Sex For Sex’s Sake – Is That Okay With You?

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heartonbellylargeHere’s a great letter about sex from Anna:

“Dear Sirens (and Rori, of course) – reading this great post, I feel I finally need to ask for help! I’ve been thinking about this thing over and over in my mind, I’ve discussed and analyzed it with my friends again and again, but some experienced advice from this community would feel so, soooo good to receive.

Here’s the thing: I met a guy on a sex-dating website, and I feel mixed signals coming from him: sometimes it feels like he actually wants to date me, sometimes it feels he’s just interested in the physical part. And I feel confused and in need for some clarity, and I feel compelled to ask him what he wants, but I don’t know how to do it, or if I should do it at all…

Now, writing this, I’m starting to feel defensive, so I’ll add more context and explain WHY I’m on sex-dating sites… *blush* No, I don’t have a profile there to find the love of my life – that would be stupid. I’m there to raise my self-esteem, to gain confidence in my own femininity and sexuality, and to overcome some teenage traumas induced by well-meaning parents (long story short, I’ve always been a little overweight, they wanted me to get fit, so they tried to “motivate” me with things like “no boy will like you if you’re fat”, “you look like a little whale, you’re going to end up sad and alone” and “trust me, as a man, I tell you (said my own Dad): no guy will be able to ‘get it up’ for you…” – so, when I discovered the naughtier places on the web, I realized that many men ARE, in fact, attracted by me and my body).

These websites (as well as cybersex – which I wrote about in another post some time ago) have helped me quite a lot in my own evolution as a woman and a human being, so I don’t regret using them. I also have profiles on many normal dating websites, and I do Circular Date as much as I can (I might have a date later today!). So no, I’m not depending entirely on the sex-dating sites, and I certainly didn’t expect to get involved with someone from there.

But there’s this one guy who found me on a sex site and invited me out for coffee.

I was a little confused, but I accepted and we had a very nice, perfectly non-sexual date (we ignored where we met). He travels a lot from work, often in places where he has no phone/internet connection (he fixes boat engines, which I find pretty cool), so we got out of touch.

But some time after the date, he saw me online at 2 am one night, remembered where he had initially found me, and started hitting on me – we ended up having text cybersex that night, and it felt great, but afterwards, when he suggested we should turn the fantasy into reality, I started feeling bad. As I told him (and I now realize I was probably making him wrong by it): I felt downgraded, from a “date” to a simple “booty call”. He seemed to be surprised and maybe even a little hurt by this remark, and after some late-night talking, he invited me to his house and agreed to NOT have sex, just cuddle and hang out.

I accepted, he picked me up, we had a fantastic time making out like teenagers, but I still felt sad and angry with myself while I was going home alone (I didn’t want to stay overnight, and he got a bad headache and couldn’t drive me home). So the next time he wanted to see me, I said I would feel better at my own place, so he came here, we talked a bit, and then turned to sexy time again – but, again, we didn’t have actual intercourse. He seemed content to not do that, and seemed to like taking it slowly and step by step. But I still felt a little used.

Just before he left, I used a short speech like this: “I’m just a girl here, and we get hormonal and emotionally attached. See, I don’t want to be fuck-buddies, I can’t handle that. If that’s what you want, that’s ok, but we will have to stop seeing each other at some point.” Again, he seemed confused, and said “I understand, but that’s not it. I’ll text you when I get home” – and he kissed me and left in a hurry (he did text me later that night. He texted me in-between meeting, but I feel like he only wants me to cuddle with, have some sexual (even if not actual sex) activity, and have a companion for the few hours right after he lands. My best friend calls him “straight-from-the-plane guy”, since he texts me and wants to meet first thing when he arrives back here.

Last time he did that, I refused, saying I can’t that evening, but I’d love to see him the following week. He replied that he was leaving for Texas next Tuesday (it was on a Sunday), I just sent him a ” 🙁 “. On Monday, I did a bad thing, I initiated, by sending him a text that I’m free and it would feel wonderful to see him before he goes away again. He didn’t reply, and I felt awful. But he replied on Wednesday, with a “sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner” and asking me what I was doing – I happened to be out with some friends, so I replied “Hey, you! 🙂 I’m out, drinking some white wine. Feels so smooth and refreshing…” and he said just “Nice!”, to which I didn’t reply anymore. I thought he was already in Texas, but I later saw on Facebook that he only left on Friday – so, on Wednesday he was still in town, probably wanted to see me, but was discouraged by me being out and didn’t insist. Now he’s there, and I’m very sure that he is going to text me and ask me to “come over for pizza” as he did three times already.

Now, I want to see him, and I do want to make out with him some more, and eventually have sex. But I don’t want to be at his beck and call and be his cuddle pillow when he comes back from his travels, horny, but too tired to take me out. I want to give him the chance to date me, if he wants. Three times already, he seemed to suggest that he’s not interested in sex only, but I still feel confused. If he doesn’t want more, I can meet him one more time, go all the way, have amazing sex, and then move on with my life and not think about him anymore (I have had casual one-time encounters with two other guys from the same website, and it was great and very confidence-boosting). So I can respect that. I just need some clarity and to know where I stand. I’m composing speeches and scripts in my head all the time, and I’m thinking and thinking how to act. Any advice, please, please? Anna”

My Answer:

Anna – OMG – you’re going to think I’m wacky, what I’m about to say – but I don’t get your confusion here.

He sounds like a “perfect” lover to me! And what, exactly, is wrong with a f*ck-buddy?! I remember one of the best experiences of my life with a man who was exactly that. I went over there for sex, he came to me for sex.

I experienced him as a friend in many ways, for some reason I didn’t do my usual “get hung up” on him – I just loved the relationship exactly as it was – f*ck buddies.

I’m not saying this is good OR bad – I’m just saying – if you’re willing to have cyber sex, what makes you think this kind of arrangement in real life would be so bad for you?

Clearly, he wouldn’t expect exclusivity, clearly you could learn from the experience, and who’s to say it wouldn’t turn into a great, yes, a lot long-distance and on his terms – love affair.

I put no rules around anything. If you think he’s going to break your heart – he will. If you want someone to touch you physically and have sex with you – and you like the way he does it – I see no reason to say no.

That doesn’t mean you can’t by polyamorous and date and sleep with other men, too!

I’m not saying you SHOULD do this – I’m just saying that your reasons for NOT doing it need to be examined. This man is not a good candidate for lifelong partnership – and it’s not something impossible, either.

If he’s not taking you out in public for coffee or a walk – that’s a sign it’s not going to go anywhere – and, again – why exactly do you care? If the issue is the emotional quality of “intercourse” – there are ways to work around it.

Look – I don’t want you to get your heart broken, and there are likely LOTS of men you could have purely physical relationships with. I’m just saying that the IDEA of having a purely physical relationship with someone isn’t something I would mentally downgrade.

Making the “assumption” that someone else is “using” you is a leap I’d never make. AND – if it doesn’t feel good – whatever it is – don’t do it!

I’m just saying that everything is a gift and an opportunity. It’s all about the learning. If this doesn’t seem like a good learning situation (seems to me there’s a lot to work with here as regards your self-esteem and sex/emotion skills and patterns) – then don’t do it.

If it does, then try it out. Nothing’s in stone, nothing’s as it seems, it’s all about YOU.

Hardly any of us can sleep with a man and not get hung up – and if what you want deep inside you is a traditional man – Circular Date THOSE men.

I can only say from my own life (there was a period of time after I was assaulted and raped, and then seduced and betrayed by my therapist for the frosting on the pain cake, that I veered into an attempt to heal myself through sex.

What I learned is that I needed to be loved – AND I needed to be touched – AND how I perceived the qualities of, and the feelings of the man I was attempting to heal myself with created good feelings and bad feelings – and I didn’t seem to know in advance how that would go.

There were times when I had what I told myself was a “casual fling” – even in a strange city – and yet I felt bad when he didn’t seem to “care.” And there have been times when I felt the “care” and was completely disgusted by sleeping with a man who liked me more than I liked him.

And I’ve been crushed the most by men I created “Imaginary Relationships” with because I was having sex with them and really wanting love.

The problem all along – for me – was a lack of clarity. Every encounter is new, different, and doesn’t fit into a box. It’s all about the learning – and the investment you make in a particular situation.

I do not disparage the learning, under any circumstances. What I DO not want for any of you is an investment of time, energy, love and heart into a situation where the learning has been COMPLETED.

Where you are simply repeating a pattern because you haven’t ABSORBED the learning from the last-go-round. And still – I champion your going through the same situation over and over again until the learning IS absorbed – and you can move on to the next experience.

Clearly – this triggered me intensely – and I’ll do more writing about it.

Love, Rori

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149 Comments

  1.  #1Arachne on May 14, 2013 at 4:00 pm

    *giggles* Feels kinda nice to see this up here… Thank you, again, Rori! 🙂



  2.  #2Daria on May 14, 2013 at 4:16 pm

    heyo! im feeling lovely taking care of me redoing my sleeping arrangements (so no invisible fleas) … dad is out at work so no wifi in the house (makes it easy for me to be here with my electrical sensitivity not getting triggered as much)



  3.  #3Zia on May 14, 2013 at 4:53 pm

    Oops new blog post. Just want to jump in and say a REALLY good looking man chatted to me at the train station this morning, I need to learn to be open and receptive and not clam up when this happens! All in good time <3

    Feeling happy at the moment, and this is a GREAT post, thanks Rori!! Especially the part about absorbing the learning – boy that was ALL my relationship was about and it took me so long to see it!!! The universe needed to hit me on the head with frying pan to get its point across.



  4.  #4Radlove on May 14, 2013 at 5:34 pm

    Hi, I’ve been MIA for a while, just really busy, starting a new job, and wasn’t dating much. Now I’m back in the thick of dating and feeling good about getting involved in the blog a little more again. I’ve missed it here, that’s for sure! I love you ladies, and I love learning here! This is a most unique community!

    About Rori’s post, along with Anna’s…

    I have done some traditional dating and some dating for fuck buddies. I explored the wild side of myself, and I have found that when I have sex in that context, I don’t really connect with the man, and I don’t really connect with myself, either. I just feel like this wild child grown up into a tempestuous woman who does all the things she was ever taught were wrong.

    The sex feels good, but it doesn’t feel fulfilling. It could much be described as a live dildo and little more. I don’t feel impressed with the men who I meet on the sex only sites. I find that they rarely want more than sex, and their relational skills are rudimentary, in general. They bring to mind neanderthals, who think a woman is little more than two tits and a pussy, to be coarse about it. I feel like an object being used. How empty it can feel making love when love is not really there!

    Has it been somewhat therapeutic for me? Yeah. No doubt. But I find when I am truly connecting with a man and enjoying true emotional and spiritual intimacy, THEN I make love with him, it is like comparing a stuffed animal with a real puppy!

    Sometimes I feel so sexually frustrated that I want to just have sex with or without real love and connection. But almost across the board, I feel disappointed afterwards, both in the experience and in myself.

    In short, if you want to seek sex to broaden your horizons, go for it. But I think you are barking up the wrong tree when you try to use Siren tools with this man and expect him to treat you like a princess. I have experimented with both kinds of dating a lot, and I have found it is like looking for classical music on a heavy metal station…you just ain’t gonna find real romance thru a site that is for casual sex. What do you think and feel?



  5.  #5Radlove on May 14, 2013 at 5:35 pm

    Hi, I’ve been MIA for a while, just really busy, starting a new job, and wasn’t dating much. Now I’m back in the thick of dating and feeling good about getting involved in the blog a little more again. I’ve missed it here, that’s for sure! I love you ladies, and I love learning here! This is a most unique community!



  6.  #6Radlove on May 14, 2013 at 5:37 pm

    About Rori’s post, along with Anna’s…

    I have done some traditional dating and some dating for fu/ck buddies. I explored the wild side of myself, and I have found that when I have sex in that context, I don’t really connect with the man, and I don’t really connect with myself, either. I just feel like this wild child grown up into a tempestuous woman who does all the things she was ever taught were wrong.

    The sex feels good, but it doesn’t feel fulfilling. It could much be described as a live dildo and little more. I don’t feel impressed with the men who I meet on the sex only sites. I find that they rarely want more than sex, and their relational skills are rudimentary, in general. They bring to mind neanderthals, who think a woman is little more than two ti/ts and a pu/ssy, to be coarse about it. I feel like an object being used. How empty it can feel making love when love is not really there!

    Has it been somewhat therapeutic for me? Yeah. No doubt. But I find when I am truly connecting with a man and enjoying true emotional and spiritual intimacy, THEN I make love with him, it is like comparing a stuffed animal with a real puppy!

    Sometimes I feel so sexually frustrated that I want to just have sex with or without real love and connection. But almost across the board, I feel disappointed afterwards, both in the experience and in myself.

    In short, if you want to seek sex to broaden your horizons, go for it. But I think you are barking up the wrong tree when you try to use Siren tools with this man and expect him to treat you like a princess. I have experimented with both kinds of dating a lot, and I have found it is like looking for classical music on a heavy metal station…you just ain’t gonna find real romance thru a site that is for casual sex. What do you think and feel?



  7.  #7Dominique on May 14, 2013 at 7:01 pm

    Arachne – I don’t know if you ever saw my response to you when this was first posted by you a few weeks ago. I was having posting problems and wasn’t getting through.

    I don’t remember the exact words anymore, and it really doesn’t matter aside from me wanting you to know that whatever your choices are, if they feel good and right to you, then it’s good and right for you.

    And I think however you empower yourself is awesome.

    xxoo



  8.  #8Vi on May 14, 2013 at 8:59 pm

    I felt warm energy coming towards me from a man who I had never thought was capable of that… and got scared.. I feel like screaming with terror and putting my palms over the eyes. And kind of.. ‘I don’t want to see that… ?’ I love my fear. I love my terror. I love my resistance to see warm energy from certain people… It’s okay. I survived warm energy and my feelings too… I am a survivor 🙂 it didn’t feel that bad after all…



  9.  #9Indigo on May 14, 2013 at 9:17 pm

    Dominique re: your post 353 from the previous thread,

    I have told you before that I think your relationship is incredible, and that I am so inspired by it and you, and I just want to reiterate that.

    When I read your post 353, it made me think all the things I dream of in my heart are possible for my relationship.



  10.  #10Tereana on May 14, 2013 at 11:48 pm

    Wow, this post couldn’t be more timely for me. I have a man who is pursuing me with a strong accent on sex right now, and it feels sort of scary, and I clam up at times. But really, I also want to train myself to be able to relax and NOT clam up and shut down and shut the guy out, as well. I think I’m doing okay, but of course my nasty voices come in and have a say now and then also.

    I remember this post from a recent thread, too. I’m glad that Rori took this one one. And this seemed like even more of a response than I remember. I appreciate how raw and open and honest it is. I feel grateful for this post…



  11.  #11sophie on May 15, 2013 at 2:06 am

    I have deep gratitude to Rori for bringing awareness for me to my relationship with sex and men. Before I found Rori I would sometimes have one night stands and feel awful afterwards when the men would pffff. Generationally I think it had just been taught to me that one night stands was something that we did. I would also believe that I was in control and I never was. Rori brought my awareness to the differences between men and women with regards to sex and has helped me learn about my own individual relationship to it.

    I agree with Radlove (nice to see you back) that if the sex feels disconnected from loving feeling then for me that feels yuck and cold and I feel sometimes used. If the sex feels loving and connected then I feel attached and it feels more difficult if the pfffff. I have learnt to be more careful now who I choose to “make love to”. I rarely call it sex as for me I find it difficult to separate the loving feelings from the physical act.

    During a really painful break up when my partner had immediately begun sleeping with someone else I used internet sex as a way that was safe for me to disentangle my sexuality from my ex’s. I was so bound up with him in my body that I couldnt enjoy my sexuality on my own; I just had images of him and at worst of him with someone else. I never met anyone for sex or even had a camera etc but I would write back and forth ‘erotically’ and I loved that experience. It was absolutely what i needed at the time and I look back on those men I ‘connected’ with with enormous gratitude for inadvertently helping me through such a difficult time 🙂

    I am in a sexual affair at the moment which is a learning experience for me and one in which I feel very unsure of the outcome. I deliberately say affair and not relationship as he set a boundary in the beginning that he didn’t want a commitment (at least not until he was sure which obviously has a high possibility of being never). I do not feel ‘booty-called’ he is consistent with seeing me regularly and keeping in contact. However, I do not feel ‘dated’ – rori’s comment above about not being taken out makes me feel sad as this man does not do that and although I always hope that he will I am not dependent on that and instead am looking for other men who will and obviously enjoying my own independent social life. I am doing my best to limit feelings of attachment. I feel unsure of how I am doing 🙂 I am reminding myself every day that I am single and hoping I am open to other men. I do have confused feelings though about how I will feel to actually go out on a date with someone else and will definitely need some ‘coaching’ when that happens.



  12.  #12Linda on May 15, 2013 at 3:44 am

    This post causes me to pause and yet examine my attitudes and opinions. At this stage in my life I realize that my attitudes toward sex and sexuality are very different than they were when I was younger. I used to be very rule oriented and lived my life accordingly. I never considered how I “felt” about sex and my sexuality. My mother told me “dont be one of those women” when it came to sex. hmmmm Honestly knowing mom for all these years…I wonder how I even came to be! anyway….

    At this point in my life I have waded thru my feelings, likes, dislikes, desires around my owne sexuality. The key for me and the choices I have made is taking full emotional responsibility for them. Owning them guiltlessly and using the experience to understand how I truely feel has been invaluable to becoming the woman I am today.

    There has been a huge shift in me. I used to be other centered.. but after seeing that is a huge diservice to me and how it hinders having the relationship “I” want I focus on me first now. I know from experience now what I need to feel and want for the physical part of a relationship to be satisfying for me. I could not say that 5 years ago. I am glad for my journey. I know me better and am glad that I had the courage to discover who I am and became a safe place for myself.



  13.  #13Linda on May 15, 2013 at 4:03 am

    My youngest daughter just had boyfriend break it off with her yesterday. It seems the same thing keeps happening to her over and over. It is so hard to watch. I have such empathy for her. I cried for her as I mowed the grass last night.

    I have tried so many times to introduce the information I have learned here. She sorta listens but has rejected the idea of Cding…

    This last guy looked her up.. pursued her… she was not even looking for a relationship… she told him in the beginning that she was not looking for a fling but was only interested in a committed relationship etc etc…it seemed all was going so well, then to use last night…her words… “he broke it off with me…I was totally blindsided”. She asked..”How can a guy tell you are everything he wanted and more…and could see himself spending the rest of his life with you, but because he finds himself thinking about a relationship he had with a 3 year on again off again ex-girlfriend that he has to figure that out and doesnt want to see you anymore”?….. I have no answers only tears for her. My heart is heavy for her today. sigh



  14.  #14Dominique on May 15, 2013 at 5:51 am

    Indigo – 8 – Thank you for this. I don’t think I can reiterate this enough. My relationship came to be primarily from my deep work on ME.

    Rori wrote an incredible testimonial for my video program summing this up beautifully.

    It’s at the bottom of the page if you’re interested.

    http://sexandheart.com/the-goddess-way

    xxoo



  15.  #15Mercedes on May 15, 2013 at 6:51 am

    If this were me, considering where we met and the fact that my feelings were a little stronger than “just sex” at this point, I would have a long talk with him about it. I’d probably even say pretty much these exact words:

    “Now, I want to see him, and I do want to make out with him some more, and eventually have sex. But I don’t want to be at his beck and call and be his cuddle pillow when he comes back from his travels, horny, but too tired to take me out. I want to give him the chance to date me, if he wants.”

    He might be indicating he wants more than just sex but he’s probably just as confused…again, considering where you met.

    For me personally, it would be very difficult to cultivate a relationship with someone I met on sex only site.

    Much Love,
    Mercedes



  16.  #16Linda on May 15, 2013 at 7:14 am

    In my previous post (11), I mentioned spending time on getting to know how I felt about my own sexuality. Emotinal connection is key for me in a physical relationship. It is a must have in order for me to flourish. At this point in my life I am ALLLL about flourishing. I looked up the meaning of the word… ” to grow luxuriantly” “thrive” YES YES YES.

    I just wont spend time in or remain in a relationship that does not allow, encourage, or develop into a place where flourishing happens.

    We meet people everywhere. All kinds of websites etc.I People have varied attitudes about them all. I personally do not have any issues with using Websites to meet people. I mentioned to someone that I used a free dating site (POF)…actually is where I met FavoriteCD… they said OMG.. that is so dangerous and I would never do anything like that, there are bad people out there!…. hmmmm

    I felt judged for a second there…but let it go.



  17.  #17Kath on May 15, 2013 at 7:16 am

    Dominique, I just wanted to thank you for pointing out the article to me on the previous link- It does ring true. He has been mirroring me but I also think that there are elements of lots of other things going on too. I do think that he looks to me for emotional strength and I let him down by not speaking my truth earlier-but then whenever I have spoken my truth he has not heard or listened or accepted that there is anything that can be done about it- its just my issue, my problem and he doesn’t see why he should do anything. However, when I look at when the relationship was good, it was before I moved in with him- I didn’t get to see the real him!- I only got to see the guy he puts out in the world- not the one who struggles being an emtionally available and functioning human being. I do really think that we could get passed this but I don’t think he can- it was too extreme for him and by him saying that he fears that I do react in the same way every time really means that he is scared that he will react in the same way every time. Sorry- I don’t mean to dominate the post with my stuff again- I just find it really helpful to think things through with you all- I’m seeing my Counsellor on Friday so that’ll help to get further peace and clarity and when he comes back at the weekend I am expecting him to say that we’re over- he has decided on all his other relationships-so I feel I have no influence over it- and after all it is about my future too- does that sound crazy??



  18.  #18Linda on May 15, 2013 at 7:59 am

    Kath – I read your other posts and the other sirens comments to you. First of all I want to give you a hug. Drama does not feel good. Second… you need to find another place to live. IF it would me… that would be my FIRST priority. Mirroring , anger, blame, what was said, why… it is all secondary in my mind at this point. There will be plenty of time to figure things out for you and grow beyond where you are right now.

    I let a man who things were good with move in with me because he needed help..(was being evicted ) Of course hindsight is 20/20 as you are finding and well know. My decision to help him… was a terrible decision and life BECAME a living hell for me. It about broke me financially, strained all my relationships and I became isolated even from myself. It felt noble and reasonable to help… but as you said.. the real person emerged in both of us!. OMG it was awful.

    So… please take care of you first. I hope something wonderful falls into your lap to brighten your day and that it brings hope, light and healing. I spend some time detoxing after my situation ended. It was the beginning of the beauty I have in my life now. (hugs)



  19.  #19Veronica on May 15, 2013 at 8:36 am

    I just feel so awful today. After telling BM that I couldn’t be friends with him anymore because I was feeling way too much, he wanted to talk about what I was feeling. He didn’t want us to stop communicating. What makes this so tortured for me is that I’ll hear things like “I don’t like you any less, I miss you, I still think about you, I care about you but my life is here.” He doesn’t want me out of his life but I can’t handle being friends.

    I feel so shaky and insecure. And so misunderstood – he thinks I’m being nostalgic. I know I have so much work to do. I know it’s CDing time and put him on your horse time. I don’t like how I am now though. I wish I could just get it and not feel so much. Or maybe I can just admit that I do love him and be proud of my love. Find another place for my love to grow, like seedlings, starting off one place and bearing fruit in another. Maybe not feel so wrong about still loving – how do I do that? Maybe I can notice all this love and it’s strength to exist, look lovingly at it. Then it’ll be just me and this love – I can see me riding a horse with this blazing love in me and now I don’t feel so hollow. I feel like those saints like Joan of Arc with such inward strength, shouting with such focused conviction as we ride. But I write this now but will I still feel this way tomorrow? I need to hang onto this image. I can feel this love that so badly wants to live and I suppose me with it. I feel like I’ve turned a corner – I hope that when I wake up tomorrow that the love will still be there. I hope I’m not deluding myself.



  20.  #20Kath on May 15, 2013 at 8:36 am

    Hi Linda,

    Thank you!- I Guess I’m still feeling raw!- not sure what to focus on first. I can shut off from him but then he has done the same with me and it is uncomfortable- I’m glad he’s not there for a few days but I really don’t like being in the house on my own. I know I need to look inside me and focus on me but what happens when you love them and want them to work with you to make the relationship better- is that all part of him stepping up?- I have stated what I want and what I need and I’ve just been told what I need to sort out- that its all my issues which is hardly helpful- sorry!- I’m off again on my confused and pained ramblings!



  21.  #21April Rose on May 15, 2013 at 8:49 am

    Kath,
    How long have you lived at his house, and do you still have your own house?



  22.  #22April Rose on May 15, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Linda,

    I too helped a man, and he came to live with me, and his marriage had just ended. I feel so silly and naive, in hindsight.

    That was four years ago. I still find it a struggle to live with him, although at least it’s no longer in my own house. We live in rent-free work accomodation.

    If asked do I want to marry this man, I would say no.
    Not sure of my next move.



  23.  #23Syreena on May 15, 2013 at 9:16 am

    In our imaginations and fantasy as women we are able to do the fucccccc0k buddy thing.

    In real life how is being a fucoook buddy working for you.
    How is that working out for you in reality then?
    How do you honestly feel afterwards?

    It appears by the thread not very good and you want more.
    “afterwards, when he suggested we should turn the fantasy into reality, I started feeling bad. As I told him (and I now realize I was probably making him wrong by it): I felt downgraded, from a “date” to a simple “booty call”

    If you want to stop feeling bad and want more and not just be a booty call, then don’t be a booty call again. Learn from it that it made you feel bad by not putting yourself in that situation again.



  24.  #24Kath on May 15, 2013 at 9:46 am

    April Rose, I moved into his house last June after he’d been to Court and had a repossession order nearly slapped on it because he’d stopped paying the mortgage and his wife refused to pay anything. Things have gone down hill since then but mostly because I now feel that I made the wrong decision and I’ve beaten myself up for making that decision and all the effects that has had. I don’t blame him but he hasn’t helped the situation!- Perhaps he’s mirrored my feelings of depression and anxiety and has become withdrawn and more aloof because he perhaps thinks I blame him-which I don’t-and even though I have tried to work with him to get through this, it feels as though he has put up more difficulties, whether consciously or not, which have made matters worse and made me feel that he has abused my kindness and has now backed off because I have picked up on things he didn’t want me to see or find out. The biggest one being that he can’t stop talking about his wife, what she did in the marriage, things she said, etc etc etc- and its driven me nuts!-I know, I should have said something but I thought I was being counsellor to him and helping him process stuff- now I know different!



  25.  #25Sirana on May 15, 2013 at 9:49 am

    My husband and I have been together for 18 years. We were inseparable and amazing for 8 of those years. In the last 10 years we have spent a lot of time fighting and repeating level 3 damage. We both don’t want to leave but he says that he does not believe he will ever feel the same about me again. His heart is closed. However, he constantly makes plans for us to do wonderful things together like quite dinners alone or creative Friday nights. I confuse this as a possibility that he is opening up but his words say otherwise. We are best friends and I think he is just enjoying my company. I don’t believe he is in love with me like he used to be. He does not initiate affection other than before sex. It is breaking my heart. I have made many mistakes and so has he. I am practicing all the tools especially the reduction of overfunctioning. I have stopped chasing him like I have been for the last several years. I think he is becoming happier every day with our new calmer “friendly” lifestyle but he is not willing to open his heart to me.

    Please help with any thoughts,

    Can’t Settle as Friends



  26.  #26Olivia on May 15, 2013 at 10:31 am

    I like that this post is challenging and probably triggering everyone in different ways. Cool.



  27.  #27Dominique on May 15, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Kath – 17 – You’re so welcome.

    I want you to keep close that you are NOT responsible for his emotional reactions or stability. This is his job if he’s up for the task.

    All you can do is continue to work on YOU which would include how you respond an interact with him. Keeping your heart open even in the face of say a storm.

    He will change, or he won’t. He may or may not change as you do. A good man, the one for you will heal through your heart, again IF he’s the one for you.

    xxoo



  28.  #28seahorse on May 15, 2013 at 11:25 am

    Dominque 26- All you can do is continue to work on YOU which would include how you respond an interact with him. Keeping your heart open even in the face of say a storm.

    Hi. What does that look like?????



  29.  #29Dominique on May 15, 2013 at 11:49 am

    seahorse – Working on you looks like digging down deep to uncover and heal old traumas and wounds, releasing chronic holdings and tension where much of your hurts are held, learning how to be open and curious about your world, filling your life with people and activities and things which fill you up, make you feel good, passionate even. It looks like bringing most everything back to you to see why things trigger you, what needs attention or healing. If it didn’t trigger you, it wouldn’t bother you and thus not need healing.

    It looks like doing your best to keep your heart open to most anyone, no matter what is being said and done, and remembering that everyone else has hurts and traumas too and often behave coming from this painful place. Please note I said most anyone, not everyone, for there will be exceptions.

    xxoo



  30.  #30MovingMagic on May 15, 2013 at 12:53 pm

    I’ve had f-buddies from time to time. There’s boundaries that I naturally set in these kind of relationships. I’ve had to zone out emotionally with them & still stay present when in their company. If you’re able to find the balance & understanding within yourself it can be fun. That’s the focus here FUN. It can often be more challenging for women to separate sex & emotions, but if you’re open to learning & experimenting with the. experience it can be a rewarding one. You don’t know until you try. 😉



  31.  #31Rori Raye on May 15, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    Sirana – Don’t give up – this is about “The Modern Siren Combo” of being warm, open, fully sexual, sensual. self-loving and appreciative of him, while Circular Dating and having the ability to leave him without losing yourself. You have much to learn, many skills to practice. Don’t stop now! Love, Rori



  32.  #32Turquoise on May 15, 2013 at 1:56 pm

    Hi Sirens…. I think I’d like a fun buddy for the summer… there is a guy I know from high school, we keep in touch on facebook and he lives pretty close. He just posted a profile on POF and wrote to me… he looks pretty hot…. I might lean forward and ask him out. We flirt a little now and again, but I haven’t seen him in years. He looks like he’d be good in bed though, and he’s a nice guy… I’m tempted.

    Mr. Conversation alluded to wanting to hook up, but it’s not materializing, which, reminds me a lot of last year. It was really good, I’m very attracted to him, but when we were together, it was brief. And never did I feel like I could say, I want you right now… always had to be his idea.

    My date was BAD, at first it seemed good, that he was a nice guy, nice looking, but then it go weird because he kept asking me the same things over and over, even though he’d comment that he knew the town I worked in, had heard of my company, was strange. He didn’t seem like he’d been drinking before, but maybe. But the really bad part was that when we were saying goodnight he got aggressive, not wanting to let me go, knew I was kid free for the weekend, I had to push him away, and if there hadn’t been a guy standing right near us, not sure how that would have gone.

    Funny, I wouldn’t mind a fun buddy, but I want that on my terms. Someone I know and trust to an extent, not a new guy I just met 3 hours ago….



  33.  #33Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 2:01 pm

    Tereana thank you for your reply to me about mother’s day on the previous post …
    (((hugs))) to both of us…I feel the same way you do. I want the partner to share the baby with 🙂

    There are days when I feel I’m losing hope…but more and more I’m learning and realizing that I cannot and should not regret my past decisions to end relationships that were not healthy for me.

    I’ve second guessed myself quite a bit over the past couple of years. This is finally starting to heal as I feel that I know that I was looking out for my boundaries and wanting to feel safe in a relationship…things that were lacking pretty badly with my serious exes from the past. One of which was a good provider and 100% dedicated to me but he did not respect my boundaries or my need to be my own person. So what is the point of being married to someone like that???

    I have been really bad lately with practicing the tools…I have been so busy and not on the blog much…but I want to get back to my Rori tools asap…

    Leaning back in all ways…
    5 second smile… (soo hard for me!!!!)
    Waterwheeling….
    Paint yourself….
    My eyes are magnets….

    Also practicing being nice to myself…not speaking harshly to myself!



  34.  #34Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 2:14 pm

    Regarding this post, I have learned about myself that it’s hard for me to have a f&ck buddy. It may start out that way but I will eventualy develop feelings, it never works for me. Even if the guy is a terrible candidate as a boyfriend and not stable in his job/life etc. I will still fall for him if we keep having good sex.
    I cannot go this route even though I have tried to turn RecycledCD into a f-buddy…I always end up hoping we will be a couple.
    ExoticCD has come on very strong sexually with me and it’s too soon for me as we dont have a trust built up yet…I don’t like how pressured I feel sometimes but at the same time yes it’s good he finds me attractive…
    But I find it unattractive that he can’t control it enough to help me feel cherished…
    Maybe I’m being too hard on him…and he’s just being “a guy”….
    But I need to feel safe and have a level of trust…I don’t want to catch a disease or get hurt…



  35.  #35Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 2:25 pm

    Turquoise that felt scary to read. I feel tightening around my nose and mouth trying to bring back memories of date rape. Trying to say no but having him continue.



  36.  #36Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 2:29 pm

    I kind of have to disagree with Rori on this one,, for myself at least…
    To each their own….
    If they can handle it then it’s up to them to decide…

    I feel that accepting behavior of just having sex with no dating or having a man take us out for dinner or anything….has the potential to establish a pattern of tolerance for that type of relationship….

    How do we draw the line or learn to have a man cherish us? Do I feel cherished in a wam bam thank you mam situation?

    Do I feel valued and does it help me boost my own self value?
    For me, no.

    I’m not in that place and the only time I was, I can honestly say it was when I was emotionally totally shut down and the sex friend was purely primal and when the cracks in my shell started to happen…it was all very messy and confusing because then I started having feelings…

    And the guy was like “What”??? I thought you were a heartless beauty…just a f*ck machine..
    well no actually I’m a human and a woman with a heart and feelings and blood that runs thru my veins..



  37.  #37Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 2:31 pm

    Emerson do you date ExocticCD?



  38.  #38Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 2:38 pm

    FW yes, mostly going out to dinner. But he has stopped making plans with me since I’ve put down some sexual boundaries…I am leaning back…
    Have questioned myself leaning back too much maybe he thinks I’m not interested, but he should know since I told him I feel open to see him oand get to know him….
    No solid plans for the past couple weeks, but he still calls and texts…flirts, acts like a friend, sometiems acts interested and sometimes hard to read. I’ve learned to stop trying to figure it out.
    But I don’t know if he is looking for a f)ck friend maybe.. I don’t know.
    I am attracted and we have kissed and gotten a little hot and heavy but no further than that…
    Any comments welcome…



  39.  #39Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 2:38 pm

    Sirana hi. I believe if he really wanted out, he would be gon already. I do believe you hold a lot of power to influence things.



  40.  #40Shar Lean Way Back on May 15, 2013 at 2:44 pm

    FW, How would you see Sirana using her power?



  41.  #41Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 2:44 pm

    Emerson boundaries are for you. What do you mean put down boundaries? Also how did you share that?



  42.  #42Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 2:48 pm

    FW
    In the heat of the moment he wanted to take things farther, and I told him I’m not ready for that.

    I said I don’t feel comfortable with that yet…
    I don’t recall my exact words but he wanted me to give him oral sex and take thigns farther but I told him i want to get to know him first



  43.  #43Sherri on May 15, 2013 at 2:53 pm

    Dear Rori,

    I’m beginning to think I am cursed. Any relationship I enter into with a man starts out great and then I realise things aren’t perfect and then I end up feeling trapped and making myself, and him, unhappy.

    I don’t seem to have the discernment about whether I am sabotaging my own happiness, or if the two of us just aren’t a good match.

    I lost my parents when I was young (a teenager), and turned to angry political causes. I have mellowed a lot over the years and done a ton of self-development. Yet I haven’t found long-term happiness with a man.

    Your suggestions would be so welcome.



  44.  #44Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 2:56 pm

    Shar the way I see it is he is still sexually attracted. He initiates so that tells me he does not feel rejected. Also though there has been fighting he is not angry enough to withdraw sex. As such I would experiment with sensual meditation to change my internal state about myself and amp up the sensual vibe. I would drop all arguing and fighting and experiment with using a soft voice. One other thing I think I would try is getting another best friend even if it is imaginary and try laughing at myself in his presence. Like sharing a private joke with my friend to inspire curiosity and more attention towards me. Explore creativity to get out of the routine. You know go back to the things we do when we have a new lover.



  45.  #45Shar Lean Way Back on May 15, 2013 at 3:01 pm

    I like that FW..I am going to explore it more



  46.  #46Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 3:01 pm

    Emerson then I would check in with myself to see what I was doing up to that point. Was I clear from early on that I did not want to go there. Or was I vague and he might have felt I pulled the plug at the last minute so now in his mind I am a tease? Also is there any thing I might have said that caused him to feel judged for being himself?



  47.  #47April Rose on May 15, 2013 at 3:04 pm

    FW,
    That date of Emerson’s sounded creepy from the off.



  48.  #48April Rose on May 15, 2013 at 3:06 pm

    Oh, I think you are talking about another guy. Oops



  49.  #49Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 3:07 pm

    Thanks FW I really don’t know how he would get that impression.
    I never said I’m open to jumping into bed…actually I stressed that I have traditional values.
    I think he is just impatient and wants it NOW.
    Sorry but I don’t want to at this point.



  50.  #50April Rose on May 15, 2013 at 3:07 pm

    Gosh, I feel soooo silly. It was Turquoise’s date that was creepy.
    April Rose, I think it’s time for bed.



  51.  #51Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 3:12 pm

    How do you express your traditional values? How do look when held up against being hot and heavy?



  52.  #52Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 3:33 pm

    Sirana/shar I would also look to increase appreciating and complementing him, his contribution to the household, things that help him to feel respected.



  53.  #53Heart on May 15, 2013 at 3:38 pm

    Hi Blog – Katarina – thanks for the input. I have no desire to date someone at work. And I’m really not interested in him like that…

    Btw Blog – my nasty voice has become a lot sweeter…



  54.  #54Heart on May 15, 2013 at 3:43 pm

    ((((Veronica)))) it will pass….



  55.  #55Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 3:47 pm

    50 fw
    ???



  56.  #56Femininewoman on May 15, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    Emerson these are tough questions to ask oneself. If you are not clear on them yourself how can you help someone to understand you? I believe in being clear on personal standards so as not to give double messages. I believe good men are okay with waiting



  57.  #57Arachne on May 15, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    Woooow, I love seeing all the responses, and how this case triggered so many other women. It feels wonderful, I feel useful, even if indadvertedly. *gives herself a self-pat on the back*.

    I also feel a little overwhelmed by how MANY comments were written in the meantime, I’ll try to answer as many as I can…



  58.  #58Arachne on May 15, 2013 at 6:37 pm

    Radlove – Thank you so much for sharing! It feels great and very useful to hear your story!

    And your advice about barking up the wrong tree is very wise, but I feel the need to add some more details, if I may. First of all, it seems I was somehow more lucky than you, in the sense that I have only met (face-to-face, not online) nice, tender, attentive men. Of course, out of all the guys that wrote to me on the websites, I only carefully selected those I had a connection with, and had communicated intensely with, for at least two-three weeks. I even refused some that I have had great cybersex with, because their manner and desires, though very arousing in a virtual space, would have made me feel uncomfortable and used in a real-life situation. In fact, I only had two “sex-dates” so far, plus a very interesting encounter with a couple… (I will share some more details about the experiences and my feelings, if anyone is interested.) So these experiences were carefully planned and anticipated, not random – and, therefore, they did not feel meaningless or “empty” to me. It was great therapy (self esteem-wise), and I only felt lonely and a little sad after the experience with the couple (having witness all their passion and love for each other reminded me I am alone) – after the other two, I freckly felt like a goddess!

    Making love… well (and I feel very sad admitting it), I think I’ve never actually “made love” in my life. I’ve been in love with men that either didn’t exist (fictional characters!), were unreachable because of circumstances, or simply weren’t “interested in that way”. *sigh* I kinda miss feeling in love… Anyway.

    You ask me what I think and feel – I feel I need more sex-as-therapy in general. As for this guy that was mentioned in the post, I’m beginning to like the idea of being ok with being fuck-buddies. But I’m not sure yet. I will have to wait and see how it feel when (and if) he texts/calls me again. I still don’t have a plan. Oh, well.

    I need to go to bed now, I’m feeling awfully sleepy. I will answer the other comments sometime tomorrow, hopefully.



  59.  #59Arachne on May 15, 2013 at 6:38 pm

    Radlove – Thank you so much for sharing! It feels great and very useful to hear your story!

    And your advice about barking up the wrong tree is very wise, but I feel the need to add some more details, if I may. First of all, it seems I was somehow more lucky than you, in the sense that I have only met (face-to-face, not online) nice, tender, attentive men. Of course, out of all the guys that wrote to me on the websites, I only carefully selected those I had a connection with, and had communicated intensely with, for at least two-three weeks. I even refused some that I have had great cybersex with, because their manner and desires, though very arousing in a virtual space, would have made me feel uncomfortable and used in a real-life situation. In fact, I only had two “sex-dates” so far, plus a very interesting encounter with a couple… (I will share some more details about the experiences and my feelings, if anyone is interested.) So these experiences were carefully planned and anticipated, not random – and, therefore, they did not feel meaningless or “empty” to me. It was great therapy (self esteem-wise), and I only felt lonely and a little sad after the experience with the couple (having witness all their passion and love for each other reminded me I am alone) – after the other two, I freckly felt like a goddess!

    Making love… well (and I feel very sad admitting it), I think I’ve never actually “made love” in my life. I’ve been in love with men that either didn’t exist (fictional characters!), were unreachable because of circumstances, or simply weren’t “interested in that way”. *sigh* I kinda miss feeling in love… Anyway.

    You ask me what I think and feel – I feel I need more sex-as-therapy in general. As for this guy that was mentioned in the post, I’m beginning to like the idea of being ok with being f—-buddies. But I’m not sure yet. I will have to wait and see how it feel when (and if) he texts/calls me again. I still don’t have a plan. Oh, well.

    I need to go to bed now, I’m feeling awfully sleepy. I will answer the other comments sometime tomorrow, hopefully.

    PS: Grrrr, it feels so annoying that I never remember to not spell the f word so my comments will be posted without moderation!



  60.  #60MovingMagic on May 15, 2013 at 7:03 pm

    My talk with AttentiveCd went so well. It feels so freeing to put my own needs first. 🙂



  61.  #61seahorse on May 15, 2013 at 7:21 pm

    Hi there Sirens! I absolutely love this post from Rori and Arachne…………… triggering, yet a welcome trigger, if that makes sense.

    Dominic- I love what you wrote. I do more and more everyday uncovering past hurt. In your book you had mentioned the tension we hold and that we hold the tension in our wombs. YES!!!!!!! As i go through my day and FEEL all, I can feel the answering tightens sometimes in my lower half!!!! It gets easier to let go of the tension as the days are passing. I prefer going through my days with my heart out there and shining away and to be only me……………………sometimes when the trigger hits and I don’t pay attention to my feelings and body, my back and legs hurt at night. So, meditate and stretch helps before I slide into myself to find what the trigger was. I feel amazed and sometimes frustrated to take care of myself this way. Thank you very very much sweetness. To all the Sirens thank you for being here and for posting. I receive so much healing from reading, thank you Sweet Sirens:)



  62.  #62Zara on May 15, 2013 at 7:38 pm

    My Medical Choice
    By ANGELINA JOLIE
    Published: May 14, 2013

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/14/opinion/my-medical-choice.html?_r=0

    xxx



  63.  #63seahorse on May 15, 2013 at 7:38 pm

    As I am reading this all over again……………. for the umpteenth time…………. I feel a lot of shoulds and NO, you cannot do that!!! So, like Rori said in the response, I am examining it…………… Know what????? I feel angry! Dammmmmmiiiittt!!! I feel angry at my ex.. I feel angry at the boyfriend that told “good girls” don’t give bl0w jobs…….. I hate control!!!! Be a good girlfriend and stay home while I go out!!! I went out anyway…….. I feel giggly at remembering that

    Feeling why “should”? I didn’t feel that way. Didn’t want to rock the boat so shhhhh shhhhhhh. Be a good wife………… I thought when i got married It was Anything goes………….. nope. I feel sad and angry at all those years of holding that poison hurt in my womb……. I love on that all because it’s mine and beautiful and because I wouldn’t be in this glorious moment right now……………………

    Should……….. They say………….should should should…………… I say they should kiss my behind…………. hehehehehehehe……….. they might think I’m not a good girl for that comment!!!!! I love my humor!!!!!! hqahahahahahahahahaahha!!!!!



  64.  #65seahorse on May 15, 2013 at 7:42 pm

    I feel that ‘should’ is from soooooooo dang looonnngggg ago. It’s like a old prickle fence around my sexuality. Ohhhh this is big inside…… It feels like a present though and I feel anticipation…… Thank you!



  65.  #66seahorse on May 15, 2013 at 7:43 pm

    62 Zara- She rocked that!!!!!!!!!! Thanks for putting that up!!



  66.  #67Liquid Light on May 15, 2013 at 7:59 pm

    I really have problems with Angelina having a double mastectomy of her healthy breasts! I really think there are more holistic ways of dealing with this. Its sad what message this sends to girls and women: we have to self mutilate ourselves to be healthy! There are other ways to deal with this potential disposition, like diet and lifestyle etc. It is not a death sentence. Really upsetting to me that she did this and that this all over the news! Uck.



  67.  #68Turquoise on May 15, 2013 at 8:04 pm

    Yes, FW.. I felt it could have gone wrong. I had my keys in my hand and there is a panic button… I also parked close to the building and it was well lit, all in my favor. It was very crowded, I could have been parked further away… Grateful things worked out the way they did.



  68.  #69Turquoise on May 15, 2013 at 8:11 pm

    I’m actually impressed with Angelina’s decision to go from an 87% risk to 5% risk, for her family. I’m sure that was a very difficult decision. I lost my sister to breast cancer. She suffered for 8 years, and while she lived longer than her doctors expected, the cancer ravaged her, and she left behind 19 and 23 year old sons and a husband, plus all of us. Not a day goes by that I don’t think about her.



  69.  #70Liquid Light on May 15, 2013 at 8:17 pm

    a f-buddy…why????? I just can’t imagine this. it seems like men are coming on to me all the time for sex…but what I want is a relationship with depth. I dunno, maybe its because in my relationship, he was obsessed with sex and wanted to do it all the time. It was exhausting and totally took the fun out of it! Ack!!!



  70.  #71Francesca on May 15, 2013 at 8:32 pm

    @ Veronica 19
    I am going through something similar and found the advice on this blog that I turn inward to my own feelings , acknowledge, and honor them without the need to do anything very helpful. I find myself telling myself that I feel conflicted. It feels so much better to honor my feelings and open my hands to let go of holding onto another who isn’t the one who can give me what I need right now.
    I also like to take the focus off of my love for him specifically and just notice how fervently I can love and how wonderful my ability to love is.
    When I do a meditation on all the things that would make me blissfully happy in a partner and imagine that wonderful man in my life, it leaves me content with the knowledge that I need more than I get from the man I love (who does not love me) and that is ok. He taught me a lot about myself and what I need.
    It sounds like you are on the right track of how to handle all of your emotions. I am trying to be patient with myself and stop trying to figure everything out perfectly. I hope some peace comes to your heart and you turn some of that love for him onto yourself . I think you should feel confident you will find your love because look how hard you are working to do it right!That is all you can do.



  71.  #72Rori Raye on May 15, 2013 at 9:06 pm

    Sherri, Welcome – and you can DO this…Being with a man requires a lot of “adapting.” There’s no other way to put it. It requires doing the hard work of personal development in CONCERT with another human being. You learn about yourself through the relationship. So – there can’t be a curse – it’s all a learning process. How about you Circular Date, and take each date one at a time. When you start feeling afraid – work with that. Learn to feel it, sink into it, speak it, and not ACT from it. You can do this! Love, Rori



  72.  #73Indigo on May 15, 2013 at 9:12 pm

    Emerson 38 & 42

    That reminds me of something my therapist said in my session yesterday, where he recommends women put down boundaries in the early stages, especially around physical involvement and getting to know each other and spend time together first, because many guys are impatient and will bolt if they do not get this soon.

    Having said this, Evan Marc Katz actually has wonderful advice about how to turn a guy down for sex in such a way that you still communicate your attraction and his ego is not bruised, and he feels inspired to continue to give you what you want.



  73.  #74Liquid Light on May 15, 2013 at 9:19 pm

    I’m so sorry for your loss, Turq.

    All I am saying is that I don’t think its all black and white as the media paints it : either your (healthy) breasts or your life. There are other options. We live in a “cancer culture” IMHO and that fear pervades everything. We need to start looking at other options, like what we eat and how we live our lives.



  74.  #75Andrea on May 15, 2013 at 9:32 pm

    Hi Everyone. What a great post. I have really been contemplating the whole sex issue this week. I love it that “going out” for me now is all about practice, practice, practice. It makes me feel as though I’m really accomplishing something along with having fun. I’m always happy when I’m self improving.
    So, I went out on Monday with a girlfriend. We sat down for drinks at a Green Mill bar, and right away there were two men sitting close by who started to kind of flirt with us.
    I put on my normal, friendly, outgoing nature and that was okay… it’s kind of a leaning forward, controlling the conversation, loud kind of being. It has always been my way. (I’ll admit it’s exhausting and usually fruitless.. it’s just how I have always done it.)
    Men pick up on this and call me “fun loving”, they laugh and jaw jack and get paw-y… I guess I give off a vibe like I’m easy going and cool with anything. It’s fine for the men. They don’t have to do anything at all, they can be stupid abnoxious pigs, and I still laugh and pretend and (it’s really yuck).
    Anyway, these guys at the Green Mill right away went for sex jokes and tried flirting by talking about sex and boobs and pussies.. and it was ick. (But I was realizing that this is the typical guy that I attract)
    My friend and I left and I was just noticing.. just learning… (I didn’t like it, first of all. I didn’t like the men, and didn’t like the effort, and didn’t like the feel of that experience.)
    We went to another place. This place was quieter and I decided to really try to be more settled into ME. I leaned back. I practiced feeling just me, just what I was feeling in the moment. I realized I was actually feeling kind of sensual, kind of horny actually. But I internalized. I can’t explain it.. I just.. instead being all bawdy and loud and “hey I’m horny” girl.. I just held it inside me.
    A man bought my friend and I drinks. Then we got into some kind of discussion where I kind of jokingly said, “I’ve never been accused of being cute.”
    Another man who was close by said, “You know what’s interesting. There’s something about you. I wouldn’t say that you were cute, and it’s something more than physically sexy… but… it’s just that you kind of instill in me a deep sexual desire for you. It’s like, instead of focusing on how you look, when I’m around you, I’m focusing on.. I guess, just how much I want to be with you. I guess being near you let’s me focus on me. I think most of these guys can feel that as well.”
    That has caused me to really step back and realize… I don’t know… I’d always kind of worn that sexuality on my sleeve.. maybe even given the impression that I was easy.. and attracted thoughtless horny toads. But when I just held it inside of me, just felt it with out acting on it, I got some very sensitive and heartfelt feedback. I had no idea.. really no idea..
    And I’ll tell you what, I think that feedback he gave me, that’s the stuff of real relationship. There’s a difference in a man thinking I’m a sexy woman, and a man feeling deep inside of himself that he has a strong sexual desire for me. I think it’s the difference in looking good, and BEING magnetic.

    Now on Friday, my main guy.. love interest… ex bad relationship… is coming back into town and he has been relentless in his pursuit of me. Flirtatious phone calls, texts, and even a letter in the mail. He has hinted that he wants to devour me when he sees me again. I’m flirting back because it feels really good to be seen by him as sexy again. But now I’m learning to live in each moment as if it is THE moment. I don’t trust this man anymore. I’m realizing that I have many other options and that the more I practice the better the options will be for me. I’ve been thinking about sex with this man again, and realize that I don’t need to be anxious about it because I’m starting to trust my NOW presence. I think he will be surprised at how changed I really am. I think that he’ll be shocked when I lean way back… even in his presence, even after all the flirtation. What he doesn’t understand yet is that I’m learning to live very freely in the present moment without apology or explanation. And that I’m starting to realize the difference between feelings that are grounded in my own experience of my heart and body right now, and thoughts that are based on fears from the past or anxiousness about the future.
    It really is a whole new life.



  75.  #76Liquid Light on May 15, 2013 at 9:49 pm

    An incredible woman like Angelina and people are applauding her for her bravery for having her breasts removed. There is something really wrong with this picture! It is so twisted!!! I’m sorry but this is so appalling and depressing to me!!! Ughh.



  76.  #77Zia on May 15, 2013 at 9:53 pm

    Hello blog and sirens, I’m feeling the withdrawl from my ex strongly today. I know that as more time passes since I’ve seen him I’ll be ok but ugh. On the plus side, I have a bowling date this evening 🙂



  77.  #78Veronica on May 15, 2013 at 10:25 pm

    Turquoise – I feel panicky hearing about what happened. I’m relieved you’re safe.

    Heart – 53- Thank you.

    Francesca -70- Isn’t this blog amazing? I mean before I felt the options I had were to either become a hard person or to feel and carry all that hurt around. They were just different kinds of suffering. Also, letting go seems like a deeply powerful act whereas before I would have thought of that as having lost or failed at love.

    I like the idea of meditating on what would make you happy. Sometimes I need the reminder of why things are not good enough to stay or continue. It is so easy to forget that there are options. Yes! Yes! And then for a while at least I could explore what that would feel like to have that amazing person in my life. This is a good idea – thank you.

    I feel supported by your thoughtful and warm wishes. I value support and kindness. Thank you. How are you doing with feeling conflicted, needing patience with yourself and letting the confusion be?



  78.  #79MovingMagic on May 15, 2013 at 10:43 pm

    I feel this post. I feel it in my core. What it triggers for me is how important communication is. Learning who we are and what we need is a process and one that changes constantly. Every experience I’ve had has gotten me closer and closer to that understanding. I wouldn’t change a thing. My boundaries grow stronger every day, as does my sense of inner peace. I stumble, get back up, learn and grow. It’s beautiful really.



  79.  #80MovingMagic on May 15, 2013 at 10:56 pm

    My mother is going through chemotherapy for breast cancer. I do agree that diet & lifestyle choices play a big part in all of this. It’s not so black and white when it’s a loved one though.



  80.  #81Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 11:41 pm

    56 fw
    I understand what you’re saying.
    I’m clear how I feel about it. I don’t want to have sex without a relationship and without trust and commitment. I expressed this.
    With that being said I am still human, its been a whe since i had some action and we have an attraction, he kissed me and I just let the moment happen and things get a little steamy, but I don’t feel that contradicts my personal view on sex and when/how I feel comfortable.

    Thank you for saying a good man will wait. Not sure if he is willing to wait.



  81.  #82Emerson on May 15, 2013 at 11:46 pm

    In the meantime I went back online tried a different dating site … One guy seemed decent, chatted with him briefly and I know better but I exchanged phone numbers with him(too soon)… He turned out to be a pain in the a$$!calling and texting nonstop and saying things like “hello???” If I don’t reply, and I said he was sending too many texts and calls… Which he respond with MORE calls and texts ….

    Good lord help me…

    I don’t know if I will ever meet someone normal.



  82.  #83Paris Helen on May 16, 2013 at 12:07 am

    Hey Rori,

    I’m a big fan of yours! The guy I was dating for months has stopped calling and contacting me! I feel so shaken up by his departure. I tried to have “The Talk” and he pulled away. It’s the first time this has happened to me More than anything I want to write him and ask him to explain but I know I should be leaning back. It’s been three weeks. I don’t know if he’s gone for good or coming back. Is there anyway to tell?

    Also, I’m trying to lean back but we’re both still Facebook friends. Unfriending him feels manly and the thought of disconnecting completely makes me so sad but sometimes I get really triggered when I see a post from him. What should I do?



  83.  #84Millie on May 16, 2013 at 12:36 am

    @Francesca,

    Hi-responding to your comment on the previous post about online dating. Yeah I feel very similar to you about it! It seems like we are on the same page, or maybe at the same step in this growing process. Online dating feels like work to me, it feels like managing, planning, trying…I don’t like it. I used to go through spurts of being excited about it, but sometimes the rise and fall of energy is exhausting and false. I find that yeah, I’d rather be CDing myself than doing that, but I agree, practice with people is needed.

    My ex, the one I’ve been telling you about, text me the other day to congratulate me on graduating college. I felt SO happy that he remembered the date! We haven’t talked for awhile, so it felt so good to hear from him. I sent a great message back about how nice it was to hear from him and thank you for the congrats etc…He said we will have drinks soon, and I didn’t know what to say in response to that. In the past I’ve done the no contact speech and so has he, but in the past we haven’t been able to uphold it. So I feel kind of “boy who cried wolf” when I state declarations like that, and I don’t feel like I need to. I remind myself that actions speak louder than words. I’m fighting the urge to text him right now. I’ve had a couple glasses of champagne and am feeling good, remembering the love I felt with him, his touch, laugh, sarcasm…. but I know that nostalgia is just nostalgia. Memory is not the present. Of course I want to have drinks with him, but I love him. So I can’t. So I write this instead. I write that I’m fighting the urge to text him. Fighting my comfort zone, my natural resort to reaching out “this one time.” Fighting my natural “reasoning” and sexual desire for him, my lust for the amazing nights we have together, and focus on responding to the world around me.



  84.  #85Millie on May 16, 2013 at 12:48 am

    Siren Andrea,

    my jaw has dropped at your bar experience. How different the first was from the second, and what an amazing compliment that man paid you! I am in awe and I know I keep saying this, but I feet truly inspired by you. I wear my sexuality on my sleeve as well. I feel oftentimes like “one of the guys” even though I am very feminine in my appearance. I attract men that are very sexual, sometimes I like it, other times I feel like I want to get away.

    I love reading your posts, I love the journey you are on and am so happy that even though I am on this journey as well.



  85.  #86Millie on May 16, 2013 at 12:49 am

    *feel* not feet



  86.  #87Millie on May 16, 2013 at 12:51 am

    *so happy that I am on this journey as well* sorry, so many typos



  87.  #88Syreena on May 16, 2013 at 2:42 am

    I feel so deeply sad and it has been affecting me quite badly.
    Read about and watched news about sex trafficking going on here in the uk, Gangs of Muslim men tafficking young white girls from as young as 11.

    One perpetrator stated.
    In an Islamic faith school where he was taught that “women are worthless. Rashid told psychologists he had no idea that having sex with a willing 13-year-old was against the law; besides, his education had taught him to believe that “women are no more worthy than a lollipop that has been dropped on the ground”

    And they believe what girls of even more worthless than there own women.

    It’s affecting me really badly. I feel so bad thinking of these children and women.

    I don’t want to turn into a man hating racist, feels very difficult to not to though.



  88.  #89Syreena on May 16, 2013 at 2:44 am

    white not what.



  89.  #90Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 2:45 am

    LiquidLight I totally agree and I believe also that elements in the environmenet affects the body too. I have read a lot recently about cancer being a fungus. I have also seen a similar story and the woman still got breast cancer. Didn’t maake sense to me but, there you have it.



  90.  #91Kath on May 16, 2013 at 2:48 am

    I’m fighting the urge too!- I really wanted to text or email him because he’s gone away for a few days but I have resisted. I realised that I was getting into the same pattern of behaviour that his wife would do with him- it feels like I’m pandering to him- accepting that all the bad stauff has been my fault when it hasn’t. All the bad stuff is his bad stuff- I have been mirroring him!- and in noticing little things that I didn’t understand or thought strange, I have pulled back emotionally and he has sensed it!- He now thinks I’ve failed him but in reality its him who has failed me. I can look past it but it is through different eyes- I don’t think he can though and I fully expect him to return and tell me that he has decided we are over. It is such a shame- and I am filled with sadness and disappointment.



  91.  #92Syreena on May 16, 2013 at 3:27 am

    Yes Liquid light, I feel the same, it doesn’t sit right with me, It is like mastectomy is being glamorized.

    I don’t like this, in the same way that I don’t like war being glamorized,

    Why do we as the public need to know this? It is a private individual matter. It just doesn’t sit right.



  92.  #93Linda on May 16, 2013 at 3:51 am

    Kath – I have several questions that keeps popping up in my head…

    Why are you giving the man you write about permission to decided whether you are “over or not”?

    Has he given or giving you what you want in a relationship?

    Is it okay with you to be with someone who has decided that throwing things in anger at a wall breaking them is okay? Do you feel safe?

    I know it feels complicated but is it really?

    Sorry… I just stayed in something that was really unhealthy for me for tooo long and I feel it is irresponsible on my part to not ask you to really consider these things.



  93.  #94Indigo on May 16, 2013 at 3:52 am

    So I had my third date with R last night, and he totally spoilt me with a delicious meal, champagne and pudding and delicacy ice cream afterwards. And presented me with a bar of my favourite nougat when I left (wait, how is this, two guys buying me nougat in 2 days??).

    And he finally kissed me. Whilst it was very nice, mostly I just felt warm and comfortable and extremely safe.



  94.  #95Linda on May 16, 2013 at 3:58 am

    April Rose (#22)

    What is your next move?

    I am not as young as I used to be LOL… I wont spin my wheels or cool my jets with anyone that I dont see me having a future with. Just sayin…

    Do you CD? Are you open to other Men?



  95.  #96Sherri on May 16, 2013 at 4:00 am

    Rori,
    Thank you for your answer, and its SO MUCH what I don’t want to hear! Lol!

    The idea of ‘adapting’ to a man makes me feel nauseous, resistant, angry, “why should I?”

    Why should I have to adapt to him? Why? Why? Why?



  96.  #97Heart on May 16, 2013 at 4:05 am

    Is there no way to order Heart Connection and listen to it online?



  97.  #98April Rose on May 16, 2013 at 4:06 am

    Linda,

    I intend to make myself a plan. A feel-good, step-up plan. On these levels: Career, home, and love-life.
    I too am not getting any younger, and I don’t want to settle for things as they are. I love what you say about spinning your jets and cooling your wheels!! That feels vibrant, happy, sassy. I want that feeling in my life as a consistent experience.
    Starting work on my plan this very day….



  98.  #99Heart on May 16, 2013 at 4:08 am

    I listened to the little sample and felt so soothed and relaxed.



  99.  #100Heart on May 16, 2013 at 4:36 am

    I feel peaceful…quiet…still….
    I stopped pushing that ball up that hill…just lying on the grass for now …letting the hill hold me, my rock…
    Enjoying the feel of my breath…I like the way my chest rises and falls and rises…like the ocean…
    I’m hungry…my mind is wandering – looking for something to pick & pull apart…Restless
    I keep bringing it back to my bed
    and the sounds of moving traffic…
    I feel a little heady…



  100.  #101Heart on May 16, 2013 at 4:45 am

    It’s nice having that – I have myself back feeling…



  101.  #102Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 5:18 am

    Rori- Thank you for responding. I know how busy you are and I appreciate it. I plan to keep on learning. I am listening for the second time to the Modern Siren CDs. It is hard for me to want to do these things when I feel so sad and rejected. In the past, I have tried to move on from my feelings too quickly because it hurts too much and I am just naturally a forgiver. He never lets go of anything. I see now that that has reduced my degree of difficulty. I just want to be happy.



  102.  #103Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 5:24 am

    Feminewoman & Shar – Thank you for taking the time to address my comment. I am trying to focus more on myself but I miss him so much. We are really co-dependent. We speak 2-3x a day and spend every minute at home together. We were once so happy and we both are in pain because we remember that feeling. However he is disappointed in me. He said he does not like how I turned out. He thinks I am weak and for him I always am. I use to be so confident and fearless. Now I feel paralyzed. I am so worried that he does not love me. I can’t feel confident or safe and I am mad at him for taking that away from me.



  103.  #104Linda on May 16, 2013 at 5:34 am

    April Rose – #97

    YES! – spoken like a true siren!! I am here to cheer you on!

    I dont know if I feel sassy, but I do feel confidently resolved that I will wont settle for less than what I want ever again. People treat you the way you let them… good and bad. Living my life tuned into my feelings and responding accordingly has made all the difference for me. Making a comittment to myself to NEVER do or stay involved in ANYTHING that does not FEEL right/good to me is the best thing I have ever done for me. Men.. dating, worklife, financial decisions.. all of it.

    I decided that 2013 was going to be a great “turn around” year. So far so good!

    You go girl!

    Setting your goals and getting your life in order will inspire you. It did me.



  104.  #105Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 6:10 am

    Sirana – I believe if you go out of the house to the library, to Starbucks, to stores, to church, you will see women around you who seem to be so self-centered yet their men are having off of them, almost pulling them towards them. That is why I so believe in the energy exchange concept.

    Mistakes are the process of life. We make them to learn, develop and evolve. Just because he says those things doesn’t mean you have to believe him. It is a choice to believe him. Those words can be viewed as his mistakes, his problem. It is because you believe them why you feel paralyzed and weak. You can start to use your own voice to talk to yourself internally and looking in the mirror. “I am worthy, I am amazing love, I am passionately playful, I radiate confidence”. Think of the most confident person you know. When I do this I imagine the Green Giant, standing on a mountain with his hands akimbo. Then I imagine becoming that person, kinda slipping energetically into him and imagine the feeling and really deeply feeling it by focussing my attention internally. I learned to do these things through guided meditation. They work. Everyday in every way I am getting better and better. If I can do it you can. Search Arielle Ford’s website for the free guided feelizations. Other places I got good things from was Mind Valley, Lisa Nichols http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4c7MF3reUc

    Believe there is a lot out there that can help.



  105.  #106Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 6:15 am

    Sirana – Another from Sasha Xarrian

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3z9tgGW3chA

    He took nothing away from you. It is best to commit to taking responsibility for your own experiences so you can empower yourself to take the best action on your own behalf. I believe he fell in love with you for a reason and all you have to do is find back that person he fell in love with inside yourself. I believe Rori that all is not lost. You might just be focussing on the wrong things.

    Confidence and fearlessness is just a thought away. Focus on changing thoughts by believing you can rebuld your confidence. You know how to do it because you said you were once confident. Even Superman after he became physically crippled and was in a wheelchair was powerful. All it takes is you making a commitment to yourself.



  106.  #107Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 6:25 am

    “I am just naturally a forgiver. He never lets go of anything.”

    eemmm Sirana you know best but these two things don’t add up to me. I believe the world reflects back to us our internal state. If I am forgiving towards people they tend to be forgiving towards me. What I believe about people I tend to find proof about it.

    I sincerely believe that you have the power to change how he responds to you. These triggers are coming up for healing.



  107.  #108Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 6:30 am

    Femininewoman – You are very right. That is true. I don’t really forgive and forget. I hold it deep down inside even though I would give anything to move on and be happy and he is doing the exact same thing back to me. He is just more verbal about his unhappiness but I am just as disappointed and sad. I have to figure out how to get my confidence back and TRULY open my heart to him or I can’t expect him to do that. Not sure yet how to do that.



  108.  #109Kath on May 16, 2013 at 6:44 am

    Linda,
    I’m not “allowing” him to decide on our future- I guess I was just trying to say that its interesting he feels that it is down to him to decide on the future of all his relationships.



  109.  #110Julie on May 16, 2013 at 6:48 am

    Hi there

    My boyfriend seems to really control our sex time together. After seeing each other for 2 years and are in our early 50s we are good together when it happens..but its only really once a week we sleep together. Odd times it happens on impulse when we are together during the week but not often…just on Saturdays. Usual routine we get in after an evening night both been drinking etc and he has to have a cup of tea first and a biscuit..then we go upstairs…the routine is the same never changes. i have suggeted sometimes different things but it never happens.He likes to take the lead so I follow. Everything is in order.
    Please help

    Julie



  110.  #111Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 6:53 am

    seahorse – 61 – LOVE this. Thank you for sharing.

    xxoo



  111.  #112Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 6:55 am

    Kath I agree with Linda. Also regardless of what he has said you yourself has been saying that things have been awful. How about believing yourself? How about thinking of saying to him that things have been awful? You can feel what you feel and still agree with him. A relationship takes two and it is a two way street. It can’t possibly be all your fault. It is just how the energy has flowed between you two. Also he had not healed before you jumped in with both feet to be with him. Maybe you unconsciously thought that you were powerful enough to rescue him.

    Being able to help him suggested that you were more together than him which many men eventually resent. They believe they are unstoppable and powerful. That belief helps many of them to feel that they are men. Helping them can challenge that belief and have them feeling emasculated. That is their internal feeling.

    “He now thinks I’ve failed him but in reality its him who has failed me”. This reminds me of things I have heard from several coaches. Margaret Paul or Gay Hendricks would I believe label this as you rushing for the position of being the victim. Randy Bennett talks about cross complaining and being in a constant state of disagreement. As James Bauer says “you catch more bees with honey”. “Stop yourself from reacting defensively and trying to come up with a zinger to one-up him if you want to melt his heart. “If he says you are clingy then say something like if you feel you need more space let’s discuss it.” Similarly if he says that you have failed maybe say something like “I can see how you might feel that way. You are an amazing guy but maybe we’re not suited for each other, I mean look at how different we are.” OR “I can see both sides of the story but here is what I want. Can you help me with that”?

    All I am saying is start scripting around possible scenarios rather than going down with your brain into a spiral of negativity. CCarter talks about the automatic negative emotional override. What he says and does is about him, don’t make it about who you are. We naturally think the worst but that is an internal voice, a pattern that can be stopped.



  112.  #113Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 6:57 am

    Kath think Men are the Head of the relationship. When they lead we get to have what we want. As long as they are leading it we can feel confident that they are where they want to be.



  113.  #114Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 7:00 am

    Sirana – this might feel odd to read but I believe sex and seduction is kinda like mental sorcery. Words are powerful and once you start moving things internally using good words to yourself you can start using your words and body language to captivate him again.



  114.  #115Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 7:07 am

    Forget – girl I don’t know about forgetting. I know you can choose to change your story around an experience. I know I can look for and focus on positives in other areas if need be.

    To open your heart – again become like a child and use your imagination. Imagine your heart in ziplock bag, imagine opening the bag and allowing your heart to breathe. Feel that deeply.

    I recently saw a picture of a head cut off in the middle with the top hanging backward. Everytime I thnk of having an open mind or sitting in front of a speaker that I don’t feel resonant with I bring back that picture to trigger myself into having an open mind. Believe that anything is possible.

    Also when in his presence think of your heart as soft and melty like icecream. Think melt, melt, melt. Think that this can melt his resistance and coldness like icicles in the sun. Think – this is easy as pie.

    He is your husband. You are a girl. You are magnetic.



  115.  #116Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 7:10 am

    Sherri – 95 – People come together in part to heal. Love brings up anything unlike itself to be healed. This man has wonderful growing and healing lessons for you whether you stay together or not.

    It’s not so much about adapting to him as much as you both adapting to each other, or I prefer to look at this as flow, finding a flow between you.

    Women usually need to be the initiators in relationship, yet this doesn’t mean he can’t or won’t do some wonderful work too.

    This may help you understand more deeply.

    http://sexandheart.com/your-mans-healing-heart

    xxoo



  116.  #117Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 7:11 am

    Julie I wonder – taking into consideration his age – if hormones are affecting his libido? Or maybe he has a stressful job? Or just that your rhythms are different?

    Dominique is great with that kind of stuff. You might wish to click on her name to get to her website and explore what is there.



  117.  #118Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 7:13 am

    Women usually need to be the initiators in relationship – Dominique this literally jumped off the page at me. Can you elaborate?

    I also note you said “in relationship”.



  118.  #119Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 7:14 am

    Sirana – 102 – The more you work on yourself, heal yourself, fill yourself up with self love rituals, activities which turn you on, people you love, the more you can boost yourself, feel good about you and your life, the more chance you have of turning this around.

    xxoo



  119.  #120MovingMagic on May 16, 2013 at 7:16 am

    Good morning lovely sirens!



  120.  #121Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 7:17 am

    Sirana – 107 – This is not about him. This is about you.
    xxoo



  121.  #122Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 7:20 am

    Julie – 109 – Have you tried guiding him? Have you tried talking to him? Have you tried watching a movie on tantra or reading a book about it together?

    You can open a talk by telling him that you have some fantasies you would like to share with him and would he like to hear? And then you tell him how good it would feel if……………Or imagining him/you/both of you doing…………………really turns you on.

    xxoo



  122.  #123Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 7:24 am

    Femininewoman – 117 – In the healing process, the woman is the one who “seemingly” does all the work, working on herself, healing, opening herself, etc. It can seem like the man is just there being who he is, not changing, not doing anything at all. YET he IS healing too, usually quietly, underground, sometimes/often without him knowing he is. If you reread the article, it explains it in more depth. 🙂

    xxoo



  123.  #124Heart on May 16, 2013 at 7:40 am

    new thread



  124.  #125Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 7:46 am

    Femininewoman and Dominique – Sometimes I get confused between stopping the overfunctioning (not calling him or emailing him first) with truly opening myself to him. I want to email him now because we always email/talk all day long and I don’t want him to think I am being cold. He initiates that contact a lot. Should I always wait for him to initiate. Remember, we have been married for a very long time and this is not the early phase of a relationship.



  125.  #126Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 8:36 am

    Sirana remember that Rori encourages giving back. Also Dominique talks about the flow in the relationship. What he thinks is in his control. If you set an intention to always be warm towards him he will feel that. The more you keep on working on that internally it will radiate out of you so he will feel it. You have more tools than just your words, use them. Your body is great to work with. The new thread is a great starting place that you might wish to explore.



  126.  #127Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 8:43 am

    Sirana – This was Rori’s advice to someone else that might work for you:-

    Julie – do you have at least my ebook? Please work on everything in it, really really devote yourself to practicing a new way of being and speaking and thinking. this alone may turn things around completely. Your WANTING him is whats making you less attractive. You need to get a great life outside of him, and find a way to calm your dramatic, pining feelings and ramp up the friendship and flirty part. Love, Rori



  127.  #128Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 8:44 am

    Another Rori nugget:-

    Rori Raye says:
    Kasey, Welcome – and the first step for you to do NOW – is to STOP, just STOP doing everything you’re doing “for him and the relationship.” Just stop. You’re driving any ounce of manhood he still possesses out of him, putting yourself in the “friend” and “mother” zone, and overfunctioning your way OUT of this relationship. On top of all that – how you’re treating yourself, and talking to yourself – the “worthless” part – has to STOP. Please, please focus, and we’ll help you here, and falling in love with YOU!!! This is the most important thing you can do to gain some confidence and put some backbone into this relationship. If he can’t do relationship, he can’t – but first, before you give up – make all these changes and leanback. Love, Rori



  128.  #129Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 8:52 am

    Femininewoman – I want to be warm and affectionate and I have been up until recently when he pointed out to me that I am always the one who initiates the affection. I always kiss him in the kitchen or touch his hand. He was making this as a point of how unhappy he has been and that he no longer feels the same. So now I feel like I can’t touch him the way I want. A lot of the posts discuss using your body and warmth to do this but since this comment I feel like I would be making things worse.



  129.  #130Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 8:56 am

    Sirana – have you asked him what he wants to do or need around affection?



  130.  #131Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 9:06 am

    Here is How to Make a Man Fall In Love

    If your man isn’t in love with you yet you need to start with giving him positive reinforcement in small doses and trigger the reward centers in his brain.

    http://women-men-want.com/

    This will jump-start chemical reactions in his brain responsible for developing the feeling of falling in love with you.

    When a man begins falling in love he will feel deep and intense surges of love toward you at certain moments, specifically, he will feel those surges of love at the moments you say certain words to reinforce, encourage and promote the development of these feelings.

    There will also be times, when he will feel deep level respect for you when you say certain other things. You need to stand your ground, without being mean or controlling.

    You need to make sure that you aren’t being a man-pleaser or a pushover, and that you alternate the love-triggering words and phrases with respect-triggering words and phrases.

    A man cannot love a woman he doesn’t respect, but he can respect a woman and not love her. So, the tricky part is to use both the love triggering words and the respect triggering words and phrases.



  131.  #132Turquoise on May 16, 2013 at 9:13 am

    Thank you Veronica! I shared, in hopes to remind all of us to be safe out on dates, and also… to follow your instincts. I was getting weirded out by him repeating himself so much and asking the same questions over and over…. felt very odd.



  132.  #133Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 9:49 am

    Feminine 129 – Are you asking if I have asked him what he wants to do instead of affection?



  133.  #134Femininewoman on May 16, 2013 at 9:58 am

    What he wants as it relates to affection?
    What are his opinions and fantasies?



  134.  #135Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 10:47 am

    Sirana – YES you can initiate but only if you really want, and you are not looking for a reply or validation or for him to fill you up in anyway, only if you can do with NO expectations. I just wrote about this this week.

    http://sexandheart.com/when-is-it-okay-to-initiate-2#comment-2960

    xxoo



  135.  #136Sirana on May 16, 2013 at 11:07 am

    I am really going to focus on healing myself and working on my insecurities.

    Can anyone recommend a good sensual meditation book? I feel like I need to work on opening me up. Instead of looking to him to do it for me.



  136.  #137Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 12:01 pm

    Sirana – I feel a bit uncomfortable talking about my book and video program even though I have Rori’s support and encouragement to do so.

    The entire last section of my book is all about this. I also devote a big portions of my video program to just this.

    http://sexandheart.com/ebook

    xxoo



  137.  #138Dominique on May 16, 2013 at 12:02 pm


  138.  #139Radlove on May 16, 2013 at 7:57 pm

    Arachne,

    58 – Thanks for your response! I hear you about needing sex therapy. A lot of my friends would disagree but for me, being a virgin until age 34, I really needed to get up to speed somehow.

    I don’t do it any more, but I went thru a phase where I was going to sex clubs almost every weekend. This is something I would recommend, not for everyone, but perhaps for you. Even tho it was WAYYY out of my comfort zone, I pushed myself because I wanted to somehow come out of my shell and grow comfortable with my sexuality after feeling repressed all my life. The advantage to a sex club is that it is sheltered. In order to get in, each person has to fill out an application, showing their real ID. So if there are any incidents of abuse, etc. You can freely report a man to the management, who will support you and ban that man from the club. I felt safe there, in the midst of my extreme vulnerability.

    Most of the people who went there were couples who mutually agreed to swap partners. They had a hot tub for 15 people and everyone went in nude. Many interesting experiences. I don’t want to revisit that part of my life, but it sure was eye opening, among other things opening, LOL! ;-P



  139.  #140Emerson on May 16, 2013 at 11:30 pm

    130 fw did you buy it?



  140.  #141Julie on May 17, 2013 at 6:17 am

    ref 109 Hello and thank you for the advise sorry for the delay due to time differemce as I am in the UK
    Feminiewoman thank you – yes he gets very tired with his job as up early and needs to sleep full 8 hours at least. He seems to a person who needs a lot of sleep… one of the reasons he needs to go home during the week! We have spoken about getting a house together next spring so hopefully things will change…but I guess he will still need to go to bed by 10 most week days…however last night wow …he came over to mine early the sun was shining we ate tea outside and ..yes the earth moved 🙂 I did encourage by gently flirting more …wearing something he likes helped….it definitely worked though :-). He still had to leave early though but the evening felt wondeful. I replied to his goodnight text with a lovely feeling message too. x



  141.  #142Julie on May 17, 2013 at 6:30 am

    REf 109 Hello Dominique thank you for your help and also passing on Rori’s advise too …and thanks very much to Rori also x.

    I will take it all on board! Last night as above things were really good for a week night!
    I have got a few of the videos Siren, Love scripts, Blueprint ..toxic man….Probably should have purchased the ebook first really and so perhaps need to do so.
    I will stop watching and definitely concentrate on my life more and flirt too.
    Can I ask another question please..something slightly different from the sex side……If my boyfriend meets up with another woman after corresponding with her…should I say anything? Feel uncomfortable with it. dosen’t sit right inside my tummy..mentioned it once but it came out all wrong. He gets angry quickly especially if he is tired…so its sometimes the walking on eggshell thing. I have worked on this and it seems to be better than it was .. using lovescripts and feeling messages etc…..
    Do you think its better not to bring the subject up again and just let him tell me if and when its going to happen or happened. She contacted him after a school reunion…quite attractive…suggested they meet up arrive early before the next one and catch up…he said he will do what he wants and I need to trust him. She is married so he told me
    Think Rori may have been referring to this in her comments perhaps as I wrote a comment last week about it …not the sex issue?. not sure.
    Julie x



  142.  #143Julie on May 17, 2013 at 6:36 am

    Hi Dominique again …meant to also say thank you for your suggestions too.. I have suggested certain things to him but nothing has been tried as yet…maybe the video idea could be worth a go though! I will ask him if he fancies the idea…or maybe I should just buy one and play it with him mmmm. x
    Julie



  143.  #144Dominique on May 17, 2013 at 10:31 am

    Julie – If you love this man, then you MUST trust him. Please read this –

    http://sexandheart.com/choose-trust-2

    (I don’t know if you know me, so I just want to reassure you that I am friends with Rori, am a regular presence here, and have her support and encouragement to share my work here.)

    You can try initiating some of this here. If you’ve been together for awhile, it is okay to do so. You WILL feel if it’s not well received.

    Opening sexually was how I started my work as a coach so naturally still one of my specialties.

    xxoo



  144.  #145Julie on May 17, 2013 at 11:14 am

    Thanks Dominique for your advise and sharing the link. I will in that case say nothing more to him about the catch up with the other woman.
    I will have a look at the information now
    Love and light.
    Julie
    xx



  145.  #146Rori Raye on May 17, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    Paris, Welcome – and this is a great question – and SUCH a common situation.
    1. Never, ever, ever ever friend any man you are dating. Period. Just don’t do it. BECAUSE – you are Circular Dating!!!! You’d have to be “In A Relationship with…” on FB to be friends – and that’s WAY down the line from “dating”!!!!

    2. I’d wait a bit more – give it a couple more weeks – and then, if you haven’t heard, unfriend him. Yo don’t want him around anyway. He shouldn’t have been there in the first place. There’s nothing you can do to “get him back” except Circular Date. From what I hear – this just wasn’t a match. Go CD! Love, Rori



  146.  #147jerri on May 17, 2013 at 2:42 pm

    hi rori im in a very confusing marriage and I don’t know what to do stay or leave sometimes im his world and sometimes its like I don’t exist to him.



  147.  #148Arachne on May 17, 2013 at 6:26 pm

    Okay, it took me awhile to answer all you lovely ladies… Here goes:

    Dominique #7 – I looked for your previous comment, but I couldn’t see it. Thank you so much for your words and encouragement!! It feels great to receive them! 🙂

    Tereana #10 – I feel happy that the post was timely for you and helped you in a little way. You are right, Rori gave an amazing answer!

    Sophie #11 – Wow, thank you for sharing your experience! It feel very comforting to me to read about what other women are going through! Good luck to you, and enjoy your affair for what it is! I hope I will have the same type of clarity soon…

    Linda #12 – Wow again, and thank you for sharing, too! I felt happy to read your empowering story! Great for you! (and, re: #13 – I’m very sorry for your daughter, I feel empathetic…)

    Mercedes #15 – Thank you so much for the reply! You are right, he IS confused, he told me as much (a long time ago, between the coffee date and the first “making out meeting”). I don’t know if cultivating a relationship with a someone met on such a website would be a problem for me (since, through experience, I know that most (or at least many) of the people I talked to on such sites are otherwise actually very decent and normal people). I will try to follow your advice and (if he gets in contact again) use those very words. They are the absolute truth, so it should be good to just say it. But at least in this way I will give him the chance to say what he wants, and we can see if and where it goes. And I continue to Circular Date in the meantime. 🙂 Thanks again for the advice!

    Syreena #23 – Thank you for the reply! Just some clarification: I don’t want to be a f-buddy, and I told him as much, because I knew it wouldn’t work for me in real life (though, after reading Rori’s answer, I am not so sure of that; if I have clarity about, mane I can accept it and have a good learning experience – especially since I don’t have any love feeling for this man yet). I think what really feels bad is not the “sex-only” part, but the uncertainty part. It’s like he didn’t confuse me by wanting me sexually (I feel flattered by that), but by taking me out for coffee in the first place. Hopefully, if he texts or calls again, I’ll have a conversation with him and get rid of the uncertainty. It feels heavy and bothersome, not to know where I stand… Thanks again for the reply!

    Olivia #26 – Yup yup! 🙂

    MovingMagic #30 – Thank you so much! I loved your reply, it felt hopeful somehow! I have been able to separate the sex from the emotions in the other encounters, because I knew from the beginning that is was just for fun. The hard part in this situation is not being sure what it is, what he wants and so on. Once I know, I will know how to “manage” my emotions….

    Emerson #34 – I feel glad if you learned something about yourself from that post! 🙂

    Emerson #36 – I felt sad reading this comment, especially the last paragraph – I feel sorry that someone could believe you are heartless… 🙁 The thing you say about just sex establishing “a pattern of tolerance towards this type of relationship” – hmmm, very interesting, it made me think about it a lot. But I don’t think it applies to me – I tried to be f-buddies with my ex after our (very dysfunctional, to be honest) relationship ended, and it didn’t work and I ended up having a mini hysteria attack at some point, because I just exploded after repressing my attachment for a long time. But I learned from it, and I don’t want to go through that again. But a “wam bam thank you m’am” encounter, if it’s not repeated (so attachment doesn’t have time to form) is, for me at least, and at this point in my life at least, beneficial. For me, it does boost my self-value as a desirable woman (I almost wrote “acceptable”, but my CBT kicked in and I stopped myself before thinking I might not “be enough”). I had a very sexless life until a year and a half ago, and I guess I need to be a little objectified. I have no problem in believing that a guy might like me as a person (I have a lot of guy friends who think of me as a great “asexual person”), the thing I lack(ed) is the assurance that my body can be physically desired – and that’s what, for me, “wam bam” is all about. But I also have to be careful not to get the wam bam mixed with “dating”. Oh, well.

    Seahorse #61 – I feel glad it was a welcome trigger for you! 🙂

    Seahorse #63 – Wow! Your comment was so powerful, and yet so hopeful in the end, to see you have overcome this… Hug!

    Kath – I’m still following your story and sending you hugs!

    Radlove #139 – 34? wow! (sorry if that felt disrespectful, it was just my natural honest reaction). I feel happy that you found sex healing in your life! I know about sex clubs, but unfortunately I live in a small town where there isn’t such a thing. But I plan on definitely visiting one, one day. Ideally, it would be with a trusted and loving partner as an experience we share in order to strengthen our bond, but I am contemplating visiting one by myself. 🙂



  148.  #149Rori Raye on May 17, 2013 at 9:07 pm

    jerri, Welcome, and if you’ll let us know more details of your situation, we’ll support you here as much as we can. Love, Rori