Observing Dating Conventions Gets You More Love – a Note to Men

Untitled design (14)

connect with manWe have to learn.  We have to practice.  We have to develop our confidence and self-esteem, and the fastest way is to learn to receive, and to PRACTICE receiving.

If you don’t know what it feels like to be cherished — you will miss it.

You’ll avoid it.

You’ll mistake it for something else when it shows up.

You’ll mistake “chemistry” for cherishing.

That’s why it’s so important to observe the “conventions” at the beginning, because we need to learn.

This is to all the men here on the blog…please understand this:

We are not about being in some sort of “position” with you.

This is not about “status” – which is a crucial part of the “seduction community” Tools.  (Perhaps I’ve never mentioned it…but David DeAngelo is one of my dearest friends, and though he may have started out teaching men how to pick up girls, he’s evolved into a teacher of how to be a great man…so I’m VERY familiar with the pick-up legacy…) This is about CONNECTION.

And in order to connect, we first have to connect to ourselves.

That means we have to put ourselves in situations where we can surrender our “stances.” (I talk about this a lot in Modern Siren and Targeting Mr. Right).

A man who gets that not all women are fully formed as goddesses, and that we need certain things to happen on your end in order to feel safe enough to be our best, deepest selves – even if you are a STEP along the way (and we appreciate your help with this, you’ll simply have to be aware of things and not spend lots of money getting to know a woman – just observe the conventions and you will learn right along with us…) — will reap the reward of a fantastic woman.

This way you can BOTH be “in process” – perhaps together.

Love, Rori

Posted in

871 Comments

  1.  #1Daria on September 16, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    oooh, i need to feel safe enough to be my best deepest self with you papi



  2.  #2tinque on September 16, 2010 at 1:52 pm

    It goes both ways. I feel safer, he feels safer, and so on. It’s a lovely symbiotic dance.
    xxoo



  3.  #3Daria on September 16, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    I didn’t know how to “do” relationship. I kept jumping into boy mode, being a friend, like a guy buddy friend, and adoring him like he was jesus and wanting to spend time around him all the time.

    Now i do! yay! and it feels amazing. such a special feeling, to be able to silently relax and let my heartflame flutter



  4.  #4Jason Miller on September 16, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    I support Rori completely with her assertion.

    The concepts of “position” and “status” in the seduction community play on the insecurities of women who aren’t powerful in their femininity and happy with themselves. It is not a true connection. It’s an immature version of connection which is more about sexual gratification. I don’t judge what people are choosing to do either way.

    But there is good news. The pick-up/seduction community is maturing into a bona fide men’s movement with the purpose of reclaiming what it means to be a man in the internet age. And that means making mature, responsible, satisfying connections with women. Not all men are interested solely in getting laid.



  5.  #5Daria on September 16, 2010 at 3:55 pm

    in order to be turned on, i must believe he’s more powerful than me. is this true? when i know i am goddess and the greatest and unlimited in my power? whole like a peach? oozing like the earth bit by the earth eater? juicing down lava, off to the feet of the cosmic hungryman.

    i am the everything. the awesome woman power.

    and so what turns me on, then, if it’s not the power.

    What is it about you man?



  6.  #6Daria on September 16, 2010 at 4:05 pm

    I think ‘tricking’ women into getting laid is great practice for men, as long as it makes men better lovers, with higher self esteem, and more ability to turn me on

    that is “tricking” or rather… practicing the art of leading a woman into sex, with a woman who is not necessarily one’s lifelong desired partner.

    it’s much like CD’ing , where we practice “tricking” men into taking us out on dates, so that we can become better receivers, with more ability to attract men

    this is why i always encouraged and supported my brothers in practicing getting girls to have sex with them

    i don’t want a man that doesn’t know how to turn me on

    uhoh i’ve triggered myself! i don’t want to support lying and being inauthentic – though pretending to be rico suave is certainly a fun sort of lying.

    i don’t want to get attacked by women who felt sad and abandoned by men, and i don’t want to make them feel bad

    i’ve felt that way too! i don’t want to blame men for wanting to practice getting a woman to bed! i feel protective of them, i hear them blamed, misunderstood

    they want to be good at this, so that they’re future wife can be pleasured by her man’s “suaveness” and skills!

    it’s not about dissing the other women

    it’s about practice, and no imaginary relationships

    i love men, and i love women, and i don’t want to blame them for wanting to have sex,

    and i want to see this play out in my life too thank you, compassion and feeling good

    and authenticness

    .

    i think men come with a disclaimer like : hey, im not married, and i want to practice sex with every woman i feel a lil bit attracted to, so i can get really really good at sex, as well as look for my future wife.



  7.  #7Daria on September 16, 2010 at 4:08 pm

    its all Daria all the way baby! who wants to say something? huh? huh?



  8.  #8life_is_too_short_to... on September 16, 2010 at 4:18 pm

    My friend and I, who are sexy fifty somethings, noticed a pattern of men we get into conversations with in various social settings (doesn’t matter who initiates it) often make it a point to mention right away that they are married. We were wondering what are some of the reasons they feel they need to do that. We decided that we are going to say we are married too. I may even start wearing a ring.



  9.  #9life_is_too_short_to... on September 16, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    It’s not like we are coming on to them. We are good intelligent conversationalists, not necessarily always interested in picking up a man.



  10.  #10life_is_too_short_to... on September 16, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    That’s right, I cherish and adore myself, and so, let the man appear who loves and cares for himself enough not to cheat himself out of the rewards we will realize from me receiving his cherishing and adoring!



  11.  #11Daria on September 16, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    life is too short – hey! my guess is beacause they feel the spark of attraction! and then they know they are married, so they say it then, to be upfront and remind themselves and stop themselves from pursuing a beautiul siren.

    ps. saying you’re married and wearing rings, would not be authentic,

    being open, and perhaps getting curious about the man as a person, maybe asking about his marriage/family, discussing what he thinks are important tools for relationship… might feel fun



  12.  #12Jacqueline on September 16, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    @ Daria – I just tried to email you and it kicked it back undeliverable to I’m going to just post it here.

    Hey! just wanted to say I’m glad you mentioned the Rori’s at Amazon thing – I know that is huge for her and she didn’t even mention it herself and I haven’t wanted to beat anyone over the head with it…but I really hope everyone will pop over there and show her support.

    Thank you for complimenting my blog – and you know you can post in the real life section anytime you want to. I haven’t said anything because it’s just something that is available to you, not something you in any way have to do. And if you want a link to the writer’s group, let me know. I’ll support you in any way I can.

    Love,
    J



  13.  #13Feeling on September 16, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    I’m excited that I think I’ve added a man to my CD-ing rotation. He is a single dad whose son in on the same co-ed soccer team as my daughter and we’ve had some fun conversations during the past two games.

    Tonight, it was raining like crazy and I stood under my umbrella, in the Rori dance position, and practiced feeling open and feeling the rain and the wind. I felt lovely and open and he stood near me almost the whole game.

    Just as we were leaving, he commented that he was going home to hop in the hot tub. I said, “mmmm – that would feel good and he smiled right into my eyes. Later, he waved at me when he drove by on his way out of the field.

    All of this feels good to me and now I am wondering, do I just wait for him to make a move to contact me? I see that he is on Facebook and I thought about sending a note about the rain and the hot tub, but I’m afraid that would be too forward. But it would let him know that I’m “out there” on FB and give him access to my email.

    Thoughts?



  14.  #14Brenda on September 16, 2010 at 6:01 pm

    Hi Feeling,

    Oooh! Sounds very romantic! Definitely let him make the next move. Rori says don’t initiate until you feel totally secure in his love for you.

    Lean back and receive, like a water wheel!



  15.  #15Mercedes on September 16, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    “A man who gets that not all women are fully formed as goddesses, and that we need certain things to happen on your end in order to feel safe enough to be our best, deepest selves”

    Beautiful…

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  16.  #16Jacqueline on September 16, 2010 at 7:27 pm

    Hi, all! Mercedes, I’ve missed you – waving at Brenda! AND wanting to say how cool it feels to be labeled an EXPERT at Ezines (I know I know….it’s not like the Harvard Law Review, but still cool for me! grin….) check it out! @
    http://ezinearticles.com/?expert=Jacqueline_Brielle
    ******

    This blatant self promotion also encourages you to see my newest blog post about the usefullness of negative projection/thinking?!!
    and has the RR seal of approval so far!

    Night to all mermen and sirens,
    Jacqueline



  17.  #17Jennifer on September 16, 2010 at 7:37 pm

    “and that we need certain things to happen on your end in order to feel safe enough to be our best, deepest selves”
    But do I need things to happen on his end to make me feel safe? Or is it all about me and the crap inside my head?
    Cause I don’t feel safe with any man.
    So therefore…since I am the common denominator it should be my issue…yes?
    But then again…I tend to over think.
    Think Think Think ….shut up brain.



  18.  #18Jennifer on September 16, 2010 at 7:44 pm

    school yard guy is kinda breathing down my neck
    He wants to know when I’m free next to go out.
    I told him monday
    he wanted me to text him
    I told him I feel better if men call me first.
    I gave him my number.
    Since I feel nervous with every man…I’ll just go out with any dude who doesn’t absolutely TERRIFY me.
    I had a guy terrify me recently. There was a bar fight when I was out with a friend…one of the dudes in it was talking to another friend and the way he talked and what he said made the hair on my neck stand up…so short of THAT reaction I figure I should be ok.



  19.  #19Denise on September 16, 2010 at 7:46 pm

    #12 Feeling

    How fun! I agree with Brenda, I feel it’s the right thing to do to lean back and let him pursue you. It will make him feel more masculine and in turn will make you more feminine. Do not contact him, be PATIENT and circular date.

    Excellent flirting! You showed him you were interested in him, that’s your job! In my opinion, the man pursues and it’s the women’s job to be open to that pursuit.



  20.  #20Jennifer on September 16, 2010 at 7:49 pm

    school yard guy just messaged me “night sweet pea”
    Gak.
    Frig.



  21.  #21Jennifer on September 16, 2010 at 7:56 pm

    Judo man is bringing me a zombie movie and thinks I should throat punch school yard guy.
    *sigh*



  22.  #22Feeling on September 16, 2010 at 8:24 pm

    Thank you, Brenda and Denise. I feel, too, that I should wait, but I also feel so impatient! i am excited for Saturday’s soccer game though! Happy Sigh…



  23.  #23Daria on September 16, 2010 at 8:28 pm

    Jennifer – wait, you and judo guy spend time outside of class now? he’s bringing you a movie? whoat!



  24.  #24Lucy on September 16, 2010 at 8:37 pm

    Jacqueline, I read your peter pan article — nice job. 🙂

    I read your email and will get back to you as soon as I can.

    <3
    Lucy



  25.  #25Dorothea on September 16, 2010 at 9:14 pm

    Hi, it’s shameless self promotion time. This is the first and last time I will ever do this, unless I publish a book on this topic, which is actually looking pretty likely.

    This is what Dorothea is workin on before she leaves the campaign for good to be a research nerd.

    http://womensmarijuanamovement.org/content/yes-prop-19-day-action-oct-5-1

    thanks!



  26.  #26Daria on September 17, 2010 at 2:07 am

    Is it Sireny to ask men for something?

    like say a man is like, hey im on my way over, i got some smoke for you. and thats cool and also I feel hungry.

    so is it sireny to say; “im hungry if you got food?”

    i remember rori said get to the palce where you dont ask a man for anytying

    but also

    what aobut being the fern

    ?

    i feel confused



  27.  #27Jennifer on September 17, 2010 at 3:40 am

    Daria…Naw…he’s on my FB and messaged me. ::shrugs::



  28.  #28life_is_too_short_to... on September 17, 2010 at 5:59 am

    Hey Daria, you feel like a friend! Yes, i was just kidding about wearing a ring or saying i’m married.

    I really don’t want to get hung up on rules.

    I think that it is about getting really, really CLEAR on what it is that you really, really want. Like, what is your greatest desire? And will you settle for nothing less than that desire?

    The right man will be the reflection of that.

    Or not. Perhaps it may not even be in the form of a person.

    I am open.



  29.  #29life_is_too_short_to... on September 17, 2010 at 6:12 am

    Jennifer, I get what you mean about not feeling safe with a man.

    I tend to feel that if I receive too much they are going to expect sex sooner rather than later, and that makes me feel unsafe. That must be the limiting belief that all men want is sex.

    OK, limiting belief, be gone!

    So, if I am not sure about if I want to go that route with a guy I will tend to start offering to split the bill and things like that.



  30.  #30Denise on September 17, 2010 at 6:49 am

    #21 Feeling

    So difficult to be patient, but so worth it!



  31.  #31Irena on September 17, 2010 at 7:05 am

    hi ladies… i have been following and using rori’s tools and reading your comments.. its my first post:-) so hello!! i recently read this and thought you would all find it interesting
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/shortageofsingleladiesdrivesmentocommit



  32.  #32AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 7:40 am

    Daria,

    I feel good asking for what I want. Maybe:

    Oh, Thank you! It’s gonna so fun to smoke. I’m feeling hungry! Can you help?

    GRIN

    I can’t remember where it was- someone posted something about stating your request. It’s weird, because I can see how I’d need to be totally okay with him saying no. But then I’d need to take care of myself, so if he said no I might have to say something like- Ok. Well I need food so _____ (state however you plan to take care of your need and how that affects him) Like maybe- I need food, so I’ll have to run to the store and I may not be here when you get here.

    How does this feel to you?



  33.  #33AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 7:46 am

    And Daria-

    I now have this song playing in my head whenever I think about you:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3-GiVIE8gc&ob=av2e

    Walking gets too boring, when you learn how to fly…
    I’m a gypsy, are you coming with me?



  34.  #34BarbinOz on September 17, 2010 at 8:16 am

    What do you ladies think about putting up a little well ya know……sexier pics……..not porno or sleazy LOL…….but just a little more skin…..would that make me some kind of ho desperado??

    I posted this on a now dead thread, what do you think Ladies? I am not talking about posting porno pics on a dating site LOL, but just more Goddessy type pics cos ya know that is the way I am feeling right now or is that LEANING FORWARD?



  35.  #35Lizzie on September 17, 2010 at 8:21 am

    ok, I couldn’t take it, I am self destructing – or maybe not. I sent a note to Family Guy telling him I want to return his tools. sigh.



  36.  #36Lizzie on September 17, 2010 at 8:25 am

    Hi Barb – I only have a head shot on any of my profiles. I have heard men say they hate the boob shot if that helps. Interestingly, the men that seem attracted to me, like my derrier – who would have guessed??
    My men friends tell me that they like to see one full body shot – and the one you have I think is excellent, and they like to have a face shot, they like the look good, but not the real glam shots because they get shocked if you don’t look like your photo when you show up. But we are Canadian – I have no clue as to what works with the English or the Auzies.



  37.  #37BarbinOz on September 17, 2010 at 8:25 am

    Amber re your youtube

    This video contains content from Vevo, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.

    🙁



  38.  #38Simply Shannon on September 17, 2010 at 9:05 am

    Daria: I LOVE the disclaimer…

    i think men come with a disclaimer like : hey, im not married, and i want to practice sex with every woman i feel a lil bit attracted to, so i can get really really good at sex, as well as look for my future wife.

    As for asking for something, I wouldn’t. You can simply state “I feel hungry” as a feeling. We think there’s a question there, that we’re asking for food but it’s simply stating a feeling. “My belly feels warm and bubbly and hungry. Does your belly ever do that? Maybe I should eat something -or- A full belly would help me feel more relaxed when we smoke.”



  39.  #39AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:07 am

    BarbinOz,

    I’m not experienced with dating sites, but I do know that Rori (and Evan et all) say that you should present your BEST self in a photo. Since you are feeling more juicy/sexy/diva/goddess I feel happy with the idea of you posting updated photos to go with your new profile.

    Also- the video was Shakira -and the song Gypsy. And thank you for telling me it was blocked! I’ll be more conscious of this from now on.



  40.  #40Simply Shannon on September 17, 2010 at 9:07 am

    Barb, I say no to the overtly sexual pics. Unless that’s the angle you’re wanting. Personally when I see guys with no shirts on or shots taken in their beds, I feel turned off. Ewww. There’s plenty of time for me to see them looking bedroom-sexy but not like that. For me, I feel sexy and beautiful in ALL of my pics, but not overtly sexual. Is that helping?



  41.  #41Dorothea on September 17, 2010 at 9:17 am

    I ask for things except for when I will feel rejected and awful if he says no.

    When I wasn’t asking, and just using feeling messages, I was not getting what i wanted, and in the end i realized i was playing games!

    So finally, I said, will you please buy me some ice cream? hehe. I’m hungry and I want to go out..will you please take me out? Then I just try to forget that i asked, and be open and warm once he gives me what i asked, as though it were his idea.

    What do you ladies think?



  42.  #42AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:26 am

    I got a tip on this from the other side of the coin. LOL

    I think it was a David DeAngelo video for men (youtube has a bunch of clips). He said the photo should be engaging in some way. FUN! The more fun you look like you’re having the more people will be drawn to you. And if you’re in any group photos posted anywhere on the webyou can just put up a link.



  43.  #43Simply Shannon on September 17, 2010 at 9:32 am

    Dorothea – hmmm…

    I feel hungry. Something cool and sweet would taste great. I’m thinking about ice cream. What do you think?

    Or, I feel lazy. I really want some ice cream but I don’t want to go to the store.

    Still feels leading to me. Asking directly and feeling messages don’t feel any different to me right now. 🙂

    I think it’s totally fine to ask for what you have in mind but realizing he may say no and offer something else or nothing. Maybe he already had in mind to bring me a milkshake and he chucked in the trash to get me a cone.

    I get what you mean about playing games. If I really want a particular thing, that’s what I should say. Not tip-toe around it, which is really still leading… just covered up in feeling messages.

    That’s kind of an aha moment. I think I still lead even when I’m using feeling messages. Sometimes.



  44.  #44Trutle Girl on September 17, 2010 at 9:37 am

    #28-Lifeistooshort
    Guys DO want sex, duh….sooner than later? Well yeah…..however we are in control of when…..I have been dating a cd guy now for almost four months and we have not had sex! He has told me he respects why I don’t want to yet and is cool with it. He is always trying to get more of my time and has said he loves me. This is before sex, mind you……

    I told him I was interested in forever and that my life is really important to ME and I want to get to know a man before I decide I think I want to has sex with him. Period. He is still here. Thinks I am awesome.

    The guys who disappear either just wanted a booty call or they are not that into you and either one who gives a poo?



  45.  #45Trutle Girl on September 17, 2010 at 9:42 am

    Also I have a guy friend (platonic for years) and sometimes he and I hang out. He always pays. He does it because he is a gentlemen and guys LIKE to pay and provide for women, even if they are not getting sex. he is getting my female goddess company and he enjoys that very much.

    Question to the sirens here: Anyone ever fall in love with two different men at the same time and have that be an issue and a problem? :o)



  46.  #46Nikita on September 17, 2010 at 10:12 am

    TG,

    I may be experiencing that dilemma …



  47.  #47Nikita on September 17, 2010 at 10:15 am

    Lizzie,

    Re: family guy,
    But isn’t the truth that you’re just feeling nostalgic for his perfectly prepared salmon?



  48.  #48Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 10:46 am

    Hi! This is too funny! A friend of mine just emailed me this video, and it’s worth the 6 minutes if you ever struggled with hang-ups! And who didn’t! 🙂

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYLMTvxOaeE



  49.  #49Trutle Girl on September 17, 2010 at 11:30 am

    Good video Brenda-seen that one before-been a while….funny…..actually kind of has a ring of truth to it, does it not? I mean Rori says no need to go into a bunch of past crap-just stop our behaviors and do something different. Interesting!



  50.  #50Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Amber, I’ve seen that Gypsy video and really like it. It’s mesmerizing.



  51.  #51Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Barb, I agree with everything Shannon wrote in #38. I also asked some guys online if they thought I should put up some provocative pics and they said no way!



  52.  #52Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 11:47 am

    “He said the photo should be engaging in some way. FUN! The more fun you look like you’re having the more people will be drawn to you” (Amber)

    So THAT’S what the appeal is with my pics! Practically every guy who writes me tells me I look like a lot of fun. hehe.

    Wow, thanks, Amber. Now I know.



  53.  #53Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 11:52 am

    With my ex-h I usually just ask for what I want/need. Unless I’m feeling flirty, and then I’ll use non-leading feeling messages (while looking at him mischievously).

    With dates, I don’t usually find myself wanting or needing anything.

    I do remember, though, driving back from the beach with WH, saying, “I’m cold.” So, he adjusted the temperature controls and asked me if that was better and I said yes, thanks.



  54.  #54Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 11:54 am

    Turtle Girl! Thanks for saying this. I agree! (Though I know others won’t.)

    “The guys who disappear either just wanted a booty call or they are not that into you and either one who gives a poo?”



  55.  #55AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 12:00 pm

    FUN!!! GRIN. That must feel really good to hear.

    Not too much of that going on in my head lately. BUT. Next Wednesday I’m flying down to see my guy and then the REAL FUN begins. Muhahahaha

    Lucy- I was wondering why the age difference is important to you? My guy is older and I’ve struggled with myself over how important that is to me. The thing is- he kicks my @ss on the physical fitness thing. He’s in better shape than I’ve ever been.

    I’m wondering what the factors are for you there?



  56.  #56Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 12:26 pm

    Amber, yes, it does feel good to hear, but it’s getting kind of old, lol. Now they have to say something more unique than that to get my attention. Hehe.

    Re: the age…. Well, my sister’s husband is a lot older than she is, and I can see some issues there that I would like to avoid.

    One thing is that women generally outlive men, and since I am at the point of literally wanting someone to grow old with, I want him to be around with me for a good long while.

    Also, older men have slown down a good bit sexually, and I have a very strong libido — and, having been mostly alone for almost ten of my prime years, I want a man who can make up for lost time with me. 🙂

    Additionally, I find that I am more compatible with men closer to my age — there’s a generational thing that kicks in somewhere around 52 it seems — so, that would be guys born before 1958 — they grew up with a different mindset it seems, especially about gender roles, etc. Plus, most of them are just not as adventurous and playful — a lot of them don’t like to go out to movies, which strikes me as a little odd and is a turn-off for me.

    Maybe your experience with that age-group is different — or are you younger???

    It may also be the area I live in — very conservative for the most part.



  57.  #57Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:07 pm

    Good day ladies and gents! I have to catch up on this….but my friend put this comment on my new blog post – which is actually about how negative thinking can help you survive….and it’s so mystical I wanted to get you all’s thoughts and invite you to check out the story….waving hello!!!!

    J

    ps – he’s deep for a guy, huh? I love that about him, yeah for men philosophers!

    Speaking of Toa … I have always been interested in that question ,” Is a glass half full , or half empty ?” . And was wondering if there is a way to comment on your front page posts ….

    The question : ” Is a water glass half full , or half empty ?”. What does it matter ? It is a half glass no matter how you look at it . From a practicle point of view , there is no difference . But from an emotion pint of view … ? And this is where Toa comes in ….

    There is a movie called ” The Bulletproof Monk ” that askes the question ” Why do hotdogs come in packages of 8 , but hotdog buns come in packages of 12 ?”. When first asked . Seann William Scott gives the western answer … ” No matter how many hotdogs you have , the packaging always leaves you wanting more …”. By the end of the movie , he figures out the eastern answer … ” It doesn’t really matter . You can always get more hotdogs ” ….

    For me , the movie brought home that ” half glass ” question . It is water . Rarely would it matter how much water there is , and even then it wouldn’t matter if the glass is half full or half empty . If that is all the water there is , then that is all the water there is . We have to make do . But usually it is easy to get more water …

    The movie brought home that there really is a difference between western and eastern philosopy , even in such simple cases of hotdogs , or even a glass of water . Of course , the reason by hotdogs come in packs of 6 or 8 , is because they are sold by the pound , where as bakers tend to sell things by the dozen … But still , it gives case to think a little …

    https://blog.havetherelationshipyouwant.com/dating/observing-dating-conventions-gets-you-more-love-a-note-to-men/#comments

    Thanks – pros and cons to every man, hmmmm?



  58.  #58Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:09 pm

    Echoing Lucy – I once went on a coffee date with a 21 year old just to get inside the modern male’s mind….he was interesting and cool. I draw the line for sex, tho at like 34; except for the guy who LIED about his age…..argh??? What do you all think? Is there an age below or above which you will not go?

    Bad girl,
    J



  59.  #59Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Turtle Girl, RE: #47 – Did you turn into a trutle?

    I really like what you said here. No need to go into past crap. Love it! It works!



  60.  #60Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    For me, the line is roughly 15 years older or younger. I’m 46, so that means roughly 30-60. But after Ry Guy, I much prefer younger! 🙂 And for some of the same reasons you all discussed – libido, growing old together.

    Another thought about physical attraction…I have observed that many couples have similar facial structures. They often look like they could be brother and sister. I feel that way about Ryan. I saw a picture of me when I was slender (so my face was more shaped) next to a picture of Ryan, and we did look like brother and sister! I felt more attracted to him than ever!

    I also observed that Bill’s face is similar to mine, too. He vaguely looks like my Dad looked! I have no doubt that that gave me warmer feelings for him. Same with the married man who was my all-time favorite man as far as types.



  61.  #61Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    WOW!!! DORETHEA!!! Outstanding site! did you design it? and promote whenever you want! I love to see what all else everyone’s into!

    Best wishes moving on and forward, but this is great work that you can take with you!

    Good job!!! champagne popping….



  62.  #62Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    Strange, tho, Ryan’s penis looked nothing like my vagina, yet I was even more attracted to him because of it! LOL! ;-P



  63.  #63Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    Nikita….looking for your male/female difference in lists of options on other page….

    GRin….

    J



  64.  #64Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    ha ha Brenda, I’m sure it was a perfect fit on the inside….



  65.  #65Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    Jacqueline,

    I’m sure it is, but I never got to take it for a test drive. 🙂 Maybe someday, if this naughty Siren will quit overfunctioning! And him will quit being a bad boy!



  66.  #66Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    Disclaimer – this is in regards to a conversation I had, it is not about nor is it directed to anyone in that conversation….but it is to Lizzie at bottom….smiles…..

    @ Jennifer…no my Dad did it too; people in general will do it because they feel too pressured to meet your needs, so if they turn it around on you – “you’re tooo NEEDY,” it is very effective at shuting you up and or down, then they don’t have to even notice you have needs, and can get back into their own “world/neediness,” without ever addressing your original neediness. It feels passive agressive but when I was a kid it just felt like I was BADDDDD! and wrong and selfish and AWFUL….!

    Now when I hear it, I don’t believe it – just like I don’t believe I am controlling, and yep asked a couple of friends on that and they thought it was waaaay off and kind of funny – but I think it’s interesting. I think people here have issues with not being what is comfortable here. And they majorly have issues with control, and for the most part a lot have been in therapy, so they are very good with words and deflection.

    So, if I’m curious, I ask, or if I have something I want to say, I just keep saying it. I find therapy speak fascinating, btw.

    If someone hears you as needy or controlling they are reacting to their reaction TO you, maybe not even hearing YOU at all……esp. since in this case it’s only come up once…..now if you hear it from multiple sources day after day….uh, yeah, might wanna think it really is you!!! lol…

    Lizzie – it just IS, is what Rori would say. It’s you living your life and there are no mistakes…..and ya know I’m gonna repost this over there, too – and that’s not a mistake, it’s taking it to all of yall..I don’t see why we are so AFRAID here to make a mistake – the tools can’t really be used without the possibility of a mistake, yes? So, you know it is only by going for it that you will get there – even with Rori tools!

    Hearts,
    J



  67.  #67Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    Jakkaline,

    i’m not were-eed at all about macking miss takes! I just be myself on hear all tha t-I’m! This is our practiss ground, rite?



  68.  #68Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 2:07 pm

    Brenda – absolutely, that’s my point dearie! We are works in progress – I hear Lizzie wanting a genuine human connection with another human – NOT he’s a MAN I better talk this way to him. I think the man will reply to her human to human conversation; whether or not it moves to romance talk, ergo tools, is another thing. FIRSTLY we are friends, human to human with any other human bean!!!

    Beans r us!
    J



  69.  #69Brenda on September 17, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    I likes bean a bean. I bean werkin hard on not werkin too hard so I kin bean femnean



  70.  #70Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    Oh, Erika, I would love to be playing in that judgment-free meadow we talked about a few weeks ago!!!!

    I wish this place could be that judgment-free meadow. I feel sad that it is not. 🙁

    I love what TN man taught me about judging — and how he never ever judged me.

    I feel very very sad. 🙁



  71.  #71Amber on September 17, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    Lucy-
    I gotta tell you- #68 feels weird to me. I don’t want you to feel sad. No, that’s not true. I don’t want you to feel sad and not look at you about it.
    Your sadness.
    You own it.

    SIGH.

    Okay Amber, you bossy biatch. Get back to work on yourself. LOL



  72.  #72Daria on September 17, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    hello – me and my cd practiced the tango for the first time yesterday. it was pretty good. we did a volcada. we got it from beg to end.

    we were up till 8 then we gave each other massages



  73.  #73Amber on September 17, 2010 at 3:00 pm

    DARIA!!!!!

    GRINNING EAR TO EAR!!!!



  74.  #74Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    “I gotta tell you- #68 feels weird to me. I don’t want you to feel sad. No, that’s not true. I don’t want you to feel sad and not look at you about it. Your sadness.
    You own it.”

    Amber, I can see how it would feel weird to you, because it was addressed to Erika about a discussion we had on here awhile back that was brought to my memory with the current thread. It is a topic near and dear to my heart, and, I think, Erika’s as well (hopefully, Erika, you don’t mind my saying that — am basing it on previous convos).

    Yes, absolutely, I own my sadness! And I do always look at me about my own emotions. So, no worries, Amber.

    And, likewise, I don’t want you to feel weird and not look at you about it. Your weirdness. You own it. 🙂

    <3
    Lucy



  75.  #75AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 3:36 pm

    Uh. Yeah….

    I guess that’s why I said (to myself)

    Get back to work on yourself…



  76.  #76AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 3:57 pm

    Lucy-

    I don’t believe I’ve ever read any of your process here. And since I have this idea that you are a lesson to me- I’d really appreciate it if you could either point me to the correct archive or tell me about it.

    You said (to Erika, here on the public blog, so that we could all participate)

    “I wish this place could be that judgment-free meadow. I feel sad that it is not. “

    And isn’t that a judgement/mirror?

    Since Erika is here, at least by reference, and since you can hear her voice and respect her I’m going to paste my favorite Erika quote into his:

    “So all the Sirens here want to be in a fearless space, right?

    And most of us seem to agree that Life is a Mirror, right?

    Now … when we hear judgment and believe it to be true, we feel angry, scared, hurt, etc., right?

    If it’s a mirror, and I send judgment outwards, and I believe those judgments are true, guess what?

    They are going to boomerang right back at me … and I will feel scared and angry …

    But if I come to the realization that all judgments are false, and I no longer dish them out, and I don’t take them seriously when they are directed at me …

    Guess what?

    Fearlessness … no more anger … placid calm and cool … non-reactive to men … able to stay centered at all times … we are talking …

    PURE DIVA ALL THE TIME, LADIES !!!!

    Non-judgment is the way … oh no, wait, it’s A way, lol, to become a PURE DIVA ALL THE TIME !!!”

    I’m going out and wont be back here until late (or tomorrow) but I’ve bookmarked this so I can find it again.

    Toodles!



  77.  #77Nikita on September 17, 2010 at 3:58 pm

    What does this mean? What is it referring to? I don’t remember agreeing to list any Female/male difference.

    61: Jacqueline says:

    Nikita….looking for your male/female difference in lists of options on other page….

    GRin….

    J

    Friday, 17 September 2010 @ 1:31pm

    ——-is this an expectation?? Or is this a joke that I maybe don’t understand since there is a “GRin” at the end?



  78.  #78AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 4:01 pm

    Lucy-

    I’ve just received my message here, so please don’t feel the need to post the standard

    “I know you are but what am I”

    I AM AMBER

    I AM ALL



  79.  #79Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 4:06 pm

    AmberS — I feel surprised that you’ve never read any of my process here. It is scattered all over the blog, like seeds blown by the wind. I’m not sure what it is specifically that you want to know.

    Yes, I love that quote of Erika’s — the whole thing, and the wonderful conclusion:
    “Non-judgment is the way … oh no, wait, it’s A way, lol, to become a PURE DIVA ALL THE TIME !!!”

    Love it. <3



  80.  #80Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 4:07 pm

    Feeling confused by #76…

    But very happy that you got your message!!!!! Yay!!!!



  81.  #81Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    Nikita – you said offering a woman a list with 6 options and giving her a timeline was controlling, or maybe crumbs? at some point controlling was inferred. I said the to get to review Steve @ EFT Down Under he pretty much required me to give him a list of options and rewarded me for speaking clearly. You said you were too tired to discuss your comments and so I said, okay. So, today I reasked the question how was the list limiting, crumb like and controlling? and why did a MAN reward me for clarity with a gift copy of his several hundred dollar program when I made such a list but here it was derogatorily referred to. I was not joking. But when I end with smiles or grins it is to let you know that this is a conversation that I am curious about and may be triggering to any or all yet I’m still pursuing it. And you did say you would answer the question, and thanked me for being patient. So, here I am being patient, but yeah, I will keep asking since you noted I had not addressed my remarks to you – which I was waiting to see you on here, now I am and this is the whole repeat of the context of the question.

    Thanks!
    J



  82.  #82Turtle Girl on September 17, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    Brenda-Yeah I turned into a Trutle…what a spazzzz…I am having a dyslexic moment today.

    Lucy-You sound like you have run on such a similar track. I went for seven years without a man, not quite ten but yeah-I want a guy with a really well functioning penis-making up for lost time as a lover….so true…don’t like the old guys in so many ways.

    As far as age and having sex-hmmmm I think my limit is 35 low end and 65 high end. Anyone younger seems like he would be my son (ewww!!!) and older than 65 seems like my dad (ewwww!!) I am 56. But it’s a personal choice. I know a guy who is 27 and well—I HAVE had evil thoughts about him-he is really cute, but no, prolly never do that. Too frigin young. Bummer……but I mean c’mon if our goal is a long term relationship guys too young usually want kids etc and then there is the generational cluelessness thing..plus I would be afraid if he was too much younger in ten years when I am looking like his mom-he will look elsewhere……..not going there.



  83.  #83Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    @ Lucy – I think that you wishing it were safe implies it’s not; I think that addressing it to Erika makes it safe for you to say it’s not safe and I think that claiming confusion makes it okay for you to never explain – as does claiming that explaining is a form of control. If we never explain we never really connect. I don’t have a judgement about it, but I’m totally willing to explain any position I have ever taken here – ie., above post to Nikita.

    Why does it have to be safe? Why is safe “better,” and isn’t it always being safe the same as never making mistakes and therefore self limiting and self contracting and never allowing ourselves growth in if nothing else allowing?

    Rhetorical questions, but if you feel like answering, it’s all good.

    Happy Friday!
    J



  84.  #84Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Turtle! girl…I had you pegged at about 25!!! PS the guy who lied about his age – made himself older….in hindsight, omgosh! Grin…

    it’s like what Rori says above, don’t do it if you can’t handle, what do you think? cuz the 27 year old sounds cool to me – and believe me THEY aint seeing their mother; somehow they are seeing a woman who is SAFE yet sexy….don’t know how but that was my observation, you young thang!



  85.  #85BarbinOz on September 17, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    OK ladies thanks for all the comments on the photo’s, I will just do a pic of me having fun??? How would that look??



  86.  #86BarbinOz on September 17, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    #80 Turtle Girl

    Totally agree, in fact until my new Lizzie revamped profile I actually had on there ” not interested in boys young enough to be my son or men who look so old they could be my dad” (!!!) and believe me I got LOADS when I first joined………but somehow there seems to be a lack of decent men in the right age group which is why I am moving over to the paid site. Its like all the men are waaaaay young or waaaayyy old, maybe the men of my age are looking for 30 – 40 year old women……



  87.  #87Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    ps @ Erika – now I’m talking to you in my dang head!!! OMGosh, and hey I’ve decided you can be fairy princess cuz I think your ears are probably pointed a little like Spock, and that’s what lead to your amazing focus on emotional growth!!!

    So, what I was saying to you was, Good for you, Erika! I hope Sunday is a huge success!!! and if you feel like it, share your method for tapping on blog issues, then everyone can move into a radical space here, or we can just see how it affects the space?

    Thanks, F.P.!



  88.  #88Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    Jacqueline, I didn’t say it was unsafe, I said it was not judgment-free.

    To me, there’s a huge difference. I addressed it to Erika, because when I saw the judgments and felt the sadness, the vision of that judgment-free meadow that we had previously discussed appeared in my mind’s eye, along with the happy feelings of such a place.

    That is an explanation. And I have explained many many things to you on here, as per your requests. I don’t necessarily agree with you, however, that “explaining” helps with connection. I have connected beautifully with many girls on here without all this need for explanation between us.

    As far as the confusion, it is genuine — I did not get what Amber was saying there. I feel amused and surprised to read, “claiming confusion makes it okay for you to never explain” because I feel like I have spent so much time on here lately EXPLAINING things to you!

    And you know what else? It IS okay for me to never explain! I have repeatedly honored your request to explain out of respect and care for you — but it would be perfectly okay for me to choose NOT to explain.

    I feel frustrated because it seems like you are not truly hearing me at all. I also feel curious about that….



  89.  #89Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    I would feel relieved if you would choose to stop making erroneous assumptions about me (“I think you this, I think you that”), and focus instead on what’s going on inside yourself.

    I don’t want to be continually put under a microscope and squirted with chemicals that distort my appearance to the one looking through the microscope.



  90.  #90Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    “and believe me THEY aint seeing their mother; somehow they are seeing a woman who is SAFE yet sexy….”

    I know! I don’t understand that either! And this 25 y o — I actually worked with his mother! and we were the same age! and kinda friends!

    And I’m like, “Doesn’t that bother you??”

    And he’s like, “Nah, you’re hot.”



  91.  #91Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    Lucy – every one of my sentences were “I think,” ergo making it all about me. I want to use whatever is on here that I find useful to me to grow, and sometimes your comments are useful to me in that context. I respect your right to never explain but I cannot agree to never comment; I believe we had this discussion and came to an agreement that all can post their thoughts no matter who the blurb is addressed to?

    and squirted with chemicals is picking up the I’m putting you down, etc. inference from the other nite, btw….I am not, I will not own that inference, and you are putting it there. I comment on anything someone says that triggers me, interests me or feels good.

    J



  92.  #92Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    and I challenge you that if you really really want there to be NO erroneous misunderstanding and viewing of you, you will have to explain all the things I’ve asked you to each and every time, instead of vaguely saying I’ve spoken about that allready. That’s what relationship is, and I don’t get that that efffort is being made. And that’s okay, I’m just being clear that I heard everything you said and disagree with the conclusion and the tone. Nuff said – I would feel better if we can agree to disagree!



  93.  #93Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:34 pm

    “every one of my sentences were “I think,” ergo making it all about me”

    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!! Good one!!!!



  94.  #94Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    “but I cannot agree to never comment;”

    I never asked you to agree to never comment.



  95.  #95Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    “all can post their thoughts no matter who the blurb is addressed to”

    Absolutely! I agree completely!



  96.  #96Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    “you are putting it there”

    I respectfully disagree.



  97.  #97Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    and this is a genuine question – if you have been doing so much explaining (and I’m still confused, haha) anyway and explaining equals control are you then controlling this in some way that is adding to my confusion?

    What I think is you want to say leave me alone, and I can definitely hear that. What I don’t want to hear is I’m “DOING” something to you that distorts you, or squishes you, or swallows you, or makes you tear up….

    So, just say leave me alone or some definitive statement that I can then just let it be! Erika and I did it, and it wasn’t nearly this hard!

    Thanks,
    J



  98.  #98Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    “That’s what relationship is, and I don’t get that that efffort is being made.”

    I am making a tremendous effort with you, Jacqueline — more than I have had to make with any other woman here.

    But we seem to have a very different view of what relationship is.



  99.  #99Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    “if you have been doing so much explaining (and I’m still confused, haha) anyway and explaining equals control are you then controlling this in some way that is adding to my confusion?”

    No. That’s what the dialogue with Daria was about the other day — the distinction that explaining is NOT a form of control when the other person is genuinely and sincerely ASKING for explanations because they want to learn/understand.

    However, Daria did point out that even when a person is ASKING for explanations, that person may not be asking sincerely, and, in that case, it is better to not explain.

    So, I wonder if that’s what is going on here …. that maybe your requests for explanations are not sincere.

    I am going to find what she wrote about that because it was very helpful…..



  100.  #100Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    “What I think is you want to say leave me alone, and I can definitely hear that.”

    No, I don’t want to say leave me alone. I don’t want to try to control you.

    I have expressed my feelings and what I don’t want — terrific non-violent communication tools that Rori encourages – and that are great for conflict resolution.



  101.  #101Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    when I’m sincere I say I’m sincere as in, geniuine vs. rhetorical; I still don’t hear a definitive statement that does not include you in some way being victimized by me and I’m still here when I wanna quit looking at a screen and relax – therefore, I too am making the effort!



  102.  #102Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    “Erika and I did it, and it wasn’t nearly this hard!”

    Then apparently whatever trigger you have around me is stronger and deeper than the one you had around her. 🙂



  103.  #103Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    and what I was saying about I feel was more in the context of I UNDERSTAND what Amber is saying and feeling because of these (following) things that I feel when I read the conversation.

    If I were in any way trying to manipulate this, I’d just manipulate it.

    Once again, will you make a definitive statement as to how you want me to address you or not address that does not include judgement about me doing so?



  104.  #104Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 5:57 pm

    “I still don’t hear a definitive statement”

    What do you mean? What do you want to hear?



  105.  #105Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:57 pm

    you are not honoring my request for a definitive statement, that comment is circular logic as Amber sees it, it goes nowhere, it is not an authentic expression of you nor of your feelings it is a play to keep this in motion and feels manipulative.

    I’m out of the conversation as of now, with it duly noted that I tried to come to a meeting of minds and that I have once again asked you multiple times clearly and succintly to do something you do not want to do and are not doing – which is once again, making a statement as to what you want from me without including any inherent, inferent, implied or intented language about how I am somehow doing something to you.



  106.  #106Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 5:59 pm

    I want to hear a realization that I have in no way victimized you and you are willing to say whatever you have to say to me in clear and straightforward terms without any wording that implies anything about me and my motivations. The what do you mean is again, circular.



  107.  #107Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    is my meaning clear? whether you choose to do so or not, can there be any doubt as to what I am communicating here?



  108.  #108Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:06 pm

    ew – i just got a quick glimpse but can i say i would feel furious if someone was asking me to do something i did not want to do

    and talking about “duly noted”

    wow

    i feel switch! in the head shutdown go numb

    i do not want to be controlled

    i don’t want to be pressured to do something i don’t want to do

    i feel disrespected, unheard and furious



  109.  #109Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:08 pm

    Maybe this will help you, Jacqueline.

    From Daria, the other night:

    “telling someone what to do, whether we think is justified, is controlling.”



  110.  #110Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Hi Daria. Yes, that is how I feel:

    “i feel disrespected, unheard and furious”

    My heart is pounding so hard in my chest and I feel like I am drowning.



  111.  #111Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:11 pm

    Thank you for helping me, Lucy – however again, is my request that I want you to just state to me how you prefer I interact with you without the side order of me squishing, swallowing, or squirting you comments been made clear? whether or not you honor that request.



  112.  #112Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    Siena said, “Go to wonder….”

    Okay, I wonder why this is happening……

    I feel a lil better now, going to wonder.



  113.  #113Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Daria I think you need to read the context here – and I’m not going to be ganged up on again. Do you think saying someone is squishing you, swallowing you or squirting you with chemicals is appropriate? and if so do you think it’s accurate, and if so, then so what? How is it relevant. So the question is – Lucy, how do you want me to speak to you. If you choose to answer it does not mean I am not asking that of Lucy.



  114.  #114Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Jacqueline, I don’t want to try to control how another person chooses to interact with me.



  115.  #115Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    Lucy, will you tell me how you want me to interact with you without including wording that implies I am intent on doing anything to you?



  116.  #116Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    “Do you think saying someone is squishing you, swallowing you or squirting you with chemicals is appropriate?”

    Jacqueline, I did not say you were doing those things. I was describing how *I* FEEL.



  117.  #117Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    Okay Lucy you won’t tell me; will you agree that you have inferred negative meanings from my words that are not there to me?



  118.  #118Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    Re: 113 — answered in 112



  119.  #119Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    Jacqueline, I am answering you again and again. Are you not seeing my words????



  120.  #120Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    In the sense that you are describing how you feel you are making ME the SOURCE of those feelings and I am not. will you agree that I am not the source of the feelings?



  121.  #121Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:17 pm

    I see your words do you see mine? Am I the source of your feelings?



  122.  #122Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:17 pm

    “I’m not going to be ganged up on again.”

    Nobody is ganging up on you, Jacqueline. You are not a victim any more than I am.



  123.  #123Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    I feel like I am being interrogated by an angry lawyer.



  124.  #124Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    Thank you Lucy, that was to Daria but I am not saying I feel victimized, just that I will feel ganged up on. Different meaning.

    Am I the source of the feelings you mention in regards to our conversation?



  125.  #125Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    That’s why I decided not to go to law school after all — too much hostility in that world.



  126.  #126Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    Who is the source of your feelings, Lucy?

    Am I the source of your feelings Lucy?



  127.  #127Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    I know it was to Daria, who is now part of the conversation that also involves me.



  128.  #128Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:21 pm

    Including the word hostility is another inference of me being bad and negative btw.

    Am I the source of your feelings?



  129.  #129Jlina on September 17, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    Including the words ANGRY lawyer is another inference, I am not angry.



  130.  #130Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:24 pm

    um… i don’t know how i want to be addressed.

    i don’t want to be addressed in a judgemental way, but other than that i feel confused… i dont have any other requests



  131.  #131Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:25 pm

    If you choose to miss the gift of realizing that YOU are the source of your feelings, Lucy I genuinely feel badly for you, as that leaves you powerless to anyone and anything that triggers squished, swallowed, squirted, angry, hostile.

    So once again am I the source of your feelings?



  132.  #132Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:26 pm

    I feel so triggered. I feel furious being spoken to this way. I feel intimidated



  133.  #133Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:27 pm

    omg i feel furious.

    i do NOT want to be spoken with, once again statements

    i do NOT want to be talked to like someone is my mom

    i feel furious and i feel like slapping the ish out of you… and i dont want to do that , this feels bad, i feel so upset… i don’t want to fight



  134.  #134Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:27 pm

    Daria, I am being stubborn and it’s being interpreted differently than that; I am investing a lot of energy and time to try and lead to a breakthrough in what I perceive to be Lucy’s circular conversations with and about me.

    It is not going well, btw!



  135.  #135Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:28 pm

    Lucy I will assume you are not going to answer the question. And life will go on, I reward myself for the heroic try however!



  136.  #136Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:28 pm

    that feels really bad. i feel talked down to and pressured… im feeling really defensive and i dont want to feel that way…. what do you think we could do?



  137.  #137Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:29 pm

    Jacqueline, I am going to use the words that Daria helped me with the other night to answer you, because Daria is better at this conflict resolution than I am, and I am learning from her:

    That question feels weird… i feel kinda attacked by that question… i don’t want to be asked questions loaded with judgments.



  138.  #138Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:30 pm

    Daria, yes I know you will feel furious with this, but it was and is something I was attempting with Lucy that had unsuccesful results – and again, I ask that you read all comments before reacting with fury.

    If ANY of us ever think that WE are NOT the source of our feelings, we have given our power away needlessly.

    Nite,
    J



  139.  #139Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:31 pm

    Requests feel disgusting

    i do not want to honor any REQUESTs .

    i feel disdain. i feel fury!

    i feel invaded upon and commanded… wow i feel really really defensive, and mad, and unseen

    i do NOT want to be talked to in a commanding, request way.

    i feel furious



  140.  #140Lizzie on September 17, 2010 at 6:31 pm

    hey Daria, you didn’t drown! I on the other hand landed on a floating iceberg…did you stop pushing that boat up the river???



  141.  #141Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:32 pm

    Jacqueline, I already KNOW the source of my feelings. But I don’t want to answer questions that feel like demands and condescension.



  142.  #142Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:32 pm

    Jacqueline, I am respecting and loving myself here by not allowing my appropriate boundaries to be trampled all over.



  143.  #143Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:33 pm

    Jaqueline – I don’t feel furious at you. I feel triggered by the words used. I would feel furious being talked to that way, and I’m processing as I read.



  144.  #144Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:34 pm

    Lizzie – yeah luckily i gave in and let a cd visit me, i felt so dispassionate i almost canceled, but then it turned out fun. i dont feel like reaching out to that dude right now anymore, cuz i remembered he had to wrok on his finances, because love wise we were ready to marry, and i had already fallen into pressuring him about job/college/money/ household



  145.  #145Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:34 pm

    Thank you Lucy but it was a simple question with only one real answer. You are the source of your feelings, it is impossible for me to be. What if the questions were not loaded, but designed to dialogue into breakthrough? What if the questions were asked out of a desire to empower you? What if say, Erika were asking the questions? What if you too gave me the benefit of the doubt? What if you just actually answered the question?

    What if is a very good question, it opens possibilities NOT judgements; unless we provide the subjective judgement to the question.



  146.  #146Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    “What if say, Erika were asking the questions?”

    Erika would never have done what you did here. At least not now — maybe in earlier days….



  147.  #147Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:39 pm

    Jaquline – to me it feels really bad to feel like im being led socratically to a conclusion that im already aware of.

    i don’t tolerate being talked to that way by a man, and I dont want to tolerate it from anyone else either



  148.  #148Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    haha weird. this was reminding me of Erika in the older days and a conversation she had with AG where AG felt super pressured



  149.  #149Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    “What if the questions were asked out of a desire to empower you?”

    It is precisely the fact that I AM empowered that helped me to keep my boundaries strong with you.



  150.  #150Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    “Thank you Lucy but it was a simple question with only one real answer”

    this feels terrible to read. I feel really furious leading this.

    i don’t want to be talked down to or shamed



  151.  #151Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    “Jaquline – to me it feels really bad to feel like im being led socratically to a conclusion that im already aware of.

    “i don’t tolerate being talked to that way by a man, and I dont want to tolerate it from anyone else either”

    Precisely!!! Thank you, Daria, for helping me find ways to express those feelings and thoughts.



  152.  #152Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    aha! so you basically are saying to me I won’t answer questions as a way of not being controlled but in a nicer feminine way of I am honoring my very reasonable boundaries? okay, but you’d have a lot more power if you’d just leave out the nicer feminine way…..IMO….

    and that’s all the energy I have for this; and you don’t know what Erika would do, actually.

    Veiled hostility!!! mirror!!!

    would be more her style….



  153.  #153Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    I feel forced. I do not want to be led into a process that i am not willingly engaging in.

    omg this mirror thing for me is over the top

    i do NOT Want to come across like this to other people

    i KNOW that i do and have in the past

    it feels HORRIBLE

    i feel humiliated and furious receiving such words



  154.  #154Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    “haha weird. this was reminding me of Erika in the older days”

    Daria, lol. When I wrote that Erika would never do this, my brain said, well, maybe she would’ve in earlier days…. so I guess my intuition was right on that!



  155.  #155Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    Sorry Daria.



  156.  #156Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:44 pm

    I don’t want to be wrongfully accused of squishing someone, swallowing them, making them cry, squirting them with chemicals and putting them under a microscope? Hmmmmmm….does anyone care? doesn’t sound like it…..



  157.  #157Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:46 pm

    “but you’d have a lot more power if you’d just leave out the nicer feminine way”

    Haha. I respectfully disagree.

    And I will step out on a limb and say I believe YOU would have far more power if you learned Rori’s non-violent communication.



  158.  #158Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:46 pm

    i dont want to be told what to do. i don’t want to be disrespected.

    nicer and feminine don’t go together

    i don’t feel nice. i feel furious. i feel furious. i feel furious.

    i feel furious.

    it woudl feel sooo captivating to start attacking right now… ohhhh… i feel quivering just thinking about it, and i dont want to do that , because it doesnt feel good.

    i dont want to feel so furious and bad

    i love me

    i love my humiliation and fury and shacky powerlessness

    and heartbreak and unseeness and misunderstoodness

    i love me

    i love me

    i got my back.

    this doesn’t feel good.

    i feel sad.

    i feel so unseen.

    i don’t want to be told what to do, or talked down to.

    i feel so sad! it would feel good to feel connected and good

    waht do you think we can do?



  159.  #159Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    I feel so hurt that you would accuse me of wrongfully doing something to injure you or lible you, Lucy; and that you allow Erika so much more respect for her processes than you do me.

    It is painful to me that when Daria shows up you become emboldened to say oh, yeah, so now for sure I’m right.

    I will NOT be told how to talk, either – neither of you are seeing the mirror!



  160.  #160Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    Jacqueline, I DO care, very much! But I did NOT accuse you of those things. I’m sorry you feel bad!



  161.  #161Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:49 pm

    Jacqueline, I feel compassion for you around your feelings about Daria showing up — because I feel the same way when Amber is here with you.



  162.  #162Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:49 pm

    yeah… inner bonding woudl say… resisting answering questions is also a reaction based out of fear… the flip of the coin

    so to avoid attack/resist reaction to control…

    we can choose to respond as…

    oh this feels bad. i feel heartache… i would feel open to talking to you when it feels like a loving space to communicate… right now i don’t feel comfortable

    and im gonna go now



  163.  #163Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:49 pm

    Thank you for your opinion Lucy, I don’t agree. I am authentic, Rori told me to be, I didn’t see a limb and it’s almost tv time….so any last “points” you respectfully – and you saying that makes me feel disrespected actually, because if you didn’t disrespect me why would you even mention it?….need to be made. Not that I’m controlling what you say that’s been made clear.



  164.  #164Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:50 pm

    I am not telling you how to talk. You keep asking me to tell you how to talk to me, and I keep refusing to tell you how to talk! And you keep asking! But no, I don’t want to tell you how to talk to me or anybody else!



  165.  #165Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    Lucy it’s robotic, I put the I feel in there and you speak to me differently! That truly does feel weird and sad to me. And I’ve gotta run….I think Lizzie’s around to play with?

    Lizzie?



  166.  #166Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:52 pm

    I got the “repectfully disagree” idea from Amber, earlier today. Lol.



  167.  #167Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:52 pm

    oops, respectfully



  168.  #168Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:53 pm

    Jaqueline –

    this might help. i feel compassion. you seem like a very sensitive, deep woman

    you are not hearing Feelings the way a man would, and are feeling the feelings of the other empathically so deeply, that it triggers you painfully and you feel attacked, guilty for their feeling that way, and the defensive rebellious, angry for feeling that way

    the way feeling messages work is that… saying that a person feels a certain way doesn’t mean that its true. Lucy owns her feelings, as you say. and when she says them, they trigger feelings in you… thats how they work… what are those?



  169.  #169Daria on September 17, 2010 at 6:53 pm

    respectfully disagree feels bad to me



  170.  #170Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:54 pm

    It’s not robotic, it’s healing and bridging, and helps people connect and have relationships without judging or balming each other.



  171.  #171Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:54 pm

    that should be “blaming”



  172.  #172Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 6:55 pm

    “respectfully disagree feels bad to me”

    Yeah, it felt bad to me when it was addressed to me earlier today, but I thought it was “just me.”

    So, I’m sorry for using that phrase, jacqueline.



  173.  #173Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 6:58 pm

    I know you got my point, Lucy – and okay, I will just go with your answer that finally came out! I hope you feel empowered by it – that was my goal….and Amber isn’t me – she’s nicer. har….

    Thank you for going through this it is got to be a tool for everyone if they let it be, you know?

    Everyone will take what they want from it, but You spoke from a position of power in the I will not!!! statement, and I feel proud that we got there.

    btw, I’ve been meaning to say I watch Lie to Me on Hulu, it’s online free tv.

    Night now….oooooh, flashpoint’s on – I’m gonna chill.

    I do respect your processes Lucy, btw. Just don’t think I need to say that, it should be implied because I am not here to amuse myself I’m here to break through, and that might not be conflict resolution speak, it might just be me being me. My friend says even if every reaction I get is negative here, I’m still learning something.

    That’s it for and about me!

    J



  174.  #174Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    “I hope you feel empowered by it”

    No. Lol. I did not feel empowered by what you said or did.

    But you did help me with boundary practice! So that feels good!



  175.  #175Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    oh, and thanks for that – and it does hurt me to think of me terrorizing little you into feeling squished, etc. UGH! I cannot do that, really, and I guess that’s what I was going for, too.



  176.  #176Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    “I’m still learning something”

    That feels good to read!



  177.  #177Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:03 pm

    I feel scared that this will start all over again when someone else reads it.



  178.  #178Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:05 pm

    “….that was my goal….”

    I feel weird and yucky reading that.



  179.  #179Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:06 pm

    It’s starting! are you ready?

    i am now going to go back and analyze how LUCY’s statements would make me feel if i was trying to teach her something.



  180.  #180Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    but before i do that, i have a q.

    Lucy? is this similar to the way you felt when i was trying to teach you stuff back in teh day when we had a thing about TN man and i was pressuring you about doing it the rori way?



  181.  #181Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:17 pm

    WOW! This is really cool and fascinating!!!

    “Lucy it’s robotic, I put the I feel in there and you speak to me differently! That truly does feel weird and sad to me.”

    I actually did not even notice that Jacqueline started using feeling messages until just NOW when I looked back at the conversation!

    And it’s true — I automatically spoke to her differently! — without even consciously realizing that she had changed her approach — because I was no longer felt attacked and controlled — instead, I saw Jacqueline opening up her heart and sharing HER feelings and needs instead of laser-focusing on ME!

    WOW! If it changes the dynamic that well between women, imagine how it must be for men!! When we are soft, open, expressing our inner feelings, they can HEAR us! And they don’t feel attacked and controlled and manipulated!

    It feels like this was a huge experiment the universe did to prove the beauty of this approach!

    I feel sad and confused that it feels “weird and sad” to Jacqueline, though. 🙁 It feels GREAT to me to know that people can hear us better when we use these ways of communicating.



  182.  #182Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:19 pm

    “i am now going to go back and analyze how LUCY’s statements would make me feel if i was trying to teach her something.”

    Oh great. (sarcasm)

    I know that if I was trying to teach someone something and they already knew the thing that I was trying to teach them, they would be resistant — and it would probably be very frustrating for the tecaher!



  183.  #183Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:20 pm

    Jaqueline – it DOES feel weird that feeling messages work. but when i feel how GOOD it works, and how HAPPY i feel to be close to a person when i’ve said my feeling…

    it feels GOOD!

    not sad. i feel curious about this sad trigger. i feel sad hearing it. tell me more about sad?

    my gues… answering myself here… is that it’s like, sounds like we’re clannish or cultish or have conditioned ourselves in a way that feels disgusting.

    i love myself and my disgust of myself training myself to speak in a certain way to maintain human relationships

    i love my non competency and competency at being human

    i love me

    i love me

    i love you

    yeah

    i LOOK weird too. and SOUND weird. Adn ACT weird.

    and i feel very very (afraid) and big and powerful

    rauggh

    i am the goddess



  184.  #184Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:21 pm

    “Lucy? is this similar to the way you felt when i was trying to teach you stuff back in teh day when we had a thing about TN man and i was pressuring you about doing it the rori way?”

    Do you mean do I feel the same way now that I did then, or did I feel then the way Jacqueline seems to feel now?



  185.  #185Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:24 pm

    yah lucy, but im gonna pretend that im triggered by something im not seeing that im acting that way (wiht a man named Lucy) lol



  186.  #186Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:25 pm

    no,! did you feel then towards me the same way you feel now towards Jaqueline.

    cuz i feel like i was talking to you the way she just was kinda



  187.  #187Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:26 pm

    No, it felt different.



  188.  #188Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:27 pm

    I’m trying to think of how to explain the difference…..



  189.  #189Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:29 pm

    I guess with you, I felt you were supporting what Rori was teaching, so I could see where you were coming from . . . and the spirit of it just felt different… (ooh, I feel scared saying that)



  190.  #190Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 7:29 pm

    hi…omgosh, all the men on flashpoint are soooo hot! yes, Daria feels indoctrinated, but good, Lucy! I see that it works within the blog – I want to hear/see how it works with women vs. men, too….

    all part of femininity issues to me…

    thanks!!
    J



  191.  #191Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:30 pm

    With Jacqueline, it feels that she is resisting what we are trying to learn and do here (not saying that is true — I don’t know for sure — but that’s how it feels to me).



  192.  #192Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:31 pm

    Hi Jacqueline! It works FANTASTICALLY AMAZING in REAL LIFE with MEN!!!



  193.  #193Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:32 pm

    I wouldn’t have been talking about you in third person if I had known you were still here.

    Oh, that’s explaining. I guess I am trying to control something — yeah, I’m trying to prevent you from getting mad at being talked about in third person. Sorry for trying to control.



  194.  #194Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:35 pm

    And, jacqueline, it works well with women too. Much better than “you this, you that.” Works well with my mom and my daughter. We can hear each other better, and see each other’s hearts better.



  195.  #195Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 7:40 pm

    I am resisting changing the way I speak here and using this tool to in a sense, get my way. However, I am really trying hard to figure out what defines feminity as well. I am willing for the tool to be a means to auththentic communication; but I did not feel any authenticity behind Lucy’s words until she said I will not!!!! that’s when I felt emotion – all too often I hear Lucy talking about feelings but don’t feel anything. That’s a weird disconnect to me – and Lucy I’m talking about you in 3rd person cuz I’m just looking at it kind of like Daria is – how do we analyze it???

    What can we learn?

    Flashpoint on…..



  196.  #196Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:41 pm

    Daria, if I remember correctly, you were mostly using feeling messages, don’t wants, descriptions of Rori’s tools, with occassional “I want to fling you into outer space so you get this stuff through your thick head” remarks — those last kind were mostly the ones that triggered me.



  197.  #197Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:43 pm

    “but I did not feel any authenticity behind Lucy’s words until she said I will not!!!! that’s when I felt emotion”

    I assure you it was all authentic.



  198.  #198Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:45 pm

    “all too often I hear Lucy talking about feelings but don’t feel anything.”

    That’s because they are LUCY’S feelings. LUCY is feeling her feelings. You are feeling your OWN feelings. hehe.



  199.  #199Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:47 pm

    “I am resisting changing the way I speak here and using this tool to in a sense, get my way.”

    I feel curious, jacqueline…. why do you want to get your way? And what does that mean to you?



  200.  #200Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:47 pm

    If you feel like talking about it, that is. No pressure.



  201.  #201Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:49 pm

    Oh. I “explained” again in 196. I was trying to control how Jacqueline thinks and feels about me. Sorry again.

    This is kinda cool. Opportunities to identify when explaining is a form of control.



  202.  #202Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 7:51 pm

    Here is a do-over.

    “but I did not feel any authenticity behind Lucy’s words until she said I will not!!!! that’s when I felt emotion – all too often I hear Lucy talking about feelings but don’t feel anything. That’s a weird disconnect to me”

    I feel sad and pouty reading that. I don’t want people seeing me as inauthentic. I don’t want people feeling “weird disconnects” about me. I feel pain in my heart.



  203.  #203Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:53 pm

    I love bein indoctrinated. I am so wise and learned. I found the fountain of made sense and i can bucket out of it. Rori is never gonna run out. neither am i.

    i leave men mouth agape with my doctrine of goddessness and femininity and my ability to listen and express



  204.  #204Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 7:54 pm

    thanks, I just want to finish flashpoint and chill – I don’t want to manipulate people by toying, directing, subconciously verbally reinforcing anything with “feeling” messages. I want to feel people are free to speak in their voice. I want to know why people are hear using this tool, and I’ve asked for months for success stories, but I’m not really hearing any from lives. I’m hearing us all here telling each other how great this tool is.

    And, I do use Rori’s tools – it is this ingrained part of the background, subtext, etc. that I feel resistnace to, it does not feel authentic to me. And I wasn’t saying it was not authentic, I was saying I did not feel authenticity.

    So, over and out for tonite,

    Have a good one! and thanks!
    J



  205.  #205Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 7:57 pm

    ps….I said I want to not manipulate people to get my way – it’s also interesting what is heard vs what is said?! I am resisting using the tool to in a sense get my way – because I don’t want to get my way in an inauthentic way. I didn’t say I wanted to get my way….smile….



  206.  #206Daria on September 17, 2010 at 7:59 pm

    Jaqueline – “I am resisting changing the way I speak here and using this tool to in a sense, get my way”

    ohh! i invite you Dear Goddess in true mama Gena style to GET YOUR WAY and embrace it and use this tool to do that please ! don’t judge it bad. go for that! that would feel so good!

    yes to using this to get our way! i want to get my way! i love my way! i love yours too! use this to get your way i love that beautiful thought of yours

    i want to defend it. i want to encourage you and all of us to take the easy way, to get our way, to vote for us and let it be easy



  207.  #207Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:02 pm

    “I am investing a lot of energy and time to try and lead to a breakthrough in what I perceive to be Lucy’s circular conversations with and about me.”

    Okay, that feels really yucky to read. I don’t want people to spend time and energy trying to get ME to have a “breakthrough” because they “perceive” something about me. Eww, that feels really bad.

    I don’t want people to judge my conversations as circular.



  208.  #208Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:07 pm

    “I am resisting changing the way I speak here and using this tool to in a sense, get my way”



  209.  #209Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:14 pm

    “I don’t want to manipulate people by toying, directing, subconciously verbally reinforcing anything with “feeling” messages”

    – perhaps this can happen when someone is triggered and not using feeling messages properly, but tweaking their best to get there. i saw this happen a few times this convo wiht lucy, and it happens with me too. i can imagine it feels bad, ugh..

    feeling messages themselves tho, when THEY ARE the best expression of how a person feels, go right under the tension and mistrust and connect people on a heartlevel instantly… its a wonderful feeling

    and its worth tweaking for and occassionaly stumbling and putting an ‘i feel’ on a thought or a judgement – babysteps.

    ” I want to feel people are free to speak in their voice”

    oooh… this feels so fresh like fresh wind. i love this feeling thank you for this.

    ” I’ve asked for months for success stories, but I’m not really hearing any from lives.”

    i feel outraged at this and my first instinct is to scream this is a lie. and i dont want to do that. that feels terrible to hear. i feel unseen and humiliated and told im nothing and that my words dont matter. this feels horrible

    “it is this ingrained part of the background, subtext, etc. that I feel resistnace to, it does not feel authentic to me”

    i feel curious, and excited. tell me more about this, i feel confused about THIS part … that you are referring to that you feel resistance to

    “And I wasn’t saying it was not authentic, I was saying I did not feel authenticity.”

    I hear you. This was heard. i can understand something not feeling authentic and i feel excited that i believe i Can dispell that feeling and present the wisdom in a way that resonates, i feel so intrigued about your trigger… it is triggering me too…
    tell me more



  210.  #210Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:15 pm

    Oh! NOW I get what you were trying to say!

    “I don’t want to use feeling messages to manipulate people to get my own way.”

    I do have a hard time following your writing style/grammar at times, Jacqueline, which is why I often ask, “What do you mean?”

    “What do you mean?” is always a sincere question for me, an attempt to clarify what the other person is saying when I don’t fully understand.



  211.  #211Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:17 pm

    it feels weird to see …smile… when someone seems angry. i feel mistrustful and disconnected, i feel sad that im not connected to the truth of this person they are not being real with me when they are smilikng over feeling angry



  212.  #212joan on September 17, 2010 at 8:19 pm

    Quote Daria:
    my gues… answering myself here… is that it’s like, sounds like we’re clannish or cultish or have conditioned ourselves in a way that feels disgusting.

    I can only answer for myself.

    Yes, it feels clannish. In order to be acknowledged, you have speak just like everyone else.

    Yes, it feels cultish in a Stepford Wife, check your brain at the keyboard, kind of way.

    No, Feeling Messages don’t feel disgusting … they feel LIMITING.

    It baffles me that Feeling Messages are the only Rori tool that spark such controvery here. I’ve never seen anybody getting this passionate because someone didn’t use the Soft Shoulders, Dance Position, Waterwheel, Yummy Pie, Anchor, or any of the other tools.

    Even Rori wrote that her tools are not “one size fits all”. Feeling Messages do not fit all.

    Yet, even some of those who do not want to be limited to speaking in Feeling Messages have still put forth the effort, only to end up being told that they aren’t using the right words. They’re told that there are only the BASIC FOUR primary feelings. That’s discounting that person’s experience of what they’re feeling and what words they choose to express it.

    It’s like telling someone that there are only three primary colors – red, blue, and yellow. It completely discounts that they see fuschia, magenta, olive green, taupe, etc.



  213.  #213Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:25 pm

    There are four primary emotions:

    Anger, Sadness, Happiness, and Fear

    there are infinate of shades and mixes of feleings, like colors.

    we worked hard to identify these. we did a lot of deep dives.

    oops and i feel triggered. thats whats going on here.

    Joan you are triggered to resitance and mistrust.

    i assure you that it feels good over here. i know what it feels like to feel resistant and mistrustful and i feel empathy. mmm… maybe you can experiment with feeling messages in a safe context.. this blog is a safe context for me… and see how they feel to you?

    and use the 4 primary feeling as a framework that we made up to Help us, get in our feelings, but not to limit us to using only 4 feelings.

    only to help us identify them, sometimes when we ask… how do i feel?



  214.  #214Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:26 pm

    I feel sad about using feeling messages improperly. I feel frustrated that I am not as good at using them properly as I want to be. I don’t want to trigger people by using them improperly.

    I feel a lil glad . . . just a lil . . . that this was good practice in TRYING to use feeling messages properly in a very difficult, heart-pounding, real-time situation.



  215.  #215Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:27 pm

    ps the stepford wife . checking brains at the door.

    im a very brainy person. likea college test acer kinda brainy person who doesnt have to study much

    the work we’re doing here, takes a LOT of brains.

    it takes more, (beautiful = yum) brains, than the masculine way of using brains

    its more like using brains in a right brain feminine way

    its quite a brain workout

    my brain says yum joan

    and we can throw in some cool Passion Stories, about our interests with our brains out in the world, when we want to share about what inspires us



  216.  #216Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:28 pm

    Lucy – you;re doing great!



  217.  #217joan on September 17, 2010 at 8:30 pm

    Joan you are triggered to resitance and mistrust.

    Daria, please don’t presume to tell me how I feel.



  218.  #218Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:31 pm

    Feeling messages feel limiting to me in the sense that they limit how much we can hurt other people with our words.

    Feeling messages feel limitless to me in the sense that they open up more opportunity for intimacy, connection, and understanding.



  219.  #219Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:34 pm

    Joan – yeah, I realize that was directive and assuming, and I felt afraid to say it, and at the same time i knew it would feel better to say what i meant even if it wasnt the perfect words that came to me.

    sorry for triggering you on that.

    i don’t like being asked to please do stuff in a directive way, that feels bad and i don’t want to be talked to that way. i feel angry



  220.  #220Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:34 pm

    Aw, thank you so much, Daria! I feel so bad for my missteps because they may have hurt Jacqueline. 🙁 When I read some of your words on this thread, I think, da*n, why didn’t I think of expressing it that way??? . . . because you were saying everything I felt, but saying it 🙁 better.

    Jacqueline, I am sorry if I unintentionally hurt you with any of my words.



  221.  #221Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:39 pm

    “it takes more, (beautiful = yum) brains, than the masculine way of using brains”

    Daria, that’s a really interesting point! It DOES take a lot of brains! It’s a lot easier being on the debate team and using linear logic to win arguments!



  222.  #222Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 8:49 pm

    Lucy, I am telling you that that WAS my attempted gift to you! I want to feel your feeling messages, and yes, it was practice; and a little bit of getting in your face about you and Nikita saying stuff that I think you thought I’d ignore…..but the ONLY reason I’d deprive myself of an hour of friday nite tv that wasn’t WRESTLING….was to actually try and force, and I know WE don’t force here….but I just kept pushing…..to get to that breakthrough. It’s what Laughing Goddess was talking about, eventually we will be friends, but we have to get there. My heart pounded too, but I was going to do it no matter what – well I wasn’t going to get ugly, but I was going to work with you as long as I could take it to find a feeling place with you. And then I got you – I am NOT!!!! – it was good, Lucy, and I don’t have hurt feelings and even if I did, it was still good. Yes we are all bright – and so it’s EASY to play with words, it’s soooo much harder to stay authentic. And you don’t have to talk feeling to do that, it just shows up.



  223.  #223Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 8:51 pm

    Hi JOAN>……wow, it’s so good to have you back! Please come visit and play more often!!!



  224.  #224AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 8:53 pm

    Ladies, Divas, Sirens, Saints, Sinners…

    Damn. I missed the party. Before I start into this tornado I want to say hello and tell you that I love you.

    But not in a creepy way. The thing is, I love me. And I’m in a really awesome place right now, so I am looking forward to healing a part of myself tonight, gently and with love and understanding and acceptance.

    And I’d like to check in with Daria and say Hey! And I have the coolest stuff in my vision about you today. And I was re-reading a couple old threads looking for a flip list you did for someone (I wanted to share it with my daughter) anyway- I couldn’t find it. But I just was blown away at how different you are now. And I’ve been meaning to say this for a while- who you are now, the Daria I experience here, she would never make the choices that the Daria you used to be made. And if I didn’t know from you telling me (and your old posts) I would never believe that other Daria was you.



  225.  #225Daria on September 17, 2010 at 8:54 pm

    umm.. what? i feel confused about what part connected you to Lucy Jaqueline?

    and i feel curious about why i get so triggered that you were tryina show lucy something… when i try to show people stuff all the time

    it feels weird because to me it seemed that lucy already knew that her feelings belonged to her?

    i feel confused – and words are magical. when feelings are expressed in words, it opens up the authenticity… that what’s felt is in resonance with what is expressed in speech… and it feels trustworthy



  226.  #226Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:55 pm

    Argh. I feel frustrated! I feel frustrated that this is not over! I feel afraid that it will NEVER be resolved.

    “a little bit of getting in your face about you and Nikita saying stuff that I think you thought I’d ignore”

    I don’t want people getting in my face.

    I don’t want people thinking that I think things will be ignored when I don’t think that at all. I don’t want people presuming to know what I think.

    I feel angry.



  227.  #227AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 8:56 pm

    Jacqueline!!!!!! You’re here (still)! SWEET! I’m just catching up, but I’m happy to ‘see’ you!



  228.  #228Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:56 pm

    I feel relieved reading what Daria just wrote. I feel understood and seen and heard.



  229.  #229Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 8:58 pm

    “a little bit of getting in your face about you and Nikita saying stuff that I think you thought I’d ignore”

    Hmmm. Now it feels kinda good to hear intentions clearly expressed.



  230.  #230Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 8:59 pm

    @ Daria – you are always so profound when you wanna be and aren’t eating dirt and being Daisy…heee…..that I did not get that that was a function of feeling messages. So how were you prior to feeling messages? And thanks because this convo felt much more open to me, too….

    and everyone will wish they had breakthroughs after breakthroughs, too!

    My breakthroughs were: I felt Lucy and heard her without just hearing waaaahwaaaahwaaaaahhhhhhh like the adult’s voices on Charlie Brown, I heard her trying to stand in her own truth and finally even say her truth. That felt like a huge weight off my shoulders, somehow – like NOW we can talk, and I know she’s analytical so we’ll get back into it now an then but now we have this common place where we were both vulnerable and more intimate and real, so we won’t go backwards from there.

    And my breakthrough was I did not feel afraid of Daria’s voice, but more intrigued by it, especially when it was used to consider both sides of the conversation. I felt more respect for Daria because she was not just saying how she felt but also doing some explaining in a cool way, while still saying how she felt.

    I felt happy another “somewhat skeptical” siren showed up and joined in the conversation, and I feel like a lot of folks left and I hope they all show back up soon!

    And that’s my intention for this Sunday thing with Erika, I won’t be on the phone but I’m holding the space for the blog to accept every voice on here and offer something of value to everyone on here. And to hold everyone here as if they were very special and heard.

    Thank you Lucy, thank you Daria, thank you Joan!

    Nite now,
    Jacqueline



  231.  #231Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:00 pm

    I feel confused about what breakthrough you were trying to get to, Jacqueline. I feel confused about whether or not you feel like you acheived your desired breakthrough.

    I don’t people forcing their agendas on me. That feels ewww and horrible and a pain in my heart.



  232.  #232Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:01 pm

    *don’t want



  233.  #233AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:01 pm

    Daria (and everyone else)

    I could never hear that Lucy owned her feelings. All I could ever hear was avoidance and deflection and martyr/victim.

    So you have better hearing than I do.

    And yes, you do try to help people break through here. Sometimes it works, sometimes we take a little longer to land on your page. I do that too. In fact, I tried once to do it with Lucy (Hello Lucy!) and al I got was deflection, so I gave up. I have an amazing amount of respect for Jlina hanging in there tonight to try and get completion.



  234.  #234AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:02 pm

    oh Lucy! I’m rooting for you. I just KNOW you can GET THIS!!!



  235.  #235Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:02 pm

    “but I was going to work with you as long as I could take it to find a feeling place with you.”

    I don’t want to be talked to that way.

    I feel mega weird reading this. I feel creeped out.



  236.  #236Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 9:03 pm

    ooooh! Amber!!!! I kind of picked up the circular arguement thingy and went around and around with Lucy who gamely hung in there, and who said she feels ganged up on when we’re both here….which is funny cuz I’m just off now….

    I agree Daria is amazing, and I also agree that I like it when you talke a second look at what I say Lucy, I think you will feel the gentleness and authenticness in it if you try???

    Group hug!!!!

    Nite to all sirens everywhere,
    Jlinaangelinavivianbrielle



  237.  #237AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:04 pm

    That’s something Lucy said to Jacqueline at some prior point.

    And I had a serious problem with it. I feel yucky and condescended to. It doesn’t matter how sincere Lucy was. TO ME it was condescending.



  238.  #238Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:07 pm

    “and finally even say her truth”

    I feel annoyed reading that because I have been saying my truth all along.

    But I feel glad that you are saying you finally HEARD it.

    ….although I do not feel heard at all…..



  239.  #239Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 9:08 pm

    Lucy, I’ve gotta go, but it was a compliment to you that I would spend all that time and energy to get you to say something that felt really real to me. It’s not making you WRONG, it’s making Your RIGHT!!!

    I was afraid to say what my breakthroughs were because I feared you’d take that like that, but if someone spends two hours working with me – say Daria, or Amber, I know they are doing it cuz they really want me to have some sort of miracle. It’s NOT saying you were doing it wrong it’s saying for me it felt better and different!…., and no matter what I say I think that it will still trigger neg. voices for you, so I’ll leave it like that. I vote for miracles happen!!!



  240.  #240AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:09 pm

    And this “I don’t people forcing their agendas on me. That feels ewww and horrible and a pain in my heart.”

    Is how I felt about how the Rori way was being presented to Jacqueline.



  241.  #241Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:10 pm

    “and al I got was deflection”

    Hi Amber. I feel annoyed reading this. I don’t want people falsely accusing me of things.



  242.  #242AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:11 pm

    But before I say anything else- I want to say to Lucy that I’m sorry if I caused her any kind of distress or discomfort or sadness. I’ve been processing here and I can totally imagine that it’s pretty hard to get the separation when someone is totally tweaking of your posts, and then saying- JUST IGNORE ME.



  243.  #243Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:11 pm

    “I could never hear that Lucy owned her feelings. All I could ever hear was avoidance and deflection and martyr/victim.”

    I feel sad that that’s all you heard, Amber. I wonder why you heard that……

    “So you have better hearing than I do.”

    Yep! 🙂



  244.  #244Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:13 pm

    “I kind of picked up the circular arguement thingy”

    I feel amused, truly amused by this circular argument assertion.



  245.  #245AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:14 pm

    Ok Lucy. You just keep feeling that. I’m fine with your discomfort. I’m actually fine with everything right now. This is me saying how I experienced things.



  246.  #246Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:16 pm

    “but it was a compliment to you that I would spend all that time and energy to get you to say something that felt really real to me.”

    I do not feel that as a compliment, Jacqueline.

    I don’t want people to try to “get me to say something.” I don’t want people to try to control me. I don’t want people to force their personal agendas on me. I don’t want people to act like they did me a favor when they didn’t.

    I don’t want to feel bullied.



  247.  #247Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:18 pm

    “but if someone spends two hours working with me – say Daria, or Amber, I know they are doing it cuz they really want me to have some sort of miracle.”

    I spent two hours working with YOU, Jacqueline! Funny how you see it so differently!

    I was hoping that you would have some sort of miracle, but it doesn’t look like it happened.



  248.  #248Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:21 pm

    yah remember : truth without kindness is not truth. babysteps to truth. we are practicing. yay. we all intend well, once we feel safe



  249.  #249Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:22 pm

    Well, I still feel hopeful that Jacqueline will get it. And Amber too.

    Even though right now it feels hopeless.

    I feel amazed by how differently Jacqueline and Amber see this whole thing.



  250.  #250Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:23 pm

    I feel horrible.



  251.  #251AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    Lucy.

    I don’t believe that you have better ‘hearing’ than me. Sadly. I believe you have the exact same hearing I do. I said Daria has better hearing.

    So 241 is upsetting to me. That’s okay. Maybe you need to be loved some more.

    Can you help me see you better?



  252.  #252Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    I feel pain in my chest.

    I feel stunned that this happened AGAIN.

    But I did say the other day that I was afraid it would……



  253.  #253Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:24 pm

    Lucy – STOP. pause.

    ““but it was a compliment to you that I would spend all that time and energy to get you to say something that felt really real to me.”

    I do not feel that as a compliment, Jacqueline.

    I don’t want people to try to “get me to say something.” I don’t want people to try to control me. I don’t want people to force their personal agendas on me. I don’t want people to act like they did me a favor when they didn’t.

    I don’t want to feel bullied.

    STOP pause. i feel curious how you would redo this in all about you short authentic feeling, truth, what do u think format



  254.  #254Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:26 pm

    “I don’t believe that you have better ‘hearing’ than me.”

    Amber, I knew you were not referring to me. 🙂

    I just quoted it and responded to your original intent. I am truly glad that Daria hears me better than you do.



  255.  #255AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:27 pm

    I am so tempted to go to logic here. Lucy doesn’t see things the way I do. So I want to prove my viewpoint. That feels unwhole.

    I feel torn apart. I feel separation. I feel hurt.



  256.  #256Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    I feel annoyed and oh lord and throwing my hands up and irritated by all the noise and the popcorn throwing and the mess amber and lucy are making in the kitchen! ugh! i feel irritated that i dont get chres done when i have friends sleep over



  257.  #257AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    Hey! Look!

    Connection!

    We both feel horrible. Can I stay with that? Can I accept that Lucy’s horrible is just as valid and authentic and in need of love as mine?



  258.  #258Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:29 pm

    Amber, that feels interesting! I have been SO tempted to go to logic throughout this whole thing! Logic is waaaay easier!



  259.  #259Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:30 pm

    I’m “blaming” lucy and amber and going into peacemaker role. hmm… feels interesting. i feel GOOD in this role.

    i feel worthy and like im sure tat im the good one now… hmmm

    i love my feelings



  260.  #260Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:30 pm

    You feel horrible too? Thanks for telling me that! Wow. It feels good to hear your feelings. Really.



  261.  #261Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:31 pm

    yes! everyone love their horrible!

    i love my horrible feeling!

    i love your horrible feeling!

    i love all our horrible feelings!

    ohh that feels scary as my horrible feelings stir. i love my feelings



  262.  #262Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:31 pm

    Lol. Daria, yes, you’re the good one now. 🙂



  263.  #263Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:32 pm

    I want to do your suggested re-do if you still think it’s a good idea. What do you think?



  264.  #264AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:32 pm

    Daria.

    Why do you feel like I am making a mess? I feel sad, like someone just walked into my room and told me I was being bad.

    Is there a better way to do this? Because now I’m feeling pissed.

    It’s not your kitchen anyway. And it feels like you don’t hear anything positive I say. Do you have a problem accepting compliments?



  265.  #265Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:33 pm

    My horrible feelings feel so horrible that my heart physically hurts. I love? my horrible hurting-heart feelings…..?



  266.  #266Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    Not just hurts, but real, actual pain.



  267.  #267AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    Mreow. Okay. That last line was because I feel hurt.

    Hrm.



  268.  #268Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:35 pm

    Maybe I need this practice because maybe my true love is going to “get in my face” this way someday and I am now being trained to handle it super-well.



  269.  #269AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    How funny! Daria’s hearing. Not better after all.

    All equal. All flawed. All seeing to be heard.



  270.  #270Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    Getting the broom to sweep up the popcorn…..



  271.  #271Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:37 pm

    Or maybe I’ll bring the dog in to eat it.



  272.  #272Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:38 pm

    Amber – can you speak spefically about the decisions and what you heard from me that has shown i’ve changed? i feel really curious to have some way to represent this for msyelf too!

    and i want to see what struck you!



  273.  #273AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:39 pm

    Lucy- Maybe so! Or here’s a reframe for ya- maybe this isn’t “getting in your face” and maybe your communication isn’t how I experience it either.

    So if we can heal this and both be whole we can open up SO MUCH SPACE in ourselves and save ourselves so much pain.

    I’m game. You?



  274.  #274Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:40 pm

    Amber, I was referring to Jacqueline telling me that she was “getting in my face.” Her words.



  275.  #275Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:41 pm

    yeah lucy! redo it!



  276.  #276AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:41 pm

    Okay. You mentioned the other day (in a convo with Mercedes about dating men you aren’t attracted to) that you do date those men, because you are learning to be attracted to better (ah- edit) HEALTHIER men.

    And when you described the situation you’d left I was like NO WAY. There is NO WAY Daria would EVER put up with that shit.



  277.  #277Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:42 pm

    I would not have framed it that way. In fact, I felt surprised when she said that’s what she was doing! I didn’t know she was deliberately trying to “get in my face.”



  278.  #278Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:43 pm

    I will try, Daria. Will you help me tweak it?



  279.  #279Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:44 pm

    I’m game — which is why I am here. 🙂



  280.  #280Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:45 pm

    That last one was the answer to Amber’s question to me.



  281.  #281AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:45 pm

    Lucy- 274- Thank you.

    Also.

    I hear that your heart hurts. And I’m feeling concerned. I don’t want you to hurt.



  282.  #282Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:46 pm

    “I hear that your heart hurts. And I’m feeling concerned. I don’t want you to hurt.”

    Thanks, Amber! That feels good to read.



  283.  #283Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:48 pm

    Amber – the mess reference was a jokey way of saying i felt triggered and suddenly saw myself in that vision and started experiencing things from there… which was fun to notice esp because clearly you guys were not at my house sleeping over, but someone is , and it triggered me that way, showing how triggers set the frame for how we react… and how its important to STOP pause… reframe as the divine goddesses we are speaking our truth with non blame.

    i caught myself blaming you guys basically. i didn not mean that you were oding that, just that i got triggered to a vision of that sleepover and felt that energy, which was really my trigger



  284.  #284Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:49 pm

    Amber – what situation was it? tell me more?



  285.  #285AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:50 pm

    Daria- Earlier today I was realizing that SOME of the men you CD have NO IDEA how to interact with you. And I was laughing because in my head I though- well, they’ve never met a goddess before. And I laughed and laughed at that. Because it’s true and also really makes for some comical behavior on their part. They have no context to place you in. The not wanting to pay and not wanting to drive to you and their approach is just so not geared towards a goddess.



  286.  #286Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:50 pm

    Lucy – yeah i will help if you want.



  287.  #287Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:51 pm

    Amber – yes, its my challenge as a goddess to be such a godess that i inspire that in them, maybe for the very first time ever, to step into a conventional romantic role



  288.  #288AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:53 pm

    So I started wondering about that. About how to communicate context to them. And then today there was the thing with men and warning labels and I thought THAT’S IT. Daria needs a warning label. Or a little introductory spiel, like back of a wine bottle. Listing your qualities.



  289.  #289Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 9:54 pm

    Daria,

    original:

    ““but it was a compliment to you that I would spend all that time and energy to get you to say something that felt really real to me.”

    I do not feel that as a compliment, Jacqueline.

    I don’t want people to try to “get me to say something.” I don’t want people to try to control me. I don’t want people to force their personal agendas on me. I don’t want people to act like they did me a favor when they didn’t.

    I don’t want to feel bullied.

    …………………

    Redo:

    I feel amazed and angry reading that. I feel bewildered hearing “it was a compliment.” I don’t want people to try to get me to do something. I feel completely astounded by this whole thing. What do you think?



  290.  #290AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 9:57 pm

    284- RE- Your ex BF and the guy that your friend is with now. He treated you with disrespect, and he didn’t honor and pursue you. And you have boundaries now and believe in yourself. From what I read it seemed like that was not true before. And I can’t imagine you without them.



  291.  #291Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:57 pm

    Amber thank you. I feel seen and i feel like its all ok when i read what you said about how some men i cd have no idea how to interact with me



  292.  #292Daria on September 17, 2010 at 9:59 pm

    yes, im learning how to do that introductory spiel in a non man triggering way.

    something like. im a goddess, and im the kind of woman that wants a man to be in charge of dating, and to be romantic. im looking for my forever after relationship to get married and have a family.

    pause. silence. breathe and feel the air as the magic spirit place. expand



  293.  #293AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:00 pm

    RE 287- Yes, you do do that. BUT. I am feeling the edges of a shift here. You do that with words. And I feel something huge welling up- and it’s that you are worthy of more. And I’m not talking about different men. That too, but more of an aura. More vibe. Less explaining.

    And here’s what is true FOR ME on this.



  294.  #294AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:04 pm

    As long as I have ANY doubt about something. Doubt about my own worth in relation to something. Or doubt about my right to want something. Or doubt about what my wanting that something means. As long as their is uncertainty in me over it, I will radiate uncertainty. And the people I interact with will mirror that back.



  295.  #295Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    yay me!!

    Lucy, try again, make it simple from your heart of the don’t wants, without guessing (as i’ve been doing also) at a metaphor or way to describe the other person’s behavior

    ie… i am gonna babystep to move away from…

    i dont want to be talked to like an evil dragon monster is trying to eat me

    to…

    i don’t want to feel …. (blank? lol)



  296.  #296Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:07 pm

    Amber – exactly! about uncertainty! so im practicing, tweaking, gettin closer to express my truth in a way that feels the BEST… and most flowy and yummy!

    and i think thats what Erika be getting at with the “clear your vibe and you’ll get what you want”



  297.  #297Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:07 pm

    Daria, even when she SAID she was trying to get me to do something, so it’s not guessing?



  298.  #298AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:08 pm

    So in order to truly have what I want, I have to accept my worthiness not just to have it, but to want it. And I hear you riffing this out, too. You already do this.

    Once I ‘get clear’ on whatever it is, I have to give it to myself. To open the channel for receiving. This clears away ALL of the uncertainty, because even if the doubts come back, others can see that I already have it, and so they don’t question that they should participate in me having it.



  299.  #299Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    I feel amazed and angry reading that. I feel bewildered hearing “it was a compliment.” I don’t want to feel horrified. I feel completely astounded by this whole thing. What do you think?

    Horrified? Lol. That’s how it feels.



  300.  #300AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:11 pm

    Lucy,

    Thank you for giving me the space to get all of that written out.

    Are you feeling any safer with me? I’m feeling more relaxed. I like that you’re just over there, doing your thing. I like feeling like we’re just hanging out in the same room, not triggering each other.



  301.  #301Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:11 pm

    I feel horrified. I don’t want to feel horrified. What do you think?



  302.  #302Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:12 pm

    Lucy – looking at what she said in particular is not helpful unless thats where the crux of the trigger was.

    go deeper. assume positive intent on her part. shes a goddess



  303.  #303Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 10:12 pm

    hi! I came back to close out the computer and yall are still here!! and it is so WEIRD/COINCIDENTAL that I want to say to Lucy that you need to give me the benefit of the doubt there. I didn’t mean it in a bullying way (I often feel bullied on here, too interesting) but what I meant was I was literally doing an est training exercise where I was attempting to MIRROR you and get deeper and deeper into you by asking the same question over and over….leadign to a euraka moment. Can you suspend disbelief and just get how that made me happy when there was maybe 5 minutes there where we were both just breathing in relief? and not get so triggered and attached at my lack of complete explanation skills. I KNOW you felt it….and then it seemed you went back into your head to hear neg. voices. My voice to you was not negative!!! You said I wanted to squish/sqash you, etc. I HEAR you on the reframe, and this is me reacting to your request to be heard. so it’s a good thing, okay?

    Now you all I don’t want you to have a FOOD FIGHT without me!!! but gotta go hug the guy….

    Nite nite….
    J



  304.  #304Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:14 pm

    Amber yoou are so right on. This feels thrilling. thank you. this is so helpful. i feel excited to hear more!



  305.  #305Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 10:15 pm

    OMG*****ddess!!!!!!…..DARIA you just said the same dang thing?!!!! Wow your skills are really expanding exponentially – ha! and you said it in one dang sentence!!!! Whooooweeeee…..

    Hugs everyfabulousity woman here!!!



  306.  #306Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:15 pm

    I have to accept my worthiness not just to have it, but to want it

    babysteps. yes. yum.. to get my pussy licked. haha.



  307.  #307Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:18 pm

    Amber, I don’t know. I feel uncertain. I hear you feeling better, and that feels good.



  308.  #308AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:21 pm

    There’s another component of this- energy wise – around the wanting. And I am really sad and I feel really shitty about this- but I have to go to sleep. It’s 1:18 and I have to work tomorrow.

    Lucy- I do not feel good that I am leaving you here still agitated. I don’t know how to tell you this in words we both speak, but I’m going to try. And I’m asking beforehand that you blank everything completely out. Everything I’ve ever said, every feeling you’ve ever had when you read my words.



  309.  #309Daria on September 17, 2010 at 10:22 pm

    Jaqueline – i feel curious and sparked to hear that you reached a point that you felt like you heard Lucy using the communicationo technique you were trying out

    it feels cool to have you feel her

    my guess is we feel that way when we connect thru the feelings to someone

    mmm…

    however the repeated question felt awful and browbeating to me…

    and i didnt notice when you felt that sparkle, it felt too triggering from this side



  310.  #310AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:23 pm

    Lucy- Can I ask you for a HUGE favor? Can you imagine that you are just meeting me tonight, right now? So what I say (write) next is pretty much the first thing you’ve ever seen me write?



  311.  #311AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:25 pm

    Okay- my boundary. I’m loving myself here and going to bed. Maybe we’ll try this again.

    Goodnight goddesses!

    Believe.



  312.  #312AmberS on September 17, 2010 at 10:26 pm


  313.  #313Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:26 pm

    I get the concept of that, Amber, being in the Now . . . I will try . . . but I feel a lil scared like, you know, like we feel scared of things that have felt bad to us before….



  314.  #314Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:28 pm

    Yeah, that’s great stuff, Amber. I’m a big fan of Michael Brown, Francis Lucille, Eckhart Tolle . . . many others in the advaita tradition…



  315.  #315Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:30 pm

    Not to mention TN man . . . hehe



  316.  #316Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:33 pm

    Jacqueline, I will try to give you the benefit of the doubt. I do agree with what Daria wrote in 309, but I will try to believe you.



  317.  #317Lucy on September 17, 2010 at 10:33 pm

    I guess Amber went to bed. Goodnight.



  318.  #318Jacqueline on September 17, 2010 at 11:16 pm

    Lucy, thank you – I really feel a lot closer to you and to knowing who you are and to admiring you. You have a big heart, you hang in here with us/me, and you might be scared but you don’t back away. I hope you feel you know me better too, and continue to give me and we all continue to give all of us the benefit of the doubt.

    I want this blog to support all of us, and to talk in my voice even if it is in baby steps, and I don’t want to feel big and crushing and I want you to feel good, too.

    Hope you do and will come to believe I really meant this as a compliment to getting to know you deeply.



  319.  #319Laughing goddess on September 18, 2010 at 12:31 am

    Just finished playing at this party. I feel so good. I feel so happy with the group. We feel so much more connected and in sync after burning man. I left the party to take my friend home. She wasn’t feeling well. I feel so good sitting in my car and catching up with you all…taking a break from the party.

    I feel happy and at peace.



  320.  #320BarbinOz on September 18, 2010 at 3:35 am

    I feel horrible and yucky about all this stuff that has gone on with this blog this past day, probably why so few others have posted too…………………….yuck, yuck, yuck……….



  321.  #321Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:42 am

    awww… i feel sad you feel so triggered by it to yuckiness… i feel misunderstood… i feel really happy! about the intense practice we got



  322.  #322Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:43 am

    probably why so few others have posted feels bad to hear… i feel angry reading that. i dont want to assume something that feels bad

    i don’t want to feel ashamed or blamed for expressing myself

    i feel sad



  323.  #323Marcus on September 18, 2010 at 3:53 am

    Just a general comment, althought I am male, this has helped me to understand the other side, what you girls are trying to do, how it affects you and why you do the things you do. It will certaiitly help with friends of mine who have trouble with their boyfriends etc. Although some things on here I don’t agree with, I admit I understand more about you girls than about my owm gender. Keep up the good work in helping each other out.



  324.  #324Lizzie on September 18, 2010 at 5:47 am

    Good morning sirens – WOW! I feel a ton of controlling man energy in early posts and the most amazing shift to feminine energy. That feels just lovely lovely lovely.

    I am off for a run. Never did hear back from Family Guy. Interesting.



  325.  #325life_is_too_short_to... on September 18, 2010 at 6:05 am

    Good morning all–

    Sometimes the interactions on these blogs are like imaginary relationships. By reading words only, I may then ascribe all kinds of motivations, intentions, feelings, qualities to the author. I may even be totally convinced I am right on, I may become emotionally invested in being right about it. especially if I have been reading certain people for a while.

    I find it more helpful and useful to simply read the words that are there and what the actual words are conveying. There may be a subtext there, but I have to be real careful about jumping to conclusions.

    I would have to ask a tremendous amount of questions to discern what you could discern in much less time if you had the benefit of voice, body language, etc.

    I believe, especially in these written word only venues, in saying what you mean and meaning what you say. I find that I don’t always say exactly what I mean, which may cause misunderstanding.
    Then I can go back and clarify. It’s all good practice.

    This is another reason why having a conversation about something significant through text messaging isn’t a great idea.

    Another good reason not to have a long distance intimate relationship where you don’t get to actually be with the person ever.

    L



  326.  #326Denise on September 18, 2010 at 6:24 am

    #324

    Very good post Life….I especially like the comment about long distance, electronic relationships. It takes time and lots of interaction to get to know someone, and to know if they are right for you. Dating is meant to be done in person…after all, the internet has only been around a very, very short time. 🙂 So I guess it’s a matter of how one wants to expend their energy and effort in regard to finding the right partner to share their life.



  327.  #327Brenda on September 18, 2010 at 6:26 am

    Mornin Sirens!

    Ya wanna know how limiting my beliefs are?

    In my efforts to be out in public and meet men, I totally overlooked the manager of a restaurant where I am a regular! I’ve been acquainted with him over a year, and he’s very kind and handsome (I don’t know that much about him).

    Because I’m overweight, I just assume men won’t be attracted to me. Many men aren’t, but I can see I need to change that belief. Last night he sat down at my table and chatted for about 20 minutes. He asked me twice if I would be back this weekend! And he talked more on a personal level, not as a manager. So I think he’s attracted…very fun!



  328.  #328Renee on September 18, 2010 at 6:31 am

    Just had an interesting txt exchange with Nashville guy (yes, the one who jerked me around forever…but that’s beside the point at the moment). He sent me a picture of an old Kenmore sewing machine ad from the 50’s that showed a man and woman beside a sewing machine — the woman had her head leaned against the man’s shoulder and the headline read, “Kenmore — keeping women in their place for more than 40 years”.

    I wrote back that the ad was funny, but that there was something sweet about that era with the big, strong man taking care of his lovely, little lady. He replied:

    NM: That’s right! There wasn’t anything disrespectful and men dug deep to take care of the woman. Now you have a few bulls that have screwed it up for all. Now a man feels shamed if he acts like a caregiver!

    Isn’t that interesting? I still have a soft spot in my heart for this guy, though he’s pretty toxic and my experience tells me he’s never going to step up the way I would like, but we’re having quite the conversation right now about men’s and women’s roles and the rate of divorce. I just told him a little about this blog and how when women stay in their feminine energy that men & women seem to be able to get to the heart of the matter more easily when disagreements arise and are able to resolve them more peacfully.

    I’ve been so busy with work these past few days that I’ve missed all you wonderful sirens, but I just read most of the posts in this blog and it seems like progress is definitely being made for many of you! Have a wonderful day you lovely goddesses!



  329.  #329Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 6:32 am

    Yay Brenda! Receive!!!



  330.  #330Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 6:43 am

    I’m off to my daughter’s soccer game … really hoping that Soccer Dad will ask for my contact info today!



  331.  #331Renee on September 18, 2010 at 6:47 am

    Feeling — just curious…what were you referring to when you said to Brenda “Receive!!”?



  332.  #332life_is_too_short_to... on September 18, 2010 at 7:05 am

    I just really don’t want to compromise my individuality in order to be a Siren who has ALL the men fawning over her and her feminine power.

    I am a person who gets great satisfaction from doing things for people that will make them happy, without expectation of something in return, except maybe appreciation. I am able to receive compliments and gifts well also, as long as they don’t come with expectations.

    I have stopped giving to much to men who I am interested in, esp in the beginning, because I know they see it as the woman is after something.

    Once you are in a relationship though, men love to be taken care of, and love you for it.

    The trouble with my LD man was that he was showering me with gifts in mixed messages. He liked the idea of “us”, but was not ready to walk the talk. He was also doing it to make himself feel better after a very bad divorce.

    He would not accept it when I said we probably shouldn’t try a relationship now. I knew it wouldn’t work. I wasn’t strong enough to walk away then. So he capitalized on that, captured my heart, and then turned it all around on me, so that he could be the one to “put the romance on hold”, as he said.

    What muddiness!!

    My errors have been in choosing men who do not know how to appreciate this quality about me. Two very, very insightful MEN (a mystic uncle and a tarot reader) in the past week have validated and confirmed this also.

    L



  333.  #333life_is_too_short_to... on September 18, 2010 at 7:09 am

    “Very good post Life….I especially like the comment about long distance, electronic relationships. It takes time and lots of interaction to get to know someone, and to know if they are right for you. Dating is meant to be done in person…after all, the internet has only been around a very, very short time. 🙂 So I guess it’s a matter of how one wants to expend their energy and effort in regard to finding the right partner to share their life.”

    That’s exactly it, Denise. There’s always webcams, I guess! I’ve never used one, though.

    At some point, you have decide if the thing is going somewhere or if you are just spinning your wheels.



  334.  #334Brenda on September 18, 2010 at 7:18 am

    I wish so much I could go to the “Pick Up Artist World Summit in Los Angeles” that Erika told us about. I checked out their website and voted for Erika for best Female coach. If you want to give her your support, vote here: http://www.1shoppingcart.com/app/?Clk=3199052



  335.  #335Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 7:59 am

    I believe Shame is a completely different feeling, vibration wise, than Anger, Sadness, Happiness, and Fear … and that Guilt also has its own frequency … Guilt is closer to Fear but Shame has a whole other feel to it in my HBR work …

    Also, Stuckness has a feel to it …

    Numbness has a feel to it, that isn’t really captured by the “Basic Four.”

    I like having lots of words to describe feelings, it feels more connecting to me because it connects people to the subtleties …



  336.  #336Renee on September 18, 2010 at 8:44 am

    Still txting back and forth with Nashville guy…I really need to focus on me and staying on my bridge rather than dredging up ghosts of love past. I feel hopeful he’ll want to see me again, and that hope will almost certainly be quashed…I wish I had known about Rori and her work 3 yrs ago when I first met him, but now I think there’s too much water under the bridge to ever regain what we had (or the idea of what we could have had that probably never really was).

    Would love to play with some other sirens this morning instead of letting myself focus on wanting a man I can’t have…where are you guys this a.m.?



  337.  #337Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 9:21 am

    Hi Renee,

    When I said “Receive” to Brenda, I was referring to just the fun and joy of leaning back and letting this man “woo” her. She realized that he is an unexpected possibility and so I was just envisioning her sitting there like a beautiful fern and receiving the water of his attention.

    Soccer Dad showed up at the game with another woman. I focused on sitting on the bleachers with an open heart, drinking my coffee and feeling the sun and the breeze. I’m pretty sure he looked at me a lot and as they left, he turned and waved in my direction and yelled “good game” to my daughter. But … I feel disappointed.



  338.  #338Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 9:21 am

    Hi Renee,

    When I said “Receive” to Brenda, I was referring to just the fun and joy of leaning back and letting this man “woo” her. She realized that he is an unexpected possibility and so I was just envisioning her sitting there like a beautiful fern and receiving the water of his attention.

    Soccer Dad showed up at the game with another woman. I focused on sitting on the bleachers with an open heart, drinking my coffee and feeling the sun and the breeze. I’m pretty sure he looked at me a lot and as they left, he turned and waved in my direction and yelled “good game” to my daughter. But … I feel disappointed.



  339.  #339Lucy on September 18, 2010 at 9:22 am

    “I feel horrible and yucky about all this stuff that has gone on with this blog this past day” (Barb)

    Barb, I apologize for my part in that. I regret letting it go on as long as it did. I feel horrible and yucky too. I’m sorry.

    <3
    Lucy



  340.  #340Renee on September 18, 2010 at 9:36 am

    Feeling — I guess I’m still missing something…I looked for previous posts from Brenda on this thread and didn’t find any having to do with a new man…I’m guessing she must have posted on another thread and you’re replying to her here. No worries though — I was just curious. I hope Brenda gets to receive from some wonderful man too!:-)



  341.  #341Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 9:44 am

    Renee,

    Brenda’s post was #326.

    I noticed something interesting at the soccer game. The woman Soccer Dad was with stood the whole game in a very masculine pose … with her legs far apart, arms crossed. As the game wore on, he stood farther and farther away from her and his arms were crossed too. It didn’t look like they were connecting. Interesting …

    I felt very feminine and open. It felt good even if I didn’t receive any direct attention. I did have a nice conversation with another couple sitting nearby.



  342.  #342Renee on September 18, 2010 at 10:20 am

    Well, Feeling, I totally missed that one. I did a search using the “find” tool on the page and it totally missed Brenda’s post! Oh, well, glad I’m caught up on the scoop now! Thanks!

    Sounds like you were doing exactly what you needed to do at the soccer game…staying in your feminine energy and being open to the day…it also sounds like that other woman’s masculine energy may have kind of been a turn off to that guy…interesting.



  343.  #343Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Feeling,

    Is it possible she was his ex wife?



  344.  #344Lizzie on September 18, 2010 at 10:32 am

    Hey Lovely Lucy (I have always wanted to write that and it seems to fit you so nicely – I hope you don’t mind)

    I have looked at some of the messages from the past day and maybe I take a slightly different perspective. The early convo seemed to surface feelings of resistance in me. As the small group worked through some of the things that seemed to be confusing, I felt more confused and more resistance and more desire to protect myself. In my head, I might have thought it would surface some level of anger – but did not. In my head, I think I didn’t become angry because my experience on the board is with a group of women learning how to recognize masculine energy/communications and feminine energy/communications, and since I haven’t been face to face with anyone on the list, there is too much missing for me to be able to discern much by way of context.

    I have learned from your shared experience. And I really value that.

    I learned how the masculine felt harsh, demanding, controlling and forced upon me almost like the little kid saying to his little friend “hey! put up your dukes!!”. I felt how that twisted my tummy. I felt how my own resistance and self protection kicked in and I didn’t want to play. I was also exhausted from a very emotionally demanding week. Then I felt like I was going to be drawn in and have even more of my emotional energy depleted and I didn’t want that, so I stepped away from the board.

    I came back later to shut down the system and saw that the convo have morphed. I felt a completely different vibe! I was quite surprised by my own response to the dialogue at that point. It felt lighter. I place lighter on the happy scale – low on my happy scale, but happy none the less. I felt the plug had been put in the energy drain and more positive energy was moving toward me.

    I am not so sure I am communicating what I want to share with you, and will try. I appreciate your exploration and sticking with the dance of masculine and feminine. I can see more clearly the strength of non-violent communications. And maybe even more importantly, I can really see how difficult it is to stay safely within what is really NVC and how easily it is to morph into blending NVC with the masculine and how that feels like I need to engage my internal troops of self defense mechanisms. I sense it was not an easy journey and I do thank you. I learned big time.



  345.  #345Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 10:38 am

    Nikita,

    No… I wish! I know who his ex is and she wasn’t there today.



  346.  #346Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 10:40 am

    Renee,

    I’m hoping that he was wishing he were with me! ha! That’s how I’m going to “frame” it for my inner Siren.



  347.  #347Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 10:40 am

    Feeling,

    Oh 🙁

    I was feeling hopeful that it may have been his ex.



  348.  #348Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 11:09 am

    I feel a bit confused by equating “controlling” energy with “the masculine.”

    To me, “controlling” energy is the ego, not the masculine.

    A fully congruent masculine man doesn’t use “controlling” behavior or language, in my experience.



  349.  #349Turtle Girl on September 18, 2010 at 11:11 am

    HELP!!!!!! Cd man is being a real poop over the whole dating other men/no girlfriend thing. It has come up about 3 or 4 times. We have been dating now for about 3/4 months and are sexual. He wants me to stop dating other men. I have told him I am not having sex with anyone else which is true. But yes I accept dinner dates, coffee, etc etc. He pitches a fit over it.

    My speech to him-any recommendations sirens? HELP!!! I am really upset over this. What to do?

    We an “argument” not heated but tense over this-

    I want to say this:

    “I am feeling angry and I don’t like feeling that way. I don’t want to feel angry, or upset.

    By you saying you “have a real problem” with me dating feels like a threat to me.

    The implication feels like if I don’t stop dating and be exclusive with you, then you will do what? Start seeing other women? Stop seeing me because I won’t be exclusive? That makes me feel angry and sad and I don’t like it. I don’t want to feel threatened. It feels bad. It feels ugly. It feels like pressure. It feels controlling. It feels like I want to stay away.

    Being a girlfriend/being exclusive with any man without being married or living with them is not what I want. I want a long term committed relationship. Until I have that I am going to do what I feel is best for me. If a man wants to have me all to himself then a real commitment is in order when it is time for that. I do not put pressure on anyone, as I do not like pressure put on me. These things take time.

    In the old days men courted women. Women dated different men to see which one felt right to her. She had choices. If a man wanted to claim her for all his own he proposed.
    The truth is every man knows that if he is not marrying you or living with you then he has NO VALID claim on you whether he will own up to that or not.

    Exclusivity without a real commitment feels dishonest to me.

    You are a grown man. You have every right to do what you want. I would never tell you what to do or how to live your life. I try and make my choices and decisions based on what I feel is best for me and I hope you do the same.

    I don’t want to have to defend myself all the time. It feels exhausting. I care for you very much and I feel misunderstood. I feel I am being pushed in a corner. I am feeling trapped.

    I love what we have together and I don’t want to stop seeing you. You told me more than once you want to pursue me. I hope that you do.”

    Ugh. I feel awful.



  350.  #350Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 11:20 am

    TG,

    I’m hearing a belief that it’s not really okay to make sure your own needs get met, and if he picks up that belief subconsciously, he will throw tantrums and so forth …

    Does it remind you of something from earlier in your life?



  351.  #351Turtle Girl on September 18, 2010 at 11:26 am

    Erika-
    Thank you for this. I honestly don’t know if this reminds me of something in my earlier life or not.

    Every time this has come up he “throws a tantrum” yes, you are right on.

    This warrant some thinking about. I feel angry at him for this. He is trying to “get his way” and bully me basically. I don’t like it.

    My needs are important and yes I grew up with them not getting met and being pushed aside but I have done a helluva lot of work on this over the years and have changed profoundly.

    At the same time he also has needs, and it is hard to balance my own with someone else’s at times.

    I really appreciate your input. I really do. xxoo



  352.  #352Lizzie on September 18, 2010 at 11:30 am

    Hey Sirens,
    Here is my new profile for Plenty of Fish – tell me what you think – and feel

    There are many exciting stories in my life, I lived all of them – some were fun others harrowing and I wouldn’t change any of it. And there is so much more!

    These are a few of the things on my bucket list:
    – Play golf on every continent
    – Ski Colorado and Wyoming
    – Cooking school in Tuscany
    – Midnight picnic – with a bonfire and skinny dip
    – Hike the Yellow Mountains in China
    – Bring my kids back to China to run the only flat part of the Great Wall
    – Bike the Great Divide
    – Quiet my brain long enough to meditate
    – Do a knitting tour of New Zeland and Chile
    – Attend Burning Man
    – Write a humour book about dating
    – Get a real hand-written love letter by snail-mail
    – Fall in love

    Here is my question for you – I feel open to meeting someone wonderful, and hope that we can talk about all the things that give us joy, what do you think?



  353.  #353Turtle Girl on September 18, 2010 at 11:38 am

    Lizzie-I love it!

    has great feel to it. Like you are a “cool girl” as CC says. lol…..



  354.  #354Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 11:51 am

    Good morning…ha! well afternoon. Erika, hey, yes! I am wanting to delve into why masculine and controlling is what is heard? The exercise as I described it is a very very cool way to get to know the “heart” of a person. And I feel yall are seeing me as a bully, and I have actually been told I was squishing, swallowing, and squirting chemicals on Lucy by Lucy and that was not true. I was speaking my voice and those were her feelings. And I love the moderate voices here, too. And I feel sad abbout soccer dad!

    Anyway, I popping in to gage the reaction(s) and to say feeling messages do not make it easier for me to communicate. On my blog! ha @ Liveyourdreamblog.com, Lynne posts about how when you are given tools and they don’t work that only adds to your feeling inept and “bad nv’s.”…..

    so I am also involved in a kind of project – and this is where you come in Erika. I’m defining new wave femininity and I think that in a way all the walking on eggshells using circular logic, and feeling speak is a de feminization of women. It feels controlling – ergo, explaining is controlling? how can you ever communicate if anything and everything can be defined as controlling?

    and most importantly it feels like an infantilization – making babies out of grown women. I read this in response the the onslaught of pink we’re going to experience next month – yeah! for cancer survivors! but booo for women being made into babies that have to speak baby talk.

    I say men have feelings to, anyone can speak in non violent confrontation and once again I ask the question – specifically to Erika this time – why are we so afraid to make mistakes, why are we so afraid to grow? What do you see in your work about this, what is the attachment – is it that we’ll be like obliviated if someone talks to us like the schoolyard bully?

    Cuz let me tell you, accepting and wonderful sirens, the whole time that exchange was going on I was getting emails from women who have felt excluded and beat up on here and not accepted.

    So, why doesn’t this feel more accepting for them, if it is such a great tool?

    I’ve been saying this for months – tell me why this tool is 1. imperative and 2. works so well without being used as a means of manipulation or shutting out someone else’s opinion?

    Thanks!
    Jacqueline



  355.  #355Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 11:58 am

    Life is too short – you are wonderfully eloquent. Hi, LG! and Renee – I am hearing something sad in your words? and that’s so interesting about the text. I’m glad you’re back and really like the story!

    @ Brenda….LOVE IT!!! very cool and isn’t it interesting how they love to sit and talk to you? Is that a shift from the tools? Whatever it is, I know you must really like it!

    I feel sad that last night didn’t result in breathing, laughing, playing, recognition and fun! results… coo, and I just deleted the like it’s and went with the sad….

    but in the moment I feel good. Don’t know how to express both of those things to be heard?

    J

    J



  356.  #356Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 12:01 pm

    Lizzie – why is fall in love at the end? is it coincidence or chronological???? lol….Lizzie falls in love with the whole world!!! then….falls in love?!

    Joy = music, green growth on trees, beauty all around me, beauty within me, beauty before me and beauty behind me.

    Joyfully,
    J



  357.  #357Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 12:05 pm

    @Jacqueline, one thing I will say …

    And, Lucy, this goes to why I liked your “going into the depression” idea …

    As I read the “conflict” on here, I feel very disconnected from it … focusing on the literal words each other are saying seems to me like skating nervously on the surface of a deep, subterranean lake filled with dark, scary feelings …

    I can tell you it works the exact same way for men, btw, because I’ve worked with so many of them. To be fully in his masculine power, a man must be IN HIS BODY, and that means IN HIS FEELINGS … but being present like that does not require him to speak in feeling messages.

    In fact, feeling messages can be inauthentic cover-ups ALSO … what matters is becoming present with the feelings, and feeling messages can help us do that …

    Lucy, the reason to go into depression is the same reason not to “avoid” a person who triggers discomfort in us … rather, I move toward the discomfort, not away from it …

    This is why for me personally “leaning back” has never been a very effective tool. It just increases my anxiety, doesn’t resolve it … whereas diving deep into my conflict with another person and exploring that dark subterranean lake will shift my energy, and the other person’s energy, magically, miraculously …

    that make sense at all?



  358.  #358Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    yes, Erika, it makes sense to me….the delving into the deep, the muddy, the non accepting parts….etc. The shift never happened, but in my experience in life, it does and it’s miraculous.

    Thanks for being here! You sound good!

    J

    still working on defining feminity – in a world wide holistic sense….



  359.  #359Lizzie on September 18, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Yes Jacqueline – I did put falling in love at the end on purpose. We shall see what happens. It is a completely different approach. I also used different photos of myself – they are not my very best and maybe I will keep these here. I have noticed already, even though I have been off the site for 3 months, there are many of the same people there. I was hoping to see a different crowd. Who knows?!

    On eH, I have been there for 2 months, been matched with about 200 men, have had only ONE contact me and he was in the USA – like that would ever work….I contacted 6, had responses from 2 – met them and NO GO. So we shall see!



  360.  #360Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 12:26 pm

    Thanks Jacqueline.

    Whenever people can’t “hear” each other, you can be pretty sure there’s anger in the way … and many people avoid their anger cuz they don’t want to go there …

    And the anger is built on old memories …



  361.  #361Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    which create limiting beliefs and get stored in your body and maybe even simple words can trigger it and you feel like you’re gonna die??? and THAT equals trigger!



  362.  #362Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 12:33 pm

    Lizzie – I’m sorry for that, I too noticed the same guys on there for years…how weird is that? And I totally loved not putting my best pix up, then they could be happily surprised! With all my heart I hope love is first on your list in real life!!

    gonna run off for my Sat. adventure….

    yall have fun!

    J



  363.  #363Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    oh, and then when the charge around the trigger is released all the LOVE flows back in? cuz sadness masks anger masks love? at the heart of it all we are and all we are is love….we are beings of love.

    that’s what I was taught, and believe….

    Happy Saturday!



  364.  #364Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    Yeah, totally, Jacqueline …

    Until the anger is released, people don’t even see the loving, wonderful person in front of them in the present moment … all they can see are ghosts from the egoic past …



  365.  #365Jennifer on September 18, 2010 at 1:02 pm

    Lizzie
    I am having similar experiences with online dating…I just don’t know what else to do. I wish meetup.com was doing stuff in my area.
    I’m on Eharmony and have over 700 matches. I’v contacted a few and they never get back to me. The ones that do contact me seem unsuitable at best.
    Same with ok cupid, and eligon.. which is “executive”
    On POF I get offers for random sex and chat…
    I feel like I’m whinning again.
    BooHoo nothing works for me.
    Boo hoo
    Whatever
    I feel frustrated. Like I am behind a big brick wall and I KNOW there are cool men on the otherside…but I can’t get around them.
    I have a date on monday with school yard guy…but I’m kinda dreading it.
    Maybe I’m not ready to date. Maybe I need to UnFck my head a while more.
    Maybe theres something else going on.
    Maybe I’m too dispirited to give a $hit anymore.
    Maybe I’ll just start a collection of small yappy dogs and forget being a wife or mother.
    Maybe I’m whinning again
    The moon is getting full…it’s the autmn equinox…equinox usually makes me hormonal.
    My brain is tired from trying to think my way through this. I feel tired.
    Boo



  366.  #366Jennifer on September 18, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    I wish I wasn’t away working.
    I wish I was at the corn roast at my brothers, drinkin apple jacks and playing with the baby.



  367.  #367Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:16 pm

    hi. i feel triggered .

    Jaqueline, my guess is you have not actually read the article about explaining as a form of control.
    It is a great article and i encourage you to read it… it feels bad to see something valuable dismissed without understanding.

    As far as feeling messages, they Do work when used the right way. It may feel limiting at first, when one is just learning to speak in this way, and not getting it right 100%. it is an effort we’re making here.

    i’m feeling so frustrated. im really really angry at having someone come and talk dissmissively (and what to me is in ignorance), about works of people that i admire, and that they are not even understandin on a blog for people who are seeking encouragement using those tools

    i dont like what im practicing to be called circular logic whne its not. i feel really angry and put down and i dont want to be talked to that way

    i dont want the sirens working hard THERAPEAUTICALLY here to heal themselves

    to have ot be subjected to repeated putdowns of the work they are engaging in

    it feels unsafe

    i dont want that for this blog

    i will sit for awhile and let this triggered feeling be, and see how i feel

    if this continues to feel bad, i will contact rori and ask her to address you specifically in order to better clarify the guidelines to keeping this blog safe for everyone who is working here on things that may feel too vulnerable to share amid consistent put downs and discouragement of using the work



  368.  #368Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:20 pm

    Jaqueline- can you please direct your questions of why feeling messsages work to Rori? And tell us her answer?

    or perhaps you can read her book and programs and find the explanation there – the book is only 20$ and is the basics. one entire chapter is dedicated to feeling messages.



  369.  #369Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:27 pm

    I’m feeling so sad and desperate that I’m not being seen and my beautiful knowledge is not seen and misinterpreted. im feeling sad, angry powerless
    i love my agner

    i love my non seeness

    my discriminated against

    my powerlessness

    my fury

    i love my feelings



  370.  #370Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    moving toward the discomfort wiht intent to explore sounds the same as “sinking into feelings”

    which is NOT lean forward, but lean back.



  371.  #371Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    I hear people asking questions and being genuinely curious, but at the same time throwing around dismissive statements and put downs as part of their communication, which trigger others… slowing down the understanding.



  372.  #372Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:33 pm

    right now, i feel sooo angry. i love my anger. i feel like just crushing everyone and having the shut the F8UCK up. i feel like i want Rori to cancel commenting capability and just have her own posts.

    ugh…

    this trigger feels intense…

    i love my intense feelings

    i love my sadness

    it feels hot heavy and overwhelming and stifling

    *



  373.  #373Daria on September 18, 2010 at 1:37 pm

    I’m having a mirror I think. i love my feelings and i love me



  374.  #374Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    Daria,

    I hear you. I love this blog and it has been a lifeline to me during many lonely, hurting days. I feel that being here and feeling the love and hearing all of the sirens working through things in open honesty is why I am as healed today as I am.

    I value everyone’s input, but there is a difference between honest questions about tolls and how they work and debate. No one HAS to be here and if the tools don’t work for you, that’s cool. But let us enjoy our island and what works for us.



  375.  #375Feeling on September 18, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    I mean honest questions about tools! No tolls! Thankfully this island is free!



  376.  #376AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    Daria,

    I am really sad. I don’t want you to feel upset. Hrm. Which isn’t me telling you what to do, but just expressing a wish that you could be happy.

    I’m just hopping on here for a minute before I get back to work, but I hear and feel your distress and I feel hurt.

    I would like to know why this is so important to you. I hear your belief that the feeling tool works. I can draw that conclusion from your experience with it (coincidentally, I have experienced it working as well).

    For me, when I feel as strongly as you seem to be feeling about this I have to ask myself why. And so I am asking you (because I would like to understand-not because I am trying to challenge you), why is it so important to you that everyone agree with your belief?

    When this has happened to me it was because I was afraid. I was afraid that I had put my faith into something and based my belief on something, that was being challenged. And that was the most pit of my stomach, sick and cold, closing down PANIC feeling. I was ANGRY because I do NOT LIKE to feel that way.

    And mostly I was afraid of what it would mean if I didn’t resist the challenge and WIN. I was afraid of what it would mean if I had put my faith in something and it turned out to be not what I believed.

    And it turned out (for me) that the best way to deal with this in my life was to realize that even if everything was BS, I was still me and I had still had the growth and experience from it and become a better, more whole me.

    These tools aren’t you. All of your progress and the AMAZING YOU that I have gotten to know (a little) and who has helped me grow is not dependent on these tools.

    These tools have been INCREDIBLY valuable to me. And continue to be a HUGE source of learning.

    But I’m not being triggered by anyone’s resistance to them right now.

    I am sincerely sorry that I am not able to word this in a way that better states my understanding.

    And I want to make clear that I recognize that this is MY experience that I’m discussing. And that I do not mean to tell you how you feel or why.

    I do love and respect you. I appreciate your leadership qualities here and your amazing willingness to interact with everyone. And your BRAVERY with processing everything right out here in the open.

    I hope that you can come to peace in yourself.

    It hurts to see you hurting.

    Amber



  377.  #377AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    Feeling,

    Re: 347. I appreciate what you are saying. I feel appreciation. I feel calm and relaxed about the love and support here.

    I didn’t come to this island to hide.

    I came to this island to heal and grow.

    I am puzzled at the idea that this island is only a good place when everyone is doing everything the same way.

    I am totally confused by what I keep hearing. Maybe I’m hearing it wrong, but it sounds to me like some people are saying that the non-feeling msg communication happening here is PREVENTING them from doing whatever works for them (in this case the obvious is feeling messages).

    I am truly baffled by this.

    If feeling messages are your TRUE BELIEF, then no one else’s behavior, use, non-use, protest against or denial of them should matter.

    There is no reason (that I can see) why people can not keep doing what works for them in the presence of “non-believers”

    This feels like a puzzle I would like to unravel for myself.

    I happen to believe that Rori’s tools work. I do not use them all, nor do I use them all of the time.

    But my belief in them is strong enough to hear and accept doubt from other people without being infected by it.

    I am sure this falls into some needing to feel safe thing.

    There is no where safer.

    Even if we are not in agreement. These are all just words, electronically transmitted. No one can hurt you here. We are all here to grow. In our own ways.

    And Rori watches over this place (THANK YOU!)

    So we have that added assurance of safety.

    Denying someone the right to be here in whatever experience they are in, in whatever stage of growth…

    That does not feel good to me.

    I would like to believe that we are all strong and independant.

    What that looks like to me is me only participating in what helps me heal. If there is something I am not ready for, I will make the choice to honor myself by not reading that post. Or by accepting my feelings if I chose to read it.

    Not by protesting the existence of an opposing or otherwise triggering viewpoint.

    I am going back to work. I am writing that here so that my INTENTION is clear. I would like to feel whole and healed. And I will continue this as long as I am not whole and healed.



  378.  #378Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    Daria, I feel curious about your anger …

    A few weeks ago, I felt myself being triggered sometimes when reading Jacqueline’s posts … and I did sink into my feelings and give myself some listening space, and now I feel like I can hear her without being triggered …

    361 and 363 of Jacqueline don’t sound to me at all judging anyone or saying “I’m right and you’re wrong” or dissing on Rori or anything like that …

    so I really am feeling curious about this …

    also… to me leaning back and sinking into feelings have two very different mental images and get me into two very different states …

    As a tool, leaning back just has never worked for me, it has a connotation of “avoiding” or “being better than” or something (for me, it may work just fine for other people, and I’ve noticed that some Sirens have had a similar experience as I have).

    What I noticed is that focusing on “leaning back” creates more anxiety for me, not less. And more anxiety makes my vibe more “push away” not more enticing …

    Sometimes I literally have to chase someone down to get them to delve into the mutual feelings with me … sometimes chasing them down really is the right choice for me. Sometimes it really is the only way to get to the bottom of what is going on for me. I’m not telling anyone else what to do, just sharing my experience.

    Very often, feeling messages feel too limited to me, that I am not able to fully express myself with them, and so it doesn’t feel authentic.

    And sometimes I see some people churning round and round in feeling messages not ever getting to the root of their recurring emotional issues … not ever clearing out the memories and energetic patterns that cause the same old anger to arise over and over again.

    So I value having all kinds of voices on this blog, and I learn from all of them.

    Does any of that resonate with you, Daria?



  379.  #379Daria on September 18, 2010 at 2:47 pm

    non feeling message communication prevents people from feeling safe here.

    it’s imprtant that people feel safe and encouraged to use them on this blog so that they can try out feeling messages, maybe for the very first time

    out in the world, without having the blog to practice and be encouraged, feels very scary to try to use them consistently

    people feel vulnerable when sharing a feeling. i don’t want them to be attacked here, the way it may happen in real life. this is place to practice just that… feeling messages and the other rori tools … in safety



  380.  #380Daria on September 18, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    “As a tool, leaning back just has never worked for me, it has a connotation of “avoiding” or “being better than” or something (for me, it may work just fine for other people, and I’ve noticed that some Sirens have had a similar experience as I have).

    What I noticed is that focusing on “leaning back” creates more anxiety for me, not less. And more anxiety makes my vibe more “push away” not more enticing …

    i used to feel this way – but as i practiced more more recently i don’t

    i am experiencing the energy of lean back in a different way (not a better than or aloof way) than i used to before.

    it feels more like being a divine being, and holding space = my lean back now

    ***

    Sometimes I literally have to chase someone down to get them to delve into the mutual feelings with me … sometimes chasing them down really is the right choice for me. Sometimes it really is the only way to get to the bottom of what is going on for me. I’m not telling anyone else what to do, just sharing my experience.

    – for me not necessary as everything comes to me back around if its unfinished, something i’ve heard you mention often

    chasing someone doesn’t feel good to me.

    i DO do this… it feels intense and controlling and i don’t want to do it – babysteps



  381.  #381AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 2:55 pm

    I am not responsible for any other person’s feelings.

    I feel sad. I feel love and hope.

    I feel strong.

    I am not responsible for any other person’s feelings.

    Are you responsible for any other person’s feelings?



  382.  #382Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:01 pm

    I feel bad. I feel like im trying to control you guys. this doesn’t feel good. i don’t want to be put down and i don’t want the blog to be unsafe for sirens practicing Rori’s tools.

    i feel so angry reading stuff dismissing tools and putting down their use

    i feel open to hearing concerns for how to better use the tools…

    or… this tool feels weird… i feel disappointed that it’s not seemingly working for me… does anyone have any insight for how to use it in a way that might work?

    the truth is, i Don’t want to hear all kinds of voices, i don’t want to hear voices putting me down , or judging me , or the tools

    i feel really angry hearing stuff like that

    i feel powerless

    i feel furious

    *

    and of course … this is trigger… i have felt this way previously in my life

    i love me



  383.  #383Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    Daria,

    It does feel like making me wrong … I’m telling you my honest, authentic experience, which sounds like is different from yours.

    “Leaning back” as a metaphor doesn’t work for me, I’m perfectly happy letting it go and using metaphors that don’t work for me.

    Holding my own space feels better for me than “leaning back,” which feels strained to me, and artificial, and not intimate.

    In my ideal relationship, neither person chases. We hold the same space. Getting there = releasing all anxiety. Leaning back doesn’t help me release anxiety.

    I hear you saying it does work for you … and I feel accepting of that.



  384.  #384Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    Lol, letting it go and using metaphors that DO work for me.



  385.  #385Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    i feel really guilty and triggered by this because i think thats how i come off when i slip into my automatic pattern of response

    i feel bad thinking that i crush people dismiss their views ignorantly, control them, chase them down and bully them and ask them pressing socratic questions that i have an agenda with,

    i want to prove to myself that im right, and i want to control them to accept what im giving them

    it feels awful

    i love me

    i feel happy im babystepping away from that style of communication

    i feel blessed that it seems my experience using feeling messages, and the lean back tool is taking me “places” that are new for me in my life, and that other people don’t even be able to See without being in the place i am

    ouch i feel pain at feeling misunderstood in the past

    i don’t want to feel unseen and misunderstood

    i feel happy and proud to feel like a leader or a scout or a pioneer or an explorer

    and i feel sad like no one believes me what i’ve seen on my explorations

    this feels sad

    feeling happy and sad

    i love my feelings

    i feel excited about the babysteps im taking Right this second

    i feel excited with the realization that i don’t even have to engage here

    and i can continue using my tools

    but not speaking out my anger would feel bad.. here i am now tingling and tight remembering my anger and it feels tingly all up in my arm

    i love my feelings



  386.  #386Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    ps – im happy to report i’ve healed most of my trigger with the word “connected”!!

    i even used it with a man the other day, without even thinking about it!

    it feels a lot better.

    onlly a touch of a reminder of screwing a lightbulb in the lightbulb socket

    but then again… why my aversion to ogun metalic technology?

    that doesnt feel good, esp when my computer does so much for me. i love you computer. thannk you for being here for me.

    thank you.



  387.  #387Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    ‘Connected’ didn’t work for me, but i just healed that the other week. now its starting to work.

    not working is just a trigger.

    i feel anxious! i feel disconnected and cold and like i want to say

    “i dont really care – if it doesn’t work for you and you miss the wonderfulness of it because of your resistance”

    and i don’t want to say that or feel that way.

    i Love my triggers.

    mmm

    triggerific today



  388.  #388Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    “I Just Want to Explain” – Explaining as a Form of Control

       

    I get a lot of newsletters, and I’ve made so many friends among therapists and coaches, and every once in a while I see something that complements my own work…and I loved this one by Dr. Margaret Paul. Explaining is something we ALL want to do – it’s a part of our need for closure (which you know I say to just forget about) – and here, Margaret shows the link between explaining and control…

    What happens when you try to explain yourself to someone who is attacking and blaming? Does it EVER work? Discover how else to communicate.

    “My husband never lets me explain anything to him. It’s so frustrating! He makes these statements that are blaming and attacking and then he won’t listen to me when I’m trying to explain.”

    “Why do you want to explain?”

    “I NEED to explain because he is not seeing things accurately. He is making assumptions that are not accurate.”

    “So you want to explain to get him to see things differently than he does.”

    “Yes.”

    “Isn’t this, then, a form of control? Aren’t you trying to get him to change how he sees things, or how he feels about you?”

    “Well, yeah, but he doesn’t have all the information he needs.”

    “So he is blaming you as his form of control, and you are explaining as your form of control – is that right?”

    “Um….I don’t know. I never thought of explaining as a form of control.”

    “Aren’t you trying to change his mind – change how he sees things?”

    “Yes, I guess so. But is that wrong?”

    “It is neither right or wrong. But is it working for you?”

    “No! He won’t listen to me.”

    “Do you think it is possible that he won’t listen to you because he doesn’t want to be controlled by you? He doesn’t want you trying to talk him out of how he sees things?”

    “Yes. That is actually what he says. But I’m just trying to give him the facts, the truth.”

    “The problem is that he does not want the facts. He is not asking you for the facts. When he is attacking and blaming, he just wants to control you. He is not interested in learning. And neither are you. You are just trying to get him to see the “facts” as you see them.”

    “Oh, I see this now. But what should I do when he is attacking and blaming and not seeing me or seeing things accurately?”

    “How does it feel in your heart when he attacks and blames? Take a moment to tune inside and see what your heart feels when he is so unloving to you.”

    “Oh, I feel awful. I feel so angry and hurt.”

    “Look under the anger and hurt feelings. What other feelings are you covering over with your anger and hurt? Tune into your heart. What do you feel in your heart?”

    “……I feel sad. And helpless. I hate feeling helpless. And my heart hurts.”

    “Yes, that is heartache. You feel heartache. And this is a very painful feeling, so you are covering it up with your anger. Right now, put your hands over your heart, breathing into your heart. Open to your Guidance, inviting in compassion for your heartache. Be very gentle, tender, and kind with yourself. Take a minute to do this…..Now what are you feeling?”

    “I feel lighter.”

    “Great. So here is what I suggest you practice. Instead of explaining and defending next time your husband attacks you and blames you, put your hand on your heart and say, ‘Your attacking energy is hurting my heart, so I’m going to go into the other room. I’d be happy to talk about it when you are ready to be open and caring.’ Then disengage and take a few minutes to bring compassion into your heart. Don’t discuss the issue until both of you are open to learning. Are you willing to try this?”

    “Yes, I am. I can feel the sense of relief inside. Now that I see what you mean, I can see that explaining is never going to get me anywhere. But is there ever a time to explain?”

    “Yes. When both of you are open, then you can explain things from your point of view, as well as try to understand things from his point of view. Both of you will learn new things and will likely be able to easily resolve the issue. But there is no point in explaining until both of you are open.”

    Here’s a link to Margaret’s site: http://www.innerbonding.com and you can follow her “Inner Bonding” work there…

    Love, Rori

    written by Rori Raye • Permalink • Leave a Comment »

    Wednesday, 6 January 2010 @ 10:43am



  389.  #389Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    holding space IS leaning back



  390.  #390Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    Daria,

    I feel curious how you feel the “lean back” metaphor in your body … cuz when I stand and lean back, I feel unstable, I feel like I have to strain to hold myself upright … I don’t feel relaxed … if I do it with another person, it feels similar to how I would respond if I were scared of them … pulling away …

    If I just stand upright and hold space and relax my arms and feel inviting, then that feels like a space where people can come to me …

    and if I chase someone down because I’ve got to get something resolved, and we have a huge blowout confrontation where all the anger gets aired and released, then I feel I have given myself space to return to being relaxed and upright.

    “leaning back” feels strained to me, like game playing. Standing upright and relaxed feels authentic to me, and inviting.

    So maybe you feel it different in your body than I do? I feel curious about the places you’ve gone with this metaphor …



  391.  #391Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    Ericka – i tried to explain it…. it feels like being a divine being and holding space.

    it feels like being open and expansive, like made of some kind of swirly air, and with a deep soft soothing voice that comes from somewhere deep inside

    it feels like my jaw being soft,

    like feeling my breath lapping at the shores of my body

    leaning back physically in Rori Raye dance position,

    one leg behind the other, leaning back, arms to the side with palms open in front

    drop thoughts to pelvis

    open heart , heartlight on…

    feels like being caressed by the breeze,

    like being a Tree / plant Goddess, fern, that the wind is loving and touching and like melting

    mentally it feels like

    touching and lightly rubbing with my minds eye

    a basketball size ball in my tummy that is a way to feel my inner belly core being



  392.  #392Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    Okay, well that sounds lovely … and I feel happy it creates that space for you.

    that’s just not how I feel it. Lean back to me does not feel stable.

    and if I lean back at dinner with a man, I feel less connected with him than I do when we are both leaning in, which feels very intimate to me.



  393.  #393Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    as i stand with my arms open… i feel somewhat open, alone

    leaning back slightly on a back leg feels like “things” begin to be attracted to me and the world is being attracted into me



  394.  #394Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    leaning in towards each other feels nice, i feel friendly and fun

    leaning back feels deep, extroaridarily deep, cosmic, like a breathing living goddess. i feel Different than him, i am the goddess opening up for my warrior. it feels like we are the players of the cosmic story

    i feel somewhat big, huge, unconnectable with, like a deity

    when i open my heart and allow the man to give to me – energetically – lean into me – in this space…

    i feel turned on by him, i feel Meaningful in a Lifetime way



  395.  #395Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:28 pm

    Well, I guess that’s where I feel mistrust about “leaning back,” it goes back to what I said above about feeling like it’s a form of being “better than” …

    and I find my connections with men tend to feel more intimate the less I see our differences and the more I see our sameness.

    I don’t want to be an unapproachable Goddess, I want to be a touchable, lovable, connectable with intimate partner



  396.  #396Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    feeling guilty for energy bashing… babysteps to relaxing on that…

    Erika – i feel concerned about consistently saying “leaning back doesn’t work”… confuses other sirens when

    the words “lean back” have picked up some connotations for you that feel bad and that are not part of Rori’s definition



  397.  #397Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    Hiya! you two sound like one of you is doing Tango and the other is doing Rumba – or something like that. Anyway, Daria, I had already written Rori, thanks and now I’ve asked her if I can quote her response. We’ll see. I don’t want to be voted off the island here either – did not know people would want to vote?

    I am here to experience personal growth and listen to stories, sometimes to grow by interacting with someone, but mostly to learn from example.

    I wonder why each of us is here? That’d be interesting….in the meantime, I wonder if it will all be different after HBR tomorrow? That will be even more interesting!



  398.  #398Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    Daria,

    I feel there is space here for both of our views …

    I’m telling you how “leaning back” feels in my body, and the hidden beliefs I’m hearing in your words …

    and I feel a touch of anger about not feeling heard here … because my answer may not be right for everyone, but it most certainly is right for me ..



  399.  #399Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    I’m hearing a hidden belief that leaning back and being Goddessy is superior to and unreachable for a man … and THAT belief feels bad to me … it feels like putting a woman above a man and making him “less than,” which can’t help but boomerang on me …



  400.  #400Daria on September 18, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    being a huge feminine goddess is not “better than” being a man. it just is. huge.

    when the man leans into me. the connection feels cosmic. when he touches me, in this space i can FEEL it on a deep level

    not unapproachable… just Awe some… like a goddess… in fact, so attractive, that i pull in the world around me like im a black hole

    i feel sad that i’m not conveying it in a way that feels good to me.

    and i am babystepping… the feeling morphs as different layers are revealed…



  401.  #401Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 3:45 pm

    And to me it feels like an unacknowledged way to stay “safe” and far away from real intimacy … that’s what I’m hearing … I’m not saying that’s how you intended it … only you know your own belief system



  402.  #402Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 3:46 pm

    when both of you are open, then you can learn from explaining? Okay, I thought being here was open, and now I see/feel a distinction. In the example of course it’s crystal clear. But how would it play out online, for example – I mean if a man were emailing me I would feel like he was open to me being open; if anyone is communicating with me, actually, I feel like they are open. Is this wrong/innacurate? How would you know then?



  403.  #403Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 3:51 pm

    ps thank you for that distinction Erika, I too hear the term Goddess used as better than – like better than a man, better than an “average” woman – and I always thought it was being done here to like prop us up, acknowledge the divine feminine. But if different voices are so triggering and unpopular – it takes it back to being a tool for exclusivity, because in fact we are all female ergo all goddesses and it means nothing other than as a descriptor of a ground of being Daria admires and Erika doesn’t?

    What do you both think?



  404.  #404Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 4:00 pm

    For me, it’s all about intention …

    I can use the word “Goddess” with the intention that I recognize the Divine Feminine in all women and the Divine Masculine in all men, no matter how they are showing up in this moment, and that feels good to me …

    Or I can use it in a way to try to make myself “better than” someone else, and that feels awful to me …

    This is why I don’t put a lot of stock in words … to me, the intention behind the words is all that matters … the intention is either love or hate … and anything that puts one person above another is hate …



  405.  #405life_is_too_short_to... on September 18, 2010 at 4:04 pm

    391 Daria Wow!! that felt great!

    for me, leaning back feels like complete acceptance of what is,

    feeling like you really don’t have to do anything

    and i am oh so comfortable in my own skin, fearless, heart open, heart-centered

    i am free, open, without opinion, i am whole and complete, the purity that God desires,

    i feel electrical impulses coursing throughout my body

    i feel very fortunate to be able to give massage to people every day where i can practice this emptiness, where I can give to them in such a way that makes them open up and receive, and then I receive their openness like a sweet gift

    after a while, the lines between who is giving and who is receiving just blur

    i love when my openness meets another openness

    i feel so very sad when i send my openness to LD man and it hits a wall

    he is filled with fear and that makes me fearful too

    when i yelled at him last time almost two weeks ago
    and then texted him that i didn’t want to be so close, i think it may have burned this bridge. I feel disappointed in myself that I reacted.

    I feel right now is a good leaning back space to be in, there isn’t any rush for closure, just sitting with the feelings as they come and go, don’t know if he will ever call again, can’t be concerned about it.

    I’m really working on trying to change my thoughts to something else when i think of him, but not trying too hard, because i am working at getting more insight into the patterns i stay stuck in that bring me back to these scenarios over and over

    after a while, the lines between who is giving and who is receiving just blur

    L



  406.  #406Brenda on September 18, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    Daria,

    I quoted a man named Burt Rosenberg on here before, and I’ll quote him again:

    “You don’t know what is til you know what ain’t.”

    I have lived most of my adult life being clueless to how to conduct human relationships. I needed to hear “lean back like a waterwheel” because I was naturally chasing men, without having any idea the effect I was having on them. I only knew that men would run the other direction as soon as they started to get to know me.

    I needed to be trained how to use feminine energy. I have been learning that through Rori Raye, and I will be grateful to her for the rest of my life, because my life has changed.

    I have done a lot of reflecting about my past, and I believe the only reason my leaning forward energy worked with Kenny is that he was VERY strong in masculine energy, and because he was so attracted to me, he welcomed all my advances, and he outmanned me, if you will.

    On the other hand, Ryan had high feminine energy. In fact, one woman, appreciating his deep ability to feel, said, “Wow, you’re the perfect man! You’re like a lesbian with a penis!” And he was most DEFINITELY NOT GAY.

    Upon reflection, I see many ways in which Ryan leaned back with me. Yes, now I see how unhealthy that was, but again, I was coming from a background of total dysfunction and cluelessness.

    As I became more aware of Rori’s tools, I became more aware of how Ryan was outgirling me. For example, he would sit in one spot on the sofa. Unconsiously, I would slide over to him. I would reach out to him. He would hesitate when we were making plans, until I would offer to drive or use my car. I longed for him to caress, hold, and hug me. Yet more and more, he ceased to initiate. I found myself initiating more and more, unconsciously responding to his leaned back energy.

    If he comes back into my life, I will be aware of these things. I won’t let it happen again.

    Erika, when you talk about both leaning in and being most connected, yes, I see that too. I experience those moments with friends or lovers to whom I feel highly connected and intimate. I believe that is the ideal state of a relationship. I believe Rori’s lean back tool is primarily intended for the development stage of a relationship. Will I use it after I marry? Sure. But I doubt it will be as needed then. Our relational dynamics of masculine to feminine will have been established.



  407.  #407BarbinOz on September 18, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    #352

    Lovely Lizzie

    Hey that could be your name on POF 😀



  408.  #408BarbinOz on September 18, 2010 at 4:18 pm

    ps You missed the “a” out of

    New Zealand

    Yes I am a spelling Nazi 🙂



  409.  #409Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Mmmm….. Leaning in,

    A dim lounge with deep velvet chairs…..a jazz trio playing….singer is wailing…..the waiter asks my date if there will be anything else…..he orders a sexy red wine….maybe a Pinot noir……he’s reading the desert menu….the music is just loud enough I can’t hear his voice ….he takes my hand in his…comes closer….says something…I tilt my head to the left….smile with a curious look….I lean in and invite his lips to my ear by pulling my hair around the lobe…..he leans over and whispers…..”you look amazing and snuggilicious…..I want to gobble you up”.

    😉



  410.  #410Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    Use Your Gluts Instead Of Your Quads To Get Your Man

    Wednesday, 6 May 2009 @ 10:06am

    Your quads are in the front of your thighs, and your gluts are in your butt. They actually ARE your butt.

    So how can the way you use those muscles possibly make any difference in your love-life?

    Because when you walk around every day mostly using your quads to hold you up and move you, you are automatically Leaning Forward.

    When you mostly use your gluts to walk around, you’re automatically Leaning Back.

    Of course, we need both sets of muscles working together — and in OPPOSITION to each other — to keep ourselves strong and healthy and on our feet.

    But what happens with so many of us is these two muscle groups get all thrown out of balance.

    And which set gets stronger?

    Your quads. The ones in front. The ones that are pulling you forward. The ones that make you Lean Forward.

    Even if you work out, and you work those gluts, the chances are good that your quads, in front, are even stronger. Try this:

    1. Go ahead and take your clothes off and stand in front of the mirror.

    2. Now turn sideways. Stand normally, don’t try to have good posture just stand in a way that feels normal and right and the way you usually stand.

    3. Take a look at the lower part of your belly and pelvis and how your pelvis relates to your upper torso.

    Does it look like your pelvis tips backwards as it goes from belly button to hip? Away from your belly button? And that your butt sort of curves away from your back?

    Does it look like you’re sort of leaning forward? Like your whole body is slightly tilted forward?

    Notice where you are on your feet. Do you feel like you’re more on the balls of your feet than solidly planted on your whole foot?

    4. Put your hands on the front of your thighs. See if you can feel the tension level there. Now put your hands on your butt and see if you can feel the tension level there.

    5. Now see if you can play with shifting your weight to the front of your feet and then backwards to your heels. See if you can feel the difference in the tension in the front of your thighs and in your butt. See if you can tell a difference in the mirror. See when you’re tilting forward and when you’re tilting backward.

    6. Now stand in the very beginning position of the Rori Raye Dance Position — put one foot behind the other (so you don’t fall over). Look at yourselves standing sideways in the mirror, and see if you can get comfortable tilting your upper body slightly backward.

    See if you can tell the difference between how your quads in the front of your thighs are working and how your gluts in the back of your hips are working.

    7. Now take this out into the world. See if you can tell when you’re Leaning Forward and when you’re Leaning Back. See if you can tell which muscle group you’re using.

    This has made a huge difference in my awareness of how my body contributes to the “vibe” I radiate.

    Let me know how it works for you. Love, Rori



  411.  #411Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Get Your Man to Come To YOU…

    Friday, 29 August 2008 @ 5:35pm

    Leaning Forward and Leaning Back are Tools that help you “get” – in your BODY – what the “energy flow” between you and a man feels like.

    And most of us are ALWAYS Leaning Forward.  Because Leaning Forward is the same as “giving, serving, offering, doing…” all the Masculine Energy things we’re taught to do with and for a man that absolutely don’t work.

    What works is to Lean Back and Appreciate a man when he “gives, serves offers” and “does” for US.

    Here’s that basic question, from Mira:

    “Dear Rori, What does “leaning forward”  look like when you are sitting in a chair at a social event –  What is the body posture? Mira

    Here’s my answer:

    Mira, Leaning forward looks like sitting on the edge of your chair or bar stool, and leaning toward the room, or toward a person you’re speaking with.

       I know it’s had to lean back in a loud place – you almost have to get your ear to someone’s mouth in order to hear what they’re saying, and you have to lean in and shout to be heard – but no matter what, you can find as many moments as possible to lean back in the chair, or turn your barstool so your back can lean against the bar, then cross your legs and let your arm drape over the arm of the chair, or on the bar, or just softly in your lap or on the seat of the chair.

    And what does Leaning Back do for you?

    Lots of things.

    It gives “air” and space between you and everyone else.  It gives every man in the place a chance to be drawn into you.  The energy exchange shifts, you look and feel more confident, and your inner man magnet kicks in.

    Try it and let me know how it feels…

    Love, Rori

     



  412.  #412Brenda on September 18, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    Nikita,

    Nice posts..thanks!

    Physically leaning back reminds me to psychologically lean back.

    Leaning back to me looks like not initiating calls and conversations, not continuing conversations that are otherwise ending, not reaching out for a caress, hug, or kiss, not cooking…and the list could go on.



  413.  #413Brenda on September 18, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    I am still in love with Ryan, but I feel scared if he comes back in my life. Whenever I would show him love, he would treat me bad. When I would back off, he would come to me and romance me. As soon as I would respond with love, he would hurt me to the core.

    I need to decide how to respond when he texts me again. He enjoys having power over me. I don’t like that at all. I don’t know what to say when he texts me. It’s not safe to open my heart. My heart is the weapon he uses to hurt my heart, like Anthony Hopkins as Hannibal feeding a man fried pieces of his own brain. Bad memories.

    I need to be prepared, because he is coming back into my life.



  414.  #414BarbinOz on September 18, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    #409 Nikita

    Lovely, lovely post……sigh…..I wish this man would hurry up and show up in my life.

    I put my profile up on the paid dating site but have to wait 24 hours for approval, hopefully “he” is on that site 😀



  415.  #415Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    would you ladies be willing to give me feedback (and maybe more questions) on the latest blog post at SpiritualSeduction.com/articles? I’d really appreciate it



  416.  #416BarbinOz on September 18, 2010 at 5:03 pm

    #413 Brenda

    I hear that you are still in love with Ryan, but as you have said so many times he is “dangerous” maybe even a Toxic Man, I don’t know I haven’t read up on that one.

    His keeping in contact with you is keeping your focus on him, why don’t you try shifting the focus onto Brenda and new men, what about the restaurant manager guy? Tell us something about him and how you felt when he spent that time talking to you……

    I know it is SOOOO hard to be in love with somebody who is not good for you, the head tells you this, but your heart aches for that person and the love you both had.



  417.  #417Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    Brenda – i feel excited that Ryan is starting to pursue you.

    “He enjoys having power over me.” – this is a judgement about him. no matter how much “evidence” you have to uphold this belief, it’s just a total guess… holding this belief will prevent you from experiencing the contrast, what you want

    are you able to let that belief about him, and what he may be thinking drop? and instead notice the feelings behind it… as fear… anger… ?

    that will move you along much faster…

    my guess is that when you backed off, he got a chance to pursue you, hence the romantic overtures…

    and that when you responded with love in the past, it may have been in a lean forward way that pushed him away



  418.  #418Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:28 pm

    “I have lived most of my adult life being clueless to how to conduct human relationships.”

    this line triggers me. when i read this… i get triggered and feel judgemental… it sounds like someone putting themselves in a victim position, and pulling for my attention on something that to me feels inauthentic

    conduct human relationships… what does that mean?
    how does one conduct? such a thing…

    how can one be clueless, or cluefull of this?

    this feels really inauthentic and i feel angry reading it. i don’t want to be exaggerated to . i feel defensive, angry ,

    on alert and mistrustful when i read this sentence

    .



  419.  #419Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Rori’s lean back tool is DEFINITELY NOT! intended only for the beginning stages of a relationship.



  420.  #420Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Whoa! Erika…well I was stopped in my tracks at your photo!!! ahem, now I’ll go look for a post! But you know what is it with the photo – femininity? sex? just feels good to you? you’re beautiful and you want to let the world see it? wondering….and wow! HOTTT girl alert!



  421.  #421Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    in fact, it was Rori’s first babystep to saving her marriage



  422.  #422Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:34 pm

    i feel really frustrated at the way im hearing myself communicate here right now. i feel so controlling, and then i feel bad.

    mmm

    i feel sad

    i love myself



  423.  #423Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    you know whats yummy like cheese sticks?

    melting cheese in the pan with thanksgiving stuffing mixed into it



  424.  #424Jacqueline on September 18, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    THE most well written, cognizant, articulate thing I’ve ever read or IMO that you’ve ever written on your work, Erika! Amazing!!! Kuddo’s high 5’s and Eurekas!…..This will answer all our questions about your method and also points to the disconnect some of me and my friends have felt for years about not being able to just manifest the “Secret” no matter how many times we listen to Abraham, etc. The has to be some other component or missing piece we’ve discussed so many times…and as close as I could come to it would be the ingrained patterning/reactionary/ego as self cannot be harmed thing we grow into. Just yesterday I was telling my bff that I liked positive intentions better than positive thinking because as long as her – mostly unconcisous but definitely there self resented supporting 4 people, NOTHING she did to try and be positive about it or on top of it was going to change it. So, yes!!!! there must be clearing, there must be freedom from attachment to ego self, there must be a way to transform….

    and I’m so glad you’ve made it your life’s dream/work!!!!

    PS – I was asking Brenda if you all had thought of doing an audio of the class? Cuz I’ve got other committments but I too believe one can just be there energetically.

    Thank you for revealing more – rofl…..- of yourself!!

    xoxo,
    J



  425.  #425Daria on September 18, 2010 at 5:50 pm

    “In a book titled, “Your Own Worst Enemy”, Kenneth Christian, PHD, discusses how ‘gifted’ children have a tendency to underachieve later in life. I hope he excuses my simplification, but Dr. Christian argues that when adults start referring to a child as ‘gifted’ or one of the brightest in a class, that child tends to get exceptions on things that other students don’t – he receives praise because he is ‘special’ instead of for specific accomplishments he achieves.

    Because he values the title of ‘gifted’ for the benefits he receives from it, he becomes fearful of taking risks that lead to failure that could jeopardize this title – and thus underachievement ensues. ”

    oohh… wow… this feels intriguing ! i can relate to this



  426.  #426Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 6:21 pm

    Daria,

    Thanks for the resource.



  427.  #427Daria on September 18, 2010 at 6:35 pm

    Nikita – i love you.

    hehe



  428.  #428AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    Nikita-

    I found a really good post about 12th house that might interest you. Not the usual gloom & doom interpretation.
    http://astronuts.tribe.net/thread/f710fed2-3a74-4169-b22a-466034b667ee



  429.  #429AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    Daria- How did it work out the other night when you were hungry? Did you ask? Did it feel good or…?



  430.  #430Daria on September 18, 2010 at 6:59 pm

    Amber – i texted him as he said he’s coming over… i feel hungry if you have food…

    he texted back… oh i only have oatmeal.

    i said oh, lol thank you anyway, i have oatmeal

    then he texted me from the store to ask what i want

    i said the salt and pepper kettle chips

    he said ILL check!!!

    i said lol

    he came with all natrual jalapeno chips (yum) they wre out of salt and pepper… Adn with oatmeal and popcorn

    lol

    he’s sweet

    i felt happy



  431.  #431Daria on September 18, 2010 at 6:59 pm

    I have my north node in the 12th house in Cancer



  432.  #432Katarina Phang on September 18, 2010 at 7:03 pm

    I’m watching “Notebook” and sobbing….

    I can see myself in that situation soon. 🙁



  433.  #433Daria on September 18, 2010 at 7:03 pm

    “*North Node in 12th House

    You are finding peace, solace and spiritual meaning in this life. You will make fortunate contacts with those who are able to give selflessly, and with spiritual teachers and higher spiritual powers.

    *South Node in 6th House

    You need to break away from obsessive, perfectionist habits



  434.  #434Daria on September 18, 2010 at 7:04 pm

    “*North Node in Cancer

    You are learning to care for and nurture others in this life. You will make fortunate contacts with people who nurture and care for you.

    *South Node in Capricorn

    You need to break away from strong ambitions and over-concern about your achievements and reputation.



  435.  #435AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 7:07 pm

    Daria- Hehe. That is cracking me up. Are you sending messages to yourself via astrology?

    I like how that worked out with sweet boy. It feels so good to me when a guy goes out of his way to make me happy 🙂



  436.  #436AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    Katarina- I’ve never seen it, but it doesn’t sound good 🙁



  437.  #437Katarina Phang on September 18, 2010 at 7:11 pm

    Amber, why? It’s a classic love story…about choosing two men you met in 2 different times both of whom you love…



  438.  #438AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 7:15 pm

    I meant the sobbing and seeing yourself in that situation. Heh.



  439.  #439Rori Raye on September 18, 2010 at 7:15 pm

    Hi – I saw a bit of a dust-up and wanted to clarify my “guidelines”
    1. I prefer Feeling Messages and discourage judgments and advice because that’s what I teach.
    2. If you judge others, you’re judging yourself, and that’s not good for any of us.
    3. There are many professional coaches and therapists on this blog, some you know of, and some that just show up “not” as coaches to interact as their personal selves – and since their business is to give advice, like it is mine…they speak differently – and you are free to love them or not, and I’ll step in if I don’t like the language (some of the coaches have been contacted personally by me to help with this “professional voice” here – and I do the best I can to help depending on how it feels to me…)
    4. Though I want this to be a safe place – this is the why of Feeling Messages and the “I” voice – I cannot see every comment, so sometimes it will not be. Still – know this is the point – safety, Feeling Messages are the point – because THAT’S what we’re practicing here…like Circular Dating.
    5. If you are feeling unheard or mowed over by someone with a stronger “voice” – please let my assistant Melanie@CoachRori.com know, and I’ll step in…
    6. If you have a strong voice and have been told by someone else here that they FEEL “mowed” down by you…I urge you to take a look at that. What effect does that have on the rest of your life? AND – if you don’t want to “follow the program” here – please look at why, then, you ARE here. I’m not for everyone. I change my mind sometimes. I learn new things and discover new things all the time. If you wish to change ME – is that really what you want from me?
    7. If you are feeling mowed over by someone here…please think of this as a great opportunity to deal with being triggered – to practice standing up for yourself and speaking your truth WITHOUT ATTACKING or being defensive. You can’t PAY for this kind of training. Practicing here, with other women, will help you SO much out there! Everyone really loves everyone else – I believe that…we just all have different patterns, different realities, different experiences, and different desires. But I do believe we all want to see each other HAPPY. And that’s what we’re about here.
    If you experience some pushing and shoving – let’s see together what we can do with it, rather than just try to “banish” it. I love controversy and challenge, and I believe that’s how we learn “love,” and that we are all here for love.
    Hope this helps!!! Love, Rori



  440.  #440Rori Raye on September 18, 2010 at 7:17 pm

    8. I do not want to see anyone fade from the blog because you feel judged or mowed over – so please email my assistant and I’ll try to help you personally…Love, Rori



  441.  #441Katarina Phang on September 18, 2010 at 7:30 pm

    Amber, I see what you mean. I was just being in the moment and enjoying the movie. It’s great, you have to see it.

    Texted SG about it (and that I was crying) and he texted back “Awww… I’d like to hear about it sometime. Maybe by the fireplace. :)”

    So sweet he is. I asked what his favorite love story was and he said “Vanilla Sky.”

    I want to see that one now. Anyone has seen it?



  442.  #442AmberS on September 18, 2010 at 7:35 pm

    Wow. I feel really sad. I feel like strength and freedom just lost the election.

    I feel so disappointed.

    Since I don’t want to have to speak feelspeak all of the time I don’t feel comfortable here now.

    I feel grateful for the help I’ve received here.

    I don’t want to be in a place where safety is the number one concern. I don’t grow in that environment.

    I feel stuffed down choking and smothered having to re-word everything into feeling.

    I also feel respect for Rori & want to honor her wishes.

    Thank you Rori for sharing your tools & your beautiful island. Thank you Sirens for the growing you helped me do.



  443.  #443Simply Shannon on September 18, 2010 at 7:37 pm

    I’ve been missing everyone. Life feels crazy busy, and I’m choosing sleep over catching up on the blog. Just wanted to tell everyone hi and that I hope the call with Erika goes well tomorrow. Sadly, I’ll miss it. Hopefully next time. I’m looking forward to hearing about it! Shannon



  444.  #444Dorothea on September 18, 2010 at 7:42 pm

    whaaaat is happening here, i feel confused and frustrated that i don’t have time to read all the comments.



  445.  #445Dorothea on September 18, 2010 at 7:47 pm

    Feeling messages are AMAZING. they’ve gotten me what i want both romantically and professionally. i use them as much as possible because after deliberately practicing them for some time, which felt awkward, they became second nature, which was a bridge to my true nature – my inner feeling core.



  446.  #446Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 7:50 pm

    Daria,

    I have a 12th house north node too 🙂

    Amber, I did enjoy that link. I don’t see the 12th as doom and gloom. I see it has the midnight house; shadows, secret selves, hidden psyche, institutional green paint – all things hidden and unseen…..but that’s just my view…Pluto is in my 12th – I like Pluto 🙂
    Thanks for sharing and clarifying though….I did appreciate their take on it; very casual….



  447.  #447Erika Awakening on September 18, 2010 at 9:07 pm

    “7. If you are feeling mowed over by someone here…please think of this as a great opportunity to deal with being triggered – to practice standing up for yourself and speaking your truth WITHOUT ATTACKING or being defensive. You can’t PAY for this kind of training. Practicing here, with other women, will help you SO much out there! Everyone really loves everyone else – I believe that…we just all have different patterns, different realities, different experiences, and different desires. But I do believe we all want to see each other HAPPY. And that’s what we’re about here.
    If you experience some pushing and shoving – let’s see together what we can do with it, rather than just try to “banish” it. I love controversy and challenge, and I believe that’s how we learn “love,” and that we are all here for love.
    Hope this helps!!! Love, Rori”

    I don’t know why, Rori, but I feel really moved by this … tears and everything … one of the things I love about this space is it does give a precious opportunity to stay connected through conflict. To practice different approaches and see what works and what doesn’t. People can disconnect, but why, when it’s so fun to see if we can reach understanding. I feel happy and tearful reading this 🙂

    As one of my NVC dear teachers said, “in a tense moment, I get present, and … I do whatever serves connection.”



  448.  #448Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    I suddenly feel crappy. I agreed to do something tomorrow and I really want to cancel it. I’m eastern standard time….and I was excited about erika’s tele class. I feel so angry at myself for not getting the time zones right. 🙁
    I thought it would be 11am my time. But I guess it’s 5pm my time. I feel soooooo sad. I don’t know what to do. I never do anything on Sunday and now I agreed to something else today thinking I could do both but I can’t, I have to choose. I feel so sad and disappointed and angry!!!! How could I miscalculate that-I used to live in California!!!!! I don’t want to look flaky or bad. I don’t want to be seen as unreliable but I feel so angry, I don’t want to miss something I feel excited about either 🙁

    What am I going to do?



  449.  #449Nikita on September 18, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    Now I can’t sleep 🙁



  450.  #450BarbinOz on September 19, 2010 at 12:02 am

    I think the Erica thing is at 8pm Monday night for me?? Lynne in Melb hellppp!!

    I don’t have a microphone does that matter? Can you just be like an audience member without having to speak? I don’t even know what a teleclass is, so this is new to me 🙂



  451.  #451Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:03 am

    Omg!!! Is stupid a feeling 🙁

    I feel sad sad sad . I feel hungry. I sleepy. I feel mad! I hate this stupid agreement I made to do what I don’t really want to do! I felt tired of saying no, so I said yes and now I feel so mad I said yes I want to punch them!!!!! Everyone who knows me knows I don’t do ____________ on Sundays!!!!!!!!!!!! Sunday is my special day!!! I do not feel good giving away my special day 🙁
    I’m feeling very bad and guilty!!!! Omg, I feel guilty and sad because I can’t clone myself, I can’t be in two places at once:( I don’t want to be in this position:(
    I feel soooooo sad..omg, can I just write I feel heartbroken 1000 times. .?



  452.  #452Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:07 am

    Wow- if it’s midnight in San Fran -it’s 5 pm in melbourne –
    Says the iPhone…..how many hours is that?

    Waaaahaaaaaaa 🙁

    I feel so sorry for myself. I hate math and I Fu$ked it up again 🙁

    Waaahaaaaaaaaaaaaa



  453.  #453Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:10 am

    It is now 3:08 a.m. In manhattan -WTF ?
    How could I invert that?????? Why did I do that???? Why!!!!!!!!

    I hate commitment now. I said yes and now I risked my circular date with HBR 🙁

    Waaaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa



  454.  #454Lucy on September 19, 2010 at 12:19 am

    Nikita, I feel so bad that you are feeling so bad. 🙁 Praying for peace for you and that the best solution will flutter gently into your heart. <3



  455.  #455Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:19 am

    I hate this!!!!!

    This is like the biggest limiting belief EVER!!!

    Love or Money?

    I want both,!!!!!!!! I want it all!!!!!! I don’t want to choose between a relationship and the world 🙁

    Waaahaaaaa 🙁 I want it ALL!!!!!
    And I want it now!!!!

    I don’t want to be a slave to other people 🙁

    I want to be the master of my own destiny……so why did I double book….?! 🙁

    Grrrrrrrrrrr

    Why 🙁

    Pout pout pout….stomp my foot….stomp all my feet…..throw myself on the pillow and just have a tantrum…….. !!!!!
    🙁



  456.  #456Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:21 am

    I’m going to punch my heart for sleeping on the job!!!!!!!

    Heart!!!!!? Where were you when I needed you…..speak up!!!!!!!!! You knew we had plans!!! Why did you agree to that???????? Why?????? Why ?????



  457.  #457Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:23 am

    And I feel crampy 🙁

    I’ll never sleep!!!!!



  458.  #458Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:27 am

    I feel tight and angry and tense in my skull….I feel my jaw clenching up ….I don’t remember when in was this angry……but I feel so sad now I don’t care 🙁
    I’m breaking a promise to myself and I don’t do that anymore 🙁 why is this happening????? I want an answer, universe! Why?

    I’m going to get a pickle.

    And I want my answer !!!!!!



  459.  #459Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:31 am

    Thank you Lucy



  460.  #460Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:40 am

    Afghan farmers grow a lot of poppies — more than anywhere else in the world. While most of the crop is converted into opium and heroin, it could just as well be used to create poppy seed bagels — as many as 357 trillion of them by one estimate. The way I see it, Leo, you have a comparable choice ahead of you. A resource that’s neutral in its raw or natural state could be harnessed in a relatively good cause or a not-so-good cause. And I bet you will be instrumental in determining which way it goes.

    “Whether I shall turn out to be the hero of my own life, or whether that station will be held by anybody else, these pages must show.” So begins Charles Dickens’ novel David Copperfield. I’d like to inspire you to write a story of your own that begins like that. For help, tune into your EXPANDED AUDIO HOROSCOPE.

    *
    SACRED ADVERTISEMENT
    Dumb suffering is the kind of suffering you’re compulsively drawn back to over and over again out of habit. It’s familiar, and thus perversely comfortable. Smart suffering is the kind of pain that surprises you with valuable teachings and inspires you to see the world with new eyes.

    While stupid suffering is often born of fear, wise suffering is typically stirred up by love. The dumb, unproductive stuff comes from allowing yourself to be controlled by your early conditioning and from doing things that are out of harmony with your essence. The smart, useful variety arises out of an intention to approach life as an interesting work of art and uncanny game that’s worthy of your curiosity.

    Come up with two more definitions about the difference between dumb suffering and smart suffering.
    *
    The preceding oracle comes from my book, PRONOIA Is the Antidote for Paranoia: How the Whole World Is Conspiring to Shower You with Blessings.

    Ok, this feels a little better



  461.  #461Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 12:43 am

    Pickle was good…..now I think I’m going to have an ice cream sandwich……but do I desire another pickle first?mmmm…



  462.  #462Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 1:01 am

    This is an excellent time for you to revamp your relationship with your body. All the cosmic rhythms are aligned to help you. How should you go about it? The first thing to do is formulate your intentions. For example, would you like to feel more perfectly at home in your body? Would you revel in the freedom of knowing that the body you have is exactly right for your soul’s needs? Can you picture yourself working harder to give your body the food and sleep and movement it requires to be at its best? If you have any doubts about how to proceed, ask your body to provide you with clues.

    How’s your fight for freedom going? Are you making progress in liberating yourself from your unconscious obsessions, bad habits, and conditioned responses? For assistance and inspiration, tune in to your EXPANDED AUDIO HOROSCOPE.

    *
    SACRED ADVERTISEMENT
    In her book Vodou Visions, Sallie Ann Glassman argues that Vodou (the preferred spelling among its practitioners) is an authentic religious tradition worthy of respect. She acknowledges that some of its beliefs may seem unusual. For instance, Vodou’s calm, gentle, sweet spirits are not always forces for good, while some of its hot, turbulent, revolutionary spirits are not necessarily bad.

    Although not a practitioner of Vodou, Raymond Chandler had some related counsel: “The disease of niceness cripples more lives than alcoholism.”

    Borrow this meme. Monitor the calm, gentle, sweet spirits in your life for the possibility that they may act as agents of deception or passivity. Be inspired by the creator gods and goddesses of ancient myth, who playfully forged millions of beautiful things using wind, mud, tears, and lightning. Tap into the fiery aspect of your nature that drove you out of your mother’s womb and into this world in the hour when you were born.
    *
    The preceding oracle comes from my book, PRONOIA Is the Antidote for Paranoia: How the Whole World Is Conspiring to Shower You with Blessings.

    ……yeah, niceness …….blech!!!!!!’



  463.  #463Daria on September 19, 2010 at 2:06 am

    Thats too much. you cant do that.

    you cant have that.

    what kinda feeling is that?

    hopelessness?

    fear?

    disappointment

    you cant have what you ask for

    a part of my being, an older, wiser part…

    already knows that i no longer need to belive that i cant have what i ask for

    and that part of my being is willing to inform the rest of me now

    it is now doing so with grace and with ease

    my mind body and spirit are receiving the information

    information transfer is now complete

    &&&



  464.  #464Daria on September 19, 2010 at 2:09 am

    a part of my being already knows how to revel in the freedom of knowing that the body i have is exactly right for my soul’s needs

    and that part of my being is informing the rest of me now

    my mind body and spirit are receiving the information

    information transfer is now complete



  465.  #465Daria on September 19, 2010 at 2:13 am

    does there have to be a wound to desire healing?

    i want to heal my triggers around teh word healing

    thank you

    angels please help me

    thank you

    i would like to have what i ask for too

    thank you angels

    i would like to feel worthy

    i would like to feel happy when i feel unworthy becaue i know it predicts a treasure inside the feeling bad that is gentle and right like brook over stones



  466.  #466Daria on September 19, 2010 at 2:34 am

    im practicing leaning back with the cat… its working…

    im practicing leaning back with my anxiety feeling… its semi working

    i feel like its laborious to breathe… being with this feeling of anxiety

    i love my feelings anyway

    i believe that i will get stronger and have greater capability to feel my feelings Comfortably as i practice so thats why im doing this

    like an emotional workout

    maybe a real workout or stretch would feel nice

    going upstairs to sleep before my dad gets home

    i dont want to hide in my life anymore]]

    i love my patterns

    beautiful colors on my magic carpet
    i want to ride the carpet to a beautiful world

    where the sky is deep purple and the stars bright white

    and even blue

    and even red

    and yellow

    and wher ethe air smells like earth

    and warms,

    and broken leaves

    and sweet grass

    and water

    and tree mold

    where my chest feels like i breathed mint

    and my head feels like i dunked into the water

    and my arms and legs and rest of body feel

    quiet and gel like

    and i feel my tummy tight

    and strong

    and my forehead clear

    and the back of my head

    lightly balanced

    my eyes fresh like tears just poured

    and colors feeding my heart

    i am afraid of my dad

    ogun

    he wants me to be happier than i am

    he pushes me

    i am afraid hes right, im falling behind, im not good enough

    i feel panick, i feel rush, i feel desperateness, i feel sadness

    i love these feelings

    it feels like being whipped with them like lashes

    i love my whips

    these are MY weapons of the warrior Goddess

    i take charge of them now

    i am in charge of me and my feelings

    my whipping feelings

    my whip feelings

    whip

    whip
    whip

    whip

    and i want EVERYTHING

    i want my body to babystep to beign that body in the story where the magic carpet took me

    i want my mind to babystep to finding what kind of mind it wants to be

    i want to be a happy, powerful mind, that does big things, and helps people in a big, satisfactory feel way

    i lkike big eating like lots of sushi

    like that

    and i want my stomach back strong

    and i want strong happy digestion fore the first time NOW

    and i want to feel good chilling at the computer… in all ways… yes ALL ways… yes i went there and reached out and got greedy and said ALL WAYS and i want to erase the belief that thats greedy and i want to Understand and Feel and Heal what is IN this sensing of greedy

    thank



  467.  #467Ragnell on September 19, 2010 at 3:04 am

    David DeAngelo is not someone I would trust. I’ve read many people saying he keeps charging and charging your credit card even though his services are no longer requested.



  468.  #468Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 3:37 am

    I feel curious about listening to the world at level ii. It feels laid back and calming. Listen to thismoment as if it’s themost interesting thing in the world. Be over there with the moment. Get curious about the moment.

    Imm this makes my time feel fun



  469.  #469Melb(a) Lynne on September 19, 2010 at 3:37 am

    Hi Barb in Oz,
    Its 8.40 pm Sunday now… so whatever time is on the blog.. will be the time diff to Melb/Syd.
    But where is Erika’s thing… ? Same time meridian as this blog? or mot?
    And what time (wherever Erika is) is it?
    Lynne 🙂



  470.  #470BarbinOz on September 19, 2010 at 3:43 am

    2pm Sunday PST, so I think that’s 8pm our time Monday night……..

    Just read your story on Jlina’s website AND I answered it 😀



  471.  #471Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 3:44 am

    Hmm it feels bad to hear David deangelo gettin the bashing… I’m quite partial to the fellow… And was never overcharged by him personally.

    I feel judgmental and mistrustful because I don’t see people being overcharged, as billing error, which to me is not something that triggers mistrust. I would feel angry however if the error was not corrected.

    His double your dating book was a fascinating read .. I tried to use it on guys… With not much success cheese… Now I get why and rejoice in my secret femininity jewel box



  472.  #472BarbinOz on September 19, 2010 at 3:44 am

    #468 Daisy

    I have never really understood this Level 2 listening, can you tell us a bit more about it???

    Thank you



  473.  #473Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 3:49 am

    Mama’s Daily Fluff:
    “True desire is all about pleasure. Pleasure is highly moral, because if an action you take would cause pain to someone else, it is no longer pleasure. The fulfillment of true desire will result in gratification and glory, not only for the woman, but for everyone around her.”



  474.  #474Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 4:01 am

    Barb in oz – do you mean with a man? Or with the world?

    It’s a listening where all attention is over there with the man as his speaking, where there’s nothing more important in the world than listening, with no interruption … Just encouraging ok’s, hmm, yeah, Oh, aww, that would feel…

    When he’s done I continue to be silent a few seconds to make sure he’s done.

    This kind of deep listening allows the listener to feel heard on a deep level and that leads to great things like spontaneous creativity and feelng loved and loving.

    I am mire recently experimenting listening this way to the world, metaphorically in a way. Meaning really treating the incoming imput from the world… The movie I’m watching , the question I’m asked, the sound of the sprinklers, for example… As the most interesting thing to hear and experience… And being ‘over there’ as rori says with what’s going on in my immediate environment.

    It’s great right now … I was expereincibf negative thought patterns… And listening to my environment instead of my thought loop now made it only one of the options of what my brain is captivated by and can choose to explore. There are other options infinite, in my environment. U suddenly feel safe and calm here, in this piece of universe I’m riding.



  475.  #475Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 4:16 am

    What is Deep Listening?
    By Joe Bailey

    See all articles by Joe Bailey
    See Joe Bailey’s expert page

    4
    Your rating: None Average: 4 (1 vote)

    Share |
    What is Deep Listening?
    From “Slowing Down to the Speed of Love”

    Deep listening occurs when your mind is quiet. Your thoughts are flowing rather than crowding your mind with distractions, interpretations, judgments, conclusions, or assumptions. Your mind is open, curious, interested — as though you were hearing this person for the first time. Deep listening applies not only to communication with another, but also to listening to ourselves and to life in general. The goal of deep listening is to hear beyond the words of the other person and yourself, to the essence of what the words and feelings are pointing to. Your mind and heart are joined in union — you are listening wholeheartedly.

    Deep listening is effortless; it is more like listening lightly to your favorite music, the sound of a stream rushing by, or a bird singing. When we listen to these delightful sounds we are under no pressure, we aren’t analyzing or figuring out — we are simply letting the feelings and sounds affect us. Deep listening is not defensive, argumentative, or intrusive. It is not about struggling to analyze or interpret. It is a purely receptive state of mind. In a state of deep listening, we realize our oneness. We realize that we are not separate, but truly one spirit — we are connected.

    When we listen deeply, we let go of any beliefs we have about the other person. We let go of our prejudices and past memories of him or her.

    Here is an example of deep listening in action.
    One day, Julie and Jeff were talking about the possibility of getting together with another couple that lived on the other side of the country. On prior occasions, every time Jeff would bring up the possibility, he sensed that Julie had a resistance to it. This time, she opened the subject. She said, “Let’s talk about getting together with Bob and Celeste.”

    “I get the feeling you aren’t sure about getting together with them, is that right?” Jeff asked.

    “I’m not exactly sure what’s going on with me about it. Can you just listen to me for a moment till I get some clarity?”

    “Sure.” Jeff cleared his mind of his agenda and just listened to her. He opened himself up to seeing a new possibility.

    She said, “I want to get together with them, but I just feel like staying home at this point. After the holidays and all the traveling we did this fall, I don’t seem to be interested in doing anything but staying home. Perhaps they could come here? Maybe we could tell them we’d like to get together and let them know we’d like them to come here.”

    “I’m open to that. I’ll call them and take it to the next step and see what happens.”

    As it turned out, other circumstances came up, and their friends couldn’t get together with them anyway. If Jeff had tried to pursue his agenda of going out West, it would have been a waste of time. More importantly, by not pressing his point and by being open to what his wife had to say, Julie felt heard and respected for her feelings.

    In the past, Jeff might have handled this situation differently. He might have had thoughts like, “She never wants to do anything!” He would have tried to logically convince her of why they should go where their friends live: because it was warmer there, because they lived by the ocean, or whatever else supported his agenda.

    In contrast, deep listening enabled Jeff to understand and respect Julie’s feelings, and he felt fine about the outcome of their talk. This non-pressured approach to listening helped Julie to sort out her own feelings, which is conducive to gaining insights. And he felt loving, secure, and quiet while he was deeply listening to Julie.

    This interaction led to a feeling of closeness and connection between Jeff and Julie. It helped him to see the situation in a new way and to let go of his agenda, and it helped her get clarity on what she wanted to do.

    The goal of deep listening is to be touched by the other person and to hear the essence of what he or she is saying. Deep listening is based on a feeling of unconditional love and respect. It stems from our natural Self, from timeless love. In addition, it slows you down to the speed of love.



  476.  #476BarbinOz on September 19, 2010 at 4:58 am

    OK Daisy thanks for that, its kind of like listening without interrupting, or having your answer ALWAYS prepared in your head before the person has finished speaking? I am SOOOO guilty of doing that and am one of those people who always has the smart a$$ comment ready, never short of a quick quip and an immediate response, I blame it on my mercury Gemini brain 🙂

    I am going to practise this level 2 listening even at work this week and go with the flow instead of my ego jumping in…….

    Thank you Daisy



  477.  #477Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 8:12 am

    :/



  478.  #478Erika Awakening on September 19, 2010 at 8:36 am

    Hey Ladies,

    I’m feeling excited for our call today. I’ll be in sessions most of the day with very little free time, so if you need to get in touch with me, please do so NOW at Erika@ ErikaAwakening.com

    A few important notes:

    1. A number of women have asked me: “If I’m not able to make it for the call today, will it be available by audio?” The answer is yes, I will make it available on my website for a modest fee, likely $29.97, to cover technological and other costs. It remains free for anyone who joins us live today at 2 pm PST. Thank you for your support and your understanding that the recording with not be free due to the large amount of time investment and technological investment that goes into something like this 🙂

    2. Some women have noticed finding “excuses” for why they are not able to be on the call or not able to participate despite making a prior commitment to participate … and I really invite you to challenge yourself here … HBR is a powerful healing technology. At the risk of triggering some people here, the ego does not want you to get healed. It will therefore put up all kinds of obstacles to prevent you from receiving healing, EVEN WHEN IT’S FREE.

    The best antidote to this is to practice what Rori teaches about SINKING INTO YOUR FEELINGS. Feel the heart fluttering, feel the part of you that wants to run, and STAY PRESENT. If you are able to face the fear directly, it will dissolve, and your feelings of self-consciousness and “I can’t do this, it’s too vulnerable” will disappear. If you run away from the fear, it will continue to run your life. And I really ask you to go deep with this and be more honest with yourself than you’ve ever been before …

    Look forward to you being on the call.

    Barb, it is perfectly fine to listen in without speaking, so not having a microphone is okay. For those feeling a lot of fear coming up, I highly recommend you just listen in and remember to TAP because that will dissolve the fear.

    Again, yes, the audio recording will be made available afterward as a product for a modest fee, so if you wanted the free call, please do whatever it takes to be there at 2 pm PST.

    Love,
    Erika



  479.  #479Lizzie on September 19, 2010 at 8:38 am

    Hi Barb, I am off to a lunch party but wanted to share with you that deep listening is exceptionally difficult to do. I wrote a whole bunch about it on one of the blogs but it would take me forever to fine it for you. In essence, I wanted to say that it takes practice. As you practice, be attentive to how long you can do deep listening in any conversation – when I am training people to do this, I start with a 2 min. practice and most people can’t last 2 minutes. Of all things I can tell how stressed I am by how long I can attend. When I am down at 10 minutes, I am very stressed! at 20 min, I am pretty good shape, at 60, I am in flow. Baby steps!

    have a great day!



  480.  #480Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 8:38 am

    I feel appreciative of my anger. I honor my sadness, and I thank my temper tantrums from last night. I feel clear on what I value. I value my opinion of myself over that of anyone else’s and the way I gauged my opinion of myself was through those yucky feelings…..I refuse to blindside myself by “sucking it up” and getting on with it if it means stuffing down my feelings. I refuse to resent myself. I refuse to be my own worst enemy 🙂



  481.  #481Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 8:44 am

    Haha!

    Now I feel super proud of myself 🙂

    Is Erika saying that other women were having the same inner fight I was having?, or is she just being nice and not calling me out directly 🙂
    I feel so happy for myself!! I feel curious if other ladies were going through what I went through…..I thought of course only I could be that forgetful….surely no one else has that problem……stupid sneaky self – sabotage problem!!!!!
    I have stomped you!!!!!



  482.  #482dorothea on September 19, 2010 at 8:46 am

    Wee, I am STOKED for today’s teleclass. I love learning about new things! I already know lots about tapping, but I feel so interested in seeing (hearing?) it in action with other people.

    I love that sirens are converging in one place, even if we mostly won’t even be speaking to each other.

    I want to franchise rori and open rori raye studios and offer bachelorette party packages that include wine, appetizers, and a certified rori instructor.



  483.  #483dorothea on September 19, 2010 at 8:46 am

    nikita, i have 10+ hours of work to do today, so i am having the same experience right now.



  484.  #484Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 8:51 am

    Now I am going to go buy puppy food….and maybe that strawberry pie I wanted 🙂

    I will be feeling you ladies on the call…. Yay!!

    I vote for me!!!!!!!!



  485.  #485Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 8:54 am

    Dorothea….
    Yes, I wanted to do a meet up thingy too…..!!!! Or a monthly party- a viewing party of DVD’s and integrate tapping into it!!!
    I love coming together.

    I also believe in the power of a group….like the compounding penny 🙂

    Ok- must go to pet store….



  486.  #486Nikita on September 19, 2010 at 9:01 am

    Ugh! Can you believe a giant fire truck is blocking my road????
    WTF??? They do training but, um I need to get out of my driveway!!! Stop blocking me!!! Hot firemen:)))



  487.  #487life_is_too_short_to... on September 19, 2010 at 9:18 am

    Dorothea,

    I feel your excitement!! I will be listening in today too!

    What an amazing community has built up around Rori Raye. I feel so supported to be around such kindred spirits.

    L



  488.  #488Dorothea on September 19, 2010 at 9:35 am

    Riffing
    I feel vulnerable and exposed. I feel like when I was a little kid or a teenager and I did something that I knew was bad and I was waiting to get found out by my teachers or mom. That feeling. I don’t know what that feeling really is. I just know what it feels like in terms of a superficial experience above a whole soup of feelings and processes.

    I want to change my name on this blog. I don’t want to be found out. Having social web in my life has always made me feel anxious. It feels like how I feel in the experience I described minute ago.

    I am not good enough. I am going to embarrass myself, and feeling embarrassed feels like being trapped, like needing to just scream so hard my lungs bleed. That strikes me like if I did that I would feel like I was releasing and getting out of the inescapable embarrassed feeling. I feel worried that everyone in my life and who meets me will see through to the pathetic, self-deluded because I sometimes act like I am as important and special as everyone else is, and self-deluded self.

    I think this might be my biggest fear. Being exposed.

    I have feelings of unworthiness. And I can’t say what they feel like because as soon as I identify and acknowledge the feelings of unworthiness, they dissolve. It feels like a tension-releasing dissolution, and I question whether the dissolution is one of yummy release or the feelings of unworthiness are fleeing to preserve themselves. A sneaky illusion.

    I feel reminded of evangelicals who are always claiming that certain ‘good (and easy)’ things of our world are just the devil trying to trick us. And I think those people are f*cking crazy, so can I apply this logic to my own fear about whether the feelings dissipate for good or for bad? Probably, yeah, actually that seems like a pretty rational and solid comparison. Maybe I am just slightly unconsciously brainwashed from living in America, where this christian belief – that many good things are just the devil tricking us and influencing the world at the expense of our morality – and judaeo christian paradigms are blanketed over just about everything in society?

    Actually, that’s probably where that comes from.

    But I feel resistant to using rationality as a way of more permanently addressing this belief. I can think myself sideways till Sunday…but it never worked before to improve too much.

    My gut is saying OMG tapping! Duh. Tapping. I am good at thinking my way through my beliefs and identifying them. This is good! I am going to try tapping more.

    I feel embarrassed thinking about incorporating tapping into my life. I am back at the beginning of this ‘riff’ where I was feeling vulnerable and exposed, like the people in my life will judge me and like me less because I am doing something “crazy.” I’m not sure if I know anyone who taps or would take it seriously.

    But I am a linguist. Linguistically, energetically, and physiologically it is a form of programming the human computer. Language faculties in the brain, both the universal faculty that houses instructions for using and acquiring language and the one that codes in instructions and information for using your first language, operate under a hardware-software relationship, and the analogy to computers like this actually runs pretty deep.

    I have nothing to be ashamed or embarrassed of. I am a linguist, whose life work is to study how linguistic elements work together to shape our individual and collective experience on earth. I am ground breaking. It would be careless NOT to incorporate tapping into my study and presentation of smaller elements of language, like sound vibration, pitch, and overall quality, as ways of speaking to your body.

    I feel excited to tap and see how it helps this yucky feeling I came here to riff about. I feel satisfied to leave it there until Erika’s call today.

    I feel light weee



  489.  #489Jacqueline on September 19, 2010 at 10:18 am

    @ Barb in Oz – thank you for speaking to Lynne’s article, I feel gratitude! She is really into using the tools and wondering about them in her life.

    @ all – have a great day! I feel embarrased to have been part of a controversy here, and misunderstood what Rori had said to me, in part ” If we were all nice and gooey and Feeling Messages – no one would be triggered, and we wouldn’t learn anything! I like provocative and shocking –I always have no fear about doing that in my programs.”

    Rori has been great to me and was even my inspiration for my blog – she thinks I’ve got a great life story and was going to post about it in two weeks; but that felt so threatening to me in light of what’s been described about me this weekend….it felt bad, inauthentic and wrong. So I declined the offer – but still feel happy that there’s a life story and ebook! in me somewhere. Smile…
    and I guess I’ll debut it on my own when the time is right.

    As for the teleclass I hope it blows everyone minds….and opens the door to pure unconditional love for one and all!

    Happy Sunday!
    Jacqueline



  490.  #490Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 10:25 am

    Yay Dorothea is getting into tapping!

    And u kno at least one person that takes it seriously… Hehe.

    Ladies a good video to use before tapping is on YouTube:

    Eft for resistance to change by innerhealingcenter.

    For me, it is very painless and straightforward, and doing that lil video before tapping enhances my ability to make change



  491.  #491Jacqueline on September 19, 2010 at 10:32 am

    I feel invalidated at the snark use of hehe….sigh….



  492.  #492Jacqueline on September 19, 2010 at 10:35 am

    and what I feel given that my feelings are everywhere today…I’m doing the walk away, see you all in a few days. Hope everyone reads my “explanation” box above…with the intention of honoring different truths and wondering about Rori’s words.

    Best,
    J



  493.  #493Daria on September 19, 2010 at 10:38 am

    I feel confused… was the “snark use of hehe” a reference to what I wrote to Dorothea? I checked and I was the only one to use hehe?



  494.  #494Daria on September 19, 2010 at 10:40 am

    ?? I’m feeling afraid and picked on? whats ‘snark’? isnt that like saying something witty to put someone else down?

    what does that have to do with my saying hehe to dorothea?



  495.  #495Daria on September 19, 2010 at 10:41 am

    I wrote it as Daisy.



  496.  #496Jacqueline on September 19, 2010 at 10:41 am

    Daria – oh, yes….well it was Daisy that said it to Dorothea, but it was in the context of at least ONE person takes it seriously, again…please read my explanation for my perceived NOT taking stuff seriously, I think you’ll find I’ve been speaking quite in context.

    But I feel bad and wrong about even replying here….and that’s why I’m saying bye for a few days! You’ve got my email…

    see you all!



  497.  #497Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 10:45 am

    Jaqueline –

    oops. i feel misunderstood. Dorothea had said in her riff that she doesn’t think she knows one person in her life that takes Tapping seriously.

    But she does,

    ME.



  498.  #498Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 10:49 am

    I was not intending to referr to you in any way, i hadnt even read your post … and i don’t know if you do or don’t take tapping seriously

    It was a message I was sending Dorothea that she knows me personally and I do take tapping seriously, so there is at least one person in her life who does so

    i feel scared and not very good that i was misunderstood =(



  499.  #499Daisy on September 19, 2010 at 10:50 am

    and called “snarky” . well my words were.

    it would feel nice to get an apology.

    i don’t feel worthy of saying something about that

    is that controlling? saying it would feel nice to get an apology