Getting Him Back After You’ve Pushed Him Away

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loveHere’s a question  from Sandi:

” Rori, Hello, I had a quick question, I had a amazing relationship that started off with everything I have ever wanted my feelings grew stronger and turned into a deep love I started to let my nasty voice win ..rule my insecurities about how he really felt about me instead of just trusting what I knew to be true which was his mutual growing love and commitment for me …

I became the overdoer, become needy, a constant worrier and I took control ..pretty much did every “Don’t Do”~ and the result was I ended up pushing him away and that just made me go into fix it mode and try showing him the amazing person I know I am and I started overfunctioning.

I have learned that my actions made him withdrawal to the point where he decided a relationship just wasn’t what he wanted right now. I see everything so clearly now and have learned everything I did wrong and that I seemed to have ruined the very thing I have been searching for my whole life ..what we had was so beautiful .. my question is what is my general chance of him giving me another chance or have at this point are they pretty much gone for good??

If not how do I go about showing him I am really Not that needy over functioning, unattractive women I became.? How can I show him the real me the feminine energy partner I want to be. I have learned the tools and know how not to revert back ..I just really want other chance ..but don’t know if men come back after pushing them away like I have done?

Thank You.! I feel blessed to have come across you and have been given the chance to learn and grow as a women ..such value~able life changing info. ..cant thank you enough!

My Answer:

Sandi – Here’s the deal – you can’t just suddenly “pretend” to be this woman you want to be.

It has to be a practice you do over time that changes you from the inside out, helped by the new things you do and say from the outside in.

You can do it QUICKLY if you practice hard and Circular Date for practice – but you have to learn the Tools and do it.

Please start with the ebook NOW and just DO everything, over and over, 24/7 (yeah – watch your dreams, too…) and practice on everyone you meet, everyone you know – and with yourself in the mirror and the writing exercises.

You can do this…and don’t worry about “showing” him ANYTHING.

If you truly shift, he’ll pick up on it RIGHT AWAY.

Even if he’s not in town!

He’ll forget about everything old, and as you prove to him consistently that he’s safe with you, and you’re not going to be his “mother” – all may very well be okay.

Love, Rori


  1.  #1Orna Walters on February 14, 2013 at 8:16 am

    Heart Rules: In choosing love every day, every day is a celebration of love! Love is not something that happens to you, it is a choice. When we make the effort to choose love in every circumstance we open our heart to receive the magic and bliss that is love.

    Happy Valentine’s Day!

  2.  #2Femininewoman on February 14, 2013 at 8:17 am

    To you too Orna

  3.  #3Femininewoman on February 14, 2013 at 8:19 am

    “It has to be a practice you do over time that changes you from the inside out, helped by the new things you do and say from the outside in.”

  4.  #4Tam on February 14, 2013 at 8:25 am

    3FW – amen to that

  5.  #5Beloved on February 14, 2013 at 8:27 am

    “Here’s the deal – you can’t just suddenly “pretend” to be this woman you want to be.”

    Isn’t that the truth…*groan*
    I mean, I did just suddenly pretend and…well it sucked. All available energy went into keeping up the pretense, while the rest of my life went to sh*t.
    And did the guy I pretended for fall at my feet with appreciation?
    Err…no. We are both facing being laid off and he’s been hustling to be sure he has plenty of money and a Plan A, B and C in place…none of which involve making sure I’m cared for and okay.
    I’m stuck with relying on G0d, lol, to show me how to do that for myself, and become that woman I want to be.

  6.  #6Orna Walters on February 14, 2013 at 8:52 am

    Thank you Femininewoman.

    It’s ALL practice! I love this post from Rori because it cuts quickly to the real deal.

    Even doctors only “practice” medicine. 😉

    As a recovering perfectionist, practice reminds me that I don’t have to get it perfect, and that I will mess things up.

    You cannot say or do the wrong thing with the right guy. If it is the right man you two will work it out.

    Be kind to yourself today. Choose love. Remember: You can search the entire universe and not find a single being more worthy of love than you. ~Buddha


  7.  #7MovingMagic on February 14, 2013 at 8:56 am

    I read a great quote yesterday. It read “Don’t put the keys to your happiness in someone elses pocket”. It feels so right on to me. These days my life is all about getting very clear on what it is that fuels my fires, & doing more of it. As it becomes an internal focus it transitions into an outward one as well. So many beautiful experiences keep flowing toward me, many of which don’t include men. The men just kind of come along for the ride…or not. 😉 I’m not attached to the outcome anymore. I have myself, & that’s alot.

  8.  #8Starla on February 14, 2013 at 8:58 am

    yay! LOVE! My favorite thing to celebrate. Well, tied with Halloween 😀

  9.  #9Indigo on February 14, 2013 at 9:07 am

    Elsie (from previous thread)

    Actually it doesn’t mean, if he doesn’t do anything, that he doesn’t care about your feelings. That is reality, it doesn’t mean that, and you KNOW that.

    I recommend you start this with the truth. That is what has helped me enormously with this road, and I have walked a similar one to you, and I have come SO far.

    Truth is: he hasn’t done anything for Valentine’s Day, and no, it doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about your feelings. Next, you decide just how important Valentine’s Day is to you really. Is it extremely important? If it is, that’s ok. But then know that with this man there is a good chance of him slipping up in this department, and decide if that is what you want.

    Or – maybe you will find Valentine’s Day is not so important to you after all, and it is, as Tam suggested, something else that is bothering you.

    Either way, I suggest you start with the truth of yourself, without judging…

  10.  #10Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 9:08 am

    Beloved: Wasn’t sure if you were still reading on the last thread or not so I thought I would post this here:

    You TOTALLY made me smile!!!! I loved meeting you too and I’m sooooo, sooooo happy that you saw the positive forces at work in me. I wasn’t always like this and I’ve worked very hard to block too much negativity from entering my life (although I haven’t mastered the ways of zapping out all of it) and it REALLY made me happy to see my paradigm shifts and thought reframes are noticeable to the people I meet!! YAY for ME!!! Thank you so, so much for your kind words!!!

  11.  #11Starla on February 14, 2013 at 9:10 am

    me and qz almost fell into an old pattern this morning, but he really stepped up to the plate and steered us to a better place. i so love that man.

    i’m still working on trusting and leaning back about it.

  12.  #12Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 9:14 am

    Beloved: “I’m stuck with relying on G0d, lol, to show me how to do that for myself, and become that woman I want to be.” – I believe, in the end, this is a MUCH better way to get there anyway. 🙂 If it were me, I’d be saying “Thank G0d I get to learn how to do this for myself and become the woman I know I am.”

    🙂 🙂 You’re not stuck! 🙂 🙂

    Much Love,

  13.  #13Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 9:23 am

    “It has to be a practice you do over time that changes you from the inside out, helped by the new things you do and say from the outside in.” – Oh yes….true, true, true in my experience…

    Much Love,

  14.  #14GlowStix on February 14, 2013 at 9:49 am

    Still and forever practicing.

    Thank you Rori, for all you bring to this world.

    Love you!

  15.  #15MovingMagic on February 14, 2013 at 9:55 am

    Starla, I love Halloween too!! Maybe because it happens to be my birthday. I’m still such a kid when it comes to that day. ((little me)).

  16.  #16Goddess Lily on February 14, 2013 at 10:01 am

    Re: Valentine’s day and taking care of yourself. I used to feel so annoyed with one of my boyfriends back in the day. I wanted flowers so bad and then someone suggested I get them for myself. I, too, thought well it’s not the same. And yeah, it isn’t…but….those flowers became a symbol for me. Not just for the obvious reason that I didn’t need a man to buy them. I do not have a green thumb. All plant life should beware. BUT don’t you know those gorgeous flowers survived and were resilient and took care of themselves for the most part. They became my favorite flower after that. I now love oriental lilies. Hence my screen name here. It reminds me that I’m gorgeous and resilient and I can take care of myself.

  17.  #17Sunflower on February 14, 2013 at 10:09 am

    How does one listen at level 2 over emails…that is the question of the day for me..feeling clueless.
    The ‘for the time out of town guy’ has been really good in staying in touch, and sharing his restless, angsty feeling about life…and now I am wondering how to respond.

    Face to face I would have just listened with my eyes, and said nothing…but over emails, what do I do ? not say anything…which seems like ignoring his feelings/not listening. OR I respond to it – which then becomes listening at level 1..Huh…this is a to be or not to be dilemma moment.

  18.  #18Goddess Lily on February 14, 2013 at 10:09 am


    Dominique’s ebook really helped me start learning how to take care of me. Put my brain in the right mindset to work on myself.

  19.  #19Tam on February 14, 2013 at 10:12 am

    So I did hear from MrP.
    It took him 2 days to reply with two sentences,
    ‘thank you for the message, Happy Valentine’s Day’ and ‘come join us skiing next week’.

    I know him so well. I knew that this would be the answer to expect to me speaking authentically and opening myself.
    He knows I am not in a position to leave the country or pay for such a holiday.
    I even told him.
    He completely ignored the real issues that need addressing.
    I knew he would.
    Poor, poor clueless MrP, and poor poor me.
    I am translating the ‘come go skiing’ as ‘I like you but I can’t do relationship’.
    The man will never talk straight.
    I am so done with that

  20.  #20Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 10:14 am

    GL: I love your comment 16. 🙂 (and also lilies)

    I too have bought myself flowers because if it really is about the flowers, then there is absolutely no reason why I can’t have them. If it’s about more than that (about wanting a man to give me a gift) then that’s a whole different issue I have to work out with myself. But in the end…if I want beautiful flowers…I can have them.

    I feel that way about diamonds too. I wanted a diamond ring so I bought myself one and I wear it on my right hand as a symbol of my strength and independence regardless of any man. I wear it every single day. I see no reason why I should have to be engaged or married to sport diamond rings. I love them and so…I bought myself one (and intend to buy more when the time is right). 🙂

    Much Love,

  21.  #21Femininewoman on February 14, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Sunflower I don’t know if that is possible. Seems more practcal to use words that engage two or more of the senses.

    Then again maybe just saying hhhhhhmmmmmm I get that might be a way to show listening at Level 2

  22.  #22ALA on February 14, 2013 at 10:18 am

    I Love you Ladies…

    Happy Valentine’s Day!

  23.  #23Starla on February 14, 2013 at 10:22 am

    ew tam, that must feel so disappointing but simultaneously reassuring, like you KNOW you’re doing the right thing. at least he’s acting in a way that can’t leave you confused about where he stands.

    reminds me of something sorta similar… i felt so sad when my mom recently sent me some messed up letter about how if i expect better out of her in terms of not lying, hurting, stealing, etc., then I don’t love her unconditionally and too bad so sad then i can’t be her daughter. she is a dangerous person and a pathological liar and manipulator. it broke my heart that she wouldn’t so much as acknowledge my deep pain or how much she has hurt me over the years with her lies and stealing and manipulating and trying to sabotage my safety and security.

    but at least it was clear. it left no question in my mind about what she was psychologically capable of in terms of authentically caring for someone beyond herself. and while it breaks my heart, it also makes it easier to know that there’s NOTHING i can do to make her psychologically primed to be like ‘normal’ people. a psychopath is a psychopath.

  24.  #24Sunflower on February 14, 2013 at 10:26 am

    hmmm…it is difficult Femininewoman 🙂

    Didn’t get “Seems more practcal to use words that engage two or more of the senses”.

  25.  #25Indigo on February 14, 2013 at 10:27 am

    Go Tam.

    As Feminine Woman said to me, his words and his actions (or lack thereof) are showing you where he’s at. And the real power lies in not expecting it to be any different.

    I have got to the point (yay me) where I have truly and thoroughly evaluated D’s willingness for commitment, and to decide to completely and utterly let go of expecting it to be anything other than what he’s shown me.

    This is a man who truly cares for me and loves having me around, but *does not want* a relationship in the traditional sense. A man with flaws and wonderful qualities, a true complex human being with his own flawed beauty who is never going to be anything other than what he is. It feels good to finally see him as he really is. It takes away the longing.

  26.  #26Tam on February 14, 2013 at 10:29 am

    Starla, yep. That’s the bottom line.
    I feel disappointed that he yet again proved me right as to not being able to engage authentically. Even a ‘i understand’ would have helped. But no. I could have scripted his non-response word for word.
    He won’t let go, therefore I must.

  27.  #27Tam on February 14, 2013 at 10:31 am

    It’s ok. It will be ok. Eventually. I just need to remind myself not to engage. I can do this.
    I can.

  28.  #28Femininewoman on February 14, 2013 at 10:31 am

    For phone conversation


    “I’ll be at your local Coffee Bean tomorrow. Want to meet up?”


    Hearing and smell

    “I’ll be at your local Coffee Bean tomorrow. I just love the smell of their hearty breakfasts in the morning If you want to meet up, just let me know!”

    This is from an Alexandra Fox email.

  29.  #29Sunflower on February 14, 2013 at 10:33 am

    @femininewoman, Maybe I will just say, “Oh, I feel like listening when you say…”

    @GL- yes there is something about getting flowers for yourself. I love them in my house, like a feel of loveliness around me, and I love flowers with fragrance..I also have a superstition – that the day I get flowers for me, some long lost man shows up..:)

  30.  #30Sunflower on February 14, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Got it. Thankyou Feminewoman. I like hearing + smell idea..:)

  31.  #31Starla on February 14, 2013 at 10:39 am

    “Even a ‘i understand’ would have helped”

    Some people just don’t have this as part of them. they have a different emotional/psychological landscape than most of us (and generally their emotional landscape is all focused around their own ego-centric needs and view of the world. often these people are very charming, attractive, and even sophisticated, so it can take a long time to see how these people are a bit dead inside when it comes to other humans’ emotional needs). They don’t take us seriously. Instead they’ll decide for themselves what it means that you said or feel xyz, instead of simply acknowledging what we are saying and feeling. it looks like MrP is deciding not to take you seriously, not because he thinks you don’t deserve it, but because he can’t wrap his head around the fact that maybe YOU ARE FREAKING SERIOUS AND HE’S HAD A PART IN EVERYTHING TOO.

    Ahhhh i feel mad for you!!!!!!!!!

    good riddance.

    and i’m wondering if you were raised by or had a very meaningful impressionable romantic relationship in the distant, formative past with anyone who also acts like that (not taking you seriously and re-directing your feelings and gripes and intentions as you express them)????

  32.  #32Tam on February 14, 2013 at 10:51 am

    Ah Starla, yes you are quite right. Fed up with analysing him too. He has mental health issues unfortunately so I can’t even blame him to be honest. He is who he is. And he does the best he can. I know he thinks I will ‘come around’ and will always be wagging my tail when he drops a one-liner. Like I used to. Those days are over though. Yep.

  33.  #33Tam on February 14, 2013 at 10:52 am

    I know him so well and I kind of understand his lingo. But. It is not what I want for myself.

  34.  #34Starla on February 14, 2013 at 11:03 am

    “unfortunately so I can’t even blame him to be honest”

    yeahhhhhhh, so does my mother, but that doesn’t make someone blameless. but we are all adults. we make choices. we are RESPONSIBLE for our choices. he is responsible for not doing the work it takes to be able to take other people seriously when they speak up for themselves.

    and you, my beautiful, gorgeous, tam, are responsible for avoiding the temptation of pursuing a man like that, as charming as he may be.

    i am proud of you!

  35.  #35Tam on February 14, 2013 at 11:08 am

    Thanks Starla. Yep. I try my best to be sensible. Not only not pursuing him, which I didn’t anymore anyway…but also not responding to his attempts at making contact anymore. It will be hard but I can do it 🙂

  36.  #36Starla on February 14, 2013 at 11:11 am

    we don’t choose to have mental illness… we don’t choose to get depressed, or to feel traumatized from the past, or to be bipolar, or to deeply need constant validation and approval. but we do CHOOSE how we cope with it. do we put our heads in the sand? do we do just enough to make it seem like we’re taking care of it for appearances, but never face our issues beyond the superficial level? do we lie to people about being terminally ill to gain the upperhand on how they perceive and validate us? do we gas-light, dehumanize, and side-step other people’s expressed emotional needs or complaints because it would force us to take some responsibility in the matter?

    THOSE are choices. conscious choices. just because the mental illness makes it a hell of a lot easier to make the choice, doesn’t mean the person is without blame.

  37.  #37Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:29 am

    I believe, in the end, this is a MUCH better way to get there anyway.””

    why? cuz having my man do it for me is bad? its not good enough?

    it robs me of being able to do it myself

    it “means”: i can’t do it myself, ill always wish i could, ill have lower self esteem, i’ll ‘miss out’ on fun, i won’t get to be ‘all that i wanna be’, i’ll be weaker

    i’ll be one of those silly women who can’t do anything and is taken care of

    and those women should be looked down upon

    drain to humanity

    feminine energy receivers are a drain to humanity

    it’s not good to do things that way

    if you teach a man to fish

    women ‘should’ learn to fish too

    NOT receive

    NOT be taken care of

    ‘having to’ do it ourselves is actually a ‘MUCH better way in the end’

    cuz it protects us when the man abandons us

    which will and can happen

    and we should protect against taht

    Thank you! I feel excited healing this

  38.  #38Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:30 am

    we are all blameless in everything

  39.  #39Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:31 am

    key concept in this healing

  40.  #40Starla on February 14, 2013 at 11:31 am

    daria, maybe we can have the best of both worlds. maybe it doesn’t have to be one or the other.

  41.  #41Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:32 am

    Daria: #37. Nope. Just my belief that it is a better way. None of the rest of what you said applies to how I think.

    Much Love,

  42.  #42Starla on February 14, 2013 at 11:32 am

    #40 is about #37

    #38 daria
    i think we are simultaneously blameless AND responsible in all things. it’s kind of a trip 😀

  43.  #43Starla on February 14, 2013 at 11:34 am

    oh! ruth! how did your hair appointment go? I did mine all by myself last night and it turned out fabulous. it’s a 10 dollar box of hair dye, and it’s soooo my new go-to color for the next few cycles.

  44.  #44Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:35 am

    Oh…and I don’t believe it is possible for a man to make us the woman we want to be. I believe they can inspire us but ultimately, if we really want to be that woman, I believe it is up to us to do the internal work it takes to become that woman. If a man has “made us” into that woman then I also believe it won’t last.

    Just my personal beliefs.

    Much Love,

  45.  #45Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:37 am

    MERcedes i really resent having my post answered wiht nope like its directed to or about you
    clearly the post is NOT about you, or relating to you, or even asking you to validate it with a yes or a no

    and its not about your beliefs

    so in conclusion

    Mercedes – nope!

  46.  #46Tam on February 14, 2013 at 11:38 am

    25 nice post Indigo

  47.  #47Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:40 am

    haha i agree about blameless and responsible

    i got caught up in “forcing” everyone to face the truth of blamelessness

    by writing down that belief


    that behavior on my part feels interesting

    am i reacting to the ‘forcing’ word by internalizing and deflecting the energies into my own ‘forcing?’

  48.  #48Dancing Siren on February 14, 2013 at 11:40 am

    Hello Ladies.

    Just stopping by.

    I am actually feeling really tired and low energy today. I am feeling exhausted in fact.

    Things feel stuck and stagnant right now.

    There is still no actual real ring (just the home-made one, which I LOVE) and I am still struggling financially and I am still waiting for the sale of my flat to go through, to finally allow me to straighten out my finances. My bad financial situation also affects his finances, because he is paying for EVERYTHING at the moment, and there has been nothing left over for the nice things (like a real engagement ring).

    It should be anytime now that the sale goes through on my flat and I can pay off my creditors, and meantime I just feel totally powerless and ineffective.

    It just feels like walking in treacle right now.

    Life has continued to feel like a struggle recently.
    I have been taking many positive steps to let go of struggle in my life, let go of my limiting beliefs here and create the life I want.

    Lots of positive things have happened, and the practicalities of my life just haven’t quite caught up yet.

    I feel like I am dealing with the same cr*p that I have been for months, well years actually.

    I just feel tired right now.

  49.  #49Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:41 am

    “clearly the post is NOT about you” – Oh…I thought it WAS about me since it quoted me. Sorry…didn’t realize you weren’t directing that to me. When you quoted me and then said “why?”, I assumed you were asking me why…

    Much Love,

  50.  #50Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:43 am

    #49…Sorry…I meant to say I assumed you were asking me why and then giving your thoughts on why I would say something like that and those thoughts were not at all what I meant or was thinking when I wrote that. I completely misinterpreted what you were talking about.

    Much Love,

  51.  #51Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:44 am

    Mercedes – i understand.

  52.  #52Daria on February 14, 2013 at 11:45 am

    Mercedes – hey so what Are your thoughts behind that belief?

  53.  #53Tam on February 14, 2013 at 11:45 am

    Starla, I have a mother like that too, or very similar. She used to do all sorts of weird things, like lock me out of the house as a 12 year old, my bags outside…later on throw things at me, stimp around the house crying and screaming about how bad her life was. I lived in constant fear as a child.
    Later on as an adult, she tried to get power over me by manipulation. At one point she cleared out my bank account hoping I would go to her and beg her to give me MY money back.
    I snapped at 30 years old. Finally stood up to myself. Went to the police. Got my money back.
    Since then she has been trying to defame me, saying I am a drug addict (ha ha..I never touched anything as you all well know 😉 and the family should be ashamed of me. She even at one point told people that I travel the world with a criminal guy. Well, I wish my life was that exciting, quite frankly – ha!!
    No, it is sad. She knows she is sick but pretends to blame everyone else, she doesn’t speak to anyone in the family anymore and when she does, so I hear, she spreads awful lies about everybody and has a conspiracy theory going on.
    I stepped away, after that bank account fraud. I just stepped away, she is not longer a person in my life. She doesn’t make contact, but give her a chance to trash me and she will.
    I am scared of what she is capable of.
    But I stay well away. I don’t hold a grudge and I have forgiven her. But I STAY WELL AWAY.
    I used to be the one always making peace and saying ‘yes’. No more.

    I choose to stay away from people like that now.
    Not talk about the bad anymore, just not giving them a space in my life. And that now includes MrP. I was always very understanding of him and his issues, because I know he is not a bad person at all.
    But as you say, he made no effort to deal with his issues or be an authentic presence in my life.
    So I am done.

  54.  #54Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:47 am

    DS: “Lots of positive things have happened, and the practicalities of my life just haven’t quite caught up yet.” – And this is a very hard place to be (at least in my experience). I’ll focus my meditation for you tonight. It will be on all those positive things, not just the ones that have happened, but also the ones that are happening and will happen for you. And for you to have rest and peace.

    Much Love,

  55.  #55Dancing Siren on February 14, 2013 at 11:49 am

    And I too was feeling a bit riled up about Valentines Day. And so I was reading Elsie’s posts and all your responses and it just helped me to feel soothed.

    I have missed being here on the blog.

    And it’s funny because I didn’t think V day would be a big deal to me either, and then when it came and S didn’t do anything I felt really upset. But then I have been feeling upset anyway about everything that has been going on for me personally.

    I know he loves me.

    And reading Elsie’s posts just reminded me of me, posting on here 2 years ago, nearly exactly the same feelings, and even of me today, having those feelings come up, although now I feel as though they have lost a lot of their power.

    V day does mean something to me. I don’t think it is REALLY important. And yet it would feel good to be honored and cherished by a man (my man) on this day. And at this time, in this current situation, is this the most important thing? If he doesn’t do anything today does it mean he doesn’t love me?

    No, of course not!

    Do I still feel a little sad? Yes a bit.

    Does the fact that he is out all hours working to earn the money to keep the roof over our heads mean more? Er, yeah. This is how he shows he loves me. One of the ways, and this is really the most important right now.


    OK, now can I find ways to love and cherish myself and make myself feel special on this day?

    Yes I expect so.

    And also, are my icky feelings all tied in with how I am feeling in general right now?

    Yes TOTALLY.

    Hmmm. OK. That felt good to write.

  56.  #56Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 11:55 am

    Here’s the statement I was referring to (just so we’re clear on what I was talking about – and thank you Beloved for allowing this conversation):

    “making sure I’m cared for and okay.
    I’m stuck with relying on G0d, lol, to show me how to do that for myself, and become that woman I want to be.”

    My personal belief is that if we, as women, learn how to make sure we are okay (and I’m not necessarily talking about financially here although that is a big part of my personal life) – really okay – on the inside – and if we learn how to become that woman that we want to be (like by reading the teachings of Rori and Dominique and Orna and others) – and then putting everything we learn that resonates with us into practice – I believe that is a much, much better way to have all of our dreams than if we need a man to make sure we are okay (especially on the inside) and need a man to make us the woman we want to be.

    I believe being who we want to be and being okay is better achieved by doing the work on ourselves and practicing what we learn than by asking (or waiting for or expecting) someone else (a man) to care for that for us.

    I’m not saying that is a belief anyone else has or needs, just me personally.

    Much Love,

  57.  #57Dancing Siren on February 14, 2013 at 11:57 am


    Thank you so much. That feels lovely to read. That will be good 🙂

    I think partly I just need to create some more positive disciplines for myself also…

    Like meditation.

    And getting to bed earlier so that I don’t get so tired.

    And leaning back with life in general (as well as with my man).

    I know it will come, all the things I have been creating, the sale of the flat, the ring etc…

    And it is just finding ways to take care of myself in the meantime.

    Self care slips sometimes when finances are so strained. And yet when you are intending to get out of struggle mentality that is exactly when self care is extra important.

    I like the sound of a gratitude diary too.

  58.  #58Starla on February 14, 2013 at 12:02 pm

    wow tam, we have the same mother. let’s put them in a room together and let them manipulate and blame each other to the death.

    and since you shared that, i think my hunch was right. you have been conditioned to second guess your own psychological and emotional needs, so you first don’t take yourself seriously (thanks mom!), and then attract men who don’t take you seriously either.


    it’s a cycle! we’re bustin out, baby!

  59.  #59Mercedes on February 14, 2013 at 12:03 pm

    DS: I’ve been using a gratitude journal for many years. It taught me to look at all the little things (no matter how small) in a positive light. I don’t do it as often as I used to (especially right now as I’m still working on my certification for meditation instructor so I’m writing those down instead) but it is a lovely, lovely thing. 🙂

    I understand about self care taking a back seat when finances are low. Can you try little things…like facials from items probably already in your pantry (Google search will bring you amazing ideas)…to help you feel good and feminine and lovely? Believe me…I get it and have been there many, many times. Big hug to you!

    Much Love,

  60.  #60Starla on February 14, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    there is a bit of pressure around valentines. pressure for women to be acknowledged and validated from outside sources, and pressure for men to acknowledge and validate their women ‘correctly.’

    i don’t do well with that sort of obligated pressure.

  61.  #61sequoia on February 14, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    thank you for the great post. I can very much relate to it as I believed I can be the women I want to be without practicing the tools. Well I practiced them a bit, esp. the feeling messages, but I wasn’t able to circular date and so I was just focused on the one man and all my insecurities came up and I couldn’t hide them and it scared him away. I am online dating now and I am also practicing the feeling messages. I live in germany so its a bit harder here as its not so common to speak with feeling messages in german as in english, but I try my best. The thing is so that the men start saying my feeling messages back to me, eg. I often say “that feels good” and they start saying that too, so I have been feeling a bit weird about this. I wonder if that happens to some sirens to?

    Also at the moment I seem not be able to hold 3 man in my rotation at a time. And most of the time it’s only one I really like, so the fokus is still on him more or less, but I can feel that just chatting with man online helps to slightly shift the focus a bit of.
    I met great man over the online dating platform, I was even a bit shoked as I did not expect that. He asked me already indirectly if I am still on there, and I didn’t answer. On his profile I can not see if he’s online or not, but on my profile (because I went for the cheapest) he can see if I am online or not.
    I wonder how I should handle that if it gets more serious between us, any ideas are appreciated.
    Thank you

  62.  #62Daria on February 14, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    umfff Nanny CD phone is offf… and im supposed to call him when i wake up

    and its been over an hour since and the phone is still off

    i want to make alternate plans for my day now. well i will accept other invites if they come up

  63.  #63Starla on February 14, 2013 at 12:15 pm

    “The thing is so that the men start saying my feeling messages back to me, eg. I often say “that feels good” and they start saying that too, so I have been feeling a bit weird about this. I wonder if that happens to some sirens to?”

    Yes, totally happens to me. And then I feel all turned off because *I* want to be the girl, damnit! But it definitely happens to me with every man.

  64.  #64Tam on February 14, 2013 at 12:17 pm

    Starla, the strangest thing is that I never attracted a man like this before. Ever. I was with some great guys when I was younger, hence I am a bit confused as to ‘why now’.
    My friend who is a psychologist said that no, she doesn’t think I am attracting such men at all, but she thinks I have a lot more patience generally for people who have larger ‘problems’ or ‘issues’ because I have grown up in an environment where this was the ‘normal’ day to day living, basically.
    So yes, guess we have been conditioned to deal with that somehow, buy becoming understanding, people pleasers etc.
    I just had time for him, where most women would have run screaming already.

  65.  #65Tam on February 14, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    Ah, excellent. As if things weren’t fecked up enough, I get a call from MrP and my friend. From MrP’s house, no less. Saying MrP wants to go boating sometime. And asking if I still speak to MrP.
    So what is this? He would have no reason to doubt that we were still speaking. So MrP shared my email or some info with him. Got him to call me and propose an activity together.
    I was so speechless, I was mumbling and just totally confused.
    All I said was that I would be open to meet the friend, implying just the two of us, and without MrP.
    I can’t believe this!

  66.  #66Tam on February 14, 2013 at 12:25 pm

    And now I feel angry.
    I feel angry that a man, who is over 50 years old, has to rope in a friend to see if I am still ‘around’.
    Is that adult behaviour?

  67.  #67Goodheart on February 14, 2013 at 12:28 pm

    I feel a little afraid admitting this – getting flowers on Valentine’s Day (or any day) is more about knowing that other people are seeing that someone loves me & is thinking about me.

    I’m pretty sure I’ve always been aware of this feeling deep down – I’m just now acknowledging it.

    It’s never really been about knowing that the guy is thinking about me or cares about me. Or maybe that’s the secondary payoff.

    I feel so shallow & I feel compassionate for my shallow needy self – that young girl in school who watched as the popular girls got flowers & cards.

  68.  #68Starla on February 14, 2013 at 12:32 pm

    64 tam
    i could see that too

    or maybe it’s a little of both. most things usually are! haha

  69.  #69Tam on February 14, 2013 at 12:33 pm

    I need to scream.
    I feel sick to the stomach.

  70.  #70sequoia on February 14, 2013 at 12:41 pm

    Thank you 63 Starla ~ yes I want to be the girl!
    and it feels like he’s taking it away from me. I also feel even more self conscious about my feeling messages – as they even ask me like in a bit of a cheeky way ‘if that would feel good’. Mmmh..

  71.  #71Starla on February 14, 2013 at 12:48 pm

    i’m trying to feel gratitude for men getting all ‘feeling-y’. there are so many women who complain that barely any men are capable of doing this. we bring it out of them. we’re magic sirens. love to us.

  72.  #72Beloved on February 14, 2013 at 12:52 pm

    Awwww Goodheart…

  73.  #73Iamabutterfly on February 14, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    Mr. Stares Me Down APPROACHED me! First time, haha. Well, I mean he talked to me ONCE when we pretty much ran into each other, but this is the first time he APPROACHED me.

    I must’ve been talking to someone he felt comfortable with, because he came over, asked the person a question and then turned towards me, smiled, and said “hi.” Easy, breezy. It was cute. 🙂

    What I feel so curious about is how I reacted. I felt really angry and mistrustful, but I knew he had made a real effort to come and talk to me, so I turned my head to the side (without really think about it,) smiled, and said “hi” back. I felt really shy. and guilty over my angry/mistrustful feelings.

    I want to learn more about those angry/mistrustful feelings!

    I feel so proud of him. I think he is a lot like me in that he is totally inexperienced and scared! but I find it endearing. 🙂

  74.  #74sequoia on February 14, 2013 at 1:19 pm

    Starta, yes true I want to see it that way too, that’s it is a good thing that they are responding back with feeling messages. Actually it shows how they are matching communication and that they are sensitive. Sometimes it feels a bit funny so…

  75.  #75Goodheart on February 14, 2013 at 1:29 pm

    Thanks Beloved. I have an amazing man now & Valentine’s Day is sweet & romantic.

    That shy, left out high school girl still gets anxious though. Awful how that stuff sticks with you.

  76.  #76Iamabutterfly on February 14, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    I am SO thirteen years old…*sigh*

  77.  #77Turquoise on February 14, 2013 at 1:38 pm

    Happy Valentine’s Day Sirens! 🙂

  78.  #78Daria on February 14, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    Yay ! My living earth technology quantum Cell emf transformer came in!

    Now I no longer have to avoid electronics or get hand cramps and headaches !

    Yay freakin yay I feel happy :).

    I’ve already gone outside

    I’m Earth rlectromagnetic field grounded….

    And Nanny CD called …. He had fallen asleep

  79.  #79Daria on February 14, 2013 at 1:48 pm

    Good hearts comment really helped me!

    I Want to have the feeling of being PUBliCally claimed acknowledged n worshipped

    That makes me feel regal and important and I feel honored by my man when he shows the World I’m his

    The public ness of it feels important almost crucial

  80.  #80Daria on February 14, 2013 at 1:49 pm

    I like the feeling of power of being claimed by a man in the world

  81.  #81Femininewoman on February 14, 2013 at 2:02 pm

    Happy Valentines Day to all

  82.  #82Dancing Siren on February 14, 2013 at 2:04 pm

    Oh and Elsie,

    If you read this. I have bought most of Rori’s programmes and can vouch for them. They are great! And they work.

    I have a fiancee now who I am very happy with, and we are planning marriage.

    This from having a HORRIBLE love life before. And the changes came about because of what Rori teaches, although obviously I had a bit to do as well.

    I have actually written my personal story, and a review of Rori’s e-book. However I tried to share the link here the other day and it didn’t post so I am guessing it got caught in a spam filter or something.

  83.  #83sha-sha on February 14, 2013 at 3:04 pm

    What a long exhusting thursday

  84.  #84Tam on February 14, 2013 at 3:38 pm

    I had a major freak out just now.
    I feel so grateful for the friend I could speak to..well, write to.
    I guess the Valentines day trigger, plus the MrP email, then his friend calling me from MrP’s house and asking me all sorts of questions, and the day was finished off not how I would have preferred it,
    by someone saying ‘oh, come on my love, I am going to make you some dinner, take you out for a little while, sit with you, whatever’.
    No, I got an innocent naughty text by Curly asking whether he could come around for ‘wink wink, nudge nudge’ basically.
    It was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
    I was sobbing like a woman possessed.
    Asking myself what I am doing wrong.
    Now I sit here by myself and feel in pieces.
    I really do. I just want to drive up to MrP’s house and beat the living daylights out of him. I feel aggressive.
    I want to tell him to ‘feck out of my life for once and all, and don’t send friends to call me and ask me to go out boating when you had MONTHS to get off your butt’. Buhuuuuuuuu.
    And the Curly thing, well that is my own fault, because I egged him on and it was fun. But it is Valentines, I cooked for him yesterday and I just expect (here we go) a man to treat me nicer – and treat me nicer WITHOUT me having to spell it out to him. And he knows. I was with guys before where we were not in a relationship but a kind of semi-relationship, no commitment. And they took me for dinners, movie, whatever I wanted.
    Men know. I feel sick for thinking I spoilt him and it is all my own fault.
    I feel pissed.
    Like I will never ‘get’ this.
    And why should I?
    When did it get sooo hard?

  85.  #85Tam on February 14, 2013 at 3:41 pm

    And I know the only, and main reason why I sit here feeling dreadful, is because I know that the man I love wants me but he doesn’t want me the way I want it.
    Yes, that is why I feel so bad.
    Because it is hopeless and I know he is tryijng to claw me back from the ledge. But I am jumping. I am jumping. I can’t take this bloody back and forth and hot and cold anymore. I am done.
    Send the bloody pope to call me.
    And see if I care 🙁

  86.  #86Elsie on February 14, 2013 at 3:50 pm


    OK – so some of you know I was worried about getting a present today. Wow – that doesnt even matter anymore.

    I found out that she served him papers today….valentines day. They aren’t married but have a house and kids together – after 12 years. He was preparing for this, but was COMPLETELY BLINDSIDED that it would be now. He has been trying to talk about solutions with her and she never wanted to – now he knows why.

    OK – so he had me come over and told me about it – I was gobsmacked. Of course, he was like well, this is on valentines day – and I thought well, you didnt get me anything, but anyway – thats anotehr story.

    So – we were talking and he was SO MAD. I have never seen him so mad. So he was sort of snipping at me – even though he is NEVER like that.

    And we had a deal. I had boundaries. I said that no matter what I will never live with a man without being married. Thats my boundary. So I said to him, if he ever thinks he doesnt want to be married, or whatever, then he needs to tell me. We have been BRUTALLY honest with each other this last year – etc. He knew that was my boundary, and he said, well, marriage doesnt mean the same thing to me, but as long asyou know that – yes, I would marry you.

    So – we have been going along.

    So – anyway – today he is SO MAD about all of this and snipping at me – I’m the only one he can tell about all of this – so then I said something about that at least he wont have to divide any marital assets since they never got married….

    And he snipped at me – I’M NEVER GETTING MARRIED…EVER….and of course, I knew he was so upset and just snipping, and I’ve NEVER heard him say this before, so I said – well, she is just vindictive and so malicious….and he said – NO, i’m NEVER GETTING MARRIED.

    So… breath was taken away. I felt like oh my God, I didnt know what to do……Oh my God. We have talked about this – is this him just saying something because he is upset about the situation, or does he mean this – he has never said this before, and frankly if he feels this way I feel like he was lying to me…..which was our deal – we have NEVER lied ever about anything to each other.

    So then I had to go – so we didnt talk long after that. And then I called him later with the number of the attorney he needed and asked me to call him, and then he called me again to tell me something about it briefly – so both calls were short, and I said – well, it seems like you are more calm now, and he said yes, that he was just very upset and blindsided and just overwhelmed.


    Do I believe him? I cant very well have a talk with him about it now – his head is NOT in any kind of a place to be taking care of our realitonship. I know I need ot let him do his thiing now and step aside….but

    the REAL QUESTION IS: What do I do now. Do I act like he didnt say it? Do I lean back? Do I even be polite? Do I just start withdrawing? I dont know what to do? I’m SO UPSET ABOUT THIS…….I cant believe he said it…….He was so blindsided that maybe he was just saying that in the moment – but he KNEW what he was saying….when he said it – and he knew it would hurt me – HE KNEW IT WOULD HURT ME – ugh.

    Please help me – wow, I thought my stupid problems about a valentines gift earlier were big…..thats nothing now.

  87.  #87Tam on February 14, 2013 at 3:55 pm

    Elsie, the guy is upset and cornered, he had a bad day. Cut him some slack, give him a break, sleep over it and talk about marriage another day.
    I heard so many men say, when they got divorced ‘I will never get married again’. They all did, one after only 2 years.

  88.  #88Dominique on February 14, 2013 at 4:09 pm

    Elsie – I agree with much of what Mercedes said, yet I want to add another piece to this. Men will say things, and it’s not that they don’t mean it, they do, BUT he may only mean it in that moment.

    I have had this happen to me numerous times, and it wasn’t even at a time when K was upset. He meant what he said in that moment, and some of these things sent me reeling emotionally.

    I learned two things around this though – Men can change their minds, as readily we can.

    And men can say things in their language, a male way of expression, which can sometimes not sit well with us because it may sound blunt or would not be words we would use. In other words not meant as we took it.

    In this case though it’s true he has a lot going on and may not be in a great place for having a relationship, I don’t think he meant those words as a forever thing. He’s upset. And rightfully so.


  89.  #89Elsie on February 14, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    @Tam – I’m not sure I should cut slack? I endured a marriage where a man told me he loved me with words but then hurt me with actions. If this man says he loves me, but now says after a year of KNOWING that my deal is that I dont want to be ina relationship without being married as the end game (I always said that because he never married her – and I wanted him to know taht I didnt want to do that)…..he knew it would hurt me and he hasnt taken it back.

    On top of it – I dont even get what he is saying. He is going through all of this – and the rough part is dividng the house and the parenting plan. NONE OF THAT has to do with marriage. In fact the logistics of the marriage would be EASY. So it doesnt even make sense what he said today.

    I am mad at myself that I talked to him afterwards in a nice way – I feel like maybe I’m not valuing myself.

    I feel like I will miss him, and I love him, and I dont want this to end, but I feel like it did today.

    Obvsiously as M. said in the previous post – Valentines day meant something to him because he mentioned that he got served on valentines day – well, I know that I didnt get anything at all – clearly he knew the day – and not only did I not get anything – but on top of it – I got told that he never wanted to get married.

    How do I act tomorrow?

    I feel like this is all over and wow……I’m weeping as I’m writing this – I will miss him.

  90.  #90Elsie on February 14, 2013 at 4:15 pm

    @Dominique – Thank you for your kind words. I really really need them right now.

    What I DONT want to do is delude myself and start making excuses – OH…..WELL, HE SAID HE DIDNT WANT TO GET MARRIED….what he MEANS is……he really does just not now…..You *know* women do that – and I dont want to be one of them.

    He had a bad day – and frankly a bad decade. This woman is unlike any woman I have ever seen or known. I have never seen the vitriol, hatred, or sheer maliciousness JUST FOR THE SAKE of spite with nothing productive ever from anyone. I know her as long as I’ve known him, and I can tell you – that girl is so crazy… soon as you think you have reached the limit to her crazy – there is an underground parking garage of crazy……its insane. LOL

    But I’m so upset because I feel betrayed and that he LIED to me. We always said we would be honest – its the one thing we have always had. Always – even if it was hurtful. Well, if he knew that he never wanted to be married and just strung me along then I”m so betrayed.

    This man is NOT poetic. But he says that I’m the only person on the planet that “gets” him, and that I’m the woman he has waited his whole life for.

    Why would he say this and hurt me? He KNEW it hurt me after he said it.

    How do I act tomorrow?

    Do I listen to him? He will want to talk to me about all that he is going through.

    I do not want to be just his friend. I do not want him to get all his emotional needs met from me and nothing in return. I dont need any more “friends.”

    He and I have known each other over a decade. But now I am more than friends with him. We are in love with each other.

    So I dont know after the fact I didnt even get a “happy valentines day” said to me – along with the fact that he said (multiple times, sort of rudely to me) that he never wants to be married – if I should listen to him tomorrow….

    Help. Sigh. I’m a mess.

  91.  #91Starla on February 14, 2013 at 4:16 pm

    Give him a day or two of space, and then sit his ass down and tell him that you felt pretty damn second rate hearing him get indignant about this happening on ‘valentine’s day’ when he didn’t even get you anything or do anything for you. And that when a man screams at his girlfriend that he’ll never get married, it’s insulting as hell.

    You’ve done nothing wrong. You are the prize. What an idiot. He’s lucky to have a girlfriend who cares enough to consult some other instead of flipping out on him. Which, according to most standards, he would “deserve.”

    alas, we’re Rori women. We don’t look at relationships like that. But goodness gracious that man owes you an apology.

  92.  #92Starla on February 14, 2013 at 4:21 pm

    i am feeling so anxious and alone right now. so i took myself to a coffee shop where i can work and enjoy a decaf raspberry mocha and a little pastry. starting to calm down. oi. sometimes life can be so overwhelming and big, and i feel so insignificant and like i was somehow designated as worth less than most every other human in our society from birth. i feel beat up and afraid.

  93.  #93Starla on February 14, 2013 at 4:28 pm

    i feel so mad and stifled and bullied and imposed upon.

  94.  #94Starla on February 14, 2013 at 4:30 pm

    are there any similar online communities like this for women? it might feel good to know i have an alternative when i need it.

  95.  #95Olivia on February 14, 2013 at 5:06 pm

    Happy Valentine’s Day y’all.

    Pre-Rori tools: (One example). The BF booked a trip to Miami over New Year’s Eve when I had told him I COULD NOT go, and sent me a text message when the ball dropped from his fancy Miami party without me (I live in the North East). : (

    1 DAY post-tools (1 day!): some *different* kind of energy: messy, confusing, hostile, bizzare, amazing, loving began to arise.

    2 weeks post-tools: he asked me where our relationship stood and that he didn’t want a B.S. relationship.

    4 weeks post-tools: He told me he wanted to bring our relationship to the next level.

    About 1.5 months post-tools: The BF surprised me at work today with flowers and a heart-felt card about how our relationship deepening is the best thing in his life and he looks forward to getting even closer. We have fancy dinner plans for tomorrow. He has booked an awesome trip for my 30th birthday in about a month. All weekend long he cooked for me…

    I’m trusting the tools and how good I feel practicing all of them! And it all came from MEEEEEEE.


  96.  #96Vi on February 14, 2013 at 5:11 pm

    Beloved thank you for your 620 comment from the last thread, your experience feels inspiring! 🙂

    I feel moved by this tool. I haven’t heard from my NVs since the day I started practicing it 🙂

  97.  #97Olivia on February 14, 2013 at 5:13 pm

    Also YES! to Starla’s words @Elsie. That feels just right.

  98.  #98k2012 on February 14, 2013 at 5:47 pm

    Reposting this from the last thread. About to read the main post. From last thread- 601- Annie.”The wrong ones for us disappear when we lean back. Weed themselves out.” Ok. That’s how it goes Annie? Ok. I see. The guy before disappearing ex just stopped writing. Well disappearing ex faked everything for one year before disappearing. Overseas cd seems like he is on his way out as he is messaging less. If they disappear from the scene at the beginning stages BEFORE I get involved with them, I don’t have a problem. But don’t disappear on me after we are in a relationship. The least a decent guy who I am in a serious relationship can do is inform me that things are not working out and u want to end things instead of just disappearing without a word. Only cowards do that all the same, like that loser disappearing ex. Disappearing after u have slept with them and are emotionally connected with them as u know ladies is devastating. But in the earlier stages, when we haven’t reached anywhere, u can go ahead and disappear if u wish. Lol. Who cares. Ladies, I am cracking up here as I write this.

  99.  #99Iamabutterfly on February 14, 2013 at 5:48 pm

    Starla, I think their are other online communities out there, but in my humble opinion, this is the best one! No where else have I seen women feel safe enough to express all their “crazy,” thoughts about G0D, life, argue with each other, forgive each other, and learn how to communicate more effectively. I LOVE THIS BLOG. Thank you, Rori, from the bottom of my heart for it. I know it may cause you stress from time to time, I know you may worry that you won’t be “profiting” as much financially because of just HOW MUCH help women get here, but I pray God’s richest blessings on you that you will always prosper and learn and grow right along with all of us here. You created this, and I hope that it does nothing but BLESS you in return.

    In the meantime, Starla, here’s a big ‘ole hug.


    Happy Valentine’s Day, Starla.

    and may you fall even more deeply in love with Love (G0D!) each and every day!

  100.  #100Tam on February 14, 2013 at 5:52 pm

    I feel worthless and unloved tonight.
    I hate feeling this way.
    I feel neglected and exploited. I can’t put my finger on it as to why exactly. Because I am in control of me and my actions.
    I feel lonely.

  101.  #101Iamabutterfly on February 14, 2013 at 6:03 pm


  102.  #102Iamabutterfly on February 14, 2013 at 6:04 pm

    I feel over-the-moon, deeply in love tonight. but it’s not coming from a man………………………………

  103.  #103BeLoved on February 14, 2013 at 6:06 pm

    Something illuminating I realized about manipulators is that they will let you believe you are in control. They know how to play the game and puff a woman (or man) up and flatter her
    and let her believe she is in control
    while they get away with all kinds of shady behavior,
    knowing full well a woman (or man) well and fully in control wouldn’t have anything to do with their shysty BS.

    I was watching my friend go on and on about how her inappropriate emotional affair let her be in control – she claimed every time she set a boundary, he’d respect it.

    But the thing is, the boundary would always get busted, it was a game they played, if unconsciously, because a woman well and truly in control of herself isn’t going to be having an emotional affair with an addict with family drama and other women baggage to boot and alternately hiding it from her husband and confessing.

  104.  #104Tam on February 14, 2013 at 6:17 pm

    Thanks for the hug lama 🙂

  105.  #105k2012 on February 14, 2013 at 6:56 pm

    Dancing Siren 82, u could try to post the link again. It would be nice to see it. Don’t remember who was asking about another online community for women. There are 2 that are used to frequent- I (formerly and The Other Woman. Elsie, it seems like your guy was angry when he was saying all this. Wait until 2 days after this and speak to him about it when he is much calmer and see what his response will be. Watch his actions after this of course and let us know how things are.

  106.  #106k2012 on February 14, 2013 at 7:07 pm

    99 Butterfly, what a lovely post u have written. I agree with what u have written about Rori. Trust me, God will bless her richly as she has helped a lot of women. While I have not started reading her tools yet and bought the e-book yet, the newsletters have helped me tremendously. Shortly after my breakup with disappearing ex, I dived into her newsletters and articles right here on the website and then I checked out the blog here. I must say that the whole experience has helped me tremendously, especially the newsletters. Which reminds me, I need to activate my credit card by Tomorrow so I can purchase the book. I love this blog. I haven’t visited the two online sites which I quoted for the longest time.

  107.  #107Daria on February 14, 2013 at 7:08 pm

    Mercedes – sorry I didn’t mean to gaslight u by quoting u and then taking cause w ur address of the comment…

    Honestly I just didn’t know what to say when i quoted to give context yet keep writing without interesting my thoughts
    I gave no context and that causes issues for me frequently

    I want to Heal change tweak this

  108.  #108Daria on February 14, 2013 at 7:09 pm

    Without * interrupting my thoughts

  109.  #109k2012 on February 14, 2013 at 7:19 pm

    Well hairdresser didn’t get to come today at all cause she had an emergency situation and it would be too late in the day for her to come. So I told her to come tomorrow. I came home and went to lie down. Didn’t realize I was so tired. I fell asleep for a few hours. Valentines day can be stressful for both men and women. For women who place a lof emphasis on the day (well many of us do), if u are involved or married to a man and the day is important to u, if the man doesn’t give u anything, it can cause a woman to be upset. It can be stressful for a man cause there are huge expectations of it and they are sometimes stressed. Like the man who was stressing out himself who I read about in Michael Fiore’s facebook page. I am just hear chilling. Haven’t heard anything more from Overseas cd but I am good. As I said, he is on his way out, but I feel tempted to message him. I didn’t. I did my eyebrows today as planned. Yes man, so I will continue leaning back.

  110.  #110Annie on February 14, 2013 at 7:21 pm

    98: k2012No says:

    “Reposting this from the last thread. About to read the main post. From last thread- 601- Annie.”The wrong ones for us disappear when we lean back. Weed themselves out.” Ok. That’s how it goes Annie? Ok. I see. The guy before disappearing ex just stopped writing. Well disappearing ex faked everything for one year before disappearing. Overseas cd seems like he is on his way out as he is messaging less. If they disappear from the scene at the beginning stages BEFORE I get involved with them, I don’t have a problem. But don’t disappear on me after we are in a relationship. The least a decent guy who I am in a serious relationship can do is inform me that things are not working out and u want to end things instead of just disappearing without a word. Only cowards do that all the same, like that loser disappearing ex. Disappearing after u have slept with them and are emotionally connected with them as u know ladies is devastating. But in the earlier stages, when we haven’t reached anywhere, u can go ahead and disappear if u wish. Lol. Who cares. Ladies, I am cracking up here as I write this.”

    I care.
    It hurts my heart to read when men do this makes me feel sad.
    We now know though that they do what they want.
    And yes I know it does us no good to label, the “coward” does resonate with me though about men who disappear. without saying.
    Hugs. X

    The questions are Why would you want a man like that?
    And is this a pattern?
    What’s the pattern?

  111.  #111Annie on February 14, 2013 at 7:29 pm

    “The least a decent guy who I am in a serious relationship can do is inform me that things are not working out and u want to end things it”

    I agree.
    And we have no control over what anyone else does.
    And if they treat us in a decent way how we want to be treated.
    It’s not our job to get another person to treat us well.
    It’s our job to move away from anyone who doesn’t treat us in a way that feels good to us.
    A blessing in disguise if you do not follow and chase.

    A better more mature grown up man up ahead who does know how to treat you is what you want isn’t it?

  112.  #112MovingMagic on February 14, 2013 at 7:36 pm

    I love it when men start using feeling messages with me. It tells me that they’re going to a deeper/emotional place when connecting with me. Depth in a relationship feels so huge to me. A mature man, who’s able to go to express himself emotionally = priceless. 🙂

  113.  #113MovingMagic on February 14, 2013 at 7:42 pm

    I love that I’m able to set a curfew for myself while on dates. I love that it’s Valentines & that I felt no internal pressure to extend my date any further even though the kisses were nice & I was enjoying the conversation. I love that I treated myself to a new bra this week, & vegan carrot cake today. I love that I bought my coworkers colorful star shaped cookies for “heart day”. What a beautiful day. 🙂

  114.  #114k2012 on February 14, 2013 at 7:53 pm

    “The questions are Why would you want a man like that?
    And is this a pattern?
    What’s the pattern?”. 110-Annie. Thanks for responding Annie. I don’t want a man like that all. Trust me. U are wondering if this is a pattern? Wow. The guy before disappearing ex disappeared early (not a problem cause we were not involved, then disappearing ex (as the name suggests disappeared after one year after were in a full fledged relationship) and overseas cd is on his way out as he is messaging less. Wow. This sounds like a pattern for true. All of them are long distance who lives overseas. After disappearing ex disappeared, hairdresser told me that she picked up from the Holy Spirit that long distance relationships were not for me. Well overseas cd was not a relationship. We just started talking regularly but we didn’t reach anywhere. When he told me he wanted a relationship I said,”wow, another long distance. I deliberately made an effort to change my criteria on the one of the dating sites I am on-change it to the caribbean region. Sometimes I feel stuck and wondering what to do. I have long term plans to change the country where I live and wonder if I should search for someone in the country I want to go and when (by the help of God), my plans materialize, I can join the person when my plans work out. But in light of what hairdresser said, I am not sure what to do. But when I told hairdresser where overseas cd lived, because she knows my plans, she asked me why I don’t search for someone inthe country I want to go, although SHE was the one who CAUTIONED me about long distance. When she comes tomorrow, I will ask for her advice and what she is picking up in her spirit. As always, of course, I will continue to pray to God and ask him to guide me in this issue. Also I keep changing my mind about online dating and can’t seem to settle. Also, overseas cd is the third guy I have interacted in a romantic way on facebook. I think I need some advice. I feel a bit confused.

  115.  #115EnergyGoddess on February 14, 2013 at 8:17 pm

    I would just like to say Rori Raye got me laid!!!! Hehe but in a good way. Not in a so I hope he likes me so i’ll give it up way, but a complete 180 in my 5 yr. relationship way. More importantly, a 180 in me!! Feels so good to be a modern siren!! I studied for months, read the ebook and listened to the monthly CDs and stubbornly stuck to the guidelines and trusted Rori. Thanks!!!!! =D Weeeee!

  116.  #116Tereana on February 14, 2013 at 9:27 pm

    I am a little belated, because I don’t get to read the blog every day these days, but here is a re-post from the last thread. This is for you, Iamabutterfly. I hope you’re okay!

    Iamabutterfly #255 (on the previous thread) –

    I hope you know that I did not mean to make you feel sad or humiliated, or even crying about what you wrote. Honestly, I don’t know what you wrote to the guy. I only responded to what you described, and I meant to keep it light. It was like an affectionate laugh of “oh, honey, I’ve been there.” I have SO been there. I’m in guys’ heads all the time, and it’s hard to get out. I’m responding to things they haven’t even said yet, never mind thought, because it’s all conjecture. I’m like that, and I was probably just laughing at myself for it – not even you at all. You reminded me of me. Thank for being a mirror.

    As for your situation, I can see that you feel a lot of pain and frustration around this. And I hope that it gets resolved for you and that you find some peace (or already have). Trust me, I am not judging you at all, though I do realize that what I wrote could have come across as sounding more harsh, when in fact, that wasn’t where it was coming from at all.

    I hope you are not judging yourself either. You’re just fine the way you are.

    Please keep writing what is in your heart!


  117.  #117Tereana on February 14, 2013 at 9:33 pm

    Happy Valentine’s Day everyone!!!

    The weather in SF was sooo gorgeous today.

    And I am spending a gorgeous night with beautiful, wonderful me. Relaxing and savoring a rare evening to myself on a weeknight, when I don’t get home late and have to get up early in the morning. Such a treat!

    I actually had an invitation for a date with a man I know, and I turned it down. At first I said yes, but I also told him I was going to get back to him today. And when I did, I trusted my gut, and said that I just couldn’t do it. I already had plans ; ) But that’s not even what I said. It’s just the truth. I had blocked out “chill-out” time on my calendar, because I needed it. And I am so glad that I did! I relaxed, took a bath. Soon I am going to do my nails and go to sleep. I am so tired now, I could practically just drift off…

    And I felt the love surrounding me while I was in the water. I felt totally loved, like roses and chocolates coming to me all the time, and it doesn’t matter if I have a boyfriend or partner right now. I’m being good to myself and that’s what matters…

  118.  #118Tereana on February 14, 2013 at 9:42 pm

    Meanwhile, part of my taking a break and relaxing is also gearing up to have an “Authentic” conversation with (k) next week. I contacted him yesterday to see if he’ll have any time on my day off to meet. I’m hoping to meet him out in some place neutral and public, where I’ll feel private and comfortable enough to talk, but not so private that we’re in his house.

    I don’t feel scared by him. He’s already proved himself by being a good communicator at the time when I was upset. But I have some important things that I need/want to communicate, and I want to be able to do so in my own time. And going at “my own pace” is actually kind of hard. Part of me wants to rush and get to it sooner, but I also know that that’s not a good idea. It would be too soon, and nothing good would come of it. I need to be ready, and I will be, when the time comes.

    Plus, it’s giving me a chance to sort out (again – seems like I have to do this all the time) what I really want. Is it marriage? Is it something else? Sheesh, what’s really important to me?? And it all has to do with sex. I.e. when can I allow myself to have sex and feel “okay” with it? This all feels so personal that maybe I’ll just write about this to myself. But this is the topic that’s on my mind right now, and I know it’s at the core of what’s stopping me from being in a really good relationship…if I can’t have physical intimacy with a man, then I basically can’t have a relationship with him at all, since that is one of the core foundations of being in a relationship. Then again, maybe that’s just a cultural myth that’s been generated by men who just want to have sex. Or maybe it’s a real and true facet of human beings, and I have no idea what the f– is going on. Okay, I’m tired, and this subject stresses me out a little bit..

    I just wish it were simple, and for me, it’s not. It feels like it can’t be, even though I want it to. And that makes me sad 🙁

    But I still love who I am… <3

  119.  #119Tereana on February 14, 2013 at 9:48 pm

    Hey – I just noticed something.

    I went to go start a new file about my thoughts on marriage and whatnot, and realized that it’s been a very long time since I wrote a long, impassioned letter at a man in my life. A really long time!

    I don’t have dates, but it’s also been a long time since I felt the urge. I used to write them and send them. Then I started writing them and NOT sending them – and saving them in folders with the guys’ names on them. And that’s where I went to go save my new file, and realized that I haven’t added anything to any of those files in months! Maybe I just haven’t had the time. But like I said, I haven’t felt the urge. And that means I must be dealing with my emotions in different ways, taking different actions, and taking more responsibility for my feelings as well. Hooray!

    This is great news, and I feel like congratulating myself for it. It hasn’t been easy! But it’s nice to see I’m making progress : )

    Okay, I’m done spamming the blog.

    Good night, sirens!!

  120.  #120Rebecca on February 15, 2013 at 12:05 am

    I want to start more being myself in the workplace and less pretend/false smiley and happy. I feel scared of this.
    Yesterday I felt so despressed. I felt like the invisible woman at work and I went home feeling incredibly depressed and lonely and scared.
    It feels good to acknoweldge these feelings.

    I wonder where they are in my body. Down my spine and inbetween my shoulder blades…. In my lower back. I also have a blocked nose…

    I feel lethargic and like a heavy weight it on me. I feel unable to feel enthusiastic about “anything”.

    I feels like pressure. It feels like rubbing my head…

  121.  #121Heart on February 15, 2013 at 12:46 am


    I don’t know what to say…Mr. P is acting Weird…

  122.  #122Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:51 am

    I’m feeling lovely 🙂

  123.  #123Rebecca on February 15, 2013 at 1:53 am

    Weird, I feel like I’m in limbo at work. I feel like I am sitting here waiting for something to happen. Feeling let down. Having hope that someone, somewhere will rescue me, give me a plan of action that is on my timeline not theirs. But I wonder if I am kidding myself… Seems like nothing is going to happen..

  124.  #124Daria on February 15, 2013 at 2:31 am

    Oohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh

    I just came back from my Valentines all day date 🙂

    I’m feeling supreme 🙂

  125.  #125Indigo on February 15, 2013 at 3:24 am



  126.  #126Indigo on February 15, 2013 at 3:29 am


    I’d like to share with you a piece of advice that Dominique gave me which helped a lot: Have you tried really *allowing* your feelings? Not expressing them to anyone necessarily, but really just allowing them to the point of “this feels scary I’m so vulnerable”.

    Feel that terror, and feel how good it feels once you’ve stopped fighting it and it subsides.

    What it left me with was a sense of how strong, and how beautiful I am, and how “still here” I am, even after I get knocked by strong, scary emotions.

    You are strong, you are unique, you are perfect, and you will find your love when the time is Just Right.

  127.  #127Heart on February 15, 2013 at 4:15 am

    I hate you Daria <3 🙂

  128.  #128Heart on February 15, 2013 at 4:23 am

    Elsie – I feel for you ….sitting in that room with a Man…raging.
    Something about his raging making you wonder…”maybe he has feelings for her”….
    The pain in your heart because he didn’t even acknowlegde you on V-day…
    Who care what She sent him…he is lucky to be with You!
    Just dump him & get back on horse…

  129.  #129Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:25 am

    Hi Indigo!!
    Thank you. I don’t know but I think I have?
    Felt my feelings. I think so?

    I cried a lot yesterday.
    And now I feel just worn out and numb.
    I feel like hiding from the world.
    I am supposed to have a date tonight and I just don’t want to go…I don’t want to see anyone. I don’t wnt to ‘work at this’, ‘work at me’. I just want a nice easy time. With myself.

  130.  #130Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:29 am

    120 Heart..he is not acting weird, he is being himself lol
    I just felt so peeved at my friend calling me, and asking me about him as he NEVER does that..and then switching from our native lingo into English…so I can only assume that MrP was in the same room, listening in.
    He probably told him to call me.
    I feel angry about this still.
    There is me telling him to ‘fish or cut bait’ and after 2 1/2 years I am out of it…and he contracts the other guy to see if I really mean it.
    Because he KNOWS that I don’t really mean it…urgh!!!!!!!!!!
    I don’t mean it but I will act as though I mean it and then hopefully I can let this go, no matter how much he puffs his chest.

  131.  #131Heart on February 15, 2013 at 4:33 am

    Tam – ever wonder i

  132.  #132Heart on February 15, 2013 at 4:34 am

    Tam – Ever wonder if your too hung up on the “girlfriend” title?

  133.  #133Heart on February 15, 2013 at 4:35 am

    i mean granted Mr. P is a commitmentphobe…
    and well He did have a gf before…
    but still…

  134.  #134Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:44 am

    Heart..I know.

  135.  #135Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:46 am

    131 – Heart, yes I was. I was because he skirted around it so much….I think it was a reaction to his commitment phobia. You know?
    I know I would not have felt secure as the ‘non-gf’. There is no doubt I could have had something resembling relationship with him as long as the pressure was off.
    But, at the price of always feeling insecure.
    And perhaps the price that he walks off and makes someone else his gf.
    I didn’t want to take either of those risks.

  136.  #136Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:53 am

    The scary thing is that after my email, when I analyse his response and the guy calling me to go boating and everything – I could interpret as him trying to please me. Because I had mentioned how I considered our friendship dead as we are not doing anything anymore, and we don’t even wish each other merry Xmas and bla bla.
    So in his little way, he said about the skiing again, he wished me a happy Valentines (which is soooo NOT his style, he normally ‘forgets’ these kinds of days)..AND he gets his matey to call me up and ask me if I wanted to go boating.
    He knows I am pissed…he knows I am checking out, these are feeble attemps at clawing me back subtly.
    Too little and too late.

  137.  #137Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:54 am


  138.  #138Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:55 am

    The last time he had a gf for a longer timeperiod than our ‘non relationship’, which has been ongoing for 2 1/2 years more or less….was at College as for as I know. 4 years so so.
    So, well. That’s almost 30 years ago.

  139.  #139Heart on February 15, 2013 at 5:00 am

    Tam – just stay on your horse…he’s testing your boundaries…you’ve re-attracted him with your new vibe & confidence…

  140.  #140Tam on February 15, 2013 at 5:04 am

    I guess, Heart. I am just sick of it.

  141.  #141Annie on February 15, 2013 at 5:19 am


    k2012No Gravatar says:

    “The questions are Why would you want a man like that?
    And is this a pattern?
    What’s the pattern?”. 110-Annie. Thanks for responding Annie. I don’t want a man like that all. Trust me. U are wondering if this is a pattern? Wow. The guy before disappearing ex disappeared early (not a problem cause we were not involved, then disappearing ex (as the name suggests disappeared after one year after were in a full fledged relationship) and overseas cd is on his way out as he is messaging less. Wow. This sounds like a pattern for true. All of them are long distance who lives overseas. After disappearing ex disappeared, hairdresser told me that she picked up from the Holy Spirit that long distance relationships were not for me. Well overseas cd was not a relationship. We just started talking regularly but we didn’t reach anywhere. When he told me he wanted a relationship I said,”wow, another long distance. I deliberately made an effort to change my criteria on the one of the dating sites I am on-change it to the caribbean region. Sometimes I feel stuck and wondering what to do. I have long term plans to change the country where I live and wonder if I should search for someone in the country I want to go and when (by the help of God), my plans materialize, I can join the person when my plans work out. But in light of what hairdresser said, I am not sure what to do. But when I told hairdresser where overseas cd lived, because she knows my plans, she asked me why I don’t search for someone inthe country I want to go, although SHE was the one who CAUTIONED me about long distance. When she comes tomorrow, I will ask for her advice and what she is picking up in her spirit. As always, of course, I will continue to pray to God and ask him to guide me in this issue. Also I keep changing my mind about online dating and can’t seem to settle. Also, overseas cd is the third guy I have interacted in a romantic way on facebook. I think I need some advice. I feel a bit confused.

    I feel confused?

    How if they are overseas were you in a fully fledged relationship?

    If someone is in another country how are they available to you now?

    The answers are inside you not your hairdresser.
    You can get that connection re connection to your higher spirit yourself.

    If you want to go abroad what steps and ACTIONS are you putting in place to get there?

    “I have long term plans to change the country where I live and wonder if I should search for someone in the country I want to go.”

    That sounds back to front to me.

    If you want to go abroad why not make plans and actions to get there?
    Why do you want to search for a man?
    The ‘men’/ man who wants you will be searching for you if you get yourself out there living your life.

  142.  #142Heart on February 15, 2013 at 5:23 am

    Tam – I know…he’s acting like the siren & dangling the carrot!

    You could always tell him you feel sick & tired of it?

  143.  #143Annie on February 15, 2013 at 5:24 am

    There will be lots of men who want you K2012.
    It’s your job to chose and pick the best of the bunch. The one who will treat you the best and offer you what you want, this is what a grown up good man wants to give the woman what she wants to make her happy.
    Not the other way around.
    That is what a man/boy wants who has not grown up yet wants.

  144.  #144Heart on February 15, 2013 at 5:27 am

    omg …

    Annie – ” The answers are inside you not your hairdresser”.


    That needs to be on a T-shirt!
    I love it!
    I love this blog sometimes..Lololol!

  145.  #145Tam on February 15, 2013 at 5:33 am

    141 Heart, I basically told him already.
    I opened up and told him I am sick and tired of it and don’t want any more contact.
    Since then this is what happened….him sending me the email and this guy calling me on his behalf, basically.
    I feel so livid.
    I don’t want to see him. At all.

  146.  #146Tam on February 15, 2013 at 5:34 am

    Heart, this is funny. MrP always accused me of ‘dangling the carrot’…

  147.  #147Heart on February 15, 2013 at 5:38 am

    Tam – <3 yes…and he's testing your boundaries to see if you mean it…and to see if u still have feelings for him.

  148.  #148Tam on February 15, 2013 at 5:47 am

    Heart.. ugh 🙁
    But he knows I have feelings for him.
    He tests, yes, because he knows I am serious about checking out. He knows I am at the end of my tether, and he knows when I leave the country I will be gone for at least 3 years.
    So now his grey cells are coming alive.
    Guess what. Too late.
    It really is too late. The bs isn’t going to pull me back in.

  149.  #149Tam on February 15, 2013 at 6:00 am

    I feel enraged today. For many reasons.

  150.  #150k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 6:04 am

    Annie- 140-“How if they are overseas were you in a fully fledged relationship?” Answer- We had a visiting relationship. During the year when we were involved. After 3 months of a relationship, he invited me to visit him in the States and he also made plans to visit me as well. On 2 ocasions when he had already made plans, he couldn’t come because of emergencies and it was the last time that
    he finally came, he disappeared shortly after.
    “If someone is in another country how are they available to you now?” Many people are in long distance relationships and it can work out. Ways can be found out to make it work. They can be available to u. It all depends on what the individuals BOTH want. So there can still be and I know of successful long distance relationships.

    “The answers are inside you not your hairdresser.
    You can get that connection re connection to your higher spirit yourself.”. Yes I know the answers are not in hairdresser. True. I know that I can get that connection myself. As I said above, I pray to God every day and ask him for guidance regarding my life to include future relationships. In fact, where overseas cd is concerned, I prayed to God and asked him to give me an indication as to whether overseas cd was going to develop into a relationship. And if things are not going to work out that he is to remove him from my life early cause I don’t want to get hurt again. I asked God to show me a sign either way from early. In other words, if he knew it is going to work out as well, he is to show me a sign. I am a Christian as well as Hairdresser and my spiritual life is going. I try my best to connect to God every day.

    “If you want to go abroad what steps and ACTIONS are you putting in place to get there?”. I can’t really disclose the details here of course. But I have started making plans. The action has started to ensure that, that very important goal is achieved.

  151.  #151BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 6:12 am

    I feel strong. I feel deep.
    I feel like sparkling molecules and atoms of being flow freely through me
    and yet I AM me
    I feel a channel of sensation flowing up from my belly to my heart that feels like YES and KNOWING and it feels in harmony with NO and NOT KNOWING
    and I feel a smile spread across my face and giggling bubbling up from my heart as I notice this.

    A supervisor just came in and snuck some stuff out of a pile I hadn’t been through on my desk, saying “you don’t see me…” and some other stuff. I sat there, quiet for a moment…then thought, heyyy, WHAT DID HE JUST TAKE!!??
    I hunted him down and asked him, he laughed and explained.
    I see now how many of my relationships had strong patterns of “don’t ask questions” and “don’t ask don’t tell”
    controlling information
    hiding from the light of awareness

    I love truth, I love awareness, I love feeling whole and expanded and unified
    yes yes yes!! 😀 😀

  152.  #152Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:21 am

    The more you operate at any of the frequency states, the more ATTRACTIVE you become to things that also operate at those frequencies.
    If you live with fear, you will attract more fear; if you live with joy, you will attract more joy.
    This is the natural law of the universe.
    I managed to lose it all when I started to operate mostly in the frequency range of anger, fear and grief.
    Do you think anyone wanted to hang out with me in those states? People want to be around positive, happy and confident people!
    So, in order to attract those high energetic states of peace and joy, you MUST continuously raise your energetic value.
    There are several ways to do this:
    Live a life of passion – focus on things you really love to do
    Be of value to others and do go beyond the call of duty – if you over deliver in your life, work and business you will create raving fans from your friends, family, customers and colleagues.
    Be grateful for what you already have – when you have gratitude, your physiology instantly changes and your feel more peaceful. You are very fortunate to have everything you already have in this world. Remember over 50% of the world’s population live on less that $2 a day.
    Stay humble – as soon as you believe you know it all, it’s game over for the manifestation process. Your subconscious stops receiving constructive information and you stop growing.
    Exercise regularly, meditate and do yoga -­‐ Your whole mind is your body; the more you use it, the higher your energy becomes.
    As we enter in to the new age of Aquarius, known as the age of awakened consciousness, the level of vibrational energy must continue to be raised.

  153.  #153k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 6:23 am

    Correction: my spiritual life is growing, not going. The action has started, in order to ensure that, that very important goal is achieved. 142- Annie. All this is so true. I totally agree with you. “There will be lots of men who want you K2012.
    It’s your job to chose and pick the best of the bunch. The one who will treat you the best and offer you what you want, this is what a grown up good man wants to give the woman what she wants to make her happy.
    Not the other way around.
    That is what a man/boy wants who has not grown up yet wants.” Since yesterday “Happy Valentines Day” from Overseas cd, haven’t heard a thing. I am leaning back and not saying a word. Actions speak louder than words. Better he acts that way now rather than after we develop a relationship, then he disappear.

  154.  #154Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:25 am

    FW 151…thank you! I loved reading that!

    DS: I focused my meditation on you last night and this morning. It felt really beautiful. I gave lots of thanks for all your blessings…past, present and future. I hope you feel at peace today.

    Much Love,

  155.  #155Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:27 am

    I believe it is a natural part of masculine instincts to test boundaries. I see this in boys all the time.

  156.  #156Vi on February 15, 2013 at 6:28 am

    I feel grateful to MH for the roses. I feel surprized v day has never been special and involved flowers/ gifts.. I feel like genuine inspiration and a muse and a tiger tamer too. I also notice a feeling of superiority and ‘win’ and would like to shift that. I love my ego, but in a relationship I intend to keep wearing Girls hat.
    I feel thankful to myself for a new skirt in small red hearts. I feel love to myself in every tiny heart on the outfit.
    I feel thankful to me for practicing gratitude and the Waterwheel tool. It feels so good. I feel more hopeful and focused on feeling good.
    I feel very thankful for a call from my friend. It felt super fun. I feel so blessed to have such people in my life…
    I feel very thankful to my body for aligning my periods with the new moon. I feel so connected to my body and to the Universe through my feminity. And I feel surprised and grateful to my body for how good I feel.
    I feel thankful to the Universe my mom enjoyed her trip. I feel .. it feels good to know she is havinf fun.

  157.  #157Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:31 am

    Today I feel grateful for accepting the challenge of meditation and joining ladies on this in that exercise. I feel gratitude and thankfulness towards myself for continuing that practice. It is already creating a new life for me.

  158.  #158Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:34 am

    Beloved: Control and power and secrets are things J and I had to deal with at one time….painfully deal with. It takes a lot of work to get open and honest and let go of other people’s actions and reactions (or the actions/reactions you think they will have). We did it though and now we have one of the most open and honest relationships I know of. We had to. There was way too much fear and mistrust and old wounds (scars even) and we were never going to be able to make it if we didn’t get brutally honest with each other (sometimes even having conversations that were very, very painful). But that work…like doing what you did and asking questions and refusing to pretend you didn’t see something and bringing secrets out into the open…is so incredibly worth it. I love watching you heal this…

    Much Love,

  159.  #159Heart on February 15, 2013 at 6:38 am

    The Answers Are Inside You Not Your Hairdresser

  160.  #160Tam on February 15, 2013 at 6:39 am

    Today I feel grateful for knowing that I had the best ever relationship with a man before I knew anything about Rori, or ‘my issues’ or whatever.
    With a man who loved me EXACTLY the way I was.
    Where conflict was resolved, and it didn’t happen often.
    Who adored me, loved me, cherished me and did the best he could to treat me like a queen with limited resources.
    He never ‘expected’ anything from me.
    Just me.
    I feel grateful knowing that the right man is just right, even if we are clueless and full of faults and have not ‘worked on ourselves’.
    All the tools and leaning back in the world aren’t going to make the wrong man right.

    We were just way too young and decided to pursue our careers in different places and I dumped him because I thought I could always find someone like him again.
    Guess what?
    I was wrong. And I no longer buy into the ‘turning men around’ or whatever else it takes with tools and us doing all the work.
    When something is right it just is right.
    And it doesn’t happen often, it just doesn’t.

    Knowing this, somehow brings me peace today. It also feels a little depressing, but it does bring me a lot of peace.

    It is not ‘my fault’

  161.  #161Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:39 am

    FW: 156…me too. I believe it will always be a part of my growth and journey. I love that you accepted the challenge and I LOVE that you are seeing (feeling) results. If you are ever in Houston, I hope you will consider a meditation session with me. Our business will be open in about 8-10 months or so (we’ve been approved on 2 of the 3 steps for the LLC…after that it’s all about making the place beautiful and opening the doors). Part of the business will be guided meditations by yours truly. 🙂 I would love to have you with me one day if it worked out.

    Much Love,

  162.  #162Vi on February 15, 2013 at 6:39 am

    Tereana Yaaay to 118 🙂

  163.  #163Tam on February 15, 2013 at 6:43 am

    I dunno. Hairdressers know a lot about life, they heard it all. they are often armchair psychologists..their clients tell them everything.

  164.  #164Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:44 am

    Yayyy Mercedes. Now I have to find a way and some time to visit Houston 🙂

  165.  #165Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:46 am

    RE 162 – Yeah. Heard and seen a lot. Unwise to dismiss their experience as there could be a lot there to learn.

  166.  #166Vi on February 15, 2013 at 6:47 am

    Mercedes, thank you for your 157 post. It feels so inspiring!

  167.  #167Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:49 am

    Ok FW…let’s manifest that for ourselves. You and me meditating together in Houston. 🙂

    All sirens invited. We’ll make a retreat of it!

    Much Love,

  168.  #168Tam on February 15, 2013 at 6:52 am

    …and to top it all, I just had a work nightmare. One client trying to play me and I was inclined to give in because they are a good company, and because, well, I give in easily.
    And my boss chastised me for ‘not putting my foot down’.
    I feel sick and tired for having to put my foot down.
    What happened to people just being nice and not always trying to get ‘one over’.
    What happened?
    Did I miss something?
    What happened to men bringing me flowers and chocolates for Valentines, not just asking for sex?
    What happened?
    I don’t get it.
    I feel exasperated.

  169.  #169Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:52 am

    Vi – you are very welcome. Big Hug!! I tell my story (usually in pieces) in the hopes that it does inspire and calm and give hope. The validation feels so good. Thank you!

    Much Love,

  170.  #170Heart on February 15, 2013 at 6:53 am

    I just think it sounds soo awesomely random, Tam & FW
    Not trying to disrespect hairdressers…
    I love it…it’s like Monty Python quote or something…hehe
    It stood out and resonated with me for some reason.

  171.  #171Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 6:55 am

    Heart: I would by that t-shirt for my hairdresser. She would LOVE it. 🙂 Let me know if you make them. You have an order for one. Oh…could you make the word “hairdresser” all blingy please? She loves bling.

    Much Love,

  172.  #172Tam on February 15, 2013 at 6:56 am

    169..Heart, I just thought it was funny. But seriously, hairdressers hear so much stuff…hehe.

  173.  #173Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 6:58 am

    Hair dressers and barbers.

  174.  #174Heart on February 15, 2013 at 6:58 am

    LOL Mercedes!

  175.  #175Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 7:13 am

    Heart: For variation, also do one with the word “bartender”. I’ll order six of those. “cab driver” – I’ll take three or so. And I’ll order lots that say “a man”. 😉

    Much Love,

  176.  #176Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 7:14 am

    Maybe “your cat”??

  177.  #177ruth on February 15, 2013 at 7:16 am


    For Heart
    “No-one expects the Spanish Inquisition”

    Starla, I had a lot of blonde highlights
    Quite a change

  178.  #178Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 7:17 am

    “radio DJ”

    “your drunk friend”

    “that wishing star you saw last night”

    “the wishing well”

    Ok…this is kind of fun for me. I need to get back to work…

    Much Love,

  179.  #179Heart on February 15, 2013 at 7:18 am

    “a man”…wow now that really resonates, Mercedes…

  180.  #180Heart on February 15, 2013 at 7:31 am

    Ruth …I haven’t seen that one….I just know the Holy Grail…and vaguely remember The Meaning of Life…
    The holy grail was Greatness though…hehe 🙂

  181.  #181Memulo on February 15, 2013 at 7:45 am

    I mentioned to my cd this morning that sometimes I will attend services on Friday nights (because this is the time when Shabbat service happens). He didn’t say anything but hexlooked very unhappy. That felt disturbing. In all the time I know him only once I said I couldn’t see him because I made other plans.

  182.  #182Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 7:46 am

    Heart 178 – yup…I kinda took the funny out of it with that one, huh?

    Much Love,

  183.  #183Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 7:46 am

    Ok – so for those following – I didnt have a great night – he did text me, but I didnt text him back.

    I dont know what to say or how to act today at work with him. He just called me on my phone but I didnt answer, but he knows that I’m over here because he can hear me typing.

    HELP. What should I do? Do I have a talk with him at work? Let it go? Ignore him? Act polite?

    What would Rori Raye tell me to do today?


    Elsie (still a mess.)

  184.  #184Indigo on February 15, 2013 at 7:47 am

    Tam 128

    If I were you I would just let it be. You say you feel numb and worn out and perhaps you are.

    I very much see here a girl trying to put up “a brave face”.

    Hugs to you.

  185.  #185k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 7:47 am

    Tam – 162″Hairdressers know a lot about life, they heard it all. they are often armchair psychologists..their clients tell them everything.” Lol. That’s so true.” Hair dressers and barbers.” True, feminine Woman, so true. You find that in some cases, u confide in them a lot- problems, plans etc.

  186.  #186Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 7:49 am

    Elsie: I think, as soon as the time is convenient to talk to him, you give him the no girlfriend speech and start circular dating and leave the rest in his hands. I believe that is the absolute core of what Rori teaches.

    Much Love,

  187.  #187Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 7:50 am

    I feel anxious. I feel shaky. I feel like the ground is moving underneath me. I feel nervous. I feel completely ungrounded. I feel needy and desperate. I feel hurt. I feel taken advantage of. I feel like my feelings dont matter. I feel like my love was not reciprocated. I feel like in that moment he knew he was hurting me and didnt care. I feel angry. I feel tired. I feel so so so sad.

  188.  #188Indigo on February 15, 2013 at 7:51 am

    Has anyone here ever cried tears, that you knew were tears of total sadness and devastation, and yet you were grateful for them?

    Like you were feeling in so much pain, and so upset and just so mad and hurt, and yet underneath it all, you knew this is what needed to happen? You know that this trigger is necessary?

    And so after you’ve cried all your tears and felt all your shame, you feel good somehow?

  189.  #189Tam on February 15, 2013 at 7:53 am

    183 Indigo, yes maybe.
    I don’t have any energy left for anybody but me maybe. I feel sick and sad and like I just want to hide in my shell, because everytime I stick my head out, I get whacked.
    That’s how I feel.

  190.  #190MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 7:54 am

    Tam, your Mr. P reminds me of my Mr. J. We dated for a bit a few years ago. We had the look & feel of a relationship, but without the title. He too was a bit awkward in many ways. I eventually ended it because I wanted the full package. He held on for a while ( we both did)…& as he felt me truly drifting away he came unraveled. I tried to make it work. I tried & tried. I stopped feeling like a woman in that situation. I’m so grateful I finally let it go. *Huge sigh of relief*. I learned so much along the way

  191.  #191k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 7:54 am

    Elsie, was he the guy who told u that her doesn’t want to get married? If u are upset about something with him, u definitely need to say it. But don’t talk to him about it at work. Tell him now that u need to discuss an issue with him. But tell him u would like to see him somewhere as u want to speak to him about something. Speak up u hear. Don’t make sense pretending that everything is ok when its not.

  192.  #192MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 7:54 am

    Tam, your Mr. P reminds me of my Mr. J. We dated for a bit a few years ago. We had the look & feel of a relationship, but without the title. He too was a bit awkward in many ways. I eventually ended it because I wanted the full package. He held on for a while ( we both did)…& as he felt me truly drifting away he came unraveled. I tried to make it work. I tried & tried. I stopped feeling like a woman in that situation. I’m so grateful I finally let it go. *Huge sigh of relief*. I learned so much along the way

  193.  #193Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 7:55 am

    @Mercedes – I value your opinion so much. I’m not sure I know what the girlfriend speech is – but I think its the one where you say that you want more and dont want to pressure him.

    Heres the deal. I’m scared to have that speech with him. On top of it – he and I are both dealing (obviously) with so much else.

    I’m wondering if I should just not say anything and just ACT the speech. Basically pull back and lean back and not really have the speech and then if he asks talk to him about it.

    I really dont want to let this guy go. But I also dont want to be treated like that. Now, granted, it was a comment he said on probably the worst day of his life, and he was angry – but still……..I dont like the fact that he knew it would hurt my feelings and then didnt even say sorry, etc.

    I’m a mess. Can I still be friendly to him? I dont know how to act. I feel so out of control right now.

  194.  #194MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 7:56 am

    Tam, your Mr. P reminds me of my Mr. J. We dated for a bit a few years ago. We had the look & feel of a relationship, but without the title. He too was a bit awkward in many ways. I eventually ended it because I wanted the full package. He held on for a while ( we both did)…& as he felt me truly drifting away he came unraveled. I tried everything. I tried & tried. I stopped feeling like a woman in that situation. I’m so grateful I finally let it go. *Huge sigh of relief*. I learned so much along the way

  195.  #195Indigo on February 15, 2013 at 7:58 am


    I don’t know if it is helpful to you, try and have a really good cry.

    It helped me today when I felt some of those feelings 😉

    My mom used to say that we cry when our internal trashcan is full.

    I think your feelings are so understandable. Please be gentle with yourself. Whatever he may or may not mean will become clear, but you take care of you.

  196.  #196MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 7:58 am

    Sorry for the triple posting. I kept getting a notice not allowing it to publish.

  197.  #197Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 7:59 am

    @k2012 – yes this is the guy I’m talking about.

    I am not pretending everything is ok – in fact I didnt answer his text or his call today.

    I dont think he thinks at this point that anything is wrong. I just dont know what I should do. I cant figure out what “feels” right.

    1. Talk to him and act more distant and aloof and lean back and then just start to create space etc.
    2. Just give him the speech.

    The reason I am nervous to do #2 is because frankly, he is going through the worst period of his life yesterday and probably for the next month. I’m not sure that I will get the best or more honest reaction from him at this point.

    I dont know.

  198.  #198Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:02 am

    MovingMagic, thank you.
    Yeah..ugh..I understand how that can happen.
    I feel unable to move forward, or rather I do and then I take a step backward whenever I hear from him.
    I am so so so so sick of it.
    I know it’s nobody’s fault.

  199.  #199Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:04 am

    My internal trash can is overflowing even after crying.

  200.  #200Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 8:13 am

    Elsie: 🙁 “I really dont want to let this guy go. ” – HE won’t let YOU go IF he doesn’t want to.

    If you have a boundary and you state it clearly but refuse to prove to him that your boundary exists then he has no reason to believe he needs to respect it.

    I don’t know what you mean by “I’m wondering if I should just not say anything and just ACT the speech. “. The speech says you will be keeping your options open until you find that man who is really ready to claim you for his love. By “acting” the speech and not saying anything, that means you would begin dating other men but not tell this man that’s what you are doing. Yes, if you feel good about that, I see no reason why you couldn’t.

    Are you prepared to start circular dating? If not, then I sort of feel like you are sending the message to this man (regardless of what your words say) that you are fine with how you are being treated and with what he is offering you.

    If you’re really not okay with that then I see no other solution than dating other men. You’ve already told this man what you want. He told you he’s not prepared to give that to you. He said it in a fit of anger but hasn’t taken it back. What else is there except finding someone who will give you the world?

    I’m very, very sorry. I know from personal experience just how incredibly hard that is. I personally walked away from the best thing that ever happened to me because I wasn’t getting my needs met. But, J and I being together wasn’t near as important to me as me being with the RIGHT man was. I took a chance that I could find real love and I left J. I found real love. J wouldn’t let ME go even when I decided the best thing for me was to let HIM go.

    Much Love,

  201.  #201k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 8:14 am

    “The reason I am nervous to do #2 is because frankly, he is going through the worst period of his life yesterday and probably for the next month. I’m not sure that I will get the best or more honest reaction from him at this point.” Ok, I understand why u are afraid of doing number 2 then. Even if u don’t give him the no girlfriend speech, talk to him about it. And the fact that he didn’t apologize makes it worse. Talk to him about it, but since as he is also going through something, be gentle but assertive. Use feeling messages.(Learning from Rori and all of u on here.). This is a good support group though. So that’s my suggestion.

  202.  #202Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 8:16 am

    But to be clear, I didn’t know Rori back then and I didn’t give a “no girlfriend” speech. I gave a “I never want to see or hear from you again” speech.

    Much Love,

  203.  #203BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 8:22 am


    “But to be clear, I didn’t know Rori back then and I didn’t give a “no girlfriend” speech. I gave a “I never want to see or hear from you again” speech.”

    Which just goes to show – you can’t do the wrong thing with the right guy 😉

  204.  #204Lori on February 15, 2013 at 8:24 am

    OMG, I could have written this letter. That’s exactly what I did with K. I am CDing now and am feeling really great. My question is that if we don’t see each other, how would he even know that my vibe, etc. has changed?

  205.  #205Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 8:26 am

    Elsie: You want us to tell you what to “do” and what will “work”. As Rori says, you shouldn’t “do” anything except take care of yourself and honor your feelings and that man who sees the beauty in that will claim you. There isn’t anything to “do” other than what feels good to you. You won’t know what feels good to you until you really start working with your true feelings…not just the surface ones. 🙁

    Much Love,

  206.  #206ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:28 am

    Massive hugs to you Tam

    I ruined my laptop keybaord with tears 2 weeks ago

    Just dont give up hope, be kind to yourself and take one minute at a time if you have to

  207.  #207Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 8:30 am

    OK I”m weak.

    He called and then I waited an hour and called him back. And then I said he could come over and talk. He talked about how last night went at his house, etc. and then he was over talking to me for about 2 min but then his supervisor called so he had to go….

    He is acting totally normal and like we are normal. He isnt acting at all weird.

    He is acting like yesterday didnt happen.

    Is it possible he thinks that I didnt care about Valentines Day? No….thats not possible….

    And then he probably isnt even thinking about the fact that he said that thing about marriage to me.

    He is SO WORRIED about child custody etc. right now and that is on his mind, not this commend that he made to me in angery yesterday.

    I want to be there for him so badly. But he hurt me so badly.

    I dont know what to do. (And by the way – he is so cute, its hard to focus.) Just be gentle with me sirens……I’m having a hard day here and odnt know what to do.

  208.  #208Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:30 am

    Thank you Ruth.
    I don’t know how I got here once again.
    I feel sad and at the same time so so mad, angry and furious…and mainly just devastated.

  209.  #209Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 8:31 am

    Beloved: Yes. He refused to lose me no matter what I said. It didn’t take long for him to start working through his own issues and proving to me he was ready to claim me. He showed me very quickly he was jealous of the men I was dating but being jealous and being ready to offer me everything I needed are two very, very different things. I was not about to be one of those “I don’t want her but I don’t want anyone else to have her” girls.

    The longest part of the whole process was in how long it took him to convince me he was for real and I should take him back. He certainly was a persistent one. 🙂

    Much Love,

  210.  #210ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:33 am


    Mercedes speaks real sense here
    you will feel so much better in yourself if you do stick to your boundaries, really stick to them
    He will be chasing YOU if he wants to keep you in his life

    For now, I guess you need to feel your feelings

    Anything nice you can do for yourself tonight

  211.  #211Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:33 am

    Hopeless. And fed up with working at stuff.
    It shouldn’t be this hard. Life, love and everything.
    I need a break.

  212.  #212ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:35 am

    I bet you are not in the same place
    I bet you are much further forward down the road

    doesnt stop the knock backs feeling like Sh8t though

  213.  #213ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:35 am

    Have a break then tam

    Nothing stopping you doing that

  214.  #214Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 8:38 am

    This is what I wish for every person on the planet whether they want it or not:

    “But, J and I being together wasn’t near as important to me as me being with the RIGHT man was.”

    Much Love,

  215.  #215Lori on February 15, 2013 at 8:42 am

    Mercedes, I love your posts. That’s how I’m starting to feel. I’m trying to see what I really want and need. I miss K but…can he or will he ever work through his issues and want to try again? Will he be able to give me what I need and want?

    I’m starting to change my focus from him to me and the RIGHT man for me.

  216.  #216Heart on February 15, 2013 at 8:42 am

    Just Keep Swimming! <3

  217.  #217Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:45 am

    211 and 212..thank you Ruth. I don’t know.
    Instead of my self esteem going up, it is through the basement right now. All the pretty people. And I feel like getting constant affirmations that I am ‘not good enough’. Because everybody is so bloody perfect looking here and I see all this triggering fb stuff and the men drooling over the fake women falling out of clothes that don’t cover boobs or arse. And they are all at it. It is starting to make me feel sick, like ‘are there no other values anymore?’

    Everybody is striving for perfection, and I am different..and get called a ‘plain Jane’ (I am so NOT). I just don’y buy into all the superficiality.
    I dress appropriately, not like a p*rn star. Apparently, that is not what the men down here want. I have had practically every guy I dated down here stare at a woman sporting the p*rn star look (and I kid you not), saying ‘now, that’s something I like’. Ugh.
    I feel so sick of it. I feel less than even though I don’t want to be like that. How can that be possible?
    I am sick of it.
    In the eyes of the men here, I am the low value woman because I am not high maintenance, I don’t care about materialistic stuff, and I don’t dress like a hooker.

  218.  #218k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 8:46 am

    I saw this in my inbox yesterday from Elaine. “Did you know that you can gauge
    how serious your man is about you by
    what he does (or doesn’t do)
    on Valentine’s Day?

    If you are not sure whether your man
    is serious about you, watch
    what he does on Valentine’s Day.

    If he is excited about celebrating it
    with you, most likely he is
    at least somewhat serious about
    your relationship.

    If he, however, disappears on you
    and pretends to conveniently
    forget about it completely, chances are,
    he does that to send you a
    message that your relationship
    isn’t anything serious.
    Do you want to know for sure
    what your relationship means to him?”.

  219.  #219ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:47 am


    Time to come back to Blighty, girl

  220.  #220Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:48 am

    Consequently, I am not the one who gets red roses on Valentine’s day..I get texts asking me for sex and naked pictures.
    Because I am a rat, obviously, and that is what I deserve.
    Feck that.
    Helpfully, I see this bloody comment from MrP on some fake chick’s wall, who also wears a dress that her boobs are falling out of, calling her beautiful and whatever else. Feck you and you fecking fakeness. Why don’t you ask Miss baloon boobs to go skiing, you could get an airbag free with it.
    sorry, I needed to spew that out.

  221.  #221Lori on February 15, 2013 at 8:49 am

    Tam, I don’t think that’s all most men are looking for in a woman. A couple of my CDs have told me that it’s not as much about the looks as it is who and how she is. J told me that he thinks a woman who is sexy and smart is more important than a woman who is beautiful. He’s (totally gorgeous man) met beautiful women who the minute they opened their mouths totally turned him off. It depends upon the man.

  222.  #222Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Lori, that’s what I thought. Turns out I was wrong.

  223.  #223Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:51 am

    Oh yeah, they tell me that too…all the words. And then they are drooling over them anyway. Like little boys. I am just sick of it.

  224.  #224Lori on February 15, 2013 at 8:52 am

    No, it’s all about the caliber of the man. The difference between a man and a boy. I have seen both. My favorite CDs are men. Yes, a beautiful woman catches their eye, same as a good looking man catches mine but, it’s more than that.

  225.  #225Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:52 am

    it’s probably Florida. But I did have a guy say to me ‘why don’t you straighten your teeth’ and such stuff. I think after a while it just knocks you.

  226.  #226MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Tam, perhaps there’s a community of like minded people that you can tap into? Community Centers, dance classes, art classes…something?

  227.  #227Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:54 am

    ‘you have the perfect figure – from the waist down’

    that was another howler.
    Jee, thanks for the compliment.

  228.  #228ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:54 am

    I think it probably *is* Florida tam

  229.  #229ruth on February 15, 2013 at 8:55 am

    I think I might have to commit murder within 24 hours of living in Florida

    How RUDE

  230.  #230Lori on February 15, 2013 at 8:55 am

    Again, it’s the guy. Those are boys, not men. Mature, masculine men aren’t going to behave like that. A couple of my closest guy friends have told me (who are in committed relationships) said that they do notice a beautiful woman but so what. They are at a place where who she is, is more important than the superficial.

    Quality men.

  231.  #231Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:56 am

    oh yes, I forgot to say I did meet a guy who was different. But he never called me after going through an hours worth of discussing out first date.
    Go figure.
    Maybe he found a porn star.

  232.  #232Tam on February 15, 2013 at 8:56 am

    Sorry Ladies. I am just having a bad day 🙁

  233.  #233Lori on February 15, 2013 at 9:00 am

    We all have them Tam. 🙂 I used to think most men were dogs, I’ve had to change my way of thinking to most men are good. There’s always the bad, just like women.

  234.  #234BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 9:00 am


    I wonder what it will take for you to hear this…to really really HEAR this..
    all of that longing to be there for HIM
    is YOU crying out to be there for YOU.
    He is a grown man, not an infant.
    Right now your inner lil’ girl is DESPERATELY begging for some attention from YOU.

    All of that fear and insecurity and desperation comes from abandoning yourself internally.
    He is a MAN, let him be a MAN for him,
    you be there for YOU.

    Look around, sink your attention onto something else. You have locked onto this man with laser sharp focus as The Only Possibility and Source Of Love and it’s scaring the heck out of your inner little one. SHE needs you right now, not him.

  235.  #235Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:02 am

    So while we are all here, where are all those quality men? Are we here because we have to deal with guys who can’t commit (always looking for the next best thing), guys who play us, guys who don’t give us anything for Valentines, or our needs aren’t being met bla bla bla.
    So why are we all here?
    Because we meet quality men?
    I think I met a quality man..and then he proves me otherwise at the first opportunity….I for one, have not met one for YEARS. Honestly. Make it 10 years.
    I am not unattractive, I am fairly young, highly educated and quite sociable, and supposedly pleasent to be with.
    So, apart from thinking where are all the good men…if I want to bring it back to me, I wonder ‘what am I doing wrong here?’.
    I give everyone a chance, I try to see the positive points…but when I then walk past a hooker and they tell me I ‘should dress like that’. Well, I am sorry.
    It’s just too much to deal with.
    I feel frustrated.
    Plain Jane has cracked!

  236.  #236Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:04 am

    Lori: I love your posts too. At one time in my life, this was EXACTLY me…EXACTLY…I couldn’t have said it better (just had to delete a few sentences because I didn’t want him back even though I did miss him):

    “I’m trying to see what I really want and need. I miss K but…can he or will he ever work through his issues?

    I’m starting to change my focus from him to me and the RIGHT man for me.”

    Also, I totally agree with what you are saying about it being about a particular man and not about men in general or even men in a particular part of the country (sorry Tam, I just have to disagree here. I have male friends who live in FL and they are very, very good men). Men are not assholes. Certain immature boys are but real men are not – regardless of where they live.

    Much Love,

  237.  #237Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:04 am

    I never used to think most men are dogs, ever.
    I had an amazing first boyfriend.
    This is why I am so amazed.
    When I meet a guy I feel very open.
    And guess what? After a couple of dates – I have a dog that’s drooling.

  238.  #238ruth on February 15, 2013 at 9:04 am

    Tam, I reckon you are in the wrong place , thats all

  239.  #239Starla on February 15, 2013 at 9:04 am

    i have not been feeling good. i am struggling and afraid and i feel anxious


  240.  #240Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:04 am

    over hookers. every time!! Ugh.

  241.  #241Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:06 am

    Ruth, I am beginning to feel the same.
    I love it here, I really do, I love the weather and easy goingness…but the men..they expect the perfect barbiedoll, and that is what women here strive to be.
    I do not want to be like that.
    Hence plain Jane is wondering whether she is really wanting to stay here.

  242.  #242Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:07 am

    Mercedes, just drop it please, I am not ready for having my words twisted. Where did I say men are assholes. Nowhere, so get off my case, thank you!!!!

  243.  #243Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:08 am

    besides, you may have male friends that live in Florida, but I live here full time. And I am European, so perhaps we have different values and different expectations as to what a ‘good man’ actually is. Who knows!!

  244.  #244BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 9:09 am


    To be frank, if I were a good man looking for a good woman, I wouldn’t give a second thought to a woman who is not over an ex and doesn’t have the good sense to get rid of shady men with drug problems.

    I had that on my mind SO often when I was d*cking around with C..what is it saying about me that I’m willing to give someone who doesn’t really love me and can’t be seen in public with me, my precious heart? What would the kind of man I want for me think about that? And turning it around – now that I have a much higher self-worth from being on my own side and sticking to my boundaries – do I want to ally my considerable amazingness with people with mushy boundaries and incompatible values?

    I don’t have to settle, and a good man doesn’t, either.

  245.  #245Lori on February 15, 2013 at 9:10 am

    Mercedes 235, I’m going to follow your examples, Rori’s and Dominique’s teachings. I feel a huge difference in myself and I can tell it shows. I feel so much better and expect more. I’m learning how to stand up for myself and that’s it okay for me to expect better. (Btw, I did tell K on Tuesday morning what I wanted). Not much of a response and I really don’t care anymore. I have CDs who are quality men and who are stepping up. I have one driving to meet me tomorrow. It’s an hour and a half drive.

    Another told me that not only am I beautiful but genuine, smart and sexy. The package. When I’ve been asked what happened with K (previous relationship), I’ve told them that he wasn’t ready for a relationship. Their response “what an idiot for letting you go”. Uh huh. Gees, I’m having fun!

  246.  #246Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:10 am

    Tam: Sorry…I didn’t mean to imply that YOU said it. That was my word for a general feeling. I just meant I don’t think the problem is with FL because there are good men in FL. I know them. Sorry I implied differently. It wasn’t my intent to twist your words at all. It was my intent to agree with Lori that the issue is with individual men and not with all of them or most of them or FL. Again…my apologies.

  247.  #247Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:11 am

    Most men here are superficial, unfortunately, and most women play to it. It is what it is. I’ll take you out for a drink a couple of time and you will see the south Floridian mating rituals.
    You will see the 85 year olds with 25 year old hookers and so on.
    It is what it is, there are very few here that are different. And they live out west, with their families, kids etc. I have been here long enough to observe it.
    Then there are all the winter birds that just come for the winter…

  248.  #248Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:11 am

    The word “asshole” was my word for men who say those kind of things to you Tam. It’s how I think of men like that. It is my word though and I do take responsibility for it. I did not at all mean to put that on you or imply that you said it or even thought it.

  249.  #249Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:12 am

    Mercedes, I dated men here for almost 3 years extensively. That was my experience. You know 2 guys from Florida? I probably dated them already, who knows. When you meet someone over a dinnerparty they are all nice. Try to have a relationship with them.

  250.  #250Starla on February 15, 2013 at 9:12 am

    in other news, qz brought me gorgeous valentine’s roses, gave me a short story he wrote about his love for me (it was sooo well written and clever), and took me to “our” restaurant.

  251.  #251BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 9:12 am

    You are plenty good enough, Tam, you are a queen.
    You don’t have to have prove it, just decide for yourself that you are and act accordingly.
    There is no reason to settle for a clown or a joker or even waste one second with one.

  252.  #252Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:13 am

    Lori 244 – LOVE it!!!

  253.  #253Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:14 am

    Now Starla, that is how a ‘quality’ man treats his gf.
    Happy for you.

  254.  #254ruth on February 15, 2013 at 9:14 am


    so whay are you angry Starla

  255.  #255Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:16 am

    I need to calm down. Sorry for being a mess. I am just superbly frustrated. I tried my best and now I am just getting more and more jaded.

  256.  #256Heart on February 15, 2013 at 9:18 am

    Oh god….are Mercedes & Tam fighting again….
    seriously….when does it end…

  257.  #257Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:18 am

    Ok, I am done with spewing. Yes there are quality men everywhere, bla bla bla.
    Blah blah blah.

  258.  #258Lori on February 15, 2013 at 9:19 am

    Thanks Mercedes! I love it too. When I’m going to meet someone or I’m out, I stop, unzipper my heart and “feel” my femininity, my softness. I love watching the heads turn. J told me that loves how sexy and sensual I am. K (different K now, ; ) ) told me the same thing. I never realized how much we project!

    I’ve set boundaries which I’ve never done before. It feels powerful and awesome!

  259.  #259Starla on February 15, 2013 at 9:20 am

    ruth, i am not angry with him. 🙂

  260.  #260Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:20 am

    I know lots of men in FL Tam…I don’t think you dated them because they are married but they are really, really good men. You don’t have to believe me. it’s okay. I have spent a lot of time in FL (even south FL). J goes there at least twice a month and sometimes I go with him, sometimes not. I went there often when I worked my last job. I have experience there and don’t need to go out for a drink to prove it (but I would be happy to meet you for a drink if it worked out sometime).

    All I’m saying is there are wonderful men in this world…all over this world…even in FL. For some reason you are attracting a type that you aren’t interested in and I don’t know why. I do know I spent a LONG time attracting men who wanted a trophy on their arms who would smile and shut up. I have no idea why I attracted that but it happened to me a LOT. So…i get it…when you find the same kind of man showing up in your life, time after time after time, I get how it can make you feel like most of them are like that. But I don’t think it’s true. I think it’s a nasty voice within yourself that needs to be sent to the corner and fed a cookie. 🙁

  261.  #261Heart on February 15, 2013 at 9:20 am

    Beloved – What an interesting way to look at thing! I’m having an aha moment…
    and feeling excited about finding ways I might be “bad” for a good man!

  262.  #262Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:22 am

    Heart: I’m not trying to fight with Tam at all. I was just trying to be encouraging. I don’t know how else to apologize for giving the wrong impression. I was trying to be a friend.

  263.  #263Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:22 am

    In Florida, the ‘quality’ men show up when you are Botoxed and surgically enhanced to within an inch of your life, with straight super white teeth, in clothes that are too young and too tight for you….
    and that will NEVER be me.

    Sorry, this was the last one…I promise 😉

  264.  #264Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:24 am

    Thanks Mercedes.

  265.  #265Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:25 am

    Lori: YAY!!!!!!!!!

    ” I never realized how much we project!

    I’ve set boundaries which I’ve never done before. It feels powerful and awesome!”

  266.  #266Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:26 am

    Well, Mercedes, if you read properly, I said the good ones live out west with their families, i e are married. It is what it is. Single guys here are like kids in a candy shop.

  267.  #267Lori on February 15, 2013 at 9:26 am

    Mercedes, I think we “get” what we “expect”. I had a pretty low opinion of men for a long time. I waited for them to disappoint me. I’ve changed how I view them and what I expect. It’s liberating. I think they also feel how we think of them.

    Unfortunately, the email for this thread is something that I exactly did with K. It won’t happen again.

  268.  #268Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:27 am

    I am not attracting ‘that type’. It is what there is here.

  269.  #269Starla on February 15, 2013 at 9:28 am

    255 Heart

    Well, there’s a pattern emerging, in which one particular poster is the common participant across the majority of isolated conflicts on this board with a range of posters. So, to answer your question, it will most probably end when that common participant knocks it off.

    Or many of us may eventually just get tired of it and leave, and then there would of course be no one to insult, pick apart, question, or demoralize for sport anymore. That would also expedite the ending in question.

    Oh… that was a rhetorical question, wasn’t it? 😉

  270.  #270Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:31 am

    I have dated soooooo many guys here. The ones born here just bought into that whole looks/superficiality thing. That is how they grew up. MrP is the least shallow of all, and best educated, yet he totally buys into it also.

    I have a friend from Canada, who spent two years in school here and then left, horrified, because even 15 years ago, when she was 12-13, all the girls in her school were wearing make up and talking about sex…and about how to look better…Whilst she was wanting to play with dolls lol. She has her whole family here…she said there is no way she would live here again.
    So, thank you, but it is not just me, clearly!
    It is a whole cultural thing going on.
    And honestly speaking, if I ever had a daughter here – I would not want her to grow up in this. No way.

  271.  #271Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:33 am

    I don’t have a low opinion of men, never had. But this is definitely being challenged by living in Florida, I have to say. Women here too, sadly.
    I guess they kind of match each other.

  272.  #272Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:34 am

    I guess I am just not the type who is interested in people who spend the whole evening discussing where to get the best botox/boob job/ butt implant.
    There are many that are. I am not.

  273.  #273Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:35 am

    ok, mad rant over..I hope. lol

  274.  #274Mercedes on February 15, 2013 at 9:36 am

    I did read properly Tam and I just meant there are good men…

    I don’t know. I’m tired. I was really, really just trying to be encouraging and loving…

    Maybe tomorrow I will be able to read properly and respond better and maybe it doesn’t even matter. I don’t really have to convince anyone that I know good men. I don’t have to defend them. They don’t even know this conversation is taking place.

    I have no idea how to say the words “sorry”, “my apologies” and “trying” and “I get it” without being misunderstood.

    Be back Monday unless the weekend allows…

    Lori: ” It won’t happen again.” – Same goes for me and my love life. It won’t happen again. 🙂

    Much Love,

  275.  #275Tam on February 15, 2013 at 9:38 am

    I never said that there aren’t any good men in Florida..but they seem to be married.

  276.  #276BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 9:38 am


    Heart – PLEASE don’t use it as a tool for blame or shame, m’kay??!!

    A friend of mine and I, who are both intensely intuitive (when we allow it!) looked ‘inside’ the essences of Gay and Katie Hendricks once, because we wanted to see how they did what they did, at an energetic level (looking at patterns only, no personal information).

    What we saw, is that they both cherish their essence, CHERISH and TREASURE it, so highly, that they don’t waste a second that’s not necessary with anyone who isn’t aligned with their essence. What they have inside of them they KNOW is so valuable, so important, that they don’t bother with anything not aligned with their desires and their vision.

    I’ve been wanting that for myself ever since I realized that – it’s been a couple of years of clearing off the sludge but I can feel it inside of me now.
    With every “No” that means “no” and “yes” that means “yes”, with every truth I speak and every boundary I honor, I create that space for what I really deeply desire in my life.

  277.  #277BeLoved on February 15, 2013 at 9:39 am

    I feel so PASSIONATE right now!!

    I feel like I want to ignite this fire in EVERYONE!!!!!

  278.  #278Lori on February 15, 2013 at 9:42 am

    Mercedes, you did just fine. 🙂

    Dominique has my personal email. I’m going to ask her to give it to you. I do appreciate what you post and your encouragement.


  279.  #279Heart on February 15, 2013 at 9:51 am

    Beloved – no no not at all…more like how can I show up better for my Mr. Right…

    ((((Starla + Mercedes + Tam))))

  280.  #280Starla on February 15, 2013 at 9:54 am

    ew, i did not consent to a group hug


  281.  #281Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 9:59 am

    Wow!!!!!! It would be great to raise the vibrations on the blog

  282.  #282Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:00 am

    Starla lol

  283.  #283Lori on February 15, 2013 at 10:01 am

    I’m right there with you FW. It’s Friday and I have a 3 day weekend! I’m a happy girl. 🙂

    I had no expectations yesterday and was pleasantly surprised by several texts and emails wishing me a Happy Vday. Love it! 🙂

  284.  #284Starla on February 15, 2013 at 10:05 am


  285.  #285ruth on February 15, 2013 at 10:06 am

    I am feeling wicked

    Bad Ruth

  286.  #286Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:07 am

    I had no expectations yesterday either!! Yehaw!! And I was surprised by: exactly nothing.

  287.  #287Heart on February 15, 2013 at 10:08 am

    How do you raise the vibes FW?

    Is it just me…or Does Femininewoman remind anyone else of Owl from Winnie the pooh?
    Hehe ….I write that with love…
    *runs away and hide..

  288.  #288Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:08 am

    oh that’s not stricltly speaking true. I was surprised by the quality Floridian men asking for sex.
    OOps, there she goes again..hehe.
    Ok, I stop NOW 😉

  289.  #289ruth on February 15, 2013 at 10:11 am

    Well no one asked *me* for sex
    Im off to sulk;)

  290.  #290Lori on February 15, 2013 at 10:12 am

    Dang, me neither! I want to be asked for sex. lol!

  291.  #291Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Ruth and Lori, I could feel ridiculed here but I don’t because it is all in good humour.
    Just that it gets old if that is what they want, mostly.
    I mean, there are prosititues, but maybe they are too expensive, I don’t know?

  292.  #292Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:17 am

    I wouldn’t even mind, I love sex, but…what’s wrong with being treated nicely too?

  293.  #293MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 10:17 am

    A guy offered to suck my toes. Not exactly sex. Ahahaha!!!! This lady is cracking up over here.

  294.  #294Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:18 am

    Girl, you can always come down here, plenty of men would be willing to help.

  295.  #295Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:20 am

    Well, all come down to Florida then, it really takes less than an hour to find a hot guy for sex, in some of the pick up places. Guaranteed.

  296.  #296Lori on February 15, 2013 at 10:20 am

    Tam, don’t feel ridiculed. We are teasing and attempting to lighten the mood. Laughter is the best medicine ever.

  297.  #297ruth on February 15, 2013 at 10:21 am


    Its been a long time
    I think I have forgotten what to do LOL

    Best head on home
    have a good day ladies

  298.  #298Tam on February 15, 2013 at 10:21 am

    Well, I am not laughing, I feel frustrated.
    But ok.

  299.  #299MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 10:28 am

    Sorry Tam, when I got the toe sucking request I couldn’t help but to laugh…I mean it seemed a little far fetched to me. I’ve got to give the guy some credit for at least throwing it out there. My laughter was coming from a good place. I’ll honor your feelings & drop it.

  300.  #300Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 10:33 am

    Words like love, appreciation an gratitude have high vibrations. I am in mental space nowawadays that these things resonate with.

  301.  #301Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 10:40 am

    I feel so intrigued that you experience me as owl. I used to be addicted to the adrenaline rush of drama these days I am more focused on love and peace. So when I do get involved in drama it is usually with the intention of inspring someone to see things differently. If I realize they don’t feel open to accepting then I’m outta there.

  302.  #302Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 10:42 am

    I’ve never been known as the one who runs and hides in real life. For years my drama queen had been wearing and using boxing gloves

  303.  #303Starla on February 15, 2013 at 10:48 am

    “it is usually with the intention of inspring someone to see things differently.”

    this is often just drama exercising itself in a prettier disguise.

  304.  #304Heart on February 15, 2013 at 10:52 am

    FW – *runs and hide* that was me describing my action …hence the asterisks …
    I don’t know why…but I just think of you as Owl sometimes..maybe because Owl is well-read & knowledgeable.

  305.  #305mary on February 15, 2013 at 11:01 am

    Hi Rori,

    I loved your answer to Sandi!



  306.  #306Violette on February 15, 2013 at 11:32 am

    Sequoia 61, I do imagine it’s different practicing feeling messages on men in Germany compared to the US. I’ve only dated one Austrian, here, and I’ve lived in France, and dating is just different. There are chivalrous men in Europe, certainly, but to me dating felt more like instant relationships than courting, in general…

    Also I found European men(a vast generalization) to be more sensitive and emotional, even feminine at times, but all the more reason to practice being the feminine one…I imagine the right person will appear. It will be interesting to hear from you how it goes!

  307.  #307Tam on February 15, 2013 at 11:32 am

    299 Moving Magic, that didn’t set me off at all, that was quite funny.
    Actually…I guess my sense of humour has suffered a bit too through all this. Ugh.

  308.  #308Violette on February 15, 2013 at 11:37 am

    Olivia 95 yes it did all come from you!! I feel so happy hearing about the good things that have been developing in your relationship.

    I keep surprising myself with how much power I have as a woman, and how much I can influence my romantic happiness. I went to a bar Wed night with girlfriends, and they got frisky and started asking the bartender what he thought of me(I’ve been there before and always talk to him, super cute) and he told them to tell me he loved me! It was pure silliness, but what fun to have such flirting! I just smiled at him when we left and he looked sheepish. That feeling has been carrying me since, and when I saw D last night, I could just feel my vibe radiating. He was so attracted to me, and I felt incredibly sexy and seductive, and I know I’m onto something with this circular flirting thing! D cooked, gave me a professional massage, we had great sex, and yes, it all came from me! I wouldn’t be feeling this way if I didn’t go out on purpose to get my flirt on with whoever was there (:

  309.  #309Tam on February 15, 2013 at 11:40 am

    Yes, in Europe generally speaking it used to be like this:
    Exclusivity Talk = when you start to sleep with someone.
    There was no ‘exclusivity talk’, it was JUST assumed that you were a couple.
    Alas here, it is quite alright to be shagging around like a maniac and excusing it as dating. That really suits most men and only some women.
    When you look deeper, it’s just an erosion of moral and sexual values, actually.
    Hence all these STD’s etc.
    I don’t know if I even disagree with it,
    but rather than making everything easier, it seems like women get stuck with this because they just generally speaking react to sex differently.

    Quite a liberation then, eh?

  310.  #310Violette on February 15, 2013 at 11:44 am

    Tam I resonate with where you are very much, as to feeling that men all want a bimbo. I live in a superficial town too, and am more an introverted type, and I’ve lived in Europe and yes, it is different being a woman there than in Florida.

    Of course you know deep down that you’re just in an icky place and that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, but I will say I have lovely, natural, intellectual cousins who live in that state and have men falling all over them, because they are simply lovely.

    The one and only thing that has helped me get out of that head space it getting out of town for a bit!! It just clears everything out. And staying on my horse too, if I force myself to keep flirting and going on dates, and face the guys who aren’t so great, keep voicing my boundaries and my feelings, somehow because of that better men have been showing up, and I feel hopeful again. And I find myself so surprised.

    Don’t give up. You won’t feel this way forever and you are attractive to men simply because you are a beautiful woman, plus you’ve got the exotic foreigner thing going for you!

  311.  #311Tam on February 15, 2013 at 11:44 am

    ‘we are not in a relationship’ is always a nice cop out phrase for doing what the hell you want and saying to the other person: ‘this is your choice’
    You choose to be with me, so if I tell you that we are not in a relationship you know the score.
    Your problem.
    Ermmm…I am not so sure about this anymore.
    Again, when did it become permissible to just wash ones hands of all responsibility by saying 3 words?
    ‘not in a relationship’
    On all accounts and purposes, when you are having sex with someone that puts you in some kind of relationship to the person, right?
    Unless you pay them for it, then it’s a service.

  312.  #312Turquoise on February 15, 2013 at 11:45 am

    Hi Sirens,

    A few days ago I saw a picture on Facebook that totally reminded me of Mr. Conversation. So, I saved it and sent it to him. I had no expectation of hearing back from him. Later that day, as I was driving home, I saw him, didn’t wave or anything, it actually wasn’t until I passed him that I realized it was him in a new car. So, just thought a happy vibe and sent it his way, like a congratulations on the new car with a smile I could feel on my face. Today, he texted me back and asked me if I felt that way about the picture (something it said) and we’ve texted a little today. Nothing special, nothing big, and I’m leaning back. It would be easy to keep texting because he is replying, but I don’t want that. I still feel drawn to him, man that guy has some sexual magnetism…. sheesh, he must have strong pheremones or something because I can get turned on just thinking about him. SOOOO, extra big reason to turn my focus elsewhere. lol. I don’t want him feeling my sexy vibe and thinking I want to hook up. Although…. I would enjoy that a lot, I know I’d feel addicted and want more.

    I had an a nice time with Sweetheart last night. We went for a drive to a scenic spot, had milkshakes and talked a lot. I shared how I’d been feeling and he reassured me of his feelings, and what’s been going on. Then he called me later and we talked another hour. He really opened up more about his health concerns, what he’s treated for and how he feels about all of it. I feel a little overwhelmed. I keep reminding myself he’s the same person, but I do feel like I will take a small step back.

    It’s been such good practice and thinking about how I acted with Mr. Conversation and this past few weeks with Sweetheart, the same type feelings again…. I realized how much I am set upon a destination. It’s not marriage, it’s the solid relationship where I feel I am safe. That they won’t bolt. Also, what a surprise to see how often I want to walk away. I did the same exact thing with Mr. Conversation over and over. I create what I don’t want and stand in my own way. I’m kind of feeling mind boggled right now at all these revelations.

    I’m going to see C, the girls and a few nieces and nephews at a local ski place for a few hours. I’m going to help out in the lodge, keep an eye on them as they need rests. I offered and he was thrilled.

    FW, I swear, what you said about seeing the person as friend or foe, stopping the argument and looking at intention, may have changed my life. Thank you for sharing, I know it’s going to have a dramatic effect on my life and my times with C. I feel such a shift. I’m excited to see how it plays out, and practice.

    I’m thinking of going and getting a pedicure first, then heading out to the ski lodge… see if I can get an appointment! 🙂 I need some ME time too.

    Hugs Sirens, may you feel awakened today!

  313.  #313Tam on February 15, 2013 at 11:45 am

    actually 4 words lol

  314.  #314Violette on February 15, 2013 at 11:51 am

    Tam 309 I actually agree with you very much. That is exactly why in America it’s so helpful to work with these tools and have boundaries, because it’s not exactly build into the culture these days…to be honest I’ve been getting a lot out of watching romantic comedies from the 40’s because the women are actually quite empowered in their interactions with men, at least during the courting phase…which I find very interesting.

    Being a feminist doesn’t mean losing our femininity and our female mystique!

  315.  #315Heart on February 15, 2013 at 11:55 am

  316.  #316Starla on February 15, 2013 at 12:04 pm

    i was craving a soda but grabbed a lemon lime sparkling water instead. 0 calories. i have pretty great willpower.

  317.  #317Heart on February 15, 2013 at 12:07 pm

    I’m not checking my FB or my main email for a couple ofdays…I already feel different.

  318.  #318Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 12:11 pm

    Turuoise. The only thing I have to say is awarness is key and conscious living and loving can change our lives

  319.  #319Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    Hehe Heart :). Not what I was thinking at all. Thanks

  320.  #320Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    OK everyone get ready to yell at me.

    Seriously yell.

    So today he came over and we talked about how he was so angry yesterday and I wasnt going to say anything but then I said – yes you were very angry. You sort of took it out on me, and I didnt deserve it. And he looked COMPLETELY confused. He was like, well, I dont think I said or did anything that was rude to you. Honestly, I think he was in just such an angry haze yesterday after what happened, he doesnt even know that being so fussy and saying he would never get married really hurt me.

    So, then I said – well, it was Valentines Day. And then he got REALLY upset. He said – OMG, it was the worst day of my life. I said, yes but you had all morning to say something, and he said….ok, well, thats not what I was going to do. Well, apparetnly he was going to do or say someting but this whole horrible thing came up.

    So, I said, look, if you think I’m the kind of girl who would want a Valentines Gift after you had that incident happen, then you dont know me very well, and you can just go, because that is not what i”m saying…..and he said……no, I know you arent. And then HE SAID…..If you think I”m the kind of guy who would really let Valentines Day pass without saying anything to YOU then you should go…because I’m not that guy. I even tried to text you last night to talk and you didnt answer me.

    So I have no idea what he had to say or planned, etc.

    So I CAVED. (Here is the part where you all yell at me.) I gave him my gift which was just something very small – and not romantic but compeltely practical, and homemade. He LOVED IT. But I could tell he sort of felt bad he didnt have anything for me.

    He said that it was an awesome gift and that he totally appreciated it and hugged me.

    Then we hung out at lunch.

    So – I know. I leaned in. I gave more than he gave me.

    So, go ahead and yell at me everyone.


    I never did bring up the fact that he said that he never wants to get married. I am really thinking that because today he was so close to me, that he just said it out of anger.

    My game plan is to now lean WAYYYYY back, and allow him to get through his stuff, and I”ll get through my stuff and we’ll see where we are at the end of it.

    OK – go ahead and lay into me. LOL

  321.  #321Heart on February 15, 2013 at 12:23 pm

    Elsie – do you have Rori’s book? Remember feeling messages…and No “you’s “.

  322.  #322Starla on February 15, 2013 at 12:25 pm

    elsie, i think you’re unfairly beating yourself up here. i do get what you’re saying about the ‘mistake’ you made in giving more to him than he gave to you, but what if we flipped it around differently, since he did say that it was reasonable for you to expect something out of him for valentines day.

    the flip would go more like “ugh, go ahead and rip into HIM, ladies. for not giving me a damn thing.”

    it is important we take responsibility as sirens, for how much we lean forward. but sometimes, the man really is just being an idiot. and then we blame ourselves. yuck.

  323.  #323Starla on February 15, 2013 at 12:31 pm

    it’s also apparent that he does care about you. he is feeling blamed and made wrong, which can shut him down to fixing it (ugh, egos… i tell ya…).

    something that comes to mind is to maybe tell him plainly that you feel angry and second rate, and you can tell he does care about you and you don’t want to feel that way with him, and it would feel good to have a do-over of valentines day as soon as he can if he’d be willing to take that on. then ask him what he thinks.

  324.  #324Allison on February 15, 2013 at 12:41 pm

    Hi Rori and everyone,

    My boyfriend broke up with me nearly 2 weeks ago after I had been shut down and not taking great care of me during January. I’d become frustrated with myself and shut him out…I left one day and neither of us contacted each other for 5 days. When I did finally contact him, he broke up with me saying he was never in love with me and there was something missing. We had dated for over 3 years and we were very much in love. He treated me like a queen and asked me to move in with him. I was very excited and looking forward to it, and then I got scared. Instead of talking with him, that’s when I put up a wall and started the sabotaging. Well, since he broke up I had been contacting him nearly every day trying to work it out, but he is cold and like a complete stranger. Now, after nearly 2 weeks of that I realize I’d done that all wrong. I know I need to focus on me, my career and my hobbies more. I’m a dancer, a massage therapist and I home school my 5 year old daughter. She really misses him too.

    Anyway, I feel like I totally screwed up and I have a hard time not feeling like this is a lost cause, especially since I haven’t really left him alone after he ended it. I’ve been trying to “fix it” up until now. He suddenly was never in love with me, really? And he suddenly is sure he can not live with anyone ever. He says he may move away to South America soon, but we used to talk about doing that together. He always told me he’d never leave without me. And now he suddenly says there was just something missing between us. Well yes I agreed with him because of course there was something missing when I had a wall up. It’s like every time I feel like I have everything I want I sabotage it because there’s no way it can be for real. I was doing so very well being authentic and loving me, and then suddenly fell back into my old ways. I’m doing my work now to help change that.

    I can probably see him regularly if I want… He’s our chiropractor and doc of natural medicine and he kept my daughter a lot for me while I worked. He said he’d continue to work on us in his office if we need it, without charge of course. He gave me $2000 after he broke up with me because he felt bad that I had to abruptly change my living plans. That is when he also gave me a massage that he “owed” me, which was confusing. It was a very erotic massage where he was only giving to me, but I wouldn’t have sex without love. He could not handle that at all and I had to fight him off, so that felt powerful to me. I just feel so clueless and confused right now. I want to keep my hopes up and move on at the same time, but I totally am battling the strong feelings that all is lost. Any advice would be appreciated. 🙂

  325.  #325Smile on February 15, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    I would really appreciate insight into this concept which i am struggling with please.

    Getting clear on what you want…without predicting and being too far into the future…? What is the difference?

  326.  #326Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 12:51 pm

    @Heart – I do have her ebook. I am wondering if I should buy the package of all her books – what do you guys think? Have ay of you bought all of them?

    @Starla – Thank you for your kind words. I do feel like I should be beating myself up. I think he did feel attacked, and I dont think I used feeling words really well….ugh.

  327.  #327Tam on February 15, 2013 at 12:58 pm

    322 Starla:
    ‘sometimes, the man really is just being an idiot. and then we blame ourselves. yuck.’

    I definitely find myself in that place often.
    Analysing for so long until I blame myself for some
    guy who doesn’t treat me well. Like it’s somehow my fault, because I was being too nice or had some other flaw or whatever else.
    I am sick and tired of second guessing myself, trying hard (even just to lean back). It should not be like this, and it doesn’t have to be.
    Sometimes the guys re just idiots/clueless/do their own thing/don’t give a rat’s arse….and we blame ourselves for not being enough, doing the right thing, saying the right feeling message.

  328.  #328MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    Tam, I’m glad I didn’t upset you. I can have a pretty dry sense of humor.

  329.  #329Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    ‘except feeling messages and no ‘you’s’
    ladies, try, try, try.
    Try so hard to make a silk purse out of a pig’s ear.
    And see if it works. In my experience for a bit but not long term. A guy either loves you and is on the same page or he doesn’t.

  330.  #330MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 1:02 pm

    Is there any way you can treat yourself to a comedy, or a light film? I know it’s not the answer but it might ease some of your thoughts.

  331.  #331Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:03 pm

    Elsie, this is what I mean. You gave him a gift. What’s the big deal?
    If you are on the same page with someone, it is NO big deal. The reason why we are second guessing ourselves so much is when we are NOT on the same page and feel insecure about every little thing.
    I hate that place.
    I do not want to go back there.
    I want a relationship where it feels fine when I do something for the guy and not like somehow it turns into a big deal. Where I don’t have to second guess myself whether I am overfunctioning…where he doesn’t start treating me as ‘less’ because I give something.

  332.  #332Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:04 pm

    I got some DVD’s out Moving Magic…thank you.
    I will turn off everything, computer and phone in an hour and just relax. I feel like a mess, confused and defiant at the same time.

  333.  #333Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    @Tam – totally. I sit around and overanalyze. Seriously I wish I got paid for it – I’d be a millionaire.

    He over there going – wow, I like bread. Or whatever guys think that dont amount to anything deep. LOL

  334.  #334Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:08 pm

    329 or was that for Elsie? Haha..Elsie, want a DVD? I have 3!

  335.  #335Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:11 pm

    I am feeling relaxed and happy on the blog again:)

  336.  #336Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    Heart, that article you posted up there – YES. Real eye opener. I am wondering whether MrP wrote that lol

  337.  #337Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    Starla, I have scared a lot of people away today it seems. You can take the heat, eh? 😉

  338.  #338Smile on February 15, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    Hi tam, 331, hope your okay… Sending lovely thoughts your way 🙂

  339.  #339Iamabutterfly on February 15, 2013 at 1:15 pm

    I feel really sleepy. I just wanted to write out some thoughts and feelings to kind of kill some time.

    I just kind of realized that what is so scary about Mr. Stares Me Down is that I know NOTHING about him. This is unusual for me. I feel like I know a little something about everyone. Even it’s not a big something, I tend to know SOMETHING.

    I don’t ANYTHING about Mr. SMD, except that we went to school together a long time ago. Which I feel so curious about, because he remembers it, and I don’t.

    I also know that I feel wildly attracted to him, and angry and scared with him.

    I hope that it’s not because he’s “a bad guy” and my body is trying to warn me, but I hope that it’s just my inner little girl, begging for protection from being hurt again.

    Here’s what I’ve noticed.

    I’m fine around guys that I’m attracted to that aren’t pursuing me.
    I’m fine around guys that I’m NOT attracted to, who ARE pursuing me.

    The men who terrify me the most are the ones who are attractive AND are actively pursuing me.

    That feels fascinating.
    I think it’s because I know that those are really the only kinds of men who can hurt me, because those are the only kinds of men I can legitamately fall for.

    The ones who I’m attracted and pursue me are the ones who hurt me the most. I have a hard time LETTING them pursue me.

    I become suspicious. I tear whoever I think it is they are apart, limb from limb, flaw by flaw.

    poor guys…:(

  340.  #340Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:15 pm

    Hey Smile, thank you. I am just ranting and raving uncontrollably…you gentle soul 🙂
    I am cracking up a little here between the MrP and Curly thing.
    But holding up ok 😉

  341.  #341Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:15 pm

    Well, not really.

  342.  #342Heart on February 15, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    #335 Tam – hehe Tam 🙂

  343.  #343Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    Elsie what stuck out to me is how many times you invited outsiders to beat up on you. It tells me you don’t like yourself very much and maybe this is how you invite guys to love you. By beating you up so they can do your dirty work for you. It seems to me your work is in learning to love yourself rather than wanting a man to marry you.

  344.  #344Smile on February 15, 2013 at 1:25 pm

    ((tam)) I empathise. I just read back and kind of got the impression mr p kept in contact re the ski holiday.
    Keep strong, you know what you want/deserve x

    I’m in the angry stage at strumming man now, it’s so much easier lol, ha but no one would ever be able to tell I’m angry, I love my quiet anger a bubbling under current but I let out the steam every now and then, he’s not worthy of ‘a show’ eventually I’ll simmer down to nothing.

  345.  #345Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:29 pm

    343 thanks Smile, and I am in that angry stage also, on and off, have been. It is easier but in the end I realise that with me there is a huge untapped pool of sadness underneath it…and I wish it would just go away.

  346.  #346Heart on February 15, 2013 at 1:31 pm

    #325 – Elsie I think you should read the book again & practice more…

  347.  #347Tam on February 15, 2013 at 1:32 pm

    The good thing is that should it happen that I bump into him at one point before he goes skiing, I would really be very cool and probably not willing to speak to him. Which is great.
    After his skiing holiday, I am almost out of here is nothing drastic changes…and I will really have bigger problems to deal with than a man-baby.

  348.  #348Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:35 pm

    i wonder how bloom-ing is doing

  349.  #349Dominique on February 15, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    218 – I’m sorry, yet this is not necessarily so. Every man is different, and his feelings for you have NOTHING to do with a day such as Valentine’s Day.

    It’s all the other days of the year combined, it’s his actions on a daily basis which will show you where his heart is.


  350.  #350Elsie on February 15, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    @Tam – What DVDs??? 🙂

    @Feminine Woman – “Elsie what stuck out to me is how many times you invited outsiders to beat up on you. It tells me you don’t like yourself very much and maybe this is how you invite guys to love you. By beating you up so they can do your dirty work for you. It seems to me your work is in learning to love yourself rather than wanting a man to marry you.”

    Yes. You are probably right. I allow myself to be treated not as nicely as I deserve.

  351.  #351Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    i feel really sad reading stuff on here about judging women

    seriously i feel so MAD!


    i don’t want to deal with seeing people’s unexamined self judgements get turned on women

    judging women for showing their bodies, for decorating them how they want , for their sexuality

    i feel so MAD!!!!!!

    i feel mad at the people who post on here about it who

    seemingly DONT GET that



    I feel frustrated to be reading a lot of them

    i feel sad reading them

    i feel scared

  352.  #352Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:43 pm

    im feeling not seen

    i feel hopeless

    i feel frustrated

  353.  #353Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:43 pm

    i LOVE these feelings

    i LOVE my frustration!

  354.  #354Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    belief: you don’t deserve a relationship when you have these judgements


    i want to heal this

    I don’t deserve a relationship and love when I have these judgements and can’t see past them.

    And it’s my ‘fault’

    Healing healing healing

  355.  #355Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    348, dominique

    i agree, but i also think most men do know that it is generally pretty dang important. still, some guys don’t want to come on to strong, or might even think you’re not terribly into vday! so to avoid confusion, for our first vday, i told QZ that valentine’s day was important to me.

    now, if you’ve told your man it’s important to you, he can tell you he hates it, if that’s the case. then you guys can talk about it. but if you tell him it’s important to you, and he doesn’t protest, and just blows it off, then i think it’s safe to take it as a sign that he’s just not that into you.

  356.  #356Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    Dominique I got that email too and felt so deeply depressed after reading it that my better judgement told me not to post it here

  357.  #357Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    I feel really angry!

  358.  #358Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:48 pm

    daria, i agree. there has been some very dangerous, hurtful judgment flying around this board lately, and it’s going mostly unchecked.

    i feel all “but whatever,” though. probably cuz i know i can’t beat crazy or stupid!

  359.  #359Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:49 pm

    I feel rageful

    i want to explode this casing off of me and blow off all the energies that feel like they are judging me and pressing in on me

    i want to BLOW the seeming source of the judgements – people writing them – back on their butts, dazed and empty of thoughts

    i feel so energized with surging feeling up my back!

  360.  #360Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:50 pm

    Starla – reading that, I feel doubtful we’re triggered by the same words/context…

    and that feels fun! to not talk about exactly what’s triggering me and therefore avoid blaming or triggering someone to defense

  361.  #361Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    now that i think about it, i bet we have two different manifestations of judgment here in mind!

    hmmm… i feel inspired.

  362.  #362Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    now i feel guilty and worried ! I feel scared i brushed someone off from connecting with me!


    i felt … triggered as well as soothed

    now i feel triggered out my body to disconnect from my emotions

  363.  #363Daria on February 15, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    yay! now i feel excited and triumphant and SURPRISED!


  364.  #364Starla on February 15, 2013 at 1:58 pm

    lol we posted 359 and 360 at the same time 😀

  365.  #365Allison on February 15, 2013 at 1:59 pm

    …He is actually going to keep my daughter tonight for me…

  366.  #366Rori Raye on February 15, 2013 at 2:05 pm

    Allison, Welcome, and you don’t say how long you and this man have been together. If you’ve been reading here on the blog – you’ll know what I’m going to say: Stay AWAY from this man NOW!!!! If he calls you, use the Tools and Feeling Messages here to talk BRIEFLY, and then hang up to go do something or go to bed. Starting NOW – start Circular Dating EVERYWHERE!!! What needs to happen here is therapy – and you can do that by working out your intimacy issues with men everywhere. This man cannot have been a match for you. Get out there (with your daughter, too…) so a good match for you can find you. Love, Rori

  367.  #367Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:05 pm

    in my desire to feel understood, and if i ever feel misunderstood, i am often triggered.

  368.  #368Rori Raye on February 15, 2013 at 2:06 pm

    Allison – I just wrote a reply, and if you need him to babysit – can you think of him, and treat him as a friend? Warmly? And STILL Circular Date? Rori

  369.  #369Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:07 pm can call me judgmental all ya like, but yes, I do find it distasteful when I sit and eat my chicken wings having to look at some woman’s free p*ssy display (spreading legs whilst wearing too short a dress with no or little underwear)..or when I do see a 60 year old lady’d boobs popping out (by which I mean popping out fully). Yes, I do find it distasteful. And even more distateful when the men I am with practically have foam outside their mouths, and can’t look me in the eye because they are too busy checking out the P8rn star look alikes.
    Yes, it does piss me off.
    Yes, I find it inappropriate. Not in a strip bar, but in a ‘classy bar’, yes. It happens here all the time.
    This is how women here try to ‘catch husbands’, or a promotion or whatever. I have SEEN it.
    So fair play.
    Where I was born it mattered what you had in your head, not how muchy p*ssy you display on a Saturday night.
    I m not uptight, I have been told by Curly that I am the best woman he has ever had sex with, he said all the women with the ‘bling’ and the fakeness didn’t even like sex, were afraid of it and whatever – he has told me some interesting stories, that really made me wonder.
    How healthy really is it to parade oneself with no shame? I don’t know.
    I let my sexuality out behind closed doors, not next to other people’s dining tables. That is my preference, and call me judgmental, but I am truly appalled by some of the stuff I see here.
    Women demeaning themselves. And disguising it as sexual power. I dunno. They don’t look much happier than I am…not sure. Maybe they are?
    I just find it very very strange.

  370.  #370Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:11 pm

    it might be unhealthy for other women to show their bodies in a certain way, but is it also unhealthy to take notice and direct negative energy towards that?

    sounds like a lose-lose.

  371.  #371Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:12 pm

    And the thing that gets me most is that the men somehow expect you to do that down here…to wear clothes that rather than flatter, make you look like a whore. I never get that.
    And, other than MrP, they are not really interested in what you have done in your life or what you have to say. They are more interested in one’s arse.
    Honestly, I know I am having a fine rant here, but it is really extraordinary. Should I believe that someone, who is predominantly interested in my arse, would make a good husband?
    Of course it is nice if he is. But it’s also nice if he ‘gets’ me, much better even.
    I haven’t seen any man here really interested in what I have to say, except for MrP…and even he is running after the fake babes.
    I give up.

  372.  #372Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:12 pm

    370 Starla, maybe. I am just sick of being blindsided when the p*ssy show starts, I guess.

  373.  #373Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:14 pm

    The point is, people can do what they want to do.
    But then complain that men just want sex and are shallow, when you have it on show for them, well what do you expect.
    And being told you are a plain Jane because you cover your arse with the clothes you wear…that is just a reflection of what goes on here.
    I dunno.
    Kinda weird.
    Maybe I am just experiencing a culture shock..haha

  374.  #374Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:15 pm

    oops i got sent to moderation, but it’s just as well cuz it was full of typos! trying again.

    morality and decency is so relative. that’s how you get someone, who is perfectly comfortable with having loads of unmarried sex, telling other women theyre awful pot smoking baby killers in their most vulnerable moments. we find power in judgment and are rendered total hypocrites ultimately. i can always find some loophole in one’s morality. that’s because judgment is a fool’s mission.

    but it feels SO good to judge.

  375.  #375Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:15 pm

    tam, i think you should try denver. it’s too cold most months of the year to show it all off. 🙂

  376.  #376Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:15 pm

    Rant, rant, rant..sorry ladies. Phew, it is all coming out today. Hm.

  377.  #377Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:18 pm

    even in a cold climate, it’s relative. if i choose to wear a skin-tight sexy sweater dress over leggings and boots, that is going to stand out as a sexy (or even slutty) choice amongst a sea of women who are wearing frumpier versions of warm clothes.

  378.  #378Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:20 pm

    Starla..haha..good point. Nah, I love hanging out in bikinis myself, this is the paradox. I guess I just grew up differently.
    In my peer group it mainly mattered who you were not how you looked…so I guess I still have that in me. I would never mutilate my body just to look like what some people consider the ‘perfect figure’.
    Just because I celebrate all the differences…and I love my body. No it is not perfect, but what is all that crazy striving for perfectness???
    To look the youngest, the prettiest etc??
    It’s like a sickness because you can’t win, always chasing your tail.
    I don’t get it, frankly.
    And people look at me like I am a freak, because I am not loud, bossy, falling out of my dresses.
    Really? Am I a freak?? I don’t think so.
    I’ll keep my p*ssy to myself and a select few, thank you very much 🙂

  379.  #379Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:23 pm

    Well, I am not a frumpy dresser at all…in fact, when I go out in Germany, people say I am flamboyant, sexy, femininely dressed…here I am plain Jane. So so strange, no?I dunno. Hm.

  380.  #380Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:24 pm

    Starla, sexy sweater over leggins is not slutty, come down here and check out the booby/p*ssy show 🙂
    You will have a new definition of the word.
    I dare you 🙂

  381.  #381Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:26 pm

    Ok, I have ranted enough – I think lol
    don’t hold your breath ladies.

  382.  #382Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:27 pm

    but it’s all relative! skin tight with no actual skin showing can be considered slutty in a place where showing skin will probably not get you a husband, because it’s hard to be sexy with FROSTBITE. haha

  383.  #383Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:30 pm

    I think we are all judgmental anyway.
    I can’t help but be judgmental of the woman who put on a p*ssy show falling around in a dress that was really not covering her, drunk out of it, at a Xmas party I went to, on Xmas day – all of Xmas day. Knowing that she left her three kids home on Xmas day to go out and parade herself in order to try and find a rich guy (so she told me)…she was not poor, just ‘high maintenance’…
    I couldn’t help but think ‘poor kids’.
    It’s awful, and I felt compassion for her also, but you know, deep down I was appalled. And judgmental, yes. Very. I was thinking how awful life is going to be for those children with a mother like that.

  384.  #384Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:32 pm

    i wonder if we look to judge others because it is easier and less work than validating ourselves through positive, independent means.

  385.  #385Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:33 pm

    yes, it is all relative, true, though I still think some body parts would be considered as ‘rude’ on show, i e in a public place…like a restaurant. Just sayin’. I am not making this stuff up, I actually couldn’t help but stare myself when some woman spready her legs the other day and I saw her parts.
    It’s just a bit…ermmm…yuck…when I am digging into my happy hour meal 😉

  386.  #386Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:34 pm

    In all honesty and much to my own shame, I think I stared more than the men….because I was in disbelief lol…I had to do double takes 😉

  387.  #387Allison on February 15, 2013 at 2:36 pm


    Thank you! We’ve been together nearly 4 years and we were making all the plans to move in together. I had everything I wanted and then I put up a wall and sabotaged it.. Yes, I remember how to be a Siren and am going back to that. I can bring my daughter to him and then go on a date with another guy. And not contact him at all… But only contact him to keep her for me sometimes, because they are wonderful together and they miss each other. ? I can really use that kinda help and feel free, relaxed and secure when she’s with him. My daughter and I are working on our wish boards together now so I feel quiet inside, focused and optimistic.

  388.  #388Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:36 pm

    And then..don’t get me wrong, I love the US, but here comes the ‘double standards’….one woman on the ship I once worked on, freaked when they went to the island of St Maarten and saw naked people on a nude beach….she freaked. She wanted to speak to the Captain why the cruise went to an island where her children saw naked people on the beach….I was in disbelief.
    But, showing your p8ssy and nipples in a bar is ok.

  389.  #389Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:39 pm

    tam, that is our culture. my uncle lives in Holland and always notices when he visits the US. we feel ashamed of natural nudity and sexuality (nude beaches, breast feeding, a nipslip at the superbowl half time show on a post-menopausal janet jackson), but embrace the extreme with pornographicized (is that a word?) imagery, marketing, entertainment, and dress.

  390.  #390Tam on February 15, 2013 at 2:45 pm

    I guess Starla, hence Curly’s comment that the women with everything on show, in his experiences were prudes in the bedroom. I was quite shocked.
    Prude p*rnstars? lol

  391.  #391Starla on February 15, 2013 at 2:47 pm

    it’s as though we are more comfortable with sex and sexuality as a commodity instead of as the ultimate core of how natural life proliferates, that is to be celebrated and honored.

  392.  #392Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 2:52 pm

    Tam you “sound” like you inner witch wants to fly at some throats

  393.  #393Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:04 pm

    FW..haha..yes, my inner witch/biatch was having a judgment/ranting/crazy day today.
    I feel done. Finnnaaallllyyyyy.

  394.  #394Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:07 pm

    commodity..yes, Starla, that feels sad. And perhaps I made that experience with sex I had with American men too..only 3..but it was never a slow, sensual, celebrated experience…but more of a fast food sex thing. You know? Like a job had to be done.
    May have just been coincidence, but that was my experience so far. With the bf I had in Europe, the whole thing was more slow and less focused on just the act. Maybe it is coincidence.

  395.  #395Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:08 pm

    boyfriends in Europe being plural..

  396.  #396Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:10 pm

    “Like a job had to be done.”

    I treat sex like this. and my boyfriend rebels against it and tries to slow us down. arrrggghhh i hate that, but i know he’s right to do it. it’ sbetter for our relationship

  397.  #397Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:12 pm

    396, Starla that is interesting….

  398.  #398Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:15 pm

    it’s my own way of avoiding intimacy.

  399.  #399Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:16 pm

    398..Starla, I think that’s what it was with the guys also. I had that feeling at the time…very strange.

  400.  #400Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:17 pm

    I did manage to slow down Curly, and that is when he started to go crazy for me..and I believe that had something to do with intimacy, for sure.
    When a 61 year old guy said he never had that in his life, and I am inclined to believe him….that’s a little scary.

  401.  #401Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:20 pm

    that IS scary tam, haha. but lucky for him that he finally got the experience.

    i seem to be trying to slow qz down in the realm of emotional connection so that he isn’t just ‘trying to get the job done’ but actually connecting with me authentically, and he seems to be trying to slow me down in the sexual realm of intimacy.

    hmmm, that’s not bad at all. i feel like a team:). but not in that 50-50 ‘carry your weight’ sort of way.

  402.  #402Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:24 pm

    yep the connection..I do think for some men (and women) it’s not easy. For me it isn’t either..
    MrP was bad also, but even he started changing in the end. At first it was all about him, and then it started to be all about me and he would ask me questions as to what I would like etc. Sadly, at the time it freaked me out and I couldn’t really open up. But it was so nice to see that he cared – enough to make my pleasure a priority, because that was such a change. I honestly don’t think he ever did that befofre because he was so so new to this.

  403.  #403Rebecca on February 15, 2013 at 3:25 pm

    I get really angry that men are fed a completely fake degrading image of women. In England it is getting worse and worse. Sex is used to sell everything. Girls are getting sexualised younger and younger.

    The whole frickin society is hypocritical and nuts and it freaks me out. Everytime I pick up a paper I read the headline “child sex” or “peado”. We as women r just seen as puppets in this charade and it makes me sick.

    Aaarrrgggh it makes me so angry when I think about how sick and hypocritcal society is…

  404.  #404Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:25 pm

    I think both of the guys had enjoyed sex as a commodity, rather than an experience and an intimacy thing. It is very interesting.
    I just had an epiphany Starla 🙂 thank you!

  405.  #405Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:26 pm

    403 Rebecca, I wholeheartedly agree. It is nuts. And it is not going to make life any easier for young women.

  406.  #406Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:30 pm

    rebecca that shxt makes me furious too. it’s such a disconnect, like “um hellloooooo???????”

  407.  #407Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:34 pm

    I also think it is so hard for women now. We are supposed to be business ‘men’, sex goddesses, mothers, sports partners, and whatever else.
    Women never had it so good (everything is open to them) and never had it so bad (are now more stressed than any other generation before, since they started analysing this kinda thing).
    We are trying to do it all and almost expected to do it all, kids, careers, perfect figures, clothes, teeth, hair…domestic and sex goddesses – all that while men are still just men and expected to do what men do. Work and provide and swing a hoover once in a blue moon. Very generally speaking.
    But in many ways true, no?

  408.  #408Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:38 pm

    at the same time, we’ve encroached upon the male identity in many things in striving for equality. we’ve told little girls they can and should aspire for all the same things little boys might aspire for. but we ridicule men and little boys who aspire for traditionally “feminine” things. We see little girls in blue and in dirty overalls getting messy and acting like “boys” in parenting magazines, but they’ll never depict a boy doing anything even remotely feminine, unless it’s for a ‘novelty’ piece of the issue that cements that marginalization.

    we are all suffering, men and women.

  409.  #409Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:42 pm

    408 true Starla. Very true.
    But there is actually a study, and sadly I do not have the details, that has measured stress levels of men and women over the years from 50’s to now, and concluded that women’s stress rates have (I think) trebles, and men’s have remained THE SAME.
    exactly the same in the 50’s as right now.
    It could be that this is because their brains work differently. However, the study concluded that the reason was that the biggest stress women (generally) had in the 50’s was what to make for dinner….as they were predominantly housewives.
    How the world has changed.
    I am glad it has, but it has piled a lot more stuff on the plates of women, very generally speaking.
    But yes, it also rendered the traditional male role as the provider as somewhat redundant.
    Though interesting, men are not stressed about that 😉

  410.  #410Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:46 pm

    “that has measured stress levels of men and women over the years from 50′s to now, and concluded that women’s stress rates have”

    I want to see the study! any idea where i can find it? I immediately have a red flag go up that questions the methodology and the comparability of the record keeping back in the fifties. because the way psychology then treated female mental illness and stress was dismal, hush hush, shamed, and treated with questionable drugs and procedures. so perhaps the record keeping back then isn’t so reliable for modern comparison.

  411.  #411Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:48 pm

    in fact, many women who approached doctors for mental health help were turned away and told “oh silly woman, you have no stress, you’re just a housewife”

  412.  #412Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:51 pm

    I read it in a book not long ago..but the problem is that I read so much and just remember the useless stuff. I didn’t make it up though.
    Don’t you think it makes a lot of sense. I did, that’s why I remembered it. Though, we both no that statistics and studies like that are open to many manipulations…but this one stuck.
    I do know, however, that my grandmother, compared to me and my mother and many other females I observe, was faaaaaaaaar more content, at peace, and happy, and supported in a community of other females that didn’t work, more social, NEVER looked/appeared stressed … and just so much more happy with the little things in life, non materialistic etc.
    It leads me to suggest that she wasn’t an exception to the rule?

  413.  #413Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:53 pm

    i also read that women risked being institutionalized by their husbands or male doctors if they rejected their expected “role” as housewife, which could greatly discourage women from reporting their stress levels, thus affecting the data for fair empirical comparison.

    i’m a nerd.

    ((((((((((((((men and women))))))))))))

  414.  #414Starla on February 15, 2013 at 3:57 pm

    412 tam that’s understandable. there are other factors, too. like she wasn’t constantly exposed to television, radio, magazine, and now internet
    marketing that are all fear-based. she lived in an economy that didn’t require financing your whole life into debt for the most part. mass gun violence and suicide bombers weren’t in the news every day, etc.

  415.  #415Daria on February 15, 2013 at 3:57 pm

    whoa i feel really uncomfortable reading some assertions

    i feel stunned

    i feel judgemental

    i feel confused

    i feel pouty

    i feel sad

  416.  #416Tam on February 15, 2013 at 3:57 pm

    yes Starla, I agree, but I was talking about the masses not the ‘odd ones out’. There are always odd ones out. Honestly, it would have been a blessing had my mother been institutionalised before she started ruining the whole family, sued her work colleagues for stuff that grew in her imagination and so on…just sayin

  417.  #417Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    414 Starla, absolutely. her biggest stress was pickling veggies for the winter, or when a pest ate her lettuces….or when my grandad forgot something from the grocery store.
    She had virtually no money, but she was so happy and loving and we used to walk through the fields picking flowers..such a cliche..but it was so much fun.
    And she liked a tipple now and then – and when she was younger she smoked – once in a blue moon..hehe. And she loved American Soldiers after the war..and was fighting with the other girls to wash their clothes for chocolate and cigarettes.
    She saw most of her male schoolmates die.
    She did not have a charmed life.
    A hard life.
    But she was always joyful and GRATEFUL of what little she had, and I dare say the 50’s generation, I mean adults in the 50’s – in my hometown, were mostly the same. They had seen such bad times, they were so happy with what they had.

  418.  #418Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:02 pm

    416 tam i’m not sure i follow. the factors i’m mentioning are factors that reach every person, essentially unilaterally, across a culture.

    however, it is interesting that men were said to have shown no increase or decrease in reported stress levels, so that does give us a benchmark…

    i feel so curious!

  419.  #419Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:04 pm

    Frankly, I don’t know of any women that were institutionalized for rejecting the role of housewife. Sorry, never heard of that.

  420.  #420Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:06 pm

    it would feel good to look at the state of women today not as victims in comparison to their simpler past generations, but with a sense of opportunity and gratitude. maybe WE can change it. in 50 more years they’ll say “women of the earliest part of the 21st century were 3x as stressed as women of the mid 20th century, likely due to increased duties and pressures in an “equal to men” paradigm, compounded by the ongoing sexism they nonetheless faced. Within 2 decades, however, stress levels had dropped to near zero, as women adapted and learned to harness their relatively new-found freedom to achieve mastery over their lives.

    and there was peace on earth”

    lol. i’m serious, though.

  421.  #421Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:07 pm

    I really believe the stress level thing for men, mainly because they are so skilled at zoning out.
    Women have everything on their mind the whole time, i e how is Johnny doing at school, what shall we have for dinner, did I take the dog out in the morning.
    Man: sits on the train playing tetris totally zoned out.


  422.  #422Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    419 tam, that doesn’t mean it’s untrue. but this is a blog for exploration, not the enforcement of logical fallacies.

    i have to leave very soon but i just wanted to say that this discussion has made me feel very inspired to explore dropping all ‘victim’ talk around being a woman. it never actually makes me feel any better. i grew up very poor and often felt victimized by the system and unable to get ahead, but it wasn’t until i stopped that mentality that i started to get ahead.

    scarcity and fear and righteous indignation and victimhood are making my chest feel tight. making me feel imprisoned. i want to feel free.

  423.  #423Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    not sure I see ‘having to fill multiple roles’ as an opportunity/ challenge.
    Why do so many women now remain childless?
    Because they have to compromise their career or aspirations or whatever..there is always a trade off of something. I really do believe women do bear the burden of their sex/hormone thing.
    My cousin is working full time with a little baby…she would rather be at home but she is the major breadwinner. Her heart bleeds, I can tell.
    Women never had to make these decisions for thousands of years.

  424.  #424Vi on February 15, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    In my case feeling anger towards others judgments is a very good sign, meaning I am on the final stage of releasing the same beliefs of my own. During this phase I tend to be judgmental of myself and beat myself up for those ‘past mistakes’, hence feeling angry. Once I feel through the anger, it feels easier to appreciate the choice of other people, even if it does not work for me anymore.

  425.  #425Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    421 tam
    totally agree!

  426.  #426Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:12 pm

    my grandmother was far from a victim also, she ran the household, my grandad just fitted in lol, he brought home the dough. 😉

  427.  #427Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:13 pm

    reality is ours to paint.

    if you can just BELIEVE that.

    otherwise, you’re at the mercy of whatever makes you feel like you’re at the mercy of it.

  428.  #428Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:19 pm

    427 true Starla. Sometimes too much freedom can be a curse too, you know? Too many decisions to make..and will we regret them? Who knows. You are still young enough..for me, I am close to 40, the children question does crop up. We will talk about this again when you are at the age when perhaps you run out of some options without knowing whether you made the right decisions, you know?

  429.  #429Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:21 pm

    i feel excited about tonight… i feel relived about the kind of plans i have with qz — he’s gonna come over and hang out and cook dinner and just chill, and i’m gonna be cleaning and doing relaxing things like drawing in my sketch book, organizing my files, etc.

    it would feel really good to share some “normal” time together. i keep fantasizing about him living 5 minutes away so we can have normal, integrated lives. instead, every meeting or conversation we have is so “high stakes” because he lives far away, and if something doesn’t go romantically perfect, it just hangs like that until our next encounter.

    i’m not sure if that makes sense to another person, but it’s been plaguing me. i have been feeling so much pressure to be perfect.

    like i feel obligated ot be cuddly and sappy and sweet, because we haven’t seen each other for a week and we won’t see each other for another week. to “make it count.” i feel like i’m not allowed to just ‘be’ sometimes. like i’ve showed up for a shift at work, except i’m showing up for a shift at my relationship, lol.

    it’s creating a bit of an unsustainable mask on our relationship. he will move closer one day, and i feel so much anxiety that things will look BROKEN to us when it all normalizes and becomes a daily thing to see each other and talk to each other.

    my anxiety is admittedly a bit extreme, and i’m sure there are many women who just daydream all the time about being in a relationship that’s nothing but intense episodes of 2-way physical and emotional adoration, but i feel very happy that he’s honoring it. and i’m sure he’ll appreciate letting all the pressure go for a night to be extra entertaining, pleasing, etc. to me.

  430.  #430Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    ok tam, it’s a date. see ya in 10 years, hehe. lunch is on me.

  431.  #431Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:28 pm

    also, the more i talk about it with him, the more i see that he is really going to be okay and we’re going to be okay if i’m not all sappy lovey dovey and 100% focused on that. but i still do have major anxiety, because in the past, that is what happened with him… as soon as i wasn’t being all focused on our romance and being all gushy lovey dovey, he withdrew and freaked, thinking something was terribly wrong.

    he and i are both deliberately working so hard on forming healthier patterns for ourselves. it’s so awkward and clumsy right now. haha. love to us. we are really brave.

  432.  #432Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:31 pm

    it was about 9 months in and literally the first time i didn’t respond warmly to his touches and kisses, and it was the last time i saw him.

    it would feel so good to stop letting past traumas inform my present. i find that happening constantly. although, i might just be extraordinarily self-aware, and ultimately doing what most people do without ever realizing it.

  433.  #433Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:33 pm

    but first i am going to hit the gym and take care of me. and he’s very supportive and it’s all good.

    goodnight ladies!!

  434.  #434Starla on February 15, 2013 at 4:34 pm

    tam it felt so fun and engaging talking with you today. thanks for the fun time! made my day fly by. love to you!

  435.  #435Tam on February 15, 2013 at 4:46 pm

    Aw, so nice. Thanks Starla, love to you too 🙂

  436.  #436Senior Lady Vibe on February 15, 2013 at 4:58 pm

    @56: Mercedes says:
    “I believe being who we want to be and being okay is better achieved by doing the work on ourselves and practicing what we learn than by asking (or waiting for or expecting) someone else (a man) to care for that for us.
    I’m not saying that is a belief anyone else has or needs, just me personally…”

    Yes. Me, too.


  437.  #437Memulo on February 15, 2013 at 5:18 pm

    I have a date in a fee mins and I feel nervous.. Don’t know why. Should stop already!

  438.  #438Senior Lady Vibe on February 15, 2013 at 5:18 pm

    @1: Orna Walters says:
    “Heart Rules: In choosing love every day, every day is a celebration of love! Love is not something that happens to you, it is a choice. “

    Wise words.


  439.  #439Femininewoman on February 15, 2013 at 5:27 pm

    Tam there is a Art of Lover online series going on now. Today I heard John Gray talk about different kinds of sex. He says sometimes it is better to have a quickie until you can schedule a full course meal so the man doesn’t feel rejected when you are not in the mood

  440.  #440Tam on February 15, 2013 at 5:38 pm

    Fw, yep. I think even I feel like that sometimes 🙂

  441.  #441MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 6:50 pm

    I feel like the more focused I am on my life & passions, the less room I have in my life for judging other people. I can’t seem to wrap my brain around assumptions, & gossip. Instead I choose love & understanding.

  442.  #442MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 6:51 pm

    *I choose* …yes, it’s a choice.

  443.  #443Vi on February 15, 2013 at 7:44 pm

    “If you’ve ever seen artists working on a portrait, you will notice that they often squint. Squinting helps them focus on the essence of their subject without getting distracted by its harsh outlines. We need to do the same in our dating life. It’s so easy to get lost in the hard assessment of people’s imperfections, but it serves us better to simply sense their spirit. That is what makes attractions grow.”

  444.  #444Memulo on February 15, 2013 at 8:46 pm

    Just came back from my date. There wasn’t an immediate chemistry, but the guy is well educated, interesting, pleasant and sounded that he really liked me. There was so much to talk about. With my cd unfortunately it is usually not the case

  445.  #445Memulo on February 15, 2013 at 8:48 pm

    I feel guilty for CDing…

  446.  #446MovingMagic on February 15, 2013 at 9:35 pm

    I’ve had moments of missing my ex over the last few days. Maybe it’s partially due to yesterday being Valentines, & that the restaurant where my date & I met reminded me of him. I noticed the feelings coming up last night, acknowledged them & let them go. I chose to stay present & engaged with my date & had a lovely time. Needless to say the feelings still,arose, & lingered a bit throughout today. Something’s surfacing that needs to be released. ((self))

  447.  #447k2012 on February 15, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    A longtime ex boyfriend called me today. I saw him calling but didn’t answer. He left a voicemail message wishing me Happy Valentine’s Day. Didn’t know he would remember me. I am here in bed and I am thinking which places I can go by myself in order to get myself out there. A place came to mind. I wonder what the traffic is like at that place on a Saturday afternoon. I will have to find out. Can u girls tell me what is the time in Los Angeles now? I need to buiy something before midnight their time?

  448.  #448Emerson on February 15, 2013 at 11:21 pm

    Memulo that’s great about your date!

    I went on a date too 🙂
    It went reallly well… Unexpected as I had no expectations!
    Sweet guy and I feel a lil bit attracted 🙂
    Met online
    More to come…

  449.  #449Smile on February 16, 2013 at 2:06 am

    I’ve just realised why I don’t want to get married… I have a hate of function rooms! I know there are other places to hold a celebration and there are some beautiful ones but I think it’s just the idea of a big room with lots of people in it.

  450.  #450Kellie on February 16, 2013 at 6:03 am


    I’ve been in a relationship for about 8 months with someone who has chased after me for 2 and a half years. Things were going really well and we were really close until as of late. He’s up and down and saying he’s unsure of continuing the relationship. He’s got a daughter that’s 10 who recently said she thinks I am demanding and bossy. I’ve never told her what to do or anything. I have always done everything for her. He’s been seperated from his wife for about 4-5 years without a divorce. He still talks to her sometimes as if they are still in a relationship. She’s very manipulative and I think she’s turned her daughter on me. I don’t believe she would tell anyone that I’m bossy or demanding because I don’t think that’s something she would say. Now I am not even sure what to think or where to turn with this relationship. I ask if we are done and if its goodbye and I get “I don’t know” What do I do?

  451.  #451Annie on February 16, 2013 at 6:55 am

    “On all accounts and purposes, when you are having sex with someone that puts you in some kind of relationship to the person, right?”

    Either a casual one where you are having casual sex in an uncommitted relationship.
    An affair.
    A one night stand.
    A professional service.
    Or en exclusive one where you are his girlfriend/live in lover for now and has no need to marry you as he already has you without full commitment.
    Or in a fully committed marriage.

    He still may not treat you how you want even if he commits and marries you though, so it feels best to me to CD and choose very wisely to get the best most compatible man for me, who knows how to treat a real woman and who wants to and is able to meet my needs and up for a fully a life long healthy loving supportive committed relationship.

    I feel pleased I do not live in Florida.
    Even without the plastic surgery I would be able to give the fakies a run for their money. Fake boobs lips bums noses etc.
    However I do not want a man who focuses on surface level outer appearances. Yuck, like cattle meat market. I am not a piece of meat or cattle.
    Yes I want to look and feel my best. Am so not interested in competing with the botox and surgery junkies though.
    Or any woman in general.
    Ant man who wants a another woman and is chasing after, trying to emotionally or physically connect with have an affair get in the pants of another woman is not the best man or any man I want or am interested in.
    If that is what they want and are interested in not a lot I am able to do about it.
    I would be sending them on their way. Actually giving them a big push away from me as I would feel totally repelled and would not want them anywhere near me.
    I want a man with more depth of character and spirit than that.

  452.  #452Annie on February 16, 2013 at 7:01 am

    It’s not you as such Tam. Hugs.
    It’s the society we have all played a part in creating.

    We cannot control what others do, want or how they behave. Buying int the surgery addiction/Botox etc.
    Or If a man chooses to want and chase that superficial stuff.
    We can only control what we do and choose not to be part of it and a man who wants the same.
    And move away from where and who we do not want to be around.

    So my question would be.
    As Rori says.
    Why are you there?

  453.  #453Annie on February 16, 2013 at 7:02 am

    haha re Hairdresser T shirt.
    Yes mine would love it too.

  454.  #454k2012 on February 16, 2013 at 7:35 am

    Hairdresser discussion from yesterday. Haha. Anyway guys a new thread started last night.

  455.  #455Mercedes on February 16, 2013 at 9:02 am

    SLV: I was so happy to see your comment come through last night!! I love it when you post!! 🙂 Just had to come online quick to say Hi!!

    Much Love,

  456.  #456Rori Raye on February 16, 2013 at 2:24 pm

    Kellie – You say you’ve “done everything for her…” This tells me you’re overfunctioning and need to step back. A teenage girl will think of a woman who is overyly concerned and doting as “bossy.” Just be a “friend…”!!!! You can DO this!!! If he isn’t right, he isn’t right – but please at least get my ebook and start working with the tools before you give up. Love, Rori

  457.  #457Kellie on February 17, 2013 at 5:21 am

    Well I think I made the biggest mistake and I am or have already lost him. I went to his parents and I cried on their shoulders because they always said to come to them if I needed anything at all. Now he wants to return my things and pick up his key. I don’t know what to say to him when he arrives. I would like to know things but am so hurt. I don’t have anyone to lean on and his family was so accepting of me. I think I’ve lost him. Any advice?

  458.  #458Allison on February 17, 2013 at 10:35 am

    I really enjoyed reading my favorite astrologer’s blog about the new paradigm of partnership. It so resonates with what I want.

    a new paradigm of partnership

    there is a new paradigm of partnership that is being birthed right now and there are many who are being called to step up and midwife it by bringing it into their conscious experience and living it by example. these are the way showers for others who feel called down the road to do this inner and outer Union work. and it truly is work- of the Soul/Spirit variety. for those who have been conditioned to believe that relationship is based on security, ownership and fusion- this kind of relationship will necessarily shatter the foundations upon which they have built much of their understanding of love and partnership.

    yet there are many who have been feeling the pull to explore this, to understand this, and to experience this. this comes from an inner yearning and resonance that there is something else that is True that has not yet been fully embodied (or at least not by many). this intuition is coming from a deep place that is sacred- and for those who are ready to honor it, the call has been put forth.

    what is this new paradigm of partnership? well it is based on two old paradigms, but it is the fusion of the conscious aspects of both, while bringing light to the unconscious aspects of both as well. the first paradigm is an ancient one- that of partnership as a means of security, solidity, and unwavering commitment. the conscious aspect of this paradigm is the desire to think of another in equal measure to the degree that one thinks of his or herself. the institution of marriage in western society (and actually eastern as well when you think of arranged marriages) is based on this premise. you take two people’s resources/energy/lives and you join them. two become one and the individuals then operate as an entity. this is a lesson in Unity and Union. there is a need to think about more then yourself. this type of partnership challenges those of us who are very self-focused and individuated to think of the Other. this kind of partnership in it’s highest expression involves service to another as well as service to the third entity that is created when two join to become one.

    unfortunately the shadow side of this kind of relationship paradigm is massively rampant. many people get married and then sign away their individual lives. either that or they think that is what they are supposed to do and then get resentful along the way after they have done so. the shadow of this kind of partnership leads to codependency, possessiveness, power/control dynamics, and imbalanced partnership equations in which one person plays the savior/teacher/parent/provider and the other plays the victim/student/child/beneficiary. this does not have to play out in stereotypical ways of the man or masculine partner being the former and the woman or feminine partner playing the latter. it can be interchanged, but it is role-oriented. it is based on the notion that we each have roles to play in our relationships and that those roles are static. you are the breadwinner and i am the housekeeper/child-raiser. you are the active/dynamic one in the partnership and i am the passive/receptive one. this is based on yin and yang- where you are that which i am not, and you live for me that which i have yet to integrate or make conscious in my own lived experience. this is wonderful in one sense as it is the beginning of integration- being attracted to our opposite. but if we stop there and just stay in our prescribed roles we will get stuck. and stasis is the precursor to infection and eventually death- both scientifically (in the body for example) but also spiritually, emotionally, psychologically and relationally. when we are focused on security and stability we will violently react against change and even growth- as growth needs movement and change in order to unfold. so this paradigm of partnership that has been established for eons has at its core a Truth but is obscured by much and twisted in a way that is unhealthy and unsupportive of real Love.

    the other paradigm of partnership which has been in large part a reactionary stance to the one mentioned above is based on freedom, independence, and individuality. think back to the 60’s and 70’s and the Love revolution that ensued. make love, not war. free love! love everyone! we are all one- the one i love is everywhere. this is the kind of Love rumi harkens to in his poems. in it’s core is the essence of Divine Love. the kind of Love that knows no boundaries and sees the Divine in everyone and everything. this Love is beautiful, open and free. it is the kind of Love that helps us dissolve attachments that are based on fears, wounding and a belief in lack. the first paradigm of partnership is all about attachment and ownership (in its most unhealthy expression). this second paradigm of partnership is the opposite. the highest expression of this Love gives us the ability to see the other as Other and to allow them their experience. we don’t want to control the other or dominate the other, we want the best for the other. we love them unconditionally from a place of Soul/Spirit, not from a place of lack or need.

    of course this type of partnership also has a massive shadow. many people who gravitate towards this kind of connecting are actually coming from a very wounded place where commitment, stability and security scare them. for those of us who are afraid of form and prefer formlessness, this kind of partnership allows us to *think* we are engaging in evolved relationship- allowing others to be free (which is a covert means to ensure our own freedom)- but we are actually acting from a place of fear and pain. for some of us it seems better/safer to never get too deep into connection because that is where the vulnerability is, and that will bring up our own shadow. it is better to be light and free- connect with everyone, feel the Love! or alternatively, avoid relationship completely and just be solo, independent and self-possessed. either way the point is to never connect too deeply- to never get ‘attached’. attachment for people who are into this kind of partnership is a scary thing and so a judgment has been built around it- a belief that attachment is lower vibration/unevolved/unhealthy, or that relationship takes away their independence. this paradigm of partnership is very self-focused and at its worst it is incredibly selfish. it is about my needs, my desires- and my lack of interest in making space for another in my life. it is a covert way of escaping shadow work as well. it is in deep connection that the worst of us comes up and out, but also the best! ‘love brings up everything unlike itself.’ for those who are afraid of what they might see within- escaping connection and the attachment that comes with it is a means to keep the dragons at bay. a lot of people will even go so far as to sabotage connections so that they never get to a place where they can get deeper. it’s interesting what the human psyche will do when confronted with the ability to transform!

    of course attachment to an extreme is unhealthy! but so is non-attachment. as long as we are in the body we have an earthly existence. let’s not try to become pure and angelic before our time. we will go back to that realm one day. for now we are in the body and we have desires, passions, needs and wants. these things are not things to eschew, they are things to consciously embrace and work with. the point is not to obliterate them. the point is to move beyond judgement of them. we contain both the sacred and the profane within us. finding the sacred that lies concealed in the profane and the profane that lies concealed in the sacred is what embracing our light and shadow is all about. ‘both light and shadow are the dance of love’ says rumi. to negate one or the other is to clip one of the wings of the bird off, and with only one wing the bird cannot fly.

    so there you have the two old paradigms of partnership. and what is the the third? well the third takes both kinds of relationship and marries them to each other. this new paradigm of partnership asks that we take the courageous leap of commitment and service to the sacred Other, while also embracing independence, individuality and freedom in our connection. this is not about ownership but it is also not about formlessness. it is a creative kind of love that is in constant movement, constant flow. it is free in the sense that constraints are not put on it, but it is contained in the sense that there is commitment by both parties to do the sacred dance of Love in both the light and the dark aspects. this kind of partnership requires radical honestly, radical integrity, and radical respect of the Other. this kind of partnership is organic, it has no guarantees, and it requires risk. it is much like jumping into an abyss. you have no idea what you are getting yourself into, but you just know in your heart of hearts that there is something in that abyss for you. this kind of partnership doesn’t live in form and it doesn’t live in formlessness. it lives in liminal space- that in-between place between fusion and separateness, between self and other. ultimately what this kind of partnership does is confront you with yourself. it provides a container in which all your stuff gets brought up and set on the table and you have to just sit with it. you can’t grab at it (form) and you can’t run from it (formless). you have to look at it, assess it, become conscious of it, work with it. whatever comes up for you is your work. and moving beyond attachment AND non-attachment to a place of being able to just be with it is the goal.

    this kind of partnership is so rare that i am considering it to be a new paradigm that is coming into existence. yes there are those who are living it, but they are few and far between. and even they may often find that society’s lack of understanding of this kind of partnership creates insufficient support for them as they do their deep work with each other, so often the best of these kinds of Unions can fall apart due to an absence of understanding in the collective. yet there are some who are doing this work and are shining examples of an organic, fluid partnership that embraces both form and formlessness, light and shadow, interdependence and independence. and there are those being called to pave the path of this new paradigm of partnership today. these are the way showers. and they show the way by making their way through the experience themselves. this is hard work, but it is also deeply fulfilling.

    so where are you in this conversation? do you see yourself in either of the old paradigms? do you feel yourself called to embrace the third? i know many people who are going through separations right now. long-standing Unions are splitting up, oftentimes because those very partnerships were based on one of the two old paradigms and the stasis in the connection had gotten to a point where change and revitalization was no longer an option. if this has been the case with you do not judge yourself. every connection has its purpose, it has its beauty and its gifts. we have many soul connections throughout our lives that help move us forward on our path. each connection is profound and sacred. but not every connection is meant to last as long as we’d like it to. many people hold onto things that have passed their expiration date- and that is when toxicity sets in. that can take it down an even more destructive path, as both parties create even more karma to work through. but if that is your path- that is your path. no doubt you will learn something from it 😉 but when you hold onto the past you are blocking your future. perhaps the connection you are being asked to release is the very thing that will open you up to the next soul connection on your journey?

    there are also couples who are in the breakdown stage but the point of no return has not yet been passed. those couples, if it is in their highest good, can do the deep work asked of them and go through the alchemical fire of transformation- but it will require a radical restructuring of the partnership to date, that’s for sure! sometimes it is in the best interest of an individual to allow something to die so something new can be reborn, other times it is in the best interests of an individual to resuscitate an ailing connection that still has a little life left in it. what is the magic rule for knowing which is which? i don’t have the answer. but your heart certainly does! so listen to it 😉 i would advise to not rely on logic either. logic is great when it is used to support the heart’s wisdom, but when it is steering the ship it tends to run it aground. the logical mind sees transformation as akin to death and so it will convince you to do that which is safe. this is important when it comes to making decisions that are truly life and death, but when it comes to symbolic death, at times it is in your best interest to choose to die. the heart will know if that is the case.

    on my facebook profile today i posted a note about the triangular theory of love. this theory, based on psychologist robert sternberg’s research, is that love has three components: intimacy, passion and commitment. he says that different combinations of these three result in different kinds of love. intimacy and commitment equals compassionate love (akin to the first paradigm of partnership), while intimacy and passion equals passionate love (akin to the second paradigm of partnership). to me commitment with passion and no intimacy seems more like ludos- game playing love. this is likely the kind of love the celebrities who run to the altar engage in (aka ‘hollywood relationships’). but without intimacy it doesn’t last. sternberg says that relationships built on two or more elements are more enduring than those based on only one. but he says that there is a love that includes all three- intimacy, passion and commitment- and that is consummate love. he says that this is the strongest and most enduring kind of love, but it is also the most rare. the new paradigm of partnership i described above is all about consummate love. it may be rare, but it doesn’t have to be that way. a new paradigm of partnership is being born and the call has been put forth! are you ready?

    a clue to start you on your journey: it all starts within.

    ~divine harmony

    for part two of this conversation click here:

  459.  #459LobbyStar on February 17, 2013 at 1:36 pm

    Well, hi everybody! So nice to see so many of you again! I just wanted to stop by, because I haven’t had time to be here much.

    I decided last month to stop dating for awhile and just focus on me, but then I met PT… and he has blown me away! He is so receptive to the FMs and he actually WANTS to know EVERYTHING that’s in my head and heart! I have to admit that it has freaked me out so much at times that I have shut down. But you know what, he totally calls me on it, and I open up again. It is amazing.

    That said, my energy has changed so much since meeting him, that four other guys have come out of the woodwork, and are now asking for dates. And PT is open to me CDing! He said it bothers him, but he knows it is what’s right for me, for us, at this point. Sirens, I am astonished here!

    The one issue I seem to be having is when I meet a guy, I let him lead the conversation by asking questions about me, but I rarely ask him about himself, which makes him think I am self-centered and not interested in him. Then I feel bad, because I’m not like that, and I’ve caused him to feel less than. So that’s something I need to work on.

    Anyway, I’m going to try to come back here more often to see y’all!

  460.  #460Zainab on February 18, 2013 at 11:30 am

    Very interesting post. Looking good, giving the ex space for him to miss you will really make him value your importance.

  461.  #461Ernest Dempsey on February 20, 2013 at 4:55 am

    Rori is exactly right about this. Also, I would add that you need to make sure you aren’t glamorizing the relationship. What I mean is, sometimes when we lose someone, the immediate effect is that we focus on the brilliant aspects of the relationship. We only look at the good things and forget the things that made us unhappy or as you put it the things that caused us to push them away. Rori’s thought about circular dating are a good idea. This will give you an objective view of the situation so you can take a good, honest look at it and make good decisions.
    Here’s another thing, if the guy misses you, he’ll come back. If he doesn’t miss you, do you really want to invest your emotions into that?
    Just a guy’s perspective. Good luck. 🙂

  462.  #462Kellie on February 20, 2013 at 7:02 am

    I bought the book have the relationship you want. OMG I can’t believe that almost everything you say not to do I’ve been doing. Then I wonder what went wrong. I’ve been the overbearing person I seem to want to know everything and want the control. Instead of using the feminine energy I’ve been radiating the masculine energy. I have got to change the way I am. I do believe it was me who pushed this last guy away. We haven’t talked since Friday and the last text message was Monday. Not sure if or when we will talk. So I don’t know if he will see any changes in me or not. I realized now that if I had only taken the chance to buy this book sooner I may have saved myself a lot of hurt and a relationship.

  463.  #463ronda on February 20, 2013 at 7:14 am

    rori ,gm i woke up this morning saying i need to talk to rori , im 42 my huband is 42 will b 43 in a couple of weeks i meet this man and this man was incarated for 7 years for stupid stuff having a gun in texas shooting at someone trying to take his car and dwi issues ,im just being honest something about me i love to tell the truth, well i was the 1st lady he had been with when he had got out of the prison system and everything was great untill he was drinking one day and i seen his behavior i didnt like that was in 2009 well he had got much better he could go with out drinking and off and on i would get tried of his behavior and we would break up off and on well in 2012 he moved to arizonia started working and he decided he missed me and i missed him to and he asked me to marry him he had all ways said he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me so we got married march of 2012 rori since then we have separated 3 times because i would get so tried of his ways which i think he would show signs of paranoid schizophrenia well the person i am i would try to be very patient with him that is problably why we were able to stay together this long well i dont thing he thinks he has a problem and so this was the problem i would go to work 8 to 9 hrs and he sit at home and watch movies do some house work at times some times had dinner ready at home because he would get disabilty and so he was trying to find a job he had his welding degrees well i was for sure the over doer but i come from a mom that was a minister so i felt i was sticking by my husband and doing what was rigth in gods eyes i must say at times this man had a heart of gold but i was the real provider the house we live in is paid for so is my car so i felt as though he felt he did not have to do any thing because everything was paid for he woulk say all you have is 2 bill electric and gas well we where growing apart his mom are someone else was allways in his ear and so now we are broke up and make possiable be going through a divorce he had to much time on his hands and i found out he was talking on the phone to another lady well when i confronted him he said that was a friend and he could have friends i put him rigth out the house because i was very upset and hurt im the one working daily paying bills and when he gets his money he would in the beginning pay things but he would buy stupid stuff than to be serious about bills i got so so so tired i felt he was using me god had bless me with the paid for house and car and he felt as thougth he needed to do nothing to much idle time cause him to be able to meet friends talk to other ladies i am so hurt because i do love him and i wanted to honor god , i would yell at him at times we would fuss daily but he was not doing his part as a husband but he would try to control me my every move i think he may possilblly be with someone else because i ask him about couseling he said no counseling well i said so you want the divorce then and he said yes he would sign i feel real bad because even thought i was do right in gods eyes it still ended up this way our vows where for richer r poorer and i was standing by his side untill he get a job . i know that conselling is needed to cont. the marriarge and both putting god 1st but i cant force any thing on him its been 5 days since we split up .of course he blame everything on me saying i had anger issues i was getting the husbandly support of course i would b upset . so rori what do i do im loss im trying to live as a christian im a good person friend and family love me so much they fight over spending time with me im truly a people person i could be a counselor to many and do but im allways so stuck on my own problems friends and family say im such a sweetheart i have friends of all ages and races please please please Rori what do i do ive cried i listen to my gospel music and pray all the time . which of ur books to you recommend me to read im had to supend my cc due to a company kept going in my acct. auto deducting but will do so on friday . may god continue to bless you and family Rori Raye .

  464.  #464wandering on February 20, 2013 at 10:40 am

    Hello everyone,
    This is my first time posting on here…I have read the blog quite a few times. I am divorced for 3 years and have been dating a man that was divorced in August for the last 3 months. When we are together, things are wonderful. We spend one day a week together and he calls and texts me everyday…I rarely initiate contact. He owns his own business and works ALOT! He also has his 2 children most of the time. He does get one weekend day off and that is when we see each other. We have not gone a weekend since we started dating in November without spending at least a few hours together depending on his time constraints because he is very active with his girls and they play sports. I love that about him…he is an awesome dad!

    So here is my dilemma, he truly cares for mem when I voice my feelings and needs, he apologized for making me feel unwanted and has stepped up saying and doing things to make me feel less anxious about things. We are exclusive sexually and he says he is not looking for anyone else…he just doesn’t have the time to let anyone else in his life. But I can see he still visits the dating site we met on…but so do I, but I have put my profile on hold on this site because he told me he isn’t looking for anyone else either. He has not introduced me to anyone in his life and has told me he will not be ready to introduce me to his children any time soon. When summer rolls around it will make things difficult for us to see each other if I can not see him with his girls. He has only been divorced 6 months right now and his girls are not teenagers yet. So sometimes I feel more like the other woman instead of someone he is starting a meaningful relationship with. He did meet my 2 best friends when we all went out for my birthday, but that has been it for interaction. I understand he needs time to heal…I so love being with him and he responds when I voice my needs and concerns.

    Am I wasting my time? I do flirt with other men and circular date, I tried actually dating one other man during this time and it just felt wrong. I care for him deeply, but i don’t know if he could ever let himself fall in love with me. I want to be in love!

    Thanks for any comments!

  465.  #465Allison on February 20, 2013 at 11:22 am

    Hello Rori and everyone,

    My ex and I were together over 3 years, very much in love and making happy plans to move in together. Then I let my fear do the sabotaging, he broke up with me and said he’s never been in love with me and will probably move out of the country without me. I have not been in contact with him since Sunday when he kept my daughter for me. When I saw him he was very sweet to me, doing and asking questions about what’s happening in my life, thanking me for letting him keep her and saying he wants to have her anytime. But I have totally decided to disappear from his life since then because I feel too deeply and it feels restrictive to be around him. I miss him and our love dearly.

    Anyway, since then I have been flirting with many men including his ex best friend, who I know has always been interested in me. My ex always told me to watch out for him, so the second I let him know our relationship is no more, of course he asked me out. Is it ok if I date that close within the circle? I mean, will this help or hinder my ex wanting me back? I am totally embracing being single. I have 2 other hot dates lined up too (one is tonight). I am a flirt and I don’t have a shortage of men around, but I have been very curious about the ex friend too. What do you think?

  466.  #466Allison on February 20, 2013 at 11:23 am

    Oh, and we have only been broken up for a little over 2 weeks. I feel like I have come a long way since then!

  467.  #467Rori Raye on February 20, 2013 at 1:20 pm

    wandering – here’s my question: Why in the world does it feel “wrong” to you to date other men when your man has been VERY clear about where he’s at in terms of long-term commitment – AND – while it’s still so early? How ab out you split the difference and go to classes, parties, out with friends (including men friends), meetup hikes and bowling nites….so that you’re ALMOST “dating” other men. Three months is WAY too early for him to declare you his “girlfriend” – and he seems o be doing nothing of the sort. Your biggest clue here as to what to do is your own feelings of restlessness and “wanting more…” A few hours a week is NOT a relationship – and as long as he’s on the dating site, I don’t understand why you’ve taken your profile offline. Love, Rori

  468.  #468wandering on February 20, 2013 at 2:35 pm

    I think it felt wrong because of the man not just because I have feelings for the man I am with… I have been spending the night at his housetomorrow for the last month but only 1 day a week… and I do have another dating site that I am on anyways… but have had almost no luck. I will try the almost dating thing because that sounds like fun… I do go out with my friends when he is not around. I know I’m at a different place than he is emotionally… everytime I pulled back he always seems to respond… which makes me wanna stay… even though I know I should probably go.

    Thanks for your time

  469.  #469April on February 24, 2013 at 11:13 am

    Don’t know what to do. He pursued me now has backed off, did tell me he wasn’t looking for a relationship. So I had the conversation of wanting to keep the exclusive sexual relationship but would be dating as I was looking for a relationship. He seemed fine with this. He still seems standoffish. Do I sit back and wait for him to initiate the sex? What are the rules around this?

  470.  #470Rori Raye on February 25, 2013 at 10:00 am

    April – you’re doing great – and it all depends on what you want… If you’re looking for a relationship, and this man isn’t – then why would you spend ANY time with him? Love, Rori

  471.  #471Sandra Franco on February 25, 2013 at 10:32 am

    I have been seeing my boyfriend for a little over a year. We first had a lot of passion by now he doesn’t kiss me anymore or touch me . He always wants me to to touch him. I have asked him about this and he says it’s because he is going through a hard time and is depressed. I don’t find that to be acceptable any longer. My needs are not being met and I am staring to feel unattractive. I am seriously thinking about ending this relationship. I would like to know what you think.

  472.  #472Rori Raye on February 25, 2013 at 5:46 pm

    Sandra, Welcome, and I’ve deleted your last name for your privacy. I won’t tell you what to do, but, if it were me, I certainly wouldn’t stay with any man who doesn’t want to touch or kiss me. Period. Love, Rori

  473.  #473April on February 26, 2013 at 6:16 am

    Thank you Rori, new development after after the talk on Wednesday the I am looking for a relationship he met someone on Friday and now wants to see where that goes. So I can only assume at this point it is a lost cause. We have a strong friendship and worse work together do I even have a chance here? Do let me tell you that I am only the second woman he has ever been with so he has never experienced the dating scene was always married till this last year.

  474.  #474Helen on February 26, 2013 at 6:14 pm

    I met a guy in September and we became fast friends. We talked with each other every day, worked out together, and he often invited me over to his place for a movie night. I’ve never had a boyfriend and my feelings for him grew. When he kissed me, I thought we had moved to some sort of relationship phase. I was so happy and for the next few days we kissed more and spent more time together.

    After not speaking to me in a couple days, he told me he wasn’t ready for a relationship. He still had feelings for his ex (with whom he has a son with) and that starting a relationship with me would complicate things. He said he wouldn’t be able to give me his whole heart and that it would be unfair to me. I agreed, wanting to let him figure himself out first, and we went back to just being friends.

    That was hard for me because I missed him and the attention he had given me. We still talked, exercised, and hung out but not nearly as much as we used to. One day, I asked him if we could watch a movie the following night because I would be leaving in few days to visit my parents for Thanksgiving and I would not be able to see him for a week. He agreed and that night he told me he was fighting the urge to not kiss me. I didn’t want to breach a barrier of friendship but I really wanted to kiss him too. I changed my mind and thought “what the hell, it’s only for tonight” and we ended up having an intense make-out session.

    We continued being just friends after that, but our conversation and hang out time stayed the same as it had been. He still invited me over to watch tv with him in the day or a movie at night and one day he told me that he will always care for his ex and love her as the mother of his child but he is now past the heartbreak of missing her (she has had two boyfriends since they broke up over the summer, by the way).

    We hadn’t kissed since that night in November, and one night in December we became more intimate. A week after that (which included more movie nights and intimacy) we actually did “the dirty deed”. We were that close for the next few weeks until the holidays. Then I didn’t see him for a month because I was with my family, who live 12 hours away.

    He was happy to see me when I came back, and he told me that he is happy with the situation and would tell me if things needed to change. I told him I was fine with the situation too and since then we’ve been “doing it”. We still hung out as friends though, not all of our movie nights resulted in kisses and such.

    But now I want more, I don’t want to have sex without love. He does care for me, but I don’t think he cares as much as I want and need him too. I know he and I both deserve happiness and I believe he is worth waiting for and fighting for. I recently found this website and am really liking the advice and information. I haven’t talked with him in two days and I am not sure what my next move should be. I kind of have to work backwards now but I am willing to try and do anything that may help him let me be the woman he cannot live without.

    I am not sure which program would be best for me or if anyone has any advice or suggestions of their own. Should I just tell him it’s too painful for my heart for me to be with him intimately? I still want to keep him in my life because we are wonderful friends, friends who can not talk for a couple of weeks and then talk again as though we never stopped talking. He is the only male (who’s not blood related) that I can trust and I don’t want to lose him or have him lose me.

  475.  #475Rori Raye on February 26, 2013 at 11:43 pm

    Helen, Welcome, and please don’t let your lack of experience get the better of you here. Friends With Benefits is not what you’re after, and he’s made it very clear that that’s the most he’s interested in. If it were me, I’d distance myself and start Circular Dating until you meet a man who really wants to be with you in the way you want. Love, Rori

  476.  #476Kellie on February 27, 2013 at 5:46 am

    So since I had backed off from him and the entire relationship for about a week he has realized what it was about me he fell in love with. He has opened up about what he’s thinking and how he is feeling and has told me things that he’s never told anyone. I really listened when he spoke and only talked when I felt it was necessary. He knew what he almost lost when I pulled away. He has even talked of marriage again. So I think I’m on the right track now. How he is being now was the way he was when we first started dating last year. Thank you Rori for the advice you give.

  477.  #477louise mclindon on February 28, 2013 at 7:42 am

    Hi Rori,
    I met a lovely guy before Christmas,
    He persued me after I initially showed no interest,
    He ran after me to try get my no, when I said no he sent a huge bouquet of flowers to my work. He said it was totally out of character for him, but I had made a massave impression on him, I was very flattered. He was very keen at first a little to for me, he said he got the impression he needed to back off a little. He said he thought he could fall for me big time. I started to like him, thats when it all started to go wrong. He has very little time free as he has children from a previous relationship, he is a good dad. He also has formed a band at the age of 48. He writes the music and lyrics, it is is passion, He seemed to want to keep all areas of his life sepsrate. He said in order to be a better person for the other, then you had to maybe be a little selfish. I totally supported him with seeing his children and the band, I was proud of him and was interested in what he was doing. It became clear that he only had one or two opportunities in a week to see me. He said he was concerned that we wouldn’t see enough of each other. We started a physical relationship which was wonderful, he was very loving and caring. He would leave without saying when I would see him next, I began to feel vary hurt about this. I said I felt he had chased me and now he didn’t quite know what to do with me, I aked if he wanted me in his life. He said he chased me because he wanted me and he definately wanted me in his life. Three weeks later he we are finished. He took me to dinner and bought me flowers, he stayed the night and then again went with no future date set. I felt confused and told him so. I asked him to give me times when we could get together so I could plan my life around those pracious moments. He was upset that he sent flowers etc but missed the most important thing was that I wanted to know when I would see him again. He sais he could’t be the man I wanted him to be and he wasn’t the man I thiught he was. I have not hear from him for two weeks, I keep hopeing he will be in touch, did I drive him away? He was a quiet man, everyone said I was too much for him, I don’t believe that. He has a very sensitive side which I found very attractive in a man. Is there any hope? I will not contact him

    I am finding your information amazing, I know I need to make changes, so glad I found you!!


  478.  #478Rori Raye on February 28, 2013 at 11:51 am

    Louise, Welcome, and I’m deleting your last name for your privacy. Please start with my ebook (over in the sidebar) – if you practice everything in it, things will change for you. Dating is dating – it’s NOT a relationship. And you were thinking of him as a relationship. What needs to happen is for you to get enough experience so you take EVERYTHING ‘with a grain of salt” and leanback and keep Circular Dating no matter what. It seems to me that right now you two want different things, and although the entire problem of “time” can always be solved by living together, that’s not what he seems to have wanted. Another man WILL want that. Go get yourself out there so HE can find you! Love, Rori

  479.  #479phoebe on February 28, 2013 at 11:18 pm

    HI Rori,
    I have just made a huge mess of a potential relationship.. I have pushed this guy away just as I was starting to fall in love.
    I am so so stupid and I really need your help.
    I very rarely meet guys that I am remotely attracted to, and I am so keen on this one.. is there anything I can do to change things around and get him back??

    I have known R for many years, as and acquaintance, he runs local cafes, and I have always liked the look of him.
    Before xmas it he started flirting, when I saw him at gatherings with friends; he asked me out, everyone said how he obviously really he liked me, things moved incredibly fast, we kissed, he phoned me the next day to tell me how beautiful my lips were, a few days and dates later we made love,lots. he bought me a tooth brush, said he loved me, he asked me to drop into his cafe .. every day.. so I did..( i drive past it at least twice a day, and before I started seeing him would go in regularly) stupid! I know i should have been more unavailable, and made him work more for me..but i though we were ‘together”.. It all felt so amazing, he was driving it , but I see I made mistakes.. I offered to drive to a gallery opening in the city, cooked him dinner, asked him over… was always available.
    I know I should have made him do all the work.
    Heaps of people were commenting on how great we were together and how his ex was a nightmare, how lucky he was to be with me now. He seemed to realise how his ex. was a disaster for him. He kept telling his friends how lovely and what a great girl I was.
    Then.. his ex contacted him.. they hadn’t seen each other for 6 months, he had been about to move in with her and ask her to get married, when she re met an old boyfriend, and called everything off. But it didn’t work out for them, so she started reeling R back in. They met .. and then he changed, became different towards me..
    There was a lot of emotional stuff for them to sort out.. and i think he must still be in love with her I know he must be comparing me to her..her hooks are still in his heart..I feel R was pushing so hard to fall in love with me to take him away from the pain of his ex, things went so fast, and then it all became too much. I know I wasn’t alluring or mystical enough. i was too available. He went away for the weekend, didn’t contact me, and came back to say he needed to talk..He had thought about us, and he didn’t see longevity in our relationship because he felt something was missing.
    I was devastated, I couldn’t see how he could feel that when we hardly had given it a chance.. three weeks.. how could he change so quickly
    I felt his ex hovering the whole time, like an eagle waiting to swoop in on her prey. She is incredibly manipulative, and hasn’t told R about the old boyfriend, the real reason she left R in the first pace and how the old boyfriend was the love of her life.

    Now I don’t know how to behave.. I will see him at dinner parties, in the street, with our mutual friends, we live in a tight knit community, and I cant avoid him.
    I want this guy.. but only if he wants me.. how can i change this around so we wants me again? Is it possible ?Does he need time to get over his ex? or is that just an excuse i am giving him?
    I am going away for two weeks, which is great, but what do i do when I get back and I see him.. do I tell him how i feel? ignore him? hold my head high and just be polite? Use the Siren tools and smile at him? .. and try and start again?? or is it just too late ? Please please Help.. xxx thank you Rori !

  480.  #480Armida on March 1, 2013 at 12:16 am

    I enjoyed reading these it helpedme out alittle thank u so much for sharing cant wait to read the next ones coming take care armida

  481.  #481Rori Raye on March 1, 2013 at 11:17 am

    phoebe – Welcome, and though I can’t guarantee you this man, I can guarantee you that your best bet is to get busy Circular Dating and having a high old time! The more fun you start having, the more men you start attracting by really, truly using and practicing the Tools, the more interested in you he will instinctively be.

    The problem here is that if his ex girlfriend is manipulative, immature, mean and anything else you might call her – then that’s what he LIKES! And, really – do you want to be like that? Men stay hung up on their exes for a reason – because she turns him on exactly as she is. Love, Rori

  482.  #482Kris on March 12, 2013 at 9:28 am

    My partner is a fantastic man but sadly quite weak! He is living between my house and his mothers when he has his 4 year old son who he has 50% of the time. His mother doesn’t like me and this causes issues. For example they have organised a family trip for his fathers birthday and I am not invited. I explained that I didn’t want him not to go on the trip as it is for his dad but felt angry and disappointed that I wasn’t even offered to go with them and he hadn’t even spoke to his mother to question why I wasn’t involved, he just told me that he is going as it is paid for. The whole family are going – apart from me.
    This is about the sixth thing where he hasn’t stood up for me with his mam and I have really tried not to say a word about her. He even commented the other week that he appreciated that I wasn’t being negative about her but when I was told about this trip I got mad!
    I had explained my feelings a few weeks ago and when he mentioned going and didn’t account for anything we had talked about is just said it feels like when I talk to you it goes in one ear and out of the other! He said he was really sorry, he didn’t realise how it made me feel and he would talk to his mother.
    He is fully involved with my friends but somehow I am not involved with his family and he doesn’t have that many friends.
    Later on that evening after the ‘mother talk’ we talked about commitment and may I add he has only been divorced since December and he left his wife the December before! He said he wasn’t ready and just needed some more time – we are on the same chapter but not on the same page yet!
    I just said right – get your things out of my house and if you can’t stand up for me or even commit when I have been there 100% for you through your divorce etc then it is over. I said he was the lovely person and that I loved him but I hoped he would find what he was looking for. Baring in mind this man texts/calls/pops into see me constantly tell me he adores me, feels so lucky to have met me blah blah!

    I am so sad he has gone and I don’t know what to do? Will he come back? Please help – I love him!!

  483.  #483Rori Raye on March 12, 2013 at 11:11 am

    Kris – I’m a bit baffled by your feelings and your actions. I don’t know how long you’ve been together, but it seems to me you’ve made both way too much commitment in your own head to a man who isn’t ready to reciprocate, and that you’re angry with him for no reason. He’s doing what he’s doing. Your job is to gauge what he’s doing and see if it works for you – not be angry at what he’s doing. And I totally don’t understand throwing a man out if you actually still want him.

    What I’m getting here is that your attraction to drama is doing you in. Please read my ebook and work with it, participate here, learn how to communicate in Feeling Messages.

    I’m nearly positive he “isn’t gone” – he seems quite into you. The thing is – he’s asking you to go slower than you want. Can you adjust? Can you hold it together and be patient? Do you WANT to? Lots of questions to ask yourself before you leap to ultimatums. Love, Rori

  484.  #484Kris on March 12, 2013 at 11:18 am

    Rori I do love this man. It is the fact he wanted to move in last year and we both felt it was too soon but now he is saying that he needs more time, I don’t understand. Also the thing with his mother and not standing up for me just upsets me and the fact I’m not involved in a family trip after a year and a bit makes me feel so hurt.

    If I mean so much why hasn’t he been in touch? What can I do? I want him back I love him. Please help me x

  485.  #485Ligita on March 14, 2013 at 6:17 pm

    I met a guy a couple of months back, and am now completely stuck on him, although we’ve only seen each other 4 times, 3 of those at my place. We haven’t had sex yet. We enjoy each other, have interesting conversations, but he says he is not ready for anything serious, although he’s 45 years old. He was devastated by a previous relationship and I think he is still in love with that woman. I’m trying not to concentrate on anything he has said in the past, and not over-analyze. I haven’t felt this strongly about anyone in the last 20 years. I’ve been on my own that long, and fear I may have pushed him away by my independence and “non-neediness”. Haven’t seen or spoken to him in 2 weeks. Ultimately he will make the decision to contact me or not, but should I, perhaps, let him know how I feel, sooner rather than later? I’ve fallen a little in love with him. I want to see him again, but don’t want to drive him away. Any suggestions?

  486.  #486k2012 on March 17, 2013 at 8:17 am

    “but he says he is not ready for anything serious, although he’s 45 years old.” Ligita, I hope u don’t mind my commenting. I suppose your questions are for Rori but I couldn’t help quoting this. This is a big red flag, trust me. Anytime they tell u they are not ready for a relationship, BELIEVE THEM. I was involved with a man who was a year I believe older than me who told me he wasn’t ready to get married. That was about 5 years ago. From I realized he wanted something casual I ended it. If a man who is 45 or in his 40’s and not ready to get married well……. He said he wanted to achieve financially first. He was not ready so I left. Be careful cause if this man is not ready and u are ready, u will get hurt. Date other people my dear, I beg u. Protect your heart. According to some ladies on a dating site I use to frequent, “RUN TO THE NEAREST EXIT.”

  487.  #487k2012 on March 17, 2013 at 9:21 am

    Correction: not a dating site, a womens website/message board I used to frequent.

  488.  #488Indigo on March 17, 2013 at 11:00 am


    In my opinion, this is way too early with this man to be stressing like this. You’ve only seen each other 4 times and you are already stressing about pushing him away, and whether he is ready for anything serious and whether he will contact you again after 2 weeks of no contact?

    Let it go if you possibly can, Ligita. k2012 is right, him saying he is not ready for anything serious is not a good sign, and at this stage with this man you should just be having fun and not getting too hung up.

    Good luck to you