Sometimes Even Bad First Dates Deserve A Do Over

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understand menThis is a great guest post by one of my favorite coaches (I refer to him all the time – he’s so gentle, manly, and has a great track record) – Jonathon Aslay:

You know that expression, “Everyone deserves a second chance”? Well, it’s true – even when it comes to first dates. Face it; they’re uncomfortable for everyone, especially men. When all we want is to make a good first impression, sometimes it just doesn’t work out, like in these examples.

Extreme nervousness – If he’s jittery, jumpy, and dripping in sweat, don’t assume he’s a junkie looking for a high. It could be he’s just so nervous about having to talk to you one-on-one that he can’t even form a coherent thought. Smile, show him how easy you are to get along with, and by the second date, he’ll be relaxed and having a great time.

Failing to listen – If you’ve been around here long enough, you’ve heard me say (probably more than once) that men don’t listen. It’s not our fault. Our brains are wired differently, and we sometimes have a hard time staying focused on the conversation. It doesn’t mean he’s not interested or that he’s a bad person; it just means he’s male. Give him another chance and you might find he has many more appealing qualities that outweigh his seeming inattentiveness.

Trying too hard – Did he bring flowers and candy, open your door, and practically propose on your first date? It may have creeped you out a little, but it’s likely he’s feeling a bit inferior, and coming on too strong is his way of coping. Gently let him know it’s a casual date, not an interview, and by the second date you’ll be getting to know the real man.

Mr. No Personality – The fear of offending or driving you away is so strong that this guy turns into the first-date equivalent of a limp dishcloth. But before you write him off as the least fun guy you’ve ever met, ask yourself if maybe he’s simply shy. Give him a second chance, and you might discover a fun-loving guy under that shy outer shell.

If your date exhibits a couple of the characteristics above, it doesn’t have to be a deal breaker. Giving a less-than-fantastic first date another try can open the door to a wonderful relationship you would have otherwise thrown away.

However, always trust your instincts. If something seems off or just not right, don’t force it. But if everything else seems okay, and you’re otherwise attracted to him, go ahead and give him a second chance. It might just be the best decision you ever made.

Have you rescued a relationship from a disastrous first date? What first-date faux pas is unforgivable in your eyes?

I love Jonathon, and you can find him and get his free newsletters and “Tips” here:

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:14 am

    I love Johnathan’s charm.

  2.  #2Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:32 am

    The “trust your instincts” comment I find sometimes confusing because some people say don’t trust your instinct or at least put it on hold. I like to trust my intution which I believe tends to be triggered from my mid-section, my gut.

  3.  #3Jade on August 11, 2011 at 7:47 am

    I’m quite willing to do my part for a relationship to work and again, I’m asking the same question I keep asking myself these days: why do women have to do all the work for a relationship to work?

    Failing to listen – yeah, guys are good at that, sadly. But if guys know they have this issue, why don’t they work on it too? It’s not enough to say that it’s not their fault or that they’re wired that way. Isn’t communicating and listening a big part of knowing if the person that’s in front of you is right for you or not?

    I don’t know about you, but I find that guys in my age range (40+) should’ve already learned how to communicate and listen properly if they REALLY DO want to get into a relationship.

  4.  #4Plum on August 11, 2011 at 7:53 am

    665: Sunflower82


    “I thought you were supposed to love me” with Byron Katie


  5.  #5Plum on August 11, 2011 at 7:55 am

    Jade 3

    Here is an easy summary of how male and female think/feel, backed up by sciences.


  6.  #6Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:02 am

    Jade they communicate with each other and they hear each other.

    They should’ve but how are we going to work with what is in front of us?

  7.  #7Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:15 am

    I know I’m supposed to reading the artlice and learning something, but I am just thinking YUM looking at Jonathans picture 🙂 He’s soo adorable I’m distracted from the message….hee hee….what was this article about again??

  8.  #8Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:16 am

    I truly believe this about first dates….kinda like I gave nocupcake nocoffee dude a second chance….but he kinda proved to be a flunky anyway, but I feel good that I gave him an opportunity for a do -over….the old me would have just dismissed him and said OFF WITH HIS HEAD!! hhahaha

  9.  #9Jade on August 11, 2011 at 8:20 am

    Plum, thanks for the video. I don’t have time to watch it now but I’ll try and do that later.

    FW, I’m not sure what you mean. All I can say is that I usually try to pay attention to what’s being said to me.

  10.  #10Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:30 am

    From an email on cheating.

    1) “Do you want to save this relationship?”
    The obvious answer is yes, or they wouldn’t be speaking with me, but the truth is that repairing a relationship where one partner has been unfaithful takes more work than most realize. So before we begin down that path of reconciliation, it’s important for the victim to realize that there is a difference between saving the relationship and him getting what he deserves. What he deserves is for you to leave him. To save your relationship you can’t do to him what he deserves. You have to pick between the two.

    2) “You might have to leave the relationship.”
    Even if you want to save it, you must be willing to leave if his behavior doesn’t change. Just
    talking about your feelings won’t be enough. You see the problem isn’t that he doesn’t understand, it’s that his way of dealing with stresses in your relationship is to go outside of the
    relationship. If he refuses to even consider changing that behavior, then there are no magic words to motivate him. It’s similar to when someone says to me, “How can I get my spouse to stop drinking?” Well, there are things you can do, but if they are determined to get drunk, then they’re going to drink. Period. The same applies to some men who cheat. If they are going to cheat, then regardless of what you do, then they will cheat.

    3) “How to know he’s sincere.”
    Forget trying to read his intentions or hyper examining his every word. All that will do is turn
    you into a detective and drive him away. Focus on the most reliable thing which is this –
    Does he keep his word? When he says he’ll be home at 7 is he home then? If he promises to call you at 6, does he call at 6? Those things may seem little, but when a man consistently keeps his promises to a woman, it means that he is investing emotionally in her.

  11.  #11Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:33 am

    Jade I am sure they try to pay attention also. But remember we communicate with body language and our subconscious focus on more than just the words. If we say a word but our body language is saying something else he will get distracted by that and our tone. Also when we crticize the little boy inside him get feel attacked and then shut down to ease the pain. Choosing our words can help with that, but most times we don’t. We only have control over ourselves.

  12.  #12Mel on August 11, 2011 at 8:35 am

    Yay! it’s a go for tomorrow! I feel excited! He seems quite sweet. I’ll keep this article in mind in case things feel a little “off.”

    He has been addressing my emails “Hey Cutie!” That makes me smile. 😀

  13.  #13Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:36 am

    RE 7 KS thjat energy was reflected in your words so I sensed that.

    Is there passion in your life? What are you passionate about? Have you tried sharing that with your husband?

  14.  #14Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:38 am

    13 @ Mel,
    Awww fun!! 🙂 Are you going to wear a skirt?

  15.  #15Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:38 am

    Mel Think of yourelf as cutie, say it to yourself, let it be your self talk. I was just out to the store and kept saying to myself “I am a phenomenal woman, I am a woman phenomenally.”

  16.  #16Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:39 am

    11 @ FW
    This was helpful to me!

    3) “How to know he’s sincere.”
    Forget trying to read his intentions or hyper examining his every word. All that will do is turn
    you into a detective and drive him away. Focus on the most reliable thing which is this –
    Does he keep his word? When he says he’ll be home at 7 is he home then? If he promises to call you at 6, does he call at 6? Those things may seem little, but when a man consistently keeps his promises to a woman, it means that he is investing emotionally in her.

    hmm I used to thnk I was being too picky if he said call you tomorrow, and then didnt call….but it bothers me when men do that. Now I know why. My instincts are right. Such a simple thing, but I like how this is summarized. Thansk FW

  17.  #17Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:41 am

    hmm and the part about being a detective drives him away…so true….
    I have to remember to focus on me, and if I’m jealous of another girl or what not…if my man is talking to her or had a flirty moment, it’s still about me and what makes me feel good….too much focus on him and why he was flirting etc. just send me into a spiral down!

  18.  #18Mel on August 11, 2011 at 8:44 am

    Hmmm…. I wasn’t going to wear a skirt ’cause I have a long drive afterwards so I thought jeans might be more comfortable. But they’re cute jeans… and I’ll wear a pretty top!

    I love skirts though. I’m wearing my flippy one today!

  19.  #19Patricia on August 11, 2011 at 8:45 am

    13 Mel

    Have a great time with it Mel….have fun…..what a treat!

  20.  #20Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:56 am

    very cute Mel I love jeans and cute tops…always a good pick! I’m so excited for you and cannot wait to hear how it goes!!

    I contacted a guy on POF last night that caught my eye, and he responded. I feel excited about adding another CD to my rotation!

  21.  #21Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Mel perish comfortable when you are dating, it could be an attraction killer.

  22.  #22Jade on August 11, 2011 at 9:05 am

    I try not to criticize men when I meet them for the first time. I know I will criticize them here, but that’s different, as I’m only trying to understand and they have no idea I’m here and I’m not going to tell them.

    Emerson, it bugs me too when they say they will call and they don’t. But then, if and when they do call and they don’t mention it, I won’t even bring it up. I just don’t want to get all worked up for someone I don’t even know that much (speaking of first dates).

    But if you’re already dating someone for a few months and they don’t call you when they say they would, then it’s a different story, especially if you’re supposed to see each other following that phone call.

    Mel, I think of myself as a rock star when I’m walking down the street. 🙂

  23.  #23Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:10 am

    Jade when we are hurt things kind of spill out of us sideways. As Rori says sometimes it is innocuous, but it is there, suggesting sometimes that their thinking is flawed.

    You might not mention them not calling but I would hazard a guess that it leaves you feeling weird?

  24.  #24Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:12 am

    By the way Mel, you can bring the jeans if you are driving and change later. Just a thought……I do that with shoes.

  25.  #25Daria on August 11, 2011 at 9:14 am

    omg ! i feel so excited! im listening to a Margaret Lynch recording – about personality profiles (5 of them based on reich and lloyd’s work )

    and one i really identified with was “creative idealist”

    theres are teh brilliant people that can really see connections and be genius

    and then she said these people like to live out their body in their 7th chakra… and they disassociate from their body and they can just… not be there while they’re there

    and im like ok i know i do that sometimes and didnt know how to be in my body till i practiced Rori’s stuff

    and THEN this part i feel seen about:

    she said the biggest thing they have to deal with all their life is FEAR

    they dont even know wher it comes from

    and it shows up like this:

    if i show my brilliance, if i show who I really am… something bad is going to happen

    im going to be killed, or hurt or imprisoned, im gonna be annhilated!

    ?OMG!! T?HAT IS MEE!! WOOWIEEEE that is my fear that i always talk about


    freakin cool!

  26.  #26Jade on August 11, 2011 at 9:14 am

    If it’s someone I’ve never met, I will feel weird for a minute or two but then I’ll let it go.

  27.  #27Plum on August 11, 2011 at 9:20 am


    I imagine you so cute and sexy, you will look fabulous in the new jeans and feminine top. Jeans can shape the buttocks in such a way, males go crazy 😉
    Is the top long enough to wear a belt on the hips? It attracts the eyes on the hips, veeeerrry sexy.

    If you should wear the skirt, you can bring the jeans along in the car and put it on afterwards, for your long drive.

    Wow, I feel our baby is leaving for kinder garden tomorrow, first school day, I am going to let a tear roll 🙂


  28.  #28Plum on August 11, 2011 at 9:21 am

    8: Emerson



  29.  #29Plum on August 11, 2011 at 9:24 am

    10: Jade

    It tells you why guys seem to not listen but something does get in and in which circumstances they really can’t listen.


  30.  #30Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:27 am

    RE 27 Daria: Gay Hendricks talks about that in the Big Leap.

  31.  #31lm on August 11, 2011 at 9:35 am

    @ daria 27:

    i looove margaret lynch!! her videos always make me feel great.

  32.  #32Brenda on August 11, 2011 at 9:40 am


    What a superb article! I totally agree! I myself have felt so frustrated by men who didn’t give me a second chance. Thank you!

  33.  #33Plum on August 11, 2011 at 9:40 am

    26: Femininewoman

    Lol I had not seen your post 🙂
    Is there an expression in English when two persons talk at the same time to say the same thing?


  34.  #34Mel on August 11, 2011 at 9:41 am

    I think I’ll still go with the jeans. They look good on me. 😉 Actually, I was planning to wear a pretty top with an intricate woven belt on the hips (kinda like a kimono belt) and my strappy sandals. It’s the “wow you look great without even trying” look.

    Thanks Plum.. Hee hee… I feel like I’m in kindergarten! 🙂

    For where to meet…

    This is in a very “car unfriendly” area, so he suggested we meet at the nearby lot so we can have an extra 5 min. to talk on the way there and back.

    I also had a couple other guys express interest to my no-photo profile. They’re not bad either!

    This is fun!

  35.  #35Brenda on August 11, 2011 at 9:41 am

    I feel back at 100% today, and I’d like to share my update on my friendship with Ryan! This is going to be kind of lengthy, and it covers about the last two weeks or so.

    It is clearly an unusual relationship, starting from him being schizophrenic to him having unique ideas about finding the right woman. The fact that this is currently a friendship doesn’t mean it always will be. He is keeping it at a friendship because he takes his time to get to know a woman at a deep level.

    In my following texts, I am aware that I was way leaning forward at times. But until you are in the crazy-making situation of having someone lead you on and let you down for 2.5 years, including a fake marriage proposal, I ask that I not be judged. I just about couldn’t stand the way I felt at times.

    So much has happened between us in less than 2 weeks. He reunited our friendship during a long, wonderful conversation several weeks ago. Then I heard nothing for 2 weeks. I went from feeling elated to feeling deflated.

    I contacted him July 30th to ask if he could care for one of my cats who just had kittens, because I am not permitted to keep all 4 of my cats here, only 2. He said his parents said he can’t. He gave no how are you or anything, so finally I asked, “Are you friendly?”

    No answer.

    I texted: I feel bad. I don’t like to be ignored.

    B: What happened between our wonderful conversation 2 weeks ago and now?

    We talked briefly on the phone, and he said he just wanted to not see each other until he finds healing from schizophrenia. I reminded him that two weeks ago, he said we could renew our friendship, and we agreed to keep off of sticky subjects, just staying in the here and now with positive subjects. He said he forgot – the schizophrenia affects his mind and it may be very valid, because he forgets a lot of things, even tho he is very intelligent. I felt like I was hit by a ton of bricks, that he had led me on and let me down yet AGAIN, and I got off the phone to let the full impact of it hit me, because I had no words at the moment. A little while later, I texted again:

    B: Let me guess, it wasn’t intentional (he said that over and over in 2009 when we dated and he led me on then let me down).

    B: Have a nice life.

    R: I can’t talk right now. My phone will be off.

    B: I’m ending our friendship for once and for all, like I should have done 2 years ago.

    The next day, August 1st, I started up again:

    B: I don’t need to convince anybody to be my friend. I have friends all over Pennsylvania, and even all over the world. You told me two years ago that you didn’t have many friends. You asked me to please not let the schizophrenia chase me away too, like it did everyone else. I respected that, and look where it got me. It is me or is it you?

    B: I poured out to you the riches of my soul. They were routinely, systematically thrown in the dumpster. I value myself too highly to allow you to trash my heart any longer. I don’t like your psychological abuse. And I think you need to take responsibility for your words and actions, rather than saying the devil made me do it. (at this point, I had intended to end the friendship, so I didn’t care if I used feeling messages or not).

    B: What did I ever do to you that you treat me so bad??

    B: Hello?

    B: You make me crazy cuz you know I care.

    B: Hello?

    R: What do you want?

    B: What did I ever do to you that you treat me so bad?

    R: Leave me alone.

    B: You’re a jerk sometimes. You shouldn’t tell people you’re a white knight type. What a jerk.

    B: You think this is about me being desperate? I could have a date every single night of the week if I chose. It wasn’t about that. It was about YOU!

    B: If you can ever keep the schizophrenia away long enough to get past, “Hello, how are you?” with another woman, someday you’ll realize what you lost in me. Goodbye.

    B: Poor men dream of finding riches. Kings dream of finding true love. I always believed that you dreamed the dream of kings. I feel sad about how wrong I was.

    B: Like Michael Bolton says, “I’m not made of stone. I’m not made of steel. I can bend, I can break, I can feel.” All you do is hurt me again and again. It’s wrong! It’s evil! Enough!

    B: Maybe if you get free of the schizophrenia, your eyes will be open to how you are treating people who love you.

    B: I don’t deserve the way you treat me and you don’t deserve my love.

    B: But I do love you.

    R: Will you please leave me alone.

    B: Jerk

    B: (both Ryan and I have talked about being in ministry and serving God with our lives) Maybe your ministry while you were still seeking your healing was simply to be a friend to someone who thot the world of you.

    R: Your perception of me is so skewed from reality.

    B: All I can speak to is the level of pain I have experienced. That’s real — that and the 50 lbs I have gained in the midst of the pain.

    R: I really can’t help you. I am so tormented myself.

    B: Ok.

    B: It used to feel so comforting to both of us to just silently cuddle while we listened to music.

    B: It would feel so good to just cuddle with you again. We don’t have to say a word. What do you think?

    R: No thank you.

    B: Alright. I had a wonderful date with a man the other night at his $500,000 house with an inground pool, and all I could think of is you. I’m crying.

    R: I’m sorry

    R: I have to shut my phone off for about 15 min. Be back.

    R: Hey I’m back

    R: Sorry

    B: Thank you

    B: I was driving

    R: Are you doing better?

    B: No, why would I be?

    R: You said you were crying

    B: Yeah. Got to potty the dogs

    R: You don’t deserve what’s happening here, but it’s not me. I don’t know what it is.

    R: And I can’t help figure it out until I’m free.

    B: Ok, I believe you. But it feels like you’re leading me on.

    At that point, Ryan called, and he was very sweet to me. He talked with me kindly until I stopped crying, and I felt so much better. And once again, he asked me to please agree to stay apart until he gets healing, so he doesn’t keep healing me.

    I knew it was wise, logically speaking, but emotionally, I have just missed him so much for 1.5 years. I believe he is my Soul Mate, whether or not anyone else believes in Soul Mates.

    B: Thanks for calling me.

    R: You’re welcome

    Three days later, I started texting again…

    B: Proverbs says, “Hope deferred makes the heart sick.” I feel like I’m on my death bed after so many times of having my hope deferred.

    B: I love you and at the same time, I feel angry. I hate feeling this way. If I didn’t care so much, I could just walk away.

    B: I wish you were here.


    B: I love you.

    B: I miss you too much. I can’t stand being apart from you.

    B: I want you to hug me.

    R: I respectfully asked you to leave me alone until I am healed and you agreed.

    R: I can’t deal with this drama right now.

    B: Did it ever occur to you that you’re the one who starts the drama, by repeatedly leading me on and letting me down? My spirit is willing to leave you alone, and my flesh is weak, because I miss you more than ever, after you opened up our friendship again. I don’t know what to do with myself. Do you have any ideas?

    B: Frankly, it is psychologically cruel. I forgive you, but it really messes me up inside.

    R: I don’t know, but you have to leave me alone. I have every right to ask you to leave me alone.

    B: I will. And I’m sorry, and I feel embarrassed. It’s like the book, Utopia, says: “You first create criminals, and then you punish them.” Similar concept anyway.

    B: Please don’t take that last text wrong. I was just trying to make an analogy. My only point was that your behavior is crazy making. And that I feel horrible inside.

    B: My heart is not a faucet. I feel so FRUSTRATED! I want to hug you and yell at you at the same time!!! I have every right to expect a simple friendship after we agree to a simple friendship and to take it as it comes.

    B: I feel so heavy hearted that you heart fu(cked me AGAIN right at the anniversary of your fake proposal. I feel like my deepest wound was just kicked!

    R: I would NEVER do the things you have accused me of doing.

    B: I so want to believe you! I want to be held by you and never let go and at the same time I want to tell you to go away.

    B: How can I believe you when it’s a cyclical pattern? Why did you tell the man at my church you were coming back to my church (Ryan originally introduced me to it) if it wasn’t to lead me on after reopening our friendship??

    B: You knew he would tell me! Damn, I need peace for more than just an hour at a time!

    R: What do you want from me?

    B: A long hug and pillow talk.

    B: I want my friend who I got back three weeks ago.

    R: I would be afraid to open up friendship again.

    B: I know I can’t force friendship but you asked me what I wanted.

    B: I so enjoyed our convo 3 weeks ago. I felt joyful that everything was ok again. I love to feel close to you.

    R: You have me all wrong and I don’t know what happened.

    B: If I didn’t care, I would have just walked away. I can’t do that. Oncest again, I will give you the benefit of the doubt until you are healed. But I don’t like to think that maybe you are saying, “The devil make me do it.”

    R: But I didn’t DO anything! I don’t know what it is you think I did!

    B: I’m driving right now with my Mom in the car and my battery is almost dead. Talk to you later.

    When I got home, I emailed him:

    Hi Ryan,

    Thank you for texting with me tonight. I am just trying to find some measure of peace, in order to face the long, dry desert ahead of no contact with you.

    You said, “But I didn’t DO anything! I don’t know what it is you think I did!”

    Here is a rundown of the recent events:

    Three Saturdays ago, we talked about a half hour in the afternoon, when you once again said it would be better if we didn’t have any contact until you get healing.

    Later in the afternoon, I texted you about how you said once, “It isn’t a sin if no one finds out.”

    You texted back that funny stuff about God knows and He can spank my hiney very hard! LOL!

    After a few texts, there was about a half hour lull of no texts, when you started texting again, asking can we be in ministry to some degree even while we’re still in the healing process. We had a lively discussion by text, which was very uplifting, when finally you called me and we talked about it some more for about 45 minutes.

    During that conversation, you said again that in the future, when you are free, delivered, and healed, we can sit down and discuss what happened in 2009 in depth. You said we can have a friendship again now, and we agreed to not go in depth about any issues from 2009. You said naturally things will come up from time to time, but it would be better if we just address them lightly and just focus on the here and now in our friendship.

    I felt very happy that I at last had my friend back, and it was probably the most connected I have felt with you since 2009.

    The next night at church, Timmy told me he saw you again and that you said you were going to go to Matt Turnabe’s Tuesday night Bible study and to Providence the following Sunday. I did my best to ignore it, knowing you don’t just say things for no reason. I figured you were trying to get my hopes up, and I didn’t expect you to actually come.

    I wasn’t surprised when you didn’t come to church, and it was par for the course.

    I felt increasingly disappointed as each day went by after our renewed friendship, and finally 2 weeks went by. I was in an emergency with the cat with kittens and finally I broke down and called you, even tho I had promised myself I would let you call me. The sadly-familiar coldness and distance were back in place. I have felt so heavy hearted about it ever since.

    I feel frustrated and confused when I can’t feel secure and trusting in words that you say. I felt like I had trudged up a long, steep hill on a hot day, and finally, when you reunited our friendship, I had reached the top. I was dripping with sweat and ready to collapse. Just as I regained some level of rest and delight in finally reaching the top, I looked up, and there was another long, steep hill to climb. Except this one was even longer and steeper! I don’t feel I have the strength to be apart from you, and yet I have to agree with you that it is not healthy to be around you right now. I don’t know what to do. I only know that I need some peace and it would feel so good if we could simply maintain a simple, carefree friendship, as we had agreed to re-establish three weeks ago. What do you think?

    I feel so weary. It would feel so good to feel connected with you and stay feeling connected with you. I don’t like life without you. I am not suicidal, but I don’t even want to be alive without you. I don’t know what to do.

    Love, Brenda

    B: I sent you an email.

    Ryan called me, and we talked about a half hour. He said he doesn’t want to see me hurt and sad all the time. He asked what he could do to help me be happy.

    I said, “I feel embarrassed saying this, but I just want to hang out with you again, like we used to in 2009! I miss you so much!”

    He invited me out for tea at the diner, right then, late at night! We had a wonderful conversation, and he was so kind! He said we could try getting together now and then, and he said he is seriously considering returning to my church, because he needs a church! He compared himself to the beast in Beauty and the Beast, saying that he isn’t ugly, but women are repelled from him with his schizophrenia. He told me about a few women he dated who never wanted to continue it. He said you’re the only one who has kept wanting me in your life, I guess because you are in love with me.

    He said again that he would like to help me feel better and be happier, asking again what he could do. I said, “I feel so good when I feel connected with you. Like I told you in 2009, I have always felt like an alien from another planet. I have spent my life looking around earth for another one of my kind. When I met you, I felt like at last I had found another alien like me!” I smiled, and he was smiling too, saying, “Yeah, I like that analogy!”

    I have felt unusually lonely in my life, after 22 years of having mostly friends in prison. I have a lot of friends, but not many people with whom I can relate at the deep level I can with you. I feel so thoroughly understood when we talk.

    “And I think the fact that I feel so drawn to you tells me that the real you really IS kind and sweet. I don’t fully understand it, but I believe the schizophrenia has really affected our friendship.”

    He said we could get together now and then and he will do his best to stay connected with me. At the same time, he acted ill-at-ease, looking down at his lap and mostly avoiding eye contact. A couple of times I caught his eye and smiled at him. He gave a strained smile back. I accredit most of that to his schizophrenia, because he’s not always smooth with interacting with people. He also seems to hide his face a lot to cover emotions.

    He grew his hair longer than ever, and it was down to his shoulder blades! It’s straight, thick, brown hair, and I love it! When we parted, he gave me a quick hug and told me twice he enjoyed being with me. I gently stroked his hair as he turned to go, longing to feel its silkiness once again. He whirled around, and I smiled. Then he smiled. It felt wonderful to see him again!!!!

    That was Sunday.

    The next day, I texted…

    B: Ryan was kind to Brenda!


    B: “May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, and enough hope to make you happy.” ~ Unknown

    R: Thanks. You too



    Last night, Wednesday, Ryan texted…

    R: Hey, how are you doing?

    I was at church and my phone battery was dead, so I didn’t get his message until about 10:30 pm.

    B: Hi Ryan, I’m feeling so happy…and tired! I had my interview today for the technical writer job in Maryland! It went very well and 3 of the 4 interviewers gave me positive feedback at the interview! I should know by the end of the week if I got it! I feel really optimistic about it!

    R: Good. I pray you get it.

    B: Thank you! I felt so encouraged the other night by the level of deep faith in God that you were expressing! I see so much spiritual growth in you, and it felt so good to see you!

    R: Thank you

    B: You’re welcome! I love talking about God and the Bible with you!

    R: Thank you

    B: (I used Rori’s recent tip here, with adaptations…it might not have been the right juncture to use it) Whoops – that felt weird!

    R: What did?

    B: Sometimes I share things that I feel sort of scared to share. Spiritual fellowship is so important to me, something I don’t have with many people. When I don’t get much of a response, I wonder if it was just a bad time to share or if we aren’t connecting.

    R: No. It’s fine. I’m just sort of chilled out right now.

    B: that’s cool! I don’t know when you texted cuz my battery was dead.

    R: I don’t remember. Maybe 8:30 pm.

    B: Ok. I was at the prayer meeting.

    R: Ok

    B: Nighty night!

    R: Good night.

    I feel so happy to have my friend back!!!

  36.  #36Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:43 am

    RE 33 KS I can understand feeling uncomfortable about calling him. But not talking to him if he has a gf? Sounds like you have an expectation, maybe of him wanting to come back in your life – or you want him back?

  37.  #37Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:45 am

    RE 36 Plum “Great minds think alike” to quote the positive side.

  38.  #38Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:52 am

    From CCarter

    “So what is Emotional Attraction?

    Emotional attraction goes way beyond what a woman looks like, what she says or how successful she is.

    If a man senses that a woman knows what she wants and isn’t afraid to go after it, and that she has certain “standards” of what she will or won’t put up with from a man, then he will feel incredibly drawn to her.

    It has nothing to do with playing GAMES or pretending to be “hard to get.”

    If you think that men just want to “chase” a woman and that acting or being “unavailable” is a turn-on for him, then I have to tell you right now, you’re not going to get far with a man.

    What works to keeping a man interested in you date after date, week after week, is something magical that can only happen if he’s feeling emotional attraction for you.

    TRUTH #2: Men Feel Emotions Just Like Women

    Believe it not, men are pretty sensitive.

    It’s just how they handle what they feel that makes them hard to connect with about it, and hard to understand –

    Unless you know what’s going on with how men handle these things in the first place.

    Men have a hard time dealing with strong emotions from women.

    So you know…in a recent groundbreaking study of how couples interact when in conflict, it was discovered that men often LOOK detached or withdrawn because they feel intensely STRESSED by the argument.

    It’s not that they’re more “in control.”

    On the contrary – they feel LESS in control.

    So they withdraw in order to try and cope.


    One of the things men often say to women when there’s a conflict or tension in the relationship is, “why are you being so dramatic?”

    Annoying, right?

    That’s his way of saying, “This is getting too intense and I don’t know how to handle it.”

  39.  #39Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:54 am

    “TRUTH #3: Men Want Relationships

    Men want to be in a relationship, and they have a strong desire to feel recognized as a great partner by their women.

    Have you ever accused a man of being “not ready” for a relationship?

    Here’s a mind-blowing statistic: WOMEN (not men) break off relationships or file for divorce 70% of the time.

    That means that women are the ones initiating the end of a relationship much more often than men.

    If that surprises you, you may also be surprised to know that a man enjoys being in committed, loving relationships as much as a woman does.


  40.  #40Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 10:04 am

    KS How about when he calls I would say “I feel excited to feel reconnected with you and I realize still have strong feelings towards you but I want to honor myself. This feels weird to say but I do not want to be friends with you because what I am interested in is a romantic relationship. I trust that you know what you want in your life to make you happy and I know being friends with you will not be in my best interest or make me happy while you are involved with someone else. I would appreciate if you respect my feelings” or something to that effect that resonates with you.

  41.  #41Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 10:05 am

    KS I realize there is a lot of “yous” in there but I just wrote as it flowed. But I am assuming/trusting that you know to remove the yous.

  42.  #42Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 10:13 am

    From Patty Contenta. No wonder I love to dance

    Would you like a fun and easy way to experience deep Pleasure? Would you like to feel gorgeous, sexy, and alive in your body? Would you like to feel sensual, playful, and energized?

    One of the deepest and funnest ways to tap into your natural PLEASURE and your natural Sensual self, is to DANCE.

    You can fire up your sacred sensual center by scheduling time to play and celebrate the beauty of Hips! To revel in the delicious art of shaking your hips and booty.

    Shaking your hips and booty just feels so good!

    And tapping into your natural wellspring of creativity,
    pleasure, sensuality, and power gets you on your way to feeling great in your body and knowing that anything, and everything, is possible.

  43.  #43Plum on August 11, 2011 at 10:55 am

    40: Femininewoman

    Thanks! That’s the one I was trying to remember 🙂


  44.  #44Daria on August 11, 2011 at 11:02 am

    help i feel sad and stuck

    I have been talking to a man whom i like very much. I feel a sense of trust with him that I really enjoy with men.

    Yet a lot of times i feel teased and especially when i tell him how i feel he says something like : “thats you, im not making you feel that way”

    so today i felt upset after hearing that and was actually like, ok well, i’ve got to go.

    Then i get this email from him. Im pretty sure it will be obvious both my issues communicating with and why i like him in this email:::

    ‘I do not know what happened today, but I do not like how
    I am feeling after. Since we have met, I have taken
    everything you have said with respect, even when I do not

    You do not give me the same respect. Instead of trying to
    hear me out, you instantly get upset with me. I have not,
    nor will I ever be the man who causes you pain.

    I am here for you while you are going through tough
    times, but in now way am I responsible for anything you
    are feeling.

    I am drawn to you because of your strength, and inner
    beauty you posses. I do not waste my time on
    things/people that have no importance to me. I have just
    met you, but I feel connected to you.

    I never want to hurt you, even if it feels that way. I
    will do whatever it takes to make sure you know that, but
    I need the same in return.

    This is not a one way street, both people’s feelings
    matter. Hopefully, you can understand what I am trying to
    convey. If not, I apologize for making you feel the way
    you do. My intention is to leave you smiling, not

  45.  #45Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 11:10 am

    RE 48 Daria not sure what you are asking for help with. Just to let you know para 5 is something I have heard in the past, except the ” but I need the same in return”.

  46.  #46Mel on August 11, 2011 at 11:13 am

    Emerson… BTW

    Flippy skirt + windy day = bad idea!

    Eeek! Good thing no one saw that!

  47.  #47Ladybug on August 11, 2011 at 11:15 am

    My adorable Main Man was 45 minutes late for our first business meet up. It was still WOW at first sight for both of us. That first month or so he didn’t really listen to what I was saying. He loved the sound of my voice in his ear while he stood close taking in my scent. Sometimes I stood on the running board of my truck so he could oggle my cleavage while I spoke softly to him for hours. I wore a sheer black silk under a wool shirt and kept the shirt unbuttoned when with him.

    No, he wasn’t listening to my words except when I could make him laugh!

    He listens now and he’s very responsive! He makes some pretty big goofs once in a while and I am very forgiving. He feels bad enough when it happens, he doesn’t need my anger. I get a lame explanation and apology, he gets my forgiveness and acceptance of his goofiness. He is truly a good man and receives my unconditional love.

    He hates that I’m CDing, but he knows I am not having physical contact with the other men. We have this weird trust thing……

    I don’t like CDing anymore, but I have this weird insecurity thing about being too stuck on a guy……

  48.  #48Plum on August 11, 2011 at 11:22 am

    33: KS

    “I feel opened to receiving your call. I am reachable on my cell phone such and such day (or everyday) from 6 to 8 pm (or whenever time) Give him a time when you are sure to have nobody around, so you can speak freely.

    I would not tell him about the other girl yet, I’d wait to see why he wants to speak to me.
    __May be he feels remorse for abandoning a pregnant woman, he only wants to know how you managed.
    __May be he figures he can be friend in order to not feel guilty anymore so he can enjoy the other woman.
    __May be from his point of view nothing happened and he feels good, he sincerely wants platonic friendship.
    __May be he figures he can have a sexual friendship with you.
    __May be he left an object he likes a lot at your place and he wants it back.
    __May be he is in love with you and trying to see if there is less drama, hoping to reconnect.

    I would wait to see what he wants.


  49.  #49Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 11:28 am

    RE 52 Wow.

    There was pregnancy involved?

  50.  #50Jade on August 11, 2011 at 11:28 am

    Daria, you say he’s teasing – is he teasing you directly or the feelingss you’re trying to express to him?

  51.  #51Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 11:29 am

    RE 50 Mel I am not so sure. It could awake the “knight in shining armor”.

  52.  #52Jade on August 11, 2011 at 11:30 am

    Feelings with two “s” – wow, that’s a lot of feelings! 😉

  53.  #53Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 11:30 am

    Guys use teasing to bond with each other. So as CCarter says it is a no brainer way to use if you want to bond with them.

  54.  #54Plum on August 11, 2011 at 11:31 am

    50: Mel

    That could be a way to have them all hot on your trail 😉


  55.  #55Daria on August 11, 2011 at 11:35 am

    hmm i feel like im working too hard!



    i sent a pretty detailed thing

    i couldve just said

    i feel really conencted to you too, and i feel mad stating my feelings and hearing “its not my fault, its you who feels that way” i feel alone and bad

    i dont want to feel this way what do u think

    i did send something like that but a lil more detailed and i didnt use the word ‘mad’

    and now i feel kinda icky like i jsut “worked”


    now i feel mad at him!

  56.  #56Mel on August 11, 2011 at 11:39 am

    LOL… At least I had cute undies on! 🙂

  57.  #57Plum on August 11, 2011 at 11:42 am

    53: Femininewoman

    Did I get the names confused?


  58.  #58Brenda on August 11, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Mel and Emerson,

    RE: #50 – Flippy skirt + windy day = Marilyn!

  59.  #59Mel on August 11, 2011 at 11:49 am

    62: True Brenda, true!

  60.  #60Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 11:51 am

    RE 61 Don’t know. I am assuming KS was previously Knocksoftly but I did not remember reading about any pregnancy. I thought your assessment was perfect. I was working on her assumptions. Your response was just being open and inviting – in my opinion.

  61.  #61Jeannette on August 11, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Well, I have been invited to go to KY this weekend where Steve was born with his family for a family reunion. I am looking forward but wishing bad that Steve was with me…

  62.  #62Leo on August 11, 2011 at 12:11 pm

    Hi Ladies!

    I now this is not really related to this topic…
    But I think I just had a great insight, I would like to share with you. And I actually think about adressing it to my Man.

    On monday we were talking on the phoen a little about our needs, his, mine, ours. At some point he mentioned how he would like me to “happily” give him his time for himself and not to just tolerate this wish. And that it doesnt feel to him like I gladly grant him his time when I then tell him how much i miss him right now.
    This matter kept me thinking during the whole week, everyday. And…i got this insight. And it seems…logically somehow.
    In a couple books I have read how men just want they women to be happy. And they dont like her to feel mad or sad. So that when I tell him how I miss him, he feels me being sad, which means to him by wanting his time for himself , he is hurting me. But he needs this time. So he feels lost and becomes defensive and confused.

    I give him his time gradly, i really do. I use it for things I love doing. So when I express how much I miss him, I actually am telling him that I am thinking of him and that I love him. And then, I keep on doing whatever i was doing that makes me feel fulfilled.

    So I think here is a misunderstanding I have to clear up. Me missing him often times makes me feel very happy, because it means that I have really big feelings forhim, that I am in love. Which is suuuuuch a great thing!!! (Of course, sometimes I feel alittle sad too, but mostly happy, for I know I will see him again soon)
    And I think…he believes he is hurting me be something doing something that is essential to him, that he just really needs, time.

    Geez…. I feel so powerful right now…
    The coming up weekend I will be over at his place. We have scheduled a couple nice things for us to do and if there is a moment…I want to have his perspective on this thought. I hope it wont be too much emotion for him… But I think it will help us both in enjoying the time apart better.
    Maybe I will offer to not tell him “I miss you” but rather “I love you”. Maybe it wont trigger the same feelings in him. Or I will always connect another sentence to it (like how I will now go do something fun)…

    Very long post…
    Hope you have some opinions on it!

    Greetings from Germany!


  63.  #63Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:25 pm

    Hi Leo,

    Reminds of CCarter’s “communication is the response you get”, and men take things personally.

    This to me is a clue to how the relationship dance step feels to him and am wondering if he would work with you to find words to express the sentiment/feeling. I don’t think it is a misunderstanding, it is just how his brain processes the statement and how it feels to him. I am not sure telling him that him being away makes you feel happy. I am wondering if changing your focus to just anticipating his return could help your brain to process a way to express how you feel to him. The anticipation of his return and how it lights you up. Just my thoughts….

  64.  #64Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    Leo correction

    I am not sure telling him that him being away makes you feel happy will help. It might trigger a fear in him.

  65.  #65Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    Plum this is the first time I am coming across this concept” __May be he figures he can be friend in order to not feel guilty anymore so he can enjoy the other woman”.

    Is this really a consideration that we should give to recycled flames? Does this really happen?

  66.  #66Leo on August 11, 2011 at 12:35 pm

    Hi femininewoman,

    yes, in fact I have been listeing to CCarter’s things lately. But… well I must have overread/-heard it. Or just not processed it correctly in my head. It hit me today.

    Thanks for your suggestions.
    I didnt mean that I want to tell him, him being away makes me happy. Just not sad. But yes… I see how THAT could lead to a misunderstanding and just seems complicated to get across.

    This “shifting my focus” to anticipating his return sounds pretty good to me. (just for me when thinking). But I am not sure if it would change the feeling in him of me “being hurt or sad” if I told him how much I am looking forward to seeing him.

    Miss you.
    Looking forward to seeing you.

    Well it does sound more positive…i guess.
    yeah, maybe I will try this and do it more often.
    Sometimes, though, he responds with a “yeah, miss you too…” but this message from monday told me differently, that he doesnt like it so much when I say it.

    So, i should not express this “insight” to him, you think? Well maybe.. when it comes up, I will really give him the feeling that I try to understand him (which i do) and that I would like to work on this with him. Ask him if he has a suggestions (which gives him the chance to get involved).

    Oh, btw, what did you mean by “relationship dance step”?

  67.  #67Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:42 pm

    I would not use “miss you” Leo. Is there some other words you could find to express the feeling?

  68.  #68Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:42 pm

    RE 72 Hahahhe Almost fell off my chair.

  69.  #69Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    As Rori says think of the relationship as if it is a dance. You can always change the steps if what you are doing is not working. If you are moving forward and stepping on his toes, try moving backwards.

  70.  #70Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    Leo you don’t need to do anything to give him any feeling. That I believe is doing too much. He will get that you understand him if you listen, really listen at level 2 without interrupting him when he is talking. That is my experience. You are not trying to impress him. If he feels that way about “missing him” just accept him as is. I would just focus on changing my words. Take the focus off him. Take it as a clue to his inner world.

  71.  #71Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    Well I KS I see it as a message/lesson.

    1. How open to you to all people?

    2. Is there still a boundary issue?

    3. Are you trusting your intuition?

  72.  #72flower on August 11, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    i love Jonathon too 🙂

    so i had the guy 9 yrs younger than me reappear on Monday lol so i get to see him once a month maybe a bit more totally crazy about me haha and yes i know he was drunk and all in a party but i just loved when he started expressing in front of his mates what i have and that im animal and all those great things he said out laud there ..oh gosh pitty the “guy from past” wasnt close to hear all that too so i ended up having a very good night out and then bringing someone over no sex this time

    dunno why i feel attracted to him but i feel very comfortable and not afraid to say anything and if i dont hear from him next day it does not drive me mad , i jsut take this one as he comes , and i am myself with this one totally and hmm i do learn i am more wild than i thought i was which is scary but hes sagitarius so maybe thats why im not afraid of outcome , i jsut take it as it is , im not afraid not to hear from him again

    on another hand im still attached to that guy form past lets call him, and i still feel nervous when i see him but if he does speak i feel amazingly good there and forget how bad i was feeling about all the stuff between us and with this one i cant even put myself in feelings messages mode when he is there in front of me , and im kind of afraid and uncomfy but id love to be in a way with htis oen like with the young boy..

    why cant i ? why cant i be like this when i have feelings , when i was jsut getting to know this one i was like with the young one , why can’t i go back or how can i? it is been so long ive been working on this…

    i guess i have improved though a bit as now in the party he first did the usual ignorance bit but i said hi as i passed by him and he replied (and i never say hi first if i see guy in person esp him) then later he passed by and he looked into my eyes (yes first time since last year) and everyone can see there is some unusual vibe between me and him , even i emt some guy whos friend of my friend and friend of this guy first time ever and he said he could feel the ‘vibe’ and that this guy is shy and even more shy than me …

    and everytime theres a guy talking to me he starts to ignore the guy and usually its his friends that try with me haha too

    lol so yes circus of emotions and feelings , i guess time will show so perhaps this one will eventually come but i am in the same kind of mode..well maybe bit different as i circular date and focus on me loads more than i used to

    on one hand id love this one to come and ask me to marry him but on another id be scared and unsure ..and all is like this with this one while with the young one i simply dont care

  73.  #73Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Thanks Femininewoman.

    Yeah, the dance, thats why I am trying to do things differently, for this conversation on monday showed me, what I / we are doing isnt working.

    Well, I dont want to give him a feeling, I just dont want him to get the wrong impression/meaning. You know…
    I have gotten really good at the listeing at level 2 part. I enjoy it a lot actually.

    Well, as I am from Germany, I rarely use “I miss you” (we do use english phrases like this once in a while, but i dont do it often). In German there are two phrases that can be used to express that (the second just gets traslated into english by the same words “i miss u”)

    Do you have a suggestions what I could say instead?

  74.  #74Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:10 pm

    And another little questions…one those little things of the daily life…
    He is at work now and has this messenge on his phone, usually its turned on and we write a little. Today its not on.
    So should I send him a text instead, wishing him a good night, when I go to bed?

    Cause…I catch myself sometimes thinking about “hidden meanings”.
    Him dont sending me a, lets say, good-morning-text, would get my attention and would me make think about “what does this mean now? doesnt he love me no more?” (not that extreme, just to use as an example)
    So, if I now dont text him, as I usually do, I hesitate a little, for I know what I would feel like if he didnt (see above). But would he actually give a thought to this? I cant see him sit there like “she didnt write me, so doesnt she love me no more?”

    So, if I feel like texting him (regardless of the outcome, if he does text back or not), should I?
    Or should I stick to a boundary like: If he wants contact, he should initiate, he knows about when I go to bed.
    Would me texting him be to leany-forward?

  75.  #75Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    Geez…it’s so hard to not put meaning into men’s actions (cause they don’t think that way), because I do put meaning into their actions…
    So hard to break that cycle…

  76.  #76Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    RE 82 Maybe leaning forward but it doesn’t seem you are clear on your own boundary.

  77.  #77Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    yeah… you’re right.
    I really am not clear on my boundary regarding this topic…

  78.  #78Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    RE 81 Leo it sounds to me like you should get clear on how you feel. For most people I know miss u would be okay.

  79.  #79Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    KS I believe there is a boundary issue because of the excitement around the fb comment and like you would have immediately let him in if he was free. Though you know he is as crazy as batshit. I didn’t get the sense that you were willing to wait and check if he was really in the place where he needs to be to reconnect with you. Just my impression…

    You also seemed to not have checked into your feelings to guide your response to him. I believe if you did trust yourself, you would have checked in with your feelings and your intuition would have guided you. I got the sense that you were initially driven by some type of urgency. Just my impression…..

  80.  #80Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    Leo a couply articles ago Rori wrote about boundary I would check it out if I was you.

  81.  #81English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    #38 Brenda

    I feel sooo in lean forward mode and picking up the oars and rowing the boat reading this, OMG this was me pre RR…………..I SO know where you are coming from Siren Sister, but it’s not a good place according to the RR school of thought and feelings 🙁

  82.  #82Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:33 pm

    Thanks, Femininewoman! my feelings are pretty scrambled up lately. When we are together, we have such a great time! I then stick to my boundaries better, but get over things faster, and have fun again faster.
    I am just troubled with the times, we arent together!

    Well… problem resolved itself. And it gave me some confidence for the next time.
    I stuck to my boundary not to text him, and he signed on, and was really nice, asking me how I was doing, and apologizing/telling me that unfortunately he doesnt have much time.
    Great 🙂

    Thanks a lot, again, Femininewoman!

  83.  #83Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:33 pm

  84.  #84Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    Leo I would also read about codependence if I was you. It might help you get clear on going in and out of intimacy. There was also an article that helped me get clear on that.

  85.  #85English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    But Brenda how the hell do we break that man crack addiction??? 🙁 🙁 🙁

  86.  #86Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    Maybe that’s why Rori says when he is not in front of you he does not exist.

  87.  #87Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:37 pm

  88.  #88Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    RE 77 KS your first sentence kind of sound like an attack to me. Which was the reason I asked about being open. I am wondering why would you want to attack him? Is it because you are mad at yourself and want to attack yourself? Maybe because still feel how you feel about him? So I am wondering if you have really sat with those feelings?

  89.  #89turquoise3 on August 11, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    Have a great time Mel! 🙂

    Hi everyone…. moving day is the 22nd, lots to do before then, but so excited! I can’t wait to be unpacking rather than packing!!!

    SLV, definitely need to choose an anonymous email and new name for on here. Until then, keeping my posts very non informative.

    It’s almost Friday!!!!! YES!

  90.  #90Leo on August 11, 2011 at 1:42 pm

    I found the video, thanks.
    Hope I will find things on the codependence.
    Do you remember which article that was on ?

    Yeah, I sometimes forget about this “if he isnt in front of me he doesnt exist”
    Have to keep telling me that!
    Thanks for the reminder

  91.  #91Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:42 pm

    KS I am sure. That is how babysteps work. So then look for the message. Maybe you have made some strides and grown a bit, but you still have some growing up to do?

    Or maybe it is a message to start wondering about yourself to see where you are on your journey to you?

  92.  #92Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:43 pm

    (((((((((((((((Truquoise 3))))))

    So good to “see” you

  93.  #93Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:43 pm

    Leo I have to look for the innerbonding article.

  94.  #94Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 1:48 pm


    How about feelings of anticipation or excitement for the reunion. Maybe he expriences “miss u” as negative?

  95.  #95Daria on August 11, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    hehe he responded wll to my message and said he respects my feelings and nwo we connected and had video sex which was awesome p;ractice opening up haha and it felt embarassign and funn too

    we’re still talking… uhoh video interrupt lol

  96.  #96Daria on August 11, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    i feel xcited am no longer obsessing about nyguy

    am not even expanding his thing to read all teh comments to him or liking his facebooks



  97.  #97Brenda on August 11, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    English Woman,

    Ut-oh. Dunno what to say. I miss him. I feel messed up inside with all his psychological abuse.

    I guess everyone else thinks it’s TMI or they aren’t saying what you said. I feel embarrassed that I shared.

  98.  #98Leo on August 11, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    Sticking to my boundaries concerning other things worked: he just asked when we gonna see each other then? (for I told him i have plans during the day tomorrow) He used to just tell me on fridays that i should come over that evening (didnt like this short notice).

    yes, that’s what I was thinking! Will use words of anticipation! used the german aquivalent of “looking forward to seeing you”

    Thanks again, femwoman.

    Will go to sleep now!
    have a lovely night!


  99.  #99Daria on August 11, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    THIS cd had a credit repair business too! and he shared some info with me that made me feel mucho better yay!

    yay loa

  100.  #100Corin on August 11, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    I feel embarassed about my attacking behaviour towards you last night. I am sorry I acted so aggressively. I want to learn to be gentler, more open and vulnerable with myself and in how I treat others.

  101.  #101Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 3:02 pm

    wow, one of my pof guys was very interviewy and questiony with our initial email contact, asking very personal questions, and I replied with whoa I don’t feel comfortable being asked that….and I feel defensive being asked what is blocking me from having a relationship..kinda odd thing to ask.

    He replied with more questions. Not sure if I will keep talking with him.

  102.  #102Plum on August 11, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    670: Sunflower82

    ***all i know is that from one day to the next he began resenting me, when i was being extra nice and supportive to him  ***

    Men feel resentful of women who help them when they didn’t ask for it.
    Once thing is that he asked you to stick around, another is that you would actually do things for him, caress his head when he feels down, or help his finances or drive him around etc… That puts him in the position to owe something, angry at the person who puts him in this position
    Also when a man is tired or feels down, he expects the woman to stay strong in her own life, inspiring by her own life, present with him, but not motherly touching him or advising him or doing things to make his life easier. That kills his energy even more and he hates it. As long as he does no ask for you to do a specific action, do no do anything for him. He resents it like you are stealing his life. And he loses respect when he sees you are not taking care of yourself, you are putting him before you.

    The other thing is that when you help him, you expect him to pay you back. Men give, women receive and give back. When a woman gives to a man she expects to be paid back. She projects her unconditional love outside of her relationship, not within.
    Helping a man is a way to keep control on his life. Men resist and shut down.

    ***to assuage his guilt he was always angry and unsatisfied. ***
    Unless he told you why he seemed angry, you can’t know the reason, you are projecting your guilt on him. It might be interesting for you to wonder where you feel guilty.

    ***I realized also that he’s addicted to self punishment and has low self esteem, and even though his family treated him like crap took all of his money and gave him hell over me, he still respects them and was always praising them, maybe because they were authentic not like me who pushed down my feelings avoided my needs didn’t stand up for myself when he began screwing up. So i Understand it but it still hurts sooo bad***

    I see you like Byron Katie, would you like to turn this paragraph around? Try to say “I” where it is written “he” and to say “he” where it is written “I” or “me” etc…

    By the way, you don’t know if his family took all his money. He may have let them do what they want with it because that’s how he prefers things to be. In any case it is his money and his family, out of your bridge. If you commented about it with him, he might have felt intruded upon and controlled, disrespected.


  103.  #103Corin on August 11, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    The more I work on this blog and other resources, the more I’m realising that my difficulties are not with men, they are with myself.

    I had a good cry and really connected with my little girl today. In the past it has been hard to feel the sadness and unloved and neglected feelings. I generally needed a man to trigger them and then to blame them on/ feel victimised by. However they are now flowing far more easily and I’m learning to soothe and take care of myself. I really hope I’m moving forward in some pretty big stuff, especially related to my father.

    Wow, it feels like there is beginning to be such a big shift from blaming myself or ex boyfriends, towards love and acceptance and nurture. That feels peaceful and exciting.

    I’m starting to release the old ‘poor me’ stories that go endlessly round and round and round my head. I wonder what will fill the space that’s left.


  104.  #104Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 3:23 pm

    Mel and Brenda,
    All this talk about flippy skirts, I must get one!
    But note to self, don’t wear on a windy day…ok hahha

  105.  #105Daria on August 11, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    aww Corin thank you … that feels so good I feel moved… like warmness coming up and shaking me 🙂

    with smiles

    you know, you just started on this Rori non-judgement thing, and you im sure were very triggered as was i

    i attacked people like crazy for years even on the blog and am still babystepping

    i think you are amazingly good at being self conscious and loving

    i feel honored

    and i feel a bit safer now

    thank u

  106.  #106Daria on August 11, 2011 at 3:27 pm

    heres a blurb from a man’s profile

    “i will respect u at all times. Protect you. Give u what a boy cant. hot air balloon rides, wine tasting in Napa, foot rubs, passionate earth-shattering sex, %100 honesty and loyalty. your best friend and confidant…your King…and yes…IT DOES EXIST!!!!!”

    hehehe i like it ! lets see how he does!!!

  107.  #107Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    #41 FW says
    If a man senses that a woman knows what she wants and isn’t afraid to go after it, and that she has certain “standards” of what she will or won’t put up with from a man, then he will feel incredibly drawn to her.

    WOW…so powerful. FW I needed to hear these words. I feel like these words give me permission to be very candid, authentic and real about what it is that I want, not just skimming by under the radar hoping that my recycled CD wants the same…I do notice he’s so different and wants to connect with me when I’m totally in my zone of sireneyness….

    I must remain true to that!!! I want a husband, house, kids, dog, cat, goldfish!!! LOL that’s what I want ok!!! And many men would be thrilled to share it with me! I just have to find the right one who is ok with me being me and being a siren and being a feminine energy!! yay! Is it recycledCD? I dunno…maybe maybe not

  108.  #108Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 3:32 pm

    FW I also love the words in #43
    It reminds me that men want relationship too….it’s not something I have to convince them of!

  109.  #109luzydel on August 11, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    I only give a second chance if I felt attraction on the first date; if not I wont lead the guy on. I don’t care how nice he is if I did not feel it, I won’t go on a second date.

    But now I am off dating and breathing again, I am happier when I don’t have to worry about men.

  110.  #110Daria on August 11, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    this man is so freakin gorgeous face and body too!

  111.  #111FlowerChild77 on August 11, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    ((((Brenda))))…don’t feel embarrassed. I feel easily shy/awkward about stuff I post sometimes, too. I think it’s good that you shared—if you are open to feedback. I am not a real Siren yet, but I had some reaction to your post.

    To be honest, I cringed at reading how many times he tells you, clearly and simply, to leave him alone. I know it must hurt, terribly, to share so much of yourself and get absolutely no response back from him–and so you attempt to contact him over and over until he does say something.

    It almost seems as though he ends up saying what he thinks you want to hear because he feels badly and wants to put a band-aid on it before he retreats again.

    I get the feeling that he may want to be on friendly terms with you/spend short amounts of time/have a cup of coffee with you, etc. Even though you say (and may actually believe) that that’s acceptable to you you—it seems that you want so much more.

    >>>”He said we could get together now and then and he will do his best to stay connected with me. At the same time, he acted ill-at-ease, looking down at his lap and mostly avoiding eye contact.”<<<

    I'm sensing that you and he have very different meanings for 'staying connected.'

    From reading through your post, what I see is that he can handle very simple, platonic interaction and remain polite. It's when you try to 'get' more from him than he has or wants to give that he seems to become frustrated and rude.

    I feel quite bad typing all this out…but my heart hurts for you when I see how you can't just accept 'no' from him.

    What do you think?

  112.  #112FlowerChild77 on August 11, 2011 at 3:46 pm

    #41/FW >>”If a man senses that a woman knows what she wants and isn’t afraid to go after it, and that she has certain “standards” of what she will or won’t put up with from a man, then he will feel incredibly drawn to her.”<<

    Thank you FW (and Emerson for bringing it up again in #116) 🙂 I will keep this in mind tomorrow when I see xbf/bf.

    I must remain authentic. In the past, I've been too easily willing to 'negotiate' around my wants and needs—in fear of losing the relationship (this goes way back to before ex-h—a pattern I'm learning to break.)

    I am so addicted to this blog, I can't believe it. But it's helping me SO much! <3

  113.  #113luzydel on August 11, 2011 at 3:55 pm

    @121: >>”If a man senses that a woman knows what she wants and isn’t afraid to go after it, and that she has certain “standards” of what she will or won’t put up with from a man, then he will feel incredibly drawn to her.”<<

    I hear this so many times…all the "blablabla" of a man or men will like us for what we do or how we behave; the truth is that for a man the attraction is wither ther or it isn't. If that was the truth then I will have tons of men begging me to marry them; I am one of those women who does not wwait for anyone to get what she wants.

    My advise…be who you are and if you need to change, do it for you not to get a smelly man 😛

    I seen women who are demanding; overweight, lazy, etc. and they have met someone…so again. Does men really go for personality and looks or they go for "chemistry"?

  114.  #114Corin on August 11, 2011 at 4:04 pm


    I agree with EW. What could you do to love youself more when you feel the urge to reach out and contact him?


  115.  #115Corin on August 11, 2011 at 4:05 pm


    Thank you for accepting my apology. I feel warm and smily too. I would much rather hold onto love for people than who is ‘right’ or ‘wrong’. That feels good.

  116.  #116Corin on August 11, 2011 at 4:08 pm

    “It’s time to begin giving to yourself that which you’ve been waiting for somone else to give to you”

    Yep- gonna do this pronto! Starting with a lovely, relaxing sleep.

    Night Sirens xxxxx

  117.  #117Butterfly Wings on August 11, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    #38 Brenda – What I am about to say is 100% about my concern for you ok? And my intention is definitely not to judge you (I see myself in you, hence why I was so concerned when I read your post), but to offer my help and support.

    I see that you’re doing practically all of the work in your friendship with Ryan, and it reminds me a lot of my past experience. The more you lean forward, the faster he will run – remember that.

    As I read the dialogue between the two of you, I get that he really doesn’t want to hurt you (so he does care about you), but he doesn’t have the balls to tell you to go in a way that will make you listen (because he does not want a relationship with you – he made that very clear when he said “Leave me alone” several times, and “No thank you” when you said you wanted to cuddle. He also said other things to you that clearly showed (to me) that he was not interested in anything with you.).

    I also get that he’s “hiding” behind his schizophrenia too – that’s just the impression I’m getting from his words. He seems to be using it as an excuse. How long will he keep doing that? It’s already been 2 years!

    My feelings my entire life have been this: If a guy wants to be with me, then he will do what he can to be! Ryan’s not even being given the chance to make the effort with you because you’re doing practically all of the contacting.

    No amount of convincing or begging will change Ryan’s mind about what he wants with you.

    He may agree initially to give you what you want (because he feels guilty about hurting you), but he won’t be happy about it and will eventually end up hurting you again when it gets too much for him. He may even resent you because he will feel he was “pushed” into something he didn’t want.

    Do you really want that for yourself?

    Brenda, I wonder what it is inside yourself that you’ve not healed that you allow this one-sided “friendship” continue?

    You say you love him, but why don’t you love yourself more? Why are you punishing yourself? Why don’t you believe you deserve better?

    I can see clear as day that you deserve SO much better! You have so much love in your heart, you’re an intelligent woman with so much to give, and I really think this guy is so below you (not meant in a judgmental way – just that I don’t believe he’s capable of being with a wonderful woman like you)!

    And how can he love you if YOU don’t give yourself the love and care YOU need?

    If you loved and cared for yourself more, you would not tolerate such treatment anyway, and he’d have no choice but to either step up, or lose you forever. This is important.

    My situation many years ago meant I let myself put up with 9 years of verbal and emotional abuse. Here I was with the man who was supposed to love me, yelling at me and calling me every name under the sun – for years! Oh how I wished he’d hit me, then I would have had a “decent” excuse to leave. But he didn’t, so I stayed.

    I loved him so much, and I often wondered how he could treat me this way. But I NEVER gave him a good enough reason to treat me better, because I continued to let it happen.

    I can’t remember how many times I contemplated suicide – but I know it was a LOT!

    As my counselor said to me: My situation was partly my fault because my words and actions did not tell him it was in his best interests to change. I was giving him “permission” to keep treating me that way because I refused to put myself first and show him I would not tolerate such treatment.

    What are you doing to show Ryan you won’t put up with being treated badly? He doesn’t have to do any work because you keep contacting him, and he knows you love him. So why would he bother changing? He knows you’ll contact him anyway.

    Brenda, my heart goes out to you, and your situation (and my own from years ago) is the basis for my life passion to help women build their self esteem so they’re not left feeling trapped in a situation like we’ve both been in.

    I know I have a lot to learn myself, and TH has been the basis of a LOT of learning this last year and a half and my experience from him opened my eyes to the fact that I had a lot of healing to do around the ending of my second marriage (I carried a LOT of guilt over that).

    I believe your situation with Ryan is a wake up call for you – he’s got a message that’s coming through loud and clear – learn to love and care for yourself more and your life WILL change! Trust me!

    I’m so hoping you get the job you applied for Brenda, because I think that’s going to give your self esteem a massive boost, and maybe that’ll be the start of the improvement of all aspects of your life? I think so! 🙂

    As for how I eventually built the courage to leave my ex, well… I looked at my then 2 and a half year old daughter and realised that if I continued to put up with this man’s treatment, then I was teaching her that it was ok.

    And if she had eventually found herself in the same situation, I would NEVER have forgiven myself. It was so NOT ok!

    No parent wants their daughter to be abused, verbal or otherwise.

    Brenda, how do you think your parents would feel about Ryan’s treatment of you? What do you think their advice would be? What if you had a daughter in your situation? What would you advise her to do?

    I emailed you the other day about potential writing work, so if you ever want to “talk” off the blog, please email me.

    Be strong Brenda xxxx

  118.  #118Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 4:37 pm

    RE 121 FlowerChild just remember to stay warm and open. Not demanding and making harsh requests. Men are very sensitive to our tonality that can come across harsh if we have been hurt and jaded. We are responsible for giving ourselves what we want, not a man.

  119.  #119Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    RE 115 Daria thanks for sharing that, it is so heart warming.

  120.  #120Ice Princess on August 11, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    Just got off the phone with LP and he asked if we could change our plans for tomorrow to something else. I love his plan and am so excited that he stepped up and thought out a wonderful day for us and the kids tomorrow. 🙂

  121.  #121Senior Lady Vibe on August 11, 2011 at 4:45 pm

    Hello world, I’m thankful for Tina Turner’s spirit and inspiration. She’s an example of a woman bouncing back from a bad situation. So… never give up and put a little Tina in your CD tool kit…

    I’m giving my girls an encore… 😀

    Tina Turner – Legs (Live)

    Go Tina, go Sharon, go Karen.


  122.  #122Plum on August 11, 2011 at 4:46 pm


    In the link I pasted in post 5, at the end of the video, the Doc says we must create 90% of our own happiness and the man can be the 10% bonus. He says that a woman is not ready for a relationship as long as she is not happy. It does not mater if she gets married, it won’t work.


  123.  #123Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    RE 110 Emerson I would keep talking to him. What I see is him teaching you confidence, to speak up early on about what you want, how you feel and to be curious about the man in front of you. Maybe that’s what he is doing? You can ask anything on the first or second “date” and get honest answers. He is being up front. His tone might be off putting but he is being masculine, going after what he wants.

  124.  #124Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    RE 131 Plum not sure what your message is. I appreciate that point though.

  125.  #125Plum on August 11, 2011 at 4:56 pm


    No scripting, my message is the one written on my post 🙂


  126.  #126Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 4:57 pm

    132 FW, Good points, he is being masculine…maybe I’ve been accustomed to these fem-energy guys lateley, and here comes a man who is not fem, and I get scared!
    I even told him I feel intimidated and maybe we are not a match….but then I kind of recanted and said that I feel open to meeting him anyway and maybe we can be friends…?

    I don’t know what the hell I’m doing right now…!!! That’s how I feel!! Gah! haha, but I feel happy…I’m learnign and growing

  127.  #127Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 4:59 pm

    RE 135 Emerson its good you are trying but are you sure you just want to meet “friends” on a dating site.

  128.  #128Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 5:06 pm

    No not really wanting to meet friends. But that seemed like the most natural thing to say at the moment.

    I feel curious about why that is.

    I got scared and closed off when he barraged me with all those questions (literally four or five questions that were pretty deep, and the first one put me off it was kidna negative)

    Hmm…I feel kinda silly right now and dumb for saying that now, suggesting to him that we could be friends.

    Yikes I feel confused.

  129.  #129Plum on August 11, 2011 at 5:13 pm

    137: Emerson

    Is that the guy who asked what is blocking you from having a relationship?
    I feel curious to know why such a question? Do you remember what you told him before he asked you that?


  130.  #130Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 5:29 pm

    Plum, yes that is the guy. Literally I had said nothing but that I liked his profile and I emailed him a photo, saying “here is a photo of me” …..he responded that I’m very attractive and what is blocking me from having a relationship.

    I responded honestly and said that I felt defensive being asked that question, it’s very personal and I don’t open up that quickly and I don’t feel comfortable answering that question to someone I don’t know…

    He responded that he didnt mean for it to come off that there was something wrong, just asking the question, which he followed with about four more really personal questions.

    So it just occured to me that I really felt unheard in that I told him I don’t feel comfortable, andwhat does he do but come back with more questions….hmm…why am I so slow to identify my feeliongs.

    Welcome your thoughts Plum and sirens et al….

  131.  #131Starla on August 11, 2011 at 5:29 pm

    Well, “my guy” who i was dating/with for 6 months until he dumped me by unfriending me and my friends without a word on facebook is back.

    he called the other night and i didn’t answer. left no message

    texted this morning, “hello”
    i didn’t answer (busy working and no idea what to say anyway)

    then sends a friend request on facebook when i didn’t answer that.

    then texts me again that he knows it’s been a while but really wants to talk to me.

    i answered when i was off of work. said i was working and now i’m headed out of town (all true!)

    how do i feel?

    well i feel smug. they all come crawling back, don’t they?

    but i feel uninterested. i could feel that immature impatient pull…like he has no respect for my time, and is on my case if i don’t answer him.

    i feel like an object still. i felt like an object when we were together.

    yet, i feel glad that i finally have the opportunity to make peace with him. i’m not trying to hang out with him as homies on a regular basis, but i do want the dynamic between us to be positive and loving and hoping for the best for the other person. i want running into him around town to be a happy experience, where i am glad to see his face and hear if he’s doing well.

    and i don’t ever want to talk trash about him or let anyone talk trash about him. i want him to be part of Team Starla.

  132.  #132Starla on August 11, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    just because we didn’t vibe well and couldn’t get along and brought out the worst in each other (i’m assuming it was his worst since it was also my worst) doesn’t mean he’s done anything “wrong.” he deserves all the good things in life. not being the man for me doesn’t mean he deserves anything less than a beautiful life. i hope to God he gets it.

    i am really dead set on having nothing but love for him.

  133.  #133Kayla on August 11, 2011 at 5:38 pm

    I am feeling soo happy right now (: one of the men that I have been CDing, asked me to be in a relationship with him last night. It kinda took me by suprise but I said yes. I feel confident that this will work.

  134.  #134Starla on August 11, 2011 at 5:40 pm

    I don’t want to be angry with him that he didn’t come for me when i was jogging and got chased down by that crazy stranger.

    i chose then to stop being exclusive with him since my needs weren’t getting met, but i didn’t honor my own boundaries, and kept spending a lot of time with him.

    i only have myself to be angry at. and i am a little angry…but i’ve learned my lesson. that my needs and boundaries are not worth risking to keep male company around. even if i think i love him.

    i am looking forward to much more healing!

  135.  #135Starla on August 11, 2011 at 5:43 pm

    Kayla, so glad you’re feeling good!

  136.  #136Starla on August 11, 2011 at 5:55 pm

    kayla, you should feel confident it will go well…
    you are the air he needs to breathe, as rori says!!

  137.  #137Violet on August 11, 2011 at 6:06 pm

    Brenda… I don’t know you and you don’t know me. Please don’t take what I’m going to say as a personal judgement towards you. I ‘hear’ this man saying he wants left alone. Maybe it’s time to take him up on it and leave it that way. I sure as hell wouldn’t want to be on that emotional roller coaster ride. I’ve been in a co-dependant relationship long enough to see the signs of one. Like I said… I don’t know you and I certainly don’t know him. So, please don’t take it personal. I’ll be the first one to admit I probably don’t know what in the hell I’m talking about. Anyway… You take care of you, ~ Violet ~

  138.  #138Violet on August 11, 2011 at 6:12 pm

    Jonathon Aslay probably gets about a zillion compliments a day (exaggeration). He’s definitely my idea of being drool worthy. hahaha!!!!

  139.  #139DE on August 11, 2011 at 6:24 pm


    hmm…i think i know u…:) am i right?

    it would feel good when Sirens change their names give us a heads-up …even outside the blog…

    Now, i intend to pay closer attention to Starla 🙂

    warm hugs

  140.  #140Butterfly Wings on August 11, 2011 at 6:25 pm

    Starla – Yay you! What a wonderful place you’re in now! So happy for you and so glad you’re not making it about him or trashing him – what a great place for you to be! 🙂

    Kayla – Congrats to you! Glad you’re so happy.

  141.  #141FlowerChild77 on August 11, 2011 at 6:33 pm

    #127/FW I understand what you’re saying. I didn’t mean that that quote would be part of any conversation I have with him–it’s something I have to remember inside of ME–kind of like the garden chat video where Rori talked about the difference between walls and boundaries. I need to stick to my own boundaries on the inside and remain open and soft on the outside. (I’m kinda talking to myself, here) 😉

  142.  #142Starla on August 11, 2011 at 6:37 pm

    To think that I was in a suicidal dark black hole only 6 weeks ago…

    and to be soooo shifted.

    and to know how i shifted, and to stay here…

    i feel…wonderful.

  143.  #143Ice Princess on August 11, 2011 at 6:43 pm

    Yeah Starla!!!

  144.  #144Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 6:51 pm

    Gotcha FlowerChild

  145.  #145Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 6:52 pm

    Starla doesn’t it just feel awesome.

    I found myself self unconsciously in my self talk saying I am a phenomenal woman.

  146.  #146FlowerChild77 on August 11, 2011 at 6:54 pm

    WHAT is WRONG with me????!!! I’m not even excited about seeing xbf/bf tomorrow…. 🙁

    I don’t know what’s happening. I won’t break our plans, but I just don’t feel…I don’t know…like I used to feel about seeing him. Is this a good thing?

    I’m more concerned with his ‘assumptions’ right now than I am about whether things are going to work out between us. What is that about?

    The last week or so, I’ve been really ‘liking’ my house and my life. I’ve been seriously wondering if I want to give this up and how I’d feel about it if I do.

    I don’t love him any less, but I just feel so detached and kind of like I’m looking at myself and my life in a crystal ball and I’m on the outside. It feels good, and yet I feel rather unemotional.

    I don’t know where this is coming from…at ALL. It’s a little scary to feel this content and this happy. Is this what happens? Is this normal?

    Talk to me…

  147.  #147Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 6:55 pm

    RE 143 Starla if you are who I am thinking you are then mannnnn your vibe has changed. That urgency and the drama seem to be totally gone. If it is you.

  148.  #148Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    RE 155 Nothing is wrong with you.

    Nasty voice!!!

  149.  #149Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 6:58 pm

    RE 155 Yep. You are complete.

  150.  #150DE on August 11, 2011 at 7:03 pm


    Well, Dahling take it as a compliment…u sound and feel sooo fabulous to me…:)

    I feel sooo touched for being a part of your growth…here on this site and outside… and share your cry, joy, and laughter 🙂

    warm hugs

  151.  #151Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    RE 139 Emerson did he ask you for that photo? I am wondering if you came across eager to send it to him.

    In any event I would encourage you not to be concerned about his questioning. He is being himself. That is the kind of thing I like because then I get to know if it’s a match as early as possible. If he is not paying attention to your needs, it is an early signal that he might not pay attention later on.

  152.  #152Starla on August 11, 2011 at 7:05 pm

    it’s me, D.

  153.  #153FlowerChild77 on August 11, 2011 at 7:05 pm

    Ok…..thank you, FW. I guess I’ve never really known what this would feel like.

    Wow! This Siren stuff is powerful…. 😉

  154.  #154Starla on August 11, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    i love it! i am proof you can get happy like *that*

    it takes a commitment though…and a serious honesty with yourself.

  155.  #155Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    In Dating Without Drama she says “not forcing him to discuss where the relationship is going before he is ready, you have the upper hand in the relationtionship.

  156.  #156Starla on August 11, 2011 at 7:18 pm

    164 – SO TRUE.

    it’s always given me the upper hand. which feels ironic, non?

  157.  #157Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:28 pm

    More from Dating Without Drama

    “The only way to become a whole person is to complete yourself. Psychologist Abraham Maslow’s renowned theory, The Hierarchy of Needs, states that the ultimate goal in a human’s life is self-actualization, or the avility to make the most of one’s unique abilities. In his book Motivation and Personality, he writes, “A musician must make music, the artist must paint, a poet must write, if he is to be ultimately at peace with himself”. We can refer to our loved ones as “my other half” – or worse – “my better half”.

    To expect that another human being can somehow fill that void within us is simply unfair. In reality the only that can make us whole is to follow our calling in life; to be who we truly are. The best relationships occur when two whole people come together out of a desire to share their full, happy lives with one another. They are people who feel good about themselves yet desire a partner to walk through this world with and experience life together. These are the relationships that succeed.

    You can have that kind of relationship if you’re willing to focus on yourself. What I am say is that while you continue the search for a partner to share your life with, you must make yourself a priority along the way. No matter how many dating prospects you have at any given time, always make it a priority to DATE YOURSELF FIRST”.

  158.  #158Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:32 pm


    “However, if you are willing to do the introspective work it takes, you will begin to grow by leaps and bounds. As you focus on your own happiness you will be amazed at the transformation that starts to occur within you. You will feel comfortable in your own skin, and when you meet a man you won’t enter into a relationship from a place of need, but rather one of strength. Men will be drawn to your confidence and will do anything to spend time with you.”

  159.  #159Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    “Even though guys are all about instant gratification in the moment, the women who hold their interest are the ones who leave them wanting more.”

  160.  #160Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 7:51 pm

    160 FW I don’t have my pic up on the dating site, so I sent him a message and said I like his profile and if he wants to correspond I could send a pic….so he replied and I sent it.

    Meh…I’m feeling turned off by the whole dialogue between him and I.

  161.  #161Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 7:52 pm

    FW I sometimes reach out to men I like on the dating site since I don’t have a pic, often people won’t contact me first. Then I switch into way lean back mode…..
    Your thoughts/feelings about this? Sirens?
    It’s been talked about before here on the blog I think, but I welcome your input! 🙂

  162.  #162Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:06 pm

    FW says

    You can have that kind of relationship if you’re willing to focus on yourself. What I am say is that while you continue the search for a partner to share your life with, you must make yourself a priority along the way. No matter how many dating prospects you have at any given time, always make it a priority to DATE YOURSELF FIRST


    FW you are on a parallel plane with me tonight….I need this

  163.  #163Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:07 pm

    167 again, more good words….

  164.  #164Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:11 pm

    I have no pic on one and am currently in a convo with someone who has no pic also. I experiment with all kinds of things. I have not reached out to anyone and I get emails. Maybe not hundreds but I get them. This one told me he was attracted by my profile.

  165.  #165Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    He wanted to talk but I said maybe tomorrow becus it is already late. He asked a second time if I wouldn’t take a quick call to say hello. Boundary pusher, I said no. He said ok sweety, totally understand with sad face.

  166.  #166Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:18 pm

    RE 169 It might be unconscious but it could be his response to your leaning forward.

  167.  #167alias girl on August 11, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    i feel so good. i can feel my progress.

    just got off phone with a cd. i tried to converse, use fm, listen, be curious. but i also was really paying attention to how i felt.

    after a while i said, i don’t feel connected. and i tried to explain why and i repeated that i just didn’t feel connected. and finally i said well i feel like i’ve been listening a lot and i’m just not into it.


    i said at this point i didn’t feel like it. and i said i wanted to get off the phone.

    he asked if he could call again. i said if he feels like it.

    he said “maybe when you’re in a better mood.”

    i couldn’t even bother with another feel message. who cared? wasted on him. too much work.

    i said, i am getting off the phone. and he made some noise a three year old boy would make when you ask for your ball back.

    he’ll probably call again. i do not feel interested.

  168.  #168alias girl on August 11, 2011 at 8:25 pm

    but i do have a coffee cd with another guy on sat.

    and the fourteen other men i gave my number to are still mustering their courage…ahem…i mean trying to find the time… to call.

  169.  #169Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:25 pm

    175 thanks FW for your feedback,
    Im just curious and want to understand, 🙂 what are you referring to specifically that could be his response to my leaning forward?

    Hmm I like your response to the “boundary pusher”….looking out for your needs. I do get a few emails from my profile alone without reaching out, and I’ve talked to a few of these guys. I’m such a hypocrite because I want to see their pic and yet I don’t have mine up. LOL.
    You’ve inspired me to be more open to it.

  170.  #170Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    176 alias girl
    thes are the words that came to my mind after reading this: I LOVE IT.

    So great to read this, and inspiring….wow so sireny of you!!!!!

  171.  #171Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:28 pm

    179 I mean I love it because your reply was so spot on, and you were so true to your own needs! Just to clarify. I don’t love that he was not listening to you.
    But I absolutely love your reply and how you handled it. You got guts girl. I want to be more like that, rather than slip into polite mode, like I’ve been taught to do my whole life!!! yay alias girl!

  172.  #172alias girl on August 11, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    i love being in my feelings. being in my body. especially on the phone because it’s soley about the connection.

    and i can FEEL what feels good or bad to me.

    i can’t explain it. i just love it though. also i love that i am letting in a lot more men because that way i get a lot more practice.

    i feel excited about the whole process. WHO KNOWS WHAT WILL HAPPEN NEXT?

    or who will call.

    and i just pick up my phone.



    and i have no idea who will be on the other end or for what reason. could be a job opp could be a person i met last year could be a new cd could be an ex.

    very interesting.

  173.  #173Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:30 pm

    I don’t see it as being hypocritical. It is your preference because you are not ready yet to put up a pic, plus you can always send one to whoever asks.

    I don’t message, send gifts do nothing first on the dating site. If they find something interesting on the profile they will come. I don’t want to lead in any way. I would say keep updating your profile and see what happens

  174.  #174Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:32 pm

    Hmm…FW I think I may switch things up and try it your way. I am going to update my profile now. 🙂 Feeling excited.

  175.  #175Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:34 pm

    alias girl I used the same wording…I told recycledCD that I felt disconnected, and now the last couple times I’ve seen him, he asks me “do you feel connected today?” It’s kinda cute because to me, it shows that he listened to what I said.

    yay…I’m going to consciously do something DIFFERENT meaning I am going to be so present in my body and in my feelings…..and in my heart, and be SO TRUE to that when I interact with any of the CDs I have in rotation.

  176.  #176Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:52 pm

    Emerson it might be tease. He might be asking if you are feeling connected to yourself. At least that is what I sense.

  177.  #177Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:56 pm

    185 FW thank you for responding and pointing that out, but no I believe he’s not doing that…I should have worded it better…

    when I did originally explain to him that I felt disconnected, I told him I felt disconnected from him when we were talking over lunch, and that’s when he asked do you feel connected (to me) today? And he asked again the next time I saw him….as in “are we connected?”

    But thanks for pointing out that possibility, I will be more specific with the wording 🙂

    He’s not really “teasy” that way…

  178.  #178Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 8:57 pm

    He keeps saying so tell me more and pushed for a phone call a second time.

  179.  #179Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    Wow FW! I feel turned off when guys get too pushy.

  180.  #180Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    I said I am old fashioned and prefer that men call me he said he was going to give me his number out of respect. He kept pushing tell me more. I told him I felt bored and disconnected, he kept saying sorry sweety and why. Anyway I finally told him I was sleepy and brain don’t work well when me sleepy. He finally said ok ok and sent me his number. No request for my number.

  181.  #181Femininewoman on August 11, 2011 at 9:06 pm

    RE 188 I don’t. I feel intrigued that I can be so sireny that they can’t help themselves. I’ve got power.

  182.  #182Starla on August 11, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    now “my guy” is texting me all late-tastic at night to tell me he’ll call me this weekend and maybe something will work out that we can talk.

    i feel irritated. like dude, hello, it’s late for a school night and i’ve told you before after 9 or 10 i don’t wanna be phoned or texted.

    no respect for my time!

    the new me is choosing to just receive the text matter of factly and not get angry at him because he sends them at any particular time or with any sort of inappropriate urgency. there’s no reason to get ANGRY. i feel silly that i even get so irritated. i can *not* get angry, instead, and just notice he has certain text habits, and know in myself that i don’t feel good about that with a man, and honor that about myself by not getting with guys that do that…

    and i don’t have to think twice about it.

    but i never ever have to make him wrong or bad. i just choose something else.

  183.  #183English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 10:28 pm

    @ 676 Emerson

    Last thread….

    I was just catching up on some posts and I saw you said you had been crying over ex and have now shifted it around to loving yourself more than you ever did and just wondered if you had any tips on what worked for you personally as I would like to get some of that self love too. 🙂

    Thank you

  184.  #184English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    #106 Brenda

    Nothing to feel embarrassed about, you just shared some personal stuff with us is all.

    Nobody died, you didn’t insult or attack anybody……..

    Have you heard about the job yet? I sooo hope you get it and get life back on track from this temporary blip. 🙂

  185.  #185English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 10:36 pm

    #4 Plum

    I am saving that to watch at the weekend, but oh that soundtrack is so annoying at the beginning, does that go away? It makes me feel funny in the head LOL!!

  186.  #186Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    192 English Woman (((HUGS))) to you from Emerson!!!!
    Aww I have to tell you loving myself….it’s still a work in progress…it was hard for me and I felt sad for a long time over him. 🙁 Honestly, I prayed to God to help me and he did.

    He brought me one or two great friends who have a lot of insight and are COMPASSIONATE and soo supportive. Thank God for them! I started going to church again too. I do believe in God and I feel peace that loving myself is OK and he wants us to…he loves us, that is what I believe.

    I think the hardest thing for me was admitting I need to shift my thoughts to myself and not obsess over another person and their problems, successess, comparisons to myself, competing, pining….blah blah blah you name it, I did all of it. I was focused on OTHERS…friends, boyfriends…I was scared of myself, really. Sounds strange, but true.

    But I’ve been pretty codependent with all my relationships, so when I finally had to turn around and meet MYSELF, I wasn’t sure how it was all going to go over.

    Turns out I like ME more than I thought I would! 🙂
    I’m learning to forgive myself and be nicer to myself, not so harsh!

    I am also thankful for Rori and this blog and all the sirens, because a lot of things I have learned on here have sort of given me PERMISSION to be good to myself, whereas before, i felt like I was being selfish.

    It took a while for me to get to the point of CDing or seeing anyone else at all. But that has helped too.

    I wish you all the best and prayers/good thoughts going out to you English Woman.

    I’m still grinning at the image of you bopping down the road to Michael Jackson! 🙂

  187.  #187English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:12 pm

    #181 Alias Girl

    I feel soooo excited just reading your post!! You seem so ALIVE and right into your feelings, go girl!!

  188.  #188English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    So many ladies on the blog this morning (your last night) are in real good feeling places and so damn happy, it is making my morning read so good and yummy. YAY!! 😀

  189.  #189Starla on August 11, 2011 at 11:21 pm

    I just wrote a pretty decent maid of honor speech.

    i feel amazed at myself. i didn’t realize i could pull something like this together:):)

  190.  #190Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:28 pm

    So recycledCD slipped a little….I’m trying to not let it bother me, but it is. He said he’d call tonight and he has not called. He is usually pretty good about it. Me no like.

    Our last convo was pretty much the norm…and I don’t know if I should bring up that it feels bad to be told you will call, and then you don’t call.

    I feel like it sounds like nagging but I also want to be true to my feelings and expressing myself…not stuffing down….any suggestions or feedback sirens?????

  191.  #191English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:32 pm

    #195 Emerson (((hugs to you too)))

    Sorry for the length of this post I am on a roll……please feel free to scroll past. 🙂

    YES YES YES, this is what I am working on right now, to stop feeling so selfish.

    All my life, like you, I have focussed on others and I have felt sooo bad in so many ways about leaving my kids and grand-kids in Australia and coming back to live in my home country and I am trying to forgive myself for that, but not being here was making me feel so damn miserable and unhappy and unmotivated that in the end every day was a struggle to just get up and go to work. An online friend on an expat blog I am on who has done the same (she lived in the USA) and has sons who now live there while she came back here too, used to talk to me soooo much last year and help me, like she said if you are miserable and unhappy every day it gnaws away inside of you eating you up and that’s how you can get cancer and all manner of illnesses………..and I do believe that.

    A FB friend a few months ago said “How could you bear to leave your children?” and my NV has latched onto that and it keeps repeating in my head like a broken record. Like I am the most selfish person in the world. 🙁

    But my “children” are 40 this year and 37 and my grand-kids are teenagers, and you know they all have their own busy lives and sometimes I didn’t see them for weeks on end as they got on with it.

    So as I said I am still coming to terms with that, it’s only been about 5 months, so I know that will take time.

    I think (feel?) what I need to do is constantly remind myself of all this Rori stuff, and Abraham and Byron Katie and all of them who are all basically saying the same, we create our own happiness, it’s not down to other people and it is hard to do the work on yourself and so much easier to slip back into bad habits, but I feel I am getting there….baby steps.

    Not quite into the CD’s side of things yet and I haven’t returned to POF since last weekend when I got some CD potentials lined up, maybe tomorrow I will go and reply.

    I just wish I had found all this stuff years ago, but hey ho no good regretting the past, it is gone……

    Thank you Emerson you have given me a lot to think about today.

    Yes I do have PERMISSION to put myself first, what use am I to myself or anybody if I am unhappy?

    I have read SO MANY self help books over the years, been on spiritual retreats, 4 day seminars on healing and didn’t REALLY get any of this stuff except on maybe an intellectual level.

    It has only been since finding this RR stuff and just lately getting into Abraham and Byron Katie on youtube that I feel it is finally sinking in, maybe I am more of a visual person than I thought, because I find it easier to understand when I see or hear the author…….

    No MJ today though Emerson, maybe a bit of Tina Turner around the living room, You’re The Best Better Than All The Rest (me/you/all of us) not “him” LOL!! 🙂

  192.  #192English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:36 pm

  193.  #193English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:36 pm

    Wow just realised!! Tina is on her horse!! What a Siren!!!

  194.  #194English Woman on August 11, 2011 at 11:40 pm

    #199 Emerson

    Don’t know if you can tweak this, but I just copied it from my Siren file 🙂 Lots of stuff from Rori and all you ladies I copy and paste into a word doc…….

    “I feel really disappointed when we don’t talk. I feel like I’m having expectations and then I’m setting myself up to be disappointed — are we on the same page here?”

    Not sure about this …..mmmmmmm……

  195.  #195Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:48 pm

    200 thanks EW for the hugs…and we sirens seem to be on a roll here with Tina Turner…I just love her too and I’ll be darned, she does seem to be on her horse doesn’t she!

    I think it’s great that you moved back to the UK! Your kids and grandkids can visit! I know it’s a long way, but wow it will be so fun to see them after an absence the heart grows fonder! I am so impressed that you had the guts to pick up and move “home” to where you wanted to be!! I’m sure it’s not easy, but it sounds like you have support in your friend, and are you happy to be back home?

    Awww…. I just love England and the UK in general, people are soo nice!! And I LOVE the weather when it’s all rainy and cozy and overcast!!

  196.  #196Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:49 pm

    I was sitting here feeling mopey about recycledCD not calling me, and suddenly I got a message from another CD: no cupcake no coffee dude! 😯

    He sent me a nice message, and I was like Hmph!!! I DO have choices! So what if recycledCD has not called! And so what if other dude on POF gives me the Spanish inquisition of 10 prying questions, who needs that??? Not me!

    I am also excited for this weekend! I plan to put on a cute and casual outfit and park myself at a coffee house and LEAN BACK!!!

    MAYBE even go to a bar in a dress by myself and practice leaning back!!! how fun!!! I’m excited!

    I feel curious because I have this weird feeling that I want to meet a new man but not online…I feel like it’s supposed to happen in person.

    And oh boy, I’m still pining over hot coworker dude….meow and sigh….he’s soo dreamyyyy and yummmyyy….

  197.  #197Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    203 thanks EW! It’s helpful. I am debating to bring it up at all.??? 🙄 But what I may do is if he calls me tomorrow and wants to see me, I might say no and tell him it would feel good to have plans in place ahead of time, rather than last minute. ….hmmm I have to ponder this one.

  198.  #198Emerson on August 11, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    I’ve made soo much progress in less than a year…it helps so much to categorize recycledCD as just a ‘CD’…that’s what he is!

    Before I would have gone all obsessive and codependent on myself and him and been a wild wreck at thsi point calling him if he wasn’t calling me. Now I’m just quiet and calm because I KNOW I can meet another guy!! AND I can CD MYSELF!!!!! YAY ME!

  199.  #199Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 12:08 am

    Hmm, no cupcake no coffee dude did text me kinda late…I mean I was glad to see it but not liking getting a text this late or phone calls.
    BOUNDARIES..I need them. I need to say something about it when I reply.
    I feel myself wanting to stuff it down for fear that he won’t want to talk to me anymore….but I don’t need to feel that way ! NOO>>>>

  200.  #200Starla on August 12, 2011 at 12:25 am

    for me the late night boundary response is just not replying. he can text me again at a decent hour.

    i have a right to not hover over my phone to monitor receipt of texts. i have a right to forget to answer a text (or even not care to) when many hours have passed since its receipt.

    he can call or text again.

    i feel so irritated just thinking about men who expect me to keep up with their texting, when a quick phone call could do the job. or they could try again at a different time that is more obviously conducive to me being, you know, awake.

    then when i don’t text back (because it’s late or i’m busy), they think i’m giving them signals of disinterest.


    today “my guy” was on me with texts and fb while i was working. all i could think was “come on man…i have a right to be busy here…you know my office hours..”

    i am seeing a guy right now who doesn’t do this sort of stuff at all…it’s one of the best and most peaceful feelings i’ve ever had in dating.

    and because i’m not distracted worrying about that bullcrap, i get to be super overwhelmed with good but scary feelings of attraction instead. and it’s just nuts (in a great way). i couldn’t even look him in the damn eye it was so intense. i’m getting over it, just cuz i know if i look him in the eye, he’ll end up kissing me, and that’s worth the scariness of facing down my pure attraction for him.

  201.  #201Senior Lady Vibe on August 12, 2011 at 3:33 am

    @110: Emerson says:
    “….and I feel defensive being asked what is blocking me from having a relationship..kinda odd thing to ask. ..”

    Yes, defensive because that was an aggresive act of offense: he stated as fact his assumption that “you are blocked from having a relationship”…. posed as a “question” … of course.

    If it was on purpose, he’s a slug. If not, I’d then have a hint of his dysfunctional background and communication mode.

    Or the third way, he could just be klutzy — a lot of women talk in this clueless way also. More conversation will reveal what’s going on. Unless it’s so bad, you opt to sign off permanently.

    Maybe it’s … ribbit, ribbit, ribbit… 😆


  202.  #202Plum on August 12, 2011 at 3:37 am

    139: Emerson says:
    ***Plum, yes that is the guy. Literally I had said nothing but that I liked his profile and I emailed him a photo, saying “here is a photo of me” …..he responded that I’m very attractive and what is blocking me from having a relationship.***

    Could be meant as a compliment. The more attracted they feel towards your picture, the wore they wonder why you are still single and why a dating site…
    He might imagine a woman with your looks never goes single in life. All she got to do is turn around and pick up a man among a long list of suitors met in her real life. He can’t believe his luck that you contacted him.
    I don’t think he realized he was sending the vibe that he suspects something is wrong with you being on a site lol It is more about his preconceived idea that good looking women don’t need dating sites to meet their husband.


  203.  #203Plum on August 12, 2011 at 3:42 am

    194: English Woman

    Yes it improves when the man starts talking


  204.  #204Plum on August 12, 2011 at 3:57 am

    211: Emerson

    I would answer something like
    “I feel appreciative of the compliment, it feels good to read. I feel confused, though, about the assumption I am blocking relationships. I would love to hear more about it.”


  205.  #205Senior Lady Vibe on August 12, 2011 at 4:16 am

    @205: Emerson says:
    “..I am also excited for this weekend! I plan to put on a cute and casual outfit and park myself at a coffee house and LEAN BACK!!! …
    …MAYBE even go to a bar in a dress by myself and practice leaning back!!! how fun!!! I’m excited! ..”

    EXCITING!!! 😀


  206.  #206Plum on August 12, 2011 at 4:24 am

    139 Emerson

    ***I responded honestly and said that I felt defensive being asked that question, it’s very personal and I don’t open up that quickly and I don’t feel comfortable answering that question to someone I don’t know… ***

    This answer sounds like you agree with the assumption, but the reasons for blocking relationships are personal and not to be discussed with a stranger.

    ***He responded that he didnt mean for it to come off that there was something wrong, just asking the question, which he followed with about four more really personal questions.***

    He realized what his question was implying about you.
    And the way you did not deny it, but got defensive about it, made him sit up. Now he wants to know what’s behind the defensiveness.
    But it all depends what his questions were.

    Everything is relative. Some women feel defensive when they are asked their job, for example. They feel judged. But it is not a personal question, it is a basic question all men gonna ask sooner or later and rather sooner.
    I feel curious to read his questions.


  207.  #207Emoticon on August 12, 2011 at 4:38 am

    “It may have creeped you out a little, but it’s likely he’s feeling a bit inferior, and coming on too strong is his way of coping.”

    OKAY Sirens i have a very serious question. I’ve known a guy 4 a yr but we have worked up so slowly to where we are right now. Just started like actually dating. We saw each other regularly. The first time i thought he was absolutely adorable. Im St.Lucian, He’s Hatian so when i told him he started cracking jokes in creole.

    After that when i saw him each week we would just smile at each other or have a very casual “hey how are you?” type of conversation. So we became FB friends. He asked 4 my number but at the time i didnt have a phone, so he gave me his but i lost it. He likes and comments on EVERY new profile pic saying things like “beautiful”, “this is perfect” and leaving me smiley faces all the time. I felt like even with these little gestures i had much more of a connection with him than anyone else on my FB. I dont know why, I can just feel it!!

    So last week we followed each other on twitter, and i sent him a kissy face (yes i leaned forward lol, i tend 2 flirt casually like that sometimes) he tweeted me back saying he wished it was a real kiss and he’s serious about that. Then he sent me a private message asking about my day and told me that he loves my smile, he loves making me smile, he thinks im beautiful… all of which i thanked him for. Then he said that he loves me, *surprise* lol. At first i felt a little shocked and nervous. I got that tight feeling in my chest and those butterflies were having a ball in my stomach, so I got scared and asked him if he really meant that and he said “Yes!! I do”, just like that. But honestly i really felt like i love him too, jus based on that unspoken connection i just felt between us from the get go, so i told him i love him too. Every day since then he tweets me or sends me msgs (im out of the country so he cant call yet 0 no roaming)

    For those of you Sirens who took the time out 2 read it, It would feel great 2 hear what you guys think about this. Would you guys consider this coming on too strong.

    It did not feel bad or like he was coming on too strong 4 me. It felt great, really awesome. I was surprised, and i liked it!! I just want another opinion because my judgement may be clouded.

  208.  #208English Woman on August 12, 2011 at 5:14 am

    #216 Emoticon

    That doesn’t sound creepy at all, it just makes me all feel smiley at the sweetness and gentleness going on here. 🙂

    I think you have been here on the RR blog for some time now, so I’m sure you know what to do or rather what not to do………don’t pick up the oars, just lie back in the boat with your big sun hat and floaty summer dress on trailing your hand in the water. 😀

  209.  #209Butterfly Wings on August 12, 2011 at 5:41 am

    A few people have asked about what to tell guys when you first start talking and they ask what you want (eg. relationship, etc).

    What I used to say was always very well-received, so I thought I’d share the gist of what I would say when asked…

    I would tell them that I was on the site to meet men, get to know them, and eventually, if we had a connection, to eventually meet in person and go on dates, and then whatever happens from there.

    They all seemed quite happy with my response, although I’m not sure if it was the “right” type of response. Although one of the guys I met on POF has been pursuing me and offering me the world for months now, so what I said obviously worked for him! 🙂

    Still feeling very happy and excited about my future.

    Oh and TH invited me to the races for next Wednesday (it’s a public holiday here in my city).

    That’s a big thing for him – he refused to ask me last year, saying it was a thing he did with the boys… Wooo!

  210.  #210Plum on August 12, 2011 at 5:43 am

    72: KS says:

    ***Haha…..I guess it does FW because he just replied “I just needed a friend, someone to talk too.” Whatever dude……talk to your girlfriend. WTF?????
    Some things never change. He is still crazy as batshit. ***

    Do you know for SURE he has a girl friend? You have not talked to him in 6 months, you don’t know what place the FB girl takes in his life. Is she on his status as “in a relationship”?

    He received a direct question “why is he wanting to speak to you?”
    He can not give the answer “because I want to be your fiancé, marry you later and spend the rest of my life with you”
    He can not say that because he has not seen you in 6 months.
    If we assume positive things, if we assume he is not trying to take from you, he might only know one thing: “he is ready to talk to you, now.” He forgot the drama, the pression, he misses you. When he is forced to say more than that, he can’t. He can’t even say he forgot the drama, because he forgot it 😉

    If you wanted a do over, you might still send the suggestion in post 52 and wait for him to phone you.

    Don’t come from a place that he wants to take from you. He might be wanting that, but your boundaries will stop him when time comes. You don’t know if he really wants only friendship, unless you SPEAK with him at least ONCE and you get the feeling of it all.

    Come from a place he misses talking to you.
    You being warm and trusting is the only way for him to ask you out on a date and for you to have a do over.
    Face to face you’ll know what is going on and, if it is necessary, you’ll tell him you don’t want a friendship with a man you wished to be married to (or whatever you wished) and/or you don’t date men in a relationship with another woman.

    He will either drop her for you or he will vanish again.


  211.  #211Mel on August 12, 2011 at 6:04 am

    It’s interesting to read about lots of you sirens getting incessant text messages and how you respond (or don’t). I feel like saying to this guy “don’t make me regret giving you my cell #!” But I actually like the idea of just not replying or ignoring them if I’m busy or don’t feel like it.

    Ideas of good FM’s to say “Down boy!” ? This guy seems a little too eager to meet me. Jonathon Aslay’s “trying too hard” description seems apt. Why does lots of attention feel creepy? LOL

    It’s funny, because before I wanted MORE attention from ex, and now this feels like too much. What am I meant to learn here?

  212.  #212Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 6:25 am

    Thanks for your replies Plum and SLV thanks for your replies.

    Blech….I woke up this morning feeling very alone and with an immediate NV telling me I’d never be able to feel close to someone….it’s too late for me to get married and really feel close to someone and have a family. All these really bad NVs going on, and shame and embarrassment for being an “old maid”….wondering what people think of me being single and all.

    Thinking about the guy I almost married ten years ago that was crazy about me and financially stable and loyal, and maybe I should have just married him after all.

    Help. I want to heal this. I went from feeling excited yesterday to today feeling so heavy and very alone very very pessimistic about the future.

  213.  #213Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 6:30 am

    The guy who emailed me asking what’s blocking me from a relationship…PLum I see what you’re saying about how he may have meant it as a compliment of sorts that I’m attractive so why am I not hooked up with someone….but I still think it was a rude question. Yes maybe clusiness is the reason, but it was off putting nevertheless and it kinda set the tone for me to feel turned off. I wish now that I would have waited to reply to him and thought about my response a little better. Oh well live and learn.

    I feel like I’m alone because I made some bad choices of staying in relationships and getting into relationships I shouldnt have. and I deserve to be alone and lonely.

  214.  #214Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:35 am

    RE 222 Emerson Those beliefs about yourself is the first things that I would prioritize. You deserve love and relationships simply because you are a child of the Universe. You don’t have to do anything to earn it. Do you know about Rori’s Waterwheel Tool? Try to believe that anything that comes towards you is with the intention of love. That way even if you percieve these guys as rude you can remain focussed on being curious or playful. Given yourself enough time to really feel what you are feeling.

  215.  #215Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:39 am

    RE 221 blah blah blah

    Feelings morph and change. Just feel them, smile at them. They will move on.

  216.  #216Jade on August 12, 2011 at 6:40 am

    Emerson, no, don’t say that. You do not deserve these things. You deserve all sorts of great stuff and they will come in their own time.

    Look, I have meant to tell you something but I don’t know how you’ll take it: why didn’t you just throw the question back at him? Why is HE on this dating site himself? What’s keeping HIM from having a relationship?

  217.  #217Jade on August 12, 2011 at 6:42 am

    And remember this: YOU ARE NOT YOUR THOUGHTS!!!! 🙂

  218.  #218Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:43 am

    RE 220 To get to know yourself Mel. You ca tell him that all the attention feels overwhelming and you would like to take things slower when you meet with him.

    I would also look at the difference between codependence and interdepence Mel. I have come to learn that a lot of what I thought of as intimacy was just codependence. Between Innerbonding and Dr. Paul I have come to accept that as far as attention from men goes, space and being alone with oneself is healthy.

  219.  #219Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:45 am

    RE 225 That’s spunk. And you will get to know how many of these guys find feistiness attractive or maybe challenging.

  220.  #220Jade on August 12, 2011 at 6:47 am

    Wow, well, it’s only been a few days since I started reading this blog “religiously” and already, I can feel a shift in me, my heart doesn’t feel as heavy and my thoughts are a lot more precise and focused. I also started reading Marci Shimoff’s book “Happy For No Reason”, which I find is really helping me see the mistakes I’ve been making in the past few years.

    That feels very good.

  221.  #221Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:49 am

    RE 221 Plum I am a little confused. He said he only wanted a friend to talk to. Are you suggesting that he might write something and SPEAK something else?

  222.  #222Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 6:55 am

    RE 216 Emoticon how regularly do you see each other?

  223.  #223Jade on August 12, 2011 at 6:55 am

    FW, yeah, that’s me, Spunky! 🙂

    I wrote that because Emerson’s post reminded me of something a girl friend once told me. Years ago, I had a date with a divorced man and she said “if he’s divorced, there must be something wrong with him”. I can’t quite remember what I replied but it really stroke me as being kind of judgemental of her to say something like that.

  224.  #224Jade on August 12, 2011 at 6:59 am

    #209 – Starla:

    If a woman would text and call a guy at all hours of the day and night, he would probably think she is crazy…or desperate. 🙁

  225.  #225Mel on August 12, 2011 at 7:00 am


    Exactly! LOL.

  226.  #226Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 7:02 am

    Thanks Jade and FW…
    Yes Jade I like your idea of replying with questions back at him! Gosh its just not in my instincts yet. I want to be more like that. 🙁 I think I go into submissive mode when I feel intimidated by a man or his questions/actions and I kinda don’t know what to do. Like a silly little girl.

  227.  #227Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:03 am

    RE 208 Emerson I have a male friend who always says it is my phone, at night I turn it off or put it on silent. This guy is going to do what he wants to do regardless of what you say so put the boundaries around your own behavior. No response can be a response to teach him how to behave around you.

  228.  #228Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:06 am

    RE 235 GEt acquainted with your silly little girl, embrace her. Why get intimidated? You are on the site to get to know new people so are they. We get to know people by being curious about them. Men can be up front and straight forward. What do they or us have to lose on a site when we might never even meet in real life? How about the whatever attitude?

  229.  #229Jade on August 12, 2011 at 7:06 am

    #222 – FW:

    “space and being alone with oneself is healthy”

    I must be really healthy, then! 🙂

  230.  #230Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:07 am

    RE 232 Jade I have guys in my life that tell me that is the way they think, especially if you come towards them first or if you immediately accept them.

  231.  #231Jade on August 12, 2011 at 7:09 am

    #237 – FW:

    My thoughts exactly. What do you have to lose? Nothing. You’re just learning, learning, learning. And that’s a great thing.

  232.  #232Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:12 am

    RE 206 Emerson that might come across as playing games, especially if you have nothing else going on. He might ask why not, and then if you have no answer related to some other plans then what……

    Then again you could have had a hard day at work and feel tired, wanting an early night to rest.

  233.  #233Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:16 am

    RE 199 Emerson a Goddess does not wonder why one of a number of her suitors doesn’t call. As a matter of fact she is so busy jugling her time between all the dates she is getting that she doesn’t even notice.

  234.  #234Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:20 am


    If you are reading I am wondering under what circumstances do you suggest no do over? Would love to hear your thoughts.

  235.  #235Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:32 am

    I wonder what guys are thinking when they put on their profile “looking for women”? I see that and I immediately think next. It seems the message I get is that they are not ready.

  236.  #236Jade on August 12, 2011 at 7:43 am

    #244 – FW:

    Yes, that really sends a weird message, doesn’t it? I would tell them: “look, they’re all around you!!!”

  237.  #237Ella on August 12, 2011 at 7:50 am

    More testimonial that they do come back around…

    Ex boy, who I was only with for a few month… Can’t remember how or why it ended… and he wasn’t suitable for me, think I probably ended it and yet felt badly that he wasn’t able to step up.

    Its been a few years, maybe 3 or 4.

    He got with someone else, had a baby.

    Well he contacts me on FB last night and says he has been thinking about me. He is on his own now…

    I said I felt pleased to hear from him and a little suspicious of why he is contacting now?

    He said sometimes you just want to speak to the people you feel most connected to.

    Huh? I don’t really feel connected to him. I mean he is a nice guy… and I just don’t have those kind of feelings for him anymore.

    He wanted to talk on the phone and it was late at night and I was feeling tired so I said no to speaking then, and that he can call me today or another time if he wants to.

    Anyway all the other CDs I am having these days who trickle out of my life again… are tending to get left open. And that feels good to me.

    Like the door is always open to them should they decide they wish to step up, and court me. Then I get to decide whether I want them or not.

    It feels good.

    Working through any anger feelings of ones who have trickled out for now who I like…

    And that is ok too.

    Feeling much more peaceful atm.

    Feeling totally demotivated to CD properly, The thought of going on anymore actual dates feels so tiring. I just don’t want to!

    Also my diet has gone slightly off kilter the past few days and I would like to focus on me being healthy again.

    I have an afternoon and evening off and the house to myself.

    I am going to get a (relatively healthy) take away for dinner.

    I am sooo looking forward to it and just enjoying some ‘ME’ time.

    I have been feeling so tired from work. I am taking this time off.

    And I am going to a party next weekend, where there will be lots of my CDs, or guys who have kissed me, all in one room. And you know what I don’t even feel triggered.

    I don’t mind one bit. In fact I am looking forward to it.

    And yesterday I was in the pub, and I was feeling tired and antsy… and I only had 3 drinks, then chose to come home to bed early, rather than hang out with some friends who were going home to get high…

    Yay for me. I feel so much better today.

    And tomorrow (Saturday night) I am choosing to stay in with my friend and hel[ her babysit rather than night out clubbing.

    It is mainly to save money and also it will have the knock on effect that I will drink less!

    Yay for me.

    I think I am making some major Siren progress.

    And I feel good/happy about it.

  238.  #238Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:52 am

    KS obviously his energy is coming towards you, at least for now. Believe him about the girl and trust your intuition. He said let’s go slow. You always have the option of backpedalling. Go slow can mean learning to swim before you dive. I would be open to the point of not caring. Only giving what I feel like giving. If that turns him off so be it. I would say just be honest with yourself about what your hope would be, journal it so you become clear about your thinking and wants.

    I would ask him if he remembers that he lives 3 hours away from you. It is fine he is scared. Appreciate him for sharing his inner world with you, love is scary. But I did not get a sense of exactly what he wants from you now.

  239.  #239Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 7:56 am

    Ella I think eating unhealthy for a few days is just getting off track and won’t make a major difference. You can always get back on track. Your body will rebalance yourself. Plus sometimes I believe you can reward yourself, no need to feel guilty. That’s what I tell myself.

  240.  #240Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Got a chat request from someone “nice pic” I said I feel curious, where did you see my pic? No response.

  241.  #241Ladybug on August 12, 2011 at 8:42 am

    Ella:”And I am going to a party next weekend, where there will be lots of my CDs, or guys who have kissed me, all in one room. And you know what I don’t even feel triggered.

    I don’t mind one bit. In fact I am looking forward to it. ”

    A couple of months ago I went by myself to a bluegrass concert at the local coffee house and 3 of my CDs showed up. At first I was apprehensive, but they are such gentlemen, I ended up having a good time.

    When the music was over and the socializing began and I was meeting and talking to the people around me, these men waited patiently and visited with others and come up to me one by one. It was very nice! Good conversations and very good hugs! One of the topics of the evening was an upcoming veterans benefit auction, so if things got a bit sticky, I would turn my attention to the old veterans who were standing there.

    Everyone knows I support and respect the veterans. They all know I love Marines!

  242.  #242Ella on August 12, 2011 at 8:48 am

    This is a poem/prayer I once made up:

    A prayer for the people of this earth in times of Uncertainty

    May all those who seek to better themselves follow the loving spirit they have inside, Let it be this that guides them down the right path.
    May all those who are influenced or ‘brainwashed’ into evil acts find the strength to rise above the pressures and the clamor of daily life, that they may make free, informed choices.
    May all the people of this earth learn to listen to their true, loving self and choose the path of love and peace, in order that they may be stronger and better each day of their lives.

    Listen to your spirit which is peaceful and kind,
    not to those around you who may have egos or agendas of their own, or who may have been conditioned and influenced.
    Pay attention to what feels right.
    Your loving spirit will never choose a path of destruction or violence.
    Let it begin with you. Look inside yourself, for the answers lie within–
    In times of chaos or uncertainty take a minute to breath, re- connect your inner being, and then make your decision about which action to take.
    Be proactive.
    Be still sometimes … be loving to yourselves and others,
    Most importantly – just be!

  243.  #243Ella on August 12, 2011 at 8:54 am

    Sirens I was considering something a lil bit radical and I feel unsure about whether it is a good idea or not.

    It keeps popping into my head though.

    I was wondering whether to send a link to the ad/intro page for Toxic Men to Pubguy’s girlfriend… the one who called me up to ask if I had slept with him etc… who kept contacing my in drama asking me stuff to try and work out whether she should stay in the relationship or not.

    Or even just to Rori’s website.

    The reason I feel uncertain is in case she decides to stay on the drame path and shows it to Pubman or takes it as an opening to bring more drama to me.

    I feel worried of feeling his anger towards me if she told him.

    And also ultimately that it could lead her to this blog, where she might read all the stuff I have written about the situation. Some of the stuff is quite personal (well I know it is posted on a public forum and still not too sure how I would feel about people who know me reading it, esp if they are not close friends).

    And I really like to help women and just feel empathy for her where she is at as I have been there… and thought this is something kind I could do to help.

    What do the Sirens think?

  244.  #244Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 9:05 am


    Thanks to you who took the time to read my long post and respond! I will consider your words. I just find that I felt good talking with Ryan and seeing him again, and I feel shame and guilt and insecurity and worthlessness arise when I read your responses.

    That is not to say you are wrong. And, you are probably right. But I also believe that sometimes relationships are unique and that departure from the standard operating procedures are in order.

    I felt perfectly horrible being pushed away yet again, after he had just opened friendship after 2 years. I couldn’t shake the horrible feeling. More or less I was saying it’s ok if you withdraw again but hey, I’m really hurting here!

    I can’t describe to you how awful it felt. I just couldn’t live with it. I am just going to keep on dating and I’m thankful that I have a friendship with Ryan.

  245.  #245Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 9:06 am


    RE: #253 – I admire your big heart in wanting to reach out to this woman! I think it is a case where you need to protect yourself. Maybe instead you could send her to Christian Carter, Byron Katie, or one of the other relationship coaches.

  246.  #246Ladybug on August 12, 2011 at 9:07 am

    Ella, I think we all have compassion and empathy for others who are going through the same hell we walked through.

    We have to protect our own personal boundaries, too.

    Here’s a riff a young lady with a very bad mommy and I did a couple of weeks ago. We were sipping my crabapple wine by the bonfire at the beach and talking about life.

    Set your boundaries

    Build your walls

    Create your castle

    Dig your moat….
    and fill it with alligators!

    You share your personal heart here with us, it is your safe place. Those people are not emotionally safe for you. Why let them into the inner court of your castle?

    Walk away from Pubguy and his Drama Queen and never look back!

  247.  #247Jade on August 12, 2011 at 9:20 am

    I agree with Ladybug.

  248.  #248tinque on August 12, 2011 at 9:28 am

    Emerson – “He said he’d call tonight and he has not called. He is usually pretty good about it. Me no like. ”

    If this is an isolated incident, then let it go. If it becomes a pattern, then a little speech or heart-to-heart may be in order.


  249.  #249Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 9:29 am

    Ella I am wondering if you have an underlying intention that you are not expressing? Why would you risk sending her here if you don’t want her to read the personal stuff you wrote?

  250.  #250tinque on August 12, 2011 at 9:35 am

    Emoticon – Just enjoy for now. Projecting into the future does not serve you in any way. He’s coming on too strong only if it feels that way to you. It sounds lovely to me, and its not like he’s pouncing on you, (yet).


  251.  #251Patricia on August 12, 2011 at 10:25 am

    256, 257,

    I would agree

  252.  #252Jade on August 12, 2011 at 10:36 am

    I’m reading emails from Inner Bonding and I’m finally crying.

    I am grateful for Inner Bonding.

    I am grateful for my tears.

  253.  #253Ella on August 12, 2011 at 10:41 am

    FW re 259 –

    I have been asking myself the same question.

    I feel a lil triggered with the wording you use saying I am not expressing something…

    I have been questioning my intention here… and have held off doing it unless I feel completely clear and comfortable.

    But there is nothing I know of that I am intentionally not expressing.

    I am not thinking to send her directly here anyway… was thinking that the toxic men programme could really help her situation.

    And the reason I would risk it, is because I do want to help women… that feels very important to me, and I do not feel so unsafe about anything I write these days…

    Its as though the more I let people see me, the more I don’t care what they think.

    And as I am typing this out I am just wondering if I somehow want him (Pubman) to heal, so that we can get married, lol.

    Ok I promise that was said tongue in cheek.

    And I have just been thinking a lot recently about how sometimes the things we (Sirens) do transforms men…

    I know this is dangerous territory, and that we can’t change men… and I know the reality of it is that if he wants to spend his weekends getting drunk and stay in a drama filled relationship then however Sireny I am will make no difference to that.

    Really I am just throwing up questions for myself.

    I think there are a few things here it could be about, wanting to help a woman in an awful feeling place that I know well from my past, maybe wanting to alleviate a guilt feeling (although tbh the guilt feeling is actually very small) or wanting somthing from him (and somehow I don’t really think it is that) or wanting to somehow get back at him – and to be honest nothing written here would probably make the situation any worse for her. In fact coming here might actaully transform her life in a big way…

    Hmph, I am no clearer.

    Feels good to explore though.

    Thanks FW because your honest and sometimes provocative feeling posts always trigger me to go deeper.

    And I mean that in a loving way not as a snipe.

    I do feel triggered by your posts a lot and that is ok.

  254.  #254Ella on August 12, 2011 at 10:45 am

    FW re 249

    I agree


  255.  #255Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 10:46 am

    Ella feeling triggered is good. I was actually wondering if it was really him who your focus was.

    The other thing that comes to mind is that you can’t help someone who does not ask you for help. You cannot defent someone in court unless they invite you to be their attorney. They most likely won’t appreciate it. People have to be in a place emotionally and mentally to accept what you have to offer.

  256.  #256Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 10:48 am

    RE 262 That is great to hear Jade. It means healing is taking place.

  257.  #257Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 10:51 am

    Ella I have invited a friend who told me a couple of weeks ago that her husband has withdrawn. For over a year they have not had sex and it seems she is constantly mothering him. Telling him to pick up after himself and constantly focussing on him. She broke down crying after I commented that he was a handsome man upon seeing his picture. She has been tense since last year and weeping but I never knew why. To date she has not visited the site as yet. She did not ask me for help but I thought she sounded like the typical type of woman that Rori’s work help.

  258.  #258Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 10:55 am

    There is a couple in my family that have been bickering and arguing for years. I only hear about when someone’s cup is overflowing. Then they tell me the whole kit and kaboodle of what is taking place. I see how Rori’s work can help and have sent them a lot of the free eNewsletters. The last message I got from one of them was that it was the other persons fault so it is pointless trying.

    Until people are in a place where “they want” the help offering it won’t make any difference is what I have come to realize. What they tend to get inspired by is the change they see in me. However, they have to want it for themselves.

  259.  #259Jade on August 12, 2011 at 10:56 am

    That part of one of the emails I received really triggered me:

    You cannot make new choices until you watch yourself making your current choices. You will never know that you can choose to learn about love until you observe yourself choosing to try to control. You cannot choose to love your wounded self until you notice your wounded self. If you are not willing to non-judgmentally notice yourself acting out the needs of your wounded self, you cannot make new choices.

    Taking loving action means learning to love both the core Self and the wounded self. It means releasing judgment and accepting the angry, hurt, shamed and frightened parts of yourself with love and compassion, understanding that your wounded self has been doing the best it can to take care of you and help you feel safe. Loving action means understanding and having compassion for all the parts of yourself that you have hated or judged as inadequate, unlovable and unworthy. You heal your false beliefs when you learn to be loving to your wounded self. Taking loving action also means embracing the core painful feelings of life with deep compassion rather than avoiding them with addictive behavior.

    Taking loving action eventually results in becoming immune to criticism and moving beyond fears of rejection as you learn how to not take others’ behavior personally. Loving action also leads to moving beyond fears of engulfment, of being controlled by others, as you learn to set loving limits in your own behalf.

  260.  #260turquoise3 on August 12, 2011 at 11:04 am

    Brenda, I read your post and didn’t comment because I just cringed. The others who replied gave a lot of really good feedback, and what I’d agree with. Your last post, about how bad you felt, and that this feels better reminds me of how I used to deal with my marriage. I didn’t want my ex to be mad at me, or to feel strain, so I’d just try to make it all better, I’d apologize for things I didn’t even feel I did wrong, just so he’d stop being mad at me, or would let it go… because I couldn’t stand how bad I felt. It wasn’t real though. It didn’t lead to any healing… when you push someone to tell you what you want to hear, because you don’t want to hear what they are really saying when it’s “leave me alone. I can’t handle this right now.” etc. it’s not real. It’s not a real friendship, it’s not give and take. It’s leaning forward, pushing and them not wanting to deal with the stress or strain of it any longer, so they try and appease you. Crying and blaming them for how bad it makes us feel, when we keep ourselves in the situation, is manipulative as well.

    You’ve been here a long time. You know what’s right, you know what’s true. The little bit Ryan stepped up here, doesn’t make up for all the hurt you’ve found from him. Choosing to stay, and to keep contacting him, and push like this is pretty much asking to be hurt again. If someone was treating me the way you are treating him, pushing this much and leaning so forward, I’d see major red flags. I’d be firmly telling them how I felt and asking them to stop, or I’d be blocking them from contacting me.

    It’s really hard to accept what people tell you, but they mean it, and we should listen. Sometimes you have to read between the lines because it’s mixed messages or unclear, but for how many times I have heard you say you are over him, over this, don’t want him in your life, I see a lot of repeat behavior here and I just wonder why. I know you said how great it was, so important to you at one time, but it ended badly and he’s telling you he isn’t healed, things won’t be different…. this sounds like a lot of heartbreak to me. I wish you’d try to see this from another perspective. Good luck with the job! I hope it works out.

  261.  #261Jade on August 12, 2011 at 11:04 am

    I find that so powerful:

    There is another essential aspect of the intent to learn: you must believe that there are good, compelling reasons for your present feelings and behavior. These reasons are your childhood experiences of disconnection from love that led to your fears and the false beliefs that create them. Understanding that you have good reasons for your feelings and behavior is the opposite of being judgmental. It is being compassionate. Your Inner Child will not open to you if you are shaming and judgmental of his or her feelings or behavior. And if your Inner Child doesn’t open to you, you will not be able to learn what you are doing or thinking that may be causing your pain.

    There are times when we have to make judgments about things, but there is a big difference between judgment intended to discern what is in your highest good and judgment intended to condemn. If you approach an actual child and ask, “What are you feeling?” in a condemning tone, the child will not feel safe in giving you an honest answer. If you ask that question in a compassionate tone, the child will probably tell you. The same is true of your Inner Child. Compassion is the natural result of understanding that you and others have good reasons for your feelings and behavior. You cannot be judgmental and compassionate at the same time. Accepting that you and others always have good reasons for your feelings and behavior will move you out of judgment and into the open heart of compassion.

    A true intent to learn is not focused on an outcome – such as getting rid of the pain or changing yourself so you can find a mate. The only outcome we are looking for when we are in a true intent to learn is to become a more loving human being. If you have any goal other than that, you will not be in a true intent to learn. Being in a true intent to learn means we want to learn to be loving, period!

  262.  #262turquoise3 on August 12, 2011 at 11:05 am


    What did you decide to do? Are you staying local, moving with your mom? Heading overseas?

    Can’t wait, you sound phenomenal~!

  263.  #263Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:05 am

    I am so silly. Somebody just asked what do you do and what are your hobbies. I replied

    Love love love zumba, dancing, sitting on the boardwalk at the beach “watching the tide roll away, ooooh sitting on the dock the bay wasting time”.

    I enjoy interacting with people and children. Makes me feel alive and passionate about life in general.

  264.  #264Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:06 am

    Hey Turquoise3 I just love to “see” you here.

  265.  #265Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:08 am

    Thanks for sharing that Jade

  266.  #266Mel on August 12, 2011 at 11:09 am

    Hey Turquoise!

    I decided to stay local for now. Give myself some more time to figure out what I want to do. I got my own place and will be moving in at the end of the month. Yikes, it’s coming quickly!

    If you ever get an anon. email, I’d like to be able to keep in touch!

    Good luck with your move! 🙂

  267.  #267Mel on August 12, 2011 at 11:10 am

    Ok ladies, I’m starting to feel REALLY nervous! Eeek!

  268.  #268Ella on August 12, 2011 at 11:12 am

    So the general consensus is to not send to her…

    That is cool. I will do nothing for now.

    I do wonder if I am subconsciously trying to get some reaction from him or something.

    So what am I feeling about this situaion?

    Ok if I could speak to him right now I would say ‘I feel furious and angry! I wanted you to be with me not her. I feel humiliated to hear that you love me while you stay with her’.


    Yep that is what I would say.

    And part of me just feel switched off now.

    The other night I was observing my behavioiur around him and it is interesting to see that there are so many points where I can either choose to engage in the toxic style behaviours with him and lean towards wanting and pining, or I can choose not to focus on that and see it as boring and him as some sad drunk.

    Hmmm, usually the choice is there… well always, and sometimes I get drawn in and sometimes I don’t nd YAY that I am able to see all this.

    On another note I feel very uncomfortable to think that we don’t offer help to anyone unless they ask.

    I get not to overfunction or shove stuff down people’s throat and ye somehow my thought on this is that there is a difference between this and inviting people when you see an opportunity.

    When I was with Barman (not to be confused with Pubman) and Barman was doing ketamine I read up a lot on addiction and the CRAFT method.

    And one thing that was said by addicts again and again is that you cannot do it for them, they have to want the help, and yet, it is really impotant to keep offering, because one day the time will be right.

    One addict said it must be offered in an unintrusive way… and that he had a friend who was always offering help, and then one day, after years of addiction he just decided to listen.

    I guess it is something like the way Rori says to stay open to men… although we can’t make them step up.

    Can’t say I have figured out how to offer help withou being intrusive as yet though.


  269.  #269Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:13 am

    Mel can you express what you are feeling and what you are telling yourself? Are you afraid your husband will react if he knows?

  270.  #270Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:18 am

    On the flip side Ella if you keep offering you will have an expectation that the person will accept. Then if they don’t you have to deal with your feeling of resentment as a result. It is almost like inviting someone to beat up on you, is my opinion. Even if someone shares their troubles with you, they might be just looking for a listening ear. If they suggest they don’t know what to do then that might be your opening.

  271.  #271DE on August 12, 2011 at 11:19 am

    I agree with you, FW, people must be ready to want change in their life.

    I did the exact things too in the past…
    and then, somehow I felt bad after (that was a few months back)…because I had “expectation” that my “help” would be valued…:(

    one of my gfs who is continuing to have “drama” in her life, i attempted to give her counsel ( since I no longer promote books/newsletters to her or anybody without them asking);…her answer would be, as always…”i know, i know…u right, u right…etc…but…blah, blah, blah…”

    Recently, it just hit me something though…although, she/they are noticing big changes in me…i am still not yet the full proof of happiness…i am still single and have my own set of problems…

    I can feel distrust in their eyes and voice…and the question “who are u to give me advice….look at u…” hmm, that feels bad…:(

    So, until I master my own happiness and my tools, I decided not to get involved;…and instead, i am using more and more boundaries with all people;

    including those close to me who were used to my availability to hear their bullshit without yet being ready to be accountable for their own participation in creating it…if my energy feels drained by the drama …i refuse to visit/hang out in the environment…and FMs work beautifully…:)

    warm hugs,

  272.  #272Mel on August 12, 2011 at 11:21 am

    Actually, FW… I really don’t think he’d care. Unless he’s a robot and is able to file his emotions away where no one can see the, he seems completely unaffected by any of the details of the separation. We had to go through this box of old letters and photos. But he seemed cool as a cucumber. Bored even.

    Besides, he’s been going out on friendly dates with girls anyways. And it’s not like I want a ‘relationship’ with anyone at this point… I would say that’s all I’m doing. Just friendly dates.

    It’s more just that it has been a LONG time since I’ve dated anyone. Just feels a bit weird.

  273.  #273Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:24 am

    Okay Mel so can you paste the word FUN FUN FUN on your forehead, on your mirror on your computer so that when you go out later your mind will focus on that rather than stress? It is just another human being who you could have been working with anyway or bumped into in Starbucks.

  274.  #274Mel on August 12, 2011 at 11:27 am

    Fun, fun, fun! LOL.

  275.  #275Kayla on August 12, 2011 at 11:29 am

    Thank you Starla (:

  276.  #276Jade on August 12, 2011 at 11:37 am

    My pleasure, FW! 🙂

  277.  #277Plum on August 12, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Emerson 222

    ***I feel like I’m alone because I made some bad choices of staying in relationships and getting into relationships I shouldnt have. and I deserve to be alone and lonely. ***

    ***it’s too late for me to get married and really feel close to someone and have a family. All these really bad NVs going on, and shame and embarrassment for being an “old maid”….wondering what people think of me being single and all.****

    Let’s say you were a rare case on earth and you had not taken a “wrong” decision ever and you had married the best match in the world.
    You think you made it, no more worries, no more loneliness.
    And …… he becomes handicapped and you sacrifice your life to keep him breathing day after day. You work outside to make money and at home you work to change his diapers and feed him etc… No more rest, no more laughter…
    As far as you know you might have been spared by your good decisions.

    Or you enjoy 10 or 20 years of happily married and he dies and you are back to singlehood.
    You could well be single today, even if you had made a good marriage when you were 18 years old.

    Some women become widows, the others divorce and stay single until they remarried and nowadays they even divorced a second time, back to singlehood and sometimes they remarry a third time until he dies and back to singlehood.

    Many feel lonely since the very first day following their wedding, yet they stay until death do apart. You don’t know what happens behind closed doors. It looks like happiness but is not always happiness. Your decisions might have spared you.

    Very, very few women had the chance to stay married to the same one man, feeling NOT alone, all her life long until the day SHE dies before him. VERY FEW.

    I don’t see your/my today’s singlehood meaning anything about your/my future. I don’t see it meaning your/my future will be lonelier than any other woman’s future.

    I think his question got to your subconscious. You are judging yourself through the meaning you give to his question. You are suspecting yourself to be flawed.
    Are not we all flawed, single, divorced or married or widowed? Men and women? It has not stopped people to keep believing in love. Men marry women every second on the planet. And at any age. When you feel ready, you too will enter a new relationship, you are not finished with relationships.

    Look at your friends who “seem” happily married. You never know. By the time you feel happily married, they might be divorced or widows, getting ready for their next relationship.
    Comparison means nothing. They are always false equations.

    Tomorrow will be a better day. 🙂


  278.  #278Plum on August 12, 2011 at 11:51 am

    284: Mel

    Don’t forget your nose button 🙂

    Also take all your time before you speak, keep cool, silence is NOT negative, take your time to feel what’s going on before you speak.


  279.  #279Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 11:55 am

    RE 284 Rori recommends playing it over and over again in your head.

  280.  #280Jade on August 12, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Awesome Tina Turner video here, must watch!!!

  281.  #281Ella on August 12, 2011 at 12:08 pm


    Re 38,

    Me no likey.

    Feels like obsession.

    You are abusing yourself rather than he abusing you.


  282.  #282Ella on August 12, 2011 at 12:15 pm


    FW – yes… For me I have an idea that the key might be in offering withou expectation.

    And the strength that if your offer is not accepted or your help appreciated you will not mind…

    For me on this occasion I am not going to do anything for now.

    However I am not going to stop sharing stuff with people ou of fear.

    I can only say ‘ah I am so sorry to hear about that. There is this website that has really helped me … it is http://www.havetherelation... if you fancy a look’

    And leave it at that.

    That can work for me in some instances and I have done this in some instances.

    Feels good to put me first though.

    And pick the moments to share or offer help.


  283.  #283FlowerChild77 on August 12, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    Ella/#253 People can’t understand or process things until they are ready to. She may have some intuition that something isn’t quite right (considering she contacted you, etc.) This girl you want to ‘help’ is not ready…or she wouldn’t still be there with him. There is a saying: “When the student is ready the teacher will appear.”

    I agree with the others. She is on her own journey and will face the facts when she is ready.

  284.  #284FlowerChild77 on August 12, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    Ella, I’m sorry—I didn’t refresh the page until after I posted. I didn’t see that others had already answer you and that you’d made a decision.

  285.  #285Ella on August 12, 2011 at 1:13 pm


    Yep – thank you.

    I am not going to do it.

    🙂 Not at this time anyway.


  286.  #286Ella on August 12, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    Flowerchild re 294

    Don’t worry


    Its all cool.


  287.  #287Ella on August 12, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    I am just about to go and pick up my take away curry… I am having lentil with garlic, spinach and some chicken.

    I feel excited to try a new curry house.

    I feel annoyed that our Sky TV is not working.

    But I have a good film called ‘Get him to the Greek’ to watch, which my friends tell me is good.

    And plenty more DVDs downstairs.

    My throat feels a little sore, so hoping the goodness in the curry will help.

    And I am going to have a glass of wine and read one of Tinque’s articles about other women on her website.

    Yay for me having some ‘ME’ time.


  288.  #288Ice Princess on August 12, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    I just got back from my day with LP. The day went well until the last few minutes in the car when out of nowhere my oldest son who is 8 says that he wishes his daddy (who is married with a baby on the way) and I were back together. We have been divorced for 6 years. LP got upset and I completely understand why. It made him feel uncomfortable and he knows their dad and how he is with them which disappointed him to hear him say that. LP got quiet and I tried to used feeling messages with him but he held back and wouldn’t say anything. We I left him and his kids at their apartment I asked for a hug and he gave a reallyquick one. I told him that I loved him and all he said in reply was I’ll call you later. I texted him as I was driving away “I feel weird about what just happened.”. How should I have handled that. I am so hurt that my kids don’t want me (or all of us) to be happy. They used to love LP and they call him wanting to play frequently. I don’t understand and I know eventually LP will call and if he decides not t continue what we have I will be okay.

  289.  #289Teresa on August 12, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    Where do i find the blogs on trust? & what if the roles were reversed? What if I am the one that the feeling is I cannot to be trusted & he seems to have an issue that can’t be overcome? Does he go into the “thanks for the memories” pile? Am i hanging on because I feel guilty about my indiscretion? I’m having a difficult time with this one. – side note: we’re not married, not living together, but i’m not wanting to be with anyone else or have another man around my kids. Help.

  290.  #290FlowerChild77 on August 12, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    #164/FW >>>“not forcing him to discuss where the relationship is going before he is ready, you have the upper hand in the relationship.”<<<

    Thank you so much for posting this. I've already 'got' the idea about not bringing up anything about the relationship—but this puts it all in a nutshell for me. And it really explains why not to 🙂

    I like knowing that not bringing it up gives me power, rather than it 'pushes him away' (which is still all about him and wanting the relationship.)

  291.  #291Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:35 pm


    RE: #263 – I see your intentions as pure. I have occasionally directed women here as a means to help them. I doubt there would be any long term damage, unless she is hostile to you. It would probably be all right to direct her to “Toxic Men”.

  292.  #292Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:39 pm


    RE: #268 – I have sometimes experienced the same when I’ve recommended Rori’s materials and blog. I told one friend in particular and she said, “No, I don’t need any help with dating.” It’s over a year later, and she just wasted that time with a man who lived with her, mooched off her, and slapped her around. She just broke up with him.

    You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make her drink.

  293.  #293Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 1:39 pm

    RE 299 Teresa it is unclear because there is no context

  294.  #294Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    Respone I got to some feeling messages

    “You have a beautiful way of expressing what is in your heart”.

  295.  #295Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:42 pm


    RE: #269 – That’s beautiful! Thanks for sharing! Who wrote that?

  296.  #296Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 1:43 pm

    Ice Princess a man once told me “families have sweet moments and bitter moments”. If he is a man he will get through it. Who knows maybe one of his kids said something similar to him and this just triggered memories of that or their mom.

  297.  #297Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:46 pm


    RE: #270 – I hear you. And I’m not pushing the others away nor you. I just needed to stay away from the feelings of shame and guilt and inadequacy that were arising in me. They are my own issues from the past, and I don’t accept those feelings. I was not saying you all were trying to make me feel those things.

    Why I keep hanging on? I am in love with him.

    When a couple is married and in love, that is called beautiful. When the love is unrequited, it’s called obsessive. I don’t know how to stop loving him.

  298.  #298Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    288 Plum, that is my problem, I VERY OFTEN feel pressured to respond or say something when sometimes I should just be quiet and take a moment!

    I learned it from my Mom, she is so codependent and a bad communicator. Sorry, I know she’s my Mom, but it’s true.

  299.  #299Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:49 pm


    Re: #271 – That hit the nail on the head of where I’m at right now. I am learning how to love myself, at a deeper level. Each time i think I have made a lot of progress, I find there is a new layer to unwind and free myself of.

    I have realized I am starving for love and affection.

  300.  #300Teresa on August 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    The context is overall trust issues, when he can’t trust me & doesn’t seem to want to get passed it & move forward & have fun. I feel like I’m hanging on to false hope & for some unknown reason to me, I can’t let go of this man. I want to move past this with him & get to the havin’ fun part of the relationship. I’m lost & don’t know what to do…..or how to even feel about it. I am just numb. We fall into the same traps everytime we speak. I say i wanna see him – he asks why – i say because i miss him – he says i don’t – i’m tired of this game of his. But I want him something fierce. I’m at a loss for words.

  301.  #301Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    Feminine Woman,

    RE: #273 – I like that! 🙂

  302.  #302Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    Starla 209
    I like your reply to a late text…no reply. I did just that, I didn’t respond until this morning around 9 am. When I wake up. Tee hee!

    FW thanks for your feedback too about the phone being turned off at night. I used to do that…and maybe am going to start doing that again…

    Plum 287
    Thanks for helping me reframe all my negative, messy thoughts about myself. You’re correct, we are ALL flawed and have “issues” etc…

  303.  #303Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    Ok sirens to all of you ladies who are so good with words…on of my CDs just said “I want to see you, hopefully soon” via text….and I am running out of feeling messages…I’ve already said earlier today and yesterday “It feels nice to hear from you” “I feel happy to see your text” “It felt nice to chat with you a bit”

    Gah what do I say in response? I feel pathetic I cannot even script a simple sentence, I get nervous or something! 🙄

    BTW, I DO want to see him!

  304.  #304Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    hmmm I could just write back “ditto” hahaha

  305.  #305Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    aww he wants to see me, that feels good to hear…I want to ask him when and where….is that leaning forward too much?

  306.  #306Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    Ice Princess,

    Re: #298 – Sounds like you handled it well.

  307.  #307Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 2:16 pm


    RE: #315 – This is a good feeling message:

    aww you want to see me, that feels good to hear…

    This is leaning forward:

    when and where?

  308.  #308Plum on August 12, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    298 Ice Princess

     ***LP got upset ***

    What did he do?


  309.  #309Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    Well, on the bright side, I have a new CD, Gar. I met him thru a mutual friend. Well I haven’t actually met him yet, but we have been talking on the phone and emailing. I feel confident we will be meeting in a week or two, and I feel good vibes from him.

  310.  #310Jade on August 12, 2011 at 2:33 pm


    I receive emails from Dr. Margaret Paul and Dr. Erika Chopich, it’s called Six Steps of Inner Bonding. It’s really helped me get serious with “healing” my inner child before I can even think about dating someone new.

  311.  #311Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    319 that’s great Brenda!
    317 thanks for the suggestion! 😉

    Gah I was feeling soo blue this morning from literally the moment I woke up! That happens to me sometimes and I just HATE it!!! I don’t know why it happens!?

    I feel better now though. I am going to be fine and like Plum said just because I am single at this very moment, it does not define my future….

  312.  #312Plum on August 12, 2011 at 2:39 pm


    “I feel opened to meeting”


  313.  #313Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    thanks Plum

    I ended up responding: “I feel happy to hear that”
    and he said that it’s Friday and what was I up to tonite?

    I said meeting a study group and then no plans after that…(I started getting excited thinking he’s going to ask me to do something tonite!)

    He wrote back “oh ok, well I’m teaching a salsa class tonight.”

    but not inviting me (it’s far from where I am anyway..and I wouldn’t go probably….but still..)

    He is so weird.
    I don’t even like salsa dancing anyway.

    I feel annoyed to the max.

    Where is recycledCD. He still has not called, and last time we talked on Tuesday he said he’d call me Thurs and MAYBE we could meet up on Friday. Here I am well into Friday and he’s still not called. Not sure if I should address this with him, Tinque said if it’s a one time thing to let it go, but I feel annoyed.

    Need more CDs. That actually call and plan stuff with me. argh!

  314.  #314Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    I know sirens are not suposed to wonder why someone (recycledCD) has not called because she is so busy with other men. But right now I’m just not and it’s me CDing myself right now, which is fine 🙂 but jeeeeez….I still want some manliness for company okaaayyyy….. 😯

  315.  #315Ella on August 12, 2011 at 3:08 pm


    Well I just saw J online again on FB IM and I decided to go unavailable.

    Feel triggered 🙂

    I feel angry.

    Feel like screaming WHY doesn’t he contact me, why!!


    Silly little me.


    Oh well… Hot guy who I know through a friend and who constantly IMs me on FB and I have told him I feel better talking on the phone repeatedly, and he took my number and hasn’t yet called.

    He IM-ed me again today and he is off to Ibiza.

    And I just sent my number to him again instead of replying.

    And then he said he has 2 missions when he gets home from holiday.

    1 – to get a phone that works all the time
    2 – to arrange a link up with me.

    So that felt kinda cool.

    It would feel good to meet up with him.

    And I am looking frward to the party next weekend and practicing less drinking.

    And I am going to start a detox tomorrow.

  316.  #316Ella on August 12, 2011 at 3:09 pm


    Feels like tightness.

    Argh F it I feel tired.

    Hmph – f it.


  317.  #317Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 3:24 pm


    #320 – Thanks! I’ll check them out.

  318.  #318Jade on August 12, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    #324 – Emerson:

    LOL! That last sentence was too funny! 🙂

  319.  #319Jade on August 12, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    My pleasure, Brenda!

  320.  #320Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 3:27 pm

    I hate dating. It is a necessary evil, because the only thing I hate more than dating is being alone. I have a date tomorrow and I look forward to it, even tho I feel nervous. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

  321.  #321Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 3:28 pm

    Dating Ryan in 2009 was like excitedly plunging into a swimming pool on a hot day, only to find the water had been drained and I broke my neck when I hit the bottom.

    I feel half alive. How the hell am I supposed to go out and date and be enthusiastic when I am dying emotionally?

  322.  #322Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    I’m glad I had the dinner party to go to tonight with people from my church. I can be around people and get my mind off Ryan.

  323.  #323Brenda on August 12, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    If you guys think I’m obsessed, if only you knew how much I think about penises! LOL!

  324.  #324Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 3:44 pm

    Teresa stop telling him that then. Just stop thinking about him and making suggests. I would stop everything I am doing.

  325.  #325Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 3:46 pm

    RE 324 Go on a dating site flirt and chat with some others.

  326.  #326Jade on August 12, 2011 at 3:48 pm

    #331 – Brenda:

    A date with anyone but Ryan should sound good then, shouldn’t it? 😉

  327.  #327Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 3:49 pm

    RE 310 Your wanting energy might be draining him.

  328.  #328luzydel on August 12, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    So Today, I accepted a “date” with someone I lost contact this past winter…

    He suggested to come to me that sounded like a good Idea, but he just called me sugesting to “bring wine”, I said I do not feel like drinking today…then he says..”well then you can make coffee…I said oh I really do not feel comfortable bringin a first date to my place, we can meet somewhere around or talk outside… I sensed that he was expecting to get laid in my place, I do not know where he got that idea; I thought that him offering come to my town was an act of being a gentleman; but my gut is telling me he has some hidden agendas. I will meet him outside just in case…I am feeling hesitant with this guy…

  329.  #329Ladybug on August 12, 2011 at 4:20 pm

    Ugh! I stopped by to see my adorable Hayseed to see if we were on for tomorrow. He looked at the ground and told me no. His brother and friends are at the beach and he will be there tomorrow with them. He didn’t even invite me to join. His hagnasty mother hates my guts so he keeps me out of the family circle now. He blew off family obligations last weekend to spend time with me.

    I went to town and saw a darling young lady I love and stopped to chat with her. I thought she left town. My DD has a crush on her brother, but the feelings are not returned. Unfortunately, her dad has a crush on me and he lied about the boy liking my DD. She invited me to their camp tonight to party. I’m going. I love the kids. I am the good Mom figure to these kids even before I met their dad.

    If I get a chance I want to invite A. to go to the beach with me tomorrow, no guys in tow. We two beautiful women can stride right past Hayseed, family and friends on down the beach to meet new men. I’ve told her about CD concept and teaching it to my DD so she doesn’t get stuck on any one boy again. She thinks it’s awesome and she knows her dad is not the only man on my playlist. I’m pretty sure she knows her dad is an idiot, too.

  330.  #330Senior Lady Vibe on August 12, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    @290: Jade

    Whoa! That’s a very short flippy skirt, very short…. 😆

    Tina, just about 70 there and a siren… inspiring.



  331.  #331Ella on August 12, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    Sarting a detox tomorrow.

    I feel excited yet a bit nervous and a lil bit afraid.

    Esp of not drinking any coffee or tea.

    Lucky work is not too full on for the nex few weeks.

  332.  #332Senior Lady Vibe on August 12, 2011 at 4:42 pm

    #298: Ice Princess says:
    “…I am so hurt that my kids don’t want me (or all of us) to be happy…”

    What your son said is normal and healthy. He is his father’s son and always will be. There is nothing wrong with his expressing a child wish that his father be with him and his mother as a family, even if the father is not so nice.

    Little boys see themselves as part of their fathers. I hope you will assure your son that you will love him and he will always be with you even though his father is not.

    It’s your made up story that your little boy doesn’t want you to be happy. He’s eight years old! A little child! He might even be worried that you will reject him! and replace him! I hope you have not expressed to him that you are “hurt” by what he said.



  333.  #333Luzydel on August 12, 2011 at 4:49 pm

    UI am hoping he doesn’t show p….I am already. Feeling bad. I want to be in bed watching netflix.

  334.  #334luzydel on August 12, 2011 at 5:10 pm

    He just texted me and is on his way…why Can’t I be excited?

    Who the hell makes a date at 9PM? I am already sleepy. This is why I cannot let a man do all the planning. I am tired had a loong week.

  335.  #335Jade on August 12, 2011 at 5:30 pm

    #340 – SLV:

    Yeah, she’s looking good! Don’t you just love the way she goes “with an attitude”? That just cracked me up! 🙂

    Luzydel, when he gets there, I’m sure you’ll just get your energy back.

  336.  #336Emoticon on August 12, 2011 at 5:45 pm

    Yes Ladies. Im not going to read into it at all, because it feels good to me. And nope im not going to lean forward either. Just sit back and wait to be surprised. 🙂

  337.  #337Ice Princess on August 12, 2011 at 6:20 pm

    Whew! I went out to dinner with the kids and my grandparents and it was just what I needed to get back on my horse.

    FW #306–
    You’re right just before my son said those things he was saying his favorite part of the day was “spending time with my friends and family”. He didn’t meant hurt me or LP.

    Brenda #316–
    thanks! 🙂

    Plum #318–
    He cringed and closed down (stopped talking and responding).

    SLV #342–
    no, my son does not know that I was upset by his words and I explained to him for the millionth time why. His dad and I couldn’t be together.

  338.  #338Ice Princess on August 12, 2011 at 6:24 pm

    And, by the way, he called and told me that I should turn on a certain channel so my kids could see the football game. He also added tha he saw that I checked in at a restaurant so he knew I had already eaten (maybe he wanted to invite me to dinner. Guess he just needed time to digest. He did not mention anything about the day or what my son said so I guess I will drop it too even though I would love to address it. What do you all think leave it alone and move forward or address it to see where he stands?

  339.  #339Jonathon on August 12, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    Jumping in to say “hi” for those who wrote sweet kind comments…… THANK YOU sooooo much

    I’m online for a few, got any questions?



  340.  #340Femininewoman on August 12, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    Hi Johnathan,

    In what cases do you believe that guys do not deserve a second chance?

  341.  #341Plum on August 12, 2011 at 8:19 pm

  342.  #342luzydel on August 12, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    He wasn’t my type and an hr later he end up winning me over. He came off a too strong, the more I leaned back the more he came forward. He is very Masculine, I am used to more subtle men. But there is something about this guy, He seem truthful and an bit rough around the edges. Someone I would not date many years ago, because I end up with “smooth” guys who end up being players. We made out and that is how he won me over….he’s a big teddy bear! and I wanted to run away from the date. We will see each other again on sunday 😉 Still sometimes I still feel like running away!!

  343.  #343luzydel on August 12, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    I know why!!!! I feel vulnerable around him…I got it now…with other men I feel I can hide it, he can see right through my vulnerability….bingo! another peace of the puzzle

  344.  #344Plum on August 12, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    “”If anyone feels lonely, separate, then ask yourself mentally whose business are you in. And it can just bring you right back to where you really are and that’s when the change can take place.””

    “”Your body is too large…. Can you absolutely know it is true your body is too large?””


  345.  #345Plum on August 12, 2011 at 8:47 pm




  346.  #346Plum on August 12, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    “”No one can ever take advantage of me. That’s not possible””


  347.  #347Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    350 FW good question…is not paying for breakfast one of the reasons for not giving a second chance? LOL that’s one of my dating stories, if any of you remember. It was soo AAAWWWKWAAARD….. 😯
    I can laugh about it now…

  348.  #348Emerson on August 12, 2011 at 9:14 pm

    Hi Jonathon 🙂

  349.  #349DE on August 12, 2011 at 9:47 pm


    Thank you so much for sharing these videos on Byron Katie and Oprah…

    I don’t have cable, so I often feel curious about Oprah’s network these days…

    It was awesome…Oprah felt enlightened to a new level…we should invite her to our blog 🙂 Awesome…:)

    Warm hugs,

  350.  #350DE on August 12, 2011 at 10:14 pm


    I really encourage u to listen to the link posted by Plum on #356…i believe it holds the answer and key to u current situation…

    warm hugs,

  351.  #351English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 12:46 am

    #253 Ella

    That feels like even more drama if you introduced her to this site, she may look at the archives and figure out which Siren is you………

  352.  #352English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 1:04 am

    #253 Ella

    Sorry I am just catching up and didn’t see others viewpoints. For myself it would feel awful to put myself out there where anybody I know in real life could read my posts, I consider this my personal Siren island space. 🙂

  353.  #353English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 1:06 am

    #273 FW

    I LOVE your reply. 🙂

  354.  #354English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 1:15 am

    #320 Jade

    Thank you for this, I have bookmarked it to read later today, I too am in need of some work on myself.

  355.  #355Butterfly Wings on August 13, 2011 at 1:33 am

    A guy I dated several months ago contacted me today after nothing for ages. We met because his sister (who I’m friends with on FB – she and I have never met but we have a LOT of mutual friends) kind of set us up!

    Our first date was good – he took me to a comedy show where we had a few drinks and lots of talking. The next time was a quick coffee and a chat while my daughter was at soccer training.

    After that things kind of drifted off, apart from the occasional hello.

    His sister told me he was quite shy and I’m soooo not, so maybe I scared him a little! lol I don’t know…

    Anyway, so he’s obviously been reading my FB posts because he congratulated me on the sale of the house and thought it was pretty cool that I might be moving close to him.

    Him contacting me brought up some thoughts of the future dates he’d mentioned which sounded like so much fun! He was talking about going kayaking amongst other things. Cool huh?

    Now I’m thinking “What if I get bored with TH cos he doesn’t do any of that kind of thing?”…. Interesting… and something I need to process.

    Could be because I’m hormonal though… I hope…! 😉

  356.  #356Daria on August 13, 2011 at 3:11 am

    feeling tired i love my tiredness

    shut down this morning i love my shutdowness

    feeling rage in a plastic bag i love my rage in a plastic bag

    feeling sigh i love my sigh

    feeling hmph i love my hmph

    feeling sleepy i love my sleepy

  357.  #357Daria on August 13, 2011 at 3:12 am

    drinking fresh yoghurt keeps my immune system strong

  358.  #358Daria on August 13, 2011 at 3:22 am

    how do people handle if someone is having a conversation around u, and it feels bad to hear?

    i feel frustrated with myself that i feel stuck with this

    sometimes i feel so angry when i hear my parents talking about me in 3rd person when i am there – GU?H i feel like jumping off my chair right NO?W just remembering it

    or if someone is saying things that feel bad, say like judgemental things about stuff i happen to care about i feel *hurt in the heart* for lack of better word – triggered – and then i sometimes feel depressed

    then i feel shutdown towards those people later

    my thoughts are like “its none of your business” and “let them be” but i wind up feeling bad

    i know we’re probably to say “woa tat feels bad to hear” but i just feel so FAR from getting to the point of saying taht i feel kinda hopeless

  359.  #359Daria on August 13, 2011 at 3:30 am

    i felt like i reached my threshold of worhtyiness and feeling good because i insisted i get something to eat right THEN instead of waiting an hour… then everything magially aligned and the man i wanted to go with me – who was hesitating when i asked – instead Volunteered so he can make sure im ok.

    THEN, the second day, i felt liek a diva so i felt it would be “too much” and they wuld turn on me and ay im spoiled and egoistical and selfish if i insisted taht i did NOT want to get up early. so i agreed and then felt AWFUL AND PIST getting up early so pist…

    and then i noticed i avoided looking them in the eyes and i felt so blamy and triggered

    and remembering other times when i did not require top treatment and how awfult ath felt

    and now i feel a bit better but my immune system had really gone down from the experience this morning


    and taht feels like huihuhuhmmm

    and i love my huhuhummm

  360.  #360Daria on August 13, 2011 at 3:42 am

    Jade – Inner Bonding feels amazing… BUT

    I really encourage you to use Rori’s dating as therapy mode… it feels amazing too, no need to hold yourself back ‘before even thinking of dating anyone new.’

    (that’s a way we all subconsciously punish ourselves by the way – depriving yourself until, protecting yourself… )

    you don’t need to… you can date and start healing yourself this way no matter where you’re at

    and you can use inner bonding practices – Rori includes some of that in her work – while doing it

    I know you might fight me on this, but the fastest way to start healing with men is to start dating in this conscious healing way…

    not to remove yourself until a later time when you are deemed ready – because you will find yourself still at square one when it comes to relating with men… because it takes PRACTICE with real men, (lots and lots of them) not just with self and not just theory…

    you are ready to feel the truth of who you are right now, because the truth of who you are is already there

  361.  #361Patricia on August 13, 2011 at 4:23 am

    Daria @372

    Good morning Daria…..I whole heartedly agree…….xo

  362.  #362English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 4:33 am


    Thank you so much for those video’s of Byron Katie with Oprah, I have had so many aha moments today listening to them, in fact I am still in my pj’s and it’s lunch time, but I will consider this free therapy. 🙂

    One of the biggest aha moments for me was when she told Oprah that happiness is not all about joy, joy, joy it’s about balance and peace, wow it took me all these years to “get” it, I thought you had to be skipping along the Yellow Brick road every day and THAT is what happiness meant!!!

  363.  #363English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 4:38 am

    #372 Daria

    “not to remove yourself until a later time when you are deemed ready – because you will find yourself still at square one when it comes to relating with men… because it takes PRACTICE with real men, (lots and lots of them) not just with self and not just theory…

    you are ready to feel the truth of who you are right now, because the truth of who you are is already there”

    I know you meant this for Jade, but thank you so much for this and especially the last sentence, I really needed to hear that today.

    I hope you are enjoying Romania, I’ve heard it’s a lovely country with fantastic mountains, the Romanian guy I used to sit next to at work in Australia told me all about it and showed me lots of photos of him and his brother mountain climbing.

  364.  #364English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 4:42 am

    @ Byron Katie on our thoughts.

    She talks about working with men in prison, and tells the story of one man who was banged up in a cell and started screaming and screaming. Just him in the cell all by himself with his own thoughts and it must have been unbearable for him.

    Then she says if you offered a Buddhist monk the same cell he would say “Thank You.”

    Wow our own thoughts (NV’s) are powerful indeed.

  365.  #365English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 4:45 am

    Do any of you techie types know how I can download stuff like Rori or Abraham or Byron Katie onto my iPod or can you download off youtube, if not where do you get all this stuff from?

    The Apple online store or Amazon or somewhere free maybe? 😀

  366.  #366Emoticon on August 13, 2011 at 5:05 am

    Good Morning Sirens.

    How is everyone’s weekend so far?

  367.  #367Jade on August 13, 2011 at 5:16 am

    EW – 366 – You’re welcome!

    Daria – 372 – You may be right about that but I don’t know if I’m ready for dating now. It’s only been three weeks since we broke up and my heart is still very achy, I still feel something for him and I’m afraid I’m going to compare the men I meet to him and find that they don’t measure up.

    I NEED to work on myself and find out what it is that’s so wrong with me, why I turn into another woman when I’m with someone, even when I feel that the relationship is strong (and it was) and I can trust him (which I could).

    I understand what you want to tell me here and I’m sure that dating men would take my mind off my x but I want to give myself some more time. I’m afraid I’ll just repeat the same mistakes if I don’t.

  368.  #368Plum on August 13, 2011 at 5:38 am


    For posts 351 354 356
    Click on the link pasted on the post
    A black page opens with a video in the middle
    Right click on the black part of the page
    A list opens up
    select “save as”
    click on it and follow the directions.

    Once you got your files on your computer:
    Google “converters” and download a converter, some are free, some ask you to pay something.
    Here is one you can download for free:
    Download it and install it on your computer.
    Use it to convert your files into the format you need into your Ipod


  369.  #369Jade on August 13, 2011 at 5:40 am

    I’ll be working today and tomorrow so I feel kind of blah…

  370.  #370Plum on August 13, 2011 at 6:00 am


    You can also browse Internet with the Firefox browser to which you add the “downloaderhelper”. It grabs the videos on most any page you visit and it comes with an integrated converter.

    You can download the helper for free here:
    Download it and install it, it sets itself up on your Firefox. An icon will appear on Firefox tool bar when you are finished
    Browse a page that shows videos
    Right click on the downloader icon, a list of actions will show up.
    Left click on the icon, a list with the names of the videos will show up.
    Select the video you want to save and click on it.


  371.  #371Plum on August 13, 2011 at 6:27 am


    Also, if you already use RealPlayer to view your videos on your computer:

    When you watch a video on Internet, the RealPlayer downloading button will appear on the top right of the videos for a few seconds.
    You can also put your cursor on the videos and right click. You will see the option to save the video through RealPlayer.


  372.  #372Emoticon on August 13, 2011 at 6:41 am

    yeah i feel very blahh myself lol. I went clubbing with a friend last night and now i’m jus really tired, and dont feel like going out of my way to leave this house to do anything.

  373.  #373Jade on August 13, 2011 at 7:30 am

    Four Non Blondes – What’s Up

    What’s going on????

  374.  #374marina on August 13, 2011 at 7:56 am

    Hi EW #377,

    you can also use to download videos as MP3. Just paste the Youtube URL and it wil be automatically downloaded to your PC in MP3 format.


  375.  #375LobbyStar on August 13, 2011 at 8:13 am

    Last night I had a first date, no sparks for me. At the end, he went to hug me, but then dove in for a kiss. I was open to it, until he shoved his tongue so far into my mouth that I almost gagged.

    I am wondering if setting off my gag reflex is grounds to refuse a second date…

  376.  #376Plum on August 13, 2011 at 8:28 am

    giraffe language versus jacko language with Marshall B. Rosenberg, founder and developer of Nonviolent Communication (NVC)
    Session from the year 2000


  377.  #377Plum on August 13, 2011 at 8:31 am



  378.  #378Plum on August 13, 2011 at 8:37 am

    Giraffe versus Jacko Part 2

    Expressing Needs and Requests

    Session from the year 2000


  379.  #379Jonathon on August 13, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Hi back Emerson and Hello Feminine Woman,

    When to give a guy a second chance?

    Maybe a better a better way to look at it would be to say when not to. If he is disrespectful or cruel, for sure NOT.

    Observe his character and his values during a first date… if he is kind and considerate, that’s a great start.

    In my new book UNDERSTAND MEN NOW ~ the Relationships Men Commit to and Why

    I describe the 7 Types of Relationships Men Choose including an outline of relationship ready men

    I even have a chapter on dating, called the Power of 3

    If the date was awkward, uncomfortable, and even boring…. there is a chance he is a bad dater and not a bad guy.

    Values and character are the most important aspects of a man and listen to your inner voice to guide you.

    Let me know if I can be of help, I’ve got your back.

  380.  #380Wildflower on August 13, 2011 at 8:42 am

    Ella–Good luck with the detox. I did one for about 9 weeks. It wasn’t easy (especially the first couple of weeks). It was worth it though. I saw a HUGE difference in my fingernails which sounds odd. They got a lot stronger which I’m hoping means the bones inside my body got stronger too. I did the one Rose Cole recommended minus the optional supplements since I was overseas at the time and couldn’t order them. However I have them now and I’m looking forward to doing another one with the supplements this time. So long story short I’m telling you all this because I believe it was worth it and I’m willing to give it another go since I found the results very motivating!

  381.  #381Wildflower on August 13, 2011 at 8:43 am

    Just wanted to say hi to everyone. I haven’t had computer access for a couple of days.

  382.  #382Plum on August 13, 2011 at 8:43 am

    Giraffe versus Jacko Part 03

    Empathically Hearing Others

    Session from the year 2000


  383.  #383Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 10:14 am


    RE: #336 – “A date with anyone but Ryan should sound good then, shouldn’t it? ”

    You would think so. But really I desire deep intimacy with a man more than physical intimacy.

  384.  #384Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 10:34 am


    Re: #387 – LOL! Yes, it is grounds to refuse a second date in my book! I dated two men like that, and it was like their tongues were dicks! Yo, buddy, that’s not romantic!

    That was one thing that royally attracted me to Ryan…the first couple of times we kissed, it was average. Then he discussed it with me, saying it didn’t feel right. He asked what was wrong. I whispered, “More suction!”

    He really responded! After that, he just kissed like my dream man! We were totally in sync, and it was the best kissing I’ve ever enjoyed! I just love it when a man is sensitive to ME and MY needs!

  385.  #385Daria on August 13, 2011 at 10:37 am

    Lobbystar – what a great opp to practice some honesty

    (and i know how difficult it is, ive definitely “withdrawn” after the kisses didn’t feel good – but then i also had an experience where after a few days, i started to Like it”)

    so this will probably feel really uncomfortable to share about – for me – but a great opportunity to practice telling the truth!

  386.  #386Daria on August 13, 2011 at 10:38 am

    meaning – wow this feels so uncomfortable and i like you and kissing feels a lil weird… i feel better being kissed more softly – what do you think?

  387.  #387alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:03 am

    my cd called and wanted to push our date 2-3 hrs later.

    and i felt no.

    seriously if it was a job interview would you call up a prospective employer and say well i’ve got to do some stuff and my roomate (his mother, i am guessing…) wants me to ….

    No, you wouldn’t.

    And how is a new job more important than finding a fantastic relationship? priorities people. and yet, men will do things for a job that they won’t do for a woman. SO THEY ARE CAPABLE of showing up consistently and on time and taking care of business.

    oh, wait… not all of them.

    oh, that’s right, how you do one thing is how you do all things. so most of these men who can’t step up for a woman also are not stepping up in their career. oh, double dud lose.

    and anyway, a don’t want to date a grown man who lives with his mother. i don’t care the reason. i don’t want.

    so at first i told cd guy it’s probably best we do it another day. and he kept offering suggestions.

    finally i told him, “i’m sorry. i lied. i’m not going to resechedule this.”

    and he just kind of sai, “ok.” bye.

    how a person does one thing is how they do everything.

    now he can stay at home with his mom and be her b*tch all afternoon. have fun.

    but i realized i don’t have a Back up Plan. 🙁

    and for some reason NV of “i am a doomed and utter failure” popped up. 🙁

    oh, ok. thanks for sharing NV but this is untrue. liar. NV have a reputation of being a nasty liar. totally unreliable source of information. just a mean mean bully trying to shame and ridicule and beat me down.

    no, thank you.

    i wish someone would come “save” me and hand me my ideal life on a silver platter. thank you. which would have me driving to the ferry right NOW to go to catalina. thank you.

  388.  #388alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:12 am

    so now i am searching boat rides near the marina.

  389.  #389alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:27 am

    i feel stuck in my cage. defeated. i love my feelings of paralysis and confusion and aloneness.

    i feel like i am barely breathing. i feel unsleepy yet wanting to take a nap. i love my depressed feelings.

    a higher step up would be anger.

    SCREW YOU! who? i don’t care who. anyone. i just want to feel better.

    screw you to my NV! SCREW YOU!
    ugh. that doesn’t even feel authentic.

    i feel like a deflated balloon.

    i love my feelings of deflation.

    i love my choosing to think dead thoughts. i love my mind stepping back into a comfortable groove of self loathing and confusion and unwillingness.

    i love my AWARENESS. this is true. if i were standing outside myself i’d say perk up. what’s the big tragedy? so someone you were hardly interested in flaked. count your blessings on that one!

    so you’re stuck in your cage. so what! think of something else will you?

    so you don’t do the things in life you often wish you were doing…so what!

    is that even true?

    you do a lot of things. you’ve done a lot of fun things. just not as OFTEN as you would like. give yourself a break. you’re still alive and the sun is shining just for you.

    just chill a moment will you. just chill out. and think of something a little more better than what your NV are offering. they are like hooded demons. avoid them. think of laughing dogs. that’s one of your favorites. mull on that.

  390.  #390alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:29 am

    think of that cute tiny dog that ran up to you yesterday while you were hiking.

    his owner said, “he ran right up to you. he doesn’t usually do that.”

    “yes, i thought it was odd,” i said. though i was absolutely delighted to make a new friend so fast.

    “it must be your energy,” she said.


    YES! the laughing dogs and i get along splendidly.

    think on that.

  391.  #391alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:36 am

    today’s abraham quote:

    It’s not about years. It’s not about age. It’s not about youth. It’s about decline. And decline is about alignment, or not. Decline is about, in this moment, which way am I forking? In this moment, which way am I forking? In this moment, which way am I forking? That’s all it’s about.

    — Abraham

  392.  #392luzydel on August 13, 2011 at 11:38 am

    Last night CD told me things that were some how a slap on my face…not in a negative way, but it was like he could see through all my BS. He said that i close myself, that i get deffensive, that when he tried to get close to me I moved away and that if I did not like him then that was understandable, but if I did like him then, Why move away?

    I tend to do this unconsciously, another cd a few weeks ago also tried to hold my hand and i pulled away, I could see he also felt rejected and the worst thing is that I liked him also, but he never called back.

    last night guy, said he wont promise anything, but that he wants to take a chance and see where things go…
    Like I mentioned before, he is staright forward no BS type of guy, a little rough and not the type of guy I date, I do not feel that intensity and strong chemistry, but I feel drawn to him, because I feel “he gets me”…

    We will see, he was an unplanned CD, something out of nowhere, I am sort of giving up in men, but I am willing to take a chance, It wont hurt anymore if I get dissapointed anyway…

  393.  #393alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:44 am

    i am forking towards laughing dogs. and chilling out. and appreciating the sun that is shining just for me.

    and thank you for my lovely cup of tea i had this morning that i got to drink out a big mug in a lovely deep color blue that goes so well with my bright yellow kitchen walls that i redid.

    my kitchen looks so much nicer and i really enjoy it. and thank you so much for starting to learn to cook.

    and thank you for really following your feelings in situations and keep yourself in a pretty good place. and really miling the moments that feels so so good. and feeling amazed how long those feelings can last sometimes. like extending an orgasm just by appreciating it and letting it in.

    and thank you SO much for having sex a couple of weeks ago. and how it felt so nice RECEIVING the energy of the man i like so much instead of trying to Get Him To Feel Good. I just received during sex and it felt so nice. and i could tell he liked it too. in fact, me receiving was the best sex we have had.

    isn;t that interesting?

    thank you for your willingness to always be open to experiment. to be willing to change your mind. to be willing to be open.

    thank you for your fun self.

    thank you for your ballbusting self.

    i love my ballbusting.

    thank you for all your big dreams that you keep alive. thank you for the life force you allow to flow through you.

    thank you for being turned onto abraham and rori.

    thank you for siren island.

    thank you for my computer.

    thank you for all the men who send me their energy alll the time, everyday via text. lol.

  394.  #394alias girl on August 13, 2011 at 11:52 am

    should i drive to the marina? yes no yes no yes no.

    i always think if i had $$$$ i would make different choices.

    is this true?

    i think so.

    argh. hello NV. self-blaming, shaming NV.


    i feel ANGRY!

    yes. good. angry is better than depressed!

    i feel LIVID! lol. maybe not livid. lol.

    i feel laughing.


    I FEEL ANGRY. I FEEL REPEATING MYSELF. i feel like beating myself in the head with a baseball bat.

    wow. i feel shocked at that. i feel a little backing off. yikes. maybe livid is an accurate description.

    aw. i feel compassion for my beating myself up. i feel a littl sad at my persistent sense of unworthiness and that i bought into all the NV of society about money.

    aw. i feel AWARENESS. and that feels Great.

    i have the one tiny glimmer of awareness which for me is Hope. Hope is even better than Anger!!!!

    ooooooh i am so close. close enough, in fact, that if i just chill out and focus on laughing dogs that i’ll probably be sucked into a feeling-good place.

    cool. i feel ok. i feel neutral with a bit of hope. and that feels like possibility. like an animal perked up to see what happens next…

  395.  #395Ella on August 13, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    Having a funny day today.

    Funny weird not funny ha ha.

    I have a headache from my detox day 1 – and I think it is caffeine withdrawals.

    Its ok though I am sticking with it.

    My detox is just a week long… WOW to wildflower for doing a 9 week one! That is quite an acheivement, not sure I would have the willpower to do one that long, although I do eat healthily most of the time.

    Well have been going in and out of feeling triggered today.

    I was invited to a social event by some of the group that J and I know mutually.

    I was pretty sure he wasn’t going as he had said on FB he was attending something else (it shows up in the window of events @ side of my news feed) then I saw he said he was going.

    I had planned to go initially then changed my mind as the day wore on and I ran out of time.

    I was thinking to go in the day to actually avoid him… I did not want to be triggered and feel like sh8t.

    Anyway when I saw that he IS planning to go, then I started to get an urge to go because I do want to see him.

    I have plans with a friend of mine tonight to help her babysit, and yet I am feeling narky and icky because I find it hard to get rid of this feeling like I am closing the doors.

    Its as though time is running out or something. Like if I don’t see him now it will be too late for ever kind of thing.

    I think he is toxic for me. Even though he is lovely.

    I was reviewing the intro / ad for Toxic men and I can identify those high then low feelings, and feeling off balance.

    And the pining, and the feeling that the perfect relationship is just out of reach, and if I can just work out how to do ‘x’ or if I had just done such and such differently then I would have that perfect relationship.

    Feels torturous.

    And so I have been in and out of obsessing over it all day.

    Like sometimes I can totally be in the present moment, and enjoying what I am doing (eg shopping for my detox) and then I slip back into my head looping round and round trying to figure things out.

    I really need to feel that I am getting better.

    From my addiction to men who are toxic to me.

    And sometimes it doesn’t feel like it.

    Sometimes I just feel like a lovesick teenager at the mercy of my emotions. And it drives me slightly mad for a minute.

    But I am getting better.

    The fact that I no longer act on these impulses (well very rarely) is massive progress from how I was a few years ago… so trying to bear that in mind.

    I just have this idea that I am on a turning point.

    I seem to be able to choose the good feelings and the actions that are most loving and healthy for me most of the time now.

    And yet I still get drawn to the toxic men, time and time again.

    Although I am getting less lost in it when I am around them if you get what I mean.

    I just don’t want to stuff. I am willing to sit here and feel the baddies (emotions) if they want to come out now.

    And yet I want to choose the good ones.

    And I seem to have an ingrained belief that men will not call me… and they don’t.

    Well at least not the ones I want to… the ones I feel attracted to.

    And I have to be honest I have been ignoring the mediocre ones who ARE calling me.

    I know this is naughty Siren.

    I just feel so like ‘blah!’ … I can’t be bothered with them. It just feels like an energy drain. I don’t have time for those people…

    They just annoy me.

    I feel annoyed.

    I don’t want to date people I am not attracted to.

    I feel a bit here, there and everywhere with myself today.

    Triggering day. I just want to go and chase after J and I simply won’t. And its making me feel narky.

    Right screw this I am off to see my friend and do some babysitting.

    Maybe I can even talk myself into communicating with some of these uninteresting men at some point…


  396.  #396Ella on August 13, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Oh and I should say… I did want to go to the social event, regardless of J, because it is a leaving do. And the people who are leaving to go to Australia I think are LOVELY. But I had other stuff to do.

    And I felt unsure with the J thing… and I kinda pro-crastinated… and just didn’t end up going.

    I didn’t really want a repeat of the group clubbing night which felt awful to me, because it felt like I was there for J, and I don’t even really know if that is true or not, but I felt akward and uncomfortable etc… and bad that things felt akward between he and I.

    Oh well F it. Maybe I will get to say goodbye to them… I could drop round and see them another time before they go or something.

  397.  #397Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 12:22 pm


    RE; #400 – Hi KS! Good to “see” you, too!

  398.  #398flower on August 13, 2011 at 12:32 pm

    so after listening to all love scripts cds i consider escorting , lets see if i can get nonsexual ones 😉

  399.  #399Mel on August 13, 2011 at 12:52 pm

    So we met for a drink. It went okay, I wasn’t as nervous as I expected. He was dressed super casually, which kind of turned me off a bit, but he seemed nice enough. It’s weird because he seemed to have a lot more personality in the emails/texts then he did in person. Sort of blah. I didn’t feel much. Perhaps he was not himself…? There was a bit of an awkward hug at the end… I guess I wasn’t expecting that or something. LOL. I get the feeling we may not be each others’ type, but we did seem to click via email, so maybe it deserves a do-over. But I’ll let him contact me. Right? LOL.

    So there you have it… my first CD.

    There will be others!!!

  400.  #400English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    WOW OK I see I am Jenny from the block on the POF dating site………the new kid and all that but I am OVERWHELMED by the men on there ha ha ha, this is soooo funny I have almost the same name on OK Cupid, exactly the same photos and profile and I have had just one CD and no other, yet on POF there are about 40 guys….some old enough to be my dad although they say they are the same age and MORE than enough to be my child…………….spent an hour on there tonight and feel totally OVERWHELMED by the drama of it all…………..after listening to Byron Katie and Abraham all day…………mmmmmmmmm

  401.  #401English Woman on August 13, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    more men young enough to be my child is what I meant……..

  402.  #402LobbyStar on August 13, 2011 at 4:05 pm

    Ok, so I’ve been dating this guy since the end of June, and we have been physical. After our last date, he did not contact me for like 3 weeks. Then today he texted and asked me out for tonight.

    I have been CDing, and so the 3 weeks of no contact did not bother me. We aren’t in a r’ship. But what are we?

    When we’re together, he is so good to me. I feel happy and fine. When we aren’t together, I feel… unsure where I stand.


  403.  #403Rori Raye on August 13, 2011 at 4:31 pm

    LobbyStar – He’s clearly not boyfriend material – at least not now – but if you’re CDing for real – you can keep him in your rotation as long as you don’t get hung up on him. Really important – the whole point of CDing is to PRACTICE using Feeling Messages, saying the truth, and all the Tools…that means you decide if you can have sex with a man who doesn’t call you for 3 weeks, and if not – then you share with him your feelings…you can even share with him your confusion….write it all out in advance and check in here with the speeches and then deliver them and see what happens. You’re not asking for a relationship here….you’re just exploring what you DO want. As for where you stand – you’re DATING. That’s it. If he’s getting sex with you…then that’s a great bonus for him, for sure – is it for you? Love, Rori

  404.  #404flower on August 13, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    so i went out , saw him there and today it did bother me what he does on dancefloor and it wasnt even that bad , just bit of dance but sexy with some slutty girl and i felt so sad i had to leave cding no sex with another man , no nothing will ever help me , ill be going in circles even if its big (long time) circles

  405.  #405flower on August 13, 2011 at 4:54 pm

    i cant stand it anymore, i really need some highe qulity than him man appear in front of me

  406.  #406FlowerChild77 on August 13, 2011 at 5:00 pm

    I hope everyone is out having some Siren fun! 🙂 Happy summer!

    It’s a cool sixty-six degrees and beautifully breezy where I live. There’s a 3-day festival in full swing and it’s nearly in my yard! The kettle-corn is so tasty. I ‘splurged’ (nutritionally) and had a nice cold Pepsi to go with it. Yum! The waves and the sky are delightful to watch. I feel SO blessed. 🙂

    My son and grand daughter were here, too. I love seeing them. And I made bbq chicken (to eat on buttered buns) for lunch tomorrow after church. I really enjoy the people at church. It’s like a big family and I feel so loved. Yes. A great day it is.

    I’m not sure what to think (even tho I’m not supposed to be thinking about it!) about xbf/bf. Yesterday/last night was wonderful.

    The night before, on the phone, he apologized for last Sunday (not confirming plans and so, no date.) He said he was sorry, that my time is important and how that was not going to happen again. He said how much he missed me and was looking forward to seeing me. I told him it felt good to hear that from him.

    Yesterday, I caught myself getting into mindless ‘chatter’ and instantly stopped—and got back into my body. Usually I “forget” all my Siren stuff when I see him–but I did good this time! 😉

    Here, I was the one worried about not talking about marriage…and it ended up that he talked about it throughout the entire time.

    Not about us–but he kept bringing it up. Two couples we know got married this summer. He made quite a few very thoughtful comments or observations about married people/couples we know—-and kept bringing it back to how long we’d been together. It is so unusual for him to verbalize those kinds of thoughts—not that I don’t believe he has deep or emotional thoughts, but he very seldom expresses them with words.

    He is very ‘clumsy’ when he does talk about feelings, but I don’t want to play ‘connect the dots’ –so I noticed how I felt really good inside and all warm and melty. I said very little and just leaned way back and listened at level two. He is very concerned about “being able to take care of us” (his words.)

    We could easily make ends meet between the two of us, right now…but I didn’t say that. Before Rori, I couldn’t ‘see’ how he wants to be the man and how important it is to him. (Before, I would have felt like it was just an “excuse” and felt irritated and rejected.)

    So……I love being with him more than ever—-BUT, at the same time, I’m feeling so confident that I will be ok with or without him.

  407.  #407Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:02 pm


    Are you ok?


  408.  #408Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 5:02 pm

    Is it possible for me to be “just friends” with Ryan when I’m in love with him?

  409.  #409Femininewoman on August 13, 2011 at 5:03 pm

    RE 413 Mel congrats. Now you have evidence that you can do it.

  410.  #410Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:05 pm


    No, I don’t think so.


  411.  #411Femininewoman on August 13, 2011 at 5:09 pm

    RE 420 Congrats

  412.  #412Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 5:15 pm


    If not, then it follows I should have no contact with him. How will I bear that? It’s been two years, and I have proven that I can’t or won’t abide by letting him initiate only.

  413.  #413Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:38 pm


    With my last toxic man who I have managed to step away from it was just lots of babysteps.

    So I didn’t try to force myself to do anything… I just noticed when I was acting from my addiction and engaging on toxic behaviour.

    Then one night I decided to walk home instead of staying at his.

    I cried a ton and that was babystep no 1.

    Another time was paying less attention to him and what he was doing… another was choosing to go do something I wanted to do instead of a chance to see him.

    Etc etc.

    And sometimes I take babysteps backwards too.

    At these times it helps to review how far I have come since say, 1 or 2 years ago.

    Oh and the other things that help are CD-ing and focusing on ANYTHING else.

    Any good?


  414.  #414Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:39 pm

    PS – I am referring to Pubman in my post above.

  415.  #415Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:41 pm


    I think it is Rori’s 3rd way…

    Ie – no contact can feel too extreme, like cold turkey and too easy to break.

    The 3rd way is gentle babysteps and transformation.

    How does that feel?

    How do YOU feel today?

    What are YOU up to?

    Hugs. xoxox

  416.  #416Ella on August 13, 2011 at 5:43 pm

    “So……I love being with him more than ever—-BUT, at the same time, I’m feeling so confident that I will be ok with or without him.”

    Yay Flowerchild.

    I too am finding ways just to feel happy each day.

    In my own life.

  417.  #417FlowerChild77 on August 13, 2011 at 6:08 pm

    Brenda…Trying to be friends with someone I had romantic feelings for would not be good for me. It would mean I’d constantly have to deny my true feelings and “pretend” it was ok—which is totally opposite of everything Rori teaches us. 🙁

    And if you be honest with yourself, you don’t WANT to be friends with Ryan. You want him to love you the way you love him.

    Doesn’t that just hurt TOO much? <3

  418.  #418Ice Princess on August 13, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    I feel a little disappointed that he hasn’t contacted me today except for the text that he wanted to see a picture of me. I did not answer the text because I am not his sexual object and I didn’t feel like it he deserved a response to that text. I went out to a fancy dinner for my cousin’s birthday which felt good but now I am home alone with the kids sleeping in another room so can’t go out to see if the guy I met from last Saturday is at the bar. I wonder if he wishes he would have asked me for my number instead of a lame hug.

  419.  #419Brenda on August 13, 2011 at 8:08 pm


    RE: #429 – I appreciate your help, and I’ve been doing those things for 2 years. Yes, I have made tremendous progress in those two years, but after trying those diversions for 2 years, it feels like this…

    I feel like a starving woman who is stumbling around a land in drought, looking for food. I am directed to the mud puddle and dried out weeds behind a rock. I drink and eat them. Then I am directed to the dried out berries on a dead bush. I eat them.

    What does that make me after 2 years of feeding on what doesn’t fill me?? A starving woman.

    Least that’s the way it feels. And I overeat. And I know that doesn’t fill the real need inside, either, but it does anesthetize the pain.

    I am just sick of living in the pain of loneliness after 47 years. And I don’t want just A man. I want a man who is my match spiritually, intellectually, emotionally, etc. So I choose to go on lonely rather than be with the wrong man.

    I’m hungry.

  420.  #420Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:35 pm

    413 Mel
    Yay Mel!!! I think I’ve been on the exact same date…..about 20 times. 🙄

    Gah…it’s odd how people are so different on email/text versus in person, isn’t it?

    It’s not funny but I had to laugh about the akward hug at the end, because I’ve had many o’ similar hugs….hmmph!

    I’m happy that you did it though! Yes there will be more!

    Sometimes I feel so let down and sad after having a CD that’s just…blah. I know it’s just practice but waaahh…I wanted sparks.

  421.  #421Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:37 pm

    420 FlowerChild
    this is inspiring, I am excited for you that you were able to use feeling messages and he was responding well. I like how you described catching yourself in the chatter and not letting it continue but getting back into your body and feeling your feelings….

  422.  #422Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:38 pm

    413 Thanks Jonathon I will check out the link you posted 🙂

  423.  #423Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:39 pm

    *391 not 413 for Jonathon

  424.  #424Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:40 pm

    413 Mel I meant Yay Mel as in yay you had your first CD, it kind a came out weird in type and didn’t want you to think i was being snarky 🙂

  425.  #425Emerson on August 13, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    414 Go English Woman! Wow I can’t wait to hear about how these CDs turn out….have fun!

  426.  #426Mel on August 13, 2011 at 9:32 pm

    No worries Emerson! Not snarky! 😉

    I have another date in the works this week. This guy (from profile at least) seems like more my type. Somewhat intellectual, well- travelled, quite cute….

    He asked for my pic, so I sent him a webcam one (I really need to take some actual photos) and he actually replied “Thanks, you’re gorgeous! 🙂 ”

    That felt nice to hear!

    Fun, fun fun! right FW?

  427.  #427Emoticon on August 13, 2011 at 9:36 pm

    I realize the easiest way to keep myself leaning back is when i remind myself that there’s no hurry. I have all the rest of my life to experience this. 🙂 Having a great weekend. Hope you Sirens are too.

    Listening to Adele’s album 21 and every song feels great!!

  428.  #428Mel on August 13, 2011 at 9:36 pm

    The text/email vs real person variation could be nerves… have you given any of these guys a second chance?

    Curious though, after 2 dates, if he’s still just blah, how do you handle taking guys OUT of the rotation?

  429.  #429RiverGirl on August 13, 2011 at 9:47 pm

    433: Brenda says:

    “I feel like a starving woman who is stumbling around a land in drought, looking for food.”

    Brenda, have you tried doing “The Work” on that thought?

    “I feel like a starving woman who is stumbling around a land in drought, looking for food.”
    …..Is that true?

    “I feel like a starving woman who is stumbling around a land in drought, looking for food.”
    …..Is that absolutely true?

    How does it make you feel when you think the thought “I feel like a starving woman who is stumbling around a land in drought, looking for food.”?

    How would you feel if you didn’t have that thought?

    Now turn it around.


  430.  #430English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 12:29 am

    Thanks for all the tips and tricks on downloading youtubes to convert to MP3’s Plum and Marina.

    I really appreciated it and now have quite a little stash to keep me going.

  431.  #431Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 12:36 am


    I am starving for love and affection. I feel horrible. I am starved.

  432.  #432Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 12:38 am

    Inotherwords, it’s absolutely true. I have had a huge void of human interaction in my life.

  433.  #433Butterfly Wings on August 14, 2011 at 12:43 am

    Hey Brenda. Could it be that you feel that way because you’re trying to get it from a man who is not capable of giving it to you? (((Brenda)))

  434.  #434Butterfly Wings on August 14, 2011 at 12:53 am

    In other words, you’re trying to drink from a dry riverbed? Hugs xxx

  435.  #435English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 1:09 am

    Brenda I so know where you are coming from because I too am starved of love and affection and want the kind of relationship you describe.

    Isn’t that what CD’ing is all about? Getting yourself out there and making yourself available to attract this two sided relationship? What happened to the 45 guys who contacted you on the dating site?

    I try and STOP the negative thoughts about no love in my life because that only leads to misery and depression.

    Somebody on here posted a link which I now can’t find, but what you do is write down all the qualities you like about Ryan and all the things you don’t like, then you put it away for a day or 2, then you write another list of the ideal man and or/relationship you are looking for, put that in the drawer too, then in a few more days you get the 2 lists out and compare them……… Ryan REALLY the ideal man giving you the relationship you want or not? It was called something like smashing the pedestal, and I think Plum sent it out as a video link.

    I have been listening a lot to Byron Katie this past week and have found so much meaning in the youtubes, have you tried them out yet? It COULD change your whole thoughts about Ryan…………….

  436.  #436English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 1:15 am

    Brenda {{{{ HUGS }}}}

    For you and anybody else, I have only just started to listen to this 5 part series on seeking love and approval, but so far it seems really good:

  437.  #437Plum on August 14, 2011 at 2:08 am

    444: Barb

    You are welcome. My tips are not only for youtube but for any video on most sites.


  438.  #438English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 2:10 am

    OOooh just went back to POF and I am soooo nervous and scared, WTH is that all about?? I only lasted on there 5 minutes, it makes me feel so vulnerable. 🙁

  439.  #439Plum on August 14, 2011 at 2:13 am


    *** It was called something like smashing the pedestal, and I think Plum sent it out as a video link.***


  440.  #440English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 2:15 am

    I think I feel safer being on my own in my little flat doing my own thing, maybe I don’t even REALLY want a real relationship anymore??


    Am I so scared of getting hurt again???

    But I listened to Byron Katie yesterday and she said (like Rori) it’s all about what “I” want…….so why do I feel so powerless when I get on the dating sites? And why are some of these men so inarticulate?

    And one just told me (when I said no thanks politely to him) I should lower my standards!!! So I blocked him!!! How rude!!!

    NO I will NOT lower my standards, thank you very much, I will HIGHER them!!

    Now I feel teary and sad and angry at rude people and I know I am far too sensitive but I am working on that……………

    OK off to get ready now to catch up with a BIG group of women for lunch – all of them married except for me but I won’t dwell on that because they may envy me and my freedom and their husbands might not be nice, but I don’t know as I’ve never met them before but 4 of us were on a social network type list 15 years ago and we have kept in touch but never met, so I will have a fun day and be happy and kind to myself, because (tossing my hair like Andi McDowell) I AM WORTH IT!!

  441.  #441RiverGirl on August 14, 2011 at 2:18 am

    @ 445:
    Brenda “I am starving for love and affection. I feel horrible. I am starved.”

    Brenda, I know that feeling, and I have often had very similar thoughts (as most of us probably have) and it causes a lot of suffering.

    I’ve only recently being paying attention to Byron Katie and the difference I feel is enormous. Her gentle way of getting you to examine the thoughts that you are having really allows you to get to what is true…for YOU.

    She doesn’t ask you not to have thoughts but she asks you to examine them and to imagine what it would feel like if you didn’t believe that thought.

    Could you ask yourself that? What would it feel like if you didn’t believe that thought that you are starving for love and affection?

  442.  #442RiverGirl on August 14, 2011 at 2:22 am

    typo only recently BEEN paying attention

  443.  #443RiverGirl on August 14, 2011 at 2:24 am

    455: English Woman says:
    “And why are some of these men so inarticulate?”

    So you don’t pick one of them by mistake!! 😉

  444.  #444Ella on August 14, 2011 at 2:45 am

    Brenda re 446

    That is easily fixed.

    Go and get some company.


    For me I feel better when I stop focusing on what I don’t have, and start focusing on what I do have… the date that wanted to cuddle me, the men who call me, my friend who I can have deep, intellectual conversations with, my friend who I can laugh with.


    Maybe try focusing on something else when you can.

    Hpw would it feel to work on your food issues? I just feel curious as I have tendancies to use food to avoid my emotions too, and now that I am detoxing, I just don’t feel so afraid of my emotions.

    ON my websie there is information about weight loss as connected to emotions, and today I am adding some more nutrition advice.

    There are also behaviour change tools for changing habits.

    If you are interested.


  445.  #445English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 2:58 am

    #458 River Girl

    I likey 😀

    Thank you.

  446.  #446English Woman on August 14, 2011 at 3:01 am

    #459 Ella

    I am interested in hearing about your detox (but not for todays lunch LOL!!) will you be putting it up on your website?

    I did one before with shop bought products for the liver, kidneys, intestines and something else and was violentally ill and the product was herbal, so am not wanting to go down that path again…..

    I like your site BTW, it feels nice and gentle and Sireny. 🙂

  447.  #447Ella on August 14, 2011 at 3:31 am

    English Woman,

    I am doing The Fast Track Detox by Dr Ann Louise Gittleman.

    There are no supplements or anything… it is just using food and liquids.

    Basically there is a 7 day prequal to the detox where you cut out lots of things like refined carbs, caffeine and sugar. And you eat lots of fruit and veggies, consume lots of water and eat a small amount of high quality protein each day.

    Then there is a 1 day fast where you drink only her ‘miracle juice’ which is a concoction you make up yourself using just natural ingredients.

    And then there is a 3 day sequal to kind of lock in the results.

    You are also encouraged to choose organic foods.

    I will put a link to her website on mine at some point today.

    I like it because it feels quite natural and gentle and like a good way to eat.

    I had not thought to blog about the detox, and now you have suggested it I might do.



  448.  #448Ella on August 14, 2011 at 3:35 am

    Ummm, I had this dream where I was going out with this older guy, and he was some kind of gangsta (I know, I know… but it was just a dream 😉 )

    Anyway it felt really nice.

    And the things that felt nice about it were that he was totaly into me, and just wanted to be with me no questions asked.

    And I felt safe and protected.

    And still excited cus of the bad boy side.

    And I was just happily playing doing Siren stuff.

  449.  #449Daria on August 14, 2011 at 3:37 am

    thank you Daria for washing my feet

    thenk you for putting medicine on my burn

    tanky ou for putting plantain on my itch

    thank you for massaging and brushing my hair

    tannk you for brushing my teeth

    than yuo for eating breakfast

    thank you for doing exercises last nite

    thank you for walking friend through stranger exercise

    tank you for looiking up info on herbs im interested in

    thank nyou for writig on blog

  450.  #450Butterfly Wings on August 14, 2011 at 3:59 am

    Eeeek! I have nothing to wear to the races on Wednesday! TH has offered to buy me something so I’m going shopping tomorrow… awww! He steps up
    AGAIN! 🙂

    I’ve not been to the races in over 15 years, so this’ll be interesting…. I want to look sexy but sophisticated! I hope I can pull it off! :-\

  451.  #451RiverGirl on August 14, 2011 at 4:06 am

    @ 465
    Just think Audrey Hepburn and you can’t go wrong.

  452.  #452Femininewoman on August 14, 2011 at 4:11 am

    English Woman I have read where that kind of thing can happen, you get worse before you get better. Reason being you body is breaking down toxins that get into your blood before passing out of your body. I experienced something like that when I was doing colon cleanses with fasting. At one point in time it felt like I had malaria. Then my nostrils filled with what I can only describe as glue looking stuff. After the last cleanse I filled up again and when I blew it out. That was the end of it for the period. It is was like it went from clogged to totally clear and breathing clear air deeply leaving me feeling really vibrant.

  453.  #453Femininewoman on August 14, 2011 at 4:12 am

    Anyone else experiencing severe thunderstorms

  454.  #454Femininewoman on August 14, 2011 at 4:21 am

    Mel “I feel really flattered by the attention and enjoyed your company but I don’t feel it is a match. It is a gut feeling”. I would tell him over the phone when he calls looking for a date. Hopefully you have not given out personal info like work and home.

  455.  #455Femininewoman on August 14, 2011 at 4:31 am

    EW What are the standards?

  456.  #456flower on August 14, 2011 at 4:40 am

    ella, thanx , i aprecciate…. i feel sad not ok and i havent felt like this about him for long now , maybe its because on monday he was looking at me , even into my eyes and last nite well i was only out 1 and half hr , there weren’t many familiar faces, first i saw one guy whos good as friend (yes he happens to be friend of this guy and he has asked me openly to try and have sex which i turned down i said that felt uncomfortable ) so i talked a little with him,

    then i saw a bouncer guy i know long time he used to work at another place (a black guy,good guy not like bounces, a married one and can talk normally like educated person)

    then i noticed this guy looking at me as i talked to the bouncer ,and i didnt even notice him in there before , i was in the conversation with the bouncer so i did see this guy looked at me but didnt smile or anything – i didnt register he looked at me , u know, then he turned his back at me and the old story of him not coming to say hi or anything , then after a while of him dancing he danced bit sexy with a girl, it was really not even a couple of mins but triggered me more and u know i really think if i was ugly and in a shorter than short skirt and was brainless thats what he would like and it makes me sad too

  457.  #457Femininewoman on August 14, 2011 at 4:56 am

    RE 471 Where are you meeting these guys?

    Is it possible to expand the places you go to meet men?

  458.  #458Ella on August 14, 2011 at 6:21 am

    Englishwoman – PS

    Thanks for the compliment re my website.

    It is getting consistent visitors now and I am feeling so excited doing it.


  459.  #459Ella on August 14, 2011 at 6:24 am

    FW – Yes I have heard that this is common too when a person starts a detox.

    For me I am likely to experience headaches, aching limbs and muscles, a sore throat and just a general kind of icky feeling, similar to mild flu symptoms I guess.

    I have no doubt it is the toxins being releases from my system and I am planning to flush them all out.


  460.  #460Jade on August 14, 2011 at 6:32 am

    Ella, could you please re-post a link to your website? I’d really like to take a look at it. Merci! 🙂

  461.  #461Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 7:54 am

    Butterfly Wings,

    RE: #447 – Yes, it is true that Ryan is a dry riverbed. I keep trying to bring back the beautiful moments we shared in 2009, which were the happiest of my life:

    – Talking almost continuously for 12 hours during a day trip to the beach, feeling so connected.
    – Dancing in the kitchen while cooking spaghetti. He came up behind me and kissed my neck, then turned me around to dance together!
    – Listening to half a Michael Bolton album while laying on our sides gazing at each other
    – Moments in bed cuddling, having pillow talk, and touching

    So I am going to do my best to walk away, and keep my eyes open for another man who will touch me as deeply as Ryan.

  462.  #462Ice Princess on August 14, 2011 at 7:59 am

    It so hard though Brenda to walk away. I have been thinking a lot about the possibility of walking away from LP, but I cant bear the thought of it because there are still little bits of good.

  463.  #463Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:00 am

    English Woman,

    RE: #450 – I appreciate your thoughts and ideas for me. I am contacting the men on the list of 45 one at a time. I never expected such a huge response, and so now I am dating them as my time allows. Unfortunately, the attrition rate is high. Oh well. I can only date one at a time. And some of them were not serious dating material. I was astounded at how many young men contacted me in their 20s! Two were even 19! And I’m a 47 yo, extra buttery woman! But I don’t take those seriously.

    I have been knocking Ryan’s pedestal down myself. But that does sound like a good exercise. I’ve been making those lists in my mind for decades, so I know pretty much what I like about Ryan and what I don’t. It’s the sensitivity and intelligence that I am a sucker for, more than anything else.

    I listened to Byron Katie’s one video that was posted on here, and I liked it a lot. I intend to listen to more.

    Love, Brenda

  464.  #464Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:02 am

    Ice Princess,

    RE: #477 – Right, it is hard to walk away. I am going to try. If he contacts me, fine, I’ll take it as it comes. But I am retripling my efforts to not initiate contact. And he contacts me very seldom.

  465.  #465Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:10 am


    RE: #456 – I will consider what you said as I listen to Byron Katie videos. However, you have no idea how vulnerable I feel simply writing that. Just recognizing I am starving emotionally is like a major life revelation, which identifies the core of MOST of my issues:

    – Overeating
    – Begging Ryan for crumbs
    – Depression
    – Excessive sleepiness (escaping the pain)

    I could go on and on. I believe if you identify a problem, that is half of the solution. I think I am really onto something here. So the next step is how do I feel full emotionally? I need to be around men who are safe, not the typical jack-a$$ I end up dating. Friendships with women are fantastic, and I appreciate the women in my life. But what I need is touching, and that is something I can only look to a man for.

    Gar is my new CD who is coming on strong, and I am thinking he might be a very good ticket to filling my empty love tank. We haven’t met yet, but it is looking good!

  466.  #466Ella on August 14, 2011 at 8:11 am


    🙂 xoxox

  467.  #467Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:13 am


    RE: #459 – I have been dating, just not finding a real good crop, as I addressed in my post above this one. It’s in process.

    Where is your website? Can you link it to your name by writing it under your name and email address here on the blog?

  468.  #468Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:17 am


    Re: #464 – When I read your “Thank You” posts to yourself, I feel soothed and secure. Your life seems so orderly! I like how you take care of yourself! You are a good role model to me! 🙂

  469.  #469RiverGirl on August 14, 2011 at 8:23 am

    @ 480
    I love your vulnerability Brenda

  470.  #470Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 8:23 am


    RE: #467-468 – I can relate to what you said about your nasal passages clearing thru detox. In the late 80’s, I lost 90 lbs (down to 150 lbs!) by eating mostly fruits and vegetables. During the process, (this is gonna sound gross!) I woke up one morning with the most gigantic piece of phlem that fell down into my throat. It was flat and dry on one side, which indicates it was stuck to my palate, probably for years!

    Detox with fruits and veggies is so the way to go! They have high water content, and they cleanse us from the inside out. I look forward to getting back on a regular program when I have enough money and enough refrigerator space again. In the meantime, I am struggling with too much carbs and low quality food from the foodbank.

  471.  #471Esteemed on August 14, 2011 at 8:39 am

    Lots of thunderstorms here!

  472.  #472Esteemed on August 14, 2011 at 8:48 am

    I am not new here. I am trying to get this up and running.

  473.  #473Jade on August 14, 2011 at 9:22 am

    Thanks so much, Ella! 🙂

  474.  #474Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 9:23 am

    Where’d everyone go??

  475.  #475T-Girl on August 14, 2011 at 10:01 am

    Wish me luck – today is my relationship talk that I am hosting for my local meetup group. My guy will be there too. It will be nervewracking to have him there but good at the same time. I like that he wants to be there. Maybe we both will open up to each other a bit more since we will be in a group setting.

  476.  #476Laughing goddess on August 14, 2011 at 10:06 am


    When I am feeling stuck and depressed in my life, something that really helps is getting out there and helping other people. The caveat is…it can’t be “doing” for men who we have romantic interests in. Other than that, there is nothing better than volunteering and helping other people in need.

    It’s great for curing obsession and addictive behaviors.

    I would recommend going to a homeless shelter and helping with the soup line. There is nothing more powerful than the feeling of giving to people and making a difference in their lives.

    I know you have a giving nature with animals and I would recommend now focusing that energy towards humans. That will cure your loneliness fast. You will be out there helping and giving to people which will quickly take your focus off of your problems and Ryan.

    You might find that you start to feel a lot of gratitude for what you do have. You might find the weight pouring off as you direct your energy towards being of service for people in need.

    I remember you listing some of your ideal jobs. What if you started doing those voluntarily?

    Now I know, I know all these excuses are coming up…I can’t do this because I need to spend that time looking for a job…blah blah blah. The mind can come up with all kinds of excuses.

  477.  #477Laughing goddess on August 14, 2011 at 10:08 am


    Yet those excuses just keep us stuck.

  478.  #478Brenda on August 14, 2011 at 10:21 am


    RE: #491 – Thanks! Yes, I have been doing that sort of thing all my life. Volunteering is a part of my living and breathing! I am already involved in a lot of ways. Except for the soup kitchen…right now I am going there myself. And feeling the shame and degradation that goes with it. They would never want me as a volunteer. I am less than human in their eyes.

  479.  #479Laughing goddess on August 14, 2011 at 10:26 am

    “They would never want me as a volunteer. I am less than human in their eyes.”

    Is it possible that this is just a limiting belief and in fact, untrue?

    I think that they would have great respect for you if you volunteered to help out there.

  480.  #480Laughing goddess on August 14, 2011 at 10:29 am

    I feel very inspired right now to do some more volunteering. I have been wanting to eventually transition my career towards doing some kind of coaching, yet I feel a lot of fear and unworthiness around that. I can see now that doing it voluntarily will help me get past that.

    I feel so excited! Thank you Brenda for helping me to see this !!!

  481.  #481Daria on August 14, 2011 at 10:47 am

    wow Brenda i feel like crying reading taht because my life doesn NOT feel orderly

    i feel so ANGRY AN D FRUSTRATED at myself for not getting it together and feeling fully alive

    in every moment i feel sad because all i wanna do is be in the flashing lights and dance dance dance

    i feel sobbing right now

    i feel like PUnching stuff because i awnt to move to new york NOW

    and i dont know how the fuchk that is gonna
    happen and

    i feel scared and guilty taht i have pe
    ople around right now and it feels prtty good but


    no what feels good is when im out going clubbing

    and then i feel fear taht i will feel lke a total loner trying to go clubbing as i will have to basically go by myself which is what ahppns to me i
    n the bay


    feel so much frustration and jealousy for my girl i see on fb who is constatly seemiung liek she is where the party is at or has people inviting her places – even though her scene is
    a bit different than what i want –

    and i know she has her own issues like she feels inable to make money so she worked as a an escort before but dammt

    i want to be social butterfly gir;1!!!

    my gf from here from way back was telling me how when i was young and i would come here to see my grandparents the whole neighborhood would be excited for a week, like Daria is coming, Daria is coming

    no wonder i felt like a star!

    i didnt even know they got liek that!

    i want that

    and constantly every moment of my life!!
    except the moments i want to rest


    i feel so icky thinking of goiuing back to my parents house to feel drained and stuck and terrible

    no bueno

    but who is gonna let me live with them”???

    if im so great why is nobody offering?

    and if its so clear cut when will it manifest for me?

    i manifested free food and free weed everyday and pretty much teh transportation but now i want a place to live and i mean not outsideeee

    somewhere without a lot of cigareette smoke and where i can rest and travel
    when i want and have people come see me!

    an i feel scared that im gonna feel lonely… i feel saddd!!!


  482.  #482Daria on August 14, 2011 at 10:51 am

    okay i WANT this place to manifest

    a place in the bay AND in new york and EASY and all that fun i want yes yes yes

    and new york guy is making fb stautses like if i was your best friend i want u around all the time

    and im like damn that would feel so good cuz hed provide that fun for me but i still wouldnt want to feel lonely

    i still want to be whre people want to dance and celebrate all the time

    and im like dammit i wish he wanted to be /MY fuchkinm best friend

    and thinking if i live in new york eh p
    robably wouldnt even wind up coming to see me or hanging out with me

    and i might wind up feeling lonely THERE



    and those thoughts dont feel good i see

    im like hitting myself
    having attack tho

    i intent do HAVE what i want!!

    yes yes yes!!


    it feels bad and thank u and i intend to have what i want ANYWAY

  483.  #483Daria on August 14, 2011 at 10:54 am

    i think a lot of this feeling has to do with not having sex or being held or stimulated sexually

    i would love to be able to fulfill my sexual needs!

    but i feel kinda bored and lack o energy thinking of doing it myself, kinda like i do with exercisign

    i guess a part of me does NOT want to feel fully good

    maybe cuz of my dad

    and i lvoe me anyway and i intend to feel fully good

  484.  #484Daria on August 14, 2011 at 11:06 am

    this feeling feels like middleschool where i just waited and waited and felt like i was wasting away and would just not be able to take it anymore

    just knowing taht evenutally i would start to have friends and be invited places and like this friend of mie said – eventualy everyone winds up hanging out where they fit in

    where just one small night/day i knew was my opportunity to make all teh difference and gain a whole group of friends and make a new life

    but it seemed like teh opportunities never came

    and i was always by myself, shadow walking and acting like its the same as if doig it with a lot of people

    i feel like a LOSER and weirdo doing it by myself!
    i feel like that going out by myself , taking the bus by myself

    really doing a lot of stuff by myself

    but i do it anyways

    and i also feel cool about it and brag to people about all the stuff i Dare do by myself that they never would

    but then they have someone to do it with1!!

    i feel like im being tortured

    i love my feelings!!!

  485.  #485Daria on August 14, 2011 at 11:09 am

    i think this feeling may even be from before that when i felt left out alone in my room while my parents partied in the other room

  486.  #486Jade on August 14, 2011 at 11:22 am

    I’m feeling freaking