How To Move On From A Broken Engagement

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Here’s a heartbreaking letter from Leslie, who’s suffering the surprise and sudden end of her 6 year relationship:

“Rori, I thought I was in a wonderful relationship with a man I have been with off and on for 6 years. He had given my an engagement ring and we planned to get married next June. We just had a HUGE blow-up and he called it all off.

He says he has “tried” and just doesn’t feel “chemistry” with me and never has. I have been “fooled” by his frequent calls, e-cards, trips to see him, and him telling me he loves me. I love him and felt “chemistry.”

Why couldn’t I see through it all? I am hurting and I want to be strong, but it’s hard. I am a “nice” person, probably too nice. I can see that I have done lots wrong. I was living my dream, not his. Why did he deceive me? Also, what can I do about not drowning in my sorrow? I can’t meet men and I do not want to get on a dating service and meet men who just aren’t interested in a real relationship. I am going to study your e-book now. Thanks, Leslie”

Here’s my answer:

This is a situation so many women have found themselves in – with a man for so long, finally getting the engagement ring and the wedding date, and then having it called off with the reason – “I never felt it for you.”

And Leslie is asking herself every minute of every day why she didn’t see it coming, and what she could possibly have done to cause him “not to feel it for her.”

I can’t know what’s going on in her man’s mind – so I’m going to guess – He didn’t marry her after a year in the relationship because he “wasn’t sure” – and then he just thought she was the greatest – “nice,” good to him, sexy, and so he didn’t want to let her go.  So he held on.  For 6 years.  Until, finally, he couldn’t say no to her anymore, so he signed up for marriage.

Then – a fight gave him the excuse he needed, and although he didn’t want to let her go, he made the choice to do so rather than marry her.

And – though it’s hard to know what kind of Red Flags he might have been waving during the 6 years  (the number one Red Flag being taking him so long to ask her to marry him) – it might have been IMPOSSIBLE for Linda to see them, because the level of emotional connection cannot have been deep enough for her to FEEL it.

The first question to ask is about the “big blowup.” If continual “blowups” are the main way anger gets resolved in your relationship – then your communication is not helping you.

No matter how bad a “fight” is, though – it would never break a relationship unless it was already nearly over.

And attempting to “avoid” fights by always deferring to him, or stuffing your feelings, or never, ever speaking up on your own behalf – will push a man away even FASTER than a fight will.

The way to go here, and what you can learn, Leslie, by – yes – DATING men (even men who aren’t serious about a relationship so that you can PRACTICE working with my Tools with them), is how to EXPRESS your anger, fear, distress, upset and pain in an emotional way that will actually BRING a man CLOSER – instead of making him want to run away.

Learning how to communicate in this way ALL the time will absolutely INSURE that your relationship will get deeper and stronger instead of just fizzle out the way yours did.

My heart goes out to you – and I hope you will start dating, just for the experience, and let me know how you’re doing.

Love, Rori

29 Comments

  1.  #1Daria on December 26, 2008 at 12:32 am

    I feel a little awkward and out of place and I would like some clarity on this… excerpt from another site on how to get a man:

    How Understanding His Story Can Open His Heart

    Paradoxically, the simplicity of male experience makes it easy for a woman to connect intensely with a man… when she understands how to engage his never-ending, internal saga.

    To engage his internal saga, think of every experience as leading to, and meaningful only in the sense that it leads to, a trophy or a scar– that is, some physical, material proof of impact on or interaction with the world. His life is a quest for the next milestone– to engage his passion, get him talking about the details of what he needs to do to get to his next milestone.

    He wants ever greater physical pleasure; freedom to pursue ever greater pleasure; and concrete achievements that give him prestige and financial success, because these things in turn give him power over and safety from other men. Help him figure out exactly how to get these things—exactly, in a step-by-step way–, and he will show you and share with you the passion he is afraid to share with other women.

    Note that he’ll likely be evasive on this topic, at first. This is largely because men tend to doubt that women will take seriously the rigors and perils of his quest, let alone the exertion required. They suspect that women will want to talk about the feelings involved… which, to a man, misses the point, and ultimately disrespects the difficulty and challenge of what he needs to do.

    To truly distinguish herself, and to get a man to truly open up, a woman should get a man talking about his next milestone, and then discuss with him– carefully, dispassionately, and precisely, rather than with cheerleading and indiscriminate approval– the exact tactics, strategy, and details of performance he will need to solve the problem of achieving that one specific concrete goal.

    Note that your tone is very important; be as serious as a surgeon– remember that for him, his wins and losses are serious, serious business. Cheerleading him– putting on a big smile and saying, “You can do it!”– will probably discourage him from discussing the details of his challenge in a meaningful way with you. Present yourself not as his cheerleader, but as his coach.

    Explore with him the technical details and workplace battles he needs to fight and win in order to achieve his goal, and you will begin to seem like a much more important part of his one eternal story.
    *****************************************************

    ok so is this total BS? or what? I remember feeling really engaged by this before I found and delved into Rori’s stuff…

    is this flat out wrong? What do you guys think/feel? Somehow it feels convincing… yet it also seems to go totally against what we have been learning and practicing…



  2.  #2alias girl on December 26, 2008 at 1:53 am

    i personally am not that attracted to it. it does not resonate with who i want to be in relation to the man in my life. i am not his one dimensional strategizer/coach who speaks in a serious tone about his manly quest.

    we are all on quests. being half man myself i relate to the secrecy or withholding of divulging my quest unless the person feels safe and onboard with what i am trying to do with my life. but also being half man i would NOT want my feminine counterpart to be in fact masculine. if that made any sense.

    i know i am female. but if i were male i would not want my complimentary partner to be a male strategizer and coach.

    it just sounds not right to me. of course we play all sorts of roles with our partners lover, sister, mother, defender, yes cheerleader, yes co-strategizer, daughter etc etc.

    honestly it doesn’t resonate with me. i have no inclination to check out more of that woman’s work. it may have it’s validity but it’s not where i am at in my life nor does it sound like the type of partner i want to be with a man.



  3.  #3alias girl on December 26, 2008 at 1:59 am

    on the other hand i do believe her description of men and their quest etc is accurate. i am just not looking to be what she suggests. i am a female. i am the feeling entity. that is what is most natural to me. i can discuss his dreams and quest without getting emotionally entangled or flippantly being like yae! go! if i am not truly connecting with him what is the point. i am the entryway to heaven for man. i do not need to step by step strategize his next lion kill with him. gag me. and then discuss football stats next? ick.



  4.  #4Caj13 on December 26, 2008 at 5:34 am

    I think the author’s premise about being “technical support” is well taken, but this should not be confused with a strategy for attracting a man. First, this male way of envisaging dreams and goals is completely alien to most women (and probably seems so obvious or limited, it’s like “so what? let’s get to what’s really important in life, like what’s deep inside you”, but as Rori reminds us “men are simple” – what you see is what you get). Knowledge is power, so it’s good to realize what’s going on with men in this area.

    I think this advice is especially important once you’re into the relationship a bit, when you’re confronted with how to respond appropriately to his sharing what to him are secrets or at least very precious personal aspects of his life (proof that you’re already special to him). In the early stages if the guy says anything along these lines, it should just help to recognize that it’s something quite important to him and should not be fluffed off or cheer-led (maybe just say something that validates its seriousness and change the subject if you’re not ready to go there yet).

    What to retain? Women are good listeners, so do keep that up but change what we listen for – the actual object and its challenges. We are natural givers and supporters, so this is precious to find out that cheerleading and a big warm smile will not do. A man doesn’t like to receive, but he will take expert advice, and good men realize and appreciate that a woman’s perspective is a valuable asset. So no “mothering”, but don’t be afraid that you’ll be “telling him what to do” if you give him your informed opinion and talk about the subject at hand with pertinence. This all reminds me of exchanges with a special someone going into a new business. He was seeking input from me, and I realize now how my ‘encouragements’ fell flat (I felt it at the time, but in my ignorance kept repeating the wrong approach, for want of anything better). I was actually struggling to give him pep-talks (which I didn’t know how to do), and shying away from sharing with him what I did know, which was what he needed from a female consumer. No need to become a real expert and bore yourself with a deep technical understanding of his passion.

    I really like this author’s how-to for these situations. Given their importance to a man’s self-image and love of himself, it tells us how we can ALSO USE OUR BRAIN with him – that is to say, when dealing with HIS agenda. WE USE OUR HEARTS and feeling messages when we are treating OUR agenda. So I see no contradiction with Rori’s approach, just a way of ‘helping’ a man in a way he can appreciate and relate to, instead of our all-too common overfunctioning, ‘giving to/pushing him away’ habits (of course, we’re getting over this now). And for me, it’s great to see how there IS a place for our thinking selves in a good relationship.



  5.  #5Caj13 on December 26, 2008 at 5:41 am

    PS The guy in the new business expressed his frustration and stopped talking to me about it, or much of anything else either. Needless to say, I was miffed that my “support” meant so little to him, and felt even more clueless when (over)analyzing why things just didn’t work out.



  6.  #6Reshi on December 26, 2008 at 10:20 am

    Daria, I too am turned off by the aspect of having to present myself as a guy’s “coach,” but there is some truth in it, it’s a huge turn-on to a guy to be with a woman who is his intellectual equal or superior–IF she can also be a girl. And I like the freedom of knowing that I CAN let my super genius side out in a relationship and not have to present myself as this 100% mysterious otherworldly creature too. I think the mistake is when we think that being intellectual is the way into a man’s heart. It can enhance a connection that already exists, but it can’t create a connection on his own. That’s my 2 cents anyway.



  7.  #7Daria on December 26, 2008 at 10:43 am

    Hi you guys! Thank you so much for your comments… it’s awesome to see what you guys write! Caj I loved it how you were able to look at it as not contradicting Rori’s work… I wonder what Rori would say about this… to me it sounds like overfunctioning and being in his business, yet it seems so reasonable it would work…



  8.  #8Daria on December 26, 2008 at 12:14 pm

    Riffing…

    I feel so ANGRY! I feel furious. I feel disgusted with myself. I feel ashamed of myself. I was just in this situation where someone (a woman) was rude to me and I didn’t defend myself. Now sometimes I would shrug this off and this is really one of those times when all arrows are pointing toward shrugging it off… but I’m not! A part of me feels really angry at myself for not standing up for myself! I love that part of myself! And part of me feels so disappointed that I “did this again” that is not standing up for myself! I hate myself! I feel unworthy to live or receive love! I think I gave myself the flu because of this! I feel so torn and this has been going on for the past 2 days. I feel gross. I want to love myself and I know a part of me loves myself. A part of me feels really angry and wants to punish myself and humiliate myself more. And I love that part of me too. I feel I really let myself down! I don’t deserve all the love I am giving myself! And that is ok… I love myself anyway. I love the part of me that let me down. I love that I am a coward. I love that I feel disgusted with myself. I can’t stand being a coward. That is not true. I Can stand it because I am still standing here. I hate myself. I worry that I am not who I claim and want to be. I really want to be punished. I feel so ashamed. And I want to feel powerful and free and proud of myself. That would feel like bright eyes and relief. I feel ashamed and that feels like carrying a too heavy weight on my shoulders… I love my too heavy weight… I love that I feel like an embarassment… I love that I feel I am not good enough, that I am not as good as my God-sister because she can so easily stand up for herself… I feel gross. I wish I could throw myself into a pit and pick a new person to be me… I love myself anyway… even though I am rejecting myself and that feels like having the flu… I lovre my flu… I love my rejection… and that feels a little calmer… I love that I am replaying this situation over and over… I love that I don’t trust myself to stand up for myeslf in the future, that this is a sign that I am not doing well… I feel insulted and angry… I feel angry at that woman and want to do something to her say something to her back! And I love myself for that… I love my feeling of powerlessness, of less than… I love my self disgust… I want to be strong… I want to be able to be SURE that I am standing up for myself in Any situation… That would feel like my head held high, like laughter, like freedom, like a light breeze caressing my body… I don’t know how to be sure I am standing up for myself… Sometimes I give in to people to avoid conflict… I am really warrior natured and that part of me feels ashamed and outraged… I love my warrior part… I feel so bad I let it down… thank you for your imput… I love you… and I’m going to go on with feeling good now, and doing what makes me feel happy… so I can have more love and compassion to share with you and with the world… and I won’t abandon you… I embrace you… thank u… my warrior part wants to abandon the part of me that didn’t stand up for myself… It doesn’t want to share my body with it… it is disgusted by weakness… I love my shame… thank u shame… I love my rage at myself… thank you rage… and that feels like ripping in two… like abandonning myself… and I guess that’s ok? I feel confused… I hate myself and that’s ok… a part of me I know loves myself too and I love both those parts of myself… I feel like I have been spinning this around and around my head with no resolution… I love my unresolved rage… I feel so angry that I didn’t express my rage or my fear… I could have told the woman… I feel upset … I don’t like being talked to that way… and I don’t want to fight you, I feel scared to… but I will run you over with this car if you attack me! lol… that would have felt great… that would have felt like standing up for myself… I am a failure… I am a loser… I am not the strong and brave person I claim to be… How gross… I don’t deserve to be healthy… that’s why I have the flu… for some reason I know they are connected… I love myself even though I am a failure and a loser… I love my failure and loser parts, and also my strong warrior parts… I love myself… hey this is starting to feel a little freer… maybe my failure and loser parts are part of my stranger… yay! I feel recognition… I love my stranger even though she is a doormat… I love that she lets people run over her and tries to hide it by claiming she is “above” them… I love my self deceit… yay! I love myself… I know if I embrace all parts of myself that is where the good stuff is… that feels like smiling… I feel like smiling and yawning… yay… this feels so much better…. I love that I have a loser and doormat part of me! I Don’t know why but I love myself and them anyway! Thank you all parts of me… I am giving my loser doormat part a rose! Yay… she is sitting down with the rose… she is smiling… I feel disgust toward her and I want to love her anyway… she is eating the rose… she looks like a big happy 4 year old… weird… I feel like beating and kicking her for being weak and not standing up for herself… and that’s ok… I love myself… I want to love her too… I am going to give her a donut… she looks like she is kind of fat… she is grabbing at the donut… she’s smushing the donut on her face and laughing… she is so cute! I love my cute self… I still feel fear… I feel fear that I will embarass myself like this again, and make myself Literally sick with my feelings… My flu feels like it’s clearing up a little bit… that feels like head lifted, like focused eyes… I feel little twinges in my solar plexus of fear… I love the part of me that is scared of myself … I want my warrior part to love my loser part too… I want my warrior part to stand up FOR her, not let her be mistreated and Then berate her… and that is ok… I am asking my warrior part to stand up for her… she has come and is taking my fat donut eating 4 year old by the hand… they are going off into the distance and my warrior is waving… she looks strong and she is smiling… I feel relief… this feels so calming… I feel like sighing… I want to believe I can trust that I will take care of myself, and stand up for myself in the future, regardless of Who attacks me and How… I love my warrior self and my loser self… can you guys help me be more whole? they are in the stars… They are sending me a star kiss… that is so sweet… I am wonderful and this is cool, really cool… thank u me… I still feel a little worry that this will happen again, but that is ok… my warrior self is taking care of her little sister loser self now… she doesn’t want to berate her or hate her… she realizes that she is a little girl and she didn’t know how to do all the things warrior self does… that is soo cooool… it feels like smiling BIG… oh I feel so thankful for this… thank you me… thank you God… this is wonderful… I am so glad to not hate myself… it feels so comfortable, and it feels great to have someone there to stand up for me… and even though they had their times mixed up, that is ok… even though I’m not 100% sure that warrior self will come out at the right time, that is ok… I know I can love all of me and that’s cool… I feel good… I Feel safe… I feel ok having a 4 year old that is dumpy and fat and not standing up for herself… I love her even though I haven’t been fat I love me and her… her being a 4 year old makes it very easy to accept her… yaya… warrior self will protect her and raise her… and I can feel safe that she will learn to stand up for herself and defend herself… that feels like sighing relief… and THAT is NICE…



  9.  #9Rori Raye on December 26, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    Daria, Thank you for this gorgeous riff – I think so many of us identify with you in this situation, and loving ourselves is always the answer. Love, Rori



  10.  #10Rori Raye on December 26, 2008 at 12:45 pm

    Daria – about the post you gave us – where did you get it and who is the author? I’d love to read more of his or her stuff, since it resonated with you or pissed you off – and let you know what I think. Can you give me the name or link? Thanks, Rori



  11.  #11Daria on December 26, 2008 at 1:31 pm

    Hi Rori… Thank you for answering! The author is JD Fuentes, and my guess is that he is a man (at least that’s what I’ve always assumed).

    This is the link I got the excerpt from:

    http://www.emotionaldoorway.com/rtl_doorway_to_love.htm

    I also have his main Rousing the Lion e-book if you would like to read it (I got it a long time ago and it was a lot less pricy and it should be ok for me to send it to you since we are not selling it) and it has some very interesting stuff in there about men and women’s “power words” among other things… for example he says men would think in terms of “success, strength, position, control, etc.” so if you use those words you will be hypnotically tapping into their emotional brain. Now I’m not sure about that but it was defnitely interesting.



  12.  #12alias girl on December 26, 2008 at 2:23 pm

    also i think men are practical. if you are presenting yourself as his strategizing coach then he will utilize your services for his own gain. you may even become seemingly indispensable to him. but it is a man’s pragmatism and ambition that is driving that relationship. NOT his heart.

    in my opinion. the opinion of a woman who is NOT in a relationship. has practically zero men in my rotation and spent christmas alone. ya know? so for whatever it’s worth.



  13.  #13alias girl on December 26, 2008 at 2:36 pm

    yes daria thank you for that gorgeous riff. you really give me such courage. and reshi and caj 13 for your insightful thoughts on this interesting quote daria presented us with about men. and rori, the loving catalyst and caring dynamic presence for this phenomenal new conversation about how to be a fabulous woman in today’s world.i feel so grateful for this blog.this blog truly excites me. i love it when i see new posts or comments posted. and i just stop everything right where i am to devote my 100% focus to reading the words. they are like food for me and i feel very hungry for this food.



  14.  #14Daria on December 26, 2008 at 5:25 pm

    Alias Girl I so know what you mean about this being food… I am constantly checking this blog! It feels so wonderful to read anything new…

    Who wants to help me write my power speech? I do I do!
    Good ok..

    So heres how a convo would start when me and the guy I like happen to run into each other, usually because we are hanging out with a mutual friend or something…

    Him: Whatsup Dee?
    Me: Hi
    Him: How have you been?
    Me: I’ve been feeling ok… (SUCH BS !!! WHAT>? I GET SO STUCK TRYING TO LAUNCH INTO THIS:

    I HAVE NOT BEEN FEELING OK! I FEEL SO MAD! I FEEL SO DISAPPOINTED! I CAN’T BELIEVE YOU ARE GOING OUT WITH ANOTHER GIRL! I FEEL SO ANGRY! I FEEL BETRAYED! I FEEL LEFT! I THOUGHT YOU LOVED ME! I THOUGHT YOU WOULD WANT ME IN YOUR LIFE FOREVER!!! WHO ELSE CARES ABOUT YOU THE WAY I DO??? HONESTLY WHO??? I DON’T UNDERSTAND WHY YOU DON’T WANT TO BE WITH ME! I MISS YOU SO MUCH! I MISS YOUR VOICE AND YOUR APPRECIATION AND ATTENTION! IT’S THE ONLY THING THAT MAKES ME FEEL OK! I WANT YOU!!!! I WANT YOU!!! I WANT YOU!!!! AND EVEN IF WE WERE TO BE FRIENDS I WANT YOU TO CALL ME! I CAN’T BELIEVE YOU CAN JUST NOT CALL ME! I DON’T WANT TO BE CALLING YOU ALL THE TIME? IF YOU THINK ABOUT ME LIKE YOU SAY YOU DO WHY DON’T YOU CALL ME???? YOU KNOW HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO ME!!! AND I FEEL SO MAD THAT YOU HAVEN’T PAID ME BACK MY MONEY OR AT LEAST CALLED ME TO UPDATE ME ON THE SITUATION… YOU SAID YOU WOULDN’T LEAVE MY SIDE UNTIL YOU PAID ME! YOU SAID THAT GIRL WAS NOT YOUR GIRLFRIEND! WHAT DOES SHE HAVE THAT I DON’T??? I FEEL SO DESPERATE! I LOVE YOU SO MUCH!! DON’T YOU MISS THE TIMES WHEN WE HAD JUST MET WHEN WE WERE SO CLOSE? IT FELT SO GOOD AND HAPPY TO BE WITH EACH OTHER, AROUND EACH OTHER… I USED TO FEEL SO PROTECTED BY YOU, AND EVERYONE USED TO THINK THERE IS SOMETHING GOING ON BETWEEN US EVEN WHEN THERE WASN’T !! I MISS THAT SO MUCH! I WISH I HAD A MAGIC WAND SO I COULD BRING IT BACK! I WANT YOU TO LOVE ME!! I KNOW YOU LOVE ME BUT I WANT YOU TO WANT TO BE WITH ME, I WANT YOU TO CALL ME, I WANT TO BE YOUR FAVORITE GIRL AGAIN, YOUR SPECIAL GIRL… I SO MISS FEELING SPECIAL TO YOU… AND I FEEL GROSSED OUT THINKING ABOUT PLEADING WITH YOU THIS WAY AND THINKING ABOUT THE MISTAKES I MADE AND HOW I MAY HAVE PUSHED YOU AWAY… BUT HONESTLY I WANT YOU TO BE HAPPY… AND I WANT TO BE HAPPY TOO… I WANT US TO BE TOGETHER… I FEEL SO ATTACHED TO YOU… I DON’T WANT TO LEAVE YOU OUT MY LIFE… EVEN WHEN I DREAM OF YOU I AM COMFORTED… PLEASE HELP ME!

    ohhhhhhkaaaay…. now I have to flip that to feeling messages… I feel grossed out by it because it’s so desperate and needy… I feel sure it will push him away… and I don’t know how to start talking about it…



  15.  #15Daria on December 26, 2008 at 5:28 pm

    Honestly I feel like I need help with this one… I feel like there is something fundamentally wrong with my speech because it’s too desperate… but it’s the Truth… oops I didn’t post in the truth section… maybe after I turn it to feeling messages it will be better? What is attractive about that humiliating desperate message?



  16.  #16alias girl on December 26, 2008 at 7:21 pm

    great daria! great start! i don’t know how to write a speech but i know that ‘s a great start! (i also know that’s not the finished product of writing a speech as no that is probably not quite the leaning in vibe you want to put out there.;) )

    but great start!



  17.  #17Daria on December 26, 2008 at 7:35 pm

    Alias girl you ROCK! I feel so happy and smiling reading your feedback! I did post a tentative feeling version on the newest Truth is Sexy post.



  18.  #18Daria on December 26, 2008 at 7:35 pm

    Did I mention you ROCK?>?> I feel SOO ENCOURAGED!!!
    THANK YOU!



  19.  #19JP on December 27, 2008 at 12:12 am

    Daria – that post seems to be about listening at Level 2 i.e. listening, checking, paraphrasing, offering ‘feedback’ (and that can be in feeling messages). These are basic counselling skills which enable a person to explore their options. I don’t see it as a masculine trait 🙂

    The first words of your speech – “I feel so mad and disappointed” – feel authentic; that might be a good place to pause and let the other person in. But do you need to make a speech in this situation?



  20.  #20alias girl on December 27, 2008 at 2:24 am

    jp that is a very interesting take on the quote daria presented to us. i reread the quote keeping in mind your perspective and it seems to make much more sense and be far less repulsive. although still i’m not sure that’s what i’m looking for. i don’t know that i want a blow by blow of his battles or to know the minuteau of the blueprint for his next kill.

    honestly. any more than he wants to hear a blow by blow of my shopping expedition or what fabric would like nicer with which shoes and should i paint my nails white or should i get acrylics etc.

    i don’t think it’s neccessary or desirable in my romantic relationship for these blow by blows strategizing of our different quests. i want to know what he’s up to. i want him to succeed. but i don’t know that i want to be full blown all up in his business in such a critical way on each of his manly quests. i could be wrong. i’ve never really been in a longterm real relationship like that so maybe. well once i was. and i found his life actually took precedent over my life. more and more and more. his quests his goals somehow got prioritized as Important while anything i was doing was a quaint little hobbie but not as Serious Or Important as what he was doing.and we were Constantly talking about his strategies and wins and losses and replays ad infinitim.

    ah yes possibly why i was initially so turned off by the quote. i am so easily and often unknowingly triggered by my past. interesting. anyway for me personally i do not want that to be my main contribution to my man. i want to have a heart connection. and for me this is not the way. the way is to be true authentic open available in my body in touch with my feelings and full of self love that spills over so he can be in that space. he can strategize with one of his buddies. and keep me updated on his winning score and cool wins or crushing losses or good plays. but No blow by blow. and no letting his quests somehow get prioritized as more important than mine.

    i feel so freaking vulnerable on this site. argh. my messy opinion that changes with each new bit of information.



  21.  #21JP on December 27, 2008 at 3:01 am

    Well AG… my man LOVES the minutiae of my nail-painting, hair-doing and dressing. He loves to give advice and I like asking him for it, and I feel cherished when he does this. He’ll even paint my nails and do my hair.

    I also discuss my work and he listens and offers advice. If I want space to express my feelings rather than get advice, then I use feeling messages – it’s that simple! There’s no ‘right’ or ‘wrong’, just different energies.

    Important to me – I never offer advice unless he asks for it. Just listen etc. If I realise I have information that may be helpful I say ‘I’ve thought of something that may be helpful, or it may not be’ and wait for him to respond.

    Everyone – I’m going for a different name. I feel in a different space now. I’ll still be posting here, so you’ll pick up my vibe, I hope 🙂



  22.  #22Caj13 on December 27, 2008 at 7:51 am

    AG – I get where you’re coming from and the whole point is NOT to turn into a free consultancy or get involved to a level that you don’t want to – definitely NOT TO THE POINT of prioritizing his agenda (yuck – heaven forbid – business partners are so much easier to switch than goddesses, and besides, he really wants to do everything himself). His agenda has nothing to do with the relationship per se, but everything to do with him as a person.

    I think what this helps with is 2 things: (1) to be aware of the absolutely self-defining role these kinds of preoccupations have with men, so as to respect that and avoid unconsciously discounting it (because he will pick up on our disdain and tends to completely misinterpret many of our ‘habitual’ encouragements). (2) it gives the women who are interested in and/or want to support their man in this all-important (to him) area of his life a way to do so that will be heard and appreciated. The trick is to keep our intervention in line with our feelings. If we’re bored to tears, or aggravated by his grandiose schemes, whatever, by all means, back away. And definitely change the subject if he is abusing your sounding board and not attending to your life FIRST (Rori has mentioned this false relationship habit many men have of ‘sharing” (dumping on you) all their day-to-day “stuff” ). We’re talking here about when they are really confiding something, (and there’s usually a fear of failure hidden there somewhere, but that might only come through indirectly) and they’ve got to the point of trusting you so much and valuing your input that they will actually seek it out. (Soon to be no longer)-JP had a good way of offering one’s input (and don’t insist if the answer is no).



  23.  #23Kristina-LEBANON on January 2, 2009 at 2:23 pm

    Sweetest Rori..
    I Wish You as All of your bloggers a very HAppy New Year 09 .. they say it is the “Aquarius “Year ;).. as i m born on the Valentine’s day .. so .. 😉 i guess it wd be My year .. but Let me tell you one thing please.. b4 i go on with all this “positive” insight ;)..
    I was engaged to be married this summer (right after i got your e-book (\Yes it helped me a load) as well as your news letters(since i am Not having your programs – i do not know what is going on with Our Postal services.. ) but, i sincerely read between the Lines.. & all that you say, write, Advise your correspondants i swollow every word on it.. but, what would you say if : 1- He came towards Me.. Got my Brother to meet him right before he came to have me see him (He saw me last year getting out of my friend’s office -in Kaslik – & (apparently) Fell Head Over Heals For just glimpsing @ me.. i never saw him !.. he made all the pursuing, he chased after my numbr, email, address.& left the country (he works in an Arab Country-for the past 13 years He is an Architect well by.. ) anyway.. so he asks my friends for my number &email.. & there it went.. for over a year on the internet._ i was Never interested in him.. (for Not knowing him) as i got on a plane last April to go “relax” in cyprus(i have to do physiotherapy every now & then, & then i could afford it so i went) but the week-end right before my flight he called on me & said : “:could you please pick me up from the AIrport…:Tomorrow.. i am coming.. i have to see you.
    I Felt Nothing (in fact i despised the sight as i saw him running towards my BMW.. i nearly wanted to get away..
    but i picked him -of course- did all the diplomatic recpetion : Lunch @ home (with my 2nd Brother here & my nephews..) but.. nothing more.. anyway, to cut things short (sorry if it took a lot: but you want details – right !?;) ) after a while while i was “relaxing in Cyprus” i checked my mail Occasionnally only to find myself falling for him.. ! yes.. (i also met another guy coming 36 hours straight from the US to meet me there) whom i didn’t like @ ALL !!!>. (he had red hair- on screen it showed me he was Blond) & red “frickles”/? on his cheek
    2 weeks later i was “Engaged “via- Phone” he spoke to my Mother in bed & Asked for my hand ( i Live in LEbanon- He lives next to Dubai -Abu dhabi ).. i went there , got a g8 tiffany’s engagement ring saw his house. suggested to have a bigger one – only to find after a couple of months of staying on & off there with him !( YEs ME!.. An Arab Traditional +Catholic Lady but hey nearly Forty ! too HEIN ?;)) that : he was totally “Clueless”(as u say rori) & as if he was in a Bull (bulle in french ) & i was “entering it ” i felt close to Suffocation ! but then said to myself: well, better to have a clueless, associable type of guy than a “Coureur de Juppons” (Skirt runner;)) hahah… NO !?… 2- Something “EJECTED”ME from my seat everytime i felt he was close to NOT”Gettin it”!.Getting ME!”… Anyway, u could say i did my part of the running off too, coz evrytime i sensed he was “unaware” or not even “Close” to what i wanted or needed (ex: a closet to hang my stuff.. or a bigger house (it was a 100 m2 ) or Not Needing to Work for @ LEast a couple of years for i Want to have babies !!! ).. He Couldn’t “get it “.. Not the smallest nor the hugest details that made me jump from my seat ;)(sorry for the image;))but yes it was to that extreme !.. guys. could you understand what i felt ?.. Please help me find new ways of understanding myself men, bcoz, i AM trying circular dating , getting Myself first “In Form” = Excercising occasionnaly, Loosing some extra weight …) but evrytime i now meet a guy it seems that i “Scrutinize” them Start “Analysing them quick enough to See how unfortunately “Awful they are ( i got to tell you that my country has been at war for 30 years & most of the GREATEST GUYS have Left to Study Work & Live Abroad.. !) so i am ven on-line dating.. but its Not Getting to me.. I do know that my AIMS Are a bit high.. for i am High in my own beleifs, Standards, Education & knowledge.so anyways, rori, what is it that makes me so ANgry @ MEN Nowadays for i DO NOT FIND ANYONE ANYBODY “SUITING” to say the least.. i am Not looking upwards, i am humble & close to everybody when it comes to Humanity, but Men!?>. what race are they !?..



  24.  #24Caj13 on January 3, 2009 at 4:03 pm

    Kristina-L For me, too, it’s sometimes hard to think we could be the same race as men. Even a male author said they come from Mars, so that makes them not even human! I think this is definitely the place to learn what they’re really like – and it’s probably the same no matter what their culture – but the truly important thing to do here IS WORK ON YOURSELF. Wherever we are, we can’t make someone else change, only ourselves. So even if you feel your self esteem is pretty high, it will still help if you can learn how to BE HEARD by men (in a relationship, of course, but it’s supposed to work in business, too). So I would say to start like the others by doing the Power and Self Esteem series on this Blog because you get really clear on your needs and wants and ALL THE FEELINGS that are associated with them. Because those Feelings are the basis of a message that can be heard. He can block or fluff off a message about a Thing (your description of him in his Bubble (bulle) and you being ejected from your chair by his obtuseness was over the top!). But he will be touched by a message that transmits your Feelings to him about that thing. And it’s actually doing the lists and the steps that allow us to formulate the messages authentically and effectively. And from the programs, we can also learn which men are Not Capable of doing the job (Toxic Men), so we can avoid bothering with them.



  25.  #25Kristina-Leb on January 4, 2009 at 10:31 am

    Oh My God Caj ?..U’re Gorgeous & Thank You for the “Bubble” translation ! You ‘re gorgeous !..;).. Thanks;)
    [i mainly am french educated so excuse me guys if i type a bit wrongful terms;).. But i Love your Language & Your Spirit – i feel like i’ve known each & everyone of you for years – But you Caj !.. you got my thumb up…:)
    As i wanted to ask rori is : “Why do We have to figure out what is it that “Suits” THEM !?>. & Not the other way around.. Coz Caj dear, i truly was ejected several times from my seat (i can tell you that !) & several X have left the MAll or the Hotel we were staying in.. & used to come back released from the Pressure Breathing Slowly & getting him “In-vol-ved” into my Feelings too !.. .with the low voice, with all the “Love” i could find in me ( because He did used to Treat ME Great – not only well !) Everybody would say : Oh my God, You Girl are so Lucky” Why do u have to jump off your feet since he’s treating you G8 !”>>. & i say, yeah, right, coz every single day am gona be waiting for another “suitable” surprise for me.. ?.. can’t live on a Lie.. i could Not Lie to myself being involved with someone who took 3weeks to figure out that :”Oh, There is Someone in MY Life i have to Let her in – Give her her space, enjoy & Respect Her to the full before “Deciding” _Alone- .. stuff like that… i could not “wait” for him to “Decide” whether or not he could fill in the house with space for me- let alone for a CHILD ! .. so rori, feeling messages -most of the time never work-(unless the Guy is Totally “Into” a Relation\ship Guide Himself !.. Why should we be the only ones to digg & forge ourself\ves into pitty or sorrow or even be “touched” with our simplest & most basic wishes : TO BE !.. i agree with Ca13 because i am feminine but sometimes when “pushed” can’t but React! of course sometimes my reactions are a bit “Blunt”?(?)or to the extreme, sometimes, yes ! But hey, aren’t we even “Allowed” to do so !?.. sometimes !?>. without reminding us of Child issues or even “HAving” ones.. ?



  26.  #26Rori Raye on January 4, 2009 at 6:04 pm

    Hi, Kristina, and welcome – and you DON’T have to figure out what “suits” him. My whole work is about doing the opposite – figuring out what suits YOU – and letting a man show up who WANTS to suit you perfectly.

    Love, Rori



  27.  #27Kristina-LEBANON on January 11, 2009 at 9:56 am

    I Truly wish Rori , to just find One MAn : who is Male enough to be Taking Care of a Lady , I want to have all the “giving”assets that he has..: what if i wanted to be pampered, Being Taken Care of, & Oh Yes :Expect of him to Take Full Care of ME.. or am i too demanding!??? Why is it that if a Gil wants & deserves ! to be well treated, well “gifted” too, (this is the least a Man could do.. !) to my beleifs, i see or feel that : this is how I would “Choose the Man” &/or Accept to be with him…
    If u do undersatnd what i mean. I want a man to “spend” [in all the meaningS of word]- everything & his “time” !,,,with me.. aren’t we “Allowed”to have such Expectations !?.. Without being High MAintenance !?. (what does it mean in your country ?) it sounds as if it has some other meanings too.. But what i wish & Fully Expect from a guy ( & i wouldn’t accpet less than it 🙂 is- once with me, aggreing two of us that we Are together – to Fully “Take Care” of me with him !… instead of going “manly” ourself !…yes i DO Not wish to “Work” if That gives me tnesions &/or make me feel awkward being just a woman in a MAn’s world… i simply rather “take Good Care of me ” in his presence,-or Out – but definitely to His expense.. why Not !?..Could you answer me on this rori?. please?.. is it wrong to think that !?.. thanks..;)… giggles & kisses to all of you.. bye:)



  28.  #28alias girl on January 13, 2009 at 7:56 pm

    Kristina. Welcome. The more you use the tools, then the more you will love yourself and have clarity and good boundaries.

    The more you focus on making yourself feel good, the less you will be unhealthily focussing on a man.

    I know it is difficult with the language barrier but I believe the message will get through.



  29.  #29ML on January 15, 2011 at 12:59 pm

    I just ended my engagement…
    Read my blog!

    http://lifeafterbeingengaged.blogspot.com/