How To Find Lost Things

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rori orange 3The great thing about being present is that you can see things you don’t usually see.

For instance,here I am in the morning, standing in front of my dresser, putting on my clothes to go walk my dog Zeke… All of a sudden I see something on the dresser top that I’ve lost.

A pair of scissors. I was looking for it last night. And there it is…

Because I wasn’t looking for it… I didn’t see it.

How can that be? It was right smack in front of my face.

Because I wasn’t looking at anything.

I was living my life it’s in the vicinity of the dresser in my head. Seeing nothing.

And this morning I decided to stand there being there.

I see my glass of water and instead of just passing over it I drink it.

And then I see the bracelets hanging on the little bracelet rack.

And then I see all the colors. And then I see that purple thing that’s the handle of the scissors.

I look at that dresser top so many times a day… But I really don’t see anything.

I assume I know what’s on that dresser top. I assume I know it. So I don’t really see it. It’s sort of “I’ve it once I don’t need to see it again…”

This sound familiar?

Is it’s what is happening in your love life?

Are you seeing a man over and over and over again and not really seeing him at all?

Try this: really be where you are and open your eyes.

What’s new? What’s different?

Stand somewhere, or sit somewhere you often are – and open your eyes like it’s the first time you’ve ever opened them…

Let me know what you see!

Love, Rori



Posted in


  1.  #1Mary on November 6, 2015 at 9:20 am

    Good morning!
    I posted for the first time on the other thread, sharing my situation with my guywho has had to move due to military transfer. We are struggling with the distance and not seeing each other. I made plans up in my head to visit him, but he had other thoughts about it which I failed to consider…I was so upset at first and felt he was pushing me away…but when I really looked at the situation and opened my eyes, I saw that he wasn’t rejecting me. His reluctance had everything to do with the pain of being together and then being apart again and his feeling of being a “piece of dirt” because he couldn’t afford to pay my way to visit (although I could pay for myself, he wouldn’t let me)…unfortunately, before my eyes opened, I got very upset and told him I didn’t think this was going to work. He still wants me to find an job and move closer. It’s confusing but I think I am slowly able to SEE that he does care, just in a different way than I might want!

  2.  #2Femininewoman on November 6, 2015 at 9:21 am


  3.  #3Femininewoman on November 6, 2015 at 9:24 am

    hehe sometimes I wonder if it is the myelin sheets in my brain that is wearing down why I “lose” things

  4.  #4Indigo on November 6, 2015 at 9:51 am


    I think it’s lovely that you have choices here 🙂

  5.  #5IamHis on November 6, 2015 at 10:52 am

    Love this post. Feels super deep, but also practical and helpful…

  6.  #6heroine on November 6, 2015 at 7:27 pm

    Tears! I cant post 🙁 – all my comments are awaiting moderation and I could really use this blog right now

  7.  #7heroine on November 6, 2015 at 7:28 pm

    All my comments are awaiting moderation – I think I tried to sign up for Rori’s newsletters using the wrong email but for some reason this wrong email is ok to post – so im using it just to ask someone to Please allow my comments

  8.  #8heroine on November 6, 2015 at 7:33 pm

    I leaned forward Alot again this week with regards to Dude
    I just let myself loose – i feel embarassed I feel free I feel rebellious yes I wrote him apologising …and sharing my day and oh god invited him to stuff lol (I was drinking wine at the time). – He ignored it all …well u need to see for yourself what doesn’t work right? I feel defeated with regards to him and just wanna forget about that for now

    Also – I went on a date with a guy – GoodFoodCd …I didnt feel attracted to him but the restaurant was really nice.

  9.  #9heroine on November 6, 2015 at 7:45 pm

    Thank you Indigo and Dixie for the comments in the thread…

    Indigo – I’m not trying to get him back – like in a real way…I know I need to lean back in order for him to learn forward but I don’t care enough…I’m kind of experimenting with being the Jilted Lover a bit…it feels bad but it feels different …leaning back feels worst right now…I don’t know why…

  10.  #10heroine on November 6, 2015 at 7:53 pm

    Anyway I’m not going to bother anymore….I mean I tried…I said I was sorry…if he doesn’t want to talk to me what can I do? I am tired of feeling frustrated.

  11.  #11Nanceen on November 6, 2015 at 11:32 pm

    Hello, anyone around?

  12.  #12Indigo on November 6, 2015 at 11:59 pm

    I am going to try and give myself a really relaxing, recharging weekend this weekend. I have bought a therapeutic adult colouring book and I’m looking forward to trying it out.

  13.  #13heroine on November 7, 2015 at 12:43 am

    Sounds nice Indigo

  14.  #14Turquoise on November 7, 2015 at 7:21 am

    Hi sirens…. Last night I went to dinner and a movie with my sister and a friend. It felt so nice to get out, have a nice dinner and talk… We are all single… So many similar things happening… And the New Bradley Cooper movie Burnt, was really good. That man has some sexy blue eyes… And the story was about what happens after his life crashed down and how he built it back up. When I got home I was still in a Bradley Cooper mood, so I watched Silver Linung Playbook, and my favorite line was when he said, the world will break your heart 10 different ways to Sunday… And it kinda hit me, heartbreak is part of life. Stop trying to avoid it, stop feeling like a failure because it’s happened… Make the best of it, learn from it… Accept the pain that comes, and then open yourself up to it all over again.
    I see it now… What’s holding me back is my fear of getting hurt again. As soon as I have doubt I start to feel like it couldn’t be meant to be, my new love story wouldn’t be happening this way… I question and worry… And doubt. I think about the future and what’s happening next instead of loving the moment I am in. Feels good to reflect on this today!!!
    Now I’m off to make breakfast for my beautiful girl, do some cleaning, take her to get her nails done, maybe do a little shopping… Pick up my other beautiful girl from her friends… Help get my oldest ready for a dance, host having her friends over and then off to a candle party with some great ladies. I may even see if some friends are going out tonight to meet up for a drink later. I want to enjoy every minute of today.

    And about this post… It reminds me that what I need, is right there… I’m just not seeing it. Look to myself first for what I need. Open my eyes to what I have.

  15.  #15Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 7:42 am

    Im feeling disappointed. Remember that conversation I posted in the other thread, where the guy was saying how sad he was to be stuck in Alabama and not able to see me yesterday? Well, I looked at tinder today and you can see how many miles away someone is. It showed that he was online 11 hrs ago (so last night) and that he was only 11 miles away, which is where he lives. When hes in another state it will show him as hundreds or thousands of miles away.

    Im not sure if I should say anything or not, but its bugging me. He was only going to be in town that one night anyway. I just feel mistrustful and not sure how to approach that without being blamey. We havent known each other long, but its still a lie. Ugh.

  16.  #16Azure Blu on November 7, 2015 at 8:27 am

    This is just me…
    But I think it is good you found out where he really was (only 11 mi away)
    BUT it is VERY early in the dating…
    For ME – It is NONE of any dates business – in the beginning – if I choose to make up excuses
    cause’ i’m not really wanting to see them at that time…

    THIS is a good reminder to you
    Don’t get attached this EARLY
    YES do keep CDing – at least 2 others –
    and turn him down the next time he says
    he’s in town…
    It will help YOU get a better perspective
    AND raises your degree of difficulty
    Right now that’s what he has
    “his degree of difficulty”

    You’re doing great!!!

  17.  #17Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 8:37 am

    Thanks Azure. That is good advice. I’m disappointed because he went seemingly way out of his way to tell me how “sad” he was. If he didn’t want to see me, (and maybe its because I told him I’d be on my period and he knew we wouldn’t have sex) I wish he’d been less “fake” about it. I don’t know if a confrontation about it would be a good idea, but it does kind of drop my respect for him down a little, and make me wonder if he’s lying about other things.

  18.  #18Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 8:44 am

    Just that he said he was “so sad” he couldn’t see me and that it was the “highlight” he’d been looking forward to. Such bullshit! It makes me feel angry and vengeful. Like next time he wants to see me I will be “so sad” that I can’t make it. Boo- hoo!

  19.  #19Azure Blu on November 7, 2015 at 8:59 am

    I’ve said those very same things to CDs whom
    i would really like to see
    I would say…”So sad I can’t see you”
    AND meant it…
    BUT i really don’t want to see them that much
    Or I have another date…
    feeling overwhelmed… need a little break
    I’m sure you’ve done the same…
    HE is giving YOU a big “heads up”

    A gentle reminder, darling Siren…
    IT’s early in your CDing
    with him…
    Rori mentions that when we feel angry toward a CD
    it is usually because we have “given” too much
    Put too much of OUR feelings into a relationship…

    !!!!Keep CDing others!!!!

    I think your instincs are VERY correct…
    Watch out for this guy… He’s used to getting
    whatever he wants…
    But it doesn’t mean you can’t be a warm invitation
    as long as you keep YOUR boundaries

    For me it is important to
    Keep learning the Rori way (YOU are rockin’ the tools!!!)
    Practice with him… (free therapy)
    The whole time…Raising your dignity, Your self worth!

  20.  #20Azure Blu on November 7, 2015 at 9:02 am

    I think this is from Rori…
    This has transformed my life…

    “So – here’s how to do Dignity without going “cold”:

    1. Lean back. Pull your energy back into yourself from wherever it is.
    That means – if you’re thinking about a man – stop, and focus on your insides, how you feel, the knot in your stomach.
    If you’re remembering and reliving a painful moment with a man – notice you’re doing it, and pull the energy away from the image and back to your body – your shoulders, your heart, your pelvis. Pull the energy back into you. Now…

    2. Imagine you’re a fairy princess, or a goddess, or an angel or a warrior or a queen, and that you’re made of gold and diamonds. Imagine the heaviness of your golden, diamond-covered self.

    Let the weight of you sink into the floor.
    Let yourself feel your substance,
    your emotional and energetic importance,
    how you matter,
    how you’re grounded in the earth,
    how important it is that you are where you are,
    that you exist. Now…

    3. Breathe.
    Experience what it feels like to be so important and dignified.
    What it feels like to be responsible for yourself.
    What it feels like to know you can count on yourself, no matter what.
    Imagine what Dignity feels like.
    Imagine others looking at you,
    in your gold and diamonds,
    in your substance and importance,
    and imagine them ADMIRING YOU.

    Experience what it feels like to feel dignified while you are being admired,
    and keep breathing.
    If you feel yourself starting to float away or emotionally go away,
    don’t fight it,
    just sink into yourself and the earth even more deeply.
    Sink into your pelvis,
    and feel the weight of you in the center of your body, in your pelvis. Now…

    4. As fairy princess, goddess, angel,
    warrior, queen, with emotional weight
    and important substance…
    practice this feeling of Dignity
    all throughout the day.

    Whatever happens that would normally throw you off – unpleasant feelings,
    anything anyone else does or says in your presence – let it go through you –
    take it in, breathe, and do this Tool.

    You are dignified.
    Settle into yourself.
    Settle into your Dignity.”

  21.  #21Dixie on November 7, 2015 at 9:26 am


    I love Azure Blu’s advice to bring the focus back to you, your happiness, your magnetic qualities.

    Its been mentioned so many times here, but try not to put yourself into his head, as in wondering “why” he didn’t tell you. It doesn’t matter.

    Turn, face the beautiful day ahead, do something that makes you feel alive, and remember, “like attracts like.”

    Someone posted that wonderful article about the Law of Attraction being like an all-inclusive resort…. Focus only on what you want. ….

    Azure, about raising that degree of difficulty…. I remember when I first met my ex- husband, I was in the middle of university finals and told him he would have to wait after exams were over to call me! I’m laughing now, because I loved that laser-focus concentration in myself, and he loved it too, even when he had to wait….

    Ohhh, what just popped up in that when I am laser-focused on a project, or work, raising my degree of difficulty without even intending to, that’s when D. often tell me how inspired he is by me…. hmmmm. On that note, back to my marking now!

  22.  #22Indigo on November 7, 2015 at 9:33 am


    Wow, after feeling triggered by Facebook this week, and making up my mind about not “going there” so I don’t hurt and trigger myself unnecessarily, I am SO glad that I don’t have Tinder.

    Reading your post just affirmed my decision and my feelings on this. If you would like to know what they are, here they are:

    If you guys were in an exclusive relationship my answer would be different. My personal opinion is:

    * STAY AWAY from his Tinder profile, and his online dating profile for that matter. This is snooping. I remember you did this with S, and what did it ever get you but heartbreak and pain and massive triggering? Dominique has a whole article about this (hers is about Facebook but I’d say it still applies).

    * Staying away from looking at his profile is not to give him a free pass, it’s to spare you unnecessary heartbreak. I’ve found that if you “look” or “snoop” thinking to find something, you will. It’s only a matter of time before you catch him doing or saying something that will trigger you and if you can’t handle it, it really is best to not go there.

    * That said, I think it is a little bit off that he told you he was in Alabama when he is in fact home, but you don’t know why he did this. His reasons could be, and probably were, more benign than what you are imagining.

    * For me, the takeaway from this scenario would not be THAT he lied, but why he lied. Why did he feel he wanted to cancel our date, and why did he feel he couldn’t be direct with me about it? Again, the answer is probably as benign as – he is unsure about you for whatever reason, but still wants to keep you as an option to see if he might want to pursue you in the future. He came up with an excuse that spared your feelings and kept the door open for him in the future.

    * You are just dating. Don’t say anything, and don’t make a big deal of it, either to him or to yourself. Don’t make it mean more than it is. You are both still unattached so act like it! Just observe him and be light and fun. Date other guys and stay away from his Tinder profile 🙂

  23.  #23Azure Blu on November 7, 2015 at 9:48 am

    Indigo #21
    As Usual
    SPOT ON!!!
    So well put!! love it!

  24.  #24Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 10:55 am

    Lovergirl – my opinion is he didn’t go out of his way to tell you. He just told you. My hunch is that you have set up a dynamic that he comes to you for sex. You warned him ahead of time that he would not be able to get it. So why would he come.

    That was the first thing that struck me when you wrote about him not coming but I decided to not be the Debbie Downer raining on your party so didn’t say what I sensed.

    Men love sex and at the end of the day if that is what they are looking for it is what they will go after. After an 8 hour marathon why would he go after no sex? Plus after that kind of marathon he could likely be filled up and looking for new adventure. I really feel compelled to encourage you to really look at the message that you might be putting out there when interacting with these men. If you want to focus on one and only one it seems to me that you are looking for commitment but these guys don’t seem to be hearing that from you.

  25.  #25Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 10:59 am

    Ahhh Azure thank you thank you thank you 🙂 for posting that about Dignity. I so needed that reminder.

  26.  #26Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:09 am

    RE 16 – I believe that is spot on. Remember words don’t mean as much to guys as they mean to us women. Their brains are just wired differently. They also don’t like the intensity of sad feelings so they will just turn right around and do the next best thing on their radar that will make them happy. If that means sex with another woman, for them :it is just sex. Especially if they are not emotionally invested. It is almost like playing basketball.

    Again with a guy actions speak louder than words. Especially if on the first few dates you don’t lead him down the route where he will share the truth about himself because they will tell you if you know how to ask. You just have to pay attention and believe them.

  27.  #27Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 11:10 am

    Thanks Azure, Dixie, Indigo. It’s hard to feel “warm” towards him right now. I feel let down, mistrustful and unsafe. I’m very triggered.

    The last time we were together, after sex, we were lying in bed watching an episode of “Catfished”. There was this guy on there that had “fallen in love” with some girl he had never met, and turns out she had been lying to him about a lot of things. He had also almost ruined a relationship with his live in girlfriend over it.

    Well the guy I was with was commenting on the stupidity of it all and saying how anyone that would lie about one thing would lie about other things and that he can’t stand people that lie. He was shaking his head at it all and talking about how he’s all about being upfront and honest about everything.

    So now, I’m feeling worried that he might be lying about other things- like being single. If he’ll lie to me about that, could he be married? I haven’t been to his house. The first time he said he got a hotel because his sister was watching his daughter at his house. He said his daughter is scared of his sister’s dogs.

    Okay, well, that’s believable enough but the next time he just commented that he had had a meeting there at the Sheraton before we met up. I kind of wondered about it because he had just come in from the airport that day and I figured his daughter might still be with her mom, yet he got a hotel room. I didn’t ask that time though.

    I know he lives here because I looked up his address, but I can’t find any indication that he is married. He says women think that sometimes, because he travels, but that he is single. Now I’m feeling leery.

    Anyway, I know obsessing isn’t good, I just hate being “tricked”. I’m not that trusting I guess. I’m always second guessing men’s intentions but so often they prove themselves to be liars.

    I know this isn’t a big lie, it’s maybe to spare my feelings, I don’t know. Maybe he just didn’t want to waste his one night here with me since we couldn’t have sex. I don’t know. I’m going to try and think of other things and focus on myself, like suggested, but it is hard.

  28.  #28Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 11:15 am


    I’m worried about that too. Maybe I screwed it up by telling him I would be on my period. He acted like that didn’t matter though and said that’s okay, we don’t have to have sex, we can go out to dinner! I was all happy that he said that too, but maybe he doesn’t like me for more than sex. 🙁 I’m not sure if there is any way to turn that around now. He did wait 4 dates before trying to sleep with me. I’m so confused! Ugh.

  29.  #29Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 11:17 am

    Also, part of the reason I warned him that I wouldn’t be having sex with him was because I wanted to see his reaction. I wanted to see if he would still want to see me. He ACTED like he did, but then he made up an excuse.

  30.  #30Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:19 am

    A confrontation would be only giving him confirmation to drop you out of his rotation, especially if it is only a test. Guys do test women. For argument sake if he was at home he could have chosen to be alone because he just didn’t want to see anyone. We all get that way sometimes, I believe. He might’ve been tired and just wanted to decompress. My assumption about his comment about you being a champ was that it was a subliminal suggestion that it kinda stretched his limits or that he can’t keep up. Or he could have been worried that he might not be able to satisfy you. It could have been any number of things but I believe putting it out there that you were on your period could have been a message that he took to mean he is kinda off the hook so he can relax. Creating a confrontation could goad him into throwing the period thing in your face. “You said you were on your period meaning down bother to come”. I’d say he’s just another man living his life so leave the confrontation thing alone and live your life.

  31.  #31Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:22 am

    RE 28 – So Lovergirl that would you testing him. So he is also entitled to test you, that being the case. This is the way how people unconsciously get in power struggles when negotiating the terms of their relationships rather than just choosing consciously and speaking their truth.

  32.  #32Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:25 am

    RE 27 Even if that is true is that so bad? Why wouldn’t any man like you for sex anyway? My opinion is that it is only a lesson. You have to decide what lesson you want to take from it and see if it is worth your while trying to turn it around or walking away.

  33.  #33Lovergirl on November 7, 2015 at 11:30 am


    Of course he is going to like me for sex, but I don’t want him to NOT like me UNLESS we are having sex. 🙁 How do I turn this around at this point?

  34.  #34Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:32 am

    Lovergirl even if he is lying it would be neither here nor there if you hadn’t slept with him. I think you have sex with guys a lot easier than many of the women on this site because of your experience. Again I think you have to get clear on what you want. If you want a committed relationship you might want to think about waiting longer than 4 dates, waiting longer than 3 months before considering going there. You already know that you are okay with sex. You already know that you are good at sex. There really is not much there to learn or to prove anything to anyone. Except to yourself that you can hold off having sex for a longer period of time. Hold off until you can get a guy emotionally invested to the point where he does want to stick around, where he does want to please you, where he does only want to have sex with you only. You have nothing to lose by holding off on having sex. All that will happen is that guys disappear if that is what they are after. You have enough evidence already that you are very attractive to guys. They will always flock to you like bees to honey.

  35.  #35Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:38 am

    Set your intention for what you want honey and go for it. Hold your boundaries and go for it. A few weeks ago all you wanted was S. Now you are sounding is like all you want is this guy. Yet you don’t know much about him to conclusively say he is single. Have you asked him if he is married? How about looking for more guys to date and try asking them if they are married depending on where the conversation is going? The more guys you date the more you attraction factor increases. There are a lot of millionaires out there, he is only one of the pack. There are a lot of guys out there that want you to make them drool over you. He is not the only fish in the sea and you have to believe that if you reeled this one in you can do it again. Get back out there an practice. That is the same advice I give myself and the same advice I give my daughter. Take your focus off the one and focus on the big wide Universe.

  36.  #36Femininewoman on November 7, 2015 at 11:44 am

    Also Lovergirl you can’t screw up jackshit because truly, you don’t have him anyway. And what could you screw up after giving him good sex. In any event he got some awesome sex and if that’s what he’s about he would be the biggest jackass on the planet to give that up for uncertainty, especially if you have been treating him well and have him feeling good about himself. That would be the icing on the cake that any man would want. Let him decide if he is a jackass.

  37.  #37heroine on November 7, 2015 at 12:04 pm

    I hung out with friends and I called my family…i feel happy and peaceful right now ….i feel calm and sleepy and blissful…
    Grateful for these love moments

  38.  #38Sweetpea on November 7, 2015 at 12:36 pm

    FW @ 35 –
    Fantastic advice! I love it:

    “Let him decide if he is a jackass.” 🙂

  39.  #39Lilybelly on November 7, 2015 at 1:01 pm

    I’m a bit surprised Tinder shows someones location all the time in the form of how many miles tgey arexaway from you right now. Distance, as in lives this far away, but not on a moment by moment basis. Ick. If that was me, I’d totally not allow tracking. Ick.

  40.  #40Dixie on November 7, 2015 at 6:28 pm

    FW…. Just popping in to say how much I loved your words on this thread!

    Thank you for sharing your insights! Honestly, it feels like hearing from a grounded, sage friend.

  41.  #41IamHis on November 7, 2015 at 7:10 pm

    I feel embarrassed writing this, but feedback would feel great.

    B, the guy from work that I really liked , the one that sexually assaulted me and then lied to me in writing when I finally got the courage to confront him two months later, was back at work this week.

    & in a flash of anger, just enough to give me the courage I needed, he was walking past me & I followed him. And I said “B, I’m not good with words either, but I’m sorry I sexually assaulted you and then lied about it. That’s what you say….”

    And he just said, ok.

    And then we worked together like two adults should.

  42.  #42IamHis on November 7, 2015 at 7:14 pm

    It felt so scary, but I’m so proud of myself. I shouldn’t have to follow him for him to apologize to me. I shouldn’t have to do anything.

    Was it slightly awkward? Yes.
    Did it feel scary?

  43.  #43IamHis on November 7, 2015 at 7:16 pm

    Feedback would feel so good. I feel embarrassed and shy, but also really proud.

  44.  #44Indigo on November 7, 2015 at 11:47 pm

    Lilybelly 38,

    I agree. I am flabbergasted that Tinder allows you to see how far away a person is from you at all times. Seems like a breeding ground for stalkers and possessive people.

    In fact, just rethinking Lovergirl’s situation: I would feel totally icky if I had to justify my location to someone I was just dating. That is my business as far as I’m concerned. If I don’t want to see someone for whatever reason I will occasionally make up an excuse to spare their feelings. Them being able to verify the veracity of my reason would feel like a total invasion. That’s just me though.

  45.  #45Indigo on November 7, 2015 at 11:52 pm

    Facebook and Whatsapp are bad enough. Now you can track someone’s whereabouts as well? Is there no mystery any more?

    I am all about timing. And some things just need timing to unfold. I am coming more and more to the conclusion that trust and faith is where it’s at. Getting caught up in all sorts of reasons that may or may not be the highest truth just doesn’t serve us I believe.

  46.  #46Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 12:01 am

    Femininewoman- he has told me that women often think he is married, or accuse him of being married because he travels all the time but that he is “totally single”. I like him but I wouldn’t say he is “all I want”. I still love S. Just trying to get past him. We haven’t seen each other in 5 months. I’m still seeing RadioCD and some others occasionally.

  47.  #47Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 12:09 am


    Tinder shows where people are at, because that’s how you are supposed to meet them, if they are in your vicinity. Anyway, it’s not always 100% accurate either. I think the millionaire guy even told me once that a woman thought he was somewhere other than where he really was because Tinder was showing him as being in a different place, due to him traveling so much. So, it is possible that it is a mistake. Unlikely perhaps, but possible.

    I haven’t said anything because I don’t like being accusatory and also because I maybe shouldn’t have been checking up on him, but my gut feeling was that I wanted to make sure he was where he said he was. I guess I’ve been lied to so many times by men that I’m not that trusting.

    I wouldn’t want someone following me around, but if I was lying about being in a completely different state, well, I mean, that is not like 11 miles vs 20 miles away. It might be a few miles off, but not so likely to be several hundred off, I wouldn’t think, especially on a day he would have come back if he wasn’t “stuck”.

    Sure there are a million excuses I could make for him but I don’t know if THAT is healthy. Like I could say oh, well maybe he thought he was going to be there and ended up coming home and just didn’t feel like rescheduling with me AGAIN. Its possible. I don’t know.

    I’ve only seen him on 5 dates…the first few we didn’t have sex but the 4th and 5th we did. Possibly there was another date in there that I forgot about.

    Anyway, maybe its bad to “look” but I also don’t want to be duped.

  48.  #48Starla on November 8, 2015 at 12:28 am

    Iamhis, I won’t even think about whether you “did good” or not. That question is not even a thing. He assaulted you and then acted really unbelievable about it. You do not need to be second guessing your own self and feelings and reactions. Period. This wasnt your fault and you’re not crazy and that’s that. He is a crazy maker gas lighter and there’s nothing wrong with you and no “appropriate ” handling you must be careful to do.

    Fxck that guy fxck that guy fxck him for being such a dxuche that you are here asking if you voiced yourself in the right way.

  49.  #49Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 12:44 am


    I totally hear you. I still “snoop” – not by violating anyone’s trust but check on a guy’s public information, from time to time. I just don’t like the way *I* feel when I do it. Like I said, it’s not about giving them a free pass – I’ve spoken about this before, but for me because of my sensitivity I can usually tell long before I do any kind of snooping the level of rightness and trustworthiness of a guy. I just don’t like that sinking feeling I get when I snoop and I “find” something, which may or may not mean anything. It’s all about me and me taking care of myself.

    This is why I think it’s really important to let a guy unfold naturally and to keep things in perspective… it’s really the only way to tell if a guy is right for you. When we snoop on someone we are just dating we are over-investing. That’s my opinion.

    Bush Boy told me that he would be really caught up in his new job and his new home for the next few weeks. Sure I could doubt that and say, “well, he could have found a few moments to email or text me” or “he could invite me up to come and see him, it HAS been 4 weeks since we last saw each other”, but where would that get me? His whatsapp activity does seem to suggest that he’s telling the truth, offline for long periods of time which probably means he’s out in the bush tracking wildlife. But mostly I just want to see how this unfolds with minimal interference from me.

    It feels better for me to just take a step back and get on with my own life.

  50.  #50Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 12:49 am

    Feminine Woman,

    Something you said to Lovergirl struck a chord with me. About how we say we want a committed relationship but to be careful of the message we’re sending out. Well, it occurred to me that yes, I do want a real relationship with my beloved. And I do not want to be used by a guy just for casual sex. Yet, I have been having sex with men whom I KNOW are not my future husband. So, what message am I sending out? Maybe I am contributing to keeping my beloved at bay by giving myself to men who are not right. Maybe I need to align my behaviour with my intention and my desire for my life a bit more.

    Food for thought.

  51.  #51Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 1:18 am

    As far as waiting months for sex, im not sure I could do that. Im very leery of any man who would tolerate months long dating without sex at my age. Im afraid hed be asexual like my ex husband. Plus, wjat if he was horrible in bed and id invested all that time in getting to know him? Good and frequent sex in a relationship is very important to me. I still want to be appreciated and loved for more than just sex, but I dont want a sexless relationship or a man who would be comfortable with that.

  52.  #52heroine on November 8, 2015 at 1:28 am

    My posts that were in moderation are missing from the threads…:(

  53.  #53heroine on November 8, 2015 at 1:29 am

    Rori never responded to me…I feel disappointed

  54.  #54Femininewoman on November 8, 2015 at 3:20 am

    Well Lovergirl you have to decide if you are going to have sex with these men that you will not get invested. 4 or 5 dates don’t make a relationship. Single guys who are worth their salt won’t allow a woman who they have dated a few times and who they are not emotionally invested to control their lives. They are gonna do what they want and assume you know what you are doing and are doing what you want. Regardless of what your reason is it is never a good sign to man that a woman would be snooping on him. If they live together he never has peace because the same woman will want to know his whereabouts every moment of the day. Men like their freedom.

  55.  #55IamHis on November 8, 2015 at 3:42 am

    @47 Starla – I am loving you so much right now! Thank you!!!

  56.  #56Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 4:49 am


    If other sirens have responded to you and helped you with good advice I have noticed Rori does not usually reply.

  57.  #57heroine on November 8, 2015 at 5:40 am

    Indigo – 🙂 awww but my posts have been deleted…that’s weird

  58.  #58Emerson on November 8, 2015 at 5:45 am

    Hello Sirens,
    Last night I went out of my comfort zone and went dancing with a new group of friends. Well I had too much to drink and I feel really bad about it.

    Nothing bad happened, but I am just embarrassed and angry with myself for being that way. I don’t drink often and I just got carried away.

    I ended up making out on the dance floor with one of the guys from the group like a couple of 20 year olds. I feel ridiculous now. Ugh.

  59.  #59BeLoved on November 8, 2015 at 6:39 am

    lovergirl – Is there something you’re avoiding feeling by focusing on this guy right now?

  60.  #60T-Girl on November 8, 2015 at 7:33 am

    Lillybelly (from other thread)

    Hubby is doing much better though still eating only very soft foods and that is still painful. He is snoring away right now, so I imagine he will be in some pain when he wakes up.

    Thanks for asking 🙂 How are things over there?

  61.  #61T-Girl on November 8, 2015 at 7:35 am

    Emerson – maybe last night you just needed to let go and feel spontaneous and free. I wouldn’t worry about it too much. I’m sure we have all done things like that in the past without much repercussion.

  62.  #62T-Girl on November 8, 2015 at 7:38 am

    Lovergirl, when I read your posts, I am thinking that “I hope she doesn’t get too invested in this one”. Maybe I’m reading too much into your words, but he sounds kind of playboyish to me and doesn’t have the life that allows a relationship right now. Can you continue to have fun with him but without any expectations?

  63.  #63Emerson on November 8, 2015 at 8:00 am

    60 Tgirl
    Thank you, yes that’s probably true.
    I’m going to make today a good day.
    I intend to take care of myself.
    I intend to be strong on the inside, soft on the outside.
    I intend to lean back. I intend to be gentle with myself.

  64.  #64Emerson on November 8, 2015 at 8:01 am

    I feel best when I trust my instincts. It is sometimes painful but my gut feeling is usually right.
    Go with your gut feeling.

  65.  #65Starla on November 8, 2015 at 8:12 am

    Sometimes the last location and last active data lies, I’ve noticed. It lags, especially when a user is using their mobile phone for the app or site. They stay logged in in the background and it isnt always sending back the right data to the app. For example, sometimes it says it’s been 1 week since my boyfriend has viewed a message on googlechat, but I just talked to him there. Or he will look active on fb but that’s just him logged in automatically.

    The moral of the story is not to check up on those things.

  66.  #66Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 9:08 am


    I’m not sure if any of you have read Helena Hart’s latest article

    but it touched me very deeply.

    This is SO me. I feel stuck and like I can’t quite get started when it comes to both my career, and especially my love life. I mean, I have all the wisdom and intellectual knowledge about what to do, but I’m not living these two areas in a way commensurate with my authentic nature and my true gifts. I’m filling them up with distractions and “fillers” of things and people I know are not a true fit, and then wondering why the love of my life is not able to come in. Huh. I need to start making some big changes. I can’t put it off any longer. I want to have my life mirror back to me the person I know I am in my heart.

  67.  #67Tee on November 8, 2015 at 10:01 am

    I have a question, is it “normal” for men to get all pissed off, defensive & retaliatory when you’ve inadvertently made them feel bad?

    Scenario: Our son is low on diapers. I asked my fiancé if he had $20. He said No.
    I accepted it but he couldn’t leave it at No. He starts saying that I should have asked earlier, I should know these things, I should get diapers and not coffee.

    I said Well, I could say the same thing about you. So I leave with our son to go get coffee. I come back maybe 45 minutes later, he’s allegedley taking a nap.

    Our son goes to play with him so my fiancé sees that I have coffee and he starts up again. He says, Did you get diapers?
    I said Did you? He said Something else so I said You can dish it but you can’t take it.

    He says, I can dish it all day & you’ll leave. I said No, YOU’LL leave. I don’t know that he said anything else after that.

    I’m really of the opinion that he feels like he messed up so he’s trying to make it my fault. He does this alot. I know that I shouldn’t have bought into the argument but it’s tough not to.

    All he had to do was say No and leave it alone. Days like this have me wondering if he’s even worth it

  68.  #68Helena Hart on November 8, 2015 at 12:21 pm

    Indigo – Thank you so much for sharing my article, I’m SO glad it resonated with you and I can definitely relate to what you wrote here. I hope you can make it to the free teleclass Leigha Lake and I are hosting tomorrow, we’re going to be talking about this very thing so it should be helpful for you:

    Love, Helena

  69.  #69Mandy on November 8, 2015 at 2:10 pm

    I feel SO absolutely raw and authentic.

    SOmetimes to feel your own authenticity something big and sometim es bad needs to happen.

    So I just woke up ou tof bed for the first time alone in my apartment. I had a wave of happiness that shortly turned into tears over what I’d been through, how hard I worked to get her and how much pain I’d suffered.

    I feel battered and bruised inside. I have taken so much abuse and swallowed it I didn’t realize there was no way in hell I could’ve fully taken care of myself with J and that’s easily why all of my problems and insecurities were ruling everything.

    First time dumping a boyfriend. First time living alone. First time being womanly as I ever have been.

    It’s easy to get stuck on WHAT HAPPENED.

    You know…what your ex did or whatever.
    I do not want to stay fixated on what J did or did not do and then have that be my demon with other men!!! I will not have my experience with J ruin my experince with others.

    Oh I went to a Comic Con event and I must’ve been talking with three male friends at once and they were just at my attention. I kind of felt like the Belle of the Ball. Two or three CDs were there and it was good. I also bought some local art from two guys I went to college with…massively talented. I dressed up as Tank Girl and went to Comic Con…Yes, us animators and artists are weird and we love it 🙂

    I just wanted to check in here with the blog because I am going through some seriously huge, quick waves of emotion. I was just sobbing a bit ago now I’m typing….it’s weird.

    But there’s no fear in the back of my mind, what hell is J going to put me through if I go and do this fun thing. That was THE WORST feeling in the whole world. It was like he was stealing time and energy away the whole time.

    I have got to get over what J pulled. I am going to need some coaching very seriously. I need a balance between thinking all guys want sex and fearing them not wanting it. It’s ridiculous.

    I don’t want to have an issue where I need sex and have to beg one of my CDs to come over. ICK. It’s nice if Valentine wants to see me. He’s the one obviously I’m intimate with. But I don’t want to be reduced to begging. That is something I would’ve done as a younger woman. It lowers your standards.

    So I’m wondering if the need isn’t purely physical. I’m wondering if there’s deeper digging I need to do to know this part of myself that is starved and practically begging for change it feels like. Someone to hug and talk to and just for a moment sit next to and cuddle. Maybe make me some tea or something.

    I want to learn what makes a woman satisfied inside herself. I know a few things to do, to care for myself, but it’s something I’m constantly working on.

    If anyone has hit on anything that really helps, please do tell me. Music helps me, exercise helps me, but I need more tools.

  70.  #70Mandy on November 8, 2015 at 2:15 pm

    By the way….

    Rori, Dominique, and all of the Sirens…

    THANK YOU from the BOTTOM of my heart for sticking with me. You are all my heros.

    I can’t count how many of you have stuck with me on this, constantly reminded me of myself, pushed me in this direction.

    Thank you for helping me dump a boyfriend for the first time…I know it sounds weird, but I needed it to happen to break the cycle of toxic attraction.


  71.  #71April Rose on November 8, 2015 at 5:10 pm


    What gifts do you have that you are perhaps a little shy about? (It’s just a question for you to ponder – I’m not asking you to bare your soul on the blog).

    I ask this because I totally relate to the ‘shrinking’ that Helena writes about in the article. I have gifts and talents that I know I have and yet I feel in some way secretive and maybe even afraid of them. Or afraid to show them. Maybe even a fear of being big, or being successful!

  72.  #72Helena Hart on November 8, 2015 at 5:43 pm

    April Rose – I agree that that’s a fantastic question to ask yourself, and I can totally relate to what you said about being afraid of your gifts (or of expressing them).

    It’s extremely common to be afraid to “go towards” your gifts because they sometimes require you to be more visible, which means they can open you up to receive more feedback or perhaps more responsibility.

    If you’re able to come to one of the free teleclasses Leigha and I are doing tomorrow, we would LOVE to talk with you about this to help you get some clarity on what your gifts are and how you can start using them in service to your life’s purpose.

    Love, Helena

  73.  #73Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 6:39 pm

    Calling it “snooping” just doesn’t feel right to me. I dont think I did anything wrong. Its public info and not like I went digging around through anyones private stuff. It doesnt feel right to just excuse a boldfaced lie either. I feel like I should be wary and maybe “snoop” more to make sure hes not married. Id feel naive just brushing it off with oh, well, its just a little white lie. Its really not. He went out of his way to tell me how “terrible” it is that he is “stuck” in Alabama and how “sad” it makes him. It seems like an elaborate amount of bullshitting, which suggests he is attempting to play me. I feel justified in being wary.

    He doesnt ACT like a playboy at all. He acts like a nice, sweet, good guy. He waited 4 dates to even try to kiss me. Hes been very polite and acts all excited about me. He schedules the dates way ahead. He tells me im beautiful. Hes very good looking, and very rich and looks like he does some bodybuilding. Hes way too good in bed to be an amateur, lol. The nice boy act is just too good to be true and I feel leery. I feel like his lie is a red flag, not just something that is none of my business.

  74.  #74Dixie on November 8, 2015 at 7:37 pm

    I need a hug Sirens.

    I finally felt strong/brave enough to end things with D…

    I felt okay in the moment, but because of the unpredictable nature of when I would see him again, (part of the issue) and that its a crazy week at work for both of us, I sent it via email.

    Nothing clingy, but just my hearts intent: that I loved and appreciated him, that I felt his love too, but that some aspects are not working (I’ll go into those one day here, not now). Basically, I asked if it would feel better if we just took a break…without any additional expectations.

    Anyhow, I was in a loving frame of mind when I sent it, now he has sent a text saying that he’s received it, and thank you, but he can’t talk right now but will message tomorrow.

    Okay, hugs needed now because even though I know I did the right thing here for me, it’s beginning to sink in. And….. It feels like grieving.

  75.  #75Dixie on November 8, 2015 at 7:42 pm


    I don’t know what to say. If you can separate your previously held fears from your intuition, then trust your intuition.

    Personally, I wonder if on some level, your intuition was ringing clearly already, hence the need to check.

    But the best part is that now, YOU get to decide. We’re right here for you!

  76.  #76Dixie on November 8, 2015 at 7:47 pm

    For what it’s worth, Lovergirl, there has been something triggering my intuition with D. lately, and I’d rather take myself out of a situation that feels this wobbly.

    I know that horrid feeling of being played and deceived, and I will never let myself in that situation again….. I trust my intuition 1000%.

    If your intuition is off, your “lean/back” mode will still allow him to step up and then, you again get to decide. Much love.

  77.  #77Dominique on November 8, 2015 at 8:24 pm

    Mandy – 60 – Much love to you sweetheart, <3 xxoo

  78.  #78Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 8:54 pm

    Helena 67,

    I’m in South Africa so our time zones are different, I will probably be at work… will it be recorded?

  79.  #79Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 9:04 pm

    I agree that spending too much time on worrying about this guy is overinvesting and that I shouldn’t do that. I just feel mistrustful. Whether it is my intuition or paranoia, I really can’t say.

  80.  #80Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 9:05 pm


    I send you lots of hugs and warm, caring vibes for your bravery.

    I know what this feels like because I was in this situation with a man I deeply loved earlier this year. I feel so supportive of your underlying feelings and reasons for doing this. If it is any consolation, you have given me courage to end things with a man I’m dating (B) which I know I need to do, but I’m a little afraid to do it.

    I love what you’ve said to Lovergirl in 75, both about extracting yourself from a situation when your intuition is telling you something is wobbley, and about how lean back mode allows you to decide.


  81.  #81Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 9:06 pm


    It’s been so great and such a privilege to watch you blossom to this point.

  82.  #82Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 9:07 pm

    Lovergirl 78,

    You should honour that. Take a giant step back.

  83.  #83Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 9:07 pm

    I’m not trying to control anyone, just trying to protect myself.

    BeLoved- in answer to your question- I’m probably trying to avoid the pain I’m still feeling over S. Focusing on someone new was helping for awhile, but now I feel let down by HIM.

  84.  #84Lovergirl on November 8, 2015 at 9:10 pm

    T-girl (61)- I might be able to do that. And thank you Emerson.

    (((Dixie))) You are being brave. That is a difficult step.

  85.  #85Helena Hart on November 8, 2015 at 9:33 pm

    Indigo – 77 – Yes, the recording will be posted on this page after the second free teleclass tomorrow:

    Love, Helena

  86.  #86Emerson on November 8, 2015 at 10:06 pm

    Oh gosh Emerson, I am so hard on myself. I feel much better now. I spent some time with a friend today and i am going to bed early. Tomorrow is a new day.

  87.  #87Zia on November 8, 2015 at 10:20 pm

    lovergirl – food for thought, as someone who works in IT. What if he was in an area for the day with low/no phone reception – his Tinder profile would never have picked up where he was, and quite possibly reverted to where he last had reception. OR, he wasn’t even on Tinder so it never had a chance to pick up any new location info. Why must it be that he was lying?

  88.  #88Zia on November 8, 2015 at 10:22 pm

    Lovergirl – It seems to me that things are going well so now you’re starting to look for the cracks, excuses…. instead of just enjoying it for what it is. If he is not right for you, he’ll weed himself out. Why create drama? What is it about drama that you love? Questions to ask…. And I asked those two questions quite often in the past, when trying to get past my pattern of drama in relationships…..

  89.  #89Millie on November 8, 2015 at 11:23 pm

    Went on an amazing date today!! I really love this new CDs energy, so masculine. The struggle I had was truly being open. I felt myself ebb and flow Btwn open and closed, he said I have walls up, that I was hard to read at first. I guess I’m afraid of opening up, but him saying that felt like an invitation for me to say what I was feeling… I wish I had done it more. I feel scared about how I feel… I don’t know why. I feel scared to “just be” to open up implicitly.

  90.  #90Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 11:40 pm

    Zia 87,

    Love it!

  91.  #91Indigo on November 8, 2015 at 11:49 pm

    April Rose 70,

    Thank you for this beautiful question.

    I have a great gift for helping people and animals modify their behaviour, especially overcoming aggressive or flighty behaviour patterns and calm themselves. I’ve helped numerous horses, dogs and cats modulate their own arousal levels, teach them to manage their aggression and anxiety and help them become more calm and focused and co-creative. I’ve helped some people with this too. I love this kind of work, and I’m good at it. I also have a gift for developing strong and nourishing bonds with people and animals, and I find this very satisfying. I love teaching emotional agility skills and helping people, and animals, see a situation from a different perspective.

    I also have a gift for language and creative writing, and I love this as well.

    Yes, I’ve been playing small. But I’m tired of doing that. I’m ready to open up.

  92.  #92Victoria on November 8, 2015 at 11:57 pm

    With regards to him being married – this would be a very serious lie, and, from what you are telling about him – very rich etc – he would be too stupid to be an active Tinder user but hiding a wife somewhere. My two cents.
    What you might be sensing is that there is one or possibly more women in his life, that he has his own rotation. This is quite frequent for men who are rich, good looking and generally very nice. He is probably very well liked by many women.
    And, you are very liked by many men. Most probably there are more men that want you than women who want him. You are the prize!

  93.  #93Indigo on November 9, 2015 at 12:30 am

    Victoria 91,

    I also love what you have said here. And I think this is why I naturally don’t worry too much about this stuff, if at all, when I am just dating someone. Before you are in a relationship, it is usual that he may be chatting or spending time with a couple of other women and thus coming across as a bit mysterious. C’est la vie. There are always usually other men wanting me as well, and yes it is helpful to realise that there are probably more men wanting to spend time with me than there are women wanting to spend time with the men. In fact, I was reflecting on it this morning and for the past 3 years or so my dating life has been a continuous game of musical chairs, as soon as one guy gets up another sits down. I haven’t been without male attention in all that time. Honestly anyone who says there are no good men out there should come here. There are just a ton of quality single men wherever you look.

  94.  #94Indigo on November 9, 2015 at 12:33 am

    Of course this is not without its downsides as I am naturally very monogamous, and really want only one special man in my life. But until he comes along I think you can turn this process into a positive thing.

  95.  #95Lovergirl on November 9, 2015 at 6:36 am

    Zia- I suppose its possible that he was telling the truth and the app is skewing things in some way. However, it says how long ago the person was “active” on the site and how far away it was. So its like “active” 2 hrs ago, 11 miles away. It also was showing him as several hundred miles away before that.

    Am I creating drama? I don’t know. Maybe that’s what it is. If so its probably because I am scared of trusting someone.

  96.  #96Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 6:40 am

    ((((Dixie)))) #73
    I know you have been struggling with your feelings about D

    You are warm and strong!
    Don’t be too hard on yourself…
    It will be interesting to hear what D’s response will be…

    To relieve some of the stress from your grieving this loss…
    Remember…You CAN always go back…
    We all have gone back and forth when trying to decide if a man is right for us…

    You can see how it feel to be without D
    As you have said…Sometimes you just need a break…

    Rori always talks about a 3rd way…
    Cding others while keeping D in the rotation…

    That is what I’m doing with Spirit…
    dating others while dating him…
    even though 2 have asked me for exclusivity…
    and guess what?
    neither one has poofed when I declined and said I wasnt ready…
    It’s amazing… I’ve relaxed sooo much into
    that I’m NOT very concerned about what these men
    are doing…
    Right now my life feels Very good…
    full of love from the entire Universe!!!
    I keep opening my heart to all life, people and
    feel VERY Full!!
    My work life is VERY full now also _ after 3 long years of NO MONEY!!!
    Much of my success financially is BECAUSE of
    using and practicing the Rori tools!!!
    The tools work for every aspect of my life…
    YAYAYAY@@@ !!!! :-))

  97.  #97Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 6:42 am

    When is your wedding day? I’m remembering you had moved it up.

  98.  #98Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 6:44 am

    WOW!!! I have followed your journey for 2 years and I feel VERY happy that you are giving yourself
    LOTS of hugs, love and the credit YOU deserve
    for ALL the growth you are doing!!!

    Congratulations on making these VERY difficult choices for YOU!!!!
    ******You are a ROCK STAR!!!! *******

  99.  #99Lovergirl on November 9, 2015 at 6:47 am

    Victoria- thank you, and maybe you are right. It’s just that it would not be the first time I’ve had men tell me they were single and later found out they were married. I’m hyper aware of little “clues” like that he hasn’t taken me to his house yet and he seems to text me more often when he is away than when he is here at home. Several of the times we met, he was also coming straight from the airport or had just flown into town. No glaring, obvious signs, just hmmmm…is this a red flag?

    I want to add that I have found out some very important information about men I was only dating by “snooping” in the past. Like, one man had a court record showing that he had been prosecuted for “adult abuse” in the past after his divorce from his ex wife. He had gone back and beat her up. I’m very glad I saw that because it helped, in that case, for me to get rid of him before anything turned into a relationship. Yes, I had felt some uneasiness about him prior to that, which was why I researched him in the first place.

    I expect that he is still dating other women and has some sort of rotation, which isn’t a big deal right now. I’m doing the same, its still early on and there is no commitment, so that isn’t a problem. Obviously we are both still using dating sites too. I suppose I just get afraid when I start to like someone because I don’t want to get hurt and fall too hard for someone that might be using me.

  100.  #100Indigo on November 9, 2015 at 7:34 am

    Lovergirl 98,

    I really do hear you. A certain risk is inevitable though. For me, being sensitive, there is always some pain involved when I meet someone I like to any extent. It’s just that I get to choose how much pain.

    I find you can minimise the risk of pain by taking a big step back and not investing your feelings, but PARTICULARLY your expectations until you have a really, really, really solid idea of the man. I find I can minimise my risk of pain by, any time I see or feel something that makes me feel a bit wonky, taking another little step back, reassessing and getting on with some other aspect of my life. Dominique says you get to choose every step of the way.

  101.  #101Lovergirl on November 9, 2015 at 8:18 am

    I just thought of something else about this guy, related to what Zia said about phone reception. He carries 3 phones around plus has an apple watch. So there is no telling which of these devices is logged in to tinder and whether he has it with him at all times. I know he said when he goes on vacation he leaves his business phone at home. He gets 7000 emails a day, so he has all the notifications turned off.

    It wouldn’t explain how he could be seen as close when he isnt if he was logged in, but it is probably another reason not to worry too much about it. Like who knows what is really going on with all this technology. Maybe one of his devices is set where it just shows his home location or something.

  102.  #102Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 8:21 am

    (((Tee))) #66
    I wrote a response and
    hit the wrong button and the whole thing was lost!!!

    The short of it is:
    Yes, we all get triggered when accused or made to feel wrong…

    I have found
    When I am the First to say (sweetly with a smile) “Oh, gee, You’re right…I didn’t buy diapers… I guess I really wanted coffee.” with a sweet kiss and a hug around his neck… and then walk away softly…

    If we go first… admit *our part*…
    I have been practicing being more and more vulnerable like this… they ALL respond more positively!!
    It’s magical… as Rori says: it is a magical moment to build emotional intimacy… step by baby step!

    You’re doing GREAT, siren!!
    Asking questions, observing yourself and
    LOVing YOUR feelings! They are ALL
    the wonderful parts of YOU.
    Whether they are
    angry, embarrased, unworthy, shame
    happy, warm etc, etc….

  103.  #103Lovergirl on November 9, 2015 at 8:28 am

    Also, I just checked my tinder acct and there is an option, if you pay like $8 a month, where you can “change your swiping location” and find matches in other cities, as well as do other stuff. Seeing as that would be mere pennies to him, its quite possible he does something like that in order to meet women in other cities and for whatever reason he had it set to his home location. Maybe he really wasnt lying to me. Whew.

  104.  #104Femininewoman on November 9, 2015 at 8:52 am

    Wow Lovergirl it all sounds like so much work. Honestly though, I don’t think I could possibly trust a man who needs to carry so many phones. I am naturally a conspiracy theorist and it all just seem like too much work to be invested in tracking a man.

  105.  #105movingmagic on November 9, 2015 at 12:02 pm

    I feel so disconnected from my goddess self. Not in relationship to men
    ..but myself, and my constant state of “doing”.
    I’m always doing…
    Yet, I can’t remember the last time that I wore a nice scent, or painted my nails for any reason other than a performance.
    I feel internally exhausted, and it doesn’t feel good at all.

  106.  #106Dixie on November 9, 2015 at 12:27 pm

    Azure, Lovergirl, Indigo…

    Your support is buoying me up today….

    Indigo, YOU gave me the strength by your conversation with your D. I remember feeling so inspired by your brave authenticity…

    Azure, you words wrapped right around me…. I so wish I could try the third way, but with D., I can’t. I have the sweetest, most tender feelings for this man… Like a wave of affection and desire for him. I’ve tried the third way, but when my feelings are really so invested in him, it doesn’t really work…

    Today, I’m letting myself enjoy the sun coming through the window. I have a tonne of doubts and worries banging at my door so I’m trying to “shhhh” them by remembering that this man loves me, and that I just have to trust i made the right choice …. In fact, I left it up to him, by asking him if it would feel better if we took a break…

    So, Lovergirl, this is where I take five giant steps back, lean back, and tell my insecurities to take a hike 🙂 I love him dearly, but maybe space will give both us of perspective. The one thing that makes me feel okay is that over this year, I’ve learned that no one, no one, is on the hook for making me happy. I get to choose my feelings. So I’m choosing this feeling of love and gratitude for having him in my life already, regardless of what happens.

    Much love and thanks….. I’m sure as I feel wobbly, I’ll be back for the steady waves of this blog

  107.  #107Tee on November 9, 2015 at 12:29 pm

    #101 Azure Blu! Thank you my Rock Star, I was beginning to feel left out around here lol
    Yes, I am questioning things! I didn’t intend to make him feel wrong. He hates that I ask at the last minute but I get scared to ask him. Money can be touchy with him so I’m trying to work through his issues and mine. Thank you for the better rewrite.

    I want to share with you this story. Last night Eric (my fiancé) didn’t come home. I felt really upset. I felt it was about our little conversation about the diapers.
    Ok he came home but it was very very late. I tried to shift gears and not think about it. He knows its a pet peeve of mine so I imagine he does it to get a response. He’s really good at getting a response from me lol

    So we get up this morning, I have no attitude. He starts talking about the game last night. He called his Mom, played with our son. I left to take the boy to daycare.

    After I took our son to daycare, I hung out at Dunkin Donuts. While I was there, I noticed something different was going on. They were about to shoot a commercial. Fascinating! Also, an older gentleman came and sat down at my table.

    We had such a great conversation; kids, weather, the best fast food places on the east coast and west coast. I started to feel a little off so I left. In between my talking with this guy, Eric called twice and texted me.

    When I spoke with him, he of course wanted to know where I was and it sounded like he missed me and wanted to know how long I’d be although he didn’t use those words, he just sounded disappointed.

    I felt elated! Of course I was avoiding him in case an argument sprung up, plus I thought he had to work.
    I realize the mistake that I make. Whenever Eric sounds upset or disappointed, there’s a tug in my heart and I IMMEDIATELY feel uncomfortable because I “made him” feel this way and I typically run to correct it.

    I feel like I did this today. Its not helping the cause lol but at least I see it now 🙂

  108.  #108Dixie on November 9, 2015 at 12:30 pm

    Azure, I am also so excited by your financial turnaround!!

  109.  #109Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 1:08 pm

    Tee!! #106
    Wow… to me… hanging out in Dunkin’ feels like
    leaning back… taking Good care of YOU
    and CDing the world! :-))
    You’re Rockin’ it!! girl….

    I really love how you are observing YOU and YOUR reactions with E your son and you…

  110.  #110Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 1:10 pm

    Dixie #107
    Thank you!!!
    It feels so empowering to be more in charge of my finances!!

  111.  #111Turquoise on November 9, 2015 at 1:48 pm


    As someone who was just in a situation where I felt like I was being lied and misled, it was a terrible feeling to have so much doubt in a relationship. Could he have been telling the truth and I pushed him away with my mistrust? Yes, but could he have been lying to me all along and that’s why he poofed? Yes. I was too invested, let him talk me into exclusivity right away… and that was the most important lesson I learned. There is a reason why we wait to get invested in a man after spending significant time with him. He said he had money, a beautiful home, cars, boat, leased an airplane…. was part owner in a company… etc. I was humbled and felt like he was quite a prize. All I know for sure, is that he had a nice car…. when I googled him, I found nothing to substantiate anything that he said. Which, then made me keep searching…. as I so wanted to believe he was being honest, yet most days I didn’t feel it in my gut. I just can’t imagine why someone would go to such lengths to impress someone, make all these plans, talk about a future…. and be lying about basic things from the start… unless there is no possible way they could really persue a relationship. I don’t believe he was married, as we talked quite often, for hours, when he was at home, at work, and occassionally running errands….. but he could have had a girlfriend, or an on again off again relationship. I really wanted to believe him, and I didn’t even care about the money…. I just appreciated that he worked hard and for what he wanted. But, the guy I’m talking to now, I did google him, and exactly where he works was the link that popped up. There is a bio in there for him, and guess what… where he said he went to school, his hobbies, interests, etc. all confirmed. I looked him up on FB, and the pictures there match what was on the dating site when we met. I feel so much more comfortable. Not all that doubt and worry. THere are so many men out there… I’m focusing on the ones who make me feel good. If Knight ever pops back up, maybe he will start to share things that make sense. But I doubt I will even hear from him…. as I feel he poofed because even though he really liked me, he couldn’t undo the lies. He took it too far.

    Follow your gut. What I would say about Tinder…. all those sites that show your location are based on the location service on your phone. If he is an active user, it would probably be from the phone he uses most, unless that app isn’t on that device. But the thing is, then it wouldn’t show he was on 2 hours ago if he’d left that device at home. I never brought up my specific concerns to Knight. I wish that I had. Do you have any proof that he is who he says he is? Have you googled him? I would think there would be a lot of info about a millionaire.

  112.  #112Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 2:11 pm

    Good point about googling

    I’ve not done it… but I haven’t gotten any bad vibes about most of the guys I’ve dated in the past 3 years…
    When I do I just delete them and move on..

    LinkedIn is another great place to find out what kind of work these guys do… it is a business networking social media site with MILLIONS Of followers…

    Each person fills out lots of pertinent info about themselves and it shows people who indorse what you do etc. it’s a great spot to find out what people do for their jobs/business!

  113.  #113Azure Blu on November 9, 2015 at 2:13 pm

    linkedIn…. it also shows how well they are respected and admired in their community

  114.  #114Lovergirl on November 9, 2015 at 3:00 pm

    Turquoise- thanks for sharing your story and yes I have already done my research, lol. I usually do on guys. He has a linked in profile and is like on a top 25 list for the city. Some of his co-workers are making 7-8 million a year. He has an address that is in the richest part of the city, but it is a condo. You would think if he was married he’d have a big house, especially since he has a child.

    I can see that he went to school where he says he did, and that he played football. Well I can see that he played football here in high school at a ritzy private school, where he told me he went and that he has a degree from the college he said he went to. Havent found actual college football records but he graduated in like 97.

    I cant find any marriage or divorce records. The only woman he is tied to that I can find may be his sister.She has a different address.

  115.  #115Lilybelly on November 9, 2015 at 4:00 pm

    I feel soupy.
    It feels so awful.

    Treadmill.. yes. Treadmill. This is how I can care for myself.

  116.  #116Zia on November 9, 2015 at 4:05 pm

    Lovergirl – *hugs*
    I know I created drama to avoid real intimacy, and I had no idea I was so emotionally unavailable until I stripped away the whys around that. Sometimes we go straight to the conclusion of why they would not be who they say they are, or find a crack to exploit to give us a reason to escape when things are going too well. And it’s hard to know whether it is that that’s shining through, or our gut instincts. They can get so muddled!
    Azure #96 – Very soon!! 😀 I cannot believe it. This time what….2 ? years ago I was first on this blog, STILL getting over yet another ex and horrible relationship. And that was the tail end of 13 years worth of terrible relationship patterns. And now I’m engaged, will be married, and have a son with my fiance on the way. How incredible, when you decide you want to turn it around, it can happen SO FAST!

  117.  #117April Rose on November 9, 2015 at 4:57 pm


    Wow! You’re inspiring 🙂

  118.  #118Dixie on November 9, 2015 at 5:08 pm

    Zia…. Your story is so inspiring!

    Lovergirl, in the past, I often would create drama to avoid showing all my layers of feelings, a definite block to intimacy. Basically, after the divorce and all the ugly, ugly feelings of the betrayal, I did everything I did to avoid rejection again, and this came in the form of “looking” for something that was wrong. I’m definitely not saying that this is your scenario, but having been through a deep betrayal before, that’s how it played out in relationships afterwards. And to be honest, I’ve been with D. for a long time… And I wonder if on some level I chose someone who is also afraid of true intimacy….

    I love this blog. I really do. Tonight I feel all sorts of fearful feelings, anxiety and doubt, and I really really miss D.’s calming reassurance. Sirens, I’m just feeling scared to lose all that. Sigh. If I could wave a wand, he’d be here, scooping me up, and we’d be snuggled in conversation and cuddles.

    This feels so scary…. I keep reaching for better feelings tonight, like making a great dinner, etc.

    (((Lilybelly)))) yes, the treadmill helps. Sending hugs.

  119.  #119Dixie on November 9, 2015 at 5:10 pm

    Tee 106….. Thank you for sharing your story! I felt so, so reassured by your total refocusing on yourself… It’s really what i needed to read tonight

  120.  #120Dominique on November 9, 2015 at 5:40 pm

    movingmagic- 104 – Awareness is the first and maybe the most important piece here. You’ve noticed you’re in an almost constant state of doing which in and of itself is not a negative thing.

    In your doing though you would want to focus as much as you can on being present, on noticing and sinking into what you’re doing, i.e. BEING as you’re DOING. Can you sink into the details? Can you notice anything while you’re doing which brings a smile to your face, which can allow you to pause and revel in whatever it is? Can you feel filled up – if only a little?

    Yes it’s wonderful to take care of yourself in the more typical feminine aspects, for they really can and do feel good plus it’s a lovely act of self-love. Yet you can love on yourself in other ways – even while DOING.

    That said, can you schedule even ten minutes a day to take care of yourself in more goddessy ways? And in those ten minutes, can you immerse yourself in whatever it is, and allow yourself to BE with as little thought as possible?

    Even taking tiny several seconds mini ME time during your day can create a big shift.

    Love to you.


  121.  #121Emerson on November 9, 2015 at 10:10 pm

    114 (((Lillybelly)))
    I feel soupy too

  122.  #122Mandy on November 10, 2015 at 1:15 am

    I feel bummed tonight. I feel like I want more attention from all my Cds. Probably means I need to not feel bad and down about myself. I’ve had a rough few days anduring I could’ve seen Valentine but didn’t bc it was too late notice and I’m bummed about not going.

  123.  #123Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 1:26 am

    Zia #115
    Me too!!! Lots of drama…
    and it was to keep intimacy at bay…
    I too have learned soo much about my
    !!!!extreme fear of intimacy!!!

    Slowly… i am managing my anxiety (which would turn into drama) when I am feeling Too MUCH intimacy…

    When I’ve created drama…
    I can call back right away, if I’ve run away,
    and talk about MY issues and how *I* am feeling…

    Or stay put… calm myself down… and share my feelings.
    it always creates soooo much more intimacy
    and I am acting much more mature, more adult!!!
    This transformation (using the Magical Rori Tools)
    is amazing to me…
    I lOVE me being MORE mature…
    I was a 60+ yr old child… attracted to immature men
    (my mirror)
    even though mature men were attracted to me
    I wasn’t attracted to them…

    I love my silliness, my playfulness, my light hearted ways…
    And I also Love my steady, mature, dignified and courageous ME!!
    She IS lovely!!!

  124.  #124Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 1:32 am

    Such Huge steps you have taken…
    being alone in YOUR space will be an adjustment…
    Be very gentle with YOU…

    What are the feelings that are coming up?
    Love those feelings,
    Maybe you could…
    Paint yourself with warm, soft love
    look in the mirror and find 2 things
    you really like about yourself and
    tell yourself how beautiful and Amazing
    YOU ARE!!!
    hugs darling, rock star!!!

  125.  #125Indigo on November 10, 2015 at 2:08 am


    I think many of us can relate to being drawn to drama to cover up the feelings underneath. In my case I just didn’t know any better. My early childhood was one big drama-filled warzone – it’s what I knew. I had no experience of relationships without drama, and didn’t know it was even possible or that that’s how it’s supposed to be. It’s taken a lot of reflection and re-wiring to turn this around, but I feel I mostly have, and have come such a long way. I feel we don’t have to keep entertaining those abandonment and rejection fears that keep us stuck in drama. Relationships can feel much easier.

    I got an email from Bush Boy last night! I lit up. It makes me glow and shine and so happy whenever I hear from him. We are in a serious drought at the moment, and where he is is one of the worst-hit places. He’s been so busy with starting a new job. The animals are fine, but they (the conservation guys) have been having to shower out of a bucket. It makes me so happy to know a man I can truly admire and respect, who is truly a hero in my eyes.

  126.  #126Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 3:15 am

    How wonderful to hear you so happy!
    Bush Boy does sound like a truly inspired man!!

    I too, grew up in a drama filled home…
    NOTHING was smooth and easy…
    My life now, Is feeling more *smooth and easier*
    than ever before!!
    Mmmmmm… im loving this!!

  127.  #127Starla on November 10, 2015 at 7:04 am

    Lack of drama makes me more uncomfortable than drama. Confession.

  128.  #128Starla on November 10, 2015 at 7:09 am

    Tee, you’re getting it! Yes bring your focus back on yourself and put him out of your mind. They always fill the void. It’s pretty much science haha.

  129.  #129Indigo on November 10, 2015 at 7:17 am

    Azure Blu,

    Thank you, and I so relate to everything you’ve written about avoiding intimacy. Not consciously or intentionally, but in so many ways I just didn’t know any better. Even to this day I can have fears of “he’s going to reject me if I (do x, y or z)” so I pull back. Now, I can much more readily look that in the face and see how silly it is, and just share myself, come what may.

    It feels more scary to me now to keep myself hidden, and I am finding joy in opening up to kindred spirits. I am more able to love myself because I can see that I can bring joy & connection to others by being myself.

    I also love what you’ve said about us going first emotionally with men. I really believe that.

  130.  #130Femininewoman on November 10, 2015 at 7:26 am

    Starla remember there is “good” drama too

  131.  #131Starla on November 10, 2015 at 8:18 am

    Ladies, you HAVE to watch this 😀 on the topic of our pull to drama

  132.  #132Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 8:20 am

    Starla #126
    Can you explain What you mean by “lack of drama makes me more uncomfortable than drama.”

  133.  #133Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 8:23 am

    Indigo #128
    I love this and feel this also!!!

    “It feels more scary to me now
    to keep myself hidden,
    and I am finding joy
    in opening up to kindred spirits.
    I am more able to love myself
    because I CAN SEE I BRING JOY
    to others by being myself.” !!!!

  134.  #134Tee on November 10, 2015 at 8:55 am

    #118 Dixie! Thanks! I just need to continue to refocus organically and genuinely, not as a way of responding to Eric. I want/need to be that way the majority of the time. It was an AH HA moment for me. Like Ohhhh Ok so this is what it feels like to CD lol

    I enjoyed the conversation with the older gentleman until I started to not feel so well. Eric had switched work days. I went home & took a nap, then woke up and went to the library. I stayed until it was time to pick up our son. When we got home, Eric had made cheeseburgers for us. Definitely not a first.

    Then he says, if you want me to make you another one…let me know. I was like Woooowww! Its been a very long time since he’s gone out of his way to make me additional food lol

    #127 Starla, thanks! That’s the thing, I hardly ever let him fill the void. I start feeling uncomfortable so I would jump in there. Its like I’m uncomfortable with the silence, uncomfortable with his silence and with his uncomfortability. So its easy for him to get in there and nudge me a little lol

    (((AZURE BLUE)))

  135.  #135Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 9:25 am

    How quickly you are seeing E’s positive reactions
    to YOUR leaning back

    nice reminder about letting the man
    Fill The Void…

    I too am a “void filler”
    an emotional rescuer…
    if I feel ANYONE floundering or uncomfortable
    -Screw my feelings-
    I’ll sacrifice ME every time!!

    Except now… I can more easily tolerate the uncomfortable anxiety I feel (all my own making)

    BUT I must be diligent!!! I easily fall back into
    emotional rescewing at MY expense!

  136.  #136Mandy on November 10, 2015 at 10:53 am

    I’m feeling mad, the last post I made said I wanted man attention and I woke up angry because I feel I’m not getting it like a Siren should so I’m just mad!

  137.  #137Indigo on November 10, 2015 at 10:57 am


    I think I am going to give it a timeline with B.

    I am not feeling particularly great in this relationship, but I’m hesitant to end it because I’m not feeling terrible either. I don’t know.

  138.  #138Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 11:12 am

    Indigo… #135
    Do you feel good when you go out, practicing your Siren skills…
    Maybe wait until you have another CD in your rotation?

  139.  #139Tee on November 10, 2015 at 11:56 am

    #133, Yes, a VOID FILLER! That’s me! I have to learn to get comfortable in that space. And to also thank him. He’s not use to being Thanked I guess.

    So AZURE BLUE, as an example, what would you have said about the burgers? I have to get better at this
    I love you guys! lol

  140.  #140movingmagic on November 10, 2015 at 12:03 pm

    Thank you Dominique for the reminder and kind words. I left the circus warehouse where I train at early so that I can have some me time before I teach.
    I feel like lack of being present is a huge part of what I’m feeling. Slowing down enough to just be. Also, taking time for some me time to sit in a coffee shop, or read a book. Maybe both… 🙂

  141.  #141Starla on November 10, 2015 at 12:35 pm

    Azure 131 – when things are peaceful and there is an absence of drama, then there is an absence of the reaffirmation I get from drama being tended to and resolved. Also, I worry that if things are quiet and peaceful and “neutral” (not intensely bad or good all the time), then the other shoe is going to drop. Drama also allows me to “test” my partner, and when he isn’t responding to these tests because we are in a peaceful period so nothing’s getting brought up, I start to find ways he isn’t up to snuff. Without drama, I get super uncomfortable and antsy and ping pong between the fear of being dumped and fear of settling for the wrong man.

  142.  #142Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 1:20 pm

    Tee #137

    I say things like…
    “Oh, E… I feel so warm and cherished when you cook your wonderful burgers for me…”
    It has taken practice to open my heart
    and be this vulnerable…
    but I am much better at it…
    Also, some of my CDs have been a little taken by surprise when I say things like this…
    They’ll say things like… “You’re kidding, right?”
    and look surprised
    or “Are you making fun of me?”
    and I have to reassure them.
    As I use it more often with each one they
    simply crave it
    Like the dessert craves a drop of water!!!
    They soften… both our hearts are melted
    with this warm, soft, kindness I share…
    It is magical!!!

  143.  #143Azure Blu on November 10, 2015 at 1:25 pm

    Starla #139
    Ohhh… I see…
    Yes, I am the same…

    neutral, easy – NO drama
    is WAY OUT of my Comfort Zone..
    It causes (used to cause much more) anxiety
    and my whole body would want to do something
    to stir up the drama again!!

    “antsy and ping pong between the fear of being dumped
    and fear of settling for the wrong man.”

  144.  #144Starla on November 10, 2015 at 1:25 pm

    Tee/Azure, it took my guy a long time to realize I was never patronizing or clowning him with my sweet words of appreciation. But once they “get” it, it’s awesome for the relationship!

    In general, voicing appreciation for all they’re doing for you, even the silly things, can’t hurt. Sometimes they’ll respond like “Gee, it’s just the trash, I always take out the trash,” but that’s when you can get silly and gushy and say ohhhh but it feels so good knowing I don’t often have to touch that stinky trash! And move on with your life 🙂

  145.  #145Starla on November 10, 2015 at 1:37 pm

    Tee, I just emailed you with a better email address to contact me with. I don’t check that account enough and didn’t mean to ignore you for 5 days! <3

  146.  #146Mandy on November 10, 2015 at 1:43 pm

    Gosh I feel snarky and talk-backy today. lol. I did kind of say something witty to someone who deserved it, and I feel pleased with myself, because they really deserved it, but me being snarky can also be a sign of me shutting down so I have to be careful.

    When I feel snarky or a little pissed, I can have a sense of humor about it and stay open, so when I feel that way I make sure to throw some comedy on or filter it through some humor of my own.

    I just don’t think it’s good for me to ever shut down. So if it takes a sense of humor to be in my anger and not shut down, there we go, lol. I hope that makes sense and sounds like a good option there. I often use humor to get myself through rough times.

    Often, rough times are when jokes are the funniest. Ever notice that? Like if you’ve just had it or been through the wringer or something huge has blown up, do you ever get to the point where it’s like, dang, that was huge…and just start laughing about it? Kind of, giving up and laughing? I think it’s a pretty healthy way to go. The laughing lets out some energy and begets some good feelings and just lets your body let it all out and you have some fun.

    Still feeling mad though. Probably because J still wants my help and I feel exhausted. It’s like every guy I know wants me to deliver myself to his place like a freaking pizza, and I want some accomodation. First of all, I don’t drive, due to a disability I have with involuntary movements, so there’s that, secondly, there’s a reason I started living alone, if they don’t come to me and come to my place within an alotted amount of time, I think it’s a deal-breaker. I don’t want to run myself out of energy just to go see a guy, J broke me of that.

    I wonder how I may script this to a man.

    Would a Siren like to help me script my frustration, anger, and feelings of unfairness, with having had bent over backwards and jumped through my bum in the past and being tired of it now? It could come out sounding so wrong so fast I think I need help. I’m also going to listen to love scripts.

  147.  #147Starla on November 10, 2015 at 2:08 pm

    “not feeling interested in going over there, but it would feel so good to see you another way. what do you think?”

    “I don’t want to travel to you, but it would feel so good to see you another way. what do you think?”

    or be really specific: “It would feel so good to be picked up to spend time together.”

    If they are like “just come here!” you can simply say “no thank you.”

    It helps not to be worried about what these men will think or if you’ll lose them from your rotation by rubbing them the wrong way

  148.  #148Starla on November 10, 2015 at 3:14 pm

    I am seriously sitting here hitting refresh compulsively. I love procrastinating chores/to-do’s.

  149.  #149Liquid Light on November 10, 2015 at 3:28 pm

    Just hit me today. I big revelation about myself. Realizing how much I’ve had my head in the clouds for most of my adult life. I dropped out of a really good college because I wasn’t happy there. I’ve moved impulsively to other locations because I wasn’t happy where I was. I left my job, city, apartment and flew to Asia to backpack for 4 months because I wan’t happy and needed a change. I’m always chasing something. I need excitement. I need perfection otherwise I’m not happy. I’m always seeking, never satisfied. I need the best job, friends, boyfriend. Nothing is ever good enough for me. It’s hitting me like a hammer. I’m never going to be happy unless I change this fundamental thing about my perpetual dissatisfaction. I had the perfect man – good lucking, charming, funny, fun, successfully – but I couldn’t see his fundamental flaws and our incompatibility until it was too late. Last night, I ended up seeing someone that I dated almost 2 years ago. We ended up at the same event and it was really nice to reconnect with him. He’s not that exciting. He’s a bit of a geek and too short. But he’s really nice, successful at what he does, and is a committed father. I’m going to try to stay open to him and to other men in my rotation right now who also aren’t perfect and aren’t that exciting. Hahaha. I really need to change this about myself or otherwise I will always be unhappy. Sigh.

  150.  #150Starla on November 10, 2015 at 3:36 pm

    Liquid Light, were you happy when you were traveling for 4 months?

    My uncle is a lot like how you describe yourself, and he was really really good with it until about a year ago when he turned 50 and his health started declining. I think he wishes he had held on to more instead of “nexting” it. On the flip side, though, he spent his life doing what HE wanted, he has seen almost the whole world, and has tons of interesting stories.

  151.  #151Liquid Light on November 10, 2015 at 5:13 pm

    Wow, Starla, I can relate to that so much! I’ve seen a lot of the world too and I just turned 50 this year. I did enjoy traveling for 4 months but I was alone. I’m tired of being alone. Now, its really hitting me WHY I’ve been alone so much! (I’m sure its been really obvious to everyone else though. Sigh)

  152.  #152Starla on November 10, 2015 at 5:17 pm

    My uncle’s a great guy ;)… totally single…;)

  153.  #153Mandy on November 10, 2015 at 7:06 pm

    Starla, I like it 🙂

  154.  #154Emerson on November 10, 2015 at 7:18 pm

    147 Liquid Light
    Were you happy when you made the changes you felt you needed? I’m just curious. Maybe being too hard on yourself?
    Perhaps you’re just a person who is true to herself and when something doesn’t feel like its working for you, you actually take action and change it.
    Many people don’t have the courage to change their life, even when they are very unhappy.

  155.  #155Emerson on November 10, 2015 at 7:21 pm

    I am realizing I have more power than I thought, to make changes for myself. It’s a bit scary, but not in a bad way… feels powerful and I feel that I have to really take responsibility for myself and my life.
    What do I want next?
    I have been feeling indecisive.
    Sometimes I feel like I keep distractions around just to avoid big changes that would be an improvement for me. Does that make sense to anyone? In other words, I need to get out of my own way.

  156.  #156Emerson on November 10, 2015 at 7:38 pm

    I had a very strange day today. I am handling it pretty well though.

  157.  #157Tee on November 10, 2015 at 7:41 pm

    #142/143, Starla, it’s ok thanks.
    I think it’ll take myself and Eric getting use to a new routine. Whenever I do thank him, he either doesn’t believe me…. (yeah whatever is what he says lol)…or he feels like taking out the trash or getting our son a haircut is part of his job so No thanks is needed.

    I’d like more of that behavior so I guess I need to start practicing more & flexing these muscles 🙂

  158.  #158Dixie on November 10, 2015 at 7:43 pm

    Indigo, Azure blu, #124, 125, 128….

    Yes, yes, thank you continuing this discussion! It is still feeling difficult to share all my feelings In a way that is authentic, and without blame…

    Before I share anything, I ask myself, does it feel okay to share this even if I don’t get a response back? Can I share without expectation? If the answer is yes, then I’ll go ahead. If it feels clingy, or in some way agenda-driven, then 5 steps back for me ☺️ to process why I need to share…

    So. A funny incident, speaking of sharing. This year, I’ve been thinking,dreaming of starting a club at school just for girls, to foster confidence, and really to help them see themselves in the world, by inviting guest speakers, raising awareness of women’s issues, etc. There might be done social awareness built in, and hopefully, a way to encourage them to pursue science, engineering, and other non-traditional work fields (stupid glass ceiling). i want them to see themselves as change-makers in the world…

    Well!! Someone was listening clearly. On Friday, I was invited to join a international charitable organization that focuses on helping female students get more involved in development projects worldwide. But, I was asked to lead the chapter at our school! At first, I said, “Yes, of course!” and felt super excited! But then, today, I received another email from our union, asking me to chair a totally separate “international status of women”

    Well! .

  159.  #159Dixie on November 10, 2015 at 7:49 pm

    Oops, I hit “submit” too soon!

    Anyhow, I was super excited today, realizing that the strangest miracles happen when we least expect it, and it renewed my belief that good things happen.

    Then last night, D. sent a super sweet short goodnight message, which felt so warming…. I felt badly about adding to his stress this week, sort of surprising him with that email, and his response felt tender. I’m still leaning back, letting him steer this boating he wants, but boy, it feels like the Universe just said “Here you go! A plateful of opportunity!”

    I feel very excited, a little overwhelmed, but very happy overall by these surprises !!

  160.  #160Dixie on November 10, 2015 at 7:55 pm

    Indigo 135….. Do you feel ready? I like Azure’s idea of having another CD in rotation if that makes it feel easier.

    I also know that you’re very sensitive to seeing one man at a time -I tend to be the same way. Can you give yourself a timeline in your heart, without needing to share it with him?

  161.  #161Dixie on November 10, 2015 at 7:58 pm


    “I worry that if things are quiet and peaceful and “neutral” (not intensely bad or good all the time), then the other shoe is going to drop. Drama also allows me to “test” my partner, and when he isn’t responding to these tests because we are in a peaceful period so nothing’s getting brought up, I start to find ways he isn’t up to snuff. Without drama, I get super uncomfortable and antsy and ping pong between the fear of being dumped and fear of settling for the wrong man”

    Yes, this was my deep fear as well.

  162.  #162Dixie on November 10, 2015 at 8:04 pm


    ” I am realizing I have more power than I thought, to make changes for myself. It’s a bit scary, but not in a bad way… feels powerful and I feel that I have to really take responsibility for myself and my life…Sometimes I feel like I keep distractions around just to avoid big changes that would be an improvement for me…. In other words, I need to get out of my own way.”

    I could jump right now because this was the little self-talk I’ve been having lately… Really, “to get out of my own way”. In a way, it goes back to Indigo’s earlier comment about finding our passions and having the courage to follow them. If I create imaginary drama”, then I’m not expending my energy in a positive, creative way. Perhaps the drama is something I’ve created because I’m fearful of other big leaps in life…


  163.  #163Indigo on November 10, 2015 at 9:02 pm

    Mandy 144,

    I’ve found authentic works the best.

    “I’m tired and I don’t think I can face leaving my home tonight. You would be very welcome to come here.”

  164.  #164Indigo on November 10, 2015 at 9:12 pm

    Azure Blu & Dixie,

    Thank you for responding.

    I ended things with B last night and instantly felt 10 pounds lighter.

  165.  #165Emerson on November 10, 2015 at 10:39 pm

    160 Hi Dixie!
    Thank you for sharing that with me!

    I am glad it resonated with somebody…

    I sometimes wonder lately if I am ‘in my own way’ because I am punishing myself for something…

    Following my passion for the past few years I have poured everything into a new career….

    If I am honest following my passion now is to have a husband and a home where I feel safe….

    I have been stepping outside my comfort zone to meet new people. Only problem is I tend to drink a bit too much sometimes when I do that. add to my to do list: don’t drink so much when you go out emerson!

    Anyways, I need to be careful what I think about and ask for…

    Lately, I have been getting it!

  166.  #166Victoria on November 11, 2015 at 1:55 am

    I was just about to chime in pleading not to shoot him down when I saw you did. I mean this in a humorous way, but I am not sure it sounds funny in English.
    Anyhow, what did he do?

  167.  #167Indigo on November 11, 2015 at 4:08 am

    Victoria, honestly once I got to that decision I felt terrific about it. I felt like I was carrying dead weight and I was carrying it just for the sake of dating someone. I felt like I was putting a barrier to intimacy between me and Bush Boy by dating B. Moreover, I didn’t like how I was feeling with B. Easy. He took it well.

  168.  #168Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 5:17 am

    I got a text from cutecityCD last night….means nothing ….just ironic I haven’t been in contact with him for weeks../months…yesterday I mentioned to a friend that I miss him and there he is. I didn’t reply.
    I may or may not.hes proven to be unavailable in the past.

  169.  #169Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 5:19 am

    I’m striving to be open in my everyday life to meet new men….I was at the grocery store yesterday and a nice looking man smiles at me and I feel curious….then his wife/girlfriend walks up. Blah!!! Lol
    Oh well
    I feel exhausted and frustrated with unavailable men.
    I will focus on meeting available loyal men who are kind and trustworthy.

  170.  #170Femininewoman on November 11, 2015 at 6:55 am

    Emerson how about focusing on meeting new people in general? Seems your comment jumped at me at being hyperfocused on attaining a goal. You just never know which girl might be able to introduce you to a great guy.

  171.  #171Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 7:08 am

    Tee #155
    I have found sharing my appreciation and how
    it makes *ME* Feel
    when someone does things I like…
    is much warmer and less patronizing than
    “Thank you”
    Also making me sound less “needy”

    Although I do see that Rori uses Thank you interspersed with her scripts and examples of feeling messages….

    It is so very VULNERABLE to share how an action
    someone is doing makes your heart melt…
    makes you feel safe, warm, cherished…

    this just happened this morning:
    Spirit called me on his way to work…
    I LOVE when he does that…
    We talked – gave each other lots of positive
    he listened to a concern I was having with a job… he gave some great advice…
    He got to his meeting and we were saying goodby
    I said “Thank you for calling…this morning!'”

    Next time I want to say: “Ohhh… i felt soo excited seeing your face come on my phone
    I feel so sunshiny and warm hearing your sexy voice this morning!”
    Ahhh… so much more intimate and vulnerable…

  172.  #172Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 7:10 am

    I feel happy to hear your shoulders are less weighted!!!
    Letting go of B must be just what you needed!

  173.  #173Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 7:13 am

    Lovely Siren.
    Wow…2 projects that are asking for your expertise and knowledge and energy!!!
    This all sounds amazing for you!!!

  174.  #174Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 7:35 am

    I found this in my archives…
    Not sure what coach this if from…
    But I love it!!!

    How Kindness and being in the Now changed my relationship!

    “The keys to change for me were from two things you wrote –
    one about staying present in the moment and
    being kind and dropping the criticism.

    There are a number of things I would rather not have in a partner that he has/does
    but when I stay in the moment where he is consistently loving and attentive,
    kind and patient – these other characteristics don’t seem to matter –
    things like earn more money, manage it better, etc – all desirable but not dealbreakers (for Me).

    Where I would usually be busy in my head about how he should be different
    and how could I put up with “that!” for long….
    instead I’ve experienced a trillion beautiful,
    loving moments with him,
    staying present to our loving expression –
    and somehow,
    just a few weeks ago – he let me in.

    In his words, “my persistent kindness and
    gentleness melted his cold, black heart”
    (of course he doesn’t have a cold black heart)
    He’s started saying “I love you” each time we are together and has softened in so many ways.
    I didn’t do anything,
    except NOT give him a hard time about his perceived faults.
    You said, “the power to create love comes from your ability to be kind.”
    As I practiced living in the moment and being kind and loving him as I would my closest dearest friends, about 12 months ago I realized I had stumbled upon the key:
    quite simply we had NO drama, lots of fun,
    good times, peaceful, loving connection,
    easy communication and tenderness.

    ****I wasn’t busting his balls to be The One***
    – a made-up label which had so much more made-up criteria for him to live up to.
    When I would leave his company,
    I felt happy each time I thought about our time together
    and realized being around him was good for my soul.
    And I felt free.
    Maybe I was the one with commitment issues
    and not the men I previously chose? 🙂
    Sure, he has traits and habits that are not what I thought my ideal partner should have,
    but each time I thought I knew who my ideal partner was in the past,
    I was 100% wrong.
    So I remain open, living in today
    and content with the man I am in love with.
    Thank you for your guidance and wisdom.”

  175.  #175Runaway Bride & Groom on November 11, 2015 at 7:37 am

    Hi all lost love I’m curious if the love I have for this guy is lost. He acts like he couldn’t live without me then he moved away . So I’m trying to find the love we use to have which feels lost our flame seems so dim it’s feeling very lost

  176.  #176Starla on November 11, 2015 at 7:38 am

    This morning, I was in a bad mood because I’m not a morning person and am not loving my job right now, and I let myself be in a bad mood around him! It was scary! And he didn’t point out that I wasn’t feeling peachy perfect about life, which I appreciate.

    The funny thing is that I do personally value taking a deliberately positive attitude, and if I were alone that is most likely what I would do. But since I feel like being in a bad mood is going to result in my abandonment, I just get stuck there. It’s like I am stuck on the level of a video game where the objective is to be in a bad mood and not worry about it.

    I wish we had more “together but separate” space behind the same front door. We actually live across the hall from each other in identically tiny condos, so when I want to get some alone time for meditation, yoga, or dance, I have to leave through his door and come through mine. I might as well get in the car and drive 10 miles home. I would love to have a private little corner or room where I can get into a positive, grateful, connectedtotheuniverse space and fill our home with it – and not because I am right in front of him and feel pressure to shift my mood.

    🙂 Well that will happen soon enough so that’s good 🙂

  177.  #177Lovergirl on November 11, 2015 at 7:43 am

    So that guy finally texted me again this morning. It’s been 6 days since I last heard from him and he’s still showing that he’s here in town (no I haven’t been able to resist checking). He said “Hey pretty woman!!! How are you doing?” I haven’t answered him yet. He texted over an hour ago but I was asleep. I don’t really feel like answering how I am doing. 😛 I’ll probably just be like “well, hello there!”

  178.  #178Tee on November 11, 2015 at 7:51 am

    #169 Azure Blue, it’s kinda fun! I think once I get the hang of this, it’ll *feel* more genuine to me.
    Expressing vulnerability.

    This morning, Eric gives me $2 towards my “drug” lol…then he’s like How much exactly does it cost? I tell him it’s about $2.40 or so, so he adds another dollar.

    Then he asks me if I could clean the floors or the tub. He said he cleaned it a little. Then he said it wasn’t a big deal, he could do it once he gets back from work but just let him know what I decided to do either way. I thanked him & gave him a kiss before he left.

    And of course he played with our son before daycare as well. These are types of mornings that I so enjoy!

  179.  #179Starla on November 11, 2015 at 8:03 am

    Yay Tee!

  180.  #180Lilybelly on November 11, 2015 at 10:22 am


    I feel so curious about what your response to rich dude will be.

  181.  #181Lovergirl on November 11, 2015 at 10:30 am

    Lillybelly- I had no clue what to say. I finally just texted back “well, hello there!!” It was an hour and a half after I got his text that I responded and I haven’t heard back from him yet.

  182.  #182Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 11:11 am

    Tee #175
    Wow!! how cool to see how our open hearts
    feels so warm and inviting to our man…
    Lovely, Tee… just lovely!!!

  183.  #183Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 11:25 am

    Great job Siren!!!
    Your doing GREAT
    YOU didn’t contact him!!!

    and a reminder from Labbit:
    “Labbit Says:
    “You have to stay behind him in terms of investment and emotions.
    As soon as you get ahead of him
    you’re chasing him,
    and the only way he can go
    is backwards.”
    “Take all of those feelings of wanting to give to him, do for him,
    hear from him,
    and put them into yourself – YOUR full life. ”

    “Everytime the thought comes up of him,
    catch yourself and ask,
    what can I do for me right now, Remember
    Your life IS full… YOUR life is Amazing
    in this moment!”

  184.  #184Indigo on November 11, 2015 at 11:55 am


    If I possibly can, I like to stay really sweet and light and gentle with these kinds of guys… my own version of being an “invitation”. If I truly don’t know what to say, I send a smile or blushing face, with a soft, girly vibe. Bush Boy texted me this morning to say he had a dream about me and I truly didn’t know what to say, so I just said, oh wow! *blushing*

  185.  #185Tee on November 11, 2015 at 1:47 pm

    #176/#179 Starla & Azure lol yaaayy!

    Today was good & I feel like I didn’t Do anything. But when I thought about it, that’s not entirely true.

    I cleared the air, or my vibe rather. I decided to let go of the whole diaper issue. I just wanted him to buy them & it upset me that he either wouldn’t or couldn’t. I assumed he did something awful with the money so I was holding onto the anger.

    I have such a feeling of lack when it comes to him & his money, it’s hard to explain. If he spends money on beer, then I feel like he’ll NEVER EVER spend it on us/his child but that’s not true! I feel that way about him in general. If he spends time with his friends, it means he never ever wants to spend time with us, etc.

    I even dreamt last night that he went out to lunch with a bunch of female friends & bought them trinkets. I followed him & was about to confront him when I woke up. Smh.

    Mind you, the vibe that I got from the dream was that these were girls around his nieces age (early 20s), he didn’t view them in a romantic way, they saw him moreso like their favorite crazy uncle, they enjoyed him/admired him.
    The trinkets were like these goofy looking headbands lol

    I guess my point is that I tend to want everything that he has & if he gives away even a sliver of it to himself or anyone else….it means he doesn’t love us. So that’s the story I was carrying concerning the diapers. And it’s not like he’s never bought diapers, his thing is just that I don’t ask at the last minute.

    So I dropped that whole deal, bought the diapers myself and didn’t say a word about it. No attitude, no snide remarks or looks. I took some of the diapers over to the daycare this morning and that’s when he gave me the money for my coffee 🙂

    I know that was a mouthful but I’m still piecing together my triggers regarding him. The whole lack vibe isn’t cool in general either.

  186.  #186Starla on November 11, 2015 at 3:05 pm

    Tee, if you guys have a kid and are engaged to be married, it sounds like it’s time to sit down and agree who pays for what! Just winging it on the money thing the way you have been is probably not going to work for you, and it doesn’t work for hardly anyone, really.

    I am excited you are feeling lighter and processing through some things too!

  187.  #187Dixie on November 11, 2015 at 3:40 pm

    Lovergirl 178: how amazing it is for you to take your time to check in with yourself before responding!

    Azure Blu: Thank you for re-posting those words from Labbit. What a terrific reminder for me!!

    Indigo- what a cute message from Bush Boy and what a perfect and warm response!

  188.  #188Dixie on November 11, 2015 at 3:43 pm

    171 Azure Blu: thank you! I don’t understand how things line up in the universe, but really, my heart felt so astonished and giddy that I knew it was not a mere coincidence!

    And even though the past few days have been a little wobbly in moments, I feel more settled in believing that yes, things do work out

  189.  #189Lilybelly on November 11, 2015 at 4:10 pm

    Me too, Dixie…wobbly is a great way to explain it.

  190.  #190Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 5:43 pm

    I love what you have uncovered about your triggers
    and how you want EVERYTHING E has…

    I can see how I do that with CDs I’m with
    Spirit for instance…
    His finances are NONE repeat NONE of my business
    BUT I always do this thing when he is spending money…
    Ohhh… but he didn’t buy me dinner
    or he didn’t ask me if I wanted that…

    He got a bonus shouldn’t he want to celebrate with me???

    He is VERY frugal in many ways…
    but he does pay for most of our evenings out!
    AND he has been between jobs for over a year…

    I think these negative, unruly feelings
    is a spill over from my mom…
    i love these negative feelings
    they are part of me…
    I want to give them my love and attention

  191.  #191Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 5:48 pm

    starla #173
    I’m feeling a bit curious about this…
    ” But since I feel like being in a bad mood is going to result in my abandonment, I just get stuck there. It’s like I am stuck on the level of a video game where the objective is to be in a bad mood and not worry about it.

    I wish we had more “together but separate” space behind the same front door.”

    It does feel disconnected to close one door and open another…
    How does he talk about this phenomenon?

  192.  #192Azure Blu on November 11, 2015 at 5:52 pm

    I’m soooo exhausted!! I’ve been working soooo many
    hours in the past 2 months…
    I can’t even think strait!
    I worked strait thru from Monday at 6:00am to Tues at 4:00pm
    I need to go to bed now
    Good night Sirens
    Thank yu for all your love, laughter, vulnerability
    Strength courage and listening hearts!

  193.  #193Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 7:13 pm

    168 yes fw!!!

  194.  #194Turquoise on November 11, 2015 at 8:04 pm

    Hi sirens… Someday is being very attentive. I feel good having him in my rotation.
    My friend has been sick and just gave up smoking, haven’t talked as much, but he’s got a lot going on. Saw him tonight briefly, will see him this weekend.
    My ex surprised the girls and came up for 2 days. I asked him to help with some things for them and he did. Tonight we all went out to dinner. Earlier I was triggered by him criticizing that I had laundry and cleaning to do. Normally I get defensive, say he doesn’t understand how busy we are, it leads to a fight and we say all these mean things we regret a few hours later. So instead I didn’t respond right away and then just said he was right, I did have laundry and chores to do and planned to get caught up this week. And we both agreed we didn’t want to fight, and that was the end of it. I enjoyed my dinner and a sangria and smiled.
    I have another guy I’m talking to… He’s local, we have a ton in common. He’s not divorced yet, so keeping this as just a friendship. One thing I learned from sweetheart, divorces can take years…, not getting invested in someone that’s not available yet. It’s weird though. He said they haven’t spoken in a year and a half. At all. He lives in the basement of the house, and they have 2 kids, my girls age. How do you just have nothing to say?
    Intense guy still pops in here and there. I’m thinking a lot less about knight these days. That’s a relief.

  195.  #195Sweetpea on November 11, 2015 at 8:15 pm


    I’m feeling kinda’ funky.

    I’ve learned so much here and it helped a lot with the experience in my non-romantic relationship with my roommate/sister. This feels totally cool to me – how the tools I’ve learned here affect every area of my life.

    I recently moved from a dinky little town where there were no eligible men to date. The whole time I was thinking, “I need to get out of here; back to civilization, or I’ll probably be single for the rest of my life.” I was there for almost 2 years.

    Within a few weeks of moving here, I met a guy who’s 15 years younger than I. He expressed interest in a romantic relationship. Although I wasn’t sure, I decided, “What the hell – back to CDing, I guess.”

    It’s really interesting to me to see how much my relationship skills have actually grown. Initially, when I didn’t hear from him for a few days, I found myself checking my phone every five minutes. Once I reminded myself about all I’ve learned here, I feel so much more at ease.

    It feels so weird, though. He’s super sweet and I trust him more than I’ve trusted any other guy I’ve dated in my life. But I don’t know if that’s because I really don’t care one way or the other, or if I’ve actually gotten some of this down.

    I talked to him tonight about something unrelated. I’ve been thinking maybe we’re back to just being friends because he doesn’t pursue me much. But tonight, he asks me totally out of the blue, when he’ll be able to see me again. And makes plans for Friday.

    I’m not sure how I’m feeling other than just odd. I feel a bit like celebrating because this is so much easier than it has been in the past, but seriously…

    What am I doing with a guy who’s (almost) young enough to be my kid? I guess I’m old enough now that at least he’s still legal, 😉 but still…

    I never thought I’d be a cougar, but the last 10 years or so, it seems most of the guys who pursue me are at least 5 years younger than I.

    Any thoughts, Sirens?

  196.  #196Sweetpea on November 11, 2015 at 8:24 pm

    Azure Blu @ 187,

    I can so identify with what you say about the negative feelings around money. My mom was the same way. She never talked to me about finances, but I always knew when she was stressing about them.

    The funny thing is, my dad had his own business at the time. He recently revealed to me that he was worth $1 million dollars at the time – yet still she stressed about money.

    That money stuff is soooo hard to let go of.

    Most importantly, I have the same reaction around guys; focusing on what they’re not doing for me. Blech!

    I love how you say you want to give love and attention to these negative feelings; such a great idea!

  197.  #197Sweetpea on November 11, 2015 at 8:30 pm

    Wow Turquoise,

    I am soooo far behind here.

    I just wanted to congratulate you though, on how you handled things with your ex. I feel happy to know that your girls were able to enjoy an evening with you and their dad without any fighting. Most people have a really hard time putting their personal stuff on ice for the good of the kids. I think that’s really huge and my heart feels good reading it.

    Yay you!!


  198.  #198Tee on November 11, 2015 at 8:54 pm

    #183/#187 Starla and Azure Blue, thank you for riding this out with me

    Agreed, things should be a little more stable at this point but most everything, except our son, has been us just winging it.

    Not sure yet where my money issues came from yet. Maybe I feel like if he doesn’t give me all that he has then I’m not important?

    My mom is weird with money. It’s never enough. She can’t seem to manage it or maybe she doesn’t want to because it’s not fun. Her $52,000 a year job isn’t cutting it smh my sister and I have tried to suggest where she could save money. Maybe staying home more often, cutting your own grass, no more bar food, etc. No, she’d rather complain & wallow in pity because her life is so hard.

    Its not that my fiancé is frugal, I think it’s mismanagement. He’s getting better but my feelings surrounding him & this subject are shaky at best.
    I feel uncomfortable and like a nag but we will need to discuss this in a way that feels good to us both

  199.  #199Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 8:58 pm

    (((Azure blu)))

  200.  #200Indigo on November 11, 2015 at 9:13 pm

    Sweetpea 192,

    I too have mostly attracted guys who were at least a few years younger than me over the last few years. I have come to the conclusion that is simply where my energy is at. It used to worry me a little but it absolutely doesn’t. Cherry Norris has a lot of wonderful things to say about the older woman/younger man phenomenon, and I say, enjoy it!

    I enjoy the more innocent, fun energy of a younger man, and they seem to enjoy the fact that I’m more centred and grounded than some women their own age (of course here I’m talking about guys in their late 20s, and I’m in my early 30s). I really wouldn’t worry about the age difference with your guy, it’s a great compliment.

  201.  #201Sweetpea on November 11, 2015 at 9:53 pm

    Thanks Indigo I’ll see what I can do about just enjoying it and not questioning it too much.

    He’s super smart and funny. He tells me he likes me because he can have an intelligent conversation with me and that I’m attractive (which always feels good to hear; especially since I can’t believe I’m as old as I am. Where did the last 10 years go?!)

    Plus, he’s one of those magician kind of guys who isn’t afraid to make promises, but then actually follows through on them. I’m pretty much not used to that.

    Physically though, he’s totally not my type. I know Rori tells us to let all of that stuff go, but I guess that’s kind of hanging me up too. I sense that there’s stuff I need to learn from him though, and I suspect the lessons may not be as hard-won as some of the others I’ve learned.

    I’ll check out Cherry Norris though. Thanks for that.

    15 years still seems like a lot. At least I can say I don’t feel like I’m having to raise him. Which is a little ironic because I felt that way in the past a lot with guys my age.

    I’m laughing out loud here after having typed that! Lol

  202.  #202Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 10:15 pm

    192 / 198 sweetpea
    I enjoyed what you shared here!
    I enjoyed reading this….
    I also recently met someone who is younger than me (10 years) and he is also not my physical type….
    He is sweet and confident…he does not have a jaded outlook like some older men I have met …
    He is smart and successful.
    He’s also a good kisser and we had fun the night we met (at a bar)…
    Yea I had a few drinks but anyway, he’s been in contact so I’m trying to remain open

  203.  #203Emerson on November 11, 2015 at 10:18 pm

    I feel hesitant…but I also feel curious…

  204.  #204Sweetpea on November 11, 2015 at 10:47 pm

    Hey Emerson,
    Thank you! I feel happy that you enjoyed what I had to say. I feel curious to see how things turn out with your younger guy.

    Staying open – I guess that’s the key?

    I mean, I wouldn’t feel so bad about a guy 10 years younger, but seriously, this guy is enough younger that I could feasibly be his mom. When I told him this, he asked, “Well, do you have kids my age?”


    “Then I don’t see a problem,” he said.

    I’ve been able to talk a lot more openly with him about what I want in a relationship, while at the same time my brain is screaming, “Is this guy really relationship material?”

    And honestly, he’s probably not. But I guess I’m just going to go with it and see what happens. I feel like I need to protect my heart from being broken, yet at this point, my heart’s in no danger of being brought into the equation.

    At first he was talking “friends with benefits,” and I straight up told him I’m not interested in friends with benefits. I don’t know what I AM interested in with him though, so we didn’t discuss that. He simply said, “Ok. Then not friends with benefits.”

    His friends call him “my boyfriend” in front of him and he’s not at all shy about letting them know we’re together. In fact, one friend in particular met me first and let J know that he had to meet me. His friend thought I was 10 years younger than I am, but now they all know now how old I am. I seem to be the only one who has a problem with it.

    But then there’s the whole, “Can this really go anywhere?”

    Honestly, he’s more like the guys I would have hung out with when I was his age. He has some bad habits that would be deal breakers for me with a guy my age, but because he’s younger, I’m willing to see where the dice land?

    Because I suspect that this isn’t going to go anywhere significant, it’s just practice, then it’s all ok?

    And really, I guess that IS the key, isn’t it? They’re all just practice until they step up and edge out the rest of the competition.

    So… I guess that’s it. Maybe I’ll just call him “PG” (No – not because he’s young; for “Practice Guy.” Sheesh! Lol)

  205.  #205Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 1:30 am

    We were talking about technology the other day and how it can be unreliable. I wanted to offer another example from my own life this morning. There is a contact of mine in gmail chat who has been greyed out for a while. I assumed they had blocked me for whatever reason, but I didn’t think too much about it. This morning I was going into my chat history for another reason and I see this person messaged me a week ago. I emailed them saying I had just seen their message and that they are greyed out on my chat list so I couldn’t reply… have they blocked me? They said no, and so I tried deleting them and re-adding them to chat and there they were again as online. Must have been a tech glitch on my side. Anyway, my days of taking things too personally when it comes to technology, and especially if there’s no good reason why I might not hear from a person, are over. Even Bush Boy the other day said he’d *thought* he’d responded to a message of mine the other day and just got busy.

  206.  #206Emerson on November 12, 2015 at 5:25 am

    Sounds like you’re having fun and I find it is a good idea to continue to CD…that way you won’t think as much about “is he the one/can this work, etc”

    I ran into an ex the other day and he was with his new girlfriend /wife whatever ….
    And it was disturbing. I felt disgusted and also a weird satisfaction ….this is going to sound catty, as I believe all women are beautiful …but his new squeeze was VeRY very plain….I was like really???
    Ugh… I felt guilty for feeling smug.
    I also know he still has feelings for me….he still contacts me but I ignore him.
    Thanks for letting me be honest here sirens….

  207.  #207Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 6:59 am

    Turquoise – how do you have nothing to say? Easy. You just have to decide. People live lies for years.

    I feel so pleased with you about what you shared related to your ex. When we get it that we have choices things shift so easily. He can go home and nitpick with his wife. I realize I have had a deep seated belief for most of life. It is that I have to fight for what I want. Looking at that belief I can see where it plays into situations like that for me. So now I am telling myself that life supports me. I really don’t need to fight. Helps me to relax sometimes when I feel criticized.

  208.  #208Starla on November 12, 2015 at 7:01 am

    I know lots of couples with a big age difference in which the woman is older. And the woman might not be the youngest looking thing, but she has so much to offer, and I totally see how their younger, “hotter” men are just enamored with them. Like any courtship, the younger man learns where he needs to step up to be on the same level as her, and it all works out. Anyway, Sweetpea, since we’ve met a few times, I can say with confidence that you are really beautiful and cool. It’s not like I’m surprised any man wants you, let alone a younger one.

  209.  #209Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 7:05 am

    Sweetpea my thoughts are that you must look hot and must be uptodate on the hip scene to be able to connect so well with younger guys. Celebrate yourself.

  210.  #210Starla on November 12, 2015 at 7:25 am

    Ladies, I am going through something kind of weird. I used to insist to a fault that my boyfriend hear all my feelings and validate me at every turn when things got tense or a conflict arose. Now I notice that sometimes I don’t want this at all, and I am sort of just “giving him grief” because I get worked up, and I kind of crave him taking control of interactions that are escalating. This would look like firmly but kindly telling me I need to calm down or laughing it off and not making it so serious.

    Instead, he escalates in his own way, all while swearing this is all my doing.

    I feel like I hold all the puppet strings on how these things go, and then it ends up being my fault as well.

    Last night, after my telling him all this, and saying that I wanted HIM to decide what steps we take to get past the escalating moment, he said he wanted to drop it, go to the grocery store together and not talk about it so he can calm down. Which is fine by me… but at that point, it was already a fight, and I had so much energy rushing through my body that it felt awful to just stop. I had been pretty much begging him to step in and handle the funk that was happening between us. I wanted resolution of some kind and I wanted it to come from him. It always comes from me. By the time he stepped in to say what he wanted to do about it, I was all steamed up with no spout.

    So now I have this funny feeling… like I need to scream or cry or something to let the energy out.

    We have the rest of our lives to figure this out so it’s not the end of the world. I asked him if he could please practice taking a little more control over escalating situations, but he just resented me for it because he feels like I’ve trained him not to. Which I get, but that again just puts me in total control. I don’t like it.

    He is a masculine man so I just find it silly that he would simultaneously hate how I handle things and then blame me for his own not stepping in to handle them differently. Please oh please take some of these puppet strings out of my hand. Show me that if things start to get weird, that you’re in control and I can count on you to do what’s right for our relationship and right for you.

    I totally admit that sometimes I just start sh** because I want him to do something about it. Yes, I know this is crazy but I also know that a lot of women do this and there’s a reason male relationship coaches and pickup artists address this phenomenon. It is important for me to know he won’t take my sh** and also that he will protect our relationship.

    Comments welcome 🙂

  211.  #211Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 7:28 am

    Wow!!! I feel soo sunshiny reading what you have shared…
    How great to own YOUR life… “Yes… I do need to get that laundry and cleaning done…”

    A gentle reminder to me… I really DONT like house cleaning… and THATs OK!!! :-)))

    I agree with Sweetpea… I feel so happy for your kids to get to be with you and their dad without fighting…
    WHAT a great gift you gave them!!!
    Siren, YOu are Rockin’ IT!!!

    I have gotten much better at NOT being triggered when people bring up things that I could/should be doing…
    I know it’s because of all the Rori tools for loving ALLLL of ME! I am MUCH stronger on the inside
    and I am continually working on giving ME unconditional LOVE
    so I don’t fall apart (well not as often) when
    people try and talk to me about anything
    I know it has helped my friends/family/men
    feel much safer around me!!!

    Ahhh… thank you sirens and rori!!

  212.  #212Starla on November 12, 2015 at 7:30 am

    I was even playfully pushing him with 1 finger, like “come on guy, you look annoyed, what are you going to do about it?” Maybe I can try doing that earlier right when things start escalating.

    I just don’t want all this control. It’s not good for us. I can’t control him into taking more control, lol, it doesn’t work of course. And when I just get quiet, he says absolutely nothing and we sit there for 10, 20, 30 minutes in silence. Weirdness.

    Maybe this is something we can talk about when we’re not in the moment of fighting.

  213.  #213Lovergirl on November 12, 2015 at 7:32 am

    Thanks Azure, Indigo, Dixie. I may need to work on being warm and receptive but its hard to feel like that when I hadn’t heard from him for so long. I felt mistrustful. Oh, and that was the only text he sent all day.

    I guess I’m afraid that his motive is to turn me into a fuck buddy that he hardly ever talks to. Then I would be allowing that by being warm or nice when he hasn’t contacted me in a long time.

  214.  #214Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 7:41 am

    Starla #207
    In my opinion he totally took control…
    and Rori has said this too..
    just like you asked for… He took control

    He is being VERY masculine when he said ” he wanted to drop it, go to the grocery store together and not talk about it so he can calm down.”
    AND YOU can calm down!!

    I did the same thing a few weeks ago with Spirit
    It was a great night… we were with our friends
    We were celebrating a birthday…
    Spirit was being fun and loving and adorable
    as usual… and I started making up crazy things
    in my mind
    that HE WAS NOT DOING!!! Trying to start drama
    for NO REASON
    and then on the way home I started talking about
    how wonderful everything is going with us
    BUT how different we are spiritually and politically
    and I wasnt’ sure how that will work?
    He talked about it for a little while with me
    and then he said…
    I don’t want to talk about this anymore…
    we are having a good time… let’s stop.
    and I said
    FINALLY I was able to stop
    stop all the Blah BLah Blah!!!
    He was taking his masculine role and calming the situation down
    and I was able to agree and be feminine

  215.  #215Lovergirl on November 12, 2015 at 7:43 am

    Starla, that’s hard. One of the big things I resented about my ex husband was his passiveness and refusal to step up. It put me in control of far too much and I HATED it!

    In his case that was just an inherent part of his personality but even so I think women a lot of times have this need to break a man down to where he does things our way, then we lose respect for him because of it.

    That’s one of the reasons I like Rori’s stuff, because she is always reminding us to let the guy take the lead and not be in our masculine energy. If he isn’t responsive to that then he may just be a more feminine man.

  216.  #216Starla on November 12, 2015 at 7:54 am

    Azure, he took control after 30 minutes of my going on about it, lol. But i listened, because it was what i was asking him to do, even if he first did otherwise.

  217.  #217Starla on November 12, 2015 at 7:56 am

    He’s not feminine energy 🙂 so that is ruled out. It seems more and more like we just need to talk about this when we are not in the middle of it.

  218.  #218Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 8:23 am


    My first thought on reading your post in 207, and I’m really sorry if this sounds harsh, was, gosh, how exhausting for him. Perhaps American men are different, I don’t know if it’s a cultural thing, but I don’t know too many men in my circle who would tolerate that kind of thing from a woman for very long. Pretty much every single one of them would say, “I want to get on with xyz (go to the grocery store, whatever) and drop it and not talk about it, and calm down. All of them value a woman who is easygoing, relaxed, happy and easy to please. Pretty much every man I know can NOT talk about things to this extent, and will get upset when we try to force them to, because they don’t think like us, don’t know what we want from them and will just feel frustrated and less than. I’m not trying to be funny by saying this, but the part of men’s brains which control their emotional thinking are literally 8 times smaller than ours, or something like that.

    All of us sirens here on the blog get what you are talking about, because we are women, but your man likely has no idea. I know the thought processes you are describing, because I used to be that way, but I also learnt the value of processing things on my own and not sharing every detail of it with my man, or making him responsible for making every wobbley emotion right. These days I deal with as much as I can on my own, and only when I cannot deal with it any more do I talk to my man about it. It’s great to ask him for a hug or something specific when you are feeling shaky, but making him responsible for bringing you down when you are spiralling? Sorry, no.

  219.  #219Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 8:56 am

    Lovergirl #210
    What do you have to loose to say exactly that!?

    My heart warms up when I see a text from you
    MM (millionare man)
    I feel happy and sparkly spending when we’re together.
    and I feel disconnected and separate when we havnt talked in awhile… what do you think?”

    my thoughts are that if you don’t address the fact that you do like spending time with him
    BUT too much time between feels disconnected

    What do other Sirens suggest?

  220.  #220Starla on November 12, 2015 at 8:57 am

    “Pretty much every single one of them would say, “I want to get on with xyz (go to the grocery store, whatever) and drop it and not talk about it, and calm down.”

    Indigo, yes! I want him to just do this. Instead it turns into this weird stand off where things don’t move on unless *I* direct them to.

    I don’t think any of it is harsh. I laid my stuff out here as honestly as I could because I want the feedback.

  221.  #221Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:08 am

    I totally agree with Indigo #215
    “It’s great to ask him for a hug or something specific when you are feeling shaky, but making him responsible for bringing you down when you are spiralling? Sorry, no.”

    To my thinking “making HIM responsible for bringing you down” is a BIG RORI NO…

  222.  #222Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:14 am

    I am Totally Responsible for ME
    not sure who this is a quote from
    but a GREAT reminder:
    “the act of loving does not depend on him or her.”

    “Non-attachment brings to your loving a quality of universality,
    in which the object of love is not anymore
    the cause of it.
    The source of any form of love is INSIDE YOU,
    and you don’t depend on anyone to be able to express it.
    This is one of the most liberating shifts
    that a person can experience.
    Perhaps, you have always believed that another person is responsible for bringing you
    into the wonderful state of being
    that you call “love.”
    But this erroneous conception is the reason why
    you cling to others,
    you are afraid of their departure,
    and you put upon them the burden of making you happy.
    Once you understand that LOVE SPRINGS FROM WITHIN YOU…
    and that no one else is responsible for it,
    you can continue loving others,
    AND the fear and the clinging disappear.

    You realize that no event in life,
    not even the death of your loved one,
    can take this state of being away from you.”

    “Learning to practice non-attachment is one of the most important tools
    to develop unconditional love,
    a non-clinging attitude towards both things and people,
    and the capacity to enjoy the present moment
    with intensity.
    Accepting the impermanence of life means reshaping all of our assumptions about existence—but thanks to this process, the possibility arises for us to love unreservedly, without conditions, and without fear.”

  223.  #223Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:21 am

    Indigo #215
    NO it’s not a cultural thing… No man in the US likes
    all this drama either…
    and that is how Rori has helped me sooo much
    to STOP being sooo masculine and pushing and pulling and RECOGNIZE
    I AM doing all of this controlling
    and to continue taking control of *ME* in a loving, accepting, kind way…
    Giving ME all the love I deserve..
    But I am still baby stepping it!!
    Which is A-OK
    So great to have all you amazing Sirens
    to help me along my WONDERFUL
    Happily-Ever-After everyday!!

  224.  #224Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 9:24 am

    Starla 217,

    I’d like to add that the ones that would say “I just want to get on with doing xyz and calm down” are the more evolved men I know, and even they would not tolerate having this responsibility all the time. We are the more emotional of the sexes, and men can understand this to some extent, but they also expect us to take a large degree of ownership over our own feelings and meltdowns. This can feel hard and unfair, I know, but it is the way that it is.

    I learnt quite a while ago now that if I wanted to be in a relationship with a man, I needed to allow a certain amount of space between us where I could still process things myself, and only come to him when he was able to close in the gap, and not every time I felt off-balance. There is just absolutely no way they can handle the full-on intensity of our feelings all the time, and Hollywood might lead you to believe something different, but this is really the reality.

  225.  #225Starla on November 12, 2015 at 9:25 am

    Thank you, Azure! Yes, I agree. And it’s not what I want. Right now I can feel how I am completely in control and it’s not healthy. I am in fact an emotionally unstable person in the context of relationships and am working on it with a professional.

    He just shuts down and checks out, or simply follows my lead, when I get charged up. I feel like I hold the puppet strings. It’s very codependent on his part, too, I think. More than anything I just want him to speak up for himself. I really need to feel that he at least has his own back, if not the back of our relationship. Honestly it feels like the 1 big empty void in our relationship and my feelings towards it.

    He told me that when I start getting emotional, what he really wants to do is to tell me to leave. I am glad he doesn’t do that. Kicking me out every time I have a negative feeling would probably destroy our relationship real quick.

  226.  #226Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:28 am

    Rori Says:
    “Men are competitive creatures who value what they have to work hard to get.
    If he gets a sense that you’re completely devoted to him with very little investment on his part, he’ll question your value.
    “This means you do not give away exclusivity to a man until you have the commitment you want from him.”
    “Instead, you keep dating and meeting lots of different men
    so that you give yourself a chance to find out what you really want and need
    from a relationship.
    At the same time,
    you aren’t prematurely cutting yourself off from your Mr. Right in case you haven’t met him yet!

    “When you keep the focus on yourself
    and keep yourself open to other men,
    you send the message loud and clear that you’re a woman who puts herself first and that you are a prize.
    This elevates your “degree of difficulty” so he has to step up his game to get you all to himself… or risk another guy beating him to it.”

  227.  #227Starla on November 12, 2015 at 9:28 am

    I am willing to take total responsibility for myself, but not also for him and for our relationship. I need him to pitch in here. I am starting to escalate the sh** testing because he’s not. Taking responsibility for 3/3 of those things means that I am spread thin and not as able to put the focus on taking responsibility for myself as much as I really should be.

  228.  #228Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 9:28 am

    Azure Blu 220,

    I SO hear you.

    I bought into the lie growing up that my man was supposed to “complete me” and that he needed to be present for every feeling and need I had otherwise he didn’t love me. It is a lie we’ve been sold mostly by Hollywood and pop culture I believe, and it is just absolutely false. I got rather a rude awakening when I got into relationships with real men and learnt that their capacity to deal with drama is very, very low.

    It’s better this way though. We help them to connect more emotionally, and to connect with their and our hearts, and they help to stabilise us and steady our course 🙂

  229.  #229Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 9:35 am

    Starla 222,

    Again, I’m very sorry to say it, but this reminds me of the two children I look after in the afternoon. They are both rather prone to tantrums and emotional meltdowns and rely on an adult to step in and say “enough is enough”. I can tell you, as their au pair, that it is exhausting – even when I am simply looking out for myself and ONLY thinking about my own wellbeing and needs in the situation – to have to step in and say “that’s enough”. Purely speaking for myself, and many people I know, I would never be in a relationship with an adult who required me to do this on a regular basis. That is, put in a boundary and stand up for myself because they couldn’t control themselves enough to respect my boundary and treat me in a calm, even-tempered manner.

    Please think about the burden you are placing on others by expecting this of them, and of your fiance. It really does come down to you to try to do better.

  230.  #230Starla on November 12, 2015 at 9:38 am

    Boundaries are important in healthy relationships. I have boundaries. I need him to have some too. I need him to be responsible for his boundaries and to live them. Right now, he either defers or lashes out. Either extremely passive or extremely aggressive. Neither is really a healthy approach. He always says he is doing something (or not doing something) in our fights because of ME. This really bugs me. How am I supposed to focus on dealing with my own self 100% when I am also 100% responsible for how he feels and reacts too? I hate it and am not surprised I’ve started pushing and testing. I do want to change myself for the better but in this case I am feeling set up to fail.

  231.  #231Starla on November 12, 2015 at 9:47 am

    Indigo, again please don’t be sorry.

  232.  #232Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:48 am

    Starla #222
    Ohhh… you are doing great in just seeing and observing the role you are playing in all of this…
    Also that you have professional help AND Siren Island and Rori’s Tools!!! Yay!!!

    Actually I am getting much better
    at Stopping MYSELF…
    cause it isn’t anyone elses job

    One time a few months ago… Spirit had asked me to meet him at a local bar (I was out with friends) and watch a game with him…
    lovely, I love hanging out and watching with him…
    I’d been drinking and all of a sudden I started getting into it with him (it was legitimate… he grabbed my cell phone and wanted to be nosy)
    I got irate and then started going on about something else… Blah, Blah…
    he got up and went to the bathroom (to defuse the argument)
    and all of a sudden I realized how I was
    and I got up and went home…
    He called and asked what happened…
    and I admitted MY part and said I was annoying myself…
    He was amazed and impressed!!
    Things between us have changed a lot since then
    and I’ve gotten better at taking control o!!

  233.  #233Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:49 am

    the end of my last post
    Taking control OF ME!!!****

  234.  #234Starla on November 12, 2015 at 9:58 am

    Well we just ended up chatting right now about a news story how we are all trained to be so sensitive to the world around us and the whole politically correct thing is going overboard. And that is totally related to what he and I are going through… the feeling like you need to be sensitive to the point of rolling over for others, and because this is unhealthy and oppressive, the alternative to rolling over ends up being lashing out. The news story I saw showcased this perfectly. So I asked if we could talk about how this dynamic manifests in our relationship sometime when we aren’t actually fighting about it.

    I mean, I can spend the whole day trying to analyze it or we can just talk about it and see if we get somewhere. Maybe the conversation will end up with the conclusion that *I* am the problem. And that’s totally fine. But I am desperate for some clarity and feeedback from him and don’t want to keep “winging it” like this. It also might help to review how I drove him to feel the way he feels at this point and for me to apologize and acknowledge that I am open to doing things differently. When we are heated at each other, I do say these things, but he doesn’t hear it as well.

    I will say, one thing he almost never passive about is reestablishing the connection between us when the fight’s over. He goes back to being just as loving and affectionate as ever. I REALLY appreciate that.

  235.  #235Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 10:03 am

    another Rori tool
    For changing the dynamic of an argument:

    Now – remember – you are NOT doing this to be “nice” or “demure” or “girl-like” or “mature”
    to DEFER to him. 
    You’re ONLY doing this for YOU. 
    You’re doing this, you’re practicing this,
    so that you
    So you can stop always reacting to things
    in old ways. 
    So you can stop living in a “defensive stance” and really, really, really be YOURSELF.”

    “He says something that annoys you
    And — the way you normally would — you feel yourself leaning towards him about to speak,
    and… you STOP YOURSELF.

    You literally catch yourself about to break one of my “Four Rules.” 
    You’re about to explain something to a man.
    You’re about to give your opinion.
    You’re about to be reasonable, logical intelligent, smart (and of course this makes sense because he did ask a question, right…?…
    you’re about to solve the problem for him. 
    You’re about to turn into a MAN.”

    You catch yourself and almost actually put your hand over your mouth to keep from doing this.
    You are not about to let this old, crappy,
    defensive, bad pattern that you and your man have
    been dancing,
    this old game you and your man have been playing
    since the beginning of your relationship (or the beginning of the date) —
    to go on for another minute.”
    “Instead, you Lean Back (standing or on the bar stool or the cushy dining booth),
    you smile at your man,
    you tilt your head to the left (that will help you get out of your masculine, thinking mode),
    and you say NOTHING.
    Or at least, almost nothing.
    You could say, “Wow, yeah…” …you could say, “Bummer…” you could grunt out “Ohhhh…”

    And then… everything will change.

    You’ll discover a new ability you never knew you had – you can CHOOSE your words
    and behavior and STILL be completely authentic
    with your feelings.
    Your man — even if he’s totally stuck in this defensive pattern with you —
    will be amazed at your response.
    He might even just smile back at you
    and reach over and take your hand.
    Imagine what your relationship would be like
    if every interaction went like this,
    no matter how it got started.”

  236.  #236Starla on November 12, 2015 at 10:05 am

    Oh dear I sound like such a neurotic and crazy person right now. LOL. Thank you ladies for being so accepting towards me even in my not so fine moments.

    When we got back from the grocery store, I kept doing what it was that he had requested: dropping it. So I was just sitting on the couch, relaxing, not saying a word, and he sat down and said “are you waiting for me to bring up our fight earlier?” LOL. I wanted to scream “stop putting me in control!” but of course I didn’t. I did ask why. He said he asked because he didn’t want to talk about it. Okay. I just nodded. I was glad he was acknowledging what he wanted and going after it, but he sort of put it on ME first by setting it up in the context of what *I* want.

    Women dream of having a man who makes it all about what the woman wants or expects, but it’s turning into an unhealthy thing and it certainly isn’t pleasing him. He is very much mostly dominant so it’s just hurting us.

  237.  #237Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 10:13 am

    Lovely, sunshiny Siren
    ALL of you is GOOD and perfect and lovable!!!

    I feel like you are VERY frightened of emotional intimacy
    just like *ME* (just like most of us here on Siren Island)
    Scary, anxiety causing, over the roof

    and I always and continually badger my man
    and point my finger at him (when three of them are pointed back at me)
    if Rori’s theory is right…
    he is your mirror
    What is SOOO triggering to YOU
    lovely, frightened Siren?

    Can you sit and feel all this fear?
    Love all your fear.
    Bring this fear and rage close
    and hug and hold them
    cause they need your love
    They are parts of you
    and ALL of you is GOOD and perfect and lovable!!!

  238.  #238Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 10:22 am

    Starla #233
    This feels like a perfect response to me:
    ” …I did ask why.
    He said he asked because he didn’t want to talk about it. Okay. I just nodded.”

    I do see what you are saying about his question…
    “are you waiting for me to bring up our fight earlier?”

    BUT i believe (and have experienced this)
    when we STOP our part in the dance
    HE will be able to stop his part…
    Maybe not right away… cause we’ve been badgering
    for awhile…
    But as soon as they feel safe – (If he is capable of changing and learning)
    He will be INSPIRED to react differently.

  239.  #239Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:23 am

    Starla I have to admit I am a bit like and reading your post I can see clearly how exhausting it could be. I also wondered if you had read any of Gay Hendricks books? The Big Leap and Conscious Loving. Gay talks about the thermostat and how uncomfortable we get when we get more love than we are used to how difficult it is to let it in so we look for ways to sabotage. Looking over my life I have seen how that describes me.

  240.  #240Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:24 am

    Remember also Starla that it is a “dance”

  241.  #241Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 10:25 am


    Just to offer another perspective, one you may not have thought of… I am truly one of the most aware, conscious and diligent people I know when it comes to my self-growth, and being aware of dynamics in the relationships and people around me… and even *I* will shut down and say “whatever you want” when a person is creating a level of drama which is above what I can handle. My brain literally shuts down and I go into a cocoon-like state where I just do not engage. You’d never say in those moments that I’m a highly aware, highly intelligent woman who knows EXACTLY what is going on because my eyes simply glaze over and I’m just waiting for it to be over. I have noticed myself going into either “aggressive” or “passive” mode when someone is being excessively and irrationally emotional. I’m not placing the blame for my reaction on them, but again, if you are going to bring excessive amounts of drama into your relationship, it is too much to expect the other person to respond like a highly evolved human being all the time.

    Everything comes back to what you *can* control, which is you. For my part, I try to stay out of the other person’s responses, because that is their business, not mine.

  242.  #242Starla on November 12, 2015 at 10:26 am

    Good questions.
    Part of this is knowing that I have brow beaten him into this position and instead of facing the guilt and culpability, I am criticizing him for not taking himself out of that position. At the same time, I know it’s not right to say I am responsible for how another person responds to me 100 percent of the time, so I resent him deeply for what seems like he is making ME in charge of his reactions and what he does or doesn’t do, all while he hates every second of it.

    I think the biggest driver of my giving him sh** and then insisting he not take it and that he stand up for himself, is my guilt over brow beating him out of doing that for so long.

  243.  #243Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:26 am

    RE 231 Starla though a lot of people don’t like Christian Carter, this comment reminded me of how he says we women want to talk through stuff and how it doesn’t work for me.

  244.  #244Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 10:37 am

    I just feel very strongly, men’s strength is in doing, not talking. And we need to appreciate them for that. They are practical, they can fix things, get stuff done, make decisions, they are NOT capable of spending long periods of time ruminating on things. I feel we need to accept that if we are to be in relationship with them.

  245.  #245Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 10:39 am

    Starla 239,

    Sorry if I am driving this point home, but I really think you just need to accept that he is different from you. He is doing the best that he can, but what you are expecting from him in terms of “taking responsibility” is outside the scope of who he is and what he is capable of.

  246.  #246Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 10:40 am

    From Dominique:

    “2. Look in the mirror.  Who do you see? 
    You see the one person in this entire world you possess. 
    The one person in this entire world you can totally trust, ( totally count on to be on your side. 
    The one person you can put makeup on, dress up, order around, pet, moon over,
    sing to…a million little things…
    without checking with anyone else first. 


    There’s no real way to argue with this! 
    No matter how crappy things might be at this moment,
    or how you’re starting to feel like things might actually be changing for you for the better (they are, if you’re doing the Tools)…
    you still have YOU.

    Go reach out your hand and pet your image in the mirror.
    Now run your hand down your other arm – slowly
    and sweetly, and watch yourself in the mirror.  There’s no limit to how long
    and how lovingly you can do this…
    so you can never get bored or run out of parts
    of you to pet.

    3. Say Thank You to the you in the mirror. 
    In fact – say “I love you.  Thank you.” 
    If you want to really try something, say
    “I love you.  I forgive you.  Thank you.” 
    If you want to try the whole thing…say
    “I love you.  I’m sorry.  I forgive you.  Thank you.”

    That about covers any emotion you could be having – from beating yourself up over something,
    to getting all excited about yourself (good for you!!!)

    Okay, yes, you can be thankful for the roof over your head,
    and that some of the needs on the Maslow scale are being met,
    and you can be thankful that you’re on track to get all the most fabulous of your needs met by the most fabulous man…but only if it feels good. 
    Only if it’s true.

    If you’re actually angry as anything about something…go ahead and be thankful for that! 
    I mean – a good bit of fire in your belly,
    no matter where it came from or where it’s aimed is pretty grand, isn’t it?

    If you’re actually feeling tearful and sorry for yourself – be thankful for that – !

    4. Imagine a fabulous man
    (and the only thing he has to have or do in order to be fabulous is to love YOU) –
    standing there around you – all the time –
    and HE’S saying Thank You.  To YOU.”

  247.  #247Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:42 am

    So I was just sitting on the couch, relaxing, not saying a word, and he sat down and said “are you waiting for me to bring up our fight earlier?” LOL. I wanted to scream “stop putting me in control!” but of course I didn’t.

    Starla you realize you have a choice to change this frame? It is about the perspective that you choose. Him asking that question is not necessarily about putting you in control.

  248.  #248Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 10:47 am

    wonder if
    his love is sooo overwhelming to you
    that you want to convince him
    that really
    you are unlovable?

  249.  #249Starla on November 12, 2015 at 10:50 am

    Indigo, I want to learn more about what that would mean for me. If I just accept that this is how he is, then what does that mean for me? How do I handle things? Things get tense between us at times because we are only human, and then I am responsible for them. That is quite a burden for me. I do think we have to talk about this together. Maybe he will tell me that his preference is that I let things go more. I need to hear what this man wants. I am trying to relinquish way more control than ever, but I need him to provide a little something for me to lean on while I get there.

  250.  #250Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:50 am

    “I guess I’m afraid that his motive is to turn me into a fuck buddy that he hardly ever talks to.”

    Lovergirl remember he can’t turn you into anything you don’t allow him to. Again I am sensing that you need to be in a relationship before you have sex but somehow you are not seeing that. The guy won’t “need” to talk or connect especially when there is no emotional connection before sex. They have an emotional process to go through also and after 4 dates belief it or not sex interrupts their emotional process. Do you subscribe to Bob Grant? He is a male coach who provides free emails and he talks about these things.

    What I am seeing is that you have sex when you like because it is important to you. The question is what is important to guys to get them to build the relationship. Have you focused on that?

  251.  #251Femininewoman on November 12, 2015 at 10:52 am

    Starla you don’t sound neurotic.

  252.  #253Starla on November 12, 2015 at 11:07 am

    Azure, I think you’re on to something, but it’s not so much that I am unloveable. It’s my fear that he will grow irreparably dissatisfied with me and our relationship if he doesn’t start representing himself more and I am then at fault for not mind reading and trying to guess what he wants or needs. When I am charged up emotionally, I want to split my focus between how I am dealing with myself and hearing/responding to what he has to say. Right now, I feel like I have to choose between focusing on myself or focusing on him, because he does not focus on what he wants. And he gets very unhappy at the time, and that scares me, because if he’s unhappy enough, he will leave the relationship.

    These are all good things for me to share with him. I guess it’s not as much of a “sh** test” as it is about abandonment fears. Wow.

  253.  #254Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 11:08 am


    I so, so, so hear you. I was exactly in this place myself. So I want you to know that everything I say comes from a place of deep empathy and understanding. I think what you are saying though is exactly what I am getting at… I think you are growing here, and healing, and you want him to make this more comfortable for you, and I just don’t think this is realistic. It’s not that you are responsible for making things weird between you, because that sounds like assigning blame, and there is no blame here. It is no one’s fault, that is not a helpful way to look at it.

    Personally I think that while all this growing and learning and getting used to a new way of being is going on, that you need to get comfortable with discomfort. You need to be able to up your tolerance for sitting with the uncomfortable feelings and growing pains that are swirling inside you.

    My point is that I don’t think he can really tell you what he wants because he doesn’t understand your process. You want him to make it easier for you but I don’t think he is really capable of that. It gets easier with time, but in the meantime I think you need to practice leaning on yourself more. Not blaming yourself, not overthinking things, just being there for yourself.

  254.  #255Starla on November 12, 2015 at 11:31 am

    Wow Indigo. Yes. 🙁

    I am scared to let things be uncomfortable and unresolved, lest he deem our relationship too awkward to continue. I have zero tolerance for discomfort. Instead of shutting my mouth and backing down, I tried to push him into fixing the discomfort. I am scared of what will happen if things feel awkward or tense between us. Will he notice and decide the relationship stinks and so do I? Part of me does see that he just loves me to death and wants me in his life even if things get clumsy. The other part of me is saying that I am not loveable enough for that to be true. Azure is right. It is about me feeling unloveable at my core.

  255.  #256Starla on November 12, 2015 at 11:35 am

    “You want him to make it easier for you but I don’t think he is really capable of that.”
    Yes yes yes yes yes I do 🙁

    This is all me 🙁

  256.  #257Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 12:11 pm

    {{{{Ohhh Wow Starla…}}}}
    Such Amazing insights you are leading yourself
    So VERY brave!!! and Courageous!!!

    This *IS* all you and that’s a GREAT thing
    Cause You are the Only one you have control of

    Darling Siren!! oxoxo

  257.  #258Starla on November 12, 2015 at 12:11 pm

    Well not just me. Improving communication is always going to help. But it would be a mere bandaid if I didn’t see how my own stuff is happening here. Thank you fw, azure, Indigo.

  258.  #259Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 12:11 pm

    Starla 207,

    My first thoughts when I read this were:

    1) Kudos to you for acknowledging that sometimes you stir up sh** just for the sake of stirring it.

    2) I think it all boils down to this: “This would look like firmly but kindly telling me I need to calm down or laughing it off and not making it so serious.”

    3) You also acknowledge: ” It is important for me to know he won’t take my sh** and also that he will protect our relationship.”

    For me, sometimes it feels good to know a guy will stand up to me and for the relationship. Other times it really just hacks me off to be told, “Calm down.”

    What feels even more frustrating to me though, is for someone to just walk away and ignore it.

    In 209 you say, “Maybe this is something we can talk about when we’re not in the moment of fighting.”

    I think with the acknowledgements you’ve made of what’s going on here for me, you might be on to something in 209.

    It seems to me that you really just want him to step in and say, “Calm down. You’re ok. We’re ok.”

    What if you were super vulnerable and straightforward with him and told him that you realize the reason you keep things going sometimes is for the reasons you stated here (I quoted in 2) and 3)? Do you think it would be helpful at all, not only for you to acknowledge it to him out loud, but also for him to possibly have some understanding about what you’re really wanting from him, in healing this?

  259.  #260Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 12:16 pm

    Indigo #250
    WOW… you are soo wise and warm
    and have such amazing insights into issues
    I love what you are saying here…
    Thank you!

  260.  #261Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 12:24 pm

    Indigo 215,

    It felt good to read your firm, loving and clear statement about what you thought of this situation with Starla.

    It felt very triggering for me to read: “All of them value a woman who is easygoing, relaxed, happy and easy to please.”

    Mind you, this is not meant as an attack toward you, Dear Indigo, but rather an acknowledgement to myself that this felt super icky to read and I’m hoping to gain some clarity on why it felt so bad and gain some healing here.

    Y’know how when there’s this sore spot in you that gets pushed a little, your heart rises to your throat and your pulse quickens?

    Maybe not everyone reacts this way. For me, this is a clear, physical indication that there’s something here – a defense mechanism maybe. Or perhaps, that fight or flight survival response. For me, it means it’s something huge coming up for healing.

    So I’m going to explore this a little and please, please don’t take this as a personal attack. As I said, it’s about me and my stuff.

    When I read: “All of them value a woman who is easygoing, relaxed, happy and easy to please…” what did that bring up?

    A guy who wants it easy. They want nothing expected of them, therefore they don’t have to give anything. I feel anger bubbling up in typing that.

    And now I feel tearful. I think because I’m realizing more and more these days how the way I was raised has affected me so profoundly; the way my dad was when I was growing up….

    Probably the fact that my family ran when the going got tough and left me to deal with big, grown-up sh*t when I was so ill-prepared to deal with it.

    Also though, because I’m generally known as the “easygoing, relaxed, easy to please” one, because I don’t expect anything of anyone?

    Early on in relationship, I’m seen that way and then later, I guess I’ve been known to be the angry shrew. All stemming from the place of not having boundaries and swallowing my anger – leading to resentment.

    Hmmm. Still letting this one take shape.

    Thanks Indigo for giving me this opportunity to get this one out in the open and stir it around a bit.

  261.  #262Starla on November 12, 2015 at 12:29 pm

    Yayyyy let’s all heal and crack open and love what we find inside and then heal some more.

  262.  #263Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 12:39 pm

    Sweetpea #257
    I feel sad reading about your childhood
    and being abandoned to care for your mother
    at such a young age…
    I sense healing going on as you love yourself more
    and sense there might be immense anger you must feel for being abandoned by your mother, father and brother…

    I too have always been the easy going, fun, happy person… *Easy to Please*
    BUT the flip side of that is
    I would bottle everything up and then
    fling it out and surprise everyone
    AND I always looked like the bad guy
    cause I communicated my feelings so angrily!!

    Ohhh… My… since Rori’s tools… (3 years)
    learning to LOVE ME!
    To love ALLL of me…
    I can share my feelings negative and positive feelings!
    BEFORE they get BIG and UGLY

    I’ve learned to soften my voice.
    lighten my tone
    Listen carefully to others
    and I keep practicing
    and getting better!!!

  263.  #264Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 1:00 pm

    Starla 258,

    Yes! Let’s!!

    Also @205 – thank you! I felt really touched and acknowledged reading that. (I wanted to use the word, “great,” but it’s much more immense than that. Words fail me.)

    Here’s something I feel really curious about, so far as this sense I get from you that you see yourself as neurotic and crazy.

    This journey I’ve been on being back with my family the past couple of years and seeing how I played into who they think I am; and then coming here and seeing how my friend sort of plays into the role she held in her family growing up…

    I’m really curious about this role-playing stuff.

    My dad always told me I was rebellious and a follower. Which is completely laughable since I only follow when I think someone has a good idea. I don’t see myself as a leader either, really, but rather a Lone Wolf kind of character. I do what I want, when I want and I rebel against anyone telling me I can’t do that. I’ll follow if I think it’s a good plan, but I don’t blindly follow anyone.

    Yet, I’ve noticed that this role my dad set out for me is one I totally played into being around my family.

    I’ve got something good brewing in me around this; I’m just not completely clear on what it is yet.

    Then, there’s the older guy I dated whose wife cheated on him. He really was a father figure, I guess. Growing up, it seemed my dad didn’t like women much, but because I was his daughter, he liked me just fine. I was different; I was immune to the disdain. But I really wasn’t.

    Anyway, I never really realized it before, but I felt much the same with this older guy I was seeing – like he didn’t like women much, but I was different. I also found that eventually, when things were falling apart between us, that I played into the role he had in his mind of women too, though.

    I, who never started a relationship until months after the previous one had ended, found myself starting up with a different guy before the dust had settled with Older Guy. It was shocking and so out-of-character for me.

    I had to wonder, even at the time, how much his preconceived notions and limiting beliefs influenced my actions and behavior.

    So maybe I am a follower then, if someone’s beliefs could so deeply influence my own actions?

    I don’t know. I’m open to seeing it and loving it if that’s the case.

    I know one thing for sure though, I’m not stuck playing the character anyone else thinks I am, or should be. From here on out, I get to just be me.

  264.  #265Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 1:12 pm

    Azure Blu #259,

    “I too have always been the easy going, fun, happy person… *Easy to Please*
    BUT the flip side of that is
    I would bottle everything up and then
    fling it out and surprise everyone
    AND I always looked like the bad guy
    cause I communicated my feelings so angrily!!”

    I identify greatly with this – lmao! Yep – that pretty much sums it up.

    As for the rest of it – you are utterly correct on all of it. There IS immense anger in me for having been abandoned. Because I was willing to accept excuses and not acknowledge that I had a reason to feel anger, It’s festered and boiled and stewed.

    I’m experiencing major amounts of healing now though, because I’m allowing myself to acknowledge the abandonment and the anger. I don’t feel so much like lashing out at everyone or directing my anger wherever the wind blows. It has a target now.

    Although I have no desire to lash out at my targets, either. I simply don’t want to have anything to do with them at all until the festering and weeping wounds have begun to heal a little.

    It seems like a waste of time to discuss it with them again – it’s all been said. “We wanted you to come with us…”

    “I told your mom if she left me again there was no coming back…”

    It’s all a bunch of BS, cop-out, deny, deflect and it doesn’t address the heart of the issue. They left me and they left her. She left because she had no choice in the matter; which hasn’t made it any easier to bear. They left because they weren’t strong enough to handle it.

    And yes. I feel super angry and hurt about it. But even more, I feel hurt and angry that after all this time, they still can’t acknowledge that I’m a grown-ass, capable, lovable woman who not only can, but DID take care of myself and survived against all odds.

    Now it’s time to stop just surviving, and thrive!

    And of course, to continue my healing and learning to love all of me. Just because they don’t think I’m worth it, doesn’t mean I’m not.

  265.  #266Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 1:16 pm


    And since that little rant felt so good, let me just address this:

    “I told your mom if she left me again there was no coming back…”

    She didn’t leave you, jackass – she went to stay at Grandma’s because you had us living in the boonies at the foot of the mountain, in the middle of winter with no 4 wheel drive and 2-3 feet deep snow drifts!

    Woww! That felt pretty good!

  266.  #267Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 1:18 pm

    Oh, AND, Azure Blue…

    Congrats on this:

    Ohhh… My… since Rori’s tools… (3 years)
    learning to LOVE ME!
    To love ALLL of me…
    I can share my feelings negative and positive feelings!
    BEFORE they get BIG and UGLY

    I’ve learned to soften my voice.
    lighten my tone
    Listen carefully to others
    and I keep practicing
    and getting better!!!”

    That felt so warm and encouraging to read!

    And it really IS key, isn’t it? Being able to share negative feelings before they get big and ugly.

    I’m still working on that, but I’m making some progress. And I’ll keep practicing and getting better – just like you!

  267.  #268Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 1:33 pm

    (((Sweetpea #261))))
    Wow… how far you have come!!

    #262 brought tears to my eyes to read about such harsh conditions with no help!!!
    How brave and kind and courageous you ARE and WERE!!!
    You deserve love, full hearted wonderful love
    From you first and of course
    kind, warm, forever love from others comes with that!!!

  268.  #269Starla on November 12, 2015 at 1:45 pm

    Interesting about playing into roles. I think I am absolutely playing into a role. I don’t even know what I am without that role. I wish I could take it more easy for a while and figure out what that is. I am overcomitted outside of work. For the 3rd time I just tried to arrange my life such that I wasn’t overcomitted, but right away, the 1 commitment I agreed to (a dance thing) turned into quadrupling up on rehearsal time together. It’s like I can never get a hold of my own schedule and time, and it’s never mine to decide what to do with. I am just trying to stay afloat to meet my commitments and my own self care and self discovery is on the backburner.

    Gosh, how I would love to get off of work every day and just have the evening free to go slow, do what feels good, and get lots of sleep. I thought I was going to have that starting in October, but all of a sudden my once a week commitment exploded. It’s frustrating, because if we would just focus at dance practices, we wouldn’t need to meet more than once a week. And if I withdraw, I can’t come back.

  269.  #270IamHis on November 12, 2015 at 1:45 pm

    Had my first guitar lesson today! I’ve been wanting to learn since I was little.

    It felt so invigorating. My instructor and I hit it off instantly, which felt really good. 🙂

  270.  #271Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 4:00 pm

    Oh {{{{{{Starla}}}}}}

    For me, who I am at my core – the “real” me – is how I feel when I’m feeling happiest. Sometimes I just feel happy for no reason in particular, just like I feel grumpy sometimes for no particular reason.

    But the core of me really always feels the same.

    I guess maybe I identify with the real me as that inner child I visit when she’s feeling down. Even though she’s feeling down and hurting, she’s still just this really lovable, sensitive little soul who wants to love and be loved.

    That feels like the real me. The mean me, the drama me, she feels like a defense mechanism to keep the sweet, sensitive me safe.

    Does any of this resonate with you?

    And then I have to ask myself is that little girl a rebel and a follower?

    She’s not a rebel, but she certainly has her own mind about things. She’s super smart and really doesn’t give a damn about what everyone else is doing.

    Just some random thoughts.

    Sorry to hear you’re feeling overwhelmed with things.

  271.  #272Starla on November 12, 2015 at 4:46 pm

    Today was a great day for processing and i can see how ive fallen into a victim mentality, too. Then I started thinking about how social media and society in general sort of glorifies being a victim and villifies anyone who doesn’t show total empathy aka respond how we want them to.

  272.  #273Lilybelly on November 12, 2015 at 4:49 pm

    Wow, just wow.

    This was so good to read, Starla. I am dealing with some of the same issues, mostly not letting crap go, wanting to talk through it until I feel satisfied and I feel frustrated and angry that J doesn’t ” fix” the situation that I want or need fixed. But really, he did fix it, to the best of my knowledge.

    After reading this tonight, I see where I failed. He took care of me in the best way he could and I failed him. I didn’t even say thank you Ugh.

    It will take a whole shit ton of courage for me to share but I will tomorrow. I could really use your comments, Sirens.

    Hugs to you all and thank you for sharing yourselves; heart and soul.

  273.  #274Starla on November 12, 2015 at 5:29 pm

    Lillybelly, someone taught me a great analogy recently. They say I “pick zits.” You know when you just KNOW you need to stop picking at your zit, and experience tells you you’re only going to make it look worse than ever or even leave a scar, and yet you keep picking? You think that just this once you’ll be able to pick it into oblivion and the zit won’t be a problem anymore, but of course it just ends up being this disgusting shameful blob on your face that may even be bleeding and swelling. I always wish I had left it alone. Sometimes pimples aren’t ready to pop because they need more time to get there, but we get anxious and fearful about letting it get any worse (because we fear feeling insecure or unattractive, and we fear someone else will see it) so we pick right into it, and of course this doesn’t make it better, usually just red and inflamed as heck! Of course, someone with the right protocols, training, and tools will be able to extract that sucker with minimal damage to the skin or inflammation, but that’s the key – doing it when the time is right, with the right tools, and the right protocols.

  274.  #275Zara on November 12, 2015 at 5:42 pm


    “Dear X,
    yesterday, I failed to feel the love when you … (did this or that). Today, my heart got smarter and I want you to know how much I respect you for the loving care you take of our relationship.”


  275.  #276BeLoved on November 12, 2015 at 7:41 pm

    “and HE’S saying Thank You. To YOU.””

    Okay, WOW.
    Mind. Blown.
    Why have I not thought of this before?
    Wow, just…wow.
    Visualization happening in 3…2…1…

  276.  #277Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:05 pm

    Always soo good to see you here

  277.  #278Azure Blu on November 12, 2015 at 9:07 pm

    Zara #271
    Ahhhh. so love this…
    “my heart got smarter and I want you to know how much I respect you
    for the loving care
    you take of our relationship.”
    MMM… sooo Warm and vulnerable!

  278.  #279Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 9:17 pm


    I didn’t take your post where you were triggered by my words as an attack at all. I can see how the words were triggering, and I’m just reporting what I have honestly seen with the guys I know.

    A guy who wants you to “make it easy” for him… well, yes. Don’t we all? My life is busy and difficult and draining enough, I don’t want my relationship also to be. But “making it easy” doesn’t follow that he doesn’t care, or that he’s not willing to put in the effort. I think it’s that he wants to know that it is easy for him to know how to please you. In other words, you show him or tell him, simply, and not make things more fraught or complicated than they need to be.

    It’s like Dominique says – it’s the work on self that can feel difficult, relationships are not meant to be. And I think we confuse the two. Those of us who are working on our own stuff, and expect our man to come along with us for the process, and it just doesn’t really work like that. As difficult as it might feel, I think we need to heal on our own, and he will heal as we heal. The relationship itself is the safe place that exists for both of you.

    It is difficult at first… there’s this beautiful song I know and it’s in another language but if someone likes I will translate it, and it describes it all so perfectly and beautifully. But for me – while my very difficult healing was and is going on, I find such comfort in just being able to rest and find solace and love in my relationships. I don’t want to drag them into what I’m going through, and lash out at them in an attempt to make them prove they love me.

  279.  #280Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 9:21 pm

    I’ve heard a lot about love languages but never really studied up on it. I just took a test though, and I think it was pretty accurate.

    Anyone interested in knowing what Love Language works for them? Check this out

    (My results actually brought tears to my eyes; I felt so understood. Now it feels a little silly)

  280.  #281Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 9:39 pm


    I completely agree with you. I knew that what you wrote was true and I feel relieved that you didn’t take it personally in any way.

    I would love to read the words to that song if you care to translate.

    I know that what was coming up for me was purely My Stuff. I just…

    There’s so much coming up for me since I’ve given myself permission to feel hurt and angry, rather than so damn logical about what happened in my past. I never really realized how much I took my shit out on other people – although I guess I should have since I’ve always been so dogmatic about others not treating me badly b/c they’re having a bad day.

    Logically, I totally understand where my family was coming from when they left me. It’s only the last couple of weeks that I’m able to say, “Just because I get it, doesn’t nullify the fact that it wasn’t ok; it was selfish and…” it was just really, really bad. It was irresponsible. It was hurtful. The feeling it gave me is that I wasn’t worth them being there for me. I wasn’t important enough for them to even give a second though to.

    In fact, they really just pretty much put it back on me: “We wanted you to come with us. You could have come with us.”

    Why should I have had to make a decision like that at 17 – to choose between going with my living, breathing, healthy family; or staying with my dying mom? Who the hell thinks it’s ok to put that on someone and then just blows it off because, “You made your decision”?

    Oh God – I can’t even believe I’ve been packing all of this shit around for all this time. I just excused it and let them excuse themselves, but really…

    It is so jacked up.

    I think the biggest thing that triggered me is that there’s no talking to them about it because they just refuse to take any responsibility or consider that it was a messed up thing to do. I’m just supposed to – and I HAVE- been easy-going about it and all laissez-faire and “Oh. It doesn’t really matter. I understand that it was the best decision for you and that’s all that matters. I and my feelings don’t matter.”

    And wow – yes. That feels like the bottom of this deep well of feeling betrayed and abandoned. This is the crux of it all – “What I want and how I feel doesn’t matter; so long as you’re ok and you have a logical explanation, then I’ll just bury my feelings around it.”

    There was no room for emotion in my family. It was all about logic.

    But I wasn’t ok. I’m starting to be ok now, but I have definitely not been ok up to now. I’ve been completely broken and wounded and lashing out at people who had nothing to do with it and don’t deserve to be lashed out at.

    So again, thank you for giving me the space to explore this. Many people would have felt offended because I was bouncing off of something they said. They would have taken the blame and felt as if they did or said something wrong. I truly appreciate the fact that you gave me the space to explore without making it an ordeal.

    Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

  281.  #282Lovergirl on November 12, 2015 at 9:58 pm

    Azure 216- I like that idea. I may try something to that effect when I hear from him again! Thanks!! Nothing today. :p

  282.  #283Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:02 pm

    I know I’m finding healing because I feel ultra compassionate toward my dad and brother right now despite all of this. I know it was a hard time for them too, and more brother has really been hard on himself because he totally blocked himself off emotionally toward my mom during the time she was sick.

    I’m grateful for the time I got to spend with her. I’m thankful that I stayed with her and dealt with it, even though it was hard.

    I love my dad and brother. I know they were just doing the best they could, even though it made things even harder for me. I’m just not ok with saying, “Oh. It’s ok. Let me just make this easy for you and go with it.”

    No. It wasn’t ok. Maybe understandable, but still ever so messed up. And then in rolls the anger again.

    I’m not rehashing any of this because it feels good – I’m rehashing it because I’ve been a hot mess for the past 10 years and it’s time to end this cycle. It’s time for me to dig into it, discover it, heal from it and get on with things.

    My relationships have been a friggin’ mess. I’ve been a friggin’ mess. My business has been dead end. And it’s not that I don’t take responsibility for my own stuff, it’s just time to face up to the truth so I can let it go.

    I’m feeling super angry with myself for burying this so deeply for so long.

    I feel angry with them for being irresponsible and setting a bad example for me. My heroes let me down.

    And actually, my dad hasn’t been my hero for a long time, sadly enough; but my brother. In my mind, my brother could do no wrong. And then he proved himself to be human, too the last couple of years.

    How could he dare be human?!

    All the excuses I made for him – that he was going through a hard time too; that he was doing what he had to do to survive….

    And then I go spend time with him after all of these long years, only to find out that he’s a mere mortal. That he’s still only there for me on the surface and when push comes to shove, not only does he turn on me, he poisons my nephews against me, too. Which is exactly what my dad did when it came to him and my mom.

    It’s just learning. It’s just healing. It’s just growth. And it hurts so bad.

    But the healing when it comes, is so f**king beautiful. I’m feeling the healing now and it’s gorgeous; surreal; unbelievably amazing and awe-inspiring. That we can put ourselves through so much and come out even stronger on the other side is nothing short of miraculous to me.

    I think I may be addicted to self-improvement and personal growth. There’s no better high than finally getting to the bottom of suffering and coming up for air; that first fresh breath of pure, healing air.

  283.  #284Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:05 pm


    Congrats on your guitar lesson. I feel happy that you enjoyed it.

  284.  #285Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:11 pm

    Azure #264,

    Thanks for that. I’m starting to believe I deserve love. I’m starting to feel love and compassion again – for myself and for others.

    I lost that for awhile. I didn’t realize how much I missed it.

    Thank you, Lovely, for your kind words; they mean so much to me!

    Not to sound like a complete ego-maniac, but I’m starting to feel deserving of love. Maybe I really am!

    Woohoo! 😀

  285.  #286Tee on November 12, 2015 at 10:19 pm

    Yesterday was an interesting day. I’m feeling proud of myself for recognizing it, I’m feeling happy.

    Normally, I want to do things my way so when Eric has other plans or opinions, I get upset. Maybe not outwardly upset but definitely on the inside.

    I believe his intentions are to make things easier. Typically, I’m putting my case together in my head to argue my side & my side only. I’m ready with objections, rebuttals and pending I-told-you-so’s. He could sense my impatience and he tells me to relax, slow down, etc.

    And magically, I did. Usually, my head is buzzing with things I wanna say, resentment because I just should have went ahead & did things how I wanted, etc.

    Today was surprisingly easy. I stayed out of his business & let him handle things. It wasn’t anything major.
    I had to get rid of a few bags of diaper wipes because they caused our son to be irritated. I wanted to handle it one way & even when I sought his help…I was still trying to micromanage how he planned on handling it.

    He made a call to a relative with a baby, he asked me how much I wanted for the bags, she said Cool…I’ll pick them up after work. Done.

    My mind was filled with questions and concerns that I forced myself to bury…I said…This is his business, it has nothing to do with you.

    So simple. I just let go & it all felt so breezy and light. I feel like I just got a glimpse of myself from the outside.

    I don’t normally think that I make things harder than they should be. But my thoughts were buzzing around like bees. Why this, what if that, why you gotta, I don’t wanna do, etc.

    Something kept whispering, This isn’t your deal. Mind your business.

  286.  #287Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:22 pm

    I find it interesting that this month’s new moon was on 11-11. I couldn’t remember for sure whether the new moon was about new beginnings, so I looked it up online.

    I’ve always been fascinated by the moon and its phases. My dad grew up on a ranch and taught me about how cows will calve out on a full moon. Ranchers know this and prepare themselves for a long night during a full moon in calving season.

    When I looked it up, I discovered that the new moon this month was in Scorpio. This is what I found:

    “Mercury, which rules the mind, likes to get to the bottom of things when it is in a sign like Scorpio. With the trine aspect to Chiron, this can be an easier time to probe deep enough to become aware of or heal from old traumatic wounds and experiences that have resulted in negative subconscious patterns.

    With Jupiter in Virgo involved with these planets, addressing our wounds and blockages can be fortunate for our physical health, work, duties, and organizing our lives and lifestyle. For people who are currently overwhelmed with responsibilities, this can be a time where you can reach a ‘block’ which can only be removed by some sort of healing or transformation. Heal from the past to build a better future.”

    It seems there’s been a lot of old, deep stuff coming up for healing here for many of us the last couple of days; especially you, Starla and me.

    I want to embrace this “block” being removed by healing and transformation so we can heal from the past and build a better future.

    I’m still not sure how much I believe in astrology and the planets and how much they affect our lives, but since we’re what percentage of water?

    Alot. It only makes sense to me that since the moon affects the tides, it would also affect the human body. Am I giving the moon more power than she deserves?

    I’m not sure I care. I just want to embrace that healing so I can build a better future. I embrace that. I accept that.

  287.  #288Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:25 pm

    FW #206,

    Your perspective here felt great to read.

    Thanks! I believe it just may be time for a celebration!

  288.  #289Sweetpea on November 12, 2015 at 10:28 pm

    Time to rest after a roller coaster ride day full of emotions.

    Sweet dreams, Sirens and thanks for all of your support today!

  289.  #290Starla on November 12, 2015 at 10:29 pm

    Tee that is AWESOME, keep it up girl, that’s the path to exactly what you’re looking for.

  290.  #291Starla on November 12, 2015 at 10:36 pm

    Things are much better for me over here. Thank you sirens for guiding me today. It felt like being taken under a safe wing.

  291.  #292Indigo on November 12, 2015 at 10:47 pm

    “As jy wil” (If you want to) by Anke Pietrangelli:

    It feels as if the world is falling on me today,
    Everything is just wrong, and I want to cry, that’s all
    It feels like everything is pushing me up against a wall,
    I just want to disappear, I wish the world would swallow me up.

    Don’t hold me tight,
    don’t leave me either
    I don’t want to be this way
    It’s the worst not to know
    Not to know what’s going on with me.

    But in your arms, the voices go quiet
    In your arms, the voices go quiet.
    And tonight when it gets cold, will you come and lie next to me?
    If you want to… if you want to.

    I’m sorry I sometimes take it out on you
    When everything just gets too much
    And I can feel I’m caving in
    You keep me alive, by giving me the space
    Leaving me alone, and later for me to realise on my own that I was wrong.

    Don’t hold me tight,
    don’t leave me either
    I don’t want to be this way
    It’s the worst not to know
    Not to know what’s going on with me.

    Hey you, I hope you love me enough
    To leave me alone, without ever letting me go
    You know, I just want to cry and fight
    Get it all out of me
    While I know you are waiting, behind the defences, for me.

    But in your arms, the voices go quiet
    In your arms, the voices go quiet.
    And tonight when it gets cold, will you come and lie next to me?
    If you want to… if you want to.

  292.  #293Millie on November 13, 2015 at 1:21 am

    When I’m with a new man, I find myself asking myself if I can see myself with him? Can I envision marrying this man ? Can I envision this being the only man I am with for the rest of my life? No matter how early, I ask myself these things. And the answer is always no. I wonder if my expectations are too high? If I’m clinging to a feeling, an ideal from the past, hoping it will return to me…a familiar safety. But instead I feel like I’m outside of myself. In the moment but at the same time not invested. I don’t care. Shouldn’t I care??
    This new man I am seeing is great. He really is… He has been married once and in two long term relationships aside from that, and the last girl he dated was for over a year. I am in shock he can find that many people he feels could be right for him! I can’t imagine staying with anyone I wasn’t going to marry for one year much less six. I wonder if it’s me… Am I holding a wall up so tight that no man can get in??

    I have this urge to chase after M….STILL! How is that possible?! I want to look him up, drive to his new home and show up at his doorstep and ask for closure, ask to knoe what happened, why did you ignore me?!! Address meeeeee!!!!!!!!! Speak to me!!! Oh how I want to pathetically, but beg to know the why…… I feel like I can’t trust anyone until I know the real story from him.

    I don’t want to be alone anymore but I don’t want to deal with the rif raf of online dating either….

  293.  #294Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 2:20 am

    Millie let yourself off the hook

  294.  #295Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 2:25 am


    Yeeeeessssss, what Feminine Woman said.

    Your feelings are your feelings, just allow them. Stop fighting them. They’re valid, they’re ok, they’re normal, they’re allowed. Just be, and do what feels right for you.
    If you can’t see yourself with someone long term, then don’t be with them long term. Date them until it no longer feels right to do so.

    I must have dated more than 30 guys in the last 3 years, and I could only envision one of them as my husband.

  295.  #296Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 2:28 am


    I’ve probably asked you this before, but do you have any words of insight / wisdom / encouragement or support for a long distance relationship?

    Bush Boy is the real deal. And someone I absolutely feel is worth seeing where this goes. So I’m mentally preparing myself for the exhilaration and hurt of long distance. I think I’m fine with it, but I think it’ll be a bit of an emotional rollercoaster. Anyone got some words of wisdom?

  296.  #297Victoria on November 13, 2015 at 3:07 am

    No words of wisdom, but you can count on me to pull your leg once in a while :-).
    When I was back at university there was a girl who was dating a guy from a different country. He let her know that he was applying for a particular school in the US for MA, and, without telling him she did, she applied to the same school (she actually applied to several schools and simply did not make a big deal of whether or not they would be applying to go to the same place). Eventually, they were both admitted, and when she let him know he was greatly surpised (did not seem happy or unhappy, just surprised). At the time, it seemed to me that she was pushing herself so hard on him. Anyway, several years later, they have 3 kids and live happily married in the US.
    It seems to me that when you do what’s best for yourself things really work out around it.

  297.  #298C on November 13, 2015 at 4:09 am

    Hi Rori,
    Your tools have worked amazingly on my relationships! I was with a toxic man with an addiction but who’s also very skilled with women, having a 20 year long happy marriage behind him. I broke out of the co-dependency I was in with him, and another AMAZING man showed up!
    As I told the new man I don’t want a boyfriend, he proposed almost right away. Now the problem is, the former toxic man is ALSO stepping up and starting to give me what I need! I love him deeply, like a soulmate, and feel so great to see him back in masculine energy. But I’m also growing closer to the second each and every day, I feel so safe with him and he’s exactly like the man I’ve imagined myself marrying. So my question is, how can I delay my answer to his proposal until the toxic man has catched up? I feel like it’s only then that I could possibly decide who I want to spend my life with.
    Thank you so much Rori!

  298.  #299Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 4:13 am


    I always appreciate your sense of humour so please keep it up 🙂

    Bush Boy let me know right from our first date that there was a strong possibility of him being posted to this particular town, and I must say even back then internally I was fine with it. I felt completely relaxed about it. There’s a good feeling, a feeling of rightness to this.

  299.  #300Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 4:39 am


    Thank you for the great analogy. I totally get it and was nodding while reading your words to me. Thank you for taking the time to respond.

    Zara, thank you for your beautiful script. I will jot this down and say these heartfelt words when the opportunity arises. I literally said, “Awwwwww, that’s it exactly” when I read this and it brought tears to me eyes.

    I am so often, not good getting me feelings up and out and into meaningful messages to him, like this and I KNOW this can draw him closer. I like these samples of scripts.

    I found out that there have been excessive texts between him and a female co-worker and I immediately returned to my state of feeling suspicious and angry, defensive and betrayed but it wasn’t anything like that at all. Yes, it was excessive and I do not want my husband texting another woman excessively, no matter who she is. It is something that is a huge issue for me. So when we discussed it, and I did tell him how I felt about it in a calm, soft voice. I shared that I felt disrespected, (because he knows this is an issue for me, it was not new) and that my heart felt like it was being stabbed, (it did, it wasn’t drama but looking at it from where I sit now, I realize that it was the old tapes of the past playing) and he assured me that there wasn’t anything going on between them.

    He looks at things differently than I do. I suspect it is the male vs female component in play. She is “one of the guys”, in our fantasy football league and also is “friendly” with me. I feel uncomfortable around her, but because she works for J, have been kind and giving.

    Anyway, he let me know that he would take care of it and what he did was tell her to stop texting him unless it was work related only. He shared how it made me feel and what it looked like to me and she said that she understood how it must look and that she in no way wanted to cause issues between us.

    THAT is how he took care of it and me, in this situation. And as I said last night, I failed at acknowledging his efforts. I wanted him to exude words of love for me and only me, but his response after telling me there was nothing going on, was for me to drop it. He felt like he needed to defend himself.

    That is the piece I mentioned about wanting to talk it out until I felt completely safe but where he had taken care of it and it was over. This is the piece I need to work on. Seeing it is half the battle, yes?

    Last night when he returned home, I told him that I appreciated him and thanked him for taking care of this and by doing so, taking care of me. He reached out, hugged me tight and said, “your welcome, baby.”

    and we continued on with a lovely evening together, filled with laughter and fun while watching football. It was a lovely, lovely evening.

    I know I could have handled this whole thing better and I need to get to a point where I can recognize the old tapes/triggers playing before I let them roll out of my mouth. I need to recognize, and stop on a dime the moment that I feel myself going “there.” I suspect that I have not been easy to live with.

    Comments and tips are most welcome.

    thank you all.

  300.  #301Emerson on November 13, 2015 at 4:40 am

    Sirens I need some feedback…
    I made the unsireny move of agreeing to drive to meet a cd…now I’m feeling tired and not wanting to go that far tonight that far after work…..I need to text him and maybe suggest meeting closer to me…we live and work an hour+ from each other ….
    What should I say?
    “I feel tired today being Friday, it would feel better if we could meet closer to me in the xxx area. What do you think?”

    Any suggestions welcome

  301.  #302Victoria on November 13, 2015 at 4:41 am

    Would you go live there for any reason other than to be with him?

  302.  #303Emerson on November 13, 2015 at 4:57 am

    292 indigo
    Probably not what you want to head but in my opinion unless one person moves, long distance relationships are doomed.
    I’ve been there.

  303.  #304Emerson on November 13, 2015 at 5:00 am

    Ugh this is familiar territory for me.
    You handled it beautifully and maturely.
    Sounds like a good outcome.
    I feel annoyed that we even have to tell our men it’s not appropriate but anyways …you handled it well…..
    I can learn from this…

  304.  #305Zara on November 13, 2015 at 5:14 am

    (((((( Millie )))))

    *****I have this urge to chase after M….STILL! How is that possible?! I want to look him up, drive to his new home and show up at his doorstep and ask for closure, ask to knoe what happened, why did you ignore me?!! Address meeeeee!!!!!!!!! Speak to me!!! Oh how I want to pathetically, but beg to know the why…… I feel like I can’t trust anyone until I know the real story from him.*****

    Dr.Pat Allen says men before andropause marry women from the waist up. Their mind process datas untill all requirements for marriage are met.
    While women before menopause run the risk to “marry” a man from the waist down. They run the risk to get bounded through intercourse by the oxytocine it produces.
    They very often feel like they are committing adultery when they first go back to dating after a break up. The period of detox from the bounding can last as long as two years. Every time the woman meets/ sees/ hears/reads from the man she feels bounded too, the count towards the 2 years starts afresh.

    It is a blessing M is completely absent from your world. It keeps you moving steadily towards freedom. It feels respectful of your right to fall in love and have children while you still can.

    Even without intercourse, it can happen that two strangers meet just once at an event and they feel such a “mind blowing” chemistry, that, although they don’t meet again, the high can still remain in their body up to 3 days following their “mind blowing” encounter.
    And everybody else, even their own beloved spouse, feels dull to them during these 3 days. It is purely a chemical chain reaction which, by itself alone, says nothing about the compatibility and the communication skills required for a loving long lasting relationship.


  305.  #306Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 6:46 am


    No, I would not, but this place is absolutely beautiful. I’ve been there a couple of times and loved it. And, I’ve been in this situation before. I moved up to Namibia to be with my ex-husband and whilst I certainly wouldn’t have chosen that place for myself, it was 2 of the happiest years of my life.

  306.  #307Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 6:55 am

    Emerson 296,

    I think your script was perfect. Authentic, simple. I have done the same thing myself many times with no bad results.

  307.  #308Victoria on November 13, 2015 at 6:57 am

    How about your own plans to emigrate to another country?

  308.  #309Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 7:05 am

    Lilybelly 295,

    I so hear you. The “other women” trigger is a huge one for me. And it can spring up on me really unexpectedly, so I know there’s still some unhealed stuff there. I always appreciate when other women share on this issue, because it makes me feel less alone, and less crazy.

    You handled it so beautifully. And the good news is, in my experience with this issue, the more you heal around it, the less it shows up in your life, or the quicker you are able to resolve it and move past it. The last experience I had with “other women” was the Facebook incident I wrote about, and even though it was harmless, it quickly taught me some very valuable lessons. Firstly, for me, behaviour where guys are interacting too much and inappropriately with other women is a dealbreaker for me. So they’d either need to accept this and change their ways (whether it’s by me bringing it up or them changing of their own initiative), or I’d need to move on. The second lesson was just to ask myself what amount of knowledge of my man’s online activity (whether it be Facebook, texting, whatever…) I can handle at what stage of the relationship. I came to the conclusion that it feels better for me to choose trust, and that Facebook was a no-go until we are a very established couple. Whew. It felt great to realise these things.

    I feel so so so so so so happy that Bush Boy is in a place and profession where there aren’t many desirable women, and that we’re not friends on Facebook (and if we were I’d unfollow him).

  309.  #310Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 7:07 am


    Yes, those are still plans that I have. I’d love to do that. However, I’d subordinate that need to the right relationship. Who knows how things will turn out in the end?

  310.  #311Zara on November 13, 2015 at 7:42 am

    ***** 292: Indigo says:
    I’ve probably asked you this before, but do you have any words of insight / wisdom / encouragement or support for a long distance relationship?*****

    It depends what you want from a relationship.

    If you want to nest and share a household with a man, then I back up Emerson’s comment.

    Be clear and negotiate the terms of the relationship before you accept exclusivity.
    Negotiate which one is willing and able to move, in the future, to the other one’s town.
    Be clear the other is willing and able to welcome the first one in his town and in his house when the time comes to move in together, and if the house is not fit to nest a couple, negotiate how a better house can be bought/rent.

    Before you accept exclusivity, check how comfortable you feel with the number of meetings per month you have had so far, and how often he calls you.
    Negotiate how long you are willing to stay long distance before the moving in happens.

    Then give it a try long distance until it feels bad.
    You never know, it could keep feeling good until the moving in happens.

    Now, if you don’t want to feel married and you like a lot of me time, and you like to keep your own space yours, your own decisions yours, etc… then long distance can be a place with no time limit, where you keep enjoying your independence while enjoying feeling connected to another human being. It all depends where your balance sits at.

    Dr.Pat Allen was married 4 times, which is part of what made her what she is today. She’s got many children and grand children and great grand children. She’s learnt about human relationships from her own personal experience and from her doctoral studies based on scientific observations.
    She says too much being together kills intimacy and too much separateness also kills intimacy. It is a question of negotiating the balance where the relationship with this specific man at this specific stage of your life feels comfortable.

    When her boy friend before last, died (he died smiling, as she likes to say), there already was a new man attending her own seminars, applying her own tools to court her. And he won her with it.
    He lived in Texas and she in California (I think).
    She kept in her male energy during the week days, at work, and she loved switching into her girl during the weekends and the holidays spent with him, and on the phone with him, letting him believe he was a better man than she is.
    She would go to visit him to Texas, and he would come to visit her and they also planned trips together. They called each other every single day.
    Their long distance relationship lasted 5 years until he died this year in May. (Smiling too, as she says). She is 81 years young today.
    Shortly after his death, there already were 3 or 4 men queuing to woe her.
    She is welcoming their courtship.

    It really depends on where your very own personal balance sits at.


  311.  #312Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 7:52 am

    Awwww, thank you Emerson and Indigo..

    I really felt and still feel that I could have handled it better. The part I could have handled better was my feelings and my reaction; you know, the shaky in your stomach feeling and jumping to conclusions that were based on the old tapes and not on reality at the moment.

    I have to figure out a way to STOP in THAT moment and am not there yet. This is hard work for me. I am up to the task but man, it is hard.

  312.  #313Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 8:25 am

    Zara 306,

    Thank you very much for this. You have laid out the issues really well. xxx

    I have never considered a long distance before. When I was dating online if a man was more than a half hour’s drive away it was a no go right from the get-go. So I was very surprised when I met this man, and he told me what he did for work, and what it entailed, and when he described being sent to this particular town, which HE specifically wanted, and straight away he talked about me coming to visit him there, and I felt internally, “Yes.”

    I am a very independent woman, and I like a lot of freedom and me-time, and I have never found a way to successfully negotiate this in a relationship. I realise that wanting this is not without its downsides… it shrinks your pool of available and suitable men quite a lot. But when you find someone who “gets it”, there is no feeling quite like it. I am a deeply intense and emotional person, and I put a lot of myself into my work, and into my friendships, my passions, hobbies etc…. so sometimes when I come home in the evening I am worn out and a little difficult to be with. I also get triggered like we all do, but I really can’t stand to let these affect my relationships too much. I am really a person who just needs to be “let be” a lot of the time. I have this internal feeling that long distance would suit me very well at this time in my life.

  313.  #314Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 9:26 am

    Lilybelly one thing jumped at me when reading your recounting of the situation was the word respect. Have you made a conscious effort to internal agree with yourself to respect him? Do you use the word respect in your conversations with him?

  314.  #315Tee on November 13, 2015 at 10:12 am

    #286 Starla, thanks! I’m proud of myself. It was a very different feeling. It felt like my body stopped buzzing. Its always buzzing with questions/scenarios where I’m somehow the victim or about to be, trying to mentally put together arguments, just in case…situations where I have to explain/defend/protect myself, etc.

    So theres always this low grade hum inside me. There was no hum yesterday and it felt odd. I relaxed, we joked around and watched Mean Girls about 5 times together 😛

  315.  #316Zara on November 13, 2015 at 10:36 am

    282 310: Tee

    Wow! You are getting this so fast! I feel amazed! 🙂


  316.  #317Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 10:39 am

    Hi FW,

    I do use the word respect. I also say words like appreciate and value.

  317.  #318Starla on November 13, 2015 at 10:41 am

    You guys watched mean girls FIVE TIMES? lol.

  318.  #319Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 11:02 am

    What a good read about Pat Allen!!

  319.  #320Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 11:03 am


    You are brave.

    And this:

    “There’s no better high than finally getting to the bottom of suffering and coming up for air; that first fresh breath of pure, healing air.”

    I agree. For me, there is nothing like that AHA moment when it finally hits you and one, you find out you really aren’t crazy after all (I have thought this about myself..) and two: there is hope for growth and continued healing.

  320.  #321Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 11:04 am

    That’s great Lily. Just don’t use “with all due respect” is what I recently learned because inherently what comes next out of that persons mouth is something disrespectful. Also I’d encourage you to get rid of “I feel disrespected”. It really is not a feeling it is more “you are being disrespectful”.

  321.  #322Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 11:21 am

    Thanks, FW.

    I did feel disrespected, like my feelings surrounding this didn’t matter.

    How would you have framed it? I’m curious as to what other words I could have used?

  322.  #323Tee on November 13, 2015 at 11:45 am

    #311, (((Zara))) thanks! It’s easy to stay outside of E’s reach when I’m busy because I feel ok because it’s a legit excuse. The times when I’m not busy are the hardest. It’s not easy focusing (for some reason) on myself. I spend too much time in my head thinking about E or our son. I wonder about dinner and haircuts, etc instead of enjoying my time when they aren’t with me.

    #313, ((Starla)) I just picked up Mean Girls the other day from the library because I wasn’t sure that I had seen the entire thing. I watched it then left it in the dvd player and left to do something . When I got back E commented on the beginning being real funny & he asked me to rewind it. That’s how we ended up watching it a few times, laughing and quoting the movie 😛 I didn’t think he’d be into it but he loves a good comedy.

    I think I am getting good at this 🙂
    I just got back (again) from the library to return a few things, get some more things. I get home and E isn’t here. (He’s off today too) My thoughts wander to their usual place. He’s out drinking with a friend, a girlfriend, why didn’t he at least let me know, etc

    I talk myself down. I don’t always let him know my every single move, if he wants you, he’ll call, don’t worry, he’ll be back, he’s a grown up, this isn’t your business, etc. So I let it go, and just like magic, he contacts me 🙂

    He says that he went to his mom’s house to pick up his leaf blower to get rid of all the leaves in front of the building, he said that the broom isn’t working and that he’s already on his way back 🙂

    I know that I have to keep practicing & not fret too much when I lose my way.
    I’m getting it lol yaaayyy!

  323.  #324Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 11:50 am

    Way to go, Tee. Nicely done.

  324.  #325Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 11:54 am

    Lilybelly 317,

    I have started saying “I don’t want …. (xyz)”

    “I don’t want to be screamed at”

    “I don’t want to have to worry about other women”

    I find it very clear and powerful. And there’s no blame.

  325.  #326Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 12:37 pm


    I do like and use I don’t want statements, especially at work but need to use them more, when appropriate, at home.

    Thank you for the reminder, Indigo.

  326.  #327Dominique on November 13, 2015 at 1:17 pm

    Sweetpea – 281 – This isn’t ego maniacal sounding at all. You always have been deserving of love and totally adorable and lovable. As an individual though, most if not all of us are the last to really get this. YAY you!!!


  327.  #328Azure Blu on November 13, 2015 at 1:23 pm

    Tee #318
    Wow… YOU ARE totally getting good at this!!
    I am VERY impressed…
    So nice to read how you do this step by step…
    I’m learning alot!

  328.  #329Azure Blu on November 13, 2015 at 1:27 pm

    {{{{SweetPea #281}}}
    You are very welcome…
    Thank you for sharing your journey
    as you work through your past and
    begin the healing… How very courageous
    and vulnerable.

  329.  #330Azure Blu on November 13, 2015 at 1:27 pm

    thank you for the interpreted song/poem…
    soo nice!!

  330.  #331Dominique on November 13, 2015 at 1:31 pm

    Lilybelly – 295 – Actually you handled this beautifully, perfectly, and I applaud you. So old tapes came up, and maybe in the moment the words you wish you had said weren’t there. BUT you recognized it right away (that lovely awareness you now have and in spades), and you pondered it all, AND you went back (which it totally okay to do) and expressed your appreciation for him and his actions which translates as love. And he responded in kind. Awesome!!!


  331.  #332Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 1:32 pm


    Yes, those are still plans that I have. I’d love to do that. However, I’d subordinate that need to the right relationship. Who knows how things will turn out in the end?

    emm – It’s like this comment hit me like a ton of bricks. He moved away to live his own life. That is what he wants to do not move away from his life plans to be in a relationship. Why would you abandon your dreams for the right relationship? Isn’t this such a female way of thinking? A man would never allow a woman to derail his plans when he is on a mission. It is like a belief that we can’t have it all. Oh boy oh boy oh boy. Can I see myself in that statement.

  332.  #333Dominique on November 13, 2015 at 1:33 pm

    Emerson – 286 – It would feel so much better if we could meet closer to me. It’s been a long and tiring week. What do you think?


  333.  #334Femininewoman on November 13, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    Lilybelly I’d say try to go back in your memory and see if you can put words to the what you were feeling in your body.

    I understand what you mean by feeling disrespected. I really do. I can put in words how I tend to feel but I’d rather you share your experience in the best way you can first. That way you won’t get kinda led by my experience which did take me a while. Also different situations can have different words. Many times also I have tried to explain to people that what they experience as disrespect another person don’t necessarily experience it that way. Needless it is met with resistance by many.

  334.  #335Dominique on November 13, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    Lilybelly – 317 – I don’t have a problem with the word – disrespected – yet what’s under this? Fear, yes? A felling of not feeling so important? Abandonment possibilities?

    So how would it feel expressing the deeper truth here? Can you explore this for a moment, and see what you come up with?


  335.  #336Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    Indigo #288,

    Oh my! I have tears streaming down my face – that is SO beautiful!!

    Thank you so much for taking the time to translate – I love it!!!

    I think I’m going to print it and hang it up somewhere.

  336.  #337Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 2:46 pm

    Lilybelly #295,

    Wow, Lilybelly! That was awesome to read!!

    You may not have handled it as perfectly as you wanted, but DAMN girl! I think you did fantastic, great, beautifully!!

    Very well done!

    The old crap may have come up for you, but you handled it calmly;

    You didn’t bury it; you talked about; AND…

    When you didn’t show him the appreciation he was deserving of immediately, you realized and later did.

    When I grow up, I wanna handle stuff just like you did!

    Wooohooo!! 😀


  337.  #338Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 2:59 pm

    Lilybelly #307,

    Was your reaction really unreasonable?

    I’m not sure it was.

    Jumping to conclusions, maybe, but seriously…

    A guy I’m involved with – especially exclusively (I assume you are)… that would have to be one of my boundaries. As far as I’m concerned, if it’s not work-related, there’s no reason for a woman to be contacting my man without my being involved in the conversation for any reason whatsoever.

    I really don’t care if she’s a lesbian. That’s a big no-no for me.

    Based on my passed experience, maybe? Yep.

    I don’t care.

    I have yet to be involved in a situation with a guy who was “friendly” with another woman where it didn’t turn out badly.

    Not to plant any seeds of doubt, (because it’s obvious to me by the way J handled it that there’s nothing out of order going on there), but I remember this long drawn-out debate on a radio show where guys were discussing whether or not a man could be “just friends” with a woman.

    The general consensus was a resounding “no.”

    That’s a boundary that just shouldn’t be crossed, in my mind. And if a woman is crossing it with my man; especially a woman who knows me, I’d probably call her out on it before I would him.

    Maybe this is something I need some healing on, but, “uh uh.” That is not okay in my world.

  338.  #339Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 3:07 pm

    Lilybelly #315,

    I don’t feel so brave, but thank you!

    Haha – I’ve thought I was crazy too, at times. I’ve acted crazy, too. It all stemmed from sitting on stuff; letting it fester and then (to use Starla’s analogy) like a bad zit…

    Kaboom!!! It all just exploded all over everyone in the general vicinity.

    Seriously, I tamped things down so much for awhile and stewed about whether or not I was crazy to be feeling that way for so long, that when the dam burst…

    It hit EVERYbody.

    If you ever wondered if you were sane before, try that one on for size. Lol

    And YES! There is hope for growth and continued healing. Thankfully, there is.

    Wouldn’t it suck to be stuck like this forever?!

  339.  #340Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 3:09 pm

    Tee #318,

    Awesome! Thanks for sharing that!

  340.  #341Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 3:10 pm

    Dominique #322,


  341.  #342Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 3:14 pm

    Azure #324,

    Thanks. Actually, it’s finishing up the healing, I hope. This one’s been hanging out there for a long time.

    It’s one I’ve already discussed with my family b/c I knew it was a sore spot. It just took me until now to realize that accepting their excuses, rather than taking a stand for me, was not getting me past it.

    Thanks for the comment though. I was feeling kinda’ badly today for having spammed the blog so much last night.

  342.  #343Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 3:43 pm

    Mmmm. I’m sure there’s some healing at hand here and I don’t want to mess that up, but I would feel incredibly disrespected in Lilybelly’s situation.

    It just IS disrespectful for a woman who knows me to do a lot of texting with a man she knows I’m with.

    Respectful would be having some boundaries, or at least respecting that I do.

    The best boss I ever had was a man who was attracted to me. He had been unfaithful to his wife and one of the ways he treated her with respect was to let her know that he was attracted to me.

    They used to have me and my fiance over to watch football or races and sometimes just to hang out in the jacuzzi and even after I split with my fiance, I would still go have dinner with them occasionally.

    However, he and I both respected his wife. The way we showed her that respect was by not having personal conversations, phone calls, sending texts, etc. that weren’t work-related. If we wanted to talk about personal stuff, we did so in her presence.

    That is just what you do, in my book.

    I used to have lots of guy friends. Once they started getting girlfriends or getting married, we stopped “hanging out” together. Because I knew the guy first, I would still call them IF I had a reason to. However, I do NOT call or text them just to chat.

    That is showing respect, not so much TO them, but to the girl in their life – and saving them headaches in the process. Or at least potential headaches.

    Since most of my guy friends are now married or involved in serious relationships, I don’t have many guy friends anymore. I could and WOULD still call them if I needed something, but unless I’m inviting them AND their girl out or having them over for dinner, we’re not having personal conversations.

    In my book, that’s the price you pay for respecting your friends.

  343.  #344Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 4:20 pm


    I did feel disrespected, by them both. She is not someone that I am close with at all, I do not consider her a friend or even someone that I would want to adult with.. (ie, have grown up beverages with). I feel uncomfortable around her and the few times that I have been forced to be in social situations with her, she has not handled herself well.

    I honestly don’t think that she even considered how I would feel, and clearly J did not either. I am considered a groovy, fun and hip chick by the women he works with so I am sure my feelings about the excessive texting were not considered. That’s fine, they both are aware now and he has taken care of it.

    I did feel disrespected and there is deeper fear surrounding that as Dominique asked me to consider. And it is fear of abandonment by J. And, fear of betrayal again. That fear alone, can drop me to me knees.

    He and I have been through more than newlyweds should go through at this early stage and this stems from right before our marriage to about a year ago. I haven’t completely healed from it yet and talk of this several blog posts back.. and this fear of abandonment is big and it is ugly and I am not sure how to tackle the healing of this and to feel solid in my footing and in me but I suppose, it is in the baby steps.

    I will say, that he is the most patient man with me and my stumbling. And I have stumbled a lot in the last year and especially in the last six months. I wonder why it got worse.. Like I said above, I know that I have not exactly been easy to love and to live with at times. He hasn’t left yet.

  344.  #345Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 4:35 pm

    Dominique #326

    Thank you so much. I really thought I hadn’t handled it well and I think in the beginning I didn’t but I was able to get better focused when I took some space away from it to think about it and look within and it turned out way better than it could have. My initial thought was..not again… (hello fear of all of those things..)

    I was actually going to pack a bag and run. I was that scared so instead of him leaving me, I was going to leave. I had the proof, right? blech..

    But I refocused and took care of me and dug deeper and past the reaction and the assumptions and yay! Everything feels easy and breezy right now.

    I have so much work to do and if I let myself think about it too much, it feels overwhelming. Little steps feels much better.

  345.  #346Lilybelly on November 13, 2015 at 4:37 pm

    FW, Thank you for your help in guiding me.


    Great love for you. xoxo

  346.  #347BeLoved on November 13, 2015 at 4:58 pm

    I feel giggly about the “men value” whatever kind of woman comment.
    My first reaction was to laugh, and then I thought, “I really don’t give a flying f*ck what those men value. I care about what *I* value.”
    I have been anything but easygoing and easy to please the past few months. I have been needy, weepy, dramatic, completely paralyzed in fear and unable to think. yet it only seems to make my friendships better, the men around me eat it up and I am more and more dumbfounded at the lengths they go to in order to take care of me.

    I’m talking GOOD men, seriously good men. Even the ones that may not seem good on the surface are treating me like gold. Very few exceptions…and even one I’m thinking of who isn’t is mostly in his own world anyway, nothing to do with me.

    As a matter of fact, the best thing I’ve ever done for myself is STOP pretending and stop TRYING to be easy to please and easygoing, when it isn’t real for me. It seems to be magnetic. I’ve never had such a network of connections and friends that feels so genuine and intimate in my whole life as I’ve cultivated the past year.

    The men around me value authenticity, being real, they value ME as I am. Even just this morning a classmate was telling me how he saw me as bold and empowered, and how much he liked it.

    I felt electric, happy and alive to hear all of that this morning. It felt so much lighter to allow all of it in soak it up.


  347.  #348Liquid Light on November 13, 2015 at 5:04 pm

    Amen to that Beloved! 🙂

  348.  #349Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 5:13 pm

    Lilybelly #339,

    I don’t know what all you’ve been through, but it sounds like it was difficult.

    I’m sure there’s more to this than a feeling of disrespect. Dominique and FW probably know more about that than I do.

    If there’s healing to be done there, then hallelujah! We both are all for that kind of healing.

    One thing I know I fell into though – and something that’s held me back in my healing, is that boundary thing. Just because someone didn’t intend to hurt me, doesn’t mean that what they did was ok.

    AND, in this case, it doesn’t seem like a major deal – as I said, I think you handled it admirably and J was obviously sensitive to your feelings and handled it in a respectful and caring way.

    All I want to say, is that it’s ok to have boundaries. Whether or not you are friends with this girl, and whether or not she’s a hot f**king mess (or a lesbian j/k), she knows about you. She knows you and J are together.

    She was in agreement with him when he let her know there was no more texting of a personal nature and that says a lot for her as far as I’m concerned.

    What I fell into – and what I don’t want another human being on the face of the earth to experience, because it sucks great big green, well… you get the point – is not having boundaries; or thinking that because it was some sort of personal trauma that brought it on, I shouldn’t have boundaries around that.

    The book I mentioned to Starla last post, The Dance of Anger, really put it in perspective for me:

    Feeling anger is a cue that our boundaries are being crossed; if the boundary is unreasonable, then that’s one thing. However, our boundaries are our boundaries. Whether or not we have a good reason for them; whether or not they are a sore spot stemming from something that has nothing to do with this person; whether or not that person doesn’t have enough common sense or forethought to know better; it’s still a boundary.

    Our feelings of anger are there for a reason.

    Maybe this has nothing to do with you and your situation, but for me, there came a point where everything that triggered me could be tied to some old, personal trauma. And because of that, everything that came up and triggered me around it, I contributed to a need for healing.

    What I’m realizing now is that, be that the case or not, it doesn’t mean I can’t have a boundary around it – or that I “shouldn’t” have a boundary around it.

    Feeling anger might just be indicative that I have a boundary there that I haven’t communicated yet.

    In a nutshell, Siren, don’t be too hard on yourself. We’ve all experienced trauma. We all have stuff that comes up for healing. There was obviously more to this trigger than I’m privy to.

    I still think you handled it really, really well.

  349.  #350Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 5:19 pm


    Very good point. Pretending to be something we’re not is never as attractive as just being who we are.

    Maybe that’s another reason the comment triggered me.

    Although I think Indigo was completely correct when she talked about it not being a man’s job to fix us. Just like we’re the only person who can truly make ourselves happy (even though I love that men want to contribute to that), we’re the only ones responsible for our healing, too.

  350.  #351Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 6:14 pm

    Aha – I just Freudian slipped and (only in my mind, thankfully) called PG, “Bill.”

    Bill is a younger guy I dated back in 07 (even before I found this blog) and dated just b/c he was persistent (I wasn’t really interested).

    I had a good time with him, and learned a thing or two, maybe (I put some of the tools to use, even though I didn’t know that’s what I was doing at that time).

    He wasn’t nearly as sweet or sincere as PG, but it wasn’t a very satisfactory relationship.

    Wonder what’s coming up for healing here?

  351.  #352Lovergirl on November 13, 2015 at 7:55 pm

    Millie- ((hugs)) I know you feel sad about not hearing from M, and confused. Sometimes though, hearing from him is worse. When S contacted me almost 2 weeks ago, it just made me cry and cry and go through all the pain of him leaving and not understanding why he doesn’t love me enough again. I even had a dream about him last night. I dreamt that he was with another woman and telling me he wanted to be with me! Awful! I cried again today.

  352.  #353Lovergirl on November 13, 2015 at 8:14 pm

    Tonight I spent some time with RadioCD. We had sex, of course, then he had to go meet a parent of one of the kids he coaches with some stuff they had left at a game. So he took me with him and then wanted to take me shopping with him to the grocery store and another store.

    It reminded me of S and how he used to always want to bring me along when he went places. RadioCD has gotten a little more possessive lately and said he isn’t sleeping with any other women and doesn’t want me to be with men, but he also said “we don’t have to be boyfriend and girlfriend or anything like that” so I didn’t agree to it.

    He’s a nice guy, really, very social, he knows seemingly everyone. We ran into a couple people he is friends with just at the stores. He also has a lot of financial issues though, that concern me and he’s kind of messy (like my ex husband, ugh). He had to clean a bunch of crap out of the seat so I could get in the car.

    You’d think with his job (a senior advertising executive at a major radio station) that he would have plenty of money to pay his bills but he’s always struggling. I guess its because he’s paying child support to a couple different women, which again, is an iffy situation. He’s also paid entirely on commission, so it varies drastically from month to month.

    Anyway, I just can’t see anything long term with him. He’s sweet and fun and decent in bed and a nice person, I just know it would be unwise. :p

  353.  #354Lovergirl on November 13, 2015 at 8:20 pm

    Still nothing from Mr. Millionaire. Not since he sent me that text a couple days ago and I finally replied “well hello there!!” Then…..nothing!! It’s kind of maddening!

    I wonder if maybe he’s very used to women chasing him and I’m not doing it so he’s pulling back? Or maybe he’s off gallivanting around with other women and just forgot about me? Or he’s at home with a wife?? He still shows as being here in town! Why hasn’t he asked to see me again? 🙁 Waaah! I liked him! The sex was fabulous and I doubt he’s going to disappear forever, but I’m struggling with feelings of abandonment.

  354.  #355Sweetpea on November 13, 2015 at 8:38 pm


    It felt sad to read about S. There’s a guy I was totally head over heels in love with before I knew about Rori. I met him in 2005 and just the other day I started thinking about him again.

    Thankfully, he hasn’t gotten in touch with me again, but wowow! Sometimes it’s really hard to move on, isn’t it? He’s the reason I first decided I needed to do something differently. Oh boy, was he a roller coaster ride!

    And {{{{Millie}}}}!

    I don’t know either of your stories, but I feel your pain. xoxox

  355.  #356Lovergirl on November 13, 2015 at 9:52 pm

    Thanks Sweetpea. I’m really the one that walked away from S, because he didn’t want to give me a real relationship and it hurt too much to keep seeing him. It’s been 5 months since I last saw him and it still just feels so painful to think about never being with him again.

  356.  #357Lovergirl on November 13, 2015 at 10:04 pm

    I wonder if, when and if the millionaire texts me again, it would be okay to tell him how I really feel? Like say I’m happy to hear from him and then tell him I’ve been feeling afraid and vulnerable and anxious, worried that I’m getting pumped and dumped. Okay, so all that is probably tmi, but maybe mention some of it? Or is that way too needy and way too early to tell him stuff like that? It’s true…. I feel panicked about it and my abandonment fears are definitely in full gear. I don’t want to lower my value and all that but I also feel super stressed when a guy I like and have had sex with disappears for long periods of time.

  357.  #358Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 10:52 pm

    Sweetpea 331,

    I’m so glad you liked it 🙂

    It does lose something in the translation, in the original language the feelings come across very clearly… this sense of needing to deal with everything that is broiling inside, but not wanting to push your partner away.

    And it’s sung in such a soft girly way, it reminded me of my younger self.

  358.  #359Indigo on November 13, 2015 at 11:11 pm

    Lovergirl 352,

    I don’t think these feelings are needy at all. I’d feel exactly the same way, I’m sure many if not most women would.

    You may remember that a week or two back I cautioned you about sleeping with a man before you were really clear about him and what you wanted from him… not because I was judging you, but because of exactly what you are feeling now. I have really, really tried to stick to this principle in my own life, and it has saved me a lot of heartbreak. On those occasions where I have just thrown caution to the wind and slept with a man without asking myself how I really, deeply feel, it has always resulted in greater or lesser degrees of pain for me. So, I have learnt.

    If you truly just want to have casual sex, then go for it. But know that this comes with no expectations – no expectations for contact, no expectations to be treated in a certain way.

    If you want to be more sure of how a man is going to treat you afterwards, well then, you have to wait and be more sure of it. There is no way round it. There are no shortcuts. Personally I don’t feel that you necessarily need to be in a committed relationship to sleep with a man, but if you know that you’re a woman who needs certain assurances, then you need to know that he is a man who will give these to you, and perhaps that you are moving towards being in a relationship.

    If these feelings about millionaire are really eating you up, you could try phoning him or sending him a text and asking him where he is at and telling him how you feel. This is not the best way to handle it though… the best would really be to discuss it before sleeping together.

  359.  #360Zara on November 14, 2015 at 12:45 am


    Keep focused on your bridge. Wait for him to come to you.
    Be elegant, no reference to sex before he does. Referring to sex first, is masculine. It switches the energy.

    When and if he asks you for a date, accept to meet him if you want to meet him again.

    During the date, let him come onto you. When it comes to the point you are about to have intercourse, you can say:

    She: ” I don’t feel comfortable having intercourse.”

    Him: “Awww… What’s up?”

    She: “I notice not seeing you for such a long time turns me off.”

    Him: “I am not sure I understand. Honey, I have been very busy. I would have met you if I had had a chance to.”

    She: “You have all the rights to keep absent and silent as long as you want. I understand your first commitment is to yourself. And my first commitment is to myself and right now I feel protective of my feelings.”

    Him: “What can I do to make us feel good?”

    She: “I want to feel we are dating.”

    Him: “But, sweetheart, we Are dating.”

    She: “I want to meet once a week minimum and I want to speak on the phone at least 2 or 3 times a week (or whatever you really want). What do you think?”

    Him: ” OK. I can do that.”
    And there you got a deal. You keep dating him along others, as long as he respects the deal.

    Or his last answer can be:
    “Honey. You know I can’t be so present. My life won’t let me. I would love to spend more time with you, honest to G*d!”
    Or he can say: “Hmmmm…. This rather sounds like leading towards a relationship. I think you are wonderful, but I m not quite ready at this point in my life”

    Either way, what he is saying is “NO” to your requirement. And this IS the deal he is offering you. You take it or leave it.
    But don’t tolerate it.

    If you take it, it is in the understanding he will keep silent and absent any time he wants to and you feel good about it.

    If you tolerate it, it means you go with it, yet don’t like it. It will keep you in a bad feeling state which eats your self-esteem down.

    If you leave it, it leaves space for new men who might want to offer you a good deal.


  360.  #361Indigo on November 14, 2015 at 2:51 am


    In my experience it is exactly like that. Exactly.

    Tolerating is a very bad idea.

  361.  #362Azure Blu on November 14, 2015 at 8:40 am

    Zara #355
    YES!!! YES!!!
    I agree with Indigo also…
    I have insisted on being courted for the past 25 years…
    WAY before Rori…
    And men LOVE IT!!!
    They may complain…
    But I have found they really don’t like jumping into sex either!
    They just feel an “obligation?” to push for it…
    and I have to say I do worry about a man who isn’t
    wanting to kiss etc. ’cause I do want a man who likes sex!!!

    I also like the anticipation that waiting brings with it…
    The teasing and the flirting… Alll VERY s*xy and Fun!!!
    s*x is always better when there is some level of caring and knowing each other!!

    Nothing wrong with casual s*x if that is
    what you want!

  362.  #363Azure Blu on November 14, 2015 at 8:53 am

    Zara #355
    6 months ago I had this EXACT dialogue with Spirit, 2 months after we had become exclusive for the 2nd time…
    He listened… said “yes this would be a good thing to talk about… ”
    and then disappeared for 12 days…
    I was sooo tired, of his inconsistent contact and unavailability, I broke it off…
    and I WAS heart broken…
    He went back with his ex
    and then called me 2 months later…

    It doesn’t always work out
    But I was sooo proud of ME taking Good care of ME!!

    That was the first time I had been able to ask for
    exactly what I needed in a committed relationship!!!

    This time around (he has asked for exclusivity again and I said NO)
    Spirit is giving me what I had said I wanted 6 months ago…
    And I am CDing… Not always available cause I have a VERY full life and am a warm and open invitation when we do see each other!

    It’s been Wonderful to experience and
    I am learning sooo much about ME
    and MY capacity (or lack there of) for emotional intimacy!!!

  363.  #364Azure Blu on November 14, 2015 at 9:18 am

    Ahhhh Sirens…
    Thank you Thank you for all your wonderful help and vulnerability and sharing on Siren Island…

    After our discussion here, yesterday about how drama
    pushes our men away… how staying out of their business is VERY good
    and how Staying out of our heads and IN our HEARTS
    brings them closer!!

    I had seen Spirit on Thur and he had set up a date for last night also
    On thur, We had a great time hanging out at our local bar, dinner and drinks with a couple of his friends…

    On friday I started getting anxious and agitated thinking about our date that night…
    I tried to figure out what I was feeling…
    First of all I was very tired…
    needed to work out – always relieves stress…
    and I was feeling overwhelmed by the intimacy
    I am feeling with Spirit… (we have been dating off and on for 16 months)
    we have NOT broken up for 4 months…
    usually we both get agitated and either him or I push away every 2 months..

    Seeing my fear of more intimacy with Spirit
    I calmed myself down (the work out helped a lot!!!)
    and made a conscouse decision
    To Listen carefully when he talked
    To NOT always have something to say afterwards
    (I always have to say something!! UGH)
    To keep my heart open all night (visualize my heart opening like a flower!!)
    and just relax and enjoy!!!

    and I did exactly that…
    and *I* had a better time!!!
    at the end of the night… (we saw the James Bond movie) he couldn’t stay
    he texted me and said
    “Thank you for your cheery self”

    I’ve been noticing lately how
    High strung I am
    He made a video of us while we were walking last weekend… my g*d!!!
    I couldn’t believe the extreme agitation I was showing!!
    Great for me to see!!
    So now I have been consciously letting go in my body,
    and my mind… to calm myself down from
    this agitation I feel every minute, all day…
    it feels so much better to give me love
    hug me and calm me down…
    sweet, darling Azure…
    My arms around you in a big relaxing warm hug
    There is no reason to be in this frightened agitation…
    You are in control…
    Life is good…

  364.  #365Millie on November 14, 2015 at 9:42 am

    Zara– thank you for your post and I really love what you wrote to Lovergirl as a sample dialog!

  365.  #366Dixie on November 14, 2015 at 10:30 am

    Azure, Zara…

    Zara, your wonderful script felt so soothing to read. It really was what I needed to hear today 🙂

    Azure, I love your unfolding story… It gives me so much inspiration. I can’t really explain, but it just buoys my heart.

    Sirens, I just have to say that this place is just a place of support and solace whenever I feel like I’m wobbling. But today I had the most incredible sign….

    My talk with D. last week felt good, but I can’t say that I’m
    embracing the wobbles. He has been in contact, saying that he loves me, but things at very busy right now, and he doesn’t want me to think the worst. He also said that I was too good to him.

    So, while I am trying to soothe myself through these feelings, I got a lovely sign today…

  366.  #367Dixie on November 14, 2015 at 10:35 am

    Anyhow, the sign:

    To soothe myself today, I put on some music, went running, (in the reverse order, oops!), made some coffee, grabbed a cookie, and decided to snuggle on the sofa with a book that I started over a year ago, maybe even two…. I liked the book but never got around to finishing it.

    I pulled it down and the book opened by itself to a page and out fell a bookmark that I wrote at least 2, maybe 3 years ago.. On one side of the bookmark, I wrote a description of my “Forever Man ” and what our relationship would feel like, and on the other side, a lovely affirmation of “Who I am, and Who I am Becoming”.

    Sometimes, I really do feel that the Universe is responding…

  367.  #368Dixie on November 14, 2015 at 10:37 am

    I’ve also been hyper aware of all my triggers lately in large settings, particularly with family.

    I love them dearly, but I can definitely see how my own fears and wobbles are being projected onto them. It’s feels enlightening to notice this at least .

    Hope everyone is having a lovely day 🙂

  368.  #369Lovergirl on November 14, 2015 at 6:32 pm

    I am having a horrible day! I feel absolutely furious!! When I was leaving work today, at a big civic center over an hour away, I accidentally left my phone on the table. I realized it about 5 minutes later when I got out to my vehicle. So I turned around to go back and get it.

    On my way back I passed by the woman in the booth next to me and she said oh, my husband saw your phone on the table and went to turn it in to the front desk. So I run inside and try to find a “front desk”. There was an empty table so I asked around and was told to go to the ticket desk, that they had been announcing there was a phone being held.

    I go there and they tell me it wasn’t my phone, that they gave it to the “owner” (but it was at least a similar type to mine, if not just like it). Then another lady says SHE had my phone, she had hid it aside. Nope. It wasn’t mine, she had made a mistake, she said it was a different type, but again, very similar and it wasn’t there now??

    I spent an HOUR AND A HALF looking for my phone and it was nowhere to be found, no one in the entire building knew anything and of course the husband of that woman was gone. He should be there tomorrow and I will ask him but I am just SO MAD!!

    I’m sure he thought he was being some kind of good Samaritan, turning in my phone when I was gone for 5 minutes but right now I would like to smash his face in!! That is all…..

  369.  #370Lovergirl on November 14, 2015 at 9:37 pm

    Zara- Thanks, maybe I will try something like that, tweaked a little bit to my own feelings, but similar.

  370.  #371Lovergirl on November 14, 2015 at 9:40 pm


    Thanks. Its obviously too late to discuss anything with him before sleeping with him now. Still maybe I can discuss it in some way if he tries to see me again. I still don’t have my phone but I doubt he tried to contact me tonight or anything either. It’s probably going to be awhile. Something feels amiss.

  371.  #372Femininewoman on November 15, 2015 at 4:45 am

    Lovergirl it is obvious to me that you don’t feel safe. How about you?

  372.  #373Emerson on November 15, 2015 at 6:09 am

    Thank you sirens and Dominique for your replies!

  373.  #374Tee on November 15, 2015 at 9:15 pm

    Thanks Sirens, it was fun while it lasted. I’m not as triggered as before with E but I still want to understand him.

    I know that that’s not my job but when it gets too quiet, the questions emerge.
    E is a man that seems to need alot of space. So much so that I often wonder if he wants a family at all!

    He gets in from work & apparently needs hours of downtime. Time that coincides with family time. I also have to add that E is also a little adhd. He often doesn’t really keep still for too long or he’ll be downstairs playing music & video games until very early in the morning.

    I go back and forth between this being an issue or not. I’m glad that I know where he is but it’s like Really? You’d rather play candy crush?

    Right now, I think he just left.
    I feel somewhat hurt & stuck
    I don’t mean stuck with him but stuck as in how to deal.

    I’ve known him since he was 18 so this isn’t new. I guess I get tired of it bothering me.

    It just feels bad & disrespectful.
    When I have brought it up, he doesn’t see a problem since he’s not doing anything wrong. Mind you I have brought it up while screaming & crying.

    Never good. He has calmed down alot & managed to stick close to home.
    I don’t like things being a mystery.

    It’s like I just want all of him where I can see him at all times. Ugh!

  374.  #375Tee on November 15, 2015 at 9:41 pm

    Sorry for whining but it’s better than me calling him & asking him where he is.
    I think if he told me where he was going, it would help? He’s real iffy about that. Some days he’s better than others.

    I know what I want. I want to be the strong confident appealing woman.
    I want to “rule” with an open hand instead of a closed fist. I want to lure and inspire. I know that my little girl is still afraid of being left and she’s just trying to keep me safe.

    I wish this were easier. I feel annoyed. Annoyed that I constantly need reassuring.

  375.  #376Starla on November 16, 2015 at 6:42 am

    Tee, you might be surprised what could happen if you supported his needs, like for downtime, instead. “He is my man, he works hard for us, I want him to recharge so he can go back out there day after day for us.” Consider what it would be like if he could see his home as his sanctuary and soft place to land. Hint: once he knows he is free to do whatever he wants without it hurting your feelings or being wrong, he might even stop wanting so much downtime.

    We end up treating our men like disappointing employees, especially in our minds. We would never do this to our best girl friends, but we do this to the one person who gives us the most support and attention in the world.

  376.  #377Tee on November 16, 2015 at 7:01 am

    (((Starla))) sorry for the word vomit lol but I figured if I could get my every thought out; good bad stupid sad nonsensical, then they would stop creeping around in my head in the dark.

    I feel like I’m a vampire, I want everything that he has. I don’t feel like we benefit as much as we should.
    I believe that I get what you’re saying, a different perspective & a little more appreciation can go a long way.

    I do believe also that this situation, his shortcomings, etc can definitely be adjusted. I just keep seeing everything through fear or lack. His lack of whatever.

    Actually right after I posted, he came home. I felt stupid yet then once again I’m wondering what did he get from the store, why didn’t he get me anything, etc etc

    I fall back into “he doesn’t love me” mode. I just always feel like I want more & usually I don’t say much about him being out but I’m not sure if I’m still giving off vibes that I don’t mean to

  377.  #378Starla on November 16, 2015 at 7:48 am

    Tee, I typed up a comment to you but something happened and the site timed out. Ohhh I feel defeated… Let me try again 🙂

    About the word vomit – isn’t that one of the great ways we get to use this site? I vomited like 30 comments last week about my relationship. It totally helped! I had a beautiful weekend with my man, and we are stronger than ever. Imagine if I had just kept harping on him instead of checking myself against some caring, lovely women first.

    When I am responding a lot to a particular siren, it’s usually because I can relate soooo much (and now I have added the criteria of “does this woman welcome my perspective at this time”). I so get that feeling of everything boiling back down to “he doesn’t love me.” I even feel it before I’m consciously forming thoughts, like when I wake up in the morning and he’s out of bed before me. I am always on the prowl for signs that he doesn’t love me. And the kicker is that men really do feel that vibe, even if they can’t put their finger on what they’re feeling. That vibe does not motivate them to prove their love for you, ironically enough, unless they have unhealthy condependency things going on that will never end well, lol.

    You are already doing SO great, Tee. I might have said this before, but don’t get discouraged when things don’t shift as quickly as you’d like in your relationship. You spent how long approaching your relationship the old way? Understand that it is reasonable and expected that it would take just as long of doing things a different way for there to be a permanent shift in your relationship.

  378.  #379Tee on November 16, 2015 at 8:16 am

    Oh goodness Starla don’t scare me that way! Lol I know it’ll take a while, practice. Yes, on the prowl…that’s good because that’s what it is. On the prowl for signs that he doesn’t love me. He comes to bed late, he has conversations with people & I don’t know what’s going on, he laughs at something on facebook & I immediately think he’s flirting or talking badly about me, etc

    My brain goes on & on. Actually Eric isn’t the type to give constant reassurances which makes me want it all the more sometimes. He doesn’t get why I don’t see his very presence & the fact that he comes home as proof enough. I sit here like. he kidding? No that’s not enough! How’s that any different than if a bird decided to stay. Warmth, food, shelter…why wouldn’t a bird stay?

    I know it pushes him away or at least pushes him to prove His point by doing it more. If I whine about him staying out, he’ll stay out more until I trust him or he’ll stay inside but he’ll make his displeasure known by being absolutely no help around the house.

    Ugh I really don’t like this. Why didn’t I pick a man that uses his words lol Eric is like a caveman sometimes lol doesn’t like to talk about feelings, he relies solely on actions. It’s so foreign

  379.  #380Femininewoman on November 16, 2015 at 8:37 am

    Why didn’t I pick a man that uses his words lol Eric is like a caveman sometimes lol doesn’t like to talk about feelings, he relies solely on actions. It’s so foreign – Isn’t this typically how most men are though?

  380.  #381Starla on November 16, 2015 at 8:42 am

    Tee, come on, girl! I know it’s scary, but it’s like expecting to lose 100 pounds after a week or even 2 months of eating right. You can’t spend a year eating and living poorly and putting on 100 pounds, and then expecting it to melt off as soon as you decide to make a change.

  381.  #382Starla on November 16, 2015 at 8:45 am

    Ah, the classic conundrum. The type of man who loves to talk about his feelings is also going to be the type of man who hates to lead. And the type of man who has a capacity for strong leadership is probably going too have a smaller capacity for talking about his feelings. You are with a man! Not a woman with a pe***. I am still reminding myself of this all the time. And he probably has to remind himself that I am a woman, not a man with b00bs, when he finds me to be so sensitive.

  382.  #383Tee on November 16, 2015 at 8:50 am

    #375, Feminine Woman lol I really don’t know how most men are. I grew up in a mostly man less world. My cousins husband actually uses words, calls her beautiful, buys her flowers, etc.
    I sometimes feel so jealous yet at the same time, he’s a shell of a man. He knows that his role is just to sit there, shut up & say Yes, dear…and he does.
    I don’t have much frame of reference lol

    #376 lol Don’t mind me Starla, I’m a whiner lol
    Slow and steady wins the race.
    I’m learning no matter how aggravating it is lol I need to get back on the weight loss track myself but that’s another story 😛

  383.  #384Tee on November 16, 2015 at 8:53 am

    Oh no E does not like talking about his feelings! He said something like They’re too much or they get in the way. He has a great poker face. Seems like nothing bothers him. How are we supposed to know how he feels? Lol

  384.  #385Indigo on November 16, 2015 at 9:26 am


    Yip, you can just about forget having a masculine man who loves to talk about his feelings. It is very, very, very hard for them to do. I think most of them would rather have their arm chewed off by a crocodile.

    Yet with a woman they feel very safe with, they can gently open up little by little. I think there comes a point in every woman’s life where she has to accept that men are all about actions, not words. Yes, the fact that he is coming home and the fact that he is choosing to stay is by and large the majority of the proof you will have, and I really believe that mature relationships are a lot about self-soothing. Dominique has written a lot of great stuff about this.

  385.  #386Tee on November 16, 2015 at 11:32 am

    Thanks Indigo! That’s a good word: self-soothing. I haven’t been to Dominique’s site in a while, thanks again.

  386.  #387Lovergirl on November 17, 2015 at 9:00 pm

    Femininewoman 372- I don’t know. I mostly feel confused and abandoned. Like, I thought he liked me and we had a good time together, what happened? Haven’t heard from him and its been another 6 days.

  387.  #388Indigo on November 18, 2015 at 1:40 am

    Lovergirl 387,

    May I do a somewhat radical experiment with you? I say this because I honestly asked the following question of myself a few days ago and was shocked at my honest answer. So here goes:

    How would you feel if he actually did turn around and start giving you all the love, all the attention you want, started fulfilling all your dreams and was there for you 24/7?

    By asking myself this question, I realised that I still had some fear and where my blocks to intimacy were. I want to stop living in dreamland, in imaginary relationship land, and have the real thing. But that requires us to get PRETTY darn real.

  388.  #389Femininewoman on November 18, 2015 at 2:21 am

    Lovergirl – we had a good time together? I am sure he is used to that with many women. I keep repeating myself with you because I sincerely believe you can take better care of yourself.

  389.  #390Tee on November 18, 2015 at 6:41 am

    #388, awesome question Indigo! What do you do when you’re not pleased with your own honest answer?

  390.  #391Indigo on November 18, 2015 at 7:37 am


    For me, my own honest answer, which was that it would scare me a bit, and would make me want to reclaim my own space somewhat – well, it wasn’t that I disliked my answer because what would be the point of that? It just is what it is. And it was very informative. I say I want this devoted, adoring, present relationship and man, but what would I do if I finally got it and him? It helped me to see the different ways that *I* might be keeping true love at bay. It was very helpful. And now that I know, I can start playing with those areas.

    For example, something very powerful: today I happened to chat to D and he happened to tell me he was seeing someone. Now, in the past that would have triggered all my internal old pain and fear and panic, and I would have found some way to try to hang onto him. This time, my old pain and fear and panic still got triggered, but it was tiny – and I was able to say “Ok. I wish you the best of luck” and leave with grace.

    Me being able to do that wasn’t about not causing a scene, or about what he thought of me or even about being super evolved, it was just a realisation that hanging onto him was keeping the true love of my life from coming in. So I let D go – both physically, and emotionally, and wished him well.

  391.  #392Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 8:24 am

    ((((Indigo #391))))
    Feels like another big step toward
    Opening your heart to more intimacy!!
    Beautiful, Brave young Siren!!

  392.  #393Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 8:32 am

    Interesting question Indigo…
    And I have had the opportunity in the past 2 months to experience more intimacy with a man I really like (love?)
    as he continues to move closer and closer emotionally…
    It is very interesting to watch ME…
    as I try to stay open… see how I push him away…
    and flex my heart muscles for MORE wonderful closeness…
    with all the wonderful sharing and dialogue on Siren Island
    It is helping me each step of the way…
    Not getting ahead of the relationship
    Being vulnerable NOT needy
    Listening carefully
    softening my voice
    Kind and not nit picking
    receiving and acceptance
    But MOST OF ALL continue to LOVE ME
    the MOST!!!

  393.  #394Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 8:38 am

    When I first began this wonderful journey with
    the Rori Ray Way and Tools
    I thought how can I EVER do ALLL those
    too many things to figure out
    I’m fine JUST the way I am!!!!
    I wasn’t very happy with ME
    and all the tools are about MY WHOLE LIFE
    not just being with a man..

    That is What Rori teaches me…
    To learn all about ME, how to LOVE Me
    How to cherish EVERY little thing about ME
    Men can come and go out of my life…
    and I am sooo complex and amazing
    I will never stop learning about
    Awesome TREASURE that is Me!!!

  394.  #395Tee on November 18, 2015 at 9:13 am

    #391 Indigo, if E suddenly became this man who was suddenly giving me all of this attention, was here for me 24/7 and fulfilling all of my dreams. I can honestly say that I’d be happy, bored, suspicious and smothered.

    I don’t know that I would trust it or believe it. I’d probably find ways to get some air lol yet in some ways that’s who I’ve become. Not all the time but sometimes. I am somewhat fearful of intimacy. When I’ve dated (and I haven’t dated much) guys, they were always clinging to me, trying to pin me down. It was annoying. E doesn’t mind (so he says, I haven’t put it into practice) giving me as much space as he seems to require.

    But I’m constantly seeking him out, maybe not physically but in my head and heart.

    I want to find balance

  395.  #396Indigo on November 18, 2015 at 9:32 am

    Very, very interesting, Tee. That’s what it’s all about, isn’t it? Finding balance.

  396.  #397Tee on November 18, 2015 at 9:42 am

    It is interesting. I’ve always known this, just wasn’t sure what to do about it. How can being away from my man pull him closer? I guess because the focus is elsewhere? I do seem to get a little more of his attention when my mind is elsewhere.

    This morning for example, my left eye is infected again. I feel like crap because I can’t see much. He was all like Awww Mommy doesn’t feel well & kept giving me kisses lol

    I can’t tell you how long it’s been since I’ve gotten kisses. We’re a little off kilter these days. We’re ok but just out of practice, too busy being parents I imagine. It was sweet though.

    Had I been ok like any other day, I might have gotten a high 5 and a quick peck as he left for work lol

  397.  #398Femininewoman on November 18, 2015 at 10:32 am

    Tee it might be because he gets the space to be your hero when you are not well. He might feel more needed at those times. I’d suggest finding ways to give him a “role” to play in the relationship. Something to do

  398.  #399Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 10:37 am

    How sweet he was kissing you and worried about you
    when you weren’t feeling good…

    Those are the times I try and open my heart (as it sounds like you did)
    Literally, visualize my heart opening or unzipping…
    as I let in ALLL that masculine, doing, action love
    my man is giving me!!
    As many of the Sirens have mentioned…
    Men just don’t verbalize… They just DONT
    But they so enjoy showing us how much they
    do love us!!
    It is up to ME to make sure I see, accept, cherish and speak my appreciation… “ohhh… my heart feels glowing and it feels sooo romantic when you have a glass of wine (my favorite kind) waiting for me when I meet you!!”

  399.  #400BeLoved on November 18, 2015 at 10:44 am

    Oh…yumyum…I’m feeling so crushy and lovey about another one of my instructors right now!
    He *really* caught my attention a few weeks ago, when we had a good conversation about theater in which it felt I had all of his attention, very present, very encouraging, I felt a certain quality to interacting with him that felt like a new feeling which I like.

    I saw some art of his today, and it was all about messages of peace. It felt…so…good. He had some little hidden messages in places where the general audience wouldn’t see it but we could see it behind the scenes. What I noticed is…how *congruent* it felt with my experience of him. I felt like..yes, yes, here is a man who lives a kind of peace that feels alive and inspiring and feels so good to be around. Yet another man in my life I feel safe and solid and secure with.

    Hmmmm..yummmm….I love this feeling! I want to practice that new feeling, it was like…sexy and safe at the same time. Something I’ve imagined and heard about, yet hadn’t quite felt yet or if I have I don’t remember it. I want to remember it now..

    Something else I’m practicing, is believing “it’s possible for me”. What seems to be at the root of my feelings of depression and incredible procrastination are thoughts like “what’s the point? It’s useless. It will never happen for me, I’m just going to mess it up anyway, this will never go anywhere..” and I intend to practice believing that “it” IS possible for me. Magical love, magical sex, a magical career, an adventure-filled, satisfying life.
    And so it is.

  400.  #401Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 10:45 am

    FeminineW #398
    Yes… this makes so much since!!
    Cause mostly we are more vulnerable… softer when we’re sick, not feeling well

  401.  #402BeLoved on November 18, 2015 at 10:46 am

    Oh, geez, hahahaha, hit submit on the previous post, switched to my email and saw a message from Natalina.

    “This is how you can rewrite your Love story to attract more of the good stuff:

    – Consider the idea of CHANGE being possible for you.

    Acknowledge that Maybe you CAN have what you want.”


  402.  #403Azure Blu on November 18, 2015 at 10:49 am

    Ahhh… me too…

    “I intend to practice believing that “it” IS POSSIBLE FOR **ME**!!
    Magical love,
    magical sex,
    a magical career,
    an adventure-filled,
    satisfying life.
    And so it is.

  403.  #404Tee on November 18, 2015 at 12:59 pm

    #398 FW, I know what you mean about giving him a role to play, something to do, but I don’t know how. My mind interprets this into telling him to do this or do that, being bossy. I’m sure that’s not what you mean lol

    #399 Azure Blue lol I’m so glad that you Sirens can translate this male behavior into words that make sense to me. I’d be lost without it. I’m definitely more vulnerable & softer. I wanna cry but I don’t know that the situation warrants actual tears lol I just feel helpless. Nothing to do but let nature takes its course. My eye will get better, it just takes time but I’m impatient.

    What I do find interesting is that Im forced to sit still a little more often, slow down, etc. I feel like it’s caused me to get in tune with my other senses because I can’t rely on my sight for extended periods. My eye stings so I rinse it & then I lie down with my thoughts. Interesting thoughts!

    I actually sent love & forgiveness (?) to someone I hadn’t thought about in years, someone who always played the villain in the story of my past. Completely out of left field. No clue where That came from 😛

    I did enjoy the kisses though lol our son did too. I like it when he giggles from the kisses because Daddy’s scruffy face tickles him ♡

  404.  #405Starla on November 18, 2015 at 2:09 pm

    “My mind interprets this into telling him to do this or do that, being bossy.”

    Ohhh, it has taken me years and years to understand the difference. I’m still figuring it out. I have an extremely patient man, thank goodness. I think the trick is to identify the problem and NOT the solution. Often times we present our problems to our men to solve, except we already have a solution and just want them to carry it out.

    A hero creates solutions. A trained monkey does what you tell it to.

    This means you tell your man your problems, not your solutions. From what I can gather about your fiance, telling him what to do is like an automatic rebellion button for him. He’s quick to a power struggle. This is a GOOD thing. That is strong evidence of a masculine personality that is primed for being a hero.

    BAD: Can you go to the store and get milk and eggs?
    GOOD: There aren’t any eggs left and I feel worried I won’t be able to get to the store before our next breakfast.
    Important note: If he doesn’t solve your problem, let it go. If you can’t make it to the store, you can’t make it to the store, and there just won’t be any eggs until someone buys them. Don’t turn this into a power struggle. We’re sharing, not manipulating here 🙂

    BAD: Be ready to go by 5:30 so we’re not late to the party.
    GOOD: The party starts at 7. What time do you want us ready to go?
    Important note: You might not like his suggestion. Go with it anyway. If you end up being late because he didn’t look up travel times, well, next time he’ll probably look it up;). Don’t make him wrong or shame him. Don’t suggest faster routes to take. Just sit there in the car. Relax. Shut up.

    BAD: Can you clean the kitchen? I don’t have enough time to get the whole house cleaned up before company arrives in 2 hours.
    GOOD: I can’t get all the cleaning done before company gets here. What do you think I should do?
    Important note: He might actually tell you not to worry about it. That’s right, he might suggest that you leave the kitchen in a disgusting state! This is his SOLUTION for your problem of not having enough time to clean everything. Go with it!

    Let him lead you and your family this way. He will refine his approach to solving problems the more practice he has with solving them.

    Nothing is the end of the world enough to warrant being controlling or bossy. A dirty kitchen, being 10 minutes late to a party, not having eggs on hand for breakfast, etc., are not situations that require your control.

    And don’t make the mistake I did and try to control him into taking more control through nagging that he do it. “You’re not telling me what you want!” “You’re not steering this ship!” LOL I am lucky to have a patient, forgiving man who loves me enough for my good qualities. Get comfortable with no movement and nothing getting done for a while. All that matters is that rent is paid and lights are on and that no one is starving. Everything else, you can completely let go of trying to control.

    I just KNOW you can do it, Tee.

  405.  #406Starla on November 18, 2015 at 2:28 pm

    Part 2 of all this is the part where you say thank you and how good it feels that it’s taken care of whenever he provides solutions, even for problems you never brought to his attention like trash that needs taking out. At first he will probably shrug it off when you thank him, but men always get used to it once they see you’re sincere and that expressing gratitude is just something you do because you are a gracious woman, and not because you’re trying to train him.

    Typing all this has made me feel so excited and grateful to have such a hero in my life in my man! Woohoo!

  406.  #407Tee on November 18, 2015 at 5:37 pm

    #405/406 Starla lol yes my fiancé is quick to rebel. It’s automatic.

    I’m noticing that I don’t always present anything to him. I tend to keep quiet & deal with it myself. He’s mentioned before that I don’t tell him anything, I wonder if this is what he means?

    Like the diaper thing, you knew he was running low, why didn’t you say anything? That’s what he said last time & it aggravates him.

    I see that I don’t present him with a problem so he can come up with a solution. Most times, I just handle it all myself in silence. Then I get mad because he’s not helpful.

    I guess I fear that he won’t want to help so I don’t say anything. For example, he’ll say….How come we don’t have any eggs? I’ll just go out & get the eggs.
    Some days it’s a non-issue. Other days, I feel resentful. I feel like he doesn’t want to buy anything useful with his money, etc etc.

    It is nice when I allow him to help but usually it’s when I absolutely have no choice. Like tonight, he helped get our son together for bed. I feel like crap, he knows it, so it was easy to let go.

    Any other time, I don’t ask for help. He doesn’t offer & it can piss me off & feel so lonely.

  407.  #408Starla on November 18, 2015 at 6:39 pm

    Ooooh, this is all your stuff. Awesome. Love to see you processing it! Do you have any of rori’s materials? She has so many good tools you could apply here.

  408.  #409Shealie on November 18, 2015 at 7:45 pm

    Hello. I’ve been reading and getting to know you all ever since discovering Rori and her tools about a month ago. This is the first time EVER that I’ve searched for the answer to a “man problem” and I’m so glad I did. I won’t go into details at the moment, I just want to say that so many of you (and Rori, of course) have helped shed light on the reason my man suddenly started withdrawing after nearly 6 months of dating bliss. It was perplexing and very disturbing and I’m so glad to have discovered you. I’m not able to comment when I’m at work, and I have a very busy social life, so I don’t get a lot of time at the computer, but when I do, this is where I spend it. It feels like the heavens have opened and the angels are singing and I’m FINALLY understanding what I’ve been doing wrong. And boy, have I been doing pretty much everything wrong. I’ve always laughed that I haven’t dated much because everyone I’ve dated has always wanted to marry me. Yeah, well, that is NOT the answer and I feel the stigma of having been married more than once. I just wish I had discovered you and this blog several years ago. I feel I’ve wasted so much time not doing things right and not focusing on ME. I’m what I like to call a “seasoned vet,” lots of living under my belt but lots of living left to do. So I’ll take this opportunity tonight to say thank you for this wonderful insight into the female and male minds. I will comment more as I become more comfortable, but suffice it to say I’ve started leaning way back. Not sure if this is “the one,” not sure if I even WANT “the one,” or if this one is just practice, but I can finally feel free to be the diva I’ve always wanted to be. That him paying all the time is RIGHT, that buying expensive gifts for him is WRONG, etc. etc. etc. I’ve bought Rori’s entire collection and am going through it bit by bit. What an eye opener. Thank you ladies. I will be back with comments here and there, but know that I will be following all of yours daily from here on out as I have been for the past month. Cheers to you ALL. And thank you again.

  409.  #410Indigo on November 18, 2015 at 8:56 pm


    I’ve loved what you’ve written here in 405 & 406. So helpful for me too! Love it!

  410.  #411Azure Blu on November 19, 2015 at 4:52 am

    Starla… #405&06
    Wow!!! Thank you for sharing those wonderful examples!!!
    i love them!!
    I will paste and copy into my archives…
    I too see where I just handle things with all my CDs
    I do NOT include them in any solutions
    I simply handle my life…
    and Tee…
    Thank you for being your lovely vulnerable self and sharing your life here on Siren Island!!

  411.  #412Tee on November 19, 2015 at 6:29 am

    #408 Starla, I don’t have any of her stuff yet but in the future, I will buy all of her stuff! RR’s approach feels so much better to me after having read so many other people who were encouraging women to be more aggressive. I’ve never had a problem being aggressive lol but all I got back from my super manly man was aggression so I knew that there had to be a better way, something that’ll work & feel good so here I am.

    #410 Azure Blue, thanks. I don’t mean to take up so much time but I’m seeing my ways more & more as I share. I also love how you ladies translate. I thanked E last night for his help. He stopped in his tracks & seemed confused lol
    This morning I felt even worse. My eye kept leaking & stinging. He asked me if I was ok. I said Not really. He asked a few more questions.

    He asked if I washed the baby last night. I said No because I could barely see. I took that to mean that he would wash the boy. Then it seemed like he wasn’t moving fast enough & I almost stepped in.

    That’s another quirk of mine. When I want something done, it needs to be done asap or else I’ll get pissed & do it myself instead. I had to talk myself down. It’s ok Tee, you have a whole 2 hours before he really needs to leave, you have time, it’s ok.

    So E gathers up the boy to wash him up. They’re talking & laughing. I get the baby’s clothes after he’s all dry & lotioned up. E puts his clothes on him, he doesn’t like the way the pants fit Isiah so I bring him another set of clothes. Everything went off without a hitch.

    E never complained or fussed. I only fear that he might & it’s my fear that allows me to step forward and take over. I also know that being sick makes it easier for me. It’s like a built in excuse or built in wall to hide behind. Like he’s somehow more liable to help because I’m sick. I have no faith that he’ll help simply because I asked.

  412.  #413Starla on November 19, 2015 at 7:29 am

    Hey, it’s perfect that you’re sick then! Btw E sounds so sweet:-).

  413.  #414Starla on November 19, 2015 at 7:40 am

    The post directory that rori links to on the right side of the desktop site has so much useful stuff, including tools.

  414.  #415Tee on November 19, 2015 at 10:29 am

    I use to spend hours reading those links lol I fell off the wagon again!
    E is sweet when I actively think about the good & not the bad or the near misses. I thanked him for his help again this morning, I told him that I felt special. He waved me off lol but he did call a few minutes ago to check on me 🙂

  415.  #416Colleen on November 19, 2015 at 10:38 am

    I am going through a devastating breakup with my boyfriend of 3+ years. He recently told me that he is not sure if he wants to get married or have children. This comes after years of talking about taking the next step, looking at rings, etc. He even told my best friend that he was going to marry me. My world has turned upside down since we lived together and no longer see or talk to each other. I know I made a mistake in the beginning by trying to talk to him and I think I only pushed him further away. He said he needs space and I’m finally learning now how to give it to him. It’s heartbreaking to not hear from the person who you thought you would spend the rest of your life with. I know I need to give him his space and time and focus on myself for once. I was always concerned about taking care of him and making him happy and by doing that, I put myself on the back burner. Does anyone have any advice for me? Do you think he will ever come back?

  416.  #417Tee on November 19, 2015 at 1:51 pm

    Lol I want to get where I don’t have to be sick in order to allow myself his help. I want to be genuine.

  417.  #418Femininewoman on December 29, 2015 at 1:08 pm

    Colleen how are things?