Creating Speeches To Express Your Feelings And State Your Boundaries

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scroll-heartHi, I thought I’d open up a new Category so that we could all share “speeches” you may have used that worked well, or that you’d like to try, or that you need help thinking up.

Just post them here, and we’ll all tweak and experiment. It would help tremendously if you let us know the situation, perhaps the way you’ve already tried to communicate, and how you’d like to “speak your truth” now.

Oh…and if I’d like to use any of your brilliant speeches in my eletters or to jump off of in a blog post or in a program, let me know if you’d like me to credit you by name, or make one up for you…

If you’re not sure what a “speech” is – it’s a Feeling Message that expresses something you want to communicate…like my “No boyfriend” speech:

“I’m not looking for a boyfriend, I’m looking to be married, and so it feels so much better to keep my options open and not be exclusive with anyone until there’s that commitment.  I feel so good with you, and I don’t want to put pressure on our relationship…”

(And variations on that…)

I really look forward to what you come up with…

Love, Rori

363 Comments

  1.  #1alias girl on July 27, 2009 at 12:45 pm

    i feel excited about reading other people’s speeches and getting better and doing some of my own.

    Rori—– the link for the teleclass on tuesday re ecommerce isn’t synced up or something. i click on it and it doesn’t direct me….

    i feel anxious i will miss the class…



  2.  #2Rori Raye on July 27, 2009 at 2:01 pm

    Alias Girl…Let me try it again…
    http://www.small-business-coach.com/e-commerce-made-simple/

    Rori



  3.  #3Daria on July 27, 2009 at 2:02 pm

    AG you are right that it is not synched… I found it works if I type in my browser.

    http://www.small-business-coach.com

    then look for the e commerce class. It’s 20 dollars. I would feel happy if Rori would give us a coupon hehe… also… is there a recording? I have a Toastmasters meeting at that time…



  4.  #4Rori Raye on July 27, 2009 at 2:09 pm

    How weird – it works from my computer…thank you Daria for the copy-and-paste suggestion. I’ll ask him about the recording…Rori



  5.  #5Daria on July 27, 2009 at 2:27 pm

    Thanks Rori. The link you just put up works, the one on the old thread did not work when I tried it.



  6.  #6Mercedes on July 27, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    Don’t have a speech that comes to mind right now, but I would like to read from my blackberry so I’m posting here to say nothing other than…”Hi!!”

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  7.  #7Tina on July 27, 2009 at 4:37 pm

    I met a man online dating, I feel he wants to secure a girlfriend type relationship right away. What type of speech would you recommend. He really does seem ok , just his rush for me to become his girlfriend. He says we are compatiable lol. He is 36, plays violen and guitar,certified massage therapist ( I seem to be attracting them) anyway, he fishes crabs or something and a few other things, he asked me to come to his house to help him fix it. I said no, that my house needs fixing and dont have the time to fix his, he then said well I’ll come over and help you fix yours. He has invited me to an ac/dc concert (the drive is an extra hour to his house, I said we’ll sleep on the beach,) with the expectation that I allow him to sleep at my place, I said no I feel uncomfortable allowing men to sleep at my house. He said he would sleep on the floor lol, like a my pet. sheesh, he wont give up. now he is ignoring me because I didnt answer his call while I was in the shower. ugh!. ok circular dating sounds fun and is just I feel overwhelmed

    This other dude has writen, “why do most women act like female dogs?” when I added him to my msn, I wrote as my display message “the lights are on the bitch is home” yikes

    Mister sensual massage guy said his penis is six inches lol I never asked now he thinks Im upset.

    I’m not sure if this is a race thing but these guys are all french. any thoughts?

    what do i say to this stuff sheesh. I definately dont want to date mr. “all women are bitches” I have sinced blocked him, he is so not in my circle

    boyfriend of 1/12 years called me and asked how I felt after two weeks of no contact, I said to him “I feel hurt and rejected, I cant handle talking to you right now, ok thank you for asking and calling me”

    speeches speeches ugh, I feel like hiding somewhere, this is just to much lol



  8.  #8Tina on July 27, 2009 at 4:40 pm

    At the same time, I feel impatient about all of this stuff , Im leaning way back, I just feel impatient.



  9.  #9Cindy on July 27, 2009 at 7:08 pm

    I am not sure I should say anything at all to my LI. It’s a long story that I have posted on the main blog. We were on a break since early June. Now he has come back little by little and we are dating again. The calls are not as frequent as before and either is our time together. But I have used the tools to lean back, not try to control, not pressure him about where the relationship is going and every time we are together it is amazing. I just don’t know if we are “back together” or not. I DO want to be his girlfriend like I was before.
    Is it too early to say anything to him? The break or break up we had was because we were arguing. I was complaining about what he didn’t do and when he didn’t call or was too busy to see me.
    We have been seeing each other again for about a month…but it is not consistent. It’s about once a week, sometimes more and we talk every couple of days.
    Do I need a speech? I asked him if we were just going to be friends and he said no. He has said he still loves me and is crazy about me…but I don’t feel like he is chasing me or that we are in the relationship we once had. I am confused.

    Cindy



  10.  #10Jody on July 27, 2009 at 7:18 pm

    saying hi from my cell!



  11.  #11Erika on July 27, 2009 at 7:35 pm

    This weekend at the convention, three awesome sexy guys hooked up with me in the span of two days … lol 🙂 oh, and I broke me “22 and up” rule because two of these guys were under 22.

    I enjoyed feeling very comfortable at this point with my “I don’t have sex this early in a connection because I’m totally enjoying the moment with you but don’t want to feel icky later” speech.

    I also did my “no girlfriend,” “no one night stand,” and “no condoms” speeches.

    Also, one guy clearly switched his focus from our connection to his own orgasm (because he needed to be somewhere else very soon), and then I refused to be part of it despite his entreaties. I said, “I feel like we have disconnected emotionally, so I don’t really want to do that right now. I need to feel an emotional connection to feel turned on.”

    Honestly though none of it felt like speeches (except my actual speech, which felt great by the way and a guy invited me on a very chivalrous lunch date right afterwards) … my “speeches” only felt like me softly sharing my world with each guy.

    I love knowing that being clear about my boundaries increases guys’ attraction.



  12.  #12tinque on July 27, 2009 at 8:38 pm

    Oh my I’m the queen of speeches. I used to totally rely on them, for if I didn’t come prepared, memorized speech at hand so to speak, I couldn’t get the words out, all thought flew away, andI would be left with nothing but total fluster. I don’t need them as much anymore the more open and relaxed I’ve become within myself and within the relationship, but here is the last one I wrote back in March –
    “I’ve been on an amazing part of my inner journey for awhile. It’s been difficult and painful and wonderful. As you know porn was the catalyst. Along the way I created a little box for the porn. In that context, within this box, I have come to not only accept it, I even enjoy some of it, but when it starts creeping out of this little box, I know it. I feel it. This makes me feel uneasy. It makes me feel anxious. Walls start going up, I feel tension in my body. This doesn’t feel good, and it can’t be good for us.
    A few years I kept some things from you because I didn’t know any other way. I was scared. I felt increasingly uncomfortable the longer I hid these things from you. It felt like lying. In a way it was lying. It felt awful, and I know that it felt awful to you when you found out. That’s not good. I don’t keep things from you anymore.
    I really, really don’t want pretense in our relationship. It doesn’t feel good. It’s not good. I want openness and honesty. Sometimes I’m going to be okay with it, and sometimes I’m not, yet I still want openness and honesty. This means a great deal to me.”
    I’ve got plenty more if anyone is interested.
    xxoo



  13.  #13Winks on July 27, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    Erika, great “no sex” speech. I’d love to hear your “no one night stand” and “no condoms” speeches.
    Rori, what a great idea for this post.

    I have been struggling with how to give a “break up” speech. Even though (at 5 months) I’m not a girlfriend…
    I gave the “no girlfriend” speech. He did step up a bit but didn’t complain that I’d be dating others. He also said he’s “not sure exactly what he wants from me” and he’s “emotionally tapped out” due to life events. He became very affectionate at first and wanted to spend every spare moment with me. I tried setting boundaries to my time with him, and declined a weekend away with him. Feeling a lack of energy toward the relationship because of what he had said. Then he asked me to dinner, an elaborately planned, fun, date. He picked me up and drove way out of his way and was very affectionate all night. He left (…the next morning…) and I haven’t heard from him since. It’s been 2.5 weeks. He has always been in contact every other day or so. So this is a big deal.
    I have been feeling like I should lean back and let him contact me in his own time. It seems like he is waiting for me to contact him first. This silence feels BAD. I am trying to compose an email. I don’t want to blame him, but how he handled it, or didn’t handle any sort of break other than doing nothing feels girly and disrespectful.
    Please critique my speech:

    So, this feels awkward.
    But I would like to go ahead and attempt to handle this in a mature way, a way that is win/win for both of us. I think we both know we are not right for each other at a fundamental level. I have known that I need someone of the opposite temperament to myself, so I look for … We are too similar. That is not what I want. I probably should have intercepted that in the first few dates. I have known that but overlooked it.
    Because I liked you.
    I had been feeling unhappy and a little blasé (knowing you weren’t into it or available) and felt it best to end it with you the last time I saw you – until you went out of your way to plan a date – then I felt like just going with it because I thought it seemed sweet, and wanted to wait.
    But I had planned on at least bringing it up in a conversation, I planned on saying something.

    I feel disrespected in the silence.
    I felt confused by the way it was immaturely, disrespectfully handled.
    I feel angry at myself for going along with it – falling for it.
    I feel like the man here writing to you now.

    I’m sure we are both happier now in the new arrangement. But the open-endedness felt icky!
    ———
    I’m still accusing him, right? How to say that really SUCKED without coming down on him? Maybe he deserves it a little. I feel angry, but don’t want to turn this into mud-slinging. I don’t want him to fire back. I feel sad. How to do a break up??? I want to sound like a goddess not a victim. I don’t want to falsely gloat.



  14.  #14Aminata on July 27, 2009 at 8:58 pm

    Hi All,

    I’m going through a tricky time with a long distance relationship. This guy is really special to me, but I feel like he wants me to be his “girlfriend” just to have me to himself while we are apart (we are both traveling now & we met when traveling). We go through long periods of being apart, then a couple of intense months together. I feel great when I am around him, but I am ready for marriage, not some catch as catch can thing. We plan to meet up next month but then he is going away for 9 months!!!! I don’t like that at all, but I am not sure how to tell him in a nice way, especially since he said when he gets home he will be ready to settle down and he wants me forever. I don’t know how much of that I should believe. I mean I believe he’s being honest now, but I don’t feel like being put on hold and investing myself like that. I just read the section on “long distance relatonships” and I feel like we’re marching right into the imaginary territory.

    Anyway, here is my speech. Help!

    “I’ve really enjoy the special relationship we have now. Still thinking about the next nine months leaves me feeling uneasy. Right now I feel ready to build a life with someone, I finally feel ready to be a wife. So I feel like we should keep our options open during this time and see how we feel about each other when you get back.”

    How does that sound everybody?



  15.  #15alias girl on July 27, 2009 at 9:19 pm

    tinque i feel very interested. 🙂

    cindy i don’t know about the speech or no speech aspect of your situation as I am no pro at speeches.

    if i were you i would definitely want to consider circular dating as it does not sound like this guy is moving close to what you seem to want. and maybe some other guy out there is better suited and could contribute to your greater happiness.



  16.  #16Robin on July 27, 2009 at 10:36 pm

    HELP!!

    Ok, Im gearing up for the big concert, and it looks like a few guys from my rotation will probably be there. So..how do you handle that? They dont know each other, and Im , wondering what to say, ie, if I should have a speech prepared, in case one or more become angry…just wondering….

    My 5 hr. guy is indicating for me to call again, wont come right out and say ‘call me’ though, just it would be nice to hear your voice, even talking would be nice, etc….

    And oh I wanna call him, but something just feels weird, but I cant put my finger on it, I dont know why I feel weird, I just cant seem to bring myself to call him..what is going on???



  17.  #17Mary Ann on July 27, 2009 at 10:57 pm

    I need help with a speech with a new guy, although I’m not sure what is happening at the moment. We met last year…I play softball with him, but I was seeing someone then. This year I am single, and I know he still is. We have talked many times after our games and we were at a party Saturday night and spent most of the evening chatting and having fun, he bought me a few drinks. He then invited me back to his place after the party for another drink. I accepted, and we spent a while talking some more. At one point he asked me if I preferred to sit inside or out, I said out and he said “whatever makes you happy”…funny I was surprised and I said “really?” before I realized it. That’s when he kissed me. We ended up fooling around a little bit but did not have sex. When things became more heated I told him I couldn’t not go further as I liked him and I have been burned too many times. He said I shouldn’t worry about it because he enjoyed my company, but did not pressure me at all. I did not leave until 3 the following afternoon. We sat and chatted for a few hours over coffee in the morning…he offered the second one…I did not feel like he wanted me to leave. I then said I better go and he drove me home. He did not ask for my number. I said I will see you tomorrow, and he smiled and said yes. Today I saw him, we chatted a little bit but he did not stay come for a post game drink and did not ask for my number. I will not see him for 2 weeks as his team does not play until then. This man comes highly recommended by good people. His friends think we are a good match. Did I already make a mistake? I know I should do nothing, but I feel impatient. I am also scared. What do I do, say or not do or say? Help…I promised myself this is the year I find my life partner, I think this man may be worthy of that…but I’m so not sure what is happening…I feel like he is unsure of what I want.



  18.  #18Tracy on July 28, 2009 at 4:30 am

    Tinque,
    Your expressions are inspiring…..
    I do feel stuck when it comes to speeches……why?because i feel unsure about what i really want…..do i really want to marry the guy,is that what i really want….do i really feel love for him…i am i really sure or will i change my mind….do i feel enough for him….i am i really enough or will i feel inadequate…..do i really want him…i am really ready….
    by the time i am done with this confused/unsure way of looking at it….i feel so lost i cannot come up with a concrete speech that truly explains how i am feeling at that point in time….hell…i don’t usually know how i am feeling myself…..so the story keeps changing….and my feelings get all mixed up i end up saying nothing at all…..I have often felt that my emotions shift depending the external environment…so my speech keeps changing based on how i perceive the guy feels about me…I don’t know if i am making any sense….
    Thanks Rori for suggesting the speech experiment….i would love to come up with one that just explains me…without any undue pressure from the outside…



  19.  #19Winks on July 28, 2009 at 7:28 am

    Tracy, I feel exactly the same way. One day I feel soft towards him, then if I look at things a different way he seems evil and using me (i may be making this up) it does depend on my thinking completely.

    an UPDATE to my previous post…bizarrely, he wrote me this morning… if anyone has any goddessy advice as to how I should respond to this pleeease let me know, I would sincerely appreciate it. How to stay soft yet firm??? :
    **
    I owe you a huge apology for disappearing. I have been overwhelmed with work and family stuff and just going through a tough time in general. I know we are sort of looking for different things in life right now, but you should know I think you are great and I have really enjoyed spending time with you. I don’t know if this works for you anymore, and I’d understand completely if it doesn’t. But if you want to go on another safari into the heart of (town) let me know. That was fun.
    **
    Is he suggesting “friends” here? Doesn’t sound romantic.



  20.  #20Erika on July 28, 2009 at 8:44 am

    Here’s a speech about feeling bored with dating: http://awakeningfromthedream.blogspot.com/2009/07/im-feeling-little-bored.html



  21.  #21tinque on July 28, 2009 at 9:13 am

    Tracy – you already said it here. now tell him. See what he says. It’s a great way to start, and I have found that voicing things aloud helps clarify things for yourself. And your feelings will shift and change even from moment to moment. That’s what girls do, at least I certainly do.
    “i feel so lost…and my feelings get all mixed up…i feel so confused…”
    xxoo



  22.  #22tinque on July 28, 2009 at 9:15 am

    Winks – sounds to me like he’s still interested. men get scared too you know. I would go and just be you. expect nothing. have a good time. see what happens.
    xxoo



  23.  #23Katja on July 28, 2009 at 9:58 am

    Are we talking about actual speeches or also about emails and text messages? Does it work,too,to deliver those speeches through email etc.?



  24.  #24tinque on July 28, 2009 at 10:10 am

    live and in person has far more impact…



  25.  #25Robin on July 28, 2009 at 10:45 am

    Winks,

    I dont know if I would respond at all, I would probably just go about my business. The way you stay strong and soft, to me, in this kind of situation would be to just not spew all over him and not be a cactus or doormat, and to really be open to him, you can stay open and still KNOW that you dont want to stick around if he’s not able to give you what you want..

    So dont go, ‘Why havent you been calling? Where have you been? etc

    and if he calls, then you could say something similar to the no gf speech, just say what you want, like for example, ‘you know, I want to be married, it feels good to keep my options open til someone wants what I want and wants it with me….and I feel appreciative that you respect what I am looking for, that feels great..’ You could mention how you feel about being friends if he brings that up..

    I wouldnt go for friends unless you have absolutely NO feelings for him romantically….



  26.  #26Simply Shannon on July 28, 2009 at 10:50 am

    No speeches from me yet, but I want to read everyone’s. Examples help me so much with finding the words to voice what I’m feeling. I’m just like Tracy – I have a hard time feeling my feelings, let alone expressing them.



  27.  #27Chanel on July 28, 2009 at 11:26 am

    Hi everyone,

    I haven’t had much time to follow the discussions on this blog lately, but I hope you are all doing well. 🙂

    Rori, here are some speeches you have inspired:

    I met a guy at my divorce support group, much older than I am. I gave him no signals whatsoever that I was interested in him. He came on to me very strongly–in fact he felt very overbearing to me. By the time I got home, he had found my email address through our support group and contacted me. His email was this:

    Chanel,
    I will not be continuing with the group because the location is just a bit more than I want to deal with traffic-wise, none the less. i wanted to let you know that I have great empathy for your particular situation and wish to offer you my email address at xxx@xxxxxx.com and cell number if you should ever
    need a, (please excuse any presumption on my part) “friend” (an overreaching word) to speak with. xxx xxx-xxxx.

    So, without hesitation, I answered with the following Rori-like speech:

    Hi xxxxx,

    Thanks for the kind note. It’s too bad the group is too far for you.

    I feel more comfortable crying on my women friends’ shoulders, so I’m going to pass on your offer for support, but it was very kind of you to offer.

    Meanwhile, I wish you the best going through the process.

    _____________

    After rereading this, I’m not sure the grammar was correct, but it worked like a charm. I got one last email wishing me the best and that was it.

    _____________

    I also have a generic text message speech that I use when a man that I don’t want is continuing to pursue me via txt messages. I’ll text back an “I’m sorry but I just didn’t feel a connection with you on Friday.”

    That also works like a charm because you can’t argue against a feeling. Also, the lack of a connection is nothing for the man to take personally. I actually feel really good about myself when I send that text message because I find that men will just cut all contact without letting me know that they aren’t interested and that feels bad to me. At least this way, the other person knows what happened.

    There was one instance where I sent this text message and the guy gave up for a while but he came back and asked me for a date. I went on said date and again, I didn’t feel a connection, but we have since remained friends. He’s a great guy.



  28.  #28Rori Raye on July 28, 2009 at 12:09 pm

    Aminata – this is a great “teaching moment” for me for all of you. The speech is great up until the last line where you say “we.” All of a sudden, you’re giving advice, you’re managing things, you’re telling him what you should both do…you’re being a MAN. Tweak this to “So I would feel so much better keeping my options open during this time and seeing how I feel when you get back.”

    Can you tell the difference? It’s night and day…completely different. I want you all to see how changes in WORDS can completely change the vibe of a speech – and…because we’re talking all the time — it completely changes our “vibe” from boy to girl…where it’s supposed to be. Love, Rori



  29.  #29Rori Raye on July 28, 2009 at 12:11 pm

    Erika – please give us your “no condoms” speech. Sounds scary to me…I assume it’s about commitment and getting tested?…I LOVE your speeches here…Rori



  30.  #30Linda on July 28, 2009 at 12:40 pm

    Hi everybody

    Giving a speech sounds scarey. Remember when you had to get up in front of your class mates and give speeches. What a nausiating nervous thing. I dont like to think of it as giving a speech more of shareing concisely where I am at and expressing myself about my needs, wants, or decisions I have made.

    I will have thing swirl around in my head, things that bother me or dont feel right about my relationships. Usually I write. When I write down my thoughts and feelings at first things are uncohiesive but expressing them on paper takes the emotion out of them and I calm down and can think clearer. After a couple of stabs at it and the jumble is cleaned up I am able to articulate in writing what I feel best expresses how I feel and what needs to be said. It is a refining process for me and it very helpful. I have written so many things that never get sent or read by anybody but the process makes my feelings expressable and centers me. I have had several occasions when I have done this and then later the opportunity presented itself for me to share. I am usually very calm and it all flows well because I have already been over it and know what my decision is and how I really feel. It works for me.

    So I dont write or give speeches, I search myself and become comfortable with what I need and want and then express it. I have found that we are always given the opportunity to share and knowing where you are with things helps to share accurately and we are not all caught up in the emotion of it or worry of whether it is going to go the way we want…. I see it a taking time to be a genuine and authentic as I can with someone.

    I have someone that needs to either step up or be booted out of my life. I want it all now.. and though I have always had a quiet confidence about things and where they would go between us. I find myself getting so frustrated and inpatient…. He has been back and forth so many times with me.. Yes he wants a relationship, no he isnt satisfied etc. Last week on Tuesday he called me after a period of silence but him asking me everyday to be patient with him…. I gave him what he asked for… time. I stayed leaned back… and he called. He said and I quote… (he was praying about all of it)…. Do you know you have the voice of an angel?….Linda, I have gotten my confirmation, you are the one for me… etc etc etc. There are lots of things that I am looking for him to follow thru with that are not happening right now. I am preparing my thoughts and waiting for the time to share them. I feel frustrated, and un important, we do not have the communication frequency that I would preffer. Just like today… only one text and has not answered my phone call or text I sent in the afternoon…. So these thing build up and I write and get my thoughts together…. He is so much better than he was.. and is getting there and I have to keep reminding myself there is no hurry. It is just that I am learning the art of being a patient goddess. You see… I am the prize here and he gets to be with me. …. That helps me keep it all in perspective.

    More later… hugs Linda



  31.  #31Aldonza on July 28, 2009 at 12:52 pm

    My circular dating speech:
    Me: If you’re not sure about me, then you should date. That’s partially why I’m dating. However, if you choose to date multiple women, I don’t want to be one of them. I’m dating other men *because* I don’t feel any level of reliable commitment from you.
    Him: That’s a double standard.
    Me. No, it isn’t.
    Him: How so?
    Me: If you showed me that I was the one you wanted…I wouldn’t date. I think you know that you’re the one I want. But I’m not going to settle for scraps of your attention. If you feel the need to sample more women, you don’t need my permission to do it. But to me that means you don’t need to sample me anymore. You already know what I am.



  32.  #32Mercedes on July 28, 2009 at 1:03 pm

    Linda: I do the same thing! I write and write and write about everything I’m feeling and thinking and almost never actually send it or say it. It feels so good to get it all out.

    I want to tell you about a time when I did this and well…it didn’t turn out exactly how I thought it would. A few months ago, J and I had a tough moment. I was going through something internal and it had a lot to do with our relationship. I was away on a business trip at the time and he knew something was bothering me. I told him that yes, I was having a hard time and I would certainly talk to him about it, but…I wanted to be there and do it in person. I asked him to be patient with me. He tried, but he was so worried and he kept asking me questions. When he asked the question “Are you sick? Because we can make it through that together.”, I knew I had really worried him. I already told him I was writing it all out and sorting through my thoughts and feelings so I would be prepared to talk to him about it when I got home. But…when I realized he was that scared, I knew it couldn’t wait. So…without thinking…I asked “Do you want me to send you what I wrote?” He said yes. I had about 2 minutes before my next meeting so I sent it without looking or proof-reading or taking out anything I didn’t want him to hear. It was all rambling, unorganized thoughts and feelings in the beginning and then rationalizations and logic in the end. He saw ME…in all my vulnerability and without any editing (which is rare for me…I generally process it all and only the “true” stuff is shared. The psycho crazy ramblings are for my own process…) well…he handled it well. We ended up talking for hours that night about everything and we worked it all out over the phone. By then, I missed him so much. By the time I got home, all either of us wanted to do was hold each other and remind each other how much we care.

    Anyway…my point is…I do the same thing and I’m grateful that I do.

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  33.  #33Dan_Brodribb on July 28, 2009 at 2:37 pm

    Here’s something I actually said to someone once:

    “About that ‘us seeing other people’ thing. I’m not sure. I guess it makes sense, but don’t like it. I’m not seeing anybody else and I don’t want to see anyone else, but since you are, I feel I should. But all my friends with benefits are out of town or in committed relationships. Which sucks because I have to put in effort and go out and wear cologne and stuff just so I can have a relationship I don’t even want. Plus, I’m trying not to be an asshole anymore and dragging other people into this feels like an asshole thing to do. But if you’re dating other people and I’m not I feel totally powerless and at your mercy. So, uh, yeah. I guess I’m going to go give fabulous orgasms to other women. But I’m not happy about it.”

    In reality there were a lot more ‘umms,’ you knows,’ sentence fragments, and awkward pauses. But you get the idea.



  34.  #34Mercedes on July 28, 2009 at 2:49 pm

    db: Really? Why would you give fabulous orgasms to other women if you weren’t happy about it? That sounds wrong to me…why not just go out there and date and see if someone comes along who is more in tune with what you are looking for than the woman you gave this speech to?

    Or better yet (if you don’t want to date and/or have sex), find a way to lose the “powerless” feeling and gain a “powerful” one without using women to do it (I’m sure men have ways of feeling powerful and good about themselves even when we ladies aren’t doing and saying what you want us to do and say).

    You don’t have to sleep with these women (we can umm…get fabulous orgasms without you…and we’d rather do it our way than be used as a pawn to make a point with another woman).

    The way you put it and the way you used it…yes…that is a VERY asshole thing to do to someone. Sounds to me like this is more of a threat and a guilt trip than true feelings and doing what is best for you at the time…

    Not sure what I would say to a guy if I got that speech, but I’m pretty sure it would go something like: “Ummm…wow…it was umm…nice meeting you???”

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  35.  #35Dan_Brodribb on July 28, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Ouch. I feel defensive all of a sudden.

    I don’t claim it as my finest moment. And I freely admit I was thinking a lot more about my feelings than hers in that particular space.

    But it was honest, it started a dialogue, and I learned things from it that helped me become who I am today so I have a hard time regretting it.

    db



  36.  #36Maria on July 28, 2009 at 3:08 pm

    Quess what. The love of my life, who broke my heart 2 years ago, is suddenly back on the picture and quess what, now he wants to marry me.
    Although l feel triggered, attracted and all that kind of thing, l feel like telling him NO, and my speech would be simple this:
    “there is something about you, that makes me feel not comfortable, it makes me feel like lm jumping on unknown and unsafe ground and l cannot ignore this feeling. Although l love you so much and you are the love of my life, l have to say NO to you.”

    Cos the most feeling is to feel safe, but l dnt feel safe with him.



  37.  #37Winks on July 28, 2009 at 3:31 pm

    Robin, thanks, this-

    “and I feel appreciative that you respect what I am looking for, that feels great.”

    is good, I hadn’t thought about it from this perspective, makes him feel good while standing firm on what i want.



  38.  #38alias girl on July 28, 2009 at 3:48 pm

    i feel appreciative of people’s contributions and sharing on this blog. i feel admiring of db’s honesty. i feel unjudgmental towards people’s past actions when they are trying in the NOW to be better and kinder and more loving.

    I feel forgiving of myself and all the crappy things I have said and done in my past.

    i feel scared when i admit things from my past and people trying to use the information against me. i am not speaking about anyone on this blog. i am speaking about my current job situation where people tried to use my past against me. blah.

    i feel forgiving of all creatures because— oops. if we could have done better, we would have. 🙂

    i feel very strange writing this.

    I want to start my own blog and make my living from my writing but I feel unsure how to. i feel overwhelmed. I just want to make money for being me and sharing myself. I feel amused at myself. i don’t want to tell people how to go about things because i am not good at that. i feel better at sharing my own foibles and maybe people can get something out of it or at the very least be entertained. or mortified. or whatever they feel about it.

    i feel SCARED to be myself in the world.

    i feel sadness and tears. i feel curious how i never know what the eff i’m going to write and then i’m crying. i feel self judging. i feel sad and alone.

    i feel a big burst of tears and now i feel better again. i feel almost ready to sign up for the phone class re e commerce.

    i feel scared. thank you for the courage to live the life of my dreams and to love openly and freely without judgement or fear. 🙂 thank you.



  39.  #39tinque on July 28, 2009 at 4:15 pm

    I too write A LOT, and by writing I mean journaling, not my blogging, yet it seems to be mostly when I’m feeling troubled or something is on my mind, and it pokes at me. There are time though when something continues to bother me, and I get very clear that it’s more than me and my old stuff, and I have to speak up or whatever it is will internalize, fester and rot, never a good thing and so something I used to do all the time.
    The speeches for me, especially in the beginning when I had never spoken my truth before, and the thought of that shook me to my core, made me feel so afraid that unless I had something scripted for myself, I couldn’t get anything out that was at all coherent and certainly not what I would want to say if I said anything at all. In the past I wouldn’t, fear of rejection, abandonment.
    Speeches were an awesome tool for me, not something I need so much anymore, mostly because there’s not so much that needs to be said and when there is, it’s far easier for me to do so. But if it’s something seemingly big, I will compose something, for I want to be clean in my speech; I don’t want to say something that would put him on the defensive and thus close down communication, and I want to get it all out, so that it need not be revisited.



  40.  #40Ann on July 28, 2009 at 5:11 pm

    I feel grateful to read the speeches here. I don’t have one at the moment but I love to read how everyone shares their path to authenticity.



  41.  #41Aminata on July 28, 2009 at 6:48 pm

    Thanks Rori for giving me that tip.

    It’s very scary for me to say I want to keep my options open. I know that’s why I was saying “we” and “our.” That’s just my subconscious effort to maintain control. when I get into girl mode, he does everything I want without me asking or telling. It’s weird how he knows. But I don’t really want to tell him what to do, he doesn’t like it. I just don’t know how to stop!!!

    It’s really hard for me to let go and receive with girl energy. That’s what I’ve been working on now that I am alone and what I plan to think about when my guy is away. I’ve been on guy mode for so long, it’s hard for me to shift. I’m going to keep working on this. If you all have any tips on channeling feminine energy, please tell me. Thanks!



  42.  #42Rori Raye on July 28, 2009 at 9:09 pm

    Aminata – Start with the ebook – it lays out the basics, and it’s a workbook so you can actually do this step-by-step, and it will make everything here and in my eletters and all my other programs easier to understand and use. Rori



  43.  #43Rori Raye on July 28, 2009 at 9:14 pm

    Alias Girl, you are so cool…Love, Rori (Follow Erika, Mercedes and Tinque’s lead with blogging. Get started. Just do it. Figure out the steps as you go along, and if my husband has another class I’ll let you know…)



  44.  #44alias girl on July 28, 2009 at 10:22 pm

    🙂 🙂 🙂 thank you rori raye. i loved the tele class! sorry about my giggling. i thought i was MUTED!!!!

    i feel good about just taking a baby step and starting. i have blogged before but never really had more than two accidental readers!!! hee hee. i feel nervous but i also feel willing.

    whee!

    the class was great though. a really good foundation to start from. thank you.



  45.  #45Erika on July 28, 2009 at 10:41 pm

    how I feel about condoms and why I won’t use them anymore (nor any other form of birth control):

    http://awakeningfromthedream.blogspot.com/2009/07/erikas-why-i-dont-like-condoms-speech.html



  46.  #46Tina on July 28, 2009 at 11:07 pm

    I’ll read your blogs Alias girl! Dan, this feels hurtful to me, I dont know the details of that relationship however, this sounds to me like you are attempting to turn the tables. I feel it is not a “one up” on you situation when a woman says that to a man. You dont “feel” connected to this woman, so whats the problem?. Dan send her to this site, so she’s not out in the dark. I’m working on a no sex speech, ugh, I really do feel sexual/sensual energy, I need to um reign it in some or not?. Is nude sunbathing a wrong choice for a first date?. I do have a belief system and morals just oh I dunno…



  47.  #47Tina on July 28, 2009 at 11:13 pm

    ok so random nude sunbathing is out of the question, I would have to feel safe with my date, like sensual massage guy, he was safe. I dont know a lot of men that can handle that type of situation. Ok, I need to work on a speech for that, allowing touching, maybe kissing, no kissing leads to other stuff ugh, I cant do this. What helps is I feel drawn so I have to remember that this is masculine energy, although I never make the first move on a man. They want to touch me, this feels so complicated to me.



  48.  #48Tina on July 28, 2009 at 11:16 pm

    I do believe I have intimacy issues, I just have to figure out how to get pass the “thrill” of the first date. Awareness is half the solution 🙂



  49.  #49Tina on July 28, 2009 at 11:21 pm

    Erika, I admire your sticktoitness, I feel condoms help a man that lacks oh i dont know what you call it…stamina? The man I was with for the 11/2 said he had a problem with time,like 5 minutes no kidding. I never once had that problem with him, I’m not even sure why he said that. Condoms at the beginning of our relationship helped in this area, I do believe.



  50.  #50sistasage on July 28, 2009 at 11:49 pm

    hi! i’m db’s hot partner (to whom he said that speech – scroll up) and this is what was happening on my end:

    gee, his feelings are hurt. well, i guess i could have seen that coming if i’d thought about it. he told me before that he, himself, wasn’t interested in seeing other people, and while he wouldn’t stop me from doing so if i desired, it wasn’t his preference. then i had an add-on to the fling i’d had a few weeks previously (which he was very accepting of), and while the fling was pretty fun, i wasn’t fulfilling any deep need, i was just having fun. and i can have fun in so many ways.

    i’ve been manipulated and guilt-tripped for my sexual adventures before, and i don’t cave to it. i think tone and body language are lost when explaining things on the internet, but what came out of db’s speech is that i realized i felt more strongly for him than i had been letting on, even to myself. this revelation, combined with a heartfelt conversation where we shared a lot more of our respective vulnerabilities led to a deeper intimacy. i thought about whether i wanted to work out a poly relationship with db (most of my long-term relationships have been poly), and decided that i, myself, preferred to be monogamous with db from that point on. renegotiation may occur later. 🙂

    i didn’t think he was being an asshole so much as thinking out loud. but i guess that gets lost without context. if db hadn’t shared what he did at that point, i would very likely have continued the lifestyle to which i had become accustomed. i have, since becoming monogamous, become far happier than i would ever have expected.



  51.  #51Rori Raye on July 29, 2009 at 12:44 am

    Wow, sistasage, Welcome and thank you for your powerful comment. I look forward to hearing more from you, and following your relationship as it deepens. Rori



  52.  #52Tina on July 29, 2009 at 12:51 am

    I feel really turned on at the same time I feel very vulnerable by saying this, sex feels really good, I enjoy the closeness with a steady sexual partner? , I want to wait this out ? lol, I would feel icky and that would feel awful. ok I need to work on this some more. I dont know if I want to be married so I’ll leave that part out.



  53.  #53Rori Raye on July 29, 2009 at 12:53 am

    Dan, thank you, and I’m thrilled to have you both here talking about having a deep, truthful conversation that actually got you more intimacy and a deeper and different commitment to each other. Oh – I visited your site, you’re a very interesting fellow… If I had a request, it would be to ask you to put your picture up on your blog, so we could get a better sense of you when you post…Rori



  54.  #54Tracy on July 29, 2009 at 12:59 am

    tinque,
    Thanks for the thumbs up!
    I am planning on giving him this speech..
    I feel great hanging out with you and i feel safe and happy with our friendship…..I feel that i am growing and learning more about myself and it feels great…..
    I don’t feel ready for a serious relationship right now….i would love a relationship that would grow from friendship and maybe something more as time goes on….however i feel that this is not an option that i can exercise with you….I want to feel certain that my relationship is growing to something better and that i have options should i choose to get serious….
    what do u guys think?



  55.  #55Tina on July 29, 2009 at 1:18 am

    ok, married in some form or fashion?. I’ll have to feel that one out. Wowsers Sistasage, your comment triggers , guilt fear, shame for me, I would love feel at some point in my body where I no longer feel guilt , fear shame tied , mixed up with my feelings of passion, sexual/sensual energy and self assurance/confidence. I feel in my body all of my feelings are in the same sort of general area, my right side, sortof all down my side, then I did a “tool” and my good feelings came right from the pit of my oh i dont know Im still working on this stuff. I found helpful tools for this though.



  56.  #56Tina on July 29, 2009 at 1:22 am

    oh thats a good one, I dont feel ready for a serious relationship, I dont feel comfortable continuing a sexual relationship (1 1/2 year “boyfriend” . Im keeping that one.



  57.  #57Tracy on July 29, 2009 at 2:22 am

    Tina….
    I should add that one up in my speech…i don’t feel comfortable continuing with a sexual relationship because i want more than that……..but i feel i also need someone willing to grow with me….from friendship to something more…..
    I just practiced my little speech on the mirror…and i feel much better just saying out loud…I am still refining the words and trying out new ways of expressing myself and i feel that the more i express myself the more i feel authentic about what i am saying…
    I’ve been practicing feeling messages with the guyz i am circular dating with and i am speaking my truth….it feels great!



  58.  #58Tina on July 29, 2009 at 3:52 am

    ok, I feel positive about having serious relationship (some day) just not with him, when I’m around him, I feel awful, I’ve had good days, I just feel all the pining away, sadness, lonely feelings is not a good sign for a serious relationship or any kind of relationship for that matter. I feel like a kid in a candy store, looking at candy I cant have, well I’ve since discovered I can have it. He wants his tools, I feel safe enough for him to come in to my house when I am not here, I do not feel safe enough to be in his presence, I’m wondering if its a good idea to just let him come in while I am away, I’ll leave a note on the table asking him to lock the door on his way out. I have a date on the weekend, a time has not been set yet, I have a date tonight as well. I’ll mull it over and see how I feel next time he asks, I did say I would drop his stuff off at his moms house, I havnt had the time.



  59.  #59DocK on July 29, 2009 at 6:00 am

    Hi Rori – happy to hear that you are interested in mentoring other blog sites. My own web site is a work in progress and it will include a blog. I got inspired by some of the women here that brought up working out and fitness issues. I realized that between my own commitment to fitness for 28 years, my doctorate in the psychology of human performance, and the articles I have written for fitness magazines – I might be able to help. I didn’t want to clog up your site with discussion of that stuff. It isn’t ready yet – but soon. I’ll make a brief mention of it when it is a “go” and see what happens. Thanks for encouraging us.



  60.  #60DocK on July 29, 2009 at 6:08 am

    Also wanted to jump in on the DB post…

    After having read what Sistasage wrote and her clarification – I get why you felt as you did.

    The difference with circular dating as, I believe, most of the women practice it here… is “dating others” is just that. Sexual exclusivity is with the primary partner and not with the others. It is staying open when the woman is ready for something more with her main LI but he isn’t (and might never be – with her) so that she doesn’t get in that “stuck” mode for years on end.

    Your situation as I’m reading it from Sistasage is that dating others did include “flings” of the sexual sort.

    For me, yes, that would be a problem and I know, in my past, I would operate the same way. If I was in an “open” relationship with someone and he is messing around, I’ll be damned if I’d be at home waiting with his cigar and robe – I’d be out there too.

    I’m glad the two of you are on the same wavelength now and having a great time – together.



  61.  #61Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 6:17 am

    db: Usually when someone says something on a blog that triggers me, I type, hit “submit” and move on without another thought – rarely with regrets. I do have a regret about my post to you (using a word like “asshole” isn’t really me and I probably wouldn’t have if you hadn’t already done it)…but mostly because I made you feel defensive (that was not my intent…I think my intent was simply to say that behavior wouldn’t have gone over well with me, but instead, I attacked…oops).

    I’m glad things worked out with you and sistasage (and by the way…welcome sistasage!!) and yet still have to stand by my own belief that if a man said that to me, I would not have been as gracious as she was (would not have learned the lesson) and would have sat you down next to Terrance for a little game of dinner roll darts. 🙂

    Anyway…sorry my words got so harsh…didn’t mean to upset. 🙁

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  62.  #62DocK on July 29, 2009 at 6:30 am

    Mercedes, dinner roll darts! LOL You could have a new career as a game developer.



  63.  #63Erika on July 29, 2009 at 7:26 am

    I also posted this as a comment on my condom post on my blog:

    Notice how my “stances” are good conversation starters. That’s part of what I’m doing … it doesn’t mean I’ll never change my mind about something … it’s a springboard for true intimacy.

    When I tell a guy my feelings about condoms, we end up getting to know each other at a deeper level much more quickly because the conversation is going to reveal all kinds of things about both of us …



  64.  #64Winks on July 29, 2009 at 8:37 am

    Erika, though I’m not sure for myself about the no condoms thing, I loved your outlook on waiting to have sex with anyone until true intimacy is there. That is something I would like to work more on. I don’t have to be married to have sex, but I don’t like feeling like a guy expects sex by a certain point in dating. 5 dates or so hardly feels like true intimacy.



  65.  #65Rori Raye on July 29, 2009 at 9:10 am

    Very cool, dock…you look fabulous! Rori



  66.  #66Rori Raye on July 29, 2009 at 9:12 am

    Thank you Mercedes, as always, for all of you…Love, Rori



  67.  #67Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 9:20 am

    Awwww Rori! Thanks! Not many people can honestly say that and I appreciate those who can and do…

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  68.  #68DocK on July 29, 2009 at 10:28 am

    Thank you Rori (blushing)!



  69.  #69Tina on July 29, 2009 at 11:32 am

    Wow, Dock you look great. Back when I was experimenting with black and white night film, my now ex husband let me take nudes of him. I was showing my mom family photos and the nudes popped out right on the floor oops. She’s no prude herself,but her eyes popped out and her mouth dropped, my cousin was there at the time too. My style was more guerilla photography with no special lighting, I just played around with what I had, like my 60 watt light bulb. I”m almost set up for the birch tree and an old bed frame I found, I’m waiting for more blooms on the rose bush.Ive started clearing the area, anyway good luck on your site. I feel inspired!



  70.  #70Dan_Brodribb on July 29, 2009 at 11:50 am

    Hey, everybody. This is going to be long and quote-heavy. I’m addressing Alias Girl, Rori, Tina, Sistasage, and Miss Mercedes, in that order. Feel free to skip the parts that don’t interest you.

    Alias Girl – Thanks for your kind words. Forgiveness–and especially self-forgiveness–is a wonderful thing. If writing is something you’re passionate about, I agree with the consensus that you should explore it.

    Rori – Maybe one day, I’ll get around to putting a picture up. In the meantime, I’d appreciate it if you pictured me as a man chiseled from stone, steel and storms, hewn to masculine perfection. Windswept golden hair. Deep blue eyes sparkling with compassion and good humour but hint at a dark secrets and an intense, unbridled sexuality. But that dorky t-shirt has got to go.

    Tina said – “Dan, this feels hurtful to me, I dont know the details of that relationship however, this sounds to me like you are attempting to turn the tables. I feel it is not a “one up” on you situation when a woman says that to a man. You dont “feel” connected to this woman, so whats the problem?”

    I’m not sure I understand what you’re asking. Are you saying the speech feels manipulative or like I’m trying to make her feel guilty? What would your suggestion be?

    Sistasage – I just found a whole box of gluten-free kisses at my house. Want to come over and share them?

    Mercedes – Like Tina, I’m curious as to what specifically you’d have liked to see in that situation.

    I also think in your original response, you touched on an issue that I’m still not clear on and that’s the role of sex in circular dating. Because as a guy, the whole thing that seperates dating from just hanging out is the physical connection. I’m not saying there has to be sex right away, but I can’t imagine going on multiple dates with someone where there wasn’t a certain level of fooling around.

    Even if you set the physical stuff aside (I wouldn’t, but for the sake of argument, let’s do it), there’s still an emotional progression in dating towards more and more intimacy.

    So is this happening on circular dating? Is it happening with every guy in the circle? In my experience, the more people you start bringing in, the more sets of feelings you have to contend with, which results in a whole lot of emtional turmoil.

    To paraphrase something Sistasage once told me about polyamorous relationships, “They always sound so good in theory, and you always think your group is the one that is smart and enlightened and loving enough to make it work, and yet inevitably it disintegrates into a giant fiasco.”

    I’ve never been in a polyamrous relationship, but I have on occasion been involved with more than one person at at time, and it’s a lot more work, more complications, and more emotionally draining than I find fun or comfortable.

    And I’ve never really seen this point adequately addressed by the Circular Dating people except as “well, by dating we don’t actually mean DATING dating.”

    Which leaves me more confused than ever.

    Thoughts would be appreciated.



  71.  #71Aldonza on July 29, 2009 at 11:57 am

    DocK, you look fabulous! I love the look of firm muscles on a woman. To that end, I lift heavy and eat clean. But it’s an uphill battle with a full life as a single mom, working full-time, etc. I also fight myself when I’m in the weight room with “the big boys.” They probably think it’s cool that I’m there, but I keep feeling judged for not knowing all the best moves, or not lifting as much as they do. Silly thoughts that keep me in the woman’s area too much.



  72.  #72DocK on July 29, 2009 at 12:20 pm

    Tina – thank you and you had me howling with your story about the nudes. I had a nude session recently (B&W photos) but I have them stuck into a portfolio book so just that scenario DOESN’T play out (they WON’T be on my website) : )

    Aldonza – thank you to you as well (more blushing – oh you Sirens). Yup – know all about the “big boys.” After all my years of working out – they still try to “help me out” so I had a shirt made that says “Mind Your Own Fitness” – which is also a play on my “Mind” in fitness specialty. Definitely not a “lean back” approach.

    When I DO feel like leaning back I just become “Dr. Blondie” instead of DocK and oohhh and ahhh at all the weight they throw around and “Oh I feel frustrated, I don’t know how to use this new machine?” and stuff.

    I’m a bad, bad girl (also the title of a great song by Candye Kane)



  73.  #73Tina on July 29, 2009 at 12:23 pm

    DB, I would suggest reading Rori’s newest post on, oh I dont know the exact title but its there. I would (since you asked) pack up your toothbrush and send it to your house via fedex, ok I’m kidding. My 1 1/2 year man wants his tools, I thought about doing that but its to much stuff and cost to much money, so I feel fear and anxiety about seeing him again, I thought about fleeing the scene, flee, flee flee yup. The more I feel the more I feel the pull, desperatation, crying blah. I guess this is where I have to from now on give out only toast and luke warm water from my tap. I really dont know what to tell you Dan lol I have my own problems, oh this is so going on my list as a “situation” I havnt seen him for two weeks , I wonder what that would feel like seeing him again?. I dont like this feeling of hurt and rejection.



  74.  #74Dan_Brodribb on July 29, 2009 at 1:01 pm

    It sounds like you’re going through a lot of right now, Tina. I appreciate you taking the time to respond. I want to offer comfort, but I don’t know what to say, except I think these feelings of yours are normal and that you have the strength to manage them as you go through them in your own time and your own way.

    DocK – I just realized you answered one of my questions earlier, and I missed it. Sorry, bout that. I guess I wonder how I would feel if I were one of the non-primary partners. It reminds me of being “just friends” with the girl I had a crush on back in high school. Lot of heartache back in the late 80s for Mrs. Brodribb’s handsome son. Some great music though.



  75.  #75Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 1:22 pm

    db: Mercedes – Like Tina, I’m curious as to what specifically you’d have liked to see in that situation.

    Well…since you asked…I like this:

    “About that ‘us seeing other people’ thing. I’m not sure. I guess it makes sense, but don’t like it. I’m not seeing anybody else and I don’t want to see anyone else.

    Beginning here is where I would have started to get angry:

    “but since you are, I feel like I should. But all my friends with benefits are out of town or in committed relationships. Which sucks because I have to put in effort and go out and wear cologne and stuff just so I can have a relationship I don’t even want. Plus, I’m trying not to be an asshole anymore and dragging other people into this feels like an asshole thing to do. But if you’re dating other people and I’m not I feel totally powerless and at your mercy. So, uh, yeah. I guess I’m going to go give fabulous orgasms to other women. But I’m not happy about it.”

    It sounds like a guilt trip and a threat. You indicate in almost every sentence that she has power over you and you don’t so you’ll do what she wants, you’ll do it her way and no matter how that makes you feel or what consequences it has for other people, you feel you have no choice. That would have turned me off and made me angry.

    The first part seems like it would have been enough to show me you are strong, sure of yourself, sure of our relationship and wanting to talk about what we can do to make it work.

    The second part, not so much.

    (umm…keep in mind, I don’t circular date – as in actually DATING other men and sleeping with one – and never have while in an intimate relationship with one man, so I might have a different mindset than some of the other women here. I have made lots of male friends and been curious as to whether or not any attraction for them would cause me to want to move on to another relationship from the one I’m in, but I haven’t actually accepted dates from one man while sleeping with another.)

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  76.  #76Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 1:33 pm

    db: “I’d appreciate it if you pictured me as a man chiseled from stone, steel and storms, hewn to masculine perfection. Windswept golden hair. Deep blue eyes sparkling with compassion and good humour but hint at a dark secrets and an intense, unbridled sexuality. But that dorky t-shirt has got to go.”

    Awww…that’s the way we all picture you already…

    *rolls eyes*

    then

    *winks and smiles*

    (to take the sting off the *rolls eyes* part…) 🙂

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  77.  #77DocK on July 29, 2009 at 1:41 pm

    Dan – the “non-primary” partners means different things to different women.

    For some women these are guys a woman flirts with. I think even people that are married flirt a bit – I also stated that there is an OK way of flirting and one that crosses a line in you are in a relationship of commitment (this is what I believe). For instance, since you like to bat your eyelashes – : ) that’s a good example. If I am getting my car worked on – I may wear a mini and halter and bat my eyelashes a lot and get a discount and my car done sooner – but I’m not giving out my phone number. (also a bit manipulative – mea culpa!) If I am in a bar and a guy starts chatting with me – I’ll chat back and maybe he thinks there is “opportunity” there when there isn’t (in my case) but I don’t see why we can’t have a conversation. This, to me, keeps my vibe open.

    For other women – they may be actually going out to dinner, a show, whatever and maybe the guy gets hurt and maybe he doesn’t because the “primary” guy didn’t step up and isn’t going to but “secondary” guy does. In that case, the primary guy loses out – but what is he losing if he wasn’t truly interested in anything long-term anyway with this woman but just liked having her around?

    The scenario you describe is one where a woman is friends with a guy but she isn’t attracted to him. He and she are JUST friends and she wouldn’t want it to be anything else (sorry, it has happened to us all at some point) and so I don’t consider having guy friends to be circular dating.

    I have guy friends but I’m not dating them and if one of them has “feelings” for me that is his responsibility since I am not leading him on to think it’s something else.

    Or is there the When Harry Met Sally theory that a man can’t be JUST friends with a woman – that’s a whole other can of worms.



  78.  #78DocK on July 29, 2009 at 1:45 pm

    DB – now I know – AKA Adonis : )



  79.  #79Simply Shannon on July 29, 2009 at 1:56 pm

    Dan: “…there’s still an emotional progression in dating towards more and more intimacy.” I feel curious about this too. I feel comfortable with circular dating as a way to keep myself open. However, don’t I want someone to naturally rise to the top of my list? I feel confused about how a relationship is allowed to grow into something more if *I* am keeping all the men on a level playing field. I just wanted to say I hear you.

    Mercedes: I have no idea what real tone was used but I read Dan’s post a little differently. I hear passion and anger (and hurt) but also sarcasm and humor. It sounds like a “no boyfriend” speech to me. Much different words than I would use… but this is a guy… being told by a girl that she does not want to be exclusive with him (polyamory). My reaction would probably have been the same as yours “ok, umm, bye” but that’s because I WANT exclusive, not vice versa. And as you have read in my previous posts, I don’t do the “dating while sleeping with one” either. I have a hard time with this one (obviously 🙂 ).



  80.  #80Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 1:59 pm

    Ok, Erika and all;

    I feel like really putting myself out there and saying this. I am absolutely allergic to condoms. Seriously. I stay in my relationship because we’ve both been given a clean bill of health.
    I feel very scared to leave him because of sex. I feel much better sleeping with him than being left with only abstinence(I’ve been celibate). My libido is really amped up now and he serves a purpose. I sometimes feel trapped by my allergy. There are alternatives but logistically they’re too risky for me to do sexploration. I want a husband for the purpose of a constant sexual partner. Before the allergy became a serious problem I enjoyed a carefree attitude about lovers. I actually almost never felt insecure! But now I feel I am at the mercy of familiarity. I hate it! I feel vulnerable, afraid, timid, ugh. I used to walk out on anything I didn’t like. I was using condoms so I didn’t care, I was detached. But they break and I feel scared of losing the luxury of sex with someone I trust. I don’t recognize this nesting instinct in me. I hate feeling tied down to a man that is not my husband. It takes me so long to trust someone that I don’t feel like I have options. This is where my anger comes from. Before my body began reacting to condoms I wanted a life partner but marriage was negotiable.Then after that doctors visit…..I cried, I knew my life would be altered forever.my autonomy had been snatched away. I got really depressed over this….really sad. Then I just decided marriage is the only option for me as a life choice. I don’t feel comfortable sleeping around and I can’t! I hate it. I need protection in a different sense now. I’m actually considering a FWB thing!!!!! as a solution to my guy not proposing on my timeline. A speech-” hey, uh…. yeah. So, I love you and feel you’d make a great husband but since I don’t feel that happening now, I’d love to just fuck you on a regular basis until I find the one. I know you only know one side of me but secretly I’m really good at using men for sex and not letting them into my heart. I do love you and respect your decision either way but I’m feeling really horny and I need to fuck on a regular basis without a condom, and right now you are the only person I feel comfortable doing that with. I want to be able to call you specifically for cock. I understand if this sounds like I have ulterior motives but my only motive here is to create safety and regularity around my sex life. I feel scared being this honest with you but I want to be able to treat you like a piece of meat instead of merely discarding you because you haven’t stepped up and claimed me. What do you think?”

    I don’t feel he’ll let me do this, but he still has a value to me even if he never commits. I feel scared he’ll lose respect for me because I’m not asking for real commitment. I feel scared he’ll assume I think I’m not deserving or something, that I have no boundaries but this is what I need. I know myself and…….well like I shared with mercedes; I’m a Leo and we are a masculine sign.we are hunters and very sexual,very assertive, very accustomed to boy toys.I’ve proven to be very resilient when it comes to taking back my heart when sex is still there. My experience has been the men can’t handle it and go crazy. So I came to rori for help feeling my feelings so that I could achieve intimacy-to connect my heart to someone and create a happy marriage. I was quite the man-eater in my past and hurt many men. I was too reseved to sleep with a lot of people so I took lovers that I dominated. I’d choose a guy just for sex and kept him until he asked for more, then I’d get angry at him and tell him he can be replaced and not to ask me for anything. Wow-I feel scared of myself for admitting that. My buddy said to stop going against my nature and I’ve been pondering what that means. I’ve been searching myself for my truth the last two days and that’s my-speech for now. Ugh, I feel exposed



  81.  #81Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 2:06 pm

    Shannon: I agree, my take on it (and yours) is probably not how others would take it and I’m guessing, if I were in a relationship long enough to be having that conversation with a man he’d know better than to say it to me that way. I’m sure Dan knew his girl well enough to know what to say and how to say it…I’m just saying for me, it would have had a pretty bad outcome…

    (Like: “Quick! Someone hold my head still so it doesn’t spin around while I spit green sh*t all over him! LOL)

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  82.  #82Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 2:08 pm

    Nikita: I don’t know if this is the case for you, but most people who are allergic to condoms are actually allergic to the latex in them. They make lambskin condoms (a little more expensive but just as effective) for people who have that issue. Just a thought that might help you move from feeling trapped and doing something you don’t really want to do (or with someone you don’t really want to do it with).

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  83.  #83Dan_Brodribb on July 29, 2009 at 2:15 pm

    “It sounds like a guilt trip and a threat. You indicate in almost every sentence that she has power over you and you don’t so you’ll do what she wants, you’ll do it her way and no matter how that makes you feel or what consequences it has for other people, you feel you have no choice.”

    It wasn’t my intention to make her feel guilty or threaten her. Everything else you wrote is pretty much bang on with how I felt at that particular moment.

    And it was confusing as hell. At that time we were BOTH agreed we were in a non-exclusive relationship. I was getting exactly what I asked for, and I was confused as hell as to why these feelings were coming up when I was getting exactly what I spent years saying I wanted.



  84.  #84Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 2:25 pm

    db: After reading sistasage’s response, I understand that this worked out well for both of you. It wouldn’t have with me is all. I think what happened there and what this brought out in the two of you is absolutely wonderful and I could really learn from it.

    Just from my perspective (knowing myself and how I react), I would have walked away and not looked back on a man who made me feel like he was trying trap me and/or guilt me into doing something I didn’t want to do. I’m not saying this was your intent…I’m saying that’s how I would have taken it.

    Different personalities, different communication styles, different people. What one person learns from, another rejects.

    Make sense?

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  85.  #85alias girl on July 29, 2009 at 2:49 pm

    nikkita. hmm. i feel curious. i feel admiring of your honesty. i relate a lot to what you wrote because in the past i tended to pick relationships that were superficially only about sex (but really more but …)

    i feel curious that maybe my own issues of not feel safe with intimacy (in the past) contributed to my “choices”. but i wasn’t really choosing. i was staying safe and comfortable and avoiding intimacy.

    if you wanted to do a speech maybe pull out all your i feel messages. i feel afraid timid insecure angry trapped rejected unchosen etc.

    as a start. i don’t know though because i don’t know how to do speeches yet.

    but i feel A lot of emotions under this issue when i read your comment. and i relate. i feel scared of surrendering to one man. i feel vulnerable. but if i keep things at a sexual level only the men feel more replaceable. (not really true though for me. )

    but i also heard lambskin condoms may solve your problem of allergy to latex.



  86.  #86Dan_Brodribb on July 29, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Simply Shannon – Thanks for your comments. I appreciate knowing that I’m not the only confused one.

    DocK – It sounds like you’re okay with some flirting, but also are also clear where your limits are. At least, I hope that’s what you were saying. I got as far as “mini and halter” and got a little distracted 🙂

    Mercedes – So if I understand you right, you get angry when you feel people are trying to guilt-trip or threaten you and you hate feeling manipulated. And when you feel that way, you have no problems making your displeasure known, or even walking away without a second thought.

    Nikita said – “I was quite the man-eater in my past and hurt many men. I was too reseved to sleep with a lot of people so I took lovers that I dominated. I’d choose a guy just for sex and kept him until he asked for more, then I’d get angry at him and tell him he can be replaced and not to ask me for anything. Wow-I feel scared of myself for admitting that.”

    I’m happy you were able to feel you could share that with us. Just as a little encouragement, I also have done some things in my past I’m not particularly proud of. But it is possible to move beyond it and have the types of relationship you deserve. I think all of us believe that or we wouldn’t be here.



  87.  #87Dan_Brodribb on July 29, 2009 at 3:22 pm

    As for sistasage’s response…well, I may have mentioned this before, but she’s a special sort of person.<3



  88.  #88Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 3:24 pm

    Ok mercedes,
    I feel triggered by your advice. I know it comes from a good place,but I feel…..annoyed. I feel like;” what you think I’m a fucking idiot?”
    let me explain. Yes, I am violently allergic to latex. A latex allergy only gets worse over time so we can’t tempt fate with it. Now, lambskin does not protect against HIV and is a porous, breathable membrane( they’re shaped loosely as well and very expensive) then there’s polyurethane condoms; the latex alternative……this is what I used when I first learned my body rejected latex but it had not been approved by the government-and they’re cut on the large side. I’ve embarassed men that couldn’t fill it( too big) he was ok-but the chance of it slipping off inside of me is much greater. I am also allergic to nonoxynol 9 and all spermicides-polyurethane is my only option-with a guy that has a big cock( no gaurantees in life) but technically polyurethane is a poison.
    I take offense because as a very feisty woman yourself don’t you think I would have exhausted all options to maintain my man-eating autonomy? Bcuz I did.
    I do deeply feel that you just wanted to help but I feel my intelligence being insulted. I feel very sensitive about this topic.
    I get triggered when people say to me”don’t get married, it’s a nightmare,youre beautiful enjoy your life”. I start growling in my head feeling like……I know what’s best for me!my body already decided!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    My anger is not directed at mercedes it’s just a build-up of frustration over ten years of people assuming I can just use condoms like everybody else. I hate this modern society!!!hate it hate it hate it!!!!!!!!! Fuck free love-fuck women’s liberation! Fuck STD’s, fuck casual sex-fuck non-committal people! Fuck!!!!!!!
    I want.SECURITY NOW
    I
    Love u miss m. Please believe me



  89.  #89Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 4:48 pm

    db: Yup. You got it…except for the “no problem” part when walking away. I’ll do it, but it hurts and it is hard…the degree to which I’ll do it “without a second thought” depends so much on how much I already care about and/or have invested in a person.

    Nikita: No worries. I’ll leave any future advice for you up to Alias Girl. Looks like she can say the EXACT same thing and not trigger anything in you. btw…I’m not a fucking idiot either. I’ve had a latex allergy since I was 12.



  90.  #90Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 5:22 pm

    Mercedes,

    Your advice is still welcome. Looks like you’re triggered by something here, I hadn’t read alias girls post. I read yours and zipped down to respond. I just feel frustrated and horny.
    I’d really love advice on my speech or whether to completely walk away from this guy( I did dump him but….) that I am so in love with



  91.  #91Fernando on July 29, 2009 at 6:02 pm

    I don’t want to trigger you Nikita, but I’d point out that some people are allergic to semen, and… I mean… that just SUCKS!

    I can understand your frustration, I’d hate to not be able to wear a condom. Actually, I hate wearing condoms in the first place, because unlike most, I last an abnormally long time without them. It takes damn near an energy drink and a snack break for me to keep up the energy to finish with a condom on. Thankfully I found some really good ones that cut down on the time it takes for me to finish. (Pleasure Plus for the curious)

    My circumstance probably isn’t helping you a bit, seeing as how those condoms are still latex. Does the pill do anything for you? The ring? I know there’s some crazy effective birth control stuff they use in Europe that the FDA has yet to allowing in the states. (like that plastic thing shaped like a “y”) I’m sure you’ve looked into a lot of things, and I’m totally shooting in the dark in case I stumbled onto something you hadn’t yet.

    Erika, I think your simile is a bit off. I’m not aware of anyone getting a potentially fatal disease by shaking hands, or making a new person by giving someone a high five. However, I DO understand wanting that total connection with someone before you sleep with them, the unshakable trust that relationships of today seem to forget is required.

    Now I gotta figure out a speech to share with you guys…



  92.  #92Simply Shannon on July 29, 2009 at 8:02 pm

    Dan: Thank you for sharing the confusion you experienced. Reading what you said is exactly how I’ve felt so many times, as in “I finally have everything I want…. so why am I so unhappy??”

    Mercedes: I laughed out loud at the dinner roll darts comment! And I’ll hold your head any time! 🙂 I feel concerned (too strong…I need a feelings dictionary) reading your posts today. You okay?

    Tinque: I definitely feel more comfortable writing things down first before I speak. It helps me to gather my thoughts and figure out what’s really going on instead of just spewing out words that are only my surface feelings.

    Alias Girl: I would read your blog!

    Erika: I feel very impressed by your no-condom speech and equally impressed by your ability to hold true until you have what you want. I’m glad the convention went well for you!

    Nikita: Thank you for sharing your story with us and with such honesty. I feel honored by your vulnerability. After reading your posts, I feel confused by what you want. If you removed the condom allergy from the equation for a minute, what is it that you truly want? Do you want your freedom (to have sex with whomever you want) or do you want long term/ marriage/ exclusive relationship? I feel confused because you say “I want a husband for the purpose of a constant sexual partner” and then you say “I know what’s best for me! My body already decided!” and then you say “I want SECURITY NOW”. What do you want? What is your heart’s desire? I completely empathize with not wanting to be celibate and having a very high sex drive. Check and check my friend. However, once I found my goal was a long term relationship and marriage, it was much easier to go without sex (not celibacy – I always have me 🙂 ). And surprisingly, my man showed up relatively quickly in my rotation of men. On a side note, my son is allergic to peanuts, so I do feel empathy for you and share your frustration. I feel bad that you have to deal with the allergy at all. Maybe if you figure out what you really want, then figuring out how to handle sex in a protected way might be easier to sort out. You know…eat the elephant one bite at a time… Maybe? I hope that helps.



  93.  #93Fernando on July 29, 2009 at 8:07 pm

    I have a dream! (Yup, I’m going there…)

    I dream that beautiful women and wonderful men can find each other easily! I have a dream that we will be judged not by the number of days before we call, but on the content of our text messages!

    I have a dream that everyone feel safe to walk and love wholly with open hearts! I have a dream that we can be honest, and we learn that the gender opposite of ours is not out to get us, but is doing the best it can to understand us!

    I have a dream that we can accept who we are and see ourselves as those who love us see us, for we are our own harshest critics, and often fail to see how wonderful and brilliant we truly are!

    I have a dream that compliments can be freely given, and not be suspected of cajoling! I dream that we lose our dependence on make-up and ab-blasters and learned to take care of ourselves and each other, that we may all glow with beauty.

    I have a dream that we can be honest about the relationships we want, whether it be monogamous, or polyamorous, so that we can all be satisfied!

    Too soon?



  94.  #94Mercedes on July 29, 2009 at 8:10 pm

    Shannon: I’m good. Just trying to explain to db what I would be like if it were me. I smiled when I wrote them all (except one but that’s onlt because of the intense feedback I got when trying to help).

    Thanks for checking on me girl!!

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  95.  #95Fernando on July 29, 2009 at 8:16 pm

    I want to add, I hope that last post doesn’t seem irreverent. Dr. King’s speech was remarkable, but I truly think that closing the rift between the sexes is nearly as important as equal rights for all races. There’s a lot of hurt in the world right now because men and women don’t understand each other, and I think places like this, and what goes on here really helps with that. I wrote that comment light-heartedly, but deep in my heart, I really feel like this is important work we do together.



  96.  #96tinque on July 29, 2009 at 8:31 pm

    Fernando – that is beautiful, so beautiful…



  97.  #97Erika on July 29, 2009 at 8:39 pm

    ah Fernando …

    I’m a little worried that I’m devoting too much time and attention to this blog, at the expense of my own blog. And I feel a little guilty saying that.



  98.  #98Fernando on July 29, 2009 at 8:43 pm

    Erika, I love you, and I called you earlier about your blog. I feel like you’re paying too much attention to this blog instead of answering your messages. 🙂



  99.  #99Erika on July 29, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    Actually, I was deep into work today so I did not have time or attention to respond to messages, especially messages that deserved more time and attention like yours 😉

    I just got home, and now I’m going to meditate and hope my head feels clearer tomorrow



  100.  #100Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    Fernando,

    thanks, I can count my blessings and thank the source that I am very compatible with semen. Birth control is not important/the issue. I’m concerned with the communicable stuff.

    Simply Shannon,
    thanks,
    What do I want?…….sex, regularly, with the same person who is more comfortable having sex with only me. I’d like this for at least 5 years, preferably for forever. I want to feel less pressure about where my next meal is coming from(sex). I want emotional and physical security with a man I trust. I would like to be married but if the man I love at the moment is incredibly scared of the devastation divorce causes and is fearful that women turn on men and sue them and break their hearts( unfortunately he’s surrounded by divorced men whose wives were less than merciful)he’s jaded that’s all. He wants marriage but his parents had a vicious divorce and his mother initiated it. I fear he may be damaged beyond repair. So, I feel frustrated wondering who am I going to feel comfortable enough with to get my needs met. The broken heart hurts but the sexual craving for me compounds everything. I had to walk away and give myself a chance to find something real, someone who has an optimistic perception of marriage. Security is everything for me. I do like marriage, it feels right to me. I wasn’t even sure I wanted to marry him but after he came back to me I began to consider that maybe we are right for one another if he values marriage. After a few months with him I got angry. He heard a story about a bad marriage and another nasty divorce story; in the heat of the conversation he said”that’s why I’m never getting married”. I felt like the rug was pulled out underneath me. I reminded him the only reason I took him back and was dating him is because he kept insisting he does want to get married and he feels like he fucked up. The emotion in his face(unusual) convinced me. I felt moved by the intensity in his heart and began rethinking my idea that he’s really searching for long-term love. I asked him(crying/triggered) why did he say that, why did he tell me he did want marriage, I thought we had the same values?….I felt stupid and at that moment it felt over. I believed him-I still dated, but not as frequently.
    I feel tricked, sure I have admirers but the physical is what I want.



  101.  #101Erika on July 29, 2009 at 8:58 pm

    Gals,

    My suggestion is not to believe it when guys say they don’t want commitment, marriage, etc. They are doing the male equivalent of women saying they don’t want sex. There’s pretty much always a yes behind the no.

    I’ve seen guys do complete 180s on this stuff under the right circumstances …



  102.  #102Fernando on July 29, 2009 at 9:08 pm

    Gals: The guys you want (obviously) are as Erika describes in my opinion. There’s a lot of guys out there who don’t want a monogamous or even long term relationship with a woman, but these men are usually jaded for whatever reason.

    Most men really want to find a woman who they feel safe spending their lives with. As much as you need to feel safe to make love to a man, we need to trust you to commit to you. Much like women have been lied to by men trying to get into their pants, I’ve been lied to by women to get into a relationship, or for a million other reasons. It’s sad, and I don’t like the feelings I get (and have, this is a recently opened wound, still VERY tender) when I feel lied to or led on or whatever.



  103.  #103Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 9:12 pm

    Erika,
    huh? So my motto of listening to men and respecting some of their little stupid decisions/blurts-freudian slips as I see them,could be ………..defeatist? Or something? I admit I am very impatient with him and keep walking away when he starts this shit.(twice). I hear that and I feel like:RUN



  104.  #104Erika on July 29, 2009 at 9:13 pm

    One of my guys who’s pursuing me for marriage right now (and I might say yes) had a terrible divorce after a short marriage and told me a while back he never wanted to get married again. Now it’s quite a different story.



  105.  #105Erika on July 29, 2009 at 9:15 pm

    Nikita,

    They teach the PUAs all kinds of ways to get past a woman’s resistance to sex. They teach men to EXPECT a woman’s resistance, to see it as token resistance (cuz if she doesn’t resist she’s worried she’ll look like a “slut”).

    On a grander scale, it works the same way the other direction. In other words, stop taking it all so literally lol 😉



  106.  #106heartbeat on July 29, 2009 at 9:50 pm

    I have that dream too, Fernando (just like the Abba song, eh?) 😉

    In fact – I’m in it! All it took was a little faith and the consideration that the world might actually be different from my wounded perception.

    Sometimes the nightmare sneaks through but I can spot it now.



  107.  #107Nikita on July 29, 2009 at 9:51 pm

    Erika, so if he doesn’t resist marriage on some level he’s pussy whipped? Or something if we inverse the theory-applied to the male gender. Token resistance to marriage.



  108.  #108heartbeat on July 29, 2009 at 9:58 pm

    Rori your post made me think. And what I’m reminded of is the Cycle of Learning…. i.e. I became skilled at toxic relationships, then, unlearning those skills, I felt awkward, deliberate, but conscious. Open to a new perspective. And finally new skills feel natural and fluid.

    Like learning to drive a car wrongly. Then having lessons to correct the fault. (hey I really did this! I drove for years before I had a proper lesson, I got about fine but… aw my poor instructor, bless him lol)



  109.  #109heartbeat on July 29, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    Ooops my last comment was intended for the twisted dark forces post



  110.  #110Mercedes on July 30, 2009 at 6:52 am

    Fernando: I like your dream. A lot.



  111.  #111DocK on July 30, 2009 at 8:45 am

    I like the dream, too.

    So what gets in the way? Well, we learn, primarily from whatching our own parents’ relationship (and other grown-ups around us). Unfortunately, it seems to be the rare case where someone remembers their parents having a relationship where displays of affection (nothing vulgar) are made in front of them and where they see these two people who know how to speak to each other – even when they disagree – with clarity and kindness.

    We have the media shoving stories of infidelities down our throats feeding the mistrust that women already feel towards men.

    We have men being taught phrases like “pussy-whipped” – god forbid it be OK for a man to really value his woman – MUST make fun of him for it!

    Then there’s music – I love rock and hip hop music but I don’t like the attitude towards women. I can take a joke now and them but it gets old.

    And what about our culture’s attitude towards sex? We push guys to be the stud and crucify women for owning there sexuality equally.

    We’re scared to death to teach sex-education but what we really should be teaching is love-making education.

    WOW!!! I know this sounds like I don’t believe the dream can be reality – but I do believe it!

    I just know that in the face of all of this – it takes a strong person to hold onto the consciousness of truth. I know I have to practically plug up my ears every time I hear co-workers and friends saying horrible things about men. Sure, there are som “bad” guys out there – but women have their faults too.

    I believe that what we are all looking for is the Beloved in form – in this life. Many people think I am odd for this, but I believe we seek that passionate, amazing, deep, playful relationship that the poet Rumi spoke of while he was dancing.

    I wish I could give you a taste of
    the burning fire of Love.
    There is a fire
    blazing inside of me.
    If I cry about it, or if I don’t,
    the fire is at work,
    night and day.
    People make clothing to cover their intellect,
    but the heart of Lovers
    is a shroud,
    inflamed in golden hues of Love.
    (Rumi)



  112.  #112cookie on July 30, 2009 at 10:54 pm

    So I’ve been quietly keepin up w these posts. But now I’m ready to share. So originally when I entered the relationship I’m in my bf’s family was welcoming, callin n sending presents inviting me to occasions etc. At that time he was estranged from them so contact w them centered around me, or so it seemed. Over the yrs, he has improved the relationship w his mom n his sisters have more access to him independent of me. Throughout this time I’ve built a relationship w one of his sisters. I believed we were



  113.  #113cookie on July 31, 2009 at 4:52 am

    Becomin friends but it has been become painfully obvious that they were ingenuine n only interestd in befriendin me to find an in with him bc he could turn his back on them but not on me. Now I’m the butt end of their jokes about our relationship n me stayn in it. This particular sister has said some very hurtful things to me directly many of which I’ve disgested for fear of creating waves btwn him me n them. But now I feel extremely uncomfortable around them I told him of my feelings n he said not to



  114.  #114cookie on July 31, 2009 at 5:06 am

    Worry about them but that is very hard to do esp when they have respect for everyone else’s relationship but ours. I expressed my feelings to said sister n was told that I have issues n was basically brushd off. She texts me every day but I don’t want to continue any relationshp w her, it feels fake n obligatory. I need two speeches, probably more. I need to stand up for myself even that means creatin enemies. I’ve never done this before usually I just retreat from confrontation but what if we do get



  115.  #115cookie on July 31, 2009 at 6:47 am

    Get married n have children? I don’t want to cower from them forever. I feel annoyed n unsure as to how much this has an influence on us. I feel like everyone is vying for his love n attention n it best serves him when I’m not communicating with his family bc in the past he family has sided with me n told me his trangressions. I would appreciatee feedback on delivering these speeches n setting boundaries w him n them. Please help!



  116.  #116Erika on July 31, 2009 at 7:57 am

    Another one (very unusual for me) —

    “I feel disgusted by the way you have treated me. I have not been able to find any way to feel good about the dishonesty and lack of regard for my trust and my feelings. Please do not contact me anymore.”



  117.  #117heartbeat on July 31, 2009 at 3:16 pm

    Cookie I would feel confident to find the right words in the moment if I felt clear inside myself as to what my boundaries were.

    I would write myself a manifesto that felt good and keep it with me to read and amend until I felt steadfast.

    When I do this I find I usually shorten it into a couple of sentences. This makes it so much easier if/when I need to speak, but I find things often shift when I’m clear inside – without me having to say anything.

    My vibe shifts and others pick up on it.

    Hope that helps!



  118.  #118alias girl on July 31, 2009 at 5:12 pm

    cookie. for me i like to get all my feelings out like my anger and stuff by myself. i punch the air etc. because i really don’t want to punch actual people but sometimes i feel That angry.

    and then i might write out all my feelings. ALL of them. but i usually do this for myself only (not sure if that is the healthiest way but that’s what i do). or talk to my teddy bear about it. he’s a pretty unbiased listener and oddly has a really good sense of humor.

    then i might figure out What I Want. A desire to build intimacy is going to be a different speech than a “Eff off i am tired of your crap” speech. i know this firsthand. 🙂

    the second will tend to alienate people that you really actually care about. I know this first hand. ah well. i forgive myself.

    but that might be a start to getting to what and how you want to say and express your feelings and desires. these kinds of things can feel Very Scary. at least for me. and we can’t really predict/control people’s reactions.

    but i feel very supportive of you practicing and establishing boundaries and expressing yourself.



  119.  #119heartbeat on August 1, 2009 at 8:36 am

    AG I love your comment to Cookie, it feels so bubbly and full of emotion. I’ve been feeling a bit shut down, I’ve been ill all week, though I feel better after a trip to town and some new clothes. I smiled at teddy, as you know I have one too.

    I felt startled at the contrast in how our two comments read – I was feeling compassion and yet I haven’t expressed that. I feel curious if maybe I flatline when I’m sick or tired, something happens anyway. Hmmm…

    i feel happy you are in a good place, AG 🙂

    Cookie I hope things are working out for you. x



  120.  #120Bethany on August 1, 2009 at 5:40 pm

    Rori, I believe you said you wanted to use the speech I gave about gray-area sex stuff–that’s cool if you still want to use it, and you can say Bethany.

    Speech about Money:
    When my “boyfriend” wanted me to spot him money for the rest of our trip to Ireland (he ran out of cash four days before the trip ended and also told me he couldn’t pay for the car we’d rented which I put down on my credit card), I said “I feel really weird having you owe me so much money…I don’t want our relationship to feel like a business transaction” or some approximation of that. It was an on-the-spot speech and not written. He said “I thought you’d understand…I would do the same for you…there are so many opportunities in Ireland and this is a team effort…” I said “I do understand…” and that was kind of it. I don’t know if it worked because he stopped wanting to be physical with me after I said that. I feel afraid that I emasculated him.

    Speech about Sex: Before he stopped wanting to do anything in bed, the most “action” I got after stopping giving him blow jobs (no servicing) was him rolling me over and rubbing on my back until he was done. It totally made me feel like a blow-up doll and gross and I think the best “speech” I could have said would be “NO,” but for some reason when that happens I just freeze and can’t express anything and then I just get cold and tight and feel disgusted and worthless. I don’t know if that’s a trauma thing, because I’ve never been sexually assaulted so I don’t know why I would react that way. If I could say no, I would also say “I feel very disconnected right now…I don’t want to do this…” For some reason sex is a power thing with me: I’ve always been able to keep real intimacy away through sex (never have had an orgasm with a guy, maybe once but it wasn’t through intercourse).

    I really liked Tinque’s speech about porn…very to-the-point and heartfelt.



  121.  #121Sunshine on August 1, 2009 at 11:58 pm

    My speech:

    I do not have any expectations except for you to be truthful and honest with me and I will be the same with you.



  122.  #122YellowMelo on August 7, 2009 at 10:34 am

    Aha! There’s my linkback up there…

    Been creeping around on Siren Island for a while, so I may as well say Hi 🙂

    Although, I think everyone’s kinda moved on from this post but hey…



  123.  #123Brigette on August 11, 2009 at 9:13 am

    Rori I had been dating my guy for 8 months. I still like him alot but Im not sure if He feels te same. He wanted to move in with me. I felt it was too soon. expecially since he also lost his job. I had suggested places for him to work but I don’t feel like he put forth an effort since it paid alot less than what he was used to. He called his self being just friends with his exgirlfriend of 4 years that he said he used to love but complained about the way she treated him his kids and she moves to new locations every 3 to 6 months (she has no stability) He claims they have broken up over 6 times. He has always lived with women. He tells me Im the best thing that ever happened to him and If I was not around at his lowest point he would probably be dead or in jail. He told me he never wanted the woman back and claims that they are not together. For some reason or another she came to my job and ask another co worker if she was me. That day I was not there and she has not come back. What was the purpose of her coming to my job. (Her and I work in the same building but I never knew she knew about me im wondering what she wanted) I told him about it he sounded angry and said that he would say something to her about trying to check up on him. He had talked about reconciling but does not seem serious. He used to call every other day then it went to once a week now its once every two weeks He was invited to go away with me for the 4th of July this was planned before we broke up The end of May. ( I broke up with him because I suspected something when he stopped answering my calls we used to talk on the phone 3 times a day and would see each other every day) He said he still wanted to go out of town but never showed up. He made up an excuse why he didn’t show after the holiday was over. When he calls again how sould I handle it. I dont want him to think that I am chasing him. This seems to be what the other lady is doing. She has been married 4 times to abusive husbands. He is the only one that has not abused her. She keeps trying to get him to marry her. I want him back one day I am mad and cant stand him. The next day I am really hurt. When I talk to him I am always decent no matter how im feeling so he does not know how I really feel what should I do since his calls are slowing down. He didnt have a phone after he lost his job. Now he claims he has a phone I guess he thought I was going to ask him for the number or get it off of the caller id. I did neither please email me back personally If you can. Im hurt and need advice and Im wondering is there any hope. Do you take phone calls if so leave your number . I think I am very different from the other women and I am not letting him have his way. Is it possible he could have went back to her because he knew he didn’t have to put forth so much effort. He talks about wantindg to improve his life but he keeps going back to his stagnated lifestyle or environment. Friends and the type of women that he is used to. He told me that I was a different type of women and he used to always give me high praise because of the way I did things and handled situations.



  124.  #124Rori Raye on August 11, 2009 at 12:06 pm

    Brigette, welcome, and I’m sorry your heart is hurting so much, and…well…can you step back for a moment and get a bigger view of this? It doesn’t matter what he’s doing or not doing. Because he SURE isn’t doing the job for YOU. That’s all that counts. Please, please, please – pretty please STOP THINKING about this man, stop worrying about him, stop trying to MAKE him love you and focus on YOU. DATE. Circular Date. You’ll get so much help here to turn your life and your self-esteem around….please look for it, take it, and work with it. Love, Rori



  125.  #125LJ on August 17, 2009 at 6:56 pm

    Help. I feel so angry and hurt right now. I feel really anxious and horrible inside. i had finally gotten the courage after several months to tell my guy how I’ve been feeling inside. Rather than throw it on him, since I knew that wasn’t going to work. I tried to set up an appointment to talk with him. I called him and told him I had to be honest w/ him. I told him how i was feeling confused about us and was feeling disconnected from him and wanted to feel connected with him. He seemed kinda hesitant but as we got off the phone, it was agreed that he would let me know the next day when we could get together. He never did. 5 days have gone by, and not a word about it. I have completely backed off from him and haven’t called, or texted him about it or anything. It’s extremely difficult for me because we work together and I see him daily and walk by him. I am cordial when i see him but don’t approach him at all and don’t say anything else but “Hi”. It really hurts me. I really care for him. I have so much I want to say and I feel he doesn’t care about my feelings. What confused me even more is that he sent me a text that basically was inviting me out of town in a couple weeks. I ignored it, but a day later texted back that it sounded fun but needed to check my schedule. I don’t know if he was leaning forward or if this was some sort of game playing tactic to cover up the fact that he didn’t get back to me to talk. It’s been 5 days, and that text was the only communication we have had aside from a “hi” at work. I’m even more confused now. I feel awkward around him at work, and angry because we are not talking. It’s painful to me. I feel like telling him this but don’t know if I should approach him again after he already knows i wanted to talk. I’m caught between leaning forward and leaning back. I feel i don’t understand and i feel i can’t just walk away without saying something…
    ..



  126.  #126Fernando on August 17, 2009 at 9:15 pm

    LJ: It feels like he’s not interested. Whatever the reason, leaning in isn’t doing you any favors, and I think that doing so is like a drug. You feel better now, but you’re going to hurt even more later.

    I think the invitation out of town was probably because he thinks he can get sex from you easily, not out of any real emotional connection.

    If you still want him, lean back. Circular date. Actually, follow all of Rori’s advice. 😉



  127.  #127Rori Raye on August 17, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    LJ – Circular Date. You in this situation is the classic model for how Circular Dating can change your life…this man is not doing the job. Flat out not doing it. Go turn on your life. Love, Rori



  128.  #128LJ on August 20, 2009 at 1:01 pm

    Thanks Fernando and thanks Rori,..i posted a new comment under in the section dealing with anger.
    It tells a lil more about what happened recently. I confronted him yesterday. The anger started flooding out. At some points, I used feeling messages, it didn’t stay that way. It seems our conversation ended with a breakup. I’m devastated on the inside, and just don’t understand. A part of me feels better that I got stuff off, another part feels that i let my anger out in the wrong way, and it is my fault for how the conversation transpired and how it ended. Please find my post for today when u get a chance. I would love your feedback.
    Thank You.
    Lydia



  129.  #129Kacy on August 31, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    Hi, How should I feel about lost “feeling moments?” If an incident happens and @ the moment, you know you are upset, but can’t find words for the feelings, or you are caught off guard, and thus you say nothing and just let it slide, but are unsettled inside and still upset, should you just let it go and try to be more in the moment in the future or can you bring it up in your next conversation, or the next day? Could you for instance say: “Can I share something with you?”….. Yesterday I felt very dissappointed that we were not able to actually get together for lunch or dinner when you asked me.” “I love spontenaity and grabbing moments on the fly.” ….. What do you think? ….. However because of the distance between us and our work schedules it is more of a challenge to actually make things work.” What do you think?” ….. “I don’t want to miss opportunities to see you because I don’t get enough notice ahead of time that an opportunity has come up for us to see each other.” …What do you think? Because of this I would like more notice so I can plan or arrange things.” … What do you think?

    Side Note: I do love spontenaity.. however this has been an issue between us and is a concern I have because my man has pretty severe commitment fears and issues. The past month he has made tremendous movement forward towards commitment with me, to the point of having “marriage conversations.” I owe much of this movement to applying Rori’s Tools in “Have the relationship you want” and “Commitment Blueprint”. … Last week especially he opened up in a Big way… but now I feel him withdrawing a little, due to his fears. I am stepping back and letting him do what he needs to do. This movement forward came about after an incident about a month ago when I told him that I needed to “be with”, touch, smell, laugh and love the man that I am in love with and that I was going to step back and let the pressure off of him, since he was having difficutly making opportunities to see me because of his commitment fears. After a week he called me and was ALL THERE. Making plans and talking marriage etc. This week however I see him back sliding a little. He still calls everyday 2 to 3 times and tells me how much he loves me etc. but is stepping back a little on making legitimate opportunities to see me. I believe its because, he opened himself up and made himself so vulnerable last week, that he’s running a little scared again. That’s okay with me, I have just stepped back and been an invitation to him when he calls and I’m keeping myself busy. Today however the incident happened that I refer to above. He calls me at the last minute to ask if I want to meet for lunch.( He lives about 3 hours away and knew he was coming into town for some health and business issues, spoke with me on the phone last evening and again early this morning but couldn’t commit to making any definate plans with me ahead of time or even mention that he was contemplating it) He asked me over the phone twice what my work schedule was and knew from that conversation that I was working in a town quite close to where he was going to end up being. I couldn’t pull away at the time that he blew through that area but it felt to me that he knew I likely wouldn’t be able to because I had told him what my day’s schedule was going to be over the phone. Then later in the evening about 5:30 he calls and wants to know if I’m still in the town where I worked so he could meet up with me for dinner. He knew from the conversation earlier in the day that I would be leaving that town much earlier and would be coming back to where I live… so it would be a little impractical for me to drive all the way back. He even commented somewhat jokingly… “Well, make sure you take note that I asked you to lunch and to dinner today but our schedules just wouldn’t allow it.” If he had brought up DINNER when we discussed lunch and given me a heads up I could have arranged it. His second invitation was so unexpected that it caught me off guard and thus I did not bring forth any “feeling messages” about the “Last minute” invitation which felt to me like he was placating me about making efforts to get together. So again, can or should I go back and address this with him? This habit of asking me at the last minute has come up before, so is not new. Should I not have any conversation about it and simply turn down invitations from him when he asks me at the last minute when I know for a fact that he could very well make the plans a day ahead. I am still struggling so much with being in the moment with my feelings and feeling prepared to bring them up when they happen. I seem to question not only the feelings but whether this is something I should even address, ( or am I being too sensitive about this or that?) I think of all the right things to say when the event if over!



  130.  #130Rori Raye on September 1, 2009 at 12:48 pm

    Kacy, I’ll just address your first question…cleaning up AFTER is what “speeches” are all about. They give you the chance to express what you didn’t express. Even after years. And the way you put it right here is perfect. It’s never too late. Long distance sucks. Men are simply not as able to deal when they’re not physically close to you, smelling you… We do better because of our “longing” and romance genes. Love, Rori



  131.  #131JC on September 2, 2009 at 10:51 am

    Hi,

    I been with my boyfriend for over a year. i want to know if he really want to have a family with me (marry & have kids). I don’t know if he still have his ex-girlfirend in mind. I kind of confuse. I don’t know how to express myself. Please advise. Please e-mail me at mhoong1@gmail.com.



  132.  #132Eileen Mary on September 3, 2009 at 1:34 pm

    Reconnected with an old boyfriend from 20 years ago on Facebook. He is in Texas, I am in NJ, so it is also long distance. He has many serious problems right now, House burnt down in Oct. 2008 and still not done. Lost job in Jan. 2009 and ended up renting a room from his ex and they have been fighting.

    Last phone call he asked me to send him an email reminder if I had not heard from him in a while. The alarm went off in my head and all I could think was “Not the Momma”. I said I am old fashioned and don’t call men. He said just sent a howdy by email to give him a nudge. I just didn’t answer. Another of his issues is he doesn’t like to complain and currently his life is just resolving problems. I have had an email that said bad day with the builder, not in a talkative mood.

    Should I send him an email making it plain I am not going to send reminders. I came up with this feeling message and need some feedback.

    “I don’t feel comfortable sending reminders so we stay in touch. Doing that makes me feel unimportant and I don’t like feeling that way. So I won’t be doing that.

    I don’t feel you are complaining to me relating your house status. I feel taken into your trust. Besides our conversations always turn to us making each other laugh.

    What do you think?”

    New at this and need a critical eye to read this message before I send it. Not sitting home waiting for him and have been going out meeting other men.



  133.  #133Kacy on September 4, 2009 at 5:54 am

    Thanks Rori, Well, I feel a little silly! The very next day, my guy called early in the day and asked me if he could take me to dinner and if I wanted to drive over to his cabin. (We have our favorite Mex. restaurant near the town where his cabin is and it is the cabin (HOME!) that our relationship got off of the ground about a year ago, when I was hired by him to design the remodeling project for him, so it didn’t bother me to drive over. ) We had an incredible time together and he was so there and so open and vulnerable with me. Telling me I am the love of his life and that I mesmerize him. (IMAGINE THAT!!!) Even sharing with me that sometimes his love for me is a little scarey for him but that it feels so good and natural for us to be together. He also said that he finds it incredible that after wanting me in his life for 38 years that his dream has finally come true. (We dated when I was 19 and he was 23. I got pregnant and lost the baby and we eventually broke up, I moved on and got married and had 4 children which ended in a divorce about 6 years ago. This guy called me 4 1/2 years ago when he heard I was single again but I blew him off for numerous reasons. When he recontacted me for the cabin project a year ago I accepted and it was then that he revealed that he has thought of me all these years and has carried his love for me in his heart for 38 years.
    Well anyway, last night he called and said he wanted to fly me over to the Peninsula for the Labor Day weekend. It still seemed a little last minute to me…. since it’s a holiday weekend and requires me to trave. But I went ahead and accepted. He wants so show me some foreclosure properties he’s considering investing in. I think it will be another incredible weekend!!

    He has asked me twice in the last week, what shoe size I wear, in a very subtle way.(I can’t imagine he wants to buy me a pair of shoes since he teases me all the time about how many I already have!) I’m wondering if he knows that your shoe size is usually indicitive of your ring size!! Hmmmmmm! I’ll keep ya posted. I’ve enjoyed your Commitment Blueprint program tremendously!



  134.  #134Rori Raye on September 4, 2009 at 9:58 am

    Eileen, it’s not so much a matter of what you do, here, but how you feel about it. There’s so little to lose here, this is an experiment. Your email is wonderful – if you want to respond to his recent email with this one, that would be fine…Love, Rori



  135.  #135Rori Raye on September 4, 2009 at 10:06 am

    Hi, JC, and Welcome. You’ll find all kinds of help here, read everything you can. It will help you put together a speech to find out what’s going on, and you’ll also find exercises to help you feel stronger so that you can stand up for yourself. Love, Rori



  136.  #136Eileen Mary on September 5, 2009 at 12:17 pm

    Thank you Rori for your response. This man was the love of my life. He always made me feel appreciated and was never judgmental, great chemistry, so I do feel there might be something to lose. We were much younger and I was going through an ugly divorce two decades ago. Now he is 52 and I am 60. I feel the stuff is getting in the way more than the distance. He has looked for a job in NJ.

    I want to explore the possibility and don’t want to push him away. He is a totally different man from my two ex husbands and the 8 year relationship men. They were products of abusive and toxic mothers. Yes I saw my pattern and am working on breaking it by focusing on myself. I rather experiment locally and do go out and meet men. He has just stuck in my heart and said I have been in his.

    Love and many thanks for your site Eileen



  137.  #137Jennifer on September 8, 2009 at 1:58 pm

    Just wanted to run my proposed card/note by you before I send it.

    “Hi, I know I called you the other day, but maybe you are not ready to talk. And I respect that. I know right now you must be very angry and frustrated with me and I can’t and don’t expect forgiveness. And this apology is actually somewhat selfish, in that I am doing this for me, so that I can put the past, where it belongs, in the past. I wanted to apologize for behaving so badly during our relationship and after. I felt insecure and so I was needy and clingy. I felt like my only redeeming qualities were my generosity and helpfulness and so I was controlling. I used guilt trips and tried to change you when things didn’t seem to be going well. And I made you feel bad when I wasn’t happy. You aren’t responsible for me feeling happy, I am. I feel badly that I didn’t let you know that I heard what you were saying. I know in the past you said that you thought I was creating my own problems sometimes. To be perfectly frank, I just wasn’t able to figure out how to change that until now. I spent so much time holding onto the past that I kept doing the same things over and over again. I finally realized that I needed to let go of the past so I won’t miss out on the future. There is much more to me than what I do for other people. The past is, just that, the past, I don’t regret it, the parts that were good, were wonderful, the parts that were bad, I’ve chalked up to experience.



  138.  #138Kacy on September 8, 2009 at 8:08 pm

    Hi Rori, Had my weekend with my guy and all was wonderful. On the 3rd day however, despite us being wonderful, and me being well centered and careful about not leaning forward (even finding time to do some walking, reading etc. w/o him, so as not to make him feel closed in) and us having some very close and intimate discussions etc. he began to display some of his characteristic “Commitment Phobia” behavior by withdrawing emotionally and physically. I believe it is all due to his CPism. As I have researched this subject I feel that there are some men that have this issue and it makes them more fearful than usual to get to that commitment no matter what “Tools” a woman uses. They seem to Row the relationship but then at crucial points they jump back scared. I feel this is what happend this weekend. He brought up our future, and did alot of future talking with me and was very open and vulnerable with me and then it appears that he realized how vulnerable he had been and shut down. I was very careful not to future talk or pursue any marriage talk on my own. I just let him be the one to discuss whatever he felt comfortable discussing. Anyway, have you ever looked at the web site called http://www.commitmentphobia.com? It suggests that these men will always be this way, and that no matter what “Tools” you use to get them to commitment they will always shut down and bow out because they really need to see a professional to get over their phobia. Do you feel this way also? Do you have any other opinions about someone who freezes up at the exact moment that he is almost ready to commit and what someone in my position can say in a power speech to let them know that I am are aware of his deep fear and yet my needs are also important. How can it be suggested that he may want to do some research on the subject or see a counselor about it?



  139.  #139Rori Raye on September 9, 2009 at 2:02 pm

    The only thing that works with a commitment phobe is to keep enough of your own life going so that he KNOWS if he doesn’t move, he’s going to lose you. YOU have to be the vulnerable one. Strong on the inside, soft on the outside. Love, Rori



  140.  #140Kacy on September 9, 2009 at 9:29 pm

    Hi Rori, Thanks for your reply. If I am hearing you correctly I think you are saying that I need to continue staying busy with my Circular dating and that it may be time for me to give him a power speech about still seeing him and respecting his decision about whether or when he commits to me but that I’m not going to close off my options unless I am in a committed relationship so I will be seeing other men (but will only be sexually involved with him) In what way specifically, in dealing with a man with CP, do I need to be the VULNERABLE one and yet strong on the inside?

    How do you know when its time to have a power speech with your man? Does the time come when I just need to do it for myself? We’ve been seeing each other for 11 months now.

    One other question Rori, how do you handle it when you share a feeling message with your man that you are feeling a big and sudden disconnect ; (because he has withdrawn and shut down) and he looks at you and says he thinks you’re just being overly sensitive and denies your experience? I don’t believe he is being purposely mean, but doesn’t realize that he has withdrawn and shut down because of his fears, so he doesn’t get that I would pick up on that, and thus if I bring it up he looks at me like “What are you talking about?” Would you just say something like “Well thats what it feels like to me, and I have to believe my own instincts and feelings.”



  141.  #141Kacy on September 9, 2009 at 9:38 pm

    If I am hearing you correctly I think you are saying that I need to continue my Circular dating and that it may be time for me to give him a power speech about still seeing him and respecting his decision about whether or when he commits to me but that I’m not going to close off my options unless I am in a committed relationship so I will be seeing other men (but will be sexually EXCLUSIVE with him) In what way specifically, in dealing with a man with CP, do I need to be the VULNERABLE one and yet strong on the inside?

    How do you know when its time to have a power speech with your man? Does the time come when I just need to do it for myself?

    One other question Rori, how do you handle it when you share a feeling message with your man that you are feeling a big and sudden disconnect ; (because he has withdrawn and shut down) and he looks at you and says he thinks you’re just being overly sensitive and denies your experience? I don’t believe he is being purposely mean, but doesn’t realize that he has withdrawn and shut down because of his fears, so he doesn’t get that I would pick up on that, and thus if I bring it up he looks at me like “What are you talking about?” Would you just say something like “Well thats what it feels like to me, and I have to believe my own instincts and feelings.”



  142.  #142Rori Raye on September 10, 2009 at 11:32 am

    The answer, Kacy, about how to reply if you use a Feeling Message and get a cold response, like his (and part of the cold response may be the exact words,body language, and vibe you used and had at the moment you delivered it) — is all part of this system. You respond to his response with HOW IT FEELS. You could say “Oh…now I feel weird and a bit angry…” Now I feel unheard and even angrier.” “Now I feel sad and unheard…” And you keep going either until you feel good and melt and connect to him, or you walk away. It’s a process. It takes practice…Love, Rori



  143.  #143Jennifer on September 10, 2009 at 11:45 am

    Jennifer says:
    Can you help me with a letter to get him to want to try again with me? Right now I can’t even get him to look at me. He won’t take my calls. Though I only called once in the last two weeks and he wasn’t home but his parents were supposed to give him the message. I had given him some space after two months of driving him crazy with texts and calls none of which he responded to. Can’t say I blame him though, I appeared desperate in them in looking back. Every time he sees me he turns away and I really do love him, I am not sure how to reach him though. He broke up with me in April as I said I had been needy, clingy and pushy and worse yet he was suffering from depression at the time. He was acting angry towards me and I said to him if you want me to leave you alone for a couple of days, that’s okay. He told me he would have to think about it and then two days later he broke up with me. Now he is back to work and doing much better now and I really would like to get him back. I know I screwed up but I am not sure how to make him see that my intentions were well meaning.



  144.  #144Kacy on September 17, 2009 at 10:20 pm

    Hi Rori, I’m a little confused. Can you help? I realize that I have several questions here, but as many times as I have gone over all of your info. I am still not quite sure how to handle this. When I began applying your “tools” to myself and my relationship with my guy, they worked way beyond belief. He began rowing the boat like you wouldn’t believe and making comments to me that every woman would want to hear. As I commented in prior messages he even began making “future plans with me.”
    There was no formal asking me to marry him; but about everything leading up to that, which was a HUGE step forward with this guy who has Commitment Fears that are quite severe. After about 3 1/2 weeks however he has stepped back and some of the luster of his emotional vulnerability has subsided. He is still calling me 2 to 3 times a day and telling me that he loves me etc. and has made a few comments about our future, but they feel to me like placating. As is typical of men with CP he is pulling away in order to make himself feel safe again and not being too emotionally vulnerable after having opened up to me to the degree that he did for 3 1/2 weeks. As I’ve mentioned before we live about 3 1/2 hours from each other, so much of the time our dialog is over the phone. Whenever he calls, I answer and am an Invitation to him. I am leaning way back in that I do not call or text or initiate anything with him at all. I have gone through your Commitment Blueprint CD’s at least 4 times. I attribute my success so far with your information. Thank You!! I know that what is happening is that he has gotten locked into his FEAR pattern again and is pulling back and freaking out about having made these comments to me about marriage etc. This is typical CP behavior. I realize that you answered me last week and said to me that the only way to handle this (with a commitment phobe) is to keep enough of my life going so that he realizes that if he doesn’t move forward, he will lose me. I assume you are referring to a power speech to communicate this to him as well as continuing my “Circular Dating.”
    Since we are seperated by distance and I dont always know when I will see him, can I have the Power Speech over the phone. Is this the time for me to have a power speech with him, Letting him know that I do not want to shut down my options thus while I want to continue seeing him, I will also be seein? others. Should I refer to my knowledge of his CPism in this speech and that I realize that it is due to that that he withdraws? Should I refer to his withdrawal and how it has hurt me at all?
    I feel some real anger, hurt and dissappointment that he drew me in emotionally and is now stepping back due to his fears.Its making it hard for me to be an open Invitation to him when he calls because of the anger and dissappointment I feel. Should I take all of his calls or step back even in regards to answering his calls at times.

    (I truly believe his comments were genuine as he had nothing to gain from lying or being deceitful to me, he is just displaying the typical CP behavior.)
    I know you commented in Commitment Blueprint that he may get angry when I have this power speech about seeing others. How would I respond if he says that if I’m going to see other men that he will see other women. I know he won’t actually do that, but I want to know how I should respond to that. Should I expect that after I deliver this Power Speech that he may withdraw further for a period of time, while he contemplates how this will effect our relationship? I’m feeling some anxiety about doing this right. Thank you Rori.



  145.  #145Brookelynn Steele on September 21, 2009 at 6:30 am

    i have been dating this guy for a month now and he still hasn’t opened up to me and i feel like i do all the talkin and decsion making “what should i do, Rori?”



  146.  #146Carmela on September 21, 2009 at 12:46 pm

    I have been away for a while working on myself and now I’m back and I like this new section on speeches. That is one of the more difficult things for me. I am seeing my ex here and there again and I need a speech to state my boundaries and let him know that I don’t want the same relationship that we had before. I know he has some love for me, but I don’t know that he is any more ready to marry me now than he was before, but I don’t want to wait around. So I have met another man who is an acquaintance of a friend. I want to make it clear to him that I do want to date him but I won’t be just dating him. He sounds like the type of guy who just wants you to date him from what I have been told and he seems a little needy. Like he thought I told him I would call him ( not my style), then he got all upset when I didn’t call him and he had to call me. I have been wondering what I would need to say to him next time he called, then he called but I didn’t answer because I wasn’t sure how to say I need for you to relax, we just met and I’m probably not going to call you much but that doesn’t mean I’m not interested in you, I’m just not much of a phone person. Any insight you can offer would be great. I’m going to go back and re-read some of the things I have been reading in these 2 posts. Thanks.



  147.  #147Rori Raye on September 21, 2009 at 2:50 pm

    Brookelynn, Welcome…and the first thing to do is STOP — STOP talking and STOP making decisions – and START dating other men – Circular Dating, you can learn how here and in my Targeting Mr. Right program – right along with him. Love, Rori



  148.  #148Rori Raye on September 21, 2009 at 3:45 pm

    Carmela, I think you’ve got the makings of a great speech here.. “I don’t feel comfortable calling men much, but that doesn’t mean I don’t feel interested in you. It feels good to be with you. Also, it would feel great to let you know where I’m at with this whole “dating” thing — (and then you do the no boyfriend speech here…) Love, Rori



  149.  #149Eileen Mary on September 22, 2009 at 11:57 am

    Hi Rori.

    Thanks a lot for the advice. I sent that email and got an email response that didn’t even address it. I waited to respond to it till after I knew he would be back from a trip to see his Mom. He called on his way home, but I missed the call and didn’t even see it on my phone. Found out about the call after I answered his last email. He called again last night after my friend sent him a hello on Facebook. Something I asked her not to do. Anyway it was a good conversation, but interrupted by my battery going dead, but with the plan to call me this afternoon after meeting with an insurance adjuster.

    In the short conversation he relayed to me he went off all the drugs the doctors have been prescribing for stress two days ago. Said thank my friend for the hello, it reminded him. I asked if the drugs are causing a memory problem and he said yes. He confided the stress over his house rebuild has so much anger built up in him by the end of the day he feels like he is going to explode. Practicing listening two and just said that’s understandable. So far the scheduled call is an hour late, so I am writing you instead of obsessing over if he will remember to call and thinking since it was my phone that died should I wait awhile and call him.

    On another note I am trying the circular dating on tagged. Now I feel like “Too many men not enough time”. Found one man that was very interesting. We exchanged a couple of emails about our interests and families, but then I got this email.

    “I AM NOT LOOKING FOR SEX OKAY I AM LOOKING FOR LONG TERM RELATIONSHIP”

    I responded with I don’t believe I wrote anything touching on the subject of sex. I would appreciate being treated as an individual and not one of your past bad experiences. The caps were not necessary.

    I am finding using your suggestion liberating and empowering. I feel more at peace with myself. Thanks for all you do. Love Eileen



  150.  #150Cassandra on September 22, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    Rori…..I am not sure how I missed this post either. I feel out of the loop! 😉

    Erika….I absolutely LOVE this!!
    ‘“I feel disgusted by the way you have treated me. I have not been able to find any way to feel good about the dishonesty and lack of regard for my trust and my feelings. Please do not contact me anymore.”’ This is exactly what I have been trying to think of to tell Charles with the do not contact me again part though….although I should most likely leave that part IN!! lol

    I had an experience last night/ this morning that I feel really really proud of that involved both boundaries and feeling messages. I wanted to share it here….Do you Sirens remember earlier this past summer even when I soooooo was not in a place to try circular dating?? Remember that dating site that I allowed my Mom to talk me into earlier this past summer? Well remember ‘dinner boy’…the one that asked me to come to his house because he had cooked me dinner? He had started calling me again recently. I had not returned any of his calls as he really creeped me out after a certain point but I chose to return his last call because I struggle with boundaries and decided that I was up for working on them and here was the PERFECT opportunity. Here is our conversation all via text message – which already on his part did not begin well as it as via text message…..but I am sooooo proud of myself for how I handled this and took care of ME and how I felt.
    Yesterday morning…..HIM: Brkfst at my place 2morrow 7:30am? (now keep in mind that we talked on the phone and met one time at the mall because we were both there and didn’t realize it until he called me. So there was no history/ dating/ anything. Can we say BOLD?! LOL)
    Me: WOW! Hi. I feel srprised to hear frm u aftr so long and supr srprised about the invitation.
    Him: Well I had been thnkng of u and wnted to c u.
    Me: I feel kind of weird about that but I do feel opn to meeting for breakfast at say… Starbux?
    Him: I planned 2 make you breakfast. I really want to c u.
    Me: It feels really odd 2 hear frm you like this out of the blue & I feel uncomfortable that u want to c me so bad when u haven’t even called me for months. I feel weird.
    Me: If u are open 2 meeting at Starbux I will check my schedule & get back 2 u later. ( because of our past dealings I knew where this was going but wanted to work on my boundaries and be totally aware of how I was feeling)
    Him: Well if u decide 2 come for breakfast let me know & I will get u directions.
    Me: k (I had no intention of going to his place for breakfast but didn’t want to discuss it anymore at this moment.)
    Later last night…
    Him: Well are u coming for breakfast? I REALLY want 2 c u.
    Me: I feel VERY uncomfortable & dismissed. I feel as though my suggestion 2 meet at Starbux has gone completely unadressed and that feels really icky 2 me.
    HIM: Look, I am trying to make time to see you and I am making sacrifices to see you early in the morning. Are you going to sacrifice too?
    Me: Wow! Now I am really feeling uncomfortable and manipulated. I don’t think that I would feel ok meeting at all at this point.
    Him: Cass…I didn’t mean anything by it….I just really want to see you. You coming?
    Me: I am not coming to your place, no. I don’t want to feel manipulated into doing something and none of this feels good to me.
    Him: I am trying to make time to see you here. You know I am busy with my son and his sports and training.
    Me: I am not feeling at all ok with this communication and as far as you making time to see me I don’t want to be fit in ‘between the cracks’.
    Him: So now I am just a ‘crack’? Is that it?
    Me: (I am REEEEAAAAALLLLLY getting to practice here!! YAYAY!! IT felt great!;-) ) I feel extremely uncomfortable having my words twisted into something that I did not say. I feel attacked and I feel defensive.
    Me: This communication does not feel good to me at all.

    At….312AM!!! I get a text from him again…..
    Him: I am thinking about you. Are you coming?
    Me: (the phone woke me up so I responded) I feel creepd out that you would txt me at 312AM! I feel irritated that you woke me up NO! I am NOT coming & I don’t feel comfortable communicating with you.
    END. Now I am quite sure that I made mistakes in here but WOW! DId that ever feel great to stand up for myself….stay true to my boundaries and NOT give a rip what HE was thinking or feeling! I feel that this was a huge huge learning experience for me…one that I needed so so badly and feel so thankful for. Even though His words felt really icky and controlling to me…I wanted to stick with it to really know how I was feeling and stick to my boundaries…no matter what….and I did!! I feel proud of my communication in this exchange and I feel that when it comes up again – not with him…I am sure I won’t hear from him again which is a good thing…but I meant with anyone else….I will be more able to handle it without getting flustered and nervous and fidgety. I actually feel that while I am still here in the house with Charles that this exchange will help me by leaps and bounds!! I feel good about this!! YAY!! For me! 🙂 🙂 🙂

    Love to all….
    Cass



  151.  #151Kacy on September 26, 2009 at 1:33 pm

    Hi, Well I delivered my power speech the other day about not wanting to close down all my options since T. isn’t ready to commit. Part of it was okay and true to what I have read about delivering power speeches and some of it (since the conversation extended beyond the “speech” at his direction) wasn’t. I got caught up in his dialog and some of his defensiveness and began to engage in too much dialog with him from my head! I had asked you, Rori, about whether I should bring up anything about his withdrawing from me emotionally, due to his commitment phobias and didn’t get an answer from you. I didn’t really intend to bring it into the conversation, but ended up doing so becasuse of some of his responses. I don’t feel real good about how the whole thing went down and feel some anxiety about that. It doesn’t feel to me that he’s going to move forward with me even though I made it clear that I’m not closing my options and have to look out for my own emotional wellbeing. HIs message to me was basically “Well, you have to do what you need to do but I’m not ready to walk down the isle yet. I think the only thing that will make you happy right now, is for me to give you a date as to when I want to marry you. I have shared with you many personal things about my finances, myself and my plans and I would not have done that if I didn’t intend to marry you at some point, but I’m not ready to make that commitment right now.” I responded by saying to him, “I feel you may not have heard me correctly. I am not attempting to put pressure on you about a commitment or a date, I’m letting you know, you can have all the time you need to decide that…but I love myself and care about my own emotional wellbeing and while you are deciding, I don’t want to close down my options.”!!! “I want to be with someone who is excited to marry me, that wants to move in that direction because they feel we can make each other happy, not find reasons that they just can’t do that now or at any time in the near future until everything is just so in their life.” At some point he said “I think you may have read more into my comments to you over the past few weeks about our future and the possibility of our marriage. I wasn’t communicating to you that this was something I was ready to commit to right now.”

    I felt real angry at that comment and that is where I
    went into my head rather than expressing my angry feelings to him. I was worried that I would look like a fool for reading too much into his “FUTURE” talk. I knew that his FUTURE talk was absolutely designed to give me hope and at that time that is what he wanted….. and that now he was just running scared again. So rather than saying to him “I feel real angry and embarrassed at appearing foolish for reading more into your dialog with me recently,” ….. this is where I said to him, “I feel that what has happened here is that due to your commitment fears, you have withdrawn from me and backed up from where you were. This has happened before with us T. and I am perceptive and intuitive enough to recognize it when it happens. I absolutely feel the withdrawal and shutdown of your connection to me as soon as it happens!!!” His response was “I can’t believe that after the wonderful, fun and lighthearted conversations we’ve had over the phone the past 3 weeks that you think I’m feeling FEAR about anything, or us!!” I said “It goes deeper than that T., its easy to be lighthearted and fun over the phone… its another thing to stay emotionally connected when it comes to commitment and fears surrounding that.” At the end of the conversation he made a special point of letting me know he loves me and said he’d call me later, which he did and has called 2 to 3 times a day since the conversation telling me at the end of each conversation how much he loves me, and calls me “baby”, “love” etc. just as he’s always done.

    Rori, I have your e-book and your CD program Commitment Blueprint, but I am SOOOO struggling with being able to know how to speak from my emotions and get out of my head. I have real issues about being able to do that. I feel so vulnerable when I even think about trying to share my feelings over issues with my man. I often can’t even identify the feelings I’m having soon enough to communicate them when I need to. It makes me surprised that he is able to connect to me to the degree he has. He has told me that he is so drawn to me and mezmorized by me, and I am the love of his life etc. So I think “Well maybe I’m not as closed down as I feel sometimes.” I often clam up and worry myself sick over having to address things. I would like to know if you have any video clips of practice sessions amounst women in your classes who are practicing sharing their real feelings with a man. Also, I did not get the DVD version of that program and thus I can’t quite visualize the dance positions w/o seeing them. Are they available on a clip anywhere? I also want to know
    specifically the exact steps I need to take to open myself up and educate myself about how to express myself from my feeling place. Perhaps it’s just my learning style, but I don’t feel I’m understanding this process from your material and making the kind of progress I would like to be making in regards to getting in touch with and expressing myself from my feelings as I would like to. I have listened to and practiced most of the steps in Commitment Blueprint over and over but can’t seem to make it my own. I feel discouraged. I wonder if Modern Siren gives more explicit detail about this Rori, but I haven’t even paid for all of Commitment Blueprint yet and am not in a position to purchase another program at this point. Do you have any suggestions about accomplishing a better understanding of this process that might help me grasp it better?



  152.  #152Kacy on September 26, 2009 at 1:36 pm

    Hi Rori, I know you are swamped and likely my last two messages have been overlooked. Could you go back and read my comment from Thursday Sept. 17th and also the one I left today and let me know of any helpful advice you may have on both. I appreciate it very much.



  153.  #153Eileen Mary on October 5, 2009 at 9:09 am

    Rori,

    I did sent the feeling message above with one edit, I left out, So I won’t be doing that.

    <<>>

    He didn’t say anything. At first I felt my feelings were ignored, but now he is initiating more contact and being more open about his health limitations with me. Turns out his request was because of side effects from medical treatments, but I am still getting more warmth in his emails and calls.

    Thanks to you I am leaning back, expressing my feelings and trusting my instincts more and more.

    Love Eileen



  154.  #154Janice on October 11, 2009 at 3:46 am

    my first and ever feeling message but I had to deliver it thru email because my husband get really defensive..

    “I felt a sudden warmth come across seeing your comment about the meatloaf and it put a smile on my face…
    I felt sad when your relationship status is claiming It’s Complicated…
    I was feeling happy and was thinking about you all night and wish you were by my side…I felt really upset and angry when I received the text that wasn’t meant for me…
    Overall, I am feeling very disconnected from this relationship, I am feeling lost and confused…



  155.  #155Amy on October 15, 2009 at 2:29 pm

    Rori,
    We’ve seen each other in other blog pages.

    I was feeling so positive about my relationship and like it was finally moving toward truly healthy, but the shut down (cave) instances were so confusing to me as many seemed without cause. And you explained to me that sometimes men do go into their cave for reasons that have nothing to do with us…and sometimes it is out of anger.

    I’ve been practicing your tools as much as I can, though I have to admit old habits die hard, and it takes a deliberate effort sometimes to lean back…and especially nod…when it feels like he’s being unfair. I’ve chosen to leave situations when he was out of bounds, letting him know that he had crossed a boundary. This stonewalling or cave dwelling is really an issue for me. I seem to be writing about something no one else is here, so I hope it is okay. This seems to be a boundary issue for me b/c all the emotions that what feels like abandonment bring up for me make me want to run and quit. I have to work at everything…I have to make a deliberate decision to love him and stay in it. Everything about me wants to run when he does this b/c it feels controlling and I’m so tired of hurting and being controlled.

    I want to talk to him about it. I want results, not more silent treatment. I don’t nag. I’m typically very encouraging and positive, yet when I do get upset about something or hurt by something, instead of pausing to see my point of view, he lets me know he thinks I’m being stupid and he attempts to control how I feel about it. When I try to explain my feelings, he first argues and tells me why that is stupid then he withdraws. I just feel like anything negative or critical is so fragile to bring up because it is such a struggle no matter how I go about it.

    Can you help me define this boundary? The stonewalling is causing too much stress for me.

    What I have so far:
    “I feel anxious and often angry when you choose to withdraw and shut me out. Often I don’t know the reason behind the silent treatment and I feel angry.

    I feel frustrated when you dictate to me how I should feel and I feel angry when you seem controlling. The stress that accompany these feelings is not tolerable for me. The health effects of that stress are making it hard for me to focus on my job and the kids.

    I feel afraid for our relationship if this behavior continues. It feels to me like it’s on it’s last leg. I feel like I have battled the emotions that result for me as long as I can.”

    I don’t know what to say next. I want to tell him in order to keep giving what I give to the relationship I need him to quit choosing this behavior, but I don’t guess that is the right thing. I know I shouldn’t threaten, and I don’t want to do that. I just feel like crying. I feel like all my attempts at loving me and being positive are just a big lie in this situation because all it takes is him suddenly withdrawing from me again (either without reason or because he is upset that I was displeased or hurt – even if all I say is, “I feel hurt by that”) and I am immediately anxious, angry, and then hurt because I have to work so hard to overcome those emotions. I am tired of working so hard and yet having to go through the same cycle. Will you help me do it right this time?



  156.  #156Kacy on October 15, 2009 at 7:35 pm

    Amy, I hope Rori answers your request. I have not had alot of luck with her answering my questions. I don’t think she uses this blog as an avenue to answer much. It has been very frustrating for me because I have purchased her e-book and her program Commitment Blueprint. I have tried to implement all of the tools as much as I am able. They seemed to work wonderfully with my man, until his commitment phobias came into play and thus I am in the same position with him now as I was in the beginning. I have tried to get more explicit information about my situation from Rori but my requests have not been addressed and it has caused me alot of stress and anxiety. I feel stuck w/o the resources I would like to have.
    This is just an idea, and I don’t know your whole situation or your man but,,, I am wondering if your man might be dealing with more than just going to his cave. Could it be that he has deeper issues which make him run away from intimate relationships or emotional connectedness? You might be interested in looking into Commitment Phobia on the internet. The one I have found most helpful although its honesty can be brutal is Commitmentphobia.com. I am not an expert on feeling messages or power speeches (although I have given a few) but I have to say that I like what you have written so far. It seems to me that the only other thing to include would be to let him know that you need to see changes in this situation or you will feel the need to protect yourself and seperate from the situation until he can understand why this keeps happening. I know this sounds scary and you may not be ready to make that decision but if you’ve had the conversation and shared the feelings and he continues to ignore them and rebuff you for your feelings that seems about the only thing left for you to do. I hope Rori will address this for you and I will be interested in what she says. I wish you well.



  157.  #157Amy on October 16, 2009 at 6:11 am

    Kacy,
    Thank you very, very much for your help. I’ll looking into the commitment phobia thing. I looked further into stonewalling yesterday afternoon and what I read was exactly what happens:
    “it is sometimes used as a means of control”
    “it creates excessive anxiety for the woman – and anger”
    “it damages the relationship, sometimes to the point of no return”
    “it removes the “relate” from the relationship, to the point where there is no relationship at all, which of course is damaging to the marriage…sometimes to the point it dissolves”
    All of these things validated me, but made me feel so sad at the same time. Powerless, in fact. So perhaps you are on to something…the why of it all. Why does he do it? What is he running from? He essentially tells me I am self destructive and fabricate it all. To give you an idea, yesterday we had what should have been a two-sentence disagreement with a two sentence resolution/makeup. But he got angry and tried to tell me why my feelings were wrong and stupid. Then he refused to talk to me further. We were not together for the afternoon. I called twice; he chose not to answer or return my calls. He was two hours late coming home. He did not call to let me know why. When he is not ignoring me, he calls to let me know when he’ll be 20 minutes late (and he answers or returns calls promptly). And when he is not in this mood…he never comes home that late. 30 minutes late tops. So, he tries to shove it onto me, but it isn’t me. I’m not a crazy woman imagining things or being “self destructive,” as he says. You know when you are being ignored and when someone refuses to talk to you or treat you with 1/2 the respect with which they’d treat a stranger.
    …just to explain a bit… Now…I’ll go look up what you suggested. Thanks again.



  158.  #158Kacy on October 16, 2009 at 6:01 pm

    Hi Amy, The only thing that came to my mind with your reply was that to truly lean back in a situation where you are being treated uinfairly would mean NOT calling him at all when this happens. Let him worry about where you are with the situation rather than you leaning forward and trying to fix it with a phone call. Perhaps, if possible, you could even make arrangements for someone to watch you children and go to coffee or dinner with a girlfriend so he knows you aren’t sitting home fretting about how he has treated you I know that can be very hard to do, but it feels to me that his not answering your calls was just another power trip on his part which he seems to pull alot. One technique that I have learned through Commitment Phobia is when a man accuses us of something negative (such as being overly dramatic or stupid etc.) is to simply say: “Yes, I may be stupid or dramatic…however this is how I feel.” By saying that, it doesn’t mean we agree with the assessment but we are ending that debate and moving back into the real issue. When we “agree” it takes the bite out of his comment and ends that part of the discussion and often makes the man actually come to our defense. It was hard for me to wrap my mind around that concept but when you read the reasons in their entirity it does make sense and I have used this process and it has been very successful. It seems that he needs to do a little worrying to bring him into a position of being open to looking at himself. I’m not an expert, obviously, or I would have my own situation figured out!! Ha! Let me know how things are. My empathy goes out to you!!



  159.  #159Amy on October 19, 2009 at 12:55 pm

    Thanks, Kacy.

    You don’t know how right you are about the phone calls. If I would not call, he would not have the opportunity to ignore me and I would not be hurt/upset/angry about it.

    I was angry that he chose not to come home on time and did not call to tell me he’d be late and that anger was only compounded by him refusing to answer my calls…then I was hurt on top of it. To me, his behavior is incredibly disrespectful and hurtful.

    We live a couple of states away from family and friends, otherwise I don’t think he’d get away with acting the way he does b/c I’d have places to go that would be easier and I could stay longer, if needed (rather than just going away for the afternoon or evening). I think he uses it to his advantage that I’m somewhat stuck without packing up and calling it quits altogether. I think he thinks these things are too small to be at my breaking point and I won’t actually leave. There have been a couple of times that I just didn’t think I could take it any more and I was ready to call it quits. He did just what you would expect…the behavior changed for some time. Then…the threat is gone and the behavior returns. If that makes sense. It’s exhausting to me.

    I appreciate your post. I will try harder next time to avoid calling. You are definitely right there. I think I call b/c I think he owes ME a phone call (I’d never come home 2 hours late w/o a call or e-mail to let him know I’ll be running late) and I know he’ll just act as though nothing has happened when he returns home. But you’re right again. How shocked he will be next time when he comes home and I’m not sitting there…hurt b/c he didn’t call.



  160.  #160Kacy on October 20, 2009 at 7:54 pm

    Hi Amy, He does owe you a phone call when he’s late. But right now you are not likely to get it because he is used to being able to treat you the way he does. I am glad to hear your resolve to not call him when this happens again. I don’t think you have to go far away or have relatives to go to, I think you just need to get a sitter if you have children and go to the mall or a friends for a few hours so that you aren’t there when he gets home. You may have to deal with some attitude when you do get home but then you can just use the other tools and feeling messages that you have learned when he addresses you about not being there. Non of this is easy, I know. It gets real confusing about what to do when and when not to talk or what and how to say when you need to talk. I often can feel swamped about all of it. Let me know how things are going.



  161.  #161Amy on October 21, 2009 at 12:06 pm

    Thanks, Kacy. I don’t have an update on this, but he hasn’t fully come out of his cave from last week (sometimes he cave dwells for a couple of weeks). He talks more to me now that I use the tools we’ve learned here (he used to shut me out entirely), but he is still only peering out from inside his cave. I can’t come too close or get too excited about anything or he’ll retreat. I have to treat everything like business and give him total space. Well, last night I had something come up – unrelated to him – that hurt quite a bit and he saw that I had tears in my eyes. He rushed out of his cave to comfort me and team up with me. I am not sure why I’m sharing this except to say, Rori was right in something she wrote when she said, “Sometimes me go to their caves and it has nothing to do with us.”

    I think all of this is overwhelming too. Mostly b/c I never realized how complicated guys can be. I am the type of girl that really thought they only thought of two things food and you know the other; three if they like sports. I was so wrong. Their wiring is way more complex than I ever knew.



  162.  #162Michelle on October 23, 2009 at 12:09 pm

    Hi everyone!

    I need advice….and help with a power speech (if that is what I should do. At this point I don’t really know if its appropriate or not??)

    I’ve been seeing/dating a guy for about a month and a half now (nothing offical at all). We started out friends and didnt start hanging out just the two of us until a little while back. We only see each other about once a week, sometimes twice. We were physical with each other pretty early on and I felt like maybe he was only interested in that aspect. But then he invited me out on a lunch date, and then to an even that turned into us hanging out all day and all night (he kept extending the date longer, we went to dinner etc.) So I started to think maybe he was interested in more. The only talk we’ve really had on the subject was essentially me telling him that I didn’t know what he thought of the situation but that I wasn’t interested in a situation like the last one I was in were it turned out to be mainly physical and a lot of BS talk from the guy that led no where and I got left out of the blue. He knows the guy that happened with and when I asked what he thought about what I said he said “I’m nothing like him..” and I said good and left it at that. Since the day we spent together seeing each other has been usually at night and involved me going to his house and us watching a show that we both love and started watching together and then us hooking up and me staying there. He is very affectionate when we are together and I feel like he likes me when Im around him. But then I wont hear from him for a while and that starts to freak me out. The last time I went over to hang out it was pretty late and we watched our show and I stayed the night but I havent heard from him at all since (we normally just text). I get confused because on one hand I think well its only been 2 days and maybe thats not such a big deal and its normal even if a guy does like you. But then I start thinking no, that if he really liked me he would want to see me more and text/call me every day and since he doesnt that must mean hes just not that into me.

    So I feel lost. I have been circular dating (starting this week). Kept my plans full and have been seeing other men (though not physically) but I want to know how to handle this situation. Do I give him a power speech when its only been a little over a month? If so what should I say that wont make him withdrawl even more? Please help!!



  163.  #163Amy on October 27, 2009 at 6:29 am

    Michelle,
    I am probably least qualified to answer you, but since it’s been since Friday, I wanted you to have a response from someone.

    When I read your post my heart screams out, “Run! Rar and fast.” I may not be the biggest expert at Rori’s tools, and there may be a lot of hope and potential in your situation with this guy. But what I read is that he doesn’t see you for the jewel you are…for whatever reason…and it may be that as you circular date some of what Rori says could result will result with him. But it might also be that he’s not plugged in right now. The good news is, someone will be. And when you do circular date you have the opportuntiy and option to find that someone…even by accident. Plus, you find ways to be full within yourself and you don’t look to this guy for anything that when that “something” is absent you freak out…whether it be attention or a text/call…whatever. When you are so full within yourself you almost have to mental stop and make time and space in your world to let the guy in. It almost feels like an annoyance at times. That sounds so hateful and wrong. But that is when you know he can’t control you and you love you. You are then in a position to love freely. Don’t need from him more than he can give. Lean way back on this one. Let him lead. If he does not step up, refuse to feel rejected. Fight it within yourself…do whatever it takes to feel it and rid yourself of it as quickly as possible if that’s what you have to do, but do not carry around rejection. I think that has always been my downfall. Rejection breaks my heart. I know I’ve loved with all I’ve got. I know I’ve been for him when I didn’t want to be. I know no one else would ever give what I’ve given. Then…after it all…I see what he saw. I was a doormat. I let him yank me around emotionally. I let him neglect me. I let him get away with not calling or texting. Why should he? Why should I be there on ready to talk to him when he does call? Why shouldn’t he have to stand in line and wait his turn when he hasn’t made plans to see me or isn’t consistent enough in his calls to have a place on my schedule? You see what I’m saying? This guy has too much space in your world. Fill it with people and things that fill you. You might soon find you don’t care if he calls or not.

    Remember you are beautiful through and through and that there are a lot of men out there that would fall all over themselves to spend time with you. Don’t let someone take you for granted. Love you.

    I hope that helps. Good luck.



  164.  #164Michelle on October 27, 2009 at 8:51 am

    Thanks so much for your response, Amy!!

    I wrote out a few speech ideas for the next time I was going to see him. This turned out to be last night. We had plans to finish up watching a DVD series we started watching together. We had such a good time and it really felt like we did more of getting to know each other some and I completely chickened out!!! I literally was sitting on the edge of the couch right next to him about to leave and couldnt make myself say anything. I guess it was the whole “scared to rock the boat” emotion because it had been such a good night. I am really hoping that days do go by again with me wondering whats going on. I almost texted or called him when i left but didn’t. I knew I was trying to take the easy way. But anyways….this is what I had planned on saying…..

    “I feel weird and a little embarrassed asking you this and I don’t want to pressure you… but are you taking things slow with me? I just want to know if we are on the same page.”

    “I really like you. Probably too much to be just friends. It feels good hanging out with you and I want to continue seeing you. But I don’t feel that we’re really getting to know each other and I want more than something physical.”

    Those were a few little things I put together. I’m not sure if I should come out and ask if he considers us just friends, friends with benefits etc or just let him explain himself where hes at. I want to lean back and see what happens but a part of me wants to just contact him and get it over with, give him the speech and save myself the trouble of wondering what the heck is going on. Well as Im writing this he just called me because he thought he passed me on the highway and we chatted for a minute. Should I just let things happen or give him a speech and get clarification?? Thanks again!!!



  165.  #165Amy on October 27, 2009 at 11:01 am

    I hope some of the ladies that are better at all of this than I am give some input too, but I’d say this is a perfect time to let him define the relationship by leaning back. The way he reacts will tell you how he feels. If you are doing all the work…driving to his place, beign at his beckon, then I think you have some answers as to what he sees this as. If he has to pursue you…you might get what you really want with this guy. Asking him might come across as needy or clingy. But being a girl that requires his pursuit might pull out what you want and what he wants to give. Hope that helps.



  166.  #166Michelle on October 27, 2009 at 11:54 am

    Thanks so much Amy….I think I agree with you…last night it just didn’t feel right to ask. Something inside just said “bad idea”, I think it’s just too early to ask anything when we aren’t seeing each other more often. Now that the show we’ve been watching is done (although I did leave it there, so I will have to get it back) there is no “reason” for us to make plans at his place, so if he wants to see me it will have to be something other than the common thing of “hey lets watch a few episodes tonight”. I’m just going to have to lean wayyyyyy back, and if he doesn’t follow, accept it for what it is. He is a shy guy, but if he wants to see me he will figure it out, im sure he knows I like him.

    By the way, I dated a guy (unofficially….and it was horrible) that went into his “cave” like that and I know what you are going through. It was very hard for me because no matter what I did he would withdrawl, sometimes with no notice what so ever and it would take me by surpirse. It really fueled my approval seeking behavior with him. The more he retreated the more I worked and overfunctioned to try to prove I could be the one that brought him out. I wanted to have that type of connection where I was the one he would let in. I’m not sure if its the same with you in your situation, although I did read your posts. (details that other people dont know always play a part in the situation). But it finally turned around for me when I stopped caring when he went in his cave. I wouldn’t call, I would make myself busy and if you can’t go out find a hobby that you can concentrate on at the house even. I started scrapbooking a lot during that time and would be so focused on what I was doing time seemed to just fly by and I cared more about what I was doing than if he would come to talk to me, and even when he did…it was kinda “ehh…” to me. Its kind of like the whole “a watched pot never boils”…when my mind was truely somewhere else it didnt matter if he was in his cave. Im not sure if that helps, but I thought I would just let you know that someone on here def can relate to what you are dealing with!! Hang in there!



  167.  #167Amy on October 27, 2009 at 1:06 pm

    Thanks, Michelle!
    We talked it out last week and I told him how I felt when he withdraws/goes into his cave (he’s done it several times in just a three week window). He said, “Maybe you should consider what you do to make that happen.” I asked him to tell me what he meant. Basically, he said that he did that b/c of the way I handled one of our kids. This kid isn’t a bad kid. He’s really laid back and he and I are both wired pretty high strung. Anway, he feels I am too easy on him and he gets sick of seeing me “let things go” (although all of his rules are enforced as though they are “our” rules and I don’t let anything “go” except letting the kid be a kid) and he withdraws from me as a form of punishment for MY actions or, he says, takes out his displeasure of a situation on me even when I have not been involved by withdrawing. I asked him if he saw how controlling that is. He refused to see it as a tool of control or manipulation. I’m at a total loss now.

    Your words help though. It may be that the whole family has to let him go sulk and ignore him for the duration of his stay in his cave. I’m very sad about this. I wish he could see the effects this has on everyone as well as how it has damaged the trust in our relationship. I’m struggling with a lot of sadness right now. I think I handled things as best I could last week in way of talking with feeling messages and listening to him. But I think he has layers of issues that can’t be addressed with these tools. I asked him to go to counseling with me. He refused. I’m sitting still now. I think I see our relationship dissolving if this is his true heart. I can’t combat these episodes of cave dwelling and the kids and I can’t live under the excessive amounts of criticism we receive from him either. I’m still willing to work with these tools and do just the things you suggest in your post; I just feel like I’m on a sinking ship and though I’m willing to do my part…it takes both people.
    Thanks again



  168.  #168terry on October 28, 2009 at 9:15 am

    Help! I feel completely lost on what I should do.

    A guy I had been dating for 6 months disappeared on me in June. I did not contact him at all. He saw me at a function earlier this week. I was leaning way back. He came over to talk to me and began telling me about 3 major issues he had been dealing with for the last four months. He didn’t actually apologize to me – he only explained his situation. I listened to him at level 2. I felt very at ease and confident.

    He then asked me out for this weekend. (I really do feel that I want to go.) I said, “yes, that would feel great…” but just as I was also about to tell him how disrespected I felt last summer, our conversation was interrupted by someone and I didn’t get to finish my feelings speech. He just said, “I’ll call you to confirm the time.”

    I don’t know what to do. Do I finish my speech when he calls to confirm the time? Do I wait until he picks me up for the date? Do I wait until he takes me home? Do I not bring it up at all at this point and just keep leaning way back and give it time? Should I even go out now? I don’t know.

    I felt so disrespected and rejected last June. It took me a few months to heal from that. I’m ok now, but I still feel the need to let him know how I felt by his behavior.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Btw, I have been Circular Dating, so I don’t feel hung up on this guy.



  169.  #169Rori Raye on October 28, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    Terry…First – write down what it is you want to express to him. Make it a speech and memorize it. If you were NOT exclusively with him by verbal CONTRACT – then you were just dating him, and he had NO DUTY to inform you he wasn’t going to call you again. He wasn’t trying to hurt you, he just drifted away. I would share with him how weird it felt, and expect him to say – “Well, then why didn’t you call me?” (AND a Rock Star woman, who had no agenda, no desperation, no games to play, could and would have called just to check in….but hardly any of us are at that place right now)…ohhh…again…I’m writing a post…I’l jump off from here….Love, Rori (Short version – have your speech ready – do NOT go with “hurt” – but with “confusing” and “weird” and do NOT make him responsible for how you felt — just share what it FELT LIKE. You may not even like him much, and the speech may have a whole different emotion behind it than what you planned…so practice expressing how you feel in the moment.)



  170.  #170Michelle on October 30, 2009 at 7:42 am

    Im reposting this here bc I got responses from people….

    HELP!!

    Last night I finally asked the guy (main guy, I do circular date) that I really like about our situation. I asked him if he saw me as a “hook up” situation and his response was that he thought that was how I saw him…I said “ha you didnt answer the question” and he said “I’m just going with the flow, I love spending time with you…sex or not! I just dont want a gf though”….I literally couldnt think of anything to say back to him (I even went to this blog online searching for something powerful to say.) He then responded again saying “Well…I guess the silence says something….ttyl” and I said “I didnt know what to say…I dont know how I feel about what you said” and he signed off (we were on FaceBook chat)….I then texted him and said I wanted to respond…i then said “I appreciate you being open with me…I really like you..and it feels good hanging out with you…I didnt know you were only interested in friendship…and I want more than something physical”. He then sent “I love hanging with you! Just dont want a title.” Again I didnt really know what to say back to that so it took me a little while and he ended up sending “Sorry”…I just said “I understand…im keeping my options open…I just wanted some clarification on what you were open to”…then he throws me for a loop and says “I hope I never made you feel smothered”….I told him “not at all…why would you think that?” and he said “Wasnt sure what you meant by options…Never stopped you from going out with others…Thought I told you about not wanting a GF”…and I said “By options I meant I never shut off meeting people or assumed anything from you…We never talked about the no GF thing..But I know now so I feel better about that…” Then he sends “Who knows what the future holds! We still have TrueBlood 2″ (He is refering to this because we have been watching the first season of True Blood on DVD at his place bc I had borrowed it from a friend and we finally finished it but season 2 hasnt been released on DVD yet. When I responded I said “Speaking of True Blood, its still at your place” and he said “I sold it” (trying to be funny)…I didnt play into it or flirt with him I replied “Hope not…I gotta give it back” and he said “Too badddd” and I said “You better get it back then” and he said “U can come get it then…Itll be in my bed” (he jokes a lot in serious situations…I said “arent u working” and he said he would be off in a bit so I told him that I would be leaving to go home in a while so if he was home i would stop by and get it….he then asked where I was…and I didnt respond so he said “It will be about an hour before I get home…U can just stay the night” and all I responded with was “just text me when u get home”….

    He let me know when he would be home and so I left where i was (which was just hanging out with my cousin) and went by his house. I walked in and everything was normal but I kept my distance and just sat down on the couch. He asked me what I had done all night and I said “oh i had a hot date” and laughed and he did and said “oooh niceeee” and I said “yeah it was great and he actually begged me to be his girlfriend but I had to shut him down” and we both laughed…I obviously didnt go on a hot date and I have no idea if he knew I was joking or not, i didnt really care. So i sat down on the couch and we just chit chatted for a bit and played with his cute little dog. He was being kinda flirty and kept staring at me and smiling. He layed down on the couch and said he was cold and then reached over and grabbed me and pulled me on him holding me. I didnt hug him back I just layed there kind of in a ball and said Oh your cold huh and just gave him a look and asked if he cuddled all of his friends like that and he again being funny said “yep…me and Josh do all the time” (his guy friend) and just smiled at me. He was being very affectionate the whole time. I ended up looking at him and he went in to kiss me and I said so you kiss all your friends too and he said yeah…and I said well I dont kiss my friends….so he said ok thats fine, just let me hold you…and he tucked me under his chin and kind of rocked me a little.

    Originally when i went by there I didnt plan on actually staying…I wanted to go in and get my DVDs and leave and make my statement but I ended up basically falling asleep on him and he woke me up and said lets go to bed. So I stayed not wanting to drive home…and honestly I wanted to be close to him. I could tell he wanted to be physical but he only gave hints to it and never really tried. When I got in the bed I said I was cold and he immediately pulled me over to him and wrapped himself around me, almost tangled up….and we fell asleep that way. I eventually rolled over and he still moved with me and held me all night. When the alarm went off this morning he woke up and just stoked my arm for a minute thinking I was asleep and trying to wake me up a little. I got up and changed and got my things together…I asked if he had to go to work and he said yeah today and tomorrow and then I said you know…and sat on him and said “It sucks you only want to be friends…” and smiled at him staring him right in the eyes….and he just looked at me and put both his hands on my face and brushed my hair out of my face…he just looked at me and kept stroking my cheek and then pulled me to him and held me for a few minutes then he sqeezed me tight….so I got up and said have a good day at work…he said you too and waved and I left.

    I have so many different emotions. Part of me feels sad that I said anything because I feel it might have been to early….we’ve only been seeing each other for about a month and a half and i dont know if he thought i wanted to be his girlfriend or have a title right away. Im happy spending time with him but Im scared that its just a dead end. I dont know if he meant that hes completely not wanting a relationship to come of us or if he just meant that right now he likes how things are and seeing me but isnt ready. I feel confused and want more clarification. I want to text him and ask if he meant that he isnt open to that at all or if he meant hes not ready right now. I feel disappointed and rejected. I feel bad…PLEASE HELP!! Should I say anything else to clear things up??



  171.  #171Amy on November 2, 2009 at 11:56 am

    I’d say, “No.” I’d say let it be. Pull back and give yourself space. I’m afraid if you don’t you are going to get hurt. You’ve made yourself known and clear about what you want. He got the message. Truly circular date and truly open all options. I think that is the only way this will turn into a healthy relationship, if it will. You don’t want to chase or pursue. Let him. Be the prize. Focus on you, not him.



  172.  #172Michelle on November 2, 2009 at 1:06 pm

    Thanks Amy!

    I did let it be…it was hard at first but I just talked myself out of it, went out and had a fun night and when I got home I was on Facebook and he sent me a chat almost immediately when I got on. So I talked a little to him then, but he was working so he didnt stay on long. I didn’t hear from him at all Saturday (Halloween) but I just went and did my thing and actually had a lunch date and went to a party that night. Then Sunday night around 6 I got a text from him saying “Thanks for wishing me a happy halloween!” (this could seem rude, but he jokes a lot and so understanding his tone I knew that he was being funny) so I responded and said “Ditto”…and he said “O yes I did!” and we talked and essentially his phone has issues sometimes and we have run into it before where on or the other of us doesnt get texts from the other. He kept joking and said something funny about seeing me tonight so i asked if he was inviting me over…and he said “You’re always welcome”…so I did a few things and went over there and we had a nice time together. He was asking me tons of stuff about my weekend and doing things for me while I was there.

    His brother actually called him while I was there (who i have met once) and I guess his brother asked what he was doing and he told him he was with me and I could tell by the conversation that his brother knew who he was talking about. I teased him when he got off the phone saying that he probably confused his brother not knowing which girl he was talking about (even though he called me by my name) and he said “you actually think I introduce any girl I meet to my family?” he almost sounded hurt but I just laughed and said who knows and he hugged me and said “well I dont.” I’ve met some other of his family members and lots of people from his hometown from one day when he took me to a festival with him there. I was showing him pictures on my camera from Halloween and we ended up taking pictures together and they were really cute, even a few of him kissing me and us making silly faces. I constantly upload picutres on facebook so it surprised me that he did that. I dont plan on posting them, but still.

    Anyways…thats just my update. I would love any follow up thoughts! I am going to continue to lean back and enjoy my circular dating! I have a lunch date on Thursday and a dinner date one night this week too!



  173.  #173Amy on November 2, 2009 at 1:21 pm

    good for you! keep dating and most importantly having fun. you guys might end up serious after all, but it always feels best when you know he’s with you b/c he wants to be there and he sought you out…not that he some how got “stuck.”



  174.  #174Alicia on November 2, 2009 at 2:20 pm

    Dear Rori,

    I just found your program and have not yet received you modern siren however
    I did read the Have the Relationship You Want Book. I can not figure out how
    to print it though? Any ideas?

    Anyway. I have been seeing a guy since July we were going along great and
    then he stopped trying as much in early September. This man is 100% worth my
    time and all I ever dreamed of. I see some of my errors and am working on
    fixing them as of yesterday. We talk or text daily, seems if we call each
    other but I call a 65% off the time and he 45%, I will stop that now. He
    switched when he was going through a emotional crises with work, he owns
    multiple business and has high stress. He says he cares for me, just
    has been overworked and stressed. He says I am perfect, a ten of a ten. I
    have gone there and wrote emotional letters and asked all the wrong things,
    pord my heart out,because he said something that sounded like he had
    reserves about my intentions with him. But at the same time some of it
    seemed to a least get us going out on lunch dates again a few weeks ago.
    He knew I was dating around some but I made the mistake in telling him he captured me like no other and other men are spinning wheels trying to get close to me. I said I still talk to great men that persue me because he had not asked for anything different. But in my heart he has taken hold.

    In the first two months he pursued me fiercely, we talked non stop. I want that
    back.

    How do I get him to stop texting and start calling? We text lots from the
    start but that depth has changed. I thought of saying in the next text,
    “Thank you for your text, I want to express to you I feel like texts are
    impersonal and I don’t want to communicate with you like this the majority
    of the time.” The texting is like half way communicating, but I’m still
    grateful out of his busy day he stop in to say HI, I’m torn. How is that and
    is it okay to say in a text. Then breath let go and wait for his call.
    Sometimes when he calls should I play a little hard to get from time to
    time? Not pick up, wait for a few hours to call back? I did skim you Have
    the Relationship You Want on Sunday morning, texted him and asked him if he
    could give me advise. He texted back immediately and said I think so whats
    up? I cried out of fear of what I was about to say. I called him 45 min
    later and after the small talk I beat around the bush and took a deep breath
    and said I FEEL LONELY, especially when me kids are at their dads. ( I got
    divorced last year) I said I had out grown many of my friends that go out
    and I would not compromise on where I go and what I do, so I stay at home.
    What do you think I should do? He said he knew exactly what I felt,
    identified with me and said he always started making projects and to do list
    to keep busy, then when kids come back you feel good cause that’s off your
    plate. I listen and the tears started rolling, I tried not to let him know
    but I think he did. Then he said his phone was about to die and he would
    call back later. I said okay and thank you. Later he did text announcing his
    sons after school care was closing in one week. I text WOW, Interesting and
    I sorry to hear that. He did not call back last night but I am sure he will
    text today. (I did read the whole Have The Relationship You Want, last
    night) Is that what I should text back? Should I show strength and
    contentment when he calls back like I did not notice he didn’t call. OH and
    I don’t want to be the lunch date girl. He said last week, ” I need to make
    time and take you out at night” Should I say next time he asks me out to
    lunch, Thank you but I would rather wait, let you use that time to get other
    things done. I don’t want to just see you at lunch? Or what?

    Thank you for all the help you have giving me thus far I feel there is hope
    and inspiration already!

    Alicia



  175.  #175Rori Raye on November 2, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    Alicia, Welcome – and — I’m going to jump off into a post here…Love, Rori



  176.  #176terry on November 3, 2009 at 2:11 pm

    Rori, thanks for your advice. I had my date this past weekend. I forced myself to stay in the moment at all times, and to feel everything I was feeling at any given moment. An actual talk of him “drifting away” months ago never came up. At the beginning of the evening he asked me how I was. I was honest and told him I was feeling a little nervous, because it had been a few months since we’d seen each other. He didn’t say anything; he just grabbed me and and hugged me. I instantly felt better and told him so. I allowed the date to flow naturally and we had a blast.

    I used lots of feeling messages all night. He was intrigued and often asked, “Cool! What else are you feeling?” He stayed close to me all evening. I continued to practice Circular Dating that evening and had several men come up to talk to me. This kept my man on his toes. At the end of the evening he kissed me passionately and kept looking deep into my eyes. I smiled and used a few “mmm’s and ahh’s.”

    Now, even though we had a great date, I feel uneasy. I have the ebook, Modern Siren, and Reconnet. I read the newsletters. I’m learning a lot and am using the tools, yet I still feel so stupid at times. I feel the more I learn the less I know. Things start sounding contradictory and confusing.

    I feel can’t tell the difference between “just dating,” toxic men, being strung along, knowing when to get out of a situation, knowing when to keep giving things a chance, how long to give a relationship before realizing it’s going nowhere, etc., etc. I feel down on myself and I feel clueless most of the time. I finally have three men in circulation, but I often feel paralyzed as to whether or not I’m assessing things correctly.



  177.  #177Rori Raye on November 3, 2009 at 2:18 pm

    Whoopie, Terry – you are doing FANTASTIC!!! It does get chaotic when you’re transitioning and transforming your life…just keep doing what you’re doing, and practicing. The water gets muddy, then it gets clear, then it gets muddy again. That signals growth…and that’s what you want. Love, Rori



  178.  #178Simply Shannon on November 3, 2009 at 2:21 pm

    Terry: Ditto what Rori said!! My eyes got big when you said you circular dated while you were on the date with him. WHAT? Please do explain. I feel insanely impatient and excited to hear about this! What did circular dating look like when you were out on this date? How amazing to have men come up to you during the date!! I bet that did have your guy on his toes.

    I feel thoroughly impressed!!!

    Shannon



  179.  #179terry on November 4, 2009 at 10:01 am

    Wow, thanks Rori! I feel tears streaming down my face after reading your answer. Your support is just the confidence booster I needed. I tend to second guess myself. Thanks for explaining about the muddy water/clear water. That’s exactly how it feels to me. I feel relaxed now knowing that I’m growing. : )

    Shannon, well to be honest, I didn’t really do much of anything with the Circular Dating. First, my date had asked me to a dance and he is somewhat of a social butterfly. (That feels perfectly fine to me. I love his social skills and I feel attracted to that quality about him.) So, when he decided to go socialize around the room, I told myself “Ok, here’s your chance, Terry. Time to use a skill you just learned!” I used the “turnaround” tool.

    Instead of watching where my date was going, who he was going to talk to, etc., I completely turned away from him. I took a slow, deep breath (because this felt scary), leaned back with palms open, felt a big smile come across my face, and scanned the room at all the men. I knew some of them, many I didn’t. Most of the men had dates.

    Shannon, it was amazing. Three of them took turns coming over to talk to me and they had all brought dates! I felt my heart racing a bit, but then I started to really feel empowered. I looked directly into their eyes when they spoke. I kept leaning back, kept smiling. After this happened the third time, I felt an arm slide around my waist. It was my date, looking a bit irritated at all the attention I was getting. I felt great!

    My date then kept getting me drinks and food. He also kept me on the dance floor a long time. During the next band break, my date went to get something to drink. I went up to the stage to look at the musical equipment, because I’m also a musician. Just then a band member came over to talk to me. I told him how excited I felt over seeing his instrument, because I felt drawn to maybe buying the same one. He instantly began giving me a demo. I nodded a lot, used ‘umm hmms’ and ‘ooohs’, and thanked him for the lesson. I told him I felt better educated on the topic.

    Just then I felt someone watching me. Sure enough, my date (the same guy who disappeared on me 4 months ago) was glaring at me and this other musician. After that, my guy didn’t seem to feel the need to work the room anymore. He stayed by me the rest of the night. Amazing! I used lots of positive feeling messages with my date, too.

    I was also careful to keep my boundaries. At the end of the evening I felt him wanting a make-out session. I told him I only felt comfortable kissing and holding each other, but that’s all. I didn’t feel ready for more yet. He smiled and complied.



  180.  #180Simply Shannon on November 4, 2009 at 10:18 am

    Terry: I… wow… I feel floored, speechless, amazed and am totally going to do this the next time I’m out! WOW, WOW, WOW!!



  181.  #181terry on November 4, 2009 at 11:59 am

    Shannon, believe me, no one is more floored and amazed than me! Ha! This transitioning feels so different. However, my whole countenance feels more relaxed than before.

    I need to add one thing: I tried those tools for me. It was to help me feel better. It wasn’t to make my date feel jealous. I wasn’t trying to manipulate him in any way. When Rori’s tools began working, I began feeling radiant. The more radiant I felt, the more confident I felt. The more attention I received, the more receptive I felt toward men. The more receptive I felt, the more attention I received, etc., etc.

    You see, I was brought up in a very strict household. I was basically taught that nice girls don’t flirt, because it gives guys the “wrong idea.” I was never taught that there was a huge difference between feminine, girly flirting and sleezyness. After listening to Rori’s programs, I realized I can flirt while still being the nice, respectful woman that I am.

    I feel I wish I knew about these skills years ago. But, no looking back…only forward! I feel a whole new outlook about dating and relationships now.

    Oh, two other guys asked me out for this Friday and Saturday. I wish my date from last weekend (Guy # 1) had beat them to it, but he didn’t. I accepted dates from Guys #2 and #3, because they asked first (and I really do feel fun with them, too.) Guy #1 may or may not call, but he lost out if he does. Too late. ; )



  182.  #182Rori Raye on November 4, 2009 at 12:04 pm

    Wow, Terry. Going to post this quick, with my quick answer…Love, Rori



  183.  #183Flipper on November 5, 2009 at 5:29 am

    Just getting on this Speeches thread – been missing all these Pearls.



  184.  #184Michelle on November 5, 2009 at 8:32 am

    OK…so I accepted date for lunch today with a guy that I am NOT interested in at all (I only accepted to circular date)…and I want to back out so bad!! I am fighting the urge! The circle of guys I had going is getting all out of wack! One guy I havent heard from in over a week, another told me last night (after he had wanted to hang out the night before and I had other plans) that him and his ex worked things out, and another guy I saw for a lunch date saturday and havent heard much from since and the third guy is my #1 and things have been good with him. We’ve seen each other much more often (before it was about once a week) and since Thursday of last week we’ve seen each other 3 nights. It feels good spending more time with him but my circle is falling apart!!

    Is it bad that I want to cancel the lunch date today?!?! I feel so stressed from work and strung out! Please help!



  185.  #185terry on November 5, 2009 at 10:40 am

    Hey, Michelle! I know how you feel about stress from work. I’m right there with you!

    So, why not go to lunch? Look upon this guy as part of your dating circle, a messenger, a new experience, etc. There may even be an element of surprise to the lunch. You never know.

    If anything, maybe it could feel like a refreshing diversion from your stress at work. It will also help you to take your energy vibe off of your #1 guy. It’s only lunch and not a lot of time involved. Let us know what you decided to do!



  186.  #186Michelle on November 5, 2009 at 11:42 am

    Ok heres the update!

    I postponed the lunch date but I used the opportunity to express myself using feelings messages. I texted him (hes at work so thats how weve been communicating today) and said “Would it be ok to do lunch tomorrow? I feel so stressed and rushed today, I have no meetings tomorrow so that would feel so much easier for me…whatcha think?” He responded and said any time after 12:30 would work, or that we could always just get a few cocktails tonight if I wanted. He said he knows im stressed and that I could call him after work and we could take it from there if I wanted. I feel relieved and more at ease now.

    I do feel that I need my energy vibe to shift off of my #1 guy though. Terry, Im so glad you brought that up. It brought me a different perspective. I have been leaning back with this guy. We had hung out last Thursday night and I had brought up some things that had been on my mind. Things came out in a very mature way. This man and I have been sexually active for the last few weeks and we have only been seeing each other for about a month and half to two months. (I have known him since around June but we didnt start hanging out just the two of us until the beginning of Sept). Because we only hung out about once a week, sometimes twice it was making me feel a little weird about what his intentions were so I brought it up in a blunt way because I know that I can be that way with him. So I asked if he viewed me as a friend with benefits. The conversation went on for a while (its on another post) but essentially I told him I wanted something more than just a physical relationship and he told me repeatedly that he loves spending time with me and hanging out regardless of sex but that he didnt want a girlfriend, didnt want a title. I told him I respected that and was glad that I now know that and that I would continue to keep my options open. He let me know that he never meant to “stiffle” me or keep me from seeing other people he just loves spending time with me etc. Well since then he has initiated more contact and hanging out, we hung out Sunday night and then again on Tuesday night and he cooked me dinner. How weird is it that we discus that and then we hang out more in 5 days than we normally do in 2-3 weeks?! I have contacted him a few times first during this time but always concerning something he has asked me about previously. I’m not initiating us seeing each other but at the same time I am thinking about him a lot and maybe that affects the situation?

    Any opinions on whats going on with him? And how I should go from here? <33



  187.  #187Mary B on December 2, 2009 at 8:19 pm

    Hi Rori:

    I have been seeing this guy for 2 months. At our first meeting he told me upfront he didnt want a committed relationship right now. Since then everytime he sees me he tells me he has not been or dating anyone since he met me. Each time he says that I did not make any comment. Sometimes I feel he maybe waiting for a response from me and I don’t give one. I really like him alot but don’t want to say or do anything to push him away. But how do i find out what he is trying to say? I know…just ask…. but I don’t know how to pose the question if he is wanting exclusiveness.

    can you help?



  188.  #188Aldonza on December 2, 2009 at 9:36 pm

    @Mary B
    I’m also interested in seeing what Rori says, but I thought I’d give my take.

    If a man says he’s not looking for a relationship, I believe him and I treat him accordingly. My experience has been that a man who is serious about me makes it very clear about wanting exclusivity and certainly doesn’t leave me wondering about whether to ask. Some guys may say that to all women they date to test them. Or, maybe he did feel that way and now feels differently. In any case, he set the stage, if he wants it to be different, it’s up to *him* to change things.

    I think you’re doing just fine with not commenting on it.



  189.  #189Barb on December 4, 2009 at 11:32 pm

    This was awesome…I’m actually going thru something very similar. I have spoke my “feelings”, and I get the same answers…along with…reasons he cannot move closer in distance to me…we have been in a long-distance relationship for four years. We both like our independence, but also have financial reasons we cannot see each other as much as we’d like…do you have any suggestions for me???
    thanks



  190.  #190Rori Raye on December 5, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    Barb, Welcome, and you’re not going to like this reply. I think long-distance relationship sucks. It is based on fear of intimacy – yours. So many people who do well long-distance fall apart once they’re together. It’s near impossible to have a close relationship with someone who isn’t standing next to you. I sincerely hope you consider becoming non-exclusive and Circular Dating…Love, Rori



  191.  #191sparkles on December 9, 2009 at 1:34 pm

    Michelle,
    Please stop driving to this guy’s house to chill and sleep with him. I dated a guy for a long time who constantly said, “You can always come over if you want.” and I did and in the end, it just made me feel horrible and cheap. I sometimes replied, “I’ll just do something else if you are so ambivalent about seeing me.” or “I don’t want to make an effort to see you just because you don’t have anything else to do.” and of course, he would talk/badger me in to it then act blase once I arrived. We would watch a movie and sleep. boo-hoo.
    That was before I learned about feeling messages.
    Now, I’d say. “I don’t want to feel like your second option. It feels horrible.” Think about it and don’t let yourself down.
    Don’t you want to go out on the town, to a concert, out with friends or out to eat/on a real date? Don’t make this easy for him by making it hard on you. You deserve better.
    I’ve pretty much ended my old relationship but he is still hanging on. I think I’ll try one of these speeches to let him know that it really is time to go (too late).



  192.  #192Natasha on January 6, 2010 at 6:33 am

    Hi everyone,

    Need some help writing a speech. I met a guy early November last year (2009). We exchanged our numbers the night we met and then texted until about 5am. He told me that he had wanted to spend more time with me (I left the venue before he did). I agreed to dinner the following day. It was very pleasant and a few days later we met again. I didn’t know it then but I was leaning back and letting him make the decisions. It felt good but strange. I had also (unknowingly) used a guy from a previous relationship as my muse. Old guy and new guy have pretty similar work schedules (flying out of town at least once a week and sometimes for days) so I figured I could learn from what worked and what didn’t work before. New guy also has two daughters from previous relationships (one with his ex-wife; been divorced 6 years). After he started pulling back and calling less and blah blah, I wrote him an email telling him how I felt and what I was looking for. (Wish I had found this blog earlier! Might have helped me write better!) He called later that night and said he didn’t see me as some floozy and genuinely enjoyed spending time with me and wanted to get to know me better. He also said that he just simply didn’t have enough time because his schedule was so hectic and any free time was spent either with his daughters or catching up with friends. He told me out right that he “doesn’t have a life” and that most women he dates feel neglected because he spends so much time working or with his daughters.

    I told him that perhaps over the festive season he ought to think about what exactly he wants from the relationship and whether he felt I was the right woman to build that with, since he already knew what I want.

    We haven’t spoken much since (that was first week of December). I sent two emails – one saying Merry Christmas, another saying I was thinking of him. He replied them; brief and with affection in his choice of words.

    I’m going back home soon and figured I would call him and let him know I’m back in town and then wait to see if he asks to meet with me.

    Question is – should I ask about our December discussion and whether he’s decided what he wants or just leave it and wait for him to bring it up? And if he doesn’t bring it up, do I continue Circular Dating (which I decided to do after his story about not having as much time as he wants to spend with me)?

    Any ideas on what I could say to get a clear answer or commitment from him?



  193.  #193Rori Raye on January 11, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    Natasha, So sorry – but there’s nothing here. You can call him when you get to town…you might have dinner with him…but that’s all. He said he doesn’t want to do what you want to do….be in a relationship. Leave him be. Oh…and NO TEXTING TIL % am again! Useless…please do this systematically and don’t get all involved with anyone so quickly…Love, Rori



  194.  #194Jo on January 18, 2010 at 9:43 am

    After not hearing from my BF on Friday i made plans for a girly night out. When he did finally call I was quite happily getting ready, adjusting my lippy and dancing around to Beyonce. He was furious that I was going out after he said he wanted to watch a film with me. (this was done by text on Thursday) I did explain that if he wants to make decent arrangements then that should be by phone communication and not text and that i never confirmed we would stay in and watch a film.
    He then said that I care more about my frineds than him. A year ago I would of not arranged to go out with the girls and would of sat waiting for him to call. Thanks to Rori, no more of that malarkey.

    I then explained that i am not putting my life on hold and waiting in the wings on someone who can never decide if they are going to be part of the performance that evening or not and that I have had enough of trying to nail jelly to a tree. 🙂 🙂 🙂 ( I have no idea where the last comment come from, think i read it somewhere, but i really had to try and not laugh out loud as it did sound rather funny.

    He did calm down, he did admit to acting like a prat and that next time he will make a proper arrangement with me.

    The problem I am finding with following Roris tools is that the stronger and more confident i get I am now realising how unhealthily insecure my BF is, so how do i deal with that?



  195.  #195Natasha on January 21, 2010 at 1:39 am

    Thanks Rori!!! Your advice is truly the best. I’m already feeling much stronger inside 🙂

    Your tools are amazing! So glad I found this blog!!

    Love, Tash



  196.  #196Jennie on January 25, 2010 at 1:23 pm

    Rori,

    I’m feeling nervous and excited and scared and in terrible anticipation all at the same time.

    I’m ready to tell the man I have been seeing that our relationship either moves forward or I have to move on.

    We have been seeing each other, once a week maybe, for the last three months. I’ve never felt so connected to someone in my life. The chemistry is off the charts. We have had the most incredible talks about how we feel about each other (both have strong feelings) what we want from the relationship, his fears with the relationship – he told me he’s afraid he can’t make me happy – he also says a lot that he really doesn’t like me dating others. I’ve told him I need to keep dating until he’s ready for something more serious. So we’re stuck, either one will budge. Or either he’s not interested enough to move this along.

    Whatever it is I can’t do it anymore. Not with this guy. I can’t date others and really be open if he’s in the picture…my heart is completely wrapped up in him. So, after all these weeks of “talks” and nothing moving forward I have to let him know I need more, I have a dream for my life, to be a wife and a mother in the next couple of years, and either he’s on board or he’s not.

    Can you please help me put this together. He’s out of town but we’ll be talking in the next day or two…and I’m so nervous about screwing this up. I feel like the way I handle it could make this or break it. Of course, I want him to rush into my arms and tell me he doesn’t want to lose me and he’s ready for a serious relationship. But I’m prepared to walk away to go find my dream.

    Much love and appreciation 🙂
    Jennie



  197.  #197Alicia on March 31, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    This is good..



  198.  #198Matty on April 20, 2010 at 7:57 am

    Rori,

    I’m new to your site as of today. Reading about the speeches you are helping people with, I realized that I gave my own speech to my boyfriend about 2 weeks ago (though I didn’t realize that’s what it was at the time.) I was matter-of-fact with him regarding what I needed, when I needed it to happen (no specific deadlines, just that it needed to be soon, not a year from now), and why. He did not disagree with me on any of it, but the route he did take was to tell me that I wasn’t “being me”. He implied that everything I said was very mechanical… and thus very quickly took the importance of my words and made them no longer mine. He claimed he wanted to “get to the heart of the matter”, that he didn’t want things to ever escalate to the point where I felt like I had to talk to him like we didn’t know each other…. yet, it’s 2 weeks later and nothing has changed regarding what I asked for and needed. No further mention of it whatsoever.

    So, now I’ve been asked out on a date by someone else and feel like I STILL haven’t effectively communicated to my current boyfriend what the situation is regarding actually dating others. I want to say ‘yes’ to the date for all the reasons you give – to empower myself, to have something going on in my life that moves me forward, to acknowledge that I have the right to date someone else (something that my boyfriend does not actually deny, but has had meltdowns over even the thought of me being with someone else) – but I do not feel I can make that step unless it’s very CLEAR that this is going to happen. I do not feel it’s right to just go do it and then ask for forgiveness if he misunderstood the situation.

    So, in order to do this, I have to ask for a serious talk with him. Again. Oh, I didn’t mention this is a long-distance relationship which already has it’s own set of challenges, and requires a vast amount of trust between the two people (which adds to my feeling that I need to be upfront). My point of view is that I have told him multiple times that I need the relationship to move to the next step. I have communicated this both in a general sense and a specific “here’s how i envision this” sense. But I have absolutely no idea how to have the conversation of “It’s time. I’m going on a date with someone else now, even though I’m still in love with and what to be with you.”

    How does that conversation begin? Just say “I’ve been asked out and I’m going”? It’s just like how you laid out – I feel like I’m in a committed relationship with him. And if you asked him, he’d probably say the same… but then he’d ‘joke’ about how he doesn’t have any flag planted in me and I’m free to do as I please. But if I make any move to act on that, he has a meltdown. He acknowledges that he doesn’t have any real claim to me, but it’s obviously implied that I should just give him more time. He says he feels guilty about that, but he can’t change how things stand right now for a variety of reasons. And I’ve told him the reasons themselves aren’t the issue. The reality is, he isn’t here.

    How do I start?

    Matty



  199.  #199Rori Raye on April 20, 2010 at 11:40 am

    Matty, Welcome, and please know that he’s going to be in shock no matter how you tell him or don’t tell him – and that’s a GOOD thing! Remember this date is about YOU and has nothing to do with trying to have any effect on HIM. So – what’s important is how YOU feel about this. If you feel weird and guilty, you’re not going to have a good time. And yet – you’ve truly already told this “boyfriend” everything you need to tell him. So, the decision to talk with him about it is yours – there is no right or wrong here – just what feels best. And you’ll need to be firm. Next time he calls, you can simply give him the “No Boyfriend Speech” – I think a whole post about it is here….basically you say “I’m not looking for a boyfriend, I’m looking for a forever husband, and I love you, and love being with you, and you are totally entitled to take as much time as you need to decide what to do about me, and I’m feeling all unsteady and weird here just waiting, and being exclusive, and so I’m going to start accepting some of the invitations for lunch and coffee dates that I’ve been getting. Just know that I won’t sleep with anyone but you, but it feels much better to take care of myself and to keep my options open.” Notice you’re saying NOTHING about what HE needs to do to snap you up….this is crucial. And don’t let yourself get led into a DISCUSSION. Your decision is FINAL. Love, Rori



  200.  #200aprilshowers on May 29, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    I’m new to the site as well. It feels good to read all the old threads and apply to my life. Here are a few speeches that worked great for me.

    “I-don’t-wanna-be-friends” speech:

    I gave this to my recently ex-boyfriend/current co-worker. He took me to lunch for my birthday to beg me to be his friend. We DO NOT have a friends-w/-benefits relationship. He ended our “imaginary bf/gf relationship” because he “was fooling himself about being sexually atrracted to me”.

    I leaned back and said, “When we broke up, I felt sad. I felt powerless. I felt lost. Oddly, I never felt angry.”

    “I still feel attracted to you. I feel uncomfortable spending time together outside of work. I don’t want to be your friend.”

    I dropped the “What do you think?” part. I didn’t care what he thought. Lol.

    The result? He follows me around like a puppy, calls and texts constantly and asks me to lunch every other day.

    “I-don’t-call-men-1st” speech:

    I went on 3 dates with a guy from match.com. He kept picking fights because I would never call him. I would only return calls, if he specifically requested a call back. (Thanks, Rori!)

    “I feel weird. I feel uncomfortable. When I call men, I feel like I’m chasing. That doesn’t feel good to me. I don’t want to call men first. What do you think?”

    The result? He took me out. Then, he disappeared or 2 weeks and called to end it. Then, he called everyday asking to see me.

    “I-don’t-plan-dates” speech:

    I went on 1 date with a POF guy. He scheduled the 2nd date a week in advance. When he called to confirm, he said, “I’m just calling to see what you planned for our second date.”

    I laughed really, really hard and said, “Oh, I’m sorry, Sweetie, I don’t plan dates.”

    He said, “Well, I figured since I planned the 1st one, we’d alternate.”

    I said, “I feel weird. I feel uncomfortable planning dates. I don’t want to plan dates. But, you can feel free to call me back once you’ve planned our date and let me know where we’re going.”

    I know the last sentence was me being a smart-ass…some habits die harder than others.

    The result? He called back. He picked me up. He drove. He took me to dinner and he paid. He kept calling and calling and calling. Yay! Too bad, I didn’t like him.

    I stopped dating the POF and match guys. But, it was a great opportunity for me to define and stick to my boundaries. I quickly learned that if a guy knew he could wear me down on 1 boundary, he’d just whine and complain until I backed down on my other boundaries.

    What do you think, Sirens?



  201.  #201Simply Shannon on May 29, 2010 at 6:35 pm

    I quickly learned that if a guy knew he could wear me down on 1 boundary, he’d just whine and complain until I backed down on my other boundaries.

    Honey… I think you’re brilliant. 🙂



  202.  #202Daria on May 29, 2010 at 7:24 pm

    Wow – April Showers ! what wonderful words you are using (and the results show!)

    i will borrow your words now!



  203.  #203Daria on May 29, 2010 at 7:26 pm

    I feel weird, I feel uncomfortable. when i call men, i feel like im chasing. that doesn’t feel good to me. i don’t want to call men first. what do you think?



  204.  #204aprilshowers on May 29, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    You ladies are funny. I like it here. I feel welcome 🙂



  205.  #205Jean on June 7, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    Just found these websites for Rory. Have her online book & have ordered the Sirens CDs. Most of you ladies sound young to me (I’m late 50’s), but I’m starting over AGAIN after 12 yrs. I’m separated, divorce pending. Not trying to fix the relationship with the “I never wanted a life time commitment” man. Made that mistake and I’m not making it again.
    Have met a nice man thru internet about 2 mo ago. Get along good & the usual good initial relationship stuff. He’s separated, divorce pending on sale of home. We spent about 2 weeks texting; then talked on the phone for about a week. He set up a date for dinner w/me wth about 2 weeks notice. Not having had Rory’s advice yet, I did tell him I felt uncomfortable meeting him for dinner without meeting face to face, but I tried to set up a meeting (wrong move on my part). He said OK; he would meet me (in a public place). We talked about it happening, but when the day came, he stood me up. I called him & left a VM telling him I was not only disappointed, but hurt that I had been treated that way (I didn’t say “by him”). I felt it was inconsiderate and that under the circumstances, I didn’t feel good about having dinner with him. He called me the next morning and explained that not only had he been sick (later I learned he takes medication for health reasons, so the reason was valid, the action to it was not), but he was embarrased because he has no money to do anything with double bills until his house closes, and couldn’t afford the gas to meet me. I told him I felt bad that he didn’t trust me to tell me the real reason ahead of time and I didn’t like wasting my time on someone who isn’t considerate enough to to call me to cancel. He must’ve said, I’m sorry at least 8 – 10 times. Never once did I say “that’s OK.” I just didn’t answer, but let him go on apologizing, which he did. He asked me to keep the dinner date with, but would understand if I didn’t want. I told him I’d think about it.

    So he started calling me daily on his way home from work to just talk, and texting me during the day to flirt. Our dinner date was still on, but I restated that I wanted to meet him face to face first. He then surprised me by calling first to ask directions, and said he was stopping by after my work to meet me face to face. Since I needed to eat (medically), I asked him to join me for pizza. I asked, knew he was broke, so I paid.

    Since then, I’ve paid for a lot of things: brought dinner to his house and helped him financially with some necessities (his meds & gas), for which he has said he will pay me back when his house closes ( he does have a closing date). Hadn’t gotten Rory’s book yet and I realize now that I shouldn’t have done this, but too late! It’s done.

    Now, I have read Rory’s “How to have the relationship you want” and realized I got off on the wrong track, but I’ve been working on getting back to being the “feminine energy” and not the nuturing/caring part of the masculine energy. That nuturing part is hardest for me having raised 2 kids into adulthood, I tend to still do that part with the man in life. (My current soon to be ex told me I mommied him)

    As I read, I understand that there may be times in a relationship where there is a balance with each partner being masculine or feminine as needed. He does take the feminime energy side and tells me how he feels and what he wants in a relationship and life. I feel good when he tells me, because I feel more secure in how our relationship is developing, but I don’t know how to respond to him. Am I betraying my feminie energy if I nuture that? Mostly, I say nothing to his “wants & feels” except to respond back with “I want you to tell me how you feel” and “I want the same thing in a relationship” since we seem to be meshing on what we want.

    Now that he has some cash flow again, he’s “buying” and started paying me back; however, my delimna is, I still have this waxing & waning between being feminine & masculine, although most of the time, I try to stick to the feminine, which brings out his masculine. How do I manage both of those in me in a relationship – especially the nuturing part that I equate with caring and loving. Keep in mind that we are older and each of us have some health & medical issues, a lot of past relationship baggage, grown kids, etc. Rory, and anyone else, I’d appreciate some light shed on how to do this physical caring without me “taking charge like the mommy”. I don’t want to get lost in that mode again in this relationship and I’m enjoying being the feminine energy – most of the time! Thanks.



  206.  #206Rori Raye on June 7, 2010 at 9:39 pm

    Jean, Welcome, and you’re doing great. Oner Baby-step at a time – and from where you started – you’re doing fantastic! All it takes is PRACTICE, and right now, you’re practicing with this guy. Try not to make more out of it than that, get as many of my programs as you can, read everything here and just practice everywhere you are, with every human being you meet. You’re not trying to eradicate your masculine energy – you’re trying to develop and express your feminine, which has been stuffed down your whole life. Love, Rori



  207.  #207Jeannette on June 9, 2010 at 12:33 pm

    Rori, I am sort of sad because I went out on my first all day date with the guy I have been talking to for 2 months. We went to a farmer’s market and had lunch at a cafe downtown. As we were sitting there he said, “I hope you don’t mind me saying this but….you interrupt me alot when we talk.” I said, “I do?!, I never had anyone tell me that before.” The rest of the date I was uncomfortable because I was afraid I was going to interrupt him. He is a semi-retired school teacher and I find sometimes, (my grandmother was one for 40 years), they like to instruct people even outside of the class room. But I am a grown woman and I don’t want to be treated as one of his students. He is a little on the critical side, maybe in part because his astrology sign is that of a virgo…. But, I don’t want to get into that too much. Anyway, I am sort of turned off by his critizisms, I know we have to take it sometimes. But it was our first real “big” date and I notice he just sort of acts like that in general…he will criticize other people to me too. It’s a turn off Rori, any suggestions on how to handle something like that! Thanks.



  208.  #208Jean on June 9, 2010 at 1:52 pm

    Thanks, Rori, for your support and words of encouragement. It’s hard to make the first “good” relationship that comes along after a wrong one, NOT important. It feels so wonderful “to feel like a woman” again. It’s intoxicating and the drunkiness of it tends to blur things a bit. I only have this one new man in my life right now. However, I’m taking advice all the time. Since I have no one else to circular date with (yet), I’m dating me.

    Mr. Newbie calls me on his way home from work every day. I wanted to go clothes shopping for our next date, so instead of waiting for his call, I just went. He called and when I answered, he heard the background noises and asked me where I was. I casually replied I had plans to go out, so I didn’t have much time to talk, but I was glad he called. He asked, “are you with your new boyfriend?” with a joking tone in his voice. I laughed and said, “of course”. I could tell he wasn’t quite sure, but kept his pride and said, “have a good time”. I answered I would and he told me he’d be online later if I wanted to chat and he’d call me in the morning.

    By the time I got home, it was late. I always go online, but this was much later than usual and to my surprise he was still online. (He usually goes to bed early for his job). He flirted w/me for about 20 min, but no mention of any date by me or him.

    He called in the morning and commented that I got home early from my date. All I said was, “I had a good time.” The truth. I enjoyed being by myself and trying on everything in the store!

    So, I feel this is how I can keep my mind off of being totally absorbed in him. I did something for me that I enjoyed. I was vague about it, but after all, it really isn’t any of his business what I do when I’m not with him. I don’t have to “report” to him.

    One thing that I find I’m doing is talking less, or maybe I should say explaining less. I didn’t elaborate on “I had a good time” by adding: “shopping and trying on everything. I looked good in this or that, etc. etc.” I think as women, we sometimes fall into the habit of talking to a man in our life like we would to a girlfriend. Remember: KISS – Keep It Simple, Sister! We don’t want to develop him as a friend anyway! Let him fill in the blank spots with whatever he wants to think.

    So, until I can add a man to my circular date list, I’m dating an amazing person who’s a joy to be around and makes me forget (temporarily) any man in my life – me! Thanks Rori for your advice and hope this helps others.



  209.  #209Jean on June 9, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    Rori – Just a comment on the websites. Personally, I would like to see the newest comments on the top of the page. It’s easier with the thread of a topic or conversation. Least I think so. Just my masculine energy making a “suggestion”. LOL



  210.  #210Shell on June 19, 2010 at 4:51 am

    Ok heres a speech for you to disect/digest.. let me know what u think goddesses;)-

    To set the scene for you

    I met J about 10 years ago on a holiday to my home country to visit family and friends. There was an undeniable spark between us but I was in a long term live in relationship at the time.. we didnt get to know eachother very well just hung out for a few hours twice during my stay. 2 years laters and now been single about a year I moved back to my home country and I saw him at a friends funeral. The spark was very much there but I figured him for a player so I was very wary of him..though attracted and intruiged and very interested talking to him.
    I needed someone to drive my car with me into a neighbour country .. because I didnt have a valid licence but I had the car.. I texted people in the area i knew including him lookin for a driver to join me on a short adventure.. He said he needed to visit that country to meet with his lawyer so he would love to come.. anyway this trip was amazing and a connection grew, we just had a blast, a real adventure.. the road trip was so much fun.. the destinations kinda irrelevant.. conversation great, eye contact, flirting, sexual tension etc some days into the trip we had mindblowing sex and that was us for the rest of the trip.. lovers. I fell for him and he was falling for me but when i asked him wat was going on.. are we in a relationship..blah blah..horror speech … he said why wat are you hoping for.. marriage or something… me appalled said no I dont want anything and didnt see him for a while. Slowly over the last 8 years we have become best of friends.. we always said friends first.. why?? I dunno.. stupid. We have been friends with benefits when we see eachother and are both single.. we are just friends when we are seeing someone else. Sex with him is so incredibly satisfying and when I am with him I feel like a goddess, and he is also incredibly loving, affectionate, giving and he will do lots of nice things for me.. but when he leaves i feel like shit and even tho he contacts me a lot and says nice things toi me there is no thought of commitment from him and he continues to sleep with other girls and same with most of them.
    Anyhow that would all be fine except I can see myself as his wife with little mini j & me’s running amok. I have known him for so long and know him so well and i just think we are perfect together.. i mean i believe there are other perfect men for me out there too.. i mean that we dont just have 1 soulmate. I know I could be happy with him . I am the girl he calls wen he goes opn a long trip.. I am the girl who always has his numbe and always knows where he is. He texts or phones me several times a week. We live in different countries again at the moment but only 5hrs drive apart.
    He is naturally an incredibly chatming man who gets people and especially women. He is always surrounded by women and he has told me he has slept with hundreds. He wants to be married and have babies, he is actively seeking a soulmate.
    Anyway after learning about Rori, her newsletters and blog I realised partly why this man hasnt made me his girl.. I realised all the things i was doing wrong and why i was still single and for several weeks I was taking my time ans his texts and ignoring a few phonecalls from him and just leaning back and while gathering the balls for the no friend speech.. anyway got tired of waiting for him to come and visit to tell him my new resolve coz that could be like next month or sumin. So completely out of the blue about 3 days since his last text message ( which i hadnt answered) I sent him this text message:

    Goddess: Hi J. I know this may seem like its coming out of left field but I have to say this and get it over with.. I’m not doing this friends with benefits thingy with you anymore.. I’m sorry it does not feel good for me and I am done with that. Hugs

    J: Hey no prob. Glad u up straight with it. I still have no problem with being best mates with you 🙂

    Goddess: Yea thats great but I cant be best mates with you.. that is also not being true to my feelings. Sex is meaningful to me J.. and I feel confused because we have been this way with each other for so long. Prob in time yea but not now. Now is about what is right for me and I dont want to feel confused or bad about this anymore..

    J: What I mean is i dont want there to be a rift or bad feelings between us. I emjoy yr company 🙂

    Goddess: There are no bad feelings.. I enjoy your comany too. I just want a lot of space so I can feel differently, move out of this headspace and open my heart for true love

    Goddess: I realised that I have been stuffing down my emotions on many levels, not just with you and this is prob y im still single.. I havent been true to myself for far too long

    J: No problem. Let me know if you want contact or if I can help with anything.

    Goddess: Yes you can start by not being nice, u r not helping lol 😀

    J: Will try be more horrible:) Hope you can be more smiley today.

    Goddess: Yea its gonna be a great day.. I feel good now.. I am unleashing the goddess inside me. Thanks for being real

    J: 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 In V (hometown) now and sea is beautiful 🙂

    Thats it!!! That was this past Saturday. When I was done I was just swelling with pride.. I felt soo good, I felt powerful and attractive and totally in control. I know he will not call me and I will not call him….well eventually he might call me but i dont care anymore if he doesnt coz if youre not my man then ure not my man and you must go an be someone elses man coz i am off enjoying my circluar dating…. A 25y old (I’m 33) called me out of the blue and asked me on a date and phew we both had a blast and a fab kiss at the car, arrived home, alone and smiling, at 2am, with entire contents of purse still intact.. nice now to find the other 2 or 3 for the roster.

    I am a goddess, thanks to Rori and to me and to you bloggers.. hope u like my story and it helps you in your quest for true love

    Luv Shell



  211.  #211Rori Raye on June 19, 2010 at 6:59 pm

    Shell, your story is awe-inspiring. For you to be able to move this decisively and beautifully (all the texts are magnificent) after all this time – my hat’s off to you. Please stay here on the blog and keep talking – your resolve to serve YOU will help everyone, and we’d like to share in your process and support you. Love, Rori



  212.  #212Shell on June 20, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    Ahh thanks Rori.. thanks to you I’m learning heaps, you have really opened my eyes and mind to a new way of being. I was at a party last night and there were 5 guys that were obviously interested in me.. I was just leaning back lots and focusing on my goddess energy and it definately works.. yay this is sooo much fun!! I feel a lot more confident about myself and also confident that I have set my own boundaries and reasons for them, it makes a difference to the way I feel and therefore what I am projecting outwardly and subconsciously. Will post more when I have more to say so watch this space x



  213.  #213Tk on June 22, 2010 at 6:58 pm

    HELP PLEASE
    I am reading all your speaches getting inspiration as i have to give one tonight… We live together for 2 years, things have been stale sexually, to say the least, from his side.. He chased me and committed instantly, told his friends before we even met that he was going to marry me one day.. He is very handsome, girls through themselves at him, but he is mine.. he asked me to marry him a year ago, of course i said yes, we had no ring tho as it was spur of the moment.. Then we had stresses with business, moving etc and he just seemed to stop loving me.. I have been so scared to tlk to him as he is not good at talking, gets angry, calls me names, blames me for everything… Then he calms down we talk a bit and we go back to normal.. We do everything together, he does lots for me and i do lots for him but the love making just stopped… Ive tried everything over compensating, being a sex kitten, being cute, being an understanding partner and nothing worked… Then i read Roris ebook and applied everything and leaned way back. I even went to the hair dresses, bought new clothes, everything. I think it kind of made him nervous he proposed again, i have a gorgeous ring now and he held my hand and initiated sex often…. But then, of course we are the same people and he has gone back to no sex?????
    My dad is very ill and my sister and i are organising funeral arrangements at present and he has not been supportive at all.. last night he turned out all the lights, took the heater and went to bed leaving me sit in the dark on the computer looking at funeral homes… Everything came crashing down and i sobbed for hrs, silently, i went to bed, he didnt even touch me, then he left for work without even kissing me goodbye… I realised how totally unconnected we are emotionally. I sent him a txt just saying. I am so sad. He replied about an hr later with im sorry u feel that way i also feel like that as well… I didnt know what to say, anyway about half hr later he txt so are we going to talk about our problems??? I felt so angry, like yelling problems!!!! What problems all i want is to feel loved and supported thru this time… But i didnt.. i breathed deaply for a long time and txt , I would really like that…. End of story.. I am soooooo scared at what he will say and where it will go.. We have to break the old pattern of fighting instead of hearing each other….. I Need so much help on this one….. I am really scared but am now accepting of what i want in a marriage… Any one out there with advice??? PLEASE….



  214.  #214Katherine on July 24, 2010 at 3:15 am

    Girls… i am so lost in here… there is so much good stuff and i dont even know where to begin. I am overseas and really needing help now, I want to order more of Rori’s things but ahhh where to start. My own situation at the moment is so confusing and you just want to do the right thing by people… not make them feel horrible, but respecting your own self at the same time…trying to find that balance on your own is hard… how to do this, where to start…. If anyone can point me in the right direction that would be really great.

    Thankyou.

    Katherine.



  215.  #215Rori Raye on July 25, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    Katherine – Welcome – and start with the ebook – it will make the process of the Rori Raye “method” clear, and then everything you read here will make sense and fit into the steps….Love, Rori



  216.  #216AJ on August 4, 2010 at 12:30 pm

    I’ve been dating this guy for a year and two months and during that course of time our sex life has faded to almost nothing although it was never the focus of our relationship. I’ve expressed my desire to increase the frequency. I’ve never agreed to be exclusive with him (except sexually) although he has made it clear he is only seeing me. At this point I’d like to create a speech to let him know how I’m feeling and also inform him that I am still dating others. It seems like when I use a speech and continue to lean back he steps up to the plate, but only for a while. I think it’s because I start to lean in once things start rolling again… I’m working on that 🙂 Anyway, do I simply lean way back right now and stay open or do I deliver this speech (most of which is borrowed from Rori’s collection)?
    “I want to let you know I’m not comfortable with the way things are between us sexually. I’ve been feeling undesired.. Not undesirable, but undesired. Having a relationship that includes sex on a weekly basis is important to me. I love you and I feel so good when I’m with you. And I want you to know my intent isn’t to put pressure on our relationship. If things are going to stay the same I feel better keeping my options open and accepting the date invitations I have been receiving.”

    Thoughts?



  217.  #217AJ on August 4, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    FYI – My speech above feels somewhat threatening and that is not how I want it to come across. How do I firmly state my intentions without sounding like I’m saying “I don’t want to pressure you BUT… if you don’t comply this is what will happen.” I want to set my boundaries but do it in a way that will facilitate conversation if he’s willing to work on things and negotiate. Am I making sense? Lol.



  218.  #218Rori Raye on August 5, 2010 at 8:54 pm

    AJ – speech sounds perfect to me. Here’s an idea. Sex often disappears when there’s anger underground that isn’t coming out in the open. Try asking “Are you mad at me?” And then “what’s up with the difference in our wanting sex? Is there anything we can do so we’re both happy?” – and then ask yourself if you want to be with a man whose sex drive is so much lower than yours. Love, Rori



  219.  #219Jen on August 13, 2010 at 12:51 pm

    Greetings, everyone!
    I am new to your site, Rori, but I have been working with your Siren program and absolutely LOVE it. I have already seen a HUGE difference in my relationship. I have been leaning back, but being receptive and open to his advances.

    A little backstory on my situation: I met S online last summer. We quickly became exclusive and it was a huge mistake for both of us. He was pulling away, I was clinging – your basic nightmare. He broke up with me at the end of November, but I just knew that he would be back. We have an incredible connection. I actually believe (tho of course I could be wrong) that his emotions are very much involved, but he is completely scared to death by that.

    Anyway – he started contacting me back in March, we finally saw each other in May, but again I was misunderstanding the situation and clinging on. Amazingly, he didn’t run. We had a really huge talk in July about where things stood and we decided that we should just enjoy each others company and see where it led. More than friends, really, but we are not being intimate. We are both on Match and have both been on other dates.

    My question is this: Since I want more from him than just this middle ground, how do I handle it when I don’t hear from him for what seems to me to be a long stretch of time? It’s incredibly painful when we have a fantastic time together (as we did this past Tuesday – I actually got a text from him immediately afterward which said “I had a great time with you…”) and then I don’t hear one peep from him. I am experiencing the pain, flowing with it, processing it in my own body. But do I SAY something to him about it? That seems whining, overfunctioning and controlling “waaa, waaa, you didn’t call and I feel sad.”

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated – thank you!



  220.  #220Rori Raye on August 13, 2010 at 7:57 pm

    Jen, Welcome, and the deal is – you express to him the level of contact that feels good to you, and then you Circular Date and don’t bring it up again – you just watch and observe and see if he’s a man who can give you what you want. Love, Rori



  221.  #221Matty on August 14, 2010 at 6:25 am

    I wrote on this thread back in April, and the advice Rori gave me was exactly what I needed to hear – this has to be about ME. I had to soul search, figure out what I wanted, and communicate it. It couldn’t be about playing games — I had to assess what I wanted, I had to clearly communicate that and THEN I had to stop talking. The results were a couple of things: First, I learned that I had to be willing to lose this person completely from my life. That step was the most difficult part for me, without question. Not that I was saying “Do this or I’m gone”, but I had to be strong enough inside to walk away once I had communicated what I wanted and if those needs weren’t then met. In my case, he & I did go through a period of me literally doing that. He heard me, he understood me (he was shocked, just as Rori said he would be – there was an AWFUL night of getting through that – but it showed me how strong I could be because I was telling the truth, and at the same time I was showing him that I did still care about him deeply. Basically, I was in control of me), and after a couple weeks of him “stepping up” on things, he again semi-disappeared. So at that point I found a time to say to him (and I’m not saying I always did this perfectly – it was extremely emotional – but I was always telling him what I wanted and needed in a truthful manner and not pleading) that I had been clear with him – he knew where I stood and since things weren’t all that different, I was going to go do what I had to do to have the life I wanted and needed. Literally I went ‘dark’ on him. Not to punish him. But because there was nothing left to do – I had told him, nothing changed, I was done. That was extremely difficult, but knowing that I had said and done exactly what I truly felt inside (that’s key), I had the strength to move forward.

    So, that was 3 months ago when I walked away completely. He did show back up after a short time period of being quiet, and here’s the bad news and good news at the same time – he’s not going to be with me. That hasn’t changed. But what he is doing is being my friend. He talks to me about my dating life (no gory details, it’s just he’s been my best friend and I need someone to talk with to get through being out in the dating world after not having done this in a long time.) He often tells me he loves me and wants me to be happy and he’ll do whatever he can to support me in moving forward. And that’s the role he plays. That’s it – no girlfriend/boyfriend stuff. At times it feels sad because I know everything that was lost between us, but I’m happy to have him in my life still. And we don’t slip back into old roles, because he knows where I stand. In fact, he sees me doing exactly what I’d said I would do. And I believe he respects me more for doing that, than if I had sat at home waiting on him and not speaking my mind. Not standing up for myself.

    If you had asked me a year ago if our relationship could be at this point, I would not have been able to imagine it. He still knows that if he changes his mind, I’m interested, but he also knows that I’m already moving on. I’m finally back in control of MY life instead of wasting so much time waiting on him. Done with waiting.

    BTW, I’ve had 2 dates in the last 3 weeks. And because I’m not spending so much time trying to make things work with this guy, I’m doing many more things with girlfriends and on my own (like taking classes and doing stuff with my dog and my house and such. I mean I actually sometimes leave the cell phone at the house when I run out now!! I just had no idea how much I had allowed this relationship to stop me from living my life, trying to always be available to and for him.) I feel I’m finding out who I really am, which means I don’t HAVE to find someone else in order to be complete. But I do know I would very much like someone else to share my life with who will be here with me. I know now that the situation I was in before will never happen to me again. I’ll find “him” some day.

    Thank you, Rori. 🙂



  222.  #222Misplaced girl on August 30, 2010 at 11:58 am

    How do you deal with someone who just wants to chat on the computer all the time or email and not see you much in person? Maybe once a month this guy suggests getting together in person. I’d really like to get to know him better and we seem to really click in our conversations on the computer, but to me, it seems like if you never spend time with a person in person there is a wall up keeping you from getting any closer. And the “intimacy” you get through lots of conversations in emails and chats is kind of artificial. I’m looking for the right words to say – I can’t even define my feeling (besides discontented or frustrated, which don’t seem like good ones to use). I would be happy to spend more time with this guy in person and get to know him and see if there is a romantic spark, but I’ve had enough with the computer communications. I always make sure to let him start the chats online and I always try to be the first to get off them. I could just totally block him from my chat and just not answer his emails, which kind of in my heart is what I think I should do. Ideas?



  223.  #223Rori Raye on August 31, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    Misplaced, Welcome…chat is useless. What are you getting from this? Love, Rori



  224.  #224Jellybelly on September 9, 2010 at 11:51 am

    I created a speech…but I don’t feel brave enough to speak it. I want to just leave it somewhere he can read it when I’m not home. So I don’t have to talk about it right then.

    Or ever. I am afraid to show my mushy sensitive self to him. (Silly girl, you know it only gets better when you do. You’ve done it, experienced it. Why are you scared?)

    I am afraid of what he will say. I am afraid he will pull away forever. I am attached to the outcome.

    I cannot say my speech… yet.

    We have created a life together, a beautiful family. You swore to love and cherish me forever. I’m not going to call you a liar, but you are not very good at this marriage thing.

    How dare you accuse me of creating a separate life from you, when you are the one missing from our home all the time. How dare you accuse me of being untrustworthy while you create lie after lie for an imaginary life. A life where you tell people I am just the mother of your children, that we are not together, and it is just the circumstances that we still live together.

    I am embarrassed. Thoroughly embarrassed, even though others think “we’re not together”.

    I’ve allowed myself to become trapped in an imaginary marriage. So many times I thought Rori’s Imaginary Relationship letters didn’t apply to me. I have a husband, I have a family, OF COURSE this is REAL.

    No, hunny. No it’s not. You want to go on pretending you’re “married” you do that. But don’t mistake imaginary for real. A real husband would not behave like this.

    He has opted halfway out. Like he doesn’t have the guts to leave, or the strength to change.

    How dare I put up with this nonsense!!
    (this is not my speech to him, btw, I’m just writing to talk here, where I can’t talk for real yet.)

    Well, I have about had enough of you and your drama. I don’t need or want it.

    (i still want you)

    I printed out my speech and left it in my underwear drawer. On top of everything, first thing you see.

    I switched the dresser drawers around last week. He was stuck on always opening “my” drawer because that’s where his used to be. Stuck on it after 2 years or more. I didn’t tell him I switched the drawers, and it was a riot of laughter and good fun when he opened the dresser.

    He now opens “his” old drawer all the time looking for his socks.

    Funny, but I kind of like living dangerously like this. Like at any time he could just stumble on my speech that I am so afraid to say.

    Because it will change things, and this change feels scary. I don’t want to lose my man after 14 years. That’s truthful.

    I can not do this pretend any more. I am disgusted with my doormattish, wimpy behavior. I would NEVER EVER put up with such nonsense before we were married, before I knew him, from any other man.

    But for some reason, he get a free pass now?

    I love myself, and I will not allow anything to throw me off my stride.

    I might stumble, but that’s ok.

    I will tell you someday all that I wrote.



  225.  #225Rori Raye on September 9, 2010 at 12:06 pm

    oh my, Jellybelly – can’t wait for the next bit of your story! Love, Rori



  226.  #226Jellybelly on September 22, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    Hi ladies,

    I ‘ve rewritten my letter (thankfully he didn’t find my first one, I think there was too much written to myself in that one. So now I’m working on cutting it down into a speech I can deliver. I don’t think I can say it all in one conversation, but here’s what I wrote. I borrowed a lot from other posters here, so I hope no one minds. Do you all think there is anything I should change or delete altogether?
    ——————-
    Our commitment took a leap of faith. But I don’t know if you want that anymore. Even as the love of your life, I may not be “enough”. I feel unclear and uncertain if you ever will be ready to recommit to me. I feel unhappy and insecure “waiting” for you. I can’t take that kind of emotional strain, and I don’t want to feel insecure and always wondering how you feel.

    I want to feel calm and peaceful, and I want to feel loved.

    I want to trust that I am loved.

    I want a man who cares about making me happy.

    I want a partner to grow with through the rest of my days.

    Commitment is what makes that possible. And I don’t want to be committed to any man unless it’s permanent. I want you forever or not at all.

    I don’t want to push you. You are entitled to take all the time you need to heal and decide about recommitting to a lifelong relationship with me.

    But I can’t continue with our current arrangement. I feel like we are increasingly leading separate lives and it makes me unhappy. I don’t know if we should continue to live together anymore.

    I can not keep being with you in limbo. It doesn’t feel good for me to wait around wondering if you will ever think I am “it” for you. It makes me feel insecure and frustrated. I don’t want to feel that way.

    What do you recommend as the best way for me to take care of me while you take care of you?
    ———————–
    Part of me wants to delete the whole letter/speech and just ask him to move out. I don’t want to hear excuses for why he’s withdrawing, I want to call him on it. No more lame BS. Make it my choice that because he’s not holding up his end of the deal I am not obligated to hold up mine.

    And…the more time I take to circular date me, even if I only get an hour, is really showing me how much less I care if he gets off his *** and starts acting like he wants to be with me. Eye contacts and Hellos are the best gifts from others out in the world!



  227.  #227Eslyn on October 12, 2010 at 9:07 am

    Rori and friends,

    My gentleman friend of nearly two years is attentive, thoughtful, kind and sweet right up until we’re around women who are his “type,” and then he’ll go and talk with them exclusively, focusing on them like a laser, and practically forget I’m in the room.

    I don’t know whether he’s clueless as to the effect this has or what, but even other people have noticed and it’s embarrassing as well as hurtful. Can you help me with some words to use here?

    Thanks,
    Eslyn



  228.  #228Debbie on October 22, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    Hello ladies! I am new to this blog, but am feeling so excited and inspired by reading your posts which have been so insightful and helpful. I am in a bit of a situation and wondering if you could offer some feedback. I have been engaged to a man for almost 2 years. At the beginning of our relationship, he was affectionate, texting all the time, calling, asking to see me, etc. and doing all of the “chasing”. After about a year into our relationship, we became engaged and moved in together. Since then, it seems that the affection has dwindled away. The texting and phone calls have virtually stopped. When I ask about it, he says that he wants to save it for when he sees me in the evening. However, when he gets home, there is virtually no talking. For a while, I would initiate the conversations just so we were talking. I want so much more from the relationship and deserve so much more, but I really do love this man and want to make it work. I have been working on some of the tools using “Reconnect” and have leaned back. For the last week or so, I do not initiate conversation so therefore there is silence, or I find myself going into another room to read or find something else to do to. Last night, I was reading some of the blogs which I had printed out and he asked what I was reading when he came in. He actually noticed! YAY!! He has touched me a few times and been a little more affectionate and I find myself “melting” when he does. I am just afraid that he won’t notice enough to do anything about it. Any advice?



  229.  #229wondering on November 15, 2010 at 9:25 am

    Hi,
    That reminds me of my short sentences I said to- my boyfriend (5 months and a few days)who is divorced twice- and says he’s not ready-
    background: A week ago he said I could keep my business going for 12 years (til I could be old enough to retire) and then go on medicare! I was hurt- and said I thought I would be going on your health insurance- if things continue to go in that direction-and so we talked – and he says he doesn’t know for sure if he’s ready- and his retirement benefit would go down if he got married (he retires in 19 days and I was at his retirement benefit interview for the explanation of it all about 2 months ago!) and he mentioned IF he got married again- what the benefits would be right there in front of me – about 5 times! so for him to say that well I couldn’t let it go- without commenting
    So yesterday heading toward his neices baptism he said (I pay to have my lawn mowed) that my son would be old enough to mow it in a year or 2- again- I had to say- what? do you think I’ll be in my same house in a year or 2??? and he said – I don’t know- and your’e not even divovced yet- I said it won’t take a year or 2 – and he said it has so far-

    Ladies- he asked me a couple of times including Sat. if I want jewelry for Christmas and if I want to help pick it out- or do I like surprises- Well if it’s not a promise ring or engagement ring- then anything will be disapointing-
    Again we do lots together he calls 3 times a day and in Jan after he retires we are taking a trip together – and I go to work and his families events and dr. appt’s etc…
    How can I move past “he’s not ready” it’s not you- I just was married twice- and get on to how wonderful we are together and he needs me and can’t live without me…
    THANKS!
    wondering



  230.  #230suncha on November 30, 2010 at 4:05 am

    I had an absolutley amazing week with my guy. so amazing i did something really stupid. I sent him a message telling him that I only wanted him and didn’t want to date anyone else and removed my profile from a dating website…inwhich he is still on.

    He has expressed to me in the begining that he wants more than just friendship, but he doesn’t want to be pressured into a commitment either. We’ve been seeing one another for 4 months…we’ve known one another since we were teenagers, but NEVER at the level that we are at now (we are now both in are 40s)

    How do I undo what I said to him?? I am suppose to go over his house on Wed. to cook dinner for us…should I just cancel and not give him a reason and go get my hair done???

    How do I undo something I already did that you said not to do?

    Thanks



  231.  #231Rori Raye on November 30, 2010 at 9:48 am

    suncha…it’s not about “undoing” here – it’s about USING the ‘blurting” to go deeper and get more connected by TALKING!!!! You’ll have to see how he is–really get how he’s being with you. If he’s standoffish, ask him what’s wrong…and bring up your discomfort about your exuberant actions…if he’s GOOD – just don’t bring it up – because…he’s good, and what’s there to talk about? Or – you can bring it up with “I’m feeling silly and uncomfortable with what I did last week….how are you about it?”…Do NOT play games!!!!!If you are the type of woman who’ll cancel a date, not give him a reason and go get your hair done – then you’re playing games, you’re being totally superficial and making relationship with any man impossible. This is not hard to get – this is stuff that doesn’t work. Love, Rori



  232.  #232Suncha on November 30, 2010 at 11:07 am

    Dinner is still on, it was acknowledge by one grunt from him!! This is what I said to him ” I’m sorry for all the messages I sent. I had a really nice time haning out with you last week and it felt REALLY good just being with you; I wasn’t able to contain myself so it kind of exploded everywhere…..and it wasn’t pretty.”

    He is very quite..didn’t respond when I asked him what was wrong. So I guess this is my cue to ” just leave it alone”, and see what tommorrow brings. Should I behave as if nothing happened and just be my normal happy self, if he acts as if nothing happened?

    He’s known me since I was 19…he is fully aware that I am an emotional person and that I am a physically and verbally affectionate person. I’ve noticed that he is somehow “training” me to only give him affection in the amounts that he finds acceptable and comfortable; which I don’t mind at all. He has bounderies just like I do. So why would a man want to be with someone he has to “train”?



  233.  #233lost in love on December 6, 2010 at 5:25 am

    Hi rori, thankyou so much! boy did i ever find you at the right time!!

    so i have drafted my first speech and wanted to get some feedback on it from everyone…

    the situation is that my boyfriend of a year is currently overseas after his visa expired in my home country and i will be going over to live in the same city but not with him as before as just before he left he told me he was “unsure” about his love for me and that he still had some feelingsfor his ex back in his home country.
    So i told him that we couldnt be together and leaned WAY back over the last few weeks he was here. During that time he did a complete 180 and told me he was wrong and still loved me and he was stupid to throw away his chance of being with me.

    of course this was very touching to hear as i love this man deeply. i think he would come back here to be with me if he could but he cant apply for another visa for 12months so i have chosen to go over there (feels like chasing!!!) so i have written this speech in preparation for when i see him (its been 6 weeks since he left)… any comments would be greatly appreciated!!

    I feel that you need time to work out what you really want from this relationship, or even if you want it at all.
    I understand and don’t want to pressure you, but I don’t want to wait around just to feel heartbroken if it’s not going to happen.
    You can have as much time as you need but you can’t have me all to yourself while you’re taking your time and making up your mind.
    I felt that it would be good for me to be in the same city as you to allow myself the time to be close to you but not contstantly with you all the time.
    I don’t want to rush you but I love myself and have to look after my own feelings and desires.
    I love the connection I have with you and I don’t want to break it up.
    I will not sleep with other men while you’re making up your mind, but I don’t want to be exclusive with you while you are unsure about your feelings.
    I want to feel secure, happy and excited about my love life!
    I don’t want to feel unsure, sad or anxious.

    thanks to all the ladies whose speeches inspired me!!



  234.  #234Eslyn on December 8, 2010 at 11:00 am

    Rori, I hope I handled this right –

    I wrote back on Oct 12 that I’m with a guy who gets so focused on other women at times, he forgets I’m even there. Last week, it happened again. A woman who was invited to a holiday get-together by one of his friends started talking to him and the next thing I knew, more than an hour had gone by and he was standing there, literally leaning forward toward her, oblivious to me or anyone else. Others were noticing and making comments to me about it.

    I went over and asked if I could speak to him privately for a minute and said this to him:

    I’m not having a good time. I feel ignored and like I’m second-best and I hate feeling like this. I don’t like coming to a party with a date and feeling abandoned as soon as an attractive woman shows up. I’m going to take myself home and find something to do that feels good.

    He looked a little surprised, like he didn’t quite understand, but I noticed he went back over to her and started talking again when I had my coat and was leaving.

    Should I have said anything more? or been more exact? or maybe just said I was leaving and not told him where I was going?



  235.  #235Mary on December 30, 2010 at 1:52 am

    Hi,
    I`ve been seeing I for 7 months and I feel that we`re going nowhere! I`m about to begin circular dating!
    Here`s my speech in response to his comment about not being sure what he wants at this time….
    I totally get that you need time to figure out what you want.
    I don`t want to put pressure on you or push you.
    I don`t want us to finish because I feel we`re good together.
    But I feel trapped and uncomfortable.
    So you can have all the time in the world to figure out what you want and if you want it with me.
    But you can`t have me all to yourself.

    Is this too abrupt?
    Thanks
    Mary
    But i feel trapped



  236.  #236Rori Raye on December 30, 2010 at 8:43 am

    Mary – it’s the perfect “No Girlfriend” speech…Love, Rori



  237.  #237Eslyn on December 30, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    Rori,

    After the event I described (see #236) I decided to get back on an online dating site and I guess my vibe changed because an old flame sent me flowers at work and my guy took note of it. He hasn’t said anything yet but I can feel it’s coming. I have mixed feelings about getting back out and actually dating — does circular dating include just “lurking” on dating sites? or do I really need to take the plunge and get out there physically and in person?
    Help!
    Eslyn



  238.  #238Dorothea on December 30, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    Eslyn, unless you are engaged/married, stop lurking and date. fun! If you have agreed to be exclusive with your guy already, give him the no gf speech and start dating. we’ll help you!



  239.  #239Eslyn on December 30, 2010 at 12:27 pm

    Thanks, Dorothea – We never actually agreed officially to be exclusive and in fact he has occasionally taken someone he used to work with out to lunch and has gone to a female friend’s house for dinner a couple of times (he says there’s nothing between them but I don’t like it). He doesn’t see that as dating but I do and I hate feeling like he’d think it was still ok to do that even if we WERE engaged or married. I think I might need help with my speech since we’ve been in this holding pattern for two years and I don’t want it to come out sounding angry.

    Eslyn



  240.  #240Ros on January 1, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    Dear Rori,
    just a quick note to ask for some feedback. I was going out with a guy, for about 3 months, things were starting to grow or so he said that he felt every time we met our relationship was going a layer deeper. Then I found out he was encountering men through websites for casual sex, as well as women whom he referred to as friends but with whom I suspect he also had sex (at least one of them).
    When I faced him about his promiscuity with men (and probably women) he told me he felt vulnerable. I asked him to have an hiv test and I also said I would have one. 2 week later he pulled out of the relationship under the excuse he felt no chemistry.
    I am still shocked by all that happened and I have been feeling very angry. I hope I have learnt something from this experience, but I also feel powerless (even guilty at times) and wonder why this happened to me.
    Is it that my views are not open enough? Or that it is ok for a guy to have an exclusive secret to himself (not even his ex wife knew about that?). He told me that that was his secret and that it was like doing drugs, and that that was part of him.
    Any help would be great, especially because my heart currently feels stalled.
    thanks for your help in advance
    Ros



  241.  #241Eslyn on January 2, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    Ros,
    The most endearing thing anyone can say is that they feel vulnerable. His saying he feels no chemistry (after the two of you have had sex?!) tells me he’s playing you. As to “his secret” the answer is no – he’s not allowed to have a secret that can endanger the lives of people he’s intimate with. Why it “happened to” you is because you chose it, but you can make other choices starting now. He’s said this other side is like doing drugs. Accept that he’s an addict and say good-bye, as soon as possible in whatever kind (but not leaving a door open) a way as possible.
    Hugs,
    Eslyn



  242.  #242Dorothea on January 2, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Hugs, Ros! You will certainly have better in the future :):):)



  243.  #243Eslyn on January 2, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    I agree, Dorothea, and as Rori says, even the “shluppy guys” are here to teach you something.

    Maybe this guy is here to teach you to listen less to what “old programming” says and more listen to your inner intuition. We so often over-ride our inner voice. This guy must have set off some red flags earlier on — we get messed up by trying to mother them and heal them. That’s not your job.

    Hugs,
    Eslyn



  244.  #244Ros on January 2, 2011 at 3:57 pm

    Dear Eslyn and Dorothea
    thanks so much. Your replies have helped and yes I agree….I should have listened more to my inner intuition and voice which was screaming out loud at times…only I was too desperate to make the relationship work…self esteem is what I need to work on. I feel I deserve better…
    hugs, Ros



  245.  #245Eslyn on January 2, 2011 at 6:19 pm

    Ros,

    The good news here is it was a short few months. You can get past this pretty quickly when you look at the blessing that having learned who he is, happened so soon. I know he must have seemed wonderful, but you’ve learned something here and you’ll never forget it. Listen to that inner voice and reflect on why you ignored it. No amount of alone-ness is worth risking heart (and health!) for someone who seems wounded. Take care of that inner wounded one first, k?
    Hugs,
    Eslyn



  246.  #246Jeannette on January 2, 2011 at 6:25 pm

    Girls, what do you do when an ex long distance b’friend calls you on Christmas Day just to say Merry Christmas and talk a few minutes and you can’t seem to get it out of your head? I want to ask him WHY? WHY did you break up with me like you did after 2 years? I don’t buy the distance thing was too much like he said. H e-mails me occasionally but tries to act like we’re just good friends now. He sent me a Christmas card….To my dear friend….it said on the cover. I don’t know why he wants to keep a friendship….I just don’t get it. Once you break up it should be over. Does he feel guilty or what…I am just trying to figure it out and get it out of my head once again….



  247.  #247Eslyn on January 2, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    Jeannette – Depends on how long ago it was. If it was pretty recent (in the last 6 months) he may be trying to hedge his bets and try to keep a line of communication open in case his current Ms #1 doesn’t work out. If longer, which is more often the case, I’d say he’s just being sentimental (guys are that way more often than any of us recognize) and he maybe feels a little guilty too, so wants to “play nice” and not let you feel he lets the holiday go by without a connection.

    Truth is, if he’s been wanting more, he would’ve reached out before this. Don’t torture yourself — As Rori says, guys do what they want to do. It is what it is and (unfortunately, if you’re holding out hope) probably nothing more.

    Eslyn



  248.  #248Jeannette on January 2, 2011 at 7:38 pm

    Eslyn, I get what you’re saying. I’m sure he feels guilty cuz he’s a rather nice man. I think he would tell me over the phone if he missed me or wanted me back. He told me he thinks of me often and I said I think of you a lot too. And you know what he said? He said, “I know.” What the hell is that supposed to mean? I haven’t even written him unless he’s emailed me. Whatever! He must have a case of the guilts cuz I was so damn nice to him….and I was!



  249.  #249Jeannette on January 2, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    Should I tell him in an email not to contact me any longer if he’s just feeling guilt? It really doesn’t make me feel very good….or would he even tell me the truth?



  250.  #250Jeannette on January 2, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    What about # 251 girls?



  251.  #251Eslyn on January 3, 2011 at 3:33 am

    Jeanette, it sounds as though you’re hanging your hopes on this guy instead of just turning away and thinking about what you want for yourself. No, I wouldn’t email him (even if using the question of guilt as an excuse to do so). He’s showing you what he wants & doesn’t want. Let it be – get out and “circular date” and if he wants to start something up again with you, he will. If not, you’ve got your dignity intact and he doesn’t get to remember you as someone he had to be firm with to break it off.



  252.  #252Jeannette on January 3, 2011 at 3:57 am

    It just wacked me out when he called. Too much sentiment and I just need to give it up. He was just such a mystery man…we got along so well….had so much in common…..then he just wanted to break it up………I know I have to move forward. Now my life has taken another twist….I found my ex love from all the way back when we were in our teens. We hooked up last summer and now are in a very involved relationship. He is the one with liver cancer and fighting to overcome it. My life has been painted with some emotional pain and it’s just very very hard at times.



  253.  #253Jeannette on January 3, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    I’m still trying to understand a few things from all that’s gone down which I wrote in #254.



  254.  #254Eslyn on January 3, 2011 at 4:33 pm

    Jeannette – help me here — you found your old love, hooked up last summer, and in between, this other guy (who’s disconnected) came…where? It sounds as though there’s this continuum of guys who aren’t available. Am I reading this wrong? As to emotional pain, please – recognize that you get what you expect from the Universe…and from people.
    -Eslyn



  255.  #255Elle on January 5, 2011 at 12:10 am

    Hello everyone, I have been reading this site for some time now and just gave my boyfriend the speech tonight that I would not be exclusive with him without a commitment (they really work). My question now is do I delete him from my facebook account if I want to keep seeing him? If I do delete him wouldn’t this make him think that I no longer want to date him? I will not contact him or comment on any of his posts but just don’t know what to do.
    Rori and all you Sirens feedback would be terrific.



  256.  #256Rori Raye on January 5, 2011 at 12:20 am

    Elle – if your status is “in a relationship” – go back to “single.” I don’t know why you’d delete him, tho – aren’t you still going to “date” him? Love, Rori



  257.  #257Mandy on January 5, 2011 at 12:58 am

    I wanted some feedback regarding my situation, I was with my ex b/f for 18 months and I felt like everything was going great we spent most of our time together with all the children and I would stay at his when the children went with there mum/dad for the night and everything seemed great then out of the blue in October he told me that he wanted a break as he was not happy. We spoke about everythiing for days and we cried together he felt like i had had too many issues the past 6 months and I know that this was a problem and i had became too needy for him. Of course after reading everything i know now that i done all the wrong things at the time and made the situation a whole lot worse. After a couple weeks of us non stop talking about everything he said he cares for me deeply and he knows that i love him and he feels he cant give me what i want right now. He felt that too much had gone on and he was left feeling hurt. In the end I told him I accepted that it was over it was not what i wanted but he was free to do what he wants. Then he started seeing someone else someone whom he always said before was not a nice person we know her mutually through our childrens school now 4 months on his still seeing her and i have to face that daily at the school. Now he is the real problem I started reading your e-book Rori which i loved and started working on myself i have been out on a few dates but it felt strange and I know i have to carry this on but from the day I spoke to my ex and he finally told me it was definately over and he had met someone we ended up sleeping together and from that day on we talk most days and I have been seeing him 2/3 times a week. He comes to my house stays the night when his children are with there mum as he has the kids majority of the time, It feels great I love seeing him and it feels we still have the same great connection that we always did. Ive never felt so close to anyone before including my ex husband. We met after my ex husband had left me for a 19yr old he had got pregnant he helped me through everything we started as friends and the chemistry was everything I had always wished for it felt like magic we always spoke about everything did most things together and when we wasnt together he would call me non stop. Im now struggling with the whole situation I want us back together im struggling that he is seeing someone else ive been trying to circulate date although i find that hard, Ive stopped calling my ex now I leave it for him to ring me, he tells me he misses me all the time and cant wait to see me. I know i shouldnt be seeing him but i cant stop i love him so much and in desperate need of advice. He is the most wonderful man i ever met and I now know that everything that happened in the last 6 months of our relationship is everything that I shouldnt of done and i dont know where to begin to repair this how can i show him how much ive changed and done for myself now when the time we do see each other is limited and ts normally late when he comes down to mine we cant keep our hands off each other and I dont want it to stop but I dont want to be sharing my man either. I feel I deserve more please help im so confused right now.



  258.  #258Elle on January 5, 2011 at 7:29 am

    Thanks Rori! My commen sense was telling me that but guess I needed to hear it from someone else…the crappy part is I can’t CD because I just fell on ice right before New Year’s eve and did quite a bit of damage to my leg so I’m off of it for about 2 more weeks… but I can set up an online profile =)



  259.  #259Rori Raye on January 5, 2011 at 9:16 am

    Mandy – Welcome – and you can DO this! This has nothing to do with any man – it’s about your self-esteem, how you live your life, how your “energy” is. Work on THAT. Use Circular Dating to start feeling feisty and full of life again. You can see whoever you want and sleep with whoever you want – including him…as long as you have no expectations, no agenda – and that’s the hard part. So don’t do it if it makes you feel more needy…your goal is to get un-co-dependent. Step-by-step. Love, Rori



  260.  #260Mandy on January 5, 2011 at 10:48 am

    Thanks for the reply Rori im slowly getting there step by step and your e-book has helped me heaps already and im continuing to work on myself and I know in time i will get to the place i need to be I am enjoying spending the time with my ex and sometimes it is hard to detach myself from how I feel about him and how much I would love us to be back together but at the same time im enjoying what we do have right now and its a lot of fun. Im getting there with the circular dating the more practice i get the better ill be at it. Im enjoying finding out about myself and wish i had found you a lot sooner then maybe i would still have had my relationship but right now im getting happier being alone and with my children and enjoying more freedom. I dont want to be sleeping with anyone else right now just want that between me and S



  261.  #261Joy on January 13, 2011 at 4:13 am

    Hi rori,

    i wanted to order but ur country options exclud nigeria.how do i go about it,i lov ur leaning back program,is workin.



  262.  #262Natalie on January 19, 2011 at 8:54 am

    Rori:
    I really need help with the speeches. I have three of your programs and you book. Still I am struggling. I met my guy through an online matching service 8 months ago. We are so wonderful together. But, I am miserable when I have not heard from him for a few days. he says wonderful things, but, then I won’t hear from him for a few days. A few months ago he told me he can’t commit to me yet. Help! Natalie



  263.  #263Natalie on January 19, 2011 at 8:59 am

    I have been circular dating, but, I only want to be with him. he says the same thing even tho he is still on the matching website. he sends me texts, but, is reluctant to call, he hads not invited me to his house since the summer. When we are together it is at my house. When his dad came to town, he did not ask me to meet him, but stated later he wished he had. I am not sure what to do anymore. How do I know if he is “just not that into me”?
    Natalie



  264.  #264Lynette on January 28, 2011 at 11:49 am

    Dear Rori and all readers,

    I am very confused and feel very hurt by what I have experience over the last few months. I have a male friend, we met during our freshman year of college back in 1999. We had an instant connection, but I was very in love with my boyfriend back at home, so I never paid any attention. Chris was like my best friend, we did everything together. He has always been there for me and I could always talk to him about everything. When we both left and went to different colleges, he would drop everything and spend the weekend with me. We have gone on trips together and we have a strong bond. About 5 years ago, we slept together and it was a very intense, passionate, loving moment. At the time, I was in a relationship and he was as well. Nothing changed between us and we remained friends. After I broke-off my engagement to my ex and moved back to Tennessee, Chris got a good job in Nashville(2 1/2 hours away from me). He started calling more and inviting me to come spend the weekend with him. I would go to Nashville to get away and because our work schedules were so different. We would see each about once a month and talk to each other almost everyday. We began sleeping together and things seemed to be going well. About 6 months into, we had a big fight and he basically said that although it was so natural to be with me and get wrapped up in me, he was not ready to be in a serious relationship….it made me feel so hurt because he was the one who had initiated everything to begin with. He told me that I was the only one that would stay the weekend with him and that I was the only one that he was sleeping with. Why did he change all of a sudden!? Even after that, he still wanted to go on a trip we had planned and we went and had a great time. He was very affectionate…..always running his fingers throught my hair and touching me……it is so confusing! Even his best friends(whom I met on the trip) say that they have never seen him act this way with a girl. Now he rarely calls and I feel so miserable! I have been listening to some of your programs and I have decided to back away. I know that I was driving the relationship and he was letting me….which makes me feel angry because he has always been the guy I could trust.

    Can anyone give me any advice on what I should say if he decides to turnaround and lean toward me? I made the decision to stop contacting him and I have not contacted him since Wednesday and I refuse to do it anymore. What kind of speech should I prepare? I feel so disconnected from him when we are not in close contact. I really love him and I want to be with him, but I will not pursue a relationship that makes me feel constant confusion and/or pain. I love myself too much for that.

    Any help would be very appreciated, Thank you.



  265.  #265Rori Raye on January 28, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    Lynette – If you’re Circular Dating many men at once, and he wants to date you – and you can handle that – date him to – but NO BOYFRIEND stuff!!! No exclusivity, no investment. Get Targeting Mr. Right if you need help with this…and follow it completely. Love, Rori



  266.  #266Eslyn on January 28, 2011 at 5:56 pm

    It’s finished.

    I’ve said good-bye to the guy I saw for nearly two years and even though I know it was right (such a HUGE bunch of differences and him wanting to just keep things status quo) I feel awful.

    Anybody — help!

    Independent but sad,
    Eslyn



  267.  #267Femininewoman on January 28, 2011 at 6:05 pm

    RE 268 Eslyn love your sadness you will heal. Hug yourself.



  268.  #268nanceen on January 30, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    Dear Eslyn:

    I am so sorry for your pain and sadness. You will grieve. But one thing I do see in your email is “I am sad..” that is good! Because you are not devastated. There is a big difference between being hurt and disappointed and devastated. Devastated means all your sense of self worth was resting on their actions and thoughts about you. Hurt and sad means “I am sorry you do not agree with what I think and feel about myself, which is I need, want and deserve a man that is crazy about me and will go to the ends of the earth to get me in is life and marry me.” Hurt and sad means you are gently protecting your heart. You put up protection but are soft on the inside. I hope what I am saying is okay and correct. Love and warm hugs, Nanceen



  269.  #269ValerieM on February 15, 2011 at 10:54 am

    How old are the women circular dating. I guess I’m asking because I’m 28 and I typically date 29-32 year old men. I’m not sure they would be able to handle the “m” word right now. Yes I am looking for a husband at some point but I’m okay with a courtship of two years first. I do circular date until I have a boyfriend but I haven’t attempted circular dating until I have a husband. I might consider it if I could here from other women my age who have successfully used it. And if the boyfriend of two years doesn’t propose I would definitely look at circular dating. But I get the impression that a lot of the women doing circular dating are a few years older than me. Anyway hopefully I haven’t offended anyone with my question, as none was intended.



  270.  #270bf n old bf on February 16, 2011 at 4:37 am

    My speech,
    Drummer- I am thrilled to have you call and show interest in me after all these years-(18 I was married- and 8 selibate) I know you have been single for all but 2 of your 61 years… I know you like the bj I gave you last week- but I am dating a wonderful guy- and need to know- if you are interested in a relationship- leading toward marriage- (I have a son) or just want to have sex (b.j.)
    Coach- I know I said I wanted a committed monogomous relationship- and you said if we continue to grow closer we would get married- now into our 8th month – you say I am your best friend- but you told me I would take it wrong and we should talk about it later when I brought up if we are growing closer (and yet you don’t want me to date other people or take a break) (but the drummer and I got together this week in your indecisiviness) and I want to be able to see him too… since you are not ready-

    I really don’t even want to tell the coach that- til I know where the drummer is going …thoughts? and edits?



  271.  #271Daria on February 16, 2011 at 5:14 am

    Bf and bf – you need to date at least 3 men.

    Otherwise a ping pong kind of effect is created – like you’re experiencing here – and it’s not healthy.

    And please – it’s fine that it happened – but no more bjs – you need to practice receiving pleasure First.



  272.  #272bf n old bf on February 16, 2011 at 6:01 am

    am I obligated to tell Coach that we are not monogomous anymore? we are having sex…



  273.  #273Eslyn on February 17, 2011 at 9:47 am

    bs n old bf: First, I agree with Daria on both her points and next, it sounds as though you’re looking to Coach (or the other guy) to tell you where the relationship is going and whether the two (three?!) of you are getting closer. What do YOU think? What do YOU feel about what’s happening? Your relationships are not just the product of what the current man on the scene thinks of things — your opinion and what you want and don’t want comes first. If you and this Coach person were so close, would you have hooked up with the other guy?! Stop looking outside yourself for answers that can only come from within you…and then decide whether either or neither of these guys fits your bill.



  274.  #274bf n old bf on February 18, 2011 at 7:40 am

    good one! coach is everything I could want in a man-but drummer has been in my head almost every day of my life since I was 17 we dated 3 months and talked about marriage but I wanted to go to college-
    we hooked up through the years after-but nothing steady ever- until I realized at my age of 27 was an alcoholic- I gave him the AA big book – and by age 34 I gave up on him coming back and married someone- (well I’m now divorcing) and the drummer has been in AA and credits me with his recovery has made contact with me -and agrees we can see where it will go- I feel after all the years of pining over him- I need to give it a chance- but I am supposed to be in a monogomous commited relationshp- boyfriend- with coach- but coach is not ready for anything so I guess that leaves me free to check out drummer and decide what to do-… right?
    thanks ladies I need your help!



  275.  #275Ros on February 18, 2011 at 7:48 am

    Hi bf, I wa married for about 15 years to a man who was an alcoholic: he was a great loving man but he was toxic. And that turned me into a toxic too (not from alcohol) but from pain in a relationship that never improved despite all promises he wouldn’t drink again. It took me years to recover.
    Why chance it again with a toxic man, now you have a steady boyfriend who perhaps just need to decide what he wants (in Rori’s way he might just need to committ).
    Why throw away a healthy relationship for a chemistry (teenage chemistry – you were 17) that might put you back in a toxic relationship? Don’t you thimk you deserve better?
    Hope it all works out for you
    Ros



  276.  #276Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 6:35 am

    Hi Valerie, I am 62 and circular dating, mostly younger men since the ones my age rather sit in a recliner with a remote. Alas I keep running into 50 year old bachelors with committment issues. 🙂



  277.  #277Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 6:58 am

    Day 3 of breakup and looking for a number 3 to continue circular dating. Getting back to feeling like the first domino. Was really crazy about the guy, but “things may grow in time” and “never say never” was not enough.

    I am now needing help with what to say if or when he contacts me as we are neighbors. This is my speech and I hope somone reads this thread and gives their input.

    I care about you a great deal, but hearing “things may grow in time” and “never say never” while being informed other women are being checked out, is a situation I cannot settle for.

    Feel like saying more, leaving the bal in his court and not push him away totally, but not sure how to word that.



  278.  #278Eslyn on March 7, 2011 at 3:41 pm

    Eileen Mary –

    I’d leave out the “while other women….” part. Just let him know that those old phrases of his (did he really say that to you?! dear God!) don’t work for you – that you want more, etc. The fact that he almost seems to be rubbing salt in the wound by letting you know “other women are being checked out” is right up there with, “hey, stick around honey, because if none of these other women excite me, I’ll keep you on a string longer — don’t write me off because hey, you might (but probably not) get lucky.”

    btw, you could actually say to him, “I’m enjoying getting out and meeting other people too — I’m not pushing you away, but I know the perfect relationship for me is one with a man who knows what he wants and it’s me.”

    At this point, you smile sweetly, give him a kiss on the cheek and be sincere knowing you’ve given probably more than he deserves and either he’ll get a clue or he won’t but you haven’t been dramatic or bitchy. (You have something you need to go do at this point, eliminating the need for further conversation.)

    Best of luck,
    Eslyn



  279.  #279Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 4:54 pm

    Thanks for the response Eslyn. As it turned out I passed him on my daily walk. I am not changing my route for him. I feel it was on purpoise as he knows my schedule. He made eye contact with me and paused, I said nothing and later felt like I snibbed him and sent him this email. I know too long.

    “I felt very uncomfortable today and did not know how to respond. Did not want to snub you, but have many confused feelings. I felt a hostility Friday, that I did not feel I warranted and that set me off. It is true that we have grown very close over the past year. You opened up to me and expressed many deep emotions. Asking about my disability that is a deeply personal thing to me had an emotional effect me. It is because I felt that emotional connection and trust getting stronger that I could no longer settlle for “things could grow”, “Never say never” while at the same time being told other women were being sought out. I have always said I did not want to do that and it makes me feel unappreciated. Personal quirks such as slow to communicate I can accept, but insensitivity to my feelings that diminish my worth I cannot.”

    This is the response I got.

    “Hi,
    I can appreciate your feelings,but I will not revisit this again. We have gone over this multiple times and it seems to me that there is no easy one sentence answer! If you really feel that I somehow did not ever have our best interest in mind then there is nothing I can say to mitigate that! I have never “depreciated” you at any time! I would never do that! I am sorry if you feel differently. ”

    Totally ignored why I emailed. Didn’t ask huim to revisit anything and denies my feelings. This was not the end of it. I felt I had to stand my ground.

    Me:”I did not ask to revist anything, just stated my feelings based on what has been said. The only point in being told others were in the works could only have a hurtful effect on me, that did depreciate me. Not the intent, but that was the effect. This response feels like Fridays attitude towards me, harsh and dismissive. I only contacted you to explain I was not snubbing you.

    How does it go from I am one of you most trusted friends on last Wednesday to a cold sorry if you feel differently. I am not your enemy. Help me understand this.”

    Him”And I think there in lies the problem. Too much said. That the true meaning somehow gets lost in the translation. I feel at this point that no matter what or how I try to explain that there will not be an adequate resolution in your mind. I will atone at this time for my not being able to choose the right words to express myself to your satisfaction!”

    Me “At this point I am almost afraid to respond. I should not be treated as the enemy for giving reason for not responding to you this morning. There was definitely anger and put downs in the responses. It was hurtful. Where the anger comes from is not my business, I just know I did not do anything to cause it. It saddens to think the closeness we shared vanishes in so few short days to where you think I am on the attack. ”

    Him “OMG, there is no anger what so ever .”

    Me “Please reread what was sent me as if you were receiving it. Certain phrases were at best cryptic and not kind. They came off angry. I only ask I be treated as I treat others. There semed to be a jumping into the shallow end of the pool. Naturally, I feel the break up was harder on me and don’t know how you feel about it, maybe that can account for this.”

    No response to the last email.

    I decided the break up, he willingly agreed. I do feel he was leaning on me so I would.

    Need some help as now I rather spit in his eye, forget snubbing.

    I am consoling myself on OKCupid and need to redo my profile. Trying to stay on the horse.



  280.  #280Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    Didn’t want it getting too long. Yes he did say that to me and he has asked me my opinion of woman that contacted him, even showed me her pic. Actually, I think he is jealous. I just turned 62 and have guys in their 40’s chasing me and he knows some of them. He told me in a year he only connected with two woman. One didn’t interest him and the other she wan’t interested.

    Oh her most certainly knows he got more tyhan he derseves and I think that is the problem. He recently had triple hernia surgery and I was the only one around to care for him. He could not even dress himself. While in surgery a brother showed up and told me my brother cares about you. Duh I never met him and was surprised he knew I existed.

    I broke up with him Friday after sex told him I wanted to be first mate to a Captain of a ship on the sea of life. A man with an open heart, not an undefined “the one” definition that aprreciates and grabs hold of me. His dog got a pet. No kiss for him just a goodbye.

    He is not stupid and he is not a player. He is rarely seen with a woman. He is a coward, but I am not taking responsibility for his words.

    Rant off! I got that off my chest, now please tell where I can improve besides nopt staying with a coward so long. 🙂



  281.  #281Eslyn on March 7, 2011 at 5:24 pm

    Eileen Mary –

    First, don’t beat yourself up for “staying with a coward so long.” We’ve all wanted to be kind the a “wounded bird” and we’ve all wanted to be the gentle, understanding one that would melt the distant heart that had perhaps been hurt or built walls around himself. All of us. But it’s usually a story we’re all telling each other.

    Rori says, “if a guy wanted to be doing something, he’d do it. You can tell what a guy doesn’t want to do ‘cuz he isn’t doing it.” We want to make excuses for them and end up facing down our gentle, beautiful selves and asking how we could’ve been so stupid.

    We’re not — you’re not — just learn from this. Watch for things like “weasel words.” Guys often tell you who they are in very easy terms when you first meet them. Next time, listen. It’s not easy but it’s simple.

    Big hug — you’re going to be fine —
    Eslyn



  282.  #282Eslyn on March 7, 2011 at 5:28 pm

    Oh, and Eileen Mary –

    Keep the email explanations to a minimum. If he emails back and wants to “fence” some more, tell him if he has anything to say, you’ll meet him and speak face-to-face but electronic talking doesn’t work.

    Then, if he does meet you, watch the body language (his and your own.) Don’t try to settle things without eye contact, voice inflection, etc.



  283.  #283Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 5:40 pm

    Man you pegged me. I thought I was over the woundewd bird syndrome. Towards the end I started feeling like his therapist.

    What is a weasel word? Have not heard of this one yet.

    Early on he told me fear is important. He really is not a trusting person and I am one of the few people that can enter his house when he is not home.

    It is sad. He really worries about being thought well of and is a volunteer EMT. He puts in many hours a week on the squad and I suspect because it gives him a sense of worth.

    Here I go getting all soft and mushy again.

    He already has another woman he met Sunday on a coffee date. He didn’t scare her off and they will go on a date I suppose. Poor woman



  284.  #284Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 5:51 pm

    I don’t expect him to take ownership of his words, he likes to think himself a kind person, he is not mean by nature.

    I don’t like the email thing. I don’t expect a response. Thanks for the easy to follow instructions.

    Besides keeping eye contact what othe body language of mine should I do?



  285.  #285Eslyn on March 7, 2011 at 6:02 pm

    First, recognize that if he met this woman for a coffee date, he’s interested in her. That’s big if he’s been someone you considered “your guy” for a long time — he’s getting out there meeting people! So should you.

    Second, take focus off him. To the very best of your ability (and find some new ones if you think you have no abilities here) go find things to do that you like.

    The idea is to get your whole mind & focus off him. In a week, two weeks, a month, MAYBE he’ll be in touch, but the ball is in YOUR court. You are the chooser.

    There are lots of nice, caring, kind guys out there; and it could surprise you how quickly a wounded bird will heal his own wounds if he finds someone he likes who doesn’t focus on what he needs to feel better. It could also surprise you how many very nice guys are ready to catch your eye once it’s not plastered to “love may grow with time.”

    This is the hard part — read back over some of the stuff I’ve had to do in the past couple of months if you have any doubt; but I have my self-respect intact and I’ve been contacted by some very (and I mean VERRRRRY) nice guys on quality dating sites and through friends that have made my head spin.

    Hang with yourself —
    Eslyn



  286.  #286Eileen Mary on March 7, 2011 at 8:22 pm

    In the past year I have been out on at least 30 coffee meets and dates. And have been circular dating. In the same time period he has met two and not future dates.

    After the irritaing emails I went on okcupid and had two contacts and a phone call tonight for a meet up. I love him or am hormonaly attached, but I am not leeting him run me down or change what I want for myself.

    Am I angry and hurt? Absolutely and with good reason and when he does eventually call I won’t be angry anymore. I I want to do is get myself stronger when he does. I have seen he has the ability to make progress with himself and maybe he would have made more if I had set better boundaries. I feel boundaries are what I need to work on for myself.

    It is not like it was all bad with him. It seems the more he got into expressing his feelings to me the more he withdrew. I also feel I need to work on making a man feel safe around me. I am trying to let go of the anger and focus on myself. He is a deep tjhinker and has come back to me weeks to amonth later and told me he does listen and think about what I say. Who knows, but I am not going to sit around waiting. I was feeling it was all about him and he gave not room for another identity.

    I hear you. I have always told J there is a nice guy in there with my hand on his chest, let him out someday. Could be he learned enough from me and will find someone. God bless.

    Currently I am seeing an old classmate and not feeling a spark. A long distance one with an ex flame. And a guy 14 years younger that sees I am a godess. So now I am looking for a J replacement. Will mis the sex though. 😉

    I believe you therte are nice guys out there, I just wasn’ty going to meet them when I was with J. Will be looking for your posts to read and thanks so much for being a godess inspiration. Eileen



  287.  #287Not a writer or an orator on March 30, 2011 at 2:15 pm

    I was in a relationship for 10 months. I did everything wrong back then-I didn’t know about the girlfriend trap, I said the wrong things, pressured him, etc. (Why didn’t I know about Rori then?). I got out of that relationship and had two new short relationships since then that didn’t work out as well. Now I’m stuck in a sort of friends with benefits situation with the first guy but I still have feelings for him. After listening to Rori’s program, I’m pretty sure this is going to end badly for me….he’ll probably split with me to marry some other girl even though he previously was “afraid of commitment.” I know I need to change things but I don’t know how to tell him. We work in the same building so it’s a sticky situation. Please help.



  288.  #288bf n old bf on March 30, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    need help again-
    I am a girlfriend now 9.5 months- just back from a trip together- and he met my ex-, drove my son and I 8 hours each way, etc etc. and said if he’s alone in the nursing home he would give his money to his kids- so much at a time- I JUST blurted out You have got to be kidding you are projecting being alone in a nursing home!!!! he backed down and said If… and that he would spend his last 90k traveling or some bs… because he could live on his nice monthly pension- (honestly! ) this man has been married twice- but it just makes me angry that at this point he (still checks email on the dating site we met on) but said he only got one email in a month and doesn’t want to date anyone else- he’s not looking… and asked what I was doing on the site- so I said I was there becaue he told me to date other people but I jsut couldn’t (we are exclusive) he said I didn’t tell you to date other people- (well in other words he did twice – he said I could do better than him- and even on this trip – I said I feel like a whore – sleeping with him, spending 3 nights a week at his house while me son goes to grandmas, and then all of us in the hotel while on the trip down) so he said maybe we should take a break- and maybe see if we want to see each other! so what the heck was I supposed to think!!

    He is also thinking of taking a job part time as a card dealer- which I said would make him busy on Friday and Sat.!!!

    Is this going anywhere? (he went with me to the Jr. High school meeting and to my sons IEP meeting just last week- and also as I said on this trip and met my ex!)
    It’s hard to lean back!!! and I find it hard to circular date since we are exclusive-

    help : )
    bb



  289.  #289Eslyn on March 31, 2011 at 10:13 am

    This is for “Not a Writer” You are not “stuck” in friends-with-benefits situation. When he calls, you’re either out or busy. When he has called several times and you’ve been out or booked, he’ll blurt out that it seems you’re avoiding him. That’s the time for the speech, which this time includes “I don’t want to be a friend-with-benefits, or anything like that. We work in the same building, and I feel like we should be able to see each other without feeling awkward; but in the meantime, I’m enjoying meeting new people.”

    If he does split with you completely, whether it’s for someone else or not, you’ll know you never really had his heart and he was just using the situation because it was comfortable.

    Best to you,
    Eslyn



  290.  #290mary on April 21, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    Dear Rori, I’ve been married for seven yrs I have a 6 mnth old baby and a 5 yr old…my husband has meet someone who is interfearing with our marriage I read some emails they have gone out on lunch. He emaild her he wishes he would ofmeet her first instead of me.. that he feels butterflies when he sees her. She has sent him pictures. When I confronted him he said he was being stupid that they had lunch and that’s it. He had been going out to. Drink with friends like never before. I asked him to spend more time with the kids and myself… when I confronted him he also said that we. Are behind on bills and that ialways assume stuff that he has never cheated on me. My reaction was I have never accused you I always. Ask what’s going on because I notice you become distant. I want to be there for you idont want you to find other women to share ur feelings with. It seems as if heno longer cares for me he doesn’t even say I love you he stopped calling mefor break and lunch in there emails she sends him when its time forher break they go to break together… please help me I don’t knwwhat to do….



  291.  #291Feeln Stuck on May 2, 2011 at 8:34 am

    Dear Rori,

    Been seeing a man for about 3 1/2 yrs rollercoaster ride. We are both single parents his daughter is going off to college in August an I have a 9 yr old son. Schedules are crazy an not much time to see each other. There are times when we talk then after we see each other he gets standoffish. I do my own thing and let him be. I’m asking how to speak my feelings better to him an how to get him to truly commit to me.



  292.  #292Want it to work on June 18, 2011 at 2:17 am

    Dear Rori,
    Things have gotten distant with the guy I like. He has clearly told me that he is attracted to me, likes spending time with me, but that for no particular reason he is not sure we have serious couple potential. I have not figured our how specifically to challenged him to give it a try. We are in a pattern of him contacting me, me saying let’s do something and him going silent, then I hear from him again in 3 weeks. I do not want to keep suggesting that we get together. He should do this. Currently, we are in the part where he goes silent. A week ago we were chatting online. It got flirty, very much so. He told me he wanted to kiss me and that he thinks I’m extremely attractive and I told him he should invite me over and I called him. Wrong move, I now know. He didn’t answer it and texted back not tonight and I havent heard from him. I sent him another message a couple of days later on a random topic just to have a lighter conversation and nothing again. I want to tell him that my feelings are hurt and I am not ok with him not replying me or taking my call. I realize I was too forward and got carried away. How, specifically, do I get this across successfully? I also want to inspire him to seek me out and ask to see me. My plan is to tell him I’m hurt. When he asks why, that’s where I get lost. I should also mention that this will start out in texts but I want to actually have the conversation on the phone since in person seems like a long shot at this point. How do I say what I want to say without being bossy, seeming needy and with becoming desirable. He’s attracted to me, I just need to figure out how to show my true self and get him to seek me out, the actual things to say. Specific help, please!



  293.  #293Want it to work on June 18, 2011 at 2:20 am

    Dear Rori,
    Things have gotten distant with the guy I like. He has clearly told me that he is attracted to me, likes spending time with me, but that for no particular reason he is not sure we have serious couple potential. I have not figured our how specifically to challenged him to give it a try. We are in a pattern of him contacting me, me saying let’s do something and him going silent, then I hear from him again in 3 weeks. I do not want to keep suggesting that we get together. He should do this. Currently, we are in the part where he goes silent. A week ago we were chatting online. It got flirty, very much so. He told me he wanted to kiss me and that he thinks I’m extremely attractive and I told him he should invite me over and I called him. Wrong move, I now know. He didn’t answer it and texted back not tonight and I havent heard from him. I sent him another message a couple of days later on a random topic just to have a lighter conversation and nothing again. I want to tell him that my feelings are hurt and I am not ok with him not replying me or taking my call. I realize I was too forward and got carried away. How, specifically, do I get this across successfully? I also want to inspire him to seek me out and ask to see me. My plan is to tell him I’m hurt. When he asks why, that’s where I get lost. I should also mention that this will start out in texts but I want to actually have the conversation on the phone since in person seems like a long shot at this point. How do I say what I want to say without being bossy, seeming needy and with becoming desirable. He’s attracted to me, I just need to figure out how to show my true self and get him to seek me out, the actual things to say. Specific help, please!



  294.  #294Eslyn on June 18, 2011 at 10:37 am

    Want It To Work –

    I hate to say it but it sounds as though you’re desperate, and I’d bet that’s what he’s picking up on. You talk about “challenging him to…” and to “say what I want without being bossy.” I’m not sure what Rori will say, but it really sounds like you want to make things happen instead of letting him come and get you. You’re so afraid he won’t that you think the way to “fix” it is for you to take charge and show him what to do. Ain’t gonna’ work, girlfriend.

    The only way you’re going to snag this guy’s interest is by dropping the oars. If it’s a long shot he’ll see you in person, you don’t have anything real anyway; but on the off chance he’s just waiting for a chance to make a run at you, you’re going to HAVE to stop going toward him. And if he does initiate a call (don’t even bother answering his texts…he’ll have to at least pick up the phone and call) don’t lead off with what he’s been doing wrong.

    Be upbeat, uncaring about his not having made earlier contact, and then be really busy and have to hang up the phone before the subject of seeing each other even has a chance to come up. Two or three of those calls (always initiated by HIM) and the subject will come up a lot faster if he wants to spend time with you.

    Good luck –
    Eslyn



  295.  #295daisyduke on June 20, 2011 at 8:10 am

    Hey guys ,

    This is my first post, please be gentle 🙂

    So my situation in a nutshell. I have been friends with benefits with xxx for almost 1 year. Time flew by. Anyways I would love to take it to the next level of commitment. We get on well, share similar interests, great sex..no amazing sex. Yet the connection, commitment isnt there yet. Im still dating other guys and he knows this.
    I saw him last on Sat, he said, youve changed and smiled. I thought yeah, I bet thats because I am leaning back,palms up~ being relaxed around you and not asking you why youre quiet or if youre okay…I’m focused on me.
    I know that casual fwb rarely develops into something long term, but Id be soooo grateful for any advice/speeches you can think of. We usually text a lot ..so something of reasonable length.

    I was thinking something like this…
    hey xxx, i feel amazing when Im around you, we have a lovely connection together. 🙂 xxx

    It doesnt tell him what i realy want though, but im scared he will run if i ‘ask’ for more, I really want him to ask ME! for more.

    Thanks, daisy xxxx



  296.  #296Eileen Mary on June 20, 2011 at 9:09 am

    Was in one of those for 15 months, ended it in March. Now he is monagamous with another woman. Sent me an email 2 weeks ago after a chat that ended in a hug and a few passionate kisses and telling me I was hot. Can’t thank me enough for all I gave emotionally and physically and I will remain in his thoughts always. Sees more of new woman than me. Lean way back, keep CD’ing and try not to think of him.

    Would love to get back with mine, but changing my vibe and starting new ventures that please me (getting back into painting) and CD.



  297.  #297daisyduke on June 20, 2011 at 9:24 am

    Thanks Eileen Mary

    Yeah its weird..on the surface we are perfect for each other, both attractive, active, friends, have a laugh together are sexually compatable…so whats not clicking for him?
    or is it? and he is too scared to ask me. He has said he only wants something casual, but he seems to have been single all this time too. He was really affectionate too and seemed happy to kiss and cuddle for long periods of time.



  298.  #298Eileen Mary on June 20, 2011 at 9:29 am

    @ 295 Want It To Work

    First figure out what you really feel and why you want it to work. So far as I can tell he has only expressed a physial attraction and I would think you want more than that.

    “My plan is to tell him I’m hurt. When he asks why, that’s where I get lost.”

    Leaning forward. You are lost because you are trying to plan how to get him. He should be working to get you.

    I am with Eslyn on this one. Don’t answer texts. Let him call you and don’t mention the lack of response to your leaning forward. Do not take any last minute offers to get together. Screams desperate. Are you circular dating? If not do so. Makes it easier to lean back and not jump at any chance he offers to get together.



  299.  #299daisyduke on June 20, 2011 at 10:25 am

    @want it to work

    I wouldnt tell him youre hurt, it sounds like you blame him for making you hurt…and however true that is he wont want to feel that way. I would just approach things fresh when HE gets in touch with you again.

    I like the saying ‘you can only be treated the way you allow yourself to be treated’



  300.  #300Eslyn on June 20, 2011 at 4:21 pm

    Hi daisyduke – From everything I’ve gathered from Rori’s stuff, things like speeches are for when the guy comes toward you and is in some sense pursuing. Your guy doesn’t sound as though he’s doing that. “He has said he only wants something casual.” He’s not scared – he’s telling it like it is for him, and you don’t want to believe it. If you want to do a speech, first of all, don’t do it texting – in fact, do that less and less so he has to at least phone (i.e. you’re making it too easy for him). Second, when you do see him in person, you could say simply that you really enjoy him but the FWB arrangement just doesn’t feel right anymore – that you want something more meaningful. You don’t have to have long explanations to give him or even clarification of what it is you do want — just leave him to think that one over and whatever you do, don’t apologize for your feelings or go back on a promise to yourself to insist on something better. There’s nothing more awe-inspiring (and fascinating!) than a woman who has boundaries.

    Good luck,
    Eslyn



  301.  #301daisyduke on June 21, 2011 at 7:02 am

    Thanks for your reply Eslyn,

    He said the ‘casual’ thing when we first got together, so I just wondered if our time together was developing and he had become more receptive to us being together.
    I dont want to have ‘a talk’ about it and scare him off. I think he is a man who thinks ‘if its not broken and its working, then why change anything?’ The only change I would like is for us to be together more, and give a ‘real’ relationship a go.
    I know him quite well now, and the ‘scared’ part refers to how his ex cheated on him with his friend/s. Yeah plural~so I think he is hurt and apprehensive to let his guard down, and by keeping things ‘casual’ he wont get hurt again. Men are deep emotional creatures too.

    I have stopped texting now, I have sent one short email but its not in relation to ‘us’, just advice on something. I dont intend to text him again.
    I saw him today we were both driving and we kinda noticed each other from a distance…normally I maybe would have texted ‘hey i saw you today:)’ , but I’m not going to!

    Daisy



  302.  #302Eileen Mary on June 21, 2011 at 4:30 pm

    Daisyduke

    If you are not circular dating start immediately. Do not text, send any emails or call him. Change your vibe, and stop trying to figure him out. Figure yourself out. Forget he is scared, that’s his problem not yours. You are a great woman and he would be lucky to get you is the attitude you need to develop. Maybe then he will take notice. If not a better man who sees your worth will.



  303.  #303daisyduke on June 22, 2011 at 6:43 am

    Eileen,

    Yeah i am CD’ing. I do see a few other men, but not sexually. I even dated one guy for a few months and never saw xxx during that time.

    Youre right, need to stop everything. I think he is toxic and Its not going to go anywhere good.

    Thanks xx



  304.  #304Jenny on July 4, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    Hi ladies…a greating from a swedish siren here 🙂

    I’m right now working on a speech to give a man…by msn, since we havent meet yet.

    There is 3 things I want from him.

    I want to hear more from him, dont need to chat 2 hours each time, just phonecall, mail or sms.

    I want him to take the lead – he made a promise when we started to send msn to each other to never ever put preasure on me. I didnt ask for it, I was at that moment so sick of all other males who did put preasure on me – wich this man got to hear. And after I had told him how I feelt about other man was disrespuctfull to me, he made teh promise; wich he keeps too good :/ Soo right now, well it is allways him who take contact, but argh I feel like he is totelly following my lead, and I hate it. He shows a lot of respects, and says he will give whatever I want if I ask. So I know he will do it if I ask.

    He made a promise to write me a letter where he would tell me his dreams, and how he wants to take care of me, threat me. And argh, been a month since he said that…and I’m kind of going out of my skin soon, I’m so curious.

    The problem I get a little stuck on how to say it all…and the fact I will have to do it on msn.



  305.  #305Peg on July 13, 2011 at 7:25 am

    Hi Rori,
    I just received your program and have found it so supportive and full of good advice.
    I have come to a situation in my marriage where I need to write my first speech and I am not accustomed to recognizing, let alone communicating my feelings in a positive manner, so I am asking for your guidance and advice on what I have composed so far.

    My husband (50) and I (52) have been together for two years and married for a year and a half. This is his third marriage and my second. We knew each other in high school so we had a familiar background when we started dating. Even though I made naive mistakes during our courtship, (like sleeping with him too soon) I went into the marriage knowing full well what could happen, but I was willing to take the chance because we talked about our concerns. Well, what I suspected would happen, did happen. After the courtship and a quickie wedding in Vegas, most of the romance and the fun stopped. I feel like I was dropped into a neat little void in his already established life and was expected to fend for myself. We have moments of connection and the sex is incredible when this occurs, but they are fast fading in comparison to the negative interactions we are increasingly experiencing. Right now our communication has broken down. We are away from each other for the summer because I am starting a business. The lack of communication has become unbearable for me. Most of the time I feel like an item on his to-do list. He calls me when he’s tired, hurting or depressed and always with a lame apology that he’s so busy he can’t call me, but I see that he does FB and talks to his other friends. I feel like I get his left over energy and all his garbage with little reciprocity. We have had several phone and text fights over this lack of loving attention since I left in June and now we just can’t have a conversation because of the elephant in the room! I’ve quit contacting him and wait for him to reach out to me as you suggest, but when he does it’s always about his troubles, his stress and aches and pain.

    It’s time to give a speech. Here’s what I’ve written so far:

    I understand that you are feeling stressed with all you have to do at work and on top of that feeling a lot of pain from the baseball injuries. I don’t want to to attack you or put more stress on you than you already feel, but I have to tell you that I feel emotionally drained after most of our conversations which makes me feel resentful and angry. I don’t like living my life feeling resentful and angry at you all the time. I want to feel love, compassion and empathy for you. I want more than anything to be a loving, fun partner and confidante for you and I want to feel good about the direction our relationship is going, but I need loving attentiveness and quality time to feel good about our relationship.

    Thanks for your feedback!



  306.  #306Leida on July 13, 2011 at 3:38 pm

    Hello Rori,

    I have been practicing your tools since last year and I feel a lot better about myself while on dates or on my own. Thank you for what you have done for us girls…

    At the beginning of this year I met this guy and we started dating. I stopped Circular Dating – I know I shouldn’t have…sigh…we dated for 2 months – it felt heavenly, like the best relationship I ever had.
    Out of the blue one day – he says we shouldn’t continue dating as he was having feelings for me and did not want to hurt me. He is 36 and I am 42 – the age difference is important to him. I was shocked because he knew my age, it wasn’t that he didn’t.

    I accepted the reality and said good bye. He tried reaching to me after that but I ignored him. I started circular dating again but I was still thinking about him and felt hurt.

    After I got over the hurt and the pain and I did some tools to really release him – guess what he showed up again.

    We have been seeing each other for the past two weeks but I feel in a limbo. We haven’t spoken the future, we haven’t talked about physical exclusivity – and I want to do that. We have a great time when we are together but he doesn’t contact me as he used to. So it doesn’t feel good.

    This time I am not stopping circular dating and he knows that…

    I do want to have THE TALK with him but I am stuck. I don’t know where to begin. I don’t want to push him away…but I don’t want this to be a relationship that we assume things and get hurt again.

    I will have to start by telling him how I feel and I need to sort out my feelings first.

    Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.



  307.  #307Annie on August 4, 2011 at 9:56 am

    Hi Sirens wanted some help with my speech. Feel unsure if I if would be better to express more of my feelings or if keeping it short is best. And does it appear cold when what I am wanting is warm and open but strong on the inside not cold on the inside.
    Would feel so great to hear others perspectives.

    I no longer want to be involved with a man who is sharing his home or life with another woman.
    I no longer want to be involved with a man who doesn’t stay in contact with me.
    I no longer want to be involved with a man who has friendships with other women.
    I feel totally disinterested and bored with being someone’s on and off fling of the moment.
    I am done with the fling bit, been there done that. Feel time to learn from it and move on and not allow myself to be pulled backwards.
    I want to feel happy peaceful calm content and secure and being involved with someone who wants something different to me is not in my best interest and does not fit in with my life.
    I am responsible for the situations I put myself in and continue to be in so
    I love you and hear that you love me but feel sure the words all you need is love are false as it takes more than saying you love someone to have a real loving adult happy relationship. So if what you want from me is to continue with pop in and out of my life as and when it suits and fling of the moment I will not be staying in contact



  308.  #308Femininewoman on August 4, 2011 at 10:07 am


  309.  #309Lisa on August 4, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    Dear Rori,

    Please help me. My boyfriend recently told me he feels uncertain about us as a long term relationship. He is interested in seeing someone else that he dated a few times a long time ago. He still cares about me and he has fun with me. We broke up last year also and he went back to the ex-girlfriend before me. He then came back to me. After reading your e-book I now believe that what is happening is that I am overthinking everything and pushing him away. I think he really wants us to work out but my behavior keeps making him think we can’t work out. My question is this. Now that I’m in this situation with him not really being in love with me and wanting to see other people, is there any hope for me? We talked and right now we are spending less time together and he is supposedly open to us working. The plan is to be on the sort of break but not entirely and then in a few weeks we plan to take some time together to try to reconnect. I’m having trouble feeling like he is giving us an honest chance. If we don’t spend much time together how can we know if anything has improved? I am the one who suggested we do this sort of break instead of him seeing this other girl. Is it likely I have pushed him so far away that he is already decided to leave? Is he just hanging on to me for sex? I really want to change myself and help him open back up. I’m just afraid it could be too late.



  310.  #310Annie on August 4, 2011 at 4:04 pm

    Thanks feminine woman yes I feel like a yo yo. Says he loves me and I mean everything to him and wants to explore if we have a future together That his ‘love in partner’ is now just like a house mate but can’t leave because of finances. And now has gone back to his cave so want a speech for when he comes out. Feel usure how to make it shorter and if it is too cold, what do you think?



  311.  #311Annie on August 4, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    How about.
    I no longer want to be involved with a man who is sharing his home/life with another woman. And wants and needs platonic friendships with other women
    I Want a real adult emotionally connected secure loving honest relationship with someone who is consistent is staying in contact and wants to move forward into a committed shared happy life
    So if what you want from me is to continue as we are with pop in and out of my life as and when it suits affair of the moment and wait and see I wish you happiness in finding what you want and will not be staying in contact



  312.  #312T. T. on August 8, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    You have encouraged & inspired me Rori ~
    Here is MY POWER SPEECH:

    You know, I FEEL uncomfortable & confused. My purpose for being in a relationship is because I’m looking for a permanent shared life together.

    I am looking for the “real deal”, but I feel afraid that I may be in a dead end relationship.

    You are absolutely entitled to take as much time as you need.

    However, I love myself and I have to pay attention to
    my own feelings and needs.

    I don’t want to put pressure on the relationship.
    I don’t want to attack you.
    I don’t want to put pressure on you.
    I don’t want to try to convince you of anything.
    I don’t want to chase you, rush you,
    or make you feel pushed or trapped.
    Most of all, I don’t want to be angry or resentful,
    and I don’t want to waste my time.

    You can’t have me all to yourself while you’re taking your time
    and making up your mind about us.
    I enjoy what we have together.
    I enjoy you very much.
    I do NOT want to break up.

    I will remain sexually exclusive with you
    while you’re making up your mind,
    IF that exclusivity is returned &
    you are not using me… but that’s all.

    Comments, suggestions, & ideas are VERY welcomed!!!

    Thank you for the changes in my thinking, resulting in changed behavior, that you have helped to bring about in my life, Rori!!!

    Even a counselor/coach needs a counselor/coach sometimes. : )

    Gratefully yours,
    T.T.



  313.  #313JMHS on August 27, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    Hi Guys, I recently bought Rori’s programme-Targeting Mr Right and I love it. However, I intend to give a power speech but I need help with a problem which isn’t addressed specifically in it. So PLS HELP!!
    I was in a relationship with Chris for three yrs and he seemed like the perfect guy in every way you can think of, with one exception he never brought up marriage and our future. I drifted into another relationship through insecurity while still with him and both these relationships ended disastrously. With Chris it was worse because although he had forgiven me, albeit not forgotten, about me sleeping with someone else, I ended up just walking out without a word. I left because I felt guilty because I had destroyed our relationship. And we got in contact again because he sent me a message for my birthday three months later. At which point he told me how much it had destroyed him and how much he cried (something he never thought was possible considering he hadn’t done so in over ten yrs). Chris accepted some responsibility (without me even saying) for not moving our relationship on to the next level. That was a year ago.
    He has been in my life since and does not want to leave. We are not involved sexually. I wanted us to get back together last year and expressed that. He said he was feeling uncertain about us and we will see what happens, so we stayed friends. We talk every day and he would happily do whatever I ask him to do but he would not cross that line. Three days ago I decided that enough is enough and I need to know what’s up, only to find that he has been seeing someone else. He claims there have been no promises and that he still loves me but he still needs time to think whether he wants to b with me. At which point I got angry and gave him an ultimatum (after watching Rori’s videos on targeting Mr Right I know how wrong that was).
    I intend to start circular dating but I have trouble coming up with a speech for him. I thought about using the no girlfriend speech but I am not his girlfriend. Someone else is. I know he will want to stay in my life but I know it will hurt too much knowing that he is seeing someone else and this may affect my circular dating moreover I speak to him too often and I love him a lot and I still want us to b together but I want to be his wife nothing less.
    So can I have some help with my speech please and what do you think about telling him he can’t stay in my life anymore? My girlfriend thinks I am being selfish considering that he loved me and treated me well when I ‘cheated’ and did not leave me. So apparently, I should return the favour and be happy for him and his new woman and stay in his life, which sounds absurd to me. I don’t want to be his friend; I want to be his wife. What’s wrong with being happy for him (even if I am jealous and sad) and leaving to concentrate on my life?
    Here is a rough draft of my speech, please edit:

    “I feel sad and angry that we did not get back together. And I feel uncomfortable and confused about what is happening with us. I hear you that you need time to think. And you are perfectly entitled to do this. However, in light of our circumstances i.e. you are now seeing someone else, whilst you are thinking I would prefer for us to be apart. This is because I don’t want to put pressure on you; I don’t want to try to persuade you to do anything. I also need to take care of me and focus on me.
    Moreover, I don’t want to be a girlfriend, I want to be a wife, it feels good being with you but I am going to start dating other people. Until someone wants what I want and wants me for a wife I feel better to keeping my options open.”
    Followed by:
    “What do you think?”

    Help Pls



  314.  #314JMHS on August 27, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    I should point out that we haven’t had sex in two years and this is mainly because of me cheating. And him having issues (real and imagined) with me not wanting him anymore. And he hasn’t tried to initiate it. Truthfully because of all the emotions that were involved in the breakup i only recently started to feel sexually attracted to him again. But now I am faced with the new girlfriend and his reluctance to end it with the girl for me ‘someone who didn’t treat him well and did all those horrible things and a year from now may do the same thing again and that would make him a fool.’ He says this would also be unfair to this new girl, which i totally understand. I just want to nurse my broken heart quietly without having to watch him with someone else to rub salt into my wound. Which is why i gave him the ultimatum.



  315.  #315kuku666 on September 7, 2011 at 6:11 pm

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  316.  #316madeline on September 9, 2011 at 7:36 am

    hi, there is a man who ia a widow and i am interested in. his wife passed away 5 months ago . when do you think he may be ready to date again ? i don’t want to pressure him. how do i go about this ?



  317.  #317Megan on October 17, 2011 at 9:42 am

    Sirens,

    I feel anxious about writing a speech to my now-distant bf. It’s essentially a goodbye speech, an “I can’t handle being friends” speech. BUT we had a bad argument recently which has triggered all this and I am still feeling very hurt about it.

    I feel confused whether to mention my hurt from the recent argument or to drop it, so as not to “beat a dead horse” and build resentment, as it is kind of an ongoing one.

    idk how to copy and paste the link to my comment which explains the situation but it’s # 102 on “Stay Out of the Long Distance Trap”

    i feel childlike in my lack of experience in this and in wanting your help!
    thanks



  318.  #318Megan on October 17, 2011 at 10:20 am

    this is what I have so far:

    Calum,
    I can’t be your friend.
    i felt very hurt by our last argument.
    it felt shocking and abrupt and rebellious and very uncaring.
    I felt disrespected. it felt sarcastic and condescending.
    I don’t like feeling this way at all and I don’t want to feel like that again.
    it’s not about the karaoke incident, it’s about my feelings.
    I want my feelings to be honored at all times and I don’t feel that they are.
    the distance and space between us has given me a new perspective on the relationship and I feel that…



  319.  #319Megan on October 17, 2011 at 10:22 am

    I know that he is not capable of relationship at this point but do I say that?
    how would I say this without bringing him into it?
    or do I just leave it at, it’s not working.



  320.  #320Megan on October 17, 2011 at 10:28 am

    T.T.,

    as you can see I’m new at this but your speech sounds great to me 🙂



  321.  #321T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 10:53 am

    Hey Megan ~ thanks for reading and posting on my comment. 🙂 ALOT has changed since then… AND, for the better: I gave my speech, distanced myself & became unavailable… my old boyfriend gladly went his way & never looked back (in reality & truth, he was toxic for me). Since that happened last summer, I have healed & grown stronger, and I have now meet and am dating a very nice man who is mature enough to want a serious relationship. Im taking it slow and KEEPING MY EYES OPEN (as its only been a few months).

    I am VERY PROUD of you, of the sand you are taking, and how concisely you stated what needed to be said…and you are RIGHT, its NOT about him ~ its about YOU…YOUR feelings, & what YOU want for YOU!! I think what you have written is GREAT! I wouldn’t bring up the fact that he isnt ready for a relationship or isn’t relationship material, because its NOT about him ~ its about YOU & what YOU want for YOU! So far, everything you’ve said is GREAT! I know how scary stepping out in this new way is & how difficult it can be! But we CAN do it, BOTH of us! Let me know how it goes. 🙂 T.T.



  322.  #322T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 11:14 am

    Hi Madeline ~ I apologize for my late response to your Sept comment above. I am a Clinical Counseling Grad Student, who specializes in bereavement (the cycle & process of both grieving & abuse) and the healing process. I would be very careful in considering starting anything other than a non-sexual friendship with any individual who has suffered the recent loss/death of their spouse, such as your friend has. In general, it often takes 1-2 YEARS to heal from the loss & death of a spouse. Just being available on a platonic level only at this time, IF that is what YOU are ok with, is all most in his circumstance & situation can handle. Anything more may just be sexual release only on his part…. and would you be “ok” and satisfied with just that, IF you knew it would NEVER be more than that & wouldn’t ever go any further? If the answer is “NO”, you would NOT feel “ok” with that, than you need to keep your distance and look else where for a relationship. Grief, death, & loss, and the healing process, are very sensitive & time-consuming processes to go through. I hope this input will help assist you in coming to a conclusion that is best for YOU!! 🙂 T.T.



  323.  #323T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 11:50 am

    Hi “JMHS” ~ I read your comment & power speech as well. I like it. I think you are right to listen to “The Truth” that is in your gut, and to FOLLOW IT….
    follow what you KNOW to be right for YOU!

    yes, you cheated while with him in the past, and he chose to stay in the relationship with you at that time ~~ that was his decision, actions & behaviors that he felt was right for him in THAT situation at THAT time.
    Now YOU must do the same….follow what is right for YOU, now, in this situation…. acknowledge YOUR truth, what you KNOW to be right for you in this NEW current situation, and follow it….
    moving on is always hard & difficult, but from what you have shared above, it is completely necessary for your own healing…. I think you already have a great start on doing just that! 🙂

    Dont let your girl-friends deter you from following what you know in your gut to be right for you in this situation, even if it means they distance themselves from you because they dont agree.
    Ive been down THAT road myself…. two of my closest girlfriends didnt agree with what I felt was right for me… in my case they disagreed with my decision to “Circular Date” & thought I was being a “player” & using/leading men on, despite my trying to explain the concept of Circular Dating to them ~~ so they cut off their friendships with me. I think that hurt more than the ending of my relationship with a long-time boyfriend who was non-committal with me & whom I realized was in fact toxic for me.

    Often there is some price/sacrifice inorder to obtain the healing we need…. whatever that may be, dont let it deter you from getting your healing and moving on with your life! And you have a terrific start ~ you are doing great!! 🙂 T.T.



  324.  #324Megan on October 17, 2011 at 11:54 am

    thanks a lot TT,

    it feels comforting and good to have your help and support.
    I’ve added some, plz tell me what you think:

    Calum,
    I can’t be your friend.
    i felt very hurt by our last convo.
    it felt shocking and abrupt and rebellious.
    it felt sarcastic and condescending.
    I don’t like feeling this way at all.
    I want to feel cared for. I don’t want to feel like that again.
    it’s not about the karaoke incident, it’s about my feelings.
    I want to make that clear.
    I want my feelings to be honored at all times and I don’t feel that they are.
    the distance and space between us has given me a new perspective on the relationship and it feels very sad to do this.
    I’m not saying I never want to speak to you again.
    we both agreed that we are free to do whatever but the prob is I still feel like your gf and as your very recent gf I still have feelings and boundaries. and when my feelings are hurt and my boundaries are crossed I don’t want to be told to “get over it”.
    I really wanted to stay in touch with you as it feels exciting hearing about your adventures but not at the cost of my feelings.
    I hope we can be friends one day as I still want to visit you in England and to show you America.

    i feel questionable about the 12th, or so, line down at the end of the sent where I say “sad about this”. orig had “sad about having to do this” and then changed it to just “sad” and then to this.
    I felt it sounded…less respectful towards myself (and therefore less attractive) with saying “having to” since afterall it is my choice, and I choose loving me.

    i feel very curious to hear what you and any others think. Cheers to standing my ground and practicing!



  325.  #325T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    Bravo Megan ~ sounds very mature, concise & to the point ~ I like it! As to the part of the sentence where you state that you are sad or sad at having to end it, I think just leaving it as a Feeling Statement” of how YOU are FEELING right now is good (ie: “I feel sad”). Or, if you rather, add what makes or is making you said… but keep is short, clear, & simple….such as: “I feel sad over our relationship”, or “I feel sad over the changes in our relationship”, or “I feel sad that our relationship has changed”….just remember to keep it short & clear/simple….mostly & above all else, keep the focus on YOU…. keep in the front of YOUR mind that this is what YOU want, what YOU need to make YOU happy….it will help you stay “upbeat” & positive while doing something unpleasant & difficult. 🙂 I hope this has helped encourage you!
    T.T.



  326.  #326Megan on October 17, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    OK – I feel good about what I have written but am hung up on the ending.

    Do I wish him the best, god bless, things like that if I’m still feeling angry and hurt?
    or just leave it @ thanks.
    I feel appreciative for all the comments I’ve left!



  327.  #327T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 3:23 pm

    Something along the lines of…. “I wish you much happiness and success in the future” is short & polite.



  328.  #328Megan on October 17, 2011 at 3:33 pm

    hugs to you T.T.

    I hadn’t seen your last comment when I had posted the last one, sorry!

    i feel anxious about feeling resentful if I end it politely.
    does this not feel un-authentic to you?
    i feel needy and nervous about asking so much from you! but you are a great help (((((hug)))))



  329.  #329T. T. on October 17, 2011 at 4:02 pm

    That’s alright Megan ~ no problem here. 🙂
    Glad I have been of some inspiration & encouragement to you. 🙂
    It is OK to be honest with yourself about what your feeling (anxious about feeling resentful….maybe you will, maybe you wont….maybe you will feel relief…???)
    and its also OK to be polite…..even if u just say “thanks”or nothing at all, rather just state how u feel.
    Its all about YOU ~ what will make it best for you. 🙂
    T.T.



  330.  #330Megan on October 18, 2011 at 11:23 am

    ok after some conflicting feelings popped up around the whole thing I have re-vamped it and still feel unsettled sending it without your opinion!

    Calum,

    i felt very hurt over our last argument.

    I don’t want to beat a dead horse.
    I don’t want to hold on to negative feelings or repeat conversations but if it pops up unexpectedly, and it feels bad,
    I don’t want a limit on how many times I’m allowed to talk about it or feel bad about it.

    I didn’t want to bring it up but
    it felt unfair for you to claim her as yours since I know everyone’s seen mr squishy now, and to ME, that feels like sharing him.
    It feels bad knowing they’ve seen you and it felt like complete disregard for me when I tried explaining this.
    I want what *I* feel to matter more than any co-worker’s opinion.

    I want to make this very clear:
    it wasn’t about the karaoke incident. it felt, AT THAT MOMENT in THAT convo, like my feelings were being tossed aside and that felt painful.
    the argument felt shocking and abrupt and rebellious.
    it felt sarcastic and condescending and i felt furious and very hurt.
    I don’t like feeling this way at all.
    I want to feel cared for. I want my feelings to be acknowledged at all times and I don’t feel that they are.

    I feel it’s best for me to cut contact with you.
    I’m not saying I never want to speak to you again.
    we both agreed that we would be free to do whatever but it still feels like I’m your gf and as your very recent gf I still have feelings and boundaries
    which coincide with this.
    and when a boundary is crossed and my feelings are hurt I don’t want to be told to “get over it”.

    I feel very sad about all this and was looking forward to staying in touch with you but not at the cost of my feelings.
    I hope we can be friends one day as I still want to visit you in England and to show you America.

    I feel appreciative of you uploading those pics to my fb but I already have those. If you get the chance, what I really wanted was the Milford Sound ones.
    thanks,
    and best wishes with everything (not that you need it),
    Carly



  331.  #331Megan on October 18, 2011 at 11:28 am

    ohhhh feeling very red-faced.

    am feeling very anxious about sending this and about getting your opinion and I just realized that there were some nicknames I wanted to leave out.

    *big gasp* this feels very embarassing and exposed.
    I hope you have a sense of humor and look past those parts. tehehe oh dearrr



  332.  #332T. T. on October 18, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    Hi Megan ~ I sense & feel your anger & resentment in your power speech…..it is good that you are getting it out. Just remember, you do not HAVE to send or use this version of your power speech. Often it is good to write many versions of our power speech, and never send or use them….it is just good to get it out. So re-write as many time as YOU feel necessary, until you achieve the version you like, that YOU feel most comfortable with, and is YOUR truth…..remember calm, cool, collected & factual is the best method of delivery. T.T.



  333.  #333obyski on October 19, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    Hi,

    I recently met a nice man that I like. I found out at the end of our first date that he smokes. Yuck. In addition, I got really annoyed several times in the evening because of the way he touched me – like scratching on my arm and hand, rather than a light touch.

    I’m hesitant to see him again because of the smoking and the way he scratched/touched me (some of his touches were very nice tough). I feel it is important to at least express my feelings to him next time he calls me for a date.

    1) Should I say both things that bother me, or focus on the “big” deal breaker one first – the smoking. I don’t want to be a total complainer right off the bat.

    2) I was just thinking to say “I really enjoyed your company, but I’m sorry I can’t date a smoker. I feel bad to say that because I really like you.

    3) Just cross him off the list?



  334.  #334T. T. on October 20, 2011 at 9:15 am

    Hi Obyski 🙂

    I think it is really great that you are recognizing your boundaries early in the dating process. There is nothing wrong with not liking something about a person and not wanting to see them again. The choice of whether you tell him the reason or not is completely up to you, should he call you back for another date. Responses range from a simple “No thank you” or “No thank you, I’m not interested” to a full explanation why, which should only be given if he ASKS for the reason(s) why. As always, responses are best kept short, simple, clean, and concise.

    And on a personal note, I would have an issue with someone who presumed to touch me too, especially without my permission or consent, on a first date…. especially if it was a “scratching” touch….. that would definitely cross a personal boundary.

    T.T.



  335.  #335Rossella on November 29, 2011 at 8:44 am

    Dear Rori,

    I need to ask you for some advice. I am watching your wonderful Commit Blueprint, as i would like to find a full committed relationship.

    I am in a relationship now with a man who I believe is a good man, only he is not interested in committing to live together. I have two children and he has one daughter who is now in University, so no longer living at home. He tells me as he has told me for many months that he loves me and that he’s 100% committed to me and has found in me the person who meets his needs, but he wants to keep the relationship as he says, as two parallel lines, where we both lead independent lives because he does not feel he wants to move into an environment with my children as they are not his children and that would disempower him, as he could not be in control of his space, etc.
    I told him that that is ok, that I am grateful for him to have shared his needs, but that my deep seated value and need is that of family, and so though I will still see him, I will now open my doors to other possibilities should they come along. He agrees with me and says that that is the best thing for me to do and that although he loves me he cannot meet my need. I believe he’s behaving from hurt, but also genuinely from his needs.
    I am in a sexual steady relationship with him: should I still have sex with him or should I withdraw that? Now things are clearer, I do not feel I can invest myself in the same way as before in this relationship.

    Any help would be very appreciated.

    warm wishes
    Rossella



  336.  #336Rori Raye on November 29, 2011 at 11:43 am

    Rosella – brilliant, brilliant question – and I’m so sorry for the frustration of your situation. This is the absolutely perfect time to practice Circular Dating full out. Get Targeting Mr. Right and follow all the instructions, do all the paperwork, and start dating other men. If this one disappears, that’s fine, if he stays as your lover, that’s fine. When you meet other men – you get a chance to get to know them slowly…and you get to choose whether this man is holding you back or not from fully giving these other men a chance – and if you want to drop him out of your dating life to allow these other men a chance at your time – and your body, too. You can GO for what you want – and you don’t have to “let go” of what you have until you want. Love, Rori



  337.  #337Rossella on November 30, 2011 at 7:33 am

    Dear Rori,
    thank you so much for the advice….it makes me feel very empowered about my choices and guilt free too.
    I just love the work you do and it has helped me immensely now as well as in the past, take care, Rossella



  338.  #338crystal carnations on December 14, 2011 at 10:45 am

    Basically in another post I have explained my wrestling with my fiancee’s porn use. It triggers all these low self esteem and fear of intimacy issues I have. He had this habit of telling me how many times he masterbated that day or joking about how slow his computer is because he has a lot of porn on it. It would make me feel so icky and angry and disrespected. So I wanted to communicate how when he brings this up it really makes me feel bad.
    Tinque helped me with my speech so here it is…..
    ” I appreciate your honesty about watching porn. However the thought of you looking at other women really upsets me. It makes me feel threatened, unsexy and a lot of pressure to live up to this ideal.
    I don’t want you to change anything ot even stop I just want to feel more secure so it doesn’t bother me. Porn really brings up all these insecurities which makes me feel like emotionally withdrawing. I don’t want to do that. I really want to heal all this stuff so when the subject comes up it really makes me uncomfortable and I find it distracting from my healing. I don’t want to get sidetracked and focus on porn when I really need to be focusing on these deeper issues that porn triggers inside of me. Thanks for listening ”
    What does everyone think? I feel like it is honest, doesn’t make him wrong and states my boundaries 🙂



  339.  #339Carol on December 19, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    Ok met this guy, dated about a month and a half, and it wasn’t getting serious, but he started to back off and I made the mistake of trying to figure out why. Now I know how to fix it (and I just asked about this on another blog post) but will never see him again I am sure. So here is my speech that I want to give, but don’t think I will ever get the chance because I can’t contact him or go see him. But I want opinions, even on how to get this speech to him!!

    So I did the classic, hey you don’t seem that into me and wondering why, don’t hear from you.. ramble, ramble ramble..UGH!! I don’t even want to think about the crap I said… And what I should have said and actually meant in my rambling way was.. you backed off are you still interested? This of course scared him off, haven’t heard from him in over a week. He actually said It’s not like I don’t like you and you are very beautiful and really nice but I don’t think personality wise we are a good match. He also had said that he didn’t want to upset me about things but he had been meeting other people.. but so had I and did tell him that in my next stupid reply but that was the last I heard from him.

    I have a shirt of his and was thinking about stopping over to drop it off and give my speech but you say here it is a no no, so I don’t know what to do.. anyways..

    I also have to say I was making the blunder of contacting him, asking to get together, taking control when I didn’t realize what I was doing..

    So here is my new speech and this is exactly how I feel. I wish I gone the “you backed off” question instead and hate myself for rambling.. but I do that..

    I wanted to tell you something. I like the you make me feel about myself. You make me feel good about myself. You make me feel beautiful and sexy and I like the way I feel about myself when I am with you.

    I also wanted to say that I was never upset about anything. I was confused and in trying to sort everything out I started in with useless babbling instead of saying what I really wanted to say. What I really wanted to say was.. You backed off, are you still interested? I just didn’t know how to go about it.

    I am not confused anymore, I made a u-turn and am back at the fork in the road, and know what I want and I know which way I want to go. So what I really want is a do-over. What do you think bout that?

    I also want to say I am not in love with you, I am not even head over heels for you, but I do have an attraction to you that I want to explore, and I know you have one for me.

    (I got this here somewhere and it is exactly what I want to say so I added it in).

    I also am not looking for a boyfriend, I am looking for someone to walk into the sunset with and until he shows up I don’t want to be exclusive with anyone.

    (we had talked about going to this place by my house for lasagna but didn’t get there so this is the end).

    There is only one thing I want from you right now.. and that is to take me out for lasagna.. that’s it. And I want to tell you, the lasagna is worth it and so am I.

    Opinions??



  340.  #340Pam on January 25, 2012 at 11:58 am

    Looks like I found the right spot to unload a question to some very experienced thoughtful women…

    My bf of three and a half months has been wonderful. After ten years of raising children (widowed) and two years of dating mr wonderful appeared. He is thoughtful, kind, attentive, concerned about my feelings (although I wasn’t sure why because this was new to me), strong, a wonderful thoughtful lover, everything I could ever hope for in a partner. We both fell madly in love. Our evenings were spent talking and just holding each other, our weekdays were spent texting sweet messages to each other. He takes me on nice dates and does things around the house. After three months he moved several of his things (clothing) over although he stills maintains an apt that he goes to every five or six days.
    The problem is in the past week he has withdrawn. I started to freak out. I’d text him to hear nothing back. He spent last Saturday evening on his laptop while I fell asleep on the couch, not complaining. I started doing research on Roye’s website and reviewed several CDs.
    So last night he came over after being at his place the night before and noticed that something was wrong. I did as Roye suggested and told him I was feeling confused and scared. Scared because I was afraid to confront him in fear that I would distance him more and confused because I said that I felt that he was pulling away. He immediately gave me a big bear hug and said he was glad that I was sharing but concerned that I shouldn’t be scared to share these feelings. He told me that there were somethings on his mind and he would share these with me later.
    The next morning he told me that he wanted to make sure I knew that my feelings were valid and that he was having issues with a pending trip to visit his father. He also said that I add to his pressure because I’m always planning things and that he said as long as I don’t try to “change” him or “make decisions for him” that things would be OK. He told me he loved me (the first time in several days) and I proceeded to have tears roll down my cheeks.
    I’m so worried that I’ll screw things up. I’m mad at myself for tearing in fear that I appear to weak. I have not texted him all day and as I write this he just texted me a sweet message to say he misses me. But now how do I react? My first thought is to text him back but I’m afraid I’m not “suppose to”. I can stop all my planning, something I know I’m obsessive about, but to not show my love for him is not something I can easily give up.

    Suggestions? Another thing he asked me was if I really knew what “love” is. Which really through me for a loop and I feel these has a different message. Any ideas?

    He was in a bad marriage for 29 years (controlling wife) and a tumultuous relationship for seven. Single for four years.

    Thanks so much for taking the time to read. We are truly blessed to have such a wonderful female community!



  341.  #341Shirley on April 5, 2012 at 8:47 am

    Hi Everyone….

    I have several questions:
    First for the inro to my situaton. I have been with my BF for 1.5 years, we dated 10 years ago for 3.5 years. I have been the only woman he ever dated and never married…..that feels icky. We broke up before because he cheated on me with his last wife…as karma goes she cheated on him and left him for another man and pennyless.
    I was the one that contacted him….we talked things out and things were going great until he got a job in another state. We are now doing a long distance thing. In December, after months of talking about marriage he told me he never wants to get married again. He has been married 3 times. We had a big fight things haven’t been the same since.
    Yesterday, he asked me to do something for him. I was tired and I didnt want too. But I did anyway. We got into a big fight. It was really stupid. But he decided to stay at a hotel instead of coming to see me last night. I feel like I’m fighting for something….that he gave up on. I’m starting to think I was the ultimate revenge for his ex.
    I love him….I know.
    I need a speech…..I need help with a speech saying I need more…I can’t be treated like this…and tha if marriage isn’t on the table I need to date other people. I’ve been trying feeling messages and at first they were working well. I feltt like he was hearing me. Now He has been repeating what I say and I don’t know what to do….

    HELP!!!



  342.  #342Tracy on April 7, 2012 at 11:51 am

    Okay, I was reading #31 by Aldonza, and it really speaks to me and confuses me at the same time. I am Circular Dating now, wanting to add more CDs to the lineup as right now there is just one..I like him alot, though I feel I need to CD because he isn’t committed to me yet..it’s just been a couple months.. So, I have said to him a couple of times that we are BOTH free to date other people, though at the end of the day I hope he comes back to me. It doesn’t feel good to me that he dates other people, though. However, isn’t this what guys do? They date multiple people until they find one they really like and step up. Hmmm…sounds like I was leaning forward when I said We are both free…Anyways, I still am confused why it’s okay for us to date multiple men, while it isn’t okay for the men to date multiple women? Thanks for clarification:)



  343.  #343Amelie on June 19, 2012 at 4:21 am

    I posted this in another thread, but have had no response. Hoping to get some help here…

    Island Man lives out of the country. I know how Rori feels about long-distance relationships, but we dated for 4 months before he moved and both feel a deep connection. He is usually very respectful, loving and kind- I wouldn’t have chosen him if he wasn’t. Anywhoo…

    We had set a time and day to Skype, which we don’t do very often, because of the time difference and work schedules. (We do talk on the phone and text a lot.) So needless to say I was feeling excited to see and talk with him. Well, I waited for about a half hour and no show. I felt angry, disappointed and disrespected. So I typed a quick “I waited for a half hour, thought we had a date?” and signed off.

    Then I took a nap. When I woke up I saw that my ringer on my phone was off and he had called 2 hours after we were supposed to chat, but didn’t leave a message. By the time I had realized he called, it was way too late to call him and honestly, I was feeling bad that he didn’t leave a message.

    He left me a quick SMS “Don’t know when did you wait…I also called you on the phone when couldn’t see you on Skype…no answer..” on Skype.

    So, instead of waiting to talk with him I sent this via text (the I’m just a girl speech): “I’m just a girl here…and I feel confused, and weird and bad when I don’t hear from you. Girls need attention and conversation and all that. It feels great to talk with you and when we set a time and day to Skype, I feel excited to see you in real time. Today, I felt disappointed. I don’t want to put pressure on you or our relationship. Is there something I should know? What do you think we can do that will work for both of us?”

    His response:
    “I was stuck in the south of the island due to a strong storm…but, made it home by 2:30 your time. When I saw you weren’t online anymore I called… why didn’t you pick up though? Were you “punishing” me? Why didn’t you call back? I kept Google Voice open to hear your call and fell asleep with the computer on my lap?! Why didn’t you? Is it sweeter for you to feel betrayed than to go…” ( and the message was cut off.)

    I felt bad that I had reacted the way I did- he is always timely and responsive to me…. but, I was feeling really disappointed.

    I responded to him:
    “My ringer was off and by the time I realized you had called it was too late to call you back. I feel bad that you think I would do something to “punish” you, I don’t want that. And feeling betrayed is not sweet… I’m curious why you didn’t leave a message?”

    And now no response (day 2)… what to do? Leaning back has always been hard for me. I have not used many feeling messages and never a speech like this one…wondering if it sounded ok? Should I have done something different?

    Day 2 I am feeling odd and scared and hurt that he hasn’t responded. I also feel like this situation was the perfect storm….

    Your help is totally appreciated.



  344.  #344Angie on June 24, 2012 at 5:01 am

    I am looking for A script for asking a man on a date. I met a guy online and I initially set the boundary of “no strings attached”. We have not met yet and I realized that I want to get to know him better. My initial reaction was to sever all contact with him because I am afraid of getting hurt. Upon talking to a dear friend, I discovered that I owe it to myself to give this man a chance. I have been in several bad relationships and run from good men. Is it too late? How do I take this initial step? Any and all questions and comments would really help me.



  345.  #345Rori Raye on June 24, 2012 at 10:32 am

    Angie – I want to give you a huge hug – and EVERYTHING you say here in your comment is a complete chaotic mess that will not serve you. “I am looking for A script for asking a man on a date. I met a guy online and I initially set the boundary of “no strings attached”. We have not met yet and I realized that I want to get to know him better. My initial reaction was to sever all contact with him because I am afraid of getting hurt. Upon talking to a dear friend, I discovered that I owe it to myself to give this man a chance. I have been in several bad relationships and run from good men. Is it too late? How do I take this initial step? Any and all questions and comments would really help me.”

    It’s as though you’ve taken all my work and the Tools and turned them each completely around and done and thought the reverse. First – I can’t imagine why any woman would set a “no strings attached” rule (this is not a boundary – it’s a nearly insane idea, unless all you want is booty calls). Then, YOU tell HIM no strings attached, then change YOUR mind, then get mad at HIM because you’re afraid of getting hurt. It’s all completely messed up. Please, please get at least the ebook and consider getting a coach. There are SO many great coaches – and participate here. You’ll get so much great help here to start seeing things more clearly. Your patterns are running you – and I’d love to encourage you to put your life into your conscious, waking hands. Love, Rori



  346.  #346Obisky on June 28, 2012 at 7:54 am

    I feel confused and I am not sure what to do. Lately, the man I am dating is smoking pot more than he used to. I feel disturbed by this because we don’t seem to relate on the same level and arguments come up more easily; there is more defensiveness and easy triggers.

    I told him that I feel disconnected with him when he smokes; the energy seems scattered, projects started and unfinished around the apartment. He says, that he is always trying to connect with me, hugging me, dancing with me in the livingroom. He is right about that. He says he does not feel accepted.

    I want to be accepting of him. But does that mean I have to accept his smoking pot? I don’t want to tell him what to do or make him feel unaccepted. He is a good guy and maybe I am being to nit picky?



  347.  #347Rori Raye on June 28, 2012 at 12:37 pm

    Obisky, In my experience with my own life and my friends and clients, you HAVE to ALWAYS be in complete, total, 100% acceptance of people in general, and your man in particular – and YOU to start with. A man will do his best to please you once he feels utterly accepted. Please observe yourself and your mind. What you think, what your body language says, what you say…root out all judgment and replace it with curiosity and unconditional love. If a man’s behavior doesn’t match with what you want, you simply then say – “this isn’t working for me, what do you think we can do to fix it?” And let him solve it – or you eventually will lose interest and find hyourelf leaving him. Love, Rori



  348.  #348Angie on June 29, 2012 at 7:11 pm

    Hi Rori, I purchased the ebook and the link says that “The page you are looking for does not exist.

    The link that you clicked on may have expired or does not exist.” what do I do?



  349.  #349Maria on August 21, 2012 at 8:10 pm

    Ok Sirens, here is my first pass at it. Yesterday morning he wanted me to get up early and give him a ride with me to my house in the city (even though his motorcycle was just fixed and the weather was nice). He said it was a favor to me so I wouldn’t have to drive. I told him I rather sleep in and was fine to drive myself. He got very angry and yelled at me and slammed the door on his way out – after we had just had an Amazing! weekend. It was weird. Here is my first pass at the speech:

    I was surprised and confused about how angry you were yesterday. You said you wanted to go with me in my car as a favor to me and when I said it wasn’t, the level of anger seemed disproportionate – so I’m guessing it was about something else. To take a guess, maybe it would have actually been a favor or a help to you, and judging the level of anger maybe it was important to you, in which case I wish you would have told me that clearly. It’s easier for me to understand things when I’m told in a calm direct way, and had that happened, I would have been glad to be able to do something for you! It would actually feel pretty good if there was some concrete way to show you appreciation. Again, I’m just guessing at the anger, I don’t really know because I haven’t been told anything explicit about this incident, maybe it was about something else. I care about you and our relationship and want things to be as clear and easy as possible for us. I think we can figure it out with a bit more direct communication. What do you think?



  350.  #350Kate on September 2, 2012 at 4:45 am

    Hello everyone. Rori – you are so fantastic. I have listened to many of your courses and am now excitedly waiting for my Heart Connection Toolkit…

    I am in the middle of writing my ‘no girlfriend speech’ as I have nothing left to lose and I actually feel like I could leave if he is truly not ready…

    We have a silly language where I call him ‘The Him’ and he calls me ‘The Her’, so I have written the speech in this language as I will likely be writing this to him as he is out of town for quite sometime with work and I thought it may make him feel something.

    “The Her loves The Him very much, but she does not want to be one of those women who waits for a man…

    She knows The Him does not want a girlfriend, and she does not want a boyfriend either. 

    The Her wants a partnership where honesty, calmness, harmony, amazing sex, and moments of silliness continue to flourish, and both people grow to be better human beings because of it. 

    The Her has always respected The Him’s feelings and will keep honouring them. The Him is entitled to his feelings and can take as long as he needs to decide what he is doing with his life. While he is deciding, The Him can no longer have The Her all to himself…

    The Her feels so sad writing this, but she has no choice – she wants to receive love as well as giving it.”

    Any thoughts?

    Thank you Rori (and others), Kate.



  351.  #351Roxanne on September 27, 2012 at 8:43 am

    Hello All,

    This is my first post. I am so frustrated with my current situation, and really would love some advice.

    I was recently involved with a living with a man who did a complete 180 on me after some financial issues rose up on his part. He began drinking heavily and lead me to follow him down that path. I moved out because I felt like things had become very dysfunctional and the relationship had turned toxic, but I was under the impression that this split living arrangement was only temporary. We had agreed that we both needed to work on ourselves but would continue to see each other in the process. A week after I moved out he freaked out and broke up with me, but said that nothing needed to change. ARGH!!! everything changes. I’m definitely not the type of person who can go from talking about marriage to barely friends and have nothing change, I don’t know anyone on the planet who can do that!!

    Anyways, the biggest issue I have is that when I thought the arrangement was only temporary I signed a lease on a small one bedroom suite for my nearly 6 year old son and I, and just used whatever extra furniture that we had stored in the garage. I left about 80% of mine and my son’s things at what I had, at the time, considered to still be my home. I really didn’t want to disrupt the home we had made for the kids, my one son, and his 4 children (who only visit on the weekends). His kids have gone through a lot on their mom’s side of the fence, and I really didn’t want to shake things up at their dad’s home too.

    It’s been a month since we broke up, and its a struggle to get him to agree to helping me move anything out. I can’t move things by myself, and with his current depressive/alcoholic/hostile state I really don’t want to make things worse by bringing someone else in to help me. My “home” feels like a very hostile environment, one which I am not comfortable entering by myself, and I would rather not move in front of the kids. It’s bad enough to see them tear up and withdraw everytime they see my son and I. His kids don’t know what is going on, I am not sure he has even told them yet, except for his 16 year old daughter, who is getting all the emotions from the younger ones piled up on her.

    This situation is toxic for everyone. I want to end it, but don’t know how. I have leaned back, and tried to get him to take the lead, but he simply will not. I am beginning to wonder if he is trying to use my stuff to hold me captive in a sense, either emotionally or materialistically. I don’t know. He hasn’t cleaned his house since I moved out, it’s disgusting.

    I feel as though he wants to play the victim. If I take control of the situation and things don’t go well (either by sabotage from him, or otherwise) then it’s my problem to deal with, my fault, and he can play the blame game and be super innocent. My rose-coloured glasses are off, I see that he is not someone I want to be with, but I love those kids, I don’t want to hurt them. With him not stepping up to take on the masculine position here, what can I do to get my stuff back? I think I need a speech here, but he hasn’t responded well to them in the past. I think his judgement is too clouded to receive my words, good, bad or neutral, he just can’t hear them.

    Is there anyone who can help me?



  352.  #352Roxanne on September 27, 2012 at 8:50 am

    P.S. Since moving, I have stopped drinking and put the focus on me.

    I started a diet program, go to bootcamp everyday and have taken on other activities. I’m not sure I am ready to date right now, but did purchase tickets to a speed dating event, just for the fun of it.

    His youngest and my son are the same age, and are on the same hockey team together. Last weekend I chose to sit away from my ex. I was hoping that this would let him know that I wasn’t there for him, but was there for my son. I think he just took it as me being angry and trying to make him jealous. My son really want to see his former “stepbrother” so I hung around and waited for them to come out so the boys could interact. I think that in some twisted way this may come across as leaning forward, as I am making myself available to talk to, but I don’t want to hurt the kids.



  353.  #353Rori Raye on September 27, 2012 at 8:58 am

    Roxanne – run, do not walk to your nearest AL-Anon meeting. GO – and ask questions. They’ll tell you what to do. My advice is not rooted in experience with a man like yours who’s in such bad shape, but if it were me, I’d either get the things I need at Target and set up a permanent, well-ordered, and happy home for myself and my son – or, if I needed the things at the house where he lives – I’d hire a moving company with big men, and go during the day when neither he nor his children are there, get what I need and get out of there. You don’t say how long you’ve been with him and how much of a relationship you have with his children. If it were me, I’d let the older daughter know I’m her friend if she needs me, and I’d give her the Al-Anon address and help her get there. This man needs to go to a doctor, to a therapist, and to AAA – and if he won’t go on his own – no one can make him. That’s what Al-Anon helps you to live with. Love, Rori



  354.  #354Roxanne on September 27, 2012 at 9:29 am

    Thank you Rori. I have sent a message to his daughter that no matter what happens she can always talk to me. I lived with him for 8 months, and became very close with his kids during that time. I would not have moved myself and my son in had there not been a promise of committed relationship, and eventually marriage.
    His children always felt that they could talk to me about what they were feeling, where they lacked this ability with their father, mother and stepfather. What hurts is that my ex was doing very well when I first met him, but when the first big crisis came up for him, he seemed to disintegrate before my very eyes. It was very easy for him to blame me for his downfall, as this crisis came about a week after I moved in. I don’t feel as though there was anything I could have done, or not done for that matter, that would have changed this mess.
    Al-Anon sounds like a good option. I can keep myself in check, and maybe begin to understand the issue surrounding his addiction.

    I can’t help but pity the guy, I’m afraid he will lose his children if he remains on this spiral. But as one friend suggested, maybe I just need to let him hit rock bottom. Maybe then he will begin to truly see what is going on around him. This is purely an instance where I cannot help him, only myself.

    Thank you for your advice Rori. I have enjoyed your book, blogs and videos. Keep up the wonderful work.



  355.  #355Ignis on January 7, 2013 at 5:38 pm

    I feel happy to be first one to comment in 2013 🙂

    I have a question that feels a bit different than those I red in the comments. I am wondering how a different languages and cultures can affect power of such speeches. My native language is Polish, but I communicate in Norwegian, since that is where I live now. I feel that some words or sentences just doesn’t make sense in different languages as much as they do in others. And how being from totally different culture can actually stop this speeches from working. Like in a culture where everyone needs to be equal and almost the same, and extremely reserved, when you say all the time what you feel about thing is making everyone to back off immediately. Has any of you experienced that?

    I am in a really messed up situation, that i feel is even too much to describe. It feels good though to change the mindset and feel better about myself after trying some of the tools here. But I wonder if being from such a reserved culture, and when things start to backfire, should one give it more time or experiment more with the language? They say that “all men are the same”, but maybe, just maybe the culture and language part is important as well to how this tools work?



  356.  #356Liz on January 20, 2013 at 2:57 pm

    Rori – I have been reading your blogs for years and have a few ebooks. I need help here. My guy of a year.. we had a fight and said that I was pissed at him because of a fight we had that night. I feel he over reacted over something minor and maybe I did as well. Things have been great between us until the holidays. He is under alot of pressure at work and with a child and I tried to be very understanding. He has tried in the midst of this to reach out to me and spend time together.. but I feel so scared now. He responded to me today but was so cold.. which scared me more. I sent a message apologizing for my part in the fight and said how I had been feeling over the last few weeks…that I was sorry if I was upsetting our relationship. that mainly I was just looking for us to find time together. I said it was easier to write down my feelings… rather than for him to feel presurre to talk if he didnt want to. I think I messed up here. I am independent I have a life, a career, etc… and I have been supportive of him in his endeavors over the last year. And kind and sweet. He said I am the woman he has always looked for. but we go through periods of fighting that last 2-3 weeks or so. Usually afterwards, he apologizes and on the other two occassions he has come back and said it was more him than me. But I am so nervous right now.. did i do the right thing with the note to him? I said, no pressure for him to call right away if he isnt up to it.. which is something he has said to me if he thought I was upset. I dont want to lose this guy.. ; (



  357.  #357Rori Raye on January 21, 2013 at 11:39 am

    Liz – If you know my work and tools and hang out on the blog – then you know I don’t think much of “fighting.” There are always better ways to communicate – ways that bring you closer, that do not lay blame, or make a man wrong. Creating SAFETY and trust is your number one job in a relationship – and job number two is sex and excitement and fun. You have to do these things for YOURSELF first so you know what you’re contributing to whatever’s going on. Just because you’re angry, and he’s angry – there are better, more fun, exciting, and safe ways to get that anger and rage OUT and heard (yes, in words and body language!) than “fighting.” Love, Rori



  358.  #358Liz on January 21, 2013 at 12:26 pm

    Rori. Thank you for responding. But what should I do? I sent the apology yesterday and asked if we could talk. He said he was on his way out of the house but we could talk later. That’s when I sent the feelings message. No response from him. I know the answer. I am to just focus on myself and be open if he returns. My heart hurts so much right now.



  359.  #359Emily on February 19, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    Hello,

    I’m not sure where to send this so I am leaving it as a comment in the thread that makes most sense to me.

    I recently left a relationship of 2.5 years. The words I used to describe my feelings were Disrespected, Unvalued, Unheard, Unimportant, Hurt, and Tired. I have been reading this blog and have seen that these words, while communicating my feelings, are also pointing to him as an agent in how I feel. I would like to know how others would express these feelings without being critical or blaming. What are some good alternative feeling words?

    My relationship was long distance, and involved race, class, and cultural differences – all factors which compound difficulties with communication. He also suffers from depression, which is a big part of the way he began to treat me. While I have compassion for his situation and want to be a source of love for him, I did not know how to remain in the relationship without feeling Hurt, Disrespected etc. So I would also like to know how others have communicated with loved ones whose behavior is affected by depression. How do you speak in a way that acknowledges the negative effects of depression on relationships while remaining supportive and empathetic?

    Thanks,

    Emily



  360.  #360Rori Raye on February 19, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    Emily – It’s pretty challenging, and I think you did great! You don’t want to be with this man, so why consume yourself with guilt and worry? My thoughts are that you were such a gift to him, and that the truth you spoke to him was powerful, and that he needed to hear it – regardless of how you expressed it. Unless your tone was belligerent and blaming – you did fine! Love, Rori



  361.  #361Emily on February 20, 2013 at 7:24 pm

    Thanks Rori for your supportive response :). I’m glad you mentioned guilt and worry. Those feelings are present, but more overwhelmingly it is sorrow, grief and helplessness in the face of an illness that is destroying a wonderful person.

    He lives in a place where high levels of racism and poverty are systemic. He has seen a lot of hardship and injustice in his life, and it is taking its toll. I know that he is the only one who can take the steps to heal himself. You are absolutely right that he needed to hear what I said, and if my words to him have given him some awareness of his state of being then I am glad. If not, maybe he needs to hear them again from someone else.

    The truth is that I do want him in my life. I care very much for him and hold him in high esteem. It’s just not an option at this time if I want to retain my self-respect. I am no longer contacting him, but have let him know that if he needs to talk about anything I am open. I am still attached to the hope of being with him in the future. I suppose time will help me to let it go.

    Rori, I wonder how you deal with cultural differences in your practice? Ignis touched on this a little earlier in this thread. How does one effectively communicate feelings, boundaries, and values across cultures. I do believe that underneath culture, we are all just people – but it takes a lot of patience and understanding to peel back all the layers of culture that hide us from each other. Sometimes we think we are communicating clearly, but don’t realize that we are only being clear in the context of our own cultural upbringing. Sometimes we think we are being respectful (for example), but our idea of respect and someone else’s are not culturally aligned. Does anyone else have experience with this dynamic in their relationships?

    Thanks again!