Circular Dating From A Man’s Point Of View

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Here’s a comment from a man – Jim –  about Circular Dating:

“Ok, First let see if I’ve got this right? When a woman cd’s she dating multiple men simultaneously, ideally only having sexual relations with one, some by this blog have multiple sex partners simultaneously. She also lets each man know she’s dating others.

So…if this woman says this to any one of the men and he doesn’t like it, the woman pretty much has an “oh well” attitude. Ok so far?

Turn this around, what if a man you really care for says the same thing to you and you don’t like it?

So, you don’t like it and you like the man. Enough to want to stick around, but there’s this one problem: He’s dating other women.

This leaves you with the insecurity of knowing he could be having sexual relations with any other or more.

Yes, I am in a safe place here at the blog with some anonymity. So what if I started cd’ing? How would I communicate to each of my women that this is ok, not to worry. Of course, without looking like a player. Which I am not, in any way whatsoever.

Also. One must look at one’s own intent and then hopefully, if their intent is sincere, hopefully they can communicate this to their assorted cd’s.

To me this is very tricky ground. almost in some ways like walking down a dark alley at night by one’s self intentionally.

My point in all. Everybody counts. Everybody. The old saying it takes all parts of the circle to make it whole, so to speak.

Conflict resolution with any issue between men and women, I believe is key.

p.s. If it is any consolation to you and everyone here. I’m sad and happy to say men could use a whole lot of what you ladies are doing with yourselves. That is not a compliment, just an observation of my view of men in generally or at least a large percentage I’ve known.


Here’s My Answer:

Jim – the point is getting obscured here.

If you like the man, and want to be with him, and he’s proposing marriage…then you say yes and don’t CD!

If you like the man and feel attached to him, and HE’S NOT SURE – meaning he doesn’t know about marriage, he doesn’t know what the future holds, he’s not sure you’re the one…but he really LIKES you, and really wants to have you all to himself – then that won’t work for you.

Then you CD.

Can you see the difference in the situations?

If a man wants to marry you and you want to CD – well, then – we’re not talking about the same situation here.

Hopefully – ALL men will want to marry you, and all you have to do is choose!

I ALWAYS advise women to give a good man a chance – even an EXCLUSIVE chance at some time in the “dating relationship” – but, if you’re ready to go, and he isn’t – then CD with actual DATES is the only answer.

CDing in the therapeutic sense is a life-long Tool.

Love, Rori

Posted in


  1.  #1Meemee on April 6, 2011 at 7:07 am

    Top of the world

  2.  #2Luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 7:15 am

    I admit I was, and still hesitant about the CD thing.
    But with my last experience I understand your point.
    I met. ‘Nice’ guy who asked me to sto dating others, but he did not offer a comitment, he said he will do the same, so I decided to give it a chance. I closed my profile, he did not closed his, he distanced himself and only kept me hanging with txts messages and promises of meeting soon.

    Now I believe he met someone else and I am left here empty handed. But I learned a lesson here, well more that one…never get exclusive without a proper commitment, and
    I have to give at least four months to feel if a relationship has potential.
    Still I am hesitant to go back and date again…this should pass.

  3.  #3LD on April 6, 2011 at 7:24 am

    This is exactly how I see it. I make it clear to every man I go out with that I’m looking for a serious relationship. The majority of the men I meet either are looking for something more casual or aren’t sure what they want yet. I could just turn them down, but instead I agree to date them and others while they figure out what they want. I personally am not having sex with ANY of them. This in itself weeds out alot of men just looking for casual sex or FWB even after sating that’s not what they want. CDing keeps me from getting “played” or too attached to one man who doesn’t feel the same about me.

    If a man I like is on the same page about relationships and marriage and wants me to be exclusive with him, I would definitely agree to it. By the same token if a man is crazy about me and I’m not sure how I feel about him, he has every right to continue dating other women until I figure out what I want.

  4.  #4Tracy Wandress on April 6, 2011 at 7:31 am

    Hi Rori,
    I have a 21 year old son who suffers from coming to terms with understanding his masculine tendencies and anger with his life so far. My divorce and the horrible role model my ex and I were have left him broken and confused.. My question is, what program for men (young man) would you recommend that I can buy for him. I have tried to get him to listen to you but he has trouble with it becuase he is a boy. So he can find his inner pop and feel ok about himself.. should note he is in therapy.

  5.  #5Jilly on April 6, 2011 at 7:31 am

    Goodmorning everyone! 🙂

    FW…Happy Birthday…hope you have a wonderful day!! 🙂

    i like this post…i like what Rori says about having a good man… 🙂

  6.  #6LD on April 6, 2011 at 7:51 am

    A perfect example of this is ministerCD. He knows I want and says he “understands” what I want but has not said anything else about a committed relationship. I find this to be vague and have given him multiple opportunities to talk about the subject and he always avoids it. This tells me he isn’t sure what he wants yet and but is trying to keep me on a string until he does decide. CDing keeps me from expecting an outcome and being disappointed if it’s not the one I want.

    I know he wants to have sex with me. He says he’s not having sex with anyone else right now, but he doesn’t say he’s not dating anyone else. Again, vague for me. So I will decide if I want to have sex or not under those circumstances, but I won’t interpret the vagueness into what I want to hear. I think alot of men stay vague and let women interpret things they way they want to. Not exactly dishonest, but more omission. That way if a woman interprets things the wrong way, it’s her problem, not his….

  7.  #7Lovingme on April 6, 2011 at 7:52 am

    FW: Happy Birthday! I hope you have the BEST BEST day, you deserve it!!! 🙂

  8.  #8Lovingme on April 6, 2011 at 8:20 am

    Hi ladies,

    I have a question (well really more of a curiosity as to what you would do in a situation like this) in regards to dating a guy that doesn’t want you to cd, sorta wants to make a commitment (he isn’t dating others, but is not quite ready to take the next step), but you have an opportunity to go on a date with someone else. What would you do?

  9.  #9Shandi on April 6, 2011 at 8:22 am

    I have been exclusively dating a man for almost 2 years now. Our only “issue” is my jealousy/trust. He is very charming, flirty, and sociable with other women. I feel that he really needs the attention to feel good about himself, kind of like Circular Dating. He has been very open with me and told me about all of the one night stands that he had while he was married to his previous wife of 25 years. He says that he was in a sexless relationship with his wife and did not feel loved, respected, or appreciated. He says that he gets those things from me and that he is no longer interested in that type of lifestyle. How do I trust that when I still feel so uneasy with all of the “socializing”?

  10.  #10Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 8:59 am


    Great question and great answer Rori!

    I have had a few convs about it already…It feels comforting that I responded very similar to you…

    Warm hugs,

  11.  #11Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 9:25 am

    Jim – the point is getting obscured here.

    If you like the man, and want to be with him, and he’s proposing marriage…then you say yes and don’t CD!

    If you like the man and feel attached to him, and HE’S NOT SURE – meaning he doesn’t know about marriage, he doesn’t know what the future holds, he’s not sure you’re the one…but he really LIKES you, and really wants to have you all to himself – then that won’t work for you.

    Then you CD.

    Can you see the difference in the situations?

    If a man wants to marry you and you want to CD – well, then – we’re not talking about the same situation here.

    Hopefully – ALL men will want to marry you, and all you have to do is choose!

    I ALWAYS advise women to give a good man a chance – even an EXCLUSIVE chance at some time in the “dating relationship” – but, if you’re ready to go, and he isn’t – then CD with actual DATES is the only answer.

    CDing in the therapeutic sense is a life-long Tool.”

    I feel relieved to read Rori’s clarification of cd-ing.

  12.  #12Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 9:27 am

    good morning sirens. 🙂

    @Feminine Woman, thank you for the advice on questions to ask. I will have to keep them in mind tomorrow. And also keep in mind to lean back and let him talk about himself. I’ve been doing that when we talk on the phone.

    @Jilly, thanks for the love. 🙂 I’m sure I’ll have a good time.

    I have been talking to techie for the past few days and I have come to realize that he is REALLY horny. He says he hasn’t had sex in a month (and I guess that is a long time for him). I told him I haven’t had sex in three months. I’m a very sexual person and I LOVE sex. So God knows I am rarin’ to go and I could impulsively jump this guy’s bones before he knows what hits him. However I am the type who ties love with sex, and I wouldn’t feel good about sleeping with someone I’m not in love with and committed to. So when he was flirting with me suggestively, I told him I really like him but I’m not ready to go down that road with him.
    It’s soooo hard…my heart is constantly at war with my libido. But I know if I sleep with a guy too soon I will be racked with guilt and shame and also I’ll become emotionally attached to him, possibly without him being as attached to me. This is my biggest fear. So I will keep my legs closed for the time being. I’m just wondering how long I can hold out though. *sigh*

  13.  #13Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 9:37 am

    Hi all! I’m still feeling great about spring. I feel rejuvenated a lot of the time. I still have low moments of energy.

    On Monday I was super activated. Then I felt really tired on tues. I intend for today to be a great day.

    I’m trying to not be on the Internet so much. I love the social interaction yet I can see that sometimes I use it as a way to avoid my own life.

    I want to feel excited about my own life.

    I love all the self-help work I am doing. I have Rori’s class and my NLP dude that I’m working with. I have also been listening to my Abraham and Wendi Friesen cd’s.

    I’ve been doing lots of research on how to change beliefs.

    I’m collecting belief changing tools.

    Some of my favorites are:
    Byron Katie – the Work
    the Sedona method
    Carol Look – eft

    I feel happy and hopeful. I am seeing small changes happening.

    I’m focusing on my morning routine. I want to start the day out in a way that feels good. I am tracking my energy flow throughout the day. Watching my habits and thoughts and noticing where I get stuck, when my energy level drops.

    I feel good for the most part. I feel so excited for spring and that I have the whole summer to create a new flow and habits for myself.

    I intend to be better prepared for winter next year. I won’t let myself get so down. I will take my vitamin D, get exercise, hopefully move to a warmer house that isn’t so vulnerable to power outages. If I need to I will travel somewhere sunny for a month. I will never let myself get as low as I did this winter.

    Now I’m feeling a little bad focusing on that.

    I watched a kids movie, Meet the Robinson’s, and I love the catch phrase in it:

    Keep Moving Forward

    that is my new motto!


  14.  #14Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 9:41 am

    Keep Moving Forward!

  15.  #15Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 9:46 am

    700: Senior Lady says: on previous thread

    @694: KS says:

    “SLV,The only question I have about sex right now is…..Where can I get some? Lol …”

    Go to Texas with PG…? 😛


    Yes and Yee Haw.. if I could just get that boy to pencil me in… or who knows.. I might get a better offer before he does..

    Iowa horse trainer wrote me a sorta sexy, and very sweet poem this morning… felt nice.. though he doesn’t exacty “turn me on”.. and he’s handsome.. IDK whats up… Hes coming to meet me in the next week or so so we’ll see what’sup in person…

    But if I find a good road trip possibility to get our heels thrown in the air by some cute cowboys in Texas I’ll let ya know!


  16.  #16LD on April 6, 2011 at 9:46 am


    This is exactly what I struggle with every single day…

  17.  #17Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 9:47 am

    Okay I posted this on the last thread before I saw there was a new post…

    Did I miss any reviews/reccomendations between the two books…

    Calling in the one.


    Soulmate Secret


  18.  #18Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 9:51 am

    @13 Laughing Goddess

    Thank you for reminding me to take my vitamin D today. 🙂 That’s good that you’re taking care of yourself. I’m also doing the same. As for changing thoughts I am involved with this program called Recovery International…it’s this program based on cognitive behavioral therapy that gives a person mental fitness “tools” to combat and replace negative thoughts. It’s been helping me sooo much and I am ever grateful. I am also seeing a therapist, but even with the reduced fee I find it hard to pay for it. I may have to stop going to therapy but at least I will always be involved in Recovery International.
    I’ve also read Potatoes not Prozac..that book has helped alot because I’ve always felt like my body was “addicted” to sugar. I’m working on applying those techniques to myself.
    Lets continue taking good care of ourselves. I have to make it a goal to get off the laptop and go outside today. It’s a lovely day.

  19.  #19Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 9:59 am

    Thanks Jilly, Lercomari, lovingme and DE.

    Shandi I am not sure I whould start trusting yet because it seems your intution is telling you otherwise. It’s been two years so I am assuming that you have not set any boundaries on when you want him to take the relationship to the other level. Or are you comfortable here? Unless you are living with him he might have one foot in and one foot out the door. What is your intuition telling you?

  20.  #20Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 10:05 am

    @LD 16

    I read your other posts and I have to say I feel happy and hopeful when I see another woman setting boundaries and sticking to them the way you have. This has protected you from a lot of heartache and while the sexual desire may be strong in you, you care enough about yourself and you are educated enough to not sleep with a man until he is serious about you. I really like that a lot.
    I told my mom about Techie wanting sex, she looked at me wide-eyed and said, “No! Don’t sleep with him. You know I’ve told you that sex is to consummate a relationship, not to start one.” And I’m so glad she told me that. She’s been divorced for awhile now and has remarried twice, both times to jerks who didn’t deserve her. So she has quite a bit of experience to offer. She also said we’d go shopping for dildos…LoL. Thanks mom for the advice, but we’re not going sex toy shopping together. 🙂

  21.  #21Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 10:06 am

    @1: Meemee says:
    “…Top of the world…”

    Yea, Meemee. What a good sign. 😀

    Hello, world. A new post; I saw the name Jim. Is that the same Jim that was here a few months ago…but “is not here anymore?” I did not say “poofed.” That Jim explained he didn’t want to compete with other men for a woman.

    After his posts, I began noticing how often there were stories of men that didn’t want to compete with other men. But!!! they had no problem whatsover competing with a woman to get their way; they pushed, pushed, pushed, a woman’s stated boundaries.

    Now I will read the new Rori post and maybe see which Jim this is. A new Jim or the “poofed” Jim that isn’t around here anymore.


  22.  #22Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 10:20 am

    Yes, that’s the one. I particulary remember this part:

    “… So what if I started cd’ing? How would I communicate to each of my women that this is ok, not to worry…”

    There is certainly a power assumption here. LOL 😆


  23.  #23Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 10:24 am

    Lercomari: Yay! I feel so excited to hear about other thought changing modalities. I’m going to check that site out.

    It is a beautiful day! I’m ready to get out and enjoy it.

    I giggled hearing about your mom offering to go dildo shopping. A sweet offer but I would feel a little uncomfortable too. 🙂

  24.  #24Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 10:25 am

    Lercomari: do you ever listen to Abraham Hicks?

  25.  #25LD on April 6, 2011 at 10:27 am


    “Sex is to consummate a relationship, not start one.”

    I like that. Thank you. I’m going to use that in my boundary communication. Trust me, I need all of the help I can get. It’s really hard to stick to them sometimes when my body is screaming for sex….

  26.  #26Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 10:30 am

    Lucy: Hi! How is your daughter?

    How are you feeling about the Saturn thing?

    I ran the right man report for LI and I and I’ve been processing that. We have lots of compatibility but we do have one aspect that is challenging.

    I felt sad and disappointed when I read it. Since then I am starting to come to terms with it.

  27.  #27Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 10:34 am

    Let’s shift global consciousness
    from instability and discord
    to balance, cooperation, and enduring peace
    We’re launching a brand new initiative with Jeddah Mali, and we are inviting you to participate as our guest – at no charge.
    The first event is Thursday, April 7, at 2:00 pm Central Time. You’ll be able to listen to a recording at any time – also at no charge.
    Once each month for 30 minutes we will focus our collective energy on global care—again at no charge—following this format:
    1) A five-minute opening conversation.
    2) A five-minute process to focus our hearts and amplify our collective intent.
    3) An optional 20-minute meditation.
    Join us at
    Simply come to this webpage at the appointed time, log in, and join others in a meditation for the care of our planet. Best of all, you’ll see your position on a map of the world, and you’ll see where everyone else is, too, focusing their energy on the exact same purpose. You can even upload a photo of yourself. It is very cool!
    Each session will be conducted live at 2:00 pm Central Time on the first Thursday of each month. Jeddah and I really hope you will join us.

  28.  #28Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 10:35 am

    @15: Prairie Girl says:
    “…Iowa horse trainer wrote me a sorta sexy, and very sweet poem this morning…”

    Another CD, with poetry, good! They just keep a’coming, er, uh,.. yeah.


  29.  #29Daria on April 6, 2011 at 10:35 am

    Happy birthday Femininewoman

  30.  #30Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 10:39 am

    Hi everyone. Thank you so much for all the love and prayers yesterday. My daughter was admitted to the hospital with very poor pulmonary function test results – small airways only at 17%. 🙁 Her doctor seemed optimistic though about getting her to a better status. The plan is for her to have IV antibiotics there for a couple days then go back to school while continuing IV’s (she has a port) so that she can hopefully still graduate in May. Appreciate continued prayers!

  31.  #31Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 10:43 am

    @30: Lucy says:

    …Her doctor seemed optimistic though about getting her to a better status….”

    That’s good news, Lucy. Hanging in there plus getting better is always good.

    Take care of yourself too.


  32.  #32Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 10:48 am

    Hi LG. Thanks for asking. (See above.) I found out that my rising sign is in the third phase of a saturn cycle (in addition to moon being in second) so I feel hopeful that hard times may be winding down. I have definitely had more than my share since the timing of the cycles began! Also found out that my daughter’s moon sign is same as mine – so maybe she has brighter days ahead. Oh I hope! I love her so much!

  33.  #33Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 10:49 am

    @Lucy wishing you and your daughter all the best. I’m glad the doctor is optimistic.
    @Laughing Goddess
    If you google recovery international you’ll get the website. The system was founded by Dr. Abraham Lowe. It’s helped a lot of people, including myself. I think I will get dressed and at least go get the mail today. I need to get outside. Also I am taking a break from talking to guys online today…I’m just going to get some work done and maybe watch a movie tonight. I’ve heard of Abraham Hicks..I don’t know much about him other than he’s related to law of attraction somehow.
    I’m glad my mom’s comment made you She’s the most awesome mom ever. 🙂

    @LD 25
    I’m glad that statement helps you. It really is powerful. Ironically my mother heard it from one of the men she was dating. I will use it in my boundary communication as well.

    I feel excited for my date tomorrow. 🙂

  34.  #34Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Thanks Daria

    Lucy what is the port? Is it something they call a central line by her collar bone? Sounds like a condition my father was dealing with also. Hope all goes well but have to admit shuttling back and forth from the hospital was not easy. It is difficult to leave a loved one there. All the best and my prayers are with you and your family.

  35.  #35LD on April 6, 2011 at 10:57 am


    You and your your daughter are in my thoughts and prayers….

  36.  #36Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 10:57 am

    Sorry to hear your sadness about your report with LI. 🙁 If it’s accurate will it be a dealbreaker? I ran the compatibility calculator with several ppl’s birthdates and was amazed by how well things fit. My ex-h and I showed up as quite compatibile – but that he would lie to me and have fidelity issues!!! Which is exactly how it was! My parents showed up as having a stormy, conflict-filled, passionate, strong, stable, loving, adoring, lasting union – and that’s what it’s been for over 50 years!

  37.  #37Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 11:03 am

    Pulling a post forward for Emerson, saying Hi! and Lucy, I’m sorry about your daughter; glad she is in good hands. I’ve been unable to breathe for about 4 days and it’s awful!! Hopefully they’ll use great meds on her and better soon….

    and the LINK FROM KATARINA – yall, it’s someone who made an audio of how to “send” love remotely – NOTHING to do with whoever Wendi Friessen is and Celtic Blue, it’d be a good idea to click on links before you assume stuff like copyright infringement, okay? That felt bad and shamed….and I wouldn’t ask anyone to do that!

    and to Emerson:

    Emerson – I was sad by your story and NOT having been married is not BAD….it’s sad that standards we have for men, when turned on us will make us feel badly, huh?

    I posted about I’ve been way beyond the how come question many times to: for someone as beautiful as you…WHY ARENT you!! D’uh?

    I’m committment phobic, high maintenance and I don’t HAVE to marry you…with a laugh, but how many women can really say that?

    Marriage is not an end game, it’s something some people – and successful women less and less – don’t want from what I read!

    Sorry if it hurts –

    and ummm, on the fertility thing – you should research that. At 40 my doctor told me do it now or you won’t do it – and I believed all the oh, she had a baby at 50 stories – and never could get pregnant again. The eggs start to thicken and get misshapen and there are tons less of them as they are also less viable….so yes, it could happen. But most of the time older actresses and such are using someone else’s eggs. If this is important to you – I so strongly urge you to act, like TODAY!!


  38.  #38Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 11:05 am

    oh, and funny how much my post to Emerson sounds like Rori’s post on circular dating…

    happy day everyone!!

  39.  #39Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 11:05 am

    With TN man and WH it showed us being wildly passionate and fun together but with volatility. (Interestingly, Tn’s venus is gemini and WH’s sun is gemini.) Fb college guy showed as being a loving, compatibile, stable but somewhat Boring union with me (exactly what I feel!) It’s all quite fascinating. Do you feel comfortable sharing what kind of difficulty showed up in your report?

  40.  #40Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 11:10 am

    @ Lucy 39

    Can I ask what calculator you are using?

  41.  #41Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 11:15 am

    I just read Rori’s article on this thread. I hope this finally clears it up for those who were missing Rori’s point around CDing and exclusivity!

  42.  #42Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 11:17 am

    Oh and SLV – from the previous thread..

    THANK YOU for the knowledge that it’s NOT just a last hurrah… I like that thought better than it’s all in my hormones…

    Angels on your body.

  43.  #43Mel on April 6, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Feeling great today!

    I found out I’ve passed the second round of interviews and on to the final “skills assessment” stage. Hopefully if I do well at that, I might receive a job offer. Yay! 🙂

    I picked hubby up from the airport yesterday evening and he seemed really happy to see me! I really felt loved.

    Another interesting thing happened that I really loved!….

    As we were driving home, he mentioned how a bunch of new work has been dumped on him because someone else hadn’t done their share. He said he’s going to have some long days this week to catch up. My heart sank. I haven’t seen him for 5 days and now he’s telling me that I won’t really see him around the house too much for the next while. Rather than blame and be angry, I said, “I feel sad about that. I know I’m just being selfish, but I haven’t seen you for a while and I miss you.” He grabbed my hand and kissed it and said “I’m sorry. Let’s spend some time together tonight. I miss you too.”

    OMG! This is what I’ve been hoping for for so long! I feel like he finally gets me, understands what I’m feeling, and what I need. Just a little bit of time to reconnect and some empathy for my feelings. Just the fact that he understood how hard it is for me and acknowledged it is a huge step. That’s all I need, really. 🙂

    I’m going to keep up with the feeling messages because after a while, they really DO work!

    Love you all!

  44.  #44Evan Marc Katz on April 6, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Sorry, Rori and all the Goddesses and Sirens reading this. Here’s where this breaks down:

    When a man isn’t a player, is sincerely relationship-oriented, but isn’t 100% positive that he wants to marry you.

    This describes me and Every. Single. One. of my male friends when we’re going through the courtship process.

    So if I’m your boyfriend, I’m not seeing anybody else, and we’re trying to figure out if we’re compatible for the next 30 years (not just the next three months), it only stands to reason that I need some time to figure things out. Just like YOU should need time to figure things out.

    And if you pull the CD card on the man who is your devoted (but unsure) boyfriend, you will quickly destroy any trust he has in your relationship.

    The principle behind Circular Dating is well-intentioned, but the practice of doing it with a good man who is rightfully trying to make a smart decision about his future only serves to sabotage what you’re building. Same as if your boyfriend of six months told you he was going to date other people because you weren’t “sure” about him.

    You can’t build anything if you’re always looking for the escape route. At some point you have to trust, become vulnerable and yes, risk getting hurt.



  45.  #45Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 11:25 am

    Lucy: Well Carol Allen breaks down the compatibility into 15 steps. All of the general stuff is great but she says we have a pitta imbalance. We are both very fiery. I can definitely see this and it relates to the conflicts I’ve mentioned before.

    We have one aspect that she says is am important indicator for a long lasting relationship and one that is pretty bad. She says that the good stuff can outweigh the bad.

    At first I felt pretty disappointed but now I feel more at peace with it. It really makes sense and explains a lot about what has been going on between us. And now that I understand where it is coming from, I’m noticing I feel a lot less triggered when it happens.

    She said the main thing is, when we get triggered to just take some space. That it will be hard for us to find resolution together in the moment but if we take space things will mellow out. This definitely seems to be true.

    I also ran a report on me and Mr Charisma. We have lots of good connections but that he doesn’t install a feeling of safety in me and that my energy is a little high for him. This confirms what I already thought.

  46.  #46Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 11:31 am

    @42: Prairie Girl says:
    “… I like that thought better than it’s all in my hormones…”

    I think it sort of is in the hormones and lots of peaks and valleys as we get older but you’ll probably always be sexy. That’s good.

    IMHO, I think being in love makes us sexier and our brain boosts hormone production too. And then more hormones makes us more apt to “fall in love” so it’s cyclical. I have only myself as anecdotal proof but … that’s what it’s been like for me. I wish I could be attached to someone who was worth it.

    That’s a positive wish, working on it, working on it…

    You can save some of the guys until later and still be OK… LOL 😆 and not to worry.


  47.  #47Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 11:32 am

    Lucy: re 32

    Yes, brighter days ahead. I totally feel that. 🙂

  48.  #48Paul on April 6, 2011 at 11:37 am

    I am a married man who desperately wants his wife to fall back in love him. I want to know if you have similar programs designed for men who need all the help they can get.

  49.  #49KS on April 6, 2011 at 11:37 am

    Where are you running these astrology reports?

  50.  #50Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 11:40 am

    Awwww Paul. I hope you get your heart’s desire.

  51.  #51Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 11:43 am

    Hi, Paul – I hope you find some answers here and the man who just posted, Evan Mark Katz has a website for guys, too…

    and btw, EVAN MARK – if you are still here, I would really love to hear if you believe when you are dating that every woman wants to marry you? or even that that is every woman’s end goal? Or, do you attempt to form a committed relationship with similar values and see where you both want to end up. In other words, if a woman wasn’t necessarily wanting to marry anyone – like myself – but was willing to be in a committed relationship, would you not want to date her because her goal is not marriage??



  52.  #52Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 11:44 am

    Awww Mel my heart felt warm reading that. I wish you all the best with the job situation, you deserve the best.

  53.  #53Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 11:44 am

    KS: I’ve been running them at Carol Allen’s site.

  54.  #54Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Also Paul Scott McKay is married and has great programs for men and couples both –

    Good luck!

  55.  #55Luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 11:47 am

    @ 44 EMK

    How can someone know a man is or isn’t a player, I share you same point of view about circular dating (must be my masculine side), however I feel men are territorial and they want to keep a woman they REALLY like hanging.
    My last guy, gave me the exclusivity speech and I agreed, but he wanted me to be exclusive while he dated others and ended up with someone else (I just found out about this), wouldn’t circular dating helped me? At least I would not have been hung up on a man who gave empty promises.

    Maybe all relationship advice sucks at the end, and people are just to screwed up to have a mature relationship. It seems like dating is a man’s game, where women end up being blamed for doing too much, or nothing at all.

  56.  #56Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 11:47 am

    LG, what you described btwn you and LI (and what Carol said) sounds very much like my parents! VERY much. They have learned how to “do the dance” and give each other grace, mercy, and space to “recover” when needed. They love each other so deeply and are good to one another despite their “iron sharpens iron” dynamic.

  57.  #57Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 11:49 am

    I resonate to a certain extent with this statement “The principle behind Circular Dating is well-intentioned, but the practice of doing it with a good man who is rightfully trying to make a smart decision about his future only serves to sabotage what you’re building”. However, if he is trying to make a smart decision about his future, I should have the space to do the same about mine, and my smart decision “for me” might be cdating until I am sure he is a good man and is actually building something I want to share in.

  58.  #58Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 11:49 am

    Rori mentioned the reports on her teleclass last week. She said she’s not a big follower of astrology but that the compatability reports are interesting because the first thing it focuses on is if the man’s energy is flowing towards the woman or vice-versa. She said that is what we want to look for…a man whose energy flows towards us. We are the flower, he is the waterer.

  59.  #59Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 11:50 am

    Evan, I think you may be misunderstanding Rori’s recommendations around CDing.

  60.  #60Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 11:52 am

    Lucy: re 56

    I had the same thought when I read your description of your parents relationship. 🙂

  61.  #61Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 11:53 am

    Scott thinks that if you have an opinion you should know why you don’t believe in something else.


    from Scott Mckay –

    I have to tell you, this may be the very first (and last) time you hear a monogamous couple broach this subject publicly, which is actually a shame. Sort of like how I believe one’s core world view shouldn’t be decided by “accident of birth” but rather by personal choice, how one structures one’s romantic relationships should be decided much in the same way.

    Let’s face it. It’s a fear-based reaction to try to prohibit someone who you’d like to believe the way you do from reading literature that conflicts with it, yet that’s what parents and shortsighted faith-based institutions do all the time.

    Bummer. Because if you want to be a stronger follower of [insert world view of choice here] instead of a “yes man”, then you should know why you don’t believe in something else.

    Here in the US, at least, the core concept of getting married to one other person has pretty much been the de facto standard for, well, ever. We get that this “cultural meme” is pretty much forced on us.

    So rest assured you can bet that Emily and I also completely get it if you’re not so interested in “your father’s Oldsmobile”. We understand if you think socialized monogamy is only for the faint of heart and is probably largely responsible for all the cheating and divorce that goes on in these parts.

    But here’s the thing. We’ve indeed read and heard all about open relationships…including The Lifestyle, “circles”, even the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy of the rich and famous.

    And we’ve still made the choice to be a couple, as in two people together. It’s an informed choice. We’re neither “trapped” nor in “possession” of one another, it’s just that we love each other wildly and wholeheartedly believe in the “one man/one woman” arrangement.

    So YES…as you listen to this podcast, you can plan on hearing some very honest musings with regard to all kinds of open relationships. We’ll talk about the pros and cons, and we’ll do so without judgment.

  62.  #62Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 11:54 am

    LG I have to admit I have some whose energy have been flowing towards me but I am sure they were watering other people as well. In my experience it is not black and white because I find I don’t always want the one that is flowing towards me.

  63.  #63Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 11:56 am

    Thanks for the well-wishes all. FW, happy birthday dear. <3 Yes, a port is a central line with permanent access (usually in the upper chest as hers is). Lercomari I will locate the calculator – can't paste link via phone – LG, do you know which one I mean?

  64.  #64Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 11:59 am

    RE 63 Same thing my dad has an I wasn’t comfortable with it. I felt it was invasive. They are talking about sending him home with some other machine, something like bpap where he puts something over his face when he sleeps at night and the machine pumps the oxygen straight into the lungs. Apparently carbon monoxide is recycling into his body.

  65.  #65Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    Lucy: is it the calculator on carol’s site?

  66.  #66Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    FW: the way I understand what Rori is saying is that the energy flowing from them to us is just the baseline for us being willing to have a relationship with them.

    Of course there are other factors as well…this is just the baseline.

  67.  #67Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    Tracy, I have two sons about the same age as yours and they have struggled as young men bc of the divorce and their dad’s choices. Do you want to share more specifics?

  68.  #68Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    Thanks LG

  69.  #69Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    Btw, happy birthday FW. 50 turns around the sun! That’s awesome!!!!

  70.  #70Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Luzydel Just to let you know I would be shocked if EMK responds to your question. I have noticed in the past that he only makes comments when it is convenient to him but ignores people’s questions. It has caused me to question his genuinness in really helping people here. I wonder if Rori guest posts on his blog?

  71.  #71Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 12:09 pm

    Thank you LG, thank you Lucy.

  72.  #72Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    EMK: Hi! IMHO you and Rori are basically saying the same thing. She is all for giving the “good guy” a chance.

    In general, many of us are here because we have been overfunctioners and/or in imaginary relationships. We are the ones who profess our undying love and commitment to men who often aren’t giving that back. We are trying to break that pattern and cd-ing helps with that.

    I do get your point that sometimes we need to be patient and give a relationship a chance to grow and develop and that seeing other people can possibly sabotage that developing intimacy.

    I really do overall think you and Rori are on the same page. What do you think?

  73.  #73Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    FW, yes a port is “invasive” – it is surgically implanted – but it is far better than the alternatives. She got hers about a year ago when they could no longer do PICC lines (Peripherally Inserted Central Catheters) on her bc all the veins in her arms were shot from years of PICCs. “Regular” IV’s have to be re-inserted every couple days, are prone to infection, are often uncomfortable, and require the patient to stay in the hospital or have daily home nurse care. A port allows for much greater safety, comfo

  74.  #74Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    comfort, and independence.

  75.  #75Katarina Phang on April 6, 2011 at 12:24 pm

    Evan, I see where you’re coming from. I really do and agree with you for the most part. However, some men are more sincere than others. There are many women who have been in stagnant relationships, year after year without the men wanting to move it to the next level, this is where CD fits in.

    Women have to treat if the men they’re with are sincere or not on a case by case basis. If you have just met him and he has shown very good signals and are consistent and if he offers an exclusivity, I would say go for it. Give it a chance for at least 6 months and then evaluate it again.

    There shouldn’t be exclusivity with no time limit. Every aspect of the relationship should be evaluated on an ongoing basis, especially for women who have been there and have no time to waste.

    I agree about the need of being vulnerable and all that. You are not ready for a relationship if you can’t risk being hurt. But there are ways to do it the smart way, or the counter-productive way.

    My .02.

  76.  #76Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:25 pm

    LG/Lercomari – It’s either on Carol Allen’s site or cafeastrology. I will look in a few minutes.

  77.  #77Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    @55: Luzydel says:
    “…however I feel men are territorial and they want to keep a woman they REALLY like hanging…”

    Hi Luzydel, it’s not Evan Marc, it’s SLV.

    I think, yes, some men will keep a woman hanging around especially if she is willing to do so. I also believe that keeping a woman hanging around is not proof that he REALLY likes her.


  78.  #78Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:39 pm

    Jacqueline, interesting McKay post! I’ve noticed there is a growing belief that when we are truly healed and enlightened we will embrace whatever our partners want to do with other people – and that when we don’t it’s bc of our insecurities, selfishness, etc. I mentioned this observation to my daughter and she said that’s how it was in the book Brave New World (which I surprisingly never read or at least don’t recall reading). This also came up today in my convo w Tinque on other thread.

  79.  #79Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    LG and Katarina, thanks for what you wrote Evan. I agree that he and Rori are on the same page. I notice I feel disappointed when it seems Rori’s ideas about CDing/exclusivity are misunderstood.

  80.  #80Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    (not just by Evan, but by some sirens who take it in the extreme opposite direction to how he does)

  81.  #81Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    LG: I feel disappointed when I see that too.

  82.  #82Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    I think this is the url for the compatibility calculator I was using:

  83.  #83Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    Oooo, I just caught man in a forum doing the “I feel” Eek! “I feel you should… ” eek!

    Am borrowing worry right now. Crazy thoughts. What will I do if I am meeting a new man and he pulls that stunt? Will I sound like a mouse if I scream “Eek!”

    Have I ever said “I feel you should…?” Eek!

    Sweetie says “tip on past and do better next time.” He says he might say it too… Eeeek!


  84.  #84Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 1:08 pm

    Had to share this that a male friend sent to me


    Barbara Walters, of 20/20, did a story on gender roles in Kabul , Afghanistan , several years before the Afghan conflict.

    She noted that women customarily walked five paces behind their husbands.

    She recently returned to Kabul and observed that women still walk behind their husbands. Despite the overthrow of the oppressive Taliban regime, the women now seem happy to maintain the old custom.

    Ms Walters approached one of the Afghani women and asked, ‘Why do you now seem happy with an old custom that you once tried so desperately to change?’

    The woman looked Ms Walters straight in the eyes, and without hesitation said, “Land mines.”

    Moral of the story is (no matter what language you speak or where you go):


  85.  #85Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    SLV: haha! That is so funny because LI is catching himself now when he wants to something regarding what I should do and choosing to rephrase it on his own accord because he never likes the result.

  86.  #86Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 1:10 pm

    @78: Lucy says:
    “…she said that’s how it was in the book Brave New World (which I surprisingly never read or at least don’t recall reading). This also came up today in my convo w Tinque on other thread…”

    Maybe time to revisit that book. Maybe do it as a CD? tee hee 😆 I’ll go write an ad for that. I want to do 90 ads.


  87.  #87Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    The weird thing is, I felt excited that Rori’s new post would finally clear up the confusion! But apparently it didn’t! 🙁 *pouty face*

  88.  #88Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    @84: Femininewoman says:
    “…The woman looked Ms Walters straight in the eyes, and without hesitation said, “Land mines…”

    LOL 😆


  89.  #89Evan Marc Katz on April 6, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    Rori and I talked about this the other day – and while she feels we’re kind of saying the same thing, I’m not so sure.

    If my “smart decision” means taking a couple of years before I decide to give you a ring and your “smart decision” involves dating other men at any point during those two years, it seems to be not only patently unfair to the man who is exclusive, as well as an action that is likely to drive a wedge between you.

    You can’t ask him for an answer he doesn’t have. That’s why he’s DATING you – to figure out if he wants to marry you. The more you push a good man before he’s ready, the more he’s going to pull away. Don’t take my word for it – take a look at the actions of men in your past.

    If you don’t get the sense that your relationship is building, then LEAVE him and find a man who gives you what you need. But to date when you have a boyfriend is, from a man’s perspective, harmful. Since it takes two to tango, you have to respect a man’s timetable. I proposed earlier than any man I know – and that was after 16 months. Most of my friends dated for 3 years before proposing. I promise you, if you their girlfriends did any CDing at any point in the relationship, they would NOT have become wives…

    Date multiple guys before you find a boyfriend.

    When you find a boyfriend, focus on him exclusively.

    If you don’t get the relationship you deserve, then leave and find a new guy.

    Anything else is just noise.

    Love you. Love Rori. Not a fan of the CDing 🙂


  90.  #90Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    Evan how do you feel about a woman saying she’d be “exclusive” but not open endedly… I mean.. saying okay.. I’ll give you 3 months.. 6 months… you figure out if I’m for you… Women tend to fall into imaginary relationships very easily (at least I do)..

    You talk about if the relationship is “building”.. well to me it might feel like it is.. I’m easy that way… he was talking about where we’d build our house… “future talking” a thing I’ve learned men do w/out any real or SERIOUS thoughts about having a future w/the woman they’re saying it to…

    Almost like they’re “test driving” the idea.. and the woman believes the relationship is building… she wastes years sometimes while he “decides” if she’s the one….

    I too have a problem with not being exclusive and CDing… It’s very hard for me… I do see the principle of it…I haven’t had to make the decision about exclusivity yet.. no one’s asked for it..

    Also keep in mind when answering this that I’m 46, have been married and already have kids… I sorta think our age changes the dynamic for both me and the guy.. but I could be wrong..

    Thanks for your input!

  91.  #91Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    Had to share this from coach Carter

    They think that if they can just get him to stop ignoring what it is that they share, and to not be afraid… that the guy will “come to his senses” and come back to them.


    If you’ve ever been in this situation, or known a woman who was, here are the 5 most common ways women respond that don’t work and push men away or turn them off for good:

    1) Pretending you don’t want anything serious either and keep on sleeping with the man “casually” in hopes that things will grow from the “physical relationship”

    2) Staying close to him by trying to become his “best friend” as you help him in his life and with his problems – all the while imagining the “payoff” of a real relationship for your good deeds once he recognizes how great you are

    3) Trying to make him jealous by telling him you’re seeing other guys, even if you’re not. Or going out with other guys and doing things with them not because you like them, but because you want him to find out and want you back

    4) Getting mad at him and telling him he’s dumb, immature, and acting like a little BOY… and that he’s just scared of a real relationship and a commitment – and then trying to get him to have a relationship with you to “fix” himself

    5) Trying to make him interested in you by complimenting him, doing nice things for him, taking up things he’s interested in to be around him… and being available to him at anytime he should show interest. This is kind of like trying to be his “best friend,” but different since it’s often still sexual.

    Now, I’m guessing that you recognized at least one of these responses as you were reading through them.

    As you read yours, you probably thought “Oh no, that was me!”… and now you see your behavior in a slightly different light.

    In fact, maybe you see you’ve made a couple of these mistakes with men.

    Here’s the thing…

    None of these responses ever work with men.


    Feel free to ask your girlfriends and your guy friends if you don’t believe me.

    Doing these things with a man is like instant MAN-REPELLENT.

    But, strangely enough, even though these universally don’t get men to respond in any positive way… these are still the most common ways that women who don’t understand men and dating respond.

    Which begs the question…

    Why do so many women make these same mistakes in the first place? And why are these so universally common?

    The short answer is this-

    If a woman makes these kinds of mistakes with men, it’s NOT because she “learned” it by seeing it work for other women with other men.

    Absolutely not.

    It’s because she does WHAT MAKES SENSE to HER in the moment.

    But guess what?

    If you’ve spent enough time around men, then you’ve probably discovered that men DON’T MAKE MUCH SENSE.

  92.  #92Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    Also…a repeat… no one has an opinion on the two books?
    I know I’ve seen people say they are reading them…
    I don’t really want to buy both if they repeat info… or … you know…
    sigh…HEP me please…lol

  93.  #93kaitlyn on April 6, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    Happy birthday, FeminineWoman!!!

  94.  #94Daria on April 6, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    “When I was doing Rapid Eye Technology, I had many clients who were having “relationship problems”. Inevitably, the women were distraught over not being able to have the man they wanted and the men were puzzled about why the woman they loved couldn’t recognize that they were, indeed, loved. I am suspicious that men might know their hearts better than women do. I finally came to suggest to the women, “I don’t care whether you think he is the man you’re supposed to marry or even how you feel about him; I care about what HE feels.” Men seem better equipped to access information about their future mates.

    So, I began to suggest to the men, “All women care about is whether they are loved and cherished and, ergo, whether their children will be taken care of.” A good marriage seems not to be based upon whether women love their man as much as whether they feel loved by their man. Correspondingly, a good marriage seems not to be based upon whether men feel loved by their woman as much as whether they feel as if they can trust their woman to respect, support, and honour them. Once a man makes up his mind about a woman, he almost blindly trusts her to run the relationship, the family, the home, etc. until he has evidence to the contrary. I don’t think it matters much what a woman opts to think about the man who loves her, just as long as he does love her.

    My friend told me that even before their marriage ceremony was over, her husband turned to the guests and raved, “I got myself an angel!” What a demonstration of love and trust! Imagine the sense of security she felt, in hearing that! Well, only we women can imagine that because that is all we care about….. “Does he love me enough to take care of me and my children? Will he brave the world to keep us safe?”

    Mary Croft from her blog

  95.  #95Daria on April 6, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    “What a man needs to hear is a woman boasting about how well he is handling the world and how safe and happy she feels with him as her partner.

    There is a case of a woman who wants to divorce her husband so she consults an attorney. He hands her the papers and tells her what to do. She said, “Oh, no; I don’t want just to divorce him; I want to make him miserable.” With a sigh, the attorney says, “I see. Then, follow my instructions closely: go home and be happy.” “What?!?! But, I’m NOT happy and I want to make him as miserable as he has made me!” “I know; I’m telling you how to do that. Be happy. Happily make his favourite meals; have sex with him whenever he wants it; wear the clothes he loves; at the end of his work day, look lovely, have a drink ready for him and, with a smile, ask him about his day; socialize only with those friends whom he enjoys; do not bore him with your idle chatter; talk about only subjects which he finds interesting ….. you get my drift.” “Are you crazy?” “No; I promise you that, if you are willing to do this for six months, when you do divorce him, you will make him completely miserable! He will be lost without you. I’ll contact you in six months.” When the attorney rang her to remind her about proceeding with the divorce, the woman exclaimed, “Divorce! Are you crazy?! I’ve never been so happy in my life!”

    What is the number one thing a man wants from his woman? No. He wants to see her happy….. because of him.

    more Mary Croft (Mary if you read this i am attempting to give you credit, i hope this is enough – love ya)

  96.  #96Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    EMK: I feel very happy to hear your perspective on this. Thank you.

    Really, it still sounds like you are saying the same thing. Perhaps the apparent difference is due to the difference between masculine and feminine thinking and expressing?

    I am currently doing exactly what you describe. I am in a committed relationship with a man. He hasn’t proposed and honestly I’m not ready for him to. We are getting to know each other and I feel safe and confident in his love and loyalty. If it ever gets to the point that I don’t feel confident in his love for me I will start cd-ing immediately.

    I’m working with Rori personally and she has totally encouraged me to stay with this situation. I found myself pulling away due to my own fears of intimacy.

    My main point is that she is encouraging me to do exactly what you are saying.

  97.  #97Boomer on April 6, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    91, FW:

    “2) Staying close to him by trying to become his “best friend” as you help him in his life and with his problems – all the while imagining the “payoff” of a real relationship for your good deeds once he recognizes how great you are”

    Oy-vay! Had a sad affair where I did that. Right after my separation five years ago. He sure was happy to have me plan his dad’s funeral and cook for him and pick him up at the airport–but he committed to another woman.

    “None of these responses ever work with men. Ever. Doing these things with a man is like instant MAN-REPELLENT.”

    Indeed! Never again!

  98.  #98Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    @87: Lucy says:
    “…The weird thing is, I felt excited that Rori’s new post would finally clear up the confusion! But apparently it didn’t! *pouty face*…”

    We’ve been down this road before on the blog; perhaps it will come up again.

    I’ve learned a lot from my parents, grandparents, life, Rori and other dating coaches I will not name. I have a good idea what I’m doing and if it doesn’t serve me, I’ll get another idea. I keep learning and tweaking…


  99.  #99Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 1:42 pm

    FW: oh my! I did all of those man repellents. Thankfully those days are past. 🙂

    Daria: love the Mary croft posts!

  100.  #100Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    Thanks kaitlyn.

    Boomer and LG I have done some myself. Thank goodness for these coaches.

  101.  #101Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    PG: I have only read Arielle Fod’s book. I enjoyed it. I have heard that their is some repeat info between the two.

  102.  #102Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    Uhhhh there, not there ***blushes

  103.  #103Femininewoman on April 6, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    I got the Soulmate Secret from the library. What is the other book being refered to?

  104.  #104Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    @90: Prairie Girl says:
    “…Evan how do you feel about a woman saying she’d be “exclusive” but not open endedly… I mean.. saying okay.. I’ll give you 3 months.. 6 months… ”

    Hahaha LOL That’s me. I take a “seasonal” approach… after a while. I think I got some flack at one point for saying that…it’s OK. A guy doesn’t get a season or two after the third steak; that would be like *I* was the fourth steak.

    I don’t wish to be one of those women saying they are “exclusive” whatever that means and putting up with the most outrageous things. Women put up with it using “feelings” over and over, hanging around while the man spends time with other women all the while decreasing his attention to the women who call themselves “exclusive.”


  105.  #105Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 1:58 pm

    Evan, it’s clear from your last post that you don’t understand what Rori is saying – particularly when you mentioned “dating other men while you have a boyfriend.” That is NOT what Rori advocates. And it’s completely not about pressuring a man, so I feel confused about those statements. I personally have never had a guy end a relationship – it has always been me that ended it. I always was exclusive (had a bf and didn’t date others) bc it worked for me – I never had a guy stringing me along, wanti

  106.  #106Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    never had a guy stringing me along, wanting me less than I wanted him – so I never felt a need to CD actual other men. But many women get stuck on a guy who IS stringing her along and in that case – yeah, end the bf/gf deal, date other guys, and if he wants to still date you too, fine. If he doesn’t, fine. This is NOT with men who are seriously exploring marriage with you! If it’s a serious exploration and a woman feels goods with it, Rori says Yes! be exclusive! for as long as it feels good! CDing is for w

  107.  #107Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    Everyone has a different approach. Here’s an excerpt from a newsletter I recently received from EMK:

    “…Here’s what Valerie has to say after only 7 weeks of coaching:

    ‘…The reasons for slowing things down –> to not tie me down so quickly so that I can assess multiple guys and we can keep discovering one another in a way that happens organically…’…”

    Hmm, sounds like a good idea. I sounds like what I’m doing. Does it sound like what anyone else here is doing?


  108.  #108Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    CDing is for when a relationship feels bad due to an imbalance in attachment and feelings.

  109.  #109Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    I’ve personally never had to use it bc I’ve never had that imbalance in a relationship – but it’s good to know it’s there if I need it.

  110.  #110Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    @108: Lucy says:
    “…CDing is for when a relationship feels bad due to an imbalance in attachment and feelings…”

    That could be one reason. Rori mentions others. I don’t believe I must feel bad with one man in order to have dinner with another man. Just me, of course… 😀


  111.  #111Boomer on April 6, 2011 at 2:17 pm

    SLV, did you ever get “Be Honest, You’re Not That Into Him Either”???

    To tell you the truth, that’s been my realization lately:

    The poofers are not upsetting to me anymore because a) there are another three (or 12 in my case) where he came from and b) I truly get that I am often not doing anything to chase him off (and perhaps occasionally I am, but I am cutting myself slack and learning), and c) I usually was not that into him either.

    That does not make a poofer any less chicken sh*t, but at least I don’t give him a second thought after he poofs. “NEXT!”

    THAT’s the power of CDing while you are “just dating.”

  112.  #112Simply Shannon on April 6, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    Evan, I feel a lot more open to the exclusivity option than I did when I first found Rori, but I don’t want to fall back into old habits. It feels difficult to know when to take a leap of faith.

    What’s the time frame you recommend to your clients before they accept exclusivity? Right away, 3 months, 6 months? What would be fair in your mind?

    I think both approaches (CDing and exclusivity) obviously work for people.

    I’m noticing a judgment coming up for me and wonder if you’d mind exploring this… I’m wondering about the women you dated prior to your wife. Would they agree with your assessment that exclusivity works best, esp. since you didn’t marry them? It worked out for your wife but what about the others? Genuinely curious what you think their perspective might be.

    I’m still comfortably sitting on the fence about this one. I needed CDing as a rule when I first came to the blog because I didn’t trust myself to have my own interests at heart. Now I do trust myself and feel open to both options.

    Sigh. That feels good to know about myself. 🙂

  113.  #113Laughing Goddess on April 6, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    Cd-ing is therapy, a place to practice our tools, to get messages and mirrors, and to practice opening our hearts.

    We can do this with one man or with many. We can do it in an exclusive relationship or not.

    For single women, it can be very liberating and freeing to date several men until one steps up. It keeps us from focusing on one man to early and really raises our vibe.

    Sometimes we are more in a place of cd-ing ourselves where we allow our inner boy to take care of our inner girl. This is important for our own inner bonding.

    Often we ebb and flow between all of these forms of cd-ing. We have choices. We choose what is best in the moment.

    We don’t need for men to understand this. It’s part of our magic, part of our mystery.

  114.  #114Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    @111: Boomer says:
    “SLV, did you ever get “Be Honest, You’re Not That Into Him Either”???,,,”

    Wow! Thanks for reminding me. It arrived at local library and I’m going to pick up now before library closes.

    I’ll be back with the book!

    “…a) there are another three (or 12 in my case) where he came from…”

    Go, Boomer!



  115.  #115Simply Shannon on April 6, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    SLV, Haha! re: 110. Yes!

    What if *I* am just not ready to commit to this man? Maybe I enjoy dating multiple men? Maybe there’s one even better than this one? Why must I limit my options when there are so many wonderful men to choose from?

    Yep… sitting comfortably on the fence…

  116.  #116Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    @113: Laughing Goddess says:

    “We don’t need for men to understand this. It’s part of our magic, part of our mystery…”

    AMEN!!! I’m magic.

    And on that note I run out the door to get my copy of…. (drum roll 😛 ) “Be Honest, You’re Not That Into Him Either.”



  117.  #117Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    Evan, did you ever date a girl who was clingy and needy, and you highly doubted you’d ever marry her (maybe a very small outside chance), but she filled a “for now” need for you? CDing multiple men is for That girl with That man.

  118.  #118Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 2:41 pm

    That’s just one scenario where it fits. There are others. It’s difficult to communicate well on my lil phone about such a complex, nuanced dating model. 🙁

  119.  #119Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    Since several people feel the point on/of cdng is not clear to other – perhaps obtuse? people…

    I’d like to summarize.

    Rori’s advice to women who want a relationship in which they will get a lifetime committment from a man, which is generally and typically referred for the purposes of this conversation, as a legal marriage certificate is to circular date until they receive that proposal.

    Cdng is defined as the process of actually dating multiple men, and using the dating process itself as a form of self discovery and therapy, or if you are having sex with a man or are already married there is another form of Cdng that involves simply enjoying a man’s company or your own and “flirting” – which is extended eye contact, smiling and letting a man initiate a conversation with you.

    You do this to keep your mind from obsessing over any one man until one man asks you to marry him no matter what.

    And if you do not do this, you run the risk of falling into a trap where you are an exclusive “girlfriend,” who might never get to be a married woman with this man.

    When or if a man you are seeing seriously who is not ready to ask you to marry him objects you may agree to sexual exclusivity, or you may not. Even if you do, you continue to dress up, hold eye contact, smile, and be open to men who initiate contact with you.

    Whether or not you tell the men you are dating you are doing this has not been clearly established.

    How you manage their expectations of sexual exclusivity is best summarized by the statement that you don’t want to add unnecessary pressure to a relationship, and you want to give a man all the time he may need to decide if you are the one, so you are going to date until he decides if he is going to propose to you.

    Whether you allow men you date to also circular date is also an action that has not been completely addressed with a definite recommendation of a course of action in that situation.

    This is all pretty clear so I don’t think anyone’s misunderstanding the concepts – I think people continue to disagree with the concept, which is allowable and doesn’t mean that anyone has less respect for Rori if this tool is not the tool they choose to use from her presentation of tools.

    Have I missed any factual data as has been presented regarding cdng in this summarization?

    Thank you all!

  120.  #120Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    Shannon, I also thought about that concept and for me – I am willing to devote six months to a relationship if I am willing to be sexually exclusive to see if evolves into something I want to live with.

    I am willing to wait indefinitely for a marriage proposal, as in my experience, it is a legally binding document that ruins your credit and does nothing for your relationship.

    But the way to decide a timeline would be to decide exactly how long you were willing to be single, divide it by 8 month periods – 2 months to find a guy, 6 months trial…and then realize that you have an option of say 4 guys, and then apply the highest possible criteria to the 4 guys you did the 8 month trial with. Alloswing for an extra 4 months/year for heartache, fun, flings, work or vacay….You’d have a four year timeline going.

    Like the fence position!

  121.  #121Prairie Girl on April 6, 2011 at 3:04 pm

    FW The other book was Calling In The One…

    Happy Birthday!… If it is today, or belated if it was yesterday… I’m trying to catch up on posts…


  122.  #122luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 3:12 pm

    I got a response from D by email, I don’t know if I should share it. I feel bad, I can blame myself for not leaving and or cding others. but this is a lesson I learned, and yes he is not a “bad” guy, but he was stringing me along and then made the decision to not date me anymore. I appreciate his honesty and that he answered my question, but I cant help feeling like an idiot.

    here is the email…

    “No, I haven’t met anyone else. I just got tired of having a profile so I decided to delete it. Also, To be honest I don’t have time for a relationship right now. I’m just too busy. I thought I did but I really don’t. I have so many things going on. It won’t be fair to you. I wouldn’t be able to give you the time and attention you deserve. I’m sorry. Hopefully we can remain friends.

    D “

  123.  #123Evan Marc Katz on April 6, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    I really have to do some work today, so let me jump in and respond to two things:

    1) Jacqueline’s motivation for CDing: “you run the risk of falling into a trap where you are an exclusive “girlfriend,” who might never get to be a married woman with this man.”

    Yes. And yet being the exclusive girlfriend is the ONLY way to get married. If you are my exclusive girlfriend and you tell me after 3 months or 6 months or 1 year that you need to see other people because I can’t promise you that I will marry you, you will ruin almost ALL relationships with men. There is literally NO way to protect yourself – because, in a healthy relationship, you’re not looking for protection, you’re not waiting for the other shoe to drop. You’re investing all you have and enjoying the process of loving. If you obsess about getting a ring – and start pressuring him to commit to marriage before he’s ready (think closer to 2 years, not 3-6 months), you’re not helping yourself at all.

    The best justification for CDing came from Lucy: “Evan, did you ever date a girl who was clingy and needy, and you highly doubted you’d ever marry her (maybe a very small outside chance), but she filled a “for now” need for you? CDing multiple men is for That girl with That man.”

    Yes. I have. And it sucks to be that girl. However the answer isn’t CDing.


    You don’t like how your boyfriend treats you? Leave!

    You don’t like how he is a regular pot smoker? Leave!

    You don’t like how he never says he loves you? Leave!

    You don’t like how his profile is still active on after four months? Leave!

    You don’t like that he only wants to talk to you once a week after six months? Leave!

    You don’t like the fact that he’s never hinted at a future after a year? Leave!

    But please, don’t mistake these men for the men like me – the ones who WANT to be in love and get married, but really want to be sure before we make such declarations. If you even suggest that you date another guy when you’re my girlfriend, I’m going to instantly find a woman who will not CD and will not pressure me to know something that I couldn’t possibly know.

    Stay tuned for a similarly themed column that I gave to Rori to share with you…



  124.  #124Ella on April 6, 2011 at 4:01 pm


    You said “…and will not pressure me to know something that I couldn’t possibly know”

    I think you will know.

    Just my opinion.

  125.  #125Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 4:03 pm

    Camile, when are they casting the extras for Batman? My daughter would LOVE to be in it!

  126.  #126Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    Lucy, I am being very left brained today, huh? smile…so I’ve given some more thought to the idea of not writing a best seller to protect your children and the only way I can see that that is a logical conclusion and proposition is if you were writing a non fiction first person autobiography or biography.

    In that case, I can understand the reasoning – though still think it’s a metaphorical leap to equate someone who does this with a child molestor.

    But my question is this – IF you were H*ll bent on being a best selling author, writing is writing – couldn’t you just find another subject that was agreeable, acceptable and churn out the #1 NYT best sellers?

    I believe those people with the writing calling are almost those who cannot not write – and if that was a genuine concern they’d write about something else.

    They’d still write though because it would be who they were – a writer.

    What do you think?


  127.  #127luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    I hate men!!!

    Not having time means “I am not that into you to actually make time to see you.”

    Not having time means that “yes I was stringing you along because you were hot and I knew that if I told you I wasn’t serious, you would not have given me a chance”

    Not having time means “than I will be having time for someone else, but not you”

    Gosh even when I was upfront, and told him what I wanted. he lied to get what he wants. Screw him!!!

  128.  #128Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:09 pm

    Luzydell – you might hate men right now, but look at you!! You love your passion…and the right man will as well.


  129.  #129Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:11 pm

    And blue green Camile – thank you! for your fine exposition and for clearing up the mystery of who….

    The Woman with the Turquoise-ness is!

    Indigo verring into purple Woman

  130.  #130Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    Regarding @107 newsletter from another dating coach.

    Is there anyone here who is dating
    and who is slowing things down,
    not being tied down quickly,
    assessing multiple guys,
    while discovering each other organically…?

    Does this really seem so at odds to what Rori is teaching? Can I get some feedback on this? I am curious.

    Otherwise, I’ll just call people “crazy” and “tip way” as I know my sweetie will advise. I could use stronger words than “crazy” but will not… unless my stated forbearance constitutes strong words… if so, there they are…


  131.  #131Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    @126: Jacqueline says:
    “..They’d still write though because it would be who they were – a writer.
    What do you think?..”

    What do I think? Or am I butting in? If one only has one story one is probably not a writer but there are some published diaries and journals that make fine reading.


  132.  #132Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    95 Mary Croft. That explains why my ex keeps blocking our divorce – I’m such a great woman – even while separated all these years – that he doesn’t want to let me go. 🙂 His tax refund was supposed to go to me as part of our settlement – but he used it to buy a motorcycle instead and said “It’s okay, we’ll just have to delay the divorce til I come up with the money again.” WTH????

  133.  #133Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    @127: luzydel says:
    “…I hate men!!!…”

    Yes, I know but while you are resting up and getting ready for the next round, you might like to read a book I just picked up:

    “Be honest–you’re not that into him either” by Ian Kerner, Ph.D The author is a Ph.D but this book looks like a fun read.

    It’s amazing that I picked up the book and it fell open to page 40 which is rather much like what you wrote in your post. Maybe you would like to read the book. I’m reading it tonight. Boomer recommended it. Yea, Boomer!

    Everything is going to be all right. Yes, there will be a next round! You will get a better man.


  134.  #134Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    SLV 110. I was referring to when it feels bad in an Exclusive relationship. If you’re going out with another man, then it’s not exclusive. 🙂

  135.  #135Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    I feel really triggered by what Jim is saying. It just seems a roundabout load a crap. Another way to get women down and steer them into the ‘girlfriend trap’ so that a man gets what he wants and doesn’t need to do a darn thing.

    Personally, I would CD until the day before my wedding. A man can propose and keep you on hold for a year or longer. He can also propose and call it off. He can also propose and stand you up at the altar.

    What part of this don’t men understand?

    A man may propose to me today and what if I’m not ready. There are things a woman needs to do to be ready as much as a man. So then what? I tell him I’m not ready and I’ll be ready in one or two years and then I continue to CD. The ones who really care stick around. The ones who don’t will just drop off and their non-genuine proposal just shines through.

    What dumb man will propose to a woman who he KNOWS is not ready? … and there are so many men like this out there!

    Dear Universe, I don’t want this! Please stop all the icky men out there from pursuing me, wasting my time and leading me to a broken heart. Thank you!

    I am the yummy pie!

  136.  #136luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    This was my reply…

    “I appreciate you getting back to me and answering my question. To be honest I am not interested in becoming a “friend” of someone who intended on dating me and kept me hanging to later tell me “he doesn’t have time”. I feel disappointed, but I thank you for your time. ”

    Good bye

  137.  #137Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    SLV -yes! That’s what I thought. do you know why Beryl Markham never wrote but one book – West into the Night? She said she’d only had one life to lead….lol, I told Rori the same thing.

    Here’s a quote from Ernest Hemingway on it!!

    “Did you read Beryl Markham’s book, West with the Night? I knew her fairly well in Africa and never would have suspected that she could and would put pen to paper except to write in her flyer’s log book. As it is, she has written so well, and marvelously well, that I was completely ashamed of myself as a writer. I felt that I was simply a carpenter with words, picking up whatever was furnished on the job and nailing them together and sometimes making an okay pig pen. But [she] can write rings around all of us who consider ourselves writers. The only parts of it that I know about personally, on account of having been there at the time and heard the other people’s stories, are absolutely true . . . I wish you would get it and read it because it is really a bloody wonderful book.”–Ernest Hemingway

    But I thought Lucy was saying she wanted to be a writer in general? or could easly write best sellers?

    Anyway, I don’t like non fiction but WWTN and Lauren Bacall’s autobiographies are soooo good, the world would be a poorer place without them!

    G’nite all…gonna actually try to rest as a means of getting well…haha

  138.  #138Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    RE: #12Lercomari – Self-control is the access to freedom. A paradox but true.

  139.  #139Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:53 pm

    Queenbee – so true, it’s all a gamble…could be left at the altar. Love is either worth the gamble, or not – personal preference, I think!

    Hope you had a DivaQueen day!!

  140.  #140Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:53 pm

    Hey, and that reminds me – Lercomari, just saying Hi! glad you’re back and nice to see you here again.

  141.  #141Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 4:55 pm

    ps…you know what the ultimate cdng is? the shows the bachelor – and well, look how that turns out?!

  142.  #142Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    @134: Lucy says:
    “….SLV 110. I was referring to when it feels bad in an Exclusive relationship. If you’re going out with another man, then it’s not exclusive. …”

    So do I have this straight: Woman in exclusive relationship that feels bad decides not to leave man but to keep him and date others in addition. Is this it? 😀


  143.  #143Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:04 pm


    This book looks good. I think reading it will be my dinner CD tonight. hahaha LOL 😆


  144.  #144Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 5:04 pm

    @ Lucy 76,
    thank you for the info. I will look those up.

    @Queenbee 138
    thank you for the reminder. Self control leads to freedom. Something else I heard, ever act of self control leads to a feeling of self respect. And I do respect myself very much for controlling my sexual urges. Thank you for your book suggestions. I need to start reading more often. I’m a writer myself and would like to write a novel one day.

    @Jacqueline 140,
    thanks for the welcome back. 🙂 Nice to see you too. I never thought of the bachelor as circular dating but you’re right. lol. I stopped watching after awhile though…I don’t think it’s really an accurate portrayal of falling in love. How many of us go on dates like bungee jumping in New Zealand? :-/

  145.  #145Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 5:05 pm

    Jacqueline 119. Lol. Sure, ppl are allowed to disagree with Rori’s model, but I do actually think in many cases they are misunderstanding rather than disagreeing. (And of course you are free to disagree with my assessment of the situation. ;)) It’s back to my hearing-impaired piano teacher example: “Little Lucy, what’s this note?” “B.” “No Lucy, it’s not D, it’s B.” She didn’t in reality disagree with me on what the note was – she just misunderstood – but she didn’t realize it – she thought I was “wrong.”:)

  146.  #146Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 5:06 pm

    And then out of all of the seasons of the bachelor and the bachelorette, only one of the couples from the show actually got married, from what I heard. Reality t.v isn’t so realistic.

  147.  #147Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 5:07 pm

    Hehe. That piano experience is probably why I dislike being misunderstood so much! It happened repeatedly and it always felt shaming the way she acted about it.

  148.  #148Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 5:08 pm

    RE: # 44 Evans says: “At some point you have to trust, become vulnerable and yes, risk getting hurt”.

    Yes, Evan. Except all the risk is for her and none for you.

  149.  #149Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:10 pm

    @135: Queenbee says:
    “…He can also propose and stand you up at the altar…”

    I know about a couple of those. One was called off after invitations went out. The other was in the church where after organist played over and over, maid of honor eventually came out to announce the wedding would not take place that day but all were invited to join together for refreshments in the reception hall. Yes, the catered food, bar, DJ etc

    Life goes on but not for this bride who eventually had a bad ending…

    So, it could be worse, if the guy is a jerk it really is better to know now no matter how much, or long!, it hurts… just don’t hang on forever.


  150.  #150Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    So in this case it’s like Rori is saying “It’s a B” and Evan is saying, “No it’s not a D, it’s a B.” And Rori is saying, “That’s what I said, B.”

  151.  #151luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    BTW I do not disagree with EMK, I had guy friends tell me the same thing. That they would not stick around if a woman will date others when he is serious about her.

    For me CDing is not just going out with other men.
    Is taking care of me and putting myself first.
    As I already lerned a man can pretend he is serious, to keep you all for himself while he make up his mind, but also a man knows withing a few dates if he wants something serious with a woman or not. He also knows how to lie to get what he wants from her.

    The problem is how does a woman knows? We are not suppose to bring up the relationship card, at the early stages of dating because it makes them gods upset (I mean men). Then how the hell do we know?
    should we wait for them to make a decision?

    Now days it is difficult knowing if a man is serious…

  152.  #152Daria on April 6, 2011 at 5:16 pm

    Circular Dating Will Get You More Love Than You Can Imagine Because It’s Therapy

    Here’s a simple question with a huge answer – to reframe the entire notion of “dating” for you…

    Rori, Ive done circular dating in the past 3 or 4 men at a time …but i ended up feeling tired an hopeless when nothing good showed up …i felt defeated…Marika

    Yeah – but Circular Dating isn’t about meeting good men.

    It’s about USING every interaction with any man – at the market – anywhere – no matter who they are or what they look like – to raise your self esteem and start finding and sorting through and healing these patterns of being attracted to unavailable men and men who just can’t do the job of relationship.

    If you interact with 100 men in a week – you’re going to learn more and heal more than years of therapy.

    Sometimes a 30 second interaction in a market or the gym – where you REALLLY PRADCTICE – BEING PRESENT, FEELING MESSAGES -Sensual Meditation – ALL OF IT —-is worth more to you therapeutically than dating one man for months….

    Marika – NOTHING, NO ONE is a CURE!!

    You have to do this yourself…using skills and Tools and AWARENESS and Behavior Modification…This is in your hands.

    You hire people to give you skills and insights and do things with you that HELP you do what you need to do. Even EFT – you learn to do it for yourself – but having someone else do it with you is way more powerful.

    It’s like getting a haircut and your all-over grooming. You can do it ALL yourself. But when a really, really good professional does it for you – or shows you HOW to use makeup and hair Tools – it’s a whole different experience and you get better results every day. But you STILL have to do it!!

    You can’t have hair and makeup come to your house every day. But after a while – you get really, really good at it, and you learn your own face and hair and end up better than nearly anyone – until another hair and makeup person shows you something NEW!!!

    My Targeting Mr. Right program is about the nuts-and bolts of Circular Dating so that you can let go of looking for some kind of result in your OLD way – and instead – feel incredible because of the immediate result you WILL get – feeling so much stronger and in control of your love life, working through “men” in a way that empowers you and gives you the practice you need in being more emotionally open, more vulnerable, and more in love with yourself.

    There’s a lot of free information about Circular Dating on the catalog page for “Targeting” – so feel free to go there and read…

    Love, Rori

  153.  #153LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:20 pm


    I hope your daughter is feeling comfortable. You both are in my thoughts

  154.  #154Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:20 pm

    @137: Jacqueline says:

    “…But I thought Lucy was saying she wanted to be a writer in general? or could easly write best sellers?..”

    Some people can do both, fiction and their own life stories, Isak Dinesen and Hemingway too! I admire that. I also admire those who are not writers but have wonder life stories to read.

    Beryl Markham, the pilot? Oh, I don’t think I read that… was she part of that East African Happy Valley bunch? Maybe I’ll read it. I love the era “between the wars.” Reading about it anyway…


  155.  #155Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:22 pm

    @144: Lercomari

    😀 Glad to see you are hanging strong.


  156.  #156LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:23 pm

    Darling Ella

    Life is just a stage, I am sure we’ll know the answers afterwards.

    PD: if a date should ever ask you again if your son is going to die, do you feel up to tell him
    “Yes, hopefully, like you and me and each of your children. He is just another mortal. Now if your question is about a near future, I can’t tell you, you and your children might die before him. God’s ways are mysterious.
    Is this convo making you nervous?
    Well imagine how it makes ME feel. Would you rather speak about what makes our children happy? Or how much we love them? What do you think?”


  157.  #157LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:24 pm


    Joyeux Anniversaire 🙂


  158.  #158LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:25 pm

    84 femininewoman

    O M G

  159.  #159LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:25 pm


  160.  #160LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:26 pm


  161.  #161LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:26 pm


  162.  #162Daria on April 6, 2011 at 5:26 pm

    omg wow.

    this feels annoying

    bypassing all arguing. i don’t need a man to understand my motivations in not getting in a commitment before the commitment i want

    if he doesn’t understand and bugs me, i will Dump him out of my dating rotation

    he won’t get to be with me

    but guess what, no it’s not 2 years for most men.

    Most men i met were ready in a couple of months to ask/beg/talk to/pressure me to start having their children.

    this to them was commitment.

    were they ready to marry? no they didn’t propose that

    but there’s a few men out there that i bet will marry me right away if i let them know it was an option.

    not unhealthy men. just men that saw me and didn’t need time to get ready. they saw i had qualities they wanted right away. they wanted to spend their whole lives with me.

    i want one of those, but one of those that feels good to me.

    Rori says its about 3 – 6 months standard till that marriage proposal.

    she did NOT wait 2 years.

    2 years is what a “difficult” man might need to be ready – that includes a man who’s a player – like most dating coaches might be (even if they don’t think of themselves that way)

  163.  #163Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:28 pm

    @145: Lucy says:
    “… “Little Lucy, what’s this note?” “B.” “No Lucy, it’s not D, it’s B.” She didn’t in reality disagree with me on what the note was – she just misunderstood – but she didn’t realize it – she thought I was “wrong.”:) ….”

    Exactly the kind of post I had directed to me by a dating coach which I shall not name. Incredibly crazy post. But he has good products. He’s a man; I’ll cut him some slack… I do that… and laugh a little LOL 😆


  164.  #164Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:31 pm

    @151: luzydel says:
    “….Then how the hell do we know?
    should we wait for them to make a decision?…”

    When I open the box and it has a shiny ring in it, I will know… maybe I’ll know sooner… I hope so…


  165.  #165Daria on April 6, 2011 at 5:31 pm


    CDing to men is like showing them that the woman he likes is not all his.

    (men don’t like this!)

    this is supposed to make it clear to him – THAT THE WOMAN IS NOT ALL HIS

    if the woman is sincere in this it becomes clear

    in order for any man to have this woman, he must MARRY HER

  166.  #166Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    Evan, lol! #123. Exactly!! Yes! That’s what it’s all about! You’ve got it, right there. Your “dump him” and “leave” are the same thing as Rori’s “don’t be a gf (with a guy like that)” – with the addition that if, in spite of your “dumping” and “leaving,” he still wants to take you to a movie or buy you a drink you let him. You leave the door open for him to become the kind of man who IS the kind of man you want to be exclusive with. People grow. CDing allows for this possibility.

  167.  #167LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:34 pm

    438: Femininewoman


    Your father is in my thought.
    I hope you can show your admiration to your father while you still can.

    I was lucky, I could show mine to my father, 2 months before he died.
    He phoned and I said a thing about my daughter.

    He said “I could never make any of you do that. I was not good at raising people.”

    It was the first time he admitted to any type of weakness.
    Something was off. I thought it was time to thank him for everything.

    He said “you are so kind to forget”

    I said “I forget nothing. I understand what I remember.
    You did great, given the circumstances.
    I owe you my life.
    You worked for all of us, you kept nothing for you. During years and years you drove kids with a difference of 20 years between the first and the last one. You drove them to school at different hours of the day and then you struggled to get at work on time yourself. You had to buy food, to cook, to get the house clean. You had to deal with the home work of each of us, with different characters, and the hippy wave back then telling us to stop working at all, lol.
    We were unbarable, I admire what you did .
    You did not give up.
    You had no wife to refill your tank of love, no family to help or even give you any advice. And on top you had to find countries to work in, and to drag all of us in the wirdiest trips ever. I am proud of you and grateful to you.”

    He said “You are way too kind. I lacked understanding and patience. I did love my children, but I am not sure they felt it”

    I said “If you worry because you used the whip, forget it.
    I never doubted you were coming from a place of love; I know you come from an ancient culture who hit children for their own good. You thought it was good education.

    I also remember the day you said JM (baby brother) was old enough to get the whip too. We cut the leather things off the whip and we hid the wooden stick. You did not really look for it, you did not buy a new one. You dropped it for ever.
    You accepted to learn from us and adapt to us. You were doing what you believed was good to us. You could have bought many houses and retire young with all the money you put in us. There was no health insurance, you kept us healthy with the best food and good schools and plenty of books and sun always. You dedicated your free time to us, always. You did not take a sport or activity without us. You listed us as a family everywhere or else you would not list us at all.
    It does not really matter if it was right or wrong, it came from a place of love. I am your daughter. I have no part in judging the education you gave us. I feel good to remember you meant to give your best.
    You worked for ever to pay our needs until we vanished from your life one after the other.
    We did not pay you back.
    You managed to have a good retirement plan so that none of us has to worry to help you. You even thought of our peace of mind as adults. I never moved a finger to help you.”

    He said “Well you are too kind anyway. If only Mummy had not left us…”
    He was still mourning my mother, even after 38 years of marriage with another woman!

    He kept silent a while, which was a first for the control freak he was. I realized he was ending his life, he would have talked over my voice or deny something, he was too concilient and attentive, something was off.
    I told my daughter her grand father could die any day now.
    He died 2 months later

    I am glad I had a chance to express my respect and gratitude before he left.


  168.  #168LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    444 mel
    445: sweetmandm


    Thank you. I was just remembering the thing about toys. Just stating facts.
    I believe millions people had a really traumatic childhood.
    I believe I was lucky and my childhood was simply average.
    It would have been better with a mother, but so many people are orphans, it is nothing out of this world either.
    I was unlucky and yet very lucky.


  169.  #169Daria on April 6, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    I want those men that are 100% positive that they want to marry me.

  170.  #170LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    449: mali

    Thank you
    hugs to you


  171.  #171LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:41 pm

    475: Femininewoman

    In the morning I felt symptoms of indigestion and like I wanted to throw up.
    I went to he bathroom but nothing came
    Then I remembered that the same symptoms belong to a heart attack. So I left the bath room and layed on the floor in the hall way. I put my legs up on a thing that was there.
    When the symptoms left, I got up and wondered what on earth happened

    Early in the afternoon, I got a phone call.

    My father had had a heart attack at the hour I was having the symptoms. He was in his pajamas, it was the time he goes to his break fast.
    He went to the bath room which implies he felt the symptoms of the heart attack and probably thought it was the other thing.
    Then he must have realized it was his heart and stepped out of the bath room and his heart stopped in the hall way where he fell on the floor.
    His own father died of a heart attack but much younger. My father was in a different city, but he felt it. He felt his chest depressed inside. He had no phone, back then, but he drove to his father’s city to check if anything had happened and of course he found his father dead.
    The night before his own death, my father phoned my sister who is 15 years older than me. She eventually told me about it the following month. He told her that death was back, his chest was feeling the same as back then for his father. He knew.


  172.  #172LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 5:42 pm

    346: Jilly
    389: life_is_too_short_to…


    You are welcome 🙂

  173.  #173luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 5:45 pm

    what the Fluck is with this man?
    He wrote me an email, I replied and said good bye and now he text me again. Can he let me freaking go?

    Ok he has not time…I GOT IT!!!

    OK He gave me mixed signals…I GOT IT!!!

    OK now he wants to keep me as his “friend”..I GOT IT!!, but I wont accept those crumbs…

    If he is willing to let me go, then that’s it I am done I do not want to talk about it or be his friend and pretend I am ok with it, because I am not!!!

    I cannot force him to be with me or to give me what I want, but I cannot accept what he is offering.

    Geesh !!!!

    BTW I delete it…just venting thanks for listening…

  174.  #174Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    @171: LonePlum

    Thank you for sharing about your father. You had a strong connection.


  175.  #175Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 5:56 pm

    RE #127 Luzydel – sometimes not having time really is just that. There are times when we just can’t focus on another person completely and it would be truly unfair for both.

    There was a time I just could not bother with the man who was pursuing me. Partly because I was so busy and knew I could not and I needed my energy/ vibe/ creative imagination just for me (selfish but true – I am willing to give myself what I need no matter what others think) and partly coz I did not know how great he was.

    Luckily, he pursued me for a year and when I finally had time, I gave it to him and discovered what an amazing guy he is.

    Ok, so it’s kinda the opposite for you. Yes, there is all the theory that if a guy really wants you he will do whatever it takes. But remember, they are also human and sometimes it just is what it is. Honor his feelings and also know that he did not take time to find out how great you are… and that is also ok. He needed to do what felt best for him at the time and you are still great!!


  176.  #176Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 5:59 pm

    126 Jacqueline. Paragraph 1: bingo. P2: I never equated the two (check the transcripts again with lots of left brain ;)). P3: Some books/topics have more bestseller potential than others – the book in question would be almost a guaranteed bestseller. P4 on: Yes, I am a writer, and I agree, absolutely. It’s what I am and what I do. …And great job using your left brain! 🙂

  177.  #177T-Girl on April 6, 2011 at 6:18 pm

    Catching up on all the messages…

    Happy Birthday FW!!!

  178.  #178luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 6:24 pm

    @175 QB

    Yes I know, some times it is what it is. Bad timing? perhaps. I am not in hate mode with him, I had the choice to leave and I did not; I decided to wait and see.
    I am just letting my feelings of frustrations out, and I am feeling relieved, gosh for one second I thought this guy could be something special, the few moments I had with him were great, I believed for a few moments…Maybe I had high expectations.

    I feel this sense of lost, like gee I wont know about him anymore, he wont call or say hello early in the morning. I will miss that, but keeping myself hanging to just those few things was keeping me away from what I really want.

    I wish him the best,

    but I can’t help feeling sad and frustrated…

  179.  #179Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    RE: #178 Luzydel – yeah, stay on your bridge and feel your feelings.

    The biggest healing I had for almost ALL my past ‘relationships’ is where I realized I was a crumb-taker – LOL!!!

    “I wish him the best” – Is it possible to stop this? It feels inauthentic and may be keeping you stuck.

    I would probably feel like bashing him over the head with a club and hugging him tightly at the same time, and feel like a complete idiot for feeling both. Definitely, don’t feel like ‘wishing him all the best’. You?


  180.  #180LonePlum on April 6, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    Prairie girl

    Nothing stops a prairie girl from living up her dreams 😉


  181.  #181turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 6:42 pm

    Lucy, it was just announced yesterday that they’ll be filming this summer… no other information was given, but I will keep you posted. Soooo excited that “my town” will be Gotham City! 🙂 I know a big reason they choose it, beyond the tax credit, google PPG Place images, the building is amazing!

    Jacqueline… I love blue green… not just because it’s my birth stone, but Caitlyn’s is peridot and Chloe’s is Aquamarine… and there are 3 of us… alas.. Turquoise3. 🙂 I’m so creative!

    I’m still on the fence about the CD’ing while in a relationship. I have a strong do unto others attitude, and I know I wouldn’t want the guy I’m with to be dating or flirting with other women. It also feels like an ultimatum to me to say, you have 6 months or I’m dating other men. I think Even is right, if he’s not treating me right, I need to leave. If he really wants to be with me, he’ll step up. I DO think CDing is great though when you are first getting to know someone, keep your focus off just one man… but if he’s telling you he loves you, wants to build a relationship with you, but isn’t ready to make a lifelong committment after 6 months, I don’t know that my dating other men is going to make him love me more. I’m not in a relationship right now… so just thinking about my past experiences.

    I will say though, the CC info. FW posted about what not to do… I’ve done a lot of that. I dated a guy who used me as a babysitting service with his daughter quite often. It was pleasantly disquised as, if you pick up Sara after school, I can swing by after work and we’ll all have dinner together… it NEVER inspired him to think of me as wife potential though. He was really looking for a woman who could financially support him, and after telling me for over a year, he just never saw himself getting married again, I walked away. That was about 3 years ago. Funny thing is… guess who just got married??? YEP. He found a woman who is a naval officer, he left his daughter, moved out of state to be with this woman who can financially provide for him while he interns at a beer brewery. He did love his beer. He knew what he wanted, and he found it. Thank goodness it wasn’t me! If he could leave his own daughter, who he’d had shared custody of for the past 7 years… he never would have been good enough for mine!

    Sorry for the ranting 🙂

  182.  #182Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 6:43 pm

    SLV 142. Almost. See what I wrote later to Evan (not sure what #, am struggling w phone blogging). 143- which book? 149 – I tried to call off my wedding after the invitations were sent but was talked out of it. 🙁 Then I was late to my wedding and the groom thought I was standing him up. *cute impish faux-guilty face*

  183.  #183Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 6:51 pm

    153 Thank you Loneplum. She is doing okay, sleeping alot which is good. Unfortunately she developed allergies to her two standard IV antibiotics so they are trying to figure out what to give her instead. 🙁 May be there longer than hoped.

  184.  #184luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 6:51 pm

    “I wish him the best” – Is it possible to stop this? It feels inauthentic and may be keeping you stuck. ”

    LOL ok I wish diarrhea upon him!!!

    I wish he was in front of me, where I could tell him…

    “I feel hurt, I feel used. I am angry, frustrated and I feel like punching you, I feel like hurting you right now. I wish you meet a woman who can make you feel what I am feeling right now, then perhaps you will understand…” and then just cry…

  185.  #185Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 6:54 pm


    Happy Birthday!! May your year be full of unbelievable surprises! May all your wishes come true! Joy and happiness!

    Can’t send you a real card, but this is what I would send:

  186.  #186Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 6:55 pm

    @180: LonePlum says:
    “Prairie girl
    Nothing stops a prairie girl from living up her dreams …”

    I had to struggle to read that… 😆
    Une vache qui saute comme un cheval!


  187.  #187Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 6:57 pm


    It sounds to me that he just got scared. Did you reply yet? Sorry didn’t understand if you emailed back or still considering what to write.

  188.  #188Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 6:59 pm

    Feminine Woman,

    Happy Birthday!

  189.  #189Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 7:01 pm

    Hey Sirens,

    What is the message here?

    I went out for a bday party. Was practicing the tools… leaning back. So the guy who ends up speaking to me first asks me what I do, which is normal, I suppose. That’s the standard question, which bores me to death anyway.

    So I tell him, while trying to remain polite. He jumps in with all sorts of analyses and stats etc about what he thinks my profession is all about etc. And I’m feeling completely put off. Not only coz of the display of ignorance but I also don’t want the focus on me in this way. I’m out to have fun not have an intellectual conversation (or not so) about my work.

    I also feel put off coz for example, a man tells me he is a cardiologist. The last thing I’m going to do is jump in with what I ‘think’ is involved in cardiology. So I’m thinking, well I’m the expert here so how is this supposed to interest me?

    He got so annoying by asking me to judge the difference between Europe and America coz I lived in both places. And I just did not want to. Why focus on what people think are the negatives? And I don’t want to be negative. There is so much else to talk about if the topic is Europe and US.

    So what is the message? I’m not 100% sure I get this ‘message’ thing. Am I boring? I hardly think so 🙂 Or maybe if I talk about my work I am 🙂 But my work is fascinating. When I do talk about it, I usually feel safe and it just comes out organically. People are usually fascinated and they tell me – or are they lying? I also try to control when/ how much I talk about my work coz I know it can get ‘too deep’ and then feel boring. What am I missing here?

    Shouldn’t a man share about himself in a convo?

    I couldn’t even bother myself with a feeling message with this man 🙂 and I managed to slip away.

    LOL! This feels irritating.

  190.  #190Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 7:01 pm


    RE: #169 – You said, “I want those men that are 100% positive that they want to marry me.”

    Like!! Love!! Wow!!

    That is the mindset I have not had in the past, and I am determined to grab it.

  191.  #191Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 7:03 pm

    @181: turquoise3 says:
    ”.. I don’t know that my dating other men is going to make him love me more…”

    I don’t believe Rori teaches to date other men so that another will love us more. I would not think to do it for that reason; it would then seem to be game playing. I would be meeting and getting to know new people — including men — , socializing and having a full life for myself.


  192.  #192Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    Lucy…I couldn’t wade through all the transcripts but thanks for following along with my logic. Earlier, I explained that although you and I have totally different ways of being, we actually have a way of working through stuff that’s very affirming!

    And I said threes instead of trees so yeah, in piano class? Yuck.

    all yall “moms”….I have had major bronchitus that felt like a knife in my chest and back,could not talk nor breathe yesterday and today I run out of bootlegged antibiotics…but I seem better – I am coughing tho and when I lay down I wheeze sort of – does the coughing mean it’s better? Boyfriend says yes I’m coughing it up….best friend says I need to go to doctors. My mother would’ve said, throw the dam* thermometer away!!!

  193.  #193Boomer on April 6, 2011 at 7:05 pm

    I wrote an awesomely quirky–but communicative and poignant–email to MrOhio tonight. I have not sent it yet. But I really want to. I want you Sirens to approve it. If not, I’ll hold it and be a mystery for him.

    He has been emailing and texting and calling since we met Sunday. We have a date for Friday. He just texted, “I can’t stop thinking about you.” But he is very flirtatious in a sexual way as well–admits to dirty thoughts and deeds with me in mind.

    We have discussed our many nicknames and what friends call us, etc. Today he wrote to all my names, telling me I drive him crazy, but he left out my most flirtatious one: of course, “Boomer.” I made up some cute reply about “Don’t ever forget Boomer. She’s the playful one who leaves you little hints…she’s the one who will make you growl. She’s the one who has you admit to servicing yourself in her honor. She’s the one who will want to say yes when Jennifer is saying not yet. She’s the one who wants to tell you some private things, but Jennifer/Jenny/JJ want to surprise you. And be surprised by you.”

    Flattering, but I am feeling a bit pressured about Friday’s date. I get it…we are 40-something adults. We are sexual. In my case–highly sexual. I have played along playfully, as you see. No talk of positions or body parts or techniques (yuck). I have insisted that it stay flirtatious, although he keeps skating into more direct talk.

    He said (paraphrased): “I will plan on picking up Jennifer for dinner around 7:10, and will enjoy a wonderful dinner and a couple drinks. But then I will need to say goodbye to Jennifer and spend the rest of the evening with Boomer. I certainly want to get to know both of them, and Jennifer probably needs to go night-night early anyway.”

    Cute, no?

    So, here’s my reply…do I send it?

    “How sweet are you? I admit, MrOhio, I am feeling a little afraid of our chemistry. I don’t want to go too fast too soon.

    See, Boomer sometimes ruins things for the rest of us. Boys reaaaaaalllly like her. And they tell her sweet nothings. She tells the rest of the gang, who get all excited…maybe this one is DIFFERENT! They urge her to go for it. She does. The boy is NOT different. Everyone feels confused and hurt when he goes ‘poof.’ We feel really bad when he poofs. Bad Boomer! We were counting on her to represent! She fails again. (Hangs her head in shame.)

    Maybe Jennifer or even Jenny needs to represent for the gang the whole evening Friday. Get all of the various MrOhios a little hooked intellectually and…gasp! (God forbid) emotionally first??? BEFORE we let Boomer unleash her phenomenal cosmic power???

    That may be better for everyone in the long run.

    What do you (all) think?”

    And…Sirens…what do you all think? Send it?? Too much? Just be direct? Or maybe not share at all that I am feeling nervous about Friday?

    I feel like a 17-year-old girl with this guy.

  194.  #194Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    LonePlum #156:

    Thank you for your support.

    You asked me:
    “PD: if a date should ever ask you again if your son is going to die, do you feel up to tell him
    “Yes, hopefully, like you and me and each of your children. He is just another mortal. Now if your question is about a near future, I can’t tell you, you and your children might die before him. God’s ways are mysterious.
    Is this convo making you nervous?
    Well imagine how it makes ME feel. Would you rather speak about what makes our children happy? Or how much we love them? What do you think?”


    Wow…i think I can pull this off this time around…at the time I felt shocked…

    I had another one who expressed to me nonchalantly that I should stop being up on my horse…cause I have plenty of luggage myself…

    I asked him what do u mean?
    He answered…u son and his medical situation…

    Well, I feel content it is likely my son and I will be alone for a longer time than I originally thought of…(it’s been 8);

    I know there is a reason(s) for all my experiences…sometimes I just tell God …”U know Father, I kinda of need a break 🙁 ”

    I sure need my break right now…

    Warm hugs,

  195.  #195luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    yes Alonka I did reply; it is time to leave it alone. If he misses me in a way that pushes him to look for me, more that just a text message and he shows me he has the time and willingness to be the man I deserve, then I may give him a chance.

    Right now I don’t think that may happen, so I can’t just be here and try to understand him while my heart is shrinking. I am only responsible for what I feel, whatever he is feeling is his problem.

  196.  #196Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    @184 Luzydel – oh I love it!! Now I feel you. I’d give you a hug (((Luzydel))). That feels really authentic.

    Good for you!

  197.  #197Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    Daria, I knew you’d have a better explanation of cdng…and I like it. My best friend believes that the man gets “ready” choses the best woman who fits the pix…and it’s done. So, yeah, 6 months…

    but what I was saying is that I’d give it 6 months to see if I wanted to continue to be exclusive…like I’ve done with Mr. Lowkeyed.

    I see Evan’s p.o.v. on it taking as long as it takes.. – Prince William was with Kate for 2 years and OMGosh…”helped” her buy a $40,000 audi…that struck me.

    And Lercomari – of COURSE it’s easy to fall in love bungie jumping in Fiji…and also why it doesn’t last!

  198.  #198Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    @182: Lucy says:
    “143- which book?”
    See #133Luzydel

    “Be honest–you’re not that into him either” by Ian Kerner, Ph.D


  199.  #199Boomer on April 6, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    LonePlum is so articulate and wise.

  200.  #200turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:13 pm


    That could be walking pneumonia, if you are wheezing, but otherwise feel better. I would definitely go to the dr. You probably need an x-ray. I would not mess around with not being able to breathe. If your body doesn’t get enough oxygen, you could have very serious problems. Caitlyn had walking pneumonia once, scared the heck out of me because it came on so quickly, and she was wheezing. You might need albuterol breathing treatments to clear that up. I would definitely go to the dr. Please take care of yourself!

  201.  #201turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    SLV, you are right… I was thinking of it as being in a relationship, (like in Rori’s example of them living together and him deciding he wasn’t sure) and within a few weeks it turned around… So, if I were in a relationship and that happened, with a man I love, I know that even if I tried CD’ing other men, a huge part of me would want the man I was with to feel the distance, realize he loved me, and be ready for the relationship. Once I have feelings for a man, very difficult to distance myself from that and be open to someone else.

  202.  #202Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    181 Camile. Thanks. Yes I saw the PPG bldg when I was there a few yrs ago – beautiful! The bldg was also used in the Inspector Gadget movie (our limo driver told us).

  203.  #203ZenPony on April 6, 2011 at 7:18 pm


    I feel comforted knowing that some of you Sirens out there are in similar situations. I am dating a few men, but there is one that is my ‘favorite.’ He and I are connecting on such a deep level, it’s a little frightening. However, he and I are in a different place, relationship-wise. I am ready to be committed and he is not, although he admits to this being difficult for him. He split from his ex-wife mere months ago. We have both been open with each other from the beginning and, for the time being, are comfortable with our agreement, which is:
    * No sex (I told him that I would not be a friend with benefits) As much as I want the sex, I realize it could destroy any chance we have in a relationship.
    * Date other people.
    * Enjoy each other’s company without putting pressure on the relationship or each other (no requirements or expectations)
    Lack of sex aside, I am comfortable with things. I like the new tools I have been learning with Modern Siren (thanks, Rori!) and am learning to be in my feeling feminine mode, and am attracting men most everywhere I go. This helps me to not get tunnel vision on my favorite, and amazingly, makes me more attractive to him. I don’t call him; he calls me. I don’t ask him out; he asks me out – sometimes he wants to set the next date up before the current date is over!
    I feel empowered, joyful and liberated. I still really want this man, but I also realize that I’d rather have him as an excellent friend than an ex-lover.

    Does that make any sense?

  204.  #204Simply Shannon on April 6, 2011 at 7:18 pm

    Hehe. Men don’t like CDing nor do they need to understand it. It IS a part of our magic. (Thank you LG!)

    It feel so easy to tell your girlfriend to just leave when the man she’s with is being a tool. But her (my) reality is that it is much more difficult to leave a relationship (imaginary or real). To tell a woman to leave a man she loves (even if he is acting like a tool) is akin to asking me to fly to the moon. It just ain’t that easy. I gotta learn how to fly a rocketship, walk without gravity, minor details… 🙂

    I am still sitting comfortably on the fence but for the most part, I’m going to date multiple men until I feel good about the one making me an offer.

    And for me, it really works to put the no girlfriend speech on the table upfront and NOT 6 months down the line. Makes the discussion a lot less ultimatum-like.

    I’m still feeling lots of judgments. Obviously dating exclusivity works for most people. Most everyone I know who is married dated that way. I did. I was exclusive with my ex almost immediately. There really was no hesitancy on my part or his. Yes there were flags I missed but I wouldn’t trade my marriage (hindsight being 20/20).

    I feel pretty open about this now. I trust myself to speak up for myself. That’s really the key. I believe I see much more clearly what I would and would not tolerate. And I would leave if that was necessary. I wouldn’t have back then, but now I feel confident that I could/would.

  205.  #205Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:18 pm

    Turquoise – peridot is spring green, aquamarine is ice clear blue (as opposed to blue topaz which is blue of eyes sort of….) so in actuality, you are your own unique color – Turquoise #1.

    I love all gemstones, maybe peridot the most? for healing qualities and have a 3 carat blue topaz as a placer for what my engagement ring should look like….
    I also have a stone that is unique because it is the same pink under natural light or man made – can’t remember the name now, but a solitaire as well and absolutely beautiful!! It would probably be my color, tho – remember when they sold “pink ice” jewelry – I have a fabulous bracelet from ex-husband of that – and you hardly ever see star sapphires anymore either they were on indigo or violet backgrounds….

    So – being pedantic….my blue stone is probably heat treated –
    A high quality topaz gem is fully translucent, and usually has a tinge of yellow, brown or orange lending it an amber tone. True, natural blue or pink topaz are extremely rare, and when found in jewelry stores have typically undergone heat treatment to create the color. The actual stone will look like a crystal, with several facets.

    Aquamarine, however, is naturally a translucent blue, although they can range from fully transparent to a rich blue-green and rarely light pink. The stone should have a hexagonal structure which resembles its cousin the emerald.

  206.  #206turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    Boomer, I wouldn’t send it. Sounds like he wants laid…

  207.  #207Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    I have an idea. Since Rori and Evan are really saying the same things using different words, and some ppl misunderstand one or the other or both, how about this? – Take a leap of faith that they are saying the same thing and use the perceived discrepancies as cross-clarifications and case studies. Assume that they both know which key on the piano is B, and that any apparent conflict btwn the too is a misunderstanding.

  208.  #208Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    I have an idea. Since Rori and Evan are really saying the same things using different words, and some ppl misunderstand one or the other or both, how about this? – Take a leap of faith that they are saying the same thing and use the perceived discrepancies as cross-clarifications and case studies. Assume that they both know which key on the piano is B, and that any apparent conflict btwn the too is a misunderstanding. That’s how I see it anyway.

  209.  #209Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:25 pm

    aha! rhodolite! maybe….

    and yes, turquoise if I am still wheezing or coughing tomorrow I will go to drs – I am feeling 1000% better tho as far as pain gone from my chest and back. Thank you and I’ll check in – first time I’ve been sick with this boyfriend – RITE of passage, ‘eh?

    so far, he’s only got a C grade going but he may improve…

    g’nite all sirenesses

  210.  #210turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:25 pm


    I love gems… when I lived in Germany I taught 4th grade to military dependent kids, and we went on a field trip to a mining facility. I was sooo interesting. My oldest thought for awhile she wanted to be a geologist… I’d be focusing on the “rocks” 🙂

  211.  #211Queenbee on April 6, 2011 at 7:28 pm

    Boomer – it feels rather desperate and TMI for me. What more mystery would he need after reading this? Your mystery is in your emotions. Reading between the lines, it feels clingy and needy. Sex is sex.

    I would save it in my drafts and then say what I really feel. ” I feel apprehensive about meeting on Friday”. Then go from there – explore your feelings as he responds to take care of you.


  212.  #212luzydel on April 6, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    Reopened my OK cupid and got an email from a 20 yrs old…”damn you’re fine ”

    LOL some times I think there’s no hope for me…

  213.  #213Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 7:33 pm


    #195: Good for you! And I like your response a lot 🙂

  214.  #214Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    I believe in Circular Dating…yet, my heart is often resistant to it…and the part I seem to resist to is going out on dates…

    I tend to agree with Evan that making him invest into getting u to a nice place/dinner etc…is so much better than a coffee place etc…

    In the past, I always had amazing dates…evening drinks/dinner/appetizers/ dancing, etc…and they would always call me…I guess it had to do with my vibe…I felt relaxed, ready to make the best of my time…so it was likely felt by men…

    Lunch/coffee dates…are like business appointments…Yuck!! None ever called again…and honestly, I am glad they did not…cause I really did not enjoy the conversations or myself in the setting…Maybe I could change that a bit now that I am aware ab it…but on a second thought…Nope…it does not feel good to me, so I will stop it…

    About dating multiple partners ….

    I agree with Lucy, Evan is agreeing with Rori…the only thing Evan does not appear to be understanding is if you use Rori’s tools, especially feeling messages with men…the wrong for us will disappear on their own…and the right ones will stand…showing consistency, caring…and since Rori is promoting to trust our boundaries, follow our feelings, choose our words, and be surprised…when we feel safe, feel loved and taken by surprised, naturally we will focus on one man…okay, okay…I will still CD myself 🙂

  215.  #215Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    I am finding sitting up I can breath!!! so feeling better I do believe.

    I love gems, rocks, geology – we had to identify 24 rocks in geology in college and i did it! have gemstones in all the chakra colors, have as much jewelry as I need, now I could always WANT….more…heee….

    I love trees, skies and birds too – I am an earth witch!

    boyfriend loves gardening – ugh…no prettiness to it, but I do like the fruits …

    but I’d so much rather look at a tree or a rock. I love granite, rose quartz, crystal quartz…well, you all get the idea.

    and I shall wait for EMK’s post to see if they agree cuz I think one is saying B and one is saying D – but everyone will hear what resonates with them anyway.

    Smiles and sweet dreams,
    Pink aka J

  216.  #216Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 7:41 pm


    #18: it’s good you had this experience, so won’t fall for something like this again;) Beer intern? seriously 😉 😉 😉

  217.  #217Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    I meant #181, not #18

  218.  #218Simply Shannon on April 6, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    Lucy, continued prayers for your daughter and for you!!! (((HUGS)))

  219.  #219Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    I have a new potential CD who’s suggesting to meet up for a 10 min coffee during business hours because we are both busy this week and ‘it takes 5 mins to see if there’s chemistry or not’ haha.

  220.  #220Boomer on April 6, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    Not sending. Thanks, Sirens.

  221.  #221Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    Boomer – how about “Boomer only comes out to play when the J’s feel like they’ve been treated like a princess – and never on the first date! Lady J has gracously accepted your invitation and a lady she will remain.”

    Yep! Set those stern expectation…!Then…ummm….go all boomer on him if you want to!


  222.  #222Daria on April 6, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    Rori recommends first MEETING to be brief… like under 30 min. So Alonka 10 min for Coffee would be great.

    and yes, Rori says for men it DOES take 5 min to see if there’s chemistry or not

  223.  #223turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    What I took most seriously about this post, and the comments… when they aren’t treating us the way we want to be treated, JUST LEAVE. I make excuses for them, listen to their excuses, don’t want to seem impatient or pushy… so I wait, feel terrible, end up leaning forward, and they poof.

    SO, new plan, when they start pulling back, being distant, etc. I’m going to walk away. No leaning forward or picking up the ball… and no closure. I’ll shift my attention elsewhere and do something that makes me happy. I hate that nervous feeling I get in my stomach when things seem to change. SO, no more staying and being patient while they figure it out. If they miss me, they’ll know where to find me!

  224.  #224Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    Rubellite tourmaline! check out the colors if you want to see some pretty pretty pinkreds!!!

    There are red and pink tourmalines in many nuances, which include a tender pink, a fine shocking pink, an intense violet and a bold ruby-red. However, only a few of these are entitled to call themselves ‘rubellites’. The name comes from the Latin ‘rubellus’, which means reddish. Rubellites are not merely red or shocking pink tourmalines. There is an important criterion for this especially beautiful gemstone, and that is the way its colour behaves in daylight and artificial light. Many gemstones change their colour depending on the light source. A true rubellite does not. It shines just as intensely in artificial light as it does in daylight.

  225.  #225Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    @189: Queenbee says:
    “… but I also don’t want the focus on me in this way. I’m out to have fun not have an intellectual conversation (or not so) about my work….”

    Perhaps he was trying to connect with you and he was not doing too well with what you gave him to work with.

    Mercedes has some real fun answers. Maybe not my style but it avoids the “all about your work” problem. Unless you really are there to network and talk about your career, then go for it.

    I don’t do “Mercedes style” but I usually don’t “work” either… If people insist I tell them I work at home. I stopped about 30 years ago after a gruesome conversation with a guy who kept insisting I had to work for a company and what was it? I told him I was an investor.

    This is one reason I stopped bothering with men. I hope you are not discouraged. You probably have a very nice pool of men.

    He: Well, what do you do?
    Me: “Usually, the best I can.
    He: No, really.
    Me: I do a lot of personal projects and some fun ones too
    He: Such as what?
    Me: blah blah blah (what i want to talk about)
    He: Yeah, but how do you make your money?
    Me: I’m rich, do you want some… LOL (then switch convo to him)

    He: Hey, old lady are you retired?
    Me: Not yet
    He: You work?
    Me: Only when I have to escape (then I do…)

    “He got so annoying by asking me to judge…”

    What does this mean he got annoyed by asking you to judge?

    “… Why focus on what people think are the negatives? And I don’t want to be negative. There is so much else to talk about if the topic is Europe and US….”

    How did it happen that the convo became about discussing negatives if the topic is Europe and U.S. It seems something went wrong here… That could be an interesting topic and broad enough to cover many, many interests. You could find out a lot about a man that way. What exactly happened?

    “…But my work is fascinating….”

    It wasn’t to this guy. Maybe he had something against it? Was it fascinating to the other men?

    “…People are usually fascinated and they tell me – or are they lying?..”

    Are you mostly teaching about it or are there back and forth conversations?

    ” What am I missing here? Shouldn’t a man share about himself in a convo?”

    IMHO, yes, he should. I think he would want you to know about him and he would want to know about you. Some guys try to impress and talk all about themselves forever until I escape. LOL 😆

    ” I managed to slip away.”

    At least you escaped! Was there anyone else to talk to? Or maybe I should think about practicing and not escape… What do you think?


  226.  #226Jacqueline on April 6, 2011 at 7:51 pm

    Oh…roflmao….this Rubellite so sounds like the perfect man – IF you want just one?!!! funny….funny!

    The colour of this gemstone is pure seduction. Its components are red, shocking pink and violet – the typical colour realm of desire and joie de vivre. In the fascinating world of the gemstones, there is hardly any other stone which has such a persuasive erotic aura. The colour range of the rubellite comprises tender shocking pink as well as ambivalent violet. It takes these two components to get the best out of that seductive red. Fortunately, Nature has created the rubellite in many colour nuances, so that every woman can select the right rubellite for her type. All she has to do is find it – and that may not be quite so easy. And certainly not if she happens to be looking for two or more stones of the same colour. However, a woman who is truly aware of the extravagance and beauty of the rubellite will derive a great deal of pleasure from it.

  227.  #227turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:53 pm

    Alonka, yes… seriously, and never again. I was way too nice to him. It’s in my nature to be nice and helpful, but he took advantage of that. I definitely felt used. BUT, of course it wasn’t always like that. In the beginning, it was really great, and he helped me get over my ex husband. He was so funny, a great cook, sex was decent, and he never raised his voice or responded with anger. My ex could be sooo mean. He didn’t treat me that way. SO yes, I did learn some things, and he said some of the sweetest things to me and that made me happy at the time. 🙂

  228.  #228turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 7:54 pm

    Alonka, I knew in 3 seconds I wasn’t attracted to Larry.. and then had to sit through a 2 hr. lunch. I wouldn’t have even wanted him to buy me a drink at a bar…. so YES, go for the 10 min. power date and see what you think! 🙂

  229.  #229Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 7:55 pm


    I realized there a few things that Rori is considering as rules for us…yet, that are really not a good fit for me…my personality…

    And the 30 minutes coffee rule does not cut it for me…Since I am a very expressive person, I cant hide the fact that I feel rushed/uncomfortable having so many people around me in an open space listening to my conversation etc…it feels so annoying…and to me is impossible to make anything romantic in that kind of atmosphere…

    So, I totally believe Rori wants us foremost be authentic and trust ourselves…over standing with/by the 30 minutes rule…rules are made to be broken in my book…

  230.  #230Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 7:57 pm

    @201: turquoise3 says:
    “… Once I have feelings for a man, very difficult to distance myself from that and be open to someone else…”

    Yes, it sure is.


  231.  #231Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 8:01 pm

    Daria, Turquoise,

    Thanks 😉 Maybe I should tell him: Yes, it takes 5 mins for a GUY to know if there’s chemistry! Let’s see how impressed I will feel in 10 mins ;P

  232.  #232turquoise3 on April 6, 2011 at 8:02 pm

    I’m going to watch Off the Map, and imagine I was on the beach there with all that amazing blue water and the jungle around me.. and then I’m eading to bed. It’s been a long day.

    Sweet dreams!


  233.  #233Alonka on April 6, 2011 at 8:02 pm


    #223: You did all that with Tom.

  234.  #234Daria on April 6, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    Darling Ella –
    MEETING is not a date, it’s just face to face hello… if the guy will like you he will ask you out

    personally, i treat first meetings as a DATE as well… and usually 1 – 2 hours

  235.  #235Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 8:17 pm

    SLV – my “sweetie” arrived last night! I said, “I guess I should move that stuff off the bed” and he said, “It’s okay, I’ll manage.” So we were watching TV in bed and I was facebooking and blogging on my phone… and he started trying to “mess around”… kissing me and stuff… and I was like, “um, I’m kinda busy right now…” (uh-oh!!! I guess I’m not quite ready for him!) I felt kinda bad so I told him he could rub my feet if he wanted. So he did and we both enjoyed it but I could tell he was disappointd.

  236.  #236Daria on April 6, 2011 at 8:18 pm

    man: so what do you for work

    me: i don’t work 🙂

    him: so how do you make money then?

    me: i don’t. hehe

    him: okay… what do you do then?

    me: i LIVE 🙂

    him: so how do you get by

    me: feeling great!


    stuff like that

  237.  #237Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 8:22 pm

    @234: Daria says:
    “…MEETING is not a date, it’s just face to face hello… if the guy will like you he will ask you out
    personally, i treat first meetings as a DATE as well… and usually 1 – 2 hours…”

    What’s the difference between MEETING and DATE? Is it just the time difference? MEETING is shorter than DATE?

    For MEETING Do we at least sit down and get a coffee or tea or margarita or something…

    So, now I’m confused, I think of first meetings as dates, maybe hour long dates but still dates.

    Who decides that it’s a MEETING instead of a DATE? THe guy. Do guys generally think, ahhh, first we have a thirty minute MEETING before I decide if I want a DATE?

    Does this now mean that we could have a meeting and not even get a FIRST DATE???


  238.  #238Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    @236: Daria says:
    “man: so what do you for work
    me: i don’t work
    him: so how do you make money then?”

    I do those variations too but usually talk about what I actually “do” and some of my interests, how i spend my time.

    People are funny aren’t they, tee hee 😆


  239.  #239Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 8:28 pm


    I never thought for a minute these were dates. Maybe that is why it doesn’t feel good to me…They are not invested in creating a setting where I feel comfortable…I rather meet someone at happy hour after work…

    I guess it depends what u do for a living…switching a hat to a feminine role in the middle of the day is a hard one for me…

    Also, the 1st meeting is our best opportunity to present ourselves (like any job interview)…why would go against my instinct and meet someone when I know deep down I don’t feel good about it???

    Warm hugs,

  240.  #240Daria on April 6, 2011 at 8:28 pm

    SLV – yes this is correct. I feel a bit confused about it (we can ask Rori to clarify)

    I personally am a lil too high maintenance to meet a man halfway (allowed for first MEETING for a 30 min time frame)

    i think this may work well if i had limited time…

    the idea i think is that the man can’t really know REAL chemistry until in person

  241.  #241Daria on April 6, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    SLV – i do too

    i tell them “i breathe” 🙂

  242.  #242Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    @235: Lucy

    How is it you and Daria are getting sexy moves from your sweeties? My sweetie is platonic. He’s been sleeping with me every night since March 20 and we only cuddle… when I know he’s there at all.

    Oh, well. That’s best for me, for now.


  243.  #243Darling Ella on April 6, 2011 at 8:32 pm


    It just hit me…CD is not about the man…it’s about me…If I don’t feel good…he sure won’t feel me either…

  244.  #244Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 8:40 pm

    @240: Daria says:
    “…SLV – yes this is correct. I feel a bit confused about it (we can ask Rori to clarify)…”

    That would be great and to have a Rori post on it and a good follow up to one on this thread.

    Soooo, now i have to think about e-mails (I still haven’t learned how to text on this phone, ick,) and couple phone calls.

    So after ten days or so of this I decide if I want to meet the guy and he takes 5 minutes (we meet in the subway) or a half hour (we eat a subway) and figures out if he has chemistry for me and if not, i don’t get a real date and if he does i do if I’m not repulsed.

    Is that it in a nutshell? 😀


  245.  #245T-Girl on April 6, 2011 at 8:42 pm

    EMK says that a first meeting should be somewhere in a date like setting, not a coffee shop. Otherwise it feels like a job interview which I can relate to. I had better first dates at happy hours or dinner vs. a coffee shop.

  246.  #246Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 8:45 pm


    RE: #192 – Sorry to hear you have bronchitis. You must have caught it from me, LOL!

    I’ve had it for 7.5 weeks!!! It is much, much better, but I continue to cough. My pharmacist recommended Mucinex DM, Maximum Strength. The same was recommended by a scientist I used to work with at the pharmaceutical company.

    My Mom did some research for me in an alternative medicine book. They said if the mucous is not yellow or green, you don’t need to see a doctor.

    I also did some research and some health food remedies are concentrated elderberry juice, fenugreek, concentrated oregano (pill form), euchenacia, and more.

  247.  #247Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 8:48 pm

    @241: Daria says:
    …i tell them “i breathe”…

    Do they get all confused? LOL 😆


  248.  #248Daria on April 6, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    SLV – no they usually get that. they also sometiems want me to share my secret of how i live without believing in money.

    Brenda – an EXCELLENT lung strengthener that really works for me is Mullein.

    i get it from mountainroseherbs online for cheap and make tea from it, then STRAIN the tea (important so it doesn’t irritate)

    I can feel it instantly and it has helped friends too

  249.  #249Nita on April 6, 2011 at 9:07 pm

    hi Rori and sirens was really curious about i question i left in ´´shifting your vibe blog´´ its 1003 the last question…actually i will copy paste it here because it counts for this post as well

  250.  #250Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 9:08 pm

    Shannon, thank you. <3

  251.  #251Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 9:10 pm


    RE: #248 – Mullein

    Thank you! I appreciate the information!

  252.  #252Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 9:11 pm

    Rori’s “rules” are like the Pirate Code – i.e., they’re more like guidelines.

  253.  #253Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 9:11 pm


    So sorry to hear your daughter is not well. My prayers and thoughts are with her and your family.

    Are you fully recovered from your gall bladder surgery?

    Love, Brenda

  254.  #254sweetmandm on April 6, 2011 at 9:12 pm

    Femininewoman- Wishing you a super great year, filled with tons of love!! Happy Birthday!


  255.  #255Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 9:14 pm

    Jacqueline, yes, I feel glad that you and I are able to work things out despite our differences. 🙂 Hope you feel much better soon! Sleep well. <3

  256.  #256Nita on April 6, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    hi Rori and sirens,lol dont know where my question went so im gonna ask on here…ok when you are first dating i wonder if feeling my negative feelings and expressing them would be a turn off wouldnt it be? or anything thats negative even if its feelings wouldnt that make him feel like im blaming anyway? i love this concept of expressing feelings but i just cant help if it will be a turn off. theres other dating advice that says that you have to be “positive” and not sweat the little things and to be “cool” but honestly i feel annoyed by this. what if the guy is late to a date? what if he makes a rude comment? i want to say “i feel disrespected, or i feel offended” etc. or im feel mad because you didnt call when you said you would. ugh but then i think about the “cool” girl crap and play it off…whats everyones opinion about negative feelings? how to deal with them when dating, and in a real relationship is it the same for both?

  257.  #257sweetmandm on April 6, 2011 at 9:25 pm

    Lucy- You and your daughter are in my prayers as well!

    Sending you a very warm hug!

  258.  #258Meemee on April 6, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    Happy birthday FW.
    Wish you all good things in your life.
    have a wonderful year ahead

  259.  #259Meemee on April 6, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    I was planning a trip to my home town.I thought I will go and stay with my parents for a couple of days. Mom had great issues with that. She asked me to stay there for a week. I cant afford it emotionally right now. And physically also, since I have a bad allergy. She got furious. Then my sister called and asked me to go home so that mom will take care of my allergy. And may be I should go and see a new doctor for my allergy. I feel so enraged. I cancelled my trip. I do not want to go home and fight with mom and feel miserable. When I feel better I will go and stay with them for a week. I feel angry with my sister. I feel angry with my mom.
    I dont know why, I dont like going home and staying there for more than 2 or three days. Every time I go there they remind me that I have not landed in a comfortable job, I am not married, that i have bad health and all my illness is because of my lifestyle etc etc. For one year I am struggling with this allergy. I had to take many decisions, change 3 doctors and do dozens of tests etc. But I hate it when my mom and sister say that I am going to the wrong doctor and they can help me find a better one etc.
    I hate this attitude that is generally there towards all unmarried woman. If I am married I am answerable only to my husband. If I am 27 and still single, then I am answerable to everyone, my parents, my sister, my brother in law, grandparents.
    I feel so furious everytime people treat me like this.

  260.  #260Meemee on April 6, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    I dont want to feel guilty for not going home.
    I want to stay back.
    I want to start writing today.
    I want to get some work done this week.
    I want to take care of myself.

  261.  #261Lucy on April 6, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    Thank you Sweetm and Brenda. I am almost fully recovered from my gallbladder surgery – just a bit of discomfort – got that out of the way just in time for my daughter’s flare-up!

  262.  #262Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 10:16 pm


    RE: #259 – By not going, you are using the walk away tool. If they ask you why, you can put your feelings in feeling messages…I feel shut down; uncomfortable; angry; annoyed, etc…

  263.  #263Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    Hi Lucy,

    Is she still in the hospital? If you are in my area, want to go to a dinner party at the home of some friends either Friday or Saturday night with me?

    Love, Brenda

  264.  #264Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 10:18 pm

    Lucy…or even if you’re not in my area…you are welcome. The one Friday starts at 7 or 8 pm, and the one Saturday starts at 6 pm.

  265.  #265Angel Lady on April 6, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    SLV – Happy Birthday! I feel grateful that you were born. 🙂 Although we have not met, you have touched my life in a very positive way. I can only imagine how many lives you have made a difference in.

    I wish you the best year yet and hope even more of your dreams manifest this year.

  266.  #266Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 10:55 pm


    Is it your birthday?

  267.  #267Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    I just had tomato soup with cheese-flavored gourmet crackers. What a comfort food! I love eating stuff like that to warm my tummy before I go to bed.

    I am going to go cuddle with my puppies (5 year old puppies). I bought them each a cute jacket at the beginning of winter, and I promptly misplaced one before I even removed the tags. Murphy’s Law: Now that it’s spring, I found it. Grrrr!

    It is light tan with pink trim and a faux fur collar! It has a little clasp around the back with decorative diamond buttons! So feminine looking for my girls! LOL! I tried it on them tonight, and they knew it was theirs, so they were very interested. Now Garnie is cuddling with it! So stinkin cute!

    Good night!

  268.  #268Senior Lady Vibe on April 6, 2011 at 11:11 pm

    @266: Brenda says:
    Is it your birthday”…”

    No. Maybe she means FW. 😀


  269.  #269Brenda on April 6, 2011 at 11:41 pm


    OK, that’s what I thot. But there is no law against proclaiming Thursday, April 7th


    Right? LOL! Happy SLV Day! I love you!


  270.  #270Daria on April 6, 2011 at 11:44 pm

    I love you.

    I’m sorry.

    Please forgive me.

    Thank you.

  271.  #271Lercomari on April 6, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    I second the motion for SLV day! 🙂 *waves to SLV* Hi lady, nice to see you again.

  272.  #272Daria on April 6, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    I love you.

    I’m sorry.

    Please forgive me.

    Thank you.

  273.  #273Daria on April 7, 2011 at 12:02 am

    My ‘survival’ Ie life is ensured not by competition or effort

    But by divinity

    It’s not my responsibility

    It is to follow intuition

    I’m launched on that and I feel comforted and sparkled

  274.  #274Darling Ella on April 7, 2011 at 12:12 am


    Welcome to the blog 🙂 Sorry we missed your question…

    Great questions indeed…

    First dates are very important…and crucial. Circular Dating helps you to acquire the self awareness you need to notice your feelings…and the opportunity to express them.

    I haven’t had many bad experiences except some uncomfortable situations involving who pays…for example, they invite u out to a coffee shop and they don’t buy it…or invite to for a drink…and don’t pay it…etc…

    or maybe these were bad experiences but i am a cool girl and don’t get mad about it…just disappointed as in “wow…u suck kinda of thing”

    I don’t express though…it is my choice…should they contact me again, i will take the opportunity to express how I feel…These are usually the 1st dates…

    On the 2nd and 3rd…things become more real to me…there is more time spent and likely more opportunity to offend/irritate/upset one another…

    I think it is totally appropriate to begin expressing your feelings even those negative…but the tone and your expression should work with one another…

    When you are in your soup of feelings…all of them coexist…for example…if i say…wow, that feels lovely…but i sound like a bitch…not gonna fly…

    so practicing touching objects…tools…”i am all that”…will keep you authentic in expressing even negative feelings.

    Another thing for me, I don’t go on a date (1st, 2nd, 3rd) if I don’ t feel good…I cancel …but that’s just me 🙁

    Modern Siren Program has a great visual presentation on touching objects and expressing your feelings about it…

    You also asked about using negative feeling messages while in a relationship:

    Well, that’s a different ball game.

    First you buy a whip…and keep it handy…maybe one that can shorten and fit in your purse…

    Lets say you feel upset and say ” Wow…i feel upset…hmm…” baam…whip him hard…
    You feel disappointed and say” I feel awful and dissapointed…” give him another hard whip…etc…:)

    Okay, okay, my bad…i got carried away there…lol

    Warm hugs,

  275.  #275Lercomari on April 7, 2011 at 12:18 am

    God, I am meeting him at the movie theater tomorrow afternoon. It’s my first date in years…I feel nervous. Reviewing Rori’s ebook to see if I can glean anything, but i feel too nervous and anxious to really take anything in. I will just remember to express myself authentically….the positive and the negative feelings. Though the negative feelings will be hard for me. I’m meeting him for the first time. Expressing negativity? Giving a bad impression? They dont’ necessarily go hand in hand…only if I do it in a “Diva” way. But I don’t have to be a diva, I just have to be authentic. This will be harder than I thought. Hard to be authentic? It sounds like a paradox. 🙁
    *sigh* I really should get some sleep….

  276.  #276Celtic Blue on April 7, 2011 at 2:00 am

    Jacqueline , I clicked on the audio link and got a sound bar and Wendi’s voice and hypnosis track and no information as to where it was sourced or who it was. It bis her work and it is not royalty free.
    see “Remote Seduction”

    I feel angry when i see my friends ripped off .

  277.  #277Celtic Blue on April 7, 2011 at 2:53 am

    This post is fascinating to me. I really think both men and women struggle initially to “get” CD’ing as we are locked into Girlfriend/Boyfriend thinking as a societal norm.

    Jim, and men and women who, like Jim, feel uncomfortable with a dating partner seeing other people are often seeing a GF/BF thing as the relationship goal .

    They are confused to be told we dont want to be a GF and that we dont want to be shutting down our options with one man. They dont hear the qualifier , UNTIL WE ARE DISCUSSING MARRIAGE OR A SIMILAR COMMITMENT. They dont even have it on their radar often enough.

    Men usually seem to think we WANT to be a GF and this is the first thing we have to get clear about. We have a different goal..

    I start with “I am, looking for friendship initially. I want to meet and get to know people and hopefully the man may come along who is right for me and ready for the long haul adventure. I dont want an instant relationship. Meanwhile I am appreciating dating and having fun !

    Later it might be quite clear ” No I cant see you Friday , i am going out with another friend”

    Sex ? Well I have to say that the guys are charming and not pressuring at all for sex when i use the above opener. In fact a couple of men have said its a relief because they dont have to go there early on and they know I am not “wondering if and when they will make a move”. Apparently guys worry about timing the moves and this lets the whole thing simmer down a notch.

    I say ” For me sex comes with relationship and commitment and caring . These things are a package deal and I feel safe and sensual when a man cares for me in an ongoing relationship. Casual sex feels all wrong and is not for me. I dont want to be friends with benefits .”

    They usually look relieved and some have expressed to me that i am obviously a high quality woman , or they admire my boundaries ..(yes really) ..and so I feel ..HIGH QUALITY!!!! Then they ask me out again.

    This whole approach is light years away from where I was years ago after my divorce when i just wanted a man to accept me and I mistook interest for relationship several times over. I was very needy.
    I truly feel great dating several people now and I dont want a relationship unless its the relationship I want , ie love and commitment!

    So I am dating 3 CDs , 2 more want second dates , and there is another wanting to meet as well.If one steps up I will consider whether to take it to exclusivity then and there , If I feel the magic and if he is offering me more.

  278.  #278luzydel on April 7, 2011 at 3:46 am

    I am up early !!! good morning 🙂
    Thanks for this blog…

    My progress is starting to show…

    I am setting boundaries
    I am not accepting crumbs
    I am not afraid of loosing a man

    Yayy me!!

  279.  #279Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:12 am

    @Brenda @Lercomari
    Thanks for the SLV day celebration. 😀


    Let us know how the date goes. I had thought only of coffee, dinner, drinks kind of early dates because they give more oppportunity to talk. Now, since this matter of 5 minute chemistry checks came up, I’m thinking also of movie dateS. This way if we hate each other upon sight, seeing a good movie keeps it from being a total waste of time. I might not want to do a proper theatrical performance, those can be pricey and perhaps put too much “importance” on date. Something new to think about.


  280.  #280Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:25 am

    @274: Darling Ella

    tee hee a purse size whip might come in handy… tee hee 😆


  281.  #281Izzy on April 7, 2011 at 4:48 am


    “I am setting boundaries
    I am not accepting crumbs
    I am not afraid of loosing a man”

    You’re awesome! I feel I’m getting there too!

  282.  #282kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 5:00 am

    I am seriously afraid to date anyone right now. Maybe later.

  283.  #283Izzy on April 7, 2011 at 5:11 am

    Daria, Mercedes, Ella, Brenda, Femininewoman, Boomer, tinque

    I feel so thankful to all of you helping me get to a better place. It feels great to feel gratitude. I hope I can could do same for you one day. For now, I am going to use this feeling to touch people around me. Like that movie “Pay it forward”. Can you feel that we are all connected in this Universe and that we all matter? Isn’t it great?

  284.  #284kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 5:14 am

    Gonna CD the treadmill then go total boy energy with a bowl of oatmeal.

  285.  #285Prairie Girl on April 7, 2011 at 5:20 am

    #180 LP
    I LOVE it!!!!!!
    Yes and can I get an amen somebody!!!!
    Angels on your body… and that poor

  286.  #286Prairie Girl on April 7, 2011 at 5:24 am

    I’m trying to catch up on posts.. last night was dress rehearsal for the play (next 3 nights the real thing.. wish me luck and a good memory for my lines).. I gotta do more arm work outs!!!! EEEK! I wear a tiger print halter top and it’s scary… the arms…

    Do you think it’s bad that my kids address me as my characters name, and quote her bad (poorly written) poetry as they walk thru the house?….They’ve had to sit thru too many rehearsals.. they think they’re stage hands and want to pull the curtain too…lol


  287.  #287kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 5:34 am

    286 Heavy, heavy weights and cardio really helped with my arms. And it’s cute the kids are so into the play. They mean no harm by calling you your character name.

  288.  #288LD on April 7, 2011 at 5:38 am


    I’ve posted this before, but here goes again. I CD because that’s how I figure out who the good guys are. And which of the good guys is serious about a relationship. Once I get that far and the compatibility, chemistry and timing is there for both of us, I’m all about being exclusive.

    But I live in a resort town that is a big party town with LOTS of players. I have been told pretty much anything by a man who just wanted to sleep with me. I’ve even had a man tell me he had cancer and only 6 months to live to try to get me in bed. Shaved his head and eyebrows and everything!

    You say when we find this stuff out, just leave. But in my experience these men want you all to themselves even when playing you. Even the players don’t like to share. Even the ones dating multiple women don’t want to share any of them. Even the ones who are married and lie about it don’t want to share.

    When a woman CDs, especially without sex, she weeds out the players and men who are serial 3 month relationship guys and the good guys are the ones who are standing when the dust settles. If I agreed to exclusivity with every man who wanted it, I’d have more 3 month sexual relationships under my belt than you could possibly imagine. In my experience, they ALL want ME to be exclusive, no matter what their intentions really are with me. They just don’t all want to offer me anything back…..

  289.  #289Brenda on April 7, 2011 at 5:49 am

    It’s Worldwide SLV Day!

    Senior Lady Vibe, I hope today you treat yourself like the queen who you are! I hope you treat yourself to something special you normally wouldn’t get or do for yourself, like a bubble bath, a pedicure, coffee out at a cafe, a new book, or whatever strikes your fancy!

    And I welcome all the Sirens to celebrate with her, treating yourselves as the queens you are! 🙂

    Love to you all!

  290.  #290Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 5:57 am

    Thanks! How about a “Sirens Day?” We can all celebrate!

  291.  #291Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 6:03 am

    Thanks! How about a “Worldwide Sirens Day?” We can all celebrate! I’m going to do all the things you suggested.

    I just had a life lesson too. I didn’t pursue the solution to a problem because I assumed that particular far out solution I required didn’t exist. And it did! Who know? Maybe I’m doing that with other things too. [gulp]

    Think extreme! is going to be my motto for a while.


  292.  #292Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 6:30 am

    For whoever might be interested

  293.  #293Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 6:32 am

    What is Feminine Power?

    According to Claire and Katherine, unlike masculine power, which is the power to create those things that can be controlled, feminine power is the power to create those things that are beyond our control, but which our hearts most deeply long for. Things such as love, intimacy, spiritual connection, self-expression, creativity, right livelihood, meaningful contribution to the world and a brighter future for generations to come all require the awakening of a co-creative feminine power to bring them forth.

    Katherine and Claire’s work has already transformed the lives of thousands of women, and I encourage you to join them this Saturday to discover the power of this groundbreaking work for yourself.

    Here’s what Marci Shimoff, author of Chicken Soup for the Woman’s Soul, has to say about them:

    “Unique, original and inspired, Feminine Power catapults a leap in our collective consciousness, offering insights and brilliance from the leading edge!”

    And here’s what Michael Beckwith, author of Spiritual Liberation and star of The Secret, says:

    “What my dear friends Katherine & Claire skillfully transmit and teach is what the feminine is, and how every woman can activate its energy within her, thereby releasing her authentic gifts into her own individual life and into our world, and contributing to a cultural shift of literally cosmic proportions.”

  294.  #294Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 6:50 am

    I got this in an email thought I would share. I took out the second thing because some might not like it.

    If you are tired of feeling like a victim, read this: ‘I don’t want to feel this way anymore. I thought if my pain touched their lives I’d feel better. I didn’t. I thought by holding it over their heads I’d feel better. I didn’t. I thought by telling everyone what they’d done to me I’d feel better. I didn’t; it only cost me friends and kept the pain alive. I thought if they acknowledged how wrong they’ve been I’d feel better. It didn’t. I thought if I could understand why I pick such relationships I’d feel better. So I read books and talked with counsellors. But that didn’t work, because then I uncovered other issues I didn’t have the emotional energy to deal with. I thought time would make me feel better. It helped, but it didn’t heal, because there were still too many things that triggered old memories. I thought by moving to a new house in a new city and getting a new job I’d feel better. I didn’t; I only changed addresses, not what was going on inside me. Finally, I did two things that worked; not overnight, but gradually, patiently, consistently as I kept doing them, they worked. First, I decided to forgive-and keep forgiving until the past no longer controlled me. My perceptions began to clear and my heart began to heal. Why? Because at last, getting well meant more, so much more to me than remaining a victim.’

  295.  #295Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 6:54 am

    PG, honey…good luck in your play. I am so excited for you that you are doing this. I’m sure you are charming your co-stars and making friends left and right. I wish I could be there to see you!

    Are they going to post any of it on YouTube at all???

  296.  #296Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 7:00 am

    203 Zen Pony – Perfect sense!

  297.  #297Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 7:05 am

    Sometimes I feel good about all this–like I am really getting it. Then I fall back into old habits. I am trying to remind myself that I am taking good baby steps and making progress, even when I make an old mistake. I struggle with the difference between “authentic” and “share too much.”

    I have done better with feeling messages when i have time to plan them or am not nervous. It’s becoming more natural in the moment very slowly. But at least i am aware of when I could have done better.

    But something is obviously happening because of this vibe.

    I keep progressing. They are all “just practice” until one steps up. Keep forgetting that. Focus on ME (keep focusing on them). Treat them all equally (getting better at that).

    Getting better. Baby steps.

    “Authentic” vs. “Share too much.” Anyone care to comment? How does a Siren reconcile these two things?

  298.  #298Daria on April 7, 2011 at 7:17 am

    Nita – the purpose of what were doing here is to express feelings in the moment. We judge feelings as ‘negative’ but that is not so. Expressing any feeling to a man will make him feel safe and attracted.

    When a man doesn’t pay for example, Rori says to say… Ohh this feels bad. I feel uncomfortable paying on dates.

    Then listen to him.

    If he argues we can say… Generosity is important to me… I don’t want a man who doesn’t treat a lady on a date. What do you think?

    Then listen.

    Often even the men we judge The worst can step up.

    The key is to trust our feelings, and that constitutes trusting him. In the moment. Don’t stuff and tell him later…(unless you did stuff and it still bothers you later) In the moment is where the magic happens. When the man has a chance to transform.

    It takes practice to comfortably express ourselves this way. And really give the man a chance without judgement.

    It changes everything.

    The key is not to blame.

    CDing is the practice.


  299.  #299Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 7:36 am

    277: Celtic Blue

    I really like everything you say there.

    I may co-opt some of it.

    Thank you.

  300.  #300Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 7:42 am

    247 Darling Ella:

    “First you buy a whip…and keep it handy…maybe one that can shorten and fit in your purse…”

    Oh, DE, you naughty kitten!

    LOL, made my morning…thanks!

  301.  #301sweetmandm on April 7, 2011 at 7:49 am

    @298 Daria-

    Nicely written and nice reminders!! Thank you for that! 🙂 HUG!

    Still trying to practice it in the moment that I do feel something. So used to denying my feelings. have even been thanked by the man I really like a lot, for expressing to him even the simplest of things. I have been surprised at that. For example- “I feel like we are almost running instead of walking.” HIM- “Oh thank you for letting me know that. ‘I will try to slow my pace!”

    It’s still difficult to express things like- I feel nervous…, that’s a tough one but important one, I know!!

    I came to the understanding today actually, that in my 20’s it was so easy to be authentic and open and just breezy me around guys I was interested in. Through the years, I have totally morphed into something different than those. Otherwise, with all others in my life, I am a true Italian woman and express away……. 😉


  302.  #302Queenbee on April 7, 2011 at 8:00 am

    #288 LD says: “I have been told pretty much anything by a man who just wanted to sleep with me. I’ve even had a man tell me he had cancer and only 6 months to live to try to get me in bed. Shaved his head and eyebrows and everything!”

    LOL! LD you must really be HOT!!

  303.  #303Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 8:03 am

    Izzy: You are so sweet! I hope you keep this feeling forever because once you reach that “better place”, it’s so depressing to go back. (that’s why I don’t go back). Much prefer the feeling of peace and strength. I’m very, very happy for you and I love the pay it forward idea!

    SLV: Re “what do you do for a living?” Yeah…hate that question….sooooo boring! My favorite is the “alphabet soup” one (because everyone always laughs) but no matter what, I like to say something silly or sometimes something that makes no sense:

    Him: “So…what do you do for a living?”

    Me: “I stack books”.

    Him: “You stack books?”

    Me: “No…but do you really want to talk about work?” (wink, smile, flirty…this is key because otherwise he’ll just think you’re a little weird…creepy even. lol – oooh….good way to get rid of someone quickly though…hmmm).

    He’ll laugh.

    Later (and this happens 90% of the time:

    Him: “What did you really mean by stack books?”

    Me: “Nothing. I just made that up so we could find something more interesting to talk about than my job. It worked huh?” (smile, wink, flirty…)

    Nobody really likes to talk about work on a first date right? And now he’ll remember you forever. Heck, I use this stuff with men who are just trying to start a conversation because I happen to be sitting there.


    Much Love,

  304.  #304Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 8:03 am

    221 Jacqueline. I used your suggested text. Thank you.

    And Turquoise, I’m not sure he “just wants to get laid,” but I have certainly met enough who do. And I have been known to be naive about it, for sure. He’s not all about sex–there have been some really nice emails and phone calls where it has not even come up. But I am aware that it could be on the agenda. I have to end the date by 11:00 anyway, so I’m not too worried.

    Boomer may be frisky, but she **definitely** is not into quickies.

  305.  #305kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 8:11 am

    My bff is a guy and he gets turned off when he asks a woman, “What do you do?” and she gives cutesy, evasive answers. He sees it as her being difficult, or worse, she’s a gold digger. But mostly, he sees them as difficult. He always asks me why can’t women just answer the question…i’m a lawyer, i’m a blogger, i shovel sh*t for a living, whatever- it’s a harmless question.

    Food for thought from the male pov.

  306.  #306Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 8:25 am

    Kaitlyn: You might suggest to him that some women find it very, very boring when a man can’t come up with anything better to ask on a first date. Plus…we’re wanting to make sure HE’S not a gold digger either and until we get to know him better, we prefer he not know even an estimate to how much we make. “Doctor” or “shovel sh*t” can give a guy a pretty good idea. At first date point, I don’t really think my income is any of his business. LOL

    Like I said, even though I’m past dating, I do this stuff with random men who ask that question. Subtle way of teaching them not to ask I guess. 🙂

    Mostly I do it because it’s the oldest and most “desperate for conversation” line a man can have. (but so, so many use it) and I like guys who are fun and funny. That question on date one (or how they react to the “cutesy” answer) tends to weed em out. Plus, if pulled off right, I personally have never had a guy insist I tell him. If he did, then we turn the tables and now HE’S difficult or a gold digger or creepy. 🙂

    I think it has everything to do with style and personality types. Some guys are going to hate it and some guys are going to love it. At that point, if one is generally a “cutesy” or “evasive” person then the guy will know and if he doesn’t have fun with stuff like that, he won’t call back. I’m guessing your bff wouldn’t call someone like me back…I’m all about having fun and not really getting into my life story and income or social status when I first meet a guy because there are a million “harmless” (ie “interview”) questions a guy can ask, but there’s also PLENTY of time for that later. For me, first dates should be cutesy and evasive. Mystery novels take some time…he can’t know the end before he knows the beginning and the middle. 🙂

    Much Love,

  307.  #307Prairie Girl on April 7, 2011 at 8:27 am

    #287 Kaitlyn
    Thanks for the arm tips…I’ve been doing cardio and some lighter weights on the upper body, but didn’t want to bulk up… I lost 80 lbs the past year and 1/2 so I know some of it won’t ever be the same w/out a close personal relationship to a plastic surgeon some day… but… anything I can do to help until then I appreciate…

    I don’t think it’s “bad” bad they call me Faye (character’s name) just bad like they’ve been dragged to too many rehearsals…lol…

    My boy (8yo) said the other day “no to you mom and no to Faye”…. And at one point in my character’s bad poetry she KAAAs like a demented bird… my 6yo was in the back of the car talking to her baby the same way… but they LOVE being on the stage… what little hams…

    This may be the coolest thing I’ve ever done in my boys eyes..

    Oh and in one scene I’m semi accosting a guy telling him we’ve been seeing a lot of each other and he should marry me.. (my character needs RR in a BIG way) and he’s running away… My girl (6y) comes back stage when I was off and said “next time say “” Delbert you’re mean”” try it okay mom?”

    I may have sent them into a life of performing from this foray…. lol..

    Angels on your body

  308.  #308kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 8:32 am

    307 Prairie Girl

    Women’s bodies aren’t designed to bulk up. Even if you’re big boned. Heavier weights build more muscle which build a lean body. And do cardio after weights. xoxox

  309.  #309Prairie Girl on April 7, 2011 at 8:32 am

    Boomer!!! Thank you for the well wishes!

    I have a few videos from last pm’s dress rehearsal that my boy took I’ll prob make a few youtubes if no body else does… I’ll post some still pics on FB in a bit…

    I’m so excited about MrOhio… he sounds so smart and funny.. AND sexy… yee haw!!! Have too much fun! I didn’t get to read your email until a few ago, I like what you sent instead…

    Angels on your boy

  310.  #310Prairie Girl on April 7, 2011 at 8:33 am

    #308 Kaitlyn
    VERY cool to know Kaitlyn! Thank you! I’m gonna start pushing it a bit then…

  311.  #311kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 8:38 am


    My bff is far from status oriented. He just feels that while someone’s career does not define them, it DOES take up a good chunk of their day. When he asks, his focus is not meant to be on that question for he is more interested in fun, lighthearted topics as well- esp on the first date.

  312.  #312kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 8:39 am

    310 Prairie

    Push it. Push it real good. lolz.

  313.  #313Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 8:46 am

    Kaitlyn: I totally understand and I’m not at all saying he is. It’s just that those things go through my head when a guy asks (the same as through his head when I don’t answer) and if he doesn’t like a woman who can’t give a straight answer to a harmless question then he probably wouldn’t call me again.

    Maybe he should try the flirty stuff too and see how women like it: “What do you do for a living? Wait…Let me guess.” and then spend most of the date “guessing” things like “football player”, “Lion tamer”, “astronaut”, etc before he tells her he gives up (and if she says “YES!” to one of those – in a flirty way – he can know she’s not interested in talking about it yet) . I know for me, that would be fun and flirty and wouldn’t feel like an interview question or a stab at checking out my potential bank balance.

    Although my job does take up a big chunk of my day, I’m guessing a guy doesn’t really care that much (at date one) what it is. I mean unless I really am a lion tamer, he’s not generally going to be all that fascinated and what’s he supposed to say next? “Oh…wow!! Project Manager?!? Really? Tell me MORE!!!!” LOL

    Anyway…just a different style from me.

  314.  #314Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Oh…and just for the record…I have no experience with whether or not these “fake job” tactics work on getting you the relationship or man of your dreams. J and I met at an industry meeting. We were ALL talking about work and we were ALL there for the same reason. No hiding it at that point. LOL

    Much Love,

  315.  #315turquoise3 on April 7, 2011 at 9:08 am

    Boomer… you are right, he may want more. It’s just when they talk about sex so much in the beginning, makes me uncomfortable, unless I’m looking for something more of a fling than a relationship.

    I hope you have a lot of fun on your date 🙂

    Alonka, I did those things, but got my feelings seriously hurt in the process, and the last few weeks I had leaned forward, cooked for him, invited him to my home, etc. I’d like to take a step back on my own, maybe even before he does… just to check in with myself, see how I feel about him, not in response to his actions when things get strained. Ya know what I mean?

    I”m very excited to hear about your date with the guy you met in person and then online… very cool 🙂

  316.  #317Kyla on April 7, 2011 at 9:23 am

    First post 🙂
    I feel reassured to read Rori’s explanation of CDing. I’m exclusive with a man who wants me to be his girlfriend and introduces me as such. Its a great relationship but I’m still open to meeting new people (male and female) and sharing experiences. I feel free. I don’t feel needy or dependent. I feel confident leaning back and learning to receive from unexpected sources. It helps me with my relationship as I feel more relaxed and open with him. I’m practicing feeling messages with everyone and its giving surprising results. I feel really good about this.

  317.  #318Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 9:30 am

    Our Relationship Experts’ Response:
    Please open up some space for compassion with yourself. It sounds to us like you are beating yourself up for your behavior – you cannot say or do the wrong thing with the right person.

    You can try to second guess what you need to say or do to get him to respond, or you can even begin to imagine what may or may not be going on with him. However, none of those actions are going to be helpful. He is telling you what he desires through his actions. It is time for you to take care of yourself and do the things that nourish you.

    The way to heal is to look at the reasons behind your behavior. What is it that you were attempting to receive by calling/texting him?

    Security? Approval? Control?

    Ultimately, this is really a great opportunity for you to learn and grow and be available to receive the love you seek in a relationship.

    You Are the Security, Approval and Control that You Look for in a Relationship
    Knowing your core motivation for your behavior is the first place to begin to shift it. Security, approval and control are things that we can never receive from another person. We get into trouble when we try to seek these outside of ourselves. You are, and you have everything you need inside of you. There is nothing this man has that will make you more complete than you already are.

    When you really embrace your own perfection, then you can attract a new level of man who will be able to communicate with you what he needs and desires. Until then, realize that most men will share with you what they desire through their actions.

    When a man truly desires to be with you in a relationship, then he will pursue you. He will initiate. A passive man is not invested in the relationship. So, release yourself from the need to please him and take care of yourself.

    From Sarah: Orna and Matthew are the real deal! Together, they’re giving the most powerful relationship advice and deep help we know of – we just love them. They walk their talk – their relationship and marriage is a testament to the work they do – you’ll want to go here to read their incredible personal story and check out their amazing ebook – Recognizing Mr. Right->

  318.  #319Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 9:35 am

    @303: Mercedes says:
    “…Him: “So…what do you do for a living?”
    Me: “I stack books”….”

    The alphabet soup one was funny but not me. BUT, this is a good one that would work for me. Because it’s also true…!!!!! kinda sorta … 😆 Makes it even funnier. I used to have a large “home library” now I’m down to one bookcase… with a couple of stacks of library books on floor beside it. I like to read and I like guys who like the written word… or ANY words. 😀


  319.  #320Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 9:38 am

    SLV, I know. It’s such a buzz-kill to see a guy’s profile say (or hear him say) “I’m not much of a reader.” I want to be able to talk about what I’m reading with MY HIM, I want MY HIM to read what I’m reading so we can talk about it.

    I think “MY HIM” is my version of “Sweetie.”

    How is Sweetie today, btw???

  320.  #321Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 9:44 am

    Mercedes, one of the funniest things I ever saw from you on here was the names you would give men when you were out. I stole one of yours recently and told some dude at a bar that my name was “Kevyn. Ya know, with a “Y.” He was like, “You’re kidding, right?” It was fun.

    My other favorites are Ricki, Cori, Stevie (considering it was almost my name–short for Stephanie), and Desdemona (“But you can call me ‘Mo.'”). Oh, and “Saffron.” That one went over well.

    And why is it that they all seem to love the names Jennifer and Jessica? I use those too. With batted eyelashes and a little lip bite. So fun 🙂

    Mercedes, you are a fun chick!

  321.  #322Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 9:45 am

    FW – I want to embrace my perfection. Working on it.

    Two things for you:

    –Happy birthday!
    –How’s your dad?

  322.  #323kaitlyn on April 7, 2011 at 9:47 am

    Boomer, same here. You don’t read, you’re out, dude.

  323.  #324Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 9:55 am

    Something has been bothering me ever since Evan posted. I couldn’t quite put my finger on it but it’s bugging me and I can’t seem to let it go.

    I felt judged and threatened reading the words that “those women wouldn’t have become wives”, like beware ladies… if you do the CDing thing, you’ll never get married. *I* [insert good quality man] wouldn’t marry you. If you don’t do this the way I say you’ll do it, then I’ll leave and you’ll be left all alone.

    Reminds me of discussions with Mr. Manly Man. Ugh.

    And then today I get an email talking about verbal abuse. This is exactly how I felt reading Evan’s post.

    “Verbal abuse is warfare. It employs the use of words as bombs and grenades designed to punish the other person, to place blame, or to justify one’s own actions or decisions.

    Abusive language is filled with poisonous put-downs which seek to make the other person feel badly, appear wrong, or look inadequate.

    Most people who use verbal abuse on their spouse are saying more about their own needs than they are about their spouse’s character. The verbal abuser has a deep need for self-worth. They are unconsciously seeking to elevate themselves by putting down the spouse. Of course, this is not an acceptable way to build one’s self-esteem.”

    I feel angry. I do appreciate Evan’s point of view, but his words felt pointed and degrading to those of us who are circular dating (especially for those of us who actively circular date and it’s working for us!)

    I’m glad it worked out for Evan and his wife. Exclusively dating hasn’t always worked for me. I feel open to both options.

    Okay, speaking my truth helps me to feel a little bit better.

  324.  #325Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 9:58 am

    @320: Boomer says:
    “..How is Sweetie today, btw???..”

    I was around town on my own this morning but did “ask him”… “that’s not you, is it sweetie” I’m embarassed to write this; I’m looking at life lessons today. I must practice my eye glaze. The sweetie question came up because man flirted with me on street and i’m pretty sure he said something to me because as he approached me on sidewalk I averted my eyes. The reason: half because I was ready to turn into store and other half 😳 because he was very short.

    Am I biased? Do I regard short men as inconsequential? I’ve read articles about men having problems when their online profiles indicate they are height challenged. I never thought I was against shorter guys. I’ve dated shorter men and been crazy about guys who were just a couple inches taller than I and I usually put in a good word for them with women who only go for the tall ones.

    I was thinking, what if this guy was my “sweetie?” Then I felt kind of bad that I hadn’t given him an eye gaze.


  325.  #326Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 10:09 am

    Awwww, SLV…well, the good news is, you did learn something about yourself. Take that as a “Yay me!” and know you will be open next time. The eye gazing is really hard, I know. I feel so “brazen.” Which is hilarious, because I speak my mind all the time. Why not hold someone’s gaze a little?

    I’m only 5’0″, and I still like ’em tall. Personal preference. And it’s OK. Cut yourself some slack?

  326.  #327Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 10:10 am

    Shannon, I too thought that comment was a little over-the-top (“scare tactics”) – but my response was, yeah, that’s probably true of Evan and his friends – and I’m sure they are great guys – but actually not the right kind of guy for me personally – and the kinds of guys I want to marry, well, they’re different than that, and would not respond that way. Besides, CDing isn’t what he thinks it is 😉 so he’s only objecting to his own misperceptions.

  327.  #328Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 10:35 am

    @327: Lucy says:
    “…Shannon, I too thought that comment was a little over-the-top (“scare tactics”) –…”

    I also sensed a punishment the other time around with this topic. Dating coach made woman being coached give up a guy when she refused to become exclusive with him after three dates. Do you remember that? Read the newsletter? Read the posts on Rori blog?


  328.  #329Lercomari on April 7, 2011 at 10:41 am

    I just had a realization, that we women are so good at what we do. We have all these little tricks to enhance our beauty. Baking soda in the shampoo to cleanse, a loofah sponge to exfoliate and glow, essential oils to heal and rejuvinate, a little oatmeal in a facial scrub for moisture and cleansing. We’re like magicians! 🙂 Sages of the bathroom who scrub, pluck, buff and polish our way to glory. I exfoliate my feet with epsom salt and olive oil, then massage them until I feel I could melt under my own touch…i massage conditioner into my hair…V05 herbal escapes shampoo in Free me Freesia smells AMAZING. I towel off, apply girly lotion, a few sprays of Imari seduction perfume…my date will see me and think, she looks and smells amazing. But he has no idea just how much magic went into my transformation. 🙂 I was laughing to myself in the shower…because its so ridiculous how much I LOVE being a girl!

  329.  #330Lercomari on April 7, 2011 at 10:44 am

    “I am strictly a female female, and my future I hope will be/in the home of a brave and free male who enjoys being a guy, having a girl like me!”

    I love this song! lol. Click the link above for your dose of girly for the day! 🙂

  330.  #331Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 10:45 am

    Boomer: Thanks! Hilarious! I know “Katie” works well with the batted eyelashes and lip bite too. Don’t use “Mercedes” (someone will ask you if your headlights are on…*rolls eyes*). It’s just fun. I love having fun. I think I lost that side of me for a little while earlier this year (or late last year???) not sure but J told me the other day that he’s glad to see me enjoying myself again. I had fessed up that I thought I had become a “complainer” he said he didn’t see that at all and didn’t really notice much difference until I “came back”…that’s when he realized I had taken a break from having fun (we both think it was mostly stress from work). Well now I AM back and I’m really super glad he likes it! 🙂

    (btw, he actually hears me tell men my fake names and jobs and he thinks it’s funny too)

    SLV: I WANT your books!!! J and I are working on an in home library and could probably fill about 1/4 to 1/2 of what we want to end with. About 90% of our books are hard cover. We read mostly the same authors (but he’s not really into relationship advice books like I can be…although I’m reading Kama Sutra again right now and he said I’ve inspired him to read it after me).

    The only unfair part of how we do it is that I usually read the book first (and I have to try to not give it away no matter how funny something is, etc) and he reads it second and can tell me all about it. (he reads the good parts to me…AFTER I already read the book. LOL). Cool thing is we both love to read and we talk about books all the time. We just finished the Dragon Tattoo books and we’re watching the movies for the second time…trying to compare them to the books and remember what the differences are. I know, I know…geeks…but we love it. 🙂

    We also enjoy other things together (I attribute this to neither of us watching tv at all…movies, yes. Absolutely zero on the weekly episodes of anything on tv though). We do crosswords, sudoku, puzzles (actual jigsaw puzzles on the table), we cook together, etc. I like that stuff because we’re constantly talking and enjoying each other’s company…vs watching tv and enjoying the company of famous people we don’t even know. 🙂

    When we need “me” time, he usually enjoys video games and I enjoy being online or writing. That’s why I’m not online a lot at night or on the weekends though…we go in spurts. If his video game is addictive and taking a long time to finish, we might have multiple “me” nights or more “me” nights in a week than we usually have, etc. Same goes if I’m on a roll with writing or my Portuguese lessons or in the middle of a big debate here…(ahem)…

    We’re both pretty flexible and we’re both pretty tuned in to the needs of the other, so it tends to work out well for us no matte what.

    Anyway…I ramble…but fun stuff!

    Much Love,

  331.  #332Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 10:53 am

    Celtic Blue – thank you for clearing that up and I think Katarina responded on the other thread. The audio when played on my computer said something like “Laura’s audio,” and I have never heard Wendi’s voice. I shall contact her and tell her how much I like the tape!!

    Kyla- WELCOME!!! You’ll find lots of great stuff here and you can read the older posts to pass the time – and jump in an post. Sometimes if we’re “debating” a point, you might get missed…but if you just keep posting you’ll find answers to all your questions!

    Everyone, have a great day – oh, and I can breathe, mostly. Life is much nicer when you can breathe I must say….


  332.  #333Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 10:57 am

    @330: Lercomari says:
    “…I love this song!…”

    Me too!…”I Enjoy Being A Girl.” I’ve put up that same link to the song a time or two on Rori blog. I’m happy to see it again. I’ll play it while I’m cruising around the ‘net.



  333.  #334Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 11:03 am

    Lucy, Not to beat a dead horse but I felt the same thing about the use of child molestation in your posts about not writing your book. I do this at times myself (go with the worst case scenario). It never occurred to me how threatening that feels to the recipient. Never mind that it leaves no room for the other person’s point of view.

    SVL, I do remember that conversation with the not-to-be-named dating coach. 😉

  334.  #335turquoise3 on April 7, 2011 at 11:10 am

    Does anyone have Christian Carter’s Mastering Make or Break Moments with Men program? It sounds pretty good. I was aslo interested in From Casual to Committed… I think Jilly said she had that one.

  335.  #336Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:12 am

    @331: Mercedes says:
    “…SLV: I WANT your books!!!…”

    Oh, I wish… long gone, long gone. Just too troublesome to pack and move around. The killing part is I’ve repurchased some of the same books on eBay. Mostly non-fiction stuff that is now out-of print. And all those are now in demand and prices are crazy on some which I will have to do without. I have to restrain myself and I’m using library as much as possible, right now I have 20 library books/DVDs on loan.

    I don’t have the house with space for it anymore. I like my current “teeny” lifestyle and keep one bookcase for old times’ sake. Maybe if you whisper a few times and rub your Aladdin’s lamp… tinque will come to your rescue. A little bird told me she might have some books…. fun ones… the kind you would like… (whisper whisper.)

    Your “at home” lifestyle is pretty much what I see for me and my “sweetie.” Happy days!


  336.  #337Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 11:13 am

    Wendi offers a FREE cd…lol…then you hit checkout and it calculates postage. ack! Just wasn’t prepared for that after a page saying it’s free, it’s free!

    I am extremely triggered by the jumping off the fence into he’s VERBALLY ABUSIVE territory – if you really believe this, write HIM and tell him so! Feels like passive agressiveness to decide it a day later –

    and exactly – we’ve all used hyperbole, ala the child molesting example, so why judge a man more harshly than we would a fellow poster?

    We are taking him out of context as much as we are saying he is taking Rori out of context.

    He just wrote a great post of FB on unconditional love, doesn’t sound like the guy who’s abusive, and perhaps, correct. I’m open to his interpretation and allowing him to have his truth anyway.

    My .02 cents

  337.  #338Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:15 am

    @332: Jacqueline says:
    “…Life is much nicer when you can breathe I must say….”

    I’ve always considered breathing one of the essentials… hahaha 😛

    I hope you are feeling well.


  338.  #339Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 11:16 am

    ps – by the non contested (yesterday) definition of circular dating if it were working for you, you’d have a marriage proposal. Unless you are actually in a committed relationship. Or are using the alt. definition of self therapy. Curious about this….

  339.  #340Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:20 am

    @334: Simply Shannon says:

    “…SVL, I do remember that conversation with the not-to-be-named dating coach. …”

    Hmm, yep. Guys will be guys; they get all mad and flustered when women don’t do what they want them to do. Ideas get tweaked all the time so I don’t worry too much. I might be someplace myself next year. I’m just trying to do what works and that is different for different people…

    Yee haw as PG would say… 😀


  340.  #341Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:26 am

    @337: Jacqueline says:
    “…. so why judge a man more harshly than we would a fellow poster? ….”

    Cuz, he’s a man… but only if when telling us “what to do” it comes off funky. If he’s just speaking his mind, cool. But when he’s speaking it for me “to do” well,,, another story… I might pull out DE’s purse size whip and give little sweet cakes a few taps… 😯


  341.  #342Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 11:27 am

    Ack. The child molestation example was Not hyberbole nor was it verbal abuse by any stretch of the imagination. I feel amazed by these assertions. I feel shaky. I feel baffled. I’m guessing that emotional triggers short-circuited rational thinking for those who read my words this way. It was a pretty straightforward logical presentation.

  342.  #343turquoise3 on April 7, 2011 at 11:28 am

    It is sunny and gorgeous here… and I’m leaving work in 15 min! Yeah!!

  343.  #344Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 11:30 am

    SLV – that’s funny but wrong, and you know I get morally outraged…lol! Feels like we are judging him out of fear actually – and yes he does say he gets results “in months” on his FB page, too. I’ll be interested to see what he says, and maybe it just doesn’t have the emotional punch to it because – well, I love men!! and I’m not feeling vulnerable at all about it. Got a really sweet email from an ex yesterday – thank you for helping me find the freespiritedness I became. Yep, that’s me – I just show ’em how to find their bliss and cut em lose.

    grinning…but it was nice.

    ‘kay I’m really off now….lalala…have a good one, one and all!

  344.  #345Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 11:31 am

    CDing in its True Form is ONLY about healthy self-care. So then, to me, it’s a no-brainer that if a man objects to That, I don’t Want to be his wife. 🙂

  345.  #346Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:31 am

    @337: Jacqueline says:
    …Wendi offers a FREE cd…lol…then you hit checkout and it calculates postage. ack! Just wasn’t prepared for that after a page saying it’s free, it’s free!…”

    I’m not familiar with the offer but there is a production cost to make each one and also shipping and handling so maybe she meant well. I’d rather do digital download but that has its own cons too.


  346.  #347Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 11:33 am

    Sorry, Lucy – since I never really understood the story and I don’t have time to read all the posts, I just generically called it hyperbole, you have every right to your truth, as well. My apologies!

  347.  #348Boomer on April 7, 2011 at 11:34 am

    I love everyone here.

    We are an eclectic and interesting bunch of women (and sometimes men).

    I am a fan of “being authentic,” but sometimes, I think we need to just not sweat stuff and live and let live.

    Could I be any more cliche?

    I dunno, I get “triggered” here on occasion, and I tend to let it slide. It’s not worth ruining the almost-always lovely feeling I find here. The one time I did say, “Hey, no fair!” I got the person’s name wrong and I felt stupid. I think the Universe was telling me to chill a little and not provoke people who have my best interest at heart.

    I know there is value if expressing even the negative emotions, but I guess I prefer this forum when it’s one of women supporting each other.

    Just my hope. And it’s not lost on me that I am expressing my negative emotions here too in the guise of “can’t we all just get along?”

    Stopping now…I do love everyone here, though, and I guess that’s what it comes down to.

  348.  #349Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 11:35 am

    SLV – yeah, it was only $2.00 – I had more of a reaction of oh, crud, I’m supposed to get off the couch go find the credit card and enter it online? nooooooo….

    Branding has a lot to do with creating expectations, and ummm…well it said FREE…

    and I like to underpromise and overdeliver in the business sense.

    Tell Honey Hi for me…will he know who he is if he’s Honey??

  349.  #350Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:42 am

    @344: Jacqueline says:
    “…SLV – that’s funny but wrong…”

    I often use humour when I speak my truth and in this case, no the whip was only metaphor I would not spank any dating coaches, unnamed otherwise. So whip, wrong, OK. But I don’t like bullying language regardless of what kind of coach and nothing wrong with my taste there although you might not agree.

    And, I do not like hypocritical messages where someone does a thing and then says “Oh, no , no way” when someone does else very similar or the same. I refer to the newsletter excerpt I posted above at #107… I don’t believe anyone commented on that… CD by any other name and the woman paid for seven weeks of personal coaching to learn that among other things… I endorse this but… is Rori’s so different???


  350.  #351Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Jacqueline, I feel annoyed. What is passive aggressive about bringing up something that made me feel uncomfortable yesterday, a month ago, a year ago? Is there a time limit or something I didn’t know about? I felt uncomfortable with his choice of wording but didn’t say anything then. Now I am. And I’m posting it for all to see right here where the conversation began. He reads here too.

    And you’re right. I’m totally reading a threat into his words. It’s definitely my fear creeping up. I mean, what if he’s right about CDing? I don’t think so. My experience says no but what if I’m wrong?

    Regardless, he doesn’t get to use threats (real or perceived). If I perceive them, I’m going to call them out. Even a day later. I’m happy to be corrected about this and told that wasn’t the intended case.

    And even if he never answers, I’m being honest here about what I’m seeing so that *I* can deal with my own shit.

    Dang I feel mad. Like being told I can’t write what I want. Now there’s a mirror for ya.

  351.  #352Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:48 am

    @348: Boomer says:
    .”..The one time I did say, “Hey, no fair!” I got the person’s name wrong …”

    I think I remember…. kind of confusing for a minute. But it worked out OK and last night I got wished “Happy Birthday” I assume by the Universe as a way to even things out. 😀

    I am learning that, for me, I will not give my “sweetie” every thing that pops into my head. He might get a headache.


  352.  #353Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 11:51 am

    @349: Jacqueline says:
    “…Branding has a lot to do with creating expectations, and ummm…well it said FREE……”

    Well, I wouldn’t do it… I’d make “free” FREE!!!


  353.  #354Darling Ella on April 7, 2011 at 11:51 am

    SLV #341

    I feel glad you are having fun with my “purse whip” reference…lol

    I don’t know what and where I would be without sense of humor…I feel greatly reliant upon it!!!

    Warm hugs,

  354.  #355Katarina Phang on April 7, 2011 at 11:57 am

    LD, you’re right. I have been dating a wonderful man the past 7 months. We share all the 3 C’s (chemistry, compatibility and communication) that make a relationship work and survive, yet our timing is way off. He has recently divorced (his 2nd in less than a decade) and he’s in no way ready to commit to another relationship (and he had a vasectomy while I still want to try to have kids). He’s got this belief in his head that he is prone to burn through a relationship.

    He told me, “I love you. I’m in love with you. Told you you are the best. If I was ready to settle down you’d be the one.”

    I have an option: to leave him or to keep seeing him and CD. I choose the latter, it works for both of us right now. We have had our drama the past 2 weeks. It was only because in my last trip (we are long distant) he confessed that he hadn’t felt this love with anyone in a long time and it felt so good to feel that again, and he made a public announcement in a party we hosted that I was his gf (well called me “wife” since we met).

    If he was ready and willing to reverse the vasectomy to give me a chance to conceive, I’d go exclusive with him right at this sec. But situation isn’t like that right now.

    I love him and it’s not easy to just walk away, the way Shannon said. We almost broke up a few times already this past 2 weeks because emotions ran rampage but we always talked it over. He said it ‘s because “we need/want each other so much.”

    We do. Love is just so complicated sometimes. In my case CD is the only way for me to stay sane.

  355.  #356Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 12:14 pm


    “I’m guessing that emotional triggers short-circuited rational thinking for those who read my words this way. It was a pretty straightforward logical presentation.”

    I feel angry and amused all at the same time. (I’m noticing the amusement is mostly a cover, to make light of uncomfortable feelings.)

    The implication I’m hearing is that I’m not rational or logical because I heard something different than what was intended. Is that what you meant?

  356.  #357Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    I missed the Evan comment and had to go back up and find it…I was seriously confused and very curious.

    Evan: Do you think it’s a timeline or circumstance thing that has us all speaking a different language here? I’m curious because circular dating worked for me. My guy had cheated and I left him and started dating other men. When he wanted me back, I said “NO” (just like that. all caps in my voice) and kept dating other men. As he continued to work on himself (not seeing other women) and continued to want to try things with me again, we became friends and I started seeing him socially while dating other men. As we grew closer, we began actually dating again and I was still seeing other men. He started filling up my time (and complaining about these other men) so much I couldn’t possibly date other guys because he was keeping me very busy and wasn’t about to lose me again. He wanted me back in his life so much that he tried everything in his power to make ME decide I didn’t want anyone else. Even through that time, I was always (I do mean always) a flirt (circular dating at a different level). He soon made a comittment to me that has not faltered once. I don’t date others anymore but that happened gradually as he “won” me back. I’m still a flirt (come on…I can’t help it!!) and he and I are ROCK solid. But he did have to step up his own speed of self examination and work hard to get me back because I wasn’t about to wait around for a guy who cheated and who couldn’t seem to decide what he wanted out of life/relationships.

    There are other circumstances as well. What about two people who are just beginning to date? He wants something “someday” and so does she but neither of them are ready for that with each other. Should they be exclusive anyway until the both figure it out?

    What about the couple who have been dating for 10 years and he isn’t a player and does want a future but he’s not sure if he’s ready for marriage. Should she not go out there and try to find someone who is sure (because 10 years is a long time to sit around trying to decide on ANYTHING)?

    Is there a timeline? I can understand why you don’t like circular dating (trust me, when I was doing it, J didn’t like it either, but he also “knew” – probably without really knowing consciously – that he was going to have to figure it out pretty soon because dates were not hard for me to come by) but at what point then would you suggest a woman stop seeing other men while her “boyfriend” decides what he wants? How long would you suggest two people date exclusively while one desperately wants marriage/family and the other doesn’t know? Are there any circumstances where you would suggest a woman circular date? How would you suggest a woman who wants marriage NOT pin those hopes on one man who isn’t ready and risk having her heart broken? And if a guy REALLY does care about a woman and want her all to himself, is there anything wrong with that man taking the initiative to fill up her time so that she CAN’T circular date or should there be times when she sits home alone waiting for him?

    I would really like to know, from a guy’s point of view (one who doesn’t agree with circular dating)…what should a woman do if she wants marriage and her guy isn’t sure and how long should she do it? And please…don’t suggest she have “the talk” with him instead because most men say they want to know what’s on our minds, but if what’s on our minds is “marriage and babies within the next nine months”….he doesn’t really want to know. 🙂

    Very curious about this Evan. VERY. I hope you’re still around to answer…

    Much Love,

  357.  #358Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    And Lucy, I’m practicing expressing here. I know what you meant in the other post. I believe you meant it only as an example. I still didn’t like it. So I’m voicing that out loud.

  358.  #359life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    337 Jacqueline

    I agree with what you say here regarding EMK.

    My opinion is that he does an excellent job of interpreting the zeitgeist vis a vis the kinds of concerns today’s women are encountering in relationships with today’s men, and addresses them on his blog in a refreshingly practical and useful way. That’s how I see it, anyway. His information has been among the most helpful and no-nonsense that I have encountered, with little smoke and mirrors.

    I would say that it might not be particularly productive for him to come on the blog here and dispute the finer points of CDing and then be accused of being abusive….as you say:

    “He just wrote a great post of FB on unconditional love, doesn’t sound like the guy who’s abusive, and perhaps, correct. I’m open to his interpretation and allowing him to have his truth anyway.”

  359.  #360Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    Hi, Life!! thanks for that –

    and I came back to say my apologies to Shannon, as well.

    I find I am in general triggered by unprovable accusations that involve something that might be slanderous or libel. And calling a well known coach verbally abusive seems that way to me – particularly as someone could pick that comment up and post it for the world to see, possibly hurting his reputation- but then I also reacted the same way to child molesting.

    I can see if you wrote an autiobiography that was hurtful to your children it might be child abuse, but I cannot make the equation to a physical act of molesting, just as I can’t see how what Evan said was verbally abusive instead of his statement of what he believes is true.

    I believe we have to be very careful in areas like this not to cause real harm. As an apartment manager I have seen plenty of angry women file on men for domestic violence, child abuse, etc. with no basis in fact from a revenge stance. And it can keep people from even being considered for housing for the rest of their lives – or I can simply and legally go put up a big poster in the Laundry room(s) with the persons name, crime and apartment number.

    I always felt that crime and punishment in that instance was absurd, because we obviously don’t and can’t make a system to rehabilitate this illness – if the accusations are true, so we should like send them all to an island?

    It’s deep and I just personally react to name calling like that – and it is totally my trigger.

    So, if I triggered you to anger – not my intention, and my apologies for that –

    and to everyone,


  360.  #361Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    Shannon, no, I am not implying that you are not rational or logical. I am not implying Anything. I don’t usually imply. I just say what I mean, straight out. So if ppl add to what I said or infer something from what I said, it’s usually their own personal interpretation. Sorry you feel bad.

  361.  #362Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    I’m confused. Lucy says this about putting her children’s needs above her own needs and understanding what happens when some people don’t. As she talks, she is referring to what is right for her and why she does or doesn’t do certain things and she never once calls out another person or accuses anyone…simply states that she is the kind of mother who puts a huge effort into the needs of her children:

    “I hope that when you are a parent you will consider your children’s needs. Many parents don’t and end up doing a lot of damage. For instance, fathers who molest their little girls bc they are putting their own desires ahead of their child’s needs. Or mothers who leave their babies home alone so they can spend the night with their boyfriends. Loving and caring for my children is playing BIG in my book, not small.”

    Then others here accuse a specific person (naming names) of being verbally abusive based on something he did. Calling him out on it and pointing fingers.

    How are those two the same? Lucy talks about two different areas of abuse and about how she personally puts the needs of her children first even when others don’t.

    And that’s the same as calling someone who posts on this blog verbally abusive?

    Maybe I’m the one with the logic problem but I can’t seem to connect those dots…

    This subject just keeps drawing me back in no matter how much I no longer want to play. I don’t want to play but I do want Lucy to be treated fairly and not be compared to the issue of actually labeling someone else here. Talk about apples and plastic cups…sheesh! (even less alike than apples and oranges so I thought I’d use that instead)


  362.  #363Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    I keep hearing these words…and maybe I misunderstand the comparison:

    “When we hear Lucy say she is NOT abusive to her children and she puts their needs first (unlike a child molester or a mother who leaves her kids alone), that’s JUST LIKE when we say Evan IS an abuser. Same thing. Don’t you see it?”

    Huh?? Ummm…no…I don’t…


  363.  #364Angel Lady on April 7, 2011 at 12:55 pm

    Mercedes – I really enjoyed reading your post (question to Evan) It is like you are reading my very mind and what I wonder in my own situation. I also read Evans post and can really understand that being a guys point of view and think there is some truth to his statements about hurting the relationship that is building with CDing.

    I also feel torn because I have 2.5 years invested into a relationship that he SAYS he wants all those things and loves me, but there just doesn’t seem to be any action to back it up… ie ring, moving into together…etc.

    And I feel confused. I left him 4.5 months ago because I want more that we have. I want to combine my life with someone now. I am ready for that. Scared but ready and I have spent the past 6 years with 2 different men in LTR who say they want that and yet we there is no movement on it.

    I feel torn between the two sides. I see them both. And DO NOT want to be the girl who pressures a man to live and marry me. So I keep leaving after 2.5 – 3 years when I don’t see it manifesting.

    I don’t know..

    I really would like to see Evan answer and appreciate your solid question.

  364.  #365Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 12:56 pm

    Mercedes – both the words verbally abusive and child abuser or child molester are slanderous and libel; unless this fact has been proven and the person convicted of either. Goes to slander and libel, and has nothing to do with either person’s posts – just my reaction to the issue with using the words. Make sense?

  365.  #366Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 12:59 pm

    In a left brained, logical discourse they both subject someone to a general term of defamation that has not been proven. That’s how they are related. And, the fact or or act of needs to be proven, or as a concientious person I cannot agree to either label of any person, not being a judge and jury.

    You’re saying one IS the other is incorrect from what I said.

    And, all of that is qualified with IMO…

    end of convo for me.


  366.  #367LonePlum on April 7, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    193: Boomer 297: Boomer

    ***“Authentic” vs. “Share too much.” Anyone care to comment? How does a Siren reconcile these two things? ***

    You are not authentic when you beg a man to be a certain way with you and you want him to understand why you don’t trust yourself. You are explaining, hoping it will control what he thinks of you and what he wants from you.

    First, work on trusting yourself
    Only then can you be authentic

    Being authentic means being oneself which you can’t be until you have defined yourself.
    You don’t know the border line of your shape, you have not drawn yourself in your own mind yet, how could you know who you are?

    You told HIM that you are afraid he wants sex on Friday.
    That’s because you don’t trust yourself enough to tell YOURSELF “I don’t want sex on Friday”

    All you have been telling your dates so far is what we are supposed to tell ourselves or, if we can’t do it yet, we tell a counselor.
    Men are not counselors, don’t dump your inner conflicts onto them.
    They expect to have fun, to be mesmerized, not to help you define who you are.

    You are supposed to use men to help YOURSELF define yourself. But you don’t make them define yourself. Nobody can define yourself.
    He will try sex if he wants to. Whether you have sex will depend on your decision.
    Don’t tell a man what to do with his libido or how you manage yours.
    Tell YOURSELF what to do with yours.

    In the worst case where he tries sex:
    _if it offends/bores you, don’t meet him again.
    _If you want to practice feeling messages, tell him it feels bad. Tell him to stop or you are leaving.
    _If you want sex, well accept it when he offers it.
    Whatever, but own you decision facing his attitude. Don’t tell him what his attitude should be.
    Act your attitude in the moment, don’t write it in advance with more explanations.

    A date who is clear she wants sex, is a date who enjoys her right to be sexual. I have no comment to make. She is taking care of her libido, and she owns her decision.
    But I don’t feel good reading he is almost commanding you to give him sex on your next date when you don’t want to.
    _A prostitute gets commanded because she is paid to do the job she is commanded to do. In her mind she is not pleasing a man, she is taking care of herself by making good money to keep independent from men who would make her do what she does not want.
    _A date who says she does NOT want sex, yet participates to his sexual flirty messages and innuendos, and is told she is expected to give sex after the meal, is a date who does not respect herself. Instead of taking care of what she wants, she appears to be pleasing the man who is not respecting what she wants. It is lower than being a prostitute. And the man knows it.

    As Meemee said once, he does it because he can. He is used that it works. The incredible part of it is that nobody forces the woman to obey to the man. All a man needs to do is to send a sexual innuendo and many women pick on it, follow him, even add more sexual innuendos in their answers.
    Yet they keep telling him they do not want sex, they want romance.
    Go figure….
    Men don’t waste time trying to figure it out. They need sex. They let the woman say she does not want sex and they keep pushing and they win, they get sex. They don’t believe in the woman’s authenticity. When they believe in it, they feel emotionally attracted to her.
    Coherence in your attitude will make them believe in your authenticity.

    How did your communication become sexual if you don’t want to involve sex?
    You are not being authentic. You are pleasing him. He took you on the sexual flirt and you followed him, to make sure you don’t lose him. He has not given you what you want and yet you are afraid to lose him? He is stealing sexual emotions from you already, and yet you are afraid to lose him? The man is giving you nothing, what would you lose if he stops contacting you?

    If you really don’t want sex to be involved, being authentic would have meant to not take the sexual flirty road at all. There are so many topics, why are you even mentioning your sexual potential?
    We all have one, no need to say it.
    Yours is yours and a rare gift he will have to sense by himself. For now, he will have to wonder what type of woman you are in bed, it is part of the real flirting game, to let him curious about it all, and to keep quiet about it. Don’t offer yourself so cheap. If he does not work at it, he was not interested in you or a relationship, you are saving a precious time by letting him go.

    If I was a man, your sexual flirting is telling me you want to get laid, you have no other value to bring me.
    I would expect you give me sex on the date. If you don’t give me sex, I would stop dating you. And I would wonder why on earth you made sexual innuendos to a stranger if you don’t want to get laid with strangers?

    If I wanted emotional attention from a man, I would not keep emailing this one.
    Or if I was in a naughty mood, I would meet him, order the most expensive diner and take my time to enjoy it, I would be joyful and as nice as can be, lol.
    I would not play sexual at all, I would be myself. A woman, not interested in casual sex, not even THINKING of it, but who enjoys the evening with a man who is all thrilled by her presence lol.
    I would not worry about what he thinks I am going to give him in exchange. It is not my problem, I am not a whore. And if I was, I would charge more than a meal lol.. lol
    I would let him own his expectations and not even think of it myself.
    I would not let him take me into a sexual conversation during the evening. I would ignore and start a new topic. I would be coherent with what I want.
    Once out of the restaurant, I would say:
    “The restaurant was lovely. I enjoyed myself, thank you. I’ll get my way home, now, Good night.” and I would walk away to my car or to a taxi, whatever.
    I would not even offer him “hot dog buns” to put his dick in between and take it back home in a doggy bag.
    Coz I don’t give a damn how he “handles” his expectations. Lol

    It would not teach him a lesson. Nothing does, too many women play his game, so he knows the next woman will give him what I did not.
    But it would be my small silly symbolical revenge against men who expect me to be cheaper than a whore when I am clearly stating I am looking for romance.


  367.  #368Darling Ella on April 7, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    Mercedes # 357:

    That is a great post with great questions. I conquer with Angel Lady…I feel very curious if Evan will answer…

    Warm hugs,

  368.  #369Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    Angel Lady: I think the answers to my questions would ABSOLUTELY help you. I too hope Evan comes back. Man….sounds like I had you in mind when I asked! 🙂 Let’s hope he sheds some light because I personally agree with what Rori is say: Circular Date. Evan obviously wouldn’t give you that advice so I’m wondering…what would he advise?

    Jacqueline: yes…it makes absolute sense. Except Lucy didn’t call anyone an abuser or a molester…she just mentioned it happens and that it happens by putting a need above the needs of a child. Now verbally abusive…THAT comment was attibuted to Evan. Make sense?

  369.  #370Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    yep, and my reaction to both is that it is a form of defamation to an individual unless it has been proven; and indeed it certainly occurs without ever being proven.

    Lucy mentioned it happens in general, but in a metaphorical comparison to a person writing and publishing something that would, in their opinion, be harmful in a way that is equal to child abuse or child molestation.

    That metaphor doesn’t make sense to me, but I have certainly agreed she has every right to make it.

    Peace out,

  370.  #371Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    DE: Thank you! I think he’ll come back and answer. But what should we do while we wait for him to make up his mind about whether or not he wants to? Stop talking about relationships? Stop talking about CDating? Wait by the phone and hope it rings? Keep hitting “refresh” on our browsers until he does come back? Make sure he gets the very next comment and nobody else gets to be involved?

    Oh Evan…what should we do while we wait for you????

    My vote is to continue doing whatever we want and be here with openness to receive your words if/when you show back up.

    What do you think?

    Much Love,

  371.  #372Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    Mercedes, I’m not comparing those two things. My issue is the perceived threat underlying the two comments. Maybe threat is too strong of a word. It’s the implications underlying the comments.

    A) If a woman circular dates, she will NOT become a wife.

    B) If a parent puts their needs above the needs of their child, they are on par with a child molester or a mother who abandons her children to go party.

    Why is this relevant to me? Because I do circular date, and I don’t always put my children’s needs above my own.

    Simply put, both of them hit me wrong. They felt bad to read. I’m sure Evan meant well trying to convince us of the rightness of his way, just like Lucy meant well trying to convince us of her logic regarding her book.

    I’d venture to say that the thing about Lucy’s comment chafed a bit because I do feel guilty sometimes when I put my needs first, instead of my kids. And my lovely NVs picked up the child molester comment and said “see… told you so, you’re a horrible mother.”

    Same thing with Evan… my NVs said “see, circular dating isn’t going to work… told you so.”

    Sincerely, a sneak peak into the inner workings of my mind

  372.  #373Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    or we could get all clingy and needy and stalk him on his website and email him at all hours and wonder why he’s not paying attention to us and cry because we’re being ignored and tell him how much we miss him and how we thought he really liked us and that we don’t understand why he didn’t reply right away and what did we do wrong and does he still want to post here and will he forgive us and why didn’t we get flowers??????

    But I prefer to continue with our lives as they were before he showed up…welcoming of all people (including other men) who show up in our lives…


    (He better hurry…I’m having too much fun with this…)

  373.  #374Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    Shannon…that’s cool…except I don’t think your NV’s should be used against Evan and Lucy unless they made direct comments to you or someone you care about…you know…the way you (and others) did to them…then yeah…all out there with it IMO…

  374.  #375tinque on April 7, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    “tinque will come to your rescue”

    I only give away books that have no sentimental value which is not many of them, AND most of them are still in LA, but I do have some available.

    SLV – Will be selecting yours this weekend. 🙂


  375.  #376LonePlum on April 7, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    372: The Circular Dating Argument

    Hey girls, click on the title of post 372
    it’s a new article from Rori


  376.  #377Alonka on April 7, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    Just wanted to share something.. I was talking to a prospective CD last night.. not my usual range, but decided to give it a try. 50 y.o., doesn’t look a minute younger, lives in Delaware and is planning to gradually move to New York over the next year, starting from 1 week a month work (he has a job in Delaware). He said that in the first 2 weeks of joining the site he got over 400 emails from women 😉

  377.  #378life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    I’m in a wonderful, inspiring relationship with the man who knews 100% without a doubt, pretty much right away, that he sees me for him so completely, that all other nonsense falls away. He’s a special man to be able to recognize and act on that.

    (manifest writing)

  378.  #379life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    374. Mercedes,

    haha! Yes! That’s the cycle that got started with the “blaming” verbally abusive comment !

  379.  #380Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    Wow Loneplum, eloquent as ever I love it.
    “If I was a man, your sexual flirting is telling me you want to get laid, you have no other value to bring me.”

    I have had a man tell me the only thing women have to offer him is sex, he has everything is what I have sensed. He has on occasion opened up and let me into his emotional world and shared some things that light him up. He has said it is not about the sex and it has somewhat baffled me. But I understand that maybe the one thing that could get him feeling fulfiled is emotional intimacy. I do like the concept of bringing value to another human being and sometimes I feel the challenge for me in this relationship is helping him to see my value in the emotional realm so that he keeps coming back. He admits being involved in casual sex so I know he has options and I do not judge him for it. It is his choice for his life so I only interact with him when he comes to me. This concept is liberating for me.

  380.  #381Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    RE 378 Alonka OMG that sounds disgusting. Sorry if I come across judgemental.

  381.  #382Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    Meant that sounds desperate.

  382.  #383Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    Jacqueline, once again, I DID NOT, DO NOT, and WILL NOT EVER equate book-writing with child molestation! I feel angry and frustrated by this continuing LIBEL against me. I don’t want to be treated this way.

  383.  #384Femininewoman on April 7, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    Mercedes I too like your question to Evan and your logic in looking at the scenario. Reason being I am not open to someone else laying down the law for my life as Rori mentions as Evan’s role. Experience teaches wisdom.

  384.  #385life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:01 pm


    I too don’t judge a man for being involved in casual sex, knowing he has options. Just that I am not one of those options. That’s all. No big whoop. See ya. love your hair, hope you win.” When I’m done with em, I’m done with ’em.


  385.  #386Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    Mercedes, that feels weird to read. Isn’t that the whole point of the blog? To read stuff… get triggered… say one’s feelings?

    I do appreciate the feedback though. It would certainly be a wonderful world if each person’s perceptions (NVs) weren’t used against other people. It is always about me and my junk. That is true.

    Ok, peace out folks. Going to a baseball opening game. Sunshine and beer – can I get a hell yeah!?!

  386.  #387life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:03 pm


    My God. I am having a hard time understanding this whole child molestation thing that is going on, and I am feeling bad for Lucy right now. She has enough going on with her daughter’s condition.

  387.  #388life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    FW. And I don’t always determine it is something I am doing or not doing to cause them to not “emotionally connect” with me in just the right way that makes them want to claim me the one. Too much other stuff going on in the universe to know for sure. I do agree that you can increase the odds by using NVC and having good intentions. Sometimes, you realize they just don’t really get you at all, simply because they can’t relate. And that is way OK, just time to move on. i sometimes get the impression that you are really hard on yourself, FW. I can be like that too. Hope things are getting easier with your dad. xxxoo

  388.  #389Jilly on April 7, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Alonka…i would have to call bull$hit on that one…just sayin 😉 he may have but i SERIOUSLY doubt it…not that it matters but i would feel turned off for sure and amused if a man shared that with me…like “ok…am i supposed to be impressed now?” lol

    ok i’m just having fun with what he said to you 🙂

  389.  #390Jilly on April 7, 2011 at 2:17 pm

    oooh….it’s storming here…loud thunder…raining…super dark clouds…i feel cozy and warm inside looking outside at the weather…i love thunder and lightening storms (especially if i’m inside) lol not a big fan if i’m outside working in them though…only 2 1/2 more weeks of winter vacation 🙁

  390.  #391life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    Excellent, Mercedes!

    Hope Evan comes back and answers!


  391.  #392Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    @369: Mercedes says:
    “….Angel Lady: I think the answers to my questions Evan obviously wouldn’t give you that advice so I’m wondering…what would he advise?…”

    Are you still wondering after reading my posts on coaching? Did you read my posts #107 and #350? Perhaps everyone read the newsletter itself and formed different opinons; however, I didn’t receive any feedback from anyone unless I missed it. Odd that. But there seems to be a lot of feminine interest in seeing the male dating coach appear.

    Perhaps he will expand on Valerie’s talk about her seven weeks of coaching with the male dating coach; I only posted a small excerpt for comparison. Did anyone read? Did anyone compare? Is everyone eagerly awaiting instead the appearance of the male dating coach?



  392.  #393life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    But, SLV, would you not think that Evan would give different advice to different women, based on their situations? Yes, I like it when he writes on here, he makes me smile. Are u still upset because he corrected you or something?

  393.  #394Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Catching up on posts. Has Santa Claus appeared yet?

    @371: Mercedes says:
    “…What do you think?…”

    LOL 😛 We’ll manage.


  394.  #395life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    “Yes, Virginia……” 🙂

  395.  #396Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 2:38 pm

    SS: “Mercedes, that feels weird to read. Isn’t that the whole point of the blog?”

    To use our own stuff against others? I don’t know. If it is, I wish I had known!!

    Maybe it would work better if feeling messages seemed more authentic here? I don’t know. Like “that feels weird to read” doesn’t exactly seem honest? “Weird”? In what way “weird”…or maybe I know what weird is but I don’t know it as a feeling?? I think of it as a way to describe someone or something??? So I take that as I’m weird…or what I say is weird…because “that feels weird to read” isn’t computing in my brain…

    Maybe you felt pissed when I said it (or still do)? Or you felt like I was misunderstand the purpose of the blog and you wanted to educate me? Or you felt like telling me I am wrong or stupid (or even weird…who knows)? Or possibly you felt irritated because it’s true and you know you’re mean to others…or you felt irritated because it isn’t true and you think you SHOULD be able to use your own stuff against others in the name of healing yourself? Or you felt frustrated because I don’t understand what Rori is teaching and you want me to get it? I don’t know what “weird” feels like so I’m trying to understand what might me under that description.

    No longer to SS…just me and a random venting:

    I hate the way feeling messages are used here because it is so RARE to find one that isn’t used as an attack against someone else (oh…wait…it’s not an attack…it’s “my own stuff” coming out) or as a place to hide so we can be mean and nasty to each other. RARE to hear “I feel AWESOME today!!” I swear 90% of the time I read “that feels bad”. Just think…if 90% of the time those women who use feeling messages are saying “that feels bad”…just imagine what guys must think… (in my opinion, we don’t even need to ask him at that point).

    “What do you think?”

    “I think you feel bad WAY too much for my taste! See ya!”

    Depressing is the word I would use to describe most of the feeling messages I hear on this blog. Mean, depressing, attacking, suffocating and something along the lines of quick sand…


    I’m going home…gonna have fun with J.

    But first I’m going to re-post my questions to Evan on the new post…


  396.  #397Ella on April 7, 2011 at 2:39 pm

    SS re 373

    Me too re NVs when I read Evan’s comments about CD-ing.


  397.  #398Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 2:39 pm

    @374: Mercedes says:
    “…or we could get all clingy and needy and stalk him on…”

    Oh, oh, I know we can send feeling messages to the male dating coach!

    Here’s mine:

    I feel that your feet are in slippers in the nursery of your daughter who is crying and you are looking at her and winking but she doesn’t like your winks as much as she likes nursing from her mother preferably in the early hours of the morning when everyone is asleep dreaming about the archaelogical excavations taking part in a place she doesn’t know about because she wasn’t even born when the first archaelogist took over on the dig because his predecessor left when he was offered a great big foundation grant to continue his research in a area he found way more interesting.


  398.  #399Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    @374: Mercedes says:
    “…He better hurry…I’m having too much fun with this…”

    Me too.

    Have you talked to tinque lately…?


  399.  #400Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    SLV: I actually didn’t see those comments. I’ve pretty much stayed away from the posts about other coaches unless that person is here commenting on it as well. Mostly I do that because 1. I know they’re seeing it that way and 2. I don’t have the energy to follow anymore coaches. LOL. Since I was skimming through the earlier posts and didn’t see where Evan had commented, I skipped over the references to him. It wasn’t until I had read enough to realize he commented on this post that I went back to read what it was. In any case…I would love to hear his take. It’s like with any coach…I like some stuff they say and not others, but I do like it a lot when a coach takes the time to comment…even if I don’t like the advice.

    Anyway…outta here very, very soon…hope everyone has a wonderful evening!

    Much Love,

  400.  #401Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 2:47 pm

    SLV: No, it’s been at least a week I would say…I miss her though…

    We do keep in touch pretty well for the most part…I did read she has no books for me…but then I have none for her either. 🙂 (love you tinque!!!)

    And I know I’m jealous of her eyelashes…

    And I know I wish we were celebrating our birthdays together. 🙂

  401.  #402Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 2:47 pm

    This is my personal opinion and is in no way a reflection on Lucy’s meaning or posting.

    I have apologized several times for any implied or inferred connection of my personal opinions and anything posted by Lucy.

    I agree that there was no corrolation between book writing and that the subject had moved on to good parenting.

    I object to the factual occurance of child abuse being used in any way as a descriptor of any form of metaphor that involves its implication as a common result of bad parenting. Or an uncommon one.

    I don’t like illustrations of how to be a good parent being made by extreme examples of what happens when a person is not a good parent are used in language that feels emotionally charged and judgemental to me.

    I’m not waiting around for EMK, lol – if I wanted to talk to him, I’d email, facebook or use his contact form.

    Wondering – would that be leaning forward since I don’t want to date him? but it’s not a business transaction?

    But if he shows up, that’ll be great too.

    Everyone take care!

  402.  #403Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 2:54 pm

    “…He said that in the first 2 weeks of joining the site he got over 400 emails from women …”

    I’m curious, what did he do with them all?


  403.  #404Katarina Phang on April 7, 2011 at 2:58 pm


    “I hate the way feeling messages are used here because it is so RARE to find one that isn’t used as an attack against someone else (oh…wait…it’s not an attack…it’s “my own stuff” coming out) or as a place to hide so we can be mean and nasty to each other. RARE to hear “I feel AWESOME today!!” I swear 90% of the time I read “that feels bad”. Just think…if 90% of the time those women who use feeling messages are saying “that feels bad”…just imagine what guys must think… (in my opinion, we don’t even need to ask him at that point).

    “What do you think?”

    “I think you feel bad WAY too much for my taste! See ya!” ”

    I actually agree with this sentiment. It feels more authentic and honest to just express one’s opinion point blank.

    We women think too, not just feel. We need both.

    SG and I loooove to have intellectual discussions. He’s actually impressed by how articulate and insightful I am. However, when I’m upset about something, I use feeling messages so it doesn’t come up as attacking/blaming.

    I think, as I have said it before, that’s the most appropriate time to use feeling messages. It’s not necessary and it’s plain unnatural actually to speak in them constantly.

  404.  #405Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    @394: life_is_too_short_to… says:

    I’m annoyed now at what you directed at. I’m also kind of wondering what bug is up your ass so that you are trying to fart it out in my direction.. huh? 😯

    Did I write something about you that you found annoying? And you then let loose on this tirade. I’m curious. I usually find your writing rather smart and well though out. I like your posts.

    But gee, I hate someone to lie about me as you just did. I don’t like that at all. But if I become angry, I’ll be inclined to hope you keep doing this kind of thing because men don’t like it either…

    Or perhaps cast a spell in your direction.

    I suppose I’ll consider the source and the kind of thought process that often occurs on this blog when fallacies are put forth as premises for questions. Yuck!

    My sweetie is much calmer and will only say, “leave it alone,,,, she must be a crazy bitch!” I agree to that; how could I not?


  405.  #406Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 3:21 pm

    @397: Mercedes says:

    …To use our own stuff against others? I don’t know. If it is, I wish I had known!!..”

    Sometimes it is, I was here minding my own biz, didn’t say a word to LITS and bah doom! Her she comes at me, arms flailing. Gosh. What did I ever do to her? I’ll never know I guess and I am rapidly ceasing to care.


  406.  #407Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    @402: Mercedes says:
    “…I did read she has no books for me…but then I have none for her either. (love you tinque!!!),,”

    I didn’t see “no books for” you. I think they are popular novels so maybe not what you are looking for. I read a lot of non-fiction but a novel is good sometimes…


  407.  #408Valentina on April 7, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    Dear Rori,
    At the begining of the year i found your page and your blog and bougth your program with my sister.

    I’m the kind of woman that everyone used to say “I can’t belive you don’t have a boyfriend yet” Like it was an option to me. But Yes, I’m sociable, pretty, smart and educated, however no boyfriends since I was 18. (‘m 33 now)

    After reading you. I went from “cero” dates, to: every guy I dated asked me for a second, third, or more dates. This happened in NO TIME.
    Small change in my acctitude and my whole life changed.
    However after CD I end up having dates with guys I would never date before. And this nice, simple guy stole my heart. He is a sweet, handsome and really caring guy… but he is not the one.

    WE have been together for 2 months. Without asking he introduce me to his friends and family and he is really cominted.

    I let thing happend but now I’m not sure if I really like him. I don’t know how to face this, i don’t want to hurt him, but I don’t want to stop seeing him.

    Don’t know how to face this and i feel gulty now, since i could stop this before.

  408.  #409life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 3:32 pm

    407. SLV
    After I sent that comment, I thought that it might make you upset. I seem to remember that you disagreed with something Evan said, and he responded back, disagreeing with you. Ever since then, I noticed you then sometimes taking little jabs at him. You seem to have something against him and for some reason, I connected the two things. Kind of seems like you may be doing the same thing to him that you are saying i am doing to you. I may be totally wrong about that. I probably should not have said that, anyway,as it was an assumption on my part.
    I will go back to minding my own business now!


  409.  #410Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 3:33 pm

    @405: Katarina Phang says:
    “…(oh…wait…it’s not an attack…it’s “my own stuff” coming out) or as a place to hide so we can be mean and nasty…”

    I’m glad to see you on the blog. I hope things are going well; I believe, from your posts, you will always make your way no matter what. Good!

    Re: the messages… Ah, yes! Little nasty surprises and I’m not up for them. At best the misuse is cowardly and it’s often used in a snide and manipulative manner. Gosh, no wonder some men run for the hills.

    I’m familiar with that gambit: the “wait, it’s not an attack… it’s…”

    Yeah, right!


  410.  #411life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 3:41 pm

    SLV, I was most certainly NOT being mean and nasty nor manipulative. I am not angry with anything you might have said. I did not think before I spoke and said something I saw. It was not personal. You didn’t like it very much. As for any men running for the hills, from relatively innocuous, but perhaps accurate, comments that push their buttons, I say,
    “If you can’t handle me at my worst, then you sure don’t deserve me at my best.” I need a strong man who can take it. They are out there.


  411.  #412Jilly on April 7, 2011 at 3:54 pm

    hmmmm…every man i’ve dated since finding Rori has said that they love that i tell them how i feel…

    but 90% of what i express is happy…authentic open and vulnerable

  412.  #413LD on April 7, 2011 at 4:00 pm


    I agree 100%. I use “I think” when it’s something I’m processing with my mind that doesn’t really trigger a strong emotion, and “I feel” when it’s something that triggers a strong emotion. Seems to work for me best to balance it out like that. I’m an analytical personality type and can’t be in feeling mode all of the time….

  413.  #414tinque on April 7, 2011 at 4:19 pm

    “I think they are popular novels ”

    Nope. Nor are there any romance novels or science fiction. They are mostly novels my mother sends me, and she has a far more discriminating taste than I. Most of what she sends are of high quality, well written. I’m happy to send you some Miss M if you’re interested.

    K buys me a more eclectic selection, but those I keep.


  414.  #415Queenbee on April 7, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    RE: #387 – SS, I did not experience your comments as defaming to Evan. I really got that it was about YOU. It is impossible to please everyone (here or other) and that is not what we are trying to do. Perhaps, what could help is what CCarter talks about ‘creating the context’. Sometimes we go straight into how we feel and not create any context for it that expresses how we are committed to love or finding a solution together etc.

    I too felt Evan’s comments/ thinking was too harsh and undermining for women. I felt shaky and it did challenge my thinking and commitment to myself about whether I SHOULD actually be CDing. It did create fear in me about whether I would lose out on a good man if I continue to CD.

    I understand your application of a slippery slope example to create clarity for yourself and how you feel/ what your boundaries may be where perhaps one could have been a Doormat/ CT at one point.

    I too had this experience with a man where I googled ‘Narcissistic’ to create clarity for myself about what I felt happened in the relationship and what my boundaries were.

    Now, it does not MEAN that the man was/ is Narcissistic. It just created clarity for myself. I did not get you saying that Evan is being verbally abusive, but just that as a slippery slope way of looking at it, you felt a certain pull in that direction YOURSELF.

    The creating of context that I was suggesting CCarter mentions that could help – perhaps start with ‘hey Sirens, this is probably really slippery slope… not talking/ would NEVER talk about Evan as a person, I don’t know him…. not saying he is doing it/ it is happening… I’m committed to my own healing and growth…’. Then go into it – the tone of Evan’s comments triggered some unexpected feelings in me connected to VA. I don’t want to feel this way… blah, blah, blah – whatever it is you want to explore/ express.

    @406 SLV – OK, you are angry. A simple ‘no’ to LITS would suffice.

    What feels more important is what it triggering this harsh response and use of scatological language?

    Is it really necessary to wish LITS ill luck in her love life? It feels bad reading this. What I post here I would hope to be relevant in some way and communicable to all Sirens.


  415.  #416Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    @410: life_is_too_short_to… says:

    “After I sent that comment, I thought that it might make you upset”

    Yes, it was bothersome so you were successful in that way. I don’t know your real reason for doing it. But now I know what you think of me; there is a useful purpose in that and I am back to my life. So I write this for other readers.

    “…I seem to remember that you disagreed with something Evan said, and he responded back, disagreeing with you…”

    You remember wrong. I don’t know who you mean since this never happened. However, a male dating coach made a mistake about what I wrote. I have NO idea how he got the words wrong!!! I mentioned male dating coach and Rori were not in favor of women e-mailing messages back and forth for three months before the first date. Male dating coach subsequently did not deny this!!!

    Further, male dating coach talked about things that were NEVER in my post and aren’t even part of my personal beliefs or ways of doing things! He scoffed at “blind coffee dates” in a scolding manner. I never used those words, or suggested such in any way or implication. Male dating coach just made it up!

    It was all around bad and when I repeated what I posted, there was never a reply. Again. I just never wrote those things!

    Probably most sirens never bothered to read the posts referred to or maybe they’ve never read any of male dating coach’s work as I have. How horrible! I felt very bad about that but I survived.

    I’m a wordsmith, although I make a lot of typos here, I defend my words. How sad too that you say you remember things the way you do. However male dating coach has larger swinging genitalia than I and that’s often what counts with the womenfolk.

    I’m here to learn ways to have the relationship I want and to share if I can, that’s it.

  416.  #417Nita on April 7, 2011 at 4:49 pm

    thank you to everyone who responded to my question about expressing negative feelings when first dating….heres another thing: when i consider dating men who im not that attracted to i feel really guilty and I feel strange. “what if i hurt him” “what if I lead him on?”, “I feel like Im taking advantage of this man’s time/ money because its not like i like him”…I start to think these things and then it doesnt go anywhere and I dont have dates and I stay at home:( Sometimes, if I am attracted I wonder “will he think Im playing games if I tell him Im dating others?” “will he think Im a slut?” does he think Im just taking advantage of him in more ways than one? ugh these thoughts stop me from giving dating opportunities a chance, also it stops me from explaining that Im dating more than just him and then I feel sneaky and secretive and anxious…any input??

  417.  #418Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:50 pm


  418.  #419Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    @416: Queenbee says:
    “…406 SLV – OK, you are angry. A simple ‘no’ to LITS would suffice…”

    I decide that, not you.

  419.  #420Senior Lady Vibe on April 7, 2011 at 4:56 pm

    @415: tinque

    Sorry, if I got the book titles wrong. We were discussing a NYT bestsellers book I mentioned… I think a couple months ago… I had impression what you had were similar… I’m sure whatever you have is wonderful!!!


  420.  #421Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 5:05 pm

    Hey, Valentina! Nice to meet you – and you might want to post on the newer thread – everyone kind of jumps to it….just go to top and click on the Have headline and it will show you….I hope you get lots of great input here and enjoy!

    Queenbee – very well said regarding context – don’t know if SS will agree but yes! when I don’t have the time to follow all the comments, I can definitely become confused or not understand where someone is coming from – lol – I can do that even if they’re completely clear too.

    Part of that and the healing that we may find here is acceptance and noticing our triggers, etc. so it’s all good- Rori love discussion!

    And EMK weighed in on the new thread….

    so all is well, and catch you all soon…

  421.  #422Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 5:07 pm

    oh, and I cracked up about Katarina’s comment…Bad, feels bad…bad bad…it totally works for those “dog” whisperers who claim they can train men too.

    I’m going back to the me I know and love – right brained, non linear, fun and no spell check dis-perfectionist!!


  422.  #423Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 5:09 pm

    Mercedes, thank you so much. It feels Great to be heard and understood by at least one person. Thank you for reposting that paragraph of mine – I hadn’t been able to reread it on my phone and was beginning to wonder what in the world I had actually said that was so alarming. Reading it here – yeah, I’d say it all over again, just like that. I don’t understand ppl’s reactions to it at all. It just seems like they missed the context or were just personally triggered somehow. I feel amazed that it has taken on

  423.  #424Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 5:16 pm

    a life of its own. Oh well. Update for all – I am on my way home from hospital and bringing daughter back to school where she will continue IV’s and try to finish courses and graduate in May. They’re giving her benadryl to minimize the allergic reaction to antibiotic but her face is still swollen and itchy and she feels quite uncomfortable (and self-conscious). Thanks again for all the prayers and well-wishes. <3

  424.  #425Lucy on April 7, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    LiFe, thank you for your concern. Jacqueline, yes, you apologized but then you did the same thing to me all over again, which kinda negates the apology. And I did NOT use those things as metaphors!!! or for anything else that your imagination is creating! Lol. Sheesh! Way to twist my words. My GOSH this is ridiculous. Okay, going back to driving home….

  425.  #426life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 5:42 pm

    417. SLV
    Thank you for your explanation.
    I admit to saying the first thing that popped into my head without thinking. I had no reason to do it, it was just a vibe I had around the situation. As I said, I could be wrong.

    It’s true that I was kind of removed from the details of it all, and did not have all the facts. I feel grateful for your bringing this to my attention. I kind of feel like all sisters here, and we can kind of let our hair down.

    But, honestly, how can you say, from that one comment, that now you know how I feel about you?
    Do you mean you think I feel negatively? That is not true at all.

    I LOVE your posts. Your presence enriches this blog.
    you provide great information. and your very humorous, too!

    I do not feel at all appreciative about your comments back to me dripping with ill will.
    That did not feel so nice and wasn;t warranted, in my opinion. in other words, the punishment did not fit the crime, not anywhere near. Are you willing to consider that?

    Well, hope you have a great evening, SLV

    and everybody!

    love to all

  426.  #427tinque on April 7, 2011 at 5:49 pm

    SLV – No apologies at all necessary. Granted I do have some crappy books, but they get tossed after reading, if I can get through them that is. I just hope you like what I choose since I don’t really know your preferences.

  427.  #428Lercomari on April 7, 2011 at 6:19 pm

    Hi ladies…Techie canceled our date. 🙁 Things come up I know, but he didn’t call me until ten minutes after we were suppose to meet. I was on my way to the theater when I got the call. I’m so disappointed. He lives in Los Angeles. That’s an hour drive away. When he called me he hadn’t even left his house yet. He said he had to meet a client and it was urgent…but still! Why did he wait so late to call me? He said he was sorry. I said, “It’s okay, things happen.” But it didn’t fully hit me how disappointed I was until later.
    So I got some drive thru junkfood and came home…
    I’m not sure what to do now. Theoretically I should find more guys to date but right now I don’t feel up to it. And should I reschedule the date with Techie?
    Gonna go watch Scrubs reruns now…at least Dr. Dorian will always be there for me.

  428.  #429Jacqueline on April 7, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    Lucy – I said at this point, I am stating my opinion. I said I was clear you were commenting on good parenting. I am not twisting your words, I am talking about my feelings. Nothing to do with your words, and now twisting…maybe at most riffing.

    I’m glad your daughter is okay, but it still sounds bad and I’m sorry!

    Lercomari – that is awful, terrible and SUX!!! I wonder what Rori would advise? To ever give him another chance? it just made me soo mad!! for you!!!
    Buddy IF I put on makeup and shave my legs, you’d better be showing up!! smile and hug!

    Wondering how Emerson is?

  429.  #430Jeannette on April 7, 2011 at 6:38 pm

    Girls, my daughter and I had a discussion today about my fiance. She feels he should be visiting me more than just on the week ends. He lives 20 miles down the road. We talk on the phone every week night for an hour or so. Any thoughts?

  430.  #431Jeannette on April 7, 2011 at 6:45 pm

    Any thoughts on my post above? #431?

  431.  #432life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 6:51 pm

    Hi Jeannette,
    My thinking is that, for starters,there may be too predictable of a pattern that is set now. I wouldn’t talk on the phone for an hour or so every night. Skip a night here and there, and keep the phone calls shorter. You’ll break the pattern and that may prompt him to miss you and want to visit more. 🙂

  432.  #433Jeannette on April 7, 2011 at 6:55 pm

    Wow, Life Is too Short to…..that is great advice. Do you think he’s just not interested in seeing me more or do people just get in a rut?

  433.  #434Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    tinque: We need to talk girl! I love books and would be happy to even buy them from you. I spend more money at amazon than any other website…lol

    Katarina: ” However, when I’m upset about something, I use feeling messages so it doesn’t come up as attacking/blaming.

    I think, as I have said it before, that’s the most appropriate time to use feeling messages. It’s not necessary and it’s plain unnatural actually to speak in them constantly.”

    I sort of agree here except I mostly use feeling messages when he’s doing something that feels AWESOME to me. When I’m upset about something, he hears what I think (although, same as you, not in a blaming attacking sort of way) but when he’s done something to make me feel amazing, that’s when he knows how I feel and that I believe he is responsible for that feeling…it’s a way to give credit where credit is due and to let him know how much I appreciate him and understand that HE is responsible for those amazing feelings.

    When I feel bad, he knows what I think (without question)…but then again, it’s been about 5 years since he’s had to know what I think about the bad stuff. When I feel good (and it’s because of how he’s treating me), he knows how I feel and how incredibly grateful I am. To me, that is the most important time to use feeling messages.

    Just a difference here…

  434.  #435Mercedes on April 7, 2011 at 7:22 pm

    Lucy: I hear you girl! Hope your daughter feels much, much better soon.

    Much Love,

  435.  #436Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 9:18 pm

    Mercedes, I feel angry that you continue to comment to me in a what I perceive to be a negative and judgmental way. I don’t want this abuse in my life. And to me this feels abusive.

    I guess I have to wonder why you come here. If the blog is so awful at feeling messages, and it’s so depressing, then why participate?

    Right this second, I don’t know why *I* come here. I’m signing myself up for abuse at the moment, and it pretty much sucks balls.

    Oh wait.

    I will not allow someone else to pull me down into their pit.

    It is not rare to hear someone saying “I feel awesome” (maybe not in those exact words).

    I can always count on SVL to speak gratitude about whatever is happening in her life. And there are countless women DAILY who feel empowered by the changes they have happening in their life as a direct result of feeling messages and circular dating. Daria gives gratitude for each of her daily gifts. Brenda is morphing into this butterfly. Lucy is pushing through her walls. Boomer has 12 CDs damnit! 😉 LD has TWO CDs she really likes. I could go on and on with the accomplishments and awesomeness on the blog.

    Okay, I feel much better. I’ll keep using feeling messages the best way I know how. I’m learning. And I’m letting go of this desire to create a bridge with people who don’t wish the best for me in my life. I will not sign up myself for abuse.


  436.  #437life_is_too_short_to... on April 7, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    Hi Jeanette,
    I wouldn’t worry about what or why he is thinking what he is thinking. Do you feel that he is not interested in seeing you anymore? Sometimes patterns get established. It’s good to keep things fresh by changing the regular routine sometimes.
    Some men seem to tend to like falling into predictable routines if it feels comfortable and easy.

    What do YOU want? If you want Steve to visit you more, not just because your daughter said you should, then you might tell him that you miss seeing him in person more than just the weekend, and it would feel so great if he would visit more often. What do you think?


  437.  #438Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    Queenbee, thank you for the constructive feedback! I thought I added context by quoting the line that triggered me and by saying this is how I felt reading it. I’m kind of stumped but mostly too overwhelmed at the moment to download your words. I’ll re-read tomorrow but wanted to say thank you.

  438.  #439Simply Shannon on April 7, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    Lucy, I’m glad you and your daughter are on your way home. Safe travels and continued healing. (((HUGS)))

  439.  #440Lucy on April 8, 2011 at 12:33 am

    Thanks Shannon. <3

  440.  #441Mercedes on April 8, 2011 at 5:41 am

    Shannon: I made it clear I wasn’t talking to you when I wrote those things. I was venting about what is frustrating me. When you feel angry or hurt, you resort to name calling pretty consistently (did you recognize this about yourself?). We’ll go ahead and add “abusive” to your list (does it fall above or below “schitzophrenic”?), but I don’t see how my venting about what is frustrating me is abusive to you. I wasn’t even talking about you or to you at that point. Now the “that feels weird” comment…that was to you…because I really don’t (honestly) equate “weird” with a feeling…more a description.

    So I’m abusive. Okay. Thanks for the label. It helps me understand what you refer to as abusive and gives a better indication of where you’re at on the exaggeration scale…

    “I guess I have to wonder why you come here. If the blog is so awful at feeling messages, and it’s so depressing, then why participate?”

    I don’t come here for the feeling messages and I don’t participate in them either so I’m not sure what that’s supposed to mean. I vent when things get depressing…so what? Isn’t that what this blog is for? (as you would say)

  441.  #442Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 7:48 am


    I think you missed the most important part of what Jim was trying to say. I can’t imagine a woman accepting me dating other women. Not if they want to become exclusive, and this is long before we are even talking about marriage. I know because I have been there. I have tried dating multiple women and was honest about it and what I learned is that they never let their guard down so that we can really get to know each other.

    I have also been in that situation on the opposite side and can verify that I never felt confident enough to let my guard down so that we could get to know each other. What can happen though is that you make a premature jump to exclusivity to remove the outside threat to what you may perceive as a budding relationship.

    So what I learned before I found my wife is that I kept my personal life to myself. If a woman isn’t willing to become exclusive she has no right to know anything about my personal life. The same would apply to a man. If he is not willing to discuss the relationship in terms of exclusivity he has no right to know what you do with other men.

    Now, at the point that you do want exclusivity, you should discuss it. This does not mean that you need to talk in terms of marriage. You may meet a man at Starbucks and sit down to have a cup of coffee. He may then ask you to dinner, then a party at a friends house. At the point that you feel like there is something going on, it is very right to sit down and ask where he sees this going. Does he want exclusivity? If he says yes, then great. If he says no, then I think I can honestly say that it is going NOWHERE. If the man has dated you several times, taken you to meet friends, etc… and he says he doesn’t want exclusivity, HE IS NOT THAT INTO YOU, and likely never will be. He may have already seen things in you that makes him realize that you are not the one for him. If a man wants exclusivity, I can pretty my say that he will know it within a few dates, especially if those dates are varied, and offer a chance to get to know each other through discussion. This does not mean he KNOWS he wants to marry you.

    So back to this thing of circular dating. If I were dating a woman for several months, and we had agreed to be exclusive, but I was still not sure I was ready for marriage, and she let me know she was going to date other men, one of two things would happen. I might make a mistake and prematurely jump into marriage to get rid of the “threat” or I might just decide that I don’t want to be manipulated and decide to walk away.

    And that is exactly what is going on here. If you agreed to be exclusive, but then she approaches you about marriage, and you say you like things the way they are, so then she decides to let you know that she is going to start dating other men, there are two sides to that. Yes, there is this “empowerment” thing on her side. She is taking control. Yes, she IS taking control. There is no us, just her. She is taking control.

    In no way would I ever feel comfortable enough, in a sane and mature manner, to be able to move forward in the relationship.

    Let’s talk about the “Bachelor.” past contestants admitted that the “competitive” nature of the show made you think you were in love and wanted to move forward with the guy. I am sure this also exists on the Bachelorette side. but once you are exclusive, and away from the show, you realize that you aren’t really in love. So this backs up my statement about prematurely jumping into a relationship if the person lets you know they are going to CD. Just like the contestants on that show, your mind may tell you to commit to eliminate the competition. The end result of this is that you may realize in the end that you are married to the wrong person because you were not allowed to just let things progress naturally.

    And why is that important? because it can take time to get to know someone. Really know them. Lets face the facts. In the beginning we put our best foot forward and try to hide our flaws as best we can. But as time goes by, we become more comfortable and slowly let down our guards. At the same time, it is hard work hiding those flaws so after a while, you start letting them show.

    Also, in the early flush of love, you overlook things that may really irritate you later in a relationship. You both do this. So where she may think it’s cute that he leaves the toilet seat up, 3 years later, it may be the source of her initiating fights. Meanwhile I’m mad that I have to touch a toilet seat before I touch myself. Maybe I’m thinking she can be more sensitive to that fact. 😉

    I can tell you this, from a man’s point of view, you better know what you are getting into because a divorce, especially after kids, does favor the woman. I know a lot of unhappy men who simply stay because they can’t afford the divorce. So a smart man isn’t going to jump.

    Let’s use the Bachelor again. Brad chose Emily and most of us thought that was a good choice because she seemed mature, settled, not into drama, slow to anger, etc…

    Most of us thought Chantal was not a good pick because she was always crying, and other small little things.

    But what happened on the ATFR? We found that Emily was not really who we thought she was. It took her being in a spot where it was just her to allow her true colors to come out. Now Brad accepts those flaws and still wants her, but the issue here is that when others are involved, we are not ourselves.

    So I am all for sitting down and discussing where the relationship is at. Honest communication is never a bad thing. But I totally disagree with simply dating other men just because you aren’t getting the full commitment that you want when the other person has not moved to that point. If he has agreed to be exclusive with you, but is simply not ready to discuss marriage, and you decide this is not good enough for you, and so you want to keep what you have with him and date other men, I mean WOW. You think this is a good thing? Maybe you need to sit down and decide why you feel so insecure. Like I said, getting married for a man is a huge step because the courts do not favor the man.

    I am talking about if a man has a business, etc… and if he has children, he is looking at many years of financial responsibility if she decides she wants out, or if she becomes so nasty he decides he wants out.

    If I am exclusive with the woman, and the only difference is that we don’t have the label of being married, and she pushes for that, I say no, and so she then tells me she is going to start dating other men, I am probably going to leave and look for somebody new. I am not going to see this as healthy. I am going to see it as a sign that we are not partners. I am going to see it as a sign that there could be huge troubles in the future when we have a slight disagreement.

    Sorry if this is long and rambling. I was free writing as thoughts came to me.

    BTW, I can say this also. After re-watching The Bachelor Season 15, I realized that Chantal would be my perfect match. I can deal with some tears. I can’t deal with all. After watching it, I saw Chantal much differently. I saw someone who does not have to act tough. Tough does not work for me in a woman and I will tell you why. In conflict with a woman, the man is a knight. If she is tough, and has her walls up, and tossing flaming fireballs at me, I raise my shield and have my sword at the ready.

    If she is soft, and vulnerable, I lower my shield, drop my sword and allow the chivalrous side to come to the front. Two soft hearts get through conflict much easier and faster. Two hard hearts with walls up are going to have to fight it out, and if they are lucky, they will tire of the fight, before any real damage has been done, and get to a point where they are now two soft hearts dealing with the problems. Sadly, it rarely happens when one or both start with their walls up.

    I realized right away that I could not deal with Michelle. I use the post SI shoot as an example. Michelle acted hard and tough, and threw a cold shoulder. Chantal was soft, vulnerable and even sweetly girlish. That works even when you are a 55 year old woman. That would make me feel safe to commit. If I can feel safe in conflict with the woman, I am going to realize this is a relationship i want to move forward with.

    One last statement, I should make is that the sexual revolution was is no friend to women but young single men thank you women for buying into it. Nothing like being able to sleep with women and get that one thing we really want, without having to make a solid commitment to get it. It’s like a single man’s dream come true. Our great grandfathers are very jealous of us.

    Kissing, intimacy, and especially sex solidify bonds between a man and woman. And we start this process before we have even vetted the other person to decide if they are somebody we could spend out life with. Brilliant!

  442.  #443Turtle Girl on April 8, 2011 at 9:34 am

    This whole topic of dating behaviors, deciding whether to cd, etc, how we relate to the opposite sex, etc. etc. is very fascinating.

    My take on it is really that what we are talking about is power. If a woman relinquishes hers in any way like having sex before marriage, or being a girlfriend then the problem is she feels powerless and needy. So the key to not feeling this way (which is icky for her and him) is to date others or cd herself so that she does not fall into the trap of feeling powerless.

    On the Other hand, the guy wants to have all the power-i.e. exclusivity without having to do anything for it such as a commitment, so he gets the “rights” to his girlfriend or the benefits without any of the responsibilities of that relationship.

    When our grand parents dated, it was a different world. Men knew sex with a woman who was wife material was off the table. So what Rusty says is interesting, now anything goes and such a deal for men. They get their cake and eat it too. We get to sit around and wait till the guy decides. And we wait and wait. And wait for years in some cases. So, by not waiting, we regain some of our power back. This is complicated. It is all about how we feel at any given time about ourselves. Men who are unwilling to commit and have a girlfriend get the best of both worlds. Women who can get to the point in their lives where they are “rock star divas” can date multiple men, have sex or not, and basically do whatever it is they want to. This is VERY threatening to the balance of power for the guys. As EMK says, if you date others, he would dump you. What? Can’t handle a little competition? So insecure about your own abilities to woo over the female that you would not be able to stand the thought of her having someone else? DNA programming says men compete for available females. Period. We haven’t come too far from our biological directives. When men get to have all the power in the uncommitted relationship then they are prone to lax behavior, and in some cases even abuse. The threat, however subtle or not that if you don’t get to own the female until you commit is often what keeps the guy respecting her more and honoring her. She is taking care of her needs, not his.

    Now the world has changed even if we have not changed much biologically, and there are all sorts of different relationships dynamics, and I say to each his own. I don’t judge, nor do I expect me beliefs to be good for someone else. But I have found that the man who steps up, the man who keeps coming around, even if I am dating others, the guy who says “I want you and I am going to stick around and do what I need to do to win you-that guy gets a gold star in my book. If he wimps out in the face of another guy who I had coffee with, then he needs to step up. He needs to really think about who I am, what he wants and where this is going. Otherwise he is just another guy who wants benefits without the commitment. No thanks dude, go and get those benefits from some other gal who is going to give up the goods and let you treat her as if she is not high value woman.

    Men are so used to not having to work for anything any more that they expect women to just do whatever it is they want them to do. The fact that EMK said he would drop the gal tells me a lot about who he is. Maybe he did marry his wife, and ok, glad that worked out. But would he have still dated her if she wanted to date others? He says no, and yet I wonder. How much did he really WANT her, did he want her above all others, enough to fight for her? Women still want a champion. There is a reason all those romantic tales of women fighting for an wooing women are still popular. By tossing all that to the wind, by removing that programming, then that is like telling women that their needs don’t matter. Only the needs of the men matter.

  443.  #444Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 9:53 am

    Great post Turtle Girl. But I think you miss the point on something. I think myself and EMK are in agreement that if the girl pulls a power play, then it is over.

    Instead of perverting what works even further by CDing, women should reclaim the power they once had, and used. That is the power over sex. Instead of CDing, try entering into a relationship without having sex. Become friends first. Get to know each other without the blinding effects of sex and extreme intimacy. Find out whether you want a relationship with the person before you BOND with them.

    If you do decide that you want that person, then continue the relationship. By not giving away the cow for free, you force the man to evaluate his feelings. He won’t stick around with a woman he does not want if he is not getting sex from her. Women used to realize this very vital fact.

    I had a humanities professor that made the statement that women’s job in society was to make men behave, but that they are failing at doing this like at no other time in history. In short, they are enabling the bad behavior by rewarding it. By having pre-marital sex, you are allowing men to have what they want without getting what you want.

    Funny that before he sexual revolution, the #1 issue wasn’t about how to get a man to commit. In fact it wasn’t even an issue. Men understood that to have a woman in their life, they had to act a certain way and do certain things. Now, as you said, men can have what they want without doing what the woman wants.

    The big lie is that you have to compromise what you want to get what you want. By that I mean women are told that this is just the way it is. That premarital sex just is a fact of life so you have to work around that. NO YOU DON’T!!!

    I had premarital sex with more women than I care to talk about, but the woman that got me to commit was one who did not compromise her values. She insisted on no premarital sex. We didn’t spend all of our time being intimate and making out either.

    We moved into that more slowly. But what we did do was become close as a couple and more importantly, we got to know each other. We became friends.

    What i can tell you, after a previously failed marriage, is that this relationship blew away every previous relationship I ever had. Why? Because I didn’t get the milk for free. And this forced me to actually see my present wife as a person, as an equal, as someone I respected. Oh sure, i resisted that at first. I thought it was silly and old fashioned. But after having been through this, I can say 100% that old fashioned is better in this respect.

    We took something that worked and broke it with the sexual revolution. And make no mistake, there are many people out there that have no desire to go back to the old ways. But the beauty of this is that you don’t need a consensus for this to work for you. It worked for my wife. It can work for you too.

    In the end, we don’t have a relationship where power is an issue. We are equals. Partners. We respect each other and we work together.

    It was not always this way but what he have allowed us to get there.

  444.  #445Daria on April 8, 2011 at 9:58 am

    Sex is not ‘it’. It may seem like it – bec many women and some men involve their heart with sex – but it’s about the heart.

    That’s why we can have great relationships where there is early sex.

  445.  #446Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 10:00 am

    Let’s take an inventor of all of the great things that the sexual revolution has done for women.

    *Men who are more reluctant to enter into a long term relationship.
    *Unwanted pregnancies.
    *Women’s health issues.
    *Sexual encounters you end up regretting.
    *Nothing special to offer the man you will spend the rest of your life with. Heck, in many cases, half of his friends have already had it. How special.

    This list could go on for days.

  446.  #447Kyla on April 8, 2011 at 10:04 am

    i don’t think premarital sex makes any difference personally. i think its more about attitude, self respect, self love..
    i’ve always had sex early in a relationship, i like sex, and have always had the man wanting to see me again. I’ve also had 3 proposals that i’ve turned down, i’m 27 🙂

  447.  #448Daria on April 8, 2011 at 10:08 am

    Sexual expression

    No more sexual hysteria women being interned in psychiatric centers

    Spiritual exploration

    More acceptance of leaving unhappy and abusive relationships

    Less shame around sex

    Empowerment through possibility of owning sexual attraction

    Enjoyment of sex

    Wider acceptance spectrum of sexuality including GLBT

    More understanding of physical sex – orgasms, g-spot,
    clitoris, squirting orgasms

    More pleasure

    Less illusion of sex as replacement for heart

    More ability for women to choose

  448.  #449Daria on April 8, 2011 at 10:09 am

    Kyla – high 5

  449.  #450Kyla on April 8, 2011 at 10:10 am

    lol thanks Daria i feel good 🙂

  450.  #451Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 10:12 am

    “Sex is not ‘it’. It may seem like it – bec many women and some men involve their heart with sex – but it’s about the heart.

    That’s why we can have great relationships where there is early sex.”

    If you believe that, fine. I know many will refuse to believe the very real reality. I can only tell you from a man’s point of view that you are not helping the situation by engaging in premarital sex. If you choose to, that is your choice. Nobody can stop you. But look around. Look at all of the women who not happy. This was not an issue 60 years ago. It is now and as a result, we have had many movies and TV series discussing the subject such as Sex and the City where trying to get a man to commit was the primary focus.

    The truth is that successful relationships emerge in spite of premarital sex, not because of it. And with the number of failed relationships that people engage in before finding successful relationship, something that is at an all time high, a successful relationship involving premarital sex is the exception, not the rule. How many women can’t even count the number of sexual partners on their hands and toes? The number is not small, I can tell you that.

  451.  #452Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 10:18 am

    Like it or not, sex prolongs a failed relationship. A man will stick around and tell you what you want to hear if he is getting sex. he will not do this if he is not getting free sex. Spin it how you want, but this is an undeniable fact.

    This wastes your time in your search for a man you can spend your life with.

  452.  #453Simply Shannon on April 8, 2011 at 10:20 am

    Mercedes and anyone else who would like to help me,

    I’m curious how you would respond to Evan if you were in my shoes and experienced his words as abusive. I’ve been in this situation before with Mr. Masculine Man when he was pushing me to be exclusive. His words were almost verbatim Evan’s words.

    I’d like to learn how to express myself without the name calling that Mercedes mentioned. I don’t want to be interpreted that way, but I don’t know how to say the words any differently.

    I feel open to suggestions. Thanks.

  453.  #454Simply Shannon on April 8, 2011 at 10:26 am


    “The truth is that successful relationships emerge in spite of premarital sex, not because of it.”

    That is very true. Using sex to get a relationship doesn’t work. Having sex is just having sex. No more, no less.

    I don’t believe that having sex before marriage will make or break a relationship. For me personally it feels better to wait, mainly because my old pattern was to use sex to get love. I realize that just doesn’t work for me anymore.

  454.  #455Rusty on April 8, 2011 at 10:53 am

    “I don’t believe that having sex before marriage will make or break a relationship. For me personally it feels better to wait, mainly because my old pattern was to use sex to get love. I realize that just doesn’t work for me anymore.”

    If you believe this, you don’t understand men. I can 100% tell you that this is not the case. Think brad Womack. I know many men like this. Many are my friends. I’ll give you one example. This guy is good looking like that, and has a very successful landscaping business and all the trappings that come from that. Sports cars, big house, boat, etc… I’ve never seen him in a relationship that lasted more than a month. When we go to his parties, there will be a new hotty there who struts around and plays the hostess. You can see that she thinks she is going to be the lady of the house and is playing the role, but we call them “the flavor of the month.” She thinks she is going to be the one that changes him. She’s not and she has no clue that he already has a plan to replace her before she even spends her first night in the mansion.

    Now he is the most extreme case because his looks and success allow him to get away with it. I’ve known some of these girls become total mental cases over it. I saw one walk away from an engagement the day before she got married. She moved to Alaska to get away from it all, and 2 years later, called the guy back to announce she was coming back and wanted to talk.

    She was very honest at this point and admitted everything. It all boiled down to the fact that she had her Cinderella moment and DID believe that she was going to be the one to get the guy to settle down, and that she would live the dream of having that sexy, successful guy all to herself.

    When she met my other friend, she actually only agreed to date him as a way to get closer to the first guy with the mansion. But they did develop a relationship, and got engaged. But somewhere inside after, in her mind, being so close to having it all, she feared that she was settling for less than what she could have. That was pretty hard for my friend to hear.

    the simple fact is that my friend with the mansion can get away with it because women allow him to get away with it. If women stopped allowing him to have the free sex, he would change his ways. He’s as big of a jerk as women allow him to be.

    Now, you can sit there and think, well I have to fall into that and take my shot at the whole thing. No you don’t. You could just realize that by doing so, you are just going to end up with a lot of heartache. And by doing so, you sabotage future relationshi