How Our Fear Of Intimacy Draws Us To Toxic, Unavailable and Plain Old Bad Men

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Here’s such a perfect example of our fear of intimacy from Janice…she makes it all so totally clear to US, but it’s also clear that from inside the way she feels – she can’t see what’s really going on:

“Hi Rori
Since I wrote to you last I have been seeing Michael on a weekly basis as we go jogging around the local reservoir. This came about  after I contacted him to look around another business venture i was looking into. When i dropped him off  at his home he suggested that we go for a coffee when I was off work. So i text him a couple of Weeks later thinking that he would have forgotten but he not only agreed to going for coffee but also suggested going for a walk around the local reservoir. which we did. Then at his suggestion we started going every week and he paid for the coffees most of the time. I really enjoyed our time together and last week he suggested that I go around to his house on the Sunday to have a go at his weights, he also asked if i could collect some paint for him as he was decorating his lounge. He was going to call around to collect the paint on the Saturday if he needed it but because I was going to be around his way I agreed to take the paint around to him and ring him on the Sunday after I had returned from taking my daughter to singing lessons.

I text him when I had got the paint to which he text back thanking me. Then on the Saturday I took the paint around but as he was out I left it outside his door. He did not text me to thank me for it ( which was very unusual for him) then on the Sunday  when i had returned about  5pm I rang him to arrange to go and see him as arranged  the  previous Friday. He did not answer his land line or mobile so i left him a message asking him to ring me back. He did not contact me until the following morning at 8am when he text me to say that he had been at home but was next door in the hot tub, had had some wine and fallen to sleep and that he owed me for the paint. He never even apologised for letting me down again!!.

I was so upset and angry that he could invite me to something and then to make alternative plans again!! with no thought or consideration to my feelings that I have not replied to his text and as per usual he has not contacted  me either. I feel like a puppet being taken out of the box when it suits him and then put back in when he has finished with me. So Rori my question is how do I tell him what he is doing to me and if it is that he is afraid of being hurt again or just hasn’t come to terms with his divorce I still do not feel it is an excuse for him to treat me with such disdain. Regards, Janice”
PS I have three other men after me, the problem is two of them are married and one of whom is very interested in me. Should I tell Michael about them,even though I have no intention of getting involved with them?
Here’s my answer:

Janice – Micheal isn’t doing anything.


He’s just doing what he does. Which is nothing.

He’s not trying to hurt you.

Telling him how jerky he’s being will get you nowhere.

The problem is what YOU’RE doing.

Everything you say here that you’ve done sounds like a servant to me.

Completely inappropriate.

You’re going to his house, you’re doing stuff for him, you’ve even figured out that he may still be in love with his ex-wife, and you understand and love him anyway!

This is completely why you’re feeling so disappointed and upset and angry.

This is where my Targeting Mr. Right program will help you tremendously – it’ll answer all your questions around these other men and how to Circular Date properly and NOT put out effort…

When we’re so used to putting all our energy into trying to keep emotional distance from a man – because it’s how we experienced love when we were small and how we’ve continued the habit of thinking of love and so experiencing it as distance and pain – the man we are most attracted to is usually the one who demands (actually offers) the most distance.

To upend this system that does us no good and causes us so much pain – Circular Dating is key. It’s a way of practicing my Tools – especially the Modern Siren tools – constantly, with men – “in the field.”

One rule – NO MARRIED MEN for “real” dates.  They’re fine to flirt with and practice on anywhere out in life (the market, the drug store, your karate class…) but FORBIDDEN on the phone, email, or in-person one-on one – anything that looks like, smells like, feels like a “date” of ANY kind. Stay AWAY!!

Though men with “girlfriends” are fair game as far as I’m concerned (if there’s no ring, there’s no deal), there’s still the same risks attached. Same with a man with a powerfully attached “ex.”  If he’s not really into you…he’s useless. That’s the bottom line requirement for you to spend any time at all with a man – that he be “into you.”

And if you’re not sure yet what it looks and feels like when a man is “into you,” this is what you get to explore and discover as you Circular Date – and as you move closer toward an ability to do real intimacy through the baby-steps of Feeling Messages and the Siren tools.

Start first with staying away from a man who does not ACT like he’s into you. Forget trying to figure out why. The BEHAVIOR he does is all you need to know.

Janice, as you start exercising your Boundaries, and your ability to say No – even though you may have “feelings” for a man – you’ll see things start to shift for you. 

You’ll start making your own rules about what’s acceptable and what isn’t (this man is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE) – and everything will get better.

I know you feel like a puppet – but it’s YOU who’re pulling your strings! It’s you who’s creating this feeling for yourself by going to him emotionally and physically.

He’s actually not even lifting a finger. He’s just asking.

It’s YOU who’s doing the giving. Of your own free will.

And what you’ve done, what you’ve assumed, the habits you’ve continued – they can all be UNDONE!!

Yes, you’re THAT POWERFUL!!!

Learn in baby-steps to assume responsibility for only RECEIVING…from a man who’s “into you” – and everything will change for you.

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Siena on June 8, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    “the man we are most attracted to is usually the one who demands (actually offers) the most distance.”

    yes, so so true. The good news is that (thanks to you Rori) I’ve finally started to realize this, so when my thoughts go to the unavailable guy who hasn’t bothered to check in with me about how I’m feeling about ANYTHING, I can switch those thoughts to something else that feels good… like the guy who IS stepping up to the plate and IS concerned about making me feel good.

    Sometimes it feels exhausting to keep coming back to those thoughts time and time again. It’s getting easier little by little though, which feels good – because hopefully it means that I’m healing my own fear of intimacy and unavailability issues.

    Thank you Rori for being so consistent and clear about this – it really helps. Love you!

  2.  #2Polli on June 8, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    my long distance, apparently emotionally unavailable man just recently dumped me and then bragged to me how he has met someone and how wonderful she is etc etc etc. nice guy, huh? i at first (like an idiot) wanted to remain friends with him forever…but finally in the light of day i have come to my senses about that. he is not a friend to me and never was, he is a user. i have to deal with him at work (by phone and IM) but i do not ever contact him for anything not work related and i never will. (to be honest, it was tempting a few times). but i asked myself, for what? more hurt? i can tell he is angry at me about this turn of events but that is just too bad. on some of the other topics i discovered the tool of making noise to get rid of the ugly voice in your head. let me tell you it works. i simply do “lalalala” over and over for a few seconds and the sad or ugly thought does go away….if a similar one crops up i do the same. it works every time. i only started doing this last saturday and already i feel so much better and so much more in control of myself. up til then i was very very sad and crying alot. i thought i was in love with him but i have to rethink that. i was obsessed with him and there is a big difference i think. in the beginnng he was so wonderful… sweet so nurturing…..but all that changed. why? i don’t know and it really does not matter. of the six month relationship 95% of the time was hurtful for me. but still i stayed for more and more…it was a roller coaster ride…i am so glad to be off of it. he even said to me after he told me about his new “friend” that we could still be friends but we would just have to forgo the “with benefits” for awhile. i told him then and there, no, never again. what a jerk. why couldn’t i see him for what he was the entire time? there were a million red flags. again it is our minds. i made a relationship where there was none on his part. so janice, don’t ignore the red flags like i did. and if you find yourself hurting after you cut off from him try the noise tool that rori teaches us to get you past the sad stuff. or to keep you from trying to make contact of some kind….we have to remember at all times we are prizes and if they choose to let us pass then it truly is their loss alot more than it is ours…hope this helps someone to get thru the process of recovering from what it really is sometimes, an addiction. i am praying alot, even for him. i am asking that God will make him a better person. not so i can have him because i no longer want him, but so that he will not want to hurt anyone else like he has me.
    during the roller coaster ride i came to this site a zillion times and found help and what i needed to know and it has made a huge difference in how i am handling this. thanks Rori for what you do and thanks everyone for sharing what you know and have learned. what a blessing you all are.

  3.  #3Polli on June 8, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    sorry, i said once before that i believe i did not stumble on this website by accident. i believe God knew i would be needing it…..

  4.  #4Simply Shannon on June 8, 2010 at 6:21 pm

    It feels so bizarre to me how this post isn’t triggering me. Before I would have been all adamant about how terrible the guy was and it would piss me off just reading the post. Now that I feel more confident and more sure of what I want and don’t want, I KNOW I don’t have to tolerate this stuff if I don’t want to. It really is that simple. There are so many men in this world that I can simply say no to that one and that one and that one… until I find myself saying yes to the one.

    In other news, I’m on day 8 of the Man Fast. It’s kind of nice in a way to not be thinking about dates and men. I did have lunch with Mr. Fab Kisser after he contacted me again. Yes, I broke my fast but it felt good to clear the air about the letter he sent.

    He says he wants to keep seeing me. I feel kind of neutral about it. I told him I’m on a Man Fast and wouldn’t be accepting any dates, phone calls, emails, letters, or texts until July 1st. 🙂 He asked me if I would go out with him on July 2nd. I said yes. So we’ll see. Who knows. Maybe by then he’ll be dating someone else. It doesn’t matter to me. I feel open and good either way. I haven’t been checking Match to see if he’s online or checking up on him on Facebook (or any other boys either). Proud of myself.

    I haven’t fully decided what will happen on July 1st. Do I put my online profiles back up? I dunno. I’m still circular dating/flirting with men in my everyday life. I actually flirted with my ex-husband tonight. We had to discuss some stuff about our kids, and it felt good talking to him. It felt kind of weird really because it felt fun and a little flirty which has not been the case between us. Almost awkward like teenagers. Too funny.

  5.  #5Sherry on June 8, 2010 at 6:23 pm

    Ugh! Perfect for me tonight! I just leaned forward, after 2 weeks, and emailed the guy on the website. After a couple emails back and forth – all about HIM – he quit responding! I feel so angry!

    I have all these men stepping up.. so many that want to go out with me.. but I keep coming back, thinking about, and emailing him! Why? It’s true he offers the most “distance”but I don’t want distance.. do I?

    Our date wasn’t even that good! Why am I still thinking about him?

  6.  #6Sherry on June 8, 2010 at 7:20 pm

    I just realized he is the only one who isn’t persuing me.. The only one I am not in control of so to speak. What does that say about me? What am I missing here? Why am I obsessing over the one who doesn’t want me?

  7.  #7dorothea on June 8, 2010 at 7:27 pm

    i dunno sherry but when good men make themselves even better for me or show me true love, i want to punch them in their stupid faces and scream at them while simultaneously vomiting on their broken stupid faces.

  8.  #8Lucy on June 8, 2010 at 7:33 pm

    ‘Though men with “girlfriends” are fair game as far as I’m concerned (if there’s no ring, there’s no deal)’

    That feels so weird to me. …Interloper Girl….

  9.  #9Apple Jacks on June 8, 2010 at 7:43 pm

    Dorothea – remind me to never drink anything near the computer. After reading your post, I almost sprayed my herbal tea all over the monitor!

  10.  #10Daria on June 8, 2010 at 8:18 pm

    Yay Polli!!! awesome… thanks for reminding me of the “making noise” tool!

  11.  #11mary on June 8, 2010 at 9:36 pm


    i like where you are!

    maybe i’ll go on a man fast too. that sound pretty fun right now!

    just concentrate on work for a while.

  12.  #12mary on June 8, 2010 at 9:36 pm


    it’s still your birthday!

    how’ve you been spending it?

  13.  #13Daria on June 8, 2010 at 9:43 pm

    mary – hey! i got some food poisoning this morning when my mom took me to sushi for lunch – – so i was napping and getting over that all day, till right now i felt better and i had a present and dinner and cake with my parents

    my mom also took me to get my eyebrows done! yay they look great!

  14.  #14Daria on June 8, 2010 at 10:08 pm

    I have so many offers of fun and exciting things to do tonite, all i have to do is say YES!

    Everyone is ready to pick me up and they keep calling my phone, asking me to come out so they can take me out to celebrate.

    At least 5 different men are calling wanting to spend tonite with me and driving around wanting to pick me up.

    they have gotten gifts for me like a gold bracelet and they want to take me to the salon to get my nails done (but i dont haha)

    there are parties going on all over the bay and at music studios and men want to take me there and lay me on the bed in the backroom and massage my feet

    they are telling me its cool to just come out in my pijamas im feeling so amused hehe

    my godsister called to say happy birthday and say shes sorry for getting at me that way and she wants to be friends

    she knows a really handsome man that wants to get to know me and they are ready to come pick me up tonite!

    two of the men are wanting to help me pay my bills this next week because they are very successful and they think i deserve it for being such a great person and it makes them feel good to take care of a woman like me

    they are encouraging me and want to support me financially saying that this will help me actually get ahead and have less stress if i want to

    my body is magically kicking off the uti now that i am no longer drinking the uva ursi

    its amazing how its just healing my pee is turning normal and even yellow and i can FEEL my bladder being happy, it feels so reassuring to stretch and squeeze it and feel nothing yeah!

    my eft is working amazingly well, its like whatever i tap on just starts manifesting, i feel so empowered and like my life is a magic carpet ride taht feels so goood!! i can even influence other people and the events in my life with EFT. i feel so proud of myself and am ready to help other people too!

  15.  #15Amy F on June 8, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    Happy Birthday Daria!

    Shannon -A man fast! I love it!

  16.  #16lucy on June 8, 2010 at 11:23 pm

    can’t sleep. feel so bad. sad. discouraged. jealous. mad. i can slay the jabborwocky. can i slay the jabborwocky? have i lost my muchness? i do believe i have. there was something special there; it vanished into thin air. a trick, a joke, a laugh on lucy. i don’t get the joke. pain in my heart. nothingness. what happened to the specialness? how is it even possible to trade that quickly? breathe feel breathe feel don’t think don’t judge let go illusion of control. funny how he taught me how to let him go.

  17.  #17Daria on June 8, 2010 at 11:29 pm

    thank you all!

    its working!

    Dman’s brother is now asking me to come see his brother

    and a new man i havent met yet wants to come see me!

    more EFT now

  18.  #18Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 1:01 am


    Wow…. Having the great time….. Woohoo…. Cheers lady…!!

  19.  #19Daria on June 9, 2010 at 1:01 am

    hehe thanks ankita

  20.  #20Polli on June 9, 2010 at 1:38 am

    thanks Daria….and happy birthday!!!!!

  21.  #21Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 5:20 am

    Happy birthday Daria!! I hope your day felt fabulous and that this year feels amazing!

  22.  #22mary on June 9, 2010 at 6:13 am


    i konked out last night before i got your response.

    how amazing to be wanted by so many people! i think i’m happiest about your sister-in-law, as she was on your mind a lot. it’s so neat that she’s coming your way now, not saying, “call me.”

    and someone else might have reported a ruined day because of the food poisoning. not you! you’re counting your blessings. how cool is that? not DOING everything, but enjoying the offers! i’ll have to remember how to do that.

  23.  #23mary on June 9, 2010 at 6:18 am


    there is no laugh on lucy!

    just lucy.

    i’m tryin’ to learn to laugh at life.

    your muchness is more now. your specialness doesn’t come and go. and nothing has vanished because you’re still there!

    i enjoy you, lucy.

  24.  #24mary on June 9, 2010 at 6:25 am

    i’m in the middle of a fab job offer!

    i know i’ll be walking on the clouds after this, and everyone’s gonna wonder where Mary went.

    they’re gonna say, “oh! THERE you are, Mary! come on down and worry about men some more! we don’t even know you now… why aren’t you doing all those Mary things you do? where are all those tears? where is that angst? come back down here and be Mary again for us.”

    but NO.

    Mary is morphing.

  25.  #25Tallgirl10 on June 9, 2010 at 6:59 am

    But now I feel sad and anxious because I have not heard from text man.

    If I don’t contact him, it is because I want him to prove he is interested.

    If I do contact him, it is because I want him to know I am interested in making a go of it. And in that, I suppose that is wanting something from him.

    I feel sad and panicked. I triggered and abandoned. I feel like I did something wrong and I am not enough.

  26.  #26mary on June 9, 2010 at 7:45 am

    oh, Tall Girl!

    you sound like me last week with Island Man. and then he called me three times and i wasn’t there. and i didn’t call him back because he didn’t SAY call back.

    then a week later, i called him back. and we got together.

    now i’m gonna wait for him. it’s his turn to take the initiative.

    i’m curious about what will happen!

    Tall Girl, let’s just be curious together. eh?

    no need for panicking at this point!

    these guys like us! they’re intrigued and mystified! our silence will send them wondering…

    and waiting is half the fun! don’t you think?

    i’m just beginning to think so…

  27.  #27Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 7:56 am

    Thanks, Mary, it felt good to read your words…even made me smile a little. Thanks… <3

  28.  #28Tallgirl10 on June 9, 2010 at 8:12 am


    Thanks for the kind words. The waiting is not fun. Not for me anyhow.

    I am just really struggling because I want to reach out to him. Just say something, and see if he responds. But that would be it. I would never know if it was just a response or not.

    But I would caution. To me it feels like playing games when someone calls three times but then you don’t call back. That feels like a power play as opposed to being open. But that is just me, and my glass house is not so fantastic ;-)!

  29.  #29Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 8:13 am

    This is so weird…. TN man was on match “within an hour” just now! His profile is still not visible to anyone, and he had told me that he let his account die when he hooked up with interloper girl.

    So what could he possibly be doing on there????

    I know I know I know it’s None of My Business!

    But I just feel really curious! genuinely curious!

  30.  #30Maria on June 9, 2010 at 8:37 am

    Hmm, l have never quite understood the concept of being unavailable myself and attracting unavailable men in. I dont see how it is going – to me it looks exactly the opposite – lm too available and that drags in all sorts of creatures.
    If lm unavailable, that would mean that the men, who want my attention, are available, and lm just choosing to who l am giving my attention back. (and to be available to them)
    Can anyone please explain this to me

  31.  #31dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 9:26 am

    lucy quit looking at his profile lol!

    man i do the same thing

    i’m such a bad little girl

  32.  #32Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 9:28 am

    Lucy, I feel curious. How do you know he’s online on Match if his profile is hidden? I didn’t know I could see someone’s status on Match if I can’t see their profile. Where are you looking? I probably shouldn’t ask this because then I’ll be checking up on a few folks who I know are on there but hidden. 🙂

  33.  #33dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 9:36 am

    well great now i just searched up my asshole ex’s account and i feel all triggered hahahaha

    “you don’t have to get all dolled up for me. i like eyeliner and lipgloss girls”

    i feel angry and judgmental and it feels like a lattice-work of spears has been suddenly installed to hold the upper half of my torso up and to keep it from totally caving in.


  34.  #34Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 9:42 am

    Shannon, happy to help! Haha!

    He is on my Connections page because I emailed him on there before his profile was hidden. So, in Connections, in his little box (and Siena, if you’re reading this, just because I said “little” box does not mean I think his peeny is teeny lol — it’s not! hehe) click on “you emailed him.” That will take you to “your emails with him” page — and his last active time is right there next to his pic. Voila!

    I found this out by accident because I just wanted to reread what I had written in the email (which he never read cuz he let his account die before I sent it.)

    But I really wonder what that boy is doing on there!!!!!

    dorothea 😛
    I don’t go on just to check his status, but while I’m there responding to OTHER GUYS (yay me!) I just take a peek sometimes. 🙂

    My friend who dated 70 guys from match and married one last summer . . . WELL, she had a guy who dumped her, and SHE figured out his match password and hacked into his account and read all his emails with other women!!!!!!!!

  35.  #35Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 9:45 am

    “you don’t have to get all dolled up for me. i like eyeliner and lipgloss girls”


    Lol. Well, he’s not attracting ME with that line!!!

  36.  #36Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 9:46 am

    Dorothea, maybe he meant their hair can be all greasy and uncombed, as long as they wear eyeliner and lip gloss.

  37.  #37dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 9:59 am

    maybe he wants me to wear eyeliner to match the black eye i am going to fucking give him saying shit like that.

  38.  #38dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 9:59 am

    maybe he wants me to wear eyeliner to match the black eye i am going to f*cking give him saying sh*t like that.

  39.  #39dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 10:00 am

    My friend who dated 70 guys from match and married one last summer . . . WELL, she had a guy who dumped her, and SHE figured out his match password and hacked into his account and read all his emails with other women!!!!!!!!

    lol this sounds like a dorothea thing to do

    not so much anymore. i fight the urge.

    well there go the dang tornado sirens. they make me feel uneasy and freaked out.

  40.  #40Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:03 am

    Bah. This guy on match who lives three hours away emailed and said I’m cute and wants to know if I ever come to his city.

    I said, “Aw, thanks! I haven’t been there in years — love the aquarium there though.”

    He says, “let me know when you want to come for a visit. sounds like you’re overdue :)”


  41.  #41dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 10:05 am

    thanks but it feels much better when men come to me!

  42.  #42Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:10 am

    I guess I should practice on this guy instead of just ignoring him. I’m not interested in him, but he’s “okay.”

    So… if this was on a school exam, what response should I write in order to get an A from Prof Rori? (Or maybe the TA, Daria, will be grading it.)

    How about: The aquarium feels peaceful and magical. I don’t want to drive to a date’s city though. I feel better when they drive to me. 🙂

  43.  #43Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:11 am

    Oh, thanks dorothea! We are on the same wavelength!

  44.  #44Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 10:16 am

    Dorothea – you crack me up!

    Have you had any cortisone shots lately? It feels like we’re on the same wavelength lately. lol

    Probably why I feels so amused. You are saying what I’m feeling.

  45.  #45Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 10:17 am

    You and me and Lucy I guess?

    Eeeew. Wouldn’t it feel wonderfully yucky to be able to read an exes emails? Except then I would probably be tempted to send some on his behalf… edit his profile a little…. hmmm…..

  46.  #46dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 10:17 am

    no i’m basically like this all the time.

  47.  #47Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 10:20 am

    Good for you. You must be in tornado alley somewhere? We just had an alarm go off here too, maybe we’re in the same city!

  48.  #48dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 10:23 am

    I think it’s a test day for sirens. second wed of the month…

  49.  #49Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:25 am

    The problem is, I don’t WANT this guy!

  50.  #50dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 10:26 am

    practice feeling messages and tools on him ANYWAY

  51.  #51Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:26 am

    Unless he brings me a large sum of money.

  52.  #52Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Yeah, but if I practice, then pretty soon I’ll have to spend a few minutes with him, drinking coffee, while he goes gaga over me and asks me to marry him. NOT FUN!!!

  53.  #53Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:31 am

    Or maybe God will have mercy on me and I can use the tools and he will drift away anyway….

  54.  #54Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:33 am

    that seems to be what happened with Jack. I did everything “right.” I think he was testing me to see if I’d jump right into a sex convo cuz that’s what he was looking for and when I didn’t, he said “Next!”

    Thank you God. I didn’t want him anyway.

    And I used the tools to the max!

    A+ for Lucy

    F for Jack

    (and that stands for Fail, not something else, Jack!!!!)

  55.  #55Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 10:44 am

    Lucy, if I’m telling men the truth, it will never get to the point of a man asking me to marry him. If I’m saying “I feel yucky and uninterested” and the guy is still saying “yes but please marry me”, then he’s just not listening. I’d be questioning if I’m really telling him my feelings if I’m getting unwanted marriage proposals. And as for dates and such, I can always say no to that stuff. I don’t have to go for coffee if I don’t want to go.

    I feel weird. I don’t want to upset you but when I hear you say you’re doing the tools and still getting unwanted proposals, something about that feels off to me.

  56.  #56Tallgirl10 on June 9, 2010 at 10:44 am


    I really appreciate you in this from the other page. All of sudden because I did not hear from him last night, I started making the whole list in my head of all the insecure things I may or may not have said on Sat/Sunday. It is all I can think about.

    For instance:
    A. When he asked if I wanted to stay over, I said – what time is it and asked if he was sure.
    B. The next morning, as I was putting on my dress, I made jokes about it being my “slut dress” because it had snaps that made it an easy on/off.
    C. Maybe he thought I came off as too familiar with the friend, as in refering to things he had told me as if I was part of his life. Nothing major, just knowing some of the friends etc.
    D. When were walking out, I caught a look of myself in a relective surface. I said “I look terrible” because my hair was everywhere. Then he said “No you don’t” and I smiled and said “Well, I look like I took a tumble” and he said – yep.
    E. After he had pleasured me, I was so appreciative. Like I had never been touched before.

    I am totally upset.

  57.  #57Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 10:57 am

    Shannon, ‘and the guy is still saying “yes but please marry me”, then he’s just not listening’

    EXACTLY. They are just not listening! It boggles my mind. It’s almost as if they think I’m kidding when I say things like, “I feel uninterested, bored, icky,” whatever. They’re like, “Oh, okay, I’ll make it right, then you’ll marry me, right?”

    The last guy this happened with, I ended up having to get kinda mean — and then he was like, “You’re making me cry; I feel so horrible right now….”

    Yeah, he ended up outgirling me.

  58.  #58Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:00 am

    Shannon, “And as for dates and such, I can always say no to that stuff. I don’t have to go for coffee if I don’t want to go.”

    That’s what I was saying/doing before, but Daria said that’s not doing the tools.

  59.  #59Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:08 am

    I feel bad for not liking bald men. I went on a date with one a few weeks ago just to date outside my “type.”

  60.  #60Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:13 am

    Haha! Dorothea, I emailed that aquarium guy, “I feel much better when men come to me. :)”

    He wrote back, “Looks like I’m going to PA. 🙂 What’s your name?”


    I feel so bad!!!! Shannon says I don’t have to meet him! But now what!!! I LED HIM ON.

    I feel like a jerk. Ha, I led him on like TN man led ME on. Mirror.

    I feel weird.

    What am I doing?

    Aren’t I supposed to go out with men, even the ones who aren’t the One?

    Daria said yes; Shannon says I don’t have to. But if I don’t, then I’m not “doing the program”!!! Huh?

    I feel so freakin confused!!!!!!!!

  61.  #61Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 11:17 am

    Hmmm. I don’t know. Something feels weird to me but I can’t see it clearly. It’s a vibe thing that’s coming off.

    What would it feel like to go out with a man just as a person to have fun with and completely forget/ignore that I want a relationship? To just say to myself that this person is “no one” to me right now. I’m just having fun and the person in front of me just happens to be a boy. At that moment, I don’t have to feel any attraction. I’m with a “friend” or a “partner in crime”, someone who feels fun to hang out with only.

    I’m sensing this is not what’s happening with you Lucy. That every man gets a pass/fail. And trust me, I do this too, which is probably why reading your posts is bugging me so much. I don’t feel full on triggered but I’m feeling something here.

  62.  #62Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 11:18 am

    And what does “kind of mean” sound like? What were the words you used? I feel curious.

  63.  #63Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 11:19 am

    The words you used to tell the guy no you wouldn’t marry him…

  64.  #64Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 11:22 am

    Lucy – just a thought…. My impression is that the tools are mainly to learn our boundaries and to state them using feeling messages. We’re only supposed to use them on guys we feel safe with. If you don’t want to go out with him, maybe you should ask yourself if you feel unsafe with him? Rori responded to me on the previous thread and it really meant a lot to me.

    Sometimes I feel like this place is a double-edged sword – like I get so much conflicting advice that I end up feeling more confused. She cleared that up for me and I’m feeling much better now. She answered today, so it’s not too far back. I could go find the # for you if you want to read it. Maybe it will help?

  65.  #65Simply Shannon on June 9, 2010 at 11:26 am

    Lucy. Deep breath girl.

    “I feel bad. I don’t feel interested/attracted/whatever. I don’t want to lead you on.”

    Tell the guy the truth. That’s all this is. You don’t know this guy. You aren’t leading him on by answering his question. You responded. No big deal.

    Pre-Man-Fast, I responded to almost every guy who ever messaged me. And 50% of the time it was to say “I don’t feel attracted or interested”. I can count on one hand how many times the guys took offense.

    Breath in. Breath out. (((HUGS))) I bet you aren’t confused. You just want to run. Remember you are the strong tree rooted into the ground. This is not life or death.

    What are Lucy’s rules? Don’t pay attention to me or Daria. What does Lucy say?

  66.  #66Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:28 am

    Shannon, I do feel interested in your perceptions of this and I feel glad to explore possibilities with you.

    The thing is, I do exactly what you wrote in your second paragraph:

    “… go out with a man just as a person to have fun with and completely forget/ignore that I want a relationship? To just say to myself that this person is “no one” to me right now. I’m just having fun and the person in front of me just happens to be a boy. At that moment, I don’t have to feel any attraction. I’m with a “friend” or a “partner in crime”, someone who feels fun to hang out with only.”

    I go and be “in the moment” — and they eat it up! I just let myself have fun in the moment, and it’s like they think the fact that I’m happy and free-spirited means that THEY are making me feel that way and that I am therefore into them. Or at least they get into ME because of it. They act like giddy happy boys cuz they’re with this free, happy woman who loves herself.

    TN man and I talked about this happening with me back in the fall — he said “you are free, loving yourself, and not ashamed of your sexuality — and that is incredibly attractive to a man.”

    (He said he has the same “problem.” Hahaha.)

    But it stops being fun for me when they start telling me they’re “addicted” to me and such nonsense. And now it’s at the point where I can’t even look forward to just going out and having fun, cuz it always turns out that way.

  67.  #67Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 11:31 am

    I have had a hard time with this feeling like I’m leading someone on; with feeling that there’s no attraction here, so I’m not going out with him. Rori says that is the ideal situation – a guy who we’re not all that attracted to – to practice the tools.So I’ve gone out with some guys who I’m not attracted to with the attitude that they are “practice men.” It’s hard for me because it feels foreign to me – something I’m not used to and not comfortable with – but it is definitely easier for me to establish boundaries with them – and that feels empowering.

    I still feel somewhat confused – like I’m doing something wrong – but it is for sure easier to tell them how I’m feeling and to be genuine and honest with them. There is no pressure to make a good impression, none of the questioning and anxiety of, “did I do something / say something wrong?” In that way it’s easier. So… I’m going to keep doing it for now and see how quickly I can move past all of my triggers and get to finding the right guy.

    We’ll see how that works. I’ve already experienced some uncomfortable feelings, but I’m being honest and in that manner, I don’t feel that I’m leading them on. The most recent guy was coming on way to strong. Normally, I would have run the other direction, but I shared with him how I was feeling instead. And now he’s backed off and I feel better.

    Which just made me think… I’m scared of dating this new CD guy because I’m attracted to him. I guess I should tell him that? Any suggestions?

  68.  #68Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:37 am

    Shannon, “What are Lucy’s rules? Don’t pay attention to me or Daria. What does Lucy say?”

    Lucy gets yelled at on here when she follows her interpretation of Rori’s tools. That’s why Lucy is trying to do the tools “right.” She wants to get an A+. And she doesn’t want to be blamed when she loses the guy she wants.

    I do tell some guys right off the bat that I’m not interested, before even meeting them. But I have to go out with SOME guys I’m not interested in, right? And I have to be open to BECOMING interested, right?

  69.  #69Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:39 am

    Shannon, so this is what I should say to the guy who just said he’s coming to PA? —> “I feel bad. I don’t feel interested/attracted/whatever. I don’t want to lead you on.”

    I’m not supposed to go out with him to PRACTICE on men I am not attracted to????

  70.  #70Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 11:44 am

    well, I went out with a guy who made me laugh so much that I thought well, what the H. just maybe it might work. So we met – he was supposed to be 5’9″, I am 5’7″. He was actually 5’5″. He was supposed to be 55; he is 65. He had a “homely” photo; he was without question the ugliest man I have ever met. I thougth, well, there must be some redeaming features. Yes, he is kind, yes he is very rich, but man alive, this was not a good thing. So I have read everywhere, you will be surprised, give it a chance… That is just such dumb advice. I have done this at least 10 times now and have discovered, that if there is not even a tickle of attraction, MOVE ON! Now I look at them and think to myself, could I concievably kiss this guy? yes – ok I will meet; no? then I tell them, thank you for your interest, I am not the one for you.

  71.  #71Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 11:45 am

    “The words you used to tell the guy no you wouldn’t marry him…”

    Something like this (remember, this was AFTER trying to say No nicely but he was just not getting it): I will NEVER marry you. EVER. No matter how much you change or how much work you do. I will not EVER marry you!

  72.  #72Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 11:46 am

    Lucy – I understand your frustration. COMPLETELY!

    It is easier to practice on men you are not attracted to. Whether or not you go out with him is your call – your “Lucy rule.” I think that is what Shannon is trying to tell you.

  73.  #73Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 11:51 am

    And the next time I post myself online, I am going to write the following;
    sweet, kind, wonderful men, I would so enjoy a delightful relationship with you. I have, over the years, maintained a firm fit body that I get to enjoy. And you just might enjoy as well, if you can do the following: stand-up straight, unbutton your shirt, (and if you like, you can be naked), now look straight down to the floor. Yes the floor, by your feet – the top of your feet. If you can not see your special bits, then your body needs work. Once you have worked on your body, and can with all honesty, look down, see the tops of your feet, and definately see your special bits, then by all means, send me a note.

    Do you think I might have responses????

  74.  #74Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 11:54 am

    My issue right now is trying to decide how long to hang in there before I cut bait and run. Usually, with someone I’m not attracted to, it is a one date deal. I’m starting to feel like a serial dater. But I guess I just need to get comfortable with that because I can see the logic in it and I know that the more I use the tools the more they will become second nature and the more they become second nature, the faster I will move past all my icky habits and be able to have a successful relationship with someone I am attracted to. So, I am dating a few toads right now. I am not going to kiss them to see if they will turn into a prince because I don’t believe in fairytales, but I will date them. And it’s getting easier for me to move past the feelings of guilt and feelings that I’m leading them on.

    Guys CD! If they are getting their feelings hurt because we are too, then that is their issue. Well, probably not all guys CD – but I believe Rori is correct when she says “they will learn something from us, too”. And I refuse to believe that what they will learn is to be bitter and women haters. Women who are deceptive and play games with a man’s heart are the ones who make it easy for a guy to be a woman hater. If I’m being up-front and honest, they will appreciate it and grow from it themselves. If I end up being wrong on that count, then I guess I will just have to learn from it once it’s proven to me. Until then…. circular dating, here I come!

  75.  #75Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 11:56 am

    Lizzie – lol!

    Sorry, but no. I think that will discourage even the guys who can see their “special bits”. But I like it! If you do post that, let me know what your results are, will you? I feel curious to know.

  76.  #76Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:06 pm

    Hmm… I found this article – seems like it ties in well here and is possible why Rori’s tools work so well… I’m going to try “Spotting Patterns”….
    Do You Attract the Wrong Type?
    Spotting patterns
    by Alina Mikos

    Most women, whether they want to admit it or not, are drawn to a certain type of man, an ideal guy. Unfortunately, all too often, this guy is the wrong type for us, so we fill our lives with one dead-end relationship after another.

    Do we really choose our ‘type’?
    It’s been debated that the mates we look for have much to do with early childhood imprinting (done before we are nine). According to this theory, we are imprinted early on with the traits and characteristics that we will find attractive in a mate, and have little or no choice in the matter. These characteristics can run the gamut from specific body scents, to hair styles and color, even to quirky behaviors like a goofy laugh or crooked smile. Whatever the trait, we need to be aware that while they may attract and comfort us, these traits by themselves are not a good foundation for choosing our lifelong partner.

    It’s OK to be attracted to certain mate characteristics, but if that person is really wrong for us, we need to end the relationship. Conversely, if we give ourselves the opportunity to date and get to know different men who don’t have all the qualities we currently deem imperative, we just may find ourselves opening up our minds on the subject.

    Lay out the facts
    If we take a look at ourselves, who we are and what we have to offer, we can pursue a mate with a much clearer perspective. If we have low self-esteem, then we will probably attract men who will treat us badly. By understanding our own strengths and weaknesses, we can meet each possible suitor with the empowering knowledge of what we have to offer and what we need in a mate to build a healthy relationship.

    It may help to make a list of the men you have dated. Be a pattern seeker. Look for common traits, such as infidelity, immaturity, or abusive or controlling behavior. If you know specifically which types of men you’re attracting, you may be able to recognize what you’re doing to end up with these types of men.

    Knowledge is power
    One common reason women continue to attract the wrong men is that they do not know how to have a healthy relationship. If we have had only unhealthy relationships, we simply do not know how to spot a guy who will be good for us. If this is the case, then it’s up to us to learn what comprises a good relationship, to admit to ourselves that our past selection patterns have been unwholesome, and to open ourselves up to the other men in our lives that are good for us. Observing the successful relationships around us in our family and among friends, can be an effective way to deepen our understanding and shift our perspective on what makes a relationship the real ideal.

  77.  #77Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:09 pm

    And… in my humble opinion – that article explains why CDing is so effective. It opens my mind to an entirely different set of characteristics that I may be missing by going on attraction alone.

  78.  #78Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 12:09 pm

    Sweetpea you make me laugh!
    This is how it works with me. If there is absolutely nothing and is really in the category of truly pathetic (at 50 is living in a basement; doesn’t have a job; doesn’t see their kids; hates the ex-wife; no common ground, treats service people badly, bad-mouths anything, can’t string a sentence together…) it is one date only.
    If there is a glimmer of affection there, I will do 3 dates – but if chemistry isn’t happening, then it isn’t happening.
    If the kiss is revolting – it is over.
    I am always very kind.
    And I have had to do the very blunt “I will NEVER, EVER….” from time to time – just like Lucy. My goodness that is so funny isn’t it?
    I have made it to 4th date with new man Family Guy – it all feels good and I am quite comfortably leaned back. He has been away since our date last Friday and should be back in town tonight, has his kids from tomorrow until next Wednesday. I will confess if I have not heard from him by next Monday, I will change into a big hairy cyclops on a rampage (well I won’t really, but I am sure you will understand because I like this one).

  79.  #79Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 12:11 pm

    The guy I just wrote about — my most recent marriage proposal — his birthday is today, and get this — so is my ex-h’s.

  80.  #80Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:12 pm


    WTf….. On an online dating site, a guy had sent me request.. I requested him for his pics, and also wrote in my profile that people without pictures won’t be entertained…

    Now he sent me a message apologizing that he is extremely sorry for having sent me the message and he doesn’t has a pic of himself… So he can’t show me his pic…

    I wonder what’s up with that…!!???? Huh.. Confusing….!!

  81.  #81Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 12:17 pm

    Ankita – say “I am so mysteriously intrigued….no more goodies until a photo because you are either seriously ugly or seriously gorgeous and in the absence of the right kind of information, the brain will only do one thing….you get to figure that one out. So here is the challenge for you, are you brave enough to show yourself????”

  82.  #82Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:18 pm

    “I will change into a big hairy cyclops on a rampage..” That is hilarious! What a perfect visual of how I feel when someone I’m interested in isn’t responding the way I want.

    These tools are about giving up control, aren’t they? Geez. What a tough job in my world. And the funny thing is, I have never felt like I’m controlling. My attitude has always been “I won’t try to change a guy. If there is something about him I can’t live with, I will just move on.” And I did. But still, now I realize how controlling I actually have been.

    On that note, I need a little help coming to terms with something and maybe you can help me with this. I went out (first date) with a guy I’m actually attracted to last night (you probably got all the details already if you read my recent posts). My question is: He changed plans around a little bit yesterday due to some physical constraints with his original plan, but rather than postpone (for the second time – the first time I postponed), he just changed the venue. When he told me he wanted to meet at 8 or 8:30, I just said, “ehhhh….” (unenthusiastically. That was how I felt. I really wanted to meet him, but 8, 8:30 is getting a little late for my comfort zone for a first date – I was trying to form words for that in my mind, but didn’t have to) He said, “Ok. How about 7:30?” I said, “Yes that would feel better if you can swing it.” But then I felt like I manipulated – like I forced him – but then another part of me feels like I was just sticking to my boundaries. What do you think?

  83.  #83Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    Hello Sirens,

    A guy on dating site approached me with a coffee date and is married, 27 years old.. i saw his profile showed that he wants friendship…

    He emailed me, that he wants a close and great friend…

    What’s up with that? Is he truly looking for friendship or something more…!! I feel so confused…!!1

  84.  #84Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:20 pm

    Ankita – my thought is that he is looking for a “f buddy” kind of friend. I think Rori addresses the “married man” dating on this post, does she not?

  85.  #85Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:21 pm


    I didn’t reply to him, and came straight to this site.. And did post the question, asking what you people feel…!! I feel something is definitely fishy, with him…!!

  86.  #86Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Ankita – This is Rori’s take on it – and I have to agree… “One rule – NO MARRIED MEN for “real” dates. They’re fine to flirt with and practice on anywhere out in life (the market, the drug store, your karate class…) but FORBIDDEN on the phone, email, or in-person one-on one – anything that looks like, smells like, feels like a “date” of ANY kind. Stay AWAY!!”

  87.  #87Daria on June 9, 2010 at 12:23 pm

    Sweetpea – Sticking to Boundaries!

    Notice you did not SAY NO IT HAS TO BE 7 30

    I would have said… I don’t feel comfortable meeting a man at 8

    I feel FLATTERED and EMPOWERED when they have to do stuff to please me… hehe.. and they feel more attracted by a woman with boundaries

    (otherwise a huge percentage of my dates would have me driving to them, etc etc)

  88.  #88Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:23 pm


    Can you please recall the name of the post, I have read almost all her posts, but at the moment I can’t recall…

    This guy is so hot, and I feel so confused.. He is married so young, asking me for coffee…, telling me that he has really a nice job with McDonald’s and earns high… asking me what I do…!!??


  89.  #89Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    Daria – That’s what I was thinking. Thanks for the confirmation!

    I really like that this guy keeps steppin’ up. Except it’s scaring the crap out of me. I’m attracted to him and he keeps hitting the ball out of the park.

    Do I need to tell him it scares me that I’m attracted to?

  90.  #90Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:26 pm

    Ankita – it is on this post – in Rori’s response to the letter.

  91.  #91Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:26 pm

    …. I mean, do I need to tell him that “it scares me that I’m attracted” too?

  92.  #92Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:28 pm

    Ankita – he may be hot and he may have a very high salary, but he is BAD NEWS if he is married. I, personally, would not even take a risk of getting emotionally involved with a man who will only end up breaking my heart!

  93.  #93Rori Raye on June 9, 2010 at 12:31 pm

    dorothea – because it’s my job, and why I’m here – I’m going to coach you a bit – is that okay? I hear so much anger towards men (particular men, also) in your comments – and although I believe it is totally righteous and that you’ve been done dirty in the past – I can also say with absolute certainty that it is doing you no good – in fact – totally blocking the possibility of love in your life. I’m not asking you to stuff your anger – I’m asking you to let it out and embrace it – “I feel so mad I feel like plucking out his eye…I feel so TRIGGERED…” A man is there to trigger you. You can either use the wonderful coming up of old crap inside you and heal it…or you can use it as a weapon as if you are at war to punish him – and therefore punish YOURSELF. Which road do you want to travel down? Love, Rori

  94.  #94Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    Ankita, 27 and Married – put on your PF fliers and run madly in the other direction. He is looking to have an affair. Very clear to me.

    Sweetpea – I feel good with how you have handled new man. He responded right away to your feeling message – it doesn’t always need to be words. Good! If it comes up again, you might try something like this: I feel more comfortable when meeting a little earlier, especially during the week since we both work, I don’t want to feel rushed in getting to know you, what do you think?

    And he adjusted accordingly, so a good thank you message might go like this: I really appreciate that you were able to adjust the time because I feel more relaxed and comfortable taking the time to get to know you.

    Sorry, I have been off-line so I don’t now all the background on your new man. Am I feeling that you are liking this one?

  95.  #95Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    Rori – I feel envious of your diplomacy. I am so happy to have found you! Thank you for dedicating your life to helping all of us!

  96.  #96Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:34 pm


    I get it… I feel like I need to run from him as fast my legs could carry… Ugghh.. feel yucky….

    It’s my personal boundaries that NO MARRIED MEN… how this guy got it, damn, no idea…!!?? Huh…!!

  97.  #97Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    Lizzie – Yes! I am liking him enough that it is scaring me. I’m scared that I’m not ready to CD someone I’m so attracted to.

    I did thank him for agreeing to meet me earlier – but told him I felt like I had been pushy. I did, feel that way – but it felt masculine to me to say it to him. Funny thing though, is that he THANKED ME – repeatedly for being flexible with the change of plans.

  98.  #98Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:37 pm

    Ankita – So you can either practice feeling messages on him and tell him you are uncomfortable communicating with a married man and it feels icky, or you can just ignore him and hope he goes away.

  99.  #99Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 12:39 pm

    Sweetpea – OK! you LIKE this one…sadly, I feel helpless. It is not in my nature to attempt to say, I am feeling that I like you. What I did say to my new man “I feel wonderful when I am with you” That just knocked his socks off. And when he asked for the next date and asked “how does that sound to you?” I responded “that feels like going to heaven”. The guy is panting…. I just love this, and remarkably, I am feeling incredibly more relaxed.

  100.  #100Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:44 pm


    I hope the second option will do best…

    Damn, i did a silly mistake, and am beating myself up for that….

    Without reading his full profile, when he emailed me, and gave me his number, i emailed him, I don’t feel comfortable calling men. i am at XXXXXXXXXX..”

    After that i went through his profile, and got to know he has written married…

    What a stupid me…. I should have not replied him this sooner….!!!

  101.  #101Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:44 pm

    Lizzie –
    Using feeling statements like you did feels better to me. Thanks!

    I’m new to all these feeling statements. I’ve stayed in good touch with my feelings – I’ve just been scared to vocalize them. So this is really exciting for me but scary, scary at the same time!

    At some point in the future I might feel it’s necessary to tell him I’m feeling scared, but I think I’ll wait to see if it feels necessary. Maybe I’ll work through it and never have to tell him! That would be great!

  102.  #102Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 12:44 pm

    Do Feeling Messages scare a guy away if he is scared of intimacy?

  103.  #103Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:46 pm


    I did a damn damn damn mistake…!!! Yuckkk….!!!!

    I feel i will have to ignore him…!!!

  104.  #104Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:46 pm

    Ankita – He might call you then. It might feel better to send him an email telling him that you just realized he is married and that you’re not interested in dating married men, so please don’t call. Whatever you feel comfortable with.

    Just a note: I don’t give out my phone number to anyone until I’ve emailed them a few times and feel safe talking to them.

  105.  #105Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    I have made up my mind, if he ever calls, am just gonna say, “I don’t feel comfortable talking to a married guy, it feels yucky… I don’t want to date someone who has anyone else in his life…!”

  106.  #106Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:49 pm

    Lucy – If they do, wouldn’t you rather know they are scared of intimacy before you get involved?

    Or is there another reason you are asking?

    To answer your question, I think it is possible that men who are afraid of intimacy get scared off by feeling messages. After all, you’re sharing part of yourself with them when you share feelings which equals intimacy of a sort in my mind.

    Are you asking to gauge whether TN man is afraid of intimacy?

  107.  #107Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    Ankita – Good for you! I think that is a good idea – that way you’re not stressing yourself out about something that might not ever happen. But, you have a plan in case he does call.

  108.  #108Ankita on June 9, 2010 at 12:53 pm


    Yes… in case he calls, I will say it… Coz right after i saw that he is married, I sent him an email asking Is he really married??? I meant is he serious about it???

    So, i guess, he may not even call, if he wishes….

  109.  #109Lizzie on June 9, 2010 at 1:00 pm

    Sweetpea – I feel that we are in the same place! it is so ackward to identify feelings as a start, then to turn them into messages. I seem to be confident with these ones –
    “it feels great to see you”
    “it feels wonderful to be here tonight”
    “you look great and so relaxed after your trip”
    “this is really nice”
    “I am feeling safe with you”
    “I am feeling really comfortable with you here”

    I am off now to an event. I hope these help. And post a few you try – I need some new ones.

  110.  #110Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    Aw, Sweetpea, you saw right through me!
    —-> “Are you asking to gauge whether TN man is afraid of intimacy?”

    Yeah, I will be seeing my therapist tonight for the first time since interloper girl flew in to the scene, and I was wondering what my therapist will say about it, and then I remembered she had previously seen some subtle signs that he may be afraid of intimacy . . . she said it was almost like we were doing a dance, that *I* have some fears of intimacy too but have been pushing through them and growing and healing so much, and she was saying last time that she thinks he and I started out in a similar place (similar vibe/energy pattern that attracted us to each other), but that she thinks I have been doing more work than he has (even facilitated in part by him and all he taught me!) and that I might be outgrowing him, and may now be more ready for intimacy than he is.

    And given the fact that in the last couple months of our interactions I have been using more and more feeling messages, unzipping more, etc. . . . that’s why I asked about whether feeling messages scare away guys who are scared of intimacy…..


  111.  #111Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 1:11 pm

    Lucy – From what I am reading here, I think your therapist may be on to something. So, if he is afraid of intimacy and you keep sending him feeling messages, I guess he will either grow personally and begin working on himself or he will stagnate where he’s at.

    The fact that he is dating a girl who is bi made me wonder if he doesn’t have intimacy issues. Just because the whole concept of bi-sexual, to me, signals that he will never be her “one and only.” And I know that guys are turned on by the thought of a threesome, but I feel guys who are serious about a woman really don’t want to share her with anyone – male or female. I could be way off on that one though. Just my opinion.

  112.  #112Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 1:16 pm

    Lizzie – I fear that I may not be of much help to you. The feeling messages I have been using of late are a lot about establishing boundaries – which means they might not be general or positive enough to be of any real help. That feels sad.

    I will think on it some more and see if I remember something though. I have to be saying something positive don’t I?! If not, I better start working on it!

    Lol! Oh – I have been – but I’ve been practicing the baby steps of saying something positive about little things. Like… I love the rain. It feels peaceful and cleansing. You know, stuff like that.

  113.  #113Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 1:17 pm

    So Lucy – I feel curious to know if you are finding that TN Man is getting more distant as you use more feeling messages.

  114.  #114Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    When I was with 1 1/2 yr. man I had this feeling, I couldnt identify, I just knew I had it. Truckman left just now and I felt angry that he left, I wanted him to leave, I felt ok about it, like eh whatever ok, I dont feel all out panicky about it, just oh so thats what Im feeling, I feel abandoned, I feel anger, I’m really ok though lol does that make sense? I really could have used his company maybe for a few more hours lol. I should have used a feeling message on hte spot but, I really wanted to check this feeling out. Needy and controlling yeah, I feel needy,insecure and controlling. My pms is kicking in too blah!.

  115.  #115Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    I feel used and abandoned 🙂

  116.  #116Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    I feel angry oooooooh yeah, just kinda like yeah not all in my head angry, just you know , used and abandoned 🙂 my anger,used and abandoned feelings feel calm? like oh yeah thats used and abandoned feelings there yes I see, I feel it yeah cool. This is so cool 🙂 its def a trigger for me of old feelings, yes I know this. when my self esteem was down the toilet, swirling around the cold water into drain, I cant get my self esteem back oh were are you self esteem? come back. I’m on my side, I trust my feelings,

  117.  #117Siena on June 9, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    Hi Lucy, I’ve been following along but not responding. Here’s my $.02, said of course with love. And I’m donning my boy hat because reading your journey has helped me finally finalize my journey with 5 year man.

    I would say that it’s not the feeling messages that are scaring him away. To be honest, he was never really close. He was always *away*.

    There’s no doubt in my mind that TN man is afraid of intimacy. Clues to this: 1) he was long distance and you two never met 2) he got very “intimate” with you without having to be really intimate 3) when he had the chance to come get you, he got distracted by another unavailable person. 4) He’s trolling while in a ‘relationship’.

    It’s been my experience that a relationship that includes fear of intimacy requires two people who are afraid of intimacy – the one who is actively afraid of intimacy and the one who is passively afraid of intimacy.

    In my case, 5 year man was actively afraid of intimacy and I was passively afraid. I kept him in my life because he was safe. He never got close enough to me to require me to be truly intimate, but he always dangled a carrot so that I didn’t leave. Because I stayed in that situation, I also exhibited my own fears of intimacy.

    At one point, he stepped up to the plate, and I got bored with him and wrangled the relationship back into that “unavailable” fear place.

    My experience is that a person who is afraid of intimacy requires the other person in the relationship to be afraid of intimacy also.

    Nowadays, there’s no draw at all of a man like him to me. They hardly even make a blip on my radar. I feel good about this because (I hope) it means that I am healing.

    It’s not your feeling messages that are keeping him away, it’s your healing. Unless he also heals, he will most likely stay away.

    Hugs, Siena

  118.  #118Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Using me for you sick perverted pleasure, tell me im no good, thats all im worth. I wear it, tell me to my face, im no good, I’m worthless. I’ve heard it before, you tell me all the time.

  119.  #119Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    I dont want to feel icky oh no not icky, icky is ok for a feeling, I dont want to feel disrespected. I dont like feeling that way. Oh dont fight with me, you cant talk right now I wont let you. You want me to react dont you? thats the game huh? now thats just pissing me off. I feel ashamed that I cant stay “in my place” that I want to rise above this level of no you cant pass Tina, your not worth it, you dont qualify, you never did, we used you up REMEMBER!

  120.  #120Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    Love, is something an intangible for you Tina, your to busy trying to fight your way out, but you cant. We give you rope see how far you will go, but ya know, its not doable for you. *sigh, break time hehe

  121.  #121Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:55 pm

    The little indian girl danced in the mud, she said look Im dancing in the mud, she held on to her towel, like it was the prized shawl all the women envied. Look im dancing she said to queen mother warrior goddess woman. queen mohter warrior goddess woman sat in the shelter where the men instructed her to sit, out of the rain, they went in to do their ceremonial prayers.

  122.  #122Tina on June 9, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    Ack, I feel dizzy lol

  123.  #123cindy on June 9, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    I have learned so much from you Rori. I’m in a dilemnia. I had read how you said it’s okay to flirt with married men. Isn’t that not a good idea? I’m feeling like the man’s wife would be sad to have to deal with that if she found out. I have a boyfriend that is good to me, however I’m thinking I have to end it with him. He talks to everyone and honestly at times it really seems like flirting to me. I don’t enjoy it and I’m feeling like it’s a deal breaker. I had told him how I feel. I can’t imagine feeling it’s okay to flirt with someone who is married. Could you give me some insight on this subject? Isn’t that possibly leading him/her to the next step in some says?

  124.  #124Tina on June 9, 2010 at 2:08 pm

    The men sang in the language, from a long time ago , barely recongizable , she sat under the shelter, uncomfortable feeling in the damp cold rain pentrating drops of rain through her sleeves and into her skin, as she wathced little indian girl dance look at me, lookatmeeeee. They prayed in the direction of hte bear.

  125.  #125Tina on June 9, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    Cindy, it’s supposed to be good to do that lol.

  126.  #126Tina on June 9, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Cindy, doing rori tools is supposed to reel that naughty man back in lol.

  127.  #127Tina on June 9, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    audible haha yeah ok oh i cant do this now ok then dont do it then.

  128.  #128Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    Here’s another article – I like this one because it’s funny and helps me realize that women really do have all the power (and guys go through very similar experiences to what we’ve been talking about here).

    8 Signs You’ve Hit Dating Rock Bottom

    by Rich Santos

    Aside from shedding light on the horror that is the male mind, this blog includes sad personal anecdotes, to help you feel better about yourself. My method of exposing my pathetic dating life allows you to say: “At least I’m not that bad.”

    With most of my friends out of town this past weekend, I pledged to get work done and put finishing touches on my new apartment. Usually, these quiet weekends are amazing, but this time around I had time to consider the following signs that I’ve hit rock bottom in my dating life (can you relate?):

    My Voice Mail Inventory

    Most guys have many girls calling so they choose which girl to take out on a given night. Because I so rarely check my voice mail, the messages pile up. In bulk, they remind me of my lack of prospects:

    Message 1: “Hi Rich, it’s Mom.”

    Message 2: “Rich? It’s your mother.”

    Message 3: “Hey, Rich, it’s Mom trying to catch up with you.”

    Message 4: “Rich, it’s Jack. Did you see that play in the O’s game? Awesome.”

    Message 5: Incomprehensible drunk karaoke message from sister

    Message 6: “Hey it’s me [my sister]. Sorry about the drunk singing last night, but you should have come, it was fun.”

    Message 7: “This is an automated call from MasterCard. Your payment is overdue.”

    END of new messages.

    One of the Girls

    I recently met up with a friend from out of town, Jenn, at a karaoke bar. It ended up being me, Jenn, her three sisters, and their mom. My favorite karaoke song, unfortunately, is Dolly Parton’s “9 to 5,” which was a campy hit with the girls when I sang it. When I told Jenn I can’t attend her upcoming wedding, she said it we’d call it even as long as I “attended the bachelorette party.” Becoming one of the girls is not in my best interest if I ever want a date.

    Paling in Comparison

    Comparing myself to others isn’t healthy, but it’s the most unhealthy when I suck in comparison to bad people. While reading about Charles Manson, I was struck by the amount of women he slept with. It seems that every evil person I read about pretty much gets laid more than I do. So, if psycho killers, and maladjusted freaks are getting laid regularly, where does that leave me?

    The Last Living Thing in My Bed Was My Cat

    …and he’s getting more and more aggressive, lying flat on his back, stretching out to the point where I’m nearly off the edge of the bed when I wake up in the morning.


    The other day I attempted to e-mail a girl to tell her to meet up with some friends and me. I just couldn’t get the wording right. Frankly, it’s been a long time since I’ve suggested to a girl: “Hey, let’s meet up for a drink.” I had to have a friend edit the e-mail.

    Sad Stats

    When I admit how long it’s been since I’ve had a girlfriend, people gasp. Their reaction has nothing to do with me being “boyfriend material. People just didn’t know it was possible for anyone to go that long without a girlfriend. I’ve also become a born-again virgin because it’s been a while since I’ve done that too. I might do better if I was Charles Manson.

    Stress Over Required Date Events

    I have until October to figure out my “plus one” for my sister’s wedding. I need a date, considering my entire family will be there. I probably shouldn’t bring a friend because we’ll have to deal with questions from my family. I wish I knew women I “dated casually” for these types of events.

    Mind Games

    My mind plays tricks on you when I’m slumping. Lately, I’ve thought: “Wow, I haven’t dated for a while. I used to be good at this.” When the slump continues: “Wow, maybe I never was good at this.” It kills confidence, a cycle that makes it tough to beat the slump.

    I’m too picky, jaded, lazy, and “over” the scene. It’s just tough to spend time with girls I’m not that into. But, perhaps I should go on some meaningless dates to get back in the swing of things. I can do casual as long as I don’t worry what it means, or think about the next step before I even take the first step.

    Do you agree with my signs of rock bottom? What parts of your dating life signify you’re in a slump or hitting rock bottom? Do you agree that you have to go on meaningless dates to get out of rock bottom, or do you have a different way out?

  129.  #129dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 3:01 pm

    Rori, ack, I feel way misunderstood and pretty embarassed too. I don’t know when else I have been posting about past men with angry sentiments except for today. About a dude from 2 years ago. i guess my tendency to cuss makes it hard to see past anything but anger.

    but i still feel frustrated about this! and i’m not sure what you mean by you’re absolutely certain there is no love in my life. Maybe you can help me understand what you mean please?

  130.  #130dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    rori you said ““I feel so mad I feel like plucking out his eye…I feel so TRIGGERED…”

    I said

    “i feel angry and judgmental and it feels like a lattice-work of spears has been suddenly installed to hold the upper half of my torso up and to keep it from totally caving in.


    so am i not doing this right? eek i feel pouty and i feel ashamed to be asking you.

  131.  #131Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    Karaoke ha, Im going to practice my song !

  132.  #132Jean on June 9, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    Lizzy & Sweetpea

    I too am starting a relationship and with Rori’s advice, trying my hardest to use the feeling comments. I’ve used the ones you mentioned, but I look for words to replace the “like” and “don’t like” or the “want” and “don’t want”, because I feel I’m being so repetitive. Anyway, I’ve used some of the following positive ones:

    “I feel very content here with you”
    “I really enjoy being with you”
    “Being with you is such fun”
    “When I’m with you, I’m so relaxed.”
    “I’m delighted to be here with you.
    “I enjoy going here, doing this, etc.”
    “I love going to this place”
    “One of my favorite things is going there, doing this”
    “I’m fond of going there”

    Try a negative/positive:

    “I don’t want to be anywhere else right now”

    For “don’t want” try:
    I can’t stand
    I hate
    I refuse to

    Anyway, some ideas to think about. I’m still learning too.

  133.  #133Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:37 pm This list of feelings words was posted way back somewhere by Doc.

  134.  #134Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:45 pm

    Rori is cool beans!

    If anyone knows abandonment its me, my mom dropped me off at a foster home , she didnt return for five years or so ha. Oops wrong path, I keep wanting to subconsciously go down that path or bridge or whatever. Sometimes I have to look up to see where Im heading heheeeeeeeeee

  135.  #135Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:47 pm

    I waited a long time for her return. She did come back eventually, I feel disappointed lol but anyway im here NOW.

  136.  #136Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    I feel mixed really, disappointment, freedom, home? the cruel world? is it? Love? is it required? more than bjs? lol heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

  137.  #137Tina on June 9, 2010 at 3:52 pm

    Mom is that you? why am I not happy to see you, why do I feel sad leaving, sad choking tears that wont come, to leave this aweful place…

  138.  #138Tina on June 9, 2010 at 4:08 pm

    I dont want to leave this place, I created, my safety, smell of cranberry bog, fennel, comic books my brother reads to me because I dont know how to I learned words like BAM! haha. my wooden stick dolls, my birds,

  139.  #139Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    Ouch. This post was painful, but finally answered some things that were running through my mind. Interestingly, my business partner gave me the same speech today about being interested in the wrong men and this post confirms it. I know exactly what I need to do now, which is tell the man that I’m moving on with my life because he’s unavailable. And I already know what will happen after that…he will become available. *Sigh* Getting ready for a relationship seems so hard.

  140.  #140Tina on June 9, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    how come i feel sad to leave this horrible place, the old lady hugged me as i was leaving, I feel bad yuck! i feel sad to leave her? nawwwwww, she was evil,mean rotten to me. I want revenge on the old lady dead in the ground, shes gone now, shes dead, she took her cross with her i bet heheeeeee

  141.  #141Tina on June 9, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    okaaaaaay. anyway learn new song, plant the other rose bush and and do some more stuff. stingy burning feeling like giving birth ha, I love you! 🙂

  142.  #142Tina on June 9, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    what does this have to do with truckman?

  143.  #143Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Jean – Thank you for the suggestions. Feeling statements feel repetitive to me as well, so I sometimes use other things – like I am. Sometimes “I feel” just feels right though. I’m working at knowing the difference. I feel that, especially if I am setting a boundary for myself or sharing a not so positive feeling – like “I feel angry… ” that “I feel” helps in my delivery. It not only helps give me the courage to say it, but it just feels less accusatory.

    Thank you so much for sharing! I am writing your suggestions down.

  144.  #144Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    Tina – that was a great list! Thank you for sharing.

    I feel bad for your struggling tonight. Do you think that the opening up during sex triggered all this stuff. Are you acting out of fear?

    I only ask because I am curious. I opened up with the last guy I dated during sex and it scared the living hell out of me. I couldn’t handle it and ultimately broke it off. I won’t go there again until I have a little better handle on using the rest of the tools. Spooky, spooky stuff.

    I have some abandonment issues as well. I lost my mom to cancer – but I sure do react to it the same as if she had made a decision to leave me. Sorry you had to go through that.

  145.  #145Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    Here’s another article I found today that is really resonating with me…
    7 Ways to Develop Detachment – Hold on loosely
    by Alina Mikos

    In a world focused of ‘keeping up with the Jones’ and romantic idealism such as ‘you complete me’, it’s no wonder we find ourselves attaching our emotions and happiness to outside sources rather than going with the flow that life has to offer. With some helpful everyday guidelines, though, we can keep ourselves on the proverbial healthy spiritual track.

    1. Make peace with your past
    When we hold on to negative feelings and resentments towards others, we are attaching ourselves to past situations and their painful emotions. If we allow ourselves some emotional detachment, we will realize that these events have already transpired, so what is the point in continually reliving them? By forgiving others, we not only refuse to surrender our power over the past but also allow ourselves to move forward with a feeling of lightness and freedom.

    2. Hold on loosely
    In personal relationships we can easily become attached to another, and while committing our love to someone is a beautiful life experience, all of us must retain our own identity and spiritual inner strength. We need to appreciate and respect our loved ones without leeching on to their lives and trying to control them.

    3. Do not let outside influences define you
    We live in a material world without a doubt, but recognizing that these physical objects do not define us is the key to releasing attachment. If we are constantly defining ourselves and our self-worth by the latest in fashion, cars, luxury trips, and so forth, we will forever be controlled by these things, and by the people who also bind themselves to these outside, insubstantial influences.

    4. Be open minded
    We all have our comfort zones concerning the people in our lives and the environments we feel safe and familiar with. These patterns of living persuade us to attach ourselves to what we are accustomed to, cheating us out of new experiences and relationships. Without change, there will be no spiritual growth and our life experiences will shrink down to only what we currently know and feel safe and comfortable with.

    5. Live in the now
    Past memories and future possibilities can distract us from living in the moment, thus missing out on whatever life experiences we could be learning from. If we are attached and focused on past events or future hopes, we cannot move freely in the moment, because each experience is tainted by either regret or expectation.

    6. Be aware of your own thought processes
    Regrettably, it can be all too easy to attach ourselves to people, objects or our environments because we all crave security, acceptance and love. The key is to realize we need to have these connections but not to rely on them to complete us. When we become overly attached to these outside sources, we all too often want to control and manipulate them, hindering us from fully living in the moment. This can place us in a state of panic, with our attempts to posses or control something outside of us ultimately resulting in the loss of that control we erroneously thought we had.

    7. Release the need to know or control
    If we place future expectations on every moment, we sacrifice our ability to appreciate that moment, whether it is harmful or helpful to our future. It is important to allow ourselves to go with the ‘flow’ of what life brings us, while keeping our eyes on our fundamental goals. If we are emotionally invested in each moment for some opportunity it may bring us in the future, we risk a lifetime of missed real and present experiences and the feeling of never quite reaching our desired destination.

  146.  #146Tina on June 9, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    Sweatpea, I feel pretty good considering 🙂 I feel flowy, yeah flowy pain, is not so bad. I wanted to “go there” I feel bad, ? why? cause I want you to stay forever 🙂 ? hehe, dunno

    ps, baby steps Sweatpea!

  147.  #147Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    “I would say that it’s not the feeling messages that are scaring him away”

    Siena, not the feeling messages per se, but the feeling messages as indicators of genuine intimacy — as my ability to embrace intimacy increased and became more evident to him via feeling messages — he, as you said, redirected his attention elsewhere to avoid the intimacy that was growing between us.

    I feel curious about this: “he got distracted by another unavailable person” — why do you see her as unavailable?

    Btw, my therapist saw her pics tonight and said, “She looks like she’s 12.”

  148.  #148Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    Sweetpea, are you familiar with Byron Katie’s “The Work”? It relates to #6 in your post.

  149.  #149Tina on June 9, 2010 at 5:03 pm

    Sweatpea, I guess this was coming sooner or later, dunno if it had anything to do with sex though, maybe? yeah …

  150.  #150Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:05 pm

    Tina – Yeah. I got the baby steps message loud and clear on that one! It was right after I purchased Rori’s book and being the adventurous soul that I am, I decided if the sensual meditation was good by myself, it would be great with someone else. And it was….

  151.  #151Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    Elayne – no I’m not familiar with it, I will check it out. Thanks!

  152.  #152Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    Tina – There has sure been a lot of action in your neck of the woods lately – and I’m not just talking sexual… lol.

    You’ve got huge changes going on right now with the proposal and all. I suspect the opening up probably set the rest of this in motion. Which is a good thing. I know I would be freaking out if I was in your place right now, though. Heck, I had a date with a guy I’m attracted to and I’m having a hard time keeping it together. Lol!

    I actually feel pretty good about it. It’s just a lot more difficult than practicing this stuff with guys I’m not particularly attracted to. Like you say…. Baby steps. Baby steps. Might become my new mantra.

  153.  #153Tina on June 9, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    Sweatpea, true about the action, no lack of thats for sure. he wants to marry me, and live happily ever after.

  154.  #154Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:32 pm

    Do I sense a lack of enthusiasm on your part? Or is it just that you’re struggling with some other emotions?

  155.  #155Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    Elayne – checked it out. It looks awesome! I printed out the pamphlet and will begin working on it immediately!

  156.  #156Lucy on June 9, 2010 at 5:39 pm

    Just got an email from a THIRD guy who is 25 years old!!! It’s weird that they are all EXACTLY 25!?

  157.  #157Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 5:40 pm

    Yay, Sweetpea! I’m so glad you found it useful. One of the things I’ve struggled with in all of Rori’s teachings is whether it’s ME or is it HIM who’s causing the problem. It seems really easy to blame someone else but I seem to be the common denominator in all of these relationship issues, so it would seem that I am the problem. Not that I’m beating myself up, but from a spiritual standpoint, it’s much easier to accept responsibility so that I have the power to change things.

    I have been taking a course through DailyOm called 27 Days to Finding True Love, and it’s full of Feng Shui stuff. I’ve bought the pink sheets, rearranged my bedroom, put the mirror under my bed with the compatible animal symbols, chinese characters on my love and relationship wall…and jeez, did I stir up some funky stuff relating to intimacy. Which is synchronistic with this post and why I’m so uncomfortable. It seems I hit the fast forward button on changing myself and wasn’t expecting things to move so quickly.

    Anyway, those four questions are really helpful, as are the “judging your neighbor worksheets.”

  158.  #158Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    Hmm… Interesting – I just bought pink sheets. What is the significance of that?

  159.  #159Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    Apparently, pink sheets have something to do with sweet dreams of your future lover 🙂

  160.  #160Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    “Eastern philosophy says that if you put pink sheets on your bed you will meet the partner of your (sweet) dreams”

  161.  #161Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    Elayne – I feel like I’ve hit the fast forward button on change as well. It’s exhilarating, but not for the faint of heart.

    Still nervous about dating a guy I’m attracted to. He’s the first one in awhile. But, I figure he’s here for a reason – so here I go. I have to say I’m not impressed with the anxiety it’s brought out in me though. I didn’t miss that anxiety – at all. Anxiety is not my friend… Well, I guess I will embrace it anyway. I love my anxiety. I will hug it and embrace it for awhile – then it can move on…. lol

    I’ve not really been one to blame others for my relationship failings. I mean, granted, guys have done me wrong, but I’ve known I have issues for awhile. Sometimes I think dating was easier before I started trying to deal with them – but when I think about it, it really wasn’t – it was just over more quickly…


  162.  #162Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    Pink sheets it is then! I feel tickled pink. lol

  163.  #163Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    Are you ready? LOL…let me know how it goes!

  164.  #164Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:58 pm

    I think I’m ready. I’m going to stay as close to the edge of fear as I can as I work through this stuff. I want it to happen FAST!

    Do you think staying on the edge of fear is the way to do that? I guess that would be one way to work through it anyway, huh?

  165.  #165Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 5:58 pm

    One way to work through the fear I mean…

  166.  #166Elayne on June 9, 2010 at 6:02 pm

    Good question…it’s been my experience that every time I set an intention and then act in accordance, that it’s like the rug gets yanked out from underneath me. I don’t know why I don’t realize what’s going on anymore, but I find myself surprised when I do this stuff (like feng shui) and wind up feeling scared or hurt when my issues are laid out on the table for me to see.

    So, yes, I think being on the edge of fear is a good thing. In my experience, eventually the fear evaporates as you get more comfortable doing something new. It’s like a whole new way of being.

    Who would you be without the fear?

  167.  #167Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:06 pm

    My lovely self…

  168.  #168Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:09 pm

    Elayne – I know that sounded trite – but I feel it’s true.
    When I lost my mom (I was 18) I promised myself that I would never love anyone enough to hurt like that again. It’s taken me many years to figure out that 1) She wouldn’t want that for me and… 2) Life is pretty empty when you pretend you don’t care for anyone. I say “pretend” because it was impossible for me to do. But I faked it pretty well for a long time.

    So fear has dominated all of my relationships and many of my friendships. Much as I’ve tried to be the “tough girl” I’m really not. I’m a big ol’ softie and I think it’s time I get over the fear and let myself be authentic.

  169.  #169tallgirl10 on June 9, 2010 at 6:23 pm

    I feel sad and helpless. I have spent hours today trying to think of a text to send him, and I realize it is all just so I can continue to lure him in.

    I think and think of how because I am not showing him I like him that he will walk away. That it is my fault because I did not do x y or z to keep him here.

    I guess you were all right, the smiley face told him I was not interested.

    I am so sad.

  170.  #170Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:28 pm

    Rori – I just watched a dating video where a bunch of guys and one dating coach say that a woman should at least make the offer to pay on a first date or a lot of guys will write you off.

    I feel sort of uncomfortable letting the man pay, but he invited me so….

    I would appreciate feedback on this. Are these guys losers, or should we really be at least offering to pay?

  171.  #171Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:33 pm

    Awww, Tallgirl – I’m going to throw on my masculine energy cape here. It’s for your own good!

    Stop with the over-analyzing for heaven’s sake! He reached out to you afterwards. You leaned back. If you must send him a text, then send him one that states something honest – like you feel he’s an asshole for becoming intimate with you and then dropping you on your head again! Ok – well maybe not that.

    Has it even been over 48 hours? ‘Cuz ya know, guys have this whole – “I can’t appear ‘whipped’, so if I’m really into this girl, I better wait to contact her or my friends will think I’m a pussy.” Sorry – I don’t particularly like the phrase – but that’s my masculine energy at its best.

    If he walks away again – which I seriously doubt – it’s because he’s a dumbass who’s not worthy of the time or energy you’re putting into him anyway. STOP overanalyzing it. He can sense that vibe and you probably won’t hear from him – no matter what he’s feeling for you – until you let it go!

  172.  #172tallgirl10 on June 9, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    There are just so many philosophies. This one is about leaning back.

    Others are about contacting the man every now and then.

    I feel very torn.

  173.  #173dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    I’ve never offered to pay on a first date. yuck. in the past when i did, those were the ones not really calling me again…funny how that works

  174.  #174Daria on June 9, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    Sweetpea rori says to always let the man pay. Very triggering practice for some. Especially to be honest and share feeling messages and don’t wamts.

    Speaking using I feel… Feeling is very important practice and roti has said not to go around to replace I feel. Make sure the sharing after I feel is a true feeling and not a thought.

  175.  #175Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    Tallgirl – let me just remind you – it’s not about what anyone else on here tells you is right or wrong. They are offering you opinions of what works for them – they might even remind you of what Rori says, but… look at Rori’s feedback on here. She is never about rules – except – the one on this post – to not date married men. May I remind you of what she said to me… “it’s not “what” you do and say – it’s the energy and “vibe” behind it. The language and “rules” YOU make are just to help you when you’re feeling confused from doing what you’ve always done. To give you some breathing room to make new choices. To make baby-steps toward not DOING stuff to disappear your anxiety – but to learn to tolerate it and work through it and love yourself more instead of trying to get something from a man. If you really just want to warmly communicate appreciation – that’s GREAT! Do it! But – if, like most of us – what you really want is to make something happen with him, have an impact, have him respond to you…have him do something – then you’re just, subconsciously, texting him “thank you” for other reasons – another agenda. And if you catch yourself not sure about something like this – keep asking yourself if you WANT something by “reaching out…” If you’ve always done things one way – and it hasn’t worked – now’s the time to experiment with NEW ways. Love, Rori

  176.  #176Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    Dorothea, Daria – I have to say I’m becoming more and more comfortable with not offering to pay.

    Funny thing – Friday night when the server brought the bill, she set it between the two of us, but it kept blowing over to my side of the table. I kept putting it back in the middle. That was actually pretty uncomfortable.

    I had just decided today that the most comfortable thing for me to do is to excuse myself to the ladies room while the man is taking care of the check. Otherwise, I feel uncomfortable – makes me want to twiddle my thumbs or something. So… just because I was already feeling uncomfortable with it before I came across the video – I needed some “positive reinforcement.”

    You two never fail me – thanks!

  177.  #177Daria on June 9, 2010 at 6:52 pm

    Tallgirl –

    I just use Rori’s because it has proven itself to me time and time again.

    When I wanted to do something that seemed “against” leaning back… Rori encouraged me to do as an EXPERIMENT while paying very close attention to how I FEEL

    (I must say I FELT that leaning forward feels horrible)

    so sometimes even when we understand something, it’s important to really FEEL the difference

    but to do that we have to be focusing on our feelings

  178.  #178Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 6:54 pm

    Tallgirl – I should probably add here that despite the fact that sometimes I do contact a man, it has more to do with taking baby steps on my part. Ultimately, my goal is to not contact them – but until that feels authentic to me, I will continue to contact them if the spirit moves me. I will just ask myself if I’m trying to make something happen before I send it…

  179.  #179Daria on June 9, 2010 at 6:57 pm

    I WAS SO NOT able to go cold turkey on not driving to men… heck i still do it some time

    let alone the part of me now plainly telling them that they must drive to me (without my shutting down with defense and resentment)

    i still even call them BLAH sometimes, and its NOT leaning back rockstarish and it DOESNT FEEL GOOD AFTER and they DO NOT usually give me what i want haha


    when i feel really into me then everything gets lovely

    Rori has great visualizations like “Goddess as Magnet” “Hundred Men Exercise” and “He’s only focusing on YOU as men and women walk by”

  180.  #180Daria on June 9, 2010 at 6:58 pm

    I feel frustrated cuz i had some months of “my life is beautiful and im really going to be happy” and lately i seem to have had cloudy pond for AWHILE

    whats the last time i went on a “real” date?



    i love me

    i haven’t been dating myself either

    i feel sinking thinking of that

    i love me

  181.  #181Daria on June 9, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    I don’t deserve love or a husband or relationship of man help because im not self sufficient!!


    who wants a woman whos not self sufficient?


    i love you NV”S

    you deserve to be heard!

    I feel rebellious. I DO NOT want to take care of myself!

    NO NO NO!!

    I refuse!!



  182.  #182Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:00 pm


    I feel like I’m starting to feel like myself again! Like the challenging fun part of me..

    I just told the guys strait up that lives in other states this message.

    This one site I’m on has cute guys but I get messages from across the country and only one guy in my state. So, I feel kinds tired, too tired to be cutsey wootsey and fake at the moment.. Here is what I said.. I feel careless about it, like I don’t have anything to loose sooo why not..

    This guy in Michigan was like.. Hey how was your weekend?

    My Response: 🙂

    “Gregg.. Please forgive me.. I’m having a moment.. I started school this week, I’m working and dating and oh ya.. brushing off the dust on my P90-x… haha

    Here’s the deal.. I feel bored with emailing. Mainly becuase there are so many emails to respond to people with… I’m considering deleting my profile cause it’s all out of state people for the most part.

    And who want an imaginary relationship?

    I can only speak for me but, I don’t.. I wish you lived closer it would be great to meet you, and I can see this would be a fun pen pal type thing but, that’s just not what I want and I assume you either.. And what’s the point of chatting? haha..

    I do feel good about this scenerio.. If I’m ever in Michigan I’ll let you know and if your ever in Dallas you let me know.. I feel wierd saying all that.. I feel good hearing from ya and like you are a super cool guy.. Hope you understand. What do you think?

    Well check out his response..

    Hey you..I agree 100% …
    well how about we try talking on the phone and see what happens?


    I like that he responded so quickly.. I don’t see the point in talking but, it couldnt hurt.. I am for sure setting some boundries and it’s feeling easier! 🙂

  183.  #183dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    money is one of my biggest triggers for a whole mess of reasons

    i still dont pay. once my LI asked me if i wanted to go to the cafe with him before our bookstore date and i said yes! and then before he had the chance to pay for my order i whipped out my card and paid. i felt so uncomfortable leaning back. and then i felt sooo bad sitting there us eating our food thinking…he should have paid. but i didn’t give him the chance too. and maybe he should have insisted but i certainly was rowing the boat anyway and i was being prickly to it.

    so then we had a very deep convo about money and dating and we got clearer on how bad it makes me feel to pay for my own dates. he doesn’t make very much money but spends it all on me. i recently told him i have a list of free things i love to do and that feel romantic to me and i would share them with him. the result of that experiment was him proceeding to take me to an expensive all day date and dinner and buy me a gift during all of it.

    so i think i overfunctioned there haha and he was like “oh hell no…u will not view me as a cheap ass”.

    i still would like to share this list with him. i tried to tell him that what feels romantic is his planning something for us, not spending money on me. On my list is stuff like go to the pond, ride the train the whole way, ride a new bus i’ve never been on before to a new part of town, get ice cream/coffee/dessert, go to the book store, sneak onto a roof of a tall building, bonus points to everything if he brings a snack for me…

    i dunno how to share this stuff with him.

    i am his first real girlfriend and i dont want him thinking he is stuck with taking me to costly meals and concerts (i still really appreciate this).


  184.  #184Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:06 pm

    Dorothea – Why not share the list with him and see if he runs with it? If not, you could always have another chat with him.

    I think it speaks volumes about him that he reacted the way he did – buying you a gift and all. Sounds like he may be a bit of a rebel. Maybe you should try some reverse psychology? (joke).

  185.  #185Hurting on June 9, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    desperately need help. I had posted a comment under summer offer but I dont think anyone saw it. I hope its ok to post here

    Wondering with someone in my situation could the Modern Siren help me? I dont feel datable because of my physical condition and it has been 4 years. Some of you may know my story for past posts. Dont feel like rehashng too much but will give you some idea what Im going through. I want to feel beautfiful and desirable again. I used to feel this way before this happened to me. Now men dont compliment me and treat me as a friend and just talk about other women. The same men who used to think I was a catch and would pursue me. I know my self esteem has suffered. I know that my health conditoin is so overwhleming that I cant imagine anyone wanting me. I know that I know longer look beautiful but I still pray that somebody out there must think Im loveable. I pray that somebody still wants to love me. Im living at home with uncompassionate and unloving family. I feel desperate, the need to be rescued and I think men sense this. Can I still be a modern siren with all these limiations?

    How do I deal with the broken heart of the man I love not wanting to be with me. He wants to talk to me everyday but only be friends. He doestn tell me but he behaves in such a manner. He is lonely and I feel he is using me for company till he finds someone better. I even told him that Im afraid of this and he doesnt answer me directly sayin its too overhwlmeing to be with me. Part of the reason I became as ill as I had by following his advice on going on a medictaion that I had severe reactons to and has been life altering. He feels guilty about it and thts why sticks around but he still doesnt want to be with me because its so overwhelming to him and I have lost 40lbs and very sickly and had many compications that are life altering. He has his own issues with anxiety disorder which is how we met. I tried to meet others online but I feel like I dont beong, Im too damaged physically. They wouldnt want me if they knew how sick I really am. He knew me before I was as sick and so I feel like I have more chance with him then anyone else, but also I love him. I love him so much and he has a beautiful heart. People say he is the kindest person you’d ever meet, but he is an athletic guy. And he is used to beautiufl women and Im no longer am the woman I once was. He used to say he loved me. Now when I say I love him he says Im so sweet to be so caring and a good heart. Ick. We are long distance relationship too which adds to the stress. It makes me feel icky so icky He used to send me a little flower next to my name in emails and he stopped doing it. Sometimes he doesnt even sign his name when he emails me. I feel like Im just a buddy to him. When we were long distance before we met he acted like he was committed but then would look to meet other women. I wish I did circular dating back then becuase that really devastated me to find out he did this behind my back. Sad part is that if I never met him I wouldnt have been in this phsycial condition and I also had another man very interested in me who I knew for over 15 years before I became so sick and turned him down only to be with this man who ends up abandoning me. Now the man I knew for 15 years foudn someone else and doesnt want to stay in touch because Im so sick and he just doesnt want me in his life. Rejection . THats what I’ve been experiencing the last 3 years since this ordeal Rejejction from everyone. What do I do? I feel so devastated. Before this man I havent been involved with someone in over 10 years.

    IF i want to win this guy back the one who is acting like a friend. What do I do? Do I tell him how I feel? He says he sees a postivie shift in me so I dont want to do anything to mess things up but he keeps talking about himself. It used to be all about me and trying to get me better so we can be togher. Now its all about him and how he wants to change (not to be with me but to be with others—-he doesnt say it but implies it by his behavior). He complains about being home all the time when he is home from anxiety and Im home becuaSe Im fighting for my life. Ive tried that so many times and at times it helped and he started being more loving but then he would shut down again when he heard how badly I was feeling phsycially becuase its hard for me to fake it all the time. Sometimes I cant hide it. Do I just act like Im firends with him and not question it? I cry all the time over this. and the broken heart affects my health. You see its not like he thinks Im a catch and if I can find someone who would be willing to date me he would want to win me back. When I tell him I went onine to date again he doesnt seem jealous. It breaks my heart. I’ve tried to cut all ties but then Im completley alone and devastated and I call him back. He is the reason I fought for my life the past 3 years. Its not like I have lovign family memebers to be there for me to support me or friends Im alone and the support group thing doesnt work for me.

    Oh the heartache is so deep. So eternal. I dont think I can get better with a broken heart and everything Im going through. I need to be held and loved and stroked.

    Tears run down my face as I write. Im so sorry Im trying so hard.

    Thank you for your love and support.

  186.  #186Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:09 pm

    Honestly.. just the thought of talking to him on the phone makes me feel triggered in a wierd way..

    He’s a nice guy and handsome.. I feel funny.. like I don’t want to becuase I’m in my cage but he is out of state so why do I need too? Ughhhhh… my intimacy issues coming up.. I try to say bye and now he wants to talk. Why should I run over something so silly! geesh

    My hair dresser has the same b-day 3/3 and she said I was born under the week of “the loner” I hope that is not true.. I try to not buy into that stuff.. but, it makes sense..

  187.  #187Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 7:13 pm

    Lucy, RE: #54 – Good Job!! I am the same way with men who are just looking for sex.

  188.  #188Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:22 pm

    WOW!! Oppsie OMG

    I feel like I’m starting to feel like myself again! Like the challenging fun part of me..

    I just told the guys strait up that lives in other states this message.

    (I feel tired and careless about it, like I don’t have anything to loose sooo why not.. )

    This guy in Michigan was like.. Hey how was your weekend?

    My Response:

    “Gregg.. Please forgive me.. I’m having a moment.. I started school this week, I’m working and dating and oh ya.. brushing off the dust on my P90-x… haha

    Here’s the deal.. I feel bored with emailing. Mainly becuase there are so many emails to respond to people with… I’m considering deleting my profile cause it’s all out of state people for the most part.

    And who wants to be in a imaginary relationship?

    I can only speak for me but, I don’t.. I wish you lived closer it would be great to meet you, and I can see this would be a fun pen pal type thing but, that’s just not what I want and I assume you either.. And what’s the point of chatting? haha..

    I do feel good about this scenerio.. If I’m ever in Michigan I’ll let you know and if your ever in Dallas you let me know.. I feel wierd saying all that.. I feel good hearing from ya and like you are a super cool guy.. Hope you understand. What do you think?

    Well check out his response..

    Hey you..I agree 100% …
    well how about we try talking on the phone and see what happens?


    (I like that he responded so quickly.. from his blackberry in 5 seconds to be honest.. I don’t see the point in talking but, it couldnt hurt.. I am for sure setting some boundries and it’s feeling easier!)

    HOLY CANOLIE!!!!!!!!!!! haha : 🙂

    Here is the last two messages..

    Me – “Well.. I feel impressed with the speed of your response.. haha. Tell your blackberry thanks! I have one too but, I took my personal email off of it.. i”m headed to the gym.. Glad we agree 100%!”

    Him- “Well I happened to be sitting here just got back form volleyball practice…and I am not looking for a pen pal either…lol
    I would HOPE that we would actually talk on the phone and then I fly there and take you to dinner…lol”

    I will text you…have a good work out.. – Gregg

    — “”Fly here and take me to dinner””.. (that feels awesome! And why have put up with crap in my past? oh ya.. I had no boundries) It still not what I want.. but, progress feel sweet!!

    THANKS RORI!!!!! I LOVE BOUNDRIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🙂

  189.  #189Siena on June 9, 2010 at 7:25 pm

    Sweetpea, re #170, I’ll tell you what worked wonders for me – it’s from a Rori scripting class.

    I told #1CD, “I feel really uncomfortable about the whole ‘who pays’ question. It would feel really good if you just told me when you wanted me to pay for something, and I’ll do it.”

    His response was, “I don’t want you to ever pay for anything, ever. Ever ever ever. No food, no trips… nothing. And I don’t ever want to talk about this ever again, closed subject, okay?”

    (Writing that sounds like he was being a jerk, but he was actually very sweet and not at all jerky or controlling.)

    Now I feel totally relaxed, and can have lots of fun on our dates. Not only did that clear up the money question, but the whole “who rows the boat” question was cleared up as an added bonus too (because that convo led to the next).

    It feels liberating!

  190.  #190dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 7:25 pm

    yay alicia! U ROCK!!

    sweetpea, i am making a list now.

    i am modifying my free/cheap list to exclude alcohol because i am not really into consuming it anymore.

  191.  #191Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:26 pm

    Hurting – I don’t know your exact situation because I am new here, and I am not sure what to say to you without more information, but I just want to acknowledge you. I had tears running down my face reading your post and will pray that someone (if not me) find the words to answer your question.

  192.  #192Siena on June 9, 2010 at 7:28 pm

    okay out the door for another first date. I’m trying to have a good attitude about this so I can feel good, lean back and listen for his message.

    I’m trying not to complain and not to feel tired of this whole CDing thing, because I know it’s good for me.

    You know what would make this better? If first dates were group dates… so much easier!

    But no complaining – just gratitude that I have a car to take me to the date and that I’m gonna meet another interesting human (haha). Laters Sirens

  193.  #193Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:29 pm

    Siena – hmm.. I like that. I like that he stepped up, too. His answer didn’t feel controlling to me – it felt awesome.

    I have to say – I’ve probably been well-primed for this. Where I come from, guys have the attitude that if they buy you a drink, you owe them sex. I finally starting telling them a drink was a small price to pay to spend time chatting with me – and if they want sex – they’re going to have to do a lot more to impress me than buy me a drink. I cringe to think how I would be feeling about this now, if I hadn’t already gotten past the whole drink/sex issue.


    It still feels good to grow!!

  194.  #194Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:31 pm

    Dorothea – I hope it works for you. He seems like a “step up to the plate” kind of guy (God! I love that kind of man SO much!!). So, I have a feeling it will be very successful. Let me know.

  195.  #195Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:33 pm


    I have just need to know.. what is the physical thing? Are you in a wheelchair? crutches? broke a nail? In a fire?

    I just need to know why you are putting so much energy around this “thing”.. What if it’s just your attitude? I have a friend who was hit by a drunk driver and in the hopsital flat on her face for six months and in wheel chair for the rest of her life.. Believe it or not she had a serious loving relationship after that.. Obviosuly she went thru a serious adjustment depression phase.. but, the birds chirped again… the music still played.. So what happened? I read paragraphs about not getting into what happened and your story, versus just stating it.. rather then eluding to it.. Please let me know so I can get a better feel.. and check out this Higher Awareness email.. I’ll post it next….

  196.  #196Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:37 pm

    Natural vibrations – HIGHER AWARENESS – EMAIL

    “I sing the body electric.”

    — Walt Whitman

    The water that makes up so much of our bodies is like ocean water. The salt crystals in this water vibrate at ever-changing frequencies. Our hearts are the emotional centers of our bodies, and they put out frequencies that are 10 times the power of the frequencies of our brains.

    WHEN WE ARE HAPPY, WE VIBRATE AT A HIGHER FREQUENCY than when we are angry or sad. Our emotions change the chemical composition of the water in our systems. That’s why happy tears taste different than tears of sadness.

    Experiencing physical, emotional and mental stillness harmonizes the vibrational output of the body, heart and mind and we become stronger.

    “”””””””””””””The message we give our bodies — one of irritation or acceptance — is the message to which our bodies will answer.”””””””””””””””””

    — Deb Shapiro, Your Body Speaks Your Mind

  197.  #197Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:38 pm

    Hurting – I can tell you that my first thought while reading your post is that a shift in your perception might be helpful.

    My personal spiritual belief is that negativity begets negativity – meaning if you think negatively of yourself, it makes it easier for other people to think negatively of you as well.

    I don’t want to sound insensitive because I can sense your pain and I’m not trying to tell you that you don’t have a reason or a right to feel negatively. But I know there are many men out there who are more interested in a beautiful soul than they are in a pretty face – and you seem to have a beautiful, although tortured soul. Perhaps if you begin acknowledging that there are indeed men out there who will love you for being you, you could shift your energy a bit and start seeing that happen.

    I really hope this helps and that you take it with the loving spirit I intend it.

  198.  #198Sweetpea on June 9, 2010 at 7:41 pm

    Hurting – one more thing – it seems to me that your long-distance friend may be more committed to you than you are giving him credit for. I don’t know many men who – feelings of guilt or no – would stick with someone through something like this unless they have feelings for the person. And not just feelings of friendship.

  199.  #199Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 7:42 pm

    This isn’t for the faint of heart.. it helps immensly to see the physcial body capability and attitude! 🙂

    The most inspirational video you will ever see!

  200.  #200Tina on June 9, 2010 at 7:57 pm

    Sweetpea, no lack of enthusiasm, it just is. I wont feel excited until there is a man in front of me with a ring asking me to marry him i guess dunno…

  201.  #201Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 7:58 pm

    Siena, RE: #117 – You said, “It’s not your feeling messages that are keeping him away, it’s your healing. Unless he also heals, he will most likely stay away.”

    This statement feel genius to me! Thank you! Very insightful!

  202.  #202Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:03 pm

    It feels good to feel centered and not quiet nor fake nor pretending.. I just had a moment.. I use to be either happy or mad with guys.. move between extremes.. And now.. I can say.. I feel exhausted, and it feels soo good to hear your voice today! Or I feel so pissed that I dove for 1/2 an hour in the wrong direction becuase my friend gave me the wrong address.. but, thanks for the hug I feel more relaxed…

    I am sooooooo getting it!!!! hahahaha ::claps hands::
    and it’s not feeling like a foriegn freakin language!

    I feel like the kids who misses the ball 20 times then knocks it out the park…. I think thats how I learn.. Lot’s of missing the balls.. haha

  203.  #203Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:05 pm


  204.  #204Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:06 pm

    Hurting can we change your name to Healing??

    That feels better.. I feel certain you are healing more then hurting… If you are here on this blog you are for sure healing! Then we can go from healing to sunshine! haha

  205.  #205EarthDancer on June 9, 2010 at 8:08 pm

    Hi Lucy;

    just wondering, is there a special significance to the number 25? a choice point, a road not taken, a memorable experience, something that might be stuffed down? i’m feeling curious – i feel people come into our lives for a reason and three contacts from 25 YO feels like more than coincidence to me …

  206.  #206Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 8:15 pm

    Lizzie, Jean, Sweetpea, and company…you were talking about feeling messages…

    One thing I do to make them more varied and creative is kinda create word pictures. For example:

    I feel like pond scum.
    I feel like a desert rain.
    I feel as happy as the desert in bloom!
    I feel peaceful when I see turquiose blue and purple together!
    I feel as bubbly as a babbling brook!
    I feel like chewed gum on the bottom of a sneaker.
    I feel like I am resting on a star with you!
    I feel like a little girl who just won a school-wide spelling bee!
    I feel as graceful as a mermaid.

  207.  #207Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:18 pm

    I just literrally laughed out loud at this comment from Rori..

    – Micheal isn’t doing anything.


    He’s just doing what he does. Which is nothing

    (It’s the.. He’s just doing what he does.. Which is nothing.. ) For some reason that just tickles me.. because how many men do we know like that? But, when you take their job…. they can’t do much…

    It’s like the saying.. if it happens once shame on them, and if happens twice shame on me.. 😉

  208.  #208Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 8:29 pm

    Elayne and Sweetpea, RE: Pink Sheets!

    I got black satin sheets, and both Ryan and I thot they were very romantic, so later I got two more sets of regular black sheets and a high quality black comforter. I think they’re romantic, but if I had it to do over again, I wouldn’t have gone with black. They hide dirt and show dog hair! On a bed, you don’t want to hide dirt!

    But I DID get pink towels a couple years ago! And I totally redecorated my bathroom in baby pink to make it as romantic as possible! I painted the walls baby pink; added the pink towel set with maroon to set it off. Got bathroom rugs in pale green with pink and maroon flowers. Got four beautiful heart-shaped plates with cherubs on them that set up in wooden stands. I got pink canvas racks with pockets to hold all my toiletries. And a few other pink decorations. I love the way my bathroom turned out!

  209.  #209Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:29 pm


    I love the idea of word pics!!!! That feels creative!

    This was my favorite.. I feel like I am resting on a star with you! ( I’m going to have to use that one)

    I feel respected as an egyptian goddess..
    I feel feirce as a wild fire.. (two snaps).
    I feel peaceful like a purring kitten..
    I feel dancing in my toes like Flashdance.. haha..
    I feel a sweetness as fresh as honey suckles..

  210.  #210Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 8:36 pm

    Tallgirl, RE: #172 – I’ve heard from more than one source, including Rori, that often after you reach a deeper level of intimacy, be it emotional, sexual, or both, a man will instinctively withdraw. He is out of his comfort zone or whatever. If you keep leaning back by NOT contacting him, I will bet you another nickel that he will call you within two weeks. It’s hard, I understand. But you are stronger than me! 😉 This is normal. It happened with me with Ryan, too, and I felt so hurt. But it’s not about him not liking you….it’s about him working on his own stuff. Trust Rori’s wisdom…and be surprised! 🙂

  211.  #211dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 8:36 pm

    I feel dirty like wet rain-soaked keds left out on the front steps. i honestly havent fully bathed in a week. i will go do this now. i keep putting it off.

  212.  #212dorothea on June 9, 2010 at 8:37 pm

    yay brenda i like that you said be surprised, it feels good to read and think about. be surprised! yayay i feel good about being surprised.

  213.  #213Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 8:42 pm

    I have the unusual opportunity of asking my exhusband dating advice!! He doesn’t always thrill me with his suggestions and answers, but I felt surprised when we were discussing who pays and who drives, and HE, as a MAN, with a PENIS, said that the man should either come to me or to a public place in MY town where I feel comfortable, and that he should pay. He said if a man is not willing to do that, he doesn’t respect you, and if you allow him to not do that, he will treat you with disrespect and continue to, something like that. He said a man EXPECTS to pay, and if he doesn’t, he’s not worth my time.

  214.  #214Alicia on June 9, 2010 at 8:49 pm

    I feel like I need to clarify..

    On Rori’s comment about the guy Michael. I laughed and got tickled becuase it sounds so calm and sweet but, like a bow n’ arrow thru the chest… bulls eye.. boom pow!

    My visual pic.. (the girl is the arrow) the guy is the target.. You see the target.. (him) take your arrow.. (he is standing still.. because he’s doing nothing) and boom bull’s eye -you overfunctioned went flying forward and he is dead in his tracks (because in calm sweet voice.. “he does what he does.. nothing”) So you he cant move becuase you made him your target..

    Shouldn’t we be the target? And the best targets are always moving.. it’s more challenging that way..

    Today in Humanities we learned that in order for the men to marry hundreds of years ago.. they had to bring back a head of someone they killed as proof to be considered a real man and eligible for marriage.. Kinda creepy but, it’s that hunter thing…

  215.  #215Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 9:23 pm

    Hurting to Healing, I hope you were touched by that beautiful video Alicia posted. I first saw that man with no arms and no legs on TV, and I cried, just openly tears running down my cheeks, in the middle of the living room of an acquaintance. All at once, I felt like I had NO problems. I felt so utterly grateful for what I DO have.

    That doesn’t invalidate our real issues, our real pain, cuz they ARE real. That doesn’t lessen them. But maybe it gives us a fresh new perspective. I feel grief in my heart for your pain. In a small way I can relate…I was wearing a size 12 for 6 years, and I know what it feels like for men to gaze at me and give me attention…but now I have regained the weight I had lost, and I know the pain of being ignored.

    A real man will see your beauty inside.

    I heard a comparable story once to that of the man in the video. Some years ago, before there was a vaccination for polio, a woman got polio and spent months in an iron lung, which was very large and noisy.

    She had to be separated from her children, and finally the day came when her son could see her. He told the story, and he stood in a hallway, and they wheeled this skinny, fragile woman out. When she asked the nurse to please turn her head, and she looked at him, he suddenly realized this was his mother.

    He began to cry, and she simply said this, “Son, He does all things well.”

    He thought she was deranged! How could she have lost the use of all of her body but her head, even her NECK, and still say, “He does all things well.”?

    I realize we come from all walks of life here with different beliefs, and we all have a right to choose our beliefs. But the story is beautiful if I tell you what happened. She took what she DID have, a mouth and a voice, and she decided to teach Sunday school.

    She convinced a bus company to donate a bus AND a driver for ONE Sunday. She taught Sunday school that week only to her own children, the bus driver’s child, and the bus driver!

    The next week she had talked with all the children all around and got the bus full. Then she talked the bus company into donating two buses and two drivers for the next Sunday! Soon they filled that.

    Long story short, within months, she had 20-30 buses filled with children every week for Sunday school, and she insisted all the bus drivers listen to Sunday school, too!

    She had all this positive influence on the lives of hundreds of children, yet she couldn’t even turn her head!

    He does all things well.

  216.  #216Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 9:25 pm

    Dorothea, RE: #212 – Thanks!

  217.  #217Brenda on June 9, 2010 at 10:27 pm

    Hello Rori,

    With a tremendous feeling of vulnerability, I took you up on your open offer for anyone to describe the details of giving oral sex in the most recent string. Maybe I should have prefaced it, to explain that’s what I was doing and why, but I chose not to. I wrote it in the form of a romance novel, and I expended a tremendous amount of mental and emotional energy in writing it.

    I feel extremely disappointed to see that string was pulled. Why? More importantly, I had intended to copy what I wrote, because I value what I write and that was a concentrated piece of writing that was a huge part of me in black and white.

    May I PLEASE have a copy of what I wrote? Or, better yet, can you repost that string on oral sex? It was the very first time I put out such a vulnerable piece of my writing, and I was very interested to see how people responded. This is the first opportunity I’ve had to get back on the internet since I wrote it. Please let me get a copy of what I wrote at the very least.

    Thanks in advance,

  218.  #218Nikita on June 9, 2010 at 10:57 pm


    Happy Birthday! 🙂 you seem really happy….I feel tickled reading about all of your invitations….


  219.  #219joan on June 9, 2010 at 11:06 pm

    @Lizzie, re your post #73 …

    Unfortunately, sometimes flotsam and jetsam also washes up on Siren Island . . .

    *breaking out of newbie lurker mode to share this visual*

  220.  #220Daria on June 9, 2010 at 11:15 pm



    THANK YOU !!!!

  221.  #221Daria on June 9, 2010 at 11:27 pm

    so i keep telling men how im feeling stuck and i dont want to do my marketing and i feel bad…

    and they have (i think more than 4 different men in a row)

    said something like: “well if you want it bad enough you’ll do it”

    “you ahve to do stuff you don’t like sometimes”

    “don’t be lazy, thats’ what you gotta do ”

    and this feels weird and bad now!

    what do i WANT to hear?

    something like:

    ohhh I know someone who LOVES to do marketing… they would love a new client

    ohhh of course you don’t need to do marketing if you don’t like it, I CAN HELP YOU!!!

    ohhh I will look to see how I can help you, meanwhile maybe I can pay your bills for you

    ohh you shouldn’t have to work sweetheart, just do what YOU WANT TO DO and everything will workout… I’ll support you


    I feel angry taht i’m not hearing that!

    whats the message?

    I want this healed!!! BIG TIME!

    thank you!

  222.  #222Daria on June 9, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    Hello Daria,

    this is Dora the Explorer –

    I think you’re just holding yourself back! you’d be a great marketer! you don’t need anyone to help you!!

    just get out there and do it!

    Dear Dora –

    I feel like puking reading your message. I feel like ripping your head off. I DO NOT WANT TO DO the fucking marketing.

    I feel angry that we live in primarily a wage system

    I feel angry that me BEING and BEING AND BEING is not getting me the MONEY HAPPINESS I DESIRE!!!


    It feels unfair… and I feel angry and hopeless and angry


    and i dont want to move in a direction i dont want to go in only to feel stuck and unhappy in a different cage


    i feel so angry at you dora i wanna kick u in your lil back pack and take your monkey

  223.  #223Hurting on June 10, 2010 at 12:05 am

    He called today and told me he thought I was avoiding him. I said Im having issues being “just friends” Was this a mistake to be honest wtih him? HOw do you get a guy to see you as a romantic intestest again? I dont know how to behvave. Anytime he hears how bad Im feeling, I can tell he loses interest. I dont know how to behave. Many times I try to keep the conversation light. I used to be fun and joke around and people always gave me compliments how much fun they have talking with me. I know I’ve changed becuase Im in chronic pain.

    But it bothers me so much how he treats me as a friend and then he says when we keep the conversation light he feels closer to me but he doesnt put forth the effort. If I try to make a romantic gesture on the phone or tell him I love him he changes the subject. I dont know how to act anymore. Can any tools help me with this?

  224.  #224dorothea on June 10, 2010 at 12:32 am

    Oh, Hurting! I feel glad you told him you don’t feel good about just friends!

    Forgive my nosiness especially because I am NOT a doctor but if you live in a state where medical marijuana is legally available, you could very well benefit from it for both your chronic pain and loss of appetite and nausea. I am NOT a doctor but I have heard from hundreds of people in similar situations to yours who benefited greatly (gained weight, used pharamceutical pain killers and mood alterers far less…).

    I liked the idea to change your name to Healing. That feels wonderful!

  225.  #225dorothea on June 10, 2010 at 12:36 am

    “If I try to make a romantic gesture on the phone or tell him I love him he changes the subject. I dont know how to act anymore. Can any tools help me with this?”

    Basic leaning back to cease overfunctioning with the romantic phone gestures and love professions. So leaning back would be not doing any of that. Sounds crazy I know. But instead of doing all that, you lean back and become open to him. Then you are warm and receiving to the good things he does or says *on his own*.

  226.  #226Daria on June 10, 2010 at 2:31 am

    watching bachelorette!

    feeling good!

    returning to feeling messages with men!!

    and i seem to have released the resentment about texting… i just answer them naturally and haven’t been upset… and am getting calls too

  227.  #227Healing on June 10, 2010 at 4:12 am

    Im so sorry I missed all the posts above for me. I thank you for your compassion and I really like changing my name from hurting to healing, Alicia 🙂

    Brenda and Sweetpea, Alician and all those who responded. Thank you or sharing these beautiful touching stories with me. I will try to draw strength from this.

    Alicia, Regarding my physical traumas I so much want to share what I have been through with all my heart but I dont feel comfortable discussing in a public forum, howver my stiutaion is quite serious and when I share my situation with others they are extremely overwhelmed.

    But I do realize I need to change my attitude even though Im suffering with so much. That is why Im here because I want to change my attitude. I had a great attitude at the beginning before I became as ill as I did, which is how I attracted him.

    Im wondering which one of Rori’s tools can help me. Do you think I can do the Modern Siren even though right now I feel like nobody would ever want me? So far the men I had met have rejected me because of my overwhelming situation.

    I appreicate all your encouragement and moral support and it has helped me tremendously. Words cannot describe the gratitude I feel for your caring and kind words,

  228.  #228moli on June 10, 2010 at 4:47 am

    Hmm this post had a lot of resonance for me. It’s true!

    But I’m practicing like crazy on all the distant guys who show up who are; not interested in a relationship/ not over their ex/ just about to move away but looking for ‘fun’/ just want to be activity partners. I actually don’t feel that attracted to that type of guy anymore. I don’t feel afraid to ‘use’ them for practice!

    But… if I no longer feel attracted to distant, unavailable men…. why is it that I’m not attracting any fabby, available men who want a relationship and who are seriously into me??

    Need more practice???

  229.  #229tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 5:03 am

    Well, I did not contact text man last night. I decided that it was a lose/lose situation for me.

    If I contacted him, and he did not respond, I would feel like crap. If I contacted him and he did respond, I would then be in the position of steering, and that would feel icky.

    The only way for me to know that he is interested is for him to step up.

    The real issue for me here is that now I am so hurt, I am no longer open. I do not want to punish him.

    I feel so sick at my smiley face, I just did not have anything else to say at that point. I did not want to push him away. Did I push him away? Some of you think so.

    As to the intimacy, we’ll see. This is what happened last time. We went on the third date, and then he disappeared for 10 days. When he finally came back, I was so angry I waited 2 days to get back to him, and I did not engage.

    Is it too much for me to want someone expressive and consistent?

    Please help.

  230.  #230Lizzie on June 10, 2010 at 5:35 am

    Good morning Daria and Happy Birthday!
    I shall share an idea that might be helpful for you with marketing. There is a trick to it. First, listen to your heart- write down the stuff you love to do. Any stuff. Reading, writing, analyzing, knitting….whatever it is. Make the list really long – like 100 verbs on a page. Second, go over that list and cluster up the words that pretty much mean the same thing. Now look at what those clusters are and see which ones are the top 3 clusters. These would be the things you love to do the most. Third step is to look at those three things in relation to helping people know about your business – which ones apply the best. The 4th step is start doing. So you would have started in your heart, and then used all that information to inform your head.

    Here is a quicky example. Lets say I love to research, analyze and write. Then in relation to my business, what could I research, analyze and write, so that others would get to know me and my business. Then l would look at how to get what I have written out to the people who I want to attract as customers – a newsletter, blog, mags, a hand-written letter perhaps. So focus on what you love and make that work for you.

  231.  #231Rachel on June 10, 2010 at 5:36 am


    That was a cute response and it should take WAY more than that to push a guy away.

    I feel your pain so much. I lived like that for over a year. I still struggle when my guy goes quiet.

    I’ve learned that there is a natural ebb and flow in relationships … and especially if a guy is afraid of intimacy, he will often pull away after an intimate time. We would have a beautiful, loving, snuggly night and then … nothing for days. It killed me!

    At first, I overfunctioned and I felt horrible. But then I began to force myself to lean back. I really did love him, so I didn’t want to give up. He always came back – eventually.

    Now we’ve settled into a bit of a “routine” with this ebb/flow thing. And I’ve learned to look at it this way:

    When he’s near, I enjoy it for all it’s worth. I work hard at laying down MY expectations and hopes and just receiving what he’s giving – even if I “know” he could do so much better! I stay open and warm and use feeling messages and let him know that I’m so happy to be with him. It has taken the pressure off and he’s giving me more attention than he ever has! YAY!!

    And then when he pulls back a little … I take a deep breath and tell myself it’s ok. And then I take that time to focus on my life, my kids, my passions, etc.

    I find that this balances things well.

    Ebb = Me time!
    Flow = Us time!

    Either way, I win.

    I know it’s really hard to get here – especially when you’re in the middle of the pain. And I still feel the pain more than I should.

    But the other ladies are right … you’re sending out a needy, desperate vibe that he can feel even if you’re not communicating. So the best thing you can do for YOU and for him… is to find something you like and go do it! Even if you cry while you’re doing it – God knows I did!

    But now I’m able to (almost) put him out of my mind when he’s “away.” And the more I live my life, the more he comes near and wants to be part of it.

    YAY to you for not contacting him. You are doing everything right. Now … find something beautiful today and let the beauty in to heal your heart. Please?!


  232.  #232Simply Shannon on June 10, 2010 at 5:36 am

    Tallgirl: I feel happy reading what you wrote. You paid attention to your feelings! The lose-lose scenario you mentioned is YOU paying attention to what it would feel like to text him. That’s brilliant!!

    As to the amount of power you are assigning to a smiley face, I want you to STOP that. I want you to tell your negative voices to SHUT UP and go sit in the corner. If any man decided to stop contacting me over a smiley face text, I would feel grateful because I don’t want that man in my life.

    Are you circular dating? I would feel ecstatic if you had THREE men in your rotation. I truly believe this would click for you if you had other men you were talking to. This one guy would be nothing to you and you wouldn’t be waiting on him to contact you if you had more men contacting you. Make sense? Willing to try that? I would LOVE to hear about more men in your rotation. Even just making eye contact, smiling and flirting with guys at the grocery store.

  233.  #233Lizzie on June 10, 2010 at 5:40 am

    Rachel, that is so wonderful! I feel the beauty of your message, I feel comforted

    ebb=me time!
    flow=us time!

    that will definately help me stay safely grounded. Thank you!

  234.  #234Rachel on June 10, 2010 at 5:48 am


    “Is it too much for me to want someone expressive and consistent?”

    No! If expressive, consistent communication is one of your core needs, then maybe this isn’t the guy for you! And that’s ok because there are many men who do love to express love and shower their woman with attention and affection…consistently.

    Imagine receiving that kind of love … every day! Imagine how it would feel to wake up every morning to a sweet good morning text. Or to have a date every few days. To have no doubt that you’re on someone’s mind … because he’s telling you and showing you in a hundred little ways. How secure and beautiful you would feel as the goddess who inspired that kind of adoration.

    Now … how does Mr. Text man measure up. He doesn’t! So step away from him emotionally … and open up to the possibility of meeting someone else who is perfect for you! Someone who is THERE emotionally and all you have to do is just smile and receive!

    This isn’t saying it won’t happen with Text man.. It’s saying that he has to EARN the right to your time and attention because you aren’t going to waste any more time trying to force him (with your worry/stress) to be who he isn’t. You have other men who are eager to give you exactly what you want. And he’d better get on the ball or he’ll lose you!!

    Even if these other men are “imaginary” at this point, imagine away! And then walk through today holding that vision.

  235.  #235lucy on June 10, 2010 at 7:39 am

    significance of number 25 (i forget who asked) – 25 yrs ago my first daughter was born out of wedlock and i placed her for adoption. when i was 25 y o my second daughter was born with cystic fibrosis. she is now 23. so does that shed any light on why three 25 y o guys are pursuing me?

  236.  #236Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 8:50 am

    How can he feel the vibe? I am not even talking to him. That has never made sense.

    I am giving him more power than he deserves, because my confidence and validation come from me, not from someone else.

    However, if I cannot keep my self esteem in check with someone, then it is a huge red flag.

  237.  #237Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 8:57 am

    Does anyone think I am overfunctioning?

  238.  #238tinque on June 10, 2010 at 9:04 am

    “I work hard at laying down MY expectations and hopes and just receiving what he’s giving…I stay open and warm…It has taken the pressure off and he’s giving me more attention than he ever has! YAY!!”

    Yes, yes, yes, this is how it works. It’s our expectations that get us into trouble. Instead of embracing and appreciating what is being given, we tend to disregard it because we’re not getting what we think we want.
    Another way to look at this is maybe you’re getting exactly what you want and need if you simply paid attention.
    I have spoken of this before, but for those who are not aware, K never said much if anything at all in terms of endearments and there were NO I love yous, not for three year, rarely a card, occasional e-mails.
    This distressed me no end for a long time, for I had been used to beautiful rhetoric.
    One day it dawned on me that all the prior pretty words had never been backed up with action, and K on the other hand was ALL action. He told me all the time how much he adored me without words.
    From then on I came to embrace HIS way, and lo and behold, the words started coming. He’s still not verbose, but I don’t mind because I hear it in how he is with me, and when the I love you does come, I know he really, really means it and is not just paying me lip service.

  239.  #239EarthDancer on June 10, 2010 at 9:14 am

    Hi Lucy: regarding the significance of the #25:

    I’m feeling perhaps it is possible that these men are nudging you to revisit & explore any emotions that you maybe stuffed down regarding your situation with both your daughters many years ago. If you were anything like me; you were in survival mode and just trying your best to get by and do what was right for your babies, and it was just plain HARD … just a thought …

    or, if that doesn’t sound true to you, maybe this is a chance to just be free, let go, love, & laugh as I feel maybe you couldn’t do back then because of the circumstances *hugs*

  240.  #240Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 9:24 am

    I’m feeling inspired by this conversation of who pays. I had a situation come up with LI where he lent me some money when we were out and I wanted to but some clothes or something. I don’t remember the exact details.

    Well sometime later we went out to eat and I paid to pay him back for the money he loaned me. And it felt so icky paying for this nice dinner. And I told him how it just feels good when he is the one handling the money. That it feels so romantic and I felt icky paying for the dinner even though that was our agreement because he loaned me money earlier.

    His reaction was soooo cool. He totally understand and actually seemed flattered and honored to take on the role of “being the man”.

  241.  #241Siena on June 10, 2010 at 9:26 am

    Lucy, how would it feel to go out with one of the 25 year olds and listen for his message?

  242.  #242Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 9:32 am


    I don’t think you’re overfunctioning with text man. I think you’re overfunctioning within yourself and with us! I don’t mean to stop writing…write away…process your “stuff”! But I feel your uptightness about whether your words/actions or lack thereof are going to scare text guy away. I say this as a fellow sister, not in judgment at all, cuz I was xactly like that last year around this time, for months! I was driving my friends nuts with worrying about every little action or word.

    It was a smiley face! 🙂 Let it go! It was fine! You are doing great in your relationship! Look how far you’ve cum from just texting! 🙂

    Smile, like the smiley face! 🙂 There’s no one right way to do a relationship. Rori gives us tools and guidelines. I think her main intent is to help us heal our self-esteems. Everything else follows from our inner vibe. We feel good about ourselves? The men will feel good about us! 🙂

    Winners wear a crown; losers wear a frown! Smile! 🙂

  243.  #243Siena on June 10, 2010 at 9:36 am

    Lizzie, #227 – great post! I feel inspired by it! I’m a marketer, and can make it work for all my clients, but have a total roadblock when it comes to my own stuff. I’m gonna do your exercise, thank you!

  244.  #244Siena on June 10, 2010 at 9:39 am

    Tallgirl, I don’t want to be hard on you, but like SS said, CDing is the way to go here. It’s like a magic potion – it fixes all those things that you are encountering.

    Do you have other dates lined up? I wish I could “make” you go out and line up a bunch of other dates, because it really is the key here.

    Even if you don’t believe it – will you do it anyway? Line up 2 or 3 dates for next week? Just coffee or drinks, he pays, you lean back and be a Siren.

    It really really really works. I promise!

  245.  #245Siena on June 10, 2010 at 9:45 am

    …and when I say CD, I don’t mean a random date here and there. What I found works is if I really throw myself into it and treat it like a FT job with a test at the end of it. I mean, really work at it.

    That means hustling sometimes to fill the 3rd spot for “date 3”. It’s a pain in the butt, but it really works!

  246.  #246Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 10:03 am


    YES!!! To your question are you overfunctioning?

    Like Siena said, not with him but in your mind…overanalyzing, over thinking.

    What about putting that energy towards looking at the deeper issues like why do I feel so bad and insecure? Following Rori’s suggestions and posts on riffing and self-esteem. What about reading an inspiring book? Volunteering to help people in need? Doing something you love?

    You are in charge of how you channel your energy.

    This work isn’t about getting the guy. It’s about getting ourself back…getting our happiness back.

    I know this is new for you (Rori’s work). It seems to me that you would get a lot more from it if you approached it with the attitude of studying, learning a new skill. It seems like you are only doing her work superficially. There is so much more to it.

    It’s not just about leaning back or using feeling messages. It about understanding the deeper purpose behind why we do these things.

    Can you see how much just doing these little things shifted your relationship with texter. Imagine if you really started applying the info here.

  247.  #247Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 10:07 am

    That means

    – cd-ing
    – riffing
    – focusing on yourself, your life
    – not focusing on one man
    – I’m sure there are many more that other sirens can come up with

    if I were you I would study study study ALL of Rori’s ideas and really start applying them.

  248.  #248Rori Raye on June 10, 2010 at 10:13 am

    Daria – Marketing is fun for me – and I’m the ultimate poetic soul. I’m happy sitting in a room writing all day and walking in nature until I sleep. I also love all people, and love being with people, and can be quite the hermit, too. You have all kinds of aspects to you. Just think of marketing as Circular Dating with the world. Yes, you need to use your boy energy to get yourself to the place, the table, the venue, the website, the human being out there – and then you get to be in your girl expressing yourself so more people can FIND you. There are all kinds of joys in the details of marketing, just as we’re discovering in Circular Dating. Do BE HERE NOW with it, one step at a time, and find what you like about each step. If you don’t know the steps you’d like to take (there are so many methods, mine is just one…) then see if you can enjoy the research until you find a strategy you like. I totally, totally think Ryan Eliason rocks with this kind of thing, and he does all kinds of free stuff and great newsletters –, and then Gina Ratliffe is a totally different direction. Find something and a mentor who feels like YOU…and you’ll enjoy it perhaps! Love, Rori

  249.  #249Rori Raye on June 10, 2010 at 10:15 am

    Joan, Welcome – and tell us about you and how this link affected you? Love, Rori

  250.  #250Jennifer on June 10, 2010 at 11:09 am


  251.  #251Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 11:12 am

    Daria, I know it was completely serious and I do hear your pain, but I’ll tell ya, I couldn’t stop laughing for about five minutes straight while reading your Dora the Explorer post, outside in my backyard on my phone.

    I LOVE your creativity, passion, and sense of humor — and you will bring so much LIFE and LAUGHTER to your Mr. Right when he shows up. <3

  252.  #252Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 11:16 am

    LG etc,

    I understand your points. However, I am not seeing how all of my work has actually changed much with him. We are back to where we were months ago.

    I have learned some new tools, and I do need to work on my sirenness.

    I suppose if I did not care, I would just live my life and when he shows up I take him at face value.

    If he were in front of me, I would say:

    I feel sad because I really am enjoying getting to know you. I want to be in a relationship where there is consistent contact and increasing mutual interest. What do you think?

  253.  #253Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 11:16 am

    Siena, I did decide I will go out with 25 (the original 25) next time he asks me, but now he has stopped asking!!! So…. I think I will respond to the emails from the other two, and may the best 25 win, haha! Could be interesting…one of them looks like he might be suitable for my daughter! 🙂

  254.  #254Daria on June 10, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Hehe Thanks Lucy! I feel good reading that

  255.  #255Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Earthdancer, what you wrote about #25 feels interesting, especially in light of what happened this afternoon before I read your post….

    For months now, I have felt like I want to cry (there’s so much to cry about!) but tears just haven’t come. Last night the thought came to me that maybe something is “blocked” in me, energy or whatever, preventing me from crying….that there is a build-up of blocked energy….

    Then today, while driving my daughter home from her cf check-up in the city, my song for her came on the radio — “My Wish” by Rascal Flatts. I didn’t say anything at first, but I started quietly singing along, and when I started singing, I started to get a little choked up . . . When it came to the chorus, “My wish, for you . . .” I turned and smiled at her and pointed at her while singing — and she smiled back — and then I felt the flood gates opening….I couldn’t bawl right then and there because I was driving in the city, but I had to stop singing, and I felt a small release of trapped energy and some real tears came to my eyes . . .

    And what hit me was HOW DEEPLY I LOVE HER — and each one of my children —

    How much LOVE is really truly inside me —

    And how loving my children is my biggest and best accomplishment —

    And how I had to overcome my fear of intimacy to truly love my children —

    Especially HER, because when she was diagnosed at three months old, the doctor told us she would die young — 23 if she was lucky —

    And we cried so hard, and I leaned against her hospital crib and prayed that God would take her THEN, as a little baby, so that I wouldn’t get to know her as a person and THEN have to lose her.

    God said, “no” to that prayer — and I’m so glad he did.

    But it has been so hard to keep opening and opening my heart to a child who is not expected to outlive me.

    Oh, tears are pouring down my face now.

    She turned 23 on Monday.

    She will not die this year, I am sure of it. She is doing pretty well, and the average life expectancy is now around 40. She might make that, her doctor says. One day at a time.

    I was 25 when she was born.

  256.  #256Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 11:46 am

    Gosh, I hadn’t even realized until I wrote that that THIS is the birthday that was given as her original expected life span.

  257.  #257Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 12:15 pm

    Well, I’ve gotten my “My Turn” category on down to 99 men. Progress.

  258.  #258Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 12:49 pm

    The original 25 just asked me on fb chat if I wanted to hang out.

    I promised myself I would say yes next time he asked.

    I wrote, “Hmmm. I would feel nervous and willing to hang out.”

    He said, “Is that a yes?”

    I said, “Yes. Lol.”

  259.  #259Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    Hey Tallgirl!

    I just wanted to tell you that to me, your posts here today feel so much better. I can still sense some frustration, pain, fear, etc., but they feel much more calm.

    Part of using the tools is to learn to deal with this kind of anxiety – to learn to just be anxious and not try to fix it. As you do this, it will become easier to find things to do other than go to a man to ease that anxiety.

    I’ve been dealing with some anxiety of my own the last couple of days. I was really nervous about going out with SR because I’m attracted to him. Then, at the end of our date, things got kind of weird and I could feel myself shutting down. I’ve been doing some over-analyzing the last couple of days too, but I have resigned myself to NOT trying to ease the anxiety – to just deal with it. To think about it – and what it is within me that is contributing to the anxiety.

    My point is, that I see you making progress dealing with that anxiety and I am too! Let’s celebrate! This is progress! These are the baby steps that Rori talks about! Being in the anxiety will get easier – pulling ourselves out of it on our own will get easier and easier! These are the baby steps Rori talks about. Let’s glory in our progress! And once we get this down pat, we can move on to the next baby step. What do you think?

    P.S. I also think that the CDing is helpful in these instances – have tried it and it works. It’s still hard, but it takes your focus off of him for at least a little bit. Are you dating on-line? If not, and if you want to, let me know. There are a couple of free sites you can try if you like, I’ll get you the names.

  260.  #260Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 12:51 pm

    Lucy – What the heck is “my turn”? Match was the first site I was on, but I bombed on it and I don’t subscribe anymore.

  261.  #261Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 12:54 pm

    Now he is warning me that he is sure he will want to kiss me.

  262.  #262Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 12:56 pm

    Healing – You are in the right place for a positive outlook. I hope you can find peace here. I understand your not wanting to be specific on a public forum. You will come to see that this is a safe, warm place to “air your laundry” and start to feel safe.

    To answer your question about whether Rori’s tools will work? I think any of them is a good place to start. Sounds like you have some physical limitations that might make it a little more difficult for you, but I’ve found that it really helps to spend time here and I get some really good advice and help on things I’m struggling with.

    Welcome! I wish you nothing but sunshine and happiness!!!!

  263.  #263Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 12:59 pm

    Lol!! This is my horoscope for today: “You’ll have a healthy conversation about big changes — with yourself. You’re not crazy; you just need to move a little further outside the box, and now’s the time. Whether it’s a new role at work or continuing education, start making those strides sooner rather than later”.

    My first thought was – nah. Forget talking to myself – I’ll go to Siren Island! lol

  264.  #264Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 1:01 pm

    Sweetpea, “My Turn” is the section where it lists all the guys who have winked or emailed and it is your turn to respond.

    How did you “bomb” on match?

  265.  #265Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:06 pm

    Ohhh! I bombed on Match because I didn’t really get many winks. Not much attention at all. I was on there for 3 months and there were maybe 20 guys who showed any interest. I went on a couple of dates, but just not anything impressive. Of course I was on there a couple of months before I came across Rori’s stuff and things started to pick up after I started opening up, but I’ve always had many more responses on the other sites I’ve been on.

    Bombed like that! 🙂

  266.  #266Healing on June 10, 2010 at 1:06 pm

    Dorthea, Im sorry I missed your post. Definitely the leaning back thing I need to do. Thats how it all started. I wasnt even interested in him at the beginnng and he pursued me so much. Now I know Im overfunctioning. But when I lean back he asks me if Im avoiding him. He knows Im not well enough to leave the house. Then I confess and tell him I cant handle just being friends. Instead of saying he loves me he says God Bless you and he is more distant in his words. He used to use a litte emoticon flower every time. He stopped using it. I want to ask him why. He knows it hurts me when he changes his behavior with me. He useed to have the most precious nickname for me that made my heart melt but stopped doing it and when I bring it up he says he doesnt feel that way anymore. He cant love me the way I need to be loved. But he says he does love me. He stopped syaing he loved me a week ago and stopped with the flowers. Makes me wonder if he met someoen else. When I ask him if we could work back to how it used to be sometimes it sounds like he wants to but yet he puts forth not effort. If I lean back I dont think he would care anymore except for his own ego but Im sure he would be relieved if I met someone else. thats the sense I get.

    Rori, what program do you think would be best for me? I want to feel desierable again and feel worthy of being loved. THis man really hurt my self esteem. He had barely complimented when I stayed with him. I could tell he was disappointed how i looked but it wasnt my fautl. I follwd his pleading on getitng on this medication that caused me to become further ill. W hen I stayed with him I had a procedure done that turned out badly and left me more incapacitataed and that is why he wanted me to go back home. But I still love him and want to be with him. Right now I feel like he is using me for company and wants my help so he can have confidence and leave the house and do activiteis to meet other women. He doesnt say other women but it is very tranpsarent and he has already tried to behind my back before we had met. . And he is so transparent in his behavior, not his words. Im afriad Im losing him before my eyes.

    If I had pleny of options I could get over it much easier but by knwoing him I ended up getting hurt and sicker even though it was unintetntional and then he breaks my heart and now I dont know who would want me in this condition. And I dont know how to feel worthy and lovevable again.

  267.  #267Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:06 pm

    Lucy – so are you gonna let 25 kiss you?

  268.  #268Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    Sweetpea, which sites did you do well on?

  269.  #269Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:09 pm

    Is it ok to use the names on here? I

  270.  #270Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    I told him no guarantees.

    Then we got into a convo about dreams and I started quoting, “Hold fast to dreams…” one stanza . . .

    Then I said, “I will kiss you if you know who wrote that without looking it up!”

  271.  #271Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 1:12 pm

    Haha. He bombed. He guessed Emerson or Frost.

  272.  #272Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:19 pm

    I would’ve bombed too. 🙂

  273.  #273Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    yeah, you can give names

  274.  #274Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    I am calmer because I have given up. I would love to see him again, but just like last time, I can’t force someone to want to be with me.

    I am just sad, and drained.

  275.  #275Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Plenty of fish and OkCupid.

    I’m definitely getting more notice lately – don’t know if that’s because it’s summer, or if I’m just more open. I contribute it to my being more open, though! 🙂

  276.  #276Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    Tallgirl – Sometimes giving up is the only way we can find peace in ourselves. You didn’t tell me whether you’re CDing or not, but I just posted the names of the free dating sites I was talking about in response to Lucy.

    I’m sure you won’t feel like doing anything with it at the moment, but for future reference….

    Girl!! I can’t believe you allowed yourself to have all of your beautiful energy sucked out of you! C’mon! It’s not worth it. He’s not the only game in town – not the only fish in the see – let’s see, can I think of another cliche?

    Have you gotten out Rori’s book and done any of the exercises? I know this stuff can be draining. And you’re actually probably feeling drained just because of the newness of dealing with all this anxiety and not “doing” anything about it. Change sometimes takes a lot of energy.

    BTW, I didn’t take anyone’s comments about the smiley face to mean they thought you weren’t showing enough interest. You really let everyone’s opinions get to you and that feels bad to me. I feel horrible for having contributed and responsible for your being on this merry-go-round of indecision. I’m sorry!

  277.  #277Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 1:53 pm

    Here’s a quote I found that I’m going to write on a sticky note on put on my wall: “the best way to deal with a problem you can’t figure out is to make it irrelevant. That is, by NOT THINKING about it.”

    I know that it’s easier said than done – but it makes a lot of sense to me. I will do whatever I have to to distract myself, but I’m not going to dwell on anything I can’t change (i.e. – if it’s someone else’s behavior)! If it doesn’t make sense to me, if I can’t figure it out – I’m not going to worry about it!

  278.  #278Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 2:04 pm

    I am just so disappointed. I was so excited on Monday and Tuesday. I was so looking forward to talking to him, and then wed came and no contact and I thought – WOW – how could I have read this so wrong? How could I have thought he was into me and interested now?

    Then I thought – am I entitled to any expectations? Am I being unreasonable?

    And then I thought – holy moly, he is not contacting me because I did something wrong:
    A. Was too couply
    B. was not confident enough (asking if it was ok for me to stay)
    C. mouthed off like I was a slut (comments about making out at weddings and my dress)

    Or that I ran him away with my text – that I did not express enough interest, as if spending the day and spending the evening was not enough interest. Some of the ladies actually said that I was expressing that I was not interested.

    Then I thought, oh, maybe I should contact him – because he is feeling I am not interested enough. You know, today is 2010 and there should be equal contact. And maybe if he knew I was interested, he would be interested. Maybe if he knew I wanted to talk, he would want to talk….

    Or maybe I made it too clear I am so busy with work and these darn posts to make me feel better ;-).

    How do you know when a man is interested? How could this have gone so wrong? What did I do?

  279.  #279Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 2:05 pm

    I feel stupid for letting him have a second chance.

  280.  #280Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 2:07 pm

    too couply? we have been out six time over the last 9 months, I know him pretty well. Am I not allowed to reference what he has told me? I never used we. I barely touched him.

  281.  #281Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 2:08 pm

    Not ok to stay – are you sure??? is what I asked.


  282.  #282Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Tallgirl, who says it “went wrong”?

    Just give him time and space!!!

  283.  #283Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 2:24 pm

    Tallgirl – Enjoy those feelings. Anger is not bad. I’m with Lucy – there’s nothing to say it went wrong – and I definitely don’t think you did anything wrong. I understand where you’re coming from with the equal communication thing. I think that you are in a good place right now though. Feel the anger toward him and then let it go.

    I feel that you will most likely hear from him again, but coming to him from a place of anger will not help you or him. If you confront him and are angry toward him, I fear you will just feel worse about yourself. I think you need to come to terms with these emotions. Just feel them – relax into them and then let them dissipate on their own.

    I so feel where you’re coming from right now. I sense that you’re not at peace with not contacting him. I think it’s good that you are considering how it will make you feel if you do though.

    You didn’t do anything wrong here though. I wish I knew what else to say. There are so many things I want to communicate, but I can’t find the words. My thoughts are with you. ((Hugs))

  284.  #284Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    As I said, this time has been different because I was so angry last time, and I don’t want to be angry this time. I am not saying that I am happy with what he is doing, but the reacting to anger was not helpful.

    I had made myself some rules so I would not take what he is doing personally, and I am failing monumentally at abiding by them. I knew he was a hot and cold guy.

    I am really not at peace about not contacting him because I want to be in a relationship where communication flows easily. However, for me to do that, I need to feel safe.

    The reason I feel like this is that we have a mutual friend. She was there at new years when he virtually ignored me. She said she asked him once what happened. His responce “We went out three times, she is not the girl for me. After the last time, I did not contact her for a week, and she did not contact me either. I texted her the following week and she waited two days to get back to me. Then it fizzled (he actually called once after that, but did not leave a message, so I did not call back).

    That does not sound like a man who is interested, does it? He almost blamed me for why we were out of contact. Interestingly, at that time I did contact him. Only once, when I got back from vacation to let him know I was home. That set the ball rolling to go out the last time. And that date was really fun, and we fooled around, and I invited him to stay, but he did not (alergic to my cat).


  285.  #285Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 3:00 pm

    Tallgirl, I *think* if someone said “she is not the girl for me” I would forget about him.

    Who knows, though, if I was actually in your shoes, what I would do?

    I feel curious about what attracts you to him so strongly. I feel curious about whether there might be other guys who you could feel GREAT about.

  286.  #286Tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 3:06 pm


    I was unclear if he said that because he felt it, or if he was just explaining to a friend.

    However, it has weighed heavily on me, and I really never expected him to step back into my life. It lingers there, and is part of the reason that I step back to make sure that he feels good about pursuing.

    I can’t make a man feel like I am the woman for him. That would be a huge waste of time. I can only be myself.

    And I was feeling good about this except that kiss episode and now.

    I guess I am not very sireny in his mind.

  287.  #287Siena on June 10, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    So I’ve been chatting online (gmail chat) with someone I “met” 5 months ago. He was complaining today that we haven’t met.

    Dude, you haven’t asked me out!!

    How is that my problem!?

    He’s a hanger-on from when I was still a newbie newbie Siren.

    It’s so obvious how different the men are now and how they were before.

    It feels good to know that I don’t have to put out any effort… yay!

  288.  #288Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 3:18 pm


    I finally agreed to go out with 25 (we haven’t set a date/time yet — I had to go make supper — he said “text me later”)….

    He told me I’ve had him hanging on for two years! I laughed and said it’s just been 10 months. He insisted it’s been 2 years. He is wrong, but maybe it FEELS like 2 years to him!

    Anyway, he said — rightly — that I have been stringing him along…that even though I have said “No” I have kept talking to him, played around (verbally) with him, teased him, flirted, etc. AND several times ALMOST agreed to go out with him but then didn’t.

    Sound Familiar?????

    Exactly what TN man did with ME!!!

    How could I have not seen I was doing the same thing to 25???

    Mirror mirror on the wall
    Who’s the fairest of them all?

  289.  #289Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 3:23 pm

    Tallgirl – lightbulb. Now it all makes sense why you are having such a hard time with the not contacting him first. No wonder you are freaking out. Well, I don’t know, I hate to put myself out here and risk getting stuck on the rack, but if you feel like you need to contact him, make your own rules. You could make it a follow up to the smiley face and tell him how you are feeling – that you want a man who will take the lead and that you don’t have to question if he’s interested.

    I don’t know. I’m not telling you to do so – you have to decide what is right for you. If you think it would make you feel better in some way, then do it. Rori’s tools are not rules. I feel that we all have to decide what is right for us. I think Rori is very wise and her tools work very well, but if you need to try something else to find out if it works for you or not, do what you feel good about.

    I guess I’ll risk being strung up on the rack…

    I hope you can make a decision you feel comfortable with and stop beating yourself up. ((Hugs, hugs and more hugs)).

  290.  #290Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 3:24 pm

    Lucy – WOW!!!! This has been a HUGE day for you.

    How’s it feel? I love the feeling of a growth spurt.

  291.  #291Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 3:31 pm

    I sent SR an email just now. I decided that I have wallowed in my anxiety and done a lot better with it and now I’m not freaking out at all, so I sent him an email with a HUGE feeling message in it.

    I was careful to make it a feeling message and it doesn’t illicit a response from him at all. He’s polite, but he’s also a man. I feel comfortably certain that if he responds, it will be because he wants to. Strangely, as I check my inner stance, I don’t feel like I’m leaning forward either. Odd.

  292.  #292Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 3:34 pm

    I’ve gotten 11 emails on POF in the last hour. CDing heaven.

    I’m feelin’ a little cocky….

  293.  #293Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    I’ve been sending a feeling message in every response I send out. It feels wonderfully feminine!

  294.  #294joan on June 10, 2010 at 3:45 pm

    Joan, Welcome – and tell us about you and how this link affected you? Love, Rori

    Thanks for the welcome, Rori, but I don’t want to tell about myself right now. I feel unsure whether I want to invest myself in this blog because I’m not sure I’m staying around. I would feel better if there were more married women posting here because I need more guidance on how to use these tools within a marriage.

    Although I’ve felt reluctant to post here, I took a small baby step and posted a link to something that was germaine to some other comments. However, because I was new, my comment first had to pass through moderation. By the time my comment was made public, there were multiple comments after mine resulting in mine apparently being “lost in the shuffle”. Regardless of whether it was accidentally overlooked or intentionally ignored, the result for me is the same right now . . . I’m feeling as invisible here as I do in my marriage.

  295.  #295Tina on June 10, 2010 at 4:07 pm

    Sweatpea, you go girl! 🙂

  296.  #296Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    Hey Joan!

    I felt that way at first too. It gets better though. I have found the women on here to be warm and inviting.

  297.  #297Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    Thanks Tina!

    I just accepted a date for tonight. Sort of short notice, but he’s been asking for a couple of weeks now and Siena’s post earlier inspired me.

    That’s two this week, so guess I’ll have to find # 3 sometime in the next couple of days.

  298.  #298Tina on June 10, 2010 at 4:14 pm

    Joan, if this helps, Rori is married for over 20 something years! You have a man right in front of you to practice the tools 🙂

  299.  #299Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    Joan – I also wanted to tell you that although a lot of us are single, so some of this won’t apply directly to your life, the idea of circular dating applies to married women too, just in a different way. I’m not sure exactly how it works since I’m new to this and not married, but I’m sure someone will fill you in.

  300.  #300Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    Joan, my two cents is that Feeling Messages would have gone a loooonnngggg way toward making things better in my marriage. <3

    Feeling Messages have been a life-saver in my relationship with my daughter.

  301.  #301Tina on June 10, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    Joan , I feel invisable, I feel numbed out, its all good here 🙂

  302.  #302Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    I think maybe I literally WAS invisible during my marriage…. that darned invisibility cloak! didn’t even know I was wearing it! Sheesh!

  303.  #303tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 4:31 pm


    I can understand why I am freaking out, but I actually read his comment that he was not interested enough to call, but had I called, he would have responded.

    I do not read it as he was waiting for me to call.

    Help! With this new information, what do you all think?

  304.  #304Siena on June 10, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Sweetpea, #297 – yay!

    Hi Joan, welcome! The first comment from anyone is always moderated, but then Rori opens it up so that future comments are not moderated. Like the others said, this is a very friendly, open community of women who will tell it straight.

    CDing relates to married women too. The idea is that every man we encounter in life is sent to us to help us in one way or another – some to help us to feel good, others to expose things in ourselves that we need healed.

    So while us single women CD with other single men over drinks and dinner, married women do that part with their husbands… and then all of us CD in the real world – with the butcher, the baker and the candlestick maker.

  305.  #305Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Tallgirl – My honest opinion is that he has a little feminine energy going on and needs a little confirmation that you’re interested. If so, it means he thinks your “status” is higher than his which is a good thing. But it would be nice if he would step up.

    However, if he doesn’t, the question as I see it, is do you want a relationship with someone that you need to use masculine energy with to make it work?

  306.  #306Siena on June 10, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    So I just watched an episode of the Bachelorette – talk about triggering! I can’t watch the whole thing without taking breaks, it feels so uncomfortable sometimes! There are some creepy dudes on there!

    I feel squirmy just thinking about it.

    Ick. No thank you – what a nightmare that would be!

  307.  #307Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:36 pm

    Siena – re: the CDing – well put. I knew someone would know how it works for married women! Thanks.

  308.  #308Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    Siena – As creepy as some of the guys on The Bachelorette are, imagine how quick you could get through all your triggers. lol!

    Ugh! Sounds exHAUSTing!!!

  309.  #309Siena on June 10, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    LOL Sweetpea, ya – that’s a better way to think about it! Even WATCHING it is triggering for me, I can’t imagine actually being the Bachelorette. It would feel exhausting, for sure… although I might do it for the wardrobe 😉

  310.  #310Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    When is it on?

  311.  #311Siena on June 10, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    Speaking of wardrobe, I have a date tonight that I’ve been looking forward to… I’m gonna totally “girl up”. Already had my nails done, and I’m looking forward to doing my hair and makeup and wearing a dress.

    I haven’t felt excited to see someone in a long time…this feels really good!

    He’s been priming me for the past week by sending me emails about how he wants to see me. If men only knew how well that worked!! I feel sad that they don’t realize how important little romantic gestures are!

  312.  #312Siena on June 10, 2010 at 4:46 pm

    I watched it online, Lucy. You can google it, and there will be options of where online you can watch.

  313.  #313Lucy on June 10, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    Jack totally blew me off. He’s been on match every day for the past three days and hasn’t replied to my last email which was a response to his email.

    I don’t really care — and am kinda glad cuz I wasn’t interested in him — but I feel kinda surprised and curious about it. He started SO strong, remember??? And I nailed the feeling message responses with him, and he ate it up . . . and then poof!

    I’m thinking he was testing me to see if I’d jump into the sex convo thingy with him, and I didn’t — so maybe that’s all he was looking for.

    Is that the message or is there something else?

    It’s another example of how, for ME, guys who start out by “stepping up” do not turn out to be good guys for me. It never fails. They start out masculine, fade to fem. Maybe that’s why I am attracted to guys like TN man who are a bit more “mixed” right from the start. It’s like that intermittent reinforcement thing — pavlov’s dogs, lab rats, and all that jazz. Gimme a bit here and there and you’ve got me.

  314.  #314Siena on June 10, 2010 at 5:05 pm

    Yay Lucy! The message to me is that feeling messages weed out the lame-o’s so that you don’t have to waste ANY time with them! You were true to yourself, he showed his true colors really quickly… next! Way to go! That feels really good and like a CD victory to me.

  315.  #315joan on June 10, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    Thanks to everyone who responded.

    Tina — Yes, I know Rori is long-time married, but she is not here posting every day about how she is currently using the tools in her marriage. Unfortunately, I can’t afford her programs right now, so I’m trying to glean as much as I can from the eletters and this blog.

    Sweetpea — Yes, that is the problem. Many of the issues of the single women don’t apply for me. For example, “who pays?” is a moot point when it is all coming out of the same account — it just doesn’t matter whether he takes the bucks out of his wallet or I use the debit card. I’ve found some things that Rori mentions about CD’ing for married women, but even they are risky business for me right now. I feel too starved for physical affection. I’m so tired of “taking matters into my own hands” that I feel very vulnerable and that I would not want to restrain myself if an interesting opportunity arose (pun intended).

    Lucy — The feeling messages and “I” statements are not new concepts to me; I’ve used them at various stages of my 17-year marriage. When I’ve used feeling messages, I’ve been told, “You shouldn’t feel that way.” Ummmm . . . care to guess my response?

    Siena — Yes, I expected that my first comment would be moderated. I just didn’t expect to get buried before it got approved. (It’s interesting to me that, even now, nobody has made any comment on my original post. Oh well, I thought the picture in my link was funny and so appropriate to what Lizzie had written.) Thanks for your interpretation of CD’ing for married women, but see my reply to Sweetpea above. If the “butcher, baker, candlestick maker” were ready and able, I just might be willing. CD/Flirting feels too risky, right now.

    So, it seems that CDing and feeling messages are the primary tools. I wish I felt better about using them.

  316.  #316Tina on June 10, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    Yah, Lucy, you smoked him out 🙂

  317.  #317tallgirl10 on June 10, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    I conferred with my guy friend and he really challenged me to face my fears. He said that the outcome won’t be any different, and I am giving him some more info. He thinks that text man likes me, and that he may be sick of always having to pursue (feminine energy), and could potentially walk away as a result.

    So, I sent a short text “Hey there – how’s it going? Kidnap anyone this week?”

    This is very in the vein of the texts that he sends me, it does not ask where he has been etc.

    So either he:
    A. Does not respond – not interested
    B. Responds but in a while – not interested
    C. Responds soon, but short – not interested
    D. Responds soon, but engages – interested

    Anyhow, this guy really is not for me anyhow, so I am just trying something new. I do tend to want all the control and I use it as a weapon.

    We will see. Sorry if I have disappointed anyone.

  318.  #318lucy on June 10, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    thanks, Siena, it feels great to read your comment! yours too Tina. 🙂

  319.  #319lucy on June 10, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Joan, Rori’s Feeling Messages are very different from the traditional psychological “I statements” (which are very common in the psych/communication fields) — they really carry a completely different spirit/vibe and are far more helpful for personal growth as well as healthy relationships.

  320.  #320Lizzie on June 10, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    Hi Joan – I went looking for your web-link….OMG that is hilarious! Do I recall correctly that your man is going fishing? Send him with bells on and do the ebb and flow. How about sending yourself away for a weekend? So next weekend, you pack your bags and take off for some fabulous place like South Beach Florida to walk on the beach, or Montreal to go shopping. Take this leaning back seriously – it seems to work, mind you I have only had 4 dates with new Family Guy – and who knows if he will step up and call me next week for date #5. What I can attest to, is the first 4 dates were way different and really wonderful for me. Don’t forget that your hubby will be in total shock with the change in you. Interestingly, I have used feeling messages before as well with similar responses as you have had. What is new for me is the “formula” : I feel …. I don’t want… What do you think?” this is powerful and can garner tremendous respect from the other person who is listening. They don’t need to agree, they really just need to hear to start. Imaging this: “I feel really sad right now, and I really don’t want to cry” – I would feel the hug walking toward me, even before it arrived.

    Oh, and I was married for 17 years – I NEVER stopped flirting. Flirting is good for you, it is the breath that creates connection and joyful energy between people. I could never imagine life without flirts.

  321.  #321Daria on June 10, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    I’m feeling triggered by the posts today


    I feel better to focus on ME. Hello Daria. Hello Daria.

    How are you feeling beautiful?

    mmm… IM feeling a lil down and scared

    ohhhh i feel bad that you feel that way.

    thank you.

    i feel sad

    ohhh i feel like hugging you and holding you forever


    i feel smily thank you

    wink wink

    ohh i love cheering you up lady

    hehe thank you “papi” lol


    i feel GOOD

    time to watch the bachelorette


    i would FEEL THRILLED!!! to have a room of men FOR ME!! and that are attractive to me

    i feel guilty and weird cuz im mostly attracted to black men, though not exclusively

    so i feel ashamed of this because it could be a “block” or something, and because I don’t know that I would find love with the bachelorette’s options now

    i feel afriad they would judge me and treat me with disdain (ok PAST TRIGGER ) LOL

    thank you trigger

    I feel good that men I’m attracted to seem to find me very attractive also – though one might not expect it haha


    I feel afraid!

    I attract men by soul light

    or… I dono

    I feel frustrated with my trigger!!

    I don’t want to feel judged by men of certain cultures and replay past traumas into ?NVs

    i love me anyway

    even with my NV limitations – I feel afraid that I judge MYSELF and certain men, whcih in turn turns to a self fulfilling prophecy of bieng judged… grrr


    and my tiny life niche on the planet



  322.  #322Siena on June 10, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    “So, it seems that CDing and feeling messages are the primary tools. I wish I felt better about using them.”

    Start here! We all constantly write out feeling messages here for practice. And often write something here before we say it to a man.

    A single woman’s feeling message might be about ‘who pays’, but I would say that a married woman could take that same concept into ‘who does the dishes’. The concept is the same – authentically expressing ourselves without blame in a way that a man can hear…

    I feel good about expressing myself in feeling messages because it exposes my genuine self, and goes straight to the guy’s heart. But I didn’t always feel good about it… it took me hundreds of posts here and lots and lots of practice to start really using feeling messages.

    I feel a little discouraged reading your post, Joan… I hope you hang out and let this work for you – in just the 6 months I’ve been here, I’ve seen lots and lots (and lots!) of breakthroughs!

  323.  #323Lizzie on June 10, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    Go forth and flirt. I am not saying go forth and flirt so much that you end up misleading or worse yet, in bed with the guy. Just fun little flirts – smile warmly at the guy who holds the door for you, twinkle you eyes at the guy who bags your groceries – you know…flirt! It is especially fun flirting with really old guys – they are so sweet and just love to flirt back – it infuses their day with joy. Lovely.

  324.  #324Siena on June 10, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    Daria, I would LOVE to see you as the Bachelorette! That would be so great! I wouldn’t be able to tear myself away from the tv!! Let’s nominate Daria for the next Bachelorette!!!!!

  325.  #325Daria on June 10, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    omg Siena THAT WOULD ROCK!

  326.  #326Daria on June 10, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    I feel jealous of Lizzie’s comfort level with flirting… it would feel so relaxing to flirt with old guys … instead i feel TERRIFIED and tightened up and weird…

    fortunately i am now able to most of the time flirt with men i find attractive

  327.  #327Lizzie on June 10, 2010 at 6:36 pm

    Daria, make it fun and natural. So when you see an old chap going up to open a door, for example, run up and say “let me get that for you” and look him right in the eyes for a second and give him a huge grin. Then right after he says some sweet thing like “thank you sweetie”, you say “you are so welcome and have a really lovely day” and depart with a huge grin.

    There you go, you have made both your day! The flirt is all in catching his eye and giving him a huge smile.

    And if that is your little picture in the corner of your messages, you are stunning! so I would guess, just by you giving some old guy a big warm smile, his heart will just have a little skip. If it comes from your heart that smile is all it takes. Very simple. Practice! Enjoy!

  328.  #328Polli on June 10, 2010 at 6:36 pm

    this is for Healing (ex hurting). you need to love yourself and accept your situation. it does not matter if he loves you it matters that YOU love you. and guess what? God loves you and will help you with everything. as for the tools….leaning back is the best tool i believe. i just got out of a bad bad hurtful relationship. i could have called myself “hurting” during the entire six months. leaning back feels so good. i have my self respect back. because i was really really overfunctioning before and he disrespected me because of it i came across as so needy. i see that now. i still have to deal with this man daily at work. and he is being so nice and so sweet now. because i no longer contact him at all ever unless i have to because of work. period. i have not only dropped my oars i have dropped them out of the boat!!! also another tool that i love and which works extremely well for me….when i have sad moments about him or am longing for what “used to be” (when it was good)…..i use the “noise tool”…..i mentioned it early in this post….i simply say “lalalala” a few times when those sad-bad-icky thoughts come into my head. interupting the thought with a noise makes your mind move away from the thought and on to the noise….and then you go on to another thought. in my case it has worked every single time. the next thought has always been a normal good one… and lastly, this website has been a God send to me. just reading what everyone else says is so helpful and healing and calming. please remember the more we overfunction the more it pushes men in the other direction. those questions you keep asking him probably scare him and make him want to run….please try the tools of leaning back and the noise…..and see what happens. I rarely have to use the noise one now but the leaning back, well since i threw the oars overboard i have no choice. i hope to never lean forward again…. I have learned alot here but those were absolute gems of wisdom (THANK YOU RORI and THANK YOU all!)

  329.  #329Rachel on June 10, 2010 at 6:46 pm


    If you wouldn’t mind sharing … I would love to hear some of the ways that K showed you he adored you. Since “I love you’s” and emails, etc were so rare. How did he give you what you needed to feel secure and loved?

    Thank you!

  330.  #330Tina on June 10, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    Daria, I’ve done it. I talk to him all the time at the store 🙂 when we cross paths.

  331.  #331joan on June 10, 2010 at 7:27 pm

    Do I recall correctly that your man is going fishing? Send him with bells on and do the ebb and flow. How about sending yourself away for a weekend? So next weekend, you pack your bags and take off for some fabulous place like South Beach Florida to walk on the beach, or Montreal to go shopping.

    Lizzie — Sorry, no, that was not I. Sadly, there is no money for taking any trips right now. The only places I can afford to go are the library, Borders, or Barnes & Noble — sit in the comfy chairs, peruse some books, chill. That won’t be any change from previous behavior. One time, I actually had a guy hit on me at B&N. When I came home and told hubby, he could not have cared less. He says he trusts me. I don’t trust me. I’ve been lonely (and horny) too long.

    Siena — I feel extremely discouraged. Ultimately, the bottom line for me is how will any of this get me sex with my husband? For me, sex is as vital as air, water, and food. I’m tired of “dating myself” in this area.

    Lucy — OK, well, without being able to purchase the programs, then I’m not sure I can appreciate the difference between what Rori calls “Feeling Messages” and the “I Statements”. All I know is that I would say, “I feel hurt,” and I would be told, “You shouldn’t feel that way.”

    = = = = = = = = = =

    I’m curious about the “I feel … I don’t want … What do you think?” formula. Are Sirens only allowed to identify what we don’t want? Are we never allowed to say “I want”? If so, that feels inauthentic to me.

  332.  #332Daria on June 10, 2010 at 7:45 pm

    Joan –

    I feel a bit defensive…

    I feel “hurt” is something Rori advises not to use because it will often trigger someone (especially men) to defensiveness… because he can hurt you

    the feelings are about expressing without even using YOU so that its just an expression no blame

    the main feelings are


    and variations of those.

    We say what we DON’T want – (but we can surely identify what we DO want on our own, and visualizing and opening to we DO want is GREAT) –

    the reason behind stating what we Don’t want is to give the other person (man) free opportunity to take the lead, come up wiht HIS ideas, row the boat

    saying waht we DO want will limit not ony what we may receive… and makes it difficult to

    “Be surprised” which is the 4th part of the mantra –

    sticking with what we Don’t want states a boundary while also giving up control…

    but sometimes its ok to SHARE what we Do want… as long as we have an authentic vibe of “sharing” and not an “agenda”

    so it is best to stick with Don’t want unless we’re surely not in control mode

  333.  #333lucy on June 10, 2010 at 7:51 pm

    joan- maybe “i feel lonely and horny. i don’t want to be in a relationship without sex and intimacy. what do you think?”

  334.  #334Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 8:01 pm

    Welcome Joan!!!

    For those of us who missed Joan’s first post:

    219: joan says:
    @Lizzie, re your post #73 …

    Unfortunately, sometimes flotsam and jetsam also washes up on Siren Island . . .

    *breaking out of newbie lurker mode to share this visual*

    73: Lizzie says:
    And the next time I post myself online, I am going to write the following;
    sweet, kind, wonderful men, I would so enjoy a delightful relationship with you. I have, over the years, maintained a firm fit body that I get to enjoy. And you just might enjoy as well, if you can do the following: stand-up straight, unbutton your shirt, (and if you like, you can be naked), now look straight down to the floor. Yes the floor, by your feet – the top of your feet. If you can not see your special bits, then your body needs work. Once you have worked on your body, and can with all honesty, look down, see the tops of your feet, and definately see your special bits, then by all means, send me a note.

    Do you think I might have responses????

  335.  #335Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 8:19 pm


    I feel sad reading your posts. My Mom was in an unhappy marriage for 25 years. She gave my Dad the ultimatum to either get counseling or get out, just before their 25th anniversary. I often thot how the only thing lonelier than being single was being married and feeling unloved.

    I am still single at age 46, but I think I am safe in highly recommending Rori’s programs to you as a married woman. Sure, some of it may not be relevant. However, I have found my relational skills have transformed amazingly in the year I’ve been listening to her CDs. I understand financial hardship, and I feel bad you are unable to afford them at this time.

    I recommend “Modern Siren” as a starting place if your financial situation changes. It really is a lot more about feeling good inside and loving yourself, in order to be most alluring to your man. This isn’t lightweight, airy-fairy information. I often feel bored by relationship articles that seem to rehash the obvious. Instead, Rori takes a fresh approach to relationships. The beauty of it is she herself was in unhealthy, lonely relationships in the past. So she more than understands the pain of loneliness and neglect within a relationship.

    For example, she tells the amazing story of “Mia”, who was in a 2 yr+ relationship with a man who just would not commit to her in marriage. It’s comparable to being in a lukewarm marriage. Rori coached Mia to totally change her vibe!

    She rearranged the furniture, rearranged her daily routine, changed her hairstyle, anything she could think of to create a new her!

    Then instead of hanging around hoping for a few crumbs from her unappreciative man, Rori coached Mia to develop some of HER hobbies: painting, reading, whatever. Now Mia was busy, and she started enjoying HER life, developing HER P.O.P. (Purpose On the Planet)!

    She stopped pursuing her man. Instead, she did HER. At first there was no notable change in the relationship. Then, little by little, he began to take notice and develop curiousity.

    Finally, after about two weeks of shifting her vibe, Mia’s man came up the stairs to find her in bed, reading. He asked, “What are you doing?”

    She smiled, “I’m reading!” as she patted the bed in welcome for him to join her.

    This was the beginning of their turnaround. She was no longer joining him to watch ball games or accompany him in HIS activities. Instead, she was busy in another part of the house doing MIA’S activities.

    If I remember correctly, their previous pattern, as a steady dating relationship, had been for Mia to call him and go over to his house. Now she just stayed home. One day he called, instead of HER calling, asking what she was doing…

    “I’m painting! And I’m naked!” You better believe he went to HER house fast! Their story goes on, and she ended up with the proposal she had been longing for.

    It was a shift in the dynamics of their relationship. She used to be the convincer, and he used to be the resistor. Now HE was the convincer, and she welcomed him step by step as he emotionally moved in her direction.

    How do you feel about that?

  336.  #336Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 8:33 pm

    Hey Joan, I feel confident Rori’s tools can help both married and single women… if they remain open to them. I feel pretty sure they won’t work for someone has already decided they won’t.

    In my experience, I have found the sirens here to be very supportive. As in any situation, we get out of it what we put into it.

  337.  #337Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 8:37 pm

    Wow Brenda! Just saw #335 and feeling lots of admiration for your explanation.

  338.  #338Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 8:41 pm

    On my way to hot springs with LI to celebrate my b-day. I’m feeling mostly good, a little stressed, and somewhat irritable. I don’t want to be grouchy. I want to be appreciative of the sweet things he does for me.


  339.  #339Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 8:45 pm


    I feel for you the way Text Man isn’t stepping up to the plate. More and more, I associate him with Ryan, who I am seeing more than ever was a girly boy. I think about how elusive he was at every turn. Each time we connected so beautifully, so intimately, he would withdraw.

    Then I think of Kenny, my seasoned, mature, thick-skinned exhusband. Within 3 months of us corresponding long distance, and not having met yet, he wrote, “I’d marry you in a New York minute if I could!”

    I was wowed out, and I wrote back, “Well, what’s stopping you???” Yes, of course it was premature, and I was very naive. I would never agree to marry anyone again who I had never met. But I did. We didn’t legally marry for another three years, but we did marry.

    So the more I see Ryan’s inability to go deep in a relationship for more than an evening, the more I appreciate Kenny, like a well-worn, well-loved glove!

    I think the healthiest thing for both of us is to fill our lives with OUR activities, and to circular date more and more. I feel resistant to Cding, because I have felt disappointment so many times with new men. But I see so clearly how if I fill my life with me and new men, Ryan will fade and fade in importance. His disappearance still hurts…but even when he comes back my way, and he will, I will take a whole new approach as these skills are being reinforced to me here on Siren Island.

    Best wishes to us all!!

  340.  #340Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 8:46 pm

    Laughing goddess,

    Happy Birthday! Thanks for your kind comments!

  341.  #341Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 8:49 pm


    I also want to draw your attention to Tinque. She is a tremendous source of encouragement and wisdom to us all. She has been married for many years. Also, if you click on her name, it will take you to her wonderful website!

  342.  #342Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 9:14 pm

    Tallgirl – Let us know how things work out. I can understand why you feel concerned about disappointing us. The debate over your smiley face got pretty heated, but I really feel like the debate was “around you” – not directed toward you if that makes any sense.

    Sometimes I have to do what feels comfortable to me and sometimes in spite of all of the advice I get here, I still don’t feel comfortable until I try it my way. I’ve always been a bit of a rebel.

    I really don’t think you need to feel worried about anyone feeling disappointed in you. We all follow our own path and I think Daria confirmed that she had to learn things “the hard way” as well – that she tried things her way, but Rori’s tools always worked better.

    If you need to march to your own drummer, I say “march”. Sounds to me like you are looking to know without a doubt one way or another whether or not he is interested. And now you’ll know.

    Feel better Sunshine. I want to see you work through this and feel happy in yourself.

  343.  #343Laughing goddess on June 10, 2010 at 9:20 pm

    Daria: you said

    “the reason behind stating what we Don’t want is to give the other person (man) free opportunity to take the lead, come up wiht HIS ideas, row the boat

    saying waht we DO want will limit not ony what we may receive… and makes it difficult to”

    thanks for explaining that! It feels good to understand don’t wants in that way.

  344.  #344Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    Joan – If it were me (and I might be way off base here, but if I am, someone will pitch in and give you better feedback) – when he told me “I trust you”. I would tell him, “I don’t feel I trust myself.” Just out of curiosity – has a been a long time – like months or something since he’s touched you, or is it just a matter of not often enough?

    Sorry. Your situation sounds miserable. One thing I can tell you from the book is that Rori says to start looking for what you DO appreciate about your husband. Start to look for the positive and make a list of those good things – things like, he’s a good father, or he’s a good provider, or just anything you can think of that he does well. Maybe you can start there. That’s one way to start shifting your vibe.

  345.  #345Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    Joan – When I first got on here, I also found it helpful to read some of the archived blogs and the comments on there. I’m pretty sure there are some on marriage.

    Hope this helps!

  346.  #346Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 9:33 pm

    Sweetpea, Aawwww! You said some sweet things to Tallgirl and to Joan! Makes me just want to

    🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

    all over the place! Hehehehe! Rebellious giggling!

  347.  #347joan on June 10, 2010 at 10:34 pm

    Thanks, all. So many responses … so little time.
    I’ll have to review/respond to them another time as I need to get to bed now. It’s 1:30 a.m. here, and I have to get up early to take my mother-in-law to the eye doctor. It’s gonna be a long day.

  348.  #348Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 10:43 pm

    Brenda – re: 346

    lol!!!! Thanks. It feels very authentic to me. I’ve always loved to teach and that’s about the only thing I feel I have any patience for.

    It feels good to hear nice things about being soft. It’s been a journey to let that softer side out. Thanks for the acknowledgment!


  349.  #349Brenda on June 10, 2010 at 10:47 pm

    Sweetpea, that’s awesome! I so relate to you! I even used to call myself “Uncle Brenda” jokingly. I forget if I shared this with you (I did share it elsewhere on this huge island!) but a friend’s mother confronted me about my identity even jokingly taking on masculine qualities. After her heart-to-heart conversation with me, I did a lot of healing on my own. More and more, I get in touch with my femininity, and I feel softer and softer too. Trust me, I can yell and swear like the nastiest man you ever heard! But I don’t like it when I do that. I am in process. But I really like the new feminine me!!

  350.  #350Sweetpea on June 10, 2010 at 10:53 pm

    Brenda – Yay for us!! It does feel so good to me to be feminine. I’m thankful I had my mom to balance me. And thankful I had my dad to love me unconditionally and thankful for my brother to teach me what a real masculine energy man is.

    Thank you universe for bringing me to this place where I can learn what I need to attract my own masculine energy man!

  351.  #351Healing on June 11, 2010 at 1:11 am

    Thank you Sweetpea 🙂 I wonder if Rori can tell me if the modern siren or something will help me with self esteem and feeling attractive again.

  352.  #352Apple Jacks on June 11, 2010 at 1:34 am

    Hi Healing,

    I don’t know what your condition is, but I agree with everyone else. Attractiveness is all about how you feel about yourself. If you feel great, that will project outwards without a doubt. I feel like you are very curious and want to try modern siren. I say go for it! And come here too. Your vibe will totally shift, you’ll really start to shed this skin and be on the path of totally becoming yourself, which is BEAUTIFUL. I’m glad you’re here.

  353.  #353tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 3:28 am

    Well, he never texted back. While I feel like shit, at least I know where I stand.

    He will text back eventually, but his silence speaks volumes.

    Done. Next.

    I am so angry I am back here again. I did not cause this, I know that from last time.

  354.  #354Daria on June 11, 2010 at 3:41 am

    Tall girl –

    I feel sad and drained thinking so much about this one man.

    Do you know about the “River of Men” ?

    We are like a pond. We have our own, contained water, and life that lives on the pond.

    Men are like a River. They come and go, They flow in and feed our pond, or they dry up, they flow again with the rain.

    Either way, we are responsible for being the pond, feeling ourselves, whether clear, or whether we’ve stirred up murky stuff

    this is old Rori stuff.. the river of men

    It’s like trying to hold on to water.

    It feels good, powerful (strange, sometimes uncomfortable) to not think of a man, if he’s not GIVING us energy… he Doesn’t exist.

    Theres lots of men out there and we can fulfill our own emotional needs, as well as have them fulfilled by MANY men.

    When we focus our energy REALLY FOCUS our thoughts and practice turning them onto ourselves, we are irresistible and men will crowd around

    Hundred man exercise feels good. Sensusal meditation gets us in our bodies… the world feels flowy and men will REALLY be attracted… even distant ones “feel” our vibe thru the magic air

    these tools are magic… practice NOT thinking, just feeling

  355.  #355tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 4:14 am

    I agree. I feel like shit. But at least I feel like I know. I feel angry that we did this twice.

    I let this happen, and it is my fault. I will never allow lukewarm men into my life again. Jerk.

  356.  #356Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 6:51 am

    Ok, he actually responded at 6:30 am my time, and he engaged by asking me a question.

    I have no idea what will happen, but I feel good about facing my fear, and learning something new.

  357.  #357Simply Shannon on June 11, 2010 at 6:54 am

    Laughing Goddess: Happy birthday beautiful! I hope you have an amazing trip!

  358.  #358Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 7:13 am

    BTW, Daria, I really liked everything you said. I will think about it.

    Also, I am going to a party tonight, so will try to round up some CD folks. Also, tmrw with the world cup, I will do the same!

  359.  #359Brenda on June 11, 2010 at 7:22 am


    I feel happy to hear he responded to your text! What are you going to do next?

  360.  #360Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 7:56 am

    Tallgirl – Yay!

    Despite the fact that he responded and engaged, it would feel good to hear you talking about CDing on here. I know it has done wonders for my self esteem. Different challenges, but I can feel myself growing every day. Plus, the longer I CD the more men there are available to CD with.

    You can do this! (You can also keep textman in your rotation if you wish).

    Funny thing – for the last few days – every time I type textman – I type “testman” – except just now I type textmand …. “and….” Just thought I’d throw that out there – see if you make anything of it.

  361.  #361Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 8:26 am

    Joan – I was reading some things in the “Heal Your Heart” category (on the right hand of the page) last night. Rori lists some tools and where they can be found under this:

    In it, she asks that we post tools that have helped us and where they are found. I haven’t actually read the posts to see how much info is there, but maybe it will help you. I wish I could help more, but am in financial straits myself and have only purchased her ebook for now. The ebook is very helpful though and has a lot in it about using the tools in a relationship. So if you haven’t purchased it, it’s a good place to start and would give you some things to start with.

    Also, the descriptions in her catalog (also on the right hand side) should help with a decision of what will be most helpful to you – unless / until someone who is more familiar steps in to make a suggestion. I’ve also gotten some ideas from the Glossary of terms (again – on the right side).

  362.  #362Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 9:02 am

    I’ve been working on feeling messages in emails to potential CDs. I just sent this one…
    Ummmm…. I’m feeling hesitant to call you. ???
    I would feel better knowing more about you. So far, your emails feel like you’re just trying to seduce me….

    Any suggestions on how I could do that better?

  363.  #363Siena on June 11, 2010 at 9:33 am

    Sweetpea, you could just say the first two things and end with “what do you think,”

    “I’m feeling hesitant to call you. I would feel better knowing more about you first. What do you think?”

  364.  #364Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 9:44 am

    Thanks Siena! I was just thinking I should have added “What do you think?”

    I’m not sure about leaving out the seduction part though. His second or third email to me said “I see you work out. That’s good. Size isn’t important to me as long as it’s tight.” With a dancing pickle. It felt pretty suggestive to me.

    Then his next email – after I whoa’d him back on that, said, “I bet you have the softest lips… and enjoy long, warm kisses.”

    Before I could respond to that one (I kind of liked that one, but… still a little suggestive), he told me to call him and that he’d like to get to know me better. So I felt the “seduction” part of the message was establishing boundaries. What do you think?

  365.  #365Siena on June 11, 2010 at 10:12 am

    hmmm, I understand .How about something like

    “I’m feeling hesitant to call you. I would feel better knowing more about you first. I feel uncomfortable about being too suggestive this soon in the ‘getting to know you phase’. What do you think?”

  366.  #366Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:14 am

    Yes. That feels less accusatory.

    Thanks Siena!

  367.  #367Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:18 am

    I’m feeling skeptical about this guy (from #362). When I checked his profile, it said something about “this will be my last Sunday on here” so I asked him why he was bailing out. He told me he took down his profile for a girl he was seeing, but she kept lying to him so he put it back up.” And he deletes my emails after he reads them. The deleting in itself is a trigger for me.

    I guess I’m trying to smoke him out. He just feels bad to me. But I thought I would practice feeling messages on him anyway – they seem to be effective in smoking out the “baddies”.

  368.  #368Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Something else I feel curious about… I went on a first date last night with a guy who’s 50 (a little out of my age range, but for a CD… ok). Upon meeting him I noticed that he has some… how do I say?… effeminate gestures… He was soft spoken and his hand motions felt feminine to me. He manned up as the evening progressed, but I’m curious to know if he’s gay. (This is a new one for me because I’ve never been attracted to a gay guy before. I have a gay friend who says all guys are gay, they just don’t know it yet, but I’ve never bought into that. My “gaydar” has been quite good in the past – a little beside the point except I’m wondering why I would need this experience now). I’m curious about what message I would need from a gay man – if he is indeed, gay.

    He’s 50 (like I said) and been married twice. One would think he would know by now if he’s gay…

  369.  #369Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 10:40 am

    Thanks for the support ladies.

    Here was the exchange:
    Me – hey there – how’s it going? Did you kidnap anyone this week?

    Him – well, I only kidnapped one person, then a cop came asking questions so I had to kidnap him too…. Did you go see your doctor again?

    Me – As long as you ate a urinal cake, that is all that really matters, I did go to the doctor, thank you for asking! Stress fracture, bummer. I hope you are staying dry in this crazy weather!

    Now, maybe I should have asked another question, but the purpose of the text was to let him know that the communication was a two way street, not to start a long dialog.

    Now, the ball is in his court. While I am still hoping he will respond to the last text, if he does not I feel ok with what I did.

  370.  #370Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:45 am

    Yay Tallgirl!

    I feel more at peace for you now. Thanks for sharing.

  371.  #371Elayne on June 11, 2010 at 10:54 am

    Hey everyone..I finally told the man that his hot-and-cold wasn’t working for me. I feel a little scared but like it was the right thing to do. All the feng shui stuff is rearranging my life and forcing me to deal with things that I guess I wasn’t dealing with. Hello uncomfortable..but I can’t wait to see what happens next.

  372.  #372Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:59 am

    Hey Elayne! I’m not sure what you’re referring to with the hot-and-cold but I’m curious to know how it works out!

  373.  #373Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 11:11 am

    I had an epifany today when i was talking to a girlfriend. I realized that the more intimacy I shared with text guy, the farther he is runs away.

    That is about his crap, not mine. I am not even sure I want to engage anymore with someone who behaves this way and is so totally inconsistant.

  374.  #374Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 11:18 am

    I just read an email from a CD that says: “You look like a sweet girl with some thorns but it appears your thorns a very long, outch!, in some twisted way, I find that sexy. Good night mistress of whoop ass,”

    It’s very amusing to me. I’m not really sure why – it sort of feels like he’s referring to masculine energy, but I’ve been sharing feeling messages with him.

    Maybe this is the power of feminine energy?

  375.  #375Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:20 am

    Today I feel horrible, so much pain, so broken.

    TN man made me feel so good, unbelievably good. So loved and cared for, accepted completely. So happy and light and delighted!

    He got past all my defenses and I was able to be truly vulnerable and intimate with him. Is that why it hurts so much? Because I let him really see the real me?

    He is the only man ever who has been the one to end things with me.

    I feel lost.

  376.  #376Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 11:20 am

    Tallgirl – interesting. There’s been a discussion on here recently about Lucy being in this same situation. The general consensus has been that her guy has a fear of intimacy.

    You are right – it is his issue. Don’t forget to look for the message (that’s the hardest part for me right now I think – that damn elusive message). 🙂

  377.  #377Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:22 am

    He was on again. I still don’t get what he’s doing on there since he can’t contact anyone.

  378.  #378Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:24 am

    Yeah, Sweetpea, that’s what my therapist said on Wednesday about him too.

  379.  #379Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:28 am

    I hate that he moved to my state and then ….this.

  380.  #380Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 11:31 am

    I have to stop romatisizing someone who I am not very compatible with and indeed to the tone of the post, least available. He is missing two of my must haves – consistent and emotionally communicative. I would take communicative at all from this one.

    He knows where to find me if he needs and wants to.

  381.  #381Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 11:37 am

    “Stay away from men who don’t act into you.”

    Time to do. And to me what “into me” looks like is consistent contact, no sudden disappearances when I expect to hear from him most, wanting to see me. That’s enough for now.

  382.  #382Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 11:37 am


    I am sorry you are in pain. It is terrible.

  383.  #383Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Thanks Tallgirl. It feels good to feel your compassion.

  384.  #384Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:43 am

    This feels interesting … three 25 year olds interested in me, then I finally tell one I will go out with him…. and now —

    I get an email from a twenty-THREE year old!

    “hey whats up how are you today i’m james and i think that you are gorgeous”

    I feel flattered and amused, but I DON’T WANT to be a “cougar”!!!!!

  385.  #385Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:44 am

    I want a man who is 45. 🙂 Yes, exactly 45.

  386.  #386Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 11:51 am

    Lucy- Keep putting that out there. In the meantime, emailing the young pups is good practice. No pressure; nothing to lose.

    Re # 378: the therapist told you what… to look for the message?

  387.  #387Rachel on June 11, 2010 at 11:51 am


    How old are you? Just curious. This is indeed an interesting scenario playing out!

    Hugs for your hurting heart.

  388.  #388Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 11:55 am

    Thanks, Rachel. I turned 48 today.

    Sweetpea, my therapist said he is afraid of intimacy. Keep putting what out there?

  389.  #389Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 12:02 pm

    You know what felt especially good with TN man?

    The times when I wouldn’t respond right away and he would text me again all worried that I was “gone.”

    “Where oh where has my Lucy gone, oh where oh where could she be?”

    “Don’t flake out on me now, baby! We were having so much fun!”

    “It’s been a whole day and I haven’t heard from you. Are there wild bears where you live? Should I be worried?”

    Oh the irony. 🙁

  390.  #390Daria on June 11, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    Happy Birthday Laughing Goddess!

  391.  #391Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 12:21 pm






  392.  #392Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Thank you world for that sentence.


  393.  #393Rachel on June 11, 2010 at 12:30 pm

    It’s his loss, Tallgirl! Smile sympathetically and simply walk on into your gloriously beautiful life. Shine! Glow! Radiate! And get ready to enjoy the guys who are consistently and emotionally into you!


    Lucy… ouch. The contrast in those texts and now does hurt. I feel it. (I have a feeling he may be back after he’s done with this little experiment.)

    In the meantime, one of TN man’s messages was to show you how good it felt to be loved and missed and pursued. Now you know what you want in a man. So hold that vision (without HIS face on it) and let it guide you in your search for the real Mr. Right.

    Like someone said on here recently… today could be the day!

  394.  #394Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 12:31 pm

    When a man backs away, it is not a signal to like him more.

    When a man backs away, it is not a signal to like him more……….


  395.  #395Polli on June 11, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    i hear ya Tallgirl10….i am going to repeat those same words….along with saying “lalalala” to drown out the painful thoughts, and lying down in the boat with no oars…..
    i don’t know about you but mine is an addiction that i am withdrawing from…..

  396.  #396Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 12:43 pm

    Fascinating lightbulb moment in the shower just now!

    Remember how I was asking a couple weeks ago, “How does a man have 21 different sex partners in four years, if ‘very few were one-night stands’? How does that work? I can’t wrap my head around it.”


    When I realized that, I recalled that Michael Brown (whom TN man asked me to read) wrote that when we ask a question about life, one that we can’t figure out in our brains, the question goes out into the universe and eventually the answer manifests not as a mental answer in our heads, but as an INTEGRATED LIFE EXPERIENCE.

    Wow. Um, well, gee, universe, thanks for answering my question…. I think.

    Now that I am SMARTER(!!!!!! )– I am asking THIS question:

    How does a man who is afraid of intimacy push through that fear to embrace the truth and beauty of genuine intimacy and love?

    There you go, universe. I look forward to receiving the answer as an integrated life experience!

    Thank you.

  397.  #397Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    HI Sirens

    I’ve been away for a while, and last contributed to a different thread – can’t remember which one. I do so appreciate your freedom in sharing your lives and feelings and ups and downs.

    I’m married (and relate to Joan’s posts) and have been feeling so sad and as if I no longer connect with my husband. I’ve been trying to use the tools. And maybe I’m not doing them right, or consistently enough, but I have really strange and uneven results – with husband. Sometimes a feeling message from me seems to prompt him to share a feeling as well, and there is connection. Other times he rolls his eyes in exasperation. Other times he says ‘Don’t feel that way’ or ‘You have no reason to feel that way.’ Or ‘not again!’ What am I doing wrong?

    For about a year now, I have been trying to hang in there, after some rows where I felt so shamed and humiliated that I could hardly do or say anything for 3 weeks. Then I found Rori and I can see how the tools can and will work. But I am feeling increasingly in despair. And crying much of the time, when he’s not around. I realised that it is very hard for me to open up since these rows last year, because I am afraid of feeling as bad as I did then. And I’m kind of determined not to let him make me feel that bad ever again. So I’m in a double bind. I don’t really feel safe opening up – not only about feelings but about general stuff that’s going on. And if I don’t open up, nothing will change.

    So I suppose I’m not really getting anywhere because I’m choosing when to open up and when not. Does that make sense. I’m not sure how long I can live with this. I’m less sure I even want to try. And in 3 months time he starts a new job away from home. The wierd thing is, sometimes he is nice, and I think it’s all my fault. He thinks our difficulties are all my fault. Other times, I feel his unspoken and spoken criticism and anger and frustration so much that I become intimidated. I’m afraid to go in his car with him – I don’t feel safe, and it feels like he is so angry when he is driving. I’m afraid that my feelings are excessive, oversensitive, overreactions, and not telling me the truth. I feel so sad, and fearful, can’t find my anger here. It is affecting my work, my socialising, my energy.

    I am starting to see a therapist in 2 weeks time. My husband is uncomfortable seeing therapists, so I go on my own. So sorry if this is a bit repetitive, like a few previous posts. But I don’t have many other places to go. And need to say this to someone. Maybe I need the Toxic Men programme!!!! Cos if i read this from someone else, I would say that there are some abusive elements in the mix. Maybe I’m just in denial that this is no longer going anywhere. I just don’t know.

    I had been doing well with getting my own esteem up again, and feeling happier in myself. I’ve gone back to ballet classes, more in touch with my body, was doing well with married woman’s circular dating, but now when I walk down the street or sit in a cafe, the men have all vanished again. So I CD with small children and their Mothers!! Better than nothing!! But am so up and down, I can’t make the good stuff stick, except when I am with some good friends. Starting to ramble, so I’ll stop. Thanks for reading – I hope to be joining in here more soon.

  398.  #398Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 12:58 pm

    Well, text man keeps texting me.

    But with my new mantra, I can’t stop smiling! I am getting myself some new stallions in the corale this weekend.

    Screw him!

  399.  #399Healing on June 11, 2010 at 12:59 pm

    Dear Polli an Apple Jack. Thank you so much for your supporting words. I completely agree with you on everything you and everyone has said. I dotn know if I did the right thing because Im in so much pain right now but I broke it off with him for the 50th time telling him I need to feel love and affection and I understand he is unable to but I cant continue this way. I told him my heart aches as I crave for his love. He knows that I have been neglected of love for so long and he still remains distance. I realize I can’t force someone to love me. I definitely need to buy one of Rori’s programs becauase I want to know how to react in this situation. He is a wonderful friend but it is difficult for me in my time of need to go from being loved to being a friend. This is when I need to feel love the most. I think if I had Rori’s tools right from the beginning and was able to lean back I could have kept his interest. So in order to incorporate what you all suggest, I need to start doing exercises in learning to love myself again and Im still wondering which one of Rori’s programs would be best to build up self esteem.

    I love you all and how you express yourself and its really beautiful to see how you are evolving. I hope to join you someday.


  400.  #400Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:01 pm


    While I love your thoughts. PLEASE BE CAREFUL here. This man has told you he likes a lot of women. Do not assume that if he were just with you, that he would mysteriously then want to be looking for the real thing.

    I would look at what he is saying as a major red flag, not as a way for him to be looking for love.

    Your looking for love, is not his looking for love, please don’t overlap the two!

    You deserve better than that!

  401.  #401Elayne on June 11, 2010 at 1:32 pm


    Basically, this guy has been hot and cold…just like the men described in Rori’s latest newsletters. It’s like she’s writing them just for me! This morning’s newsletter was delivered just ten minutes before I got ready to e-mail the speech below to the man.

    This guy was in and out…shows up then disappears. It became crystal clear what I had to do. I’d been feeling bad about it, imagining telling him to go to hell (lol), but still waiting for him to call…so he called this morning after I finished working out, and vomited all of his problems all over me. I was already feeling annoyed with myself and him because of his behavior, so I was kind of crunchy on the phone with him and he even commented on it. (Was I maybe not being authentic with him?)

    On the phone he made a comment about how he would spend more time with me I had more time during the day. I didn’t realize it until after I’d gotten off the phone, but that comment triggered me. So here’s my speech:

    “After we got off the phone this morning, I realized that I felt triggered by
    something you said on the phone. Your comment about “being more flexible
    during the day” really pissed me off after I thought about it – the only time I
    ever see you is during the day and it’s always when it’s convenient for you.
    We don’t go anywhere together (like on an actual date), you don’t call when
    you say you’re going to call (unless you want to have sex), and you’ve blown
    me off several times.

    Whatever this “relationship” is, it’s not working for me. I don’t need any more
    male friends and “friends with benefits” isn’t an option either. I’m not
    interested in whatever is left of you after everyone else is through.

    Finally, thank you for being the person who made me finally set boundaries
    with men. It’s almost comical that it worked out this way.


    And his response:

    “I understand your point and respect your decision. I always appreciated your intelligence
    and if I was
    your teacher re: boundaries setting I am happy that, at least, I brought someting useful to
    I do not remember my comment about being more flexible during the day, but that does
    not matter.
    You have been very important for me during these last months. I thank you, truly.
    Being a friend with no benefits is better for both of us. ”

    Normally he NEVER e-mails me back that fast! Although he seemed to miss the part about not needing more male friends…and he almost sounds like he’s beating himself up for acting that way.

    What do you make of that, Sirens?


  402.  #402Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 1:37 pm

    Ewwww. Yuck. Blech. Grrr.

    I feel ticked off.

    I feel eyeballs big and round and intense, and gritting teeth. I feel fangs growing around my lips.

  403.  #403Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 1:39 pm

    I feel huh? whaaaat? huh? I feel blindsided and confused by tallgirl’s statements.

    Trigger? oh okay.

  404.  #404Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:42 pm


    I am concerned you are even asking that question. You set a boundary and said you no longer want to see him, then you are pleased when he gets back to you (and by the way – I am the pot calling the kettle black on that one). And you are enamoured with him beating himself up. It does not matter what he thinks!

    I read that he agrees to be friends (as a nicety), and to move away from the the sexual part. It sounds to me like he respects your boundaries. I hope you do to!!!!

    Please stay away from him.

  405.  #405Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    I feel protective of TN man. I feel protective of me. He does not judge me. I do not judge him.

  406.  #406Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:45 pm


    I am so sorry! My goal was not to upset you. It was to make sure that we all only go for men who are into us, and act like it. That is my bandwagon today.

    His being honest with you makes no difference.

    My main point is not that he couldn’t change, but that past behavior is the biggest predictor of future behavior.

    If he is seeking real help to move into intimacy (therapists and self reflection), please don’t assume that him cycling through women is that.

    You derserve more and that is my point.

  407.  #407Daria on June 11, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    I feel rolling my eyes

  408.  #408Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    I also realized a couple weeks ago that he is my “shadow” in a sense.

    My mom told me a couple years ago (after my marriage ended) that she had always been afraid that I would not be able to be faithful in marriage (I was!!), that I could not be content with one man.

    I felt so shocked when she told me that!

  409.  #409Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:47 pm


    Feel free to fang me if you need to! Fang away, I can take it.

    I am also struggling with taking men as they are, not as I want them to be. And not romatisizing that someone will myseriously become something they are not.

    It is not judgement, it is reality.

  410.  #410Daria on June 11, 2010 at 1:50 pm

    I feel guilty

  411.  #411Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:50 pm


    I feel so sad that your mom said that to you. I also feel sad that you feel you lost your shadow. You deserve a wonderful shadow who wants to be with you with all his heart and soul.

  412.  #412Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    why ms. daria?

  413.  #413Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:52 pm


    BTW, I feel super excited that you stepped up for what you need. That is really really gard, and most of us have a hard time doing it!

    You should be really proud.

  414.  #414Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    That’s the point, tallgirl — I AM taking him as he is; I ACCEPT him the way he is. I LOVE him the way he is. Just like I love and accept MYSELF as is.

    You can love and accept somebody as they are without putting yourself in any kind of danger. I have come to the point where I love and accept my ex-h as is, and have forgiven him — but that does not mean I will live with him.

    I think you totally missed the point of my post #396.

  415.  #415Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:55 pm


    I feel badly that I triggered you. I feel badly that I may have put my stuff on your stuff. I feel happy that for even a second you had your shadow.

  416.  #416Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 1:59 pm


    Perhaps I did. I have been reading here that you are longing to be with him. I am assuming that you mean that in the sense of a relationship, not as one of the women he has been dating serially but for short periods of time. If I am incorrect, then please feel free to correct me.

    I feel triggered even thinking about myself and then accepting someone for who they are, but without thinking the would be something different, if they were with me.

  417.  #417Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    By “shadow,” I was referring to the psychological concept — your shadow is comprised of the parts of you that you tend to reject and despise — like the parts of me that caused my mom to think that about me — there was some validity to her statement — which is why TN man is my shadow — and which is why — oh yeah, message!!! — it was amazing to be accepted and loved by him with all my dark parts AND amazing for me to love and accept HIM with all his dark parts which are the parts I have all my life rejected and despised in MYSELF. Loving and accepting him as is, has been, in a profound way, part of learning to love and accept myself.

  418.  #418Tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 2:03 pm


    I feel excited by the autheticity of what you just said. Thank you for sharing it.

    I am very bad at loving myself – the good, let alone the bad. And maybe that is why we are having this discussion so I can learn to do that.

    I thank you.

  419.  #419Daria on June 11, 2010 at 2:04 pm

    I feel detached, I feel judgemental.

    Hmm I feel powerful and powerless. Hmm

    I feel curious! now!

    I love my feelings

  420.  #420Elayne on June 11, 2010 at 2:05 pm


    Thanks for the encouragement! I feel strangely relieved now that I’ve set my boundary and said no..all the time and energy I’ve freed up! Yay!


  421.  #421Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    tallgirl, being triggered is a GOOD thing. It helps us heal stuff. 🙂

    I was bad at loving myself for most of my life — one of TN man’s gifts to me was that he taught me to love myself AS IS, ALL of me.

    Daria, I feel curious about your current process right here. 🙂

    My ex-h just arrived to take me and the kids to dinner for my birthday. 🙂 Catch ya later!

  422.  #422Polli on June 11, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    Daria-do you realize how much you give us all? I was just catching up here and I found the pond thing which i have never heard of before (i only found this site about six months ago). thanks for sharing it….it really was good. and then just now i read the eye rolling thing and it was just so cute…..
    thanks for being here with us….and sharing some really good eye opening wisdom….

  423.  #423mary on June 11, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    happy birthday Laughing Goddess!
    have a fun, safe trip.

  424.  #424Brenda on June 11, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    Tallgirl and Elayne,

    Here is what I see…

    You said no and you set boundaries. It was extra-much leaning back.

    Your men are responding by stepping forward.

    You are rejecting them. Maybe they have newfound respect for you for setting boundaries. Maybe this is a new time for your relationships to get a fresh start…as YOU want them.

    I may be wrong, but this is called Have the Relationship YOU Want.

  425.  #425mary on June 11, 2010 at 2:48 pm

    hello Healing:

    i’ve heard most of Rori’s programs, and I don’t think any one of them will “bump up” your self-esteem. it takes getting out there and doing the programs.

    but first…

    you’re letting this guy that you care so much about mean too much. i know, because I did it too, with R.
    a good friend told me not to let R continue to contact me, but i didn’t have what it took to completely cut him off.

    then one day he told me he was going to Costa Rica. he used to be a sex addict, and that just sent signals to me that he was gonna soak up the beautiful women there and whatever…

    so i sent him an email that said, “have fun in Costa Rica. i won’t be in touch, but remember that i love you and will pray for you.”

    and that was my last email to him.

    for about eight months.

    and then he wanted me back.

    i suggest that you cut contact completely with this guy. that will improve your self esteem right away.

    i know, because it worked for me.

    if you need help, download this book and read it every day. it will be well worth the very modest price…

  426.  #426mary on June 11, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    i’m working on detachment.

    when i really like a guy, i find that a thought of him becomes attached to almost everything i’m doing:

    *sprinkling salt from a shaker
    *walking down my hallway and hitting the elevator button
    *boiling eggs in the morning
    *watching sea gulls while i’m out on my walk

    i mean EVERYTHING gets attached to him in some way. so everything that i do is painful if i’m wishing for him and he’s not there.

    i’m recognizing an attachment like this to Island Man. and i’ve been trying some of the tools outlined in this post in one of the comments.

    it’s a lot of effort to cut those attachment cords and simply be JUST ME experiencing these things that are MY LIFE.

    it’s just me here! and that’s as it should be.

    hey, Mary! you’re enough! you stand alone.

    and that’s great.

    enjoy another’s company, but leave it at that. because you don’t need anyone.

    (and i believe that God is… and that fact means that i am enough.)

    i will stay with this until i master it…

    it’s my next step on the adventure.

  427.  #427mary on June 11, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    Island Man is in contact, but he manages down my expectations with intermittent rewards.

    he has taxed my patience to the max.

    and that makes him so yesterday.

  428.  #428Daria on June 11, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Hurting –

    Heart Connection Toolkit is designed to BUMP UP SELF ESTEEM.

    As you listen to it over and over. It is an audio program. One of the firsts

  429.  #429Daria on June 11, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    oops I meant HEALING!

  430.  #430Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 3:28 pm

    I just realised I have nothing more to lose. Because I have nothing more to lose, I feel I can lean back totally (rather than slipping back to leaning forward). I want to go cold turkey to using only feeling messages with my husband, despite the pain at the moment. I can stop being selective about which feelings to open up about (ie safer, positive feelings), and open up about them all.

    It will either kill or cure the relationship. Either he will step up and begin to be respectful of my feelings, or he won’t, and I will know. And if he won’t, then I have practiced some useful ways of relating.

    Hmm, how long shall I give it? I have no idea how to end a marriage, if it comes to that, but already I can see myself getting out of it, IF I really do not begin to feel a breeze of change. Maybe in a few months. I have nothing to lose! I have nothing to lose. I have nothing to lose. I’m not gaining anything any other way.

    I will love, honour, cherish my feelings. All I have to do is do nothing, lean back, and say “I feel . . .” No energy left to lean forward and try to make it work. I feel sick and so tired of worrying about whether or not it’s ever going to work again.

    I will love, honour and cherish my (rather battered) self-esteem. I will love, honour and cherish my soul. And my body. And yes, that line in Rori’s e-letter today is fantastic – “Our self-esteem depends on how truthful we are with ourselves, and the moment we say or do something that is NOT what’s REALLY going on with us – our self-esteem goes down.” Yes!! When he comes home tomorrow, I will use feeling messages and, if necessary, the line about ‘I don’t like feeling x . . I feel so turned off’. I don’t mean to just repeat Rori’s words, but writing them out helps me practice saying them somehow.

    I feel scared but also relieved that I can stop trying anything but this.

  431.  #431Brenda on June 11, 2010 at 3:52 pm


    Sorry you are hurting. I wrote a few messages last night to Healing…they may have been on the string two before this one, about Sex and Commitment. I wrote about a previous client of Rori, “Mia”, who turned her relationship around. Check it out if you want.

    I heard that people on death row are considered the most dangerous in the world, because they have nothing to lose. That can be turned to good. You have nothing to lose in your marriage, so you are dangerous as a womanly force! Go for it with gusto, whatever you decide is right!

    I also feel Modern Siren was very healthy for my self-esteem. I learned to change my vibe, and it is powerful stuff! You can do you, pursue YOUR interests, be about YOUR purpose in life. Meet new people.

    Another approach Rori talks about in Toxic Men is if you are getting nowhere with feeling messages and open discussion, just walk out when you are being abused. You don’t even have to say anything. Or you can simply say, “This feels yucky! I don’t like it at all!” Leave the house for a few hours or a few days, or whatever you can or is appropriate for the situation.

    If you have a friend you can stay with for a few weeks or months, it could be the separationg of the relationship clears the air and allows each of you to see your feelings clearly. It can be just the ticket to make or break a relationship. It’s worth the risk.

  432.  #432Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 3:55 pm

    I feel slightly odd – but it’s as if I’m writing little essays or speeches on here, rather than in a conversation. I hope that will come – but I’m really tired now, so going to bed.

  433.  #433Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    Hi Brenda – luckily haven’t quite gone to bed yet!

    Thanks for answering – I feel really moved by your comments – you know how it is. It’s been so hard for me to go public with all this – with anyone. I feel so ashamed. I know I don’t need to, but hey. I want to be the kind of person who can make things work out!!!! But hey, again. He’s been away for a week, coming home tomorrow, and I’ve had a holiday with my 75-year-old mother. And it is partly this break that has helped me see I have nothing more to lose.

    I’ve had some rough patches with my Mum in the past, but I had a brilliant time with her now, and had decided that I would stop pretending with her that all was well. I felt huge relief at stopping pretending, and she was incredibly supportive. And encouraged me to leave if it can’t be mended. To give it a bit more time, but not to stay on being reined in and squashed and criticised for ever.

    I’m listening to Modern Siren and Targeting Mr Right, and I”m going to get Toxic Men, because, well, just because I’m beginning to feel that is my situation. It’s been hard to realise or admit this. And funnily enough, over the summer, I will have to be away from home. Well I don’t totally have to be, but it is strongly encouraged, and I actually want to have some weeks away. And I will be among some good colleagues and friends.

    The tricky life event bit coming up is that he starts a new job in another part of the country in September. And we’re supposed to be moving there together. I’m scared of making decisions too quickly, but I’m beginning to wonder whether we might have to sell the house and buy two smaller places if the marriage can’t mend. Oops – this is head stuff. I’m going to trust my feelings more.

    Thanks again. I do appreciate this.

  434.  #434Daria on June 11, 2010 at 4:15 pm

    Lorelei – wow you’re doing great! babysteps Siren

  435.  #435Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Hi Daria – thanks – I”m still not in bed, though it’s very late over here in Europe. Hope all is well with you, dear. I really am going to get to bed now – looking after my body which is tired and stressed. But also experiencing relief.

  436.  #436Brenda on June 11, 2010 at 4:26 pm


    Have you heard the song about Loralei? I sang it in high school choir!

    The separation is the best thing in the world for the relationship, and it could be the solution. Just go with the discomfort that arises and sink into your yucky feelings. This is a safe place to vent and pour out your heart!

    We are not perfect, but we really care! I’m glad you were able to open up to your Mum.

  437.  #437Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    Well just before I finally sign off, I just want to write something really strange but true about my relationship. I don’t know if it has always been like this, but when he is around, it feels as if he interferes with, messes up, my antennae – it’s like my intuition, my feelings (and my thoughts, for that matter) just don’t work so well. They get fogged up. It’s very subtle. Often we’re in different parts of the house. No shouting, and very little conversation. But this happens.

    What would happen if I said, I”m feeling blurry and fogged up. In the right context.

  438.  #438Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 4:36 pm

    Brenda – yes I sang that song too – but isn’t it about sirens luring men to their death?! ‘He knows not what comes o’er him, as (somehting) his spirits fail’ . . . la, la, la-la la-aa la la la etc. I can hear the song. There is a funny side to this, and right now I would take any power I can get!!

    I chose my sign-in name because my dear best gay friend, who is the only person I’ve been able to talk to about all this, is German. And the Lorelei are German sirens, as I bet you already know.

    Good night!

  439.  #439tallgirl10 on June 11, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    I feel strong for the first time in over a week. I am so excited for my party tonight CD, here I come!

  440.  #440Brenda on June 11, 2010 at 4:55 pm


    That’s interesting. I was young and never really knew what the song meant. Are you talking about the one that says, “Sweet Loralei”? If it’s about men crashing to be with sirens, that is what Modern Siren is about! Awesome! LOL!

  441.  #441mary on June 11, 2010 at 4:57 pm


    You could take it in baby steps!

    I mean, you’ve been married a long time, eh?

  442.  #442Daria on June 11, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    Yay TALLGIRL!!!

  443.  #443Daria on June 11, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    Lorelei –

    What you’ve said, and especially the post about feeling tied up… HAS REALLY REMINDED ME OF MY RELATIONSHIP TO MY PARENTS. whom I live with.

    At first it felt terrifying to express feeling messages to them… but I’ve been babystepping the past two years… more recently have practiced leaving the room…

    our relationship feels really good lately!


    I feel great saying this.

    I am still babystepping,

    and yes, I can feel their energy when they are in the house, even other rooms.

    I am practicing turning my focus onME and only what I want… due to a recent Rori message I read

  444.  #444Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Healing & Joan,

    I got this description of the Modern Siren program in Rori’s latest email:
    if you’re feeling incredibly,
    hopelessly frustrated by your man and his hot and
    cold, immature or thoughtless behavior toward

    And nothing you’re doing seems to work or make him
    want to change…you’re probably making all the
    same mistakes I did.

    We women have ALWAYS been taught to try to improve
    our relationships with men in useless ways that
    damage our self-esteem and DESTROY a man’s
    ATTRACTION to us. That’s why you’ll want to check
    out my Modern Siren program –

    The “Siren” will teach you – quickly and easily,
    in powerful, completely new, FUN ways – how to
    reverse all the damage in your relationship and
    COMPEL him to want to get as CLOSE as possible to
    you. Take a look at it (and you can even try out
    the entire program for free for 30 full days)
    right here:

    You can sign up for Rori’s email at the top of the page if you don’t already get it. They have some really good info in them.

  445.  #445Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 8:55 pm

    I feel bad. I feel discouraged. I feel resigned. I feel hopeful. I feel tired.
    SR finally read my email. I felt panicked for a second and actually said, “oh S**t!” when I saw it. I feel confused about my reaction. I felt like I’d been caught doing something I shouldn’t be. Ahhh! I felt guilty. Why?
    Very odd!

  446.  #446Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 9:06 pm

    Oh my! Today has been such a big day. I feel freaked out a little.
    I had a bad experience with a member of another race a couple of years ago. It was horrible! I’m pretty white bread I guess. I’ve never really been attracted to any other race, but this thing happened and I’ve had to deal with it. Now, I keep getting emails from members of this same race. I finally decided to respond to one – the guy actually seems pretty safe to me – I like his personality and I’ve decided there’s a reason I keep having the opportunity to get some free therapy on this.
    I feel sad though. I feel nervous. Maybe I shouldn’t have taken this on yet, since I also hit on another huge issue for me today. But, in for a penny….
    If I wasn’t ready for it, it wouldn’t be put in front of me. That’s my theory. So…. here I go.

  447.  #447Lucy on June 11, 2010 at 9:12 pm

    Rachel re: #393 …thank you…that feels good to read… <3

  448.  #448Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    I feel numb. Think I’ll go to bed. I feel glad SR hasn’t contacted me today. It all feels too much!

    I feel unsure I would handle it well if I talked to him today. Feeling yucky. Feeling scared. Feeling… abandoned isn’t the word. I feel blunted. I feel empty? Not empty. Drained. I haven’t even started work on these two biggies yet. I feel uncertain I’ll be able to handle it, yet I feel optimistic that I can. I feel excited to know these two issues will be behind me after this. I feel like they are not affecting my life negatively though. Why do I need to deal with them?

    Ugh. Arrgh! Where’s me pirate ship? That didn’t even make me smile….

  449.  #449Sweetpea on June 11, 2010 at 10:06 pm

    Actually, I feel calm right now. But I am terrified that I’ve unleashed an emotional storm of epic proportions and I won’t be able to handle it. I’m starting to feel anxious. I’m not going to worry about what’s going to happen in the future. I have to have faith that this is all happening right now for a reason. If that reason is because it is my fate in life to spend the rest of it in a mental hospital then… that’s not going to happen. It was almost funny for a minute though.
    I will be ok. I’ve had lots of time to get ready to deal with this stuff. It’s not as if I’ve been in denial. This is just the big show. Like at the firework shows – how they save the best for last. All the big giant fireworks and then it fizzles down to nothing and – the show’s over. That’s how this is. I’ve been seeing pretty displays of fireworks and now it’s time for the BIG display.
    I’ll be ok.
    I love my fear.
    I love my panic.
    I love my anxiety.
    I love my healing process.
    I feel full of love!

  450.  #450Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    Good morning, Sirens

    Brenda – ooh, I think we’re on to different songs. I also know ‘Sweet Lorelei’. The European Lorelei song is different. It turns out that the first half of the name means “murmuring” (the ‘song’ that attracted men), and the ‘lei’ bit means ROCK! – the whole thing means ‘murmuring rock -I can definitely go with this. I chose a better name than I realised. Sorry I seem to be hiding behind a an ID, but it’s want I feel most comfortable with at the moment. (A little afraid of husband seeing all this . . ).

    Mary – yes, it’s baby steps but I need to get on a roll with them. Married 15 years. I’ve been tolerating a lot for a long time. And like the lobster, or is it a frog, being slowly, slowly heated up and cooked, I didn’t realise. I just heard Rori say on a CD that diva’s don’t tolerate loveless marriages. Thing is, it’s not 100% loveless, hence confusion. I badly need to get heart and head clear enough to get some changes up and running, and have a last go at saving this by leaning back not forwards. Doing less is going to have to be more!

    Daria – I feel really interested in your comment. Yes, this situation reminds me both of earlier situations with my parents too, and also of a toxic job I was once in. When I was with my mum last week, I was also practising feeling messages with her. And she responded great. Actually, she always would have done, probably, but she has also changed and grown over the years. I was really surprised how supportive she was when I told her how I feel in the marriage. I had actually planned to ‘let the horses out’ but I worried beforehand that she would tell me to support my husband in his new job and remember my wedding vows. But no – I’d been hanging on to an older version of my Mum. She really surprised me, and stepped up to the plate in a way that I can believe in. She said she felt honoured and privileged that I told her all this, because she’s 75 and people start to want to ‘not upset her’ – but I’ve been doing that all my life, ha ha ha. Now I’m taking the risk that being open and honest might upset her, and doing it anyway. And she was supportive, protective even.

    Have a great day my dears, despite our different time zones.

  451.  #451Lorelei on June 11, 2010 at 10:31 pm

    Hi Sweetpea

    About how scary feelings can seem . . here’s something I find helpful, when I remember/have time to do it!

    When I feel scary feelings lurking, and I’m resisting feeling them I try to get on my own, and first imagine myself in a safe place, preparing a meal for guests. Then I go out and wait for the guests – the feelings – who I want to bring in to the table and welcome home. Doing this in a visualisation helps me be very specific.

    Then I wait for the guests to show up – it doesn’t take long cos they’re already lurking out there, kind of wanting to come in, actually desperately wanting to know they can come in. And I call them by name, ‘see’ them as best I can, reassure them, hug them, cradle them, in my mind’s eye, often physically acting it out as well. As the feelings (all parts of me, really) get welcomed and brought to the table, I feel the feeling, and integrate it, rather than keeping it at a distance. And I usually end up finding joy and love and relief.

    Occasionally I’ve had a feeling – Sorrow was a big one – that was too big to fit in the room I prepared (all in my imagination – I’m not going mad here). So I just patiently waited and watched in my imagination over some weeks, and gradually Sorrow began to melt and shrink in size, and my imaginary place also got bigger, and with time, my Sorrow and I got together properly.

    I found my heart imagination really does know how to process this stuff. And it doesn’t take as long as it sounds. Well, sometimes just feeling a feeling that has been kept out for a long time, takes a little while to be felt and embraced. And there a lots of lovely Rori tools for how we do this – being rocked in a sea of feeling, falling to knees, etc. But cos I’ve done it quite a bit now, the imaginary room and lovely meal are set up permanently in my heart, and I can do the welcoming in really quickly! Some feelings keep running away, so I just keep reinforcing it, and welcoming them back in.

  452.  #452Alicia on June 11, 2010 at 11:48 pm

    Rori –

    I like the Home Page.. it looks pretty.. I feel good looking at it. I noticed the change. 😉

  453.  #453Alicia on June 12, 2010 at 12:01 am

    Welllll… I feel soooooooooooooo embarrassed!!!!!

    I’m hoping not what I believed happened is not true. I just had to laugh it off and let it go…

    Everyone was gone from the house tonight so.. I thought it would be perfect timing for an Alicia Play date… Fast forward to me having to take a battery of the remote control so I could use it in more prodcutive places.. (lol) Otherwise known as my vibomax 2000..

    Well.. I decided to work on my “yes vocals” (thanks to modern sirens) and the door beeps when someone comes home.. So I thought “no worries” let it out, have fun..

    Well.. several vocal excerises later haha.. I hear someones foots in the hall.. I feel totally ALARMED. Totally SHOCKED and I jumped up.. and ran bath water.. (like that would throw off the noise) ( just out of panick.. hoping to confuse them haha.. I guess) then I look at myself in the mirror and laugh it off.. Put on a brave face walk into the living room and act liked nothing happened..

    My roomie luckily just walked in then. So, I thought maybe I was safe.. She tells me the party was boring so her and her boyfriend came home early! (sarcastic: grrrrrreat) I ever so casually say.. ohhh so you just walked in? (to confirm) As I slip the battery back in the remote.. ever so causally. And she’s ya..
    I ask where her boyfriend was? Hoping he was still outside.. But, no he comes around the hall way.. brushing his teeth, looks at me and turns immediately around..

    lol….. Ummmmmmmm ya! So much for my personal date night! hahaha. I feel mortified.. but, say-la-vi.. oh well.. 🙂

  454.  #454Simply Shannon on June 12, 2010 at 7:11 am

    Lorelei: #451 – I LOVE the “invite them to dinner” tool. That’s amazing! I will be trying that one.

    Alicia: I would feel embarrassed too. Ack! I know it’s your roomie’s beau but I bet he’ll never look at you the same again. 🙂 I’m going to try “yes vocals” very soon! I am normally so quiet (have kids so kind of a necessity), but I want to try this. Thank you!

  455.  #455tallgirl10 on June 12, 2010 at 9:03 am

    So, my party was really fun. Sadly, there were not men for CD, other than some married ones to talk to.

    I feel sad and anxious. I also feel strong and hopeful.

    Now with my new attitude, I am struggling. I know I should not want someone who is not acting like they are into me. And I also in my head am leaning towards text man, who has only given the me the crumb of engaging to my text.

    Do I wan a relationship based on texts? Texts that I started. No! It feels icky.

    I tried to end the exchange with a have a fun night! Of course he responded with a short response. That then puts me in the never ending text hell.

    So I am not going to respond. Which feels icky, but feels less icky than getting into a never ending text chat where I would ask him to call me.

    He knows where to find me. This feels so sad, but like giving up is the way to go.

    I want a relationship with:
    A. Good communication that is consistent
    B. Is growing
    C. Is with someone who does not run further away when we get closer

    Texting crumbs are not enough. I will not pretend that they are, and I won’t engage.

    It is scary to say goodbye in this way, on my own, to myself.

  456.  #456Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 9:12 am

    Lorelei – Thank you so much for sharing your scary feelings tool. I wasn’t resisting the scary feelings, I was wallowing in them. But I practiced what you said and everything dissipated right away. It was great! I just looked back at all the feelings I had written and visualized them – it was really easy. Panic was this big black hole that wouldn’t even fit at the table. So I graciously invited it in anyway and put it on the couch. (It was a little big for the couch, too). So I may need to have another visit with panic. I feel like he’s comfortably (well… semi-comfortably) ensconced on the couch and I’ll just keep re-visiting until we get more comfortable with one another.
    And drain was a big black, well, drain. Like a black vortex with a drain at the bottom. Not nearly so big as panic.
    This was so helpful! Thank you so much!

  457.  #457tallgirl10 on June 12, 2010 at 9:13 am

    I won’t take crumbs, and turn them into diamonds in my head.

    I feel sad.

  458.  #458Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 9:15 am

    What was really interesting to me is how the different emotions felt as I invited them in. Anxiety was a little guy with TONS of energy – hopping around all over the place.
    I invited the good emotions in too, so there were huge differences between all of them.
    I feel great and slept restfully. Thank you again!

  459.  #459Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 9:17 am

    Tallgirl – Did you CD anyway?

    That is my big challenge right now. I CD every time I remember to. I’m just not very good at finding the message yet.

    Like the guy at the gas station. We always chat warmly, but I’m not sure what I’m supposed to be getting out of it. He’s nice though. It would feel creepy to go on a real date with him, but I CD with him anyway!

  460.  #460Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 9:19 am

    Tallgirl – I feel interested about your saying goodbye to yourself…

    What is going on with that feeling?

  461.  #461Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 9:19 am

    By “going on” I mean, where is it coming from? How does this feel like saying goodbye to yourself?

  462.  #462Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 10:06 am

    Lucy re: #385

    There’s a guy on POF who won’t leave me along who’s 45. I’d be happy to refer him to you…. (?)

    I kid. Seriously, does any one know what to do in situations like this. He feels off to me. I don’t know if it’s just because I know he’s looking for a serious relationship… I am too. Just not with him. But he is persistent. He’s one of those guys who says he doesn’t want kids – I told him in a feeling message all of this stuff. That it feels bad thinking about going out with him because he seems to be looking for a serious relationship, but doesn’t want kids and that I do want kids. Of course, he gives me the standard “I would consider it with the right person.” So I told him, “I don’t believe in trying to change a person, so if you say you don’t want kids, I would feel weird even dating you.” He won’t leave it alone.

    What am I supposed to be learning from these persistent guys who I’m CDing who are wanting a serious relationship but are NOTHING like what I’m looking for in a relationship? I’m flexible, I’m open-minded – they don’t have to be ideal… but these guys are nothing like what I’m looking for.

    I feel uncomfortable CDing guys who make it obvious they’re looking for a serious relationship, but I went on a date with one anyway and now despite the fact that I’ve told him – in feeling messages, that he’s moving too fast, he still isn’t backing off.

    Is this just all about boundaries? Hmm…. I’m having a hard time getting them to hear me and respect my boundaries, so… I guess I’ll get a little more tenacious myself. MY boundaries! Back off!

    Does that sound about right to anyone? (Not my response, but the message I’m supposed to be getting from these guys?)

  463.  #463Lucy on June 12, 2010 at 11:02 am

    Sweetpea, that was happening to me all the time for several months — I really had to get kinda “mean” to them cuz they just weren’t getting the picture.

    But hey, you can give me 45’s user name on pof and I’ll check him out!

  464.  #464Lucy on June 12, 2010 at 11:03 am

    “I won’t take crumbs, and turn them into diamonds in my head.”

    One girl’s crumb is another girl’s diamond.

  465.  #465Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 11:22 am

    Siena – So I just need to reiterate? I feel like giving in, but that feels bad to me. That’s why I’m thinking my message is boundaries. I feel acquiescent right now. That feels strange to me – not my normal MO.

    What is your opinion then on what I should tell the guy who I have been out with? Right now, I just want to tell him I feel unheard and…. NEXT! He probably won’t listen to that either, so should I get that adamant and just see if I end up needing to reinforce my boundaries?

    Thanks for your help on this Siena. Are you wanting 45s name to see if he creeps you too? A second opinion would be great. I’m not interested. So if you’d like to chat with him, that would be great too…. 🙂

    Going to get his name right now!

  466.  #466Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 11:24 am

    Siena – He’s 1koolv2.

  467.  #467Lorelei on June 12, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    Dear Sweetpea

    I’m delighted that you like this visualization of feelings and found it useful too.

    It’s amazing how the heart produces just the right pictures of stuff for us. When I was trying to befriend the giant Sorrow, he/it was like a huge black stone statue, massive, frozen and unmoving. Gradually it was more like a big ice statue starting to melt. Then finally all the ice melted, revealing a little girl in a black dress. The really weird but nice thing is that all the ice-melt became a kind of sea or massive pool. And all my personified feelings can swim about, play and splash about in it! It’s become part of the original welcome home meal deal, and an apparently permanent part of my heart’s fixtures and fittings!!!

    This all took 5 or 6 weeks to watch the change – and was often extremely painful, but it got a kind of momentum of its own, and I knew I just had to keep faith that something would change as I kept welcoming. I think I even said to Sorrow that there was no rush.

    I always feel such amazing relief when another feeling, part of me, comes home – like relief after estrangement and reconciliation. The heart really does have its wisdom, doesn’t it?

  468.  #468Lorelei on June 12, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Hi everyone – I’ve been practicing baby baby feeling messages – like:
    – I feel so relaxed in the sunshine
    – This food tastes so good
    – I want to / would prefer to do x
    – I love being here, I feel happy/peaceful listening to the birds etc etc.

    But – heavier stuff, heavier and potentially more threatening feelings and wants/don’t wants are coming in this marriage.

    The question is this:
    Do I only start to unzip and say, e.g. I feel very confused by . . ./ very disturbed that . . very lonely and unheard / neglected / silenced . . etc etc, IN RESPONSE to some kind of enquiry from him, even if he just asks about my day? So then I give feelings not facts.

    Or, do I volunteer the feelings-information when he doesn’t ask or seem interested? – which seems like initiating and leaning forward, now I think about it.

    Do I ever say “I feel . . ‘ even without an enquiry, when I’m about to start crying, or already crying. because I feel so sad and so bad?

  469.  #469Lucy on June 12, 2010 at 12:42 pm

    Sweetpea! I emailed 1koolv2! I just wrote “Hi there :)”


    He emailed back:

    I am psyched that you would say hi to me; as you seem to be a nice Christian lady; and to top it all preety.
    But let me ask if I may: Why?
    I mean; I smoke; smoke pot(Legal), I’m a devout atheist…I would imagine that a woman like you would run away from me as if she was on fire, lol

    LOL! Now what?????

  470.  #470Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Lucy! Lolol!!!!

    Now what? Holy crap! I don’t know. I can’t even figure out what to do with him myself!

    That is so hilarious though!

  471.  #471Sweetpea on June 12, 2010 at 12:53 pm

    Lorelei – Wow! A little girl in a black dress? That gave me goosebumps. I never imagined that panic would become something else – thought it would just dissipate into thin air.

    I love hearing about your feelings.

    As to the rest of it, I remember Rori saying to practice baby feeling messages such as you did. I think it’s great that you’re doing so. My opinion would be that saying “I feel bad or I feel sad” especially under those circumstances would be very authentic. I think part of using the tools is because we women often say we are feeling things that aren’t authentic. i.e. we say “I’m fine” when we’re mad – and it’s the authenticity that is such an attraction to men.

    Sounds like you’re doing great. The rest of it is just doing as you feel more comfortable with it.

  472.  #472Karen on June 12, 2010 at 1:09 pm

    I’m new to this site. I did 3 of Rory’s cd’s and posted my story last night but I can’t find my post anywhere so I will see if this one gets posted.

    Any advice for circular dating for single, working Moms? My first priority is to raise my 5 year old son. I work a good 50 hours a week and there is not much time for him let alone going out with 3 different men a week! Or finding the time to actually meet these men. I find that I have to schedule dates so far in advance that the men usually disappear by the time we are about to confirm and go out. This is getting very discouraging.