Don’t Walk On Eggshells

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arguing-coupleHere’s a situation close to my heart that I haven’t really talked about much before…this letter states the problem exactly, and I’d love to get a dialogue going around it…

“Hi Rori,
I am 27 years old, I been with my high school sweetheart for almost ten years. We have been engaged for about ten years except he hasn’t officially proposed to me because he doesn’t have the money to purchase a ring. I love him and I know he loves me, but one of our biggest problems is our communication. It’s hard to explain, I feel as if one day we are very close and in touch with each others feelings, and the next day we get into a small fight- because I forgot to call or didn’t think about doing or saying something.

I feel like he bites my head off for small things, and if I apologize, (which I seem to do very often) it still doesn’t matter, he still remains upset with me and doesn’t want to get past it and move on. I feel tired of constantly feeling “inadequate” in our relationship. I feel like I’m always walking on eggshells. When I approach to talk to him about “our last fight” he says things like “you can talk all you want but I have nothing new to say.” This type of response from him makes me feel like I can’t fully trust him. One day he tells me that I should trust him more and be able to share anything, because he loves me and he wants to be that support for me. Yet, when I do, he shuts down….

I feel so confused and lost because I feel like he is not following through with his talks about how much he cares about me. I hate fighting with him and everytime it happens I just want to hurry up and make it better, either by apologyzing and clearing the air, etc. so that we can continue to enjoy each other. But, he is totally different, he could care less about making up. He stays like that for a few days until he finally decides that the whole situation is silly and that we should move on. I’m tired of this emotional drain-pattern, in my opinion is not normal.

I feel like we fight more than we make love, and as soon as we begin to reconnect, some stupid fight manages to sneak up on us and then we disconnect again!!! I don’t know what to do in order to feel secure in this relationship, secured to know that he is as crazy about me as I am about him. I don’t want to end the relationship because he truly is an amazing guy, I just don’t know how to inspire him to really SHOW his love for me. Do you think I’m been flaky and emotional?? I feel so insecure about myself right now…

Hope you can give me a helpful advice, Thanks Mary”

Dear Mary – I’m VERY familiar with this – you’ve got a MOODY man.

He has emotional issues. and the way he’s dealing with trying to keep himself together is by blowing steam out at you. The nicer you are, the more understanding you are, the more you tolerate this kind of thing – the worse it’s going to get – because your very “niceness” and “understanding” make him feel even WORSE about HIMSELF – and then he feels angrier with YOU for making him feel that way.

Plus (some bonus…) it completely destroys his ATTRACTION to you because he considers any woman who’d be “nice” to him when he KNOWS he’s being a “jerk” to be pretty much “worthless.” His respect for you will go down – and your self-esteem will take the plunge with it.

Step 1 for you: STOP being overly nice.

When he gets upset. say “I feel awful and I don’t want to fight.” Let him blow off a bit of his anger, and then say “This feels awful, I want to feel close to you, and I don’t want to fight…” and then LEAVE the room! If all he wants to do is vent at you – DON’T be his punching bag!!!

Say – “it would feel great to talk about how we can not have these kinds of fights. I’d love to talk about what’s going on and it doesn’t feel good.”

There may also be something he’s feeling bad and guilty about that you have NO IDEA about (and it may be something you DO know about – work, family, kids, money…) – and so he’s taking it out on you. (And please don’t start getting worried or suspicious – I just want to make you aware – but an attraction to or flirtation with another woman, though it’s just one of hundreds of possibilities of things that might be bothering him, is a possibility. I’ve seen this kind of thing sneak up on many a bright, lovely woman when her man is angry, tense, combative, starting arguments, and making drama.)

My guess is this has nothing to do with you (or any other woman) – and everything to do with something going on with him in his life outside of you that’s making him feel bad.  Money issues alone (and you mention he can’t afford a ring…) can do this to a man.

What you need to do next is to learn to…

Step 2 – TALK

So – how do you talk about problems in a relationship without doing the dreaded “relationship talk”?

First, you have to write this out. Write out a speech full of Feeling Messages and business-like fact gathering. Your goal here is INTIMACY and CLOSENESS – NOT to get him to change, or do what you want.  The DIALOGUE alone is what you want – and ANYTHING that happens is part of that…

Start with “I’ve noticed we’re angry a lot, and fighting a lot, and it feels awful. I don’t know what to do. I know there are things we’re both upset about – (money…sex…whatever’s always coming up), and it would feel so good to talk about it and solve some of it.  Can we talk? Is now a good time? What do you think?”

Let him respond.  Really listen to him, without thinking about your own agenda.

If you’re feeling frightened of his possible anger, and you can feel yourself wanting to walk on eggshells, say “I’m feeling afraid.  I’m afraid of your anger.  I can feel myself wanting to tiptoe and walk on eggshells, and I don’t want to do that.  That feels awful.”

If at any point he starts attacking you verbally – try a Power Speech (my Toxic Men program is all about Power Speeches) – where you say something like – “I hear how angry you are.  I hear that you’re angry with me…This feels scary, and yet I want to feel heard, and so I want to hear you…and yet I feel really, really bad, and now I’m feeling attacked, and I don’t want to feel attacked.  I’m happy to hear how you feel, and I don’t want to be attacked, and so I’m going to leave now…” And just walk backwards and away.

Don’t let him strong-arm you, and don’t let him attack you.  Screaming at you is not attacking you.  Leaning forward with his face red and his fists in the air is pretty scary, but as long as you’re sure he would never touch you or physically hurt you, you want to be able to stand there while he turns red and screams “I’m just so frustrated with you!” (Even though you’d NEVER say that to him – you’d just say “I’m feeling so frustrated!”)

The more anger that’s unexpressed, the more distant the relationship.  There’s no way to heal this without the anger coming up.  You have to be able to hear it without folding – even though it may trigger an old traumatic reaction inside you and make you want to run or scream back – or just freeze.  See if you can do none of those things (it takes practice) – and simply say how you feel.  And when you’ve had enough – just say – “I’ve reached my limit, I can’t hear anymore,” and leave.

If you do this, you’ll break all your old patterns, and you’ll feel so much better and stronger inside.  And if he still can’t join in the dialogue to save your relationship – and without attacking you – then you will likely feel less and less for him.  It will be YOU losing interest in HIM.

Remember – this isn’t about you being understanding and tolerating him however he is.  This is very specifically standing your ground and building YOUR tolerance for being present when he’s angry, and knowing when to walk away when you’ve had enough.

It’s sort of a fearless, powerful thing to do – and he’ll get it right away.

You may be shocked to find the whole anger experience turns into a crying experience – yours AND his – though he’ll likely do anything he can to keep from going there, and anger is a really standard way men get to stay away from their pain.

Remember, too – you may be aware of the pain underneath his anger – but he’s NOT A LITTLE BOY.  Do not “understand” him and be “nice” to him because of the pain you know is underneath. Just build your own ability to tolerate being in the presence of intense emotion – especially YOURS (this is where Modern Siren comes in…) – and you’ll be surprised how quickly things get intimate, and the blow ups become less and less a part of your relationship.

Try getting your mind around this, and then practice in your imagination.  Let me know what happens next time…Love, Rori


  1.  #1Nelia on May 18, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    UGH! Causing you to feel inadequate? Walking on eggshells? Biting your head off? Until he decides?

    I hate to jump to conclusions, but (jumping), this situation seems manipulative at best, emotionally abusive at worst.

    What do others think?

  2.  #2Flipper on May 18, 2009 at 4:14 pm

    Of course, I feel it Can be a manipulative, abusive situation, and I feel I wouldn’t know for sure until I stand my ground. As Rori said, men often stick with anger instead of going into what they’re really feeling (and which conveniently often gets projected onto the person they’re mad at). After all, I’ve been guilty of hiding or simply denying my anger so as not to have to deal with it. But trying to actually face the anger and talk to each other about it, rather than caving, pretending or freezing with fear, feels like a good way to get in touch with my own issues and find out what’s behind his outburst. If he can’t get to a place where he respects my feelings and acknowledges his own, but continues to bully, abase or intimidate me, THEN I’ll know he’s an emotionally abusive person, probably incapable of loving himself, and so anyone else including me.

  3.  #3ann on May 18, 2009 at 10:22 pm

    reading on mobile

  4.  #4heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 12:51 am

    Thank you Rori. This feels very pertinent to me.

    I feel in pieces, sad, angry, confused about whether to step back or talk. I feel afraid and insecure in my situation. I woke up crying this morning. My man is depressed and angry, he has stayed in touch on the phone after walking out on Saturday night (we don’t live together) but opened up a bit on the phone on Sunday. Saturady night I’d told him I felt crappy (he had been unaffectionate and quiet for over a week, and not for the first time – he lost his job a while back but now has another one, though he’s not happy in that line of work, he feels bad about himself, everything he sees is bad, he’s deeply depressed and angry).

    I’ve been through a rollercoaster of emotions, from feeling clear and strong (that’s when I feel like saying ‘I can’t stand this, it’s just not good for me, I am getting on with my life, let me know when you feel able to connect with me again) to feeling miserable and insecure and angry and afraid of making a mistake in how I speak with him. And so very sad and missing him so much (that much I have said).

    We will speak on the phone later and he said he will come over ‘if he feels up to it’ – and that last bit upsets me, as if I only get the leftovers.

    I feel nauseous this morning. I feel afraid.

    Rori, should I speak with him like you advise in this post? I bounce between letting him get on with dealing with his feelings in his own way, and speaking up.

  5.  #5FEMENERGYLOVE on May 19, 2009 at 12:59 am

    hmmm,rori’s advice sounds spot on.i feel confused over my own situation.went away for the weekend with my boyfriend and three other friends.a couple and another girl who has a boyfriend where she is from.this girl is beautiful and boyfriends type of girl before me.i’m brown haired.from the moment i met there friends he would make comments about her that made me uncomfortable ‘her eye make up makes her eyes look small’ noticing her make up?anyway went on this trip and the other couple were really close,you could feel the solidarity.with us it was like the attention would shift between me and her.and he talked about her a lot to me.she said this,she did that.i felt so disrespected,so alone,so not part of the group.i used feeling messages to get my message across but was called complicated.I COMPLETELY SHUT DOWN.wouldn’t really talk or participate,honestly what was i there for?felt so triggered!needless to say the last two days were horrible for us.he said they were really difficult for him as there was no proper communication.these ‘friends’ have now left and we’re spending time together,he is loving,really loving but i still feel a HE walking around on eggshells?not wanting to rock the boat?did i use feeling messages incorrectly?i’m DYING TO ASK WHATS WRONG?but that would be just reaching out and being needy again right?i feel ashamed of shutting down,but feel proud of myself for voicing my thoughts and insecurities.feel like he ends not know how to be his talkative funny self around me anymore,how do i go around this?i’m on eggshells as well now trying to not be too emotional etc. sigh,going to make a cup of tea

  6.  #6FEMENERGYLOVE on May 19, 2009 at 2:17 am

    in hindsight,i was feeling really insecure.i didnt feel comfortable with the way he told jokes about there being beautiful blondes in our company while i got whispers about maybe sex later on..felt cheap and used.told him all of this.sigh,i do not like feeling triggered,or feeling like i’m scrambling to make things right,i feel like i have been here before,and i’m well tired of it.i feel like the cookie monster,the cookies being my relationship and i devour them in the EFFORT to make them lovely,or perfect,or meaningful…more tea…

  7.  #7heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 3:14 am

    Just recording my process here. I realised my feelings are important and so is my relationship, made the decision to text him asking him to call when he’s able, which he did (within 10mins). I said “thank you for calling me back. I woke up feeling upset. I felt angry last night when you said you’d see how you feel about meeting tonight. I feel afraid we’re drifting apart. I don’t want a superficial relationship” He said “yes I understand” and he was trying to find somewhere quiet to talk. I said “I don’t like calling you at work and I don’t like talking about this on the phone. Talking face to face feels better. I want to hear you properly and I want you to hear me too” and he said he would come over tonight.

    I have been crying and just letting myself fall apart. I am not going to try to ‘keep up’ today – stuff the washing, and business, and tidying. I will have a bath, though.

    I feel like this (practising) – “I felt angry last night when you said you’d ‘see how you feel’ about coming over. Hearing that makes me feel small and unimportant, and scared – and I don’t want to feel like that.” (this is where I want to add ‘and that’s not good enough for me – making arrangements at the last minute, not making plans, is just not good enough for me’ – I feel angry)

  8.  #8heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 3:21 am

    Hmmmm I feel I said that already, but maybe it’s an opener… I am beginning to feel trust in myself to dig deep and dive in to the process between us, be open to however it goes. I’m going to let go of thinking about it now, and just BE for the rest of the day.

  9.  #9FEMENERGYLOVE on May 19, 2009 at 4:23 am

    letting it go sounds like it would really feel good heartbeat,that way you dont have any expectations and you will say how you feel and thats that.i dont want to feel like the cookie monster anymore,devouring.i feel letting go will also do me good.

  10.  #10heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 4:37 am

    Thank you, Femenergylove (amazing blogname!) – I feel a lot clearer now. For now (cuz my focus is inward) I just want to say- I hear your insecurity and discomfort and confusion on that weekend, and your willingless to explore and gain clarity now. cyber-hug xx

  11.  #11Wyndee on May 19, 2009 at 5:35 am

    Good stuff on moody men, Rori!

  12.  #12DocK on May 19, 2009 at 5:49 am

    Wow – is there something in the air with guys and communication lately?

    I had mentioned having a disagreement with a guy I see about women in sport and their representation and the DEMAND of our culture that they be “feminine” but “play as good as a man” and so on. I didn’t feel the conversation went well.

    This isn’t just some little arbitrary issue that we don’t agree on. This is the VERY ISSUE that I researched, lived, breathed, wrote about and was the subject of my dissertation. If I couldn’t defend my position, I wouldn’t have earned the right to be called “doctor”. The first talk about it wasn’t great. Then he HAD to bring something else up about it even though he said, “I know I probably shouldn’t tell you about this…”

    Even though we got through that I was so frustrated. It was clear he felt he was right and I felt, maybe overly dramatic, but if I didn’t know what the hell I was talking about I might as well take my diploma off of the wall and return it to the University that gave it to me.

    I left him a message, a feeling message, about how frustrated I felt trying to talk to him about this. That this was a very sensitive issue for me and that I just didn’t want to talk about it with him anymore.

    He took personal offense that I somehow, didn’t think him WORTHY of engaging in this discussion, rather than understanding that I just don’t want to argue with a man I love – which is exactly what I said.

    I feel very hurt, angry and sad. I tried to NOT argue about something – a man is very competitive – especially in arguing – and I don’t feel there is much to be gained by this. Beyond the fact of this being an issue very close to my heart – I feel we just don’t know how to communicate. Feel so sad.

  13.  #13heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 7:16 am

    “I feel frustrated that there seems to be this distance between us – and I’m feeling insecure – can we talk about this? I don’t want to go on feeling like this or drift apart – that would feel awful”.

    I feel really shaky.

  14.  #14Linmayu on May 19, 2009 at 7:36 am

    Thanks Rori. I have a feeling this post will help me with what’s to come in my life.

  15.  #15Linmayu on May 19, 2009 at 7:39 am

    Aaahhhh. Wow. I feel scared just rereading this post. I’ve always felt so helpless in the face of men’s anger–like if a man is angry, he’s become this monster, not even human, and he’s automatically going to win because he’s bigger and stronger and angrier. It feels so awful.

  16.  #16FEMENERGYLOVE on May 19, 2009 at 7:51 am

    heartbeat,saying that would feel wonderful actually,maybe we could both say it:-) i just feel afraid to say it to him right after work as he is tired etc and i dont want to be complicated.but feel i will burst if i keep quiet!i feel afraid.

  17.  #17Flipper on May 19, 2009 at 8:15 am

    Dock – I can feel your frustration. When I’m in a discussion, it’s to try to approach the truth or explore different positions on a subject. If I feel I’m right, it’s not to claim the truth as my own or deprive anyone else of it, still less to cry victory. Conversing with people who have to BE right (against someone else, even if the two are saying exactly the same thing) feels exhausting and crazy-making.

    That was an interesting turn of the tables: here’s a guy who allows himself to say something to you he feels he shouldn’t (because it would be biaised, hurtful, offensive to you?), and then allows Himself to feel personally offended when he Thinks that You Thought him unworthy? I was going to write “..when he feels unworthy” and then checked myself – I don’t feel he was getting anywhere near his real emotional issues or considered himself unworthy for a second, but was using his remarks to get or keep the upper hand and always BE right.

    Even if we have high self esteem, it’s still easy for us to empathize will all the gazillions of women who actually Feel unworthy, not just accused of it, or feel personally attacked when guys pull out all the stops to win their arguments. Apparently, that’s only normal and fair among men. And yet, I feel this fellow has played an emotional card with you that he would never have touched in a match with a male. Sures feels like a foul to me anyway. Expertise in a man is an acceptable reason to concede, but the same in a woman is just never enough.

    I felt triggered by your post, so I can feel you fuming from here. When you find the hose that puts out the flames without dousing love’s fire, let me know.

  18.  #18heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 8:22 am

    Femenergylove – it’s taken me all day to get to that statement lol! I feel afraid too, and then I feel like a big woman who can trust herself to speak deeply and truthfully. I swing between the two.

    I’ve done that ‘he’s tired’ thing too. I just figured out it’s ok for me to say “I’m feeling this…. and I’d like to talk about it. What do you think?” And then he can say ‘ok’ or ‘later’ or whatever, and you get to say ‘thank you’ or ‘I feel uncomfortable, that feels too far away’.

  19.  #19Flipper on May 19, 2009 at 8:29 am

    PS Dock – I felt using feeling messages was the right way to go, even if they didn’t seem to make things better for the moment. It may take awhile for them to work through his filters and usual mindset, and then he may finally realize their meaning was all about holding your own and not about challenging him.

  20.  #20DocK on May 19, 2009 at 8:29 am

    Flipper – thank you. I feel heard and understood by you. I do think he has some issues regarding my level of education (even though he has said otherwise) of his own insecurities. I felt I was clear that I DID try to converse with him on this – that we were getting nowhere and that it just wasn’t worth the argument – neither one of us is going to change the world (most my dissertation is doing is sitting on library shelves collecting dust) and I just didn’t want to talk about it. I felt so startled by his “take” on my saying that. I feel confused by his resistance to just letting it go.

    Again, thanks. I am fuming. I can feel my stomach hurting and my throat feels tight.

  21.  #21Flipper on May 19, 2009 at 8:55 am

    Dock – If, or rather when he finally ‘gets it’, I bet he’ll feel so much safer with you and grateful for feeling a lot better about his own insecurities. So you may Be Surprised (I wouldn’t be) that he’ll come around and want to get closer.

  22.  #22heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 9:31 am

    Ok I feel ready now. I’ve got into my more centred place. I put on a long swishy skirt I’ve not worn with him before and left my hair curly. I feel a little nervous too – my fear that I’ll shift off-centre when he’s here in front of me.

    It’s felt good being connected on here today. I’ve felt very supported – thank you xxxx

  23.  #23Nelia on May 19, 2009 at 10:15 am

    Flipper : You’re definitely taking an objective and mature approach. I’m inspired by your willingness to take responsibility for your role in these disagreements.

    For myself, it doesn’t matter to what habits men are accustomed to “sticking.” I require respectful treatment.

    I’d love to read whether your ensuing discussions get you to the same place. Keep us updated and good luck (or rather good skills of understanding and persuasion)!

  24.  #24Tina on May 19, 2009 at 11:12 am

    I saw my “boyfriend” this weekend. He did the usual, came to my house. He just tapped on my door a few times and made his way in , no hug, kiss, no signs of affection. He took off his shoes and sat on my couch, laid way back. I did the same, I did not get up to greet him, I did not move off my chair , I was sitting in front of my pc. His and my behavior have become predictable bye this point. I figured this would be the time to try something different, I have control over this, sortof driving the boat without really driving. We talked about his week, my week. He showed me his new license , for driving “big man” trucks lol. ohhhh thats really wonderful, those are not easy to drive. of course I was playing up to his need for power lol. He is my “man” afterall.

    I felt this feeling my of sadness whelling up again. I said to him , I have to run a few errands then got up and put on my sandels. He gave me the keys and I drove him back to his place and drove off to do my thing. I felt an incredable quiet strength as I shopped for a new shirt (for the dance.) feeling sad but something inside me had changed.

  25.  #25Tina on May 19, 2009 at 11:28 am

    I drove by his house ( with his car lol ) later saw his lights out so came directly home and looked through my bag of stuff, new shirt, leave-in hair conditioner and some food. I called him not long after, he said “whats up with you?” I took this oprotunity to let him know how I was feeling. I said to him in my voice started to crack by this point. I feel sad then silence then breathe. I said I feel sad when you didnt hug me , there was no sign of affection so I am taking that as a sign you dont want to sleep in my bed tonight and thats all then said to him I’ll bring his truck back then he could drive me home. I showed up at his house, sat down and did not move. We talked (still no affection) hm then stood up and said I was ready to leave. We got to my house, sat in the car and silence again. I restated how I was feeling opened the door and came in to my house. He sat there in the driveway for a minute then drove off.

  26.  #26Tina on May 19, 2009 at 11:41 am

    No phone calls, no thing. I went to bed that night feeling sad and replaying the events in my head. I started to tell myself to trust how I am feeling. Justifed or not , it is how I am feeling. When I was able to get to that reach that place in my thinking, I felt so much better, confident, stronge then I did an odd thing lol I welcomed myself home, I hugged myself and welcomed my myself home to my body and my feelings. I said to myself. Welcome home! Tina. I soon drifted off to sleep. I felt happy and an aha feeling come over me.

  27.  #27DocK on May 19, 2009 at 11:54 am

    Tina – feel sad reading your posts and also feel your disappointment. Also, though, feel your triumph with you, feeling, breathing, speaking and doing. Yes, welcome home!

  28.  #28Tina on May 19, 2009 at 11:58 am

    The following morning I made plans to spend the day with my supervisor. We drove out to pick up some lobsters and had a great day. At different points in the day, I could feel myself pining away for my boyfriend. It didnt last long, maybe a few seconds. The trust I felt in my feelings made a hug differance. I felt powerful, unwavering, like a tree, I feel stronge like a tree. I touched my heart with my hand when I feel sad thinking about him and said Welcome home Tina!. Yes it sure feels good. I cooked the lobsters at her house. She is an elder so I did most of the work. We cooked fiddleheads,lobsters and she made the ribs. We said our goodbyes then I came home , regrouped , talked with my son, relaxed then got ready for the dance. My home community was holding an event for the long weekend, that attracts people from everywhere and one of the events is the dance.

  29.  #29DocK on May 19, 2009 at 12:06 pm

    Going to go take a dance class in a few hours. Although at a gym – very tough choreography – what I need right now. Mind trying to “catch” the combinations, body doing and spirit dancing. Need the distraction.

  30.  #30Tina on May 19, 2009 at 12:14 pm

    I prepared myself for the dance, new shirt purple in color, my leave in hair conditioner is great lol. I danced the night away. I met there a few older ladies (widows) we danced all night, we danced with my freind R , he was the perfect gentlemen all night. We danced till we couldnt dance anymore. I practiced my “walk” attempted to hold eye contact with various men, they couldnt do it, lasting maybe 2 seconds , leaning back, way back. I do have belly dance experiance, and did so oh so very subtlely. Is there such a thing?. No man approached me, just a few community leaders, shaking hands, lingering hands lol. I was in a world of my own.

  31.  #31Tina on May 19, 2009 at 12:33 pm

    The following evening “boyfriend” calls me. of course he was very angry on the phone. He got his play py play from people that we know (small town). I had a huge smile on my face, if he knew Im sure he would have blown a gasket lol. He tried to engage me in an argument. I didnt go for it ( i know better now) he said “so you got nothing to say now” I said I was listening, threw him off lol. He came over not long after, he drove me to the all night drug store , so I could get my vitamins. A lot was said concerning cheating and all that so on and so forth. He went straight to my bedroom. odd lol. I called out to him when he was done doing what he is doing to come up and get me. He was reading. I did the dishes. He did finally come up, I said now what?. he sat on the same couch, I sat on the same chair. He couldnt look at me. I finally had to say something. I said with a smile on my face and a twinkle in my eye. “Would you like to come over and sit on my lap so I can tell you how pretty you are.?’ He GIGGLED lol. he said no thats ok I got up and left and walked to my bedroom. I said shut off the pc and lights and walked away.

  32.  #32heartbeat on May 19, 2009 at 12:56 pm

    Wow things have gone really well for me – we talked for 2hrs and told each other some deep stuff (on the phone, we’ll meet tomorrow, glad I dressed anyway – helped me feel good). I feel peaceful and relieved! I feel glad and grateful I made the invitation. All it took was keeping my centre as a guide, speaking from my heart, listening fully and noticing when I felt my old stuff come up – and sharing that too. Noticing my inclination to ‘help’ and sharing that. We really opened up. I felt heard. I feel so much closer to him now.

    I feel so thankful this post came up today, Rori! xxxx

  33.  #33Tina on May 19, 2009 at 1:03 pm

    The following morning , he sat in MY chair and I sat at the table. He offered to till my future tomato garden. I was happy and said oh that would be wonderful. He had to go home , load up this BIG MACHINE and bring it over on a trailor. He said that I could stay home and get my gardening clothes on lol dirty jeans, big boots and all. It was his time to row the relationship boat. and he did so magnificently. I sat on my bags of peatmoss, black earth and watched him in all his glory. I imagined that my coffee cup was my bonbons lol. I felt tense at times. big rocks could hit me in the face, I didnt move. I felt certain parts of my body tensing up, he would look at me then I would relax and smile at him. I gazed at his arms, bum, legs oh I just soaked him all up. I did not move until he loaded up his tiller to take home. Wow I said what a lovley garden this is going to be. thank you. He then asked me if I wuld like to get those wild roses I so wanted to get, he took me out to eat, he took me to all his childhood secret places, his stomping grounds of his youth. A huge cliff we looked off. We picked some wild fiddleheads, it seemed natural to walk behind him while we romped through the woods, allowing him to lead, mind you he did look back at me a few times lol. he rowed the boat all day long um and night…The End

  34.  #34Ann on May 19, 2009 at 3:43 pm

    Heartbeat I’ve been reading from mobile today until now. I felt happy for you. I’m glad you will able to “be” with yourself and tonight worked out good for you and your man.

    Tina thank you so much for taking us through your journey with you. It felt great to see you write “Welcome Home Tina” that feels so empowering.

  35.  #35Ann on May 19, 2009 at 3:58 pm

    Dock I’m sorry to hear your man didn’t get what you were trying to say to him. Sometimes for me I just have to speak what ” I know” then take care of me and let it go.

    What I mean is if I was the one in your position I would speak what I know….”I know what I have learned(studied, got a doctorant) I know everyone doesn’t feel the same way I do and that’s okay that what makes people different. However, I know the strain of these discussions is putting a damper on our relationship that I don’t want to be a part of. I feel the best thing to do would be to agree to disagree, drop this and get back to enjoying each others company. What do you think?

    I would say something along those lines even if I had to say it more than once and refuse to participate in the arguement. I hope it works out soon for you.


  36.  #36Flipper on May 19, 2009 at 4:03 pm

    Brava, Heartbeat and Tina. I know your good vibes will still be with you tomorrow, like the roses. I felt happy reading your stories, though so different, and how you’ve both arrived at a good-feeling place.

  37.  #37Flipper on May 19, 2009 at 4:21 pm

    Nelia – Thanks for wishing me well – the understanding I need and want is of My Feelings and the persuasion of their importance so they’ll help me stand up for myself and not allow disrespectful behavior. What I meant was that most men seem to test us with behavior that feels abusive to us, which of course is not acceptable, but they are not all abusive manipulators. So if I mark my boundaries and refuse to be disrespected, the normal, basically good guys will stop dishing that out to me. The abusers who can’t do relationship will continue to abuse, despite anything I say or do, so I will know to let them go.

  38.  #38Linmayu on May 19, 2009 at 10:13 pm

    I’m feeling so inspired by Tina’s story. From despair to being cherished, within a space of several days.

    I feel a sense of mourning. My time with men is really, truly, at an end. I have cancelled all my dating profiles, broken it off with all my (one) suitors, and am clinging to the Lord for dear life. I feel no one would understand where I’m at and what I hope for, except for Him. Right now it feels good to think of the Deity as male as He is likely the only husband I will ever have.

    I have danced in the clouds with Him; I have slept under the shelter of His wings; I have read His love letters; I have lain quietly in bed and felt Him enter my heart.

    He has carried me, gently uncovered the truth for me, and made amazing promises to me. Promises that He will stand by. Promises that He is leading me toward, even now.

    All my life I’ve tried to row the boat of my own life…and Rori’s ways work so amazingly well for a walk with God. Learning to surrender and to feel and to open my heart and be seen…feels so thrilling.

    I should not mourn, if I have such a Lover by my side. But still, I feel the loss; I feel the burden of widowhood though my husband still lives. I feel the shocking clarity with which my own inner self says, “Withdraw. Remain single.” I feel the resoluteness required to stay on this side of that line.

    I feel mourning for what might have been with A., mourning for who else I might have met. Where my husband is concerned I feel very cold and distant. Yet where my God is concerned, I feel frequent infusions of bliss and joy.

    My decision isn’t a popular one. But it’s right for me.

  39.  #39Tina on May 20, 2009 at 12:37 am

    Dock I feel for you on your right not to be taken advantage of by no man not even him. I understand his need for respect from you. He needs and wants your respect I take it?. You have your feelings , continue showing compassion for your feelings, You have the added bonus of your diploma lol. You are passionate about this issue (women in sports) I think its cool. How does this sound?. I respect you (his name) however I do feel passionate about this issue ___________ I do have a diploma afterall and I am very proud of my accomplishment.I feel frustrated when I am arguing with you about this topic, It does not feel good for me, I respect you and that is all I have to say about it. Saying all this and of course leaning way back on your sofa oh hell just lay down and say it . Leave the room after if you feel to. I would lol if only to keep me on course and prevent me from “going off.” Hope this helps, I really question my ability to give/support, I work in a treatment facility go figure…

  40.  #40gina on May 20, 2009 at 2:08 am

    I relate more to the man than the woman in this post. my roommate and I had an argument today that amounted to me being moody, taking things out on her, and feeling contempt that she tolerates my b.s. I just read a quote recently – something like “never believe in your own B.S.”
    That makes me feel like everyone has B.S., so that’s comforting, but lately I’ve been feeling like I’m especially weird. A guy I’m seeing has been pursuing me like I want – drove far to see me yesterday, brought me flowers, took me out to dinner, etc. He says I inspire him to want to drink less, and stop chewing tobacco. That feels nice, but I don’t like that he has these addictions. But maybe the more relevant point is that I have been communicating in a way I think needs revising. I’ve told him that I think he’s an alcoholic and that I want to be with a man who is consistently disciplined and respectful. To demonstrate that he doesn’t have a drinking problem, he didn’t drink last night – but I could tell that it’s deliberate and difficult for him. I feel myself turned off more and more. I told him last night that I have started to hate kissing (cause I feel zero attraction to him, and I basically like the attention he gives me, but feelings of desire for him are missing.) Last night we spent the entire dinner arguing – we’re both involved in a political movement, and he is somewhat of a leader. But he doesn’t want to know certain information cause he considers it a downer, but I do know a lot about it, and I think it is super important for him to be informed. plus he does this weird defensive stuff where he speaks in terms that don’t even make sense (like arguing against having knowledge!!) and it drives me nuts!!!! I feel confused – am I just being controlling?? I let him stay the night last night because he lives far away, and we got past the arguments (but not totally connected, just pretty comfortable – I do feel like I can be completely myself around him) but I feel zero sexual desire for him. I don’t know if I’ll hear from him anymore cause I expressed that I didn’t feel like kissing him last night, and this morning I didn’t even want him to touch me. I don’t care so much about him as I do about my own behavior. I feel like I’m going to be a cat lady, and that I would prefer it to being with a man that I don’t respect. My question is – do I not respect him because i don’t treat him with respect? or because he isn’t respectable? I feel confused about how my feelings for him dwindled (I started out feeling pretty attracted to him) – did I squander them with my behavior? I’m still dating other people – this one just fits a pattern I’ve always been confused about: somewhat decent, but obviously “flawed” (alcohol and tobacco) men, working hard to get me, and me appreciating the attention but resenting the man. I feel like a jerk. I think I should let this go and be available for a man who does turn me on – but I just hope that I’m not a controlling sabotaging person who has no hope for establishing a loving healthy relationship with a man.

  41.  #41Tracy on May 20, 2009 at 2:17 am

    Yesterday and today have been really bad days for me.This guy i am still attracted to has really withdrawn and i feel so angry right now.I feel hurt and i just want to tell him exactly how i feel.It is not probably the best time…Because i feel so emotional like i want to cry and just let it all go….
    I feel confused and desperate and i feel so scared about what is going to happen.I feel scared i am loosing him,i feel scared about dating again.I feel afraid of telling him anything because i feel afraid if i do he’l leave.
    I feel angry that i still have feelings for him and i want to change that.I want to fall in love with someone who is available,someone who cares…and wants to be with me…I feel frustrated that i keep feeling bad over and over again….
    I want to feel safe,i want to feel at ease and let things flow at their own pace.I want to be patient and not over react each time i am faced with this situation.
    I want to feel confident with myself and where i am.
    I feel i have changed though because the last time this happened i tried to talk to him about it and had an emotional breakdown…..This time round i feel the same sadness and frustration but i feel no need to pour it out on him,neither do i want to keep it inside…I accept my sadness and my impatience and confusion….
    I feel that the answer lies within me…not with him…
    I feel scared trying to calm myself down and feeling through this situation….it feels different and i feel unsure…
    I really want to move on to a better place meet a great guy and settle down but i feel that i need to let go of my pain and insecurities that i feel right now….
    I am glad i got triggered because otherwise i would not discover this part of me,but it feels like a black hole..a part of me i have wanted to hide and now i have to face it and pass though it…it is really hard.

  42.  #42Tracy on May 20, 2009 at 2:57 am

    I feel angry because i let myself believe that i could only have fun and enjoy myself when i am around him.I feel mad that i measured all my happiness and joy based on how i was feeling about him.I feel mad at myself for letting this happen.I feel that i have done this with every close person i have been with.I make it their responsibility to make me happy and feel angry when for some reason they stop hanging around me,or are not available.I just feel frustrated and stuck and i don’t know how to undo this cycle.I feel that i need to stop this.

  43.  #43Flipper on May 20, 2009 at 4:30 am


    I feel your Nasty Voices getting to you, trying to make you beat yourself up, and we know that’s an absolute Rori no-no. I feel them trying to defend you, make you take responsibility for everything ‘like a big girl’, but they are misguided and no longer of much practical use. However, they are part of you and there’s no point in trying to obliterate them. Listen to them and then tell them you are now in charge and have a better way of protecting and asserting yourself, then set your NV’s in the corner with a cookie. Let yourself feel the anger, just feel it and try not to start dealing with it how you’ve always done – which sounds like it’s been blaming yourself – but stay with feeling, expressing it through shouting, writing, rap-talking in the mirror with slitty eyes and all claws bared, angry tears whatever . When this happens to me, I now tell myself ‘yes I feel Angry, revolted, sick with rage about being so badly treated, overlooked, taken from without getting back, and that was Not Fair and Not my Fault.

    Yes I may have Seemed to be accepting or indifferent to bad behavior or hurtful comments, but it was my misunderstanding of politeness, childhood coping patterns, old fears of rejection, that fashioned my reactions, but that is No Reason for me to feel guilty or deserving of punishment. I was trying to do and be my best and only knew to ignore my feelings, leaving me essentially rudderless, so how could I have done any differently? And if I want to do better now, I have to be gentle, kind and encouraging with myself because that’s how I’ll blossom and find happiness, not by berating myself and taking the rap for all the crap that happened TO me.

  44.  #44DocK on May 20, 2009 at 5:50 am

    Tina, Ann – thank you for your wonderful suggestions.

    I hope I get the opportunity to apply them but I’m not sure I will. He and I have had some ups and downs. In spite of the fact that the subject matter is sensitive to me – women and sport and their representation – should not be THE thing that ends our relationship but that might be the case. Sometimes it’s the most puzzling things that shine the light on the bigger issues.

    In his defense, don’t know that I behaved as I should have in the final “round” but I can’t change it and can’t beat myself up about it. I’m just leaning back and waiting to see what does or doesn’t come next and will go from there.

    Again, thank you so much. Very, very helpful : )

  45.  #45DocK on May 20, 2009 at 5:53 am

    Linmayu – I feel grateful to you for sharing with us where you feel you are at right now. It feels sad, frustrated, emotional but also hopeful, inspirational and beautiful all at the same time. I guess the “soup” that Rori speaks of – I know that your journey is taking you in the direction of amazing peace but also brilliant, fantastical love.

  46.  #46Linmayu on May 20, 2009 at 7:01 am

    DocK, I feel triggered by your women in sports argument, and were it me, I would absolutely end a relationship over it. A man has a right to his opinion but I don’t feel comfortable being with a man who expects that women should bend over backwards to fit HIS desires, and when he says that women athletes should wear more revealing clothes (and still play as well as men), it feels like that kind of disrespect to me. I couldn’t be with someone who had that attitude; I don’t want to fit into that kind of box–which is why I often say I’m *blessed* with looks that a lot of American men don’t like. I simply don’t attract men who think the way your LI does, because I don’t fit their idea of what a woman should be.

    You expressed it beautifully–“sometimes it’s the most puzzling things that shed light on the bigger issues.” Like the classic example of being on a date with someone who yells at the waitstaff–he’s showing his true character and how he’s going to treat you down the road.

  47.  #47Linmayu on May 20, 2009 at 7:05 am

    And I feel thankful for your comment to me. I felt conflicted posting, because I wanted to share where I am, but I don’t want to come off as judging anyone else here for dating and being in relationships and engaging with men, and I definitely feel uncomfortable giving the holier-than-thou appearance, because I’m not holier than anyone. But the truth of what’s going on with me can sound like some kind of a high horse, I’m aware.

    I learn so much from everyone’s story here. I’m not sure how much more I will post, but I’ll definitely be around reading. 🙂

  48.  #48Nelia on May 20, 2009 at 7:22 am

    Flipper : So? Have you taken Rori’s advice? What were the results?

  49.  #49DocK on May 20, 2009 at 7:36 am

    Linmayu – I hear what you are saying about his views although he says that he just feels that is the reality – but not only for women – for men as well – that sex and attractiveness and all of that sells. He misses the point that this is being IMPOSED on women whereas, for men, if they CHOOSE to use their looks (an example would be the soccer player Beck using his looks to advertise products) that’s fine but they are not required to do these things as PART OF their sport – and, again, it is a choice and they are still valued for their talent (and paid well for it).

    It’s kind of funny that my dissertation was considered to be “feminist research” because it was qualitative and was about women’s EXPERIENCE (doesn’t that mean what they are FEELING?) of performing their sport in the culture of femininity and homophobia. In other words, yes, the women GET that they are supposed to look feminine (one reason is because our society fears that all women playing “masculine” sports are gay) and would get more money for their sport but that it doesn’t FEEL good. What I was writing about is what they felt and how it affected their ability to focus, play, enjoy their sport and so on.

    Anyway dear one.

    I have loved reading your postings and your journey. I couldn’t “buy” a date for 3 years awhile back so I know what it feels like to be in a place of not dating and relating. It is OK – I learned a lot about myself.

    Hope to keep hearing from you but if I don’t – I will feel you out there and know you’re still reading along with us.

  50.  #50Robin on May 20, 2009 at 9:18 am


    I feel inspired by your strength! Wow! I feel inspired by your decision to be true to yourself and do what’s best for you

    I feel triggered reading this too because I Feel both soothed reading your words that are filled with strength and peace, and also scared because of what Im struggleing with in myself. I want so much to have a family and I sometimes feel judged because I haven’t married and am still single…

    I want to so much to be able to lean on God in the same way you do, to feel fulfilled, and yet I feel weak when it comes to this..


  51.  #51Tracy on May 20, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    Thank you for responding.You are so right.Whenever my NVs come up,it hurts and i feel so sad and i immediately turn the blame to myself.I guess i’ve always wanted to feel like the big girl and take the blame….instead of just accepting my feelings and being easy on myself.
    I didn’t realize that,thanks for helping me see that.
    I was always feeling stuck each time my sad feelings came up and i felt frustrated always trying to feel through the morph…
    It feels better to accept my situations and not guilt myself all the time…



  52.  #52moli on May 20, 2009 at 1:55 pm

    Oh how I wish I’d read this 6 months ago 🙁

    Was in crisis in falling appart relationship where all the pent up anger and frustration pushed a huge wedge between us.

    Now it’s too late. Still feel so heart broken that we never quite resolved things.

    Fantastic blog by the way!

  53.  #53Daria on May 20, 2009 at 2:35 pm

    I have been experimenting like CRAZY!

    I leaned FORWARD and wrote a guy I found very attractive online that I wanted to see him… wound up driving to him… he accomodated me and I feel so good with him. I’m starting to think he’s an angel or soemthing… although may be kind of feminine energy (I don’t know for sure because he offers me stuff and brings me drinks etc).

    So I had decided from BEFORE meeting him that I wanted to experiment with him … sexually! yeah. haha

    So on our second meeting I was feeling weird because I wanted to start experimenting and I felt shy. He is really non-judgemental it seems just like he told me he was… and being with him feels comfortable… I don’t know if he thinks so because he asks me do I feel ok with him… etc… he thinks me being shy is being scared…

    So I told him I felt like having sex… I kinda snapped at him because he wanted to know what I was laughing at… later I told him “I want to have sex with you” very plainly and openly…

    Now this is a HUGE EXPERIMENT for me…

    he looked in my eyes and said ok… I felt flutstered and I said “I’m just saying” then I said… “what do you think?”

    So he said theres nowhere to do it, which was kind of true because we were in my car in front of his house and he did not have his own room… (BUT I would’ve pulled up at the end of the alley or taken his family’s other bigger car somewhere).

    Anyways he started kissing me and holding me and covering me with his sweater and basically just being really sweet… and he kept saying why am I scared of him…

    because now I felt So TRIGGERED like omg does he not want to etc and thinking of past stuff was just going through my mind… it’s like Rori said all this past stuff with exes came up and I was just feeling insecure and I said I felt insecure but I was just feeling bad about myself and not good enough… and he was really just holding me and being so sweet

    I kept telling myself I loved myself and I felt so DESPERATE at wanting to do it I felt super NEEDY and like icky that I now felt I was ahead of him…

    I didn’t let him touch me in an intimate way and he said he’s sorry and he won’t disrespect me again… and I said I don’t feel disrespected I feel insecure

    (and then part of me is like ok I just said i want to have sex with you wtf… you think its disrespecting me to touch me?)

    But then I also did feel really “scared” or “shy” and I liked the way he was holdig me

    so I went to sleep feeling awful that my OUTCOME (having sex) didn’t happen and that I put myslef out there like that… (Although I was just expressing my feelings so I think I’m just triggering myself)… I don’t want to wind up spending time with a guy who doesn’t want to have sex with me… but I know it is really so early (normally I would NOT be wanting to have sex this fast AT ALL except for right now I wanted to experiment with this).

    So I’m not sure what is happening, I woke up feeling upset, then now feel better and good.

    I also had to call guy whos having a baby because financial issues are happenign (Again) and felt WAY less angry and just left him a voicemail about how I’ve been feeling uncomfortable not hearign from him and his having a baby and etc…

    I mean i just felt so normal and casual like he was really my friend only and I did not feel attached…

    I think this may have been from trying to embrace my (sort of rejected) feelings with this new guy… And I was able to lean back… right now in my mind… and actually figure I can ENJOY his respectful attention and let him lead …

    And meanwhile if I really want to have sex I can experiment having sex with my ex who also has started calling me….

    because I don’t have to Zero in even on this wonderful new guy and I don’t even owe him sexual loyalty and HE does not owe me sex…

    I don’t know I just feel good about it all now…

    So weird…

  54.  #54Daria on May 20, 2009 at 2:37 pm

    I just want to emphasize HOW MUCH STUFF was coming up as he held me and kissed me… about other exes and guy with baby and feeeling rejected and not good enough… omgosh! That stuff really Does come up!


  55.  #55heartbeat on May 20, 2009 at 2:52 pm

    Linmayu you don’t feel high-horsy to me, just high! High on Love. And I can relate to that, as I’ve been following my own spiritual path, and for me, this has helped my healing in relationship. I don’t feel judged by you! Are you giving up men for good? I feel sorrow in your comment too.

  56.  #56heartbeat on May 20, 2009 at 3:02 pm

    Just popped on to say thank you for all the support – things are going fabulously juicily now 🙂 Thank you Flipper, Femenergylove and Ann for being so loving and kind yesterday when I was in such a state. Today, I couldn’t be more different! I am so glad I stepped out and offered the invitation.

    Stepping out and inviting feels different to leaning forward.

    I feel a little selfish not responding to everyone, I guess that’s my old way – when I receive, I want to give back. So I will do things a little differently, slip into bed (again!) and get a good night’s rest. I feel wonderfully sleepy.


  57.  #57Rori Raye on May 20, 2009 at 11:03 pm

    Moli, Welcome, and I’m sorry you’re feeling bad…and I KNOW the great relationship you want is close by. Love, Rori

  58.  #58DocK on May 21, 2009 at 7:32 am

    So, the latest in the chapter or our “disagreement” over this is that I stood my ground (he has continued to refer to my “arrogance” regarding this subject). I said that I felt that I had earned the right to some amount of arrogance regarding something I had studied and excelled at. That this wasn’t about what IS (women being valued for what they look like rather than what they do) but about how I, and they, FEEL about it – and that no one had a right to tell me that I shouldn’t feel something – that if it made me FEEL de-valued, icky, upset or whatever that is what I FEEL – not up for debate.

    Also, that if he FEELS that my telling him what I FEEL is “putting him in his place” then he also had a right to feel that and I wouldn’t argue with him.

    There was some more than that – but in the end – he said that he “apologized with all my heart if I hurt you or drove you nuts on this.”

    I accepted his apology and also affirmed that although I had felt hurt, I realized it was not his intention.

    YEESH!!! I FEEL exhausted.

  59.  #59Amanda on May 21, 2009 at 5:05 pm

    Hi, I have a few questions for you. now ill just start off by saying that im 22 years old and i’v only had 1 relationship in my life thus far. so, my questions to you are as follows:

    1) I like to think that im a reasonable looking person. However, all guys seem to notice on me is my huge rack. how do i get guys to notice my other, better aspects*?

    2) Guys have always treated me like a piece of meat. How do i get them to stop without being harsh about it (as is my previous method)?

    3)Now this is the big one; I have met a couple of nice guys. They were nice to me and were really in love with me. But sadly, I wasnt the least bit interested in them. In fact, shortly after i met them(like, within a day) i would delibertly* find a major flaw in them that would make me want them less( e.g: 1 guy i thought was going to be controlling, another i thought was fake and would just tell me what i want to hear). How can I just let go of my unrealistic ideals of the perfect relationship, so i can have a real one and love the guy im with!?!?

    Please help! Im sick of being alone!


  60.  #60Rori Raye on May 22, 2009 at 12:08 am

    Amanda, Welcome, and thank you for this wonderful letter – I’d like to feature it in a post…for now – the person treating you like a piece of meat is you….I would say “beautiful, amazing breasts” and you say “huge rack” …when you start looking at all of you as amazing – they will too. More in the post, Love, Rori

  61.  #61Daria on May 23, 2009 at 5:19 pm

    Omgosh Rori I so love this comment you made to Amanda…

    I am practicing right now telling myself I have beautiful amazing toes… beautiful amazing tummy pouch… beautiful amazing bootyhole… beautiful amazing hair… beautiful amazing heart… omgosh it feels cool

    (except now I feel triggered by having written the word bootyhole… it hurts all my shoulders up to my ears like I’m drowning… I feel so Tense…

    Also beautiful amazing heart… makes me feel gross… like naseaus a lil bit… Iiiick… the word heart makes me feel icky…. what is UP WITH THAT? that feels so surprising to me and strange to feel this way… I did not know I was triggered by the word HEART… ickkkyyyy… grosss. I see like a green mountain… with grasss… and freaking weirdness… i’m feeling tightness in my lower back and those weird tears… I love myhself and whatever this is about… I love me… this feels so amazing that I have these feelings… I Am an aamazing creature… soooooo amazing… beautiful and amazing creature… beautiful and amazing Daria… that feels like a let down? why? I don’t know… sounds like Daria is not beautiful and amazing… uffff… that feels so disappointing… I am going through so much of my worst feelings right now and all by triggering myself with some WORDS… this is crazy i didnt’ know this would happen when I started this post… I Feel so interested and excited and curious… and i feel worried I kinda lost track now… I feel bad… I feel disappointed… and i still feel interested because I’m still feeling the feelings… it feels so cool to feel the keys under my fingers and watch the words appear on the screen…gosh…

    I feel tight behind my nose bridge… and in my lower back … and in my left elbow… I feel AMAZING… I can’t believe I’m feeling th]ese feelings woohoo … is this a flashback from the weed i smoked a few hours agoo… maybe… I promise my]self I am not beating myself up … everything I choose to do is perfect beautiful and amazing for me… and healthy and ick that heart healthy green grass feeling… ick… why do i feel ick at the thought of a green heart…

    green is suppose to be the healing color of the heart chackra and right now I feel like maybe i could allow a little green in even tho a part of me seems terrified of it….

    this is some crazy stuff I feel right now… I feel tight in my cheekbone, I feel tight in my middle of my chest, I ]feel tight in my lower back, I feel tight in the back under my head…

    I feel so interested in how I feel right now! and it feels SO FUN To just keep typing… and I also want to stop…
    haha… I want to post my post now…

    I feel tight under my ears… I feel I am a beautiful and amazing creature… that feels like I’m a fairy or an enchanted something like I have on my computer wallpaper…
    an enchanted Goddess.

  62.  #62Ann on May 23, 2009 at 9:59 pm

    Hello ladies I’ve felt the need tonight to listen/hear. What I mean is while watching tv, and moving around the web a few things have JUMPED out at me.

    For ex. a couple of quotes that jumped at me:

    You shall never succeed if you’re too afraid to fail.

    Being certain doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re right, and even if you are, what good does it do when it isolates you from others?

    Then the phrase “fear of intimacy” came into my head. I’ve read Rori talking about the “fear of intimacy” before but tonight I felt like maybe I didn’t really understand what that phrase meant. So I googled the phrase.

    Below is a short passage from the first link. These are just 3 of the articles I’ve read but they’re real eye openers and boy do I have a “fear of intimacy”

    fear of intimacy:

    The simplest and most understandable way I have ever heard intimacy described is by breaking the word down: “in to me see”. That is what intimacy is about – allowing another person to see into us, sharing who we are with another person.

  63.  #63Ann on May 23, 2009 at 10:06 pm

    Is something wrong with the post I tried to post just now? It shows… Your comment is awaiting moderation

    I can see it but don’t know if anyone else can.

  64.  #64Symantha on May 24, 2009 at 6:14 am

    Hi ladies,
    I’m feeling very pissed off! – get very angry with my bf because he responded me in a rude way in front of friends and then I’m just pissed and stop talking, he asked 30 min later what’s wrong and told him in feeling messages. But then he got pissed because I was angry. What feels very frustrating is I get angry and end up being in a worse position than him for being rude in the first place!!!!!
    I don’t get it, what I’m missing?? Now I’m in bad mood and don’t know how to recover as we are in a trip, in the car and I can’t stand myselfm Help!!!!!

  65.  #65Rori Raye on May 27, 2009 at 1:27 pm

    Welcome, Ann, and thank you for the links. Love, Rori

  66.  #66Cindy on May 27, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    What Mary described is exactly how my relationship is with my boyfriend. I feel like we are a trainwreck sometimes and we both say we feel like we are walking on eggshells. Me afraid of expressing my feelings because he gets angry at me and he is afraid to say something to make me feel upset or angry or insecure. We have such issues communicating and like Mary, I so want our fights to become less and our intimate, loving times to become more and more. At times I take the blame for it…I tell myself I am oversensitive or overly insecure. R is very moody and this situation is so close to my own.

  67.  #67Cindy on May 27, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    By the way, I was talking about the “Walking on eggshells” post.

  68.  #68Time & Time Again on June 2, 2009 at 2:54 am

    What is a “Feeling Message” I saw that alot in your posts
    and sounds like I have done that,,only to be told by a very rude “friend” ” I am sick and tired of your messages, and you are acting like a child from kindergarden…” Needless to say I allowed this friend to move in -platonic frienship and one sided frienship – when he was totally down on his luck. Lost his job, and had lost his rental lease as well. When he didnt have monies for entertainment, he was very “friendly” and
    stayed home to “visit” and to drink my wine!! Now, his financial situation has improved by 100% and you would think he was the house owner. Leaves for work at l0am..without saying BUH! and comes home at 1.00 am sneaking in to avoid any word exchange. I have asked him to look elsewhere for a place to rent..his response is :” Cannot afford any of these rentals and there is nothing walking distance to my job.. I am not an ungreatful soon as I can, I will make it up to you..”
    I really don’t believe any of this..but obvious his “confort
    zone” is threaten…MY BIG QUESTION AND STATEMENT:
    I |feel unkind and cruel if I give him ultimatum to move out, yet since there was a time I had a “crush” on him I suffer pain in my stomach every time he comes in and out without even a greeting and I know he knows this and is taking full advantage.

    I am a few years older than him, and self-esteem is very low…I want to be graceful and firm.

  69.  #69Rori Raye on June 2, 2009 at 9:37 am

    Dear Time – Welcome, and thank you for your question…first, Feeling Messages are VERY specific – you can find the exact Tool in my ebook, and often I talk more about them in my eletters and here. And Second, the issue here is – yes – your self-esteem. To be tough here (don’t read this if you don’t want tough) – you are in a humiliating situation, and you are there because you have no boundaries and are not feeling your own, fabulous worth. This is where we need to put all effort. As you start learning my Tools for having truthful conversations with ANYONE…and you start practicing doing that every day – you’ll soon be able to give a “speech” to this man that will create a discussion of an exact timeline for him to leave your home. Period. And from this moment – what you need to do is get a great life – get out and do things – and DATE!!! You’ll get help every step of the way to do that, here and in my book and programs. Love, Rori

  70.  #70Kath on June 30, 2009 at 5:52 am

    Hi Rori,

    The man that has spent the last 18mths attacking me verbally, not valuing my beliefs and opinions and basically trying to control every aspect of my life; has now turned round and told me that he loves me!- This is after I said we were over and could he please move out. For the past two weeks he has been the nicest, most thoughtful person I have spent time with in a long time. The only trouble is, I don’t believe him- how can someone spend all that time and nearly every day- being so heartless and cruel and then, like a lightswitch, switch to feeling and doing the complete opposite?- You’re right when you say I have to take responsibility for allowing myself to be there- but now I want out of it- and he won’t listen or hear that either- what do I do-I feel so frustrated and angry at not being heard.

  71.  #71Rori Raye on July 1, 2009 at 11:06 am

    Kath, Welcome, and so sorry you’re finding yourself in this situation. This man is toxic. He’s turning around because he has to to keep you. You have to be forceful in throwing him out, or in moving out yourself. You may need help for this…Let’s see what the other women here have for you in terms of specifics, if they’ve been through this…Love, Rori

  72.  #72Overlooked on July 14, 2009 at 4:04 pm

    This whole thread is so hard to read. My husband shuts down, and I can’t find a way to connect with him. He travels a lot, and when he comes home, he does not seem anxious to see me, is not affectionate, and after being gone a month does not even initiate sex. If I flirt with him, he tells me how tired he is. It’s more like he’s my dad than my lover.

    I’ve read the e-book, have the reconnect CD’s and am listening to them … but this week things are coming to a head.

    I’m sitting in my office crying today. My stomach is all in knots and my throat and neck feel tight. I’m having anxiety about him leaving tomorrow and I’ve said nothing. I feel so afraid. I feel so dumb to have allowed this for so long.

    Two weeks ago I went home to Southern California and saw old friends (without my husband and kids). I forget what a great person I am; men and women both were so lavish with their compliments of me, my heart, my mind, my body … it was so sensual and I felt so loved.

    But I came home, and he returned from a month-long trip, and he kissed me on the cheek. Suddenly I felt bad. And no sex. No affection that wasn’t “fatherly.” It’s an incredibly wobbly feeling. I’m feeling rejected, and it’s painful. I can’t find our marriage. I don’t want to be mad. I hate that feeling. But I’m so mad.

    Worse, I feel dumb. I’m a lawyer. I think for a living. People value my opinions for a living. And I act like everything is OK around him, when it’s really not. How can I be so dumb!? I’m such a strong woman when I want something, but not here.

    I’ve recently lost almost 30 pounds. I told him I was going to do it and he said “I’ll believe it when I see it.” And I did it, and now he says nothing about my appearance, just “I’m proud of you.” Well I don’t want him to be proud, I want him to think I’m hot!

    But oh, I’m just too tired. I’m losing interest in trying. That feels so terrible. A year ago I read the e-book and we had a great talk and he convinced me to trust him, which I thought meant that he was a real man, and not toxic. But now he’s doing nothing and I’m so disappointed. Our boat is just floating around in the river.

    I want to feel good again. I want to be adored again. I want to be sexual. I don’t want to be pat on the head like a good doggie. I want earth-shattering fantastical deeply moving love!

    I’ve been sitting here trying to identify my problems – my “stuff.” I’m finding that I’m afraid of a lot of things. I’m afraid that I’ve been faking it by trying to be “good” for too long and he doesn’t know who I really am – and that he won’t like me. I’m afraid that he won’t row. I feel lost. I feel inadequate. I feel overlooked. I feel afraid to tell him all this because he won’t want to come home next time. I feel afraid that if I don’t tell him it will just be fake (again) and we will just be doomed to repeat it. I feel trapped!

    I’m going to ask to talk with him tonight. If he says yes, I’m going to lean back and try the feeling messages I wrote above, but without his stuff. I’m going to be real. I’m so scared …

  73.  #73Overlooked on July 15, 2009 at 1:26 pm

    Last night was difficult. I was soft and vulnerable, purposely used feeling words and never even mentioned him. But he acted like I was speaking the old way. I remember Rori wrote about this being a likely first response from men who have anger, so I just kept using feeling words:

    “I feel lonely when you’re gone, but I feel even more lonely when you come home and we don’t have a connection. That feels terrible. I want to feel connected to you.”

    His reaction was anger. I watched it and experienced it, and it felt very scary. I cried. I shut down a little. I let him blame me for being “too emotional” and having “unreasonable expectations.”

    We took a break, and he went off to the computer, his hiding place, to work. I came into the room, and he acknowledged me, so I said, “I don’t want to mislead you. I am not trying to tell you what to do. I just want to tell you how I feel.”

    That opened the conversation and I repeated what I said before about feeling lonely, adding, “I don’t want to chase you. That feels harsh. I want to be chased.” He reacted differently. He said he “could understand” what I was saying now, because my delivery had changed. I don’t think it did, I think it was him hearing me finally, but it didn’t matter to me how he heard it.

    At bedtime, he pecked me on the cheek and said “goodnight” and put his back to me. He has been gone for a month, was home 4 days, and was not affectionate or wanting to have sex at all. I felt like he had given me cheap words earlier, and I waited about five seconds before saying (emotionally, my voice was cracking because it was so sad) “I feel so disappointed.”

    He sat up and yelled, “WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME!?” I cried and said I did not want to stay there, and got up and left the bedroom. I sat downstairs for a long time feeling broken and paralyzed. I could not get back on my horse. I decided I had to go somewhere happy, so I climbed in bed with my four year old who snuggled up to me, and that was happier.

    In the morning, the alarm went off, and my husband left while it was still dark – for another 10 days – without saying goodbye. I felt crushed and hurting and then a little numb. Then I became angry.

    I resisted all temptation to “do” something (like send him a text or email). I decided to go on a painting trip this Saturday with my mom, who is an artist. I thought about playing the guitar lesson DVD that I bought when I get home tonight. I worked, but it was hard to focus.

    Then, at 11:30, I recieved a text message:

    I am very sad. I really want to understand you … last night, I did not. Your delivery and my acceptance are not in sync. I Love You!

    I replied:

    I’m very sad too. I felt broken last night. Thanks for sending a message. I feel my muscles relaxing a little. I want to be vulnerable, but not fragile. It hurts. I love you, too. It would feel good to talk when you have time.

    I don’t know if I did this right or not. I don’t feel “good” about it. I am in a very sad place, still. I am unsure whether I want to tolerate someone who can know I am crying and can just do nothing. That feels so cold to me. But he decided to send me a message, and he says he wants to understand me. Hmmmm …. I need to try trusting him. That is very scary because he keeps disappointing me. I don’t want to be disappointed, and I don’t want to feel rejected any more.

  74.  #74Rori Raye on July 16, 2009 at 11:03 am

    Dear Overlooked, Welcome, and I’m so sorry you’re in this situation. First, I want to say Brava to you for taking care of yourself, for speaking the truth so beautifully and getting things started. I know I will not surprise you by saying that there is something seriously wrong here. He is feeling guilty about something and hiding something. Not wanting to have sex, for a man, is a big deal. Either he’s got a hormone problem and is worried about getting it up, or he is so furious at you he’s shut down (this one doesn’t seem all that likely), or – and I’m sure this has occurred to you…there’s another woman somewhere. the only way you’re going to find this out is by being direct and asking the questions you need to know about. “It feels totally weird aned horrible to not have sex. What’s going on with that? Am I doiong something that’s stopping that, or is it something going on with you that I need to know? Is there another woman? Can we talk about this and try to get back on track? Would you like to go to counseling?” Just write these thingws down and see if you can get this relationship more honest. I know it will not be pretty – but it’s your only option to getting te intimacy you want. Love, Rori

  75.  #75Overlooked on July 21, 2009 at 10:16 am

    Thanks for the advice, Rori.

    This has been going on for a long time, and these questions have been asked by me. I’ve done alot of sleuthing (and I have lots of resources for that) and I don’t find evidence of another woman. He becomes angry when I ask about another woman, but then admits that he understands why I would ask. I realize I have labeled him “not normal” for his sex drive, which creates stress for him … guilt and/or anger would cause him not to feel aroused by me or attracted to me. I’m not taking responsibility for that, but I recognize that it’s there. If that’s the case, sex with me represents stress instead of connection. I think we can work on that if he’s willing.

    We’ve seen a counselor this past year. He always says the right things and indicates he wants things to be better, but in the end, he never shows up. I saw the counselor by myself yesterday. He thinks it’s time for a “state of the union” meeting. I’m going to ask my husband if he will come to a counseling session with me. I am imagining that he wants to come, and will ask him with that on my mind.

    I feel like the girl who is sitting in the coffee shop waiting for her blind date to show up. So far, I’ve been stood up, and I’ve been waiting alone for a very long time. It feels like I’m willing to wait a little longer if I know he’s going to show up. But it also feels like I’ve just asked the waiter for the check. And that doesn’t feel as scary as it used to.

    He comes home in one week, so I’ll send you an update. In the meantime, circular dating. Summer is a wonderful time for circular dating.

  76.  #76Overlooked on August 5, 2009 at 9:44 am

    Very sad again today. His trip home did not go well. He had to work during the rafting and camping trip I planned for us (his birthday present). I went on the rafting trip with a girlfriend and had a great great time. But when I came home, he was mad about our finances.

    I made a mess of the finances a year ago by missing a series of bills, and our credit rating tanked. I’ve completely changed how I handle the bills, and haven’t missed a payment since. But he tried to refinance a property and the credit rating kept him from doing that. He says he has forgiven me, but he was very angry – yelling that I’m not taking it seriously. I honestly don’t know what else I can do to change it. He cannot seem to forgive me for this. It’s ironic. Us not forgiving each other and always being mad is making us madder and more and more separated.

    He was yelling at me over the phone about being irresponsible (in my opinion for something that happened a long time ago that I’ve already taken steps to change/fix) and I just hung up the phone. I know that wasn’t the right way to handle it.

    He left on a trip an hour after that call. That was two days ago. And he hasn’t called.

    So here I am, again. I’m stuck not knowing whether I call for the thing I did – the hang up – or just wait for him to call so that I’m not the boy. Right now I’m deciding not to call. He will come home Friday for only a few hours. If he hasn’t called by then, I’m not sure where to “be.” I’m so confused and tired.

  77.  #77Overlooked on August 12, 2009 at 2:37 pm

    Just an update … I did not call him. Within a day he sent a picture of the new airplane he’s flying to my email. There was no message, just a picture, with the subject line “my new toy.” That felt disrespectful and like my issues were being ignored. Again.

    So I stopped.

    I thought about how cute the email was, and how he was extending an olive branch in his own way. I let it sit for a day. He did not invite a response, so I really didn’t owe him one.

    The next day I photoshopped (quickly/poorly) my head into the driver’s side of a ferarri and sent it back to him with the same subject line: “my new toy.”

    He came home Friday and we had “real” talks. Then I started overfunctioning. Took the day off to spend it with him, cooked, cleaned, made sure everything was perfect for the three days he’d be home. And eventually the “real” conversation we were having morphed into the “old style” conversations we have, and Monday night he spent another couple of hours berating me for my mistakes on the finances. Really mean stuff.

    When I took him to the airport the next day, he asked if something was bothering. I said, “I don’t feel good about how we left things last night. It can’t be all on me. I can’t take that.” He assumed I was referencing my past complaints about lack of intimacy and said, “well I’m going to be gone for 20 days, so I can’t do much about that!”

    “Then he said OK, so how about you work on the finances for the next 20 days, and we’ll talk when I get back.” And I thought for a minute about his intimacy comment just a moment ago and said, “OK, and what if you think about intimacy and we talk about that too when you get back?” Oh boy. One misstep, telling him what to do and what to think. Disaster. Eggshells.

    I could have said, “It would feel good to know that we can work on intimacy, too. What do you think?”

    But I didn’t. What do you think he said in response? “Oh, yeah, sure, right, GREAT IDEA.” With a roll of the eyes. I walked away. “Don’t I get a hug?” he asked sarcastically.

    I said, crying, “You don’t really look like you want one.”
    He said, “FINE, but remember, YOU walked away!”

    And he was right. I did. It was scary. I didn’t do it “right” by saying “that feels awful” but I did actually walk away.

    That part was hard, but the next two hours were harder.

    I did not call him on my way back to work and apologize. I did not text him telling him he was the world’s biggest prick. I did not email him later laying out the reasons I was justified. I did not tell him how I felt so he would know that he had – dreaded word – HURT me. I started to do many of those things, but ultimately I did not do them. I deleted them.

    I directed myself to other things. I was in pain, but I didn’t reach out to him.

    Within two hours, he emailed me. From the airport. Subject Line: “Victory.”

    He said …. “I was/am very disappointed in how we parted earlier. I don’t understand why you choose to act the way you do. Nevertheless, I wanted to give you credit for a small victory. You chose to walk away, a tactical move that allows you to bolster your position and punish me for reacting to your comment. You then proposed the argument that I didn’t want a hug or kiss goodbye because I reacted to your parting comment about me working on our relationship if you work on the finances. You won! You were successful in hurting my feelings and making it my fault…which makes me completely accountable for the poor parting. Nice move…success. What I don’t get is which objective you are pursuing. It appears that your little victory was more important than a hug and kiss upon parting…a little strange considering that your main criticism of me is my lack of expressing affection appropriately. I will never understand that motivation. But, you are to be commended. Nice move, you win. I love you. Me”

    This should be read with great sarcasm, if you can’t tell. It’s hardly worth the “I love you” at the end. I’ve heard this kind of speech from him before.

    But you know, he’s right. It was more important for me to walk away than to get that little meaningless hug and kiss. And he’s right about something else: it was a choice he made about making himself open or not that led to the poor parting, not me! He said it with sarcasm, but he’s right! And come to think of it, he’s right about something else: it was a small victory. I didn’t intend it that way, and I sure didn’t intend to hurt his feelings. But he is feeling the guilt of his own actions, not mine.

    I am not overfunctioning by responding. I really wanted to reply with “I will respond when I have a moment.” But I realized that responding at all tells him I’m taking a moment, and I don’t want to take a moment. I want to move on. I am leaning back. This emails shows me that in some way, he knows he is acting badly. I will create some space for him to return to. But I won’t create some space for him to make it my fault. His email did not invite a response.

    It felt bad at first, but now it feels like progress. It would still feel even better if I had a plan. I need to figure out the boundaries, and what to do instead of him.

    I’m working on the plan next.

  78.  #78Flipper on August 13, 2009 at 10:13 am

    Good for you, O – I feel very encouraged about what happened and how you handled it. Brava!

    Let’s nuance his “rightness” and have you take the credit you deserve. It certainly didn’t Feel like winning, did it? Your ‘victory’ wasn’t against him, but For yourself : walking away was not a tactic to get back at or get something from him, it felt like a good move in the circumstances to help you feel better (or less bad at any rate). And that is a tremendous baby step in the right direction in my book, one I’d feel like taking again and again.

    I see you noting where you may have made ‘mistakes’ and fretting, and I don’t want you to feel bad about that. This is so beautifully laid out that, without beating myself, I’d use my hindsight to “tweak” some of my remarks. Not to redo everything in my head for a perfect result but to practice going from my usual way (stopping at and saying what he did, said etc, which I Think is the problem, but which makes him wrong) to seeing how I could express more clearly Only what I’m feeling about it, which is the Real issue). (For example, whenever I said ‘you’, I’d see if I could say something else that was true but using only ‘I’ and only relating to my feelings).

    I always worry that he’s not going to understand what I’m talking about if I don’t properly expose the details (who said/did what etc.) But Rori said he usually understands perfectly when we go right into to the feeling, without the ‘factual’ preamble. After all the rational, reasonable drawn-out discussions face to face and in writing, your guy still even said “I don’t understand why you choose to act the way you do.”

    That’s why I don’t feel there’s any point in countering his specific beefs, but I feel there are elements in what he wrote that I could use to start writing the kind of speeches I’d like to say when the time feels right. For example, if I was the object of this kind of ‘reasoning’, I might want to say “I don’t feel that my objective is to win a victory over anyone, and at the same time I don’t want to feel like I’m the loser in some sort of match.” What do you think?

    Thanks for sharing. Hugs.

  79.  #79Rori Raye on August 13, 2009 at 11:08 am

    Overlooked, I read these backwards, so I don’t know your prior comments yet… seeing and experiencing anger from a man is GOOD – it’s actually a step forward. It’s a chance for you to respond in Feeling Messages.

    What you’re doing here is the wonderful art of Strong on the Inside and Soft on the Outside – in which your turning away is an inner choice to step back, rather than a defensive one on the outside As you practice this in everyday situations, you’ll start to “get” how this works. Intimacy is not something you discuss and work on…it’s something YOU DO, by expressing yourself in a way that’s about YOU, and doesn’t make him wrong. Please work with my ebook to really get the 4 Rules and how Feeling Messages replace the things the 4 Rules forbid. Love, Rori

  80.  #80Overlooked on August 17, 2009 at 12:32 pm


    It has been five days since I’ve heard anything from my husband. I still have not communicated with him, either. It’s a very long time for us not to communicate when he’s on a business trip.

    It feels like (1) I’m being punished with the silent treatment (and so are the kids); and/or (2) I’m letting him punish me by giving him so much space and having that be OK; and/or (3) I’m punishing him with the silent treatment, which feels like a game, and I don’t want to play a game.

    I’ve been reading my Rori Raye materials and listening to the Connect CD’s.

    I’m trying to change how I think about the silence so that it’s not a “game.” This part is really hard … the soft on the inside part. I guess it’s just a boundary, not a game. I do not want to invest time in someone who can’t be bothered to invest in me. But how does that work when you’re married? I’m already invested. Do I change that to “I do not want to invest any more time in someone who has stopped investing in me?” Because it’s just not true.

    What can I do for the next 11 days until he comes home to keep from going crazy?

  81.  #81Rori Raye on August 17, 2009 at 10:06 pm

    Overlooked, forgive me, I just found this comment and can’t go back to find your other comments so I’m sure about your circumstances (this showed up as needing moderation, though I know you’ve posted here before…sorry it didn’t show up when you posted…) can you tell me again why you’re not calling him? Did he leave with bad feelings? I believe you have to step in here for the kids…and I’m not sure how to help you do that without the background…I’ll try to find your comment when you post…Thanks, Rori

  82.  #82Overlooked on August 18, 2009 at 6:42 am


    Thanks for the question. Yes, he left with bad feelings. We fought in the car on the way to the airport. At the airport he rolled his eyes at me, and it felt dismissive. Instead of reaching out to hug him, I took a step back. He didn’t notice. I kept stepping back.

    “Don’t I get a hug?” he asked sarcastically.
    I said, crying, “You don’t really look like you want one.”
    He said, “FINE, but remember, YOU walked away!”

    Ironically, he then turned and walked away. I know now that he expected me to chase him. I’ve overfunctioned for so long. I went to the driver’s side and drove away. It was very very scary.

    I’ve been thinking about how to say this better next time. Like “It feels like I’m bothering you.” I made it about what he’s feeling instead of what I was feeling.

    It was a small victory for me to walk away in that I took a baby step. It was another small victory that I did not immediately try to call or email him.

    Within the hour he sent me a stinging email from the airport critiquing my actions:

    “I was/am very disappointed in how we parted earlier. I don’t understand why you choose to act the way you do. Nevertheless, I wanted to give you credit for a small victory. You chose to walk away, a tactical move that allows you to bolster your position and punish me for reacting to your comment. You then proposed the argument that I didn’t want a hug or kiss goodbye because I reacted to your parting comment about me working on our relationship if you work on the finances. You won! You were successful in hurting my feelings and making it my fault…which makes me completely accountable for the poor parting. Nice move…success. What I don’t get is which objective you are pursuing. It appears that your little victory was more important than a hug and kiss upon parting…a little strange considering that your main criticism of me is my lack of expressing affection appropriately. I will never understand that motivation. But, you are to be commended. Nice move, you win. I love you. Me”

    You need to read it dripping with sarcasm. I’ve heard this speech before, and it’s not delivered in a loving way. I did not respond to it. That was August 11th. For six days he has been gone and not communicated with us in any way. My daughter cried last night asking why we haven’t heard from Daddy. I am covering for him, but I am hurt (yes, there’s that word) that he would punish the kids.

    I did intervene and break the silence. It felt like the right thing to do after six days. He’s in Japan on a military base, so there’s a time difference of 16 hours (ahead of us). But there are phones, and he has a phone card, and obviously there is email.

    Here is the email exchange that occurred recently:

    My email (5pm): This silence feels like a game, and I don’t want to play games. I want to be real. Do you?

    His email (midnight): I want to be real as well. I sent you an e-mail prior to departing that expressed my feelings…and you did not answer. In my impression, you have chosen silence. I Love You…and I miss you…That is real.

    My email (5:30am): Your prior email didn’t feel like an invitation to answer you. It felt like pushing me away. It feels like I am always being blamed for things, now including the silence. What do you think?

    So I guess the question about breaking the silence is moot. I did it, and I wish I hadn’t. His response felt like blame, and excuses. I think he has now opened the door for a response to his first “nasty” email, but I think doing so now will be counterproductive. I wish I had not included the part about blame in the email, and stuck to one thing at a time. That part felt more about him than me.

  83.  #83Rori Raye on August 18, 2009 at 4:47 pm

    Overlooked, I think it went WELL. And the idea was to get him on the phone with the kids. Just focus on the kids, on bridging the gap. Get webcams. Set up a family blog. Get the family together. and while he’s gone…I want you to work on NOT having arguments anymore (which it seems to me you did very well in the exchange here). Also – He said… I Love You…and I miss you…That is real. Now, THAT is what I want you to train yourself to RESPOND to!!! What you’re doing here is ‘sticking” to your agenda – and I want you to rethink this whole thing along the lines of my method of strong on the INSIDE, soft on the OUTSIDE…keep reading and doing Tools. Love, Rori

  84.  #84Overlooked on August 18, 2009 at 5:20 pm

    Okay, I see that. I can see that. I did send him an email regarding the phone and the kids, with that goal in mind. I started out angry, and I found myself laughing. I just let the whole thing stay in the email, even though it sounded schizophrenic. Here’s what I wrote:

    “Your little girl cried last night, and again this morning after I sent my email to you. She keeps asking why you haven’t called. I have told her that you may not have a phone where you are, and that there is a time difference that makes it difficult. I keep redirecting her as best I can. I feel really angry about this, like I might hit you if you were standing here. That is real. I love you, and I miss you. And I wish you were here so I could punch you.”

    And I think that last part was funny. I don’t know if he will or not, but it was funny AND true! And now I feel better, no matter whether he calls or not.

    Still working on not WANTING to be angry, but I’m getting there.

  85.  #85Overlooked on August 19, 2009 at 11:04 am

    Not angry today. Saying it out loud (or emailing it) and thinking about it as a fact instead of an emotion was like freedom. No, not like freedom, it was freedom. So, it’s gone.

  86.  #86Overlooked on August 20, 2009 at 10:35 am

    Eureka! Update … we communicated last night. I was able to change how I was thinking about his words into how I felt. And it was so much easier …

    Series of emails:
    From me, Wednesday:

    That last part where I said I wished you were home so I could punch you was supposed to make you laugh! I hope it did. The kids want to hear from you, especially Olivia. It would feel great to hear your voice. We are home now, and we will be at home this time tomorrow.

    From me, Thursday:

    It feels like I’m talking to an empty space. I want to talk to you. I feel totally out of control because I don’t have a phone number for you.

    From him, within a couple of hours:

    I am sorry I have not called. Dale and I are on 12 hour shifts in an underground facility that does not have exterior phones. With passdowns, I am actually in the bunker from 5PM to 7AM…I just woke up and it is 1230AM your time. In addition, I lost my voice. This has been a fatiguing exercise… Please tell my little girl that I will call this evening. I miss you guys as well…all of you, but I especially miss talking to you. I think you made some very bad decisions when you walked away from me at the airport…but that was your choice. I did not walk away…I stood there waiting to give you a hug and kiss and you walked away…it takes two to hug and kiss…you chose to walk away…that event is something you must look inside for why and what you were trying to accomplish.

    I love you and I love the kids…please tell them.


    From me:

    (first I included responses from the kids, letting him know I had communicated as he requested).

    Thank you for the apology. It’s so nice to get a message from you about what you’re doing and what it’s like there. I knew you would be working very hard. It also touched my heart to hear you say that you “especially” miss talking to me. That feels connected, even though you are very far away. I’m looking forward to hearing your (hoarse) voice.

    So at first that felt fake. At first I wrote “Quit blaming me and let’s move on!” But I stopped thinking. I re-read what he wrote that made me think that way.

    (1) He says he thinks I made a bad decision. He is entitled to his opinion.

    (2) He says it takes two to hug and kiss. I agree!

    (3) He says I chose to walk away and I need to look deep inside for why, and what I was trying to accomplish. I have, and I like my decision, and I like what I accomplished!

    So I did not respond to all that stuff. He didn’t ask my opinion about it. I responded to the good stuff. I hope it won’t take long for him to move away from the “old way” – the blame thing. I can see that when we are face to face, this is going to be difficult for me. I am going to concentrate on his words, not what I think he’s saying.

    OK, these are baby steps. Did I miss an opportunity to say more, or is this going the right way? I feel good about it.

  87.  #87Overlooked on August 20, 2009 at 2:24 pm

    I took a short walk today. It felt so great to have the sun beating down on my skin. Three men gawked at me. Two male attorneys I know stopped (one stopped in the middle of the road in his car and rolled down his window) to tell me I was “looking great.” Upon my return to the office a male co-worker said “I can really tell you’re losing weight.”

    So funny. I haven’t lost any weight or changed anything about my physical appearance for two months. Obviously, it’s my insides that changed today!

    So, I wanted to share that success.

  88.  #88Overlooked on August 21, 2009 at 8:51 am

    At 3pm yesterday, I recieved a call at my office from him, from Japan. We had a short but good conversation. One part …

    “It feels so great to hear your voice. If I close my eyes it’s like you’re here.”
    “Does that make you happy?”
    “Yes, it does.”

    (He wants me to be happy = not toxic!) He called later and talked to the kids at home. But this call was for me. He said he would call the next day, and I said that would make me happy. I said thank you.

    I’ll let everyone know how we progress after the homecoming in a week.

    Thank you, Rori.

  89.  #89Flipper on August 23, 2009 at 5:11 am

    This is fabulous, O-L – thanks so much for sharing. Hugs.

  90.  #90Overlooked on August 24, 2009 at 4:21 pm

    I find myself getting nervous about him coming home Friday. Not so much nervous, as skeptical. I’ve been listening to my reconnect CD. There are really a lot of things to remember, and so so many tools. Which is great … but hard to focus on. I’m feeling overwhelmed a little bit. What are the top three things to remember, so I can at least concentrate on those, for the first day he’s home?

  91.  #91Rori Raye on August 24, 2009 at 5:05 pm

    Hi – strong on inside, soft on outside
    Leanback, but open up
    Use feeling messages – don’t “organize” or overfunction.
    Love, Rori

  92.  #92Desperate Army Wife on September 20, 2009 at 12:24 am

    Hi Rori,
    I’m so heartbroken…Don’t know what to do. In 2000, I broke up w/ my cheating ex-husband who got his mistress pregnant. At the time, my friend (now my husband- Nick) was my rock.
    Nick left me bec. he fell in love w/me and I couldn’t return the feelings. I was going thru the divorce. Nick joined the ARMY to forget about me.We kept in touch. He met someone new and married her. He didn’t know I got divorced.
    In 2003, as soon as he left for Iraq, she cheated on him. He didn’t talk to her after that and divorced her. In 2005, we met again. Love at first sight.
    I knew he would be the one for me. Within 5 mos., we eloped before he left for Iraq the 2nd time. I waited for him and had a 2nd wedding. Huge & over 450 guests in 2007.
    In 2008, he left for Iraq the 3rd time. We were doing great. All the soldiers informed me each time that he constantly talked about me. He loved me so much! They said he loved me very much.

    I went thru a very traumatic event in 2008. Grandma died in hospice care November2008. On the day of funeral, my brother had a massive stroke. At the same time, my son was arrested for drug possession and alot of different things (16 yo). Husband(Nick) was still in Iraq, unable to be with me. Then, I had to have removal of pre-cancerous cells having a Total abdominal hysterectomy. There was so much darkness in my life that I was so depressed. All these times, my husband was in Iraq. When he came back, he had to deal with us going to courts for my son’s arrest. We didn’t really have time to be together. Then, he left to go home to Texas (I own a house there). However, I live in California. To make a long story short, he reinstated his ARMY contract without consulting with me first for another 4 yrs. He’s supposed to be out in 2011. Now it got extended to 2013. I was upset but still wanted his love. With all of this, in June..he started to act very distant. I started to feel threatened. It would seem that he kept pushing me away for some reason… I didn’t know if it was another woman. His family assured me that he’ll get his senses back and find his way back to me. In July, he sent me an ARMY ring that claims me as his wife. I talked to him last in August. I have not heard from him for a whole month. On my birthday, Sept 1, 2009 He sent me a huge very expensive bouquet of flowers. But yet, NO calls back from him. I asked the ARMY FRG to check on my husband. to see how he’s coping/adjusting. He came from Iraq-California, spent a month doing courts for my son, went to Texas moving into Washington. The ARMY said that they’ll look into it and will help him for his PTSD.
    I don’t know what to do. I feel he just gave up on our family. We were the closest of all couples. He used embarrassed me cause he would constantly kiss me in front of all his family…..Then, now… nothing. What do I do to get him back? I live in California, he now lives in Washington. I am so depressed. His family said to leave him alone. I was leaving him alone until the ARMY told me he admitted he has PTSD. He also stated he needed help bec. he can’t deal with it. He wants to go back to Iraq bec. dealing with the problems over here was too much. I want to be at his side but family says I should just leave him alone. I’m afraid that he’ll find other women or probably with another woman right now. I don’t know. I ‘m so scared of losing him coz he is a great man. Should I leave him alone or should I be at his side? I’m lost and confused. Counseling doesn’t help. I’ve gone to 2 counselors already and they make me more depressed than ever. How do you handle a guy who isn’t normal? My first instinct is to leave him alone. This advise would be for a normal guy. He’s not normal… there’s something wrong with his psyche if he’s just leaving me COLD TURKEY.
    Sad chanelle

  93.  #93Tina on August 1, 2010 at 11:48 am

    I found this, I remember reading something about eggshells, thanks Rori

  94.  #94Tina on August 1, 2010 at 11:40 pm

    The first time I jumped out of the truck, he was “asking” what took so long when all along he could see me throughthe cafe window, I finally couldnt take it anymore and jumped out with my coffee and slammed the door, and walked off down the street, he demanded I get back in the truck, I yelled at the top of my lungs I CANT TAKE THIS SHIT ANYMORE! EFF YOU IM NOT GETTING IN THE EFFIN TRUCK ID RATHER GO JUMP OFF A BRIDGE THAN GET IN WITH YOU AHOLE! HE YELLED, i YELLED SOME MORE WE YELLED AND YELLED AND YELLED FOR ABOUT 20 MINUTES, I FINALLY GOT BACK IN, HE PROMISED NOT TO SAY ANYTHING , HE SAID LETS JUST GET BACK TO THE HOTEL. we talked again blah, we talked blah, we sat in front of a coffee shop again and talked some more, he got angry again, i jumped out again, I said i cant take this i have to leave, he said you cant stay out all nihgt i said id rather stay on a park bench downtwon then go back with you, your yelling at me, stop it! he called me on the cell while i was sitting on a bench wondering what the hell i was going to do now, now that I made up my mind to sleep on a bench hm, i had coffee and money so i wasnt worried to much and a phone to call if i needed too. anyway he did come back to get me, i stayed at the hotel , we slept after the whole name calling incident waht a night mare,

  95.  #95Tina on August 1, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    if this situation happened back home, everyone would hear about it but in a huge city, no one apparently cares lol. everyone and their dog would know that tina and mr eggshells had a serious blowout, morning coffee gossip yeah for sure.

  96.  #96Tina on August 1, 2010 at 11:45 pm

    Sex came up I said oh hell no , your kidding right? he said no, I said no effin way forget it, he said how about tomorow morning then? i hit the roof again. he yelled i yelled he called me a whore yeah whatever. i told him to go rent a hooker ahole!

  97.  #97Mary on December 14, 2010 at 11:09 am

    Misdirected Anger Which is a Form of Abuse Often Leads to Other Forms of Abuse,Like Physical Or Sexual Abuse!Cant Even Imagine Why this Young Woman is Still with this guy&Cant believe your telling her to Leave the Room,She should leave the Room Alright to pack her Suitcase on her way out the door!IF In 10Years he has Not Been able to Afford a Ring to Marry her-He’s NOT going to Marry her&she needs to Move On with her Life&Get Away from this Guy 4-Ever!She’s Young&Theres Better Men Out there in the World for Her to Meet,Date&Marry!

  98.  #98Rori Raye on December 15, 2010 at 9:26 pm

    Mary, Welcome, and thank you for your insight – and yet – it’s easy to say “leave him.” If you are in a toxic, verbally abusive relationship (physically – yes – RUN!!! hopefully with your friends helping you out…) – leaving will not solve your problem. You will simply look for another man to punish you. The work is all inside, and you CAN start in the relationship as it is now. I’ve seem horribly verbally abusive men stop completely – in days, when the woman I was coaching changed her words, her energy, her body language, her life completely. When you show up differently – he changes. And, usually, you get bored with him and leave without pain. Transformation is the name of the game here …for me, anyway…Love, Rori

  99.  #99Mary on December 15, 2010 at 10:16 pm

    Iam getting Older and Set in My Ways & The Things that I would Settle for & Put Up with in My 20’S & 30’S- I Have No Patience & Zero Tolerance for in My 50’S (Cant Blame it All on Menopause),Because by the time I Hit My 40’S I Would’nt Stand Around,Wait Around & Allow Some Bone Head to YELL @Me,I Would Be Gone Or, He Would Be!Theres No Reason for Either Person in a Relationship to be Yelling at the Other Person-Its Disrespectful.Theres No Reason He Cant talk to her like She’s a Real Person with Real Feelings&Emotions!I Would be Having a Moving Party!I Dont Walk On Eggshells!

  100.  #100Mary on December 15, 2010 at 11:14 pm

    Rori, A Friend of mine has been sort of with a man for 13Years,There was Never Any Dating Involved,He Only wanted to see or visit her when he was Horny&Didnt even Care IF There was a Bed Available,He Lied to her,Cheated on Her&Even Married the “Other Woman”,Over the Years This man&his wife have both Stolen Everything that My Friend Owned(More than Once),He Would Vanish until he had Problems with his wife,then would appear in My Friends Life like Nothing Ever Happened&Like they had just enjoyed a Lovely Breakfast that Morning,He never Lived with My Friend even before the wife,Or even take her anywhere-lunch,dinner Or, a movie was too much of an effort for this man to put into my friend.I Finally Not Only Convinced My Friend to Move,I took Her Boxes,Helped Her Pack&Used My Truck to Move Her into a nice Apt.SO that HE cant Find her.Was that The Rite Or,Wrong thing to do?Am Now Trying to Help Her to Build herself Back up to Who she was before this Nightmare,she is Now taking some Pride in her Appearance Again,Wearing Make-Up,Doing her Hair&Wearing Nice Clothes that she Bought in the Hopes that “THAT LOOSER” Would take her someplace Nice to wear them!My Friend Is Really Pretty when she puts an effort into her Appearance&Iam trying to get her to Date Again,She says she’s NOT Ready!Men are always trying to get her phone number So they can take her Out(I know I’ve seen it happen when I’ve been with her&they have asked)&She’s NOT Giving It Out,Is she Afraid that she will fall into the same Pattern and be some man’s Sex Toy again?How Do I Get her to Snap Out of it? I Really Miss The Friend that was Fun Loving&Happy!Please Help!!

  101.  #101Mary on December 15, 2010 at 11:53 pm

    Is it too much these days to expect a man to dress up to take a woman out on a date?Be on time to pick her up?Or Call her If he’s going to be late?These Days Everybody has a Cell Phone, So it’s NOT Like He has to even drive around find a Pay Phone,A Place to park,Or get Change?What Is He trying to say with this Kind Of Inconsiderate Behavior?The Last Couple of times he has done this to Me I have called a Friend and gone out with them instead.Needless to say this man will call Me the next day to Complain that When he Arrived to Pick Me Up I was’nt there!&Why did’nt I Answer My Cell Phone?For the Same Reason He didnt answer his when I Called Him when he was late Picking me Up for Our Date!Just Like Him I Did’nt want to Answer!Of Course I was’nt there he was an Hour Late(According to My Neighbors),His Story was he was 30Min.Late IF That were True I Would have Run into him on My front Porch.How Long should I wait for a Man Who is Late Picking Me Up for a Date?I Dont Sit Around ALL DRESSED-UP&No Place to Go Waiting on Any Man&Why Should I?

  102.  #102Mary on December 16, 2010 at 12:41 am

    Hi Rori,Love Your Website&Love that it’s an Open Forum So That Us Ladies Can Ask Questions,Get Feedback from You as well as Other Ladies Who Care Eough to take the time to Comment on Situations with men.Rori,as Pretty as you are I Dont know why you would have ever had any Poblems with Men,What the hell were they thinking(Or NOT Thinking which seems to be their Problem 98% Of the time)!Could it be that the Large Majority of Men are Defective Or,do they Suffer from Aspberger Syndrome?I went out on a date with a man like that NOT Long Ago,Luckily it was a first date&I met him there So I had My Own Car,10Min.into the Date I Noticed that NOT Only did he Have Nothing to Contribute to the Casual Conversation of a first date,He never made Any Eye Contact with Me,Didnt have the Ability to Listen Or even Understand Anything that I was saying to him,I excused Myself to go the Powder Room&Left the restaurant,We had Not been there long enough to even order something to drink so I didnt feel bad about leaving and sticking him with the check since We Ordered Nothing there was NO CHECK!

  103.  #103Daria on December 16, 2010 at 2:01 am

    Mary – from the way you wrote your post it seems you feel angry and frustrated with men

    This is just my observation.., I felt a lil surprised reading your pist because it reminds me of some of textbook cases

    Seems you blame nen or stuff your ferlings around thrm and get resentful.,. Rori yalks of what could be a pattern that you use to push love and happiness away without meaning to

    You can use feeling messages to start learning to express what you don’t want to a man in the present moment… In a way ge can hear you and will attract men

    Roris ebook is like 20 and describes all the basics… It helped me a lot and I know it can help u if something in there catches your attention

  104.  #104Mary on December 16, 2010 at 4:09 am

    GEEZ, Glad that I am NOT the Only Having Problems with men.Came to the Conclusion Many Years Ago That YA CANT LIVE WITH EM&YA CANT KILL EM(Think My Attorney told Me Once that It was Against the Law Or Something)LOL!Anyway I have this Theory that Women Are Like The Marine Corps We are Just Looking for a Few Good Men(&NOT FOR SEX-WIN OUR HEARTS FIRST&PUT YOUR THINGY AWAY TIL YOU DO)!Actually I Believe theres Some Good Men in the World&They Like US WOMEN HAVE BEEN BURNED SO MANY TIMES, THEY LIKE US ARE AFRAID TO LEAVE THEIR HOUSES TOO!So I am Improving some with Age(I USE TO BELIEVE THAT ALL THE GOOD ONES WERE MARRIED OR BURIED)!HAD TO RETHINK THAT ONE THE MARRIED ONES CHEAT ON THEIR WIVES&LIE TO THEIR GIRLFRIENDS!You Almost have to ask them for reference’s before You date them So You Can Weed Out The Sex Maniacs,Drug Addicts,Alcoholics,Loosers,Freeks,Serial Killers,Stalkers,Wacko’s,Pedophiles,Pervert’s,Liars,Cheater’s,Slime Bags,Pig’s&Pukes that have Disease’s that IF They Dont Kill You- Make You So Sick that You Pray for Death!MEN ARE LIKE BUSES&THEY WILL TAKE YOU FOR A RIDE&NOT ALWAYS TO A GOOD NEIGHBORHOOD!SO Ladies Even IF Their References Check-Out You Still Want Copies Of Their Medical Records&Live with them for 10Years before You have Sex with them(Cuz Sex Will Never be Worth Dying Over)!You Never Know Who They Have Had Sex with B-4 You came along!Life Is About Choices You Can Be Smart Or,Dead-Your Choice!Men will never Put On Your Date Application that They Had Sex with a Hooker 3Mos.Ago&She died Last Wk.From Aids!They are Not Quite that Stupid They Want Sex&Most of them Think Monogamy is an Exotic Wood from Eastern Europe!The Best way to handle it is- You Dont Do A Thing IF You aint Got that Ring.Sometimes ALONE Is Better,I’ve been Married Twice&Divorced Twice,I’ve Lived with Men,Dated Them&Have Also Been Alone Just Me&My Old Dog!Would be Alone for the Rest Of My Days b-4 I would Be with any of the Men I Described Above!Whats the Point in Wasting time on Any Of them?Since this is 2010 for a few more days anyway,Maybe its time We Ladies Flip The Script on Men,Get their ph. #’s&NOT CALL THEM,Dont Tell Them where WE LIVE,WORK OR Anything else About Us Maybe in 2011We Should be The Players&Play Them Just like they have done with Us for YRS.!Maybe We All need to have an Answering Service to screen Our Calls&Take Our Messages(IF THEY REALLY NEED A WAY TO REACH US)!LET THEM CHASE US IF THEY CAN FIND US TO DO SO!When did The Male Species Decide to try to Become So Complex&Complicated?Never Use To Be That Way!What happened to the days when a Man would meet U&IF He liked You He would ask for Your ph.# &Would Actually Use It to Call You On a Wed.&Ask You Out on a Date for Fri.Night?He would take You to a Real Restaurant for a Real Meal,Maybe a Movie Or,Out Dancing After!Now They ask for Your Ph.#&IF They Do Call Its Just for A Bootie Call?Then They have No Clue Why Your Ph.#Has been Changed Or,Disconnected,You Have Moved Out&Your New Address is a POB,Some of them are kind of Funny though,Cuz They are So Dumb They will Stand there for Hours Staring@Your POB with a Confused look on their face like how in the hell does she live in there?You can weed them Out with All the Other’s they are too Stupid to even LIVE&You Wonder How They even managed to LIVE This Long&Also who dropped them on their head on the side walk&from What Height?Keeps Me Up some nights Wondering What % Of the Male Population is Worth Dating&What % of them are Good Marriage Material?The Male Species Leaves Alot to be Desired&The More I see&Learn About them through the whole Dating Experience,The More Iam Convinced that ALL WE LADIES NEED IS A GOOD DOG,AFTER ALL A DOG CAN BE TRAINED,THAT MAN YOUR ABOUT TO GO OUT WITH WAS TRAINED BY HIS PARENTS&YOU DONT KNOW WHAT KIND OF CRAP THEY RAISED HIM TO BE!THATS WHY I ALWAYS MEET THEM SO THAT IAM NOT @THEIR MERCY CUZ IF THEY ARE BEHIND THE WHEEL OF THEIR CAR THEY CAN TAKE YOU WHEREVER THEY WANT TO&DO WHATEVER THEY WANT TO YOU AFTER THEY GET YOU THERE!WHY RISK THAT?Long Gone Are The Days When Dating Use To Be Fun-Now It’s Just Dangerous!Bad Men Never Tell You They Are Bad-if they did would you ever go out with them?Am Almost Convinced there’s Better Quality Men to Date in Jail than there is Running the Streets Free!There’s even Men in Prison that can be Rehabilitated.But is there Any Hope @ALL with that man you met@The Store,Downtown,The Park Or The Dry Cleaners?Just Cuz He Looks “NORMAL” DOESNT MEAN THAT HE IS!

  105.  #105Mary on December 16, 2010 at 5:22 am


  106.  #106Mary on December 16, 2010 at 8:07 am

    Daria, Did you do a 360 on your opinion of Me?Or,are You Out Chartering Buses?Would Love to Spend the whole day hearing about how angry and frustrated you think I’am about men.But before I go to work today-I Pay My Own Bills! I must go “RESCUE” Yet another Friend of mine & Put her in My Guest Room!That is Unless You would prefer that I leave her to freeze to death,Living with her Boyfriend in his tent in his front yard with him & his 2Dog’s,The temperature here is 4 & We have Snow?He’s another of those “WY.WINNER’S-His trailer(that was too Old to Insure & He was B-hind on taxes on it,ALSO Had No UTILITIES IN IT FOR SEVERAL YRS.& Also, Owes Lots of back taxes on his Land) went up in flames last summer,HOWEVER,He has Lots of Potential- No Job,Likes his booze & drugs & His Truck also took a major Dump last summer as well,IT’S VERY COZY OVER THERE WITH THE NO ELECT,GAS,WATER,& THAT MAKE SHIFT TOILET HE PUT TOGETHER ALL BY HIMSELF-A PLASTIC TOILET SEAT ON TOP OF A BUCKET!(HE HAS LIVED LIKE THAT FOR ALOT OF YRS. B-4 THE FIRE)-He had No Job before tragedy Struck & He has’nt Worked a Job in @ Least 5 Yrs.& Somehow He Still Doesnt think that he needs a JOB!PERHAPS YOU WOULD LIKE TO LIVE ON HIS PRIMATIVE HALF ACRE OF LAND WITH HIM&LOVE HIM?CALL ME PICKY BUT I HAVE HIGHER STANDARDS & REFUSE TO BE WITH MEN THAT ARE TOO LAZY TO WORK & WILL NEVER HAVE AS MUCH AS I HAVE ALL BY MYSELF & WITHOUT THEM!

  107.  #107lime on March 21, 2011 at 8:34 am


  108.  #108Nancy on March 30, 2011 at 10:40 am

    Rori, I have been dealing with this issue for quite some time. I have been afraid to talk about it to my friends/family for fear of the obvious – they tell me that I should not deal with this type of behavior.

    This entry sort of hit the nail on the head for me. I needed to hear some empowering speech about how you shouldn’t be tolerating such anger; what it comes down to is NO ONE deserves to be abused.

    Countless “I’m sorry”s have weighed my heart down, sinking me into a (very private and closed off) depression. Only sometimes (mostly from the constant fights) do I sit to myself and become a weakling.. crying to myself, wondering how much longer I will tolerate this, when I will finally solved this huge problem in my life.

    Recently, I have learned to not ‘fold’ into my normal reaction of upset, some tears, and even sometimes anger as well. I have kept my wits and stayed calm, letting him know that his reaction is getting out of control and I don’t appreciate being spoken to in such a manner. It feels AMAZING to be in control of myself and ESPECIALLY not to let myself drown in the depression it brings me. Crying to yourself while he sits in the next room watching TV is not my idea of a healthy relationship…

    I thought yesterday that I may not be able to take this much longer. That I might just give up on the years I have spent loving him for relief of this pain. Somehow, I thought I would find clarity… and now I found it. WALK AWAY. I have learned to calm my normal reaction during his anger episodes and will now learn how to walk away when I HAVE HAD ENOUGH. I pretty much never do this. I have been too afraid of the consequences to do such a thing. It feels good to know that I don’t have to deal with that behavior and that I have the power to walk away and let him deal with his anger on his own. If I cannot help him through it, or out of it, why would I stay and deal with the wrath, especially when it is ALWAYS directed towards me and what I am doing to ‘annoy’ or ‘piss him off.’


    This is why I will now walk away when I have reached my limit:

    last but not least,

    Ahhhhhhh it feels like I can finally breathe. A game plan to solve my problems. Why was I going in so naked (without a plan?)!?

    I deserve! < And that is enough.

  109.  #109Megan on February 6, 2012 at 12:19 pm

    Ahhh, I too, could have used this post about 4-5 mos ago. But I could use it RIGHT NOW also, I think….

    I have been dating a guy who seems incapable of communication. I do not know if it is 100% him and un-fixable through changing my behavior or if I am not communicating well either and it is more like 70/30.

    I have tried various techniques, unfortunately at the time I was in a place where internet access was very $$ so I had to pull bits and pieces off the blog at a time and try to work with what I had.

    The situation feels maddening as this guy can be the SWEETEST, most loving and supportive guy but when I find myself releasing steam or talking to him about people that have disappointed me (and not strangers, I mean my family and close friends)

    The most I will get is 1 line, “yeah, that’s really bad” but he literally REFUSES to go further.
    he says it’s pointless or counter-productive or worse, that he doesn’t want to just “slag these people off”- which is maddening for me to hear.

    I’ve tried explaining that this is not what I want either, that it’s about me, not them, that I feel a void, I feel hurt (by them), etc.
    I don’t know why it’s so hard for him to acknowledge my feelings and offer his support.

    Sometimes I wonder if him acknowledging the lack of support I receive makes him feel bad, guilty, or less-of-a-man for all the support he receives?

    If anyone has any ideas/suggestions as to what might be going on, I’d really, really be interested and grateful. I have scowered the blog and am left only with questions marks and heartache.

  110.  #110Megan on February 6, 2012 at 8:31 pm

    I’m hoping that someone sees this on the recent comments feed…

    I just found a comment he had made that didn’t get to me during the initial argument-
    I was saying I felt frustrated and wanted compassion and he said
    “you didn’t want compassion just petty insults”
    this really throws me for a loop.
    I feel that he must know this is a lie and is trying to throw any ammo at me he can come up with.
    He is easily offended so he’s trying to offend me.

    Ladies! what am I dealing with?? how do I handle this?

    anytime I walk away and cease contact, initiating, leaning forward, I am inevitably the one to initiate the peace-making. He is so stubborn he will never come around first.

  111.  #111bobby on February 16, 2012 at 4:20 pm

    wake up if you feel like you are walking on egg shell you do not have to he is in control of you put a stop to now he does not own you plus why be unhappy if no change walk away he knows you will not so he will treat or do anything he wants

  112.  #112bobby on February 16, 2012 at 4:22 pm

    he is cheating

  113.  #113Sarah on February 29, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Ladies, I’m a married woman, and have had similar issues to this. Being a Christian, I try to walk a fine line between loving/submitting/respecting my husband and standing up for myself and loving and respecting myself so that I don’t get bitter and feel I don’t have any say in my own life…so I have been studying the book Boundaries and my husband and I are reading Love & Respect. These are both helping me a lot! Boundaries is helping me with forming healthy loving boundaries that are good for myself and other people, and Love & Respect is helping my husband and I understand each other better and communicate better. Hope that helps! 🙂

  114.  #114Emily on March 22, 2012 at 6:52 am

    Almost Sleeping in Seattle

    Dear Rori,

    I am confused. I am reading your blog posts. I am very excited that I found your work. I have been doing “the work” in many other areas of my life, and the romantic field is the last holding on.

    I recently (6 months ago) met a man with what seemed to be the makings of good relationship material. I began to allow myself to fall. This took effort, the opening that is. I quickley discovered my “trust issues,” that I had been keeping at bay by not “getting in a serious relationship,” for eight years since my last, and first “serious” heart break. Which I likely destroyed through said trust issues.

    These trust issues, came up after a month of being doted on, and they came on strong, the green-eyed monster I like to say, almost out of nowhere (an x-lover had contacted me, and he ‘the man’ was in a shitty mood when we had last parted), I experienced the shakes, and the color left my skin, I had, as I described it in a poem later, been spiritually raped. By my imagination. The one month mark is usually where I run, but instead I called him, and expressed what I was feeling, and admitted to my trust issues.

    BUT, I was still spiritually drained. I didn’t snap back the next day, as he had hoped. “I will call you tomorrow, and it will be like when we first met.” He called, I said I needed to fix my attitude. I worked on it, freaked out more, and saw him the next day, even though I hadn’t gotten myself all the way together yet. One of his friends even marked, you look like someone took away all your power. Not very attractive. He “the man” became less attentive over the next few days, while I had usually been greeted by my starbucks drink of choice in the morning, suddenly I had to tell him I was hungry when it was 5pm and he had been gone to work all day. He responded, but it was different to ask, than to be greated, showered with attention. I went to work the next day, to the music video shoot, and started to get my attitude right, reflecting on the notion that maybe relationships don’t have to be war. He called that day, checking in about my shoot, I was busy with a gig and texted back. Then, I didn’t hear from him for a week. Finally, I got my nerve up, and texted that I would love to see him. He quickly responded. And the rest is history, lots of responding, less direct action.

    I would periodically get fed up, and let him know it, he would brandish me with attention, if momentarily, and then we would slip back into the same pattern. I didn’t push for answers right away, contemplating my own energy, lots of times when the spaces occurred I needed space. BUT I found myself being terrified to call. About a month and a half ago, I got lots of attention, so much that I wondered if I was bored. He seemed so in love. And I had become addicted to “the Pain.” Emotional cutting I call this. I enjoyed slash created situations where I would feel neglected because a) this way I kept a form of false power which allowed me to not have to be in real relationship, if he gave me too much attention i might have to get real about my issues – wandering eye fear of commitment and most significantly being vulnerable (i know this last one because in spite of my boredom or anger when ever “true” love (genuine interaction) shown through I teared up and softened. and b) I was addicted to pain – in place of honesty and flow, I became an adrenaline junkie, in truth I liked the feeling of fear/excitement I got when I finally got the nerve up to call, or the stories from the drama.

    But this type of relationship is, well, not a relationship, because both parties are not truley relating, they are gaming.

    So as I read these blogs, I see the good stuff, but I am left with a question, how do I focus on myself, AND open up. I am very good at being the muse, but clearly not very good at being relational IN a relationship. (i.e. I pulled back at the beginning of January, if he is going to be casual, I will be casual, suddenly, he is calling everyday, and chomping at the bit to see me, BUT my energy had shifted, and I was no longer longing for the attention, I was more entertained by it, this seems out of balance, I would like to meet my man, not be seeking power over him, or under him.)

    I recently, confronted him with all of my tears, I cried and cried, the next day we were in sync like we hadn’t been in months. But he had said he was confused- he wasn’t sure he was ready for a relationship, god do they get everything out of a book, english isn’t even his first language, and I felt like in order to give him the proper space and myself the proper freedom I needed to establish that I was single. But this made me even more sad, it was just three weeks before that I had been confused. So here I am single, which hasn’t been all bad, in fact I am very good at being single, and very sad.

    Almost Sleeping in Seattle

  115.  #115Rori Raye on March 22, 2012 at 11:01 am

    Emily – The solution for you is the therapeutic aspect of Circular Dating. All you need is to PRACTICE being open, and tolerating huge amounts of energy and feelings going through you while you’re in total concert with your body and consciously allowing it to soften and tolerate all the energy. This is essentially a ‘spiritual” practice, because it practices opening your spirit to yourself, and letting that flow out into the world.

    Targeting Mr. Right is your program, after the ebook and Modern Siren – so you know WHAT to practice when you’re Circular Dating on an even deeper level.

    You’re a very deep woman (as are we all) and that is your glory – and you want to practice letting that out and NEVER focusing on any one man. Love, Rori

  116.  #116Emily on April 16, 2012 at 11:13 pm

    Thank you Rori,

    I have let some time pass, have started allowing myself to feel. I am back in the sadness today. It feels utterly disconnected to him, but totally related. Since we last spoke I seem less concerned about “what to do” and more engaged in experiencing. A lot of the anxiety has to do with not being in the present moment.

    So, I must ground in the present moment. I have had some delightful experiences with men, since then. My ex from eight years ago came and visited, he drove me crazy, and we managed to break through to some relating by the time he left. I also got to hang out with an artistic partner and former lover, who I get along with very well, coincidentally with the x.

    Do you think that perhaps when we choose to get focused on a man, we place our pain there, instead of owning it for ourselves. I am shocked that I am crying today, like it is fresh, well not so shocked, but somewhat disappointed. Thank you for telling me to feel, I can tell this is the first big step. First serious one anyway.

    Love to you for the work that you are doing in the world. I believe it is part of the healing.

  117.  #117Emma on July 22, 2012 at 4:29 pm

    hi guys- really need some advice!

    I found out my ex lied to me about being busy and I went ballistic. All Rori’s help went out of the window and I let him have it. I was really abusive. Months of anger came out.

    I do not feel like he has been there for me when my friend went missing and then police found his body 2 weeks later. The day I found out my friend had actually committed suicide is the day I exploded at my ex about lying to me. It was all too much.

    His response was to play the victim- as always. I apologised for the abuse but not what I angry about. He said he had tried his hardest and as usual that was not good enough for me. He then said i had ruined our whole relationship and he was going to text my parents loads of ‘F**king abuse, because I can’ My therapist says he is controlling of me and manipulative. I said he never used to be like this and my therapist says ‘that is because he has lost respect for you now because of how you allow yourself to be treated by him’

    He is controlling but I was definitely in the wrong this time for attacking him verbally. (He deserved it) but I should not have abused him like I did. I have apologised several times. I ended our argument by ignoring his threat about texting my parents and saying ‘you know I want a relationship with you, but if you want me out of your life I will accept that. Just know that I love you’ – he responded to this with more threats about texting my mum. I didn’t reply.

    The next day my ex texted to say ‘Despite our argument I want to be there for you about your friend, we will not discuss ‘us’ during this. Now, why are you feeling guilty?’

    I replied telling him how I felt about my friend dying, being very honest and ‘feeling messages’ but saying I would work through it. After a few texts he stopped replying and I haven’t heard from him for 5 days. I normally hear from him every day.

    What do I do?

    Do i send a feelings message?

    Do I wait for him to contact me?

  118.  #118Sandra on September 7, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    I’ve been married to my husband for 2 yrs.
    I feel like a stranger in the house. He is very quiet, but it’s so hard to talk to him cause he gets mad at everything, when he starts arguing my heart feels as it wants to get out of my chest. I have to walk like you said on egg shells so he won’t wake up and then get mad. We rarely have sex, sometimes we sleep in one couch and I sleep in the other couch. Do you think this marriage of is over?

  119.  #119with an addict on October 14, 2012 at 6:31 pm

    Hey Rori:
    I love every single thing you have ever published on your site (or on a video)….I am a huge fan. (oh, and Meryl’s last name is Streep, with a “p”, lol)
    I have practiced your steps to getting back a relationship, or relating to my man, and so far they are working. My situation is complicated, however. I am currently separated, but still married to an addict, who is also bi-polar. When I met him, of course, I didn’t know, and the last ten years has been an emotional roller coaster for me. I guess its what twelve steppers and you would call toxic. I am trying to practice twelve step principles as well as your program, and believe it or not, the positive, self-empowering attitude of both work well together. I believe he loves me deeply, but his priorities are very skewed at the moment (i.e.stinkin’ thinkin’). I am not yet convinced that he is ready for help; but, the practical advice you give has drastically helped me to feel better about myself, and really ticked him off that I am not caving to his every wish. Not that I am belittling him, but I’m not responding to his crap, and no longer devaluing myself by constantly checking up to see where he his or who he is with. His addiction filters into every aspect of our relationship. It compels him to a constant pleasure seeking behavior which usually ends up hurting me in some way emotionally. Despite my own heartbreak, I am trying to make baby steps forward for my own security. I would like to see you give some advice relative to those not necessarily dealing with the normal male’s personality. It’s hard enough to figure out how to relate to a man on a normal level, but when you had any kind of addiction, alcohol, drugs, porn, strip clubs, etc, its a nightmare. Using your principles, I have communicated to my husband, (not yet an ex), that I have no intention of filing for a divorce, yet, but I will not be treated like the women he auctions off on stage in the strip club where he is now employed as a DJ. (He walked off his stable radio station job with benefits…) He knows he does not want to settle down with this kind of woman, but does not hesitate to remind me how easy it would be to get his needs met elsewhere. I am terrified on the inside. I am trying not to be controlled by my emotions, but I am heartsick. I want him to get help. My mother is nagging me to dump him immediately, but ten years is lot a short relationship, I am so tired of investing time in men who are great actors in the beginning, then turn out to be jerks. When he asked me to marry him after 4 months of dating, he was teary-eyed, and in a sincere voice, said “I love you more than anything, and I would follow you anywhere, I cannot live without you”. Who could resist that? I was captivated.” Now, I feel an extreme since of despair and emptiness, and suspect he is back on drugs, (crack cocaine), based on his behavior and language when contacting me. Please advise me on how to deal with my current situation. I feel so helpless to control anything. I have signed up for therapy and meditation classes at the university where I am pursuing a graduate degree. My graduate work is stressful, and I am finding it hard to focus. After not talking to him for the past two weeks, he manic- texted me this morning from 7-9:30 p.m. begging me for sex. At first, I politely responded that I was not up yet. Then told him No flat out, and reminded him that he told me before he left that he no longer wanted me, and didn’t think he could be faithful(?), which I thought was odd, and probably meant he had already cheated. I love him so much, and am afraid If I tell him no to sex, he will only seek out a stripper who will do what he wants. Am I doing the right thing? This whole situation is making me crazy, and I am struggling to put one foot in front of the other each day to stay in school. I finish my coursework in December and graduate in the spring, and I have to get a real job. Currently I teach two classes as a graduate assistant, so I can make ends meet just fine. I just need some affirmation, I guess, that I am doing the right thing. I really wish he would see the light and get help, but he appears to be enjoying the run-away freight-train lifestyle he is leading. It breaks my heart. I hope you have some insight for my situation. Based on what I see and hear from others, I think there are more women like me out there who are stressed out over a toxic relationship. Thank you so much for your advice. I really value your opinion.

  120.  #120Rori Raye on October 15, 2012 at 9:41 am

    with an addict (I changed your name) – Welcome – and, truthfully, I can’t even imagine what you are doing with this man. You can’t possibly love a man who acts this way, treats you this way, and isn’t getting help. Please, please get professional help yourself to heal yourself and whatever’s in you that would accept this and want this, so you can leave this man and start fresh. Love, Rori