Marry Smart?

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ringI followed a comment thread about Susan Patton’s “Marry Smart” for a bit, and started to weigh in…and then realized we’d all be better served if I wrote it here and opened up a discussion!

The book Marry Smart isn’t about being smart about getting married – it’s about marrying a “smart” man.

The concept is: You’ll never find a bigger, better pool of available, smart men as you will in college – and so you’d better figure that into your plans when you’re young and there.

Sigh…So sad we’re still in this conversation at all.

All of us reading about it, writing our thoughts…

Here’s a comment on the blog that stood out to me (perhaps it’s because “Damain” is a man, and I generally don’t allow men on the blog at all…). I experienced him as kind of hitting a lot on the head…(Here’s what Damian wrote:)

“I am gay so maybe that’s why I don’t understand. But I don’t know WHAT it is with women that they get like this. I am perfectly willing to admit I don’t want to be alone, and I don’t see what’s wrong with someone else mentioning it’s desirable not to go through life alone and it’s a good idea to try to reel one in.

OK, the way she puts it amounts to requiring women to be rather pushy about the whole thing, interfering with their ability to play hard to get. Women seem to want to PRETEND to be contemptuous of relationships, perhaps because they are not and it’s a point of insecurity for them. It’s considered undignified to be man crazy, desperate, and trying to hook one in because your biological clock is ticking and you want to have BABIES NOW!!!!

Might it be that characterization is often closer to the truth than many are willing to admit? And then, out of defensiveness, many women feel an obligation to try TOO HARD to come across as NOT THAT DESPERATE so it comes across as a little forced sometimes?

After all, the way it works, some can argue, if you try TOO HARD and too defensively to make sure everyone knows you AREN’T THAT DESPERATE, maybe that is only proof that you ARE THAT DESPERATE! What’s the saying? Methinks the lady doth protest too much!”

 What Damian’s saying, to me, is that it’s so hard to be “cool,” and “not desperate or needy,” and “hard to get” (a GENUINE High Degree Of Difficulty) – when you’re actually feeling just the opposite.

So it’s easy to get caught up in pretending – which comes off as inauthentic.

And that’s how we get into trouble.

I kept writing about:

The very fact that someone writing this stuff (Susan Patton writing an apparently poorly written book) could get SO much media play, and SO much interest from the rest of us.

We must want to talk and argue about it – and yes, that’s true. We do.

I didn’t become aware that I wanted to be a mom until I was three years away from being “too old to do it physically” – and it took everything in me to stay not desperate on the inside, for real.

And we didn’t have online dating, then, so I always feel grateful for connecting with my glorious, smart husband.

Conceptually – knowing what you want, setting a vision for it complete with timeline sounds like plain old good planning. And – when it’s matched with romance, love, children and cliches – it feels dicey.

Unfortunately – the two pulls in our lives are directly opposed.

One is to focus on our careers, our dreams, our adventures, with as little “have to” or encumbrance as possible.

The other is to feel “settled,” in love, taken care of, culturally “in place” and – “married with children.”

If you have lots of money – it’s possible to get enough help to do both – and even wealthy women are opting to be “stay at home mothers” because, otherwise, if motherhood is high on your list – you miss a lot of the fun if you’re working a lot of hours.

Some dreams aren’t so well meshed with others, and timing doesn’t always mesh dreams together well.

And that’s how Susan Patton gets famous. We read, we complain, we talk – because, at bottom – we are all terrified of the unknown – whatever stage of life we’re in – and that we’ll, somehow, never “put it all together.”

And then, that fear creates a sense of urgency. And that sense of urgency clings to us like a bad smell.

Many successful women have said they now wished they’d had their children young, and then gone on to focus on their careers once their children we’re more independent, in school, off to their own dreams.

Many stay-at-home moms mourn the demise of their dreams of accomplishment and fulfillment in the world of work.

Some women get both – by plan and by chance.

What are your thoughts about “strategy” in love?

Love, Rori




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  1.  #1Femininewoman on May 8, 2014 at 7:56 am


  2.  #2Femininewoman on May 8, 2014 at 8:15 am

    Strategy feels “bleh”. Too much energy, too much thinking, work etc. Like trying to convince a man that might not even be worth his salt because of being driven by the desperation.

    I myself was focussed on my career/education when I was young. So when the man messed up I just kept on my horse. Yes I wish I had children earlier but realistically I know I would not have been able to do the things I have if I had them. So no I have no regrets. A lot of people my age have grown kids while I have teenagers. I am enjoying them and getting to consciously teach them about relationships.

  3.  #3Azure Blu on May 8, 2014 at 12:01 pm

    Rori thank you… timely post. sorry if you’ve heard this before from me… :-))

    In the past year
    i have been struggling with my feelings
    of being in a HUGE time crunch.

    I am 62 and kept having a nagging feeling in the pit of my stomach…
    I would follow the feelings down but
    I couldn’t seem to get to the core
    of what the feeling truly was.
    When one fine day
    I realized (It was such a BIG deal I didn’t want to show this feeling the light of day)
    I was petrified of getting older
    and not having a committed, forever relationship
    with a loving, kind man!!! :-0

    in my mind “TIME was RUNNING OUT!!!”
    As Rori teaches…
    Love that feeling, hold that feeling gently and tenderly in your arms.

    Magically after using the Rori tools
    this feeling got smaller
    and my clingy, neediness
    (which obviously was showing up while I was dating) made way for ME LOVING ME MORE…
    even My fear of aging alone.
    Now, even more, I can be my authentic self with men (and everyone) no matter what age they are…
    In an openhearted, kind Powerful way!!!
    Rori’s stuff is sooo awesome!!

  4.  #4April Rose on May 8, 2014 at 12:33 pm

    Wow, Azure Blu

    My heart feels melted. I feel your vulnerability and it makes me relax and feel strong.

  5.  #5Azure Blu on May 8, 2014 at 1:32 pm

    YOUR own PERFECT timing!! :-}

  6.  #6Azure Blu on May 8, 2014 at 1:34 pm

    I feel so good about what you said…
    (((Thank you)))

  7.  #7Mandy on May 8, 2014 at 4:56 pm

    I SO feel triggered with anger. J put up an argument when I asked him to taper more. I thought he was doing 3-4 drinks a night when it’s more like 5 or 6. I feel he’s trying to get away with more than I want him to like a child and it fills me with anger and I’m certain he can see it. Maybe I should just cart my butt down to Al-Anon.

    This is very hard and I’m trying to be strong and stay under control but I feel stressed with anger right now because he’s acting like a kid. So frustrating.

    I will be exercising hard later to get it out of my system…

  8.  #8Cupcake on May 8, 2014 at 5:28 pm


    Al-Anon helped me a lot once when I was with a guy who started drinking heavily.

    Have you gone to meetings before?

    It just sounds like you have the same conversations with him, over and over. I feel bad for you in this situation.


  9.  #9prplpsn28 on May 8, 2014 at 6:42 pm


  10.  #10Mandy on May 8, 2014 at 7:10 pm


    Thank you for letting me know of the redundancy, because I am too close to the situation to realize it sometimes. I do have a lot of the same conversations over and over, and I can come up with ideas to handle it differently.

    Another idea could be, I can say hey, this much beer per this amount of time, and if you run out during the allotted time, it’s not my problem, and if he gets mad and gives me problems, I can probably go do something with a friend or my mom or something. That’s one thing. But usually he drinks at night as we are both night owls, and thankfully I have an older female friend across the street who is a substance abuse counselor, who said she’d shelter me if I needed it, just to be away from the situation.

    Does that sound okay? I just want to make sure I’m making healthy decisions here…

    Al Anon sounds good though because as my friend said no woman should have to do this by herself.

  11.  #11Tereana on May 8, 2014 at 7:15 pm

    Hm, wow. I don’t know much about dealing with an alcoholic partner. Somehow, “acting like a kid” sounds like it would be par for the course. Is there a way to make it a team effort instead of you being like “the momma” telling him what to do? I don’t know, like a drinking game where you drink one non-alkie drink for every alcoholic drink he has. AND, he needs to take a non-alkie drink in between, too. Make it like a game. And how about this – if you’re comfortable – for every non-alcoholic drink he takes, you remove one piece of clothing. Like strip poker, but with juice or water. But he doesn’t get anything for an alcoholic drink. Rewarding good behavior. What do you think? Would he go for it? Lol

  12.  #12Tereana on May 8, 2014 at 7:23 pm

    What really stood out to me about this article was what the guy said about trying to not look desperate. I’m pretty sure that I do this, and I mainly try hard to convince MYSELF that I’m not desperate or feeling the clock ticking. And that’s mainly because I cannot control the passage of time. But I do feel that maybe, just maybe (or definitely) this contributed to tension with S. See, he is adamant about not having children. He even talked about getting a vasectomy so that we wouldn’t have to worry about birth control. But the truth is that just the idea made me sad, not happy. And I told him I was sad for his sperm…

    Anyway, it’s like I said before about not wasting my time having sex “for fun.” It’s not really fun anyway, if it’s not “going anywhere.”

    I still think he was over the top. I think he was foolish and ridiculous and created a lot or unnecessary strife and tension. But he is sensitive, as am I. Which means I can’t really mask my true desires, even if I want to. I would still always want children. And I’m not willing to waste years of my life on someone who doesn’t. What’s crazy is, maybe he thought I would do that? Because I really wouldn’t. I want to tell him: don’t flatter yourself, buck-o. Anyway. Lol

    I’m getting some sleep tonight. Doctor’s appointment tomorrow. It feels good to rest…zzzz

  13.  #13IamHis on May 8, 2014 at 7:27 pm

    I feel shy as always! I feel a little nervous but I want to write this out and get some input. It would also feel good to know I’m not alone in this, not a “bad person” for being this way, and that I can move forward towards healthier attractions. I feel so judgmental of myself and it would feel good not to feel judgmental of myself.

    I have…almost an addiction to taken men. Someone with a girlfriend or fiance, specifically. I don’t feel right or good being interested in a married man, so I try not to even let me heart go there when I notice a married man noticing me.

    (I’ve recently had an extremely difficult time with a married man at work. He’s beautiful and extremely hard-working and lonely and we have common interests and spend a lot of time together and confide in each other. We’ve had so many tense moments because we both want to do the right thing, but we both have such a pull towards each other. I feel angry about it, because I’m like, why can’t I have this kind of relationship/attraction with a single man? I feel so guilty and awful but I know we’re both strong because we avoid each other at various times when we’re feeling “weak with attraction” towards each other. that might sound weird, but he’s a good man who would never cheat on his wife and I’m a good woman who would never be “that girl.”

    and I feel scared writing about this because I know this is a sensitive issue for so many people and I’m not saying I’m immune to it at all, I’m just trying to explore the things that I want and need to heal in myself and the kind of men I’m attracting who likely want and need healing too.)

    The thing is, I don’t feel afraid of taken men. I feel afraid of single men. I do. I feel afraid.

    It actually turns me off when someone I’ve been interested in, even for a long time, suddenly realizes that I’m interested in him too and starts acting all excited and eager.

    It seriously turns me off and that feels so bad and so wrong.

    I feel afraid that once single men get closer, they are going to “find me out.”

    “Oh, you are ‘this way’ when I thought you were ‘that way.'”

    “I thought you were so cool but now I see that you’re just really messed up…”

    “You’re not who I thought you were…”

    I have all these fears of men saying these things to me even though they never have.

    The fear of not being good enough.

    I flirt.

    I love keeping men guessing.

    I love watching them stare at me, I love seeing them nervous and unsure around me.

    I love the uncertainty.

    I love keeping myself a mystery to them.

    There’s such a huge part of me that doesn’t want to be known.

    I feel scared that if I ever let a guy “know me” he’ll lose interest.

    I lose interest once I start seeing a man’s flaws.

    I tell myself that story that HE’S “not good enough” for ME or…my huge ego, more accurately.

    Feeling kinda sad…:(

  14.  #14Kyla on May 8, 2014 at 7:39 pm

    (((IamHis))) We usually are attracted to unavailable men because we fear real intimacy. Its fun and exciting but not deep and loving. And/or we love the powerful feeling it gives us of being so desirable that we can steal away a taken man and it gives us a self esteem boost. I’ve been there honey.

  15.  #15LoveAlways on May 8, 2014 at 8:01 pm

    Wow Rori, I feel speechless on this one. How do you make such a choice? such a strategy? Love is love. But following your dreams and your path is fueled by your passions. I just can’t fathom choosing. My answer: I’d find a way to do both.

  16.  #16LoveAlways on May 8, 2014 at 8:06 pm

    Honey, that pull, attraction, meeting of souls . . . basically happens with married men or men living with kids and women . . . it’s their vibe when they are unhappy. The flirting, attraction, closeness to another different woman, the taboo, the guilty trip, it’s the typical MO! You are in a good space questioning this and feeling your feelings. May I suggest you give yourself some serious SPACE emotionally, physically, mentally and which ever other way you can from this situation. Continue to figure out your feelings and go deeper. You need the distance to get out of the fog. I’ll warn you ahead of time the draw is strong and hard to resist. ((((HUGS)))

  17.  #17IamHis on May 8, 2014 at 8:08 pm

    Thanks, Kyla. I can honestly say I’ve never really experienced deep and loving and it makes me feel sooo sad.

    It also makes me feel sad when I see a guy (especially one I knew I could have had a chance with, or one that I ran away from, or one that I flat out rejected) show deep and loving actions and words towards another woman.

    I feel angry. I live my full, wonderful life and feel happy most of the time. and that’s when I get noticed. and I never have any expectations because I’m simply not expecting to get noticed.

    and then I have to go “okay, I’m being noticed. what am I supposed to do?”

    and I usually just kind of run away because I feel so embarrassed or scared or angry and nothing has even happened I just had a guy that i’m actually attracted to show an attraction to me and I can’t even handle it.

    I feel embarrassed and stupid and angry.

    This beautiful stranger seemed mesmorized by me at the store. and the attention felt so good but I couldn’t remember what to do.

    so I just let him hold the door open for me and let him stare at me and while the attention felt good, I just kind of ignored him because I felt too foolish to even open my heart up and just allow a basic interaction to take place.

    God, I feel sad.

  18.  #18LoveAlways on May 8, 2014 at 8:10 pm


    “I tell myself that story that HE’S “not good enough” for ME or…my huge ego, more accurately.”

    Truth is it is not about him at all. You deserve a man of your own, You deserve better. You deserve a man who is clear of being in a relationship already and claiming his misery, unhappiness, etc.

    No blame on him. Focus on you. You are doing a beautiful job working through your feelings on this.

  19.  #19IamHis on May 8, 2014 at 8:12 pm

    Thanks, Lovealways. 🙂

    It feels so good to get support from other women. I’ve recently realized that I have a really hard time with other women; trusting them, opening up to them.

    Issues with my sweet Mom who is healing and who I am so proud of…

    PS – what does “MO” stand for? 🙂

  20.  #20IamHis on May 8, 2014 at 8:17 pm

    @18 Lovealways – in that particular quote, I wasn’t talking about the married man, I was talking about general single guys in my past, and why I talk myself out of being with them, letting them see me, accept me, or allowing myself to see and accept them for who they truly are.

    does that make sense?

    I’m kind of all over the place…

    I love and accept that about myself, though.

    it feels artsy and free. 🙂

    also, thank you for being so sweet and for your input. It feels sooooo good!

  21.  #21Mandy on May 8, 2014 at 8:28 pm

    Tereana, I will consider that. Don’t wanna be his momma! 🙂

    A game…hmmmm…..

  22.  #22Mandy on May 8, 2014 at 8:31 pm

    Only thing is Tereana, he’s not interested in seeing me naked right now because he has NO drive whatsoever, he feels icky about himself because he’s an unemployed alcoholic but we’re doing everything we can to change that.

    I will also keep updated here on what goes well as well. I have a problem of only speaking when bad stuff happens…lol…

    Maybe I could reward him with brownies? He loves those when I make them…seriously no kidding he really really appreciates them!

    Brownies or cinnabon rolls…reward…lol…

  23.  #23LoveAlways on May 8, 2014 at 8:43 pm

    Modus Operandi

  24.  #24Veronica on May 8, 2014 at 8:47 pm

    A few days ago, I could sense how much life there was to live and this amazing unfurling feeling in my chest happened – I was opening up! That felt magical/awe-inducing.

    I was replying to OwlCD – and noticed in myself that again I was not content with how I was communicating – then a palpable shift to a deeper level and I felt like I was having a connection/conversation that started to feel tender, soft, beautiful to me, I felt like I was growing into my sirenness in seconds.

    I thought back on the day and realised that I had some precious moments. I didn’t realise it at the time because I was unhappy about wasted time, feeling antsy – I’m ready to let go of my perceptions of what a good time should be because there are amazing things happening.

  25.  #25LoveAlways on May 8, 2014 at 8:47 pm


    Yes, it makes sense to be all over the place 🙂
    You are processing!

  26.  #26Veronica on May 8, 2014 at 9:00 pm

    Interesting article. Feeling shame about my neediness causes me more anguish than embracing and loving and being open with my neediness (yeah this means so much to me right now, a relationship is a good I want for myself – because I love myself – and I would like to be there now but circumstances I can’t quite understand yet are preventing me from being in the big love I know exists). Sometimes my ‘neediness’ signals that I’m not in a healthy relationship.

  27.  #27CurvySiren10 on May 9, 2014 at 5:46 am

    Mandy, I feel so uncomfortable reading about J and his drinks. I don’t know a lot about alcoholism but I do think you should look into Al-Anon for support and ideas. I do know some about addiction and I can tell you that telling what to do, how much to drink etc. will NEVER solve his issues. If anything, I feel like it will only make him more rebellious about the drinking and less attracted to you as a romantic partner. I know it comes from a place of caring, but this is not how addiction works. Rewards with sex or brownies or anything else just isn’t enough if he doesn’t TRULY wish to stop. Deep down. Just my 2 cents…

  28.  #28Andrea on May 9, 2014 at 6:12 am

    Oh the tales of the single gal in online dating world.

    #1. I’m having fun. : )

    The first day I put my profile up, I wasn’t aware of all the quirks of Plenty of Fish. I went through profiles of men and pushed the “flirt with them” button. And it turns out that function automatically sends an email to the man saying, “Hey there.”

    Talk about ugh. Well many men responded back, but two men stood out to me, so I continued contact with them. Both of them needed constant prodding from me to continue conversations with more than just, “Yep.” Or “I’d like that.”

    They both started messages each morning but they were just… “good morning.” Nothing for me to go on.

    One man messaged me his phone number. I messaged him mine and told him he could call me. We planned on meeting at a little cafe that was doing an impromptu gospel concert. He didn’t show up, he texted me that he was sick.

    Fine, shrug of shoulders, I had a nice time anyway. Then he texted me mundane texts for the next two days. “how are you?” “I’m going to the market to get cough syrup” “I coughed a little at work today but am feeling better.”

    Yesterday afternoon he texted me: “So what have you got going this evening?”

    I felt a little excitement.. like maybe he was going to ask me out.

    I texted, “Oh I feel nice hearing from you. I’ve got plans til seven but after that..?”

    He texted me back with a list of tv shows he’s gonna watch.

    I was like.. oh ickiness. This guy actually lives and works less than 8 blocks from where I live. (He doesn’t know where I live but he told me where he lives.) And he’s so freaking boring. And he just wants a texting relationship.

    I texted him: “I feel extremely bored and blase’ about a texting relationship. If you’d like to get to know me, you can call me sometime after 10 pm so we can have a decent conversation.”

    He said, “I don’t stay up that late.”

    Oh icky ickiness!! I feel sick to my stomach that I gave him any attention at all.

    I delete all his info and just feel so grossed out by that whole exchange.

    The other guy didn’t even get as far as sending me his phone number. He’s still messaging me boring one liners through they POF site. But he would complain if he saw I was online but didn’t message him back. LIke.. “Hey.. where are you?” You there?

    I finally told him: “I just feel very bored and not at all excited to respond to someone who didn’t read my profile and doesn’t want to hold a conversation.”

    And his response was: “What? Well you contacted ME first. You wanted to get to know me first. I’m just answering you.”

    Ugh ugh ugh.

    Those are my two worst case experiences. But I’ve had eight really really great connections. All messaging, texting, and phone calls.. but it was after I went back to POF, changed my profile all around and stopped reaching out First!

    I took Kyla’s advice and I feel way better.

    I wrote on my profile that I like engaging in conversation, but that meeting face to face was the best prize of all. So if they feel like rising to the challenge, here’s a little quizz for them.

    Then I put a few questions for them to answer. And I left it at that. Plus my pictures are pretty fantastic.

    Then I logged out and only logged back in a day later and I had many responses, and narrowed it down to 7 who really answered my questions and showed they wanted to put some effort into meeting me. Now that feels way better than pulling teeth…

    I’m the same woman, but the tweaks in my profile, and the not making first contact have made a huge difference.

  29.  #29Andrea on May 9, 2014 at 6:37 am

    Yay! I just got asked out for a date tonight by one of the top eight. But I said I feel more comfortable having a few days notice for a first date, so he countered with, “What about lunch on Monday?”

    That feels so good.

    Well, here’s another story. My first night on POF I was contacted by a man who is out of search fields. He is six years younger than me and lives about 40 minutes away. He’s stunning to look at. Well, his pictures are.

    He messaged me, I messaged back, etc…
    He sent his phone number, I sent him mine, we started texting back and forth. He sent me pictures of himself… HAWT!! And asked me to send pics of myself.

    I texted: “Oh I love taking private pics of myself but I would never send them via text or online. They are for private viewing pleasure between me, and .. perhaps one day, a man I know and trust and have a relationship with.”

    He said he understands. More texting through out this week. I got bored of the texting and stopped responding. He texted that he misses me and asked why I stopped responding.

    Me: I feel good about our texts and messages back and forth, but I feel more interested in getting to know you as a real person. Put a voice to the pictures. You may call me after 11 some night.”

    He texted a couple of texts to me about how he wanted me to initiate phone contact and how does he know that I’m interested in him if I expect him to continue to reach out first.

    I didn’t respond back. I reasoned that I told him, call after 11, and if he wanted to talk to me, he would call. If not… no biggie.

    So finally, after 11 last night, he texted me: You still up?

    I didn’t respond. He texted again, “Listen, I don’t want to just call and wake you up. Please respond if you’re awake.”

    I texted back: Hi. I feel surprised to hear from you.

    Right away, he called. And we talked for over an hour. sheesh. We just gabbed about so much neither one of us realized the time was going by so fast. Finally I had to cut it off.

    I gushed to him: Thank you so much for calling me. I feel 100 percent more interested in you than I did with just the texting.

    He was like..Well, you know. I knew it would make you happy. I really like to hear your smiles through the phone.

    That was a nice experience for sure. I definitely feel my confidence building the more I really decide for myself that I’m willing to stay in contact with those who make me happy and who make me feel relaxed and valued. Any others… I am learning… why am I wasting my time?

  30.  #30Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 6:40 am

    Wow! Awesome Andrea! I feel excited to hear more about your adventures!

  31.  #31Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 6:58 am

    It sounds like to me… you have such a kind and caring heart that needs to be focused on YOU!! :-))

    I do agree with Curvysiren 27
    “I do think you should look into Al-Anon for support and ideas.

    I do know some about addiction and I can tell you that telling Him what to do, how much to drink, playing games etc. will NEVER solve his issues.”

    He can only stop His addictions because HE Wants to not because of what anyone else says or does!

    I’m wondering…
    Does He feel like Your addiction?

  32.  #32Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 7:00 am

    (((Mandy))) Do you have Rori’s Toxic Men program? You are dealing with an addiction, this man is is a relationship with alcohol. I would get to the library and pull all the info on co-dependency you can find and go to every al-anon meeting.

    The number one thing I’d stop doing is trying to control, cajole or influence his drinking in anyway.. You are actually enabling him and at the same time giving him someone else to blame for his problems. Bad behaviour means he doesn’t get your attention, at all, you walk away or ignore him completely. Good behaviour means he gets to spend time with you. The only reward you should be giving him is your time and attention when he’s earned it. That’s how I treat everyone.

    The only person you can change is yourself. The only behaviour you can control is your own. I know you want to help him but he’s the only one who can help himself, he’s got to want to and he’s got to do the work. In the meantime you need to take care of you and put every ounce of focus on yourself. I’ve lived with addictions too and I just want to wrap you in a big hug and get you to start satisfying your own wants and needs.. be his inspiration not his caretaker. Sending you love and courage.

  33.  #33Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 7:01 am

    So fun to hear about your online dating adventures!!
    Yay YOU!!!

  34.  #34Tereana on May 9, 2014 at 7:10 am

    Mandy, yes, I think sheltering and getting yourself out of the situation temporarily could be helpful. Without you there, he may notice what he had to do. He may not. But you give him the option.

    And I agree that al anon can be good, too. It’s group support. And it can be helpful to be around people who are going through something similar…

  35.  #35Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 8:41 am

    Iamhis #17
    Darlin’ siren…
    How vulnerable you are here with us…
    so sweet, courageous and tender sharing the heart of YOU!!
    Thank you for trusting us with this part of you… :-}

    I too have struggled with NOT wanting a anyone to really see me…
    so I focused on overfunctioning and giving
    and then getting angry
    because they weren’t reacting (to alllll of my giving) like I thought they should
    and pulling away…

    I have learned through the Rori tools
    I was TERRIFIED of closeness or intimacy – I am still a work in progress but am MUCH better.

    You, iamhis, are on the road to MORE intimacy
    because YOU have seen and shared with us
    your fears and battles…

    Dominique says some powerful things in her blog post:

    Small quote from her post
    “And the more you discover and uncover who you are inside there, what YOU like and don’t like, what YOU want and don’t want, what YOU feel and don’t feel, how amazing and beautiful YOU REALLY are in there, the easier it becomes to be this real and vulnerable being.”

    “You will find that others will be inspired by your courage and will begin to reveal themselves to you in turn.”

  36.  #36Mandy on May 9, 2014 at 8:45 am

    CurvySiren10 – 27 I understand why you feel uncomfy about the situation. It is a slow and painful process to detox, but his doc told me everything we are doing is right and to taper really slow with beer. I think I have come a long way here…staring the fear he might leave me if I laid down some rules. So far he’s fine, but I do feel the resistance of pressure. I agree with you pressure never works, I know because I am one person who also runs at the first sign of being controlled!

    Azure Blu – 31 – My addiction? Well, there’s a co-dependant thing that’s going on here. I was feeding his addiction and he…well, to be honest, he cooks me dinner, snuggles with me, kisses me a lot, tells me I’m pretty and tells me he wants to be the person I need him to be, so that’s all good, but I can’t quite say he’s my addiction because there’s not much to be addicted to right now, there’s no sex because he’s sick. Usually if I know I’m addicted, I’m addicted to their energy but mostly the sex. I can sa I am addicted to the scent f his hair, his hugs, the way his skin feels…holding his hand…I feel I am very invested in this and I need to fix it…I made my bed now I’m lying in it as it were. He’s doing very well, it’s just sometimes I get frustrated with him.

    Kyla – 32 – I do not have the Toxic Men program as I am disabled, on SSI and get about 721 dollars a month to split between two people to live on. But I KNOW I NEED IT BAD and have been pining for it for the longest time. I admire and appreciate your words very much and especially the hugs, but I have to sheepishly confess, I feel *really* triggered hearing the word “enabling”, because I am helping him taper, helping him get off the drug; Being as I am the breadwinner at the moment, I have to buy him beer to do this, or he could go into Delirium Tremens, possibly seize up and end up in the hospital, I know this from talking to his doctor and substance abuse counselors, taking abnormal psychology classes in college, and and I really, really don’t want or need that. As a team, we are working really hard on it. He is going to CODAC, the doctor, and church several times a week and doing everything he can. As for me, I looked the demon in the face and said no more, this stops, but it has to stop gradually. I’d like to think this is a huge step for me, and feel great about it, instead of constantly feeling awful about the enabling, because the tapering is necessary to keep his body, and it certainly won’t last forever. I know he wants this sobriety and I’m letting him do it by himself aside from actually buying the beer for him to taper with. It was a mistake to tell him what to do with the tapering the other day and that’s probably why I felt angry.

    Good news is, the drunken arguments have stopped, because he’s only having enough to keep the DT (shakes and sweats) at bay, and he doesn’t act all desperately emotional either. Thank goodness, that was awful when he would do that, being sh*tfaced.

    SO…all in all…I suppose there’s addiction to him in me, I mean if I can’t admit it outwardly and it feels like there might be a little, then there’s some.

    Al Anon seems like a unanimous vote here, and also, I realize opting out is better than telling him what to do (meaning leaving to go do something fun.)

    Ah…I might have to give up the rest of my extra money this month to start the Toxic Men program because let me tell you ladies….I am the QUEEN of being attracted to Toxic Men. I need to go find that article in which Rori mentions House MD and how Cuddy is addicted to him and they are co-dependant.

    I hope I can do a month trial for free. If so thank goodness for that (Or thank Rori!)

  37.  #37Tereana on May 9, 2014 at 8:46 am

    Andrea – fun adventures! Def reminds me if online dating. Lol

    But here’s my experience: ok. So we find a guy who wants to please us (that’s what guys do, right??). And then what? A man pleasing us can feel great. But it doesn’t have to mean anything. Case in point: S. He loved pleasing me. He loved doing things for me. But he was never “going anywhere” with that. And I knew it. I was just enjoying myself. In the end, he probably felt taken advantage of. Which he was, pretty much. I used him, with no intention of taking it any further. But that was only because he made it abundantly clear that we weren’t interested in the same kinds of dating.


    I STILL think that he reminds me of me. A lot. With the exception of his relationship goals (or lack thereof) he tinds me of myself, except older, and male.

    So he taught me a lot. He held up a mirror and what I saw was NOT pretty. But it’s also not the complete picture. It is just certain parts of me that I know I need to work on, in order to be the best I can be in relationship. Why it ever mattered to him is still beyond me. But he’s got his issues. And one if them is, he thinks he’s got it all worked out. He thinks his method is perfect, he’s great at relationships, and there is nothing about himself or his life that could be changed or improved. And yet, this is just arrogance. And he can project that onto me, but it’s not true. I am constantly learning, growing, evolving. Because I want to. Because I know it can help. Because I want to believe that things can be different.

    He has simply given up. On himself. On life. I won’t give up. It may not be pretty right now. It may be a lot of things I don’t like. But I won’t give up on myself. I won’t give up on love. And s person like him can never take that away from me.

  38.  #38Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 9:10 am

    (((((((((((((Mandy))))))))))))) I’m so sorry for my poor choice of words Mandy and I didn’t mean with respect to the tapering which I understand from your previous comments is under supervision. I meant it more as you being in charge and trying to manage this situation, it allows him to give responsibility and blame for his problems over to you which he is already doing with his addiction anyway..

    please email me kylacodenameawesome[at]gmail[.]com

  39.  #39Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 9:11 am

    So GOOD to hear you are NOT going to give up
    on YOU!!!
    YOU are the BEST thing that ever happened to YOU!!! and to us
    and to the Universe!! :->

  40.  #40Femininewoman on May 9, 2014 at 9:14 am

    Andrea I love it. I like to hear your smiles. Woohoo.

    Only the 11p.m. timeline I don’t like. One never knows what they read into that late night contact.

  41.  #42Andrea on May 9, 2014 at 11:04 am

    Oh I so agree with you FemWoman # 40. I do need to find something else that works, but on weeknights, when my daughters are home, I find it so hard to concentrate on a phone call.
    I want to be 100 percent present with them, and then I need relax time for myself after they go to bed, and then I have time for a phone call from a brand new man. heh.

  42.  #43Andrea on May 9, 2014 at 11:19 am

    Tereana, I feel like I’m missing something… I’m not understanding what you’re saying in your post.

    “A man pleasing us is great, but it doesn’t have to mean anything?”

    For me, all of this, dating, kissing, loving, relating.. etc… it’s all about what it means TO ME. I feel happy that I’m happy. When a man shows takes an effort to know me, or to please me.. I only take it in that moment. It’s only about that moment. It’s not about him, it’s about… right now.. I’m happy. This feels good.

    And in the next moment if I feel good, and he’s the one there helping me feel good, that’s awesome as well. It’s up to him to continue the pattern of being present with me in the feel good moments, cause I’m determined to feel good. If he’s not the one there with me, then someone else will be.

    The men, including my ex, and my other CDers.. are, at this time in my life, not making themselves present in my earnestness to express joy, so other men are filling in to take their places.

    I guess I’m not looking for it to mean anything from their perspective, that’s their business, not mine. I don’t analyze or attempt to get into the psyche of the men in my life. That’s their business. I don’t care WHY they do a thing. I care that in the moment they do it, I feel good.. or alive.. or blushing.. or turned on.. or ecstatic.. or laughing.

    Cause if I don’t feel happy, if I feel icky, then I’m going to try to figure WHAT it is that’s making me feel icky, and then I’m gonna ask… “Do I want to feel icky?” And if the answer is no, then in that moment, I’m going to get away from that which is making me feel that way.

    Life is too short for me to sit in feelings that I just simply don’t want to sit in. Especially if getting out of those feelings is as simple as getting away from a man.

  43.  #44Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 11:24 am

    Liquid L #192 from previous post…
    Darlin’ siren
    I agree with Kyla
    “Take your time…”
    Sounds to me like he didn’t want to burn any bridges to you… and genuinely did want you to take time and figure stuff out. :->
    And maybe… (his fingers crossed) you’d contact him when you are feeling better!!!

  44.  #45Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Azure 44, Thanks. His response made me feel a little angry because I didn’t feel heard. But then again, pretty much everything makes me angry recently. 🙁

    Maybe I just need to get laid, its been too long! hahahaha!!!!

  45.  #46Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 11:54 am

    Liquid Light go get laid!
    What happened to all those boy toy candidates? 😉

  46.  #47Femininewoman on May 9, 2014 at 12:36 pm

    RE 46 Kyla I so disagree with you. Though I also realize fun was intended

  47.  #48Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 12:38 pm

    Liquid L
    Yessss those boy toys are calling… :-}

    “It’s been a Long, Long, Lonely Winter”

    Spring with the longer days, warmer weather, and Less clothes
    ALWAYS makes ME hornier!!!

    Last night I had a WONDERFUL picnic with
    CD- MN…. a man I feel may be able to have a deeper relationship than the other CDs so far…
    Sooo romantic..
    We went for a long walk on the wooden walk way through the springtime forest with a creek running beside us..
    It was 78 outside (the warmest day of spring so far)
    The sweet smell of crab apple blossoms,
    new bright green leaves budding on the trees.
    Warm breeze from the south on our skin.,,
    We talked, ate, drank wine and talked…
    I played in the water
    I hadn’t really let him kiss me until last night…
    MMMMMmmmm… he had great kisses!!!

    HE can definitely handle more emotional connection etc. and so
    I am feeling VERY uneasy because
    I have never let myself get really close
    to a Nice man!!!
    This is a new Journey into me staying connected
    not getting angry
    and pushing him away…

    How do I feel when I’m with him?
    Warm, secure and
    scared (of opening up and feeling true intimacy!!)

  48.  #49Femininewoman on May 9, 2014 at 12:41 pm

    A male friend post of FB

    When a man truly loves a woman she becomes his weakness. When a woman truly loves a man he becomes her strength. This is called Exchange of Power

  49.  #50Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 12:45 pm

    hahahaha Kyla, they’ve all disappeared/I”ve chickened out!!! I’ll keep an open mind though …who knows???

  50.  #51Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 12:48 pm

    wow azure 48 sounds great!!!

  51.  #52Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 12:52 pm

    FW #49
    Ohhh this is good… I have pasted and copied,,,

    Liquid L ~:-))

  52.  #53Helena Hart on May 9, 2014 at 1:12 pm

    IamHis – 13 – I could really relate to what you wrote, and I want you to know that it’s TOTALLY possible to completely turn this around!

    For me, Circular Dating was the key to uncovering my patterns turning my own love life around. I learned to stop making “instant chemistry“ a requirement and started paying attention to how I felt about MYSELF in a man’s presence.

    As I started feeling better about myself, more and more high-quality available men started showing up – and I found that I was now attracted to this type of men too!

    The more I did this, the more I began to get bored with and lose interest in men who weren’t available or interested in a real relationship.

    Hope that was helpful, if you’d like some help with this let me know!

    Love, Helena

  53.  #54April Rose on May 9, 2014 at 1:16 pm


    Please forgive me for weighing in on your situation. My intention is to be gentle and offer a perspective from an April Rose point of view!

    I heard a weird warning sound when I read this

    “Only thing is Tereana, he’s not interested in seeing me naked right now because he has NO drive whatsoever, he feels icky about himself because he’s an unemployed alcoholic but we’re doing everything we can to change that.”

    We’re doing everything we can to change that. Hmmm.

    Okay, so I’m loving it that you guys work as a team. And that’s great for things like housework and going out places and getting food ready etc.

    However, when it comes down to a man’s self-esteem, teamwork is out. There needs to be *him*, dealing with his problems, and *you* making occasional encouraging sounds.

    He is out of work. This is probably the single biggest factor in his depression and his drinking.

    Rori says, show confidence in his abilities. Do not try to help. A woman trying to help a man creates the worst possible feelings in him.

    Rori talks more about this in the Love Forever program.

  54.  #55Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    FW 47
    No problem honey!
    I had sex with 2 of my CDs when I felt I really needed it and I felt a million times better after. It was all part of my experiments to lighten up and see what happens 😉

  55.  #56Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    Kyla 55 – yeah, I hear you girl!!! I could def use some lightening up!!!

  56.  #57Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 1:47 pm

    Helen Hart 53
    So well put…
    This has been true for me now for about 4 months!!!

    “As I started feeling better about MYSELF, the more I began to get bored with and lose interest in men who weren’t available or interested in a real relationship.”

    For a year, using Rori’s tools, I couldn’t see how things were changing
    BUT sure enough now,,,,Life is much softer, gentler and AMAZING!!!

  57.  #58Dominique on May 9, 2014 at 1:51 pm

    Azure Blus – 48 – This feels so beautiful to read. I love it!!! YAY you!!!


  58.  #59Mandy on May 9, 2014 at 1:53 pm

    April rose,

    I can understand how I’d get super confused here. I’m trying not to be a nurse, but it is SO hard.

    He is gone to his class on how to get over addiction by himself right now so there’s that…and I have been showing lots of confidence in his abilities, telling him he’s awesome and I even gave him a card saying so after a recent success of his.

    I see your point here, this could turn into a “melding” situation instead of a relationship, and I know I hate the “melding” thing.

    I will need some meditation time to feel around this and see if anything comes up about ideas for how to remain me, while he’s being he, and not forcing any issues or mothering him.

  59.  #60Dominique on May 9, 2014 at 1:56 pm

    Iamhis – These two articles may help you…


  60.  #61Dominique on May 9, 2014 at 1:56 pm

  61.  #62Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 1:59 pm

    Dominique ~ Thank you for the encouragement!!

  62.  #63Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 2:00 pm

    Azure Blu Yay! I felt squishy good hearing about your date 🙂

  63.  #64Dominique on May 9, 2014 at 2:00 pm

    Mandy – 59 – I agree with April Rose here. This may help clarify things for you.


  64.  #65April Rose on May 9, 2014 at 2:02 pm


    I understand the stress that’s on you. Much more so because you live together.

    I imagine it would be easier and less painful for you if you had your own space.


  65.  #66Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 2:07 pm

    This is Soooo beautiful…

    “For isn’t this what life is about?
    Experiencing and FEELING ALL of it?
    Isn’t this what makes you YOU, in other words
    mulit-faceted, rich in experience and feeling,
    Your past hurts and traumas,
    your scars DO NOT detract from your allure,
    they only add depth and gorgeousness to YOU, lovely facets of awesome lushness.”

  66.  #67Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 2:08 pm

    Kyla!!! Thanks for that!!
    Yessss… squishy good… :->

  67.  #68Helena Hart on May 9, 2014 at 2:15 pm

    Azure Blue – 57 – That’s so great to hear!! 🙂 I’m glad you’ve also had success using Rori’s tools.

    I’ve found that you can see the progression of how you’re doing on the inside by the men who are showing up in your life.

    Love, Helena

  68.  #69Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 2:31 pm

    Kyla, on the topic of boy toys etc., I’m not feeling attracted to anyone right now except cute meetup guy. And I can’t even talk to him so prob not in the cards for us to have sex. I’m hopeless 🙁

  69.  #70Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 3:00 pm

    hahahaha!!! that was post #69!!! OMG…blush!!! LOL!!!

  70.  #71April Rose on May 9, 2014 at 3:01 pm

    Hey LL

    You can change that belief!

    And anyway, you don’t have to talk to him. Just smile. And keep your gaze on him. Slather yourself in love through the excruciating feelings!! And he will talk first.

  71.  #72Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 3:03 pm

    thanks AR, I was being sort of facetious sort of ackkk!

  72.  #73April Rose on May 9, 2014 at 3:04 pm


    Try it. When a guy looks at you with interest. Try heaping love on yourself while you feel the panic. And don’t turn away. You can do it! Be as you are, you don’t have to remember anything else.

  73.  #74Azure Blu on May 9, 2014 at 3:20 pm

    Liquid #69 :-}}
    boy toys~ # 69
    i’m thinkin somethin’ yummy just might be coming up…

  74.  #75Kyla on May 9, 2014 at 3:34 pm

    LOL I love it Liquid Light!

    I also love hearing about the silent tension between you and meet up guy. Sounds hot.
    I like to practice melting into my chair, relaxing my pelvis and allowing myself to feel turned on when I’m feeling tense and nervous.. its feels good and is very relaxing too.. add just a little bit of eye contact and I’m blushing and smiling like a happy fool 😉

  75.  #76Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 3:39 pm

    Azure 74 hahahaha!!!! LMAO!!!!

    Kyla, yeah, I’m enjoying the nervous tension too! Even if we never end up talking or having sex (hahaha!!!), its really fun to feel this way, so nervous around someone!! it makes me feel alive and silly and giggly and ridiculous and foolish and idiotic and girly and immature and weird and crazy all at once!!!

  76.  #77Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 3:57 pm

    I ended up having another horrible date last night through Its Just Lunch. First it was the cheap guy who doesn’t pick up the tab even though he suggested we have dinner (and not just drinks), then it was the gay guy, then last night, the guy alludes to having a really bad childhood involving abuse. He was super femmy and awkward the whole night. Yuck!!!

    I put my account on hold. The whole thing really creeped me out!!!!

  77.  #78Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 4:19 pm

    I guess the good news is that I got a lot of information last night, enough to know that there are huge red flags and not to proceed forward. So for that I’m grateful. I listened to Lauren Frances’s tele class yesterday (love her!) and her whole class about how the first date is all about getting a second date and not putting up barriers, being open and curious. And that the first date is all about the man and letting him impress you, and showing appreciation and approval. So that was my mindset going in and I think I was pretty successful at it even though it was extremely challenging. OK, I lost may patience a few times…hahahaha!!! But for me, under those circumstances, it was huge! So just trying to thank my lucky stars that he revealed himself to me, warts and all, and I only wasted one evening on him!!!

  78.  #79Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 4:26 pm

    the other things she recommends about first dates: don’t have an agenda, don’t negotiate or change plans, go with the flow, don’t challenge or compete with him, listen, etc. All very in alignment with RR!

    PS: this is more just for first dates, early stage, but later on when he’s “hooked”, you can be more high maintenance hahaha!!!

  79.  #80Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 4:35 pm

    sorry being a blog hog today

    the other thing she said is that you want to go in with an open mind so that he will feel comfortable revealing himself and not be guarded (if he feels like you are judging him) you want him to show you who he really is…

    This was huge for me and it worked last night because he really did reveal who he was

  80.  #81Waterfall on May 9, 2014 at 4:54 pm

    Hi Sirens, Just checking in..
    This post feels very appropriate..thanks Rori!
    Hmm… All these topics of desperation vibes, stratergies & co-dependency is really touching a nerve with me….

    Yet at the same time I need to love all my feelings of unworthiness, of ickiness, of not getting it ‘right’ and say ‘So what..?’ Who in the grand scheme of things really cares…??

    I have been thinking about D and what can I do to make the relationship work. And the truth is there is NOTHING that I can do, it will either work or it won’t. To me relationships are like your height – there is NOTHING you can do to control them. If you have good relationships it is as purely random as how tall you are….

    Ho hum….

  81.  #82Andrea on May 9, 2014 at 5:10 pm

    huh… something is in the air. Another man that I gave my business card to months ago texted me this afternoon.

    He: Hi Andrea, I haven’t see you out for Happy Hour lately. I kind of miss you. I was wondering if you’d ever like to get together and shoot the sh*t for a little while.

    Me: Well hello, I feel great and curious hearing from you. I feels nice to know you’ve been watching for me. I have to admit, I feel “bleh” about “shooting the shi*t”. But if you want to ask me out on a date, I would feel happy about that. I’m looking forward to your call.

    I sent it and with in two minutes my phone was ringing. I said, “Wow, that was quick!”

    He said, “Yes. I wanna ask you out, on a real date.”

    So we are going out next week. So funny. I like it.

  82.  #83Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 6:05 pm

    OMG!! I just accepted an onsite contract but the commute is like 2+ hrs each way UGHHH!!! I feel so nervous and anxious about it but I really like the company and the founder and the good news is that it could lead to a long working relationship since he has ongoing work. I just hope I survive the next few weeks!!!! ARGGGHHHH!!!!!

  83.  #84Luzydel on May 9, 2014 at 6:32 pm

    Today I had brunch with CaptainCD and it is funny the more in control I am of myself, the more he wants me. But i cannot be with a man the requires me to play games so he can keep his attractions towards me. I want a man that wants me even when he knows I like him too…

  84.  #85Millie on May 9, 2014 at 7:14 pm

    FeminineWoman 2- I love this. 🙂

  85.  #86Millie on May 9, 2014 at 7:24 pm

    IamHis 13– I feel similar in that I feel afraid that once a man gets to know me, he will lose interest. At least that is the pattern I have anyway…I feel most attractive when I’m unknown. I wish I could keep men guessing as you can. I wish I was better at flirting. I feel like crying tonight and cuddling in bed. I haven’t been kissed since January. I’m such a pretty and amazing girl, but it’s so depressing that men either don’t see it, or I’m not interested in the ones that do present themselves, because they are nerds or creeps. I just feel really sad about it all.

  86.  #87Tereana on May 9, 2014 at 8:08 pm

    Azure Blu #39 – thanks!! 🙂 that felt so special and warm to read. Aw… I’m blushing 🙂

    Andrea – what I meant about it “not meaning” anything was that a man can be really good at “giving” to is and doing things for us, and it may feel GREAT! But in the end, he may not have any kind of long-term intention. Maybe he’ll do that until he gets into our pants. Or until he thinks we are his girlfriend. This was partly coming from what happened with S. Even in the middle of him insulting me and saying horrible things to me, he offered to make me coffee in the morning. He offered for me to sleep in his bed while he slept on the floor. After I left, he asked if I had found a safe place to stay. I didn’t answer him. It wasn’t any of his business. My point is, it was in direct opposition to everything else he was saying. His caring gestures were just what? Rote? Habit? Automatic?

    I don’t know what. I jokingly suggested that he loved me – being flirty – and he laughed and said no way. He certainly was not expressing love. Not with words.

    And then, to contrast, with M, he was much more invested emotionally. He talked about marriage, what kind of kids we want, a future together. That was all important. And he certainly did a lot of things for me. But he often fell short on what would have made me feel really loved.

    I guess, where it really counts, is when the words match up with the actions, and there is follow-through. If any of those is missing, then it’s probably not going to create the best feeling for us…

    Does that make sense?

  87.  #88Tereana on May 9, 2014 at 8:10 pm

    LL – congrats!! 🙂

  88.  #89Tereana on May 9, 2014 at 8:19 pm

    I’ve written some letters to S. I haven’t sent them. Don’t know if I will. I like what I’m writing. But maybe it’s better staying as a draft. And in my mind. It feels good to concentrate on me. If I’m taking care of me then no one can really criticize me for not doing it. And then other things will bother me less. In theory, at least.

    Hm, just observing – I guess it’s important to me that people don’t criticize me. Just based on the language I used.

    I have a friend that used to be a very good friend. We had a sort of falling out over email a while back. It was years now. I don’t know why, I just thought of her. I’m often tempted to reach out and see if there is anything I can say to make it better. I’m not sure that there is. I think I know what I did to make her angry. But also, she made me angry. I don’t know if I was ever clear about why.

    And then, today, I saw another old girlfriend in the train station. Sure it was her. But I avoided her. She also did something that made me upset, many years ago. I never told her what it was. I just stopped communicating with her. And I haven’t heard from her since.

    So many broken bridges. I am not used to this. Is this what adulthood is like? People who you think are your friends become not your friends in an instant. Meanwhile, when you need help, suddenly, people come out of the woodwork who you didn’t even know cared.

    Everyone keeps asking me if I’ll move back to the Bay Area. It’s odd to me that that is their first assumption.

    I feel that people don’t know me well. It must be because I am not totally revealing myself to the world. How could I do this better? How could I be really “out there” so that the works sees me and recognizes me? And I can stop explaining myself. lol.

    Anyway, I’m rambling. Time for bed. Sleeeeepss….

  89.  #90Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 9:17 pm

    thanks Tereana! 🙂

  90.  #91Emerson on May 9, 2014 at 10:00 pm

    89 hi tereana
    I can relate to you about the friend thing. I’ve had very similar experiences.

  91.  #92Emerson on May 9, 2014 at 10:02 pm

    I think it’s possible to marry smart at any age…

  92.  #93Liquid Light on May 9, 2014 at 10:12 pm

    91 Emerson, me too! Unfortunately I can totally relate Tereana.

  93.  #94Daria on May 9, 2014 at 10:17 pm

    I’m totally strategizing… I plan on doing both. I put both VERY upfront and select for a man who wants to partner me in both… marriage and my dreams of what to do

  94.  #95Daria on May 9, 2014 at 10:18 pm

    Close CD (last man i got close to i forgot what i called him before if anything) told a friend to tell me he loves me

  95.  #96Daria on May 9, 2014 at 10:19 pm

    and when it Really works out she becomes his strenght and he her weaknes//most softness

  96.  #97Daria on May 9, 2014 at 10:32 pm

    Andrea you are such an inspiration for me here

  97.  #98Millie on May 9, 2014 at 11:45 pm

    Andrea 82- I love this too. It’s so great when you suggest a date and a man is into it too and calls!!!

    Deep down I felt scared to suggest I wanted a date because I was afraid the man would not want to go, that he wouldn’t be excited. I feel good that I finally spoke up to Mechanic, but it doesn’t feel good that he hasn’t called or spoken to me at all. I feel like I was placed on the back burner, his “maybe” earlier in the conversation said it all. Oh well.. bleh

  98.  #99RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 12:00 am

    Okay so… story time.
    Today when C was at my house, we were kissing on my bed… it’s been awhile since we’ve had time to be alone and to be passionate, and I felt wonderful. But he was touching me down there… and I just, I felt tears welling up.

    After a year of dating we decided to have sex. I was seventeen, and this was this past November. In January, we had a scare. The condom broke. I remember afterwards when we were laying there and he got up to take it off. I just heard him stop, and there was this silence. He turned to me with this really, really sad, scared, confused look on his face. I just sat up and looked at him, and I started crying. I cried that whole evening. My parents were out of town, and he stayed with me and made me soup. He went to the pharmacy and brought me back plan B. I felt really appreciative and impressed and glad for him, but I couldn’t stop feeling sad. I was so scared, even though I knew I wouldn’t be pregnant after the plan B, I cried that whole night. He left eventually because he had to be home, and I felt this overwhelming sense of loss when he walked out the door, even though he was saying he loved me. I realized I wasn’t ready for sex. I wasn’t ready for the consequences.
    We haven’t had sex since then…

    Also to add to this, me ex boyfriend from a couple years ago forced me to have sex with him. I thought I had healed from that, but after the condom breaking, all my worries and fears of abandonment came back so strong.

    Coming back to today… this happens a lot 🙁 it’s as soon as he enters me, it feels good, but then it triggers me, I don’t know how, every time it is different, but I don’t know what to do or how to deal with it.

    Although, today I think I expressed it better than I ever have 🙂 especially because today it wasn’t major crying or a huge feeling of sadness, it was more just I felt teary. Normally when this happens I completely shut off, and it usually ruins the love feeling moments for that day 🙁 but I asked him to stop, and wow, he kissed me so passionately and held me soo tightly. After I stopped feeling the tears come, I said,
    “intimacy feels really scary to me sometimes.” He asked why? and I said “I don’t really know. All the emotions it brings up inside me, and feeling so vulnerably close to someone”. then I said “but it feels really soothing to feel you hold me so tightly… and, in the end, I just feel really facinated by intimacy”. And I do. I didn’t really know what to say, but I’ve never expressed myself after my tears in this situation before. He responded so well, it brought joy to me to feel such a flow of love between us. As soon as I said those words, he just said, Ohh Claire!!” and he practically pushed me back onto the bed because he was kissing me and holding me so passionately. It felt amazing.

    It’s really late at night, writing this out may not make much sense, but it feels so good to just put my experiences out there. Thanks for listening sirens 🙂 also if anyone else feels the sudden urge to cry during passion, can you please talk with me about it? I handled it so well today, but I’m still sooo confused about it and don’t really know where it comes from. Thank you.

  99.  #100Daria on May 10, 2014 at 12:23 am


  100.  #101Daria on May 10, 2014 at 12:23 am

    im a great dancer! yay!

  101.  #102Waterfall on May 10, 2014 at 2:51 am

    Ahhh trigggers…

    Last night I went out with another guy friend & I felt so spoilt & loved by him. This man makes me feel AMAZINGLY special – although it is not romantic in the slightest. It’s more like a big brother friendship or even a fatherly friendship. He just spoilt me from start to finish & that was exactly what I needed.

    With him it is so east as there is absutely NO pressure – just pure friendship. I wish I could feel this relaxed and happy with someone I was dating.

    I think I like feeling spoilt !!! I like feeling that all my whims are taken care of…

    Yet interestingly this friend told me that in a romantic relationship he expects it to be equal and for the woman to pay her way. He said that if you don’t have that in a relationship then you run the risk of having a ‘sexist’ man who goes back to old fashioned stereotypes. I kind of got what he meant but I feel so confused about how to ‘be’ in a relationship!!??

    I personally don’t feel comfortable with a man paying for me (or anyone paying for me) unless I can in someway repay him.

    Anyway I’m waffling and I’m also thinking about D and the fact that things aren’t ‘perfect’ there and I’m wondering how to deal with all those imperfect things, and whether I should be dealing with all those imperfect things…?? Or whether I should say ‘no – this is not what I want’ … Hmmm I feel confused …

    I guess apart of me doesn’t know what D’s intentions are to me. Does he really want to be with me in a boyfriend & girlfriend way? Or is he just liking me because I am there and its someone for him to emotionally hold on to?

    I feel very apprehensive.. What would Roris advice be? To get out of his head??

    Ahhh triggers…

    I hope this all makes sense!

    I am still flirting with other men – and that feels great – but taking it any further just feels impossible…

    It seems the minute I get with a man, any man, I turn into a jealous, obsessive control freak and it is awful and it is stressful.

    I constantly feel like I am holding him back and meeting ‘someone special’. Even writing that makes me feel strange!!

    I’m thinking ‘Oh, he should be with that girl or that girl. He would be a lot happier than her than me’

    I start thinking ‘She would make him happy, she’s more fun, she’s more organised, more ambitious, more feminine, prettier, sassier, fitter, stronger’ Ohhhh the list just goes on…

    Yet in a friendship with a man I am as happy as larry, almost blissful. I don’t have to worry that theg are feeling fulfilled and content.

    It’s like I always feel like an outsider looking in on all the couples and their intimacy and relationships… Does that make sense??

    Its like I don’t ‘do’ relationship. Yet I really want a relationship!!?? Arghhh… Hmmm…?

  102.  #103Azure Blu on May 10, 2014 at 5:55 am

    Liquid L
    Wow thanks for sharing the advice that L Frances gives about first dates… it does have the same feel as what rori teaches…

    I felt interested reading about your date from It’s Just lunch…
    In 2005 I did a year contract with that service and was very disapointed in the men I met through there.
    I did meet one man that I had several dates with… but the rest were not interesting at all…

    I hope you have better luck.

    The last date It sounds like you did some practicing of being a siren and made the best out of the situation.
    Yay Liquid!! :->

  103.  #104Azure Blu on May 10, 2014 at 6:02 am

    You lovely, sweet heart…
    I feel soft and warm reading about your feelings you shared with C concerning physical intimacy…
    You were sooo authentic…

  104.  #105Femininewoman on May 10, 2014 at 6:27 am


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  105.  #106Azure Blu on May 10, 2014 at 6:28 am

    Also it sounds like C responded so tenderly to your feelings…

    YOU Should ONLY EVER have sex if YOU WANT to…

    I think it is good you are trying to uncover why you have tears and fear during intercourse…
    Have you thought about seeking counseling to deal with the trauma from the forced sex by your ex?

    But I know I can get very emotional (and cry) while having sex with someone I love…
    Sometimes they have been tears of joy and happiness when the love making has been intense or particularly warm and tender…
    Or tears of sadness when there has been a disconnect between me and the person I’m with…

    Love making for me is the intimate sharing of 2 people and IS very emotional!!

  106.  #107Azure Blu on May 10, 2014 at 6:41 am

    Wow I get these feeling too…
    “I’m thinking ‘Oh, he should be with that girl or that girl. He would be a lot happier than her than me’

    I start thinking ‘She would make him happy, she’s more fun, she’s more organised, more ambitious, more feminine, prettier, sassier, fitter, stronger’ Ohhhh the list just goes on…”

    I think they have gotten less
    since I’ve been slathering myself with the LOVE Potion and using the Rori tools…
    I want to follow these feelings and see what I come up with.

  107.  #108Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 6:42 am

    Thank you to everyone for your supportive comments on the previous thread. I’ve been very busy that last couple of days and am only now catching up on the blog.

    I have layers and layers of feelings to uncover, and I finally feel like I have the space to do it. Though some terrible things have happened, the feelings are very beautiful. I don’t know if this makes any sense to anyone. I feel in a very loving space with myself where just getting right with me is my first priority. Some things which baffled and confused me before are starting to make sense to me, and for that I am very grateful.

    I realize this probably doesn’t make much sense without context, but I don’t able or desirous of going into the details here. Just that I asked for clarity and for things that were happening in my life to make sense, and it came.

  108.  #109CurvySiren10 on May 10, 2014 at 7:00 am

    Indigo~ no, it doesn’t make much sense lol. But I wish you the best and am happy to hear that you’re in a good place with yourself and getting clarity on what you need clarity on. Lots of love xo

  109.  #110Femininewoman on May 10, 2014 at 8:10 am

    Love to you Indigo

  110.  #111Azure Blu on May 10, 2014 at 8:25 am

    ” I feel in a very loving space with myself where just getting right with me is my first priority. ”
    Sounds like a great place to be, girl…
    clarity is soooo wonderful.

    Be your Siren self!! :->

  111.  #112Andrea on May 10, 2014 at 8:46 am

    Millie 98 : ) I feel a need to clarify.. in my story, this is a man who has been chasing me for a while. I know without a doubt that he wants to be with me. All the Happy Hour flirts, and the way he missed me when I wasn’t there, and how he asked me for my phone number a month ago and I gave him my business card.

    I would never just suggest a date to a man.. just out of the blue. There is one man in my sporadic circle of pals that I definitely have the hots for. He has gone hot and cold on me several times. A while ago, I tried the “friend” route, where I suggest.. let’s go to this show as a group, and I always invited him. Sometimes he came, sometimes not. One night after a late bar concert, he offered to drive me home and he took me to breakfast and even kissed me in my parking lot, but after that… nothing.

    I have felt chasy and leaning forward with him. But he never reciprocated. He asked for my phone number once a year ago, but never called me. He sees me at dances, but never asks me to dance.

    Finally I got… Hey Andrea, he’s just not that into you. So, I stopped. I realized I was wasting a ton of energy on this imaginary personality and he didn’t even have the one characteristic that I like the most in a man… the most important characteristic that a man I’m going to spend energy on can have…. That he Likes ME and wants to put effort into being with ME. I realized, Oh my gosh, he’s really lacking in the most important aspect…. so.. I finally said.. “enough”.

    Of course, that was pretty easy for me because I was dating other men at the same time. But I realized there are going to be those men who catch my attention from time to time. And it’s a really great lesson for me to contain that attraction energy, that firy heat, inside of me. To radiate that sensual, slow burning, “want” from the inside out… and not pursue, or even talk, or even think about, a man who simply is not interested in me.

    Because there are just so many men in this town who are interested in me. And I’m going to reserve my energy, heat, and attraction, and curiosity for those men.

    It was a hard lesson for me, don’t reach out, but I think I’ve got it down now. The funny thing is, the better I become at this lesson, the more men are drawn to me. And I’m realizing, I would rather “go fishing” in the pool of men who actually like me and show interest in me, than wade fight my way through the waves in the oceans of men who are meant to be with other women.

  112.  #113Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 9:15 am

    Thank you very much CurvySiren, Feminine Woman and Azure Blu. Lots of love to the three of you x

    I may share the details at a later stage, but you know when something happens, which just provides that clarity on something that has been baffling you for a long time? When the penny finally drops and something finally makes sense to *YOU*.

    It’s a good feeling.

  113.  #114Liquid Light on May 10, 2014 at 9:34 am

    Azure 103 yes, its been pretty disappointing. That’s why I put my account on hold. Interesting that your experience wasn’t very satisfying either. But maybe after taking a break, the pool of men will improve.

  114.  #115Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 10:23 am

    Andrea 112,

    I always learn things from you, and I really learned something (which should be pretty obvious!) from your post, that is…

    That it’s ok not to make an effort for a guy who is not making an effort for you! It’s ok to drop the reins, shrug your shoulders and go fishing (or do your hair or what have you).

    There just comes a time when you just really do lean back for good.

  115.  #116Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 10:27 am

    That’s how I feel about Blue.

    I had a girls’ night last night (which was so much fun – we had a chocolate fondue!) but since seeing each other on Thursday night, he has not made a move to see me, and I’m just very like whatever.

    I’m not going to talk to him about it, unless the feeling comes up in the moment. I just can’t be bothered.

    I have assignments to do, other lovely things to do – I’m just going to live my life.

  116.  #117IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 10:45 am

    Reading what you ladies wrote and responded to…I feel soooo good and supported which feels amazing because I seriously felt so scared! Femwoman, loved the quote, Dominique, you are such a gifted writer, (((((((Millie))))))), Azureblue, April Rose, anyone I missed, thank you thank you thank you!

  117.  #118IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 10:48 am

    It would just feel good to write about this. I feel so scared and vulnerable again. I feel judgmental and scared of being judged. I have morals and beliefs and uncertainties and fears and shame and grief and hope and trust and love and courage all welled up inside.

    I just really need to write about him. Where someone, anyone can read it and understand, relate, connect, share, grieve, move on, process themselves.

    That’s why I’m here.
    For the community.
    I appreciate it so much.

  118.  #119IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 10:52 am

    I remember the first time I saw him. Instant attraction. When I ever I feel instant attraction, I always look at a man’s left hand. There was the ring.
    Okay. Not going there, I thought.

    We were at a meeting at work, and I was talking to a coworker with whom he worked/works with closely. She’s a woman, but there’s clearly no attraction between them.

    He hadn’t seen her in a while and was very friendly and a cool guy with her, asking her how she had been, etc.

    I was sitting there and kind of expecting him to introduce himself to me since I was new to the company. Everyone was introducing themselves to me and being incredibly nice, and he seemed incredibly nice, so yeah, I expected it.

    Even though he was close enough to touch, he would not even look at me. I knew right then, that he was attracted to me, and that he respected his wife and their relationship.

    This a good guy, I thought. Oh well, I thought. Good for him, I thought.

  119.  #120IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 10:57 am

    Well, as things would have it, we ended up sharing a tiny office.

    At different times, but still, the same office. With windows, and large desk…to share…

    Not even kidding. Big desk with lots of separate compartments and one chair. One chair to share.

    Always crossing each other paths…

    I respected him. He introduced himself and was warm and professional. He felt safe.

    He had just had the position I had this year, last year, and now we were sharing an office at different times.

    He became a mentor and was such a huge help to me. I thanked him all the time. I was really uncomfortable there at work at first, but he made it much easier for me to transition, because he took me under his wing, and everybody at work likes and respects him.

  120.  #121IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:04 am

    He has one picture of him and his wife on the wall by our desk, and tons of his two little children.

    I don’t put any personal pictures up at work. My little wall is all art and inspiration and work-related things.

    She’s beautiful and they are beautiful.

    and get this: she looks a lot like me.

    I was having a rough time. This position is extremely stressful in every way: intellectually, physically, and especially emotionally.

    I have a ton of people under me, and they rely on me, but I am still taking classes and learning about the profession and I feel so much resentment from them because of my position; the fact that I landed this position largely because of my personality, drive, and likeablity. and I’m still learning it, and it’s obvious to everyone.

    I felt extremely guilty about even landing this position.

    and on a personal level, I found myself in deep grief over another man again.

    I felt “left” again, and Married Co-worker caught me in some of my most vulnerable, emotional moments.

  121.  #122IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:09 am

    one of my favorite moments between the two of us came at an especially low moment for me.

    I had made a huge mistake, and my position was once again in question by one of my more vocal subordinates. They was about five of us in the office, and I felt so ashamed that my head was literally hung low.

    He looked at my subordinate and said, “hey, everyone messes up. and you don’t see a lot of what I’ve seen in her. She. is. awesome.”

    He said it with such authority and firmness that the other guy just kind of sighed and mumbled,

    “yeah. I know. you’re right…”

    That moment; as weak, stupid, inadequate, and insecure as I felt, it filled me with hope and security.

    I don’t know if anyone has ever done that for me when I was being attacked.

  122.  #123Helena Hart on May 10, 2014 at 11:19 am

    IamHis – 119 – I can relate so much to what you describe. I’ve written a lot about “instant chemistry” and feeling instantly attracted to men who aren’t right for you – men who are unavailable or who keep you at a distance. Perhaps this will help:

    Love, Helena

  123.  #124IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:42 am

    Thanks, Helena! I will make a point to read that in the near future…

  124.  #125IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:44 am

    anyway, time is passing. I started the job in August, but things didn’t start to get “weird” until October.

    One of my female subordinates had been watching us interact for quite some time.

    In my under-estimation of myself and the fact that I feel insecure a lot, I honestly didn’t even realize that anything “dangerous” was even happening between us.

  125.  #126RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 11:46 am

    Daria thank you for the hugs, xoxo

    (((Azure Blu))) thank you, and no, I have never tried counseling for this. I am seeing a physiologist for anxiety right now, and that after 6 months of the cognitive behavioral therapy I’ve been doing, it has become easier to find and feel my confidence! My point is though, I don’t think I can afford more than one counselor at a time. I’m not sure if counselling through the emotional trauma my ex caused me would help, but I feel open to the idea. I am so complemented that you think I sounded authentic, that means a lot to me right now:) Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings with me. It actually feels really good just to hear that somebody else has experienced crying during intimacy…

  126.  #127IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:50 am

    Anyway, my subordinate caught him helping me with something.

    I honestly didn’t even feel guilt or shame or weird or anything when she walked in, because to me, it was completely innocent and even necessary.

    He was helping me with some complicated forms on the computer that he knew how to fill out, and that I honestly was completely lost as to how to fill out.

    So, he kind of had his huge, gorgeous, strong arms around the chair and computer desk and was clicking at things on the computer to help me.

    We had started laughing about something, I don’t remember what, and she walked in and I smiled at her and was clueless that anything inappropriate was even going on.

    After he left the office, she stayed behind.

    “IamHis, he totally LIKES you.”

    I brushed it off.

    “Haha. Right. Too bad he’s married…”

    “Don’t be naive…” she responded.

    “these days, that doesn’t mean anything…”

    I felt myself tighten. I felt threatened, angry.

    “It means something to me.”

    I started to be a little more cautious after that.

  127.  #128IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 11:55 am

    well, at some point, things got weirder.

    He started looking at me…differently.

    Slower. Like he was trying to figure me out.

    It unnerved me a little.

    Why the sudden change? Why the curiousity?

    then the little comments started.

    He would apologize for leaving the desk messy.

    I would reply, “are you kidding me? it’s okay. have you seen the back of my car? You know messiness usually means a high intelligence…”

    and he would say stuff like, “my wife hates that I’m a slob.”

    or if I thanked him or complimented him, I would hear, “my wife would just call me an idiot.”

    Danger zone. I know.

  128.  #129IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:02 pm

    well, a few months passed and he started staring more.

    Looking at me intently.
    In the eyes.
    For a long time.

    I would look away quickly, secretly loving it, but feeling extremely guilty and unsure of myself too.

    Then, it was like he was noticing my body and what I was wearing. I never dress super-sexy, just professional, with nice colors, and feminine. That’s the way I’ve always dressed at work.

    and he would look away or look down when I caught him.

    I don’t know if it’s because I caught him or because he felt guilty.

    He started asking personal questions about me.

    and I would answer, but I know I was giving off a guarded vibe because I was being guarded.

    and then he would mention his wife.

    Well, we were in a meeting and I noticed that another female co-worker was making a kind of disgusted face behind me.

    and so I turned around and he was like, gaping at me, but at being caught, he quickly looked away and blushed.

    He brought his wife to lunch at work the very next day.

    Introduced her to a bunch of random male and female co-workers, but not even looking at or mentioning me.

  129.  #130IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    I feel icky writing this, but it also feels good to write about it, because I need a place to share it and process it and move on from it…

  130.  #131IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:13 pm

    anyway, by January, my job was practically killing me. I was losing sleep over it, and a couple of my bosses told me that they were worried I could take a lower position in the company at another office if I needed to.

    I agonized over the decision.

    All my co-workers were supportive and amazing at this time. Male co-workers were hugging me, female co-workers were checking on me. I had had a death in the family, and the stress of the job was at an all-time high.

    I decided to stay. I’m glad I did. I truly believe it was the right decision. Things got better. I got stronger.

  131.  #132IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:14 pm

    He watched me so closely during this time. He became even more soft and tender, which I loved and hated so much.

    He would ask me if I was okay all the time. Look at me, touch me in innocent and supportive ways.

  132.  #133Dominique on May 10, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    Waterfall – 102 – What your friend suggests would be great in a 50/50 masculine/feminine energy dynamic, yet this kind of a union would likely feel milque toast indeed.

    Look how you felt when you were taken care of, as a woman in feminine energy will feel. And a man in masculine energy will want to take care of you. You’re not beholden in any way. You won’t be going back to any stereotype you might imagine.

    Masculine energy is about doing and giving, feminine energy about being and feeling, allowing – PRIMARILY. Doesn’t mean a man can’t be, feel, and receive, nor a woman can’t do and give. This is about the predominant energy.

    This isn’t a ploy or a game which you know. You can do whatever you want when you’re coming from a place without expectations or agenda.


  133.  #134IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:16 pm

    I became stronger and even more vulnerable.

    It was good. My performance at work actually improved. It was like the grief made me want to live a more full and purposeful life.

  134.  #135IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:18 pm

    I became closer with my co-workers at this time. It felt great.

    I was still putting distance between he and I when it felt necessary though.

    My guard isn’t up with my other coworkers the way it is with him, and he can tell and I think it bothers him.

  135.  #136IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:24 pm

    It feels so much better writing about this. It feels more and more silly the more I write about it, which is good.

  136.  #137IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:25 pm

    so, long story short, I am leaving the job. I’m not sure if he knows or not. I feel good about the decision, but extremely sad and conflicted too. It’s stressful, up and down. It takes you so high and then leaves you so low and exhausted. It’s a consuming job.

  137.  #138IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:26 pm

    I took a brief vacation without telling him and had someone fill my spot while I was gone.

  138.  #139Millie on May 10, 2014 at 12:27 pm

    Andrea 112-
    Thank you so much for your response and clarification. I see now how your situation and mine was different on many levels. I totally agree with your lesson of “not reaching out” and I have become supremely better at it!! However, I found myself “leaking” with Mechanic. For example, drunk texting him when I had no self-control. The reality is- I just liked him, but felt like I had to hide that, so my affections “leaked” out in other ways that were not beneficial to me. So, that’s why, after that drunken night, I decided to confront my feelings and suggest a date. I totally agree with you that a man who is not interested is a huge turn-off. Last night I was feeling very depressed and “Nobody likes me.” But that isn’t true..there is a whole pool of people out there that would perhaps be a better fit for me than this guy. He is the “nobody” in that sentence, and he is really is nobody….I don’t even want to go on a date with him now, last night I just wanted to on a date period and was feeing all loser-ish. If Mechanic ever asks me out, I’m going to say “mabye” with a smile and walk the f**k away.

    Andrea you are always such an inspiration and guiding force on the blog. Thank you so much for your thoughtful and deep responses and posts. 🙂

  139.  #140IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:27 pm

    He seemed soooo excited when i got back.

    I walked into our office and he was beaming.

    the next day I think it was?

    He smiled, pointed at his gorgeous body, and said “are you ready for this?”

    which was so weird. My guard flew up.

  140.  #141IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:28 pm

    I didn’t look at him when he said that. I felt uncomfortable. and just kind of preoccupied myself until he left the room.

    I sighed in relief.

  141.  #142Dominique on May 10, 2014 at 12:31 pm

    Iamhis – Sending you much love. <3


  142.  #143IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:32 pm

    Here’s where it gets really weird.

    I think he started spraying pheromone cologne in the office.

    The office is big enough to where there are quadrants.

    The smell was always strongest by our desk.

    It turned me on. The first time I walked in there, he was standing in the back, so casually, and the smell and him standing there made me feel so turned on I felt embarrassed.

    My male-coworker walked in while I was alone at one point, and I said “can you smell this office?”

    he said he couldn’t smell anything, but I stepped outside because it was so strong I needed some air…

  143.  #144Millie on May 10, 2014 at 12:33 pm

    Haha I typo-ed “maybe” with “maybye.” Haha!! Freudian slip!

    I’ve realized that simply addressing what you want and seeing what the man decides to do with that information, feels a lot calmer and more relaxed to me, than holding it in and just waiting for him to do it. I get that aspect of all of this now. The anxiety I created by holding my true thoughts and feelings in escalated my “imaginary” feelings for him. I put myself on edge. I created the feelings. Not him. I’m never going to make that mistake again.

  144.  #145Dominique on May 10, 2014 at 12:36 pm

    Iamhis – This may help give you some clarity or at least something to ponder.


  145.  #146IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:36 pm

    well, there was no pattern to it. One day the office would smell like that smell and the next day it wouldn’t.

    sometimes he would be in the office…with the smell, waiting for me…and then other days he was nowhere to be found. Sometimes the smell was there and he wasn’t there.

    Sometimes he was there and was there was no smell.

    Sometimes he was NOT there and there was no smell.

    I was starting to question my sanity…

    Thankfully, “the smell” didn’t always turn me on, so I started to feel stronger. i was learning to master it.

    (I know I must sound ridiculous. I feel like freaking Pavlov’s dog, being manipulated and conditioned or something…)

  146.  #147IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:37 pm

    I will read it, Dominique. I know this is Imaginary, but it just feels good to analyze for right now, so I can see it for what it truly is…

  147.  #148Millie on May 10, 2014 at 12:41 pm

    In other news– I decided to block my long time ago ex’s phone #. He started randomly texting me at late hours of the night, sending like 5 messages in a row, basically having a conversation with himself. When I responded the next day, no reply from him. This has happened at least three times if not more. I felt annoyed and fed up with it. I don’t know if he’s just bored, but I feel like it is a game. I thought about saying “It would feel good to connect with you again, but I don’t feel connected via texting,” but in the past he just shuts down and I’m honestly over the whole thing. So, I blocked him. It feels very freeing to do that.

  148.  #149IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:44 pm

    Compliments and sexual comments gradually started. Normally i would feel offended, but I have to admit, I liked it.

    I shared them with an older female friend and she comfirmed they were inappropriate.

    I don’t want to say anything about it to anyone at work at this point, because my time left there is so short, it kind of felt pointless.

    I felt really angry. He started a new pattern of not being in the office and then randomly coming back into it and lingering for what appeared to be really stupid reasons.

    He’s technically not even supposed to be in there when I’m working.

    That smell.

    Finally, in anger, I was just like, “have you been spraying something in here?!”

    he quickly said, “No, why, what does it smell like?”

    and all I could come up with was “…I don’t know?”

    well, things calmed down and I got a grip and our interactions felt normal again, which felt good.

    I don’t like tension, especially not sexual tension with a married man.

  149.  #150IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:48 pm

    I should also mention that I found out that he was creeping on me on a certain form of social media where I practice feeling messages and being in feminine energy.

    He started acting more confident around me and would let things slip that he had no other way of knowing; like my age, musical interests, favorite authors, etc. He also started using similar feeling messages that I use on my this particular social media site, and my experience has been that men I practice feeling messages on start mirroring the way I speak for some reason.

    Feeling messages scare me sometimes.

    They are powerful, and they have a powerful effect on men.

    anyway…nothing was ever said about the social media but I think he knew that I found out because he started defending himself that he has this need to investigate things because of his background in journalism or some crap like that.

  150.  #151IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:49 pm

    Before things got weird between us, I also overheard him talking to some coworkers about his past. He used to sleep around a lot and “be a jerk” but when he met his wife, she “made him want to be a better person.”

  151.  #152IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:50 pm

    This is good. The more I write about it, the sillier it feels, and the better I feel about it.

  152.  #153IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:51 pm

    I also found out that he had another “inappropriate, but not grounds to be fired” thing with a coworker who had recently been through an awful divorce. He’s made it known that he thinks she’s hot.

    I don’t know what happened, but she reported it, and he was really, really mad about it. I just listened to him vent about it. I said nothing.

  153.  #154IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:52 pm

    I feel so silly. I’d feel embarrassed if he found this and read it, but I’d also feel kind of vindicated.

  154.  #155IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:54 pm

    anyway, I was exhausted and emotional the other day at work. it had nothing to do with him, but he seemed worried that it did have to do with him.

    He sat down next to me while I was eating at the desk and just didn’t say anything. He usually doesn’t do that.

    I didn’t tense up or anything because it wasn’t about him.

    He just kind of sat with me for a few minutes and then left the office without saying anything.

  155.  #156IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:55 pm

    It feels good to just to let all these stupid little interactions out in the air.

  156.  #157IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 12:58 pm

    I’m going to miss him. I just needed to say that. No, I’m not going to miss HIM. I don’t even know him that well. I’m going to miss the attention. The attraction.

    I’m just going to miss it.

    and that’s okay.

  157.  #158IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 1:00 pm

    i feel sleepy and bored. Good sign! 🙂

    and I have fun plans tonight. 🙂

    Thanks for reading if you did, and for advice if you gave it.

    I truly feel thankful to you all, and I truly feel like I have so much potential and so much good is going to come my way.

    Feeling so much better.

  158.  #159IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    Millie – you go, girl! I had a total creeper text me in the MIDDLE OF THE FREAKING NIGHT when HE KNEW I had work early the next day. He didn’t even act like he did anything wrong when I talked to him about it…no blaming…just feeling messages…and do you know how he responded to “I feel extremely angry getting late night texts when you know I get up at 4…?”

    He sends me another text. With a teddy bear and flowers in the text message pic.

    okay, sweet maybe.

    but I told him, CALLS FEEL BETTER. (calmly, at the time. but it was getting redundant…)

    then he had the nerve to “call me” so I could “go drive and see him.” after not speaking to me for weeks. and I just said “driving to you doesn’t feel good. that doesn’t feel good to me, especially after not hearing from you. No thank you.”

    needless to say, he dropped off the face of the planet, and I FEEL GREAT! NEXT! 🙂

  159.  #160IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    Millie – you go, girl! I had a total creeper text me in the MIDDLE OF THE FREAKING NIGHT when HE KNEW I had work early the next day. He didn’t even act like he did anything wrong when I talked to him about it…no blaming…just feeling messages…and do you know how he responded to “I feel extremely angry getting late night texts when you know I get up at 4…?”

    He sends me another text. With a teddy bear and flowers in the text message pic.

    okay, sweet maybe.

    but I told him, CALLS FEEL BETTER. (calmly, at the time. but it was getting redundant…)

    then he had the nerve to “call me” so I could “go drive and see him.” after not speaking to me for weeks. and I just said “driving to you doesn’t feel good. that doesn’t feel good to me, especially after not hearing from you. No thank you.”

    needless to say, he dropped off the face of the planet, and I FEEL GREAT! NEXT! 🙂

  160.  #161Waterfall on May 10, 2014 at 1:58 pm

    Wow Dominque – Thank you so much! Makes a lot of sense

  161.  #162RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 2:39 pm

    102- (((((((Waterfall))))))

  162.  #163Luzydel on May 10, 2014 at 3:08 pm

    It feels good to not be hung up and depressed when a man doesn’t contact. I dunno, if it is pretentious for me to think that maybe CaptainCD fell for me? Well CuteCD hasn’t contact me he said he will be with his 4 children somewhere, but it feels bad that he doesn’t even say a short hello. Maybe he is not that into me… Oh well. I want to go on a date with a new guy… it is just hard to meet someone randomly. But I am cooking and cleaning, and is raining, and I fell cozy and comfortable being with me, myself and I. am I selfish to keep contact with captainCD because he is very generous with his dates? I still like him (just do not see him the same way I used to) I do not trust he can give me the relationship I want. But he is so cool to hang out with, and if I come up with an Idea to go somewhere, he’s game. I like that, but it is a little selfish of me? …

    CuteCD is a cheap guy… but captain never let me pay… I do not want to decide. I do not have to because neither is committing to me.

  163.  #164Sayrah on May 10, 2014 at 4:05 pm

    Sisters, please help! I am new to this and eager to put the tools to work, but I’m feeling stuck in texting with men. I really don’t want to text them at all (or have long phone conversations –I want to meet), and these are the frogs for the most part –sending me stupid pictures of themselves, of young girls doing the splits (yuck), and getting needy about me responding to all their messages (many many messages) all before I’ve even met them. I’ve been trying the feeling messages in text message and it often happens that triggers him to say something just awful like “you’re too independent” or “I’m just trying to help you because you’re 35 and not married” –at that point, is it advised to keep interacting with him for the “free therapy?”. It feels so weird to keep interacting with them after they have been rude & mean, and so I cut them off. In working with this new way I find a lot of men are operating on an assumption that I’ll be immediately dedicating all this time to them, they become obnoxious and demanding until I give a negative feeling statement and they respond like jerks. Feeling stuck in this pattern and I want to learn!

  164.  #165Rori Raye on May 10, 2014 at 5:05 pm

    Sayrah – If what you’re looking for is a “traditional” relationship – which most of us are, really – then you want a “traditional minded” man. this means he behaves the way traditional men behave. He doesn’t do weird things like you describe. He feels happy and grateful to be with a lovely woman like you, and he just follows his ‘bliss” by continuing to contact you, and treating you well. It’s possible you don’t have the hang of Feeling Messages yet – so please get the ebook and keep interacting here. try out pne of my Certified Coaches – (in September – there’ll be a whole new list of Rori Raye Relationship Coach Training – RRRCT – Trainees for you to try out for free…) Love, Rori

  165.  #166Tereana on May 10, 2014 at 7:55 pm

    RileyTheOwl (99) – Yes, I have felt the urge to cry, too. And sometimes I have. The men have usually responded well. And, like you, I often don’t know why it comes up. I think this is part of why, for me, it’s best if I am with one person for a long time. I didn’t have sex as early as 17. But I don’t think it matters how old you are. Sexuality touches us on a deep emotional level. And being present with our feelings is what being a siren is all about. I think you handled it quite well.

    Thanks, LL and Emerson! I’m glad you can relate about friends – well, not glad, because it isn’t fun. But glad because I don’t feel so alone and weird. I guess things change and people change. We are taught from a young age this idea of BFFs – that someone will be your best friend “for life.” Well, maybe she won’t. Maybe she will. Life is a long time. We are the only ones who can be our true BFFs. I mean, right?

  166.  #167Tereana on May 10, 2014 at 8:02 pm

    IamHis (146) – I haven’t been able to read through the whole story yet, but what you are describing sounds kind of like gaslighting. You can look it up to see what it means. But, assuming that he is potentially spraying something in the office, and the unpredictability makes you feel a little crazy, then this could be it…

  167.  #168Tereana on May 10, 2014 at 8:05 pm

    Mandy – I may have been “off” on suggesting a game. But the idea was in line with what some others have said, which is that you want to stay the romantic partner in the situation. I like this:

    “Rori says, show confidence in his abilities. Do not try to help.”

    Not that you aren’t doing that already, in showing confidence. But the “not helping” part is the hardest. And I actually think this piece of advice is useful in almost any relationship…

  168.  #169LoveAlways on May 10, 2014 at 9:14 pm

    Happy Mother’s Day everyone!!!

  169.  #170RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 9:19 pm

    Tereana, I never thought I would have sex at 17 either, though after being with him for a year, it felt natural. We haven’t since January though, because it started feeling to scary, as I said before. Tereana, I feel glad hearing that the men respond well to you:) I think it really scares C sometimes. I cry every time now… and we are not having sex, he’s just touching me “down there”, so it feels as though I’m becoming more triggered by intimacy as time goes on. I really really want to have a time together when I can experience all this love without the crying. That would be really amazing. Just warm happy intimacy. I feel worried that it’s hard for him when every time he tries to love me, I cry.
    Okay, wait. I LOVE that I feel sad and scared during intercourse. I love my little girl inside who feels scared of being abandoned… Riley, I love you. Let me hold you and embrace you. and I forgive myself for beating myself up about it… <3

  170.  #171RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 9:21 pm

    ((Love Always)), happy mothers day to you too <3 xoxo

  171.  #172Emerson on May 10, 2014 at 9:29 pm

    Thank you for sharing. I was glued to your story like a telenovela!!
    Ugh sorry that happened to you.
    That’s weird about the pheromones. ??!! :-/
    I didn’t even know of such a thing.
    You are strong. Good for you sticking it out in your high position, and I know what you mean when you say you feel it’s time to leave.

  172.  #173RileyTheOwl on May 10, 2014 at 9:29 pm

    ALSO, thank you Tereana and Azure Blu for acknowledging me on here and talking to me about this, it makes me feel soo welcome on this blog and I feel like I have a place where there are people I can talk to. I don’t honestly have many others I can talk to, so this is really special to me.

  173.  #174Emerson on May 10, 2014 at 9:32 pm

    I ran into an old female friend/associate today.
    Weird because I was just thinking about her the other day and wondering where she ended up and how she
    Was so sweet and positive.
    When I ran into her today at the most random place ever, she recognized me and said she was just thinking if me the other day. Strange but cool!

  174.  #175Emerson on May 10, 2014 at 9:34 pm

    Sirens I think I’m really done with Indian men…tereana feel free to chime in.
    They seem to be lazy about making plans or going out of their way to see me. But at the same time very flirty and sexual.
    I’m feeling impatient and annoyed.

  175.  #176IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 9:57 pm

    @169 Emerson – thank you soooo much. You have no idea how good your feedback feels.

    I feel like such a horrible person.

    soooo guilty and angry at him and angry at myself for liking the attention and for “forgiving him” for being human and so dang attracted to me.

    I had a great night with a single guy and a married couple.

    I felt beautiful…but unsatisfied.

    I feel sexually frustrated, honestly.

    I feel really vulnerable saying that…

    I’m trying really hard to figure out “what’s missing” besides sex.

    I looked up stories of single women struggling with the same things. That was helpful.

    It’s so triggering to married women. I know it’s hard with kids, work, exhaustion, low-self esteem, poor body image, men’s thing with porn, loss of interest due to babies or just sheer exhaustion, a man feeling emasculated because the wife makes more money and he has to take care of the kids.

    I refuse to give in to him.

    I feel so confused because I care about him and empathize with what he must be going through in his marriage.

    at the same time, I don’t trust him and I think he’s a selfish jerk who’s using me and being sneaky with his wife and not being vulnerable enough to talk about his emotional, physical, and sexual needs with her.

    He was complaining about it (just something fairly reasonable she wanted him to do) one time when he was really tired and he just kind of leaned into me and I have never wanted him more than at that moment.

    He complains about things his wife wants him to do, and I don’t know what to say because I understand why he doesn’t want to do them because I’m just as tired and as lonely as he is.

    He keeps arranging “group things” and I keep not going.

    He made a comment about not having my number and I completely danced around the comment.

    The way he looks at me sometimes.

    It feels so good to be looked at like that.

    I feel so angry.

    Where can I find fulfillment?

    Why is this such a temptation for me right now?

    How can I become a better, healthier, stronger person?

    I don’t know how to be around him.

    I feel embarrassed for being a blog hog and I feel embarrassed that I’ve written so much about this, spent so much energy on this, but something deep inside me needs to see the truth: this would never happen if I were stronger, healthier, less lonely, loved myself more, hell, loved him and his wife and his babies more.

    I deserve better. I will have better. This will only make me stronger.

    The guilt I feel.
    It is not wrong to feel an attraction for a married man.
    It’s just not.
    It’s would feel wrong to act on it, but what IS acting on it?

    I feel angry at him for thinking I’m weak enough to “play” with him.

    I have higher self-esteem than that, I do.

    I thought writing about it might be cathartic but maybe it’s making it worse?

    I feel threatened and flattered and turned on and victimized and empowered and full of lust and full of distrust and angry and curious and sad all at once.

  176.  #177IamHis on May 10, 2014 at 10:00 pm

    I also feel incredibly thankful that my leaving has absolutely nothing to do with him.

    That feels incredibly empowering, and makes me want to tell him to go screw his inflated ego’d self.

    (Ironic word choice…)

  177.  #178Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 11:41 pm


    You sound incredibly wise and self-aware and authentic for someone so young, I’m sure you hear this a lot.

    Love to you x

  178.  #179Indigo on May 10, 2014 at 11:47 pm


    I had a work flirtation thing with a married man some years ago (all initiated by him, to be honest I really didn’t reciprocate or follow where the flirtation was going, although to be honest I enjoyed the attention) and he would do strange suggestive things like the man you described. Leave things and notes (inside jokes) on my desk, make suggestive comments about coming to fetch me and bring me to work when there was a problem with traffic (but not making this offer to anyone else), inviting me for drinks alone with him in the boardroom…

    It was all sort of sweet and harmless (mainly I think because I didn’t really respond), but it made me feel vulnerable, and it felt kind of dangerous. I considered moving departments. But yes, eventually I left that company, and that was that.

    Anyway, I just wanted to let you know that I empathise and I think leaving the job is a good thing.

  179.  #180RileyTheOwl on May 11, 2014 at 12:14 am

    Indigo-175, teehee thank you, that makes me feel proud. My confidence rises so much when I read things like that. I feel very isolated from other girls my age for a large part of the time, though I think there are many reasons for that and not just being more “mature”. but it feels really special and enlightening to know I’ve got that step ahead.
    Thank you for the love, love to you too.

  180.  #181Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 1:18 am


    I felt the same way when I was your age.

    With time, I’ve learnt to just “go with” who I am rather than fighting against it, and come close to the people who love and value me for being me, and leave the ones who don’t.

    You will find other like-minded friends if you have the confidence to just be yourself. This blog is a great community of women.

  181.  #182Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 1:53 am

    Things have felt really low effort with Blue the last few days.

    He Skypes me every day (IM) but whereas he used to keep the conversation going, now he just sends me a link to a cute picture, or gives me some random boring update about his day, and leaves it at that. For example yesterday he texted “hey, how you doing?” then didn’t comment on my reply, and when I eventually said, “and you? what have you been up to?” he gave some boring reply two hours later, and that was the extent of our communication. He didn’t call, or ask to see me.

    I had a girls’ night on Friday night, and he called me just as I was getting into bed, which was very nice. But he said, oh well I’ll let you get to bed now.

    I dunno. I feel very uninterested and can’t-be-bothered-ish. It feels so low effort to me.

    I’ve switched off my Skype today because I just don’t feel like it.

  182.  #183Millie on May 11, 2014 at 2:05 am

    Just got home from a great night!
    Went to Band guy’s show with a girlfriend where we rocked the dance floor. I danced mainly with her until a man finally came up to me towards the end. Band guy came and talked to me a bit before the show, but not much. I don’t like lingering after a show when I’m talking to one of the band members. To me, it feels like I’m expecting something, so my girlfriend and I left. I text him thank you and goodbye, sorry I didn’t see him afterwards. He immediately replied “Ok.Bye.” I felt very startled by his cold and abrupt reply. He had not been that way up until now. He text me again that he had wanted to invite me and my friend over to his place for some drinks. So…that answered my confusion…he had wanted to hang out after, which makes sense. It would have been fun, but not only am I holding out for real dates these days, but he’s technically still married even though they are getting a divorce. My girlfriend and I had a blast dancing though 🙂

  183.  #184Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:33 am

    Happy Mother’s Day : )

  184.  #185Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:37 am

    Iamhis – Your processing is amazing and I think you’re doing great, imho. I appreciate your strength in all this, feeling all these emotions.

  185.  #186Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:42 am


  186.  #187Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:46 am

    Hi Indigo : )

  187.  #188Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:48 am

    Hi Indigo : )

    The impression I got was that the interaction from Blue was heading into lean-forward territory for you. Pre-Rori I would have bitten and tried to get some momentum going.

  188.  #189Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 2:52 am

    oops almost double post

  189.  #190Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 3:01 am

    Hi Veronica 🙂

    Yes I think so too. I am aware that in the past I would have started questioning myself and wondering what he was thinking and whether I should lean forward and close the gap, and now I can just smile at that girl.

    I’m not going to lean forward. I’m not going to wonder. It’s a beautiful Sunday and I’m going to get on with my day 🙂


  190.  #191Femininewoman on May 11, 2014 at 4:23 am

    Indigo for me I don’t like the Skyping. When it is a LDR I can appreciate the necessary. Otherwise for someone I am dating I see it as making myself too available and giving too much of my energy and time. I believe a man at times need to feel like he is starving for the emotional connection and craving my presence. If I am dating him plus giving him additional time on Skype it just seems like giving him too much of a good thing to me. Any body could get flooded. People have different saturation amounts of love that they can take in at any given time.

  191.  #192Femininewoman on May 11, 2014 at 4:27 am

    Millie – He immediately replied “Ok.Bye.” I felt very startled by his cold and abrupt reply.

    I don’t see it as cold or abrupt. He responded. That’s it. He could have chosen to ignore and reply the following day.

  192.  #193Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 4:47 am

    Feminine Woman,

    I hear you. Truth be told, beyond the initial high of “ooh, he’s contacting me”, I HATE instant message Skyping.

    With D, the Skype conversations used to make me feel starving for the voice or in-person connection, and the number of arguments we got into over Skype on IM! That you then couldn’t soften or take back or resolve. It left a very bad taste in my mouth about Skype.

    And now with Blue, when he starts a conversation and then doesn’t respond to what I say, or takes hours to respond or keeps it short, and most importantly doesn’t firm up plans to see each other, so that it all feels very low effort… ick. Ugh ugh ugh. Yuck.

    I like what you’ve said about it. I’ve had my Skype off since yesterday evening and it feels very good actually.

  193.  #194April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 6:01 am


    I feel breathtakingly amazed and blown away by your strength and your vulnerability.

    I am reading your story and all the while I am thinking “Wow girl, you are such a siren. I want lessons from you!”

    You have been in *one tough situation*. I’m still shaking my head here, amazed at you and totally won over by your integrity.

    If my man shared an office with a woman, I would want her to be you.

  194.  #195April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 6:34 am

    On second thoughts I don’t think I would want my man around a divine and deliciously attractive siren like you, IamHis!

    I believe you have behaved impeccably. You have put your self and your career first, in the face of an extremely challenging situation.

  195.  #196Kyla on May 11, 2014 at 8:11 am

    Happy Mother’s Day xoxox

  196.  #197Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 9:59 am

    Hi Sirens,

    I realise my boyfriend is showing himself to me. He is always telling me how he wants to be that type of person who lives in the moment and forgets the past. This confuses me because I feel like he’s saying he would forget me if we weren’t together. Its like he is sending me a message or something.

    My main issue is our lack of plans together. He never tells me what he’s doing until the last minute – and I find this really, really rude.

    He never asks me what I want to do, or what I feel about his plans – it is all about him.

    Take for example New Years Eve. I had pressumed we were spending it together but when I asked him (a day or so before) he told me he was going to stay with his friend who was having relationship problems. I truly felt aghast and shocked that he did not want to spend it with me. He didn’t even ask what I was doing. In fact he practically showed no interest whatsoever. This devistated me – and really I’ve not been able to get over it – or move on from it. I felt abandoned and humiliated. I just couldn’t understand why he didn’t care.

    Also I felt like if he could treat me like this now at the beginning of the relationship how would he be in years to come. My heart felt like it was in my mouth thinking about it. I couldn’t bare to think about it.

    Also at Easter although I don’t see him at the weekend he didn’t even care if I had any plans for Easter Sunday. I felt so upset and like I was screaming inside.

    He thinks its fine just to spend time with me and live in the moment. But I want so much more and he doesn’t seem to get that.

    I feel angry and tense just thinking about it..

    I just don’t know what to do. My fear is we will split up and I will miss him incredibly or we will stat together and I will feel angry at myself for staying with someone who blatany doesn’t care about my needs.

    I haven’t seen him for a week now as he has deliberately given me some space and has gone away, yet I am sitting here staring at my phone waiting for him to contact me because I miss him!!! This frustrates me that I miss him so much !!??

    Before he left he asked for another chance but I feel so scared that we will either go back into our old pattern or we will split up.

    I feel I want him in my life as a friend – because in lots of ways he’s my best friend – he us constantly there for me as someone to talk to and share things with but he is a rubbjsh boyfriend. He doesn’t really care to make himself my boyfriend it is all about him and nothing is about me.

    I need love and security – those normal things. Goodness knows what he wants. I think he wants to be single but still have a girlfriend.

    The scary thing is because I “like” him so much I know I will overlook my needs to give him what he wants in order to stay with him. The whole things confuses me so much..

    I know I have this opportunity now to keep him at arms length but this feels very scary. I am scared if I really do this I will never see him again or he will have enough of me pushing him away and he will disappear on me.

    That probably doesn’t make sense!? I feel like what I am saying is he is making me out to be the bad guy because I am “never” happy and I’m always moaning at him. He is acting like he can’t please me or do anything right. Yet when I ask for these basic things he tells me I’m wrong and that he does tell me his plans and makes plans for us etc. Also he tells me that he does care about me and worry about me.

    I don’t know, its like all the time I smell a rat. Friends think it is all super dodgy. Some suggest he may gave another woman thoughhe tells me he doesn’t.

    I feel so confused…

    Also I always get the impression with him that he misses me but then after spending time with me he seems to quite quickly get bored of me. Our conversation will dry up and I find him very unengaged after just a day in my company. Its like he can’t wait to get away and you can bet your bottom dollar he will find an excuse ti leave me so that he can come back refreshed.

    Also what is weird is whenever I start ro feel relaxed and positive about the relationship this is when he seems to bolt.. Thats what gets me so angry..

    Sorry to pour my heart out on the thread… Any advice will be greatly recieved… I am finding it so hard to stay strong..

    Oh, also he tells me I read too many relationship books…

  197.  #198Andrea on May 11, 2014 at 10:16 am

    So, what I’m hearing is: “I, Waterfall, do not deserve a loving, nurturing, respectful relationship. I, Waterfall, will settle for tid bits and crumbs because at some points in the past this man has been an okay friend to me. In other words, I am living in an isolated bubble and this one person is the only person in the whole universe. I have no other choices for friends. I have no other choices for love. I have no other choices for conversation, or fun, togetherness on Easter or New Years. There is no one else on this whole planet that can possibly fill the spaces in these gaping holes in the relationship I have right now. I, Waterfall, am not a prize, I am not an exuberantly amazing woman filled with love for myself. I guess I’m kind of icky because it’s okay for the person that I allow to be the closest to me, treat me icky. I didn’t have the fortitude or the strength to make him prove he was worthy to be close to me. I, Waterfall, am scared of my future and have no vision or faith that if I would turn my love onto myself and get rid of this jack ass that is dead weight, then life and love and everything will be 100 percent better. No, I’d rather just stay the way I am and try to get HIM to change because I’m not willing to do the work to change myself. So, I want him to make me happy because I’m too scared to try to make myself happy.”

    I’m sorry… If that’s not what you were trying to say. But I guess… that’s what I read. My advice… No contact for 30 days with this loser. Get Rori’s tapes and start working on yourself, then watch the real men come into your life in droves.

  198.  #199Millie on May 11, 2014 at 10:27 am

    Femininewoman- 189 Yes. That is true.

    Andrea-195 So powerful…

  199.  #200Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 10:39 am


    Sorry, I read the same thing as Andrea.

    You think you will feel sad and miss him if you walk away from him? Let me save you the suspense… you will. But it will be nothing compared to how you will feel about yourself if you allow this barely-there relationship to continue.

    You need to start judging men on their actions, not on how much you like them or how you feel about them.

    It may feel good in the rare nice moments you are getting with him, but you know what else feels *really* good? Having the strength to say no to something that is not meeting your needs and doesn’t feel good, going and doing something caring for yourself, and allowing the space and looking forward to something better coming along.

    Sorry if this is harsh. But I see so much of myself in you. Step AWAY from guys like this.

  200.  #201Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 11:23 am

    Haha thank you all so much for these comments. The truth hurts but I really need to hear it.

    Lol, a thought has just whizzed past my mind and it says be careful for what you wish for…

    What I mean is he keeps asking me where he is going wrong and saying he will change. What if he does change??? I will feel stick with him and just lumping along like we are…

    Argghh this is what scares me. I keep saying no to him but somehow he is still in my life.

    Yes, Andrea you are so right! I need to stand up for myself and say I am worth so much more than this.

    Lol, sometimes I can’t see the wood for the trees. I am NOT happy with him – therefore I have to leave… Even if I am on my own I will be happier…

    I think on some level I must not be being clear to him about what I want because he isn’t taking me seriously when I say I need space. How do I enforce it in a calm and mature way yet still leave the door open for him to step up (which is what I want)

    Maybe it’s about dropping all expectations. He made try and make me out to be the bad guy but I need to rise above this..


  201.  #202Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 11:28 am


    I feel a sad hollow heat in my chest reading what you wrote – that was me in so many ways, some of me is still there, which frightens me. Indigo’s words really get to it beautifully.

    I can’t read Andrea’s words, I start but I can’t read further, the past-hurt just feels really present.

  202.  #203Daria on May 11, 2014 at 11:28 am

    ooh waterfall situation about wana live in the moment guy reminds me of M man

    i now feel triggered about the ‘live in the moment’ men….

    i’m glad i moved away from m man


    i want a man who plans… so i can live in the moment in security!

  203.  #204Daria on May 11, 2014 at 11:30 am

    Waterfall – ‘What if he does change???’

    “I will feel stick with him and just lumping along like we are…” <<< NV

    truth is you don't know how you'll feel… because it will be CHANGED!

    scary to believe change can be that big… the nv's block it, and say it will be the same….

    Be surprised…


    Daria takes her own advice now

  204.  #205Veronica on May 11, 2014 at 11:34 am

    *Waterfall, I’m referring to what you wrote in 194. I saw that there might be possible confusion.

  205.  #206RileyTheOwl on May 11, 2014 at 11:38 am

    (((((((((((((((Waterfall))))))))))))))) honey, I have been there. I really can’t offer much advice because even though I’ve been in a similar situation, I had no idea what to do. I’m inexperienced. I hadn’t heard or rori, and I just chased until he left me… But, while I was reading that, I felt this urge to tell you to just leave (not the relationship, but your physical environment) and go on an extragagent vacation or spa retreat, urgently, just GET OUT OF THERE.Then listen to the others advice. My heart goes out to you, I think you deserve much much more than what he is giving you, and I think you are very capable of taking the steps of self-love to get there. So much love to you, xoxo

  206.  #207RileyTheOwl on May 11, 2014 at 11:53 am

    Daria. “I want a man who plans, so I can live in the moment in security.” YES. This resonates with me so much.
    Veronica, thanks for the hugs 🙂

    Indigo, hmm we are alike. Yes, I realized not to long ago that I’ve been isolating myself for being different, but I started just letting other girls love me for who I am. For the first time in school, I’ve begun to make friends. Yay : ) my other issue when it comes to friends at school is me needing a lot of alone time. I have a bit of social phobia/anxiety which I see a councelor for, and it helps, but it just adds to my need to be alone.

  207.  #208Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 12:05 pm

    But sirens how do you live if he leave if you are so entwined with each other. How do you leave then?

    I feel scared that I am being judged. Yet I know everyone means well but it all feels so judgemental and like everyone is pointing fingers at me..

    Lol, this is just my own trigger.

    All of my life I’ve felt judged in my relationships. All I ever hear from anyone regarding any of my romantic relationships is:

    ‘Boy is he treating you badly!’

    ‘He sounds weird/ awful/get out of there sister!’

    ‘Your relationship sounds terrible you deserve more’

    Ahhh I feel so triggered but I know its my triggers and I want to learn to see past this and mot feel like a scared child stood quivering and shaking before all the adults and grown ups. And that is truly how I feel..

    I need to deal with this. I need to deal with these wounds…

  208.  #209Andrea on May 11, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    Hey I just saw a quote the reads, “A Boy makes his woman jealous of all other women. A Gentleman makes all other women jealous of his girl!”

    Hah! I’m holding out for my gentleman.

  209.  #210Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    I long for soft words…

  210.  #211Andrea on May 11, 2014 at 12:20 pm

    Ohhhh… Daria… 201.. so profound: “You don’t know how you’ll feel… it will be changed!”

    Waterfall, certainly not judging. I hope there is an innate understanding here that, at least for me, the posts that foster my most intense responses are those that resonate with my deepest fears.

    I feel “triggered” as some would say here, not because I find myself in that situation physically, but because together, you and I both, are hoping to solve deep inner wounds by attempting to change outer, malleable, always shifting, always shoving back into our faces, space…

    Our outside space of activities and people and relationships and appearances and etc… are only to be noticed so that we can see our inner selves more clearly.

    For you, as for me, what is showing up outside of us is only pointing to what we believe inside of us. And that’s where we need to start. That man you’re writing about, this blog I’m triggering about, that situation, this situation… it’s all only directing us inward.

    You’re not being judged, you ARE being the cleansing potent for my own deep healing today, and for that I’m ever grateful.

    And also, I firmly believe that once you start being concerned ONLY with how YOU YOURSELF FEEL in any given moment, you won’t be worried about icky men who don’t treat you right, or other women who tell you you’re with icky men who don’t treat you right. : )

    You’ll only be concerned with how YOU YOURSELF FEEL! That’s the place I’m trying to get to as well.

  211.  #212Andrea on May 11, 2014 at 12:26 pm

    Oh.. with my exboyfriend that I was in a relationship with for 18 months… I had meetings with a life coach once a week and he would tell me:

    “Andrea… that’s abuse. Can’t you see that you are being abused?” When I would tell him little situations I was going through with my then boyfriend.

    And for the life of me, at that time, I honestly could not see that I was being abused. To me, it was just what I had always been used to when it came to men and relationships. It wasn’t until I started really working on loving myself that I started realizing… Holy Crud! I’m being abused! I don’t like this!

    Then it took even more months to get away from him, then even more months to get over him. But I can honestly say… Man, I feel really happy now. Free.. and happy. I smile from my heart now because I am loving me more profoundly and gently and tenderly every day. In ways that my ex.. and so far no other man.. has been able to do. It feels really good. Better than my best day with my ex.

  212.  #213Cupcake on May 11, 2014 at 12:53 pm

    208 Waterfall,

    It hurt my heart to read what you wrote about being “entwined” in each others lives.

    He dissed you New Years Eve and Easter.

    Honey, he doesn’t see himself as entwined. His actions show that.

    Circular date. Please. There are nicer men out there.

    I can’t write very much where I am. Don’t mean to be terse.

    Sending you a hug.


  213.  #214Dominique on May 11, 2014 at 12:56 pm

    Waterfall – 194 – If you lean back, give him space to come to you (a very different energy from keeping him at arm’s length) and he doesn’t, if he truly does disappear, then sadly you never really had him at all. Wouldn’t you rather know this now?

    One thing you can try is letting go for now all the stuff which bothers you, and really, really, REALLY focus on ALL the things he does you DO like, which make you feel good, and TELL HIM – eg. I love when you…. It feels so good when….. Thank you SO much…. I feel special….. I feel taken care of….. and so on.

    See if this doesn’t encourage more of what you want in this relationship. If not, then you will know better what’s what and where you stand.

    Another thing to think about, keep your processing to yourself for now. He doesn’t need to know you read relationship books and are on here.

    And keep working on you. The more you learn and grow, the more clarity you will gain, so you will be able to make your choices with no doubts or regrets.


  214.  #215April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    Waterfall, there is a lot in what you wrote in this short sentence
    “Also I always get the impression with him that he misses me but then after spending time with me he seems to quite quickly get bored of me. Our conversation will dry up and I find him very unengaged after just a day in my company.”

    Check out your energetic compatibility on

    If you and he belong to opposite communication styles (and you can find out for free using just his and your date of birth), it is always gonna feel like one of you gets tired first. There is a palpable ‘energetic drain’.

    And, you may well be attracted to men of the opposite style, particularly if your father was the opposite to you. Matchmatrix calls these ‘false attractions’. It causes all kinds of suffering in relationships.

    It may simply be that you keep picking the wrong men!

  215.  #216Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 1:36 pm

    It’s so difficult – I just feel 50/50 on this. Every time he lets me down like Easter or New Year he DOES try and make it up to me and tells me how bad he feels that he’s let me down. He says that he is just jot romantic or into that stuff but he wants to be and that he feels awkward and embarrassed but that he is trying because he really, really loves me and really wants to make me happy – he just doesn’t know how.

    And that just melts my heart and that’s what makes me feel confused…

    Is he just giving me ‘lines’ all the time? Or is he really trying to please me…

    I feel so confused..

  216.  #217Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 1:39 pm

    The thing is he will tell me what a wonderful time he’s had with me and that I make him really happy. And that just makes my heart sing and I fill up with love for him. I realise that even though I feel bored and disengaged – he doesn’t feel like that – he feels happy.

    And that’s why I’m so confused…

  217.  #218Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 1:41 pm

    Also he doesn’t ‘do’ events like New Years eve or Easter. He would just much prefer to ignore it all and snuggle up with a DVD or something..

  218.  #219Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 1:43 pm

    Andrea, Daria, everyone,

    I love that you are triggering me. Its what I need because I know I need to face my triggers..

    It’s just me riffing!

    Much love sirens !!

  219.  #220April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 2:49 pm


    Did you see my post to you 215?

  220.  #221Waterfall on May 11, 2014 at 2:58 pm

    April Rose,

    Yes, you raise some very good points re: Matchmatrix. And yeah, you’re right I think he js like my dad. I have thought this before but I still don’t know the answer…

  221.  #222IamHis on May 11, 2014 at 3:56 pm


    ((((((April Rose))))))) – Your comment made me cry. I’m having such a rough day today. I can’t focus on anything and I’ve just been sobbing. I put a block on my social media account that he creeps on. I hope that doesn’t make things worse.

    I’m wondering if I’ve been guilty of an emotional affair. I read up on it. I guess since I’m the single one, he is more guilty than I am. I just don’t know how this happened.

    I never meant for this to happen.

    I was researching “ways to end it” and they are all written for the married people involved and that makes me feel angry.

    This article made me sob too:

    “His or her motivation for bonding with a person who is already in a relationship in such an inappropriately intimate way could be an indicator of very deep seated issues, that could create a perfect storm when mixed with yours.”

    …inappropriately intimate? I don’t know if I did that, necessarily.

    I hate that I’ve overheard him talk about his wife being less interested in sex after having the kids. Not to me directly, but to a co-worker in front of me.

    I feel so dirty and guilty and sad. 🙁

  222.  #223April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 4:23 pm


    From everything I have read of your story, I see him as the predator.

    I feel sad that you are consumed with dirty and guilty feelings, simply because of being a living being who experiences a chemical and physical attraction.

    You are guilty of enjoying some of his advances.
    You are guilty of being feminine and accepting his offers of help.

    You are not guilty of having any kind of affair.

  223.  #224April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 4:28 pm

    When I say “you are guilty of experiencing an attraction” what I mean is that their IS NO guilt. You are being a natural woman.

    It looks like it has gone past the point where you can deal with it coolly, as before.

    Have you a superior you can confide in at work?

  224.  #225IamHis on May 11, 2014 at 4:30 pm

    Thank you so much, April Rose! I wish I could get a real life hug from you.

    I’m feeling really lonely right now, I have work to do, and I need to go to bed and get up early.

    Gonna go pray.

    You have NO IDEA how much I appreciate you.

    Talked to a sweet married woman at church about it. (too loudly, I’m afraid. I was feeling really angry.)

    It just helps when…I don’t know…when someone like really empathizes, you know?

    also, hugs to Indigo, too.

  225.  #226IamHis on May 11, 2014 at 4:34 pm

    I don’t feel comfortable confiding with anyone at work about this.

    Everyone LOVES him and not everyone loves me.

    My boss, specifically. I really clash with her for some reason. I hate it, because I see a lot of myself in her, and we’re a lot a like.

    I also hate it because I feel myself judging her.

    She judges “single people” who don’t have to balance everything in their lives like she does.

    and I “judge her” for putting too much emphasis on her career and not enough on other things.

    so. much. ickiness going on inside me right now…

    April Rose, you are like this angel voice to me right now!!! I feel sooooo thankful and teary!

  226.  #227April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 4:41 pm


    Wow, what a soup of feelings

    “I feel threatened and flattered and turned on and victimized and empowered and full of lust and full of distrust and angry and curious and sad all at once.”

    I’m thinking you have grounds for intimidation or harassment. I’m also guessing you don’t want to go down that route.

    I’m wondering if you could apply to move offices so you no longer share. And let him know how uncomfortable you feel around him and that you don’t want to be alone in a room with him. No explanations required. Simply stick to your guns.
    And let a senior staff member know you have made this request.

  227.  #228April Rose on May 11, 2014 at 4:44 pm

    I wish I could give you a real life hug.

    Sending an angel to hold you and help clarify your heart and mind while you sleep.

    ((((IamHis)))) Goodnight.

  228.  #229Cupcake on May 11, 2014 at 5:36 pm


    I see you struggling for a new way of looking at things, a way that will shift your energy and clarify where you stand. The image I get is of the fog of swirling emotions lifting so that you can see what is really there.

    I want to suggest something, and I feel concerned that it will sound harsh or scolding. I don’t mean it that way, if it does.

    My suggestion is that you create a new name for yourself on this board, a name that declares who you are in the world without the presence of any man. Our words create our reality. Words are the way our thoughts blip into the material world. We pin our thoughts, our energy, to the page by writing words down. And when you are naming yourself something that requires a “him” for your very existence….Well, it feels to me like taking a stand with a moniker that is all about YOU– that just feels like it can only be a good thing.

    What do you think?


  229.  #230IamHis on May 11, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    Happy thought: my girlfriend and I were hugging, when my cute guy friend randomly came over and “joined us” in our hug.

    It made me laugh and felt good. 🙂

  230.  #231IamHis on May 11, 2014 at 5:52 pm

    aw, Cupcake you are so sweet! (Punny!) 🙂

    I love my name change.

    I used to be Iamabutterfly on here. (Read:

    It was a line from a song that talked about how the singer in the song was a butterfly.

    I loved the pain and the beauty of the singer and the sad woman he sung about.

    It was really about a bad marriage and escaping that bad marriage. I always thought the song was sad but beautiful.

    I changed by name to “IamHis” because that name change represented faith, and not fear in me.

    If I never find my earthly “the one,” I have a secure relationship with my G0d.

    (“He” is masculine from my understanding, though I don’t deny feminine qualities at all. In fact, as the Creator of the female, I question the need for gender when referring to G0d at all, but that’s a long story for a different time, lol.) 🙂

    My relationship with G0d is my most significant relationship.

    Chr1st is referred to as the bridegroom in scripture and the church is referred to as His bride.

    While I was dealing with heartache, this passage in Isaiah 54 brought me so much comfort.

    I knew that no matter how many men were careless with my heart, and no matter how many men weren’t right for me, I’m technically already married to G0d, when I entered a covenant relationship with Him in baptism.

    I belong to H1m. He is my husband.

    I do long for an earthly, physical husband, but I take great comfort in my relationship with my eternal, Heavenly Husband.

    I am His, and that’s the explanation of my name on here. 🙂

  231.  #232Cupcake on May 11, 2014 at 7:25 pm

    I am His-


    That is beautiful.

    I didn’t understand and am glad to have a better understanding now. Lovely, lovely name.

    Your friend,


  232.  #233Luzydel on May 11, 2014 at 8:09 pm

    I am trying not to write about the “bad” things men do to me. I seems that when I do that I attract more negative things from them… I will try to only write about the nice things men to to me… even it they’re simple… I want to attract nice treatment from men. So I want to talk about it more often. I seem to dread over silly negative stuff and over analyze them instead of enjoying the sweet things many men have done for me… 🙂

  233.  #234Tereana on May 11, 2014 at 8:19 pm

    Emerson, LOL!! (175) I got a big fat lol when I read that. Not at you, of course. Just because I know EXACTLY waft you are talking about… Of course, they are all different. It’s never been possible for me to generalize and say “all Indian me are like *this.*” and sometimes I think I am done with them, sometimes not.

    Interestingly, S is not Indian, but he has a mild obsession with India since traveling there several years ago. Go figure.

    V, who I met up with last week, is Indian. He’s nicer than most. But it’s never felt “meant to be.” He’s so cute, though! And soft lips. Ooh, I forgot : ) Anyway. He knows that I mostly date Indian guys. He seems to have a propensity for dating Jewish women. We’ve joked about this.

    I wish that I had not had that drama with S. As a kind of a Hail Mary, when S was getting all crazy on me, I called to see if V was still up. He wasn’t really. But I kind of let him be part of that. I regret that. Because the negative energy could spill over. I don’t want that. Yuck. So I’ve decided not to say too much about it. And a friend who was closer let me crash with her anyway. Whew

    So yeah. Anyway. I just met a couple this morning – Indian guy, white woman. They are getting married in August. So..,it can happen! Just needs to be the right guy, I guess : )

  234.  #235Tereana on May 11, 2014 at 8:23 pm

    Luzydel – that seems like a good idea!


    Ladies, I did have a really nice day today. I taught a dance class in the morning, and took yoga in the evening. I avoided my mom as much as possible. But I had a really nice dinner with my “fairy” godmother last night 🙂

    It was a good day of self-care. And a really big trigger came up. And I realized how LONELY I feel. Like, I feel better on my own sometimes. But just lonely. And I let myself feel this deeply. And then I made dinner.

    That was my night lol. Ok I’m tired. Must sleep, but just wanted to check in. Good night!

  235.  #236RileyTheOwl on May 11, 2014 at 9:00 pm

    Just going to write to myself on here, this will be a little journal entry I guess. I’m not feeling good right now, and I think just writing will help.
    I feel “Bleh” right here. I just generally don’t feel super in touch with myself today, and it’s bothering me. C is acting all distant and it makes me sad, I seem to be having trouble taking my energy back to myself and focusing on things I love, I can’t get him off my mind and it feels chasy and weird 🙁 I feel dependent on him for my happiness right now. I’m over-analyzing him and his actions towards me.
    I’m having trouble turning my feelings around today.
    I wish I had rori’s ebook, I think it would really help me make this breakthrough, I so often find myself in this position with these feelings. It is a pattern.
    I need to focus on my math, so that I past my test tomorrow. I want to get him off my mind. I feel insecurities right now. Yuck 🙁

  236.  #237Indigo on May 11, 2014 at 9:42 pm

    RileytheOwl 207,

    Hugs to you honey, that is great. It is nice when you are yourself and you let people love you for being you.

    Are you sure you have social phobia/anxiety, and are not just highly sensitive (or ultra sensitive as Dominique would call it). You sound like a prime candidate for high sensitivity to me. High sensitives usually have high emotional intelligence and empathy, and are very intuitive and sensitive to the world around them and the people in it.

    A striking feature is that they need lots of rest and alone time to recharge their batteries because they sense and feel more deeply and acutely than others.

    Dominique has some great articles on being an ultra sensitive woman.

  237.  #238RileyTheOwl on May 11, 2014 at 10:16 pm

    Indigo, I adore Dominique and her blog, so I will absorb those articles very soon! Thank you 🙂
    I am highly sensitive in that way, my therapist had me do a test to see what my levels of sensitivity are. It was interesting, because some of the options for results were whether I was seeking senses, avoiding them, or just highly sensitive. (I am highly sensitive). That test was for my physical senses, such as sight, touch, etc. I cannot be in rooms where there’s crowds, noise, bright light, etc. Like a concert. Because it triggers my anxiety. I am also emotionally sensitive of course: )
    I was diagnosed with social phobia/anxiety, although I feel like people can be to quickly diagnosed with many things these days… I was bullied when I was younger and was in an abusive relationship. That’s where I feel my issues stemmed from. So to answer your question, I do believe I am infact both sensitive, and have anxiety when I’m in large crowds. It has gotten so much better through counceling though.

    You’re right, I am an “ultra-sensitive”. it’s just me, my personality. I do need so much rest and recharge time. Have you heard of MBTI-personalities? I feel interested by them, and they help me understand myself as a sensitive, “need recharging” person : )

  238.  #239BeLoved on May 12, 2014 at 4:20 am

    Luzydel 233 – I like that idea 🙂

    I processed some feelings and triggers from the weekend on and it didn’t feel right to post it on the blog…just let them float off into the ethers felt better.

    Now that’s past, I am remembering…the utter sweetness of being with an old friend I haven’t seen for a while. My heart has missed him dearly.

    He was hooping when he saw me walk in (went to see a band this weekend) and he lit up and dropped his hoop and came right up to me, so happy to see me. He was gushing about how good it was to see me, how beautiful I look (despite having gained 70 lbs. since I saw him last..!).

    He looked at me, eyes shining, so much admiration and joy. He kept hugging and hugging me.

    I told him I felt so scared and anxious to be back hanging out in my old scene, I didn’t know what to expect and he reassured me and made me feel so comfortable and loved and welcomed, I felt at ease so quickly.

    Later on he found me and was thanking and thanking me for being there and making his night, for being a part of his amazing night. Hugged me a big, long, heart hug and told me how much he appreciated me and called me “sister”.

    I felt a twinge of sadness because I had felt “not-sister” feelings for him for a while, and also felt grounded and centered and perfect, settled. Yes, sister. Perfect. I love him. I felt loved. Yum yum yum.

    I feel bittersweet and smiley, remembering it.
    I feel expansive and teary-eyed.

    Noticing also this morning how I feel more myself than ever before. I am dressing more the way I used to dress over a decade ago (mainstream dressy casual, as opposed to hippie tye-dye and thrift store schlep) and bought a bunch of new clothes this weekend, more than I’ve bought for myself in maybe the past 2 years altogether. I feel excited about buying clothes and actually found several things I actually jumped up and down in the dressing room over. I don’t buy anything I feel ‘meh’ about anymore, I have to LOVE it and feel great in it. Which was my standard when I was a size 8, but at size 18-20 has been more challenging.

    I have a new, great job that I love and feel SO grateful for.

    This morning as I was waking up, I felt deeply into and breathed through difficult feelings of “death” and “struggle”. Felt present with feelings that came up around feeling faced with the deterioration of aging family members, bringing up unresolved feelings around my grandmother’s death. It seemed to me that she died decades before her body died and I feel anguish at such a waste of a life. I feel resolved to to whatever it takes to live a wilder and more joyful life for as long as I possibly can.

    It seems with all of the women in my family, their long, slow deterioration of mental/emotional and physical health seems to be tied with choosing to stay saddled with a man way beneath them. Why – only they know but I imagine it’s for security, comfort, predictability, out of fear of change.

    So, I’m feeling empowered and amazing in my singleness. Like Rori has said, nobody says we have to be married, or be in a relationship, and there’s no reason for me to anchor myself to anyone who feels more like a burden. I feel so much more free and happy on my own than I ever have before and it feels really, really good. I actually have no desire to make space for a relationship in my life right now. I want to keep the focus on developing school/career/creative/social endeavors.

    I even sort of feel a “pushing away” energy – more than disinterest, maybe feelings of actively pushing away a relationship because I never ever want to feel dragged down and mired in a sh!tty relationship again. Ever. Ever ever ever. 7 months post-NC with T and the feeling of all of those old hooks mostly dissolved makes me feel like I can fly now, makes me feel like jump up and down happy.

    T used to accuse me of wanting to do just this…get happy and run off and go wheeee!!! without him. I felt so guilty and horrible, because it is exactly what I wanted to do and I believed it was wrong, lol.

    Wheee!! Hahahaha!! Wheeee!! Here I go!

    Okay, time to shower and get to work. Much love to you all xoxoxoxooxoxoxox


  239.  #240BeLoved on May 12, 2014 at 4:23 am

    Feeling very “catch me if you can!” this morning 🙂

    Minxy and happy. Just, fricking HAPPY.


  240.  #241BeLoved on May 12, 2014 at 4:24 am

    danceparty alone in my room before work happy.

    smiling from my heart happy.

    overflowing happy.

    thankyouthankyou yesyesyes don’t wanna stop with the happy…!!


  241.  #242Kyla on May 12, 2014 at 5:20 am

    I hope everyone had a lovely weekend!

    I’m off on a mini business trip today and Ninja is watching my kids for me tonight. Half his stuff is already in my house and that feels surprising really good. We had a lovely weekend with all the kids.. pj parties, a nerd festival, picnics and a road trip. He met the rest of my family last night too. I feel so happy. We are going to go away this weekend just the 2 of us and I’m so looking forward to it. I can’t remember the last time I felt this good. Everyday feels like an adventure.

  242.  #243Femininewoman on May 12, 2014 at 5:34 am

    Congrats Kyla

  243.  #244PixyStix on May 12, 2014 at 6:34 am


    I feel totally immersed in your story.

    I want to shed some light on “the other side”. I don’t know if it will help you necessarily. Maybe it will, I don’t know. But at the very least it can give you an inside peek.

    I agree with april rose in that I feel him (in your story) as predatory. I don’t feel triggered so i’m 99% sure this will be simply un-biased information.

    When my ex husband was having affairs he was known to make up stories about me in order to gain sympathy from the women he was seeking out. I recognize the role I played, I wasn’t perfect either. However, I know that what I heard about the things he said simply wasn’t true.
    He said I wouldn’t have sex with him. When the truth was I was dying for his affection. More literally, begging for it (not the most effective way to earn it, I know, but that’s just what WAS actually happening).
    He told them all the mean things I said to him. I probably gave (and still give-from a distance) him more credit than he ever earned.

    Understand that the things you hear from him may not be entirely true, or may even be the complete opposite from the ACTUAL truth about who his wife is.
    All of this is manipulation to gain sympathy from people. Manipulation to get people to like him, to be on his side. I won’t bother getting into the “why” of it…But it’s working very well. As you say…Everyone likes him. Just like everyone liked my ex. Even friends that were my friends first, who know how he behaved and heard the lies first hand STILL like him. Heck…I still like him. Feels weird to say that…Oh well. Is what it is.

    So anyways. That’s my story for what it’s worth.
    What you are seeing, hearing (smelling?) It’s not the TRUTH. It may be a version of the truth. It may be HIS truth. But it is not REAL truth. I hope this gives you a “window” or insight at the very least. Sending you love!

    And it’s not your fault. You are NOT guilty of an emotional affair.

  244.  #245PixyStix on May 12, 2014 at 7:02 am


    You sound so lovely. You are so young and have such a journey ahead of you. I feel sad to read about some of your experiences…Being forced, and abused. Having to go through things like that is truly awful. And at the same time, you are a beautiful human being who brings a unique experience and perspective to the world.

    I would love for you to feel out the idea that your tears, and your fears are yours to feel and express when they come up. The guy you are seeing sounds like a wonderful person to be vulnerable with. Feel out the idea that your feelings and tears will bring him no harm. As a male seeing a female romantically (any male, any female) emotions are something he is going to see and experience. There is no need to protect him from them.
    It’s hard to say if this particular guy will be someone you will spend your life with, and if it did turn out that way, you will know he has the capability to be solid through emotional times.
    It is important for you, as a wisening woman, not to stuff or hide or bury yourself under *trying* not to turn off a man, or shut yourself off to protect him.
    That is not to say, just go and unload on him whenever you can. Just that, as you are now, you are beautifully open.
    You also have a huge head start on all this learning and growing and healing and experiencing and healing again stuff.
    It’s a life long journey.


  245.  #246Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:11 am

    Riley #170
    “Okay, wait. I LOVE that I feel sad and scared during intercourse. I love my little girl inside who feels scared of being abandoned… Riley, I love you. Let me hold you and embrace you. and I forgive myself for beating myself up about it… <3"

  246.  #247Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:15 am

    RileytheOwl #173
    You are sooo welcomed here…
    You too have much to share and teach…
    You are soooo much further along about loving and understanding yourself at your age than I was.

    I’m not understanding why you can’t discuss your trauma about the sexual abuse from your ex with your current therapist?

  247.  #248Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:30 am

    IamHis #176
    Have you said these things to Him?
    “Have you talked about your emotional, physical, and sexual needs with your wife?.”

    I had the same thing happen to me when I started a job just last year… (I think he took advantage of me being new)
    Of course come to find out he is a BIG flirt… he would suggest drinks after work (sometimes with coworkers sometimes not)
    group outings with his wife included
    and flirt and stare at me…with her there…
    I would ignore him walk with other coworkers (he would pout and act like I was hurting his feelings!!!! AHHHH!!)
    and all of the things you wrote about…
    except for the pharamones spray (how disgusting)
    eventually I complained to my bosses boss (my boss thought he was in love with her???!!)

    He was moved to a different office…
    He continued to be around me when others weren’t there…
    I finally said… “You are married… I feel VERY uncomfortable when you are here with me alone.
    Please don’t do this anymore…”
    He quit doing these things
    and we hardly spoke after that!
    It was a BIG release!!

  248.  #249Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:34 am

    PS… At times i felt turned on and flattered by all his attentions (so that was confusing)

    but also I felt VERY powerless during allll of this…
    I felt frightened and bullied by him…
    He was one of my bosses and had been at this company for 23 years
    I felt scared of loosing my job if i said anything.

    I felt like I took back my power when I told him to never come around again.

  249.  #250Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:41 am

    I TOTALLY agree with AprilRose 195
    “On second thoughts I don’t think I would want my man around a divine and deliciously attractive siren like you, IamHis!”

    “I believe you have behaved impeccably.
    You have put your self and your career first,
    in the face of an extremely challenging situation.”

    You have been such a Siren through some REALLY tough times in a HIGH Stress job.
    Yay to YOU!!!

  250.  #251Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:52 am

    Waterfall #197
    Yes… Start LOVING on YOU!!! Get the ebook
    and read
    AND practice, practice, practice feeling messages,
    What is Your POP? Purpose on the Planet!!
    YOU are the PRIZE!!
    Love all the feelings YOU have
    You said “I felt
    abandoned and
    You felt Scared,
    and Unlovable
    Gently find those feelings
    hold them in your arms and
    Paint Love potion ALL over them
    hour after hour…
    Baby steps… this all takes time.
    love to you… darlin’ siren!

  251.  #252Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 7:55 am

    Daria #203
    So true
    Love, love this!!!

  252.  #253Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 8:18 am

    Beloved 241
    Your Happyness is catching and I am feeling
    and twirlly in my office…
    Thanks for sharing!!!
    Happiness is like a hick-up
    Its catchy!!! :-)))

  253.  #254Azure Blu on May 12, 2014 at 9:16 am

    I feel all smiley and sunny hearing about your weekend and the happiness you are feeling now in your life and your relationship with Ninja!!

  254.  #255Liquid Light on May 12, 2014 at 10:08 am

    woohooo, Kyla!!!!!

  255.  #256Dominique on May 12, 2014 at 10:14 am

    RileyThe Owl – 238 – Thank you so much. I feel honored. Here are the three articles around ultra-sensitivity.


  256.  #257Dominique on May 12, 2014 at 10:14 am

  257.  #258Dominique on May 12, 2014 at 10:14 am

  258.  #259Tereana on May 12, 2014 at 6:25 pm

    Oy. I feel so tired and sleepy today. Maybe it’s the heat… Anyway. I keep thinking of messages to send to S. But the thing is, they would feel good to me, and I might be “right,” but then there’s that old question: do you want to be right or do you want to be loved?

    Grah. I want to be both. Lol

    No, actually. I would much RATHER be loved. But it’s so much EASIER to be right.


    So anyway, before I wrote anything to S (it’s been almost a week since the “incident.” I wonder what he is thinking about it?), I was looking through some old messages to another guy that I dated and who rejected me for what I thought was a spurious reason. And I was mad. I am pretty sure I never sent a one of those emails. But what was interesting was that the “story” I was telling about why he left me, and how good I was for him, and he was so “stupid” and “idiotic” to make that choice…well, it didn’t feel good to read, for one thing. And it is almost EXACTLY the story I’ve been telling myself about S. With some other details, of course. But a very similar trajectory. It’s all so weird. I don’t know where that comes from. Why would I believe that? Am I telling myself that to make myself feel better? Probably? How would I feel if I didn’t believe those things? What would appear true to me if I did not need to be “right” about this story? S told me lies about me. But he might have told me truths about himself. What would those truths be?

    Where I started from was a feeling like I wanted to write him a feeling message. But then again, someone who has made it a point to hurt your feelings probably isn’t the right person to engage with on that level.

    Here is what I accuse the men of, invariably: fear. I say that they are full of fear and running away from themselves. And maybe they are! But even if so, it must be true that it is my own fear that I feel so acutely.

  259.  #260Tereana on May 12, 2014 at 6:26 pm

    And I’m afraid of the fear. I’m ashamed of it. I reject the fear.

    Like that old saying, “we have nothing to fear but fear itself”? Well, I’m afraid of the fear. Ha!

    Ok where am I going with this. I have no idea…

  260.  #261Tereana on May 12, 2014 at 6:30 pm

    Azure Blu 248 & 249 – awesome! I feel so great reading how you took back your power with your boss. Yay! I feel inspired

  261.  #262Nora on May 14, 2014 at 4:39 pm

    Hi Rory,
    I got your book and I have tried consistently to do every tool. I am (was?) in a relationship with a man for almost 4 years… He was very clear that he didn’t want a girlfriend, I didn’t belive him… during the first two years it was very painful, I found your blog out of desperation and followed some advice… things got better when I did the basic lean back, it was very hard for me not contact him, but to my surprise he realized how he felt about me and started to pursue me and even started to introduce me as his girlfriend… this year he introduced me to his 5 year old son, he was very afraid of her ex response, so that’s why it took him so long… the boy loved me, he was really excited about me, it was very surprising so, the ex found out about me very soon and they have had a lot of problems because of this event…

    For so long, I have felt that I want to be married and I want to have a child, I am 35 years old… but because of what he said about not having even a girlfriend, I kept it to myself… because of your book and advise on your blog, I came to a point to be honest. I have spent so much time living by some strange rules made up to keep peace with his ex that I became accostumed to feel my truth.

    We talked about this in the worst possible time, we were fighting about trivial stuff that I felt was a cover up of a fight he had with his ex, who is not letting him see his child… the fight was several days… but finally we were able to focus and stop being defensive and he said he didn’t want to marry and that he doesn’t have the means to support another child right now, and that if he ever does, I’ll be too old to have a baby… We decided to be apart. I have done a lot of work not to contact him, to believe him, really believing, thanks for all your tools. He has contacted me several times, he is in great pain, at first he was angry, now he is back to normal and I can feel he is very sad and anxious, but his mind doesn´t change… this morning he texted me and said “please block me, I can’t stop writing to you…” I didn’t, I was warm, I said I love you so much, and I feel so sad we have to go our separate ways… and really mean it.

    What do I do?? Should I stop all contact? Is there hope? I cannot be in this relationship without planning a future, it’s been too long, and too painful because I was clueless plus his issues… If I hadn’t come accross your work I could not say this truly… I

  262.  #263Rori Raye on May 15, 2014 at 6:06 pm

    Nora – you sound brilliant, lovely and deserving of all the love in the world – what you must do is CIRCULAR DATE!!! We’ll help you here, and get ‘Targeting Mr Right so you can understand the therapeutic aspect of it….Love, Rori

  263.  #264Madi Brown on May 17, 2014 at 4:16 pm

    Madibrown doesn’t think that you can SCHEDULE love and a relationship…..If you could they would probably add it onto the curriculum while you’re in college. Get Your Man 101.

    For Reals, and Love you the most,
    Madi Brown