Do You Have To Love Him To Date Him?

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moviecoupleThe Question:

Hello Rori, It’s been six months and I’m still trying to get over the guy I love. Because we are friends, I still see him sometimes and talk to him as a “friend” and this makes me unable to let go of him, he thinks of me nothing more than a friend, or so he seems.

A new guy showed up and he’s giving me all the love, all the attention and all the care I could ever ask for, and he want me to be in a relationship with him. He has a great personality but physically very unattractive!

I don’t know whether I should give him a chance or not because I’m not in love with him, if I do give him a chance I might change my mind after a while and end up breaking his heart. I’m still not over the guy I love (the guy who wants to be only a friend). What do you think I should do?

My Answer:

You don’t need to be in love with someone to date him.

You are ALWAYS Circular Dating.

Give every man who adores you a chance.

If you can’t kiss him after three dates, where you’ve REALLY looked at his inside, not just his outside – you can consider sending him back to being a friend…

***AND – even THEN – time can change things!

Here’s a great story from a client about falling for a man you’re not attracted to – and watching him transform into the sexiest man ever!–>>

Love, Rori


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  1.  #1Femininewoman on February 24, 2014 at 7:17 am

    Good question

  2.  #2Kyla on February 24, 2014 at 7:42 am

    Ooh this kind of helps answer what I just posted on the last thread. Date him even if I’m not sure of him. I feel at sea.

  3.  #3Femininewoman on February 24, 2014 at 7:51 am

    Kyla I was hoping this post would. I am also wondering if it is that you are unconsciously holding onto hope that another man you want more will come out of the woodwork and not allowing this guy a chance. He seems to be very into you. How long has it been?

  4.  #4Kyla on February 24, 2014 at 8:30 am

    Aww thanks FW, its only been a little over 2 weeks! Its feels scary soon for me. I feel afraid that I will let these good feelings carry me away and cloud my judgement and I feel untrustful of my ability to choose the right man anymore. I feel so much loss and grief still from leaving my marriage and last engagement. I feel deep fear at losing my heart and dreams again and not being able to piece myself back together next time. I feel about NewGuy the way I felt about exH and R.. I have my own life and they want in.. but I have no idea how to figure out if I want this guy. It feels like walking on the edge of a cliff and I’m afraid of heights!

  5.  #5Veronica on February 24, 2014 at 9:10 am

    Rori, thank you for this:

    “If you can’t kiss him after three dates, where you’ve REALLY looked at his inside, not just his outside – you can consider sending him back to being a friend…”

  6.  #6Syreena on February 24, 2014 at 9:26 am

    I like someone as a friend and his company, I don”t like how I feel when he strokes my arm or hand and want to pull back when he goes to kiss me. I am actually feeling less chemistry as time goes on with i’m not more.

    I feel squirmy around him, he feels too lechy and it makes me feel cringy. I am not able to fake it. I don’t want to hurt his feelings. I like his company apart from the lecherousness. I need to be in love to want the physical. I am not in love with him so it feels yucky,

  7.  #7Syreena on February 24, 2014 at 9:28 am

    Now how to tell him? How to put someone in the friend zone after being in the dating zone?

  8.  #8Syreena on February 24, 2014 at 9:31 am

    I wouldn’t want to kiss someone after three dates. That would be too soon for me.

  9.  #9LoveAlways on February 24, 2014 at 9:33 am

    The Six E’s come to mind on this when you don’t feel sparks for the guy who wants to date you.

  10.  #10Cris on February 24, 2014 at 9:43 am

    I wonder how I would behave if I CD men with this Rori’s philosophy… I CD friends only as I am married… 😀

  11.  #11Syreena on February 24, 2014 at 9:48 am

    Just because someone wants to date me and fancies me and is ‘nice’ it doesn’t mean I want to be physical with them and share my body or my life with them.

    That’s it! That is the problem the niceness from this man feels like a strategy to get me to be physical, it just doesn’t feel right. To get something back off me for being ‘nice’ and ‘gentlemanly.’

    I want good and kind. Not ‘nice’

  12.  #12April Rose on February 24, 2014 at 10:57 am


    I feel so excited and happy – I’m doing a little jiggy dance here!
    I can feel the relief in the air, like the calm after the storm (as opposed to the tension of the calm before the storm)
    I feel delighted to hear that you expressed your anger to your ex. Go you! As FW said, your authenticity has had impact.

  13.  #13Indigo on February 24, 2014 at 11:05 am


    I too feel delighted you expressed your anger 🙂 I have felt it building up in your blog posts and it seemed like such a release to read your post. You came across as so strong – I have always believed this is very attractive, and I’m glad you were rewarded with yummy chocolate.


  14.  #14Indigo on February 24, 2014 at 11:23 am

    Well, I had a verrrry interesting weekend.

    And good in almost all ways.

    On Friday night, Blue invited me round to his place and made me an extremely yummy pasta dinner, and put on some movies which felt really good. He did not try and “get” anything out of the evening, which is probably why it felt so good and safe, just like hanging out with a dear friend. It didn’t need to be romantic, though he tickled my back and gave me a needed massage whilst we were watching. Like I said, it felt very low pressure and great.

    On Saturday night, I had a girls’ night with my best friend. We were absolutely surrounded by men, close on 10 of them, all trying to talk to us, and I think we just felt like giggley girls – it felt playful, like being in high school again. AND… in one night, ALL THREE of the guys I’ve dated in the last 3 months were in one place. At the same time. To be honest, it felt a bit claustrophobic. And yes, the attention was rather nice and I think did both me and my friend a lot of good, being that it was such a fun context, yet I really felt exhausted and peopled out on Sunday.

    Speaking of Sunday, I woke up on Sunday morning (very late) to find a message from none other than D. It really quite took me aback that all of these men made an appearance in one weekend.

    Anyway, to cut a long story short, I ended up at D’s place last night to watch a movie and it was absolutely lovely. Like Shannon’s story, he was doing little things to be attentive, like making me cups of tea and he bought yoghurt that he knew I’d like… that kind of thing. The best of it though was how I felt, both going there, and whilst I was there. I wasn’t hooked into him at all. I was all about me. And I decided in advance that if I felt the least bit bad or unhappy, I would simply leave, no explanation given. And he was wonderful – super affectionate and caring. And when I finally left, he asked for a kiss! In a rather cute way. And I felt totally fine and all about myself as I was driving away and back to my house. I felt serene and calm and unconcerned today, and not anxious or needy at all.

  15.  #15Liquid Light on February 24, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Wow, Indigo, that does sound like a fantastic weekend! You are on a roll, girl!

  16.  #16April Rose on February 24, 2014 at 1:03 pm

    Wow, Indigo
    I feel amazed!

  17.  #17Amber on February 24, 2014 at 1:04 pm

    Hi Sirens, I just got caught up on all of the comments. Happy Monday!

    Shannon P. -123 from the last blog
    It sounds to me like you were authentic in your anger and frustration and that is Very ‘Rori-like.’ Good for you!

    Kyla-128 from the last blog
    Awareness is the first step to change. Yay for you for noticing when you’re pushing love away. Yes, love. There was a moment of ‘love’ in that strangers gesture. When we can accept loving gestures from strangers it becomes so much easier to accept them from the man we want. Cheers to you!

    I had a great weekend. (T) is stepping up more and more. I realized this weekend that he LOVES making loving gestures and taking care of me. I also realized how often I either don’t accept these gestures or forget to REALLY appreciate them. I was very proud of myself this weekend, therefore, because I ASKED for something and not only did I get what I needed, I got MORE! Here’s the short story:

    I pay my sister to do my laundry, not because I’m lazy, but because SHE is living in my house with MY washer and dryer. I don’t have one where I am right now. Every so often, though, she doesn’t have time to do it, and this weekend was one of those times. The last time this happened I mentioned to (T) that I was running out of clean clothes, and he sweetly offered the use of HIS washer and dryer. (This was pre-September breakup, btw and way before I found Rori) I’d never taken him up on the offer because, pre-Rori I would have assumed that he was just ‘being nice’ and didn’t really mean it. Well on Friday he and I were talking on the phone and I asked him, straight out, no hemming or hawing (yay me!) if the offer of the washer/dryer still stood. He said “Of course. Pack up your laundry and bring it over tonight, we’ll get it done.”
    Not only did my laundry get done, Sirens, but HE folded almost all of it and when I tried to help, he shushed me away and tld me to ‘go lay down and relax.’
    Being able to accept loving gestures is truly improving not only my life, but all of my relationships, too.
    Cheers to accepting love and happiness!

  18.  #18Helena Hart on February 24, 2014 at 2:02 pm

    Amber – 17 – Yay, that’s awesome!!! I love that you’re having so much success with leaning back and letting (T) give to YOU! That just put a big smile on my face. 🙂

    Love, Helena

  19.  #19Liquid Light on February 24, 2014 at 2:05 pm

    OMG, I’ve got a date tomorrow after work with an architect. My ex was an architect! I love architects! 🙂

  20.  #20Turquoise on February 24, 2014 at 2:12 pm

    Hi Sirens…. kinda stressful family and didn’t get to see any single men, but two have asked me out. One, I’ve mentioned here serveral times… he wants to talk about getting together but doesn’t make concrete plans. He did ask if I could go out Saturday night, but I already had plans, so we are supposed to get together soon. We shall see. Another is a guy from online that I’ve emailed with a little bit. He asked if I’d like to get a drink, but we don’t have set plans either. Mr. Conversation is getting on my nerves, Sweetheart is getting on my nerves, even Pen Pal is getting on my nerves… and I feel it’s because it’s too much texting and energy at men that are not going to be dates and romance. So, just going to give that a little bit of my time and be open to possibilities with new men. I feel stuck, time to move forward.

    Still no word from Piano Man, and starting to just not care. If he contacts me some day, maybe, if not… oh well. it was fun when we went out… leaving it at that.

    🙂 Have a good night ladies!

  21.  #21Olivia on February 24, 2014 at 2:33 pm

    Three dates is a good general rule of thumb. If they are just “meh” and not actively grossing you out, I say one month where you really give it a shot – making out, holding hands, maybe sex if it’s right. I’ve done that at least twice. If at that point you cannot imagine yourself faithfully happy with this man I say send them back to being a friend. You could try and summon them back if you change your mind. I wonder what others think of this…

  22.  #22Kyla on February 24, 2014 at 3:27 pm

    Thanks Amber 🙂

  23.  #23Amber on February 24, 2014 at 3:28 pm

    Thank you! My new motto is ‘when in doubt, lean back.’ It’s getting easier and easier as I experience the great results!

  24.  #24Shannon P. on February 24, 2014 at 5:14 pm

    Oh look, a new thread, who knew! :p

    Funny, he has completely retreated again today, lol. Yelled at me this morning about financial matters and went right back to pouting.

    I feel very “whatever” about it, though. I’m dealing with my kidlet and I’ve found a new computer game that I like… I’m struggling to care at all.

    I suppose that, deep down, even while it was happening, I was thinking, “this is great–while it lasts”. And it really was nice, but it didn’t feel like love from him towards me. Kind of hard to explain. Like it felt like niceness towards me, but not like love towards me.

    On the other hand, I agree with Amber. It has felt good allowing myself to receive and to stop being prickly pear, lol. I’ve always been extremely “strong and independent” and prickly about some things (while not others).

    The interesting thing I’ve realized about myself over last night and today, though, is this… I don’t feel good touching people or being touched. As an autistic person, ALL touch feels very intimate to me.

    I was listening to a discussion on touch, and what’s a ‘sexual’ touch versus what’s just a ‘friend touch’. And I realized that I don’t really differentiate (neither in giving or receiving touch). To me, it’s all too intimate.

    I LOVE to cuddle when I feel bonded to someone. I LOVE to snuggle and touch and be touched. But I do NOT like to touch or be touched by someone I don’t feel intimate with. It’s too personal, it’s too intimate, it’s too “sensory”.

    I don’t know what I’m going to do with this. I see perfectly the merit of allowing myself to touch people, particularly men I’m dating. But… it just feels SO intimate.


  25.  #25LoveAlways on February 24, 2014 at 5:20 pm

    Hi Sirens:

    I had an aha moment. Pre-siren, I was a hot mess, imbalanced, meeting and having relationships with other hot messes . . . looking for balance. I have my own balance now! I am not looking for anyone or anything or any situation to balance me. Whatever I felt I craved before I give to myself now. Removing all this weight from love, all I want from a man is to be loved, to feel love, to enjoy love and to share love. I don’t need anything else, because I feel balanced. And feeling balanced feels weird, out of place, a little chilly because I am out of my comfort-zone of chaos. But it is a welcomed chilly feeling. Refreshing, cooling . . . balancing.

  26.  #26LoveAlways on February 24, 2014 at 5:26 pm

    “Me, myself and I, that’s all I got in the end
    That’s what I found out and there ain’t no need to cry
    I took a vow that from now on
    I’m gon’ be my own best friend”
    Beyonce Knowles

  27.  #27RileyTheOwl on February 24, 2014 at 5:52 pm

    Wow… reading this post and all your comments has given me a greater understanding of why I feel so turned off of the man I’m currently with… (in the last post I mentioned him and how I want to end things with him)
    I often feel turned off by his “niceness” towards me, and I always feel like he’s so baby-ish in the way he’s always whining after me for kisses and hugs and affection in a very non-attractive way. I felt confused over why this bothered me at first! Having a man wanting to kiss me is what I WANT… but when he did it there was something off-feeling about it… and I guess I just felt like I was being unfair feeling like it was somehow “wrong”. But I don’t feel unfair anymore… it makes sense now :).
    I really want to get out of this relationship. He makes me feel like I’m his mother… sigh.
    Syreena, when you described one guy as being “leech-y”… that’s exactly the word to describe my man. Ugh… he makes me feel so weird and un-womanly…

    In the end though, when I finally feel like ending things with him, it feels scary, because I have few friends other than him, and we’ve been exclusive for over a year. And during that year we had an amazing connection, we have been through the worst and the best times and even the worst end well. We have amazing memories together, so I feel scared that I’m making a mistake and over-reacting? Can I fix this leech-y feeling he carries that I didn’t even notice before, or is this a sign that I should move on to someone new?

  28.  #28Kyla on February 24, 2014 at 6:18 pm

    First fiance,M, quit drinking, started therapy and last month reached out on facebook that he’s been sober since we broke up, exH told me recently he went to see a therapist for a year after I left him, R told me last week he’s seeing a therapist since he went home and now Bear, who’s been having a one-sided text conversation with my phone for the last 22 days, says he started seeing a therapist last week because of losing his chance with me. They were each thanking me for inspiring them to deal with their sh*t so that they can be good enough to love someone like me who make them feel like men (first fiance is now married with 2 sons). These men say they wanted me so bad it drove them crazy and they hurt me and themselves in fear that they’d lose me and lost me away anyway. Hearing it the first time from M felt so good but then I heard it from the next 3 and that feels so strange in my tummy, like guilt and irritation and fear all swirled together. This does not feel good.

    Ok awareness.. I am attracted to these men, ok.. well.. I’m their trigger.. but I’m choosing not to be their therapist as a trade off for love anymore.. I’m attracted to them because I was a therapist to adults around me since age 3 (I don’t remember any earlier!). I don’t want to attract these men anymore and I’m walking away faster.. Hmm ok it feels good that I inspire healing and betterment just by being me and respecting my own boundaries in a loving way. I can have a powerful, healing affect on people that I come in contact with even if just briefly. Oh that thought feels better.. Maybe my love for me heals me and others at the same time.. I intend to heal the part of me that needs to feel needed to feel worthwhile.

  29.  #29Liquid Light on February 24, 2014 at 6:30 pm

    I’ve got another date on Wednesday at a nice place. He seems to be a successful professional man too. I feel like I’m starting to attract better quality men! Woohooo!!!!

  30.  #30Kyla on February 24, 2014 at 6:32 pm

    Yay LL that’s awesome!! I feel so happy for you!

  31.  #31Olivia on February 24, 2014 at 6:38 pm

    @kyla: “I inspire healing” I love that!

  32.  #32RileyTheOwl on February 24, 2014 at 7:15 pm

    Kyla that is a difficult situation you’re in, but I’m feeling inspired and awed by your ability to look at the men you’ve attracted and realize the good, true, and beautiful reason why, instead of getting down on yourself for attracting these types of men.You must have an amazing vibe, and even though these past men have been difficult for you, you are facing the situation with such admirable strength and insight. Soon Mr Right will turn up, and I feel like you are doing the perfect thing by not being a therapist as a trade for love. I wish you well 🙂

  33.  #33prplpsn28 on February 24, 2014 at 7:40 pm


  34.  #34Indigo on February 24, 2014 at 8:21 pm

    Thank you April Rose and Liquid Light 🙂


  35.  #35Indigo on February 24, 2014 at 8:21 pm

    Amber 17,

    I love it! 🙂

  36.  #36Zia on February 24, 2014 at 8:22 pm

    Love this post…. and this was pretty much my rule when dating. If I didn’t want to kiss him by the 3rd date, I didn’t continue. Took a year to find a guy that I was happy to kiss but I had fun dating and learning! 🙂

  37.  #37Zia on February 24, 2014 at 8:24 pm

    So Zia’s dating adventure continues… what a difference it is making feeling secure and grounded within myself. I can have a wonderful night with M, and then not hear from him all the next day…. and that’s ok! Coz then I DO hear from him in the form of something like “Just wanted to let you know I’m thinking of you”. Aaaaah feel so easy breezy!

  38.  #38Indigo on February 24, 2014 at 8:26 pm

    RileyTheOwl 26,

    I know what you mean. On Saturday night B was there and was chasing me down for affection, saying things like “don’t I get a kiss?” I felt a bit hounded and a bit pounced upon.

    I contrast this with Sunday night when D and I were watching the movie, and then he just gently pulled me into his arms and let me rest my head on his chest, and at one point just casually tilted my chin up so he could give me a kiss and then just went straight back to watching the movie. It made me feel so relaxed, it was so masculine and without any sort of fuss attached to it.

    I suppose what I’m saying is, like you, I want a guy who wants to kiss me, but it can’t be demanded or cajoled out of me, it needs to flow in a relaxed and organic way or I don’t feel good about it…

  39.  #39Millie on February 24, 2014 at 8:31 pm

    Responding from the previous post:

    Tereana–It feels good to know that you understand how pain can actually be a weird sort of comfort….
    I also feel happy to know that you have awareness of it too and are constantly growing in the face of it.

    FeminineWoman–Thank you, thank you, thank you.
    Sometimes…”It’s okay” is so powerful. Sometimes that’s all I really need to hear. I can definitely let other men into my life!!! I have gone out with a few other men during all this Mechanic stuff….but they kind of poofed also, which doesn’t help. It’s hard not to take all the poofing to heart.

    I’m not going to reach out to him and share how I feel. I kept looking at my phone last night and also today…and just could not pick it up and bring myself to reach out. Which is GOOD! I’m glad my desire to just be is bigger than my desire to reach out. Also, I would never call him….and I’ve reached this point where I find texting to be very unsatisfying, so I just don’t want to do it. Texting has its purpose…for “hey I”m running late” and such….but texting him to reach out to “talk”….would really go against everything I feel…it would feel cheap….it would feel low….and totally unsatisfying. If I’m going to share how I feel, I want to do it in person, looking at someone in the eyes…and I don’t want to have to ask for that time….like they are doing me a favor. The other reason is that..if he isn’t asking me how I am….he doesn’t want to know right now. So, I’m saving how I feel, I’m remembering how I feel about this, and putting it away inside myself, a little shelf. It’s not getting ignored, but I’m not letting it go either, I’m just setting it aside. If the day comes where I’m in front of him or any other man that triggers me to act in this manner (I promise you all, I don’t act this way with every man, the players just have a power over me) I will call upon this feeling and I will have no fear in saying how I feel. I don’t want to be afraid anymore. Fear and hesitation cause you to miss out….I don’t want to miss out anymore. But I’m not going to throw that in someone’s face if his actions don’t seem to be saying….”tell me, I’m here.”

    Anyway, my cousin is in a similar boat. We are cut from the same cloth, which makes sense since we are family and two years apart. She just told a guy that she is head over heels for that she can’t be friends with him! I applauded her!!! She was spending SO much time with this guy..I really don’t know how she did it! He doesn’t want more…and she’s having a hard time, but I told her it was a courageous thing to do and to admit to him. I asked her if she thought I should do the same with Mechanic, but since he’s “poofed” she said, “He doesn’t deserve to know how you feel.” I told her that I’m angry with myself for not being authentic….she said that he hasn’t been all that authentic either. I don’t know about that…I know that men play games to get what they want…and it disheartens me, but I prefer to think, he was authentic.

    It’s interesting though…I feel like I wasn’t authentic because I didn’t say how I felt in the moment I felt it, BUT what I was really feeling was fear and panic, so I said nothing…so for me, feeling clammed up was authentic. I was authentically clammed. Haha!

    Anyways….the urge to talk to him is still there…

  40.  #40Syreena on February 24, 2014 at 8:59 pm


    I think it’s when it comes from their little boy neediness place yes. It turns me off. It feels really yucky, cringy. Like I am being used.

    For me I only want it as an expression of wanting to share a loving gesture towards me because they are in love with me and me them.

  41.  #41Andrea on February 24, 2014 at 9:30 pm

    Hooray Millie! I feel vicariously victorious through you!

    And I feel strength for you and honored by your growth and I feel you honoring yourself and that feels really solid. And the more we practice loving ourselves fully and giving to ourselves fully, then the less time we have to write letters to men, or express ourselves to them with out them asking us to.

    It feels like you are just riding a one speed bike up hill, and you are almost at the top… just have to keep on pedaling, keep it up, stay strong, and pretty soon you’ll get to glide down hill for a while on the wind of self esteem, self love, and pride… no more chasing. Pretty soon, you’ll be looking behind you and laughing and yelling at the men, “Just try and catch up” And they will. They will want to just be in your energy and vivaciousness.

  42.  #42RileyTheOwl on February 24, 2014 at 9:39 pm

    Syreena, it is a really awful feeling… Often it strikes deeper than that, and in his presence I feel like an item for him, like I’m his thing that he can pick up and kiss, only for pleasure. Today he offered to help me clean dishes, and I smiled and welcomed the offer, thanking him, and I rested my hand on his back. But he got so distracted by my hand, he just melted and nuzzled into me and started grabbing at me in such a boyish way… It made me feel sooo turned off…

  43.  #43Millie on February 24, 2014 at 9:55 pm

    Andrea, thank you so much for that!!
    I feel such respect and admiration for you…and it feels good to have you and others cheering me on with every step I take. I do feel like I have grown leaps and bounds just within this past week and I’m so looking forward to growing even more, to breezing down that hill…
    thank you 🙂

  44.  #44RileyTheOwl on February 24, 2014 at 9:55 pm

    Indigo, I feel a new sense of hope from reading about that natural interaction, that is the sort of feeling I want to get when I’m around a man… It makes me feel like I’m being honoured by a man with CONFIDENCE, instead of being his key to self-esteem. I’m feeling happiness through you for experiencing that good feeling 🙂
    I’m also feeling tired of my man. On this blog it seems like everyone goes with code names, so I’ll call him “C”. I really want to circular date and experience attraction and other men…

  45.  #45RileyTheOwl on February 24, 2014 at 9:57 pm

    Just the thought of circular dating makes me feel all giggly and excited 🙂

  46.  #46Amber on February 24, 2014 at 10:02 pm

    Hi Sirens. Here is a letter to (T), inspired by our conversation tonight. It started as a letter to him, anyway, then kinda morphed into a letter to myself. Of course I’m not sending it, lol, but the things I realized and worked through while writing it are… priceless.

    Dear (T),
    I can feel the distance between us and it makes me feel sad. I want to lessen it. I want to hold you and be held by you. I want to be kissed and loved and adored. I don’t want to be judged for the woman I was two years ago. I am not her anymore. I love her, though because she helped make me who I am today. Today I am a better woman than I was yesterday, and I hope that tomorrow I will be better still.
    I forgive that woman of years past. She was lonely, sad and very confused. I forgive her for having shaky boundaries. I forgive her for having loose morals. I forgive her for accepting sex as a substitute for true intimacy and connection. I forgive her and I have gown from her. She is not me any longer. I can feel Amelia surging under my skin. Wanting to shout at you, wanting to convince you. Wanting to explain and be heard. But more than anything, she just wants to be loved. Completely and unconditionally loved. And do you know what? I love her. The woman of my past lives in Amelia. Yes, sometimes I take her out and try pieces of her on again. She is confident in her beauty and sexuality. She loves to look pretty and gain sexual attention from men. But I control her now, not the other way around. I control her, I love her and I forgive her. Can you?

    So there you have it, ladies. My realization after finishing this was… drumroll please… I have now worked through my abandonment issues and apparently I now need to forgive myself for a few years where I stepped out of the normal role of ‘girl’ and embraced the morals of a man. I was a slut. I gloried in it and I enjoyed nearly every minute of it. I must feel guilty deep down, though, because I have attracted a man who will punish me for it. Thank you all for letting me be real and safe here. I’m so proud of the work I’ve done so far, and I embrace this chance to heal further. Something tells me this will cease to be an issue in my relationship once I’ve worked through it myself.
    I know there is a section about attracting men who punish us but I can’t remember which program it is in. Any help would be appreciated.
    Cheers, Sirens, to recognizing and working through all of our issues, large and small.

  47.  #47Millie on February 24, 2014 at 10:59 pm

    Amber….is your real name Amelia?

  48.  #48Veronica on February 24, 2014 at 11:03 pm

    One of Rori’s articles in the ‘Heal your Heart’ section is really working for me, especially the following:

    “I guarantee you that if you find things to immerse yourself in – things that capture your attention in a wonderful, fulfilling and satisfying way…they will way outshine any man’s old, worn-out pull on you. Your light will expose the shabbiness of the man, the obsolescence of him.
    You’ll start to feel this: “Done.”
    It’s not about “over.” It’s not about “forgetting.” It’s not about “Letting Go” so you “don’t” have a mental, physical or emotional experience around him when he isn’t actually there. It’s about just getting so passionate about yourself and what you love in life that you become bored by him.”

    I wake up and feel myself thinking about BM and LastCD. Then I do my own stuff and it’s like they don’t even exist. A couple of days ago I woke up with this feeling of “I survived”.

  49.  #49Amber on February 24, 2014 at 11:24 pm

    My real name is Amber
    My strangers name is Amelia:-)

  50.  #50Millie on February 25, 2014 at 12:06 am

    Your stranger’s name? What does that mean?
    I like how your letter was initially to T, but then it became a letter to yourself. Ultimately, I think that is what is so therapeutic about letter writing. It allows us to work out our thoughts and feelings in a safe place and gives us perspective with no real intent other than to be heard by our own selves.
    It sounds like you want to prove you want to prove to yourself that you have changed. I know you have….It saddens me to hear you call yourself a slut. That sounds like a man’s judgement on you. You glorified in sex. That’s ok. You realize now that you used sex as replacement for real intimacy, I do that too….and it’s ok that that happened. I need to remind myself too, but it’s much easier to say “it’s ok” to someone else over yourself. I’m glad to hear your letter helped you 🙂

  51.  #51Millie on February 25, 2014 at 12:06 am

    Veronica–I love this!!!

  52.  #52Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 4:58 am

    Riley, what I have to ask you is this… (and remember, I have only the snapshot of your posts here to work with, so I could be completely, totally off the mark. I’m a VERY keen observer of what people say and what they don’t, but I’m not always right, lol.)

    Have you told him yet that you feel smothered when he has been seeking this affection?

    Have you been direct about what you want from him?

    I just have to wonder if you’ve really reached full intimacy with this guy yet. He senses your withdrawal, but does he know why it’s happening? Does he know he’s been smothering you and does he know what it would take for him to be less boring to you?

    What would “not boring” look like to you? Would he need to take you out more? Be more adventurous in bed? Be more adventurous in the world with you (and or without you?)?

    Are you absolutely certain that you’ve given him a chance to step up in the things and the ways that you really want him to? Have you asked specifically and consistently for what you want to be doing, or how you want to be treated?

    Or are you just withdrawing from him without making any demands?

    Honestly, if this guy is this affectionate AND is so needy, what that says to me is that you’re not giving him the tools to help him gain that affection. You’re withdrawing from him and he senses it, but he’s completely puzzled as to why, so his only choice left is to crawl after you for snippets of affection. Which makes you both feel icky.

    We’re the “topping from the bottom” leaders in our relationships. If there’s something missing, before you walk away, you might want to really sit down with yourself and ask yourself if you’ve been honest with him…

    Or have you not wanted to hurt him by telling him that you’re feeling smothered? Have you not wanted to rock the boat by demanding more adventure? Have you not wanted to insult his manhood by asking for adventurous sex?

    Have you been direct about what you want, and how you’re really feeling when he has acted needy?

    If you’ve been cosseting his feelings by not being consistently honest about your own in the moment… then maybe your work here is not yet done.

    If you’ve protected his manhood by not asking for more adventures, or more excitement, then maybe he still has some messages for you before you go.

    And if he’s boring but also needy and clingy, then it seems to me that you’re NOT being direct with him. Because if you’re telling him you feel smothered and you feel bored, there should be some anger and resentment on his part–OR he would be stepping up. But it seems more like you’re very busy not rocking the boat and looking elsewhere for your fun… Expecting him to JUST KNOW that you want and need more adventure or more excitement.

    Men never JUST KNOW anything. You’ll leave this guy and learn that no other man is going to JUST KNOW, either.

    Ultimately, you’re going to end up either drifting relationship to relationship… or you will have to threaten a guy’s feelings and manhood someday by being honest about these feelings.

    You’ve stated that you’ve given him chances to step up, but I get the opposite from your words on the board. I hear you fussing about his feelings and protecting him. I hear you seeing him as emotionally weak, and protecting that weakness.

    I can’t believe that you’re not doing it inside the relationship on a consistent basis. It sounds like you’re afraid to hurt him, afraid to offend him…

    And as such, you’ve unmanned him because he wants more than anything to please you, but you are just withdrawing… and he doesn’t know why.

    You’re turned off because he’s not being manly. But he doesn’t KNOW what your vision of manly is unless you brave his pain and tell him….

  53.  #53Andrea on February 25, 2014 at 5:58 am

    Riley the Owl… : )

    You are so descriptive that I feel that choked, compressed heaviness in my chest when you post.

    My sister could mirror you in words. She is one year older than me and has been married to the same man since she was nineteen.
    My sister complains that he’s too needy, too clingy, that he uses her as a prop to show what a good husband he is, but hasn’t “seen” the real her in years.

    When I visit, I still the same man that she married all those years ago. He hasn’t changed at all. He’s still trying his best to please her like he always has.

    She is the one who has changed. She keeps trying to blame him and justify to me why he is making her feel claustrophobic and strained. And I see that he is as steady as he ever was.

    I tell her that when she married him, she needed him. She used him as a prop for her self esteem, to escape the life she didn’t know how to live by herself coming into adult hood, to show the world she could be a better wife and mother than our mom, she used him for so many reasons… she was needy, clingy, she gained tons of weight and he always loved her regardless.

    Now she is changing. Last year she decided to really lose weight. She’s lost almost a hundred pounds. She wants to move to my town and go to college. She wants to actually have an adult dating life. She wants to feel free and unencumbered. She wants an adventure. She wants to feel alive and healthy and vibrant. She wants to be single.

    I tell her COME ON!! There’s nothing wrong with any of that!! But she gets stuck in the trap of guilt over her husband. So she stays with him, but BLAMES him for her misery. AS IF!! Yes, when she leaves him he is going to be heart broken. But that is not her fault. She is a totally different person than she was when she married him. He is still a wonderful and doting husband. He hasn’t changed with her.

    She is stuck all up in his business. I just watch. Observe. When she calls me I tell her that her plans for her future sound great to me. But I don’t say anything about her current situation with her husband because that’s just something she has to work out for herself. And she will.

    I just was reminded of my sister when I read your posts.

    There’s nothing at all wrong with saying, “I want something different now. And thank you so much, man, for being there for me in the last part of my life. But goodbye.”

    There’s nothing wrong with that at all. We journey together with the exact right people for the time we need to journey with them. My sisters husband was a huge gift to her when she was nineteen and for many subsequent years following. Now, life is wanting her to explore different avenues. She thinks that staying with her husband and blaming him for being him is “loving” him. When I think that leaving him and becoming the best woman she can be right now is actually loving him and all those that are in her life.

  54.  #54Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 6:35 am

    Ugh, I am SO triggered by Andrea’s post.

    People are not disposable. Abandoning them isn’t loving them! Abandonment is a selfish act.

    I removed my long rant before posting. I will just say that the world feels so surreal right now. Like a bunch of empty ghosts walking around, devoid of compassion for each other. Want some fun and excitement? Throw another human being away like garbage instead of taking up sky diving or something. Just dispose of a person who’s been loyal and loving like they’re a pair of old worn out socks. It’s actually LOVING to throw people away like garbage, instead of giving them a chance to change. No, really!

    I’m seeing this attitude all over the place and it feels so awful. So horrible.

    Do promises of a relationship really mean so little? Is commitment really just a “for now” promise?

    I suppose I have to give up my infantile belief that every single human being is infinitely precious and worthwhile, and should only be abandoned if they are abusive. Even leaving abusive people has felt horribly hard for me… I cannot imagine being willing to throw someone away just because I want to have more fun in my life.

    I don’t get it. I cannot agree. It feels really hard to be a person who believes in fidelity in a world that sees humans as garbage to be thrown away on a whim. And that’s not about Andrea, that’s about our society as a whole.

    It feels horrible to see people being so casual about ending committed relationships.

    RILEY, you can (and should) be circular dating the whole world while in this relationship. Being in a relationship shouldn’t be stopping you from smiling and laughing with other people–all other people. It should be stopping you from dancing naked or in a silky nightdress. It shouldn’t be stopping you from taking up skydiving or extreme skiing.

    There are many ways for you to make your own excitement in your life and not leave it up to your man to create it for you.

    ((( This is all my personal view. I am not speaking for Rori. )))

  55.  #55Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 6:38 am

    oops, [it shouldN’T be stopping you from dancing naked or in a silky dress]… fruedian slip, I guess… it should stop you from doing so in a sexual manner with other men… but not stop you from doing it for and with yourself.

  56.  #56Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 7:19 am

    Andrea I didn’t have as strong a reaction as Shannon but I did read in your words a slight suggestion of non-chalantly just brushing someone off. A take it or leave it kinda masculine attitude. I totally agree that she should be staying with him and then turn around and blame him for her misery, however another way is to love consciously. Becoming aware of the dynamics and between them, how she is feeling and talking about it rather than just walking away.

    Riley I did get the sense of looking for “greener grass” somewhere else in relation to your guy and I did comment to that effect on the other article where I first your post.

    Shannon I do believe that the “frame” in which you put things is something that needs to be worked on. “Garbage” and “disposable people” are things I believe need to be removed out of your vocabulary. Though they are coming for a passionate place to save a commitment it I believe is connected to the inner mean girl that will beat you up when convenient. Just because people make a commitment to each other does mean that the commitment should become like a never ending ball and chain around their necks. People enter relationships for wrong reasons and can awake out of the haze somewhere along in their lives. Only an individual know what they need to honor their heart and clinging to a commitment no matter what can be like putting oneself in prison. There are different kinds of commitments and different levels to commitment. Why stifle yourself to death just because you made a commitment? It is no wonder some men drag their feet and are seemingly afraid of committing to the wrong woman. It leaves me with a vision of a dog grabbbing on to someone’s pants and shaking them around like a rag doll to hang on to the commitment that the person made.

    People are not disposable. They are complex and as time goes by people grow and want different things out of life. It is a wise thing to do to keep revisiting your commitment with your part to make sure that this is what you want.

  57.  #57Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 7:20 am

    “I totally agree that she should NOT be staying with him and then turn around and blame him for her misery”

  58.  #58Andrea on February 25, 2014 at 7:20 am

    I so feel what you are posting Shannon P. I believe that what you are expressing is exactly the way my sister views her relationship.
    She will not leave him or the commitment she made at the age of nineteen. Instead, she mutilates herself with alcohol and guilt. She has been in the psyche ward of the hospital twice now in the last year because she’s tried to commit suicide.
    She doesn’t want to jump out of airplanes, she wants to honor what her soul is shouting at her from the deep crevices of her gut…
    She abandoned herself many many years ago and this journey back to self is killing her. And yet… She’s courageous enough to stay on that journey.

    Her only problem is that she stays with her husband, but blames him for all of her problems. And I was saying…. It’s not really about her husband at all.

    Yes, it is a much loving situation if she would leave him and stop blaming him for everything that’s wrong in her life. Yes it is so much more loving to herself and to him if she would start to tell the truth, instead of… right now what she’s doing… lying to herself, to him, to her daughters, to the world, to her own bleating heart…

    “I’m supposed to stay in this relationship because we made a commitment.”

    I tell her, BS! It’s not her husband’s fault that he is who he is. It’s not her fault that she is no longer in love with him and that her guilt is killing her.

    Blame and guilt and shame…. over a commitment she made when she was nineteen.

  59.  #59Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 7:29 am

    Lots of typos but hopefully you get what I was trying to say.

  60.  #60Andrea on February 25, 2014 at 7:30 am

    Oh and I should say… I AM nonchalant about that situation because I see the suffering my sister is putting herself through in the name of..
    “I’m supposed to…”

    I want to shake her out of it.

    But, I’m not in that relationship. I CAN be nonchalant. It’s not my heart. It’s not my commitment. It’s not my pain.

    I feel like I’m the only one my sister can talk to about this because instead of telling her… You SHOULD do this or that in the name of convention or commitment…
    I just listen and I say… “What it sounds to me like you’re saying is that you really need to leave this relationship.”

    She says… “Yes.” And then she opens up to me about all of the dreams and wishes that she has at 41. And I encourage her inner dreamer.

    I wish she were free. I wish she would show her daughters the example of a woman who is able to follow her happiness and her dreams and be courageous enough to listen to the impulses of her soul.

    And get out of the business of her husband’s future. What if his true soul mate is right around the corner, just waiting for my sister to finally be honest???
    What if there is a woman out there who is just perfect for my brother in law and can offer him that safe warm place to put his needy heart. While my sister then has the freedom to explore the truth of her destiny….

  61.  #61Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 7:33 am

    If only people were aware enough to ask

    “Can you love and accept your man exactly as he is even if nothing ever changes? This may be THE most important question to ask yourself when entering into a relationship/marriage. ~ Dominique”

    Life is not perfect. For the most part people are not taught how to do relationships so they stumble down the road and sometimes have to change their steps to get right footed.

  62.  #62Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 7:34 am

    Andrea I so feel you and so agree with your thinking about the situation. It can be very painful to be observer to something like this, especially when it involves our loved ones.

  63.  #63Camille on February 25, 2014 at 7:35 am

    Hi All,
    Its been a while since I was here. I apparently need a refresher course. Im going through some confusion in my relationship and need to get back to “yummy pie” your stories are inspiring im certain ill get the help I need here again!

  64.  #64Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 7:53 am

    Right, so if you don’t like your child, you can just throw them away, right? I mean, having a child is making a commitment, but if you don’t LIKE the commitment you made, and it’s not feeling great, just walk away, right? It’s just a kid.

    I do NOT believe in disposable people.

    Don’t make a commitment if it means so little to you that you’ll just bail when you get bored working for it.

    Rori’s tools are all about fixing what you have. Even a toxic man can be turned around, though an abusive one can’t.

    I won’t stop using those words just because the truth in them sounds offensive to others who think that people are disposable.

    Before you throw family away, make SURE they’re irredeemable. Make SURE that they can’t and won’t change if they know the stakes.

    It’s YOUR promise, it’s YOUR commitment. And if you break it, it’s YOUR word that you are saying means nothing if something more fun comes along… and it’s hard to respect yourself when your word has so little value.

    I do agree that, once you’re sure, and you’ve exhausted every avenue, then leaving may be the only thing left to you.

    In neither of these cases does it sound like leaving is the only thing left. Greater vulnerability and honesty may well make the “leechy, needy” guy step up. Creating excitement for ourselves can alleviate the NEEDINESS for the man to make it for us. And choosing to stop blaming and reach for gratitude and appreciation can change a relationship completely.

    I don’t believe in disposable people, and I don’t feel like I need to stop saying that just because it offends others. Maybe those of us who have been thrown away like garbage don’t like it. Maybe we don’t appreciate being thrown away because the other person doesn’t want to bother, doesn’t want to step up, doesn’t want to be vulnerable or to be honest. And maybe we get sick of being thrown away like garbage because we didn’t know what to do and the person throwing us away never bothered to tell us.

    Be certain before you discard another human being. We don’t throw our children away, why would we throw our husbands away? Because somehow he’s worthy of less than our children are? He’s less of a person? I cannot agree.

  65.  #65Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 8:04 am

    Anyway, I don’t have anything more to say on it.

    I have huge abandonment issues. I’ve felt forced to discard my own family because they were severely abusive.

    This is a massive trigger of both rage and pain in me. The casualness with which people approach breaking someone’s heart devastates me. It feels awful to me to treat love and relationships like socks to be changed if they get a little dirty or crusty.

    It does feel like being thrown away, and you can pretty it up any way you want to. But you can’t change the heartache and the heartbreak of being thrown away or change the fact that it feels like being THROWN AWAY.

    Abandonment and rejection really HURT. They activate the same area of the brain as does physical pain. Be sure you’ve done your due diligence before you stab another human being in the heart with a rejection dagger. The pain is real.

  66.  #66Andrea on February 25, 2014 at 8:08 am

    No.. we don’t throw people away.

    We start to tell the truth. We tell the truth IN OUR relationship. We say… “I am NOT HAPPY!!!”

    And we don’t make our unhappiness about HIM. Because it’s not about him.

    That’s what I’m saying. There are so very many people who are in loving caring wonderful committed relationships. I see it all over the place. My mom and step dad… a couple other of my siblings… many of my friends… women on this blog…

    All over the world there are people who are telling the TRUTH. And their truth is: I am extremely happy with my place in this life and my place in this relationship. I’m happy even in my sadness. I’m happy even in the hard times. I’m happy even when it seems like something more fun is going on somewhere else. I’m happy with you.

    People are not disposable and I don’t believe that anyone on this stream is saying they are.

    My sister is NOT telling her truth. She is making her unhappiness all about her husband. It’s not about him.

    If she said, “I’m unhappy.”

    He would try to find out why and fix it. If she said, “I feel like I would be happy if I could be single for a little while and go to college and move away from this city and get a new life for myself….”

    He would try to help her. Or he would start to try to get honest himself. Or he would say… “I don’t want to move. I don’t want to let you out of this commitment. I don’t want you to go to college.”

    What ever it is… Then they could work out negotiations from that point.

    Like Shannon P was saying to Riley The Owl… be honest with in the relationship. The first honesty is:

    “I’m not happy.”

    I was saying that my sister continues on and says… “I”m not happy because of HIM.”

    And that’s not true. Yes, it’s MY opinion FOR HER that she should leave him. That’s MY opinion. Because staying with him is literally killing her. But when she leaves him, she’s going to have to still face the underlying truth…

    ‘I’m not Happy!”

    And whoops…. can’t blame him anymore. So when she gets to that point maybe… finally… she can dig deeper into herself and find out the real WHY.

    It’s not about disposing of her husband. It’s not about disposing of children. (?)

    It’s about telling the truth. It’s not about the husband. It’s not about the boyfriend. It’s not about the man.

    I’m not happy.

    Okay….. go from there…..

    is all I was saying….

    There’s nothing wrong AT ALL with wanting to BE HAPPY!!!! Even if your happiness means that you leave your husband. Even it means other people might be hurt (your opinion of their business) for a little while. There’s nothing wrong with trying to figure out what’s going on in your own heart. Even it rocks the boat for a little while.

  67.  #67RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 8:11 am

    Shannon and Amber, thank you, I feel really supported and it feels comforting to have other sirens to share with, and to hear your perspectives on things. Wow, that was a totally wow moment for me, I realize that YES, Shannon you are right, in the past few weeks I have NOT been direct with him, I am withdrawing, and realizing it makes me feel all cringy because I don’t want to be that kind of woman! Ahh… I used to be super direct with him though. This is the reason I’m feeling like just leaving, because even when I’m being the most feminine, expressive, warm open strong FEELING goddess-like woman, our connection feels unsatisfactory. I didn’t start closing off and withdrawing until after months of expressing it every time I felt unhappy with something.
    I KNOW withdrawing is not the right thing… But I feel like I’m repeating myself when I tell him “I’m feeling so weird and closed in right now, I would love some silence to breathe for a moment” And he gets all whiny and confused… Sigh….

    It feels like I can’t practice my feminineness with him, you know? I get a negative reaction from him when I rock the boat…
    Shannon, I do circular date in this way 🙂 I smile and lean back and let every man come to me, the reactions I get from men around me are incredible, (my man is the complete opposite though), and it feels so good to have men come up to me and call me beautiful and ask what I’m doing that evening. Then I have to tell them I’m in a relationship, where I find myself feeling like “nooo, I want to go have fun and attract men and experience this goodness…”
    He saw me talking to one of our mutual friends in a feely/lean back way, and he got soo jealous 🙁 he then made up this story about a girl who was talking to him over FB, saying that she was hitting on him and stuff like that… Uggghhh icky feelings ugh. It made me feel weird, but I didn’t think much about it until he later confessed to lying about it because he felt jealous that I “attract men”. It made me feel angry. I said wow… I’m feeling speechless.. and I’m feeling anger…. It feels so frustrating, I really just miss feeling relaxed around you, I miss feeling our trust for each other, and this leaves me feeling all disturbed inside.

  68.  #68Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 8:23 am

    Riley, have you had an “I want” talk with him?

    “I want to have my own space sometimes. I feel like I’m being asked to be someone else’s happiness and it feels claustrophobic to me.”

    “I want to feel loved. I like it when you light up when I come into a room. I feel great when you compliment me.”

    “I feel fantastic when I get enough time to be with myself and just recharge a little. As an introvert, that time feels so important to me. I feel all tapped out every once in a while. I feel refueled when I’ve had my alone time.”

    Maybe gush a little when he has given you space (even if it was grudging). Say how you feel understood because you got your recharging time. You feel reenergized and thank him so much (even if he was a little snarky or needy, but let you do it). Any indication of him giving in to your wants, let yourself just go overboard about how great you feel and thanking him.

    If you honestly do feel like you’ve done all you can, and feel like you’ve been honest about what you want, then I support moving on. It would be much worse to end up married before moving on, or having children.

    I just want to know that you feel absolutely certain, and that you feel firmly that you did your own due diligence. It’s so easy to get caught up in the fun and excitement of many men noticing us and responding to us; it would be unfortunate to give up something that you committed to only to find out later that the patterns repeat.

    In other words, if you truly feel it’s HIS pattern, and it’s not going to change… then I support the choice to leave.

    On the other hand, it’s important to understand that you have to make it clean and complete–for both of your sakes if you do. Hope can be a beautiful thing, but it can also bring pain when it keeps us clinging to something where there actually isn’t any hope.

    It does sound like his action was desperate. However, it also seems like he’s acting this way because he feels you withdrawing. He’s chasing, but he seems to feel completely at a loss as to how YOU want to be chased.

    A little gushing if he does anything that pleases you might help him to find his way out of his own silliness and into the fullness of your siren beauty. <3

  69.  #69Camille on February 25, 2014 at 8:28 am

    My boyfriend and I have been dating for a year and ten months he got distant………I stepped back ……he was calling and texting again and I messed up and called him and didnt communicate well…….I was overly emotional and accusatory and told him I was sick of him hurting me. So here we go remind me ………I need to lean back, start circular dating and is this the point I let go of the relationship?

  70.  #70Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 8:36 am

    Camille, one “mistake” doesn’t end everything.

    However, I’d let go of the relationship, regardless. That will give him space to fill up!

    When we hold onto a relationship, we hold onto ideas and expectations. We have a concept that we want that person to live up to.

    Letting go of the relationship and just letting him decide how involved he wants (or doesn’t want) to be in your life gives him room to step up into.

    Part of what harms us the most is our own expectations.

    Make room for lots of men in your life, and just watch them all. See which one steps into your relationship bubble, and then decide if you’re going to accept him being there.

    Maybe it will be your ex. Maybe it will be someone better!

  71.  #71Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 8:48 am

    Millie- 38

    Not reaching out is a good choice. You’re right, if he comes back around or you see him again, that’s time enough to say it.

    Huge BRAVA to your cousin, by the way! Yes, that took tremendous courage and good on her!

    I feel in awe of you both.

  72.  #72Veronica on February 25, 2014 at 8:49 am

    Millie -50 – : ) What you have been writing recently has resonated with me.

  73.  #73Veronica on February 25, 2014 at 8:55 am

    I’ve been so busy and feeling so stressed. The stress comes from not being able to do what I want to do which to me is a deep form of self-love. When I feel so stressed I realise how important it is to have that adoring, forever man because what I’ve experienced so far in my life hasn’t come close to that. I’m tired of having non-forever men in my life.

    I feel down.
    I feel overwhelmed.
    I have thoughts of ‘I’m never going to live the life I want to’. I know it’s partly me and not being able to make it happen, but also partly living with family who do not understand in the least.

  74.  #74Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 9:24 am

    “I don’t feel like I need to stop saying that just because it offends others”

    Trust me Shannon I am not offended. My belief is “those rejections are God’s protection”. I have always had those who reject me to come back so now I have a different perspective on rejection. I have also learned from other coaches to disengage from relationships without the bitterness and holding on to the pain.

    Though I have not done the course I have received some information about “Conscious Uncoupling”.

    Like the following:-

    “What I want to share with you today is a profoundly healing practice my former husband and I engaged when we chose to end our 10-year marriage.

    Rather than suffer the deep trauma and prolonged heartache that characterizes so many breakups . . . Mark and I chose to do things very differently.

    We moved through the transition from husband and wife to life-long friends in such a deeply loving and contained way, that I often felt even more loved by him than I had before.

    And while I’m not at all advocating for breakups or divorce, I am suggesting that we must come to accept these separations as a sometimes unavoidable reality.

    In light of that, we must find a way to uncouple in conscious and respectful ways that allow everyone affected by the breakup to move forward with hope and the possibility for a happy future.

    There is, of course, significant heartache during any breakup, but what I’ve learned in working with tens of thousands of people over the past several years is that our suffering is not necessarily caused by the endings themselves, but rather by how we end a relationship and the devastating mistakes we often make as a result.”

    I suggest getting rid of it out of your vocabulary because obviously that is how you view the way your ex has treated you and it is obviously causing you pain. I might be reading through different eyes and maybe it is the reason why I feel your anger and rage about your situation being projected at times in your advice to others. I know giving advice helps to make you feel powerful and kinda in control but believe it or not it is away to distract from one’s own pain.

    It is your choice to make to continue viewing things the way you do and using language the way you do. The question is what feelings does it stir up in you when you use them?

  75.  #75Femininewoman on February 25, 2014 at 9:36 am

    I got this from Katherine Woodward Smith – Conscious Uncoupling. Maybe someone might find it valuable

    “PRACTICE: Discover Your Source Fracture & Evolve Beyond It

    Your “source fracture” is the original wounding of your heart. You can identify exactly what it is by connecting with the emotional center of the pain you are feeling around your breakup and becoming conscious about the meaning you are making of this experience.

    1. Close your eyes and drop your awareness all the way down into your hips, connecting with a deeper, wider center within yourself that has access to wisdom, power and perspective. Extend the energy of this center down into the earth, and out to the edge of the room.

    2. Notice where you are holding the pain of your breakup. Ask yourself, “Where do I most feel this disappointment in my body?”

    3. Turning towards the feelings, rather than away, welcoming and witnessing them with love, place one hand on the lowest part of your body where you are holding the emotions of your breakup.

    4. Identify the meaning you are making about yourself, others and life as it relates to this breakup. What’s the story you are telling yourself that you can feel in your body that is at the heart of this emotional center?

    5. Identify the “I am/I am not . . .” held in this center. If this pain could speak and tell you its name, what would it be? (i.e., I am not loved, I am alone, I am not enough)

    6. Identify the story about your relationships with others as an “Others never/Others don’t/Others can’t/Others won’t/Others always, etc. . . ” If this pain could speak and tell you its name, what would it say? (i.e., Men never come through for me; Women only want me for my money; Other people don’t really care about what I want and need)

    7. Identify the story about your relationship with Life as a “Life is/Life isn’t/Life doesn’t/Life never/Life always, etc.” If this pain could speak and tell you its name, what would it say? (I can never get the love I need; It’s my fate to be alone in life; Life blesses other people with love, but not me)

    8. Ask yourself, “How old is this part of myself?”

    9. Ask yourself, “How big is the energy being held here?”

    10. Open your eyes and shake it off. Ask yourself, “What’s the best thing about being my current age?” and connect with the resources you now have as an adult who has access to power and a more mature and holistic perspective. The part of you that is able to think objectively and rationally about the automatic meaning you’ve been making about what happened.

    From here, I invite you to begin identifying the specific ways of relating to yourself and others that are literally creating evidence that these beliefs are “true.”

    Begin to challenge these beliefs by accessing a deeper truth that can wake you up out of the trance of that old “source fracture” story. This ability to access truth outside of those old erroneous meanings is critical to being liberated to create a new experience. “

  76.  #76Kyla on February 25, 2014 at 9:54 am

    Thanks FW, those posts are very helpful to me!

  77.  #77Dominique on February 25, 2014 at 10:07 am

    Kyla – 27 – I love this. YAY you!!!

    ” Oh that thought feels better.. Maybe my love for me heals me and others at the same time.. I intend to heal the part of me that needs to feel needed to feel worthwhile.”

    Choosing the better feeling though is one of the keys to healing, and this doesn’t mean deluding yourself. Usually the better feeling thought is more closely aligned with the truth, YOUR truth.


  78.  #78RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 10:16 am

    Wow, yes that post made me feel really good and energized after closing my eyes and just sinking into the feeling. Thank you!

    Shannon, you’re so helpful, thank you so much. I love gushing appreciation, it makes me feel like I’m so warm and soft and happy and good 🙂 it makes me feel like I’m really special and radiating all my goodness outwards. Also I am only 18 and in my first year of college, so I’m not exactly considering marriage or children.

    I’m feeling different now though, I’m feeling like even though I don’t feel attracted to him, I SHOULD try and and be myself; the warmest, most open loving expressive woman I can be. I will stop withdrawing from him…. I’m still considering ending the relationship, but either way it is all part of being a woman. Just because I want to leave isn’t an excuse for withdrawing. I’ll see how he reacts to this, and how I feel after a few days (a week ish) of being like this. I’ll keep updates on here 🙂

  79.  #79RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 10:27 am

    Camille, I’m also in a place where I’m exploring the options of ending a relationship, although for different reasons.
    First of all, when you find yourself falling into the icky feelings of how chasing him felt, catch yourself. When I’m having a bad moment in my day, (plans got canceled, something went wrong, I’m feeling gross, I feel insecure) I try to catch myself. You can do this. Then exhale and breath in really deeply, BELLY BREATH, which means when you breath in your belly should move outwards, not your chest. Then say to yourself that that was thenand come back to the BOW just breath. Love the part of you that acted that way. Remember to sooth the girl inside you who is feeling insecure, don’t stuff her down.

    Whichever of Rori’s tools you like, remember this key part that makes a world of difference for me: do it for YOURSELF. Don’t get all in touch with you feelings for HIM, but for your own happiness, health, and wonderfullness. Do it so you can heal yourself, and put yourself first. I hope this helped 🙂

  80.  #80RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 10:31 am

    *Now. Sigh. Typing all this is difficult on my phone.

  81.  #81Dominique on February 25, 2014 at 10:37 am

    Riley – 66 – “I said wow… I’m feeling speechless.. and I’m feeling anger…. It feels so frustrating, I really just miss feeling relaxed around you, I miss feeling our trust for each other, and this leaves me feeling all disturbed inside”

    This is beautiful. So how did he respond?

    It’s possible as you’re discovering that this just isn’t the man for you. As you’ve been growing and changing, instead of of growing with you, maybe he’s remained stagnant.

    I had a similar situation with my ex. I grew in leaps and bounds, and he stayed the same growing actually more resentful if not bitter along the way at my changes. Since I had wanted out for a long time, for me it was a breath of fresh air, a new lease on life when we ended.

    This is about taking the best care of you whatever this looks like. If you don’t take care of you, no one else will be able to.


  82.  #82RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 10:56 am

    Thank you Dominique, it feels good to have someone recognize my siren-Ness 🙂 he responded becomming quiet, and kind of resentful. Kind of like a puppy dog… he started to talk about everuthhing I did that made him feel annoyed, for example he complained that I never ever text him or initiate things with him and that makes him feel awful. (Even though I am welcoming every time he initiates) to this I said something along the lines of “I really don’t like the feeling initiating gives me, it makes me feel all weird and controlling. It’s against my nature to initiate, and it makes me feel to weird, and I’m not okay with it. I feel so good when I’m contacted, and that a just the way I am”. This did not end well… He kind of just said “okay”. 🙁
    It feels like I’m a siren trying to fully release my power, but he’s not acting on it and I cant fall in live with myself around him, and it just feels like ropes are holding me down when in around him. Naturally I want to avoid him because of this, and I gravitate towards things that trigger my self love.

  83.  #83Shannon P. on February 25, 2014 at 12:04 pm

    Riley, he may well not be able to step up. And at your age, 11 months is a LONG time of giving him an opportunity to do so.

    I just want to make sure that you truly feel on every level that you did your best and that it’s seriously a case of where he just isn’t able. He may well become able some day… but you have to decide for yourself that you gave it your all and you sincerely feel like it’s not your own issues that are in the way.

    Just don’t “flee” because it’s easier, is all I’m wanting to say to you here.

    It is possible to feel sure that you’ve done your best and the other person’s issues are in the way.

    I don’t believe in “stay at all costs,” but I also think that it shouldn’t be done flippantly, and that you must really know in your heart that you will be hurting another person’s heart. If, knowing that, you understand that you’re hurting that person’s heart because HE CHOSE to remain as he is… then you will be able to move forward feeling better in your life.

    When that happens, you won’t beat yourself up or sabotage yourself subconsciously. You’ll walk out of it with your heart feeling sad, yet unburdened; instead of going on wondering, wondering… did I do the right thing? could it have worked? was it really my problem?

    It seems like he may lack the emotional maturity to step up. But to be sure, you want to be sireny with him even when it doesn’t seem to be working… because that way you’ll know it wasn’t that you weren’t being honest. It was because he just lacks the maturity.

    In which case that won’t be your expectations hurting him, it will be his own immaturity. You see what I mean?

    My abusive ex… it was his choice to be abusive. If it hurt him when I left him, it was because he lacked the emotional and mental maturity to treat other people with respect (or himself, he was an alcoholic).

    So it may be your BF’s choice to embrace his insecurities over embracing your emotional needs and intimacy with you.

    That feels better to walk away from than, “I didn’t want to hurt him so I left so I wouldn’t have to be real with him”, doesn’t it? In one case, there’s certainty within you. In the other, there’s looking back and saying, “I didn’t tell him how I felt. I wasn’t real with him” and then we start the self-beating, ouch!

    Too much of our self-punishment is subconscious, too, is the problem. So the certainty that “I did all I could” can alleviate our self-sabotage.

  84.  #84Kyla on February 25, 2014 at 12:14 pm

    Thanks Dominique 😀

  85.  #85Amber on February 25, 2014 at 12:26 pm

    ‘The Stranger’ is a visualization/meditation in Rori’s one of Rori’s programs (Dominique or Helena-help, I can’t remember which one!) where you go deep inside yourself and meet the part of you that you’ve been hiding from the world. It was an amazing experience for me.

  86.  #86Helena Hart on February 25, 2014 at 2:14 pm

    Millie – 49 – The Stranger is from Toxic Men. It’s about speaking to the voices inside of you that you’ve most likely been stuffing down and distancing yourself from. Usually what happens is these parts have characteristics that you’re attracted to in men on a very deep, unconscious level. In other words, you can be attracting and attracted to what you don’t like about yourself. So the goal here is to discover, listen to, learn about, accept and love these voices and parts of yourself, which are actually deeply in love with you and are just trying to help and protect you (they just don’t always know how to go about it in the best ways). This way you get comfortable in your own skin, and start attracting a new kind of man. It’s definitely an amazing tool and experience!

    Love, Helena

  87.  #87Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 2:27 pm

    LoveAlways – I loved what you wrote in 24!!

    RileyTheOwl – I like that name : )

    Amber – so good to write those “processing letters.” I do them all the time! I don’t think I’m brave enough to post them here. Lol. But they do help…

    Last time I wrote one, I couldn’t believe it – S contacted me the very same night! I had no expectations. I simply write the letter from my heart, with no intention to send it… But I think it must have shifted my vibe into a more relaxed groove of being in line with myself and me feelings… Always helpful : )

  88.  #88Kyla on February 25, 2014 at 2:28 pm

    Helena thank you! This is so helpful.

    “voices and parts of yourself, which are actually deeply in love with you and are just trying to help and protect you”

    When I hear my NVs I sometimes give them the voice of a small child and it is easier to love on that small child who’s just repeating what she’s been told.

  89.  #89RileyTheOwl on February 25, 2014 at 2:31 pm

    Speaking of stranger names, my stranger name is Riley. It feels wrong to use it on here now.. because it’s the name of the little girl inside me who I love, but can get on my nerves sometimes. I usually use the name Riley for usernames as well. My real name is Claire, I’m going to go with it from here on out 🙂 it feels more authentic for this blog.

  90.  #90Kyla on February 25, 2014 at 2:33 pm

    Oops I missed these!

    Thanks Olivia 🙂
    Thanks RileyTheOwl 🙂

  91.  #91Amber on February 25, 2014 at 2:48 pm

    Thanks, Helena-85-I thought it was toxic men, but wasn’t sure. Looking forward to the teleclass tonight!

  92.  #92Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 2:50 pm

    I just did a really powerful thing. Well, it feels powerful – in a vulnerable kind if way.

    See, I was so scared to tell my father the truth. But how am I helping by keeping it to myself? So I opened with the fact that I care about him. Then I proceeded to tell him his situation is out of control and he needs support. Well, I didn’t say “need.” I suggested a 12-step group. You see, my father is basically an addict. Like a lot of us coming in here, he has emotional addiction problems, even if they don’t get attached to a substance. It is still just as bad and just as harmful.

    I said I was afraid to tell him because he might get angry, but that I didn’t care, because being afraid of his anger in the status quo is worse.

    And it was true. I would rather he gets angry at me for being bold and suggesting he gets help – even if he hates it – than to live in fear of his emotional explosions. Because that is what they are. Like nuclear bombs that flatten my own emotional landscape and take days to recover from… And make me fear any interaction with him.

    Maybe I feel bolstered by the relationship with M. He has been supportive of me and really makes me feel loved and cared for. In fact, today he said he loved me for the first time : ) I feel solid about his feelings and bit scared or threatened. And it feels good because it feels like I am CHOOSING it.

    S was in contact with me. I know how much he turns me on. But he was up-front from the beginning: he doesn’t want to be married. Or have kids. Ever. Whereas M is just the opposite. He’s falling in love with me and we’ve only kissed. He says I am the most beautiful woman he’s ever met.

    I feel like just soaking up a this love and enjoying it and responding, and not questioning. I’m searching my heart and I have no misgivings. I know when I say something, he listens. He wants to please me, and I also care how he feels – not before me, but it does matter to me. If I did something to hurt him, I would feel bad. So I want to avoid that. But also know that nothing is set in stone and there is a lot that remains to be seen…

    And I got a random text from H today (aka Beach man). It has been forever since I heard from him. I haven’t texted back. I always feel bad when I engage with him. Ugh

    It feels good to have a boyfriend. It doesn’t feel like a trap. It feels like a freedom because I don’t have to worry. And I like that. But I’m still here, because I still need the support and I know that it’s still going to be tricky, navigating new waters with a new person, and using feeling messages and non-blames language. It feels better already, but it’s good to have the community to come back to because I’m sure challenges will come along…

  93.  #93Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 2:52 pm

    *not scared or threatened! (Autocorrect…) sheesh. Lol

  94.  #94Helena Hart on February 25, 2014 at 3:03 pm

    Kyla – 87 – Glad that was helpful! Sometimes even our habits and the old “roads” we go down when we feel triggered are just trying to save and protect us too, I just wrote a blog post about that.

    Amber – 90 – You’re welcome! I’m looking forward to the teleclass tonight too! I’m going to be talking about exactly what a man needs to fall in love and want to stay forever.

  95.  #95LoveAlways on February 25, 2014 at 5:01 pm

    Thanks Tereana!

    I just penned a new sirenblog poem:

    Inappropriate Thought of the Day . . . STILETTOS
    02/25/20140 Comments

    see me tip my scales from side to side
    like walking up stairs in stilettos on my toes
    got it going on
    not hurting anything or anyone one in anyway.

    Passing them all by
    with a knowing look

    Turn away

    Keep it stepping
    Just tipping along
    in stilettos walking up stairs on my toes

  96.  #96Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 8:29 pm

    Ok, well, sigh of relief. H had a legit question for me. And it actually had to do with his current Gf. He wanted advice/feedback. It was odd, I didn’t feel jealous, I felt relieved because it made it easier to tell him I have a boyfriend. Yay. And it made me appreciate Meven more : )

    I did my best to give honest feedback while underscoring that only he can decide what to do. He asked me because his Gf and I have something in common…

    Anyway. I’m glad I took the call. It wasn’t too bad.

    And a positive enough response from my father. Hex wasn’t angry (that I could tell) and he doesn’t hate me.

    M just likes me more and more. This is fun. I don’t know how to tell people. I don’t want to ruin it. Lol…

  97.  #97Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 8:31 pm

    LoveAlways, why inappropriate?? ; )

  98.  #98Tereana on February 25, 2014 at 8:37 pm

    About the woman in Rori’s post, this makes me think of Mel’s story also. She was not attracted to Architect at ALL in the beginning. But he showed up, he was consistent, she let him give to her, and over time she became very attracted to him! So…even if the man’s physical appearance doesn’t change, sometimes our perceptions of him can…

    ‘Night, ladies!

  99.  #99LoveAlways on February 25, 2014 at 9:06 pm

    LOL – Tereana I copied the heading from the page! “Inappropriate thoughts” is part of the graphic:

  100.  #100Helena Hart on February 25, 2014 at 10:07 pm

    98 – I love that there’s a siren blog!! Is it yours, LoveAlways?

    – Helena

  101.  #101Liquid Light on February 25, 2014 at 10:44 pm

    On this smothering thing, I just had a date and it was overall great. But he was super affectionate, hands all over me, eyes laser focused on me. Its nice on one level but its a bit much too. Its a bit smothering, and my first instinct is to pull away. Its hard to get in touch with your own feelings if the guy doesn’t give you any space. On the plus side – he’s smart, sweet, accomplished, interesting, cute, creative.

    It doesn’t help that my ex was the same way, and extremely sexual, and ended up breaking up with me and breaking my heart when I didn’t reciprocate in every way.

  102.  #102Liquid Light on February 25, 2014 at 10:51 pm

    I want stiletto

  103.  #103Daria on February 26, 2014 at 1:20 am

    still feeling good

  104.  #104Daria on February 26, 2014 at 1:21 am

    i am still oopen for dating

    i will now answer my pofs

  105.  #105Daria on February 26, 2014 at 1:44 am

    i answered them! yay me ! and now to rest and gather up my electricity

  106.  #106Daria on February 26, 2014 at 1:52 am

    LK said some praises to me tonight and got me feeling magical and powerful about being able to sense electricity and magnetism (electromagnetically sensitive)

  107.  #107T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 5:54 am


    I was dating this guy that was recently divorced and in December he stopped talking to me cold turkey because he was being manipulated by his ex. So he decided to call me back in February telling me how much he miss me and asking for another chance. Wondering how can he want another chance with me but witing to see if his ex is gonna take him back? Ive started back chatting with him, we spends the night with eachother at times and have a sexually relationship. I feel as if im stuck and need some advice on what to do. I really love this guy and he know it. Im talking with other guys but cant get into them like im into him. I even tried lying as far as telling him im getting married in July just to protect my feelings but its not working.

  108.  #108Shannon P. on February 26, 2014 at 6:03 am

    T, I can’t tell you what to do. I can only tell you what I would do. Given your history with this guy, quite frankly, I would tell him no, and I would move on.

    However hard it is, you know this guy and you now know EXACTLY what he does. He runs back to her EVERY TIME.

    I would tell him not to call me again. Period.

    No matter how much you love HIM, you’re a fill-in for him until she lets him crawl back. He is as addicted to HER as you are to HIM. Think about that. Seriously sit down and really, really think about that.

    He is as addicted to her as you are to him… so if she crooks her finger at him again, what is he going to do? What would you do if he crooked his finger at you?

    I think that Rori would tell you to cold turkey from this guy. I’ve seen her tell people that multiple times on the blog. When you’re addicted to a guy, the most self-loving thing you can do is cut them out of your life entirely.

    Just as you are addicted to him, he is addicted to her. He’ll always go back if she lets him. But he’ll keep coming back to you when she’s in her “off” period, because you will always let him…

    It’s a never ending cycle, unless you choose to step out of it and let him find someone else to play this endless game with.

    You have the power to step away, but like heroin, it can be extremely difficult to let a man go when we are addicted. But this isn’t going to change for you. Just as all of those men you are dating are second fiddle to him… you are second fiddle to his ex.

    I know that sounds harsh, but you have to sit yourself down and be honest with yourself about what you’re doing here. You’re being a willing second fiddle to her. You’ll never measure up, just as the men you are dating never measure up in your own mind against him.

    Is that honestly, truly, sincerely how you feel? ARE YOU really a second fiddle, or do you want to be the “leading lady” of your own life? What are you really willing to settle for, for yourself?

    That’s what you have to decide here.

  109.  #109T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 6:37 am

    I do feel that way most of the time that I am second fiddle to her. I guess I go by what he says. Everytime my mind id made up to just let it be he decides to call back. Im really tired of going thru the same thing with him and honestly feel as if im at my breaking point but at the same time having hopes of us working. I asked him Sunday do they(he and the ex) still talk and he said occasionnally. I also asked if he was considering moving to Cali where she’s located and he said if he wants to be with her he guess he have no other choice. I dont hink she really wants him but she know as of now she have advantage over him. She told me herself that he will jump to her finger snap! He says otherwise but idk.

  110.  #110Shannon P. on February 26, 2014 at 6:46 am

    Yes, you do know. You just don’t want to accept it.

    And trust me, I know that feeling, so there’s no judgment in saying that. It’s an addiction, giving it up feels like ripping something essential out of ourselves.

    But again. He’s your addiction… but you’re not his addiction. It will always be one-sided; she’ll always be his addiction.

    You really have to choose whether you want to continue this cycle or not. You’re not deciding whether or not you and he can be together–he has already decided that he’ll go back to her every time because he is addicted… you’re deciding only what part you will play in his ongoing saga with her.

    Will you be his past, or will you be his “go to gal” every time she tosses him? That’s what you’re deciding here.

  111.  #111T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 6:58 am

    I understand exactly what your saying and trust I know its the truth. After my kids dad and I broke it off I thought I would always jump to his beat and he thought the same thing. I did eventually come to my sense and stopped with him so I know in time this to will end. He even tries me still but im strong enough to say no. I just dont think no of us will forever be in a situation to jump whenever someone in our past calls!! I can be wrong but I dont think they will work even if its not with me. For starters they have been separated before for almost a year. She has now divorced him and went back to her home town, she’s much older than him and have 3 kids one his age and he has none and wants kids.

  112.  #112Shannon P. on February 26, 2014 at 7:08 am

    I’ve been following your story, and he just recently went back to her again, unless I misunderstood what you were saying… and broke up with you to do so.

    But you can do what you wish, of course. 🙂

    If you decide you’re going to do this yet again, remember that you need to out-girl the other woman.

    So get your Siren program out again and heat up your air waves. Listen to it over and over again and out-girl her!

  113.  #113Turquoise on February 26, 2014 at 7:09 am

    Ouch… 107, Shannon P. I’m not sure if Rori has changed her rules, but in the past we were directed to not really give each other that kind of direct advice. Using words like always and never… aren’t words we want to use with the men in our lives either, so it does feel good to practice that here as well. All men are different, all relationships are different, and taking a couple of paragraphs in a post to mean that someone will always choose an ex and never choose you…. feels overly rigid to me, at least.

    T. Bradley, I know how it feels to want one man so much more than others… I am sure we can all relate to how intoxicating that can feel. The one thing I have learned in all my experiences is that time and space can really help alleviate those feelings and clear my head a little bit. Maybe if circular dating others isn’t exciting you, planning to see friends or a special day for yourself could help some. We learn here to be sirens, how to carry ourselves and set us apart from the needy clingy scared versions of ourselves we once maybe showed the men in our lives. I believe any man can be inspired to step up and choose a woman. Focus on yourself and figure out what you want for you. The rest will come from there. There is sooo much great information here, and everyone wants to help each other. It’s such a great way to process our thoughts and feelings!


  114.  #114T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 7:23 am

    I love your post and glad that you can relate to what im saying. Love can be something serious. Im focusing more on myself now. We now spend most weekends together. And circular dating isnt really my thing. I actually be out with this one guy but he’s not really my type. He told me last week that when we was talking marriage thats what he really wanted but his mind wasnt stable.

    No they haven’t been together since she divorced him in 2012. She told him as well as myself to go and live his life but soon as he starts doing that she gets mad with him so he starts acting crazy towards me! He tells me that she hasnt said she’s gonna take him back but at one time they was talking about it.

  115.  #115LoveAlways on February 26, 2014 at 7:40 am

    Helena – yes

  116.  #116LoveAlways on February 26, 2014 at 7:40 am

    Helena – yes

  117.  #117LoveAlways on February 26, 2014 at 7:41 am

    Sorry for double posting – phone is acting weird

  118.  #118Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 8:08 am

    LoveAlways – Awesome!!! I’ll check it out! 🙂

    Love, Helena

  119.  #119Liquid Light on February 26, 2014 at 10:58 am

    Did anyone read my post #100? Is this something to be concerned about? Btw, he’s been separated for a year and said the divorce will be finalized in the next few months. Maybe he’s just wanting a fling?

  120.  #120Veronica on February 26, 2014 at 11:23 am

    Indigo – 14 and 37 – There’s something in what you’ve written that I believe I can learn from. While I don’t chase and cajole for affection, I do recognize something in that completely free and in yourself at ease that you describe that I want to open up for myself.

    Because I sense that I’m not there yet, and that that could be an obstacle. Okay so there’s a wanting on my part for affection, I used to feel hungry for it, sometimes starved, now there’s an in-body pressure from this wanting to be adored. While I did let a past CD enjoy his affection of me (and I was surprised how easily I let that happen – all melty and sinking in yummy-ness). I do have an energy that wants, I notice a trying, not quite a doing but a trying, that my openness would tend to something and not a terminating or an ending of something. Could desire get in the way? I don’t do – as in initiate, but there are more subtle feelers of mine – how do I know? Because although I was more listening of me in my interaction with him, I still don’t really honour what I’ve heard from me. If I honour what I’ve heard then the fun will be over because on some level I know that this interaction will not be long term at all. I don’t really want to be all in me when this is how things sit.

  121.  #121Veronica on February 26, 2014 at 11:25 am

    I finally recognized how my NVs are trying to protect me. Yay I noticed that.

    And while I’ve decided to retreat from actively dating men, this one man today – his energy felt so directed at me – like a cooing and purring – and it was so unexpected, as in, I’m off for a while. Did not see that coming at all. I kept my distance because that’s what I felt like doing.

  122.  #122Daria on February 26, 2014 at 11:26 am

    Love Always – OMG i LOVE! Ifeel carried away

    by the vision of tipping your scales side to side on stilettos ….

  123.  #123T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 11:48 am

    Liquid Light-100,
    I love to be affectionate myself. I was involved with this guy for 2 years and he says his ex wasnt affecionate at all and I really dont think he knows how to handle that. He says he loves it but he’s still acting a d** fool. She divorced him in 2012 but he’s still chasing her for some reason. Anyway for a while I was thinking he only wanted me for a fling. This is my first experience dating a guy that was getting ready to go thru a divorce and it’s just not working for me. I dont know if it’s because his ex was more of a mother figure and thats all he know right now.

  124.  #124T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 12:16 pm

    Love Always-25,

    Ahahahaha I just love it!!!!! She did that song right?

  125.  #125RileyTheOwl on February 26, 2014 at 12:42 pm

    T. Bradley, I really feel like the time has come for you to focus on putting yourself first 🙂 it’s easier said than done, and if you’re not quite sure what this means and you aren’t super familiar with Rori’s programs/tools then I suggest you subscribe to the free daily emails she sends! By putting yourself first, it is healing yourself. You will begin to see light everywhere, feel overwhelming feelings and ENJOY them. The more you use her tools and practice, the better you will feel. I have never bought a single rori program, but I get my hands on all the free stuff I can!
    This man sounds a little unstable… I know you love him, and maybe just take a moment to feel that desire wash over you. But afterwards, let your mind move on to something else. Maybe spend a day loving yourself and see how this feels 🙂 see a friend, or go out and make a friend somewhere! Have a bath, make your favorite meal. Do somethting you love. Love yourself. If he does something that makes you feel icky… Whether it’s talking about his ex, or turning you down, TELL HIM. “I’m feeling really weird right now… I don’t like hearing about other women when I’m with you, it makes me feel off.” It’s up to you. I hope this helped 🙂

  126.  #126Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 1:01 pm

    Liquid Light – 100 – Was this your first date with this man? Is that why it felt like a bit “much”?

    Love, Helena

  127.  #127Liquid Light on February 26, 2014 at 1:13 pm

    T Bradley, Yeah, I’m a bit concerned about him being separated for only a year too, and not being divorced yet. I just wonder it that has something to do with him being so affectionate with me last night.

    Helena, Yes, it was our first date, and yes that’s why I’m concerned about it. It felt like too much. He kept grabbing my hand too and was leaning forwards me, and in my space more and more as the date went on. I don’t really like it when someone grabs my hands like that. I pulled my hand away a couple of times but he kept doing it. I’m probably just more reserved when it comes to this stuff as it is.

  128.  #128Leigha Baker on February 26, 2014 at 1:21 pm

    Hi Sirens!

    While I have my chance to catch up with the latest on the blog…

    Is anyone watching the Bachelor this season – specifically last night? How Andy tried to communicate with Juan Pablo…how feeling messages would have helped immensely – and the situation could’ve brought them closer?!

    I could say so much more…

    I’m curious what everyone else thought? 🙂

  129.  #129Millie on February 26, 2014 at 1:38 pm

    Amber and Helena–
    I’m so interested in learning my stranger! Thanks for sharing….curious about the toxic men program now..and where it could lead me to….

    Yesterday was pretty great..
    Spent the morning sharing my portfolio with the next senior class where I graduated from. It was really exciting and fulfilling to be on the other side of the fence and share my experiences with the class. It feels good to be considered a role model and to give my perspective. I remember being in their shoes and how it felt.
    At work, my coworker described me as “A quiet force” because I always have a point of view, but I don’t shove in people’s faces or feel the need to be the center of attention. Quiet confidence. I loved hearing that!! That is exactly who I want to be and sounds like I am projecting that! Great 🙂
    After work I went salsa dancing yay! I felt unsure of myself at first since it’s been awhile since I salsa-ed, but I swing dance all the time, so it was easy to pick back up. I danced with many guys, all very friendly and helpful! One guy, who I was having a hard time following…I told him I am mainly a swing dancer and just learning salsa, he asked me if I was a better swing dancer than salsa. In the moment, I felt insulted! So after that I wanted to leave…He came up to me again and asked me to dance, I said “No way!” He asked why and I said because you were rude to me. I feel insulted. He didn’t have a clue, and when i repeated his comment, he apologized and said he didn’t mean it I was bad at salsa and hoped he could dance with me again later. It felt good to just SAY what I was thinking and feeling. After that I danced with a ton of other guys and the “rude” guy came again to ask me to dance, this time asking me if “I wanted to dance with the nice guy.” Haha…I said yes. Another guy kept on dancing with me and we were having a great time just being silly and sexy. At the end, he waited for me and my friend and put his arm out for me to grab. I gracefully accepted and he walked me to the car and kissed me on the cheek. All in all I’m pretty happy with siren choices, all baby steps or pedals, up that hill 🙂

    I’d like to add too, Shannon P. you mentioned how if I had been more practiced I would have accepted Mechanic’s walking me to my car. I’ve never had a problem accepting that kind of gesture, but looking back, he didn’t really make it clear that is what he was doing. We had happened to be leaving at the same time and he waited for me, but walked in front of me to the exit near his car all without saying anything. Looking back I remember feeling unsure, and I walked out the door closest to my car. He looked back to see me not there. I didn’t want to just follow him, when my car was the other direction. He said later he didn’t know there were two exits. Anyways, it doesn’t matter, but what does matter to me is if he’d been walking me to MY car, he would have asked where are you parked or extended his arm, or said let’s go, or I’ll walk you out, or anything, anything, instead of just walking to the parking lot and expecting me to follow. I didn’t want to follow. I didnt want to look at this man’s back as I tried to keep up since I wore a tight little skirt and he was charging out of that joint. I made that quick decision and now, I feel like it was right. Following him would not have felt good. Saying “wait for me” would not have felt good, calling his name out to stop would not have felt good. So maybe, my gut is serving me better than I think.

  130.  #130Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    Liquid Light – 126 – That makes sense. I’ve found that there’s a big difference between a man’s energy coming towards you (which usually feels good), and a man who just WANTS something from you (which can feel icky, especially if he barely knows you).

    If you feel uncomfortable when ANY man’s energy is coming towards you, that’s something you’d want to take a look at. But otherwise I’d say it’s important to trust yourself and your instincts around this.

    Love, Helena

  131.  #131T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 1:49 pm

    Riley the owl-124,
    Yes I take all positive info and soak it in. Things are getting better everyday!

  132.  #132T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 1:51 pm

    Liquid Light-126,
    I think thats my problem. And maybe he’s different and will act like a man should act. Just let him be affectionate and see how things go.

  133.  #133Millie on February 26, 2014 at 1:52 pm

    Although, a good feeling message to use at that moment would have been….I felt like I was running after you when my car was in the other direction. Following a man out doesn’t feel as good as being walked out by a man. I would have liked to walk out together. Done.

  134.  #134T.Bradley on February 26, 2014 at 1:54 pm

    Riley the owl-124,
    He admitted that his mind was unstable at that time he stopped talking to me cold turkey. When he called me back in February and said he messed me I think it was only to have sex! He did ask for another chance but why ask for another chance and keep saying you still wanna be with your ex? Thats crazy and yes he still seem unstable.

  135.  #135Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 1:58 pm

    Millie – 128 – Yes, the stranger is an amazing tool! It’s about embracing, loving, and accepting all parts of yourself – because if you’re not doing this, these parts often end up “running” you (your thoughts, beliefs, behavior, etc.).

    I’m going to be working with this concept in my next teleclass, where I’ll be talking about healing and getting through the “rough spots” in your love life. I felt all kinds of things shifting in me after the first time I tried it!

    Love, Helena

  136.  #136Liquid Light on February 26, 2014 at 2:32 pm

    Yeah, I think I’ll see how it goes and try to trust my instincts. He seems like he is a genuinely nice person, just a bit overly enthused. Hahahaha!

    Thanks TBradley and Helena!

  137.  #137Leigha Baker on February 26, 2014 at 2:37 pm

    Indigo – 14

    I loved what you wrote! And how you’re so aware of your feelings and what you feel good doing and not doing.

  138.  #138Leigha Baker on February 26, 2014 at 2:42 pm

    Veronica – your posts always have an essence of softness, awareness, openness and vulnerability to them – it’s really inspiring to read them.

  139.  #139Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 3:09 pm

    Leigha – 127 – I have it recorded, I’ll have to watch it! 🙂

  140.  #140Tereana on February 26, 2014 at 3:15 pm

    Oh my goodness… Ladies, I just literally got teary eyed from reading a message from M.

    He wrote to me that he’s always been praying for a [girl] with a golden heart. And that he feels very, very happy…

    And I just responded that I feel so much joy. Because it’s true. It is so amazing…

    Only a little while before I met him, I had written down on a piece of paper that I had a goal to be in a relationship. Now, this doesn’t always work for me, but in this case, I believe I wrote it with a clear intention, as well as a belief and openness to to really being true and possible. And it’s amazing how little time it’s taken. Especially since it’s taken me a LONG time to get to this point…

    And despite all the beliefs I had about being unlovable, unworthy, etc. I no longer believe that. It doesn’t feel true anymore. I feel the most lovable, the most worthy.

    He’s saying he prayed for a woman with a golden heart. And I feel like that really is my heart. It feels so true and wonderful…

    Wow, just one happy girl… *melt*

  141.  #141Leigha Baker on February 26, 2014 at 3:22 pm

    Helena – Yayy!! Yes watch it and it would be great to hear your thoughts!! 🙂

  142.  #142Leigha Baker on February 26, 2014 at 3:25 pm

    Tereana – I love it!!! How exciting – I’m so happy for you! I love that you wrote it down too. 🙂

  143.  #143Linda on February 26, 2014 at 4:08 pm

    In my absence from here I have been trying to work thru some big issues inside me. I am stuck and have come to a wall. I feel a great big black hole of fear and pain in my chest. Thoughts roll over in my mind and tears roll down my cheeks randomly. There is such a mire of emotional soup inside me that I cant get my balance.

    Today I came home from work, standing there alone my heart feels a great sense of loss. It feels closed and I have found ties in my soul that are hindering me in moving forward in my love life. At times I am filled with concern about it . At others.. I just can touch a belief that when I feel a deep abiding peace in my spirit with a man… they will loose their grip on me.

    I have so many feelings to sort thru still when it comes to understanding myself and how the last relationship I was in affected me good and bad.

  144.  #144Turquoise on February 26, 2014 at 7:32 pm

    I just heard from 3 guys within seconds of each other. Funny thing… I wasn’t thinking about any of them….. Lol, also realizing all 3, plus piano man, their names start with J. Hmmm.

    At hither guy texted me this morning, haven’t met him yet, but sounds nice. His name starts with a K, lol… Is the universe sending me a funny message of… Next? 🙂 I know that’s silly, but if I can’t laugh about dating, I might cry, so keeping it light!

  145.  #145Millie on February 26, 2014 at 8:20 pm

    when is this teleclass? and how does that work? is it like skype??

    Tereana–YAY!! what an amazing thing to hear! So happy for you!

  146.  #146Tereana on February 26, 2014 at 8:23 pm

    Thank you, Leigha! It feels good to be seen : ) instead of just rambling on here randomly… But that’s ok, too, I guess.

    I just wanted to share. As much as I wanted to share anything. It feels kind of surreal and real at the same time. I will see him tomorrow night. Then I will find out how real it feels… Lol

    Linda – we missed you!! Or at least, I missed you…

    And turquoise, that’s awesome – when it rains it pours ; )

  147.  #147Tereana on February 26, 2014 at 8:27 pm

    Thank you, too, Millie!

    I feel so super smiley right now 🙂 🙂

    In fact, I was actually so happy tonight that I felt kind of irritable. I know that sounds weird. I think I was just so overwhelmed with positive emotion. But it wasn’t bad, I just need time to process… I’m holding onto myself. Still here… : )

  148.  #148Tereana on February 26, 2014 at 8:32 pm

    Millie, I liked your post in 128, too. You sound like a siren on fire!! 🙂

  149.  #149Indigo on February 26, 2014 at 8:37 pm

    Leigha 136,

    Thank you so much 🙂 I do feel like I’ve come a long way in this way.

  150.  #150Indigo on February 26, 2014 at 8:42 pm

    Veronica 119,

    What I would like to say to you is make sure it’s affection you seek…

    If your desire for affection is pure, it will feel different, you won’t have the same expectations and “needing” attached to it, and other people will more readily provide it, and you won’t feel so disappointed if they don’t. However if you’re trying to validate or prove something, or “get” something that you maybe should be looking to yourself for, you will feel that yearning, uncomfy feeling attached to it. And then probably best to sit with it and see what it’s trying to say rather than reach out.

    Just my experience 🙂

  151.  #151Indigo on February 26, 2014 at 8:51 pm

    Shannon 63,

    I just simply cannot agree. Sometimes leaving a relationship can be a loving act, and it does NOT mean people are disposable, and is not the same at all as a parent choosing not to fulfill the needs of a dependent child. Adults are not dependent, and they do have to make decisions for their own life which, yes, sometimes may temporarily hurt another, but may be better in the long run.

    Hurt is NOT necessarily a bad thing (harm is different). It is in painful experiences that we most often find our greatest growth and awakening. Dominique has some beautiful articles on this.

    I married when I was very young as well. During the course of my marriage I discovered I did not want to have children. For my husband on the other hand, this was his dearest dream. He also cherished the idea of a more domestic wife, whilst I could feel the wings of my soul straining to soar and experience more of the world and broaden my mind. I was feeling caged in in that relationship, and as a result I could not love him as he deserved. He was a wonderful, loving, supportive husband but the relationship was not bringing out either of our best selves.

    I decided to leave as much for his sake as my own – I couldn’t bear not being able to be and give someone I loved so much what they wanted. He is now happily married to a woman who is a much better fit for him, and they are expecting their first child. The men I have dated since him have been a much better fit for me, and I am more fulfilled in my own life, so I know it was the right decision. And it was a loving act.

  152.  #152Millie on February 26, 2014 at 8:58 pm

    Thank you Tereana! 🙂

    Liquid Light–

    You mentioned that the fact he isn’t officially divorced feels weird to you…I’m wondering if maybe you need a boundary…”I don’t date men that are still married or just seperated.” “I feel weird going out with a man that is married.” What do you think? Or is it just his energy that is concerning? I get turned off my smothery guys too…I begin to feel invisible, like I’m not really seen or being heard.

  153.  #153Helena Hart on February 26, 2014 at 9:33 pm

    Millie – 144 – The next teleclass is on Tuesday (and then the next two Tuesdays after that). It’s over the phone, and if you can’t make the live call the recordings are posted immediately afterwards. Here’s where you can find all the info:

    If you have any specific questions about it, feel free to ask me here or email me through my website! 🙂

    Love, Helena

  154.  #154Emerson on February 26, 2014 at 10:40 pm

    105 Daria I was just thinking about lk today.

  155.  #155Emerson on February 26, 2014 at 10:40 pm


  156.  #156Emerson on February 26, 2014 at 10:43 pm

    CutecityCD wants me to drive to him to meet for a date. It’s about 35 minutes.
    He is wealthy and had a busy job etc so he wants me to go there.
    I’m thinking “no” but in tempted.

  157.  #157Daria on February 27, 2014 at 12:05 am

    Emerson – “i’m feeling mixed feelings… I feel disappointed it would feel so awesome to see you … and actually i feel kinda weird I really don’t feel romantic driving to see a man… I feel so much better when the man comes to me and takes me out”

  158.  #158Daria on February 27, 2014 at 12:08 am

    I’ve been noticing M man coming in my thoughts and lo and behold he called

    Guywho called a few days ago sounding flirtatious too

    the man im dating closely im feeling good with

    answering more pofs now

    choosing not to discourage myself from my visions of the glory of all men wanting me (and smalling myself down to only focus on the guy who is dating me and making me feel good)

    i want to continue attracting and inspiring/stimulating him until we have committed

  159.  #159Daria on February 27, 2014 at 12:09 am

    Emerson – don’t even consider it but keep it polite and flirty 🙂

  160.  #160Daria on February 27, 2014 at 12:11 am

    that really works for me, esp to not drain myself engaging with men where i dont feel princessy

    i can now say oh i feel disappointed and be ok with that feeling… and also feel smily knowing im loving myself when i don’t engage with men on certain levels of behavior, only with the men behaving on the levels im choosing

  161.  #161Femininewoman on February 27, 2014 at 1:45 am

    Re 139 🙂

  162.  #162Syreena on February 27, 2014 at 3:40 am

    LL, nice does not equate to good.
    Niceness is a strategy, comes from the head. They have an agenda, they want something.
    Goodness comes from the heart.

    To me personally it makes me freeze, shudder or want to pull away if someone who hasn’t spent a lot of time getting to know me wants to touch me. I feel creeped out. I could be any random girl as they don’t even know ME yet. They just obviously like my outer shell and this shows me how they think of and behave with women girls in general. I don”t want a man who treats women or me like that personally.
    To me it shows me they are happy to be physical and touch women like we are objects rather than real people. I don’t like that myself.

  163.  #163Linda on February 27, 2014 at 4:23 am

    Thanks Terena !

    in reading comment #150… I appreciate the the gentle wisdom there Indigo. What you write is what I have lived. Not the exact details but leaving can be a loving act and best for the two people involved.

    I too left a marriage but after 27 years and my 2 children was born. My husband was a wonderful supportive good man. (He still is this kind of man) By all appearances we had a marriage that others would love to have. Inside it I was alone, there was no emotional connection, intimacy, passion, romance and I was so very very unhappy and after I communicated my needs and hopes things did not change… I became so angry and resentful.

    I came to the place where I realized that the man I married was not knit together in such a way to even begin to provide what I had never had but wanted so much… leaving was the best. Expecting him to be someone he wasnt was not was so wrong of me.

    Seven single years later I have yet to find a man that fits though. The last relationship I had with the man I called FavoriteCD came super close in the beginning of the relationship… however after several attempts it did not work either. Emotionally he was a man-boy and so insecure and needy. Sexually things were awesome, but it all began to break down because of all the other issues. He is a supportive, good loving affectionate man too. It felt a constant tug of war was going on between us. For me a relationship is a partnership not an ownership. We did not bring out each others best.

    I often battle feelings of defeat or thoughts that I messed up my life (recently a huge battle) because leaving people who profess they LOVE you is hard.

    I could survive but not THRIVE in either of those relationships. I even have recently seriously explored reuniting with my ex-husband to which he is open to.. but it does not fit me. I dont want to settle for cohabitating with someone the rest of my life.

    I needed to read that post… I needed to revisit why I left my marriage and why a man loving you is not necessarily a reason to stay engaged in the relationship.

    Maybe this will help me break the ties I have in my soul to my past. Something has to give here. This pain inside has gotta go.

  164.  #164Tereana on February 27, 2014 at 4:57 am

    Last night, CCB was blowing up my phone with all kinds of texts. I heard the buzzing but just rolled over and went to sleep. Lol. He is thinking of me now…

    It was a sexual, of course.

    I like what I have with M. It feels good, but it’s still new. We are still getting to know each other. He has reassured me that it’s not going to end. Still, it’s nice to know there are men out there who want me. Cute, attractive, successful men…even if they only just want me for my body. Lol

    M wants me for my heart. That much is clear. And to me that is so much more valuable. That is the kind of thing that stays…swoon.

    Oy, I just didn’t really think it was possible band it is!! Even with my crazy family! Even with being engaged before! Ah! Quick, somebody pinch me… Lol. I must be dreaming….

  165.  #165Linda on February 27, 2014 at 6:08 am

    Terena… so nice to read the place you are in. enjoy!

  166.  #166Cris on February 27, 2014 at 6:21 am


  167.  #167April Rose on February 27, 2014 at 7:07 am

    Hello ((((((Linda)))))

    I missed you too.

    Something that Rori coached a lady on (I forget in which programme) which brought much relief, was this:

    Forget about ‘moving on’, ‘breaking ties’, or any form of closure. Because – that takes effort and uses up your precious energy. Instead, imagine each man from your past is on your horse. Where is he? Is he on the saddle behind you? Hanging onto for dear life to the horse’s mane? Is he bumping up and down in the saddle bag?

    Just picture him and let him come along on your horse with you.
    The main focus remains as you, your horse, and your journey.

  168.  #168Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:35 am

    Leigha -137 – (((((Wa, thank you.))))))) I’ve been feeling concerned about whether I was shutting down or becoming ‘cold’ – your perspective helps me. (Breathing and relieved)I feel safer to tread further.

  169.  #169Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:37 am

    Indigo – 149 – Okay (breathing), that ‘unpure’ affection really seems to get to what’s going on. I sense that it’ll help me to open up something. Sitting with it seems be to be a very loving thing to do for me. I definitely sense something deeper trying to provoke that (and there is fear on my part) and my impression from what’s been happening so far is that of a pushing me back to myself (feels like rejection most of the time or a ‘not here’ energy).

    This is so kind (thank you):
    “and other people will more readily provide it”

  170.  #170Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:38 am

    Indigo – 149 – Okay (breathing), that ‘unpure’ affection really seems to get to what’s going on. I sense that it’ll help me to open up something. Sitting with it seems be to be a very loving thing to do for me. I definitely sense something deeper trying to provoke that (and there is fear on my part) and my impression from what’s been happening so far is that of a pushing me back to myself (feels like rejection most of the time or a ‘not here’ energy).

    This is so kind (thank you):
    “and other people will more readily provide it”

  171.  #171Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:43 am

    Tomorrow will be a year since the breakup. While I’m not one for anniversaries, I do notice dark soft panicky and heartsore feelings shadowing about.

  172.  #172Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:44 am

    Emerson – 154 – Thank you for the hugs. And Hi : )
    As for wealthy and busy, I keep wondering if he couldn’t hire an assistant so that he is less busy or in this case, hire a beautiful car with a driver to make sure that 1) you arrive in style and 2) feel gorgeous and adored.

  173.  #173Veronica on February 27, 2014 at 7:44 am

    Tereana – It’s lovely reading your enjoying of his heart-care for you.

  174.  #174Kyla on February 27, 2014 at 7:52 am

    Hi T.Bradley 🙂
    From the last thread, NewGuy is 13 years older than me and although I usually date older men the gap isn’t usually so obvious.
    I guess it feels extra weird to me because you can “see” that there is a huge age gap. My daughter and her friend think he looks 100 years old (in reality he’s grey haired and looks his age) and I still get asked for i.d. when I go to a bar (thanks to my parent’s youthful looking genes!).
    I know Rori says not to judge age and instead go with how things feel..

  175.  #175Emerson on February 27, 2014 at 7:52 am

    Thank you veronica and Daria!

  176.  #176April Rose on February 27, 2014 at 8:46 am

    I just realised how crappy WM is towards me if things aren’t going well at our work.

    I feel nauseous and shakey when he is stressed.

  177.  #177Linda on February 27, 2014 at 8:47 am

    April Rose ty so much..

    I do remember the get on your horse and ride. I have done that.

    The soul ties I have are really attached thru my children and grandchildren and family to my past when I was married. I have a very amicable relationship with my ex. There are things that we agreed upon for the sake of our kids etc. I still use a discount club card that is in his business name and have a credit card for emergeny or gifts for our kids/grandkids if necessary. Get togethers , birthdays, some holidays like christmas have been spent at a mutual time and not seperate. He(my ex) does taxes and has done mine since our split.

    My oldest daughter still lives at the home with my ex husband. She does my hair there (she is my stylist) I have over the last 7 years spent some time there with her but it is very rare. My ex is usually never there and if he was he was doing something else and not in the same room with us.

    My last relationship man found all of this very upsetting and “abnormal” . He demanded that I cut up the cards, not go there at all, have my taxes done another way because it bothered him AND if I really loved him and cared how it affected him then I would. He pushed and expected to be included in everything in my life from within the first couple of months of our seeing each other.

    I felt bullied and pushed. I fully planned on changing things in my life when I finally met my new man and we were solid and committed. April of last year.. I introduced him to my family (ex excluded) for an easter dinner I had. One of my daughter and her husband are very close to my ex husband and they were friendly and kind. (My relationship had been strained with them since I divorced) I was sooo excited to have cleared the hurdle.

    Instead of my new man being pleased.. he was offended and said he was upset with how untalkitive and cool they were toward him. I was horrified and it made me so nervous. After many conversations with them.. my daughter and husband invited he and I to their home for a little cook out . He refused… because he was upset with their “snubbing” at easter. I let it go. I did nto pursue it. I felt stuck between a rock and a hard place.

    After that.. there had been so many things that arose between him and I(which I posted about over last year) I was feeling very unsure about the longivity of our relationship and by late June had broke things off with him. From that point on things were back and forth on an off , working on our relationship and since it was not solid.. I just did not want to push or incorporate him in things. Not till I was sure.

    It was one BIG mess and his BIG issue.

    Ultimately we did not work but he accused me of never making the break from my ex and I am disfuctional unhealthy. OMGosh… If he was the man for me… and I felt peace in my spirit about him and I I would have made the transistions and we would have been planning our life together. We never reached that point but he said it was because my family controlled me. OMG… what a mess it has all made me.

    I am second guessing so much!

  178.  #178Indigo on February 27, 2014 at 9:35 am


    I feel so happy that my writing that post helped to bring awareness to something for you 🙂

    I personally have not felt the need to break ties with the past. I have preferred a gentler, more natural process of letting go slowly as and when it feels right. This has worked for me. And most often, I keep people I once loved in my heart for a long time – sometimes I suspect for a lifetime.

    I believe saying goodbye to the relationship we once had with someone can be done with love, and dignity. For me, that has been absolutely and utterly necessary – to treat kindly and respectfully someone who has held my wellbeing so precious for so long. I could never dishonor them.

    I encourage you to find a way of moving forward that works for you, and not necessarily try to do it the way everyone else suggests. A different way might be best for you.


  179.  #179Indigo on February 27, 2014 at 9:36 am

    Veronica 168,

    🙂 ((hugs))

  180.  #180T.Bradley on February 27, 2014 at 9:57 am

    Ok i was thinking he was 13 years younger!!! Anyway Im going thru something with this guy thats 5 years younger than I am and I had a problem dating him at first because of that small gap but as time passed it wasnt anything to those few years age difference. However his ex is 17 years older than him and have a son the same age!!! Ive been talking to this guy thats 11 years older than I am, he’s ok and we like doing some of the same things but I noticed something that I didnt like about him that usually happens with age. Im use to looking at the guy that im having a hard time with committing that very much in shape and i love that!

  181.  #181T.Bradley on February 27, 2014 at 9:59 am

    Ive learned that everyone is different and we all have our ways of letting the past go. I tried so hard to get my guy friend to let his past go and he tried explaining that when the time is right he would. I guess i felt that way because she divorced him and moved to a different state. He is now still holding on therefore its hendering our realtionship from moving forward.

  182.  #182Femininewoman on February 27, 2014 at 10:05 am

    “He is now still holding on therefore its hendering our realtionship from moving forward”

    T Bradley is this proof enough that you do not have a relationship?

  183.  #183T.Bradley on February 27, 2014 at 10:09 am

    Well we was actually trying to move forward but when she calls its like his mind just goes elsewhere. He even asked me in November-December to marry him. He stopped cold turkey talking to me in December and all of a sudden asked for another chance in February. He’s really confused!!!!

  184.  #184Femininewoman on February 27, 2014 at 10:14 am

    T Bradley sorry but it seems to me that you are the one confused. How would you feel being married to a man whose heart is with another woman?

  185.  #185Femininewoman on February 27, 2014 at 10:18 am

    T your story reminds me of a friend’s. He was with a girl because the one he was in love with had moved on and married an older guy with a kid. He treated her like she was his property and a trophy to show off. She was a really beautiful girl. Eventually she realized that she could not do it anymore. It seems she had married to have someone to take care of her. He was successful and together but was a little abusive.

    As soon as she left that guy and got divorced, my friend dropped his current girlfriend like a hot potato and went off and married her.

    My lesson from the story is that a man who is still yearning for his ex is not ready for a relationship with anyone.

  186.  #186Femininewoman on February 27, 2014 at 10:27 am

    Pinch Pinch Tereana

  187.  #187Indigo on February 27, 2014 at 10:32 am

    T Bradley,

    Also remember that trying to get a guy to let go of his past is trying to control him, in some way. It can’t be done.

    You can’t coax or cajole or encourage him to do this… you really can only make yourself more enticing than the memory he has of his ex, and love yourself enough to give him the space to work through it on his own.

    In the meantime, are you dating other guys? or at least putting your focus on other things?

  188.  #188Liquid Light on February 27, 2014 at 10:42 am

    I”ve got a date with the architect on Sunday! I’m def going to give him a chance because he really is very awesome in many ways. I do think he’s a good person and genuinely interested in me. He asked me a ton of questions on our date the other night and really listened. Also, I guess I’m of the opinion that sexual chemistry is really important. I’ve known several women who are in sexless relationships/marriages, and I just can’t imagine that. There is no way I would be OK with that. Having a strong sexual attraction doesn’t seem like a bad thing, on the contrary, I think its good and if you don’t have that esp in the beginning then its something to be concerned about IMHO.

  189.  #189Liquid Light on February 27, 2014 at 10:43 am

    Yay Tereana, so happy for you!!!

  190.  #190T.Bradley on February 27, 2014 at 12:09 pm

    Indiago and Femininewoman,
    Both of you ladies have great points. Its just kind of hard because it’s been a long time since i’ve had a relationship. At this point i dont know if im feeling lonely or what the situation is. My thing is, is the ex gonna really take him back or is she doing this because he was trying to really move on with his life. This guy has everything I want in a man and its hard to let go. I dont chase him but I know soon im gonna just give up and let it be!

  191.  #191T.Bradley on February 27, 2014 at 12:13 pm

    Indigo 185,
    Im not trying to control him. I think its more of him trying to control me. His ex controls him, i dont know if its because she’s a lot older and has a great career that he lets her do it or what. My reaason for saying he tries to control me is because he most of the time wants things his way.

  192.  #192Liquid Light on February 27, 2014 at 12:44 pm

    I had a date last night, first time meeting each other for a drink. He kept cursing throughout our date and I finally couldn’t bite my tongue anymore because it was really bothering me and I said “You’re cursing a lot”. He was taken aback and got defensive and the date went downhill from there. Its not a big loss because he had other red flags that he was waving all over the place. But if anyone has suggestions for how to handle this better in the future, please let me know. I keep running across this. Ughh.

  193.  #193Linda on February 27, 2014 at 12:48 pm

    @ 176 thank you Indigo. What you wrote puts into words how I feel and is my attitude as well.

    I am believe that we reap what we sow. Life is challenging enough as it is without making it worse on ourselves.

    When I step back and look and my relationships. I have tried very hard to build bridges and enhance them. I feel pretty good about them.

    Then as an outsider I look at the relationships that man I was with… they were all broken. He hardly talked to him mom and when he did he would get so mad.. he has three siblings and only spoke to one and of his 2 of his four children did not even speak to him. His track record on marrige… 3 failed ones and he was did not speak well of the women. hmmmm

    And I was the unhealthy one?

  194.  #194Indigo on February 27, 2014 at 1:38 pm

    T Bradley 189,

    I understand. I don’t mean “control” in the negative or manipulative sense… I know you are not trying to do that.

    I mean it in the sense of wanting a particular outcome, even with the best of intentions. Trying to understand what is going on in a man’s head and trying to encourage him in a particular direction is a form of trying to control the outcome. The reason I say this is not a great idea is it puts too much of the focus on him.

    What matters is you, and how you feel.


  195.  #195Valarie O'Ryan on February 27, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Liquid Light, I know how it feels when a guy is acting in a way that completely turns you off.

    And I used to do 1 of 2 things:

    Clam up, say nothing, & hold resentment. OR

    Call him out on it in a blamey way – “You smoke too much.”

    And it never really worked for me. Now I just state how I FEEL so it’s all about me & leaves him out of it:

    “I feel really uncomfortable around a lot of smoking (or cussing).”

    It softened me up & let the guy step up & fix it. And if he didn’t then he just wasn’t the best guy for me, but it gave me loads of practice in stating how I was feeling.

    Love, ~Valarie

  196.  #196Liquid Light on February 27, 2014 at 3:38 pm

    Thanks Valarie! I’ll try that next time.

    I end up getting pretty affected by these types of guys that are just rude and inconsiderate and clueless about how to treat a woman. It just bums me out. I wish it didn’t affect me so much but it makes me feel depressed about meeting someone who is just respectful and kind. I guess I have expectations around this and feel that is this is the way I expect to be treated at the very least. And its rare to even find that so then I get discouraged and sad. I wish there was a way to suss these guys out beforehand and just avoid them altogether.

  197.  #197Liquid Light on February 27, 2014 at 3:49 pm

    Now that I think about it there were clues in his profile. And I was feeling a bit leery and anxious about meeting him. Probably should have just honored those gut feelings.

    On the other hand, we met at a place that I hadn’t been to before . And it was full of attractive classy professional men, def going back there! 🙂

  198.  #198JeanMarie on February 27, 2014 at 5:12 pm

    Lovely goddesses – have you noticed that when you use feeling messages with a guy – that he ends up using those back to you and then only talking about himself? at first I thought I was imagining this, but the last 3 men I have gone out with, I have paid more attention and this is definetly happening. It doesn’t make me feel very good. I use the feeling messages; they say how good I make them feel how theyfeel they can open up and then they do – but all they do is talk about themselves! what do you think, Ladies?

  199.  #199Linda on February 27, 2014 at 6:42 pm

    I spent the evening with the two most precious people in my life… my grandsons! ages 4 and 7 months. It always lifts my spirits and calms my mind. It is like I leave my the heaviness of life behind and get lost in the wonder and blessing of another land where the biggest deal in life is the the block tower you just built toppled over. HA!

    I drove home and within a few moments I realized I was yelling at the guy I no longer see. He used to pout when I spent an evening like that because it was not with him. I felt such a relief that I dont have the concern of dealing with a backlash of “I am just not important to you” from him. wow I really still have a lot of resentment about that. I honestly have to admit I became so unattracted to him for sooo many reasons. So my healing continues. Maybe I am not stuck afterall.

  200.  #200Zara on February 27, 2014 at 7:47 pm

    111 Shannon P.

    *****If you decide you’re going to do this yet again, remember that you need to out-girl the other woman.

    So get your Siren program out again and heat up your air waves. Listen to it over and over again and out-girl her!*****

    It feels bad receiving this advice.
    I don’t want to pace my being according to another woman’s being. I don’t even want to think of the other woman, she is HIS business, not mine.

    I might outgirl HIM, but SHE is not my concern.

    I want him to feel inspired by my own being, no matter the millions other women on the planet.

    I don’t care if the reason he outgirls me is because he loves her or does not love her, whatever, the result only is what counts: he and I are not cocreating a relationship.

    The other woman is irrelevant.


  201.  #201Zara on February 27, 2014 at 7:54 pm

    106 T Bradley

    *****Ive started back chatting with him, we spends the night with eachother at times and have a sexually relationship. I feel as if im stuck and need some advice on what to do. I really love this guy and he know it. Im talking with other guys but cant get into them like im into him. I even tried lying as far as telling him im getting married in July just to protect my feelings but its not working.*****

    According to what I told him, I am engaged to be married and yet I have a sexual relationship with him. What does that tell him about the type of relationship I want?

    How do I feel when I lie to the man I imagine being in love with?
    Is this allowing me to feel in alignment with myself and become a man magnet?


  202.  #202Tereana on February 27, 2014 at 8:49 pm

    It feels nice to read all the nice, positive notes! Thank you, Linda, Veronica, and LL.

    FW – LOL. Thank you, too ; )

  203.  #203Tereana on February 27, 2014 at 8:53 pm

    Linda, that made me smile to read about spending time with your grandsons. They sound adorable : ) You should never have to feel that doing that is not important! The right man in your life would not just support that in you, he would value YOU for how much you love them and enjoy that time. You are totally ok…

  204.  #204Tereana on February 27, 2014 at 9:01 pm

    Wow. G-d is a total trickster. LOL!! That is somewhat tongue-in-cheek. But I’ve started to notice a slight possessiveness in M. It’s not like some, he just likes to say that I am “his” this rankles me slightly, for reasons I don’t fully understand.

    What’s funny is – I’ve been doing this practice, spontaneously, where, each morning, I will write down a word that is on my mind, and it will be a focus of attention for the day. A couple of days ago, I wrote “ownership.” Hah!

    I thought I was writing it down for how much I should/could/would take ownership of my life. I didn’t think that it could mean that I could be “owned” by another human being. Again – ha! Just the idea seems false.

    But, then again, maybe this is something to consider. It triggers me. But maybe that doesn’t mean it’s wrong. Maybe there is something I am not accepting about fear it is to be in a relationship and to truly ‘belong.’

    Ironically, a sense belonging is something that I crave very deeply.

    This is something I am going to have to mull over…while I sleep…

  205.  #205Tereana on February 27, 2014 at 9:02 pm

    I don’t know why that corrected to “fear.” Freudian autocorrect. I meant about *what* it means to be in relationship…

  206.  #206Emerson on February 27, 2014 at 9:42 pm

    Daria and sirens…
    I am having a recurring theme…
    ExoticCD is practically begging me to come over to his house tonight. I said no and he was somewhat pouting. Interesting.

  207.  #207Emerson on February 27, 2014 at 10:04 pm

    Hm I did use a feeling message with exoticCD Telling him I feel unheard which sums up how I feel with him right now

  208.  #208Emerson on February 27, 2014 at 10:05 pm

    Hi tereana and sirens I am still catching up on your stories!

  209.  #209Linda on February 28, 2014 at 3:37 am

    I feel like my heart is purging. Memories come they are ususally not feel good ones and I speak out loud to it. They are just popping up and pouring out of me.

    Trying for so long to make something (a relationship with the guy I called FavoriteCD) for so long after it went wrong… all because he loved me. I guess I have been beating myself up for months about it all. On the back side of this I see I had just become so unattracted to him. Being with him became so draining. It was not giving life to me but sapping it. I was dreading week ends and the constant pressure I felt. There are truly keystones and pressure points in our lives. It can literally take one tiny little thing to cause a wall to fall and crumble. The tiny little thing?? giving my self permission to embrace my true heart of hearts.. I did not feel at ease or have abiding peace in my soul when I was with him. Even though someone said he loved me… stepped up.. was giving.. was affectionate… included me in his entire life..(you know the things that we should be looking for that make relationships real not imaginary)…doesnt make it for you. The things he did were as if he was “selling himself” to use his own words.. and that after everything he had done it was never enough. When things are given with expectations and conditions attached it taints it all.

    The further I get away from this and the guilt I had for not feeling what I should have (where that came from I dont know)… This stuff is pouring out. Revelations are coming…I am being able to purge .


  210.  #210Tereana on February 28, 2014 at 5:10 am

    Speaking of fear, though…

    I decided last night to have the conversation with M about waiting for sex. We talked and it was a huge weight off my shoulders that we are on the same page. Amazing. I couldn’t be more grateful. And yet…

    I fear. Something. Underneath the gratitude of having what I want – which is someone willing to wait with me (not “for” me, but with), is a fear.

    Just the kind of fear that I suppose everyone has – will it be good? Will it be okay? Will it be worth waiting for? What if it’s not? What if I love everything about him and that one area really bothers me and I don’t get to find out until I’m already invested?? Argh. I suppose this is why people co-habit, mostly, these days.

    It almost makes me want to run back to S. okay, not really. Realistically, no, because there is no sense in that. But I know that with him, I KNOW it feels good. With M, I can only speculate and have no idea if he will be the kind of man I need in the bedroom as well as outside.

    But I guess I should just focus on what I have and what’s good: it’s good that he is willing to wait. It is good that he loves me with his heart, and not just his mind or his pants. It’s good that he introduces me to his friends, takes me out, and is willing to invite me into his community. He supports me and what I want to do. He is a good man.

    Last night, I watched as kids played with him and he teased them, and they clearly loved and admired him. In that moment, I found him so sexy and wonderful. I was happy and proud to be “his” girl, and felt comfortable being there, even though I was different from almost everyone else

    It was a very positive experience

    The fear of sex goes even deeper, though. It feels, on some level, like a primal threat. And I still don’t know if there is a way to communicate this with a man in a way that doesn’t make it seem like a hindrance. Because in reality, it is also an opportunity for him to take care of me even more

    I guess I just have to trust, come back to trust

    That’s how I’ve always made it out to myself: that waiting is about trust. But it could also be about preparation. Preparation and education. So that when we get there, we are both ready. We manage expectations, and we know how to make it feel good…


  211.  #211Tereana on February 28, 2014 at 5:16 am

    Hi Emerson!! 🙂

    Linda, that sounds beautiful. Purging is nice sometimes. Or it feels like crap, but on the other hand you are getting all the toxic gook out, and making room for the good, healthy stuff : )

  212.  #212T.Bradley on February 28, 2014 at 6:23 am

    Indigo 192,
    Nooooo I understand exactly what you mean by the controling part. Maybe I didnt think about it like you just put in it ur blog. Ive started as of yesterday putting more focus on myself. I also realize the more you stop trying so hard he will start paying more attention to you or at least wonder whats happening. I actually think I try to hard with him and this is the reason he acts the way he does.

  213.  #213T.Bradley on February 28, 2014 at 6:27 am

    I cant explain why I told him that besides to protect my feelings. He did ask about me getting married. I am in love with this guy and I cant tell a lie that im not!

  214.  #214Valarie O'Ryan on February 28, 2014 at 7:00 am

    Liquid Light, these guys usually show up to help us for any number of reasons:

    1. To get really clear on our boundaries
    2. To practice feeling messages/speaking from our
    3. To drop judgments & get curious
    4. To notice where our focus is

    For me, it was pretty much all of these things! I noticed that I “focused” on these behaviors a lot – so that’s what I kept getting. So I switched it – Instead of trying really hard to not get that kind of guy, I just focused on the kind of guy I DID want.

    And then, if I got a “not wanted” guy, I practiced my feeling messages (keeping it all about me) & really tried to hold off on the judgment (he’s so rude, what a jerk) & just be open & curious instead (hmmm, I wonder what makes him like that?).

    It was challenging at first – I’m not going to lie. But it got easier.

    What it did was soften my vibe. And it helped me to get really clear on what I DID want.

    And those guys started fading away, like magic.

    Love, ~Valarie

  215.  #215Liquid Light on February 28, 2014 at 1:33 pm

    Thanks Valarie! That is SO helpful!!! 🙂

  216.  #216Emerson on February 28, 2014 at 10:58 pm

    211 valarie I love this

  217.  #217Emerson on February 28, 2014 at 11:01 pm

    206 wow Linda thnks for sharing this about yourself! I find it soo helpful because I felt the same way about an ex many years ago. . . Dreading weekends etc. It was not good.

  218.  #218Zara on March 1, 2014 at 4:18 am

    210: T.Bradley

    I cant explain why I told him that besides to protect my feelings. He did ask about me getting married. I am in love with this guy and I cant tell a lie that im not!*****

    My post was not asking the “why” of my lie about getting married in July. My post was asking how do I feel when I lie.

    Is the lie protecting my feelings in the end? Does the untruth create a connection with the man or even with myself? Do I feel free and expanding? Do I love myself inside that lie? Do I feel honoured?

    What is my experience of the lie telling me? Is the lie serving my feelings?


  219.  #219JEanMarie on March 2, 2014 at 5:04 am

    As much as I CD(and I do a lot), it still leaves me with an empty feeling. I feel fear that maybe I no longer have feelings – does that make sense? I don’t have the tingly, excitement feelings for men anymore. I felt I have kept them to “me”, kept them in check(opening my heart but keeping it inside me), that maybe I can no longer feel for a man. Have I CD’d so much – been doing it for 4, 5 years now – with only one relationship in that time frame, which turned out to be not a “real” relationship – that there just is nothing left out there for me? CD’ing and feeling messages, being open and vulnerable and real – uses up so much of my heart and soul – men love it, they want me – but they are not the ones that are right for me and I feel like its still – all about them. Sad, I feel sad, lonely, after all these dates and these years – I feel lonely.

  220.  #220WaterFall on March 2, 2014 at 5:28 am

    Hi Sirens,

    This is my first post in this blog and I feel very insecure, more than on a first date with a dream man. I have a fear to be judged by women .. To be not noticed .. To be the one telling stupid things nobody interesting in.

    I have a specific question I couldn’t find in the blog. I’ve been in daily contact with this guy for a few months, though we never met, we live in different countries. He is the one initiating always with good night good morning and other pleasing things. I use feeling messages, setting boundaries and we have nice connections which I enjoy. Recently when I sent him the picture of roses that a friend of mine brought form the concert stage, he is musician, it was so beautiful that I felt a need to share, he suggested that I have a new boyfriend because roses is something being given from heard. I said its just beautiful and if I had a boyfriend I wouldn’t tell him. He laughed and asked why. I said I don’t know I must think about it. And then he replied that it doesn’t matter. I got surprised and asked why, and he said that actually we have good virtual friendship. And here I got triggered. I began to develop nice feelings about him, he seemed so committed from the start, caring, devoted. I had no doubts he likes me and we are moving towards something nice and romantic. So I answered “yes of course, all men are so jealous, it makes me sick”. I don’t know why I replied this way, I felt I need to protect myself from being vulnerable. I just couldn’t admit that I want more. I will look so stupid to want more. I live damn far, there is no opportunities for us, no future , he is under divorce and may be there forever. And I am still triggered, I don’t know what to do and where we are going and what to say. He’s been same friendly and open but I feel anxious and a kind of closing down. I don’t want be a friend. Or he could mean that we aren’t lovers and ” who I am to demand something”? Ah, forgot to mention, I said that I feel safe now because he isn’t jealous. And he said why do I think he isn’t ? I changed the topic because I felt he got triggered himself and went into defencw mode. I know he has issues from his ex who was trying to change him into more romantic one and demanded more love, attention, feelings etc. so I feel really confused and unfocused what to do. I am thinking over every word now, I am stiff and can’t relax. It was so nice without a closure I was open free, no second guessing , no anxiety. Any advices, is there a way out a friend zone?

  221.  #221T.Bradley on March 3, 2014 at 5:22 am

    I know exactly what u meant. Yes I think I did lie to protect my feelings. Im sure not telling the truth connects with him or myself. I felt bad about lying to him but like i stated that was a way of protecting my feelings. However now I still do care for him but its some what helping.

  222.  #222Rori Raye on March 4, 2014 at 11:01 am

    Jean Marie – I know it’s easy to say – but CDing takes a lot of Tools in place…and I totally encourage you to follow everything in Targeting Mr. Right to feel better about all of this – and then to try out one of my Certified Coaches to help you personally. Love, Rori

  223.  #223Rori Raye on March 4, 2014 at 11:06 am

    Waterfall – This is SO NOT stupid! You would be in shock how many women are in this situation. My specialist coach for this is Samantha Harris at – because she got her many through very long distance (though her method of connection was WAY outside most women’s box – online games)..AND – I do not understand why you’re all bound up in this. In my book – long ago, pen pals were the thing. And those STILL didn’t work out until you met the man, and often it then just was a friendship. Relationships start with attraction – a man’s attraction to you that’s beyond the attraction he feels for most women. You can get him there in a number of ways – but if you’re not physically in his space – it’s hard, to near impossible. I would say that you’re allowing this situation to drain away your energy…if it were me, I’d drop out of this and start CDing for real. If you truly want a relationship – and not just what you’ve got here – then do what you need to do to be in a REAL relationship – which is, first of all, dropping the Imaginary ones. Love, Rori

  224.  #224JeanMarie on March 5, 2014 at 7:02 pm

    Rori #222- thank you for the kind words. Yes,
    I do have targeting Mr right, Modern Siren and the Relationship Ebook. using all the tools, putting them all together. Men are always attacted to me – but after a while, the more I use feeling messages – the more men become about their feelings and it becomes all about them – using feeling messages to me! and less about me. It feels exhausting after awhile. I meet my own needs , I put my needs first so I don’t seek them from men. The dates, the meets, the chatting, the brief encounters at work, café’s, etc – all practice and I do that. But nothing has become of so many encouters and the so many CD’ings I go on – never amount to anything. I would love to try one of your coaches; unfortunately finances do not allow me.

  225.  #225WaterFall on March 10, 2014 at 3:07 pm

    Yes Rori I know your position regarding long distance relationship ok I agree it’s a kind of imaginary one but I enjoy it in the moment why not ? It’s nice experience which I would like to get into a little bit being in control for my feelings of course. It’s new to me.. I’ve never had a guy friend.. Never ever in my life. May be that’s why I am getting interested , it’s so unusual and I feel a little failure as a woman though he treat me very well and in the same time it’s a challenge. Male experts advice me that it’s not true and this guy is playing tactic to make me feel needy but I don’t think so I feel that he is indeed not so much interested or ready or in the right timeline for romance with me. I just can’t be friend with a guy. If I like him enough to get into personal conversation with open heard then I like and appreciate him as a man first of all. And I can’t pretend I am not interested. I express my feelings very open no matter how he percieves our connection. I do show him sometimes my romantic interest subtly does he like it or not. That’s the way I am and it doesn’t make me feel less. But then I thought today: is it ovetfunctioning? Does initiating romantic stuff, flirtation, compliments, playfulness with a guy whose intention is just be friends considered masculine? On one hand it is only expressing feelings but on the other hand it is initiation ..

    What do you think?

  226.  #226Daria on March 10, 2014 at 3:41 pm

    Waterfall – yes unfortunately that is all masculine behavior 🙁

    initiating romantic stuff, flirtation, compliments, (except for playfulness) with a guy

    the reason why not is because it drains you, and you want the real thing…

    good luck and come post under the newest articles so you can get siren support!

  227.  #227RileyTheOwl on March 11, 2014 at 11:21 pm

    Daria, I’m feeling unsure over over whether I’m acting masculine or not when I do some things. I love to compliment my man, such as if he looks like he’s dressed better/looks better than usual or just generally good, I love to tell him “you look incredibly handsome” or “I feel really turned on by your smile/sweater/when you do this”… Is that leaning forward? Because lately I have been gushing a LOT, part of showing him what I love/like in relationships as opposed to saying what I DISLIKE.
    Basically I’m trying to express things that I like and want more of in a relationship in a siren-y way…. Help??

  228.  #228Dominique on March 12, 2014 at 5:31 am

    Riley – This is perfect. You want to let him know what makes you feel good, turns you on, makes you smile, and so, for it will inspire even more of this in him,more of what you love. And the rest won’t feel so important anymore.


  229.  #229Femininewoman on March 12, 2014 at 7:37 am

    Anybody ever googled 5 Deadly Terms Used by A Woman or 5 Deadly Terms Used by A Man? Very interesting.

  230.  #230Shannon P. on March 12, 2014 at 7:43 am

    FW, that’s hilarious.

    “”Bonus Word: “Wow!” – This is not a compliment; she’s amazed that one person could be so stupid.””

    LMAO, yes!

  231.  #231WaterFall on March 12, 2014 at 9:18 am

    “Initiating romantic stuff, compliments, flirtation is a masculine energy”

    Mmmm.. Mmm.. I’ve been thinking..
    May be it depends. There are different kinds of flirt, compliments, some may be very direct and some subtly and indefinite, warm and encouraging. Like, ie “hey, you have a nice butt I’d like to.,” is very strong flirt I assume. But without any romantic gestures added to the mix, we would have very dry, friendly, man-to-man connection. I’m very romantic person, I can make romance out of a piece of brick and I need to give it out otherwise I don’t feel like a woman. Very subtly easy warm and non-suggestive. Just showing how his actions makes me feel. That his sweet night wishes which I read in the morning due to our time difference make me smiling. And the winter feels warmer with his texts. And I think you are a wonderful man. Because its truth and how I feel. I read somewhere that men dont appreciate compliments to there physical appearance but to their concrete actions. Suggestive flirt, like “oh, you are so nice I can imagine how great it would be to go dance/go to the beach/hang out/visit my place/have a coffe, dinner etc. with you” is masculine IMHO

  232.  #232JeanMrie on March 12, 2014 at 10:14 am

    According to Rori – in her programs – putting the focus on a man, his looks, etc. is “masculine energy.” You have to practice (from the programs) 1) keeping your heart inside you, 2)the waterwheel 3) leaning back 4) the focus on the present(nodding, being aware of his words at the moment, the space you are in at the moment, etc). So gushing, compliments, etc to a man – are a turn off. They are trying too hard, they are making it about the man. Men feel uncomfortable with that attention on them. What pulls a man is – is to express YOUR FEELINGS about things. Men want to hear how you FEEL. A man who wants compliments or thrives on them – is not a “manly”man in the relationship you are looking for. What you can do is notice how YOU FEEL when you are with a man, or when he does something you like. “ooohhhh, the porch is all fixed up! Wow, I feel so happy, it will feel so relaxing out here now, THANK YOU! ” Being here together, in each others arms – feels soft and warm. I feel so safe, it feels wonderful!”Focus on the things a man DOES – not his looks, his work, his car, etc. There are so many things you can use the feeling messages on about him. Practice, practice, practice the messages – on every man you interact with during the day – the UPS man, the postman, the man behind the deli counter, the downstairs neighbor. Every MAN encounter is an opportunity to practice feeling and will help to make it more natural, more easy to come by, with the MEN you want in your life.

  233.  #233JeanMrie on March 12, 2014 at 10:16 am

    Just a bit more – flirting, being flirty – is wonderfully feminine and girly. But it means keeping the focus – again – on you. It means leaning back, making eye contact, being soft, feminine, SMILING! Letting a man open the door(even a stranger, instead of being in the front and holding it for him), leaning back for a moment in different situations so a MAN can step up and help(pick up something you dropped, carry a pkg, etc) and then a warm THANK YOU with a sweet smile.
    These things MAKE A MAN’s DAY!!!

  234.  #234RileyTheOwl on March 12, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Ohhh wow… I have been doing this all wrong, hahah! I really love the concept of saying everything I like that my man does, because it inspires him to do more of it. But I didn’t have any idea that I shouldn’t really be commenting on his looks, and the last couple of days I feel that I’ve been doing it wrong, because I haven’t stayed within MYSELF while giving compliments and “thank you’s”.
    First, while I give compliments and thank you’s… I just realized that I need to practice more staying with myself, not leaning towards him, but really feeling my appreciation, and relaxing back into the feeling.
    Second, my actual compliments may not be worded right… instead of saying, “wow, you look really good in that sweater”, maybe I should say (only if it’s TRUE of course) “this sweater feels really soft, and I love it”.
    All the while I really need to focus on myself, because as good as giving compliments is, I feel like the last few days I’ve been giving them for the wrong reasons. It’s been feeling off. I guess I got so caught up in the power of compliments that I lost the touch.

  235.  #235RileyTheOwl on March 12, 2014 at 2:31 pm

    On another note, here’s the catch-up with my love life 🙂 any advice would be appreciated, or just general comments 🙂
    For the ones who didn’t see my post a couple weeks ago, I’ll just let you know that I was feeling bored and distant from my man, and wanted to leave the relationship because I felt smothered and I felt I couldn’t express myself around him, and I also felt very unsatisfied in general. I got amazing advice from all of you, and even though I have been practicing expressing my feelings for awhile, there is always more to learn. Basically I was being super feminine and feeling around many people and with myself, EXCEPT around him. I made up this little self-lie that I couldn’t be myself around him… but really, I had just given up. I was going to end things because I thought he just wasn’t the type of man for a woman like me… but I quickly turned around that way of thinking when I talked to some sirens on here. Thank you for that by the way <3

    Since I had that epiphany, WOW. He's like a new man! I didn't even have to have an "I want" talk… although maybe we had little bits of that talk here and there. I was already super focused on myself, so immersed in myself that I was cutting him out… so I started being warm and open and inviting. The main problem was that I didn't feel he was masculine enough. So whenever he did something slightly more manly and stepped up, I would totally gush. Especially for "in the bedroom" things…
    After I started focusing on what I wanted from him, and thanking him for every little thing I liked, told him exactly what made me feel good when he did it, all the things I disliked started disappearing! He stopped smothering and being puppy-like, COMPLETELY! and he acts so much more manly and confident… wow 🙂 I love it 🙂
    but in the last couple days, as I said before, I feel a little bit less of a connection. I also feel weird, a little flighty and light. I feel like I'm leaning forward to much when I'm complimenting him… ugh and it feels icky. I really want to find a good place in between feeling my apprehensiveness towards him, and over-expressing it in the wrong ways.

    TL;DR: I turned things around with my man by expressing what I loved, but somehow I started overdoing the compliments (he didn't say so but I can just FEEL the shift) and I'm not sure how to properly compliment and thank him without leaning forward.

  236.  #236Dominique on March 12, 2014 at 2:35 pm

    Riley – It’s actually okay to comment on his looks – now and then – for example – you’re so handsome. And only when you feel filled up with wanting to say this. Again – now and then.

    Most good men doesn’t really care so much how he looks, or more accurately, he doesn’t need to hear it so much. This is more important to a woman.

    You do want to reinforce more what he does which makes you feel good, what he says to or does for you. For example – I love when you…. OR That felt SO good…. and so on. Thank yous go a long way too.


  237.  #237Dominique on March 12, 2014 at 2:49 pm

    Riley – You might find it’s always going to be a balancing act so to speak. That you are feeling him pull back from too many compliments is great, YAY you!!!. So you back off from this, and then see what happens, and this can be different from moment to moment and situation to situation depending how you are feeling in any given moment as well how he is feeling.

    Think of this as a dance, back and forth, in and out, side to side, flowing as best you both can.

    There will be times when you feel weird/off/disconnected. It happens to everyone. Try to embrace these times as well. If it continues, tell your man – I feel disconnected. If he asks why, you can say you don’t know. You feel off.

    You can ask for hug if this is what you want – A hug would feel so good right now.


  238.  #238JeanMarie on March 12, 2014 at 4:32 pm

    Riley I do agree, there have been times when I have felt disconnected in a relationship and looking back, I think it is when I was trying to get something from a man or out a relationship that I should have been doing for myself. I can’t remember which program(maybe Siren?), but Rori talked about getting your needs met BY YOURSELF, so that you don’t; seek them from a man. And when I did all the things that I needed – for me – I was much more relaxed and not “seeking ” these things from a man. Then I felt closer to him and not so disconnected, not so much “in my head” in stead of in the moment and in my heart. Also, maybe you need to Circular date yourself, even if you are in a relationship – it might help you put the focus on you again. Does that make sense?