More On Circular Dating

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moviedateJust to clarify – Circular Dating is not about dating.

It doesn’t even need to INCLUDE “dating.”

Circular Dating is a therapeutic tool for interacting with men out in the world and using my tools.


That can look like an encounter with the butcher at the market. A short conversation with a man at Starbucks. Or an actual date.

It’s about learning to open your heart, feel steady when your heart is open, trust yourself and stay sane.

Targeting Mr. Right – my program on Circular Dating – explores ALL possibilities of CDing – from conversations at work to actual dates.

The thing is this: Some women are just naturally “cool.”

They can tolerate “limbo.”

They somehow know, deep inside, that a man is going to come through, and they can “wait him out” peacefully.

Most of us, however – are NOT like that.

Being naturally “cool” is unusual.

A naturally cool woman likely NEVER has a problem with relationships at all!

So – we’re now about: How do you stay “cool” when you’re in “limbo” – and yet EXCLUSIVELY committed to a man who is trying to make a decision if you’re the right one for him?

And that’s what we’re doing here:

Working at feeling so good that we can be cool – no matter what.

But – what if you can’t?

What if you’re not there? What if waiting a man out feels like torture and you start to get weird and insecure and scared? No matter HOW lovely he is?

That’s where Circular Dating can save you. You just have to know how to do it so you’re not wrecking your relationship.

If you’re “holding your tongue,” and not asking the guy every few minutes whether he wants to marry you, or if he’s in love with you – even though you WANT to – where do you go with those feelings?

Yes, you can go to your girlfriends. You can go to therapy. You can find hobbies and get involved in other things that make you feel good and like you’re contributing to the world.

Or – you can do what I did and go to another city for the weekend to sit and think and walk around.

You can go out with your girlfriends and sing karaoke in a bar where there are tons of men and talk to them – without dating them.

You can go to an art class where there are 10 men drawing the nude model…and you can talk to them.

There are a bunch of ways to use Circular Dating.

You can go out for coffee with people you meet at a lecture.

Where Does Trust Figure In, Here?

In an act of trust and commitment, I allowed my husband/then boyfriend to move in with me. Not a smart move necessarily, but it worked out in the end.

Trust happens all throughout the day. Different men have different levels of trust available to them. They are also different in the levels of “danger” they’re attracted to.

My husband told me this last night: “I think every man is looking for his dream girl.”

And that, to me is the closest assessment of all this: He’s looking for his dream girl.

The question is ALWAYS – am I “her”?

And if he doesn’t know – then what exactly are you supposed to do?

I know several couples with blissfully happy relationships who are NOT married because “marriage” is too traumatic a concept for those men. And yet – they are some of the best relationships I know about in terms of emotional content.

The assumption here is that WE, as women, are also looking for OUR dream man!

Is that true?

Are we assessing our willingness to commit forever to a man?

Lots of questions to ask. Of men, of ourselves.

And, for me, Circular Dating is the way to get clarity on all those questions.

Intimacy is a terrifying thing for most of us. It’s a condition where we get closer emotionally to another person than we’re used to – and closer than we think we can bear.

It takes bravery and practice to go outside our comfort zones.

And I know this for sure: If we women cave into our fears and insecurities and start demanding a level of intimacy a man is not ready to handle – we lose.

If, instead, we work on our OWN fear of intimacy, open our hearts to allow a man in, with as much warmth as possible whenever he DOES venture in close – and use Circular Dating to stay sane and centered and self-appreciative while the process is unfolding – we have a huge chance of having what we truly want with a man.

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Karol on July 28, 2014 at 6:43 am

    Hi Rori,

    I am in that limbo right now. My husband (one year marriage – three years relationship) starting to back off in a very light way. I can see his body language. He is leaning back. He is a photographer. Used to be a model photographer. Now he photographs sports and family, because models gave us a lot of issues. I was leaning forward, I “got it” and I am working on simple back off a little bit. But I am struggling with the open part now (leaning back and be open when you see he is hiding something is very difficult). He even said that I am acting strange and that I am not relaxed anymore, which makes me more tense. He said I like a lot to do “relationship talk” and he hates. He starts saying: what happens with you, you look tense, and I start to say how I feel and I can’t complete the sentence and he says owww here “comes again – you always want to talk about how you feel” . Which makes me think that he doesn’t really know how I feel, he just want me to act the way he wants at the time he wants and back off when he wants. I caught him looking into an old picture of one of his models. I feel he really likes this girls, I’ve already told him that, he got angry when I said it, he said very loud that he was a professional. I didn’t say anything when I caught him, I couldn’t pretend that I was ok with it, but I choose to shut me up because I feel like I can’t say anything about how I really feel, think or want.
    The truth is… he likes perfect beauty girls, he always say that I am not but I am ok. I have to walk away buecause I want a man who simple adores me or who I am and I am just not have the courage to leave him. At least not now.

  2.  #2Tanea on July 28, 2014 at 6:43 am

    Hello ladies,
    I did a post but I dont see it on the last blog! Anyway I need some advise on this guy ive been on and off for 2 years. I met him when he was gong thru a dicvorce. He’s now 29 and his ex is 46. We have been thru so much within this time frame. We have had times that we got alone very well and other times where we couldnt see eye to eye. I honestly thought he was done with his ex but apparently he wasn’t. Because I had been thru the same thing with my ex i knew what it was like to go back or still want that person. Anyway when he wanted to go back to her he would ignore my calls and texts until she got mad with him and he would call me back. This was an ongoing pattern for a long time. Ive taken this guy back every time he called. So just April this year he changed his number and left to go where his ex is which is about 2000-3000 miles away. The end of April he finally contacted me telling me how unhappy he was with this woman, saying he knew he didn’t want her, and upset because she couldnt give him any kids. So the end of April he came back to his home town. He begged to have me back saying he know he was done and asked me to marry him. We was geting alone so well and started ring shopping. June he started saying we wasnt making it because I wouldnt let the past go and so he started ignoring me until he seen me out. July he is now saying he is remarried to his ex. What is really wrong with this guy???? Im so confused!

  3.  #3Femininewoman on July 28, 2014 at 9:17 am


  4.  #4Labbit on July 28, 2014 at 10:06 am

    This is such a brilliant post and could not have come at a better time for me! Reuniting with TenderCD has been an adventure, even as I continue to circular date. For the last week and a half, I’d been facing down trigger after trigger. So many emotions came up from my subconscious…anxiety, fear, joy, love, vulnerability. I felt like I was going through life or death trials. (An exaggeration of reality of course but that’s truly how it felt!)

    I remember one day last week being so anxious about whether or not to reach out to him, my head just spinning. We talked every day and each time I took a baby step towards being ever more open with him. Sharing how I was feeling, really feeling inside, even when it felt scary and unnatural to share! So much panic leading up to it each time, but also a feeling of trust in myself that this was the right way to go. Through each trial I was able to use the tools I know now, like painting myself with love or the fountain tool or any other tool I could think of to give my boy energy something to do, to give myself love and compassion even as my girl energy was struggling with all these emotions.

    Finally last Friday everything seemed to clear for a time. Just like that, TenderCD was right there. We spent an amazing night together on Friday and he was naturally open with me, sharing things from in his heart that we’d never come close to last time we dated. He told me how safe he felt with me which felt so, so good. Highest compliment I could have gotten in that moment. Nothing was forced, it all was like an upward spiral of opening up between us.

    On Saturday we didn’t want to part, though life had other plans. What felt great was that in the past I would have spent all day Saturday thinking about him, strategizing for our next date and trying to find ways to bring him in closer, or excuses to reach out to him. This past Saturday I had almost no sign of those urges. If they came up it was easy to give them a cookie, put them in a corner of my mind and return focus to loving myself and doing what I had to do or wanted to do. Then on Sunday he surprised me with a call and we chatted for nearly an hour. Our phone calls used to be so forced, maybe 10 minutes of superficial conversation. Sunday’s call was two lovers connecting and growing intimacy. I don’t care where this goes. I’m not thinking about the future. I’m enjoying what is. I love being surprised!

    I feel peaceful. Like a bubble. Floating, tingling, loving. Especially myself. It feels easy to circular date everyone right now as the love just radiates out…

  5.  #5Adriel on July 28, 2014 at 10:07 am

    Working in a male-dominated industry, interacting however briefly with dozens of men every day, I supposed I “circular date” without really even being aware of it, huh? I’ve definitely learned lots about men through all these years. It’s just sometimes hard to be the same, cool, light-hearted way I am with with men I barely know with men I’m emotionally invested in. I am definitely terrified of love and in way past my comfort zone with one man in my life. (Meaning he’s a good man and he’s good to me and he wants me in his life and it’s terrifying because I’ve never had a good relationship with a man I could be so real and vulnerable with!) I guess that’s where I just have to deal with my sometimes-overwhelming anxiety that a man like him could never really want a woman like me, and just be cool and continue to have good experiences with the other people I meet every day, and ride that wave, and let this thing happen in its own way and time.

  6.  #6Labbit on July 28, 2014 at 10:10 am

    Also, since I am continuing to circular date my confidence keeps on growing. Every time I check my online dating inboxes there are messages from men interested in me and I can set up dates as I please. I was quite shocked last Thursday when a man on the subway started a conversation with me and then asked me out! I totally see how CDing keeps my focus on me, gives me an abundance of opportunities to practice and makes it easier to avoid fixating on any one man, no matter how wonderful he is. 😉 I like stoking his curiosity about me. It feels incredible when a man comes towards me and I’ve put no effort in beyond being myself.

  7.  #7RileyTheOwl on July 28, 2014 at 12:53 pm

    My tummy feels full of butterflies and I feel nervous and excited and jumpy and confused.

    Breathe…. I don’t need to be nervous, I don’t need to feel guilty.

    I feel so relieved and soothed and steadied to be back at siren island, my life has been so full of new experiences this past month, which gives me many things to share that I NEED to sort out on here, yet I don’t know where to start 😛

  8.  #8RileyTheOwl on July 28, 2014 at 1:03 pm

    I guess I’ll start with the most recent, as it’s what’s making me feel excited and nervous. I just spent a week on vacation for a family reunion, and I met this man at a camp fire on the beach on the last night. We chatted for awhile, and he kept hinting that he wants to see me back in Victoria. (We discovered we both live in the same city). I have never been friends with a man whose even a little older than me, and he is 24. he doesn’t know I have a boyfriend, and I just want to be friends with him. We’re seeing each other on Wednesday to do hula hooping together. (He teaches it and is really good). Even though I am not interested in anything more than friendship, I feel guilt because he doesn’t know this. He hasn’t expressed that he wants anything more either, but I sense that he feels some attraction to me through compliments and persistence to see me. I feel excitement because this feels like circular dating, but I feel nervous because I’ve never done this before.

  9.  #9Rori Raye on July 28, 2014 at 3:40 pm

    Karol – my question for you is – “Where are YOU in all this?” I don’t hear anything about who YOU are, what you do, what you love, what your work is….it seems you’re totally focused on him, which is the problem here. It’s not possible to “back off” unless you have somewhere to “go TO.” My Certified coaches can help you almost instantly with this. Go look in the directory of Coaches over in the sidebar on the right. Love, Rori

  10.  #10Linda on July 28, 2014 at 7:20 pm

    I was going thru a drawer earlier tonight. Looking for something I still can not find and I ran across 2 envelopes. One was a hand written letter that I received from a man that I dated for a couple of months after I broke things off with him. (I just was not attracted to him)… I read the letter. The words warmed my heart to know that he regarded me so highly and wrote about how I made alive my being around made him feel. It made me feel happy to know that I had touched his life in such a good way.

    The second was a envelope from a man filled with love notes written on napkins that I found in my lunches that he would pack for me. The words on the napkins that used to move and captivate the deepest parts of my heart and soul. At the time they were written I believed every word with every fiber of my being. I was soo very deeply in love with the man who wrote these to me. We were together for almost 2 years until one day…he poofed! This is the event that brought me to this blog). Tonight as I read them I felt detached and and cold . They were just words and meaningless dribble to me now from a man who promised me forever but left me without warning. Tonight I threw them all in the trash.

    I have thought tonight… how open, trusting and in love my heart was back then. I would like to think that I can be that way again.

  11.  #11Millie on July 28, 2014 at 7:57 pm

    Tanea– Rori responded to you on the previous thread, don’t know if you saw it. I would ask yourself, do you want a man who ignores you? His reason for doing what he does, doesn’t really matter. The question is, what do you want in a man and is he capable of giving it?

  12.  #12Millie on July 28, 2014 at 7:59 pm

    Labbit– what you are experiencing sounds so beautiful. I love your analogy of spiraling upwards with intimacy. I wish I could create that with someone. 🙂

  13.  #13Millie on July 28, 2014 at 8:02 pm

    Linda– my parents still write love notes to each other after being married 33 years. It’s funny how we can feel so detached from things that used to mean so much to us. I have gifts from an ex that I used to cherish. I still love them, but they remind me more of me now and not him. He isn’t ever-present, which is good.

  14.  #14Millie on July 28, 2014 at 8:16 pm

    I had a really amazing weekend. My new calling in life is horseback riding. I can’t express how elated I feel, immersing myself in this new calling. I took a lesson one day, and went on a trail ride the next. Needless to say my bum hurts and I have a vastness to learn, but I’m so excited, I cant wait until my next lesson! Satisfying my desire to ride had me feeling light as air without a care in the world most of the weekend. I felt “in the moment” and laughed and enjoyed just being. I went to a party with friends sat night. I knew Mechanic would be there with this woman that is staying with him. I’m proud of myself for staying in my body of how I felt and didn’t allow speculation of what might be happening between the two of them overtake me. I was friendly with her and did not ask any “innocent questions.” He approached me several times and talked with me, we took a photo together, and you should see how big my smile is. I don’t know if he has feelings for her or not, I suspect he does, but I’m content with never knowing and never asking. All I need to be concerned with is me and what feels good to me. I really wish my feelings for him would go away and more CD opportunities would show up.

  15.  #15Azure Blu on July 28, 2014 at 10:06 pm

    MarikaB #11…
    WOW!!! You are a Siren!!!
    I am smiling reading how brave and vulnerable you are being!!!

    You have inspired me to keep leaning back…
    riding my horse… doing things I love!!
    A date a week in advance!!! Yes…
    You are loving YOU more and MORE!!!

  16.  #16Azure Blu on July 28, 2014 at 10:09 pm

    I feel energized reading about your horseback riding…
    You sound sooo happy…
    When we do a thing we love… it is like feeding our soul.
    Mmmm… I love how you feel doing it!!

  17.  #17Azure Blu on July 28, 2014 at 10:14 pm

    Sighhhhh… this all sounds sooo lovely…
    sooo good to read about how, even though you were scared and anxious, you kept giving YOU love and attention…
    A helpful reminder for me…
    When a man’s loving energy is coming toward me…
    and I feel anxious and overwhelmed…
    Also the tool of giving your NV a cookie!!!
    love that…

  18.  #18Azure Blu on July 28, 2014 at 10:22 pm

    Mmmmm… I feel your strength when I read about you throwing the notes from the one cd, in the trash…

    Someone disappearing with NO explanation would be devastating… crazy making… mind bending…
    How did you get through it???
    Did he ever contact you?

  19.  #19Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 12:13 am


    That’s wonderful!! 🙂

  20.  #20Kim on July 29, 2014 at 4:45 am

    I feel kind of inspired reading your comments today, and how some of you rurn things around with awareness and leaning back and loving yourselves. That’s how I feel…aah.

    Now, hm. I feel nervous about this week. Like I have to make a decision about two men…I also have a date with a third lol.
    I was really thinking about the guy who was dating me on and off for a long time and that we could be each others best friends and he has this stable life, and all these things are so much more important to me than the chemistry in love feeling and gazing into each others eyes. Lol. I am almost nervous of the talk we will have Wednesday. What if he offers me the commitment that I wanted. What if I suddenly have to make a decision about him and us? Gulp!!! I feel nervous. Eeek.

    I almost thought wild child was dropping off…and I felt relieved as well as a little sad, and then I got this from him:

    ‘I’ve wanted to text and my battery was a little low. This week is going to be a scramble for me but I’ve already been thinking of just taking another evening off and seeing if you want to spend some time together. It’s only Monday. So if you think that’s a good idea, let me know, let’s see what we can work out.
    I don’t really want to skip from weekend to weekend or every other.
    With all that out… Blah, I wish I was falling asleep with you tonight! That’s the part I’m curious about. Could we? More often. I know I’d sleep better.’

    Lol. So much for the dropping off.
    I am booked up all week, except for tonight, we made tentative plans (he has a couple of last minute projects to finish by middle of week). Do I have to tell him I am dating others? The whole truth? I want to be honest and not like he was with the fact that he is still living with an ex.
    I do not want to withold information. To me it feels like a crumbly foundation for anything.

  21.  #21IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 4:51 am

    Saw R has been back on Tinder. I feel a little angry and a little sad. He didn’t have to ask me out on a second date and then blow me off! He could’ve just ended it there. Feel rejected. Feeling rejected feels so bad. I’m not used to it. Probably because I don’t put myself out there enough. I can almost hear my mother smiling from a distance and saying I told you so! & then criticizing my body, absent-mindedness, my messiness. All the things I have trouble loving in myself. It’s really hard to love aspects of myself that I feel like other people would struggle to love as well. R made me feel good.

  22.  #22IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:00 am

    Talked to another guy and told him about R. Not that R stood me up, but that I found his mugshot online! It felt good to question R’s character. I don’t know him very well at all, but he has to be somewhat of a jerk for standing me up like that. I told B that R was my first Tinder guy to meet in real life. B said he hadn’t met anyone. When I asked him why, he said he recently went through a break-up. I said, isn’t the whole point of this site to meet people? He said he would meetME, so I gave him my number & he’s supposed to get in touch with me today.

  23.  #23IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:04 am

    I really need to love on myself and feel good. If I’m going to be completely honest, one of the reasons I want to put myself out there is because I feel so angry with my Mom. I want great guys falling all over me, & I want to tell her how wrong she is about how undesirable to men I am. I think my anger towards her is pushing me to get over my fears.

  24.  #24IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:08 am

    I feel so sad and angry and scared. I’m also freaking out about turning 30 soon. It feels like a death sentence, not because there’s anything wrong with that age, but something about that age and my personal lack of experience feels humiliating. It makes me feel undesirable, especially to younger men.

  25.  #25IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:30 am

    Kim, I feel jealous! 🙂

  26.  #26Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 5:32 am


    Yip, this is dating. You can see now why Rori encourages us to have lots of men in the mix. You’ll get better at discerning the quality ones the more practice you get. Yes, some may poof or stand you up. Don’t get too hung up on what it means. And DEFINITELY don’t take it as saying anything about your worth.


  27.  #27IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:33 am

    It can’t be healthy to have a desire to date simply to prove a point to your mother…

  28.  #28IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:37 am

    ((((Indigo)))) Thank you! It feels so good to have your support.

  29.  #29Femininewoman on July 29, 2014 at 5:40 am

    Iamhis end what?

    You can’t end something that hasn’t started. It was just one date.

    Would you have preferred to be several dates down the road and have him flake like that? Or down the relationship road to have him disappear?

    Seems to me you are making up a lot of stories like an only child who plays with imaginary friends and make up stories about what they do together.

    Really! What does I feel undesirable mean when there is no men telling you that you are undesirable?

    Do you feel undesirable to yourself? That can only indicate that you are rejecting yourself is my humble opinion.

  30.  #30Femininewoman on July 29, 2014 at 5:44 am

    I would look at the words I said to her to understand why she came to that conclusion. I believe that is where the clue is rather than hating on her.

    Unless she is on dates with you how else can she assess what the men are feeling?

    I say either ask her what she meant or look for the value in her words to shift how you are being to get the result you want. Everyone we interact with has some lesson to teach us about ourselves. Our choice of words, their choice of words might not be perfect but there is always something to learn.

  31.  #31Adriel on July 29, 2014 at 5:45 am

    IamHis (#28),

    It can be healthy if dating/relationship/marriage is what you want and your mother had previously discouraged you from finding what you want. Anger/rage is not a bad thing, it is good when we use it to discover what it is we are truly angry about and we let it move us to act in the way we truly want, to set right something that’s been wrong.

  32.  #32IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:45 am

    I feel skin hungry. It would feel good to be hugged. I miss M. He moved away. He was always touching me. He triggered me big time because of the super sexual way he used to look at me. I’m still trying to figure out why that was so triggering. Made me feel angry and turned on and good all at once. He also made me laugh and made me think. I feel like I messed that one up with my fear anger combo. I liked how people used to watch us. I suspected some jealousy from both guys and girls when he and I were talking, flirting, embracing. He never asked me out though…

  33.  #33Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 5:51 am


    I am with Feminine Woman – it is not wise to get hung up on what you *think* other people (your mother, these men) are thinking about you. Since none of us actually know for sure what people are thinking about us, most of it is likely projection of what we secretly fear or find hard to love about ourselves, which is why it’s better not to even go there. Put all your focus on what you think and feel about you – your experiences, everything around you, especially what feels good… Try for a while not thinking about other people at all. Not getting into their heads.

  34.  #34IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:55 am

    FW – all I meant was that if he wasn’t that into me after our first date, he didn’t have to ask me for a second date. I feel triggered because I know I have a tendency towards imaginary relationships. I have also never been on a 4th date. I feel embarrassed about this.

  35.  #35sequoia on July 29, 2014 at 5:58 am

    this post felt very good to read and it highlighted things I needed to know, that to Cd I do not need actual dates and I realised that I am CDing a lot already esp. at work as I am meeting a lot of man there and actually are encouraged to flirt with them there.

    Marikaberg it felt good to read your post, that you are doing somany great things. riding waterskiing wow and that T ask you out so much in advance.

    G called last night, I felt very surprised, and he asked to see me on Sunday too.
    I shared with him that I feel curious to get to know him better and that it would feel good to find out if doing other things than being in bed with him would feel as great as that.
    He told me that he is going to have more time to meet from next sunday onwards—-so lets see.

    Meanwhile I am going to use my working environment to practice the tools. I met E-Cd there and there are a few others I would like to come towards me too.

    And I want to date myself more too, I might take a trip away for a day or so and I am going on a two week trip net month…feeling excited about this.

  36.  #36IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 5:59 am

    @34 Indigo. This is very good advice and provides clarity. Thank you. I truthfully do feel kind of lousy about myself right now.

  37.  #37IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 6:02 am

    @36 sequoia – your first paragraph felt very good to read. I feel so teary…

  38.  #38IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 6:06 am

    @32 – Thank you, Adriel. This feels helpful as well.

  39.  #39Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 6:07 am

    IamHis 37,

    This is where your work is. This is where ALL your focus must go. You will attract into your life what you believe about yourself, including in the way men treat you… so it’s absolutely vital you start down the path to self-love and stay on it. You don’t have to be perfect at it, just keep moving towards more self-love and self-acceptance.

  40.  #40Kim on July 29, 2014 at 6:18 am

    Indigo, lovin’ your comments..helping me a lot too.

  41.  #41Tanea on July 29, 2014 at 6:39 am

    Millie 12,

  42.  #42Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 6:42 am

    You sweet, lovely Siren…
    You are being sooo brave opening yourself to us here on Siren Island… oxoxo

    I do understand about a mother that is sooo judgemental and how it is affecting your life…
    You are very young and have already begun to work with the RR tools…
    Yay YOU!!!

    I too struggle with fear/anger when getting closer to men…
    After many years of working through the neglect and abuse from my mother…
    and using the RR tools of MUCH self LOVE and
    constantly checking in with MY FEELINGS…
    The wonderfulness of realizing I can parent MYSELF..
    and visualize my little girl and talk to her softly, gently
    this has changed MY life!!
    You are doing really good Darling woman!!!
    Soo glad you feel safe to share here with us.

  43.  #43Linda on July 29, 2014 at 6:47 am

    Azure @ 19. How did I get thru it? Not to be trite but it was one day at a time.

    The pain of him leaving was unbearable. My skin literally ached for weeks. I couldnt eat and lost 40 pds. I eventually sought professional help which was totally unbeneficial. I sought faith based help from a chaplain at work which was disasterous as he started “hitting on me “. It culminated with him kissing me on the lips…. to which I reported and he was dismissed. I cried every single day for months especially when I pulled up in my driveway after work.

    Although he maintained a small studio apartment, we basically lived together and he had lots and lots of things in my home. I could barely stand to be there. I entertained thoughts of sucide but my christian faith stopped me.

    It was not long after he left that I discovered he was involved with another woman out of state, was living a double life with me. Even later I found that he had been using my computer and found remains of activity with yet other women. He sure had me fooled I thought he sincerely loved me.

    I heard from him about 8 mos after he left, inquiring about all this things he had left behind. I gathered everything that I had not altready thrown away and heaped them in a messy pile in the side yard. It rained on them. I did not even care. I have never spoke or seen him again.

    This was 7 years ago. It was not until I found this blog that my healing began… it started with me painting myself with love.

  44.  #44Linda on July 29, 2014 at 6:57 am

    Revisiting my journey since I found this community while writing my earlier post here is sobering to me.

  45.  #45Karol on July 29, 2014 at 6:58 am

    Thank you Rori!
    I used in my life your Modern Siren program 3 years ago. It was great. Thanks for your program, I did CD a lot and found him that time in middle of a lot of men. I was just one of his girls, but he was also one of my guys. I was very honest, told him that I want a relationship and he kne he could lose me if he wouldn’t step up. So he did! We started our relationship and less than one year we were living together. Now we are planning our wedding. Planning kids, planning and working in the whole package. But somewhere, since we started living together, I lost my siren and I just can’t take her back. I used to be Rock Star Free Spirit. Now I feel I lost my “pepper”.
    Truth? Feeling confused, because I studied your book, your blog, Modern Siren program and I know I am doing a few wrong things. I just don’t know how to stop them without creating problems in our relationship. Everything starts to fall apart when I started to help him on his work (I am the fashion producer in his shooting session, I am also his assistant in the filming production and edition and help him with every detail for his clients when he is traveling because he is also parachute athlete). Besides, I am a business development executive in a big company. I am trying to fill my life with my stuff (Spanish course, new business course, make up course, gym, running, yoga, going to my Buddhism center). The thing is he demands me a lot and complains that I “stick” to him a lot. How should I be apart if he demands me all the time??!!

  46.  #46Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 6:58 am

    Kim #21
    Ahhhhh…. how lovely,,,
    2 men coming toward you… showing up in
    glorious ways…

    I love what wildman said…
    He is planning!!! just what you had asked for…
    he sounds so warm and lovely…
    wanting to get closer to your warm,
    soft siren heart!!!
    I also understand if you’re thinking he may NOT be trustworthy… scary…

    and the “stable man” wanting to talk on Wed…
    Does he bring out the best in you?
    How do YOU feel in his presence?

  47.  #47Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 7:06 am

    (((Linda #44)))
    You are being sooo open and vulnerable to share all of this with us…

    Such extreme deceit!!!
    Ohhh… I feel good that you are finding healing here and with all the Rori tools!!

  48.  #48Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 7:15 am

    hugs for you… you are going through much…

    For me it feels good that you are sharing with Rori and all the Sirens…

    I’m wondering if you are feeling that you have much masculine energy going on…
    doing, doing, doing…

    You sound lonely for YOU…
    You are craving time to LOVE YOU…
    Time to feel and be in YOUR feminine

    I know you have the Modern Siren CDs…
    For me the Modern Siren is amazing…
    I still listen to it and always find new
    insights I hadn’t realized the last time I listened…

    also I contacted a Rori coach when I was in extreme anguish…
    She has helped me soooo much!!

  49.  #49Kim on July 29, 2014 at 7:40 am

    Wow Azure Blu!
    Thank you!! I was just thinking hard about how I feel in each of those men’s presence, thank you for that nudge!!
    Stable man does not always bring out the best in me. He is part feminine energy and his MO when things are difficult is to ‘stonewall’ and go quiet and disappear.
    When we are not together, the connection almost always slips because he is ‘busy’ and preoccupied.
    This makes me feel disconneted. When we are together everything is always perfect but sometiems it feels ‘fake’ like we are not the real people…hm.

    Wild child…completely different. Totally open, connection never slips. Even when we were pissed with each other, he was still communicating (angrily lol), he was ranting and raving. And I didn’t feel bad, ignored or upset….I actually felt amused because I could see that he was angry with himself for keeping this ex thing a secret and upsetting me.
    I saw through all the rants.

    I want to date with my head first. But my heart is somewhat in disagreement. I know stable man could be everything I have always wanted, but if he doesn’t work on his commitment issues and the connection does not feel intimate and real, this would not feel ‘warm’ and good. The safety with him would come from external stuff….

    I feel 100 times better in wild childs presence but that is only 6 weeks old and way too early to tell. One thing I know is that even in the first 6 weeks with stable MoM, something always felt off, like he wasn’t free to really fall in love.
    Weird, huh?

  50.  #50Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 7:48 am

    Not Weird…
    That is how I felt with MN…
    the cd I just broke off with…
    Kind, stable, did things together… planned “fun” dates in advance… stayed connected everyday…
    ask for an exclusive relationship..
    I knew he wanted to get married and live happily ever after…
    BUT… there was a wall that he put up…
    I couldn’t get close… I tried all the RR tools,
    I wasn’t my sparkly self around him…
    He did make a few jokes off and on but…
    I’d make a joke and have to say “that’s a joke”
    also too feminine for me…
    I got worn out trying to “out girl him”

  51.  #51Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 7:50 am

    If the SM has committment issues…
    disappearing when things get rough…

    I feel good that you are seeing a red flag there…

    That feels good that WM stayed connected even when he was upset and you were upset…
    I LOVE that!!! I haven’t met anyone who can do that yet…

  52.  #52Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 7:51 am

    Kim, 🙂 xx

  53.  #53Karol on July 29, 2014 at 7:56 am

    @Azure Lu
    thanks for the insight! You’re right! It is my masculine energy and lack of self love!!
    I wish I could ask for Rori coach help or other Rori programs, but I am cutting extra costs since I started to buy all items for the wedding.

  54.  #54Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 8:07 am

    You are soo welcome…
    This is just me but…
    seems there are MANY red flags about this man…

    It would be sooo important to MY well being to look at where I could cut back… before I got married…
    “Spanish course, new business course, make up course, gym, running, yoga,”

    and get coaching (Valerie is a great coach and Not and affordable)

  55.  #55Linda on July 29, 2014 at 8:08 am

    You know.. I have thought about it over and over. I have read this before

    You will attract into your life what you believe about yourself, including in the way men treat you…

    I do not believe this. I am a faithful, honest person. I treat others with respect. I am patient and a non violent person. These are deeply rooted character traits and core values for me.

    My life experience in life does not support this.

  56.  #56Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 8:08 am

    I meant “and very affordable”

  57.  #57Femininewoman on July 29, 2014 at 8:41 am

    Linda I would challenge that belief. I don’t want to discredit your experiences because I know things happen in life. There are blips in the radar at times. But if you look at the lives of successful people and talk to them you will find out that they believe that they can be successful no matter what they do. Failure is only a part of the process and they likely don’t call what happens failure.

    That belief that that doesn’t happen to you could be your unconscious block. I have experimented with things around beliefs this year and am more convinced than ever that what we believe is what we create in our lives. So now even when I can’t see physical evidence of what I choose to believe I keep on believing and looking for it to show up. Regardless of what the reality has been in front of me this year. Right now for me a belief is just a mental decision. At least that is what I have been experimenting with this year. Even when it seemed irrational I would just choose to believe what I wanted to show up and this far it has.

    I don’t know if this make sense to me but it is my experience. I just choose and just keep walking on that path. I tell myself now I get to decide.

  58.  #58Kim on July 29, 2014 at 8:55 am

    Azure Blu, wow, yes yes yes!!
    I know exactly what you mean about being worn out ‘outgirling’ him! Precisely.
    He would have step up moments for, say a week or so, and then – crickets. Or botched plans because he was on the fence, I got angry and he stonewalled and refused communication.
    He is a good man! But I feel fake around him, like I am not me but a different version of me.
    With wildchild it’s a bit different. I think due to me counting him out as a relationship suitor, I am always totally myself around him. Even on the paddleboard the other day. With anyone else, I might have sucked it up and pretended I was happy with stuff. With him, I was like ‘eh, turn around, I am scared now’. Lol.
    The freedom of not really caring…
    Feels liberating.
    No need to act and be a better version of myself.
    The guy used to date and photograph models. I don’t feel threatened just bored by that and think, well, if he is interested in me with my boyish figure, crooked teeth, crazy hair and quirky workd view, then the competition is pretty thin on the ground, if he was picking someone just for looks, it would not be me lol.
    MoM’s ex gf is not really attractive but she felt like a huge threat to me because he has this emotional connection and quite happily dropped me for her before.
    So strange.
    Anyway, taking one step at a time!

  59.  #59Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 8:57 am

    Linda #56

    I thought that also…
    I am sooo nice, respectful, kind, generous, funny…
    easy going… nonjudgemental…
    ALL these amazing things..
    and I kept attracting men (or was it.. being attracted to) who were not that way (mmm… my mirrors)… who gave me crumbs and ended up treating me, at the very least, poorly!!!

    But I did have very nice, kind, helpful, supportive, generous, loving etc, etc
    men want to BE with ME…
    I just always was afraid my strong (angry is probably alot of that) personality would push them over!!
    and I would reject that sort of man… I couldn’t understand why that sort of man would love
    Unworthy ME!!!

    ME NOT LOVING ME attracted alll of that…

    I am attracted to MUCH nicer men now…
    and they are attracted to me…

    I have also realized alll MY Niceness
    was a lot of overfunctioning…
    which had strings attached…
    I did give wanting to control,
    manipulate and wrangle people to like me!!

    Wow… I really am sooo glad Rori’s tools have freed me from soooo much of that…

  60.  #60Kim on July 29, 2014 at 8:59 am

    56 Linda. Yes, that resonates with me.
    Time and time again I say bad things do always also happen to good people and innocent children and none of this is necessarily ‘attracted’, to me the LOA is mumbo jumbo.

    I do, however, believe in dealing with those things not by getting hopeless or bitter but by actually hoping they lead to better choices, better men, and that the lessons we learn help us in some way.

    I have heard from people who had cancer that it changed their life for the better. However absurd this sounds to me. I can almost understand that. Very bad and humbling experiences can be extremely useful even though I wouldn’t wish them on anyone. Ever.

  61.  #61Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 9:08 am

    Kim #59..
    I do understand what your saying about WC…
    because you’re at ease with him thinking.,,
    This probably will NOT work..
    YOU can be YOU!!! Ahhh… how relaxing
    AND good practice…
    How nice NOT to be intimidated by his modeling career (you know what I mean) ;~>

    Me too with Spiritcd…
    I’m pretty sure this can’t work (me not believing in Hell and him being “born again” christian)
    I can be myself… hold my boundaries…
    share my feelings much easier… be at ease and
    BE ME!!!
    Lovely practice…

  62.  #62Kim on July 29, 2014 at 9:25 am

    Azure Blu, do you think that could be a part of our emotional unavailability, being relaxed around a man who will in all likelihood not be ‘dangerous’ for us in the sense that we do not see him as a long-term prospect? Or perhaps we are making excuses as to why we do not want to jump in fully? Religion in your case and instability and immaturity in mine?
    I do wonder sometimes.
    Though I could also not be with someone who believed in hell..I think?
    Or does that really matter? Hmmmmmmm!!!

    Being at ease is good. Being oneself is good.
    Maybe it does come back to good moments and savoring them and not digging too deep with thoughts and the head.

    I kissed three men last weekend and only Wildchild felt good. LOL. Maybe that’s enough for now haha.
    Let’s not overthink.

    Is it sustainable to have these chemistry, lovey dovey feelings for someone and yet considering entering into a commitment with someone whom I do not have them for? Heck, 20 years ago this would not even have crossed my mind. I would totally have gone with my heart and it mostly worked out!

  63.  #63Kim on July 29, 2014 at 9:31 am

    Yeah, models, eh. When I first saw and heard it from him, I was kind of also making another notch on the ‘not suitable’ pole, to be honest.
    I thought in the long term I would feel totally insecure and perhaps I would?
    I don’t understand what someone who goes for superficial beauty and photographs naked girls in his backyard (and then shares it with me), actually sees in me. That is SO not my scene. LOL.
    I saw one of his ex gf’s on a photo he showed me…like as if it was some kind of trophy.
    I was like: blah.
    At first I felt irritated, and like an ugly duckling. And then it kind of washed over me, because there is no chance in hell I would want to compete with a model, or someone who is so totally different to me and so attention seeking that they post a picture of their naked skinny ass on facebook. lol.
    That’s to me a person from another planet, so how could I compare myself to an alien?
    It’s like comparing a squirrel to a horse, doesn’t work.
    So I don’t.

  64.  #64Kim on July 29, 2014 at 9:33 am

    (not wanting to be judgmental about people posting their backsides on fb) – just isn’t my personality…lol

  65.  #65Femininewoman on July 29, 2014 at 9:59 am

    Kim – dwl

    I am loving your standards and your value of yourself

  66.  #66Karol on July 29, 2014 at 10:03 am

    @azure blu could you help me with the red flags?

  67.  #67Kim on July 29, 2014 at 10:05 am

    Thanks FW….it’s ebb and flow, but mostly, I have stopped comparing myself and just started liking myself the way I am. And it feels good and natural and the standards and boundaries just flow from that as well.
    The only time I break my own boundaries is when it feels fun to do so and I know it isn’t going to make me feel bad later on…and then it’s ok! 🙂
    Gotta live a little too and enjoy life…

    On another note, MrP contacted me again, this happened all week. He suggested staying over Sat night and taking me boating Sunday. Ermmm…no way Jose. 🙂
    And yet he tries…

  68.  #68Labbit on July 29, 2014 at 10:11 am

    Linda #56 — I would add that the universe also challenges us to see how and if we’ve grown. Have you ever read The Alchemist? One of my favorite passages says:

    “Before a dream is realized, the Soul of the World tests everything that was learned along the way. It does this not because it is evil, but so that we can, in addition to realizing our dreams, master the lessons we’ve learned as we’ve moved towards that dream…”

    In Rori speak, I’d translate this to mean that as we uncover our subconscious triggers, learn to love them and heal them, the universe might throw a HUGE trigger at us just to see how we react. Will we take our newfound knowledge, our healing, and behave in a new way? Or we will react in the same old ways, without moving forward or trying something new?

    I truly believe that if we are meeting the same challenges over and over in life, it just means that our healing hasn’t made it to the point yet where we can move beyond it. What a wonderful gift that is! Yes there are obviously some things that come into our lives that are not about being tested and totally outside of our control (i.e. a serious illness) but for the most part what we meet in our life is simply a chance to grow and move towards our dreams.

    Here’s the rest of the passage from The Alchemist, I find it quite inspirational:
    “…That’s the point at which most people give up. It’s the point at which, as we say in the language of the desert, one ‘dies of thirst just when the palm trees have appeared on the horizon.’ Every search begins with beginner’s luck. And every search ends with the victor’s being severely tested.”

  69.  #69Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 10:21 am

    Kim #63…
    Ahhh… yes… I do know how I get VERY anxious when looking at emotional intimacy…
    so seeing flaws in my cds does keep me from getting tooo close…

    I too feel VERY good about looking at the red flags now…
    and yet… being able to unzip my heart..
    Seeing how I FEEL When in his presence…
    All this is SOOO different from before RR…

    -also having faith that this man is NOT the last man on the planet I will be able to connect with
    -having boundaries I cherish and uphold

    Yes… me Not believing in hell
    doesn’t work for some people (which I totally understand)… especially those who are “born again christians”
    I have shared with him that
    he deserves to be with a woman who believes as he does (after all there is the online christian dating site)
    because these beliefs are the heart and soul of him!!!

    Really i am just practicing how it feels to be relaxed and be ME
    when I’m with a man with whom I feel so good being myself…
    I’m not sure how much longer I can let this go on…

    He may just poof… He does seem rather flaky in some ways
    I haven’t heard from him in 2 days…

    I do need to start online dating again…
    but i’m waiting for my finances to get better…
    which is coming along!!!

  70.  #70Labbit on July 29, 2014 at 10:26 am

    Millie 13 – thank you! I love what you have been sharing lately about finding activities to love yourself. I feel a new vibe coming from you and it’s wonderful!

    Azure Blu 18 — likewise, I’ve felt very inspired by your CDing journey recently. Your comments and replies always leave me feeling warm, thank you for that.

    Kim 21 – how intriguing that Wildchild keeps moving towards you! It must feel wonderful to be surrounded by men who are tantalizingly into you. I’ve read somewhere here that most men assume a woman is dating multiple people simultaneously until the exclusivity discussion comes up. What does your heart say? If you’d feel ‘guilty’ not telling him, I’d turn that around and ask if you’d feel bad if he was dating others without telling you.

  71.  #71Kim on July 29, 2014 at 10:28 am

    Azure Blu, I do love your posts, they make me feel so relaxed about everything, I love the way you deal with all this in a way to take the good and be aware of the ‘red flags’ and just see it all as practice.
    I feel inspired.
    I really do!!
    Yes. I am going to try that also. Not overthinking and just enjoying with awareness…
    Wild child has not firmed up the date for tonight, and I am also internet dating…so everytime I feel a little lacking in attention, I chat with some guys on the internet. It’s a nice distraction…
    I want a man to come towards me and there are lots in real life and on the internet…I have trouble scheduling them all…lol.
    Though, I am craving a real will come.

  72.  #72Kim on July 29, 2014 at 10:34 am

    Labbit yes, I would feel bad if he was dating others without telling me…but he kind of told me he isn’t. Might be bs, who knows….so far I am the one who has basically kept this on a friends level, deliberately, with the odd physical session thrown in ahem.
    Now, he is always claiming me physically in front of his friends and the whole world, constantly trying to hug me and kiss me (and a little shy about it too), so it really feels like I am the only one around.
    In some ways I am not even bothered right now because I am kind of waiting what MoM has to say Wednesday…he has been my exclusive dating partner on and off for 10 months and he is kind of number 1….(dating with my head, anyway)..

  73.  #73Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 10:39 am

    This is simply my opinion of what the red flags would be for me…

    “The truth is… he likes perfect beauty girls, he always say that I am not but I am ok. I have to walk away buecause I want a man who simple adores me or who I am and I am just not have the courage to leave him.”

    “I couldn’t pretend that I was ok with it, but I choose to shut me up because I feel like I can’t say anything about how I really feel, think or want.”

    “I start to say how I feel and I can’t complete the sentence and he says owww here “comes again – you always want to talk about how you feel”

    “The thing is he demands me a lot and complains that I “stick” to him a lot.”

  74.  #74Mandy on July 29, 2014 at 10:49 am

    Oh wow, this hits home for me, Rori.

    I noticed, after six months of celibacy with my man, My body is as ridig as a board when I touch him or lay my body against his. SO it must be the both of us with the problem not just him.

    I was always terrified I’d lose him if I circular date! This is clarification for me, and although I always sort of knew that CDing isn’t necessarily a date I was always very very nervous about it.

    I really need to go interact. Even at the gym I have this look on my face that says hey I have my game face on don’t freaking interrupt my workout!

    Once I get paid in two days I’m going to get a hot haircut and have my nails touched up that will feel good.

    To tell you the truth Rori, J is gone to do some work for his dad in another city and staying overnight and you have no idea how grateful I am for the space!

  75.  #75Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 10:50 am


    I love this: “mostly, I have stopped comparing myself and just started liking myself the way I am. And it feels good and natural and the standards and boundaries just flow from that as well.”


    I love this: “I truly believe that if we are meeting the same challenges over and over in life, it just means that our healing hasn’t made it to the point yet where we can move beyond it. What a wonderful gift that is!”

    That is the kind of thing that can make or break us, in my opinion.

  76.  #76Mandy on July 29, 2014 at 11:09 am

    What am I doing here in this situation???

    Going back to my old ways again!

    So I’m re-watching watching love scripts.

    He triggers reactions, in me, very naturally. He triggered one last night, when he was talking about how hot the naked woman in Game of Thrones was, and my heart sort of sank about it for the first time in months and months; I have been losing weight for over a year and weight/running training for five months, and have felt very hot and confident.
    Yet…I never hear the phrase from him, “You’re hot”. It’s usually me telling him he’s hot, and he hates hearing it, because he can’t really stand himself right now, he thinks he’s too skinny and doesn’t have a job.
    He’s always telling me he hates compliments, so stop it. How much of a turn off is that?

    I know I can’t expect much from a man who’s hurting, but if he can say “She’s so hot” to a character on TV, why not me?

    In the same show, the character Melissandre (and her breasts) are taking a bath when Stannis’ wife comes in, and Melissandra says to her, “Men never crave what they already have. It’s only flesh. It needs what it needs.”

    Really? I guess I’d better just focus on myself and keep myself happy, because if it is true men never crave what they already have, I’ll be celibate forever.

    Sometimes I think maybe if he says a woman is hot, there’s still a spark of hope but I feel painfully left out, ignored and average.

    I hope like hell intimacy can happen for me. AH! Why do I always jump to “pick up the fire hose”? I always admired my dad and always wanted to be just like him so I took cues from him about affection…he’s always chasing after my mom.

    Arrrrgghh! My man is not creating my star power! He is not creating my femininity or charisma or self-esteem!

    It doesn’t help that he is very nit-picky and hates all the music I play…I don’t feel lit up when he does that stuff. It just makes me annoyed and annoyance turns to anger.

    We’ve still got a lot to work on, and I can’t for the life of me find a couples counselor who takes my insurance.

    Oh well. I’ll do my hair go o the gym and paint my toenails, maybe even flirt a little when I am out, maybe that will perk me up…my life doesn’t have to be all about him all the time, in fact it sucks big time.

  77.  #77Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 11:13 am

    Kim #72…
    xxx… ahhh… that makes me feel very good that you think i’m sounding relaxed with the process!!

    You too inspire me…
    I didn’t realize you had a 10 month cd going on…
    You seem very relaxed about all this cd activity and you are sooo young!! Yay YOU!!

  78.  #78Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 11:23 am

    I feel you ARE moving forward…
    YOu are living in a new place…
    You are looking for a couples counselor…

    have you taken a close look at the situation you mentioned about your Dad chasing after your Mom and you chasing after J?
    Did you feel like it’s a pattern you might be feeling obliged to repeat?

    are you thinking it is what J’s supposed to do?
    did I missunderstand
    “Arrrrgghh! My man is not creating my star power! He is not creating my femininity or charisma or self-esteem!”

  79.  #79Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 11:31 am

    as Rori says in this new post:
    “And I know this for sure:
    If we women cave into our fears and insecurities
    and start demanding a level of intimacy
    a man is not ready to handle
    – we lose.

    If, instead, we work on our OWN fear of intimacy,
    open our hearts to allow a man in,
    with as much warmth as possible
    whenever he DOES venture in close –
    and use Circular Dating to stay sane and centered
    and self-appreciative while the process is unfolding
    – we have a huge chance of having what we truly want with a man.”

  80.  #80Kim on July 29, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Ha Azure Blu, not that young and not that relaxed lol.
    Perhaps with almost 40, never having been married, that whole family thing bypassing me, I now see it no longer as a tragedy to be alone.
    I am happy.
    I would love to have a relationship and get married, but I want it to be right for me.
    It hasn’t really felt right with a man for a long time.

  81.  #81Kim on July 29, 2014 at 11:39 am

    It felt almost right with a lot of

  82.  #82Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 11:48 am


    I know Dominique has written in her articles about how men can get turned on by just about any woman, and certainly by the sight of just about any woman’s naked body. This has helped me not to see women who are put forward as objects of desire (such as the woman in the show you were watching) as anything special. Or at least, not any more special than just about any other woman, not any more special than you. This distinction has greatly helped me to put it in perspective, because I always thought, well if he finds her pretty it must mean that she’s more attractive/prettier/sexier than I am. No. Men like to look at beautiful women. It means NOTHING.

    Maybe you could hold off on complimenting him for a little while… as, I don’t know, it may feel smothering to him… and instead focus on your own desirability. Look at yourself in the mirror, find things that you like and find beautiful. Focus on those.

  83.  #83Indigo on July 29, 2014 at 11:50 am

    Azure Blu 80, I love this quote from Rori.

    I LOVE this article actually. I think it is my favourite.

  84.  #84Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 11:53 am

    yeahhhhh… the ALMOST…
    I’m excited about meeting the one that sticks!!
    Any day now…
    but who’s waiting??? LOL

  85.  #85Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 11:58 am

    Indigo #84…
    Yes… I sooo agree… this post of Rori’s was soooo
    good… it reminded me of some of her older ones I’ve read in the archives…
    Just a perfect reminder of all that is great about what Rori teaches!!!

  86.  #86Karol on July 29, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    @azure blu
    I got it
    Sad… I am really sad but I can see he is not the right man for me.

    thank you

  87.  #87Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    You are welcome…
    were you thinking of staying on the blog for learning and support?
    We would love to have you stay

  88.  #88Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    Indigo #83
    Nice reminder about men looking at nice bodies…
    but NOT to take it as an insult to me…

    I LOVE to look at well muscled and handsome men…
    but it certainly doesn’t mean I’m not Lovin’ the man I’m with much MORE…
    He’s real the other is JUST EYE CANDY… no emotions there…
    Actually I have found most of the men who work out THAT much are annoying as they ALWAYS are at the Gym
    and look at themselves alllll the time

  89.  #89Kim on July 29, 2014 at 12:21 pm

    I think there is also a difference whether the man is looking at a body in passing, or twisting his head half an hour into the opposite direction, stops in the middle of the conversation and his full attention goes out to another woman.
    That turns me off a man.

  90.  #90Azure Blu on July 29, 2014 at 12:28 pm

    Ohhh… you are sooo right!!
    I dated a man (ONE date)
    The entire time he spent checking out EVERY woman
    that passed by while we were sitting at the cafe!!
    He called several times wanting to go out…
    then asked why not…
    I explained to him why…
    He didn’t realize he was doing it…
    He thanked me for letting him know..
    and to give him another chance…
    Nice enough guy but…
    I really didn’t like anything else about him either…
    so didn’t give him another try…

  91.  #91Mandy on July 29, 2014 at 12:37 pm

    Azure and Indigo,

    Again thank you dearly for responding. I need other perspective sometimes!

    Azure thank you for letting me know I’m making some progress here. The new apartment feels wonderful and my disposition has been much better here.

    I have always felt an obligation to repeat my dad’s patterns…call me nuts but I’ve always wanted to be like him because I have always thought he was the coolest human being on the planet. SOunds weird i know but it’s true.

    No, it’s not what J’s supposed to do, meaning create my “Starpower”…I’m just trying to remind myself that my yumminess does NOT come from J, it comes from inside me, so I need to look inside me deeper, feel it out, and love myself harder. I am considering taking a pole dancing class or two for a good price in August. Doesn’t mean it will absolutely happen, but I’m totally gunning for it.

    I fall back into my old ways of caving into my insecurity which hasn’t happened for a long time, but I just feel like a two year old who wants to go pout and maybe even throw a fit.

    Interestingly enough, this article is about CDing and I am terified like i said of it – but I really need to open up. I don’t know what created my fear of intimacy, I’ve never had a problem with it; but when one partner shuts down sexually, the other is likely to do so as well, just sort of like, if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em…

    Indigo –

    Brilliant. I have done some internal feeling about before I read your comment and decided this means I have to love myself extra super hard, but don’t exactly know how to go about it. I take care of my physical needs, I go to the gym four times a week, I get my hair and nails done, I model…what more could there be? I thought about a pole dancing class.

    What if I thought about it from the perspective that Jerod and I are not serious because there’s no intimacy, and just lose some interest in him and be a little selfish and just like myself…moreso than just leaning back?

    Leaning WAY back and loving myself HARD and CDing seem the best options here. I definitely don’t want to depend on my man for those feelings. I should be in control of that.

    Thanks ladies for caring 😉

  92.  #92Karol on July 29, 2014 at 12:38 pm

    ((azure blue))

    Of course I will stay! I finally find friends that want to hear my story instead of saying to me that he is the best men on earth and i should do everything to keep him!

  93.  #93Kim on July 29, 2014 at 12:40 pm

    Ah ladies. Lately I feel a lot of compassion for women who define themselves entirely by their outer shell, because I feel they lack so much happiness and peacefulness 🙁
    Inlive in South Florida, and every day I see so many beautiful women, and so many aging women trying to keep up with 18 year olds. 60 year olds in micro shorts and with lopsided faces and boobs from all the surgery.
    I just want to cry, because I want to give them a hug and say ‘but why, darling?’ They would look soooo much better being themselves rather than trying to be someone else.
    We age. We can’t deny it.
    No matter what we do.
    If we are not happy on the inside, how can we fix that from the outside? There is always someone prettier out there, what a senseless and sad competition.
    I always wanted to fix my crooked teeth. Lately, I am thinking of keeping them. Why? Because they are me. They are a part of me. They are my crooked teeth.
    I am not particularly fond of them, don’t get me wrong….but…somehow, I would almost feel odd with perfect teeth, like what, after 40 years, am I trying to prove to myself now?
    I might still do it one day, but I don’t think it is a lifechanging event anymore…
    Acceptance was the lifechanging event.

  94.  #94Mandy on July 29, 2014 at 12:46 pm

    Kim – 90 – I agree so much.

    Dominique told me herself that the appearance of a naked woman is straight from head to penis; with his beloved, it is head to heart and then maybe to penis, if there’s no anger getting in the way. Durrrr….I forgot about that…sorry Dominique!

    Marikaberg – 92 – I am a model, and no offense taken, I mean if I wasn’t a model I might feel the same way, but a model is more than a marketing tool to sell stuff; it is being the ultimate feminine presence and shining even if you have a zit or a bruise you can’t hide…you can learn a lot from models, how they get into their feminine presence, their emotions, and glow from inside for a photo; also, they take criticism very well…all very feminine and attractive; and you don’t need to be perfect physically to do these things, which is the best part. Rori did an article on it, which is very interesting.

    (PS – The good news is, you may not think it, but ALL models have some kind of imperfection, asymmetry or rolls when they bend over…ALL of them, that’s why artists Photoshop the hell out of them…and I know a lot about that, because I am a photo editor myself!) 🙂

  95.  #95April Rose on July 29, 2014 at 2:47 pm

    Hi Mandy,

    I’ve been meaning to write to you for ages. And to recommend John Gray’s book ‘Mars and Venus in the bedroom’.

    One of the scripts he wrote for women to say to their man was “Honey, I’m feeling all hot and turned on. I’m going to go in the bedroom and touch myself (and think of you). If you feel like joining me you know where I’ll be”.

  96.  #96April Rose on July 29, 2014 at 2:48 pm

    And I also agree with Indigo. Lay off the compliments. Let your compliments be for the actions he takes first.

  97.  #97April Rose on July 29, 2014 at 2:49 pm

    I had a man who liked to be complimented. But he was a feminine energy man.

  98.  #98April Rose on July 29, 2014 at 2:50 pm

    Yay to “losing some interest in him”. If you can. Genuinely.

  99.  #99Dominique on July 29, 2014 at 3:02 pm

    Mandy – 77 – “men never crave what they already have”

    Oh my, this is SO not true, not for a good man anyway, not for a man who loves and adores his woman, his beloved one and only. K craves me as much as he did twelve years ago if not more. Actually I think it IS more. Sex continues to be AMAZING. And the connection and intimacy continue to deepen, become more profound.

    So please try not to believe things like this.


  100.  #100Karol on July 29, 2014 at 3:15 pm

    trust models are not interested. I work with them. Guys who linkes and prefers them are narcisists… Good guys don’t like a woman for her apareance. Idiots don’t have imagination, so they need empty stuff such as beauty. People who give to much importance to beauty, usually are selfish and they could not make you happy because they are too busy trying to take from others.

  101.  #101Kim on July 29, 2014 at 4:11 pm

    I feel disappointed. Wild child just texted me something about his work. Today was the only day he could have made a date. Nothing.
    I have plenty of other men to date but it makes me feel really disappointed when someone is all talk, like he was yesterday, and then doesn’t follow through.
    I also don’t feel like being warm and welcoming when he contacts me again.
    I almost feel like he has lost his chance now.
    Ok, he doesn’t know that my longer term dating partner wants me back, but he knows I am internet dating and busy for the rest of the week.
    This ‘busy with work’ thing is a lame excuse since he had time to meet a friend yesterday.
    Anyway, looking forward to my other dates this week!

  102.  #102Linda on July 29, 2014 at 4:59 pm

    To those of you who made comment about my position on the law of attraction… I read thru them all. Thank you for the personal examples from your lives.

  103.  #103Gina on July 29, 2014 at 7:46 pm

    My friend starred in this movie about a guy’s perspective on deciding on whether a woman is “the one”. I love the movie – entertaining and enlightening! My friend plays ‘Rebecca’
    the movie is available on Amazon

  104.  #104prplpsn28 on July 29, 2014 at 8:35 pm

    Thank you Rori for this. Perfect timing 🙂

  105.  #105Veronica on July 29, 2014 at 10:38 pm

    Before I catch up with all the posts here and on the previous thread:

    FunnyCD and I spent the afternoon hiking yesterday. It felt so easy to have open-hearted conversations and simply enjoying each other. I felt so comfortable, adored, giddy but also the deep pleasure of knowing more of him such that I didn’t want to be on a dating site anymore. I informed him that I was taking my profile down and in the time it took for me to get online, he had already replied that he felt the same way and wanted to tell me the next day and had already disabled his account.

    While we were together I could sense myself just enjoying what was around me even contact with other men.

  106.  #106IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 11:00 pm

    Woke up in the middle of the night and saw I got a text from R. I feel shocked. & a little relieved & a little mad. I have a suspicion he was/is testing me, & that doesn’t feel good. He said something along the lines of “I went ahead and saw the movie. I’m sorry. It wasn’t that good.” Sooooooooooooo many clever ways I could respond. What the fudge, butthead. I love my sophomoric euphemisms…

  107.  #107IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 11:02 pm

    I seriously feel like going “ewww, R.” Just eww.

  108.  #108IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 11:05 pm

    It wasn’t that good because you flaked out on the awesome girl that was supposed accompany you, loser. Duh. I feel giggly…

  109.  #109IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 11:08 pm

    Or I could just say nothing. I feel gross that he even bothered to tell me that! Ewww. Any advice on what I should say or is saying nothing more powerful? Toxic men is the only program that I have that I haven’t watched. The time is now, Daniel son.

  110.  #110IamHis on July 29, 2014 at 11:13 pm

    He is so testing me! To test if I’m truly picky or not which is one of the reasons I gave for not ever being in a relationship. It’s true, you &/%”::;&! Ick, I feel so disgusted!

  111.  #111Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 12:03 am

    I have to end things with J because I’ve established, which I knew from the beginning, that I only want to be friends with him, nothing more. He’s starting to get more invested, he’s calling me today because he wants to make weekend plans. I think I have to tell him then. Sorry I just want to be friends. Ugh. I never look forward to these conversations. I don’t like hurting someone, and I don’t like not being able to fulfill their expectations that I feel the same way about them as they do about me. With J unfortunately he’s just not my type at all. Lovely guy, but I can’t talk to him, we have nothing in common, we don’t connect at all. There’s no attraction, no flirting, no juice.

  112.  #112Millie on July 30, 2014 at 12:38 am

    I feel very assertive today! Asserting what I want and don’t want and how I feel with no investment in a man’s reaction makes me feel very powerful, strong, and right! One man has been texting me very frequently late at night for what is clearly to hook-up. I told him I don’t want to be anyone’s booty call, but that I’m happy to be just friends. I had been saying no and not responding to him, but he did not get the message until I spelled it out. Being clear and straightforward feels really good!! The ex that had contacts me out of the blue often, expressed he still cares, but he seems to be clinging onto our past. I had been going back and forth with ignoring him and blocking/unblocking his # and finally decided to just communicate how I feel and what I want and don’t want. It feels really good to be REAL and speak the truth, to acknowledge reality and set boundaries. I feel super strong right now and ready to speak truthfully to any man that crosses my path! I feel a great release in being assertive instead of continuing to ignore and bouncing between closing the door and opening it, which in my situation I think is an unwillingness to face an uncomfortable situation. It’s easier to shut someone out, that connect with me and express what is going on with me. Going back and forth between anything also indicates to me that I don’t really know how I feel or what I want. When that behavior happens, I need to sink in, feel, and express! So happy I realized and felt this today!! Yay

  113.  #113Millie on July 30, 2014 at 12:41 am

    Labbit 71 🙂

  114.  #114Kim on July 30, 2014 at 4:38 am

    (((Indigo)))) eek. I knkw how that feels. I always hope for things to fade out but when they don’t, my line is normally that I met someone. Even if it might not be strictly true. It means I don’t have to tell them anything that might make them feel bad about themselves.
    This is pretty much the only white lie I use….still.

  115.  #115Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 4:43 am

    Kim, thank you for the hugs x

    He phoned, and I wimped out. He asked me if I had any plans for the weekend, and I told that as a matter of fact I do, that I was going hiking with a group of friends (something I’d been invited to but had not yet decided if I was doing) and that it was likely to take the whole day Saturday. There was an audible note of disappointment when he said, well we could do something another time. I couldn’t bring myself to say anything just then! Gah. Oh well.

  116.  #116Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 4:46 am

    On the upside, J has been very good practice. He’s very masculine, takes his role as initiator and man very seriously, and has saved me on more than one night by giving me something to do to take my mind off things when my feelings were spinning. So 🙂 But I always dread this bit. When it ends. I’m sure I’ll get better at it.

  117.  #117Kim on July 30, 2014 at 4:46 am

    Well, it all came out yesterday. I felt bored and turned off by texting and told wildchild.
    He said he understands and is hoping he can make time thursday when his work load abates, well I am bust thursday and had told him. That’s ok.
    We had a conversation and he told me that he is not seeing any girls and not sharing anything (calling txting) any other girls. I felt I needed to be honest and said that I am nkt cutting my options and although I love spending time with him, I am looking for my life partner and it doesn’t feel good to wait for men to get their life in order (he kives with his ex)….I also told him I was seeing my ex today as he wanted to talk.
    He was a little ‘duh, I knkw what he wants’, but in essence he did say that he understands all this too.
    No arguiing, no defending, no dropping the conversation.
    I feel good about the honesty, and whatever happens happens…

  118.  #118Kim on July 30, 2014 at 4:58 am

    Indigo, I never got better at it. I so dislike disappointing people, but also I always wonder why some men are so keen, when they must feel that we are not into it..maybe pur Siren skills…lol.
    I always feel surprised when it happens.
    Because it is so obvious when there is attraction/feelings from both sides….
    I see it.
    I feel when a man in into me or when he is lukewarm. Hm.

    Nervous about meeting MoM tonight. I wonder where this conversation will go. In some ways happy I have a clear head and am not full of lovey doveyness for wildchild.
    Wildchild is actually a homebody lol. Not so wild.
    Anyway, I wonder what MoM will say….

  119.  #119Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 5:42 am

    Kim #119…
    You are amazing!!! I LOVE what you shared with WC!!
    Sooo clear…

    I have found when I do this it is
    soooo good for ME… ME getting clearer with ME…
    Me believing that I DESERVE taking care of…
    My self worth soars!!!!
    Yay you!!!

  120.  #120Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 5:49 am

    Millie #141
    You Siren you!!! I LOVE THIS…
    “It feels really good to be REAL and speak the truth, to acknowledge reality and set boundaries. I feel super strong right now and ready to speak truthfully to any man that crosses my path!”

    Yes, I agree…. it is Power making to discover our own boundaries and to share them with our cds!!!
    Yay… happy dance’
    All this makes me feel good tooo!!! just reading about it!!

    there seems to be several sirens being clear about what they WANT!!

  121.  #121Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 5:53 am

    Indigo #113
    No communication, no connection, no flirting no juice…
    Sighh… that just doesn’t sound fun AT ALL!!

    Have you practiced what you might say to him?

  122.  #122Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 5:57 am

    Sighhhhhh… I got choked up reading about the closeness you and Funnycd have…
    Exclusive!!! Yay!!!
    I feel warm, soft candle light happy!!!

    Thank you, thank you for sharing this journey
    here on the island!!!

  123.  #123Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 6:13 am


    I feel real admiration for you having that conversation with WC… I find the no-girlfriend speech so hard.

    This: “I always wonder why some men are so keen, when they must feel that we are not into it..maybe pur Siren skills…lol. I always feel surprised when it happens. Because it is so obvious when there is attraction/feelings from both sides….
    I see it.
    I feel when a man in into me or when he is lukewarm. Hm.”

    I think it’s definitely our siren skills, I think it’s also a case of them seeing what they want to see. I agree with you, it’s so obvious when you’re both into each other, you can feel when a guy is into you, or when he is lukewarm towards you. I wonder what goes through the mind of a guy who can surely feel your lack of enthusiasm. I struggle to hide what I feel – if I like a guy it radiates out of me, if I don’t like him, it just feels like politeness. I felt lukewarm at best about J. I remember thinking the whole time I was with him, wow, some day he is going to make some lucky girl very happy, but it won’t be me.

  124.  #124Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 6:15 am

    Azure Blu 123,

    No, unfortunately the actual being with him part is not much fun. I thought of saying something like:

    “I feel unready for a relationship. I would be happier just being friends.”

    I can’t bring myself to say something like, we’re not a match, or I don’t feel that way about you.

  125.  #125Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 6:33 am

    Indigo #126

    I think that feels good… honest and clear!!

  126.  #126Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 6:36 am

    I can’t believe he saw the movie without you…
    at least he apologized and was honest!! :-((
    I do see why you would feel angry!!
    How many dates have you had? were you unavailable for a date and so he went anyway?

    I;m remembering a bf doing that to me one time…
    One of the many times he treated me poorly…

  127.  #127Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 7:26 am

    Heading off on a walk just now with a friend I haven’t seen in a while.

    And, I’ve decided I will go on this group hike on Saturday… the scenery will be breathtaking.

    I’m feeling that I need these things to give something for my energy to do, to fill me up and distract me, and hopefully calm me and make me feel good. My feelings are all in a flutter.

  128.  #128Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 7:34 am

    fluttering feelings…
    Walking with a friend sounds lovely…
    I need to do that after I finish my project this morning…

  129.  #129Kim on July 30, 2014 at 7:38 am

    121 Azure Blu, thank you and yes!
    After I was so totally honest and upfront, guess what?!
    I felt so much better. And more, I felt ready to let it all go.

    Before, I was feeling kinda frustrated at the lack of dates and nervous about seeing MoM tonight. Now everything is out in the open, I feel relaxed.

    Not heard from either today….and I feel light, productive, ready to immerse myself in my life (enough to sort out)…and just go with the flow.

    I made it clear that I am dating and being exclusive with men only if they make dates, are consistent, sort out their lives to be free for me, and I feel good with them.
    Hey, and when I saw that black on white, I was nodding to myself. I deserve that.
    And they know it 🙂
    They know it!
    No grumbling about that from wildchild, just a frustrated ‘I don’t know what to do’ and I said practically the same thing to MrP who has been in contact all week, and he gave me the thumbs up.
    They know.
    They try to get away with offering very little, and are used to women bathing in their crumbs. I may be too much work for these guys, that’s fine. There are plenty others….

  130.  #130Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 7:56 am

    Kim 132,

    I really love this. I think when you really practice treating yourself that way, you won’t accept less from men.

  131.  #131Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 8:02 am

    Ohhhh…. Kim!!!
    This sounds sooo powerful!!

    This is exactly what I have found… They get it!!!

    They respect a woman who is clear and upfront with what she wants…
    Not angry or bitter (it usually comes from NOT being clear)
    And… just like you said… they will stay
    OR they will move on…
    in the mean time we are creating the warm, loving, intimate, soft space for the right man to walk into!!!

  132.  #132Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 8:03 am

    I am feeling anticipation about hearing what MoM
    will talk with you about tonight…

  133.  #133Kim on July 30, 2014 at 8:36 am

    Azure Blu….the funniest thing was when I told wildchild about this meeting he was like
    ‘He’s going to come with a ring’
    He doesn’t know him. That is not MoM’s style at all.
    It however made me giggle!!!!
    MoM already alluded to getting some misunderstandings out of the way. He also already said that he is happy to reconsider his stance about ‘never having children’, so I assume he wants to talk about the big stuff…maybe I am wrong.
    Whatever it is, I will stay open and curious…

  134.  #134Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 8:43 am

    Wow, Kim, you should feel very proud
    about how you are LOVING YOU (strong in the indside) and
    being soft on the outside…

    I’m smiling… reading what WC said… the ring!!

    mmmmm…. very curious…
    MoM reconsidering his stance “never having children”
    These are classic Rori responces to your being the Amazing Siren…
    Singing your Sweet siren song..
    He’s ready to wreck his ship upon the shore and throw away the oars!!!

    I’m inspired!!!

  135.  #135Kim on July 30, 2014 at 8:47 am

    Let’s wait and see Azure thank you for your lovely uplifting comment 🙂

  136.  #136IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 9:06 am

    Ladies, (Dominique, you always seem to have just the right words) but feedback about a good feeling message would feel good.

    “I feel surprised to hear from you.”

  137.  #137IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 9:07 am

    & just see what he says?

  138.  #138Dominique on July 30, 2014 at 9:44 am

    Iamhis – 140 – What is it YOU want? Do you want to see him again? At all? You’re not dating, only saw him once if I’m remembering correctly. Did you like what you saw that one time? Do you want to stay open and curious about him?

    If you cannot answer yes to these questions, then let the message from him go.

    If you can answer yes though, how about – I feel happy hearing from you yet surprised and confused.


  139.  #139Indigo on July 30, 2014 at 9:53 am


    Just my penny’s worth – a man who would suggest a movie date with you, and then not confirm it and TELL you about the movie he saw afterwards? A man you’ve been on one date with? I would give him a wide berth. I’d forget him. No feeling message required. Just my opinion.

  140.  #140IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 10:07 am

    I feel curious about him because I liked a lot about him and feel curious as to what he’d say about flaking out on me. I don’t know that I necessarily feel happy to hear from him, though. Hmm.

  141.  #141Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 10:13 am

    IamHis #45
    Because I have a tendency to NOT want to be vulnerable and curious and share what I’m really feelings with cds…
    I like to take instances like this (where I have little or no inverstiment) as a perfect opportunity to discover what I am REALLY feeling…
    and share those feelings with him…

    in my mind this is a perfect opportunity to practice being authentic and open…
    with no outcome in mind…

  142.  #142IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 10:28 am

    Thanks Azure Blu, I’ll take that into consideration. It feels good to just not say anything for now. I feel strong and good, but shy because I’m so new to dating. This post felt good to read because I feel more confident with men without actually dating them, but just being a feminine presence feels good.

  143.  #143IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 10:57 am

    Things I’ve done to feel good about me:

    -coffee and two-hour conversation with a wonderful female family member felt soooo good.
    -cute men at a gas station talked to me about my car and I felt confident.
    -bought a soft, pink, lace feminine bra and matching panties from Victoria’s secret. I needed a new bra anyway, but I picked out an extra special one that would make me feel good and it did. 🙂
    -talked to a lovely, positive single mom who makes me feel so heard and makes sure that I only accept the best treatment from men, women, everyone!
    -wrote in my journal
    -shared my feelings here. 🙂
    -read some really good articles and got further in some of the books I’ve been reading.

    I feel so thankful for the time off that I’ve had. 🙂

  144.  #144IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 11:01 am

    Feeling curious: I remember Rori talking about there being books on being a woman in business, but I’d feel hesitant to delve into ones without recommendations from her or other ladies here.

    Any good titles?

    Thanks in advance! 🙂

    I feel excited to learn.

  145.  #145IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 11:13 am

    I felt kind of angry, but now I feel surprised and confused.

    I just want to see what he says.

    It’s what I was and am honestly feeling…

    What do you ladies think?

  146.  #146IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 11:17 am

    Feel kind of embarrassed by how much feedback I want, but there’s nothing wrong with wanting feedback. I’m learning to trust myself and this is all very new to me.


  147.  #147IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 11:23 am

    Something that feels good to consider is that I really have nothing to lose. So it feels good to take some risks and to stay curious about work, first dates, books, music, life in general.

    Thinking and writing on here feels good right now. 🙂

  148.  #148Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 11:29 am

    Time off sounds wonderful!!!
    You seem to be enjoying it very much!!
    Feeling YOUR feelings and processing them
    the way I see it…
    Is the VERY best!!!

  149.  #149Dominique on July 30, 2014 at 11:37 am

    IamHis – Then go with what feels real to you – surprised and confused. And you absolutely have nothing to lose. You have a lot to gain no matter what happens or doesn’t happen with this man.


  150.  #150Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 11:39 am

    Iamhis, I think that was a crappy, disrespectful way to treat you and that guy doesn’t deserve one more second of your time or attention. Yuck. How some of these guys feel like they can get by with such appalling behavior is beyond me!

    Also, (I’m not sure if this was you or not), re. turning 30, you should be jumping for joy. That is a great age. Enjoy it, girl. You are still young and beautiful and have the world in the palm of your hand! I wish someone had told me that when I turned 30 because I was totally freaked out about it too. But now looking back, (I’m late 40s) I wish I had just reveled in it more and enjoyed it more. Ditto for when I turned 40!

  151.  #151Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:40 am

    Marikaberg -11- Yay! I enjoy reading how excited you are about how the tools are working for you.

  152.  #152Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:41 am

    Millie – 15 – oh I like this:
    “I’m content with never knowing and never asking. All I need to be concerned with is me and what feels good to me.”

  153.  #153Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:41 am

    IamHis -22- When you spoke about feeling rejected I remember feeling angry and annoyed and irritated and frustrated and relieved when that happened to me (quite a few times). I remember two things that helped me deal with it (it was difficult for me to deal with): I think it was Rori who said that only a person who doesn’t really know you can reject you; and
    Rejection/ standing you up was what HE did with the date – it’s what he did and bears no weight against who you are. This helps me to not get caught up – knowing that sometimes the actions of others have nothing to do with me. Also I realized if I’m rejected I use it to mean that there’s a better place/person for me.

    IamHis – 33- skin hungry – aw, inspires me to send you hugs ((((((((IamHis))))))))

  154.  #154Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:42 am

    Azure Blu – I am so enjoying your presence here. Such a pleasant feeling : )

  155.  #155Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:43 am

    Linda – 56; FW -58; Azure Blu – 60- Hm lightbulb moment for me – there’s who are and then there’s what you really believe and they may not be in line with each other? I hope I’m not misreading your comments. Apologies if I have and please let me know.

  156.  #156Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Azure Blu – 62- and Kim -63 – Lovely, beautiful conversation. I would really like to know why what someone else believes that possibly doesn’t impact on the relationship is so important? Is it because their beliefs come with their expectations about your beliefs? I would really like to know what you think. FunnyCD and I have very different beliefs regarding one issue and yet I’m strangely not bothered and instead feel slowly curious.

  157.  #157Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:44 am

    Kim – 68 and 132 – Yeah!!!

  158.  #158Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:45 am

    Azure Blu – 124 – I enjoyed yesterday so much and I feel really good that the decision to take my profile down was mine and not in relation to a request of his. I remember him already talking of ‘us’ and ‘relationship’ and ‘having a girlfriend/companion’ and ‘being selfish in not wanting to share’.

    My NVs are starting to rage though. Right now they’re about ‘what if he becomes a feminine man, what if this drops off, what if he’s deceiving you’ – and part of me, I’m not sure where from, thinks ‘bring the truth on’. What I feel is a coldness in my chest because of all the previous experiences of a man being interested and then disappearing.

  159.  #159Veronica on July 30, 2014 at 11:58 am

    Noticing what happens after feeling the coldness in my chest and the anxiety: I don’t mind walking away.

    Saying what I feel to him feels scarier

    And the old behaviour feeling tempted to check on him.

    I just want to disappear into myself, the love for myself that I want to practice.

  160.  #160IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    here’s what I ended up saying: “Uh, hey R. I felt kind of angry at first, but now I feel surprised and confused.”

    R: “Okay, I understand. I apologize, I’m just all over the place so my my flakiness is not on you.

    Me: “You okay?”

    R: Yes just stressed about some biz stuff

    Me: I understand, but it felt really icky getting flaked on like that.

    R: I apologize again

    Me: Also feels weird having you tell me you went ahead and saw the movie

    Anyway, I wish you the best.

    R: I apologize, it was a spur of the moment thing, not really planned.

    (code for: another girl came along, but after going out with her, I realized that you’re cooler.)

    I’m glad I responded. Now I know for sure he’s not worth my time! 🙂

  161.  #161IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 12:23 pm

    Thank you everyone for your support, it feels really good! 🙂 I feel silly and childish. It just feels good to learn about communicating in a way that feels good to me.

  162.  #162Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 12:24 pm

    Iamhis: hoorah for you!!! 🙂

  163.  #163IamHis on July 30, 2014 at 12:30 pm

    Thanks especially to Dominique and Veronica. Aww. It feels so amazing to be supported by women. and thank you, Rori, for the community!

    I’m off to take a nice hot shower and get ready for tonight! 🙂

  164.  #164Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 1:13 pm

    ((IamHis!!!)) Yay…

    in my life… when I take up for ME in a kind heartfelt way…
    I become stronger on the inside…
    which means I can be Softer on the outside…
    You’re inspiring!!

  165.  #165Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 1:16 pm

    (((Veronica))) #163
    Darlin’ Siren…
    I agree… self love,,, paint yourself with love…
    Open YOUR heart to YOU!!!
    hug YOU…

  166.  #166Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 1:18 pm

    PS veronica…
    Rori says
    “Intimacy is a terrifying thing for most of us. It’s a condition where we get closer emotionally to another person than we’re used to – and closer than we think we can bear.

    It takes bravery and practice to go outside our comfort zones.”

  167.  #167Azure Blu on July 30, 2014 at 2:02 pm

    Marika B…
    My thoughts are that…
    All is welll… relax and focus on LOVing your feelings

    “I’m happy with you and I want to keep dating… but the future’s important to me too.”
    This is something from C. Carter…
    Rori has 5 things we are NOT supposed to do…
    we are supposed to stay out of the mans Business!!
    Does anybody know that list?
    I couldn’t find it…

    Basically.. you need to get clear with what YOU want…
    and share that with him in feeling messages..
    not get into his business

    Rori says
    “You’re very new to all of this. See if you can let all these concepts, ideas and tools flow around inside yourself so you can begin to trust your instincts and intuition, and NOT ACT from defensiveness and discomfort and fear.
    I hope this makes some sense – I know it sounds a bit poetical…
    And the answer is to LOVE your terror. Love the fear. Love the ugly.
    Can you see what a difference this would make?
    LOVE your mistakes…stop telling yourself yu suck at anything, and when you DO tell yourself that – love the part that’s telling it to you!
    It’s all about integrating your system harmoniously. Building it all around self-love no matter what. Then everything shows up better. Love your insecurity. Love it all. That way, no one can shake you up when it happens….”

  168.  #168Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    The guy that I have a date with on Friday has a wiki page and has testified before congress! But he also seems like he’s a total geek, and I’m just not attracted to geeks. I have worked with geeks for my whole 15 year career and they make me cringe. Sigh. I’m just really beginning to wonder if I’ll ever meet someone again who floats my boat 🙁

  169.  #169sequoia on July 30, 2014 at 3:33 pm

    Milli is so great that you have started horseback riding. I feel inspired to take lessons too. IT’s such an exhilerating feeling to gallop and one of my dreams is to go on a horseback riding holiday tour in ireland spain or france.

    Marika I can relate to what you are writing about your CD-T – there seems to be a lot of similarity.

    He called to ask me out for sunday on monday night 🙂 but I havn’t seen him too in two weeks and he texts me regulary, there are some gaps of two days so…its very early days but we had sex and it was amazing.
    I would be lying if I would say I do not want to have sex with him anymore, I would like to just have more intimacy, more contact, more romance…but as Rori wrote in this post it can’t be forced.

    So I have decided to be the cool girl. I feel glad as or the last 2 days I havn’t felt a desire to reach out to him. I know that he want to have sex when we see each other on sunday, and he won’t stay the night as he has to get up early on monday…this triggers me a lot!!!!
    And I do look forward to sex with him but that he doesn’t stay for the night gets to me and I just want to see how I feel that evening.
    He is going to pick me up from work and I might be quiet tired, depending on how much treatment I got, so if I feel tired I still would like to see him for dinner or drinks but I might just want to cuddle with him and it would be interesting to see how he reacts.

    I have also been reading Evan Marc katz ebook and blop and he suggest if after 3 month the man is not moving himself into boyfriend status – eg. speaking everyday, spending weekends together, introducing one to friends and family – he is obviously not ones boyfriend and than its time to move on.

    So I am going to see how I feel with G for the next 3 month, still having sex with him (being sexual exclusive with him – we had that talk) but also being open to date others (not having sex so) – and how it unfolds and if after 3 month he still only keeps texting me and we only see each other occasionally I move on.

    In the meantime I am leaning back, no texting , calling first (when I did he was busy most of the time anyway! and it didn’t feel good at all) , lots of feeling messages and being cool – not bringing up any relationship questions or making plans or wanting it to have my way –
    so hard for me with the staying over part after sex (not asking him to stay over)-
    would welcome your thoughts on that. I already have expressed that it doesn’t feel good that he leaves after and doesn’t stay over, but he says he has to get up so ealry…mmmh

  170.  #170Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 5:19 pm

    The LD guy changed the dates to the weekend to come for a visit even though we had previously agreed to meet during the week. It’s a bit annoying to change plans like that. I sent him a message to let him know that I can’t get together over the weekend. I dunno, he seems kinda pushy or something. I don’t have high hopes for this guy and maybe that’s a good thing!

  171.  #171Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 5:24 pm

    I’ve got drinks planned with someone from work after work one day next week. In my mind, it is definitely NOT a date, I’m not interested in him, but I think he is in me. I do want to foster connections at work so that’s why I want to get together with him. I hope it doesn’t get awkward with him though. Another guy at work friended me on Facebook (I didn’t accept) which I thought was really weird. I hardly know him and he’s a work colleague, it just seemed inappropriate to me and puts me in an awkward position. I’m really private and generally do no let my work life cross over into my personal life on Facebook. It just bugs me that he did that. 🙁

  172.  #172Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 5:57 pm


  173.  #173Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 5:57 pm


  174.  #174luzydel on July 30, 2014 at 6:23 pm

    I have to listen to my gut feeling more often;
    a potential cd I did not meet yet, but was communicating with kinda gave me this funny feeling inside that something was off; however I went along with the texting because I did not want to overreact or be too paranoid. Today around 7 o’clock am I got a text message from him and just like that he asked for money and that he will pay back. This is a man whom I have not seen face to face yet… strange and I sort of felt it. I have to trust my instincts and learn to differentiate my gut feelings and my “paranoia” …. not an easy task.

  175.  #175Liquid Light on July 30, 2014 at 7:19 pm

    yes luzydel, I struggle with this too…but I’ve found that when I trust and can tap into it, my intuition always knows

  176.  #176Linda on July 30, 2014 at 7:40 pm

    Sequoia @ 175

    In your post you mentioned that it triggered you that he did not want to stay the night when he had to get up so early for work. I feel curious why? The reason I am asking is I encountered this in my last relationship only it was reversed. I was the one that did not want to stay over on a work the next day night.

    In my relationship I was the one that has to get up early and be at work on the clock at 5:45 AM M-F. (early hospital shift). I live 10 minutes from my job. He lived an 50 minutes away. I do not know what the details of your situation are but will share with you what mine were.

    I did not want to stay on Sunday night and drive to work from his house. For lots of reasons and none of them had to do with my lack of caring for him or his importance to me/commitment to the relationship. It had to do with my preference for a less stressful unfrazzled commute to work. I simply was acting for my best interest and being kind to myself.

    I did stay on work nights a lot for a while. It was stressful and after a while I remember saying.. “you have got to be kinder to yourself”. After a while I told P how stressful it was for me and that I preferred to go to work from home and explained all the reasons why. He took offense to it and said… said “if you really cared about me, you would put in the extra effort”!

    I felt unheard and that my needs and preferences were dismissed and they were used as evidence that I did not really care. My preferences were NOT wrong and NOT an indication of my commitment to him…but he made them wrong because it did not meet his expectation and therefore I did not care.

    I just thought that I would share my story and experience with this. Perhaps you are dealing with one thing and feeling it means something else. Just food for thought.

  177.  #177Kim on July 30, 2014 at 9:12 pm

    Well, the talk with MoM felt disappointing. He is still the feminine energy man I know.
    I know he loves me, he was even crying, but he did not even mention commitment or the future, he was just waffling. About wanting to be happy whether alone or with someone..uhmmm..don’t we all?
    He had his third chance now and the best he said was that our timelines are different, basically after a year of knowing me, he still feels unsure.
    Kinda gobsmacked cause I thought he wanted to talk to me to seal the deal. Lmao.
    It was a draining talk with no conclusion at all.
    I told him we can date but not exclusively and then he started crying. Then I excused myself saying I needed to go to bed.

    Wildchild dropped out totally, just a little text from him after Insent him a photo about lobster season here, he had asked me when it was previously and it started today.
    I did say I was burnt out on texting and kinda pushed him away. Well, that was an easy push away.

    Feeling a little frustrated right now but happy I stuck to my boundaries (MoM wanted to stay the night, I said no), and in a little bit of a ‘whatever’ attitude right now.

    It’s all good.

  178.  #178Kim on July 30, 2014 at 9:13 pm

    I am tired of outgirling MoM. I am no longer considering dating him exclusively, or maybe ever. No matter how good a man he is and how much we have in common..

  179.  #179Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 12:43 am

    marikaberg 143,

    “Fluttering! I love that! Makes me think of a butterfly, they look like they don’t know where they are going, curious and free as the wind, yet have a mission none the less.”

    I love this! Like a butterfly, curious and free as the wind… thank you, it feels so good to think of my feelings this way.

    They did feel all in a flutter, and last night I had a dream about a girl… she was very sweet and feminine, and didn’t have it all figured out. She still saw herself as having a lot to learn, and not having arrived yet, and still making a lot of “mistakes”. Yet there was a sweetness and gentleness about her, a sense that despite the “mistakes” it was all ok. I had the sense when I woke up that perhaps I was like that girl, and I felt much better.

  180.  #180Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 12:49 am


    Oh my goodness… I don’t want to sound judgey but I feel so weird at the idea of a man bursting into tears in front of a woman over something like this. It is not as though someone has died.

    The talk you described with MoM wouldn’t feel good to me either. I also would not feel good feeling like I had to steer the relationship and that he had no clear idea of what he wanted.

  181.  #181Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 12:54 am


    I am feeling inspired reading your posts.

    I feel as if I’m going through another “growth spurt” – learning, healing, changing old ways, peeling back old layers of defences. But it feels very slow and very difficult. There are some things which I KNOW are learning areas for me, things I need to improve/heal/do better at – and I feel frustrated with myself. I wish I had made more progress or that they didn’t affect me emotionally as much as they do.

    Well it affects me far less intensely than it did in the past, but even so. I just want to be a lot further along the road.

  182.  #182sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 3:41 am

    Marika yes I feel very grateful to have this support here too. I love reading your posts and it is great that you are holding yourself back to want to know where it’s heading with your CD. Also great that you havn’t asked any questions about his ex.

    I have asked already, about his ex and if he only want sex or if he is generally open for more. Not sure if it affected him on some level .He said he doen’t know yet but that he is open.
    I have the feeling so it would have been better to not have asked and to be more cool.

    From now on I want to just be in the moment with him, have fun and don’t ask any questions reg. the ex or where this is going.

    Linda – thank you so much for sharing your experience on staying over. It gave me a totally new perspective.
    I have the feeling his situation is similar as he lives 10 min from his shop. He doen’t need to get up that early but he is working on another venture at the moment.
    Reading about your perspective I understand him now much better. Before my stuff clouded things. I think some of my shame issues made me feel like a booty call, as we would have sex and than he would leave again. I thought the work thing is just an excuse for him not staying and that he didn’t care. But reading about your experience it makes sense as I do live a 40 min drive away.
    I could tell him that i am wondering how it feels to spend a whole night with him and how it feels to wake up with him – or would that be to pushy?

  183.  #183sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 3:56 am

    Linda 183 -again thank you for sharing, I nearly would have made some drama out of it, taking the him not staying overnight as not caring for me. Your perspective gave me a new picture and I understand him now.

    I wonder did he ever offered to stay at yours to spent the night together and wake up together.

  184.  #184Linda on July 31, 2014 at 3:57 am

    Kim.. Its good to read how easily you are navigating thru your relationship opportunities. Things run smoother when you know what you do and dont want.

    I had many talks draining talks like the one you described with P. They all had the same theme and he would usually issue some sort of this has got to happen or else. Certainly not a environment where I felt secure and even though he would say he loved me, spoke of and wanted a future with me, I did not feel loved. The whole thing felt like I was being offered a “straight jacket” .

    If MoM had been decisive sounds like you would have responded differently. Perhaps he will step up later. It is possible. In spite of the draining nature of the conversation, at least he has a clear understanding of where you are at and what it would take to claim you.

  185.  #185Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 4:03 am

    Just another thought on the whole sleeping over thing – for me, I like to assess how I’m feeling in the moment, and how I’m feeling about the relationship before I agree to it, as for me it’s akin to the whole “settling in” thing that Rori talks about. To me, sleeping over can feel a little like getting too comfortable or being taken for granted, without a proper commitment.

    For example with D, I feel like this whole settling in thing can easily happen. And I don’t want that. Because the relationship is not yet where I want it to be, the commitment is not yet where I want it to be, and so I don’t want to get too comfortable or complacent, only to feel disappointed later on, so if it feels particularly good in the moment, I sleep over, but I’d say at least 50% of the time, I don’t.

    Just my own perspective 🙂 For me, sleeping over is in some ways akin to living together, and I’d want to be careful about that if I was still CDing. I understand very well what people are saying about home being closer to work, and I think this is very valid too.

  186.  #186Kim on July 31, 2014 at 4:37 am

    Indigo LOL!
    Did you listen in? When he started crying and saying ‘this feels so sad’, I actually said that nobody has died, nobody i ps sick and our life is in our own hands and that there are many opportunities to do what we want and have the life we want.
    This whole ‘all is lost’ mentality just makes no sense to me when HE was the one who could have changed it.
    I feel empty now.
    I can’t take care of his feelings.
    I can’t show him how a man lives his life. He admitted to not having a decent make role model in his life. So he became a woman, basically.
    He is such a sweet and breat guy. He would be devoted to me,mas long as I didn’t need someone who plans for the future, or asks for exclusivity (assumes) or ever propose to me. He even said he doesn’t see that as a man’s job, he thinks a woman can propose just the same and he believes this to be almost preferable and said maybe even 50% of people do ot that way. We argued about thatbfor a while, I even looked up statistics and he didn’t believe them.LOL.

    In the end I said it doesn’t matter even if he says 95% of women propose to their men. I would feel bad being with a man who thinks he doesn’t ever want to do that ‘job’ . I said we are just not on the same page.
    I got so wound up by the nonsense he spoke and told him how demoralising it would feel to be with someone who never took the reins.

    I feel like I dodged a bullet but at the same time it makes me so sad because I can see how much he adores me and loves me. He just can’ get over himself.

  187.  #187Kim on July 31, 2014 at 4:40 am

    I kinda longed for wildchild’s opposite mentality ‘let’s move in together, let’s not date otehr people’ bla bla….I would have found that rather soothing at this point lol.
    Sadly he disappeared a bit.
    So back to the drawing board.
    It’s all rather exhausting.

  188.  #188Linda on July 31, 2014 at 5:37 am

    Sequoia. I truly believe that I have experienced first hand a alot of the things that Rori’s teachings tell us NOT to do. I did not do them though… HE did.

    Expectation is a major relationship killer.

    You mentioned feeling shame about your sexual envolvement etc. I know for me if I decided to be intimate with a man that I had to take full emotional responsibility for it. So if I did and the relationship did not go in a direction that was good for me, I take full responsibility for my decision to be involved that way and not make it anything about them period. This is what worked for me.

  189.  #189sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 6:51 am

    Yes i agree with you Linda – expectation is a major relationship killer and its not loving in itself – and I want to learn to be more loving before anything else – to myself and towards others.

    The sexual shame things runs deeper so and this situation is triggering it.
    SO far I enjoy the physical part of the connection very much and normally I wouldn’t have consciously started off with it but it just happened and I want to give it a chance. He is caring and wants to give me pleasure, gives me a lot of pleasure and I do enjoy it a loooot!
    The sexual shame that is triggered has to do with believes with I assume are not really mine but my mums or societies and I want to take full responsibility for it.

    here is some snippet of a discussion between Evan Marc Katz and Rori reg. Circular dating:
    Men and women aren’t all that different, and if you found out your boyfriend was “keeping his options open” until MARRIAGE, you’d probably feel pretty upset. I’m not sure why it would work any differently for the man who’s on the receiving end of Circular Dating.

    The good news is that by my “rules” (and I hate that word), you don’t have to wait long to find out where you stand. If he’s not your boyfriend in 2-3 months MAX, you’re OUT the door. Usually, if you look at successful relationships, that choice is made in the first 4-6 weeks, tops. So if you can play it cool until then and then walk if the relationship isn’t escalating (he doesn’t call every day, he doesn’t leave his weekends open for you, he doesn’t take down his PROFILE, he doesn’t refer to you as his girlfriend, he doesn’t integrate you into his life, he doesn’t make you feel safe, etc.)

    From Me – Of course I get the last word…for now…

    I just love this discussion…and what it points up MOST for me is the difference between a man COACH/therapist and a woman coach/therapist.

    Evan can see things I can’t.

    He can experience things I can’t, and come to conclusions from a different place I do.

    And yet – it’s also true that he can’t see with a woman’s EYES and feel with a woman’s feelings. And this isn’t just because he’s a man – but because he’s Evan and sees and thinks and feels and perceives as Evan.

    Same for me.

    What’s so great about this is that you have us BOTH!

    You get the firm, no-nonsense boundaries and help saying “No” from Evan, and you get the inner beefing up, the support, the tools to allow yourself to be vulnerable and available to Love.

    Let me know how you feel about all this!

    Love, Rori

  190.  #190sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 7:02 am

    Marikab It is a good thing that the tears are coming, let them out…
    I believe that all our relationship issues are running much deeper, related to our parents our babyhood.
    I know that I probably felt unloves as a baby, I was rejected already than and I am attracting it again and again into my life to feel those feelings to the core again.

    The feeling of wanting to be loved, of wanting to be desired – wanting to feel those feelings can also escalate into an emtional addiction which I know I do have.
    And there is a very fine line, as I do not want to feed those addictions as they do really prevent my healing, relarding building up ones self esteem and self love with cding and feeding ones addcitions to feel good.

    Or another emotional addiction is to want a man , a relationship to make you feel save.
    If its a core wound not to feel save than anything that makes one feel save is feeding the addicition to want to feel save…and its not really helping oneself and int he longrun it will create pain, it will come up again and again to be healed from the core.

    Its a tricky thing so to be really truthful with emotional addictions. A sign that emotional addicitons are not fullfilled is when one get angry!!
    and beyond the anger there is normally the sadness or fear….and thats were the treasure for healing lies.

    Its easily written but its challenging !

  191.  #191Linda on July 31, 2014 at 7:19 am

    @ 190. Sequoia. Yes we spent a lot of time together. We woke up together often. Yes he stayed at my house too.

    He was not a big fan of getting up when I was leaving to go home when I left for work. Even though I did not request that he leave when I left it was his decision to do that. (he works from home) It was rare that he would and perferred to stay on his turf.

  192.  #192Kim on July 31, 2014 at 7:51 am

    It’s funny how hopeful I felt with old and new CD, and now that the chips are down and things are just as they always were I feel so uninspired with it. With them.

    Wildchild sent me a video he did last night for a surf place. All I mainly saw was a bikini woman with her ass in the frame as the opening picture, and for some reason it made me think of him filming that, like he filmed us on the paddle board the other day, and having a stash of little videos like that he re-cuts with women he dated’s arses in them. I felt turned off. He wrote this whole novel about it….I didn’t want to write back, felt closed off.
    Eventually I just answered ‘nice video, nice arse’ nothing else.
    Those were my thoughts…and now I just feel demoralised with these guys. So weird how our feelings can change so quickly. 🙁

    I have a date tonight….but eh, so uninspired. Talking until midnight and not sleeping much, nothing positive to take from it and lots of boy energy needed in my daily life right now. Feeling like a squeezed lemon, all my juice gone.

  193.  #193Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 7:53 am

    sequoia 201,

    I love this post of yours. It’s really insightful.

    I know very well the wounds that come from babyhood, and the feeling of being rejected or neglected as a child, and the emotional insecurities or addictions that that can bring on later in life.

    My belief is that the remedy for that is developing inner strength. Also as you say, feeding our desire for what feels good in a healthy way. But especially developing the inner strength to look after yourself, to act in your own best interests, to be able to create the kind of life that sets you up to succeed, to become skilled in self-soothing and self-care, and in building relationships that nourish you. For me, this is how I heal from the wounds of the past.

  194.  #194Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 9:11 am

    I feel curious about LD changing plans…
    Did he give a reason?

  195.  #195Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 9:14 am

    O my goodness… asking for money
    and you havn’t even met???
    that is a new one…
    I’ve NOT heard of that… 🙂
    Good to know…

  196.  #196Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 9:26 am

    Darling Siren… YOU canNOT make a mistake…
    Rori always says…NOTHING we do is a mistake…

    You wrote this…
    “I like the phrase you offered…although I may change it slightly…as I don’t even know if T. considers us ‘dating’. It’s so flipping complicated.”

    What I have found is if I am BRAVE and share my authentic self with feeling messages… (It doesn’t matter whether T considers you are dating)
    He can then respond…

    You might say…“I’m happy with you and I want to keep dating… but the future’s important to me too…. What do you think?”
    Practice being vulnerable (THE SCARIEST THING)… sharing your feelings…
    and BE curious and open about his answer…
    baby step baby step

    I have been exactly where you are over and over with BK…

    the best thing is to practice… Every cd is therapy…
    YOU figuring out who YOU are
    by loving your feelings
    as they are coming up…

  197.  #197Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 9:36 am

    Veronica #161… thank you lovely siren, for this thoughtful question…

    I have dated several men who were quite opposite politically and I too enjoyed a good discussion and hearing their point of view…

    BUT… Spiritcd’s religious beliefs requires I become “born again” at some phase of our relationship…
    He will continue pushing for this until it happens…
    I have a mother that believes this also and we have a loving truce… but I don’t live with her…

    Interesting… as I am writing this It is helping me be able to share this with Spiritcd
    and ask him what his thoughts are on me NOT becoming “born again” in the contects of a relationship…
    He is being very GRUMPY because we havn’t had sex yet…
    I’m just not seeing this going anywhere.
    I haven’t even been to his house yet…

  198.  #198Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 9:53 am

    (((Kim #184))) oxoxoxo
    You beautiful, brave, warm goddess!!!

    I feel sad that MoM couldn’t be manly and step up and declare never ending love for YOU…
    still waffling … :~\

    My speculation (which we’re NEVER to do)
    He was crying because he thought he could continue offering crumbs
    and you would keep hanging in there…
    Hooray for YOU walking away!!
    Rori says:
    “stop giving ANY man a chance who seems “confused” about you
    and what HE wants.
    He may be fine for Circular Dating –
    but NOT if you’re going to get hung up on him.”

  199.  #199Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 10:00 am

    Thnk you, Thnk you, Thnk you,Thnk you,!!
    for sharing your life after being married to a “born again” man…

    I MUST end this soon… I KNOW what his religion requires… I was raised with it…
    But the hugs and kisses and compliments are sooo wonderful… ahhh the dancing…
    Funny, happy man!!
    AND pushing SOOOO hard for sex…
    with NO boundaries…

  200.  #200Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 10:04 am

    Indigo #204…
    Ahhh… lovely siren… you know how to wield a keyboard!!! :-}}

    I love what you said here.
    Thank you

  201.  #201Kim on July 31, 2014 at 10:14 am

    211 Azure Blu…awwww thanks for this, and the Rori reminder also. How very true.

    I am tired with confused men, feminine men, men who won’t/can’t commit. So tired, so so tired.
    Which is a good thing, because it means I just let them drop off.

    I might CD him but the attraction is all but gone anyway.
    I find it so hard to respect a man for acting like this.
    Would he ever have my back, stand up for our love and for me, be my hero?
    Or just say ‘this sucks, this is sad, waaaaaaaaahhh’.
    I did not even act like this as a child, so it makes me get goosebumps. Passivity, negativity, hopelessness….

    For no real reason.

    No father figure and mollycoddled by his mother as he had a disability. A ‘precious’ boy. Without knowing how a masculine man behaves. I am sorry for his soul because he is hurting.
    I am sorry because he loves me and I know it.
    But, sometimes, that just isn’t enough.

  202.  #202Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 10:20 am

    marika 210,

    I would encourage you to stay away from those blogs and sites which tend to simplify dating and relationships, and make us feel bad about ourselves. I can’t think that it does a siren any good, since we have much deeper, more profound, complex and emotionally attuned knowledge at our disposal. I particularly dislike the phrase “he’s just not that into you” – as if a man is a king sitting high above on a throne, smiting anyone who does not measure up, as if he is the one who gets to do the choosing. Ugh. No.

    Please remember you are the treasure here, and *you* get to do the choosing. Please try not to give your power away by agonizing whether T sees you as a booty call. You get to choose. If you want him in your life, and if what he is offering is enough for you, and if you want to have sex with him or not.

    Sorry about my rant here, but I dislike articles that disempower women by encouraging them to see themselves as “just sex objects” rather than fully empowered, fully aware, fully sensitive, whole human beings in charge of their own lives.

  203.  #203Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 10:26 am

    Thank you Azure Blu *blushes*

  204.  #204Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 10:43 am

    Just a suggestion…
    have you read through all the archives and the Siren comments that go along with this?
    for an entire year i read through the archives and the day to day blogs… when I felt like I was loosing my mind trying to untangle my heart from a 2 year imaginary relationship and loosing a job I loved!!!

    I still do read through the archives off and on

  205.  #205prplpsn28 on July 31, 2014 at 11:47 am

    I’m finding relationships, specifically mine with H, to be way too exhausting and not worth my while. Fed up. Done. Better off on my own.

  206.  #206Veronica on July 31, 2014 at 12:02 pm

    IamHis – 168 – : )

  207.  #207Veronica on July 31, 2014 at 12:04 pm

    Marika – 172 – Ha yes the bouncing around – your processing seems so healthy though. I feel uneasy offering suggestions because I do not have the training or the experience to give the suggestions that will help you.

  208.  #208Veronica on July 31, 2014 at 12:05 pm

    Azure Blu – 209 – I feel sad reading how this is happening and understand and agree with why you see this not going anywhere. I don’t like being pushed into a way of being and I don’t like to push anyone else either. I don’t understand why is it so important to him that you become ‘born again’ – has he said anything about it?
    If I may ask, how did you come to a loving truce with your mom?
    Thank you for sharing with me – it helps me to think about this with a bit more clarity.

    170 + 171 – thank you dear Azure Blu x It was all me – as I felt through my fear and anxiety – he called and was as attentive as he has been. I need to hold your reminders close to me – love myself completely, fully, passionately.


  209.  #209Veronica on July 31, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    I’ll have to catch up the previous thread tomorrow.

    Good night Sirens x

  210.  #210Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 12:16 pm

    (((prplpsn))) #220

  211.  #211Indigo on July 31, 2014 at 12:19 pm

    Azure Blu,

    If Spiritcd needs you to convert to his religion I can understand why you feel this relationship might not be for you… one of my absolute requirements, you could say it is one of my deal breakers for my forever man, is that he needs to accept who I am, and that includes in very large part my beliefs and the way I see the world. He does not have to agree with me, or believe the same thing (in fact if he doesn’t it can make for some interesting and lively debate!) but he does need to accept me and can’t pressure me to change.

    Again, it’s something I love in D. He and I can talk and debate in a very respectful manner and he will listen to my beliefs and opinions and views, and accord them the respect they deserve, even if his are not the same. It is very important to me that my relationship is a safe space for me to believe what I believe, and be able to express that, without fear of the repercussions.

  212.  #212Femininewoman on July 31, 2014 at 1:44 pm

    Again prplpsn????

    I am wondering if you don’t see this as a recurring theme in your relationship and if you don’t think it is time that you really decide what you really want to do.

    Again I invite you to review the blog and read back all that you have written about H to be really clear on the direct that the relationship has gone.

  213.  #213Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 2:50 pm

    Indigo #227…
    Yes, I had actually met Spiritcd 5 years ago on the dance floor… and immediatly he began talking about his religion… and me being “born again”

    I respectfully shared my beliefs and listened to his but made it very clear by the end of the night (when he was asking me out for a date) that this really couldn’t go anywhere because he was wanting me to change my basic beliefs (I don’t want him to change his)…
    and now 5 years later (we had NO contact until 8 months ago)… I’ve let him in closer…
    BUT I’ve been very careful with my heart
    even though I do have a crush on him as he has MANY of the things I want in a forever man

    I MUST let him go…

    MarkiaB brought me back to reallity
    by sharing her experience with HER husband
    who is insisting and badgering her into
    embrassing his religious beliefs

    almost ALL folks who share this conviction are told (by what is written in the bible) to go and spread the gospel… and bring the sinners into the church…

  214.  #214Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 2:52 pm

    Sooo… now have put my profile & pictures on Plenty of after what my girl friend told me about a friend of hers meeting the man of her dreams on that site AND
    Kyla saying that is where she met Ninja…

    Wow!!! Sooo many good looking, sweet, great profiles men!!!
    I’m sooo happy I’m trying this…
    Already talking to one man tonight!!!

  215.  #215sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 3:26 pm

    good to hear that you are focusing on trust Marika.
    My Cd hasn’t been in touch too. Monday was the last time we spoke and normally he was texting me every other day.
    I know from other relationship coaches, male ones , that men have this thing were they totally retreat into the ‘cave’, esp. when they need to focus on other things like work, are stressed or need to think about the next moves and process emotions. If a women can give a man space at that time he feels free and its certain that he’ll bounce back – its important so that she doesn’t draw him back, rather he has to come back by itself.

    I want to give my CD this time , even so I feel slightly triggered by it, but I know he has a stressfull and bussy time at work, so I want to trust, esp. as he set up our date so early, and I also assume that he did that so that he can be focused on work. I might be wrong but I want to give him the benefit of the doubt as it is early days and he has b.een in touch and caring.

    I want to trust and give him a few more weeks to get more momentum within our connection, eg to arrange more dates, to increase our contact and level of intimacy. If he doesn’t by the end of next month I will let him go. Its also going to be the time when I am going on my two week trip. And I guess we will both know that if things haven’t developed until than it won’t happen. But if they do than my trip is going to bring him stepping up even more.
    I can handle both and I want to trust that all is for the highest good.

  216.  #216Kim on July 31, 2014 at 3:28 pm

    Azure Blu…ugh, sorry about your experience with spirit man….it is so nice to have a crush and so sad to know it isn’t going to go anywhere 🙁
    I feel like that with SDT too, but hey, we know what to do.

    Actually, I found POF much better than match, eharmony or OKCupid. Maybe because everybody is on there as it is free?
    It did take me a lot of weeding out, but I did have real quality men contact me on there…after weeding out lol.
    Good luck!

  217.  #217Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 3:37 pm

    Thanks darling Siren.
    Soooo good to hear you found POF a nice online experiance!!!

    Yeah,,, I think you and I have commizurated that SDT and Spirit are alot alike…
    Soo fun… affectionate… Took my mind off of closing the door to MN…
    Yep, we know what to do…
    Yay us!! and Yay RORI!!! AND us woking the RR tools!!

    One man closer to our forever man ;~>>

  218.  #218sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 3:42 pm

    Azur blu, yes Plenty of fish is a great site and its free. I am on a local one but the guys seem really dull on there. My membership is running out soon and Pof is always a good option, esp. now I feel more inspired after reading that a friend of yours and Kyla have met there men there.

  219.  #219sequoia on July 31, 2014 at 4:06 pm

    Linda – thank you for sharing more on the staying over.

    Indigo- ‘ My belief is that the remedy for that is developing inner strength. Also as you say, feeding our desire for what feels good in a healthy way. But especially developing the inner strength to look after yourself, to act in your own best interests, to be able to create the kind of life that sets you up to succeed, to become skilled in self-soothing and self-care, and in building relationships that nourish you. For me, this is how I heal from the wounds of the past.’

    yes I agree with what you wrote…what I found for myself so and its not my own concept but I got inpspired by somebody reg. this is that there is a very very very fine line between nourishing relationships and relationship of any kind that feed our emotional addictions, that feel good.
    I know for myself that in the past most of the love relationships and also friendships were based and still are based on mutual emotional addictons. I give you this and you feel good about yourself and you give me that and I feel good about myself. Its shallow happiness and the core wound that the addicitons cover up can never be touched if one continues to live in emotional addictions. I am not an expert and I am speaking from little experience as I am just beginning with this, wanting to see my addictions and than not feeding them, but rather retreating from them and seeing what emotions come up. Its easier in some areas than others. Rori has written about this too, eg. the addiction to reach out to a man, to call, to do do do..and once we stop fear comes up, also anger which is a sign that the addiction is not being met, but when the fear come s up the healing can happen and than other emotions might come up to…its a challenging journey because we live in sooo many addictions at least I know that I do, and challengin them is uncomfortable and scary.

  220.  #220Billybelle on July 31, 2014 at 4:09 pm

    Hi Rori (and the other ladies),

    I am having a scheduling issue (maybe)…So basically, I am dating a bunch on top of being busy just taking care of my general life stuff. I have been on many, many first dates but have found that I am often busy when the fellas reach out re: the second date. In fairness, I haven’t been given more than a days notice for the second date on ALL occasions. I have been using the suggested dialogue and they seem to understand and say they will try again soon, later, etc.
    I am not hearing from them again. – I’m suprised bc the dates have been going really well. Help! I don’t want to call or contact or suggest but I am starting to get that anxious feeling and the ugly voice is doing its worst. What can I do?

  221.  #221JeanMarie on July 31, 2014 at 6:09 pm

    After CD’ing all these years – I feel there is no
    “feelings” left in me. I CD – a lot- men come in and out of my life, like the waves or tide, in and out. But
    I do not feel the excitement anymore, the thrill. Even
    the hopefulness. I suppose I have come to love myself so much – like rori says – I meet my own needs, I know you cannot get those from a man or expect a man to fulfill them – so much that I do not
    find any man even remotely what I want. Yes, I have several of the series – Siren, Targeting Mr Right, have the relationship you want – and going on 4 years of CD’ing now. But I find no answers, nothing on how to get the thrill back, the excitement. It feels like the men – they are so excited about me, so thrilled, but I find they offer nothing. It feels sad.

  222.  #222Azure Blu on July 31, 2014 at 6:55 pm

    Jean Marie…
    ohhhh…noooo… I was wondering if maybe this might happen to me…
    I’ve been dating for many years (7)…
    RR tools in the last 2…

    I;m getting worn out… I’ve stopped off and on
    But I want a long term man in my life…
    I have created a welcoming space for HIM…

    Wonder what Rori’s answer to this might be?

  223.  #223Kim on July 31, 2014 at 8:24 pm

    Azure Blu and JeanMarie.
    Me too.
    7 years dating, single, some longer dating relationships. I frequently feel worn out and like there is nobody for me out there. Sometimes I perk up with a guy for a bit and then any or all of these things happen:
    -he flakes out
    -still in love with another women
    -starts acting needy and suffocating
    – doesn’t want a committed relationship

    I feel very tired of it. When I meet a guy now, it’s just like blah. I kissed 4 guys in 6 days and it was all blah. Really.

    Occasionally I feel excitement and a man comes towards me and there is chemistry, and I stop myself before getting overexcited, like with wildchild…and he dropped off batr a good morning and good night text.
    If I had put this time and energy into a hobbie, or a pet or something, sometimes I wonder whether I might have been happier.


  224.  #224Liquid Light on July 31, 2014 at 8:35 pm

    JeanMarie, I totally understand, I feel the same way. For me, its been a year and a half of being completely underwhelmed by all the men that I meet. And I’ve been dating like crazy since the end of my last relationship. I just feel like they don’t have very much to offer at all, and it makes me feel so sad. I really wonder if I am capable of feeling excited about anyone again. I just feel so blasé and disappointed over and over again. Its so depressing. Anyway, thanks so much for posting. I so appreciate knowing that I’m not alone in feeing this way! Hang in there, girl, I haven’t given up hope yet but I am very very skeptical at this point. 🙁

  225.  #225Violette on July 31, 2014 at 9:14 pm

    I feel waves of exhaustion with men, and then I’ll feel excited and hopeful…

    I got a missed call from S and he didn’t leave a message. I still have a couple of his things he left here, as if he was moving in the first time he slept over (and last). And wow, when I’m tired like this…I feel really grouchy about the whole experience. Grouchy that I haven’t had sex in so long, and that he was so bad at it, and that I stuck around as long as I did, trying to build intimacy to see if that would improve the sex. Such a waste of time! And now I feel so resentful about it. I don’t ever want to date a man who doesn’t so much as kiss me very well. Also I feel so disappointed that S wasn’t sad when we broke up, that he was angry and self-righteous. No way we could even be friends, he was such a jerk. Well, he was. And I so didn’t see it coming, that’s what shook me up, that I had expected a much different ending, him being sad and sorry and me feeling a loss…it but a bad taste in my mouth about all the sweet things he had done for me before.

    And I feel surprised how much I still have these feelings!

    Because I went on a date with someone I met online, and I could feel residual fear and anger from what happended with S, and even with SJ from before him, and I do not want to bring that into my new experiences. I want to clean that up for myself. Focus on forgiveness, forgive myself especially.

  226.  #226Violette on July 31, 2014 at 9:17 pm

    It’s such an automatic reaction for me when someone behaves badly that I take it as a reflection of something wrong with me. And if anything it’s the opposite. These men were not up to my level. I mean that they were way less attractive and cool than me. That sounds mean, but I feel like that impacted their actions, that the way they behaved that disappointed me came out of their own insecurities, not anything lacking in me. If anything I need a better man to treat me with more equality and respect. Because he respects and likes himself so much he believes he deserves a woman as beautiful and accomplished and fun as me.

  227.  #227Violette on July 31, 2014 at 9:53 pm

    It’s wild how hard it feels to handle rejection. I went out with SJ twice, at the beginning of the month, and I loved it, I liked him so much. And then, after like making out the whole second (and first) date, he never called me again. And…it’s been so hard for me to accept. It hurts! I hate it. I don’t want any man who just trails off to have this much of my energy.

  228.  #228Liquid Light on July 31, 2014 at 9:53 pm

    Jheez, I get so tired of the endless emails back and forth on these dating sites. I sent this message to someone who I have been communicating with back and forth with off and on for several months and just got tired of it. Ughh…

    Me: Hi, Its a long story. To be honest, I really dislike endless emails back and forth. And besides we already met a few months ago in xxxx. That obviously didn’t make that much of an impression on you so this doesn’t bode well. I like it when I knock someone socks off and not barely register on their radar screen. So take care and go find someone who knocks your socks off! If I see you around, don’t worry, I’ll be friendly… it won’t be awkward or anything.s

    And then he asked me out for lunch! LOL! Truth be told, HE doesn’t knock MY sox off so I feel kinda ho-hum about getting together. But so interesting how being totally honest and fearless in communication changes the dynamic so radically…

  229.  #229Violette on July 31, 2014 at 10:11 pm

    Even the last guy I slept with, G, 5 months ago before I moved to this new city…He really just appeared out of nowhere and spent a romantic, magical, easy week with me before I went. He kept in touch with emails. And when I was in town last month for work…he proceeded to treat me like garbage. I had really thought that I’d finally found a man in that town who was different, but no, he’d become like the others.

    The disappointment from that, was coming up for me on this last date I went on…I still, or maybe for the first time am allowing myself to feel how bummed that made me.

  230.  #230Violette on July 31, 2014 at 10:27 pm

    Wow, forgiveness can really make a girl feel 50 lbs lighter!

  231.  #231Violette on July 31, 2014 at 10:39 pm

    I signed up on POF a couple of days ago. I don’t want to say there was noone of interest…but I have been really practicing saying no to the ones I have absolutely no attraction to…where I can tell. I feel mean, it’s funny but I feel mean rejecting men who seem nice. But this experience with S has driven home for me that if I don’t like someone, I need to not waste my time. It’s a self-esteem issue really. And jeez, they’ll live!

    One guy called me on the phone and we spoke, and then I had to go work, and he sounded angry with me, and got off the phone quickly and said we’ll speak again. It made me feel totally shocked. I even said, like, really? To him on the phone. I was even more surprised that he texted the next day to say he enjoyed the talk! I don’t want to talk to him again though. I don’t want to talk to someone on the phone and they don’t ask me out, and they hang up quickly like they’re punishing me for needing to get off the phone…but really the main reason is he told me he lives like an hour away and I’m just not open to going far away, which they always expect me to do.

    I went on a date last night. Woah, I really liked the guy. I know this sounds bad but he spent a lot of money on me and I really liked it. It surprises me how much I like that. Money. Eesh, something to keep my eye on about myself. But I also noticed right off the bat he had a confidence about himself, he wasn’t nervous, he came off relaxed and it was lovely. And he didn’t try to find out everything about me in that awful forced way so many guys do…he just let the conversation ebb and flow, and…I could feel him. And man was he a good kisser. I feel really excited about him. He wanted to see me the next night but I said I couldn’t. Thank God, I do need the time to digest things. So I’m seeing him tomorrow, and we shall see. It feels nice…I feel embarassed to meet him on POF, but he didn’t mention one thing about it on the date, and I liked that. Who cares! There are more interesting things at hand.

    Also a guy wrote me who seems actually really nice, and I feel wiling to continue to write back and forth with him, because I get a good vibe. I hope he’ll want to meet too.

    It feels cringy and icky to be online dating, and I actually get annoyed when I see someone new has written. But then look at the nice surprises! Look at me with new romance in my life, who’ have thunk!

  232.  #232Violette on July 31, 2014 at 10:41 pm

    I am romantic and lovely. I am a magnet for love:)

  233.  #233Rori Raye on July 31, 2014 at 11:17 pm

    Billybelle – There might be something simple we could do to make this work better for you – if you can – try one of my Certified Coaches (the Directory of amazing Rori Raye Coaches is over in the sidebar on the right). Love, Rori

  234.  #234Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 6:37 am

    Kim #241…
    Interesting to think about…
    If I had put this much energy into a hobbie or a pet…
    Or something…

    Course during all of this Cding ( since RR) I am always learning more about ME… there’s that…
    but I don’ want to get jaded or cynical…

    I wasn’t very authentic last night with Spiritcd…
    He textd me around 9:30 pm and wanted me to meet him at the beer garden… he had met a couple from Canada and was having a good time and wished I was there…
    I was cooking and cleaning… invited him over when he was on his way home…
    he stopped by and we did some very heavy petting for several hours.
    I shared (again) I had to be in an exclusive relationship, that sex for me is the sharing of something special and is best when we know each other better and ease into it slowly…
    He agreed…
    BUT Sirens,
    I don’t want a relationship with him…
    Why did I do this???!!!
    He was being sooo sweet and tender and
    I can’t believe I’m leading him on like this…
    Ohhhh… my god!!!

  235.  #235Kim on August 1, 2014 at 6:53 am

    Aw Azure Blu… are not leading him on? You are enjoying the attention…honestly, I don’t see anything wrong with that. I think he knows deep down anyway…
    I probably would have done the same..

  236.  #236Kim on August 1, 2014 at 6:54 am

    Leading him’s not like you promised anything you can’t keep. Exploring is not necessarily leading on.
    Be kind to yourself 🙂

  237.  #237Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 7:13 am

    (((Kim))) xxxx.
    Ohhhh,, thanks sooo much … I feel A LOT better…
    It does feel sooooo good to get really BIG, Warm hugs…
    He gives the best…
    and he says such wonderful things…
    We have sooo much fun..
    Sooo playful…

  238.  #238Kim on August 1, 2014 at 7:19 am

    Enjoy it! I would.
    I would be authentic and open and just enjoy.

  239.  #239Kim on August 1, 2014 at 7:24 am

    I wanted to do the same with wildchild, but he is not coming towards me at this point, so….and I am a little unwilling to accept last minute plans for the weekend, if he does come around. Feels cooled off this whole thing.
    I did express to him that I am not interested in last minute kinda dates and friends with benefits casual dating (at the same time he knows I would not be ready to consider a relationship with him at this point).
    He expressed to me that he doesn’t know what to do.
    Now he disappeared bar the twice daily texts.
    I don’t feel pursued so it’s kinda dead now…
    On the other side, I had a nice guy yesterday….nothing in common with him much but so sweet and nice….masculine. Might just explore with him if he shows up again…lol.
    No more laser focusing on one man even if I have a crush and lots of chemistry. Learning still…

  240.  #240Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 7:42 am

    Kim… we’re at the same place with SDT and Spirit…
    I need to keep practicing sharing my feelings…

    I finally asked him where he lives…
    I’m sure he is NOT that proud… cause he’s living in an apt… he said he sold his house a few years ago…
    Most guys would have shared their financial stats by now… for men it had much to do with who they are..==========================================e3w
    ooops my cat typed that… :~>

  241.  #241Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 7:52 am

    one thing I’ve noticed… if i’ve dated a guy for a little while and he has shown great interest and then starts backing off…
    if i lean forward a little and show more enthusiasm it’ll kick start things…
    It seems me leaning back tooo far and tooo long… they get a since that I’m not that interested..
    Especially when they start having feelings for me…
    And also when they have since I’m dating other men…

    There seems to be a fine line between leaning back too far and participating in the rythem of getting to know each other….
    Is this anti Rori?

  242.  #242Kim on August 1, 2014 at 7:57 am

    I wonder what your cat meant to tell us lol

    Hmmm….I didn’t realise spirit was quite so new.

    I admire you for not pushing him away when you realised he won’t be your forever man, that is great.

    I end up pushing them away. I kinda pushed SDT away by telling him I don’t want fwb and I want friends (as in his situation I wouldn’t want relationship either). Being slightly reserved and shy, I think it left him nowhere to go, nothing to pick up on.

    But even that is ok. Previously, I would have felt sad that i had pushed a guy away and then gone into overdrive and chased him, well initiated contact and such.

    Now I feel very phillosophical. What’s meant to be is meant to be. He could ask me for dates…and he isn’t, so that’s all that matters to me nowadays..
    And that was the case even before I seemingly pushed him away, so I feel ok with it.
    May the best man win, not the ambiguous one!


  243.  #243Kim on August 1, 2014 at 7:59 am

    259 I found the same.
    I do not think it is anti rori to occasionally move towards a man who has shown the movement towards you.
    Many men are used to women chasing nowadays and leaning too far back has also done the same for me.
    I had guys saying I blew them off when all I did was: nothing and lean back.
    Interesting, huh?

  244.  #244Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 8:28 am

    the reason I didn’t know where he lives is cause…
    I’ve know quite clearly, since we began hanging out – There can be NO relationship…
    (more off than on) meeting when we were both out for a few hours at a bar… maybe every other month for 8 months…

    Sooo I didn’t ask many questions… just hung out got hugs and kisses and warm conversation and playful banter…
    I think I am pushing now by getting to know him better and sharing more about me…
    Hoping he’ll put up a deal breaker…
    But NOT so far…
    As alll us sirens know… Rori’s tools work REALLY well!!! Even when we don’t want them to…

  245.  #245Kim on August 1, 2014 at 8:30 am

    Ha! Thanks for clarifying Azure Blu…that is a long time of sporadic dating. Very interesting.
    I can’t wait to see where it goes…he he.

  246.  #246Linda on August 1, 2014 at 8:55 am

    Azure… I have been reading along with what you are posting.

    I feel curious about your situation with SpiritCD. I wonder if the religious element was not in the mix of this relationship how you would be regarding the relationship and feeling about him ?? It sounds like you enjoy very much and love the energy he brings to you but are discounting it because he is a christian. It is quite possible that the very things you are enjoying from him is rooted and fueled by his spiritual life.

    I assume by your comment about your “truse” with your mom that your exposure/view of this type of believe system is negative and undesirable.

    I can understand enjoying the attentions and affections of a great man and how wonderful that feels but why let him in closer ? I find myself wondering what is a work here really if anything?

  247.  #247Labbit on August 1, 2014 at 8:55 am

    Hello Sirens! I feel floaty and dreamy today. On my walk home from the gym this morning I noticed a beautiful tree with berries in three colors — unripened orange, riper red and ready-to-eat black. I felt so enamored just standing under it, admiring each berry like a confetti popper about to explode. It smelled delicious too. When the wind caught the tree the branches seemed to wave down at me. I felt romanced! By a tree. Silly? Totally. And fun.

    Last night TenderCD and I worked out together. It was a day of healing for me — I felt anxious in the morning and wanted to text him to firm up our plans. I wasn’t even sure if we were going to get together or not. As the morning went on I realized that I wanted to work out whether he joined me or not, and that it was more important to give him the space to come forward to me than it was to decide anything in that moment. So I concentrated on my work and when fearful thoughts did cross my mind, I silently repeated some words that I’d pulled from Dominique’s ebook: the world is attracted to my peace, my love, my calm, my trust, my big beautiful heart! I CD’ed the staff at a deli where I picked up lunch and a man in the park who sat nearby and started a chat.

    Early in the afternoon TenderCD did text and took charge of planning immediately after serenading me with some sweet words. It’s funny how urgent it all felt in the morning but by the afternoon I felt calm and safe in his care. I’m so glad I trusted myself to wait to hear from him. It felt so good that he came to me. I told him I felt yummy and that his words sent shivers down my spine. I’ve noticed that with each date he gets more decisive and even more masculine. It feels delicious.

    We met at the gym after work, both arriving in our work clothes. After our workout he started walking me to the train…but that wasn’t what I wanted. I wanted to spend more time with him! I felt unsure of how to tell him this without trying to control him. So I stopped walking. I asked my heart for help in what to say. I said, “I feel sweaty. It would feel really good to shower right now. What do you think?” He smiled and invited me back to his place, and said he had hoped to keep the evening going. He asked if I wanted to shower and then go to dinner, which was perfect!

    During dinner we talked more about this. I shared how I felt more comfortable when he planned things and took control, and that I felt controlling in asking him to shower and hinting that I wanted to go to his place. He replied that his main concern was making me happy, and that if there was something I needed I shouldn’t be afraid to speak up and ask for it directly. That he would let me know if he felt pushed or prodded; that he couldn’t read my mind so I shouldn’t expect that he knows what I’m thinking. (I laughed at this last part! It’s so true…I do expect him to just know somehow, unfair as it is.) He also said that the more open I am the more comfortable he feels being open…I melted at this. He reminded me that though he’d offered me a few different restaurant options and let me pick, that when a better idea came to him than the place I’d picked he suggested it without hesitation. The place he suggested was amazing, very romantic with outdoor seating under a gazebo of staggered Edison lights. So when he wants control he will take it, and that it’s up to me to speak up when his decision goes against my wishes, and also up to me to let my wishes be known all the time. Melted some more. We spent the rest of dinner laughing — he shared a very funny and personal story from childhood and I got his advice on a couple of issues I needed help with, and he asked me for some work thoughts. It felt like a true back and forth sharing, with each of us balancing our energies nicely. Plus we had small plates to share, which meant a lot of feeding each other from our forks. One of my favorite flirts!

    After dinner we went back to his place for a while. Things started to get very hot. He has asked to take things slowly this time around so when things started going further I felt unsure, and I could see that he was unsure too, and I asked if we could slow down. Though it was hard for both of us to stop, we did, and I am glad for it. I would rather wait for a night we can spend together in relaxed peace and harmony. He called a car for me and I went home after some final good nite kisses.

    It has been so wonderful to get back together with this man who I barely gave a chance to last time, because I was so wrapped up in my own head with expectations and demands that looking back don’t even make much sense. I very much like being surprised! I am enjoying how feeling peace and trust opens me up to love, and how it opens him up too. It feels harder right now to think about dating other men, but I am keeping myself first. I know TenderCD is not dating anyone else and he knows that for now, I am. We started an exclusivity chat last night and I have a feeling that pretty soon we will have that in more depth. There is no rush though.

  248.  #248Labbit on August 1, 2014 at 8:56 am

    Whew! Sorry my posts are so long…I have found it very helpful in going through the archives when other Sirens share their experiences in detail…I hope that my story can do the same. 🙂

  249.  #249Linda on August 1, 2014 at 8:57 am

    haha talented cat!

  250.  #250Linda on August 1, 2014 at 9:02 am

    Labbit that was refreshing to read. Left me feeling smiley!

  251.  #251Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 9:05 am

    I have been reading all your comments and absorbing, and reflecting and cheering you on – I’ve just not felt able to jump in at any point.

    B has been redeeming himself and spent the last two days decorating whilst I’ve been at work. Yesterday, I realised how far I’ve gone in the opposite direction with being able to receive. I’ve been so busy man-managing my own life for months – I’ve almost forgotten. I kept feeling like I had ‘to do’ something in return. In fact I did do – I bought tea

    The same in other areas – giving – not receiving. I need to go back to ‘Modern Siren’

    Even with the decorating, B always manages to say the exact thing that makes me want to punch him on the nose. It just feels so conditional. I’ll do this for you but I’ll disapprove of you doing anything which is outside of my expectation because I’ve done this for you. I have a friend moving from another city literally a street away with two kids and I offered to go and help her unload the van. It’s evening, I’ve been working – tomorrow I’m decorating. I’m not pushing myself by helping her. I wanted to help – it wouldn’t be for long. Yet B gave me snide remarks ‘cos he’s painting my house whilst I go and help her…I feel grrr angry, stampy feet, stay out of my way…life doesn’t flow with B….there’s limits to his generosity and open-heartedness…always a nailing down never a rippling out…

    I wrote about him before he moved in last year that I wanted to swim in the ocean but with him I was swimming in a paddling pool – bumping up against an edge wherever I went! I so should’ve listened to myself! I’m enjoying the reminders above from you ladies about not hanging onto a man who’s confused or ambivalent about you and look at their actions not their words…

  252.  #252Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 9:11 am

    I very much enjoyed your story Labbit – your energy feels wonderful – and the day/evening sounded lovely. Thank you for sharing. It is all such a good reminder of how it feels to be back in our ‘heart’ energy xx

  253.  #253Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 9:25 am

    And now I’m going to see my friend feeling guilty and like I shouldn’t…bad atmosphere ugh

  254.  #254Linda on August 1, 2014 at 10:24 am

    Oh Sophie … I so understand what you are feeling. That was a huge element in what I dealt with in my last relationship. I totally get what you are feeling.

    I enjoyed that he would offer to do things for me but then I would hear about it later or the how he referred to stuff he did in the language he would use… like “slaving away” or complaining that his body ached and knees hurt so bad from being on the roof of the house. Those “TAKE BACKS” . It is like receiving a gift only to realize that there were lots of expectations and strings attached. It takes all the happiness out of receiving because you dont know what it is gonna cost you later etc.

    Some people have a way of orienting the entire relationship around them and making the air tense and unpleasant. Indeed, the energy does not flow freely at all.

    It left me feeling closed off and ugh!

  255.  #255Indigo on August 1, 2014 at 10:27 am

    So, I’m getting up early for my hike tomorrow morning, and going to watch a feel-good chick flick with my mom tonight. I feel in need of soothing.

    I feel weepy, like little tears of frustration stinging my eyes. Maybe it’s hormones. But I think it is more likely I have been peeling back a layer for healing this week and my comfort zone is rebelling against it. That can actually make it quite hard to love on yourself extra hard, but it makes it all the more necessary. I think that is actually where my discomfort and frustration is coming in – the part of me that knows I need to love and care for myself, and the part of me that just wants to pitch a little girl fit right there on the carpet, at war with each other.

    It does get easier with time, but I don’t like this part :/ I will try a nice dinner, a hot bath, and the aforementioned chick flick.

  256.  #256Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 10:33 am

    Linda #264…
    Veronica has asked about the loving truce between my pentacostal, charismatic mom and me…

    When I was growing up I was instructed in spirituality and religion by my mother and her membership in various churches that loudly proclaimed their enthusiasm and ardore for god.

    Being born a worm and a sinner we all need to confess our horrid sins and let “jesus into our hearts”… of course to those who have not experienced this it sounds ok…

    However when I became a teenager I spent time in many other churches and denominations of my choosing and came to believe that I am loved by a higher power, the universe and I am perfect just the way I am!!! and that spirituality is VERY private for me…
    Since that time my Mom has been VERY disappointed in my lack of church attendance, me not believing in god the same way she does etc… and she expressed this freely, frequently and ignored and treated me badly because of my beliefs…
    I spent much time railing against her beliefs and explaining mine… needing her love and attention…

    However 10 years ago I began realizing I was treating her exactly as she treated me… NOT accepting her just the way she is…

    sooo I began a loving journey to sharing my meditation as prayer (and not feeling like a hypocrite)
    Softly saying I love you MOM… softly letting her into my heart… asking warmly “do you ever miss me?”
    “how did it feel when YOU were growing up”
    She spent some time in the hospital and I stayed with her night and day…
    It has been a glorious journey and she has become a wonderful source of love and support for me and I for her…
    It truly is a miracle!!!

    The main reason I worked soo hard to find my way to forgive her for the past and have a loving caring relationship with her is because
    I believe in my life, that NOT until I mended some of my first family relationships could I ever hope to have a loving relationship with a man…

  257.  #257Linda on August 1, 2014 at 10:41 am

    Oh… I want to add that I tried really hard to shift the engergy with P. I stopped just doing what he suggested or wanted etc to keep the peace and I started not “going along” with everything. I started doing some of the things I wanted to do, without guilt. I felt more centered and balanced… but he did not flow with it and the unpleasantness grew instead.

    Thankfully I did not live with him and had my own space.

  258.  #258Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 10:42 am

    Linda #264…
    I have made a comment on how and why I have mended my relationship with my Mom
    but it is in mediation…

    Yes, I like your question to me…
    “Why let him get closer and what is at work?”

    Partly cause it’s sooo nice being around a man I find sooo handsome and sexy… they’ve all been ok looking
    He is gorgeous to me
    and fun and playful and smart and right here in my own town…
    NOT sure the underlying need to continue…
    he must have a subconcious hook from the past…
    doesn’t feel real dependable
    a little slippery
    not upfront…
    kinda too charming, can’t relax…
    mmmmm… alot like my dad… BINGO~!!!
    NOT GOOD!!!

  259.  #259Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 10:45 am

    (((Indigo #273)))
    Mmmm… i do send healing, calm vibrations to YOU and cookies for your little girl pitching a fit…

  260.  #260Dominique on August 1, 2014 at 11:02 am

    Labbit – 265 – I SO LOVED reading this post. 🙂


  261.  #261Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 11:09 am

    Kim #261…
    That’s my since also…
    Sooo many women take control of the dating situation…
    my cds seem very surprised I don’t do that…

    Sooo yes… a gentle lean forward works well and is NOT anti rori…
    thanks my dear!!

  262.  #262Dominique on August 1, 2014 at 11:14 am

    Azure Blu – There is absolutely nothing wrong with leaning forward or initiating now and then, even in early dating stages, IF you can do so with NO expectations of anything, with no agenda.

    And when in a committed long term relationships, there will naturally be more of a flow with this though the bulk of the initiating and leaning forward will still be coming from him.

    And you will FEEL when the balance is tipped too much one way or the other. The energy around it will feel palpable, eg. his energy will pull away, shrink from you withdraw when there’s been too much leaning forward. And know that this balance could vary in any given situation or place in time.


  263.  #263Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 11:20 am

    Thanks for explaining more…

    I think I’m getting a little better at feeling when things are tipping one way or the other…
    “with no expectations” is an important reminder!!

  264.  #264Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 11:39 am

    Labbitt #266
    Wow!!! thank you sooo much for taking the time to share YOUR wonderful feeling messages…
    I have pasted and copied All of them in my FM folder..
    Just an amazing time!!!

    Yes, I love your point about writing it all out
    cause I too avidly read the archives for hours when I first came to Siren Island and still do…!!!

  265.  #265prplpsn28 on August 1, 2014 at 11:46 am

    Well…H and I are breaking up. He’s come up with all kinds of lame excuses as to why he can’t focus on a relationship. But I know the real reason is because he doesn’t love me. I really wish he would have come out with this a long time ago. Would have saved a lot of heartache. I feel worthless. Unlovable. This is exactly what happened in my last relationship before H. At least he only waited 1 yr. I feel really hurt and let down.

  266.  #266sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    I don’t feel cool today at all. I thought I can be cool but I feel sad that today. I feel confused and I do not feel appreciated. I feel insecure and I wonder what G’s intentions are. Is he using a strategy on me…I do wonder.
    Instead of him becoming more communicative and interested in seeing me it has been dribbeling along and I feel not inspired by this. Ok he is bussy at work but if a man is into a women he always finds the time to speack to her , text her see her. I do not want anything mediocre, its not enough.

    I am wondering if I should cancel our meeting, just tell him I feel exhausted from work when /if he contacts me on sunday ( as I assume now).

    Or I just meet him, go and have dinner with him and express that I feel disconnected and not open for intimacy…that I need to spend more time upfront to open up and to feel inspired to go there.
    I feel tearful.

  267.  #267sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    I just doesn’t feel good if the men doesn’t put any effort in…or as little as he can. It just feel so not special, so mediocre. Maybe I am addicted to feeling special, I know I am a little and my child is raving about it, I actually feel angry that I am not treated in a special way.

  268.  #268Indigo on August 1, 2014 at 12:14 pm


    Why would a relationship not working out be any reflection on your worth or loveability. All it means is that you and this man were not a fit, it says nothing about your quality, your desirability, your worth or your loveability. Please keep that close.

    I’m so sorry, but I would encourage you not to dwell on H not loving you. First of all, you do not know for sure that that is true. Second, perhaps he is not really available for a committed relationship with any woman… that is something I have thought many times when reading your posts.

  269.  #269Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 1:10 pm

    Labbit it feels good to read about your date with Tender Cd. I was wondering what expectations did you have the first time you were dating him and how has it changed this time…would be inspiring to hear from you.

  270.  #270prplpsn28 on August 1, 2014 at 2:07 pm

    Thanks Indigo. It feels horrible tho. Lower then low.

  271.  #271Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 2:23 pm

    (((Purple))) I agree with Indigo it’s no reflection on you and recognizing that you feel those feelings gives you a really good opportunity to get to know them and then see them for what they are ‘falsehoods’ and then get to learn how to love yourself really hard so that you can go for the kind of relationship you’d truly like – where you feel good

    (((Linda))) it takes all the happiness out of receiving because you don’t know what it’s going to cost you …. so right sister 🙂 so joyless too…i’m still feel on alert’ all the time with B even when he’s ‘being nice’ that he’s going to be impatient with me or moody…I don’t mind. It’s his loss and I guess I’ve learnt a lot about what I want in a man (or don’t want). I feel pleased that I went to help my friend – she was trying to do it all on her own against the clock with the delivery men – I feel pleased that B helped me with my stuff so I could go and help her with her stuff – is that nuts? What goes around comes around – no? That’s how I like to see life anyway – we all help each other out…B is much more compartmentalized than that.

    I feel quite amused that I more or less dismantled the house around him by packing up all my things and getting on with moving out myself … and finally got him out of his cave ha ha ((((((oh B))))))(((he makes his life so very difficult)))((((and he misses all the best parts))))

    (((Indigo))) did you do your plan? are you feeling any better?

    (((Sequoia))) I think the main point here is that you’re not feeling good – right? So how can you help yourself feel good? You can’t do anything to make him do the things that will make you feel good but you can express to him what you want in a relationship or someone you’re dating – then he can decide whether that’s what he wants too…or not? I’ve not kept up with things, have you been dating long? xxx

  272.  #272Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 2:25 pm

    I am sorry you are feeling tearful…
    I remember Rori saying it is good to meet in person and share your feelings with the cd…

    I think this sounds really good…
    “Or I just meet him, go and have dinner with him and express that I feel disconnected and not open for intimacy…
    that I need to spend more time upfront to open up
    and to feel inspired to go there.”
    “I like feeling special and I don’t feel special.
    What do you think?”

  273.  #273Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 2:42 pm

    Ahhh Azure Blu – yes – I like how you’ve said that “I like feeling special and I don’t feel special – what do you think?” it feels simple and vulnerable and authentic and gentle

  274.  #274Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 2:48 pm

    thank you darling Siren…
    But I got those words from you!! ;+>

    maybe I just rearranged them a little

  275.  #275Veronica on August 1, 2014 at 2:50 pm

    FunnyCD invited me to a get together in two weeks time where I’ll be meeting his friends but wanted to see me ‘at least twice’ (lol) before then – in privacy for us to have our bodies get used to each other. I love exploring and he knows how to explore a body without it becoming too sexual – sensual sometimes slipping into a sexual moment and yet not fully sex. Eventually we had a conversation naked – so revealing that I felt a newness to the things I was pondering.

    Fears, wanting to run away, noticing an irritation pointing to a wanting to control what is happening – this is unfolding in ways that are deep and new. Intimacy is scary. And feeling safe too so that I can say to myself ‘I’m not there yet’ and still he’s besotted with me yet not pushing for future plans but interested in how I want to live in the future. I feel safe enough not to bolt but my is there a newness to what I’m experiencing.

    With all the boxes ticked for a man I would want to ‘go deep with’, I can let those ‘boxes’ go and really ponder on what I want. At first I felt uneasy at not being as enthusiastic as he is and then feeling relief that I have my own time and my own way of getting to this ‘enthusiasm’. I am feeling thrilled deep down that this is happening and noticing a certain respect for this relationship to have its own privacy before meeting mutual friends as partners. There are things my mind gets caught in and wants to have that privacy to unravel itself.

    And noticing that I’m not physically attracted to him and then that slips into attraction and then slips out again which is so interesting. It seems to be situated around CARE – yeah it seems like the next big thing for me between us – CARE.

  276.  #276Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 2:54 pm

    292/191 – it’s me Azure Blu 🙂 – Sequoia hasn’t commented yet – I was liking the scripting for Sequoia – I was liking how gentle it felt – I notice it – I need more of it right now – I forget how to be gentle

  277.  #277Veronica on August 1, 2014 at 2:54 pm

    *meeting each other’s friends as partners

  278.  #278Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 2:58 pm

    wow veronica – I feel breathless reading about your journey – how brave you are being! how very very bold yet tentative all at the same time! How you are staying the line and not bolting just unfolding – wow!

  279.  #279Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:01 pm

    Sophie… ohhhh… :-))
    Yes… I felt it was very gentle also…
    I actually pasted and copied it as something to share with Spiritcd… if need be…
    he is VERY casual and
    I’m NOT feeling that special… it would be good practice…

  280.  #280Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:03 pm

    Ohhhh how warm and sensual all of your interactions with Funny are feeling…
    You are a BRAVE siren
    gently holding your space while experiencing YOU and HIM…
    I sooo appreciate your sharing

  281.  #281Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    Thank you Azur Blu and Sophie for scripting and pointing out that it is gentle.
    I might word it like this, what do you think : I would like to feel that I am special to you but I haven’t been feeling that. or just I would like to feel that I am special to you without but?
    And than it would be interesting to see how he responds.

  282.  #282Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 3:33 pm

    297 – I didn’t realise SpiritCD was quite casual – I suppose I assumed because he was asking about the born again thing he wasn’t xx

  283.  #283Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:39 pm

    I think Rori advises not to use the word *you
    ‘When I’m dating I like to feel special and I’m not feeling special…. What do you think?”
    Sirens… some help here!!

  284.  #284Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 3:42 pm

    I would like to feel that I am special to you but I don’t feel it. What do you think?

    if its mediocre it just feels a waste of time to me. If there is no desire from the men to get to know me, to be at least open to explore the connection.
    There can be of course no guarantee that it will work out, but if there is no desire to explore things its a waste of time.

  285.  #285Liquid Light on August 1, 2014 at 3:42 pm

    I had a lunch date with someone new today in my new town. Unfortunately, he was just what I feared he would be – a total geek. Really smart, accomplished, nice guy but zero attraction. Food and restaurant were great, and I’m loving my new condo and location. Oh well, at least I discovered a new restaurant. He brought me flowers, and was talking about wanting a relationship, etc. etc. (way too heavy for a first meeting) but there’s just no there there for me. I really have no interest in seeing him again, and now I’m trying to trust my instincts more so I won’t be seeing him again.

  286.  #286Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 3:44 pm

    Sequoia – i would maybe leave out the ‘to you’ because its making his feelings more important than yours (or at least making it about his feelings rather than yours) – “I like to feel special. When (blah blah blah). I feel special” Is there any thing he does that makes you feel special? Or any behaviours in general that make you feel special?

    In this way you are expressing what you like and how that looks for you. You are not ‘directly or indirectly’ asking anything of him. Just telling him, so he knows, then it is up to him what he does with the information – whether he chooses to hear you or not, whether he can hear you or not.

    I don’t know – have you been dating him for long?

    Does that make sense?

  287.  #287Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 3:44 pm

    I would like to feel a desire from you to get to know me and explore this connection but I don’t really feel this from you. What do you think?

  288.  #288Femininewoman on August 1, 2014 at 3:44 pm

    prplpsn I think your comments were loaded with words that suggested that H was really into prioritizing a relationship in his life. It was clear that he is not afraid of commitment, he can love and care for another and that he can do relationship. He demonstrated that through his relationship with his child. It might just be that he is on a mission to see his child through life and is not in a place where he really wants to focus on anyone else. I don’t think it is about him not loving you.

  289.  #289Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:47 pm

    I know…
    when he asked me out on a REAL date 3 weeks ago he asked me at the beginning of the week for Friday… we did all kinds of fun stuff…
    and it has slowly been less and less…
    BUT more and more pressure for sex…
    I’m thinking he would probably like to be asked over for dinner…
    but it feels too much leaning forward… I asked him over last night… after I couldn’t go meet him downtown.
    and asked him to go with me to the lake on Sunday with friends… he can’t go
    Nooo… no more leaning forward…

  290.  #290Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 3:50 pm

    mmm Sophie I don’t know…I am expressing this in german not english and it doesn’t come across the same way, so its a bit tricky. He also pointed out that I am a princess already…so if I just say I want to feel special he could misunderstand…and I want to feel special to him…thats the truth really, but I understand reg. the you, it could put to much focus on him, thank you for pointing it out.

  291.  #291Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:54 pm

    YESSS!!! i like this alot!!!
    just the feeling message I needed…
    Thank you!!!

  292.  #292Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 3:56 pm

    Marika great to hear that your Cd is in touch and looking forward to your date and that you had a great day.
    Today I have been feeling a bit insecure….not know ing what’s going on…
    But I have not been reaching out to him, which is already sthg. I am happy about.

    I know that the special thin runs deep, I never felt special to my parents really…not in a sense that they truly loved me and wanted me.
    In retrospect I am realising they used me to show off when it suited them and than made me feel special, but I didn’t feel loved.

  293.  #293Azure Blu on August 1, 2014 at 3:57 pm

    Sequoia #307
    Mmmmm…. yes, i like this one also

  294.  #294Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 3:58 pm

    308 – that feels icky Azure Blu…I don’t like it when there is pressure for sex but not a lot of effort into romance or connection/fun – mmmmmm –

  295.  #295Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 4:04 pm

    Sopie and Azur blu I think i got it know:

    I missed the way how you used to make me feel special. When you call and text me and share with me that you are thinking of me I feel special.

    we haven’t done that much so there is not much to refer to with ‘when’

  296.  #296Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 4:08 pm

    Sophie yes it feels much better if there is more romance rather than sex…but I think some guys just push for it, esp. when there is a hot spark and the magnetism is mutual.
    I gave in, I am not regretting it as it was truly amazing. However there is always a risk on how it continues from there…

  297.  #297Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 4:13 pm

    Seqouia – 314 – yes! I like that and then ‘what do you think?” – it must be difficult in translation -other sirens have shared about that before

    And remember you don’t need him to make you feel special ‘YOU ARE THE PRIZE’ YOU ARE SPECIAL!!!!! That’s the vibe we all need to find in ourselves – I’ve had it sometimes and believe me everything (and everyone) shifts.How can you help yourself to feel that specialness with or without him?what a prize you are for ANY man! xx

  298.  #298Femininewoman on August 1, 2014 at 4:21 pm

    Marika lovely!!!

  299.  #299Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 4:24 pm

    Yes sex is a tricky one – to be honest though when I think about it the best boyfriend I ever had I was the one pushing for sex and he wanted us to wait and so we did…I like remembering him – he is my first hand experience of a good man – he did all the rowing the boat, all the romancing – everything, all the things Rori says they will – so I know it exists but it was a long time ago and he is majorly eclipsed by a multitude of toxic relationships – strange I let him through…

  300.  #300Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 4:26 pm

    yes Sophie! And truly its nobodies job and not his job to make me feel special…it would be feeding my addiction to feel special – the addiction my parents started of by giving me ‘love’ when they made me feel ‘special’. It has become a black whole that as I believe only truly divine love can fill.

  301.  #301Sophie on August 1, 2014 at 4:32 pm

    @ 319 Yes 🙂 looking for the validation of specialness outside ourselves as we would have done as children is handing our power over to others – we need them to feel special – whereas really we need to learn to feel our specialness regardless of what others are or are not doing xxx

  302.  #302Kim on August 1, 2014 at 5:07 pm

    Wow. Ugh. I was really unsireny. I felt really rejected.
    I had a text from SDT saying that he was really busy this weekend, well he has been really busy all week but still had time to visit friend and do videos…and if I wanted I could wach him ‘catch waves’ with friends presumably ‘loosely planned’ on Monday and Tuesday.
    I have work Monday and drywall fixers coming on Tuesday…
    So I just told him that and said I intended to have fun on the weekend, and he wrote back ‘K, enjoy’. As if he was pissed.
    I just felt so rejected and non-pursued and whatever else…and said he ‘saved me a lot of hassle by flaking out whe he realised he wasn’t going to get laid anymore’.
    I know.
    Not very sireny.
    But I am pissed. It sounded like I was getting an audience with the king, when it suiited him..and his friends.
    Like I am one of the serfs who should kiss his feet.
    Sure, busy all week and all weekend and when it suits him I can follow him and friends around.
    No thanks.
    Hell no.
    Sireny or not, I am not lowering myself to that.
    He can go and catch his waves with some other chick.

  303.  #303Dominique on August 1, 2014 at 5:19 pm

    Sequoia – These scripts all have the feeling of making him wrong which no one tends to respond to well. How about instead something like this –

    I feel so special when…..I love feeling special.

    ……makes me feel special. I LOVE feeling special.

    And see what he does with this.


  304.  #304Sequoia on August 1, 2014 at 5:38 pm

    Thank you Dominique for your feedback. I think I leave the feeling special message – it doesn’t really translate well into german, and the feeling special is also somehow burdened, at least in my mind at the moment.

    I’d rather use it feels so good when …

  305.  #305Kim on August 1, 2014 at 5:40 pm

    I was even more unsireny. Lol. SDT asked me how it is working out for me to be non-spontaneous and not accept last minute dates and I said it is working out great for me and that I had dates all week lol.
    He said ‘I knew that’
    My big mouth.
    Oh well.
    Another one bites the dust.

  306.  #306Kim on August 1, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    Sequoia, you’re a Jerry? Me too.
    Hence I do not gel well with south Florida flakiness 🙁

  307.  #307IamHis on August 1, 2014 at 7:48 pm

    I was feeling pretty down today. Lots of negativity swirling around in my head and my back hurt and my body felt sad. A sweet guy from Tinder insisted I meet him for lunch. I told him coffee would feel better for a first meeting. He agreed. It felt so good being with him! I felt safe, calm, & happy. (With R I felt terrified, nervous, unsure. ) He is tall, tan, good – looking & not from the states. I felt relieved that I could feel both attracted and safe @ the same time. That hardly ever happens for me! It felt good because we are in the same lifeboat (roommates getting married, slightly lonely, & not sure what step to take next.) He was still so positive & seemed really cool. We’re not a good match for dating because of differing religious beliefs, but I have found a new friend in him & that feels better than I thought it would! 🙂

  308.  #308prplpsn28 on August 1, 2014 at 11:55 pm

    Had a long talk with H tonight. Says he needs a break to clear his head. Was actually a pleasant talk. I don’t think he wants to completely let me go. Wants to keep in touch. But he said he also know that it’s not fare and selfish on his part to ask me to wait so we agreed that I would keep my options open and date others. Tho I really don’t want to.

    I did go out tonight with a girlfriend and had a good time. In between uncontrollable crying fits. How embarrassing. Ran into a guy friend who has been interested in me but new about H and I. Have plans to go to a boat show/festival with him tomorrow but not sure. I think it’s way too soon. And he’s 13 yrs older then me. I still feel like my heart is with H. I came home and cried so hard I could hardly breath and had an anxiety attach. I should have been coming home with H. It just doesn’t feel right. 🙁

  309.  #309Kim on August 2, 2014 at 4:56 am

    You’ll never believe what happened next.
    Wildchild said if I needed help he would move in and pay all my bills…uhmm..say what?
    We had four or five dates and he has been ever so busy….I thought he had flaked out. Turns out he was pissed at my CDing…because on the one day he had time, I was busy…lol.
    So what.
    Financially it would help me tremendously, I am having anterrible patch with losing jobs and having had a leak in my condo…but it is a studio…and I love my own space…and i don’t even have a relationship with this man!!!
    But if that isn’t stepping up, then I don’t know what is!!
    Stepping up to sort out his living with the ex situation, and my financial situation.
    It isn’t going to happen, I love and need my own space and hardly know him, but still….
    What does everybody else think?

  310.  #310Femininewoman on August 2, 2014 at 5:48 am

    Kim obviously Rori’s tools work. You have likely given him an impression that you are into him enough to work on a relationship with him. He might be only capable of being a serial monogamist which is good because it kind of suggests that he is not a player. As I am not into the moving in together thing I would prefer to know what he sees for us in the future. If he suggests marriage I’d want to know what his timeline is so I can share my own and what I need for a marriage to work. For all you know that might just scare him.

    What I am thinking is that you don’t want a savior or someone to pick up the slack for you. What you want is a lover and partner who wants to grow old with you even if everything in your life is crumbling. With a savior if there is nothing to save you from or help you with one of you might get bored and want to bail. For me saving someone from their own sh!it or helping them to sort out their life is not necessarily the ingredients to create a long term relationship.

    All said I would not dismiss him. It seems you need to get clear what it is you “need” to know someone to move forward with them. I believe this is his bid for exclusivity. Maybe that is how he ended up living with his ex? If he can pay all your bills why can’t he pay all his own in a different living situation?

    Why did you label him wild child anyway? Does he seem to be adventurous and willing to take risks?

  311.  #311Kim on August 2, 2014 at 6:12 am

    I had all these thoughts too, believe me, I am not naive…point is that the security would all be mine because if he did move in (which I am not planning on anyway…lol), everything is in my name and I could throw him out from one day to the next, if needs be with the in-house security. He has zero rights, and if he didn’t pay up, he would be out instantly.
    He knows that so he would be the one taking all the risks actually…
    Totally agree about the soft landing pad also, I told him that.
    He now pays almost the same for his own room in a large apartment, in a great location with pool etc. he would move into a tiny studio…so really, he hasn’t got a great deal to gain from this at all.
    If I was him, there is no way I would do that.
    He wasn’t really voicing bein pissed about the CDing, he just pulled back and sulked, men all act differently to that, some charge forward, some disappear…no man likes you dating others in my experience…by moving in he would put a stop to all that, the easy lazy way.
    I still have enough to survive for 2 months even without finding a job, not going to make rash decisions…first of all, he needs to start dating me, else someone else will snap me up lol.
    No worries…it would be the first time I would let a man take advantage of me…not going to happen at 40 when it didn’t happen at 25….
    He knows.

  312.  #312Kim on August 2, 2014 at 6:19 am

    FW I agree with all that.
    I labeled him wild child because he has lots of tattoos and smokes…lol..and I am a goody two shoes.
    I told him the reality that I really only want to live with a man with whom I have a commitment, engagement..and as i onky know him two months, this is obviously not on the table and not something I would want.
    I do not even know whether I want a relationship with this man, and he knows because he had assumed that we had a relationship until I said ‘not so fast’, and that I am dating others until I find my life partner.
    He is quiet, shy and a bit lazy. Honestly, I think this whole moving in is an attempt of his to
    a) step up without doing all the dating/courting
    b) satisfying my requirement of not entering a relationship until he moved out with the ex
    c) trying to help me out and also making sense for him financially
    So hence he called it a win-win…
    I am not going to have a man move into my private space until I know him and his intentions much better….

  313.  #313Violette on August 2, 2014 at 9:06 am

    I had sex with A on date two! I don’t even know if I feel sorry…the chemistry just felt so good and I so wanted to, but of course now I feel afraid of what happens next.

    The sex was so nice by the way. But he didn’t stay the night because he said he needed to get his contact lenses because they were disposables. I feel so close to judging him and being mad at him. I flip on that when sex comes into the picture, adoring and hating someone…

    He said let’s have brunch today and then go to his place and have more sex. Heh…I want to. I also don’t…I have some work to do, and I don’t want to see him every day and get in over my head.

    He didn’t call me though, he wrote me on POF this morning and said he is awaiting me for brunch. So…what, I’m supposed to call him? Brunch where, what time?

    I hate this part. The…explaining to a man that I prefer if he does all the calling, that I prefer a phone message to an online mail…

    And as far as not really knowing what I’m dealing with in terms of what he really wants with me, I’ve don’t it to myself because I don’t know the guy. But I’ve been craving good sex soooo badly lately. It feels unhealthy to go this long without it. So, I guess I’m not sorry. I just don’t want it to feel expensive to my emotionally, I want to keep a hold on myself.

    Ugh, I want to call him. I probably will. I feel disappointed with myself…mainly because I feel afraid of giving away my power to him.

  314.  #314Violette on August 2, 2014 at 9:11 am

    Then again sometimes I’m “too good.” I don’t take any chances, I play it so safe, and I end up going 6 months without sex! Because I want to wait to months, until a man takes me out of town on a romantic getaway, and this and that…it seems in a way I hurt myself with all my rules. I mean, thank goodness for them, because they keep me sane, but I don’t really feel it’s completely bad of me to call him, he did write me. It’s not my first choice, I prefer that he would call me, or just name a place last night when he left! At any rate it will be a chance for me to express that I prefer speaking on the phone to online.

    Ugh, I wish I felt more together around sex…I am doing my best here. To take care of myself in whatever way makes sense to me.

  315.  #315Violette on August 2, 2014 at 9:16 am

    I feel frightened of the men on POF who get angry and mean when I don’t write them back quickly.

  316.  #316Violette on August 2, 2014 at 9:18 am

    Alright, so instead I just answered him on POF. I just said ok to brunch where? I don’t know…it felt easier.

  317.  #317Violette on August 2, 2014 at 9:48 am

    Oh shoot, now I feel angry I haven’t heard back from him. Ahhh! I want out of this head space!

  318.  #318Violette on August 2, 2014 at 10:33 am

    I can’t believe it, he’s really not replying. He really just had sex with me and then invited me to brunch and is blowing off. I feel so rejected. Feels so painful.

  319.  #319Indigo on August 2, 2014 at 10:53 am

    Azure Blu 277,

    Thank you so much for the hugs, healing vibrations and cookies xx

  320.  #320Indigo on August 2, 2014 at 11:22 am

    Sophie 289,

    Thanks for the hugs sweetie. I did do my plan, though my bath turned out to be lukewarm (yuck!) and the romantic comedy we watched turned out to be very not what I had in mind. Oh well.

    I had a good sleep and then up early for the hike this morning. It did me the world of good, though I had to just go through it in order to see that. My body feels extremely pleasantly tired, so it’s hot chocolate and apple pie, and bed.

    In terms of my feelings, I have been turning a concept today over in my mind: How do you love yourself and pretend everything’s ok when it’s not ok? When things aren’t going quite as you’d like them to, when your life isn’t quite where you’d like it to be, how do you pretend that it’s actually all ok? I want to be ok and happy, whatever happens, but sometimes that is a hard concept to integrate. Sometimes things don’t really feel ok at all, and then I find it hard to love myself, and even harder to love “what is”.

  321.  #321Violette on August 2, 2014 at 11:27 am

    I feel so pissed, I never want to speak to him again. At the same time, I want to call him, and make sure this is really happening, that he really means it, because…I still can’t believe it!

  322.  #322Indigo on August 2, 2014 at 11:30 am


    I’m so thrilled for you. It feels so good for me to read how you are involved with a guy who is besotted with you. I feel like a friend cheering you on from the sidelines, and I just feel very glad for you.


  323.  #323Indigo on August 2, 2014 at 12:05 pm


    Your offer from Wildchild makes me think of Rori’s “settling in” concept, ie. making a man comfortable in your home… kind of skipping straight ahead to cosy couple. It sounds good in theory, but I am wary of it. To me it bypasses several crucial steps, to do with healing and developing trust and communication and building romance.

    That said, I think the fact that he has offered is a good sign. It means he is obviously invested a lot more than you maybe previously thought. And that is a good position to be in.

  324.  #324Violette on August 2, 2014 at 12:05 pm

    He just replied, said he was still in bed and invited me to join him. I feel so disappointed and grossed out. I want to reply something honest…like it feels good to hear from you but I feel mixed feelings, since I understood you’d invited me to brunch and didn’t hear from you all morning.

  325.  #325Indigo on August 2, 2014 at 12:12 pm


    “as far as not really knowing what I’m dealing with in terms of what he really wants with me, I’ve don’t it to myself because I don’t know the guy. But I’ve been craving good sex soooo badly lately. It feels unhealthy to go this long without it. So, I guess I’m not sorry. I just don’t want it to feel expensive to my emotionally”

    There is nothing wrong with craving good sex, and then giving it to yourself when you haven’t had sex in a while and you’ve been missing it, but it DOES come with a price tag.

    The reality is, you need to know what you’re signing up for when you have sex with a guy on the second date, ie. someone you don’t know very well. You need to prepare yourself emotionally beforehand for the possibility of exactly what’s happening now – that you might get anxious and angry and feel used, that he may or may not get in touch again, that he may take longer than you’d like to contact you etc. etc. It is no good pretending that just because you want him to treat you a certain way afterwards, that he will.

  326.  #326Violette on August 2, 2014 at 12:18 pm

    I just replied that I feel surprised and confused.

  327.  #327Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 12:24 pm

    Indigo #341
    more HUGS for YOU!!
    I don’t know if this will help…

    Rori Says:
    “A Tool For Self Acceptance
    To help yourself treasure yourself EXACTLY THE WAY YOU ARE RIGHT NOW – even though you’ll ALWAYS want to learn new things, explore new ways of behaving, speaking and just BEING – try this (read how, first, and then stop reading for a moment and try it):
    1. Look away from your computer screen for a moment.

Look at a bookcase, or a pile of papers, or a book, or the phone, or a picture on the wall. It can be a pretty thing, an ugly, practical thing, or something in-between.

Look at it. Really, really look at it.
    2. Look at the colors.

See that there are more than one color – even if it’s red or blue – there are many shades of red and blue in the color you see.

Look to see if light is shining on or bouncing off the object. Maybe there’s a sparkle of light on one side, and nothing on the other.
    3. Look at the texture.

Feel it. See if it feels bumpy or smooth or rough or soft. Now check in with your body. Do you feel anything, just from looking at this simple object? Do you feel judgmental?

Like – is it an ugly object, or old, or worn? Does it make your mind go off in a million directions about all the things you have to do?
    4. Gently bring yourself back to the simplicity of looking at the object and feeling it, and then bring your attention back to your body and how you’re feeling.
    5. Put a name to the feeling.

It could be sad, like a sad memory, it could be happy, because you love that object, it could be bored because you want to get back to this letter.
    6. Now tune into how relaxed or tense you are.

Now absolutely, completely ACCEPT whatever you’re feeling. Absolutely ACCEPT the object EXACTLY AS IT IS. Absolutely ACCEPT yourself, in this one moment, exactly how you are, just like the object.
    Now come on back to this eLetter.
    Why This Works To Help You Be Vulnerable… And Irresistible
    What you’ve just done is one step, one small but powerful step to Loving Yourself, that will steadily undo all that self-hatred like Tammy is throwing at herself.
    And this is just the beginning, because what you’ve done, really and truly, is BE VULNERABLE.
    That’s right. That’s all Vulnerability is – accepting yourself in this one moment, and then letting everyone around you – even that man you really care for – see you EXACTLY as you are.
    Just the way you really, really looked at and ACCEPTED the object you worked with exactly as IT was.
    Vulnerability is not necessarily revealing personal things about yourself.
    And, the greatest thing about doing this very small but powerful thing is that it looks exactly the opposite of how we’ve all been taught to think it looks.
    It doesn’t look timid or doormat-y. It looks like self-esteem and confidence.
    And all you did was look at what was right in front of you, experience it, then accept your most basic feelings of happiness or sadness, without FEELING YOU HAVE TO DO ANYTHING.

  328.  #328Kim on August 2, 2014 at 12:28 pm

    344 Indigo thank you.
    I feel much like you.
    He would help me out of a pickle, but then I have this guy in my studio (!) that I don’t really know.
    I love courting and dating and he wants to bypass all that because he is lazy and also, he thinks if he moves in I have no chance of seeing anyone else anymore lol.
    I don’t know.
    The weird thing is he doesn’t really come towards me much, so I figured he had lost interest…lol.
    If it was to happen, and I don’t think I want it, but if it was, it would be a massive experiment.
    He is very cheerful about it.
    He seems to have already thought about all the ifs and buts and solutions, which had me floored. I don’t think this was planted in his head yesterday….
    I feel a little amused.

  329.  #329Violette on August 2, 2014 at 12:29 pm

    Indigo that’s all great if I had sat down and planned it out…I went with it in the moment, and I don’t know that I expected anything from him but the truth. I was very clear I wasn’t up for casual sex, and he said he was open to something more. Asking me out to brunch and not contacting me until the afternoon feels extreme to me. I can’t turn back time and mentally prepare myself, all I can do now is be honest and clear with him, and…take care of myself. I don’t really feel I’m being unreasonable. Maybe I am, I just don’t feel it…

  330.  #330Violette on August 2, 2014 at 12:35 pm

    He asked why I was confused. I replied that I have enjoyed the time we have spent together so far, and I have mixed feeling because I understood he’d asked me to brunch and I didn’t hear form him earlier and it made me sad, because I’d wanted to do it. That I felt funny and I didn’t want to feel that way with him, that I didn’t know what to do.

  331.  #331Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 12:51 pm

    Darling Sirens…
    I went to one of my Favorite parks this morning…
    Favorite because the silence is deafening…
    I love that sound… “no sound”
    except the humming of the bees, birds and the corn russling in the breeze when it blows gently…
    Ahhh I regenerated MY soul…
    Thank you Mother (nature)

    Soo I met Spiritcd downtown last night and we had such a good time as usual…
    I live in a Big Ten college town and we are having an international soccer game today… lots of folks and bands downtown and main street closed off last night…very fun

    I was watching myself as I got tense, and started putting up my brick wall – because of course there is the possibility of more Emotional Intimacy!!!
    Sooo I reminded ME to open my heart…
    and just be…
    that did help some… but my words started getting to be off putting and a little critisizing and belitteling
    which I am reconginzing is my way of shutting down ANY emotional closeness especially with men…

    I wore a dress last night because he had ask me off and on “Ohhh, i’d LOVE to see you in a dress”
    He asked me if I had worn the dress for him…

    and I LIED and said I already had it on!!! :-/

    I did the same thing the night before when he asked if I wore the T’s baseball shirt for him….
    I LIED and said I already had it on!! WHAT??!!
    Such amazing opportunities to be vulnerable and soft But I got SOOO FRIGHTENED SOOO afraid to show authentic me, vulnerable me…
    These are SUCH good lessons for me to see!!

    Sooo i started thinking…
    when I talk to Spiritcd, I want to bring up what felt good about the last time we spent together…

    We talked this afternoon… he ended up having to work and was telling me about a lady who fell off a zip line and destroyed her elbow and arm (he sells replacement join parts and assists Dr. in surgery)

    and I did GOOD!!! :->
    I said it felt soo good to meet him down town and dance..
    I felt sooo warm and close when he had his arms around me when we were listening to the band…
    He said he felt really special too!!!
    Ahhh… breaking down those walls brick by brick…
    Yay ME!!

  332.  #332Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 1:00 pm

    Also what I notice about ME when the man starts moving the relationship forward…
    I begin ONLY focusing on anything negative…
    So today I started thinking of alll the good things about Spiritcd
    I want to get better at being Soft on the outside as my cds move the relationship forward…

    I’m really curious to watch ME as I say these snarky, off putting, disrespectful comments to the men who are trying to get close to me.

    WOW… this is a really BIG breakthrough to notice …AND now I can start to change it!!!

  333.  #333Kim on August 2, 2014 at 1:09 pm

    Azure Blu what you write there really resonates with me.
    One time, I had a discussion with my oldest gf from home and she said, ‘do you remember when you were only 15 you told me never to show your feelings and never give anything away so the boys don’t know that you like them?’
    I was totally gobsmacked.
    I remember my mother told me to behave like that, keeping feelings inside and never show how you really feel as she perceived it as weakness.
    That dress and T-shirt story totally resonates therefore.
    It is not easy trying to unlearn all we have learnt.
    You’re doins so fabulously!!
    I, too, focus on the negative when things turn real, this is self protection I believe. Worst case scenario.

  334.  #334Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:09 pm

    Azure Blue I relate and I love to hear about how you are working to improve intimacy in your life. Thanks for writing that. I just totally relate….

    A wrote me back that it was his fault, he went to bed late and woke up late. I replied ok, then he wrote back so what do you want to do? I replied I don’t know, what do you think?

    It feels really hard to stay open right now. He didn’t exactly apologize, but he took responsibility. But, it wasn’t oh I’m sorry how can I make it up to you? It feels like such a fizzle.

  335.  #335Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    He wrote back that he’s probably going to stay home today, I should join him. I asked him to call me. I can’t have this conversation online. I feel really sad and turned off. I just want to tell him that I prefer not to shack up at each others house right in the beginning.

    If he doesn’t want to speak on the phone, well at least I’ve put myself out there, I don’t feel the communication is the same in a dating message site.

    I have a feeling this is a no go. He’s being grose. I feel sad about it. But…one more experience won’t hurt me. I’m sure I’ve learned something here….

  336.  #336Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 1:16 pm

    Thank you for the words of encouragement!!

    You are being a Siren,,,
    I love the feeling message you wrote him…
    My thoughts are he has responded quite well…

    Maybe you could think of all the good things you liked about the 2 dates…
    Wait and see what he respondes to your question and then open your heart and practice being soft on he outside!!!
    This is good practice being vulnerable!!!

  337.  #337Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 1:18 pm

    Mmmm… Viollette #356 ,
    Yeah.. I see your point…now that you heard his answer
    This is just me
    But I would need more together out of the bed time to cuddle up with him today…

  338.  #338Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:19 pm

    Kind of feeling again like I may never have sex again. Like I’m cursed in sex. Like in order to build any intimacy with a guy I have to wait a ton of time, and maybe he’ll go away, and most of the ones who have any talent in bed will go away….it makes me sad. I don’t think my standards are that high, but maybe they are. But he went straight from having sex too turning from a guy who seemed like a possible boyfriend to a creep!

    Ahh!! Triggered and burned out!!

  339.  #339Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:24 pm

    Azure Blue, thank you for hearing my post. I just feel really sad and like a little girl and I want to cry. I want a man to hold me care for me and tread me like I’m special, and never make me wonder. He’s not calling me. I hate him a little right now. I hate how men assume women are crazy all the time. He had really struck me as the type who could handle communication. I just want to turn off all my desire for love. Who needs it!

  340.  #340Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 1:25 pm

    Kim #354
    Thanks dalin’ Siren!!
    Interesting that you feel the same when cds start to ask for more emotional intimacy…
    Yeah, my mom was all about NOT sharing emotions with anyone,
    Hard habit to break!! We CAN do it!!! :>)

  341.  #341Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 1:32 pm

    Hugs for you Darling Siren!!
    Rori says there are NO mistakes!!
    just practice…
    This is just me…
    But I have found that although men push really hard for sex… they appreciate when a woman puts the breaks on… and if they go away while you try and see what’s a good time for you to have sex…
    at least the emotional impact is less.

    And don’t get me wrong… I have had sex quickly but the emotional tole and what i ended up expecting never really worked out for me…EVER!!

  342.  #342Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:48 pm

    Thanks again for your comment Azure Blue. I feel inspired to share intimacy, to share it with the men who are actually showing up. Yeah, I agree that I have regrets about sleeping with men in my past too soon…I have gotten away with it before though. But I guess it’s a matter of faith, believing I won’t actually be without good sex FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE. It frightens me when the months start to add up. And I wish I could not put so much on it! I do wish that about myself. On some level it does feel like a weakness that I get so attached after sex, like an alcoholic who feels stupid they can’t have one little drink without going berserk.

    Ugh! I’m just really frustrated over this, and really need to find my serenity.

    A did call. I was able to tell him on the phone that I prefered to do things in public rather than get into hanging out at each others places in the beginning. He said that was fine and asked me out for Monday. I should be happy but now I’m still miffed he never actually apologized about blowing me off today! I am really proud of myself though that I was straight with him about it. I mean there was time when I would have smiled and said it was fine and nicely gone over to his place and had sex all day and night and buried myself really. So it is good that I told him I felt bad about what had happened.

    He also said we could call each other about the plan for Mon, and I asked him if he’d be up for just calling me. He said yes. God, for women like me, many of the women on this blog, I really do feel like a foreign animal to many many men, they want me to call them, and “hang out” and all that.

    At this point, to relate to your post again Azure Blue, I do regret having sex so soon, because now I like him even though I also hate him (because I like him) and I do want to build intimacy with him or practice doing that, and be open to relationship with him, and it’s going to be really hard with me “wanting what I want”, i.e. him to be a gentleman and now how to do that for me and give me great sex and marry and make me a princess.

    Boy, this experience really is opening up some things about myself to heal. Thank you Azure Blue for the reminder to treat it as practice, and that there are no mistakes.

    Kim I am thinking of your posts right now and admiring the easy lightness you have seemed to maintain with your CD’s, and wanting to go there myself. I sometimes find there is a fine line though between keeping it light and free and fun, and going for the intimacy. At leas that has been a bit of a struggle for me lately. Not getting hung up, but still being vulnerable and open.

  343.  #343Violette on August 2, 2014 at 1:50 pm

    Hah, I just wrote the longest post in the world! I really need a real girl to talk to…maybe a therapist. Or just a real friend, but right now I am feeling really greatful for the presence of the virtual friends on this blog, thank you everyone who is here to support each other, and to get something better out of life, and to get better at loving ourselves.

  344.  #344Femininewoman on August 2, 2014 at 3:16 pm


  345.  #345Sequoia on August 2, 2014 at 3:26 pm

    Violette I can so relate to your posts. I also had sex with my DC on the 2nd date, well it was really our proper 1st date but we had met twice before. And it was the best sex I ever had…after 1 year of holding back, and I did had opportunities during that time , but with those man I felt I had to wait. With him I just didn’t want to stop myself as it just felt so good even so in the beginning I told him that I do not want to go there.

    The tricky thing now, which I can also hear you are expressing, is to move it also out of the bedroom. I also want to go on dates with him and not just end up straight in bed with him.

    And I also told him that if he just wants sex I can’t continue. He said he is open for more, but he seems to be bothered that I am dating other men.

    We have a date tomorrow, that he arranged already on monday but I haven’t heard from him since tuesday and I feel very insecure about the whole thing as he used to text me much more in the first weeks.
    I am proud of myself that I haven’t reached out to him so and I want to trust that he is coming through – I do somehow trust him, he has sthg trustworthy about him.
    He has been very bussy with work lately and told me that he has more time from sunday onwards so lets see.
    What I get from him so is that me CDing really bothers him and I am planning to find out when we meet if my assumption is valid.

    I have spoken to a coach today, who I met spontaneously today ( who wants to date me if I am letting go of this CD lol) reg. the sex thing and he said for a man time with sex doesn’t really matter…if the sex was good and it unfolds harmoniously it doesn’t matter if its the 1st date or the 15 date.
    If the sex isn’t good he dissapears after the 1st or after the 15th date.
    Obviously this is not to say to have sex early but if it happens, if I am flowing with what is happening and allowing myself to have sex because being in the moment with it feels so good and I do want to with no agenda attached to it, it can turn out to grow into more.
    Its important so to not get blinded and to hooked by the chemistry, to stay cool and really find out if the man is a match on the emotional, mental and spiritual level – if he is well its kind of lucky I guess.

  346.  #346Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 3:26 pm

    Violette #363…
    Wow… you are doing sooo good…
    So interesting to read how you handled things in the past!!! Like me…
    and now we are Sirens in process!!!

    Yay for sharing your feelings with your cd!!
    what a pleasant surprise that he asked you out on a real date…
    and you asked him to call you “is that ok”?
    I’m loving alll of this!!!

  347.  #347Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 3:34 pm

    Violette #364…
    I have a group of really great gf and I feel sooo lucky to know them!!
    BUT they don’t understand the RR way and sooo…

    I feel sooo happy to be able to have this blog to help process my wonderful (and sometimes scary) journey that I am going through and to read about everyone elses journeys…
    I feel amazed at what a support this blog really is for me!!
    Thank you ALL
    you wonderful Sirens!!!

  348.  #348Labbit on August 2, 2014 at 4:00 pm

    Sequoia 287 — Oh I had all kinds of expectations the first time around dating TenderCD! I expected him to call or text everyday, I expected that I would see him every weekend and maybe more during the week, I expected that he was the one I was going to marry and that he’d sweep me off my feet. And also I expected him to be the best traits from all my ex-boyfriends combined. The thing is I didn’t even REALIZE I was expecting all of these things. In my mind, everything I’ve listed above was what my mind saw as “treating me well.” No wonder every guy fell short!

    The biggest issue was that I didn’t love or trust myself, and that led to being suspicious of his every move. I made it up to him to make me feel good about myself. So if he didn’t respond to a text within 24 hours, or if he had plans on the weekend and couldn’t see me, my mind jumped to him seeing someone else or not liking me enough. I put a ton of pressure ON BOTH OF US without meaning to. I decided he was the one I wanted without really getting to know him at all, and I held him up to an impossible standard. I know now that it’s not his job to make me feel good about myself — that’s up to me. I fill my life up with people and things I love to do, I stay on my bridge heading towards my dream, and if he’s the right guy for me he gets in front of me and leads me up the bridge to happily ever after. 🙂

    These days I’m feeling more love for myself and more compassion for myself too. And I’ve found that’s spread to everyone in my life — because I feel good it’s much easier to trust myself, and then also easier to trust everyone else. It’s like Rori says: Stop beating yourself up!! That was the first step and the key for me. It’s hard! I still have days where I feel miserable and I feel wrong. But more often I feel good. Once I started supporting myself, it was easy to go on dates with men of all kinds and start just noticing how I was with them. I noticed how I felt with guys I was attracted to, guys I was not attracted to, guys I considered out of my league and guys that I felt I was out of their league. If you don’t punish yourself for what you see, you start to gain confidence. At least I did.

    Before I had rules about how men could show affection. If they did ANYTHING outside those rules I couldn’t see it as affection. This time around, I see all the ways TenderCD shows and tells me he cares. The thing is he did these things last time too but they didn’t look like affection to me! I have a trust deep inside of me now — trust in myself first that I’m in a situation that’s good for me and if it’s no longer good I can leave the dating situation. Then trust in him, that he cares about me and wants to make me happy. Then I have a trust in us, together, as a team. That even when we make mistakes or say the wrong things it’s still done from a position of caring.

    For me, it all starts with trust in yourself, love and compassion for yourself. Stop beating yourself up and everything grows from there.

  349.  #349Labbit on August 2, 2014 at 4:03 pm

    Also, I still get triggered constantly. I am not by any means “fixed” nor was I “broken” before. It’s all part of the journey to me now and it’s fun! Being vulnerable, really opening myself up to a man has felt scary every single time until I actually do it. Before I open myself up, when I’m thinking about, that’s when I panic or feel fear. If I push ahead and open myself up anyway in a situation where I feel deep down in my gut or heart that I’m safe, the rewards far outweigh the risks.

  350.  #350Azure Blu on August 2, 2014 at 5:19 pm

    Wow Labbitt this is soooo Beautiful!!!

    and Rori says///
    “know that the more you heal YOU, the more you keep your focus on you, taking exquisite care of you in all ways, not worrying about what he’s thinking, doing, saying, the more you can keep your heart open and vulnerable, no matter how you feel, no matter what he does or doesn’t do, the better you will feel AND the safer he will feel with you, making him feel loved and accepted. AND the better chance you have of having the relationship you want.”

  351.  #351IamHis on August 2, 2014 at 5:51 pm

    K is texting me! Crap, I think I like him.

  352.  #352IamHis on August 2, 2014 at 7:54 pm

    He apologized if he came on too strong. I said, No, I like it. We texted some more and he wants to go to the beach with me to watch the sunset on some weeknight so it won’t be too crowded. He isn’t being creepy, he’s being considerate because I told him I hate the beach when it’s crowded but love it when it’s not. I feel excited and nervous and scared. I feel safe with him, but going to the beach feels kind of romantic. I don’t know if I’m ready for romantic? Maybe another date close by where we can just talk and get to know each other more would feel better. Beach is about an hour away and feels so intimate.

  353.  #353Millie on August 2, 2014 at 9:21 pm

    I haven’t been following everyone’s comments…but I just want to spurt..that the ex that was texting me constantly is engaged. I just saw it on her facebook. Confirmed. I asserted myself the other day to him, speaking the truth, and he never responsed. Ok, i just feel bad for her that is engaged to a man texting his ex and also sending her photos of his… You know what. I find it strange he didn’t tell me, but of course he’s been dishonest before, why wouldn’t he now. It doesn’t matter…. Honestly it doesn’t, I just find the whole thing curious, but I’m ready to let go of that curiosity now.

  354.  #354Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 12:42 am


    That is so great that you are aware that this experience is bringing up things inside to heal. That in itself is you doing really fantastically!!

  355.  #355Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 12:48 am

    Awww Azure Blu 348,

    Thank you!!! I found this piece on acceptance and vulnerability really useful… and soothing. Thank you x

    I have two main flaws (faults/imperfections/growth areas? what is a good word?) – the one is impatience. The other is a tendency to judge people or objects as being wanting, of seeing the ways they can be improved upon. I know this is really a reflection of the difficulty I sometimes have in accepting myself. That wherever I am, even though it may not look “perfect” to me now, or not where I’d ideally want to be, that it’s really ok. Practicing acceptance can feel hard for me, but I really like the thought of doing so. So this is something for me to go on with.

  356.  #356Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 12:57 am

    Regarding having sex early on:

    I think if it’s an in-the-moment thing that feels right, that it doesn’t necessarily have to affect the flow of the relationship forward.

    But I think what’s key is you have to have a lot of self-awareness around this. I think you have to know what tend to be your patterns around having sex with a man. Some women can handle their emotions quite well around having sex with a man they don’t know very well – they are able to maintain a certain level of coolness and patience. But many of us will start attaching all kinds of expectations to the event, we may start judging ourselves and him, it may bring up feelings of anxiety and neediness. I know for me, it can often bring up the thought of “If he would only just _______ it would be ok.” It can be a great opportunity in many ways, but I think the waters can feel a bit murky, and so I think it’s good to know yourself and how you tend to feel and react *before* you go through with it, so you can be better equipped to look after yourself afterwards.

  357.  #357Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 12:58 am

    I think in many ways it’s similar to how you feel when you lean forward with a man – if you can be completely in the moment, without expectations, and are just expressing your feelings cleanly and clearly, without an agenda, it tends to work out much better.

  358.  #358Millie on August 3, 2014 at 1:17 am

    Tonight, I feel like crashing onto the floor, sinking into it, and never getting up. I’ve been feeling so happy and full of life lately, but….one thing I dislike about myself is how much I feel things. My ex is getting married. He text me all this crap about he cares and loves my company blah blah blah, all the while he’s engaged! That makes me upset! I feel angry! What a jerk! He was/has been completely dishonest with me always. It’s such a horrible feeling to feel lied to and deceived. He was playing games with me this entire time. There was nothing special between us, at the end of the day, I’m a game. Then, Mechanic was at this function tonight. And I WISH, oh how I WISH, I didn’t care what he does or who he talks to, but I DO. My skin crawls when he flirts with another woman in front of me, how he would rather stay than be with me, I feel invisible and unimportant. And feeling this, I am angry with myself for having feelings for him! How can I “like” someone who makes me feel disregarded?!! Ugh, it’s really painful. He hasn’t done anything wrong, so I can’t say anything to him about it, but the immensity of what I feel is out of control. I want it to go away! I think the only solution is to avoid him at all costs. I need to not go to an event if I know he’s coming. This whole thing is triggering how I feel about my ex, that I have no special relationship with Mechanic either. That he is/will be dishonest with me, that I will always be someone to be toyed with. Oh my….I just feel like all these feelings are swirling inside me with nowhere to go. I can’t lash out at either of them! I’m sick of feeling this way. I’m sick of it. I feel like I’m not good enough. As I am, nothing I do or don’t do, wear, say, express, don’t express, nothing i do is enough. Like I’m invisible. It doesn’t matter if I’m there or not, that I exist or don’t. So much pain right now. I’m trying to remember my euphoric moments, the moment I met J, riding a horse, dancing……it’s just so hard. I’m always going to be alone and sad. 🙁

  359.  #359Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 2:57 am


    My ex-husband texts me all the time too – nearly every day actually. I don’t think he means anything by it, in fact I often consult him about the guys I am dating and get his input, but yet he doesn’t want his wife to know that he is communicating with me, and sometimes he says something flirty or appreciative to me which suggests that the feelings are not quite dead. In the beginning it used to confuse and trigger me – and in fact we went a year without any contact whatsoever – but I think he is just one of those men who kind of needs the attention, even though he is monogamous, and as my feelings for him have faded over the years, so I have been able to just let it roll off my back. If I don’t feel like speaking to him, I just log off, no explanation.

    My point is, if your ex is still triggering you like this, perhaps there are some residual feelings still, and getting a bit of distance till you have a handle on them would be a good thing. For me, I’m at the point where my ex-husband doesn’t trigger me at all, I can just accept the friendly attention as a compliment, knowing it means nothing.

  360.  #360Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 4:50 am

    Azure Blu – 274 – Thank you so much for sharing this with me. I do appreciate that you recognized (and honoured) your need for her love and attention when you were against her beliefs and explaining yours. This is such a lesson for me about radical acceptance in the context which you explain: letting the other be who they are.

    Oh but the softness – that is beautiful Azure Blu! I take it that your soft loving interest in her was a result of the acceptance of her (and your needs)?

    I am really triggered by this:
    “NOT until I mended some of my first family relationships could I ever hope to have a loving relationship with a man…” I need to mull over this carefully – at what point is it vital to give up hope for a relationship operating from a point of non-acceptance?

    I feel soft joy for you that you and your mom can now be a source of love and support for each other.

  361.  #361Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 4:57 am

    Indigo – 286 – I like what you said here.

  362.  #362Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 4:58 am

    Sophie – 289 – Having to be ‘on watch’ when something nice happens – wow, I can relate to that and yeah, I feel sadness around the amount of time I spent being ‘on watch’. You sound much better.

    297 –
    I do feel afraid of this intimacy because it so unlike what I know. I do want to run away but the love (mine, or what’s trying to grow between us, I’m not sure) makes it easier to deal with. FunnyCD is also very open which helps me to not slip into imaginary land – my imagination is very busy sometimes and especially when I’m out of my comfort zone. Xx

  363.  #363Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 5:00 am

    Azure Blu – 299 – Oh your energy – how it makes me smile! Your words reminded me to leave that space open for whatever this is, to hold my space and to leave him space to be/do what he needs to be/do. Thank you! Xx

  364.  #364Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 5:04 am

    Marika – 306 – The way you describe enjoying that 4am text – so tender, beautiful.

  365.  #365Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 5:09 am

    ((((((Sequoia))))))) – 320

  366.  #366Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 5:13 am

    Indigo –
    341 – great questions!

    343 – I feel touched by your feeling good for me – that analogy of being like a friend cheering from the sidelines is quite precious to me – thank you so much. (((such warmth in my chest from your comment xx))))

  367.  #367Kim on August 3, 2014 at 9:38 am

    MarikaB coach? I don’t have a coach…
    Maybe that was not for me?

    Well…news news. I was invited by wildchild’s friends for happy hour yesterday. They did not invite him…lmao…the guy is his best friend, but the girl had arranged it and they just forgot to invite him, he said to me he was busy (work).

    So he texted me…and I said I was out with his friends..he was shocked and said ‘they invited you and not me?’. LOL.
    In the end he was telling me how much he misses me and cuddling etc. too funny.
    So the girl told me he already mentioned 4 weeks after us meeting that he can see living with me in his future and she practically told him to get a grip…lol.
    She also told me he is financially quite stable, would definitely not mess me about and although she wouldn’t want to date him (haha), he is a good man and if I needed help with bills I should just go for it.

    I am with an older CD right now (MoM, the stable guy). He took me for dinner and movies and it was nice…

    Rocking two lovers haha.
    Though one at a time as the other is sooo slow…haven’t seen wildchild for over a week…

  368.  #368Violette on August 3, 2014 at 10:41 am

    Thank you for the supportive comments. Sequoia I feel calmer know I’m not the only person in the world who has slept with a guy on the second date. I still don’t regret it.

    But I do feel turned off by the way he behaved after. Marika I hear you that you think I should just walk away. But I don’t want to. I agree he behaved badly, and it wasn’t cool, but I don’t feel ready to write him off completely yet. Of course at this point it’s more about practicing, researching myself…I guess I’m willing to give him a second chance. I don’t want to overthink it.

    I replied to 2 other men on POF who asked me out right away without having long conversations, I love that. I’d much rather meet, then ask each other all about each other.

    More than anything…I have a lot of healing to do with my views of myself. I am working too hard doing jobs on the side, my main career is left undealt with, it feels like…I’m not myself, and even with all the work I feel like I’m scraping by. I don’t want a romantic partner to know this about me, to see me this way. I want to be seen as the person I know I really am. I need to take the time to get my mind right. Maybe then I’ll attract a man who loves me as much as I do.

  369.  #369Dominique on August 3, 2014 at 10:57 am

    Veronica – I don’t think the relationships with our primary caregivers need to be healed (whatever this really means) before being able to have a healthy, happy relationship with a man. Sometimes it just isn’t possible. Sometimes having an understanding about them in relation to you is what’s needed all that is possible.

    The primary relationship is your life is you, and in this context, I think this may help.


  370.  #370Dominique on August 3, 2014 at 10:58 am

  371.  #371Tanea on August 3, 2014 at 11:45 am


    What do you feel about a 46solution year old dating/marrying a 29man year old?

  372.  #372Tanea on August 3, 2014 at 11:48 am

    sorry phone is acting up! But what do you feel about a 46 year old woman dating/marrying a 29 year old guy?

  373.  #373Millie on August 3, 2014 at 11:49 am


    Thank you for your response and sharing your experience with your ex-husband. In my case, I know it may appear I still have feelings for him, but I don’t. I do have a problem with him saying some of the things he has been saying though. A few weeks ago he sent me a pic of his dick. While I was open to having a friendship, I’m not sure he can depart from the sexualness we used to have. I’m not on that page anymore, so it doesn’t feel good to receive. I don’t feel as though his words are kind and appreciative. I feel that he wants something from me, which also does not feel good. I don’t support a man who is engaged, “dipping” on the side. I also don’t support him saying we will always be friends, and yet completely not being a friend. It’s fake. The dishonesty of it all, is bothersome and I don’t want to be a part of it. So, it isn’t that I have feelings for him, it’s that I have feelings around what he is saying to me and what his actions are. I do agree that if I feel this triggered, there is more to it, but I do not think “my feelings for him” is what is underlying here.

  374.  #374Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 11:55 am


    Personally, I try not to judge. Would I want to date someone 17 years younger or older than me? Absolutely not. But I believe love can and does cross all kinds of boundaries.

    Is this your ex you are talking about?

  375.  #375Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 12:01 pm


    By “feelings for him” I didn’t mean that you necessarily still love him… just perhaps that your feelings about the relationship may not be completely resolved, ie. maybe there is still some residual anger or something else… you would know best. If you felt neutral towards him, he wouldn’t trigger you.

    I had to smile because my ex-husband also used to try to make our conversations sexual, still does. And I have got completely comfortable saying “I don’t want to talk about that” or “I don’t feel comfortable sharing such intimate details” and just logging off if need be. I agree your ex sending you that picture was totally inappropriate, and depending whether I wanted to possibly continue communicating with him, I would share that it was not ok in no uncertain terms. I have done that… said firmly please do not send me pictures like that. And he does respect my wishes now.

  376.  #376Linda on August 3, 2014 at 12:42 pm

    374 & 379 Millie

    Your posts are raw and open and your “ex” certainly has triggered you. When I read your posts I felt “wow he is texting her and engaged”? I am not you or emotionally involved so my mind went to his “Fiance”! I feel really bad for her and my protective warning side says. Warn her that he is not into her. He does sound dishonest , confused… or something !. Nothing I would be hitching up with.

    You are not the only one his is being dishonest with. I would be running not walking to the nearest exit.

    As far as having feelings for Mechanic, which I know you have shared here. Embracing them in the reality of what is real and not hoped for or imaginary feels a self loving gift to give yourself.

    You most certainly can meet yourself honestly in any moment and just throw your arms around yourself there. Paint yourself with love there and see how you feel in a bit.


  377.  #377Linda on August 3, 2014 at 12:53 pm

    Labbit @ 369

    I find the things you are sharing about the expectations that you had before with TenderCD healing to me. I know I have shared this before but in my last relationship I was the one that was saturated with his expectations. He expected of me…almost to a tee the things you shared you were.

    Oddly I feel validated from the opposite side of the coin.

  378.  #378Linda on August 3, 2014 at 1:19 pm

    I have had a busy week end. Triggering to say the least.

    My youngest grandson turned 1 yesterday. I attended a small family lunch to celebrate. Then the evening was to dinner to celebrate my youngest daughters 25th birthday. (yes they share the same day now) 🙂

    My son in law came to dinner and was sullen and quiet. He has a long history of acting moody, pouty about things. It used to affect me terribly and I would try to “fix” it. That was years ago I might add. Having lived with that for the last 15 years all thru my daughters dating him and now marriage (which I strongly urged her to consider a deal breaker MANY times)….I have absolutely NO tolerance for it from him. O M Gosh grow up!

    YES !!! this is all reminiscent of how P would treat me at times last year. I have no tolerance. NONE

    I am angry about it today. I feel disgust and no respect for my son-in-law’s behavior and his selfishness. I am so so glad I am not trying to put up with that sh!t with P anymore.

    My life may not be where I want it but at least I am not dealing with trying to live with a piece of dynamite anymore. YEAH for ME and my new . Yes Yeah for ME!

  379.  #379Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 2:12 pm

    I am more and more convinced that, for me, love means being fearless. Not that I don’t have any fear – I do, and at times, plenty of it – but stepping out into the unknown despite my fear, trusting that there will be a safe place to put my foot. Trusting that it will all be ok. Trusting that the world won’t come crashing down, and that despite being painfully triggered at times, that the sun will come out again and that I am getting better all the time.

    For me, love gives me the courage to keep going. Love is my motivator. It’s stronger than my fear. I feel like it’s a pure flame inside which will one day triumph.

    Love is fearlessness for me. Love is courage. Love is trust.

  380.  #380Indigo on August 3, 2014 at 2:14 pm

    I saw D tonight for the first time in just over a week. It felt so good to be held and kissed, and to be close to him again. I had missed him. It had been a weird day.

  381.  #381Linda on August 3, 2014 at 3:15 pm

    I have had a weird day. Lots of emotions, thoughts etc. I have been thinking about the way my life is right now. There are pros and cons. There are times I feel so frustrated and at others peaceful. I seem to land on the negative side of my perspective than the positive more than not. It is human nature to do that or just mine?

    Instead of my usual quite internal white noise of feeling a failure I thought about feeling successful instead. Shifting this feels foreign and un natural.

    I can say that I certainly know lots of things I DONT want in my life now. AND if I had not started to truly like/love myself I would have probably ended up in a really unhappy in a relationship again. So even though I feel I don’t know when I will get there.. I am gonna keep headed down this road one baby step at a time until I have the relationship I want with a man that I feel wonderful with, can trust and be me with. I believe He is looking for me too. That makes me feel teary…. I cant give up now.!

  382.  #382Sequoia on August 3, 2014 at 3:17 pm

    I had many feelings today.
    I kept my trust up that my Cd would come through and he did. He texted me in the morning, than called and even so he was injured he came through to pick me up. We went for dinner , connected beautifully and went to mine. I did lean back all the time. Than after a beautiful more tender than before intimate connection I did express in non-violent communication style …that he didn’t contact me for a few days and that I feel disconnected as I value connection. How does he feel hearing that.
    And he told me that he feels overwhelmed. He had told me about his stress at work, so many thing going on in his life. Apparently there is no other women – which I do believe.
    I said that I have this picture that when two people meet and they want to be together their communiction grows and not gets less over time.
    He said that these days this is not true , that if a lot of stuff is going on in an individuals like the person might need time out for some time.
    He said he feels like I have put a pistol on his head.
    I said that I feel afraid that he misunderstands me, that I don’t know him and can not say much about the future either but that I feel interested in getting to know him…and that I do not want a friends with benefit connenction.
    well I feel I did the right thing, but I am not sure now how it will continue. Apparently it doesn’t bother him that I am dating as he can not give me what I want – eg. 24 hours nonstop with him (in exaggerated form that what he expressed He feels I want from him )
    Even so I do not feel more clear at least I was truthful and open.
    I do believe that he is very bussy and he had a lot of unexpected stuff popping up at work….are we just on very different time lines and is he a man who is just not in the right space to be open for a relationship.
    I remember reading somewhere that man , I think Christian Carter , that man can’t open up to a relationship if there are not in the mental space and space in there life were they are open for it…eg. if their more focused on work, etc. Is that true? Or is he just not enough attracted to me?.
    I also asked him if my perception of me sleeping with him so early and him not persuing me because more because of that correct and he said no that complet Bs and not true, that it has nothing to do with that but that he is super bussy and stressed right now.
    Tell him to contact me again when he has more time for love or just keep seeing him and dating, shifting my focus away as much as possible and keep him in my rotation, that is not really existing yet?

  383.  #383Linda on August 3, 2014 at 3:22 pm

    My heart has been closed up for quite a while. It is okay for now.

  384.  #384Linda on August 3, 2014 at 3:33 pm

    sequoia… Shift your focus away. He spoke his truth. Fill you life with what makes you feel full and happy.

  385.  #385Sequoia on August 3, 2014 at 3:36 pm

    mmmh normally he texts me straight after we meet…but not tonigh and I wonder if I did the right thing.
    May be it would have been better to not mention anything and just see, keep leaning back…I don’t know.
    I felt I needed clarity and I believe that I expressed my feelings in a non threatening way…
    I have also noticed that I am afraid of true intimacy and I told him that too. That one part of me wants and longs for a committed love relationship and another part is afraid of intimacy. Than he brought up that I dating again – he mentions that again and again but apparently it doesn’t bother him, hmmm….
    I feel confused one minute I feel sure that I did the right thing expressing that I feel disappointed that there was no contact for 4 days the next minute I do regret mentioning it…
    I want to trust that there are no mistakes and that if he is the right one for me he will come through.

  386.  #386Sequoia on August 3, 2014 at 3:42 pm

    yes thank you Linda. Well he has been feeling that he can not give me what I want – in his words 24 hours every day non stop with him. I had not idea that he perceived me as sooo needy. I did leant back as much as I could, not calling or texting, not even thinking to much about him…mmmh

  387.  #387Sequoia on August 3, 2014 at 3:49 pm

    Labbit #369 thank you for sharing the expectation you were having with your Cd the first time around. I read it and thought wow this is good for me to read now I do not want to project them on my CD. But I had expressed some of those already to him and even so I read your post and thought to myself yes I want to let go of my exectations I did express some more needs, eg. the need or the desire to have more contact with him today and he felt overwhelmed.

    I wonder what happened the first time with tender CD…did you stop seeing him, was there any contact etc. I would feel curious to know as I find your story inspiring.

  388.  #388Tanea on August 3, 2014 at 4:30 pm

    Indigo 396
    My ex and I have a 5 year age difference. His ex is a lot older than he is but I have two guys interested in dating me, one is 17 a or 18 years older and the other is 12 years older. I don’t judge either but I think that big age difference will eventually cause problems. Cant be compatible

  389.  #389Linda on August 3, 2014 at 5:42 pm

    I realized today that I used to feel so driven to work on finding my man. Lately I have been surprises that I don’t feel that way at all anymore. I feel tired of it all. The purse with the holes in it thing feels real and sobering. Even though I know that I have weeded out and steered away from bad for me things and relationships. I still believe that sharing my life and being happy with a man is possible. I am not sure that I will ever be able get my children to accept a new man in my life and fully accept him. This makes me feel low and trapped in a way. At other times it makes me feel indignant and angry. I want to believe that there is a man out there that will not make this the reason to not have a relationship with me. One that will not issue ultimatums and expect me to choose I have to choose between them and he. How unfair that felt. I hope that I find a man will accept the easy and difficult things without drama and not push, manipulate and put demands upon me. I have never had a man tell me to “Grow some”! How belittling and offensive those words felt.

    I dont know when my heart will feel open to looking or, putting myself out there to engage in a relationship again. I still feel worn out and disenchanted with striving. I wish he could find me, I want to just fall into his arms and ride off into the happily ever after sunset and take me to our place on the lake and everything would just fall into place. mmmm

  390.  #390prplpsn28 on August 3, 2014 at 5:55 pm

    I am having a really, really, really hard time. Lots of tears. Periods of being almost angry. Mostly sad tho and not completely clear. Cannot find my happy place. A whole lot of speculating and I know I shouldn’t do that, but it’s there. Ugh. 🙁

  391.  #391Violette on August 3, 2014 at 6:49 pm

    Marikab be good to yourself! Find ways to release him and put the focus back on your wonderful self. Find a way to like everything you did and said. Let him come towards you, and fill yourself up with a sense of being loved and cared for within, no matter what he does. You are doing fine.

  392.  #392Azure Blu on August 3, 2014 at 7:34 pm

    Ohhh… I feel happy about your wonderful time with T!!

    It sounds soo good…
    Darling Siren, feeling messages happen when they happen… or Not… :-}}
    baby steps

  393.  #393Azure Blu on August 3, 2014 at 7:41 pm

    Veronica and Dominique…
    I wanted to clarify :-))

    This is just MY opinion for ME…
    about reconciling my relationship with my mom
    to pave the way for me to be able to have a better relationship with a man (and everyone else)

    I never reconciled my relationship with my father…
    He was impossible for me to get close to and
    he would only try and contact me every 10 or so years…
    so I just let that go and work on forgiving him when something comes up in my feelings about him (not very often) that need healing…

  394.  #394Azure Blu on August 3, 2014 at 7:44 pm

    ((((prplprsn )))))
    Give yourself some really warm, long sweet hugs!!
    take those angry feelings and explore them…
    and LOVE them…

  395.  #395prplpsn28 on August 3, 2014 at 8:36 pm

    Marikab and Azure Blue…thanks for the hugs.

  396.  #396Millie on August 3, 2014 at 8:56 pm

    Indigo 397,

    Yes I agree with you that I do have feelings around the situation. I do feel angry with him. So angry, that I am choosing to discontinue any further contact with him. I sent him a text and told him I don’t want to hear from him anymore, and blocked his number, for good this time. There is no reason to engage any further with him. As far as residual feelings about the relationship, unfortunately my experience with him has left me with many triggers. I will have to work through them…

    I totally agree, I feel bad for his fiance also. The kind of man he has finally shown he is to be….is not loyal. I choose not to get involved, she can make her own assessment and decisions. She does know about me and even reached out to me months ago questioning his faithfulness, so she is aware. It’s up to her now.

    As for Mechanic, I’m trying to love myself in every moment, but it’s hard when he triggers me in ways I cannot express to him. It’s my feelings that I need to go through and work out. Using the paint yourself tool is a good suggestion though, thank you.

  397.  #397Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 11:18 pm

    Dominique – 391 and 392 – Hi Dominique – it’s so good to see you here : ) Thank you so much for your words.
    I really appreciate this and am so glad for now knowing this:
    “Sometimes having an understanding about them in relation to you is what’s needed all that is possible.”

  398.  #398Veronica on August 3, 2014 at 11:19 pm

    Azure Blu -417 – I hear you, thank you x

  399.  #399Sequoia on August 4, 2014 at 2:23 am

    Marika it feels good to hear that you had a great date and that you are feeling good.

    I feel still a bit strange and I have the feeling for me the lesson is to let go of control.
    I went into the date not wanting to share me feeling dissapointed, I wanted to give him time and just be there in the moment, but when he said he is going to go soon I think I started feeling afraid and wanted to control the situation and it just popped out of me and the energy did change after that. I have the feeling that it tainted the whole evening which is sad as we had beautiful connection.
    But I did it and I do not want to think that it was a mistake. I tried sthg new. eg. use nonviolent communication, which I had practiced with the coach I met spontaneously a few days earlier. And it gave me more clarity, that he can not give me what I want right now, even so he had said that already before in a joking way, but him responding like that I could not not hear it.

    Well…I am going on my trip in 3 weeks, want to prepare for the course I am doing there, and I am going to be dating other men….so I am going to be bussy.
    I feel sad that man, particular this man, put so much priority on his job and so less priority on love.
    I did ask him if he experienced a lot of heart ache and he said yes and that he closed down his heart over time…mmmm sad!

  400.  #400Indigo on August 4, 2014 at 3:33 am


    As Rori and Dominique always say, there are no mistakes. I think you did great with expressing your feelings. If you felt that it was weighing on you and you needed to express that to him, then you did the right thing. As I say, it sounds as if you did great with how you expressed them – no making him wrong or blaming.

    I don’t want to make you doubt yourself because I think you did great, but if it were me I would not have had this conversation. Since it is so early on and we are not dating exclusively, I just would have let things continue to unfold for quite a lot longer and continued dating other guys. I do feel that he had a point in what he said in that it can feel like a lot of pressure when he has not fully committed to you yet.

  401.  #401Labbit on August 4, 2014 at 7:02 am

    Indigo 424 — Love this. Agree.

    Sequoia — I broke things off with TenderCD after we had a fight. There were lots of little things leading up to the fight…I can’t remember all of the specifics anymore and I don’t really want to either. 🙂 The point is more that we never would have connected the first time around. I didn’t know how to let him into my heart, to be open and vulnerable.

    This weekend some friends of mine are having an evening party. These friends live in a beautiful house in the heart of the city with a great deck and pretty views. They told me TenderCD is welcome to come as well. I’m struggling a bit here though on whether it’s appropriate to invite him or not. We’re not exclusive right now. He’s never met these people before. And I agree with what Rori says in that I don’t want to be the social director of the relationship.

    I plan on going either way, but I’m curious what you Sirens think about inviting him? Perhaps it’s too soon. I would feel comfortable at the party by myself, and also comfortable with TenderCD there. Certainly if he’s my forever guy there will be plenty of opportunities to see friends together in the future! Maybe it will feel right or not right to invite him in the moment when I see him next (which would be lovely!). It would feel good to have a script ready in case it does feel right to invite him. Keep it casual?

  402.  #402Kim on August 4, 2014 at 7:57 am

    Labbit. I never invite any man to anything if we are not exclusive. Period.
    Depends on how you feel though.
    If he wants to make plans with you on that soecific evening and you want him there, that is when I would consider saying that I wasn’t free but he could tag along. Maybe.
    Otherwise it is a great opportunity to CD and focus on you.
    If he doesn’t mention any planning whatsoever for the weekend, I wouldn’t bring it up and just go.

  403.  #403Azure Blu on August 4, 2014 at 9:01 am

    i have taken my cds early on if they have been very attentive etc…
    before becoming exclusive…
    I have a group of friends that are ALLL married or in LTR and I get soooo tired of being the single one at our get togethers… so it’s soooo nice to have a date now and then,,, but I make sure it isn’t leaning too far forward… not messing up the balance…
    I feel like it’s also an opportunity to see how they interact with my friends..

  404.  #404Kim on August 4, 2014 at 9:06 am

    Good point Azure Blu…

  405.  #405Azure Blu on August 4, 2014 at 10:05 am

    sometimes wonder if I put alll my attention on a man because I have real issues
    that have EVERYTHING to do with ME and what I’m going through
    and NOTHING to do with the guy I’m obsessing about…?

    Lovely Siren… think about the last 3 months of YOUR life,,,
    You are doing MAJOR changes with your feelings,
    how you are handling life, RR tools are life changing and have caused me to have hours of tears etc…
    going through the emotional turmoil of changing ME….

  406.  #406Femininewoman on August 4, 2014 at 10:19 am

    Labbit I am feeling confused. If you broke things off with TenderCD why are you considering inviting him?

    Am I missing something?

  407.  #407Indigo on August 4, 2014 at 10:46 am

    Feminine Woman,

    Labbit broke things off previously with TenderCD but they have recently reunited (Labbit I hope you don’t mind me jumping in here).


    I love this: “The point is more that we never would have connected the first time around. I didn’t know how to let him into my heart, to be open and vulnerable.”

    As far as inviting him to the party, if it were me, I like to assess where I am coming from, and how I think I’ll feel both during and after the party. If I think it will make me anxious or bring up expectations in any way, I avoid it. If I feel that it will not significantly alter things and that I can just be in the moment and enjoy it, then why not, go ahead.

  408.  #408Indigo on August 4, 2014 at 10:52 am

    Marika B,

    If it is any consolation, when I first started on this healing journey in a big way, I used to cry all the time for the first 2 years or so. I still cry more easily than I used to (in the past I hardly even used to cry at all) because the feelings are much nearer the surface.

    As I said, initially I cried all the time. It was as though I was releasing years of pent-up emotions. For a long while, I thought I was never going to stop crying. I would cry over anything (including once in a shopping centre when someone let the door close on me as they were walking through it, I sobbed uncontrollably) but eventually the crying did lessen significantly. I love what Karla McLaren says: “Tears restore flow to the psyche.”

    My point is, if you feel good and happy, embrace your tears, they’re not always a bad thing 🙂

  409.  #409Azure Blu on August 4, 2014 at 11:03 am

    Indigo… #434
    I love what you said here…
    I used to NOT cry much… didn’t ever want to feel!!!

    Ahhh… it is so good to have access to my feelings now and let my tears “restore the flow to my psyche”

  410.  #410Labbit on August 4, 2014 at 11:52 am

    Kim 427 — Thank you! This rings true to me.

    Azure Blu 428 — I hear you. TenderCD is super attentive, though I don’t want to make him feel pressured or uncomfortable by bringing him to an event that is potentially all couples either. I am sure we’re headed in that direction but I want him to run the show, you know? 🙂

    Indigo 433 — Not at all, thank you!! And thank you for your thoughts as well. Right now I feel uncomfortable in asking him. When I see him I might feel more secure in asking, we shall see.

    Femininewoman 432 — It’s like Indigo said. 🙂 He came back and asked for another shot. I feel so glad he did!

  411.  #411Linda on August 4, 2014 at 12:29 pm

    Labbit I feel happy that your second shot is working so well. There is something that feels well a little more accomplished and successful about that whole idea when first it was not working at all and then some things shift and then it does.


  412.  #412Kim on August 4, 2014 at 12:32 pm

    I feel cautiously optimistic.

    No idea why.

    Well, I think it’s because I have kind of made up my mind to be more open, and to get off the fence I have been sitting on.

    With MoM, the CD I was dating on and off for nearly a year, I have been sitting on a fence, because he was sitting on the fence. Now he is ckming towards me but still not offering a commitment, or a future. I gave him so many chances to step up. A year of dating. He is so nice and sweet and I feel loved…but I do not feel cherished and claimed, for me there is a difference. Moreover, all the attraction I had for him has but evaporated. Puff…into thin air.
    Even the kisses don’t feel good anymore.

    Wildchild hasn’t been actively making dates but he is working ao hard and into the nights and I respect that..we will meet tomorrow most likely. He is constantly in contact. It feels like he is loooking for my approval and trying to clean up his act, business wise, life wise.
    He offers me a solution for my financial pickle also, by moving in and paying my bills. I kind of decided that this is a gesture and a stepping up, I have not seen by a man in a very long time and if it isn’t all talk, I will stay open and give the kiddo a chance.
    The details will have to be worked on, and I am still not sure I can share my little personal space with him, but just the fact that he would consider this…for me is a huge deal and feels really good.

    We shall see what the next few weeks bring.

  413.  #413Azure Blu on August 4, 2014 at 1:31 pm

    Kim #438
    I do feel you are sooo right!!
    wildcd IS stepping up by offering to pay the bills and move in and staying in contact with you…

    I think it is sooo important for ME to start seeing alllll the ways my cds ARE moving forward and stepping up…
    My negative voices LOVE to focus on the ways things AREN’T working!!!
    AHHHH!!! Stop your noisy uproar!!!
    oooops… I need to LOVE MY NV…
    I love MY NV
    I love the way I focus on what isn’t working.
    I LOVE the way I am shifting this
    and focusing on the positive.
    I LOVE the way I use feeling messages.

  414.  #414Labbit on August 4, 2014 at 1:45 pm

    Thank you Linda! We will see where this all goes. Right now I feel very happy, and that’s all that matters. 🙂

  415.  #415Kim on August 4, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Yes Azure Blu, that is my problem too!
    I often focus on the negative and make mountains out of molehills…with men. I am sure some intimacy issues play into it, self protection and overthinking.
    I used to be somewhat different, but my accumulated experiences have had me feeling overly skeptical…also different culture to what I was brought up with. I do sometimes feel out of my depth.
    Trying to focus on what is and the positive, the negative will show up all by itself anyway, right?
    It doesn’t need encouragement from us lol.

  416.  #416Starla on August 4, 2014 at 5:02 pm

    Where is Karol? I have been thinking about you, Karol. What happened with your situation? <3

  417.  #417Dixie on August 5, 2014 at 1:31 pm

    Lovely Women,

    Thank you so much for letting me read your postings and responses. I’ve gained so much and felt so much stronger on the inside because of your journeys.

    Here is my situation in short strokes. I just need to hear myself say this get feedback perhaps.

    I was dating someone casually 4 years ago, more of a FWB than anything else and I let a connection form in my head. (I know, I know). He was separated at the time. But then 2 years ago, he became very affectionate, supportive, loving, tender and honestly, it was the safest I had ever felt. I felt like I was floating on balloons. There were trust issues, the main one being that he was still separated, so although things felt good, it wasn’t enough.

    Fast forward to now. We broke up this April, and although I felt awful, I know deep down that the relationship and its issues were affecting me. I was feeling low, and suddenly not very secure as I once felt. It took a lot of time, but I did what you ladies have preached: I took care of myself, and focused on everything else good in my life. Obviously I still miss him, especially the talking, brainstorming, and sharing and supportive nature, but I’ve accepted that its gone. I leaned way back and did not make contact for months, and I thought I was doing really well.

    He contacted me last week and said he was thinking of me and wanted to catch up. At first, I felt infuriated because when things ended in April, he was acting like a stranger and after months of no contact, I felt uneasy to share with him, let alone “catch up.” He sensed my hesitancy and apologized for unsettling me. But (this is where I need advice) after few emails back and forth, I said that it would feel okay to meet and catch up.

    In my heart, although I still feel a lot of tenderness for him, I’m wondering if this might be a chance to practice letting go. I do not believe the our meeting will rekindle any feelings except maybe camaraderie, and I am telling my balloon of hope to go float somewhere else for now. The truth is that years ago, when I was married, I never had the courage to set boundaries, and still be loving towards myself. I wonder if this is the opportunity I have now….to meet him, be loving and strong for myself, and show myself that yes, I can do this and move on with confidence.


  418.  #418Dixie on August 5, 2014 at 1:34 pm

    Geez, sorry for the typos.

    Is it possible that this might be just a learning experience for me?

    I also have not dated anyone since April, and yes, in those years, I was exclusive with him. Part of me would love to start dating again just to get my feet wet again, but that is a separate post 🙂

  419.  #419Azure Blu on August 5, 2014 at 8:06 pm

    Hi Dixie,
    It sounds like you are doing a great job in taking care of you!!

    I know for me… when i talked to my ex after 5 weeks (he initiated) it was very good practice for me…
    I usually like to ignore and walk away…

    But I was advised by some Sirens on this site to
    practice sharing my feelings with him…

    It was the best thing for me to do…
    I talked to him about my feelings and what I did want…
    What I liked about our relationship and things I was concerned about.
    He surprised me and said
    when he was with me it was the happiest he had ever been, He could be himself when he’s with me…
    he thought about me all the time
    and could we see each other again…

    I thought about it and decided that I didn’t like the fact that he didn’t talk to me for 5 weeks and he would say he was going to call and then didnt

    fast forward 3 months… he’s been calling off and on and we are going to meet for dinner to catch up and see what might happen.
    Sooo you never know…

  420.  #420Indigo on August 6, 2014 at 2:26 am


    It sounds like you are doing great.

    You could always do as Azure Blu suggested and practice sharing your feelings with him? As long as you feel you are not in danger of getting hurt in this situation, through continued contact, or by meeting him.

    As far as dating again, go for it! Circular Dating is great fun and should help you feel great about yourself.

  421.  #421Indigo on August 6, 2014 at 2:27 am

    Azure Blu,

    I feel such admiration for how you handled your ex! It is very inspiring to read of a siren’s strength like this.

  422.  #422Dixie on August 6, 2014 at 12:07 pm

    Azure Blu and Indigo – Thank you so much for your words! Honestly, I feel so much better knowing I can come here to process how I feel and get feedback…

    We are meeting on Friday and I am trying to make sure I feel steady. He wanted to know if I had a place in mind, but I leaned back and said that anyplace he picked would feel good so long as we could talk. (I said that proximity to ice cream would also be nice, but not a necessity). He said, okay, he’ll come up with a place and let me know.

    This is where my mind goes into serious overdrive. Long ago when I was married, my ex- had a longstanding affair with someone who became pregnant more than once. And that whole time, I had the most awful feelings in my stomach that everytime we needed to talk, it would be another bomb dropped on me. It was years ago, but it was so devastating to me then, that sometimes even now I anticipate the worst possible outcomes before anything happens. Almost like ducking when nothing is really falling from the sky.

    So whenever I imagine Friday, (which I’m trying not to do) I’ve been trying very hard to separate this little conversation with those big bombshells from the past.

    I might make plans for Friday evening, just to make sure that this is not the only thing happening that day. It would feel good to have something else to look forward to…

  423.  #423Azure Blu on August 6, 2014 at 1:37 pm

    What feelings do those “big bombshells” from the past bring up? They sound VERY SCARY!!! oxoxo
    i’m wondering if you dig deep and focus on YOUR feelings
    gently and softly take them in your arms and LOVE YOUR FEELINGS
    ONE by ONE

  424.  #424Dixie on August 8, 2014 at 3:30 pm

    Azure Blu #445
    Indigo #446

    Thank you once again…. I saw D. today and I felt steady but a little nervous. At the end, I felt just sad and disappointed though, not because I was hoping for a renewal, but because the conversation felt so strange, generic and stilted. Even he acknowledged it. We both felt it. We used to communicate so well so this felt like a big deflated balloon. It felt like words were trapped in my tummy. When he asked, I told him exactly that, and he said that he understood, that we had gone from “100 to 0” in the breakup and that it must have felt like the rug was pulled from beneath me..

    I did lean forward a little. When he left, he held my hand and said that he would still like to see me again if and when I was ready (as friends). I let it hang in the air at the moment. When I came home, I settled myself and sunk into my feelings. I texted him, thanking him for the invitation, and said that I was felt glad to see him, despite the awkwardness but that it just felt stilted today which is why I felt sad.

    He emailed shortly after saying that it felt hard for him as well, as he did not know even how to address me without using his usual terms of endearment and that that felt inappropriate. He said he was sorry if it was too soon to catch up and that he would be “here” if and when I was ready.

    Lord. Why we didn’t say this in person I do not know. So I responded moments ago. I thanked him again for being sensitive to that and that one day, it might feel good to be friends. But (and this is the part I feel proud of), I said that without open and honest communication I don’t know if even a friendship in the future would be feel any better than today. It wouldn’t feel real.

    I acknowledged that I made mistakes in our relationship but what I always appreciated was that he made it feel easy to share. He was steady and I loved the safe feeling. I said that if I had ever not done the same for him, then I was truly sorry and I was open to hearing that.

    There were so many questions that hung in the air, things that had felt “off”, after the sudden breakup, and I said that I accepted that. But in terms of friendship one day, I said that since there was nothing really to lose right now, that if there was a chance of a true friendship going forward – one that felt real- then we would have to be open and honest with each other. Anything less would feel less than genuine.

    And then I said I was truly grateful that he was in my life.

    Sooo… how do I feel? Better, settled, relieved. I wasn’t sure about leaning forward, but I felt this pull to just assert my boundaries. And I feel glad now because truly, felt free in saying what I needed to. Friendship or no friendship, I just don’t want to slide into anything that feels less than sincere.

    (high five to me!)

  425.  #425Dixie on August 8, 2014 at 3:33 pm

    And high fives to everyone on these boards who have set such amazing examples – thank you!


  426.  #426Donna on August 14, 2014 at 9:14 am

    Oh I need some help and advise! I am a widow. Lost my husband of 22 years 21 months ago. After the grieving process I discovered what loneliness was. I went on a dating site and did meet someone. We have been dating each other exclusively five months. We really enjoy each others company but recently his ex-wife has entered the picture. She left him 10 years ago for another man. Moved to another city. Well when she has now left the man she was with and lives with her brother in the same town we live in. The problems are starting. His ex is needy. He has helped her find a job, helped her open a bank account, helped her fix her vehicle, and most recently rented a UHaul and moved her from the other guys house back to her brothers house here in our town. I have told him I do not like this especially now that we have made a commitment to see each other exclusively. He tells me I am insecure. Well he the heck wouldn’t be! So we are still seeing each other but this “thing” is between us. I am trying to be understanding but part of me says RUN! Need some advice! Help me sort this out PLEASE!

  427.  #427Rori Raye on August 16, 2014 at 10:42 am

    Donna – I’ve been in sort of this situation. There can be all kinds of reasons – he could still be in love with her, he could be NOT in love with you (yet) – at any rate, you are locked in battle with this woman. Try this to get more clarity – REVERSE IT!!!! “Oh – you’re such a great man to care about another person like this…I totally understand that she was so important in your life and you want to be helpful to her, and yeah, I’m just a girl here, and girls don’t like sharing time with their men with other women…and since it’s so obviously important to you, and she’s an actual friend of yours now, perhaps you could introduce me to her so that it’s the three of us, and I can feel less jealous….” In other words – go from discomfort to absolute acceptance and love – and start Circular Dating, and get yourself some friends! Women AND MEN!!!!

    If you’re going to fight for a man – your weapons are vulnerability, authenticity, independence and great sex. If you need work on any of those things – get a coach! Any of my Certified Coaches will support you, help you – and if they feel you need to get un-exclusive and Circular Date more radically, they’ll tell you, and tell you how. Love, Rori

  428.  #428Donna on August 16, 2014 at 11:11 am

    Oh Rori thank you for responding! I will definitely use the reserve strategy that you suggested. I have already met her and he tries to convince me there is nothing more than compassion there for her. He says I get all his passion and I know I do. He also says that he lived 28 years in that and he is not going back to it. I can’t wait to blow his mind when I use this reverse strategy. I used the appreciation approach and he was stunned. You have definitely been a great help!

  429.  #429Azure Blu on August 16, 2014 at 12:36 pm

    Dixie… there is a new thread… in case you didn’t know.

    Wow!!! I am VERY impressed by your VULNERABILITY
    and Siren Strength
    All evening using Rori’s tools like a soft/strong artist!!
    YEs, YES, YES!!! hIgh Five to YOU!!!

  430.  #430Azure Blu on August 16, 2014 at 12:41 pm

    Rori thank you sooo much for sharing this lovely tool!!!

    Reverse Strategy… I think I have read it before
    BUT such a good reminder!!!

    “If you’re going to fight for a man – your weapons are vulnerability, authenticity, independence and great sex.
    – and if they feel you need to get un-exclusive and Circular Date more radically do that”

  431.  #431Donna on August 16, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    Oh Ladies I just had a chance to use reverse strategy! He got it! He said Donna this is the best I have ever heard you talk when her name was brought up! Okay I need to know more. Been trying to decide do I buy the set of books $399.00. I can definitely see things changing just from a few tips I have received here today but $399.00 is kind of steep for me. I work as an in home daycare provider and I am a widow so any money I spend has to be a wise investment. Anyone have any thoughts on what books or do I need all the books? Thanks in advance!

  432.  #432Bee on October 3, 2014 at 8:01 am

    I have an annoying situation. Definitely related the above post. Ive been with my boyfriend for almost 2 months now, after 3 months of dating multiple men and him practically begging me to be exclusive – I had told him its a big step for me and that I only do serious relationships, and that I’m not willing to get into a relationship unless he’s serious about it.
    After him asking so many times I realised I was ready, and that he was completely committed and ready for a serious thing too, so I decided to be exclusive. The previous three months before that he chased me so much – I never initiated anything, not even a text message!
    Over the past month we’ve both been fairly stressed out – he’s been struggling at work and I’ve been flat out with major exams. Even still he’d make the effort to call etc. But his openness in terms of expressing emotions and how he feels about me has dramatically declined over the past month or so. It’s frustrating. I feel like I’m not getting what I want, whereas before I was very happy. I can sense myself tensing up and feeling more insecure and less trusting.
    I know my feelings have become stronger over the past few months, I’m in love with him and I haven’t even told him because he hasn’t said it to me yet. I’m not sure if I should have the circular dating chat about wanting to go back to NOT being exclusive, or to tell him this is how I feel and see how he reacts.
    About 2 months ago I was able to tell him very easily that I felt as though he was becoming distant, and I asked him if anything was up. And he felt so guilty for not being appreciative and being attentive etc he immediately turned around and became all amazing again – that lasted about 2 weeks.
    I’ve already started circular dating, I just don’t know what to say to him, and I know I need to say something because my feelings are eating away at how I am naturally towards him. I feel less light and fun and more heavy and dull – He was literally amazed and stunned by me a month ago and now I feel like a piece of furniture. I’m sure my insecurity is blowing things out of proportion in my head but I still want things to change and go back to how they were.

  433.  #433Rori Raye on October 3, 2014 at 3:13 pm

    Bee – you sound awesome – and just keep doing what you’re doing and being totally expressive and straight-forward with him. Watch to see if it’s YOU blocking the intimacy by shutting yourself down….Love, Rori

  434.  #434Julie on October 4, 2014 at 3:25 am

    Hello I am really unsettled by a recent event.
    Having sold my house a couple of months ago and moved in with my partner until his is sold. He has a buyer and we have a house but waiting on all the legalities to be completed. It seems to have been taking a while and there has been quite a lot of tension.
    We have not been getting on 100% partly due to the stress of the situation. I also feel he has been nagging at me and critical as I am in his home and feel have to try and fit in with his ways of doing things. It has been difficult. We have had quarrels but then I have tried using the scripts and relaxation techniques which have helped.
    Things seemed to have settled but we are both feeling anxious with regards the buyers intention. It seems we are walking on a tight rope in case the sale falls through. Two previous sales have fallen by the ways side by two of his previous buyers.
    Something unsettling happened the other day after he had been critical three times and I had expressed my feelings at not feeling comfortable with that.
    My partner and I went out for tea after the heat had settled and on return he was calling his mobile from the land line as said he could not find it. I was shocked to hear the ringing tone coming from my bag upstairs…he went to it and asked what was his phone doing in my bag? I really do not knowI It was so not real! I was very confused and asked him if he was playing some kind of game with me? Had he put it there for a joke? He denied it and said he was not bothered and forget it. I could not as did not like the fact it was in my bag. He got angry and said he had not put it there and let it be!
    Any advise/ comments really welcome please.
    From one very confused person 🙁
    Love and light