How Important is Sex in a Relationship

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Sex is such an important thing – not because it’s so crucial to be having sex for sex’s sake (though it makes us healthier in so many ways…) but because it’s such a serious barometer for the health and intimacy level of a relationship.

It says so much about the physical and emotional status of each of you.

It demonstrates hormones – testosterone and estrogen.

And hormones say a lot about who you are in so many ways.

Here’s a letter that’s a good jump off about sex in a relationship:

“Rori, I went through the same situation with my husband and it was indeed a big red flag when a man rarely initiated sex. And my husband for the longest time trivialized the issue as if I made sex such a big deal over everything else. He was (and sometimes is) still in denial how important sex is in a marriage.

Long story short, we broke up because I was so unfulfilled and resentful so I strayed (let’s just put it that way at this point).
We’re in a reconnecting phase these days and sex has been frequent and wonderful (once a week/10 days for 5 mins when we were married, 2-3 times a week for at least 30 mins these days). And he wanted and initiated it all the time. I sometimes wonder it is because I am “no longer” his wife so sex is more exciting (we haven’t lived back together and have yet to spend the night together since we broke up last year).

At any rate, I’m happy about our sex life. He’s now more responsive about pleasing me too, something he never cared before. I’ve been doing what basically needs to be done to be attractive again to your man (always dress femininely, be gracious and showing appreciation of things he does and that makes me happy, etc.)

I wonder what you think about sex during reconciliation. We’re not officially back together (he’s still resisting) but I know he can’t afford to lose me. At times I feel things don’t go as fast as I wish it did (I know…I know guys are slow). I do believe though that our sexual relationship is working to bond us closer but at the same time the golden rule out there is a man will less likely to commit as long as he gets sex with no string attached (though I know he’s not seeing anyone else).

Under opposite circumstances (if he was the one who was more sexual than me) I would have perhaps acted differently. But sex was the main thing I complained about during our marriage and now I have it turned full circle, so it’s a bit crazy if I’m complaining about that now (it just shows women really are never happy lol). thank you, Karen”

Here’s my answer:

Dear Karen,

I have so much to say here…and I think this applies no matter WHAT your situation. If your man is not sexually interested (once a week, as you describe is quite OFTEN for a man who isn’t much interested…), or if you’re dating a man where the sex is good but the commitment is fuzzy.

Let’s start with the centerpiece of this situation – he wasn’t interested in having sex with you – and now he is.

I’m assuming nothing’s changed physically – he’s not all of a sudden using Viagra or stopped watching porn, or started watching porn just before he sees you?

The only thing that’s changed then, is YOU.

And how have YOU changed?

A lot of different ways:

1. You’re not there all the time.
2. You’re not a sure thing.
3. You’ve demonstrated that you’re just fine without him.
4. You’ve demonstrated that you can take care of yourself physically and emotionally
5. You’ve demonstrated that you’re willing to be without him in order to have the love and relationship and fulfilling sex life you want and deserve.
6. You’ve demonstrated that you don’t NEED him, and that you’re not desperate to have him.
7. You’re “gracious” and “appreciative” – new things.

So now – he has absolutely no requirement of intimacy in order to have sex with you. There are no strings. He feels free. His body is responding again.

Only – what would happen if you got married again?

Would he all of a sudden feel pressured – by his internal workings – or by you – in a way that would interrupt his sexual response again?

Would he again start to withdraw sexually because that’s the easy way for him to do that?

(Opting out sexually is likely the number one way men AND women act out anger – and it’s the first thing that goes when intimacy winds down.)

If you’re lucky enough to have a man who just wants sex no matter what – this may not happen to you – or, he may cheat, instead.

The way to go here is to USE sex to practice INTIMACY. That means you have to feel safe. You have to feel safe and open, so HE’LL feel safe and open. You have to feel expressive and you have to surrender to yourself in his presence.

Continuing in next post:..Part 2 on the 14th…

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Katarina Phang on August 13, 2010 at 9:48 pm

    This is a great topic, Rori since I find so many women are so conflicted about sex. Many hold the belief that they are “sacrificing the sacred part of their being” if they’re having sex with a guy outside commitment as if it was so wrong for a woman to enjoy sex just for the sake of enjoying sex.

    Sex is a vehicle for bonding and connection, before and after commitment. That’s my belief. My two last LTRs started with sex very early on. It’s just not true guys will disappear just because you have sex with them early.

    Guys disappear because they don’t feel it for you -with or without sex. How many guys never call back after without sex-first dates? Or a few no-sex dates?

    My point exactly.

  2.  #2Simply Shannon on August 13, 2010 at 10:50 pm

    Rori, I would love a post from you about the benefits of waiting to have sex. As someone who used/uses sex as a way to generate intimacy, it feels so important to not go there too quickly. Kind of like your stance about circular dating. Don’t go exclusive until you have what you want.

    I see so many posts that start… “we were having so much fun on our 1st (or 2nd or 3rd) date. We slept together. And now it’s all gone to crap…” I cringe when I see these posts.

    In my personal experience, it’s better to wait. Waiting has made a HUGE difference in limiting how tangled up I get in a man.

  3.  #3Laughing goddess on August 14, 2010 at 1:38 am

    Okay, my post has nothing to do with sex but it’s something I feel inspired to share because I am so excited!!!

    Tonight I found some cash that I had hidden and then lost! This comes at a time when I really needed it. Oh my gosh! I feel so excited and grateful to the universe! I had hidden it and then couldn’t find it and then I thought maybe I had combined it with another bit that I has hidden and knew where it was. So I wasn’t sure if it was really there. Part of me figured it may be and would show up at the perfect time. Part of me had given up on it and thought I spent it.

    So, LI was helping me clean to get ready for landlord visit and he said…” oh ya, I found your cash stash” and I said “what? Where?” and he showed me and I was overjoyed! I wasn’t sure how I was going to pay some of my bills this month. LI had actually offered to loan me money which I appreciated but really didn’t want to take. Now I don’t have to!

    Thank you thank you thank you universe!!!!

    I had been applying Abraham hicks teachings today especially because I was feeling so stressed about landlord visit and wala! I got an added bonus! I feel sooooo relieved and grateful! I’m actually glad I misplaced it because I probably would have spent it and now I have it when I especially needed it. I don’t even think I can express how wonderful this is for me!

    Yay yay yay yay yay!!!!

  4.  #4Katarina Phang on August 14, 2010 at 8:23 am

    Simply Shannon, in my opinion a lot of women use sex as a tool to “trap” a man thinking men will be more emotionally connected after sex. Don’t get me wrong, when the ingredients are there they will and they can but it’s not a guarantee. Don’t have sex only because you think he will commit to you. Have sex because you’re in the moment and you want to enjoy it as much as he does.

    Have sex because you want to share and create, without agenda and expectations. Unleash your inner sex goddess.

    If you feel it’s good to wait, please wait but don’t keep holding off just because you have to follow the “golden rule.” There is no such thing as golden rule when it comes to sex. And guys do disappear too if you keep holding off. After all they’re human beings with their own needs just like us.

    It’s a mistake to think that if he loves you he will wait as long as you want to, simply because “the rule” says it you shouldn’t have sex before commitment -or whatever. See it from his POV: what’s wrong with me, she doesn’t trust/respect me enough to have me have all of her?

    At that point in a relationship, sex is fatally important because it’s not only physical gratification and goes beyond that. This is where sex works to deepen your connection with a man as men do bond with us through sex, though the route isn’t as direct and smooth as ours.

    Sure some guys will keep waiting, but for the best guys out there who have options, the fact you keep holding off can become a turn off for them. So beware!

  5.  #5Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 9:41 am


    thank you for your post. I’ve been hearing about the “Golden Rule” all my life so it was really refreshing to read what you had to say.

  6.  #6Katarina Phang on August 14, 2010 at 10:49 am

    Apple Jacks, you’re welcome. I have no idea if you’re a man or a woman, but I want to also say this when a man is so hard on wanting sex right away from a woman, it can also be a turn off for her.

    Whenever it feels right -and it depends on many factors and the types of men you’re dealing with- I don’t think it’s a bad thing for women to decide to be intimate with a man regardless of timing (there is no one good timing for all situations). You can’t gauge what a man’s response after an “incident” will be because as it has become apparent, men are very good actors when they feel it serves them well :).

    Just be your authentic self and enjoy the moment. If he disappears, he disappears. It just means he’s not the right person for you. Don’t overanalyze.

  7.  #7Mercedes on August 14, 2010 at 11:03 am

    Want to make it clear from the start that I don’t disagree with this…just have another perspective based on my own heart:

    The way to go here is to USE sex to practice INTIMACY. That means you have to feel safe. You have to feel safe and open, so HE’LL feel safe and open. You have to feel expressive and you have to surrender to yourself in his presence.

    For me, it is better to practice intimacy outside of the sex. Then, intimacy during the sex is totally natural. Intimacy outside of sex is the hard part, but once mastered…it is also the wonderful part.

  8.  #8AmberS on August 14, 2010 at 11:09 am

    Yay Laughing Goddess!!!

    Way to manifest! SWEET!

  9.  #9AmberS on August 14, 2010 at 11:12 am

    I feel really ridiculous asking this, but I’m struggling in this right now.

    Can someone please help me define intimacy? Because I feel like I’ve spent my whole adult life avoiding it by having sex…

    Is there a different post that addresses this?

  10.  #10Daria on August 14, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Amber – to me so far intimacy means being authentic and open with someone

  11.  #11AmberS on August 14, 2010 at 11:33 am

    Daria- Thank you!

    I wanted to say thank you for explaining your process the other day but it was in the middle of a different topic and it didn’t feel good for me to jump in.

    You riff here, but sometimes (ok- most times) I don’t get it, but I get that it’s for you and about you, so I don’t want to trigger you by asking. The other day you also explained it and it clicked for me. Thanks & Thanks

  12.  #12Daria on August 14, 2010 at 11:37 am

    im feeling so lonely. looking at the big pile of clothes i feel numb. shut off. in my past experience when i put away clothes my thoughts start rambling in obsessive circles and it doesnt feel good. and wehn im done it doesnt feel good either.

    i don’t get an instant feeling of accomplishment –

    that would feel good

    i feel icky and sad and bend my head

    this is how i feel often in the morning, unless i have planned activities with people

    but i don’t like having planned activities right?

    i do like having plans to be with people, i like it when in the morning i can go out directly and be with people or they contact me and i can instantly wake up and get into a sharing conversation and laughing

    my heart feels achy

    i feel lonely and pouty

    i feel drained

    i got a voice that says i know im not going to do anything that feels good today

    the only thing that feels good is being around people and i dont know anyone that wants to be around me today

    i feel angry at my cd’s and that feels disappointing

    im so tired of being lonelay…

    i feel sad

    i don’t like feeling like this in the morning

    i remember waking up at guywhohadababy’s house, next to guywhohadababy and like 2 or 3 other people sleeping on the floor, and feeling so secure happy and good

    i love that feeling

    i love feeling that i’m having fun, im allowed to have fun today

    my debts are looming on me

    my disorganized clothes and laundry are looming on me

    my dmv decision is looming on me

    i feel sad and small and quivering next to these unstable towers ready to fall on my head and bury me under their rubble

    i know no one will help

    i feel scared of living alone cuz i dont want to feel lonely in the morning

    when i was a kid and i had videogames i remember feeling JUICED to wake up in the morning and play them all day

    also when i had friends who wanted me to play with them outside i felt soooo good

    thats all i want from life really

    is to keep feeling that feeling

    but now i feel lonely in the morning so what is that about?

    i guess i haven’t had models for being happy since my mom was depressed ever since we came here

    i might have inadvertedly learned patterns for depression

    like to deny myself happiness

    my mom says she doesnt like cleaning either but thats mostly what she does, all day everyday

  13.  #13tinque on August 14, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Mercedes – This will be a first, me disagreeing with you, but then again I’m speaking from my own experience and what worked for me.
    K and are were already in a committed relationship, but my heart still was guarding big time. The intimacy was there but calculated I suppose, more shallow maybe. The right words are not coming to me.
    Running parallel to this I immersed myself in exploring my sexuality, and it was via this journey that I discovered my vulnerability and allowed it and learned how to be deeply intimate in this way. It was through our sexuality that I found and was able to open my heart and be intimate in this way.

  14.  #14Daria on August 14, 2010 at 11:46 am

    my dad is here, and teh guy who works on our house is here, theyre not in my room though

    their presence is not feeding my soul like what im looking for

    i was having hella fun for the past two months – avoiding – or just moving my thoughts away – from the huge bills i don’t know how to pay

    and now it feels like stuff is crashing – i feel mad at my cd’s over money… now that i have money it feels harder to let them give to me … and i feel resentful of them i feel unsafe and like they don’t want to give as much to me

    on top of that

    i dont really have people reaching out to me in the morning

    wait i do

    a few people

    but they’re not hitting my spot either

    so i have what i want but its not hitting my spot

    what is it that i want then?

    i feel like im crying somewhere inside

    outside i feel pouty face, am making it into sad face to match the inside

  15.  #15girl on August 14, 2010 at 11:48 am

    Rori – thanks very much for your advice to take a walk to get clear and calm: simple and effective.

    Now, my head is relatively clear, and I still feel very weird about commitment and relationships. Cause yesterday, I told my mom about how unromantic and not excited I currently feel about my relationship with D, who I think is a great guy, and she said that’s just how it is. she said that a day doesn’t go by when she doesn’t feel really irritated by my dad (simple things, like when he walks past the cats, he almost steps on them every time). It’s like I long for the days I spent pining away for some man who I perceived as so much better than me. The days when i believed that a man (who was unavailable and unwilling) could be my champion, if only…. And now, I have a great man who does step up to be with me, but i feel bla. I don’t feel interested in sex – it feels like a chore. I don’t feel like kissing him – it gives me the heebie jeebies. does this mean I’m not into him?? I mean, if my mom divorced my dad for being annoying, that would have been dumb. And I think it would be dumb to break up with D, cause he is the only man who has stepped up that I do completely admire and respect. I value respect over lust, so I guess I know that I’ll stay with him…but I feel so disappointed. that this is “it”. And in my mind, lust is trumping respect in the sense that I still do pine away for this guy from the past: N. N was so very sexy – I wanted him so bad, and I still do – even though it’s been 2 years since I’ve seen him. I just want to feel HOT for d. I feel lukewarm. And, in a sense, this feels safer. Like ‘attraction’ equals massive pleasure and massive pain. I feel ‘Secure’, which equals contentment and boredom.
    It’s possible that I’m blocking feelings of love – cause I have been a little self destructive (skin picking, eating unhealthy food) and I do feel a little unworthy. I’m going to take good care of myself today, and perhaps that will help me welcome his love, and my unwillingness to be close will dissolve. Urgh. This just feels like big dose of unpleasant “reality.”

  16.  #16Daria on August 14, 2010 at 11:49 am

    i miss my best friend . we used to talk everyday and hang out everyday. i could call her instantly when i woke up and we would instantly be laughing for hours and hours.

    but we’re not friends now. this feels sad.

    i feel sad.

    i feel very hopeless about life.

    im just avoiding my “problems” and dealing with my “problems” is just going to make life MORE dry and depressed and boring

    i already have close to an ideal life for some — “i wish i could just do nothing all day and hang out with friends..”

    i feel angry…

    do you? then do it. ohhh i can’t i gotta have money. well then stfu.

    these voices. are torturing
    my morning.

  17.  #17Daria on August 14, 2010 at 11:51 am

    oh no girl! that feels so awful .

    i feel scared. i feel scared that that’s what my relationship will feel like when i get committed to a man who is pursuing me…

    that it will turn into that… it reminds me of my highschool boyfriend

    this sux!

    i feel worried that that is the way i would feel while allowing a good man to get close to me

    i wish Rori would address this some more…

  18.  #18girl on August 14, 2010 at 12:05 pm

    Yeah, Daria – I feel jipped. Like now I know why movies end at “happily ever after”…so we don’t see the passion evaporate into ho hum borderline misery interspersed with moments of appreciation.
    My mom said that if I want excitement, I can stick with jerks, so that every time I feel bored, he can cheat on me – then things will get exciting again. I have a friend who seems madly in love with her husband – we’re having gelato this afternoon: I’ll see what she has to say about this, too…

  19.  #19Mercedes on August 14, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    tinque: You and I took very different paths to our intimacy. For me, it was not until I was intimate out of bed that I could begin to feel intimate in bed. Before that…it was just sex. Once I opened my heart fully while clothed…everything changed for me. I think maybe that came from sexual abuse as a child?? Not sure but sex was strictly body feelings and a deep desire to turn those feelings into love…until that is, I was given the gift of making love with an already open and vulnerable heart. Then…well…things have only gotten more and more intimate…

    Much Love,

  20.  #20Renee on August 14, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Mercedes — where can I find your blog? If you’re not comfortable posting it, you can email me at:


  21.  #21Mercedes on August 14, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    Renee: Just click on my name. It will take you right there…

    Much Love,

  22.  #22tinque on August 14, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    girl – the passion doesn’t have to evaporate into ho hum misery…
    the passion can even grow with time. the excitement can sustain.

  23.  #23tinque on August 14, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Yes Miss M I know our paths were different. I wanted to express that is more than one path to the same thing. Your experience was exactly opposite to mine, yet we arrived at the same destination, true intimacy with one special man.

  24.  #24Laughing goddess on August 14, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    So once again I’m not posting about sex.

    Oh god, that was so stressful! Landlords came over and they were so sweet and they said they were lucky to have a tenant like me. Really all was well. All is well.

    At the same time, I feel shaky and adrenaline flowing through my body. I feel nervous and shaking. I feel tightness in my chest. I feel confused as to why I am letting this het to me so much.

    I just reallly love living here. And I have made some changes in the house that I didn’t clear with them. And I so enjoy having a stable place to live. And it’s easy. I’m in a routine and I want to feel solid and secure in my living situation. I really want to feel solid and secure in my living situation. It’s so important to me to have a sense of safety and security.

    And I feel curious if I can find that sense of security in myself. In my knowingness that I will always be here for me and so will my higher self and god and the universe. I belief that they are all helping me, assisting me and I am guarded and protected and blessed. And even if something happened and the landlords weren’t happy and I had to leave, I would still be okay. I am surrounded by people who would help me if I needed it and even more importantly, I promise to show up for me.

    I will always be there for me. I will never abandon myself. I will always vote for me.

    It’s okay for me to have a good life. And by being happy, I can spread to live and make the world a better place.

    My inner little girl deserves safety and security and a warm place to sleep, and a clean functioning kitchen where I can prepare healthy food for myself. And all is well and I am just fine, thank you very much!

  25.  #25girl on August 14, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    I just feel so BIG in so many ways. And it feels good when I perceive a man to be bigger. I feel D is as big as me, and a little bigger in some ways, but a little smaller in some ways. I would feel good with a giant.

    Like, on Eat Pray Love, the guy she ends up with weeps cause he is so full of love – and he just seems huge in his capacity to love. N seemed huge in his sexual appetite, and huge in his pain from a divorce. I love all that space to explore. I feel like I occupy so much space in my relationship with D. Like I want more – more space more curiosity – more room to grow. maybe this is just a “low” – there have definitely been highs…

  26.  #26Daria on August 14, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    i feel like i have nothing “out my window”

    all i have out my window is a wall

  27.  #27Renee on August 14, 2010 at 1:06 pm

    Sirens…I’m feeling unwanted by Dr. Feelgood…after I saw that eharmony had matched us this morning, I wrote him a txt that said, “I’m cracking up! Eharmony matched us just now as well. I guess the cyber-dating Gods are trying to tell us something, lol.”

    To which he replied, “That’s great. And says at least one thing — we can check little boxes with consistency!”.

    That seems very wishy-washy to me as to whether he’s even looking forward to meeting me tomorrow or not…he has yet to firm up our plans for tomorrow and it’s 4pm my time the day before. His last message prior to that wasn’t particularly committal either…I’m just getting the feeling that he’s lost interest for some reason and I don’t want to keep Sunday evening open for him if he’s backing out on me.

    I know this isn’t a feeling message, but I’m thinking of sending him a txt that says, “Maybe I’m reading something into your last replies that’s not there, but I’m just not getting the feeling that you’re really that into meeting me after all so I’m going to bow out and make other plans.” What do you think?

  28.  #28Mercedes on August 14, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    Renee: I think maybe you’re reading too much into his comment. I thought (but I’m reading it from someone who has never talked to him and has zero take on his personality) it sounded kind of cute…and very funny!

    You may not agree and I understand that, but if I personally got that message (and again…I’m taking it as humor) I would say

    “EXACTLY! haha! Looking forward to tomorrow… 🙂 ”

    I think even by saying the words “but I’m just not getting the feeling that you’re really that into meeting me after all” you’re putting yourself down. Why not stay with the feeling of “you absolutely can’t WAIT to see me tomorrow!” until he says otherwise?

    Just my thoughts…

    Much Love,

  29.  #29Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 1:23 pm


    thank you for addressing me directly. I’m a woman. 🙂
    This topic is bringing home to me my feelings in the very moment, but I’m too exhausted to post. I’ll give a try at least get to the point. I’m open to anyone’s guidance here.

    I feel I may have found someone to explore sexually with. I’ll be honest I am hot for him. He’s kind, gentle and just really fun. He’s interested in me too as he’s the one who’s chased me. I am not looking to get married, though. What I really want is a lover not marriage. But what if I do sleep with him and fall in love?

    My exprience as most people know, is very limited. Without going too much into detail but I only really been with one person twice, it hurt a lot, plus he was very rough with me (he was angry with me, can’t remember all the details) and it turned out that he did not penetrate me so I’m still in tact down there. This guy I am very open to exploration with (tinque, I’ll email you the details when I’m free). I told him most of my details except the hymen being in tact part. Didn’t get that far. He told me, “someone needs to take it slow and easy with you.” He asked me if I had a toy, and if I would use lubrication…all of this made me feel good coming from him because he was so gentle, and that made me want to jump his bones. I never did any of those things though, I just don’t like going down there too much. It hurts. all this indicates to me that he’d be great to explore with. But, I’m afraid of the after. Not necessarily his reaction, but mine. What if one time is not enough for me? What if I want it over and over and over? What if I get really attached? What if I cry a lot? I feel I’m going crazy if I don’t and I’ll go crazy if I do and it’s making me feel withdrawn. Thank you to anyone who can help, and my apologies for the long, slightly melodramatic post.

  30.  #30Simply Shannon on August 14, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    I completely agree with Mercedes. It feels so important to create intimacy (truthfulness, safety, love/caring, etc.) BEFORE I become sexually intimate. Yes, I can have sex for sex only. But for me that kind of sex is just animal gratification. It doesn’t spark in me any kind of connection or generate love sensations. It’s like eating a fast food meal. It satisfies for awhile but ultimately it’s not really what I’m looking for.

    And just like Amber said, I’ve practiced “intimacy” a lot through sex. Building intimacy without sex (by waiting) has opened up my eyes so much. I love getting to know the person in front of me for who they are outside of the bedroom… rather than sleeping with a man upfront THEN feeling surprised when I figure out his values don’t match up to mine.

  31.  #31Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 2:32 pm


    RE: #13 – Thank you for sharing with us such an intimate thing about yourself. That’s beautiful.

    I have sometimes felt opened into emotional intimacy through sex, but sometimes I have avoided intimacy through sex.

    I want both this time around, for sure.

    Amber, I believe intimacy is closeness, in a word. It is revealing your deep truth with someone.

    I heard this saying in 1993 and it still resonates with me:

    More than anything in the world,
    Each person desires intimacy.
    And, more than anything in the world,
    Each person fears intimacy.

    Some of my scariest, most vulnerable moments have been while having sex. Twice men tricked me, trying to get me pregnant against my will. One time the man slid the condom off inside me, accidentally on purpose. The other time a man poked holes in the condom.

    God knows how deeply I desire to be a mother, but not like that. I only want to be a mother when I choose to with whom I choose to.

    I also could have gotten STDs (and no, I’m not talking about Suck The Dick Syndrome! 🙂 ). I am fortunate that none of these things happened to me.

    I heard on the news a few months ago about two women in Florida who were seducing men at bars. They would target men with expensive watches, then get them drunk and give them the date rape drug in their drinks. They would go to their homes and have sex with them. When the man woke up in the morning, his jewelry, money, credit cards, and other valuables would be stolen.

    Having sex goes beyond physical. It creates soul ties. If the person we are with is not pure, this can also bring darkness into us.

    Now I am at a point where I am convinced that anything that makes me that vulnerable needs to be protected by a commitment.

  32.  #32Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 2:38 pm

    Hey Girl! RE: #15 – Did you ever see the movie, “Meet Joe Black”? I recommend it to you as therapy.

    Sometimes time apart is what is healthy for a relationship. Each person’s feelings become clear, and it will either make or break the relationship.

    What do you think?

  33.  #33Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    Girl, Here’s another thought. No, you don’t need to settle for status quo. If you choose to not take a time out, you could do things to spice up your love life. How bout giving him a massage or making him a candle lit dinner, stuff like that?

    Erika Awakening was talking about creating and maintaining sexual tension that keeps a relationship alive and growing. I really like that. I think humor and innuendos can contribute a lot to that!

    Like with Bill, we are still just getting to know each other at work, and when the coworkers commented that his name sounds like the name of an assassin, I said, “Are you going to name your son Jesse James?”

    It was off the wall, but it was a way of having him think about having a child with me! It was even a way of letting him know I am still fertile, even tho I am 46. It was a subtle tease.

    I love stuff like that!

  34.  #34Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    Renee, RE: #27 – Whew, your Negative, Niggling, Naughty, Nasty voices are working overtime, aren’t they??? Talking you right out of what may very well be a fantastic date with a doctor!!! Stop, all right?

    Send them to the corner and feed them a cookie. There was nothing wrong with what he said. it was noncommittal. Maybe he doesn’t want to sound too attached to the outcome until he meets you. He will have a much better sense of you then.

    Don’t you dare cancel your date! 🙂 Why are you so silly like that? 🙂 (like TN Man said to Lucy).

  35.  #35dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    Apple Jacks, go for it if that’s what you want to do. It’s okay to cry too. It really really is. And anyway he knows you’re basically a virgin, which means he is probably prepared for anything to happen. Please just tell him if you need to take a breather or want to stop or want more. Positive sexual experiences are very likely and possible, it’s true.

  36.  #36dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    where’s gina?

  37.  #37Diana on August 14, 2010 at 3:23 pm

    I discovered something fantastic: I love the me I am in his presence.

  38.  #38Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    Dorothea thank you so much for your post. I feel very moved. 🙂 I still feel a little frightened, however. Baby steps. Tinque will be hearing from me a lot!!!

  39.  #39Jasmine on August 14, 2010 at 3:52 pm


    Can you expand on that? You mean like you feel really good about being a woman in his presence? Like really feminine and beautiful? I love that feeling! That’s how I feel around Bill!

  40.  #40Jasmine on August 14, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    We have been off and on for like five years, and he just swept me off my feet for the umpteenth time a couple months ago. Sometimes I don’t think he is the right man for me, and then he does the things he does and reminds me of why I fell in love with him way back when in high school.

  41.  #41dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    yay apple jacks i am excited for you. sex is fun. i’m curious how old you are. I was much older than just about everyone when I had sex for the first time. i feel very optimistic for you.

  42.  #42Renee on August 14, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    Indy guy called me tonight, but no mention of getting together again yet…he mentioned something about long distance relationships being hard when you both have obligations and I said I guessed it was only as big of a challenge as you let it be…feel like I was doing a bit of convincing there and backed off, but still…

    No further word from Dr. Feelgood today…I guess he’s either going to stand me up or call at the last minute expecting to see me…I don’t know whether I should agree to see him or not…he’ll be 2/3 of the way to my city (from his city) because of a bachelor party he’s attending an hour away, so for that reason, I kind of feel like I should say yes, but on the other hand, I feel it’s very presumptuous of him to assume that I would keep Sunday night open for him when he’s been in such slight contact these past couple of days and still hasn’t firmed up anything…what do you think?

    Diana — that must be a wondeful feeling…I’d love to feel that way about someone:-).

  43.  #43Renee on August 14, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Brenda — Thanks for being such a sweetheart. I ended up just texting him back, “Haha! Exactly!”, but haven’t heard a word back from him…I really do have the 6th sense that something’s off there and I don’t know what it is…whereas w/Indy guy, I felt like things were fine but he was just kind of taking his time…

    Indy guy did say something interesting though…at one point, I said something about a blow-up doll and he said, “so that’s why I haven’t heard from you, huh? You’ve been playing with a blow up doll!” Thought it was interesting that he said HE hadn’t heard from ME — like it’s my job to contact him or something? I sensed a bit of feminine energy about him on our last date and I think I’m dead on with that.

  44.  #44Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Thanks Dorothea. I just turned 33 (I don’t come off that way). My first somewhat experience was when I was around 18 or 19. When I was 14 my first so called kiss was also a negative, forceful experience. These two experiences coupled with religious guilt, I said forget it on guys for many years. I’m lucky I look really young (thanks to my Indian genes), but sometimes it can feel like a hinderance to be this age, yet look so young and truly be so inexperienced.

  45.  #45dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    i feel delighted that this man that you are actually hot for wants to give you a positive sexual experience.

  46.  #46Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    🙂 Dorothea you’re moving me and uplifiting me with your excitement. I have to talk to him more in depth first. I still have a lot of negative voices due to religious guilt. I have to figure out how to shake them.

  47.  #47dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    wine helps

  48.  #48Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    I’ve been told….but I don’t drink. Lol, I have some situation, huh?

  49.  #49dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    it’s the blood of christ after all.

  50.  #50Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    Dorothea, I’m Muslim lol.

  51.  #51dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    ohhh, well do you honestly believe that if you have sex with this man you are a bad person or that god will turn his back on you or you will go to hell or something?

  52.  #52dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    omg lol. ok. now i understand. sorry for the christian-centric view

  53.  #53Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 4:48 pm

    Lol, no need to apologize Dorothea. To answer your first question…there are so many voices you know? Hard to just spell it out. Purity, cleanliness, heaven hell, marriage….makes me want to scream sometimes.

  54.  #54dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    I have a decent understanding (for a non-Muslim girl) of the Koran and Islam…I did all my historical studies in college on Islam and the Middle East, particularly Women and Islam.

    So are they “negative” voices to you, or is it genuinely your personal belief system but you feel pressure to defy it. In an ideal world would you find a Muslim husband and then embark on having sex with your new husband, or are you just ready to have sex already?

    thanks for letting me be nosy.

  55.  #55Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    Hello Dorothea,

    I’m actually a Sufi Muslim and I had a great deal of spiritual training all through out my 20s. Kind of experienced…evil spirits so to speak (long story). So in order to keep things on the right track and not be “attacked” I had to stay in purity in all ways of being. Purity of thought, word, deed…so it feels like it just feels at odds with the purity concept. Then on the other hand, I was also taught that purity is about the heart and judgement is not to be given power, not even against ourselves. That we should always be gentle, forgiving and all of that good stuff and to follow our hearts. I guess I’m just battling it out and trying to figure out where I stand. One minute I feel like this is good, the next I think what if it isn’t?

    Sorry, I’m fasting and I feel lightheaded. Let’s just say there’s a lot of internal conflict and I’d love to spell it out if only I can think clearly.

  56.  #56dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 5:04 pm

    when i’m hungry a bunch of triggers and feelings come up. i think you can take advantage of that here if you want. the blog is here for you to riff on and be with your feelings and write the down. Don’t be sorry.

  57.  #57Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    Thanks Dorothea. Been trying to take advantage. It is true when you’re hungry and thirsty, there are a LOT of triggers and feelings and high absorption of new ideas. *Sniff* I feel like calling this guy a b*a*s*t*a*r*d for doing this to me. I was doing just fine focusing on myself. Now I have all of this stuff to contend with. I don’t wanna. *folds arms and pouts lips*

  58.  #58Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    I like teddy bears. Nerd contacted me again and I let it go to voicemail. Not really feeling like dealing with his weirdness.

  59.  #59dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    when i am hungry it feels like there is no food in my belly to anchor down my deep fears and negative feelings, so they float like balloons up my esophagus and burst open at my head and spill all over the place.

  60.  #60dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    i am terrified at thought of LI getting a better job that involves constant exposure to other women (like an admissions person at a college). so what do i do with this…?

  61.  #61Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Wow dorothea. That was awesome. I feel so in my head right now…I wished I came up with your description. My sinuses feel like they want to rip out of my ears.

  62.  #62Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    Feeling sleepy….about forty five minutes left to eat and drink something. Yum. How wonderful it will feel to have something glide down my throat and into my tummy.

  63.  #63Renee on August 14, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Brenda — you were right…Dr. Feelgood just texted me that he’s really excited about meeting me tomorrow, so I guess it’s a good thing I didn’t spout off this afternoon whilst listening to the NV’s. It didn’t hurt that I just had the most fun conversation with this guy who’s 9 yrs younger than I am! I can’t believe I’m actually thinking of robbing the cradle like that, but he really made me laugh and I like that…it seems like it’s been too long since someone I dated made me laugh a lot.

    Between Dr. Feelgood, Indy guy and the kid, it feels like I have good quality men coming at me from several directions right now and that feels really good.

    I understand why you passed on the nerd…it’s really hard to settle for interaction with someone like that when you have such interesting interactions with someone you really like (Bill). I feel bad, though, that you didn’t get a chance to CD a little this weekend just to practice, but if it’s not meant to be, it’s just not meant to be. Hope you’re having a great evening!

  64.  #64Apple Jacks on August 14, 2010 at 6:32 pm

    Yay it feels good to eat and drink something. I feel light as a particle of feather, yiiiiippppppeeeeee!!!!!!

    Dorothea, I wanna have sex with hot for guy lol. *Grrrrr* to all these voices. Baby steps…

  65.  #65Renee on August 14, 2010 at 6:45 pm

    Dorothea — that fear about other women is just your NV’s stepping up. You’re a strong-willed, powerful woman and you can quash them if you want to…but your LI adores you and it sounds like you’re really getting the hang of this stuff.

    I think you haven’t nothing to worry about with other women…if he loves you and you’re being vulnerable with him, he’s just not going to give these other women the time of day, don’t you think?

  66.  #66dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    yeah i’m just scaaared and insecure. weeeeee fun lol

  67.  #67Jennifer on August 14, 2010 at 7:11 pm

    I feel frustrated. STILL no action on the dating sites.
    I see a couple of guys who look interesting but thier profiles are soooooooo short there’s practically nothing i can think of to say to them first.
    There are no roses to send or any such thing
    I’ve got one of them looking at me…but not sending any messages.
    Maybe my simple pleasures list comes off as overly simplified.
    I feel giving up
    I feel annoyed
    I want men to contact ME
    I want cool men with intrests, with hobbies and stuff they like that isn’t “going to the gym and riding my motorcycle and watching hockey”
    I want a man who reads and cooks and knows stuff
    Like usefull stuff.
    I feel like snobby
    I feel sooooooooooooooo bored with this
    How long have I been bitching about this same thing?
    Im thinking about what I am going to do for ME tomorrow…ME ME ME
    Maybe a pedicure
    Maybe something else…I don’t know yet.

  68.  #68dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 7:14 pm

    Jennifer, I wonder what would happen if you just copy and pasted your last comment into your dating profile, and just left that there as the contents of your profile… i like it for some reason. loads of authenticity in there and openness with your feelings.

  69.  #69Jennifer on August 14, 2010 at 7:17 pm

    Well, since there is nowhere to go down from zero contact I assume I would then be the subject of snotty emails from men.
    No action is better than harrassments, yes?
    I feel afraid of that.
    I feel afraid to be attacked verbally by men.
    I’m invisible now…but it’s safer.

  70.  #70dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 7:21 pm

    yeah verbal attacks would feel yucky. i’m just curious.

  71.  #71Jennifer on August 14, 2010 at 7:23 pm

    Invisible is safer
    Cause men might attack me
    Cause that’s what men do?
    Drunk daddy men
    and bad touch cousins
    and B sometimes too
    and random guys who say mean things to me
    like “where is the beautiful girl”
    and “You ARE ugly aren’t you”
    and “Ewww”
    Invisible hurts but visibility is dangerous
    Invisibility is hurt that ends
    Danger from words and hands and loud voices and mean faces and laughing mean faces hurts worse
    I feel nauseated
    I feel tight in my head
    The muscles in my scalp
    I feel tight in my throat.
    I feel burning in my eyes
    I feel numb

  72.  #72Jennifer on August 14, 2010 at 7:26 pm

    My arms are numb
    Angry brother men who try to choke me
    and B who says he could smack me
    And throws a door slamming tantrum cause I had people over
    And turns to ice
    and leaves me alone
    and takes and takes
    lies and lies
    my face is numb

  73.  #73Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 7:29 pm

    Renee, RE: #63 – Yay! I’m happy for you that Dr. Feelgood is still feeling good about your upcoming date! Awesome!!!!!!!

    And I’m glad you have other good men in your circle, too!

    I wanted to CD this weekend, too. I am really looking forward to Bill on Monday, tho! He is a joy! He makes me laugh all the time!

    Isn’t it fun to rob the cradle? I loved it with Ryan being 15 yrs younger! It was such a compliment that a handsome young man was attracted to me! He turned me into a cougar.

    Bill is one year younger and that feels comfortable too. I want him to manhandle me! LOL!

  74.  #74Jennifer on August 14, 2010 at 7:29 pm

    I feel furious

  75.  #75Janice on August 14, 2010 at 7:30 pm

    I’m so frustrated! I am a member of several dating sites and the only men that contact me are not in the slightest bit desirable. I know Rori says on her Siren CD’s that we can learn from men like this, but some of them are so disgusting! Also, are we really NOT supposed to make the first move on dating sites? Are men truely turned off by this? I’m just supposed to sit around and wait? Help!!!

  76.  #76Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 7:33 pm


    Your reaction to Dorothea’s suggestion is sad feelings but beautiful healing. I really like her idea. What about trying it as a one or two day experiment? That particular post struck me as a notable piece of writing, too.

    May I please have your recipe for peanut butter cheesecake? ! ? ! Mmmmm! I told Bill my drug of choice is cheesecake!

  77.  #77Brenda on August 14, 2010 at 7:35 pm


    You are a beautiful cheesecake loving Diva! Even tho we have two different personalities, I really enjoy your zany self! Any developments with your Judo instructor?

  78.  #78janjune on August 14, 2010 at 8:03 pm

    those are some beautiful, authentic triggers you are having girlfriend!
    oh yeh!

    you are beautiful and there is going to be a kind, loving, emotionally generous man who is going to snap you up and live your Happy Ever After with you!

    love, janjune

  79.  #79janjune on August 14, 2010 at 8:05 pm

    hey brenda,
    you are a hoot!

    loving reading your comments…

  80.  #80Renee on August 14, 2010 at 8:20 pm

    I’ve never dated anyone who’s 9 years younger than me and I don’t know how I feel about it…it’s alluring on the one hand (there is the stamina issue, lol) but it’s also dating out of my comfort zone.

    I appreciate the man’s willingness to “step up” though…he just started emailing me yesterday, today we progressed to txt and then a phone call and he’s already asked if he could see me sometime this week — now THAT’s the kind of stepping up I like! Indy guy and Dr. Feelgood better watch out — this guy’s local and seems ready to go the distance! That feels good:-).

    I’m feeling peaceful and full of my feminity…all Goddessy and confident in my ability to attract a good quality man…and there are 3 others who are somewhat intriguing who’ve written me today who I haven’t even had the time to write back yet…things are good.

    G’night, you lovely, supportive sirens you — I appreciate the opportunity I’ve been given here to vent, to get advice and to get encouragement…I’m so thankful I came across this site!

  81.  #81janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:04 pm

    oh yeh!

    i just tell ’em upfront, first time they bring it up, and they ALWAYS bring it up nearly immediately, it makes me laugh, they’re like “i gotta know whether im gettin any….i gotta know RIGHT *NOW* dammit.”
    no, i just get it out of the way,
    “NO,” i tell them, “i don’t sleep with men. i want to wait until i am married.”
    invariably they ask, “you mean you aren’t *ever* going to sleep with anyone unless you’re married to them?”
    me: “well, i can’t say that for absolute sure, you know ‘never say never’, but i don’t plan to.
    i want to wait, even though i was kinda wild when i was younger and have been married, i still want to wait because i want it to be special between just me and my husband.”

    that seems to answer so many questions for them.
    they seem to be able to figure out in less than what, oh say, *8* seconds what they think about that!!

    there have been a few men who turned on their heel and couldn’t get away from me fast enough…..:) like oooohhhhh no, i want some pu**y………..bye!
    i just think “oh God, thank you for me not having to go through what i would have had to go through with him.”

    but most men don’t do that generally they have enough other things they like about you to keep them interested.
    plus, i have noticed they actually seem to like these things:
    1. a female who can make a decision for what she feels is her wellbeing
    2. i think they are sooo much more aware than women that we *all* have a right to make our own choices whether someone else likes our choice or not.
    most men do try to be their own man and so the men i have been with and had this discussion with seem find it very easy to relate to a female who makes up her own mind about what is in her best interest and sticks to it.
    3. i think there are men who relax when you say you won’t sleep with them because they feel like if they did marry you they wouldn’t have to worry about you running around on them.
    4, and i’ve even had one man say,,,,(this was a long time ago) but he said
    “ummm, yes, and he’ll know you’re clean”.

    i understand that this type of man wouldn’t be right for every goddess, but this type of man, the one who accepts and respects the fact that i have chosen to not have sex with men until i’m married IS very much the right type of man for me.

  82.  #82janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:14 pm

    i wonder where my comments are going.
    i’m losing them….hmmmm

  83.  #83Renee on August 14, 2010 at 9:16 pm

    Janjune — If there are any curse words in them, they could be stuck in moderation. Otherwise, I don’t know what’s happening to them. Good luck!

  84.  #84dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:20 pm

    also saying j*sus flags moderation. lol

  85.  #85janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    well, i guess all good goddesses are out cd’ing tonight like we’re supposed to….

    i’ll get there eventually.

    still healing.

    i found my center tonight.

    it feels like the place rori describes that men enjoy being with us in.

  86.  #86janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    oh, yes there were!
    i was trying to disguise them with $$$ !!!, but theyre probably onto that by now

    let me try it

    f*ck la!d i can’t think of any of the other ones.


    there i think that was it

  87.  #87janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    im going to try the other one you said beetlejuice with on the next comment and see if it comes up

  88.  #88dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:38 pm

    beetlejuice is j*sus’ third cousin.

    i dated myself tonight. am focusing on myself these days. yeahhh. been stuck for some reason, not wanting to wash my face or brush my teeth. i’m going to get off my bum right now and wash my pretty goddess face.

  89.  #89janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:52 pm


    i said
    I love J____
    and it came up on my screen on the blog but it doesn have
    your comment is awaiting moderation over the comment.

  90.  #90janjune on August 14, 2010 at 9:53 pm

    well, lost another one!!!!!!!

    i think beetlejuice is in my computer tonight!

  91.  #91dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:54 pm

    i wonder what else triggers the censors. please excuse the following experimenting .it’s sat night and there’s hardly anyone here anyway.

  92.  #92dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:55 pm


  93.  #93dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:55 pm


  94.  #94dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:57 pm


  95.  #95dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 9:59 pm

    well, f*ck and j*sus are definitely always moderated. i’m running out of ideas for offensive words.

    sorry, moderator, for the vulgar onslaught.

  96.  #96janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:01 pm

    well, i got four words here

    c, s, f, g

    so those aren’t triggering it

  97.  #97dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    abortion suicide christ hitler lady gaga

  98.  #98dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 10:06 pm


  99.  #99dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 10:06 pm


  100.  #100dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 10:08 pm

    i wonder if racial slurs trigger moderation, but i don’t feel comfortable upsetting anyone here by saying them.

  101.  #101girl on August 14, 2010 at 10:09 pm

    Thanks for the feedback ladies. And Dorothea, if my scenario/voice sounds familiar, it’s cause I am using a different name – I recommended this site to a friend, and would prefer if she didn’t recognize my name/situation – hopefully, buried in the mix she won’t pick up on it.

    I’m feeling resistance right now – he’s about to come pick me up to go to his place, and I feel ick. which is weird – when did i start feeling this way?? I feel ick thinking about him touching me in the water (we’re going swimming) once, we had sex in his pool and it was super hot, but I’m not feeling it. Mostly, it’s a physical issue – I feel turned off by his belly. what do I do with this?? I know he wants to lose it. And I know that I would hate to feel like a man was turned off by my body. But I just don’t feel like getting close.

    At first, I wasn’t so concerned with how I “felt” – in the sense that I didn’t let myself really consider it. I knew that I felt secure, and so from there, I took care of the relationship. I treated him like “my beloved” – I did what I could to make his life a little better each day. Sometimes that would mean giving (especially when he was recovering from surgery) and sometimes it would mean receiving. The result was that I was showered with love and attention, and he, his family and friends perceive me as “very very sweet.” lately, I’ve taken a step back and am gauging how I feel, and it’s easy to say “i’m not feeling it” – and then I don’t feel like treating him all that well. And then he responds in a sort of needy way and I feel less and less inspired. I feel myself spiraling away from the relationship, back to singledom, and I don’t know that I would end up in a far different mode if I found some other man with rock hard abs.

    So, tonight, as an experiment, I’m going to remind myself that it doesn’t really matter “who” I’m in a relationship with – but the relationship provides me with an opportunity to love and be loved. I’m going to embrace the opportunity to love (as a verb) him regardless of how I feel (introverted and turned off), and see if by making a conscious choice to take care of the relationship, if I can get back to feeling invested and involved in the relationship…

    I’m going to make room in my heart for him and I’m going to be willing to love him back.
    Aaah…this feels scary. This conscious choice was easier to make when we were just getting started – cause I was taking something neutral and making it positive. Now I’m taking something negative in hopes of making it positive. I have a hunch that this is what commitment is…loving no matter what. I feel inner resistance and I feel myself giving in…I’ve been single basically my whole life – I have a tendency to withdraw..I see that this is an opportunity to reverse something that doesn’t serve me very well. Wish me luck!

  102.  #102janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    oh well, my comments are just kind of “trail of healing”… using this forum to track the process.

    also love love love the other goddesses comments. so clarifying.

    so, was trying to send a hug and a big air kiss to the goddesses and to rori… here it is again
    look out! mmmmmmmwah!

  103.  #103janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:14 pm


    i hear noises outside!
    i feel scared.

  104.  #104janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:18 pm

    good luck girl with your experiment tonight!

  105.  #105janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:24 pm

    well, let’s see, i don’t feel like not being on here anymore

    i feel chatty tonight….
    chattin it up

    i think i just feel good about finding my center which has been missing a long LONG time.

  106.  #106janjune on August 14, 2010 at 10:26 pm

    the other day, yesterday i think, i wanted to get on here and record the fact that as i stood in the kitchen doing whatever i realized i liked myself!
    not for this or that or for anything special i did or because someone complimented me but just in general.
    boy, that’s a new one.

  107.  #107dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 10:39 pm

    girl, i am drawing a blank but it feels exciting to know that a familiar siren is among us!

  108.  #108Lucy on August 14, 2010 at 11:05 pm

    on pof im they won’t let you type the word “account.” It shows up as *******. isn’t that weird???

  109.  #109dorothea on August 14, 2010 at 11:10 pm

    that is totally weird, lucy.

  110.  #110Lucy on August 14, 2010 at 11:15 pm

    i noticed that as bad as I have been feeling about not hearing from wh – it has not triggered abandonment or shame or even rejection issues as has happened in the past. i haven’t gotten all down on myself about it. i have mostly been baffled – like genuinely surprised that he isn’t tripping all over himself to get me cuz i’m really believiing that i am an awesome woman and if he wakes up and smells the coffee he’ll be thumping himself on the forehead saying “i coulda had lucy!” I really feel like I am his

  111.  #111Lucy on August 14, 2010 at 11:17 pm

    his dream girl but there’s a cloud in the way so he doesn’t quite see it yet. this is a big change of attitude and self-esteem for me!

  112.  #112Lucy on August 14, 2010 at 11:26 pm

    also, within five minutes of meeting him, when i got into his car and saw his hot manly hairy thighs just below his cool-guy shorts and stretching down to the gas pedal – i had to catch my breath and thought FINALLY a guy who turns me on just lookin at him. mmmm mmmm mmmmmmmm! just remembering the goodnight kiss now makes me instantly wet.

  113.  #113janjune on August 15, 2010 at 12:22 am

    sorry if my lost comments all pop up, i’ve retyped them so they probably are in moderation or something but im not getting the flag that they are and i want to record this for my self:

    as for sex,
    i just tell them from the beginning that i don’t have sex with men. i want to wait until im married.
    a few have turned around and headed for the door.
    but that’s okay, i figure it saved me alot of problems/ heartaches.

    Mostly, men just don’t really seem to mind that much. it just doesn’t seem to be a deal breaker.
    they’re always curious, they always want me to clarify, do I mean I won’t *ever* go to bed with a man until i’m married or do i mean I would if we were engaged or just what do i mean.
    i tell them upfront that “I don’t have any plans to have sex with someone until i’m married. that doesn’t mean it won’t happen, but I’m planning not to. because even though i was kind of wild when i was young and have been married, i still want that to be something special between just me and my husband when i get married.”
    this seems to answer so many questions for them, they can infer for instance:
    1. yes, i like sex….i said i was wild when i was younger.
    1 1/2. i’m open to marriage.
    2. i will make my husband special when we are married
    which is what they, we all, are looking for in a mate, so i think they see the possibility of the promise of emotional fulfillment due to the fact that they can see a female looking ahead, planning ahead to make a man special within a future relationship.
    2 1/2. i think men really understand and like a female who is willing to do this for a man even if that man isn’t going to be him. they still like you for caring about whoever that man is going to be. this has been my experience that they just like the idea of you reserving something for that special man you are going to be with.
    2 3/4. i also think that these same men won’t like you any less if you DO have sex with them.
    but they won’t drop you just because you don’t.
    2 7/8. i wouldn’t spend time with a man who judged me either for
    having sex with him
    or not having sex with him.
    3. i think a man who has grown into what i want a man to be if imgoing to spend time in his presence knows the value in delayed gratification. he has, in his career or family, put off things in the now for just the chance, even the mere possibility, of gaining something he really really wants in the future.
    4. i think men are more willing to gamble on getting a good relationship, regardless of whether we sleep with them or not, than we generally realize.
    5. i think men will spend considerable time and effort and of his resources of all kinds on a woman he sees as valuable, whether she sleeps with him or not.
    6. i think that’s why men want resources, to lavish them upon the women in his life if he determines her to be worthy, whether she sleeps with him or not.
    7. i think they like and respect women who can make decisions that further their (the woman’s) well being. whether they like that decision or not is very often, in my experiences with men, irrelevant to whether they want to continue to be around me or not.
    i think this is all very interesting.
    that so many men won’t walk away if you won’t have sex with them.
    i feel very confident and unafraid to tell men that i don’t have sex because i’ve had very good experiences with them accepting it and still wanting to spend time together.

  114.  #114janjune on August 15, 2010 at 12:29 am

    2 7/8. i wouldn’t spend time with a man who judged me *NEGATIVELY* either for
    having sex with him
    or not having sex with him.

  115.  #115janjune on August 15, 2010 at 12:32 am

    all this is stirring me.

    im thinking about different men in my past that i’d like a do over with!

  116.  #116janjune on August 15, 2010 at 1:10 am

    got to get over that!

    do overs aren’t permitted.

    i am wondering though how some of my past relationships might have been different if i had
    1. liked myself at the time. regardless of why or how it happened, if you don’t see your own value, it’s going to reflect in your relationships. i know there were at least two men who i didn’t let value me because i wasn’t in touch with my value. i see it now, that they saw my value, but i just couldn’thandle it at the\ time.
    i felt too unworthy of receiving.

    2. known how to find my center.
    i always felt “off-balance”, too much moving about (emotionally) based on what other people wanted aka people pleasing.
    3. had had the guts to treat the men i loved the way i wanted to treat them.
    there were times i feel i should have responded with acceptance of men who were genuinely trying to touch me but i was too scared and didn’t know how to do it either.

    i feel so much more capable now.

    i hope to meet many wonderful men who will accomplany me on my Bridge to Happy Ever After.

    i look forward to meeting a kind, generous, well-balanced, strong, soft on the inside strong on the outside man who is up for the journey together.

    i am excited about knowing how to detect abuse of all kinds and knowing i am going to be there for myself.
    oh this is good. thank you rori for being so generous to share your knowledge with us.
    i haven’t been able to buy anything but the ebook, but with rori’s newsletters and posts and the goddesses comments, has come so much healing.
    i feel so grateful.
    i feel tears.
    i feel so healed up and over.
    i feel wholeness and cohesiveness and confidence and assurance.

    i feel like i can handle the things i need to deal with without feeling so overwhelmed.
    and that there will be room in my life for someone special who we will have fun together and enjoy pancakes in the morning with the sunshine streaming in and he’ll be sharing his plans for the day with me and we’ll go about our business taking care of things and then be glad to see each other in the evening. best friends.
    commitment choosing each other because we want to.

  117.  #117Diana on August 15, 2010 at 2:37 am

    Dear Jasmine,

    I felt I loved him and when a friend asked me why I said: its fun to be with him, we talk about interesting things…and went on. Then I realized that what I really loved was the me that I became when he is with me. I am fun! I am interesting, i feel beautiful, sexy, magical. In his presence, all of this things about me just pop out! And they don’t with other men.
    Special things about me, even things I was not aware of pop out and I simply love that woman!

  118.  #118Daria on August 15, 2010 at 2:48 am

    I recognize you girl!

    and i’m still relating with your situation, felt a nip of fear that it might come on stronger in full force

    hope Rori can help us with this. my huge fear of intimacy because of this feleing too




    what IS that feeling

  119.  #119Daria on August 15, 2010 at 2:51 am

    Apple Jacks i totally feel you girl – i feel like that right now about a new man and freakin i can imagine feeling even MORe like that in your situation

  120.  #120Daria on August 15, 2010 at 2:55 am

    girl – Circular Dating girl , but I think you will see on your own

  121.  #121Renee on August 15, 2010 at 5:42 am

    Diana — I can totally related to what you’re saying. I have very different sides of my personality…sometimes I’m quiet and reserved…other times I’m outgoing and playful…I like the people most who bring out my outgoing, playful side.

    Last night I talked to a guy for the first time who really made me laugh — I felt fun, funny and playful. I’m really looking forward to meeting him because I like the side of my personality he brings out.

    I’ve realized just through this post that I think the reserved, quiet side of my personality is boring…I love my quiet boring side as well as my fun, outgoing side…but I enjoy my fun, outgoing side more:-).

  122.  #122Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:15 am


    That is so beautiful! I don’t know Bill all that well yet, but every time I see him or think of him I break into a huge grin!

    Janjune, thanks for the kudos! I appreciate what you wrote about waiting til marriage!

    Girl, How did your date go last night?

  123.  #123Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:19 am


  124.  #124Jennifer on August 15, 2010 at 8:51 am

    Hey Brenda and Jajune
    Thanks for support.
    Brenda my birthday IS Aug 20th, it’s my first without B in 6 years…I don’t know how that’s gonna go.
    Of course…he DID have a tendency to screw me over on my Bday.
    One year I threw myself a cheesecake soiree…at the local coffee and dessert place and he did’t show up. So there I was, family and friends and NO boyfriend.
    He said he didn’t come cause he didn’t feel included.
    Like what am I supposed to do? Kiss his A$$ on MY Bday?
    Any way
    The recipe for peanut butter cheesecake is super easy.
    Use the recipe for no bake cheesecake…instead of two bricks of cream cheese, use one and a half and replace the half with peanut butter.
    While whipping the cream cheese and peanut butter together add a little brown sugar.
    I use A good quality strawberrry jam as topping.

  125.  #125Apple Jacks on August 15, 2010 at 8:54 am

    Thank you Daria. 🙂 Means a lot to me.

  126.  #126Apple Jacks on August 15, 2010 at 9:04 am

    I suddenly feel an early memory sparked when I was a little girl. I used to talk to the moon. 🙂 I just realized I always had a love affair with the moon. Maybe I should try saying hello again tonight. I’ve always been so fanciful. I feel a longing for that again.

  127.  #127Laughing goddess on August 15, 2010 at 9:28 am

    AJ: I feel resonance with your above post. I feel so great when I am connected to the magic of the universe. Yum! (to quote Daria 🙂

  128.  #128dorothea on August 15, 2010 at 10:12 am

    i am feeling angry
    i feel like losing my temper
    i lost my temper a little bit
    maybe a lot bit.
    i dunno
    time to just
    and get to work.

    or something.

    aaahhhhh i feel like an alien in my own body right now.

  129.  #129Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 10:20 am

    Apple Jacks, you said:

    “But, I’m afraid of the after. Not necessarily his reaction, but mine. What if one time is not enough for me? What if I want it over and over and over? What if I get really attached? What if I cry a lot? I feel I’m going crazy if I don’t and I’ll go crazy if I do and it’s making me feel withdrawn. Thank you to anyone who can help, and my apologies for the long, slightly melodramatic post.”

    My advice is just relax and let go. Worrying won’t get you anywhere. Billions of people have sex everyday, it’s just a natural phase of adulthood.

    What if you want it over and over? Good. I did and do LOL… What if you cry, then you cry…it’s not the end of the world. If you stop overanalyzing and let just things unfold the way they do at any given moment, you’ll be surprised…

    Don’t have any expectation. Be all zen about this. Yes it might hurt a bit if it’s your first time, but there are things that hurt much more like giving birth and women still do it :D. But if you relax and have the right mind set, everything is gonna be alright.

  130.  #130Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Apple Jacks, now I know you’re Muslim I understand the internal conflict. You know, a lot of Muslims have pre-marital sex…not that what you have to follow what’s trendy. It just shows sex is really natural, those with or without strict upbringing are going to do it at one point in their lives.

    I don’t agree with religions that restrict full expression of human sexuality and portray it in worst light, thank God I wasn’t brought up in that kind of environment -not in my family, at least :). I think that’s a means of mind control. But Sufism should be more gentle about these things.

  131.  #131janjune on August 15, 2010 at 10:32 am

    omg jennifer

    that cheescake recipe!!!!
    i feel mouth watering.
    i feel drooling.

    An early HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!

  132.  #132Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 10:39 am

    Simply Shannon, you said:

    “I completely agree with Mercedes. It feels so important to create intimacy (truthfulness, safety, love/caring, etc.) BEFORE I become sexually intimate. Yes, I can have sex for sex only. But for me that kind of sex is just animal gratification. It doesn’t spark in me any kind of connection or generate love sensations. It’s like eating a fast food meal. It satisfies for awhile but ultimately it’s not really what I’m looking for.”

    I don’t disagree with this assertion. But sex can mean different things at different times. Some days I just want fast food, some days I want gourmet. 🙂 Some days simple animal gratification is more than enough -and more than I can handle. I don’t want to be serious with every guy I (want to) have sex either, surprise…surprise.

    Sex can be very satisfying this way too, at least for me. That’s the magic of living in the moment, you don’t have to attach sex to any future agenda at all times.

    At the same time sex within a committed relationships isn’t always great as I have experienced. How many married couples give up sex or find their sex lives ho-hum? Even when they are so emotionally connected and in love with each other?

    Exactly, my point.

    Sex is never one-dimensional. It has and offers a full range of expression and experience. That’s the beauty of it.

  133.  #133dorothea on August 15, 2010 at 10:42 am

    sometimes i lose my temper because i feel turned off and i don’t want to admit to myself or the man that i feel turned off. now why is that?

    oh, Self, reveal yourself unto me!

  134.  #134janjune on August 15, 2010 at 10:47 am

    apple jacks,
    i would love to hear about your love affair with the moon if you want to share
    that sounds so deep and feminine and goddessy.

    my love affair is with the sun
    the blazing hot brilliant prismy reflective clearing sun!
    the hot the heat the cleansing the purifying

    but the moon sounds very very interesting

    i would like to vibe in the moonbeams the way i do in the sumbeams

    i am going to make some i forget what it’s called so i’ll call it moon water to set out tonight.
    you put water in a glass gallon jug, cover the top with something to keep bugs out and set the jug out overnight in the moonlight.
    it tastes different than regular water in the way that sun tea tastes different than regular tea.
    something about the different energy sources…

  135.  #135janjune on August 15, 2010 at 10:52 am

    katarina phang,

    loving your posts

  136.  #136Jacqueline on August 15, 2010 at 10:55 am

    The first time I had sex was definitely with a gentleman.

    He not only sat back down when I’d told him he could go “do” my friend in the back seat of the other car, two weeks later in her house he’d moved a heavy chest of drawers 1 foot over so we could do it for my first time. I remember there being very little blood, and my friend still screaming, “gotta wash the sheets!” It was nice, it felt “full.” And hey it defined the 70’s.

    In a way many young generation women can’t imagine, we were finding our way and sex was both a form of intimacy and a form of power and control It’s the untold story of the “psyche of no repercussions” way woman’s lib was successful.

    We claimed a form of Independence that swung the pendulum so far in a direction it would never again be repeated.

    And we called it, “The Age of Aquarius.”

    This is sthe start of a short story this listing triggered in me – some of us were raised “sl****,” and some of us had mothers that tried hard, but a LOT of us grew up in a time when women still weren’t supposed to call boys but it was perfectly all right to sleep with as many of them as you wanted to. Before AIDS and the wrath it caused, there was a little bit of Janis Joplin in all of us.

    But it’s funny because the debate is still raging! Today’s “hook ups” are kind of a return to that time, to me. And women are still trying to figure out whether it gets them power or gives their power away.

    Very interesting discussion, I love how on track it’s been and how many different directions/opinions are being honored!

    I believe it all comes down to you – once again – atttitude is everything. I’ve had 3 4+ year relationships that started with a “one” night stand, and I’ve held out for marriage. Honestly, I could never see that either way it made a long term difference. Honor ourselves to the best of our truth may be the best we can do?

    Happy day!


  137.  #137girl on August 15, 2010 at 11:11 am

    Experiment was okay – he seemed more confident, which was more attractive, and things were feeling good again. until it came to sex. So then the question of this blog (How important is sex?) took on a new meaning…how important is it to ME that I want to have sex with him???
    He asked me if something was wrong, and I said no, but he could see on my face that I felt yucked out about sex, so he stopped. Which is nice of him, and I appreciate that he is sensitive about stuff like that. But I like to like sex. When I’m on top, sex with him feels pretty amazing. When I he’s on top, I feel totally icked out.
    Later we both talked about how we want to lose weight, and he seems determined to get into shape, so maybe the issue will take care of itself.

    Daria, yeah, I guess I am veering towards circular dating – cause I’m feeling curious about whether i can feel more turned on AND feel safe and good. But maybe I’ll just be reminded of how lucky I am to be with a great guy who takes care of me…or maybe I’ll find some hunk who’s even a better fit. But I guess what I’m looking for is a feeling of certainty, and perhaps circular dating will help with that. Although, I don’t feel good about breaking away from him to do this. I don’t want to hurt him!
    what can I say???


    Baby, I appreciate you and I enjoy your company so much – I feel secure and safe and good. But all of this has happened very fast, and now that we’re talking about moving in together, and having a future together, I’m beginning to feel uncertain. I don’t want to commit unless I feel 100% sure. I feel worried that if I don’t explore this uncertainty now, that it will taint our relationship moving forward. Right now, it feels good to keep my options open – it feels good to keep dating until I feel 100% about commitment. What do you think?

  138.  #138janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:13 am

    apple jacks,
    but here’s the thing…you haven’t done it before so at this point you have no way of really knowing that sex has a range
    it can feel sacred
    it can feel bonding
    it can feel animalistic
    it can feel liberating
    it can feel demeaning

    it is used to share and give pleasure
    get pleasure

    and can also be used to rob people of their self worth.

    it, in and of itself is, the purely physical act itself, is a natural and primitive and intuitive and pre=programmed act.

    but then other meanings can be attached to it.

    a lover attaches his/her love and adoration to it
    a rapist. power
    the feelings that are attached, in the human mind, to the act of sex run the gamut from the sacred to the debased.

    so, as with most things, i am now finding,
    any act or action
    i do or have done to me seems subject to how i take it,
    the way i interpret it.

    we have more power of our own choices than we are led to believe we do.

    i feel rori figured that out and is sharing that with us.

    love, janjune

  139.  #139girl on August 15, 2010 at 11:15 am

    Dorothea – #132: I do that too!! It’s funny – like I want to spare the guy the truth, but not my wrath

  140.  #140Apple Jacks on August 15, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Hey guys,

    want to reply to all just got a family crisis to ward off. I’ll be back. Thanks to all of you for being so encouraging! 🙂

    Katarina, I would love to discuss more in depth with you about this outside. Could you email me? My address is Anyone please feel free to email if you’d like. I’ll be right back. 😉

  141.  #141Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 11:23 am

    katarina, many of us have already experienced and enjoyed all the things you are describing sexually – being in the moment, growing past conditioning, etc. – and now our personal evolution and awareness is taking us to what (we deem for us) is a higher level of consciousness, enlightenment and awakening. <3 Lucy

  142.  #142Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Girl, RE: #136 – Excellent feeling message! Go fer it!

  143.  #143Rori Raye on August 15, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Janice – I’ve got a full instruction sheet how to work…a fine way to make moves without making moves… coming up in about 10 days…Love, Rori

  144.  #144janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:26 am

    hi jacqueline,

    very sage observation:

    “And women are still trying to figure out whether it gets them power or gives their power away.”

  145.  #145Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:29 am

    Janjune, RE: #137 – That is really deep and beautiful what you wrote! You could actually turn that into a poem!!!

  146.  #146janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:30 am

    hi lucy,

    your comment #141–

    “– and now our personal evolution and awareness is taking us to what (we deem for us) is a higher level of consciousness, enlightenment and awakening. <3 Lucy"

    i felt "Yes!! this is it!!" when i read your comment!

    thank you for that.

  147.  #147Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:33 am

    Janjune and Jacqueline,

    So which is it? Does sex give or take away our power as women?

  148.  #148Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 11:35 am

    Lucy, sex is something very basic and instinctive. You can want higher level of consciousness and all but you will see your basic make-up still wants that “debased” part of the sex…

    …which is okay.

    Both are intertwined and shouldn’t be mutually exclusive. That’s why I’m more in tune with eastern religions which understand human nature much more wholesomely than the no-sex-outside-marriage monotheism.

    Can we accept our human conditions? I do.

  149.  #149Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:36 am

    This blog is addicting! Boot me out of here so I do my housework!!!

    I found out it wasn’t nerd who called last night. It was 62. They both have the same names. So I just returned his call and got his voicemail. When I heard his last name on his greeting, I was glad I found out that way cuz I treat 62 much differently than nerd. I will go out with 62 as a friend.

    Tell Brenda to quit procrastinating!!

  150.  #150Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 11:37 am

    Brenda, you can only give your power away. Nobody can take it from us. We have a choice.

  151.  #151Rori Raye on August 15, 2010 at 11:39 am

    Hi all – saw your experiment! Yes, the words Jesus and lovely, colorful variations around sexual words and some others will land you in moderation (I know none of us want well-written sexual spam or comments designed for more specifically religious sites going through…I sort of have no choice). If I know you – I’ll pass your comment right through (but I only can get to the queue once a day sometimes, so please be patient….)! Love, Rori

  152.  #152janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:39 am

    thank you brenda.
    that feels validating.

    i love your feisty robust spirit!you are modeling the way i want to be able to handle myself… love your sense of the humorous in situations where you are being prodded to anger.
    love how when being accused of something you didn’t mean you just parrot back to what you DO mean that is obvious to everyone but the person trying to goad you.
    just love it. 🙂
    thanks for sharing your Self here.

  153.  #153Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:39 am


    I am delighted with all your posts! I am a born again Christian. Oh, you’d be surprised what they teach us these days! Bwahhahahahaha! LOL!

  154.  #154Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:42 am

    Katarina!!! Superb answer!!! I love it!

  155.  #155Rori Raye on August 15, 2010 at 11:42 am

    wow, Brenda – what a fascinating question re sex and power…answer is neither. That’s like saying does eating give or take away power. Or walking or running, or kissing. Sex is simply a hugely powerful experience on so many levels if you really let yourself go…so whether the experience feels good before, during and after is for you to discover – and it’s totally specific to the man and the moment! Love, Rori

  156.  #156Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:43 am


    Your experiment with moderation-triggering words is a howl! I got a kick out of that!!!!


    I love how you word things! Thank you so much for your encouraging, uplifting words!!!

  157.  #157janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:43 am

    well, goddesses, gotta go,
    this looks lke its going to be a very lively day on the Blog!!!

  158.  #158Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Rori, it was originally Jacqueline’s question, but thank you for yet another superb answer!!!

    You rock, Rori! I love you! You changed my life!!!

  159.  #159Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 11:46 am

    Brenda, tell me all about it! 😀 You seem too sexual to be a born again Christian. Or probably that’s why? You need an external “control” to your libido LOL..?

    And thanks for liking my posts.

  160.  #160janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:49 am

    apple jacks,

    when i used the word debased when referring to sex in my comments to you i was referring to the acts of rape or other forcable acts that one person commits sexually against another person against their will

  161.  #161janjune on August 15, 2010 at 11:54 am

    just wanted to clarify that!

    sending love to all the goddesses and rori

  162.  #162Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 11:57 am


    When I reached age 32 and was still a virgin, because I wasn’t married yet, it felt like a curse, not a blessing.

    My Mom had tried to poison me against men to protect me from all the hurt she had endured. I finally said f*ck it and had sex with a man I had just met that day.

    I experimented here and there with it for another 5 or so years and then I started throwing caution to the wind and went to sex clubs and made sex dates off the net and went the opposite direction for 3-4 years. I have had a vast amount of sexual experience, some good, some bad.

    Last year I met a man, Ryan, who brought me back to my original ideals. He developed the relationship gradually, with just light sex play (oral, hand). I really dug it that he was far more interested in getting to know my heart and my spirit.

    I could say far more about sex, and I will if you want, because I can’t say I fully regret going wild with it, but I came full circle and decided that anything that makes me that vulnerable needs to be protected with a commitment. But I had enough scares that I just didn’t want to keep playing Russian roullette.

    I see Apple Jack’s situation and I think she needs to break through and experience herself fully as a woman, if she chooses.

    Overall, I believe everyone has a right to believe, feel, and think the way they want to, because God gave us a free will.

    I feel very good about returning to my no sex until marriage belief. But I can read what you write in your liberation and totally go there with you, because I experienced much the same.

    Don’t know if I gave enuff detail to sound coherent. I guess I am at peace with it.

    I believe sex and vulnerability go hand in hand and when I give that to a man, it is a huge gift of myself that I don’t want to be taken for granted.

    One of the ugliest things a man ever said to me is, “It’s just sex, honey.”

    But I could really relate to what you said. Sometimes I want it to feel slow motion sacred and holy and an act of worship and sometimes I want to f*ck like a wild animal!!!

  163.  #163Jacqueline on August 15, 2010 at 12:06 pm

    Whooooweee, Brenda – that sounds so liberated! and makes me feel good that we can coexist with our idea of sex like the boys say, and sex like a sacred gift. I have never answered the does it give power or take away, it does both I think. And I feel lucky in that I had a mother that gave me a book on having your period, and that was that, period. hahhaaa…..I came to sex with NO preconceived notions and was taught everything by men I knew – and luckily those men/boys were good guys. God watches over drunks and fools? smile…

    and thanks for the credit, too – your personality is so many layers deep the things you say and do never cease to surprise me! and your onion self is peeling away layers and looking like a white rose instead.

    Think of that! the next time you talk to your Bill!

    xoxo all,

  164.  #164Jacqueline on August 15, 2010 at 12:20 pm

    Okay, I answered my question for myself – IF I can quiet the “negative voices” – which I guess just came from non verbal mother communication and society at large- it gives me power to use and express my sexuality. If the voices are so ingrained in my unconcious/subconcious, it is a struggle to take power from it and sometimes feels humiliating, eg – gives the power away; but a good way to not allow that to happen is to choose your partner very wisely for you and your needs.

    I think that’s why we were all so worried about Anikita’s story – i.e., maybe we felt she didn’t choose wisely and it would end up trashing her; but I’m glad that since then she’s sounded good in her comments, as you all do today!

    Happy balloons to you all, whatever color you like!


  165.  #165Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    Jacqueline, RE: #164 – I feel deeply touched. You brought tears to my eyes. That is one of the sweetest things anyone ever said to me.

    Thank you from the bottom of the white rose blossom.


  166.  #166Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 12:29 pm

    Jacqueline, I’ll take a purple balloon. I was born in 64, so I was only a kid during the hippie revolution. Nevertheless, it deeply influenced me and I feel part of it. I still dig men with long hair, and that was something I loved about Ryan!

    My all time favorite artist is from that era, Larry Norman. He had long blonde hair and I was in love with him most of my life!

  167.  #167Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 1:55 pm

    Well we finally got our sex thread. Thanks, Rori.

    I just made my do list and flea bathed my German Shepherd daughers (pronounced “doggers”). So that’s a big one knocked off. Now I reward myself by swimming, which is also exercise.

    Swimming in the rain…I feel very Sireny…

  168.  #168dorothea on August 15, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    girl – i know who you is now. yay!

  169.  #169Apple Jacks on August 15, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    This is all very interesting everyone. Thank you…I’m taking it all in. janjune, I’ll get back to you with my moon affair. 🙂

  170.  #170Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 2:59 pm

    Brenda, I hear ya, sweets!

    These days, my husband and I are f*cking like animals while being very emotionally connected. How does that sound?

    Yes have the cake and eat it. 😀

  171.  #171Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 3:33 pm

    Go, Katarina, go! LOL! 😛

  172.  #172Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    I love sex, and I am really into waiting for a commitment. I want the deep innter intimacy first. If I sound self-contraDICKtory, I’m not. It just sounds that way. I have a method to my madness. I will love it when the subject cums up with Bill!

    I know myself well enuff to know I’m no prude. But I know the beauty and joy of cuddling and pillow talk…

    which will make the sex that much sweeter when the time cums.

  173.  #173Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 3:50 pm

    Apple Jacks — “I suddenly feel an early memory sparked when I was a little girl. I used to talk to the moon. 🙂 I just realized I always had a love affair with the moon. Maybe I should try saying hello again tonight. I’ve always been so fanciful. I feel a longing for that again.”

    OH! Me too!!

    You are going to LOVE this… A couple weekends ago I had the great privilege of seeing this artist’s work displayed at our town’s huge annual art show. His paintings touched the little girl inside me who STILL adores the moon and fairies and all things fanciful and magical. The one I loved the most — and could hardly pull myself away from — is “The Man in the Moon” on this page. I felt drawn into the picture because I used to do exactly what the girl in the painting is doing!

    I love all his work!

  174.  #174Katarina Phang on August 15, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    Brenda, I have learned sometimes the “obsessive wanting” is the problem. If you just let go, you’ll be surprised of what you might get.

  175.  #175Jennifer on August 15, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    I’m looking at this okcupid site you guys were mentioning..
    It’s kinda interesting.

  176.  #176Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    Lol, Katarina. “Lucy, sex is something very basic and instinctive. You can want higher level of consciousness and all but you will see your basic make-up still wants that “debased” part of the sex…”

    Most of that is “reporting the obvious” although I wouldn’t use the word “debased” because of what the word actually means…..

    Yes, it is all intertwined and not mutually exclusive — again, rather obvious.

    So I’m not sure where you are disagreeing, although you seem to be doing so.

    I am coming from a position of being in tune with eastern philosophies as well — and that is precisely from where my statements above flowed. Wholesome understanding and acceptance of human nature and the human condition — and the ability to grow and evolve to be true to our highest selves — including our sexuality.

  177.  #177Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    ‘i felt “Yes!! this is it!!” when i read your comment!’

    Thanks, Janjune. 🙂

  178.  #178Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    “You seem too sexual to be a born again Christian.”

    That feels weird to read. REALLY weird. Really icky.

    Um….. Christians are humans, humans are sexual. Humans have varying degrees of libido (and it can shift and change) — some humans have higher libido and activity than other humans…. what’s being a Christian have to do with it?


  179.  #179Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    “I still dig men with long hair”

    Mmmmm, Brenda. I touched WH’s hair — it was luscious. (It’s not long long, but it’s, ya know, longish — think Aragorn — Viggo Mortenson — in LOTR — not when it’s all dirty from battle tho lol — more like when he was wearing the crown at the very end. :)). Sigh. I would’ve touched it more, but I was “leaning back” — I wish now I wouldn’t have leaned back so much — I wish I woulda had my hands all up in that silky hair — if I get a chance again, I’m going for it! Yeah, I’m INTENDING to have a chance again, and I’m going for it!!!

    And even tho I have placed myself into the wait-til-marriage camp, I might change my mind when I get with winker hottie again. 🙂 But then again, I might not. I might wait til he marries me. 🙂

  180.  #180Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:04 pm

    Lucy, #180 – I love to smash stereotypes.

    I can understand this is the perception of most people. Some Christians, sadly, are stifled and won’t fess up to their deeper desires (and actions). I am not perfect, but I keep it real.

    God created G spots and clitorises. Sex was intended for pleasure. It’s a hush-hush subject among most Christians. I’m about opening it up and making it okay to have sexual desires and frustrations. Because we all have them. It’s just some people don’t admit them.

    I flow with my environment. I feel harmonious with God, and harmonious with my body. And I like the strength I’ve developed by controlling my sexual desires. I like feeling in charge of when I let my relationships go to that level…or not.

  181.  #181Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:08 pm

    Here’s Larry Norman’s contribution to the discussion…these are the lyrics to his song,

    Pardon Me

    Pardon me, kissing you like I’m afraid
    But I feel I’m being played with
    And you’ll leave me when you get the chance.

    Off you’ll go, in the darkness of the night
    Like a bird in freedom’s flight,
    You’re thinking only of deliverance.

    Close your eyes, and pretend that you are me.
    See how empty it can be
    Making love if love’s not really there.

    Watch me go, watch me walk away alone,
    As your clothing comes undone,
    And you pull the ribbon from your hair.
    Pardon me.

  182.  #182janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:15 pm

    hey brenda,

    “Janjune and Jacqueline,
    So which is it? Does sex give or take away our power as women?”

    rori said neither.

    i say both.

    because again, whether a man is misusing a female’s sexuality to gratify himself without her permission or whether we are just simply aware of our physical beauty: our beautiful breasts or shiny hair, gorgeous skin, eyes, legs, hands… we know there’s power in our sexuality by men’s powerful reactions to it.

    when i have used the power of sex to try to entice someone to love me who doesn’t or try to use it to make myself love someone i don’t, it feels like giving that power away.

    if have been true to myself, my values and the man i am with, i have felt the sexual relationship gave me power, both personally and within the relationship.

  183.  #183Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:19 pm


    Another stellar response, thank you!

    All I know is after “cheap” sex, where it was easy cum easy go, I am at a point where my body is sacred and I will only ever share it again with a man who cherishes me.

    In its highest form, I believe sex is a celebration of spirit connection between a man, a woman, and God. It is an act of worship to me from now on.

  184.  #184janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:20 pm

    but omething that feels even more important than that is feeling that those things aren’t even relevant anymore…

    because sex isn’t about that (power), even though our cultural conditioning leads us to believe it is.

    that’s why i love rori’s program so much because i do know, realize, understand that in my own life i am now in touch with the fact that relationships are about connection and not about power at all.

  185.  #185janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:26 pm

    yes brenda,

    the war of the sexes has been going on far too long, in my opinion.
    too much power struggling.
    not enough connection…

    in my heart and psyche, it’s about union not struggling for power against one another.

  186.  #186Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:31 pm

    Janjune, I totally agree. I just want to love my man.

    I am kinda old fashioned in some respects. I believe there needs to be a final decision maker in a relationship. I want my husband to discuss things with me, but when we are head to head, I will defer to him in a marriage.

    Funny now, thinking about calling Bill a b*tch and a PITA (Pain in the A$$)! LOL! I meant no disrespect whatsoever, and I’m so glad and relieved he understood that easily when I discussed it with him the next morning. I can’t wait to see him tomorrow at work! Bill is on my wavelength. I like to think about him.

  187.  #187Sherry on August 15, 2010 at 8:33 pm

    I love this thread!! All of the different viewpoints! It is truly wonderful to see how others think and feel on their road to self discovery 🙂

    I am a Christian and I am extremely sexual. I don’t have a problem with being both at the same time.

    In my 46 years I have went back and forth on the whole sex issue. I have abstained and I have done it for the sheer pleasure knowing nothing else would come from it. I have always tried to do what felt right to me at the time. I don’t feel there is a cookie cutter answer for this issue. Everyone is on a different phase of their journey.

    I don’t think sex gives away my power, nor do I feel it gives me power. It is a very big part of who I am and for someone to know me, they have to know that side of me.

  188.  #188janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:35 pm

    i’m going to try to compose my profile for going back on some dating site….

    should i go on okaycupid? i’ve been on match. that kind of blew…. oh, goddesses seem to like POF. how many are there? how about lavalife? whatthe hell is lavalife? sounds like old men trying to have an orgy…

    any and all goddessey suggestions for dating site profile writing would be gratefully accepted….

  189.  #189janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:40 pm

    brenda, bill sounds like a great guy…

  190.  #190janjune on August 15, 2010 at 8:42 pm

    so cool. love your comment.

  191.  #191Brenda on August 15, 2010 at 8:56 pm

    Janjune, thank you! Yes, he is no doubt the highest quality man who has ever been attracted to me! I can’t wait to get to know him better!!!!!!

    Good night, beautiful women!

  192.  #192Lucy on August 15, 2010 at 9:43 pm

    Sherry – “I am a Christian and I am extremely sexual. I don’t have a problem with being both at the same time.”

    Same here. 🙂

  193.  #193girl on August 15, 2010 at 10:02 pm

    I sort of collapsed into an unexpected deep sleep for several hours this afternoon, went rollerblading, went shopping and I feel all better now. Not worried about my feelings about D. I kinda had a hunch that my funk had less to do with him and more to do with my personal state. I bought a protein shake mix, a blender, and ingredients for salad for me to make for D and me. We’re going to start an exercise routine this week, and that feels good. I’m prepping ingredients for the salad now and I feel healthier already. Aaaah…much better.

  194.  #194girl on August 15, 2010 at 11:00 pm

    I’m happy for you, Brenda!

  195.  #195Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 5:09 am

    The okcupid site is a LOT more interesting than the POF site so far.
    I am at the point where I need to start filling in “about me” parts….now I’m nervous.
    “Hi, I’m an emotional basket case but I have a job I fact I work too hard and sometimes have trouble slowing down after work and haven’t had a vacation in 7 years. Thanks for stopping by”

  196.  #196Renee on August 16, 2010 at 5:50 am

    Hi Sirens — I feel like I missed out on all the fun on the blog yesterday because I was busy living life. But I’m not writing to whine today, I’m writing to say I’m having fun!

    The kid (the man who’s 9 yrs younger than me) seems intent on sweeping me off my feet and I’m loving the attention he’s lavishing on me. He txted and called me all weekend and last night, I was waiting for Dr. Feelgood to arrive for our date (he was a few minutes late) and txted the kid to pass the time (he knew I was meeting another man for a date) and he proceeded to send me 3 multi-media pics on my phone of lilies, tulips and roses, the three flowers I had told him were my favorite.

    So while I was waiting for my other date, this guy’s swooping in there sending me flowers, lol. And when I got finished with my date with Dr. Feelgood (which was fine, btw, but I didn’t really feel much attraction) he called again and told me how much he’s looking forward to meeting me and that I seem like no other woman he’s ever dated before, lol.

    Indy guy’s caught up in the mix too — calling/txting me all weekend because I put him off when he called Saturday night…we chatted for a bit and then I told him I had to run because I had plans (my plans were just to take a bath and watch some Tivo, but those were my plans, nonetheless) and I still like him, but I don’t think Indy guy’s going to step up the way I like whereas the kid seems completely in awe of me.

    I feel giggly and fun and worthy of this attention…I’ve been such a little siren while on the phone with him — talking to him makes me feel more confident and luscious as opposed to making me feel a little lacking, the way I’ve been feeling lately with Indy guy because Indy guy didn’t ask me out for this weekend. (And now he’s saying he wants to see me again, he just needs to find time in his schedule — boo! Boo for busy schedule’s that prevent a guy from driving a few hours to see me! Yay for men who make the time to meet me because they’re already enamoured!)

    So I’m feeling very worthy and desirable today and I love it!

    I did, however, have an interesting moment with a “feeling” message I gave the kid…he was asking if I could meet him Wednesday night because he wants to take me to dinner at a nice restaurant we both like nearby. I replied, “that would feel good”. There was a pause in the txting, and he finally wrote, “That would feel good or be good?” To which I replied, “both:-)”. But that told me he obviously didn’t get the whole ‘feeling’ part of the message, so I don’t know what I’m going to do there…guess I’ll keep using them until he “gets” it, lol.

    It feels great to be adored! The only thing that might throw a crimp into the works is that we’ve talked a little about the whole “exclusivity” thing and I’ve already given him a version of the “girlfriend” speech, accompanied by my personal speech about only wanting to have sex with someone if we’re going to be sexually exclusive. He strongly feels that if you’re sexually intimate with someone that you should be exclusive with them, “What’s the point of seeing other poeple if you’re really into the one person you’re seeing?” he says. And I wasn’t really sure how to answer him.

    I told him I felt conflicted by this issue (because I do) but that we could talk about it if the time comes. Since his wife cheated on him, however, he has a bit of a sensitivity there with being exclusive and I understand that. So if things progress the way it looks like they will, do I force myself to keep seeing other people, despite my desire to see only one person? Is this just a case where I need to delay my gratification to stay on my bridge, even if it means I might lose him in the process?

    I know this talk seems premature, but we really seem to have hit it off on the phone and if his pics are accurate, he’s pretty cute, so I feel optimistic about our potential…hmmm…I’m excited about my options right now, I just want to ensure I proceed in my best interests…

  197.  #197Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 6:29 am

    Renee – I have thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments and watching you CD! You remind me so much of myself! I just lean back and let you ask the questions and get the answers I need lol. I love the way Brenda helps you! She cracks me up 🙂

    Even though I do feel you are getting ahead of yourself, I also feel it is important to have these things worked out before they come up. I say that because I am in that exact situation and have made the choice to still CD while being sexually exclusive with one man. It is working for me most of the time, but I still have questions and doubts. So, I’m anxious to see what the other Sirens feelings are on this subject.

    I know Rori suggests ways to CD without actually going on dates with other men, and that may be an option for you once it gets to that point. I’m just unclear on when that point is lol.

  198.  #198Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 6:42 am

    Sherry, thanks!

    Renee, you are doing awesome with circular dating! Your cougar man sounds pretty cool the way he’s stepping up!

  199.  #199Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 6:46 am


    Here is an eletter for you, and for all of us, from David Wygant, another relationship coach:

    “David, I have so many first dates. How come I don’t get a second date? Why are so many men not attracted to me? Ann, Ontario”

    – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
    – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –

    “Hey Ann,

    Let’s break this down…

    When you’re out on a date, are you being flirtatious?

    **Are you complimenting the guy?
    **Are you touching him at all on his arm? On his shoulder?
    **Are you leaning in when he speaks?
    **Are you smiling and laughing at his stupid jokes?

    Basically, think about how much time are you spending in the moment and flirting versus how much time you are spending thinking about how much he likes you?

    In order to secure a second date, you need to realize that you may need to go on 50 first dates before you have a second date.


    Don’t worry about your “batting average,” but instead enjoy each date, be present in the moment, and be flirtatious.

    That way, when you meet guys with whom you have a connection, you will not sabotage yourself and you WILL be getting second dates.


    I know what you’re thinking…

    David, what do you mean I might have to go on 50 dates before I get a second date? That is obviously an extreme example to make a point…

    …BUT what you need to take away from it is that it’s your ATTITUDE and MINDSET that needs to change.

    Dating is all about learning how to relate with yourself. It’s not about keeping statistics and judging yourself on numbers that don’t mean anything.

    When you learn to truly relate to yourself, you will have no trouble getting second dates.

    **If you believe that you’re a great person and that you’re a fantastic catch, then you’ll get second dates.

    **If you embrace your body, your face and your mind, YOU WILL GET SECOND DATES.

    **If you flirt with men so that they know you are sexually interested in them, then you will get second dates.

    The only way to learn how to do this, is to go out on “throw away dates.” These are dates that are going to teach you how to flirt, how to relax, and how to feel totally comfortable around men.

    To those of you that have read my blog, or listened to any of my courses, you know that I teach you how to do “hello practice.”

    – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
    This is one of the BEST TOOLS to getting confident around men!
    – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –

    “Hello practice” is where you say hello to EVERYONE you see, so that you’re more relaxed when you speak to men.

  200.  #200Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 7:03 am

    Reading all the comments about sex and God and CDing really got me thinking last night. With all of the hurt feelings and back and forth going on I realized just how different yet the same we all are. I honestly feel blessed to have been able to read and share in all of it 🙂

    I woke up to the realization this morning that I may have made the decision to have sex with my fav CD in part to get closer to him. I have no problem with my sexuality. It has taken me a long time and I actually embrace that part of me now. I am my most vunerable, most open self during that time. We are both there, naked – both physically and emotionally – and I feel safe.

    I also realized that once the sex is over, my walls go back up and I close off. It is the strangest feeling. It is not a gradual thing, it happens immediately… I become really quiet and distant. I know I am supposed to love this part of myself, but I want to change it. I want to feel open and vunerable and authentic all the time! How do I accomplish that?

  201.  #201Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 7:32 am


    What happens after sex? Cuddling? Showering? Sleep? Getting up and back to business as usual? Have you discussed it with him? If so, how does he feel (AKA what does he think? 🙂 )

  202.  #202Renee on August 16, 2010 at 7:45 am

    Sherry — Thanks for the kind comments. I’m glad my situation resonates with you and that the questions I’m asking are helping you get to your happy ever after as well:-).

    On closing up after sex, the biggest step right now is that you’ve realized that you do that, so you can be conscious of it. When you say you close up “immediately” after sex, do you mean as soon as you get out of bed or as soon as the act itself is over? For me, it seems like as long as I am laying there naked, I still feel vulnerable…sometimes that feels a little scary, but I know that being able to allow yourself to be vulnerable with a man is the key to bonding on a more emotional level.

    Would it help to have some more intimate topics on hand to discuss afterwards to keep the “connection” you feel you’re establishing through sex going? After sex, when I’m lying there feeling all lovey-dovey, I ask questions like “other than the days your children were born (if applicable), what is the proudest day of your life?” or “what’s your favorite childhood memory?” or other questions like that…I’m not sure if this is the “right” approach, but it seems like, if I’m with someone I really like, the intimate moment seems to extend past the sexual act when I’m lying there trying to discover more about this man I’m with. If I don’t feel inspired to ask any questions like that, I probably am not with the right man. What if you just try some feeling messages about the yummy feeling you feel right after sex with a great guy? What do you think?

    If I understand you correctly, it sounds like you feel similar to the way I feel about sex — I realize I use it at times not only to feel good physically, but also to feel more close to a man…I’m working on trying to feel that intimate connection outside of the bedroom as well, but I think I’m a little like a guy in that way…I’ve heard the saying that women need to feel close in order to have sex and men need to have sex in order to feel close, and that’s where I think I may be more like a man…having sex with someone makes me feel closer to him in a way I don’t seem to be able to outside the bedroom (at least, not very easily).

  203.  #203Renee on August 16, 2010 at 7:55 am

    Brenda — Thanks for the encouragement! I found out today he’s only 8 yrs younger than me (so obviously, that’s a HUGE difference, lol) but I do feel like a cougar! Yesterday, I was talking about the way things were in childhood with there only being 3 channels on tv and that kind of thing, and I said, “but that’s probably before your time, youngster” to which he replied “cougar” and we both laughed, but it is definitely out of my comfort zone.

    But, like they say, if you only keep doing what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always gotten, so I’m willing to step outside my comfort zone a little and give this a shot.

    I have to admit, though, that all this male interaction is wearing me out a little…I’m juggling several men right now, but I have a hard time remembering whom I told what and what they’ve told me (like their kids’ ages and whether their parents are alive/still married, etc.). I think I’m at the point where I don’t really want to add anyone else to my plate until I see how things play out with the ones I’m already in contact with…I’m sure some of you guys can relate:-).

    How are things with Bill today?

  204.  #204Renee on August 16, 2010 at 7:57 am

    Btw, Sherry — I love the fact that you’ve made this decision about sex outside of the ‘heat of the moment’…that says a lot about your maturity level. I would like to make my next sexual decision with the same level of self-awareness and maturity as opposed to randomly getting caught up in the moment somewhere after the first few dates.

  205.  #205Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 8:08 am

    Renee – like I said lol we are a lot alike! My sister has even said to me I am more like a man when it comes to sex!

    Brenda – after sex… Usually when he goes to the bathroom to get a towel it happens. The minute he leaves my walls go up. Sometimes we sit up and talk, sometimes we lay in bed and cuddle. Either way, I don’t do/say much. I find it hard to show affection – to be open – when we both have clothes on.

    I have been working on knowing how I feel. I have spent my whole life being “the peacemaker.” I stuffed down all feeling and made jokes and tried to get everyone to just get along. I honestly have no idea what I feel about much in my life. I know that sounds odd lol and believe me it feels odd too.

    I am happy that my fav CD is comfortable with my silence. If I talk he will respond, if I want to be quiet, he will just sit there with me or hold me whichever I want at the time. He will make me laugh with a funny story, or even ask me questions about things we see on TV. I don’t usually ask him questions Renee. It is like I shut down and just want to roll inside myself and be there with him. I realize that isn’t really being “with” him, and I want to change that.

  206.  #206Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 8:11 am

    Btw Renee – My fav CD is 10 years younger than I am 🙂

  207.  #207Denise on August 16, 2010 at 8:13 am

    I know I am supposed to love this part of myself, but I want to change it. I want to feel open and vunerable and authentic all the time! How do I accomplish that?

    Great question, Rori’s tools are a good start. It may feel weird at first, but gotta start somewhere.

    I would also suggest YOGA if you haven’t tried that yet. Not a physical class only, but with a teacher who is big into making the body/mind connection. Amazing stuff.

    Finally, to be brave, to have courage. The only way to grow is to have courage. Being vulnerable means we’re subject to being hurt, embarrassed, ashamed, etc. But, as in all feelings, they will pass though, they are temporary.

    Just my two cents 🙂

  208.  #208Denise on August 16, 2010 at 8:17 am

    @knocksoftly, #197

    What I would say is that we attract those who are like us: if one is emotionally unavailable then that person is attracting those who are emotionally unavailable. It’s like looking in a mirror.

    One of the things I would like Rori to talk more about and address is when it’s time to cut our losses and move on from a relationship. Not in an out of control way, but in a way that comes from a mature view that the other person is just not a good match for us.

    I dated a man shortly after my divorce that was like this, he just couldn’t ‘get it’ when I was explaining things to him. Very frustrating. Finally, I decided that just wasn’t where I wanted to expend my energy (there were other things as well, but this was a big one), and moved on.

  209.  #209Denise on August 16, 2010 at 8:31 am

    @Sherry #189

    I can relate with this post. Now that I’m older and dealing with men who are older and supposedly more mature :), I find that giving my intimacy, time and energy trumps the sex part. After all, he can’t have sex with me if I’m not there because I don’t feel like I’m being treated the way I want to be treated (not that I’m being treated badly!, it’s just that I don’t feel an acceptable level of resources from his side) or that I just don’t feel that connection that is unexplainable.

    I have also FINALLY learned that Sex does NOT equal LOVE. So even if I have sex with a man does not mean the relationship is going to work long term. The sex can be incredibly good, but there are so many other factors, timing being one of the most important, that are more of an influence on the relationship.

    Now, I am NOT saying to not make him wait or work for it, I think those are good things…but neither am I crazy or despondent about sex if it does happen.

  210.  #210Renee on August 16, 2010 at 8:36 am

    Sherry — we ARE a lot alike! Being a typical middle child, I am also a “peacemaker” in many cases and one of the challenges I’m working on from Rori’s work is that of recognizing how I feel about things so I actually CAN express myself in feeling statements. Sometimes I feel a knot in the pit of my stomach and I have to just run through a list of feelings that it could be it see which one resonates with me at the moment. I’m finding that “fear” is a big one for me — fear of being rejected, fear of not being good enough, fear of being confronted — I’m working on being ‘ok’ with my fear feelings — acknoledging them and telling myself it’s ok to feel that way and even if I don’t feel it at the time, telling myself “I love my fear and the knot in the pit of my stomach”…it actually does seem to help.

    You said you have a hard time feeling connected/expressing your feelings with your clothes on and I can definitely related to that. Why don’t you try one small thing — have a towel by the bed (or at the foot of the bed) before sex so afterwards, he won’t have to get up and go get one and you can both stay naked a while longer and revel in you vulnerability. Also, maybe you can just jot down a list of things topics you’d like to discuss that you feel may lead to intimate discussions so when you start to feel yourself freezing up and shutting down, you can try to remember some of the things your wrote down and try to force yourself to remain “in the moment” with this guy and exploring him a little further. What do you think?

  211.  #211dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 8:48 am

    I like the idea of keeping a towel by the bed.

  212.  #212Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 9:02 am

    Denise – its funny that you suggested yoga. I have been kicking that idea around for about a month. I have found my view and experiences have changed a lot since I’ve gotten older too.

    Renee- those are good ideas. It’s not necessarily when I am dressed – just used it as a figure of speech. Sometimes we lay in bed totally naked together. I still shut down.

    “Finally, to be brave, to have courage. The only way to grow is to have courage.” I feel the whole issue stems from fear.. of what I’m not sure. When I lay beside him, I will lay my head on his chest but not touch him with my whole body. I do this as to avoid eye contact. I just feel completely detatched to myself… It’s funny that I am just now realizing this.

    I like him and I feel we have similar core values and things could go somewhere. I have no clue what the next level is or how to get there. I am great at getting dates and keeping things casual. I feel I am ready t go beyond casual for the first time since my divorce 14 years ago. Once again, I just don’t know how…

  213.  #213dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 9:04 am

    i have to run an errand but maybe it’s time to talk to him about how you feel about post-sex and ask him if he has any ideas about it. what does everyone think?

  214.  #214Renee on August 16, 2010 at 9:25 am

    I really like Dorothea’s idea — while you’re lying there, after sex, maybe you can tell him what you’re feeling…”CD#1, it feels good to be with you and I like it when we spend time together, but I’ve noticed that after sex, when we’re lying here like this, that instead of feeling closer to you like I’d like, I feel myself closing up and putting up walls and I don’t want to do that anymore. What do you think?”

    Does that resonate with you?

  215.  #215Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 9:27 am

    Dorothea – I have thought about that but I really feel he “feeds” off of me. The first few times we had sex he tried to keep the intimate thing going through words and actions. I pushed him back. I set my walls and silently told him to stay away. Since then, he gets his clues from me… exactly how far I will allow myself to go at a particular time. So I’m not sure there is anything to talk with him about.. it may be I need to work on me before I can bring him in to it? I’m not sure.. this is all brand new to me! The more I write here, the more I am learning myself!!

  216.  #216Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 9:30 am

    Renee – that is exactly how I feel! But, by saying that, wouldn’t it seem like I was asking him to fix it for me? And how would he do that? I get so confused about all of this!!

  217.  #217Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Or would that be allowing him in to my process? Which would be a good thing? Ugh! Why can’t I get this stuff?

  218.  #218Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 9:37 am

    Renee, RE: #206

    You all have been busy since my one hour chat with Bill! 🙂 I am happy and he just stopped over at my desk to talk. Maybe he did that here in the office instead of asking me to lunch in order to keep me tame! 🙂 I made a little subtle comment about “other uses for coconut oil” when he was discussing the dietary benefits. I don’t think he got it, tho, cuz I didn’t make the sexual innuendo too strong, being that we are still early in the romance. But it is my favorite lubricant! Hehe! If he’s lucky, he’ll eventually find that out! 🙂 I got in as many feeling messages as I could, and when he left my desk, I said, “It was nice talking with you! I love talking with you!” He seemed relaxed, and I noticed when he first came, his face was kind of white. When he left, he had a nice flush going. That is a sign that a Siren has done her work well! 😛

    About Cougar Man (did you name him yet?), sounds like some fun joking around. Ryan, 15 yrs younger, was more insecure, and he got all bent out of shape when anyone asked me if he was my son. 🙂 Which happened three times.

    After a while, I stopped making little comments about it. He tried to not let it be an issue, but I could tell it was an issue for him. One sweet thing he said was, “I am going to forget how old I am. When people ask me how old I am, I am going to say, ‘I don’t remember'”. I really loved that!

  219.  #219janjune on August 16, 2010 at 9:45 am


    sounds like you’re having so much fun!!
    i’m having fun hearing about all your men!
    you out there cding, really making it work!
    oh yeh!

    i’ve wondered the same thing about keeping on cding when you met someone wonderful.
    i’d love for rori to clarify, but i’ve decided this for the time being:

    if i get into cding and somewhere meet someone very special and we want to see only each other, i will agree to it…. but only for awhile, like a few months.

    because i figure to have gotten to the point of only wanting to be with that person, i will have had to see them a few months anyway, say 4-5 months….
    and rori says a man knows if you’re the girl of his dreams right away (and they ALL have that dream girl image they are looking for…) or whether you are just someone they enjoy being with until they find “HER”…
    she says they know when they meet you if you’re the one and that if they are going to make it permanent

    I absolutely believe this!!
    they will!!
    i believe they will make plans to try to “claim” a goddess in a relatively short period of time if they are ready for a goddess and are capable of stepping up.

    anyway, so i figure if i’ve already dated them 5 months and want to make it exclusive for a FEW months, like for me it would be 3 or 4, certainly no more than 5— no that feels too long,
    then i’m going to do it…
    i think i will be able to definately tell what is going on in a short period of time.

    i think he will know whether i’m his dream girl and *I* will know whether i am his dream girl!!

    i feel like he will propose by that time if he’s serious.

    and why not??
    i mean, he is welcome to stay in the circular dating rotation b/c we already know we like each other ..,
    but why waste our time if we want to find Mr. Right on a man who’s already determined that he’s not our Mr. Right?

    i feel so *getting it* now–
    thanks for bringing that up renee!!


    BUT NO, NO, NO NEVER anymore long, exclusive dating arrangements for me.

    this is just how i plan to do it.

    would love to hear rori’s answer to this question.

  220.  #220Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 9:49 am

    Brenda – I love your updates concerning Bill! I am amazed at how well you get Rori’s programs! You are a testiment to how they really do work!

    My son (who is 19) asked my daughter (who is 21) how she would feel about dating an 11 yr old one night when we were out to dinner. I had just started dating fav CD and my son didn’t like the age difference! When I told fav CD about it he thought it was hilarious! I admit it pissed me off when my son said that… Fav CD doesn’t have a problem with the age thing, but I still struggle with it for some reason.

  221.  #221Denise on August 16, 2010 at 9:55 am

    @sherry #215 & 219

    I agree with you Sherry, this sounds like something you need to address for YOURSELF. It feels like sharing a feeling message in this case is putting the onus on him to figure out what’s wrong. He’s not your therapist. It doesn’t sound to me like it’s anything HE’S doing to make you feel shut down, it’s something that’s happening within you to make that happen.

    Be kind to yourself Sherry, this is a HUGE path you are going on right now. Developing a strong, sharp observing ego (looking at yourself objectively) is crucial, and what you’re doing right now is developing a strong observing ego. You’re asking the right questions. This is not going to solved in a day. If you don’t know what’s causing you to shut down, you’ll have to contemplate this for awhile I’m sure. Could be beliefs, past experiencies, etc.

    You also may need some temporary professional assistance in moving past what’s causing you to shut down. I wouldn’t think Rori would want to put these forums out here as a substitute for professional help. (EDMR is supposed to be an excellent, relatively quick, effective way for folks to get past roadblocks–a professional can help determine if this is right for you.)

    From everything that I’ve learned, we have to bring our best selves to the table in order to have the best relationships possible. That is usually a path we have to go on ourselves. That doesn’t mean we can’t share the progress we’re making on our path or letting people know about what we’ve learned, etc….but it’s our path.

    Are you doing this ‘wall’ thing in other parts of your life? Interacting with others? At work? With family, friends?

  222.  #222Denise on August 16, 2010 at 10:02 am

    If you can find a good teacher, YOGA is amazing. I have been a person who has had to be in control of everything (and everyone!). I could never really relax because I was never in the moment. I was always looking ahead, trying to figure out how to get the future to meet my goals. I was ALWAYS leaning forward.

    YOGA taught me to be softer with myself and to be in the moment.

    That was my experience…and YOGA did this for me when I had no idea it was going to do that for me. I went initially because of stretching and stuff–didn’t realize the huge emotional/mental benefits I was going to get. I was lucky enough to have a few amazing different teachers.

  223.  #223janjune on August 16, 2010 at 10:12 am

    that closing up after sex issue is very interesting goddesses…

    i have just fully processed the fact that one of the reasons i don’t want to have sex outside of marriage anymore is because i don’t like it!

    yeh, i don’t like it.

    because no matter how good the sex was or how much i loved the guy, i always felt empty when we got up out of bed in the morning. i felt like something hollow inside.
    i hated that feeling.
    i don’t want to feel it ever again.

    when i was married, even though it didn’t last forever, and even when my husband and i were going through our difficulties, i knew he was going to “be there”. i don’t understand it even now, but it has to have something to do with having that committment that “i know he is going to try”, that i knew he was going to at least try to work through things and not just abandon me.

    that’s it.

    i felt like he would stick around and try even if we had problems and not just abandon me on a whim….

    i’ve wondered why i loved married sex so much and
    that’s it for me.

    i just never felt that connection with other men even in relatively long term relationships where i felt loved and cared for and pampered and respected and special…

    it just wasn’t there…

    so, that’s why i don’t care if i ever have unmarried sex…

  224.  #224janjune on August 16, 2010 at 10:15 am

    and that’s why i love this blog!
    and ALL the goddesses and rori.

    i’ve wondered about that for a long time!

    but the above discussion just triggered the answer… listening to all the different goddesses points of view!

    i love love love you guys!
    goddess janjune

  225.  #225dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 10:21 am

    Yikes, all this talk about married sex is making me want to stop having sex with my LI. I have been feeling shaky and vulnerable after we have sex. He says he isn’t going anywhere but I want a freaking ring.

    How the heck am I going to tell him this?

    Or what if I just want to have sex like every once in a while? I don’t like that it is considered a regular thing in my relationship, because then I feel pressure to give it as frequently and wholeheartedly as I would if we were married. And I don’t want to be a pretend wife. But I feel like I have to give him a glimpse of my libido so he knows I won’t be a frigid wife.

    I just want a ring on my finger and a date set. Is this unfair?

  226.  #226janjune on August 16, 2010 at 10:26 am

    i wonder of i’m going to start having sex again now.

    now that i know that icky feeling was attached to the abandonment issues i’ve been working with…

    i’d already figured out i’d abandoned MYSELF. now i know this bit of information…

    i wonder if it was me abandoning myself that i was feeling after unmarried sexand not abandonment by the man????

    i feel excited to explore this part of my being.

    i feel healthy and freedom.
    i feel clarity coming.
    i feel emotional health.
    i feel freedom.
    to be and say and do who i am.
    i am okay and so are my feelings.

    i love you rori!!!!!

  227.  #227Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 10:38 am

    Janjune – Big Hugs!!! Breakthroughs are wonderful 🙂

    Dorothea- Is the only time you feel shaky and vulnerable after you’ve had sex? Or are you afraid he will go somewhere at other times too?

  228.  #228Renee on August 16, 2010 at 10:54 am

    Janjune — sounds like you’re really doing some good work there in realizing your abandonment issues. I feel curious to know whether, now that you know what the issue is, you’ll be able to face your fear and feel comfortable having sex outside of marriage or whether that is just a boundary you need to set for yourself to do what you feel is in your best interest. Keep us posted!

    I have been CDing up a storm lately! And as much as I get the concept of why you would want to continue dating other people the whole time, I think I’m thinking more along the lines of what you’re thinking…I may allow myself to get exclusive with a man for a few months, but after 4 or maybe 5 months, if he’s not seriously talking marriage, it’s back to CDing because either he’s going to step up at that point or I’ll need to be looking elsewhere for Mr. Right — in either case, CDing would seem like the best solution at that time.

    But for now, if Cougar man (I’ll go with Brenda’s nickname here, lol) and I hit it off as well in person as we have on the phone, I don’t know that I have a great answer as to why I would need to continue dating other people if I’ve met someone I’m interested enough in to become sexually exclusive with (and he already knows that sex, to me, equals sexual exclusivity). He also knows I don’t plan on waiting around for years for ANY man — I told him flat out that at this age, I felt that people know, for the most part, after a few months if they’ve got something special or not and that I had no intention of being one of those women who waits around for a man to step up.

    He said, “I love your honesty. I think you’re totally worth it, but if I didn’t, I might be running the other way right now, lol”. I asked him why, out of curiosity, he would be ‘running’ at that point, but he kind of changed the subject and I let it ride. I don’t think he’s been around a woman who’s really set strong boundaries with him, and he seems to really respond well to that.

    In fact, most of the men I’ve been interacting with seem to respond well to my setting boundaries early on — it seems to help them feel comfortable to know which rules they’re operating under.

    Last night on the phone I told Indy guy that when we have our next visit, I was probably going to have to nix staying in the bed with him. I told him that I thought sex was an important part of a relationship, but that I wanted to make sure there was a relationship there for it to be part of before I wanted that to enter the picture. He said he agreed and understood, but we’ll see how rapidly he tries to get together with me again…I’m starting to have my doubts as to whether he’s the type of man who ever steps up…he’s been pretty laid back, despite telling me that he wants to see me again and that he knows I’m not suffering from any lack of invitations from other men. If that doesn’t prompt him to step up, I don’t know what would, so I’m not going to blame myself if he doesn’t — I’m just going to put it off to his being more of a feminine energy, non-‘step up’ kind of guy.

  229.  #229Renee on August 16, 2010 at 10:58 am

    Sherry — you and Denise make a good point…it’s possible he might feel somewhat responsible, but of course, you could always tell him, “I’m not telling you this because it’s anything that you’ve done or because I want you to fix anything, I just wanted you to know what was going on with me.”

    But if it seems more appropriate to you to just work on being more open without telling him what your process is, I think that’s fine too — the main thing is you recognize it and know it needs work some way or another. What do you think?

  230.  #230janjune on August 16, 2010 at 11:11 am

    had to get back on here and record…
    omg this is all comingtogether at once
    i can’t type fastenough

    this all stems back tomy first love.
    the first man i loved and hjad sex with
    it was in college
    i was cding…sooo many men soooo little time!
    i was in man heaven!!!
    it was date date date and more date!!!
    oooh, i loved it the excitment the fun my roommates and friends wdere very outgoing very fun there was about six of us that were always out socialzing, but studying hard too. it felt very balanced.
    we we just havingfun with the boys, not getting serious

    then i met someone we dated from the beginning of fall semester until christmas pretty exclusively…
    but right around thanksgiving we got in an agrument and stopped seeing eiach other a little bit and he IMMEDIATELYhadanother date!!!!
    that sdhould have tol;dmesomething

    so what did ido, i got ME a date with someone who had been wanting to take me out and i had wanted to go out with him too but didn’t so it wouldn’t cause problems with the guy i already liked, “B”.

    B and i got back together shortly after that and i told him i didn’t want him to go out with that girl and that i would break my date with “D” if he would not go out with her.

    he said no, he had made the date and he didn’t feel it was right to break it (i see now that he didn’t want to break it,,,, reallly i sensed that then too.)

    so we went out on or respective dates.

    i was happy to go out with “D”… i knew he wasnted to go out with me for months and so it was a great time, he was talland good looking and a basktball player and he was from a rural area and very sweet and comfortable AND it was so much fun actuallygetting our date that we had both wanted to have.

    so i stayed out really late but told him B and i had gotten back together.

    when i got back to my a[artment B was waiting it was a bout 3 am he sad he had been waiting on the porch since 11pm/ he said he had shut his date down early because he wanted to be with me (i don’t believe that, i think she just wasn’t sas much fun as he thought she was going to be i think that if she had been fun he would have satyed out late)
    he was mad that i had stayed out so late.
    he thought we were back togheter so why was i out hav so late with D. we had gotten back togher we were just going on the dates out of obligation….oh hey, right…
    he was mad because i had styled my hair!
    i have really straight hair and always wear it that way EXCEPT when theyre is something special going on….it’s just too much trouble to go to b/c no matter what i do, it is straight again in no time expecially in the humidity…

    so after that he claimed me.

    he loved me, he adored me, he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me, he had never met anyone he loved more than me, he lavaliered (sp?) me, he took me to meet his parents etc., all the things gthat we think make it serious….

    oh yeh i fell hard

    i gave in to him fully body mind spirit and soul
    i thought we would be together forever, i loved him without reservation and let him love me too

    and then you know what?????

    the end of the sememster, he told me he wanted to date N.

    oh my god!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    omg NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    what happened???????????????????????????????????????????
    omg NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    and he stuck with it.

    and his roommates who i knew told me they were dating all summer and he was madly in love with her and he had given away the gift i specially made him for his birthday

    because he didn’t want it anymore.

    they weren’t being mean.
    they were my firiends too
    they knew i needed to know
    wanted to know.

    so i started partyoing it up, and sc__wing whoever whenever and just having all the fun i could have

    and didn’t believe or trust any of them no matter what they said or did.

    i never really gave anyone a chance to love me and show they loved me after that.
    i just didn’t believ e love committed loved really existed.
    so the guy that drove me to this website was the man i felll in love with after B.
    he was a narcicist.
    i can see why i fell in love with him.
    i didn’t have to worry about the love issue–,
    i knew from the way he acted that i would never have to worry about these issues of being abandonmed by a man who said he loved me because i knew that F loved me but not in that way…

    so he was so safe i have just stayed hung up on him after that…through an engagement, thru a marriage, emotionally i kept him on my horse because he was so safe and if felt relationship but it was an imaginary relationship just me projecting what i wanted to project upon this man…
    and the engagement and the marriage maybe could have worked out, i loved them and i know the guy i was engaged to loved me, not sure about my hasband, but i was just too turned around to know how to make anything work

    i don’t feel it anymore, but i can remember the utter shock and confusion of having this man B who i had totally abandoned myself to

    the only thing i feel right now is anger.
    i would love to kick him in the nuts.

  231.  #231Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 11:15 am

    Janjune, RE: #222 – In Commitment Blueprint, Rori says keep circular dating until you have a ring on your finger. She told a story of a client who had 5 dates going. One proposed to her, and she actually had to go home and cancel dates!

  232.  #232Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 11:17 am

    Sherry, RE: #223 – I appreciate your kind words. I have listened to some of Rori’s programs about 4 times each and took notes. I was desperate to get this stuff last year with Ryan. Sadly, I didn’t get it in time. I realized it was a process. So I have been really, really working hard to get it, and it has been gelling all the more since I’ve been on the blog.

    I will call myself a Rori testimonial when I have a ring on my finger! 🙂 But I hope I am finally on the fast track!

  233.  #233janjune on August 16, 2010 at 11:22 am

    hi brenda,
    thanks for the answer.
    i will have to get committment blueprint when i get back to work…
    but i still don’t feel like i would mind taking 3-4 months out to date exclusively, but no more than that!!
    i think i have learned my lesson on going exclusive… now that i look back on my rel. with B

    maybe after some more emotional processing and percolating i will understand why NEVER to date exclusively—for any length of time, under ANY circumstances.

    i don’t understand it yet… but rori has been right on everything so far, so i’m sure she knows what she’s talking about on this issue too.

  234.  #234Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 11:25 am


    I like a lot of the ideas going out to you to develop emotional intimacy in bed with your man. I love pillow talk for this. Eye contact is hard for me, too, and I broke thru a lot of that when Ryan just gazed and gazed at me. I replaced a lot of my self-talk during those times by telling myself, “He loves me. He’s fascinated by me. He wants to know my deep truth.” One of the most romantic things he ever did was lean his head on his elbow on his side and gaze at me through over half of a romantic Michael Bolton album! It was captivating and magnetic! I felt safe with him, and, after all my long distance relationships, I was at a stage where I was craving intimacy. I laid on my side and gazed right back. We lay there wordlessly, lost in each other’s eyes, for who knows, about a half hour!

    Could you start with silent eye contact? Something like that?

    I most definitely think you should draw your man into your growth process! You would be in effect, taking an area where you are shut down from past emotional damage and using it to connect at a deeper level with him. Here are some ideas what to say:

    I feel so vulnerable. I want to hide. (Pause)

    I feel scared to look at you. I don’t know why. How can we work through this? (Pause)

    I feel so good to be with you making love or not making love. But I don’t know how to show it. Can you help me?

  235.  #235Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 11:33 am


    I was exclusive with Ryan already before I started to listen to Rori. He kept dragging it out and dragging it out. He was serious about wanting a lifelong marriage partner, but he was also serious about choosing if I was the right woman. So he kept testing me.

    Then there was the fake proposal, which hurt me worse than anything I’ve ever been thru. And still I hung on, totally confused and vulnerable.

    He gave me consistently mixed messages. He would say just friends I’m not in love with you, and then the next week he would be back to gazing in my eyes, saying, “I care for you, Brenda”. One night when I was pretty convinced it was history, we got frisky at a diner and then took it home; made out on the sofa; and played for a long time in bed.

    I thought it was back on track again, and all my feelings grew again just like that. A week later, he broke up with me, 3.5 months after his fake proposal.

    My heart was mincemeat by then.

    It was during that last 3.5 months that I realized like a revelation that Rori was right on track with CDing. If I had been CDing all that time, much of that wouldn’t have happened. And, I would have been secure enough in myself to pull back when he became psychologically sadistic. It would have saved me a lot of pain, and it would have made my path, down MY bridge, so much more clear.

    I highly recommend circular dating.

  236.  #236Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 11:36 am

    Sherry, RE: #223 – Tell your son that it isn’t age difference that matters, but maturity level. The older you get, the less significant age difference is. I was 45 and Ryan was 30. I loved it!!!!

  237.  #237Tina on August 16, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Im a freedom fighting warrior goddess woman 🙂

  238.  #238Brenda on August 16, 2010 at 2:03 pm

    Hey Tina! I was wondering where you were! Did you just get back from grocery shopping? 🙂

    I painted my toenails this morning! Shocking pink!

  239.  #239dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 2:18 pm

    omg tina me too 😀

  240.  #240Sherry on August 16, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    Brenda – RE: #237 – Those are excellent ideas! Thank you! I don’t know when or if I will have the courage to actually try one of those. I honestly know I need to do something and I honestly want to try. I like the eye contact thing.. but I don’t think I can do that yet. Maybe I’ll start with one of the beautiful statements you suggested…

    This has been a lot for me to process today!!

  241.  #241Daria on August 16, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    thank u orishas… i feel awed with how my intent of taking a break off smoking today is playingout…

    with a long phone conversation last nite and waking up in the middle of the day today… with a headache and no craving to smoke

    and lots of phonecalls frm my guy friend offering to smoke with me since i did the past two days with him…

    i felt good and loved

    haha now i feel curious about smoking later tonite…

    i feel good that im not feeling desperate or cravy

    i feel good that i feel good being at home right now!

    i feel good that i put my sheets in the washer and go!

    my hormones feel more calm – i probably have ovulated


    i feel embarassed talking about ovulation

  242.  #242janjune on August 16, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    just recording–

    but really i see that it wasn’t about him and his little nuts anyway… *big smile*

    it’s about letting someone else do *my* job for me.

    i *wanted* another date with D….
    but i got intoxicated on the adoration and attention i was receiving from B.

    i know that was it.

    blah blah and blahblahblah, the story could go on and on but here’s what i’m seeing…

    even though i had feelings of my own, like:
    1. wanting to go on another date with D
    2. not really liking B’s mom, she was all scowly faced and pinched up looking and snooty, she came across as a real tightass and *my* mom on the other hand was fun and pretty (to me) and twirly, meaning she enjoyed life and had fun and liked people and let them feel that….i knew that having a mom like that had to do something to a boy, now a young man…
    i knew that much….
    3. plus the guy really wasn’t that good…hell, what am i saying?!! he wasn’t ANY good in bed…
    i didn’t know what it was supposed to feel like, but i knew it was supposed to be better than THAT!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hehehehehehehehehehehee1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    i’m not trying to be mean
    i just think that is funny!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    the poor guy!!

    but he seemed so SURE.
    and he told me he wanted to grow old together and be poor together (just starting out in life type poor) and he’d never leave me and i was the love of his life.
    we had already had sex many, many, MANY times before he started saying all this so i believed that he meant it.

    but here’s the tHing,
    i still let the man have my JOB.

    it’s my job to think for myself
    and its my job to feel how i feel
    and its my job to decide what i want…
    not just be swept off my feet into somebody else’s dream
    whether they mean it or not.

    i think that’s rori’s whole point.

  243.  #243janjune on August 16, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    so now i feel eased off
    not mad

    i forgive him

    for using me
    for as long as he wanted and then without any apparent consciense, unceremoniously (sp?) dumping me in the street on my ass. not literally but that was how it felt.

    he did go on to date N.
    and then did the same thing to her.

    then it was M
    and after that i lost track of him.

    but i just put his name etc in facebook and there he is… standing there holding a stupid fish.

    like who gives a damn about his stupid fish?

    oh well! now i’ve got the giggles again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    putting your photo on facebook holding a fish!!!

    oh no!!!!that’s hilarious.
    i wish my sister was here so we could have the giggles together!!!!!!!!!!!!

  244.  #244janjune on August 16, 2010 at 6:11 pm


    excuse me.

    i *do* know the spelling on that one…..:)

  245.  #245Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 6:36 pm

    I got a package from B today.
    It’s the bracelet of contention
    The one that he said I said mean things about.
    He said I asked if it was real. Which he assumed meant that I didn’t like it….and therefore thought that his gifts weren’t good enough for me.
    OF COURSE I asked if they were real, my friend had just gotten a very expensive bracelet that we had talked about I would be too freaked out to wear!
    This is the reason he gave for not showing up with birthday and anniversary gifts on time….I would wait like months for my gifts.
    And he said it was because of what I had said.
    I call bullshit on that.
    I feel like emailing him and telling him so.
    I feel like facebooking him and telling him so.
    I feel like calling him and yelling at him
    I feel like driving to his house and shoving the fckn thing down his throat!!!!!!!!!
    What a douche bag excuse.
    Friggin assclown
    His father used to literally look at a gift and complain about it. and what did he do? spent three days shopping for father’s day and spend $85 dollars on the ungratful bastard in front of me while I was still waiting on a birthday present from the year before!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I may actually spontaniously combust!!!!!!
    [[pulls out hair while rolling on the floor frothing at the mouth]]

  246.  #246Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 6:44 pm

    self centred, arrogant, ignorant, narcassitic, passive agressive, rotten, spoiled, small dicked, bald mother FCKER!!!!

  247.  #247Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 6:45 pm

    I am giving the bracelet to his sister so she can wear it at thanksgiving.
    FCK you bald man.

  248.  #248dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 6:54 pm

    Jennifer is feeling angry, among other things…

  249.  #249janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:23 pm

    im trying to notice men.

    i just walk by. look at them, might even smile, say hi, have eye contact —but just as *people*, not as MEN, a separate category.—- i don’t think i ever have unless i was flirting,,,

    but i started to look today.

    there were two of particular note:
    the first one was in the parking lot at a medical building, looked like a salesman—suit, shiny car, briefcase and when he opened his trunk there were alot of things back there which he loaded more in… anyway, i noticed he kept looking over in the direction i was even though he was loading stuff in the back of his car, so i decided to pay attention and took lots of time gathering up my things in the front seat…

    it was so amusing…..
    he danced and he pranced, he didn’t have any more to load into the trunk, so he started looking at the bottom of his shoe, then he looked again, kept looking over toward me, i was in a different parking lot than him, quite a ways away for that type of thing, i thought, (and i’m not that good looking) but this man wanted to get a look for some reason.

    so i stalled some more to see what he would go through in order to get a look at a woman he merely *thought* might be attractive….
    he reopened the trunk and fished around and looked my way and then i decided i’d seen enough because it was SOOOOOOO apparent at that point that rori’s point that “men will do whatever they have to do to get to the woman they really want”
    and i might add:
    or even want to look at
    or want to talk to …..

    i was like
    “Yup.” “Score!! Another one for Rori!!”

    i realize i have never never never really known what men are like until i got on this website.
    it sounds like yehyehyeh when you start reading rori’s stuff, like let’s get to the good part willya?? i want to know how to get him to ___________…!

    but rori

    RORI!!!!??? HOW DID YOU GET SO SMART???!! 🙂

    anyway, i was still processing about why B had affected me like that so i went to this fairly large park which is about 1/3 mile from my home!! that i never go to!!! that i am going to start going to!!!
    and got out and walked, sat on a park bench, laid on the park bench, looked up at the blue sky through the oak branches… gorgeous day here.
    when i walked back to my car about a quarter of a mile away i NOTICED a man which i have to pat myself on the back for paying attention two times.

    i noticed him head across the parking lot from the ballfield he was at to throw something away waaaaaaay over “there”. it was just a little pice of something but i realized as i got closer that he was fiddling around stalling and then because i am now LOOKING :), realized that he waited and was timing it to begin walking back to the ballfield so that we would be at the exact spot in the road at the exact same time…. to the footstep….. i almost laughed out loud….i hope he didn’t think he was being discreet.

    im sure they do this all the time with us goddesses and we don’t even realize it.

    he must have not liked what he saw because:
    my eyes were riveted on him, i was watching every move he made through very dark sunglasses to see what he was going to do next… as we got closer
    he just kind of hunched his shoulders over a tiny bit and put his head down a tiny tiny bit and didn’t make eye contact.

    what i think is this:
    they look at us all the time. i mean LOOK.
    we just don’t know it or realize it.

    is there something rori has written about this?
    i think there is.
    i think i remember reading something about this, like that we’re a magnet just by being a girl…. something like that….

    if anybody can remember where that is…

    ((((( DARIA )))))???!!!
    you always remember … can you remember where this is???
    i would love to read it.

    for now, i’m going to keep noticing to see if i read this right today because im absolutely positively SURE about the first one today, but not absolutely positively sure about the second one.,,

    and yet i know what i saw.

  250.  #250janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:25 pm

    woooo hoooo

    im out in the moonlight
    vibin with the moon.

    got my lunar water out here
    oh yeh

    but ye old battery on ye old netbook just said “Low Battery” so going to go take a hot herbal bath with herbs from my rescued herb pots and get lots of sleep.

  251.  #251janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:37 pm

    thanks sherry!

  252.  #252janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:38 pm

    renee, i am interested to find out too….:)

  253.  #253Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 7:43 pm

    ok, I’m gonna riff on something here.
    I don’t wanna offend anyone.
    But I feel triggered by Jajune’s last blog…
    Jajune..darlin’ it has nothing to do with you personally, I’m in a wierd spot and I feel soooooooooooo jealous that men notice you.
    So I’m gonna riff on the feelings I have and I hope you know it’s about ME and not you.
    I feel jealous
    Annoyed and sinking in my stomach at the same time.
    I feel angry and foot stomping and unfair and tantrummy and pouty and lip out and arm crossed.
    I’m a GIRL too!
    Why dont me notice ME!?!?!?!?
    They look through me!
    They don’t see me
    Unless it’s as a physical object that takes up space to be stepped around
    I have had doors literally closed in my face
    I have put on my long swingy teal and gold skirt and gold top and gotten a latte and hair down and makeup on and NOTHING!?!!?!?!?
    I feel frurious
    How can I feel wanting and not wanting something at the same time
    WTF is THAT!?!?!?!?
    I want to be seen but I want to be SAFE
    I want men to make me feel safe
    I want to be smiled at
    I want to be talked to and asked for my number
    I want to be out with my sister and have someone see me INSTEAD of her
    I feel a stone in my chest and tight in my eyes and scalp
    I feel sooo frustrated
    I feel hateful and bad and spoiled for wanting too much attention

  254.  #254janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:44 pm

    hi brenda,
    this stuff that’s coming up is history but it’s still important or *was* b/c it was still creating problems.

    i can see rori’s point about circular dating until there’sa ring on our fingers just from looking back now at what happened in the situation with B.

    good lesson.

    hard won.

    goodnight goddesses everywhere!

  255.  #255janjune on August 16, 2010 at 7:46 pm



    they ARE looking at you, you just don’t know it.

    that was what i was saying!!

  256.  #256Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 7:51 pm

    Jajune..I really don’t think they ARE.
    Unless they’re doing it where I can’t see them…behind me?
    Thanks for the reasurrance…I appreciate it!

  257.  #257Jennifer on August 16, 2010 at 7:52 pm

    your name is JANjune…I’m a dumbass…sorry ;-(

  258.  #258Lucy on August 16, 2010 at 8:01 pm

    Hmmm. I’m joining okcupid. Did any of you read this on there?

    “As a woman, you are totally awesome but not exempt from contacting others. You’ll get better results here if you take the initiative and send messages to those who interest you. We’ve studied this extensively; women who make the first move end up with better-looking and more desirable matches. We can’t emphasize this enough.”

    What do you all think? Rori??????

  259.  #259Tmizz on August 16, 2010 at 8:03 pm

    Okay, I want to write about sex. Because it’s really important. But first, I want to write about one of Rori’s tools, from a recent eletter. I actually stopped reading it so I could jump off and write this…

    First, I want to admit that I was thinking about my ex today. I have no idea why. First, it was just a thought like, “I want to talk to him.” Then I convinced myself not to contact him at all. But the more I convinced myself, the more I really wanted to. Then I got into a conversation with my neighbor, and she said something that made me think of him again. And I thought, “he would really get a kick out of this.” But I continued to think about “leaning back.” About not getting in and “doing something.” But that FEELING, that URGE would not go away! But if I thought something like “I really want him to call,” that just felt “needy” and BAD.

    So let me go back to the “ex” part – we’re still friends. Or at least, that was the deal. I “let him go” for reasons that I still think are valid. We had one conversation since then that started off great, and then devolved into something not-great. We chatted once after that, but he still seemed sore. I KNOW that he doesn’t hate me. In fact, I suspect that he’s thinking about me all the time. He probably still likes me a lot. He’s probably just pissed at me for “dumping” him. But now I’m mind-reading.

    Long story short, I kept thinking about him. I kept distracting myself. But finally I succumbed. I sent him a few short IMs, and then stopped. He didn’t respond.

    I became aware of how I was feeling at this point: a little off-balance. Kind of anxious. And then I started picking him apart, too. “What’s he doing? Why hasn’t he gotten back to me? Is he mad at me after all? Is he just playing games with me to make me think he’s mad when he really isn’t, just because he thinks he can play me like that?” And then I got angry. I got mad. Not throwing-things-about type angry. Just indignant. And then starting to wonder: What is it that I’m doing that makes me come across as so “needy”? And why, even when I KNOW not to do certain things. And even when I can identify that “needy” feeling, it still comes out, and I still do these things – not always automatically. Sometimes after thinking about it a lot! It’s like I feel that I “have” to. Maybe that’s where the neediness comes from? And what’s worse: do I have a “need” to be “needy”? Now that’s a deep one, and I’m going to have to think about that….

    Meanwhile, as I started to become aware of how I felt, I started to also then think about myself. Remind myself that *I* am the one who is important here. *I* am the person I care about in this situation. My feelings and my opinions matter to ME. His choices are HIS. He can call if he wants to. He can respond if he wants to. He can sit at home and twiddle his thumbs if he wants to. It’s all the same to me. Well, it’s not, if I’m honest, but all the same, no matter what he does, I am a resourceful person, and I am going to be doing something in my life that I enjoy, whether he is there or not. His choices are totally his. And so are mine.

    Then I read Rori’s letter. She had five things to watch out for, to see if you were thinking about a man, and of course, I was doing ALL FIVE of those things. Right up to getting in touch with him. [But the FIRST thing I had to do at that point was NOT kick myself for it. I simply said, ok, I did that. So what? now I’m going to do something else.] And – I was laughing – I even told him in one message that I was thinking about him! lol. That was like, double duty. Here are the five things from the eletter:

    “1. You think about him, even when you’re doing
    something or are somewhere where there are other
    things to look at and think about

    2. You go from thinking about him to wanting
    him – like you would a glorious piece of
    chocolate fudge brownie

    3. You analyze every move he makes and
    everything he says, and every move you make and
    everything you say

    4. You initiate contact – calling him, leaning
    in for a kiss, hugging him, sending emails,
    texts, cards…

    5. You worry about everything you do and say
    and everything that happens out of fear it will
    push him away”

    I did all of these. And then I just kept hovering around the worrying part. It was classic! But then I did an amazing thing, that really helped. Before I read on, I back-tracked. I started at number five, thought about what I was doing there, then went back through each of the other four and did the same thing, until, when I got to “1”, I then counted to “0” and there was nothing left! It was like the thought just went away.

    Thanks, Rori!

  260.  #260janjune on August 16, 2010 at 8:07 pm

    had to come inside the battery on my netbook konked out.

    that’s what rori is saying, i wish i knew where to find the blog posts or whatever….

    but didn’t realize until today that


    i’m no beauty queen!! believe me!!

    i would never never have noticed these men—they were not in direct sight, i was looking somewhere else, not interested, busy, didn’t see them…

    but rori keeps telling us that these men will come from somewhere— sounded to me like out of the woodwork, in droves once we get our vibe right.

    i think for me part of getting my vibe right is noticing THEM. not the one in front of me ignoring me or the one flirting with someone else,….
    the OTHER ones!

    i think they’re looking now, i just never noticed it before and i think they’ve always been looking and just never noticed it and i think they’re looking at all of us and we just don’t notice it. because they’re far away. physically. they’re watching from a place where we don’t see them, like a quarter mile away or the other parking lot!!!

    no matter what we look like they like us like looking at us, want to look at us and are looking at us whether we see them doing it or not whether we’re dressed to the nines or in a ripped sweatsuit with stains on it, whether we’re young or old or classically pretty or have our own look or overweight or underweight or ‘just right’ THEY’RE LOOKING AT US and they want to be with us and be around us and i can see that we are kind of magical to them.

    ALL of us.

    i feel like i got in on a little secret today!!


    ALL of us.

    you will see it Jennifer.

    and i think this is what rori is saying
    that they ARE looking at us
    ALL of us,
    MANY of them
    MANY MANY of them.

    yes, i believe this i don’t feel it now don’t even think it

  261.  #261janjune on August 16, 2010 at 8:16 pm

    lucy, i wonder about that advice.

    guess someone could do an experiment and see.

  262.  #262Lucy on August 16, 2010 at 8:30 pm

    I just took the quiz on cupid that tells you which states have the best dates for you — and wow! WH’s state (Delaware) made the list of the five best states for me! And, interestingly enough, it’s the only state of the five that is close enough to be reasonable…

    I think he and I are meant to be….. 🙂

  263.  #263dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 9:07 pm

    Hi, I just came by to report on how my boy energy is taking care of me
    1. I got all of my laundry together
    2. I decluttered my jewelry and threw useless or ugly pieces away (thanks for the inspiration, Jennifer, lol)
    3. I cruised my house for garbage and eliminated it
    4. I went to the restaurant for take out alone even though this is a very NV-inducing experience. I held my head up high and cheered myself on that i deserved it.

    I ignored LI’s call. He says he wants to hear my voice and how i’m doing, but I just don’t want to talk to him right now. I can feel myself missing him, but I don’t want to move my mouth and make sound come out of it for him. That feels like TOO MUCH EFFORT right now.

    I am feeling good and grounded and peaceful whew.

  264.  #264Lucy on August 16, 2010 at 9:08 pm

    okcupid is interesting…. I am in the process of answering questions on there… and this is one of the questions:

    “Would you need to sleep with someone before you considered marrying them?”

  265.  #265dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    lucy i have never signed up for a dating site. i tried eharmony but it didn’t accept me, and that’s where I ended it except making a match account to spy on my ex and witness my imaginary relationship with him be imaginary.

    right now i am feeling very guilty for not calling him back. it feels cruel. but i really really don’t feel like talking to him. i want space. he is not calling for any urgent reason except to hear about my day, is it okay to just not call a guy?

    maybe i will want to talk to him tomorrow or the next day.

  266.  #266dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    woah i feel suspicious and like these people must think people were born yesterday about seeing “i’m seeing someone/here for friends” and “i’m married/here for friends” as status options on OK Cupid.

    Yeah, I’m married and I’m here on the self-advertised “google of dating sites,” just lookin for some friends…

  267.  #267Isa on August 16, 2010 at 10:15 pm


  268.  #268Tina on August 16, 2010 at 10:35 pm

    Hi Brenda, I was out on a hunting trip with eggshell man. The whole hunting gathering thing was cool, we killed and skinned a moose.

  269.  #269Tina on August 16, 2010 at 11:37 pm

    I really wasnt *thinking we would actually kill a moose, I rather enjoyed the 4 wheeling through the woods. When we stopped, I poured myself a cup of coffee , as I was pouring it and standing behind eggshell man,he shouted theres a moose, he aimed and shot and killed it, i watched it drop, like wow holy shit he killed a moose, I drank my coffee.

  270.  #270Tina on August 16, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    we went searching for it , it wasnt to far , maybe , im guessing 200 yards? we walked to it flagged it then went back to the 4 wheeler to drag it out, I was in charge of leading us out, since it was pass dark by this point and we coudlnt see and it was really a bumpy ride. so I walked with a flash light while he dragged it on the back , out of the woods. he started to complain about my sense of direction, I felt kinda pissed and told him, i cant pave the effin way for fck sakes, anyway we got out to the road, then had to drive on the four wheeler to get the truck with all the knives and stuff yuck! but yeah, I had to hold it legs and stuff, while he gutted it. yuck!

  271.  #271dorothea on August 16, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    tina, can u get me up to speed on eggshell man? i remember u were feelin shaky about him so i feel curious now how things are going. hopefully better!

  272.  #272Tina on August 16, 2010 at 11:49 pm

    Dorothea, yeah Im not sure how things are going. I just feel glad to be back home. We had another argument blah, the next day about mel gibson’s rant.

  273.  #273Tina on August 16, 2010 at 11:57 pm

    He says Im stubborn. I feel challenged, when we agrue about stupid stuff. He says I’m pulling “moves” yeah so what? you dont like my moves , go fck yourself then. I feel angry, my mouth does go off, I feel out of control 🙂

  274.  #274Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:01 am

    lol, your funny dorothea. I was reading your swear words earlier and its the only thing that made me laugh oh besides watching the one that flew over the cuckoo’s nest.

  275.  #275Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:04 am

    Im stuck in my *head after spending time with eggshell man blah. I need to feel, i need to feel, I feel, I feel oh what do I feel?

  276.  #276Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:10 am

    Oh yeah, I feel like having SEX! I feel like watching PORN lol. Is watching porn together taking it to the next level? oh hell if I know.

  277.  #277Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:15 am

    I noticed that in the middle of arguing with eggshell man, that I wanted to have sex, I feel weird about that maybe next time?

  278.  #278Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:45 am

    Oh, I know what happened, I didnt say, “I want to feel closer” yeah thats it! me bad oops. Next time, I said that before and it seemed to defuse it.

  279.  #279Tina on August 17, 2010 at 12:54 am

    I want to feel closer, is not something I feel comfortable saying, my usual mo is to just say eff it! Im done!

  280.  #280Tina on August 17, 2010 at 1:17 am

    I feel all fighty and stuff. I feel like fighting for intimacy and closeness 🙂 I noticed that when he cut his toe with a knife, I stayed in my feminine energy, I didnt feel like saying or doing anything , I thought your a big boy, go to the hospital but your not getting any pity from me, just out of feeling resistance, defiant, not give a crap attitude. Im not supposed to anyway, so that worked out in my favor. He did ask me to hand him something to stop the bleeding so I gave him a napkin, oh just one napkin. we got to the butcher shop and we left some fur on and he had to cut it off before it was brought in, this was all after the argument about mel lol.

  281.  #281Tina on August 17, 2010 at 1:26 am

    I did commend him on his hunting skills 🙂 he did drive us to our hunting grounds , I did drive until my thumb felt sore, its a big bike.

  282.  #282Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:09 am

    janjune – Rori says several things about this, one of which is… there are men out in the world everywhere… at the supermarket… NOTICING you…

    NOTICE them noticing you… smile at them when you see one looking at you —

    and i see it all the time, men and women too, we are aware of the people around us, but don’t necessarily make the connection of eyes for enough to FEEL moved and vulnerable

    the magnet tool, i used it today, enhanced on it, i used squiggly energy lines, like my magnetic vibes…

    the tool is in an e-letter, i will reprint it now after findng it :

    So I took away that boys and men are pretty
    much exactly as they always were! Men still want
    to feel like men and act like men in the most old-
    fashioned way. And girls – all girls, are magnets.

    So – I want you to know that you already ARE a
    magnet for men!

    If it doesn’t look and feel like that in your
    love life right now – that you’re a magnet for
    men – I want to help you get past whatever it is
    that’s BLOCKING your “magnets” so you can get the
    love you want.

    So, here’s a Tool that’s something you can DO,
    but that’s not about you doing anything with a

    Try this:

    1. Imagine yourself standing or sitting or
    lying down in a beautiful place.

    It can be a beautiful, calm, peaceful place –
    or it could be a wild jungle or a noisy dance club
    full of people.

    I want you to be able to do this all the time,
    anywhere, so try a bunch of different images and

    If you’re feeling yourself actually IN that
    place – step outside of the picture for a moment
    so you can SEE yourself there – as though you’re
    YOU watching YOU. Now…

    2. Watching yourself in the picture in your
    mind…Picture yourself as a Magnet for men.

    See yourself that way from the outside. How it
    looks, with you as a magnet for men.

    Imagine your magnetic energy just radiating
    from your skin, your hair, your body, and as you
    move around the place, or just get comfortable
    there, now…

    3. Picture men running toward you from
    everywhere, pushing and shoving each other aside
    to get to you.

    They’re just showing up, coming into the
    picture you’re seeing… helplessly drawn toward
    you… smiling, bringing gifts…. Now…

    4. Go INSIDE your picture and IMAGINE yourself
    DRAWING in these men from everywhere.

    Imagine even MORE men showing up! All of a
    sudden, men are just showing up from everywhere
    and coming into the picture with you…

    Imagine it working the way a magnet you hold
    on the beach draws in thousands of little pieces
    of iron from the sand.

    Or you can imagine it in any way you like – as
    waves coming toward you, or sparkly energy coming
    from the men to you, or as some magical power you
    have that mesmerizes men and compels them to look
    for you, to find you, to be with you…

    5. Now imagine that all you have to do is
    SMILE, and even MORE men will drop from the skies,
    fly at you from everywhere, and STICK to you like

    6. Smile, and imagine it happening that these
    men are chasing you down to be with you…

    7. The next step is really, really important –
    I want you to EXPERIENCE how it FEELS to be this
    amazing magnet you are.

    If you’re doing it right and full-out, it
    might feel uncomfortable and downright scary…
    that’s GOOD!

    8. I want you to do this small baby-step Tool
    wherever you are, however you feel.

    Just imagine yourself as a magnet from the
    outside, as though you’re looking at yourself,
    and then step into the picture and EXPERIENCE how
    it feels.

    Even if it makes you feel shaky – you will be
    more authentic, more YOURSELF – and SO much more

    A man will be able to FEEL your feelings in
    that moment, and he’ll be drawn to you just as
    the men in your imagination do!

    This is how it works!

    KNOW that you already ARE a magnet -just
    because you’re a girl. (It doesn’t matter what
    age you think you are – you’re a girl, and you
    don’t have to do anything but BE what you already

  283.  #283Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:10 am

    i feel very important, respected, appreciated, big, powerful that you said I always remember.

    I feel like a big pharaoh, i feel wise

    i feel a lil detached too, a little hollow

    i wonder if i feel like im a man or a woman


    i feel uncomfortable a bit with this feeling

    i feel better than, i feel alone

    i feel important though, and loved from afar by my lil audience crowds

    this feels good

    i feel lonely too

    i want both and more

    thank you


    thank u

  284.  #284Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:21 am

    my new practice of being aware of my feelings throughout the day,

    im praying to the orishas when starting an activity, and setting intentions for my activities

    my activity is something like drive to teh store, smoke, make my bed, spend time on the computer, spend time with chris

    each one at the beginning i get in touch with the orisha of doors, to start the activity, i feel very in tune with intent of my day

    i feel less anxiety, i know what i am doing, in touch with spirit with my activity i started the ritual for starting

    also want to revisit the article aobut being happy waiting –

    we feel anxious waiting – what if we felt happy? irealize a lot of my awful unworthy feelings in the day happen when im waiting

    it feels uncomfortable and unfamiliar to feel happy while waiting – but its so possible

    shifting to happy when waiting has also feels great like heart opening … imagining beautifuly touch of joy in while more exciting things are coming up too

    helps me enjoy my day

    feels good


  285.  #285Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:31 am

    “Sometimes it is challenging to read the above statements and uncover your blocks, so see if any of the questions below help you uncover what’s blocking you from making the effort to be happy while you wait…

    (1) What’s the “downside” to being happy while you wait?

    (2) Does it feel “unsafe” to be happy while you wait?

    (3) Are you more comfortable/ familiar with being unhappy?

    (4) Are you afraid of happiness?

    (5) What is the “upside” of being unhappy every time you’re waiting for something?

    These are all powerful questions that I recommend you answer as best you are able… once we know the upside of being unhappy and impatient, we can make healthier changes and choices. So try and figure out,

    How does remaining unhappy
    every time you have to wait
    for something “serve” you?

    Maybe you don’t believe that staying “the same” is serving you, but it must be, or else you would be committed, even inspired to change.

    — if i feel unhappy when waiting i feel safe… from being too happy and then feeling rejected and blindisided by other kids/people who look at me like i am overeager and i feel rejected and horrible about myself like i am socially naive and even worse socially unlikeable not cool and unattractive yuck that feels icky

    aslo it protects me from feeling so happy and then feeling disappointed when i get the icky feeling like above even without other people like i can be feeling happy and then something will happen to make me feel worse so … .by being unhappy already i am protected from the feeling of disappointment which i feel afraid of and unable to cope with oh no ick ack ick

    — and its a habit of feeling unhappy while waiting, people do it, i bond with people with it, i mgiht feel attacked for being different energy i feel afraid of feeling judged yum i love myself

    this felt scary

    thank u

    i have realized today that working hard is stretching comfort levels and feeling “negative” feeling emotions that you dont want to feel and continuing on a decided path with an intention of feeling good

    which is lovely

    i am working hard

  286.  #286Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:33 am

    I am a female philospher


    female like the sphinx

    my scent

    will wet

    the nose of your nite dreams

    many years from now

    you will remember my lion thighs

  287.  #287Daria on August 17, 2010 at 2:38 am

    yeah Tina, I want to feel closer – feels scary yeah…

  288.  #288Daria on August 17, 2010 at 3:07 am

    I am more comfortable and familiar with being unhappy in certain situations including waiting… I am noticing myself fringe unhappy or running thoughts or frowny facing or blank facing out of habit

    This time I am going to happy it is on to I know how to do it — open heart trust don’t anticipate attack

  289.  #289Daria on August 17, 2010 at 3:12 am

    My purpose in the moment is to be here

    Doin wat I’m doin

    Thank u orisha

    My activity rite now is preparing for sleep


    On another note — man not giving me respect love. — feels good to be turned on around him… I feel heat amd his body affecting mine when in the room. That fed good I ge like I’m being paid attention to by his body ife givvrm to and relaxed safe … I feel a lil surprised to notice the feeling my body knows we are lovers

  290.  #290Sherry on August 17, 2010 at 5:58 am

    Daria – Thank you so much for the post on “waiting!’ Wow! That resonates with me so much! I really admire your process.. thank you for sharing it!

  291.  #291Renee on August 17, 2010 at 6:16 am

    Tmizz — Interesting point about needing to be needy. I feel the same way at times.

    Just this morning, I had this overwhelming urge to lean forward and txt the guy I’m most interested in at this point…actually composed 2 msgs and then made myself delete them in a brief moment of sanity. But I’m wondering why I felt the need to do that?

    This guys’ been in heavy contact with me since this weekend (all at his initiation) and seems to be really into me at this point, and yet, just because I was feeling like I wanted a distraction from work and, I guess, feeling “needy”, I was so tempted to write him just to get more attention, despite the fact that I know he’s at work and he txted me several very sweet msgs right before we went to bed.

    Needing to be needy…interesting thought and probably something I need to think about. It felt so much better when, after I quelled my urge to contact him, he msged me instead. Leaning back feels much better long term, but it’s those short term “needy” moments when the urge to lean forward crops up…working on this but obviously I have a ways to go.

    So did you end up hearing back from your ex at all? How do you feel about having leaned forward today?

  292.  #292Renee on August 17, 2010 at 6:36 am

    Janjune — I think Rori’s right — there ARE men everywhere once your vibe is right. My vibe is much better than it was a few months ago (heck, it’s better now than it was a few days ago when I was having PMS and feeling all insecure and stuff) and I swear, there are cute men coming at me from every direction.

    And I know for a fact that I wouldn’t have given some of these men the time of day a few months ago, because cougar man apparently emailed me on Match a few months ago and I never emailed him back! I have no idea why either, other than I must have been hung up on the age difference at the time, but if I take that out of the equation, he’s treating me (so far) exactly how I like to be treated…he’s really “stepping up” just the way Rori mentioned and to think, I totally ignored him a few months ago.

    There’s another cutie who’s been emailing me the past few days who also emailed me a while back and I completely ignored…this man, too, seems to be ready to really step up (he’s not dawdling and has already asked me out)…perhaps I just didn’t value what these men have to offer when I was running around in my insecurity. I think I was more intent on finding men who were a “challenge” to me instead of being interested in men who were showing they could actually step up. The fact that I’m attracting more attractive, successful “step up” kind of men seems very promising to me…I like being swept off my feet:-).

  293.  #293Brenda on August 17, 2010 at 9:44 am

    Janjune, RE: #252 – That is a beautiful piece of writing. I could hear that as the narrative spoken to the big-inning of a fantastic romance movie, showing a man and a woman silently acting out those silent scenes….

    What do you think? 🙂

  294.  #294janjune on August 17, 2010 at 11:58 am


    “what do i thinK?”

    i think you are a very creative, innovative, intelligent, inspired, inspiring, kind, unjealous, accepting, adventuresome goddess.
    that’s what i think!

    love you girl!

  295.  #295janjune on August 17, 2010 at 12:06 pm

    daria!!!! thank you so much for coming up with that information about the magnet.

    seriously, you can process your feelings about a compliment, but you really are the human index for roridom. 🙂

    i just love you and the way you always try to guide new goddesses back to “the rules” as you call them.

    it’s so helpful for those of us goddesses who are trying to learn this way of relating to the men in our worlds because it’s so easy to get sidetracked with other valid points of view…

    and there are many… other valid points of view.

    it’s just that i’m choosing this one.

    and you do help keep the program in front of us on the blog.

    love you!

  296.  #296janjune on August 17, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    well, renne, i’m just seeing what you described!… it almost makes me laugh… first, about how *right* rori is about all this stuff and secondly, about the lengths men go to to just even get a look at a woman they find attractive.

    and that’s the other thing rori says that i find astonishing!!! that what they think is attractive isn’t what we women think!!!

    oh, it’s so funny!@! i feel like laughing!!! right out loud!!!

    i feel a fizzy tickly effervescence in my tummy between my gut and my pubic bone.
    it feels fresh and lively and fun and open and sunshine and breeze and blue sky and airy

    i just want to chuckle and giggle a little bit and throw my head back and laugh out loud from my belly that men love us so much!

  297.  #297Daria on August 17, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    yay Renee!! awesome!

    my girl who complains about why i have so many men and she just wants one to stick with,

    got a phonecall from a guy and a picture – she and her cousin were making such a big deal of how horribly ugly he was – and when i saw him, it looked like a TALL HANDSOME MAN WITH STRONG FEATURES

    yeah his features may have been very strong, but it was definitely enough handsomness in there for me to possibly be attracted to him in real life

    im like wow!!! girl you gotta practice and talk to men who come toward you, thats how u get more

  298.  #298janjune on August 17, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    i’m feeling inspired by, it think it was dorothea’s post awhile back about using her boy energy to get things done.

    that’s what i’m going to do.

    go use my boy energy to put my physical world into order.

  299.  #299Tmizz on August 17, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    Hi Brenda –

    It was nice to hear your thoughts about leaning forward with your man yesterday. Yes, I think sometimes that works. But it only works if you’re not trying to “make” it work. lol i.e. you’re not *trying* to make him contact you by not contacting him. You’re simply not contacting him, so he’s leaning forward into that space. I think that’s more of what I need to work. It happens for me sometimes, too!

    But not when I’m in that “needy” space. Because that needy space is a negative one, not a positive one. It’s not the kind of space a person wants to be in! I mean, they’re almost the same thing, but not, right? Total qualitative difference. And I think that’s what Rori is talking about when she talks about our “vibe.”

    We’re “creating space.” But is it a good, positive, warm, welcoming space? Or is it a harsh, caustic atmosphere that says, “You be here, or else!” teehee. It looks so silly written out. But that’s what it’s like sometimes!

    Anyway, back to your question: how did I feel leaning forward?

    Not that good. Kinda frustrated. A little icky. A little ready to be harsh with myself about that, but also ready to be patient with myself also. I was ready to recognize my desires. To say to myself: it’s okay to want what you want. It’s okay to feel what you feel. Hey, you feel needy right now. Maybe that’s okay! Nobody should be able to invalidate you, even for that. Actually, that just came out now, as I was writing this. And it felt good! I think putting myself down for feeling “needy” was part of the problem. Only I didn’t realize it at the time.

    But thinking about the “needing to be needy” issue made me think of my mom. I recognize that it’s a deep-seated unconscious psychological reaction that I’m having, in this and other intimate – even sometimes friendship – relationships. Because my mom is the kind of person who “needs” people around her to be needy. She needs it to feed her ego somehow. Without it, it’s like she’s afraid she will wither and die. She rejects people who don’t need her enough. Sometimes she rejects people BECAUSE they’re needy. It’s totally unpredictable, and that’s part of the poison, the addiction. You keep trying to anticipate or second-guess whatever he needs are going to be in any given moment, and you decide how you are going to “be” according to that. I got very good at that, growing up. I was the oldest, and so I had no older siblings as buffers. It was my survival mechanism, and so I have to say to myself that was a GOOD thing. It meant that I was able to adapt myself to a threatening situation. Now I have to REARRANGE and re-adapt. Because not every situation is like that one! Not everybody needs me to be needy! But trying to get my head around that is like trying to squeeze and orange with a garlic press. it really doesn’t work! Anyway, so I just relax. Try to go easy on myself, and be grateful for the little baby steps that I’ve been able to take over the last couple of years. When I stop and take a look back, I realize, I’ve come an incredibly long way! But it’s not over yet.

    Meanwhile, no. I did not hear back from Mr. Ex. Let’s call him D. It really does annoy me, because it feels like he’s blowing me off on purpose. But I really don’t feel like I have a lot to expect from this guy. He was the one who clearly liked me from the beginning, but I realize that I’m the one who initiated most of what went on between us. In the end, I wasn’t satisfied, because it seemed like he just wasn’t stepping up – even he seemed to have every intention of doing so. He would always come up with last-minute excuses or “reasons” why he couldn’t hang out, or he would pick a fight, so that he’d then tell me that he didn’t want to. It got to be very frustrating. I told him several times that it just wasn’t working out for me. But I still LIKE him. That’s the problem. 🙂 *sigh*

    It was much better when he liked me and I didn’t care! lol

    So what I did was, I went back and read the rest of Rori’s letter. I did exactly what she said. I imagined what it felt like to be just grabbing onto him and how frustrating and futile that was – how it made him want to just pull in the opposite direction, like a dog on a leash. Then I imagined how it is if you just let go of the leash. It drops to the ground, but the dog doesn’t run away, it just stands there. Then I imagined myself turning and walking away and the dog trotting after me. After I did the visualization, I literally stood up, opened my hands and turned around, looking at the first object that came into my vision. It was my massage table! I am a massage therapist and I am starting my own business.

    Then I laughed! The message from the Universe was clear. it was definitely telling me what to do! The massage table and my business and that work is what’s important to me. It’s my life! I need to be following my own life and my own dreams. Then the men who will come trotting after me will be the RIGHT men, and I will be able to pick and choose the one that *I* like – not placing myself in that icky, undesirable position of “wanting” or “needing” to be liked or even approved of by a man. ANY man. Because I already know that they are the ones who should be – and do – want to be with me. They should be the ones beating down my doors to let me in. They should be like flakes of iron just flying through the universe to stick to me! Like the amazing Goddess that I am! (I already had one ex-bf call the Goddess dressing that I love the “me dressing.” So I know it’s true! 😉

    Ugh. I keep thinking I’m going to write a really short message, and then it just gets longer and longer!

    JanJune – I wanted to say that I really like a lot of things that you’ve had to say so far (though I haven’t had time to read all of yours or everyone’s responses). But I especially appreciate what you had to say about waiting for sex until marriage. I feel the same way. In that, I think with the “right person,” it would be better to wait, because it would make it more special to have that deep commitment first, and then be able to really BE with my Husband, than to just have sex because we are there and because we want it. I’m all for sex, don’t get me wrong. I love sex, and I crave it, and my body loves it, and it makes me happy. But I really think there is something to be said for “waiting” whether or not it is for religious reasons. I know several female friends who waited, and I think it only strengthened their marriages. In fact, I like what you had to say about the guys, too. The right ones will stick around, and respect your decision. Also, I think most guys, even though they obviously want sex *RIGHT NOW* because their hormones are beating at them from inside their brains, in the long run, they want a strong woman who isn’t going to “give in” to them just because “they want to.” Not like it’s a test. I just think, in the end, they would probably me more grateful. And, like you said, trust you more. Which isn’t to say that lots of trust and connection can’t be built with sex that happens earlier on. There are so many factors that come into play. But for me, even though I am not a virgin, I still like to think that, with the person I eventually marry, it will be possible to hold off, because I won’t *need* to have sex – either to prove that I’m good in bed, or that he is. I want to try framing it in such a way that says, “Hey, I want to do this as much as you do, but I’m trusting you that when we get there, it is going to be totally amazing! And I think it will be worth waiting for.” Then of course giving him a sly smile that will totally drive him through the roof. He’ll be biting his knuckles, but holding himself back, because he knows he wants me THAT BAD!! haha. 🙂 Just thinking about that makes me feel good. 🙂

    And one other reason, too. I think most people think it’s the guy who loses interest after he has sex. More often than not, it’s me who loses interest! Or I become needy and clingy. Or both! And with a guy I really care about, I would NOT want that to happen! So really, waiting until marriage would be like an insurance policy for the relationship: Have sex now and it will be great, but short term. Or, wait, get married, and HAPPILY EVER AFTER!

    Not that it’s really all that black and white. But I think, for me, and knowing myself and what I like, I think it’s a scenario that could work for me. But it would have to be a decision that I make *for me.* Not to ingratiate myself to anyone else. The same with making the decision to have sex. Thanks, Janjune!

  300.  #300janjune on August 17, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    hi Tmizz!
    love the name!

    yes, it’s so beautiful to be able to make our own decisions about what’s right for us without influence from others.

    just knowing what *i* want is a very big step for me… separating my feelings from what someone else wants *from * me or me feeling like i have to comply with what they want in order to make them happy and thus make them stay…

    it is freeing to be wrestling that issue to the ground with my boy energy, making way for the girl energy in me to step up and step out and shine and love shining…

    i’m now finding it’s that way for me with the sex issue but also with very many other things…
    i think now that sex was just the first step of many in me determining what was in my best interest…

  301.  #301girl on August 17, 2010 at 3:16 pm

    I hate sex lately. I hate the sounds smells textures mess and the feeling of irritation overwhelms the momentary pleasure. All I want him to do is get off and be done with it. I don’t like turning him down for sex, so I’ve been doing it anyway. I am realizing that I like the game of sexuality, but now that I’m in a secure relationship, the allure of sex is minimal. The only time I ever liked sex was in a purely physical relationship, which was amplified by (and totally dependent on) marijuana. Urgh…

  302.  #302dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 4:37 pm


    don’t have sex if you hate it. please. communicate with him. you have all the tools you need to communicate with him.

    i feel really angry and protective hearing you are going through the motions of sex with your non-husband because u don’t like turning him down. hello, what about YOU? don’t freakin have sex if you dont want to. please. ahhh i feel triggered.

  303.  #303janjune on August 17, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    just recording-

    so many changes taking place… this is how this program has worked for me…
    boom! all of a sudden i get a whole bunch of things all at one time.
    it’s kind of overwhelming, so well, i guess it happens the way it happens…

    right now i’m dealing with a fairly important situation which would ordinarily put me into a hissy fit, but i just feel mad about it, not like i want to go smack somebody.
    just agitated and annoyed at people’s disregard for others, how it’s ALL about mememe with some people and they frankly don’t give a shit whether that works out for *you* or not. even when it’s their job, they just work you in to what they want regardless of the needs of the person who is paying for the service… i have fought and fought that the last two years and i have won too but at a great cost to me emotionally. and physically.
    but now i have learned a new way of dealing with it.

    quit fighting.
    state my request.
    follow up when they don’t answer.
    repeat my request.
    after they quit trying to explain why they can’t do it, why it can’t be done that way, which generally has taken 4-5 minutes, state it one more time so i know they’ve heard me because now i want to ask them who to talk to to make sure this gets done this way.

    I say:
    “it needs to be done this way. who do i need to talk to to make sure this company can handle doing it this way?… i want to go somewhere else if this is a problem because it’s not optional. i want it done this way. who do i talk to?”

    ooooh, i feel so in my boy energy typing this!!!
    i know this is very basic, baby stuff but i’m just learning it. 🙁

    🙂 i love my boy energy!!
    i love using my boy energy to take care of me and my loved ones.

    i love that i can switch hats now!!!

    even if it’s not in relation to a man.

    rori’s Tools work in my whole life. with everyone. for me right now its just knowing i need to put the hat on.

    like today was the first time i realized i had the ability to just stop in the middle of a situation and choose, and put on my boy hat.

    it was an enlightened moment for me.
    kind of magical, mysterious

    i feel like i just saw fairy dust;
    we can change our situation and some outcomes and the present and sometimes future results by changing our energy.

    it feels like i found another secret.

  304.  #304Lucy on August 17, 2010 at 5:40 pm

    I feel confused about Evan’s email — “You Do Not Want Him Anyway.”

    I feel confused about why he wrote off Dylan as a player.

    The story goes: They had sex on their second date. Alice got needy and leaned forward and established an imaginary relationship in her head. Dylan withdrew. Alice wants him “back.”

    Evan says: “Dylan WAS a player. Dylan DID sleep with her right away. Dylan WASN’T ready for a relationship.

    “In fact, when Alice looked at it objectively, Dylan was kind of a selfish jerk for coming on so strong and pulling away so abruptly. .

    “And yet here she was, reeling from raw emotion, begging me, her trusted dating coach, to help her GET THE SELFISH JERK BACK.”

    I don’t understand why he is considered a “selfish jerk” and a player. Was he supposed to want a relationship with Alice just because it’s what SHE wanted and was pushing for?

    I honestly feel confused.

  305.  #305dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    I invite anyone to join me this evening for a beginners workout I selected for myself from youtube. It starts with some yoga for stress relief (7 min), is followed by a “bikini bootcamp” (10 min), and then a 15 min ab workout.

    I love youtube. here are the links

    I want to lose weight big time. I want to be hot again. I’m still hot…actually I am just saying that because it feels better to say it instead of listening to the voices that tell me i’m yucky.

    exercising to proactively prevent depressive episodes. Works pretty good as long as you routinely exercise.

    anyone want to join me? i’m going to get started in about 20 min, but it would feel cool if any other goddesses wanted to try some youtube workouts with me over the next few days or weeks.

  306.  #306dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    I invite anyone to join me this evening for a beginners workout I selected for myself from youtube. It starts with some yoga for stress relief (7 min), is followed by a “bikini bootcamp” (10 min), and then a 15 min ab workout.

    I love youtube. I’m posting the links separately because with the links I got moderated.

    I want to lose weight big time. I want to be hot again. I’m still hot…actually I am just saying that because it feels better to say it instead of listening to the voices that tell me i’m yucky.

    exercising to proactively prevent depressive episodes. Works pretty good as long as you routinely exercise.

    anyone want to join me? i’m going to get started in about 20 min, but it would feel cool if any other goddesses wanted to try some youtube workouts with me over the next few days or weeks.

  307.  #307dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    www dot youtube dot com /watch?v=1EVUoBQGqP8
    www dot youtube dot com /watch?v=7eOdcFVrFSw
    www dot youtube dot com /watch?v=edUFqkWSve8&feature=related

    replace the “dot” with periods and delete the space before the “/watch” hope it works!

  308.  #308dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    woo i am pumped for the workout of the day and i will post tomorrow’s selection here tomorrow in case anyone wants to join me. by join me i mean do the workout sometime that evening with me.

  309.  #309dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    er the same evening as me. not at the same time, though that would feel cool.

  310.  #310Jennifer on August 17, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    I am looking at my okcupid site
    I have NOTHING to say about me.
    I’m drawing a blank.

  311.  #311dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 7:38 pm

    i feel energized and powerful after doing my youtube workout. the yoga for stress relief felt amazing. i felt a little embarrassed for knocking yoga but i honestly think i would feel embarrassed to do something that feels that good and might make me look funny in a class. i feel disconnected from the type of person who enjoys “yoga.” i did some of the little yoga stretches many times. The bikini bootcamp vid managed to kick my ass in less than its 10 min. It feels so reassuring that there are people out there devoted to finding fast ways to stay in shape a healthy way. The ab video was ok, but toward the end it felt confusing, so tomorrow I am going to find a new ab video, do bikini bootcamp day 2, and the same yoga vid to start.

  312.  #312dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 7:46 pm

    OK Jennifer, here is my content for you based on how i perceive you to be really feeling.

    “Hi handsome studs (or perhaps creepy mongoloid), my name is Jennifer, and I’m feeling totally blank on what to say here about myself. I have writers block and it honestly feels like it’s induced by my dating-site pessimism. This feels especially frustrating to me, because i am a dynamic girl with passion for life who currently feels excited about hearing from interesting men.”

  313.  #313Jennifer on August 17, 2010 at 8:04 pm

    That DOES sound like how I feel.
    Maybe I’ll use that as my about me essay
    I got the what books and food do you like and movies and music and what not
    Shoot, I’ll throw it in and see what happens.
    I may take out the mogoloid part thought…it feels mean.

  314.  #314dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 8:07 pm

    haha that makes me feel excited. yeah i would definitely feel vague and maybe even a little creepy not filling out the part about my movies and books and all that after an intro like that.

  315.  #315Jennifer on August 17, 2010 at 8:10 pm

    I changed it to creepy stalkers. Feels better to judge behaviour (that people choose) than looks and stuff.
    Ain’t I just politically correct.
    My cousin annoys the crap outta me
    I put a thing about work on my FB and she’s all trying to tell me there’s been a LAW passed that says I can’t talk about work on FB.
    The go’vt dont’ pass laws like that….maybe your workplace has a policy..but mine don’t .

  316.  #316Simply Shannon on August 17, 2010 at 8:30 pm

    Jennifer, I feel surprised. Nothing to say about you? Huh?

    Inspiration words for the next iteration…

    Intellectual men

    Maybe a sentence for each of these telling why you love them or how you feel about them.

    Thirty something red head who loves…
    Judo – I feel XYZ
    Cheesecake – I feel XYZ

  317.  #317Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 8:33 pm

    Or a haiku 😉 !!!!

  318.  #318Jacqueline on August 17, 2010 at 8:36 pm

    Need help – thank you to those who have written to me at! I’m setting the blog site up and wanted “feeling” imput on name – how does sound to all sirens? Please give me some feedback about if that feels good to you. What do you think?

    Thanks all!


  319.  #319dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 8:39 pm

    what kind of site is it?

  320.  #320Jacqueline on August 17, 2010 at 9:02 pm

    Second Act or Starting Over – Managing Change for women – woman2woman is pretty well out there….I’m riffing on “reinvention” right now…thanks so much for asking. Basically, just support on all levels, not just relationship advice, with women’s stories that have changed like, everything and found happiness. Had the idea way before eat,pray,love – but now, sigh, it’ll probably feel like follow up. lol

  321.  #321Jacqueline on August 17, 2010 at 9:03 pm

    do you think reinventing is too hard to rmember?

  322.  #322Jacqueline on August 17, 2010 at 9:06 pm

    Mercedes I know you’re here…somewhere…reinvention of a new you???


  323.  #323dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 9:35 pm

    hey that’s really cool Jacqueline. I recently coordinated a website/organization launch for women to speak out and support each other, and we actually got news coverage all around the country and will be doing some fun and meaningful things. I feel so excited for your new contribution to the big self-supporting community of womanhood.

    Hm, Reinvention… –>evolution?

  324.  #324dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 9:38 pm


    Yay Jacqueline, start a new-you revolution! Did I mention I feel way good about your planned website?

  325.  #325girl on August 17, 2010 at 9:38 pm

    Dorothea, I think me not liking sex is me avoiding intimacy , so I’m trying to not give into whatever is triggering me to maintain distance.

    Not having sex feels bad, too – cause he seems to take it so personally. I feel like I don’t like committed relationship sex cause it’s BORING. It probably doesn’t have to be. But since I’m not getting deeply intimate with sex, some sex feels like a better choice than no sex at all. Cause with the way I feel, I could be fine with minimal touching and just hanging out as friends. After we have sex, even though the sex annoys me, I do feel more connected to him and willing to be close in general. I have some friends that gush over the fabulousness of obviously lame relationships. Why do I feel lame about a fabulous relationship?? Bla!!!

    A significant twist is, because of his knee, I have to be on top, and I take full control of sex. So it’s not like I’m lying there just taking it. I’m doing my best to manuever the act in the least annoying way possible so we can just get it over with. The only thing I feel like doing less than having sex is talking about why I don’t want to have sex.

  326.  #326girl on August 17, 2010 at 9:40 pm

    Went swing dancing tonight and it was SO fun. boobs bouncing everywhere was a problem, but over all it FELT SO GOOD. I like that it’s less sexual than salsa dancing, and the scene is bright and upbeat. SUPER FUN.

  327.  #327girl on August 17, 2010 at 9:45 pm

    Lucy, I think Dylan was a player because he’s fooled around with her rather than pursuing her for a serious relationship. He obviously doesn’t care about her, he just cared about getting off.

  328.  #328dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 9:48 pm

    if he has a knee injury maybe a wedge or one of those convertible foam sex cubes will help with getting him on top. I’ve never used one but i seen em in the store so it’s just an idea.

  329.  #329girl on August 17, 2010 at 9:50 pm

    Plus, I have turned him down for sex plenty of times (I didn’t even have to say it, he tried to initiate, but could feel my body language saying no) and he seems to get concerned about it, take it personally and act insecure and needy. We wen’t several days with no sex, it’s only been the last 2 that I tried to do it in spite of how I feel.
    I feel sort of triggered by the idea of me being some submissive girl who gives in to my “non-husband”. I’m not. I feel like some sort of non-girl who is somehow broken when it comes to receiving love from a would-be/could-be husband.

  330.  #330Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 9:54 pm


    Hi 🙂

    I feel you, to a degree…..I can testify though that refusing sex with my LI served me well…..even though I felt a little crummy saying no……this is where feeling messages were GOLD. Along with “Wants” and “Don’t wants”. He was understanding and over time my pleasure felt like his priority-and I do mean FEEL 🙂

  331.  #331dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 10:01 pm

    ‘I feel sort of triggered by the idea of me being some submissive girl who gives in to my “non-husband”’

    i’m sorry:( i would feel triggered too.

    u might have already done this, but to me it sounds like you just need to talk to him when you’re not getting down to it or trying to get down to it, and not in a way that makes him wrong or inadequate. more like, how you’re feeling and asking if he thinks there’s anything he thinks that can be done about it, telling him what would make you feel good, what you would like in order to feel more “ready” for sex whenever with him (if you can figure that out). I like the word ready because it is more neutral than ‘turned on’ or ‘hot,’ so it doesn’t imply that he is failing at turning you on or getting you hot. I’ve also found that using the word “h*rnier,” however, works great because although it is not very neutral, it is so direct and sexual that men do not even notice the fact that you’re basically saying you’re not regularly feeling all that h*rny for him…they just hear that you want to feel h*rnier and they want more information about this exciting topic.

    blah blah blah, that’s what i say.

  332.  #332Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 10:01 pm


    Just read about the knee………. My experience; “I feel lazy” 😉 I feel sleepy….. I don’t want to work so hard for it….. I feel tired…. Etc. I could see myself feeling resentful in your situation……and needing a break from the pressure of performing for a man…..those are just my feelings…..but some women love being on top-so they might feel differently than I would.

  333.  #333Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 10:15 pm

    I never gave my LI any direction about how to get me h*rnier…. He surprised me….I also didn’t ask what he thought about my not feeling turned on or ready or in the mood or too tired because honestly it didn’t matter….I may have asked once or twice but for the most part my feelings were non-negotiable in regards to sex….. He wasn’t thrilled but I kept reminding myself that I wasn’t married so sex was not going to be delivered on demand. That inspired him to really work for it…..and inspire me to respond differently….because I felt differently. I wanted a shared experience….a mutual desire……expressed that and he worked for it…..but I was never attached to the outcome. I felt determined not to let myself feel like I was an instrument for pleasure-that was my truth……and because I stood up for my heart I never felt resentful….I felt h*rnier 😉 and he (hopefully) never felt controlled or directed by me. He was free to figure it out on his own or just go to sleep. I’d like to say he respected me even more….because I was congruent and fully present.

  334.  #334dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 10:19 pm

    “I wasn’t married so sex was not going to be delivered on demand.”

    I like this. It feels good reading this because I hate feeling like i’m a bad “girlfriend” if I don’t want to have sex on demand, like a scary preview of married life for him.

  335.  #335Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:19 pm

    I went on a solo 3 hr. kayaking trip today 🙂 I had lots of fun, plus hard work with rowing but luckily I’m in fairly good shape to paddle non stop for three hours. I wanted to keep going but the river was low and I coudlnt paddle any more, I walked the kayak some, went swimming, watched ducks, beavers and an eagle. My curiousity about things and where the river went, kept me going and going and going. I really didnt feel like stopping, every time I looked into the river, I wanted to jump in and swim but that wouldnt get me any where. Im planning on going out again this weekend. Did I find freedom or at least get my want and need fullfilled? yes, I did. IM A MACHINE! I feel like going far far away up the river, maybe even spend hte night some where and come back the next day, that is what I want to do. I got in to the “zone”

  336.  #336Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:21 pm

    Dorothea, that freaks me out to, the sex on demand thing. we talked about that tonight, me and eggshell man.

  337.  #337dorothea on August 17, 2010 at 10:26 pm

    everyone have a nice night, i gotta go bye!

  338.  #338Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:27 pm

    I will not give up my freedom to wake on eggshells for sex on demand. Freedom fighting warrior goddess woman says NO, I mean HELL NO!

  339.  #339Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:30 pm

    good night Dorothea 🙂

  340.  #340Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:33 pm

    I dont know why I didnt start earlier in the summer , I feel bad about this, there is only a few more weeks of great swimming and kayaking weather left.
    I feel bad about sex on demand. I feel bad about going to bed a place of rest and sex on demand yuck, I feel yucky, I feel eggshelly.

  341.  #341girl on August 17, 2010 at 10:56 pm

    Thanks for the feedback ladies. Dorothea, I feel heard and understood – thank you.

    It’s not that I’m tired or not in the mood, I feel icked out by sex. When he’s touching me, it feels annoying. I much prefer to be on top, and I actually like to minimize what he’s doing as much as possible, cause there is very little that I like him to do.

    Does anybody watch Cougar Town? It’s like Andy and Ellie’s relationship. Andy is a great guy, and Ellie does love him, but their relationship is not based on how hot she is for him – she appreciates his commitment, and he loves taking care of her. She rarely wants to have sex with him – in fact she gives him 3 automatic sex cards each month – if he gives her a card, she has to have sex regardless of how she feels. She views it pretty much like a chore, but at the same time, other female characters regard her life as “ideal” cause her relationship is great in other ways. She has described him as a clumsy lover, but he tries hard.
    I relate to her character in general. She’s taking on a feminine role of being wife and stay at home mom, yet she’s tough and emotionally very independent. I used to watch the show and think that was the kind of relationship I would want to have – I think it’s smart. Now, it’s like I’m coming to terms with the fact that this smart relationship doesn’t have all the excitement of wondering what the hell Johnny or some other player is up to. I’ve been wondering if this is “settling.” But, reading Evan’s emails about the virtues of settling for “Mr.Good Enough” is helping me get my head around the fact that a hot charming guy isn’t good husband material. A kind, loving, committed man is. And I have one. I feel a little let down by reality. I feel a little sad, that the Cougar Town relationship is a far more accurate picture of happily ever after than all the magic and romance in Disney movies or romance novels or romantic comedies. But it’s also okay. It’s like eating a broiled chicken leg off the bone – it’s satisfying and pretty tasty, but it doesn’t knock your socks off. There are tasty fattier parts, and other parts you’d rather avoid. The leg bone is an unpleasant reminder that this food used to be a little creature, but then genuine gratitude ensues. Chicken nuggets are far more comfortable to eat, but there’s no nutrition, and you’re in denial of the truth of where that food came from – there’s spiritual and nutritional deficiency.
    And, sort of back to the conversation about whether sex is about power – Rori compared sex to food, and people can certainly act out control issues through food. And they can through sex, too. And I’m realizing that somehow the game of seduction gives me a feeling of power, and that is how I’ve enjoyed sex in the past. But I already feel like HAVE him. Trying to get him off is a little bit of a fun game. But I’m aware that I can probably connect in a much deeper way, but I feel a little stuck and blocked. And his attempts to get through the wall feel annoying. But I guess if someone had chicken nuggets all their life, they might be somewhat disappointed by “real” food. But, in the long run, it would be more satisfying and far better for them. And once they got comfortable, they could spice things up a bit.

    I feel better…aaaah…just in time for him to come over….

  342.  #342Tina on August 17, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    He wanted me to initiate sex ew hehe. I read somewhere on this site, that WE only have to dress sexy , feminine and thats it, let him come to us. Im good with that. He actually laid there, saying ok you initiate sex lol. So he basically wanted to just lay there *being the girl, and “take care” of his “needs” lol whaaaaaaaaa??????? it never worked out that way. I dont ever remember him bringing it up again.

  343.  #343girl on August 17, 2010 at 11:02 pm

    i hear what ya’ll are saying about how you won’t do it if you don’t feel hot enough at that moment. Especially outside of a marriage.
    i’m saying that this feels like an emotional hang up for me, not just a mood thing.

  344.  #344Apple Jacks on August 17, 2010 at 11:07 pm

    Hi all,

    I missed a lot of posts. I feel overwhelmed. I feel I need to clarify something. Yes I do have guilt over this issue outside of marriage and whatnot, but more than that…it just HURTS so much. That’s how I felt during my first time. It hurt too much and while I feel like I want it, I also feel like I can’t have anything sticking in me. It feels sharp, and hard and needles shooting up to my abdomen. My insides scream, “Just stay OUT!” Of course Tinque has been helping me with this. But I’m not fully out of this yet. Sometimes it regresses, but…baby steps.

    Then on the other hand I also feel open and relaxed and soft and lost in the moment. Conflicting feelings. I also feel confident and secure I’ll get there.

  345.  #345Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 11:14 pm


    Ok. So perhaps your lovers get a choice; sex or emotional intimacy…..but to keep Girl” distance no man can get both? It certainly wouldn’t be the first time a woman structured/compartmentalized this way 😉

    “I love my “don’t get too close to me feelings”…….”.

  346.  #346Nikita on August 17, 2010 at 11:18 pm

    Oooops typos……in order to keep Girl’s distance …. And maintain her emotional comfort zone…….GI Joe said “knowing is half the battle” 😉 right? Or was that a different cartoon quote?

  347.  #347Apple Jacks on August 17, 2010 at 11:19 pm

    I feel drained. I’ve been in boy energy for the past two days discussing some current events issues (ground zero stuff) on the phone, in person, and on facebook. The kid who was attracted to me (who I like to call girly boy) really made me feel angry with his ignorance and constant attempt, I feel, to get a rise out of me. I feel like calling him and idiot. Ah what the heck, he’s an idiot.

    janjune asked me about my love affair with the moon…I don’t know I guess his smile and the way he constantly followed me always made me feel safe and protected. I would ask him, “why do you always follow me Mr. Moon?” *smile* “Because you like me?” *smile* “Okay, so you like me. :)” And then I’d feel all warm and chipper at his constant smiles. I just went with the answers that voiced in my heart. And that’s how it developed.

    Ironically in Islam too, we go by the lunar calendar and during Ramadan where everything becomes upside down, the stories would read that the Prophet liked to eat under the soft light of the moon. It was an attempt to feel the contrast fromt he sun, which is more direct, hot, and masculine. The moon in Islam is more soft, subtle, and vulnerable. The whole purpose of Ramadan really, is to get back in touch with your vulnerability.

    I feel sleepy and playful. Goodnight everyone.

  348.  #348Apple Jacks on August 17, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    Lucy – I LOVED the painting you posted! Really made me smile. Made me feel like climbing a tree too.:)

  349.  #349Tina on August 17, 2010 at 11:24 pm

    Girl, I know this is a personal question, I’ll ask anyway, are you having orgasms? or not? when I end up on top I do have orgasms maybe one or two. are you just not FEELING at all?

  350.  #350Tina on August 17, 2010 at 11:33 pm

    I sometimes dont feel hot enough for sex eventually I get there. I do have days where sex feels like a chore, doing something I dont feel like doing. Most of the time, I want to feel hot for sex, his JOB is to please me first, he is getting the hang of this. On occasion I’ll do something, like maybe a fantasy he has, like this halloween, Im gonna dress up like a nurse 🙂 he wants to have nurse sex hehe.

  351.  #351girl on August 18, 2010 at 1:57 am

    Yes, very astute observation wise Nikita – thanks, that helps me understand.

    Tina, yeah, I can make myself cum when I’m on top. I just don’t like anything he ever does to me physically. Like just now, he was rubbing my back, and it felt good cause I’m sore. I wanted him to do it harder, so I was pushing up against his hand, but then he started scratching my back. I let him know that it felt good for him to push, not scratch, but he didn’t really understand, and I almost felt like crying that he couldn’t tune in and touch me in a way that I liked. Eventually it worked out, and I felt mildly satisfied, but dissatisfied enough to escape to write this. I feel sorta like crying now. Like, yeah, it’s a little bit my own emotional distance thing, but also it’s that I generally don’t feel turned on by his physical presence. That feeling of being addicted to someone – I don’t have that. That burning desire when he’s near – do you know what I mean? I feel sad about that. And I’m not sure what to make of it. We watched “Bachelor Pad” tonight – which is CAPTIVATING!!! Women on the show do all kinds of self destructive things to be close to the men they feel hot for, and it really doesn’t pay off in any way, except that they get to feel the hott feelings. And I sit there and judge them, but I’m wishing that I felt hot.

  352.  #352girl on August 18, 2010 at 2:00 am

    It’s not true that I “don’t like anything he ever does…” and that doesn’t feel good to think. It’s just that I usually feel turned off by his sexual advances.

  353.  #353girl on August 18, 2010 at 2:16 am

    I guess what I’m saying is that I don’t feel physically attracted to him. I feel motherly tenderness for him – like sometimes I feel warm and fuzzy looking at the back of his head, cause I think it’s cute (he has a little faux hawk. I feel good and secure and loved…and I get that this is a smarter way to be. but this feels like a sad sacrifice. is this it?? I asked my mom and she said she didn’t know what to tell me cause she says that the passion fades into friendship anyway, and she says you end up needing a good companion. which he is.

  354.  #354Daria on August 18, 2010 at 3:06 am

    girl – i feel the same non turned on ness with one of my cds. this is one of the men that from the beginning treated me really well… so well that it felt shocking and weird to me back then

    he wants to marry me and always has, from the first hour he met me… which felt weird

    he’s a great friend and has been there for me and i for him

    however, when he makes advances, he gets like this 5 year old voice and i feel like im his lil sister or mom… and i dont feel attracted

    and i haven’t really been able to change that yet, tho i’ve talked to him about it SOME

    i noticed i fall into a trap of going into “directive woman = motherly ” voice with him unless I am VERY careful at each moment to not fall in that habit

    i feel curious to keep practicing that

    i too want to feel attraction

  355.  #355Daria on August 18, 2010 at 3:07 am

    but it reminds me too much of my highschool boyfriend, who was a sweetheart and devoted to me, but i felt also like a friend … kind of like cute cuddly attraction but not sexual

    and i promised myself i wouldn’t do that to myself again – make myself exclusive when im not feeling passionate

  356.  #356Daria on August 18, 2010 at 3:18 am

    i went to the club and i did my very first experiment of talking first to a cute man…

    i spotted him, hung around, tried smiling, then at the end as i walked by i looked at him in the eye smiled and said “you’re cute!”

    now mind u this is an experiment… and ive been trying to do this for like 6 months now

    so i did it!!

    i was going to keep walking but he stopped me and got my number

    i felt a lil insecure and a lil unimportant and rushed when i was giving him my number, but i also felt good and excited

  357.  #357Denise on August 18, 2010 at 4:47 am

    I asked my mom and she said she didn’t know what to tell me cause she says that the passion fades into friendship anyway, and she says you end up needing a good companion. which he is.

    I’m not YOUR mother, but I am a mother and a divorced woman. Your mother may say that because she too did not have a sexual attraction for the man she might be referring to.

    I haven’t read all the posts, but if there is a lack of sexual attraction, this is NOT the man for you. Eventually you would not want to have sex with him at all, that’s not fair to him or to you. Men instinctually need sex, for more than just physical purposes.

    All THREE factors need to be there for a long lasting, happy, satisfying relationship: Physical/sexual attraction, friendship, commitment/similar beliefs and values. If one of those is missing, there will be a negative affect–it’s like a three legged stool.

  358.  #358Mercedes on August 18, 2010 at 6:18 am

    Jacqueline: I like both reinvention and revolution…but Dorothea nailed it with revolution I think…I like that one best.

    Much Love,

  359.  #359Renee on August 18, 2010 at 6:33 am

    Girl — Nearly everything you’ve written about this man reminds me of a relationship I was in my mid-20’s…I loved the man — he was a sweetheart, a genuinely good person who did sweet things for me on a frequent basis…he had a key to my apartment, and one day, when I was working and he was off work, he let himself in, cleaned my apartment and bought fresh flowers to put on the dining room table. I’ll always carry that memory with me…I felt so adored.

    On the other hand…I found that sexually, it just wasn’t there for us. After about 6 months or so, I found that I wanted to kiss him only when I’d been drinking (anything other than a little peck) and the same went for sex. Now, mind you, I have always had a pretty strong sex drive, so this was the first time I’d experienced this. I ended up going to therapy for a while and going on antidepressants because the assumption was that I was just depressed and that’s why I wasn’t that interested in sex.

    Eventually, though, it just did not feel right…I told him that it might just be my depression talking, but being with him wasn’t working for me right now. We both cried and mourned a little (we’d been together about 2 years at this point and were very integrated into each others’ lives), but after I broke up with him, it felt like a HUGE weight had been lifted off my shoulders. I did feel sad and lonely at times immediately after the break up, but I just knew somewhere deep inside that this couldn’t be “it” for me — there had to be more, and my subsequent dating experience has shown me that is true (for me anyway).

    I feel a little uneasy about sharing my story with you because I don’t want to feel responsible for encouraging someone to break up with a man who seems, from your description, to be a very nice man, but I feel good about sharing my truth as well so that hopefully you can determine whether my experience resonates with you — or not. What do you think?

  360.  #360Renee on August 18, 2010 at 6:41 am

    Girl — I should add that part of the reason the therapist thought me to be depressed was that I was also unhappy with my job, so I was unhappy with several key areas of my life. Turns out, I just wasn’t in a job that was a good fit for me and once I switched jobs, that helped, but when I met the next man I dated, that helped a lot too…I was very sexually attracted to this new man and we were “in love” within weeks of meeting, though my lack of direction in my career and personal life (outside of my relationship with this new man) pretty much ran off this man…going through periods of not pursuing personal dreams and goals has haunted me periodically in my life, and each time I was in one of those periods where I wasn’t pursuing life, my love relaitonships suffered, which is one main reason Rori’s teachings resonate with me in this regard — I’ve had the experience of pegging all my happiness on a man and that hasn’t worked out…I don’t mean to imply that’s what you’re doing at all, I just wanted to clarify that although I was able to meet and fall in love with another man who was a better sexual match for me, since I still wasn’t doing the “me” work I needed to do, my relationship with this man didn’t work out.

    Please let us know how things are going…I feel interested in finding out how you approach this challenge in your life right now. Good luck!

  361.  #361tinque on August 18, 2010 at 7:30 am

    girl – “passion fades into friendship”

    it doesn’t have to. you CAN have both. I do.

    I’m with dorothea and Mercedes on revolution, like it, like it, like it.

  362.  #362Simply Shannon on August 18, 2010 at 7:39 am

    Girl, I completely agree with Nikita. Right now it sounds like you are attached to the outcome (a committed relationship with this man) and possibly feeling stuck as a result? Not sharing how I really feel is denying a man the real m?. Trust me, I get what you’re doing. I’ve done it myself. Had sex when I didn’t really feel in the mood to do it. Told myself I would eventually get in the mood. Told myself it was the physical aspect.

    The reality for me is that if I’m feeling cared for strongly enough outside of the bedroom, I’ll feel more turned on in the bedroom. Maybe you’ve “decided” it’s the physical aspect because you don’t know what’s really causing the problem? (I do this too – decide it’s one thing – then that “one thing” gets fixed and I’m not any happier. KWIM?)

    I’m going to suggest you consider that other things are happening (or not happening) outside of the bedroom and it’s not just his physical appearance that’s holding you back. Does that make sense? I’m not suggesting this in a bad way or trying to point out problems. Just saying that for me the physical appearance thing was a smoke screen for my lack of overwhelming love feelings.

    I hear it in the comments you’re making about feeling resentful that he’s on his back while making love and in the lack of comments about all of the awesome things he’s doing outside of the bedroom.

    And I hear you managing down your expectations which feels bad to hear.

    Any of that resonate?

  363.  #363Simply Shannon on August 18, 2010 at 7:41 am

    LOL! Tinque: I’m following you today. 🙂

  364.  #364Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 7:57 am


    RE: #297 – Thank you so much for the encouragement! I really appreciate that!


  365.  #365Jennifer on August 18, 2010 at 9:13 am

    Men are confusing…
    I took cheesecake to Judo last night….Judo instrcutor sort of jokingly said that If I didn’t make good with the cheesecake it would be 1 million pushups!!!
    So we’re all eating cheesecake and chatting and he said I was very generous for bringing the cheesecake…I said…”well gee..I didn’t want to do a million pushups”
    Later he comes up to me and says…just for the pushups threat…here’s a hug….and like grabs me and hugs me hard!!
    Like WTF dude?!?!?!
    Ya wants me or ya don’t…make up yer mellon.

  366.  #366Liz on August 18, 2010 at 9:15 am

    Girl…you saved me some typing because I feel like you’re writing for the both of us with your comments. I’m 39 and in a relationship with a guy for 8 months now, fabulous guy except I have these smiliar feelings on the emotional/sexual/intimacy front that you describe. I feel so unsure of what to make of them and how to act upon them, if at all…am I in a funk just in general, specific to him/relationship meaning we’re not compatible?? I’m just withdrawing on the sex front which adds its own issues so I feel like its just blurring my ability to feel certain about what’s really at play here. I read down to comment #360+ and had hoped that Rori would have chimed in replying to you and that might offer some words of wisdom….Rori, would you mind responding to the scenario that Girl has brought up? Cheers.

  367.  #367Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 9:19 am

    Jennifer’s in like with Judo Man.

  368.  #368Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 9:21 am

    I wish it were as simple to have a relationship with a man as it is to have a relationship with cheesecake. Cheesecake and I get along so well, just as smooth and sweet as can be! I want to marry cheesecake.

  369.  #369Jennifer on August 18, 2010 at 9:30 am

    JEnnifer’s in confusion with Judo man.
    He “doesn’t do relationships” ok, I respect that…so STOP TOUCHING ME unless yer teaching me…
    It makes me allllll gooey inside and that’s annoying when it’s not going anywhere.
    BOYZ are dum

  370.  #370Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 9:57 am

    Jennifer, I second the emotion.

  371.  #371Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 10:48 am

    Dorothea, thanks!! and Mercedes, you too!! I went with Life’ – it can be you creating your life’s dream OR life’s “dreamcreations,” like those fab things that happen to you by synchronicity or just the beauty of a sunset. Makes the Ebook Title easy:

    Live your Dream Life. smile….I’d love it if you’d email me at so I could get your input.

    Revolutionize your life …..arrow……start here….wow, we can all make a board game?!!!

    Thanks again…..

  372.  #372Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 10:50 am

    ps. I feel really uncomfortable with all the veiled references to “Girl,” like it’s an inside joke to some who know her, and the responses have to be edited to not reveal.

    It’s feels very inauthentic, exclusionary and hurtful to find a game being run on the board to me.

    What do you think?

  373.  #373Daria on August 18, 2010 at 11:12 am

    Simply Shannon – I’ve been in a similar situation as girl, twice. Even 3 times. Both times were with the men who were the most into me and caring for me. I felt like they were puppydogs. They did a lot more than other men I did feel sexual with. But I felt like I was their loving and adored sister… Tho they wanted me…

    What do u think?

    This is different then him not doing enuf out the bedroom. Tho I do like the suggestion that
    Ay e it’s not physical… It was mainly emotionL

  374.  #374Daria on August 18, 2010 at 11:13 am

    Jaqueline- rori encourages u’s to use a different names if we want to. Girl has stated before that she doesn’t want to be recognized by a poster whom she may know in real life so that she can share freely .

  375.  #375Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 11:19 am

    Hey, Daria – yes I got that, it’s all the other’s who HAVE recognized her and mentioned it, like I know your situation, etc. that creates an evnvironment of exclusion. If someone chooses to use a new name, they should be treated like a new story/poster, IMO.

    Thanks for answering, I always appreciate that about you!

    How’s your riffing going this week?


  376.  #376Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 11:33 am

    I just chatted with Bill and it felt really good! Yay! Relief! I kept it real light and work-related, and I felt at ease with him. Glad my email yesterday and my slip-ups Monday didn’t have any detrimental effects.

    I am also doing really good with my eating, as a result of feeling so happy about Bill in my life. I am steadily pulling out of depression from Ryan.

    I feel so happy to have all of you new friends, and you have made a huge difference in my life, along with Rori. It would feel so good to meet you some day. I wish Rori would have a conference and we could all come and meet each other!

    Then I could figure out who girl is! ;-P


  377.  #377Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 11:39 am

    Brenda, I love it when you talk to Bill-boy! You just light up the board with a laser light show of happiness. Go Team Bill!!

    Have a great day, ladies…..


  378.  #378Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 11:47 am


    Haha! Yeah! I feel so happy when I’m around him! He is such a sweetheart! So easy to get along with!

    I just want to be with him all the time!


  379.  #379Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 11:52 am

    ps…..I have a relationship problem!! My guy asks me if I want to ride with him to pick up a check from a client – and you know, really my answer was NO!!! but we’ve barely seen each other, so I say okay. Well he gets confused about which customer he’s going to, despite the GPS – AND we spent 2 HOURS finding the guy’s house. UGH….so I non-sirenly yelled at him the whole way. How do you stop this situation? You’re in a vehicle, rush hour traffic, drove an hour out of your way, and ummmm, you can’t control the man, lol….but how do you not want to, or do the it’s not my business? When clearly it is your business cuz you wanna jump out of the truck and walk home at that point.

    How not to yell when someone won’t listen to you (my directions were, btw, correct!) and is driving you in circles???


  380.  #380Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 11:56 am


    My understanding of Rori’s principles are that you do what serves the relationship. It isn’t about the situation, as frustrating as it may be. You could say, “I feel sure it is this way” maybe but beyond that, I think we are supposed to let him figure it out himself.

    What do the rest of you say about that?

  381.  #381Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 12:16 pm

    Brenda that’s a good question, because when you are traped in a situation it’s difficult to lean back, lol. I literally let him chase me across the kitchen one time, kept stepping back, checking it out. But in this situation my slightly claustrophobic self came clawing out and I was near panicking. Ugh….


  382.  #382girl on August 18, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    Jacqueline, I’m not sure what you are referring to about people veiling my identity. Dorothea said “where’s ______?” (referring to my usual name), and so I let her know that I’m using a different name. Sorry if it made things confusing.

  383.  #383Brenda on August 18, 2010 at 1:16 pm

    girl, I’m all kinds of curious who you are. But it’s fun to call you girl. Hey girl!

  384.  #384girl on August 18, 2010 at 1:20 pm

    Daria and Liz, it feels very good to hear that you can relate. It feels weird to hear from Tinque and Mercedes that you can have it all. It’s encouraging, and yet I wonder if it’s a difference in personality or something that keeps me from being able feel attracted to men that are good for me (although I’m glad for you ladies that you love your men). Or maybe it’s just luck. Renee, I really appreciate your words as well. I’m wondering though (I’m not very familiar with your history) did you find your forever after man? Do you ever wish you stayed with the “safer” choice for the sake of having a family or having security? I feel so confused!

  385.  #385girl on August 18, 2010 at 1:22 pm

    Jacqueline, that situation in the car sounds maddening!!

  386.  #386girl on August 18, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    And Daria, I appreciate the way you hit the nail on the head in response to SS’s idea that he needs to step it up more outside of the bedroom. He’s a wonderful guy and treats me well in every respect. That’s why it sucks that I feel so lukewarm.

  387.  #387Simply Shannon on August 18, 2010 at 1:52 pm

    Daria and Girl, So this is just my own projection but sometimes I feel smothered by how nice a guy is. Something in me wants him to “man-up” and that’s why I’m not feeling all that sexual with him. It’s not the “nice-guy” syndrome so much as a guy wouldn’t let me walk all over him.

    Like he’s doing so much it’s almost too much and in a way that’s a turn-off. I’m totally projecting myself out here but this is in general how I feel about Mr. Fab Kisser. He’s so nice to me and giving to me but I’d feel more turned on by him if he got pissed off by some of the crap I’ve pulled. The fact that he lets me get away with it feels icky. I feel turned off by it.

    I’m in the exact same place with him as you’ve described Girl so I feel relieved in a way to hear you working through this. For me, the thing I “blamed” it on was his height. He’s barely taller than me. I feel bad wearing my heels and I feel resentful about that! Yes, I feel resentful. My poor heels feel jealous of my flats. It’s only been recently that I’ve decided to just wear the dang things. I still feel uncomfortable at times but it’s getting better.

    My gosh I feel superficial!

  388.  #388girl on August 18, 2010 at 2:05 pm

    I judge myself for being superficial, too. Like if this was a movie, I might dump a nice guy, then he’d go get all fit and buff on his own, and then I’d want him, but he’d reject me for not loving him all along. So “seeing past” a physical turn off is part of love?? That sounds right, but this feels crummy. I don’t sense that D would take any real crap from me, which I really like about him. But I know that he can sense how turned off I’m feeling, and he is overcompensating, which is a turnoff.

  389.  #389dorothea on August 18, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    girl, I will be honest. I feel turned off by very nice guys too, especially my LI at times. I have even said jokingly that he should be an asshole to me sometimes. And sometimes when I have been getting physical with “nice” guys like this, I want to scream “SLAP MY FACE” or “CHOKE ME.” I have never done such though.

  390.  #390dorothea on August 18, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    or i want to slap his face and tell him what a worthless maggot he is. lol. wtf? i never really realized this until right now.

  391.  #391dorothea on August 18, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    i feel freaked out and embarrassed now.

  392.  #392Daria on August 18, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    lol dorothea. i feel amused

    i think this is probably part of the attraction to toxic men thingy

    but now i want to get slapped while having sex too


    this is hilarious


    i am like

    hiring guys to put me down and slap me during sex



    this sounds like fun!


    i dont know

    i feel delighted and rolling on the floor laughing

    maybe feeling like this means im right at the doorstep of loving myself


    i love all my feelings

    even my intense shame horror humiliation ickyness wanting to be treated like a whore and feeling embarassed aobut it and exposed for a no good icky gross girl who is a total cum covered slut a bad girl that no one loves but everyone uses

    eeww icky eww i have gross icky yet laughy delighted feelings

    Thanks PORN!!

    lol maybe

    its not porn its jut me

    or you or every human


    i feel confuesd and icky and gross

    i dont want to be a werid werird weirdo who hurts myself and makes myself feel bad

    thank u

  393.  #393Daria on August 18, 2010 at 2:35 pm

    i feel amused and great and giggly in a little girl way writing about this

    i feel excited now because i feel swelling warming heart thinking about non pornographic style love sex with a man who cares about me too!

    but i really like it with the player who is suddenly irresistibly addicted to you

    that he does acts of love for you in public

    thats what i want

    HELLO DARIA! its nice to discover so many things about you today

  394.  #394Daria on August 18, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    I feel really triggered reading Brenda’s writing about men tricking her into getting pregnat by poking holes in condoms.

    I feel judgemental of Brenda.

    I feel gross ick, shocked, disgust to read that in a casual comment…

    — i didn’t feel that way when she first shared it awhile back —


    i feel triggered by ‘things like that’ in real life

    I feel triggered that someone would say stuff like that from their past —

    i don’t feel good saying something like that, – though triggering things have happened to me also — without a setting of purpose on speaking about it

    it feels triggering to me when people say triggerig things about their past in conversation

    i feel judgemental that its subtlly intended to shock the person into giving that person attention… and it feels like im being shocked and pulled

    that feels bad

    ha i probalby do this too

    this feels weird

    i feel triggered

    i feel trigggerd in life aobut this

    like when people say stuff like

    oh yeah last week when i was raped, they had carrots on sale for 4.99


    ugh this feels weird. i feel mistrustful of that

    i feel judgemental of people who tell gross/traumatic stories of themselves matter of factly ….

    i feel tricked… like YOU KNEW that was gonna make me feel shocked and bad for you and that’s why you said it,

    and I FEEL RESENTFUL of being manipulated and now i REFUSE to give you that compassion that you were trying to get from me

    by saying something that would make me feel shocked and bad


    this is a crazy trigger. i want this healed

    i dont want to hold back compassion when i feel triggered

    i do not want to feel manipulated

    i feel confused

    i do not want to feel confused

    i want to clearly be in the know about what i want and dont want about this and what this strigger is

    i feel triggered and like someone is choking me out


  395.  #395Daria on August 18, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    I feel guilty about “using” Brenda’s posts for therapy

    my guess is she will feel triggered – bad

    and i feel guilty

    like i feel guilty about “using” men for therapy

    when what im doing is practicing telling the truth

    please tell me this telling hte truth is all for the good of all

    right yes?

    i am ok to feel triggered i love me

    i will grow bigger and bigger to where i am emotionally adult and Divine

  396.  #396Daria on August 18, 2010 at 2:59 pm

    I AM emotionally adult i love me i love me

    i love Brenda too

    I feel good

    I feel heard being able to express myself

    I feel excited that I feel like I’m expressing myself more clearly about being triggered by stuff

    i feel so excited to have this work smoother and smoother and have it flow like water!!

    and with a amn


    i feel excited about truth with a man where ifeel powerful enough to feel my triggers without attacking and him is like that too

    ooohohh how freakin exciting

  397.  #397dorothea on August 18, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    i don’t want to be in boy voice anymore

    i don’t want to get involved or chime in on other poster’s stuff unless they specifically ask for help or ask me for input

    i feel drained
    i feel like sobbing
    i feel tired
    i need a hug really bad:(
    typing that i need a hug has tears welling up in my eyes
    i just want to feel loved and none of what i’ve been spending my energy on here is getting me love.

    omg i feel lonely lonely. all alone and no one to hold me or hug me.

    thank you, i’ve needed to cry like this for a while now.

    i love me and i love my lonely feelings. i love my alienated feelings.

    wow amazing how when i intended for dropping my boy energy and boy voice, i suddenly welled up with crying and feeling. i feel soft now. and full of tears.

  398.  #398Jacqueline on August 18, 2010 at 3:13 pm

    Dorothea, HUG HUG HUG….soft girly feel air on your skin, easy, kind, like coming home, welcome, plush, pampered, beatiful you!!!! Waterwheel coming to you with waves of letting go….

    did you see my thank you for your comments last nite?

    I loved it that you answered me with enthusiam… has been contentuous but you are fine….you are embraced by Rori’s loving self here, no matter what else. That’s a lot of what I feel from Rori….Love, Rori… just hear that now!

  399.  #399tinque on August 18, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    big hug dorothea

  400.  #400Isa on August 18, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    Today I chickened out of an awesome opportunity to circular date….
    yet I embrace myself and feel good about what I’ve learned…
    I got really nervous, my heart was pattering a bit and I observed….withut judgement
    then out of no where came my answer to why didn’t I really want to go?
    I realized that I have been going to settings where men aren’t attracted to my type…so I end up having great girlfriend chatting and acting like its okay…
    well no…
    I do care..
    so now I will target Mr. Him rich soil where I am likely to be hit on….yah for me! Neve realized how much this bugged me….my boy was trying to protect my feelings….now he has set a date for me where I can get in position and recline..sigh…thanks Rori…

  401.  #401Isa on August 18, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    I feel released…from some grip…I feel that I want to be wanted and that’s okay…I am not hard and indifferent to that….I need that…I want that…I deserve that…I shall have that…I intend to be open to receiving that….I intend to be fearless but will allow myself to feel shakey and nervous if I feel like….I will not let an intention become a chain…I intend to feel what I feel…without judgement…ooh I’ve been so much more connected to my emotions….sigh deep breathe…deep waters….now I move on….

  402.  #402dorothea on August 18, 2010 at 8:05 pm

    Thank you for the cyberhugs.
    I felt unworthy receiving them in the moment but now I am feeling fully heard and cared about, which is a wonderful feeling

  403.  #403Laughing goddess on August 18, 2010 at 10:44 pm

    Ooo Dorothea. I feel sad hearing that you are sad. I truly live and value your presence here

  404.  #404girl on August 18, 2010 at 11:21 pm

    I just had a wonderful experience. I started my period today, which made me wonder if my emotional/sexual response to D has been heavily influenced by hormones. In any case, D brought me a beautiful pair of earrings and that loving feeling has been reignited and I feel love and heat and light for him again. So that makes me think that there are irrational forces at play, combined with my own inability to do romance sometimes – I am growing in this way, but I’m realizing that the reason I was involved with toxic men in the past was because I was incapable of having a loving relationship with a good man. So I’m learning how to do it. But he had toxic relationships, too (also because he was apparently unable to have a good one) – so he’s new at this, too. Plus we both individually have self destructive tendencies that we are beginning to discover as we get to know each other. But we have made conscious decisions to grow together, and our relationship continues to move forward as we get through these hurdles. I feel so good and grateful. I feel so much love and appreciation for him.
    I had super bad cramps, so I asked a friend if she would give me some weed. D was going to take me to swing by her place to pick it up, but my friend was so sad and down, that I decided to stay and chat with her about how sad she is about 2 toxic relationships with guys who are incapable of pursuing her for real, but who she’s hung up on. I ended up staying with her to talk for a couple of hours, and it felt really interesting cause I used to be in a toxic relationship with one of those guys. She’s finally getting to a point where she is completely fed up and ready for a good guy to treat her right. She sees that D treats me very well, and has said before that she basically wants what I have with D. In light of how she’s suffering now, I told her just a little bit of how I’ve been feeling down lately, too (sort of pointing out that relationships aren’t total paradise – reality can still bite), and she pointed out that even though I seem to be experiencing a low in our relationship, I still seem way happier than I did a couple of months ago when I was without him. It felt really interesting to hear a friend notice that.
    I feel so grateful to the universe for giving me beautiful ear rings from a loving handsome man right before I engaged in a pizza and marijuana fueled conversation with the most beautiful and sweet women I know, who is suffering over men, one of whom I have cried over as well.
    When D was finished visiting his parents, he stopped back by my friend’s house to pick me up (after patiently waiting a couple minutes while we finished our conversation), and on the way home, he brain stormed places he could help my friend get a new job (which would remove her from one of the toxic relationships). All so lovely.

  405.  #405girl on August 18, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    Outside of relationships, last night, I had a delicious experience that was all mine. I went to a dance hall alone (to scout out the scene for my ballroom dance students), and jumped right into a dance session even though I missed the first hour and a half of the lesson. I wasn’t that good, but I feel amazed that I had the complete confidence to do it. Then I stayed and danced with lots of nice men. I introduced myself to one of the lead women teachers, and I’m planning to audition to be on her dance team. This will probably take me out of the salsa dance scene, which is more dark than light lately. The swing dancing was BRIGHT BRIGHT LIGHT! Free spirited jumping around, risk taking and fun! And wholesome, which I feel attracted to. Thank you, Universe!! I love you!! I feel lots of love and romance all by my lonesome right now!!! (of course, the weed helped…gotta give credit where credit is due, I think)

  406.  #406Liz on August 19, 2010 at 9:13 am

    Simply Shannon, re#390…..OMG, yes, blaming my man’s “height”….am there, in the midst of struggling with this. and i feel guilty for the fact that it bothers me. then i tell myself to look at TomKat and their height scenario, but i haven’t been able to have that convince me to chill out about it with my guy. I haven’t worn heels in many months and miss it! i feel huge and unsexy/feminine when i’m taller than him in heels. my therapist asked me if i thought my feeling about his height actually reflect my fustration with having gained 15 lbs this year despite training for two triathlons. i’m still playing with this to see if it feels like it fits and perhaps behind my lukewarm/non-passionate feelings of late.

  407.  #407dorothea on August 19, 2010 at 9:48 am

    Liz, my LI is only about an inch taller than me, and I am a pretty short girl…
    I have gained 15 pounds too.

    I think I did this because of his height affecting me one way or another. I don’t feel bad or turned off by his height. I don’t even see it. Except for when I wear heels, but THEN I feel like this amazingly beautiful and statuesque goddess that he gets to show off. I mean, my legs and ass look even better in heels.

    He is small in stature so I have gained weight. hmmmm. yes I definitely feel the connection here, but I don’t know precisely what the connection is.

    I used to never date short guys, but now I see them everywhere and feel turned on by them.

  408.  #408Simply Shannon on August 19, 2010 at 10:30 am

    Dorothea: I feel intrigued and jealous of your feelings when you wear heels with your LI. Sigh. I wish I felt that when I’m with Mr. Fab Kisser. I feel ugly saying this but when I’m wearing my heels and feeling all fabulous and leggy and hot-momma-sassy, I’m typically questioning what the heck I’m doing with someone I feel lukewarm about.

    Eeeek! I want to erase. I want to erase. No. These are my truth thoughts as ugly as I perceive them.

    So, what the hell am I doing with someone I feel lukewarm about? What am I getting out of it? Clearly I’m getting something out of it or I wouldn’t be doing it. Right?


    Safety. I feel safe with him. Even in my most judgmental self, I feel safe with him that he wouldn’t hurt me on purpose.

    Curious-er and curious-er…

    No. The words I want to use are I feel safe with him because he CAN’T hurt him. Interesting twist of words. Can’t not wouldn’t.

    That’s pretty telling huh.

  409.  #409dorothea on August 19, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Shannon, how would it feel to lean back and not worry when you’re looking awesome in your heals, and perhaps instead simply inspire him to row and lean forward and pursue this beautiful leggy goddess who is out with him?

    how lucky is he! hehe

  410.  #410Nikita on August 19, 2010 at 2:10 pm


    I feel very happy about you dancing and I love ballroom. You circular dated last night !:)

  411.  #411Nikita on August 19, 2010 at 2:15 pm


    Wow, what’s that feel like; having dated the same man and yet comforting her? She knows you dated? I agree……you seem very strong and a peaceful way….and happy

  412.  #412Tmizz on August 19, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    JanJune (re: #303)

    Thank you – that was inspiring!

    I also hear what you say (in a different comment) about wondering if rejecting sex was just another way of rejecting or avoiding yourself. I’ve definitely wondered the same thing myself. Like, am I being totally unrealistic with myself here? Never mind the guy. What about MY libido? What about MY physical needs? Maybe avoiding sex is just a way of avoiding having to encounter myself and my totally natural and healthy and beautiful sexual desires…hm…

    Not that I do avoid them, at the moment 😉 …though I’ve never had more than one partner simultaneously. Not really my style.

    On another topic you brought up, I also realized this year that I have abandonment issues. Who knew? I always thought that was “someone else’s” problem. And then, there they were! Bam!

    But I’m happy, because NOW I get to deal with them! Maybe I just wasn’t ready to see them before and now I am, and that means I’m making progress! Hooray! *doing a happy dance*

  413.  #413janjune on August 19, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    hi Tmizz!

    doing the happy dance with you!!!
    …whirling, twirling, step step step…!!:)

    i feel happy to invite you to stick around!
    i feel that within the dynamics of this blog is the opportunity to recognize, confront and heal dysfunctional patterns — i know that is the way it has been working for me… 🙂

  414.  #414Brenda on August 20, 2010 at 8:52 am


    RE: #397 – You said, “I feel really triggered reading Brenda’s writing about men tricking her into getting pregnat by poking holes in condoms.

    I feel judgemental of Brenda.

    I feel gross ick, shocked, disgust to read that in a casual comment…”

    Here is where I am coming from…in my past, I felt almost across the board ignored, when I was either yelled at, criticized, interrupted, or just plain ignored. I am still learning relational skills, which is why I am here.

    Sometimes I don’t know how to relate to people in “normal” ways. I am used to everyone treating what I said as of equal value as if I had said, “It’s hot today.”

    A huge NV and part of my self-talk is saying to me almost every time I open my mouth, “No one is interested in hearing a word you are saying.”

    I have done my best to combat it by replacing it with, “I am an adult who is worthy of being heard. I deserve to be loved and cared for.”

    So in case it is of any help, I am not being manipulative with that. I am not sure how to say things sometimes. It was very, very hurtful when he did that. I thot he loved me and it turns out he was just trying to have a child…without my permission.

    I have been wracked with pain all my life and am getting free of it as fast as I can. But sometimes pain just drips out of my mouth, and I don’t know how to present it.

    How do you feel about that?

  415.  #415janjune on August 20, 2010 at 11:53 pm

    hi brenda,

    i love to see your posts come up!!

    i feel admiration at your ability to express yourself to others in such a kind, gentle way; i am learning alot from watching you do that.

    i feel tickled inside to see goddess get ahold of the rori program and work it.

    i feel encouraged by your tenacity.

  416.  #416Lisa on August 22, 2010 at 7:41 am

    After reading part 2 of this I just want to go find a guy and have sex. I want sex so much to have that connection, but I am picky about who I have sex with, as well. I want to contact “the guy” but I told him already I cannot do a casual fling. Ugh. I feel the need for sex. It has been almost 9 months since I last had sex. I feel deprived.

  417.  #417Lisa on August 22, 2010 at 7:57 pm

    I feel disconnected, sad looking at pics on facebook from a family wedding last weekend and my 25 year class reunion from this weekend. I could not travel back home to attend either. I saw “the guy” post that he is on his way to Denver and I want to text him to tell him to text hi when he drives by my city. I want to text “please get hold of me while you are in this area the next 2 months so we can have sex so I feel closer to you, even though you treat me like crap”. Ugh. I feel lonely I need to go eat and I am going alone, again. No one to go with me right now. I want the guy to want to stop here and see me, but I feel if I have to ask it doesn’t feel genuine that he would want to really see me. I went to see the guy almost 2 years ago expecting something and now over time realizing who he is and trying to let go of who I thought he was, accepting who he is and realizing I didn’t make him be who he is. I just happened along in his life as he was being who he is, but imagining maybe he is someone different. The guy I thought he was, nice, geeky but real, into me, loving. He’s not. He is an alcoholic, liar, manipulator, in denial about his drinking, somewhat abuses women emotionally, still geeky but a jerk, not a nice, loving geek. Lol. I feel bad that I wanted more from him because the desire hurts.

  418.  #418Tmizz on August 23, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    It is so happy to be danced with!

    I want to respond to something that a commenter said, way back somewhere in the middle of the thread, but I think it got buried among the other discussions. She was asking about feeling messages and what happens if the guy doesn’t “get” or understand the feeling messages. And I want to say, I completely know what you’re talking about!

    Sometimes it feels like, yeah, feeling messages are great. It’s wonderful to be in touch with your feelings and to be able to express them clearly and without “drama.” But what if the guy doesn’t get it? What if he just doesn’t “hear” what you are saying, either because he doesn’t have a reference point, or doesn’t care what you are saying at all?

    I think part of the answer might be in *how* you are delivering the feeling message. There is a big difference between saying, “I feel angry about that,” while folding your arms and making a pouty face, vs. looking someone squarely in the eye and saying, “I feel angry about that,” in a calm, even tone. So that comes down to body language (which you don’t have in a written medium) and also how *you* feel about your feelings. Are they bothering you? Does it make you feel icky/anxious/embarrassed to have a feeling, and so are you unconsciously conveying that, along with your “spoken” feeling? These are questions I have to ask myself, too, because I know it happens for me, which is why I’m putting them here. 🙂

    But my other response to that is…maybe it’s not always the right time to give a feeling message to your guy. Maybe stay quiet and wait for him to *ask* you what you’re feeling – then he’ll be in his “caring” space, and he won’t feel like you’re trying to force it on him, or “tell” him what to do. And you’ll KNOW that he cares, instead of having to force or guess. Great, right?

    Of course, this is all in an ideal world. I’m still working on getting all this to “work” for me – but I’m getting there!

    I HAVE made “feeling messages” work for me in some seemingly totally blocked situations by acknowledging *his* feelings first. This works for a couple of reasons. 1) The guy DOES have feelings. In fact, they have a lot of feelings. Nobody says it much, but guys are really pretty emotional. Only they don’t really have the equipment to talk about it all the time like we do. I think part of what Rori says about us being a “safe space” for their feelings as well as ours means that sometimes we can do what we do with our feelings for them – acknowledge them. Name them. Allow them to feel them. And then just wait for them to open up! And they do. It’s happened for me. 2) Like everybody, a guy just wants to be heard. And so do you! But amazingly, sometimes to the way to be heard is to listen first. I was having a disagreement with a guy one day, and I foresaw it becoming a fight. I felt frustrated because I had a different point of view and I just didn’t feel “heard.” So I went out of the room for a moment, and when I came back, he had his back toward me. But I sat next to him, put my hand on his shoulder and stated back to him what he’d said about his thoughts, feelings and motivations, and why he said what he said. I let him know that I’d heard what he said and I wasn’t just “steamrolling him.” He literally turned around, and after that, he was all ears. He even told me later that he noticed what I did. It wasn’t a relationship that worked out, but it was really a learning experience for me, in terms of communication. And I think it goes a little against what some of this stuff is saying about “feeling messages.” But it’s in line with it in the sense that, sometimes in order to get a message across, you have to create a space in which someone can be there to *receive* the message, and one way you can do that is by receiving first.

    Does that make sense?

  419.  #419Nikita on August 23, 2010 at 7:55 pm


    It makes sense. Thanks, I really enjoyed that and felt a certain resonance with your comments.

  420.  #420Isa on August 24, 2010 at 4:13 pm

    Mercedes –

    I tried this and the event just ended up feeling uncomfortable because I was thinking about surrendering and it felt like I was telling myself that I had to be those things. Does anyone have tips on how to do this?

  421.  #421tinque on August 24, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    I’m not sure what you are asking Isa.

  422.  #422Machelle on October 4, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    Hi Rory, I don’t know where to start. There is so much advice I need. I am dating a guy, virtually living with him actually and we have been together 6 months. From the moment we met we were inseperable. We had sex OFTEN and I mean often 3 times a day….sometmes he initiated sometime I did…he always told me how beautiful I was and complemented me on my body. He has since stopped. I am the one who initiates sex now. He never does and when we do have sex…it is me moving around him.. he stays in the same position the whole time. On his back. I have shared with him that I need him to be more affectionate and that I need him to take on more of the initiator role in bed as well as I need him to be more assertive in bed. He says he will work on it but, it’s just not something he is use to. He also told me the more I tell him I need his touch. The more he feels like he needs to force himself to touch me. I am watching my self esteem dwindle a way. I feel as though he is repulsed by me. I don’t know what to do. We have other issues too. I have trust issues with him as well. He was on several dating sites well into our becoming an exclusive couple and he was still somewhat entangled with an ex girlfriend. I went from being a woman who wasn’t the least bit worried about him cheating on me to someone who is now untrusting as well as feeling very very insecure. He told me I need to change my insecurities with him and work on it, I told him he needs to be more affectionate. I am working on the insecurities issue quite seriously and he hasn’t worked on anything. I don’t know what to do anymore. We also use to talk non stop and now…we hardly ever talk when we are in the same room together. I try to make conversation but he will give me one worded answers or ignore me. I am not the type to pout or nag so I let it go and maintain a smile on my face and continue on my day. I don’t know what to do…please help me save this relationship…if there is anything left to save.

  423.  #423Machelle on October 4, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    Hi Rory, I don’t know where to start. There is so much advice I need. I am dating a guy, virtually living with him actually and we have been together 6 months. From the moment we met we were inseperable. We had sex OFTEN and I mean often 3 times a day….sometmes he initiated sometime I did…he always told me how beautiful I was and complemented me on my body. He has since stopped. I am the one who initiates sex now. He never does and when we do have sex…it is me moving around him.. he stays in the same position the whole time. On his back. I have shared with him that I need him to be more affectionate and that I need him to take on more of the initiator role in bed as well as I need him to be more assertive in bed. He says he will work on it but, it’s just not something he is use to. He also told me the more I tell him I need his touch. The more he feels like he needs to force himself to touch me. I am watching my self esteem dwindle a way. I feel as though he is repulsed by me. I don’t know what to do. We have other issues too. I have trust issues with him as well. He was on several dating sites well into our becoming an exclusive couple and he was still somewhat entangled with an ex girlfriend. I went from being a woman who wasn’t the least bit worried about him cheating on me to someone who is now untrusting as well as feeling very very insecure. He told me I need to change my insecurities with him and work on it, I told him he needs to be more affectionate. I am working on the insecurities issue quite seriously and he hasn’t worked on anything. I don’t know what to do anymore. We also use to talk non stop and now…we hardly ever talk when we are in the same room together. I try to make conversation but he will give me one worded answers or ignore me. I am not the type to pout or nag so I let it go and maintain a smile on my face and continue on my day. I don’t know what to do…please help me save this relationship…if there is anything left to save.

  424.  #424Rori Raye on October 5, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Whoa, Machelle – you sound fascinating. He’s angry. You need to take care of yourself – Circular Dating…and romance yourself. There’s a lot you can do here…start with the ebook…that will give you the essentials, and then go to Reconnect your Relationship, then Modern Siren. We’ll help you…Love, Rori

  425.  #425Brenda on October 5, 2010 at 8:10 pm


    Welcome! You are overfunctioning, like I used to. Stop initiating sex, touch, telling him “you should…”

    Lean back. Let him come to you. Focus on your feelings, not his behavior.

    Talk to us. We are mostly on the newest threads…

  426.  #426machelle on October 6, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    Thankyou for your input I really do appreciate it… Rori, I would love love to download the ebook…but, I lost my job 3 months ago and money is tight….so I read through your posts when I can…they have been very helpful….and Brenda..I will start talking on here….which threads should I look at?… I don’t even know where to begin……I think about leaving him everyday……I still have my apartment…thankgoodness I can go back to it when I need too. I need some advice some real advice there is so much more to purge from my heart and I have no one absolultely no one to talk too….my best friends tell me I deserve better and need to leave him and to be honest if that is the truth then that is what I will do…I feel as though he cheating on me but I have no proof. I feel as though he is dishonest. But, I have no proof….I have caught him in a few lies but then he says I am paranoid. I do love him and want to turn things around and I know I have the abilities to do that. I just need to learn how. Am I the one who made him angry Rori?….how do I change that?…will someone help me?….

  427.  #427Brenda on October 6, 2010 at 3:01 pm


    When you first open the blog, the newest thread of it will be first, which is currently this one:

    We comment on other threads, but the newest one is the one Rori prefers that we write on, so she can find us, as well as find each other. It is just to keep it from getting so confusing to be on 5 threads or so at a time.

    I am not a professional myself. I am parroting what I have been learning from Rori and the other “Sirens” here. I have been on this blog since April 2010, and been listening to Rori’s CD seminars since April 2009. This is a wonderful place to pour out your heart, and I have made many long distance friends in the process! We are not perfect, but I have felt very accepted here, overall…I hope you will become comfortable sharing your deep truth, so as to best be helped! I myself feel a bit vulnerable now and then, but I have found sooo much help and support, and I have concluded the risk is worth it!

    You can’t change him. You can only change yourself. So while you may not be to blame for his behavior, why try to change him when you can only change yourself?

    I have been working hard on smoothing out my relational style, and it is really a process of inner healing. Such a deep work takes time, effort, and patience. So reward yourself when you take baby steps.

    I am not sure exactly what Rori would advise you to do, but if it were me, I would leave him, at least temporarily. Experience has taught me that taking a break in a relationship can make it or break it far more effectively than words. Leaving would create a huge shift in the relationship, and that needs to happen, one way or the other.

    Here is the psychological dynamic:

    You are acting as the “convincer”, and he is acting as the “resistor”. If you were to go back to your apartment, you would become the “resistor”. At that point, he could re-evaluate and choose whether or not he wants to be the “convincer”.

    Think of leaning back and receiving, like a water wheel. A water wheel doesn’t DO anything. It just leans back and receives. The best word I can give you is


    Stop initiating conversation. Stop blaming him and making him wrong. Stop initiating sex. Stop reaching out to him when you feel insecure.

    When you feel unsure what to say, stay silent or else look deep inside and simply state how you feel…

    I feel scared. I feel insecure. I feel like I just got hit with a ton of bricks. Ouch! That didn’t feel good. I need to go take a walk.

    I am not suggesting to say all that in one paragraph. It is better to just state one or two feelings at a time.

    As far as where to start on the blog, choose one or two articles at the tops of threads that sound relevant to you and your relationship and just read them, then work the tools you find there.

    As far as your income, I recommend “The Power” at the library! 🙂


  428.  #428Machelle on October 7, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    Thankyou Brenda!…Holy cow have you been watching me the whole time?…LOL.. you described me to a “T”…….I do tell him “you should be more affecionate” …..actualy I usually phrase it as…”I need you to be….”…and then insert whatever that need is…….it’s become a vicious circle with us…..He has a list of things he needs me to do. Don’t hug on him….don’t snuggle with him at night…..basically not to touch him at all……I have a list of things I need him to do…. be more affecionate…hug me more…etc……the more I need the more he resists…I have explained to him that his NEED to not be touched is just as strong as my NEED to be touched…..His need to not be assertive and take on that role in bed is as great as my need to have him make the first moves……I need to just let it go….and like you said let him come to me…..I’m not sure I can change needing affection from a man……it is deeply integrated within my soul to touch and be touched and be hunted by a man…..but, I will give it a sincere go and see what happens….I also have huge trust issues which I KNOW I need to change..and is not helping our relationship at all….but, that is something that will require deep examination in my heart on how I can change it…..I was molested by my dads best friend for 10 yrs (4-14) and then had a dad who told me I was ugly growing up….then raped at 23…I am now in my 40’s…so I have a lot of work to do there with trust……I have found some good stuff on here and I will continue to read through everything…. and I will also go to the library and check out the book you mentioned…..I know some of what is going on with me goes way back to my childhood and I know I do not need to continue carrying that baggage with me into a relationship….it’s time to dump it….Now I just need to learn how to do that…..thankyou again……it is truly appreciated……

  429.  #429Brenda on October 7, 2010 at 2:51 pm


    I read all your posts, if that’s what you mean. I really relate to you. I am much the same way…needy, clingy, overfunctioning. I feel really sad reading about being molested, raped, and emotionally abused. Are you seeing a therapist for that? There are a lot of them that get grants and donations and will help you at no charge.

    You have come to the right place!!! I have grown sooo much since coming here! I love it here! And I just keep growing! I am in the process of reconnecting my relationship from 2009. I wasn’t the only one who made mistakes, but I really pushed Ryan away by doing a lot of the things you are talking about. I am learning now in baby steps to lean back and let him come to me.

    Of course it is impossible to just stop feeling needy and stop needing touch. I grew up with very little touch, and I continue like that because most of my relationships in adulthood were long distance. But I have learned many things that help fill me inside, and so it is really a beautiful path of inner healing that leads us to our happy ever after!!

    I am hoping and praying that the inner healing I have found and am finding will be a big part of changing my dynamic with Ryan so he comes back bit by bit. He has started calling or texting me about once a week. Even that is big progress after how badly I overfunctioned and pushed him out of the relationship bubble.

    I am filling my life with friends, other dates, the blog here, and developing my Purpose On the Planet (P.O.P.). Over time, it really does create a positive shift. We are here for you!


  430.  #430Brenda on October 7, 2010 at 2:56 pm


    some more thoughts…

    Here is a feeling message to get started with:

    Instead of “I need you to be more affectionate…” try:

    I feel isolated. It would feel so good to be with a man who held me and cuddled me. What do you think?

    However, if you have been leaning way forward, it might be better to lean completely back. This would look like you literally leaning back on the sofa or staying to your side of the bed without reaching out. If he comes your way, be inviting, not hostile.

    When you are alone, you can literally hug yourself, caress yourself, slowly put lotion on yourself. Run your fingers through your hair. You NEED that touching. If you are not getting it from him, you can start to fill you emotional needs from within, and love yourself.

    The healthiest thing you can do is to start to date other men! Can you get 3 men going to date by posting internet ads? Or by dressing up and going out to coffee shops, hotel restaurants, parks, community events? If you have 3 other men calling you and giving you attention, you will be less focused on him and your vibe will shift to not so needy! Best wishes!

  431.  #431Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    omg, a guy i have a huge crush on just might ask me out to dinner, i feel so excited and SOOO guilty toward LI. i feel like a cheater.

  432.  #432Lucy on October 7, 2010 at 3:32 pm

    Dorothea!! I am SO happy to see you here!!!!! I was JUST thinking, during dinner, that I was going to post on the blog, “I miss Dorothea” — and here you are!!!!! So glad!!


  433.  #433Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    hi lucy! i need comfort. tell me i’m not a dirty cheater! i have been clear there’s no ring on my finger so i am free to date around, but i act like my heart belongs to him, so i feel awful guilty, but i f*cking like this other guy oh yes i do

  434.  #434Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    ok he’s not asking and i am getting bored…

  435.  #435Lucy on October 7, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    Dorothea, I would feel the same conflicting feelings if I were in your shoes — but in all honesty, you’re not doing anything wrong … as TN man once told me when I was in a similar situation, “Nothing promised, nothing lost.”

    It’s really the whole point of what Rori teaches. So now your LI gets to fight like a man for your attention and affection!

    And you get to feel your feelings. 🙂

  436.  #436Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    now he’s being mean and i’m not sure if he’s trying to neg me or he’s just an asshole. losing interest…

  437.  #437Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:48 pm

    ah that flash of feeling desired by someone you greatly desire felt good and refreshing and now i have lost interest in his tactics. he didn’t ask, but if he does, i might consider it.
    i dunno
    it also feels empowering and comforting to have wanted someone and then realize you’re not entirely into them afterall.

  438.  #438Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    he said “now leave me alone so i can clean my house. mwah”
    what the f*ck does that mean? i didn’t even respond.

  439.  #439Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    the only thing i that passed through my head upon reading that was “lol you’re a weirdo”
    but i don’t think i am supposed to say things like that to men.

  440.  #440Daria on October 7, 2010 at 4:01 pm

    Dorothea – how about… Lol that feels weird… Starting to feel a lil turned off … I don’t want that . What do you think?

    Ack kina scary

  441.  #441Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 4:05 pm

    “abrupt goodbyes feel weird”

  442.  #442Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 4:08 pm

    i said, “woah, that felt abrupt. going home, bye!”

    and now i am going to go home.

  443.  #443Brenda on October 7, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    Hi Dorothea!

    Welcome back! I hope that other man asks you out!

  444.  #444Katarina Phang on October 7, 2010 at 6:32 pm

    Dorothea, congrats and please no need to feel bad. SG and I are going to spend 8 days next week but I still date. It’s only an exploration stage of our courtship at this point (yesterday was our first month anniversary), there is no guarantee.

    It’ll be better off for both of us when I date (and I bet he does too if he finds anyone interesting on match).

  445.  #445Katarina Phang on October 7, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    I’m sorry if he didn’t ask you out though, thought he already did.

    Don’t focus on luke-warm guys. You just need to find that one man who is so excited to see you…again and again.

    I was originally booked to leave for Asia tonight visiting my family but I rescheduled it it the last minute because we’d been battling the past week if we should see each other again before my trip and finally found the flight taking into account all the constraints and variables from both of our sides (especially his being a single dad and all). November was just too long for him (and for me too).

    We’re so happy we finally made it.

  446.  #446Dorothea on October 7, 2010 at 6:50 pm

    Thanks Katarina, i lost interest real quick when he wasn’t moving forward with it. i bet he is just a shy one/scared of rejection. but it’s not my job to guess. or maybe my scared vibe started coming through when i started feeling like a cheater.
    but i mean, obviously the guy is attracted to me, sending kisses and all. it was the first time we ever talked outside of professional contexts, and the flirting escalated hardcore. fun!

  447.  #447Katarina Phang on October 7, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    Dorothea, just in case he needs reassurance, maybe you can just be direct with him once and for all while being tongue-in-cheek. Like you can say, “So, are you going to ask me out ever or what?”

    If he’s still coy, he’s no good. Just move on. Don’t waste another breath on a guy like this.

  448.  #448Lucy on October 7, 2010 at 7:03 pm

    “ah that flash of feeling desired by someone you greatly desire felt good”

    I know that feeling! It does feel good, even when it’s temporary!

  449.  #449doesnt understand partner on October 17, 2010 at 10:32 pm

    ive been with my girl for 9 years. we split up in 2008 for 9months and i started dating someone else.. we worked things out and got back together. at first sex was awesome she wanted it just as much as i did now… her libido is just the same as before we broke up. ive talked till im blue in the face dont know what else 2 do. she says i need to try 2 get her n the mood. well im tired of being the one who initiates allllll the time!!!!! help!

  450.  #450Rori Raye on October 18, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    dear doesn’t understand…we’d LOVE to know what you’ve talked about, and how you’re trying to get her in the mood. Unless she has physical, hormonal issues – low sex drive is always about the feelings going on in the relationship. Either she doesn’t feel safe and/or she doesn’t feel loved and cherished and/or she’s angry. Does any of that ring a bell? If you’re just trying to get her to participate – that doesn’t feel like love and cherishing to a woman. Sorry – but we girls are all the same. If you break up with her – if the problem is with the way you’re relating to her as a woman – the same thing will happen to you with the next woman. There are all kinds of books – and Tinque can help you big time.

  451.  #451Dashing.... on April 2, 2011 at 3:43 am

    hi, i happen not to like kissing and my boyfriend loves kissing, i was wondering if something is wrong with me or i am simply not going about it right..what should i do Rori???