Baby Steps Away From Being “Hung Up” On Him

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Here’s a letter from Marie, who’s in graduate school – what we’re working on is her self-esteem and her hung-up-ness on Bill – who’s “difficult” and confusing….see if you identify with these ups and downs:

“Dear Rori,

Well, a lot of things to tell you!  Last night, I participated in a Shakespeare reading of “As You Like It”!  I read a few parts and it was fun!  I mean, it was through the English Department and the women were stand-offish and the men were weird (I’m starting to notice how people act and not just internalize it like – Oh, something’s weird with me–I feel like I understand it more now–not that I can assume anything, or that it’s the same thing every time I sense this, but I felt proud of myself for noticing it).

Also, Bill called me and asked if I wanted to come over and hang out at the laundromat with him because he was so busy.  Um, no thanks.  I said no I didn’t want to do that and he said Okay, can I stop by and see you for a bit?

And I said sure, that’s fine.

AND I stopped him at a certain point when we were kissing because I didn’t want to get carried away.  Never done that before!  It felt so much more balanced.  I felt stronger and yet also vulnerable and he was tender and sweet to me.

He said I was beautiful and that he likes being with me, and I said I like being with you too.

I know that you’re right about all the men out there in the “big pond,” but it’s okay to still have feelings for this boy, right?  I know he’s clueless but I feel like I’m aware of that and can put my foot down where I need to–especially if I don’t get drunk, I can make better decisions for myself.

Also, forgot to tell you that last Friday I had a meeting with a career counselor who’s going to look at my resume and help me with prospecting letters–a sweet OLDER MAN named Clarence!  I’m going to go to a Business School lecture tomorrow afternoon as well.

I feel all giddy with fluttery feelings, I don’t know–scary transition feelings, maybe?  Yes, I think that’s what they are.  I feel scared of the unknown.  But I want to feel excited about the unknown because what if it’s good?  What if I believed that the universe wants to give me good things?  Everything I truly want?

That feels scary, like turning myself inside out and wearing all my soft, quivery parts on the outside.  But I love that about me because it’s okay to feel exposed.  That feels like my heart aching, just a tiny piece of it in the top left corner.  But I love that little aching part because it’s trying to push through my ribs and get my attention.

It feels scared and I love it for feeling scared because even though I’m getting stronger I can still be sensitive and feel.  Now its not aching so much, just twinging a little.  I am still working on the obsessing stuff, but I have my channeling list!  Reformatting, reformatting, reformatting, just like you said. Marie”

My Answer:

Marie – you are totally amazing!!! LOOK at your letter – you’re smack in a transition, breakthrough after breakthrough – you are in a completely different and new place now – and all because you are so fantastically DOING the work. You’re doing the Tools, doing what we talk about – and it’s ALL WORKING!!!

Fear is good! It means you’re stepping into the unknown and beginning to expand. And see – he came to you!!!

And yes to everything you say – I loved the part of getting that it’s about all those other people reacting to you – it’s not about YOU. You’re a total inspiration.

Don’t worry about the ups and downs, that’s what happens – rollercoaster. But you’re now on the RIDE!!! Your’e LIVING!!!

Posted in


  1.  #1Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 7:25 am

    Lovely and I can resonate with Marie. It is scary, to make a change to who you are, to reformat; yet it feels exhilirating.

    Thank you.

  2.  #2DE on May 7, 2011 at 10:28 am

    Great post Rori…I feel smiley because after reading the ebook and viewing Modern Siren program my awareness in my surroundings began just as it did for Mary…

    It seems to me there are Tiers in awareness…Mary’s observation of people”…the women were stand-offish and the men were weird” seems like a 1st Tier…

    My next tier would be “how was my vibe coming into the class?” “Oh, I felt kinda of scared and intimidated to be in this class”…or “I felt excited to be in the class…excited to experience and feel surprised…”

    Next tier “Wow…is it possible I might be projecting my own negative voices on them…and therefore, they seem “stand-offish and weird?” “Am i fearing to be thought of as weird by them?”….

    Next tier “Okay, I love my fear…thank u for raising my awareness and protecting me…Thank you NVs…etc ”

    Next tier: How can I shift this? Okay…My thoughts create my reality…Hmm…the women seem stand-offish and men are weird…that means…I am stand-offish and I am weird…how can I shift this? I feel open ….unzip my heart…I smile, make eye contact…take a deep breath…What do I see know??? Hmm…she seems poised…i like that…the other one she seems stylish…i like her style…he seems goofy…i feel smiley looking at him…i feel relaxed…and so on…”

    LOL…Okay, this was a great exercise for me Rori…thank you 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  3.  #3Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:33 am

    HA! HA!

    I got in early on this one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



  4.  #4Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:49 am

    jacquekune & Rosa,

    I will respond to your 269, 272 & 273 comments later- now I have to get ready for golf with N(ow), as Brenda so creatively put it.

    Life is beautiful ladies, I have a comment for all of you….


    lol, and I probably will love all of you anyway. Not to worry- the simplest of responses will be good enough for my love!!


  5.  #5Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:52 am

    All I can say, is he better kiss her soon or she just might implode.

    And that would just be down right messy!!


  6.  #6Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Since I have the floor, may as well take advantage of it!

    To 5: Jim,
    Implode from the vacuum she is feeling inside?

  7.  #7Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:55 am

    6: jIm


  8.  #8Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 11:00 am



    I am beautiful, sensitive, and intelligent!

    Love, Brenda

  9.  #9Jim on May 7, 2011 at 11:01 am

    I kind of like commenting on my own comments, this is fun!!

    I better go before N(ow) becomes N(ever)!!!!

    I am so lol!!!!

    I’ve learned to amuse myself, all 4’8″ of me, ask Brenda, “I’m a tall 4’8”

    Brenda, lots of love & thanks!!!!!!!! Your the best!

  10.  #10Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 11:01 am


    You’re funny! I want you to kiss me, too! Or I’ll implode from the vacuum I feel inside, too!

  11.  #11Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 11:02 am

    Jimmy is not 4’8″. He’s just being annoying! LOL!

    He’s really 5’11” and drop dead gorgeous at age 53 with a full head of hair, blue eyes, and not a single wrinkle!

  12.  #12Jim on May 7, 2011 at 11:03 am

    8: Brenda,

    Ut oh, I didn’t know you were watching me amuse myself.

    I’m glad to see you, sent you a return email and I really do have to go now.

    Bye for now!!

  13.  #13Jim on May 7, 2011 at 11:05 am

    11: Brenda,

    Now that’s a lie, I’m balding, average looking, 52 and have a few wrinkles-

    Go away Jim, she’s keeping you here.


  14.  #14SummerBaby on May 7, 2011 at 11:07 am


    Have fun golfing with N(ow). Remember to be present. Lol


  15.  #15Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 11:13 am


    Thanks for making me smile! Have fun with N(ow)! I already responded to your email, even before I came on here to bug you!

  16.  #16janjune on May 7, 2011 at 11:47 am

    who, in your personal opinion, would you guys say is the best isp in terms of price and service?

    i’m with now has triple billed me three times during the course of my contract and i’ve had two bad data cards (don’t know if that’s the name of the device,…s the litte “thingy” that connects you)…

    i’d like the very lowest price possible for the fastest speed
    and the best service 🙂

    i’ll check back later.
    thanks in advance.

  17.  #17The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    #16 Janjune, sitting here in Europe I can’t really tell you. But from the experience of a friend, who is in a rural area in the US and doesn’t have any other choice than Verizon, I know that the problem often isn’t that complicated. For folks outside of the big cities, there’s often only two or three alternatives, if at all. And it isn’t about finding the fastest connection with the best service, it’s only about chosing the least of all evils…

    With google, I found this site which may help you to find out which options you have:

  18.  #18kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    I feel annoyed. A guy asked for my number the other day. He seemed smart and decent enough, so I figured whatever, I’ll be open and hey whatever. But he keeps texting me no matter how much I use ‘It’d feel better to hear your voice, call me’ or variations of ‘I feel better getting to know someone in person. Text volleys feel draining to me.’

    His response today: ‘I’d like to get to know you better this way first to see if I wanna take you out.’

    My response: ‘Would you like to check my hooves and teeth first as well? F*ck off and die.’

    I’m done. I have no patience for this shite.

  19.  #19SummerBaby on May 7, 2011 at 1:06 pm

    OMG Kaitlyn, you are my idol! I know this is not exactly a feeling message, but what a howl. I love this!

    Maybe it just feels so delightful and fun to me because I’m still busy soaking in mine (see end of last thread).

    I hope I’m not making light of your experience. I don’t mean to. I’m just in awe of all that raw anger.


  20.  #20Scarlet on May 7, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    Hahaha Kaitlyn you’ve got some balls to say that to him. My problem is that I worry too much about being nice so I haven’t been able to stop certain guys from texting who’ve been doing so for months without putting any real effort to met me in person. Recently I’ve been learning to just ignore their texts completely and not respond if I’m no longer interested.

  21.  #21Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    Hehe, I am mildly triggered by the descriptions of English dept people. I find them – men and women – to be warm, welcoming, connecting, inspiring. I would have preferred reading FM’s in this regard. No biggie, just noticing. 🙂 (plus my daughter is graduating from that dept next week!)

  22.  #22Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    2 DE. I like that! I feel better after reading it. 🙂

  23.  #23The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    #21 Have you read DE’s #2 comment, Lucy? Imho she nicely shows how the impression changes once you use the proper tools to correct the subjective pov! It’s all in the eye (and the mind) of the beholder.
    Well done, DE!

  24.  #24kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    Thanx, Scarlet and Summerbaby. Anger comes natural to me. I guess I’m here for the opposite. To learn how to be nicer.

  25.  #25The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    #22 Oops I see you already found that comment, Lucy!

  26.  #26Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    Kaitlyn – “to see if I wanna take you out.” Ugh. Major turn-off. <3

  27.  #27kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    Lucy, totally.

  28.  #28Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    Lurker – Thanks for looking out for me. 🙂 <3

  29.  #29Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    Am riding with my ex and my son right now to go to daughter’s play. I feel kinda bad that my ex didn’t tell me I look nice.

  30.  #30The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    #24 Especially nicer to yourself, Kaitlyn! I have to say, it actually feels good to see your energy directed at a jerk who deserves a kick in the a**, for a change.
    I understand that the toughness you needed in the past nowadays often stands in the way when you try to connect with people. However, we folks here know that you’re different inside, and we already see you as a nice person. So, what’s missing are just some more baby steps now.

  31.  #31SummerBaby on May 7, 2011 at 1:39 pm


    It seems to me that you are more in touch with your anger than I am. Which if I could get there, I could more easily feel it and move through to better (Kinder gentler?) emotions.

    I am a long term stuffer. Learning as are we all.

    P.S. off to work and tomorrow off to see mom, so I won’t be able to catch up for a while… be well everyone.

  32.  #32The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    #26 “Major turn-off.”
    Glad you say that, Lucy. Indeed, the arrogance, it burns! Sounds like Charlie Sheen.

  33.  #33kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    I feel impervious to verbal abuse. I spent so long in strip clubs where it’s common to at least experience a few times a night, some guy who’s mission in there is to hurt a girl’s feelings. And they don’t even buy dances. It’d be one thing if they did. Tell me whatever, dude, just give me your money.

  34.  #34The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    #33 Be well, Summer! C u, Baby.

  35.  #35Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:49 pm

    Kait, how about using the next incident like that as practice: “I feel hella pissed and f*cking turned-off hearing that remark. Bye.” No need to be “nice,” just authentic and non-attacking. <3

  36.  #36kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 1:52 pm


    I like that, but I’ll reserve that for someone I care about. Some ppl deserve attacks because I get off on out-witting them and I don’t plan on talking to them again anyway.

  37.  #37Lucy on May 7, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    I hear you. My thinking was that it might be helpful to practice with the ones you’re not invested in so that when you Are invested it will be second-nature.

  38.  #38The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    #35 At Twitter, I follow a club dancer who’s sometimes telling stories about how she’s reacting on the customers with sharp tongued irony. Not really helpful for the income, of course, but she simply can’t keep the lid on it anymore when her tolerance for BS reaches its limit…

  39.  #39kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    Lucy, true dat.

  40.  #40kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    Lurker, heh I follow her as well. Forgot her name, but she’s kinda a known twitteratti.

  41.  #41The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 2:17 pm

    #40 @Mikathestrippper?
    She’s a nice girl, but the job toughened her, too. Probably inevitable when you have to deal with so many jerks…

  42.  #42kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    It feels like after screwing things up with Adam, I’m never going to meet anyone good unless i work on myself and by that time what if it will be years? Then my choices will be more limited because my looks will have faded.

  43.  #43kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    41 that’s her. it’s not so much that the job toughens you, but it’s that it’s a job where you deal with the general public. if you’re already smart, dealing with the idiots that are the general public, will make you feel angry.

  44.  #44The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    #42 Kaitlyn, if you look for 20 year olds, that may be the case (even though so many of them are looking for a cougar :D). But if you look for guys your age, not so much. I’m close to 50 and I can say my preferences have changed over the years. So, it’s all relative. There will be more than enough guys asking you for a date. The problem prolly will be to pick the right ones out of the crowd. Remember how Boomer had 12 CDs at a time? That may be more stress than fun!

  45.  #45kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    44, I’m 39 and only like men my age. I’ve always only liked men my age even when I was younger.

  46.  #46The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    #45 Damn! Hey, we older guys can be hot, too!
    (yeah, I know, that’s prolly not what you meant. I’m only joking)

  47.  #47Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 2:40 pm


    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! OMG!!! I love this..

    OMG! I had to stop reading to write this so now I have to go find out if he said anything to that..

    *snort* lol!!

    I love your openess to going with what floats ya.

  48.  #48kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    Lilybelle, nah, i hung up and he never called back.

  49.  #49Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    42: kaitlyn says:

    It feels like after screwing things up with Adam, I’m never going to meet anyone good unless i work on myself and by that time what if it will be years? Then my choices will be more limited because my looks will have faded.

    What are you telling yourself here?

    Here, i’ll share what my daughter told me
    as she looked into my eyes, the other night….
    imagine it’s being said to you, too

    mama, you are ageless and timeless
    and any one is very lucky indeed
    to spend time with you


  50.  #50kaitlyn on May 7, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    Elizabeth, well thats sweet but I know how reality works.

  51.  #51Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    Damn, Kaitlyn…that made me almost spew my drink out my nose and made my son think I was finally falling out of sanity.

    Not laughing at the situation, of course, but the response to someone who doesn’t deserve any of your precious time or energy. of the blog award.

  52.  #52Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 2:57 pm

    eh, kaitlyn…..what can i say about reality….I’m so effin’ glad to know of the reality where I don’t feel pressured to go under the knife to get rid of any hard-won beautiful wrinkles, or starve myself to get rid of a few extra pounds of flesh in order to look and feel OK about myself or attract a good looking, exciting man. It’s called, con- fi- dance, baby 🙂


  53.  #53Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    His response today: ‘I’d like to get to know you better this way first to see if I wanna take you out.’

    My response: ‘Would you like to check my hooves and teeth first as well? F*ck off and die.’



  54.  #54The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 3:02 pm

    #52 “It’s called, con- fi- dance, baby”
    Sounds good, Liz! Wanna dance?

    Damn, too sad that all you girls are too far away! I’m gonna check out the nightlife here instead. C u, Sirens!

  55.  #55Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 3:04 pm


    How about a torrid tango ? Can you handle it? 😉


  56.  #56The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    #55 I know where to put my feet, and I would put up my most torrid look, but I would need some training for the propper posture. And only standard Tango, not the Argentinian original. But funny that you mentioned that, just some days ago I thought about joining a training course, after watching a TV report about Milonga. So hot, wow…

    Ok, I’m gone now. C u!

  57.  #57Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 3:15 pm

    44. Lurker

    “(even though so many of them are looking for a cougar 😀 ).”

    even though so many of them are looking for anything that wears a skirt….just as true

    (hey, don’t look at me, I had a CD tell me that last night about so many guys out there. He also said he has had many women tell him that they can’t get a date, and no body wants them, and when he says, I’ll go out with you, they say, no thanks. He says they are too picky. He didn’t tell me that I’m pretty, so I’m done with him 😉


  58.  #58Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    56. Lurks

    Taking tango lessons is on my bucket list, for sure 🙂


  59.  #59The Lurker on May 7, 2011 at 3:21 pm

    #57 “even though so many of them are looking for anything that wears a skirt….just as true”
    It’s even worse, they would settle for a woman in a tight jeans, too!
    Oh, btw, I always love to virtually see your pretty face here!
    But now i really have to go, or else the night is over. Bye!

  60.  #60Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 3:23 pm

  61.  #61Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 3:27 pm

    I can’t forget the classic line from Lily T a few weeks back…..
    kind of think it got overlooked

    “maybe you’re grieving the relationship you wish you had with Adam”…….

    could apply to any of us i’m sure

    wise words


  62.  #62Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 3:33 pm


    I know you are gone now…working and all..I’m thinking of you and hoping you are feeling better.



  63.  #63Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    I wonder if they say no thank you to him because they feel as if he feels he is doing them a favor?

    Just my first reaction.

    And besides, he didn’t tell you that you were pretty. Shame on him! Next. 😉


  64.  #64Daria on May 7, 2011 at 3:38 pm

    I feel unworthy and small and afraid to share how I feel

    I feel sad reading about men being attacked.


    Mm feels sad like disconnect fear

    Rori posted to lonepl how attacks feel bad after the initial revenge rush.

    I notice myself shut down and with defenses up after I attack.

    I used to be too numb to notice…

    Rori says we gotta keep heart open 100% of the time to have it open sometimes.. It doesn’t work to shut down sometimes and open up other times

    I intend to heal this within me so my boundaries come across without attack and I rewire my reality to peace

  65.  #65Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    One of the local radio stations has this fabulous morning show, often full of bullshit but fun nonetheless.

    They had a segment this week about “The problem with men.” I was amazed at how many women didn’t have a clue about what men are about or what they want. It was a total man bashing session..and I thought to myself…Ahhh, good for ME.. I LOVE men and I KNOW what they really want…deep down inside. I think I’ll keep this to myself. 😉

    Of course, the next day? The problem with women:

    Hold Grudges
    Hypocritical (Do as I say not as I do)

    The #1 compaint men have about women??

    Drama, Drama, Drama…

    I found it interesting that this is how women are generalized.

  66.  #66Daria on May 7, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    Being hard on myself about:

    Getting in other people’s business

    Bringing the mood down

    ‘always have something negative to say’

    ‘no compassion for where someone’s at’

    I’d like to heal this. Thank you.

  67.  #67Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 4:10 pm


    Personally, I really like how you offer me new ways to look at things. Your thoughts and perspective are always valued by me. Hugs.


  68.  #68Daria on May 7, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    Thanks lilybelle.

    I also think about myself that I try to force people to live by the rules. While also that I’m a rebel.

    I think these ate all beliefs I adopted when I was young and I’m babystepping to changing this.

    I love me!

    Thank you Daria for using Rosas stop sign tool and restoring my energy.

    Thank you for noticing my feelings.

    Thank you for practicing tools and continually dropping blame.

  69.  #69Alicia on May 7, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    Good response! I’m glad fear of the unknows is good. Sometime I feel “fear scary” and then there is “fear unknown” wobbly and moving forward. I always think life is somehow reflecting back to what in internal..

    Ya know my counselor was like.. Whoa you are pissed and making some big moves. (Emotionally with boundries) And the funny thing is at the end of the months I moving to a beautiful new home. I found it, picked it, I can afford it. And it my choice not, a transition due to my having to keep my head above water and survive. I nice solid choice and my pick. It feels like a new me and a for real new big chapter starting going right along with the new emotional me too.

    Yippy skippy.. ( That only took a year) haha

  70.  #70Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    I gotta move by June 1st, and I feel overwhelmed by life. Just too much to keep up with, both financially and timewise. I just get overwhelmed and then I do something fun. But blocking problems out doesn’t make them go away.

  71.  #71Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    Eating cookies doesn’t make problems go away, either.

  72.  #72janjune on May 7, 2011 at 4:51 pm

    @ jacqueline,
    just posted this on the previous post but wanted to post it here too to make sure you got it

    @ jacqueline

    was digging around outside in the peonies and it just pulled together for me that what i had done last winter was go into “personal attack mode” on you, rather than just stating my case when something you were doing bothered me. (…that was when i left the blog for a few months.)

    i felt awful surrounding that, i care about you alot and feel your friendliness and warmth toward me and always have, so it didn’t feel good at all to act that way toward you. but i was so upset by it (“it” being the Trigger)… i see that it wasn’t you at all, i’d like you to know i see that very clearly now.
    even though i can tell by your comments to me that you’re not holding a grudge, i wanted to tell you face-to-face, *virtual-style*, that i am sorry for doing that.
    i appreciate your heart staying open to me until i got it figured out.
    back later tonight… if i get packed


    Saturday, 7 May 2011 @ 4:45pm

  73.  #73janjune on May 7, 2011 at 4:55 pm

    hugs brenda… feeling overwhelmed with the urgency of so many important things to do and with immovable deadlines for them all is an energy-zapper for me as well…

    saying a prayer for you…

  74.  #74Brenda on May 7, 2011 at 4:59 pm





  75.  #75Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 5:07 pm

    Do you have any advice on how to get a guy to stop seeing you as his little sister and start looking at you in a romantic type way?

  76.  #76RiverGirl on May 7, 2011 at 5:16 pm

    Elizabeth, have you tried turning up the volume on the flirting? Smiling while holding eye contact for longer than you usually would with him. Try to stay in your feminine energy more and not get drawn into analytical logical discussions quite as much.

    That is some of what I am trying to do with TM (texting man) except I can’t get to see him face to face to get the eye contact happening via text message!! No wonder I feel stuck. lol

  77.  #77Jacqueline on May 7, 2011 at 5:20 pm

    Wow! so many vacationeers….whooo hoo…

    Janjune I knew you got upset and I didn’t really understand it, ..and I knew always that you had a lovely manner and a good heart.

    So I just felt bad that I had upset you and let it go. Then, I was so happy to see you back.

    And your honesty is just so admirable and clear. I love it – and I’m glad you’re back and I appreciate you saying this, it feels like a good kind of closure that we so rarely get. I hope you have the best time ever!!! on your trip.

    (And peonies – wow – I love peonies maybe best of all flowers. Way to hot for them here. I’ll be sending happy thoughts to you and your flowers for your fabulous adventure and return )


  78.  #78Jacqueline on May 7, 2011 at 5:25 pm

    Rivergirl – I love the photo, don’t know if I’ve told you…it just so matches your vibe, which is very cool!

    Have a great Sat. nite sirenesses….sireni….darling sirens!

  79.  #79Lilybelle on May 7, 2011 at 5:26 pm


    Hang in there Brenda…a little bit at a time. It will seem like you are packing and sorting forever and living in disarray for the entire month but at least it isn’t so overwhelming.

    I am already starting for my move July 1. I have a huge pile of donation clothes on the floor in my bedroom right now and I still have one dresser to go through.


  80.  #80Femininewoman on May 7, 2011 at 5:40 pm

    RE 75 Have you tried lowering your voice so he can lean forward to listen?

    Have you tried a light touch on the forearm when speaking?

    Have you tried using emotional words like “baby” tell me more?

    Or I want my spirit to connect with your spirit?

  81.  #81RiverGirl on May 7, 2011 at 6:09 pm

    Wow! Thank you Jacqueline. I love that photo too. I sometimes feel like such a clumsy clutz with my interactions with men I am interested in. The calmness and serenity and grace of the girl in the photo struck a chord with me. She is like my inner siren and I am trying to find the courage and tools to reveal her more often. I don’t know exactly why, but her protective big sister thinks she will get hurt and trys to shield her from the arrows of admiring men. It feels encouraging to hear that some of that vibe is beginning to show to others so thanks J for letting me know as I hadn’t realised.

  82.  #82RiverGirl on May 7, 2011 at 6:11 pm

    Oops, tries not trys…this is not a rugby match!

  83.  #83Daria on May 7, 2011 at 6:25 pm

    Feeling good… Dipped in salty mono lake and got fresh Yosemite water 🙂

  84.  #84Elizabeth on May 7, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    # 75…… is from a different Elizabeth, not the one who has been posting (me) Perhaps we could differentiate ourselves somehow…..

    Hi Elizabeth the Second!! 🙂


  85.  #85DE on May 7, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    Lucy and Lurker, thank u 🙂 It feels good to hear that 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  86.  #86medicalgirl on May 7, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    Hi: I have to ask someone’s advice. I was receiving texts from a man I didn’t know so I politely texted him back and told him I think he has the wrong number. Apparently that was the wrong thing to do. Now he texts me all the time and asks if I want to go out for drinks and tells me “Come pick me up.” I feel like changing my number. He texted again last night at about 12:30 am after I was already in bed. (by the way, from now on, I’m leaving my phone in another room) but again I texted him back and told him to find someone else to bother as I’m not interested. So I took my phone and put it in another room. This morning I had 9 texts from him and it’s really starting to p*&% me off. I realise my mistake in texting him in the first place NOW, but I thought I was just being kind in case he really did have the wrong number. What do I do????

  87.  #87Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 7:25 pm

    i walked away again from stuff with my guy that felt bad. i am baffled and i want so badly to just shake him and say KNOCK IT OFF, YOU ARE REALLY HURTING US HERE. i did try that proverbially.

    so i went and took care of myself, instead of sitting on the phone crying and sobbing for him to here. i cried as hard as i needed to while i was in the shower, and then i went for a walk, telepathically conversed with the grass and the trees, ate some diner food and read my favorite magazine, and then got my nails done.

    i actually prayed for him and us today. i prayed for healing for me. i prayed that he will come around with this. i prayed for health and happiness. i put on the bracelet he gave me and washed my love all over myself and it, hoping that the vibes of love and health will gently steer him and us back into the right direction.

    i will keep praying. i will keep sending my love and good vibes. i am giving it up to god, so to speak

    for the record, when i say pray, i mean send out my intentions and really mean for it to come true. i’m not a religious girl.

  88.  #88medicalgirl on May 7, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    Dorothea, you may not be a “religious” girl, but you’re as close to pure as anyone I have heard from in a long time. I believe that’s all any of us do when we wish good things on people and “pray”. My husband left me 11 years ago after he had an affair with another woman and my world crumbled. It took me about a year and a half and I seriously got on my knees and prayed for him and his new relationship. I wished him well and sent up a prayer that everything would go well for him with his new lady. I cried and cried and cried and released it all. You know what? They are still together to this day and I am so happy for him. We don’t talk, but my 3 children have lots to do with him and we have never bad-mouthed each other and I wish him every happiness. You sound like the kind of wonderful person that is doing the same thing. You are letting it go. I loved the fact that you put on the bracelet and washed yourself in its love! Good for you!! I know you are hurting, but the release you must feel must be amazing. Great and amazing things will come to you. You are well on your way to being healed! I am impressed by your strength in this time of hurting, but you are on exactly the right path!!! Take care!

  89.  #89Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    ohhh medicalgirl, thank you so much. i feel elated reading your words to me.

    as for that dude texting you, i would tell him to “f*ck off before I complain to the phone company”

  90.  #90Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 7:51 pm

    ohhh medicalgirl, thank you so much. i feel elated reading your words to me.

    as for that dude texting you, i would tell him to “f*ck off before I complain to the phone company”

  91.  #91medicalgirl on May 7, 2011 at 7:55 pm

    Dorothea…lol….thanks, actually I think I will. I was trying to be “lady-like” but that’s not working. My “prayers” are with you and I am so proud of you for being so open about what’s going on with you. Keep it up! I am here to support you anytime! I’m so glad you shared and so grateful to meet people like you who are honest, open and courageous!

  92.  #92Rosa on May 7, 2011 at 8:00 pm

    Dorothea @443 last blog .

    Situation , guy has dated me 2 or 3 or 4 times, dinner, concert etc EXPENSIVE. We park outside restaurant (my purse is full of coins already 🙂 ) . I say ” here I have too many coins in my purse , lets use those” (for the meter.) Or in the parking station by the pay machine I have some money ready and say “let me contribute a little after such a great dinner, thank you so Much”.

    Or else for a dinner i cook , ” I have so much enjoyed our dinners out ,do you like home cooking? I would love to cook you something fresh from the fish markets “(after 5 or 6 dates maybe).

    Or after a few expensive dates we are getting take away food I might say, “this one must be my turn!”
    I make jokes about spotting a cheaper option .

    Basically if he asks me out , he pays most of it .
    Although recently dinner and movies , we started with movie and i said ” it feels like my turn , you can get dinner” . His response was I’ll get the candy and drinks. . Great!

  93.  #93Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 8:07 pm

    thank you, rosa! i definitely am going to experiment with letting this part of me into dating.

  94.  #94Jim on May 7, 2011 at 9:00 pm

    273 Rosa,

    Last thread. Do you have the number? I will go back and see it, if not I’ll try to go find it.

    269: Jacqueline,
    I suppose once people think it’s “over,” then it is. Notice how people are willing to talk the talk… “I would give my life for this or that cause…” Do you ever hear people say, “I’m going to live for this or that!” “Truly Live!”

    I read somewhere once that a hatred of war won’t get rid of war. Only a love of peace will. And that if a person can truly think in terms of peace and harmony during war, they can flip the switch. Though it must be both and at the very least- One to start and stay on track despite the predictable resistance coming down the pike by the other.

    What I think makes it all the more difficult is believing whole heartedly in the good relationship and doing action from that perspective regardless of what is in the air.

    People stay because they want to, that’s all there is to it. Sure there is, “ennui, fear, finances, comfort…” I think that gives people time to make changes, should they really want to.

    –“Because I hear a lot of people who are still in a relationship knowing it’s “over?”– Well then, it would be prudent to get off a dead horse. Do you see any hope in it’s “over.” Even if one says it’s over, that’s it, it’s over.

    As for perhaps changing a persons mind? Well, the last time you had your mind made up- Could anyone change it. Only you can do that.

    Anyway, that’s my take on your 269, interesting number for such a comment as yours, Just a thought.

    272: Rosa,

    Your comment was great! Though at the end you said, “I feel REALLY GOOD having empowered and educated myself and worked so i have resources and I can choose to pay occasionally if I want , when I feel good offering.”

    If men waited till they felt good offering? Well? Women would certainly know who loves them and who doesn’t. I’m just saying as a man, a lot of the time we do things out of duty- because it is good and right, necessary for the world to turn. If we did most everything as a matter of feeling? Well, there are times I would most certainly starve.

    8: Brenda,

    Indeed you are! Keep up the good work.

    10: Brenda,

    Here’s a KISS for you and a hug… XO!!

    14: Summerbaby,

    You said, “Remember to be present. Lol”

    Summerbaby, I am not only present, I get involved.

    64 & 66 Daria,

    It’s all good! Sometimes you just got to get what you feel off your chest. This is a good place to do it. Should you feel the same in the future? Be my guest, tell me just how you feel about men and perhaps me.

    By all means, on this one, don’t regret, your just expressing yourself- so do.

    Reading these posts helps me better understand women too. individually and in some ways as a whole, though I have to be careful on that one.

    75: Elizabeth,

    “Do you have any advice on how to get a guy to stop seeing you as his little sister and start looking at you in a romantic type way?”

    Like I’m doing with N, every opportunity express your feelings. Today, I told her she was the most beautiful woman I have ever known. Instead of thank you, she didn’t take the compliment at first, given a moment, she did. Though she didn’t say thank you, she did see it in herself, I think. Thank you wasn’t what mattered, Her knowing how I feel about her and her receiving it.

    Little does she know, yet. That between my ears, I have it to make any woman happy to be with me. I’m not selling myself here, I’m giving, no charge. Over time, the rest is up to her.

    The women on this blog may say to themselves or me. “Ok, what makes you so special?” Nothing except I have the key to happiness and that is creativity, boundless creativity, and that means… The ability to make good wonderful experience happen together, over and over for the rest of our lives.

    There is a catch though. Like you said, I need the woman to be present completely and to get involved. So when you think about it. Really, what is there to be afraid of? Happiness, failure, success, fear itself? This isn’t confidence speaking, this is the way it is.

    86: medicalgirl,

    Ironic your comment number is 86 and that’s exactly what you want to do with this disrespectful dud, not dude, I mean dud. If your not going to have your number changed, never respond to him, no matter what he texts and on that note. DO NOT READ ANOTHER TEXT, he will go away sooner or later. Or, do record the texts and notify the police, there are laws against harassment. That is probably the better choice,

    Sorry your going through that.

    Well ladies, if I’ve missed anything, do tell.

    Thanks again,

  95.  #95medicalgirl on May 7, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    Thank you , Jim, you are absolutely right. I was remiss in answering time and time again. I should have known better. You seem to be the glue that holds this thread together???? Thank you so much for re-enforcing what I should have known all along. May I plead a moment of weakness and naiveness? No excuse, I know. Thanks again for your common sense and your responses to all of us. I can’t speak for others, but I sure do appreciate knowing that there’s another voice out there who can help us through what we seem to need help with!

  96.  #96Daria on May 7, 2011 at 9:35 pm

    Hmm feeling sad

    Before rori have always either contributed or else paid the whole thing for my friends and I. I took men and women, multiple ones out to dinner regularly, and gave them presents, sometimes huge ones.

    I did a 180 on this about a year ago when my financial situation changed.

    I now feel really good like this, but I feel triggered reading about women who want to pay on dates cuz my nvs pop up big time. I have no desire to go back to my past behavior. I super enjoy letting aan always take the lead, and I notice when I don’t, I turn myself off and get my energy a bit anxious, somewhat less amazing and mysterious.

    I feel bad that my nvs aren’t seeing my generosity through my whole life. I feel afraid that men don’t want to always be masculine.

    I feel really proud of myself when I practice … Still challenging… Not paying for something.

    When I practice holding out for really good treatment, the kind if treatment I imagine super divas w high confidence receive.

    Dorothea was a big inspiration for me that I deserve men to pay for me.

    Most of my brothers and guy friends and even some girlfriends have been helped by me in the past w money. I
    used to fantasize about making a lot of money so I could gift more to my friends. I saw myself as a sole provider.

    It’s almost unbelievable to me that I still have friends who love me and who contribute to My wellbeing now.

    I think it also helps me because having been wildly generous in the past, I know it’s not ‘too much’ for me to deserve the same.

    Like I know I used to drive back and forth across the bay and that I take buses and bike and walk, so it’s not too much for another person – a man – to do it for me.

    I just really like extreme femininity. For me it’s a whole new world to let men lead in everything. It doesn’t diminish my place or power, because I get to go deeper and deeper.

    I want to feel More and More deserving.

    I really want the husband who wants and offers to give meassages daily.

    Whew. Feeling much better. The nvs are quiet and I feel good about all of me and what I want.

    It really wasn’t about others after all.

  97.  #97Daria on May 7, 2011 at 9:47 pm

    “If you’re finding yourself being “extra careful” to not push a man away – perhaps that’s EXACTLY WHY he’s not coming closer!

    The road to a man’s heart is the “Emotional Road” – and even though we women have been taught over and over again that men HATE emotion, it’s just not true.

    Men hate DRAMA – which is actually almost the OPPOSITE of true emotion.

    “Drama” is what we do when we’re AFRAID of our true, real emotions.

    We feel so afraid, deep inside ourselves, of our rage, our terror, our pain – that we work really hard to shut down those feelings and keep them hidden – and what happens then is that they “pop out.”

    Those feelings (especially the ones we think are ugly) – because they’re denied sunlight and attention and just plain acknowledgment from us that they exist – actually end up RUNNING us.

    The effort of keeping them hidden makes us tense.

    The effort of keeping them hidden makes us “fake.”

    The effort of keeping them hidden basically puts a WALL up between ourselves and a man.”

  98.  #99Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 10:00 pm

    Daria – all women deserve to have men pay. PERIOD
    but not all women have the same views on whether they themselves will ever pay.
    BUT all women deserve to have their own views on whether they themselves will ever pay.

    Hmmm I like this deserving thing.

    All women deserve to have men pay and to have their own views on whether they themselves will ever pay.

  99.  #100Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    “So – to undo that?


    This means that whatever comes up – wherever you are, whatever you’re feeling, however or whoever triggered those feelings – you stop doing what you’re doing, take a second to acknowledge the feeling, and then give LOVE to that feeling.

    Most of us have been taught to protect ourselves.

    And the way we’ve been taught to protect ourselves is to keep ourselves to ourselves.

    We don’t THINK we’re doing that – because we talk about the relationship with a man, we show our love to him, we pay attention to him, we may even be sharing ourselves in bed with him…but we’re still protecting ourselves.

    So much of the time, the things we DO and SAY are all about GETTING or GIVING Love, but the effect those things we DO have on a man is usually superficial.

    He hears us talk about our day, and about work, and he hears us telling him what he should be doing, and he hears us asking him for things – but that doesn’t get him any closer to CONNECTING with us.”

  100.  #101Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    “The only thing that connects a man to us – instantly – is our emotions.

    So know that you can use ANYTHING – any moment, anywhere, to allow your feelings to show – to stay open, to look him in the eye with your heart open and TAKE IN his love, instead of SENDING or GIVING him love.”

  101.  #102Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    “This may not come naturally for you, especially when you’re so used to hiding what you’re feeling for fear you’ll scare a man away or have him thinking you’re just flakey.

    That’s why I created Modern Siren. I want to dispel the MYTH that being a juicy, emotional, authentic woman turns a man off. Nothing could be further from the truth!

    Men LOVE women who are authentic and vulnerable, and the feeling he gets for you when you’re wearing your heart on your sleeve is to take your face in his hands and show you he adores you.

    It can happen in so many other ways.


    There’s nothing more beautiful in all the world than a woman’s feelings.

    That’s why we’ve been painted and sculpted and written poems about from the beginning of humankind.

    When an artist paints a woman “in the nude” – it’s not about her body – it’s about seeing her heart and soul without anything getting in the way.

    Remember how powerful you are emotionally “naked,” love your feelings, and let me know how you’re doing.

    Love, Rori”

  102.  #103Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    “If your man hasn’t been very affectionate lately, or you’re still waiting for him to say, “I love you,” then read this special letter where I explain what makes a man feel “safe” and want to have a romantic relationship with you (not just a friendly one):

  103.  #104Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    I’m going to focus less on giving love or getting it, like showing him through my actions,

    and more on opening up and really sharing my authentic emotions in the moment

    i feel amazing when i discover that i opened up in an everyday familiar moment that i didn’t use to open up before…

    theres opportunities to open up all throughout the day

  104.  #105Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:13 pm

    97: Rosa,

    Am I missing something or do something wrong in locating it.

    I clicked on your address and scrolled down to 386, that post is from Laughing Goddess to Mel.

    I’m fairly new to computers, almost 3 years now.


  105.  #106Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    Dorothea – i feel anxious and defensive being addressed about this paying issue

    i feel relieved to not feel attacked

    ok i do feel defensive reading that all women deserve to have their own views

    my nv hears “you were saying they don’t deserve to, because you were triggered, and you said something to Rosa about it, and you were pushy, and this is a trigger mine and even if you’re working on it as your own trigger now, everyone is gonna see it as you pushing your line on others”

    and then i feel defensive


    i feel confused

    my actual feeling was AACK! wall-up!


    this is my practice being really in the moment authentic

    felt scary

  106.  #107Daria on May 7, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    i feel afraid of pushing people away

    i love my fear


  107.  #108Rosa on May 7, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    Daria ,Jim, Dorothea and others,

    I like that you are experimenting with extreme femininity Daria.

    I also like how you deal with your nasty voices.

    I am very interested in this ongoing “who pays for it” discussion.

    Daria wants to be the extreme receiver in her feminity
    Jim seems to think its a duty to pay because its good and right and keeps the world turning and he might starve if he waited till he “felt like it”.I wasnt sure how to read that but I wondered if paying for dates was like going for a dental check up? Its good and right but you dont feel good doing it?

    Rori says dont handle money around a man.

    Others here seem to agree with any and all of these views.
    Dorothea wants to experiment .

    My view is that I feel feminine and cared for when he pays , but if we are regular dates I want to offer contributions here and there so I feel good and right with showing him that although I am a feminine woman , I also appreciate the money he spends on me ! I feel it is an act of appreciation and token of thanks.

    The men I date are often divorced and many have had to divide assets, educate children etc. The one I let pay for EVERYTHING has no kids, never married, director in a global company etc etc.. His yearly bonus is likely to be more than I earn in total.He knows that, and says charming things about me having sons to educate with my money.

    The others I do as I mentioned previously, pay for drinks or parking or a coffee.This is just a financial gesture . I feel really weird taking the restaurant check from a man but I did it once for an old BF’s birthday and it still felt weird.

    I have dated a man once who gave me email feedback that he was angry I did not offer to pay half the bill (a pub meal ) on our first date. I did buy drinks by the way. This was also our LAST date ..tee hee. Unsurprisingly, he griped all night about his court case with his ex over 5000 dollars he felt she owed him !

    I also had a date once where he was determined to spend nothing on me. He took my coffee order to the counter and seemed to be looking at me to come forward to pay for mine , I sat down .He paid the three dollars. We talked for 90 mins , it was 7pm. Restaurants open all around us and we were getting on fine. He did not offer another drink or a meal. He asked to see me again. Unwisely I did not heed the red flags.

    Came to pick me up from my home so we could go out , then sat down with wine he had brought and said he was going to order pizza!!!! I told him I didnt want any and he ordered it anyway, then produced half the money and asked did I have ten dollars ! He ate some and i said it was time he left. uuughh..

    Nowadays I only let them in to my flat after several dates, otherwise its pick me up downstairs only.

    In fact I have got very defensive around this issue I realise.

    As to the “who pays” , allowing the man to pay most of the dating costs initially like this seems to filter OUT the guys looking for a “Purse” .

    I feel good doing it this way.

  108.  #109Jim on May 7, 2011 at 10:48 pm

    94: medicalgirl,

    It’s all good, thanks for the compliments.

    I must confess when I first entered this blog, I thought it was somewhat of a haven for women to learn how to manipulate men in quantity. For the most part, I was indeed wrong and glad to be.

    Over time, I actually see what I’ve wanted women to do in life- put a little work into themselves. NOTE; Men need to do the same and maybe more so than women. There is always room for self improvement and anyone on that course will in some way mature, grow and maybe find that the “pursuit of happiness” is a tangible journey that can be attained.

    This is an incredibly good platform for women to grow. and grow with other women’s opinions, attitudes and beliefs. A place where one perspective isn’t “The Way,” It is smart and safe. In a way, a bit of a finishing school at an emotional level, involving and including each woman’s unique individuality and perspectives.

    A little spicy at times!! 🙂

    I’m glad I came back. I have my own growth to deal with too, Here’s the thing. I believe in love and it’s the best thing we can continue to experience in life. So why not work on it and ourselves.


  109.  #110Rosa on May 7, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    Jim , I have reposted it here.

    Interesting subject matter for me as Iam typing on hospital keyboard right now and I GET where she is coming from. I just had my second breast surgery (and I still have more to do because of technical issues yesterday ) for cancer. No its not recurrent. yes I think I am cured.

    BUT I am scared s…less to show my very scarred and nipple-less body to a man , I am scared to lean on a man and become his liability.I am scared to feel love for a man who feels pity for me, I am terrified that I have lost my sexy self. I cant flirt , I cant play with a mans mind like I could before.

    I am lost and afraid and totally alone in this experience that started in October.

    And I am one of the lucky ones. I know its cured.

    Jim if you love this woman please remember she is possibly feeling all this and more . Mortal fear.

    If i had a great guy who loved me right now i would likely push him away or try and sabotage myself (I am trying very hard not to..more on that in a moment)

    I would need him to hold me long and tight like you hold a screaming kicking toddler.

    Then i would want him to touch my wrists , my cheeks , my hair and linger in what femininity I still offer.

    I would want him to take the worry away from me any way he could, get my car tuned, do the groceries, drive me, bring me food ..and even THEN I would likely “say no I am ok” if he offered (and yes rght now that is what I am actually doing.

    PLEASE do not wait around till her fear evaporates. It wont. But you can overcome it.

    Stride in and do stuff for her , even if she seems slow to accept your offers.

    Hold her often , brush her hair and massage her beautiful hands while looking in her eyes.

    Tell her often you arent going anywhere else.

    If you cant do these things , please dont bother with less, unless you wish to remain unavailable for love for personal reasons .

    As for me, since having cancer I have met a few good men. One has sent me chocolates , one a huge basket of fruit and the third is offering to drive me home from hospital.

    One had his wife die of breast cancer and is in a bit of a do-over fantasy , lives 1000 miles away, one is a 53 year old uncommited charming dilettante of a man who I could fall for easily but is Dangerous with a capital D , and the third is a good solid ordinary serious minded man , a doctor who is not quite divorced.

    So there we have it.
    I am damaged goods too.
    The men I attract may well be the same.
    I hope I am not too scared (or scarred) if one good men truly steps up.

    Never mind what to do about sex. Nothing more than the briefest pecks in a long long time.

    Any insight Lone Plum? The voice of reason is always appreciated.

    Tuesday, 3 May 2011 @ 3:01am

  110.  #111Rosa on May 7, 2011 at 10:59 pm

    I love being a student at emotional finishing school!!!!

  111.  #112Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    it didn’t even cross my mind to attack you or anything you said. i am just feeling excited about this idea (truth even!) that women are deserving of LOTS of things. and that deserving one thing doesn’t take away from deserving another. ABUNDANCE! woohoo. i love being deserving of many things even if they’re seeming opposed too!

  112.  #113Dorothea on May 7, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    what i meant is i am feeling excited about it and i wanted to share it with u!

  113.  #114AmazingMe on May 7, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    Happy Mother’s Day Sirens!!!!!

  114.  #115Daria on May 7, 2011 at 11:33 pm

    I’m feeling sad

    I miss having close friends. I miss having guywho. To call amd knowing he’ll be there to say bye to in my imaginary relationship

    Other people’s voices and energy can feel so good to me.


    I miss my little brother, and I feel afraid to call him because I feel guilty ever since he has kids I’ve hardly spent any time with him.

    I miss our group overflowing our hearts with love.

    I miss Me overflowing my heart with love.

    I’m gonna pause and do a meditation on that.

  115.  #116Daria on May 7, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    Yay dorothea I feel good that you want to share your joy about women deservedness w me!

    I feel sad this joy is reminding me of what I think of as strained relationship I’m having w my sister. I feel sad.

    I love my sadness. I choose to have wonderful loving relationships w women. That feed my heart and spirit.

  116.  #117Daria on May 7, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    I love my sadness. And that feels like. A smile. I love my smile and that feels like hmm smile. I love my hmm smile. And that feels like big breath sigh. I love my big breath sigh. And that feels like tingling on my booty. I love the tingling on my booty . And that feels like squeezing above my nose. I love the squeezing above my nose. And that feels like. Smile I love my smile and that feels like. Tingly feet. I love my tingly feet and that feels like. Hm smile. I love my m smile and that feels like sigh x I love my sigh and that feels like… Eyelids closing

  117.  #118Daria on May 7, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    I will feel better after rest.

  118.  #119Daria on May 7, 2011 at 11:52 pm

    I will feel better after rest. I will feel powerful.

  119.  #120Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 3:03 am

    Daria: I’m feeling relieved after listening to this and feel inspired to share with you.

    Please lemme know if it resonates.

    There are four parts total.

  120.  #121Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 3:12 am

    Rosa’s post #107 brought up a memory of my own.

    I had recently become sexually involved with a neighbor and our “dates” had consisted of him coming over to my house and hanging out. He worked as a cook in a restaurant and one day he suggested going out to eat there as he got everything “half off”. Woo hoo I thought, an actual date.

    At the restaurant he orders a couple of cocktails made with high end liquor and the most expensive entree. I had a house wine and a couple appetizers. When the bill comes, he looks at it and tells me my half is….
    I was too shocked to say anything. Not only wasn’t he treating, he was expecting me to literally pay half the bill, even though my order came in considerably cheaper. This amounted to him getting his discount on his meal (plus!), but mine costing the same as if I’d been there by myself. Joke was on me.

    This ‘relationship’ never became more than a casual thing and a short lived one at that. I now see it as a lesson. Men who expect a woman they ask out to split the bill do not have the agenda of wooing her. They are treating her as they would a “buddy”. If I go out with a buddy, I’m more than willing to pay my own way. If I go out with someone who has romantic intentions toward me I want to be “courted”. The man paying (because he did the asking) is part of the dance of courtship. If he doesn’t want to do that, then he is automatically weeding himself out. If he’s not willing to put any effort into courtship, how much effort would he put in as a life partner?

    That said, I feel uncomfortable with Dorothea’s use of the word deserve in her statement (#98) “-all women deserve to have men pay. PERIOD.” Why should I deserve to ‘not pay’ simply because I have an extra Y chromosome? Or uterus? Or vagina? That gets into some creepy territory where men deserve things simply because they were born male and ” a woman’s place is…..”.

    In a partnership, both parties find themselves alternately giving AND receiving. If they feel comfortable doing that during dating, why should they be made to feel “less feminine” or “less masculine”, or guilty of something? Giving AND receiving are both part of having a balanced life. IMHO.

  121.  #122Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 4:49 am

    Oops! That should be extra X chromosome. 😉

  122.  #123Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 5:59 am

    Mother’s Day thoughts.

    I wish you all the very best Mother’s Day and a day filled with bountiful blessings and love.

    I am sitting here this morning, tears running down my cheeks, feeling so unbeleivable blessed and loved. I am so thankful for the gifts I have received in my my son and his dad. Having this kind of realtionship with my ex is a blessing to me and he is so very important in my life. He never ceases to bring tears to my eyes with his gifts and cards of admiration for the being the wonderful mother and person that I am. And, he doesn’t show it just on this day…

    Nothing else matters right now, except for me, allowing myself to sit in these feelings and truly enjoy the way that I feel right now.

    I wish this for all of you today and every day.

    Much love,


  123.  #124Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:50 am

    I do want things to get better with this guy but I am a little shell shocked as of last night/waking up this morning. I feel dread and anxiety and fear when I am sitting on the computer and i see my email count go up 1 on the browser tab. It could be him, emailing me something that will feel bad to read or will open a can of drama. when i wake up and i see a new text message i am scared it’s from him, and there is a new drama that awaits me. i don’t feel any dread when the phone rings and it’s him, because i always feel happy to hear his voice, but now I am forming some dread and anxiety about when the phone will ring, because when i don’t answer the phone for him, he leaves a nice voicemail, but texts and emails after calling too and it’s something that feels bad.

    sirens, i think i am guilty of having done this to him before, perhaps multiple times. this is abusive. i was on the phone yesterday with him just sobbing my heart out harder than i have in a long time, saying i am so sorry for ever being crazy to you.

    because i am on the receiving end of it and i feel battered and beaten up and scared of him and unsafe.

    i feel regretful for ever perpetuating that on anybody.

  124.  #125Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:51 am

    Thats so beautiful Lilybelle,
    That your ex cares about you as a persona and as the mother of your child.

    Mine called today to find out how many school shirts were at my house , how many pants and could I send some back to his place..

    Never mentioned how was I , or my surgery last week. Never mentioned Mothers Day , just lots of fast talking asking me to pack shirts and get them to him.Told me he wants more money for driving lessons for son.

    I feel very hurt and distressed when this sort of thing happens . He just demands stuff.

    I actually washed , dried , ironed the shirts and got it all sorted so my son had clean stuff and his father didnt b*tch to him about it.

    I realise this was the pattern of my marriage..just trying to please him and keep the peace.

    So what should I have done?
    “Sorry dont know and dont care about the shirts. I just got out of hospital as you know”
    Only person who gets flack then is 16 year old.
    I hate that my ex still makes me cry after 8 years.

    I just wanted to be treated as a person .

  125.  #126Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:55 am

    Dorothea. I am sorry you feel dread and fear from his contacts and what those contacts will bring.
    This is not healthy.
    This is big time eggshell stuff.
    I hear that you may have used negative tactics in the past and that now he is .

    Can you express how you feel when you read the emails and texts ?

  126.  #127Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:56 am

    I am going to leave the city for a hike this morning and leave the phone at home.

    i dunno if this makes sense but his communication style lately feels violent, even when he’s being nice. he is putting us in a bad place.

    not that we werent already in a bad place cuz i put us there the same way…

    BUT i am trying to get us out of there because it became clear he (and i!) didn’t like it, but the last thing i expected was for him to fight back against it changing for the better.

  127.  #128Daria on May 8, 2011 at 6:59 am

    Lily t – rori teaches that if we don’t choose either the masculine giving role, or the feminine receiving role, then what is created will be a friendship, not a romantic relationship.

    Men usually want the giving role, so they are looking for a woman who is able to receive.

    For me I deserve to be taken care of, and yes he deserves to lead, to be appreciated for it.

  128.  #129Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 7:07 am

    A love song to mothers….

    MotherWoman found a unique way to celebrate mothers. We engaged our community in creating this video to honor the gifts we receive from mothers. Families and friends told us what they treasure most. We asked internationally known singer/songwriter powerhouses, The Nields, to write a love song to mothers. Amazing family photographer Sarah Prall captured the beauty of area mothers, fathers and children. We hope you enjoy this tribute and share it with the mothers you love!


  129.  #130Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:08 am


    i release these characteristics from my identity, weee

    i grant myself tremendous patience and full right to the enforcement of my boundaries as the enormous fallout from releasing these things happens around me and to me.

  130.  #131Ella on May 8, 2011 at 7:09 am

    Help Sirens,

    I feel panicky… Following on from posts on last thread… I felt better after posting here and getting support and I think it was Rosa who said my vibe is god right now, and that just made me feel really good and lifted and I went and had a night out and had a brilliant time!

    I am getting a lot of male attention now.

    But today I feel like someone just burst my bubble.

    Yesterday I blogged about my friend’s ex (my live in landlord) and how I feel confused about my feelings for him. Because he and I have been hanging out, and one night last week we kissed and cuddled and admitted to fancying one another, and I also felt bad about it because I love my friend and they are recently split up.

    She left him and is with another guy, which he doesn’t know about the other guy! That feels icky cus I know, and he has said a few times he wonders if there is someone else and I feel dishonest and horrid cus I know there is and yet I can’t/don’t want to tell him cus I feel afraid of losing the friendship with my mate.

    ICK ICK.

    And he is the kind of guy who has really high morals and belives in ‘doing the right thing’ and I feel worried about his reaction if/when he finds out and also finds out I knew, because I won’t lie.

    So far he has not asked me directly if there is someone else and whenever he has mentioned it I went quiet, which I think he noticed.

    I feel panicky.

    And to top it all off I feel completely confused about how I feel about him!

    I mean this guy is a honest, step up guy. He is tall, really tall (yum) and strong, he is working and he is fun.

    He can do relationship and has no issues. He is a rarity around here it seems to me.

    BUT he is my best friend’s ex.

    AND he has been actively dating this last weekend, even though it has only been 1 week since they split up.

    He had a woman over on Friday, and another woman over last night!

    At first I thought I was ok with it, however now I am feeling a bit icky. Like I am not good enough otherwise why wouldn’t he give this attention to me? Was I only good for a kiss and cuddle and not as a serious prospect?

    But that doesn’t seem right as he has made it clear that he thinks I am way above his ex in terms of who I am… well what I mean is he has said I am worth much more than any of the guys I date, and that I am hot and well presented.

    And the woman who he had over last night is just coming out of a violent relationship and she is also really nice. And possibly well suited to him as they both have children of about the same age, and are divorced.


    And she stayed the night and I think they were kissing and cuddling and they have made plans so meet again and do stuff with both their kids.

    And then he came and told me about it and was talking about her and saying that she could be a maybe for him.

    And it is that conversation that has made me feel sick, and awful.

    I said that for me I always need time between relationships but that is just me.

    I just feel so confused because I really like this guy. But I don’t know if I could be in a relationship with him, and the fact that he is my friend’s ex… just makes it feel impossible.

    And I just don’t know if I am ready to be in a relationship with someone anyway.

    Plus I have no idea if he views me as a potential partner. Or a friend, or his ex’s friend or what!!


    And then there is the whole thing that I am the Prize, and yet right now, because of these other women, it is not feeling like that.

    And yet I am not in a position to ask him not to date!

    I feel icky.

    Before last week he was never even an option for me, so I didn’t have to deal with any of these thoughts and feelings.

    Maybe I should just let it go and he can be with that woman. Maybe that is best for everyone.

    But it feels a bit icky.

    And this whole thing feels so rushed. For him to even think about a new relationship now, after 1 week just feels so soon.

    And yet that is his business.

  131.  #132Ella on May 8, 2011 at 7:11 am

    This is super triggering for me because I have not really told him how I feel, mainly cus I don’t really know and the opportunity hasn’t come up. And he hasn’t asked me. And I feel afraid that it could be akward if he doesn’t view me as a potential partner and I will feel rejected and may not be able to cope with that! I feel SCARED! Like crazy.

    Except that after the kissing happened I said I felt a bit weird and a bit bad for his ex, but that it was nice. And I had already admitted to fancying him.

    It just feels so triggering for me because I kinda feel like here is the first real step up guy who I have encountered of this standard and if I let it pass me by there may never be another one.

    And therein lies the problem here.

    Ah, ok, I get it!

    This is about trusting that there are lots of step up guys who will want me.

    But logically telling myself that does not make me believe it… it doesn’t make me feel it!

    I feel grabby and panicky and this is so not the place my vibe needs to be at here.

    But none of the other guys I have dated have been step up like he is and I just feel so afraid that he will get with that woman, and they will be happy and I will still be here dating toxic men and on my own.

    That feels absolutely AWFUL!

    Seriously the thought of having to watch him get with someone else and be all happy, cus that is the kind of guy he is, while I just stay stuck, feels terrible.

    And I feel pressured and panicked by the fact that he is talking about potential relationships. Yesterday he wasn’t and that was fine cus it felt like there could be time for things to happen naturally and now I feel like if I don’t say how I feel or do something then it could be too late.

    This other woman is making it feel urgent.

    And that feels panicky knot in stomach.

    Or maybe it is all in my head! And he is not interested in me in that way, or wouldn’t consider it cus of his ex.

    And that makes me feel icky/sad too.

    🙁 🙁 🙁

    Oh and he has invited me to meet him at a pub later and we are going to have a drink and then come home and I am going to cook dinner (so far he has cooked for me twice).

    Help, what do I do? How do I fix my vibe here and HELP basically.

    Very panicky, vulnerable and insecure feeling Ella.

  132.  #133Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:11 am

    I do understand that men like to give, and to lead, and I do appreciate it. But in the actual romantic relationships I’ve been in, partnerships the giving and receiving flowed back and forth. And friendship was also a core to the relationship, as well as the dynamic of romance. Not an “either/or” thing.

    Everyone deserves to be loved and cared for–not just one half of the population. kwim?

  133.  #134Ella on May 8, 2011 at 7:12 am

    I feel like CRYING Waaaa, waaa booo hooo.

    I don’t want to be alone.

    I don’t want to have to take crumbs from toxic guys for the rest of my life!

    No No No.

    Feel so sad.

    Want to cry. 🙁

  134.  #135Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:16 am

    Rosa, your son is 16? Have you considered it may be time for him to learn to do his own laundry? He will be out in the world expected to take care of things like that on his own very soon.

  135.  #136Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:20 am

    I noticed my anxiety level go up when I posted that post to lily.

    I felt my heart beating fast and did not feel good

    I felt like I was pushing against resistance..

    I was preaching or teaching and part of it was to make wrong.

    Even though the information I was sharing was very valuable, I think it wouldn’t be received because the poster didn’t ask for help or ask me to share what I know of Roris teaching.

    I feel uncomfortable Most of the time, I feel invisible less than and angry when my mother gives me information against my perception of truth.

    I felt bad.

    Then I decided to switch to me and felt a bit better, but regretted addressing my post to lily because i don’t want to push against ‘imaginary’ resistance.

    I know from experiments and (amazing, transformational) experience that Roris tools work.

    I know that I feel good now deserving to receive just by being a woman, the way my body has a pussy that receives and having a penis makes me more masculine physically.

    I experienced the wonderful way this new worldview feels rather than the tit for tat masculine way that would indeed have a hard time justifying why one masculine being is more deserving than a masculine being.

    In masculine, deserving comes on merit and earning. It means one is more or less than.

    In feminine, deserving is a birthright. Like being a magnet is a birthright. I’m deserving because of being female as all females are… Our role is to go deeper and experience pleasure and love deeply… And we deserve men to care for us lead us provide a safe environment to do that… And they also benefit from the deeper love that we create when that happens.

  136.  #137Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 7:22 am

    132: Lily T

    I so agree with what you say here.

    Recently, I commented to my mother (who has been married to my dad for over 50 years),
    that I wanted someone who cared about me and my feelings, wants to give to me. She didn’t miss a beat to let me know that it is about taking care of each other, it’s not a one-way street. I am happy to have the example of my parents’ marriage — in many respects, anyway. He never takes his dish to the sink and stuff like that. I see where I can too early on in a relationship get into that kind of “serving” mode, so I am working on that. It’s all about the balance.


  137.  #138Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 7:26 am


    Actually, I appreciate your commitment to radical feminism. I am very much wanting to experiment with that, because of so many years of having to overfunction as single mother. But it feels weird, and it feels like if I don’t DO something, like initiate a text message once in a while in a fledgling CD relationship, they are going to think I am not interested. That seems to be happening now with one of them. He seemed very interested and was texting and calling, and I returned texts, but haven’t initiated anything. I’m just not sure they know how to interpret all this radical leaning back. kwim?
    what do you think?


  138.  #139Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:32 am

    Note to self:

    Noticing how Rosa ‘enabled’ bad behavior and didn’t enforce boundary due to belief

    ‘my son will get flack’

    Byron Katie style, this belief may not be true.

    This is similar to how my mom enables my dad because she doesn’t want drama …
    Trying to protect Me

    However this creates more problems for me because it is so much harder to enforce my own boundaries

    Enforcing boundaries heals situation. Persons become responsible for themselves.

    Feels so terrifying when am still holding the beliefs that I can control the other person.

    Perhaps he will make drama anyway

    Chance to heal comes from authenticity.

    It’s worth it,

    Practicing the boundaries in Babysteps I will get there.

  139.  #140Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:32 am


    My parents are that way also. And they’ve been together over 53 years. They take care of each other in the same, and different ways. It’s never all about giving and/or receiving.

    Thank you for acknowledging what I wrote. I’m a very pragmatic person and I’ve been feeling that this blog and I may not be a good “fit”. I just don’t see men and women as fundamentally “different”. I’m having trouble distinguishing the polarity of masculine vs. femine energy. I’m seeing it all as “Human Energy” sometimes expressed in different ways, styles. And I’m really not sure if trying to “feel” men as such different beings will ever result in the kind of relationship *I* want. I suppose I will just continue to read and observe for awhile.

  140.  #141Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 7:34 am


    Rosa, I’m sorry that your ex didn’t take the time to recognize the contribution that you make to your sons well-being. Ensuring his needs are met, his clothes are well taken care of and he is loved.

    I honor you.


  141.  #142Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 7:36 am

    The other thing I saw with the last guy, is that if you decide you’re going to give up all control and let the man lead everything, you better know who you are giving the reins to. They need to have certain character attributes like being mature and un-selfish. I felt as if I was being controlled, for his purposes. Not in a good way.

    I know you Daria have recently said that ALL men like to feel masculine and do the giving, etc. But not all of them know how to handle that in a good way.

    I would like to add, not as any criticism of you particularly, but in general, I don’t much appreciate hearing so often on this forum that it is up to the woman to say, do, act, and have the right “vibe” in order for this to happen, with ANY man. That’s just straight up unrealistic. Sometimes you just have to call a spade a spade. IMHO.



  142.  #143Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:38 am

    Elizabeth – ‘they will think I’m not interested’


    So they will Leave!!! < —- that is the culprit, feat of abandonment

    Men don't need to think that you're interested very much to pursue you. Men pursue Truly uninterested women all the time, I'm sure you've seen it.

    Your warmth and authenticity responding to him is enough to express your interest.

    If he leaves, there will ne other men. He will leave even if you try to manipulate him to stay by trying to lure him in with pushing back on him with initiating stuff. Actually that will push a good man away, because what a good man wants is to be able to give to you.

    You must be willing to let men go, in and out your life like a river. They will do this anyway whether you are willing or not. But your leaning back and allowing men who don't have it in them to pursue go, will allow good men who Can pursue get to you. And one of these men will keep stepping up forever.

  143.  #144Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:41 am


    I’ve realized I can feel feminine, sometimes even my deepest feminine, by giving and doing. It simply isn’t about “tit for tat”. Ever.

    “And we deserve men to care for us lead us provide a safe environment to do that… And they also benefit from the deeper love that we create when that happens.”

    I agree with the above statement. But I also believe, I FEEL that it goes both ways.

  144.  #145Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:41 am

    What if he does take his dish to the sink. Maybe even my dish. That would feel nice.

    Lily t and Elizabeth do you have Roris book? It lays out the foundation for Roris work. It will make the stuff we practice here clearer.

  145.  #146Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 7:41 am

    Daria: did you listen to that recording?

    I was wondering what AH has to say about blood sugar. After listening to Rose Cole, I’ve been noticing when my blood sugar is low, my whole perception of my world changes. So that’s how I ended up listening to a video about diabetes.

    I felt really inspired by her message to that young woman about being a teacher. Really I resonated with everything she said.

    I feel so curious to hear if you did too!

  146.  #147Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:45 am

    Lily – one can’t feel that it goes both ways, that is a thought.

    I Think it goes both ways.

    I feel: happy sad mad afraid. And variations.

    What I would do is experiment with both ways, the Rori way and the way I think is what works.

    I would really pay attention to how I feel, even good bad was enough at first for me.

    Then try out both ways and see how I feel. This is what I did, ad I used to hold similar views in the past, but now changed them because my experimenting and feelings showed me what felt good.

  147.  #148Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 7:46 am


    I believe this.
    May I add another aspect?

    By leaning back and allowing the men who can’t/won’t step up, it saves me valuable time and my precious self-esteem to simply let them go. Whether he likes me or not isn’t about me, its about him.

    I owe myself this gift of changing how I relate to men…clearly, my old ways didn’t work.

  148.  #149Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:47 am

    Lg it only loads some seconds on my itouch, so I am going to let it flow for now. Thank you mucho.

  149.  #150Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 7:51 am

    139. Lily T.

    I knew you were a kindred spirit 🙂

    I think there are a lot of good ideas and tools here.

    I especially like not making the man and the relationship the center of one’s universe.

    It’s just that it feels unnatural and forced and inauthentic to apply tools, unless it naturally happens without me having to think about it…does that make sense ? Anything other than that, to me, is still in the arena of manipulation, and puts another kind of wall up.


  150.  #151Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:55 am

    When I first started here I didn’t see men and women as different. I thought my most feminine was taking care of others, there was a lovely sweetness in that.

    As I learned about feminine masculine energy, and started experimenting, I changed so much.

    And I started noticing my feelings. And found a whole new world in the feminine way of being.

    I feel grateful.

  151.  #152Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 8:01 am

    142. Daria

    I get this. It feels good to read what you wrote.

    For me, it’s not so much fear of abandonment any more, but miscommunication, misunderstanding….however, i am beginning to think that that is part of it feeling a bit foreign to me and my usual way of doing things.

    Yes, I know what it feels like to be pursued and not be interested. It’s happening to me right now. He’s not giving up. But I don’t think he is right for me. I talk to him when I feel like it. and it’s fun. i’m not doing anything i don’t want to do, and am totally uninvested in any outcome.

    How many people do you think, that once they are in a committed relationship, retain that uninvested to outcome attitude?


  152.  #153Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:02 am

    146 Daria:

    Since I’ve been reading this blog I’ve tried noticing and distinguishing the difference in what my thoughts vs. feelings might be. Most of the time they are in accord. That is, I think something because it’s what I feel. I “believe” something because it’s also what I feel.

    So you, or anyone else, can tell me something I’ve written is actually a thought, but no, to me it is actually a feeling that evolved into a thought, perhaps belief. I tend to be more cognizant of using the word ‘feel’ on this blog because that is encouraged, but off-blog, I use the words feel, think, believe interchangeably because in my perception they mean the same.

  153.  #154Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:02 am

    sharing information that is different feels challenging

    I feel tense now

    I’d like to share in a way that feels good,

    Ok so then I can drop the masculine teaching advice thing and share my experience and feelings.

    I was close to that anyway.

    I don’t want that ‘push against wall’ feeling.

    I feel… Relieved now 🙂

    I feel smily.

    I feel sluggish in my tummy and mucusy and I feel embarrassed about that.

    My lips feel hot.

    I ate wheat stuff w proteins and now see it does throw my insulin and blood sugar off.

  154.  #155Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:07 am

    Lily – yes it’s common for people outside here to use thought feel belief interchangeably.

    I feel afraid that would make it very difficult to notice my actual feelings. Ie I feel afraid because I hold that belief.

    I’m actually feeling a lil angry because I feel drained when I see people on this forum not practicing Roris tools – and that’s My Personal stuff that I will heal.

    Beliefs are different from emotions. Feelings are emotions. Not convictions.

    A feeling message expresses an emotion.

  155.  #156Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:09 am

    Lily t what emotions are you experiencing right now?

  156.  #157Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:09 am

    I am feeling tense.

    I am feeling afraid.

    I am feeling curious.

    I am feeling excited.

  157.  #158Ella on May 8, 2011 at 8:11 am

    Ok Ella,

    I am going to work it through with you.

    We are the feminine. What does that mean?

    Well it means that we express. We lean back and we recieve.

    That means that I don’t have to ‘do’ anything. Or lead or push. I don’t have to get weighed down by the masculine thoughts and logic…

    No I do not have to be logical.

    Ok, so how do I feel?

    Tight, and confused.

    Can I express that?


    Can I express that to him?


    Does it mean I have to take any offer he makes me? Any arrows he sends to me?

    No. I don’t have to. Only if they feel right, and that is not pressured.

    Oh and I feel afraid of rejection. But that is not really a thing.

    Men cannot reject us. Either they can step up for us, or not. Thats it.

    Ok, so how else do I feel?

    Afraid to speak my truth.

    Afraid of percieved rejection.

    Awful hearing about other women.

    Confused about my feelings.

    That is all fine AND I can say all of that!

    When I think of that other woman – Ick! Sicky and tight.

    Can I say ‘I realise I actually don’t want to talk about other women with you. It feels awful to me. I didn’t think it would but it does.’

    Yes I can say that.

    Do I have to explain?


    Does it mean anything?

    Only the meaning I give to it.

    What about the idea that this is the only man who I could feel happy with?

    Is it true?


    Ah, I feel frustrated cus I know there is a technique here for flipping these kind of thoughts but I can’t for the life of me think what it is…

    It involves asking lots of questions about the belief.

    Does anyone know this technique?

    Ok, how am I feeling now?

    Well better.

    I am going to speak my truth.

    And stay in the moment. Because before that one conversation everything was feeling really good for me right now.

    No point getting into my head about the future, or what might happen, or how that might feel.

    Just express and use calming techniques.

    Ok, what calming techniques do I have?

    Stroking arm works. Looking at pretty stuff around me like tress.

    Wine – lol! No only joking.

    Taking a shower.

    Snuggling in bed.

    CD-ing other men.

    Floppy body.

    Brushing hair (but only when alone as it goes really bushy!).

    Ok, I can do this. I can find a way to feel good in this situation too.

    It starts with expressing my feelings and asking for them to be respected.

    Then just doing whatever I need to do to take care of myself.

    And then no matter what happens I will be ok.

    I will make it feel safe for myself.

    I just realised I was deriving a sense of safety from him. Like it felt safe and cosy with us in the house and then when those other women came I felt on my own again, and I felt unsafe.

    It is a fear about not being able to take care of myself!

    Yes, and work feeling scary in case I cannot earn enough money and I lose everything.

    That is my fear in tummy. NV.

    Feel scared.

    Its ok lil Ella, we are here and we are going to take care of you. I promise. We are grown up and we can do it!

    Love you Ella.


  158.  #159Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:13 am

    Elizabeth – I feel confused with your question.

    I guess people who commit to not being invested in outcome generally practice it forever as they start to feel better w wonderful freedom and powerful results. In that way it is like a lifestyle or spiritual practice.

    Relationship is just one area, a challenging one hehe

  159.  #160Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:16 am

    Daria, if you feel drained when you see people not practicing Rori’s tools on this forum…you must feel drained quite a bit, no? 🙂

    Can you allow that the tools may have some flexibility depending upon where a particular siren is in her life? In her relationship?

    I do, because I can see quite a difference sometimes between a young woman who hasn’t yet had a partnership, and a middle aged woman who has had experience with a long one. Some of the tools may work best when dating a relative stranger, others when dealing with conflict in a long established relationship. I see them all as “adaptable”.

  160.  #161Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:16 am

    Lg – I feel really curious about your takeaways from those videos that aren’t loading on my thingy. Tell me more please!

  161.  #162Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:18 am

    #149 Elizabeth.

    Thank you kindred spirit. 🙂 I’ve been feeling that way about Rosa lately as it happens.

  162.  #163Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:19 am

    Lily that feels bad. I feel angry to ne laughed at my feeling bad.

  163.  #164Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:23 am


    What am I feeling?
    I’m feeling good that Elizabeth could relate to what I wrote about being in a partnership.

    I’m feeling slightly pushed by you to accept the polarity of masculine and feminine energy that you feel, but I just don’t- as much.

    I’m feeling slightly chastized about not following Rori Raye’s concepts on her blog and slightly irritated because I don’t see “everyone else” doing that on a regular basis.

  164.  #165Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Daria, I didn’t and Don’t ! mean to make you feel bad or laughed at! Certainly Not. I don’t usually post to you directly because I sometimes find your sensitivity to words overwhelming. You always get passed it, but I don’t like being the direct cause of discomfort to you. I can’t help how you interpret what I write to other people, or in general.

  165.  #166Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 8:34 am

    158: Daria :

    Well, the problem starts with the whole premise of “having the relationship you want” Right there, you are invested in outcome. Because to be truly not attached to outcome, you wouldn’t even care whether or not you had a relationship! You would be OK with whatever 😉


    Elizabeth – I feel confused with your question.

    I guess people who commit to not being invested in outcome generally practice it forever as they start to feel better w wonderful freedom and powerful results. In that way it is like a lifestyle or spiritual practice.

    Relationship is just one area, a challenging one hehe

  166.  #167Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:36 am

    I’ve worked with women of diff ages and saw their stories and developments and watched Roris work w them and there was no difference, the tools work across the board, but they actually have to be used.

    I feel angry

    Ok I’m remembering a few years ago when on the questions board the women were busy supporting each other in Not using the tools and then they were stuck in toxic places for much longer. Many returned much later to try again.

    I feel angry. I guess part of it is I feel Invisible that I came from similar beliefs as the posters who are new and did a lot of practice to change.

    But now it looks like I’ve always held these new beliefs and feel like I’m across a gap and feel dismissed.

    And honestly I feel pist and left put that people are found as ‘kindred’ spirits because of resisting tools.

    I feel so angry about this.

    I am now being hard on myself that I have a hard time making myself trusted.

    Rori does a great job of that but she hasn’t been doing her welcome paragraphs to posters like she used to and I so miss That inspiration.

    I feel so angry!

    I want fuchkin support not to get into battles with women while trying to help them with information in a blog about that exact information.

    I am being hard on myself about feeling upset about this.

    I don’t want to be triggered by this ugh!

    And I don’t want to read and judge the women either.

    Ok they want to resist doing this work so what???

    I Know they will do the work anyway eventually so..,

    But what if they don’t?

    What if the whole blog gets taken over by stuck beliefs, masculine thinking?

    What if it slows me down?

    I don’t want to be slowed down.

    Trigger – old feelings – impatience at slowed down by other students, feeling left out because I know the lesson better, ostracized and made fun of, like it’s a bad thing, self doubt that I’m mean to others and alienate them and try to be better than because I know my stuff

    Hi trigger. I love me.

    Ok I intend to heal this. Wow I really remember this, 5 th grade.

    So angry!

    They ‘should’ be happy I know the stuff thru should honor me but no. Instead they alienate me and put me down… And it’s my fault because somehow unknowingly I alienate Them.

    Feeling mad about that.

    Loving me.

    I love me.

    Thus feels sad.

    I feel sad and I feel angry and I feel humiliated.

    I feel powerless to change this, apathetic low energy.

    I love me.

    I love my apathy.

    I love my sadness.

    I lobe the brokenheartedness I feel.

    I feel so angry!

    I love my anger.

    Ok then I know this is healing.

  167.  #168Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 8:37 am

    161: Lily T.says:

    #149 Elizabeth.

    Thank you kindred spirit. 🙂 I’ve been feeling that way about Rosa lately as it happens.


    Hey Lily, i know, i resonate with so much of what Rosa shares here, too!! She is so courageous and so generous with sharing her process. simply amazing.


  168.  #169Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Lily t – thank you I feel glad that you don’t intend to make me feel bad.

    I have discovered a memory of an incident that helped create a strong trigger for me around sharing information, and healing that will help me very much shift how I relate in this regard, as a person, teacher and coach. Yay!

  169.  #170Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:47 am

    Elizabeth – well, I feel uncomfortable to share…


    For me and what I know about manifesting,

    Having a desire is ok, in fact that’s the whole point if manifesting it. yet being attached to that desire is not, that will block it.

    I read recently in a book about the Buddha brain, that a desire is healthy and spiritual, yet a Craving, with a Feelin of Need and anxiousness, is not, that is what attachment is.

    So I create the vision and desire of the relationship I want, yet not try to control or hold on to glimpses of it as it starts showing up, or else it won’t fully form.

    In my experience with men, one will show up w more of what I want, then disappear, if I relax and reassure myself that thus is a Good sign, that more of Whaf I want is coming, then even More of what I want shows up, maybe a different way or from a different man.

    The attachment to outcome is the anxiety, craving, need around it, not the vision of beauty .

    It would feel great for me to have a wonderful relationship, but I feel great anyway right now single.

  170.  #171Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 8:50 am


    Have you considered the possibilty that Rori’s tools that may be relatively new to you, may not be for other women who have found their way to this space?

    Example: I’ve been pretty much doing the “leaning back” tool since I first started dating as a teenager. I’m 50 now. I was likely doing it before Rori even thought of it as a tool.

    The “rowing the boat” concept isn’t new to me either – though phrasing it that way is.

    Circular dating isn’t a “new” concept either. It is the traditional form of Western courtship for hundreds of years- oddly going out of fashion around 1970 and being brought back with the advent of on-line dating.

    You can be p**sed if you feel like it, but some of us, like me, are enjoying reading Rori’s tools/philosophies because they open up different ways of thinking/feeling that we want to explore. Or in some cases, explore further.

  171.  #172Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 9:01 am

    169 Daria

    Yes, you are correct with what you say here. Daria

    I get a deep sense however, that a lot of this practicing tools as you see it needs to be done goes against this very philosophy. But I also sense that you are very aware of this and working to drop this.

    Also, I sincerely hope you will take to heart what Lily says in 170, because it is very true. I was also CDing and leaning back and letting the man row the boat as a teenager. My thing was expecting a man to complete me and looking for love, approval and acceptance outside of myself.



  172.  #173Ella on May 8, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Oh Dog I feel nervous!!

    In the pit of my tummy.

    La la la la la…

    Don’t know why, I have met him for drinks before.

    I feel scared 🙁

    Ahh. love my scaredness.

    Love my anxious butterfly tummy.

    Going to put my current fav tune on now and get ready.


  173.  #174Ella on May 8, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Shaky hands…

    shaky shaky, nervous.

    Ow, just get up and clean teeth Ella. That is all.

  174.  #175retailtherapycat on May 8, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Ella – I dont normally post much but I am so rooting for you and you gave yourself some brilliant advice which I needed to listen to as well! You will be fine – you are a fabulous Siren – he would be a fool not to realise that!

    Let us know how you got on won’t you?


  175.  #176Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:13 am

    I feel uncomfortable sometimes too when I see what I perceive as people resisting the fundamentals of what Rori teaches.

    Also, I feel more vulnerable here because this is more of a journal, therapy, practice space compared to comments on most blogs. I feel vulnerable when I am practicing open my heart and well…being vulnerable.

    For example, the basic premise of Rori’s work is that there is polarity within a relationship and we get to choose if we want to take the feminine or masculine role.

    It is the basic premise of her work, she lays it out in the first chapter of her book, everything else is built upon that notion.

    Here is some of my takeaways from those vids I posted.

    My inner wisdom guides me towards what is true for me. Other people have their own inner wisdom and guidance. My only concern is my own vibration, my own reality, my own thoughts. My thoughts and feelings are not the same thing although they are very closely connected.

    First I think a thought
    then I feel a feeling in response to that thought
    the feeling is my emotional guidance
    it let’s me know if the thought or belief serves me or is limiting
    if I think a thought and feel bad
    that is my indicator that I am thinking/believing something that is out of alignment with my inner guidance
    the bad feeling is my inner knowing saying “wait, stop, you are headed down a thought path that isn’t serving you”
    turn around and follow the good feeling thoughts
    be willing to change your perspective
    have an open mind
    that is the first step towards creating change in your life.

    The more I study Rori and AH, I see so much similarity in their teachings even through the terminology and context is somewhat different.

    I feel inspired to write and article about this!

  176.  #177Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:17 am

    I love my typos
    I love my typos
    I love my quirks
    it’s okay to not be perfect
    I love me
    I love me
    I love me

  177.  #178Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:23 am

    Yes! I have been wanting to start writing and have my own blog. I don’t care if anyone sees it. I just want to have a place to express myself.

    And now I feel really clear about the subject matter. I want to explore and decode LOA and how it relates to relationships, and Rori’s teachings. I feel so excited!

    This is something out of my comfort range, starting a blog.

    I’ve done lots of wild and adventurous things in my life. It feels funny that I am so intimidated by this.

    But I’m working through the fear and feeling better and better about it everyday!

  178.  #179Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:27 am

    I feel insecure about my writing skills.

    I’m not a writer. I’ve never been a writer. I excelled in other areas math, art, design.

    I am not a writer.

    How do I feel when I think that thought.

    Heavy, bad, ugh, heart closed.

    I am a writer.

    Well yes, I am writing right now. 🙂

    whew. Gotta let that sink in.

  179.  #180Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:32 am

    Nobody cares what I have to say.


    I care about what I have to say.
    I care about what others have to say.
    Others do care about what I have to say.

    Those turnarounds feel better.

    I’m also realizing that I feel good about just putting my writing out there without any expectations. Just for the mere joy of it. I will attract people who I resonate with and we will learn from each other.

    As Rori says,

    Every student is a teacher and every teacher, a student.

    Yes, I will attract like-minded people and we will learn from each other. I’m not trying to save the world. I trust that everyone has their own divine guidance. I will just focus on following my bliss, my truth.

    Wow, I feel a weight lifted off my shoulders.

    You mean I don’t have to worry about everybody else???


    Ok, gotta let that sink in.

  180.  #181Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:39 am

    Ok, next step. I have to get fast Internet at my place.

    We are supposed to be getting dsl in my area. It has been delayed for six months.

    It could happen any day now. I am ready. I’m ready to let high speed Internet into my home life.

    Yes, I feel it coming!

    I feel so excited to post inspiring phots and quotes and ….!

    I feel so excited. The vision is coming closer and closer. It’s right there!!!!!

  181.  #182Laughing Goddess on May 8, 2011 at 9:44 am

    If anyone has any tips or suggestions on starting a little blog, I would love to hear.

    Rori and PG gave me some great ones already.

    I really need encouragement.

    I know this isn’t a big deal and lots of people do it but somehow it feels out of reach for me.

    I’m working on it and I am moving forward. The walls of resistance are coming down

  182.  #183gina on May 8, 2011 at 9:44 am

    I’m a lil’ hung up on the fact that D never contacted me to “finish” the conversation I started last week about how I’m not up for an imaginary relationship with him. After that “Hey G” the next day, to which I told him I was annoyed to get a casual hello since we hadn’t finished that other convo, and I haven’t heard from him. WHAT A JERK!!! On the phone he kept saying “I don’t know what you want me to say, G” and I totally wanted him to say/DO something to make me love him. And Jacqueline is right that I did push. But Rori is correct, that tweaks be damned, I was done with his crap.
    Still feels bad that he just won’t step it up for me. Though I feel MUCH better this week than last – last week, I walked around all weepy and lovelorn, and this week I feel stronger and open and new relationships of all kinds are developing.

  183.  #184Daria on May 8, 2011 at 9:45 am

    Yay LG! 🙂

  184.  #185DE on May 8, 2011 at 9:51 am

    Laughing Goddess:

    I feel happy that you are expanding your comfort zone and create a blog…Your writing abilities feel awesome to me…it feels clear, logical, i don’t get “dizzy” trying to get what u mean…and English is my 2nd language…;) So, yes, I will be u “follower” ! 🙂

    Not sure if I got the chance to mention to you, but I love your recent growth and it sure shows u have worked with Rori closely as well …and as Daria says, using the tools would give us results sooner and later…

    It feels bad to me to feel the resistance of so many women here…but, I acknowledge everyone has his/her own timetable…

    U said: “I’m not trying to save the world.” I do…by being the change I seek in the world…first…

    Here is something I read that gave me a good clarity on my journey:…
    Below are 7 levels of consciousness that clearly outline a path for our evolving consciousness:

    – tribal and mass consciousness – one obeys the group and lives by trial and error
    – individual consciousness – one develops a stronger sense of s…elf and ego
    – seeker’s consciousness – one asks questions and seeks independence
    – intuitive consciousness – one develops the heart and is becoming spiritually aware
    – group consciousness – one serves a higher good filling the needs of others
    – soul consciousness – one experiences spiritual service.


    Can’t wait to read the 1st blog 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  185.  #186Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:05 am

    I’m feeling so good!


  186.  #187Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:29 am

    Lg – I was now able to listen to that first video. Thank you.

    Ah manifesting work feels good.

    I did sone vibe readjustments on some blocking thoughts using ask and receive.

    I feel a lil More empowered to envision and live in what I want.

  187.  #188Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:30 am

    My blog turned into a collection of inspiring stuff for me

  188.  #189Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:34 am

    Ella the belief inquiry is probably Buron Katies The Work

  189.  #190Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 10:40 am


    To those of you with children, happy Mother’s Day!

    And, to those of us without children, I am going to take the liberty of passing along the greeting Jim emailed me, and it just made my day…


    A woman doesn’t have to be the mother of her own children to be honored on mothers day, God knows the men you’ve mothered over the years and this it just one man thanking you for them. They all called me and asked if I would send you a special note, thanking you as they couldn’t be here or there. Just like them to be absent again!! 🙂

    They all had nice things to say about you and are sorry if they hurt you.

    They went on to tell me what a wonderful woman you are and they were glad you were in there lives, despite themselves.

    With love,

  190.  #191Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:45 am

    the Work of Byron Katie

  191.  #192Daria on May 8, 2011 at 10:53 am

    I want to do like lg and start playing The drums in a band.

  192.  #193Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 11:01 am

    “Have the relationship you want” and “attachment to outcome”: TN man would say that “Have the relationship you want” is consistent with non-attachment thusly: You must let go of the energy of “wanting” (lack, craving, desperation) and then you are in the energy of “having” and you will Have the relationship you want. So “have the relationship you want” indicates a letting-go process rather than a grasping one. <3

  193.  #194Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 11:04 am

    LG, i feel happy for you about your blog. I set one up over a year ago but never wrote anything on it…just didn’t feel ready I guess.

  194.  #195anna on May 8, 2011 at 11:14 am

    I’m having a hard day today ladies and could really use some advice. My bf and I are trying to work our relationship out and build a strong foundation for our future. We have been “broken up” for a year now but we have been talking and hanging out 9 months of that year. Our relationship has become better than ever before but I find myself getting scared that we may not get back together since we haven’t yet. He says he wants us to but he isn’t ready to say when exactly. Most days I’m just going with it, speaking my truth holding my boundries but last night I broke down. I had a few drinks (not good I know because these emotions sneak up on me sometimes and I can’t contain them.) I was crying and kept telling him that I wanted to be with him and that I am afraid it’s not going to happen. I feel bad that I laid that all on him and that I was so emotional even though they were
    feelings I have every day (and he knows that
    because when I do break down it’s always the
    same conversation that I am scared). It doesn’t
    happen too often but when it does I feel weak
    and dramatic. He said he loves me and he
    doesn’t think our timetable is so off, but I still
    feel bad and I am finding myself wanting to
    reach out for him and “chase” him today. How do I forgive myself?

  195.  #196Daria on May 8, 2011 at 11:33 am

    Yay I spoke up when my dad was not liking the way I dressed (hood on to protect my ears instead of something cuter )

    I said I don’t want to be picked on. There was mire said including that I dress how I want to.

    I just want to say I felt good for saying something.

    I also said authentically I’m sorry that you don’t like it!

    Yay me.

  196.  #197Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 11:34 am


    If this was me and a situation I was in..wait, I was in a similar situation…

    I let him go.

    Over..done..and gone. And I am so better for it. That was a terrible place to allow myself to be put. And I let it happen because of empty promises and bullshit.

    Never again.

  197.  #198DE on May 8, 2011 at 11:40 am

    Hmm…I feel angry right now…

    I feel protective of Daria…

    I feel angry of those who use “age” and “time” as means for “knowledge”…something like…”oh, u have no idea…i’ve been around before u hun, i knew this s*hit before u…” Geez, how about instead of “explaining” and “analyzing”, “documenting, just simply be present with your feelings and express…

    “oh, i feel jealous …she is practicing openness at an earlier age than I do…she can experience more happiness than i do…oh…she actually cares more about my happiness than I do, wow…I feel touched…she can appreciate a life without material things…she has achieved a spiritual level I envy…or I feel judgmental of her…as in she is less than me because she has no “career” I place value on…she has no “title” and “credentials” or she doesn’t have my education and experience in counseling etc…I feel closed minded and limited by my own judgments and so called “education”, “experience”…accomplishments that besides of giving me food on the table and a comfortable life…I feel an unhappy and closed minded b*tch!”

    I feel angry when I see so many here saying “Oh, Daria so sorry I triggered u”…that’s soo bullshit!!! U are not sorry…that’s pleasantry…being polite…yet, so dishonest!!! How about instead say what u feel “I feel scared…I feel judged…I feel confused…or how about I feel happy I triggered Daria because I contributed to Daria’s healing…

    Hmm…now, I feel better…and relieved…and I am not sorry for triggering anybody…I feel happy!!!

  198.  #199Daria on May 8, 2011 at 11:41 am

    Anna – hugs! I would get Roris book, it’s 20$ and start working with the tools. Also you can read articles on the sidebar.

    Its natural to feel very insecure when you are dating exclusively without a commitment. This is one of the strengths of dating more than one man – especially in the healing way Rori teaches as Circular Dating – so that you’re not focused on one guy and letting doubts and neediness sabotage the attraction and push him away.

    I feel compassion for you – you can read the power and self esteem articles, start clicking back to the oldest one… To learn riffing and that will help you forgive yourself.

  199.  #200Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 11:47 am


    .. this was to Anna. My apologies.

  200.  #201Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 11:55 am

    197: DE

    Thank you for putting into words the way that I was feeling. No triggers here. I feel protective of Daria as well and she serves as an incredible inspiration and teacher to so many.


  201.  #202Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    #197 DE

    I’m going to take a guess your post is in response to a dialogue I had with Daria this morning. I feel Bemused …to read it. Because not one thing, not one motivation, not one feeling you attributed in your rant did *I* experience when writing my posts. Not one.

    I don’t feel triggered.

    Perhaps you are projecting something about yourself?

  202.  #203Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    Lilybelle – I thought your post was great for Gina as well 🙂

  203.  #204Jacqueline on May 8, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    Happy Mother’s Day! Everyone is a mother to something…even if it’s a moss. Smile – my guy friend Kreeden has been trying to keep his moss alive.

    Daria I admire you, you are so radically honest with yourself, and it just ripples out from there.

    LG – hope today is a better day. On wordpress free blogs site there are like a lot of tips on what to perhaps write about, etc. I think it’ll even generate ideas….it’s really easy. Then you have to mess with how you want it to look forever, lol…but there are themes you can preview. I hope you look at the free or I think it is…

    Happy Feminine Identity Day!!

  204.  #205Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    Aww it feels good to feel loved and that’s how I feel hearing you guys feel protective of me.

    I don’t want to attack or judge or see it happen To others or To me and I am practicing with my own thought noticing process – ie noticing when i do it – as well.

  205.  #206Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:27 pm

    Wow jaqueline that feels great and I am smiling here! : D

  206.  #207Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    Happy mothers day all! We birth the world! 🙂

  207.  #208The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    Just a general point – How to create totally unnecessary drama here:

    1. Write about your negative feelings about others that are created by them not doing what you want.
    2. Weigh in on this instead of simply ignoring it
    3. See 2. as an attack and take sides. Let this escalate into a larger scale catfight!

    This is exactly what I wrote recently about. One trigger leads to another. Negative feelings spread. Grrr.

  208.  #209Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    Lurker – Im sorry you see our work as unnecessary drama. It feels bad to hear it called that.

    I invite you – again – to leave.

  209.  #210Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    This is a blog where we ‘unleash our inner drama queens’ and process scary emotions and look deeply at everyday interactions to go under what we usually miss.

  210.  #211The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    #209 There she goes again…

  211.  #212Sloane on May 8, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    Hello Sirens-
    I am feeling confused about feeling messages when all I want to say is” why.. why.. why.. etc.. what’s up? why are you ignoring me? what’s going on/…I don’t get it?”.. I could use some assistance in creating a feeling message statment rather than living with these why questions I am feeling towards x and the past week of events.. which basically included being ignored and not feeling very important to him..
    So.. is it really as simple as …” I feel ignored and pushed aside this week.. is there something I need to know?” Or.. “I understand your issues and am compassionate.. yet they are no excuse for treating me like a stranger or with dissrepsct. It doesn’t feel good.. what do you think?” I am really trying to shift my experience and use these RR tools and see a shift in my being and vibe and approach.. I feel scared to feel these feelings and speak them.. so any great tips would be so happily received.. thank you!!

  212.  #213Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    Wow, DE! and yes, I will speak directly to you….

    I feel Lily and I grossly misunderstood and mischaracterized

    this feeling I have stems from interpreting your words as a whole lot of assumptions presented as “right”,

    from your own perceptions of things and what we are thinking and how they should unfold on this forum

    I feel very dismayed experiencing this “us vs. them” vibe

    I feel limited

    I feel happy to feel limited because then I know what it feels like to feel unlimited


  213.  #214DE on May 8, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    Lily T:

    Hmm…I feel like attacking…I feel annoyed…reading “I feel bemused”…it feels as being “ridiculed”…

    I feel tempted to explain myself…The post was not addressed to u in particular; there were other posts by other participants that inspired the same anger…

    Projection…?!!! Possibly… I admit feeling jealous of Daria’s accomplishments in her spiritual path… often times earlier in the process…and I feel embarrassed about it…how about u? Oh, I remember…u experienced none of it…okay…

  214.  #215gina on May 8, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Daria, thanks for saying so @202 – I was starting to go down the self doubt track. I want to conjure an immediate image to take me back to reality when I begin to question whether this is “my fault.” I’m also finding unproductive to meditation on what a POS he is. Oh, there it is: Valentines Day. I’ll just remind myself of those 2 words, and that should help keep me in check.

  215.  #216Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Lurker, do you see that you are also a tree in this forest of “unnecessary drama”? You just did step one yourself, then Daria did step two, and now I am doing step three. 🙂 <3

  216.  #217The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    #216 Yes, Lucy, I did! But then I thought, why should I be the only reasonable person here? That’s so not like me! So, I jumped into the madness.
    Want some popcorn, hon?

  217.  #218Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    That felt bad – again – after writing.

    I dont want my, or other sirens process judged as ‘unnecessary drama.’

    I feel humiliated and invisible.

    And furious and powerless.

    I don’t want to feel this way, and I dont want to close myself off when I feel attacked.

  218.  #219DE on May 8, 2011 at 12:50 pm


    That feels good to read someone expressing instead of “explaining”…Thank u 🙂

    Warm hugs

  219.  #220Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    My experiences with forums discussing psychology, philosophy, politics, spirituality, religion, methods and things of a more esoteric nature, over the years, and the reason I usually end up leaving them, is because, more often than not, there are usually a small skeleton crew of people who establish themselves as being “the gurus” of the whole forum. They expend incredible amounts of energy, fighting tooth and nail trying to prove their credibility and chase away people who don’t lay alms at their feet and agree with them that their way is the only way. Gets pretty tiresome to see, actually. Some of us are here for our health, and to expand our consciousness, not to become famous or be a part of some kind of cult.



  220.  #221gina on May 8, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    I have witnessed men doing MAJOR BS to women lately, and I just hate it. Boo to those guys! The stuff they do is UNFATHOMABLE…the lies and the bad behavior. how do they justify it in their own heads? Ugh! I feel disgusted and disheartened. And it feels crummy to remember D’s good behavior because we wound up HERE and that leaves me feeling scared that guys can turn on me. But, I actually didn’t like him as my first impression, and I had a sinking feeling sometimes while we were together. (small things…like he told me he wanted to take me to Mama’s pizza cause he said I’d love the salad bar. The salad bar is a piece of crap. He’s a chef and he knows better. He just wanted some pizza and figured I wouldn’t want pizza so he tried to sell himself as a good guy by talking up the CRAPPY salad bar. I didn’t even register any judgement at the time, I just remember kinda shutting down and feeling down and distant from him) Plus the fact that I wasn’t interested in sex with him – okay, feeling better, like I can trust my feelings to take me in a good direction.

  221.  #222Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 12:54 pm


    RE: #207 – Like! Thanks for sharing your perceptions of the blog. We need the balance of your voice here, and I feel sad when it all too often becums a war zone, instead of a place of healing.

    Thanks for mothering us today, LOL! Happy Mother’s Day to you! 🙂 Just teasin!

  222.  #223Daria on May 8, 2011 at 12:55 pm

    Wtf ! My process is Not unceszary drama. Lucy I feel betrayed to see that you implicitly agree with that.

    This is Very necessary to me and I lover my insights my practice and my voice.

    Feeling mad and pouty and legs shaking.

    Feeling like fuchk everybody who is judging me.

    Ok means I’m judging myself.

    Ok it’s not about them they’re just reflections of me.

    I feel crying inside and powerless to stop the humiliation. Whoa this feels deep.

    Disco Ne ted. I felt scared.

  223.  #224Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 12:56 pm


    I admire and appreciate your radical honesty, too, as Jacqueline said.

  224.  #225Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 12:59 pm


    RE: #211 – Questions like “why…?” tend to come across as accusing and making wrong, even when we don’t intend them that way. So try to go deep inside your soul and ask how his treatment, or lack thereof, makes you feel…

    For example:

    I feel confused. I want to feel close to you, yet I feel ignored.

    I feel insecure, and I don’t want to feel that way with you. It would make all my insecurities go away if I felt reassured that everything is all right. What do you think?

    I hope this helps.

  225.  #226Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    218 DE

    You’re welcome, and it feels good to hear that, DE

    It does feels good to express rather than explain,

    i wonder though, where is it written that it is more authentic to express every little feeling I have as it arises, as opposed to internally processing it first and then giving a synopsis in other than feeling messages?


  226.  #227The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    #221 “Happy Mother’s Day to you!”

    LOL Brenda! Uh, ok, thank you!

    But I have to say, you’re better suited as the blog mother. I see you’re trying to soothe the tensions instead of putting oil into the flames. Admirable.

  227.  #228Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:03 pm


    You have a right to think and feel and speak as you wish.

    For myself, I have found that when I speak every single bad feeling, I lose friends. But again, if expressing your every feeling is where you are at in your process, that is valid. I know I have shared many things on here over the past year that are not exactly socially acceptable. Sometimes it’s healing to get this stuff in black and white.

  228.  #229Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    I’ll pass on the popcorn Lurks – just ate some pears – but thanks anyway. Time to catch up on what’s going on here – yours was the first post I saw today… Am so surprised to see DE involved in a “conflict” – is this a first, DE? (I haven’t read what it’s about yet, just skimmed.) Love and hugs to ALL! You are all amazing and inspiring women! And I am grateful to be connected to all of you. <3

  229.  #230Daria on May 8, 2011 at 1:04 pm

    Wtf !

    I feel so angry!

    Ew! I feel like super betrayed.

    Ok so Brenda thinks me and lily t process where I find out about a trigger since I was 10 that affects my whole life is unnecessary drama??

    Ugh this feels disgusting.

    I feel like super judgmental.

    I feel super sad.

    You know what this is not fuchkin ok.

    At all.

    It’s not fuchkin ok to judge My process. And it’s not ok to back up men saying humiliating things about it to me.

    And it’s sickening to me.

    I feel like attacking

    Oh wow!

    I loveme.

    I love my betrayal trigger feeling.

    I love my humiliation.

    I love my outrage!

    I love my no!

    Is it fair to back them off me with attacks? Yes it’s fair but that’s not what I’m practicing.


    I can ignore them.

    I wush I could beat them down but I can ignore them instead.

    I love you anger!

  230.  #231Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:05 pm


    RE: #226 – LOL! I resemble that!! 😆

    When I was in 12th grade, I defended a student who was being yelled at by the teacher he said, “What are you, Brenda, the house denmother??”

    So your comment doesn’t strike me as anything unusual! 🙂

  231.  #232Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:06 pm


    Sometimes I find myself entertained by triggering you. I feel like I can control you by saying things that so effortlessly anger you.

  232.  #233The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    #227 “where is it written that it is more authentic to express every little feeling I have as it arises, as opposed to internally processing it first and then giving a synopsis in other than feeling messages?”

    VERY good question, Liz! Yeah, indeed, maybe it would be better to write some controversial stuff into a diary, rather than post it here? Food for thought.

  233.  #234Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:08 pm


    RE: #227 – I think almost anyone else reading my 227 would find it validating to you. But I knew it would trigger you, because all I have to do is open my mouth, as it were, and you are triggered.

    Is it my words that trigger you, or me? Or everyone?

  234.  #235Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    Oh dear, Daria! Not at all!!! (“implicitly agreed to that”) 🙁 No no no no no! I was simply quoting Lurker’s phrase and pointing out to him that with that post he was doing the very thing he was objecting to Us doing. I feel bad that it seems I was misunderstood. I very much agree with you and I Hated seeing Lurker’s follow-up comment to you – “there she goes again”) 🙁

  235.  #236Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:09 pm


    RE: #225 – That is the number of Elizabeth’s post to which you referred.

  236.  #237Daria on May 8, 2011 at 1:10 pm

    What the fuchk speak what I feel and it’s a conflict?

    Ugh this feels so fuchkin unfair.

    I feel sick!

    I feel disgusted

  237.  #238The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    #230 “What are you, Brenda, the house denmother??”

    Well, as a guy, I have to say I find girls who care for others and try to create a positive atmosphere attractive. No risk of drama with them, and caring is a very femine trait. No surprise, then, that so many guys think nurses are hot!

  238.  #239gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    Yeesh can’t we all just get along? I’m not liking the condescending tone and judgement and criticism coming towards Daria. The comments seem to be attempts to shut her up, dismiss and invalidate her point of view. I feel compassion and support for you Daria! Hugs!!

  239.  #240Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    234. Lucy

    I feel disgusted when I see you grovelling and
    justifying your words like that.


  240.  #241Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:18 pm

    238 Gina

    Don’t worry Gina, Daria is stronger than that 🙂


  241.  #242Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    I actually feel rather amused and compassionate when I see Lurker perceiving his triggers and reactions as somehow “different” and “more reasonable” than the rest of ours. I was trying to help him become more conscious and aware of his own “drama” – because, as we know, awareness is the first babystep. 🙂

  242.  #243Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    I want you to know that I respect you as a person and I respect what you write here. It was that very respect that lead me to engage with you this morning. I could have chosen not to, as I often do with people on this forum.

    Rori says, “Feel you feelings.” ” CHOOSE your words.” I tried to do that when I asked “Have you considered the possibilty that Rori’s tools that may be relatively new to you, may not be for other women who have found their way to this space?” I phrased it that way because it’s true. Not in ANY WAY a diss of you, simply a reality of having been on the planet for awhile.

    Many of us have had the same experiences, that of overfunctioning, of having assumptions, and expectations when it was “too soon” to have those with a man. Many of us have “been attached to outcome” and still struggle with that. Many of us have learned some things along the way, as you have, that have become tools we use. And we may have never “packaged” those tools, or even- given them a name. But we are willing to share what we’ve learned with someone else – especially if that someone may be struggling with something we’ve struggled with ourselves before. And some of us choose to share AND explore with other women on forums without the labeling of right – or wrong- or “my way is better than your way”.

    I have no control over how you or anyone else interprets my posts. But I do know without doubt that I felt I was speaking with you this morning as adult woman to adult woman – without any “undercurrents” of any sort.


  243.  #244Daria on May 8, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    Lucy – ok thanks for that. I also now read the comment from you that his was the first post you read.

    So that makes sense as to how you didn’t see what he was calling drama.

    I actually found lots of healing earlier today interacting w lily.

  244.  #245gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    Eww! We aren’t “friends” here, and this is more of a diary than anything. It’s a place to practice. Oooh I feel annoyed. It seems like newbies have come here full of judgement about something they don’t know much about, based on their past experiences elsewhere. But I notice that these new voices are strong and intelligent, and by attacking Daria, who usually is a dominant presence, she’s been weakened, and then regulars, like Brenda (who have seemingly felt overpowered by Daria in the past) are taking the opportunity to swipe at her while she’s down. No Bueno! this feels like Lord of the Flies chaos and competition and I don’t like it at all!

  245.  #246DE on May 8, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    Elizabeth 225:

    “i wonder though, where is it written that it is more authentic to express every little feeling I have as it arises, as opposed to internally processing it first and then giving a synopsis in other than feeling messages?”


    Why does anything has to be written to be “accepted”? Processing implies “thinking” to me…I believe the truth is only in our heart…as soon as we rationalize and explain things…we are detached from the center of our being…and therefore, the truth…

    The so “resented” feeling messages help us open the channel to our heart…

    It feels bad to be thought of as a cult…because I want to stay centered…and wow…I just realized your posts didn’t trigger me…I actually thought of u as a part of our “cult”…wow…I feel smiley…I wonder why did mine trigger u? and why do u think of yourself different than “our cult”?

    Warm hugs,

  246.  #247Sloane on May 8, 2011 at 1:25 pm


    Yes, I can try those .. that is truly how I feel.. I am so afraid to speak truthfully about how I feel as he has gotten to know me so well as someone who doesn’t gripe or get thrown off by his behavior.. and now I feel weird starting to say how it bothers me.. but clearly have let it go on too long.. I just hope it doesn’t push him away. I don’t wan to be a problem.. Ugh.. I feel patheric right now.. lol thanks for your contribution.
    And.. what I also want to say is that ” I feel missunderstood by him and that I am actually sensitive and feel hurt everyonce in awhile”… how’s that??

  247.  #248The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    #238 “The comments seem to be attempts to shut her up, dismiss and invalidate her point of view.”

    Her point of view is that she has negative feelings because others don’t do what she wants. I don’t dismiss or invalidate those feelings at all, even though they are VERY judgmental. I just raised the point if its a good idea to write about this here. I’m sorry if even this careful criticism, which didn’t mention any names, and just showed up the typical chain of events, triggered someone. Ok?

  248.  #249gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:29 pm

    Ooh kinda surprised at my own trigerredness here. Feeling like speaking for Daria, because Daria’s relationship to Brenda is similar to my relationship with my roommate. we say the same stuff to eachother – she drives me insane, and she can’t comprehend what bugs me so much about her. So we just don’t speak – we haven’t spoken in a month and it works much better that way. Because we fundamentally operate in different ways, and as much as I can feel compassion and love for her as a human being, my ego can’t stand hers. So it feels best not to engage – forget healing…it’s just a personality clash.

  249.  #250gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    Lurker, I’m here to process feelings. What are you here for?

  250.  #251Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    236 Daria, by “conflict” (notice I put it in quotes from the beginning) I only meant something like, “a current healing process where some people are feeling attack-type feelings for a variety of reasons and hopefully everyone will be able to use it all for growth and not go away and never come back.” It was for lack of a better word, to differentiate it from the processing-type that is unaccompanied by attacky-type feelings. Does that make sense? No judgment was intended.

  251.  #252Daria on May 8, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    Lily – mm well I feel happy we had that exchange as I got to heal some important stuff to me.

    I feel bad and closed off reading your question .

    I’m pretty sure Rori means choose feeling messages and don’t wants as your words.

    I don’t want to argue or feel bad like I’m pressuring you like I did earlier.

    My belief is:

    Roris tools work. They work for women of all ages and cultures. They all work. This is Roris blog and I strongly
    believe in her tools.

  252.  #253The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:33 pm

    #241 Lucy, imho “trigger” is too big a word. I’m mildly annoyed by all the avoidable brouhaha. That’s not on the same level as the oh so horrible negative feelings others write about.

    Hmm, do you think it’s humanly possible to read all the stuff here without ANY emotional reaction about the comments? Seems to be the only way not to be triggered at all.

  253.  #254DE on May 8, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    Brenda #231:

    Wow…It feels awful reading that!!! But u know what…that’s a start…baby steps should be welcomed…I think behind all the “polished” and “niceness” facade there is a big angry and judgmental vulcono…

    I don’t buy not even one minute into all this “niceness”…

    Looking forward to seeing that side of u here on the blog…

    Warm hugs,

  254.  #255The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    #249 To learn more about women, and what they look for in a relationship. And this blog is very informative in this regard, thank you.

  255.  #256The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:39 pm

    #253 DE, in that comment you’re very judgmental yourself. And you showed you’re not into niceness when you wrote that you don’t care if you trigger someone. So, what exactly is your point? It’s ok for you but not for others?

  256.  #257Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:39 pm

    245 DE

    “Why does anything has to be written to be “accepted”? Processing implies “thinking” to me…I believe the truth is only in our heart…as soon as we rationalize and explain things…we are detached from the center of our being…and therefore, the truth…”

    OK, not to get too long winded here, but…here goes…

    You’ve hit on a good point here. There is a trend in the spiritual world to reject and demonize anything that smacks of “thinking” and intellectualizing, as somehow being “less than” feelings and emotions –our true being.

    When, in truth, we have been given mental faculties for many reasons. Some people believe that reason and logic remove us from the center of our being.

    This is not so. It is our task to integrate the heart, the mind, the body and the spirit and have them work together. Babies and children and animals come from pure feeling, and while we can learn from them, as adults we have many memories and experiences and wisdom that we can’t just erase. We use them in an emotionally intelligent way, and we come full circle.

    The truth is never in the language, feeling messages or not.

    When we unhook from language completely, then there is a freedom to use language completely…yes, this is a kind of a paradox.

    Life is constantly revealing itself freshly in this moment, and it doesn’t have anything to do with “coming from the heart” or being detached from the heart or anything like that.

    OK, I have to get ready to do some ear candling now

    but I might answer to the rest of your post first



  257.  #258gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    Lurker, when triggered in the real world, I have stuffed feelings down and acted in inauthentic or defensive ways. So, I consider this a great place to PRACTICE being trigerred, and processing feelings thoroughly so that I can increase awareness and ability to sort out what’s going on for me. So, out in the real world, I can go through that inner process and communicate that which best serves the relationship. I for one, am not trying to AVOID being trigerred here.

  258.  #259Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    239 Elizabeth. Literally loling here! I feel surprised and genuinely amused to see my post labeled (judged) as “grovelling” and “justifying.” Holy cow. I feel like I just entered the Twilight Zone or a three-ring circus. In my world, what I did is called “clearing up a misunderstanding with compassion and grace.” Wow. I forgive you for judging me. I don’t want to be judged. <3

  259.  #260Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    “Why should I expend my energy in anger, when I can expend it in love?” ~ Mother Theresa

  260.  #261Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:45 pm

    “It feels bad to be thought of as a cult…because I want to stay centered…and wow…I just realized your posts didn’t trigger me…I actually thought of u as a part of our “cult”…wow…I feel smiley…I wonder why did mine trigger u? and why do u think of yourself different than “our cult”?”

    I love being a part of this group and I DON’T want it to be a cult. Seeing a group grow smaller and less accepting because of rigid rules….and perceptions that some newbies or whatever, are “resisting” the program, when that is not true…..that is what triggers me. As I understand Rori, she does not want her stuff to be blindly followed either. There is a lot of room for movement. If you read Tinque and Mercedes, they are very accepting of where people are at, and do not chastise people, ever, for not following rules and doing things a certain way.

    It feels good to express this 🙂


  261.  #262gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    Lurker I find your comments so irritating – I feel annoyed at what seems like lack of awareness.

    Not sure what this is, but lack of awareness really gets on my nerves, and I see it more in men than in women. Like I can see people working hard to get their needs met, but they are masking it under words that don’t match their obvious intentions and it makes my guts twist and turn and my blood boil.
    It’s really difficult to continue to speak in feeling messages under those circumstances – it’s hard to stay with my point of view rather than switching over to judge theirs.

  262.  #263Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:47 pm


    RE: #238 – You said, “Yeesh can’t we all just get along? I’m not liking the condescending tone and judgement and criticism coming towards Daria. The comments seem to be attempts to shut her up, dismiss and invalidate her point of view. I feel compassion and support for you Daria! Hugs!!”

    I love Daria. I have tried at every turn to express that love. I think what Jacqueline expressed about the Good Wife is valid, that people have a switch, and once it’s flipped, it’s flipped. When I try and try to get along with someone and they just prove to not have the same goal (ie, harmony and love), then I just give up.

    But I still love Daria. Just expressing my candid feelings here, and above.

  263.  #264DE on May 8, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    The Lurker #255:

    U said: “DE, in that comment you’re very judgmental yourself. ” I never said I won’t be…

    U said: “And you showed you’re not into niceness when you wrote that you don’t care if you trigger someone. ” I never said I am into niceness either…

    U said: “So, what exactly is your point? It’s ok for you but not for others?” ****

    I don’t think the purpose of us here is to “scratch each other’s backs…” Playing “nice” with “passive aggressive” and “negative emotions” NEVER promotes healing…

    Is it possible u are still “Lurking” around because u choose not to heal some “sh*t” within u????

    Arghh…I feel annoyed…

  264.  #265The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    #257 Sounds very reasonable to me. However, if you feel triggered by people at your job, you wouldn’t process that feeling in front of them, right? Especially not with FMs that would trigger them. That wouldn’t be very helpful, right?

  265.  #266Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    OK Lucy, thank you for forgiving me.
    I think it was that “no,no, no, no!” that triggered me,
    like god forbid i were to upset you Daria, and a walking on eggshells vibe…but, I will take responsibility for my own perception.



  266.  #267Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 1:51 pm

    #260 Elizabeth:

    It feels good TO READ you express this. 🙂 Thank you.

  267.  #268Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:51 pm


    RE: #244 – You said, “Eww! We aren’t “friends” here, and this is more of a diary than anything.”

    Eww! I feel bad realizing other people would not want to be friends. I like to think of us as not only friends, but sisters.

    And, every healthy relationship has disagreements. I don’t want to pet anyone’s peeves.

  268.  #269The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    #261 “It’s really difficult to continue to speak in feeling messages under those circumstances – it’s hard to stay with my point of view rather than switching over to judge theirs.”
    Indeed, it’s obviously not that easy to get the FMs right. It sure takes a lot of training. But FMs shouldn’t trigger a guy, but instead show your vulnerability and thus make him want to protect yourself. Remember, no judgment in FMs.

  269.  #270Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 1:57 pm


    RE: #246 – You said, “And.. what I also want to say is that ” I feel missunderstood by him and that I am actually sensitive and feel hurt everyonce in awhile”… how’s that??”

    That works! I felt vulnerable when I first started to use feeling messages like that. But I found they really do draw a man closer, as Rori says, not further away. Our genuineness is gutsy, and it makes a man feel safe to feel his feelings, while attracting him to our raw honesty.

    You could even say it in a moment where he hugs you (does he hug you?). This is from one of Rori’s CDs…you communicate with your body by leaning your head down, pressing it against his chest or shoulder, and holding your hand over your heart.

  270.  #271Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 1:57 pm

    220: Gina:

    You are on to something here with this statement:

    “I can trust my feelings to take me in a good direction.”

    YES! YES! YES!


  271.  #272gina on May 8, 2011 at 1:59 pm

    I never said that you gotta follow “the rules.” Lord knows I don’t (probably would be better off if i did, though)! I just don’t like people invalidating Daria’s pov because of their age etc, because she’s on here “working” through stuff according to Rori’s program for hours nearly every day. So, she’s not some authority, as in “boss” – but she has developed a sort of expertise purely as a result of the work she has put in. I understand that coming into a situation, hearing people communicate in an unusual way could be uncomfortable and incite judgement, and I’m just saying, that she’s gone far down a path that the rest of us haven’t. She’s worked hard to get there and I felt defensive when I perceived she was being disrespected and judged.

  272.  #273Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 1:59 pm

    #267 Brenda:
    ” I don’t want to pet anyone’s peeves.”

    Ha ha! Good one. Apparently triggering someone’s peeves is the inevitable result of posting anything honest here. I guess the question becomes whose peeves does one choose to pet?

  273.  #274Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    266 Lily T

    Thank you Lily. I feel more “included” again.



  274.  #275Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    271. Gina

    can you work with these triggers within yourself, instead of distracting yourself by defending Daria ?


  275.  #276gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    Lurker, I am not enjoying this interaction. going for a run. thanks for all the triggers.

  276.  #277Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    Thanks, Elizabeth, that feels better.

  277.  #278gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    Hmm..okay, Elizabeth. I feel annoyed by what seems to be a snarky tone, and doubly annoyed by the hugs and kisses that follow.

    And Elizabeth, I’d rather know what’s going on with you rather than read provocation.

  278.  #279Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 2:05 pm


    RE: #253 – Read some of the back threads, and you will see me at my angry, volcanic best!

    I am real, if I am nothing else. And that is why I am here. I was raised in a home with almost nonstop yelling and criticism, so you are right on! One boyfriend told me I can fight with my tongue as some men fight with their fists!

    My exhusband, who I have known and loved for 11 years, and we are closer than ever, told me not just any man could handle me. But for him, I am the last woman he will ever have. He said no woman he has ever known compares with me, and he doesn’t WANT another woman, even tho I have repeatedly offered to place personal ads for him while he’s in prison.

    I know who I am, and I like who I am. I am here because I don’t want to relate in constant, nasty anger. I want to learn to express myself lovingly and tactfully.

    But just let me know if you’d like to see the volcano erupt…it cums quite naturally to me.

    But I know I got a heart of gold. And it’s open to anyone who would like to be loved by me.

  279.  #280The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    #271 Uh, Gina, did you maybe miss #166? Judgment leads to judgment. That’s the problem, imho.

  280.  #281Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 2:09 pm


    Included in what Liz – strong voiced, intelligent newbies resistant to things they know nothing about? 😉

  281.  #282Daria on May 8, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    Thanks Gina
    I wouldn’t dwell on valentines day. Just let yourself feel what you feel inthe moment whether it’s angry or open

  282.  #283The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    #275 “Lurker, I am not enjoying this interaction.”
    I’m a bit sad to read that, Gina. I tried my best to get the discussion back to general points about FMs, and away from drama, in #264 and #268. Sorry that it didn’t work out.

  283.  #284Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    Better not hug and kiss me Elizabeth – you are annoying Gina.

    Wait though! It’s okay because Gina comes here specifically to be triggered. So I guess it’s alright.

    xxxooo Back at ya Babe.

  284.  #285Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Lurker, but why judge it as “avoidable brouhaha”? Seems to me that judging it thus is simply contributing to the very thing you are judging. 🙂

  285.  #286Daria on May 8, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Brenda I just read a Rori e letter about how being authentic is not about baring your past but rather the in the moment feelings without judging them.

    I’m not sure, it may be the one I cut pasted most of above.

  286.  #287gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    Hmm…interesting Daria…I guess I feel like I should close myself off to him since I want to judge him as a jerk. But really I just feel sad underneath. I feel a little devastated to be ignored and left by him. And for some reason to accept that I wouldn’t be best served to just hold on to this anger and hold it against him if/when I hear from him, just brings a rush of sadness and vulnerability. I guess that’s an attractive way to be. And yet I still feel strong that I don’t want to accept bad behavior. Okay, thanks very much – I see what you mean.

  287.  #288Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    I really do love using practicing the feeling messages though.

    I love how vulnerable they make me feel, although I do feel vulnerable much of the time, anyway.

    Yet I am still aware of the importance of being able to discern when it’s appropriate to use them and when not so much.

    They do get me in touch with my core, especially when I am feeling off balance, confused, angry or some other emotion that is hooking me and making me assign praise or blame.

    I think one of the more valuable discussions here for me, resulted in arriving at the realization that feeling messages can be just as judgmental and blamey, when I am the Object of it, meaning I am responding to something I perceived as someone doing “to me”.

    When that switch flips and I know that people are mostly coming from their own perceptions, but they are most likely not doing it to intentionally hurt me, then I can state my feeling as the subject, taking responsibility for my perception.

    And then I have the freedom to make a fully informed choice as to whether or not I want certain behaviors in my life. What is it serving?



  288.  #289Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    277. Gina,

    Well that’s just it Gina, you are reading it as provocation rather than what’s going on with me.

    I can’t help you there, you’re on your own, babe!


  289.  #290Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 2:24 pm

    Well I didn’t get caught up on the thread but I have to go do stuff while I have a bit of masculine energy to do it with, so ttyl everyone. <3

  290.  #291The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 2:24 pm

    #285 Ok, ok, Lucy, that’s a point. But then, I’m a man. And this blog is about relationships. So, isn’t it actually helpful if every now and then a man steps in here and points out of that stuff some Sirens are doing isn’t working, but backfiring? Hmm.

    I have more thoughts about this, but I rather no post them because they would only add to all those triggers. Would be nice to have a discussion with you some day. I like the way you make your points. You don’t trigger me negatively at all.

  291.  #292DE on May 8, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    I paid close attention to the dynamics on the blog for many months now…

    Because of Daria’s strength, commitment to truth and honesty…and yes, expressed anger and frustration towards many “Sirens” here…including myself…the changes happened…just amazing…like overnite changes…

    usually, people stop for a while, go on “processing”…and then, come back stronger and more open and committed to open their hearts and express from a more vulnerable place…

    Her power stands in her amazing ability to connect with our energies…and thus “read” us…there is no “go around” about it…

    And yes, other coaches here have their gifts as well…just different gifts…each one appeals to different groups…

    I don’t feel Daria’s passion as expressed here is understood and appreciated for what is worth…

    Seeing paragraphs full of “psychological” bubble gum full of “logic” and “explanations” as a “rebuttal” to her “expression” does not promote acceptance either…

  292.  #293Daria on May 8, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    I’m feeling drained and kinda beat up… And kinda good.

    I love myself and my feelings.


  293.  #294Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 2:26 pm


    Sounds just like my sister.

    And that is the kind of condescending bullshit that triggers me.

  294.  #295Daria on May 8, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    Yay Gina! Awesome! Yes u are strong And vulnerable!

  295.  #296Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    292: You are loved, Daria and I have learned so much about healing from you.

  296.  #297Sloane on May 8, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    Cool.. thank you.. I like the hugging one.. if I can be present enough to say something I will.. ususally I am so nervous that I just say hi.. I’m fine.. rather than taking a breathe.. he’s not one to really give a lot of space for speaking.. he is toxic.. I am aware i am dealing with someone less than healthy.. so It is a bit more difficult.. but I will continue to use FM and go that distance for my sake and for my growth.
    Thank You..

  297.  #298gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    This whole thing has gotten icky I guess because we got all into eachothers stuff (myself included). It feels best to be on here when we are sharing our own feelings and situations and we support eachother. When I say I’m not trying to avoid being trigerred, I just mean it’s good when powerful feelings come up cause I know I can learn from them. But it doesn’t feel good to get all caught up in judging eachother (whether that judgement is in the form of feeling messages or otherwise).

  298.  #299DE on May 8, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    Brenda #278:

    “But just let me know if you’d like to see the volcano erupt…it cums quite naturally to me. ”

    Yes, that would feel good …

    Warm hugs,

  299.  #300Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 2:40 pm

    Thank you Lurker, that feels good to read. I hear that you want to help. I wonder if studying Rori’s “boy voice” might help you tweak your communication with us so that we can hear you better. What do you think? Gotta go now. Later gators.

  300.  #301gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    I’m sorry, shouldn’t have accused you of provoking. I did feel strongly about wanting to defend Daria. I don’t think I was distracting from my own stuff, I felt fueled by it – I hate it when I’m judged for where I’m at by somebody who’s got a whole different approach, past and intention. And it’s difficult on here, because I feel torn between wanting to “argue” and wanting to stick with feeling messages – sometimes I see that I end up using feeling messages in order to argue and it doesn’t really work.

  301.  #302Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    P.s. I didn’t mean to imply that you “should be like Rori” – not at all – just that she’s really good at navigating tricky situations and we can All learn from that. 🙂

  302.  #303Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    291 DE

    Sounds like you are triggered now, DE,

    but I would like to share with you that I do hear you and agree with some of what you said here

    I would hope that Daria knows that I fully believe that she does have a gift, is very self-aware, and that I appreciate and understand what she is about and have personally benefitted from her gift, although I can’t objectively agree that she is always on the money.

    She’s a bit radical in her approach, making it less “inclusive”, which is what annoys me at times, but that has its own value.


  303.  #304The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 2:45 pm

    #299 Hmm, Lucy, don’t I always have a “boy voice”, as a guy? But I’m always interested in improving my communication skills. Will check the archive here for stories about this.

    See you later, hon!

  304.  #305gina on May 8, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    Lily T., I don’t know what to say…I did get argumentative, and I don’t blame you for giving it back to me. It doesn’t feel very good though, and I hope that the dynamics can clear up. What do you think?

  305.  #306Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 2:52 pm


    RE: #285 – You said, “Brenda I just read a Rori e letter about how being authentic is not about baring your past but rather the in the moment feelings without judging them.”

    Thank you, I realize that. My purpose in mentioning my past nonstop diet of yelling and criticism wasn’t so much to bare my past but to say I can criticize and yell very well!

    But I don’t want to. I want to be soft and loving…while still genuine.

  306.  #307Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 2:53 pm


    I agree this afternoon of sirens sniping at each other doesn’t feel good at all. Maybe since so many of us have “let off a little steam” we can get back to the process of learning and healing. I hope so. Peace.

  307.  #308Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 2:54 pm


    RE: #290 – You said, “But then, I’m a man. And this blog is about relationships. So, isn’t it actually helpful if every now and then a man steps in here and points out of that stuff some Sirens are doing isn’t working, but backfiring?”

    Right on! Thank you for your lurkful feedback!

  308.  #309Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 2:55 pm


    RE: #291 – You said, “I don’t feel Daria’s passion as expressed here is understood and appreciated for what is worth…”

    Right on! I agree, and I have learned so much from Daria!

  309.  #310The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 2:58 pm

    #307 Hehe, “lurkful feedback”!
    Brenda, it’s always fun talking to you. Hey, you know how important it’s for us guys that a girl shows humor? It’s a great plus.

  310.  #311Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:01 pm


    RE: #298 – You said, “Brenda #278:

    “But just let me know if you’d like to see the volcano erupt…it cums quite naturally to me. ”

    Yes, that would feel good …

    Warm hugs,”

    LOL! I hate life! I feel a tidal wave of anger ready to flow over its banks so often! I don’t wanna be alive! I think this world is cold, harsh, and evil, and I feel like I have a life sentence on earth. I feel so disappointed with life.

    I wish I felt free to bare my heart here, really bare it, but I feel misunderstood so much and I am way too vulnerable already. So I save it for Kenny and a few close friends who “get” me.

    Sometimes I just wanna scream, and sometimes I just wanna cry. I feel so full of pain. I feel weary of being misunderstood, and weary of trying and not making the grade. I feel angry about society and all its foolish conventions. I feel angry at the government for being way too controlling.

    I guess you’ll hafta really insult me to get me really going. 🙂

  311.  #312Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:02 pm


    RE: 309 – Thanks! 🙂

  312.  #313Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    i want to tell lurker he is a f*ggot pr*ck who should find some place to pick on men instead of being a b*tch here.

    this is obviously me needing to handle my anger differently. suggestions?

  313.  #314Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    300. Gina

    Hey Gina, no worries, it’s all good.
    we’re all learning and growing 🙂

    as for me and my recent past situation, i have made a conscious choice to let go of any hurt and enjoy life to the fullest going forward, putting full trust in myself to attract and accept the exact right man for me, without any doubts and no matter how many i have to go thru 😉


  314.  #315Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:09 pm


    How rude! I would feel awful if I were Lurker. Maybe if you think about his feelings you could handle it a little differently? How bout…

    I don’t feel safe on the blog with men here.

    I don’t get it. I like Lurker’s feedback. I don’t think he’s trying to do anything but learn and give us honest feedback. Wow, now that’s a volcano! 😆

  315.  #316Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    I have taken huge steps this week in healing this situation with my sister and am in the mode of practicing forgiveness.

    I think that the dynamics are forever changed between us and I also think that is a good thing. My boundaries are firm (thank you for helping me to learn it’s okay to have boundaries in all areas of life) and I am strong.

    I know practicing forgiveness isn’t the same as full on forgiveness but it is a step in the right direction and towards where I want to be.

    Practicing forgiveness isn’t bad is it?

  316.  #317The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:10 pm

    #312 Yeah, obviously, the wording has to be improved!
    First ask yourself, what are you trying to achieve? And then phrase your statement accordingly.

    Btw, if you think I picked on anybody here, you will have dire problems in getting along with most guys.

  317.  #318The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:12 pm

    #314 I don’t feel awful, Brenda. I think that ridiculous outburst is rather funny. Don’t be concerned.

  318.  #319Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:12 pm


    When I feel triggered by men, I remind myself that boy have penises, and girls have vaginas. And that boys like to stick their penises in girls’ vaginas.

    Then I remember why I like boys so much! 😆

  319.  #320Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    “Btw, if you think I picked on anybody here, you will have dire problems in getting along with most guys.

    I do not want to be criticized, even if they’re hypothetical, conditional criticisms.

  320.  #321Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:14 pm


    RE: #317 – LOL! And that’s another thing I remind myself of, that boys tend to take things in stride much moreso than girls. Case in point.

    I like boys. Thus I want to learn how to relate well. So I can marry a boy with a penis. 😆

  321.  #322Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 3:15 pm

    317: The Lurker says:

    #314 I don’t feel awful, Brenda. I think that ridiculous outburst is rather funny. Don’t be concerned.

    It struck me as funny, too…but I like how she expressed an intense feeling in a crude way, but had the immediate self awareness to know in the moment that it wasn’t at all a useful way to express that. Kudos!


  322.  #323Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    I realize i have an extremely dryyyy sense of humor, but it was a serious question.

    that is my first reaction.

    i’m not sure what to do with it. it doesn’t feel good.

    lurker, you making sarcastic butthurt comments to me every step of the way or labeling me as ridiculous or criticizing me is not going to help me figure this one out.

    i just want to fight:( i am thinking of all sorts of things i can say to prove my point, to make him wrong, ESPECIALLY stuff i could say that would allow me to be like “don’t judge ME. look at YOU hurting us.”

    i could probably go on for hours

    i’m too smart for my own good:(

    quiet, brain.

  323.  #324Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    At moments like this, I find this blog entertaining.

    But that’s cuz I’m in a black mood. Other times I feel vulnerable and hurt. Right now I think almost anything is funny.

  324.  #325Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:19 pm

    how do i feel? i dunno..protective. attacked. defensive. like HOW DARE YOU. but how dare you surely is not a feeling.
    bah, i am stumped. i dunno what i’m freaking feeling! just ready to beat his ass ghetto style to teach him a lesson. but i know that is the product of many layers of transformation from the core feeling underneath this all.

    i don’t know what i’m feeling! that is probably why this is always a damn big deal for me. i would like to heal this, thank you

  325.  #326The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    #320 Right, Brenda! That’s something you should check before marriage. And take care it’s not a “f*ggot pr*ck”!

    For the record: I respect gays and get along well with them. I support gay marriage. And I never use the word “f*ggot” in my own words. However, imho a gay bf is probably not the best choice for a hetereo girl who wants a monogamous marriage, including sex.

  326.  #327Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:27 pm


    RE: #324 – In all sincerity and kindness, is it possible that you have post-traumatic stress syndrome for all your lacks in childhood? If I remember correctly, you were raised without a father, right?

    What you described in the past left me feeling so sad for you, and I just wanted to wrap you in love.

  327.  #328tinque on May 8, 2011 at 3:32 pm

    “However, if you feel triggered by people at your job, you wouldn’t process that feeling in front of them, right? Especially not with FMs that would trigger them. That wouldn’t be very helpful, right?”

    Processing on the job may not be the best choice (though it would be doable depending on the situation). It is part if the purpose of this forum whether one uses it as their own personal diary, letting it all spew out, or whether it’s working through triggers with each other, or to connect in some way.


  328.  #329The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:33 pm

    #319 “I do not want to be criticized”, sez the girl who just called me a “f*ggot pr*ck”. Uh huh.

    “lurker, you making sarcastic butthurt comments to me every step of the way”
    Dorothea, words have consequences! Maybe you should read Rori’s stories about this. If you don’t want to be criticized, avoid insulting people. That would help a lot. Come on, do you act like that in real life?

    Ok, now, seriously, where did your outburst come from? What, exactly, triggered it? There may be something to be learned in this.

  329.  #330tinque on May 8, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Lilybelle – Who says you have to forgive? Isn’t acceptance good enough? And what does forgiving look like anway?


    PS – I almost hit submit and had your name as lilybelly lol

  330.  #331Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Maybe, Brenda.

    i still am not sure what it feels like tho:P

    i feel heavy and sad, but i think that’s just the beer, hotwings, and fish and chips i just grubbed down on.

  331.  #332Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 3:36 pm


    I thought much of what you wrote was in the vein “Lighten up Ladies” :).

    Strange day. Maybe there is something about Mother’s Day that contributed to people being “trigger happy”?

    I just finished eating shrimp scampi with my parents that I cooked. We had a wonderful day filled with family visits and calls. I feel good. I feel real good.

  332.  #333The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    #327 “It is part if the purpose of this forum whether one uses it as their own personal diary”
    Right, Tinque, and I’m aware of that. However, problems start when Sirens talk about triggers that were “pulled” by other Sirens on this blog. That’s what I was hinting at with talking about the workspace. Talking about being triggered by others, in front of them, without carefully phrased FMs, will very often lead to an escalation. Triggers lead to triggers.

  333.  #334tinque on May 8, 2011 at 3:39 pm

    triggers lead to triggers – yes they can, but they don’t have to. again another purpose of this blog.


  334.  #335Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:41 pm

    Yay Tinque~ I’m so happy you are here. I was just sitting in here thinking about the very question you just asked me..

    I think that it is acceptance. Forgiveness is my stuff, meaning that I am still stuck on that belief that if I don’t forgive her then what I desire will be forever withheld from me. So I think I have to completely forgive in order to receive. Where did this belief come from, I ask myself.

    I think that given the situation, acceptance IS as close to forgiveness as I can get.

    Lilybelly.. 😉

  335.  #336Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:42 pm


    I am dying for a good recipe for Scampi.



  336.  #337Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm

    Lurker, i didn’t ACTUALLY call you that.
    (everything below this point is not addressed to you)

    right now with lurker i feel like i’m getting roped into a never ending battle that will be a spiral of nastiness. i feel pitted against a force as big as my own. i am going to sob tears if i think about it too long. it is so obvious to me how much he is escalating and picking at things, but then i just escalate and get so upset in an effort to show a man that he is doing that.

    it is the worst trap ever:(

    i feel so sad:(

    what i feel/see happening with lurker, or where it could go, is a mirror of how my male love relationships go all fo the time.

    i am feeling so terrified lurker is going to say something, and it is going to make me feel even more desperately depressed, and i take it personally like he is hoping to hurt me, and it is just bad bad bad.

    i’m stuck here:( like every day:( with my guys. this is a hard way to live. i am trying so hard to keep things happy and healthy at least on my end with my current guy. i don’t want to feed the beast.

    i am sobbing. i don’t want this anymore. i feel like i’m going to fall apart into irreparable shreds if i go though this anymore.

  337.  #338Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm

    355: Okay, maybe not dying for it. 😉

  338.  #339Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    Hi Lil.

    I used Ina Garten’s – The Barefoot Contessa from the Food Network.

    You can find it on the internet – that’s what my Mom did.

    Turned out great, but I’m burping garlic. I guess it’s fortunate I’m alone lol.

  339.  #340The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    #333 Well, I hope you read the comments starting at #166, Tinque. I didn’t start any argument. I only showed up how one thing lead to another after the back and forth had already started. Pls no misunderstanding about that.

  340.  #341Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:46 pm


    Thanks for the lead! Can’t wait to try it!


  341.  #342The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    #336 “Lurker, i didn’t ACTUALLY call you that.”
    And, of course, I believe you, and not my own lying eyes who see comment #312!
    Dorothea, just as an advice, when you think loudly in public, you can’t tell people they shouldn’t have listened to that! Ok, you can, but it’s not going to make much sense.

  342.  #343Brenda on May 8, 2011 at 3:51 pm


  343.  #344The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 3:53 pm

    #336 No misunderstanding, Dorothea, I won’t weigh in on what you wrote “below this point”. I respect that. Hope the Sirens can help you with your input.

  344.  #345Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 3:54 pm


    Dorothea is clearly working through some issues that she has and pointed that out. It would feel good if she was shown some compassion and understanding.



  345.  #346Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:57 pm

    no! i said i want to tell you those things! i didn’t actually say lurker, this is how you are, so go f*ck yourself. i am trying to work through something so back the f*ck off.

    see what i am working through?:(

    this is why i cry every day. i get wrapped up into this. i don’t believe that lurker or my guy are f*ckin idiot assh*les, so i figure it’s something i’m doing. but they feed it like i feed it. what am i supposed to do? walk away from everyone with my nose in the air?

    i feel so confused and sad and pissed pissed pissed and embarrassed that i’m spending another day crying.

    and it’s not lurker’s fault!!! just in case anyone is reading into what i’m saying (aggghhhi feel so angry that people read into what i’m saying!! i know what i mean! i don’t want people to use me for their desire to feel victimized all the time!
    ugh maybe i do that too!

    ahhhhhhhhh i feel dark and i’m falling

  346.  #347Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 3:58 pm

    *missed important quotation placement:

    no! i said i want to tell you those things! i didn’t actually say “lurker, this is how you are, so go f*ck yourself.” i am trying to work through something so back the f*ck off.

  347.  #348The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 4:01 pm

    #344 Lily, I understand that, but Dorothea said I should keep out of the discussion about her problem, and I respect that. I hope you Sirens can help her.

  348.  #349Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 4:04 pm



    I don’t know if you realize this just yet, but by doing lots of crying, you are also healing yourself. Little by little, day by day until one day, you wake up and realize that you aren’t crying. It all of a sudden happens, takes a lot of work. Believe me, I know how much work you are doing and how much work crying is.

    Work it out girl, you are doing great and I just want to offer this one additional thing…

    There is no time limit here for crying. Please don’t think yourself foolish or stupid or beat yourself up for crying some more. And please, do not be embarrassed. Please be gentle with yourself.


  349.  #350Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 4:06 pm

    Thank you, lilybelle – your comment made me feel so safe

    i wish my guy would make me feel that safe. he kind of gives me the opposite tho. blah. but that’s okay cuz i’m saying no to that.

  350.  #351Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 4:12 pm

    Really, Dorothea, it has to be about how YOU feel, not about what he thinks, not about what you wish he would do, you know? And when THAT switch gets turned on, you won’t even believe how good you’ll feel. I promise you that.

    I will continue to keep you safe until you feel strong enough to feel safe on your own. You are close, I can feel it. Don’t stop now, keep feeling it…all of it.

    I’d like to suggest a hot shower or a soak in the tub.. Actually, a shower where you can really bawl your eyes out and noone will really know what the hell is going on. You know, the gut wrenching sobbing kind of bawling.

    I think when I went through all my stuff in February, I should have done the shower sob. I laid on the kitchen floor, curled up in a ball, sobbing my eyes out. The neighbors probably thought I was killing myself in here. I wasn’t, just had a broken heart. 😉


  351.  #352Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 4:14 pm

    I also realized, my kitchen floor needed cleaning.


  352.  #353Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    ohhh my neighbors are going to be relieved when i move:P

    i did the shower sob yesterday. i think what i am going to do now is…my laundry. and meditate. and watch documentaries. and rub my feet.

    thank you for the encouragement.

  353.  #354Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 4:18 pm

    352 – LOL

  354.  #355Daria on May 8, 2011 at 4:18 pm

    Dorothea wow I feel excited about you healing your trigger! And loved that you feel protective of me.

    I feel excited that these steps you’re taking to share your feelings are gonna super shift this for you!

  355.  #356Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 4:21 pm

    Poor Lurker has been made into the mascot for my trigger.

    Right now I feel like what would make me feel “okay” again is if lurker said “oh dorothea, you are hurting so bad, i’m sorry you have this hurt in your life, hug”

    is that weird?
    i often crave this sort of “fix” from my man too.
    i crave compassion and support biiiig time.

  356.  #357tinque on May 8, 2011 at 4:22 pm

    “if I don’t forgive her then what I desire will be forever withheld from me”


    Holding grudges though is a whole other thing. This creates blocks in you (it’s a holding on, and wherever you hold, there is no flow), so the good stuff has trouble getting through.

  357.  #358tinque on May 8, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    Lurker – “I didn’t start any argument.”

    I know you didn’t, and I’m not saying that you did, just putting words to how the process sometimes works.


  358.  #359tinque on May 8, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    Lilybelly – I was just going to say lots of garlic, salt and pepper, and a bit of fresh basil if you like it as I do, but Barefoot Contessa writes good cookbooks, great suggestion.


  359.  #360Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 4:27 pm


  360.  #361tinque on May 8, 2011 at 4:30 pm

    dorothea – It sounds to me like you are doing some very deep healing or processing. The sobs are a wrenching out of some old and deeply embedded stuff. This is good, really, really good, might feel horrible, but it is GOOD. Hang in, and sending you BIG hugs.


  361.  #362The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    #357 Thx, Tinque! I’m sorry that this resulted in putting oil into the flames.

  362.  #363Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 4:34 pm


    “Rubbish” Perfect, that I understand.

    Thank you, Tinque.


  363.  #364Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 4:45 pm

    303 Lurker. Lol, that’s not what I meant. Sorry I wasn’t clear. I meant that Rori uses “boy voice” when she writes to us as a coach – that is, she advises, suggests, explains, etc., which is what I hear you wanting to do too – and she has found a way, personally, to do this without judging and triggering us. So I thought maybe you would want to study how she writes to us as a “boy voice” model for writing in a non-triggering way. Yes, you do already write to us in “boy voice” – and you could tweak you

  364.  #365Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    (cont’d) could tweak your boy voice to be less triggering so that we can more readily receive from you. Is that more clear? <3

  365.  #366The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 4:51 pm

    #355 Hmm, Dorothea, I feel like I’m walking on eggshells now, but imho it would be helpful for you to learn about the male pov on this. And the next paragraph is really my honest opiniion, no sarcasm in that:

    Arguments happen. In relationships, too. This doesn’t necessarily have to be bad, reducing tensions is necessary (still, FMs are the better, non confrontational way to do this, imho). What’s important after an argument is to apologize for insults. Those apologies have to be honest, coming from within you, and phrased in a way that convinces the other side that you’re serious. Experience shows that apologies that avoid the word “sorry” or “I apologize” don’t work well. Also, men don’t like to be called “poor” whoever, that’s generally not the way we want to be seen. Remember, how you communicate influences the responses! Ok?

    Ok, having said that, I’ll take your “mascot” sentence as an apology. Dorothea, what you wrote about your relationship moved me, and I really feel sorry about the hurt you feell! I hope you’ll make progress in healing, and also with Rori’s tools. And I’m crossing fingers that this will lead to a better relationship for you.

  366.  #367Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 5:01 pm

    319 Dorothea. I feel good reading your “don’t want” statement. I haven’t yet read past that post but I see you have written more… hugs for you… (((Dorothea))) <3

  367.  #368The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 5:04 pm

    #364 More clear! Thx, Lucy.

  368.  #369Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 5:07 pm

    322 Dorothea. Haha! I hear ya sister! —> “too smart for my own good.” I have actually had three different men in the past say that about me! (not men I dated – two were in ministry with me at church, and one was a doctor treating my daughter.)

  369.  #370Daria on May 8, 2011 at 5:08 pm

    Feeling tired and good from hiking in Tahoe. I feel cool to have been able to blog while siteseeing and do what I want. Feeling sleepy.

  370.  #371Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 5:19 pm

    Lilybelly 🙂 To me, forgiveness means simply letting go of seeking revenge. It has been a very powerful thing in my life. I feel glad you are healing all this stuff. <3

  371.  #372The Lurker on May 8, 2011 at 5:28 pm

  372.  #373Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 5:32 pm

    #370 Lucy:
    “To me, forgiveness means simply letting go of seeking revenge.”

    I like this very much. I’ve never actually sought revenge, but when I finally stopped having “revenge fantasies” about an ex, it felt very freeing. Might even say closure? smile.

  373.  #374Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 5:42 pm

    RE 333 “they don’t have to. again another purpose of this blog.”

    I like that message Tinque but for the most part I think it is a message that is lost on our consciousness for the most part. Trigger happiness seems like the name of the game here. I have heard another coach speak about building in the pause before reacting but it seems to me that this place is just to practice being triggered. That is aside from LG and jilly for the most part. Sometimes I long for lighthearted positive vibes that provide that extra boost of energy though I have a riproaring burst of laugher on Dorothea’s “beat him ghetto style”.

  374.  #375Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 5:42 pm

    Hi everyone,

    I have 372 posts to catch up on here, and just caught up on the other thread, but wanted to say Happy Mother’s Day to all the moms out there, just in case I don’t make it through all the comments before midnight 🙂

  375.  #376Jacqueline on May 8, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    Wow…that was amazing to watch. The human interaction and the authenticity were amazing. The taking up SPACE here was something….the all points of view and the kitchen sink too felt like a boiling pot…that didn’t boil over! Very cool.

    And Brenda – huge bouquets of roses and a white Teddy Bear to you for mothering all the babies…
    and not in the same was DE said, that it would “feel” good – but I would love to see you take that space up here as well. Really go into the soup, show your rawness and woundedness and cry. It’s been way too long. Somehow you have felt boxed and bow tied and I know that’s not you – you are uncontainable.

    But I love what you said about your heart.

    I heart you – and you Lucy – and you and you and you…yall!!

    xo hugs

  376.  #377Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 5:53 pm


    Lucy, (I have this urge, every time I type your name, to call you Luce..I suppose because when I am writing to you, I really am talking to you so…)

    I feel good too. And, even better because I don’t seek revenge at all.

    I feel happy. It’s really quite amazing and powerful, as you suggested. And I have grown so much over the last few months.

    I think that this may be the last you all hear about this particular issue.

    Can I get a Whoo Hoo?

    Lilybelly (the poster formerly known as Lilybelle) 🙂

  377.  #378Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 5:55 pm

    Dorothea what struck me reading your comments is that you come across tough so I am wondering if you had to be because your dad was not around to stand up for you?

    It also seems that you argue back and forth I am wondering if you have ever tried just to drop the thought, drop the arguing, just litteraly drop it? Do you think that would come across as weak?

    You might have also written it in the past but have you ever cried in front of the man? Do you believe this is weak?

    I am also wondering if you were the eldest in your family and had to protect your siblings or your mom?

    These are just some thoughts/questions that I am wondering if you wonder about could lead you to some answers that might help.

  378.  #379Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 5:58 pm

    Lilybelle reading your comments I get the sense that seeking revenge is draining and exerting a lot of energy; forgiveness feels like just a intellectual to make and feels like releasing energy that can be redirected to self. It feels like shifting the focus from external to interal.

  379.  #380Lilybelle on May 8, 2011 at 6:04 pm

    Someone who wrote to me, has this in his profile. It is my all time favorite conversation ever…

    “I want you to get swept away… I want you to levitate…to sing with rapture… to dance like a dervish…be deliriously happy…or at least let yourself open to be. I know it’s a cornball thing…but love is passion…obsession… something you can’t live without. I say fall head over heels…find somebody you can love like crazy…and will love you the same way back. How do you find him/her? Well …you forget your head and listen to your heart. The truth is there is no sense living your life without this…to make the journey and not fall deeply in love…well…you haven’t lived a life at all. But you have to try…because if you haven’t tried you haven’t lived!!!! Therefore…stay open…who knows lightning could strike.”

    This is from “Meet Joe Black” and is Anthony Hopkins talking to his daughter….


  380.  #381Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:07 pm

    Hi Kindred Spirits !
    Esp Lily T and Elizabeth …all We Who Dare.

    Its not who is rowing the boat always , its sometimes about who is rocking it.

    I totally agree with that excellent discussion LilyT about this Way being the traditional come back around again and its what my mother did and grandmother. I was raised to expect men to come to me , date me and pay for me , plan and carry through and look after me.

    But with the 70’s and the womens movement and the birth control pill it all flipped upside down .

    Suddenly men didnt want to row any more because they had FREEDOM to date forever , with free sex whenever they want pretty much .

    I see a whole crop of new problems arose then . Sti’s, later and later births and resulting IVF etc, but worst of all , I see women who LOST THEIR SELF ESTEEM. This happens imho because women are designed to easily love emotionally , and sex and orgasm causes attachment. So with sexual freedom , women get to attach emotionally all the more until he sees it happen , hes not attached yet and he feels fear at losing his freedom and ..woops …there he goes!!! Out that door as fast as his Nikes will carry him.

    Isnt that what most have experienced here? The amazing Houdini? Then the lost self that follows?

    I think Rori’s way is an alternative, go back to traditional roles ..yep you gotta give up SOME freedoms if you want it to work ..(freedom to initiate all the time etc..) , then wait and see if you can attract into your life a man who relishes that kind of reworked femininity like he knew in his childhood if hes my age.

    Harder for the younger women indeed , the younger guys EXPECT freedom and to stay single a lot more , they may not have many role models of alternative ways. The advent of internet porn and internet dating are hugely influential here, but that would take another essay 🙂

    Maybe its a case of tempting them into the boat by Sirenising yourself , then leaning back on your cushions and making it clear you dont do oars . This means , inho again, not doing sex either , not till he has rowed that boat a good way!

    You will lose quite a few over the side. The ones who dont want to row anywhere, just want a good time among the cushions without even leaving the pier.
    I see increasingly that THIS IS A GOOD THING for me at my age. I want a heavy duty LTR , hes gotta row somewhere first.

    So sex , that we fought so hard to be free to have freely , is now a liability if you give it away easily to friends ..the birth of the F*** buddy FWB movement ..

    AAAAGHHH..Triggers me so much . That is the same thing as playing Russian Roulette with your heart..IF you are female.
    It is physiologically very difficult for a woman to have FWB relationships and NOT fall in love with him, at least a little. Her self esteem is in a High Risk Zone.

    So , back full circle to sexual conservatism and letting him pay , and TELLING him how I like to be treated and that i am dating as FRIENDS until a special man steps up for a special relationship with me…well its working for me. I have a few good quality CD’s of my age or a bit younger , all of whom seem to get this very easily . Who knows if they are getting easy sex elsewhere after dates , or have a stable of FWB’s ..who cares???

    As long as I know I will never be in a stable of mares again, i am happy 🙂

    Comments welcome.

  381.  #382Jacqueline on May 8, 2011 at 6:08 pm

    Lucy – how was the play etc. How was mother’s day?

    And I have the urge to sing you a song from Blood Sweat and Tears…but not sure you wanna be playful right now???

  382.  #383Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:10 pm

    Ooops , I lost the bit about how this is ok to modify as per Lily’s suggestions re life experience , age etc..

    I see Roris stuff as an excellent guidebook ,and will reduce the risk of getting lost and increase the chance of enjoying the journey . Its not the only Map to the Territory though and we all need to explore the lie of the land at our own pace.

  383.  #384Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 6:14 pm

    Whoo Hoo Lilybelly! 🙂

  384.  #385Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 6:21 pm

    RE 371 Thanks for posting that link Lurker. I particularly like the statements “There’s no end to how you can move from feeling bad to feeling good WITHOUT having to RELEASE all the pent-up energy into the world, and onto other people.
    If you allow the dark to BE there, the light will just creep up on you.
    It’s when we try to stuff DOWN the dark that it spews out all over everyone and our lives.:

    I understand that as choosing not to stuff, one can choose to notice and by noticing the dark feeling it gets acknowledged and as such not stuffed down. I like that I do not have to choose to spew. For me that is growth because I used to spew all the time not even noticing how I am really feeling. I feel really thrilled about this growth and when people tell me that they notice the growth I feel proud of myself and no, I don’t seek validation.

  385.  #386Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 6:23 pm

    #380 Rosa,

    That was fun to read. I like your style. 🙂

  386.  #387Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 6:24 pm

    Rosa I know there was no pun intended but I am hoping you meant “lay of the land”. I totally like what you wrote in 382. I don’t like feeling restricted by rules because I tend to unconsciously want to break them as it feels restrictive or constricting.

  387.  #388Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:26 pm

    Know I didnt ,”lie of the land” is the idiom where i live , just as Sirenise has no Z 🙂

  388.  #389Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    And no , know should have no k , you know?

  389.  #390Rosa on May 8, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    Off to the hairdresser ..yippee !

  390.  #391Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 6:35 pm

    Tinque maybe some of us understand forgiveness as the release of grudges. Noticing internally that we are holding one to the point of seeing the person hurt. Forgiveness might be letting go of the right you might feel you deserve to see that person hurt.

  391.  #392Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Lurker thanks for “Experience shows that apologies that avoid the word “sorry” or “I apologize” don’t work well.”

    I recently experienced “I guess I should apologize” and I instantly felt a wall go up because it felt condescending and inauthentic to me. As in “it might be the right thing to do but I don’t really want to”.

    Even “poor baby” is prohibited if he is physically hurting in some way?

  392.  #393Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:49 pm

    my guy called me twice today and left sweet messages, and texted me this morning about mother’s day (happy not being a mom day..haha there was a prego scare)

    i didn’t want to talk to him today after how things went yesterday. i don’t want any more drama and craziness and eeeeeeeesh. but i got scared. if i do talk to him, i’ll get more bad stuff. if i don’t return his calls, there will be hell to pay.

    so i texted him:
    “I don’t want to cause problems or make u act meaner to me by not calling u back. I feel trapped. I fel shell shocked with how things have been going and when we talked yesterday. i feel like no matter what i do, i’m going to get more bad scary stuff from u. What do you think?

    then i sent another when I got more clarity on how to say what i was going for before he could respond

    “I dunno I just felt like if I didn’t acknowledge your call somehow there would be hell to pay from u in one form or another.”

    then i got really scared about said hell, and sent one last text before he responded

    “I don’t need any answer. I am scared to have even said anything and want to back out of the conversation now. Goodbye.

    Eesh, I’m glad I backed out. I was feeling really scared and really leany forward trying to explain myself when all i really want to do is just hang back and not deal with drama, rudeness, meanness, none of that.

    I am catching myself earlier and earlier before things turn totally toxic. weeee

  393.  #394Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:53 pm

    he texted back “No listen, I’m just going to keep on trying to come around and show you that i care. I’ll prove myself one way or another – I should be your man.”

    whew. that was much better than what i was expecting. hooray for being surprised. and hooray for leaning back and giving him the space to follow up and keep his word.

    maybe he finally is gettin it.

    or maybe tomorrow there will be hell to pay.

  394.  #395Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    That anger article lurker linked is a throwback to a different time – a time of 39 comments per thread. ah the good ol days

  395.  #396Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    i mean hooray for leaning back, from this point on, and giving him space to follow up on his words.

  396.  #397luzydel on May 8, 2011 at 7:02 pm

    Hello again ladies!!!

    My life is uneventful when it comes to dating. I reopened my profiles, but I have not get a single email. These are the same profiles that used to get me at least five emails per day. I am not worried, it will happen if it is meant to — it is not like I am not being open and flirty because I have, but I cannot force men to ask me out 🙂

    To be honest I feel less needy of men’s company. I would like to be with a nice, yummy, cute, smart gentleman; however I am enjoying the company of yummy, cute, smart ME right now 😉

  397.  #398gina on May 8, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    I feel bitter and sad and lonely. i feel pining away for D but then i looked at his photos and his texts and the thought in my head was “I do not want him. I do not want him.” It’s weird. Even when I was with him, it was when he was close to me and I could see what he would look like if he had a healthier lifestyle. I sensed who he’d be if he made himself my guy. And that’s who I loved – who I thought the could be.

  398.  #399Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:08 pm

    hugs gina. is there anything u can do for you right now?

  399.  #400Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 7:18 pm

    Wow….. I really don’t like reading all the talk about women who decide to just walk away from the blog because they feel done. This reminds me of when things get tough in a relationship and people just walk rather than work it out. But today, catching up on this thread and yesterdays, I can’t take this. All this arguing and proving to each other who is “right” is exhausting and has given me a huge headache.

    We have lost a lot of bloggers here lately. SLV, Alonka, Jilly, Mercedes, and serveral more were pretty constant voices on this thread when I joined a few months back. And while, there were some triggering conversations, it didn’t seem this constant. This is really a shame in my opinion.

    I do value hearing a men’s perspective, but I’m wondering if this is the right place for it. I have no personal issue with the guys who post here, but maybe this isn’t the appropriate blog for it. There are tons of blogs out there, maybe this one isn’t a good fit.

    I do not want to read so many negative and angry posts, I understand processing feelings and emotions, but hardly any posts were in regard to the article.

    All this snapping at each other isn’t healthy, and if it happened this way in a relationship or a marriage, I think it would go downhill very quickly.

    I deeply respect Rori’s perspective, rules, point of view, which is all based on her life experience. So, how can life experience be discounted?

    Daria is a really good reminder of what Rori’s rules are. She knows the material inside and out and is able to remind all of us of what Rori’s perspective would be on any instance.

    I don’t think though, that all men who won’t step up and fit that desired role are toxic, immature, or not ready for a relationship. That seems to be an over generalization that happens here when something doesn’t go “the right way”.

    We are all different human beings and want different things in our lives. In my marriage, my husband was the sole provider, I was a stay home mom, but there was also the plan that when the girls went to school, I would go to work. He was happy to be the main provider, but also wanted to build a life with me, where we both contributed to our lifestyle. Expecting men to pay for everything throughout the entire relationship, or even the majority of it, seems unrealistic to me. I agree with Kaitlyn that some men want ambitious women. Also, in today’s economy, it’s not always possible to just have a single income.

    Daria, I appreciate and value much of what you say, but it does feel like if anyone writes something to you that you don’t like, you lash out, process everything on the blog, people then apologize for triggering you, and it goes round and round. I don’t want to not feel like I can’t give another suggestion or idea to you, because you won’t like it. To get so angry and emotional, often on what doesn’t apprear to be such a serious thing, I dont’ understand. I’ve asked a few times how old you are, because your view seems young. I feel like I’m trying to have a conversation with a young woman, but get a teenager over-reaction.

  400.  #401T-Girl on May 8, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    Luzydel – I’ve noticed lately a huge drop in e-mails as well. A couple weeks ago I couldn’t keep up.

    My update – I just spent the entire weekend with my first date sex guy. We had a great time, he is a really sweet and gentle man. Is he my “one”? I’m not sure…I am still having a hard time with him not having a job. I know that is very shallow of me. And that makes me feel even worse. But I didn’t let it bother my weekend and it felt great to be “sireny” and feminine. He is one that definitely operates in masculine energy and notices when I start to as well. Interesting stuff to see in action when I’ve never noticed these things in my pre-Rori days.

  401.  #402Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    now he is texting me some more. it is like apologetic stuff i guess, or promises to be better, but i just want some spaaaaaaaaaace ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

  402.  #403T-Girl on May 8, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    Turquoise – well said. I’ve noticed a different vibe on here lately as well. It is too bad. I end up skipping over a lot of posts but one of the other things I have noticed is that I am really feeling unheard lately because I think posters are only focusing on certain conversations and then the rest of us get lost in nowhere land. I’m not going to leave the blog but I am going to hope it goes back to the feel good, sireny place that is was when I first started hanging out here.

  403.  #404Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    #397 Gina:
    “And that’s who I loved – who I thought the could be.”

    Gina that’s huge. It really is. I hope you start feeling better very soon- perhaps this acknowledment means you are on your way.

  404.  #405Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 7:35 pm

    T-Girl, I was skipping a lot, but then the same thing happened, I was lost and realized I’d missed something somewhere, so I had to go back and look for clarification… so lately I’ve been trying to read, or at least skim over the main points of each post, unless it’s a conversation I really have no part in.

    Another thought, I read a lot about what women on here want FROM a man: sex, a provider, attention, affection, time, energy, children, planned dates, romance….. but what do people want with a man? There is so much focus on being available and open, how to be on a date, but what about when you meet that amazing, authentic, open man? What then?

    Marriage isnt’ all peaches and cream, as Rori has stated herself many times. What do we want to build with someone, because I’m not getting the vibe from Rori that we are supposed to take a backseat to the man and let him plan our life?

    For me:

    1. Sex and chemistry and amazing and wonderful, but I want a man I still want to hold hands with in 50 years.

    2. I want a man to travel and explore with. Someone who has the same urgency to see new places and experience new things.

    3. I want a man to come home to at night, where I feel safe and protected from the outside world. Someone who cares about the events of my day, and will help me work through issues that come up in life.

    4. I want to laugh and smile, to be centered in a loving relationship of give and take. To feel valued and to give so that my love overflows onto another person, who doesn’t doubt my feelings for him are authentic and true.

    I don’t want someone to feel like because he showed up, met my list of requirements, had a decent paycheck and gave me attention, that I chose him for those reasons. I want to fall in love with someone that means everything to me, that will seem like a part of myself….

    Is this what other people want? Tell me, I’d like to know.

  405.  #406Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:39 pm

    doing a flip in the name of positivity, love, and good vibes —

    he is acknowledging he hears me about how this is all feeling to me, and never once said i can’t have my space.

    i am actually afraid of him continuing to text me unless i text back. i don’t want to be harassed and not given my space since i just said i don’t want to talk! i don’t want any sort of bad news business with him because i am not responding to him!

    he hasn’t done any of this yet tonight though! but i am so scared for him and me and us together that he will! ahhhhhh anxietyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

  406.  #407Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:41 pm

    i like my flip but obviously this is bringing out a lot of triggahs in me

  407.  #408Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    T-Girl I read your comments. I don’t always respond but I read them. I have also felt like tiptoeing and walking on eggshells lately because I have been told by others what to write, I have felt lashed out at and at times feel afraid of not saying the right thing. I don’t like triggering people because at times it feels like draining drama to me as if there is a miscroscope out looking for a word to cause a trigger. Mostly that causes me to hesitate when I write. Your acknowledgement kind of speaks to what I have felt have caused the blog to become a very small place where only “certain” are welcome because they exclusively practice what Rori says. I imagine some correction is necessary but until people feel that something comes naturally to them there will be blunders. There is also another undercurrent that I sense, I hope I am wrong and am not ready to put words to them as yet but it is something I sense.

  408.  #409Lily T. on May 8, 2011 at 7:42 pm


    I want a man who cherishes me and feels cherished BY me in return.
    What else matters?

  409.  #410Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    oh i feel terrible:( there is a question on the very end of the anger thread that no one answered, and she really needed our help. we could have helped her pretty well i think!

  410.  #411Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    That’s me too Turquoise3

  411.  #412Femininewoman on May 8, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    RE 409 are you sure it wasn’t answered on the following one.

  412.  #413Daria on May 8, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    Turquoise – this blog is the place to process triggers and speak up for my Voice that doesnt get heard.

    I feel surprised to be blamed for spewing as I dindnt once attack anybody.

    That is progress for me in itself not to mention healing an important trigger for me about not being heard and bring attacked for speaking up

    This isnt the first time emotions go free or even people leave from the blog.

    I’ve been on this blog for 4 years.

    It’s not a place for stuffing. Notice how Rori decided to post my attacks on the men from yesterday, saying it was powerful.

    That’s because many women will hide the parts of themselves or emotions they think are ugly. Here this blog is about honoring those ‘ugly’ parts as well.

  413.  #414Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:55 pm

    blah blah blah
    u know whaaaat people? i want the right to freely complain, b*tch, whine, attack, etc., while simultaneously also having the right to ask other people to stop when *i* dont like the same sh*t

    jeez that i think is what is described as mean, bully, controlling…

    i want this healed. thank you!

  414.  #415Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 7:57 pm

    am relating first person triggers from the blog to a similar situation/trigger in my love life, and processing this way! mega healing happening!

  415.  #416Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 7:57 pm

    I was actually feeling good and mellow… and excited to come share that Tom came over last night, we talked for hours, not really about “us” but about ourselves, some common goals, life, etc. We watched a movie, laughed a lot, he gave me a fabulous back/shoulder/neck/scalp massage and then we had some really good sex. I feel so much better having gotten some 🙂

    I just took Glory for a quick walk, the sky is amazing here tonight, so clear for the first time in weeks… beautiful crescent moon and a sky filled with stars. I feel better, left the cruddy feeling I got from reading all this negativity outside.

    Ok, moving to a positive for me….

    Things I love about the blog:

    Daria’s thank you tool

    The stop sign tool (Rosa right?)

    That FW can direct me to an article for any problem I have almost immediately. I wonder if you have a photographic memory, or just extremely organized computer files? 🙂

    That women all around the world come here to share, and we all have similar experiences.

    That I can work through how I’m feeling and learn about myself from the experiences of others. It’s like history, we learn about our past to not make the same mistakes. I can learn from the sirens here, and save myself some agony, by recogizing the red flags right away, not getting swept up in what I want it to be, but really isn’t.

  416.  #417Lele on May 8, 2011 at 8:01 pm

    Sunday night – Mom’s day. Hearing all the NVs about all my shortcomings after talking to my Mom. Things are so difficult. Don’t know what to do about all that. Getting over a cracked heart – not completely broken. Roller coaster fo feelings. Swinging between no-hope-for-any-future to “Maybe, maybe, maybe, I can take another path and have the life worthwhile for me”. Only problem is, I don’t know how to make this happen. Not just a fantastic relationship but work that will support me and allow the time that is needed to have a relationship and energy for my creative work. It seens so much to try to have. An impossiblility – so I’ve been taught but I still hope, wish, dream. I can feel this in my soul.

  417.  #418Daria on May 8, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    I feel pressured and blamed.

    I don’t take posters leaving personally and feel compassion that others do.

    Im responsible for me and i did a wonderful job today focusing on me, being brave to express my truth, not judging.

    I could tweak on, not perpetuating my addiction to drama by reading posts that feel bad.

    I feel sad and angry still. I could riff on my emotions more.

    I could have avoided answering turquoise.

    I don’t need to justify myself.

    I don’t have to be silent to not rock the boat when something feels bad.

    Love to me.

  418.  #419Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 8:08 pm

    Woohoo Lillybelly! 😀 <3

  419.  #420Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    Hi Rosa,
    good read! 🙂

    I’m all talked out from the discussions today about how those who believe that partnerships between men and women can work are resistant to the Rori philosophy and tools.

    I like this comment:

    “I see Roris stuff as an excellent guidebook ,and will reduce the risk of getting lost and increase the chance of enjoying the journey . Its not the only Map to the Territory though and we all need to explore the lie of the land at our own pace.”



  420.  #421Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    I’m watching Shania Twain’s healing journey on the Oprah network. She is being so open and vulnerable – working through the domestic violence of her childhood, and her now-ex-husband’s affair with her close friend, and everything in between. Apparently she stopped singing and performing a few yrs ago bc she had gradually lost her confidence. She is on a journey to heal everything now. So beautiful…. so tender… her sister is with her too…

  421.  #422Nikita on May 8, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    Hello hello
    happy mothers day ladies

  422.  #423Elizabeth on May 8, 2011 at 8:28 pm

    408: Lily T. says:


    “I want a man who cherishes me and feels cherished BY me in return.
    What else matters?”

    That’s right!

    All we are saying….is
    give peace a chance!



  423.  #424Nikita on May 8, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    So question? Do we tell when we stumbled into someone’s secret stash?(email left open on the exact page to raise doubts)

    I think: strategically it’s foolish but I want to be authentic and heal these fears, I don’t want to “be strategic” I’m clearly upset and can’t fake being nice. I feel bad.
    I also feel unsure whether I’ll be believed when I say:I didn’t look for it;but it found me

  424.  #425Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 8:48 pm


    I wasn’t just referring to today’s conversation, nor am I blaming you. I said that the need to be right, which was in reference to all triggering conversations on the blog, where we argue our side, is exhausting to read. While I appreciate the male perspective here, my comment was concerning how much arguing there has been the past few weeks, when it seems many women have left, and I’m wondering if the timing of the male perspective is relevant. People seem extra triggered now than they did a few weeks ago.

    And while, Dorothea, we all have the right to bitch and whine, name calling isn’t appropriate. Calling someone a derogatory name like fagg@t is extremely offensive to me… and I dont’ think it has any place here to use terms of hate.

    And we can all apologize for what we say here, but that doesn’t change what is said and done. Forgiveness is a wonderful thing, and in my life, I’ve been able to let a lot go, to move past things and look forward, but it doesn’t mean I forget or don’t maintain an impression of the person who behaves that way. I doubt I’m the only person who feels this way.

    I thought the idea of the blog was to learn about having the relationships we want in our lives. I thought it was to use feeling messages and support each other. I didn’t realize it was an outlet for all emotional triggers, to vent and berate each other just because we can.

    I came here to learn about relationship tools and techniques, to learn from each other, not to bitch and whine.

  425.  #426Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 8:57 pm

    Thank you Dorothea for brushing my teeth
    thank you for washing and putting away clothes
    extra thanks for doing it even though i wasn’t absolutely out of clothes to wear just yet.
    thank you for washing the hiking dirt and tears off my face
    thank you for taking me hiking
    thank you for loving me more than worrying about the idea of ‘wasted money,’ and ordering me delicious food that filled me up after only a few bites. Thank you for not forcing more food into my belly even though i had just started eating. Thank you for putting my feeling good ahead of the ‘wasted money’ of not eating the food.

  426.  #427Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 9:03 pm


    I think it’s best to be honest, you just have to be prepared for what you might hear when you start a conversation like that. Think about what you want to say first.

    I had that happen to me once, same exact thing, and he lied when I first asked him about it, not realizing I’d actually read it. When he knew for sure I knew, he left. He came back hours later ready to talk, but I even though it was a hard conversation to have, if I hadn’t brought it up, it never would have been dealt with. In my situation, it was a pretty big revelation I stumbled upon, but it wasn’t something I ever forgot, or even forgave. When we’d fight, years later… it often came up. Somay have been better had I never known about it, but it wouldn’t change the fact that he knew what he’d done. It’s a tough situation, but I always think honesty is best.

  427.  #428Dorothea on May 8, 2011 at 9:09 pm

    whether the word offends you or not, the fact is i felt like using it and wanted to know what to do with that feeling and put some light on it, so i said the word i was thinking instead of use some round about way of describing what i was thinking/triggering — f*ggot. Much easier than euphemism, which is probably why you just used the actual word when u were referring to it just now. i also used the word b*tch, which is really derogatory against men.

    i don’t want to use those words any more…that was kind of the point. but you can keep scolding me:P

    blah here i am again! defending. feeling nauseated from confrontation. you see those words i wrote about being scolded….i act like it’s easy breezy stickin up for myself, but deep down i feel mortified, disrespected, at odds, defensive defensive defensive.

    i can literally feel my adrenals pumping and sinking into that is soothing them and slowing them down.

    and then i go up to what i wrote at the top here to edit my defense of myself.

    and my adrenals start racing

    and then i catch myself.


  428.  #429Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    I don’t feel responsible for other posters leaving either, and the tone of the blog, may have nothing to do with it in some cases. Maybe they left for other reasons… but I do feel responsible for what I write here and my actions, that it could cause someone to leave, and that would affect their healing and experience with Rori’s tools. Rori wants this to be a safe place for everyone interested in her work to come and post. Shouldn’t we all be keeping that in mind when we blog here?

  429.  #430Turquoise3 on May 8, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    I forgot you said bitch, but knew there was another derogatory comment. I didn’t read the rest of your posts completely, where you processed through it, the comments made me feel so sick and angry, I skimmed over the rest.

  430.  #431T-Girl on May 8, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    FW – I know what you mean about the undercurrent. I feel it too. I am optimistic that a correction will happen here and faithfully still read everyday though skipping over alot. I am just thankful that I have found Rori – it has been a huge learning experience for me.

  431.  #432T-Girl on May 8, 2011 at 9:28 pm

    Turquoise – you describe exactly what I want in a man too! I think you have defined “soulmate” in your words.

    My question is, how do we recognize that person when he shows up. Is it a gradual realization, or will we know right away?

  432.  #433Lisi on May 8, 2011 at 9:35 pm

    I am frustrated.

    And lonely.

    And dating NO ONE.

    And, that doesn’t feel so good right now.

    M. texted “happy mother’s day” this morning — which was nice — and said he missed me. That’s cool.

    But I’m ready for a real relationship, and he’s not that guy. Not for me, anyway.

    Ready. Now. Universe.

    Gratefully opening myself to the thrill and the fear of deep intimacy. Accepting myself and my partner fully. Ready to experience. Be grateful. Embrace.

    And so it is.


  433.  #434Daria on May 8, 2011 at 9:42 pm

    Feeling great! My mom asked me to tall to my dad while she’s sleeping and im asking and finding out lots of fun info I didn’t know like what his favorite number and day of the week is.


  434.  #435Meemee on May 8, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    Hi all
    I am back after an exciting weekend. Was away for a couple of days
    Read the last thread.
    Feeling upset.
    Happy to see jacquiline posting
    Hope LP will come back.
    I really hope she will
    Miss you

  435.  #436Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 10:20 pm

    Wow. I feel dismayed and incredulous reading complaining and arguing about other people complaining and arguing! *shakes head in disbelief*

  436.  #437Simply Shannon on May 8, 2011 at 10:26 pm

    Hey Nikita, Questions for you to consider.

    How ready are you for change to happen?

    Are you genuinely curious to know his response, or have you already decided what the secret stash means?

    Hope that gets you closer to the answers you seek.

  437.  #438Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    Jacqueline, the performance was wonderful and I felt so proud. My ex also took me and the kids to dinner before the show (paid for everything in case anyone is wondering lol)…I had margarita-grilled chicken and it was scrumptious! My daughter is, sadly, getting pretty sick again and she and I both feel discouraged about it. 🙁 It’s so hard hearing her heavy cough – I feel so achey and helpless every time I hear it. I try to just not think about it bc there is nothing that can be done that we’re not alread

  438.  #439Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 10:29 pm

    (cont’d) already doing. You can sing me the song if you still feel like it. 🙂 Thanks for asking about me. How was your weekend? <3

  439.  #440Meemee on May 8, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    Friday my friend/roommate was going for a dinner from her office. She invited me too because I know her friends. Three of them were there. Had a great time. It was after a long time I was in a group, eating and drinking and laughing.
    There were two male friends of her. I enjoyed their company. One of them (Her boss) is a nice fellow. I enjoyed his decent and considerate behavior. I enjoyed his attention. The other one was also a nice guy. He made all of us laugh a lot with his jokes. It was after a long long time I was mingling with a company of men.

    Then she invited all three of them home. Her boss and this other guy came. I cooked some meat and other dishes. Her boss complimented me saying that its nice. Then we watched a movie together. We had a nice time laughing and talking. After dinner her boss and friend left and they took us for a night ride. We just drove for an hour listening to music and talking about many things. It felt good.

    I was having a mild fever and cold. Her boss offered me some medicines to reduce cough . I liked his attention. Then when I stopped at a medical shop, instead of making me go out to get medicines, he went and bought it for me. I felt like a queen.

    I liked it all.
    Laughter, attention, good behavior and everything.
    It feels good to receive attention from men.

  440.  #441Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    Hi Meemee. I hope Loneplum comes back too. I feel bad bc it appears as if she was “singled out” but I know there is more to it than meets the eye. Loneplum, I hope you are doing okay. SLV, I miss you too! <3 Lucy

  441.  #442gina on May 8, 2011 at 10:51 pm

    I think all the conflict this afternoon exemplified how Rori’s tools do work. I find it very difficult to “hear” opinions and judgements – I feel competitive and maybe I feel some adrenaline rush from the conflict, and sometimes I may get a Charlie Sheen Rush (Winning!), but for the most part, it just feels awful. Women using masculine voices is challenging, but men using masculine voices is even more trying. I can appreciate the value of a male point of view, but I wonder if Rori has some advice for how a man can communicate with us effectively.
    Actually, I feel deficient about this understanding in general: I teach ballroom dance and I encourage women to speak to men in feeling messages as they are working through kinks that inevitably come up as they are learning to follow, but I’m not sure how to encourage the men to speak. So far, I ask them to report how they think things are working, and I ask them to also avoid the word “you”. Would love feedback about how a man can effectively communicate with us…

  442.  #443gina on May 8, 2011 at 10:54 pm

    About how the value of Rori’s tools was exemplified today: For instance, when DE summed up her version of what Lily T was really saying – it was exactly how I interpreted Lily T. So when Lily T said it was so far off the mark, I was surprised and wondered what WAS going on for her during that convo with Daria – just saying that I find it difficult to get to the truth of someone’s point of view when the communication is speculation, beliefs, convictions etc.

  443.  #444Jacqueline on May 8, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    Lucy – lol…the song says secrets of a wild woman…but it’s provocative. Yes there is more, including a very cordial email I received dated in February of this year. There are always two sides to every story.

    However I have a code of honor that doesn’t include posting private emails…but I admit to confusion from this and non reading here of posts as well. I feel singled out definitely.

    I am glad I am not “charged” and just read a great article on all anger being reactive. There were certainly some very charged words used here today! I feel grateful for freedom from reaction.

    I do feel very uncomfortable and not able to process it here.

    I’ve learned a lot here the last few weeks and I am happy hearing about your family and share your pain about your daughter.


  444.  #445Daria on May 8, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    Oh Lucy hugs!

  445.  #446Alicia on May 8, 2011 at 11:29 pm

    I just got home from 6th date with Mikey..

    Wow it’s sooo odd. He adores me. I adore him.

    But, I am missing some chemistry.. I want to be more open with him. He treats me great, says sweet things and I still hold back. What is my deal? I just done feel pyhsical attraction. It’s like I am with my most sweetest innocent guy friend. I feel like this is a middle school romance.

    He even got out of the car to hug me and give me a little peck and said. He was going to have start getting closer to me and see how that feels. I can tell he is frustrated a little it’s our 6th date and we havent even locked lips for more then a second. But, I figure that is his lead. Yet then I wonder if I am being closed off??
    Then I still smile and feel totally respected so I forget about it. I know he has some purpose in my life. It just seems like it’s more of a healing, trusting thing. I am becoming more open and feeling more safe.

  446.  #447DE on May 8, 2011 at 11:44 pm

    Gina #442:

    It’s all good 🙂 I relate to the feeling of “adrenaline” rush and fear…and awfulness…I felt it many times before even participating in a heated argument here on the blog…

    I learned that being open to judgments and possible attacks is the most vulnerable place to be…and the most potential for healing and growth…if we so choose…

    Daria has been the most open person and most vulnerable woman I’ve ever met…I felt deeply inspired by her journey…she has nothing to lose…but many of us do…old layers of bad habits that we consider still “normal” in our lives…it’s sure feels scary…

    The questions that come to mind when I hear all these frustrations around Daria’s expressing herself are “why do u get triggered because she gets triggered? why do u feel the need to explain yourself…or be accommodating and pleasing? Who is Daria reminding u of? Is there something there for u to heal as well…instead of “apologizing” and “walking on eggshells” ab it?

    I feel actually very safe around Daria…because she is honest…and she would always tell me what she thinks…there is no pretend…take it or leave it…and yes, I want to be “busted”…I want to feel “the push” sometimes…and stretch my comfort zone…

    When I disagree with Daria’s point of view it actually connects me deeply with my truth…For example, if Daria suggests something I try or do that does not feel good to me…it’s a great opportunity to determine why it does not feel good to me…was I not fully truthful ab my situation? is there still confusion ab my feelings? maybe I feel still resistant to change? I feel scared maybe? I feel addicted to my “own” reality? Well, anyway…this is a brief description ab my own process to discover my authentic self…

    Holding hands and singing “Alouete” all day on the blog…won’t promote growth…not to me anyway…

    Good nite…and

    Warm hugs,

  447.  #448Lucy on May 8, 2011 at 11:57 pm

    “holding hands and singing Aloute all day” lol! That’s really funny, DE. <3

  448.  #449Lucy on May 9, 2011 at 12:06 am

    Thank you Daria. <3

  449.  #450Daria on May 9, 2011 at 12:17 am

    Aww DE I feel so safe and smily to hear your wonderful perception of me


    Thanks for the love.

  450.  #451Jacqueline on May 9, 2011 at 12:21 am


  451.  #452Daria on May 9, 2011 at 12:27 am

    I’m home!

    And showered set out new sheets and brushed my hair!

    My boy is living me and doing things for me all the time!

    Thank you for ordering yummy food for me!

    Thank you Daria for doing EFT and ask and receive.

    Thank you for creating a healing color – pink – for the relationship w my Sis and recording it here.

    Thank you for massaging my head, and brushing my hair.

    Thank you for brushing my teeth and washing me.

    Thank you for laying out sheets on the bed.

    Thank you for standing up for me. When people complained about my computer use.

    Thank you for standing up for me when my dad complained about my clothes.

    Thank you for noticing my manifesting of harmonious family coming real.

    Thank you for taking me to see such cool sites like the white calciumcarbon deposits at mono lake

    Thank you for making sure I was warm.

    Thank you for making sure I ate regularly.

    Thank you for giving me vinegar baths out there.

    Thank you for standing up for me on blog.

    Thank you for filing my nails.

    Thank you for believing I’m worth healing and experessing myself.

    Thank you for being awesome.

    Thank you for loving me.

    Thank you for taking cool pictures.

    Thank you for getting me coconut creme Starbucks.

  452.  #453Daria on May 9, 2011 at 12:27 am

    Thank you for thinking up cool stuff to ask my dad.

  453.  #454Daria on May 9, 2011 at 12:30 am

    Wow 19 man just called lol for a sec cuz he thought of me. I felt great when I answered … Told him I just got back from my trip. He wished me happy mothers day. Said he’s back to his sing I said thank you for the call

    I felt much better, this feels much better.


  454.  #455Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 12:50 am

    I have been thinking about forgiveness.
    I think of it as an energy like love is an energy .
    To me its different to letting go of revenge.

    To me it is a positive energy I feel in myself , in the body, which I feel i give to myself as a blessing at the same time i bless them with my “forgiveness”, even if I dont agree with them, even if they hurt me.

    I need to let go of revenge first , and although I may feel angry or sad when i think of them , I can still feel this other feeling of blessing them for only being human and faulty and imperfect like me. I call that forgiveness.

  455.  #456Jacqueline on May 9, 2011 at 12:54 am

    Loneplum – you are lying. Bye now to everyone….I won’t be attacked but I will prove my point – you were “appreciating me” in FEBRUARY:


    This must have been in error from the no contact rule you had enforced in October as it is dated in February? and I was understandably confused.

    You lie and you beat a dead horse – not to worry though, I have asked to have my blog link removed from Rori’s and will block your email address here.

    You basically called me a whore, btw. And now you are a victim.

    Feel better!

    Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:06 PM
    Funny, SLV never told ME a thing about it.
    Thank you for telling me; I went and read her comments

    I will make sure to delete her address. Along with whomever referred
    to it publicly without even emailing me directly, although they asked
    me to send the mp3

    you got to laugh

    I have been ASKED to send the mp3 to them, i have been sent the emails
    address and now they are “discussing” my name on my back
    I can’t stand people who say “thanks so much” to ME and, in my back,
    put my name PUBLICLY in the same post with the concept of stealing.

    People pay a fortune to have their work known all over the world. It
    is called “publicity”
    The speakers are getting their publicity for free here.
    The event is meant to make them known further than their habitual circles.
    A stranger listen to a free mp3, he/she gets hooked and googles the
    speaker, find his products and buys.
    Et voilà
    Me sending the mp3 to the sirens who missed it, I am helping the
    speakers to get his free publicity.

    Do not fear anything about the mp3 you already received. They were
    offered free in the promotional event, I sent them to you and to whom
    I please because the law allows me to share my belongings for free
    with whom I wish, as long as it is not in a business oriented

    I really appreciate your email, thank you.

  456.  #457Lucy on May 9, 2011 at 1:20 am

    Yes, Rosa, that is what happens when we let go of revenge. 🙂

  457.  #458The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 1:21 am

    #423 “So question? Do we tell when we stumbled into someone’s secret stash?(email left open on the exact page to raise doubts)”

    Nikita, that reminds me of the story Mel told us recently, the one where she accidentially noticed her hubby is surfing on Facebook. The difference is that he saw her looking at the screen and instantly shut down that window. But the basic question is the same, how to react on this?

    Well, I guess there isn’t a “one size fits all” answer. It depends on the specific situation and the status of the relationship. And there your story is very much different from Mel’s. Let’s not get into the details of HOW to have a conversation about this, and focus on IF you want to talk about this with your bf now. Correct me if I confuse something, but the point is, you’re not that much into your bf right now, and much more into another guy on the internets, right? So, what exactly do you want from your bf now? That he focusses exclusively on you? Are you willing to drop the other guy in return? Or do you want your bf to accept that he’s only there for providing real life company, without sex, and to tolerate your virtual affair? Is this realistic?

    As I see it, firstly you need to get a clear picture of what you want before you start a conversation. Because else you may come into a position where you hear arguments you’re not prepared to answer now. And you may have to promise stuff that is not really in your interests. So, imho you shouldn’t start such a convo now. Focus on yourself instead, make a list of the realistic options you have, and explore which one feels best for you. After this it will be much easier to have some serious talks!

  458.  #459Daria on May 9, 2011 at 1:23 am

    Dear Daria – you are awesome!

    I love you honor and cherish you. Forever. I do!


  459.  #460Brenda on May 9, 2011 at 1:25 am

    I found Bambi injured in the middle of the highway, fully conscious. I carried him off the road into the grass, and I left him with a gallon of water in a dog dish. I am trying to find a rescue that will help him, not kill him.

  460.  #461Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 1:27 am

    “And honestly I feel pist and left put that people are found as ‘kindred’ spirits because of resisting tools.

    I feel so angry about this.”

    I accept you feel anger. Myself feels neutral about whether I use a rule or a tool 100% or 80% or 10% and there are many reasons why I will accept some at 100% and some at 10% in my own life . Not the least is a cultural difference.

    However I feel angry when my choices are viewed as resistance. I feel pi$$ed that my choice for me is “labelled” as resistance. It is my choice for me. As such it is full acceptance and made from the position of WHERE I AM NOW in my life.

    Why do you think of my choices for me as resistance Daria ? This pre-supposes that the Tools are ALWAYS right and that a Siren can only play this game if she accepts all the Rules and Tools without question, without modification and without RESISTANCE. It pre-supposes that a good Siren will use the Rules and Tools 100% or else she is RESISTING something.

    Well maybe she chooses to resist because she enjoys resistance !

    or maybe she just doesnt believe certain tools work for her in her life.

    Or just maybe she has some tools which work even better for her there’s a thought.

    This reminds me of certain religions and cults, people who insist that thou shallt believe the truths in full, and live life by The Book 100% or you cant be one of them.
    Resistance to “the teachings’ make you an outcast.

    Well I doubt that is the purpose of Roris material , to create a Dogma of Dating.

    I resist the teachings of many “Books’ because they dont fit me or my life. I am here on the Blog because I accept many truths that Rori teaches and they have helped me. I dont accept them all.

    I feel relieved to open my mind.

    I feel happy to live with freedom to think and decide for myself.

    I feel magnificent when i learn all sorts of new stuff and take what works for me and cook up my own casserole of beliefs. This feels right for me.

  461.  #462Daria on May 9, 2011 at 1:32 am

    Ella – I feel scared that you may wind up feeling really bad

    For me personally, I would put a friend I Respect’ man or guy she likes or has feelings for into the unavailable category – like a married man.

    This is because I would start to feel guilty and awful to hurt my friend, and I wouldn’t want that done to me. The guilt would be more than I could handle to really feel ‘goid’ receiving his attention.

    And hiding from my friend that I’m dating him would
    eventually feel really toxic and inauthentic. Hiding is not condone high self esteem.

    I think this guy is unavailable bec of that and I feel scared for you be aide I would feel confused in that situation and it could feel really bad to me after awhile if I get attached to this man who is unavailable due to being my friends guy.

    Now this could be remedied if she said, sure go ahead, and meant it…

    Even so, I’d feel bad to date a man who’s dating other women right in front of me in out house!

    Hugs to you! What a challenging situation this would be for me!

  462.  #463Daria on May 9, 2011 at 1:34 am

    Ella – basically I want to avoid guilt here for you cuz it’s not so much about other people, but that it looks like this could a VERY feel bad situation for you in the future if you attach to this man that comes ‘pre-loaded’ w guilt about your friend, etc

  463.  #464Meemee on May 9, 2011 at 1:38 am

    fever and cold
    Feeling dull
    and sad
    and lonely
    🙁 🙁

  464.  #465Daria on May 9, 2011 at 1:39 am

    Rosa – hi! I see you writing to me, and I feel afraid to read the post because I felt bad in our recent past interactions and feeling vulnerable and scared right now.

    Am doing the not reading things that migh feel inflaming to me and my adrenaline and nervous system tool right now.

    I want to acknowledge that I see you and say sorry for not being available right now to talk about this.. Will feel good to talk when feeling a bit safer.

    Love to you!

  465.  #466Meemee on May 9, 2011 at 1:40 am

    Going to parents’ today.
    I hope to have a good time there

  466.  #467Daria on May 9, 2011 at 1:41 am

    Meemee – I hope so for you too! Thanks to Meemee for taking care of Meemee!

  467.  #468The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 1:48 am

    #435 “I feel dismayed and incredulous reading complaining and arguing about other people complaining and arguing!”

    Lucy, that may feel a bit icky, but imho the larger point, how to deal with negative energy, is an important question. Dorothea is aware of her desire to lash out and insult, and is seriously trying to work on this. This deserves respect. And I guess this is an issue many folks struggle with. After all, who has never felt an “adrenaline rush” and let that out in an insulting vent? That may feel like a necessary release of pressure in that moment, but more often than not, it only makes us look like nuts in the eyes of observers. And that’s probably not how we want to be seen.

    Well, I don’t have a failsafe recipe to deal with negative energy, either. I managed to reduce the times when adrenaline rushes in by taking a mental timeout when I feel insulted. And then to react with the rational side of my brain. But that may be more suited for us guys, and what Rori wrote about dealing with anger may work better for you ladies. In the end, everybody has to find the methods that work for her- or himself. But it’s good to discuss this, and to hear what others do when they feel the “rush”. We may learn something new from this that will help us!

  468.  #469Lucy on May 9, 2011 at 2:07 am

    Hi Lurker. I feel confused about your post to me and how it relates to what I expressed.

  469.  #470RiverGirl on May 9, 2011 at 2:09 am

    Turquoise @ 404
    “I want to fall in love with someone that means everything to me, that will seem like a part of myself….
    Is this what other people want? Tell me, I’d like to know.”

    Yes, that DOES sounds like something I want. 🙂

  470.  #471The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 2:37 am

    #468 Lucy, I’m sorry that I aparently wasn’t clear enough. My point simply is, the complaining and arguing is based on negative energies, and while reading such stuff feels icky, having a discussion on the meta level, about how to deal with “adrenaline rushs”, is helpful. You probably feel confused because I used your comment as a starting point to make a more general statement. Rereading what I wrote (I usually reread my stuff several times before posting, but sometimes it still looks different after some time has passed), I see that I better should have brought this up in a different way.

    Got me now?

  471.  #472Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 2:39 am

    Hi Lurker , I feel resaonance today with you.
    I feel irritated by being labelled as a “tool resister” ..
    🙂 🙂 🙂

    Naughty me !

  472.  #473Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:05 am

    I think, at a meta level , that name calling , swearing at and cussing people on the blog is not acceptable.

    Dealing with emotional pus letting is tricky , as someone is likely to get covered in it. And we all have a few good messy carbuncles .

    Maybe a “safe word” or “warning word” system ?
    OK I am now in Code Yellow everyone, or Here it comes , Code Red, stand clear or get splattered!

  473.  #474Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:17 am

    That feels good Daria,

    You dont need to comment .
    I really was just expressing my irritation .

  474.  #475The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 3:22 am

    #471 Rosa, thank you for experiencing resonance – that feels great! Thinking about this, the idea that we’re both on the same frequency, where the energy output peaks, is giving me naughty thoughts, too. I imagine that frequency to be somewhere between 60 and 70 uh, rounds per minute…that would be hot…
    And indeed, in this context, I think the “real thing” is much preferrable to any tools. At least I hope so!

    (I hope I didn’t go too far with this comment, but you writing “naughty me” triggered me positively, in a reinforcing way…)

  475.  #476Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:27 am

    Elizabeth at 260 . I see you expressed my point but better than I did.

    love being a part of this group and I DON’T want it to be a cult. Seeing a group grow smaller and less accepting because of rigid rules….and perceptions that some newbies or whatever, are “resisting” the program, when that is not true…..that is what triggers me.

    I totally 100% agree . I feel concerned at the direction things take here when freedom of speech and action is called resitance.
    I dont want to stay in a place where its “my way or the Highway ”

    I am wartching closely further developments to see if I need to get off here myself. Still deciding.

  476.  #477Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:32 am

    You are such a boy Lurks 🙂

    The tools I use remain my secret and they CERTAINLY would not be acceptable on the blog !

  477.  #478Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:33 am

    Apparently i have a lot of resistance though :0 🙂

  478.  #479Lily T. on May 9, 2011 at 3:33 am

    #442 Gina,

    Initially I wrote a post about how I feel about men paying – which included a personal example and also a statement about how I felt uncomfortable with the use of the word “deserve” when it comes to men paying. Daria responded and this led to dialogue between her and I and Elizabeth that evolved into other ideas about giving/receiving, what partnership might look like.

    My feelings about Daria at the time was she was being a respectful and patient teacher of Rori’s concepts. My intention was not to challenge her, but just engage her with the idea that Rori’s concepts and tools might be ‘adaptable’ to women depending on their stage in life. Daria got frustrated and riffed her way through the frustration. That didn’t bother me – Daria gets triggered several times a day, every day, and sooner or later comes up feeling better. The age/experience deal was the fact that some of Rori’s ideas turned into tools has been around for a very long time. I didn’t know if Daria realized that. NO disrespect was ever intended by me and I was surprised others took the ‘conversation’ in the way they did. I’ve gone back and read that segment of this thread and I’m still surprised there was that reaction.

    Anyway that’s what was going on with me during that convo, despite any perceived speculation, beliefs, convictions, etc.

    I can’t speak for how/why people take Daria’s riffing personally. I generally skim/scroll through it because I see it as her ‘self work’, not my business.

  479.  #480Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:35 am

    It feels surprising to me that i can resonate with energy peaks with some lurking bloke , even on a virtual screen
    🙂 🙂 🙂

  480.  #481The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 3:39 am

    #477 “Apparently i have a lot of resistance though”
    Rosa, I probably totally misinterprete this, but this sounds hot to me. I imagine that we could grow together very tightly if we met in real life…

  481.  #482Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:43 am

    Hi Lily T ,

    I was no doubt part of the fray having written a whole post on how i felt about paying( in my life, in my country ,at my stage, and at my age).

    I then fortuitously went to sleep .
    Seems we had a few carbuncles lanced .

    I did not intend to be purposely inflammatory , but i also dont want you and Elizabeth to get flack for this .

    I say , tell it like it is, its your truth for you.
    I am delighted to hear others thoughts as well as feelings around using tools or not and which work for them in their own lives.

    I cant help being 51, married 16 years , divorced , successful professional ,recent cancer, two amazing kids .This is My life. I dont apologise for that .
    It would be crazy if the tools that worked for me also worked for an 18 year old student who is trying out love for the first time.

    Rori totally agrees as I understand it. She says that young people may not need to CD for example.. There is a reference to that on Reconnect and also i have seen it written here.

    This is why I object to homogenization of our experiences and views to a one size fits all approach.

  482.  #483Brenda on May 9, 2011 at 3:44 am

    I dropped off my dogs at home, 25 miles away, called some wildlife rehabs, and returned to pick Bambi up. Both front legs are broken. He has budding horns, about a half inch long. He is on a crib mattress and sleeping bag in my car, resting. I have been awake 17.5 hrs and am going to sleep until one of the rehabs calls me. I just hope one of them will be willing to treat him. So far two of them just said let the cops shoot him. 🙁

  483.  #484Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:44 am

    Lurker I always go for a man with great makes the hypnosis very powerful.

    Are you still flirting ??? 🙂

  484.  #485Lily T. on May 9, 2011 at 3:47 am

    I want to add to #478:

    You know, it feels really strange to be told you are ‘resistant’ to ideas you have been practicing longgg before they were ever ‘packaged’.

    What can I do but shake my head?

  485.  #486Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:49 am

    I know Lily T, smae feeling here, confused and discarded.
    Possibly past Best Before date 🙂

  486.  #487Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:51 am

    Or else I can just feel like singing (though that upsets some people here too..)

    “Everything old is new again! “

  487.  #488Rosa on May 9, 2011 at 3:52 am

    Brenda you have such a loving heart. You make me smile.

  488.  #489The Lurker on May 9, 2011 at 3:53 am

    #483 I always jump at opportunities for flirting, Rosa! That’s part of my personal CDing program. Seems to work for us guys, too.

    And, yeah, same with me, I have a crush on girls who have a colorful imagination. The combination of two adventurous and visionary souls is always so powerful!

  489.  #490Lily T. on May 9, 2011 at 4:03 am


    Hi Rosa.

    That was the point I was trying to make yesterday- some tools might work better for a women who’s yet to have her first partnership, others for a middle aged woman who’s had (or struggling with) a long one. And anything in between.

    Life is not “one size fits all” and concepts aren’t going to be either.