do here for free or inexpensive dates…? Coffee shops, botanical gardens (we have an awesome bonsai exhibit here in a slightly private yet safe setting), the hike near the botanical gardens (if I feel safe with a man), outdoor drum circle (for those so inclined), poetry readings at our local literary-type non-chain bookstore, riding bicycles together, free demonstrations of sustainable living techniques then sit outside at a garden or park and talk about what we saw, participatory local sports events like frisbee golf, horseshoe or ball games (good for some laughs and breaking the ice), fishing (though that’s in remote locations usually), free talks and exhibits at universities, our amazing local ice cream shop ($2-$4 per person and great fun), browsing at big bookstores where we can sit and read, swimming (if it feels safe), cookouts on the grill/barbie (cheaper to buy groceries than restaurant foods), cheese and wine tastings open to the public or at which he can bring a guest, church get togethers, surfing the internet together sitting close on a sofa at a coffee shop looking at stuff we both enjoy that sparks our conversation and sharing (one of my favorite dates by far), looking at antique or other interesting unusual shops, scheduled nature walks and hikes with a guide and a group (usually free or about $5 per person here), sunset rides on paddle boats nearby (costs a bit but cheaper than a fancy restaurant).

    I do not judge a man by how much money he spends on me… though that matters later if we get closer (so I know he’s not stingy or lazy in general!). I find his creativity, curiousity, novelty, supportiveness of my good times, multiple interest areas, generous heart, willingness to take risks (and not try to please or impress me), and his sense of hilarious and warmly considered romance and fun to be waaay more important and enjoyable.

    Hope this is helpful to someone :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:18pm

  729. 729: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Happy Birthday Turquoise :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:18pm

  730. 730: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    FW I agree about the questions (sorry Mercedes, lol, xo!)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:19pm

  731. 731: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Timing and context are two things I believe are important. I don’t believe a separated man is rearing to rush back into marriage.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:19pm

  732. 732: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I do love to dress up and be squired out by a man very much, and I love fancy restaurants when they’re really amazing… I just save that till we’re in that deep so it feels comfy and special. I kind of like taking restaurants off the menu, lol, so I can see if he has interests, creativity, can make a good time with less money etc… that impresses, warms and wins me so much!

    Spending money is too easy imo. Anyone can do that.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:24pm

  733. 733: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Gotta run again, bye all, and may your evening be filled with deep love and comfort.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:25pm

  734. 734: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Oh gingersky

    I dont date right now but thise posts feel SOOOOOOOOOO good to read.And i am maused by the eighties dting stuff, well, ok, i did mine in the early 90s in London, but -yeah, I can really relate!
    I LOVE to cook

    You kmow, this feels exciting for me to date myself doing all these things
    Sod the man!
    Thank you

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:27pm

  735. 735: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    FW: I can see that. I personally didn’t date men who had no potential to be my one (ie had hugely different views on life, were unattractive to me physically, didn’t fit my personality, etc) more than once or twice. This is another area where I disagree with Rori in that I don’t waste my time or his (or his money) if I’m not interested. If those questions reflect who I want to end up with, I wouldn’t even hesitate to ask. (That’s not my advice though…that’s what I would do if I were in the same situation)

    But I can certainly see the value in not asking too.

    Who was it that posted all those questions about marriage, etc to ask on a first date because men have nothing to lose and will usually answer honestly on a first date? I can’t remember but I liked that a lot and saw real value in it. I feel the same about date two as I feel about date one. Ask away…what do either of us have to lose. :-)

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:29pm

  736. 736: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    six to eight weeks is sooo long in a womans time line isnt it

    well, it is in mine

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:32pm

  737. 737: SmileNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks mercedes and FW,

    Mercedes…”The wrong-for-you answers could cause you to lose a lot if you wait too long to find out how he feels” this is behind my wanting to know what he believes. With cycle cd (loa attraction guy) I feel comfortable I don’t want to ask these questions but with ambulance cd (separated cd) Im not sure what he’s looking for?

    FW yes I agree with what your saying too. I don’t want to interview him. We’ve talked about our families etc. I still feel non the wiser.

    I winder if I could do it this way… What do you feel about this?…
    Plans for Xmas day it bound to come up in convo.. saying
    “it would feel great one day to have a family of my own to share it with” This way I’m sharing ‘my’ wants a bit more.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:33pm

  738. 738: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Here’s one of the nice websites for our city that shows some free things to do, in case this helps any Sirens to figure similar stuff in their area of the world:

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:33pm

  739. 739: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Oh…FW…I also always had an agenda. My agenda was to find the partner I was to spend the rest of my life with. I didn’t hide this fact from men but sometimes had to say “Slow down grasshopper. I don’t mean to imply that’s YOU. I’m just saying that’s what I want out of life.” Sometimes men got SUPER uncomfortable with my honesty about what I was looking for. A few men told me it was refreshing to hear something other than “I’m not looking for anything serious. I just want to have fun.” when clearly the same women saying that were looking for something serious. I’ve heard most men can tell if we just want to have fun or are looking for something more serious by date three. (I heard this from an old CD).

    But I’m so different than a lot of women I guess. I really did feel like I had nothing to lose with these guys. I had dated my share of men who hurt me and really saw no reason why I should hold back at all. I was soooooo in the “weed ’em out early” stage of my life when I was circular dating.

    Probably not a healthy place to be. Thank goodness J came and found me when he did. lol

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:35pm

  740. 740: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I just posted a link of free things to do in my city… it went into moderation. Hope I didn’t violate anything… there’s just some good food for thought on there imo :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:37pm

  741. 741: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I wonder if all cities offer online ideas/listings of free things to do… surely they do?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:38pm

  742. 742: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I meant the arboretum for the bonsai exhibit, and the botanical gardens too (our botanical garden is plain and no big deal, but a nice place to sit in a green spot for talking with other people around!)

    just trying to spark Sirens’ interests to see what they like to do that can be free. We can help our dates by asking them to take us somewhere we like if it’s free! Web can see if we like the man with no cost or obligation, lol!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:41pm

  743. 743: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Daria for drinking coconut juice

    Thank you for taking liver herbs and probiotic

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:41pm

  744. 744: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Smile: I think you’ll get conflicting thoughts on that one here too.

    To me, it sounds way more serious (dreamy and hopeful or wistful maybe…sounds almost sad to me – but then that would all depend on tone, body language, facial expression, etc…I’m reading a lot into just the words without knowing anything else) than to just come out smiling and ask straight up “So, I have a question. How do you feel about marriage and kids? I’ve heard that a lot of separated/recently divorced people are instantly against it and never want to do it again. Is that true for you?”

    but that’s just me.

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:43pm

  745. 745: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Nail.On Head
    thats my point

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:43pm

  746. 746: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Ginger sky – hmm well part of the practice is not helping him… And then there’s no obligation anyway, and part of the practice is getting comfortable receiving without bucking into the NVs of obligation…

    That practice feels crucial for me to build my ability to feel confident receiving

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:45pm

  747. 747: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    Doesn’t Rori teach that instead of asking questions, we can just talk about what we are looking for in a relationship and let the man comment on that – in order to find out if he is looking for the same as us? Use feeling messages to describe our wants and needs for the future, for a relationship, for a family, etc and see where he goes with the conversation?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:46pm

  748. 748: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I think the point is to face and heal the trigger of ‘obligation’

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:46pm

  749. 749: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso – yup :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:47pm

  750. 750: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Daria for thinking about being pleasures and feeling so set in my ways w Dman that he seems he’s coming around now haha

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:48pm

  751. 751: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Looking back, I was so into that “who cares” stage I even put straight up on my profile that I enjoyed being treated like a lady and knew that a man who didn’t pay for our date probably wouldn’t get a second date. Lots of men reached out to tell me how awful that was. None of them asked me out. I ignored their messages (no need to debate my point) and went on a lot of dates. None of the men I went on dates with asked me to pay. Not one.

    Weed ’em out early. LOL

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:48pm

  752. 752: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Oh, yeah, one of my other most favorite things to do for free here is go to The Grove Park Inn and walk around, sit, look at the giant fireplaces and watch the guys who do the fire show stoking the logs… they have no other heat source in there in winter, and these guys go at it like crazy men, doing tricks turning giant logs and everyone watches as the sparks fly! Very romantic. And a ritzy setting where I can dress up if I want. I have always loved hanging out in hotel lobbies and on observation decks, etc. At GPI they have one bar which has comedians and a hilarious dueling piano show for free every Friday night.

    I’ve dated men with money and without. it makes no difference either way for me. (Not trying to spam or obsess, just noticing new ideas on this topic as I wait for NSM to pick me up again for our group dinner.. here he is!)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:49pm

  753. 753: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I have on my profile that I don’t pay on dates also .

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:49pm

  754. 754: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    If it is a date which costs nothing, or next to nothing, then that works.It really works

    This is *very* different to dating in the UK, but its really quite brilliant

    takes the icky money thing out of it
    you see, we dont really do coffee dates that much over here
    we should

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:51pm

  755. 755: CalypsoNo Gravatar says:

    New POF guy seems fairly normal now that we are chatting via text. I can feel my guard lowering. His dad died of Alzhiemer’s and that is what my mom has, so we have been exchanging funny stories about how to have fun witht hem in theor last years.

    he seems witty and has not asked for a naked pic, so that’s a pretty good start for a POF guy! Ha.

    Ok – off to Girl’s Night – gotta go get mom now.


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:51pm

  756. 756: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    And I am simply LOVING the idea of cruising round posh hotels all dressed up

    Would quite like to meet you in real life GingerSky

    you are deffo a glass half full person
    I really feel quite uplifted

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:55pm

  757. 757: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Yesterday NannyCD gave me $10 for food while he went to work, and when I didn’t use it, he wound up asking for it layer as he was low on cash for the week

    I felt resentful

    He always pays for everything , and I get a bit of a resentful vibe coming from him

    I get the impression I have a very ‘me me me’ vibe as I don’t like to share certain stuff that’s for me

    Well I felt nu band weird and turned off giving him that $ back

    I didn’t address it,

    Likely this is my stuff yet it’s not something I like / can handle

    He owes me 4 $ he’s borrowed too

    I feel very controlling about $


    I’m feeling turned offf what with that and some no tolerance type of comments I think related to his religion.,.,

    And mostly e the no sexual advances thing.,.

    And his kisses feel tentative and that feels like turn off

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:56pm

  758. 758: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I feel guilty and scared to tell him it’s not working for me

    The truth is its not now, mostly cuz of the no sexual stuff

    Yet he’s so there for me, an excited for us to go to the symphony on Christmas eve…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:58pm

  759. 759: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Calypso 746 – yes…she absolutely does. I was never much good at that (but I also have not been dating other men since I met Rori…only J). Not sure if I would have felt different had I known Rori then or not.

    I was just really, really direct. I asked a lot of questions, gave a lot of information and…honestly really enjoyed dating a lot of the men I met…but was clearly trying to get to know who they were under the first date nervous/polite demeanor they usually showed up with.

    I don’t think I did it “right” (I never made a true connection with anyone I met online although one guy was close…he did become someone very special to me for a time) so what I’m writing here isn’t advice…just more about what I would do. It’s an example of how I circular dated. Raw, out there and uneducated in what I was supposed to do. As I said, it’s a good thing J came and found me…

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:58pm

  760. 760: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I feel triggered by people taking one sentance out of it’s beautiful, and well written context and bastardizing it. Probably I feel triggered because it is something I AM practicing, exactly how rori explained it.

    And no…I’m not just using someone for sex.

    And where did rori say “Just use him for sex!”

    She did not say that.

    “Men only care about how they’re affecting YOU – in other words, if you could work on your art form in a way that involves YOU relaxing into and experiencing pleasure, pleasuring yourself, using him and his body to get pleasure – this would all turn around.

    I used sex much the same way as you for most of my life – and it wasn’t until I practiced doing NOTHING but breathing and experiencing orgasms and letting myself receive that I was able to transfer that feeling into everyday life.

    Just practicing alone is terrifically helpful – and if you can handle practicing with a man (or woman) that would be even MORE helpful! Just look at it like that, and not as a WAY to get to anything.

    Sex is a Tool, too – see the Sensual Meditation in my ebook….”

    *sex* is a tool. (alone OR in company)

    *practice alone*

    *NOT a way to get anything*

    *Men only care about how they’re affecting YOU – in other words, if you could work on your art form in a way that involves YOU RELAXING INTO AND EXPERIENCING PLEASURE, pleasuring YOURSELF, using him and his body to get pleasure – this would all turn around*

    Keep it in context. She actually explained this and layed it out VERY well.

    I feel all hot on the back of my neck.

    You realize, I wrote about my own practice and did not even explain it much differently, and was agreed with by many who disagree with rori.

    And Beth has made sex an art form. I’ll put money down that she knows, like I do, exactly what rori means. As I always thought of sex as an art form.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 2:58pm

  761. 761: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    If it takes the icky money thing out, ones missing on healing all that ickyness… Healing that was a big thing to me and it wd be big for any woman who has hang ups around $

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:00pm

  762. 762: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Headed out ladies…I have a workout session planned with J (Dang Body for Life!!!) and then we’re going to do a little shopping.

    Have a FANTASTIC evening everyone!

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:03pm

  763. 763: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    well Daria, honestly and truly
    I dont feel icky about contributing or paying
    I a fine about it
    I think its just the whole process when you dont quite know where you are with all that

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:04pm

  764. 764: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Real quick before I go…

    GlowStix: I’m very happy you were able to read what Rori wrote and get value from it. I read it and got triggered and hated the advice. Can you respect that some of us see her meaning differently than you do and disagree with it from our own perspectives?

    Much Love,

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:06pm

  765. 765: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Am feeling so mad at men right now


    Also feeling needy

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:11pm

  766. 766: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    Hi Sirens

    The subject of “eye rolling” is very interesting to me.

    I have one friend who rolls his eyes at me whenever I talk about a certain subject, or certain subjects. But, yet, he never really bothers me.

    Yet, I have another friend who prides herself on being sarcastic – and she thinks she is hilariously funny – she makes me cringe. In fact she doesn’t say ANYTHING without resorting to sarcasm.

    I’ve lately started avoiding her. I feel sad about this.

    I suppose I think occasionally its okay – maybe the person is trying to make a point – just NOT all the time.

    Hope this helps!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:11pm

  767. 767: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:


    I so relate ti what u e r saying about your mums…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:12pm

  768. 768: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    Happy bday Tam!! *glitter*

    😉 <3

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:14pm

  769. 769: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    Apologies for my spelling! I’m on an iPhone…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:15pm

  770. 770: T-GirlNo Gravatar says:

    Happy birthday Turquoise!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:20pm

  771. 771: TereslynNo Gravatar says:

    Hey everyone, trying to lean back in my current long distant relationship. I have only been answering his calls when I haven’t been busy which means only every other time he calls. This Is soo hard for me, but the result is he has called me much more often than usual. Also I am not waiting for him to initiate Our next contact as I am working on CDing. This is difficult cuz I miss my toxic man and have to force myself not to contact him..

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:21pm

  772. 772: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    I want people to disagree with me. And I gave into an urge to re-iterate my perspective as well. I feel shut down. I won’t give into this shut-down. This is an urge I want to give into.

    I felt triggered by this apparent lack of context. As if, all the other detail around those words falls aside. I feel resonance with the entire frame of advice. And it’s something I started practicing even before I read this. And it feels personal. I am practicing this solely for the purpose of forming a connection through sex again. Which is something that is so difficult for me. And I don’t think anyone would understand that unless they’ve felt it.

    So much talk about induced bonding through oxytocin.

    I don’t experience that.

    Bonding is difficult for me.

    And yeah…It does feel scary when people don’t get it and say how it’s bad to use sex and a mans body. It has brought me nothing but beauty. And if there is anyone who understands I desire to keep my perspective out there for them to see.

    I feel out of breath, as if I just said that. It looks like it would sound if I said it out loud.

    I need a break.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:26pm

  773. 773: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Hmm this one guy wants to see me… Might feel cool … Change of scenery

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:26pm

  774. 774: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Wow I wrote change of scenery

    I’m feeling kinda down n mopey

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:35pm

  775. 775: ruthNo Gravatar says:


    some of us have had so much soul less sex in the past

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:39pm

  776. 776: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Belle …I not sure exactly what I feel gor CudG …when I’m around him I like somethings and I dislike other things…I fluctuate between being attracted /turned off…
    In real life…he’s still someone Im still getting to know ….
    It’s always some guy….earlier in the year it was Manboy….now it’s CudG …and soon it will be some other guy…
    It’s a pattern…and i don’t know how to change it….

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 3:53pm

  777. 777: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    I just had a reality check….

    I looked at CudG facebook….he was out with friends yesterday…He had told me he was going out with his friends when we met up…but seeing it on Fb is like …okaaay.
    While I was home obsessing about whether he would call me…and going over the date and feeling heartbroken….HE Was living his life.

    I felt surprised…I felt bad and a little jealous…but I also feel disconnected and turned off by the guy in the picture…
    Above all else…I Feel So Embarrassed
    i feel cringey on the inside…
    like ick…I’m pathetic! …..lolol….
    Omgod…this guy does not care about me at all…and I am going on and on about him on the some kind of Freak.


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 4:17pm

  778. 778: HeartNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 4:58pm

  779. 779: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:05pm

  780. 780: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    598: Femininewoman says:

    “Regarding “rolled eyes” Tam. I encourage you to read Dr. John Gottman’s research. It was eye opening for me. The fact that you mention it suggests it is something you do in real life. It is a psychological trigger for most everyone. It changes the vibe. Even the vibe of the eye roller. Even if it is done in the imagination the receiver can feel it. I truly believe it can be life changing if everything connected to eye rolling is left behind. Even when my kids do it in a light hearted way it leaves me feeling myself wanting to lean forward to slap it off their faces. I encourage you to pay attention to people who do this and see what happens.”

    Even before Tam said her ‘please’ was akin to an eye roll I imagined her rolling her eyes at me and felt it.
    I brushed it aside and thought sarcasm but what I actually felt was psychologically attacked and contempt coming at me, hence my words I did wonder. And in real life if a man does this I want to physically hurt him but and it feels very difficult not to. And if a woman does it I want to get away from her or get her away from me.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:08pm

  781. 781: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Ty for the links FW felt interesting to read.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:09pm

  782. 782: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Big Hugs Heart.
    You are not pathetic, you are healing and learning.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:10pm

  783. 783: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Re 735 I

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:20pm

  784. 784: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I hear you Glowstix and some of what is said feels good to me.

    I am a pedant myself so to me the word use I took as use.
    If people don’t mean that word they are using and really mean the word in another way it feels confusing and unsafe to me as I do not like ambiguity.And I feel all offbalance inside I don’t know where I stand with ambiguity. Too much guess work involved which feels draining on my energy and makes me feel stressed then in their company.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:23pm

  785. 785: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    now that I’m home and can be a little more present with the responses.

    Mercedes! I appreciate so much how you’ve been such a spacious place to land when I’ve felt confrontational!
    I invested a lot of time to think about different angles, what this has brought up for me
    what there is to discover
    while, one the one hand, it does seem to me that you pulled one sentence out of context,
    on the other hand, what shines through for me is reading “It’s how I would like to see people in this world treated.” I feel connected to where you are coming from and believe that I get the point you want to make.

    Reading that I can use a man’s body for pleasure made me think….Oh! Right! Men don’t exist just to cause pain! They can bring me pleasure, too!

    I don’t see an inherent conflict in the way I understood Rori’s advice and what you want to express, but that’s the fun of different perspectives, isn’t it?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:28pm

  786. 786: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:

    Belle here again…announcing that I’m switching my screen name to match my actual first name.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:31pm

  787. 787: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Indigo – 601 – YAY you. Happy dance!!!


    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:32pm

  788. 788: SassyNo Gravatar says:

    A very Happy, Loving, Sireny, Goddessy, everything you want it to be, Birthday to Starla, Tam, Turquoise and my youngest daughter (tomoro) and any other December beauties!

    Love and kisses and sparkly faerie dust….

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:34pm

  789. 789: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    It feels awful to be gaslighted.
    I don’t want to be gaslighted.
    It actually feels soul destroying.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:39pm

  790. 790: SassyNo Gravatar says:

    At this point, it’s been so long since I’ve even HAD sex, I’d feel happy (gee maybe even lucky and satisfied) to use, be used, using, take advantage of, or whatever the case may be, just to feel alive and wanted again!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:42pm

  791. 791: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    A Message To Women From A Man: You Are Not “Crazy”

    September 12, 2011 in Women with 418 Comments

    You’re so sensitive. You’re so emotional. You’re defensive. You’re overreacting. Calm down. Relax. Stop freaking out! You’re crazy! I was just joking, don’t you have a sense of humor? You’re so dramatic. Just get over it already!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:44pm

  792. 792: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    RE 735 I mentioned the Lauren Frances frist date heartbreak prevention question “So Bob why aren’t you married yet”. It is out of context for a second date with a separated man.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:45pm

  793. 793: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:46pm

  794. 794: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:


    I found several definitions for the word use:

    1 archaic : accustom, habituate

    2: to put into action or service : avail oneself of : employ

    3: to consume or take (as liquor or drugs) regularly

    4: to carry out a purpose or action by means of : utilize; also : manipulate 2b

    5: to expend or consume by putting to use —often used with up

    6: to behave toward : act with regard to : treat

    7: stand 1d

    What I heard was definition 2
    I’m wondering if the way you heard it was definitions 4 or 5? Which would make perfect sense and of course feel icky.

    Feeling reminded of the ex who did actually gaslight the living bejeezus out of me and what a clusterf*ck that was had me feeling provocative.

    I’ve been a little prickly today, forgive me if anything I said fostered disconnection. I feel softer now and more ready to connect.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:49pm

  795. 795: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    551 Starla
    I went to this link and it brought me to a video that starts out by saying basically you don’t have to forgive anyone if you’re not ready and in fact if you feel you need to get revenge on someone, then go out and get revenge etc etc….
    What the????!!!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:53pm

  796. 796: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I am a highly sensitive person.
    I love my heightened sensitivity it beings me great joy and pleasure and is also there to protects me. It feels important not to ignore the painful side that this sensitivity brings me, it serves me well and alerts me to when I need to take responsibility and care for and look after myself by disengaging and moving away from people who gaslight me as this is harmful to my heart and soul.
    It is my responsibility to take care of my heart and soul and look after them well.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 5:58pm

  797. 797: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you inner guidance for taking care of me.
    I feel peaceful and loved when I am taken care of.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:00pm

  798. 798: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    I’m behind on the blog..and really busy right….but…

    Happy Happy Birthday to all the Sirens that have a birthday around this time.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:02pm

  799. 799: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I feel happy and enveloped by love.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:03pm

  800. 800: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    I have to change my perception and goals.
    I’m having a hard time with switching that’s from boy to girl energy and back again. I intend to be open to meet the right man for me. I want to be a soft ocean and not flypaper.
    I want to cd so I can have free therapy.
    I intend to not run away from men who like me (like my older coworker)…
    I will take care of me and make myself beautiful.
    Should I reach out to old friends? Maybe…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:10pm

  801. 801: Miss BellsNo Gravatar says:

    I feel SO PROUD of myself.
    I published the Kindle book and it is formatted very well if not perfect.
    It is a VERY exciting TRUE story about a remarkable woman.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:11pm

  802. 802: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    *switching hats

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:13pm

  803. 803: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    798 miss bells I can’t wait to read it

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:32pm

  804. 804: k2012No Gravatar says:

    “I learned my lesson, no sex if a man doesn’t love me.” Here, here. Cheers. Don’t remember who wrote this. The thing is ladies, sometimes u are not even sure if the man loves u. We all know however that sometimes sex happens early in a relationship, sometimes too early. Afterwards, however the relationship will continue for a while. Well for me in some cases, the relationship ends quickly. In a few cases sometimes they last a long time. I can’t have sex outside the context of a relationship. So if I start sleeping with a man who I am supposed to be involved with and if he ever tells me that he is not ready for anything serious and is not ready to settle down/get married and wants to do a million things before he gets married (my ex boyfriend, the one before the disappearing ex told me this). Any man tells me that, like they want a casual sex/friends with benefits thing will receive his marching orders IMMEDIATELY. Or even if u don’t say it, I see it in your actions, u only show up when u want sex,I just end the relationship. Ex boyfriend before disappearing ex only wanted this type of relationship. He is lucky he lasted nine months. After I couldn’t take it any longer, I ended it. Sex is very sacred to me and I can’t just deal with a friends with benefits/casual sex relationship. Not my style as when my heart start get involved, I can’t stop it.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 6:41pm

  805. 805: LuzydelNo Gravatar says:

    Feeling so low today… is this how people get close, by braking down walls? Like I mention I know “D” and I are not the forever after couple, I am not his one and I think he is not mine. But the relationship (though not committed) is bringing out the “worst” case of vulnerability in me; I can’t go into detail of what is going on, just that he is a good man.

    It is like we are dying in front of each other and coming back to life again, but different people.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:42pm

  806. 806: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #746 Daria, yes, not helping him. I just have things in mind to answer if he asks me where I want to go on a first date. Yeah, it’s helping him. I used to be too much the other way, always saying, “I don’t know. What do you want to do?” I won’t help a guy all the time, and maybe not even after the first date, but if he’s not from my area, has driven here to take me out, and has spent all his money on gas, I offer ideas of things I enjoy doing, in a leaned back way. I don’t know… it works for me. They seem to take the reigns and figure things out fine usually after the initial time or two, and that’s what I’m looking for.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:43pm

  807. 807: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    My past dates and bf’s complained consistently that I always used to just say, “What do you want to do?” I guess I’m getting over that finally lol. Hmmm.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:44pm

  808. 808: GlowStixNo Gravatar says:

    “I dunno…what do you want to do?”

    Yeah…I say that a LOT.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:47pm

  809. 809: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #804 Sex is sacred to me too. It just feels like that honestly for me. Affects me way too deeply, bonds me with the man, opens my heart in a special way, and has all kinds of effects and implications for me to see it in any other way. I have never had any blockage to enjoying sex, so I don’t need to work on that, just needed to work on not doing it too early or in a non-committed situation, as you’ve described. I know it seems different for everyone.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:49pm

  810. 810: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #746 Daria, I mean yes, you are right, not helping him is an important part of what Rori says, thanks for your words on it. It gives me food for thought.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:54pm

  811. 811: RadloveNo Gravatar says:

    Miss Bells,

    801 = Congratulations!!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:55pm

  812. 812: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    “I’m sure whatever you think of will feel great :)”

    “I feel more romantic when the man takes me somewhere”

    feels different than “what do You want?” or “whatever you want” to me

    I say what would feel good to me when first date in my area too, I actually want to cut down a bit on controlling that, I’ve wound up doing the same thing on dates instead of discovering new things

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 7:57pm

  813. 813: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Right on, Daria, good words. I say these things too.

    Lol we wind up doing a lot of the same things on dates here no matter what, since it’s a small town kind of city. That used to drive me up a wall, as this is my home area, but I grew up in Atlanta and Houston. i got used to it finally. BUT your words here help me with my vibe, internally.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:00pm

  814. 814: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #794 BeLoved I think I remember when you shared way back on the blog about your ex gaslighting you. That was rather stunning and memorable, yes. Glad to see you here and hope you are doing well!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:02pm

  815. 815: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #793 Annie, that was good, I bookmarked it. I’ll add it to my bookmarks section of sites that define what constitutes abusiveness between people… so many things on those sites were surprising to me, and I noticed they were being done to me and I was doing some of them to others too!

    And even cooler for me, I noticed it was my leaning forward that caused some of them to come to me from others, esp from men, and my not taking good care of me that was illiciting others. It felt more than great to learn that I can affect all that, and without “fighting back”, just by changing my vibe and getting thru my own triggers.

    Taking good care of me means that I don’t put up with that kind of behavior, but simply remain curious, don;t take it personally, move away from them energetically and physically, keep NO attachment whatsoever to what they think of me, and say, “That feels bad to hear that you see me as overreacting. I feel curious.” Then usually I just kind of drift away and do something else that feels more interesting for me and leave them alone energetically and/or physically.

    If the behavior continues however, then taking good care of me equals disengaging that person from my life (like Beloved did w her ex?) Some people are just abusive. That feels boring and sad, and maybe even scary, and I don’t like feeling that way.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:17pm

  816. 816: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:

    Okay…after tossing and turning and running this thread and my day through my mind…
    I have to say, I take back what I said and thought about the eye-rolling.
    I could see how I was feeling defensive because my ex used to lambaste and berate me for HOURS on end when I would express contempt or disgust. He was so much more articulate and educated than me, I felt so helpless to defend myself and didn’t think highly enough of myself to just leave and I was clinging to my *right* to express contempt. (For the record I told this man straight up when I first started dating him that I was mentally ill, he must have been too, to decide to be in relationship with me at the time because I was seriously batsh*t nuts). It feels bad, and I can still feel some part of me not wanting to let go and I wonder, if I can choose to let that go forever? I wonder if that’s possible?

    The kicker for me was seeing the look on C’s face when I did it, he was smiling but I saw how his eyebrows raised in surprise, he had never seen me do that before and I feel like I betrayed him and myself a little bit.

    I feel grateful for Annie’s wisdom, I feel like her posts were healing for me. I have had some kind of internal conflict going on about protecting myself, instead of removing myself from harmful situations I have tended to lean in and wow
    if you know how bad gaslighting is
    imagine being gaslighted on LSD
    over and over and over again.
    I was so attracted to the pain, like a moth to a flame. It was horrible, horrible and yet I kept going back.

    It feels bad to say it, and I was feeling contempt for wanting to protect from harm.
    I remember once, while we were tripping, T was ranting and ranting and ranting about who knows what (I would dissociate), sometimes he would rant for 15 minutes STRAIGHT about how I wouldn’t stop talking and let him talk…wtf??? and anyway, for some reason, I stripped down naked and told him, “I will not protect myself from you!”

    I cannot, for the life of me, understand the thought process that led to that…and it just got worse after that.

    I have had the Serious Crazy for a while and I feel it healing.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:23pm

  817. 817: k2012No Gravatar says:

    ‘I can count on one hand’ as the saying goes in my country the number of times I have had just casual sex/friends with benefits. Ginger, I had to end it pretty fast so as not to get attached. To make matters worse, the guy lived with his girlfriend. After a couple of weeks, I put a stop to it. Couldn’t deal with it. The sex was good yes but I ended it with him because we couldn’t be serious cause he was involved with someone so I just stopped it. He was a former co-worker and we were friends first. I can’t recall doing anymore friends with benefits. One time I got involved with a guy who I later found out had someone else. I ended it and he confessed to me when the girl left him. He told me that when we started he wanted it to be a sex thing only, but later on he found out that I was deeper than that. Yeah man. Can’t deal with the casual thing. I mean Ginger and other ladies, sharing your body with a man is so intimate and bonds u with the man that there is no way I could just sleep with a man who I am not in a relationship with. Nope. Not me. I mean, I know some women can do it. I have a friend who is fine with it but based on what she used to tell me, she still couldn’t deal with it very well as she told me that the guy only used to come over when he wanted sex. So she thought she could deal with it but she couldn’t.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:27pm

  818. 818: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:

    Gingersky, it’s me, Belle.
    BeLoved is my real name, I decided tonight to start using it on the blog 😀

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:30pm

  819. 819: VioletteNo Gravatar says:

    Ruth, no matter the age I still find the difference between dating in Europe and the US interesting…mostly because dating isn’t even a big thing in Europe! At least not in France where I was…people just seem to get into relationships really quickly. I admired it, because I don’t know how to do that. But dating comes more naturally to me.

    Glowsticks I think it’s great that you are walking away from something that doesn’t work for you. Sometimes that just feels so good to do. Oh, and I’ve also had that happen to me so many times, with men who obviously had plenty of money, that I now just say I didn’t bring any money. So I can’t pay and I spare myself that resentment.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:44pm

  820. 820: MovingMagicNo Gravatar says:

    ((Smile)) I’m also dealing with an illness in the family. I can relate to some of the emotions you’re going through.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 8:46pm

  821. 821: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    It seems true that sometimes when people do these kinds of gaslighting behaviors, it’s only bc they are trying to communicate something that’s of importance to them, whether “positive” or “negative”, and our reactions are more than they know how to handle. So they manipulate to keep themselves comfortable whilst still getting to vent their judgments etc, bc they/we get regressed and disempowered, and don’t know better ways to express themselves and what’s bothering them. Better and less judgmental communication would imo help this a lot.

    We use abusive behaviors to steal energy from each other momentarily to make ourselves feel better and avoid carrying or looking at our own darkness inside.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:04pm

  822. 822: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Belle, lol. We had someone in the past called BeLoved? And I recall a story about someone being gaslighted by their ex. Lol!

    I feel confused and dis-confused at the same time 😉 Thank you!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:07pm

  823. 823: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #816 BeLoved I salute your honesty, wisdom, willingness to be naked in that moment (I don’t find that so “crazy” actually, though I see the drama and pain addiction you went through). I salute and appreciate your sharing all this here. Thank you.

    ((((( BeLoved )))))

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:13pm

  824. 824: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:


    I honor your transparency though it kinda feels shocking to my system, it feels like two different personalities

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:22pm

  825. 825: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:


    It feels like you have peeled back a layer

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:22pm

  826. 826: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    I have a date this weekend with blueCD. I feel soo nervous and vulnerable. I’m not even excited about it because I feel ashamed of not having my act together right now.
    I hate feeling like that. I feel like I don’t measure up. I feel vulnerable and shy.

    I feel like shutting down.

    I can see myself shutting down when I meet him if I feel defensive or vulnerable by his questions.

    Remind me please sirens I need your help…. What should I ask on the first date and what should I remember about being sireny…
    Listen at level 2
    I’m all that

    Deep breath

    What so I do if I don’t want to or don’t know how to answer a question ?!?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:25pm

  827. 827: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    What does gaslighted mean?!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:26pm

  828. 828: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:


    Beautiful sweet human spirit

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:27pm

  829. 829: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    I feel like I’m five years old
    Vulnerable and unsure
    Waah Emerson

    I want a man to make me feel comfortable not like he’s trying to size me up…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:28pm

  830. 830: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    A kind of emotional abuse

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:30pm

  831. 831: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #754 Ruth If I remember Europe well, there are no coffee dates bc that might be like “water dates” since in Europe, coffee is like water… or maybe blood transfusions, LOL! Do you agree? 😉

    Daria: “And mostly e the no sexual advances thing.,.

    And his kisses feel tentative and that feels like turn off”

    I also get very triggered by this… I want us to feel and acknowledge that we’re having sexual attraction, even when we agree to not go there too soon… but tentative kisses? Omg that is so ugh for me. no blamey attitude meant on a man, but that is not manageable for me.

    Though I did teach one of my exes (who introduced me to NSM) how to hug me hard, as he hugged really tentatively. I yelled at him (my beautiful young step mom, the love of my Dad’s life, had JUST died, and it was hard and I was there till 30 mins before her death, exhausted to passing out. I had sat up holding her in position with my legs, arms, shoulders, head, hands, pillows etc so she could breathe a little better all night, and I was exhausted, wrenchingly torn and heartbroken and angry at the hospital… I shouted “HUG ME DAMN IT! Just grab me and hold me, squeeze me TIGHT! Let me FEEL your strength! (he was there for me the whole way!) I am falling apart here! Your hugs feel like a little girl!” And I broke down screaming and sobbing and beating his chest.

    He got it. He said he had been taught that he’d be violating a woman if he hugged her hard. I said, “If you don’t change this you will be alone all your life!” He had been ditched by his wife. He is married again now. I hope I helped. I know I helped me, and he said it helped him big time and thanked me many times for this, and said he did not at all mind me yelling at him like that.

    Tender passionate touch, yeah. Intense rough passionate touch, yes.

    Tentative touch with no passion, no thanks.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:33pm

  832. 832: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    How do you know if you are being gaslighted? If any of the following warning signs ring true, you may be dancing the Gaslight Tango. Take care of yourself by taking another look at your relationship, talking to a trusted friend; and, begin to think about changing the dynamic of your relationship . Here are the signs:
    1. You are constantly second-guessing yourself
    2. You ask yourself, “Am I too sensitive?” a dozen times a day.
    3. You often feel confused and even crazy at work.
    4. You’re always apologizing to your mother, father, boyfriend,, boss.
    5. You can’t understand why, with so many apparently good things in your life, you aren’t happier.
    6. You frequently make excuses for your partner’s behavior to friends and family.
    7. You find yourself withholding information from friends and family so you don’t have to explain or make excuses

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:35pm

  833. 833: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson, hello! Annie posted a link about gaslighting a bit earlier on this thread. It will answer your Q.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:35pm

  834. 834: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Happy Birthday Turquoise and Starla! Woo hooo!

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:36pm

  835. 835: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Happy Birthday Starla

    and QZ

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:38pm

  836. 836: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    FW yay, this looks like the same site I found that helped me so much with my connection to NSM and our bad behavior to each other last year. Feels so relieving to read this.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:38pm

  837. 837: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I was gaslighted by my Mom the WHOLE time I was growing up. Poor Mom, she didn’t realize what she was doing, and I can say that now. She is healing now too, and had an exceedingly difficult life. I used to just be furious and broken and blaming all the time. Feels infinitely better now, and I had only hoped I might feel even partially this good someday. Glad I didn’t decide to end it all. I would have missed out! Who knew.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:41pm

  838. 838: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Tam, was that you who dreamed of having breast cancer? Could that mean you feel you are giving too much and it’s not being received or appreciated, or returned by someone(s) in your life? Do you recall which breast?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:43pm

  839. 839: SensiouswomanNo Gravatar says:

    Had an amazing evening with the most tender endearing man I have met in a long time. The evening was cut short because his ailing mother has taken a turn for the worst and he is having to fly back to his hometown tomorrow morning. I feel sad for him.. he said that his mother really had died a long time ago that she went with her mind that has been ravaged by Alzheimer disease. But he said a mouth full when he said “as much as we thought it would be a blessing for her to go… now that the time is near.. I don’t want her to go”.. I know very well how he feels.. so saying prayers for him tonight and on forward. I hope he can get there in time to be with her.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:47pm

  840. 840: IndigoNo Gravatar says:

    I feel so happy today, learning my songs.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:53pm

  841. 841: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #826 ((((( Emerson )))))

    Say what feels true? Stuff like, “I guess this sounds weird, but I feel shy and a little nervous, and I’m not sure how to answer your question right now. I’m not sure why that’s happening. I’ve been learning to be more myself lately and more relaxed instead of trying to impress. I’m not used to it yet! I’m enjoying being here. What was your question again?”

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:53pm

  842. 842: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #826 Emerson, what does it look like when you feel shut down? How do you act?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 9:56pm

  843. 843: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson, you might also get the whole nervousness thing offline by smiling, leaning back and telling him up front and early on: “I’m getting used to dating again and I’ve been feeling nervous and shy, like a kid! It feels weird and annoying, but I won’t let it stop me. I’m enjoying this process and it feels good to just tell the truth (lol). I hope this feels okay for you, I’m enjoying our date!”

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:00pm

  844. 844: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Luzydel and GlowStix, I am enjoying your posts as usual, and find them deep, engaging, so very human and soaring and real. Thank you.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:01pm

  845. 845: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #801 MissBells! I have a Kindle! I am SO excited for you! And I look forward to reading this, wow. I love this kind of story a ton. Congratulations!! :)

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:04pm

  846. 846: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you gingersky… Yes lean back…good advice

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:06pm

  847. 847: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Shutting down looks like me being defensive and eventually dismissive and feeling like “I want to leave” and shutting the guy out…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:08pm

  848. 848: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Wow… I wrote a draft of an imaginary responses as if I was the woman on Annie’s link about gaslighting, the one whose husband keeps making comments about her weight. It was awesome and I lost it. Was something like:

    “It feels bad when you make negative comments about my weight. It makes me feel quite sick and ____ when I hear that. It makes me want to eat more and add even more weight to comfort and insulate myself from words that feel bad. I am awesome and I deserve a good life and to be treated well, and I don’t want you to feel unhappy either. I want and need your encouragement and support, as this battle seems hard enough for me without the heavy weight of your negative words. I don’t feel willing to accept that this is a “joke” and that feels like dishonesty from you, though I don’t blame you bc this is certainly not an easy subject to talk about. I want us to be honest, and this feels like a very serious issue. I don’t want to feel this way. I want to take some time to figure out how to make my life better inside and out. What do you think we should do?”

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:14pm

  849. 849: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I would do this to trigger some honest communication if he was truly being abusive. I would begin to make my life great and take good care of me without him. I would stop caring what he thinks of me and care only for what I think and feel about myself.

    He can come along for the ride of my great life if he wants, but I would let him crash his boat for me before I connected with him deeply again.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:20pm

  850. 850: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #847 Thank you, Emerson, yes I remember you saying that before.

    What does it feel like in you when the shut down occurs… like, what images, thoughts, memories or sensations do you experience… if you right now just flop out on your bed or chair, open your body and feel what is there around shutting down like that.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:23pm

  851. 851: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson, when you have that feeling online in you, then hold your head with your hands… right hand on your forehead skin to skin, and left hand on the back of your head on the bottom of the curve of your skull in back. Place your feet solidly on the floor and imagine connecting with roots into the ground, gently coming out from your feet… going into the ground… a little deeper each time as you imagine energy like warm honey flowing from your head down each and every part of your body and into your feet… let the roots gently continue digging a few inches deeper each time you imagine them.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:27pm

  852. 852: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Let all feelings that don’t feel good pass through those roots and into the ground, passing out of you. Then draw nutrients up into yourself as rich water from the earth, like a tree.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:29pm

  853. 853: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Ginger sky it feels like hopelessness, worthlessness, rejection, isolation…
    I’m getting…”You don’t deserve to be treated with respect”

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:30pm

  854. 854: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Close your eyes during this. Let all the feelings come up and be seen and felt so they can pass.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:31pm

  855. 855: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson, just close your eyes, hold your head, keep your legs open and let it flow out and in. I am here. Sending you energy if you want it.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:32pm

  856. 856: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    I really like this guy is the thing …. I’m making him “special” and he is not,,,, he’s practice

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:33pm

  857. 857: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you gingersky

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:35pm

  858. 858: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    I apologize, I should say rather, “keep your feet a little apart” not “keep your legs open”

    You are special. He is fortunate to be getting to spend some lovely time with Siren you, a wonderful woman who is very human and worthy of respect, acceptance, closeness and choice.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:38pm

  859. 859: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    I love Daria

    Thank you for not eating stiff that doesn’t feel all the way good

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:40pm

  860. 860: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you Daria for visualizing

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:41pm

  861. 861: DariaNo Gravatar says:

    This Dman convo threw me off today. I feel sexually needy now and a little… Sad

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:42pm

  862. 862: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    “You don’t deserve to be treated with respect”

    Is this true?

    Can you absolutely know that this is true?

    How do you feel when you think this thought, that you do not deserve to be treated with respect?

    Who would you be without this thought?

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:43pm

  863. 863: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    #859 Daria, thank you for not eating stuff that doesn’t feel all the way good

    I am putting that on my wall. That’s good for me, wow, that hits close to my core.

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 10:44pm

  864. 864: TereanaNo Gravatar says:

    Annie – it sounds like you have some big residual anger/issues about whatever topic it is you are talking about, and my post must have triggered it. You seemed to get some of what I said, but the rest seems very diverted.

    Whatever it is, I won’t get in the way of your stuff, since we are clearly talking about two different things.

    You sound very focused on the guys and them “taking responsibility,” and I was completely talking about something else.

    I hope whatever part of yourself it is that is bugging you about this becomes healed…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:06pm

  865. 865: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    I feel relaxed…I had a glass of cheap red wine..
    gosh…I wonder if the chemicals in my brain are the cause of all this….

    I feel a sense of hopelessness…
    I love my hopelessness…I love my disenchantment….I feel so modern…

    I’d rather be childlike…and naive…
    like that Fool-tarot-card….

    I wonder how do I backstep towards that…

    Wednesday, 19 December 2012 @ 11:44pm

  866. 866: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    wow I feel So goood

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:00am

  867. 867: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    I love u blog…lololol

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:05am

  868. 868: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    Winnie The Pooh may have had a Blustery Day, but in my world, this has been Triggery Day.

    (Mayan calendar? Tragedies in our nation recently? Astrology? What?)

    I was not triggered much, but found myself speaking to it in others. Weird.

    I even had triggery interactions with a longtime woman friend/associate who was a guest at our dinner tonight… she was villainizing entire groups and nationalities of people as she described her environmental activism work, and as usual ime of her, she could barely describe anything without irritable biting and insulting derogatory negative comments, name calling, sarcasm, and unflattering characterizations added in. And for what purpose? What does that gain?

    That felt so different and out of place in our group, we don’t usually have that kind of energy at our dinners.

    (Makes me think of the chapter in Byron Katie’s book, Loving What Is, about the environmental activist woman, and also one of my top favorite movies, The War, with Kevin Costner, where anger and pride and having something to prove gets way out of control. I adore that movie.)

    She was irritated with me on some seemingly conceptual grounds from the moment she walked in the door and I said hello. Not sure what I did, if anything, to upset her. Don’t care unless she speaks to it on her own (that’s not my job but hers only).

    She got triggered with me and called me “Sweetie” in an insulting tone as she “shot down” my non-confrontative innocent query in front of everyone about a technology she shared about (which I thought my question/comment was in agreement with her views etc). Lol I’ve hardly ever had someone call me sweetie or honey like that in a bad way… usually only a man, and only maybe 3 times in my life! I realized she was (as usual) firmly and strongly in her male energy (and therefor seeming strong but most likely actually off-balance). I felt incredulous and amused, leaned waaaay back with her and held my ground with almost no nervousness this time, and spoke assertively to what I saw, period. She seemed to pick up on some femme energy in me. It all eventually turned around amazingly after I made my points clearly and didn’t back off (which feels very interesting to do while leaning back at the same time, kind of like leaning back as applied to the more professional boardroom type of experience?).

    I hope she may find this femme energy she seemed to pick up on in me to help in her relationship, as her man is (predictably?) getting tired of her being in triggered male energy all of the time, needs some space/change, as she shared in our quickly engaged, between the lines and under the surface brief convo on that. I hope she gets peace, she seems to enjoy being angry and is jubilant and powerful in it, but maybe that feels bad for her and isn’t as effective as she thinks.

    I feel grateful for this blog where we can practice new skills safely, and we can say anything and hopefully not take what others say about their own feelings personally and enact any kind of conflict over them. I always quote the 4 Agreements and say “What others say about me is none of my business. It’s about them, not about me.” So I’ll add, “What others say is none of my business, esp when was about them and not about me in the first place.”

    Goodnight, Triggery Day… wonder what tomorrow will bring.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:19am

  869. 869: GingerSkyNo Gravatar says:

    (And Emerson, I feel I might have been to directive in giving you instructions on the grounding exercise tonight… I am tired, a bit drained, and just was throwing stuff out that might be helpful if you wanted it. Not meaning to be bossy or insulting or self-appointed. Just didn’t like feeling you in isolation/pain like that 😉 All the best.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:25am

  870. 870: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    Hi Tereana anger issues were triggered by Eye Roll, not you.
    And some good processing and healing tool place.

    Re responsibility and men/ women owning their own stuff re pregnancy was something different.
    Didn’t feel angry/ triggered by that.
    That but some other stuff up about manboys and grown up men for me. So TY for that. :) About men who blamed women for ‘using’ them to have a baby when they were obviously not taking responsibility for their own bodies and choosing to have unprotected sex i.e not putting a condom on it if that occurred. Nobody forces a man to have unprotected sex.
    So it felt good to be reminded that anyone who was playing that blame game was not a healthy grown up man who was taking care of himself and listen carefully to where people are at.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:36am

  871. 871: AnnieNo Gravatar says:

    I don’t want to be in a realtionship with a man boy. I want to be in a healthy loving relationship with a grown up man.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:39am

  872. 872: ruthNo Gravatar says:

    Gingersky, coffee over here is not so bad now
    we have Costa and the ev!l Starbucks
    Happy Birthday to Turq and to Starla for Sunday

    (I am getting fed up with this cold)

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 12:39am

  873. 873: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    Re eye rolling

    I started to wonder… Do I ever do it to other people. Even if its only metaphorically.

    And the answer is yes I do. Well certainly in the past I did.

    I rolled my eyes to people who I disagreed with but couldn’t express how. It was a way for me to dismiss what they were saying.

    With a couple if boyfriends I have rolled my eyes if they have liked music, films or books etc that I have “disapproved” of.

    I have rolled my eyes at my boss before when he has given me too much, or too little work to do. Or work I don’t approve of.

    I have rolled my eyes at women friends who’s opinions I have not approved of.

    I have definitely rolled my eyes at my mum… More than once…

    I realise it easy for me to remember when someone has done it to me, more than when I have done it to them.

    Hmmm, this is really interesting for me to think about.

    Does it clarify anything for me? Not really.

    Do I have a deeper understanding of myself? Not really.

    What am I gaining from this thought process? I don’t know….

    Grrrr….. I feel confused…

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:16am

  874. 874: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    PS I am really enjoying the blog at the moment…

    I really need it.

    Yay! To everyone who’s able to be honest and open and post on here. We all have so much interesting stuff to say…


    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:20am

  875. 875: HeartNo Gravatar says:

    Whats this whole eye-rolling thing about…

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:20am

  876. 876: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:


    You’ll need to go further back in the thread…

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:22am

  877. 877: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:


    You are not pathetic.

    I am in a similar situation with men..

    Please don’t feel bad.


    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:25am

  878. 878: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:


    I just got my daily Note From The Universe – and it seems to go directly “against” Rori’s teaching on giving and receiving. It seems to suggest that we should give…

    I find this interesting as this is one area of Rori’s teaching that I have a massive issue with.

    The thought that we, as women, should only “receive” seems completely wrong to me, and slightly odd and counter intuitive.

    I wonder what other sirens thoughts on this are?

    For me it makes me feel dead inside at the thought of not being able to “give”…

    “Haven’t all the years you’ve spent being Santa Claus, Rebecca, been more fun than all the years you spent waiting for Santa Claus?

    And not just for the joy you’ve helped place on your favorite faces, but for your ability to act instead of wait. Acting makes the suspense bearable. It gives you a starring role. Time passes more quickly. And best of all, it makes possible your dance with life as you network and mingle with other dancers.

    And so it is in all things, Rebecca especially those dreams that have placed their trust in you… act, don’t wait.

    Happy Hallelujah, Santa Claus!
    The Universe”

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 1:41am

  879. 879: BelleNo Gravatar says:

    My heart feels raw again.
    This morning the other woman I work with made a comment that, coupled with one from yesterday, made it clear that C has been sleeping over at her place. (Fortunately she is a very cool woman and would never be snarky about it with me and I’m sure she doesn’t feel threatened by me in the least, they were comments made in passing to other people in response to them asking why he was late for work.)
    I feel so betrayed.
    I felt so strong and in control one minute, then the next I’m in the bathroom crying. It’s like the reality of the situation it didn’t sink all the way through or something.
    My heart feels burning
    *I* made this choice
    *I* told him I didn’t want to be friends
    *I* wouldn’t take his number or give him mine while he had (has? who knows what is going on with this guy)
    This pain is far far less than if I had gotten involved with him outside of work, I knew it was trouble, I mitigated it as best I could.
    I can’t handle this and I need to stop pretending like I can.
    If I have to stay in my office during lunch and breaks then that’s what I have to do.
    I don’t want a man who keeps breaking my heart, I want a man who cherishes, appreciates, loves, respects my heart and my tenderness. I don’t want a man who exploits my naivete and trauma patterns, I want a man who loves them.

    I acknowledge the ongoing pattern of feeling betrayed in my relationships as a reflection of an inner betrayal.
    In what ways have I betrayed myself?
    Everything that brings up, I uncreate and destroy
    Right and wrong
    Good and Bad
    POD and POC
    All 9
    shorts boys and beyonds

    I don’t want to betray myself again. I choose to love, cherish and protect my heart, my soul, my emotional/mental/physical/spiritual well-being. I choose to be true to myself.

    I choose to enjoy a healthy, sacred life partnership with an adult man who wants and is able to give me what I want.

    I choose to heal the pattern of insanity and choose instead to be sane, whole, integrated.
    I choose to remember how powerful I really am.
    And so it is.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 5:33am

  880. 880: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Rebecca – I think you may be taking the receiving thing too literally. Women give in so many ways, with their feminine energy presence, with their appreciation and love, even actively, and it’s more than okay to do so as long as you don’t have an agenda running behind your giving, as long as you are not expecting something back.

    You want to be aware though of doing too much or over functioning where you would smother and/or mother. This is where problems can come in.


    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 5:36am

  881. 881: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    880: Dominique

    Thank you!

    As ever – that makes perfect sense and a lot of clarity – and reinforces what I am already (trying) to practice…

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 5:58am

  882. 882: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Rebecca – :) <3


    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:04am

  883. 883: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    I also want to add that I wouldn’t and don’t feel comfortable with a man paying for me. Maybe occasionally but not all the time.

    I would feel like a ‘kept’ woman.

    I don’t want to feel ‘paid for’. This is something I feel very strongly about – but I can see a lot of sirens on here feel very comfortable with it and I am a very interested in the dynamic/message it sends out into the world…

    It really intrigues me..

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:10am

  884. 884: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Gingersky, thank you, yes it was me and I think it was the left breast. Urgh. Was a horrible dream…I was going through all these procedures seemingly without anaesthetic…

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:22am

  885. 885: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Thank you <3
    It was only taken with the best of intentions ((gingersky))

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:40am

  886. 886: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Rebecca: I was catching up on the blog from last night and when I saw your comment 878, I had words in mind to speak to that. Then I kept reading and Dominique said exactly what I wanted to say, only much more beautifully. :-)

    As far as being comfortable with a man paying, I am very comfortable with it. I don’t feel like a ‘kept’ woman because I take care of myself in all other ways. I am very, very independent and pay all my own bills (even though I live with J and he could afford to pay for everything). I pay for all my wants and my needs. I work hard. I support myself. J pays for our dates. I don’t feel ‘kept’ at all when a man pays for my dinner and drinks or movie or whatever. I feel special. I guess the difference is, *I* don’t feel paid for. I feel good when my *meal* is paid for though. :-)

    Much Love,

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:42am

  887. 887: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    My negativity feels like an overwhelming blanket, clogging my pours and smothering my face.. Dragging at my shoulders and opening my heart to creeping suspicions..
    Suspicions from days past, not the hear and now.. I feel resentment towards my negativity. I wanna scream get with the program stop bringing me down!
    I feel cold and a deep yearning for warmth..
    I wanna be free of my suspicions and negative reactions to things he does to trigger me..

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:43am

  888. 888: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    First date Questions I can ask:
    What prompted you to contact me again? I’m just curious.
    Do you still believe in the dream? Marriage kids and happily ever after?
    Who do you live with?
    I may ask him these questions just brainstorming ….

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:49am

  889. 889: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    886- Mercedes. Took the words out of my mouth about, my man paying for me/our meals outings!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:50am

  890. 890: TamNo Gravatar says:

    So it was my birthday yesterday….and what I kind of expected did didn’t need to be just the age difference that turned me off Curly.
    Well, he had asked me out for the night ‘to meet at a bar’ but I already had plans with my gf, and said we might ‘pop by’ later…
    So we decided to make that bar our second stop as my gf was keen to meet/see him.
    As I was waiting for her to get smth out of the car, I see a couple approaching and pay no attention. Suddenly they stop and stare…so I look up and it was him with another woman (one of his ‘female friends’ and they clearly had been going there together in one car), he looked shocked to see me…she gave me an evil stare and kind of disappeared into a bar.
    I introduced him to my gf – and he was clearly so stunned that he forgot even to say ‘happy birthday’ to me. He said ‘oooh I didn’t realise you’d be here so early’ and then ‘I am just going into next door (not the place where we were heading and we were all supposed to meet) to meet NoCD’ and ‘I leave you two to have fun, might see you later’.
    EPIC FAIL. I actually turned to my gf and said ‘fail’.
    And she was like ‘oh, I thought he was going to come and talk to us?’
    Anyhow, we got a drink and fast forward 20 minutes he and NoCD turns up and he is immediately engulfed by yet another (yawn) fake plasticy barbie doll ‘female friend’, the ones he claimes to not like, haha, and chatting animatedly…he saw us but made no effort to say hello. I suspect he saw the look on my face, he might even have heard the ‘fail’ who knows.
    So then I see after a while he is standing right behind us with another guy and still no move. I was just happily chatting with my gf…we had fun. Then we just left. I did not even turn around to say anything, I just looked straight ahead and we left.
    An hour later I got a text by NoCD saying ‘oh, Curly said you were here, what happened?’ and I just replied ‘ we were, didn’t see you, moved on to go dancing’. haha.
    And we did. Moved on to another joint and danced a little, met a really nice guy who is also a fab dancer and he took my number and wants to take me for dinner.
    You lose one and you win another.
    To be honest, I feel relieved because the age difference creeped me out and now I see that maybe other things creeped me out too so that I don’t need to worry about that.
    He has not been in contact since and normally calls or texts very early.
    Good riddance.
    Next :)

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:52am

  891. 891: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Oh no, I am in moderation…and was just storytelling from last night and how Curly catapulted himself out of my CD rotation…oh well.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:54am

  892. 892: SensiouswomanNo Gravatar says:

    Awwe Rebekah,

    Your last post touched my heart… I am so sorry..and I don’t know you at all.. but it sounds to me like, and I think I am right but I could be wrong here.. but it sounds to me like your expectations are not being met by this guy.. or maybe a lot of people have let you down and not meet your needs.. both in the present and in the past.

    I only know about me.. and I have matured a lot in like the last 10 years.. but the one thing that has helped my negativity more than anything is to realize that I don’t have to live that life any more. I learned that any time you look at people to make your life more special.. happier.. etc. and you havent learned that true happiness and positivity comes from within then everyone and everything will disappoint you in your life.

    Flipping this can be difficult at first.. that is till you see the benefits.. once you get ahold of what changing your perspective..what you focus your thoughts on and how that can change your life for the better then you become motivated to change what you think on.

    The Bible says some where “as a man thinketh so is he”… I think it is in Proverbs.. and it is true… what you place your thoughts on you become. And just repeating positive affirmations I am not sure changes much… it might help.. but believing the new thoughts are the ultimate key. You might have to fake it till you make it.. but it will click..

    Today try to practice just thinking about everything in your life that is working.. everything that is beautiful.. and having an attitude of gratitude.. then accept that you are your only key to happiness. Treat yourself well.. imagine that you are a stranger and you are trying to be kind to them and help them through a rough spot.. do for yourself what you would do for others.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:55am

  893. 893: TamNo Gravatar says:

    try again without the word:
    So it was my birthday yesterday….and what I kind of expected did didn’t need to be just the age difference that turned me off Curly.
    Well, he had asked me out for the night ‘to meet at a bar’ but I already had plans with my gf, and said we might ‘pop by’ later…
    So we decided to make that bar our second stop as my gf was keen to meet/see him.
    As I was waiting for her to get smth out of the car, I see a couple approaching and pay no attention. Suddenly they stop and stare…so I look up and it was him with another woman (one of his ‘female friends’ and they clearly had been going there together in one car), he looked shocked to see me…she gave me a hard stare and kind of disappeared into a bar.
    I introduced him to my gf – and he was clearly so stunned that he forgot even to say ‘happy birthday’ to me. He said ‘oooh I didn’t realise you’d be here so early’ and then ‘I am just going into next door (not the place where we were heading and we were all supposed to meet) to meet NoCD’ and ‘I leave you two to have fun, might see you later’.
    EPIC FAIL. I actually turned to my gf and said ‘fail’.
    And she was like ‘oh, I thought he was going to come and talk to us?’
    Anyhow, we got a drink and fast forward 20 minutes he and NoCD turns up and he is immediately engulfed by yet another (yawn) fake plasticy barbie doll ‘female friend’, the ones he claimes to not like, haha, and chatting animatedly…he saw us but made no effort to say hello. I suspect he saw the look on my face, he might even have heard the ‘fail’ who knows.
    So then I see after a while he is standing right behind us with another guy and still no move. I was just happily chatting with my gf…we had fun. Then we just left. I did not even turn around to say anything, I just looked straight ahead and we left.
    An hour later I got a text by NoCD saying ‘oh, Curly said you were here, what happened?’ and I just replied ‘ we were, didn’t see you, moved on to go dancing’. haha.
    And we did. Moved on to another joint and danced a little, met a really nice guy who is also a fab dancer and he took my number and wants to take me for dinner.
    You lose one and you win another.
    To be honest, I feel relieved because the age difference creeped me out and now I see that maybe other things creeped me out too so that I don’t need to worry about that.
    He has not been in contact since and normally calls or texts very early.
    Good riddance.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:56am

  894. 894: RebeccaNo Gravatar says:

    Mercedes, Rebekah,

    Thank you both for you response.

    I just am confused about the dynamic still.

    Firstly, do you think a man should pay because he is a man, or because he earns more?

    Secondly, is there a logical reason why a man should pay? ie A man should pay because……

    Thirdly, would, in your opinion you think it wrong if I didn’t want the man to pay?

    Maybe it’s where I’m going wrong?!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:58am

  895. 895: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:

    I switched computers so my last post went under Belle…
    cleared my cache and I think it’s good now.

    After riffing about what I want and don’t want, and saw the stories I was telling myself, and noticing how I wanted to withdraw…
    I allowed myself to feel my feelings and notice my thoughts and
    What if I CAN handle this?
    I started to imagine them together and felt compersion. I really like K, and she’s not possessive or jealous, she’s straight up and someone I trust.

    So I decided to just ask. I felt pretty sure K wouldn’t mind if I asked her, and I felt like I could trust either one of them to tell me the truth. C was in so I asked him instead. I imagined myself feeling strong and good, no matter what the answer.

    “I feel scared to ask you this because I don’t know what you’ll think of me for asking. Are you sleeping with K?”

    He looked surprised – “No, no. Why do you ask?”

    I told him what I heard and in telling it realized I only heard a smidge and my mind filled in the rest.
    I had hurt my own heart. I noticed a longstanding pattern of not really hearing something, and feeling afraid to ask for clarification, and walking around feleing like everyone is in on something that I just don’t ‘get’.

    I used to act like I didn’t care, but I do.
    I used to not want people to see my weakness, that my hearing isn’t that great and I haven’t processed spoken word very efficiently in the past (I’m willing to let that change!).

    I choose to enjoy being in harmony with myself.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 6:58am

  896. 896: TamNo Gravatar says:

    It seemed like he did not know how to behave and was awkward…but the main thing is that I don’t want to date a man who is surrounded by female friends all the time, and they had been butting into our conversations previously, tried to put me down, ignore me and were just altogether totally unpleasant people to be around (talking bad about others the whole time). I don’t want to invite that into my life, really.
    I think a man’s friends are a reflection of his character, like my friends are a reflection of mine also. He is pleasant to be around but his friends do not feel pleasant, and they are not going away – but I will 😉

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:03am

  897. 897: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Ladies: I think today is officially the last day of the 30 days of meditation. I know I’m not stopping here but I wanted to say thank you to those who participated. It really felt good knowing so many of us were meditating together.

    Today was one of the best sessions I’ve ever had and I know they will only get better as I continue to practice. I don’t know what was different about this morning but it was absolutely lovely. I think maybe because I started my morning extra early. I did a short but pretty intense pilates workout and then a relaxing yoga ‘workout’ and melted from that into my meditation.

    My posture was perfect for once (sometimes I find myself fidgeting during the beginning of the meditation, trying to get it ‘right’ and trying to be comfortable). I was nice and warm too. I sometimes get cold in our Zen room (I think because it has large windows all along the one wall…it just feels cold in there) but today I used a really, really soft blanket to wrap myself in while I was sitting on my Zafu/Zabuton set (I don’t own a meditation robe and always thought they were kind of silly but now I want one really bad). My legs didn’t get uncomfortable at all for once. I didn’t yawn (as my diaphragm relaxes I sometimes yawn…this has gotten much better with practice but it still happens sometimes…today it did not). I think the pilates with a focus on my abs right before meditating helped that a lot maybe. Or the fact that I was up for so long by the time I did the meditation I wasn’t tired at all. I don’t know.

    It was so warm and peaceful and….ahhhhh….just really nice.

    This morning actually made me excited for my evening meditation too. And to get up extra early tomorrow for another one. I felt something ‘shift’ this morning and I want that again. I feel like I could have mediated for another hour today (I’m sure I couldn’t have *actually* made it that long – 30 minutes is my longest – but I feel like I could have).

    Anyway…I hope you are all having beautiful experiences with your own meditations/visualizations and I hope that you will continue the practice even though 30 days is officially up.

    And again…thank you for joining me. As I said, it felt really good knowing others were meditating with me.

    Much Love,

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:04am

  898. 898: GoodheartNo Gravatar says:

    HAPPY BIRTHDAY Turquoise, Tam & Starla :-)

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:04am

  899. 899: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    891- Sensiouswoman.

    Thank you for your kind words!

    I am not sure 100% that this all stems from my man, I know I hold residual feelings about this from my childhood. I have been let down a lot emotionally through out the years.

    I am actively practicing things that fill me up and make me feel happiness, but it is a work in progress. One day, one thing at a time. I feel I lack a purpose and maybe I hold resentment towards my man for having one. I can’t honestly say.

    As to the positive thinking changing my out look on the world, yes I totally agree. I have also been practicing this, not as much as I could be.. I know I tend to get stuck on the unpleasant things more then not..

    I desire to be kinder to myself and to be my source of happiness. It’s hard to break old habits….

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:09am

  900. 900: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I forgive myself for not feeling I do enough, I have done more today then yesterday and will do more tomorrow then today.. Every set brings me closer to me.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:11am

  901. 901: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Rebecca: I don’t think it’s wrong at all if you want to pay. I also don’t think there’s a logical reason why a man should pay. I think it’s traditional and I love tradition. I think it’s romantic and I love romance. But most of all, it feels really, really good to me. I don’t think anyone should do anything that doesn’t feel good to them. If you feel better paying, then you should.

    One thing I would caution though is that a lot of men feel more like a man…like a protector…like he’s taking care of us…etc when he treats a woman on a date. I would consider being in tune with what he wants on this one so as not to emasculate him unintentionally.

    Much Love,

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:14am

  902. 902: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    And I’ll also add that a man who feels more like a man when he pays on a date is the kind of man I am attracted to. I’m attracted to that kind of man in lots of ways. In my experience, they also tend to be take charge kind of guys. They know what they want and they go for it. They usually have a plan for what to do and rarely need us to suggest places, etc (I think it’s because they know it’s their money we’re spending and they know where they want to spend it). Just in my experience, these types of men are attractive to me. I don’t know. It just *feels* so good when he treats.

    I should also add that I like to surprise J once in a while and pick up the tab. He does seem to like that on occasion. He smiles and thanks me and kisses me and usually says something like “I’m a lucky man” to the waiter. But…those occasions are rare and he’s never once indicated he wants me to pay. He just seems pleasantly surprised when I do it. I’m not sure how he would feel if I tried to do it all the time or even most of the time. I don’t intend to find out. It would ruin it when I do surprise him. :-)

    Much Love,

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:32am

  903. 903: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Wow tam that is interesting about curly!! Good for you !!!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:39am

  904. 904: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson…thanks :)
    I don’t think he is a bad guy at all, but makes no difference. I haven’t done all this work on myself and my self esteem to put up with anything that doesn’t feel good.
    I’d rather be by myself than buy into any kind of drama and people who are not on my wavelength.
    Life is choice…I choose happy when I can and sad when I can’t avoid it…not the other way around!!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:42am

  905. 905: BeLovedNo Gravatar says:


    Yes it has felt like two completely different people inside as well :)
    Textbook borderline personality disorder.
    At least now I can see from multiple perspectives.
    When it was at it’s worst, in the midst of the barrage of psychedelics with T, I was totally polarized. Idealize/Devalue
    and when I was adoring, I could never remember that I had ever loathed, when when I was loathing, I could never remember I had ever loved.
    It was hell.

    I always feel so surprised and grateful when you respond to me with compassion and kindness.
    I so often feel so triggered by what I imagine you are doing that I feel like I am literally out for blood.
    I pondered on that last night, on your screen name “Feminine Woman”, and wondered about how I’m treating my softer self on the inside.

    I want to offer virtual hugs and for some reason I feel like I can’t
    like I might break you if I hugged you too tight
    even virtually

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:48am

  906. 906: DominiqueNo Gravatar says:

    Rebecca – 893 – The male/female dynamic is basically man does and woman is (receives). Imagine sex, man is “out there”‘, woman is in there. Man gives, ejaculation; woman receives.

    If he asks you out, allow him to pay. If he’s strapped for money due to whatever reason, tell him you enjoy his company and that you don’t have to do anything which costs money. Gingersky talked at length about this yesterday.

    If he hand you your half of the bill, I would suggest being wary for signs of future stinginess which isn’t just about money.

    Most of the time let him take care of the bill. If you make enough money to treat once in awhile, and it’s a pure gesture, not one out of feeling obligated, then go ahead.

    In my relationship, K has ALWAYS paid, likes to wants to, wouldn’t have it any other way. On our first date,I asked if I could help (it was a spendy place), and he looked at me like I had three heads. Knowing him he probably said something like, don’t be silly.

    He’s makes a nicde income but is not wealthy by any means. he is a gentleman though.

    So this is food for thought for you here.


    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:55am

  907. 907: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Tam that is good advice. I agree 100%.

    I feel under pressure that I’m not good enough sometimes. But I know that’s a lie. I am good enough.

    I refuse to be scared of what I want for my future. So what if I end up buying a house and living in it alone! Wow that feels exciting actually. It could change too. I could have someone there with me if i want.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 7:58am

  908. 908: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Dominique and sirens what are your comments about my post 888….

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:00am

  909. 909: TamNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson, yay to you!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:05am

  910. 910: MercedesNo Gravatar says:

    Emerson: I personally like it. I think we should ask anything we want to know very early on. I also see FW’s point to me yesterday when she said it feels like an interview and agenda. It sort of does, but I think I’m of the mindset that I’d rather get that part out of the way early so I can decide if I want to continue dating the man.

    I think each of us will be very different with what feels good on a first/second date.

    Much Love,

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:09am

  911. 911: FemininewomanNo Gravatar says:

    Belle I have to admit that more than once I have felt scared of your words on the screen, imagining possilbe outbursts. I am strong, I can take hugs.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:13am

  912. 912: EmersonNo Gravatar says:

    Thanks Mercedes !
    I agree it feels interviewey… But how else will we know ?
    I’m trying to look at it as practice!!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:17am

  913. 913: k2012No Gravatar says:

    Excellent advice Dominique. I like your analogy about the male/female dynamic. I guess u can also look at the Bible in which God made man as the provider and the fact that he (man) should take the lead. Your partner seem to be a perfect gentleman. Men pay and women treat once in a while. True. Mark u now (a term my dad likes to use) we women don’t want to be gold diggers now and eat out the man. I know some women might tend to want to do that but that’s another story. Men pick up on that sort of thing quickly anyway.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:19am

  914. 914: RebekahNo Gravatar says:

    I have felt showered with things I had long been craving. Little things and big things.. I feel appreciative of this, letting my heart receive them after so long has been a challenge, I accept this challenge.
    We are learning, he and I.. I understand this process we are going through.
    I forgive myself for feeling needy and greedy, it is not wrong to want more. My feelings service me, they lift me up and fill me up. I can accept these feelings and love them.

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:22am

  915. 915: RadloveNo Gravatar says:

    Ha! Relationship advice to me from my ex, K:

    “I’ve watched you continually have men try to get with you by the dozens and that’s not the problem. I just wish you’d re-think a few things and stop filling your head with all this relationship advice.

    “Relax and be simply you, period. There are no rules. Why? Because each man and woman is different, so it’s impossible to apply a set of rules, ideas, or concepts to all of them and it doesn’t ever work out when one does.

    “You are a beautiful butterfly and all you got to do is spread your wings, that simple.”

    What he said was sweet, but I highly value Rori and all of you, and I feel really good about all I’ve learned and continue to learn!

    Thursday, 20 December 2012 @ 8:27am

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