Is It What Men Want – Or What YOU Want That Counts?

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10-6 love yourselfHere’s a comment on this blog that just snapped my head around, made me feel fantastic, and I wanted to make sure everyone got to read it (this is not a comment on my part about male coaches – I love them all – it’s a “Brava” to an amazing insight, and to Andrea who’s doing the work brilliantly.

Andrea starts with a short list of some of the things presented in a program for women, featuring things men have said:

“Here is just a small sampling of the golden nuggets that come from these incredible men:

•The men said they were THRILLED when a woman made the first move, and that many men DO NOT love the chase as they’ve been hurt or rejected a lot.

•If you make men feel great about themselves, and that you truly care about them, they’ll WANT to commit. Being needy or clingy, bossy or pushy are the top reasons men withdraw.

•Thousands of men surveyed said what they want MOST from us in bed is an emotional connection.

•All of the experts insist that men want to fall in love as much as women do.

•Despite what you’ve heard, the men swear we SHOULDN’T be dating multiple guys if we really like one as many men find this a turn off, and become intimidated even if they’re strong and confident.”

Andrea’s Comment:

I feel such a personal response to this information. I have to say that in my own journey I found much of this to be true.

The part about “men are THRILLED when women make the first move” I found to be very true. I was always Thrilling men and pleasing men and I was very adept at finding out what THEY liked.

Men liked it when I made the first move because then they got to slow down, lean way back, check out other options, while I did all the work. Why wouldn’t they be thrilled.

The problem was I was NOT HAPPY making the first move.

So much more to say about every one of those different statements but I wanted to say something about my own path. I first found C. Carter, and EM Katz, and then read a lot of David W. All last year I was poring over material and watching videos about What MEN Want.

And still I was missing something. My relationships still sucked even though I thought I was doing the exercises. I thought I was understanding the practices. Here’s a strange thing that happened once I stumbled upon Rori’s work: I started concentrating on What Does ANDREA Want.

Maybe, in all of the other materials that I was reading, there were messages about finding and loving myself first…. but I just wasn’t hearing them until for some reason… Rori’s blogs and e-book changed my focus.

Some of the men relationship experts talk about how men don’t think Circular Dating is a good idea.

I don’t Circular Date because MEN think it’s a good idea.

I don’t Circular Date in order to get or keep a man.

I Circular Date because it gives me the boost and the confidence I need to feel like a Modern Siren.

And for some reason… the same men who told me that they didn’t want me to Circular Date… are know commenting on how intriguing, exciting, and sexy I am.

They knew me before…. but now, they say.. I have an edge.

They WANT to spend time with me. They COVET my availability. I just got asked today if I would set aside some time for a Saturday date of golfing.

When I was studying the works of C Carter and the other men relationship experts…. my focus was on MEN. How could I get a MAN and KEEP a MAN.

Now… my focus is on me. How can I be ecstatic with myself and MY LIFE whether I have a man or not. And.. counter intuitively…. that has made all the difference.

Now I’m feeling overwhelmed kind of with all of the dates I’m getting, and with how my one relationship that I’ve mainly been focusing is getting better and better.

I’m not putting down the work of male relationship experts. I’m just saying that for some reason… I wasn’t getting the answers I needed… I needed to stop thinking about what men want, and start focusing on what I want.

Why that makes me more attractive to the opposite sex is still an enigma… .but it does!!

From Rori: Thank you for this, Andrea…

Posted in


  1.  #1Femininewoman on January 20, 2014 at 7:05 am

    What I want

  2.  #2LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 7:11 am

    I’m going to date as many guys as I please, it’s up to the man to step up and seal the deal or move on to someone else.

  3.  #3Cris on January 20, 2014 at 7:13 am

    What we think that is good!

  4.  #4LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 7:16 am

    There is some good information out there from male coaches. I Like Todd Creager’s approach. Christian Carter makes good points as well. But I agree with Andrea, this is about ME. Me me me me me me.

  5.  #5LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 7:18 am

    I take a little bit of everything I read and hear and try it on like clothes. Some things need to be altered to “fit” well on me, other things are too restrictive.

  6.  #6Shannon on January 20, 2014 at 7:28 am

    I have lately been enjoying Mathew Hussey. I do find that I don’t mind saying something to a man. But I just say it and move on. I figure that 99.9% of saying something to a man will result in pretty much nothing.

    Yet so far, 100% of just “being myself” and going about my day saying little or nothing to anybody has left me still alone and with only icky dates from desperate guys.

    The big difference in combining the whole “approach but don’t follow up” concept with Rori’s leaning back and being Present is that I’ve lately seen so many guys look at me with stars in their eyes. And it is a HUGE confidence boost.

    I figure I wouldn’t have a chance with these guys anyway. But seeing them looking at me like I’m awesome feels so great–even without anything coming from it.

    I haven’t been approached ONCE by a guy who just saw me and walked up to me. It’s all been me making eye contact or even going up to them to just drop a one-liner and stroll away.

    It’s good for my aching ego. Perhaps one day, if I do enough approaching and see enough stars in enough guys’ eyes, I won’t need the crutch anymore to feel good about ME.

    For now, however, it feels great to be looked at like I’m amazing, whether it’s only his own flattered feelings or not.

    I really do think that most of Mathew’s stuff is highly compatible with Rori’s stuff, though he definitely has a more leaning forward stance in “doing nice things for him”.

    But his ways of “initiating” are very leaning back esque. Like “dropping your hanky” and letting him think HE was the one who decided to pick it up and give it back to you. Like walking past and simply saying something, without any expectation of any return on it. “My, aren’t you tall!”

    So I do think that men have things to offer us… but I also feel in my very soul that Rori’s methods are the right ones for finding and keeping a real, deep, intimate, meaningful relationship.

  7.  #7Aurora on January 20, 2014 at 7:42 am

    if you’ve jumped to this thread, please please see my message to you on the last one post 187


  8.  #8Femininewoman on January 20, 2014 at 8:35 am

    So do I LoveAlways. I think it is good to know what else is out there and at times try them on to see which one fits best.

  9.  #9Christine on January 20, 2014 at 8:44 am

    I love this. That is all.

  10.  #10Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 8:52 am

    @LoveAlways… I agree too! I take what works for me and leave the rest with all information…

    I also agree with what this post suggest that it is all about WHAT men want… which just feeds the very issue of the PROBLEM in our society and many societies all over the world that “IT’S ABOUT WHAT HE MAN WANTS”…… which is why we have so many lazy men in this country… they think it is all about them… they have been taught that at a very young age… even Graham White talks about how it isn’t a woman’s problem if a man hasn’t grown up… it’s his job to grow himself up..

    Focusing on what a man wants is feeding the problem… doesn’t mean that we can’t understand them… but I love Rori’s work b/c it focusing on understanding ourselves…and how to be more self centered = Feminine ever Dr. Pat Allen talks about becoming more self centered.. our society has taught us all backwards… it’s a man’s world… it’s quickly becoming a woman’s world…

    WOW.. I had lots just pour out of me…


  11.  #11Summer35 on January 20, 2014 at 8:55 am

    This comment is in response to your Subscribers e-shot today, titled “How Do You Build Trust – And What Does Trust Have To Do With Love Anyway?” as I couldn’t see how to comment on this email, and it really, really hit home for me.

    Having just found out my ex is dating another girl, after breaking up with me last summer but consistently blowing hot and cold towards me since then – reading it was like a light going on in my head.

    My ex has told me repeatedly since the break-up that he “loves” me, he’s in “pain” about it all (with regular tears, and tantrums) and he “can’t stand” the thought of me with another man. Yet he is now dating someone else; I assume because none of the above issues apply (yet) and it is a fun, and carefree experience.

    The good news here is that I have been in a similar situation post break-up in the past. Back then, I raged, cried and shouted about it all on a regular basis with the old ex – thinking mistakenly that I should “give as much as I got”, and that expressing my pain in that way would somehow convince him to come back (it didn’t). With this recent ex, I have managed throughout all the heartache to consistently lean back, listen to him instead of accuse, keep an open heart towards my own future RELATIONSHIP not RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM and see my own needs and boundaries, expressing them in as honest a way as I could at the time (not sure I nailed that one 100%, but at least I was aware of what I was trying to say, which was a massive improvement!)

    In short, I can recognise this break up as a learning experience with Mr Not-quite-right, and not as the de-railment of my entire romantic future.
    I don’t think this man is coming back either, but in terms of my self-esteem based on my own behaviour, I am in a completely different place, this time around. I have never before realised how important it is to have a strong sense of self respect and of my own “truth” – especially when I am feeling so sad about a man.

    I am not over it yet, but I feel the sun will shine again!! This feels like it is absolutely the right path to moving on, despite the sense of loss and pain that there is another woman in the picture.

    Thank you for the consistently powerful and thoughtful advice.

  12.  #12Brenda on January 20, 2014 at 9:20 am

    Aurora I seen your comment and thanks for the input.

  13.  #13Tereana on January 20, 2014 at 10:29 am

    Yes, and I agree that’s it’s great and even invaluable to have a male perspective on dating. It’s so helpful to understand how men’s brains work, how the interpret things, how they see the dating process. It takes some of the mystery out and simplifies it. But like Andrea said, we have to do things because it’s what WE want. And she didn’t say this, but to expand, the minute we become “caretakers” of him and his emotions, we lose our appeal, our edge, out sexiness, because then we become like a mommy figure. And no sensible guy is turned on by that. Lol

  14.  #14Kyla on January 20, 2014 at 11:32 am

    I feel gut wrenching guilt in my sloar plexus. My heart is jumping rapidly in my chest. My shoulders are tight and cold. My gran has been taken into emergency surgery and it doesnt sound hopeful. I’m 3000 miles away and feeling defeated. I’ve been having dreams of her and my late grandfather over the past 5 weeks. I should’ve called her. I didn’t because I wanted to protect myself from long distance drama and guilt trips after my cancelled wedding to R. I feel selfish and stupid. I feel hot tears streaming down my face at my desk in work.

  15.  #15Jameella on January 20, 2014 at 11:36 am

    Need some help. Does anyone understand this about Rori’s advice about not “servicing a man”. I have been dating someone for about 3 months. He is very sensual/sexually inclined. He is the first person I have dated after a long term (12 Year) toxic relationship with someone who also was sexually inclined/abusive in some ways.

    At first this new guy was not very attractive to me – someone who I wouldn’t say had the looks I would be interested in. He, like Rori says, grew on me. We started to get more physical, I did a couple of lap dances for him – which by the way really turned both of us on – most importantly me, we got more into being physical, but I don’t feel comfortable yet going all the way. I’m basically scared that I will lose my centeredness/be too involved.

    In lieu of that, he is taking me to orgasm or almost orgasm. My question – Rori, I believe on one of her sessions – I have her complete set, but not sure where I heard this, says don’t service a man. I’m not sure why she says this. Does anyone know? It would seem unfair not to help him our, if he helps me get to be pleasured. He wants it, how do I refuse him. Need the script words for this. I have done it, I do feel more vulnerable getting more physical. I am circularly dating. Have not been physical with anyone else. But does anyone remember if they heard a script for this.



  16.  #16Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 11:49 am

    @Kyla I’m sorry!!! <3 <3 sending you lots of calm, loving, peaceful energy!!!!

  17.  #17Tereana on January 20, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    I do feel traumatized by Brenda’s story. And even more sick to my stomach reading that she is apologizing to us for upsetting us, and that she will not do anything about it because she is afraid. This is even scarier to me – that he continues to rape her, constantly, by simply keeping her in fear (Brenda, since it is hard for you to hear these things, I’m just going to talk about the situation with you in the third person, ok?)

    This man clearly has targeted B as a woman who would be compliant for him. He has been testing her and “grooming” her for a long time now to be sure that, when he finally did do violence to her that she would respond in precisely this way – by doing nothing for fear of his angry response. And he does this by alternately offering affection and anger in a random fashion so that she never knows which she will get. He KNOWS that she feels bad about his situation and he is using her compassion to control her. He KNOWS that she would feel terrible if anything “bad” happened to him because of his actions and he is using this to skate along and do whatever he pleases with her.

    And I was thinking even more, Brenda, about the scene you described:

    1.) you were in the bedroom. He had just gone down on you and it “felt good” [what really happened: he had already called his buddy and told him to come over. Your x was actually just “prepping” you for his friend’s arrival, so that you would be “ready to go.”]

    2.) then x tells you to “do” his friend [translation: he gave you one more chance to capitulate on your own willingly and you refused.]

    3.) so – not sure if I have this right, but this is the part that makes my heart race with panic and my hands are shaking this as I type it – he (I’m supposing x) “threw your legs up” and his buddy “stood over you with his penis out.” So basically, you said no to having sex with his friend, so he held your legs open while his friend penetrated you, and then together, they flipped you over so he could go some more from behind. Does that sound about right?

    And when you went to the bathroom to get away, he followed you and got angry at you for leaving and made you go back. Then they couldn’t even get it up.

    Oh my God, the situation. Is so disgusting. I can’t tell if I feel trauma simply because I am very empathic or because it’s triggering some type of traumatic experience of my own.

    Here’s the thing, Brenda – you are afraid of him, right? If you tell no one, he can keep doing this over and over. In the end, he might even kill you (and if he doesn’t literally, and you do nothing, then he has killed you figuratively.) of you tell no one, you are NOT SAFE. EVER. You say he’s “going away” for a year? (I assume you mean jail, for his “traffic issue.”) what happens when he gets out? If you DO tell the police, or at least a medical professional, you CAN get help and support. The police CAN help you.

    Abusers do this. They isolate their victims so that they won’t ask for help, believing that no one will help them or understand or that they will be labeled “crazy.”

    Brenda, let me ask you – what kind of man gives his woman to another man to have sex, against her will? How is that congruent with a “step-up” partner who wants a strong, monogamous relationship? Is it? Ask yourself what kind of man that is?

    Here is what I see: a man who wants to harm you, but needs your affection. So he can’t do it himself. He intentionally called his friend into do it for him. He knew you would say no. It makes him feel SO powerful to know how much you have suffered. He absolutely loved watching the agony and confusion on your face, and he gets off now on how much more you are afraid of him even than before.

    His method is what you would call the ‘monkey’s paw’ style of power. Rather tha get his own “hands” dirty, he uses his friend, which then adds to your humiliation and shame – and your silence. Because he is just betting – and you are validating his assumption – that you will be too ashamed to speak of this to anyone, and too afraid to report it to anyone who could do anything about it. He KNOWS he is getting away with this. And the worst part? He may not ever contact you again. He may “go away” and never come back. But you will always yearn for him. And if he does come back, after his stint in jail, then do you know what will happen? He will call in his friend for a surprise visit on your reunion date and he will say, “you did it before. That means you will do it again.” And you will feel like you have no choice because in your mind you are saying, “he’s right. I did do it before.”

    And the only reason it is so hard to know how to feel right now is that, at the same time you know all of this happened, it doesn’t feel like it happened TO YOU. You dissociated. Which it all feels numb and like it took place inside another person’s body. Another person’s life. Again, he is just betting on all of this, and taking advantage of it.

    How does it feel to read about all of this? Does it feel surprising? Strange?

    The only person who can do anything about this is you, Brenda. No one here can tell you what to do or when or how. We can only give support and offer feedback based on what we see. And what I saw was a woman asking for help. You won’t be letting us down if you do nothing. But you will undoubtedly be letting yourself – and your children down – if you don’t follow through on this call for help. This is about you, Brenda, and no one else.

    And if anyone wants to know about dissociation in regards to sexual trauma, there is a great book by a woman who endured all kinds of trauma, and got through it. I forget the authors name, but it’s called, “sum of my parts.” But it wouldn’t help to compare your situation to hers. Except to say that abuse is abuse. Trauma is trauma. And dissociation is a coping mechanism for these things. To compare and say “well it didn’t happen to me as much” would be to traumatized yourself again.

    I’m sorry for the long post. This story has ignited something that I feel really passionate about. I feel passionate about women taking a stand and speaking up for themselves and NOT letting men get away with hurting them. Like Shannon said, it spreads the hate by teaching your children that it is “ok” for a man to do that to you. But they will be harmed even by the violence to you. And they may take that and turn it into anger and violence in their lives. Show them love by taking care of YOU and show them that this is NOT OK.

    Whatever you decide to do, Brenda, just keep this in mind – you feel unsafe now. But you are even less safe if you say and do nothing.

    That’s all

  18.  #18Dominique on January 20, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    Jameella – 13 – It wouldn’t be about servicing but about sharing. If you feel good bringing him to orgasm in whatever way YOU choose, then do so. If he’s making demands, and this feels bad to you, you are not obligated.

    A good man’s greatest pleasure or turn on is to see his woman experiencing pleasure, and this includes sexual pleasure or orgasm, and if he’s been the creator of this pleasure, all the better for him.


  19.  #19Olivia on January 20, 2014 at 12:18 pm

    100% yes to this! I had the EXACT SAME experience as Andrea. I was reading male relationship coaches and digesting it and my relationship “still sucked” until I found Rori (and listened to my psycho therapist more) and started doing FOR ME and Rori’s tools were wonderful.

    My man still protests sometimes at how I make him do work he is maybe not “ready” for! It makes me giggle inside every time.

    For example last night my boyfriend brought up his frustration at how I will sometimes bring up things that he did a week ago or more -I could tell he was trying to express how this can make him feel off balance. In other words I am a high degree of difficulty woman who holds him accountable using feeling messages and little speeches when necessary.

    So in response I expressed how it’s very important to ME to share my feelings with him when something affects me strongly and sometimes it takes a week or more for me to build up the courage to say something to him or sometimes it takes me a little while to understand my feelings. And his response to that was to kiss me and hold me close and tell me he ADORES ME.

    Just because it is difficult for them doesn’t mean they won’t do the work if they are worth it!!

  20.  #20Tereana on January 20, 2014 at 12:18 pm


  21.  #21Tereana on January 20, 2014 at 12:20 pm

    Olivia, that’s awesome! Thank you for sharing 🙂

    Dominique – thanks for the feedback on the last thread!

  22.  #22Cupcake on January 20, 2014 at 1:01 pm


    Just breathe. She knows you love her. The guilt your feeling is a way you’re coping to feel connected to the situation, to insinuate a level of backwards-looking control into a situation happening in the present that you have no control over.

    Let the guilt happen, because it’s going to, and put the focus of your energy instead towards the love between you.

    The love she does feel. The guilt circles around you, and doesn’t connect your hearts.

    You want the connection. It’s there.

    Just breathe.

    Sending you a hug.

    Your friend,


  23.  #23Turquoise on January 20, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    Hi Sirens!

    I had some practice with this last night. Sweetheart and I have been seeing each other again for 3 months. We dated last winter/spring for about 6, but I hadn’t been intimate with him since we started seeing each other again. I was trying to keep it light, fun, casual, and repeated I wasn’t interested in being his girlfriend because he’s still married. He’s been understanding, but we’ve been spending a lot of time together, so I haven’t had much time for anyone else. Well, we had a great couple days, and after thinking about how I was practically celibate last year, I decided to take it further this weekend and we spent the night together Saturday night. I did feel emotionally closer and was feeling more excited about the possibilities of this relationship. But then he started texting me saying he’d had this big conversation with him mom solely about me… had been thinking about me all day, his feelings are so strong and went into a lot of detail about how I make him feel. He was very very mushy. Then he said, now that we are sleeping together, he won’t be seeing anyone else. Not that he has, and has said he has no interest in.

    I stopped, paused and sank into my feelings, which honestly I was feeling smothered and overwhelmed. So I called, asked if he had time to talk and we talked for about a half hour. I shared that when I’ve said I’ve felt smothered in the past, this is the kind of thing that gets me there. In one breath he will say we are having fun, staying in the moment… and in the next he’s talking about us like we are already a couple and getting married. But I reminded him that my saying I don’t want to be his girlfriend, isn’t just words… it’s true. As long as he is still married I won’t change my mind on that. I said I wasn’t trying to hurt his feelings or to be unkind, but that I’ve meant what I said. I also said that I won’t commit to a married man. If us being intimate was too much for him, we could keep it more platonic until things changed. I care about him, but I don’t know that I will ever want to be married to him. We have talked a lot about the changes that still have to happen in his life for that to even be a possibility. He said he understands and appreciates my honesty and that he will dial it back, and of course… the intimacy is not too much for him. I do care about him, we have a lot of fun together… but I’m really trying to think about what is best for me.

    Then, Mr. Conversation called and we talked for over an hour and a half. I’m not sure what is up with him….. he hasn’t called me in awhile, we mostly text or see each other in person. He’s always telling me I should end it with Sweetheart… think he wants me all to himself, even though we don’t want the same kind of relationship.

    I did delete my online profiles last week. I just got sick of it. The men I was hearing from were not at all what I’m looking for, and it was starting to feel exhausting. I decided I want to get out more and have more fun… so looking to meet people in social situations now, at least for the time being.

  24.  #24April Rose on January 20, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Brenda sweetie

    How are you feeling?

  25.  #25Olivia on January 20, 2014 at 2:51 pm

    @Brenda – I second everything Tereana said —
    How horrible – please stay away from these characters!

  26.  #26April Rose on January 20, 2014 at 2:56 pm

    I cannot comprehend that someone I love would want to harm me. That does not compute and I would not want to believe it was possible.

    I feel terrified to open to the possibility.

  27.  #27Kyla on January 20, 2014 at 3:39 pm

    Thank you for the hugs and thoughts. I felt lighter and calmer after writing it down. I feel achy heart and love for my mom, she’s holding it all together and keeping so up in her brain and logical and positive thinking right now until we hear more.

    And I feel turned off Bear. He’s been texting inane updates about what he’s doing constantly, its all been feeling very boring. Ugh calls/texts/emails do not a relationship make for me. I want regular in person contact, all this chat in between does not fill the space for me. I keep taking steps back and notice that it feels boring because I feel unheard about my needs and my feelings and I don’t think he has the ability to do real relationship.

  28.  #28April Rose on January 20, 2014 at 3:49 pm

    (((((your gran))))))

  29.  #29Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 5:23 pm

    What do you do if a guy says he will call you to set up a date… and when he calls ( I was giving my child a bath) and he didn’t leave a voice mail. Do I lean in and return his call or just wait to see if he calls back?

    What do you think sirens


  30.  #30Shannon on January 20, 2014 at 5:26 pm

    Lisa, Rori has specifically and exactly said, “If he doesn’t ask you to call back through either texting or leaving a VM, then don’t call back.” A person calling you is NOT a specific request for a call back, is what she said.

    So my answer would be not to call him, because that’s what Rori says. If he asks, just say that you were bathing your child and that you didn’t think to look at the phone… after all, you’re a busy lady, right? 😀

  31.  #31Kyla on January 20, 2014 at 5:30 pm

    Lisa – Rori says only return their call if they leave a message specifically asking you to call back.

    but (and especially if someone has told me in advance that they are going to call) if I see I’ve got a missed call, I will return it unless I don’t want to talk to them.

    Do what feels good, that’s the key.

  32.  #32Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 5:57 pm

    Ok Thanks!!! @Kyla and @Shannon

    and I think that given the fact that he has texted me tons and I’ve used feeling messages like I’m feeling excited to her your voice… I’m wanting to re-enforce his calls rather than texts…. hummm

    Thanks so much!

  33.  #33Liquid Light on January 20, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    Kyla, yeah, that obsessiveness is a turn off to me too. I met a guy last week and he’s been calling me incessantly. I haven’t once returned his call or picked up so you’d think he’d get the hint. That kinda clueless behavior is a big turn off and red flag IMO!! I haven’t heard from him today so I’m hoping he’s finally gotten the hint. Sheesh.

  34.  #34LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 6:27 pm

    Wow Turquoise!!! Beautiful!!!

  35.  #35LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 6:30 pm

    ((((((Kyla)))))) Feel what you feel, embrace it and then reach out and send positive feelings with all the love you have. Please don’t spend too much time before you embrace all the love and send it out to her. She knows you love her <3

  36.  #36LoveAlways on January 20, 2014 at 6:33 pm

    Lisa # 10

    Lovely! Let it pour out! 😀

  37.  #37Andrea on January 20, 2014 at 6:36 pm

    I know what you mean about the barrage of mundane texts. I’ve had that happen in the past, and like Kyla said, it just feels boring. But too, I did a real check in with myself and I realized #1. That I had asked this man to contact me and stay in touch.
    And # 2. That I was going through a small period in which I just wanted to really be tuned in to ME.

    So I texted him and said, “It feels really wonderful to know that you’re thinking of me and staying in contact and I’m going through some family drama right now. I feel sad and mopey and I just want to be tuned in to me right now. If you’d like you may call me on Saturday or Sunday this coming week and I’d love to take some time to talk to you then. Thank you. I really appreciate you being here for me, talk to you then.”

    And …. he did. He called me Saturday afternoon and we had a nice talk and I felt present with him because I’d taken the four days before that to just be with myself and my feelings about what was happening with my family at the time.

  38.  #38Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 7:11 pm

    @LoveAlways <3 Thanks! 🙂 That makes me giggle!!!

    I decided to call "MR" b/c I'd been working on getting a phone call, but I didn't put anymore energy into than he did.. meaning that I didn't leave a voice message… like he did not…

    I have another man in the picture "T"… we are going out on Saturday… and I didn't leave my Saturday open for "MR" as Rori says… "T" called first and Sat was my first available evening open… So IF "MR" calls back he will have to take what I have left open…

    Ok about my pouring out today… I went inside and found it… How I make it about men… today in particular… in my mind… Is "D" really worth keeping in contact with, should I just dump him… yada yada… what more do I need to learn to do to attract mr. right?

    and so even if my actions are leaning back… in my mind… it is still about men, relationsip I don't have that I want… so I'm doing exactly what I posted about making it about men, instead of focusing on what do you want today Lisa….. how do you feel today Lisa…

    I had a better than usually great day today… I can tell my health is improving.. I'm making progress… my children are happy and healthy… my biz is improving little by little… and today was beautiful! Why not focus on that…. all day long…

    My obsession if I might call it that… needs to be ME and my life… NOT whether or not to call a man back or not… if I'm learning enough to draw in the right man… hummmm

    I guess I just cannot comprehend a man doing whatever it takes to find me and when he does keep me…

    sounds like a splinter of "I'm not good enough yet for the right man"… hummmm Which part of me knows I am.. and Dominique keeps reminding me… but could be a core belief…


  39.  #39Cupcake on January 20, 2014 at 8:15 pm

    Dear Sirens-

    After yesterday’s surprise (but not really?) of Lord Voldemort’s second bolting from our liaison after a cowardly email informing me that our plans were null and void, I’ve had thoughts tumbling around in my head all day.

    I think I’m okay. I say “I think” because I can’t help but notice that I am still in my pajamas from this morning, haven’t left the apartment or even opened the door, and have ingested 10 almonds and 2 cups of instant coffee for the duration of the day.

    Tomorrow, I plan to rejoin the human race.

    Here’s what I’ve been thinking about today:

    1.) Sherlock. I watched last night’s episode of Sherlock today, and I kept getting Sherlock and Lord V confused in my head. Both are tall, pale and have a shock of dark hair. But it wasn’t that. It was the selfishness of letting Dr. Watson grieve, of never telling him that he was in fact alive. (Hope that’s not a spoiler for anyone. Obviously they couldn’t have Season 3 if his “suicide” hadn’t been faked.) So when Watson says, “How could you have done that?” and Sherlock rambles on without any emotional accountability, I felt so tied to Watson. And when he punched Sherlock in the nose, I cheered.

    2.) All day I checked my phone, thinking surely Lord V would send me a message, following up to last night, “Hey, I’m really sorry. Hope you’re okay. I felt bad disappointing you- It’s just unfortunate timing that this good friend declared her love for me the day before you booked the ticket to come over here.” SOMETHING showing that he thought of me at all, had any concern whatsoever for my feelings. Obviously, nada. Radio silence. And part of me was thinking, “No! No! No! Please don’t disappear. I cannot imagine my world without you in it. Just stay in contact. Be my friend. Please do not vanish.”

    I thought about writing him. (I didn’t.) But really, at the end of the day, it’s just RUDE. I mean, dumping someone is one thing, moving in a different direction, okay. But courtesy is something else altogether.

    He texted me– after texting me lovely, fun texts all day, giving no hint of any misgiving- he texted me “Best not to talk about coming over.” And went on to explain about this other woman declaring that she had feelings for him, and he had “liked her for a long time but never said anything.” And I wrote back “GAME OVER.” Which I suppose was rude but those were the only words that came to mind. He wrote, “Lovely.” And I responded with “What do you expect e to say?” And some feeling messages, and then I ended with, “You deserve to be happy. I want that for you. And I need to get on with my own life, anyway. There are people here who I haven’t been fair to, people who want my full attention and haven’t been getting it. So perhaps it’s just as well.”

    I’d have expected that he’s write back something like, “Yes, it’s just time for us to both focus on being with people in front of us.” Or “I hope you find happiness.” Or SOMETHING. But nothing. That’s simply bad manners.

    3.) And right along side with the “No! No! Please don’t disappear!” feeling, there was an equal feeling of “What a jack@$$.” A sense of, “Go eff yourself, you selfish whack-job.” (See why I identified with John Watson so much today?) So those two feeling kept jostling against each other, and I felt confused by it, and it sort of tired me out until I didn’t really feel anything any more. Like headphones that cancel out white noise.

    4.) I just have a very weird life. I am so, so, so alone. I imagine all of you have routines, people you see every day, interact with at work or in your families. I don’t have that. I don’t have a job right now, although I’m doing an editing project from my apartment. I have about four good friends who are scattered all over the country, a sister who doesn’t like me, and a mom with a short term memory problem (bless her!) who doesn’t remember where I am and so our entire conversation is repeating what city I am in and that what I am doing is looking for a job. Pretty much, yes, the entire conversation.

    The person I talk to the most is an exboyfriend who was the worst boyfriend ever in the history of the entire world, who has become like my stalwart older brother, benefactor, and boss. He called me several times today to make sure I was okay. (Twenty-five years ago, when HE broke my heart, he was not so considerate. So perhaps in twenty-five years, Lord Voldemort will be the one calling to make sure I’m okay, and the karmic debt will be repaid.)

    So my life is just so freaking weird, I can’t even begin to explain. It’s so underpopulated. And I don’t understand why. I always feel like I am STARVED for companionship, for closeness, for intimacy. I have become so adept at being alone that I don’t even notice it (like I’m sitting here, having only eaten 10 almonds all day, and when I think about it, I realize I’m hungry, but if I didn’t think about it, I wouldn’t notice it.)

    Which is why when I meet someone who “gets” me, I want to keep that person in my life. Although I feel so disappointed in Lord Voldemort. I woke up this morning and I thought, “He’s on to the new woman and probably I didn’t cross his mind at all today, although yesterday I was his best friend.”

    I’m sorry I’m rambling.

    5.) I don’t know what the heck I am doing. I don’t particularly want to live in New City, although there are elements I really like. I don’t know where else to go. The place I wanted to go– speaking strictly geographically now- was to Lord V’s country. And I can’t think of anywhere in my own country I particularly want to be. It’s so sad. But maybe if I was there, I wouldn’t want to be. (“Why is it when I am in Rome/With all my heart, I yearn for home?// and when on native soil I be/ My soul is sick for Italy?”)

    Okay. Long enough post. Thank you for indulging me. I just feel lost, and surprised by the conflicting feelings. And I want to stand at the foot of the tombstone of my dream with Lord V and say, “Please don’t be dead.”

    And at the same time I’m so mad at him for not being the remarkable man I thought he was, and just some stupid guy who hides behind emails.


  40.  #40Lisa on January 20, 2014 at 9:04 pm

    I feel like not even bothering with men that give very little effort… I have so much other stuff I’d rather be doing…

    I’m used to men opening car doors for me, helping me with my coat.. even helping me put it on… going and getting the car when it is raining…holding the umbrella for me paying for my dinners and night out… really being excited to meet me and go out with me… and I really tire of men that don’t want to put the effort in… now I don’t demand these things, I don’t even ask for them even with my feeling messages, or gestures….. they just do it…I suppose b/c I’m so feminine… I don’t know.. I’ve never ask them why… I love it, it makes me feel feminine and it makes me feel adored and special… and according to Matthew Hussey… that is what to do! Act like a Queen…

    I’m ok if they do it and I’m ok if they don’t… I just pay attention to the ones that do…and how they make me feel….. and the ones that don’t even want to walk me to my car…get kind of lost in the midst of the ones that do…

    I have no idea why I just poured this out on here…


  41.  #41Starbright on January 20, 2014 at 9:10 pm


    I have been where you are in spirit…and it feels hard!

    This past year I have made a real effort to involve myself in groups and activities more and it has been such a great thing! After occasionally going to churches and spiritual centers I found one that felt like home. There are so many activities and by continuing to put myself out there I don’t have enough time to do everything or meet up with everyone. I am having so much fun! Also great are meetups. keep putting yourself out there…also I believe when you feel happy all kinds of great things you want will be magnetized.

    Also, the story about Lord V. makes me think of the Baggage Reclaim website of Natalie Lue. My thoughts are that he wanted to make sure you were still available to him…that warm/cold push/pull kind of interaction…May be off here but you may find some helpful info on her site if you haven’t looked at it before. I’ve experienced that kind of interaction before and it didn’t feel good and was very hard for me to get away from. But, I am so much happier now than I was several months ago when I was immersed in it. All the best to you!

  42.  #42Cupcake on January 20, 2014 at 10:15 pm


    Thank you. I will check out the Baggage Reclaim website.

    The funny thing is, despite my ramblings above- Lord V. really isn’t an @$$h*)^. I think he just got scared because he’d made a rational decision to not move forward with me, and then found himself sliding down the path with me, just because the conversation between us is so fun. Until without meaning to go there, we were back where he’d drawn the line before.

    But he owed me a conversation rethinking everything, not a 3 line email. That’s just callous. Like Sherlock. (That show really got into my head today. Can you tell?)

    Anyway, thanks for your kind thoughts.


  43.  #43Angela on January 20, 2014 at 11:51 pm

    I have to say LoveAlways, i loved the way you expressed yourself in the previous post. It was inspiring and light.

  44.  #44Brenda on January 21, 2014 at 4:17 am

    24 April Rose

    April Rose how are u? I am feeling well I don’t know its mixed up feelings all day.I feel like in some way I brung all this about because I should’ve never continued to deal with him this many yrs.I also feel it was wrong what happened that night but I should’ve made it really clear in the beginning maybe I don’t communicate better with him on what I don’t want he said that a few times to me.

    Maybe when he asked me when we were watching tv and I told him no I don’t want a 3 way with his friend and I told him if wants to do Stuttgart like that he could go out and get someone else.He said he just wants to have fun since he’s going away and I told him maybe I’d think about it when things are better between us but no for now.

    So he got his coat to leave and I got frustrated and so I asked him if he could leave me money to get to work and he said no he’d be back to take me but it was already 12 at night and he has a tendency to say one thing and do another. So I told him if he couldn’t give help me get to work that he should get his suitcase he had just moved back into my house a day before, I told him when he leaves to take the suitcase with him.

    We were fighting each other as usual and he went too far with this one.

    I am feeling well really I don’t know right now I’ve mainly been in bed.

  45.  #45Brenda on January 21, 2014 at 5:17 am

    17 Tereane

    Everyone I know I am writing and some stuff is not clear and many typos my apologies.

    Well I can’t imagine someone I love and thought loved me to do this kinda of stuff.Well the thing is its been countless events going on not to this degree but I believe that the way my life is going and my past is why he feel its ok to act a certain way towards me.

    It felt like punishment me for me asking him to basically move out at 12 at night.He said he had called his sister and she said any woman that throws him out in the middle of the night doesn’t care about him and especially due to his traffic situation. I did tell him to go out and get someone else to do it so he did get his coat on to leave, he said if I would’ve just told him to stay he would’ve, he said I don’t know how to talk to him and I get too angry and always my answer is to ask him to leave and I do.

    It still doesn’t excuse the fact that he asked me to do the 3some in the first place or that I said no and he still insisted that it happen anyway. I’m at fault I feel in this situation because I stayed involved with him I loved him and now I’m sitting here chasing those feelings away because I hate what happened that night and I feel so out of order like my body feels heavy and I can’t understand how I feel right now.

  46.  #46Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 5:38 am

    Okay, first off, Brenda, we’re not disgusted by you. You were sexually assaulted. You didn’t do something wrong.

    There are things that we teach our daughters… don’t walk a dark alley at night by yourself, for example. We teach these things to protect our daughters, BECAUSE bad men exist and do bad things; not so we can say, “I told you so” after something awful happens.

    You were raped. The first thing that you need to do, is to internalize that fact.

    The second thing that you need to do, is to report it and get this man out of your life for good. PERIOD. That should come before any other consideration.

    Now. The next thing that you need to do, is to forgive yourself. We can tell you until we’re blue in the face that it wasn’t your fault. But it’s very clear that you FEEL like you had fault in it. And we all know that FEELINGS ARE NOT FACTS. They can’t be rationalized away. They can’t be told they’re wrong until they give up…

    You feel what you feel. So forgive yourself.

    Then after that, understand this… EVEN IF you did something “wrong”, he was the one who made the decision to rape you. HE CHOSE THAT. Internalize that.

    Another man would have heard you say ‘no’ and HE WOULD ACCEPT IT. He wouldn’t have raped you. He wouldn’t have had his buddy rape you. He would have heard your ‘no’ and he would have honored and respected both your ‘no’ AND YOU.

    So no matter how much you may or may not choose to blame yourself… you need to remember this. HE MADE HIS CHOICE TO RAPE SOMEONE. That someone, was you.

    Even if you kicked him out or let him in or whatever else. The choice to rape was his. He could have walked away like a rational person; but he didn’t. That’s not your fault or even your problem.

    The decision to rape was ultimately HIS. No matter the setup or anything else. He chose. He elected his response to whatever happened. He could have made a healthy choice, but did not.

  47.  #47Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 5:56 am


    Why do we women blame ourselves for so many things? How could you not have seen the future? I mean, what’s WRONG with you that you didn’t see this coming? Do you see how silly that is? Of course you couldn’t have seen this coming. What kind of idiot would even ask you that? LOL

    It’s easy to see how silly it is when someone else expects you to foresee the future, isn’t it? So don’t be hard on yourself for not doing the impossible–that’s silly! 🙂

    Do what you can do now. Now is all you have, so make it great, dear lady! You’re being awful hard on someone who went through such a tough time. You were grieving about your lost dream of marriage to a certain man, and family and all that comes with it. Don’t be harder on yourself than you would any other grieving person. It’s too easy for us to do, isn’t it? Give yourself the advice you’d give others, and then follow it.


    Lisa, I really just want to be blunt. D is in such a bad place… and you seem awfully attached. It looks from the outside like a bit of an imaginary relationship. You’ve already attached so much of your hopes and dreams to him. I wonder why?


    Well. I really love my ex, even though he treats and has treated me like s**t! I see the same thing here… your Lord V treats you badly (so far as to be with another woman), and still there’s this longing for him.

    Why do we do this to ourselves? *sigh*


    I see so much of me in so many of these posts from you wonderful ladies. That emotional connection/ bond that is SO powerful and SO deep… that we’ll let them get away with almost anything.

    I can’t blame Brenda, I let my ex-husband (not to be confused with my recent ex-boyfriend) slam me up against the wall so hard that he left bruises all up and down my body. But what did he say? He wasn’t abusing me because “I never hit you”. He held me down with his hand over my nose and mouth until I almost passed out.

    So for some of us more than others, we’ve let men get away with absolutely horrific actions. I let my more recent ex ignore me almost completely for 7 years, and right after this breakup, I still would have taken him back, multiple times!

    Why is it so hard to let go of men who can’t be there for us, or who are actively mistreating us? What happens inside of us that we allow this? I don’t know.

    But none of us are alone in having done it. That’s all I can say.

    I choose to make a new choice now. I choose to love myself enough that even if I’m deeply emotonally attached, I’ll say, “No, please stop contacting me” to unhealthy men.

    It has been hard the last week or so since internalizing what I’ve been saying about the fact that I would be a complete IDIOT to go back to him (and so I won’t unless something extremely dramatic changes). Letting go of the dream is the hardest part.

    I don’t know what the answer is, but I do know that I have to ask myself if I can change and move forward? Can I become a woman who upholds her standards? Can I refuse to accept a man who can’t step up, even if I love him?

    Wow. Talk about courage! I don’t know if I have that much courage, but I do feel like I have the support of the ladies here. Maybe with your support, I can find that courage. But I feel terrified to let go of that dream that I attached to J. It feels hard and scary.

    A false sense of security is what I got from holding onto the lie and pretending it was a dream. It’s hard to be afraid instead of pretending security. I’m afraid of what will happen if I don’t get back together with him. But the false sense of security didn’t serve me.

    Gonna go cry for a while. See you later.

  48.  #48Dominique on January 21, 2014 at 7:22 am

    Shannon – I’ve been following your story closely. I feel so impressed with your awareness as well as your wisdom. Your ability to see things clearly even in your own life is awe inspiring, yet you still feel stuck. I understand this feeling. It summons many memories within me. Even with my ability to recognize what was what, it took a VERY long to time to finally extricate myself. Please know that no only are you not alone in this, you are also supported every step of the way.

    I realize you didn’t ask for my help, and I don’t want to be presumptuous, yet I went looking for some applicable articles for you anyway, articles which may help. I found several and will post two here for your perusal if you wish to read them.

    They don’t directly address your issues, yet they contain many aspects.


  49.  #49Dominique on January 21, 2014 at 7:22 am

  50.  #50Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 7:29 am

    Thank you, Dominique. I am off to read them right now.

    I wish I felt financially secure or felt I had the ability to BE financially secure. Honestly, I think I’d move out tomorrow if I felt I could support my daughter and I.

    Yet I’m not going to lie, I do still feel emotionally stuck, too. I hate that I’ll never be able to just shut him out and grieve without ever seeing him again. It would, strangely, be easier.

    I wrote him a letter today. I tried to focus on feeling messages. I massaged his ego and told him that he’s a great dad (he is when he bothers). I also told him that I love seeing stars in his eyes when he talks about her, and that I feel like I’m somehow interfering with his parenting of her… and that I’m not intending to do so.

    He has been snapping at me for my invitations to be part of her life, and it’s pissing me off.

  51.  #51Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 7:39 am

    Oh, Dominique, I know that I fear intimacy and love. I just don’t know what to DO about it.

    My mother died when I was 6. I lost family after family as a child. When I was grown, over the course of my adulthood until now, I’ve lost 3 men I wanted to marry to death (each in radically different circumstances). I’ve lost 1 child to adoption in extremely bizarre circumstances, and I had a baby die a few hours after birth.

    I am definitely afraid of love and petrified of intimacy. How could I not be??

    How CAN I not be?!

    If only I had the answer to that!

    I do know the terror is there, but I don’t know how to get rid of it. I’ve lost so much, and now I’m losing it all, yet again. Yet I am clinging to him, wanting to hold onto that love, anyway. It’s so stupid! He’s a jerk, why can’t I just let go? Why am I holding onto someone that hasn’t existed for 8 years?

    It’s all so upside-down and backwards. I should be able to let go because of the fear and yet I can’t. I shouldn’t be so attached (for the same reason), and yet I am!

    It’s completely effed up!

  52.  #52Dominique on January 21, 2014 at 7:56 am

    Shannon – I think most of us have fear of love and intimacy as much as we crave it. Most of us have suffered deep trauma which can get in our way in a big way.

    Awareness is the first step, and it’s a big one. And with this awareness you slowly peel away the layers of stuff you wisely erected to protect your tender heart. This takes time. It’s a life long process.

    Even after almost twelve years with K and even as wonderful a relationship as we have, I still carry some protection which I still work on constantly.

    Here’s something else related to this.


  53.  #53Dominique on January 21, 2014 at 7:57 am

  54.  #54Brenda on January 21, 2014 at 8:00 am

    46 Shannon thk u for your input, I have been all about words and no action because if I act on something anything its completely letting him go and I know I have to its so scary. I don’t want to accept this type of behavior from him or anyone.He says something and then I’m right back at square one with him it feels as though I am trapped in my own feelings.

    I can’t honestly sit here and say I’m in love with him its not been alot of things going on that makes me feel really loving towards him or to even know if I’m in love with him.I guess I was at some point and now I’m trying to grasp the fact that all these yrs that I loved him adored him for some of the good times we had and some of the good things he has done I have to let go because what happened that night is ultimately not how I want to be involved with a man I love to basically be pushed and badgered into something I said I did not want to do.

    I told him I would not want to do a 3 some and that I would consider it one day in the future and I did say most definitely not his friend. I told him first off we had just got back to even where I was accepting his calls and I was feeling like I was in a good place with him that to even consider doing a 3 some now I just did not think I want to do.

    Maybe I wasn’t clear enough for him.He always tells me that I don’t know how to talk to him.He told me that at least if I had told him that we could go get a hotel rm and if we had some drinks and I didn’t want to at that point that he would’ve been ok with it because at least I was considering doing it that night, instead of flat out saying no that I wouldn’t consider doing a 3 way with his friend ever.

    He was so angry when he left out that night he got to his truck I had sat his suitcase outside the door.He text me and said I was childish I sat on my bed for about 5 mins and he called me and asked me to come out to his truck and talk to him and I did.He was loud and he was drinking we both had been at my house drinking watching basketball I thought we were having a nice time.Until he brung up the 3 way.

    Well when I got in his truck he was a lil loud and still trying to convince me and telling me how he had a few women that would do it for him the times he and I had not been talking and how they loved it and would do it anytime. My heart sank and he also told me that the woman were the most humble person he knows and she said if I keep putting him out he can always come to her house that he should forget about me anyway. He said that she would do anything for him and I pushed him into getting comfortable with another woman.I reached over and I tried to kiss him and I told him bye and started getting out of his truck and he said he wouldn’t kiss me because my kisses are phony, that I’m a fake person and all of my friends probably are thinking the same thing that I am a fake woman and that if he was to ask one my friends to do it for him as a present because he’s going away that they would do it in a heartbeat.

    I got out of the truck and he asked me to bring his cup out to the car so I did when I got back out to the car he was smiling at me and said its late he tired and don’t want to get stop being out so late and he’s been drinking. He said he would come in and go to sleep.He said I don’t know why u just can’t do this for me and he said u are going to do it I am going to take it and he laughed.I thought it was just talk because he had been drinking and he was angry because I sat his suitcase outside the door.

    When we got in he got undressed and laid down he asked me to get him some water so I did.I came back and laid down and that’s when he started kissing me and went down on me and his friend came in and stood over me with his penis out and x came up and tried to kiss me and I bit him l, I think he bit me back I can’t remember but I know that my jaw was sore the next day.

    He kept saying just do it for him,and I said no,and he told his friend go ahead, and his friend said she said No.But he told him go ahead and so his friend put his penis on my lips, and x held my legs all the way up and slid inside me kinda rough my legs were up so far back and the guy was pushing it in my mouth and I did start to open my mouth I said I may as well try to get it over with and I felt soaking wet a feeling not like sexually.I know x felt it too cause he stopped and told me to turn around for his friend and his friend got inside me and I know he felt it too because he slowed down and went to the bathroom and came back but tried again and x kept telling me to keep giving him oral while his friend was behind me and I kept stopping and his friend stopped and he couldn’t get back up neither could x.Then I ran to the bathroom and x came in I told him I don’t think I’m bleeding he said no I wasn’t., he kissed me down below and said to come on back out that I’m making them both go down.I was happy and it was sort of the plan I was so nervous and embarrassed I had seen his friend every single day before Christmas for about a yr now he was a new friend of his but he came to visit x at my house almost every day.

    I have not talked to anyone about this, I don’t know how, the last thing I told my mom or 4 of my friends was that he gave me a ring I showed them the ring I even showed my closest friend the card he gave me of all the promises and how sorry he was and how much he loves me and will as long as he lives is what he wrote on the card.He sung to me that night he gave me the ring and the card he took me to a nice restaurant we had so much fun but I guess no of that meant he was ready to live up to any of the stuff he said in the card.

  55.  #55Brenda on January 21, 2014 at 8:16 am

    (((((Shannon))))) hugs

  56.  #56Veronica on January 21, 2014 at 8:21 am


  57.  #57Veronica on January 21, 2014 at 8:22 am

    Brenda, if I may ask, are you financially dependent on him?

  58.  #58Brenda on January 21, 2014 at 9:09 am

    57 Veronica I am he is there in times when I am at my lowest financially.I work I have 3 kids and my older kids there father has not been financially helping out in about 6 mths now he said his money is tied up in a building he owns.My 6 yr old his father died in a car accident while I was pregnant and x has been in all of my kids lives especially my 6 yr old.My tennagers kids father has never been there for them beyond money.X has been there for advice with my tennagers he buys food he watches them when I work late well usually he’s watching sports or just comes and checks on them because they fight alot or get bored and he’ll drop them off a few places they have to go sometimes I’m not able too.

    He puts gas in my car for work and he cooked for us a few times but he mainly buys restaurant food once or 2 twice a day 3 times out of a week.A few times he’s gave me money in my hands but he prefers to just get the stuff I need.He has bought school supplies for my kids, he usually does a lil more for my 6 yr old, he has bought my teenager son games for his xbox , he helps with busfare for my daughter to go to school.He gives them something at least twice a week, so yes ge has helped me out financially and it may seem like crumbs but its more than any man has done for me or be there for me in a while now.Maybe I have been so stuck on him I don’t know what the world has to offer or maybe I need to focus onme ggetting myself together financially and I won’t keep look at him as though he is God, because right now I think the world of him I just hate a lot of the stuff that has went on between us.I keep telling him I need to work on me and get myself together and he insists that he is with me all the way that we are a team and he loves me but what happened sat night I can say I don’t know for sure that he loves me or ever love me.

  59.  #59Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 9:19 am

    @Shannon Being Blunt it good! I don’t mind.<3

    Awfully attached…? how so b/c I don't know whether or not to return his calls… I think I was hopeful in an imaginary way that things might progress to more… but deep down, I always suspected he wouldn't…

    I do get attached to men that are ( otherwise ) good men and listen to me, really care about me, we have great times together, communicate well and the attraction is there… YES! I do! … b/c that is what I'm wanting… for long term…BUT how attached? I don't think much when I said to him, that I didn't want to be in the middle of anything that was going on with him and her, and pretty much left it at that… I think that I've the ability to un-attach easily when things aren't right… I was disappointed YES! and part of me wishes it wasn't true… but in all honesty… I might have spent another month with him and decided OMG no way… you just never know until you spend more time with someone… so part of it is getting attached to only what I know of someone… not knowing the whole story…

    I'm more attached to the story of "being in a committed relationship" than I am to one man…and if anything am attaching that to certain men that have certain aspects that meet that need…

    OK now I forgot what I was going to post… oh well…


  60.  #60Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 9:28 am


    I did The Work on this subject myself…it was a big one.

    “I can’t let go!” and it totally took me to a place of total bliss and inner peace…

    We attach to the things we think we need… ie your post to me about being awfully attached… if it fills a need we have we tend to want to cling to it… even if it is bad..( b/c we fear we won’t have it again) In my experience. I totally get that!!!.. been there… it takes lots of love for yourself and baby steps to get to a place of trusting life enough to let go and trust again…enough trust to allow intimacy and love to come in… In my experience…

    I was angry at God for all the stuff I’d been through in my life… and I didn’t even realize I was angry…



  61.  #61Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 9:43 am

    Oh Now I remember…. what I needed to post…

    Ok when “T” called last night he said I think we should go out to dinner…what do you think? I said, I think we should that sounds wonderful…

    and I forgot to use my messages…

    so, my question is… is there a way to script it out on Friday when he calls me back… to make sure he is ‘taking me out” and paying… I know he doesn’t make much, I suspect…

    I’m usually clear when men ask me out about them paying… this time, I’m not…

    Just wondering if there is a script that I can use to find out before we go out……

    Just curious..


  62.  #62Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 10:00 am

    Okay, so I was reading through Dominique’s writings that you linked to me. And I realized something. Something sad and strange.

    When I got pregnant, J changed. I didn’t know Rori’s teachings, so I tried to mollify him. I was pregnant and just didn’t want to deal… so I tried to be what he said he wanted.

    I changed.

    And I started feeling unloved. I was being someone else, and he didn’t love that someone else. I kept trying and trying to fix it, to change and be the person he could love. I felt unloved…

    Since he ended things, I have felt even more unloved; but at the same time, I’ve also begun to accept and reclaim MYSELF.

    In the meantime, I don’t really love him, either. He’s a stranger. I love and miss the man he was… before we both changed into people neither of us liked.

    Now here’s where the mental gymnastics and weirdness enters in. :p

    For a moment as I was reading, I inexplicably and suddenly felt loved by him. He loved and loves who I was–when I was who I really am. He doesn’t love the person I tried to be… he doesn’t love the fake me that I became to try to ‘win him back’ during my pregnancy. I love him for that, lol. How messed up is THAT?

    I love him, too… but I don’t love “this” him. I love the him he was, when he was still himself.

    For a moment, I loved him again. I miss the man I loved. Then the moment is gone and I just feel confusion, lol. Like I got to glance behind a veil but it fell back into place.

    I do love the J I fell in love with so long ago. I do feel he always loved the REAL me, too. Bless his heart for that.

  63.  #63Andrea on January 21, 2014 at 10:22 am

    Hi Lisa, I’ve been there before. A couple of times. Here are some of the ways I’ve dealt with that… It always worked for me.

    “Hi Joe, I feel so scatter brained sometimes. I forgot to mention something to you, do you have a few minutes?…. Well, I know we agreed to get together Friday night, and I’m really looking forward to it, but I also feel a little confused about whether it’s a date or not. I really feel wonderful and that I’m in the right place in my life to be dated right now. For me, a date is when a man asks me out and takes me to someplace that he enjoys or that he knows I’ll enjoy and he pays for what ever it is we decide to do. Is that what you were thinking? Is that what Friday night is?”

    The reason it works for me is because I’m always prepared to hear… “No! That’s not what I was thinking. I was thinking that we would meet there and split the tab.”

    Then I respond with, “Oh that sounds more like a friendship to me and I have to admit that I already have plenty of friends and I’m looking for dating right now. Thank you so much. Will you still keep me in mind when you’re ready to date?”

    But… that “No” has never happened to me yet even though I’m prepared for it. So far I have always gotten… “Oh yes!! For sure. That’s what I was thinking too. Hey, how about I come pick you up and take you to the new Mexican Restaurant in town?”

    Or.. “Yeah, that’s what I was thinking. Do you think you’d be okay with just a coffee date for this first time?”

    Or..”Ooohh… I like it when a woman let’s me know what’s up. I’ll see you at seven, dress nice and be ready to be surprised.”

  64.  #64Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 10:23 am

    Lisa, I think I missed one of your posts along the way, so just ignore my comments, lol. I thought you were still trying to decide whether to call him and still wanting more after realizing his situation is still so locked up with his ex and all the legal stuff and the distance and stuff. So yeah, I think I missed something.

    Anyway, so I’m trying to do The Work on “I can’t let go of him”. But what is the first turn around for making it about me? Is it “I can’t let go of me”? Because I’m struggling to comprehend that as a turnaround and how it’s true (or, I guess, why I would let go of me-I’m kind of stuck with me :p).

  65.  #65Andrea on January 21, 2014 at 10:26 am

    Oh… another one I’ve used is this:

    He: I think we should get together sometime.

    Me all sexy and smiling and joyful: OH YES!! That feels so wonderful to me. I just love it when it man comes and picks me up and takes me out to a nice place. I just love to feel all taken care of like that. It feels so fun. I just can’t wait!

    He, even more excited: Okay, Oh I have just the place in mind. You’re really going to love it. Oh… what kinds of flowers are your favorite?

  66.  #66Andrea on January 21, 2014 at 10:29 am

    Sharon… my first thought was this as a turn around:

    Your statement, “I just can’t let go of him.”
    Is that really true??
    What is more true????

    “I just CAN let go of him.”

  67.  #67Andrea on January 21, 2014 at 10:32 am

    I”m sorry…. I meant that last post to SHANNON #64…

    Turning I can’t into the real truth.

    I CAN.

    The next question might be… Why don’t I WANT to?

    Or why do I want to honor the idea that I CAN’T? why do I want to feel powerless with this issue? Is there something in me that just does not want to accept the responsibility of this issue right now?

    And then, instead of making yourself accept responsibility.. .just notice why you feel more comfortable in the realm of I CAN’T as opposed to the realm of I HAVE ALL THE POWER in this situation.

    Not trying to change yourself, but just sitting with yourself in the honesty of what is.

    You CAN let him go.
    You just don’t want to right now. (What’s wonderful about holding on to him right now?)

  68.  #68Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 10:53 am


    “Shannon thk u for your input, I have been all about words and no action because if I act on something anything its completely letting him go and I know I have to its so scary. I don’t want to accept this type of behavior from him or anyone.He says something and then I’m right back at square one with him it feels as though I am trapped in my own feelings.”

    My take from my perspective: I agree with the others. This man is abusive and I can’t see good coming from it AT ALL. Genuinely abusive behaviour escalates rather than ‘gets better’. As the others say also abusive men tend to be very good at manipulating things so that we often feel like its our fault or buy into a belief that they are not so bad. I have had to get a restraining order against an abusive man – it was like jumping into an icy cold sea with no way back up – it was FINAL and SCARY – but that was the only message this man could hear and it was absolutely necessary for ME.

    Things I had to focus on:

    This man’s behaviour was NOT NORMAL
    It was not my fault
    It did me no good having feelings of pity for him (that just weakened my resolve and I had to put myself first because MY SAFETY and MY HAPPINESS was the most important)
    There are men who are loving and kind
    I deserve a man who is loving and kind – I CERTAINLY DONT DESERVE A MAN who brings violence or chaos into my life
    I had to keep reminding myself of HOW AWFUL he made me feel rather than HOW WONDERFUL he made me feel

    I needed support – I know you said that you feel embarrassed with your mum and friends but would they not be completely on your side were you to tell them how that actually you’ve changed your mind because he’s mean? xxx

  69.  #69cupcake on January 21, 2014 at 11:05 am

    Wow, Andrea, Shannon and Lisa,

    This conversation you are having is really helping me.

    I am still in my pajamas from Sunday night and still haven’t eaten. I know I should get in the shower, put on some clean clothes and go out. I just seem to feel like there’s no rush on that. I’m really stuck in my head. And I don’t even know what I am thinking about.

    A recruiter called last night and asked if I’d be interested in a job that offers a long commute, a control freak type A boss (female), and significantly below-market compensation. I said I felt like I would be wasting everyone’s time if I said I was interested in what she was describing at that salary.

    She said she would explore their flexibility on that.

    It’s easy to find a job that doesn’t pay enough and provides a lot of stress. It is so much like dating. Should I just take the job or at least interview for it, because I need a job? Or should I have faith that I know what my skills and experience are worth in this market?

    I suppose the first step is to change out of my pajamas, eh? Maybe eat something?

    Thanks, Andrea, for what you wrote about being able to detach and just not choosing to.

    I can feel myself detaching from Lord V. It feels easier, this time, because I don’t respect the way he ended it. Loss of respect equals detachment, for me.

    It’s just not knowing what is in store. The CDs here Ive met being unacceptable for the long term. This isn’t what I want at all. I’m meeting such amazing people in New City, but so far they’re all women.

    I guess I will go to the gym. I’d already be there, I think, if I could wear my pajamas.

  70.  #70Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 11:07 am

    I am getting so used to being sent to coventry (do we all share that phrase? – the silent treatment) that I’m getting quite used to it here – I just sing myself little songs – I don’t think there’s a day goes by when I haven’t inadvertently done something ‘wrong’

    I’m just 220% focused on sorting out my own life and being happy regardless – B may be my greatest teacher for how to just let someone be and remain in my own inner peace and to honour myself in the light of other people’s agendas

    I’ve taken on new business too with organic health and beauty products and parties so that is going to be some serious Siren factor and i’m working towards my dream of living somewhere hot and by the sea – focusing on my own health too and how to feel as good as I can feel

  71.  #71Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 11:10 am

    Andrea, I think “I CAN let go” is great for the “opposite” turn around.

    I’m trying to sort out the “to the self” turn around, which is the first turn around. Example, instead of ‘he hurt me’, it would be ‘i hurt myself’.

    But I don’t know if “I can’t let myself go” is an accurate to the self turnaround.

  72.  #72Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 11:14 am

    (((Cupcake))) not that it really matters but there is the potential that Mr V’s line about the other lady isn’t true – it just all sounds a bit convenient to me…

    I’m all for the taking the job that is going to be good for you – I’ve had a rough few months but I’m hanging in there – I’m like “no universe, I keep settling for what I don’t want. This time I’m really stepping up and I want you to provide me with what I do what” – it’s been hairy but I believe in it – I am going to get to where I want but not if I settle

    I have plenty of PJ days – sometimes it feels good to just give myself a break but then I find myself beating myself up with the could be doing/should be doing so I also try to either FULLY commit to a PJ day and make it lovely or do at least one step so my mind is at ease for the remainder of the day

    And I’d say…whats in store? Amazing things and amazing people!!!! That’s what I’m choosing to believe 🙂 xxx

  73.  #73cupcake on January 21, 2014 at 11:17 am

    Brenda, et al-

    Am I the only one who thinks the clue here is that this guy seems to care about what makes his FRIEND happy but not the women? He will play all the women against each other because it seems to me the only person he sees as a real person is this other guy he seems pretty eager to be in sexual situations with.

    He sent Brenda from the truck on an errand with the cup so he could call his boyfriend and coordinate.

    Brenda, you’re not a real person to this man. No woman is. You’re a utility to him, and if you are pretty, which I suspect you are, its the status of sleeping with a hot girl that brings him back, a status that he values for what it earns him with this other guy.

    It creeps me out. I would put money on the idea that he has sex with this guy and probably others without a girl in the room, too.

    Brenda, it feels like you are stunned. I concur with what everyone else here has said — you need more back up here than we can give you. There’s got to be a confidential support group that you can talk to from home to get you started on finding your feet again. If you are not willing to call the police, call a hotline of some kind. You are in danger and you need other people with experience in this to work with you.

  74.  #74Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 11:17 am

    WOW bingo! I put my head in other things andmy answers come… I know that.. why do I forget… hummm a protective mechanism…. to keep my story…

    OK “MR” called today… but what was so wierd he was suppose to ask me out.. but he said my week is getting full already and I said yes, mine too… but then I said next Saturday.. I’m available, I have a meeting on Friday night…

    so it was wierd cuz I said, I have the next Saturday and Sunday available…

    Im starting to like this guy… he is very honest and upfront… but he left it at we’ll figure something out cuz I want to see you again, I said yeah I know me too…

    but then he said Hey whats your status now are you dating…. and I said I am dating, he ask more.. and then I said I’m not in a physical situation yet, but men ask me out, and I meet them, and see how it goes… then he said he was doing the same thing, nothing physical yet… so he said good we are on the same page…

    then he apologized for the hot tub remark and said he was trying to be flirty and tease…. I said oh flirting and teasing is ok.. I just wanted to be clear, I wasn’t sure… he said sorry about that, I don’t want you to think I meant the first few dates, he said I wouldn’t do that unless things had progressed! I said great! me too! and if they do! I’m totally up for that!!

    so what I’ve realized is… that as long as I tell myself to keep my distance… I’m ok… but when I start to like them… then I get all mushy and feel weird about them not asking me out and stuff… hummm it’s like I can reel them in softly and feminine, and then I am some what distant just out of “I don’t know you well yet”, but if I start to like them… then I notice the fear of rejection comes in… OK i’m confusing myself… I need to sit with this…

    anotherwords if I date men I’m not into and attracted to it’s easy… I can be feiminine and do all that stuff… as soon as I’m attracted to them or start to like them… I think things change… I just noticed that I felt sad when he didn’t make a date with me… and before I didn’t even care.. but after talking to him and his honesty and openness and communication ( which by the way is a big turn on for me) then I realized ummmm I want to go out with him, again now…


  75.  #75Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 11:28 am

    Also I tried to prempt a mood earlier with some positive appreciation (we’d had someone come and look at the house) so I told him how pleased I was etc. Unfortunately I’d picked the wrong thing I thought he’d be unhappy about (doing his thinking FW?:)) ha ha but still it felt good because it helped me to stay in a light-hearted space and this (rather than being angry and snappy) are great habits for me to cultivate.

  76.  #76Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 11:30 am

    and also being able to stay relatively unaffected means I remain open when he does come back round which he always does eventually …

  77.  #77cupcake on January 21, 2014 at 11:34 am

    Sophie #72-

    Thanks for the validation about waiting for a job that is not a bad situation from the start.

    And as you said, not that it matters, but I think I figured out who the woman is that Lord V is now interested in. He has always had a little crush on her, I could tell from Facebook, when I was his Facebook friend.

    My exboyfriend/now pseudo -brother says he suspects Lord V sought out the conversation with the woman, because he wanted to know what his chances were there before I booked my ticket. And I do think he was wrestling with what to do, because he took his dogs to the beach, which is what he does when he needs to have a think.

    Anyway. GAME OVER.

    I’m scared to leave the house, I think.

    Eventually, I’ll run out of instant coffee and then I will have to leave. 🙂

  78.  #78April Rose on January 21, 2014 at 11:39 am


    I feel sad reading how hard you tried to change yourself, to be the person you thought he wanted.

    I don’t believe he wanted that at at all.

    I suspect a trick of the mind, protecting you from the intimacy you would have experienced from being yourself.


  79.  #79prplpsn28 on January 21, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Hi all! Just signing in to new thread. I’m way behind.

  80.  #80Shannon on January 21, 2014 at 11:44 am

    April, you are absolutely right. And I have just had one realization after another today.

    I realize that I was so angry that another woman would get him, and I would have wasted all of those years with him, etc. etc. I felt so angry and resentful about all of that.

    Yet he taught me this beautiful lesson about how much he WANTED to love me, and how I didn’t let him… and he won’t ever get to benefit from that. And how unfair that feels. And how infinitely sad it feels.

    I really screwed it up so badly. I didn’t know any better.

    I could have given him the intimacy he craved, if I’d just allowed him to make me happy. If I’d just allowed him to love ME instead of trying to make HIM happy… it would all have been different. If I’d stood up for myself, we’d both have been so much happier.

  81.  #81Sophie on January 21, 2014 at 11:53 am

    ahhh I see Cupcake – I was just guessing

    I get going outside fear sometimes – I don’t know if it’s anything like your experience. For me I just feel really vulnerable and outside is just overstimulating or I just feel vulnerable and I don’t really want to be around people…

    making myself do small tasks helps sometimes, or the opposite putting on make up and theatre face and totally showing up or just giving myself a break – as you say you’ll go out when the coffee ends 🙂

  82.  #82Turquoise on January 21, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    I’m really really glad I had that no girlfriend speech with Sweetheart. He and his wife have been separated for two years, they haven’t started the divorce process yet…. I believe mainly due to financial issues and both maybe being in denial about handling said issues… but this is EXACTLY why I can’t be his girlfriend right now. She has also been dating, but apparently their children read some very explicit sext messages between her and multiple men and there are all kinds of problems going on. He’s emotional, worried about his kids, and knee deep in all of that. I understand and am supportive…. been through a long rough separation and divorce myself. BUT… and here is the good part. I do not feel triggered at all by this. He has a lot to deal with, they will figure it out, and I will give him space to do that. I’m not upset that he’s upset. If I was all emotionally charged and feeling super connected, I might feel differently about all this.

    I feel healthy. WHEW!!!!!

    Thank you love always!!!

    Kyla, I’m so sorry about your gram.

    Hi April Rose!

  83.  #83Turquoise on January 21, 2014 at 1:31 pm

    And they have decided to start the divorce process.

  84.  #84April Rose on January 21, 2014 at 1:36 pm

    Anyone fancy giving themselves a fresh start?

    Forgiving ourselves and being very gentle and compassionate…

    And starting again.

    No regrets ….. only gratitude for the lessons learned.

  85.  #85Millie on January 21, 2014 at 1:38 pm

    I wish I had time to read everyone’s posts! Just skimming I’ve read some real gems of information and truth.

    I feel horrible today. My immune system is on strike. I have no energy. I went to the store and bought blueberries, carrot juice, oranges and greens. Hoping that will help turn my cold around.

    I feel like I know what I want…I just have no clue how to get it. Right now I want sex. I want to be touched. I’m wondering how having a real FWB would feel while I dated other people. So all my needs are met….even though there is no one to date. I made an online profile and barely got any responses. I’ve done online profiles many times and each time I seem to get less and less responses. I’m not sure what that is saying…but I don’t really have any interest in meeting anyone online, so maybe my profile is conveying that.

    I had this thought earlier while I was beating myself up and telling myself I’m going to be alone all my life cuz nothing seems to change and I’m clearly inept at relationships…I had this thought of YES. What if I was voicing this to someone and the other person said YES, you’re absolutely right. Then what? Am I saying all this to myself because I want someone to say yes you are absolutely right you should just fold in the towel now and start collecting cats. Then what? I’m creating all this drama in my head about being inept… it’s not helping. But I can’t escape the fact that there are no guys around me.

  86.  #86Turquoise on January 21, 2014 at 2:00 pm

    Hi Millie,

    Sometimes I think it comes in waves… with the occasional dry spell. I bet in a month you can’t believe how many men are around you. If you are sick and not feeling well, your energy is low and just on yourself right now. When I’m in a dry spell, I watch movies with hot actors and fantasize about them… it cheers me up! 😉

    Focus on feeling better, and then do some nice things for yourself and smile at everyone along the way. It always helps! 🙂

    April Rose, that feels lovely!!!

  87.  #87Cupcake on January 21, 2014 at 2:04 pm


    Thanks. I do just feel afraid to go out. Like it would just be too much to take in.

    I texted a girl I met this week who goes to my gym, and she’s going to let me know when she’s going there tomorrow so hopefully it won’t feel so scary to leave the house if I am meeting someone.

    I always feel so confused by “dating” meaning treating people like commodities. It feels so weird to drop people. Keep your heart open, and tell them you want no contact. What? That’s the disconnect for me.

    My mom just called. She may have short term memory problems, but boy is her Mom-radar attuned. She called – first time she’s dialed the phone on her own in months- and said, “Are you okay? Are you eating? I feel worried about you.”

    That’s not normal for her. And of course, I’m not okay and I’m not eating. So I think the Universe had a hand in that call. Which set off my tears again.

  88.  #88April Rose on January 21, 2014 at 2:08 pm

    Hello Turquoise,

    I wish I’d had your strength and boundaries 5 years ago.

    My fella is still married. He is planning to take divorce proceedings now that 5 years have passed and it shouldn’t be contested.

    I was already in and attached by the time I found Rori. I tried to backtrack and say I didn’t want to be with a married man. But obviously I haven’t stuck to those guns.

    Oooh… next time I will be TRUE to myself and to all sirens.

    Hugs to you 🙂

  89.  #89April Rose on January 21, 2014 at 2:14 pm


    I feel all warm and affectionate picturing you in your pyjamas….

  90.  #90redbutterfly on January 21, 2014 at 2:27 pm

    Did Brenda wind up getting that restraining order on the creepy rapist today? I felt so angry reading her story, I wanted to just go smash his head in.

  91.  #91redbutterfly on January 21, 2014 at 2:29 pm

    Hugs to you, Cupcake! Wish you lived in my city so we could go work out together!

  92.  #92prplpsn28 on January 21, 2014 at 2:40 pm


    Brenda…I totally agree with Tereana.

  93.  #93Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 2:42 pm

    A life without love is a waste. “Should I look for spiritual love, or material, or physical love?”, don’t ask yourself this question. Discrimination leads to discrimination. Love doesn’t need any name, category or definition. Love is a world itself. Either you are in, at the center…either you are out, yearning.

    ~ Shams Tabrizi Art: Kadri Pamukoglu —

    If I’m yearning for love from a man, I’m out.. If I’m in the center with Love than I’m not wanting anything other than what is…

    and this is my lesson… “D” triggered the yearning again…. and I got caught up in “not having” and started yearning.. and bingo attachment…..

    and Turquoise, I’m so happy for you! I get it! I totally get it! I just experienced something similar… and I felt so good about myself, for not getting sucked into his marital stuff… he will work it out…and I’m not going to be in the middle of it… thanks for posting…

    Ok another date coming my way.. “K”… nice! I love it when the flow is steady…


  94.  #94prplpsn28 on January 21, 2014 at 2:51 pm

    Brenda 44/45…please do not blame yourself. This was not your fault. A man NEVER has a right to do what he did. Please listen to what Shannon says in #46. I totally agree with her.

  95.  #95Rori Raye on January 21, 2014 at 3:28 pm

    Brenda, Please go to your nearest mental health clinic. Please tell them your story and assign you to a counselor-in-training. It doesn’t matter if they’re an experienced counselor, just that they can listen to you and give you information to help you reconfigure your life. The very first thing you need to do is get some help financially, so you can stand on your own two feet – a better job, food stamps, housing, assistance. This particular man is just one of many people who’ve taken advantage of the way you view yourself – and that has to change. You have essentially entered into an arrangement where you are being paid to comply, and in your head, that looks like love. We aren’t suited to help you here with this – so please let us know you’re getting some professional or community (your local community or church) help disengaging from this situation so it doesn’t happen again. Threesomes are supposed to be fun and sexy, not scary. It is totally okay for you to engage in sexual orgies, in threesomes and foursomes, swinging, whatever you like. It’s not okay for you to do those things under duress. Love, Rori

  96.  #96cupcake on January 21, 2014 at 5:08 pm

    Hi, Sirens-

    Wow, the Universe has been pulling for me today. After my mom called, I got an email from a former mentor I hadn’t been in touch with for a while, and then texts from various people along the way. So it feels like the love is pouring in, which feels really wonderful right now. I actually managed to fix myself some stir fry, and ate my first meal in 48 hours. And I think I will wash my hair and then watch movies on my computer until I fall asleep.

    I also got an email from the HR department of a company I used to work for, and I am going to speak to them later in the week. If they hire me for the job I used to do, I can telecommute. Then it doesn’t matter if I decide to leave New City or not. That would feel like a big relief, not having to decide that right away.

    I did take my profile off OkCupid earlier. It felt so depressing to go on there and look at men who aren’t anything like what I want. Maybe I will put it back up in a few days. It just felt like an incredible relief.

    Anyway, thanks for all your messages today. It helped a lot to feel connected.

  97.  #97Lisa on January 21, 2014 at 7:52 pm

    @Cupcake Yeah!!! <3

    Ok well life has twists and turns… "D" called again tonight..

    I used feeling messages.. and that felt good…

    so he explained to me that she has left and he is proceeding with divorce… ( ok not my problem, not my issue) and that means nothing to me…he is still 16hrs away….. and still in flux…

    But the part that is so lovely is that he wanted me to know that he cares for me, likes me ALOT he says, ALOT… and the way he said, got through to me… he said our weekend was amazing for him, every minute…

    He said that he just wanted me to know that none of this has anything to do with me…and that even if I fall in love with another man, he still wants to keep in touch with me b/c he said "Lisa your an amazing woman"

    I was able to use my feeling message with him to a point.. but then it go hard… I told him that even though things worked out the way they did, I'm still glad that we had the weekend together.. it was fun, amazing, melty…

    I feel so good and also sad… this is why I do love this man…maybe not the love ( LOVE) thing that builds with time….. but the love of friendship of two really good people that have big hearts…and can recognize another person with a big heart

    He is a selfless man…and a good man… and I told him that… and it felt good… to say these things…to him and be vulnerable..

    and so as of now, were just friends…

    and part of me wants that so bad… and I know it is really that I want a good man!!

    "M" wasn't a good man by my standards… he was very selfish and self centered.. and wanted in return – he gave to get… my feelings weren't cherished…

    "D" so far has cherished my feelings…

    So I'm so glad FW brought up the whole subject of falling in love too soon b/c I've thought about it for days now… contemplating it..understanding myself better…and that is part of loving myself.. listening to myself…

    "D" opened me up… and shown me that a good man will WANT me bad enough to drive 16 hrs through the night with no sleep to meet me.. and then calls me to let me know that he still really likes me ALOT and that it's just his crazy situation he is in… and that everything about me is amazing…

    I cried… it felt so good to hear that from a man…not a man that is just saying it to get me… a man that is not expecting that anything will happen more between us and has nothing to gain by saying it…

    I love a man with a good heart… and communicates well and has good character, honest and loyal… and selfless… that is such a turn on… and the icing on the cake if he is fun, adventurous. That is such a turn on for me…

    I can cry now and let my hopes of things happening with him go… and know that even if short… it was great!!!

    and I have a new friend….

    OMG I'm crying… crying… crying…letting go with love … open hands…


  98.  #98Veronica on January 21, 2014 at 8:33 pm

    Brenda, I’m sorry that you’re in this situation. Please follow Rori’s advice.

  99.  #99Andrea on January 21, 2014 at 9:12 pm

    Shannon # 71… I get what you’re saying.

    I went through that “self turn around” with..
    “He is ignoring me.”

    Why is he ignoring me? Then I went to.. “I am ignoring me.” Why am I ignoring me?

    Then I started to pay attention to me and it turns out, I didn’t care anymore about whether “he” was contacting me or not.

    That’s a hard one though that you’re working through… “I can’t let go of me????”

    Maybe it could also be something like.. “I can’t let go of “MY TAKE” on the situation.” ??
    Or “I can’t let go of my opinion about it?”
    Or “I can’t let go of my perspective??”

    Ooohhhh….. I feel so into my head right now. : ) I have to admit that is one reason I let the Byron Katie stuff go.. because I was always in my head. : ) It’s so refreshing to allow myself to just sit with the equation and let myself feel my way… not into change…. but further into deep contact with ME. Such a process. It’s so wonderful that we have these experiences in our lives so that we are able to go through these things.

  100.  #100LoveAlways on January 21, 2014 at 10:01 pm


    I feel so much better with Rori’s advice to you Brenda! We are here if and when you need us.

  101.  #101Veronica on January 22, 2014 at 12:36 am

    I feel frustrated. I would like to be asked out on dates that men plan and yet that doesn’t seem to be happening. I notice that I still feel uneasy about going on dates. I have this anxiety that these men will then expect something in return. My inner siren says, yes, they get to spend time with me which is very valuable and rewarding. I don’t like it that I’m focusing on their reaction. I want to feel excited about letting things happen.

    A while ago I bought gorgeous underwear – the kind I’ve always wanted: the kind that makes me feel so beautiful and like a woman. It’s amazing what a difference it makes. When I was working in another country, I couldn’t find clothing that made me feel that way or suited my body. I felt unattractive and incapable of changing that situation. It definitely had a huge impact on me.

    I was chatting to my supervisor and was so pleased with myself with how open I was. That felt so good : ) and he suggested we meet at a Korean restaurant next week – I’ve been wanting to suggest this for a while because I could then share more about my time there which he’s interested in knowing about. I feel good that I didn’t initiate this and that I responded so openly. This is definitely progress for me but it also feels so good to be interacting with men who are interested in my thoughts, experiences, etc, and this isn’t even a romantic interaction.

  102.  #102Lisa on January 22, 2014 at 6:14 am

    @Andrea interesting that Byron Katie work kept you in your head….
    ……for me it does the exact opposite it gets me into my feelings and my body and allows my thoughts to melt away…. with no thoughts…

    so many ways to get into our feelings and our bodies… 🙂 everyone is different….<3


  103.  #103Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 7:37 am

    Veronica have you considered taking yourself on a date to where these guys might take you? Who knows they might be doing that for themselves and being there alone your paths might just cross.

  104.  #104Luzydel on January 22, 2014 at 8:26 am

    In a real committed relationship is what both want and finding a happy medium where we’re both happy. But when it comes to just dating and starting up it is what I want. The problem with me was that I started to compromise even before the real relationship started. I acted as if I was already in a committed relationship when I wasn’t.

    So, until I meet a man who is willing to commit and compromise to have a REAL relationship with me, I am not going for what he wants; but for what I want. I am not going to initiate unless it is just with a glance or a smile telling him it is ok to approach me. I am not going to tell anyone “I am seeing someone” unless it is a REAL committed relationship.

    I am no longer “suffer” because I am not “that woman” that men want. I am wonderful me and I am going for what a want. A man who sees the wonderful me and is willing to commit to her!

  105.  #105Andrea on January 22, 2014 at 10:02 am

    I know Lisa… I kept trying to “figure it out”…

    As though… if I could just “get it” then my life would change.

    Finally I stumbled onto Power of Now, Eckhart Tolle… and in one of his quips he talks about how “this” is non-comprehensible to the mind. Just let it enter and resonate and have faith.

    I took on The Work as though it were a puzzle I could solve. ARgh… : ) It was like.. “If I could just get this one thing and DO it right, if I could just get these “rules” then life would be better… I’d have more control. I’d have certainty.”

    When a lot of what Katie talks about being at peace with the acknowledgement of uncertainty.

  106.  #106Lisa on January 22, 2014 at 11:01 am

    Ahhhh Andrea yes, you had a motive with The Work…( to make your life better) sounds like you were mentally trying to figure it out.. now I get it… so your mind would be spinning more and more to try and “get it”…. make sense… <3

    Yes I LOVE Eckhart … and he and Katie are good friends… though I've met Katie in person several time, I've not yet been able to meet Eckart…


  107.  #107R.N.AmazingMe on January 22, 2014 at 11:18 am

    Well if you’re familiar with me you know I love music because I can express my heart…  This is start of a song, beautiful and this is how I feel ABOUT ALL OF IT..
    I think part of me knew the second I saw him that this would happen.
    It’s not really anything he said or anything he did,
    It was the feeling that came along with it.
    And the crazy thing is I don’t know if I’m ever gonna feel that way again.
    But I don’t know if I should.
    I knew his world moved too fast and burned too bright.
    But I just thought, how can the devil be pulling you toward someone who looks so much like an angel when he smiles at you?
    Maybe he knew that when he saw me.
    I guess I just lost my balance.
    I think that the worst part of it all wasn’t losing him.
    It was losing me.

  108.  #108Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 11:32 am

    I went to another speed dating event last night. Pretty disappointing. I didn’t meet one man that I found attractive! They were either too old or too goofy! Why is so hard to meet a normal successful man? Oh well, I will keep trying. I’m throwing myself out there and meeting a ton of new people. Its been fun and I’m making a lot of new friends.

    Someone on here tried It’s Just Lunch. Was wondering what it’s like? Anyone tried it? Is it worth it? Thanks!

  109.  #109Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 11:36 am

    My gran is currently stable in ICU and I feel hopeful again. My mom spoke on the phone to the consultant and he told her no need to fly home and that felt relieving.

    I feel exhausted today. I took a day off work and just slept. I have so many feelings moving around in me.

    DrWho has sent one lovely text every day since our date Saturday and I feel warm and melty. He hasn’t done that before and I feel so good and smiley. I can’t help feeling anticipation and excitement when I think of our next date.

    I’m feeling wary of Bear. I feel unheard. I also notice that things he says don’t match up and warning bells are ringing.

    Today is Wed and usually I’m making my wkd plans but I feel like I need to hibernate away so have delayed responding to anyone again. I feel confused if its because I am feeling drained with family stuff or if I’m comparing the other potential CDs to DrWho and favoring him. Well I can’t help favor him, he matches my wants and needs in every way in how he treats me and how I feel with him yet we are dating so I am keeping options open. I feel muddled and sleepy. I don’t want to think today.

  110.  #110Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Kyla, girl, that sounds great! I would give my arm and my leg* to be dating someone that I’m really excited about! Enjoy it and don’t overthink! It sounds FANTASTIC!!! You go girl. You are inspiring! 🙂

    *That saying is kinda weird…ok, I’d give a toe…or at least a toe nail or two…hahahaha!!!

  111.  #111Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 11:45 am

    And I got the strong feeling that ex-colleague is looking to move our friendship straight to the next level, skipping dating altogether and that feels weird. I don’t want a FWB and I’m not ready to let my hormones kick in if this is a potential relationship. I have tried having conversations with him but it all gets lost in his jokes and flirting and I tell him I feel confused and he says I own him. I haven’t responded and I’m going to step back more.

    New CD seems fun and I feel intrigued about him and yet I don’t want to put any effort into responding to him either. I feel unsure why.

  112.  #112Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 11:47 am

    LOL thanks Liquid Light I feel giddy 🙂

  113.  #113Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 12:07 pm

    WOW, oh wow. Oh boy. Holy cow.

    So, J just told me that he wants to have a “what would that look like?” discussion about us getting back together.

    He looked at the little dark room that would be K’s room (our daughter’s room) if we moved out, and it made him sad, he said (he wasn’t going to tell me, but did). I think he has finally let go of what’ll happen to ME and instead looked at what will happen to HER… the price of his choice.

    Also we’ve had a couple of discussions between yesterday and today. I told him yesterday about how I realized how much he wanted to love me, and I hadn’t let him do it… and that I was sorry for that.

    I kind of figured that, since it was over, anyway, I just as well let myself be baldly honest. I didn’t complain or blame (what good would it do, anyway?).

    This morning, I told him I was going to look at an apartment, and he was like, “you feel so different from yesterday,” and I said that I had ACCEPTED that it was over, but I didn’t WANT it to be over… which is different. I told him that he could say he isn’t family all he wanted to, but he couldn’t make me FEEL that he’s not family.

    I also told him that I wanted to let all the resentments go because if it’s a choice between him and my resentment… it’s a no-brainer.

    I really expected him to still hold onto his “it’s over”. He has held onto it despite anything and everything and has sometimes been downright belligerent about it.

    Now suddenly it’s “let’s talk about what that would look like” and I just don’t know what to expect… I find myself almost backpedaling. I’m pretty sure that I’ll chase him off as soon as I say the “no girlfriend” speech. And I know he’s going to “lay down the law” about getting a job (which is fine, I didn’t have a problem with getting a job, but I think he’s going to be hurtful about it).

    I’m reeling. Seriously. I really thought he’d stick to it no matter what.

  114.  #114Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    Cupcake – that’s great how your day ended up bringing up some really positive stuff and potentially a good lead too – woo hoo

    Kyla – I feel happy for you that there is good news about your Gran – maybe its not necessary to question the whys and whats of feeling the need to hibernate? If I’m vulnerable with stuff going on I try to put the questioning aside in case i’m not thinking straight and just be – like a warm hug around myself 🙂

    I am posting rather than going into a spiral of beating myself up – i’m right on the precipice 🙂 I have overstretched myself and am feeling a bit overwhelmed and I can’t decipher where I’m allowing other peoples agendas to have allowed me to question and doubt myself or where I need some more strategic thinking…and I feel sad like there’s noone that can help me with these problems

    I feel very weighed down by other people’s agendas – B’s also and so i’m trying to use it as a lesson in listening to what I want rather than what everyone else wants – it feels scary and lonely though – it feels like the edge of a cliff. But I know I do a lot of worrying about what other people think and trying to manage situations so that everyone feels okay and I know I cant and that it exhaust and overwhelms me. I am bringing awareness to the fact that I need to let people take responsibility for their own emotions – this feels anxious and tense

    B is still not talking to me – I feel stiffled by the dense energy – it feels so grim and gloomy – not sure if I should approach him and if so if theres a good script? or just leave him under his cloud?

  115.  #115Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    Shannon it just goes to show how mostly ignorant most of us are about how relationships really work. I would suggesting staying in the vibe that you are now in and still focusing on your life. You don’t need him. Wanting is different yes with a whole different vibe. I would talk yes but not turn around immediately and jump back in with both feet. With the no girlfriend speech, even giving yourself the “mental option” makes a difference in your vibe that he can feel. After all that you have been writing I am honestly not surprised about this turnaround on his part.

  116.  #116Dominique on January 22, 2014 at 12:26 pm

    Shannon – 112 – This feels amazing to read. You were real and authentic, and you had no expectations. And look… YAY you!!!

    Try to stay with curiosity and openness. Softness, gentleness, for yourself first and foremost.


  117.  #117Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 12:31 pm

    (((Shannon))) I second what FW said.

    Your energy is shifting back to you 🙂 So maybe your outside focus right now could be looking for a job and taking care of yourself in all sorts of loving ways so that you can support yourself one way or the other and raise your energy and options that way. Let him step up and claim you if he wants to but keep the focus on you and know you will be ok no matter what happens.

  118.  #118Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 12:32 pm

    Thanks Sophie. I feel soothed reading that.

  119.  #119Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 12:34 pm

    I don’t know what I should tell him it would look like. I do know I want to be married. I do know that I want to have time with him, not be ignored all evening, every evening. I don’t ever want to talk about what happened with this again. Ever.

    But, is that it? That’s all I need to say? Should there be more? The married thing is kinda huge. :p

  120.  #120Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 12:36 pm

    Sophie, you sound overwhelmed. I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. I wish I could offer more than a caring ear. *Internetz hugz*

  121.  #121Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 12:45 pm

    Shannon tell him you don’t know! Let him figure it out. Stay in feelings and let him come up with the solutions and the logistics. Share what feels good, what you want and ask him what he thinks? Keep the conversation going like that. Leave out the things he does wrong and flip them to how good it feels when you get what you like.

    For me this sounds like the time for scripting and conversation rather than a power speech, you are negotiating. If marriage is a deal breaker than that part is for a speech.

  122.  #122April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 12:56 pm


    What a beautiful chance to explore what your ideal relationship would FEEL like inside you, and share that with him.
    “I want to feel connected and secure. I want to feel the bond of trust and easy companionship. A good relationship feels like spending time being together in the evenings, feeling warm and safe and connected.”

  123.  #123April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 1:00 pm

    “A great relationship gives me permission to express myself as I really am. And I want to honour myself just exactly as I am. I have abandoned my true nature in the past, and that felt so lonely and disconnected. I want to live true to my spirit – that would feel amazing. And to share that with a partner I trust would be something I have never felt before. Ohmygosh it feels scarey (giggle)”.

  124.  #124Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 1:01 pm

    Wow, April!

    Oh my goodness. You ARE a sireny goddess!

    My heart felt happy and awed just reading what you just wrote!

  125.  #125Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 1:02 pm

    Shannon 🙂 we posted simultaneously so I’ve only just seen yours – ahhhhhh how wonderful when there’s an energy shift

    I like a mix between what you ‘know’ and what Kyla says – you tell him what you do and don’t know and ask him what he thinks…


    thanks for the virtual hug – i just did a business brainstorm with my sister in law so feel a bit more focused again and a little less swimming around in a whirlpool of fear – there was someone to help me with my problems after all – thank you universe! xx

  126.  #126Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 1:05 pm

    121 – I love that April Rose – mmmmm how would that feel 🙂

    I did an interesting exercise yesterday with yearly intentions – whereas previously all my ‘work’ had been focused on what each month was like last year and what I would like each month to be like this year (goal orientated) I started to look at how each month last year FELT and how I’d like this year to FEEL …

  127.  #127Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 1:12 pm

    (((Sophie))) I feel happy that you are supported!

  128.  #128Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 1:12 pm

    April Rose – Like!!

  129.  #129Cris on January 22, 2014 at 1:25 pm

    @Shannon, I just can say I am glad to hear what is happening now in your life!

  130.  #130April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 1:45 pm


    What would it feel like to run a hot bubbly bath, get in (bring a drink and a piece of chocolate), lie back and let your imagination go….
    To a feeling place of what would feel most good to YOU. Let no-one else into the picture during this special time of feeling-visualisation.

    Call it an appointment – with yourself. That way if anyone tries to interrupt or take up the time you’ve planned for your self, you can say “Sorry, I have an appointment at that time”. 🙂 🙂 🙂

  131.  #131April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 1:50 pm

    I know that one
    “…trying to manage situations so that everyone feels okay..”

    And the result? A kind of lukewarm experience for everyone.

    I’m learning to allow conflict of interests without trying to smooth them out. It is a masculine energy activity to try to solve or sort out or please everybody.

    Feminine energy allows the mess to be there! Aaaagh, I know …… eeeeee …… i want to clean it up ……. Nooo….I must lean back…. feel uncomfortable if necessary ……. allow a man to step forward and help!

  132.  #132Lisa on January 22, 2014 at 1:53 pm

    @Kyla wonderful news!
    @Shannon Fabulous!!<3 I'm so happy for you…

    I'm having a hard time keeping up on here and still getting my work done and feeling productive towards my goals…

    I realized that I'm catering to my emotions and feeling guilty if I don't try and read and keep up with the posts…

    My plate is overrunning.. already so behind…

    I'm working on balance and trying to keep myself off things that keep me from moving forward on my goals of $….

    I wish I could speed read so fast to keep up with all the posts… but can't…

    sending the love even if I'm not posting it for everyone… <3 <3


  133.  #133Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 2:16 pm

    Ahhh April Rose I have plummeted away from the happy vibe and am crying

    The exchange with B the first in 24 hours was just B/S – he told this man who is moving in his name and I made a joke saying it took him 7 months to tell me his right name – Now he wants me to practically get on my hands and knees with an apology – I feel so upset I don’t want to apologise I don’t think I did anything wrong

    I want him gone but he won’t go so then I just try and keep the peace cos i’m so afraid of this level of animosity it feels horrible

    And I still feel scared for the new lodger moving in on Sunday – I’m liable to be stressed out of my mind if there’s an atmosphere 🙁

    I want to run away but feel I need to be here incase anything goes wrong between them (see? that’s micromanaging isn’t it?)

    I get no warmth or sympathy from B – he sees sleeping in the same bed as me (when he does) as a great service to me for which I should repay him by never ever doing anything he doesnt like like accidentally offending him with a joke – I dont want him in my bed or my house and right now I dont want him in my life

    I’m still trying to just not get upset so that I can focus on doing the work I need to do but I am upset and I don’t sleep well and then it gets worse

    F**&&kk I want this situation to end – I want him gone and either someone else in that room or rent the whole thing out and just go away – such a sad sad heart 🙁

  134.  #134Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 2:26 pm

    I just did an impulsive emotional spew and I swore and so now I am in moderation feeling slightly naughty and slightly ashamed -oops sorry for swearing – I am normally more considerate – just easy to tip me over the edge – actually ashamed – maybe it won’t get cleared

    I love the positive visualising April Rose _ i do it all the time – go off to my happy place 🙂

    I guess the letting go of trying to manage everyone else is a bit like Rori’s post beforehand where we’re on the ladder and we can just fallllll and then what? I imagine lots of eggs being thrown and just letting then drop and smash all over the floor- like you said messy – but so?!

  135.  #135Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 2:38 pm

    At least I spewed at the blog – thank you blog – I din’t spew at him – I just attempted to tell him how I felt then when that fell on deaf ears left the room – again…now to find my happy place and visualise with all my heart the happy days to come and a peaceful, easy-going houseshare – maybe with the lodger money go out dancing 🙂 … with men 🙂 xxx

  136.  #136Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 2:40 pm

    ((lisa)) I know 🙂 its hard to keep up … and remember what I want to comment on x love to you xxx

  137.  #137Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 3:11 pm

    Sophie, I am still so confused by your situation. Seriously.

    Anyway, on my own stuff… I feel so scared now. I’m suddenly feeling in a tizzy… do I even want this… of course I do… don’t I?

    Ahhhh! *runs screaming around the house*

  138.  #138Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 3:35 pm

    I can’t think of anything else besides these:

    I want to be allowed to be me and express my feelings.

    I want to feel connected and loved.

    I want a new beginning. I want to feel fresh, without baggage from the past.

    I want to be married/ to be a wife.

    I want to feel supported (not financially, he’s awesome there already, but rather emotionally).

    …. cannot think of anything else, arg!

  139.  #139Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 3:41 pm

    Shannon this is the time you share the terms of your exclusivity and what a relationship looks like for you. I’d be focusing on Rori’s Reconnect Your Relationship if I were you, even if you don’t want this one. At least it would be great practice for you. To see what really works.

    If you want marriage, when he asks just let him know you never ever want to be living with a man without that. One reason is because of how humiliating and devastating it feels to give your life and your all to someone without a full commitment on his part. Remember that as women when it comes to relationships we stand to lose at lot. Look at what has happened up to now where you can’t even figure out how you would survive without finances plus with a sick child. I wouldn’t necessarily initiate this talk with him but I would put everything out there if he asks. He would ask if he didn’t want to know. This relationship is broken so what you want is to create a new one with the powerful siren you. Who is not demanding but know what she wants and shares that in a soft firm manner. No need to compromise. I might even continue packing if I were you and get engrossed searching for jobs and setting up babysitting help with friends and family as backup. If nothing else just to start putting the energy out there to see what help will come back to you. Stay focused on your life. Obviously this is what affects him and gets his attention. Believe it is more than just about your daughter. Just don’t focus on any agenda to get him back. Keep practicing letting go. Give him no reason to believe that he has a hold on you.

    I am feeling so proud of you.

  140.  #140Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 3:41 pm

    ha ha Shannon me too – he needs to leave basically but I dont know how to make him short of calling the police which I wont do because its so much drama and he’s not an awful person just too difficult for me and I feel unhappy. I have talked to him about this and given him suggestions as to where to find housing but he hasn’t made any moves…maybe I need to do it again but I have such a reaction every time…I know at some point he’ll find somewhere else but I think he may be waiting for the conclusion of a court case which could set him up financially to do it…

    Any kind of reasonable conversation with him feels impossible (or has thus far proven impossible) so I was attempting negotiation and all of that really just so that I could keep the peace, be able to move someone else in and focus as much as poss on getting my work done to get money in – It’s all such masculine energy isn’t it?! I don’t feel like i’m in an exclusive relationship (or want to be) but when I brought this up before once again it was so explosive I preferred the slight but not too much intimacy eg watching films, cuddling etc – I am not feeling sexuallly inclined

    i do not want to create an atmosphere for the new person but I suppose I can’t control that…

    What do I do? – ignore them all and go out and CD? What do I do?! A very powerful speech and then just deal with what comes?! xxx

    Shannon – ha ha ha made me laugh 🙂

  141.  #141Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 3:46 pm

    I just had an “interview” with someone at Its Just Lunch. Its very expensive which I didnt know… she was really putting the hard sell on me even after I turned it down a few times. Has anyone else here had any experience with this service?

  142.  #142Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 3:46 pm

    yes Shannon! I want to be allowed to be me and express my feelings too – ahhh that feels like breathing! xx

  143.  #143Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 3:52 pm

    Sweetie you don’t need anyone’s permission so I would definitely not say “I want to be allowed to be me and express my feelings.” You just let him know that you are a girl full of feelings that will be expressed. At times it might not be expressed in the best possible way but you are committed enough to yourself to not dismiss your feelings.

    You want to be a wife so that you can give and receive love in a space where you can just love without fear. You want to feel heard when you share about your feelings and internal state. Though sometimes you might need to let him know ahead of time that you are not expecting him to fix anything just that you would appreciate him listening to you. This is how you feel loved. You don’t want to be in an attention starved relationship because you are a girl and like every other girl you thrive on attention. Without attention you wilt like a dried up rose and feel lifeless and that is not how you want to feel with any man. Keep telling him you are a girl and that you want to feel romanced and close. You want to hear sometimes that the man wants to see you and wants to be with you because these things make you happy.

    Shannon I would read the book 5 Love Languages so I can help myself be clear on how I feel loved and what love looks like to me so I can share that with any man.

  144.  #144Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 3:55 pm

    RE 137 – As Dominique puts it, it is okay to say “I feel like a simmering cauldron of emotions today”. You are a girl. You are entitled.

  145.  #145Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 3:55 pm

    FW – I love that FW I love that – copy and pasting – the book sounds good too xx know it was for Shannon but thank you 🙂 xx

  146.  #146Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 3:59 pm

    Sophie your comments reminds me about the post about the therapist. He might very well know you are afraid of his explosiveness. How about putting up your hand and just saying STOP. I don’t want to be spoken to like that and just back away and leave the room. Think of a different response that you have never used in the presence of this energy. Even if it is to joke and say “do I have to drop your pants to get your attention”. Think of something different to break the cycle of him exploding and you giving the same response. Just stop talking on eggshells and speak.

  147.  #147Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:00 pm

    Yeah Sophie. It is a great read.

  148.  #148Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:06 pm

    Shannon I meant to say “he wouldn’t ask if he didn’t want to know”. Let him decide if he can do it. You are just sharing the dreams you have for your life. Let him decide if he wants to come along for the ride.

  149.  #149Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 4:07 pm

    FW – I have been…I will keep doing it…doing that is what has led to him not talking to me for 24 hours cos apparently I should be apologising rather than walking away…I feel okay and get the pressure gets too much – that’s when I come on here and it all comes ouT!

    I will keep doing it Im going to do everything I can do to keep feeling good and being happy and he can do what he chooses and i’ll be nice to the new person – if B decides to not to be then so be it

  150.  #150Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 4:08 pm

    and then the pressure…not get

  151.  #151April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:10 pm


    There is no urgency here. Mmm. Breathe…..

    You may need several days/weeks to sink down in your body, feeling into how you really WANT to feel. Allowing the possibilities.

    I have shut down to possibilities, settling for what I have. For years. And now I am waking up again. You and I are waking up together.

    I want to set my sights higher. As a siren, I want to be adored. And I know something is moving in that direction, because I am beginning to feel adoring feelings for my own deep feminine nature.

  152.  #152April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:12 pm

    Feeling. I like to think of it as an art.

    Three years on from discovering Rori, and I see how much feeling there is still inside me waiting to be discovered.
    I feel delighted to be walking this path of discovery.

  153.  #153Sophie on January 22, 2014 at 4:14 pm

    and yes maybe different responses still…mmmm…pondering…

  154.  #154April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:21 pm


    I know how helpless-feeling and draining it can be sharing living space with a resentful man.

    I had to sink into frightening helpless feelings many times. Not pleasant. Not comfortable.
    Yet necessary, I’d say.

    When I finally gave up trying to influence him out of his awful withdrawn absence (while in the same room), and took my focus and thoughts off him ENTIRELY, was when the turnaround slowly began.

    I would encourage anyone NOT to skip over feeling how powerless and crazy it makes you feel. Sink into those feelings, sister. We are here, your sister sirens, and you are not alone.

  155.  #155Shannon on January 22, 2014 at 4:23 pm

    Yes, yes, I will listen again to reconnect! I have it, and I’ve only listened a few times. I transferred to Siren… but I think reconnect needs a revisit, thank you FW!

    And yes, you are right. I don’t need permission! In fact, that feeling was what landed us here to begin with.

  156.  #156Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 4:25 pm

    Colbie Caillat’s song Bubbly has been in my head all day. 🙂

  157.  #157April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:28 pm

    Standing on the other side of the room, facing the (withdrawn, resentful) man. I take a leaned-back position, palms up.
    I smile. He glances up, then away.
    I continue to stand there, feeling vulnerable, longing for connection. Feeling the pain in my heart.

    I promise myself not to speak unless he speaks first.


  158.  #158April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:35 pm

    O yeah…
    I promise myself not to speak. He doesn’t speak. I go away and do something nice for myself.

    Eventually…. I don’t stand there any more. I don’t try to initiate connection. I surrender, and carry on with my own life.

    It’s up to him now.

    I’m guessing he needed space with all my thoughts and energy off him. He came back. And acts more adoring every day.

  159.  #159Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 4:37 pm

    Kyla: 🙂 you are making me smile, girl!!!!

  160.  #160April Rose on January 22, 2014 at 4:38 pm

    I gave up control. Wow.

    I couldn’t make him connect with me. It took a long time for me to surrender and accept what was.

    Since then, my feminine side has deepened and blossomed.

  161.  #161Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    I just a text about a potential date for this weekend. Or maybe its for a group date (meet up thing) I’m not sure. But I met him last weekend at another meet up. I was attracted but then there were some things that made me feel a bit unsure and I started to feel weird. Like at first he was very flirty with me and came up and plopped himself down next to me on the bench in a very bold manner. I liked that. But then after a while he started to pay less attention to me and more to his friend that he came with. She made a point of letting everyone know that they were just friends. So when he started flirting with her though I figured he wasn’t interested. I left the event early and he asked for my number but I chalked that up to him knowing I’m new to the area and wanting to introduce me to some fun meet up groups. Didn’t really think I’d hear from him though. Kinda excited because this is the first guy I’ve felt attracted to in a whole but also hesitant because of the hot/cold way he was acting. Thoughts ladies?

  162.  #162Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:44 pm

    Yayy April Rose. It’s lovely to witness the transformation.

  163.  #163Kyla on January 22, 2014 at 4:49 pm

    Go and practice Liquid Light and have fun!

  164.  #164Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:50 pm

    Maybe him flirting in front of you with her after flirting with her is him showing you the type of man he is or where he is in his life? Maybe just in a place where he is enjoying his freedom and not necessarily actively looking for something serious or committed. Maybe she knows that and doesn’t want to get looked over by other guys because she knows he will flirt with her in public?

  165.  #165Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:52 pm

    I’d ask myself why would I feel excited about a guy who blows hot/cold. What are the thoughts going on inside you that might lead you to feel excited.

  166.  #166Femininewoman on January 22, 2014 at 4:53 pm

    What about him that caused you to feel attraction?

  167.  #167Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 4:54 pm

    hmmm, FW, what you wrote really resonates with me. I think I started to feel weird for a reason and what you wrote perhaps nails it. He’s pretty newly divorced….hmmm, interesting.

  168.  #168Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 4:57 pm

    i’m not excited about the hot/cold part and that’s when I started to not feel attracted. But initially I was attracted to how bold and masculine he came across and that he was v flirty with me. He was fun to flirt with and he’s sexy, very manly. But then I got turned off when he started flirting with her and was surprised that he asked for my number…I dunno, maybe I should try to be open if I do see him but cautious at the same time…is that even possible though? hahahahah!!

  169.  #169LoveAlways on January 22, 2014 at 5:54 pm

    love it!

    “152: April Rose says:

    Feeling. I like to think of it as an art.

    Three years on from discovering Rori, and I see how much feeling there is still inside me waiting to be discovered.
    I feel delighted to be walking this path of discovery.”



    I love love love this!


  170.  #170Lisa on January 22, 2014 at 6:32 pm

    I’m having a rough night… not feeling good about me now… trying to love the me that isn’t always calm and collected and doesn’t always know exactly what to do… and does things b/c she doesn’t know what else to do…or the me that back slides….. in default..

    the me that forgets and doesn’t always act evolved…

    I’m feeling deflated and worn down tonight… having a hard time accepting this part of me… that means well but doesn’t always do well…

    Having a hard time being under someone else’s thumb financially and being controlled by them b/c of it….. being in checkmate all the time…. knowing that this game he plays “he will always win” ( my ex).

    I want to throw my hands up! and not need to try and get out of it…and not need to control even any minute amount of anything…


  171.  #171Cupcake on January 22, 2014 at 7:23 pm

    Hi, Sirens-

    Emerging from my 48 hour hiding-out from the world, I had a really good day today.

    I have two preliminary job interviews set up, one for Friday and one for Monday. The Friday one is in New City, and I don’t think I am that interested in it. I mentioned it a few posts ago- it’s a long commute and working for a female boss who’s described as “Type A” and “demanding.” The salary is way under-market for what they’re asking, so I told the recruiter not even to put my name in for the job unless they were willing to come up. I didn’t hear back from her, but I got a call from the HR department of the company today, so I guess they’re willing to go higher. It’s STILL too low for what they’re asking…but it’s a “temp to perm” position for 90 days, so…I don’t know. There’ s an employee gym in the building and the Type A boss brings her dog to work. So far, those are the only things recommending the job! 🙂

    The other one would be a telecommuting job for a company I used to work for. (At about the same money, I work in my pajamas without a demanding Type A boss looking over my shoulder. In fact, the boss would be a boss I had 15 years ago, who I respect and like. And if I get the telecommuting job, I can move if I decide New City isn’t the right place for me.

    So—the ball moved forward on the job front today.

    Also, I spent the day running around with my friend Kyle, who doesn’t have a car and had some far-flung errands to run. I said I’d drive him, so that I had a reason to leave the house and wasn’t alone for the entire day. It was really fun. He’s such a nice guy.

    Then I went to meet a girl I met last week at the gym, and we hung out for a while after working out. (I am fixing her up with Kyle, as they are about the same age…ie much younger than me!)

    And my ex-boyfriend from 25 years ago who is now like my brother called and checked in with me, telling me a funny story. He has been calling multiple times a day to make sure I am okay. (Just FYI – He is happily married, and his wife knows he does this. She considers me part of the family, and invites me for holidays, etc, sometimes.) I am so lucky to have friends like this. On the flip side, he was THE WORST boyfriend. I mean, award-winningly bad, if they gave awards for these things. Slept with several of friends, total jackass. I’m not sure when he turned into a nice guy.

    And I guess the other thing- Lord Voldemort emailed. It was weird. I was sound asleep, sat up in bed, reached for my phone at 4:04 am. There was an email from him that arrived at 4:02 am.

    He said knew I was disappointed about not going to his country to see him, but he hadn’t wanted to hide anything from me, and that this thing with the friend who declared her feelings for him had happened out of the blue and still hasn’t sunk in entirely.

    He said he doesn’t want to throw away our “close affinity.” That he’s still the same person and that he doesn’t want to stop talking to me.

    I walked around with that for most of the day, and then tonight I answered him that I didn’t know how I feel, and I need to sit with my feelings and figure it all out.

    I said, “You are the same person…it is the world around you that has changed.” I mean, if he’s somebody else’s boyfriend now… Here I am getting cast as the beloved little sister again.

    Which is funny because the person who’s little sister I actually AM (my sister) doesn’t like me very much at all. I wonder if that’s why I keep doing this, ending up the beloved little sister in my relationships.

    I have an appointment to talk to Rori-trained Coach Caro tomorrow, who is AWESOME– and I’ll talk to her about it.

    I know that I have to tell Lord Voldemort I can’t be his beloved little sister. I know this is my opportunity to do things differently.

    Anyway. The other reason this was a good day is that, according to the scale at the gym, if you lock yourself in your apartment for 48 hours and don’t eat anything but about 20 almonds, apparently you lose 5 pounds. It’s probably all water weight, and it will probably reflect that tomorrow, but it was still nice to see numbers lower than I’ve seen them in years. I kept getting off the scale and back on again. Jiggling the weight mechanism. Squinting at the numbers. I wanted to high five myself.

    So now I have to sign off and go try on clothes that used to be tight and see how they fit now.

    Oh, and the final reason it was a good day today is I froze my OKCupid profile last night, and so for the first time in weeks I haven’t looked at the parade of Humpty Dumptys it offers. Hooray! Free at last, free at last! Of course I’ll have to go back to it eventually (sigh) – but what a delicious relief, to imagine there are better men than what shows up on the website.

    Your insights are most welcome.


  172.  #172Cupcake on January 22, 2014 at 7:29 pm


    How are you liking your new job? The pink lipstick one?

  173.  #173Cupcake on January 22, 2014 at 7:31 pm


    WHERE ARE YOU?? I am wondering how you are.


  174.  #174Cupcake on January 22, 2014 at 7:41 pm

    #168 Liquid Light

    Sounds like a perfect guy to practice on! Maybe he is Circular Dating too!

    Have fun!

  175.  #175Liquid Light on January 22, 2014 at 8:52 pm

    Thanks cupcake and kyla, I might give that a try! 🙂

  176.  #176Lisa on January 22, 2014 at 11:56 pm

    I can’t sleep it’s 2:30a…..


    I feel helpless when someone is more powerful than I…. and I don’t like that feeling… of being helpless……

    Being vulnerable can feel good and it can also feel very bad…. violence… not being able to get away, being a rag doll in someone’s hands…

    I don’t like feeling helpless… tears, tears, coming….. it’s safer for me to have some control or sense of helping myself… an escape…

    Violence is scary….

    I want so bad to be able to be completely vulnerable to a man and stand there feeling all that I feel and know that it is safe…

    crying feels so good… release… being open…

    I was thinking today how much I just love men…they are such amazing beings… ( crazy making at times) but amazing beings….

    I feel safe so much more than ever in my life, b/c I trust me…. and yet there is still a splinter in me that pops up at times…around safety and I think it makes me guarded… and I attract guarded…

    I’m an enigma… for sure…

    I wish I had a man to stand in the room with my palms up and feeling all that I feel and watch what happens…

    Men are so sensitive… to so many unseen things.. we as women project… it’s just amazing to me… how they do it…

    Society has taught men to not feel…. but no one really knows that society has also taught women to no feel also…. and the journey begins…

    I don’t want to be hurt…… I’ll do TheWork on that… see where it takes me…

    I think it will take me to a place where I attract men that I won’t be hurt by b/c I won’t fall for them that deeply… hummm and how scary is it to really put myself out there… vulnerable, feeling, sensual me out there… and find someone that I might just fall for that deeply… take the chance of getting hurt…

    I’m breathing deeper now…. the anxiety is leaving… I feel peaceful now.. accepting of myself more… loving the me that isn’t perfect… isn’t always on top game… isn’t always evolved… and isn’t always calm….

    sleep… sleep I hope….


  177.  #177Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 4:13 am

    Okay, so here’s my strange question for the day.

    Have any of you taken pole dancing lessons from an actual stripper?

    I’ve found a strip club about an hour away… I have been thinking about this a lot, and I would really love to learn pole dancing from a stripper…

    But seriously… do you just go into the bar and talk to the girls? It isn’t that I wouldn’t have the courage to go in there, it’s more that… would they teach me? Or am I going to make a complete ass of myself?

  178.  #178Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 4:29 am

    Lisa, was it you who said “being under someone’s thumb financially”?

    I’ve struggled with that. It is part of what ended my relationship with J… maybe even a central part of it. I really didn’t feel right working when I had a small child, but money was this continual argument for us.

    Since all of this began, I’ve gone down into despair because I don’t have a job yet. I’ve even felt judged by Rori because she goes on a lot about being financially stable, yourself, or don’t try to be in a relationship. Yet at the same time, for me personally, it felt RIGHT to be a stay at home mother, especially after K was diagnosed.

    This has been my turn around for it. Perhaps it will help you, perhaps it won’t… but if your ex (I think I remember that’s whose financial help you need) gives you money, it’s easy to feel resentful. Personally, it felt like a SACRIFICE to give up working, and I hated that part of it.

    So this is an area that, for me, has needed major healing. Not only around men, but around the censure of women, too!

    I’ve chosen now to focus on gratitude. I remember long about doing The Work and something I just couldn’t get beyond was “I need more money”. Yet through all this, I haven’t done The Work again on it… I HAVE, however, done a feeling affirmation, “I feel rich.”

    Perhaps it is that which has allowed me to realize that I do not NEED MORE than what I have. (Desire more? Yes, NEED more? NO!).

    If you are in a home of any kind, and you have computer access, and you get to take a warm shower each day and feed yourself… you do not NEED more. Therefor, you and/or your ex is A GOOD PROVIDER. Your life is great compared to most on this planet, by virtue of the luxury of a roof over our heads.

    At the end of the day, the best way to switch this around and to mend your relationship with your ex so that it feels less painful is to be so appreciative and grateful about this. He gives you money. He provides. This is him dragging the wildebeaste home and grunting and shoving it at you. Don’t tell him that it annoys you that you didn’t get the wildebeast on your own, or allow yourself to be mad that he grumbled while he delivered it–don’t allow it in yourself!

    Thank him. Thank yourself. Affirm that you FEEL GRATEFUL. Affirm it to both of you. Yay, you have a wonderful provider–if you didn’t, you couldn’t be here talking to us. He’s fantastic, whether it feels icky or not to depend on someone else, at least the person you have to depend on is coming through enough that you still have a roof over your head and you don’t actually NEED anything more.

    Desire helps motivate us, but sometimes it can cloud our vision and make us believe that’s need… when it’s really just desire. And when it pretends to be need, we can develop resentment around it.

    J is a good provider. I haven’t been grateful enough of that. I’ve allowed arguments to overcome my gratitude, and desires to masquerade as needs.

    Maybe you aren’t doing that, but I suspect that you have at least some resentment towards him for the need to be provided for by someone else.

    He’s doing a GREAT job of it. Maybe he would do even better if he knew that you appreciated him for it. And I mean beyond the lip service. If you want him to FEEL YOU (and you do), then you have to affirm your own feelings when they are what would support your relationship with him (even if financial is the ONLY relationship you do have).

    I don’t believe a job is necessary. I don’t believe that depending on our man is as bad as our society tells us it is. But it’s a fact that it can FEEL BAD if we let it do so. It can FEEL GOOD if we affirm gratitude, instead, though.

    I refuse to accept the belief that I’m less than because I don’t have a job that brings in this or that amount of money. I choose to feel good because there’s a man in my life that’s an incredible provider. I attracted that, and I can choose to appreciate that if I want.

  179.  #179Femininewoman on January 23, 2014 at 6:16 am

    Shannon there is no way you can make an ass of yourself by asking a question. That can happen only in your own mind if you allow yourself to think that.

  180.  #180Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 6:20 am

    You know what’s feeling so awful about this?

    I feel like it’s not a win no matter which way this goes with J.

    I feel such terror that he will hear my desires for a relationship and say yes… and equally terrified that he’ll hear them and say no!

  181.  #181Femininewoman on January 23, 2014 at 6:22 am

    Shannon talk to your fear/terror. See where it is in your body. Put your hand on that body part and talk to the fear. Ask yourself what am I afraid of?

  182.  #182Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 6:28 am

    Abandonment. Or that if I don’t take this chance now, he’ll abandon me when I’m even older and it’ll be even harder to find someone who won’t abandon me.

  183.  #183LoveAlways on January 23, 2014 at 6:38 am

    Good Morning Sirens:

    Did some life uncluttering this morning! I called ALL of the catalog companies and requested to be removed from their mailing lists! How freeing it felt. I DO have control over my mail box!

  184.  #184Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 6:39 am

    Oops, that if I don’t take the chance to leave and find a new man. I realized my last comment might not make sense, lol.

  185.  #185Dominique on January 23, 2014 at 8:38 am

    Shannon – These two reminded me of you. It may help you look at your situation in a better feeling way.


  186.  #186Dominique on January 23, 2014 at 8:39 am

  187.  #187Shannon on January 23, 2014 at 8:55 am

    Dominique, thank you.

    You know, I believe he IS capable. Maybe more than capable, lol. I KNOW that he’s a good man, a very decent man, and definitely a man who wants to please me in every possible way. He’s certainly not perfect, and I do feel afraid that he’ll drop back into withdrawing.

    I’m listening again to “reconnect your relationship” and I’m on CD 4… and she is talking about what to do when he turns around and he’s coming back towards you.

    She says she was scared when it happened to her. She wasn’t prepared.

    Even though I’ve listened to these multiple times, I think this was the first time that statement really clicked into my brain.

    He DID just turn around, granted with an attitude of, “Maybe i’ll let you come back, but only if…”…

    And I feel scared. I feel hella scared. It’s like Mat Hussey said in one of his videos… you’re sort of following along behind someone. They suddenly stop and turn around, like BAM!… and what do you do? Duck your head, turn around, and run for the hills, lol!

    I feel like that right now. Like, Here I am being all Sireny in hopes of him noticing it. Then he lifts his head, and his eyes meet mine, and he zeroes in… and I’m all… “Oh sh…! Oh my god…! Uh… run away. Run AWAY! HE SEES ME! Wait, wait, what do I do? If I run away, will he just chase me? If I stand still, will he catch me? OMG! AAAARGGG!”

    Back to the CDs, cause it’s true–I feel terrified! Oh dear!

  188.  #188Veronica on January 23, 2014 at 8:57 am

    FW – 103 – That’s such a good idea – thank you for suggesting this and reminding me of the options available. I went to photograph a beautiful Turkish mosque today – and the men were so courteous, it was such a pleasure to be around them.

  189.  #189LoveAlways on January 23, 2014 at 9:36 am

    I just took myself on a date to a local museum I have always wanted to explore. The thought hit me, and I just went! I took a break out of my day and spent an hour enjoying the exhibits and being in my own positive energy. It was exhilarating! I “checked out” from the hustle and bustle of business to have a feminine moment. There was an exhibit that expressed that we live in different worlds simultaneously based on the things we do and commit ourselves to in our current lives. I am living in five worlds right now, just based on the things I do. Something to think about. And yes, this is part of my higher vibration CDs! Going places where like minds gather. Not to meet anyone in particular, but to cross paths and experience and interact. It was a new experiment that I enjoyed. I also got some inspiration for my own artistic work. Going to make a big project – a curtain! I’m so excited! All this from one lovely detour in my day . . . I will certainly do this more often!



  190.  #190Femininewoman on January 23, 2014 at 10:28 am

    Doing something new or doing the same thing in a different way is a way of creating new neural pathways in your brain. Is what I heard yesterday.

  191.  #191Lisa on January 23, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    @Shannon #178 <3 <3

    You know that does bother me too!… b/c not everyone can just jump right on out and get a job to be financially stable… If I put my child in school, along with all the issues of that in itself, then I'd not see her but 2hrs a day and that wouldn't be but eating bathing and homework… she would not see her father at all during the week…

    and then have either of us some of the weekend… so it is a choice that my ex and I made for this for our daughter.. I work my butt off! I do have a job! and a very hard stressful one… I just don't get a paycheck…

    My ex ( and I never want to go back to him) does provide… I am grateful…but get tired of him being resentful b/c I can't pull blood out of a turnip…. I'm not superwoman or a genie…

    I have my own business and I do run it… but it is hard to make it when my time is so tight.. I used to stay up til 3am and get things done… but I can't it anymore it is not healthy for me to be that strung out..that isn't loving myself…that is overfunctioning

    I will try and shift it to a vibe of gratitude..and some days I do! others I'm not so grateful! . I just hate having my ex dictate to me what I can have and can't do… he controls the money… I don't get a check…

    as for not being "Dating" or "Marriage" material b/c I don't have a "Job" well Rori might be right… and I might be alone for a very long long time… and that makes me want to vomit… cuz that is just a societal generalization that a woman should be able to do it all!!! and be a mother… it shrinks down being a mother to a slave labor… it makes mom's look low and worthless… to live in a society where if you don't work and make money, AND be a great mom and take care of yourself…. something is less valuable about you!!

    When if we even look at that sentence it makes someone tired even saying all of it… how impossible is it to do all those things really!!! and have a sexy body and act feminine all the time and keep your vibe up… and always feel your feelings… and I do a pretty good job… with what I do

    I get really upset with all of that pressure to be it ALL so you can have a man …. I don't get it… I do keep myself fit and I'm very sexy ( men's words not mine) and I'm attractive and youthful, calm yet strong in a feminine way ( I just got told this at lunch) and still it is hard to keep everything going… and then that all sounds overfunctioning in itself…

    Dominique has told me I don't have to be perfect for the right man, and I also believe she mean that I don't have to make lots of money or have a job that gives a paycheck either… I'm so hoping that is right… b/c otherwise, I'm going to be a lonely old woman…just b/c I chose to raise my child and actually See her and be with her, instead of give her to someone else to raise…

    Sorry all this just flooded right out of me….

    Thanks for the trigger!!!


  192.  #192April Rose on January 23, 2014 at 12:32 pm


    You can be it ALL. You are already.

    You are 100% Lisa Siren.

    No need to DO anything beyond accept and believe that you are 100% yummy woman pie.

  193.  #193Dominique on January 23, 2014 at 12:33 pm

    Lisa – 191 – “Dominique has told me I don’t have to be perfect for the right man, and I also believe she mean that I don’t have to make lots of money or have a job that gives a paycheck either.”

    Yes this is exactly right. Case in point – Me – Not only was I quite the hot mess when K and I got together, only two weeks out of my house after an over twelve year marriage) and not yet divorced, I was not making it financially.

    I’ve been working steadily before, then, and now, and K healed right along with me and thus the relationship was able to become what it is now, and it continues to grow in wonderful ways. Even now, though I work hard doing what I do, and I’ve been doing it a long time, helping women with their relationship and personal problems, there’s no way I could support myself with my work, and K is more than okay with this. I DO contribute in many other ways though apart from making a difference in my little corner of the world.

    Here is something to consider – If you were a dynamic career woman, where would you have the time to nurture your goddess self? Where would you have the time to simply BE which is what much of this work is about. Goddesses/Sirens are BEing FEELing creatures. Try to remember this next time you’re asked to be a type A woman.

    There is no such thing as perfection by the way. Your quirks, foibles, idiosyncrasies are what you make you even more lovable than you already are and endear you to your man.


  194.  #194Lisa on January 23, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    @Dominique After I posted that post, I got all shakey! Fearful! and nervous… I literately am shaking so hard my hands can’t type…..

    I was frightened to be so vulnerable and blunt about my feelings… oh goodness this is hard to type while shaking so fiercely…

    and then I read what you typed and tears came… down… so it is possible to be a mom, and biz owner and not make much and contribute in lots of other ways ( growing veggies and putting them up for winter, barter with massage etc.) and still be suitable for the right man…. that feels good… to read….

    I do my siren-y stuff.., I might not get the floor vacuumed…

    If I was a dynamic career woman, I’d pay someone to clean my house and pay a sitter so I could go out on dates…but I’d still want to grow my veggies and other things I like that make me ME…

    Oh my! Wow… your story is wonderful! Have you thought about writing a book about it?


  195.  #195Dominique on January 23, 2014 at 1:22 pm

    Lisa – Yes, yes, and yes it is. I have written a lot about my story. Some of it can be found in my articles, and some is in my ebook.

    Sending you much love.

  196.  #196Lisa on January 23, 2014 at 8:34 pm

    I can’t seem to get to the new thread??? Humm I’ve tried several ways to get to the blog and all of them just lead me to the monday’s post… what happened to the post about Tina and the 7days steps?


    @Dominique that’s wonderful!

    I feel so much better tonight…. I did TheWork on “If I was ready he’d be here” and it was amazing!

    I realized what I’ve been doing b/c of that thought ie reading all kinds of books, blogs, newsletter etc.. trying to make it so I was ready for him… and he’d come…

    what I realized is in the process of all this, I’m focusing on “him” whoever that is… and not focusing on ME.. and being with ME present with myself… and I realized that is what is missing … being with myself……living my life fully and passionately … for me…

    So, I’m feeling very free and focused on me tonight…


  197.  #197Lisa on January 23, 2014 at 8:41 pm

    @AprilRose <3 <3 Thanks so much!!!!


  198.  #198Confused on February 5, 2014 at 10:29 pm

    So what do I do if I’m married and I feel like my husband is ignoring me? I’ve tried talking about my feelings but it doesn’t work.

  199.  #199Rori Raye on February 6, 2014 at 10:33 am

    Confused – your situation is so common and classic – please, please consider getting my Complete Collection (less expensive than ONE session with me) – AND – as soon as you’ve got at least the Tools from the ebook down and practicing constantly, get some private coaching from one of my Certified Coaches to get you through this fast and turn things around – really – this might be VERY EASY!!! Certified Coach Directory over in the sidebar…(likely, you’re not using Feeling Messages correctly and need a bit of guidance…) Love, Rori

  200.  #200Lynne on February 11, 2014 at 11:18 pm

    Correct! Focus on what you want and all will follow.