If You Want To Hear Him Say “I Love You” – Read This

Untitled design (14)

Here’s a letter from Rachel, who’s got that age-old dilemma of how to be happy with a good man – even if he doesn’t fill in all the blanks for you…

“Dear Rori, I try to follow your invaluable advice… I have read your book twice now and I think it has helped although I have run into a real doozy with my new boyfriend.

We were friends for a year, I didn’t even see him as relationship material until he started to do so many things for me with regard to helping around my house and with my career. We became business partners and then… soon after I finally said goodbye for the last time to my ex I suddenly noticed him.

How sweet and thoughtful he was and how he seemed to be there for me. One thing lead to another and within a couple of months we were sleeping together.

It quickly escalated to every night! I love that he calls me everyday, wants to see me every night, even if we don’t have sex. even if it is usually under the guise of business.

The problem is that he has told me how he felt about me only once (and we’re going on 4 months now) when he had to travel out of town and missed me. He finally confessed that he’d liked me since we met and felt too intimidated to ask me out.

It was very sweet, although over the phone, and we talked for a couple of hours and both confessed our feelings, it was great and what I had been waiting to hear.

But then I went to visit him and it all returned back to the same never talking about anything.

He never has taken me on a real date (we’re both very broke though), but not even for just a drink. We’ve gone out, but I am a social person and it’s always at my instigation and usually along with other friends.

I am used to men who tell me how they feel or at least tell me the things they like about me. I feel as though we are still just good friends, but we sleep together.

I trust him completely and don’t think he’s looking for anyone else so I feel like I’m being spoiled by wanting to hear it from him. I’m not the best communicator but I’ve tried to bring it up and he doesn’t seem to get it.

I think he’s trying to show me by doing so many wonderful things for me so I hesitate to push it because in every other way he gives me exactly what I want which is time spent together. But he never makes it feel special. He said he’s not romantic but I’ve never experienced anyone who so honestly seems to feel that way.

Am I being needy, wanting some validation? Or is validation normal to want in a relationship? He hasn’t had many girlfriends and is much younger than me, so I want to be patient and possibly show him. But I’m not sure if that’s just pushing and I should just accept him for how he is… I think I will eventually leave or cheat if it stays the same.

Craving romance ….Rachel”

My Answer:

***Briefly, Rachel, here’s what I’ll focus on – since none of your relationships (you mention your ex) have ever really worked out (is that right?) then why are you trying to push this one – which clearly IS working – into the dust bin?

Some men just aren’t romantic, some men can’t say they love you (though it sounds like you had a very fulfilling phone conversation).

This is not about “romance.”

This is about the big ticket items:

Do you want to be married to him?

Do you want to live with him?

When do you suppose that should start to come together?

Do you see him moving in that direction?

Are you spending so much time together that living together and marriage seem like a logical next step?

Or are you “dating” – in which case you should also be “dating” many other men at the same time.

The 3rd and 4th month of a relationship is very challenging – that’s when things turn real or they don’t.

What YOU have to do is to start saying not what you WANT – but what you DON’T want – you don’t want to “date” him exclusively indefinitely without knowing where you’re headed or how he feels, and if he just isn’t lighting your fire – perhaps your fire is lit by men who do not treat you well (this guy’s ACTIONS are speaking louder than words – sounds like he’s “giving” to you.

The next few weeks are for you to become more vulnerable, for you to see if you enjoy his company and want the relationship to move on to marriage, and see what he does.

They are for you to keep your options open until he tells you to shut them down. He has to make these decisions, and pushing him is not only useless – it does not serve you.

Take care of yourself, enjoy him on a moment by moment basis – and see if those moments grow into a lifetime.

Stay in touch with your feelings and you’ll know what’s happening – pushing him to give to you in the way you want him to give to you will not work.

Let him know whenever he does something you LIKE, and let him know whenever he does something you don’t like.

Let him know how it feels – what about your relationship makes you feel “not special” – all that (but first – really examine your own feelings, motives – what you really want for the long run.

I say brava to you to know that if things don’t work for you the way you like, you’re happy to leave and let another man make you happy. It also sounds like this guy deserves a shot.

Love, Rori

And I just received this from Rachel:

“Rori, Thank you so much for your awesome response… you seem to have hit the nail on the head. I do believe he is worth a shot. I will follow your advice with an emphasis on telling him what I LIKE… and DON’T like. We have made a little headway since I wrote you and actually, the approach I took is right in line with the advice you are giving me.

Once I backed off at being angry about it and really tried to understand his motives and trust that he does want to be with me without having to hear it first, it seemed to fall into place a little more naturally.

I had to patiently communicate my thoughts on relationships and my needs very clearly so that he didn’t immediately go into the old “this girl is pushing me to giving up my own sense of self for her” thing that he and a lot of men seem to fall into when put into this position.

I told him that I liked the way he was and didn’t want him to change his ambitions and goals and sense of independence (which is what attracted me to him in the first place), but that I needed to communicate my needs in order to feel comfortable. I also told him that “I look at every relationship as though it is going to last forever…now so far none of them have, and guess what? It was okay” … and that got a laugh out of him and helped ease him into openly discussing the future.

I got out of him (It wasn’t easy and took two phone conversations and a final talk in person) that he does want a relationship, doesn’t want me to see other men and is open to the idea that visions of the future are always subject to change and to keep an open mind.

Which for now is enough for me. That may change in time, and I will follow your advice and keep at it…But I am a fan of letting things progress naturally, as he is. And pushing was as you said… “pushing it into the dust bin” and making me more miserable.

Thank you for recognizing that he is giving to me… It helps to hear that you see that.

Many of my friends can’t understand why I’m so crazy about him, but when you said that “my fire may be lit by men who don’t treat me so well” you were right on.

I think I’m finally recognizing that and to have someone who is giving of their time and energy and someone so trustworthy as well, is just an amazing feeling. I do feel as though he is quite a hidden treasure that I really want to cherish.

Thank you for being so in tune Rori. You are doing a great service for my often irrational state of mind when it comes to love. And no doubt for others as well.

Thank you, thank you, thank you….

The take-away here is that most stuff we think matters doesn’t matter at all.

It doesn’t matter what other people think, it doesn’t matter what our family thinks, it doesn’t matte what your “brain” thinks – what matters is that you feel “met” emotionally, that your physical, emotional, psychological, romantic needs are being filled enough so that you feel a constant sense of well being and contentment and comfort when you’re around a man and when you aren’t.

FEELING loved – and TRUSTING you are loved is where it’s at – and when you’re feeling that – you can speak to a man so directly and truthfully and emotionally authentic that he will change what he needs to in order to make you happy. Period.

So …look for that. Look for your feelings, not for what a man is like on paper.

Love, Rori


Posted in


  1.  #1Femininewoman on July 18, 2011 at 7:22 am

    Thanks again for another article.

  2.  #2Femininewoman on July 18, 2011 at 7:27 am

    “FEELING loved – and TRUSTING you are loved is where it’s at”. I believe I can do this regardless of what is in front of me. I can do this through my self talk because I love me.

  3.  #3Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 8:48 am

    Hello, world. I am thankful for siren marina. I just read, on the previous thread, her post with the time and date web site link. I’ve not seen that web site yet but I’m excited about it. I think I might get some really good dates for my calendar agenda.

    I’m feeling yummy… a little hungry too; I haven’t had breakfast.


  4.  #4Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 8:51 am

    The take-away here is that most stuff we think matters doesn’t matter at all.

    It doesn’t matter what other people think, it doesn’t matter what our family thinks, it doesn’t matte what your “brain” thinks – what matters is that you feel “met” emotionally, that your physical, emotional, psychological, romantic needs are being filled enough so that you feel a constant sense of well being and contentment and comfort when you’re around a man and when you aren’t.

    FEELING loved – and TRUSTING you are loved is where it’s at – and when you’re feeling that – you can speak to a man so directly and truthfully and emotionally authentic that he will change what he needs to in order to make you happy. Period.

    So …look for that. Look for your feelings, not for what a man is like on paper.

    Love, Rori


    WOW! I couldn’t agree more, and it goes both ways. This is great advice to men also when looking for a wife. Most of what you think, or others tell you to think is important, just isn’t. Which is why I think my attitude is a health one. I want a woman that i feel loved by, feel comfortable with. I can live out of a tent with this woman and be happy. I can’t live in a mansion with the wrong woman and be happy.

  5.  #5Mel on July 18, 2011 at 9:08 am

    Lilybelle, FW, SLV, Rusty,

    Yeah, I’m not going to worry too much about it. At first it made my heart jump when she emailed, wondering what it could possibly be. But then when I thought about it, I realized that ANYTHING she had to share with me wouldn’t change the outcome anyway.

    If I found out he was having an affair, it might explain some stuff… but in reality it would probably have just piled on more hurt. If there was something else, drug/alcohol concerns (just as an example) …again, me knowing about it wouldn’t really change anything. It would be something he would have to want to change for himself.

    Then again, she might have just wanted to have a coffee and the timing didn’t work out well for either of us. I’ll never know. But I’m not going to fret about it! 🙂

    AND the knowledge wouldn’t really change how I feel at this point. I don’t want to be with a man that after 10 years of marriage doesn’t KNOW that he loves me. I want a man that knows how special I am, appreciates my spunky personality, likes my nerdy humor, thinks I’m beautiful, wants intimacy, enjoys spending time with me, etc. J can’t / wont be that person.

    I’m still looking into overseas opportunities, checking into requirements, trying to prepare in case I get some interest. I have a good feeling. It’s strange, but I know something will work out for me. I want to be happy, and I know this will make me happy. I DESERVE to be happy!

  6.  #6DE on July 18, 2011 at 9:08 am

    Beautiful post Rori…

    It brought back memories of my last relationship…
    i feel sad i just could not keep him on my saddle…

    i recall the feelings making the decision to write him the “notice” not to contact me again in any shape or form…

    i felt sooo unsafe around him…:(

    now, i can feel compassion for him…been dreaming of him a lot…i often wonder what would i say should i ever run into him…

    i feel pain still…it’s been six months since the last time i saw him…

    i feel paralyzed at times to move forward…i feel better alone…not dating…feeling free and unattached…i know i feel afraid …it’s interesting how on one hand i feel strong…yet, on the other hand i feel afraid…oh….yes, i feel strong if i stay still within my perceived comfort zone…yet, one step forward feels frightening…:(

    i love my fears…they want to protect me…

    I remind myself healing takes some time…baby steps seem appropriate…

  7.  #7DE on July 18, 2011 at 9:09 am


  8.  #8AmazingMe on July 18, 2011 at 9:20 am

    @4 Rusty: Amazing words and so true…I too want that feeling of intense love no matter where you are and what you have the love binds you. Work together to build and stabalize your lives together…good stuff!

  9.  #9dcd on July 18, 2011 at 9:21 am

    I know I have a good man, and I believe he loves me. Our situation is that he believes telling someone he loves them implies promises of a future. I understand there are no guarantees and no promises. It’s just nice to hear the words I love you. I don’t push him or suggest it and I have only written the words in a greeting card at Christmas time. I do love him. I believe he loves me. I just want him to tell me. Even if it’s only once. I don’t need a lot of stroking…I’m comfortable with the way we treat eachother. I really like our relationship. I would just tweak that one thing. Any advice?

  10.  #10AmazingMe on July 18, 2011 at 9:23 am

    You can have everything you have ever wanted and be miserable with the wrong person! I would much rather have happiness in my life. Money buys everything but happiness…happiness is earned, respected, and is a lifelong gift that gives forever as long as u let it…

  11.  #11dcd on July 18, 2011 at 9:24 am

    And the reason I wrote I love you in the greeting card was because that is what I was feeling for him. My feelings of love for him don’t hinge on his feelings for me. Although I want him to love me…I would accept if he didn’t…But I would also probably back off the relationship and date others as well as him.

  12.  #12AmazingMe on July 18, 2011 at 9:26 am

    @9 That is tough everyone is different and shows love in different ways. If you love him and he loves you and you feel it that is most important. Ask yourself would you rather he say he loves you yet his actions speak otherwise or would you rather him show it and make you feel it without saying a word? Just a thought…

  13.  #13dcd on July 18, 2011 at 9:28 am

    @12 I would MUCH rather his actions speak to me. That’s why I’m not too concerned about him “speaking the words”. It would just be nice.

  14.  #14AmazingMe on July 18, 2011 at 9:33 am

    @13 I know what you mean I have been there once myself. I guess there is no pushing that issue we just have to take care of ourselves.

  15.  #15Femininewoman on July 18, 2011 at 9:37 am

    RE 10 Amen to that

  16.  #16Femininewoman on July 18, 2011 at 9:41 am

    RE 12 I have had the experience of a man saying he loves me but his actions had me wondering sometimes. I believe he said it because it made him feel good because of the power of it over the other person. I dunno. I believe his love language was words of affirmation/kind words. He said when someone used words of appreciation it would light him up.

  17.  #17Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 9:46 am



    You SO got this!

    What a Siren!

  18.  #18dcd on July 18, 2011 at 9:46 am

    I sometimes think he feels afraid of saying “i love you” because HE reads more into it than just it meaning i care about you, i’m happy with you and I want to be with you…at this moment…..I think he feels like if he SAYS it out loud, that I will read into it what HE reads into it, which is I love you means you want to marry a person. (Which may or may not be the case…it may mean that for him, but it does not mean that to me.) I totally get that there are no guarantees and I am fine with that. I just want him to feel safe and comfortable….but I will not push it or even mention it because although i would like to hear it, i do not NEED to hear it.

  19.  #19Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 9:48 am

    In case anyone was wondering…

    I am freaking FABULOUS! YAY ME!

    And, I am ALL Freaking THAT!

    Yes, Yes, I am!!


    A little self talk can’t hurt anyone, right?

  20.  #20Mel on July 18, 2011 at 9:50 am

    Yal Lilybeylle! YOu are freaking fantabulous!

  21.  #21Mel on July 18, 2011 at 9:51 am

    lol… I can’t type today! (because I am freaking fantabulous! ) 😉

  22.  #22sugar n spice on July 18, 2011 at 9:54 am

    How do you deal with it when a man you’re dating is really caring, attentive, affectionate and wonderful when you are together, but when you’re apart there is not enough communication to make you happy?

    How do you learn to not push things? To let the relationship progress on its own? I know trying to push things doesn’t work, but I’m sooo not used to this feeling.

  23.  #23Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 9:57 am

    @9: dcd says:
    “…he believes telling someone he loves them implies promises of a future. …I’m comfortable with the way we treat eachother. I really like our relationship. I would just tweak that one thing. Any advice?…”

    Since you asked, I have three.
    1) acknowledge to yourself whether he has TOLD you he believes telling someone (YOU) implies promises of a future… or is this a story you have told yourself. Either way you will know the truth…. then proceed to steps two and three.

    2) do not continue telling him that you love him. Your post indicates that you cannot say this without wanting him to say it you. I would not want this kind of pressure from someone, it might even kill the attraction and affection I was feeling. I might be less eager to continue the relationship and instead want to kill it while I had the chance.
    “I just want him to tell me. Even if it’s only once.

    3) instead of saying “I love you” which means different things to different people and can be pressurizing, find another catch phrase to use when the “I-L-Y” urge hits. It could be affectionate, light hearted and not deadly pressurizing. It should be something you don’t say to other people, only to him.

    “you’re my sweet jelly bean…” That’s kind of silly but it could be that or whatever you choose… and it would become something private between the two of you.

    I hope this helps.


  24.  #24Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 9:57 am

    19: LilybelleNo Gravatar says:

    In case anyone was wondering…

    I am freaking FABULOUS! YAY ME!

    And, I am ALL Freaking THAT!

    Yes, Yes, I am!!


    A little self talk can’t hurt anyone, right?


    Somebody is in a great mood today. 😉

  25.  #25tinque on July 18, 2011 at 9:58 am

    dcd – Some men just aren’t that into the words. I know it feels so good hearing it, yet hearing it without a single word, eg. the way he looks at you, touches you, looks out for you, etc. says as much if not more.

    I waited three years for those words, and it was an amazing lesson for me, to hear I love you without a single utterance. K to this day doesn’t say it all that much. Yes I love hearing it, but the rest feels so much better to me.


  26.  #26Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 10:04 am

    @18: dcd says:

    “…..I think he feels like if…”

    I’m adding another step, the first three are mine but I believe this fourth step is also from Rori…

    4) Stay out of his head.

    [back to me] There is a lot of mind reading going on. Continue to enjoy your relationship. Let it grow; please don’t hunt it down and smash it.


  27.  #27Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 10:06 am


    I agree with that post. What are our feelings as to why men will sometimes start out saying it a lot but then get to the point that they rarely say it?

    My feeling is that it happens mostly because of the reaction they get in return. For instance, when he first says it to a woman, he eyes may light up and she appears to be glowing with happiness. This makes him feel good. But over time, she doesn’t light up like that anymore. So he is less motivated to say it. Maybe it even hurts a bit to see the lack of glow, so it is easier to just not say it, that way he doesn’t see the lack of glow.

    Now both may love each other very much. She may love hearing it but doesn’t realize that she isn’t glowing as much as she used to. But she shows it in other ways also.

    What do you think?

  28.  #28Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 10:10 am

    @19: Lilybelle says:
    “..In case anyone was wondering…
    I am freaking FABULOUS! YAY ME!…:

    Yes! Me too (even with the freckles, birthmarks, moles, skin tags, bumps, scars and other assorted spots 😳 )

    Yay! 😀

  29.  #29dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:11 am

    @23 We have had a conversation where we discussed that a lot of times he thinks people are insinuating things or that people mean things other than what they are actually saying. He has a habit of jumping to conclusions (his words). He said he has always done this…(this conversation was not about “us”) and i try to gently point out to him when he does this that there may be another way of looking at things…just take people’s words for what they are, not for what you think they might mean.

    I do not tell him i love him. i only wrote it in a christmas card because that was what i was feeling right then…and i still feel that way, but like i said, i do not want him to feel uncomfortable or pressured so I do things and treat him in a way that makes him feel loved, but i do not pressure him into feeling he needs to tell me he loves me by telling him I love him out loud….and i really am okay with that. I feel confident that as our relationship progresses he will tell me eventually, if and and when he is ready…if not, so be it….he is good to me and makes me feel loved, and yes, that is what matters. the topic of the discussion is “if you want to hear him say I love you”….and I do….but I feel loved already and him not saying it is NOT a deal breaker because i do FEEL it. i just think it would be nice to hear.

    and i like the suggestions. i think he would be more comfortable doing that. in his own time! no pressure here. i don’t want it from him and i don’t want him to feel pressured either.

  30.  #30Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 10:16 am

    @29: dcd



  31.  #31dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:16 am

    @26 “…..I think he feels like if…”

    I’m adding another step, the first three are mine but I believe this fourth step is also from Rori…

    4) Stay out of his head.

    I’m not really in his head….these are things he has said…I may not be expressing myself very well in this forum.

  32.  #32DE on July 18, 2011 at 10:19 am

    Expressing some frustration around dating…hoping to get some clarity as I let it all out…

    I leave on the west coast…and dating has been quite a challenge since following your rules, Rori…why? well…I stopped roaring the boat…stopped initiating contact when they don’t…filling in the blank for them…and as a result…they “poof”…:(

    Rori, I do have a dilemma…it appears there are more men nowadays interested in a 50/50 relationship and also highly feminine energy…:(

    I noticed lately being sooo turned off by the interaction…:( I tried to stay away from explaining…but rather expressing my feelings, beliefs, hopes/views of the future…they look at me as if I am an “alien”…some of them appear to get me into debates…:( i expressed i don’t feel good debating…they act confused…i understand why…because they were never confused in the past when i would speak the male voice/language…yet, i dont know what else to say/do…so, i do nothing…and they “poof”…

    Part of me feels okay with it…but my negative voices tell me I will never get all I want/desire…attraction, communication, protection, being taken care of financially…:(

    It also feels like it’s gonna take some time for currently confused/emasculated man to regain their status as leaders and main givers in a relationship…just as it will take some time for us, women, to heal our hearts and embrace our feminine roles in a relationship…

    Because of it…I feel tempted to bend some of your rules…:( Like initiating sometimes the conversation/contact via phone/txt…hmm…as i type this i feel scared…because i recall how easy is to fall into the trap of overfunctioning…being in touch with my feelings and having no expectations…is often easier said then done…:(

    I feel curious what other Sirens think…

  33.  #33mary on July 18, 2011 at 10:19 am


    this is all so relevant to what I’m going through with music man.

    here’s what spoke to me:

    “Or are you “dating” – in which case you should also be “dating” many other men at the same time.”

    now what to do? i don’t want to be music man’s girlfriend any more, but i don’t really want to put myself out there to date again, although i wouldn’t turn down offers.

    oh! that could be the way i do it.


    the thing is this: the reason to not be dating JUST ONE is because my hopes and dreams become fixed on that one. (i know this is obvious) but i’m already wondering about music man. and i BROKE UP with him, which means my hopes and dreams have moved on from him. so could i risk just dating him for a short time while i get more organized and launch my career?

    ummm, no. because very soon my hopes and dreams would latch onto him again.

    so do i need to start dating other guys to date music man?


    uh oh. now what?

    maybe it doesn’t matter? because i think i might not want to marry him? maybe i just leave it alone and keep my options open. then, when the opportunity presents itself, i’m okay to go ahead and date someone else.

    and all the questions about do i want to marry him?

    do i want to live with him?

    (i know these were for Rachel, but i’m personalizing them to learn something)

    i’m not sure i want to marry music man.

    maybe i’d rather marry someone who shared more of my values.

    so today i’ll listen to him. see what he has to say, which will all be reasons not to break up.

    and then say, “well, i see that things don’t have to be all or nothing, as you say. they’re not black and white. so yes, i’d love to see you! and no, i don’t want to go back to the way it was when we were boyfriend/girlfriend. but i do enjoy your company!”

    leave it open for me to date others, and then get on my horse (which is headed more in a career direction now) and ride.

    i know he’ll go into “well, i guess i’ll be dating other women, too.” and instead of saying i wouldn’t like that (as in the case of trying to get him to marry me), i’d just say hmmmm. because i’m not sure i want to marry him.

    he can quit asking me for dates when it’s not in his best interest to do so.

  34.  #34dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:28 am

    @33 and then say, “well, i see that things don’t have to be all or nothing, as you say. they’re not black and white. so yes, i’d love to see you! and no, i don’t want to go back to the way it was when we were boyfriend/girlfriend. but i do enjoy your company!”

    leave it open for me to date others, and then get on my horse (which is headed more in a career direction now) and ride.

    i know he’ll go into “well, i guess i’ll be dating other women, too.” and instead of saying i wouldn’t like that

    a similar thing happened to me when i was just starting to date my boyfriend. he was still dating someone else. And i told him i was going to a music festival if he’d like to meet me and my friends there…he said he would but he had other plans already…so i just said ok…..and then there was complete silence…he goes, don’t you want to know what i’m doing, and i said, no. he said, well, if that were you, i’d have a million questions…i said, well, i have plans. i invited you to come along, you said you couldn’t…that is your business. i’m trying to respect your privacy…and i didn’t ask him one question about what he was doing or who he was going with, etc. Two days later, the day the music event happened, he called me in the middle of the event and wanted to know if he could meet me there…i said, of course, but you can’t bring a date! ( i was just kidding him) he said well, in case you didn’t figure it out, i broke it off with her. I said, oh, no i didn’t realize that. It ended up he did not come to the event….but he did ask to see me exclusively the very next day.

    The point of that story was yes, what’s fair is fair….but we need to take care of ourselves and mind our own business. I did not want to know about his business. Apparently he wanted a reaction out of me. At that point, he wanted to make me his business, and I was happy with that. it has been really good ever since. We have our growing pains, but for the most part, it is a really good relationship.

  35.  #35mary on July 18, 2011 at 10:29 am

    he keeps telling me that the relationship is the thing, not the piece of paper.

    i’m gonna tell him that i’m looking for a mate. i already have a lot of relationships. with my mother, my daughters, my best friend, my dentist, my lawyer, etc.

    i want to be in that exclusively special place that is recognized by everyone, including church and state.

    the other day he told me that a friend dropped by with his “common law girl.”

    and i just didn’t like the sound of it. that’s one way that i know i’d like to be married.

    but that’s just me.

    i know that marriage is not for everyone. maybe it’s not for him! which is one of our values that clash.


    enough about me. enough about music man.

    thank you. this is helping me know what i want to decide today. before i go on my long trip tomorrow.


  36.  #36Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 10:31 am

    @5: Mel says:
    “..AND the knowledge wouldn’t really change how I feel at this point…”

    Perhaps if you don’t meet with her, you will protect the emotions of your inner little girl. If you meet with her the knowledge might change the way you negotiate your separation from your husband. If you don’t “feel” up to going, consider sending your inner “little boy” to take care of your interests.


  37.  #37mary on July 18, 2011 at 10:32 am




    i love it that you didn’t ask about his business! i love that so much!

    music man always asks about my business. i don’t like it.


  38.  #38dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:36 am

    Mary, my go-to response when someone tries to get a reaction out of me is usually “Hmm”…..that make them have to keep digging, which usually makes them back off because they know they are looking nosey, or they dig right in and i either have to say, that’s personal or that’s private or something that makes them understand i do not wish to talk about that subject with them. like when he said he already had plans, i said, Hmm. and left it at that…that’s when he couldn’t hold it in any longer. at that point though, we were both free to see others and do whatever we wanted. so i really was ok with what he was doing and i was ok with what i was doing. it wasn’t a game.

  39.  #39tinque on July 18, 2011 at 10:37 am

    Rusty – What you suggest may be true. For how many women I have no idea. It’s a valid point though.

    I can only speak for myself here. I light up not only anytime K says those words, I light up every time he comes home from work. It’s a real feeling. I love seeing him.

    The glow you speak about is there, but it doesn’t make the words come more often.

  40.  #40tinque on July 18, 2011 at 10:42 am

    Darling Ella – This all experimentation. There isn’t a right way or a wrong way. Though you want to be coming from a lean back receptive place, you are also coming from an open heart place.

    If you can initiate from a goddess rockstar place, no expectations, no agenda, then do so. If it feels right to do so, do it. If it feels bad, don’t do it.

    You will find you way in your own unique way. Play with it.


  41.  #41dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:44 am

    @39 I know what you mean. I adore my boyfriend. I can’t help but smile and get all gooey any time i see him…..the one thing that makes it okay for me that he doesn’t “tell” me he loves me is that yes, i know he loves me by the way he treats me, but i also realize that i love him with no conditions…i love him because i love him, not because i hope he loves me back….and that makes it okay for me.

  42.  #42dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:44 am

    but that doesn’t mean i don’t want to hear him say it….i don’t NEED him to say it I WANT him to say it….two separate things.

  43.  #43dcd on July 18, 2011 at 10:47 am

    @40 If you can initiate from a goddess rockstar place, no expectations, no agenda, then do so.

    I love this. This is always my goal. It makes me much happier to operate this way.

  44.  #44Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 10:48 am

    32: DE says
    “..Because of it…I feel tempted to bend some of your rules…:( …”

    Rules? What rules? I didn’t see any of those here.

    BTW, if any of those “50-50” guys have single fathers, uncles, older men friends who don’t get upset and run away if a woman they are dating suggests a fun (and probably inexpensive or free) thing to do when they want to see her, or if she calls them every now and then when things are going well, or bakes them a chocolate cupcake just for helluva it… you can let me know. I might be interested.

    Cool. 8) … things are looking up!


  45.  #45tinque on July 18, 2011 at 10:49 am

    I get it dcd. I too wanted desperately to hear the words back the. It tore me apart sometimes that he couldn’t say them.

    Like I said, I waited three years. I know you said somewhere how long you’ve been together, and I apologize for forgetting.

    If it’s been less than a year, please try to wait. If you’ve been together longer, then you may want to eventually have a little heart-to-heart about this with him. If you want help putting together a short thing to say to him, just ask.


  46.  #46Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 10:59 am


    I dig this and I like feeling that I can’t do it wrong. I almost feel like it amps my vibe up, for me personally, thinking that I can adjust and go with what works for me…

    Tolls are good but I like no rules.

  47.  #47Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 11:02 am

    @35: mary says:
    “…i want to be in that exclusively special place that is recognized by everyone, including church and state.
    the other day he told me that a friend dropped by with his “common law girl.”
    and i just didn’t like the sound of it. that’s one way that i know i’d like to be married.
    but that’s just me…”

    That’s me too and I just arrived at this state of mind about twelve months ago after decades of other intentions. I’m still dealing with it and working out the kinks. I do know that not every relationship must progress there but I want to keep myself open for it. I am not closed to marriage.

    “Common law girl” sounds to me worse than “girlfriend” or “mistress.” Kind of ewww, I wouldn’t want to be referred to that way.


  48.  #48DE on July 18, 2011 at 11:12 am


    Thank u…yes, i agree it feels like experimenting is the way to finding my own “unique way”…:)

    I feel lonely often lately…and tendency of being impatient…and scared…

    I miss feeling the affection,…the warm, strong body of a man…the connection to one man…although, i admit I never felt safe in a relationship with a man: sometimes for my own unhealed reasons…and sometimes because he could just not deliver, thus my needs were never met…

    Warm hugs,

  49.  #49DE on July 18, 2011 at 11:21 am

    SLV #44:

    “Rules? What rules? I didn’t see any of those here.”

    Lol…Okay 🙂

    Sorry, I did not quite understand the next paragraph…:(

    Warm hugs,

  50.  #50tinque on July 18, 2011 at 11:22 am

    All perfectly beautiful and normal feelings Darling Ella. I felt this way a lot before K showed up. This is when you reach out to girlfriends, not quite the same as a warm, loving embrace from a beloved, yet it helps. It really does.


  51.  #51Femininewoman on July 18, 2011 at 11:24 am

    RE 35 Mary are you sure? I have seen Rori say that what we want is a relationship.

  52.  #52dcd on July 18, 2011 at 11:27 am

    I’m not desparate to hear the words, I would just LIKE to hear them. Like I said, it is not a deal breaker as long as my heart feels love from him and he treats me with respect and kindness….and he does that…at this very moment, everything is really good. i really do come at this topic from a goddess rockstar place, no expectations, no agenda (I’ll have to use that over and over…I love it) kind of place. i have no anxiety, no desparation. i just thought today’s subject was interesting because yes, i would like to hear him say i love you….but it’s not necessary 🙂

  53.  #53dcd on July 18, 2011 at 11:29 am

    Have the courage, acceptance and humility to feel love fully. Have the strength and confidence to give your love freely.

    This is my goal with my current relationship….nobody is perfect, but it isn’t as hard as i thought it would be….

  54.  #54mary on July 18, 2011 at 11:46 am

    51: Femininewoman

    yes! i think Rori’s right. we do want relationships!

    i think the relationship set has lots of subsets:

    mother, daughter, sister, student, acquaintance, friend, date, girlfriend, wife

    i’m wanting to be in relationship as a wife. and girlfriend is now looking to me like a stopping place that sometimes doesn’t spill over to wife. i didn’t believe Rori about this and i had to try it for myself. and it could have worked for me. we were heading in a good direction then. but then we plateaued, and that made me anxious. and i don’t want to be anxious any more. i want to be proactive about what i want.

    right now i really want to get my career started. and i think i’ll meet some guys along the way. and i’d like to be able to date them.


    mm is not gonna like it. not one bit.

    but i don’t have to date anyone right now. i can date the world, as Rori says. and just make plans to do things with friends, do things with myself, be out and about, etc.

    yes! i forgot all about dating the world!

    oh, i’m so glad i’ve spent a little time on this blog…

  55.  #55DE on July 18, 2011 at 11:57 am

    Hmm…I read Mary’s post…i relate to it…

    Part of me resisting to dating…or getting serious ab it…is because of my strong inner desire to focus on the new career i am seeking…

    I completed my degree while i was married and my ex saw it as his investment (he was not even ashamed to say it)…he made me pay for it painfully…during and after our marriage…when he was packing i found my diploma in his belongings (yes, i snooped)…i felt once more cut deep in the heart…

    i no longer want to feel i owe anybody anything…besides respect and love…

    but to get there…i must feel i have completely achieved the self-respect and self-love …

    yes, that is it…this is why i resist…sigh…:(

  56.  #56tinque on July 18, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    No Darling Ella, not completely. We are all works in progress. You can even be a downright mess and still attract your special man. You may lose him if you don’t continue to work on opening yourself, but if you do and he’s your brand of good man, he will stick around. And he will likely fall even more deeply for you.


  57.  #57Plum on July 18, 2011 at 12:17 pm


    From previous thread
    762: Plum says:


    She might have been fishing for info, trying to make sure he really is getting a divorce or you are not moving in the same town as he is.
    You might have given her the info she wanted, in the way you answered to her. Or he gave her a proof in the mean time.
    And yes, nothing she could say matters if he wants out of the marriage anyhow. Unless knowledge allows you more money from the divorce.


    Monday, 18 July 2011 @ 9:39am


  58.  #58Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    @49: DE says:
    “…SLV #44:
    Sorry, I did not quite understand the next paragraph..”

    Scuze. Eu scriu cel mai bine în limba engleză. Îmbrăţişări calde.


  59.  #59Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 12:25 pm


    Faking it til I make it, RMan. 😉

  60.  #60Plum on July 18, 2011 at 12:28 pm


    From previous thread
    767: Plum says:


    You are not in jail, you are not awaiting in a death camp and you are not holding on the souvenir of a truly faithful and supportive lover whose thought would free your mind.

    I know what you mean, but there are people lives and then there is your own life. And even within your own life, there is the past and there is the present.
    Today you are young and beautiful, free, healthy, smart and I sense smiling most of the time. You live in a country where there is no war and no fear on an every minute basis. You come trough as a pretty active person, who enjoys her life.
    If it was not for the “thought” of S.
    The thought of S is what keeps your mind locked in, feeling lonely and longing. Your situation is totally opposite to the book you mention.

    As you said, it’s not about blaming the past. What is done is done, and he indeed loved being with you because you are lovely.
    He probably misses Marina’s warmth. No doubt about it.
    You acted from love and love is in your heart, it is what you are.
    You are a wonderful human being gifted with compassion.
    I feel you when you say he is simply busy doing his stuff and you are busy doing your stuff. That’s how true and simple it gets and will always get.
    As long as you stick to your very firm new boundaries.


    Monday, 18 July 2011 @ 12:11pm


  61.  #61Plum on July 18, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    59: Lilybelle

    You’ve got to be kidding! You can’t fake!
    You ARE fantabulous!


  62.  #62DE on July 18, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    SLV #58:

    Hmm…part of me feels smiley that u responded in my native tongue…the other feels weird…as in being made fun of 🙁

    yes, i know you speak English…but the way my language was used to respond to my confusion…translated to me as “it’s not my fault u don’t understand English…” and that felt kinda bad 🙁

    Warm hugs,

  63.  #63Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 12:53 pm


    Thank you, Plum. You’ve no idea how much I needed that.

    I need some girlfriend hugs. This day has been one big triggerfest. I’ll let it out when I get home…


  64.  #64mary on July 18, 2011 at 1:14 pm


    The thing I have yet to do in life – my big task – is to make a trade with the world.

    you know?

    Really put myself out there with my energy and see what comes back.

    I’m excited to do that. Just see what happens!

    I did some interviews with entrepreneurs years ago, and I wrote all their stories – hundreds of them. And the common thread was that they just got started. They didn’t see very far down the road; they just liked a road, chose it and started walking down it.

    I can do that!

    And then unexpected opportunities came their way! Because they had chosen a road.

    That could happen to me!

    I’ve been standing at a place where one road forks into lots of different roads, unable to decide which one to take, and I might have missed some of those opportunities.

    I’ve chosen my road now, but I’m still right at the vortex. I’ve been too scared and busy with other things to go forward. And too distracted by my guy.


    This is my perfect opportunity to start moving forward, get to work and make a trade with the world. And I have to date the world to do it. Which will give me double benefits, with work and with my man.


    I’m so excited.

  65.  #65dcd on July 18, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    @45 If it’s been less than a year, please try to wait. If you’ve been together longer, then you may want to eventually have a little heart-to-heart about this with him. If you want help putting together a short thing to say to him, just ask.

    Thank you so much for your kind offer. When I need to have this conversation with him, I will DEFINITELY come to you for some advice! I don’t feel the need right now. We have been dating a little over a year now. I’m okay right now. Who knows what i will need in the future though! Thanks to everyone here for being so generous.

  66.  #66DE on July 18, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    Tinque #56:

    It feels soo comforting to read “You can even be a downright mess and still attract your special man. …”

    Thank you for the reminder that through active CDing I can practice opening my heart …and that only via an open heart I can attract the right man in…

    Warm hugs,

  67.  #67DE on July 18, 2011 at 1:27 pm


    Big warm and loving hugs…:) Sending u lots of encouragement 🙂

  68.  #68Daria on July 18, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    hello ! i just woke up…

    oooh! i can do my EFT

  69.  #69Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 1:39 pm


    Hope you are having a fabulous time, Daria.

  70.  #70Daria on July 18, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    feeling sad 🙁

    Nyguy is texting me but not setting a plan

    some other guys called me but havent set a plan either

    i feel all antsy

    i am now going to make my own plans which are probably going to the MET museum

  71.  #71Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    59: Lilybelle says:


    Faking it til I make it, RMan. 😉


    LOL! OMG, you did not just turn one of my posts around on me! 😀

  72.  #72Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    61: Plum says:

    59: Lilybelle

    You’ve got to be kidding! You can’t fake!
    You ARE fantabulous!



    I’ll second that. 😉

  73.  #73Daria on July 18, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    feeling better after my morning eft

  74.  #74mary on July 18, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    oh, i have to leave now to go listen to mm.

    i think i’ll just listen and not talk much.

    i feel anxious.

  75.  #75Daria on July 18, 2011 at 2:27 pm

    and now one guy is gonna come visit me 🙂

  76.  #76Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    Am feeling a MASSIVE urge to contact J.

    Huge… not sure I can fight it.

    Just looked at the event page for Sat night clubbing, and his brother, who he was going to be with when he met us, has posted that he is already going to be in the city and will meet us there.

    He said ‘I’ not ‘we’ so I am guessing J is not gonna come??

    Because I can’t imagine he would turn up without his brother to meet us… his bro was kinda the connection.


    I don’t know.

    The thought of not getting to see him feels awful.

    Am seriously considering leaning forward.

    Was thinking of a text like ‘have been thinking about you. I had so much fun when we hung out. Definitely want to do it again. x’

    But I want an outcome.

    I do.. I just do.

    I can’t get past that I may have pushed him away.

    I can’t seem to help myself.

    Feel like I am falling off my horse and smashing on the rocks.

    And tonight was with a friend who has no concept about leanig forward/back etc and ALWAYS leans forward… contacts them etc… and it seems to work for her, because she is totally Rockstar with it and authentic!

    Sirens help.

    I want to see him.

    Do I contact him on a whim?

    Maybe say ‘Were you abducted by aliens? Look I had an amazing time with you. Have been thinking about it and it was so much fun. I definitely want to hang out again. Ella. x’

  77.  #77Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:47 pm

    Might lean forward.

    I am just gonna post here till I know…

    What about ‘Hey, was just thinking about you. Were you abducted by aliens? It was so fun hanging out with you and I definitely want to do it again. Stuff can get scrambled on IM. Anyway maybe see you Saturday but if not hanging out another day would be good! Ella. x’

  78.  #78Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    @742: Rusty says:
    “…You can feel icky all you want but that only mean you are reading way too much into what I said.
    …And you also would simply not be looking at the reality of the situation. This is natural…”

    I don’t feel icky;
    I don’t want to feel icky
    and I don’t plan to feel icky.
    Your opinions and ways of doing things might be natural to you and your reality but they are not for everyone.

    “…But ask yourself, isn’t this what CDing is all about? You have a man who is not getting off the pot, so to speak…”

    No. Rusty, your description of CD as something that a hypothetical woman “does” after dating a guy, is limited and not entirely accurate. One male dating coach had a similar idea in mind and couldn’t expand it to what really is going on in CD. Perhaps you don’t get it either or more probably don’t like it.

    CD is also not about:

    “…When you meet a potential mate, you do size them up to an extent…
    …I wouldn’t be taking you to a 5 star restaurant and the show that I have exclusive tickets for…”

    Rori does not teach us to “quantify men” this way depending upon “sizing them” up when we meet. Rori style is CD men the same. So if you are preaching to me “what CD is all about” this is your own version.

    This is the *behaviour* that I see as icky: a man spending beyond his means to impress a certain woman, showing her a lifestyle that is not his own. If it were the usual way he entertained, he would not be petty about parceling it out. It seems sad too. And poor, no matter how much money a man might manage to pull together for a date.

    That is truly not my style.

    What’s natural for me is to want the real thing. I’d like my dates to reveal what my day-to-day life with a man would be. Not something plastic and pretend. Not something showy and fake with a man looking at every dollar to see whether or nor I was an investment or whether he’d be able to pay his bills after the dates. Ewwww.

    I want a real man that knows his way around. A man who knows how to live wonderfully well within his means, a man who is kind and generous with all the people with whom he socializes. Anything else is mean and cheap no matter how much a man might spend on any particular date. Ick indeed!

    I’m not looking for a common man with little imagination or creativity but why should I? It’s true, I have known men who spent money on things they thought would impress me; sometimes it was annoying.

    Here’s more of the “icky” words you sent, so right back atcha … LOL 😆

    “..You can feel icky all you want about that, but my best is reserved for somebody very special, …”
    “..You can feel icky all you want about that, but my best is reserved for somebody very special, …”

    I sent that one twice because the idea of it is so “icky.” 😛

    OK, three times. 😆
    “..You can feel icky all you want about that, but my best is reserved for somebody very special, …”

    Here’s another one==>

    “…IMHO, nothing icky about that at all…”

    It’s all so desperate, sad and… icky. I recognize those kinds of men are a lot of what’s left out here. *sigh* Oh, what a task I see before me. I’ll keep my spirits up and attempt to deflect your discouragement, Rusty.


  79.  #79Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:51 pm

    Urg, where the heck is everyone.


    Nothing I am doing is working anyway.

    Everyone has said I should lean forward here… even Rori… and yet I feel so scared!

    What is wrong with me?

    Feeling so sad.

    Like what am I going to be destroyed if I lean forward and it doesn’t get a repsonse?

    No, but I am so sick of feeling so awful…

    But then

  80.  #80Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    But then I feel like crap anyway so what F8cken diff does it make?

    I feel so shut off. So disconnected. Leaned so far back I fell off the back!!

  81.  #81Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:56 pm


  82.  #82Rori Raye on July 18, 2011 at 2:56 pm

    So sorry all – don’t know what happened – so many of you ended up in spam, and I didn’t check until now — not used to that happening, will be more vigilant…Love, Rori

  83.  #83Rori Raye on July 18, 2011 at 2:57 pm

    Ella – Leaning back has to be matched with opening up…let us know if you feel that’s happening, or if you’re leaning back and shutting down. That won’t work – even a little bit of it….Love, Rori

  84.  #84Ella on July 18, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    Rori I shut down with him.

    And now I don’t know how to get back.

    I feel so confused.

  85.  #85FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    Still catching up on the other thread….

    Ella…if you do lean forward…how will you feel if he doesn’t respond? I think that’s the most important issue, here—how you will feel if you don’t get the outcome you want?

    If you just ‘stop’ and leave it be—allow it to play out naturally—you could go on the outing and meet some new people, and perhaps meet a guy who would step up and make seeing J again a less attractive option. 😉

    It’s the ‘sense of urgency’ that has me thinking ‘stop and do nothing.’

    Just my two cents… <3

  86.  #86Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:01 pm

    Think I am going to take a risk and contact him.

    Wonder where you all are?

    Rori said you are ending up in spam? Wonder why my posts are getting through.

  87.  #87FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 3:02 pm

    Oh, gosh…I didn’t refresh the page before I posted. I had no idea that Rori already answered you. Sorry for sticking my nose in…

  88.  #88Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:04 pm


    Re the sense of urgency – I know… totally.

    But I have been like this for almost 3 weeks now, and sometimes have left the sense of urgency… but have always been contemplating whether to contact him.

    I have been stuck here, on this issue… and it hasn’t gone away.

    If he didn’t respond I would feel devastated.

    And I feel like that anyway.

    And I don’t really know why except for the idea that I caused him to pull away by leaning back and shutting down and

    Argh, bascially I feel it is my fault.

  89.  #89Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    Does Rori mean to contact him?

    Why am I paralysed on this?

    I feel stuck and frozen.

  90.  #90ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 3:16 pm


    If he doesn’t respond or responds negatively then how would you feel? If it were me I would feel worse!

  91.  #91FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    Ok…this is another thought I have about this. It seems you’ve been kind of stuck in this place where you can’t decide and it’s kind of ‘taking over’ your thoughts and life at the moment.

    If it were me—maybe go ahead and contact him and get it over with. At least that way you will know ‘something’ and can move on.

    Either way…we will all be here for you 🙂

    (((Hugs))) cuz I know how this can eat away at a person and kind of ruin everything when you can’t stop thinking about it….

  92.  #92ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    That’s true it is like being stuck in limbo when you don’t know.

  93.  #93FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    Ella…Please try not to keep blaming yourself for him not stepping up. And that’s really all it is–him not stepping up. How is that a Siren’s fault?

  94.  #94Mariposa on July 18, 2011 at 3:21 pm

    I really needed this today, Thanks Rori and Rachel for this post!

  95.  #95Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:21 pm


    Yeah possibly/probably. I don’t know.


  96.  #96Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    Flowerchild re 93,

    Logically I know and I just can’t get myself to feel it.

    It feels like my fault.

    I feel like I shut down.

    When I was speaking to Rori about it she did say to contact him with a flirty text if I didn’t hear…

    I guess if I do it and he doesn’t respond I could go and crawl into a hole and just hide for a few years…

  97.  #97Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    @62: DE says:
    “…but the way my language was used to respond to my confusion…translated to me as “it’s not my fault u don’t understand English…” ”

    Awww, you know what I wrote… and that is not the translation. 😆 Do you think people will think I would write that? Or that you didn’t quite understand what I wrote the first time?

    I’ve been been reading your most excellent posts for months. I suspect you are not confused; I didn’t use any language that you have not used. Yet you wrote you didn’t understand. And now you write you were confused. Really? I don’t believe you.

    I bet you are not confused at all. 😀 What I think is you’re having fun. But I like fun so OK!

    I wish I knew your language so we could trade literature or something. Sadly, I am like most Americans who are rather mono-lingual with only snippets here and there of other words and places.

    I’m probably not as fluffy as the others. That probably comes with not being as feminine. What’s a girl to do?

    @49: DE says:
    “…SLV #44:
    Sorry, I did not quite understand the next paragraph..”


  98.  #98Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    So far I have typed this out as a FB message… and not sent it yet…

    “Were you abducted by aliens?
    I am not sure it really came across above but I had loads of fun hanging out with you and I definitely want to do it again.
    I am going with …. and the others Saturday so maybe see you there and if not come and have a lazy day with me… xxxx”

  99.  #99DE on July 18, 2011 at 3:27 pm


    okay…u feel compelled to reach to him…

    Now…what is it the u need from him? (for example: connection, significance, certainty) I feel curious…what needs are u trying to fill by contacting him?

    this approach helps me identify my reasons often when i feel stuck and can’t open up and feel my feelings sometimes…

    a bit reverse than what we are used to…but it works for me…

    warm hugs,

  100.  #100Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:28 pm


    I want to see him.

  101.  #101Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    I want to get rid of the niggle that it is because of something I did that he has poofed.

    I want to know whether what I felt that day was real, or something I jus made up…

  102.  #102ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    I’m preparing for my conversation with LP. The other day he told me that he was “unhealthy for me”. I thought and thought about this and came to the conclusion that if he believes that he is unheathy for me then he IS and I can’t do anything to change his feeling until he wants to. Right? And, I just don’t know how to say that we can’t be friends then.

  103.  #103DE on July 18, 2011 at 3:30 pm


    Okay…that good…it seems to me u want connection…and significance…closeness…

    How does it feel to want these things? Sad, afraid, etc?

    Warm hugs,

  104.  #104Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    I have asked myself what it is that he holds that I want… and how can I cultivate that for myself?

    I think it is fun… carefree and live in the moment like a child that just lifts my spirits.

    I can get some of that for myself.

    And I still want to see him.

  105.  #105Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    I want connection. Closeness.

    It feels like strong and overpowering. And that feels scary.

  106.  #106Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Feels like tight in my throat… and tense in my shoulders. and red hot power in my belly…

    feels like fire that could spew everywhere.

    Feels unsettled in my stomach.

    And tense shoulders.

    Heavy arms now and heavy hands.

    Feels sad now.

    I want to reach out. Don’t want to be stuck anymore.

    Feel confused and heavy head.

  107.  #107Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    @86: Ella

    Just saying “Hi.” I’m way behind in posts and lost connectivity for an hour or so each a few times. It was me not the blog so don’t know where the others.

    It might keep things in perspective if you think of your last three big “attractions” and where those men are now. What’s the worst that could happen… you’ll go on to meet and date someone else?

    Hugs, girlfriend.


  108.  #108Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:37 pm

    Ok, feeling a bit calmer now.

    I may still contact him though.

    If I do what state should I be in first, to make sure I am doing it for the right reasons, instead of acting out of some of my issues?

    It seems to me I have been in a calm place a few times and yet don’t quite trust myself so have stayed leaned back.

  109.  #109Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:40 pm


    Yes that does give some perspective.

    Thank you 🙂

    I have just been going round in circles with this one for what feels like forever.

    Guess I could contact with something casual and then let go.

    Thanks for the hugs too.


  110.  #110Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    “Hey. Were you abducted by aliens?
    I’m not sure if it came across above and I had LOADS of fun hanging out with you and I definitely still want to do it again.
    Am going along with Sami and the others on Sat so maybe see you there. If not come and have a lazy day with me… Ella. xxxx”

  111.  #111DE on July 18, 2011 at 3:43 pm


    I feel unsure and yes afraid at times to answer to your posts…and mainly because of sarcasm i sense…the post we talk about appeared to have some sarcasm in it…and i feel confused as to the point you were trying to make…agreeing? or disagreeing?

    I would read again the initial post…

    Slv u stated in #41″….or if she calls them every now and then when things are going well, or bakes them a chocolate cupcake just for helluva it… you can let me know. I might be interested.”

    Well, again I feel afraid to assume what u meant…my initial reading of it suggested that men would not poof if i would bake them something…or if i call sometimes…

    I don’t want to bake them anything or call them till they prove real interest and consistency…I feel that my job is to be open to their advances and express…

    I used to do a lot for men in the past…i would invite them for dinner within 2 dates…and guess what…they would always want to come over…all…i am a great hostess…and my home feels very inviting and cozy to anyone…i feel afraid to do that again till i know it’s worth it….i sure know i am worth it…

    Warm hugs,

  112.  #112Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:48 pm

    “Hey. Were you abducted by aliens?
    I am not sure it came across in the conversation above but I had loads of fun hanging out with you and I definitely still want to do it again.
    I am going along on Saturday with …. and the others. Are you going?
    Maybe see you there and if not come and have a lazy day with me… Ella. xxxxx”

  113.  #113DE on July 18, 2011 at 3:50 pm


    The feelings that would allow me to reach out are:

    peace and/or joy/playfulness/richness in my life…

    I would approach him and txt him while feeling lets say peaceful, yet caring place…as in reaching out to someone I appreciate…:

    “Hello J (i always like to address all men in a respectful way…hey is tooo informal)…i feel weird saying this…but it feels there is some weirdness between us…not enough things said…disconnect…what do u think?” I will take it from here…

    Ella, i don’t recall the entire story behind this guy…what is it that u feel like u pushed him away again?

    Warm hugs,

  114.  #114FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    Ella…did you send it/post it?

  115.  #115Ella on July 18, 2011 at 3:56 pm


    Basically he wanted to see me. He initiated. He tried to call me and I missed his call.

    Then he got me on IM on Facebook.

    We had a kinda weird conversation where he was really into me and setting up a date and I was being attacked ny NVs and kinda kept putting up barriers.

    And then he didn’t call after that.

    I have been struggling with it ever since.


  116.  #116DE on July 18, 2011 at 4:00 pm


    Okay…so, now it seems like u feel afraid he will reject u …

    well, then can u connect to a feeling of caring and concern within u…and use the example i give u?

    i feel certain he will respond…

    and this time around u will feel more open right?

    what do u think?

    Warm hugs

  117.  #117Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    DE that is EXACTLY it.

    I feel afraid he will reject me 🙁

    Feels terrible.

    I am thinking of moving it to text, as before it was on IM and that went badly.

    This is what I have typed out

    Hey J. How are you? Were you abducted by aliens? I feel really unsure about whether i came across in our last conversation but I actually had loads of fun hanging out with you that day and I DO want to do it again.
    I am going with …. and the others to …. on Sat so maybe see you there and if not I’d really like it if we have another lazy day together. What do you think? Ella. xxx

  118.  #118Plum on July 18, 2011 at 4:09 pm

    88: Ella
    No, you did not feel it was your fault, it is Rusty who told you it was your fault.

    In any case, I would drop the “have you been abducted by an alien” it sounds like a reproach, it implies he was supposed to contact you, and he failed his duty towards you. It does not sound like fun.
    Don’t tell him about the past, it sounds like you are trying to justify why you text him, which could imply you are not free to text him, you feel you are intruding so you explain why you text or why you like him.
    He is supposed to be the one who tells you he likes you, and that he had fun with you.
    If you really are going to text him, send him something like
    ”I feel good about (event name), it will be fun. Will you be there?”

    This way you are not asking permission to have fun and to go there, you are a rock star, free to go wherever. You are not leaning forward, ruining your attraction by saying you want to meet him. That would take the lead off his hands.
    Yet you let him know you will be there. If he is average smart, he knows what that means. It is an invitation for him to speak to you once he gets there. You are not saying “I want to meet you”, in a needy style, but you are saying “you are allowed to court me”.
    You stay on your rock star island and he is invited to celebrate you.


  119.  #119Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:20 pm


    Thank you.

    I felt it was my fault and Rusty’s voice compounded this idea.

    I have played with many different possible messages in the past few weeks and initially was thinking like you… that just a short upbeat message would be great.

    And then another Siren suggested ‘have you been abducted by aliens?’ and somehow I kinda like it.

    I don’t know my message just feel authentic to me.

    Ok, other possible option.

    ‘Hey J. I still really want to hang out together again soon. It felt so fun last time. I am going along with the others on Satuday so hopefully see you there. If not a lazy day soon would feel great. Ella. xxxx”

    Plum, I want to lean forward a bit. Because I honestly feel I shut down with him.

  120.  #120Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    Hey J. Was thinking about you… hanging out together felt so fun last time! I am going along with the others on Saturday so hope to see you there. xxxx

  121.  #121ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    Ella, I like your message in 119 better for what it’s worth.

  122.  #122Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    Hey J. Was thinking about you… hanging out together felt so fun last time. I am going along with the others to … on Saturday. Will you be there?

    Ok, I see how this is good, positive and upbeat.

    Fee weird not mentioning the commuincation breakdown from before though.

    I feel afraid he will think I am ‘psycho’ like Rusty said.

  123.  #123Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 4:30 pm


    One text message does not a psycho woman make unless she is talking about boiling bunnies or other similar freaky things.

  124.  #124ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 4:30 pm

    No, I don’t think he will think you’re psycho. I think it shows that you are not dwelling on the bad…and if it comes up later after communication is open then address it then.

  125.  #125Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    HAHA So much distortion in your post SLV. But I expect that. You don’t know me and suppose to by some posts on the net. It’s like Ella’s IMs. Anything not in person leaves a lot to be desired. Too much is left out and too much assumed.

    I make no apologies for reserving my best for somebody special to me. In fact, that’s natural. And I don’t mean just money, and in fact, money is just the tip of the iceberg.

    Not sure what planet you are from where you expect a man to give his best to every woman he knows and at the same time, expect there to be something special between him and the woman he decides he loves.

    Again, my best is reserved for ONE special woman. I make no apologies for that. I don’t expect you to understand it.

  126.  #126FlowerChild77 on July 18, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    I think LonePlum is right….I like her words in #118: ”I feel good about (event name), it will be fun. Will you be there?”

    I also think her reasoning about not talking about the past and also not really asking him FOR anything (to see him, etc.) Her message is really only a FM….and wondering if he’ll be at this fun outing.

    I know you want to SAY you want to see him because you feel like you put him off—but it really is much less leaning forward to not say that.

    If it were me, I would feel the most dignity after hitting ‘send’ with LP’s simple message. 🙂

  127.  #127Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 4:38 pm

    122: Ella says:

    Hey J. Was thinking about you… hanging out together felt so fun last time. I am going along with the others to … on Saturday. Will you be there?

    Ok, I see how this is good, positive and upbeat.

    Fee weird not mentioning the commuincation breakdown from before though.

    I feel afraid he will think I am ‘psycho’ like Rusty said.


    Sorry you misunderstand me Ella. I was not saying you are psycho. I never said that. I believe that when I said that, that I was implying that men bring their own baggage with them. I was stating that maybe he saw something repeating, something that reminded him of other women that were psycho.

    I was not saying you were psycho. I was saying that your IM’s on one hand said you wanted him to come around, but on the other hand, you implied that this was also not what you wanted. That a man could read it that way by you saying you were scared. This was backed up by him going way out of the way to try to convince you he was cool. A good guy.

    Again, I was not saying you were psycho. Sheesh.

  128.  #128Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:39 pm

    Thanks Lovely Ladies.

    Am thinking the message in 122 is the best so far?

    Lillybelle I did not talk about boiling bunnies, only how I felt scared that if we met again it would not be the same… not my most Sireny moment!

    I am feeling calmer now.

    Going to take it to text (off IM) and I will have to wait till morning now anyway as it is half past midnight here.


    I wonder when this particular healing challenge will be done.


  129.  #129Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:43 pm


    when you say that my messages could make someone think I am a psycho, for whatever reason, it feels very bad. It feels bad to be associated with that word.

    It feels to me as though everyone thinks I am a psycho when I hear that… it triggers me.

  130.  #130Ella on July 18, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    Sirens I agree re the simple, present tense message.

    It doesn’t feel natural for me here to open with @I feel good about the event on Sat…’

    So I am thinking to go with

    ‘Hey J. Was thinking about you… It felt so fun hanging out together last time. I am going along with the others to … on Saurday. Will you be there? xxx’

    Rori said I could flirt a bit.

    I think that feels ok to me.

  131.  #131Brenda on July 18, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    Miho is going to draw me! 🙂 She’s an artist.

  132.  #132Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 4:47 pm


    I know, Ella, I KNOW. That’s what I was trying to tell you… One text does not make a woman a psycho….

    I have an acquaintance who is practically a bunny boiler. In fact, she has climbed into bedroom windows of men she used to date long after he dumped her…while his new/now girlfriend was sleeping, used a fake pregnancy to get a man to commit to her, he did despite fabulous KNOWING advice, they are now divorced…she still texts him icky stuff…another male friend of mine dated her…this time I didn’t say anything…she psycho’d out on him too. A year later, she is still texting him. One night, he received 49 text messages. THAT is crazy…

  133.  #133Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    119: Ella says:


    Thank you.

    I felt it was my fault and Rusty’s voice compounded this idea.


    Man, this must be “beat up Rusty night.” That’s cool, I have a thick skin.

    don’t recall saying anything about fault. in fact, when it was suggested, I made a comment about it being about responsibility which simply allows one to learn from their mistakes.

    As I recall, the mistake in question was minor and fixable. The mistake wasn’t something I made up, and in fact, I believe it was FW or Lilybelle that backed up that they interpreted the IM chat the same way I did, and then you reread it and agreed.

    Not a big deal and not about fault. My whole message was to simply learn from it. That is all. I guess that make me a bad guy. LOL @ that. Funny but sad that trying to help somebody makes you a bad guy. 😕

  134.  #134Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 4:57 pm


    This is what I said:

    “Sweetie, I’m here for you. I was at work earlier so I thought about you all the way home and here I am.

    I agree with the impression Rusty got on the IM. I read it the same way in that you may have felt uncomfortable with him coming over and I didn’t get that you were uncomfortable with the way you felt..liking him so much already..”

  135.  #135Lilybelle on July 18, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    Lucy??? Been thinking about you and wondering how things are going..

  136.  #136Ella on July 18, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    Rusty I don’t think you are a bad guy.

    The truth is I am/was struggling with the situation and my NVs and my feelings ie: it was my fault, I did something wrong etc… I was feeling guitly, bad, ashamed and silly

    I posted about it here… and also asked for help. I think I even asked specifically for your input.

    I do appreciate that you reached out to help me. I feel touched that you were there and wanted to look after me and help me.

    And after I recieved it I felt even more insecure.

    We tend to stay away from advice giving on this blog and I am really starting to get why.


  137.  #137luzydel on July 18, 2011 at 5:04 pm

    I am reading some Elizabeth Gilbert’s quotes…

    “When I get lonely these days, I think: So BE lonely, Liz. Learn your way around loneliness. Make a map of it. Sit with it, for once in your life. Welcome to the human experience. But never again use another person’s body or emotions as a scratching post for your own unfulfilled yearnings.”
    — Elizabeth Gilbert (Eat, Pray, Love)

  138.  #138Ella on July 18, 2011 at 5:13 pm

    Think maybe sometimes I lean back too far. And/or shut down.

    Also that I am often to hard on myself and berate myself for the slightest thing… like I sometimes percieve Kaitlyn to be doing.

    Maybe I can ease up a bit… and be more gentle.

    One text does not a psycho woman make, lol. This is true.

    Going to explore this.

    Feel a bit sad.

    I love me.

    And I love you all too.

    I am feeling a lot calmer.

    May send the text tomorrow (prob will). Will see how I feel then.

  139.  #139Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    I often express my truth playfully but I am sincere in what I say.

    @32: DE says:
    “…Rori, I do have a dilemma…it appears there are more men nowadays interested in a 50/50 relationship and also highly feminine energy…:(

    …I noticed lately being sooo turned off by the interaction…:( …”

    …I feel curious what other Sirens think…”

    I think:

    The things that turn you off about a man, I like!
    –When I am dating a man and he wants to see me, when we are talking I want to feel free to mention some fun thing for us to do.
    –When I am dating a man and we are getting along with each other, I want to feel free to call him every now and then to share some happy event in my life or just to acknowledge that he is alive and I like him.
    –When I am dating a man I want to feel free to do some little thing that both of us will enjoy, such as baking chocolate cupcakes.

    I want a man who cares how I feel, who loves, adores me and cherishes me. I don’t want a man who wishes to dominate me and under whose shadow I must quake. I don’t wish to put out any feelers for any of that sort either.

    If instead of appreciating, or indeed being delighted, a man runs from any of the three kinds of things I have described, he is not for me. He might be for others, but not for me.

    That is what I think.

    If the men who are “turning you off” because they are unlike what you want, well, if they have older guys in their circles who are similiar… I’ll take them!!!

    I expect Rusty will post that all men hate the things I like to do and they run from it. OK, I acknowledge the Rusty opinion so he doesn’t have to post it! I don’t need ALL the men.

    Maybe there is only one of my kind of guy on Earth, OK. But if some men are being cast off because they aren’t considered “masculine” when we share, great, I’ll take them. They are plenty masculine enough for me. Yippee!


    “…BTW, if any of those “50-50″ guys have single fathers, uncles, older men friends who don’t get upset and run away if a woman they are dating suggests a fun (and probably inexpensive or free) thing to do when they want to see her, or if she calls them every now and then when things are going well, or bakes them a chocolate cupcake just for helluva it… you can let me know. I might be interested….”

  140.  #140ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    Okay ladies….I just got a picture message from LP and I don’t know how to respond or even if I should. He sent me a picture of Barbie dolls set up in a house and the weirdest part is that his daughter is not with him. With am I supposed to say back to that!?

  141.  #141Ella on July 18, 2011 at 5:16 pm

    IP could you say you feel confused… ? xx

  142.  #142ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 5:17 pm

    Should I even say anything?

  143.  #143ice Princess on July 18, 2011 at 5:17 pm

    Should I be playful and send him a strange picture back?

  144.  #144Ella on July 18, 2011 at 5:20 pm


    Thank you for posting that.

    Me likey.

    And feels v relevant for me atm 🙂


  145.  #145Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 5:39 pm

    136: EllaNo Gravatar says:

    Rusty I don’t think you are a bad guy.

    The truth is I am/was struggling with the situation and my NVs and my feelings ie: it was my fault, I did something wrong etc… I was feeling guitly, bad, ashamed and silly

    I posted about it here… and also asked for help. I think I even asked specifically for your input.

    I do appreciate that you reached out to help me. I feel touched that you were there and wanted to look after me and help me.

    And after I recieved it I felt even more insecure.

    We tend to stay away from advice giving on this blog and I am really starting to get why.



    Ella, know this. I do not know what is in his mind. I don’t know what past experiences rule his actions. do not know if his intentions toward you are good or ill. But you know mine are good. I would love nothing more than to see you find a great guy who cares the world for you.

    I can also say that if I were him, the IMs wouldn’t scare me or put me off for good. But then, very little does scare me. After all, I am braving this den of estrogen all by myself with no help at all. 😉 Most men would consider it a suicide mission. 😛

    I do stand by the idea that your FM’s weren’t the best ones to use, not only because they send the wrong message, but I also don’t think they best describe your feelings, though you thought they might.

    Here’s the definitions.

    weird (wîrd)
    adj. weird·er, weird·est
    1. Of, relating to, or suggestive of the preternatural or supernatural.
    2. Of a strikingly odd or unusual character; strange.
    3. Archaic Of or relating to fate or the Fates.
    a. Fate; destiny.
    b. One’s assigned lot or fortune, especially when evil.
    2. often Weird Greek & Roman Mythology One of the Fates.
    tr. & intr.v. weird·ed, weird·ing, weirds
    Slang To experience or cause to experience an odd, unusual, and sometimes uneasy sensation. Often used with out. (Weird out)
    You say this is how you felt. Well, by the definition, that’s not what you described. You described being nervous about having him come over so late at night.

    Using “weird,” especially when describing your feelings about a guy coming around to spend time with you is going to carry a lot of negative connotations to him. Not good connotations. “I’m feeling weird about you coming over,” is not something a guy wants to hear. It is hugely unwelcoming and not just for the short term.

    Definition of SCARED
    : thrown into or being in a state of fear, fright, or panic

    See scared defined for English-language learners »
    Examples of SCARED

    I am really scared about speaking in front of the class.
    He was scared that his mother wouldn’t let him go to the movies with his friends.
    She’s scared to walk alone at night.

    OK, I can see this to a point, but think about the synonyms to see the power of this word.

    Synonyms: affrighted, aghast, alarmed, fearful, frightened, horrified, horror-struck, hysterical (also hysteric), afraid, scary, shocked, spooked, terrified, terrorized.

    The power of this word is huge. Again, while you may choose to use this word to describe your feelings that night, I don’t think it is accurate. What you described as your feelings would be much better described as “nervous.”

    I can only tell you from a man’s point of view what it would feel like being told that. granted not every man is the same, but for many men, those FM’s would have come across really negative.

    I have heard some her talk of love scripts. I wonder if having some FM scripts wouldn’t be helpful? Explore the feelings you’ve had with guys, and write down how you felt and an FM word to describe those feelings. Then go to a dictionary to see if the descriptions accurately portray how you felt. If not, it isn’t likely to be a good FM to use. One point i want to make about this is that I don’t think anyone should add to the power of an FM in an effort to make it heard. By that I mean, and I know this may be triggering, but don’t overstate your feelings. Don’t build it up to something bigger in an effort to make it heard. I can see this almost being a natural thing to do. Like bigger is better.

    It is just my opinion but it seems to me after seeing the definitions that this is what you were doing, even if subconsciously…to give more power to your FM.

    This is the definition of nervous.

    1. very excitable or sensitive; highly strung
    2. (often foll by of) apprehensive or worried I’m nervous of traffic
    3. of, relating to, or containing nerves; neural nervous tissue

    And here are some of the synonyms.

    Synonyms: aflutter, antsy, anxious, atwitter, dithery, edgy, goosey, het up, hinky [slang], hung up, ill at ease, insecure, jittery, jumpy, nervy, perturbed, queasy (also queazy), tense, troubled, uneasy, unquiet, upset, uptight, worried, keyed up, on edge, on pins and needles, on tenterhooks


    It’s just my opinion but I think this word better described your feelings, is more than powerful enough to get your feelings across, and will not trigger a guy in a bad way.

    hearing that a woman feels nervous about being around us, so long as he understands the context you mean it, is actually a good feeling to a guy. It will actually stroke his ego a bit to know that you feel that you don’t trust yourself to be a good girl with him around.

    I will also say this. If your FM is intended to tell the guy, “I don’t trust you.” it is an FM best kept to yourself. You don’t need an excuse, or an FM or anything else to justify looking out for your safety, but if it is a guy you just don’t trust yet, because you don’t know him well enough, it isn’t going to feel good to him to hear that. A good guy would be more than happy to respect your boundary if you just say, “I make it a steadfast rule not to do _____________ with any guy I’ve not known for very long.” What is in the space is up to you.

    Anyway, I can only say that while they may be unappreciated, my intentions for you are good.

  146.  #146Rusty on July 18, 2011 at 6:00 pm

    139: Senior Lady Vibe says

    I want a man who cares how I feel, who loves, adores me and cherishes me. I don’t want a man who wishes to dominate me and under whose shadow I must quake. I don’t wish to put out any feelers for any of that sort either.

    If instead of appreciating, or indeed being delighted, a man runs from any of the three kinds of things I have described, he is not for me. He might be for others, but not for me.

    That is what I think.

    If the men who are “turning you off” because they are unlike what you want, well, if they have older guys in their circles who are similiar… I’ll take them!!!

    I expect Rusty will post that all men hate the things I like to do and they run from it. OK, I acknowledge the Rusty opinion so he doesn’t have to post it! I don’t need ALL the men.

    Maybe there is only one of my kind of guy on Earth, OK. But if some men are being cast off because they aren’t considered “masculine” when we share, great, I’ll take them. They are plenty masculine enough for me. Yippee!


    “…BTW, if any of those “50-50″ guys have single fathers, uncles, older men friends who don’t get upset and run away if a woman they are dating suggests a fun (and probably inexpensive or free) thing to do when they want to see her, or if she calls them every now and then when things are going well, or bakes them a chocolate cupcake just for helluva it… you can let me know. I might be interested….”


    HAHA, your fascination with me is…well…flattering. but sad to say, you don’t seem to know me very well. And you don’t seem to get what some of the women want when they want a leader. See, the key word is a leader, not a tyrant. A tyrant will try to dominate you, a leader doesn’t. A subtle difference lost not only on you but on many would be leaders as well. A leader is what DE and some of the other women seem to be wanting when they want the man to “lead’ by choosing a date for them.

    For instance, I took my wife to the movies. She hinted around about maybe seeing a movie. Was kind of non-committal about it though.

    I knew she wanted to go to one so I told her I would look for times. I found the times of the movies and let her know and asked of there was anything in particular she wanted to see. I had mentioned a while back about maybe seeing transformers.

    Anyway, I asked her if there was one she had her heart set on. She was noncommittal. So I suggested some of the more popular movies out right now, including the one I had wanted to see. I had seen the previous transformer movies but not on the big screen. I do want to see this one on the big screen. She mentioned that she was surprised I had not gone to see it alone.

    OK, that was a big message to me. She wasn’t thrilled about seeing it but I knew she would go if that is what I picked, knowing I really wanted to see it at the theater. But I know I can go see it alone and enjoy it just fine, so that is what i will do.

    I know she has enjoyed the Harry Potter movies and it wasn’t lost on me that this was the opening weekend for that movie. So I told her we would go see that, and that I would pick a time for it, a time that would allow us to go get something to eat before hand. We had not eaten at Five Guys yet and we both have wanted to try it, and i knew one was right by the theater. So I chose that movie and a time that would allow her to get ready, and still leave us time to eat first.

    What she wanted was for me to choose…she did not want to be the one to pick the movie, knowing I had wanted to see transformers on the big screen, for my birthday. I knew all of this. A tyrant would have said, “I’m seeing what I want.” A leader takes into account everything and chooses the best for everybody. Now, had we also gone to see several movies she had wanted to, and I didn’t, etc… and I felt it was my turn to have it my way, sure I may have chose that movie, but honestly, only if I felt she would have a good time also.

    Turns out that I did choose everything right and she had a great time. Five guys was very good and the movie was great. We BOTH enjoyed it as I knew we would. And it was an even better treat for her that i spent the extra t see it on the IMAX in 3D.

    I do enjoy that you think me the Rogue, SLV. Kind of funny that you seem to think I am so despicable. 😛

  147.  #147Jennifer on July 18, 2011 at 6:04 pm

    ok girls.
    Here’s my thing.
    I have a uber casual wedding reception to go to. It’s a sort of BBQ, river party, byob thing. For my baby sister’s best friend. Our families have been friends for years.
    I don’t want to go alone. That would suck.
    My mom and bestie think I should invite T from judo class.
    It would be nigh on imposible for him to invite me as he doesn’t know about it.
    Is it anti-rori to ask him or rockstar?
    Advice please.

  148.  #148Plum on July 18, 2011 at 6:10 pm

    122 Ella

    *** Fee weird not mentioning the commuincation breakdown from before though.
    I feel afraid he will think I am ‘psycho’ like Rusty said.***

    The thing is you don’t know why he poofed.
    It might just be him who changed his mind, because that’s just the way he is.
    Or he might have heard of a girl he was courting and with whom he started something.
    It might be totally independent from your IM convo, so you risk to sound ridiculous if you assume he wanted you with no doubt at all but he stepped back only because of one word. Plus you are telling him to hang around with you for a lazy day and that you really liked him, but what if he is with someone now? Will he take that as an invitation to be the other woman?
    And it sounds desperate, like
    “please, you abandoned me just for one word that you did not like, I was not worth a fight to win me or to understand me, yet I am kneeling, begging you to understand I REALLY like you.
    Even if you poofed for one single word, I want to hang around, because I have nobody else.”

    If you really want to refer to the IM convo, you can try:
    “I feel confused about our last IM convo, seems that we got tongue tied. Will you be at the (event name)? I will be there with (girl’s name). It should be fun. I feel good about it.”

    This way, if he does not text back at all, you save your pride.
    But if he says “no, I won’t be there” you still have the possibility to suggest meeting somewhere else, if you still want to lean forward.


  149.  #149AmazingMe on July 18, 2011 at 6:21 pm

    @148…That is some great advice Plum, I really like your take on Ellas’s situation!It helped me in a way as well, that is why I love it here. 9 times out of 10 we have all been there before but learning different coping skills is great!

  150.  #150DE on July 18, 2011 at 6:45 pm

    Senior Lady Vibe #139:

    It felt very good to read your response…I understand now…thank you for being patient with me…

    While I often see u playfulness and I appreciate it…at times, I don’t…possibly for my own reasons…sometime English might be a barrier in breaking down the “code” of being playful even though you were so generous about believing in my language abilities;…there is also my mood, sensitive,..deep thought, contemplative…serious…sad…my soup of feelings 🙂

    And I totally agree with your wants…

    as to “If the men who are “turning you off” because they are unlike what you want, well, if they have older guys in their circles who are similar… I’ll take them!!!”

    Well, I wished so too…but in the past, all men I’ve been with avoided having their friends around me for more than a few minutes…:( I know that is a sign of controlling behavior…or if I try to flip it…that is a sign they sure knew they had a treasure in their hands…and didn’t want to loose it…

    Thank you for exploring these ideas/thoughts with me…

    Hope you have lovely evening 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  151.  #151Patricia on July 18, 2011 at 6:46 pm

    I’ve been reading the posts off and on during the day…………I feel sad and empty reading some of them…………I feel my head hurt when I’m reading what sometimes sounds like talking heads………….

    where is everyone’s heart tonight?

  152.  #152Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 7:14 pm

    @125: Rusty says:
    “…Again, my best is reserved for ONE special woman. I make no apologies for that. I don’t expect you to understand it…”

    That’s easy to understand and it’s very simple. However, your kind of “best” would not be much for me nor best for everyone. This is something you either do not understand or are not willing to accept.

  153.  #153LobbyStar on July 18, 2011 at 7:15 pm

    Oh Ella, I’m watching your situation very closely, as I’m in the same boat.

    I’ve been out with this CD twice. After the 2nd date, he emailed me a long email, nothing about the date, and then I texted him a reply, because my wifi was hosed. Then he said he hoped I had a good time with him, and I replied that I did. He answered, “Good. Just wasn’t sure.” Then he wished me a good week, which implied to me that he did not plan to be in touch again.

    So I emailed him the next chance I got (a few hours later) and apologized for making him wonder if I had a good time and reiterated that I did. I have not received any kind of response. I don’t know what to make of that, because this guy was uber-into me prior to this.

    Debating, like you, leaning forward.

  154.  #154Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 7:30 pm

    Hi Sirens,

    It’s been awhile since I posted..I haven’t been making time to come here. I had to make a very tough decision recently though, and I’d like you guys’ feedback if you’ll give it.

    Well if anyone remembers, I have been seeing this guy, Techie, for almost four months. He’s an absolute dream for me….I get all warm and flush whenever I think about him kissing or making love to me. It’s been three months since I met him. I had been CD-ing when we met, but after I met him I just didn’t see the others anymore. We started talking via video chat (Skype) every night, though we couldn’t spend time together often because his schedule is erratic. He’s a freelance web developer and also has a lot of family obligations. And he lives and hour away. And neither of us has a car. 🙁 On top of all that, he never stepped up and committed to me, because of his busy schedule. When I asked him if he considers us a couple, he asked me to be patient with him, and I said okay, though I didn’t really know what “be patient” meant.

    And then I got REALLY worried. Because when I bought up the issue of commitment again, he told me he didn’t even know if he wanted to live in Los Angeles for much longer. He wanted to move to New York or Portland or San Francisco. This struck fear into me. Was he really going to leave? I even went so far to tell him that I wouldn’t move to New York or San Francisco, but I had been considering moving to Portland to start over. I don’t have anything really tying me to California and Portland is a smaller, less expensive place to live than here. So if he wanted to move to Portland then I wanted to move there too. It was the truth, and I was hoping this would make him more comfortable about committing.

    But after a couple weeks the fear had grown really big, that somehow a year from now, he and I would still be in this same place, or not much further along. I don’t want to be that woman who waits years for her man to commit to her or say he wants to get married, just to be disappointed in the end. I started thinking that I need to CD again, though I really really don’t want to. We’ve had sex (wonderful, glorious sex), he came over on 4th of July to meet my family, and we just blend into each other so well. But still…no commitment. I looked up a blog post Rori wrote some time ago, titled Don’t Get Hung Up On Him – Even If You’ve Slept With Him. It’s a little late for that, I thought as I began to read. I also read the article The Best Way To Make Him Commit. What I gathered from both of those is: 1) Don’t beat yourself up if you slept with him sooner than you intended to. Treat it as a learning experience. 2) Speak my truth, which is “I need a commitment from you because I want a man who is on the same page as me when it comes to eventually getting married and starting a family.” and 3) Continue to date other men until you get the commitment you want. I’m 26 years old and separated from my first husband (I got married at 19). I want to be in a serious relationship and get married again, and have kids before I turn 30..that’s four years from now. I don’t know if that is too much to ask, but that’s how it is in my mind because I don’t want to have kids well into my thirties (or on the flipside, be struggling to have children at that age).

    So I had “the talk” with him today. Via instant messenger, because I didn’t have the money to travel to see him today and that is how we usually communicate anyway. This is how the conversation went:

    Me: Well I was thinking about our relationship, and I understand why you’re not ready to commit yet, but I really want to be in one now. So I think it’s best if I see other people

    Techie: Oh.

    Me: I just feel afraid that a year from now things will still be the same between us…and I don’t want that. I’m not getting any younger and I do want to be married and have more kids before I’m 30. I do care about you so much but I just don’t want to look back and wish I had done things differently, Techie. This really really hard for me…I just…

    Techie: You just…want a man you can marry before you turn 30?

    Me: Not just that, I want to have kids before I’m 30…it’s not that I want to be married before 30 to just anyone, I want a real relationship with that person. I think four years is enough time for that to happen but I need to be with someone who is on the same page as me. And you wanting to move to New York…I just feel too unsteady waiting to see what will happen.

    Me: Not that I am breaking up with you or cutting you out of my life, I just feel I should date around more.

    Techie: Well…your will, your desire. If that’s what you want, then go for it.

    Me: Okay.

    I HATE IT when they say that. “If that’s what you want then go for it.” Why didn’t he fight me over it? I don’t WANT to date around. I WANT him to do better..I want him to claim me. I want to be HIS. sigh

    I KNOW this man loves me and thinks the world of me…and I think the world of him. He hasn’t actually said it but he “gives” to me, like Rori mentioned in this blog post. I KNOW he would see me more often if he could. And I KNOW he wants the absolute best for both of us. But I DON’T know if I did the right thing or not…which is why I am asking all of you to critique my performance. I think he thinks I am putting an unnecessary time limit on my marrying age, but the time limit was more about starting a family than fearfully setting an age I should be married by. I still feel very much like a junior siren. I promise my class (blog) attendance will be better. 🙁 Thanks ladies….

  155.  #155skai on July 18, 2011 at 7:39 pm

    my heart has jagged shards in it so it’s not too accessible, sry.

  156.  #156Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    @146: Rusty says:
    “… And you don’t seem to get what some of the women want when they want a leader. ..”

    I go by what people post here. That’s what I respond to.

    “…See, the key word is a leader, not a tyrant. A tyrant will try to dominate you, a leader doesn’t. A subtle difference lost not only on you but on many would be leaders as well…”

    Wrong. And Rusty you wouldn’t know subtle if it smacked you on the heinie, hinei, hiney… alternate spellings for the more sensitive among us.

    “…A leader is what DE and some of the other women seem to be wanting…”

    I’ll readily accept them speaking for themselves and defining what they want. You speaking for them, not so much.

  157.  #157Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    @150: DE says:
    “…Hope you have lovely evening
    Warm hugs,..”

    You, too DE. Good night.


  158.  #158Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 7:56 pm

    cutting and pasting from the other article

    747 Rusty said

    o back to Emerson’s posting that a guy cut himself out of the running for suggesting Starbucks as a casual first date.

    I personally saw nothing wrong iwth it, but she did. I see it as a good first date. Again, if I barely know you, I am not going to be putting as much into it.

    See, I come forma school of thought that says I want a natural relationship, not one based on “resources” as in, I do not want to have to impress a woman with things to get her affection. I want a relationship based on mutual interests, mutual attraction, etc… I do not want a relationship based on whether I impressed her with where I took her for dinner, etc…

    My feeling is that I can be happier living in a tent with the right woman, than I would living in a mansion with the wrong woman. I want a woman to feel the same way. It’s important because you never know what the world is going to dish up for you and so the one thing I want to feel is rock solid is my relationship with my woman.

    I think many men want the same thing. Maybe not all, and I do know many that embrace the competition aspect of dating and relationships, but that has never been me.

    Monday, 18 July 2011 @ 8:19am

    Rusty I find it interesting that you don’t comment on or reply to any of my posts, but you feel inclined to bring my name into a discussion that I’m all about “resources”

    I feel triggered beint talked about in third person in a negative way since you rarely address me directly.

    I’m in a learning process here just like everyone else…and actually, i gave that guy a second chance and he turned out to be a DOUCHE. My gut feeling about him was right.

    Maybe it was the way he asked me to starbucks and the lack of effort overall that bothered me.

    For your information, I have since met dates for coffee and it’s been fine, so stop judging me please

    Monday, 18 July 2011 @ 7:53pm

  159.  #159Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 8:26 pm

    I have a right to express my feelings on this blog, just like anyone else

    I have a right to my feelings about a situation even if it’s judged by others as wrong

    I have the right to evolve and learn without EXPLAINING MYSELF to everyone

    I feel angry and triggered for being sideswiped in a conversation that had nothing to do with me

  160.  #160Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 8:50 pm

    @Emerson 159

    If I may (forgive me if you see this as intruding, but since it’s an open forum, I thought I’d share), I’ve had experiences in the past where I was being triggered by someone who I had to interact regularly with online as a result of being in an online community. What I learned from it is, if someone really does make you feel uncomfortable and you feel they’re mistreating you, it’s best to stop interacting with them. Perhaps they will still try to provoke you for some time after, but if you make up your mind to wash your hands of the person, you cease to give them fuel with which to burn you with.
    It seems like you and Rusty have been having a lot of exchanges. The second thing I learned is, no matter how much you argue with some one, they will NOT come around to your way of thinking. If you think they’re personally attacking you, they’re actually attacking a view that doesn’t belong to them. And yes it’s tempting to try to “shut them down” (for lack of a better word), but when I get caught up in trying to shut someone down, in the end, I find that all I do is aggravate myself. And the person still goes about their day convinced that they’re right. If the conflict gets to be too much, you can also take it to the website admin. But for me, I try to not be aggravated as much as possible, since there’s already enough stuff in life to be aggravated about.
    So, I just thought I would give my two cents. Everyone has their opinion and a lot of the time opinion sharing turns into toe-stepping. Take care and sending good vibes your way.

  161.  #161Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 8:54 pm

    Lercomari thank you for your feedback. I think you may have a good point. How are you? Long time since I’ve seen your name and pretty face on here 😉

  162.  #162Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 9:00 pm

    Lercomari, I;m still catching up on the blog so I see your summary of recent events,…SIGH….I know exactly how you feel.

    Have you checked out the “speeches” Rori suggests?

    I know what you mean about not wanting to date others, I get the same way and I tend to get focused on one guy unless I consciously decide to CD and stay on my horse….
    ..which it sounds like what you are doing, you are on your horse!

  163.  #163Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    Hehe. I’m doing alright Emerson thanks. 🙂 Just thought I would check in. I have an issue though…I made a post about at 154. It’s a long post though, so maybe you can tell me what you think tomorrow. 🙂

  164.  #164Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 9:11 pm

    @Emerson thanks…I think we posted at the same time. lol. At least I know I am on the right track and “staying on my horse.” I think I’ve seen the speeches before but now would be a good time to read them again. The next time I CD I know not to settle on a guy until I know he wants to step up and commit. Otherwise, heartache, wondering, worrying…*sigh*

  165.  #165Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 9:16 pm

    164 Hmm…he may still step up…? I think if you CD yourself, friends, men, lean back and do the waterwheel it will feel good regardless of the outcome from him…..

    I have to share that I’ve done the waterwheel and physically leaning back with a couple of men and it’s been amazing how they react….very positive. Maybe they don’t say everything I “want” to hear…but it’s ok, it’s good….

  166.  #166Emerson on July 18, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    Lercomari you have a good head on your shoulders, sending hugs your way…

  167.  #167Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    Thank you much Emerson, hugs are always appreciated. 🙂 Have a good night! ~.**.~..*~

  168.  #168Lercomari on July 18, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    And I’ve seen your advice…thanks a lot.

  169.  #169Shirley on July 18, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    Hope I’m posting this in the right place:
    Sirens please help:

    I hope someone can help me, because I’m in desperate need of advice. I’ve been dating a great guy for about two months. (I’m 52, he’s in his forties). The first couple of dates were great — he seemed really taken with me, and he asked me on a second date well before we were done the first one. Then after a few dates he seemed to pull away, he stopped getting in touch (he prefers email) so often, and we seemed to drift into the friend zone.
    I decided to give it until September, and then let it go if it’s not going anywhere, but here’s my immediate problem:
    His mother works for a rather famous local theater festival. They have four venues and put on about 10 plays during the course of the summer. He said he could get free tickets, and we arranged to go and see Shakespeare’s Twelfth Night. I’ve been to the theater there many times, but never with a man, and I was just thrilled that he was going to take me. Yet it took several weeks and a couple of prompts to pin him down on a date. Two weeks ago he emailed to suggest a date, and I wrote back, truthfully, that I had a family event that day, and could we make it the following weekend.
    Four days ago, he sent me an email that included the following:
    “Ah, but this part is embarrassing; my mother has cornered me into going to the Twelfth Night opening tonight. I’m happy to see the show twice.”
    I’m at my wit’s end trying to figure out how to reply to this. Here is what I think I probably should say: “About Twelfth Night. I’m disappointed, but I don’t think I could ask you to see the same play twice.” And just stop there. But I’m so tempted to ask if we could go and see something else instead, even though he didn’t suggest it.
    I think if I send the message I have in mind, he will know I’m pissed off and either do something quick to make it up to me, or take the opportunity to let the relationship go, in which case I will at least know where I stand.
    I’m just not sure if I have the courage to go through with this option, because I really don’t want to stop seeing him.
    I have also considered that maybe he really meant it when he said he was happy to see the show twice, but it just doesn’t feel right to take him up on it. How would I know if he really wanted to be there?
    Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

  170.  #170Daria on July 18, 2011 at 10:15 pm

    Shirley – take him up on it. Lean back.

    Make sure you are circular dating. 2 months is very early

  171.  #171nikita on July 18, 2011 at 10:30 pm


    what are you doing?

    i just had falafel 🙂

  172.  #172Daria on July 18, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    Ooh! I was leaning back w a bit of shutting down too…

    And I felt stuck on speaking…. Anything

    I love me

  173.  #173Daria on July 18, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    Nikita – I’m sitting in times square… What’s poppin? 🙂

  174.  #174nikita on July 18, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    I feel better –
    zero frustration
    still feel horny 🙂
    but I’m ok
    I think it was hormonal/full moon horniness

  175.  #175nikita on July 18, 2011 at 10:38 pm

    listening to abraham

  176.  #176Senior Lady Vibe on July 18, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    @169: Shirley

    You will do what’s best for you and I can only give you my thoughts. I date a man for the pleasure of his company and I hope he dates me for mine. What we do is icing on the cake.

    Opening nights are always fun because there are usually extras: Q&As, meet the actors receptions, etc. I would be curious why it was not planned for me to attend the opening night and I would conclude that it was not the pleasure of the man to have me there.

    I’d be happier on an outing when the man is just as enthusiastic about it, or more, as I. You know him, I don’t, so you’ll have to judge his true enthusiasm for seeing the play twice. Frankly, there seems to be a warmed over, leftovers flavor to the offer, especially as you mentioned you had some difficulty getting an invitation in the first place.

    Would it be more about his “getting a friend free tickets” or spending time with me? In assessing the value of the invitation, the “spending time with me” would outrank “free tickets” and also the cost of the tickets. I’d reply with an FM similar to what you drafted here. I might make it: Although I’d like to see you…I don’t feel good about asking you to see the play twice. Then see what is offered. If he offers something and I wanted to see him, then I’d go.

    But beware, I’ve been on those “second-choice” man doing the right thing dates and they are never…quite right. But if it’s your first one, you could go for the learning experience.

    I’m sure there are lots of other entertainments a man could plan if he wanted to see me.

    I’d also be keeping myself entertained by going out with friends and accepting invitations from other men.

  177.  #177Laughing goddess on July 18, 2011 at 11:13 pm

    Ella: I feel so curious!!! Did you send the text?

    If I were to use “were you abducted by aliens?”, I would use it just as a one-liner to start a conversation. I probably wouldn’t include it with other thoughts because then maybe the light-heartedness becomes muddled. I’d maybe put a winky face next to it to communicate that I am being playful.

    If I remember correctly, you said that Rori suggested saying something edgy or random???

    Am I remembering that right?

    It’s not that that particular line is significant, it’s more about the energy of being playful…and flirtatious…if that’s what you’re going for.

    IMHO, leaning forward with a feeling message feels somewhat incongruent.

    This is just based on my own perception, not something that I’ve heard Rori say, but leaning forward is masculine by natural and doing it with a feminine feeling message feels a little akward to me.

    When I lean forward, I like to be playful. Afterwards I will lean back and sink into my feelings.

    Oh and I loved your Zumba video. I felt so excited and uplifted watching you dance!

  178.  #178Laughing goddess on July 18, 2011 at 11:23 pm

    Edit…”masculine by nature”

    Also Ella, I wanted to say that I really appreciate your communication style. Your voice sounds strong and clear.

    Feeling messages and flirtations sound best to me when they reflect the personality and energy of the person saying them.

    In your own voice, what would you say to spark a playful conversation and be flirtatious…if leaning forward is what you want to do….???

  179.  #179alias girl on July 18, 2011 at 11:38 pm

    i am going to go lean forward from a non-rockstar place on a dating site. thank you. results should be tremendous, exciting and new. wah. not.

    i am trying reprogram my “set point.” my new set point is

    dating many gorgeous men who take me on EXTRAVAGANT dates and also cooks me pancakes in the morning.
    an actively sexual being with these gorgeous men

    ARGH i FEEL A GAP between my present set points and my desired set point.

    I FEEL ANGRY. RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. I feel like swearing at just anybody. splat.

    ok. going to go lean forward now!

    lol. brilliant. my results should be brilliant. i can’t wait to see my instant manifestations to reflect to me exactly where i am vibrating.

    aw. i love me. xoxo

  180.  #180alias girl on July 18, 2011 at 11:54 pm

    dear kind sir,

    your profile is so well worded and you seem so ‘up’ and together. wow. i really feel like you are out of my league and my unworthiness is kicked into high gear. wow. i feel naseous. maybe i will stay single forever.

    anyway, write me back!

    Alias Girl

  181.  #181Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 12:00 am

    Lilybelle, hi! Made me smile to read you asking for me. 🙂 Will fill you in in a moment…. <3

  182.  #182alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:03 am

    i am attracted to what i am attracted to. i want what i want.

    i am tired of feeling bad about it. i am tired of judging myself for it.


    other races do not appeal to me.

    i might end up with someone who is not hispanic if i meet them in real life. but it is a stretch for me and online all those other races feel BLAH. and NO. to me.

    well most men online i feel No about.


    I FEEL HOPELESS. I FEEL ANGRY. i feel a burning hot coal in place of my heart. i feel my whole body is just going to instantaneously become a pile of ashes.




  183.  #183alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:05 am

    i’m a racist when it comes to dating. OKAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY.

    probably a lot of people are and people just don’t admit it.

    some people like mint chocolate chip. I do not. not a big deal.

    why do i have issues with this?

    why am i fighting myself and making myself wrong?

    why am i shaming myself.

    sad face. pouty lip.

    i love my racism.

  184.  #184alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:08 am

    can’t i just order him off amazon? free shipping?

  185.  #185Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 12:09 am

    Ella, I feel sad seeing your anguish. I would feel happy to see u trusting Rori’s words to you instead of listening to your NV’s and Rusty. I feel annoyed reading R’s dictionary post. ALL the mature men I know (incl my sons and the special man who loves me – yes, he told me and I feel it!) understand what a woman means when she says she feels weird or scared abt something. They are not intimidated by these words bc they “get” women, and they are strong and loving men. I would love to see

  186.  #186alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:10 am




    and acceptance for where i am right this



  187.  #187alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:14 am

    i keep hoping a man will bring excitement and good times and PLAY into my life.


    I can be the spice in my own life! i can be spicy and exciting and make good times and allow myself A LOT of playing in my life.

    starting RIGHT NOW.


    I don’t know but i will figure it out!





  188.  #188Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 12:17 am

    Ella… I would love to see u let go of the idea tht u did something wrong. I bet that is the message this time: stop the self-blame game. Who knows why he hasn’t called? Could be a zillion reasons. All is not lost. You are learning to open up – your FM’s were part of that. I would feel bad to see u shut down more by Not exprssing it when u feel weird or scared. You can do this. You are doing great. <3

  189.  #189Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 12:21 am

    @183 Alias girl,

    Don’t call yourself a racist. It’s a terrible title. Just because you like a certain race of guy doesn’t make you a racist. Everyone is attracted to a particular look, attitude, skin color, whatever. You can’t help who you are attracted to. It doesn’t make you racist. The thing is, we’re taught that if we ever prefer one race over the other in ANY situation, it makes us racist. But it’s just not true.

    As for me, I love black men…like, a lot. I wouldn’t rule out dating someone of another race, but I will always prefer black men, particularly African men, because I just love the way they look, smile, talk, walk, etc. I don’t consider myself a racist. I’m attracted to guys of other races too (I love Hugh Jackman, and Demitri Martin…and I went through a phase in high school when I wanted to marry all the members of N Sync. lol). But if you were to ask me I’d say I love African guys most of all. I just know what I am attracted to and there’s nothing wrong with it.

    So, please don’t beat yourself up. However, should you find yourself in love with someone who isn’t Hispanic, just keep an open mind. Love has a way of surprising us in unlikely ways. When you’re in love with someone and they love you back, all your previous perceptions fly right out the window.

    Love and good vibes! 🙂 ~*~*~

  190.  #190alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:22 am


    i can feel something shifting. something just shifted a little bit.


    i feel a little more peaceful. i feel a little enthusiasm and a little bit of knowing.

    i feel a little more at peace. that feels like the energy in my body is flowing in a healthy way. like there is flow. and it is coming in and going out. more like i am oneness with the air.

    i feel embarrassed and self judging. i feel sad face. i feel SELFISH!!!!

    ah, hello voice that labels me selfish. i feel you are off the mark and misinformed and you have been indoctrined into a way of thinking that i NO LONGER SHARE WITH YOU. so you might want to either go harangue someone else with your “selfish” shame trap or change your tune to something more fun and supportive. thank you.

  191.  #191alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 12:26 am

    thank you Lercomari. i felt touched and teary reading your response. thank you for sharing your open heart and experiences with me. 🙂

    i seem to be battling my shame demons tonight!

  192.  #192Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 12:28 am

    All – I feel amazed and overwhelmed seeing Rori’s ideas come to life in my relationship. The concern I had last wk has been set to rest. It took great vulnerability on my part and patience on his. The process was incredible and deepened our intimacy just like Rori describes. SLV, he is the kind we want. It is exactly like u described to DE. He is masculine and stepping up completely, and delights in all of who I am, not just the ultra-feminine parts.

  193.  #193Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 12:34 am

    And Tinque, I loved your “messed up” post – soooo true! He cherishes those messed up parts of me and can handle them bc he sees me taking responsibility and working through it all bravely, even when it’s hard, like so many Sirens are doing here (Ella, u come to mind especially, with your fear around “psycho” – good, strong men will see your heart even thru your struggles and “messed-up-ness” and it will warm their hearts).

  194.  #194Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 12:44 am

    @alias girl 191, you’re very welcome. and you’re right, it’s just a voice in your head, not reality. Tell that voice where to go! 🙂

  195.  #195marina on July 19, 2011 at 1:07 am

    Hello dear Sirens,
    Alias Girl I love reading your riffing posts. Like Lercomari so beautifully said I don’t think you are a racist either for wanting a hispanic guy.
    So far I have never dated a greek guy, bc they somehow remind me of my greek cousins and so it feels as wrong as dating my own family. A friend of mine of chinese origin has the same with chinese guys.

  196.  #196marina on July 19, 2011 at 2:36 am

    Yay for Lucy 🙂

  197.  #197marina on July 19, 2011 at 2:40 am

    Hi Plum,
    Thank you for your kind response. This is the third reply I write but I keep losing them so this is just a quick one telling you I read it and I feel very moved and lots lots of triggers and nv’s coming up. Which is good. I worked through some of them writing my first to reply’s. Snd I expect and welcome more of them to come up. It is not as bad as I thought it would feel.
    Thank you.
    Xxx marina

  198.  #198Ella on July 19, 2011 at 3:05 am

    LG re 178

    My own voice is sounding something like this atm:

    Hey J, I was thinking about you… It felt so fun hanging out with you before. I am going along with … and the others to … on Saturday. Will you be there? xxx

    Or maybe

    Hey J, I was just thinking about you…. xxx


    Hey J, I was just thinking about you. Hanging out was so fun before. Maybe see you on Saturday. xxx

  199.  #199Ella on July 19, 2011 at 3:30 am

    Tell you what gang, I am feeling sooo confused atm.

    Now I can see that the girl who has invited me out on Sat is in a relationship with someone else… not J’s brother, although the night I met them all it looked like she and J’s brother were going to get back together.

    So he took his attention off of me and onto her… then she and I became friends… then J and I ended up hanging out.

    Now she is with someone else and J’s brother is saying he is going to drive down and meet us, rather than come on the minibus with his ex and her new beau, and there is just NO mention of J and what he is doing at all.

    It is enough to do my head in, if I let it.

    And housemates g,friend is now well and truly moved in and they have been rowing already (big rows) after just a couple of months… so interesting to see how this one is going to work out.

    Ok I do hope.

    Well one thing this is all teaching me is to just stay very firmly on MY hourse, while all around is changing and shifting…

    And regarding Saturday. I can just go and have some fun.

    Thats it.

  200.  #200Ella on July 19, 2011 at 3:33 am

    Don’t even know whether to text J now… might wait a bit.

  201.  #201Lilybelle on July 19, 2011 at 3:42 am


    Girl~ When you get that figured out…send me the link. lol

  202.  #202Lilybelle on July 19, 2011 at 3:47 am


    I knew you would work it out Lucy. I’m feeling quite happy to hear about this. Smiley even. 🙂

    Whoo Hoo.

    And, this man of yours is causing me to feel hopeful..that there really are men out there who do want to date a woman in her 40’s AND have a relationship. I feel hope. And excitement.

  203.  #203Ella on July 19, 2011 at 3:53 am

    Re 184/201

    Me too! Lol

  204.  #204Ella on July 19, 2011 at 4:03 am

    Lucy or Tinque re 193,

    Can you direct me to this blog post please? I would like to read it.

    I did go to Tinque’s website and didn’t know where to find this particular post.

    Thanks. xx

  205.  #205Ella on July 19, 2011 at 4:04 am


    Are you just visiting New York?

    Are you ok? For some reason I feel worried about you. xxx

  206.  #206Ella on July 19, 2011 at 4:15 am


    This is the profile of a guy who just contacted me on POF:

    ‘Hiya there.

    My names ….., this is my second time on here, as I think everything and body deserves a second chance(in some circumstances)

    I enjoy playing the xbox(sorry ladies!), making music(rap, hiphop…I know, but still I’m told I’m rather good at it, lol), listening to music, writing lyrics, socialising with friends(without the need of having a drink or getting into stupid un-needed fights lol), and most importantly…spending times with my gorgeous daughters(ladies, if me being a single father doesn’t appeal to you then shallow is one word that springs to mind, full stop)

    Why don’t any women talk to me on here? …Surely I’m not that bad looking?!? Lol.

    Also, another thing, why do women think they look good enough to ignore my incoming messages? Stop being so damn ignorant and let me know why atleast(without being harsh about it)’

    Ewwwww, Eeekk!

    A part of me does feel a bit like writing him back to tell him why no women talk to him or reply to his messages.

    Scary or what!!

  207.  #207Ella on July 19, 2011 at 4:16 am

    Oh plus, there are 2 pics of him… and neither one is smiling!

  208.  #208RiverGirl on July 19, 2011 at 5:00 am

    Ella, I just got a contact request from a guy with a pic of him holding a rifle. Uhmmm, no thanks! lol

  209.  #209Butterfly Wings on July 19, 2011 at 5:21 am

    Gee you girls talk a lot! 😉

    739: Femininewoman from prev thread says:

    “BW the fact that you had a headache suggested to me that you had an outcome you wanted with TH. Seemed like you might have internalized the pressure to me. Also have you heard/seen where Rori says cdating is for therapy for yourself?”

    Yep I hear ya FW. The headache was definitely caused by me holding onto stuff that I wasn’t letting go of and probably some kind of outcome with him.

    What’s funny though is that as soon as I went to his house to take his shirt back and we had…uh…”relations”…. my headache had completely disappeared! I thought that was a myth! 😉

    Surely that’s not all I was after, because we didn’t talk much – it was all action! 😀

    I love the idea of CDing and I did a bit in January and I was absolutely inundated with offers but that was totally overwhelming for me. It did help me to take my focus off the guy and put it on me though, which was a really good thing.

    Right now though I just don’t have the time to fit more than one guy into my life and I HATE the fact that I have the ability to break so many hearts! lol I sound like I love myself here, but it was getting pretty bad….. :-\

    And right now (without even “trying”) I have Mr Weekend guy contacting me daily asking when he can see me, I have a girlfriend who’s been trying to book me in for weeks (with no luck), then there’s TH who’s here at my place now, and there’s the guy I used to work with who wanted to see me tomorrow night for a couple of drinks at the pub but now I have to work so I cancelled on him.

    On the upside of this, even though I’m not actually “dating” other men, having all of this attention has really helped me to detach from TH which of course is a wonderful thing! Meanwhile he’s spending the night with me tonight and I’m gonna get the best cuddles ever! Awwww! 🙂

  210.  #210Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 5:29 am

    RE 209 BW sounds like you have enough going on so you can take the pressure off him.

  211.  #211Lilybelle on July 19, 2011 at 5:31 am



    It’s right on this thread from yesterday.

  212.  #212Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 5:31 am

    RE 206 I would only ask him what qualifies him to know what women are “thinking”. Is he psychic?

  213.  #213Ella on July 19, 2011 at 5:39 am

    Hey J,
    Was just thinking about you and how fun it was hanging out with you. Are you going to be there o Saturday? xx

  214.  #214Lilybelle on July 19, 2011 at 5:41 am


    Out of all of them, Ella, I liked the feeling of Plum’s from last night.

    Are you about to push the button?

  215.  #215Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 5:44 am

    Shirley remember this is his mother. You can’t compete with her and anything but leaning back might come across as competing. This might be what some coaches call a “mama’s boy”.

  216.  #216Mel on July 19, 2011 at 5:48 am

    Ugh. I can’t seem sto say ANYTHING without it triggering him to anger. He is just assuming that almost everything I say is with mal intent. I suppose he’s projecting his own fears/insecurity onto me? He will misunderstand a lot of what I say and then rather than ask for clarification, he will allow himself to be instantly triggered and get upset.

    The misunderstandings usually are about him thinking that I’m “out to get him” or that I think he “doesn’t have it together” or that he’s “not responsible.” Perhaps he’s feeling this way about himself? Or he’s afraid of these things? Because I’m NOT out to get him. I actually WANT him to be happy.

    At first I wanted to remain friends. That’s the hardest part about all of this is that I feel like I’m losing my best friend. Maybe we will be able to be friends one day, but it seems impossible right now. I don’t allow my friends to treat me like garbage. I am not friends with people that yell and scream at me. My friends have empathy and respect for me. He does not deserve to be my friend right now.

  217.  #217Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 5:53 am

    Ella I like Plums response to you in 148. I also just read something from 2 other coaches that suggests reaching out like that comes across as desperate. They say it is best that if you run into each other you come across as that happy girl who has exciting things going on in her life. Possibly that zumba class and how excited your clients are about it. One also suggested watching the Discovery Channel to have something to discuss. They say the mystery is in how happy you are without him that could have him chasing you again.

  218.  #218Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 5:57 am

    Mel remember a few weeks ago Rori wrote a post about something similar. Him being angry because he is angry at himself or something he is thinking of doing? I would review that if I were you. I believe that anger is all about him. He might be regretting his decision especially if he feels your vibe as having any inkling of happiness.

  219.  #219Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:00 am

    Mel I would may tell him I would like to facilitate his anger but I cannot hear him when I feel attacked. I would invite him to share the anger when he can do it without screaming or shouting (sounds like a girl there, sorry) or when he is calm but I respect myself and don’t allow people to scream at me so I am going to take care of myself because my heart is too fragile to deal with screaming and I would walk away.

  220.  #220Ella on July 19, 2011 at 6:08 am


    Sirens I’ve done it.

    In the spirit of being open… for possibly a wonderful fling?

    Sent this:

    Hey J, was thinking about u… and how fun it was hanging out with you. R u going to be there on Saturday? …. has invited me along. Ella. xxx


    Ok, feeling weird, like tingly nervous excited.

    Loads of NVs popping straigh up. Triggering stuff around not being good enough, too old, psycho etc…

    Woohoo I love my NVs and that I get to practice healing this.

    Right now how to be Siren/Rockstar about it.

    Ok, he IS just 1 guy. Who I kinda like. And he is still v lucky to get any of my time or attention.

    There are other guys.

    Other men who want me. Hundreds of them. Other men who make me feel good.

    If he was feeling discouraged… I have just given him another chance.

    Wow lucky him!

    I am brave. I am a brave warrior woman.

    If he doesn’t come back now that is a shame for him cus he will have missed out on me.

    I am going to go along on Sat and have a good time regardless of him. Yes I am.

    Experimenting with being open, honest, authentic.

    If he replies that might feel good I will see.

    If he doesn’t I will be totally fine. 100%.

    He inititated first.

    I initiated here.

    One text does not a psycho woman make. Lol, I love that! Gonna keep that.

    All is well.

    I am going to LOVE on my Siren self now.

  221.  #221Mel on July 19, 2011 at 6:11 am


    I agree. I think perhaps that HE feels like he’s irresponsible (or fears he is), that HE doesn’t have it together, and is AFRAID I am out to get him.

    It’s hard not to take it personally when I’m being attacked, but I’m just going to try to see it in this way. That it’s NOT about me. But that doesn’t mean I have to tolerate it.

    I’m going to stay clear of him and not initiate any conversation in the future. Its SO hard to say things like “I would be happy to discuss this when things feel more calm” in the moment when I’m feeling hurt and blamed and attacked, but I’m going to make a real effort to see if it helps.

  222.  #222Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:12 am

    Lercomari I believe you did an awesome job. You spoke your truth and I am sure your self-confidence must have taken a boost. He knows now that you are the girl who wants to be married and will always think of that when he thinks of you. You also shared how you feel with him which I think was good. You told him what you wanted in your life and that you are taking responsibility for creating that. I would caution you from here on to stick by your words and to not go back to begging him if he withdraws. Stay on your horse. He most likely will experience this as confidence and come back looking for you. Many coaches suggest he might withdraw for about a month to six weeks before he gets lonely and start missing you, but he will come back around that time if you give him the space to step up. If he shows up again you will need to be warm and open.

  223.  #223Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:15 am

    Mel maybe practice dramatizing or visualizing “oooooh my heart. I feel attacked, I feel my heart racing and my blood pressure rising. I don’t like feeling this way. I have to go take care of myself” while putting your hand over your heart “I will be happy to take to you when you are calm”.

  224.  #224Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:17 am

    Mel do you think you can hold your heart and obviously start deep breathing as in exhaling noisily through your mouth?

  225.  #225Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:23 am

    Mel about the out to get him thing I read recently one coach who says some men fear women who they think can hurt them. It might be his fear of what’s coming.

  226.  #226Mel on July 19, 2011 at 6:33 am


    About the out to get him thing…
    I’m just insulted by that honestly. It makes me angry that after this long he doesn’t know me well enough to know that I am a kind and generous person. Does he not see that I am staying here until our lease is up so as not to leave him “in the lurch” without any way to pay the rent? Does he not see that I am encouraging him to take the furniture with him (I can’t take any with me anyway)? Does he not see that I am being a really reasonable person in this situation?

    Does he think I SHOULD want to hurt him?

  227.  #227Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:37 am


    Here are four simple steps that Dr. Baucom suggests you can do to save your marriage. You can start right now. But you must understand that while these steps are “simple”…that is not the same as “easy.”

    They do,however, give you a path that you must follow if you want to change the destiny of a marriage in trouble.

    Here are the 4 steps:

    1) Quit the blame game. Stop blaming your spouse and stop blaming yourself. This is the first step because marriages get frozen into a pattern of blame that immobilizes any prospect of progress.
    Instead, the momentum gets dragged down and down.

    Blame is our way of avoiding seeing ourselves clearly. It is much easier to point the finger somewhere and say “It’s their fault.” But in marriage, you can just as easily turn that pointing finger on yourself and place the blame there, saying “it’s all my fault.” Unfortunately, blame feels good in the short-term, but in the long-term, it prevents any shift or change. So, even if you can make a long list of why you or your spouse should be blamed, forget it. Even if that list is factual, it will not help you put your marriage back together. Blame is the fuel of divorces.

    2) Take responsibility. Decide you can do something. Change always begins with one person who wants to see a change. Understand that taking responsibility is not the same as taking the blame.

    Instead, responsibility is saying “regardless of who is at fault, there are some things I can do differently, and I am going to do them.” What buttons do you allow your spouse to push? What buttons do you push
    with your spouse? Decide not to allow those buttons to be pushed and stop pushing the buttons.

    Everyone typically knows what they should be doing or not doing. But it is difficult to move in that direction. Don’t be caught in that. Decide that you will take action.

    The difference between blame and responsibility is this: if I am in a burning building, I can stand around trying to figure out who started the blaze, why it has spread so quickly, and who I am going to sue when it is over (blame), or I can get myself and anyone else
    I can out of that building (taking responsibility). When a marriage is in trouble, the house is on fire. How will you take action to save the marriage?

    3) Get resources from experts. If others have been helped, you can be, too. Experts with a great deal more perspective and experience can be a real help in these situations.

    Don’t assume that your situation is so different from every other situation. The story changes in each case, but the dynamics are much the same.

    Remember what Albert Einstein said, “The significant problems we have cannot be solved at the same level of thinking with which we created them.” In other words, what got you into trouble will not get you out of trouble. That requires a whole new level of thinking. And that is what you get from an outside expert, someone with a fresh perspective.

    4) Take action. More damage is done by doing nothing by taking a misstep. It is too easy to get paralyzed by the situation.

    Therapists often talk about “analysis paralysis.” This occurs when people get so caught up in their churning thoughts and attempts to “figure things out” that they never take action.

    It is not enough to simply understand what is causing the problem. You must then act! On a daily basis. Resolution of the situation takes action.

    Will your marriage be saved? Marriage is one of those places where it takes two to make it work, but only one to really mess things up. You can only do your part, but many times, that is enough. Resolve not to ask the question but to begin to act.

  228.  #228Ella on July 19, 2011 at 6:40 am


    Yes just did it.

    213 was what I sent and felt like the most authentic one for me…

    Its done now.

    I’m letting it go and actually I truly don’t mind what happens atm…

    If he doesn’t repsond he has ruly missed out. He is lucky I have made some time for him…

    If he responds that will sure feel nice.


  229.  #229Ella on July 19, 2011 at 6:44 am

    My Goodness I am seeing it all today.

    There is a guy on POF who has written in his profile ‘Any serious women out there who want to settle down and make babies get in touch’

    He he… sounds kinda weird to me.

  230.  #230Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:46 am

    Re 226 He might. Haven’t you read where Rori says being nice doesn’t work with men. I am sure she is one of the coaches that teach that. He wants you to take care of and look out for yourself. He might not be able to understand why you would want to be so nice to him when he is being such a ……………….

  231.  #231Mel on July 19, 2011 at 6:52 am

    Re: 230

    Is this why he is so NOT being nice to me?

    Men are complete jerks sometimes! (Sorry Rusty!)

  232.  #232Mel on July 19, 2011 at 6:55 am

    I just figured why make it harder on each other than it needs to be. Apparently he’d prefer if I hated him!

  233.  #233Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:58 am

    From Rori’s How to create Attraction and Connection email.

    And, here’s what’s really important– A MAN

  234.  #234Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:01 am

    Mel I might be wrong but he might be pushing you to do that but you should only be your authentic self. You might need to really get in touch with your feelings and in the moment share them and honor yourself.

  235.  #235Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:06 am

    More from on Attraction

    But what DOES have to do with the attraction a man feels for us is how attractive WE believe we are. How attracted to OURSELVES we are.

    Because when we find ourselves attractive, we put out a completely different vibe than if we doubt our attractiveness.

    So — finding yourself “acceptably attractive” is like writing out a losing game plan. You’re already putting it out there that you’re “less than.” A man picks up on that, and he will start to lose interest because of it.

    This may be part of the problem of why men only see you as a “friend” or stop calling after date or two.

    A man just starts to LOSE that attraction for you, and he doesn’t even know why.

    He may TRY to explain it.

    He’ll tell you he doesn’t feel the”chemistry. “He’ll just stop calling. He’ll tell you he’s “too busy” for a relationship.

    That’s where it gets confusing, and you think if you could just “convince” him that his thinking is wrong, everything will be all right.

    And that’s just not how attraction works.

    Attraction is mysterious (even though some
    elements of it, like pheromones, have been
    scientifically studied)

    And we forget that as women, WE are mysterious
    to a man!

    Just because we’re women!

    We’re naturally mesmerizing to a man because he doesn’t quite understand us, but he knows he wants to. He wants to feel the thrill of our femininity and dive deep into our mystery.

    That’s why all we need to have a great man and a great relationship is be our natural selves

  236.  #236Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:12 am

    I love this, being my own fan.

    “But the truth is that you need to focus on YOU.

    Whenever you find yourself worried that you’re
    not good enough, not attractive enough, not sexy
    enough, not anything enough for any particular
    man or for men in general, completely flip that

    Instead of beating yourself up when a man rejects you, I want you to become your own best friend and fan.

    Pledge that you will devote yourself to YOU no matter what happens. You will focus on how you
    feel and what you need, and as a result, your man
    will naturally start to gravitate toward you.”

    Love, Rori

  237.  #237Ice Princess on July 19, 2011 at 7:21 am

    I feel so wonderful today. Other than that weird text from him and my equally playful text back that is all I have heard from LP, but….when dropping my kids off today for their morning activities I had a conversation with a guy with no makeup and a baseball cap on but I felt so amazing and so wonderful about our conversation. Maybe I will get to see him again tomorrow! And, while cutting my grass a lawn service man came up and had a conversation with me..yeah me for opening up to these men because it really did make me feel good!! 🙂

  238.  #238Jennifer on July 19, 2011 at 7:27 am

    hey guys. Really looking forward to some advice from siren island re: my last post? Anybody?
    Daria Daria Daria

  239.  #239Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:31 am

    Jennifer it could be rockstart depending on “where you are coming from”. If you are wanting something from him as a result of the invite this could change the vibe.

  240.  #240marina on July 19, 2011 at 7:34 am

    I just talked to one of S’s brothers. He told md S is completely ignoring his family as well. As weird as this may seem I feel a little relieved that it probably has nothing to do with me. His brother asked me to not give him any money bc he thinks S is using it to gamble. I feel sad about that. I feel sad to know that S is currently in a bad situation. I know I am telling myself to focus on me. Which I will. I do feel glad I have contact with his family and that they want to help him get out of his money and probably gambling problems. I hope he will soon stop hiding and turn around and face his problems. I wont be waiting I have my lovely horse waiting for me. But if there is anything I can do to help him help himself or his family help him I will. Its feels good to know they are there for him but a bit frightening they haven’t succeded yet and don’t know what to do either..

    Oh and you know what is so freaking ‘ironic’? My greek grandfather was a gambler. He had to sell his beautiful big house with a beautiful garden to pay his debts and my fathers family had to livd in a small flat. My father never gambles or plays cards or anything

  241.  #241marina on July 19, 2011 at 7:41 am

    I just feel so glad I don’t have kids or other ‘obligations’ with S.

    Well off to do more jobhunting. People keep offering me jobs, which us a very very good thing and I feel very grateful. Except, I feel very spoiled writing this, they are all job offers like the job I used to have and I don’t want that. I will apply since I have to. And keep working on my career switch in the mean time.

  242.  #242Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:43 am

    RE 241 Marina the writing can help you hone your writing skills to see what you can create.

  243.  #243Ella on July 19, 2011 at 7:47 am

    Hey Jennifer,

    What number is the post you want advice on?



  244.  #244Laughing goddess on July 19, 2011 at 7:48 am

    Ella: There is something I’m feeling curious about. I seem to remember that when Rori wrote you back, she said something about saying something shocking to him. I’m not sure if I am remembering that correctly. Could you clarify that for me?

    I’ve never heard her say that before and I feel drawn to that concept and want to understand it better.


    <3 <3

    did you hear back from J?

  245.  #245Jennifer on July 19, 2011 at 7:50 am

    Ella: 147.

  246.  #246Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:50 am

    Mel this is for you just in case you are still not getting the emails

    “Love can accommodate a lot of things. A few meltdowns, lots of anger, lots of working through.

    But love can’t withstand a continual onslaught of criticism, disappointment and judgment.

    Even a man who loves you will lose that love if he doesn’t feel good about himself in your presence.

    And the only way YOU can want to be with a man who belittles you, treats you badly, withholds affection and attention and rolls his eyes at you is if you feel the same judgmental way about YOURSELF.


    I remember being so AFRAID of my own anger and all the disappointment that built up in my unhappy experiences with men, that I became almost “robotic.”

    I was afraid of anything I felt that wasn’t a laugh or a smile, and so I couldn’t really be myself with a man I liked.

    Of course, with a man I didn’t care for — and there were some great guys who fit into that “he’s great but I don’t feel it for him” category — I didn’t really FEEL any anger, because they didn’t do anything to disappoint me! And so I could “be myself.”

    But I’d spent so much time and energy trying NOT to be myself that it became a habit… and over time, it was harder and harder to feel exactly what I really felt — and nearly impossible to express that.

    It took me trial-and-error to simply discover what I really felt, and then a lot of experimenting to learn how to express those feelings in a way that resulted in my ability to meet, get involved with, and bond deeply and emotionally (and be my whole self, including angry) with my wonderful husband.

    So, truly, whatever situation you’re in – your anger is key here. Key to what got you into this situation — and how to get you out of it.”

  247.  #247Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:52 am

    Whenever you feel out of balance and angry, start asking yourself questions… you don’t need to know the “why” — try for the “what” and the “how” you feel, and see if you can work yourself out of the darker feelings into the light without forcing it…

    Try to find out what voices in your head are taking control, and why you’re giving UP that control over yourself to those Nasty Voices.

    Try to notice when you’re punishing yourself and a man with your anger.

    If you can practice expressing yourself in Feeling Messages, without blaming them or anyone else, including yourself — everything will change for you.

    You explode because that’s your habit.

    Because you only KNOW the cycle of stuff, then explode.

    I want you to learn something new, too:

    1. Catch what you’re feeling.

    2. Say out loud — to yourself, to the mirror, to your journal — what you feel in words.

    3. Realize that underneath the feeling you speak are more feelings — under anger is pain, and fear, and guilt…

    4. Know that those feelings will always be there, that they morph, and revolve, and that you cannot always resolve everything that ever caused you trauma and pain, and you cannot always make sense of everything that happens in your life.

    5. Know that the important thing is what you DO with those feelings.

    6. The most important thing is to not allow them to RUN you but allow them to speak to you.

    7. And then, turn your attention, your focus, your energy on the good and pleasant and pleasurable feelings that are inside you, too — right next to the ugly and terrifying ones!

    Right next to guilt is forgiveness. Right next to fear is bliss. Right next to rage is your funny bone.

    There’s no end to how you can move from feeling bad to feeling good WITHOUT having to RELEASE all the pent-up energy into the world, and onto other people

  248.  #248Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:55 am


    If you catch your feelings early — and ATTEND to them — you can tell them that you love them and that they will not run you, that you are choosing to believe the good feeling thoughts that create the good feeling feelings for now.

    Some people like affirmations — or “implants” of positive thoughts that are really just the flip-side of the nasty thoughts your Nasty Voice lives on.

    I like “Intentions” and talking to yourself about your “strengths.”

    I like flipping all thoughts around to the ones that feel the best — because they’re really all in there.

    We may believe, on the deepest, most powerful subconscious level, that “there’s something wrong with us” — but that doesn’t make it true.

    In fact, it’s utterly impossible that it’s true (for another discussion) — especially if you have any spiritual faith at all.

    So, just by knowing that the thought “There’s something wrong with me…” or “My anger hurts people…” is RUNNING you helps you STOP that thought and replace it with “I’m just fine the way I am. I’m totally unique, and the world cannot do without me exactly as I am. I’m perfect. I’m me. I’m supposed to be me, the way I am…” and then you can work through what happens when you actually start saying NICE things to yourself!

    Even though you may believe that all the “work” that needs to be done is on your “inside,” the truth is that what you do and say on the “outside” is crucial! It can profoundly affect and change what you feel on your inside!
    So starting right now… Know this:

    1. If you allow the dark to BE there, the light will just creep up on you.

    2. It’s when we try to stuff DOWN the dark that it spews out all over everyone and our lives.

    3. When you’re angry with a man, you’re really just yelling at yourself.

    4. So, start talking to yourself about your anger, and let me know what you discover.

    Love, Rori

  249.  #249Laughing goddess on July 19, 2011 at 7:56 am

    Jennifer: 147

    How do you feel when you think about inviting him?

    Has he invited you to something before?

  250.  #250Mel on July 19, 2011 at 7:59 am

    Thanks FW! Thise are great posts! (No, I’m still not able to receive the e-newsletters for some reason.)

  251.  #251marina on July 19, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Hi FW yes that is the attitude I choose too. I have to start somewhere so better just jump in what’s in front of me. My Mum will be here tomorrow and we will go jobhunting at the unemployment centre around the corner. they have pc s there (hers btoke down and my laptop is bejng repaired

  252.  #252marina on July 19, 2011 at 8:07 am

    Oops I could not write official letters on my phone.. Lol
    I look forward to tomorrow. It is going to be fun. I am going to put my files in order now.


  253.  #253Jennifer on July 19, 2011 at 8:11 am

    He has, although there was a group of us (me and two other girls we know from judo class) he had intended to pay for everyone’s drinks. A small moment of awkwardness ensued when I didn’t “get” that he was paying for everyone (not a date after all).
    I feel a little nervous to invite him. I feel like I would be “declaring” him to take him to a wedding. But then it is uber casual. Also it would be nice for my sister to see him. She’s 8 months pregnant and hasn’t seen him in months at judo.
    I’m on the fence.
    Also a little resistant cause my mom thinks I should.
    I tend to be a little “teenaged rebellion” when my mother makes suggestions.

  254.  #254Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 8:17 am

    RE 253 It is human nature to resist when someone tries to convince. People play roles with each other.

  255.  #255Jennifer on July 19, 2011 at 8:21 am

    yeah? Cool. I always thought it was a leftover from teenaged rebellion.

  256.  #256Ella on July 19, 2011 at 8:23 am


    No, she didn’t say something shocking, she said text him with some kind of cliffhanger and gave the example of ‘I was just thinking about… ‘

    And then he answers…

    and then say something like ‘your blue eyes… ‘ or whatever.

    Tbh for me personally this didn’t feel authentic (I wouldn’t normally say that kind of thing) so I went with my message.

    Rori did say she was going to make a post out of our corresspondance and I felt excited/relieved.

    As yet I have not seen it and feeling a lil frustrated/impatient.

    I guess this is a good opportunity for me to practic patience.


  257.  #257Ella on July 19, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Jennifer re 147,

    It all deoends on your relationship with him ie are you flirting with each other etc…

    You could mention it and say you don’t want to go alone or that you would feel uncomfortable going alone or whatever and then see whether he steps up and offers to escort you…

    I might try that.

    What do you think?


  258.  #258Daria on July 19, 2011 at 8:41 am

    Hi Ella – i’m feeling good 🙂

    Jennifer – personally I would go alone… not sure what to advise *you* 🙂

    feeling bloated and a lil bummed that i have some burn mending shopping to do… for gauze strips and such…

    i covered my almost completely healed burn with bandaids and w the heat and all it had gotten a weird infection/reaction

    so now gotta care for it again…

    lots of NV’s and fear to sink into about that last nite

    and im feeling… tired right now…

  259.  #259Shirley on July 19, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Sirens, thanks for your adivce. Haven’t decided what I’ll do yet, but I’ll let you know what happens.

  260.  #260Jennifer on July 19, 2011 at 8:48 am

    I probably will not take him. It feels a little like “declaring” him if you get my meaning. And we have never had a date.
    Now if I can just get my mom to stop suggesting I call him up for booty call.

  261.  #261Daria on July 19, 2011 at 8:55 am

    Dear Rori – i need some tweaking help please…
    if i am sitting next to a man on a couch…

    and i feel all ‘weird’ and he is VERY attractive

    do i open my body TO him by turning TOWARD him and opening my palms toward him?

    or is leaning back into the couch the way to go… NOT turning towards him

    also if he’s not reaching out to touch me… do i make sure not to touch him?

    can i slide into him and lay my head on his chest? or is that leaning forward

    i feel very turned on sitting next to him but it would feel good to touch more… what do i say???!

    also its like… if he’s involved in the music or the tv show… and i feel kinda left out in a way… but not really left out, just insecure… because if we were silent and he was actively touching me i would probably feel ok…

    and there is silence… so im practicing just feeling the silence… but do i say something? like…


    it feels like a humongo effort to break the silence there…

    i need help with this scenario

  262.  #262Daria on July 19, 2011 at 8:56 am

    Jennifer – i feel relieved to hear that. and i wouldnt ask him either if we never had a date

  263.  #263Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:28 am

    I wrote Rori about my couch dilemma… 🙂

  264.  #264Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:30 am

    I’ve run into this couch dilemma before…

  265.  #265Ladybug on July 19, 2011 at 10:12 am

    Alias Girl I don’t perceive racism in your preference of Hispanic men. I think our culture has wrongly labeled everything as racist. I watch our children and their multicultural circle of friends. As they banter, tease and laugh with each other, the PC adult stand horrified at the “racism” of their words. I see them celebrating their differences.

    I take my little blond teen daughter out to make friends and go “Boyfriend Shopping.” Most of her friends are wrestlers and Canoe Boys from the Rez. They are kind, gentle, very protective of her and sensitive to her autism. They dance with her but don’t want to date her.

    DD16 came from the skater area of the park, balled up her fists, squinched her face and delcared, “White boys creep me out!” She is soooo honest. I learn a lot from my special needs child!

    She likes brown and red boys. She has a white boyfriend, though. He’s a stoner and probably an undiagnosed aspie. They hear the beat of the same drums.

  266.  #266Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 10:19 am

    156: Senior Lady Vibe says:

    “…See, the key word is a leader, not a tyrant. A tyrant will try to dominate you, a leader doesn’t. A subtle difference lost not only on you but on many would be leaders as well…”

    Wrong. And Rusty you wouldn’t know subtle if it smacked you on the heinie, hinei, hiney… alternate spellings for the more sensitive among us.


    Wrong, but I expected as much.

  267.  #267Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 10:30 am

    152: Senior Lady VibeNo Gravatar says:

    @125: Rusty says:
    “…Again, my best is reserved for ONE special woman. I make no apologies for that. I don’t expect you to understand it…”

    That’s easy to understand and it’s very simple. However, your kind of “best” would not be much for me nor best for everyone. This is something you either do not understand or are not willing to accept.


    What on Earth gives you the idea that I think all women are the same, or want the same thing? So much judgmental assumption in your posts. Again, doesn’t surprise me.

  268.  #268Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:42 am

    I feel easily attracted to a particular race and even in that a particular style of man…

    lately CD ing i’ve noticed Im able create somewhat attraction with all different kinds of men… as long as they’re on a date with me…

  269.  #269Senior Lady Vibe on July 19, 2011 at 10:44 am

    @267: Rusty says:
    “…What on Earth gives you the idea that I think all women are the same, or want the same thing?..”

    You say so. Repeatedly.

  270.  #270Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:01 am

    wow i just read an inner bonding article and feel inspired

    i imagine Rusty feels bad and then angry being talked to with what seems like implied contempt

    i imagine SLV feels similarly being addressed that way

    and i feel uncomfortable … and fascinated like the ‘train wreck’ watching that Rori talks about

    i want to heal this ! thank you angels

  271.  #271Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:03 am

    wow it feels so good just sitting here next to you… i feel protected and amazing… and i feel a lil weird with the physical distance between us… im starting to feel insecure about my attractiveness… what do you think?

  272.  #272Ladybug on July 19, 2011 at 11:04 am

    I’m with you, Daria. There was a big misunderstanding on both their parts and all of us have to witness the fallout of it.

    It feels very uncomfortable!

  273.  #273Starla on July 19, 2011 at 11:06 am

    Hi all,
    I wish I had time to read all these comments… I will catch up sooner or later.

    I am feeling great. Well not in every moment, but I am CHOOSING a positive attitude whenever I can remember to.

    I am shifting everything I can in my life.

    Gettin the ‘vortex,’ so to speak.

    I can feel everything changing. Abundance is coming to me. I am in control.

    It’s awesome:):)

  274.  #274Starla on July 19, 2011 at 11:12 am

    i think slv and rusty would make pretty, clever, sarcastic as hell babies:P

  275.  #275Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:14 am

    ladybug – it feels good to read “im with you” and also… i feel uncomfortable to say this… but i dont feel good to think that “we have to witness the fallout”…

    i would feel ashamed reading that if i were in the interaction…

    and i don’t feel like i have to read any posts

  276.  #276Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:15 am

    starla – LOL!

  277.  #277Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:20 am

    i am feeling high on my own memories of being with NYguy yesterday

    well the high feels like a swelling from my belly that goes into my face in a big smileeeee


    and eyes roll up to the ceilieng in ecstacy

    and i said to him “you can do it… i believe in you”

    about something small and he smiled

    and omg

    im making howling noises now

    oh man

    this attraction stuff

    feels fun amazing overwhleming


  278.  #278Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:21 am

    mm it feels good to be touching… when our knees are bumping

  279.  #279Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:27 am

    it felt good when i switched my mind to “i wonder what you showed up to heal for me”


    ok so i told him obama is my first babydaddy and lil boosie is my second babydaddy and he said

    “am i on that list?” OOOOHHHHHHHH


    🙂 🙂 🙂


    i feel giddy


    whtever im healing im down for it

    theres lots of this that reminds me of other stuff and

    i love me

    of course


  280.  #280Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:32 am

    this is such a pattern with me! I remember this with getright man, and with an ex, and with other men…

    im with the man, we’re silently connected in a way, i feel very drawn to him and yet distant

    and his friends and the men around us are just pouring their attention into me,

    like i am amazing goddess, and im actually wondering if he feels uncomfortable

    and even make efforts to make eye contact with him so he doesnt feel weird…

    and theyre like all into me, to the extent that i feel scared that other women in the room are going to feel jealous because these men are so like “ZOING!” into me with their energy

  281.  #281Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:35 am

    from lovescripts

    “i feel lonely and untouched and unfelt”


    i feel unfelt baby!!!

  282.  #282Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:36 am

    so he asked me if i ate jamaican food while ive been ehre and i said no and then he said ohhh tomorrow night i might be able to take you

    that would be tonite

    we’ll see

    it would feel great to see him


    im amking howly noises

  283.  #283Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:42 am

    feeling soooo uncomfortable writing on the blog… after the last posts i wrote that were to diffposters

    i feel … afraid of a backlash… my stuff… family stuff

    i am healing!

    heal heal heal

  284.  #284Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:46 am

    i did by the way ask Rori my couch question… she said its a powerful question… and its more about whats going on in my body and saying something authentic and organic…

    and… shes gonna do a post on it… later…

  285.  #285tinque on July 19, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    Shirley – If he offered, he meant it. Believe him. If he is a Shakespeare lover, to have the opportunity to see the performance twice is a treat.

    And even if he isn’t he still meant it.


  286.  #286Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    tinque I feel intrigued by the fact that many times you suggest that guys mean what they say. How do we know the difference when they speak with double meanings or just saying something to stop our questions?

  287.  #287Daria on July 19, 2011 at 12:12 pm

    “oooh this feels incredible” 🙂

  288.  #288tinque on July 19, 2011 at 12:14 pm

    Jennifer – Totally rockstar….

    “I have….to go to….I don’t want to go alone. It would feel fun to have you join me. What do you think?”


  289.  #289tinque on July 19, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    Femininewoman – because men rarely speak in double meanings. they tend to be direct, and they tend to speak their truth in that moment, and they tend to have no problem owning up to changing their viewpoint at a later date.

    if he is dismissing, you will feel dismissed. there will usually be either a direct turn down or a waffling, eg I’ll call you later.


  290.  #290Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    269: Senior Lady Vibe says:

    @267: Rusty says:
    “…What on Earth gives you the idea that I think all women are the same, or want the same thing?..”

    You say so. Repeatedly


    LOL, Really? Examples please. Me thinks you assume too much. 😉

  291.  #291Mel on July 19, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    I’m curious about the speaking the truth as well. Does this also apply for when they say hurtful, mean things? I’ve had the experience of having something extremely hurtful said to me in a argument and him later saying he didn’t mean it. Which time was he telling the truth? LOL 🙂

  292.  #292Donna on July 19, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    This is my first time to the blog. I do receive Rori’s newsletter and value her methods. I have never been able to afford to order the products, so thought I would give this a try.
    My story – Divorced after a long unhealthy marriage. Dated causually for a couple of years and was not really looking for a relationship. Met my guy through a friend and we really hit it off. Long story short, things progressed and a year later I moved into his place. Things were great, we spent most of our time outside of work together. He has a son who was 10 when I moved in. We had him every other weekend. When dad was at work, it was assumed I would be there for his son, which I was happy to do. Things went along for 2 more years, until his son started having problems in school and his ex was calling all the time. I was completely left out of all of this, and it felt horrible after taking care of him like he was my own son. I finally snapped, he said I clearly was not happy and thought I should move out. I was completely blindsided and crushed. He had always been up front that he didn’t want to get married, which I understood, he had 2 bad ones already. And we were both in our 40’s and kids were not in our future. But, before this, we had been looking for a place to buy, to spend our lives together.
    Well, I moved out and a couple of months later we started talking and seeing each other again. He had moved in with a co-worker to save money, so our lives became him coming over in the evenings he didn’t work or have his son. Things seemed back to normal and good between us. The last few months I have been uneasy about the fact that he still doesn’t include me in a lot of things we did before I moved. I was very close to his family, and now hardly ever see them. I confronted the issue of where we stand last week and it has turned into a nightmare. He says I always knew he didn’t want to get married. Yes, but, I did think we would at some point get a place together again, that we were in it for the long haul. Now, he says he can’t promise anything to me, that his focus has to be on his son, who is almost 15 now and miserable with his mother. He spends all his extra time and money entertaining his son and I feel neglected. I love him and don’t want to push him farther away.
    I miserable and don’t know what to do.

    Any advise?

  293.  #293Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    291: Mel says

    Let’s say you have a big butt, and the man knows you are sensitive to that. He may even like that it is a little bigger.

    But when you make him really mad, in an immature moment, he blurts out something hurtful regarding that. Later he says he didn’t mean it. Translation is, “We both know you have a big butt, but I regret using that fact to hurt you.”

    Not all men are truthful either, but if you are paying attention, you might be able to tell when they aren’t being truthful.

    Also there are times you should just assume that you aren’t going to get an honest response if the honest response is going to get him in trouble. Like, “Do these pants make my butt look big?” Ermmm yeah, not too many men are going to say, “Why yes..yes those pants do make your butt look big.” Some comedians have made skits about just this subject. One said something to the effect that if he were honest, he would say, “No, but your butt makes those pants look big.” Keep in mind now, I did not say that. 😉 LOL

    I would say that men are as truthful as women. Take that for what’s it worth. Most of the time you should assume they are telling the truth, especially about a relationship.

    In life there are no guarantees…well except death and taxes.

  294.  #294Mel on July 19, 2011 at 12:37 pm


    The natural remedy that you suggested to me has been absolutely amazing! My skin is feeling so much better! Thanks so much! 🙂

  295.  #295Mel on July 19, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    Hey Rusty,

    Do you think he is actually trying to get me to hate him? It seems that way sometimes!

  296.  #296Daria on July 19, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    mel and tinque – what natural remedy is that… curious herbalist minds want to know

  297.  #297English Woman on July 19, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    #281 Daria

    That is the VERY first mention I have heard of LOVE SCRIPTS………oooh thank you, I have been dying to know what that is all about……:D

  298.  #298English Woman on July 19, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    #294 Mel

    Oh I am very interested in this product also…………:)

  299.  #299Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    295: Mel says:

    Hey Rusty,

    Do you think he is actually trying to get me to hate him? It seems that way sometimes!


    I doubt it, but then, I don’t know what is in his mind. I don’t know if he has a history of playing mind games on you, etc…

    If he is lashing out at you, my gut tells me that one of two things is going on.

    #1, he is nervous about his future, even if he is the one that wanted out.

    #2, he never wanted out but want a role reversal of sorts where he expected you to chase after him…forever. or in some way, he was being comforted by your leaning forward to the extreme, while he was checking out. Now he resents the fact that you appear to be dealing well with the fact that it is over. You are moving on with your life. This makes him uncertain of his choice.

    Maybe if he does something like this again, just remain calm, and ask him what he is feeling at the moment.

    Maybe ask him if he is nervous…don’t say scared. Men get nervous, not scared. 😉 Kidding but it may trigger him to macho up, where “nervous” might not.

    Ask him if he is angry at you or himself, etc..

    Again, my thinking is that he might simply be nervous about his future. I know that feeling. You can look at things ahead, and decide that this is the direction you are going to go, but it is still unsettling. The unknown always is.

  300.  #300thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    well i just gave a “no girlfriend” speech on saturday. this was a first for me. he didnt seem to protest much [considering how much he says he loves me]. he just said he understands.

    so i’ve been getting the pathetic 10pm texts from him over the past week: i’m sad and lonely. i miss you. i wish you weren’t mad at me. i feel so lousy. everythign sucks right now. how are you? i’m sorry, i really wanted it to work out. BLAH.

    i only respond with i feel sad too, a little angry, and a whole lot disappointed. I WANTED IT TO WORK OUT TOO!!!!!

    i’ve told him that he cannot have me as his exclusive girlfriend while also hanging out with his ex. it doesn’t feel good to me, even if he isn’t being physical with her. my situation reminds me a lot of rori’s article under other women in your mans life. about the guy who after 2 years together was still spending half his time at his ex’s house, because that’s where his office was set up……. and sleeping there as well. and it drove his current gf mad. who does that to someone they care about?!?

    so he makes his choices, poor in my opinion, then has the nerve to cry about us not working out. he wants to have his cake and eat it too. i actually feel REALLY angry. i feel like when push comes to shove and he has to choose…… he chooses her!

    i also feel like my feeling messages did not work on this man. 99% of our time together was good. positive feeling messages made him give me that look, that particular soft, fuzzy, sweet, smiling with his eyes gaze that made me feel loved. but anytime i told him i felt uncomfortable with her in his/our life i was told my feelings were silly, crazy, you name it….. instead of protecting me and understanding how i felt he just started to hide things from me.


    i just kept thinking he would outgrow her. shes one year shy of HALF his age and i thought once he got into real feelings with me whatever fluff there once was with her would start to fade. i feel really, really stupid. it’s like for some reason reality finally set in and i feel like a great big fool. i’m SO MAD at myself for falling head over heels and waiting around for a man who put his connection with his stupid needy ex above all the good that we had.

    my heart is breaking open inside my chest. i can’t even imagine jumping back into dating. sigh.

  301.  #301Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    thirtyseven allow yourself to feel those feelings and honor them. Just know that you are not stupid. Many of us fall for guys that are not good for us because attractiong does not have a logic, it is just how we feel. You are alive so you will be attracted to certain things. Honor yourself and take it easy on yourself. Stop criticizing yourself. Maybe even laugh and think about how you can enjoy feeling like the victim for the day. He feels how he feels so he cries too. Just continue to be alluring siren that you are. He will feel unbalanced. Are you really mad at him as he suggests? Or is it just that you feel disappointed that you feel second rate and like you are not his priority?

  302.  #302Camille on July 19, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    This is my first blog also….but when I read your post I felt compelled to respond, I am a fledging siren, I have a question about your situation……has there ever been a verbal exclusivity mentioned on his part and are you dating other people?

  303.  #303Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    RE 292 Donna what I thought about your situation is that maybe you need to be really clear about what you want in this relationship. Also be clear that you cannot compete with his son for his attention if that is what he is focused on. I have read and experienced that for the most part, guys can only focus on one thing at a time. Until he develops the need to take his focus off his son and put it on you expressing feelings of neglect might only produce conflict. If you do not feel totally happy in his presence and when you are not with him, I would encourage you to ask yourself, “why am I here”?

  304.  #304tinque on July 19, 2011 at 1:51 pm

    Mel – Yes they mean it in that moment, but when they feel better, less angry, they don’t feel it anymore, so in a sense it was meant initially.


  305.  #305tinque on July 19, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    Daria – I hope Mel doesn’t mind me sharing this. The stress she has been under caused her back to break out. I suggested yogurt masques. It has to be plain full fat yogurt to be applied generously to the affected areas and left on at least ten minutes, half hour is better.


  306.  #306Rusty on July 19, 2011 at 1:56 pm

    i am going to sit with my wife in the ER. She could not get a quick Appt so the only way to be seen is to go to the ER at the Naval Air Station Hospital. She hurt her wrist when she knocked our neighbor’s brick mailbox over. this thing is as heavy as a boulder. I had to buy a tow chain and use my truck to stand it up. I did most of it by myself and have her drive a few times while I muscled it into place. Then I cemented the thing in place much better. The people who made them are crooks because most people have severely leaning mailboxes.

    Anyway, we are great friends with these neighbors so she panicked and tried to lift it, (not thinking clearly) and hurt her wrist.

    It is so heavy that even I could do nothing more than rock it back and forth, and need my 6 foot long wrecking bar and a solid cement block as a fulcrum just to tip each side long enough to get the chain underneath.

    It was totally illogical of her to try to lift it, but she was thinking with her heart and was only thinking about having knocked over the neighbor’s mailbox.

    Anyway, I’m off.

  307.  #307Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    Rusty I like how you say “thinking with her heart” just goes to shoe our hearts have a brain of its own. I have also read about people responding to things in the moment because of emotional hyjack. Totally not logical or thinking. It is part of how the human body works.

  308.  #308Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 2:07 pm

    Rusty I feel proud of you for choosing to sit with your wife in the ER.

  309.  #309thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    i’m mad at him because i think a lot of his choices are poor. i know his choices are HIS and really not my business, but i look at him sometimes and think that if he has two choices and one is the good, healthy, rational person thing to do and the other is shit, he will choose the shit. which then upsets other areas of his life, and then he loves to fall back on the old “but i didnt do anything wrong”.

    he also loves to tell me “it could be a lot worse. i know guys who have cheated on their wives, talk constantly about being with other girls, can’t stand the perosn they’re dating, etc. i love you and i would never cheat on you” well, knowing it could be WORSE doesn’t make me feel any better.

    it finally just clicked in me that if i am committing the rest of my life to this person, i have to trust that his choices will be the best for HIM, ME, and US. and i suddenly realized that i don’t have that trust. and that’s why i walked. but it’s sooooooooo frustrating.

    i finally discussed everything with my mom last week, and she was appalled. her words……… it’s a real disappointment. she likes him! she says that his actions are not matching his words and that if he truly loves me and wants forever committment he does NOT allow/enable her inappropriate & disrespectful behavior and then disregard my feelings about it afterwards. it’s a very simple concept. i shouldn’t have to tolerate things that make me feel bad and uncomfortable, especially when they are coming from the person who claims to want to make me feel safe and loved. i’m sorry, i feel like i’m just talking outloud here…… maybe a bit too of trying to convince myself that these thinds are true so i don’t just go back based on how much i love being around him. it’s very hard.

    this is why it makes me mad to hear him boo-hooing, because as ive told him in the past…….. he knows exactly what makes me feel good and what makes me feel bad and he has all the tools to make this work. i would never enable a situation that consistently made him feel bad. not one woman i’ve spoken to about this situation would put up with it for a day let alone 10 months and that’s why i’m beating myself up. it will pass.

  310.  #310Plum on July 19, 2011 at 2:15 pm

    307: Femininewoman

    No, not human, but female body.
    It is well known what male bodies think with 😉



  311.  #311thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    305 – tinque/mel/daria —

    straight tea tree oil works wonders for healing…. i’ve found that if i get any sort of breakout on face or body, a dab of tea tree oil a few times a day REALLY makes a fast difference.

  312.  #312Donna on July 19, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Camille, thanks for responding.
    After I moved out and we got back together, I asked him about seeing other people. He said he wouldn’t like it if I dated but if I did he would hope I would let him know. I don’t think he is interested in other people, he just seems to be happy living apart with no responsibility and being with me when it’s convenient for him. When I see it in writing, kinda forces me to see the selfishness in it.

  313.  #313Donna on July 19, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    Femininewoman – #303
    It is not that I feel I’m competing with his son for attention, it is just frustrating to not be included with all the things we all used to do together. In my mind, since not living together but still seeing each other, I thought we were on the road to the future we used to envision. But, after the confrontation, I don’t know what our future is in his mind. I thought that when his son is finally out of the ex’s house (college) that we would pick up where we left off and move in together again. Now he says he doesn’t know if that will ever happened, leaving me not knowing where to turn.

  314.  #314alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 3:12 pm

    ladybug #265 LOL! “white boys creep me out” lol.

  315.  #315Plum on July 19, 2011 at 3:14 pm


    From Rori

    Friends With Benefits Stinks

    Here’s a comment from Regina – it’s so powerful, I felt so passionate about my answer because it’s so at the core of all women’s problems in love that I’m reprinting it whole and then letting fly:

    Rori, Please HELP. I am so lost and feel so alone. I have been dating Robert for 4 years and you could say we have lived together all this time. We both have our own place, but from the beginning he always wanted me with him. SO I came to his place every day after work and stayed there on weekends. I had a key to his place and he has one to mine. I would get off before him and he wanted me to come on over and make myself at home and wait for him.

    He always made sure he was home right after work and we would eat dinner and then he would help with the dishes and then we would sit together and watch tv or a movie. Then we would get up and shower together washing each others backs and making love afterward and then falling asleep in each others arms.

    It was the best 4 years of my life and on weekends when he had his kids we spent all the time together like a family. Then a month-and-a-half ago out of the blue he started telling me he was going to go out with some guys from work and then he would come home to me very drunk.

    I would try to guilt him into not going. Which just made him mad at me. I know that was wrong. I finally just stopped since it didn’t help and then the parties stopped 4 weeks ago and then I woke up one morning a month ago for work and then he kissed me good bye like always and told me he loved me and would see me tonight for dinner.

    Then like clock work he called me around lunch time and while we were talking he just told me he wanted to break up and that he needed space. But he loved me and wanted to keep me in his life as his friend, because he sees me as his best friend.

    I was crushed and tried to make him change his mind. It didn’t work. Then a few days later he came by to fix some things he knew needed fixing and we talk and he asks if I was willing to be friends and to be exclusive sexually.

    I was desperate not to lose him, so I agreed. And I would see him every other night and he would come by, spend some time watching TV with me, holding me on the couch and kissing me and we would make love and he would stay for an hour or more and then kiss me good bye and go home.

    I know he went home because I would drive by and check a little later and also in the morning to make sure there wasn’t anyone else there.

    I haven’t found another car there and he is always home. Then the other night I saw him at a going-away party for a friend of ours and we ended up coming back to my place and making love and him sleeping over. I became curious and wondered if there was another woman and looked at his cell phone text messages and calls. ( only friends) He woke up and caught me and was so mad and left.

    I haven’t seen him for 3 days. And then I see him at the gym (we work out together once a week) and he showed up because he knew I needed help with the free weights. He played around with me some and gave me a few hugs, but he didn’t try to kiss me like he use to.

    Please Rori help me win him back. I know I shouldn’t have invaded his privacy but I was so desperate to know he wasn’t with another woman. I am so scared I lost him for good. Which is hard because I see him at the fire department we both volunteer at twice a week.

    I know he loves me because of what we have been through, but my insecurities keep messing things up, because I have been cheated on by an ex-husband and ex-fiance in my past. I desperately want to find a way for him to return and spend a life with him and his children.


    Regina – you aren’t going to like this. It’s tough love, so don’t read if you don’t want to hear it.

    You’re in a friends with benefits situation, and you’ve been there a long, long time.

    The “losing” of him (if you ever actually “had” him, and I don’t believe you did) happened a long time ago.

    He’s long gone.

    Some men don’t need more than what he has with you right now. There may not be another woman. There may be many other women. There may not be another woman for years. Makes no difference. He may never be into ANY woman. He may frequent prostitutes for all you know. Every time you sleep with him you are physically endangering yourself (I hope you’re using condoms).

    Here’s the Truth: He’s not into you. This is what the movie “He’s Just Not That Into You” is about – and I suggest you see it (perhaps rent it and watch it over and over and over again until you get it the way the characters finally do).

    Here’s what I want you to do, and if you decided to read this – I know all the women on this site will help you to stay strong:

    1. Drop him out of your life. Completely. NO CONTACT.

    This means – no gym unless you’re sure he’s not there – best thing to do is take a month’s free trial at another gym, perhaps some interesting dance classes, something new, but if you can’t, then make sure you go when he’s NOT going to be there.

    Same with the fire department. Take a month off, or make SURE he’s not going to be there.

    Yes – he will complain.

    He will show up on your doorstep. He will call you. He will try to belittle you, he will call you crazy, he will get angry, he will try to make your life a hell until you start sleeping with him again and being his friend.

    You’re going to have to be very, very strong and tell him this:

    “””I feel so bad, so vulnerable, so lost and sad. I feel like I haven’t taken care of myself. I can’t handle seeing you. It feels too bad. I can’t be your friend, and I don’t want to be your friend until I no longer feel attached to you. So please don’t call me again, or come over.”””

    And if he DOES call, or shows up at your home – I suggest strongly that you hang up the phone, slam the door before he says ANYTHING. If you need protection, call the police.

    Yes – I’m totally serious here.

    You are – (and I’m going to start a series about this, because I use this harsh terminology with my clients all the time – it’s very helpful to see it from this perspective) – you are a JUNKIE.

    He is like the needle you can’t wait to stick in your arm.

    You’re giving him your body, your heart, your friendship. And for what? For the thrill he gives you when he’s with you.

    Same with heroin.

    It makes you high, and then it destroys your life. But you can’t let go of wanting the “fix.” He is your “fix.”

    Regina – I want you to take a square look at what is really happening here – a “nice and friendly” version of the classic “booty call,” and then, I want you to….


    Every single man who even looks at you kindly, I want you to smile back at him. I want you to take every invitation you get to anywhere. I want you out of the house and in the company of some man.

    I want you to experience what it feels like to be with a man who is not like heroin. Yeah, maybe a boring man, maybe a quiet man, maybe a not-so-sexy man, maybe a man you can’t or won’t fall in love with.

    This man is not toxic in himself. He may be a very nice man. But he’s heroin for you. There is no “easing out of this.” Cold turkey is your only option here.

    Please get started Circular Dating this minute, get a support system in place (blog here night and day if it helps you – we’re here 24/7, and living all over the world on this site), get at least my ebook so you get the basics of what you need to do here.

    Now – if he ever should show up and want more than friends with benefits – you can still be easily fooled. So you have to get yourself in a place where you are dating so many men, you can handle him being one of them, should you so choose. In my experience – when you get to that point you will no longer be interested in him.

    So – this is your plan, should you choose to accept it.

    If not – and this is your choice, and a choice I don’t recommend – you can use as many of my Tools as you can get and practice with this man. But the first Tool is always around “Boundaries” – and right now, your body and heart must be “off limits” to him.

    Regina – if you decide to get on your own side, instead of working against yourself and your life – I KNOW you can do it. I KNOW you can have what you want.

    Your task is to rebuild your self-esteem in the company of men who WANT to be with you, who want to make you happy, who want to give you what YOU want. It’s very difficult to lift yourself up in the company of a man who always makes you feel bad.

    What’s going on for you here is something we’ve ALL been through. And now it’s ENOUGH. Enough is enough. Save yourself.

    We’re all here to support you.

    Love, Rori

    written by Rori Raye

    Sunday, 5 April 2009 @ 9:06pm

  316.  #316Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    227 FW.

    WOW. That is sooo good. That writer is exactly right. Very sound advice.

    Rusty, did you read it? It brought you to mind.

  317.  #317Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    Lilybelle and Marina, thanks for sharing my joy. 🙂

    Lilybelle, I’m so glad it helps you feel hopeful and encouraged. <3

  318.  #318Corin on July 19, 2011 at 3:40 pm

    This post really applies to my current situation.

    I’ve been with my man a little over 6 months and everything is going well: talking about deciding to get married, kids etc BUT no ‘I Love You’. Well…this is embarassing to admit but he did say it once….during sex. I was really suprised and if I’m honest, freaked out, and my response was nothing if not lacklustre. I said something along the lines of PAUSE….”me too”. My friends have advised me that because my response was not very intimate to say the least, that is why he hasn’t said it again. Their advice has been for me to bite the bullet and say it myself. That feels like leaning forward to me so I’m at a bit of a loss currently.

    What advice do you Sirens have on this? I’m thinking that finding a way of being vulnerable without leaning forward is the best approach but I’m unsure of how to do this. I’m aware I don’t want to put pressure on him and that saying the I-L-Y would mean I was then waiting for it to be returned.

    Hmmm…maybe next time I’m feeling the I-L-Y vibes I could say ‘I’m feeling really strong feelings about us right now but a bit embarassed and anxious about sharing them’. That feels truthful and vulnerable without pressure.

    I feel loved by him in many other ways and I’m so aware that previous boyfriends have delivered the words without the actions to back them up. This time I’m valuing the actions over the words but still part of me would like to have Love expressed between us. I’m also a bit worried I will blurt it out unintentionally. Maybe that would be the most vulnerable and honest way to go anyway.

  319.  #319tinque on July 19, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    thirtyseven – tea tree oil is good yet I prefer the yogurt even though it’s messy because it also softens and soothes the skin, make it feel silky.


  320.  #320Plum on July 19, 2011 at 4:14 pm

    More About Friends With Benefits and Strong Surrender

    From Rori

    Oh, wow – my Friends with Benefits post got some strong reactions…let’s go further..

    Here’s the comment from Priscilla:

    “””I’m a little lost on the strong reaction from Rori. I totally understand the “booty call” thing. But what exactly did the guy do except withdraw and maybe become insensitive to her feelings? It sounds to me like he got scared and gave the typical response most men give when they aren’t ready for a serious relationship. He may be toxic and can’t DO a relationship.

    I know none of his reactions were great and I am certainly not defending him! No way! Why couldn’t she just lean back and circular date? Practice the tools. Maybe Regina was Overfunctioning because she didn’t mention her own hobbies and interest. They pretty much did everything together. She also said they each have their own place. She could have went back to her place, stop being so available and set some basic boundaries for herself and him. Does anyone get what I’m saying here? Maybe some pieces are missing for me, too. Priscilla”””

    And here’s a comment from Mark:

    “””Male lurker here. Typically agree with Rori and find her advice intriguing, but in this instance, I don’t really get it either. The guy spent every day with her FOR FOUR YEARS. And for now, it appears he’s not seeing anyone else. That doesn’t sound ANYTHING like a “booty call” to me (and trust me, I’ve had many).

    Why not ask him why he’s pulling away? Maybe he has a lot of stuff going on in his life. Maybe he’s going through some emotional issues. Or maybe he’s just not happy with the relationship but is too nervous to bring it up (we men tend to bottle up our feelings you know).

    If he doesn’t want to be exclusive and Regina’s uncomfortable with that, that’s fine, but at least give him the benefit of the doubt. You’re operating on very limited information here.

    I see this “My partner doesn’t give me what I want, so forget ‘em” attitude a lot in men and women, and I don’t really get it. Running away without actually communicating seems very weak and selfish to me. Mark”””

    Here’s my take, and the reason for the intensity:

    This first series of posts is not about making the man wrong, or about moving on, or about anything cool or reasonable or even understanding anything or learning the lesson.

    This is about saying NO.

    Even when you don’t have full information.

    This is not about throwing things away, or belittling someone or yourself, or talking, or communicating, or arguing, or trying to understand, or giving someone the benefit of the doubt, or even getting into your feelings and expressing them.

    Those are all well and good – those are crucial, but they cannot happen until you can say NO.

    You cannot say yes to ANYTHING until you can say no to something.

    Until you can say NO to what you don’t want, you can’t say Yes to what you do want.

    In fact, until you can say NO to what you don’t want, you can’t even KNOW what it is you DO want.

    And a person who needs to check a phone or a computer is a person who cannot yet say NO.

    This is Regina.

    Once you’ve passed this point…you’re into “junkie territory.”

    Once you’ve passed this point there IS no rhyme or reason – at this point you’re being LED by INTENSITY.

    Regina FEELS the intensity.

    And I want to meet her where she is.

    I don’t want to calm her down, or be reasonable. I want to meet her at that point of desperation that feels like the edge of a knife – where whatever you do sends you off the edge and into free fall.

    I want her to know that harnessing that intensity will help her dissolve the intensity – and then we’ll get a meaningful baby-step.

    Priscilla, your idea is EXCELLENT – once you have a way to keep moving forward and using Circular Dating – but in my experience, most women, especially after 4 years, feel a hormonal and emotional attachment to a man that makes it so much more difficult – if not impossible – to move forward.

    I created an entire program around Circular Dating – Targeting Mr. Right – so I could walk you through and motivate you and support you to use this Powerful Tool. It’s the most challenging Tool to get yourself to do, because it’s also the most powerful – so I want to “prep” Regina and get her into a more powerful-FEELING place right away here.

    Once a woman’s behavior goes to checking on a man’s phone, we’re into “junkie time.” that’s when I get tough. That’s when I know communication isn’t happening, self-esteem is practically non-existent – and – that’s when I know for sure who has the POWER in the relationship: HIM.

    Number one step is getting at least a glimmer of a sense of your power back. Getting yourself back. Regina outlines herself as a woman who really doesn’t feel any personal power, and has no sense of her value, or even who she is, what she wants. Her whole life revolves around this man.

    This is the time for boldness. This is the time for getting the concept into your mind, body, heart and spirit that you are about RESCUING your LIFE. This is the time to climb up on the horse.

    Regina’s whole world has collapsed, and all she has to hang onto is whatever this man is offering. If she hangs on, she cannot shift her vibe enough to rescue herself. Her only hope with this man is to rescue herself – and if she even considers the idea of hope with this man, it will diminish her resolve to rescue herself.

    This is high stakes. This is a turning point. I’ve seen this many, many times.

    Now – about the nuts and bolts of the conversation, the baby-steps…

    I read my post over and over, and I couldn’t find anything in the speech I wrote for Regina, or my assessment, that made him “wrong” for wanting what he wants. I’m totally willing to be wrong – but I still like the speech. It says the truth about where Regina is, and sets boundaries without attack, and leaves room for her to express dismay, anger, regret, whatever she feels at that moment.

    I think it’s very interesting that some of your wonderful insights and thoughts in both of these comments are sort of “cool” – they talk about what a cool girl would do. They are intellectually correct, if seen from a distance.

    But Regina is not a cool girl. She is in a crisis. She’s a woman who went to a man’s home every day for 4 years and waited for him because that’s what he wanted her to do. She’s a woman who checked his phone looking for other women, and then let him get ANGRY and felt fear and guilt about it.

    Being reasonable is not a place to start. Considering your best interests is not a possible place to start when you’ve never really considered your best interests.

    I’ve felt, through these years I’ve been writing about this – how easy it is to give advice, how easy it is to say things that should be helpful.

    And yet, at every moment of my life, I can feel my own resistance to even my OWN best advice, and so I know there’s more to it than just knowing what the “right” or “best’ thing to do is.

    There must be some kind of IMMEDIATE, INSTANT PAYOFF for each baby-step in order for you to want to keep doing the Tools and baby-stepping – and so that’s why I have so many different ways of going about things.

    For Regina – there’s a treasure trove of what she might consider “ugly” feelings to be discovered: anger, rage, terror, revenge. She’s going to have to get in touch with her anger, and use it to propel herself forward – and every time she sees this man, it’s going to feed her “junkie habit.”

    We have to help Regina get a hold of herself so she CAN move forward and stand toe-to-toe with this man in a way that will make HER feel better.

    I know we want to understand the man’s side (I agree with you that there’s no need to judge this guy – he’s just doing what feels the best to him) and want to know what happened and if there’s any hope here. And i truly appreciate, Mark, you’re offering us here that side of it – would you please continue – it’s so helpful, and if I’m ever wrong, I so want to hear about it

    But, since we don’t identify with him (Mark does, that’s so great and helpful) – it’s much harder to look at why Regina has been here for 4 years, and finds herself in this place right now.

    I love being provocative, and I’m always thrilled when I read something that makes my fingers move at double speed across the keyboard.

    I was passionately moved, and still am, as you can tell, by Regina’s situation, and I’ve been in her situation, and know so many women who have, and I know that in order to do the “Surrender” part of Strong Surrender – in order to allow yourself to be vulnerable and speak how you feel, you have to have the “Strong” going on at the same time. The baby-steps are for both.

    Circular Dating is the Tool that works for everything – as Priscilla said – and though I might normally have given Regina baby steps…I just feel that in her situation, the biggest bang for her buck, the fastest way for Regina to get the “Strong” she needs so that when her man shows up – which he WILL – she can “Surrender” – is to say NO to the deal he’s offering.

    He’s not suggesting they “date.” He’s suggesting an “agreement.” An “arrangement.” And there is no room for her to ask him “Why” he wants what he wants. She has to say NO.

    In the speech I suggested – there is nothing nasty or angry or in any way making him wrong. She simply says NO to his deal. She doesn’t try to negotiate a different deal.

    And if any of you have ever been in this kind of situation after 4 years – you know that stepping back is much easier if you’re not sleeping with a man. So she has to say no to that. Her hormones are much stronger than anything else going on right now…she does not have an option to continue to sleep with this man.
    Regina is suffering with a problem you men have also when you’re crazy for a woman, but which is pretty STANDARD for us women – which is to sugar-coat, to see only what we want to see, and to lose ourselves in a man and relationship.

    The number one thing Regina has to do, in order to get the love and relationship she wants – and in order to BE ABLE to TALK to this man (which is something you know I’m totally about doing first and foremost) – is to get herself back.

    You are seeing this from a man’s general viewpoint – of “it’s all okay.” Men do not generally see the “problems” we women see. You men generally (and argue with me here if you like – though I’m guessing you’re a WAY above averagely sensitive man) think that things in a relationship are fine, when we don’t think they are. You tend not to understand why we’re unhappy, even if we tell you in the ways we’ve been taught to tell you.

    Did you notice that Regina always goes to HIS place? What would YOU think about a woman who stuck with you for 4 years, without talk of marriage, and always came to your place?

    Surely this man can see the distress Regina is in – and yet – and this is KEY – what he wants from Regina – what he STATED he wants – is to be “friends” with her – and YET – sew her up into a sexually exclusive deal.

    Now – you tell me – is this something a man who cares about a woman, after 4 years – says? No. this is all about HIM.

    He has basically had a great home life with Regina for 4 years, and now wants that home life to continue, but with less contact and less commitment.

    Yes – he is withdrawing. And YES, the only way Regina can bring him close again is by NOT DOING what she’s been doing for 4 years. She needs to reverse this completely. If she’s been driving him away by giving and pursuing, then she needs to stop that. If he’s having personal difficulties, but doesn’t feel comfortable talking about it with Regina – her asking him isn’t going to help.

    The ONLY thing that will jolt him into even a WILLINGNESS to have a “conversation” with Regina is if her VIBE is different. If after 4 years they do not have the communication for him to do anything but withdraw – Regina needs a new way of communicating.

    Strong Surrender requires holding onto your inner strength so you don’t go chasing a man to fulfill you.

    In my experience – the only way to begin a conversation a man does not want to have is to feel that you can walk away at any time – and to be able to say – I am FEARLESS about having this conversation, because if we can’t talk to each other, then I’m gone.

    And for Regina – that is very, very difficult. Can you see from her letter that she has basically done everything “he wanted”? That he says what he wants and she does it?

    This is a psychological issue for Regina, and it’s a case of getting your “diva” on so that you CAN ask him what’s going on, and use my Modern Siren Tools to turn things around.

    A man who goes out and gets drunk instead of talking, and a woman who “goes along” are not good candidates for the “heart to heart” conversation that needs to happen here. Heart-to-heart talking is a skill, and you need backbone in order to do it.

    Regina needs to tend to her backbone before she can talk – otherwise it will come out the way it always has. He needs to be shaken up with – “I have needs that don’t fit in with your description of the relationship you say you want with me – which is ‘friends with benefits’ – and I don’t exactly know how to talk to you about it. It would feel great to talk about how this happened and how you’re feeling, and when you want to do that, I’d love to talk with you about it, but until then, I don’t feel comfortable with the arrangement you’re suggesting.”

    The prevailing wisdom in the “get him back” community of experts is that – if a man does or says something about needing “space’ – the first thing you do is AGREE WITH HIM. “Oh – I’m so glad you said that, you’re right, it’s the right thing to do, this isn’t working the way it should, you’re so right, and I’ll be fine.” And then you smile, and go out and date every man or woman who shows up in your life.

    And yes – this works great. Only – it’s a lie.

    No one feels that way when someone you love withdraws and goes away. No one.

    Yes – it pulls them back. Yes, it works for a minute. Yes, it even makes them jealous. Sometimes.

    But then, you have to keep it up. You have to always stay at arms distance. You can never stop lying.

    And I am completely opposed to this.

    The whole core of my work is about telling the truth – and the truth is that Regina is heartbroken, mystified, thrown for a loop, totally confused, and has deeper feelings that are hard to even connect with – rage and terror. How can things be brilliant for 4 years and then suddenly dissolve?

    Mark – you know the answer to this.

    Something happened. Regina’s man was going along, content, and something happened. Something shook him up, and he no longer felt “content.” He no longer felt “in love” – if indeed he ever did – and suddenly, contentment wasn’t enough.

    Well – there’s a big, big difference between “contentment” and what you need to commit to a woman forever.

    He is trying to EXTEND his “contentment” at Regina’s expense.

    REGINA HAS TO ASK HIM WHAT HAPPENED. YES. But the basis for that conversation is not there. and the reason it’s not there is because Regina is still at his “beck and call” – emotionally.

    This is not “cutting bait.” A man is not a fish. Fish do not yearn to jump in the boat and be eaten.

    But a man yearns to throw himself into the heart of a woman who can appreciate and love him – and above all – love HERSELF.

    This is the step I want to help Regina recover – her love for herself. In that process, her man may rekindle his feelings for her – if, as I said before – they were ever more than “friends with benefits” – and I doubt that they were.

    There’s so much here – let’s keep the discussion going. I don’t have to be right. REALLY. Actually there IS no right. I try to see what’s really there, to the best of my ability, without rose-colored glasses – and to suggest you take the STRONGEST steps that will get you where you want to go the FASTEST.

    Love, Rori

    written by Rori Raye
    Saturday, 18 April 2009 @ 2:40pm


  321.  #321Mel on July 19, 2011 at 4:29 pm

    Re: 320

    That’s one of the BEST Rori posts I’ve ever read!

  322.  #322Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    Ella, this is what Tinque had posted about being a mess:

    56: tinque says:
    No Darling Ella, not completely. We are all works in progress. You can even be a downright mess and still attract your special man. You may lose him if you don’t continue to work on opening yourself, but if you do and he’s your brand of good man, he will stick around. And he will likely fall even more deeply for you.


    Monday, 18 July 2011 @ 12:13pm

  323.  #323Daria on July 19, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    thanks tinque

  324.  #324Lilybelle on July 19, 2011 at 4:56 pm


    I was feeling so hopeful and encouraged this morning. THEN, I started listening to my NV’s tell me that there is no way in hell that the kind of man I desire is going to want to meet me, date me and subsequent relationship me. I’m too old, not pretty enough and that it’s too late for me and I should probably settle with one of those toothless dudes with the fish.

    Damn it! That’s what I get for listening to “statistics” during a work conversation today. Ugh. Ugh. UGH!!!

    I need to chose to believe in what I see. NOT stats. I don’t believe stats anyway. I typically need to see it to believe it. lol. I just need to listen to people’s stories…believe in what I see and find the next best feeling place to hang out in until this passes.

    I’m only 47 and damn it, still very, very young looking and acting. Men see my chronological age and say ewwww…

  325.  #325alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 4:57 pm

    i feel embarrassed. i feel quivering lip. pouty lip. downturned eyes. i feel heat in my face. in my right shoulder. fidgeting. touching my ear. moving my head. fidgeting.

    i am experimenting with new behavior and i feel embarrassed and ashamed to be who i am. 🙁 i feel teary eyes.

    i became such a Master, A-1, expert, PRO at knowing which of my behaviors are more pleasing to others. that i lost myself in the presence of others. which is why the company of others grew to be a chore and not pleasurable for me. others enjoyed my company. of course, i was bending and contorting around them.

    and the main acceptable emotion in my family growing up was depressed. although you still got yelled at but it seemed to be very accepted. but the top #! was if i contorted to others needs. 🙁 oh sad face, grief, tears, sobbing. that feels like sweating. more hot face.

    if i felt anger, it was shamed. if i expressed boundaries – shamed. needs- shamed. (or ignored which is worse not sure)

    if i expressed happiness i was picked on. ridiculed. happiness was an extreme mismatch in vibrations in my house growing up.

    and now. now. i am moving towards being a social creature and the only way that works for me is to be authentic. and i am bombarded with my shame voice and embarrassment.

    “no, don’t say that.”
    don’t post that. erase it.
    tone it down.
    don’t get too much attention. (SELFISH!!!!)

    i feel heat in my chest.

    i feel embarrassed to be judged. i feel embarrassed to be authentic. what if no one likes me? what if everyone decides i am “too much” and i get excluded. 🙁


    nono. there are people who will like me and want to be around me. certainly. i just need to allow them to come to me. keep experimenting with being authentic and like will be matched with like.

    and then i will feel part of. and that will feel pretty good.

  326.  #326ice Princess on July 19, 2011 at 5:02 pm

    I’m having such a great day. Did things for me today! I even told LP that I was starting to believe that he was unhealthy for me and he said well I’ll just talk to you later which used to make me feel so awful but now I feel relieved…I can feel things starting to change within me. I know that bad days will still be ahead but I think I can do this now. Thanks everyone for helping me through this.

  327.  #327Plum on July 19, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    321: Mel 

    I am so glad you read it, Mel, I was thinking of you too when pasting it.

    I felt desperate reading Rusty’s posts to you, explaining to you how to spy on your husband, pay a detective, check his computer and all.

    It is so not the problem. And so opposite to the soul of this blog.


  328.  #328Ella on July 19, 2011 at 5:38 pm

    Ok Sirens,

    Well J has not replied.

    I feel kinda ok. Its weird.

    And earlier he popped up on FB IM and then disappeared so I know it is not a no credit on phone issue.

    Sigh… well I guess he just lost interest then.

    Oh well whatever.

    I was reading over some of the stuff FW posted about attraction and I know I may often put out that less than vibe sometimes.

    That is ok I am working on that.

    Think this is an ideal opportunity to focus on loving me and raising my vibe and feeling MORE than… instead of less than.

    Yes MORE than.

    Know that I am a GORGEOUS, super attractive Siren.

    No matter what.

    It is sad for him that he is missing out on time with me!

    I did feel a lil triggered – annoyed when I saw him on FB… felt like I wanted to throw things. PISSED.

    And just feeling ok now.

    Daria and DE said some stuff that really helped me… they said what am I actually feeling… what am I wanting that is causing me to feel an urge to reach out to him here.

    Daria wondered if it was about feeling connected and close, and fear that nothing better will come along… and that is it EXACTLY.

    I am yearning for connection and closeness.

    And I feel fear that nothing better will come along and I won’t have that.

    I am feeling LONELY.

    I realised that tonight.

    I posted on FB that I am feeling lonely and a load of people made comments to cheer me up. And one guy who I’ve met a few times through mutual friends IM-ed me and wanted to cheer me up.

    He told me all the reasons he likes me and he said I am beautiful and also that I am vulnerable (in a good way) awww. felt so nice.

    J’s brother also made a comment to cheer me up and asked if I am still coming out on Sat, which felt good.

    Another man who disappeared before showed back up and wanted to ‘try again’ with me if I would allow him… I said ok although I do not believe it will go anywhere.

    And my boss from my bar work job asked me to meet up with him for a drink outside of work, although he has a g,friend so not quite sure what all that is about.

    All in all I am feeling quite good about myself although am eating chocolate cake in bed (its late here) which was not really part of my ‘lose the last few pounds’ diet plan!


  329.  #329thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 5:38 pm

    I could use some help here…..
    Just got my daily text from him saying:
    I was in (my favorite store) today. I miss you.

    How am I supposed to reply to these? It seems stupid to just keep texting back that I also miss him…… When things are the way they are. Should I ignore them? Should i be sireny?

    I don’t know what to do. But I think giving him time alone might make him see my worth. Help?

  330.  #330Ella on July 19, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    Oh & cheer up guy from FB says he is gonna finally call, after months of IM contact and me saying I feel better on phone but decided not to make a boundary here as I was not really thiking we would date.

    And another guy from the internet who has come and gone a few times finally asked for my number to plan a date…

    He is one who triggered less than stuff for me… so has been good for healing.

    So actually feeling quite Sireny and good.

    And no matter what any of these guys r doing or not doing I completely love and accept myself as I am and I am for me!

    I am great.

    And I am my biggest fan.

    Nearly time to love myself by having some rest.


  331.  #331Ella on July 19, 2011 at 5:49 pm

    Oh & forgot to say… one thing I have learnt from this whole thing with J is that I really intend that I will not shut down with guys anymore…

    And I know what that means now.

    I will not let my NVs get the best of me and I will be consciously staying open… and KNOWING that I am MORE than good enough… for any guy!

  332.  #332Lucy on July 19, 2011 at 5:50 pm

    Ella, I feel glad for you that you posted about your loneliness on fb. Yay for being real. Hugs and love. <3

  333.  #333ice Princess on July 19, 2011 at 5:56 pm

    Wow Ella! So excited for you! 🙂

  334.  #334Ella on July 19, 2011 at 6:00 pm

    Thirtyseven I am feeling a little confused.

    As far as I am aware the no g,friend speech is to let a guy who is dragging his feet on commitment know that we are not going to wait around for him…

    But you don’t have to shut down to him by ignoring his texts… unless you want to.

    I guess you can diminish the importance of them and fade them to grey a bit and just answer when you rememeber.

    Or you could sink deeper into your feelings to find out what you are really feeling, underneath ‘thinking’ that is it silly to have to keep replying.

    Eg ‘I feel furious… disconnected, bored, sad, annoyed …’ whatever to keep recieving these texts.

    I want to be close with you and until you are ready to be close I need to focus on other things.

    I don’t want to keep recieving lots of texts (only say this if you are really sure you don’t want to recieve them – I have done this before and then missed them when they have stopped).

    Maybe just start with expressing how you feel about getting these texts.

    What do you think?

  335.  #335thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 6:35 pm

    Ella truth be told I am totally confused too.

    I thought the no girlfriend speech was good for a man dragging his feet OR for a man giving us not exactly the relationship we want. It does kind of feel like N ultimatum to me though, and I don’t know what the Hell I’m doing.

    My NVs are saying, well why do you miss me? Just go see ypur ex bartending like you did behind my back. Or just go take her to get pierced like you did.behind my back. I’m still feeling too raw and angry to get in touch with my true feelings.

    Your suggestions for responses sounded so perfectly siren like and logical, and so far removed from anything I would automatically think to say that I Just feel more lost than ever. Thanks for taking the time to address my issues though. I feel like I need to sleep onthings before i can express myself.

  336.  #336Mel on July 19, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    “I’m too old, not pretty enough and that it’s too late for me and I should probably settle with one of those toothless dudes with the fish.”

    Oh Lilybelly! But you ARE pretty, and it’s NEVER too late and you will find a wonderful man with a beautiful smile to love and appreciate you for the amazing and smart person that you are!

  337.  #337DE on July 19, 2011 at 6:49 pm

    Ella #334:

    Well, the No gf speech applies anytime…a man asks u what u are looking for…

    I used it early on when they ask what i am looking for…or they want exclusivity early on…

    Just today I had a conversation with a guy…he asked me what I am looking for…so I told him flat out…”I am not looking to a status of a girlfriend to anyone till consistency, compatibility and chemistry are apparent…and of course, a serious discussion of a long term future together…”…He got quiet…:) He apparently hasn’t heard that before 🙂

    So, the no gf speech can be used in many instances when you feel like stating your boundaries …this way, there are no games….they know upfront u are going to be available to dates to other men till the right one comes along…

    Warm hugs,

  338.  #338Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 6:59 pm

    Lilybelly several relationship coaches got married in their 40s – Virginia Feingold Clarke of It’s Never Too Late to Marry is one.

  339.  #339Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    thirtyseven I believe you would better off if you sleep on it to get things clear.

  340.  #340thirtyseven on July 19, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    In better news, I just got back from a fantastic 50 minute walk. This is something I’ve started nightly since things started really going to Hell betwen us….. It’s helpful so much for me both mentally and physically!

  341.  #341Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    Ella in the EFT Interview CD Rori recommend that we say I deeply and profoundly love and accept myself. I am using my mind to embed that in my unconscious every spare moment I get – walking on the street to lunch, riding on the bus or train. I find I unconsciously lift my shoulders and smile as a result many times and people around me actually respond to it. This is what I am now focussed on to keep my vibe up.

  342.  #342Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    RE 340 I would recommend focussing on reprogramming your self talk as you walk.

  343.  #343Wildflower on July 19, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    I have to admit I’m feeling confused. Rori posted earilier that leaning back without also opening up won’t work. My question is, what does that (leaning back but not opening up) look like? I feel worried maybe I do that?? I feel torn between just accepting myself for who I am (kind of on the quiet side) and trying to be more “open.” What do you guys think?

  344.  #344Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    RE 343 I think the response you get will help you to know. What I do is I visualize my heart opening, my heart light flickering for all to see and feel, as I talk in my head, my heart is open and warm. I also try to keep a smile on my face as the physical sign of my open heart.

  345.  #345Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 7:43 pm

    @FeminineWoman 222,
    Thanks so much for your reply. I feel very validated since I did the right thing on my own. 🙂 Well the very night I talked to him, I logged onto Skype and he messaged me no more than three seconds after I logged in. He asked me how I was doing, and how my laundry day went (because I told him I was doing laundry that day). And I could tell he already missed me because he was showing a lot of interest in how my laundry day went. lol. We ended up talking until like 5am (About four hours), but not about the talk we had had earlier. About movies and other random stuff. I felt really relieved and energized to be talking to him, because I had been down all day because of the decision I had to make. He told me he’d been down too, but never mentioned out conversation. He showed me last night that he really does care and want me in his life.
    I don’t know if that counts as him “showing up?” He expressed that he misses me yeah, but I don’t know if that counts. Should I stop logging into Skype so often? Should I talk to him less? I know I should start concentrating on myself, going places, CDing my friends, myself, other guys. But I feel afraid he will get comfortable talking to me every day like we use to and he’ll think that nothing has changed.

  346.  #346Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    As I read this today I felt I was reading about Ella. It is something I got from Sasha Xarrian

    “It doesn’t matter if it doesn’t work ouit for you. The only thing that matters is that you step through your fear and do it.

    So many times we criticise ourselves for our perceived failures. We took a step and failed. A secret to self-confidence is to not judge yourself for being brave enough to take it. That is what really counts.

    A lot of things we do, don’t work out. So what? Better to die trying than to not try at all.

    But again, the important point is, if you walk through your fear and take action, your self-confidence will improve, especially if you honor and praise yourself for taking the action.
    It doesn’t matter if the action works out! What matters is you conquered your fear! And now your comfort zone has expanded. Once you continue to do this, you will find your comfort zone will get larger and larger until there is nothing that ou are afraid to do. Your self-confidence will be explosive.”

  347.  #347Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:49 pm

    RE 345 Lercomari the thing that came to me is “honor your commitment”. I would keep my word, whatever I said to him. Without boundaries there can be no commitment. He has to know you love yourself enough to take care of your needs. You are so committed to your happiness that you are fiercely creating the life that you so desire.

  348.  #348Wildflower on July 19, 2011 at 7:54 pm

    Thank you FW I will try that. I guess I feel so confused with all this sometimes. I feel like my first couple of dates go really well and then sometimes the men start losing interest or drift away. I wonder if maybe they just weren’t that interested in the first place, or if I change and close up because I start to feel more vulnerable. I don’t want to do that, but I’m quiet by nature so I wonder if sometimes men are expecting me to say more?? I don’t know 🙁 All I know is I’ve been CDing my a$$ off for the past year and right now I’m feeling exhausted and wondering if I’m any closer to what I want than when I started. There are other things going on. I have a family member who I love dearly in critical condition in the hospital right now so I suppose my feelings of frustration and exhaustion (been up for a few nights straight) could be affecting my outlook. But still. Ok I don[t want to sound all negative so any advice on how to be “open” is really appreciated. Thanks again FW!

  349.  #349Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:57 pm

    RE 348 It is not good to do anything when you are tired. It brings your vibe down. Cdating is therapy to helps us heal our issues.

  350.  #350Femininewoman on July 19, 2011 at 7:59 pm

    RE 348 Sorry to hear about your loved one. Sending prayers and positive vibes your way.

  351.  #351Emerson on July 19, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    229: Ella says:
    My Goodness I am seeing it all today.

    There is a guy on POF who has written in his profile ‘Any serious women out there who want to settle down and make babies get in touch’

    He he… sounds kinda weird to me.

    Ella, I literally laughed out loud when I read this! So funny! The other guy’s post that you mentioned was seriously disturbing!
    I hope you have some legit ones come through. 😉

  352.  #352Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 8:34 pm

    @FeminineWoman 347

    Thanks so much for your advice…I will honor my commitment and start creating my life the way I want it to be.

  353.  #353Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:20 pm

    ‘i dont feel comfortable with that because im not feeling loved in girly ways…

    i need to be told im beautiful,

    i need you to put your arms around me,

    i need more affection

    i need to be held

    i need to be told im loved

    i need to feel adored

    i need time

    i need attention

    i need to feel heard

  354.  #354Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    “you look so good

    i love touching you

    wow .. nice package”

  355.  #355Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:30 pm

    help! i feel like im in love

    but i can handle it

    he called

    hes tired

    i feel good that he called me though!



  356.  #356Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    ok yesterday he texted me and i called him wen i went out and went to see him

    and then contributed money!

    and… i felt all GOOD about it…

    well at first no, cuz i said i wouldnt. and then he said that was ok.

    and then i did, and he said hes a good person and i can share everything when he has it

    and i had said about how i felt weird and i had felt tense

    and it felt good and i was looking in his eyes

    and i felt protected by him

    and then today he was gonna call me to see me

    and i woke up feeling terrible and

    i called him twice

    but now he did call me back like he said and hes tired

    and …

    i feel all great

    and i feel icky writing this cuz i think im making it sound like im a lean forward weirdo

    which i was, for awhile

    and i told him i was feeling all clingy and like i was bugging him and he said no no

    and he said we can hook up tomorrow early

    and he said he wants a back massage right now and would i give him one

    and i said yah it would feel great to give him one if he was here – AND I MEANT IT!!!

    i dont remember wanting to give men back massages before…


    like, normally i would feel put off and be like huh, what about mine
    or feel scared and closed off

    and trying to hold back and make sure im strategically not giving

    however now im feeling all open and just honestly happy to hear from him and would have loved to give him a massage


    i feel like i have trust towards him and all open and warm towards him too

    maybe hes here to heal my holding back

    in Love scripts, Rori talks a lot about praising men, like saying how they look good and how it feels good to touch them, and how to always play with their papi thang etc

    and i want to start an experiment of doing that kinda appreciating without worrying that im leaning forward

    and see how i feel and what happens

    i feel a lil more tight now after i wrote this post cuz its like…
    what am i getting?

    but somehow im feleing all grateful that he;s here to hang out with me and that i feel good around his body and i feel good around him’

    and last time we hung out i did feel MUCH more feminie then the first time when i felt like i was all jumping up to “impress” and i felt all boy

    i love me

    i feel all stirred up inside and a lil nauseaus now


    it felt better to feel the warm joy i felt a moment ago

  357.  #357Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    wait im just looking at it from outside and it sounds like im falling in love…

    yet hes not doing too much… well he’s tired and not rushing desperately to see me… or calling me constantly trying to see me

    and that feels bad

    ok i dont want to analyze

    i was just feeling great

    i can trust that

    i feel great so there

    he loves me no matter what it looks like

    yay me

    love my nvs

    i believe i am lucky!

    i believe acuna matata

    i believe i am loved!

    i can appreciate appreciate appreciate!

  358.  #358alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    #337 DE nice!

  359.  #359Daria on July 19, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    as long as i feel good thats whatsup!

    and i DO feel goodi dont have to wait to feel good for when the logistics line up with what i want

    i love me

    the nvs are getting me and i love me anyway!!!

    back to rori listening now

  360.  #360Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:02 pm

    omg i feel so afraid of my own judgements!

    what am i getting here?

    Daria i thought you wanted romantic amazing dates with guys who would want to come see u all the time

    well he does seem to want to see me like everyday

    and he did call

    and i feel protected with him

    and i feel turned on around him

    and i feel so good when im with him!

    “that sounds stupid”

    i love me!

    and thank you!

    i feel glad you want so much amazing stuff Daria

    and… i think you can have it!!

    and appreciate what you Are receiving

    he wants to see u early tomorrow and that will feel fun huh

    yes it will/would

    and he flirts with me and i feel good and paid attention to

    i love me

    i love my nvs

    i am healing

    whatever it is, i am definitely healing here and that is my intent and it feels lovely

    sigh.. mff that Does feel good

  361.  #361Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    what throws me off is when Rori says we dont wnat to feel ‘grateful’ to a man, but do want to appreciate


    to me grateful is the same as appreciating

    i do feel happy that he called (but is that too small?)

    i love me

    i felt good!

    and now im running myself down

    and i felt so good i felt good to think about giving him a massage

    i felt so Not mad

    i felt so Good


    cuz he said hes exhausted so hes gonna get to sleep tonite so that we can link up early tomorrow


    whatever it is – oh yeah i remember this is about my healing –

    it feels good it felt good

    ‘but what if he doesnt like you? hes just being a friend?’

    he does like me

    i love me

    i can do this

  362.  #362Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    i have so been holding back with men when it comes to appreciating the way they look, the way i feel turned on around them, ive been avoiding touching them and avoiding touching their papi thang


    i love me!

    i want to heal everything!

  363.  #363Corin on July 19, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    318- Can anyone help with what to say here? Should I not even be worrying about this? It IS bugging me although I try to focus on other things.

  364.  #364Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:14 pm

    it reminds me of being with Getright, but without the crazy drunkeness, the ogling of other women, and the constant criticism

  365.  #365T-Girl on July 19, 2011 at 10:22 pm

    My emotions are running amuck today. This evening I asked poker player a bunch of questions just to get to know him better. I don’t think he took my questions seriously and jokingly made me feel bad about asking them. He treats me so wonderfully but I am beginning to get scared of having so many feelings for him. He is 46 and has never been married. What if I just turn into one of his “ex girlfriends” which he seems to have so many of. Stupid NV’s. Please don’t ruin this for me. I’m so scared…

  366.  #366Corin on July 19, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    T- irl,

    No one can make us feel bad. I wonder if feeling vulnerable and aware of how deep your feelings go is more where you are at. Can you communicate this fear and vulnerability to him? How would it feel to do that with no expectations in the reply? I’m so with you in my situation on the fears that your NVs are raising. I try to hold onto my trust in him and even more than that, that I will be OK no matter what happens with us because I am wonderful.

    I remind myself that if I do turn into another ex girlfriend it will be because there’s something even more amazing that I have been released to find. ‘I have all this or even better in my future’ is what I keep saying to myself. The guy in some respects is coincidental because it is me who has learnt to open up to the level of love i am gaining thus far with my man. If I keep rising in my love and he can’t follow me then that means that someone who can offer even more love is in my future.

    Hope this helps, it seems a bit garbled re- reading but I thought that sharing what I do might help in some way. xxx

  367.  #367Corin on July 19, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    Opps, I meant T- Girl

  368.  #368Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    “i know i tolerated it before

    and it doesnt seem fair to be making a big deal of it all of a sudden

    and i feel like i just woke up…

    and i know youre not doing anything on purpose to hurt me

    and when i hear you planning your day and talking to yourself and im right there i feel left out… and i feel neglected and i start to feel resentful”

  369.  #369Daria on July 19, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    and i dont want to be about telling you what to do,

    it just makes me feel like shutting down, and walking away…

    what can we do to make this better… for both of us

  370.  #370lm on July 19, 2011 at 10:56 pm

    daria @ 356:

    this is interesting to read…

    i am experimenting with letting a man lead totally, including agreeing to call a guy (i’ll call him soccer guy) who told me he wants me to call him when i have time during the day. i’m on vacation and he’s stuck working in a super-hot office, so he says it would ‘make his afternoon’ if i called him at work. it was sweet and felt masculine. i think i would have been really hesitant to call him even if he asked even a couple of weeks ago. i would have judged him for being feminine.

    it seems like a little thing, but it’s kind of a shift for me. going totally by feeling totally. sometimes it’s still hard for me and think too much about whether or not i’m ‘doing things right’. NVs! ah!!

  371.  #371Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:06 pm

    ok so maybe i really enjoy taking the train to a man

    it feels adventurous to me

    so sue me!


  372.  #372Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    Im – yah, i would feel resistant to that one…

    i don’t even really enjoy men calling me… unless its to plan a date

    even though one of my main daters right now, hawkman, calls me and texts me just to talk pretty regularly

    the calling i did today and yesterday was majorly needy lean forward calling…

    i felt so clingy and like i better “lock down” this new york thing while im still here… it did not come from a powerful place

    i felt ‘crazy’

  373.  #373Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:11 pm

    ooh i like the idea of going totally by feelings!

    that does feel good

    i would like to enjoy that i feel given to by this new york guy…

    tho he didnt call me back after eating his chinese food like he said… im not really worried about it…

    hawkman dosnt call when he says he will either… but he calls… often

    maybe i really AM low maintenance…

    i dono


    now im feeling a bit sad

    i am healing i am healing 🙂

  374.  #374Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 11:12 pm

    @ Daria 371

    As long as it feel okay to you. 🙂 I take the train to go see Techie. He lives an hour and a half away and taking the train is more practical than driving (He doesn’t have a car and I don’t have the gas money!). You’re right, it does feel adventurous. And seeing him walking toward me all sexy looking on the platform is so worth it. I just wish they still used steam engines so I could see him walking through a cloud of steam…lol.

  375.  #375lm on July 19, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    and…soccer guy just texted to say good night twice and that he wishes he was with me to take care of me because i’m sick.

    that feels good! like he’s giving to me from far away.

  376.  #376Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:23 pm

    Lercomari – yeah but seeing it written it out… the nv’s…

    “why doesnt he take the train to you? why doesnt he take the train to Me?”

    i actually think my taking the train to him and all that is making me feel MORE invested and leading to this ‘in love’ feeling im having…

    all that investment wouldn’t be going on for me if i wasn’t doing those things… would it?

    and if im investing in a something that isn’t as invested in me… im gonna break my heart

    im still up for all the healing here though

    i wonder what he showed up for me to heal?


  377.  #377Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    i guess i feel kinda vulnerable being here in this city by myself

    and i feel grateful that he is taking time out his day to spend with me and make me feel at home and show me a fun time

    is that like “greatful” doormat? am i asking for too little?

    i really appreciate it!

    it makes me feel like i have a ‘friend’ i have someone here im connected to

    it feels GREAT

    well i can appreciate that


    i am guessing that its a good thing,

    or am i being a doormat?

    there are other men who also showed me around and i appreciated them … (but i did not feel all ‘crazy’ or feel a drive to call them when they didnt call me… and im pretty sure that they would respond positively and maybe are even waiting for me to call them)

    so maybe its a mix

    i dono

    its also clearly hormonal how my body feels around him

  378.  #378alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:40 pm

    ah, splendidness was the day. a beautiful hike just before sunset. the dog named rico that kept wanting me to pet him while his owner kept shouting “Rico! rico” “rico come here!” and rico would run to his owner and then run back to me for more pets. “Rico!” “Rico!” “Come here!”

    and then the holy-what-tha TRAFFIC that i was easily lead around and kind of breezed my way through on side streets.

    and the parking spot.

    and then i popped in the store for a few items and the hot hispanic guy that has worked there for years did a double take when he saw me, (literally) and then i chose his line to cash out in and he gave me the c-o-l-d brrrr. why? i think he has a girlfriend? but why? WHY DON’T THE BOYS I LIKE, LIKE ME?!!!!
    and anyway i was probably pretty chilly myself but wtf after years of giving him the flirty smile and getting nada back i feel kind deflated and so am trying to act “cool” now. like whatevs. yeah paper bag. thanks. ciao.

    but why the double take (his TRUE reaction) until he saw that i saw him. and then all i got from him was the brrrr..

    i pick the same man over and over and over and….

    but i got over that quick. and then i was going to go home and i was like NO i don’t want to go home. I want to be active and live a FUN life. and I AM THE PARTY!

    little alias: and you work too much alias girl and i am … i just can’t… do it anymore. 🙁

    Big alias: do you want to go play tennis?

    little alias: i don’t know.

    Big alias: it would be new behavior.

    little alias: no. i don’t know. i don’t feel like it.

    big alias: well it would be new behavior so let’s say we go try it and see how we feel then, ok?

    alias: ok.


    I want an active, adventurous, BELLE OF THE BALL, life.

    baby steps.

  379.  #379alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:42 pm


    i feel wrong to ask this but am going to anyway.

    i feel curious why he doesn’t take the train to YOU.

  380.  #380Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:43 pm

    i mean do i feel like a goddess he adores?

    maybe in some way

    i feel like i adore Him… and i just feel all lit up when i hear his voice

    and i can enjoy that… hey

    i CAN enjoy that… evne though chemistry is ‘probably bad’ maybe its not bad, or good

    and in some ways i do feel like a goddess, and like he likes me

    i love me

    i felt good that he called me after all my crazy calling him

  381.  #381alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    what can i do RIGHT NOW that would be FUN?

    my vibration is going to have a new set point called FUN.

    like the settings on a stove.

    there will be







    hmmm what else?

    i will add the setting CALM AND PEACEFUL CONTENTMENT

  382.  #382Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    “what if he doesnt call tomorrow?” 🙁

    will i feel all crazy and bummed?

    that would suck

    i would like to feel excited about getting a chance to go to the museum

    and not even worry if he calls or not

    but i sooo miss him!!


    it would feel Great to see him tomorrow… which i said

    i like how appreciative my tone was/is on the phone

    i really felt good!


  383.  #383alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:48 pm

    what if

    i never again


    a single thing







  384.  #384Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:49 pm

    OMG alias i love the stove settings!!

    right now im cooking on fun peaceful loafing

  385.  #385Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:50 pm

    alias girl do you think you will go to jail if you dont?

    i do .. i feel stuck to my persecution terror

  386.  #386alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:50 pm

    mmm then i came home from my hike and tennis and made a shake. and it was all cold and slurrpy and delicious.

    and i thought

    heck, this is a good life.

  387.  #387alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:52 pm

    #385 daria

    i don’t understand fully (at all really) the question

    i mean my answer is no because i don’t have those kinds of feelings or fears in my core

    but i would like to understand better the question

  388.  #388alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:54 pm

    right now i am simmering on quiet contentment and a wry sense of fun. but i have an eye on ADVENTURE possibly for tomorrow since i didn’t end up getting in my seminar that i was on the waiting list for.

  389.  #389Daria on July 19, 2011 at 11:57 pm

    alias girl – ok cool! well i think it comes down to the core things…

    but basically i figure if i do only what i want i will be like a homeless bum and eventually they will start picking on me and telling me not to sleep there and then i wont want to and then theyll take me to jail

    something like that

    or i wont pay some kinda fee i get assigned and then theyll put out a warrant and take me to jail

    or ill smoke weed somewehre or drive without a license and ill go to jail


    i dono

    just seems that if i dont do stuff i dont want to then ill one way or antoerh go to jail

    i guess i have the impression that society is built on a kind of unseen implicit slavery so not doing what i dont want to will eventually out me for rebellion

  390.  #390alias girl on July 19, 2011 at 11:58 pm

    #385 do you mean like not stopping for red lights because …lalalala “i don’t want to”

    or not paying taxes

    well both of those things i really don’t mind doing. in fact i feel rather appreciative of both of those things.

    i can’t think of something illegal that might come of my decisions to STOP doing crap that I Don’t Want To.

    I mean, i don’t even mind doing the dishes or the laundry.

    but i don’t ever do them when I Don’t Want To. Never. somehow i either come into alignment or say screw it and wait til the inspiration comes.

  391.  #391Lercomari on July 19, 2011 at 11:58 pm

    @376 Daria,

    I understand your point. It does hurt if you’re more vested than he is. I feel reluctant to say anything more than that…I’m still learning the RR way…but I know that you’re a vet at this and usually know the right things to do.

    @379 alias girl,

    He has taken the train to me a couple times before. But I would just rather go see him. My city is hot and desert-y and not much to do there. He lives in Los Angeles though, and he knows the city inside out. It’s way easier to get around by public transit in L.A than in my town. So its fun to go exploring with him.
    Also I live with a mom and a sister who are at each other’s throats on a regular basis (she’s 21 but is pretty much still a teenager), so I welcome the opportunity to just get out of the house and go on excursions with him.
    I know me going to see him seems like leaning forward, but he is the one who sets the dates and what we will be doing.

  392.  #392Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:01 am

    ok for example what if i dont want to wear clothes!

  393.  #393alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:03 am

    Lercomari ah yes, i see. normally rori suggests otherwise but i see your points.

    although rori does say even if he has the “nicer” place, have him come to your place.

    not sure. i don’t do everything 100% rori. that would be weird and cultish nd robotic if idid.

    but i do believe there is a little something to the point she makes.

    but also it sounds like you are really lined up with it and enjoying it.

  394.  #394Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:05 am

    ouch well thank you for the trigger

    Daria you are not weird or cultish Or robotic if you do decide to do things 100% Rori

    not gonna sign up for that nv

    one day ill feel confident enough to aonly choose men that bring romance to me

    meanwhile ill work with where im at and if i want to throw myself at men and break my heart i can deal with it

  395.  #395Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:07 am

    i never thought about dating before Rori, i was a hanging out casually girl

    dn it always felt very fun like this feels, however i did get my heart broken


    like with guywho

    i just luvvvved going to him

    i did not know anyone ‘my style’ who went out on dates

    but it does seem like it would feel posh to have men taking me out

    i still am not really 100% in the habit of men taking me out



    i am a lsoer. no im not. i love me

  396.  #396alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:08 am

    daria. #389 i would say that would be a vibrational thing. if you were homeless why couldn’t you find yourself a nice place to sleep? a place away from policeman. and why would someone insist on not moving if a police officer asks them to?

    i mean i get that “you don’t want to”

    but there is a vibration underneath it that seems to be causing more trouble than it would be worth. why would you WANT that?

    #392 ok so go to a nude beach, be naked in your house or yard or go to nude parties. why do you have to WANT to do things that are breaking the law rather than just deciding what you want and then finding a way to do those things while coexisting within the laws.?

    even pot smoking you can get a prescription and be legal.

    what do you think?

  397.  #397Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:09 am

    i feel much more confident about myself with men now after learning Rori stuff

    and i Have been getting treated a lot better!

    almost like wow

    and this is more like “old me” style

    and it feels so comfy


    thats probably wassup with it

    but whatever it is

    i intend to heal what this situation showed up for me to heal

  398.  #398alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:10 am

    #394 LOL. your last couple of posts of your recent behavior are so NOT 100% rori.

  399.  #399Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:18 am

    yes 🙂


    except for the ‘im experimenting’ part

    well wait theres a whole lot of parts like the “i wonder what he showed up for me to heal” part

    and the sharing with him how im really feeling part

    and this other part where i let go of trying to plan and went with experimenting

    and lots of lil stuff

    but i still dont want that NV

    sorry if that was triggering to you alias girl, im feeling a bit uncomfortable … reading into your post that you felt uncomfortable too

  400.  #400alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:25 am

    i feel annoyed that my statement had nothing to do with a person and she is on a public forum when she states that she is “triggered” as if the statement was made to her personally. yes, i feel uncomfortable with that a desire to clarify. and annoyed. ugh. i don’t want drama.

    and i feel overlooked and stepped over that i respond to someone’s direct inquiry and i am left wondering if they ever even read it.

    i don’t want to waste my time and energy with people who ask and do not acknowledge that i responded.

  401.  #401alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:27 am

    like i am being sucked into someone’s vacuum.

  402.  #402alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:29 am

    and the energy and love and care and concern and ALL THESE REALLY GREAT QUALITIES that i have cultivated in myself and wooosh into someone’s vacuum.

    and what is in it for me.

    i feel disappointed. annoyed. and used.

  403.  #403alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:31 am

    and disgusted with myself. and one more time i vow to not get sucked into someone’s vacuum. and

    then it happens again.

    i will find the people who appreciate and give back to me. i will find the people who give and take. i will find the people who treat me with respect. i forgive myself. and i love myself for being honest.

  404.  #404Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:33 am

    i got attention by asking what to do…
    and sharing ‘smart’ information

  405.  #405Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:35 am

    wow.. im feeling scared and im feeling a lil angry…

  406.  #406alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:35 am

    re my response #396

    Daria. please stop asking my thoughts on something if you are not going to make any sort of acknowledgement that you even read it.

    it happened on a different post as well.

    and i feel really AWFUL. i feel like i am wasting my goddess energies and i don’t want to do taht.

    i feel like someone jsut wants to engage me so i start paying attention to them but that was the only reason for the intial engagement was so she could suck up more attention when i hade been perfectly content to just do my own thing on the blog.

    and then SUCKKKKKKKK and “alias girl… what do you think about?” and then the big


    screw you.

  407.  #407alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:38 am

    or “i’m triggered” = SUUUCCCCCCKKKK for attention.

  408.  #408Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:40 am

    thank you alias girl for your response to me… it’s helping me

    and i feel awkward to address this when theres the elephant of feeling upset about the other topic

    “but there is a vibration underneath it that seems to be causing more trouble than it would be worth. why would you WANT that?”

    this is really helping me though

    the vibration is there, like a Resistance to being controlled

    an ‘outlaw’ thing

    i think its a cultural thing for me and it seems to be very deep

    and built in with being an ‘outlaw’ is the existance of ‘law’ and then being outside it

    and the vibration in a way doesnt feel good

    its like a resistance, defense vibration

    ‘but it kept me alive for thousands of years’

    i love me and i intend to heal this

    but then the world would heal

    that feels scary

  409.  #409alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:44 am

    are you kidding? this is not feeling good. i feel unacknowledged.

    i do NOT want to just jump back to twenty minutes ago casual conversation and have all my feelings I just expressed unacknowledged and Ignored.

  410.  #410alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:46 am

    i feel repulsed at what seems like continual dynamic manipulations to keep redirecting my attention in a way that suits the other person.

  411.  #411Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:48 am

    alias girl – im feeling really defensive reading snippets of this stuff and im feeling really angry and shut down… i can’t truthfully hear openly where you’re coming from – i just notice myself wanting to argue and attack – when its coming at me in this way… it feels scary

    i care about you and want us to feel good communicating

    im gonna not read them but would feel open to talk about it another time in a way i can handle

  412.  #412Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:54 am

    wow i feel really calm and powerful

    and a lil tense still a lil pist

    ok actually i feel VERY Angry

    i feel like i still want to defend myself and attack

    and im not gonna do it!

    yay me!!!

    i can do this

  413.  #413Daria on July 20, 2011 at 12:55 am

    ok feeling scared… like im pissing someone off by being so … calm in the face of anger… like they’re gonna get More angry at me

    how dare you be so unaffected

    you don’t give a fuchk!

    you have no shame

    and all that stuff


    i love my feelings

    it feels good though!

    yay healing

  414.  #414alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 12:58 am

    daria. do what you want. i feel unacknowledged and ignored. which is what i often feel in my interactions with you.

    which is why i vow to not engage and then i feel sucked in. and then i feel ignored.

    i feel like i keep giving a person chances and maybe it’s just a mismatch.

    i don’t want to just be a source of attentive energy to someone.

    yes, i imagine these posts are hard to read. i do not feel compassion. i feel ignored and used. again.

    oh, i feel triggered.

  415.  #415Daria on July 20, 2011 at 1:01 am

    i feel so controlling about this dating thing!

    it feels so good being with you… hanging out casually feels wonderful

    and i just feel so much more secure when a man shows up with a set time and a plan

    i feel like a princess!

    and it feels wonderful… i even feel a bit unworthy of it!

    and i want to feel worthy!

    i love my unworthyness

  416.  #416alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:01 am

    i feel furious. how dare someone use up my resources as if i were put on this earth for them.

    i feel fury in my chest. i feel like a thick, hot, steel rod in the center of my body. i feel like the most powerful entity on the entire planet.

    I WILL NOT ALLOW PEOPLE TO USE ME. i forgive myself for allowing it to happen again. i forgive other people’s limitations.

    i forgive my own limitations. i forgive myself for going to the hardware store over and over and over again to buy milk. “sorry m’am no milk here.” and then i go and do it again.

  417.  #417Daria on July 20, 2011 at 1:03 am

    this feels really uncomfortable to write about my stuff right now!

    like im being a total insensitive jerk!

    ok i can handle this

    i can write about my stuff anyway

    i deserve my processing space


    i caught another snippet on my screen and i felt defensive and i traced it down to the word ‘used’

    i felt shut down reading the word used

    and im like who me defensive defensive

    noticing my reactions

    wow it feels unbelievable to not be attacking!!!


  418.  #418Daria on July 20, 2011 at 1:07 am

    i feel love for alias girl!

    and i feel scared… and i love my fear!!!


  419.  #419alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:07 am

    i feel so sad to be ridiculed.

    i feel the tralalaing is attempted ridicule. a sublime “attack”

    i feel so intuitive. my biggest blessing and my biggest curse in this life. and no, i wouldn;t trade it.

    tralala…i’m going to dance around in my skirt and pretend that i’m not angry.

    tralala no one can hurt me. i am unaffected. unless the attention is on ME.

    in a way that suits ME

    in a way that i will attempt to control to suit me.

    and screw it if it uses up alias girl’s goddess resources. i don’t care. tralalala. i will discuss being fake triggered to get attention

    but then when i am for real triggered i will clam up


  420.  #420Golnaz on July 20, 2011 at 1:32 am

    sorry , my english isnt that much good 🙁
    but i want to ask a question , i have a problem with my boyfrind , he have been away from me since 3 months ago , he said that he trust me BUT he dont ! if he calls me and i can not ansewr even just for 5 mintest he will became angry and mad . i should call him 2 times an hour ( forget about the bill of my cellphone however its a big problem for me too because he is in another country) , he didnt let me go to parties and gatherings even with my sister and my brother 🙁 … he said it’s just because that he miss me but i dont think so
    but he is too kind and always he says that he loves me … but i affraid of this kind of behaviour

    please help me
    how can i make him trust me?

  421.  #421alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:43 am

    daria. i often don’t feel like i am treated like a human being in our interactions.

    i feel bad this happens over and over again for me.

    occassionally i felt like you would come take a dump on my blog and then when i responded to not liking it you just went on your merry way.

    i feel like i am banging my head against a wall. looking for the aformentioned milk from a hardwarre store.

    and then enough time will pass and i will see something written by you about how you “love” or adore” me.

    it is just not how i would expect to feel if i was being adored and loved using my definitions. and so i take it seriously but it is not maybe. it is just words thrown around a blog.

    and i feel tired of being ignored or feeling used to be for attention.

    so i don’t want to do it anymore.

    and i can’t change another’s behavior but if i don’t respond to what seem like not quite genuine requests for my perspective on something… well i am not responding to take care of me. not neccessarly to push against you.

    but to care and cherish me. i just can’t tolerate being used by anyone anymore. and thank god for that. and i also am not silent about it anymore.

    anyway. i learn a lot from you and i will continue to read many of your posts( unless they feel bad, of course.)

    i don’t think this is do with me personally. i think this is how you are in the world and this is how i am. and maybe they just don’t match up on the level i require for continuing or deep engagement.

  422.  #422alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:47 am

    i feel kind of grown up. i feel self caring. i feel like i am a mother petting her daughter’s head and helping her through an emotionally charged and disappointing situation.

    i feel a little tug of a NV but it is so mumbled and soft i don’t even know what it is saying. whatever it is that NV is apparently losing it’s hypnotic power over me.

    i feel like i can do this.

    i will just keep practicing being authentic and let the chips fall where they may.

  423.  #423alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:52 am

    i feel pretty back to balanced. and that feels like easy breathing. and a curiousity about what now?

    what should i do now in this moment? what setting do i want to turn myself on to?



    aw, but i lost interest a little that it is just a party of one. maybe later.

    i could make homemade granola.
    or add the stuff i got from the library onto my computer.

    or surf the web.

    or go fishing at pof.

    i am setting my setpoint to

    suprise and delight. and appreciation for all the suprises and delights that come to me.

  424.  #424alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 1:54 am

    well i still feel a tinge of the “screw you” vibe activated in me.

    ok, maybe more than just a tinge.

    but that has kind of been there lately to take care of my NV. so i guess that will stick around until i get better with navigating the realm of socializing with other beans. (human beings)

  425.  #425alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 2:01 am

    this is familiar for me.

    i was talking with my therapist. i told her that i present a false self to people that contorts to what would be pleasing to me and i am not getting much out of it.

    and then something will happen one too many times and i’ll feel like puhlease. what is the point. and that’s my screw you point.

    she asked if i ever returned from that and undid it.

    no, i said. that’s why i don’t have any relationships. unless it’s a business relationship, then i will tolerate more but it’s often still a false self.

    why would i want to undo it? i wondered. if i wasn’t getting anything out of it.

    and i told her i felt unworthy to go for things i really wanted (relationships with men i am interested, or people who i thought would make cool friends. or jobs i wanted.) i told her i felt unworthy for what i desired.

    and then for the other things i make them unworthy.

    because i don’t know how to negotiate getting my desires met in a healthy way with healthy people in healthy relations. (wait does any of that even exist?) it must… or i wouldn’t have a desire for it.so yes, it does exist and it will come into my experience as soon as i allow it and become a vibrational match to it.

  426.  #426alias girl on July 20, 2011 at 2:11 am

    i mean what’s the solution for me?

    if a man doesn’t want to provide romance or dates or move towards long term

    and i do

    then what other solution is there? rori says the third way is to cd. (is that the 3rd way? i think so)

    but eventually i would get bored with the man providing me nothing of what i desire.
    i would stop going to his hardware store and requesting milk. it would eventually even probably get amusing to me.

    and eh would call me up occasionally offering me his hammers, free of charge. and i would say no, thank you, i am really looking for other things at this time. thank you though. you really do have nice hammers.

    and i guess same with anything. people move on. i shouldn’t feel so distressed that relations don’t last or that i move on. or i make choices to keep looking for something better and sifting through the contrast of life so i become really really clear on what i like.

    but like abraham says, don’t blame the rascal that caused the wanting because they are now not actually your new desire. the contrast of that situation caused you to know what you DO NOT WANT. and now allow what you do want.

    don’t keep focussing on the rascal for not giving it to you. you are only keeping the not having of it in your vibration.

    so thank you for all the contrast that allows me to know what i want. and for me keeping my focus on that so that i may come in whateve surprising and delightul way that it will.

  427.  #427Emoticon on July 20, 2011 at 3:21 am

    So I recently saw an old friend for the first time in 10 years since he moved to Trinidad and Tobago. It was only for one night but it felt so great. He drove all the way to my brother’s house 2 c me and we stayed outside talking for a few hours. When it got dark he took me and each of our little brothers to eat and to the movies. I flew to St.Lucia the very next day, but i was sure to thank him 4 the night. Since then he’s sent me a few messages (it’s only been a day) asking me to suggest more of our old friends to him on FB and asking me if i miss him yet. I suggested an old mutual friend, but didnt respond to the last part. wat do u sirens think abt this

  428.  #428Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:14 am

    RE 427 Emoticon not sure I would respond to the last part either. This is the first time in 10 years and it seems he is taking it for granted that you might have been waiting for him all this while.

  429.  #429Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:16 am

    Alias Girl I love reading your posts.

  430.  #430T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 5:19 am

    366 Corin, you are right – no one can make us feel bad. I needed that reminder. I need to bring it back to me.

    I am feeling very vulnerable right now and my feelings for him are getting VERY strong – I tried to communicate it last night but was not very successful. Now I feel scared trying to communicate my vulnerability again.

  431.  #431Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:21 am

    RE 420 Hil Golnaz. You can’t make him do anything. This is long distance and when I remember my long distance relationship I had to admit to myself it is all just words. It was too difficult for me so I let it go.

  432.  #432English Lady on July 20, 2011 at 5:24 am

    Does anybody know how to find out where you were up to when you have to log off the Internet? I was reading this morning at home, logged off, came to work and tried to pick up at lunchtime the last post I read but it has taken me nearly all of my lunchtime to find that point LOL!!

    HELP!! I am so far behind now 🙁

  433.  #433T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 5:35 am

    I am trying to live in my heart and not my head and it is scaring the crap out of me. Or is that my head trying to take over? Agghhhh!!

  434.  #434T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 5:37 am

    432 EL, I don’t think there is. I keep a little piece of paper by my computer and I write down the last comment number I read so I know where to pick up again. I can only read at home because my work blocks the website due to “relationship/dating site content”.

  435.  #435Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:39 am

    RE 433 Love the fear T-Girl it is there to protect us. Just know that you don’t have to “do” anything about it.

  436.  #436Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:41 am

    RE 430 That’s just your body telling you that you are an alive and juicy siren. I would practice pouring all that love myself, painting myself with love and waterwheeling it to me.

  437.  #437T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 5:52 am

    435 Thank you FW. I beleive it is my head that is trying to “do” something about what I am feeling. I need to bring it back to my heart.

    I also need to learn to recognize my feelings. Last night he kept saying “are you ok”? And I kept saying “I’m fine” when I didn’t feel fine. I think now I should have said “I’m feeling scared right now, but I will be fine”. But I feel saying something like that would scare him away. I think I just found out what is going to be the hardest for me in my healing.

  438.  #438Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 5:59 am

    RE 437 I understand from another coach that “I’m fine” is one of the biggest lies people tell in relationships. He seems to have felt that something was a bit off why he kept asking and I believe it is okay to say “I am not sure what I am feeling” or just plan “no”.

  439.  #439T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 6:01 am

    It didn’t feel good to me to say “I’m fine”. I didn’t feel authentic. I like that it is ok to say “I’m not sure what I am feeling”. Sometimes I don’t know…and its ok. I need to remember that.

  440.  #440Butterfly Wings on July 20, 2011 at 6:03 am

    210: Femininewoman says:

    RE 209 BW sounds like you have enough going on so you can take the pressure off him.

    Yep you’re sooo right FW! Almost a year ago I wasn’t so busy so spent many hours at home waiting for TH to contact me and of course my vibe was terrible! And thinking back I am sure he was feeling pressure from me.

    But with so much happening in my life now, and the fact that I usually don’t care whether he comes to visit or not (if not, I get more work done!), it’s helped a lot and he wants to be with me MORE!

    I love it! 🙂

  441.  #441T-Girl on July 20, 2011 at 6:04 am

    I think someone posted on here not too long ago about buying a piece of jewelry with a heart on it? I need to do that so I have a constant reminder to get out of my head and back into my heart.

  442.  #442Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 6:07 am

    RE 441 I believe that was Lilybelle who bought a bracelet/

  443.  #443Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 6:25 am

    Well Jared, if you’re uncomfortable with yourself others are going to be uncomfortable as well. Acknowledge that you are nervous, embrace it, and accept it and make fear your friend! It’s okay to feel
    nervous–make to fun of it! Don’t try to shut it down or hide it.
    There are times when you are going to be nervous but it’s okay.
    Women will get uncomfortable when you show that you are uncomfortable with yourself by attempting to hide the fact that you are nervous. Some people find it helpful to be completely obvious about their
    nervousness. I’ve heard women stumble with their words a little and then actually make a joke about it. One woman, after stumbling a bit, said,” You’re really cute, I’m a little nervous.”

  444.  #444Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 6:30 am

    “How did that make you feel?” A question like this really allows a person to open up and share.
    When asking open-ended questions it is also important to take on the role of active listener. Instead of being focused on what you’re going to say, practice simply listening. Come from a place of human interaction and let go of your EXPECTATIONS. Just engage in curious conversation. If you are truly listening to what the other person is saying, and trying to understand the place from which they are coming, you will have an abundance of follow-up questions at your disposal.

  445.  #445Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 7:48 am

    Interesting comment from a Dr. Paul email

    “Thoughts are truly harmless, and fantasy is a part of life that can rejuvenate the marriage one is committed to, or the love one wants when in a single state.

    The man in question was indeed a dog, and tipped into wrongful territory. But the lesson here is that ALL men DO look around, have fantasies about other women besides you – all of them. But the certainty in a high character guy is that he clearly knows the difference between fantasy and reality, thought and action. Get over the illusions about storybook love, and in the real world of real people, you’ll find that it is indeed a magical thing to find a great person who is genuine, but never, ever confuses fantasy with action”.

  446.  #446Rusty on July 20, 2011 at 7:51 am

    217: Femininewoman says:

    One also suggested watching the Discovery Channel to have something to discuss.


    I personally think this is a great idea. I feel, and many guys I’ve known have expressed similar frustrations, that a woman will complain that the two of you aren’t talking enough.

    Like my wife LOVES to talk about family and friends that I either have spent little or not time with. I don’t know them. Therefore talking about them and their on-goings in life are like screeching finger nails on a chalk board. I usually allow my wife to talk all she wants about it, and may offer a few comments, but it is not an understatement to say that the conversation does not interest me.

    Now men will get beat up all day long for this, especially in arenas such as this blog. Well sorry, but that is how most men are hard wired. We simply aren’t interested in talking about people we don’t know.

    Should we feel guilty about this? I don’t think so. And your post is exactly why. Simple fact is, women don’t like to talk about things we DO like to talk about. I love the Discovery Channel, and the History International Channel and things of that nature. I don’t like every single show on those channels though, but shows involving history or something that I can learn from, I do love.

    I loved that show “Doing Davinci” where they built many of Davinci’s more interesting inventions that were only done on paper.

    For this reason, I loved my humanities classes while most people hated them. One of my professors said that her daughter married a man from one of those very old money elite families. She said her daughter told her how at every evening meal on weekends, there was a subject regarding historical figures or subjects that you were expected to research a little so as to be able to participate in a discussion during dinner.

    Some might think this to be torture but it would have been absolutely right there in my wheel house.

    In short, I personally think many more men would feel more connected to their women if their women chose to find interest in topics that interest their man.

    There was a very funny commercial a long time ago. Don’t remember which beer it was, but the ones where they would slam a beer bottle down on the table and things would merge. Like football and golf. but one day they had a commercial where a guy and his girl were in a sports bar and a basketball game was on. It was done in First person view from the guy’s perspective and he kept trying to watch the game. His girl was in full on gossip mode and kept trying to get him to tune in to her conversation. She even put her fingers in front of the TV and snapped her fingers and brought his eyes back to her. So he slammed his beer bottle down and she suddenly started commentating the game as if she were an announcer.

    It was very funny to most guys. In fact I never knew a guy that didn’t laugh out loud when they saw that commercial. The reason it was funny is because that is how most feel (notice I didn’t say all, SLV).

    This is also why most men have to be dragged kicking and screaming to couple’s therapy, because they see so much out there telling them they are the one at fault. Very little advice like yours telling a woman to actually learn about things that men like to talk about.

    Another funny commercial, but one more friendly to women was one that has been on the TV recently where a guy gets some sports package on cable or direct TV or something like that. His girlfriend sits down and watches with him, and pretty soon she is an expert and he makes a comment about the coach needing to call a certain kind of play and she gives this irritated expression and analyzes (correctly) why that would be dumb, then she jumps forward on the couch and hollers something like, “That was holding Refs! Where’s the flag!” The guy looks over at her and says, “Will you marry me?”


    Here is a book (Talk Football: Written by a Woman for Women who Want to Speak America’s Gridiron Language) that helps women understand football.


    I think the point that you seem to understand is that just like it is hard for a woman to feel connected to a man that never wants to talk about things that are important to her, it is also hard for a man to feel connected to a woman that never wants to talk about things that are important to him.

    I think that in the old days where families grew up in a local area and spent a lot of time together, this likely didn’t surface as a major concern much. But today, we spend less time with others who are close to us. So we will want to get that personal interaction from our mate. If there aren’t enough common interests, it will surface as a concern.

  447.  #447Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 8:09 am

    Rusty how is your wife’s wrist? How did you feel sitting in the ER with her?

  448.  #448Rusty on July 20, 2011 at 8:12 am

    324: Lilybelle says:


    I was feeling so hopeful and encouraged this morning. THEN, I started listening to my NV’s tell me that there is no way in hell that the kind of man I desire is going to want to meet me, date me and subsequent relationship me. I’m too old, not pretty enough and that it’s too late for me and I should probably settle with one of those toothless dudes with the fish.

    Damn it! That’s what I get for listening to “statistics” during a work conversation today. Ugh. Ugh. UGH!!!

    I need to chose to believe in what I see. NOT stats. I don’t believe stats anyway. I typically need to see it to believe it. lol. I just need to listen to people’s stories…believe in what I see and find the next best feeling place to hang out in until this passes.

    I’m only 47 and damn it, still very, very young looking and acting. Men see my chronological age and say ewwww…


    Not all men. I don’t think I am that unique and I do prefer a woman near to my age or younger. Most men I know say that for a long term relationship they do want somebody close to their age, preferably no more than a few years older to no more than several years younger. What is going to be most important to me, and I believe most men, are things like how I feel around her. Is she fun and energetic?

    You seem to have a good energetic and friendly vibe. I’ve picked up on that and so had I been single and ready to hit the road on my Harley, I would have certainly taken you up on that offer to pick you up on my way. 😉

    I can’t see you being single for long. I think we all feel that same sense of hopelessness at times, when we are looking for that ONE person. But we often do find someone. So I can’t see somebody with your special qualities being single for long.

  449.  #449Rusty on July 20, 2011 at 8:29 am

    447: Femininewoman says:

    Rusty how is your wife’s wrist? How did you feel sitting in the ER with her?


    She sprained it, and it will take some time for the pain to go away but now she has a good splint to immobilize it, and some good anti-inflammatory medication. Also some good pain killers so she can sleep better at night.

    It felt good to sit with her. She was hungry so I walked to the cafeteria and brought her back a plate of food and her favorite soda (diet Coke with Splenda)

    I also got her a gel ice pack out of the freezer at home to wrap around her wrist while she slept. It does help. Had done this for her a few times before but she didn’t want it every night. Doc suggested she allow me to get her the icepack often…as often as he can stand it.

  450.  #450mlc on July 20, 2011 at 8:33 am

    I am feeling scared nervous punched in the stomach….my bf of 1+ years has had devastating financial issues every since we met. I knew this and accepted it. I am not interested in his money or lack thereof. (although i know this is a thing that makes a man feel like a man, when he can provide and pay for things in a relationship. I am very sensitive to this). Anyway, we have some very routine things that we always do…he always texts me good morning, he always calls mid day, i always text after work and we call eachother after work, he always calls me before going to bed. Yesterday was a typical day. Totally normal…..at 9:24 he texts me (our goodnight phone call is always at 10) and says i’m going to bed i’m feeling lousy. no call. at 10 i called him and asked what was wrong. He said he didn’t want to talk but that he was worried about money and he seemed to be having a meltdown…so i told him i understood and said good night. This morning no good morning text. So i called to check on him at 10. He was working on a project and said he felt better today. I did not make a deal out of last night, but said i understand that you like to withdraw when something is going on, but we always call at night. if you don’t want to talk that’s fine, but i need to hear that from your voice, not in a text. I am so confused. I just feel like crying. I don’t know what to do here.

  451.  #451mlc on July 20, 2011 at 8:34 am

    i want to be supportive but i don’t want to push. what do i do?

  452.  #452mlc on July 20, 2011 at 9:01 am

    am i all alone here? 🙁

  453.  #453mlc on July 20, 2011 at 9:04 am

    feeling really scared

  454.  #454Femininewoman on July 20, 2011 at 9:05 am


    You cannot take Step Three of the Commitment Blueprint 7 Steps – which is being “an Invitation” – by CALLING HIM, or REACHING OUT TO HIM – or ANY Leaning Forward energy. This is “Rori Raye Language” – so I have to basically reframe some familiar words and concepts so you can experience them differently – in a Leaned Back way.

    By making a REQUEST for his company (“Can we talk,” “I miss you”) BEFORE he contacts YOU – You will simply be literally “mailing” him an invitation to friendship or friendship and sex – but until HE makes a move toward YOU – you are NOT an Invitation.

    An Invitation is an OPEN, “inviting” thing. It draws a man in by its mystery and sense of promise. It’s a “lure.” An Invitation, in Rori Raye language, is not a “Request” for his company. It’s an Invitation to more amazing, fantastic, thrilling stuff, the stuff that you ARE – should he show up.