Get Affection, Attention And Romance – Valentine’s Day Special Until The 17th

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If even the thought of Valentine’s Day was upsetting to you because your love life is not where you want it to be, you may be stuck, like I was, in doing things that push your man away instead of bringing him close.

Things that make him want to hold onto his “freedom” instead of making him want to grab YOU – quickly and for FOREVER.

I can help you turn all that around – and so fast you’ll be amazed with my special Valentine’s Day “Commitment Combo” – just go here->

If you’ve invested time, energy, and all your heart into your man and now you’re seeing it all fall apart – he’s distant, even cold and angry sometimes, you can’t seem to communicate without either walking on eggshells or getting into a fight, and all the affection, attention and romance has dried up – I know exactly what you’re feeling.

After the dreadful New Year’s eve where the “ultimatum” I’d given my man (and we were LIVING together – which made everything harder for me) turned into his “I just need more time and space” speech…I didn’t know which way to turn.

And when Valentine’s Day started showing up in television ads and everywhere else I looked (only a month after our dreadful New Year’s) I found myself feeling desperate, alone, and so tense I could barely contain myself.

I knew everything was getting worse.

And I knew my tension and upset and fear and confusion and ANGER was part of the problem, too, because I couldn’t open up and be warm and loving with him the way I KNEW I needed to be if I had any hope of changing things around.

Perhaps this is happening to you right now –

Your man isn’t as loving as he used to be, or you’ve just been “going on” so long – not engaged, not married, just still dating – or worse (like I did) you’re living together without the commitment you truly want.

If you’re like I was, you’re wondering if he’s changed his mind about you and the relationship – though I could barely even let that into my thoughts without completely despairing.

You just LONG for those early days when he was passionate and romantic, and can’t figure out what to do to get it back.

Valentine’s is just plain scary when you’re going through this.

It’s like everything BAD gets put under a microscope, and it feels like everyone around you is judging you for why things aren’t “working out” the way you want them to.

It’s like torture, trying to live “normally” from day to day while you’re never sure what’s going to happen – or if he’ll EVER propose, or commit – or even get back that FEELING he once had for you and want to be more affectionate and romantic.

Valentine’s Day can be a terrible reminder of everything that’s missing in your life – I remember it as some kind of dreaded event. I wished it would just disappear.

It’s just a heartbreaking reminder of everything you don’t have yet from your man.

If you’re where I was – totally stuck and confused – I HAVE ALL THE HOPE IN THE WORLD FOR YOU!

I know you have every hope because I was somehow, in only a week or two, able to turn my relationship around COMPLETELY – and got my marriage proposal less than two weeks after Valentine’s Day – on my birthday.

If I could do this – with all the tension and anger I was feeling, and all the coldness in my relationship – then I KNOW YOU can too!

So, how did I pull this off?

First – I had to get clear about what I was doing that wasn’t working – and that was HARD, because everyone – all my friends, even my therapist – were telling me the WRONG things!

They were telling me to “give him space…”

They were encouraging me to be “understanding.”

They were telling me to be “nice” and a “good woman” and to “cook” more.

They were telling me to “give him time, he’ll come around…”

And the weird thing is – that was my instinct!

I INSTINCTIVELY wanted to be understanding, nice, and give him time and space…because I thought that was what would WORK!

Only, even THINKING about giving him “space and time,” after the 10 months I’d already given to him and the relationship, made me – ANGRY.

So, there I was, angry and yet trying to be nice.

I felt like a stiff, wooden doll being pulled in two directions, and the worst part was, I felt like I was losing MYSELF right along with losing HIM.

I felt absolutely unable to be “myself.”

I was afraid to “talk” about anything REAL – for fear I’d start “pressuring” him and make everything even WORSE.

So I just went on like that, and things got worse and worse ANYWAY.

And then something flipped around in my head.

It was an experiment that got me started – an impulsive decision to go out of town by myself for a weekend – as if I didn’t “care” about our relationship and needed some “alone time” for myself.

I think I mostly was just so angry I couldn’t hold it together anymore – going to work each day, and then not knowing what to do (should I “act like a ‘good woman’ and cook for him, or should I act like I didn’t care and ignore him”…stuff like that).

When I was out of town by myself – staying in a crummy hotel room, eating in restaurants by myself, walking around town pretending to care about what was in store windows – I thought I was going to break apart.

But when I got back, something had changed for me.

I had somehow realized – INSIDE me – that I would survive without him, and that there was nothing I could do to make him “hurry up and marry me,” or “please love me the way you did before” by ASKING HIM to do it, or by trying to CONVINCE HIM to do it.

And as soon as I GAVE UP on that whole idea of WORKING to INFLUENCE HIM – I calmed down, something inside me shifted, and the difference was huge.

I started focusing on myself in a different way.

I started looking at him and relating to him in a different way.

And he CHANGED. Everything got better.

I didn’t know at the time what I was doing, but three years later, as my marriage was going through a horrible, terrible, soul-destroying rough patch, I REMEMBERED that time just before he proposed to me – and I was able to understand some of the things I’d done and not done that had WORKED.

I was able to apply those things, and new things I just made up out of desperate trial-and- error – and BINGO – everything turned around just like it had long ago.

And so I wrote it all down.

I was an actress and playwright and director then, and so I wrote things down as dialogue for characters and as plot for stories, but as I became a professional relationship coach, and started using what I’d learned with my clients, I realized those things I’d discovered and written down were TOOLS.

They were simple steps any woman could do, simple words any woman could say that were absolutely life-changing.

These Tools are in all my programs, but because Valentine’s Day is coming up – I decided to package two particular programs together for you in something I’m calling my COMMITMENT COMBO.

Modern Siren will teach you unbelievably easy, fast and FUN Tools (Tools you’ve NEVER heard or seen anywhere else because they’re not “theory” – they’re “DOABLE”) – that will ATTRACT your man in an incredibly powerful way.

They will make him instantly drop his defenses and want to be with you – for 2 reasons:

1. He’ll be intrigued by you – you’ll suddenly have an air of “mystery” about you that is simply part of being a WOMAN – it’s something you already have – Feminine Energy.

He’ll feel, perhaps for the first time, that you are exciting, and unknown – you’ll be compelling to him in a way he’s never felt before.

And then…

2. The Tools will allow you to make him feel totally, absolutely SAFE – emotionally – with you!

And you’ll be able to do this in a completely different way than everyone tells you – just how it happened with me when everything everyone told me only pushed my man away, instead of attracting him more, until I figured out how to reverse that…

And in the “Commitment Combo”, I include my Commitment Blueprint program.

The “Blueprint” will help you trigger your man’s NEED to lock YOU down into a lifelong commitment.

Instead of doing – like I did – all the things that don’t work, you’ll be “Bridging” – and AUTOMATICALLY triggering this need of his to commit to you.

This will happen to him for so many reasons, and so I put the Blueprint into a 7-Step Method.

You’ll see results from the FIRST TIME you try the FIRST STEP.

This is how powerful the steps in my Commitment Blueprint are.

Don’t you owe it to yourself to finally do something positive and good for yourself and your relationship with the man in your life? Why suffer through another holiday feeling desperate and lonely for his full love and passion?

Stop agonizing over whether or not he’ll ever make a real commitment to you, or whether he’s about to change his mind and leave.

Get my Commitment Combo of my 2 most powerful programs – Modern Siren and Commitment Blueprint – and get them now at a very special price for both.

To learn more about how you can get these programs together at a special price, and get the Romance, Affection and Attention you deserve for Valentine’s Day – just go here and be sure to order by February 17th :

To Valentine’s Day Special Combo->

Here are some of the things I discovered long ago that inspired my now-wonderful husband to get closer to me and quickly propose to me that will help you right now:

1. I completely STOPPED trying to “talk” with him about what’s happening in the relationship.

Whenever I had the URGE to step in to “talk” – especially if he gave me an “opening” (and of course I was finding “openings” every time he said ANYTHING…) – I just physically turned my body around, walked into the bathroom, or any other room, away from him, sat down on the floor and started breathing deeply.

I taught myself to focus on myself somehow, or on my surroundings – the cat, or a speck of dust on the floor, or the light coming from a window.

2. I completely STOPPED trying to get more affection and attention from him by getting close to him.

I stopped touching him first, I stopped making conversation first, I stopped cooking, I stopped doing ANYTHING that felt like I was doing it to GET him to be closer to me.

3. I completely acknowledged my anger, and instead of trying to bottle it up inside (what I’ve ALWAYS been taught to do with my anger – it just wasn’t okay in my family for ME to be angry) – or let it make me “roll my eyes” or tell him how he was doing anything “wrong” (and this was a BIG one for me), or even say anything negative about him to anyone else, I learned how to communicate my anger to him in a way he could hear.

4. I slowly relaxed enough and started to feel secure enough inside me to open up a bit more to him.

Instead of “punishing him” for the pain he was causing me, I started to feel more successfully protective of myself, more able to survive on my own in a GREAT way, and so I could RECEIVE more affection and attention from him.

And then everything suddenly shifted.

We were laughing instead of silent.

We were making love instead of always finding excuses not to.

We had a brilliant Valentine’s Day – I was able to NOT focus on getting proposed to, and we had a close, wonderful, romantic, affectionate evening.

And then, less than 2 weeks later, when we were out to dinner for my birthday – he unexpectedly, completely out-of-the blue put a calendar in front of me so we could pick a WEDDING date – RIGHT THERE.

He came through.

And I hadn’t actually done a THING, except for the 4 steps above – which were actually about NOT doing what I was doing, and just opening up in a different way.

Now, it’s easy for me to tell you to do these things – it’s the HOW TO that’s where the real solutions are – and that’s what you’ll find in my Modern Siren and Commitment Blueprint programs – solutions.

Changing the way you’ve been relating to a man – and relating to yourself – can seem overwhelming. But in Siren and Blueprint, I break everything down into tiny, teeny, easy and FUN steps that you can do AROUND THE CLOCK – no matter WHAT’S going on, or how he’s behaving, or how you’re feeling.

Tiny, teeny BABY-STEPS that will get you RESULTS every single time you DO one.

And so that’s ALL you have to DO – the Tools.

You can find out more about Modern Siren and Commitment Blueprint, and how you can get them packaged together at a special price in honor of Valentine’s Day – so you can get these results IMMEDIATELY – in TIME for Valentine’s Day.

But the offer is only good through February 16th, so don’t wait to go to this link and place your order:

Valentine’s Day Special Combo Until Feb 17th->

I don’t want you to suffer the way I did, and I don’t want you to have to endure all the trial-and-error I had to.

So let me know how the Tools in this letter help you see things in a way that will really WORK for you, and be sure to let me know how Siren and Blueprint help you…

Love, Rori

P.S. Remember, though.this is a very limited time offer.

You have to place your order by February 17th in order to get the special price for my Commitment Combo.

As always, you have a full 30 days to review the programs, try all the Tools, see how they work for you.

And if you’re not happy for ANY REASON, simply return the programs to me and I’ll give you a full refund.

So why wait, and why go through another holiday feeling confused and lonely?

Get my Commitment Combo and start to make positive steps toward securing a lifelong commitment from the man you love:

Valentine’s Day Combo->

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  1.  #1Senior Lady Vibe on February 16, 2011 at 2:57 pm

    hello world

  2.  #2Daria on February 16, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    Hello Slv, it’s me, World

  3.  #3Daria on February 16, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    World is such a weird cool word whirl world woorld whirled

  4.  #4tinque on February 16, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    hello SLV


  5.  #5tinque on February 16, 2011 at 3:14 pm

    whirlygig, whorl…

  6.  #6Daria on February 16, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    This is how guywho used to play me cuz I was always going upstairs to his room w something in my cup:

    [Mike Posner]
    Once I throw on this, once I throw on this
    Its over girl
    Once I throw on this, once I throw on this
    Its over girl.

    I hear you knock knock knock baby come on up
    I hope you got got got something in yo’ cup
    Cause I’m three shots deep and I aint tryna sleep
    Get your redbull on cause I’m ready
    You’ve been playin hard to get with me all night
    We both know exactly what you want right
    Don’t tell me what you won’t do
    Tell me what you gon’ do, whatchu gon’ do

    Once I throw on this bowchickawowwow
    Whatchu gonna say
    You act like you gon leave
    But I know that you gon’ stay
    Break it down dicky downdown
    Girl dont even play
    Once I set the mood right I’ma make sound like
    I’ma make you sound like

    Are you tryna make me late wait wait till the second date
    But I cant cant cant even comtemplate
    Waiting one more minute lemme jump in it
    I brought you flowers and a teddy

    (or some sweet words)

    You’ve been playin hard to get with me all night
    We both know exactly what you want right
    Don’t tell me what you won’t do
    Tell me what you gon’ do whatchu gon’ do
    Once I throw on this bow chicka wow wow
    Whatchu gonna say
    You act like you gon leave
    But I know that you gon’ stay
    Break it down dicky downdown
    Girl dont even play
    Once I set the mood right Ima make you sound like

    Yeah I can make you sound like

    [Lil Wayne]
    I gotta leather couch
    and a black mic
    and we all alone
    what it sound like
    the night was dead
    we found life
    I know I talk shit
    but it sound right
    you say you can’t
    but that’s a fib
    gotta give something
    something’s gotta give
    I bet you love it
    I went to bed
    Now we light up … cigarattes

    Now I aint even gotta say shit (no you didn’t bastard)
    To make you feel aright girl you know you like that
    Say I aint even gotta say shit
    To make you feel aright girl you know you like that
    Once I throw on this bowchickawowwow
    Whatchu gonna say
    You act like you gon leave
    But I know that you gon’ stay
    Break it down dicky downdown
    Girl dont even play
    Once I set the mood right I’ma make you sound like
    Yeah Ima ima make ya

    Once I throw on this, once I throw on this
    Its over girl
    Once I throw on this,once I throw on this
    Its over girl

    And so it was!!! And I was taking myself there and he knew exactly what to do and how to set the mood, to bow chicks wowwow and he didn’t have to say a word to make me feel aright, I felt safe and home

  7.  #7Daria on February 16, 2011 at 3:40 pm

    It should be.. Once I throw in this, once I throw in this..,

    Cuz when he threw in the bomchicka wow wow it was over .,. I was hooked

  8.  #8Daria on February 16, 2011 at 4:05 pm

    Hey something happened! Now that I unloaded that guywho vibe… I feel better and very deserving…


    I’m feeling bored and not very concerned w Securityman

    I will have a wonderful man!

  9.  #9Darling Ella on February 16, 2011 at 4:34 pm


    Wished u were here with me today gf 🙂 I would have taken you with me to a party for one of the Blazer’s basketball team players 🙂

    U would have definitely forget about the Security man after tonite 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  10.  #10Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    Thank you Shannon, SLV, Jilly, Andi… anyone I missed…

    Shannon, I completely feel ready for the real-life test too!!! I get where I went wrong with past relationships – now I’m ready to show my mettle and get it right.

    SLV, I’ll plan on being in a committed relationship by that April date. I put a sticker on my calendar too. How about I get married next Valentine’s Day?

    I feel frustrated tonight…. I had a good session with my therapist but we were just getting to the crux of the matter when time was up. She said that she didn’t think I was stuck in any past patterns in relationships bc I really have had a pretty healthy mix in the past, with just two being “toxic” – and we know the reasons for those.

    Now, she said, I seem to have a NEW pattern of connecting strongly with a guy I really like and then not wanting to let him go when he doesn’t choose me. She said she thinks it is bc I have enough experience and awareness of myself that I now know what I want and don’t want in a man along with the keen awareness of how rare those qualities are. So I feel panicky that another rare bird will not show up. Thus I want to “keep” the one I have found.

    She also said that part of the problem finding a relationship is that I’m not at all desperate or needy and have high self-esteem… so I feel no need to settle and am holding out for what I know I deserve and want and need in a relationship.

    That’s all well and good, but I am tired of waiting!!!!! And, truthfully, they are so rare that maybe there isn’t one out there for me. 🙁 Maybe I have to accept that? That sucks.

    It’s like trying to find a rare species or …. the copy of Jane Eyre with the inscription from April’s dad (in “Definitely Maybe”). Maybe that metaphor can help me get by — I’m looking for that one copy of Jane Eyre — it’s out there somewhere, and maybe if I keep looking AND get lucky, I will find it.

  11.  #11Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 4:56 pm

    Former CD said yes to my request to come fix my computer. I feel smiley. He wrote, “How about Sunday at 2:30? I will need your address. I promise to just work on your computer.”

    Hehe. He knows I know he likes me a LOT. How sweet of him to reassure me that he will only work on my computer. 🙂

  12.  #12LonePlum on February 16, 2011 at 5:25 pm

  13.  #13Lorelai3 on February 16, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    Hi from Australia everyone!
    Beautiful! I had a great Valentine’s Day with one of my men, thanks to the Rori Raye tools.

  14.  #14Alonka on February 16, 2011 at 5:39 pm


    Thank you so much, I am listening to something and that is helping me;)

  15.  #15Kristine on February 16, 2011 at 5:52 pm

    Hello beautiful sirens…Happy late Valentine’s Day I had a great day you know why I didn’t think about who wasn’t here in my life, who I missed, and that I was still single..well ok the single thing might have been on my mind a little but honest I had 3 beautiful Valentines’ telling me how much they love thier mommy. That means so much I have a wonderful and supportive family and feel so blessed that when things seem rough at times they make it so much better…Sometimes this blog and the people in your life and even those who are not all have a story and it’s what you take from their story, what you choose to learn, and what you decide that is best in your life and what is not… seems so simple though it is not I know or we wouldn’t be here. Talking and going through life changes helping one another through obstacles in dating and even marriage. One thing I wanted you all to know is how much I appreciate your stories and comments that have tought me so much. I know what I deserve, what I want, and what I need and there is no reason that any of us have to settle and not have all of those things…Burger, fries, and a hot night in the sheets is so lame, ROMANCE is not old news and I will live my life to the fullest until I find it or it finds me 🙂

  16.  #16kaitlyn on February 16, 2011 at 5:57 pm

    Just finished work, but wanted to give everyone the lowdown on blenders since that topic popped up in last blog. I’ll get to everyone’s questions about RR stuff tmrw.

    Blenders: Get a VITAMIX blender. It is the king of blenders and so hardcore and durable, you can blend beets. Clean up is easy. ALL the raw food people have it. for more info. But it’s like $400.

    The best store brand blender is the KITCHEN AID PRO LINE. I’ve had it for 4 years because maybe one day I’ll have a Vitamix. I’m saving and investing that Paris hooker money for now. You know, since it ruined my life and all. 🙂 Eh, I’m a money saver anyway.

    The secret to weight loss and longevity and youth…get ready…


    OF COURSE, veggies are almost as efficient if you eat them, but even more blended. I only use a bit of fruit to sweeten the taste.

    Just making fruit smoothies is a sugar overload. You’re better off eating your fruit.

    I eat fruit a zillion times/day. Don’t worry about sugar and/or carbs when it comes to raw food. However, don’t load up on fatty raw foods such as nuts or avocados. Sure, they’re natural fats, but no need to eat them daily.

    I shop at farmers’ markets for produce. It’s cheaper and usually all organic. Trader Joe is awesome, too. As for non-organic, produce in it’s own wrapper such as bananas don’t have to be organic.

    If you can’t afford organic at all, don’t worry. Just get produce. Eat produce!!!!!

    I’m an omnivore, but most of my diet is salads with protein, fruit, brown rice, quinoa, steel cut oats, egg whites, and I cook in coconut oil. I also use coconut oil for my skin and hair.

    I try not to pre-packaged food and never drink soda.

    Also, AVOID store bought juices. Yeah, sure the bottle says “now with vitamin C,’ but what they neglected to tell you was that all those juices have been pasteurized to sit on the shelf. Pasteurization zaps away what nutrients, vitamins, minerals there was to almost null.

    I just drink water and black coffee with a splash of milk. I save my calories for food.

    I’ve gotten this down to a science, and I love spreading the gospel.

    People have no idea I’m 38.

    Food affects looks.

    Food affects mood. (If you think I’m disgruntled and negative now, just imagine the nutcase I’d be without health.

    And wear sunscreen. Even in the car. Window tint is only SPF 5. Wear sunglasses to keep you from squinting as well.

    Btw, pretty cool how we can go into boy mode and over-function/give advice here, huh?

  17.  #17kaitlyn on February 16, 2011 at 6:02 pm

    Heading off to a party. My bff is a great guy. He’s been keeping me busy to quell my mind off my dude. He even made himself my Valentine. We sat in the corner of the restaurant and laughed at all the Entourage wanna-bees. Gonna lean back at this party.

    Funny, how I’m the RR expert until the rare great guy comes along and I get too comfortable and lose my RR cool. And myself. :sigh:

  18.  #18Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 6:58 pm

    ok…i need to talk my life out again….

    but first…Kaitlyn…I’ve just started going raw since October…I went 100 % at first…cause that’s me ALL or NOTHIN (not always the healthiest way to be 😉 then went off then on… i’m finding my way, it a process (not an ON or OFF lol) and for the most part i’m really enjoying it! I love the way my skin looks and the whites of my eyes are so white…yay

    ok so yesterday after I posted about pipeliner man…I started feeling really turned off about the whole situation (he’s 9 hrs away and we haven’t seen each other for 5 weeks because he keeps having to work the ONE day off he gets)

    1. I’m really understanding because I’m not home alot during the summer…so I get the work thing.

    so anyway last night I said…

    ME: things don’t feel good right now…I’m having so much fun with you, and I’m falling for you too. but i’m just a girl who wants it all…and I need to see a light at the end of the tunnel…and right now I don’t.

    (i’ve definitely done better in the past with my feeling messages…but anywho..)

    HIM: ok baby..we can talk about it whenever you like

    ME: thanks baby

    HIM:baby…have you been thinkin about us today?

    ME:Yes…I felt so happy yesterday (valentines day) and this morning and then it just all felt imaginary…like I’m making up an imaginary man with an imaginary relationship…and it feels really bad..

    then we ended up talking for about 45 mins on the phone and so I asked him THAT question!!!! you all know…So…where do you see this going?? yep…I sure did!!!
    HIM: I’m not really sure what tomorrow brings…

    ME (IN MY HEAD) GGGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!! What do you mean you don’t know what tomorrow brings??????? NOBODY knows what tomorrow brings!!!! But have some effin idea!!!!!!

    I said that I want marriage and children and if we aren’t on the same page then what the hell are we doing???

    HIM: it’s ok if we aren’t on the same page

    ME: wow…(IN my head of coarse)

    so anyway no conclusion to the conversation…

    but today I want to end it!!!! cut off all communication!!!!!!!!!

    k I”m actually feeling sad
    I’m feeling turned off
    I’m feeling frustrated
    I’m feeling let down
    I feel confused
    I feel unsure

    I feel unsure of where to go from here…

    I know I don’t want a long distance relationship anymore…I know he isn’t moving to my city…I don’t know if I can make him a snack and carry on with dating…Im thinking I just need to cut ties so I can move on….ugggghhh ;(

  19.  #19Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    Kaitlyn: It happens. Sometimes it’s easier for us to see other people’s patterns and stuff than it is to see our own. It’s so cool that we are able to help each other.

    I just got into a fight with my lover today…a huge fight. We worked through it but I had the thought “how could I possible help anyone else when my life is such a mess?”. But deep down I know that’s not true. We all have something to offer even if we don’t always apply the lessons in our own life.

    I’m feeling exhausted right now from our argument but glad it’s over. Have fun at your party.

  20.  #20Senior Lady Vibe on February 16, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    @10: Lucy says:
    “…SLV, I’ll plan on being in a committed relationship by that April date. I put a sticker on my calendar too. How about I get married next Valentine’s Day?…”

    Oooo, Lucy, that’s only two months! Do you remember when I put the little fox (because you are a little fox!) sticker in calendar? Gee, time is speeding.

    V-day wedding is doable but v-day engagement would be very cool too and give you more time. You know, to manage the fifty bridesmaids, lol 😆


  21.  #21Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:08 pm

    Jilly: I say just lean way back and if it doesn’t feel good to talk with him then don’t. He’ll figure it out. Hold strong. You can do this!

  22.  #22Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:09 pm

    So we all get to be bridesmaids at Lucy’s wedding?!?!

    That’s cool!

  23.  #23cateyes3 on February 16, 2011 at 7:09 pm

    Why is that I can feel happy but down-hearted at the same time…. Or is it just lonliness sticking it’s head up and giving me an evil grin like… hee hee… I’m still here!


  24.  #24Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 7:11 pm

    18 Jilly

    I hear you on the LDR thing. It’s punishing and frustrating.

    How would it feel to just take care of yourself and leave all the contact to him, even for a few days?

  25.  #25Senior Lady Vibe on February 16, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    Good news: I got fresh ginger! I’ll be making the tea tomorrow, now going to relax. I got a little honey too ( haven’t bought honey in fifteen years) for the fun.

    Bad news: No chicken gumbo soup, I fear it does not exist anymore, all the new soups seem to have a lot of starchy stuff in them. I compromised and got Progreso chicken with wild rice. Ritz crackers have trans fats, couldn’t find a premium brand of vanilla ice cream everything was supersweet cutesy. I don’t usually buy these foods but I realize now even the processed foods of yesteryear were way better, how could that be!


  26.  #26Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    Lucy: What if the belief “they are so rare that maybe there isn’t one out there for me” is the only thing holding you back?

    I know you already realized that hence the Jane Eyre metaphor.

    Believing that a man with those qualities is rare leads me to believe love it’s just a matter of numbers, statistics, and luck.

    But I don’t believe that. I believe in magic, manifestation, and spiritual love.


    See you next v-day! I’ll be one of the 50 bridesmaids.

  27.  #27Senior Lady Vibe on February 16, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    @26: Laughing Goddess says:
    “…See you next v-day! I’ll be one of the 50 bridesmaids…”

    Me too, me too…since I’ve “invited” all of them. LOL

    Well, when I get married everyone can come be a bridesmaid, no ugly bridesmaids dresses just wear your favorite red dress.


  28.  #28Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 7:26 pm

    27 SLV

    “Well, when I get married everyone can come be a bridesmaid, no ugly bridesmaids dresses just wear your favorite red dress.”

    I love that idea!

  29.  #29Alonka on February 16, 2011 at 7:27 pm


    Just know that loneliness will pass. It always does. You may not believe it now, but it’s just a phase. There will be other phases, maybe sooner than you believe. Just keep on doing whatever may bring you closer to what you want;)

  30.  #30Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 7:29 pm

    thanks LG and Eternity 🙂

    YES!! the LDR thing is something I’ve never done before and he was working in my city and then got transfered so it became long distance…grrr… we’ve only been dating 5 months but I don’t want a whole year to go to an imaginary relationship

    and…he does ALL the contacting…he always has (I met him ARR (after Rori Raye) lol..I feel smiley and clever lol

    but I do have a few new men on the bench 😉 I feel happy about that

    Eternity whats your story?

    laughing goddess…you sound so grounded even though you’ve just had a huge fight…i feel in awe

  31.  #31LonePlum on February 16, 2011 at 7:30 pm

    I posted this for you in the previous thread.

    968: LonePlum says to Alonka 389 + 664

    I don’t understand why you think you should not meet him.
    Do you think you owe him sex when you meet him?
    Or is it that he invites you at his place and you know for sure he will want sex and you feel unable to say NO?

    Anyway, your email is saying you don’t like him and you don’t want to meet any more. He will stop dating you if he reads it.
    Do not use emails and phone to complain.
    Do not complain

    Do not play games, he will be lost and he will stop dating you
    When the phone rings, pick up the phone and be welcoming.
    When he texts/emails, text/email back. Short messages. No explanations, no questions, no complains.
    Wait to be face to face to clear up things when need be.

    Say out loud to yourself.
    “Why do I feel bad?
    _because he does not meet me often enough
    _What is he doing right now?
    _he is inviting me to meet him
    _is it what I want from him?
    _Yes it is
    _is it what makes me feel bad?
    _No it is not. On the contrary it is what I want to happen more
    _Is it logical to refuse what I want more ?
    _no it is not”

    And accept the meeting because it is what you want from the man and he is giving it to you

    It HAS GOT TO BE IN A PUBLIC PLACE if you are still at a place in your life where you might have sex with him and then feel bad about it.

    During the meeting you follow the flow, you enjoy. Do not ask him to meet you more often.
    Be an invitation by enjoying the evening and saying what you enjoy when you enjoy something.
    Show your appreciation of his efforts to treat you.

    If the man does not push sexually, it is fine, you’ll go back home happy
    No comments about the relationship because, remember, it is not a relationship, he is dating you.

    If the man pushes sexually at the end of the dinner and insists in taking you to a private place, that’s when you tell your truth
    “I am afraid we went too fast into sex. But no worries, we can stop sex and take our time to get to know each other now. I need the man to make time for me and to share our friends and joys and problems etc…, (or whatever you need) before I can feel safe enough to have sex.”

    No matter what he says or how he touches you, you stick to the “No sex”
    If he keeps insisting, don’t get into a conversation about it, don’t explain.
    Stand up and say “I am leaving the restaurant now, I am going home. Thank you for a lovely dinner.”
    And leave.

    He will keep a good souvenir of a nice dinner with you, and he will respect you for standing up for yourself at the end of it.
    He will not feel the pressure because you don’t complain and you don’t ask him anything.
    You are receiving him just the way he is, you are not asking him to change. You showed you enjoy dating him just the way he is and you expect him to respect you.
    It might switch something in him.


    Wednesday, 16 February 2011 @ 4:46pm


  32.  #32Alonka on February 16, 2011 at 7:39 pm


    I’ve been living the way you describe for years;) Maybe less devotion, but a very similar attitude. It works. Fruit, veggies, fish, yogurts and lots lots of water. Have to fight weight issues, so no dinner unless I go out;)

  33.  #33Simply Shannon on February 16, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    Lucy, the convo you are having right now reminds me soooo much of Erika’s last few posts. Have you seen them?

    And I am so gonna be a bridesmaid in your wedding. Woot woot! I’ve already penned you in for next Valentine’s Day. OMG!! I feel so excited!

    And SLV, A red dress? SWOON!! I’m in, I’m in!! Oh please please please plan your wedding soon! 😉

    November 10, 2011… that’s MY wedding date. Who’s in? I am really quite serious. I could scream with excitement!

  34.  #34Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    Jilly: I feel confused by the end of your conversation with him. Are you frustrated because he didn’t give a clear answer?

    If so, the vibe I got is that he’s kinda buying time. He likes you but maybe isn’t exactly sure how to make it happen with the job and moving thing. Maybe he has some insecurity about providing and getting a job.

    Not really our business and it’s definitely a crucial time to stay centered, cd, do your thang.

  35.  #35Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 7:53 pm

    SS: Im so there! Already started looking at flights.

  36.  #36Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 7:58 pm

    My story, I’m Australian and he is American we met online. After six months, he asked me to marry him and move to be with him or he would move here. We both have kids and our ex’s would not let either of us move the kids out of each other’s country which I understood completely.

    He was the first man I’d connected with after being divorced for seven years. It went on for 12m seeing each other on the webcam daily and I went for a visit in Oct last year.

    I knew it had to end, my brain and heart both did. But I had always thought that the goodbye would be with love and kindness like the last 12m had been. Guess that’s being attached to an outcome.

    Two weeks ago he disappeared, no calls or emails and no response to mine. I thought he died or was in an accident until he defriended me on FB 2 days later. Still have heard nothing. I know he is not dead or in hospital.

    I think he found someone closer but it really doesnt matter now. I will never do LDR again and ironically some of the guys contacting me on this dating site are international or interstate – no thank you.

  37.  #37Alonka on February 16, 2011 at 8:00 pm


    Thank you very much.

    ‘Or is it that he invites you at his place and you know for sure he will want sex and you feel unable to say NO?’

    No, he will invite me to dinner at a nice restaurant and expect me to spend the night together like it happened many times before. If I go to his place he cooks me breakfast and really cares to treat me well. If we go to my place, he is the most respectful guest.

    Why I think I should consider not seeing him? he has been less attentive lately in-between dates, he ignored my texts/emails a couple of times. He came back from vacation last night and I haven’t heard from him yet. He knows I don’t like it. In fact, he didn’t confirm our Valentine dinner plans, so I don’t even know if/when we have the next date.

    I am letting go and am not focused on all this stuff – went back to the dating site and even talked to a couple of new men tonight over the phone. I am doing whatever I have control over.

    Anyway – he knows that I can’t possibly be happy, but if I act happy as if nothing is wrong, then it’s a sign of weakness, even in his eyes. I hear you and if he calls tomorrow the latest, I will probably accept a no-sex weekend date. If he shows up after tomorrow, I will say that my weekend is booked (even if it isn’t) and remain warm on the phone. Maybe I will say that it doesn’t feel good to be asked last minute.

  38.  #38Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 8:00 pm

    laughing goddess..

    yes I feel frustrated that it basically came down to…”I don’t know what tomorrow brings” that feels bad to me…am I not seeing another side? yes…i agree.. I know he doesn’t know how to make it happen…he has 3 little girls that live in new york that he misses terribly but he’s not there with them because of his job…he doesn’t feel like he can make less money and he doesn’t seem to think he could find something better.

    he steps up in so many other ways that no other man has…

  39.  #39Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    wow..eternity… heart hurts reading that…i can’t even believe that…but i can…(big sigh) is that how you found Rori?

  40.  #40Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 8:13 pm

    Jilly: Your situation reminds me of how things started with LI. We met, quickly fell in love. Saw him on and off for a month. He left for an already scheduled trip to Peru for business (raw foods, as a matter of fact). He was kinda distant. I definitely leaned forward trying to start an email thing. He said he didn’t want to have any kind of commitment while traveling. I was crushed, then pissed. I put him out of my mind and was open to other men. He made a few feeble attempts at email and phone but I wasn’t impressed. I had completely written him off. I joined a band and did some fun stuff

    He called as soon as he got back, about three months later. He had let me borrow a few items and I figured I’d just give those back and move on. Well he had a beautiful necklace that he had designed and had made for me in Peru and he wanted to be with me.

    He said he started to really miss me while he was down there and that let him know that I was the one. It seems like he had to 1. Follow thru with this job he had (purpose is very important to a man) and 2. Take some time to explore his feelings for me. But once he knew, he knew. And he was on a mission to make it happen.

    And even tho we got in a fight today, I can honestly say he is a great man. Ya, we trigger the sh*t out of each other sometimes but we always get thru it feeling even more in love. I try really hard to push him away out of fear and he always stays strong. Sometimes when I am upset I tell him I want to break up. I don’t really mean it. I don’t know why I say it when I’m upset. And he never falls for it. He says that the only way he would break up with me is if I told him 10 times per day for a whole week. Then he would know I had really thought about it. He says he knows we have something amazing and a great future together.

    I’m guessing he wouldn’t be so certain if he hadn’t had the time and space to decide for himself.

    Long story but hopefully it helps someone.

  41.  #41Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 8:13 pm

    39 Jilly

    I found Rori by chance at the six month mark. I’ve been a long term lurker reading voraciously and learning all I could.

    Ironically I think Rori’s tools helped me keep it going way beyond when we should have called it quits given the impracticality of the LDR. I learned to lean back and get on with my life as you need to in a LDR.

    So couple weeks ago after the disappearance, then I decided to delurk and pick myself up and move on as best I can for the time being, until I learn to Siren Strut my stuff.

  42.  #42cateyes3 on February 16, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    Laughing Goddess>>> THANK YOU for the last post… It makes me feel hopeful! 🙂

  43.  #43Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Here is a text conversation I just had with my brother. I’m just putting this out there to blow out steam, and I welcome any feedback if anyone feels like it:

    My Mom is in a nursing home, and all but $45 of her SSI money is taken by the nursing home. So my brother and I have been paying $50 a month for her to have a cell phone. He has been paying the bulk of it, because he earns more money. And for the past 2 months, I’ve been unemployed and on an emergency budget, barely making it.

    Just to give you an idea, he lives in a 5 bedroom house; has 4 cars; an ATV; 2 dirtbikes; a sailboat; and a horse trailer. He recently sold his 4 passenger airplane. His daughter just spent a semester in Rwanda; his other daughter has 4-5 horses with heavy vet and farrier bills; they go on vacation about 2 weeks a year.

    He had some unusual, large bills recently and said he could only pay $30 of it this month. So my Mom was going to pay the other $20 out of her measly $45 for the month. Last weekend, I was 1.5 hours from home when I came upon a terrific sale on pants in her size, which is an unusual, hard-to-find size.

    Here is our text conversation around that:

    B: Hi, S, I have been meaning to let you know, I made an executive decision to spend $25 on 2 pairs of pants in Mom’s size. I was out of town. They were a rare find in short length. They were on sale. I can’t find them in short in my area. Mom was already low on pants and had hardly any cuz laundry room lost 3 pairs of hers. So I decided to use the money I owe you for them while I had the opportunity.

    S: My checking account bounced today.

    B: Oops. Sorry. I had to make a quick decision when I was in the other town.

    S: I understand. This is the type of thing that forces me to not rely on your word or your judgment. Not a big deal…$20 would have solved the problem, but was a contributing factor when I was already in the hole.

    B: That feels bad to hear. I don’t like to be criticized and condemned when I am doing my best and trying to operate on Mom’s behalf.

    S: I did not criticize you. I just stated how it makes me feel when you make a decision on Mom’s behalf with my money.

    B: I’m not going to receive any false condemnation from that. I like working with people who are not judgmental. This feels awful.

    S: Ok, now we each know how the other feels and we will each make decision going forward on the experiences we have. Good night.

    B: I already apologized and am not going to apologize again. I will pay you back the $20 asap. Good night!

    So am I right or am I wrong? I reasoned that my Mom needed two pairs of pants far more than my brother needed the $20. What do you think?

  44.  #44cateyes3 on February 16, 2011 at 8:28 pm

    Alonka, Thank you for the kind words… Greatly appreciated.


  45.  #45Anya on February 16, 2011 at 8:30 pm

    I’m feeling so triggered…did I find myself a toxic man? Realizing now that he’s got his hooks in me…ufff, so frustrating that I get attracted to the emotionally unavailable guys all the time!

    I have 8 perfectly good CD’s who text me and call me and want to see me. Their waterwheels are turning towards me. And all I’m thinking about is that one who gives me his energy and time, makes me feel great once a few weeks and then disappears! Why?? And how can I stop this?

    He called me at 10pm on Valentine’s day and left a very sweet voice mail. I didn’t pick up because I was on a date with one of the CDs (which I’m really proud about btw), but when I called him back the next day he didn’t pick up. I left him a voice mail with a feeling message, saying that it felt really nice to get that voice mail from him and that he should call me back whenever he gets a chance. He still didn’t call back! This is so frustrating! I know I should lean back, I should focus on me and my other CDs, but I’m not at a place yet where I know how to do it.

    We had a date on Friday where he cooked me a nice dinner at his house and then we went out with a few friends. It was a great date.

    Any advice on how to distance myself enough to stop being so mad and frustrated about him not calling and stop looking at my phone every half an hour?
    I only have Mr. Right program and I don’t think Rori covers it there.
    Any advice is appreciated!

    I know it’s a learning process and I’m on a steep learning curve, but he has managed to trigger me into my unsure, self-conscious place overnight 🙁

  46.  #46Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    Another thing is, I F up Rori tools quite often. I suggest things, lean forward, really, I break all the rules at one time or another. Even today, the reason we got in a fight is because he thought I was being blaming and making him wrong.

    BUT sometimes I do remember the tools. And especially if I’m noticing a lack of juiciness in our relationship, I will really focus on getting in my feminine. It doesn’t take much to recapture his interest and devotion.

    So for anyone who is worried that they can’t follow the RR way, I want to say that even a small vibe change can make a world of difference.


  47.  #47cateyes3 on February 16, 2011 at 8:32 pm


    You are right in spending that for pants. Especially when it’s hard to find stuff that makes her feel comfortable and lets her keep her dignity.

    For my 2 cents worth. The phone is a luxury. Clothing is a necessity.

  48.  #48Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 8:36 pm


    RE: #36 – How sad. I feel your pain. I don’t get it how people can be so cold to end a relationship that way. Even one or two lines could ease the way so much better:

    “I’m sorry, I can’t deal with the pain of a long distance relationship. I feel grateful for the joy we’ve shared, but I need to find romance in my area. I wish you the best.”

    I wish I could take your pain. I wish you a wonderful, loving man in Australia!

    And that reminds me of Steve Irwin. I admired him so much, and it was sad that he died young. Terri was from the U.S. and they did it! I wish you a loving, compassionate man like him!

  49.  #49Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 8:42 pm


    RE: #47 – Thank you for your feedback! I totally agree that the pants help her have her dignity. Not only does the laundry room lose her pants but they bleach the life out of her clothes, washing them in hot water, too. So she goes around in faded rags, and I am the only one who ever buys her clothes. I am on the verge of pulling her out of the nursing home so she can be with family; out of the institution; and have her life back. I just don’t know if I can handle her level of care, especially if she takes a turn for the worse.

    BTW, I see the cell phone as very important….

    1. It is safety equipment. If she has a heart attack or gets stuck with her electric wheelchair not working, she can call 911.

    2. It is her primary link to family and friends. She and I talk every day. If she had a phone by her bed with local service, she would be unable to call me, because most phones are long distance these days. Plus she couldn’t call me from anywhere, only by her bed, where she would be more confined and wouldn’t have sound privacy.

  50.  #50Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 8:42 pm

    Shannon, yes I’m in for your November wedding! I feel excited too! What posts of Erika’s do you mean? on her blog? (last time I read her blog she was writing about a coming era of everyone sharing their partners :O)

  51.  #51Boomer on February 16, 2011 at 8:44 pm

    Brenda, this is probably not “siren politically correct,” but your bro sounds like a total d-bag. And I don’t mean “dirt.”

    Srsly??? Maybe he could sell a horse so his mom can have some freaking pants.

    But I’m in a mood, so take my snark with a grain of salt. But the sentiment stands…I’d be upset too.

  52.  #52Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 8:50 pm


    RE: #45 – What helps me most to keep in a good frame of mind when a man doesn’t call me is to keep telling myself, “I am giving him the gift of missing me.”

    Each time I feel myself going into anxiety and insecurity, I use Rori’s visualizations (Modern Siren has some amazing ones!) and switch my self-talk to stuff like this:

    “Brenda, I love you! Your time will come! You are beautiful and loveable, and a wonderful man will be with you in the future. Only the man who sees your true beauty will stay around. If he doesn’t call back, it’s his loss.”

    Here’s a quote that also carried me a long way toward a healthy mindset:

    “God chose one man for me, and there is absolutely nothing I can do to mess it up, so if you aren’t coming, that makes it very easy on me. You simply aren’t the One. Case closed.”

  53.  #53Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 8:56 pm

    thanks for your insights LG. <3

  54.  #54Daria on February 16, 2011 at 8:56 pm

    Brenda – this seems to be a long standing pattern of you explaining yourself

    bouncing a checking account can really trigger a man, especially one who has big financial responsibilities

    here’s where the pattern starts

    Him: my checking account bounced

    Brenda: omg! thats terrible! im so sorry! i feel really guilty… and i don’t want to feel that way cuz i know mom need these pants… but im sooo sorry to hear that. that must feel really frustrating and is a lot to deal with. Thank you for supporting me and mom this way… you are great and im really sorry this happend

    – basically in your answer ‘oops’ – to me – it came off really flip and like you did not realize the magnitude such a thing is for a household that runs on well oiled financials… and for the man supporting that household

    – then you ‘explained’ defensively

    i can see how he was triggered. changing familly patterns takes a lot of babysteps and awarenes… i know

    i still easily get triggered

  55.  #55Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 8:57 pm


    Thank you for your feedback! It really helps to know I dun good, cuz it’s hard for me to be objective when it comes to my brothers. I think, “Really? Am I that horrible of a person?” Then I think of a line from an old Saturday Night Live show, “Is it me or is it him? It’s him, right?”

    Your words just inspired me to send a semi-snarky text: “Maybe you could sell a dirtbike or a horse trailer so Mom can get new shirts as well. In case you didn’t notice, she’s wearing rags. I know you just handled her wheelchair repair, and I appreciate that. But I feel quite concerned for her dignity, too.”

  56.  #56Daria on February 16, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    i think some appreciation was in order too

  57.  #57Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    yes SLV I remember when you told me about the fox sticker. I felt inspired by it – but had forgotten the date. 🙂

  58.  #58Boomer on February 16, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    I have mentioned my “bestie,” Annie Clyde on here.

    She is going through a horrific divorce from an abusive alcoholic man, whom I believe has mental health issues bordering on the pathological. He is using their children to decimate her. He got to her family before she did and told them horrible lies about her as a mother, and in keeping with their religion, they have taken his side (a wife never has a right to leave in their estimation).

    Annie Clyde’s parents and sisters have given her husband the money to fight her for custody of her children! I am in shock and am absolutely disgusted at the disloyalty. And she’s been court ordered to pay HIS legal bills by next month too. I’m just horrified. She makes less per month than I pay for my mortgage. He does not work at all. She supported them for two years before she asked for the divorce.

    Her husband does not work, he sees the kids once a week (he moved an hour away and does not help her with the kids when she works), and then blames her for having to leave the kids alone for short periods as she finishes or starts shifts (the kids are 11 and 10–so not babies, but admittedly not old enough to be left alone for more than 30 minutes). She has enlisted neighbors to help, but that only goes so far, and I help on weekends.

    He is going after SPOUSAL support too. Talk about a man not in his masculine energy.

    I just feel horrified, angry, absolute disgust, and I even feel violent on her behalf.

    It’s been a long day. I’m afraid she’s giving up. She even said she’d go back to him if it would make the pain stop. How can people be so horrible to each other? I feel distraught for my friend.

  59.  #59Alicia on February 16, 2011 at 8:59 pm

    About the Valentines combo on Rori’s post..

    I already have Modern Sirens…

    What is commitment blue print about, Is it about more circular dating?

    Can anyone fill me in on Commitment Blueprint?

  60.  #60Daria on February 16, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    ohh that would feel terrible. it sounds like youre resentful of his family’s life. that would feel really terrible to be treated that way. i would feel really disconnected and not appreciated.

  61.  #61Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 9:02 pm


    RE: #54 – Wow, you really understand me. I felt in total agreement with Boomer’s feedback. Now I read yours, and I feel myself blushing….you’re right. Hmmm. I feel like now I gotta eat humble pie. And the feeling message you wrote for my situation is perfect. You really have an insightful way of seeing relationships and situations in balance.

    Shucks, now I feel embarrassed that I just wrote a snarky text. I spose I ought to follow it with yours. Maybe tomorrow. It is midnight, and I really shouldn’t be texting him so late. Yikes. How I struggle with this stuff.

    Thanks for reminding me…baby steps. Yep, this family stuff is deep-seated.

  62.  #62Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 9:03 pm

    48 Thank you Brenda. I feel heard and accepted here and not judged for the LDR.

    I feel grateful for the time we had. I felt loved, cherished and desired, when I was with him, which I thought I would not be again.

    He helped me get over my ex-husband once and for all and he taught me to open my heart and be feminine instead of always leading with my brain.

    I know we will cross paths again eventually because of where we met online. I feel scared about how I will feel when that happens but I will stay on that site because I have many international friends there.

    My goal is to look after myself so well I am able to feel comforable doing so and being there.

  63.  #63Boomer on February 16, 2011 at 9:11 pm

    Brenda, I’m in no position to be giving advice. I am feeling dark, bitter, and way foul today. I may regret posting this and be banned forever or chastised by a few folks here for “not getting it.”

    But…yeah, on the one hand, I’m with Daria. That text WAS snarky and resentful and passive aggressive.

    On the other hand…I am having the hardest time with what seems to be approval and understanding of men being jerky. Perhaps I’m just not getting it and perhaps I am not centered or whatever, but from what I can tell from your script with your bother, he started the passive aggressiveness with the whining about the bounced check. His inability to keep his bank account above NSF level is not your emergency.

    When do the men in our lives–be they husbands, CDs, brothers, fathers–have to be accountable for their behavior and their poor communication?

    This attitude likely contributes to my poor track record with men, and I’m willing to own that and examine it, but really…sometimes I feel suspicious and concerned that a lot of the stuff we preach on this blog excuses men with a “boys will be boys” casualness.

    Frankly, if my brother had talked to me that way, I would not have been so passive. I’d probably have gone straight to the aggressive.

  64.  #64Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 9:11 pm


    Re: #33 – I’m in! November 10, 2011…Mr. and Mrs. Simply!

  65.  #65Anya on February 16, 2011 at 9:11 pm


    Re: #52

    Thank you for this! I will try out saying this to myself. Hopefully it will work. Obviously the only thing that is triggering me is my own negative thinking, and that’s one of the main things I am working on.
    I wish I can get all of Rori’s programs! One day I’m sure I will! For now I’m relying on this blog and all of the Sirens’ experience! Thank you! 🙂

  66.  #66Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:14 pm

    Brenda: I agree with Daria and I feel relieved that you see the pattern. I’m not saying this to beat you up and I really hope you don’t beat yourself up either. Family triggers can be especially hard. I feel really curious to hear how he would respond to a message like Daria’s. Please let us know his reaction if you decide to send it.

    How are you feeling now?

  67.  #67Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 9:16 pm


    I used her feeling message almost verbatim. I added at the end:

    “I really appreciate all you’ve done over the years for Mom and me and I hope to make it up to you.”


    I feel you. I think he is somewhat blind to partially pinning the blame for his money management on me. In my perspective, he is totally living outside his means. And, yes, sometimes I DO feel resentful when I see his mother living in rags while his children are each provided their own car, even tho both daughters have each totalled a car, in addition to several fender benders. I spose I sound a lil judgmental, but maybe they’d learn quicker to value their cars if they had to replace them with their own money after crashing them.

    We are ALL in process.

  68.  #68Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    Boomer! You are officially BANNED! You must leave the island immediately.

    Haha! Just kidding. Everyone’s entitled to an opinion…even if it’s wrong.

    Seriously, just kidding.

    But leave now

    just kidding

    I don’t know what’s gotten into me

  69.  #69Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 9:23 pm


    RE: #66 – TY for your feedback. I went ahead and sent Daria’s feeling message. I figured I was already texting him too late, and I’d rather he get the softer text together with the harsher one.

    It’s hard for me to find the right balance of being soft with him, because in the past, he and my other brother decimated me with criticism.

    He is probably in bed, and I will probably get a response in the morning. I will let you know when I do.

  70.  #70Daria on February 16, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    omgosh that’s horrible
    i was alone for hours since i was 5

    whats the law in the us? they have to be 12?

  71.  #71Boomer on February 16, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    LG…mwah! Big kisses.

  72.  #72Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:25 pm

    Just playing the devil’s advocate here…please don’t shoot me.

    But if I understand the situation correctly Brenda’s brother had been covering Brenda’s portion of the expenses for a few months and the reason he was upset is because Brenda had already agreed to pay him the money that she spent on mom.

    I totally understand that mom needs to be taken care of and brother lives beyond means but still if someone told me they were going to give me a certain amount of money and I had bills to cover and then they didn’t, I would probably be upset too.

    He doesn’t sound like a bad guy to me.

    If I was Brenda, I probably would have felt triggered too and quite possibly would have responded defensively.

    But I don’t think trying to understand his perspective is making excuses for men.

  73.  #73Boomer on February 16, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    Daria, I don’t know what the law is. It’s very fuzzy and “gray area.” I was alone after school for two to three hours from sixth grad onward – I was 11. No one threatened to take me away from my mother.

    I feel dark and dangerous tonight. A very very rare occurrence. I’m usually spouting freaking rainbows out of my butt. But wow. Triggered much???

    Apologies if my bile seeped into the blog. I has me some issues tonight.

  74.  #74Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 9:30 pm

    43 Brenda,

    Can this be an opportunity to have a discussion with your brother about an ongoing budget that is more realistic? Maybe plan for future purchases so you can be spur of the moment?

    Is it possible to get an account for your mother with no fees, that he can contribute to, and can keep separate so it doesn’t interfere with his payments?

    I’m not privy to his situation but there seems to be a disparity. But again who knows, just because he has all those things he may have no cash flow at all and needs to sell a few of those horses. Maybe I’ll buy one for my own siren horse *wink*

    If buying a $20 pair of pants makes cheques bounce or contributes to it- yikes, that is very very scary. Such a thin line of financial security would make me very nervous.

  75.  #75Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:30 pm

    Brenda: You’re doing awesome in my eyes. I feel admiration that you feel humble and are wanting to do your part to make things right. Brother isn’t perfect and I understand your sensivity towards him. I have high hopes that you can inspire you entire family relationship to feel better which will most certainly benefit your mom with your great attitude.

    Something I just heard Abraham say is that criticizing other people’s prosperity keeps it out of our own lives. I dunno if it’s true but it just came to mind.


  76.  #76Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 9:31 pm


    RE: #62 – You said, “My goal is to look after myself so well I am able to feel comfortable doing so and being there.”

    You’re welcome! Right on with this approach to your site with international friends! That’s being a rockstar diva, just keep coming back and doing you, rather than isolating yourself.

  77.  #77Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:40 pm

    Boomer: that’s a horrible story about your friend. Understandable why you may feel a little dark.

    Gosh, I really hope everything works out for the best. Trying to trust that it will.

    Sometimes in situations like that the best thing we can give our friends is hope. Ya know, be their shining beacon of positivity. Sometimes that just pisses them off tho. I like to believe that deep down they like it. I’ve even had friends tell me that even tho my polly Anna attitude pissed them off initially, it really helped in the long run.

  78.  #78Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    LG thanks for post #40…I felt happy reading about your experience 🙂

    yes…it does sound alot like my current situation with pipeliner…

    he called a little earlier..asking how I was feeling and we had the best conversation…yay 🙂 he corrected himself from last night….I mentioned that we dont need to go over it again…that I just have some feelings I’m working through..but he said…

    HIM: i don’t know what tomorrow brings…but I know I want you in it (he could have said that last night!!) lol

    we are just going to have to MAKE time for eachother…

    and it was crazy because my phone stopped working today but I could receive texts and call out but when someone calls me it says the number’s been changed lol…I went to the movies with the girls and he tried calling for 3HOURS and couldn’t get through and he was super worried and so tonight he said he felt horrible not being able to reach me and that we need to give each other “emergency” numbers incase something ever happens…I feel happy and melty inside

    i felt totally connected with him tonight 🙂

  79.  #79Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    LG, so you think I should not believe that the kind of men I like are rare?

  80.  #80Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    Eternity: I’m really enjoying the way you express yourself. Trying to learn and emulate. You feel very soft yet wise.

  81.  #81Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    and LG..thanks for the reminder about a man’s purpose…i’m leaning way back! 🙂

  82.  #82Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    Lucy: “LG, so you think I should not believe that the kind of men I like are rare?”

    No, I’m not saying that exactly. I’m saying it doesn’t matter if they are rare. Rare is irrelevant in the world of magic. That’s what I’m saying.

    ¿y tu?

  83.  #83T-Girl on February 16, 2011 at 9:50 pm

    OMG, on cloud 9…Rori’s tools so work…I am a total convert….

    Rubber band man, who texted me on Valentines Day after not hearing from him for 3 weeks and not seeing him for 2 months (and I leaned back) stopped by tonight. It was a great night….and of course during that time 2 other guys called as well (but I had my phone on silent). What a great night it has been…I’m too excited to sleep!

  84.  #84Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    Jilly: that’s funny about your phone. I bet he was sweating.

    I imagining a responsible man who takes his word seriously. Who already has 3 kids and wants to feel confident that he can provide for any future commitment he may make with you, especially if he is wanting children.

    This is, of course, still getting in his mind and none of our business but sense you feel really good with him, I say we give him the benefit of the doubt….

    And keep cd-ing.

  85.  #85Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    Since, not sense

    But ya maybe sense too, as in sensual pipe layer

  86.  #86Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:02 pm


    RE: #58 – How horrible! Wow, no wonder you are not in a terrific mood. That is so unfair on your friend.

  87.  #87Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:04 pm


    RE: #59 – “Can anyone fill me in on Commitment Blueprint?”

    Wonderful! 12 CDs! Terrific guest speakers at the end! Rich with info on stages of a relationship and how to do circular dating. I totally recommend it, and you will not regret it!!

  88.  #88Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:11 pm


    RE: #72 – I hear ya. I just appreciate your perspectives, and it helps me be more objective. I really am trying hard to build my relationship with my brothers, and we’ve come a long way. I knew he wouldn’t be cool with this. But when I saw those pants for such a good price, I just ruled in favor of my Mom’s needs over my brother’s finances.

    I guess what I did was right and wrong. And I just learned more about how to use the feeling messages. So that’s baby step growth. And I really will work hard to make it up to my bro.

  89.  #89Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:14 pm


    RE: #73 – This is a place for emotional processing and healing. Please feel free to seep bile…

  90.  #90Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:25 pm


    RE: #73 – You asked, “Can this be an opportunity to have a discussion with your brother about an ongoing budget that is more realistic? Maybe plan for future purchases so you can be spur of the moment?”

    It’s a good idea. However, my current feeling is I’ll get a part time job to have more cash flow and it’ll be a cold day in southern california before I ask him for any more money for my Mom.

    For real, I take care of the footwork of refilling her phone each month: I pick up the money at his house; get the phone card to refill the time at the store; and call to refill it with the PIN. That night he knew I was sick coming out on a cold night to do all that. When I arrived, he was walking out the door to go to the SAME store with his son. I didn’t say anything, but I felt perturbed that he didn’t offer to do the footwork to buy and refill her phone himself that time, knowing I was sick.

    You asked, “Is it possible to get an account for your mother with no fees, that he can contribute to, and can keep separate so it doesn’t interfere with his payments?”

    Yes, and she already has a bank account he could deposit into easily, a lot more easily than me driving 12 miles each way to pick up money at his house. But again, I’m not going to ask him for any more money.

    You said, “If buying a $20 pair of pants makes cheques bounce or contributes to it- yikes, that is very very scary. Such a thin line of financial security would make me very nervous.”

    Yes, I agree. And for real, I felt kinda disgusted. I don’t like it when people are so petty. When it’s family, $20 is pocket change, for real. He knows that, but he’s from my family, where little things are blown into big, hairy, audacious issues! Any normal person who wasn’t raised by my Dad probably would have said, “No big deal. Just catch up with the $20 when you have it.”

  91.  #91Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 10:31 pm

    58 Boomer

    Wow that’s a desparate situation. I feel for your friend so much. Not to have the support of family must be devastating for her. Him not working and with children that need her makes me really sad for the kids that they are in the middle of this and her for carrying the full burden.

    I feel eternally grateful to my ex-h for working with me and making our divorce amicable. I feel so happy he is loved up with a wonderful woman who is kind and caring towards my sons.

  92.  #92Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    Brenda: it’s understandable why you bought the pants. I mean who would imagine $20 would make such a big deal to someone with all those things and mom did need the pants. Yet he has his own worries and wants to trust that you will be true to your word.

    No bad guy really. In fact, it’s very touching to see siblings working thru lifelong patterns in order to help momma.

  93.  #93Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:35 pm


    RE: #75 – Thank you so much for your encouragement ! I have put out a lot of emotional energy to bring healing between us for years, and it truly is starting to take effect. I feel closer to my brothers than I’ve felt since I was a teenager. I actually enjoy family gatherings now, after not even attending them for a few years.

    You said, “Abraham say is that criticizing other people’s prosperity keeps it out of our own lives. ”

    Who’s Abraham? Lincoln? Overall, I feel very happy for my brother that he has done so well financially (part of his wealth was assisting in designing and programming for Bose stereo! He made trips to China and Japan in the process!). I feel quite proud of him, matter of fact.

    My criticism tends to come in pettiness over $20 and when my Mom is silently doing without so many things she needs. I buy her all I can – toiletries, clothes, encouraging music, dinner out now and then. I have felt quietly shocked at times when I’ve seen him bring her a poinsettia for Christmas when her needs are so vast, and they seem so blind to them.

  94.  #94Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 10:36 pm

    Brenda: “And I really will work hard to make it up to my bro.”

    I dunno if that’s really necessary. You said your feelings messages. No more work necessary except for sticking with your feelings.

  95.  #95millie on February 16, 2011 at 10:36 pm

    hi sirens,found this site by accident am so grateful. i sooo need this kind of honest nurturing and husband of 16 years walked out at christmas just his bag and computer and walked up the road and thats it. I asked him to please at least sit down and talk he said no and that i had shitted him for a long time. he worked in another state last year and this and had come home at christmas to visit the kids(3) and me. of course this isnt the whole story, no there are no other people involved . but i need advise on how to communicate to my husband, its been 5 weeks now and we are communicating via phone and skype. but i know this is only because i wrote him letters explaining how all this made ME feel and also the kids. he has now said he is coming back next year to try and work things out, but jhow do i communicate to someone 2000 km away in a positive way to heal things. in the 16 years i have always shared my feelings and not in an agressive way but not once has he shared anything, nothing ever. i have loved reading everyones comments and they have truelly helped me in this dark period.

  96.  #96Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:39 pm


    RE: #83 – Yay, Siren! Happy for your news!

  97.  #97Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:41 pm


    RE: #94 – I mean work hard to earn extra money and pay him back. Literal work.

  98.  #98Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    80 LG

    Thank you, that means more to me than you will ever know.

  99.  #99Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    Brenda: ya, I can imagine it’s frustrating to see mom going without when it seems like he has so much. But, as I’m sure you already know, you will have the power to inspire him to take care of mom if he feels respected and emotionally safe with you while you also hold clear boundaries for yourself. Also great practice for your man.

    Btw, will we be attending your wedding as well?

  100.  #100Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    Brenda: I was worried that work meant overfunctioning which would def. Not be necessary. 😉

  101.  #101Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:46 pm


    Welcome. Sorry to hear about your situation.

  102.  #102Buttery on February 16, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    I’d like to go to vegas and get married. I dont want my family around.

  103.  #103millie on February 16, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    to explain further my husband is in the army and has been posted away for two years. to stay in our house with the kids was a joint decision, at the end of this year he is due to be posted again. hopefully back to where we live or we would more with him next time. he never once bought up anything last year and so i feel so angry lost, confused, sad helpless and deserted. for the last two years have been very sick but was feeling so much better at the end of last year. have now been looking after my self much better, you know exericse, diet etc. the things that i did before getting sick , but what else can i do . i need girl love at the moment and i think i have come to the right place.

  104.  #104Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:49 pm


    RE: #99 – You said, “you will have the power to inspire him to take care of mom if he feels respected and emotionally safe with you while you also hold clear boundaries for yourself. Also great practice for your man.”

    Perfection! Yes, that is a very good goal for this practice.

    Yes, you are all invited to my wedding! Are you coming, LG? 🙂 It will most likely be held in PA.

  105.  #105Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 10:51 pm

    Brenda: of course!

  106.  #106Lucy on February 16, 2011 at 10:53 pm

    ack! lol. shannon, i am trying to find the erika posts you mentioned… not easy to find stuff on my phone… but i found her only 2011 blog post and it was about how uninteresting and undesirable sex is!!! Lol. she cracks me up. and Amber thinks *I* am consistently inconsistent! 😉 probably erika and i have a lot in common hehe. but i don’t think i have EVER felt sex was uninteresting or undesirable (maybe with a particular man, yes, but not in general!) 🙂

  107.  #107Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 10:54 pm


    Good! 🙂 I don’t have a date set yet, but I can tell you he will be a wonderful, loving, compassionate man! Your puppy, his girlfriend, and your man are invited, too! 🙂

  108.  #108Eternity on February 16, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    95 Millie

    So sorry for your pain. LDRs are so very very hard at the best of times. Feels good to hear you are taking care of yourself.

    Learning to express your feelings in the way that is used here may help. There are many wonderful and giving people who I’m sure will be able to offer advice.

    If you are looking for support with a military LDR, there is another wonderful community on the forums of, with quite a few military spouses, for support and advice.

  109.  #109Brenda on February 16, 2011 at 11:21 pm

    Please bear with me while I process a bit more. This situation has crystallized in my mind to this:

    The justification defense is what comes to mind. It is a legal term used for such cases as when someone technically “trespasses” into a building…but they had a darn good reason for doing so…the building was burning and there was a baby screaming in the window. So they broke a lesser law to do a greater good, and that justifies breaking the law.

    In this case, the lesser “law” was paying back my brother. But my Mom needed pants desperately, and I happened upon some in a distant town, where I was not likely to be again. So I justified not paying him back as scheduled because of her need being greater and outweighing that.

    I see disparity in part of his family being lavished while part of his family is wearing rags.

    What do you think?

  110.  #110LonePlum on February 16, 2011 at 11:25 pm

    Brenda 43

    Next time you want to buy something knowing it will forward an expense to your brother, send him a text to ask him it is fine with him.
    It is not your money you have no right to judge he does not need it. Or to judge he should give it to your mother. The law judges such things, not the individuals.

    It might be true that he does not need it and it might not be true, but since it is not your money, you should not even go there. Your part is to check with him so to give him a chance to readjust his financial balance.

    It does not matter how much money he makes and whatever he does with it, it is his own privilege. Judging his expenses and his style of life is not related to the situation you ask us to comment.
    He could be on benefit money or he can make millions, it is the same situation
    He had inserted in his financial plans the money you spent. That money, as little as it is, was part of his balance.
    If you had clearly told him you were going to use these 25 dollars, he would have saved from somewhere else the 20 dollars that were missing in his bank to complete the phone. (not sure I understood his text about this part, though)

    You were defensive about your intentions, but he does not criticize them at all.
    They are not the point.
    He did say he understands and it is no big deal.
    He seems to understand how your mind worked when you took the decision to use his money without warning him. He knows you meant well. He is not criticizing your intentions.

    He was just telling you facts
    The 20 dollars are missing in his bank
    You judged on your own that he can afford unexpected expenses. He is only stating he can’t trust your judgment.
    He was informing you.

    You could have said “I feel awful my decision contributed to your troubles. I should have not assumed you could afford it. I should have checked with you. I am sorry. I will not again take a financial decision for Mom ‘s comfort, without checking with you. ”


  111.  #111Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    Brenda: I just had this image of you and your man and your children. I couldn’t tell if the children were his, yours together, or adopted but they’re really cute.

  112.  #112LonePlum on February 16, 2011 at 11:29 pm


    I had not seen your post n°109 when I posted mine
    And I’ve go to go now, sorry.


  113.  #113millie on February 16, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    thank you eternity and brenda for responding

  114.  #114Laughing Goddess on February 16, 2011 at 11:33 pm

    Brenda: re 109

    Here are my honest thoughts

    I think you are wanting to justify your choice so that you don’t feel bad. Your story is a fair argument. His is as well.

    The main thing is, you don’t have to feel bad about what you did, then no need to justify.

    You did what you thought was right. Fair enough. You had good intentions. Your brother snapped at you. You snapped at him. You realized your part in the drama. You apologized. You move on. No big deal.

    No need to persecue yourself or your brother. We’re all growing.

    What do you think and/or feel?

  115.  #115Jilly on February 16, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    LG @85 LOL…yes..VERY sensual pipe layer!!!!best ive ever had infact 🙂

  116.  #116Eternity on February 17, 2011 at 12:23 am

    Got an email from GSOHGuy today. His profile made me giggle. Had big expectations when I opened it to find a copy/paste get to know you email asking what my experience has been on the site and what I did in my spare time.

    Yikes, what a let down. His profile was so funny but here he talks about getting the results he wants from the site. Ooo feels a bit icky, eek I dont want to be a result. I dont even know what that means >.<

    Think the message will go something like.

    Thank you for your email. It felt good to hear from you. I was giggling when I read your profile. Where do you get your sense of humour from? I spend my spare time blah blah. I feel uncomfortable? a bit weird? talking about other dates I've had from this site. I'd rather know more about you instead. What do you think?

  117.  #117Eternity on February 17, 2011 at 12:24 am

    85 LG

    omg all this talk of pipe laying haha, reminds me of what I missed in a LDR 🙂

  118.  #118Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 12:51 am


    RE: #111 – Awww, cool, thanks for sharing that! What a nice thought!

  119.  #119Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 1:00 am


    RE: #114 – In general, I like your thought path there.

    What I expressed in 109, tho, was a definite shift in my thoughts and feelings. I concluded that what I did really WAS right. And that I really am NOT sorry, while still agreeing that it’s good and healthy to continue to relate to my brother in a productive way.

    I concluded that the mother of adult children is as important in the family as the children of adult children, and that if the children are lavished while the parent goes in poverty then something is wrong in that family. And I intend to communicate that to my brothers and sisters-in-law in a gentle way. We should all be willing to make some sacrifices for our Mom. She made a ton of sacrifices for us a few decades ago.

    I am weighing all this, as petty as it may appear at the surface, in light of my strong desire to take my Mom out of the nursing home and have her live with me. I don’t think I will be successful UNLESS I have the devotion of my brothers and sisters-in-law as well. Her care is a huge responsibility. But she’s not heavy; she’s my Mother.

    I think they are set against me sharing a house with her because they don’t want it to disrupt their lifestyles. They’re not willing to sacrifice much for her.

    I don’t like seeing my Mom perpetually sad and lonely in the nursing home, longing to be with family. I don’t like seeing the nurses aides making mistakes like putting her roommate’s teeth in the cup that belongs to my Mom, for her teeth. I don’t like seeing her clothes lost and faded. I don’t like seeing her stuck in a dining room full of coughing, hacking people that gross her out. I want her home with me, where she belongs.

  120.  #120Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 2:02 am

    I’m praying for that too Brenda.

  121.  #121kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 2:10 am

    If I don’t hear from my guy by his birthday (4/3/11), what are your thoughts on me calling him to wish him happy birthday?

  122.  #122kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 2:42 am

    “893: Femininewoman says:

    RE 866 Kaitlyn: it is fine to be triggered here I think Rori encourages it. I am also now wondering if you might have practiced giving to get? Or the type who keeps score? Doesn’t always work with men.”

    I give when it strikes my fancy. No expectations. I don’t keep score. Just a modicum of appreciation is all I need.

    I know now that though my guy was the one suggesting we exchange gifts yet never got me one due to ‘his busy career and trying to finish his novel, his dad, the blizzard, sand in his vagina, whatever,’ I shouldn’t have made a big deal of it like I did and should’ve given him space to give to me in other ways.

    Or am I being too permissive/ doormat-esque?

  123.  #123Ann on February 17, 2011 at 3:27 am

    Quick question….my Live In boyfriend (he’s 40 I’m 35 we both have 12 year old children) is going on a weekend with his 40 year old single drinking friends. It will be for 3 days. I REALLY don’t like the idea and told him how I feel, I feel nervous, I feel worried….I don’t ever want to tell him what to do and what not to do, but I don’t like this being he is the ONLY one in a relationship out of the 4 other guys who have NO children and no interest in having a long term committment or marriage to any woman no matter what. He’s going. I tried to put a “girls” weekend together the same weekend he’s going, it didn’t work my gf is busy. So I can go the weekend BEFORE he goes with my gf, but my bf asked if I was doing it to “get back at him”. I told him no, not at all, but why am I staying home while you are going out? That doesn’t feel fair at all. Any advice? I’m freaking out. This is a GREAT man, marriage is on the table and he’s picked a date, etc etc….but I’m not into a man who wants to spend weekends away with his SINGLE 40 year old friends who drink and smoke pot. I am a mother, I don’t do these things even when my 12 year old is away with her father every other weekend. All my friends are married, with children or at least a child or boyfriend. His friends aren’t. No children, no gf’s and all the freedom in the world. This man also lives in MY house………Am I just acting jealous? It really makes me feel uncomfortable…I would never know if he was doing or did something like cheat. I don’t trust his friends and don’t like the amount of drinking they do, plus they will be in bars all 3 nights/days. I’ve told my bf how I feel, he’s going. There’s no discussion. This is about the third or fourth “weekend” trip he’s taken with his single friends in 8 months, one was a four day fishing trip, another was a weekend poker game, golfing, etc. this up coming trip is to Atlantic City. I don’t do these types of trips and my friends are NOT single and don’t drink for a past time or smoke pot as his friends do. Plus, I’m a MOTHER!! He has no clue on being a parent to his 12 year old as she’s always been with the mother (he was never married to her and has never lived with her and the daughter, he found out the ex gf was pregnant 2 or 3 months after they broke up permanently) I just need advice on how to handle this without freaking out. I’m really not happy about it at ALL. Thank you!!

  124.  #124archerie on February 17, 2011 at 3:50 am

    Brenda , ‘

    That story amazes me @43.
    Is his second name CONTROL?
    We are talking $20 . There can be no valid reason for him projecting his financial anxieties on to you and trying to control your generosity and thoughtfulness and paint you as Badgirl Brenda for doing stuff for your Mother and being generous and thoughtful .

    I say GO BAG YOUR HEAD S !!!

    I will also add that this seems to be an example of something I notice from a certain type of man I have had email exchanges with. I call these guys the Snipers.

    These guys take my feeling messages and seek to invalidate them in some way. They either poke fun at me for having those feelings, or they reply with snide or sarcastic comments ..straight into attack mode.

    I figure these guys have huge defenses against emotional connection and get terrified when feelings are mentioned. But they re seeking to invalidate or argue against ,someone elses internal experience , which cannot be done . This seems to frustrtate them greatly because they cant “logic” it away , and so they BITE…ouch!!

    Your brother may have some of these traits do you think?

    Does Rori mention this in her programs ?

  125.  #125Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 3:57 am


    Your question leaves me wondering how much you trust your man. What is his character like? It sounds like you have some fear that his friends will talk him into behaviors that he wouldn’t normally participate in. Is his character that weak?

    It is a healthy thing for partners to spend some time apart – to participate in activities separate from one another so that they actually have something interesting to talk about and so that they don’t get to the point of relying on the other person to fulfill all of their social needs.

    It sounds, a bit, to me like you fear that you are somehow losing something by his going away. The fact that you want to plan something with your friends as well tells me that the going away part isn’t really a problem…or you wouldn’t be choosing to do it yourself. In my eyes, it seems that the problem you have with it is that you don’t have any control over what he does when he isn’t in front of you. Why does that scare you? Does he have a track record of cheating?

    Also, you end your question listing various positive qualities of you and your friends and negative qualities of your man. So, this is the man you chose. You don’t really get to say…I make good choices and you don’t therefore you have to make the choices that I say are right. You either accept him for who he is or you kick him to the curb.

    If he is not trustworthy, why do you want him?
    If he participates in behaviors that you find unacceptable, why do you want him?
    The fact that you are a mother is not his fault.
    The fact that all of your friends are married with children is not his fault.
    Why must he change his lifestyle, his friendships, for you? You chose him and you want to change him?

    I think there is something deeper going on…what are you afraid that you’re losing? Are you envious of his freedom?

    OK..these are just random thoughts, but they are what came up as I read your post. Dig deeper…feel the feelings that are coming up because they are messengers of the truth. I hope this doesn’t sound harsh because I, obviously, don’t know the whole story, but these things jumped out at me.

    You can’t control him…you can only choose your own happiness, take care of yourself and engage with the kind of man that makes you feel good.

    Hope this helps in some small way. Pam

  126.  #126archerie on February 17, 2011 at 4:01 am

    Hi Ann,

    I think it gets down to your imagination is hurting you , not helping at all.

    The answer is smile , wish him a nice weekend, say nothing more, get busy , do not discuss it again. Do not mention it again, smile , and LEAN BACK .

    Make plans , go out, date yourself. Go out with your girlfriend too the preceding weekend , but as a “personal space” weekend. Do not explain, justify , argue, debate , just lean back and do it.. If he mentions you “getting back ” at him , thats only because you have attempted to control his life and his outcome and blamed him for hurting you in some way. Or else why would he think you need to lash out in return?

    So what if he gets drunk, stoned , or laid ??
    Then he may not be the man you actually want if he does dishonour a valid commitment.

    And if you suggest he is going to that is very demeaning to him.

    Sorry , I do understand jealous feelings but the basis is personal insecurity , not what he is doing. This sounds harsh. If he has previously cheated, well dump him now , and siop trying to change or control him.

  127.  #127Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 4:13 am


    Hi. Welome to Siren Island. I just wanted to let you know that I’m so sorry that you’re feeling so sad and lost. I live in a military town and hear, all to often, how difficult it is for women to ‘hold down the fort’ while there man is away. It is a helpless feeling to be a single mom when you aren’t single.

    I wonder if your illness isn’t related to the stress that you’re feeling. I’m glad you’re taking care of yourself and hope you begin to feel better soon.

    You asked, “How to I communicate to someone 2000km away in order to heal things?” Wow…I’m not in a LDR, but this just makes the process harder. I’m wondering if you might find help from a military wives’ group, online LDR support groups (as Eternity suggested) and surround yourself with supportive friends.

    I hope you find some peace and solace here. Sending loving vibes your way, Millie.


  128.  #128Ann on February 17, 2011 at 4:23 am

    I feel SO envoius of his freedom!! And I told him that. I don’t get the chances or choices to do weekend things away, and I so wish I did. No it is not his fault and I don’t want to change him. i just feel that he misrepresented himself and now he’s living in my house!! For the first 5 or six months of us “dating” he said he isn’t interested in spending his time with his single friends he wants a wife to spend his time with. Now he’s living here and going on trips when he says he has no money, helps me and my daughter by living here with groceries only. He has NEVER offered to take me away anywhere even someplace inexpensive. When I want to go out to dinner, I PAY. Other things have come up that I feel I’ve been lied to or had the truth sugar coated are the first 3 months I was dating him he said his daughter’s mother who has 3 kids by 3 different men was MARRIED to the man she lives now with. Month 3 or 4 it comes out NO they aren’t married. This bothers me a LOT. I was married to my daughter’s father for 10 years. He knew this. He was married but to a woman who wasn’t his kid’s mother. And for 2.5 years. No I don’t think he will cheat, but I don’t know him under the influence of POT and being DRUNK. He is in a TERRIBLE financial situation which I only found out because he kept that from me until around month 6 or 7, which is a major reason why he’s living here. RENT free. He gave me a sort of guilt trip as I said no living together before marriage the DAY I met him for our frist date. He said he had no where else to go after the living arrangements went sour with his roommate (male). He said he would have to sleep in his office at work. So I reluctantly said ok, live here. I let him know it was not what I really wanted. But I caved. I do love this man. Then I find out while he was living with his roommate he was smoking pot after I asked him point blank if he was or not and he said no. I’m not into that type of behaviour!! I find that out while he’s living with me already. He’s given at least 3 other women engagement rings, then asks me, do you really want an engagement ring? They are SO expensive. YES I f ing DO want one? What am I chopped liver???? Why is he in all the debt he’s in? Because he bought a girlfriend a HOUSE!! He only saw her once a week on a Friday, dated her for 1/5 years, she never met his daughter, but he buys her a house. She never moved in, ended up cheating on him with a guy from their bowling league so he is STILL after 5 years trying to short sale this house. It’s his own fault he’s in debt, but I pick up the pieces. Then he tells me there are things that go on at his work (he works with women not just men, obviously) that he doesn’t tell me about because he doesn’t want me to get upset. Why, what are they saying or doing? Yes, I have had relationships with my ex husband who I know was cheating, my ex bf who I lived with who I’m pretty certain was cheating. Do I worry because of my past? Yes!! I’m trying not to, but all these things that he tells me one thing then the truth comes out months later make me not trust him. I laid everything that I want and don’t want and can handle and can’t handle regarding having a relationship right from the start. he knows exactly how I feel about everything!! I don’t want a man that goes away a LOT with his friends, that was the demise of my marriage. It starts out as a weekend here and there then turns into all the time. If you want to be single, stay single. I want a man that wants to be with me. Every now and then, fine, go out. Go out all the time, I don’t want it!! I’m just so hurt, it seems as if he isn’t truthful for fear of my reaction, so I know he’s holding back. I just don’t know how much or what he’s holding back. I just don’t know what to do. My daughter is so attached to him, he’s living here. Talking gets me no where but upset and I can’t speak my truth in feeling messages, I’m too overrun with emotion and hurt and anger. Do I not go away with my gf now? I really don’t want to!! It’s nothing I would be doing if he wasn’t going away himself, that’s the truth. Staying home alone all weekend doing nothing, is going to feel vrey bad to me. I just don’t know what to do or how to fix myself. It’s going to end up pushing him right out the door, maybe that’s ok, but I don’t think it would feel very good. I just don’t know what to do or how to fix me!!

  129.  #129archerie on February 17, 2011 at 4:45 am

    Oh My Goodness Ann,

    Now this is the truth here you are beginning to uncover the feelings. Start with feeling messages ..”I feel …??? ” This means STOP looking at the mechanics of who is or isnt doing the right or wrong thing and focus deep down in YOU .What are you feeling?

    it reads like this to me as an observer,
    angry , furious , seething,
    let down , anxious , fearful,
    confused , bitter , hurt , hurt , hurt..

    Rori says you MUST stop overfunctioning . That means stop everything you are doing to make the relationship “work”. Ask your self what are you doing out of FEAR that he might leave or not give you a loving relationship ??

    Are you not asking for contributions to the household budget ? (I personally would not want a man around me who wasntn equally contributing AT LEAST – but that is my boundary , my rule for me)

    Are you stuffing down your feelings so much that they are overrunning you with “emotion and hurt and anger? “and sapping your self esteem.

    Do you have boundaries and do you know what they are ? An example of a boundary might be ” I do not accept a man in my home who is not engaged and date set” (if that is what you want) , or ” I do not financially support a man with whom I am in relationship unless illness intervenes and I am fully commited in marriage”. Or ” I do not pay for dates with my man. If he doesnt offer to take me out and pay , i do not suggest an outing with him. I go out with a girlfriend instead ”

    I hear such a cry of despair from you. For me that came from a LACK of boundaries . That was the cause of my low self esteem , not anything the man “did ” to me or failed to do . It was ALL about my choices. I felt so powerless and frustrated because I gave HIM my choices and power to make me happy.

    There is a lot of information in the blogs. I encourage you to read and practice here re feeling messages and boundaries.

  130.  #130Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 4:48 am

    Wow, Ann – that’s a lot. Hope you don’t mind if I pull out some key points that really speak to me:

    “I feel SO envoius of his freedom!! And I told him that. I don’t get the chances or choices to do weekend things away, and I so wish I did.” It’s OK to feel envious, but it’s not OK to expect him to give up his freedom as well just because you have a child.

    You go on to talk about how he deceived you and how you are overfunctioning in the relationship. You are not a victim to these things…you can choose to accept that he has been deceitful or not. You can choose to stop overfunctioning or not.

    The lifestyle of his daughter’s mother is none of your business. The fact that she is not married to her partner is none of your business. Why is it important to you to feel superior to her? Why is it important to compare your 10 year marriage with child to his 2.5 year marriage without one? Instead of inferring what this means about him…what does your judgement about it and need to feel, as I see it, better than him, mean about you? Especially, why do you judge his daughter’s mother for living with her boyfriend when you are doing the same thing…no matter the reasons?

    You are overfunctioning, devaluing yourself in the relationship. Why do you want a man who has lied to you and is taking advantage of you financially? Why would he have been sleeping in his office if he has all of these single friends? Why did he need you to rescue him (not the job of a feminine woman) instead of going to his friends for help?

    What do you love about him?

    So much of what you share makes no sense to me. If he owns a home…the one he bought for his girlfriend, why doesn’t he live there? why does he have to live with you? I believe this man is toxic and you are behaving in a majorly codependent way.

    “Then he tells me there are things that go on at his work (he works with women not just men, obviously) that he doesn’t tell me about because he doesn’t want me to get upset.” Umm…doesn’t his telling you this make you upset. His actions to not match his stated intentions.

    “I laid everything that I want and don’t want and can handle and can’t handle regarding having a relationship right from the start.” You stated your boundaries but you didn’t hold them…in his eyes, this means that you didn’t mean them. If you don’t hold to your boundaries, it is not his fault. If you still struggle with trust because you’ve been cheated on before, you might want to seek counseling rather than dumping your fears on every successive man that comes into your life. It really sounds like you need to CD and take care of youself. Just because you are a mother doesn’t mean you must sacrifice yourself and your needs…and then judge everyone else for not doing the same.

    “It seems like he isn’t truthful because he’s afraid of my reaction.” This is important an important piece of the puzzle. Only you can change your reactions. Why do you react in a way that would encourage him to be not truthful?

    Ultimately, I need to stop responding. I find myself feeling overwhelmed by your victim stance. This is a big trigger for me…when people choose powerlessness and helplessness instead of empowerment and behaving like and adult I just want to throw my hands up in the air and say…fine, when you want to actually make a change rather than continue blaming, let me know and maybe we can talk.

    Ann, I think you need to “chunk this down.” You have so many complaints and issues going on. What is the ONE thing you want to work on TODAY? Maybe the sirens can help with that.

    I do feel compassion for your situation, I just feel frustrated.

  131.  #131Ann on February 17, 2011 at 4:59 am

    I don’t mean to frustrate anyone and I am not the victim. I’m doing it all to myself and then lashing out at him because I’m not telling myself or him my truths or standing firm on my boundaries. Thank you, thank you all so much!! It’s ME I need to work on, I’m hurting he’s not hurting me. Just thank you!! I’m taking steps right now with self help e books and things on jealousy, I can’t afford or do counseling, which I’m SURE I need. I have no insurance (health insurance) my company went bankrupt in December, therefore no cobra either – no job, and am self pitying. I’m sorry to everyone, but just thank you for being tough so I can stop feeling sorry for myself and my own choices and start fixing my own issues not blame everyone around me. Thank you!!!!!!

  132.  #132archerie on February 17, 2011 at 4:59 am

    And I agree with Pamelala, this does read like you are in “victim stance” .

    The only way out of that really in the end is to assume he WILL NOT CHANGE.

    Then ask yourself what will YOU change about this that involves you only , your behaviour , your decisions , your thoughts, your beliefs?
    And change one thing at a time.
    Stop trying to drive the relationship or whip him into shape . He is as he is..

    You are attached to that , but do you want it forever, assuming he WILL NOT CHANGE ???

    Roris wrote about this recently ..its just the way he rolls… “A Man Just has to cheat”

  133.  #133archerie on February 17, 2011 at 5:01 am

    Ann ,

    the blogs have so much good stuff and its all for free!

  134.  #134Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 5:04 am


    Yay! OK, so you get it that you can only change yourself and need to stop being jealous and blaming in order to change to come. Now, I’m feeling hopeful.

    I love archerie’s suggestion that you operate out of the belief that HE WILL NOT CHANGE. Ok…starting point. If he never changes, can he offer you the life you want to live?

    Tough question, but necessary. The answer to that question will help guide you to your happily ever after.

  135.  #135cateyes3 on February 17, 2011 at 5:04 am

    Good morning/evening Sirens!

    Today is going to be a great day! For the last 2 days, I’ve leaned back and today will be no exception. I feel the need to start and try the CDing and I feel scared.

    This is something that is very new to me. Since my husband’s death in ’08, I hadn’t been with a guy (or felt anything for him since this last Jan and I panicked. I became obsessive and wanting to control him. Rather than letting him go at his own pace and lead. I scared him off and I feel thankful to the sirens on this blog for helping me to realize some things that I need to work on.

    I feel soo out of sync sometimes but, baby steps! Just do the best that I can in taking care of myself and my children.

    Hope everyone here has an awesome day!


  136.  #136Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 5:09 am

    @102: Buttery says:
    “…I’d like to go to vegas and get married. I dont want my family around…”

    Vegas, hmmm, maybe you could have fifty bridesmaids.


  137.  #137Ann on February 17, 2011 at 5:19 am

    I have been thinking about the fact that I have to accept him and his life for who and what he is. I don’t know if I can accept it or not. I really don’t. I feel hurt that things are coming out NOW after all these months that are showing me the TRUE him. I sort of thought he was someone else in another way and now he’s living here. It feels as if I let myself be duped, or lead along sort of. It’s something I really need to think about. i don’t know if I can accept him for who he really is and I don’t know if he can ever give me the life I want to live. It’s just hard for me to deal with. I am very attached to him and never wanted to be anything but strong and sireney and independent which I was before him…how funny how in 8/9 months here I am codependent and controling, self pitying with no self esteem when I met him I was a TOTAL confident, no bullshit siren…seems as though I changed, not him, huh? I need to get a complete grip on myself!! HAHA Thank you all, and I do read all of Rori’s posts on things as well as the cheating thing. He’s not a cheater. I’m just being ridiculous. And as for why he can’t live with his single friends, they want RENT from him. Why can’t he live in his short sale house? It’s being rented by the “potential” buyers who live there and are waiting for the bank’s approval (for a year now) on the final price. And I am wrong to judge the mother of his child due to her lifestyle, that issue is from my bf’s parents who feel the need to tell ME how wonderful she is, talking about her NON stop whenever I’m around his parents and how I should be friends with her (that doesn’t feel good to me at all and it’s not something I want to do) and my bf telling me she got pregnant on purpose and he never got a choice on being a father or not. (This is more than my bf just playing a victim by the way, she’s done this to 2 other men, it’s true). Plus the fact he won’t have any more children (his online profile where I met him said “maybe” to more kids, another lie – he was meeting sub-par women saying NO to kids – he said this) due to his being 40 with a 12 year old although I said I would have more being im only 35. Jealous that she has 3 and I will only ever have one child as long as I stay with this man.

  138.  #138Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 5:26 am

    @109: Brenda says:

    “…I see disparity in part of his family being lavished while part of his family is wearing rags.
    What do you think?…”

    IMHO, “the law” would not be with you on this one. Finding a good sale on pants would not equal saving baby.

    You had a financial agreement with your brother. You broke it. He relied on our agreement to his detriment.

    Now we have posters on the blog bad mouthing him and calling him names, mostly on your say so. I felt a little upset reading it.

    Should your brother contribute more? I think so. But that’s another issue. A issue for you to work out together rather in this way which was IMHO, stepping into his business and unilaterally rewriting the agreement to better suit you.


  139.  #139Ella on February 17, 2011 at 5:27 am

    I have won @ Solitaire twice now since yesterday! Yay 🙂

  140.  #140cateyes3 on February 17, 2011 at 5:28 am

    Jilly: Feel soo happy for you! This gives me hope. 🙂

  141.  #141Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 5:32 am


    These are good insights. I find it interesting that his friends are the ones who set boundaries and would require rent, but they are the ones he wants to spend time with/party with.

    It is rare for a man to respect a woman who is letting him use her.

    Really tough situation, but good lessons to be learned if you will allow yourself to be brave and learn them. It’s important to remember that just because two people love one another, that doesn’t mean that they are good for one another.

    Sending hugs,

  142.  #142Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 5:34 am

    sorry a little unclear here — left out word –but I see once again Lone Plum has done a much better job than I…

    “…A issue for you to work out together rather than in this way which was IMHO, stepping into his business and unilaterally rewriting the agreement to better suit you.”


  143.  #143Ella on February 17, 2011 at 5:39 am

    Just want to riff out some negative energy…

    Mr B

    Don’t you EVER EVER contact me again!
    Don’t you DARE ever ask me for anythingagain…
    Don’t even TALK to me about relationship!
    Ha! You don’t know the meaning of the word!

    I don’t want to hear it.

    I feel SO ANGRY that you continue asking me for stuff and yet haven’t lifted a finger to look after me! Not one thing.

    You abandoned me when I was sick and I needed you.

    You left me in pain and hurting. You left me when I felt vulnerable bc you just aren’t strong enough.

    Well whatever Mr you made your choice.

    You don’t get me! NO – you don’t get the prize.
    Don’t pass go, don’t collect $200, you leave with nothing!

    Except your powder.

    Have that.

    And one day you might look back and see what was being offered to you.

    You might think ‘there was someone there who cared about me! I had a chance at a good life with a loving woman, and I wasn’t able to step up!’




    This time it is… no more.

    Had enough of you.

    I feel sick around you. I feel tired of struggling and wondering if you care and trying to piece it all together in my mind.

    You weak, pathetic little man.

    So many chances and you just didn’t.

    Like a little girl flower just sitting there.

    Told ya I’m not gonna row the boat…

    And look what happnened to the women who did. You stayed with them for a while cus it was easy, but it didn’t work! The passion went!

    Lie I told you consequences help us learn, getting away with stuff is lieing to ourselves.

    But you choose the easy way…

    You will get your consequences.

    Maybe you will learn.

    But I am out.

    I’m done. Need something better. Need someone stronger.

    Need a manly man to step up and be there when I’m sick, with pints of icecream and soup!

    It is so simple – yo are so dumb… I’m not going to spell it out for you anymore.

    You can’t meet my needs – I accept that.

    So now I must leave you alone.

    And you must leave me alone.

    I hate you.
    f8ck you f8ck you f8ck you!

    Arghhh hGrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

    Begone! Lil floppy, insubstantial man.

    Not for me… not for me… not for me!
    I feel hateful.


  144.  #144Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 5:41 am

    @121: kaitlyn says:
    “If I don’t hear from my guy by his birthday (4/3/11), what are your thoughts on me calling him to wish him happy birthday?”



  145.  #145Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 5:43 am

    It’s another 4 hour sleep night…this is getting to be a trend. UGH.

    However, I woke up feeling like something has shifted with P. I feel clearer with regard to who he is (lovely, dedicated, passionate – introverted, hopeless, passive). I see his flaws. I recognize some key characteristics that I need in a partner, but which he is lacking.

    My heart doesn’t feel quite as tied to him.

    I feel more and more sure that I’m going to be OK if he doesn’t come back. Just saying that feels like a tug in my chest…a grieving. I guess it makes sense to grieve over good things when it means the death of a dream, but the birth of a brand new future.


    Releasing P to his future, to healing and to the love he needs.

  146.  #146Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 5:45 am


    There was one thing in my whole trauma/drama story that I didn’t mention and this is where I am really struggling.

    M and my sister have been friends for years. When he told her that he had feelings for me at the beginning of January, she immediatly starting to tell him things about me that were negative and things about my past. He already knew all of these things because I had been real and open and honest with him through out our friendship. I dismissed it initially because after he told her this, she sent me a message asking me when I was going to tell her this and also mentioned that she had had a crush on him for years. I did not know this and to me, a crush is a crush. Heck, I have a crush on Matthew McConaughey, have had for years. And a crush is not the same as loving someone. She told me not to tell him, she never would and he didn’t have a clue. But as soon as she did this, she turned around and told him that she had a crush on him and proceeded to treat me like shit for the last seven weeks. I did not express to her or to M how I felt about that, that I felt betrayed in the worst way and still do. She also told him that if it was someone that I had a crush on that she was interested in, she wouldn’t move forward in that relationship, she would never do that.

    I have not talked to her all. I can’t. I feel that if I say anything, it will forever impact our relationship and at this point, I do not feel that I want one with her, ever. I feel betrayed. She sits in judgement of me, for my past..something that happened over ten years ago that I have made amends with, she has never wanted me to have the things that she does, and this includes her friends, clothing, rings..things that really don’t matter. In fact, she said when all this came out at the beginning of january.. “why can’t you just let my friends be my friends.”

    I need some thoughtful guidance here and for now, am remaining silent, to both. I am thinking about what is best for me, what I need to do to move over and through this, without neglecting my feelings of hurt and sorrow for this.

    I have talked and will continue to talk to a therapist to help me through this as well. I felt so good to be heard and validated with the above when I spewed it to her.


    Hugs to you all and thank you so much.


  147.  #147Mercedes on February 17, 2011 at 6:17 am

    I’m sick and getting worse and I have to be at work because I’m taking off two days next week to go to Arizona.

    How do we fix a cold with congestion and coughing? I can’t take cold medicine because it makes me feel so disconnected and woozy that I can’t concentrate at work let alone teach a class of new people.

    So far I’m of course doing vitamin C and also airborn (but I’m afraid it’s a bit too late for that to help), acai and hot tea with honey (but I don’t know what the best kind of tea is for a cold so I’m doing green – it’s the only kind of decaf I have at home but I’m more than willing to stop at the store after work to get something better).

    What else? Thoughts or ideas? What kills a cold fast…oh…and I fear I might be getting a fever. Not here yet but I sort of feel that coming on.

    Ladies…any advice will be followed. I’ll try whatever. J is out of town tonight and back tomorrow and he feels terrible for leaving me while I’m not well so I want to feel even a little bit better when he gets back. Plus, I don’t want to be a total downer on the trip to AZ.


    Much Love,

  148.  #148Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:23 am

    @139: Ella says:
    “…I have won @ Solitaire twice now since yesterday! Yay …”

    Have you tried FreeCell?


  149.  #149T-Girl on February 17, 2011 at 6:31 am

    Mercedes, so sorry to hear you are getting sick! I am in AZ and cold and flu season is in full swing here. I myself am getting over an upper respiratory virus. You can go to the dr. and take a flu test – if it is the flu they can prescribe Tamiflu. Hope you feel better. 🙁

  150.  #150Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 6:32 am

    RE 146 Lori C reading these comments brought back to memory my belief that my mother has been jealous of me for many years. She got married when she was 50 years old. My first proposal for marriage came when I was 24 before she got married. She set up my father against him and my father went ballistic. Mind you the guy had messed up some but I had forgiven him and was willing to move forward. It might not have been wise on my part at the time but he had been consistently good towards me for years. Fast forward 10 years later when we reconnected and were looking over what took place. He suggested that when she saw the ring he felt she was jealous. My dad wanted to marry her from she was about 19 but she did not want to. Looking back as well as reviewing other things that have happened I have to accept that she is still jealous of me, having achieved some things in life that she never did. It hurts still and I sometimes feel betrayed by it but I still in the quiet of my heart and my spirit forgive her.

    What I am saying here is that the people who have the power to hurt us the most are those that are closest to us and those that know us the best. I am not convinced that you need to do anything now outside of healing yourself. However, if I may suggest something radical here, I would say fast forward your life in your mind to the point where you are lying on your deathbed. Ask yourself who would you want around you and what would you want to say to them? What would you want your life to look like, lying there and looking back? Is love important enough to you to allow your sister, that guy and yourself to be happy? Is it important enough to you to release everyone to do whatever they think they need to do make their lives happy?

    What happened to you is unfortunate but put in the right perspective, as in now rather than later, could have saved you a lot of heartache if you learnt 10 years from now that this was still going on behind your back. I believe the quicker you purge yourself from this and start looking for your real soulmate the better off you will be. As a matter of fact if you keep quiet about it and go on living your happy life, it will put in your power rather than you coming across as trying to force something. It might be best to just leave it alone after letting them know that you do not wish to discuss it. Give yourself some time but keep moving forward. When they come back at a later date it will have lost its impact and your brain might be better able to express your experience to them if they are still interested. Right it might just go into emotional hijack.

    I apologize if I come across as trite but I can’t see any other way around it. I am not convinced that you need to tell them at this point in time how you are feeling. It just seems like lifting up bandage off a raw wound.

  151.  #151T-Girl on February 17, 2011 at 6:32 am

    Feeling sireny today for the first time in a long time! Such a good evening last night…

  152.  #152Mercedes on February 17, 2011 at 6:34 am

    T-Girl – thank you…probably not going to the doc just yet (but maybe this weekend before we leave if I get worse). Well…at least all be in good company in AZ…we’ll all be sick together. lol 🙂

    Much Love,

  153.  #153Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:36 am


    Last night I bought some fresh ginger for tea (stole the idea from Daria!) and I was looking at this:


  154.  #154Mercedes on February 17, 2011 at 6:45 am

    SLV: Are you kidding me??? Did they write that article for me??? OMG! I am going to the store to get fresh ginger. I have some in a jar at home for sushi but I think I’ll go with fresh for the tea.

    Oh I hope this helps! Thank you!! and Thank you Daria for posting the original so SLV could steal it!! 🙂

    Much Love,

  155.  #155Ella on February 17, 2011 at 6:46 am


    What an icky situation.

    I think you are in the right place to begin making some positive changes.

    What I got from your posts is a sense of you being overwhelmed. Like there is so much and it is all ravelled up and you don’t know where to start.

    Firstly just STOP.


    Ok, now you don’t have to do anything dramatic.

    I know it might feel like you are really despearate, and you need to DO something, and you have no options BUT YOU DO!


    Obviously you are the only one who can ultimately decide what you want to do but you don’t necessarily have to make any big decision today.

    Rori talks about ‘the third way’ ie: you don’t have to stay and lump it, and equally you don’t have to break it off yet, if you are not ready.

    You may decide to do that later… but it will be a positive choice, from a place of strength not desperation.

    Try to take some of the urgency out of this.

    You can unpick this babystep by babystep.

    Firstly you need to get in touch with yourself.
    And YOUR needs.

    Forget him, just for a minute… in fact stop paying him any mind.
    Let him go away… don’t even think about what he is doing (difficult I know but there are some great tools on here that can help with that including a whole post on Rosa’s STOP sign).

    Now, what can you do that will make you feel really good right now. Forget him… its not about doing something cus you feel jealous of his freedom (but well done for seeing that).

    It might be that you would feel really good staying at home and having a bubble bath and a good book… whatver it is you like doing.

    Make a list. Really get in touch with this. This is a first step in self love.

    Next… don’t stuff down your feelings. Whenever they show up really feel them.

    Use Rori’s drop to the floor tool.

    If he is around you can start practicing non blaming feeling messages with him.

    Don’t worry if it doesn’t work well or you don’t get it at first, keep practicing.

    Get the focus back on you. Do some stuff that makes you feel good.

    Then have a think about what your boundaries are…
    get clear, write them down.

    Are you ok for a man to live with you without paying rent? Are you ok with your partner smoking pot?

    Don’t worry about what you ‘think’ is right or wrong here… get in touch with what feels ok and what you as a person can actually tolerate or not. Stay way from judgements or right or wrong and instead just think about what is acceptable for YOU…

    Either accept or reject, regardless of the individual circumstances.
    I know this is hard bc then all the guilt feelings come up etc…
    This is fine, they are just feelings.

    But once you decide a boundary be prepared to stick to it. Keep asking yourself whether you are sticking to your boundaries. Are your actions backing up your boundaries?

    Do whatever it takes… trust your boundaries. This might feel scary but this is how you will make this situation feel safe and ultimately change this around, whatever the end outcome.

    Also spend some time getting real clear on what you want in a man… you deserve that.
    Is he it? If so you will need to be able to accept him, just as he is.

    You may want to do some work on your self esteem too.

    I have a similar situation to yours except I did not move in with my guy.

    I am now pretty much out of the situation by choice but I can very much relate to your feelings.

    For me it has been a process.


    In the past I have acted out of urgency and made some mistakes with men.

    This was before I found RR.

    Anyway I hope my post is useful to you.

    You are stornger than you know.

    Big hugs to you.


  156.  #156Darling Ella on February 17, 2011 at 6:46 am

    Did I graduate the Siren Island course???? It feels weird…I ain’t getting anymore of Rori’s letters…and somehow I am in expectation of them every morning …:(

  157.  #157Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 6:56 am

    Ann I see what everyone else has said but I am thinking that this man has no boundaries. I have heard Dr. Paul say without boundaries a man cannot commit. He indiscriminately buys engagement rings so there is nothing special about him giving you one. I have heard Rori say it should be the ring and the date. I have gotten two rings that led no where because there was no date. He has no money but buys a house for someone else. A man without a purpose is like a lost cause to me. A man with a purpose might be focused on work to the point of ignoring me a bit but for me that is more tolerable than a man without a purpose. Bouncing around on water like a piece of driftwood wouldn’t cut it for me because I will not be dragged around on that water. If I were in your situation I would continue asking myself “why am I am here”? Remember also that when we are beating ourselves up we invite people into our lives to help us beat ourselves up. I know you say in the beginnig of relationship you were confident but that seems to be questionable. As Ella suggests I would recommend looking carefully at yourself.

  158.  #158SummerBaby on February 17, 2011 at 7:08 am


    I can’t take cold remedies because of allergies to them, soooo I get eucalyptus oil put a few drops in boiling water and breathe it in a towel tent. you can do this several times a day… it’s potent, and it will clear you up.

    Ecchinacea and zinc help me immensely too. Feel better soon.


  159.  #159Ann on February 17, 2011 at 7:39 am

    Thank you femininewoman and Ella so much. And thank you all for just letting me beat myself and vent on here so I can stop. I did read the STOP post, it’s the hardest thing for me to do because I’m an act first, think later, but I’m trying and at least know I do this. He does have a purpose, he’s been in the same job for 21 years, is only 40 and will be retiring, that’s right RETIRING in 9 years. Sure wish I could say that, I can’t!! His purpose is to raise his daughter to get her into college or whatever she wants to do and leave the state, retire but still have a job that isn’t half as demanding as the one he’s in now. Our kids are the same age, so my life long dream is to get out of the state I’m in I HATE it here, 9 years is hard to deal with as I want to leave NOW but again, I’m an action first thought later type of person so this is forcing me to stop and THINK!! We’ve talked already about where we will move once he retires, etc so it’s all on the table. His financial mess does scare me a lot, I’m very into having all my bills paid and don’t like debt at ALL. But this is his problem, not mine. The only thing that I’ve kept as a pure boundary is I will NOT marry him until his debt is GONE and I mean GONE. That’s the only boundary I’ve given that I refuse to drop. He knows this and has accepted it. At least that’s what he says. He has stuck by me through some really bad crap, my father (72 years old) going to jail, that’s right JAIL over domestic issues with my mother. My ex BF who I was engaged to suing me for the engagement ring (which I sold) back and going through his stalking letter mailing nonsense for 8 months. He didn’t leave me although I would have left him, surely. So I do feel an obligation to stick by him. he is caring, he is thoughtful to an extent (not by my own thoughtful standards) and I do love him. I’m not sure how to give boundaries as I’ve made the mistake of being “too” nice already and telling him he didn’t need to pay rent because I felt bad for him and did my mothering overfunctioning thing. I can’t take back my word and tell him to pay up. I can however take what he offers money wise the next time there’s a big bill that comes in. I have a problem accepting help, a big problem. I’m very stubborn in that respect….I don’t want to feel I owe anyone anything that way I can say I did all I could when things fail and can just walk away without feeling obligated to stay. I’m just not sure what boundaries to give and won’t it be like springing new rules on him all the sudden out of no where? I’m starting with just stopping the overfunctioning that’s making me feel very used, although how can it when I’m doing it to myself!! HAHHA My brain is so whacked….Thank you to all who have helped me, I’m sorry to rant and bitch…but thank you, I feel like I can hold my head up again at least….And when I say I was confident in the beginning of all this, I really was. I was a rock star who didn’t give a f*&^ about anyone who didn’t treat me like a goddess, which he DID!!! I’m not sure if losing my job has made me go right down to zero lack of self esteem and no love for myself or what’s happened but I’m a mess. It makes me sad to remember how I used to be. I had no problem telling any man exactly what I wanted and needed and STICKING to it. When they failed to step up they were gone, IMMEDIATELY!! I refused to take any crumbs, it was all or nothing. And he saw that and HAD to have me….now, I’m not so sure….now he’s interested in getting away with the single friends when before he was begging to get just a day of time with me…what happened? Bummer!!!

  160.  #160Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Ann I might be wrong but I understand that this “I don’t want to feel I owe anyone anything that way I can say I did all I could when things fail and can just walk away without feeling obligated to stay” is very masculine. Men provide and protect. It also suggests that you are afraid of being vulnerable to allow a man to take care of you and that you might be afraid of intimacy. Have you looked at any of Rori’s programs?

    “I refused to take any crumbs, it was all or nothing.” This is also dangerous because no one can give us all we want and suggests a perfectionist style. There are gray areas in life and it’s best to strive for balance.

    I think what happened was that he found holes in your boundaries through which he pulled down your self esteem by causing stress.

    You are not a mess because you are taking babysteps. Forgive yourself for making mistakes, we are not perfect. You were doing the best you could at the time. Yes, financial distress affects our self esteem big time.

    Look first at how you feel. Find what makes you feel icky, angry and less than. Those are good areas to start setting boundaries around. You will not necessarily get it right the first time around. Learning is a process but your feelings if you pay attention will guide you.

  161.  #161Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 8:06 am

    @FW Re: 150

    I so hear what you are saying about the death bed situation and I surely don’t feel you are trite. I have come to practice my life thinking about my deathbed and regrets that I have and have been over the years, able to make decisions based on this very thing.

    But this situation is too hard and painful for me to think about that, at least right now. I am SOOO angry at her for her betrayal to me and I know that I can feel that and do feel it. If I am being honest here, which I am, I want her to feel the repercussions as well. I want her to know that her decisions have affected me and hurt me deeply.

    But the truest part of who I am, also wants to forgive. Can’t I have both?

  162.  #162Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 8:10 am

    155 Ella, your response to Ann was beautiful!

    Ann, you are in a good place. Keep reading and practicing!

  163.  #163Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 8:17 am


    RE: #141 – Give him the gift of missing you.

  164.  #164Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:21 am

    @159 Ann
    “…I can’t take back my word and tell him to pay up…”

    Sure you can. Did you guarantee to give rent free housing for the rest of his life? Even if you did, you could stop that. This is a breeze.

    Add up your housing expenses, include utilities and divide by half. IMHO, tell him you’d like him to start paying his share. I’d cut him some slack and make it April 1st instead of March; that is very generous, it allows him time to organize himself and the bonus is he might find someplace else to live.


  165.  #165Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:27 am

    RE Lori C Only forgiveness can get you both. It is not about her but about freeing yourself to have what you want. Forgiveness will give you that. It is a choice and commitment you make in your heart, your cells and your body. If there is anything that can get her to feel the repercussions it is forgiveness. That will set up the universe to work in your favor.

  166.  #166Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Ann and SLV we are women, we are entitled to change our minds, we are notorious for doing that. If I am not mistaken I believe I have read somewhere in Rori’s writing that we can do it.

  167.  #167Ann on February 17, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Thank you all!! Working on everything starting today, but one thing at a time….baby steps. To SLV, we are moving into a new place (if we are still together) in June so yes, everything will be split 50%. Here at MY place however, yes I did say he didn’t have to pay rent WHILE we were HERE so that would be going against what I promised. The deal was groceries, which I have to say, it’s about $500 to $600 a month that I don’t have to pay and helps alot!! Remember, my daughter eats, not just him and I. So when/if we move in June, I’m going to be VERY cautious and explain that this is what I would like what do you think and see if we can come to a FAIR agreement. he knows that it won’t be like this here when we go somewhere else. So, I guess I should stop bitching!! HAHAH Thank you ALL!!!!

  168.  #168Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 8:29 am

    Eternity and all:

    Thanks for letting me feel icky last night about the Annie Clyde situation. She is desperate and feels hopeless. Her husband is essentially “Gaslighting” her – like that movie where Charles Boyer tries to drive Ingrid Bergman crazy to get her jewels and get away wit murder. Her husband knows what her triggers are and is absolutely dancing on them to torture her and to make her crumble…her separation from her family and longing for their approval, her fears about the religion-bordering-in-a-cult they come from, her own concerns about her parenting abilities, money, and so on. I am just now getting all the details, and so far, yes, Eternity, I have been trying to be a “beacon of hope” for her. I fear her attorney is “out of his depth” here and is not prepared to really fight the way she needs. I HATE fighting dirty, and refused to do it in my divorce (always took the high road), but my ex never had any designs on taking our children because he knew they were better with me (although he was very difficult in other ways).

    And you know, AC’s circumstances have made me count my own blessings. Yes, my ex in the past was difficult and caused me tremendous pain with alcoholism and abuse and mind games, but now we actually get along well and cooperate wonderfully for the kids’ sake. I attribute this to my willingness to “do the right thing” and take the high road (while still having boundaries) and to his finally growing up (although he still drinks).

    But last night I thanked him for finding a place where we could be cool together and good co-parents. He was taken aback, but he said thank you.

    So some good may come out of this for me…but AC’s ex is a whole different level of ugly and evil and determined than my ex ever was. I am afraid for her. I am afraid of him for her. And for me, because he knows I am supporting her with advice and encouragement and even money to fight for her children and for her rights as a human being. He has subpoenaed her phone records, her medical records, her mental health records — she is being exposed and laid bare here, and it is heartbreaking to watch.

    So if any of you are praying women, please add my best friend to your list. Whether you bow to Mecca, light a candle, invoke the Mother goddess, or dance naked in your backyard around a maypole…whatever it is that allows you to ask for hope and positivity for yourself or others…can you add my friend to your list? She could sure use it.

  169.  #169Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:37 am

    From the Soulmate Summit

    Arielle: So for those of you who have not been living around here for a while and don’t know what the law of attraction is, let’s start with that definition, because that’s what made the difference for me, the law of attraction in manifesting my soulmate. The law of
    attraction. The law of attraction states that we draw to us the people, places, and experiences that match our state of being. The good news for most of you is that you already know how to manifest. You’ve done it many, many times. Maybe you didn’t think of it as manifestation, but you’ve done it. Whether its creating a new job or new place to live, or parking place, or finding a little black dress at the mall. So you have used your manifestation muscles before in the past, so what I want to do is teach how to do is how toy strengthen them in the area of romance.
    One of the first things to understand, when you are manifesting, is to understand the difference between wanting versus knowing. When we are in a state of wanting, or needing, or hoping, or dreaming, or wishing, all we are going to draw to us is more of that same feeling, wanting, hoping, dreaming, wishing, yearning, which doesn’t get you close to that relationship that you truly desire. So we need to make a shift, and the shift is to knowing, to knowing and trusting that the one we asked for is already ours. Our perfect right partner is out there, right now, just waiting for us to put out the cosmic welcome mat. I shared with you earlier, that statistically there is more than enough love in the world, and the soulmate possibilities are truly out there. So it’s time for you to choose to believe and own and embrace and live in the knowingness that your perfect right partner already exists, to get out of the wanting.

    The first piece of homework is, I want you to make a list of all the things you don’t want your soulmate to be. You can look at your past relationships to come up with that. You can say “I don’t want my soulmate to be a liar. I don’t want my soulmate to be a cheater.” Those kinds of things. Write it all down, whatever the “don’t wants” are. The reason we do this is because we look to the past to create the future. The reason we do this is because you make a second list and you turn them into powerful positive statements, so if betrayal has been your issue in past relationships and you’ve written “I don’t want a cheater,” then you write on your new list, my soulmate is loyal and monogamous. You start looking inside and ask yourself, what is the heart traits and qualities that I truly desire in a soulmate. You may end up with things like my soulmate is loving, kind, affectionate, generous, and compa-ssionate. Start to prioritize, what are those heart traits and qualities that are really going to make your heart sing.
    Finally a third part of this is to start writing a paragraph that is about your lifestyle together. I mean I really want you to go for it, and see your days and your nights, your weekends, and your holidays and your vacations. Begin to marinate in the juiciness of this life that you are creating with your beloved, put it on paper. Then on day 10 when I am taking you through the soulmate secrets, we are going to use these lists to help you create and manifest the relationship of your dreams.

  170.  #170Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:38 am

    @167: Ann says:
    “…So, I guess I should stop bitching!!…”

    I guess so.


  171.  #171Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 8:39 am

    Whoa. OK, on a completely unrelated note and much more light-hearted, I might add…

    What feeling message can I offer via email on a dating site to indicate to a potential CD that I would feel comfortable (and would very much enjoy) taking our six cycles of back-and-forth emails to the phone call level?

    Is this done? Is this Siren-y?

  172.  #172Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:39 am

    More from the Summit

    I’d like to share with you a process we teach in Calling In The One, about how to set a powerful intention. It’s really about a shift from trying to get love, to moving into a consciousness of trying of being a creator of love. So we want to invite you to set an intention that is really an intention as to what you are up to creating or generating, as opposed to wishing for love, hoping for love, praying under the phases of the moon for love to happen. We have all been there, and we’ve done that. Instead we want to invite you to set a powerful intention, and you as a conscious co-creator of your love life.
    What I want you to do, is find some time where you can really let go of your mind and let go of everything that is on your list and your preconceived ideas about what it is that you think you may want. One of the things to want and to serve as a list of things to have, but just put them aside. Instead take the time to ask yourself these questions to close your eyes, to drop down into your body. Breathe all the way down into your hips and really align with this consciousness of possibility. After doing this exercise that Arielle just guided you through. Entering into a consciousness of possibility, really breathing into a place inside of you, where you know you were not made to live this life alone, that you were made for love, you came into this world to create, to experience, to express, to create and contribute extraordinary, exquisite love and partnership.
    From this deeper center, ask yourself the question, “What do I most deeply desire to experience with my beloved?” Just listen for the answer from the deepest part of yourself. “What do I most deeply desire to express with my beloved, to my beloved?” Listen for the answer from the deepest part of yourself. Taking a breath and breathing down to your hips and, “What do I most deeply desire to create with my beloved? What’s the life I desire to create?” Asking yourself the final question, what do I most deeply desire to contribute to the world through this union with my soulmate? What do I most deeply desire to contribute to desire to my community, to my friends, to my family, to the world through this partnership?”
    Then look at what you have, look at the answers and craft an intention for love that really captures your deeper desires of what it is that you most wish to create,
    “My intention for love is to create an extraordinary, fulfilling partnership with a mate that I can experience a profound mutuality of giving and receiving, where I can express the fullness of who I am without holding anything back. Where we can create a life that supports each other to give the world a gift in the biggest way. Where our rela-tionship becomes a model of possibility and contributes a sense of hope and really empowers the vibration of love in the world, and contributes to the feeling of love and interconnectedness in our world.”

    That becomes your anchor, your stand, you are no longer waiting to get something from the universe, or get something from life. You are standing as a powerful co-creator with an intention to bring forth this exquisite love into your life, into our world, and in standing in that place you will discover heaven and earth will begin to move on your behalf in ways you couldn’t possibly begin to imagine. To bring forth everything you might need. To realize it in our manifest world.
    We want to encourage you to really take the time, you’re going to have this audio. You are going to be able to download this audio, we are going to send it out tomorrow as a recording so you can listen back to tonight’s audio, you will have that to keep. You can listen to these exercises. We really want to encourage you to take the time to really anchor into the love manifestation mindset and really set your intention for love in this series.
    You are going to be in an open and receptive space to be empowered by each of our experts through the 11 days of the series. So again, just a quick reminder, tomorrow you are going to receive an email with the access codes, 12 o’clock Pacific Time, our live broadcast for 24 hours. Tomorrow on the series we have Dr. John Gray and Carol Allen, who is a Vedic astrologist; you can visit for a complete schedule of speakers. They are going to on that page, also have

  173.  #173Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:43 am

    RE 167 Ann says “So when/if we move in June, I’m going to be VERY cautious and explain that this is what I would like what do you think and see if we can come to a FAIR agreement.”

    Hopefully someone else like Daria will chip in here but the above seems to suggest roommates to me not romantic partnership. A fair agreement IMHO is not what happens between lovers.

  174.  #174Turtle Girl on February 17, 2011 at 8:56 am


    I have looked for cold remedies for years. The absolute best one I found for me is Oil of Oregano. It’s really strong and comes in a small bottle. I put a few drops in some water and gulp in down. I have also put a bit right up my nose, but you have to dilute it to do that, cuz it will burn big time and blast out your sinuses.

    Always worked for me, cold gone in about 2 days or less.


  175.  #175Ella on February 17, 2011 at 8:56 am


    Practice recieving. Rock Star status! You have done it before so you know what it feels like.

    One thing that jumps out to me…

    Why is he retiring so young if he has massive debts?


  176.  #176Ella on February 17, 2011 at 8:58 am

    Ann re 167

    What about an arrangement that feels good to you?

  177.  #177Ella on February 17, 2011 at 9:00 am



    Don’t offer me crumbs!

    Pah! I want the WHOLE CAKE.

    Lil boy begone.

  178.  #178Ella on February 17, 2011 at 9:02 am

    Loser loser, silly boys lose

    You don’t get to choose.


    POW on your silly dumb white powder head..

    Blah blah I feel betta.

  179.  #179Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 9:03 am


    “A fair agreement IMHO is not what happens between lovers.”

    I feel curious to hear your idea of what kind of agreement does happen between lovers?

    For me, a good feeling agreement is what happens between lovers.

    I feel perplexed and confused. Are you saying you wouldn’t or don’t contribute to the household finances?

    Can you share more about your views because I feel really confused. I mean, even Rori has a job. Geez.

    Seriously tho, I just want to understand this perspective and right now I’m having a really hard time getting it.

  180.  #180Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 9:14 am

    RE 179 LG I am putting it in the context of Ann’s situation. It seems her commitment would be that a FAIR agreement would be splitting expenses 50/50.

    I am yet to find a situation in real life where this happens between love partners. Someone is always giving more, in my experience. I also cannot imagine how a man could be cherishing me and having to share 50/50?

  181.  #181Ella on February 17, 2011 at 9:19 am


    I think I understand where you were coming from.

    You are referring to how it always works better when the man serves us.

    So he pays for dates.

    And in a relationship we find a way to make it still feel like he is serving us, even if he cannot pay more financially.

    A fair agreement put me in mind of roommates too. Rather than a romantic relationship where the man is finding ways to cherish his woman.

    In my last relationship he earnt more than me, and he paid more than me.

    This was really good practice for me at recieving.

  182.  #182Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 9:26 am

    RE 181 Yes Ella. Also if I look out in the world in the situations that I know of, both in my personal life and in the office, in most instances the guys will tell you they carry the biggest financial responsibilities in marriages. I believe it is tied to their masculinity so they don’t look for a fair agreement when they are really great masculine men. If as the feminine partner I have to negotiate a fair agreement around money, I believe something will be a bit off in the energy exchange that will feel icky to him. I know of guys who have lost their jobs and had to depend on the wife to take care of the family. They all say they were a little uncomfortable while that lasted. Guys on the “take” is not bothered by that.

  183.  #183Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 9:38 am


    Am I understanding correctly that he is working and will be retiring early at age 40 and that you have lost your job and are not working? and yet, you are letting him live with you for free while he goes on vacations with his friends?

    What kinds of things does he do that show you he values you?

  184.  #184Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 9:46 am

    RE 168 Boomer will do.

  185.  #185Ann on February 17, 2011 at 9:50 am


    RE 183, it sounds WORSE when you put it that way….WAY worse…..yes, i lost my job, company went bankrupt December 20th, right in time for Christmas. I get unemployment but it’s $800 a month less than I was making while employed plus no health insurance for myself or my daughter. When a company goes bankrupt there is NO cobra or insurance extension. I’ve applied for state health insurance for us. And yes, he is living with my daughter and myself rent free, paying ONLY groceries no other bills and is going to Atlantic City with 4 of his friends while he bitches he has NO money at all and has offered to take me NO WHERE even out to dinner. You’re correct. What does he do to show he values me? He tells me I’m sexy, I’m beautiful that he loves me, he’ll wash dishes or make dinner. I’m angry right now and hurting so I can’t think of much else. I also made the HUGE mistake of saying I thought VAlentine’s day was silly and from what he says he believed I meant WE don’t celebrate it as a couple, to which I said I would never have said that as I got YOU things. I bought a sexy outfit, wore it that Sunday, Valentine’s came and WENT no card no gift nothing. i had 2 cards I got him, I did not give them to him, I decided I made the mistake of getting him anything by my own foolishness so I changed my mind about giving him anything. I did tell him he could make dinner one night this week, that would be a LOVELY V Day gift considering I make dinner 7 nights a week, although I AM unemployed…………I also clean, do all the laundry pick up dry cleaning and entertain his daughter while she’s here for the weekend whenever he gets her. I do tell him this is for NOW because I don’t have a job, but it will END once I get one I can’t cook gourmet dinners every night, I’m too tired when I get home. I don’t know. I think I’ve riled myself up so badly now that I can’t think clearly, I feel very teary eyed, hurt and am not sure what I’m blowing out of proportion but the going to AC with friends for the weekend KILLED me and my feelings toward him. He can go and do whatever he wants, but he knows I’m BROKE and will be sitting home while he’s away. It doesn’t feel fair, but I don’t want to be a brat, know what I mean? I just want the same his friends get. He can find money even if it’s cheap to go for 3 days away with friends. Take me to dinner, buy take out for us on our kid free weekends. Do SOMETHING for ME!!! Am I wrong?? I may be over sensitive, I’m not sure, that’s why I’m posting here. You gals will tell me like it is and if I’m being ridiculous will tell me to knock it off. That’s what I need. Tough love. But if HE’S wrong, then I need to know I’m not being silly about it all. I don’t think I am!!

  186.  #186Prairie Girl on February 17, 2011 at 9:55 am

    Boomer the other day I said…

    “it feels very tiring trying to communicate so much via email. I like talking on the phone better.”

    Then of course he sent me his number and I had to say..

    “I feel icky calling a guy first if I’m not in some sort of realtionship with him… unless of course I’m going to hire him to fix something”…


  187.  #187Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 9:59 am


    You ask if you’re being a brat, but, from here, it looks like you’re picking up the crumbs of his sweet words and sweeping them under the doormat that is you. 🙁

    I feel sad. I want to hug you and tell you that you deserve better.

    I want to sit with you and go over ever sentence that you’ve written and dissect them so that you can see the truth of what is going on…apart from your self-esteem and, what seems like, minimization.

    Again, I don’t want you to blame him. I want you to see him for who he is. I feel like you have rose colored glasses through which you see him.

    I wonder if you don’t tell yourself, as I have in the past, this is as good as it’s going to get. If I let him go, no one else will come along who is even half as good to me as he is. Maybe he’s my last chance.

    Praying for you today…may you see truth, may you find comfort in a warm glass of tea, may you love on yourself and surround yourself with people who treat you well.


  188.  #188Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:00 am

    Ann says “how funny how in 8/9 months here I am codependent and controling” yet you are planning to wait until he retires before you move to where you want to be though you hate where you are now?

    “I have been thinking about the fact that I have to accept him and his life for who and what he is. I don’t know if I can accept it or not” yet you are considering marrying him? Has he proposed to you? It seems like a ultimatum telling him you will not marry him until he gets out of debt so, and I am sorry to say this, but I don’t see him making any effort to get out of debt. This just might be his way of having his cake and eating it too.

    “It’s going to end up pushing him right out the door, maybe that’s ok, but I don’t think it would feel very good” Do you really believe that? Who are you in this arrangement for, yourself, him or your daughter?

  189.  #189Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:02 am

    RE 185 Ann reading that post I feel fear for your daughter.

  190.  #190Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:10 am

    RE 185 ” Do SOMETHING for ME!!! Am I wrong??” It depends on what he sees you as. The things you are currently doing suggests a role that I am afraid to write here.

    Does he tell you you are oversensitive? You are not. You are writing like a normal woman who wants the love and respect she deserves.

    Ann reread your words. It is not fair, your status seems to be even less than his. Doing the heavy lifting for nothing in return. He is not wrong, you are not wrong. He is doing what he wants to do, simple. He is assuming that you are also doing what you want to do. I am sure he is thinking that you are a big girl and you make your own choices.

  191.  #191Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:12 am

    Ann where is your anger? Have you found it yet?

  192.  #192Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 10:14 am

    FW: I get what you are saying. Thanks for taking the time to elaborate.

    When I hear that splitting the bills makes a relationship more like roommates than lovers, I feel kinda triggered. It seems like an unfair generalization to me. But I get that you meant in the context of Ann’s story.

    I do understand what you are saying that it’s never 50/50 in a romantic relationship. That one person is always going to be giving more.

    And I imagine we agree that it feels much better when the man is giving more.

  193.  #193Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 10:17 am

    RE #189 I was thinking the same thing. Children learn from what they see. Is yours the life you would choose for your daughter’s future? Tough question.

  194.  #194Ann on February 17, 2011 at 10:19 am

    Ok. What do I do to step out of this role I’ve clearly done to myself…and STOP doing what I have been? I am so low right now I can’t stop sobbing. Do I tell him he needs to leave? I have no idea why the hell I went from being happy, which I was when I was working (he moved in here with us in November, I didn’t feel this way AT ALL). He had zero desire to do these guy related trips, he had gone on a fishing trip but it was on about month 3 we were dating and it was what it was, he wasn’t living here. He even had an every Wednesday night cooking top chef thing with his guy friends that HE stopped doing, I did NOT ask him to stop and even said why did you stop? He said he would rather spend the time with me. What have I done? And i agree he thinks I’m doing what I want to be doing. How could he not think that, I’m not saying any different, I just don’t know how to say anything without screaming at the top of my lungs and telling him to get out forever. I’ve let my feelings be pushed down so far without speaking my feelings to him in a way he can hear that I’m just spewing over. It feels terrible!! What do i do? Stop cleaning, stop cooking? I need to anyway for my daughter and I won’t live in a dirty house. Do I ask for help? I feel like it’s unfair being I don’t work right now, is that a wrong feeling??? If it is, why do i feel so used and neglected? He even said to me I don’t want you to feel like I’m taking advantage of you. That right there says it all. he must feel he IS taking advantage, right?

  195.  #195Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 10:27 am


    Make a plan for one day at a time…that might help with your feelings of being overwhelmed.

    For today:
    You don’t have to clean TODAY
    Call a girlfriend and cry on her shoulder
    Feel your feelings
    Express your anger
    Take a hot bath

    That’s what I would do. You don’t have to make big decisions today. Maybe his weekend away will help you take some time for yourself and decide what would feel good to you, you could work on a speech, you could CD with your girlfriends.

    I think the important thing to remember is that you don’t have to DO anything today, but take care of yourself.

  196.  #196Ella on February 17, 2011 at 10:30 am


    Forget right or wrong.

    This relationship is all out of kilter.

    You have said yes to stuff you weren’t really ok with and are overfunctioning and then feeling resentful.

    Does this sound accurate?

    I am not saying it is all your fault, or that he is blameless, but blame and judgement won’t help here.

    Stop trying to figure this out and get back to your feelings.

    They will lead you to a safe/good place.

    One thing I can say from your situation is that it doesn’t sound like you are happy or getting what you want.

    But it also sounds like you are taking the ‘boy’ role by telling him what you want him to do to make it better.

    I should withdraw for now and start taking care of you.

    Visualize ‘dropping the relationship’ and do not pick it up… he can fingure it out.

    Just because you are in this situation doesn’t mean that you can’t change your mind.

    IT IS YOUR HOUSE. You can do what you like.

    If you now require a different arrangement that is fine. You can negotiate this with him.

    You don’t have to accept whatever he throws to you. You can reject stuff too and express how you feel.

    He is a grown man, you are not responsible for him.

    If you feel he is not contributing enough bring this up!

    Gosh I feel like I could be talking to myself. 🙂

    This is very healing for me.


  197.  #197Ann on February 17, 2011 at 10:33 am

    Thank you Pamelala, it’s a start and I love the suggestions. I am going to an animal shelter tomorrow to see if I can volunteer some time to get out of this house, I think part of all this is going just stir crazy from not working for 2 months. Hopefully the volunteering will be 5 days a week for most of the day each day. I think getting out will help clear my head a bunch. And I have been thinking about his weekend away, i even told him I think a break will be good even if for 3 days. I’m going to take a nice long hot shower and try to get it together a bit. I don’t need my daughter seeing me act like a nut case! ahahah thank you all!!!

  198.  #198Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:41 am

    RE 193 It is teaching the kid that is the way men treat women and it is okay. It is teaching her that women are weak and it is okay to be weak. It might be a great time to really look at your life and decide what you really want.

    RE 194 Best thing to do right now is read as much on this blog as possible.

    He needs to do the guy related stuff to feel his masculinity. Tell him to have fun. Use the time to read and to assess your life and what you want in it.

    We tend to lose ourselves in our relationships if we are not aware of what we are doing and keep ourselves centered. What you want to do is be become aware. Ann nothing is wrong it is how you feel and it is fine to feel. You can ask for help “It would make me feel happy if you ……..around the house” He said that because he feels blamed and cannot possibly be feeling good about that. Even I want to run away from my mother for that.

    You will feel overwhelmed when the reality of the situation starts hitting you but I would not recommend screaming at him. If you bring that to him it is tantamount to inviting him to do the same to you.

    As Rori recommends start focussing on your feelings so you can identify them. Get clear on what you want, set your intention, and make peace with yourself that it is okay to want what you want. Forgive yourself for making the mistakes, we all do noone is perfect. You were doing the best you know how up to this point. Hug yourself for reaching out, searching for help and finding this place to let our your anger and frustration. Next you will have to find a way to say what you need to say without exploding. Read as much as possible here, that is what helped me. You will need to lift your self-esteem so you can express yourself in a feminine graceful way. You are worthy of love and the best life has to offer.

  199.  #199Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 10:43 am

    180: Femininewoman says:
    “…I also cannot imagine how a man could be cherishing me and having to share 50/50?…”

    Uh-oh. I might be being doing this. I probably will be doing this. I hope to be cherished. Does this mean a man cherishing me falls outside your imagination? Does this mean I would be in the non-cherished zone or just hard to imagine me being cherished?


  200.  #200Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:45 am

    RE 197 Ann that sounds wonderful. Also volunteering at the shelter will do a lot for your self esteem.

  201.  #201tinque on February 17, 2011 at 10:46 am

    Ann – You’ve already said it all, and you’ve received some very good advice from the women here. Your story breaks my heart, so I feel compelled to jump in here.

    Words are meaningless unless there is action to back them up. I see you getting a bunch of rhetoric in order to shut you up, and aside from words there’s nothing here.

    You ask him to leave by asking him to leave. “This doesn’t feel good anymore. I feel confused and angry and just plain awful, and I don’t want to feel like this anymore. I don’t want you here anymore after the first of (March/April.”

    It would be tempting to insert a few choice words, but refrain if you can.


  202.  #202Mercedes on February 17, 2011 at 10:48 am

    Thank you everyone for the advice…I’m going to try out all the home remedies tonight with the hopes that I will at least feel better if not actually get better sooner. In any case, I wish I could rest. 🙁 It’s hard to feel good no matter what you do if sleep isn’t a part of the routine.

    As for the above,

    My situation is a lot different than what you are discussing here, but I need to put a slightly different perspective on something Femininewoman said in #173.

    “A fair agreement IMHO is not what happens between lovers.”

    This might be true generally (I don’t know so I don’t want to speculate), but in some situations, a fair agreement is the absolute sign of love and trust.

    For me, it was almost impossible to give up my independence and move in with J. He asked three times and all three times I signed a new lease agreement on my apartment locking me in for another 6 months to a year. As much as I loved him and wanted to take our relationship to that next level, I was terrified of giving up my independence. I was afraid of how I would look to him and mostly I was afraid of how I would feel about myself. So…instead of showing J how much I love and respect and trust him, I avoided moving forward in the relationship.

    One day, he and I sat down and really discussed the problem. We came to a fair agreement that allowed me to keep the independence I longed for and it allowed him to live with the same woman (the one who loves her independence) he fell in love with. Neither of us had to worry about how we would feel about me.

    That agreement…the fact that he didn’t stick to his stance that he could afford the home and didn’t need my contribution and the fact that I didn’t stick to my stance that if I wasn’t paying my own rent I wasn’t independent…is, from my perspective, the absolute example of love. It was the two of us finding a way together to grow. It was that love and the desire to grow our love and find a way to do it comfortably that allows us to have an agreement with regard to finances and still be crazy in love with each other.

    Agreements like ours are not for everyone…I totally understand that…but for us, I must say that it in no way puts us in the roommate category…nor does it diminish our love or our status as lovers. Anyone who sees us together knows that we are not roommates in a financial agreement. We are two people who are absolutely in love and who will always do whatever it takes to stay that way (up to and including finding a way be happen and to get the bills paid).

    Much Love,

  203.  #203Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 10:48 am

    FW, Ella:

    In my current relationship, we split the financial expenses pretty much evenly. It’s pretty casual tho. We don’t really micromanage, we just both contribute what makes sense for the particular situation. I feel good it. A few issues have come up where one of us didn’t feel good about a certain situation but it was easily worked out.

    As far as the overall energy of the relationship, he is definitely the giver, doer, provider.

    In my last relationship, he paid all of the bills and gave me spending money but I felt like a servant (I know that’s not a proper feeling message but it’s the best I can come up with atm). I was definitely the doer, caretaker, and overfunctioner. When we broke up, I had no money to speak of and hadn’t worked a proper job in 4 years, although I did help him start a profitable business.

    So ya, I get triggered by the roommates comment because that hasn’t been my experience at all. I got triggered when Daria said it a while back too. At the same time, I respect all of your opinions and I want to understand why this is so triggering for me.

  204.  #204tinque on February 17, 2011 at 10:50 am

    “He needs to do the guy related stuff to feel his masculinity.”

    Not necessarily. K has never done guy related stuff, has never done boy’s night out, and he’s most definitely masculine. He would just rather be with me, and I like this very much.

    I on the other hand love my girl time, but I get it via internet or during the week while he’s at work.


  205.  #205Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:51 am

    RE 190 I sense I might not have been clear. What I was saying is if I have to share 50/50 in all the maintenance of the household I would have a hard time feeling like he was cherishing me. Cherishing for me represents that he takes care of me and allows me to do what I chose to do. I don’t see myself in a situation where I would be rescuing a man. That is one of my boundaries I could never break. If we were married and he lost his job I would be open to handling it. But going into a situation where the man’s job could not allow him to support me and from the get go I would have to be stepping into the providing role is not something I could do.

  206.  #206Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:54 am

    RE 204 Tinque I understand what you are saying but the comment is specific to Ann’s man who seems to need that. I am also a believer of the Men are from Mars concept that teaches that. The guys I have experience with demonstrates that.

  207.  #207Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 10:56 am

    After that experience, I realized how important it is to me to be responsible for my own financial independence.

    I believe that energetically it is important for me to continue working on my abundance attracting vibe and any blocks I may have with money.

    I enjoy contributing to the overall well-being and future of our family. At the same time, I want it to be very clear that it is ultimately my partner’s responsibility to be the provider.

    I also want him to feel calm about financial matters. I enjoy having a man who isn’t so busy trying to provide for me that I don’t get to spend much time with him. Quality time is more important to me than being provided for.

    As I’m writing this, I’m feeling good getting clear on what I want and noticing some limiting beliefs I could work on.

  208.  #208tinque on February 17, 2011 at 10:58 am

    I hear you FW, and many men do fall into this category. I just wanted to point out that there are (and this was surprising to me) men who don’t want that and are not feminine energy.

    As for this roommate discussion. It baffles me. The whole money thing being such an issue, such a loaded topic.


  209.  #209Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 10:59 am

    RE 205 I guess also that is how I saw my father doing it so for me that is the norm and what I expect.

  210.  #210Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:03 am

    RE 207 Laughing Goddess thanks for sharing that because I myself was recently conflicted around money. I wanted to have it all and at the same time resistant to the idea of a man with money and giving to me. I would offer to pay on dates even after hearing my mother say that my father stopped taking her out at one point in time because he always wanted to splurge and she used to stop him. I am used to seeing him providing everything in the household when he was financially capable.

    I have recently accepted that I am open to having a rich man and to him providing for me. I think I inadvertently pushed one away recently because of that lack of clarity.

  211.  #211Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:07 am

    FW: re 205

    I feel curious how you are managing this in your real life. Are you with a man who pays for everything? Do you work and if so, what do you do with your money? If you don’t mind sharing.

    I’m having a hard time envisioning what this looks like?

    I don’t see sharing bills as rescuing. I can imagine being with a man who couldn’t at least pay for himself and have some extra to woo me. That would be a turn off, yes.

    But a young man who is still young and developing his career but who obviously understands and makes an effort to fulfill his role as provider. And I am young and able and enjoying my work. I mean, ya it would be cool to manifest someone who’s wealthy AND has plenty of time to spend with me but…I guess that’s just not all that important to me.

    I’m now remembering that my friend Manifested a husband like that. He made a million $ (literally) before he met her by age 33 and had already “retired”. That part is cool but they still have plenty of other issues, financial included.

  212.  #212Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:07 am

    I should also say that I believe “Where your treasure lies there you heart is also”. I believe that I am loved and cherished by a man he will be willing to give me his treasure/money.

  213.  #213Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:11 am

    Meant to say couldn’t imagine being with a man who couldn’t pay for himself.

    Also, to clarify, I definitely don’t feel good paying for dates. Yuck

  214.  #214Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 11:11 am

    #186 – Prairie Girl, thanks for the insight. I used your FM about emailing feeling tiring. We’ll see what we get 🙂 You’ve been really helpful to me on here, and I feel appreciation for you!

  215.  #215Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:13 am

    FW: we are cross posting so some of what I’m saying may seem weirdly out of context 🙂

  216.  #216Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:13 am

    RE 211 I am not living with a man and wouldn’t until I am married. I also do work. I am sorry but in my mind Ann’s situation is clearly rescuing. I am also not young and thee one I love made a lot last year. He picks up all the bills when we are out together. I do circular date and find that guys always, always, always want to pay. I have recently had one who suggested I pay for something but I did not even respond. He never asked again and he just changed the subject. We have since dated where he paid.

  217.  #217Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 11:13 am

    Do I detect a faint sea breeze of sh*t over siren island today?

    Ja, think so.

  218.  #218Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 11:17 am

    End Day One. Start Day Two.

    I just love the little life reminders that show up.

  219.  #219Prairie Girl on February 17, 2011 at 11:20 am

    #214 Boomer I feel exactly the same way about YOU!!! Thank you!

  220.  #220Ella on February 17, 2011 at 11:22 am

    @ Tinque

    “Words are meaningless unless there is action to back them up. I see you getting a bunch of rhetoric in order to shut you up, and aside from words there’s nothing here.”

    This resonates for me too!

    This is all I have gotten from MR B for the last few weeks, since I left when his drug habit came out.

    I am done with it.

    It is meaningless.

    It is crumbs… as Pamelala said words that are crumbs!


  221.  #221Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 11:23 am

    Yay, mutual admiration society!

    I gotta say though, that I appreciate the tough love on here as well. I need my butt kicked sometimes. I don’t post anything here thinking I’m just going to get validation and unicorns and rainbows. I come here for the hard lessons too.

  222.  #222tinque on February 17, 2011 at 11:25 am

    Ella – I’m so excited you are really, really seeing this and getting it. yay!


  223.  #223LonePlum on February 17, 2011 at 11:26 am


    I cook chicken soup, if I have what it takes,
    in which I add tomatoes, garlic, chili and thyme

    When i don’t have what it takes for the chicken soup I simply boil cubes of chicken bouillon in water with the tomatoes, garlic, chili and thyme

    I get into bed and I drink the soup
    I get real hot, I might sweat
    I keep under the blankets.


  224.  #224Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:27 am

    FW: Thanks for exploring this with me.


  225.  #225patti on February 17, 2011 at 11:28 am

    Amazing, after 6 years of cronic neck pain
    I found tapping, worked on some negative feelings, let them go, and my neck quit
    I feel relieved and happy

    I am in a good place.

    I hope all is well well with ya’ll

  226.  #226Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 11:28 am


    RE: #124 – You said, “That story amazes me @43.
    Is his second name CONTROL?
    We are talking $20 .”

    Thanks for your feedback. I can see both sides, and more and more, I am leaning toward this side you present.

  227.  #227Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:29 am

    Advice from Bob Grant
    Bonus: When you say, “Don’t ever call me again!” —-> What He Hears – “Don’t ever call me again.”

    When a woman makes a threat, men take it seriously. Men treat verbal threats the same as women treat physical threats. They are always to be taken at face value.

    What works better with a man is learning how to become the woman who lives by this phrase – No Man is a Match for a Woman Who Puts Her Heart First.

  228.  #228Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:29 am

    SLV: sh*t breeze? What do you mean?

  229.  #229Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:32 am

    RE 224 not a problem. I have been very feisty most of my life and have been willing to push all kinds of buttons with guys. I am an explorer in that realm.

  230.  #230Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 11:32 am

    @228: Laughing Goddess says:

    “…SLV: sh*t breeze? What do you mean?…”

    I means I smell sh*t and I’m inclined to grumble about it. Maybe I’ll riff… Sometimes I do but I erase them.


  231.  #231Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:36 am

    FW: Also wanting to say that I do understand that you are talking in the context of Ann’s relationship. I’m feeling a little triggered but in a good way that’s helping me get clear on what I want.

    I don’t believe that Rori is saying categorically that if a woman share household expenses with a man, there is a masc/fem imbalance.

    I do fully support a woman having a personal preference that a man pay for everything but I don’t think it’s a requirement to having a healthy relationship.

  232.  #232Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:40 am

    RE 231 Agreed. Can you direct me to where I might have suggested that? Maybe I can clarify.

    I should also state that I read other coaches materials and some teach that we should forget fairness. It should be that the man does more and we should feel a little like we owe them in the money realm. It is part of being vulnerable. I have read where we should wait until they give us 10 times before we give back. In circular dating I am very open to doing that, particularly when I am not invested.

  233.  #233LonePlum on February 17, 2011 at 11:42 am

    So… Kadaffi… getting hot yet? Might be time to move your tent somewhere else…
    We’ll stay tuned…

  234.  #234Lakshmi on February 17, 2011 at 11:43 am

    Hi Ann,

    I feel so sad when I hear your suffering! I have lost my boundaries before, and felt so stuck.

    You’ve gotten amazing advice here, and I don’t know if I can add to it, but a few things struck me. You wrote “So I do feel an obligation to stick by him… I’m not sure how to give boundaries as I’ve made the mistake of being “too” nice already and telling him he didn’t need to pay rent because I felt bad for him and did my mothering overfunctioning thing. I can’t take back my word and tell him to pay up.”

    You are not obligated to do anything! And I think Rori would say that obligation is not sexy or sireny or alluring. Also, I think you might consider changing your agreement regarding rent now. Your circumstances have changed since you agreed to let him stay at your place rent free (i.e. you lost your job). You made your offer under different circumstances and you are not OBLIGATED to honor an offer you made when you were employed. That is not “taking back your word.” It is honoring your needs and those of your daughter (you could be saving money for her health insurance if he contributed to rent).

    Speaking of employment, are you job hunting? I’ve been laid off before and I know how demoralizing it can be. The volunteer thing sounds great! That will surely lift your spirits and your vibe.

    As to your anger, and your fear that it will all erupt, his going away will give you some space to feel your anger. REally express it! You might get physical and beat up a pillow. Or go running and listen to angry music. Or scream like mad (if you’re afraid of people hearing you, you can do it in your car). If you get some of it out physically, you may be in a better place to express it to him in a non-blaming way when he returns.

    I also was thinking about the child thing. It sounds like you’d really like to have another one. Are you sure you want to give that up to be with this man?

    Big hugs to you. Be gentle and loving to yourself.

  235.  #235Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:46 am

    I guess I should also state that for some reason I tend to attract guys who operate their own businesses.

  236.  #236Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Lori C,

    RE: #146 – If I were you, I would discuss it with at least your sister, and maybe him, too. Maybe you could put together some feeling messages and I want/don’t want, like/don’t like messages and bounce them off us to tweak them.

  237.  #237Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:51 am

    RE 234 Lashkmi I think you make a good point saying “That is not “taking back your word.” Ann might be the person who has a strong belief around honor and your word being your bond, that maybe she could explore. I am wondering if I myself will put aside my feelings just to honor my words? I have never thought about that before thanks.

  238.  #238Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 11:51 am

    FW: “Can you direct me to where I might have suggested that? Maybe I can clarify.”

    I don’t know that you necessarily ever said or implied that. Your roomate comment triggered me. And I already had some charge based on a similar comment and conversation I recently had with Daria.

    Mostly I just wanted to understand the perspective more and there’s also some defensiveness because I’m in a situation of splitting bills.

  239.  #239Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 11:55 am


    RE: #147 – I am just getting over a severe cold, which I think may have been pneumonia or bronchitis, because it really centered around chest congestion.

    I did some crash research at a health food store, asking the clerk and reading their reference book on nutrition. Here is what I found works well, among many remedies:

    Elderberry concentrate – expensive but very effective – the book said studies showed it killed the rhinovirus.

    Concentrated oregano in pill form. I have been taking 450 – 675 mg 2 or 3 times a day

    Best wishes for a speedy recovery…altho sometimes it seems to have to run its course.

  240.  #240Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 11:57 am

    RE 238 I see. I have a history of seeing it from the other angle. Most of the people I have close relationships with and are living with men have situations where the guys carry most of the financial burden. I am having difficulty coming up with an example of it splitting 50/50. I can even think of cases where guys allow the women to handle the finances and give her 100% access to everything. There are guys on the job where the wife doesn’t work but he gives her full access so she handles the bills.

  241.  #241kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    144: Senior Lady Vibe says:

    “@121: kaitlyn says:
    “If I don’t hear from my guy by his birthday (4/3/11), what are your thoughts on me calling him to wish him happy birthday?”



    Even if I was the one who messed up? )Though, my last attempt to reach out 11 days ago went unresponded to?)

  242.  #242Pamelala on February 17, 2011 at 12:06 pm


    I gotta go with SLV 100% here. And yes, I assume she knows your situation and was replying based on the info she has.

    If he wanted to hear from you, he would call. If you intrude yourself into his process, the chances of his calling are greatly diminished.

    In Commitment Blueprint, Rori says, “No matter the emergency, you do not contact him.” A birthday is far from an emergency.

    Take yourself out for a cupcake for his birthday if he hasn’t contacted you, pray for him/send positive energy his way, but leave him alone to figure out how he’s feeling.

  243.  #243Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 12:12 pm

    RE 241 I have read from another coach that they don’t necessarily expect us to reach out to say happy birthday. How has the birthday events been handled in the relationship with him over the years? Do you both generally do what you want to do?

    IMHO you might be the one to mess up but his actions are showing you what he wants right now. It would be wise because obviously reaching out is not working so trying something else might. Reaching out to him might be a predictable pattern of behavior.

    If he is upset it would be respectful to allow him to have his feelings and give him time to get over it, I think. Did you communicate during reaching out that “you are there” when he is ready to communicate? That would leave the door open so if he feels like it he knows it would be safe to contact you. But he has to feel like it. You have a right to mess up, you are human. He has a right to be upset, he is human.

  244.  #244Daria on February 17, 2011 at 12:14 pm

    ” lost” Lori c I “lost” my best friend of 10 years bec she wantrf to date a guy she knew I liked I fely so disrespected . I calm se how yoir sister fely I still dont know how she could discount my feelingd .

  245.  #245Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    Erased the riff but found this and repaired it.

    230: Senior Lady Vibe says:
    @228: Laughing Goddess says:

    “…SLV: sh*t breeze? What do you mean?…”

    It means I smell sh*t and I’m inclined to grumble about it. Maybe I’ll riff… Sometimes I do but I erase them.



    I erased some stuff. I had a little clue that since money was being discussed on the blog that any minute…

    Any minute the miniature uteri would be brought out.

    The miniature uteri trigger me. It’s so insane. Rori and her miniature uterus. 😆

    No need to keep your word, use your miniature uterus.

    Tell your man you don’t want something and then complain when he says OK, I won’t give it to you.

    Tell him what to do and then he says, OK, then bitch about it.

    Didn’t “yo mama” ever tell you to never tell a man you don’t want something when you do????? Huh?

    Mine told me. And lots of other stuff too.

    “Feed him before you start having a talk with him.”

    “But don’t get stuck in the kitchen.”


    Can’t stop thinking about the miniature uteri,

    I want to see sirens’s eyes. faces,
    Is everybody keeping a straight face, saying how good it is to have one???

    I had to escape.

    “Use your miniature uterus.”

    It will solve all your financial worries.

    Which siren said that Rori uses her miniature uterus and put it on her desktop? Hmmm, I don’t remember because I was ROFL.

    I do not have a miniature uterus. I do not LOL 😆

    I don’t want one either.

    I do things the old-fashioned way. No miniature uterus required.

    Since it’s now been predicted that I won’t be cherished (regular uterus and all) in the world of imagination,

    I’d better make sure I’m on path to put relationship into reality.

    In meantime, I’ll put wedding date into my imagination

    haven’t figured out date,

    the end of the 26 Days would be a good time to do that.

    I would be afraid to do business with the miniature uteri team. Hmmm


    If told my father about miniature uteri, he’d bend over laughing and have a hard time stopping:

    He would say: “Now you know that’s crap, don’t you?” 😆 😆 😆

    I think I’ll go tell him.

    I’ve got a bad case of the giggles. 😛

  246.  #246kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    Pamelala, thanks.

    riff: I bet he’s feeling I’m a worthless wh0re who has no regards for fidelity or his feelings. A needy girl who became blaming and critical out of resentment instead of focussing on herself and just leaning back when he became a lil more withdrawn due to career, stress, and general recovery from intense feelings for me just like John Gray says.

  247.  #247tinque on February 17, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    kaitlyn – “Even if I was the one who messed up? ” – yep

  248.  #248kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    247 Tinque

    WOW. Interesting as in I feel curious. I’d like to explore your thoughts. PLease explain.

  249.  #249kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    Sirens, if I ask you to explain something, it doesn’t mean I don’t believe you. Just means it has jump started my curiosity and I’d like to explore what you mean.

    *Most ppl in my life get defensive when I ask them for advice, they answer, and I inquire further.

  250.  #250Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    Brenda @236

    The thing is, I can hardly come up with any feeling messages right now. lol.

    I would appreciate any you can throw at me.



  251.  #251Daria on February 17, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    Patti I fel inspired on my eft

  252.  #252Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 12:32 pm

    RE 249 Kaitlyn I would humbly like to suggest that you pay attention to that, it could come across as belligerent. It is something I have done and have learnt the hard way to read people’s body language when doing it. I have also learnt that I did not want to take no for answer. Sometimes they were saying no with the body language not the words. I am now paying attention to other people around me. They show on their faces that they are not quite convinced or sure, but choose to just say “okay”. In some instances the person might continue to explain, sometimes they don’t. Take the defensiveness as a message to you. The fact that it is most people is significant and might be part of human nature. You might also be prone to giving explanations and being long winded, which could possibly be why he is not responding? What do you think? It could a great exploration of yourself and your communication style. Someone said “communication IS the response you get”.

  253.  #253Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    Daria did you read Lori C’s situation, can you help? I am not convinced she needs to be sharing any feeling messages with them right now. I am thinking she should be taking care of herself rather than sharing how she might be feeling because of the situation. She seems to be doing great otherwise.

  254.  #254Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 12:35 pm

    SLV, I’ll bite. What is the reference to the miniature uterus?

    Can you elaborate for us newbies?

  255.  #255Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    244: Daria

    Did you and your friend ever get past it? How did you deal with your emotions at that time?

    I would love to hear if it isn’t to painful still. BUT, it is okay if you don’t feel you want to share.

    I am making progress, I really, really am but I also feel that I deserve to FEEL all the emotions I have and not bury them. I think one of the lessons for me here, is to stand up for myself. I haven’t in the past and it is clear that I need to and by standing up for myself and for what is right for ME, I am doing myself a great honor.

  256.  #256tinque on February 17, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    kaitlyn – “WOW. Interesting as in I feel curious. I’d like to explore your thoughts. PLease explain.”

    This man is hurting, maybe irreparably so. What happened may have been a deal breaker. Maybe not, but you don’t know. If he hasn’t contacted you by April, even though you think you messed you, you reaching out to him is still not your job.

    This would be majorly leaning forward. If he’s “still in the game”, the first move will have to be his.


  257.  #257Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    @241: kaitlyn

    Calling him is “leaning forward” but if that’s want you want to do, do it. I always do what I want to do. I learn from Rori and others but I don’t follow “rules” just because they are “rules.” Well, rules of this type. I usually do follow rules… I’m pretty straight arrow.

    IMHO, and this is only for ME, me and nobody else but me. If a guy had sent me a birthday card in the past I always feel free to return the greeting on his birthday, just with “Happy Birthday” on it, just for the fun of doing it because I really do like birthdays a lot. If I had never received one from him I probably would not send one.

    I would not call.

    In your specific sitution, I would do nothing. Two weeks is very, very little time for a guy to be out there getting him and his manhood together. And i his “manhood” depended upon an idea of getting a “high end call girl” to “belong to him.” You really might not want him for the long run. But I know that physically attraction thing is very hard….

    I’d maybe read Rori’s “No Closure”…

    or read NTBFOTP (not Rori)…

    only in my humble opinion, nothing to do with the sponsor…

    Read this EMK blog post and check out comment #3 by “BeenThruTheWars” for NTBFOTP. This is NOT your situation but it might help build your resolve to focus on yourself. That’s why I’m citing it here.

    And basically, “I’m me” that’s how I feel, do what I what and own it.


  258.  #258Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    daria and lori, i might be missing some details bc i’m reading bits on my phone… but am wondering… why is the friend/sister supposed to sacrifice what might be her “the one” just bc you like the guy too? My best friend in college liked this guy and the three of us starting hanging out together and it turned out he liked me and i grew to like him and he wanted to date me and i felt scared that she would feel hurt and it would ruin our friendship. so i talked to her about it and she said – i love you and

  259.  #259Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 12:52 pm

    and if he likes you, he likes you. and i would never stand in the way of your happiness or his. i love you both. i was amazed by her genuine love! he and i started dating and the three of us became even closer in our friendship. we were three best friends. then she got hit by a car and died and we were devastated. she was truly an angel.

  260.  #260Daria on February 17, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    When I first came yo the blog rori told me I had a strong nerf to ‘ contribute’ . Ast tje time I didnt se how this could ossibly be a block … Til I have it up surrendered it. I’m Worthy Under,that. Can I drop it? If no, why

  261.  #261Daria on February 17, 2011 at 12:58 pm

    Lucy I didn’t ferl goid with it. Or talk aboit it w her in a way that got me yo that place. I dont wasnt a friend who dates guys I likr. It fels bad to me. Rori face me some words around this.last monthY

  262.  #262Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    @254: Boomer says:
    “SLV, I’ll bite. What is the reference to the miniature uterus? Can you elaborate for us newbies?…”

    That’s what a siren uses instead of a business plan, market research, investment portfolio, or anything else. That’s how you make your money… It’s feminine. 😛

    Note: I’m not feminine so I must be active in managing my resources if I wish to continue being able to get up in the morning at whatever time I please and go whereever I wish during the day. I am not retired and I am far from rich.


  263.  #263Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    My potential CD responded well and MASCULINELY (yay!) to my FM about taking the email conversation to the phone:


    I am so glad you feel good about our communication too.

    {Blah blah stuff about my knee rehab because he asked about it.}

    On another note, it feels kinda tiring trying to communicate so much via email. I like talking on the phone better. What do you think?


    I agree.
    Let me know.

    Woohoo! I am actually getting this stuff to work, no???

  264.  #264Daria on February 17, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    I frel indpired ny carol look who makes much more than her husband …but he provides for te household. Her money frim biz is just .prosperity income . it doesn’t go to providing.

  265.  #265Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    Oops! I left his phone number in!

    Now nobody call him, OK!!!

    Oh my gosh!!!

  266.  #266Daria on February 17, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    I like trip use my magical powers in stead of planning to manifest a bigu life. Its brm beter than planning. I do fel rich and during richer. I fel closed of and bad yo ferl ridiculed aboit it. I understand its a persons nvs triggering them to ridicule. They tel that person its selfish our silly to trust their magic. Its in me too thats why I’m triggered.

  267.  #267Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    Boomer I am wondering if you could write to to ask them to delete the post with the number.

  268.  #268Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    Ack! Now he wants me to text him when I am free b/c I said that I am in “Mommy Mode” until about 10:30 and is that a good time for him?

    Do sirens text their availability for allowing the wooing to commence????

  269.  #269kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    #243 “Did you communicate during reaching out that “you are there” when he is ready to communicate? That would leave the door open so if he feels like it he knows it would be safe to contact you. But he has to feel like it. You have a right to mess up, you are human. He has a right to be upset, he is human.”

    Thanks. I feel I left the door open, but now reading this I wonder how he perceives it, like does he feel he has a safe, open, receptive woman to open up to again?

    After Paris we had a long talk. He was obvs very hurt and not understanding at that this was a financial decision. I think he knows I have zero attraction to this client, but he still views this as infidelity. I understand. He’s a man. He says he’s suspicious that I’ll do this again next time I’m in debt.

    ‘As much as I like you, Kaitlyn, what’s that say about me if I took you back? I’d be a sucker. I’d be a chump.’ And THIS is coming from a quiet introverted guy who despite his accolades and accomplishments, has low self-esteem already.

    However, like pre-Paris, I did remind him that how I started feeling based on his withdrawal emotionally plus not following through on things he said he’d do VEERED my decision twds yes to Paris. Ok Sirens, THAT I’m realizing too late is BLAME and completely counter-productive to gaining his attraction and connection back.

    The next convo days after that was regarding how I finally got my jacket back from his friend’s house. Amicable convo, but I did say I’m over come with guilt and that I ruined my life. He said ‘you didn’t ruin your life.’ We left it at that and said goodnight.

    Next day I called at 3am and no answer. He emailed saying “I was sleeping when you called. What’s up?’

    Me: ‘I was asleep in your flannel and just wanted to spend a few mins saying good night…’

    No answer. Though the last response was mine and it was friendly.

    But now I’m wondering if he really does see my door as open?

    Did it seem like my door is open?

  270.  #270Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:23 pm

    Boomer I think it is safe to take that as him leading and you get to decide if you want to follow.

  271.  #271Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    FW, I did just that! Thanks for the advice. D’oh! I must be more careful in my excitement!

  272.  #272Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    RE 269 Kaitlyn I think “Me: ‘I was asleep in your flannel and just wanted to spend a few mins saying good night…’ just tells him you are missing him and thinking about him. Also calling at 3 a.m. seems to communicate that you could not sleep.

    “Please feel free to contact me when you need to talk” or something like suggests the door is open and he has the option to contact you. If he doesn’t choose to anything you do could possibly come across as controlling. I might be wrong but it seems the ball is in his court now as you have given him the power.

  273.  #273Boomer on February 17, 2011 at 1:37 pm

    The guy’s phone number and assertion that he’d call me tonight were deleted from 263 above. Wow…being more careful.

  274.  #274kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    When would I say “Please feel free to contact me when you need to talk.” ??? Or should I go in Tinque mode and not contact him AT ALL unless he contacts me? Hmmmn…

  275.  #275Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:42 pm

    RE 274 Kaitlyn I would do exactly what Tinque suggests. If he does I would insert the invitation to call me when he wants to if I still feel that same way at that point. You might not but it will also give you an opportunity to practice being open and to exploring what might work.

  276.  #276kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 1:43 pm


  277.  #277tinque on February 17, 2011 at 1:43 pm

    Please don’t message him kaitlyn. He needs time and space to figure this all out.

  278.  #278tinque on February 17, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    If he does call or message you, tell him this, “I miss you.” That’s it.


  279.  #279Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    Tinque do you mind telling why not give him the impression that he can call again later if he wishes? Especially if she misses him? Does it come across as too eager?

  280.  #280Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    i feel angry and sad about not being chosen by the men i liked. 🙁 making a sad sad pouty pouty sad face. feeling it in my body head to toe. feels relaxing similar to sex! i feel surprised. i feel pleasure in my feet hehe. my body feels alive tingly receptive open full. hmm the pain sadness anger is only in my thoughts. choose better-feeling thoughts? am i able? i will try. oops there is no try – only do or do not. what better-feeling thoughts should i choose?

  281.  #281Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 1:49 pm

    Wise words from the Evan Marc Katz free newsletter:

    “The man of your dreams is NOT the one of your fantasies.
    It’s the guy who calls you when he says he’s going to call you, the one who introduces you to his family, the one who is already planning for your future.
    Once you get this, the rest is actually quite easy.”


  282.  #282kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 1:50 pm


    NIIIICE! That feels authentic to me.

    But man, did I miss my chance to do that. After our first post-Paris huge talk, neither of us contacted each other for 4 days. Then he emails.

    He: “It’s snowing here. It’s cold.”

    Me: “Then get your sexy ass back here to CA.”

    No response. Until I called to say I picked up my jacket from his friend’s.

    I was trying Christian Crater’s ‘cool girl’ approach. I wish I would’ve said “I miss you.” Would that have been better?


  283.  #283tinque on February 17, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    FeminieWoman – There is the subtle or maybe not so subtle implication of an order. Asking someone to call you if they want smells strongly of agenda. In a case such as this, kaitlyn or someone like her wants to feel better. If he calls, she will feel better. This isn’t really about him at all.

    It would be very different if a man’s father died for example and this was said. In this case it would be appropriate.


  284.  #284Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    am open to suggestions for better-feeling thoughts. thank you.

  285.  #285tinque on February 17, 2011 at 1:53 pm

    You’re not a failure kaitlyn. You’re learning just as we all are. It’s our job as living breathing human creatures. Some learn better than others. It’s a wonderful thing that you are here and learning now rather than not at all.


  286.  #286kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 1:55 pm


    xoxoxo right back.

    Curious as to know if I screwed up with my response and if ‘I miss you’ would’ve faired better.

  287.  #287Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    RE 283 Thanks, makes sense.

  288.  #288Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 1:57 pm

    Tinque I should ask if a man is being feminine if after the withdrawal he shows up with the “miss you” line? I have experienced that but didn’t know how to respond so I eseentially ignored it by changing the subject.

  289.  #289Terry on February 17, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    I haven’t been on here in a long time. Life has felt crazy for months now.

    I feel exhausted from this relationship stuff. I bought Rori’s ebook – I have read it multiple times. I bought two of her programs – have watched and listened to them ad nauseum. I’ve read a couple of EMK’s ebooks. I’ve also read other ebooks.

    I don’t chase men. I stay with my feelings. I chose my words without any drama. I Don’t. Do. Anything.
    as far as leaning forward…etc., etc. I circular date.

    Men disappear around the holidays and Valentine’s Day. When I express my feelings they act as if I have three heads. When I lean back and don’t call or pursue… neither do they. I have found most of them to be lazy. It feels they’re making it their mission to out-girl me. i feel frustrated, because I can’t convey how it makes me feel, because they don’t pursue.

    Rori has been married a long time. I feel curious. Have times just changed? Have men become so accustomed to not having to pursue or work for a woman (especially with the “hook-up” mentality), that most of them are just passive and lazy? Does anyone else feel this way? Are we women only here to help teach and turn things around for the next generation of women?

    I feel so discouraged.

  290.  #290Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 2:00 pm


    Do you think I can txt my guy who still didn’t contact me after he came back from vacation in Canada? What if he is sick?

    Will it give him too much power?

  291.  #291tinque on February 17, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    kaitlyn – I see you way overthinking this. One thing to remember always, and I’m not the only one who has said this, you can’t say the wrong thing to the right man.

    You don’t know nor will you ever know if one phrase might have worked better than another.

    You only have right now, and you move forward from the now. Things will fall as they will. The only way this man will come back if he does is by keeping your heart and thus your energy open and receptive, AND by taking your focus AWAY from him. Put your focus back on you.


  292.  #292tinque on February 17, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    FW – If you want to outgirl him, melt, melt, melt. If he’s in front of you.

    If this message is through e-mail or text, a smiley face should do it, or if you have like I do on my emoticons, sparkling stars.

    This is a good way to convey feeling without using words.


  293.  #293Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    Terry, in my experience men DO go for what they want – they pursue the woman they want – as long as she responds with openness, joy, and receptivity to his pursuit. <3

  294.  #294Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    RE 290 Alonka Your question reminded me of once when my ex, the children’s dad did not hear anything for a week. Sometimes he withdraws and we hear nothing from him. After the week, I got an email “I might have well been dead, was in the hospital for a week and not even an email”. I responded that I thought everything was alright and that he was just being his normal self because he there have been times in the past that I had not heard anything. I was soft and laid back in the response so he responded to my questions telling me what the situation was. Then called.

    Remember we tend to make up stories.

  295.  #295Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    RE 292 What if it is on the phone? Repeat “I miss you too”?

  296.  #296Lee on February 17, 2011 at 2:13 pm

    I just wanted to say THANK YOU to all the fantastic sirens on here… you have helped me SO much. You are all fantastic women and I know your true loves are on their way to you…

    Big love xx

  297.  #297Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 2:13 pm

    @290: Alonka says:

    “…Will it give him too much power?…”

    IMHO, no, don’t text and no, it will not give him too much power.

    It’s Thursday, first day of the weekend. Do you have fun things planned? That would give you some power. And fun.

    I don’t have any fun planned.


  298.  #298Terry on February 17, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Lucy, I know. And thanks for your response. I do feel open and receptive, I smile and show appreciation for things they do, I “mirror” as Evan says.

    The problems arise after a couple or three dates. They want to reverse the roles, sit back, and let me pursue them. When (and if) they contact me and ask why I haven’t called them, I express – in feeling messages – that I don’t feel comfortable pursuing men. That’s usually The End.

  299.  #299Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    Re: 259

    Yes, there is a lot more to my situation/story that what is here in this thread. It starts back a couple of posts.

  300.  #300Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 2:19 pm


    Thank you so much;) I like this approach.

    he will not contact me only if he really decided to break up, right. But in that case my txt is not gonna do me any good.

    I did respond to his txt from Canada with a couple of lines and a few questions which he didn’t reply to. No need to lean forward, right.

  301.  #301Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 2:24 pm


    Thank you once again:)

    I just challenged my ‘cheap’ guy who wanted to go out tomorrow night and he said no to my date plan. He wants me to cook him dinner! I understand, last week I only took him to see an opera, he prob missed dinner since then!! lol

    Otherwise I have a tentative CD for Sat brunch.

    Also, I need to study a lot this weekend and sure will come up with more fun plans.

    Hope you get plans last minute, they are the most fun ones! And the weather is improving so your cold should go away for good!!!

  302.  #302Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    @298: Terry says:

    “… I express – in feeling messages – that I don’t feel comfortable pursuing men. That’s usually The End….”

    I’m curious. Did you ever asking in a thinking response why they haven’t called you or if they want you to call them?


  303.  #303Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    Terry I hear you but you know what I practice even in the office. For me it is about building up my skills also. I find it funny experimenting with the guys in the office and I find they do respond to the feelings.

    One just passed and said “everything alright”. I said “I don’t know why you bother if you are not interested”. He turned back and asked again so I responded that yes everything is alright and “I feel valued” because he sat down next to my desk. He responded by laughing and saying he was happy to know that I felt that way.

    On the holiday thing I have friends who disappear. I have also heard guys across cultures suggest that they pick arguments around that time to disappear because they feel obligated to give gifts, especially if they receive. One guy actually said he does not want anyone to give him gifts because of that. On Monday he shared that he cancelled his Valentine’s Sunday arrangements that the girl had called to arrange because “I am a good guy. I know myself, I would have paid”.

    My advice to you would be to practice in the field regardless of whether it is a real date or no. As long as there is a man practice. I find even when they are sitting next to me in the office and I physically lean back in my chair they lean in to me. Sometimes I have 3 at a time at my desk interacting with. There is one who comes over almost every morning to hug and kiss me. He goes as far as saying I love you and shares details about his life with me. I have to admit though that I have 7 guys in my immediate environment so I am lucky to have fertile ground to practice on in the office.

  304.  #304Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    RE 298 Terry have you ever tried flipping “that I don’t feel comfortable pursuing men” to the positive about what you feel or what you want. I also have to check what others say but I think John Gray says that we should not complain so early on. Or maybe “I like strong men who lead”

  305.  #305Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    253: @ FW

    I am listening to you. I went and purchased myself some beautiful flowers. I love flowers.

    I also got a guitar today and am going to teach myself to play that damn thing, if it’s the last thing I do. I LOVE the sound of an acoustic guitar. But alas, I have to cut off my fingernails. lol One of the best parts of the day today was one of the dudes at work, came and played for me in my office. He could have stayed all day and I wouldn’t have complained one bit.

    I am being gentle with myself, loving myself and I want to thank you for your guidance and support. I am hearing you. It is getting through and your efforts have not been for nothing.


  306.  #306Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Lee is this your first time posting?

  307.  #307Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    Terry, one time a guy said something about the slow pace of our attempts to connect, and I responded, “I’m just following your lead, turtle. :)” He replied,”oh yeah? feisty! I like that!” and he stepped up his pursuit. 🙂

  308.  #308Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    @298 Terry

    Sorry, I signed off two quickly and then lost second post.

    Is there some pattern to these guys that you’ve noticed? Are they unkind, boorish, taciturn, gloomy, unsuccessful, dowdy, womanizing, cheap, deceitful, thoughtless, untrustworthy, uneducated, dull and uninteresting, unromantic? Anything else you can think of?


  309.  #309Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    Tinque @ 201 you said to Ann
    “Words are meaningless unless there is action to back them up. I see you getting a bunch of rhetoric in order to shut you up, and aside from words there’s nothing here.”

    I feel very triggered by your comment. It is true that words need to be followed by action, but it felt to me that you were telling Ann she needs to shut up.

    That seems totally unfair to me given that many others on this blog are given the freedom to go over and over their issues and situations. “Talking it through” over and over is just what we need to do sometimes to get to how we feel about a situation and how to move on. The feedback and advice (whether we take it or not) helps us get to that place.

    Also Ann is telling her story and her feelings here, but I wouldn’t mind betting there are so many others silently following this blog that relate to Ann’s story and benefiting hugely from the diaglogue and the terrific feedback she is getting from “the sirens”

    Having said that, I love your way of cutting to the heart of things and giving simple, direct advice.


  310.  #310Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    That’s great Lori C. I see many of the scenarios here reflecting my own life so I sometimes respond to reinforce what I learn and to help myself also. Writing helps to cement what I learn inside me. I also feel overwhelmed at times by problems women have but believe that we can hold each others hand as we go along. It is always easy to be catty and tear each other down so I cherish this space where we can celebrate each other as women. As well as change ourselves to help our men to learn how to be with us.

  311.  #311Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    RE 307 Lucy thanks for that. That was playful, I will definitely try to use that one.

  312.  #312Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    Winnie I know you addressed Tinque but I just wanted to suggest that it might be a result of the hazard of cyperspace. The comment is misunderstood and I will leave it up to Tinque to clarify.

  313.  #313Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    @ 303: Femininewoman says:
    “I am a good guy. I know myself, I would have paid”.

    Really? I don’t think he’s such a good guy. Do you think he’s a good guy?

    I think a real good guy would not have accepted in the first place, then cancelled with no apparent alternative, disappointing her and wasting her time. And if the girl was someone he liked, I think a good guy would have taken the excellent opportunity to step up, ask her for a little some sort of date and to make her happy instead of wimping out.

    The bar to “good guy-dom” seems rather low these days. Do you think women have anything to do with this?


  314.  #314kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    303 and 313,

    Yes, he’s an asswipe. But it’s her fault for leaning forward asking him out on V Day.

  315.  #315tinque on February 17, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    Winnie – You seem to have misread my words. It’s her man who is giving her a bunch of words, words he knows she wants to hear, to appease her, to get her to leave him alone to do whatever it is he wants to do.

    Please reread my post.


  316.  #316Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    Still searching for a better-feeling thought…. It has to be one that is non-speculative bc I have a hard time holding thoughts that might be untrue. Any ideas?

  317.  #317Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    @284: Lucy says:
    “…am open to suggestions for better-feeling thoughts. thank you…”

    I’ll be standing behind you and hope they toss high…


  318.  #318tinque on February 17, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    Lucy – I’ve been thinking about your request, and everything I come up with sounds trite to me. Sorry.


  319.  #319Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    #308 SLV,

    I agree with you about being surprised with Terri’s experience. In the past few years I went to an unbelievable number of blind dates. Not even once anyone told me why didn’t you call, I am shocked

  320.  #320tinque on February 17, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    Winnie – I just reread my comment to you, and it sounds potentially snippy to me. It wasn’t meant in that way at all. (blushing)


  321.  #321Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 2:55 pm

    RE 313 He is 39 and in my opinion immature. I don’t consider him a good guy, but I love when they talk because it clarifies for me how guys think. He is currently separated so still married and pines for his wife. He seems to make it clear that he is not interested in getting in a serious relationship. He says he tells them “let’s date and sees where it goes”. It told me that the girl was in pure boy energy and he accepted so as not to hurt her feelings. He explained he had gone shopping at an outlet mall and ended up spending more than he planned to. He did not want her to pay for him so he bailed. I pointed out to him that when he spoke to me on Friday it was clear she was going to pay. That was when he made that comment, so I believe him.

  322.  #322Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    wow Tinque, I so appreciate your resistance to offering trite suggestions! That feels good. Thank you! (I also feel surprised! in a good way.) SLV, thank you for your humor. 🙂 If anyone has a non-trite, non-speculative good-feeling thought suggestion, SLV and I are ready to catch it. 🙂

  323.  #323Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    @300: Alonka says:
    “… few questions which he didn’t reply to. No need to lean forward, right….”

    Right, he didn’t reply to you. So if anything he owes you a reply. Concentrate on making happy yourself. First, you’ll be happy. Second, happy non-clingy women are more attractive. Nothing to lose! That’s what I’m doing.

    If you have new CD guys contacting you, you could reply to them.

    Did you listen to the John Gray mp3, was that the one you listened to? I learned some things. It was really inspiring especially the part about soul mates.


  324.  #324Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 3:02 pm

    Lucy/Tinque Is there such a thing as “a better-feeling thought”? Could that be the problem? Isn’t it either a feeling statement or a thinking statement?

  325.  #325Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 3:03 pm

    Femininewoman @ 312 and Tinque

    Sorry, I had another look and I did misinterpret Tinque’s words. This is such a 1 dimensional way of communicating and words can so easily be misunderstood without the non verbal cues.

    It probably says something about my issues that I “saw” it the way I did. Learning, learning all the time. : ) I think we need to be careful to word things clearly on here. We know what we are thinking as we write things, but the reader doesn’t allways. I hope Ann didn’t take it the wrong way.

    Thanks for picking me up on it. xx

  326.  #326Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 3:04 pm

    @ 325
    Typo alert! *always*
    haha I hate typos!

  327.  #327Terry on February 17, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    Re: 302, 303, 304 Yeah, there’s only so much I can write at one time, but I do “flip” around my feeling messages – while melting – how I want to feel like a girl, I feel special when a man calls and leads. I smile and flirt while saying it, too.

    I also practice feeling messages on everyone – co-workers, family, friends, dates. At times I even feel like I’m over-doing it.

    Re: 307 Lucy, I love your turtle comment!
    Re: 308 SLV Um, most of the men are educated and appear very nice. Of course, we can’t possibly know anyone upfront or in such a short space of time. However, if I had to pinpoint one “flaw” maybe it would be they’re a bit self-centered??

    Also, even though I don’t exactly feel like I’m complaining to these guys, I wouldn’t even have to express those kinds of feeling messages if they would just step up to the plate in the first place. Lol!!

  328.  #328Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    RE 325 Winnie what it does for me is get me to pay closer attention to myself because I have to wonder what guys looking at me see and hear. One thing for sure I now pay closer attention to them and their body language. I also notice that they go to some lengths to clarify specific words in order to be very clear about what they mean or want to communicate.

  329.  #329tinque on February 17, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    FW – interesting question. Yes I think there can be better feeling thoughts. Change the thought, change the feeling. So the way I see it, the natural progression would be a better feeling thought.


  330.  #330Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    winnie, to me, tinque’s statement was worded very clearly and well. i agree with your thought that perhaps you mis-read it bc of your own filters/triggers. Do you feel that you are being asked to “shut up” somewhere in your life? <3

  331.  #331Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    @301: Alonka says:
    “…I just challenged my ‘cheap’ guy who wanted to go out tomorrow night and he said no to my date plan…”

    I think Rori advises that we lean back and allow the guy to make a date plan. I believe that is a good idea. Sorry to say, yes he does sound cheap. You already bought him opera tickets and he wouldn’t get you a bottle of water at intermission or a cab! IMHO, don’t make any date plans for him.

    I think some sirens might say “run” but if you are not in love with him he might make excellent practice. He’s a damn hard case if you don’t mind my saying so! 😆


  332.  #332Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 3:10 pm

    Lucy: ” I have a hard time holding thoughts that might be untrue”

    What is your criteria for determining if a thought is untrue or not?

  333.  #333Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:11 pm


    I don’t have cold. It’s a more serious chronic thing but I’m hanging in there. Thanks for your inspiration, I will make an effort to get outside this weekend!


  334.  #334tinque on February 17, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    Lucy & SLV – How about this, “it was a gorgeous, springlike day (maybe winter is over?). It felt so lovely having warm air kiss my cheeks today, and the sun made my body supple and glowy. Along with spring comes new beginnings.”



  335.  #335tinque on February 17, 2011 at 3:14 pm

    LG – If it feels bad, it’s a lie.


  336.  #336Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 3:15 pm

    Lucy @ 330

    Constantly!! Haha!! Actually not so much asked to shut up as going unheard.

    I’m the oldest in a large family and seem to be the one everyone turns to when they need support/advice/money and they are all so caught up in the “dramas” of their own lives when I want to unload a bit of my “stuff” that I end up being the one doing the listening to them again. I feel so drained by it sometimes.

  337.  #337Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    RE 327 Terry have you ever asked anyone how you come across? I am wondering if there could possibly be a hidden attitude that could even be hidden under your radar of consciousness? Somebody might be able to give you feedback that could help. I have done that with a guy in the office that I am close to and to my close guy friends. I realize there could be the campaign effect also so I ask them to be honest. I have a male friend in the office who ask me to pull him by the ears and pull him back so he says he takes that privilege with me also, even if I don’t ask. But he adds “with all due respect”. He considers me a good friend.

  338.  #338Lori C on February 17, 2011 at 3:23 pm

    Re: 303

    Holy Hannah!

    I’m going to start practicing on my work guys tomorrow. Totally switch it up. I am a Senior person so they look to me for guidance, which, I suppose is masculine, but I bet I can do the same thing from a feminine angle. This should be interesting.

  339.  #339Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:23 pm

    @319: Alonka says:

    “…I agree with you about being surprised with Terri’s experience…”

    I wasn’t surprised that she’s getting these responses.

    However I am curious if there is a pattern in the kind of the guys responding this
    way and ending the dating sequence. I’m also curious if anyone is responding in different way than the one she posted.

    Helpful research I think. This is how I am learning.


  340.  #340Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 3:26 pm


    RE: #146 – You could say to your sister:

    M, you, and I have been friends for years. I feel sick about my trust being broken with you. I haven’t said anything up to now because I feel afraid that if I say anything, it will forever impact our relationship. I feel very heavy hearted and angry about how your crush on M has been handled this past 7 weeks. I felt betrayed in the worst way and still do. What do you think?

    Lori, it’s hard for me to write feeling messages because I am not you. Does this say anything you intend to say?

  341.  #341Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    @321 FW

    “…It told me that the girl was in pure boy energy and he accepted so as not to hurt her feelings…”

    And then cancelled so she’d feel even better… LOL 😆

    Well, kaitlyn, called him an a&&wipe. I wasn’t going to go that far…now I will…


  342.  #342Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    @322 Lucy

    Are you seeking subject specific good-feeling thoughts or good-feeling thoughts in general?


  343.  #343Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    RE 341 No arguments there. For me it is about learning their process or the process of the unavailable/unattached man that we try to change.

    Last night I had a 50 year-old-never-married say to me “you have stopped calling me”. I made it clear in the past that I certainly don’t want him and he is tryng to convince me now that he is “good marriage material” in those same words. I flung back i am the girl here. He talks all the time about not being married or not wanting to be married but is currently living in a separated woman’s home because he had problems where he “lived”. He is cheap as hell and my 5 year knowledge of him is that is always on the “take”, always wanting with nothing to give.

  344.  #344Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:37 pm

    @327: Terry

    Bottom line, as far as one could tell after say three dates. Are these guys, excluding their “bye-bye question” to you, generally the kind that women would want to continue dating?


  345.  #345Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 3:39 pm


    335: tinque says:

    LG – If it feels bad, it’s a lie.


    Thursday, 17 February 2011 @ 3:14pm

    Yes, that’s my way of knowing as well.

  346.  #346cateyes3 on February 17, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    This morning, I got myself a neat bracelet (like what Rori suggested of switching from boy to being female) which is a new concept for me but feels awesome!

    It’s almost like you can literally feel the switch.

    This bracelet has two words… Love Life! Powerful words. 🙂

  347.  #347Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    subject-specific, SLV. I think I’ve got it: “I might be chosen by a man I like some day.” That feels better than the thought “I wasn’t chosen by the men i liked.” This new thought feels hopeful. I was testing it out while making tea a few minutes ago, and I started to tear up, to my surprise. For me, that is a good thing. I feel like a hopeful little girl believing that life might actually some day bring me wonderful new things. I don’t know for sure, but I can hope. I feel like Eowyn. I so relate to her.

  348.  #348Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    LG and Tinque. That doesn’t work for me. for example, the thought, “I don’t have a man to sleep with tonight” feels bad, but it’s not a lie.

  349.  #349Lee on February 17, 2011 at 3:58 pm

    306: Femininewoman says:
    Lee is this your first time posting?

    Thursday, 17 February 2011 @ 2:35pm

    Hi FW 🙂

    I have posted a while ago about my situation, we broke up after 4 years of on again off again, and in mid Nov I said enough is enough… I was not being treated in the way that I wanted, and after reading here I realised that I was in an imaginary relationship with no commitment whatsoever…

    I have been through all the stages of grief, and was very angry at the beginning of this year… now I am accepting… I made the mistake of sleeping together on quite a few occassions (leaning forward on my part, the sex was amazing)… then I remembered my boundaries and stepped back again. I have been very ill for the last month or so and leaned forward again, and of course was disappointed with the response that I got. The medication I was on clouded my judgement and feeling so unwell I was very emotional and vulnerable.

    In the last few days I am finally regaining my health and of course my sanity and have leaned back and only replied with FM to the texts he has sent (on Mon & today) asking how I am feeling.

    This site has helped me so much, I have Rori’s Ebook, Committment Blueprint and Modern Siren. I have been working on my girl energy and started to CD – only got 1 atm but more are on their way 🙂

    I am feeling sane again, and as much as I miss him, I realise that he will not change unless he wants to, and he was not treating me the way that I want. I met him after only a couple of weeks of separating from my ex husb. and didn’t heal at all at that time. I feel so much better now, I am learning to be on my own again after 12 yrs and 2 relationships. I’m only 33.

    Once again, a heartfelt THANK YOU and HUGS to all the amazing women on here, you have helped me so much on my journey, and I am reading the blog constantly to remind me that ‘I am the prize!’…

    Big love xx

  350.  #350Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 3:59 pm


    Are you sure this not a thought?

    “I feel sick about…my trust being broken with you.”

    Maybe it seems kind of blamey and I bet I could refute it. I don’t think adding “I feel sick” in front of something makes the “something” true. The “something” could be true but maybe it’s not true. There is a flaw.


  351.  #351Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:01 pm


    One day soon I will be chosen by a man that I like.


  352.  #352Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 4:04 pm

    Lee thanks for sharing your story. For me it took and bit of going back and forth to finally find the strength to totally lean back. As Rori says its babysteps. I believe you are in a good place and I hope you heal both emotionally and physically. I am using visualizations and self talk to build my self-esteem and the life I want in my unconscious mind to change my emotions and use every tool and forum I can to practice in. It is amazing how were born girls and somehow allowed our socialization to get it all warped.

  353.  #353Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:10 pm

    SLV, for me that thought wouldn’t feel good bc it might not be true. I have too much experience with believing things that turned out not to be true… I used to be quite a believer/dreamer/magical-thinker. I still try sometimes but it always feels bad. (It used to feel good, until things started proving my thoughts to be untrue.) But I feel good about the thought I wrote above.

  354.  #354Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 4:10 pm

    Lucy and SLV

    How about “One day soon I will choose a man that I like and he will love me for that”

  355.  #355Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 4:15 pm

    Lucy remember the unconscious mind tries to find ways to create things we have there. So I have worked with changing my thoughts or words around that I struggle with believing such as “I am married” to “I am open and ready for marriage”. Rori has also suggested writing our stories about our relationships in the present as if it is currently happening. Will look it up for you. It is somehow based in the law of attraction. Alicia wrote something also on the previous article about it.

  356.  #356Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:15 pm

    351: Senior Lady Vibe says:

    “One day soon I will be chosen by a man that I like.”

    “One day soon a man that I like will choose me.”

    I think I like the more active second version. What do you think?


  357.  #357Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    Winnie I love having the power of choice.

  358.  #358Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:18 pm

    haha I like that one, Winnie. It would be cool to believe that. it wouldn’t stick for me though – wouldn’t feel good for long bc of the might-not-be-true factor.

  359.  #359Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 4:19 pm

    Lucy remember that beliefs are powerful.

  360.  #360Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:19 pm

    @354: Winnie

    Thanks, Winnie I like the “he will love me for that.” I’m still playing around with it. We have got to hurry the wedding is next Valentine’s Day. 😀


  361.  #361Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 4:20 pm


    RE: #350 – Lori was asking for suggestions for feeling messages. If you have time to develop them for her, have at it. In the meantime, I don’t like to be criticized.

  362.  #362Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:21 pm

    “One day soon I might choose a man who loves me for it and chooses me back.”

  363.  #363Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 4:22 pm

    Question is it the “you” in our statements that actually make them blameful and critical?

  364.  #364Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    @353: Lucy says:
    “…SLV, for me that thought wouldn’t feel good bc it But I feel good about the thought I wrote above….”

    Sorry, I’ll just work on one for me. Still playing around with it… 😀


  365.  #365Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    Lucy, I think in the end we are the only one who can choose. We alone get to decide which of the men who choose us is the right one for us.

  366.  #366Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    @361: Brenda says:
    “… I don’t like to be criticized…”

    OK, but it’s not fair to mislead someone. I value fairplay so I will remark on it.


  367.  #367Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    Lucy @ 362


  368.  #368Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:29 pm

    Thank you FW, I do that too. I hope former CD is able to fix my computer when he comes sunday – I would enjoy communicating on the blog much more that way than on my phone… tho am grateful for my phone. soon this thread will be too long for my phone tho. 🙁 feel a lil excited about former CD coming over… but a bit scared I will flirt with him and make him want what he can’t have even more than he does already.

  369.  #369Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    my other options for a computer-fixer were 1) a stranger, 2) TN man who would drive the 4 hours to help me if I agreed to kiss Interloper Girl, 3) WH whom I did not ask bc he would probably drive 1.5 hrs to help bc he is kind and I would end up with my heart aching and pining like crazy. So I picked former CD.

  370.  #370Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    @354: Winnie says:

    How about:
    “One day soon I will choose a man that I like and he will love me for that”

    “One day soon I will be chosen by a man that I like.”

    “One day soon a man that I like will choose me.”

    Let’s see what I can come up with that’s true and useful.


  371.  #371Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 4:44 pm

    oh yes, Winnie, I agree we get to choose – that is exctly my point – I want the guy I want – but the catch is, he has to choose us too in order for it to work, right? 🙂

  372.  #372Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    370: Senior Lady Vibe says:
    @354: Winnie says:
    How about:
    “One day soon I will choose a man that I like and he will love me for that”
    “One day soon I will be chosen by a man that I like.”
    “One day soon a man that I like will choose me.”
    Let’s see what I can come up with that’s true and useful.
    “One day soon a man that I like very much will find me and we will choose each other…


  373.  #373Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 5:00 pm

    Lucy, I am picturing many men choosing me and I am struggling to decide who among them is right for me.

    (Gotta have dreams!)

  374.  #374tinque on February 17, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    It felt really good to have been chosen. Strangely or maybe not so, I didn’t realize I too had chosen until much, much later.


  375.  #375Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    Boomer —

    I’m coming into this a bit late — but have read with interest your comments on the religion, and the divorce, and how it is playing out.

    The religion (cult) I grew up in had rules exactly like this. Makes me wonder what religion they are.

    A couple of things about groups like that:

    The rules are so black/white and so rigid that no one can really keep up all the time. It’s beyond us.

    That means that everyone is trying really hard to be a “good group-member” and feeling like they’re failing.

    These groups function on a “principal of least interest” in the EXTREME — similar to what we are working on in relationships. Imagine a dysfunctional relationship where they guy is ALWAYS leaning back, and you are ALWAYS chasing his love.

    You’ll do ANYTHING to keep him. You’ll give up anything. You HAVE to have him, no matter what his demands.

    This is what it’s like being part of these groups. The group and its rules are always in “leaned back” position, and you are always in “chasing love / over-functioning” position.

    This is why her family is willing to side against her. Because, her leaving and breaking the rules puts them in the position that they’re willing to do anything to maintain good standing in the group.

    Messed up, I know, but this is the psychology of it.

    You can never talk anyone out of a group like this. I have an extremely high IQ, and couldn’t think my way out. I was raised in it, and it goes three generations back in my family. I had total belief that the group was right, and that I HAD to follow the rules, be a good member, etc….

    I had to be assaulted by an elder and have a nervous break down before it got bad enough for me to leave. I blamed myself. It took me 7 years to deprogram.

    To this day — leaving that group, and the insidious mentality — remains the hardest thing I’ve ever done.

    You will still feel angry, and rightly so, about the way they’re treating your friend. I’m hoping my experience with cult mind control helps you to deal with it.


  376.  #376cateyes3 on February 17, 2011 at 5:10 pm

    I’m starting to feel a little giddy by all of the last couple of comments about “One day soon”…. 🙂

  377.  #377Mercedes on February 17, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    I so wish I could read tonight but I just can’t. I’m sipping the ginger tea and if that doesn’t make me feel a little better then I’m going to make a strong hot toddy and crawl into bed.

    I did eat dinner though. Very yummy even without much for taste buds: hummus with roasted red pepper from the local deli, warmed whole wheat pita and kalmata olives with two small balls of fresh mozzarella. Packed with protein and nutrients so at least I’m not letting that part go.

    Hope all is well with all of you…

    Much Love,

  378.  #378kaitlyn on February 17, 2011 at 5:21 pm

    I was chosen and I blew it.

  379.  #379Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 5:22 pm

    Hello, Sirens,

    I’m still dating M. I enjoy him, but don’t think I’ll marry him. I like dating him, though.

    So, last night, he was supposed to come over, then texted and said he just wasn’t up to it, and was really emotional and having a hard time. He wanted to talk on the phone. I said that would be okay with me.

    Now — I’m thinking of Daria’s comment: “respect his masculinity by not worrying about his feelings”

    and Rori’s statement: “the way to a man’s heart is through his emotions, his feelings.”

    So, I took the phone call, and tried to focus on identifying the feelings he was describing as he was talking to me. He responded well to that.

    I also told stories and identified similar feelings I have/had.

    I did not try to fix him or his problems. I did reassure him a bit about his ex — who recently dumped on him — and about his guilt over whether he spends enough time with, gives enough to his daughter.

    I think it’s a good thing when a man wants to call me up and talk about his feelings.

    How do Sirens handle this?

    I haven’t gotten there in the Rori programs; I assume she must handle this.

    What do you brilliant and fascinating women think about this? Do you have similar stories, or insights?


  380.  #380Ella on February 17, 2011 at 5:26 pm


    “I just challenged my ‘cheap’ guy who wanted to go out tomorrow night and he said no to my date plan. He wants me to cook him dinner! I understand, last week I only took him to see an opera, he prob missed dinner since then!! lol”

    Huh?? I hope you said no?!!

    He wants you to cook him dinner?

    You took him to the opera?

    Are you choosing the ‘boy’ role here?

    I may have missed some posts further up but I hope that you (and he by default) are putting your needs first?


  381.  #381Ella on February 17, 2011 at 5:29 pm


    This is an interesting question and one that I have wondered about too!

    I will be interested to hear the responses bc I have had this happen to me too where a guy will start to open up and get in touch with his feelings.

    And that is fine, I mean we want him to feel safe to do so, but we still want him to be the man so we don’t want to get too focused on his feelings.

    How do we handle this situation?

  382.  #382Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 5:30 pm

    Kaitlyn —

    Thank you so much for the whole food info.

    I have EXTREME trouble with food issues.

    For the past year, I have been gluten-free. Some time recently, I fell off the wagon, and I’ve been eating bread products ever since.

    They’re like crack to me.

    So, my biggest problem is actually sticking with anything I try to do.

    I have been thinking that, now that I have given my body a year of gluten-free detox, I could go with a more standard diet.

    I try really strict diets, like whole foods, and gluten-free — do them for a while — then fall off and have no plan.

    Maybe I just need to do something that’s not extreme. My life is so incredibly busy that I just need food to be easy, nutritious and done.

    And, as for your comment, “I was chosen and I blew it.”

    I’m wondering if, after the emotions have faded, you’ll look back at this guy and be grateful you’ve moved on past that level of relationship into a healthier level.

    As much as I love/loved B — I want a healthier level of relationship than I had with him. I still cry. And, then I turn him back over to god-source / Universe and allow that it will turn out as it should.

    If he comes back to me, he needs to find his own way back.

    Does that help, at all?


  383.  #383JenniferW on February 17, 2011 at 5:38 pm

    Tinque re:#292,

    What exactly does “melt” mean? Would you give me an example? I’ve heard that term frequently. 🙂

  384.  #384Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 5:39 pm

    Lucy: I’m pretty sure you have plenty of available men to sleep with. 🙂

  385.  #385Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 5:41 pm

    Boomer —

    Depending on what the religion is — your friend could expose it in court.

    Make the case not just about her and laying her bare, but about them, and what they’re doing to her because she’s left the group.

    Are they mainstream? This has happened a couple of times with divorce cases I know of in the religion of my background.

    It does clarify things for the court — and gives your friend a leg to stand on.

    She’ll probably be afraid to say anything against the religion, because that’s what she’s been trained.

    But, she’s got to fight to keep her kids….

    Anyway, I’ll stop now. I just get pretty emotional about situations like this…


  386.  #386Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 5:51 pm

    LG, I will use more precise words: I don’t have a man available to me whom I want to sleep with tonight. —> bad feeling thought but not a lie. What say you? 🙂

  387.  #387Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 5:56 pm


    Your comment is awaiting moderation.
    Lucy: more questions if you feel inclined to answer.

    I feel curious about your choice of religious beliefs. Jes*s being the son of god hasn’t been proven to be true as far as I know, yet many people believe that.

    I feel curious how that fits into your criterium of what makes a belief true.

  388.  #388Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:00 pm

    @376: cateyes3

    I was playing around when I was here a little while ago seeking a personal statement. I’m getting close, not quite there yet…


  389.  #389Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:02 pm


    “…hummus with roasted red pepper from the local deli…”

    My favorite hummus! Feel better soon.


  390.  #390Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 6:03 pm

    Lucy:re 386

    haha! Well, I’d say you have a case of WhatIsitis. That’s what is itis. That’s an Abraham term for someone who is so focus on their “current reality” that they can’t get to a space where they can allow their “desired reality” in.

    Subjective and unprovable? Yes. But it resonates with me.

    They say that we need to care about how we feel. And if a thought makes us feel bad we don’t focus on it. We focus on what makes us feel good. Which draws more and more good feeling things in. But we don’t do it for the purpose of drawing things in. We do it because it feels good to feel good and we care about how we feel.

    I have proof of this in my own life and it is true for me.

  391.  #391Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:07 pm

    @378: kaitlyn says:
    “…I was chosen and I blew it…”

    No, you didn’t. There’s plenty more choosing going on.

    Hugs. 😀


  392.  #392Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:24 pm

    LG, good question. 🙂 That is a major factor behind the shift for me … I used to have strong, sure religious beliefs, but over the past few years, events have caused me to question those beliefs to the point where, like Rori says, we can’t know anything for sure (except for stuff like right now there is not a man in my bed ;)). I still hope that many of my religious thoughts are true, but I don’t know for sure. It is even harder to hold a belief about having the relationship I want bc I have seen people l

  393.  #393Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 6:26 pm

    Ella #380,

    I texted my ‘cheap guy’ back: Oh I was hoping that a smart and successful man like you would want to take me out to a nice dinner at a nice restaurant (even if that involves a cab there and back)!

    He replied: I like my plan better, it’s more creative and fun

    So I dropped it.

  394.  #394Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    live their whole lives and not have the relationship they want.

  395.  #395Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    351: Senior Lady Vibe says:

    “One day soon I will be chosen by a man that I like.”

    “One day soon a man that I like will choose me.”

    I think I like the more active second version. What do you think?



    When you speak in future tense — the imagination — the seat of creating it into your life — sees something off in the future.

    You want to HAVE the experience of choosing the man you like. That means PRESENT TENSE:

    I am drawing the man I like into my life.

    I am attracting the man who chooses me.

    I am attracting my optimal life-mate.

    I am attracting the relationship that is in my highest and best interest.

    I am bringing this man, this relationship, this reality into my life NOW.

    Make it NOW. That’s how law of attraction works.


  396.  #396Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 6:29 pm

    My guy didn’t contact me. I feel terrible. Maybe I should ask him? so it’s not so easy for him to break up: he disappeared and never had even to talk to me

  397.  #397tinque on February 17, 2011 at 6:30 pm

    JenniferW – Melting is having your heart wide open and soft, your entire being pliable, and if you’re being held, you soften against him. No thoughts, just pure beingness. Imagine melting butter. This what you do. Melt into him. Become almost a part of him.


  398.  #398Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    Lucy: I feel ya. Our minds, they want answers.

    The more I learn, the less I know.

    I’m trying to simplify.

    Mostly what I have now is…

    Think thoughts that feel good
    do things that feel good
    say things that feel good
    if I find myself in a situation that is really hard to see the good in, remember that it is temporary. Things can change on a dime.
    Try to soothe myself and feel good

  399.  #399Daria on February 17, 2011 at 6:35 pm

    Lucy why do you think its hardrr for you than the rest of us ?

  400.  #400Darling Ella on February 17, 2011 at 6:39 pm


    What is your view about melting in front of someone u don’t feel safe with? …

    I feel that way with someone…I just melt when he touches me…yet, I never feel safe with him…therefore, I often resist to my own feeling 🙁

    Warm hugs,

  401.  #401Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    Oh, one other thing…

    I try to remember that I an always going to want more than I currently have. That’s what life is about. We have desires and that what keeps us going.

    So, if my current reality doesn’t look exactly like my ideal, I relax knowing that soon what I want will be here. Yet even then my desires will have evolved into something else. My desires are always expanding. That is life.

    I never expect every detail of my life to be perfect.

    I choose to be happy anyway?

    Why? Because I can and it feels good.

    I choose to be optimistic.

    I choose to believe in a kind and benevolent creator.

  402.  #402Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 6:41 pm

    Lisi @ 382
    “I try really strict diets, like whole foods, and gluten-free — do them for a while — then fall off and have no plan.”

    Lisi, you might find the links I’ve put below helpful. It’s not a diet, so easy to stick with long term. Since I cut out sugar all my cravings have gone. My natural appetite control hormones kicked in and started working for me rather than against me. So many benefits other than just weight control.

  403.  #403Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    LG, I fully agree with all that about focusing on what feels good and desired reality etc. I’m just saying that I have experienced Not achieving my desired reality even when I have been completely open and receptive to it. I see a difference btwn *focusing* on what is and simply *acknowleding* what is even while open to what is desired.

  404.  #404Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Really for me it boils down to a spiritual crisis. Do you believe God (whatever that means to you) is kind and loving and wants the best for us? That free will means we have the choice to be happy with our reality or not? To see God in everything around us?

    Or do we choose to say
    this isn’t good enough
    you aren’t good enough
    I’m not good enough?

    Life is hard. Life sucks.

    Attitude is everything, not to sound trite 😉

  405.  #405Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 6:48 pm

    Lucy: “Not achieving my desired reality even when I have been completely open and receptive to it

    I know what you mean. I’ve had the same experience. For me it just means I wasn’t as open as I thought I was, that there is still some resistance somewhere.

  406.  #406Daria on February 17, 2011 at 6:50 pm

    Why do I think its harder for me ?

  407.  #407Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:50 pm

    It feels “funny” (strange) and sad having this discussion bc I used to be well-known as the quintessential childlike dreamer/miraclemagic-believer/pillar of faith.

  408.  #408Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:51 pm

    @395: Lisi says:

    “…Make it NOW. That’s how law of attraction works…”

    Ooo, good. Something new to think about. Thanks so much. I’m going to take a break and maybe my mind will perk enough to try a bit more. I know it’s not right,; I’m trying to find the elements.

    I will try present tense. I was making close future because in my reality I will not be meeting sweetie immediately but i feel, feel, feel he is out there…

    A secret (whisper)… i don’t think he’s ready yet either…something. i don’t want to spend too much energy on figuring it out… not quite ready but I’m kinda sure of it.

    If not back tonight, I’ll get back with it soon.

    I appreciate your input, turning me in a new direction.


  409.  #409Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    That’s one thing i am really struggling with in the final edit of my book – it is so full of “desired reality focus” bc most of it was originally written during those years of strong belief in desired reality … but reality turned out differently… so i don’t know what to do with those passages. 🙁

  410.  #410Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 6:58 pm

    @400: Darling Ella says:

    “…yet, I never feel safe with him…therefore, I often resist to my own feeling …

    DE, that’s! Safe. That’s how I want to feel and i’ve kept this word in mind since I read the Rori post about the must have qualities.

    I do not want to spend not even one moment of my time left on earth not feeling safe in the love of my man. I just won’t have it. Dating is just leading up to it but a committed relationslhip has to have that.


  411.  #411Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 6:59 pm

    my fave hummus is greek olive 🙂 i will be sad when my phone stops loading this thread. 🙁 hey! maybe it magically will keep loading even at 1000 comments! would be cool! 🙂

  412.  #412Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 7:01 pm

    I also figure, what do I have to lose with my belief that attitude is everything?

    I mean if it’s true that life sucks, and it’s hard to find the perfect man, and there is no God, life is harsh, a matter of chance and luck…

    Well, I would rather live in a deluded state of happiness. What do I care? I’m happy even if I’m completely wrong about this LOA thing.

    What do I have to lose with choosing to be optimistic?

  413.  #413Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    RE 393 Alonka that was lesson in guys don’t like suggestions. It has to be their idea so we have to help them see our idea as their idea.

  414.  #414Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 7:09 pm

    Lisi, thanks. I wasn’t trying to do LOA though – not trying to get anything with this – just wanting to find a better-feeling thought than the one I had.

  415.  #415Simply Shannon on February 17, 2011 at 7:11 pm

    Lucy, check out The Ultimate Soulmate Summit with Nick Ortner. He’s doing EFT talking about never meeting someone as interesting as Man XYZ.

    You popped into my brain. Love you! Shannon

  416.  #416Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 7:12 pm

  417.  #417Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 7:14 pm

    FW #412

    Thanks, I just couldn’t take it anymore. When asks me out, it’s always ‘for drinks’. Minimal food. Last Sat I invited him to the opera – Placido Domingo was performing in New York (!!!!) He wanted us to meet at the theater, he got himself sparkling water without asking me if I want anything, after the show he suggested ‘drinks’ and said he had a huge dinner. He ate half of my appetizer, then got a cab and asked to go to his house first. So not only I ended up alone in the cab but I had to pay for it too.

    it wasn’t about ‘suggestions’, just when I heard that he wanted me to cook him dinner tomorrow, I couldn’t take it anymore;))


  418.  #418Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    Lucy —

    B. makes this AMAZING home made hummus.

    It’s garlicky and lemony and WONDERFUL.

    He used to make it for me, and then feed me tastes off his spoon. Whatever he was eating — he loved to feed me some of it from his fork.

    That was one of his better qualities. And, he was sooooo good at supporting me in my goals and my direction. He said he loved to “give” and that was true.

    But, he sat on my floor and said he wasn’t ready for a relationship — when he came here — after we’d had sex.

    So, I didn’t stop CD-ing, or break off my relationship with M.

    Then, he flipped out when he asked if I was sleeping with M and I said yes.

    I miss him. I loved him. I’m grateful I knew him and had those experiences.

    Only he can find his way back. Always before, I’ve made the first move — sent a text or an email — re-established contact.

    It’s nearly 3 weeks now. Maybe I’ll never hear from him again. I feel so sad about that.

    Maybe he’ll come back on his own.

    Maybe I’ll move on and not think about him anymore.

    But, as SLV and I have been discussing — affirmation, positive picture time:

    I am MANifesting the relationship that supports me.

    I am MANifesting a relationship that is fulfilling to me — where my sexuality is accepted and valued.

    (I feel like his reaction says that he wanted to OWN my sexuality — and he can’t.)


  419.  #419Winnie on February 17, 2011 at 7:17 pm

    SLV @ 408
    “A secret (whisper)… i don’t think he’s ready yet either…something. i don’t want to spend too much energy on figuring it out… not quite ready but I’m kinda sure of it.”

    Just smiling as I read that comment, it feels so open, leaning back, being an invitation. Just letting it happen. I love it!

  420.  #420Simply Shannon on February 17, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    Skimming through posts now…

    Lucy, re: this statement…

    It is even harder to hold a belief about having the relationship I want because I have seen people live their whole lives and not have the relationship they want.

    You do know people who have the relationship they want though, right? Why is it easier to believe the negative thought versus the positive thought?

    Sounds like you’re willing to believe it’s NOT possible based on the people who don’t have the people you know without that relationship


    believing it IS possible based on the people who do have the relationship they want.


  421.  #421Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    Lucy I am reading your comments and can’t help but think about Virginia Feingold in this month’s interview when she said sometimes we are so caught up in the negative that we can’t see it. For some reason you are somehow coming across as negative. RE 406 I would start to wonder about when that happened to engage my intuition.

    Virignia was saying that at times guys withdraw because they are sensitive to feeling blamed/wronged. They need a safe place to fall. I felt sadness deep in my heart as it reminded me of how caustic my tongue used to be in my younger days and how I took pleasure in tearing down guys. I am trying to make peace with my past but sometimes I wish I could live my life over again.

    Sometimes also I feel sympathetic towards guys when I read our comments on the blog. It seems sometimes that we suggest ignoring their feelings/hurts as if it does not matter. Virginia was saying that yes sometimes the guys are hung up on their ex but don’t feel safe with us why they can’t move the relationship forward. I believe I am in a place to release anyone I love to find real love for themselves wherever they can and in whatever way they can. I want him to be truly happy even if it means it is not with me. I believe that is the greatest gift I can give. I am committed to finding my own happiness.

  422.  #422Simply Shannon on February 17, 2011 at 7:22 pm

    My word, I can’t write…

    Sounds like you’re willing to believe it’s NOT possible based on the people who don’t have the relationship they want


    believing it IS possible based on the people who do have the relationship they want.


  423.  #423Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    RE 417 Lisi I have heard that men are territorial. A guy told me that. That is the reason when they feel safe and are sure of their “the one” the move in quickly to close the deal.

  424.  #424Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:25 pm

    WonderWoman I am wondering where you are and what is happening with the situation with your friend? Hope all is going well.

  425.  #425Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 7:30 pm

    LG, 398 – I feel heard. thank you. that’s what i’ve got too. 🙂 That’s why I was looking for a better-feeling thought. Your other posts too – yes, we are in agreement on ALL of that! Seems our main departure is just the “bad-feeling thought equals a lie” belief. I’m with you on the rest of it. Daria, I feel confused as to why you think I think “it’s harder for me”…. I feel surprised and puzzled reading that. What do you think?

  426.  #426Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 7:31 pm


    RE: #416 – Ewwww!

  427.  #427Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:31 pm

    RE 416 Alonka I realized that but I was just pointing it out in case you missed that lesson as you were so focussed on him being cheap. To a certain extent I don’t see him as cheap. Reason being you are focussed on him as if you are a victim. Take full responsibility for what is happen and try to see what you are doing to encourage/invite that situation. Virginia suggested something similar in this month’s interview. It is also a concept I have heard from Christian Carter and Gay Hendricks; take 100% responsibility for everything happening in your life. Evan Marc Katz says we are the ones who accept the man. They do what they do, it is up to us to accept it.

    If you take 100% responsibility for what is happening in your life and focus on yourself what would you be doing in the situation?

  428.  #428Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:33 pm

    RE 417 Lisi I have heard that men are territorial. A guy told me that. That is the reason when they feel safe and are sure of their “the one” the move in quickly to close the deal.


    True. His feelings were at the point where he couldn’t handle me being with anyone else. But he was still telling me he wasn’t ready for a relationship.

    I took him at his word — something he used to say I didn’t do. He said I never listened. This time I did.

    If he comes back, he’ll know not to do that again.

    Maybe he’ll know not to do that again with the next woman he meets — and he will be happy with her for the rest of his life.

    I genuinely want him to be happy. I have so much love, tenderness and compassion for him.

    He’s just my sweetheart.

    Tears now.


  429.  #429Darling Ella on February 17, 2011 at 7:35 pm

    SLV #415:

    So beautiful song 🙂 Thank you for sharing…:) I haven’t listened to it before 🙂

    You said:

    “I do not want to spend not even one moment of my time left on earth not feeling safe in the love of my man. I just won’t have it. Dating is just leading up to it but a committed relationship has to have that.”

    Oh, gosh, I so agree with u…

    I would give the same advice…yet, it feels awful…I feel like I am a walking contradiction…

    On one side I believe and embrace the belief that men can heal through our hearts…yet, on the other side…i really don’t know how i can reconcile it within me when i feel so unsafe…:(

    Warm hugs,

  430.  #430Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    RE 416 Alonka I should say about 4 years ago I invited that 50 year old I spoke about earlier to a Broadway show because I wanted to see the show so badly and my then bf was away. He asked how much was the ticket but I said it was okay because I was the one inviting. He is as cheap as hell but he did bring a snack for both of us. He stills talk about the Broadway show because that is the only one he has ever been to. I am now trying to remember that guys test our boundaries.

  431.  #431Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:38 pm

    I bought B a Valentine’s card that I didn’t send.

    It says: This Valentine has magical powers. It can only be opened by a wonderful person.

    You open it and it says: see?


    I say, “see?” and B. imitates it and teases me. He loves it.

    On the inside I wrote:


    I don’t know if I’ll ever give this to you, or if I’ll only write it for me. There’s a song call, The Dance. It goes:

    I’m glad I didn’t know
    The way it all would end
    the way it all would go
    I could have missed the pain
    But I’d have had to miss
    the -e -e -e -e DANCE.

    For me — it was worth it. I’m grateful to have experience what I did WITH you and THROUGH you.

    Bless your heart,


  432.  #432Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    @412: Femininewoman
    “…393 Alonka that was lesson in guys don’t like suggestions. It has to be their idea so we have to help them see our idea as their idea…”

    Alonka, I think you have to start “getting your Princess on.” I grew up seriously Princessified. And I was a pouting princess from an extremely early age.

    In “princess voice” “Ohhh, I don’t like that” works wonders. It just cannot be fake. I don’t know how to tell you how to get it. Is it inborn? I don’t know. But i noticed that my granddaughter does serious “Princess.” I was buying snacks for her and her brother and the snack machine was stocked wrong and a trail mix bar came out instead of her choice, the machine would not take anymore dollars and I had limited coins. I told her she was welcone to all the coins I had but she didn’t like the choices available so she opted to take nothing.

    I’m a princess too so did not bother to go hunt around asking for change and gave the extra bar to her brother. She also had the snacks brought from home so she was not nutrition deprived.

    But this is a lesson. If you don’t like it, you don’t have to take it. Make them offer you something else. LOL

    I have other “Princess” stories too… 😆 I bet all of the sirens do. I just remembered my sisters and I used to all call each other “Princessa.” LOL


  433.  #433Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    So, tomorrow night, Leaning Forward Guy is taking me to the nicest restaurant in town.

    Here’s the thing: I was busy during the first few emails and such, and totally didn’t pay attention to him.

    He got totally into me. I’m actually not attracted to his pic. Maybe I will be attracted to him in person.

    But — I get scared when a guy leans forward too much.

    I have an insta-claustrophobic response.

    Maybe because I’m a survivor of sexual crimes.

    Maybe because I’m a strongly independent woman, and I do NOT want a guy to take over my life.

    What do you all think? Do you have an “eeewww” response to someone who leans way forward?


  434.  #434Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 7:43 pm


    I encourage you to read the New Testament for yourself, slowly, quietly, and just let it speak to you. The Bible is the Owner’s Manual to the human being. It is an expression of God’s heart and mind, His Words.

    Places like John 1 say, “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” It goes on to say how the Word came to earth and dwelt among us. His Name was Je(sus.

    He is my husband in a very real sense, and I have an intimate relationship with Him. Even tho He lived 2000 years ago, He is alive today, and He lives inside of me.

  435.  #435Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    RE 427 You know Lisi I am a firm believer that they do come back. It has only been 3 weeks and I imagine that under the circumstances he must be very hurt. They don’t handle emotions well and would not want to look weak in your eyes. I believe it is a man thing that they can’t handle infidelity and imagine what is guy friends would say to him if they know. Give him time, work on yourself. He must know how you really feel about him. Should he come back he should be assured of that. I am sure he recognizes it will take a long while to get that level of comfort and compatibility with someone else.

  436.  #436Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    thx shannon! can’t listen to it until my computer is fixed – pray that former CD is able to fix it sunday! or that God sends me a new one 🙂 A laptop would be nice! maybe a Mac like my kids have… with a great word processor with ability to read my old documents. yes thank you God.

  437.  #437Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:48 pm

    Brenda —

    I’ve read the whole New Testament. Repeatedly.

    I have a completely different perspective. I hesitate to express it here, because it would no doubt offend you.

    Although my observations have been enlightening for a number of people — I am careful with it — as it is overwhelming and upsetting for people who are still very involved in traditional American modern Christianity.

    My perspective, however, is not from a lack of knowledge, education, or experience with the New Testament and with Christianity.

    Quite the contrary.


  438.  #438Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    RE 432 “I feel overwhelmed and want to take things slowly until I feel safe.” “i want to keep my options open until I am sure my emotions are safe”

    Just some FMs

  439.  #439Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 7:52 pm

    FW —

    Yes. He was very hurt and angry. I’m sure he still is. And, in some ways, I love that he was — because it tells me how deeply he felt about me.

    I keep letting him go, detaching from the outcome. I allow for the possibility that he will come back.

    I have rarely experienced an emotional connection like I had with him. It was truly magical. He knows that.

    And, thanks for the FM’s, too. I had been thinking something along those lines.


  440.  #440Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 7:54 pm

    @426: Femininewoman says:
    “…RE 416 Alonka I realized that but I was just pointing it out in case you missed that lesson as you were so focussed on him being cheap. To a certain extent I don’t see him as cheap. Reason being you are focussed on him as if you are a victim…”

    FW. The man is cheap as dirt. One of the worst cases I’ve heard of. The good news is, he’s so awful he will make good practice for Alonka who leans forward big time. Yea, Rori, yea CD.


  441.  #441Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:00 pm

    RE 439 I repect your opinion but I choose to look at something else because he is not here and I can’t say anything to change his behavior. I might be able to help Alonka reframe her perspective to broaden awareness.

  442.  #442Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:03 pm


    I did not wish to offend and I hope I did not. I believe you did post that you were not in love with him. Think you are fortunate to have two CDs who are going to help you create the relationship you want.


  443.  #443Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 8:05 pm

    shannon, my statement about some ppl never having the relationship they want was only in response to why I don’t believe it’s a done-deal that I’M getting one. I believe it could go either way for me – therefore I am choosing the good-feeling thought that I *might* indeed have a really awesome the One relationship (yay! hope! feels good!) rather than the thought that I will *definitely* have that (this thought feels bad bc it feels disingenuous for the reason just mentioned).

  444.  #444Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:05 pm

    @440 FW

    There has been previous discussion.


  445.  #445Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:08 pm

    RE SLV The 50 year old I spoke of told me a story of a woman who bought clothes and things for him. According to him the only thing she did not buy was underwear. He went as far as telling us if she was around he would point her out. We were at a social event. I can’t think of anything in my experience that is cheaper. I also feel confident that some other sirens can share similar horror stories.

  446.  #446Femininewoman on February 17, 2011 at 8:12 pm

    Lucy you are very logical/rational right brainer, is it?

  447.  #447Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:12 pm

    @444 FW

    OMG! I hope I don’t run into these kind. Oh, I am, right? Oh, I am. That’s what’s left. We will knock heads at first date. Oh, my.


  448.  #448Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    FW, SLV,

    Thank you and of course I am not offended. I don’t see myself as a victim and I totally invited him to the opera. It’s the rest of the evening that left me speechless;))

    I do use princess voice and it’s a great advice. E.g. when he said he had a big dinner and not hungry I ordered the most expensive appetizer on the menu: $22.

    Do I ‘allow’ him to treat me this way? Well, I don’t make a scene right on spot, but when he asked me out for tomorrow, I told him exactly what I want and I am not going since he is not giving me that.

    Do I lean forward by inviting him to an opera? Don’t think so. We are friends for at least a year, we would have gone on a date that day anyway, so I was lucky to get these tickets and happy to offer them.

    As to my 2 CD’s – well I don’t have them anymore!! This guy I let go and the other one is not calling haha

  449.  #449Eternity on February 17, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    416 Alonka

    Wow just wow, I felt disappointed for you. I don’t want any man to get a drink for himself and not even ask me.

    I’d be screaming next. I start my CDing this weekend, we shall see what curve balls get thrown my way.

  450.  #450Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    FW #444

    When I’m in love with a man I may buy him underwear;)))) As part of a gift for an occasion or sometimes because I feel like it!

  451.  #451Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    @447: Alonka says:

    “…As to my 2 CD’s – well I don’t have them anymore!! This guy I let go and the other one is not calling haha…”

    Well, I have no doubt you will have more. And these two might not have disappeared forever.

    Have a good long weekend.


  452.  #452Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    @449: Alonka says:

    “…When I’m in love with a man I may buy him underwear;)))) As part of a gift for an occasion or sometimes because I feel like it!…”

    I might buy him some too. I don’t expect my guy to have a homeless man attitude pointing me out like box car vagabonds marking symbols on mailboxes. LOL 😆


  453.  #453Brenda on February 17, 2011 at 8:34 pm


    RE: #436 – I believe everyone has a right to believe, think, and feel as they want to. God gave us free will. And, I am passionately in love with Him and His Son, Jes(us. I accept you exactly the way you are.

  454.  #454Eternity on February 17, 2011 at 8:40 pm

    432 Lori

    Yes, I have a very strong eww if the leaning forward is too much for me.

    I feel cornered and trapped like I have no choice and want a way out. I feel panicked and breathless.

    Like if he talks me into dinner too fast he’ll talk me into other stuff. I dont want my boundaries about sex to be overriden.

    I want to at least get some sense of who he is, in a call or a couple of emails before I go meet him. I want a man who senses this and will let me get to know him at my pace and be ok with that.

  455.  #455Lucy on February 17, 2011 at 8:42 pm

    FW, sorry you feel negative reading my posts. re 406, I was very cognizant of the process as it was happening – how, when, why. Re: guys and safety, I totally agree. I did poorly in that respect during my marriage, but learned that lesson so well that now men feel v safe and good with me – WH even took me by surprise by verbalizing how safe he felt. I am equally right and left-brained — straight down the middle. I think that’s part of what makes me appear inconsistent to some ppl… I switch back and forth

  456.  #456Senior Lady Vibe on February 17, 2011 at 8:43 pm

    @428 DE
    “…I would give the same advice…yet, it feels awful…I feel like I am a walking contradiction…”

    *You* are far from a contradiction. Your man would be safe in your love if he had a commitment from you. That’s all we can do since we can’t control the other person. This is a big challenge. This is truly what I want. Will I find it? Is it possible to have it? I am choosing to believe so.


  457.  #457Lisi on February 17, 2011 at 8:49 pm

    @453 Eternity

    That was me in 432. Yes — trapped, panicked and breathless.

    And you’re right — it has to do with boundaries, and wanting to make sure mine are respected.

    I get the sense from this guy that he’s VERY attracted to me, and VERY eager to meet me. That’s flattering.

    But, at the same time — I wasn’t feeling very attracted to him. He described himself as a cross between Ballou the Bear and Shrek.

    Not so flattering, IMHO. Also, trying too hard. And the pic was not flattering, either.

    I enjoyed talking to him on the phone, tho.

    We’ll see.


  458.  #458Laughing Goddess on February 17, 2011 at 8:51 pm

    Brenda: re:433

    All I’m saying is it isn’t proven in a rational, logic, hard and fast physical sense.

    Yet people still believe because of faith and inner knowing.

    Would you agree with that.

    I have read the New Testament and I did have an inner knowing, although I’m guessing my interpretation in somewhat different than yours.

  459.  #459Alonka on February 17, 2011 at 8:51 pm


    Happy CD’ing and my attitude is always to have fun! And you do meet some funny people;)) Once I was on a first date where the guy was so nervous, he told me to be somewhere but then decided that I would misunderstand and go to the WRONG place. So he mostly was hanging out in a WRONG place with quick trips up the steep hill to the RIGHT place. We met an hour later… and spent 4 years together!!

    Good night everyone and thank you so much again for your support!!