If He’s In An Emotional Relationship With Another Woman — Do This (Video!)

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Have you ever felt so helpless over a “friendship” your man has with a woman that you can’t control your jealousy? Where the urge to STOP him is so strong it’s all you can think about?

Christine is in this situation, and she left a question for me as a comment — I thought it was so universal and powerful a question I wanted to put it in a post so everyone could read it and my answer:

“Dear Rori,

I can’t begin to tell you how much I hate myself right now! I am jealous and insecure over my fiance’s friend from work. She is going through a nasty divorce and just lost her dad to cancer recently. My fiance is trying to be her friend (as he says) because he’s been through what she is going through, he had a nasty divorce and lost his grandpa to cancer last year.

He says that he still loves me and wants myself and his co-worker to be friends eventually. But how do I get past this jealousy that I feel since they have a connection that I don’t have? This feeling caused me to accuse him of cheating on me (something he has never done) because family and friends have told me that because he is trying to be friends with her and is pulling away from me is trying to tell me that he wants to end it by cheating.

Please help me I don’t want to lose him! He is the only man that has ever loved me for me, I don’t want to throw away 3 years of a normally great relationship up to now.  Christine.”

***Here’s my answer:

Whoa, Christine – okay–get OFF the train you’re on.

Just step off the jealousy train. Step OFF.

Now get on another train. This train is LOVE FOR CHRISTINE!! I want you to hug yourself and love yourself SO hard you feel safe in your own arms.

Now– this is an emotional thing he has with this woman. If you try to step into it — you will LOSE.

Instead – you must build your self-confidence – double it – triple it…and get REALLY BUSY. This means activities, classes, FUN THINGS! I want you SMILING ALL THE time.

AND – I want you VULNERABLE. You’re going to have to out-girl this other woman, and you can’t do it by creating some drama for yourself. You’re going to have to do it with Feeling Messages – and they’re going to have to be happy, positive, passionate ones.

Come up with some ideas…post them here – everyone – please help with ideas (and I’ll write a new post around this) to be vulnerable in a happy way instead of a negative way. Complaining here will do you in. You cannot see her as a competitor. You’re going to have to BEAT this jealousy thing and prevail over your man’s heart in a different way — and that way is marked “GIRL”!!

I also want you to flirt your ass off out there when he’s not with you – this is Circular Dating within a relationship. We’ll all help, and the Targeting Mr. Right category here will give you some basics…Love, Rori

***Now that I’ve had time to digest the question and my answer — I KNOW it’s easy for me and you to tell Christine to shift gears lightening fast.

Many, many men have female friends they don’t want to lose — friends YOU will have to become friends with or at least tolerate HIM being friends with.  This means lunches, dinners…all kinds of things he might not want to give up.

Most men would get that this isn’t going to work when they’re in a romantic, serious relationship.  Most men get that women are jealous and will not tolerate another woman around their man.

And yet, there are plenty of men who don’t know this, don’t care to know this, and if they did know it (when you tell them) — they will accuse you of being insecure, jealous, and having low self-esteem.

And some men just don’t want to be told what to do.

Here’s my take — we’re all different, and some of us can handle a bunch of other women in our man’s life, and most of us can’t.  Or at least — don’t WANT to.

And, you know — that’s enough to say NO to a man.  Some things are dealbreakers.

If it’s one for you (as it was for me when I got serious with my husband) — you have to catch it early, you have to share with him that this won’t work for you and is a dealbreaker, and then simply not invest yourself in this man.

Marriage is supposed to be great.  It’s supposed to be best friends and passion — and it’s supposed to be a team.

Asking a man to give up his friends is not a good thing.  A man will just sort of naturally dial back on the friendships with other women. Aand know this — if he was interested in her, she would be more than a friend.

An old girlfriend is not a threat to you except in these two ways —

>>She’s a “backup” for you, emotionally.  When things go wrong in your relationship, instead of working on things with you, he can go to her.  And…

>>She takes up emotional room.

And none of that feels good.

handsome-guyA “new” woman friend is something that can happen through work and sports and hobbies — and would be totally unacceptable.  At least for me.

If this woman “needs” him – she’s “outgirling” Christine and allowing him to use his masculine energy with her and feel very manly about it. Because her situation seems more legitimate for needing him, she is vulnerable rather than demanding.  Cancer and loss beats jealousy and insecurity.

Christine’s jealousy — the way she’s expressing it, is working against her.

And she’s in an impossible situation.  The more she worries about his connection with this woman, the more she feeds it.

If she would focus her energy on herself, instead, and ramp up the attraction between her and her man instead of obsessing, thinking about him all the time and essentially dialing DOWN the attraction — he would likely move further away from from this other woman and closer to Christine.

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Heather on August 28, 2009 at 11:30 am

    Well, this topic touches a core for me! Have been dealing with a stubborn “ex” in my relationship for such a long time and to the point, I’m not sure if I am more stubborn or the ex is. It IS a dealbreaker too. I feel awful everytime it happens and really makes my blood boil. I’ve made it clear as crystal that it is a dealbreaker too. And still, this ex called last evening while we were home. He cut her off immediately, told me it was the “ex” and apologized to me for the phone call. Yes, just as Rori indicates, I have been accused of being insecure and jealous, and my man gets that these phone calls and communications are not OK with me. It took me a long time to have the courage to express that to him. Finally he seems to get it after much struggle on my part. I feel I must take steps to speed up this process.

    Rori, I do love your advice to Christine (and the rest of us in this horrible situation), to focus on our own happiness and to do and feel things that make us SMILE all the time. Imagine smiling 24×7!!! How exciting is that? It does really help.

    One thing i recently did was to complete an extended meditation exercise. This exercise lasted for 9 days. Each day I just focused on one thing that is either in my life right now, or that I want to have in my life in the near/not-so-distant future, and how I hope to accomplish that. I usually chose morning or late night for this exercise and did it at least 3 times a day and journaled about it. This is something i will come back to as I see changes unfold; and its also something i intend to do again.


  2.  #2alias girl on August 28, 2009 at 12:11 pm

    thank you rori. i love the ideas here and i feel so comforted by your words of advice and the wisdom from your experience.

    i agree that circular dating within the relationship and FLIRTING and having men shoot their energy arrows at you will help enormously.

    i feel so angry reading this situation. i personally couldn’t tolerate it. i just don’t feel that secure with myself. also energy he is putting towards another female is eenergy he is withholding from me.

    i don’t know how i feel about my man being friends with other females. i’d have to see how it feels. i just don’t know. it doesn’t feel that great thinking about it right in this moment. i’m not sure. i’m not sure i’m actually mature enough to handle the jealousy insecurity thing in a relationship. i seem to need a lot of reaassurance or else i just want the man gone.

    thank you for all the great boyfriend contenders i have in my life all wanting to please me and treat me like a godess. i feel so happy that i am attracted to them. and what a pleasant fun surprise that they are wealthy and like to spend money on me because it makes them feel good and manly to do so. thank you. i feel very good about this.

  3.  #3Dan_Brodribb on August 28, 2009 at 12:36 pm

    My female friends are important to me. A couple of them are exes. Any woman who dates me will have to deal with that.

    At the same time, my female friends are my friends for a reason. They get that when I’m in a relationship, a great deal of my “emotional space” is reserved for my my girlfriend. They would expect no less from their own fellas, so they’re pretty understanding and supportive about it.


  4.  #4alias girl on August 28, 2009 at 12:45 pm

    dan i would feel so jealous. i don’t think it’s neccessarily healthy but i don’t care. i do not want my man dilly dalling with his exes. and herels why. because my exes are still in love with me. they would still be with me if they could.

    so i don’t want my man in that situation and also is why i am trying to completely sever things with my exes now because i am still in love with them too. and i don’t want that staticy interference in my relationship.

    i guess my jealousy stems from my own feelings and expereiences and unsurity of how i feel and how i react to other men. i would not want to be close friends with men who are just waiting in the sahows for things to go wrong in my relationship so they can be a good “friend” and swoop in.

    so apparently it all has to do with me. of course that makes sense. so now i feel more clear on what i want and what i don’t.

    i feel happy dan that you are clear on what you want too and after having written this out i no longer feel threatened by your choices because they are Your choices. and i will end up with a man who is compatible with my choices and desires. yae. i feel good. thanks for being yourself and i appreciate the contrast.

  5.  #5Mercedes on August 28, 2009 at 2:27 pm

    AG: I agree with your take. Because of past problems with J, it is a deal-breaker for me. He knows and respects that. On the lucky side, he didn’t have any “just friend” female friends, so I never had to try to get him to stop being friends with someone he was already close to. He never switched to “just friends” with anyone he has slept with. I agree with Rori on that…had it been there and I tried to put a stop to it, I would have lost…so I’m grateful for that. With the exception of his ex wife (who lives several states away and who he has children with) he doesn’t have female friends. She and he are “friends” in the sense that they are friendly with each other, but they don’t go to dinner.

    As far as new female friends, he sees nobody outside of work unless I’m invited. I know that sounds harsh, but it isn’t and wasn’t when we talked about it. I don’t agree with putting yourself in a place of temptation. If there is one little crack in your foundation and you find youself in a tempting position with a “friend” then there is too much potential to go to this “friend” about your relationship problems rather than going to your love. I want J and I to always go to each other. There are no temptations where friends are concerned. Yes, we meet strangers of the opposite sex and yes, we might find them attractive, but no…we don’t develop friendships. I couldn’t handle it and if he were to be honest, he couldn’t either.

    We have female and male friends…but they are OUR friends…not HIS friends or MY friends. It works for us.

    Much Love,

  6.  #6tinque on August 28, 2009 at 2:52 pm

    As far as I’m concerned remaining friends with an ex is just weird (unless there are children involved).
    We parted for a reason ie. we were not good together. I’m reminded of when my ex called a few years to “see how I was” and then he asked me to lunch. I asked why and added that I didn’t feel it was a good idea. He replied why not, for we had been together for eleven years. I said, “My point exactly.” (I wanted to add that it had been over thirteen years by the way but left it alone.)
    In any case I’m SO glad K feels as I do.

  7.  #7alias girl on August 28, 2009 at 3:42 pm

    thanks mercedes. i feel very much more open to you than i did before because i have changed inside. so i feel happy to have you comment to me because i wasn’t sure if i had completely alienated you. 🙂

    I used to feel very threatened by other people and different opinions and I just don’t feel that as much as i used to. i feel very happy and much more relaxed about this.

  8.  #8Mercedes on August 28, 2009 at 3:59 pm

    Awww AG…that might be one of my biggest downfalls. I don’t feel alienated unless someone specifically tells me to go away. Lol. We’re good. I love your attitude and your comments to others. We may disagree sometimes and/or have different styles or even trigger each other. I don’t see that as ever causing me to feel alienated. If you tell me to alienate myself, that might do it. Otherwise, I’m happy to “know” you.

    Much Love,

  9.  #9Donna on August 28, 2009 at 5:39 pm

    I’m new here. I have Rori’s Heart Connection and Reconnect Your Relationship programs. I’m not really practising the program as much I want to or surely need to…YET. Or perhaps I am. I guess being here and posting is a baby step. Reaching out to connect with other woman so I can learn how to share my feelings will help me learn to express my feelings to men as well. I think most possibly the reason that I’m having a slow start with practising the advice is because it truely is so different than how I’ve ever been taught before. Talking in feeling mode feels so weird to me right now. Perhaps rushing out and practising on men, every man I meet is the quicker, more effective way to get there. However, I’m feeling that I might be more comfortable doing it on this forum with women who understand and can guide me. Perhaps if I can just get in the habit of doing that in a safe enviroment I will naturally do it from a place of comfort rather than feeling awkward about it? Is that cheating? Is it cheating because I’m not truely letting myself be vulnerable to a man yet? It feels like it is, I supose thats my answer. The question is ALWAYS how does it feel after all. So, I will do both. I will make a pact with myself that every time I post a feeling message here..I will find an opportunity to use a feeling message in my life with a man. Oh dear, I sound so wishy washy about Rori’s program don’t I? I don’t feel that way…I truely feel that committing to this can change my life and make me a better person, a better mate, a better mother. It’s just feels as if maybe relearning is harder than learning. I know that’s why the tools are important. I feel like this forum is another tool, a valuable tool, so yes I AM BABYSTEPPING! Yay me. I’m going to not question myself and feel bad or guilty because I think I’m not doing it the way its supose to be, I’m going to turn my negative feeling that it’s cheating into a positive feeling of I’m doing something to move forward. lol…ok…and the topic was….sorry, I’ll try to make a topic related comment now 🙂 I Feel that if we women could get to a place that we feel so good about ourselves in our our relationship with our man, maybe we could feel even better knowing that we arent in that friend zone with our man as the other women is, but rather his goddess of choice. I liked Rori’s phrase of outgirling the other woman. I feel that in the process of outgirling the friend, we would feel so good about ourselves that it would draw other men into our energy bubble. Our man might come to the conclusion (on his own) that he didnt have time to devote to friend mode with another women because he would need to use that time making sure he didnt give other men opportunity try to steal HIS goddess. Just a thought. I think its a good thought though. Atleast its a thought that makes me feel good and thats where I want to be. Thanks for listening. Much love to all. Donna

  10.  #10alias girl on August 28, 2009 at 6:11 pm

    aw. thanks mercedes. i feel very vulnerable and accepted. aw. i feel teary. thank you. i feel happy to know you too.

  11.  #11Donna on August 28, 2009 at 7:11 pm

    Oh my goodness. I just re-read the topic letter. I got abit off track talking about being new. I feel so shocked and infuriated about family and friends telling her that he is looking for a chance to break it off by cheating under the guise of being a friend. Atleast that’s what I think I read. I feel so bad for her. No wonder she is having trouble feeling good and staying in a good place. That would be like having your nasty voice on friggin loud speaker. Shame on those people. Shame on them for trying to steal her confidence, Shame on them for trying to steal his honor. It’s not their relationship, it’s not their place to judge, guess, or even repeat their interpitation of what they think they heard! On the positive side of this ugly dark situation is the light. It’s posible proof that she is doing well in her relationship. Alot of people, too many, are jealous of seeing a good relationship and think that tearing it down somehow makes their unhappy relationship feel more acceptable. I hope she finds a way to ignore their ugly voices, that she realizes that the more they tear at her happiness the more secure she can feel that she is in a good place. I wish for her revenge and true happiness to be that she knows they can’t break her confidence, or her bond with her mate if she doesn’t let them. I know its not that easy when it’s your situation. If only we could magically (or perhaps with Rori’s magical tools) just trust ourselves and our feelings..we truely do know in our hearts and own skin…what is true in our lives and when we are being malipulated to doubt what we feel to be true by ” family and friends”. It’s just not that easy to feel the truth sometimes. Sometimes it is because we dont want to know, but sometimes it is also because we doubt our ability to feel what we really feel. We trust not only our ugly voices but we add the ugly voices of people that are more clueless than we even feel we are most of the time. Shame on them! Shame on us for forgetting that we have our good voices that whisper instead of shouting like our ugly voices do. Why do the ugly voices shout? Because even though truth is quiet and unassuming, it’s powerful, and ugly has to shout because it fears and wants to live. Ugly will survive, in our lifetime probally..it always has, always will….so far…but wouldn’t it be awesome to know that we..with Rori’s help…were actually contributing to its extinction someday? Yeah..that feels awesome to me. Much love to all. Yeah…I sucked at making this a feeling message…@@ I’m gonna get there…promise. Donna

  12.  #12Ann on August 28, 2009 at 10:38 pm

    My friends are both male and female. For me the more I can love and accept myself the less competition I feel with other females.

  13.  #13Tracy on August 29, 2009 at 1:42 am

    I feel embarrassed admitting this but i have struggled with being the other woman with a man who was engaged to someone else….
    I feel bad when i read comments on how women struggle with jealousy because part of me feels guilty for causing someone else to go through the same…so this post triggers my guilt over the whole situation and for allowing it to go on for a long time…
    It took a while before i finally understood what i was doing and why i was doing it…The whole experience projected my insecurity over my capasity to have a real relationship and when it finally clicked it was easier to end it…i didn’t feel compelled to stay in any longer….
    My strongest focus right now is my belief in a universe that is abundant and that can provide me and everyone else whatever that which we desire…II realized that the more i felt compelled to be with this guy the more i felt limited and confined in a situation that did not feel good for me….and the less i was attracting the situation that felt good for me….
    I worked out a speech with feeling messages and i expressed how i felt to him and i feel that the space i have created will enable me shift to something that feels much better…I feel glad that i have been circular dating because i feel less clingy and expressing my feelings has enabled me reach a more honest level with myself and i can truly see me for who i really i am…I feel scared and relieved all at the same time…but i feel much better than i did before so for me it feels like progress….

  14.  #14Tina on August 29, 2009 at 6:02 am

    I always felt uncomfortable about these situations. I felt intuitively “this ain’t right.” I always had a feeling of being “groomed” to accept this by my ex husband and my current ex boyfriend but I would always burst in to a “HELL NO I’M NOT ACCEPTING THEM AS MY FRIENDS” and a “WHY THE HELL ARE YOU HER ABOUT THE FREAK’N WEATHER, YOU THINK IM STUPID” I would always feel that my life with these men were not important, not as important as “developing a friendship” with their exs like a you werent “friends” before what makes you think your going to be friends now and why do I have to be friends with your exs. A come back would be something like, “why are you so insecure?” then I would say something like “why do you “all of a sudden care about her “feelings” when what I am telling you is upsetting me and pisses me off.” on and on never feeling resolved. Husband is now soon to be ex husband , boyfriend is now sleeping with “town whore” lol. gawd. I”m glad its over. I feel more at peace with myself -takes deep breath. Neither one of them ever “cheated” on me but it left me feeling frustrated and controlling. blah. My ex calls or messages me and says Tina, I swear I never cheated on you.” that was never the MY issue though, my issue was why he insisted on “developing friendships” with these women and what I was feeling and saying was coming across as ‘Are you really that insecure” then try to guilt me about it afterwards. Why do me do this? This is a question for FERNANDO!!!!!!

  15.  #15Tina on August 29, 2009 at 6:14 am

    My current ex boyfriends “town whore” girlfriends bother contacted me and is trying to in his words “hook up” gawd this gets worse. He’s ex that he has a child with is trying to sell me fckn tupperware. He’s now girlfriend is trying to be “friends”. He sends me an email yesterday – I deleted without reading and filed it in my junkmail folder ugh! I swear something has gone terribly wrong seriously I cant make this shit up already!. I want it to go away poof like it never happened. I feel embarressed and humiliated about all of this. I go to the store , it seems everyone is talking about “our breakup” and him “gone off” this has all happened in about 48 hours and I feel overwhelmed. I was in my groove , feeling the love, doing yoga, working, doing things that is “all about me” and “loving myself” now this craziness.

  16.  #16Laura on August 29, 2009 at 9:52 am

    I struggled with jealousy for nearly 3 years as my super hot boyfriend had many women friends. He insisted on going to dinner with them on occasion or getting together with them without me. Sometimes he’d invite me along but if I wasn’t available he’d still see them without me. This upset me yet in the dynamic of our relationship, it was all about me being jealous, or insecure, or needy, or a psycho, or needing therapy, or attacking him, or whatever. Somehow it was never about him acting inappropriately (and by the way I’m sure he was faithful to me) or him worrying about my feelings. Instead, it was that if I was a good and strong girlfriend I would be confident enough to tolerate these relationships and let him have the freedom to be friends with whomever he wanted.
    It took me ages (including meeting a new man) to realize that if the relationship is right, I wouldn’t feel jealous, and the man would do whatever it takes to make me feel right. When you know a man feels that way about you, the jealousy evaporates. My new boyfriend knows how to tell me when he’s working with a female colleague that she is gay, or happily married, or that he’s told her all about me, some subtle reassurance to be sure that I don’t feel threatened. Surprisingly, I realize now that part of the ‘boy’ and ‘girl’ roles in the relationship is the man’s treasuring my feelings. I really believe now that with the right man you will not feel jealous. And if Christine can have the strength to say that her boyfriend’s relationship with the female friend doesn’t work for her, he will come around if he’s the right guy and if he’s not, she’ll know. And DEFINITELY circular dating is the key to having that strength. Good luck!!

  17.  #17maryam on August 29, 2009 at 10:08 am

    My boyfriend has many girlfriend.One from 2o years ago,he sends e-mail to her and talk all about how is his day,if she has it nice,if she has got sex,songs and sauna with and he says i have no right to say no to this relationship.He sends me no mail on daytime,he says we see each other everyday.

  18.  #18Rori Raye on August 29, 2009 at 11:31 am

    maryam, welcome, and you know, if you’ve been reading my letters and posts, that I completely do not want you to be exclusively tied to any man before marriage. It just doesn’t work to your advantage. It doesn’t serve you. I don’t know how old you are, but if ANYTHING a man does, consistently, that’s a part of his nature and his life bothers you intensely –then you must keep on dating other men, along with him, until you come to a peaceable decision with yourself about what it is you want and don’t want. I, personally, would not be able to, or want to tolerate sharing my man in this way. The less you “tolerate” the higher quality of man you will meet and connect with. ACCEPTANCE is a whole other thing. If this situation (and I’ve been in something like this situation — it happened all the time in the theater community I was deeply involved in once…where everyone remained friends and worked together — and it didn’t feel great, and I made the iron-clad decision to not allow that in my marriage) doesn’t feel good, and you can’t “accept” it with good feelings…then Circular Dating will help you meet another man who doesn’t have this baggage. (There will always be SOMETHING you don’t like about a man…everything’s a trade-off…but see if you can tell the difference between tolerating and accepting.) Love, Rori

  19.  #19Rori Raye on August 29, 2009 at 11:35 am

    Laura – Welcome, and thank you so much for your terrifically helpful comment. It’s so not about the details and what’s going on – because that’s all mental and trying to make sense of things. As you beautifully put it — it’s all about how you FEEL — and about how he cherishes your feelings. Love, Rori

  20.  #20Rori Raye on August 29, 2009 at 11:38 am

    Tina — you are brilliant…and this is just all getting stirred up because something new and wonderful is happening inside you. Everyone’s trying to get to you in some way. Handle it as though it’s all a message…use your Tools to stay steady, to stay with your feelings, to deal with the triggering in a deep way instead of trying to shut down around all this…it will be a terrific experience when you look back on it…because you will have learned so much, and have such an appreciation for yourself. Love, Rori

  21.  #21Rori Raye on August 29, 2009 at 11:54 am

    Tracy – Brava to you. This is a huge step, and I know because I was there. Long, long ago, when I was very, very vulnerable (but not so young as to be excused), I went to New York to “get away” and try my luck as an actress there — and I was “set up” with a powerful, successful theater producer by a director who’d hired me for a small project. The producer was an older, distinguished, calm man, and long married, and I had an affair with him in the most naive way. I thought I was in a “relationship.” I thought we were “seeing each other.” I thought I was “in love with him.” I “pined” after him and thought about him all the time. I never gave his wife a moment’s thought until I accidentally ran into them both at an event. I felt so humiliated and “evil” — I cut it off with him immediately, though he was angry about it and continued to pursue me.

    This whole thing was about fear. My fear. I was so emotionally damaged, I needed “protection” – and I had no idea how to take care of myself (oh I was good with the logistics of that – just not the EMOTIONAL part). The experience changed me — I was able to look at what was “acceptable” in the world (it would be difficult for any young actress to turn down a successful producer, which is why we now have laws about sexual harassment at work…) — and what as acceptable to ME. I really started to get a handle on who I was, and how I could be myself and care for myself emotionally. I had to look at all the men I’d been with were completely not good for me. I had to turn things around. Tracy, You are THERE NOW. Circular Dating is key here…let me know, all of you, if this topic is of any interest, and I’ll write a deeper post about my experience with a married man and learning from it…’Gooid luck! I look forward to reading more of yur comments and following your story…Love, Rori

  22.  #22Rori Raye on August 29, 2009 at 12:05 pm

    Welcome, Donna! You have such a lovely, soft, warm voice as you write, and I’ll bet you’re like that in person, too…and I hear you babystepping…just keep doing what you’re doing. A couple of rules for you — no more apologizing for expressing yourself however it comes out here, and practice is key. Practice with EVERYONE, at all times…it will make everything better so much faster. Love, Rori

  23.  #23Tracy on August 29, 2009 at 12:16 pm

    Thank you so much for sharing the past.Its the exact same situation with me and i feel that i am in the exact same position….I feel stuck and i feel confused and though i have ended it i know i have to heal and move on.
    I have been circular dating and this has helped with my vibe and i am meeting so many other men and it feels great but this guy still feels as though he is holding on my horse and a part of me wants to cut off all the links…and part of me feels stuck in the situation…
    I would love more insight on this topic.Thank you..

  24.  #24K on August 29, 2009 at 12:23 pm

    I have a weird situation…. I am feeling jealousy, anxiety and anger toward one of my closest friends. She always leans WAY in to get attention from men that I ‘like’ or am attracted to. One time it even ended up her getting married (failed of course, and I would have NEVER married him anyway)….but it’s frustrating. I am leaning back and just being there for the guy who’s mom just passed away, and he is in my circle of interest….AND she knows this, but she steps in and is really aggressive! UGH, breath, relax, ‘it is what it is,’ and if he responds to her then I’ll still be backed off and it wasn’t meant to be anything else…I won’t fight for his attention (we are all going to a concert together tonight); I told him long ago about the ‘dynamic’ of our relationship, and in the past he’s responded to me more, but I’m feeling insecure!! I don’t like feeling insecure– I am great, I’m smart, funny, confident, and LEANING back has worked when he and I are on our dates. Maybe it’s nothing, and I’m feeling insecure, but I need some support Warriors!!! :'( Tear of frustration not pity or sadness!!!

  25.  #25Maria on August 29, 2009 at 3:49 pm

    Laura, l want to say that l agree very much about your comment in your post. If you are SURE of your man feelings for you, then he can have as many female friedns as he wants-but deep inside you KNOW that he loves and wants you.

  26.  #26Simply Shannon on August 29, 2009 at 6:45 pm

    I love the “outgirl her” comment. I’m trying to stay open and vulnerable but it sure feels hard to do when you’re in the middle of it.

  27.  #27cani on August 30, 2009 at 3:44 am

    Great blog, and advice. Interesting to see things from a woman’s perspective.

    Just one question: what is circular dating??


  28.  #28K on August 30, 2009 at 8:24 am

    I dealt with the friend situation well, I think. I wore my sexy, lacy pink bra ALL for myself, feeling sexy and Warrior for myself; I did lean back at the bar and concert, and I got the appropriate attention from him. He touched me, sat by me, asked what I wanted to drink first etc, etc…plus the bonus was a hot few minutes in the car on the way home!!!! During the night, I was leaning back but also observing it all, and my girl friend who fights for all the attention is working hard and getting nothing…I will not be jealous any more.

    My ‘guy’ on the other hand has lots of friends, girl, guy, everyone, and he’s a very out-going person in public. However, I know and see the other side of him– the vulnerable, shy, connected to me side! Also, he, in subtle ways, shows me that I’m different (in our group outings) and he NEVER crosses the line around me–IE flirting with other women…That is what keeps me from feeling jealous…. I know I have and mean more. However, I’ve never been a jealous type as far as my men go; I just have this weird competitive thing with my girlfriend, but I refuse to compete!!

    The lacy underwear for myself gave me a physical reminder of myself!! It was a good tactile reminder of the lacy pink feminine strength I AM!!!!

  29.  #29Daria on August 31, 2009 at 2:45 am

    Congratulations K! Wow thanks for the reminded of what lacy lingerie can do for me!

  30.  #30K on August 31, 2009 at 6:25 am

    Daria– THANKS!!! I needed that! I do feel good, and there is a picture on our FB that shows us connected and it’s really ‘cute’…btw, said girlfriend took it!!! There is balance in the universe; we just have to remember and trust that!!

  31.  #31Rori Raye on August 31, 2009 at 10:18 am

    Welcome cani, and whoa — did you ask a big question!!! Go to the Targeting Mr. Right category here, and keep asking questions…(I assume you get my newsletters, if not, be sure to sign up for them, they’re free…) There are several men who lurk around here, and who are very helpful. If you take in this information…it will help you as a man…Rori

  32.  #32Bethany on August 31, 2009 at 11:21 am

    Wow, I’ve been away, resting, as I’ve been very tired, and I have tons of catch-up reading, but this topic is hugely triggering for me. Probably because of my dad’s many affairs with women my mom knew (one of which she says she ran into last weekend! Weirdness…) I don’t feel comfortable with female friends, in most instances. Facebook is especially irksome to me because it blurs those lines that much more…I remember how terrible I felt seeing Christopher interact with other women. So, I guess it’s good that I’m “free” to circular date and flirt…been flirting a lot more, still no one asking me out and I think it’s because I’m so anxious about it. So, what if I just decide to enjoy my own company and smile as much as I can? That’s pretty much all I can do–can’t FORCE them to ask me out. Ugh.

  33.  #33Bethany on August 31, 2009 at 11:23 am

    Christopher’s been calling me more and being much more vocally affectionate as I’ve been a little more relaxed. I have sort of let myself not think so hard about every single conversation go the way I want (EFT helps me with this too), and I actually can say I feel a little bit less distraught about the whole thing.

  34.  #34Daria on August 31, 2009 at 11:59 am

    Bethany that’s wonderful! I haven’t been getting asked out too much either lately (except this guy today who wanted me to sleep “with” him in the same bed and who ?I don’t want to do that with) … but I still feel so happy about my love life. I feel so free to be me! yay

  35.  #35Francesca on August 31, 2009 at 2:51 pm

    Hi everybody. I’m not sure if this is the appropriate place to pose a relationship question, but…

    I am in the process of basically negotiating with my boyfriend about downgrading our status to “dating” because he feels I don’t make enough time for him. I think he is right, but I can not find the motivation to nourish our relationship the way he wants. It’s a pretty clear gender role reversal in terms of the “needy woman” and the independent man

    The problem is my last relationship turned me into a monster – the guy was so unavailable but I was sooo in love with him. I learned how to be independent and make myself happy between our rare time together. Now I’m used to that and once a week would be fine for me. I do love my current boyfriend but I’m just not inspired until he nearly breaks up with me and then I panic! I have requested his patience but I think he’s looking for a more dependent woman who will make him feel needed.

    Any advice would be appreciated. This is a horrible feeling because I know I need to finish grieving over my ex before I can emotionally commit to anyone else. Strategies? New way of thinking about the problem?


  36.  #36Chanel on August 31, 2009 at 4:13 pm

    Hi Rori,

    Thanks for addressing one of my comments on the other thread. 🙂

    I hear what you are saying about using Circular Dating as therapy and practice.

    Right now, it just feels better for me to take a breather from dating and work on getting happier.

    I HAVE been practicing your techniques on some male friends of mine that I probably won’t date (well maybe one of them, one of these days, never say never!). So I’m still doing your tools and practicing Leaning back and flirting a bit, and it’s wonderful to watch the difference that it makes with my relationships with male friends.

    What’s even more wonderful is seeing how relaxed I am becoming. I’m sort of leaning back in all of my relationships and watching what happens. Some friendships self destructed when I stopped rowing the boat, and that’s ok.

    I have stopped trying so hard and it makes a huge difference, even at work. I didn’t realize how much nervous tension I was carrying around. How much I needed to control things because I was so worried about people not liking me.

    My relationship with my daughter has really improved. It’s hard to lean back with a 6-year-old, but it is possible, if done with awareness.

    I have found that if I can relax about my relationships with other people, and stop working so hard, I free up more energy to work on projects and hobbies.

    I still have a long ways to go! I’m the master boat rower and it takes a lot of practice not to pick up the oars!

    So I’m practicing your tools, without actually dating, and working on getting my house in order and feeling stronger before looking for a relationship with a man.

    I think it’s working for me, I’ve never flown solo before and this is what feels good to me right now.

    Thanks again for all your work! 🙂

  37.  #37Daria on August 31, 2009 at 4:28 pm

    Chanel, it sounds like if you are smiling at men out in the world, and leaning back, then you Are Circular Dating…

    I don’t see what the difference is?? between dating and what you’re doing now?

    all what you say about getting happier and getting stronger can be done really well with Circular Dating, even accepting dates from men…

    remember Circular Dating is not about “looking for a relationship with a man.”

    In fact we are Never “looking.” At least not actively, only imagining what we want, what the happily ever after is for us is all the looking were doing.

    I can feel so much resistance from you to dating and I feel sad and concerned. It would feel so much better and faster to reach your goals of feeling deeply happier and stronger and the way to do that is by being open to men… you are a woman! that is the way…

    I feel confused and the reasons sound like excuses to me, and I feel triggered. I don’t want to see you use excuses of working on being happier and stronger to prevent you from using the best way of getting to actually Being happier and stronger!

    Are you opening yourself and your vibe? or are you closing? because closing will NOT taking you to happier and stronger, while opening, scary as it may feel, Does

  38.  #38K on September 1, 2009 at 5:20 am

    Chanel— I too use the tools on all my relationships and they work universally. You are doing a fabulous job and I applaud your efforts. We are all working our way through this experience called life, and we can interpret advice/suggestions….whatever from others any way we want, or just ignore it :0) You are taking care of yourself, accepting and owning your feelings, and becoming aware for and of yourself…..GOOD WORK!!!

  39.  #39Daria on September 1, 2009 at 6:10 am

    K i feel triggered. I feel like the implication is that My advice should be ignored… I feel trembly…

    Chanel agreed you are doing wonderfully. From your above post however, I Feel resistance to dating. That doesn’t feel good to me and makes me feel worried.

    I’m feeling kinda trembly and tight in my jaw right now.

    I want whats good for everyone.

    Me personally I haven’t been on a date in a month, yet I still feel totally open to dating…

  40.  #40DocK on September 1, 2009 at 7:06 am

    Hi Daria

    A song came on my ipod that made me think of you. Not the sad part about being alone/lonely but the happy part because I know that you miss home but I also think it is possible that when you find the love of your life you will feel like you are always home when you are in his arms in California and/or Romania. : )

    Song: Feels Like Home

    Somethin’ in your eyes, makes me wanna lose myself
    Makes me wanna lose myself, in your arms
    There’s somethin’ in your voice, makes my heart beat fast
    Hope this feeling lasts, the rest of my life

    If you knew how lonely my life has been
    And how long I’ve been so alone
    And if you knew how I wanted someone to come along
    And change my life the way you’ve done

    It feels like home to me, it feels like home to me
    It feels like I’m all the way back where I come from

    A window breaks, down a long, dark street
    And a siren wails in the night
    But I’m alright, ’cause I have you here with me
    And I can almost see, through the dark there is light

    Well, if you knew how much this moment means to me
    And how long I’ve waited for your touch
    And if you knew how happy you are making me
    I never thought that I’d love anyone so much

    It feels like home to me, it feels like home to me
    It feels like I’m all the way the back where I come from

    Hugs, Maria

  41.  #41K on September 1, 2009 at 9:04 am

    Daria- I don’t know what you are responding to so strongly…I read Chanel’s post and I connected with her feelings. It appears we are going through similar growth…I would never say discount anyone’s advice or follow anyone’s advice without considering how it works for you. I have posted similar things on different blogs. I am not judging you or anyone, I just know that it’s so hard when you feel like you should jump from point a to point b and then feel ‘weird’ because something (whatever it is) doesn’t work as it appears to work for everyone else….
    if my comments to Chanel triggered you, then I’m sorry, or not….if you need to use that to feel what you need, then your welcome….I’m here just like everyone else, to get advice, connect with others, and grow as a person

  42.  #42Daria on September 1, 2009 at 9:41 am

    Hi K – thanks yes I was just using the opportunity of feeling triggered to express my feeling upset because I noticed myself feeling trembly and upset, whereas in the past I would have said nothing because I would have thought my feelings were better to be quiet about to avoid triggering someone.

    Thank you for answering me.

    Thank you Dock you are so sweet!!! I’m finding home and its in my own arms and at one point that song would have amde me break down but now I have healed a lot of heartbreak!! Thank you !!!

  43.  #43Rori Raye on September 1, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    Welcome, Francesca – You don’t say how old you are…but there’s a HUGE difference between intimacy and dependence. The fact that you were crazy for an unavailable man tells me that your problem is your fear of intimacy – and that THAT’S what you need to work on here. Are you of an age where you want to be married and think about having a family? You also don’t say how long you’ve had this boyfriend…and…I totally do not see the value in allowing “grieving” over a man who was emotionally unavailable stop you from moving forward with your life. This is about YOU. This is about your own emotional growth and getting past this need you have for “distance” in a relationship. An unavailable man is easy. We can’t get close because HE’S creating the distance, so we feel totally free to cut loose with our “love.” It has nothing to do with love. It has to do with fear. And co-dependence. By distancing your boyfriend…you’re just playing the same record. Please find all the Tools here and in my ebook to get you on your own journey past this stuff that’s holding you back from real love. Love, Rori

  44.  #44Bethany on September 1, 2009 at 12:33 pm

    I read this again and I feel mad again. I feel hypocritical. I have guy friends who I feel affection for but absolutely no romantic spark with, and yet when I see C. even speaking to a woman I feel is attractive, I automatically go to feeling threatened and diminished and jealous and panicky. This is my biggest, most painful issue, I belive. I admit, I feel incredibly insecure about other women. If it’s around a guy I don’t feel anything for, I can often feel relaxed and like a prize and not worry about his attention going to the other girl(s) or not, but if it’s a guy I feel even the tiniest bit attached to, it’s meltdown time. I am working on EFTing this and Erika told me her intuition is that it’s an imprint from my mother, who, when my dad revealed all his affairs to her, was incredibly fearful about losing him and really focused on what he was doing. That makes sense…although it’s hard to root out all the memories because this thing is a huge, huge energetic boulder I’ve carried for about 15 years. So, yuck…it feels really gross and I want it to go away, but maybe being impatient about shifting it is making it stick around, I don’t know.

    I wish I could be one of those women who is never threatened by other women. If they exist.

  45.  #45Simply Shannon on September 1, 2009 at 12:37 pm

    Ummm. Wow. Rori – I felt my heart drop reading what you wrote to Francesca. Fear of intimacy? Free to love because he’s creating the distance? Gulp. Please explain fear of intimacy and the codependence issue. Wow. I can’t even form words around this. I feel shaky. I never thought of it this way. My chest feels tight. I would like to know more. This is triggering me. Something is lingering here for me to discover. Unattainable = safe?

  46.  #46Bethany on September 1, 2009 at 1:12 pm

    I guess I feel hypocritical because if a guy asked me to stop hanging out with my guy friends because HE was jealous, I wouldn’t understand that, but it feels completely unacceptable to me for him to have his energy go out to other women. Weird.

    I just read Rori’s response to Francesca, and I feel like I’m in that boat too. Fear of intimacy, so I get all caught up in jealousy? I don’t know. I really would like to get this out of my system but I have a hard time even comprehending what my problem is. I might be thinking too much again. I kind of feel not quite ready for anything serious, and yet not interested in casual boyfriend-girlfriend pattern…I may have just painted myself into a corner. I feel really confused now. How the hell are you supposed to figure out what you want? It’s like the farther into my 20s I get the more confused I become. Isn’t it supposed to get less confusing? Generally? I mean, I DON’T want to feel threatened and jealous and want him all to myself, and yet really concentrating on what it would feel like to say, “okay, you and me, we’re locking this down for real” feels kind of weird, and I feel squirelly and squeamish. I don’t KNOW what I want, romantically, professionally, etc. I feel epicly confused and without any kind of direction. I feel like I have no intuition, like it left me somehow. I feel like doing one thing, then two minutes later completely uninterested in doing that thing. I want C., and yet I don’t know if I want him FOREVER. I feel abjectly terrified of committing myself to one guy because what if what happened to my mom happens to me? That would be the worst of all worst possible scenarios. I am aware that I’m spinning in my head now…when I think about a committed relationship, I feel a clamping feeling on either side of my midsection, like I’ve been squeezed by massive salad tongs. I feel uncomfortable pressure on my chest. I feel like running away. That is my fear response. Commitment = trap = gullibility and getting blindsided by the person you love. That’s my feeling. I would riff but I don’t have time now…later…

  47.  #47Daria on September 1, 2009 at 1:46 pm

    Well Bethny of course YOU wouldn’t say ‘you and me we’re locking this down for real…”

    1. HE claims you

    2. Locking down is like throwing him in the cage (what program is that from? I think Targeting) We want the relationship to be free and grow and expand, not locking down (and just that choice of words points out the way of looking at it in that moment

  48.  #48Francesca on September 1, 2009 at 6:55 pm

    Thank you for the response, Rori. I think you’re completely correct. It’s so much easier to sit back and blame a man for not giving you the opportunity to love him when really you’re just too scared to be SEEN by anyone. It really is a pathetic version of scapegoating. But I don’t have to let it continue. I am 27 and never have been interested in marriage and kids…but what you said makes me wonder if that’s just another symptom of hiding from intimacy. I’ve been with my current boyfriend for about 10 months. He’s given me so many chances but at the same time he doesn’t let me walk all over him. I respect him and I want to make it work because he’s a one-in-a-million man. I am terrified of sabotaging it. I know I have a lot to work on! I will be heeding your advice. Thank you.

  49.  #49Daria on September 2, 2009 at 12:54 am

    Hi Francesca I am 27 too and haven’t been interested, now I am starting to open up to it more a little bit, maybe just a little bit.

    Actually what I’m interested in is meeting lots of sexy men who give me their attention and feeling like I have all their attention and being able to have any man I want.

  50.  #50Francesca on September 2, 2009 at 9:55 am

    Hi Daria. It’s a strange time in life for someone who hasn’t ever considered marriage or kids, huh? I am starting to feel a slight presence of my “internal clock” but wonder if that isn’t just social (my mom) pressure. My boyfriend is definitely interested in marriage and kids eventually and I am trying to be open to the idea.

    Of course REALLY doing it and just thinking about it for 10 seconds are very different things. When I really try to imagine it I feel the salad tongs that someone mentioned above! I am really freaked out by intimacy, I’m beginning to realize (thanks to Rori). Even intimacy in my relationships with my parents, my sisters, my friends – I avoid all of it. I have always had a major bond with animals and even get paid to train them! Now I’m seeing that maybe that fits my pattern too! No judgment from them!

    Where do I start? I am always very forthcoming with my feelings to my bf, but maybe it’s fake. Maybe I think I’m being open, but I’m really just reading a script that I think will sound “human”. I constantly feel like a freak/outsider. How do I feel connected to another human – without pretending? I almost don’t care if I’m alone because then I don’t have to work so hard to project a persona.

    Anyone feel this way too? Do we all feel this way, even a little?

  51.  #51Francesca on September 2, 2009 at 10:38 am

    Here’s another situation that sticks more to the subject, if anyone’s interested 😉

    My first boyfriend was recently married. Over a year ago, he had broken up with his girlfriend (now wife) and moved back to the States to try to rekindle our relationship, after being close friends for years since our break up. He told me I was the love of his life. I tried to feel it, but there was no spark or attraction. He pretty abruptly dropped it after months of anticipation, love-emails, phone calls and day-dreaming about the past.

    I heard thru a mutual friend, just a couple months later, that the ex girlfriend was moving here and, in no time, they were getting married! I felt pretty amused by his declaration of love for me – now rendered almost laughably meaningless…but I still have a lot of love for him as a friend.

    In spite of trying to keep in touch – his friendship has been one of the most important of my life – he has totally disappeared. I miss him but I guess it’s inappropriate for me to be friends with him now. Maybe that’s his opinion, or maybe that’s her talking.

    Any advice on friendships with exes when you honestly don’t have a romantic interest? I don’t see the problem with it but perhaps she knows more than I think she does about why he moved back here… I don’t want to be responsible for making someone else jealous but I miss my friend :'( selfish?

  52.  #52Tracy on September 3, 2009 at 4:16 am

    I experienced something similar with an ex of mine…he was my first love and i always felt we should get married but i didn’t feel the deep attraction and intimacy for him no matter how hard i tried…He broke up with his campus girlfriend and at the time started hitting on me mildly…i took it seriously and because i was only interested in something serious asked him plainly what he wanted…he said friendship…I felt really bad because i seriously wanted to work things out with him,but the funny thing is knowing what i know now…it would never have worked…the chemistry was never really there…i was really only after A relationship…six months later he got engaged,and is now married…H e tried getting in touch with me just before his wedding…was rather friendly but finally i decided that being with him doesn’t feel right…even as friends because i feel that he treats me as though i am more than that yet i am not…so i cut all communication and infact did not attend his wedding…
    I am happy for him and i wish him all the luck in the world…but that’s it…for me that chapter of my life is closed for more interesting things happening at the moment…
    It took me awhile to come to this…i feel that the more i am in touch with my real self the more i can decide what i feel comfortable keeping and i feel okay letting go…and once i can reach this point there is no doubt in my mind…I am still working on this….but i feel that good progress is being made…

  53.  #53Francesca on September 3, 2009 at 11:07 pm

    Thanks Tracy,
    that sounds like an eerily similar situation. I think you’re right about closing the chapter…really the whole “rekindle a past love” thing is all about the fear of moving on and starting from scratch.

    I have always felt like it’s a HUGE investment to get to know a person – whether it be a friend or boyfriend or boss. I am so reserved that when I DO decide to share it’s like I’ve given away a limb or something. I’m so reluctant to leave it or give up on it. I feel so much safety in the people who truly do know me. But of course they are not necessarily the people I should be with forever. And I’m not in charge of other people’s decisions.

    It’s hard to let go of that, but when left without another choice, one adapts! I think I need to get better at sharing myself without feeling like it’s the end of the world. Or maybe be more discriminating. Who knows. Erg, I’m a little sensitive now because my best friend, who seems to see me more clearly than anyone is ignoring me completely and I don’t know why, therefore I am coming up with all kinds of reasons on my own!!!
    Oh well. I am so thankful to have another outlet here. I want to hear more about your experiences out there in the world – I really want to hear about the lessons you’ve learned/are learning. Thanks for sharing 🙂


  54.  #54Tracy on September 4, 2009 at 1:15 am

    I felt exactly the same way.reserved and it always felt so hard to let people in and once i let them in…i always found myself clinging to them so hard and feeling that i was really lucky to have them around.I felt that i had so few friends and close acquaintances and when they were unavailable i felt so alone…it felt as though my happiness depended on them..
    For me what has really worked is first changing my perceptive about myself….loving myself more….taking care of my own happiness….circular dating was a nice place to start…i have made so many friends,met so many men….and i feel less worried about letting go of past relationships and embracing new ones that are coming up….its a process and i still feel that i need to work on it more and more but this blog really helps to encourage and puts me in the right frame of mind…
    I feel happy to have someone sharing similar experiences as i do…i am also 26 going 27 and marriage does feel like a good thing to have but not until i feel that i am ready and i meet someone who wants to commit fully to me…i have to work on myself first…i finally realize that the happiness i was seeking out there is in fact within me…so for now i am working hard at loving myself for a change…
    As for missing the EX,yeah i miss the times we spent together,i miss the friendship….but i am trying to focus on taking care of myself and looking for other fun things to do to create similar experiences as i had in the past…its been challenging because i am a master of trying to fix things and i find it challenging to let go and let things be….really hard it’s amusing…
    The more i am learning to let go the more things actually work out the way i want them to….its ironic but it works…

  55.  #55Francesca on September 4, 2009 at 1:41 am

    hmmm, the idea of fixing things that you mentioned has me wondering… I was the peacemaker in my family and continue to live that role. wonder if i’m spending too much time trying to solve conflicts just to solve them. What if it’s ok to have a conflict?? that’s tough for me, but I think it’s worth exploring. Maybe I need to learn to let conflict happen and not apologize for it just for the sake of peace. maybe it’s ok to not talk to someone when they just don’t fit into your life anymore 🙂 gracias

  56.  #56Tracy on September 4, 2009 at 3:26 am

    I don’t remember who exactly forwarded me this link but it was someone from this blog
    http://www.lynneforrest.com/html/the_faces_of_victim.html…it has helped me reconcile with the idea of always trying to fix things and as Rori puts it Over functioning all the time…i am the first born in my family and i have had to make lots of decisions…but i always felt overwhelmed with men i was dating because i would do the same thing with them…try and fix them to be a framework i felt comfortable with..i ended up always complaining over what they were not doing rather than enjoying what was actually happening…it felt so tiring…
    Honestly my mind is still wired more on the masculine side as a result of my past experiences….but i have started introducing the feminine side as well where i just relax and enjoy what is around me….it is a process i am still learning but i like it so far…

  57.  #57Victoria on September 9, 2009 at 7:13 am

    My motto has always been to keep thine enemies close. Not that this woman is an enemy, but I’ve been in these shoes and here’s how I handled it….

    I showed interest in the woman’s problems. I encouraged him to let me meet her. To her I was warm and sympathetic (all the while seething inside!).

    He began keeping me updated on her “condition” and I would show my support for her.
    He began including me in their get togethers (it’s easier to keep an eye on someone when you are with them then without them) and eventually it was she and I who became close and remained excellent friends for years.

    So the result was that I took the pain out of the situation for him by involving myself in their relationship. It kept the relationship from being “private” and made me see that this woman really wasn’t a threat after all, but rather a poor soul who was reaching out.

    It also showed my man that I was secure enough to not act jealous (even if I was) and made me more attractive to him.
    End of problem.

    Now, if he had refused to allow me to become a part of the situation, I would then insist that relationship end. If we are supposed to be in a “committed” relationship, there would be no reason for a “private” friendship with someone of the opposite sex.

  58.  #58Rori Raye on September 9, 2009 at 1:55 pm

    Wow, Victoria – totally, totally brilliant. What’s required here, though, is true confidence. Otherwise, you’d be tense and lying all the time, and not be able to handle it. You did this in a amazing way. Love, Rori

  59.  #59Francesca on September 9, 2009 at 2:05 pm

    I agree! What an amazing, grown-up way of handling the situation! And it really is a true and honest test of whether a man is involved inappropriately. Plus, you may come out of it with a new friend. Excellent approach!

  60.  #60Francesca on September 9, 2009 at 2:10 pm

    Oh, and I wanted to thank Tracy for the link – that was really interesting reading. I still can’t figure out where I usually reside on the victim triangle, but I think maybe I’m just a plain old victim who blames herself for most things 🙂
    I can relate with feeling like a man dating women…I find myself relating better to Rori’s advice as the “man” rather than the woman it was intended for. I am working on softening up and letting myself be more vulnerable and honest with my emotions. It’s tough but helping with my relationship visibly.

  61.  #61Rose on September 21, 2009 at 7:54 am

    Dear Rori,
    a friend of mine gave me a copy of your book to read. However in my relationship I just want him back and have what we used to have.
    Let me start from the beginning.
    We met about 10 years ago and the first year we dated like maybe 4 or 5 times. Then things became closer till he asked me to marry him. Everything was fine. But we are not married, he held off because he wanted a real nice wedding. For me the justice would have been just fine. I was married before and had the big thing with dress and cake and church and reception etc. Things seemed to be fine but looking back on it about the last 4-5 years ago he started to withdraw. However we lived side by side, had fun together and good times, just the sex stopped. He now announced, that he was not happy, that I am emotionally and financially draining him. That he lost all feelings for me and that he doesn’t think he would ever get them back for me. When I asked him if there is another woman he said yes and that for now she is nice to be with. I cant recall the exact way he was saying this because I was just soooooooooooo upset hearing this that I can not recall the exact words. But just the way he said it made me feel as if this is not anything permanent. Besides the fact that she could be his daughter by age. I met her once or twice and had a feeling right then and there that she was going to cause me problems. Moving out is not an option for me right now because I am jobless, and have been raised in such a way that a woman is to stay home and take care of her house, children and her man. So I never even learned anything that would make me enough money to support myself. When we met I had a part time job and was staying with my daughter but that is not an option anymore because she is in the Navy, doesn’t have a place of her own because she is always at sea. Also I don’t want to leave because I love him and he really is, even though it doesn’t sound like it right now, a great guy. The best man I have ever come across. At his age 59, I feel this is like a mid life crisis. He spends weekends away and I suspect he is with this woman besides doing his hobby. What can I do to bring about a quick result that brings us back together, Just s0mething to start with to see some small result, to have again what we used to have. Maybe reconnect to that, or as he said one time start over. if we make it through this we will be stronger than before. As always it is up to the woman to do the work. That ‘s what it feels like to me anyway. What can I do for him to at least wake up and take notice, and then do something to keep it together. I need to see something that comes from him too to give me some sort of hope because otherwise I might just move out and live in my car.

  62.  #62Rori Raye on September 21, 2009 at 2:49 pm

    Rose, Welcome, and sorry for your situation…here’s the FASTEST and truest way to turn this around. You were brought up WRONG. It is totally unattractive for a woman to not have something outside the home that turns her on, and makes her money. If you can, get a job – selling Mary Kay or another product that has a good support structure is a great thing many women start with — or even babysitting. Go to the nearby community college and take CLASSES in computers, bookkeeping, something that will teach you something valuable. Get a part-time job. Bring home some money and start feeling good about yourself. Living in your car is not an option, and so, of course he feels drained if that’s your ONLY option. You must GET A LIFE that has nothing to do with him. Once you do this, your attractiveness rating will zoom upwards, and then let us know what happens. Until you make this shift, nothing you do with him will make any difference. And once you do, all my Tools will kick in for you. Love, Rori

  63.  #63Sher on October 22, 2009 at 10:58 am

    Hi Everyone!

    I just want to say that listening to the tapes (I have invested in my heart happiness by purchasing all of Rori’s packages over time, except the very last one) over and over for a month each has literally changed my life!

    While in the midst of an unhappy (imaginary) relationship with a ‘separated, soon to be divorced’ man, I discovered Rori’s ebook a little over a year ago. What I learned helped me realize how little I really knew about a topic that mattered so much to me. I had serial relationships that lasted a few years and deteriorated, but never led to happily ever after (nor would I even admit to myself that I wanted that!)

    I discovered that as a single business owner, I was extremely good at male energy, but had completely lost my feminine mojo! I listened to the Siren series and found myself laughing with delight, constantly. It has been incredibly fun to open up to vulnerability and feeling messages, to lean back and let the man row, to practice flirting and taking myself on dates. I decided what I wanted in a relationship (which the man I mentioned above got a speech and cut from my life) and made a list of those qualities. Amazingly enough, I have drawn the most remarkable man into my life by leaning back, practicing the techniques (I make lots of mistakes, but interestingly enough, it doesn’t matter!), not dating anyone who doesn’t match my 42 item list of criteria (really!)

    Now here’s the cool part: I am 50 years old, overweight, attractive but not remarkably so, and it doesn’t matter! I am having the time of my life and realizing that girl energy has little to do with appearance and everything to do with feminine energy — I don’t pretend, I simply relax into who I am and delight in it! It feels great to be me, to be female, to be vulnerable and to express that in a relaxed way. In less than a year, I met the man of my dreams (he met 41 of the 42 items!) and plans to marry me in April. He makes my heart sing, and I am getting lots of practice leaning back and letting him row. It makes him happy, and it makes me happy.

    Thank you, Rori. I am proof of what’s possible, and just wanted to encourage everyone to keep going… Practice will remove insecurity, circular dating will, too. It really is a pretty instant change, once I believed it was possible and truly tried the exercises and gave it a whole hearted effort.

    Warm regards and a gleeful cyber hug,

  64.  #64Rori Raye on October 22, 2009 at 10:23 pm

    Oh, Sher, Thank you for your wonderful story, and BRAVA to you! Love, Rori

  65.  #65Michelle on October 27, 2009 at 1:33 pm

    First I want to say that I have def struggled with jealousy in basically all of my past relationships. I will add that in almost all of those relationships I wasn’t getting what I really wanted and needed out of the situation and so the attention to anyone else just set me off and made me feel like I wasnt good enough. In hindsight though, in all of these situations I realized that it was my gut instinct that made me feel the way I did.

    First instance was a guy I dated for 3 years and was engaged to. His ex still talked to him and even called me and caused all sorts of problems for us. It drove me nuts and eventually it stopped but there would be the occasional contact that would irk me and eventually (not due to jealousy) I ended our engagement because I knew I was not ready and it just wasnt the right thing for me and him, we were better as friends. The week after it ended…he hooked up with his ex.

    The guy following him always was talking to women and it bothered me a lot. Most of them we worked with which made it even worse. I eventually found out that he was talking to them late at night about very inappropriate things on MY computer that I would leave at his place all the time.

    The last relationship I was in was very hard on me. It lasted a little over a year and the guy never told me he loved me, how he felt in any way other than liked me, and never gave positive affirmation like “you look nice” etc. This annoyed me and really hurt my feelings and he would always say that I expected it which made him not want to do it. He said he just wasnt that kind of guy…which would have been a great explaination except that he had told me about the last girlfriend he had and how he had treated her…which was basically like a princess. I struggled with things regarding his ex a lot even though they really didnt talk much anymore. He always told me how he was completely over her and had no desire to remain in contact. The day we broke up we had a fight about him keeping the numbers of all the girls from his past, including hers in his phone. He said that he had no intention of talking to them again…and my response was simply then why keep their numbers, basically calling his bluff. We ended things officially…but continued to talk for months after. Then I found out that they had been in contact and talked basically every day. Not only that but he had gone on vacation to California and she met him there and spent a week together..(she is married). I was so infuriated and hurt. Looking back on all of those situations I could always feel when something was off. The relationships werent what they should be which left the door open for me to worry about these other women, ex’s or friends. Since then I have had such a different thought process when it comes to jealousy and girl/guy friendships. — I guess when it comes down to it, now I realize that I don’t want to keep a guy from something he WANTS to do. Because the bottom line is, HE wants it and the more you fight it the worse it becomes. And if what he wants to do is something harmful to your relationship, then its probably not a situation you should be a part of. But I see so many relationships were women dont allow their men to go out and do this that or the other. There is a fine line between setting yourself up/putting yourself in a bad or inticing situation and just completely shutting a person off from any and all opportunities. In that case….I dont want someone to only be faithful to me because they havent had a chance not to be. Not that I would ever purposely tempt or want the person im with to throw themselves into a hard situation. But I would want to know that if something came up, he knew that I left my grip loose enough where he can make the choice on his own not to do something that would hurt me or put our relationship in danger. Allowing the freedom for your man to choose you on his own and not because he is under your thumb.

    I feel good saying all of that. I hope it gives some good perspective to everyone. And please dont get me wrong, the feelings are still there sometimes, a twinge or moment where I feel like I want to grip tighters and put my foot down. But I always remind myself that I want them to stay because they want to not because ive made them. I deserve that peace and comfort in a relationship and when its right it feels right. 🙂 I think ive rambled on enough for now. Thanks everyone for all the great posts and comments. I LOVE IT!

  66.  #66Simply Shannon on October 27, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    Michelle: I feel completely in agreement! Nodding my head, yes, yes, yes. I’ve learned this lesson the hard way too. TRUST MY INSTINCTS! If something isn’t right, I trust myself to feel what it is I’m feeling and speak it outloud.

    I just had the same thing happen. Something just didn’t feel right. Found out he cheated on me. Then after when we were still talking (stupid mistake #1), I felt something wasn’t right that he was talking to another woman. “we’re just friends so what’s the big deal?” Blah, blah, blah. After we broke up… you guessed it, he’s seeing her now. As much as it hurt to find out what I knew to be true, I felt relieved to know my instincts were right!

    I won’t hold on so tightly anymore. If a man wants to be released, then by all means GO. There’s gonna be someone else to fill his shoes in a skinny minute. 🙂

  67.  #67Sandi on December 10, 2009 at 3:23 am

    I am new to Rori’s prorams. I have recently purchased modern siren. I have been in number of bad relationships, mostly abusive, and I am proud to say that I have gotten out of them and off that track and moved on in my life. At the moment I am involved in a ong distant relationship with a wonderful man that I have know for 10 years. We were friends first, more like couple friends, My second husband and I with he and his now ex wife, although she never really had any time to participate in the friendship. My husband passed away 8 years ago, and he got divorced 3 years ago. He was always a very special and understanding man, and was a great support to me during difficult times. Our relationship has taken on a new position and we have been talking about marriage. It is just hard from the distance point of view. In any event, he has female friends that he has been friends with for a long time, and I know I try to be understanding of the friendships. I know that he is exclusive with me, however recently one female friend in particular was in a difficult situation and my guy was there with a shoulder to cry on. She had a problem with being stalked by her ex, and he took her to some of her clinical training one weekend. I tried to be understanding, but at the same time inside I was a bit concerned (jealous), but I didn not show that to him, I just told him I knew they had been friends for a long time and that I trusted him, however I told him that I know how women can be and I wasn’t so sure I trusted her. I just did not want to let him see the jealousy in me, and I guess I leaned back a bit, and stayed positive in myself as a woman. I did not ask that he call me while he was taking her to the clinicals she had to complete, and I did not call him, or text him. I waited for him to contact me, which he did and when he would contact me it was to tell me he loved me. I did not ask for his reassurance, bur every conversation he reasured me that I was the woman he loved and wanted to spend the rest of his life with.
    After this little weekend trip, he called and told me how frustrated he was that this femae friend had not talked to him since the weekend. I told him that his female friend wanted more from him than just friendship, and she was upset with him because he did not make a move on her. He did not believe me, because that has never been anypart of their friendship. About a month later she finally called him and told him that she was very upset because he did not make a move, and told him how hard she tried. Well he told her that he loved me and he was never going to be more than friends with her. He still talks to her, and listens to her problems, he thinks they can remain friends. I think there will always be a bit of jealousy on my part and at times it is hard to keep under wraps. I am just unsure if I should let him know that I get jealous, or should I just keep my focus on myself? He knows that I am not into game playing and usually I tell it like it is.
    Am I wrong to not let him know of my jealousy streak?

  68.  #68Rori Raye on December 11, 2009 at 12:23 pm

    Sandi, Welcome, and it seems like you’re doing really well with this. Simple – always speak the truth. It’s the WAY you do it that makes the difference. You WANT to share your feelings, but make sure it doesn’t hinge on what he does. The long distance sucks. That’s the issue – getting physically close to each other and married or living together, or travelling together for years, or whatever you want here. Put together some speeches, we’ll all help, where you simply share that the long distance between you feels hard sometimes, that you’re just a girl here, and sometimes you feel jealous and weird and uncomfortable about other women around him. You feel possessive…and you don’t like feeling that way…but that the most important thing for you is openness and you just didn’t want to be about hiding how you feel. And that you trust him, you know he’s a good man…and you know this woman is not a threat, and yet you wanted him to know. Do it with a sense of humor and make sure it’s coming from a place of confidence and sharing, and not wanting him to DO anything about it. If what you actually want is for him to stop talking with her so much….then that’s a whole other thing, and you’ll have to negotiate it. Love, Rori

    ALTERNATIVELY…there’s nothing to be jealous here about, except for the time he gives to her, when the time you have with him is limited.

  69.  #69sonora on June 12, 2012 at 5:28 am

    This happened to me. Woman out there for Goodness sake Do NOT demand him to end friendship with an old girlfriend. You will create a vine that says she’s better than me…and you will loose the one you love.

    I lost the one I loved. The chemistry was so there. We couldn’t keep ourselves from being publicly happy. If he just went through a breakup chances are she misses him and might want contact with her. What ever you do please act confident.

    Rori, I want my ex back! Help!

  70.  #70Benna on July 30, 2012 at 6:23 am

    The man I am in an exclusively sexual relationship with just told me that a mutual friend of ours (who is married) tried to kiss him the other night. They were working on a project together and she gave him a ride home. She was being seductive and tried to kiss him. Additionally, she has been trying to convince him to have an affair with her. He said he would not want to hurt anyone and he wouldn’t do it. He said he told me because he wanted to talk with someone about it. I feel very jealous, even though he did nothing wrong. I do not want to continue to be friends with this woman; I told him so. I don’t want him to continue a friendship with her. At the same time, I don’t feel I have a “claim” on him and I don’t want to tell him what to do. Thoughts?

  71.  #71Rori Raye on July 30, 2012 at 9:30 am

    Benna – What a “Desperate Housewives” kind of situation – and tricky and hard. Except – your boyfriend confided in you! I think that’s pretty damn cool! doesn’t sound like he wants anything to do with this.

    First, I’d share with him how shaky and creepy the whole thing feels to you, and ask him how he’d like to handle the situation so you can both feel comfortable. Let him tell you, and respect his opinion and desire. I’d drop the woman from your life (and not have social interaction with her as a couple) – but you need his permission to tell her why. And there will ALWAYS be other women. Always. If he told you straight out – I hardly think he’s going to take her up on anything. He’s probably creeped out himself. Read Dr. Sheri Meyers “Chatting Or Cheating” – and call her if you need to talk with someone who knows exactly how to handle situations like this. Love, Rori

  72.  #72Nicole on August 29, 2012 at 3:33 pm

    Dear Rori,
    I am in a similar but more f’ed up situation here… My husband of 6 years has an old female friend who he had hooked up with one time years before we were together. I didn’t have and issue with her, I’m still friends with some of my old boyfriends. But recently it has become much more then friendly in my opinion. She broke up with her long term bf and started talking much more to my hubby. (btw she lives in another state so this is all via txt) So I guess one night she got drunk and was texting to him that she was seeing a new guy that she liked and got new lingerie for him. Well it didn’t take long before she was sending him nudie pics in her lingerie (freaking ho) and the convo turned scandalous. I found out because the genius husband forwarded the pics to his email so he could get a better look and left his email open on our home computer. (like I said, genius). So naturally I go absolutley postal. He does the I’m sorry wont happen again routine. I’m still furious and hurt. I write him a letter using all my nice feeling sentences. I think he gets it because obviously he doesnt want to hurt me. He says shes just a friend and that if he knew id be so pissed he bever would have done it blah blah. But he lied and hid it and if he didnt encourage it he certainly didnt put a stop to it. Meanwhile a couple weeks later I see on his phone (yes is was being a skeevy snoop) and see they have had addiional scandalous talks not acceptable for a married man to be having since I confronted him the first time! I decide that im leaving if he doesnt cut her off completely and we see a counselor. He freaks and makes an appt for us. We see the counselor and He tells her that these conversations are not going to happen anymore. I send her an exeptionally polite considering the circumstances letter telling her to go away. He at first complains that im being mean By makig him disown a frIend he’s had for 20 years but eventually agrees to do whatever I need to fix it. So great.
    Fast forward 3 months. Things seem good but this dumb ho is still a FB friend and comments in his posts. Which makes me feel livid because I want to set her on fire everytime I see her stupid ho face. And I see that they still talk via txt, though from what I see it is just normal banter. No more slut-tactic chats. But what do I do?? She is supposed to be gone from our lives but she’s not. I don’t want to feel like checking up on him. I dont want to feel like a crazy person. He doesn’t seem to get it and seems to think as long as im not screaming and hes not having trashy talk with her that everything is fine. Helppppp!

  73.  #73Nicole on August 29, 2012 at 3:34 pm

    Dear Rori,
    I am in a similar but more f’ed up situation here… My husband of 6 years has an old female friend who he had hooked up with one time years before we were together. I didn’t have and issue with her, I’m still friends with some of my old boyfriends. But recently it has become much more then friendly in my opinion. She broke up with her long term bf and started talking much more to my hubby. (btw she lives in another state so this is all via txt) So I guess one night she got drunk and was texting to him that she was seeing a new guy that she liked and got new lingerie for him. Well it didn’t take long before she was sending him nudie pics in her lingerie (freaking ho) and the convo turned scandalous. I found out because the genius husband forwarded the pics to his email so he could get a better look and left his email open on our home computer. (like I said, genius). So naturally I go absolutley postal. He does the I’m sorry wont happen again routine. I’m still furious and hurt. I write him a letter using all my nice feeling sentences. I think he gets it because obviously he doesnt want to hurt me. He says shes just a friend and that if he knew id be so pissed he bever would have done it blah blah. But he lied and hid it and if he didnt encourage it he certainly didnt put a stop to it. Meanwhile a couple weeks later I see on his phone (yes is was being a skeevy snoop) and see they have had addiional scandalous talks not acceptable for a married man to be having since I confronted him the first time! I decide that im leaving if he doesnt cut her off completely and we see a counselor. He freaks and makes an appt for us. We see the counselor and He tells her that these conversations are not going to happen anymore. I send her an exeptionally polite considering the circumstances letter telling her to go away. He at first complains that im being mean By makig him disown a frIend he’s had for 20 years but eventually agrees to do whatever I need to fix it. So great.
    Fast forward 3 months. Things seem good but this dumb ho is still a FB friend and comments in his posts. Which makes me feel livid because I want to set her on fire everytime I see her stupid ho face. And I see that they still talk via txt, though from what I see it is just normal banter. No more slut-tactic chats. But what do I do?? She is supposed to be gone from our lives but she’s not. I don’t want to feel like checking up on him. I dont want to feel like a crazy person. He doesn’t seem to get it and seems to think as long as im not screaming and hes not having trashy talk with her that everything is fine. Helppppp!

  74.  #74Rori Raye on August 29, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Nicole! You’re not going to like this – so don’t read if you don’t want some tough love:

    So – what are YOU doing to save your marriage except making demands? The coach for you is Dominique at http://www.sexandheart.com

    How about YOU send your husband nudie pics (perhaps no face shots – Dominique knows how to do this….so he can look at them on his computer and put them on his phone! You have to affair-proof the relationship – not just tell him to damp down his instincts. You have to give him what he needs that he’s getting from this woman – and she’ll disappear. Right now you’re giving him nothing but a hard time (this is possibly not true – but it’s what you’re SAYING here..). Love, Attraction, Sex – it’s not something you get to assume and demand. He’s clearly not a cheater, or he wouldn’t have been so obvious about moving the pics to his computer – he’s likely pretty clueless – and you’re just making things worse.

    There are ways to handle this kind of thing that ends marriages, and ways that enhance marriages. Which do you want – and it doesn’t matter that you’re RIGHT about everything! Do you want to be right or happy? Love, Rori

  75.  #75Holly on February 28, 2013 at 9:56 am

    Would say i’ve been in a similar situation and it was really difficult. I had been seeing a guy I worked with and had been really wary of getting involved for the fear of getting hurt and because I didn’t want to lose his friendship. He’d pursued me for months and I felt like I couldn’t deny my feelings any longer. In the end, I told myself to stop being so silly and enjoy what we had and as soon as I started doing that, it was all going just great.

    Then, a new female friend of his cropped up. This being another co-worker. All of a sudden, I suddenly felt like I was playing second fiddle to her, he would hardly talk to me at work, we stopped spending time together outside work and she seemed obsessed with his private life (we were keeping our relationship quiet). This was all going on in front of my face and it started to really annoy me. One day, I happened to look up from my desk to see her throwing bits of paper off him. I had enough and blew up at him when we (finally) got a moment to ourselves. He at first thought I was joking but I wasn’t and we ended up having another argument with me asking him if he’d got fed up with me as he never seemed to have any time for me anymore and I felt like I was all of a sudden second best. He denied it all.

    The week after, we broke up after he called off a weekend away early. I was really hurt and upset and what made the whole thing worse was, I’d to face him at work, the pair of them sat opposite me and would do nothing but caper and carry on in front of me. She was engaged at the time but I felt like her behaviour was out of order for an engaged woman. I put up with being ignored by him and I cried in the work toilets everyday for weeks before I finally summoned the courage to tell him that we needed to sort things out.

    I confronted him over her and asked if he’d feelings etc for her, all of which he denied, then I asked why all of a sudden I was suddenly dropped for her and the response was “Oh she’s a good laugh”. I told him that I felt as though i was left out of every conversation between them, I’d try and join in but everytime, felt as though my contribution wasn’t wanted, needed or welcome to which he told me I was welcome to join in if I wanted. But then I said, “Its a bit difficult to talk to the pair of you, when you sit with your back turned me, which as good as says, I don’t want you around anymore”. He couldn’t answer.

    it was an impossible situation, I felt lost, hurt and felt like I’d lost my best friend. The girl didn’t make things easy for me, asking him questions about his personal life, marriage, kids and then one giving him dating advice, all of which with me in full earshot. I should have really stood up and torn a strip off her but I couldn’t and would instead leave the room and go to the toilets and cry.

    In a way, i regret going mental over her but I felt as though I couldn’t take any more of it and I really just wanted her to back off. Instead, I felt like I let her win and despite the fact she was engaged to someone else, I didn’t like her behaviour and she made me feel really threatened and I felt like she could have had more tact post breakup (I’d personally NEVER do that to another girl).

    She eventually left the company but him and her meet up often and instead, I’ve lost my friend and I’d do anything to have him back. We don’t talk anymore and that’s what’s really hurt me.

  76.  #76Rori Raye on February 28, 2013 at 11:36 am

    Holly, Welcome, and this has happened to me, and I know it’s happened to many in this community. The thing here is – this is going to repeat itself over and over until you learn the skills you need to prevent it from happening. They are emotional skills, keying into what’s actually going on instead of what you’re making up in your head, and a way to communicate that makes you feel better. You can start on these skills in my ebook, and everything you read here, and we’ll help you. Love, Rori