Free Teleclass: How To Know If Being A Professional Coach Is For You…

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Hi, this is Rori, and if you’re on the fence about RRRCT, talk with me LIVE, tomorrow, Tuesday, June 16th at either 11am PST or 5:30pm PST (2pm and 8:30pm EST), live and in-person by teleseminar on the RRRCT Teleclass…

1. To Phone Or Skype into the call: Dial (425) 440-5100

Conference ID: 269386#

Backup Dial-In # (323) 476-3997

2. To listen and write questions to me in real time from your computer or device:

(**On this page, you can find local and international numbers to try….)

You’ll get to talk with me live – in-person – and talk with a Certified Coach Master Teacher, too!

Some of Winter Session RRRCT Trainees may show up too – to tell you how it feels to start from nowhere, with nothing resembling a professional coaching career – no website, no “brand,” nothing in writing – and, within 12 weeks: Have a full website, email subscribers, an actual written program to give your subscribers, and real clients…

How Do You Know If  Being A Professional Coach Is What You Want?

1. You have to want to begin working for yourself.

Making your own hours, charging the rates you want (and you’ll be able to charge WAY more than you think you can – even from the beginning!), working from wherever you want in whatever clothes you want.

And – helping the human race find peace by helping women, men and couples find love.

2. You have to want to help others.

If you’re concerned that the status of your own love life is standing in your way – don’t be.

Your actual relationship “state” has nothing to do with being a successful coach.

What makes you a successful coach is your ability to help OTHERS.

To HEAR them, to listen to them, to know just enough more than they do about how relationships work that you can HELP them.

Rori Raye Relationship Coach Training is designed so that you’ll know a LOT more than nearly anyone else about how relationships and men work – and very quickly.

As a huge bonus: You’ll find your own love life improving daily all through RRRCT Training…

3. You have to want to make more money than you’re making right now – and easier.

Most people assume that starting your own business equals poverty, ridiculous hard work, and suffering.

And – I’ve found it to be just the opposite (…and so have my Certified Coaches and Trainees).

Think of it – a beginning fee to talk to you should be around $120/hour. From that idea, you can give discounts, package rates, etc…and, as the Trainees from Winter Session RRRCT have found – you quickly move up the ladder to $150/hour and more.

If you’re a CEO of a company, and making six figures already – then your choice to be a professional coach may be about “switching careers” – and you may be concerned about taking a “hit” in your income. When, really, you’ll be making what you’re making now – or more – with less work.

The work of entrepreneurship never ends until YOU say “stop.”

This is true.

Yet, it feels like you’re following your vision and your dreams – instead of “manifesting” someone ELSE’S visions and dreams.

Once you’re squarely in the “game” of deciding your own destiny – work takes on a different “feel.”

Instead of waiting for someone else to tell you what to do – you work off your own ideas.

You take everything I teach you and amplify it.

You realize very quickly how you can make money two ways:

Per hour as a coach – AND per product or program you sell.

You can make money live, in person, at events and on the phone or Skype with clients and workshops – AND – you can make money in your sleep selling the videos and books created FROM those events and workshops.

You can’t run out of ideas, because, in the entrepreneurial world – new ideas are happening constantly.

And you can’t run out of potential clients – because new women turn 18 every day, women go through breakups, divorce, and change constantly. There will always be women who need you – who want to talk to YOU, not read a book. And there will always be women who just want to read your book.

You can do well – and quickly.

4. You have to want to write and create.

There is no substitute in the world of online information for written material.

Videos get you attention and a personal way to reach potential clients – yet, writing is still, and will always be – the fastest way to reach your audience and be taken into their hearts.

It’s what separates you from anyone else.

5. You have to want to tell your personal story.

Just giving advice will never cut it in the world. People want to know who you are. They want to know why and how you know what you know, and they want to trust you.

A woman doesn’t want her coach to be perfect. She wants her to be like HER – and yet HAPPY.

Whatever challenges, tragedies, difficulties, crises you’ve endured in your life – if you tell that story, people will listen.

They’ll want to know you.

If you want to keep yourself under wraps and just “teach” – this kind of coaching isn’t for you.

6. You have to want to listen.

Coaching is more about listening than teaching. More about hearing than advice-giving.

What you’ll learn in RRRCT is to do both. To listen, to hear, to be trusted – and then give advice that WORKS.

You’ll learn the Rori Raye method of taking a woman through an EXPERIENCE with you….an experience she can’t get from anyone else, anywhere. You’ll discover that, after only 6 weeks of RRRCT – you can do magical things in a coaching session that NO ONE else can do.

It’s a process of skills, techniques, Tools, and your own personal SELF that make your coaching unique and irreplaceable.

Once a woman has “vibed” to you as her coach – she’ll never want to be away from you.

7. You have to love – and love using – the Rori Raye Tools

If my methods and systems have helped you in any way – with your actual love life, with your emotions, with your confidence, with your recovery from a break up, with dating and understanding men – you can help other women do the same.

Come to the RRRCT Teleclass tomorrow at either 11am or 5:30 pm PST – and ask YOUR questions. I’ll be at both classes!

Get an honest, straightforward assessment from me personally about your chances to do well in this field, how fast I believe you can make back your RRRCT investment, and how soon you can feel as though you have a genuine, real, viable business.

I KNOW you can do this!

Give yourself a shot at your dream. I’ll be here for you, and all of RRRCT past and present will be here for you. We’re a sisterhood at RRRCT, and we not only show you your future – we’ve got your back.

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Helena Hart on June 15, 2015 at 1:45 pm

    I’m SO looking forward to being on this call and helping answer everyone’s questions. Being a part of RRRCT truly changed my life in every way imaginable!

    Love, Helena

  2.  #2April Rose on June 15, 2015 at 4:04 pm

    I’m looking forward to the call.
    I’m feeling more serious than I’ve ever been before about joining the training…..
    And that feels scary
    in an exciting way!

    I feel nervous because I have taken online trainings before and dropped out because of the lack of in-person contact with the trainers and other trainees.

    I learn best in an environment where I am physically present with the other people….

  3.  #3Tereana on June 15, 2015 at 5:43 pm

    Hm…I think I might be good at this, but I’m not sure that it’s what I want to do…I’m struggling right now and meeting resistance with the thing I say I want to do right now, though. So there’s that…

  4.  #4Allure on June 15, 2015 at 5:53 pm

    I like what do already. 🙂

    Today felt fun and free. I had the whole day to myself. I basked in the sunshine and played in the water. I feel pleasantly drained and snoozy. I feel a mild excitement for tomorrow. My lust for a new day seems to be returning 🙂 I feel smiley.

  5.  #5Azure Blu on June 16, 2015 at 8:20 am

    I’m loving the yummie, warm feeling words
    you are sharing with us…
    I want to try feeling an excitement for tomorrow

    yhhhhhhhhhht (my cat says this!!08777798888888

    and LOVING what is happening

  6.  #6Allure on June 16, 2015 at 9:57 pm

    (((azure))) 🙂

  7.  #7Allure on June 16, 2015 at 10:08 pm

    I feel awake and peaceful. Sitting outside on my patio with a candle lit. Feeling thankful for me, thankful for the moment. It feels slightly challenging to stay in the moment, yet effortless to remind myself and be gentle about it.
    Feels nice. A bit hollow without the heavy belly feelings. A good hollow. I think I might be goading myself into feeling turmoil. It’s not working out 😀
    I feel a bit gravitational. Magnetic. I am in a soft space. I feel soft too. Scrubbed and slathered with oils and moisture.
    Smelling fresh, feeling fresh. Feeling calm.
    Oh and now I feel anticipation for clarity.
    Breathing feels good. I am a soft place. This is a good moment to be in.
    I think I will bask in the evening for a few minuts and go to sleep.

  8.  #8Millie on June 17, 2015 at 2:01 am

    Lovergirl– responding to you from the previous thread.

    I once felt as you do. His name was J. We had this on and off relationship that was very passionate and also very “insane” at the same time. It was very cyclical…we would get together everything would be great until all of a sudden I started wanting more again and he would break things off. Or I would break things off. We kept coming back to each other and I thought to myself that- that must mean something. And I let that keep me going, but the truth of it is– that is not enough. Whatever attachment he has that keeps him coming back but not committing, is not enough to really mean anything other than what it does in that moment. What I mean by that, is on the great scope of things, in the big picture, a man that is truly showing up for you, is going to look very different and be way more vast that what is happening right now. I’m not trying to be preachy or know-it-all, please stop me if I am. I just feel like I’ve been in a similar situation and I remember when I had the same questions and “push and pull” type thoughts as you. It was really hard, and I latched on to what I thought meant something, but was really just a crumb…because in the big picture, a man that keeps coming back, but only offers the same limited relationship, one that you feel you have to “handle,” is very small in comparison to the possibilities outside of him.

    Looking back on my own experience, I see how tunnel visioned I was with J. I also didn’t really know better- he was the first man I really fell in love with. I thought him coming back, us not being able to be apart, this dramatic push and pull relationship meant something, it meant we had this undeniable connection, that we were on some level meant to be together. Well, it didn’t mean any of that. He met someone else and married her–after telling me many times he did not want to get married.

    S feels a connection to you, but he’s fighting himself. He thinks he “should” be with you, but he isn’t.
    I’m sharing my story with you because in hindsight, that glimmer of hope that he would one day figure out I’m it all along- really means nothing. J knew I wasn’t it all along. I kept it going by hoping, by reading into things that are crumbs. He knew I wasn’t it. I just didn’t want to accept that.

  9.  #9Victoria on June 17, 2015 at 5:12 am

    Millie, Lovergirl
    I have also been told by a man that he does not want to marry and he wants his freedom, only to find out that he needs his freedom in order to marry someone else.
    And, in order to be fair, I have to admit that I also been on the other side, telling men that I am not ready for a relationship but in fact dumping them in order to get into a relationship with someone I desire.
    For this particular situation, I think S. thinks that he has been honest telling Lovergirl that he does not want a relationship with her, but of course he would take advantage of her friendship, domestic help, s*x, whatever she is willing to give without commitment to reciprocity. He thinks he has been clear, and she things he is giving her mixed sygnals. Part of the mixed sygnals I think are coming from Lovergirl, from her not being able do decide whether she wants a boyfriend/husband, as she is not sure whether she needs such a figure for her kids at this stage in their life. If she is to allow a boyfriend/potential step-father figure, the man will have to have a say about her childrens upbringing, and she may not be willing to allow that at this stage.

  10.  #10Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 6:06 am

    Millie and Victoria-

    S does want to get married- to someone that doesn’t have 5 kids. He wants to start a family with someone and thinks I have too many children. He’s okay with someone that has 1 or 2 children but doesn’t think he could handle 5. That is his main reason for not wanting to be with me, according to him.

    It’s all very logical and makes sense. It’s also probably the reason 99.9% of men wouldn’t want to marry me. I fell in love with S and feel like if ANYONE would change their mind about me, it could be him. I know he has feelings for me, even if he doesn’t admit how much.

    HE was the one, in the beginning (a few months in) who said he was starting to feel like he wanted to spend his life with me- but that he just didn’t think he could do it because of my situation. It was our first fight because I had been too afraid to even dream he would want that with me and it opened the floodgates. I was like don’t say that, don’t give me that hope then turn around and shatter it like that!

    Then later, he would start asking me all these questions, about what it would take financially to support my family and whether I wanted another baby. He would make jokes about getting me pregnant. Then, he DID get me pregnant, twice.

    After the first miscarriage, he said the best part about me being pregnant would have been his getting to be around me for the rest of his life. He said I was his dream woman, everything he’s ever wanted. He still flipped out and the second time he flipped out again. He also has expressed worries that I won’t ever be able to have more kids (I’m almost 39 and have had two miscarriages in the past year).

    Even in the doctor’s office the other day, he asked me again how much I thought I would need to support SIX kids. Actually, he asked if I would be able to support them on a particular salary, which is what I know he makes when he’s at his lowest sales at his regular job. I said oh definitely and he acted like he didn’t believe me- but its way more than my ex husband ever made!

    That and his comments about not feeling love and affection for me or me being number 1, are kind of bogus. Because I KNOW I have been the main woman in his life for the past year. He also acts very affectionate towards me, to the point that other people have commented how in love he appears. One time he tried to claim that it was the sex that was attaching him to me, so we stopped having sex (it was after the first miscarriage). He would still have me over to his house all the time to do work for him and take me out to eat.

    I asked him then, if he had feelings for me and he said NO. I was like why do you still want me around all the time then? He said you are just so pretty I like watching you work. I said how can you not have feelings for me, what are you, some kind of sociopath? He laughed and said he does have feelings for me, he just didn’t think it was a good idea to express them.

    After the second miscarriage, he is paranoid about getting me pregnant again, so he says. He says its too tempting!

    He tried going out on dates with another woman and said he just couldn’t feel any chemistry with her. He made comments about how most women would seem like a “downgrade” from me. He’s said he’s afraid if he finds someone else, that in 10 years he will regret that he didn’t stay with me. He made that comment that I’m really probably the woman he should be with, if he just “let himself”.

    THIS is why I am so confused. THIS is why I find it hard to accept that he just doesn’t want to be with me. He has constantly come back to me, no matter how upset I get with him. He has tried to get me deeply involved in his business and talked about making me his partner in that. He STILL wants to talk to me about it, even now.

    He has always been the one who calls and wants to see me. More so than any man in my life, S wants to be around me. His disappearing act, his trying to date other women (which he has said many times that me being around makes it hard for him to be motivated to do), going back to the swinger parties- all seem like attempts to try and fight how he feels about me. Its like he’s trying his very best to deny that we have anything because he logically thinks its a bad idea to be with me.

  11.  #11Victoria on June 17, 2015 at 6:57 am

    It seems to me that he is not confused, but simply can not have his wish list fulfilled: a woman who is physically as attractive and sexually liberated as you are, but has no kids. It seems to me that he is actively looking, and the moment he finds one he would drop you like a hot potato. Now of course, the other question is, is it realistically feasible for him to meet such a woman. I think your best bet is to believe, and, more importantly act like, you are conviced that there is no one better out there!

  12.  #12Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 7:45 am


    Yes, he says he “should” be looking. He has gone on dating sites occasionally but then will say he doesn’t have the motivation because of me. He says he would not even talk to me at all if he got serious with someone he wanted to marry. He says he would cut all former women out of his life completely.

    Now, whether he would actually follow through on that? I don’t know. S is an emotional guy and he gets very attached and has a hard time letting go of people. He doesn’t like people leaving his life.

    This is why I’m like, um, then WHY are you trying to get ME to be a “partner” in your business? Then some other woman comes along, what are you going to do? She is going to want to be the one that helps you with that! He hasn’t really answered that question, but that is a big part of the reason I decided to stop working for him when he went out on dates with that one woman.

    I don’t know if I can compete with other women. I’m flattered that S seems to find me so attractive, but I’m almost 39, could stand to lose 10-15 lbs and of course there are tons of prettier women than me! Even the sexually liberated part, I’m not near as liberated as some of the swinger women out there that he has met.

    I feel like we connect on more of an emotional and intellectual level. That, he may have a harder time finding with someone else. We share a similar sense of humor and spend a lot of time laughing. Not that he probably couldn’t make MOST women laugh, he’s very playful and witty.

    I’d like to believe he couldn’t meet a woman that he likes as much as me. So far- he hasn’t. He’s even said that his ex girlfriends didn’t even have some of the qualities that I do (and he’s still friends with his exes and never says anything bad about them, one of them I went to high school with and she is also really pretty). I wish I knew exactly what qualities those were, but there is something anyway!

  13.  #13Indigo on June 17, 2015 at 8:14 am


    I’m going to say to you what I said to Mistea1 on the previous thread… there is a whole world of guys out there!

    No one is saying you should stop loving S. I still love D like crazy. But there is a WHOLE world of guys out there. Whenever you find yourself thinking things like, S is the best I’ll ever do, no one will want me with 5 kids etc. etc. Remember… a couple of billion men of ALL shapes and sizes. Just widen your view.

  14.  #14Victoria on June 17, 2015 at 8:20 am

    I think this is a very important questions, which are the qualities that he finds special and attractive in you.
    I have wondered a lot, I think it is quite important to understand how attraction works for a man, mostly because I have figured that it works differently than for a woman.
    I have been re-reading “Why Venus and Mars collide”, and somehow I don’t like the book. It says that it is very important for a man to be left alone, to be left to do whatever he wants, to appreciate him, and not tell him that he is not doing enough. It also says, a woman should be responsible for 90% of her own satisfaction, and the man should be responsible only for 10% because this is only as much as he can do. And, even though what the author says there is not so different from what Rori teaches (focus on yourself), I somehow get triggered by the way he says it.
    Anyhow, I digress. It seems to me, from your story, that S. feels very masculine with you, because he sees himself as the more powerful partner (financially, physically, as your employer, etc) so he can be the man, the person in control, the master. If he STRONGLY likes this feeling it probably attracts his primal side. What do you think?

  15.  #15Senior Lady Vibe on June 17, 2015 at 9:14 am

    9: Victoria says:
    “If she is to allow a boyfriend/potential step-father figure, the man will have to have a say about her childrens upbringing, and she may not be willing to allow that at this stage.

    No, this is not correct. A woman’s lover/boyfriend doesn’t “have to have a say about her children’s upbringing.” Not at all. That’s not his job and not his relationship with the children.

    Dating and/or bedding a woman does not give a man any say with her children. His only job in that regard is to stand firm with her and not undermine the rules and standards set by the parents of the children.


  16.  #16Zara on June 17, 2015 at 9:41 am

    ((( Lovergirl )))

    Lovergirl 175 said: *****Maybe so…only now I am completely confused because he just called me! It was midnight when he called and I was in bed but not asleep yet. Anyway, he called, he said, just to find out how my new job is going. He asked questions about that and he said he had been waiting for the “emotional storm to blow over” and that his Aunt and Uncle had been in town (which I already knew they were coming). Then he wanted to talk about some new idea he has for his business. He wanted my opinions and advice, as usual.

    I feel so…confused!! I don’t know what he wants! I’ve probably told him ten thousand times I don’t want to be his platonic friend. Yet, he doesn’t seem to get that. He wants to talk to me just like nothing happened. I don’t doubt he will want to have sex again too. He KNOWS at this point how I feel about things, yet he is back to the same behavior.

    I’m not sure what to do. Maybe I shouldn’t have talked to him. We talked for 20 minutes and I was going to tell him I needed to go to sleep but he said it first. I was nice to him. Maybe I shouldn’t have been? I just don’t know how to act with him. I don’t want to be strung along. I love him though. :/*****


    S is doing what feels best for him, with no intent to either hurt you nor to win your heart. He is just living his life the way it works best for himself.

    When he phoned you at midnight, he was simply phoning a friend he knows will pick up the phone that late at night.
    It is up to you to not pick up the phone so late at night. As long as you answer to him so late, he is reading it as you being happy with it the way it is. He does not mean to hurt you, he just does what keeps working for him. He is focused on sorting himself out. There is no malice in his blindness for your heartache.

    He probably thinks you are doing what you want to do.
    It is not up to him to withhold his friendship. Witholding friendship is not a manly move. It is up to you to accept or not what he is offering you. It is up to you to pick up the phone or not, to visit his house or not etc…

    Friendships can be platonic, sexual, financial, political, artistical, philosophical, geographical, etc…, they can be a bit of everything, all kind of friendships. It takes all to make a world. You get to accept the types of friendship you feel good with and you get to walk away from the rest. You’ve got the power to accept only what feels good and to tolerate nothing. That is probably how S deals with friendships himself and he might assume you do the same for yourself.

    He had told you before that him fathering a child with you would not be a conscious choice on his part, and he is still looking around to meet whom to consciously father a child with. He might feel he is being honest and all is right in the best world.
    From there, whatever interaction you accept to have with him, he might think it is from your free choice to accept what he is offering you: a friend you work for and you have sex with while he looks for his Ms Right.
    You feel tied up to him in a same sack and you feel you can’t hop forward and you stumble because he is not synchronising his hopping with yours. But that is not his reality. In his reality there is no sack race going on. He is not tied in a sack, he is out there, living his life. Calling a friend.

    So, he calls you.
    He brain storms about his business. As very often. You go along with his conversation about the business. As very often. You accept what he has to offer in that moment. He probably thinks you like that and you are doing what you want to do. He might expect you to stop that type of conversation if you are not getting what you like.

    He might think your last outbursts were due to hormones changes or some inner work you have to do on yourself. He might have thought all you needed was a few days on your own, after which your mood would be back to acceptable and he could speak to you again with no changes necessary on his part.

    After all, after each of his period of silence, you have welcomed him as if nothing and you have accepted the same unchanged interactions with him. Hence he can not relate your anxiety to the “friendship” he is offering.


    “Hmmm S? It felt good hearing your voice. I’ve missed you. But the conversation feels cold. I would love to keep speaking with you but I can not do it on a friendship level. It feels painful. My heart wants to feel courted and loved by your heart. Anything less feels cold. You know where to find me if your heart should want to connect with mine. In the mean time I am hanging the phone down as my dear heart needs all my warmth right now. Good night.”


  17.  #17Dixie on June 17, 2015 at 10:18 am

    Millie, Zara, Indigo,Azure, Victoria, Lovergirl…

    This conversation has felt so enlightening and uplifting to me. I’m taking so much good advice and honestly, my heart has felt like a wobble board lately.

    D. has pulled back and I can say with honesty, that it has felt pretty bad. In the past, I would have overfunctioned for certain, and it always felt exhausting.

    I am over over-functioning. I’m not mad or angry, just loving these very honest feelings of dissatisfaction. They let me know that this on/off does not feel good.

    But now, with this discussion, I’m feeling my way out of this entanglement. I can see my situation more clearly from
    all the insight here. I love that even though these feelings feel scary, I know I will be okay.

    Lovergirl, I love the scripts here suggested to you. I love how you’ve set boundaries. You’ve inspired me, you really have. And yes, as Indigo said, I love D. I also want more than this.

    Oh, it feels SO good to just say that!

    Yesterday at a BBQ, I felt so free and light, like a kite. So much fun. So far from overfunctioning 🙂 I miss the silliness, the dreaming, the sharing and closeness with D. But I have to put myself first again….

    I will probably schedule a session with Dominique soon… I’m ready to let go of some old limiting fears.

  18.  #18Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 11:55 am

    Indigo 13-

    It’s not that I think S is the best I can do, I think he’s perfect for me! I’ve never met anyone that “fits” me so well. I know there are other men out there. It’s true I do limit myself too- heck I haven’t dated a white guy since my ex husband. :p I know I could widen my scope. Interracial relationships are always going to have their own challenges too- l just tend to feel more comfortable there.

  19.  #19Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 12:04 pm

    Victoria 14-

    That’s possible. That he feels super masculine with me. He does make comments about how I really like a man to be “the man” in a relationship, and that is very true about me. I LIKE that dynamic a lot.

    He has also said I make him feel “wanted”. He said no one else makes him feel like that. He also says that I make him feel “relaxed” in bed vs feeling pressure to perform from other women and not being able to orgasm easily with them. That and he told me that I encourage him a lot and am lighthearted and positive vs his more serious ex girlfriend. From what I know about her she seems very type A and I am much more type B, lol.

    Both S and my ex husband have referred to me as “easygoing”. He said it lifts him out of his negative moods, even though he doesn’t show it (like when I was pregnant and he was flipping out, he later told me I had no idea how much my kindness towards him had helped). So that’s what I know from what he has said. Maybe there is something else, I can’t be sure.

  20.  #20Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 12:16 pm

    Senior Lady 15-

    Me, personally, I think it would be a huge relief to have a man like S, step in and act like an actual father to my kids. In the out there chance we actually ended up together like that, it would be wonderful.

    My kids dad has pretty much abandoned them. He is not involved and could care less what they are up to. They do see him, but its only every couple of months. He rarely even bothers to call in between and doesn’t remember their birthdays. I have to really go out of my way to even get him to spend any time with them. Like, I recently told him one of the kids had stitches in his leg that he can’t get wet when they are there over Father’s Day weekend and he didn’t even ask what happened.

    Four of my children are boys and two of them are teenagers. I feel overwhelmed trying to handle it on my own. My oldest is soo incredibly angry at his dad and the world and he takes it out on me, even though he has told counselors that he thinks I am a great mom. It would be a lifesaver to have a man around here helping keep him under control. I would welcome the help and advice though I’ve never told S that.

  21.  #21Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 12:28 pm

    Zara 16-

    Maybe that is true. I don’t know how to respond when he contacts me. There is so much conflicting info. Do I just act warmly and go with my feelings or do I shut him off even though I really do love talking to him?

    These conversations with him never feel cold. 🙂 He always sounds eager and happy to talk to me. This time he said he’d been wondering and really wanting to ask how my new job was going but he was waiting for the emotional storm to blow over. He’s super supportive and much more interested in me and what’s going on in my life than probably anyone I’ve ever met. He asks me a million questions about my thoughts and feelings and opinions. He gets excited about every little success I have, and it feels genuine.

    He’s very hard to hang up on, lol. He’s like a big, enthusiastic, puppy, haha. He’s always full of all this stuff he wants to talk about and tell me. It’s very hard for me to shut him down.

  22.  #22Lovergirl on June 17, 2015 at 12:30 pm

    Dixie- thanks and I am glad I am inspiring someone, lol. I feel so conflicted and confused. I have set some boundaries though and stuck to them. I may have to be really firm on the not being “just friends” part.

  23.  #23Indigo on June 17, 2015 at 1:00 pm


    I love this:

    “I am over over-functioning. I’m not mad or angry, just loving these very honest feelings of dissatisfaction. They let me know that this on/off does not feel good.

    But now, with this discussion, I’m feeling my way out of this entanglement. I can see my situation more clearly from
    all the insight here. I love that even though these feelings feel scary, I know I will be okay.”

    I wish I knew what my life had in store for me. Well, maybe I wouldn’t want to know because that would ruin the surprise. But not knowing feels very scary. I wish I could prepare for it, the way one prepares for a date, the way one looks forward to it. I know our only job is to keep being our happiest best selves, but when one relationship ends it leaves a void – I don’t mean the void of doing stuff, I mean the void of loving someone. I just wish I knew for sure that it would all be ok.

  24.  #24victoria on June 17, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    The best way to predict the future is to create it 🙂

  25.  #25Allure on June 17, 2015 at 3:46 pm

    Mmmmmm I feel relaxed. Bundled up in my bed enjoying my own company. Life is so entertaining when I let it be. Daydreaming. My brain feels crowded. Too many people.
    I am reminded…I don’t need to DO anything about anything. I am living in the moment, feeling, and loving myself. I am allowing myself to recieve love from all around. I don’t need to analyze them, do anything with them or try to make anything happen because of them.
    I feel overwhelmed.
    So I lay here and do the only thing I can do and keep my sanity…Enjoy it! Spicy life right?
    Let. Go. Of. Control.
    Hanging on is the only block.
    I feel a full bladder, tingly toes, a warm pain in my elbows, slightly tight throat, a smile on my lips.
    I feel at ease, relaxed, calm, buzzed. Still daydreaming. Sigh.

  26.  #26Dixie on June 17, 2015 at 6:25 pm


    I’m so glad that my feelings resonated with you! I definitely feel anxious and scared sometimes that maybe, just maybe, I’m not supposed to meet someone. That perhaps that I’m meant to save the world, some sort of teacher/activist 🙂 Leaving a string of lovers across the globe 🙂

    But that’s bananas truly, because after D, I KNOW in my bones that he was brought into my life to remind me how awesome it feels to be in real, synergistic, passionate partnership. After a string of short relationships, falling in love with D, and feeling his tenderness made me feel so, so loved and treasured.

    And thats why it feels okay. Because I don’t really know what the future holds except this: as long as I put my self first,
    as long as I do what’s in my best interest, as long as I go along the path of least resistance, then I feel good!

    And to be honest, that’s the girl that D fell in love with too., I just forgot to fall in love with me too! 😉

  27.  #27Dixie on June 17, 2015 at 6:30 pm

    I’m watching a documentary now about female game changers, including Hilary Clinton, but grass roots activisits worldwide.

    And I LOVE feeling this inspired by their strength and courage. I love this feeling because it reminds me that following my passion brings me back to my true self.

  28.  #28Allure on June 17, 2015 at 10:19 pm

    Can’t sleep. Feeling a thunderstorm in my belly. It’s not unpleasant. Keeping me up anyways. No question I am drawing romantic attention to myself. It feels overwhelming right now. Still not unpleasant. Oh gee now i’m yawning. Maybe I just needed to say it and acknowledge it.
    Remind myself again I don’t need to do anything other than be here right now.
    Feeling even more relaxed. I can learn intereting things from this experience.
    I feel energetic mountains moving.
    Yawn yawn yawn. This is working. Sleep time!

  29.  #29Waterfall on June 18, 2015 at 3:59 am

    Hi Guys,

    Just quickly catching up while I have 10 mins..
    It’s a beautiful sunny day here and I am working from home today.

    The guy that I met on holiday has been in touch a few times. I’m not sure what to do. I only want a platonic friendship with him and I feel he wants more. But then I know I need the practise. What do other sirens think?

    Also, I broke my promise to myself and reached out to D last night. I even said how lovely it would be to hear his voice. He told me he was abroad (again!) at the moment but that he would love to speak to me. We spoke for an hour or so and just told each other our news…

    I don’t know why but it felt kind of cold and clinical. But that’s what I wanted right?!!

    Towards the end of the call there was a lull in the conversation and I could sense he wanted to get off the phone. He said “Oooo… here is the awkward bit…”

    That made me then feel really awkward and like he wanted me to get off the phone.

    Sigh. All I can do is try and focus on being grateful for all the positive things in the relationship – rather that focusing on all the negative.

    He had sent me a present and a card and I tried to focus on that. I focused on the other nice gifts he had given me, and all the poetry, letters, nice cards, hugs, kisses and precious time together.

    Though sometimes this is hard as I wake up feeling so much ANGER towards him and BITTERNESS. I feel a coldness in his voice and I keep questioning WHY I was not “good enough” for him. I keep blaming him, and wishing he would sweep me up in his arms and ask me to marry him and promise he would do everything in his power to make me happy…

    I told him I had realised that I was too clingy for him. Over the past few days I realised that although not the underlying cause this was the reason why we weren’t working. I told him I needed him to want to be around me and socialise with me. He agreed with me, and it wasn’t like I said it badly, I said it in a way that will hopefully release both of us.

    I do feel sad that he will probably meet someone else, but I also know that I wasn’t happy in the relationship and not getting my needs met.

    I just wished that we had split up last year because I felt SOOOO much stronger. Now I feel downtrodden and completely under his power. I feel like I’ve ended up loving him so much more because we have gone through this very rocky last year together…

    Maybe it’s because he keeps promising to be there for me. He keeps saying that no matter what he will be there for me. He told me to phone him anytime. This is what was keeping me warm at night. Now I realise I need to wake up and smell the coffee because this is probably a “line” too…

    In his head he cares. But not really enough to do anything about it…

    Lol. The worse thing is I realise just how NEEDY I am. I have NEVER seen this before so clearly with myself…

    I think this is good, because hopefully in time I will be able to work on this.

    I know I have become ADDICTED to him. Other men would offer to hold me, comfort me, be there for me…

    But I have PUSHED them away. I want him because he is not available and I find him exciting and stimulating..

    But really why do I need this so much in my life? Why do I think the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence? Why do I envy his life so much and see it as being so much better than mine. Why do I want to be a part of it so much, and yet feel so unworthy and that leads me to KEEP TRYING harder and harder. What is that about? How can I work on this…

    This has been in me for as long as I can remember. I always wanted to hang with the cool kids. I was always so embarrassed about my family and friends. I would follow people around and try to fit in with them even though they didn’t want me. This all led to years of hurt and feeling not good enough and rejected…

    I have felt like this literally since childhood…

    So when a man who I see as cool and amazing gives me some attention I go hell to leather to make sure it stays that way. I want to impress him, I constantly think about him and what he would say about this and that etc…

    I drop him into conversation ALL the time. I go over and over in my head conversations we have had, and things I would like to talk about with him. Things I would like to get his opinion on. Talk about over functioning!!!! If he gives me the tiniest bit of attention I am in raptures…

    What needs healing within me to release me from this? I have been like this since ever since I can remember… I am so acutely aware of it..

    I guess I form a life for myself. Yet, still I am so easily thrown off balance. I want to heal this yet I feel anxious…

  30.  #30Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 4:57 am

    How lovely to hear your siren melody!!

    I have found… no matter how great a guy looks on paper…
    IF he triggers *ME* learn from the triggers…
    But as in your case… it is YOU taking
    Exquisite care of YOU…
    and walking AWAY!!!

    You set your boundaries… You asked for what you needed…
    He couldn’t give you that…
    He hit his “relationship wall”
    most likely, this is all he has to give ANY woman

    Now you have a WONDERFUL opportunity
    to begin learning, and loving MORE of YOU
    ALL of you…
    You have already begun to see so many
    wonderful insights into who you are…
    a VERY important time to learn to LOVE
    all of that about you…
    My self esteem grows and Grows!!
    here is a link I found that has some great
    comments from Rori

  31.  #31Labbit on June 18, 2015 at 5:00 am

    The last few days have been eye-opening for me. Right after Tender invited me on a vacation next month, he let me know that the next couple of weeks are going to be incredibly busy for him at work and so far life has lived up to that. He barely texts me from work right now, and when he comes home he rests about 30 minutes before the laptop opens up and he’s right back it. After a few hours he plops into bed exhausted, and it’s rinse and repeat the next day. Our conversation, quality time is barely existent right now. He let me know I’m kind of on my own at the moment, not because he wants it that way but because that’s how it has to be so he can focus on this very important project. I’m accepting the challenge wholeheartedly, as if it were my own idea. We do have a date set up for this weekend which I’m looking forward to.

    I see how easily I could get upset about his lack of attention, not because getting upset would make sense but because it is what part of me wants to do. Instead, I see this as opportunity, as many of you Sirens were recommending to me when Tender had withdrawn…I see this as a chance to learn how to truly turn my focus onto me, fill myself up, fulfill myself, so that when Tender does have his free moments I am already full and can spill my abundance of love and happiness over onto him. Instead of feeling anxious, looking to him to fill me up all the time as I’ve done in the past.

    In these last few days I have seen that I’ve made a LOT of progress from a year ago in this arena of taking care of myself, putting me first. I don’t have terrible nightmares anymore or wake up to panic attacks like I used to (though sleep is admittedly still less peaceful than I’d like, and Tender has a nice bruise on his leg from my tossing and turning to prove it). During the day I’m mostly able to catch my gremlin thoughts, love them, and breathe love and compassion into myself. The gremlins are different now…not so much an anxiety-fueled call for me to rush forward towards Tender as a nitpicky bunch that wants to pick HIM apart now, change him into ways that my mind thinks would please me more. They say things like why doesn’t he text or call more, what is he doing during those long spaces between the hours when I see him? Even though I know very well that he’s working, plain and simple.

    So this has come at the perfect time, as these lessons always seem to, when I’m feeling stronger in myself and can be mindful about concentrating on expanding my life, seeing friends and talking to others, being open to the world to CD (though I want to shut down so often right now, especially from male attention, which means it’s all the more important to open up!!), keeping myself feeling good via activities, and yet also letting myself rest and allow these sometimes crazy thoughts to pass through me without adding any energy to them or resisting them.

    Last night I had dinner with a dear friend after the gym, and he reminded me how important it is that each partner in a successful relationship comes to it whole, not looking to the other for fulfillment or validation, how being whole allows each partner to together build something larger than themselves that carries us through the tough times. And then we chatted about light, funny stuff for the rest of the evening. It was just the recharge I needed! I’m feeling so grateful this morning.

    My light is feeling a little dimmer than usual I admit, but considering now versus the past situations like this, the light inside of me is blinding in comparison. Ever brighter. That’s what I’m learning right now.

  32.  #32Labbit on June 18, 2015 at 5:02 am

    Oooohhhh Azure Blu, what a fantastic link!!! 🙂

  33.  #33Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 5:44 am

    {{{{Labbit}}}} #31
    Ohhh.. lovely Siren…
    I had no idea you experience such uncomfortable and frightening sleep!

    Yes you do sound like you are MUCH more relaxed this time around…
    I know i wouldn’t be as anxious IF Tender were there with you most nights…
    AND he explained about being busy… and
    He had an Amazing vaca planned…
    ALLL VERY loving and giving and thoughtful of his beloved!!!

  34.  #34Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 5:46 am

    Sooo glad the link was helpful…
    For ME as well…
    “the healing happens when you hear all the voices,
    sink into them, acknowledge them,
    love and embrace them,
    and then move in the best-feeling directions.”

  35.  #35Sassy on June 18, 2015 at 6:43 am

    I downloaded the “Why men love bitches-from doormat to dream girl” and all I can say is WOW! Woah! Amazing. Especially since it’s feedback from real live men, not just a females’ perspective of what they think, feel and do.
    It has already enhanced what I’ve gleaned, picked up and learned from Rori, Dominique and the other female coaches I follow.
    I’m making these changes, albeit slowly and no doubt will backslide some. But yesterday I really put into practice the behavior that men want to have fun and feel our positive energy to stay attached. We had a long car ride to and from one of my clients offices and just laughed and joked, sang, teased each other and had fun!
    It was just what I needed after an anxiety filled weekend of not hearing from him and then ultimately seeing that “busy” word that triggers me to no end.
    Anyway, feeling very happy and maybe, just maybe I can maintain this new prospect of putting myself first and keeping him “just outside his reach” to keep him intrigued.

  36.  #36Beloved on June 18, 2015 at 6:53 am

    Oh, those NV’s….!
    The way being at peace with them is showing up like this for me – sitting at the table with “the guys” during a break. They start talking about a fellow classmate they do not like. They share some of her more outrageous stories. I feel surprised, and say, Oh, wow, I heard something different (an even more outrageous story she shared privately with me) and then say, “and I don’t want to repeat it because I don’t want to add to the negativity.”
    Which, just fell out of my mouth, all natural and ease. Simple – “I don’t want”, no judgment on anyone else, mostly just a conversation with my own self, a statement of simple truth, not meant to be directed at anyone else.
    With that statement I felt something shift and I felt even MORE peaceful and at ease. “The guys” are known for being pretty negative and big complainers and I felt that somehow I was making peace with and being show a need to forgive my own negativity.
    I always wanted to be included, to feel like part of the group…and when I sat down with them yesterday I actually moved some of their stuff to make space for myself and …gasp…TOOK UP SPACE, ha.
    And later I felt like…well, that wasn’t all it was cracked up to be. I have been wanted to be included and accepted with a bunch of men who complain and put other people down. Big whoop.
    Ha 🙂
    Each one of them, with me individually, is super cooperative and sweet. I feel it’s up to me to learn to be strong and secure in myself and stay centered even when I’m in a “pack”, haha.
    I do notice, that more often than not, they defer to me.
    One of the really interesting things I’ve noticed recently, is how well, “What do you think?” works.
    So many times, recently, I swear I wasn’t even trying to get anyone to do anything, I was just musing over the next thing to do …and I will say, “I am feeling like this equipment needs to be moved to the other side of the lab and out of the way, what do you think?”
    The guys have jumped up from just sitting around doing nothing, to move it. Without my asking, I mean, I’m sincerely wondering what they think…and they just leap into action. Over and over again, I ask what they think about what to do next, and they just DO it.
    On the one hand, I feel “useless” and like that’s a bad thing and I breathe through those feelings, on the other hand, I feel like a queen bee. I’m just being my natural self.
    So interesting.
    I wonder how wonderful today will be?

  37.  #37Waterfall on June 18, 2015 at 7:00 am

    @ Labbit 31

    Wow, feel inspired reading this. I notice how much it is triggering me and that I want to fight against it.

    With D and other people I haven’t known how to handle this kind of situation. I tend to just want to block it out and pretend it’s not happening but I’m sure people pick up on my mood even if I try and hide it.

    When I was with D I felt really cast aside if I wasn’t his number one priority. Hmmm. This is making me think!

  38.  #38Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 7:04 am

    How wonderful alllll of the work you are doing with your job!!!
    Always so good to notice when we’re TAKING UP SPACE and YOU made room for YOU to sit!!!
    YAY… self love and esteem, recognition, reverence and honor!

    Ahhh… the magical words
    “What do you think?” it has been powerful for me to use these words…
    I have a tendency to be a know it all…
    It has helped to open ME up to others and allow me to be MORE authentic and vulnerable…
    I DON”T WANT to know it all…
    it keeps me soo closed off!!

  39.  #39Waterfall on June 18, 2015 at 7:09 am

    @ Azure Blu 30

    Ahhh, thank you for the link…
    What a timely reminder for me to lather more love onto myself!!

    To love all of me, even the low self-esteem…

  40.  #40Beloved on June 18, 2015 at 7:19 am

    Oh, Azure Blu, me too! I was dubbed “the smart one” in my family, which makes me laugh and laugh because my younger sisters are so obviously more intelligent than I am, they just didn’t do well in school. So I had a “know it all” attitude and well, that just made life feel yucky and gave me a false sense of security, and any time that facade felt threatened, I would feel as if my very life was threatened!

    Every time I encounter something that feels bad in another person recently, I say “I am willing to forgive and release that in myself.” Yesterday, it was arrogance and insecurity that came up for me, and this morning as I recall the experience I say that…I forgive, love, bless and am willing to release that in myself.

    On a tangent – One of the sirens on the other thread mentioned how much happier she realized she is without her ex, and I felt my heart leaping in resonance, YES YES!! As much as I have felt like I was missing him off and on when things felt rocky at home, I never did pick up that phone because the few minutes of relief I might have experienced wasn’t worth having him back in my life in any capacity.
    It felt good to notice, really, just HOW MUCH happier I am without him. So, so SO happy. Happier than I knew I could be, and it’s only getting better and better.
    yum yum yum
    yes yes yes!

  41.  #41Lovergirl on June 18, 2015 at 9:56 am

    Well, nothing from S for the last couple of days. Maybe he was just calling so he wouldn’t feel like a “bad guy” after the stuff that happened with the swinger party. I really don’t know what is going on with him and that makes me feel anxious.

    I’m trying to distract myself with other things. I went out with a girlfriend yesterday for happy hour. I’ve known her since high school. One of the nice things about having moved to this city last year is that I am closer to old friends and family and was able to get away from all the church people that pretty much shunned us after the divorce from my ex.

    It felt good to chat and hang out. Some guy bought us shots but he wasn’t bothering us too much. We mostly just talked- she is single and never had kids. She’s on Tinder and had like 7 dates with new guys in the past couple of weeks, lol. She was encouraging me to try that. I might give it a go.

  42.  #42Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 10:04 am

    Ahhhh… yes the WONDERFUL place to be
    when you realize how the Universe is working
    FOR YOU…
    By leading you away from your ex!!
    and Alll the great things you learned about yourself
    AND men!

  43.  #43Lovergirl on June 18, 2015 at 2:07 pm

    Well, Tinder is fun, if a bit overwhelming, lol. I only said yes to about 15 guys and almost all of them have matched me already. Ive only been on there a couple of hours and have one guy taking me out on Monday and another one talking about this weekend. The others dont seem as great but these two have decent personalities over text. 🙂

  44.  #44Azure Blu on June 18, 2015 at 3:02 pm

    yay for YOU!!
    sounds fun! ;0}

  45.  #45Sassy on June 18, 2015 at 6:12 pm

    Blog is sooooo slow, and I have been in moderation since 6:43 this morning and it’s 9:11pm!!!!

  46.  #46Tereana on June 18, 2015 at 8:49 pm

    An interesting thing is happening for me. Some of you might say “I told you so.” But also, I think I’m being forced to listen to the universe and my own inner guiding voice, which tells me to slow down when I want to go fast. And my outsides want to go fast. Fast feels normal. But it’s stressful. And it feels like panic. Like “thisthingmusthappennoworitwillneverhappensoihavetodoitnowhelpmeGod” kind of panic. And that’s now necessary.

    I might be changing my plans. Instead of moving to the new city now, maybe I’ll wait for a bit. Stay a few years. Save money. Plan ahead.

    But the cool fun thing that’s happening isn’t that. It’s that I’m getting more requests for dance teaching. And I love doing it. And I don’t mind askimg for money. It’s s cool combination – something I love doing, which other people want to learn, and they are willing to pay for lessons. That’s kind of cool : )

  47.  #47Tereana on June 18, 2015 at 8:51 pm

    That’s *not* necessary…

  48.  #48Zara on June 19, 2015 at 1:52 am

    Lovergirl 40 *****Well, nothing from S for the last couple of days. Maybe he was just calling so he wouldn’t feel like a “bad guy” after the stuff that happened with the swinger party. I really don’t know what is going on with him and that makes me feel anxious.*****

    There was no reason for S calling. He does not need to have a reason. He calls because that’s what friends do.
    Don’t you have friends you remember to call once in a while with no particular intention other than keep in touch? That’s what S does with you. The only way for this to stop is when YOU stop picking up the phone. Otherwise he will keep in touch, which is not a problem in itself if it was not for the story you attach to his calls.

    And yes, may be one day he will blurp a suggestion for a meeting. Just like you would do after a couple of calls with your friends. And yes, you both being swingers, he will find natural to include sex in the meeting. Which is not a problem in itself if it was not for the new story you attach to it. On his part there is no reason to stop enjoying sex with each of his friends who accept it from him. Including you. Sex seems to be how he connects. There is no romantic reasons behind.
    After all, you first met in the understanding you don’t attach any story to sex. That’s where he is at.

    And yes, that “wonderfull” meeting with him will be followed by periods of total silence. Just like friends do. No special reason for it.

    The only way this is going to stop is when YOU say NO to him.
    For real, not only when frustration takes over you.


    “I am having a hard time after our phone call. I love hearing you but I feel destabilised about the friendliness with which you treat me. I can not handle a friendship with you, it feels too painful considering my romantic feelings. When we meet and when you call, I expect to feel courted and loved. I can’t help it. My romantic feelings for you builds up that expectation in me. But the call was just a friendly call again. Followed by nothing again. And I feel let down, my expectation for romance deceived. That deception feeling is harming my self esteem. I will not pick up the phone any more. I now know what I want. I will not accept anything less from a man than a romantic courtship. I am worth it.”


  49.  #49Indigo on June 19, 2015 at 3:59 am

    I really like this script of yours, Zara. It’s a bit longer than I would have said, but good.

    I, and I’m sure many of the other sirens, will really caution you against accepting friendship with a man whom you have romantic feelings for. Especially if he is the one keeping it at friendship. It generally only leads to heartache and disappointment. On the other hand I know how difficult it is not to answer when you love speaking to that person, and you feel like you are getting a lot out of the friendship. But you are holding yourself back.

  50.  #50Senior Lady Vibe on June 19, 2015 at 4:20 am

    Here’s a quick little two-minute video from Cherry Norris==>


  51.  #51Indigo on June 19, 2015 at 8:52 am

    Nice video! She absolutely and totally reminds me of Mary Poppins… just a spoonful of sugar!

  52.  #52Femininewoman on June 19, 2015 at 9:51 am

    Zara you are always so wise.

    I’d love to hear from you. I am here recuperating from surgery.

  53.  #53Azure Blu on June 19, 2015 at 10:09 am

    I am hoping your surgery went well!!
    What surgery did you have>
    I remember you and Dominique talking about it…
    I’ve forgotten what it was for though.
    Sending you get welll quickly Vibrations!!

  54.  #54Femininewoman on June 19, 2015 at 11:42 am

    Thanks SLV,

    Hip surgery

  55.  #55Waterfall on June 19, 2015 at 11:59 am


    Fantastic comments and scripting to Lovergirl.
    I am so amazed at what you’ve written. It’s completely eye-opening for me!! Weirdly I can see this for other people but not myself…

    If you don’t mind I am going to copy & paste it, for future reference…

  56.  #56Waterfall on June 19, 2015 at 12:00 pm

    Feminine Woman,

    Hope you’re recuperating well!

  57.  #57Zara on June 19, 2015 at 2:59 pm


    Hello 🙂

    I have just emailed you at the yahoo adress.


  58.  #58Kim on June 19, 2015 at 3:49 pm

    FW…how are you?
    Just sending some vibes for a speedy recovery!
    Hope you are comfortable!

  59.  #59Sassy on June 19, 2015 at 6:15 pm

    Healing thoughts to you FW!

  60.  #60Tereana on June 19, 2015 at 7:32 pm

    FW, wishing you a speedy and full recovery!

  61.  #61Tereana on June 19, 2015 at 7:48 pm

    Ladies, I just did something funny. I think I just CDed with a guy who was CDing. Let me explain…

    We met last summer. We know some people in common. He’s been saying on and off that we should get together. But he’s taken months to make a plan.

    So tonight, I met him at his restaurant, which he owns. He got me everything I needed and wanted. And it came out, at some point in the conversation, that he is in a serious, committed relationship. Yet everything about the meeting “smelled” like a date. So what was it about?

    Then I realized – aha! – he was CDing. He was getting “free therapy” and perspective by talking to me. By spending time with a woman who was not his girlfriend, he got to feel like a man in a different way. But there was no “cheating” involved. We simply talked about our lives and spent time together.

    Meanwhile, I was texting with some other guys even during pauses, like when he went away to get me food. So it’s not like I wasn’t CDing him. I was. And it was fun. I enjoyed it. I got perspective and “free therapy,” too. And some free food 😉

    But my real aha was how men do this all the time and don’t feel bad about it. As women, we feel like terrible cheaters of we so much as look at or think about another man. Maybe it’s cultural, or maybe it’s an innate difference. But in any case, it’s harder for us. But once we lose the guilt, we find the freedom that men have all the time. And that ends up making us more attracting to them…

    What do you ladies think? Does this ring true to you?

  62.  #62prplpsn28 on June 19, 2015 at 8:26 pm

    Hi everyone. I’ve been away from here for a while again. Trying now to catch up 🙂

  63.  #63Lovergirl on June 19, 2015 at 10:12 pm

    Okay- thank you Zara for the comments and script ideas. It’s very hard for me to accept that he really wants to just be friends, despite me repeatedly telling him I am not okay with that! Anyhow, I have drafted up a text to send the next time he tries to call.

    I’m sure he will call eventually, even though it has been 4 days this time. I can’t stand these long disappearances. I think I’d rather him just be gone for good than have this slow, torturous sort of “break up” that we seem to be having.

    Anyhow- I have this saved in my draft texts to him and plan to just hit send the next time he tries to contact me in any way. “I don’t want to talk as just friends. I get all excited and happy to hear from you and its a huge letdown afterwards to remember that I am not #1 and don’t have your love and affection. I’m worth those things. Please don’t call if you can’t give them to me.”

    That’s it. Short and not that sweet (lol). What do you ladies think?

  64.  #64Lovergirl on June 19, 2015 at 10:47 pm

    I saw Chicago again last night. He had begged me to give him another chance, and said he would “work on” the chemistry (no idea how anyone can do that). So he took me out to eat and we went back to his place and had sex. It still wasn’t any good.

    I just can’t get into him at all. He does weird things like puts his tongue in my ear and it totally turns me off. I’m pulling away, totally grossed out and he keeps going for it again! Yuck!

    That and he continues to lecture me about everything and I find it really annoying. I feel like I’m being talked down to and like everything I say is being trivialized. Its like he treats my comments as though they are coming from someone who doesn’t know anything at all. It’s maddening.

    Like, we drove past this ritzy private school and he commented on how expensive it is. I said I know, my stepbrother and stepsister went there. Their mother was a poor single mom, and they lived in the bad area of town but she secluded them from the neighbors and scrounged every penny to make sure they went to private school. He acted like he didn’t believe me and said “well MAYBE she did”. Uh hello, I just said she did! There was no “maybe” about it!! Ugh!

    I talked about how I sold some items online and he tried to tell me I am doing it wrong. I know I’m doing it just fine because I’ve spent the past year helping S do the same thing and he knows what he is doing and taught me well. Anyhow, Chicago apparently thinks I’m too stupid to figure this out for myself and says I am going about this or that wrongly. Whatever, its working just fine for me, thanks. Grrr…

    Oh and I said something about how I was going to get my first paycheck Friday (today) and am excited about that. He was like “are you sure” and “how do you know?” I said because my boss told me and that it might not be automatically deposited yet but I would go pick it up if not. He was like oh, you might not get it because sometimes they send it to some main office somewhere and you won’t get it for like a week. I said I wasn’t worried about that I am sure I will get paid tomorrow, but he kept harping on it and being negative and weird. Of course, I got paid like a normal person today. Wtf is his problem?

    I told him that I still just really don’t feel good about the chemistry in bed. He said chemistry is made outside the bedroom too. I was like well yeah, but I feel kind of judged and disapproved of. He said he just worries about me and tries to “help”.

    I also said I am really kind of still attached to and in love with someone and I think its hard for me to get close to someone else right now. He said well, you don’t open up very much, its like you are closed off. Then he started grilling me about when I last saw this person and I said oh like a couple weeks ago. He started acting kind of jealous and saying I shouldn’t talk to or see that person if I am trying to get over them.

    He was asking if I was ever going to see him again and I said I really don’t know for sure. I just felt pressured and on the spot. It was hard to say I’d rather not because he would try to argue with me.

    Oh, and Chicago is on Tinder. I quickly swiped no on him, lol.

  65.  #65Millie on June 19, 2015 at 11:04 pm

    FW– I’m glad your surgery went well! Hope you have a speedy recovery, although I’m sure some time off is nice.

    Zara– wonderful and poetic script as always!! Thank you for sharing!

    Lovergirl– Honestly Chicago sounds super masculine to me. He wants to have the solution to everything and whatnot. Yes, I see how that is annoying, but as an experiment, I wonder if you went into super girl mode and stopped trying to out-masculine him what he would say!!! How I’d love to be a fly on the wall on that night. I say “out-masculine” because…. I’ve learned….masculine men love to be praised. Even if they reject it. Praise them, it works wonders. I think it would be interesting to take a 180 on Chicago and ooh and ahh at him flaunting his peacock feathers. Of course, I’m not saying this is the right man for you, nor is it 100% truthful of you to act this way…but it would be interesting to see how he responds. I wonder if he seeks a woman who does not accept him. If he seeks to feel put down. If he seeks a woman who is not impressed. If all of a sudden you acted impressed, would he respond well or be turned off?!! I wonder?!!!

  66.  #66Indigo on June 19, 2015 at 11:22 pm


    I found your story about your stepbrother & stepsister interesting because it was the same with me and my brother. My mom was a single mom with very little money but scraped together every spare cent to send us to private schools because she believed in that. So it does happen of course.

    As to your script for S. Hm. I hear you saying:
    “I think I’d rather him just be gone for good than have this slow, torturous sort of “break up” that we seem to be having”
    And I honestly think this is where your truth is. I don’t have to tell you that he doesn’t think he’s breaking up with you, but this is how it feels to YOU. Which reveals how very different the pages are that you are on.

    Your script which says he shouldn’t call you unless he can give those things to you, to me has the vibe of still waiting on him, hoping that things will change. Whereas the more powerful thing to do would be to state what you are looking for in a man/relationship, and you’ve realised that you and he are not heading down that road, that it’s too painful to be friends and that you need to go and find the man who wants the same thing. And then NO contact.

    Sorry, I see no other way. And if it’s any consolation I find myself in the same position so I know what you’re going through.

  67.  #67Lovergirl on June 19, 2015 at 11:27 pm

    Millie- I get frustrated when people on this blog are so positive about Chicago. I feel like he is showing signs of being emotionally abusive and it makes me uncomfortable. I really don’t like him that much. He uses guilt and buying me things to try and keep me around and plays “nice” but my intuition says he is really not that nice.

    Masculine, maybe, but also he is talking down to me, which I find disturbing. I do not like it at all. S will explain things playfully to me, or show me how to do things, or even be critical, but he never makes me feel like an idiot. Even when he is sarcastic, its more saying I know you know better than this and don’t play dumb!

    He treats me ten times better than Chicago, yet everyone is telling me to stay away from HIM. :p

  68.  #68Lovergirl on June 19, 2015 at 11:36 pm

    Indigo- I want to leave the door open because I don’t believe him when he said those things. Not from the way he normally acts. He is very affectionate to me. If he is going to say that stuff though, I want to see if he will stick to it.

    I’m not really looking for a relationship, because if it doesn’t work with S, I don’t have hope that it will work with anyone else. He’s everything I ever wanted and if he could SEEM so into me for so long and really not be, then I just cannot go through that again. I will probably just have casual sex with people.

  69.  #69Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 12:52 am


    It’s the weekend and I am feeling relaxed… Tomorrow I am going to go on a lovely walk with some friends. I wish I could go today but I have too much to catch up on!!

    I have had a lovely few days away seeing my family. I would like more men and some dates in my life !!

  70.  #70Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 12:58 am

    (((( lovergirl ))))

  71.  #71Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 1:01 am

    I wish I had something to report on CDing it just doesn’t seem to be coming my way!

    Lovergirl – I sense Chicago is wrong for you and I wonder if you can completely pull away from him?

  72.  #72Millie on June 20, 2015 at 1:08 am

    Lovergirl— if you feel that way, then I wonder why is it you still see him? The blog is here to share insights and offer differnet perspectives as well as support you…. If I’m being positive about Chicago it is because I see him as human looking for affection in the only way he knows how. The fact that you continue to see him tells me that you want to and are open to hearing what others may see in him by your stories. It that is not the case, then I’m wondering what is it you want to hear or feel in regards to him?

  73.  #73Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 1:13 am


    I have felt like I was CDing long before I came upon Rori’s blog. It’s interesting though as yes, I actually sensed my D was CDing me…

    It always felt a bit weird!!

    He didn’t CD me in the sense that he saw other women, yet I did feel a little like “free therapy” I also felt like an experiment! Like he was experimenting with having a girlfriend!

    He often told me how he had never been on a date or even asked a girl out. Although saying that he did struggle with me too… I couldn’t get my head around it to tell you the truth.

    I think I felt that he enjoyed having someone to open up to. He said I would make a good therapist which of course worried me because I didn’t want to be seen as that!! It felt like I was just there to help him, and obviously I wanted more than that..

    It did feel like he was using me at time. He got love, intimacy, friendship & stability from me. I got to cuddle him and feel a masculine man around me and in my life… But not the stability or consistency…

    Hope this helps…

  74.  #74Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 1:47 am


    I really like what you are saying to Lovergirl about the ooohing and aaahing!! Hehe I need to practise this so much more, it does not come naturally to me.

    I notice when I like a man I almost immediately become more intense, more masculine… I find it hard to just be… Impossible almost…

  75.  #75Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 1:59 am

    “I think I’d rather him just be gone for good than have this slow, torturous sort of “break up” that we seem to be having” This to me is so obviously choosing the victim role. Like volunteering to be tortured and then turning around and complaining.

    It reminds me of Rori’s post where she mentioned something suggesting kinda stepping over the man’s dead body, I gotta go review it.

  76.  #76Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 2:06 am


    Can you explain what you mean by ‘victim role’ I think this sounds incredibly judgemental.

    I would say Lovergirl is getting away from this man to stop herself becoming a victim. The longer she stays with him the more of a victim she would be!! I think the word to describe her is brave..

    A little more positivity wouldn’t go amiss…

  77.  #77Zara on June 20, 2015 at 3:09 am

    Lovergirl : *****Millie- I get frustrated when people on this blog are so positive about Chicago. I feel like he is showing signs of being emotionally abusive and it makes me uncomfortable. I really don’t like him that much. He uses guilt and buying me things to try and keep me around and plays “nice” but my intuition says he is really not that nice.

    Masculine, maybe, but also he is talking down to me, which I find disturbing. I do not like it at all. S will explain things playfully to me, or show me how to do things, or even be critical, but he never makes me feel like an idiot. Even when he is sarcastic, its more saying I know you know better than this and don’t play dumb!

    He treats me ten times better than Chicago, yet everyone is telling me to stay away from HIM. :p*****

    I would drop Chicago too. Life is too short to force myself to stay in a situation where my words are doubted and my impulse to share something is shot down at every try.

    When the situation happens, I use it to practice telling the truth about how I feel and to practice saying “no” to what feels bad. And I leave. Men understand a woman who leaves. As long as she stays, her words are bla bla bla.

    Of course the man wants to debate and argue and justify. So it is a chance to practice not falling for it, not participating in his argumentation. Staying put, feeling good about myself, keeping in mind the one with the issues is him and it is not my problem at all. He is not my son, I don’t have to be stuck with his behaviour not one more minute.

    If you are Cdating, then you are not breaking up with him. He is just a date you don’t feel like meeting anymore. Anyway he is cdating too, you found a bra on his floor although he was already having sex with you. So, I would not feel so fearful of hurting his feelings. He has got back-up plans too.

    The picnic episode is a clear example of what you have to learn to spot in your Cdating. He was imposing on you to work to make him happy. Of course this turned you off coming from an almost stranger. When you finally told him you felt turned off and could not push yourself to organise a picnic, he reproached you not to be romantic. That gave me a feminine vibe from him.

    See, during the courtship, what is romantic about a picnic is that it is the expression of the MAN’s inspiration to pamper you. The man plans it, cooks for it, buys things for it, choses the food and buys it himself (like the strawberries Chicago demanded) his heart inspires him to make YOU happy. Chicago was imposing on you a situation that would have been the total way around. I felt turned off myself reading it.

    Anyway even if he was the woman, imposing a partner to work at something to celebrate him/herself is a turn off.
    So he has it all wrong in my book, poor guy.
    I want to feel pampered myself
    When my love tank is full and I feel well pampered, I want to feel inspired to chose to pamper him in my own ways.
    I don’t want to be demanded to work at pampering my man
    I don’t want my words to be doubted and corrected
    I don’t want to be told how things are in my own life. I should know, thank you.

    Lovergirl, dear, I feel disturbed by how you have sex with a man you feel turned off with.
    I can not put myself in such situation without a certain feeling of abusing myself. It would be a too violent feeling for me.

    After a man has corrected everything I say, after he has shown mistrust for my souvenirs, mistrust for the information about my own work , I can not share with him any intimacy. He creates separation, hence I feel separated and I stay in alignment with that feeling of separation. My body expresses what I feel. My body stays away from his body.
    If I’d let a man touch me after he created separation, I would feel totally fake which is quite disrespectful to him and to myself, and I would feel totally disloyal to myself. My soul would feel betrayed by me and abandoned to feel raped by my own choice. Oh…. My dear soul…. No no no. I don’t want to abandon you.

    I choose to have sex with whomever I feel like. I choose the “whomever” to be a man 100% into me, not 1% less than 100%, a man who gets me, a man who trusts me, a man I feel beautiful and young and healthy and joyous with. A man on the same page as mine. I don’t care who the man is or how he looks. I give myself time to feel my feelings around men, without judging who they are. I focus on how I feel with them. When I feel beautiful and smart my soul turns the green light on for my body. I feel turned on.

    Then having sex is in alignment with my soul and my self esteem blossoms. Which in turn, attracts men even healthier until eventually my soul turns the green light on for my heart and the miracle happens.


  78.  #78Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 4:41 am

    Sorry FW – that wasn’t supposed to sound harsh. I know you are trying to help Lovergirl

  79.  #79Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 4:44 am


    What an amazing inspiring comment about Lovergirls situation! I feel it could easily apply to me too…

    I often felt like this in situations with men and when I look back at certain relationships, also friendships I have wondered why I’ve stayed in them.

    I often feel trapped, I often feel I won’t get any better…

  80.  #80Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 5:32 am

    Does it sound judgemental Waterfall?

    Switch positions for a minute and imagine yourself as a woman with high self esteem. Do you see yourself allowing yourself to be part of “a slow tortuous breakup”? Do you see yourself having choices or an option to be apart of it or not? Is someone holding a gun to your head and saying you have to be a part of this?

    Have you seen the movie Color Purple? Did you see how Celie’s whole vibe changed when she got it in her head that she had a choice?

  81.  #81Zara on June 20, 2015 at 5:36 am

    Millie 65 *****Lovergirl– Honestly Chicago sounds super masculine to me. He wants to have the solution to everything and whatnot*****

    A solution to what problem? Lovergirl was not sharing with him any worries she might have, she was not exposing any situation that needs a solution to be found. She was happily sharing bits of her life. There was nothing that needed to be fixed. It was a time to happily share rather than judge and assume.

    Now, if what Chicago heard in her stories about her life is that everything needs to be fixed and he wants to impose on her to fix herself while she, on her side, is proud of what she is telling him, well, then, he does not like her the way she is. How is he going to ever worship her as should be in a relationship?
    And even in the now, how is she going to feel at her best with a man who does not honestly like her?

    It is not even the typical case where a wife comes home frustrated by a work situation and when she describes the work situation, hoping to feel heard and pampered, the innocent husband gives unrequited advices of what she “should” do and how she “should” feel. There you can say he switched into the manly fix-it mode. There you can hope the wife will breath rather than explode on him.

    A man in fix-it mode jumps when you seem to struggle. Whenever he feels you in a vulnerable situation. When you express unhappiness in your stories. It is the protector heroe in him.
    When you share simple things like your pay check is coming soon, he rejoices with you. He does not interrogate you to make sure you know what you are talking about.

    Either Chicago judges Lovergirl as a pushover, or he projects his own pushoverness. Either way, I feel turned off. (And… I search what in my life this messenger is pointing at.)


  82.  #82Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 5:44 am

    According to Bob Grant “Men LOVE expensive things” so sleeping with a man who does not feel your high value or high self esteem is telling the man don’t love me… my humble opinion.

  83.  #83Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 5:49 am

    Today’s Inspirational Quote

    The Soul is the voice of the body’s interests.
    — George Santayana

  84.  #84Indigo on June 20, 2015 at 5:56 am

    I agree with Zara’s assessment of Chicago, and have to wonder why Lovergirl is seeing him.

    It reminds me of a guy I was dating at the time, when I told him that I had switched to a three quarter day at my previous job – this was a decision that I was thoroughly proud of. I was proud of how I’d negotiated for it, and proud and happy for what it would mean for me and my wellbeing. For whatever reason, he took my sharing as an opportunity to dissect and disagree with my decision – simply because it was not what he would have done and he couldn’t see the logic behind it. He must have “debated” it with me for the better part of an hour, as if it was even any of his business. I remember feeling like I was going to explode with frustration. Knew right then he wasn’t the guy for me.

  85.  #85Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 7:20 am


    Yes, saying someone is taking the “victim role” does sound judgemental. People have said this to me in the past and I have just cried and cried. It felt like an enormous brick wall they were putting in front of me.

    I had a very long, and tortuous relationship myself once. Now looking back I realise these people weren’t the great friends I thought they were. In fact I think I embarrassed them and it was a way for them to get rid of me.

    Saying someone is taking on the “victim role” suggests that they are keenly and willingly taking on this role and then just moaning about it. I don’t think this is the case at all.

    Sometimes you can feel like you are going mad when you are in the relationship. I realise that I am the only person who can heal that but for me it feels an impossible task. I don’t KNOW what I am looking for to heal and CORRECT. It is probably a slow process…

  86.  #86Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 7:25 am


    Wow. Amazing…

    I couldn’t agree more now you’ve opened my eyes. Problem is I find it very difficult to decipher between the two?!

    My ex was very much as Lovergirls describes Chicago. Though weirdly it didn’t bother me as it was just the way he was… He was rigidly practical and got very wound up if he saw people doing things and he felt they should be doing them better. It wasn’t just me that he spoke like this too. Plus he genuinely wanted to help, even if the help wasn’t asked for.

    He would joke at how boring and practical he was and how most people switched off when he was talking. He was boring hehe but he was also very useful and a lot of the times right!

  87.  #87Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 7:26 am

    Thank you Waterfall, I think Chicago is wrong for me too. I struggle with feeling guilty for dumping him already and him begging and saying he would change things when I told him I didn’t feel chemistry and didn’t like some things, made me feel obligated to give him another chance. I really just don’t feel good with him though and writing about it has helped me see why.

  88.  #88seemingly maybe on June 20, 2015 at 7:33 am


    It’s time…I’ve been following this blog and reading all of your amazing advice and stories since April. I’ve made incredible improvements to my relationship with my boyfriend of two years by paying close attention to your recommendations and watching/listening to Rori’s programs.

    I still have a *ton* of work to do on myself (feeling messages are super tough for me!), but wanted to thank everyone here for what I’ve been able to accomplish thus far.

    Many of the issues that I am dealing with now revolve around the question “what if I don’t want to see *him*?” What if I feel we are both better off not getting together on a night that we normally would because of his mood? What if I think he needs space, but he doesn’t and thinks that being with me will make him feel better? It’s not that I don’t want to listen to him when he’s down, but sometimes he just needs space to feel better. Not sure how to gently get that across without making him feel rejected.

    Anyway, thanks again for the incredible help so far!

  89.  #89Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 7:36 am

    Millie 72- I am open to hearing what others say and I didn’t mean for that to come across as a criticism. I am feeling trapped and any positivity towards him contributes to the guilt I am feeling for not liking him. He probably would love me making him feel more masculine and that is probably what he is seeking. I just feel that he does not really like ME and I am not feeling good with him so don’t want to give that to him. I know I want out and at this point more encouragement to leave him than anything else.

  90.  #90Senior Lady Vibe on June 20, 2015 at 7:39 am

    @Lovergirl @Indigo

    Sending you healing wishes. Maybe use some of your resting time to self-indulge in books and DVDs; I like to do marathons of TV/cable series and a lot of indie and foreign films. Take care.


  91.  #91Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 7:47 am

    “I just feel that he does not really like ME ..”

    Ahhhh!! Lightbulb moment for me. Wish I could bottle this and open and use as needed.

    Thank you Lovergirl…

  92.  #92Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 7:52 am

    Femininewoman 75-

    Perhaps I am playing the victim role. I do feel kind of helpless. I tried to end things with him and he argued and begged and promised to change instead of accepting it. So I started feeling obligated to give him another chance. I’m still very unhappy with him though and maybe should have just cut it off then and there. The more time I spend with him the less I like it.

    I think I do struggle with a victim mentality sometimes. Learning to set boundaries with people has been a huge step for me and when I set a boundary and it gets crossed I start to feel helpless.

    In marital counseling, this was actually pointed out to me, that I had been abused most of my life and learned that trying to set boundaries was useless. Chicago reminds me of my ex husband. I probably never would have gotten out of my emotionally abusive marriage, if it wasn’t for the counselors helping me and encouraging me to keep setting those boundaries, even when they were not being respected.

    Even S, is crossing my boundary about not wanting to be “friends” and it is hard for me to keep setting the same boundary over and over but that is what I am striving to do.

  93.  #93Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 7:58 am

    Oh and looking back, Femininewoman was talking about S, not Chicago, but like I said, even S is not accepting my “no” to being friends and I struggle with that. Im not trying to be a “victim”.

  94.  #94Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 7:59 am

    I have an issue around the words “self esteem” in general. To me it suggests succeeding or failing at life and it is such a sweeping generalisation of the human psyche.

    Also, I feel it does little in helping us to understand human issues and the life decisions people make. Therefore equating everything back to self esteem. I would always add the caveat and say I have low self esteem in a particular area of my life, the same with self confidence. And again it is often more to do with what we have learned rather than who we really are.

    I think there are general perceptions in society of what confidence is, what happiness is, and again it is just another way to force people to conform to a generalised view that no-one ever questions.

  95.  #95Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 8:02 am

    Waterfall, yes, when someone says “you are being a victim” I just feel more immobilized. Sometimes just being encouraged for every small step feels more helpful.

  96.  #96Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 8:15 am

    Zara 77-

    Thank you! This was very helpful and very true. I do not feel good about having sex with Chicago at all and I avoided it for quite awhile. I tried to give him a chance again but it really felt pretty bad. I don’t want him touching me again.

    If I had to put a finger on the feeling with Chicago and why I dislike the sex with him, it would go back to feeling like he doesn’t really like ME. When I am in bed with S I feel loved and adored and ravished. He is full of compliments and affection and it feels genuine. Chicago, it feels like he wants something out of ME that I cannot give.

    I avoided the picnic, but like you say he wants something from ME and that is feminine. This last time I saw him he was saying I still hadn’t done anything for his birthday and he wanted me to make him dinner or make him a cake. I really just don’t feel like doing anything for him at all so it felt like pressure and obligation. He seemed kind of demanding about it.

  97.  #97Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 8:21 am

    Femininewoman 80-

    I do not WANT to end things with S, not really. I love him and would love to have him in my life forever. I don’t like the feeling of it ending, the sudden long silences. He has been my best friend for the past year and we have gotten close. It is torturous to lose him. I’m not sure how that is a reflection of my self esteem. I’m letting him go because he is slipping away, not because I want that.

  98.  #98Senior Lady Vibe on June 20, 2015 at 8:31 am

    @80: Femininewoman
    “…Have you seen the movie Color Purple?…”

    Oh, yes! Long ago. And the book is superb, subtle and heartfelt; reading it first increased enjoyment of the film. I don’t think Steven Spielberg quite “got” the story or sensibility of the book; however I enjoyed the visuals of the film.

    I just ordered both and it will be a delight to “revisit” them.

    P.S. Spielberg did splendid work with his WWII true story series “Band of Brothers” and “The Pacific.” If you’re up for that much testosterone, they are both magnificent–I knew nothing of Peleliu before I watched this.

  99.  #99Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 8:48 am

    Well I never said “you are being a victim”. That’s the kind of thing I have learned not to do.

    “I am feeling trapped” – I am almost 100 percent certain he senses that but at the same time he is getting his needs met so he will use whatever words necessary to get what he wants. Many men can smell vulnerability in a woman from miles off. There are men out there who like to take advantage of this. Just the other day my daughter was telling me a story about a guy admitting taking advantage of girl. He had told her he had a girlfriend but this other girl still chose to come around to wake him in the mornings, do his laundry, food, cleaning and have sex. For a whole year she did that and of course he did not stop her.

    Until we take 100 percent responsibility for what is happening in our lives it is easy to say I feel helpless and stuff about the other person make me feel.

    I have a cousin who was with a girl for years. When he was being deployed he upped and married another girl. After a few days he started calling we know begging her to be with him and take him back. He hounded her for months despite the fact that she was not responding to him. Men do what they want. All the begging shows is that he knows where he can laid and he will say anything he needs to say to get it. Men know women are emotional and respond to emotional stuff. Drop him like a hot potato and rest assured that the next day he will be on the next train to wherever he is guaranteed to get laid.

  100.  #100Kim on June 20, 2015 at 8:55 am

    98 Amen. 100% responsibility for our own lives. Also means not dating someone who makes us feel bad and then incessantly complaining about them…or having sex with them. To me, this sounds like abusing self or having a door to let others abuse us.
    I do not get it.
    Sorry if that sounds judgmental but I feel goosebumpy reading that.
    As for staying stuck on a guy and then moaning that we feel bad or want to know what he is thinking. Well, we have all been there…hence there is a lot of good advice on this blog..but it constantly is ignored or belittled.
    Lovergirl, the other girls are giving you a lot of stuff to soak in and be working with. So do Rori’s articles. I am beginning to wonder if you like being stuck on a man who is not interested in having a relationship with you and hiring this Chicago man to beat you up further.
    I am asking: Why?!

  101.  #101Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 8:57 am

    Lovergirl you are not letting him go. HE is going. You are clinging on to the air between you and him in your mind.

    Whether you want to end things or not it does not matter. The question is what does he want?

    Until you are able to get Rori’s program I can understand why you can’t grasp how you portray your self-esteem by clinging on to what you don’t even have. In her Reconnect Your Relationship she is very clear about a woman with high self esteem. Think about Sex and the City if you have ever watched it. The character who seems to be able to have sex with anyone. Any guy who would have the nerve to treat her like the way S has treated you Lovergirl she would drop like a hot potato and go flirt with the next guy who would even look at her

  102.  #102Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 9:06 am

    “I’m not sure how that is a reflection of my self esteem.”

    Well Lovergirl ask any man. They don’t find it attractive when they tell a woman that they don’t want a relationship and the woman keep clinging on. Ask an old man, young man, bum on the street or even your own teenage son. Maybe one of them will tell you. They know only a woman with low self esteem would want any of them when they don’t want her.

  103.  #103Sassy on June 20, 2015 at 9:08 am

    Lover girl,

    I totally get what you are saying and how you feel about both of these men in your life.

    I would offer the suggestion though that every time you engage with Chicago, he most likely sees your acceptance of dates, and especially when you have s€x with him. as the same exact thing that we do….we fall back on “actions speak louder than words”. He’s being led on by your actions which apparently make him think it’s a free pass to verbally, mentally and emotionally abuse you.

    You have the power to shut this down right now-stop seeing him, sleeping with him and engaging with him!

    As far as feeling guilty, you are the only one who can make you feel guilty. Just walk away.

    As for S, in following your story with him, I just see someone who is most likely afraid of intimacy and doesn’t want to allow himself to truly commit to you. No matter what his reasons are, because they really aren’t relevant, he’s not coming to you at this time. He may, at some point, but until that happens, you have to focus on you and your children. At the end of the day, nothing else matters.

  104.  #104Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 9:13 am

    RE 95 I felt just a big blech when reading it. For me it is reeking of a man with some kind of knowledge that this woman is used to servicing men in some way so he is demanding to be serviced. It’s like I can’t help but wonder if he pays you Lovergirl to service him. If you are in the sex industry then to me that is a totally different kettle of fish. However, if this is a potential man for a romantic relationship something just seems so totally off to me.

    Maybe you are only sharing of the story?

  105.  #105Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 9:13 am

    “part” of the story

  106.  #106Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 9:32 am

    Femininewoman 103-

    This feels offensive. I’m not in the sex industry but thanks for playing. I didn’t even sleep with Chicago until after the 4th date, I wrote about that on here, though I don’t expect people to remember the details. Anyway, I will address other comments later, I have to run!

  107.  #107Indigo on June 20, 2015 at 9:32 am


    I can understand how boundaries feel like that to you – if you have had an abusive/ traumatic/ difficult background, it teaches you that the price of having people in your life is that they don’t respect your boundaries. I know, because I battled in the same way.

    HOWEVER, what I learned is that boundaries really have nothing to do with the other person. They are for you. They have absolutely zero to do with how the other person behaves, whether he or she “respects” or abides by them or not. They are YOUR rules for what YOU require for a person to be in your life or to spend time with you, and if someone chooses not to respect them, that is their right, but then you choose not to spend time with them. Boundaries are actually about putting you in control of your life, not about laying down rules for other people. You can’t control them, but you can control who you see and spend time with.

  108.  #109Tereana on June 20, 2015 at 9:37 am

    Waterfall – I’m curiois about your post in #73. Were you reacting to something I said about your situation? I don’t recall commenting on your dating experience, recently.

    But what did you mean by “hope it helps”? I was in no way seeking or looking for help. I was sharing an experience and an a-ha moment. And I was wondering if some other women on the blog could relate to it and/or use it as a way to see the value in CDing, with a different perspective.

    If you thought that I was looking for some kind of help or reassurance in this case, then I think you missed my point. That was not at all what I was looking for.

  109.  #110Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 9:38 am

    Lovergirl I can’t imagine why it would feel offensive to you but yeah…..

    I have no issues with people in the sex industry. It is their choice of lifestyle for their livelihood as far as I am concerned.

  110.  #111Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 9:40 am

    I always feel sorry for Samantha in Sex in the City. I don’t really see her as a role model. She seems rather sad and there seems to be an emptiness about her. I actually respect women more for showing their vulnerability even if it’s being completely stuck on the wrong man. It is better than suppressing it if that is how she truly feels.

    I met up with a friend the other night. She is one of the most negative people I’ve ever met and doesn’t have much time for many people. If she doesn’t like them she quickly labels them as bad people. Yet if I say I like them she looks at me like I am completely mad !

    Recently she met someone and is now very happy. I’m glad for her. But when I talk about D she is extremely negative and more or less told me I was in a very bad relationship with him. She told me that I should look for a “normal” relationship like the one she had found. I felt she was really judging me. But in all honesty I know she was trying to help me.

    I was just laughing inside really at how she was making out how perfect she was and she felt I needed to change. She is probably right but it wasn’t the support I felt I needed.

    She has been alone for years and in and out of flings. I have never once judged her now I’m wishing I had. She got herself in all sorts if situations and was miserable. Again I was loving and supportive – kinda wished I hadn’t been now because everything seems all about her..

    She showed me pictures of him and told me how amazing he was. Again he didn’t sound amazing to me, but she is happy so who am I to judge. Just wish she wouldn’t judge me as it feels like being made less than and that doesn’t feel like friendship.

    But knowing this friend, it is just the way she is. Its what she truly believes so I know there is no malice to her words. She truly believes I need to meet somebody similar to her new beau..

    I guess I may have sounded like this in the past without realising!! Haha yes actually I have…

  111.  #112Tereana on June 20, 2015 at 9:40 am

    Lovergirl – why on the world are you going out with Chicago still? From everything you’ve written about it, it seems like he is just not on a level where he can please you. Maybe you would like him to be. Maybe he would like to be. But he’s not. And that means there is someone else better suited to pleasing you…

  112.  #113Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 9:49 am


    You were asking all the women on the blog for their point view! I think you are taking my ‘hope it helps’ the wrong way…

    Just meant hope it helps your research / exploration into the subject etc…

    Does that make sense! Lol, maybe bad communication on my part over digital communication…

  113.  #114Senior Lady Vibe on June 20, 2015 at 10:06 am

    “At what point do we say, “Enough’?”

    “It’s NOT better for somebody to be there but emotionally absent rather than being gone altogether.”

    see the seven-minute video:

    There are also related videos at the end.


  114.  #115Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 10:08 am

    Some comments from another site:-

    “I reacted by getting the message loud and clear. He was pushing me away, and I went away…

    …and then when he wanted me back, I was so far away, he had to do some work to convince me he was sorry about the way he behaved.

    I knew he was crazy about me but he had a tough time acknowledging it to himself. There was nothing i could do except face this reality and and not get my “hopes up.” You cannot have a relationship with someone who is running away.

    So: always distance a distancer.

    Give them more distance than they want. Don’t let them back in unless they acknowledge what they have done and apologize.

    The standard to use is “convince me” you are sorry. Anything less and you are giving the wrong message. — that you don’t mind being kicked around while they make up their mind.

    Being single is not an affliction. Having an ambivalent man in one’s life is. Yes, she may be able to reel him in, but why would she want to? Does she want a grown up or a little boy?”

  115.  #116Indigo on June 20, 2015 at 10:10 am

    So, this feels relevant to me, but also to Lovergirl’s situation:

    I support women coming to their own conclusions in their own time. Some people take a lot longer, and other people know almost at once. I can truly speak for myself here. Because for a long time, I couldn’t imagine the thought of life without D. Now I can. And that was just time. Because if a person is not in a place emotionally to be clear about what’s going on, and especially what they want, what other people say is not going to really sink in, unless it aligns with where they are already.

    For me, something just clicked for me a few weeks ago, and it suddenly became much easier to walk away from D. It was like specifically my life came into focus, and what I could change and what I couldn’t. And that I didn’t have endless time to find the man who wanted to marry me, and more specifically I didn’t want to wait around for a man to make up his mind. I saw the next 5 years stretching ahead of me with no resolution, and I just knew that I could not let that happen.

    So, update from me: I’m on OKCupid and another local dating site (not having much luck with that one) and going out and meeting new people at every opportunity. So that’s where I am at this moment 🙂

  116.  #117Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 10:14 am

    SLV thanks for that clip. Gonna share it with my daughter too.

  117.  #118sweetmusic on June 20, 2015 at 10:57 am

    Hello everyone I’m new:)A little about myself i love feeling messages and Rori’s tools about confidence, loving myself, feelings, and healthy communication. These developments have hooked me up with a wonderful masculine man! He is my steady boyfriend, who is eager to propose. I must admit that I am not comfortable circular dating after a certain point untraditional to Rori philosophy hope you ladies are forgiving and accepting about that. I know Rori encourages until engagement were I have felt for myself I feel safe with a secure boyfriend who has expressed through words and actions his commitment and desire for marriage. I thank Rori for helping me personalize my boundaries and feelings and look forward to sharing !

  118.  #119Millie on June 20, 2015 at 11:57 am

    Zara— I guess I misunderstood the post.

  119.  #120Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:12 pm

    Indigo 84-

    I do feel like Chicago is totally wrong for me. Even when S asked me about how my heart felt about him I said it says “no”. I have been trying to give him a chance but I just can’t do it anymore.

    Today over text, I pretty much dumped him. He texted and asked if I was going to see him again. I think it was pretty obvious when I saw him the other day that I was thinking about being done. I told him after sex that I just wasn’t feeling it.

    I had told him the other day I didn’t feel chemistry and he begged for a chance. Since then I have been trying to use feeling messages to let him know I’m still not into it. I told him after sex last time that I was feeling judged and disapproved of and he argued with me. He also asked if its his weight and I said no (it’s not, S is a few extra pounds as well).

    I told him today, you know I am really just not feeling like you and I are a good match. I said you have been good to me in many ways but I feel unliked and like you don’t really enjoy me in bed or enjoy my company.

    He said “I do enjoy you and I know I show you that as well, but if you don’t want me I understand”. I said I just feel like its not working, I’m sorry. He was like “well nice knowing you. Good luck” and I said ok, you too. Hopefully that is the end of it.

  120.  #121Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:15 pm

    Waterfall 85-

    I feel like this too. I feel even more helpless when someone tells me I am being a victim. Thanks for understanding.

  121.  #122Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:28 pm

    Kim 99-

    I am not trying to “moan” and “complain”. I am sharing how I feel on this blog, I understand that is was it is for… It is helpful for me to write it out and get opinions and see it from different perspectives other than my own, even the perspectives I disagree with.

    I don’t think we are supposed to be offering actual “advice” on here and expecting people to follow it? Am I wrong? I do not feel that I have to follow every bit of advice I am given, especially since a lot of it is conflicting. I weigh in the various thoughts and feelings but I am not going to do everything people tell me.

    As far as S, I love him. I don’t feel I am totally “stuck” on him, as I AM seeing and sleeping with other men and not calling him. Emotionally, yes, that is who I would love to be with. I love spending time with him, and it is painful that what we have had the past year seems to mean nothing. I don’t expect to be over it in an instant. Things like that take time.

  122.  #123Femininewoman on June 20, 2015 at 12:30 pm

    Ladies I just caught up on some comments. Thanks for the well wishes Sassy, Tereana, Kim, SLV, Zahra,Waterfall. Slowly but surely feeling like myself daily

  123.  #124Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:38 pm

    Femininewoman 100-

    I do not feel that I am the only one clinging. S is the one who calls and asks me to come over and help him with his foot, or wants to take me out for his birthay, or calls to talk. I do not call to talk to him or text him or do anything but respond to him, almost ever. I did when I saw that he was going to a swinger party with someone- I was very upset and I knew that was a mistake.

    Again, this is more confusing and conflicting to what I have read. Much of the advice I read on here says to respond to a man warmly and not ask where he has been or what he is doing and just express how you feel. That is what I have been trying to do with S.

    I feel like instead of drawing closer, lately he is moving farther away. It’s scary and I am afraid I am losing him completely. Maybe I am and I am prepared to do that, but it is not what I really want. My heart sank when he said he didn’t feel I could be number one or he could give me his love and affection. Those sound like very final words and I am waiting to see if his actions back them up.

    This is why I have drafted that text for the next time he calls. I am prepared to let him go if he TRULY means what he says. It doesn’t mean it is easy for me.

  124.  #125Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:42 pm

    Femininewoman 101-

    Again, its not like I am actively seeking S out. He is the one that calls and texts and asks to see me. So as far as “clinging on”, I’m mostly only doing that in my heart. I am not bothering HIM.

  125.  #126Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:48 pm

    Sassy 102-

    Thank you and I think I think my words to Chicago today were pretty final. I hope that he respects that. I am quite used to men NOT respecting it when I try to end things and continuing to call and text even when I don’t respond, some of them for years. Men can be hard to get rid of. I do not plan on seeing him again.

    I know S is afraid of intimacy and no matter what anyone says on here or what HE is saying I know he has some feelings for me. He’s said so before and his actions have always made that clear. You are right it doesn’t matter, its only how he is acting RIGHT NOW that matters and I am trying to remember that. It’s painful. I love him very much, we have been through a lot together and it is very confusing. I am trying to focus on me. I’m trying.

  126.  #127Beloved on June 20, 2015 at 12:50 pm

    Here’s a refresher:

    Guidelines For Posting

    Hi all – If you’re new here and not sure how commenting here works, and how to best participate in and USE the community we have here – here are some guidelines:

    What’s so special about this community on this blog is that we’re a safe place…

    We’re a laboratory. A place to practice Tools, to share our secrets, to be raw and vulnerable, and to learn to trust ourselves and one another in an emotionally safe, anonymous environment.

    To keep it safe in this way, I monitor it as best I can, and want to respond quickly if you let me know something has suddenly become heated, gone off the guidelines, and become unsafe. (Sometimes we have a man join us, and if he seems thoughtful and caring, I let him through. And – the moment any woman becomes uncomfortable with his presence – he’s gone.)

    The language of the blog is Feeling Messages

    The safety and wonderfulness of the blog is based on and depends upon focusing on speaking in Feeling Messages, in our rawness, vulnerability and poetry rather than description, advice, opinions and reporting.

    If you’re not sure what I mean by Feeling Messages – start with my ebook Have The Relationship You Want (click on the book photo over in the right sidebar), and then read everything you can here – especially the comments.

    And everyone here will help you with this!

    We LOVE helping rephrase words, speeches and scripts – (and to avoid giving advice, we’ve found that the best way to do it is to say it how we would say it, not how we think someone else should say it).

    Since I’m the only “boy” on the blog, I get to suggest!

    (And I’d like to discourage suggesting from anyone else who isn’t a coach.)

    “Suggesting” is forbidden in the 4 Rules to use with men, and so I ask you to try to avoid it here, too. I know you have fabulous ideas – and I’d love it if you’d express them as how it’d work for you, rather than as how you think someone else should do it.

    If you’re not sure how to post your ideas and share your thoughts and feelings, simply start by STOPPING giving “opinions.”

    This blog is so different from everything else out there

    It’s not Huffington Post, and I keep it as monitored as I can to make it as safe a place to express feelings as possible. And I also want it to be a great and safe laboratory for everyone to express themselves ONLY in Feeling Messages ALWAYS.

    That means “boy” energy opinions and advice aren’t helpful to any of us who’re practicing openness and vulnerability and “girlness.”

    The only exception I make to this rule (and obviously I can’t monitor everything all the time, so no way is this going to be “perfect”) is for professional coaches and therapists who want to come here and be “boys,” and professional and offer opinions, advice, and help. Dominique, Orna Walters, Greta Hassel, Virginia Clark are some of these coaches.

    Unless you’re a coach or therapist, and especially if you’re new here – would you consider seeing if you can “Translate” your thoughts into Feeling Messages?

    I generally ask everyone to stop giving advice and use the blog to share in Feeling Messages and “Riff,” and generally expose their own emotions and practice speaking them in a safe place where “making sense” is not important.

    If you feel compelled to give advice, here’s one way to try doing it differently: “If it were me…I’d feel good….” so you’re staying in Feeling Message format, not in masculine opinioning.

    Also, if you’re new and just trying to catch up on my Tools by reading as much as you can here, you may not be all that familiar with my programs. So – I’d really encourage you to get the ebook. It’s very inexpensive, it’s the basis of all my other programs, and it would help you reframe your “voice” on the blog if you’re finding yourself stuck in masculine energy advice giving. It’s “Have The Relationship You Want” over in the right sidebar.

    If you’d like some help with “Riffing” – a major Tool in use on the blog – please ask for help.

    intimacyYou’ll notice that Daria Riffs a great deal and is expert in it (if you’re confused by some of her comments – it’s because she’s often”Riffing” – you can read about it and learn to do it yourself in the Power and Self Esteem Category here. Just start from the oldest post in the category and follow the directions. You can also ask Daria for help, and so many other of the fabulous women here are amazing in helping with Riffing, speeches, scripts, Feeling Messages – and so many of my Tools.

    Interacting and asking each other for help makes everyone feel good, and gives us practice in helping without going all “boy” and giving opinions and advice. Watching how it’s done here so brilliantly so often will help you communicate with men in a new, wonderful way.

    Looking forward to hearing more and more of your voice – as raw, vulnerable and safe as you’re willing to let it be.

    Love, Rori

    Here’s a sample of a passionate comment that I did not let through – and what I personally asked the writer to do to follow the guidelines:

    “The only mistake any of you make is thinking that any of this is helpful. Putting a different spin on problems doesn’t make them go away, it just makes them worse. Who is Daria to judge? Shes been here for 4 yrs and still doesn’t get it . Love yourselves girls. Feel what it would be like to have the kind of relationship you desire and allow it to happen. Staying here will keep you exactly where you are. You cant get to a happy place from patronizing anger, it just doesn’t work that way.

    OMG you all think you have to change yourselves to find what you are looking for. Do any of you realize that you are fine just the way you are? Who you are is the most precious gift. As for this being ” practice” for a real life situation, the ones who purge their opinions and judgments on the vulnerable and confused will never get it , inflicting their limiting beliefs . Stay here and stay in misery. Do the work ( the real work ) of accepting and loving yourself and know that you are fine just the way you are.

    I realize that most people don’t love themselves. When two people come together that really care about how they feel it just doesnt get any better. Perhaps these many perspectives are what causes the confusion. Maybe a LOVE YOURSELF policy would help these women to understand that its not their business to worry about some guy. If they cared more about how they feel instead of trying to control a bad situation. their lives would be blessed , but then again when we know better we do better.

    The best advice comes from within, intuition and inner guidance goes a long way to becoming who you are meant to be. Believe in yourself and never mind the endless line of do gooders ready to pounce when they think you have made a mistake. There is no chance for growth or expansion where there is no love.

    Its the constant attention to what you lack that keeps you where you are. I can only hope that one of you gets this. Your life will change dramatically. the possibilities are endless.

    ***Here’s what I wrote:

    Hi, This is Rori. I’m so sorry, and I couldn’t let your comment go through like this, because, as insightful and well written as it is, and despite the great ideas in it – it doesn’t follow the guidelines of what we’re actually doing here on the blog.

    Would you consider rewriting it and reposting it?

    Here’s how it works here – the whole blog is centered around being open and vulnerable and speaking the truth from your heart – And to do that, to keep it a safe place, as safe as I can make it – we all speak from the “I” position – using what I call “Feeling Messages.”

    This means you’re sharing your feelings and experiences – NOT using the word “you,” – and not giving advice (except for me and other coaches posting here) and/or making judgments of ANY kind.

    In other words – this isn’t a forum where you give opinions and have judgments. I miss some of that, yes, but basically, there are no advice-giving and judgment leveling allowed.

    Judgment is totally the opposite of acceptance and self-love, and if we can’t love, have compassion for, be curious about, and have no judgment of others, then we surely don’t much love ourselves either.

    Also – judging and thinking are all masculine qualities, and we’re about developing our feminine energies (you can read all over the blog what I think those are).

    If you’re willing to take a look at how often you use the word “you” – and instead replace it with how YOU feel about yourself, and what makes sense to you – I would welcome you with open arms. If you don’t like my work – that’s fine, and so I wouldn’t be for you, and my blog wouldn’t be a place you want to be. Let me know how you’d like to proceed….


    Also – sometimes things get heated

    Someone gives advice, and someone takes it personally and it feels like an attack. And then attack-mode sort of takes over. I try to jump in quickly, and several women on the blog are watching out for this and let me know personally in case I miss it.

    When this happens, I know it’s SO easy to react to defensively. We all instinctively want to defend.

    And defensiveness does NOT serve ANY of us (certainly not me). So, please, if you catch anything here that doesn’t feel right, let me or Dominique or Daria or Starla or Feminine Woman, or any of the women you see posting here regularly know you’re feeling uncomfortable and we’ll work to sort it out.

    Whatever you do when you want to “react” to something you see here – take the time to re-read these guidelines and USE your feelings and this blog to PRACTICE with!

    That’s what we’re all here for – to practice.


    I get into serious copyright trouble if anyone prints articles by someone else on this blog as a comment. (When I print guest posts – I get absolute permission from the writer.) So…

    I’d appreciate it if you’d do it this way:

    *If you receive a letter from a relationship expert, or read a great blog post of theirs – PLEASE don’t copy and paste it whole into a comment – instead:

    1. Choose a few lines to quote, put it in quote marks, and then…

    2. Link to the page on the site where you found the article or post or letter.

    3. If it’s a newsletter, and it’s not to be found on a site you can link to, then use your favorite quotes (just a few lines, please) and add a link to the writer’s website if you like, or just no link.

    Thank you so much, I appreciate your sticking to this rule…

    (If you ever want to print one of MY articles or letters on some other site – feel free, just please put in a link back to the blog or the site – that would be great for all of us!)

    Love, Rori

  127.  #128Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 12:54 pm

    Indigo 106-

    Thank you for the helpful reminder about the purpose of boundaries. It is very easy for me to lose sight of this. It is very easy for me to spiral into fear and helplessness and to feel weak when I assert a boundary and it is crossed. I have to remember what I can control and what I can’t.

  128.  #129Beloved on June 20, 2015 at 12:55 pm

    I am reading a lot of Louise Hay lately, and feeling her work in a whole new way.
    I found this meditation from her book “Heal Your Body” that makes me feel giddy and smiley when I read it while looking into a mirror:

    DEEP AT THE CENTRE OF MY BEING there is an infinite well of love. I now allow this love to flow to the surface. It fills my heart, my body, my mind, my consciousness, my very being, and radiates out from me in all directions and returns to me multiplied. The more love I use and give, the more I have to give, the supply is endless. The use of love makes ME FEEL GOOD, it is an expression of my inner joy. I love myself therefore, I take loving care of my body. I lovingly feed it nourishing foods and beverages, I lovingly groom it and dress it, and my body lovingly responds to me with vibrant health and energy.

    I love myself therefore, I provide for myself a comfortable home, one that fills all my needs and is a pleasure to be in. I fill the rooms with the vibration of love so that all who enter, myself included, will feel this love and be nourished by it.

    I love myself therefore, I work at a job that I truly enjoy doing, one that uses my creative talents and abilities, working with people that I love and that love me, and earning a good income. I love myself therefore, I behave and think in a loving way to all people for I know that that which I give out returns to me multiplied. I only attract loving people in my world for they are a mirror of what I am. I love myself therefore, I forgive and totally release the past and all past experiences and I am free.

    I love myself therefore, I live totally in the now, experiencing each moment as good and knowing that my future is bright, and joyous, and secure for I am a beloved child of the universe and the universe lovingly takes care of me now and forever more.
    And so it is.
    I love you.

  129.  #130Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 12:57 pm


    To me you sound completely aware of how you feel and that is fantastic to me!

    You know what you want but that doesn’t mean you won’t be disappointed if you don’t get it. I’m sure that’s part if the emotions you are working through and sounds pretty healthy to me. I would really worry if you didn’t feel any pangs of disappointment because I would be wondering where is the passion?

    But I see you getting on with your life as well and that feels very powerful to read…

    I feel a little bit in a similar place. I know D is wrong for me but that doesn’t stop my heart from missing him… Hopefully those pangs will go in there own sweet time!

    I have felt obliged to people, quite a lot over the years to tell you the truth. It is something I am working on but something I don’t have any answers to.

    I sort of feel obligated and *used* by almost everybody. I trust no-one and live in fear of people distancing themselves from me. Even and especially my own family. It is a deep fear inside me of not fitting in. But I really feel like that with every one.

    So I realise that I am the ONE common denominator in all of this. Maybe this is something to do with ME rather than them.

    Again I wish I had some answers for myself… I don’t..

    I feel a bit like I can’t read and everyone else can and they are ALL telling me how easy it is! It is not easy for me, the penny is not dropping.

    I am trying to stop putting pressure on myself. I can sense my love for D was because of all the loneliness and filling the void. I am accepting that…

  130.  #131Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:08 pm

    I’m not feeling Samantha in Sex and the City as much of a role model either. She suppresses her feelings and just has casual sex with everyone. I can do that easily, and I have done it, but I’m not sure its always a good thing. It’s more self numbing, which has its own pitfalls.

  131.  #132Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:11 pm

    Tereana 111-

    Well, it looks like I AM done with Chicago now! 😉 I feel somewhat guilty but also relieved. I was trying him out but he didn’t fit right. :p

  132.  #133Azure Blu on June 20, 2015 at 1:13 pm

    Indigo #115
    Lovely Siren… I agree… we are all on our own time schedule…
    our own time line to grow,
    to change to grow our beautiful butterfly wings
    and fly high
    and visit alll the beautiful flowers and enjoy their nectar as we please!!

    It takes as much time as it takes…
    and Rori and this blog encourage us to move along
    AND to take our precious time//

    I LOVE your post #106
    “what I learned is that boundaries really have nothing to do with the other person. They are for you.”

    “Boundaries are actually about putting you in control of your life, not about laying down rules for other people.”
    This is EXACTLY what I needed to hear!!
    Such Wonderful insight!!
    Thank you!

  133.  #134Azure Blu on June 20, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    You are sounding sooo brave.. so happy…
    Your vibrations are of you singing songs FOR

    Congratulations on CDing…
    changing sooo many things in YOUR life for YOU!!!


  134.  #135Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:17 pm

    Femininewoman 114-

    I like the distance a distancer advice. That is a helpful something to remember.

  135.  #136Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:22 pm

    Indigo 115-

    Yes, I think we all need to come to terms with things on our own timetable and rushing it can be counterproductive if we are not ready. Good luck with your dating!!

    Have you tried Tinder? I am liking it a lot. You can just swipe past any guy that you are not attracted to and you can only message each other if you BOTH are interested, so it weeds out a lot of men. Plus if they are annoying you during a conversation you can just “unmatch” them and then they can’t message or even see you anymore. Bye bye!

  136.  #137Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:32 pm

    Waterfall 127-

    Thank you for sharing. I feel this too, that sometimes other people have all these “easy” answers for things that are very difficult for me. Perhaps I just have more emotional hurdles to get past than most. I do have issues feeling obligated and I have a tendency to be super polite and nice to everyone. When I step outside of that box, people are especially shocked so it makes it that much harder.

    It doesn’t help that I used to be married to a minister. That put me even more in that type of position for much of my life, worrying about making everyone happy except for myself. Its a huge step for me to do anything that other people might be hurt by or not like.

  137.  #138Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 1:45 pm

    Just looked at the swinger site and saw that S is signed up for a swinger party tonight. Ouch. It stings, even though there is nothing about him going as a couple, I know there is at least one woman he knows going. I am going to try and not look at his profile tomorrow and see who has validated him. :/ Ugh. I’m also going to avoid contacting him and I have that text ready and slightly modified to sound less eager to have him back. He knows I am working tonight because we talked about it the other day.

    He’s not doing anything wrong, but it still stings a little that he would want to go to those things and is not trying to see me. I do have a guy that wants to meet me after I get off work tonight, I may meet him for a drink or something.

  138.  #139Waterfall on June 20, 2015 at 2:07 pm

    I definitely fit the “people pleaser” profile perfectly and it’s something I would love to change.

    I realised the other day how absolutely devastated I feel if someone criticises me or rejects me. It is like I physically feel it in myself and I feel a deep down anxiety and sadness for days, weeks, maybe months and years. In fact it never leaves and will always rear it’s ugly head when I am feeling at my most vulnerable.

    I hate the thought of people disliking me, disagreeing with me, calling me out on stuff or any type of conflict. I just have to walk away if I do. Standing my ground feels far too stressful for me and I end up welling up and emotional.

    I know it is a weakness in me and I fight it but I have no idea a better way to solve it. The thought of someone openly criticising me and being sharp and abusive towards me is something I have always struggled with.

    Often I have been friends with people who years later have told me something about my that they didn’t like. It goes right through me and leaves me feeling devastated and lonely. A friend called me b!tchy once, and it really upset me. Other friends have called me cold and unemotional. Again, I’ve found this deeply upsetting. It feels like they are looking for a reaction from me, and looking for me to prove them wrong. I have no intention of doing this.

    At work one of my colleagues told me that I lacked confidence. Again, I would never say this to somebody. It went straight though me because I actually didn’t really know what to say to it. I can’t help being me, and I felt like she wanted me to change to please her. Again, I felt kinda put on the spot.

  139.  #140Labbit on June 20, 2015 at 2:29 pm

    Lovergirl, I can only imagine you might be feeling overloaded right now with help, but just in case you’d like one more, here’s an article that I constantly refer back to when I feel like the Energy Exchange is off between me and Tender:


  140.  #141Millie on June 20, 2015 at 5:45 pm

    Beloved 125– thank you for posting the guidelines. It it a nice reminder and I personally benefit from hearing them again! Thank you

  141.  #142Dixie on June 20, 2015 at 6:16 pm


    I’m just putting my bags down here, I give up. I mean, with D. It hurts too much. I just can’t anymore. Either I’m too sensitive (I am), but this rubberbanding hurts alot and doesn’t make me feel loved or cherished or even safe. And I need those things.

    I made a list of all the good feelings I have when I’m in a good relationship, and I want to feel those things again.

    It was a beautiful day today and I feel guilty for wasting it on less than positive thoughts. D reminds me of my Dad, strong, but definitely a retreater, and I feel like a child, aching for love and affection.

    I’ve gone into boy energy and given myself the pep talk…. And once school ends next week, I’m sure I’ll be able to focus more on CDing. My heart just misses D, but that is neither here or there since the man has poofed.

  142.  #143Allure on June 20, 2015 at 6:58 pm

    As I peel away these layers I am feeling a renewed sense of confidence. A confidence that knows who I was and knows who I am and feels excited to get to know myself and who I will be as time goes on. Just like that I am not trying to savour and embrace what IS right NOW, I just am. Now I remember how luscious it feels. So sweet.

    I feel wholly content. I feel pleased to say this. Everything in it’s place. Everything where it should be, shifting as it will in this perpetual moment moving through time.

  143.  #144Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 8:55 pm

    Labbit 138-

    Thank you. I like that article a lot. It is very helpful and I may try some new things after reading it. 😉

    Tonight I had several Tinder guys asking me out but I was working late at a public venue. One offered to take me out for a drink afterwards but it is almost 11 pm and I just really don’t feel in the mood to go out. Who takes a woman out for the first time that late anyway? Maybe I’m just getting old.

    Oh well. My kids are at their dads for the weekend and I’ve hardly done a thing. I haven’t met with any men. I have mostly been relaxing, worked, laid out in the sun, played on the computer, went to a few yard sales and put some stuff online to sell.

    There are all these men wanting to meet me and I just feel like chilling out. So I guess loving me is ignoring them for now. Even though I know S is out at a swinger party, I turned down the married man that asked to have sex with me tonight (the one I mentioned sleeping with a week or so ago). Normally I would feel like having sex, just because I know S is and want to get rid of the pain. Not feeling it tonight though.

    I have all these

  144.  #145Lovergirl on June 20, 2015 at 8:56 pm

    Oops, the last start of a sentence was just a typo. 😉 Chicago has continued to be quiet so hopefully he is accepting the “breakup”. I feel kind of bad about that.

  145.  #146Violette on June 20, 2015 at 9:19 pm

    Last night, with M, I brought up as a joke something a little bit gossipy (not terrible though) that we’d previously talked about. I made fun of the her…well it’s a movie star that talks about how hard her life is. I don’t want to be making fun of people but, well it came up once. Anyway last night he gave me this look like he felt sorry for me and told me that his friend (who he named by first name as if I remembered who all his friends were from the 5 sec meeting at the party last week) had dated her.

    I felt so blank, like, what’s your point? I sputtered something in response. He gave me the same look like, I was wrong!

    Woah did that trigger me. First of all, his FRIEND dated her, not him. And briefly. Why is he defending her to me? Like…as opposed to defending me!

    And he had been with me about the conversation before and I do a call back as a joke and he flips it on me, throws it in my face.

    And to add to it the whole premise of why this person says she has a hard life has to do with the way her father died. Which is the SAME WAY MY FATHER DIED! And I had already told him.

    I said the conversation was weird, then after the date it hit me hard, I was furious!

    I’ve been counting the moments to tell him how I feel. I almost want to text him without him reaching out to me. I know I am triggered because of mommy stuff…Mom loved to make other people more important than me and acted like I hadn’t lost anything when my Dad died.

    But even so I want to tell him.

    I want to tell him that if felt bad being in a conversation with someone about something and having it suddenly flipped on me. I want to tell him that I don’t ever want a man to stand up for another woman over me, when he’s dating me, and especially when it’s make her father’s death more important than my father’s death!

    Ahhh…pitfall of dating someone…immature.

    The part I won’t say is I really don’t want to be compared to a big beautiful movie star when my own life is…not on track right now. If feels like a low blow.

    And oh I am trying not to judge him for putting such a premium on “who someone is,” on caring about fame and status. It is not a quality I admire. Particularly when it comes with a group mentality and it feels like everyone has to kiss everyone else’s butt or else.

  146.  #147Violette on June 20, 2015 at 9:30 pm

    It was a crummy date all around. He just…doesn’t make an effort.

    I’m bored. I love being with him. I love the way we related to our world views. I love that a lot because that’s something I’ve been missing with most of the men who have been stepping up and dating well. Most of the well behaved men, the ones who never make me feel insecure and all that, well they’ve been old and businessy, and I love being with someone creative like me.

    Aside from all the things that are obviously not working for me…

    He makes me laugh. I mean that feels so nice.

    But, I am really bored anyway. Well, maybe more worked up and angry and turned off.

    I feel disappointed. Sad.

    I have a date on Monday. He’s older and businessy and stuffy. It feels forced. But I’ll go. And be with someone who can organize their time and have more basic manners. And enjoy that.

    Mostly I want to be alone again. Press restart. Like 4 dates with M and one with new guy and I’m pooped.

    I have so much anger. Sooo much anger.

    I don’t want to . I feel trapped by it. I know it’s a self care thing though. If I can find the time to site with myself and approach everything from a place of power, and get my life to a place where I feel proud of it, and find people who are nice to me AND that I actually connect with, where we actually “get” each other…I want that with all my hear.

    In the meantime focusing on my own value, and really trying not to put another minute of effort in here.

  147.  #148Allure on June 20, 2015 at 10:52 pm

    I feel release. I feel still. I feel…Blank.
    I thought about something and now I feel tingly.
    I have this absence of vision of my future right now. Beyond not knowing what I want or don’t want.
    I know what I want right now. Fun! F’n simple. I can feel my heart pounding.
    I feel domesticated and I feel like releasing a deep growl from the depths of my gut.
    I feel tangled up.
    This feels good. This feels like truth. I like that it is not making me feel panicked. Excited actually…Raw.
    So much in front of me. Do nothing. Let it all just flow. All easy like.

  148.  #149Allure on June 20, 2015 at 10:55 pm

    This sh*t will work itself out. That I know.
    If I can be steady in my center, focused on my own feelings and where i’m at, remain open, trusting, authentic, and breathe!! It will all disentangle itself.

  149.  #150Indigo on June 20, 2015 at 11:25 pm

    Azure Blu,



    Thanks for the reminder about Tinder! I’d meant to try it but had forgotten.

  150.  #151Indigo on June 20, 2015 at 11:28 pm


    Feeling you here. I feel the same way. And hopefully we can take a bit of solace in our solidarity here on the blog.

    May I suggest watching Cherry Norris’s videos. After SLV recommended her the other day I started watching them, and they are extremely positive and cheerful, and the advice is great. For me they just really helped to lift my mood and propel me that little bit forward, because I can get rather dark and down when I think about a loss.

  151.  #152Indigo on June 21, 2015 at 1:13 am

    Millie, this is especially for you:

  152.  #153Zara on June 21, 2015 at 3:49 am

    63 Lovergirl. :*****“I don’t want to talk as just friends. I get all excited and happy to hear from you and its a huge letdown afterwards to remember that I am not #1 and don’t have your love and affection. I’m worth those things. Please don’t call if you can’t give them to me.”*****

    1) the text is short => very good. Too many words = bla bla bla specially by text

    2) excited and happy to hear from you => very good. It describes your truth in short and simple words.

    3) I get=> cold. It talks to his mind. Or it is more about a switch in the mood or a momentaneous sensation.
    “I feel” will embrace his heart. When I read the word “I feel” , I start feeling what I am reading. The text becomes a fluffy cloud in which I let myself float. I feel embraced by the emotions of the writer.
    >>>I FEEL excited and happy.

    4) I’m not number 1 => red alert!
    I AM number 1 in my life and won’t let anybody talk me out of my own podium. I don’t want to suggest to a man that I am knocking myself off my own podium, he might believe I have a good reason to say I am not worth not even my own podium first place.
    I try to avoid structures of speeches such as this one.
    Plus, I try to keep in mind only G*d knows the place I have in the man’s life. I try to speak only of what I know.
    >>>I don’t FEEL a priority in his life, or I don’t FEEL HIS number 1.
    He can’t debate about what I feel, it is just what I feel, it does not have to be his reality. He feels me through my feeling and gets what I mean. He does not have to relate it to his truth. It is just the way I feel. He can connect to my feelings no matter his reality.

    4) don’t have your love and affection => “have” : I feel possession and coldness when I read this word here. Besides, his mind will automatically tell him: /of course she “has” my love and affection. I am not a monster, I would not sleep with her and work with her if I did not “give” her love and affection./ Which, by the way, Lovergirl, you told us he does give love and affection in the present moment. This is precisely why you miss him.
    >>>I don’t FEEL loved and cherished.
    It is about my feelings and he can’t debate them.
    I am not minding his truth, I am minding my own business when I share my feelings. He can connect to my feelings and realise the gap between his reality and mine. It allows him to understand me. Even if the situation does not change, it makes me feel grounded in myself to have expressed my truth. I feel the air around cleared up.
    As a bonus, sometimes, when the man loves me and is able to do a relationship, connecting to my feelings will give him a chance to change his behaviour in order to make me feel good.

    5) it’s a huge let down => as in a work partnership.Cold.
    >>>I FEEL let down.
    Feelings feelings feelings… Keep the feminine approach. If he is able to do relationship, he is longing for the feminine, not the business partner.
    Now, I feel let down sounds blaming him, even if it is my truth. I do feel let down. But he is not letting me down, he has not promised me the love that I want. I am building the expectation in myself. In short, I am letting myself down when I make myself believe he will treat me in a certain way that does not fit reality.
    >>>I feel let down by myself. In a huge way.

    6) I’m worth those things. => things = cold.
    I am trying to share my feelings. What I want are not things but feelings of love.
    The “I am worth it” is more for myself. In case deep down I would be doubting my worth, I write it clearly in my draft for me to hear me say it. I am not sure I would say it to a man as I assume he knows I am worth it.

    7) Please don’t call if you can’t give them to me. => it feels like the law talking to me.
    I try to avoid telling a man what to do. It is a total turn off. He will call if he wants to. He takes care of his needs. And I will take care of mine by not answering the phone.

    >>>I will not take your call as a simple friend. It feels destabilising. I feel all excited and happy to hear from you which leads me to feel let down by myself in a huge way when I realise afterwards I don’t feel a priority in your life and I don’t feel cherished<<<


  153.  #154Dixie on June 21, 2015 at 4:07 am

    Indigo, thank you so much! I really needed that hug, and I feel a bit more settled this morning.

    It will feel better and easier, but yes, coming here feels soothing.

    Zara…. This speech spoke to my heart. So feminine but powerful.

  154.  #155Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 5:39 am

    I think my computer might be showing me posts that are slightly older. It could be because of my browser.

    Anyway, this has been an interesting week. As I said, I may well be staying in my current city, in my current job. I have to move houses, though.

    And I made some headway on working with my grumpy coworker. She can be VERY toxic at times. And for months now she’s really gotten on my case in several situations, either trying to provoke me, or else just triggering me in ways that made it difficult for me to work with her. But then this past week, I finally made a breakthrough. There was a situation in which she was getting all worked up, and in the past I would have contributed fuel to the fire by reacting, but I didn’t. I held my ground and stood up for what I thought was right and best in the situation. And when she wanted to do it “her way” and insisted on doing it “her way” (even when it wasn’t necessary and wasn’t even what the client really wanted), I said “OK.” I stepped back and let her do her thing and didn’t argue. My supervisor saw everything that happened, and saw my point, and saw that she was basically steamrolling me for no reason. But I didn’t really get steamrolled. I just stepped out of the path. Lol. It was much less stressful…

  155.  #156Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 5:52 am

    So I have one more thing I wanted to share that made me think about what we go through with guys.

    First off, it was cool having a quasi-date with a man who’s already in a relationship. It meant that the conversation could be about things I wouldn’t want to talk about with a guy who was a potential partner. For example, he mentioned how he thought marriage was the next step for him and his partner, but he was nervous to do it, and that this was probably very stressful for his girlfriend. And I was able to tell him frankly, “You have no idea how much you guys stress us out!” And we could both laugh about it with no pressure, since he wasn’t trying to get into my pants, and I wasn’t someone who was going to threaten the relationship we were having, since it was just friendship and spending time.


    I just watched a movie that made me think of a similar thing, especially in the time aspect of relationships. And this is going to contain major spoilers, so stop reading if you don’t want to know about this movie. But I just watched Interstellar, which, actually, turned out to be even better than I thought it was going to be when I started watching it.

    In this movie, the dad tells his daughter that he’s going to come back, and then flies off into the galaxy. But he doesn’t know when he’s coming back, and she of course doesn’t either. So this makes me think of when men go off, and we have to sort of “wait” for them, and we want to know the exact day, time, hour, and minute that they will return, and they just can’t tell us. And the men must be torn. On the one hand, they want to go exploring. On the other, they want to come home. And within the exploration, there is this element of always being on the way toward going home. But we can’t necessarily “feel” that when we are the ones at home, not exploring, not having communication, not knowing if they are really on the way back to us or not. It’s the most stressful thing in the world. And yet it’s the kind of place we find ourselves in all the time. (I did with V. And sometimes just a normal thing, like he goes to the office and can’t text or call because of meetings, so we start to freak out that something is wrong.)

    And there was another critical aspect of the movie. Because it dealt with space-time, people would age at different rates, depending on where they were in the galaxy, or what planet they were on. So that’s another thing that made me think of guys. We may perceive the passage of time as hours, days, weeks, and notice every minute. Whereas, a man might tell us, “I’ll call you,” and then he’ll think about calling us for two or three weeks before he actually picks up the phone and calls. And those weeks seem interminable to us, but they are a blip on the radar screen for him. He barely notices that passage of time and thinks it’s nothing. To us, we feel let down, abandoned, left waiting. But maybe to him, it feels like he’s succeeded – he said he would call and then he did. That length of time just isn’t significant to him, mentally.

    We’ve talked all about this before. Just seeing it in this extreme way – not about dating, but just about life and human existence – seeing people separated not by a few miles or a few cities, but galaxies, light years, and waiting for the people they love for actual years – maybe even a life time. That kind of put all our worries into perspective. Ok, so he didn’t call for a week. So what?

    I’d like to apply this attitude a little bit more to my relationships…. : )

  156.  #157Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 10:35 am

    Zara 151-

    The part about not being #1 and having his love and affection is directly from something he said. That is why I said it in my text. I am going to re-read what you wrote though and try to rephrase. I am also feeling angry with him right now so that may have to be in there as well.

    I haven’t heard from him since Monday when he called and asked about my job. It still feels like he was just trying to make things better so he wouldn’t be the bad guy. He didn’t like me feeling angry with him, so he called and was “nice” but hasn’t called back since because he is trying to move on. Maybe I won’t hear from him again or for a long time.

  157.  #158Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 10:50 am

    Zara- (and anyone else that cares to weigh in) is this better?

    I don’t want to accept calls simply as a friend. I feel all excited and happy to hear from you and crushed when it doesn’t turn into more. I don’t feel special or like the most important woman in your life and that means a lot to me. I feel angry, like my worth is not being recognized. I would rather not hear from you at all than just as a friend.

  158.  #159Indigo on June 21, 2015 at 11:36 am


    I think it’s great, up until the last line! “Rather” to me still has the sound of negotiating. I think it would be great if you could find it in yourself to say “I don’t want” instead. However, this speech has to feel true to you, and it’s 100 times better than things you’ve said in the past. For me I think what’s key with a speech is, are you prepared to back it up with action? This does not have to be perfect, but for me what’s important is getting to a clearer, more powerful place.

  159.  #160Millie on June 21, 2015 at 12:06 pm

    Indigo– thank you for sharing that video! I love her voice and how she talks!

  160.  #161Femininewoman on June 21, 2015 at 12:25 pm

    The I would rather line sounds like an ultimatum to me. He might take it as a bluff and call you on the bluff.

  161.  #162Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 12:40 pm

    Okay Indigo, Femininewoman-

    I took out the “I would rather not hear from you at all than just as a friend” and replaced it with “it feels like accepting crumbs and I don’t want anything less than your best”. How does that sound? Lol

    Now, will he ever actually call me again, so I can send it??? 😉

    I love the video that was posted for Millie too! Going to have to check out some more. 🙂

  162.  #163Zara on June 21, 2015 at 1:19 pm

    Lovergirl. ***** “it feels like accepting crumbs and I don’t want anything less than your best”.*****

    Oh… This feels good to read. I like it.


  163.  #164Zara on June 21, 2015 at 1:23 pm


    ***** I feel angry, like my worth is not being recognized.*****
    My worth not recognized because one man among millions does not want to give me the crown of his harem?

    Lovergirl, you are telling him you need to be the number 1 of a bunch of women he sleeps with in order to feel respected?

    You are telling him you need his approval for reassurance of your worth? It feels needy. It is a major turn off.

    Worthy people don’t complain they want their worth to be recognized. They know they are worthy, They don’t speak about it. They simply don’t engage with those who don’t see their worth.

    >>>I feel angry at myself for accepting crumbs<<<


  164.  #165Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    Zara- I am okay with S having casual sex with other women. I don’t believe he is ever going to be a totally monogamous man and I am honestly okay with that if it is JUST sex and not anything more. I do need to be #1 emotionally. I feel that if he is going to spend time with me he needs to be reaffirming that I am worth more than the other women in his life. I’m not angry with myself for accepting crumbs because I don’t believe I have been. If I were to accept “just friends” I would be.

  165.  #166Zara on June 21, 2015 at 1:53 pm




  166.  #167Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 2:20 pm

    Okay, I changed it again.

    Instead of mentioning anything about my worth, I just said “I feel angry, like I am accepting crumbs. I don’t want anything less than your best”.

  167.  #168Zara on June 21, 2015 at 2:33 pm

    Lovergirl 165

    I feel my worth when I read this. 😉
    I like it


  168.  #169Starla on June 21, 2015 at 4:57 pm

    Violette, definitely share with your guy about how bad it made you feel! But certainly do not blame him. Right now your version of events blames him for your insecure, uncared for feeling. This is what we do when we don’t want to take on the vulnerability that comes with owning our own insecurity, but that vulnerability is what he or any man NEEDSfor connection and for feeling inspired to protect you.
    Try: i have been feeling so down about my life lately. When we talked about that celebrity, in my mind i ended up feeling like it was a comparison, and i felt like i was inadequate and ive just been feeling so raw and down ever since…

    He will probably say ohhh baby you do not need to feel that way, and take you in his arms and hug it away….

  169.  #170Azure Blu on June 21, 2015 at 5:11 pm

    Love the feeling message!

  170.  #171Azure Blu on June 21, 2015 at 5:15 pm

    Love the final version of YOUR feeling message…
    Great work!

  171.  #172Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 6:11 pm

    Waterfall 112 – ooohhhkay. You’re right, it’s so hard to convey time in a digital medium. I heard it more as you thought I was asked for help. And a lot of times, here on the blog, I do cone in when I am in a state of some kind of unrest or not knowing what to do, and I do want help. This was not one of those times…

  172.  #173Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 6:15 pm

    And also I am not conducting “research.” I was simply posing the question “does it ring true” to inspire introspection and to see what came out of it – for yours or anyone else’s benefit. Not my own. I wasn’t looking for feedback, per se. Unless someone felt inspired to post their own thoughts. Maybe the way I presented it didn’t make that totally clear…it was for everyone to ask themselves the question, but not nevagse the answer was going to helps in any way. I’m fine. Lol

  173.  #174Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 6:19 pm

    Lovergirl: I feel happy for you! Of course there is some sadness. You are a compassionate woman. He seems like a good guy who tried to make it work. He’s just not *your* good guy. ; ) xoxo

  174.  #175Tereana on June 21, 2015 at 6:20 pm

    Edit, #70, *convey TONE

  175.  #176Violette on June 21, 2015 at 6:57 pm


    Thank you for weighing in on how to speak to him. I agree that I don’t want to convey judgment, it is difficult for me to express my feelings to a man, especially a man like him…triggering in certain ways, without being a bit bitter in my tone.

    I don’t want to bring up anything about celebrity at all, the issue for me is that he is comparing any other person’s circumstances to mine, and favoring their experience, when I have been through the exact same thing. I also dont’ like feeling like we were both having a conversation in the past, and he flips it on me and suddenly judges me as if I’ve said something terrible, when he was saying it too before!

    I am down on my life but even if I wasn’t I wouldn’t want any man I’m dating to defend an ex of his friend over me.

    That is what I want to express.

    Not sure how yet. I’d better get on that so I have it ready when the time comes, so it doesn’t spew out if I can help it.

    I do like him. I want to stay focused on that. I don’t want to judge him. I do. I judge him. I don’t want to.
    I want him to stay around.

    But I also don’t want to feel like I’m less important than anyone else. I don’t like that being hinted at to me.

  176.  #177Dixie on June 21, 2015 at 6:59 pm


    Ladies, wishing you all a lovely goodnight. It’s felt like a rollercoaster lately with my emotions, and without D to lean on, this board has really felt like a refuge – thank you for that!

    Wishing everyone a wonderful new week 🙂

  177.  #178Dixie on June 21, 2015 at 6:59 pm

    Ladies, wishing you all a lovely goodnight. It’s felt like a rollercoaster lately with my emotions, and without D to lean on, this board has really felt like a refuge – thank you for that!

    Wishing everyone a wonderful new week 🙂

  178.  #179Dixie on June 21, 2015 at 7:00 pm

    Oh, that was a funny mistake! I’m laughing!

  179.  #180Rori Raye on June 21, 2015 at 9:08 pm

    Ooooo – seemingly, what a great situation for private coaching! This is all about how you express how you feel, not trying to help him deal with his need for space. Check out the certified coaches – they’re amazing!
    love Rori

  180.  #181Labbit on June 21, 2015 at 9:54 pm

    Oh Sirens, I am feeling so confused right now. I am very much in the soup, the soup of emotions, and I can’t tell which way is up at the moment. I’m so on the rollercoaster of emotions right now!

    I keep bouncing back and forth between feeling fine — great even — to feeling bad, really REALLY bad. Feeling angry, at myself and at Tender, feeling like we are in the same room and yet a world apart, like I can’t tell what he’s feeling and WHY WON’T HE JUST TELL ME and then I realize I don’t even know what I am feeling either!! Anger, fear, grief at times, grief I think for giving up my old patterns, the habits of leaning forward when things get awkward and tough and how completely weird it feels to stay leaned back…but not yet being Sireny enough to know what to fill those spaces of awkward with instead…not knowing what feeling messages to share, if any…getting really mad at myself for not knowing, but then soothing that over with love and compassion and not letting me fall into beating myself up…and then just feeling sad and awful…and then a release, relief, able to love myself again and not worry about what Tender is thinking or doing.

    I can’t tell if this is what Rori talks about in Commitment Blueprint, where as I’m healing old stuff is showing up to be healed too, or if this is my intuition trying to tell me that something is deeply off with Tender.

    It’s no wonder that he is mirroring me right now, here but kind of not, both of us deeply triggered by each other. But perhaps most importantly he is still here…maybe a little less present at times than usual but then again so too am I bouncing between present and not. He is here though, he hasn’t gone away, keeps bringing himself back every time I think the rubber band might be snapping. Sometimes the silences between us seem so long…we used to hardly go two hours without talking, now it might be a day or more, feels like a week to me sometimes! And when we do talk I am doing my best to be open and an invitation, even as my gremlins inside are telling me to build walls, shut him out, lash out at him, or back away and disappear to prevent him from hurting me.

    Oh I just wish I knew what this was!! Is it old stuff wanting to heal?? Is it stuff relevant to now, to me and Tender, that I just can’t see or quite understand yet? How am I supposed to love myself, feel whole, when I feel like everything I do and feel is pushing him away right now?

    I feel exhausted. And in a few hours I might feel alive again. All of these emotions are temporary I know, and I am doing my best to allow them all and guide myself back into balance. How am I doing? How do I do this? This rollercoaster, I want off!!

  181.  #182Labbit on June 21, 2015 at 9:56 pm

    I suppose, on the plus side, I must be feeling much safer with myself these days, because in the past I never would have even let myself feel all of this! I would have judged myself harshly…pushed it down…

    I see that no matter what, this is all leading me to exactly where I need to go. To my forever relationship, my forever man. I need to allow this so I can heal…I need to let these emotions and old wounds come up to find a way out…I need to trust in this process even when it feels weird and I want to resist it so much…

  182.  #183Labbit on June 21, 2015 at 10:17 pm

    It’s so funny too how my mind keeps wanting to make Tender responsible for how I feel…projecting my own fears and gut instincts onto him. My brain is telling me he wants to disappear on me or dump me…when really it’s ME who wants to disappear, to run away or dump him just to alleviate this pressure, though of course in my heart I know that’s the wrong thing to do. My brain is telling me he’s making excuses, though it’s me who is doing that. That he’s lying to me, when really I’m lying to myself at times and pretending to be cool and OK when really I feel neither cool nor OK!

    I can see this…I see what I am doing…maybe that is the first step to healing?

  183.  #184Indigo on June 21, 2015 at 10:55 pm


    I love your final script, and I’m glad you liked the video!

  184.  #185Victoria on June 21, 2015 at 11:29 pm

    I personally do not like the “accept crumbs” phrase. I say this admitting that I am not a native speaker, and may be some of the connotation is lost on me, but it feels to me that there is an implicit blaming in this phrase. S. most probably does not feel he is giving you crumbs: he probably thinks his friendship, affection, and having s*x with you are an expression of his care and interest in you. It is only up to you to decide whether these are crumbs or simply gifts not up to your taste.
    Also it seems to me you would be better off without sending the message. Its preparation is very valuable in the thought/emotion process for your own sake, but otherwise, you can have the same or better effect if you just stop taking his calls.
    He is not calling you right now, and you waiting for him to call, so that you can tell him to stop calling is like… too much of your energy sent his way. I believe you need your energy for yourself.

  185.  #186Zara on June 21, 2015 at 11:42 pm

    My post 168 was meant for Lovergirl 167


  186.  #187Waterfall on June 21, 2015 at 11:42 pm

    Tereana said:

    “What do you ladies think? Does this ring true to you?”

    Your question, to me, suggested that you were ‘exploring’ the subject.

    As far as I can see you were asking the question to everyone and I find your response to me a little sharpe and triggering as I feel I have just as much a voice here as everyone else even though I do not post here very often.

    I am struggling to see what your “issue” is to be honest. Maybe something has triggered you…

  187.  #188Lovergirl on June 21, 2015 at 11:49 pm

    Victoria, how about “I feel angry with myself for accepting crumbs”? I dont want to just wait on his call to send this, though its tempting. I just want something ready in case he does call again trying to be friendly. I would feel rude just ignoring his call without explanation and dont think I could do it. He means to much to me to just ignore him. Im going to sleep now but may comment more later.

  188.  #189Victoria on June 21, 2015 at 11:53 pm

    This is how I relate to what you are saying.
    I want to tell my man that what he is doing is not enough. That I want more conctact, more attention, more quality time together. At the same time, the moment I ASK for these things I no longer feel good about myself. I feel bad that I have to ask, I think/hope/wish he would be giving me those out of his free will, without me having to ask. When he does not, I start wondering, am I doing anything wrong to push him away, does he not like me enough to be inspired to do those things, does any man actually do these things, is my man capable at all of being fully present and intimate with me or with anyone else.
    I have no solution, and no advice. What works, temporarily at least, is doing fun things/seeing friends, but works really really well for me, is being courted by another man. Having a date with someone else when your man has left you without attention. This makes me feel so good, I have my energy back at me, I feel mischievous. There is a very slight streak of guilt, but not too much. I have told him time and again, that I do not like to be without male attention. This is just who I am. There is zero value for me in pretending to be ok with his absense when I am not.

  189.  #190Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 1:30 am


    I can just say how it seems to an outside observer.

    It seems to me that your fear of leaning forward may be getting in your way here. That maybe you are waiting until you’ve got this all figured out and you have the “perfect” feeling message. Have you thought of maybe just talking to him, not with the perfect speech, but just from your heart.

    When I was in university, my friends nicknamed me “perfect Indigo”. It wasn’t really a compliment. It was because I tried so hard to hold it altogether and do things perfectly, even when I felt like I was falling apart inside. That is kind of the vibe I get from you, like you’re afraid to put a foot wrong in case it makes you un-sireny. Maybe it’s too much pressure, maybe it’s too much to ask from yourself?

    I know you battle with anxiety, but I kind of feel in a good relationship there shouldn’t be this much anxiety. Can you share with us what feels off about Tender?

  190.  #191Femininewoman on June 22, 2015 at 2:16 am

    RE 185 Victoria – I can’t agree with you more.

  191.  #192Femininewoman on June 22, 2015 at 4:23 am

    Labbit also is there any anger? And when there is how do you express this?

  192.  #193Labbit on June 22, 2015 at 5:26 am

    189 Victoria — Mmm, yes, I very much relate to what you are saying! There is definitely some of that happening for me right now — the whole, I want more/need more attention and affection, but not knowing how to say it from a place of strength. But also feeling like this might be coming from my own abandonment fears…where the answer is I need to soothe myself first, realizing that I might be projecting problems there aren’t real.

    190 — Yes, I am clearly battling my own perfectionist tendencies. 🙂 I do want to clarify that although I’m bouncing around with a lot of anxiety right now, I don’t necessarily see this as bad. It feels to me like I could be on the verge of something really good, something really big, of breaking out of some old habits that no longer serve me. I’m standing on the cliff and there is a rope bridge to go across to a beautiful garden…but I’m afraid to walk too far out onto the bridge for fear it may fall apart. Even though the land I’m standing on is slowly browning, no longer has enough to fulfill me. That’s the best visualization I can give for it.

    There is part of me that wants to play it ‘safe’ and stay in my cage, but there is an ever-growing part of me that wants to fly free from that cage! So yes, I’m anxious, because I’ve been in the cage for a long time and even though the cage doesn’t have what I want, I am still finding it hard to spread my wings and fly. I’m scared my wings aren’t big enough, or that I’ll crash into something, or that I’ll start flapping and I will somehow be the only bird that can’t fly. Is it silly? Oh yes, absolutely. And yet I’m trying to honor these feelings anyway without letting them run me. That push and pull, that cracking out my now too-small shell, the struggle between my heart pushing me towards what is good and my mind struggling to control me and hold me back, that’s what’s making me anxious.

    I guess, straight up, the issue is that Tender is asking me to give more to him, to initiate more, and he’s pulling back some because he’s not getting what he wants. I do initiate some but mostly I leave it to him to lead. And I am struggling with this…I want to show my appreciation for everything he does for me, yet it seems like everything I read warns against leaning forward too much. Well, even a little leaning forward feels bad to me…so where is the sweet spot? I feel a rush of urgency to do, do, do and start doing everything for him to show him I love him, yet that is giving to get. If I call him first more during the day while we’re apart, or text him first, does that then become a habit I have to keep up? I don’t want that…that doesn’t feel good.

    I just don’t know. I have been here before, in this totally weird period right before a guy proposes, and I know it can manifest in all kinds of strange ways for both me and him. So I know that’s part of what’s going on, where we’re both trying to figure out how we relate and what if anything needs to change before we can be “all in.” I can’t tell if this is simply him struggling with his own fears and I need to lay back and keep loving on myself, or if this IS truly a time where I need to lean forward some and reassure him. And if I do need to reassure him, how the heck do I do that?!?

    192 Femininewoman — Yes, I feel some anger, and he probably does too though that’s just a guess and in reality it’s not my business how he feels anyway unless he tells me. My anger is at me, for not knowing what to do here, feeling like why don’t I know how to turn this around? Feeling puzzled and not wanting to feel that way. Anger that things aren’t flowing along more happily. But while I have anger, it is not overpowering. I feel anger maybe 5% of the time…it’s more confusion that’s reigning right now. Total puzzlement.

  193.  #194Dominique on June 22, 2015 at 5:57 am

    Labbit – can you try loving on your confusion? Maybe this is exactly where you need to be, in murky waters, not knowing up from down, yet you can still swim around in trust, for the waters will clear when you allow them to be there.
    You’re processing through all of this is so beautiful.

  194.  #195Victoria on June 22, 2015 at 6:18 am

    “Projecting problems that are not real”.
    I have decided for myself, that whatever I feel is real for me. I do have abandonment fears myself, and I have learnt to recognize when it is my abandonment fear speaking, and I need to just pep-talk myself.
    Why do you think he wants you to initiate more? Has he said something?
    I am getting the impression that mostly he wants to be left alove to concentrate on his work, meanwhile you are kind of bored, kind of missing him, and kind of worried that he is a workacholic. Am I correct?

  195.  #196Labbit on June 22, 2015 at 7:09 am

    194 Dominique — OK, I can try. :} That certainly sounds better than what I’ve been doing anyway. Allowing it sounds kind of nice, actually…thank you.

    195 Victoria — He’s straight out asked me to initiate more. He’ll say ‘It would be nice if you called me sometimes…’ or ‘I feel like I am always reaching out to you first…’ But what he maybe doesn’t see is that he’s often so focused on whatever he’s doing when I initiate that he can’t really be with me anyway. 😉 So he maybe forgets and then when his mind frees up he’ll reach out to me.

    I don’t know, maybe I am leaning back too far. That is certainly a possibility. And maybe I’m not quite feeling whole right now, but I don’t see myself looking to him to fill me up either. It’s more…maybe my guard is up a bit? Like I don’t know quite what to do or how to handle this, so I’m standing still, and I’m not sure if that’s right or not.

    I like Dominique’s idea. I’m just going to swim in the murk for awhile and see what comes of it.

  196.  #197Femininewoman on June 22, 2015 at 7:37 am

    Labbit your comments reminded me of these scripts I have saved a long time ago. Here goes:-

    I want to be sensitive to how hard you work. I know work is asking a lot of you right now. But I miss you. How can we work together on this to create a win win situation.

    Also Rori’s instructions:- The only time to initiate with a man is when you have a committed man and you know your contact is welcome.

  197.  #198Victoria on June 22, 2015 at 7:45 am

    You know I have had a similar conversation with F. He has said numerous times that he loves it when I call him. Also, he has made comments that he feels I would never call him unless he calls me, I will be just silent. I have told him that I prefer to not call him, especially during the day because he works in a busy hospital, and I do not want to interrupt him. Also, I do call him occasionally, like may be 10% of the calls are initiated by me. But my man loves to call, I think actually ever since we are together there has been only one day when he did not call me. As for not seeing each other, the longest has been a week or ten days. This was last year, after I had broken up with him (for the 3rd time) and then I asked him to take me back, and he did, but he was studing for an important exam and he said we shall not see each other until he passes it, and I was very deeply hurt that he wanted no contact with me for a very long time, but because I was still feeling guilty, I sucked it up. We still talked on the phone for hours though.
    Anyhow, I think you are doing brilliantly with recognizing your feelings, triggers, etc. I only wonder whether Tender realizes that you are actually missing him and wanting more contact. He might be thinking you are not only ok, but actually happy to be left to your own devices. Could it be so?

  198.  #199Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 8:30 am

    @FW @Indigo
    Glad you like the vid. You might recall seeing Cherry Norris guest post here on the Rori blog.

    Her videos are usually short and sweet, as Indigo said “a spoonful of sugar.” 🙂 The “medicine” in this case is quick “tips to meet and marry your man.”

    You might like this one too.

    Is He Interested For The Long-term Or A Short Term Fling?


  199.  #200Violette on June 22, 2015 at 8:44 am

    I’ve come up with a speech for M:

    I find you funny and charming and I feel good with you. And at the same time the conversation we had about (insert celebrity name) last time we were together has lingered with me, because I felt as if someone else’s experience of their father dying of cancer was being made more important than my own experience of my father’s dying from cancer. I don’t want to identify with having a hard life, but I also don’t want to feel I’m being compared and less than. I want to feel that a man I’m dating wants to protect me, more than the person his friend used to date.
    Thank you for hearing me say that.

    I don’t want to send it to him…but I would really like to say it to him. I would really like to express this to him. I wish I could have expressed it in the moment. It all feels like it’s about expression now.

  200.  #201Millie on June 22, 2015 at 8:55 am

    Had a super triggery day with CDB yesterday. Uh I felt so frustrated and when I expressed myself it still felt like we weren’t connecting. I feel like he talks a lot, but talks over people and doesn’t truly hear the other person. He takes things as an attack and I began to feel very exhausted and wanted to just be silent. I don’t have time to write a lengthy post with details, but I think I may have to drop him as well….

  201.  #202Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 9:10 am


    May I suggest if you do say it to him that you shorten it, and that you consider re-phrasing it so it sounds less blamey? I would feel made terribly wrong if someone said that to me.

  202.  #203Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 10:17 am

    So, I have a date tomorrow night. He seems cute and masculine, so I will let you know how it goes!

  203.  #204Violette on June 22, 2015 at 10:33 am

    Indigo how to I make it sound less blamey? Certainly not what I’m going for but I also don’t want to be unclear. I feel in the past I have made speeches that sounded easy for a man to hear, except that they never really heard my problem.

    I have kept the whole thing focused on me, I never said “you” did anything, only spoke about my own feelings and what I do and don’t want…
    How to express something I am angry about! I don’t like being treated that way! And…I don’t want to come from a place of anger.

    I have no idea. It feels bigger than me.

  204.  #205Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 10:46 am

    Uh-oh… I’m in moderation.

    What happened?

    I have something to share I believe informative, entertaining and inspiring, I respect copyright, and (since the 1970’s!) I don’t absentmindedly do “you-you”.


    What good thing can I make of this detention?

    Now I’ve lost Internet signal… should I look for some sort of “woo-woo” message?

    Thinking, thinking…

    Maybe it was the “S” in the http? OK. No check out pages…I’m not selling anything. 😆


  205.  #206Allure on June 22, 2015 at 10:50 am

    Feeling light and free. I fed my soul this weekend. Took great care of myself, did things I wanted to do. Something i’m doing is yielding amazing things within my relationship. It isn’t intentional. Quite the opposite. My sole purpose right now is narrowing my focus down to myself. I can see that’s the point.
    Sitting here in my own little space in time. Focused on what I feel inside. I’m feeling very earthy and attractive. Authentic. I know this is going to be a good week. I feel forgiveness for myself.
    I felt myself move beyond “this will all work itself out.” Feels like an achievement. I don’t even need it to work itself out. I will sit here in all the hot, soupy goodness and I will feel my enjoyment of it. Feeling more myself. This is more my speed.
    It is a gift to be given such a juicy set of circumstances. The sexiest part of life is the complexity of emotion. The multi layered situation.
    I feel connected. Ever since last night when I felt myself plug in. I am a part of everything and it is all telling me something. Giving me something to chew on, to live for. I know now that I had to process through my shame, my dark spots, my guilt and toxicity. Where would I go if I did not? I know I would go somewhere. Life has a way of taking you places whether you want it or not. Kicking and screaming, or wide open and willing. I want to go the places it will take me wide open.
    Now is a time for release of control. I am moving with the flow of everything.
    The time for control will be and it is not that far off.
    This time will bring the clarity I need for that time. I feel it in my bones.
    It’s all in whisps.
    Lazily weaving their way through my consciousness.
    Cutting through the haze.
    A tendril for change and for desire. Some say walk a new path.
    A hint of “the right people adjust.”
    Do I adjust?
    Only if i’m the right person…
    I feel flutters of anticipation.
    I have never before questioned whether or not *I* am the right person. It feels like a struggle. How does a girl know if she is right for he? What will she say if not? What will she do?
    I see myself drifting again. Into this trap of what then?
    I can’t know. It is way too early in this metamorphosis.
    Remind myself it’s ok to drift yet now is the time for letting go of control. I can’t take control. Not when I don’t have a grasp of what i’m holding. ok…so now is a time for curiosity.
    Today I practice freedom and curiosity. I will dance, sing and be free. I will focus on breathing and opening. I will practice giving balance. I will let go of judgements and let stuff be as it is in it’s own way. I will be gentle with myself and allow movement. I will comlete my to do list.
    I feel like i’m shifting into a new being. I don’t have to enjoy every moment. I will welcome and embrace every moment as it is.

  206.  #207Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 11:05 am


  207.  #208Femininewoman on June 22, 2015 at 11:09 am

    Violette I honestly had no problem with your script except that it came across heady/reporter style rather than feminine. I figured it is because you are still angry. And really only you can take care of that. Hope you are not looking to him to do that.

    “I find you funny and charming and I feel good with you. And I want to share something that has rested heavily on my heart since our last conversation and I’d like to get it off my chest. Do you feel open to hearing me?

    Is how I would suggest you go though I don’t like how it starts. ” find you” have a kind of thinky/telling off vibe to it from where I am sitting. You have obviously processed what you want to share but remember he will be at a disadvantage. He does not know where you will be coming from so he won’t be prepared and might feel attacked and go defensive.

    The thing is to get in your heart and mind that you are talking with him not to him. Think of being on the same team and sharing something in a loving way. He could have ignorantly or cluelessly triggered your anger. He is human and can make mistakes. Maybe he just doesn’t really get you and nothing you say could help to change that. If that is the case you can just give up. In giving up the anger might morph into feeling empathy for this man. Ask yourself what if I just give up this anger rather than holding on to it? How would it affect the way I see this experience.

    You see you want to come from a place of sharing your experience so the other person understand where you are coming from and how you are feeling. You want to get him to feel what it feels like being you.

  208.  #209Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 11:09 am


    I’m not sure how you could word it differently. I just think this whole point is too subtle for most men. I can virtually assure you he didn’t mean to undermine your experience of your father dying of cancer, so I think he may just come away feeling wrong and like he doesn’t know what to do in future in this situation to make you happy. I’ll leave it with you though, because I don’t feel like I can be more specific.

  209.  #210Femininewoman on June 22, 2015 at 11:12 am

    Asking if he is open to hearing you is showing him respect. Maybe he might not be emotionally in a place where he can really hear you and want to schedule a time when he can. Sometimes timing can make a huge difference.

  210.  #211Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 11:57 am

    trying again. I’m rather tenacious. lol

    @FW @Indigo
    Glad you like the vid. You might recall seeing Cherry Norris guest post here on the Rori blog.

    Her videos are usually short and sweet, as Indigo said “a spoonful of sugar.” 🙂 The “medicine” in this case is quick “tips to meet and marry your man.”

    You might like this one too.

    Is He Interested For The Long-term Or A Short Term Fling?


    Monday, 22 June 2015 @ 8:30am

  211.  #212Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 11:58 am

    it’s not that… so who knows?

  212.  #213Waterfall on June 22, 2015 at 12:01 pm


    I had a lovely day yesterday! Went for a beautiful walk and also wonderful historic sights such as Runnymeade where the Magna Carta was signed..

    I also saw the Queen at Windsor Great Park which was pretty awesome!

    Still not dates / cd’s but hopefully going to singles night next week with one of the girls I was chatting to.

    Will keep you informed…

  213.  #214Frannie on June 22, 2015 at 12:06 pm

    Hi ladies – I need some advice. Thank you in advance!!

    I’m in a pretty unique situation, at least in my mind. I’ve been single my whole life (never married), but have had a few “serious” relationships. I’m almost 42. I have a 5 year old son, and I have him ALL THE TIME. His father was never around, and passed away almost 3 years ago. I feel this puts me at somewhat of a disadvantage, as I never have any “time off” from my son. He doesn’t go with his father on weekends or anything like that. I feel like I’m always in my “boy energy” because if I’m not, nothing would ever get done (trash, dishes, household repairs, bills, etc.). I also work full time.

    I’ve been off an on several different dating websites, all with no real results. For some reason, I am always attracted to the same type (wrong) of men. When I do start chatting with someone I’ve met online, I try to push my “boy energy” aside and use my feeling messages. I’ve purchased a few of Rori’s programs, but finances are tight right now and I can’t afford to purchase any more of them.

    I started talking to someone a little over a week ago. His name is Thomas. We had several very long phone conversations, and I feel very comfortable with him. We decided to get together last week and had a great time, even though I felt a bit awkward at first. We both have young children (my son is 5, his son is 7), and his babysitter fell through. I ended up driving out to his area (about 45 miles), and we had a “kiddie” date. We went to a FunPlex where they had go karts, video games, bowling, etc. It was a fun place!!

    Here’s where it gets a bit tricky and I need your advice. He was upfront and honest with me, he was in jail a while back and is on probation (or maybe it’s parole) until November. Technically, he’s not supposed to leave the state (he’s in New Jersey and I’m in Pennsylvania), although he has said he would come out my way next time. He drinks a lot (not sure he is an alcoholic, but he has said he enjoys a few beers every night when he gets home), smokes, and cusses up a storm – all in front of his son. Far be it for me to tell anyone how to raise their child (I hate it when people tell me what to do with my son), however, his behavior is not something I want displayed in front of my son – should they ever meet.

    Is there a tool I can use/practice to deal with these issues? I know one of Rori’s programs (Toxic Men maybe) talks about how to know if someone is so toxic you should stay away or if they can change. I’m kind of hoping that maybe if I continue with my feeling messages and other tools, he will want to be with me so badly that he will stop these behaviors (don’t get me wrong, I drink too, but not anywhere near what he does. I also don’t really mind that he smokes, as long as it’s not in front of my son – he can go outside (like my ex used to do).).

    I’m trying not to give up on this guy, since I feel like we have a real connection. I know he feels it too, he’s told me as much. Any advice on how to handle these not so great behaviors? I’m not trying to change him per-se, but I would like to see him cut down on his drinking/cussing/smoking. In all other aspects of his life, he is a GREAT guy. I just don’t feel comfortable bringing him around my son, since I don’t want my son to emulate someone who drinks & smokes, etc.

    Are there any tools I can practice, that would help change the behaviors (make him realize that he might lose me if he continues), or is this situation a lost cause?

    Thanks in advance ladies!!

  214.  #215Senior Lady Vibe on June 22, 2015 at 12:23 pm

    Trying one of my old favorites.

    Rori Raye:



  215.  #216Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 12:53 pm


    My gut says “no”. The probation and behaviors that make you uncomfortable seem like huge red flags. If you are wanting a long term relationship your child will see all this and it is unlikely those behaviors would stop without a LOT of time and effort. It’s not like he’s going to quit cussing and smoking and drinking tomorrow. Are you comfortable with him how he is NOW being around your son?

  216.  #217Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 12:57 pm

    Violette- maybe more like this?

    I find you funny and charming and I feel good with you. The conversation we had about (insert celebrity name) last time we were together has lingered with me, because, since my own father died of cancer, my experience felt like it was less important. I don’t want to feel I’m being compared. I want to feel protected by my man, more than other women.
    Thank you for hearing me say that.

  217.  #218Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 1:00 pm

    Tereana 174-

    I assume you are talking about Chicago. He is definitely not my man and I don’t want to string him along. Hopefully I wasn’t too harsh and he will be okay. :/ I feel bad but I have to take care of me.

  218.  #219Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 1:09 pm

    So I’ve been talking to all these guys on Tinder. Man, they all seem to want to know your life history before you even meet up! :p They will be like “tell me about yourself” and ask all these questions that feel to me like they should be saved for a date!

    Anyway I have been asked on a few dates but they don’t seem to want to work around my schedule. If they ask and I am busy I will say I can’t Monday but I will be free Tues and Wed, or something like that and half of them don’t set up another time.

    Then the ones that do ask me out they want me to pick a place. I just told this guy that I feel awkward choosing a place for a first date, that I usually leave that up to the man. I said if you have a couple of suggestions I would be happy to pick one though. Will see how he responds to that.

    There was another guy who asked me out for this evening. Then, he texted the other night while I was with Chicago and asked if I could go out right then. I declined and haven’t heard back since, so I assume our date is off?

  219.  #220Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 1:25 pm

    The guy I tried to get to suggest a place to eat still won’t, lol! Sheesh how hard is this? He said “I don’t know what you like to eat/drink”. :p

  220.  #221Jasmine on June 22, 2015 at 1:35 pm

    It feels like I’ve been away from the blog for ages but it’s not been long really. I want to be on the blog! I love the way FW has re-written the script. I particularly love the reminder to soften any ‘speech’ with asking if it’s a good time to talk…that feels particularly gentle and I need to remember it. I am very good at launching into how I feel because I feel uncomfortable containing it and I want it resolved.

    Frannie – One thing I have learnt from years of this (though admittedly, not necessarily fully integrated) is to do my best not to get invested or carried away too quickly – to take time getting to know someone and to see if they feel like a good fit to me. I do find this very difficult especially if I’ve not met anyone I feel ‘that connection’ with for a while but I have been burnt enough to know that it’s wise to stay aware during the ‘getting to know period’ and not dismiss any red flags as ‘things that might change’. The way I understand what Rori teaches is that we express how we feel about things in as much as then we are being authentic to our truth and discovering via any man’s reactions whether we feel good with them or not – it’s different from setting out to change someone or hoping they will change. It’s more about who we are and whether they work with that. I hope I’ve got that right Rori and I hope that makes sense Frannie? Targeting Mr Right is a good one…

    In my world, I came off online dating because I felt bombarded by work at work and then bombarded by men when I got home and with things happening in my personal life I just did not feel resilient enough to manage it. I feel better not being on there and just doing what feels good to me.

    My ‘I really don’t have time for men’ vibe might be coming across though because I keep being asked on dates. It feels quite nice though in real life – than online – I feel able to manage it better ‘cos it’s not so overwhelming. YoungCD text me AGAIN but I feel totally bored with his lack of consistency which is a result after a sporadic 6 years of it. At work CD has not asked me out again which I feel good about because I dont feel comfortable bringing that into my workplace anyway but he has upped his flirting which I do feel good about (he only flirts when there’s noone else around :). A regular delivery man brought me a note asking me out and he was very sweet when I said I would like to but I would like him to ask me in a couple of weeks – it was right when I had to go to my friend’s funeral and my head wasn’t feeling very stable…His response felt very warm and genuine and he was keen to do what I wanted so we shall see if he messages…Another man who I don’t feel attracted to because he keeps telling me things like ‘you’ll get used to it’ about the job I don’t enjoy which just makes me feel cross and want to yell at him because I know myself and he doesn’t, he asked me out too but I said no. It would feel much too much effort to go out with him and I don’t want to.

    To be honest I don’t really want to go out with anyone ha ha – or at least I only want to go out with them if they carry high energy with fun and laughter.

    I feel bored of effort. I feel bored of the dropper outers. I feel bored of the unavailables. I feel bored of the struggle AND I want more light light light. A man who shines bright.

  221.  #222Jasmine on June 22, 2015 at 1:41 pm

    Lovergirl – I’ve heard similar things about Tinder though I think others on here have had positive experiences.

    If someone wants to ask me lots of questions I tend to say something like ‘I don’t want to talk a lot online. I prefer/like/love to meet in person. what do you think?’ and the whole where to go thing I’d probably say ‘it’d feel great if you knew somewhere to go. what do you think? – Other sirens may have better phrases but I try to use just really short simple statements over and over otherwise it’s a drain on my energy! And it feels interesting to see how each man responds to the same phrases 🙂

  222.  #223Azure Blu on June 22, 2015 at 2:40 pm

    Labbit #169
    A few posts back Rori said…
    “If your man asks you to do something…
    this is him being masculine…
    Do it!”

    In a more established relationship…EMK mentions often, it is good for the woman to participate,
    so the the man can feel her enthusiasm,
    Evan believes our leaning forward, a little, keeps the momentum going…
    I am queen of leaning back too far…
    especially when I like the guy…
    My lack of “strong on the inside”… shows up,
    loud and clear…
    And I’m sure I come across as standoffish and needy… not a good look
    (this is me, NOT you)

  223.  #224Azure Blu on June 22, 2015 at 4:36 pm

    Lovely Siren… so nice to hear your lovely melody again!@

    “I want more light light light. A man who shines bright.”

    Me too…
    I’ve been on several dates a week now for the past 3 weeks…
    My goodness… I am observing me just fall right into
    being masculine…
    When I see it… I try and stop…
    not sure why i keep doing it…

    These men are all soooo sweet and eager…

    lots of masculine energy coming my way…

    I have been feeling curious and interested in learning about their politics and religion
    and *IF* they bring up income
    I say…I am curious about what they feel would be ideal for them, in a woman they would have a long term/marriage with…
    For me..
    I’ve noticed it is VERY integral part of whether the relationship should move to a date or continue dating (depending when the conversation happens)

    It is important in our age group 55-66 yrs
    our social security, pensions, who owns homes…

    Some are NOT interested in anyone without at least close to what they have… but
    When I share my financial situation (vaguely) and
    given my occupation – graphic designer –
    I can generate income till i can’t type or see anymore… they all seem fine
    as long as it is brought up and discussed and they
    I feel i should have discussed these things much earlier with Spirit…
    he brought it all up (good for him) a few weeks before we broke up… and I think he seemed a little disappointed by what i shared with him…
    If it didn’t work in his vision for his future…
    I totally understand… obviously he was weighing out many things trying to make a decision..

    My belief is… I am supporting myself,,,
    I have a retirement income that I am implementing now… and
    If a man wants a woman with more income or assets (no pun intended) than I have
    of course he should find her…

    But, knowing roughly what I have (all the men have much more than i do) and he is still fine..
    let’s continue exploring and getting to know each other.

    All this talking on the phone, receiving yummy compliments and dates, luscious dinners and dancing…
    is helping take some of the sting out of
    Spirit’s decision to disappear…

    3 weeks now since I found his picture on FB
    still feel angry, disappointed, betrayed
    missing HIM… all the goodness that we shared…
    BUT – not a relationship did that make…

    I am really glad that we didn’t end up together…
    It still HURTS!!! ;-((

    our total opposite views on politics and religion would have been miserable and
    really wouldn’t have worked in the long run…
    his whole family believed about the same way…

    I refuse to date anyone with differing politics – they need to be at least middle of the road_
    nor extremely religious…
    Soooo many out there that have around the same as me… so much less stressful!! :-))

  224.  #225Dixie on June 22, 2015 at 5:11 pm

    SteadyCD texted then called today…. And I was hyperaware of my response!

    First, right away (!) I felt this invisible wall go up, still friendly, but a walk to keep him from getting close! Tonight is my busiest night of the year, finishing report cards, and the funny thing is that if D had called, my heart would have done somersaults.

    So, I used that reason to cut the conversation short, and he wants to call me on Friday, to go out once school is done…

    So. I’m going to practice here, with him. He has some qualities that trigger me in a HUGE way, but I’m going to use this as an opportunity to share my boundaries.

    It might feel easier with someone who really likes me (the attention actually is sweet) but for whom I’m not head over jerks about. He actually brings out my masculine energy, so I’ll have to practice just letting him lead.


  225.  #226Dixie on June 22, 2015 at 5:23 pm

    Oh! I meant to type “head over heels” not “head over jerks”!!

    What a typo, lol!

  226.  #227Dixie on June 22, 2015 at 5:29 pm

    He wanted to know about my summer plans, and I felt this uncomfortable whoosh of energy heading towards me. How funny, I suspect D might have felt the same thing.

    SteadyCD’s energy felt uncomfortable and overwhelming. He asked about my plans for the summer, and i felt myself laughing but being evasive, nervous. I’m not sure

    but if we really attract who we are, then I’m excited that as I learn to take down my walls, I’ll attract the same.

  227.  #228Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 7:33 pm

    He said “I don’t know what you like to eat/drink?” I said “I like pretty much anything. Mexican maybe?” He was like “Mexican is fine with me”. I said “Ok. It would feel great if you knew someplace to go. What do you think?” He responded ” Authentic Mexican food?” Ugh. He seems super dense. I think I will unmatch this one and forget about a date! I can’t stand indecisiveness in men. S just keeps looking better and better and more my type than anyone else….

  228.  #229Millie on June 22, 2015 at 9:04 pm

    (((Labbit)) I hope you feel better! It’s so hard to love our confusion and love every feeling we have! I struggle with it every day! You express your heart so well, I love reading your posts and I feel so inspired by them to love every confused feeling I have as well!

    Lovergirl– I haven’t been able to read all your posts, but have you spoken your script to S? I feel happy to hear that you are exploring other options on Tinder. My coworker did meet her husband on that app–so you never know!!! 🙂

    Femininewoman– how are you doing recovering from your surgery?

  229.  #230Millie on June 22, 2015 at 9:35 pm

    Well I wanted to share my super triggery day I had yesterday with CDB, now that I have a moment…

    Everything has been going well with CDB. He asked me out a week in advance for Saturday night and wanted to take me to his favorite sushi restaurant that he has been ranting and raving about. When we got there he asked for us to sit at the bar and asked if I minded he ordered for us. I could tell he was really excited about sharing this experience with me and that he was in his masculine peacock mode and wanted to give to me, so I said I would love for you order! And let him know what my favorite sushi was. It was amusing and made me feel good to watch him take charge and make sure we tried all the great things, even though to me the place wasn’t the best I’ve ever had…that wasn’t the point. The point was us being together and enjoying what he had to give, which I think was pretty wonderful and he put a lot of thought into it. I spent the night with him, for the second time and the following day was father’s day. CDB’s father is absent and he was having a hard time with the day. My friends invited me out to lunch and to the beach with them and I mentioned it to him and he started saying how good that sounded and he loves the beach…so I asked if he wanted to join, which he clearly wanted to! I am also leaving for a trip tomorrow, so I did want to spend more time with him. Everything was going pretty well, but I do like to observe how a man I’m seeing acts with my friends. Very quickly I could see that CDB likes to dominate conversations. He has a hard time really listening to people, because before he’s let them finish their sentence, he’s saying “ya” and going on about something he wants to say. This is a HUGE difference from how M was–the strong, silent type, who did not need to prove anything. I get the feeling CDB needs to prove something and I almost find it annoying and slightly exhausting. On the plus side, he is very introspective and can communicate on a deeper, more self-aware level. So, I don’t know. Later in the evening, the subject of using condoms came up when we were alone and he told me that he doesn’t like using them, he hates how it feels, and he wants to be truly intimate with me and not have that barrier. Well Ladies, this is a HUGE trigger for me, but I kept my cool and let him know that I understand and agree they are a pain sometimes, but I don’t have unprotected sex until I’m in a committed and exclusive relationship, which we are far from right now as this is very new and I don’t feel comfortable with not using them. I have contracted STDs and have allowed myself to be vulnerable too soon with people…and right now, I’m not in a place where I can rush in to that. I don’t remember every detail of the conversation, but he said that he has to focus so hard when he wears them and it’s not enjoyable. I said that I’m sorry it’s not pleasurable for him, but I have to do what’s right for me and my body. Then he says that “he can’t talk to me, he guess he can’t be honest with me, because I turned what he said into a negative.” UGH at that point I started to get really upset! I felt like he wasn’t understanding or respecting me, and then he turned it around and said he couldn’t talk to me– which triggered me into feeling like a failure at communication and I started to shut down. I told him of course I want you to be honest with me, but I am going to be honest with you in return, and you may not like my answer, but that doesn’t mean holding back is the answer. I was so hurt and frustrated after that. I felt like my body was in danger. M and I stopped using condoms fairly soon because the commitment was there, but apparently it wasn’t…so I’m hesitant to allow someone to penetrate my body in that way until there is real commitment there. I want to feel safe and that’s one way that I feel safe and honoring myself. And then…when we got home he wanted to have sex when I knew he didn’t have one. When I said something, he said “well what did you think was going to happen?” That made me so mad!!! Like it was my fault…and somehow I’m responsible for this. I just told him again that I don’t have sex without condoms. I’m not comfortable with it. Then he lay there asking me what I wanted him to do. I said I don’t know. He said the condoms were at his house, we should go there. I said I’m not going over there, I have to be up early and I want to be here. So after some time he decided to go to his house and come back with them. He seemed frustrated with me because I wouldn’t ask him to do that. I told him, I’m not going to ask anything of you. I guess he wanted me to tell him what to do. He’s already said he wants me call him and initiate more…I just love the feeling of a guy calling me, like M did. I never had to lift a finger with him and that’s the kind of relationship I want. I want how that relationship felt when it was working. I don’t want this….CDB came back, surprisingly. To me, he comes across as a selfish lover. To me, he seems only interested in pleasing himself. Not once has he asked me while it’s happening what I want. I’m just not used to men like that…and I feel impatient and not willing to tolerate it or change him. It’s not worth the work…and maybe that’s my fear of intimacy talking, but I just don’t think he’s the man for me.

    When I opened my email this morning, there was an email from Helena Hart that was about being attached to your ex who has vanished. How perfect. She said to change your words..instead of missing the man, miss how you felt with him and look for that feeling with someone else instead of pining for that man who provided you with it once. That makes a lot of sense and it makes me feel like if I keep seeing CDB, I would be settling big time. I deserve to feel that amazing and loved and respected and wanted again. I don’t feel that with CDB. On the way home in the car I got really frustrated with him because he kept talking over me and then when I finally did get to speak he took what I said the wrong way. He’s always telling me, if I say something serious in response that “he’s just playing” and If I smile and laugh then “why are you laughing, I’m trying to be serious.” It’s like I can’t win. I get the sense that he is a controlling person. I don’t know…I’ve never had that strong of a communication issue with someone. I”m not hard to talk to…and I’m very honest, not out to hurt anyone….I just don’t like being treated as guilty.

    So I don’t know– I’m leaving the country for two weeks so I’ll see how I feel when I get back. He seems like he’s waiting for me to take the lead, which I don’t like– so I think it may be best to let him go. Alone time is needed anyway. I’m not over M and I need to get over that hurt before I can really be present and deal with my triggers I think.

  230.  #231Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 10:37 pm

    Lovergirl 217/218,

    Try this:

    “I love Italian food/seafood/Chinese food, and I feel sure you will come up with a great place. I love surprises 🙂 “

  231.  #232Indigo on June 22, 2015 at 10:46 pm

    Frannie 212,

    Honestly, the first thing that stood out for me was the distance, and the fact that he can’t leave the state. Are you sure you want to be travelling to him all the time? This puts you squarely in masculine energy with no let up. This is the kind of thing which can kill the romantic attraction, because a man only falls in love when he is doing/giving to you.

    As far as his undesirable behaviours, you could try saying something like: “You have every right to smoke, drink and cuss as much as you want. However, it makes me uncomfortable, and I don’t want my son exposed to it. Do you think, when we are out on a date, you could refrain yourself?”

    His response to this will tell you a lot about where he is at. If he wants to be with you he will want to make you happy and cherish your feelings, however if he is resistant he may not be your man. You don’t want to tell a man what to do because you’re not his mother, you can only guide him. This does seem like a bundle of red flags to me though.

  232.  #233Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 10:48 pm

    Well, S just called me- at midnight again, a week later. I didn’t pick up the phone and he kept calling, which seemed odd. He called 3 times in a row before I sent him the text I had drafted up.

    He was like, this is important! It’s regarding pay pal someone just stole $500 from my account! Please call me back and check your account.

    So of course I called him back. My account is fine but he was stressing about his and its after midnight so he can’t get a hold of anyone. I helped him find a phone number to call and suggested he call his bank (which would have someone 24 hours) and have the payment stopped from that end. Someone had hacked into his account and stolen his password and money and he was locked out of the account and freaking out.

    Of course, when something is wrong- when he is hurt, when he is stressed, when he is caught in a bad storm and scared, I am the person he calls. I can’t not help him. I love him too much. Its confusing though. :p

  233.  #234Lovergirl on June 22, 2015 at 11:56 pm

    So he called back again after talking to the bank and asked me about my text. He said you don’t want to be my friend, you don’t like talking to me? I said I like talking to you..too much, that’s the problem. It makes me want more. He was like okay, I understand- I kind of thought it was something like that (he claims because I haven’t called HIM lately, which I virtually never do anyway).

    He sounded all sad. He was like “it was really good sex and you are a wonderful woman”. He said “I am not going to delete your number from my phone and please don’t delete mine. If you ever need anything or there is an emergency, please call me”.

    Then he was talking about Chicago again, saying I have a boyfriend. I said no, I dumped him. He acted like he didn’t believe me at first and then said I was probably going to fall in love with some other man. I just said I don’t know, maybe. He said I was probably going to fall in love with some guy at first sight when I am working. I said I don’t really believe in that, I’d have to get to know someone first, it takes time. He was like, okay.

    Then as we were getting off the phone he called me his “non friend”, lol. He was like I’ll let you know how things turn out with the bank stuff, if you even care. I said yes, I care, you can tell me that. :p This is not going to be easy.

  234.  #235Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 2:32 am

    Lovergirl he would have figured it out if you had not answered

  235.  #236Dominique on June 23, 2015 at 6:43 am

    Dixie – 223 – LOVE your typo!!! The truth in typos?

    I’m also loving your processsing. YAY you!!!


  236.  #237Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 7:08 am

    Good morning!
    I am managing texting, talking to and dating
    about 5 men at once…
    This is MUCH better than I have done in the past…
    with Spirit out of the running…
    there is more room in my heart to explore
    more men… :-))

    Stilll alllll the others that appear in my In Box…
    it is soooo confusing and overwhelming…
    how do I choose?

    I haven’t met anyone that I’m too excited about, yet…

    With the 5 I am on the phone with, texting and meeting… I am focusing being open hearted
    and listening carefully…
    Practicing staying out of Masculine mode.
    And giving them at least 3 dates…

    I am observing that 3 dates does work.
    after talking on the phone over the couple of weeks it takes to have 3 dates… they have relaxed and I get a better sense of who they are…
    I’m sure I am more relaxed also!

  237.  #238Jasmine on June 23, 2015 at 8:38 am

    Azure Blu I love the processing you are doing –
    When I read about wanting to find a match with someone with the right values and who’s idea of the future matches yours not only does this sound very sensible, I, too, want that in a man, but it also sounds like getting to that place (where I want to be) where I believe there truly IS that man out there, there truly IS a good match for me and I don’t have to bend myself to suit someone else (because I feel impatient, or because I’m good at denial, or because I’m really good at avoiding intimacy). I can try holding steadfast to the feelings I can imagine being with THAT man.

    I’m cheering you on dating all those men! And I feel admiration that you are doing the three dates…I feel freaked out after just one if it hasn’t felt wonderful…how did you get to that place? I know I feel confused with the how do you know? how do you know? But I’m also trying to hold steadfast to the belief that ‘what is for you will not go past you’ and that everything is in the timing. I got a birthday message from my email crush this morning and it made me feel all gushy and elated…though it wasn’t enough and all it warranted was a thank you ha ha. Oh I love silly me. Constantly letting it go, letting it go, letting it go…

    Millie – you sound so wise and taking the time of being away before making decisions – I would say if your instincts say selfish lover you may be right…I don’t think I would have felt very happy in that circumstance either

    Waterfall – I feel smiley that you had a lovely happy day

  238.  #239Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 8:39 am

    Femininewoman 233-

    Yes he could figure it out himself. Hes a smart guy and he texted me this morning to say he got it all worked out and is getting his money back.

    Im the person he calls when he is stressed or hurt or something is wrong. Im not sure what to make of that but I know I couldn’t turn my back on him when hes upset like that. It would feel cruel.

    He texted me this morning to tell me it all got worked out and I just said yes, what a relief!! I thought that would/should be the end of it but I think I will hear from him again today. He made a comment about being on a phone call at work like he has something further to say.

    Its going to be very difficult for me to follow through on this. He knows how to pull on my heartstrings and I just adore him.

  239.  #240Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 9:44 am


  240.  #241Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 9:46 am

    Is it Your Birthday?

  241.  #242Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 9:51 am

    Thank you for your comments..
    i like how you have put this so sisinctly:
    “someone with the right values for me and who’s idea of the future matches mine”
    It is helpful to simplify my thoughts and feeling messages
    When I share them with men/others..

    You feeling Gushy and elated from the bday wish
    but knowing it wasn’t enough!!!
    I agree all that was needed was the “Thank you”
    matching what they give!!!

  242.  #243Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 10:21 am

    “Im the person he calls when he is stressed or hurt or something is wrong”

    And because he knows that you will always be there for him he will have no motivation to change anything. I wonder how you will respond when he reaches out after he gets married to another woman?

    Again we have to take 100% responsibility for what we create in our lives. Handing him your heartstrings for him to pull on like a puppeteer, at his whim and fancy at anytime of day or night, sorry, is not attractive. Any man would wonder if you have a life and where are your kids – under such circumstances. Believe it or not it shows low value and that you don’t value your life.

    Even my daughter told me the other day that a guy asked her if she would rather hear his voice than sleep because she took a late call which I always discourage. Next time she didn’t pick up and he called as soon as he woke up the next morning. Then few days later was complaining to me that she did not take his call. That to me is the way to keep attraction going. Not jumping at a man’s every beck and call.

  243.  #244Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 10:24 am

    “Im the person he calls when he is stressed or hurt or something is wrong”

    Little boys look to their mothers for this. Grown men take care of business theydon’t go running looking for mama. As a matter of fact men are socialized to hide their emotions, man up and stop the whining.

  244.  #245Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 10:40 am

    “He made a comment about being on a phone call”

    I think it was just a polite way to end the conversation. I would be surprised if he was texting while on the phone. Guys tend to be only able to focus on one thing at a time. Ask them.

  245.  #246Jasmine on June 23, 2015 at 11:25 am

    Yes it is AB – I am feeling very loved and very cherished and very lucky. I’ve lazed in the sun and received so many loving and thoughtful messages from friends, men and family. It has felt very soothing and happy. I remember it’s Zia and Purple’s birthday’s near mine (probably others too) so happy birthday to them if they’re reading!

  246.  #247Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 11:52 am

    Happiest of Birthday to you
    my Dearest Jasmine!!!
    I feel happy to hear you are feeling loved, cherished and lucky!!
    Ahhh… a lovely day lazing in the warm summer sun!!
    YOU deserve it!

  247.  #248Jasmine on June 23, 2015 at 12:03 pm

    Thank you AB – I feel all warm and smiley reading your kind words xxx

  248.  #249Azure Blu on June 23, 2015 at 12:10 pm

    Millie #230
    Thank you for sharing your date with CDB
    You sound like you are using your feeling messages
    like a Goddess that you are!!
    You should be proud of YOU!!

    How good to respect YOUR boundaries
    around the hot topic (anxiety provoking)
    of Condom use!!!
    Wow!!! I am inspired!

    He does sound very exhausting…
    no matter how you react or what you say
    he is upset…
    Quite the drama king!! ;~0

    Love, love how you deftly navigated the whole evening and morning!!!

  249.  #250Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 12:15 pm

    245 Femininewoman-

    S must be a super man then 😉 Because he is on the phones all day at work and frequently tells me when he gets a call, then finishes a conversation later. He sells insurance so he is talking to someone on a call for about an hour at a time. Sometimes he will text a little bit during a call but he mostly likes to focus. Those left handed men ARE supposed to be better at doing two things at once. 🙂

    Anyway, it would be weird for him to end a conversation that I had pretty much already ended, like that. I wouldn’t be surprised if I hear from him again soon but I won’t be all that surprised if I don’t either. I didn’t respond to him. The point is to try and avoid talking as friends, so I would have to try and cut it off anyway.

  250.  #251Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 12:23 pm

    Femininewoman 244-

    It does seem a little boyish but more in an endearing way. S is never “whiny”. He did lose his mother about 10 years ago, so if he doesn’t look to the women in his life for things like that he really has no one.

    One of the things I love about S is that he is more open with his emotions than your average man. It’s not at all in a wimpy way either. He is very sensitive, but in a good way and not at all feminine. Sigh…. he is so my dream man, in every way.

  251.  #252Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 12:34 pm

    Femininewoman 243-

    It is very hard for me to wrap my head around the theory that responding to someone you care about, when they are clearly distraught, is “low value”. I am usually awake at midnight and my kids are in bed so I don’t know where S would get the idea this meant I don’t have a life or am neglecting my kids.

    I have told S that I don’t want to keep communicating as friends. If there were an emergency, of course I would still help him out, just like he says he would do for me. No, I wouldn’t expect to be his confidant when/if he is married to another woman. I’m sure she would take on that role. That he calls me now, says to me that at least I AM still the main woman in his life.

    He said to me last night “you weren’t going to answer my calls at all? You were just going to ignore them?” and sounded hurt. I said, I did send you the text and at least let you know why and he thanked me for that. I just can’t be coldhearted and rude. It’s not me.

  252.  #253Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 12:35 pm

    He also said he was calling to protect me. He said he was worried that if his account was broken into mine might be too. I do think it was sweet of him to think of me. 😉

  253.  #254Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 12:45 pm

    RE 253 Yupp and that is what you want to keep going. If you had called or text to call you in the morning and then shut off the phone he might have been delirious during the night or jumped in his car and showed up at your door.

    I really doubt he was distraught. It was only $500 not $5000. He would survive. Strong on the inside, I believe also means letting some of those calls go. Let him know what it is to really miss you. Not have you in his life so he can really value your presence. It is counterintuitive and men want what they can’t have. Try it for a change as a experiment, you might be surprised.

  254.  #255Femininewoman on June 23, 2015 at 12:46 pm

    “Let Her Go”

    Well you only need the light when it’s burning low
    Only miss the sun when it starts to snow
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Only know you’ve been high when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when you’re missin’ home
    Only know you love her when you let her go
    And you let her go

    Staring at the bottom of your glass
    Hoping one day you’ll make a dream last
    But dreams come slow and they go so fast

    You see her when you close your eyes
    Maybe one day you’ll understand why
    Everything you touch surely dies

    But you only need the light when it’s burning low
    Only miss the sun when it starts to snow
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Only know you’ve been high when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when you’re missin’ home
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Staring at the ceiling in the dark
    Same old empty feeling in your heart
    ‘Cause love comes slow and it goes so fast

    Well you see her when you fall asleep
    But never to touch and never to keep
    ‘Cause you loved her too much
    And you dived too deep

    Well you only need the light when it’s burning low
    Only miss the sun when it starts to snow
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Only know you’ve been high when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when you’re missin’ home
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    And you let her go (oh, oh, ooh, oh no)
    And you let her go (oh, oh, ooh, oh no)
    Will you let her go?

    ‘Cause you only need the light when it’s burning low
    Only miss the sun when it starts to snow
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Only know you’ve been high when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when you’re missin’ home
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    ‘Cause you only need the light when it’s burning low
    Only miss the sun when it starts to snow
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    Only know you’ve been high when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when you’re missin’ home
    Only know you love her when you let her go

    And you let her go

  255.  #256Senior Lady Vibe on June 23, 2015 at 1:04 pm

    Whew! I’m finally out of moderation. 🙂

    The Cherry Norris 2-minute video is @199 on this thread. Short and helpful.

    “Is He Interested For The Long-term Or A Short Term Fling?”


  256.  #257Senior Lady Vibe on June 23, 2015 at 1:50 pm

    Truths can be picked up anywhere. I recently viewed Steven Spielberg’s “The Pacific” film series which depicted battles and relationships during WWII.

    In every battle there were men who were wounded or killed. There were also men who were pronounced “gone” by their war buddies. “Gone” but usually not physically wounded they could no longer be reached through reason. “Battle Fatigue” “Shell Shock”

    Often those that attempted to help them risked their lives and were sometimes killed.

    I think this sometimes happens to women in everyday life… in the war of love.


  257.  #258Waterfall on June 23, 2015 at 2:41 pm


    I agree with you about keeping your distance to see if he really misses you.

    My D was very similar in the sense that he got used to having me there as someone to talk to, be with spend time with, cuddle, be intimate with and he was very happy for all thar to happen! He always told me how much he loved me, missed me etc, etc…

    But at the same time he has never offered me a real commitment or relationship. Certainly not what I want.

    It is difficult because I still miss him etc but I do believe that he had no incentive to change. He had me right where he wanted.

  258.  #259Lovergirl on June 23, 2015 at 3:52 pm

    Femininewoman- yes. I agree. I need to try this. Its hard and goes against everything I feel for him but I need to majorly pull back. Im trying to start doing that. i love that song by the way. 🙂

  259.  #260Waterfall on June 23, 2015 at 4:10 pm


    My D used to call me day and night and if I ignored him it increased 10 fold and he would say how anxious he was and that he needed to speak to me. He would turn up at work, on my doorstep he would always have some emergency or some reason. I could tell you there were many and he made them out to be super important at the time.

    I felt like you that I could not be horrible. I have really tried to maintain that though I feel one day I may be pushed over the edge.

    The truth is, I believe that we both wanted it to work but we were just not well matched. We were from different backgrounds etc and found it hard to build a life together. He wanted to and I wanted to, but only on our own terms and we couldn’t compromise enough for it to happen.

    I think a lot of stuff comes down to personality, and your life situation.

    I can see you really love S, hold to to that love but don’t let it make you loose sight of who he is.

  260.  #261Indigo on June 24, 2015 at 2:21 am

    Senior Lady Vibe,

    I have been watching the Cherry Norris videos and have absolutely adored them. Thank you. Such sweet, fun, feminine, kind, no nonsense advice.

  261.  #262Dixie on June 24, 2015 at 4:01 am

    Dominique 236.. Thank you SO much for your support! My autocorrect typo made me laugh out loud – you’re right, it was pretty revealing!

    Anyhow, D contacted me that night… I was exhausted beyond belief, lying in bed, listening to the rain. And I was remembering a funny moment between the 2 of us, when he would stay up late while I worked. I shared that when he asked. Anyhow, the conversation felt easy, normal, and I was SO proud that I could speak my piece about the
    distance in a non-accusatory way (mainly because I don’t feel attached about the outcome anymore).

    After he used my nickname (a sign hes in a better space), I said: “x, you have every right to pull back, to look after yourself, your world. Me feeling triggered by the distance I feel is something I need to heal by myself.”

    Him: I just want to be there and rescue you. I miss you alot.

    So I didnt ask about why the pull back happened, didn’t pry, didn’t feel anything, but content and in the moment – the sound of the rain, a funny dream, just sharing. I said I was tired because I had to get up at 3 to finish work, and like the old days, he offered a wake up call to make sure I didn’t
    sleep in… And he did, and I slept right through 🙂

    Yesterday morning, steadyCD texted a nice message, then another at night. He likes phone calls, but I sense that he sends texts because he picks up on my lukewarmness. Still, I’ve responded warmly and will try to continue.

    Anyhow, I feel okay. Calm, and strong this moment.,

  262.  #263Dixie on June 24, 2015 at 4:04 am

    Couldnt do any of this without the support here- love to you all.

    I feel more grounded than I have in weeks.,

  263.  #264Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 4:43 am

    Dixie #262
    I feel calm reading your interaction with D!!!
    Sooo Sireny and strong!
    Lovely, lovely – YOU!!!

  264.  #265Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 5:39 am

    been thinking about you… hope all is going well…
    I know you have been feeling deeply and healing.
    huggs, kisses and
    loving vibrations I am sending your way.

  265.  #266Victoria on June 24, 2015 at 6:32 am

    How are you doing? Anyone promising from the new batch?

  266.  #267Violette on June 24, 2015 at 8:05 am

    FW than you for the point of view about…giving a man fair warning before sharing my feelings. This does respect him and it also respects me by being careful about who I share my feelings and how.

    I would like to try to approach communicating unpleasant things from a space of letting him know me, not anger. I mean, that is what I try to do. Which is the whole point of speeches, so I can express from a more “refined” place. So I can learn to speak clearly and calmly, the way I would certainly like to be spoken to. So I stand a better chance of being heard.

    It is so tempting not to say a thing. And I have over communicated in the past, mainly in the sense of needing a man to fix my problem, not wanting that to be the case but becoming so overwhelmed with emotion and wanting to have a real partner who can handle my feelings. But far more times I haven’t communicated enough. And I feel afraid of saying things wrong but at the end of the day it feels more important to say something than the say nothing for fear of it not being the perfect words. Or attitude.

    Dating M has been very painful, very difficult, because he reminds me of someone who broke my heart. The only person who ever really broke my heart. It is taking a great deal of strength for me to look back on the past and let it have it’s place, and allow the present to be a fresh experience, in a different time.

    Indigo, thank you for cautioning me, I hear that you doubt he will be able to hear what I was saying. I agree with what you wrote Lovergirl, it’s just one thing not…the three things I wanted to express.

    I look at someone like M and envision having fun together, connecting on our work, on our world views in certain ways, I can envision a life somewhat, but it would be very difficult for me to respect a partner who puts his friends on such a pedestal. They are kissing each other’s buts, and the girls are…not included, unless they want to act like guys. I don’t envision a life of much connection with him socially. I would see us leading separate social lives, at least to the degree of actually feeling satisfied.

    Also it makes me look at the friends I have differently. I don’t have many, they are fine, I like them and am happy to have them, but no great freindships, no giggly reunions or super fun times. I used to have those friendships but they didn’t last. And he is able to have that, because he doesn’t seem to care what his friends act like. I feel jealous of people who are able to truly enjoy their friends. This is part of what makes dating someone like him so painful. And experience tells me he would never understand that about me, and would judge me for not…being like his friends’ girlfriends. Just cool with whatever.


  267.  #268Violette on June 24, 2015 at 8:13 am

    M hasn’t contacted me. I feel sad. I don’t know if we are a match, I don’t even really know much about him, but I didn’t feel ready to call it a day.

    He’s the first man in a long time who feels appropriate for me. These past few years the nicest men I ‘ve dated have been older. Or…really corporate, different humor, different views on things, just not fun.

    Lately it’s even been men who feel like my parents’ friends. OK Cupid is all such older men, at least the ones who are stepping up and being gentlemen.

    M, felt like someone I should be with. Someone I felt comfortable being in public with. Someone where other people would think, what a nice couple.

    And the feelings of, another one bites the dust are swirling all around me.

    And the WHYS! Why why why? Didn’t he like me? Does he have another girlfriend? Is he lazy and got bored because I didn’t sleep with him?

    I am going to indulge myself with these feelings a little longer.

    Then I want to really let it go. Come to a new place. Create a life I want. With men who are perfect for me swirling around me until I don’t even know how to chose.

    I deserve that. I’ve had enough suffering. I want a good life and I know I can have a good life now.

  268.  #269Violette on June 24, 2015 at 8:44 am

    When I lived in a foreign country I saw a therapist, and one day she innocently suggested I work on my language skills (which were fluent but…not perfect) to help with figuring out my visa problems. I became rageful, a wave of intolerant fury went through me so fiercely that I almost couldn’t breathe. How could she ever, after all I’d said, and after seeing me and speaking with me and knowing me at all, not know that I was consumed with working on my language skills day and night. It was my obsession.

    I wanted to get up and leave. I felt so betrayed. And she was totally bewildered. I didn’t even want to tell her why I felt so angry.

    And she just said, you mustn’t get so upset. You mustn’t react so angrily.

    I take it so personally when anyone in the world doesn’t assume this or that about me. And the way I see myself is so often not what others are seeing. And it IS NOT personal. But it’s like I don’t believe it.

    What an opportunity it would have been to say to her, well I feel sad you haven’t seen enough of me to know that I do work on my language skills, tirelessly. And that would have been that.

    There was no need to put the power all in her hands. She didn’t know that about me, and I felt she should have, and that’s all I needed to say.

    It comes from a childhood where speaking my truth was unsafe I guess. Where I feel almost like fear of death when a bad feeling comes up and I know it must be communicated or I will feel worse.

    Is it really so simple? Just don’t do that? Could I really have just…not done that? I believe so, with practice. I don’t even need to say things tactfully, just…without great anger. To not get so angry about things. It would certainly simplify things.

  269.  #270Indigo on June 24, 2015 at 8:49 am

    So, two things I could really use you Sirens’ feedback on:

    I had a date last night with a new guy from OKCupid. It was disappointing. He was one of those guys who takes good photos, and in real life he didn’t look nearly as good. I didn’t feel attracted at all. Also, once we had exhausted the basics of work, family and favourite TV series, I sensed there was very little for us to talk about. Either he’s not a great conversationalist, or we have nothing in common.

    Yet, he was sweet and very taken with me, behaved like a gentleman and paid for the date. I felt uninspired. I’ve heard several coaches say to give a guy 3 dates before you decide not to see him again. What do you ladies think?

    Secondly, our boss is very kindly taking all of us out on a dinner cruise around the harbour on a fancy yacht on a Friday night two weeks from now. There will be drinks and gorgeous food and a dance floor. I feel like this is the perfect opportunity to flirt with co-worker from work, since we rarely get to socialise during the day. Any pointers or suggestions?

  270.  #271Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 9:24 am

    Victoria #266
    Hello… darling Siren
    thank you for the question…

    I’m healing from the Spirit devastating surprise…
    over 3 weeks since I found him and his ex on FB
    Knowing he isn’t what I want for my Mr. Right…
    but still missing all the lovely, energetic, classy good looking energy he shared with me…
    It is getting less and less as i CD more…

    Yes… I need to tell one of the 5 no thank you…
    He was fun… but seemed to have a noticeable problem with alcohol…

    Another one was soooo hyper when we talked on the phone and he seemed to talk in riddles
    i used feeling messages to say I feel overwhelmed with too much sharing all at once… explained that i like to take things slow and he understood…
    liked it that i was upfront and honest…
    and he continues to call and text and ask me out… I haven’t had time to meet him yet…

    Pilot cd i was NOT interested at all after the first date…
    but my Rori coaches ALLL have pressed me to give most CDs at least 3 dates…
    It has worked out much better than I thought…
    it has taken the urgency out of dating…
    I am relaxed and just listen and have Sireny conversation with them and THEY relax also..
    He is planning a second date on Sat.

    I have a date with Firefighter cd on Thur.
    He is Soooo yummie!!! AND i like the way he thinks…

    There are several more… (Wow) but these are the main ones right now…

    They are all so very attentive… texting me good mornings… how’s your day going…
    can we talk tonight? When can I see you again?

    I notice I am MUCH more open with all this attention,
    expressing my appreciation for compliments and time
    and am being much warmer than when I was previously cding…

    And YES, the ones who don’t show up on my phone or ask for dates… just fall away…

    I am NOT in a hurry… it is lovely to spend time with all this masculine attention…

  271.  #272Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 9:25 am

    How are you and F doing?

  272.  #273Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 9:27 am

    Yes, the 3 date suggestion…
    I used to ignore it if I wasnt’ feeling like I wanted to see them again…
    BUT I’ve been giving it a try… and sure enough…
    It makes a big difference…
    I find *I* am more relaxed when on the phone with them knowing I will be giving them at least 2 more dates… and THEY are much more relaxed by the time
    we’ve spent MORE time on the phone… texting etc.
    I can see why Rori and coaches urge us to try this.

  273.  #274Senior Lady Vibe on June 24, 2015 at 10:22 am


    You’re welcome. I like to share goodies and she covers a lot of early dating tips.

    Are You Leading Him On If You’re Not Turned On?


  274.  #275Senior Lady Vibe on June 24, 2015 at 10:30 am

    here’s another one… below…then I’m going to sign off on Cherry Norris for a while.

    I agree with her a lot (but not all) of the time. I’ve been a subscriber for several years and hadn’t noticed how many little videos had accumulated; I’m enjoying viewing them again.

    How To Know If He’s The Right Man For You…


  275.  #276victoria on June 24, 2015 at 11:25 am

    We are doing fine, or shall I say I am doing marvelously well with focusing on me :-). I have changed so much since I came here and we are both happier from it. I no longer overfunction, I choose when to lean back or forward. I am having the best relationship with myself I ever had. He is stepping up, very slowly, asking me do I see him in my future (!!!!). He is asking me what I want (?!). I am just smiling and keep telling him He is gorgeous and I adore him and I am just in the moment and I don’t know about the future. I am all zen and smiles and he is head over heels in love.

  276.  #277victoria on June 24, 2015 at 11:45 am

    I also think the 3 dates rule is good unless the guy is totally repulsive.
    On the party in two weeks… I would look at that as a marathon run which requires you to train consistently every day to build up more stamina and endurance 🙂 Start flirting now, with your sexy coworker, with your boss, with your female colleagues and with the world, and train more every day 🙂

  277.  #278Zara on June 24, 2015 at 12:01 pm


    *****I have told S that I don’t want to keep communicating as friends. If there were an emergency, of course I would still help him out, just like he says he would do for me. *****

    Just like friends would do.
    He got the proof your words mean bla bla bla and that you DO keep communicating as a simple friend, even at midnight.

    ***** So of course I called him back. My account is fine but he was stressing about his and its after midnight so he can’t get a hold of anyone. I helped him find a phone number to call and suggested he call his bank (which would have someone 24 hours) and have the payment stopped from that end. *****

    I feel turned off by a man who needs a woman to suggest him to call his bank and to find for him a Paypal contact number that is there for everybody on this planet to find.

    *****That he calls me now, says to me that at least I AM still the main woman in his life.****

    No, it means he wanted to make sure you check your account. That’s what friends do.

    *****I just can’t be coldhearted and rude. It’s not me.*****

    Does that mean WE are coldhearted and rude?
    Rudeness is in the eye of the beholder.

    *****He also said he was calling to protect me. He said he was worried that if his account was broken into mine might be too. I do think it was sweet of him to think of me. ;)*****

    It is not sweet, it is normal. That is what a decent ex-boss does in such cases.
    In this case, given the situation, I would have texted him back a thank you note and I would have gone back to silence. I don’t need to be on the phone with him to check on my side if my account is safe. As long as my account was safe, that was it.
    >>> My account is safe. It feels sweet (or whatever it feels) to have been warned, thank you. I feel trustful you will sort out things on your side. Good night.<<<
    The rest was his business, he is a man old enough to sort out himself and I check in myself that my need to "help" does not come from my need to control his world in the only way I know how. (May be I feel my own world out of control…)

    Trusting a man's capacity to sort himself out is a major turn on.
    Being coherent with my own words is a turn on. (No communication as friends)

    *****Of course, when something is wrong- when he is hurt, when he is stressed, when he is caught in a bad storm and scared, I am the person he calls. *****

    As friends do.
    And even as a friendship, this connection is unbalanced. He takes your energy and leaves you longing. When does he even help out in your own work problems or family problems?
    Anyway, how do you know he does not call another "friend" for other types of problems?


  278.  #279Senior Lady Vibe on June 24, 2015 at 12:20 pm

    excerpt from Rori post:

    “…I often agree with Jason on most of this – and though it’s a very harsh view coming from me, but you can see from Jason how a man sees ANY response we make to a man — no matter what we say, if we respond, the “friendship” is ‘on’…”


  279.  #280Lovergirl on June 24, 2015 at 12:34 pm

    Zara 278-

    I told him that while we were talking at midnight. He was upset. He was like you wouldn’t pick up the phone if I called? I relented and said I would pick up the phone but I would rather he not call. He said I will miss you and please call me if you need anything. He started talking about how good the sex is and how he thinks I am wonderful and that I am probably going to fall in love with some other guy.

    I adore him and its extremely difficult for me to be harsh with him. I don’t really want him gone out of my life forever! 🙁 A male friend also pointed out to me that I left the door open and that he would most definitely be trying to come back in at some point.

    I WANT him to. I want him to admit that he cares more than just a friend and to agree to put me before other women. I FEEL like he cares more than he says. I’m not really sure that I would WANT something like a marriage commitment as that sounds kind of stifling and scary. So I don’t want to push for something that I am not even sure I actually would want.

    I’m not turned off at all by S asking my advice for things. I suspect its sometimes an excuse to talk to me. He is capable, but he was also stressed. He couldn’t get into his account because the person had changed the password and he was having issues with not being able to get through on the number he called.

    I would feel very hurt and offended if S didn’t answer phone calls from me. We’ve been much too close for that- so yes, to me it seems rude and disrespectful to stop answering calls without an explanation. He’s not some guy off the street.

    S can call anyone he wants for his problems. It’s okay with me. I know he has a male friend he asks advice from as well as sometimes his ex girlfriend. So he COULD have contacted either of them with several of his recent issues, and who knows, maybe he did. He still called me.

    S has helped me out a lot with work problems- he was paying me to work for him for a year. He really doesn’t NEED someone to help him. He has helped me out, like when my tire blew out he drove me 45 min away to pick up my vehicle and then back to his house, which was another 30 min. He has offered advice on things with my kids and family when asked.

  280.  #281Indigo on June 24, 2015 at 12:56 pm


    I feel like you need to draw a distinction between friendship and romantic love. I have a couple of close guy friends, and they call me and contact me regularly to talk about anything and everything. I’m very close to them and I love them dearly, but I am very clear that it is just friendship. In actual fact my friendships with them make me slightly uncomfortable, because I don’t really love being in the “friendship” role with men. It is only the fact that I love them as people and can truly see no romantic future with them that keeps me in the friendship.

    One is my ex-husband. He and I once shared the closest bond imaginable. We slept together, shared a bed, house and life and were best friends. We adored each other. That is in the past though and we now talk almost every day if not every day as friends. We share all kinds of things, yet he is married with a child with his new wife, and we are both very clear that this friendship is completely non-threatening. My point is that you can share an extremely close bond with a man and still have no romantic future.

    Perhaps on some level both of you may want a romantic relationship, but you recognise realistically that it will not happen. My point is that, however close a friendship or a bond, it is dangerous to let that gallop away with you to romantic dreams if that is not realistic. Friendship with a man can be a great and valuable thing – but if you have romantic feelings towards him beyond what the friendship calls for, my honest opinion is you are playing with fire.

  281.  #282Lovergirl on June 24, 2015 at 12:57 pm

    Waterfall 260-

    I think S is wonderful and perfect for me. There is nothing that bothers me about who he is. The only thing that bothers me is not having the assurance of being #1 in his life. THAT is important to me. It wasn’t a big deal when he was pretty much giving me that anyway, but once he freaked out and decided to date other women then it changed for me. I’m not okay with that. Just sex, okay. Dating- no.

    I do feel he makes excuses to see and talk to me. He always has and it felt flattering because I knew it was really that he wanted my time and attention.

    If S wanted to continue as we were before- no emotional relationships or “dating” other women, just me, I would be totally happy! I’d be okay being a friend with benefits as that is what we started out as but I can’t do it if there is any other woman in the picture emotionally or if he is TRYING to get another woman in that position. So THAT is what I am trying to protect myself from.

  282.  #283Indigo on June 24, 2015 at 12:58 pm

    Thanks Azure Blu & Victoria!

  283.  #284Lovergirl on June 24, 2015 at 1:03 pm


    What would differentiate, to you, a friendship and a romantic relationship?

  284.  #285Indigo on June 24, 2015 at 1:11 pm

    For me, it’s very simply that the one has a future, or the possibility of a future, together and the other does not. With a friendship – even a friendship with benefits – you have to accept the choices your friend makes. You get no say. So they can date other women, meet and marry other women, move away, whatever. It’s their life. In a romantic relationship, you have a shared life, so you DO get a say. For me, the test is always – do I want a say so badly that I will get upset if they do something I don’t want them to do? You see, with a friendship I can let them go to make their own choices, and I really won’t get too upset no matter what they decide. With a romantic relationship, I am INVESTED in their choices. If I don’t hear from a friend for weeks, or even months, it does not materially alter my life or wellbeing. In a romantic relationship it very much does. The real test is, does this person have the power to deeply hurt you. If you can truly be ok with whatever they decide to do, it’s friendship. But if you cannot handle their choices, then I’d say it’s not safe to have just friendship with them.

  285.  #286Lovergirl on June 24, 2015 at 1:20 pm

    Obviously, I have romantic feelings for S. However, for those that are saying it is just friends from his end- then why does he get jealous? He has gotten very upset with me for sleeping with other men and that is why we no longer go to swinger parties together (though I’ve never done it in front of him). He said he can’t handle it.

    He has shown quite a bit of jealousy over Chicago too. If a man calls or texts me when I am with S, he will demand to know who it is and he clearly doesn’t like it. He has warned me not to EVER tell him again that I am planning on sleeping with another man. It upsets him.

  286.  #287Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 1:28 pm

    Victoria #276
    All of this sounds so inspiring!!

    Do you feel you are able to keep your Siren coolness
    because you occasionally CD?
    Am i remembering right.. just a little while ago he had withdrawn?
    How did you get through that to this Zen place and F asking if YOU see him in YOUR future? ;~))

  287.  #288Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 1:32 pm

    I too struggle with NOT communicating my feelings…
    I agree with you here:
    “But far more times I haven’t communicated enough. And I feel afraid of saying things wrong
    but at the end of the day it feels more important
    to say something
    than the say nothing for fear
    of it not being the perfect words. Or attitude.”
    and I have found the more I practice sharing MY feelings with men/friends/family…
    I am getting better and better at sharing
    my feelings WITHOUT an attitude!!!

  288.  #289victoria on June 24, 2015 at 1:37 pm

    He has not changed, or not much anyhow. And I have always been CD ing even before Rori, I am just a natural flirt.
    I just learned to bring my energy back to me back on me and to really love ME. Does this make any sense?

  289.  #290Kim on June 24, 2015 at 1:39 pm

    Wow Indigo, so cool you are getting out there! Yay!
    So happy to hear this! Really am.
    As to the no attraction guy, eh, I have never been one to waste my time if I had other irons in the fire lol, however, if you don’t, and he is working really hard for a second date with you, and you have nothing else in, why not.
    I usually measure attraction like this: if I couldn’t even get myself to kiss the guy, I don’t bother, because I have done it and it never got better…somehing is off chemically.
    With MoM, I was not overly attracted at the first date.
    He felt safe, kind and a little cute…but I wasn’t super keen on a second date…however, I remember thinking I could kiss him lol. The rest is history.
    I can kiss most men except those I am really not attracted to, and I have found that never grows, so no second date with those, no thanx. cd-ing shouldn’t feel like a chore.
    Hope this helps.
    As for the coworker, hmmm, I would just be smiley and friendly but wouldn’t rob him of the opportunity to be the man and initiate by talking etc., but I would definitely try to be as inviting as possible to see if he takes the bait lol.
    Just have fun, sounds like an amazing evening in store!

  290.  #291Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 1:55 pm

    Darling Siren!!
    So good to hear from you!!!
    How’s things going in FL with MoM in the summer?

  291.  #292Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 1:57 pm

    I agree with Kim
    about how to handle the evening work party!!!

    Sounds sooo fun…

    Yes. Let him initiate
    As I;m sure you know…
    and be your gorgeous Feminine self!!

  292.  #293Azure Blu on June 24, 2015 at 2:00 pm

    Victoria #289
    Yes… makes total sense!!!
    Super focus – ALWAYS – on Ourselves!!!
    Me too… always a flirt!

  293.  #294Waterfall on June 24, 2015 at 2:12 pm


    I so hear you, and you have to do what’s right for you and no-one else.

  294.  #295Kim on June 24, 2015 at 2:27 pm

    Hello Azure Blu! You sound great! Love your presence here…and thanks for asking.
    All is well bar some incidents…lol…due to our different characters and me losing patience with him sometimes…we went to a drive in yesterday and when the movie was finished I said, wow, let’s go home, I am soooooo tired and it’s so late. We have had trouble with our different bed times…however, once I had said this, he started to procrastinate SO much, including emptying the car of trash and driving BACK to the screen to – wait for this – read the credits!! To the end! I quietly boiled on my seat lol.
    I asked ‘why are we back here?’ ..well, he wanted to see what happens at the end of the credits. The black screen?!
    I breathed in.
    We finally got out….he decided to go the long route home,
    Yes. I lost it. I said: ‘you know, if I didn’t know different, I would think you did this deliberately, because I asked to go straight home.’ Of course he got angry.
    Today I laugh about it but I was pretty pissed last night….this procrastination and prolonging seemed to be passive aggressive almost!
    It’s him. There is no ‘quick’ or ‘fast’ in his life. We have been due to go to a weekend in the Keys for the last three months lol. Most of the time it doesn’t bother me but occasionally I could strangle him lol.
    Else, all good…

  295.  #296Kim on June 24, 2015 at 2:31 pm

    Interestingly, the living together part is working lovely now…. 🙂

  296.  #297Femininewoman on June 24, 2015 at 2:56 pm

    Kim that’s really nice. I feel so happy for you.

  297.  #298Violette on June 24, 2015 at 3:55 pm

    Azure thanks for understanding and also reminding me to practice on everyone I know. This is a skill that develops an ability for intimacy, which I want very much to grow at.

  298.  #299Waterfall on June 24, 2015 at 3:56 pm


    I am feeling so overwhelmed with the politics in my office that I am finding it almost impossible to focus and actually ‘do’ any work…

    I know that this is completely playing into the hands of the politics but I am feeling wrong if I do and wrong if I don’t.

    I am feeling like I don’t know whether to run away and hide or stay and fight. But I know fighting will just lead to more fighting..

    I have butterflies and anxiety. I’m not getting support. I feel panicky, I feel tense, I feel anxious…

  299.  #300Waterfall on June 24, 2015 at 3:57 pm

    … I feel drained from being bullied and being ganged up on… I feel nervous to go into work… I never seem to get on top of things…

  300.  #301Violette on June 24, 2015 at 4:07 pm

    I want to know how to be more proactive in my dating. I want to date a man from the country I wan to split my time in. Noone on OKCupid has matched that, so I did a search today. One man on the whole site! I went ahead and Liked him. This is a bold move for me and I felt giddy and giggly. Then I realized on my own account I can’t see Likes without an upgrade, so I feel deflated.

    But, remembering how many men are out there. And…to a certain degree I do have some control. I don’t have to totally wait for a cute guy to find me, I can FLIRT!

    It’s been difficult to find time for events, cultural events, but I want to try. I want to open myself up energetically to a man from my future half country who has a family with me and loves my work and I respect him and maybe I even like his friends! Wouldn’t that be nice! And maybe he even likes my friends.

    I my send a short message in a couple of days…in the spirit of learning how these things are done.

    There are also a couple of men of interest I saw that aren’t from my country of choice but I have been considering messaging them too, even though I don’t want to burn my energy in a direction I don’t really want to go in…

  301.  #302Kim on June 24, 2015 at 5:27 pm

    Thank you FW! How is the healing process going for you?
    Hope it’s all going well…

  302.  #303Lovergirl on June 24, 2015 at 9:18 pm

    Popping in to say I had a great date with the one guy I have finally met off of Tinder!! He was even hotter in person, a black guy with hazel eyes and huge muscles. He’s a former football player for a major state university and he still looks it (hes 39, so my age). He works as a security specialist for a medical research company and flies all over the world, clearly making very good money.

    We had drinks and appetizers at Houlihans and of course he paid. We talked for 3 1/2 hours and he gave me a hug at the end of the date. He messaged me after, saying he’d managed to restrain himself from humping my leg. 😉 Lol It was fun.

    He’s got an 8 yr old daughter here so he is back in town at least once a week. According to him everyone thinks that because he travels so much he must be seeing a lot of women but he actually doesn’t because he spends so much of his time working. So far I’m liking him. 🙂

  303.  #304Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 12:28 am

    I am so happy for you!
    He sounds so cool!
    The best part is, just to know that men like this exist, and they are out there, looking for a true siren 🙂

  304.  #305Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 12:57 am

    on the topic of male friends.
    To me the big difference between male friends and non-friends is whether I want to sleep with them. With friends, I know I have no chemistry and I do not want to sleep with them (it does not matter whether they feel chemistry, but in my life I have noticed the lack of it tends to be reciprocal). This gives the wonderful opportunity to have common interests, activities and wonderful discussions.
    For me FWB is a misnomer because I personally am very clear that the men I sleep with are non-friends.
    I do not manage to stay friends with men who used to be lovers. There is one guy from my university years whom I dated briefly, with whom we have tried to be friends over the years but I noticed that he is very attracted to me still (I am not) and is trying to have some no-strings attached s* on the side, and I am simply not interested, and it kind of ruins it for me.

  305.  #306Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 1:14 am


    Yeah, I’m not insanely fond of having male friends. I find they make great friends – they’re loyal and caring and great fun. But therein lies the problem. Inevitably one of us feels something more than friendship, even if it’s only a little. I also don’t really like how I feel – I want to feel like a girl, and sexy and desired and leaned back. When I’m with my male friends I feel like one of the guys which is really not something I want to be.

    I noticed it last night, I was out to dinner with a few friends, and two of my guy friends were there, and I just noticed how casually they treated me. I also noticed how hard I had to work to be noticed. And when I came home I thought “Woah, I don’t like this. This is not how I want to feel. I want to feel like a woman, like a feminine ingenue to be flirted with and won over.” I noticed how much leaning forward I feel compelled to do.

    And I decided right then and there that I was going to cut back on any male friends or male friendships.

  306.  #307Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 1:27 am

    You are not mentioning D. lately.
    Did you tell him you about your emigration plans as you wanted to do or not yet?

  307.  #308Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 2:24 am


    Thanks 🙂 And in the end I agree with you. If I can’t kiss a guy it’s a non-starter. I could not imagine kissing this guy at all, like you say chemically it was just off. He wasn’t my type at all.

    It was also a case of, he messaged me straight away when he got home and the next morning to wish me a good day. When I didn’t respond I got a needy message on the dating site asking me to tell him if I wasn’t interested. I don’t know if this is just something guys from my country do but it’s a total turn-off. I do not want to obsessively message with someone I’ve met once, who is essentially a stranger, unless there is something to say. Yuck.

    Anyway, I let him go gently. Onwards and upwards.

    Thanks for the reminder to be fun and open, and let him initiate. I needed it!

  308.  #309Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 2:44 am


    I have ended it with him. I have not spoken about it much here on the blog, because, well, I don’t tell the blog everything, and it’s felt far too personal and private and vulnerable to discuss.

  309.  #310Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 2:54 am

    Dearest Indigo,
    I apologize for being nosy.
    No need to tell unless you feel like it.
    You know we just love you and wish you well, the blog is in fact more understanding, non-judgemental and generous-spirited than most people I meet in real life.
    Is it ok to ask about the sexy co-worker?

  310.  #311Femininewoman on June 25, 2015 at 3:31 am

    Congratulations Lovergirl. My only suggestions would be to make first meetups shorter. About the humping leg comment I’d use it to slip there that I am lady and I like to hold off on that kind of thing at first meetings. He knows he is hot and likely thinks all women want him. That pedestal my dear belongs to you and as a man he needs to work for it. That’s how they place value on things.

  311.  #312Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 3:42 am


    Yes, the blog is wonderful. It’s not that I was afraid of being judged, I just didn’t have the words, nor did I want to find them, if that makes sense.

    Sexy co-worker is sooo sexy. He smells good. When it comes to men I am an arms and shoulders person, and he has the most gorgeous strong arms and shoulders. He held the door open for me today and kind of smiled at me with a look that made me feel quite nice. I kind of smiled timidly back. I am keeping in mind what you said about practicing daily for the marathon!

  312.  #313Kim on June 25, 2015 at 4:11 am

    308 Indigo…ewwww. Yes, let that one go definitely.
    Memories of men texting me 30 times a day and getting upset when I didn’t respond to every message…I run very fast when this happens. Lol.
    Needy, yes.

  313.  #314Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 4:33 am

    Yes, what is up with that?

    Surely that is something you build up to IF it is something you’re both cool with, not messaging someone several times a day saying “hope you have a good morning”, “hope you have a good evening” after you’ve had one date. Seriously what is up with that.

  314.  #315Femininewoman on June 25, 2015 at 4:46 am

    Indigo not making excuses her for him but you are a hot chick and the guy might just be too focused on impressing you and getting it right so he can win. There is no way for a man to really know the right mix and balance to do a dance until you start dancing relationshipwise with him. Guys know that girls like attention the degree might be different for each but they won’t necessarily intuitively know.

    On the flip side there will be guys that will be so besotted with you that they feel paralyzed. When these guys take their slow time we end up thinking they are not interested. For me I give things a little time and experiment before deciding. Guys might need a little in coaching in your preferences. Just saying…

  315.  #316Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 5:26 am

    I absolutely second what FW said about some men being besotted and needing some encouragement. F. has admitted to me to being paralyzed in my presence in our first meetings. I could feel in my gut that he liked me but he acted extremely clumsy and not very gentleman like. He actually acted like a 16 year old out on a date not having any idea what to do, he would just talk endlessly about work and his own stuff and was trying to impress me. It did not occur to him to ask me about me, to make compliments, to hold doors. My favorite episode is when we had a day time date, something like 2-3 months after we started going out, we had coffee and sweets and then went for a walk in a park. He acted very nervous, like he had something on his mind (I thought it was work), he did not seem fully present. Anyhow, eventually he got into his car and I was on my way back to whatever I needed to do next. He called me on the phone 5 minutes after we parted and he said, I need to tell you something, I am in love with you. I was so shocked, I basically saw a bench on my way and just sat down. I was like “huh ?”.
    And then he said “I have been wanting to tell you this the whole day”. I said “uhhhh, I think I am in love with you too. How come you never told me while we were together”. He said he was so nervous, he just could not tell it to my face, at the same time, he felt like he would explode if he did not tell me. Some men are like that.

  316.  #317Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 5:53 am

    also, the sexy co-worker sound sooooo sexy.
    What does he look like?
    Also, please practice with other people for the marathon, not with him. You can keep the “shy” Indigo for him, that is usually soooo charming.

  317.  #318Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 6:33 am

    Victoria #316
    Ohhhh… my !!!
    I love this story of you and F!!! and the first time he said “I love you”!!!
    Sooo romantic… sooo sweet!!

  318.  #319Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 6:36 am

    Darling Siren.
    So sorry to hear about you and D!
    huggss and love from me to you…

    Even though it was something you initiated…
    I know you would have rather it been different!

    But,,, It could be the best thing that NEVER happened!

    Yes… this coworker Sounds supper exciting!!!
    Yummie!!! :-))

    I like what Victoria is saying – keep the shy, sweetness for coworker and practice on others…

  319.  #320Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 6:41 am

    FeminineW… #315
    Yes… I can’t believe how tongue tied and speechless
    men can get…
    Even now… at my age… I can tell they just CAN’T
    say anything for a few minutes while they get over whatever it is they are feeling (too excited??!!)
    It used to get me agitated… Like “Get it together Dude” I’m just a girl!!!
    But now I see how sweet it is… How very vulnerable they are
    and I appreciate that I am actually turning them on that much!! :-))
    Now I open my heart and soak it ALLL in!
    Yes, girls it can still happen at 63!!!
    Isn’t that wonderful!!!???

  320.  #321Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 6:45 am

    Thank you, it was a pleasure for me to remember that moment, it was very sweet and romantic for me.
    He is a complex being, my man.
    There are some incredibly sweet and romantic things he has done for me… at the same time, he has pushed me over the edge of my patience 3 times, I have broken up with him 3 times. Not in the last year though, and, as I wrote to you yesterday, I and him are in a much better place in the relationship we have ever been.
    By the way, he gave me a beatiful watch as a gift for my birthday last year, and for the last few days I can’t find it, I am pretty sure I must have lost it. I am wonderding shall I tell him… I am very miserable because it…
    He came to see me very briefly today to give me a small gift (he is working a 12 hour shift so I will not see him later). He gave me something very small but thoughtful which I needed but did not care to by for myself… This is not the first time, he does such things occasionally, I was so tempted to tell him that I lost the watch but bit my tongue… Urg.

  321.  #322Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 7:15 am

    Ohh.. No – Sooo sorry to hear about the loss of a precious gift from F!!
    I know how awful that can feel… and then to figure out when is the best time to tell him…

    how thoughtful of him to bring you a gift today!
    How great is that you have stayed focused and leaned back and NOT broken up for A year!!
    Your Sireness is shining Brightly my dear!!
    Yay for Rori’s tools!

  322.  #323Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 7:15 am

    Victoria 304 and Femininewoman 311-

    Thank you! I did think the date went on kind of a long time. I could tell the poor waitress was getting annoyed with us sitting there so long too. I wasn’t sure how to end it politely.

    There were some things he said in there that made me wonder if we would be a good long term match. I feel like I would be afraid to share any of my sexual history with him or to tell him about the swinging. He seems judgmental towards that sort of thing.

    The nice thing about S, is that I don’t have to hide anything. He is very accepting of me and everything about me. I was distracted from thinking about him during the date but when I got home my heart ached. I’m not sure anyone is ever going to compare.

    I also felt a little intimidated. He grew up here and went to expensive private Catholic schools, where of course, he played football. His job involves, as he describes, solving everyone’s problems and he is the expert. He says he only sleeps 2 hours a night and doesn’t need any more sleep than that. He talked about how everything he does has to be efficient and how managing his time is very important to him.

    He seemed very type A and I am rather type B. Time management has always been a struggle for me, but I didn’t tell him that. I also didn’t want to tell him things about my family because I was afraid of looking low class. Like, he was talking about how he doesn’t understand people who do drugs and I couldn’t say yeah both of my parents were drug addicts, because it would be embarrassing. Again, S knows everything and I feel safe telling him stuff.

    I don’t even want to begin to think about how he would react to my oldest son, who is one of the most difficult children I have ever met (and I worked with behavioral disordered teenage boys before I had him, so I’m not saying that lightly). Again, S has been very supportive and helpful regarding my son, probably because he was similar in some ways when he was growing up.

    Some of his comments showed that he (like most men) has some Madonna/Whore complex too. I mean, I expect that but its like I have to put on a facade.

  323.  #324Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 7:28 am

    I have a HOT date tonight – first date – with a firefighter… YUMMIE!! his photos are VERY handsome

    We have spoken on the phone several times… WONDERFUL discussions about love, politics, religion (he is middle of the road veering left) our children…
    He texts me in the morning… during the day and wants to talk EVERY night!!
    As someone mentioned.. for me that is WAY overboard… in the beginning…
    “it is something we can build up to”
    I did share that with him and he has tried to not be so eager…
    He lives about 45 min. away… which I am not excited about… he said well… if we want it to work we’ll figure something out…
    still when it came to the first date…he tried to mention something about meeting halfway…
    I ignored it…
    I want to feel courted… I will share that if he brings the halfway up again…

    I pur off JAcd, till next week… too many dates in a row…
    Pilot cd has set up a date for Sat. he wanted to spend most of the day together… this is only the 2nd date… I get overwhelmed with too much time together in the beginning…
    anyway… I am keeping my options open!
    I really like the quality of men that is coming my way this time around!!
    sense my self esteem AND self love
    is MUCH better the CDs are mirroring all of that…
    i feel excited, a little scared, and working on finding a more calm and centered spot to be in for the rest of the day…
    still the disappointment and betrayal of Spirit
    hangs over me… i visualize untieing the ribbons of his energy that are around my arms and legs…
    i have managed to undo most of them but one on my right arm…
    I want to love MY sadness, my missing, my little girl that feels abandoned and mistreated..
    she needs love lots of love!!

  324.  #325Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 7:56 am

    This new guy seems absolutely wonderful!
    He must have been trying really hard to impress you with his super-human capabilities and achievements.
    I think you do not need to worry about long term, your son, what schools he went to etc. What Rori teaches us to be in the moment and just care about how he makes us feel.
    I see he made you feel somewhat not up to his level, but I guess he did not mean to, it is just a side effect of his bragging. Mind you, if he is so-superhuman, why is he on Tinder, the same place where you were?
    Also, I think you are fast-forwarding too much. Maybe you will feel comfortable eventually telling him everything about you, maybe you will not, maybe he harbors much darker secrets behind those hazel eyes. I don’t think you need to put a facade, just to have an open mind, and do not shoot the poor man just because he is not S!

  325.  #326Victoria on June 25, 2015 at 8:01 am

    I love how busy you are!
    I almost miss that, the excitement of shuffling several CDs in one week!
    Can you may be un-glue the “disappointment” and “betrayal” labels that you put on the story with Spirit? He has helped you move closer to your ideal man! Plus, I can bet that 1) he misses you and his heart hurts thinking about you, and 2) he will re-appear when you fall in love with someone else, like they all do.
    Have great fun with the fire-starter (woops, fighter) 🙂

  326.  #327Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 8:20 am

    Feminine Woman,

    I hear you about a guy not knowing how much is enough and just wanting to get things right. If I had been a bit more into him I’d have taken the time to tell him, but I just felt a bit bored and uninterested to be perfectly honest.

    I completely agree with both you and Victoria about many men taking a long time to warm up or to make a move or get their feelings out because they may really like you and it’s overwhelming for them. I asked one of my guy friends about that today and he said yes, that is totally normal. I am very much in favour of being patient and taking your time.

  327.  #328Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 8:21 am

    Azure Blu,

    Thanks for the hugs. Enjoy your date! 🙂

  328.  #329Femininewoman on June 25, 2015 at 8:36 am

    As they say give the boring guy a chance. He might surprise you

  329.  #330Beloved on June 25, 2015 at 8:58 am

    “I wasn’t sure how to end it politely.”

    What has felt best for me, is to say, “I’m feeling like it’s time to for me to go.”

    I’ve never had anyone question that. The story I tell myself is that I have an internal clock that tells me the exact right time to go. I trust it, I honor it.

  330.  #331Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 9:11 am

    Indigo & Victoria…
    Thanks for the well wishes for my date with the
    firefighter :-))
    I’ll let you know how big of a fire he “starts”!!!

    I know you are right about the labels… and there are many times when I am thankful for all I have learned from him … but of course as I get closer to other men…
    my escape is to bring up the wall of an ex (in this case it is Spirit)
    I noticed as Spirit and I became more intimate
    i started thinking about my ex’s
    just so weird… how scary intimacy can be and all
    the ways I try and protect myself…

    I’m thinking now that i may have uncovered the reason I’m thinking about Spirit
    I can flip this…
    I can sooth myself
    Azure… I will take care of you as you open your
    heart to these new men in your life..
    I will only let you get as close as is safe for your heart…
    I will always take care of you Azure… oxoxox

  331.  #332Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 9:17 am

    Victoria 317,

    He’s tall but not too tall, big but not too big – strong arms and shoulders, which you can see because he always rolls his sleeves up half-way. Floppy long-ish (but not long) brown hair that flops in his face with a single streak of grey in it. Blue eyes and glasses. And a beautiful voice. Yes, I purr 🙂

  332.  #333Indigo on June 25, 2015 at 9:19 am

    Beloved 330,

    Yes, I do that too. I say “it feels like home time for me” or “I feel like I need to get home”. There’s no need to be specific. People don’t tend to question it.

  333.  #334Azure Blu on June 25, 2015 at 9:37 am

    He sounds adorable, hot and sexy…

  334.  #335Millie on June 25, 2015 at 12:20 pm

    Lovergirl– just a few things I noticed in your post…when you first met S did he automatically know everything about you? Think back on how your first meeting was. Was it awkward? Did you tell him everything?? Did you hide certain things? I think most often we grow attached to what is comfortable and only remember that comfort as how it feels today. It is easy to forget how rough or awkward things felt and started with the men we come to find comfort with now. You can’t fairly compare your comfort level with someone you’ve spent a lot of time with to someone you went on one date with. Although I do understand that there is “instant comfort” sometimes on a first date. I think that comes with how you feel about you in the moment and the mans response and vibe. I also hear that you are uncomfortable sharing your truth with this new man. No one says you have to share everything up front, but I wonder how you know how we will respond if you don’t share your truth? You are assuming he will not accept you based on the opinions he has stated already. I would challenge him and be authentic. If a man tells me he hates dogs, and I adore my dog… I would not hide that love just because he doesn’t like them, nor would I assume that he would not accept me because I have a difference of opinion. I am hearing from this that you do not accept yourself and do not feel fully confident in owning who you are in front of this man. I think that is why we practice CDing and all of this processing. Give him a chance to get to know you….Anyway, that’s my two cents! I’m so glad it sounds like an overall good experience!

  335.  #336Femininewoman on June 25, 2015 at 1:06 pm

    Millie such an excellent comment.

  336.  #337Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 4:23 pm

    S texted me today, asking me if I would help him do a little thing on the computer for his business that he is perfectly capable of doing himself. It would take him a few minutes at most. He added “It’s perfectly okay if you don’t want to”.

    Wtf? I was at my grandmother’s house. I was visiting her after my sister did my hair (they live about 45 min away).

    So I texted him back like half an hour later “I’m in (Hometown). Hearing from you feels confusing. My heart wants your love and affection, not a friendship where I am helping you out while you are taking other women to parties and dating them romantically”.

    A few minutes later he texted back “Ok I understand- I should stop asking”.

    Does he? Does he understand? Will he stop asking? I’m seriously starting to doubt it! It kind of makes me angry that he would have the gall to ask me to do something for him after all I have said to him lately. It would have been easy and only taken a few minutes but I actually stopped doing that particular thing for him a long time ago and TOLD him I didn’t want to do extra things for him, even when I was working for him. Ugh!

  337.  #338Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 4:50 pm

    Millie 335-

    True, I did not know everything about S and vice versa on our first meet. However, we met with the intention of having casual sex, so he and I both were beyond the pretending in that regard.

    My first date with S was wonderful. 🙂 He took me out to a very nice restaurant and we had drinks and appetizers at the bar. At first I wasn’t sure if I liked his looks but I LOVED his personality. We hit it off immediately. He was making me laugh and I felt like “wow, I really like this guy”.

    When I agreed to have sex with him he was so excited that he didn’t even want to drive back to his house (like 20 minutes away). He took me around the corner to a nice hotel and said he didn’t care how much it cost, I was worth it! 😉 We had a great time in bed but he was nervous and worried that it wasn’t good enough and kept saying how he wanted to keep seeing me and that the first time is usually not as good as the next ones. He was like I want to have sex with you at least 300 times! So silly…

    I was comfortable talking to him right away. We would stay up, literally ALLLL night talking (in between rounds of sex) We couldn’t get enough of each other.

  338.  #339Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 4:57 pm

    Millie thank you for the advice regarding the new guy. I am going to try and give him a chance and not set such high expectations. 😉 He does seem like a good guy.

  339.  #340Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 4:59 pm

    Oh, and Chicago texted me today wanting my help too! Today is apparently text Lovergirl and see if she will do things for you day! He sold his truck and wanted a ride to go get a rental. I was 45 minutes away visiting family. He found someone else. Imagine that!

    I wouldn’t have minded helping him so much, since I really don’t care if he wants to be friends. I just have no desire to sleep with him. Friends would be fine.

  340.  #341Allure on June 25, 2015 at 5:26 pm

    I feel like screaming!
    It’s not that dramatic. I feel a bubbling, forceful, urgent feeling in my chest and throat. At the same time it feels choked and wheezing, quiet and weak. Like in a dream. I can’t get any sound out.

    I can’t SAY what I want to say. I want to say back off! You can’t come at me like this for THOSE reasons just now! And now what? Now you treat me like a precious gem without a flaw. Like i’m your home and all in the world and in te enire cosmos that represents who you are is anchored to me.
    I feel played. How is that possible? All along I knew I would get a really good, solid relationship, with no future and no past. No bells and certainly no whistles. I knew all along that if I ever wanted bells and whistles, i’d be looking somwhere else.

    I never wanted to change you. I wanted spend time with you while I worked on me. I celebrated your growth too. I had thoughts that maybe we would somehow stay together forever. You would talk about kids with me sometimes. It felt off. Now I know. I know…I don’t want kids with you.
    I don’t trust this new way of being for you. Yeah you’re cool and all but you are kind of a dick and you know it. Doesn’t matter if I can HANDLE it. It is what it is. Yeah you do things. I have spent years appreciating those things only to have you demand things of me! You yell into my face just a couple of months ago that you want me to see how terribly I treat you? Because I didn’t hear you say good morning?
    And now what?
    I feel angry. That I had to prove myself in such a way to see this side of you. I don’t trust it as far as I can throw a $20 bill. Besides, I liked the way you were just fine. I don’t want you like this!
    All clingy and like the sun shines out of my little behind. Fuuuuuuuuuuu ck that. Get pissy! Yell at me. Let me yell back. I feel so turned off.
    I want to feel like I can tell you to f*ck off and you won’t look at me like I broke your heart. Like…You don’t need this shit anyways.
    I am bored. And spent weeks now mucking through my sh*t.
    To get here. To what i’ve actually known all along…You are not my forever man. Just now. When you’re treating me like precious gold and jewels.
    I feel like a big pile of goo.

  341.  #342Zia on June 25, 2015 at 5:41 pm

    Lovergirl #337 – I get the awareness that he’s testing the waters here. You have said something to him, and he’s testing it. Does she really mean what she’s said, or is she going to give in again? This is a great opportunity for you x

  342.  #343Allure on June 25, 2015 at 5:50 pm

    I thought I would feel purged but I don’t. I feel angsty and contradictory. I see all the lies and all the imaginary crap I built up over the years. It’s sitting there between the lines.

  343.  #344Allure on June 25, 2015 at 5:51 pm

    I knew it somewhere deep down. Now it’s real and I don’t want it!

  344.  #345Lovergirl on June 25, 2015 at 5:53 pm

    Zia 342- this is how I feel as well. He is testing. I have felt that S has put me through a great deal of testing over the past year.

    Its funny, there have been times he has done things amnd I got upset and he acted like I had no right or reason to be, then later admitted that he admired how I stood up for myself. That is what I intend to do here.

  345.  #346Allure on June 25, 2015 at 5:56 pm

    I feel myself freaking out. I want a man who is in a position to have a family or not commit myself at all!
    I feel all over the place. I have moved beyond commiting myself to this man just because he’s loyal, reliable, and there.
    I feel gross. I feel panic.

  346.  #347Allure on June 25, 2015 at 6:03 pm

    I feel lost. I still don’t know what to do or say. I feel lingering fear that i’m losing my grasp on what the reality of the situation is. I know I have to communicate.

  347.  #348Mandy on June 25, 2015 at 6:14 pm

    Hello Sirens,

    I’m on an anti-inflammatory diet, which helps me with my painful condition. I feel so much better.

    Just a question. I’ve been doing so much self-reflection, looking in the mirror, digging up the gunk, I can finally see myself clearly in the reflection, the magic inside, the emotions, the tough side the soft side which I protect, etc.

    I am very happy to say the least.

    What is it, as a woman, that gives you the strength to say “those words” (what it is that you may riff to your guy.)

    My biggest fear was always hurting someone! It needs to be gotten over. Honesty. Sometimes with me it is my anger that drives me to honesty and sometimes it is not a bad thing so long as it comes out in a respectful manner and not all attackish.

  348.  #349IamHis on June 25, 2015 at 9:31 pm

    (((Allure))) – Your processing feels so beautiful. Is there maybe some fear underneath all that anger? You’ll be in my thoughts and prayers tonight, lovely creature.

  349.  #350IamHis on June 25, 2015 at 9:34 pm

    I feel so exhausted, relieved, & finally…excited! I had soo much I was working through, & I finally feel like I’m on the downward slope of the mountain. Feels amazing and freeing. 🙂

  350.  #351Femininewoman on June 25, 2015 at 10:45 pm

    Lovergirl it is about boundaries. Look in the mirror and see if he is showing you that it is time for you to stand by yourself and your boundaries. Maybe even start establishing boundaries for yourself and your behavior. He might be a boundary pusher, many men are, yet he just asked a simple question. No is a complete answer. Guys find it sexy when women can say and accept no for an answer. No need to ruminate about why or wtf. No. Finito.

  351.  #352Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 3:40 am

    Millie #335
    YES!!! I love what you wrote here!!!
    Being authentic with your CDs gives them
    a chance to step up and show Us who
    they really are! It challenges THEM to be authentic also!

    I really like this:
    “I am hearing from this that you do not accept yourself and do not feel fully confident in owning who you are in front of this man.
    I think that is why we practice CDing and all of this processing.”
    Ahhhh… yes… what WE learn as we continue to CD!!!

  352.  #353Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:14 am

    Remember… You will be able to make it
    happen when YOU are ready…
    just keep loving you
    Sounds like you are taking really good
    care of you with your new diet!!

  353.  #354Victoria on June 26, 2015 at 4:14 am

    Azure, Millie,
    I kind of disagree, I hope you would not mind me saying that.
    I would not say to a a man on a first date that I have been at swinger parties or that my parents had problems with drugs. There might be a time and place for such information, but it would definetely not be the first things that I will volunteer information about. And to my mind, it is not at all the same as whether you like dogs or not.

  354.  #355Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:16 am

    Allure #347
    I have found…
    that when I am the MOST confused
    is about the time i find
    MY biggest breakthrough…
    keep on your path Lovely Siren,

  355.  #356Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:26 am

    Ohhhhh… You are SOOO right!!!
    I had forgotten those were some of the things
    Lovegirl had mentioned…
    I was only referring to the dog
    I have things in my past I have NEVER shared with
    any man… because it doesn’t speak to who I am today!!

    I feel sad that Lovegirl is feeling less than.

    Rori has a post where a young mother was dating a doctor who was treating her poorly…
    She was a stripper, raising 2 children and going to school to become a pharmacist… and yet, she felt she was NOT of his class…
    Rori pointed out, that really, she was VERY accomplished… courageous and smart
    and to take that man off of the pedestal she had erected for him… and put herself up there…
    and keep walking across her bridge…

  356.  #357Millie on June 26, 2015 at 4:33 am

    Victoria– I wasn’t saying that all should be revealed on the first date. If you read my post I said that Lovergirl felt u comfirtable about herself and made an assumption about his possible reaction. I used the dog example as something on a basic and simple level for clear understanding. Obviously it’s not the exact same thing.

  357.  #358Millie on June 26, 2015 at 4:36 am

    Sometimes I feel like not saying anything on the blog anymore.

  358.  #359Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:45 am

    mmmm…. well, i had a disappointing date…
    regarding online dating…I feel proud of the fact that I have gotten
    fairly accomplished at reading between the lines of the profiles… weeding out the ones, I have learned, I am not a match with… looking at the photos and telling which images are outdated, heavier than they say they are… etc…
    WELLL, this one slipped right through… I walked into the restaurant where we were meeting and he had his back to me… a large round man, I thought I had the wrong guy…
    I mention quite prominently in my profile that I workout (I am NOT a fanatic) on a regular basis and eat healthy…
    i would expect you to do the same!!!
    Welll,,, I thought… Ok Azure, give him a chance…
    BUT… 70-100 lbs overweight is too much for me!
    We spent 2 hours talking… appetizers and wine…
    and he brought up about his weight… and I said…
    “being in shape and eating healthy is important to me… i feel decieved.”
    He apologized… said his photos were recent…
    we stayed a little longer…
    he paid the bill and we went our separate ways!!
    Not sure what I learned from this?
    Practiced sharing my truth… I might not have shared it in person if he hadn’t brought it up…
    but i would have texted him about it…
    I like practicing saying these things in person..
    and actually believing what *I* am feeling is Important and needs to be shared!!!

  359.  #360Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:51 am

    I feel happy to hear that your processing
    is liberating and causing YOU
    great Happiness!!! enjoy!

  360.  #361Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 4:53 am

    Ok… Opinions…
    There is a CD on POF and we’ve been messaging within the site…
    He likes all the activities that happen in my city in the summertime…
    I mentioned our Summer Festival…

    He said… “Are you asking me out?”

    Sirens, How do I turn this around?
    Help please…

  361.  #362Victoria on June 26, 2015 at 6:13 am

    How about “I feel like I need to say something smart to turn this around” 🙂

  362.  #363Sassy on June 26, 2015 at 6:28 am


    #361-I would just say your truth…that you are a woman that prefers to be asked out on a date and given suggestions or choices as to what you want to do or where to go.

    Let him be the pursuer/chaser. That’s his “job”.

    I have now read Steve Harvey’s “Act like a lady and think like a man” (or however it goes), and “why men love b!tch$s” and was pretty much blown away. I really have been clueless about men my entire life! Sheesh. Time to change my thoughts, and my heart.

  363.  #364Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 6:46 am

    Thank you Sassy and Victoria!!

    Do you recommend reading these books…
    it sounds like you got some good information from them?

  364.  #365Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 6:56 am

    Azure Blu – 361 – can’t you just say “No, I’m not, I’ll leave the asking out up to you”? 😉

  365.  #366Sassy on June 26, 2015 at 7:09 am


    Re those books, yes! I actually bought and downloaded them into one of my reading apps on my iPad so they are always available.

    I truly learned a lot from both. I love hearing things from the male perspective, and they are pretty much no holds barred info.

  366.  #367victoria on June 26, 2015 at 7:38 am

    I loved Why Men Love Bitches – it is funny and upbeat and wise.
    The Steve Harvey book was patronising, like most male advice how to ” act as a lady”. My 2 cents,

  367.  #368Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 7:45 am

    I had a date that felt pretty nice last week, got a lot of yummy kisses. I felt a little bored and still, the guy was attentive, sweet, and a great kisser so I certainly felt open to more dates. I feel certain he understood clearly what I am looking for, what I require as far as actual phone calls and dates.
    Over the week I got a few texts, “Good morning Hun,” kind of stuff. I responded in kind. So last night at 11pm I get a text saying, “I’m guessing you lost interest.”
    My first thought was…you guessed right 🙂
    Since it was so late I declined to respond until this morning. When I read it again, I felt a bright spot of anger in the center of my chest. I imagined he was trying to emotionally manipulate me. I mentally composed some feeling messages. I thought, well of course I lost interest, what did you expect? You haven’t called or made plans.
    I felt into the whole soup of all of those feelings and went with the simple truth, which felt the best.


    Ahhhh…..iz true.
    He had texted me a couple of times about how he missed talking to me, and he responded to this text about how he will miss my kisses…and…I’m noticing, that all he has to do is CALL to hear my voice or MAKE A DATE to get more kisses and I feel totally icked out by the idea of pointing this out to him. It feels like leading and reassuring and I feel happy to let that go.

  368.  #369Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 8:28 am

    Beloved… thank you for the script!!

    I agree it does feel irritating when the cds ask that question…”have you lost interest?”
    I have started saying… “ohhh… no —-, texting and talking everyday is something i like to build up to… in between dates… What are your thoughts?”

    They have all tapered their texting and calling… and continue to request dates!!
    I don’t want to get that invested that quickly!!!
    And (a gentle remineder after last night’s date) it is important to keep things warm and open BUT not invested!!!

  369.  #370Mandy on June 26, 2015 at 10:06 am

    Thanks Azure,

    It is a rough time. I tell you I can’t think of anything else than expelling him from my home. But there’s some awesome stuff coming out of me, me sticking up for myself and people just complying without a question. Interesting, no??? Sometimes it’s funny how easy it is.

    But I’m telling ya, the breakup almost happened last night because J got into it with me about the air conditioning (controlling the temperature so as to control electricity costs) and I’d just had it with his control-freak attitude – I just started crying and got my stuff together and was getting ready to walk out the door to go to my parent’s house for the night, and he stopped me and said wait I want to work this out, and I just worked it out for the moment for the sake of peace, but I’m ready for this to end so soon.
    I just want him gone. I know it will suck. I know I’ll feel very alone. But I need to be alone. I really really need it, more than I ever have before.

    I’m dealing with seriously debilitating itchiness this morning. I’ve been trying to eliminate all sweetener and anything corn derived, anything from the Nigthshade family and Ragweed family, and anything artificial. Those being gone and me still itching, hmmm. This mystery isn’t solved yet. What I do is kind of go soak it out in the bathtub rather than dose myself with allergy meds that make me sleepy. Or run and sweat it out, and it sometimes works, but the itching is just debilitating sometimes.

    G has been so supportive. He listens to me every time I have a gripe! I’m so surprised. He gets it. Usually I feel guilty about griping because my dad and/or others get all uncomfy because their sensibilities are so delicate, I love how he handles anything that comes at him with a sense of humor, heck even when someone he manages with work is being a brat (he works with a lot of younger people), he just lets them know who’s boss, in a practical, calm manner, so the group he manages keeps up as a well-oiled machine. That and he calls me every day. That’s freaking awesome! He always says fun things too about how he wants to just steal away with me for a weekend,. or move me into his house, and I have to say, I feel very intoxicated by him, he’s quite an enticing guy…if he were to shoot me an arrow I couldn’t refuse I might actually think to myself, well, heck, I’ll let him woo me as long as he likes..

    Nice specimen of a masculine man. I like watching from afar what they do. It’s pretty charming stuff. I’m taking notes and seeing what my weaknesses are, you know…my weakness used to be goth boys, punk rock boys, who looked like bad boys, who seemed exciting and it’s a thing of…I’ve been dying for a good masculine guy to show me what a masculine guy is, now that I see it, it doesn’t creep me out anymore, I’m not afraid, in fact I’m charmed as can be, this type of man who gets things done and has a smile on his face while doing it, gosh…yeah, completely, totally swoon-worthy, but still, gotta be careful 🙂

    CDing is such a powerful tool, I haven’t even let myself revert back to my old ways of being complacent in this situation because I’ve shifted completely for good into being about me. When it’s not about me, it’s a co-dependant situation and I’m done with co-dependancy! 😛 Time to grow up 🙂

  370.  #371Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 10:48 am

    Hahaha, after I went for a walk I decided since he said he was going to miss my kisses, I would respond with “mmm…the feel of kisses on my neck makes me feel warm and delicious.”
    I’m totally having some fun with this 🙂

  371.  #372Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 11:30 am

    Beloved!!! love your kisses script!!

    Yeah… after reading EMK and Mathew hussey…
    the men who’s energy is coming toward me…
    I like to give them some encouragement!!
    They respond well and need to know how much i do appreciate allll that masculine energy coming my way!
    You know… the balance of leaning back with open heart AND kindness and appreciation!

  372.  #373Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 11:30 am

    Well, that got him going, he’s trying to get a date for tomorrow night. I’m available next week 😉

  373.  #374Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 11:38 am

    Ha, Azure Blu, I kind of giggled. I was feeling like a great big tease more than anything, and enjoying it and appreciating that in myself. 😀

    I am actually GREAT at teasing…While I was in the shower (great meditative place!) I realized I had shut it down SO hard with an ex because any time he felt teased, it brought up his rape trauma and his whole childhood trauma and he would dump all of that on me. I thought it was because of me, instead of just seeing it as a bad situation and leaving.

    Oh, ding ..there goes my text and I have a date for Tuesday night now…which is SUPER AWESOME because I would love to make out with this guy again.

  374.  #375Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 11:41 am

    Lovely Siren… YOU sound AMAZING!!!

    Your interactions with J last night…
    wow!! such goddessy sireneness!!
    YOU Walking away… and HE wanted to work things out…
    now that you are leaning back… he can move forward and fill that space!! – NOT that you should go back with him… that is up to you…

    G sounds like he is continuing to show his appreciation of YOU!!! You sound like you feel good about the way you are pacing your interactions with him!!

    I’m wondering if all this itching is being caused by how uncomfortable you have become with J living with you..
    I know I had gotten SOOO physically ill (stomach aches, head aches dizzy spells)
    when I was allowing my ex from 2 years ago to
    treat me VERY poorly – on again off again…
    lieing and playing games…
    Until he broke up with me and I NEVER went back with him again… ALLLLL my symptoms disappeared and I have been well ever sense!!
    Just a thought!

  375.  #376Azure Blu on June 26, 2015 at 11:46 am

    Beloved #373
    You Siren Vix*n YOU!!

    Yes… the fine art of teasing… Men LOVE it!!!
    and it does take practice!!
    a little flirting a little teasing…

    a great reminder…
    that’s some of the fun of dating!!
    I do like it when men tease me too…
    as long as it isn’t malicious

  376.  #377Mandy on June 26, 2015 at 12:14 pm


    The itchiness I know in my heart is truly yes about J still living here. I am stressed about it, and Psoriasis acts up when you are stressed, just like most stuff.

    I take a hot shower to calm the nerves, it works. Remembering J’s humanness is the other thing that helps.

    I tell you what though, oooh, it’s a debilitating condition sometimes…But yes a lot of the times I will have either stomach, skin or joint symptoms if I am upset. I didn’t know our emotions can actually cause tissues to flare up and even go as far as early-onset arthritis (for me, I have Ehler’s-Danlos Syndrome, which is a genetic disorder caused by lack of collagen in the body’s cells, which manifests itself emotionally and physically…just dealt a rough set of cards, but dealing accordingly!

    Thanks for helping me figure that out!

  377.  #378Femininewoman on June 26, 2015 at 4:16 pm

    Millie please do continue to share. There is value in feeling how you feel when others don’t get what your are saying. You get to experience your automatic go to response and decide if you wish to change it.

    Also you get to experience how different people interpret your words and get to decide if it is worth looking at your communication style.

    Communicating on this blog can be used as a really great learning experience.

  378.  #379Beloved on June 26, 2015 at 4:48 pm

    Wow, just wow…I feel like warm honey.
    So, M texted me how he just wants to please me.
    I told him, you know what else feels good and makes me go all warm and melty? Phone calls. I love hearing your voice. And plans in advance. I just feel so sexy when I feel like a man is handling things.

    So guess who got a phone call?
    He just kept going on about how much he wants to kiss me, how good I smelled and how it made him want to devour me, how he had been thinking and thinking about me, and how he knew I wasn’t calling or texting him because I want a man to lead…the vibe was so sweet and genuine and I just leaned back and let it flow all over me. I said, good, that’s what I want. It feels so good to hear your voice and I feel so happy you called me because I really did want to hear from you and see you again 🙂

    So, so far I feel I have a Real Live Good Man and this feels really easy.
    Last night I started affirming, “I, Beloved, am now willing to let into my life the kind of man that I desire.”
    And so it is 😀

  379.  #380IamHis on June 26, 2015 at 7:25 pm

    Feeling confused. Feedback would feel great.

    This guy and I bumped into each other while rushing around at work, and I had been feeling disconnected from him, but my hands once again developed a mind of their own and I actually put my hand on his stomach to kind of slow him down and ended up petting his stomach.

    So later on, he came over to where I was and just lingered around me. He finally came over and stood right in front of me and sighed deeply. He seemed weary and sad and wanting to talk…and with anyone else I might’ve asked what’s up/what’s wrong, but I kind of felt like he was going to start talking, & I was just…with him…there, if he wanted to say something?

    It felt very vulnerable on his part, and it was kindof beautiful.

    Was not asking him anything and just being there with him the right thing to do?

  380.  #381Dixie on June 26, 2015 at 7:47 pm

    (happy feelings all around!!)

    This blog is feeling so inspiring lately! Beloved, right now, I am SO inspired by how you shared your needs in such a feminine, strong way! Lovergirl, I’m excited by this man who seems intrigued and attracted to you!

    So a little update: I was invited to go on holiday to Portugal. And I’m going. And I’m excited! And I don’t feel the need to tell/inform D. that I’ll be gone because… Well, I don’t need to, really, unless he asks or moves forward in any real way.

    Ladies, I feel so excited about this trip! And today, the last day of school, well the best thing happened. First, some of my former students came to visit (I love that so much), then, the grade 12 student who I taught earlier this year, the one who was inspired to visit all the NYC locations in a novel, gave me the sweetest card. In it, he included this:

    “Thank you for being the kind of teacher you are, for all the students like me, who need so much help and encouragement, but will never ask. PS Everyone secretly calls you ‘Nathanael’s mom’, hahaha. Even my mom calls you that!”

    I can’t even describe how sweet it felt to hear that type of appreciation. Why am I sharing here? Because this feels really like a sisterhood (siren-hood? Lol) and you guys inspire me every day…

    So, Portugal in less than 10 days. I am feeling so light and happy and excited. As for D., the best thing has happened in that my heart is just looking at him as if he was any other man. Definitely less swooning here, definitely less (oh, I can’t believe I’m going to say this!) interest and attraction for a man whose now attention feels lukewarm. Monday night felt good, but now…… Poof again!

    I like feeling cherished, desired, adored, protected, and supported by a man. These are all major turn ons. I love when a man takes the lead, steps up, and steps into that masculine role. So, maybe this man will be in Portugal, or maybe not, but I am not waiting anymore for Life to happen “to me.” Portugal feels fun, light, exciting, bursting with excitement, fresh and new…. And I’m so glad that I get to share this bit of happy energy with you all 🙂


  381.  #382Lovergirl on June 26, 2015 at 8:58 pm

    (((Millie))) Please continue to post. I enjoy your posts!

    I only have a minute to stop through tonight. The new guy does want to meet with me week after next again, so that should be fun and I will try to stay open.

    I just got hit up today over text by a guy I haven’t seen in over a year. He says he is getting married in October (so not sure why he is texting me, I guess just to share the news). He and I weren’t serious but were fwb for awhile.

    Today I worked at my new job. I was at a public event so lots of people and guys hitting on me. One guy asked for my number and another who used to work for our company (but now works somewhere else) kept coming over to talk to me, like the whole day. He was clearly interested. I’m not interested in either of them but it was flattering anyway. Some guy at the grocery store yesterday asked me to go fishing with him too. I kind of laughed it off but again, its flattering to remember that guys still find me attractive.

    Did not hear from S today but I don’t feel overly focused on him right now either, which is a good thing. I’m kind of feeling like I really don’t want to hear from him unless he wants me in a more serious way. I don’t feel like bending on that.

  382.  #383Lovergirl on June 26, 2015 at 9:01 pm


    I am so excited for you getting to go to Portugal!! That sounds awesome!! 😀

  383.  #384Tereana on June 26, 2015 at 9:13 pm

    Lovergirl, many posts ago…yes, I was talking about Chicago. I’m sure by now you have moved on to better things. And better men : )

  384.  #385Tereana on June 26, 2015 at 9:25 pm

    I guess this is still the most recent thread…

    Anyway, I had an “aha” moment recently. See, in my life, I’ve tended to like guys who are kind of a little bit weird. Not super weird or creepy (many of those kind of men like me…which is not fun for me). But the kind of guys who are nerdy or uncool. And I’ve reasoned that I just don’t like “normal.” And that’s partly true.

    But the real truth is that I probably think I can “fix” them. On some level, I probably like feeling that I am more attractive than they are, and that gives me security (it really doesn’t). That, and don’t give myself a chance with high-quality guys. I assume they are out of my reach.

    That’s because my self concept is of being someone who is not very attractive. I see middling-to-average men and I see them as being on the same “level” as me (attractiveness wise). When the truth is that they probably see me as being much more attractive. Or at least that is what they tell me. I am not just speculating, here. This is based off actual things that people have said to me.

    So my big “aha” was that I am selling myself short. With money an with relationships. I’m shooting always for the lowest common denominator. I’m not askimg for the best, so I’m not getting the best. I may whine about not getting it. I might feel that “the best” is something I deserve. But I’m not necessarily “asking” for it. I’m not sure I exactky know how…


  385.  #386Tereana on June 26, 2015 at 9:29 pm

    There is a guy I like right now. I consider him to be very attractive. I fantasize about him. But he’s younger than me. And even though we’ve been spending some time together, and I’m enjoying it, I’m not sure if I feel lots of chemistry. But I do when there is some distance. Like when he’s dancung in my class. Or when I’m just thinking about him.

    Up close, he seems almost boring. But I still like him, and keep waiting for him to make a move. Probably best he hasn’t yet. But I see good things about him. I like him.

    I just wonder if – like so many men who are attracted to me as well – I like some men more as a fantasy, not as someone to actually live my life with….hmm….

  386.  #387Zara on June 27, 2015 at 5:48 am

    Lovergirl 282 *****I do feel he makes excuses to see and talk to me. He always has and it felt flattering because I knew it was really that he wanted my time and attention.****


    What follows is only according to what I read in your post. Keep in mind, I might misread words, and on top of it, even when I read the proper word, I might misunderstand how the structure put all the words together, and on the top of the top of it, my own projection of the world will filter what I read. So take any post of mine with of pinch of salt.

    So here goes:

    A good healthy man does not make excuses to see and talk to me. His excuses are not about him asking for help. He does not put me to work.
    A good man offers occasions to do things for me. He calls to propose his help. He wants to work for me. He offers good feeling dates.
    S calling to make YOU work is a turn off. It is my world upside down and it feels bad to read.

    Yet I see you blossoming at your own pace.

    You married a man who let you work to pay off his studies.
    =>And a few years later, you divorced.

    You have been sleeping with S who felt inspired to put you to work rather than feeling inspired to cherish and protect you. (That episode about the car tire changed, is the least a man can do for ANY friend, you are worth that basic attention and so much more).
    => And a year later, you put a brake on the relationship and you are doing your best to build up your own boundaries.

    You have dated Chicago who wanted YOU to make him feel pampered.
    => And a few weeks later, you felt clear you want to put the brake on that too. And you did.

    Through these 3 episodes of your life I have read in your posts, I see that the time you take to feel your feelings, is getting shorter at each encounter you experience.
    It feels good to observe that your soul is connecting faster and faster to your body and that you become quicker in hearing your body wanting to walk away from a bad feeling situation.

    I feel trustful you are close to reaching your heart and hear her true desire.


  387.  #388Zara on June 27, 2015 at 5:58 am

    Lovergirl 282. *****I think S is wonderful and perfect for me. There is nothing that bothers me about who he is. The only thing that bothers me is not having the assurance of being #1 in his life. THAT is important to me. It wasn’t a big deal when he was pretty much giving me that anyway, but once he freaked out and decided to date other women then it changed for me. I’m not okay with that. Just sex, okay. Dating- no.

    I do feel he makes excuses to see and talk to me. He always has and it felt flattering because I knew it was really that he wanted my time and attention.

    If S wanted to continue as we were before- no emotional relationships or “dating” other women, just me, I would be totally happy! I’d be okay being a friend with benefits as that is what we started out as but I can’t do it if there is any other woman in the picture emotionally or if he is TRYING to get another woman in that position. So THAT is what I am trying to protect myself from.*****

    “Firends with benefits” does mean the door is opened for other important women in HIS picture. (As well as it is opened for other men in yours).

    One example among others, the man loves a special woman and for some any possible reasons (among which, she does not love him and keeps looking for her Mr. Right), he feels unsafe within his love for her, so he keeps a close sexual friendship with you. Like a comfort blanket for his soul who feels not good enough for the other woman his soul really desires.

    Another example, the man dates a woman and for some any possible reasons he does not feel her good enough to enhance his life, even if he loves sharing time with her and he trusts her. So he keeps other close sexual friendships, hoping that between all the female sexual friendships, the feeling of lack in his soul will be soothed away.

    “Friends with benefits” implies no romantic feelings, and an agreement to being sexual together without expectations of romantic faithfulness. Without expectations to feel number one.
    It implies he can date his heart out while coming back in bed with you to charge his battery back up after each disappointing date. You were being the good friend who holds his hand while he walks through the mine field of dating, trying to find the woman who will make him feel safe enough to let your hand go and honor her hand only and only hers.

    Even S will stop s*xing around once his soul will be longing for a specific woman. When his energy will be 100% into one specific woman and this woman makes him feel safe giving his all to her, he won’t have even 1% energy left to give to a comfort blanket.
    OK, let’s not be rude , let’s rephrase that.
    He won’t have even 1% energy left to give to a “friend with benefit”

    And this is without even speaking of that special woman who might tell him to cut contact with all his comfort blankets. A man in love does cut contact. I don’t need to tell him to put the focus on me. He IS 100% focused on me, and he forgets about his “friends with benefits” the minute he feels inspired to love me. That’s why I keep dating him. I can’t feel my worth when I date a man who is busy giving energy to other women. It’s a case of ending feeling depleted. Where’s is gone all my energy put into dating him? When is all that energy feeding back into me?

    Wether it is as lovers, f*ckers, friends, friends with benefits, spouses, boy-friends, dates… This is knit picking. The quality of the energy exchange is what matters to me. What do I want to feel?

    You want him to keep sleeping around as long as he does not “date”.
    In my world, that he “only” sleeps with others without dating them, still means his energy is not 100% into me. He has got enough energy left to invest on other comfort blankets because his soul is in love with NONE of us all. We all are his friends with benefit. I still don’t get to feel worshiped.
    Which is fair enough in your case where you are the one who claims she wants to be a friend with benefit.

    You can’t claim you want a friendship with benefit situation and at the same time demand his heart be invested in you only. If you don’t want him to date anybody else, then you want him to be your exclusive boy-friend or your non official fiancé (or whatever it is called according to different cultures).

    Why not? What if what your soul deeply desired was a boy-friend who worships you and has no energy left for any other woman? A man whose energy invested in your best interest gives you space to feel your own worth? What is wrong with that? Feeling loved and cherished does not imply you have to become legally married again. Take it easy. Breath. What does your soul want? What feelings about yourself do you want to feel?

    Who the man is does not matter. What matters is the energy in which you feel your worth.


  388.  #389Indigo on June 27, 2015 at 6:50 am

    There were two things on the blog today that really jumped out at me and were worthwhile to me.

    The first is Beloved who said in # 373: “I realized I had shut it down SO hard with an ex because any time he felt teased, it brought up his rape trauma and his whole childhood trauma and he would dump all of that on me. I thought it was because of me, instead of just seeing it as a bad situation and leaving.”

    This brought back memories of D, who most definitely had some major trauma in his past, and would use any event in which he felt triggered, however innocent, to dump all his anger and pain on me. I also thought I had caused it, instead of just seeing it as a bad situation and leaving.

    The second was Zara when she said in #387: “One example among others, the man loves a special woman and for some any possible reasons (among which, she does not love him and keeps looking for her Mr. Right), he feels unsafe within his love for her, so he keeps a close sexual friendship with you. Like a comfort blanket for his soul who feels not good enough for the other woman his soul really desires.”

    I realise I am the man in this scenario. I keep close friendships which are not on the road to being my forever relationship, and I give to them romantically, as a comfort blanket because I feel not good enough for the man my soul really desires.

  389.  #390Dixie on June 27, 2015 at 6:50 am

    (Zara + Lovergirl)

    Zara – I am so glad you posted this response to Lovergirl. It resonates so much with me at this very moment….

    Lovergirl – as so many sirens here have mentioned, we see aspects of our current/past relationships in your journey with yourself. For me, I can feel the threads of D.’s affection loosely around me, but not as certain as sure as they once were. And, I’ve not mentioned this on the blog because it felt way too painful and confusing, but he’s been in touch with a former lover, who is still his friend. This is a huge, massive, trigger for me, and in the past, these situations have left me feeling suckerpunched and reeling and quite literally, physically sick.

    Hence, the decision to now just let the threads fall where they will, and the excitement about Portugal.

    I know D. is on the fence, and the emotional connection feels like its dwindled. In the past, I would thought of ways to bring him back, bring him closer, but now?

    No. He can come back if he wants, but to tell the truth, for the first time, MY heart feels unsure about HIM. So like you, I’m letting more men in my life, in all capacities.

    Lovergirl, I don’t know if this is helpful, but it was for me: I’ve been visualizing the relationship I want, what it feels like, what it looks like, and all the delicious details. And yes, it is exactly what I experienced with D., in the past – a true romantic and sexual partnership, a creative force where I felt I could truly fly and be all that I could, because I felt the strength of his love and passion. And I STILL want that type of relationship. I don’t know if it will be with D., but at least I will recognize that feeling again when it happens 🙂


  390.  #391Sangelina on June 27, 2015 at 7:00 am

    “Who the man is does not matter. What matters is the energy in which you feel your worth”.

    So well said!!

    Lovergirl, I do admire your going out on dates and trying to stick with your boundaries with S, despite your heartache.

    However, I’m still having a hard time understanding why you feel S is perfect for you. I believe it’s EMK who said that the biggest flaw a man has is giving up the chance to be with us. So, the biggest flaw S has is not wanting a relationship with you and that alone makes him not perfect for you. Let’s imagine a hypothetical situation where S calls you up and says I will be your boyfriend. Will you feel emotionally safe enough knowing that he as “disowned” you several times, will you feel safe enough not to feel the need to constantly check on him online, will that possible relationship be truly fulfilling knowing the hard work it took on your path to get it? Sometimes, it’s just best to start off on a clean slate with someone else.

  391.  #392Lovergirl on June 27, 2015 at 7:20 am

    I am busy right now so cant type much but I want to quick point out that these men are not treating me badly before people go to crazy with the assumptions.

    Zara, my ex husband worked full time and I was a stay at home mom, I wasn’t supporting him. Chicago spent tons of money on me and even flew me to Chicago. S has always taken me out and spent money on me, virtually every time we are together. I was working for him so asking me to do things was acceptable.

    I feel irritated with the assumptions being made about my relationship with S because they are not even close to being true. He treats me much better than the women on this blog are insinuating.

  392.  #393Zara on June 27, 2015 at 7:20 am


    I felt moved reading the end of your text for S. It said “I don’t want anything else than your best”.
    It felt inspiring, like wanting to reach out to the best in me and to nourish my soul with it. I felt myself glowing with love.

    I’d like to share back some of that glowing energy you sent my way with these words.
    Stand in front of a mirror and speak to your reflection your own words. 🙂
    “I don’t want anything else than your best”.
    What do you hear your reflection saying to you?


  393.  #394Kim on June 27, 2015 at 7:49 am

    391 Lovergirl. Feels bad to read, ‘The women on this blog’ are going by the information you give them, which is basically your musings about why an uncommitted man is the perfect man for you, and periodically how upset you feel when he dates other women. Or you don’t hear from him.
    As if it is that surprising, seeing that he has zero investment.
    It doesn’t matter whether a man feels jealous, or pays for dinners out (big deal). He is possessive over your body but not your soul, he is not committed and doesn’t want a relationship with you at this time, maybe ever, maybe with no one. I still have exes being jealous when they see pics of me with another man. That doesn’t mean they are sitting at home trying to work out how to capture me, it is just how some men feel…and it means: nothing.
    MrP once ran out of my house when he saw me receiving an innocent text from another man. Whoa, I thought: he loves me. No, he was just possessive and behaving like a child that had his toy taken away. That did not make him go down on one knee or deal with his issues in order to have a relationship. It’s just how he felt in the moment.
    Zara’s posts to you are so wonderful. And so full of truth.
    Who cares how well a man treats us – if we are stuck on him and he is unable to give us what we want, it is going to be an ongoing misery. The only thing that matters is that he wants what we want..and cherishes and loves us. It all has to work together.
    The women on this blog care about you, I feel surprised that this is not noted and that no effort is made to understand the valuable words they offer to you. You don’t need to ‘defend’ these men. We are not judging them. They just do what they do. We are responsible NOT for what they do or don’t do, or interpreting it in any which way we want to interpret it, we are responsible for ourselves and removing ourselves from situations that don’t suit us. That’s all these women are saying.
    If you are happy with the situation, cool, but slagging off men you date for not being S, and the women on this blog for never understanding your situation, when they are trying their best to help, just feels awful to read…truly.

  394.  #395Indigo on June 27, 2015 at 8:33 am


    What Kim says in 393 is true, really.

    D treated me very well in many ways – he was always showering me with money and little gifts and doing little helpful things for me. He was very affectionate and cuddley and kissy, but it was all on his terms, all what he wanted to do. Yes it felt great in the moment, and confused me for years, but in the end it is a long lonely road to heartbreak if he doesn’t want YOU. Back when D and I first started dating I knew he adored me, and certainly he’s always been jealous of other possible men in my life. But I knew even back then that he was ambivalent at best about a long term relationship. So all the lovely treatment in the end meant nothing – or shall I say, we had a lot of fun, but it brought me to the place I am now. Which is without him, because he doesn’t want a relationship – meaning, he doesn’t truly want to make any woman in his life #1. We maybe could have carried on for years having a friends-with-benefits type relationship, me knowing he had deep feelings for me, yet our relationship going nowhere. Me never knowing where I stood. No future in sight because it’s not what he wants at this time, maybe ever. Next to this, all the little gifts and dinners and cuddles paled in comparison. If I am honest they started to feel meaningless for me, as if I was receiving them from a friend.

    You’ve talked about your outbursts with S before – well, this is what was happening to me. The insecurity of not being #1, and not knowing if I would ever be #1, was driving me insane. Men like this are not bad guys, but they are selfish. They want what they want when they want it, and when they don’t want it, it must go away. In many ways it’s simply low self-esteem which causes us to accept this. It’s really got nothing to do with them being bad guys. It’s the internal conflict inside ourselves which we cannot resolve which is the problem.

    I now know how I want to feel, and what kind of man I want. And it really is very far from D, for the simple reason that I don’t want a man who is purely selfish. I want one who prioritises me. Who makes me feel important because I AM important to him. Wow, that would feel so good after all this time of guessing and wondering.

  395.  #396Zara on June 27, 2015 at 9:46 am

    Hmmm, I feel lovergirl’s irritation. I did not mean to wake up her frustration.
    I don’t know what I feel about it.
    I feel I “should” feel sorry, but I don’t.
    Like, I shared my coloured picture of lovergirl’s posts and I don’t feel sorry for sharing my coloured picture. Lovergirl is asking this blog to colour her words with each our personal filter. And so, I did.
    On the other hand, I feel bad that she is feeling bad reading the posts.
    Although she does not say she is feeling bad. She says she is feeling irritated. I make the “crazy assumption” she feels bad, but I don’t know.
    May be she feels good feeling irritated. May be feeling irritated is her “safe home feeling”.
    I don’t know.
    Who knows what, anyway?


  396.  #397Zara on June 27, 2015 at 9:50 am

    Lovergirl. ***** Zara, my ex husband worked full time and I was a stay at home mom, I wasn’t supporting him. *****

    The following is copied from one of your posts in the thread “controlling is not where it is at”: lovergirl said =>I’m sooo leery of being used for money though. I saw way too much of it growing up- men who were essentially gold diggers, exploiting women and using them to buy them stuff. Then my ex husband, I felt sorry for him and his lack of money when we first started dating (in college) and so I frequently footed the bill for things. I even paid for my own engagement ring.
    Never, ever again! Even though he worked and I was a stay at home mom during most of our marriage, he never really got it together financially and left us struggling and under so much stress, despite his Masters degree. Ugh.”A good healthy man does not make excuses to see and talk to me. His excuses are not about him asking for help. He does not put me to work.
    A good man offers occasions to do things for me. He calls to propose his help. He wants to work for me. He offers good feeling dates.
    S calling to make YOU work is a turn off. It is my world upside down and it feels bad to read. *****

    And, again, I don’t say a word about money in my quote here. (A good man will give money out of his good heart if money is the only solution to a situation, and he does not dream of making the love of his life work for it )
    My point is about the energy coming at you from this man. It seems to be about making you work, having you doing things for him. Making you go to HIS house. Versus a good man inspired to visit your home (children or not children), inspired to give it all to you in an energetical way: repairing your home (with no money exchange, it kills the romantic vibe), visiting your home with his hands full of food and flowers and toys and being a good company for your children and what not.

    On this blog I call a “good” man, a man who meets the needs for the woman who longs to feel cherished. It is not a judgment on the men who do not cherish her. As I said before, S is just doing what works best for him. There is no malice in his blindness to your heartache. You are just not on the same page. He will some day cherish a woman and so he will be the “good” man (for her).

    It is about my needs, without judging the millions men who won’t ever fill my needs. It takes only one. That is the one I call a “good” man. (For me)
    And as a guide to follow the tracks leading to my needs being met, I call the right man a “healthy man”. Of course who is not healthy for me might be healthy for another woman. This world is wonderfully relative. Everything is true and everything is false. It all depends of what makes me feel good.

    ***** I feel irritated with the assumptions being made about my relationship with S because they are not even close to being true. He treats me much better than the women on this blog are insinuating.*****

    So, if I , one of the “women on this blog”, got it all wrong and S is the good healthy man that meets your needs, and you feel worthy, and you feel in love with yourself, and you feel number one in S’ life, and you feel cherished and safe in your feelings, and you feel peaceful, then I offer my apologies for reading in your posts that you feel anxious because your need to feel number 1 is not met.


  397.  #398Zara on June 27, 2015 at 9:55 am

    I don’t understand my last post!
    It is mixed up with a previous post.
    I am going to write my last post again.

  398.  #399Zara on June 27, 2015 at 9:56 am

    Lovergirl. ***** Zara, my ex husband worked full time and I was a stay at home mom, I wasn’t supporting him. *****

    The following is copied from one of your posts in the thread “controlling is not where it is at”: lovergirl said =>I’m sooo leery of being used for money though. I saw way too much of it growing up- men who were essentially gold diggers, exploiting women and using them to buy them stuff. Then my ex husband, I felt sorry for him and his lack of money when we first started dating (in college) and so I frequently footed the bill for things. I even paid for my own engagement ring.
    Never, ever again! Even though he worked and I was a stay at home mom during most of our marriage, he never really got it together financially and left us struggling and under so much stress, despite his Masters degree. Ugh.”A good healthy man does not make excuses to see and talk to me. His excuses are not about him asking for help. He does not put me to work.
    A good man offers occasions to do things for me. He calls to propose his help. He wants to work for me. He offers good feeling dates.
    S calling to make YOU work is a turn off. It is my world upside down and it feels bad to read. *****

    And, again, I don’t say a word about money in my quote here. (A good man will give money out of his good heart if money is the only solution to a situation, and he does not dream of making the love of his life work for it )
    My point is about the energy coming at you from this man. It seems to be about making you work, having you doing things for him. Making you go to HIS house. Versus a good man inspired to visit your home (children or not children), inspired to give it all to you in an energetical way: repairing your home (with no money exchange, it kills the romantic vibe), visiting your home with his hands full of food and flowers and toys and being a good company for your children and what not.

    On this blog I call a “good” man, a man who meets the needs for the woman who longs to feel cherished. It is not a judgment on the men who do not cherish her. As I said before, S is just doing what works best for him. There is no malice in his blindness to your heartache. You are just not on the same page. He will some day cherish a woman and so he will be the “good” man (for her).

    It is about my needs, without judging the millions men who won’t ever fill my needs. It takes only one. That is the one I call a “good” man. (For me)
    And as a guide to follow the tracks leading to my needs being met, I call the right man a “healthy man”. Of course who is not healthy for me might be healthy for another woman. This world is wonderfully relative. Everything is true and everything is false. It all depends of what makes me feel good.

    ***** I feel irritated with the assumptions being made about my relationship with S because they are not even close to being true. He treats me much better than the women on this blog are insinuating.*****

    So, if I , one of the “women on this blog”, got it all wrong and S is the good healthy man that meets your needs, and you feel worthy, and you feel in love with yourself, and you feel number one in S’ life, and you feel cherished and safe in your feelings, and you feel peaceful, then I offer my apologies for reading in your posts that you feel anxious because your need to feel number 1 is not met.


  399.  #400Zara on June 27, 2015 at 9:58 am


    It seems to keep posting together two parts of two different posts.


  400.  #401Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:02 am

    Lovergirl. ***** Zara, my ex husband worked full time and I was a stay at home mom, I wasn’t supporting him. *****

    The following is copied from one of your posts in the thread “controlling is not where it is at”: lovergirl said =>I’m sooo leery of being used for money though. I saw way too much of it growing up- men who were essentially gold diggers, exploiting women and using them to buy them stuff. Then my ex husband, I felt sorry for him and his lack of money when we first started dating (in college) and so I frequently footed the bill for things. I even paid for my own engagement ring.
    Never, ever again! Even though he worked and I was a stay at home mom during most of our marriage, he never really got it together financially and left us struggling and under so much stress, despite his Masters degree. Ugh.”A good healthy man does not make excuses to see and talk to me. His excuses are not about him asking for help. He does not put me to work.
    A good man offers occasions to do things for me. He calls to propose his help. He wants to work for me. He offers good feeling dates.
    S calling to make YOU work is a turn off. It is my world upside down and it feels bad to read. <=

    Again, I don't say a word about money in my quote here. (A good man will give money out of his good heart if money is the only solution to a situation, and he does not dream of making the love of his life work for it )
    My point is about the energy coming at you from this man. It seems to be about making you work, having you doing things for him. Making you go to HIS house. Versus a good man inspired to visit your home (children or not children), inspired to give it all to you in an energetical way: repairing your home (with no money exchange, it kills the romantic vibe), visiting your home with his hands full of food and flowers and toys and being a good company for your children and what not.

    On this blog I call a "good" man, a man who meets the needs for the woman who longs to feel cherished. It is not a judgment on the men who do not cherish her. As I said before, S is just doing what works best for him. There is no malice in his blindness to your heartache. You are just not on the same page. He will some day cherish a woman and so he will be a "good" man (for her).

    It is about my needs, without judging the millions men who won't ever fill my needs. It takes only one. That is the one I call a "good" man. (For me)
    And as a guide to follow the tracks leading to my needs being met, I call the right man a "healthy man". Of course who is not healthy for me might be healthy for another woman. This world is wonderfully relative. Everything is true and everything is false. It all depends of what makes me feel good.

    ***** I feel irritated with the assumptions being made about my relationship with S because they are not even close to being true. He treats me much better than the women on this blog are insinuating.*****

    So, if I , one of the "women on this blog", got it all wrong and S is the good healthy man that meets your needs, and you feel worthy, and you feel in love with yourself, and you feel number one in S' life, and you feel cherished and safe in your feelings, and you feel peaceful, then I offer my apologies for reading in your posts that you feel anxious because your need to feel number 1 is not met.


  401.  #402Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:07 am

    I give up 🙂
    I have changed from safari to puffin browser and the same glitch is happening. I can’t paste my long post, it comes out all mixed up and some parts are missing.


  402.  #403Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:10 am

    Lovergirl. ***** Zara, my ex husband worked full time and I was a stay at home mom, I wasn’t supporting him. *****

    The following is copied from one of your posts in the thread “controlling is not where it is at”:

    lovergirl said =>I’m sooo leery of being used for money though. I saw way too much of it growing up- men who were essentially gold diggers, exploiting women and using them to buy them stuff. Then my ex husband, I felt sorry for him and his lack of money when we first started dating (in college) and so I frequently footed the bill for things. I even paid for my own engagement ring.
    Never, ever again! Even though he worked and I was a stay at home mom during most of our marriage, he never really got it together financially and left us struggling and under so much stress, despite his Masters degree. Ugh.<=

    This is where I interpreted that without your money, this relationship would have not gone as far as getting engaged.
    There is another couple of posts where I got the same "crazy" impression but I can't bother finding them just right now 🙂


  403.  #404Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:11 am

    ***** Chicago spent tons of money on me and even flew me to Chicago. *****

    I know, I have read your posts about Chicago.
    And my posts about Chicago does not say a word about him spending money or not. His spending money is not my point around your experience with Chicago. (The experience I project through your written words)
    Please, reread the previous posts you and I wrote about you not feeling liked by Chicago and you feeling he was trying to make you work at making him feel pampered.


  404.  #405Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:12 am

    ***** S has always taken me out and spent money on me, virtually every time we are together. *****

    I know, I have read your posts about S.
    My posts about S does not say a word about wether dating you was costing S money or not. His spending money is not my point regarding your experience with S. (the experience I project through your written words).


  405.  #406Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:13 am

    ****** I was working for him so asking me to do things was acceptable*****

    I know you were working for him in exchange of money. That’s the work I am referring to, when I say:

    =>”A good healthy man does not make excuses to see and talk to me. His excuses are not about him asking for help. He does not put me to work.
    A good man offers occasions to do things for me. He calls to propose his help. He wants to work for me. He offers good feeling dates.
    S calling to make YOU work is a turn off. It is my world upside down and it feels bad to read”<=

    And, again, I don't say a word about money in my quote here. (A good man will give money out of his good heart if money is the only solution to a situation, and he does not dream of making the love of his life work for it )

    My point is about the energy coming at you from this man. It seems to be about making you work, having you doing things for him. Making you go to HIS house. Versus a good man inspired to visit your home (children or not children), inspired to give it all to you in an energetical way: repairing your home (with no money exchange, it kills the romantic vibe), visiting your home with his hands full of food and flowers and toys and being a good company for your children and what not.

  406.  #407Zara on June 27, 2015 at 10:14 am

    On this blog I call a “good” man, a man who meets the needs for the woman who longs to feel cherished. It is not a judgment on the men who do not cherish her. As I said before, S is just doing what works best for him. There is no malice in his blindness to your heartache. You are just not on the same page. He will some day cherish a woman and so he w