Trying New Things and New Places to Be Where a New Man Can Find You

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Here’s a great question that’s so common – so speaks to all of us when we’re in a painful place with a man who’s withdrawing or who we’ve actually “broken up” with – where we don’t know whether to avoid him or confront him, or pretend he doesn’t exist:

“Rori, I do have some questions though: We attend the same small church and he usually ushers. I don’t want to stop going to church but feel that he may think I am checking up on him and feel pressured. What should I do?”

One thing I ALWAYS recommend around a man you’re not sure of or trying to detach from is this: Experiment by trying out new gyms, new churches, new spots to eat lunch and hang out in the workplace…basically, yes, changing your routines completely.

Think about it – if he’s at that church – you could go two different ways at the same time:

1. You could see him at church as a doorpost, a picture on the wall, a person who is no longer relevant to you but is still a human being, a man who delivered his “Message” to you and is now no longer useful, a lump in a pew, a whisper of some old pattern you once had, a memory, a made-up belief, a future “acquaintance,” a visiting triggering mechanism….so many ways to look at him and not get too flustered and still enjoy the church you go to….and

2. Maybe knowing that he’ll be present in church – a place that’s meant to be sacred and safe, where you can open up to God and your fellow worshipers – maybe that’s a MESSAGE that you’d serve yourself better at a DIFFERENT church.

Perhaps going to 5(!) new churches and trying them all out would be fabulous for you!

Same with gyms – almost all of them have free trial periods and free days, and think of all the new folks you might meet doing this.

Same with taking yourself to church classes and choirs and meetings and restaurants and bars and hangouts and volunteer groups and even learning to play pool and watch sports on the big screen at sports bars – try everything anywhere near where you live or work. You’ll widen your world!

If you take just a moment to look at every sticky situation – you can find a whole bunch of “perspectives” to see it from. You can see it from a place of pain or a place of opportunity. You can see it as a place of frustration or a place of learning.

You can put a positive “spin” on almost anything – and even if you don’t believe it because the positive spin may not be all that believable – or even factual – at least it’s a new way to look at it.

It gives you enough distance so that you can either move toward it and take it on and get triggered and deal with it and see how you feel – or you can step away and avoid it.

In fact – you can not only AVOID some things – you can go so far in another direction that you end up in a COMPLETELY NEW PLACE!

You can end up in a strange place. Unknown. Mysterious. Scary. And maybe even rich with possibility.

Yeah, you could end up feeling off balance, or you could have a good experience.

Let’s call this Circular Dating with the World.

Instead of thinking of Circular Dating as just having to do with men…how ’bout we think of it as constantly opening to new experiences and possibilities just for the exercise?

So you don’t think of it as a “gamble.” It’s not a “trial,” or a “look see,” it’s those things possibility – but more importantly – it’s just an EXPERIENCE.

If you go to your regular church you know he’ll likely be there. You won’t know what’ll happen or what you’ll feel or how you’ll feel an hour later.

If you stay home you’ll feel powerless and angry and awful. So forget that one.

But what if you go to a DIFFERENT church?

Who KNOWS what’ll happen there?. You have no agenda – nothing except anticipation of either fun or boredom or loneliness – and so you can’t “steel” yourself for anything.

If you find yourself shutting down around a new experience – then you can catch that and use it to practice with.

The old boyfriend doesn’t even have to be in the picture. He’s USELESS, remember? There’s just no more need to practice on HIM!

The drive we feel for closure and confrontation and to tie things up neat in a bow is just not going to happen in church. And it’s a non-serving drive to begin with.

(I know that some really, really like the way confrontation feels, that it feels like “closure” and so it feels good and complete, and that the opposite for them is “stuffing” – and so I don’t want to close the door on “confrontation” when it’s helpful.)

And I don’t want to close the door on going to church if there’s going to be a special speaker you’ve always wanted to hear, or if you’re in the mood to ride your horse right into the pews and stay on it no matter what happens (lovely image, I think…).

But I’d much rather make the case for using this situation to try something new. All that energy being used in service to you – and riding your horse THERE – is SO much more powerful than chasing down confrontation and closure.

No matter how you look at it – one’s the past, and one’s the future. And if you want to confront something that’s past – there’s certainly no urgency to it – so why not use the “push” of a painful situation to ride yourself further down your gameboard and keep Happy Ever After in sight?

This is my vision for you. You can always go back. Always go backward. The opportunities and impetus to move forward, though – show up as messages I want you to read.

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Lucy on March 23, 2010 at 8:16 pm

    I really like this! Circular dating the world. 🙂

    That’s exactly how I have been feeling lately. Not that I have anyone I need to avoid right now, but that I need a change — an adventure.

    Many years ago, I actually transferred to a different college at the opposite side of the state just to get away from a charming boyfriend who kept pulling me back with his magnetism every time I broke up with him! It proved to be a new adventure that I did not regret. (He actually drove the six hours to my new college a couple times to try to win me back! He almost succeeded, he was almost irresistible – and he asked me to marry him — but by then I had a new boyfriend who I really liked.)

    So, I think Rori’s ideas here are great. 🙂


  2.  #2Orna Walters on March 23, 2010 at 11:15 pm


    This is sooooo powerful and important and put so lovingly. CHANGE is the thing to embrace when we’re looking to heal.



  3.  #3Honey on March 24, 2010 at 1:34 am

    Amen to that Rori! Great post. There really are so many ways to look at a situation and I love the idea of Circular Dating the world. I feel like one should avoid ‘past message men’ especially when you still feel for them because it easily can become about them and not you. Trying new things and trusting yourself to go through it with love is the way forward for me. From my own experience, I didn’t realize how small my world became until I stepped out of it. No expectiations just trust and an open heart. Have a beautiful day to you all !

  4.  #4DocK on March 24, 2010 at 7:12 am

    I felt interested in the part about “confrontation” and “closure” especially in light of the other post about Kate.

    I did have “confrontation” and it was actually helpful. Before it happened, I felt stuck. I understand the grieving process for something and accepting “over” and feeling the soup of feelings but I also didn’t feel moving forward. When the “encounter” happened, I realized that there was something I believed that wasn’t true. It didn’t change the other reality, that this person would just be a “messenger” and on the back of my horse if I wanted him there, but the information that had been passed on to me was the most painful part and it wasn’t even correct. Realizing that, standing there in front of him at that time, I then felt a “click” in my heart and I was just looking at him and hearing words that I realized didn’t matter and that thing happened that Rori talks about – I felt bored.

    It was at that point that I felt healing begin. It was also probably different from Kate, however, because I knew the conversation wasn’t something I wanted because I thought I could convince him or him me of anything or that there was some sort of opportunity to be together again. I just knew that some misinformation was circulating and it didn’t feel good. The clarity helped, for me.

  5.  #5Ada on March 24, 2010 at 7:41 am

    Rori, (and everyone) I have a question. I broke up with my long distance man a week ago and I only feel like hanging around the house, having baths, taking care of my young child and doing nothing else constructive. I realise that this won’t help in the long run and pretty soon I’m going to have to get out there and circular date and get back on my horse of what I love to do but just now it feels far away and I want to do nothing but brood on it. Is it healthy to have a period of this before dusting yourself off and getting up again?

  6.  #6Pam on March 24, 2010 at 8:28 am

    Ada – here are some quotes that are helpful to me when feeling this way (and I do often). They are from Wayne Dyer’s book the Power of Intention:

    “You are always a valuable, worthwhile human being — not because anybody says so, not because you’re successful, not because you make a lot of money — but because you decide to believe it and for no other reason.”

    “The state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind.”

    “Be miserable. Or motivate yourself. Whatever has to be done, it’s always your choice.”

    I am learning how to set positive intentions daily instead of the negative ones that my mind seems stuck on. I find it really helps to always reflect on what you are grateful for. When you do this, your thinking will eventually shift.

    “I appreciate all that I am and all that I have.”

    “Stop focusing on what you do not have, and shift your consciousness to an appreciation for all that you are and all that you do have.”

    I am on the same journey. Learning to love yourself is the best gift you can give to you and your child 🙂

  7.  #7Jennifer on March 24, 2010 at 10:40 am

    I am sooooo doing this right now.
    I wrote about it in another thread and the universe has certainly helped me along!
    I went to a women’s self defence class with my sister. We entered a contest and SHE WON her 8 week class FREEEEE!!!
    She emailed me to say she wanted to split MY cost with me so we could both go!
    Hello Universe!
    I cant wait to get my tax refund…I’m buying big bad boots..
    I also feel good to be responsible and have my car worked on.
    And pay off some bills.
    But REALLY!?!!??!

  8.  #8Simply Shannon on March 24, 2010 at 1:20 pm

    Yes! Dating the world! Just doing something, anything different really opens me up to exploring even more new things. So many times before I would feel stuck in a rut and keep doing the same things over and over. I’ve finally realized it’s just taking that one step, just doing one different thing can make all of the difference.

    Jennifer: I feel so excited for you! All these things you are doing are getting you out into the world, having fun for YOU. I just know your guy is going to show up when you least expect it doing something in your normal, new-every-day life. And bad-ass boots sound awesome!

  9.  #9Siena on March 24, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    “Instead of thinking of Circular Dating as just having to do with men…how ’bout we think of it as constantly opening to new experiences and possibilities just for the exercise?”

    This is just what I needed to hear. My CD dates are boring the heck out of me, and I don’t want to spend any time with them at all! So I’ve been finding new and fun things to do with family and friends, which makes me feel really great. But I’m just not in to the guys who are in my life at the moment.

    I’m hoping this is just a stage, and I’m practicing telling them that they are boring me, which is really good for me, because I’ve been the “too nice” girl for way too long.

    Everything in its season, right?


  10.  #10Goodheart on March 24, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    It’s hard to circular date when no one is asking me out 🙁 I feel blue.

    Men were contacting me, but when I wrote back not one responded. Not even one. I’m talking close to 10 men & not one followed up after their initial email. And now, the past few days, there has been no activity at all. It’s like I have become invisible.

    I just hid my profile.

    The rejection is making me feel bad. I just want to forget about all of it & do nothing.

  11.  #11Goodheart on March 24, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    I feel like the universe is telling that I’m not loveable.

    I hate this feeling because I know it’s not true.

    But I still feel it.

  12.  #12dorothea on March 24, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    goodheart, you are CLEARLY loveable. <3

  13.  #13Ada on March 24, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    Goodheart, I am struggling with the internet dating scene too. The men just drift off really quick and they aren’t even the ones I like! The ones I like make no contact at all. I’m not bad looking, not mad, don’t really get it but it’s not good for the self esteem I agree x x

  14.  #14Goodheart on March 24, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    Ada, yes it’s the ones I’m not interested in that seem to blow me off too. This is very new to me. I feel like the universe just bonked me on the head & I have no idea why. Things have shifted in my life & I feel confused & kind of empty inside. What is wrong with these guys? Part of me feels like saying, hey stupid, what are you thinking passing me by when you made the first contact? I wonder if it is their self-esteem issues? Like they feel there is no way they could keep our interest so they flee.

    I just feel tired. Tired of all of it.

    Dorothea – thank you 🙂 hugs

  15.  #15Turtle Girl on March 24, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    I have had the same experience with online guys. They contact you, then if you don’t pick up the ball and run with it, they fade off. Are all of them feminine energy men? Fuck. It is just ridiculous. I tell them I don’t call men and they scold me for that! Like it is bad manners of something not the call them! Weird.

    Or we have a few emails, they learn I have a degree, am an artist, am smart and own my own house, etc etc, and they just fade off. Feel they aren’t good enough? I don’t get it. Where are all the high self esteem, good men who will call and be a real man.
    I haven’t met too many lately.

  16.  #16Siena on March 24, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    OK there, must be something in the air because TG, I could have written the EXACT same post as you did…

    I’m feeling blue also. Really for the first time since M and I broke up about 2 months ago now. I’m feeling like the “right” combo – masculine man, wants me, wants a real relationship, I’m in receiving mode, high self esteem, etc. etc. — is a pipe dream.

    And I’m feeling like I could *kick* myself, because M was that masculine man, and I short circuited the attraction because I hadn’t dealt with my own low self esteem issues and was overfunctioning. And I felt really certain that he would call – he hasn’t even called!! All the other guys (before I knew of Rori’s tools) at least CALLED after the breakup!

    For these past 2 months, I really felt like I was on the right path. I’ve been feeling good, healing myself, closing doors that needed to be closed… and then, today, blah! And if I have to tell ONE MORE man why I won’t drive 50 miles to meet him for coffee… I swear, I might just go join a convent!

    Rori, is this part of the process? Is this the darkness before the dawn? What do I do? I feel like crying…


  17.  #17Siena on March 24, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    Goodheart, the Universe can’t tell you you’re unlovable, because it’s totally NOT true. All the same, I know how you feel – I’m in the same boat as you are… it sucks. Get me off this boat!

    I had the thought (today?) that my story is of the woman who is always breaking up with someone. But I DON’T WANT that to be my story anymore!

    I met some friends for lunch today and they were asking about what happened with M, and I felt like my response was a script that I’ve told them at least 4 times before, with other men. How depressing!

    I keep thinking – that was then, this is now! This is the new Siena, and that old script doesn’t pertain to me anymore.

    But, unfortunately, for the time being right now, the *new* Siena is attracting feminine men who want me to meet them halfway for coffee… sigh. This won’t do.

    I choose a new script! One where the MOST fabulous man comes along and I can finally receive him and we are both just ecstatic. And I will laugh with those same friends I met today about how much of a boob I used to be… and they’ll shake their heads and wonder at the transformation that took place in me, and wonder how I found such an amazing man who is obviously crazy about me.

    And then I will finally be able to close this chapter in my life. It’s been open WAY WAY WAY too long. Next!!!

  18.  #18EarthDancer on March 24, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    Hi Turtle Girl & Sienna:

    ME TOO! But from Modern Siren Rori says that better & better men will show up because these men are just like helping us “clean out the garage” (us) so to speak LOL

    And Turtle Girl, if they reply in an icky way when I say I don’t call men, I say calling men feels like masculine energy and I like feeling ‘girlie’…what do they think? Almost all of them have said they like me feeling ‘girlie’…and I also just flat out say I don’t drive out of town to meet men, it doesn’t feel safe…

    I just had an online guy call me and it felt like I was being interviewed!! Like one question right after another and there was no level 2 listening to respond to!!!!!and he said then we’re obviously not suited ’cause he just wants to get to know me. I replied I feel like it was less of a conversation and more of an interview and that didn’t feel good…so good-bye!!

    Don’t give up! YOU are the prize…xoxox

  19.  #19EarthDancer on March 24, 2010 at 7:12 pm

    JENNIFER: buy the boots!! Yeah, you can always be responsible about things that need to be done… but love yourself first…I’m feeling so happy that your sister is splitting the cost of the self-defense class with you…YIPPEE!! 🙂 Maybe you could use the money you are saving on the boots!

    GOODHEART: I am experiencing the same and I am feeling discouraged but Rori says there will be an ebb & flow…

    In Targeting Mr. Right, Rori says to keep your first online reply simple & mention something about his profile or his photo then…write “I’m intrigued” and your name…THEN if he responds write back that you’d love finding out more about him but you don’t like emailing a lot but that you can be reached at 555-5555…Make it EASY for you, don’t put in too much effort….

    xoxox hugs to all of you

  20.  #20heather on March 24, 2010 at 7:16 pm

    Simply Shannon: “Just doing something, anything different really opens me up to exploring even more new things.” — Exactly!! I notice this happening with me as well, it’s a process of discovery and a little sprint of a fun new experience inspires more fun experiences! It makes us better people and more interesting to others. Lately I stumbled on an article called “Ten tremendous Women Who Never Married.”, authored by Samara O’Shea. I found it very inspiring – these ladies had amazing and full lives. Role models….

  21.  #21EarthDancer on March 24, 2010 at 7:27 pm


    *hugs* to you; I have my days when I want to give up too…I had a guy like your “M” who pursued me, was sweet, romantic, we had a lot in common…I was afraid, I didn’t want to ruin it…but in retrospect, I closed myself off by trying to appear like I wasn’t too eager…I call him “Hot Tub Man”… he was the most romantic man I’d ever met…but he faded away…I still get a twinge when I think of him or see a car like his…he just wasn’t Mr. Right (even though I wanted the possibility that maybe he was)…blah! I would at least like to go out with a man more than for coffee…none of my CD have gone past that stage… I just have faith in Rori that all these experiences are making me ready for Mr. Right when he shows up…meanwhile the waiting SUCKS!!


  22.  #22Tina on March 24, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    or a can of peas on a shelf at the corner store 🙂 A visiting triggering mechanism. I love these baby steps. I mean if someone told me just to think about him as a can of peas on shelf, I’m sure I would have tried it that way then cried or whatever later, thinking about him without first knowing why he triggers me the way he does. What this FEELING is an why I was so stuck in that feeling, I love my sad , lonely worthless feeling 🙂 <<<<is not love. A man told me today that I was beautiful 🙂 I said thank you I feel good hearing that compliment. He seemed quite pleased with himself.

  23.  #23heather on March 24, 2010 at 11:24 pm

    from home: woke up in the middle of the night. feeling frustrated that I haven’t done more “exploring” and wanting to experience more, join more groups, be more involved in life … feeling a little empty now. Probably means i will (or at least want to) attract more. Saw parents last night and that triggers me in so many ways. When they asked about my bf, it’s SO simple – he’s missing in action now and I need/want to be circular dating more. Feeling insulated and isolated a bit. Feeling like I need to re-adjust my reality of “happy ever after” and get that more on my radar screen than this long-range “purgatory” I seem to be experiencing.

  24.  #24Lucy on March 24, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    I feel SO excited!!!

    I felt really discouraged most of the day today, like some others of you, feeling like the relationship I want is never gonna happen… 🙁

    But I got out of bed in the middle of the night cuz I couldn’t sleep and I had a NEW IDEA for my online dating profile: opening with a request for a computer genius to help me set up my blog. Hey, I have been looking high and low on the site for a man who appeals to me, to no avail, so I figured I could use my membership for something useful!! I had given up on finding anyone there, and pretty much given up on dating as a whole.

    After I changed my profile, before returning to bed, I decided to take a quick look around to see if anyone new turned up in a search. I was so shocked! Here was a new guy who was good-looking, good age, wrote well…. I kept reading, waiting for the expected deal-breakers — but everything kept looking better and better. I started to regret changing my profile, because I was interested in this guy even if he WASN’T a computer genius, and I didn’t want that part of my profile to deter him.

    I finished reading his lengthy main part, then looked at the shorter sections on the side. I almost passed out when I read his JOB section! — The guy is a computer genius!!!! (No, he didn’t call himself a genius, but it was obvious from his job description that he is!!!)

    This is the FIRST guy in TWO YEARS besides TN man who has actually captured my attention!!! I never thought anyone else would.

    I sent him a one sentence email– just a smile across a crowded room — because he wouldn’t find me on there if I didn’t do anything.

    I SO hope he feels interested in me!!! Please root for me, Sirens! I feel encouraged that even if he’s not the One — at least now I know it is possible for someone besides TN man to catch my eye!

    I feel curious about this happening just a couple days after I gave up on circular dating. 🙂

    I feel so grateful for this blog and all of you.


  25.  #25dorothea on March 25, 2010 at 7:12 am

    ugh i am so sick of waking up every morning and the first thought is HIM (the guy i just broke up with). grr grr grr my stomach hurts when this happens.

  26.  #26Linda on March 25, 2010 at 7:14 am

    Hi Been getting caught up out here.

    I have been discouraged about the online thing. You know I hardly even look anymore. I did not have any emails for weeks, I even broke my own rule and wrote some men. NOT ONE responded! hmmmm ok no more leaning forward. I mean one guy deleted the email from me. OH well HIS loss. He could have met a really GREAT woman (ME) !

    I had a guy offer to buy me a glass of wine and I accepted, told him to let me know when and would see if it worked. He NEVER responded! hmmmm

    Gee the manners of some people ! Oh well.

    I have been doing what I want anyway, and it all seems less important now.

    I keep hearing from S. That man confounds me! I wish I did not love him still but I do. He has treated me so badly in the past. He told me he deleted his POF account (which he has said before but didnt)… But low and behold he did. The woman that he was talking to so heavily has hers hidden. Oh well I dont give a crap. He wrote me a looooong email. I wish I could believe it and him. I would feel really good to read what he wrote if that was the case. NOW… I just feel skeptical and unmoved. His emotional hooks did not grab me like they used to. I just have to stop the cycle of all this.

    My not tolerating bad behavior from him or any man feels good. I seems he wants what he cant have. He said he respected me for leaving him. He wants me back… offered appology… invited me to church etc. I love him.. but he has to be good for me. I talked to him on the phone but my energy is different. I am going and doing, speaking my mind and heart to him. I am not going to get sucked in to him again. If .. my saying NO to the less, makes room for the MORE. Inspiring men takes patiences and discernment sometimes. I guess if this guy really means it… and makes me feel great, and ever gets it right by me he might get the goddess, only he has to try really hard because he has done so much to damage things. Is he really a toxic run from man or a good guy that needed some strong inspiration and a great relationship in the making.

    So far, I feel unmoved or convienced of anything.


  27.  #27amy on March 25, 2010 at 7:48 am

    First of all I would like to thank you for doing what you do…finding you and receiving your e-mails, and reading this blog in the last few months has felt like I have an older, much wiser sister standing in my corner telling me just what I need to hear whenever I need to hear it…pretty darn cool!! :~)

    Next, after reading this this morning I had to write and ask you a question about something I am going through…but first, a little background…I am 37 (38 in May, sigh.) I was married at 24 for 7 years, no children. He cheated. I was in a long term relationship with the father of my daughter for 6 years. We were due to get married in June of last year. He cheated and left in May. So, almost 11 months later I have picked myself up, dusted myself off, done a TON of work on myself, and gotten myself back in the game! yea, me!!

    I signed up for Match. com a little over a month ago, and within 4 days I found myself talking to the single most intriguing man I have ever experienced. Day after day we both were constantly amazed at the intensity of the connection between us in every conceivable way…emotionally, spiritually, sexually, how we felt about relationships and how we believed people should behave within them, same favorite foods, wanting the same things out of life, it goes on and on…he said more than once, “it’s like we share a brain”! One hurdle however, was that he is in Michigan, I’m in Texas…but we were working on that…kind of even made it even more intense though, not getting to really see each other, and the conversations covered even more…and the chemistry…oh my, the chemistry!!

    But, I made a mistake. A couple of weeks ago I had a very heated issue arise with my daughter’s father and even knowing what he had been through with his ex-wife, her children and her ex and all the drama, and knowing how much he hated it, i found myself telling him about this situation. Why, oh why did I do this?? So naturally, within the next week I could feel him pulling back, and ultimately he said that he had finally realized that he just couldn’t be in a relationship with someone who has children. What???!!! I was in shock at the time, but after having had some time to think about it, I truly don’t think that is really it. I think the drama of that one situation scared him to death. He doesn’t want to go back into a situation like that. And I can’t blame him. But what he doesn’t know is that through all of the bs with my ex, that is the absolute worst it has ever gotten, and the worst it will ever get because I simply will not live my life in a soap opera. Nor will I allow my daughter to.

    We have had a couple of texts between us, I have to admit, initiated by me, but in a light-hearted way…sort of. I would like to clear the air with him and apologize for even telling him any of that grossness…no matter the connection between us, it was just not appropriate at that time. And I guess to see if my thoughts on his feelings about women with kids or drama with exes is correct. (my being a mom was never an issue before this, and he of course knew all about her, and said what an amazing mother i was alllll the time!) He even had me seriously thinking about moving and having a child with him…he will be such an amazing dad, and he truly deserves to be one. God, I have never felt so strongly for someone, especially in such a short amount of time! But 3-5 hours on the phone every day can do that, apparently!

    At any rate, I find myself thinking about him and missing him and wanting to tell him things about my day, something I think he would find interesting or funny, comparing everyone i meet to him, to feel that longing for me from him, to hear his voice, to SEE him!! I really don’t know how to go the rest of my life never having seen this man face to face! He said he thought seeing each other would make it more difficult (to not go on with this)…I think it would be the opposite. Long story short, nothing, not my marriage, not my last relationship, nothing, has ever felt SO right on so many levels. This does not feel over and done to me. not at all. I just don’t know what to do about it at this point. Hence, this letter…HELP!!!

    Thank you again for heeding your calling in life and being a source of strength to so many!

    big hugs!!

  28.  #28Jennifer on March 25, 2010 at 8:06 am

    Boooo To men who only want to email me on the dating site. Boooo I say.
    I need a power speech.
    Anybody got any ideas?
    Also trying to soul search lately.
    My boss says I am too assertive to the point of agression.
    I’m too smart and intimidate the other nurses.
    Well, frig.
    Now what?
    I don’t know how to be anyone else…and dammit I LIKE me.
    But if I alienate people…that’s not where I want to be either.
    I wonder if that’s what happened in part with B?
    Boss says I have a hard time listening to others. I THOUGHT I was listening to him on level two. But maybe not.
    Asking him feels like a bad idea.

  29.  #29Kate on March 25, 2010 at 8:50 am

    I have a question and this is the first time I’m writing. I recently got out of a 2 year relationship with a guy who was a cheater (didn’t know til the end), a lier, and extremely passive aggressive. I’m happy to be free to date and all of a sudden a few of my male friends have expressed interested in having a more than a platonic relationship with me. However, the one I chose to start dating is confusing me. He’s been pursuing for weeks (email, calls, texts) and since we hang out in the same group, we’ve seen eachother a few times without him having to actually ask me out. He drove me home from a party Sat. night, had a good time, got physical but no sex, and then he followed up with a “when can i see you next?”. So that brings us to lastnight. His roommate, our mutual friend, was having a dinner party and I told this guy that I would see him then. So, I get there and everythings fine until another girl I know he is dating (he was seeing her before I even became single) shows up and clearly she thinks she’s his girlfriend, or close to it. He promptly got her a beer, sat next to her, etc. Then he went into his bedroom, I was sitting across the couch from her, and she then got up and followed him into the bedroom. At this point, I was feeling silly because he and I have barely started dating, but he has expressed a great deal of interest so I was expecting him to pay attention to me at this party. So I just got up and quietly left the house. He then sent me a text saying “Did I bore you?”. To which I responded, “No, it was actually quite interesting…”. I don’t understand why he would invite us both to his house at the same time? Even if all he wants to do is sleep with me, doesn’t he think his chances are greater if he gets me alone? I have no idea how to respond now. And I don’t know if my leaving the party was the best response. But I suddenly found myself feeling uncomfortable so I wanted to leave. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

  30.  #30Simply Shannon on March 25, 2010 at 9:06 am

    Jennifer: Something to try re: listening at level two. When someone is talking, listen and then repeat back to them what they just said. When I concentrate like that, it really stops my brain from thinking about what I’m going to say and focus on what they are saying. You’d be surprised how hard this is. It really makes me notice if I’m listening at level two, and a lot of times I’m not.

    And remember everything is a message. Everything is an opportunity to learn something about yourself and what you do and don’t want in your life. Your boss gave you a great message! So what would assertive (not aggressive) look like to you? If you imagine your interactions with your coworkers and picture them as aggressive, how could you change that part in you so that people feel welcome to express ideas?

    I know criticism sucks to hear but this is a great opportunity to grow and improve.

    Boss speech: I don’t want to come off as aggressive. It feels good to share ideas with others. Any suggestions on what I can do to improve in this area?

  31.  #31Goodheart on March 25, 2010 at 9:28 am

    Thanks all you ladies for your comments & suggestions. It’s comforting to know I’m not alone in the things I am facing.

    The online thing feels like I’m swimming in a vast wasteland of floating trash where I just want to get through all the muck & find myself climbing onto a beautiful island with lively music, swaying palm trees & magic in the air.

    The men online are the muck! I’m tired of being rejected by unworthy men. Ok, not that rejection of worthy men should feel better, but it does 🙂

    I’m going to stay away from CD for awhile since I’m not getting any attention anyway. I swear it’s like the moment I feel confident, happy & enthusiastic, here comes the big BONK from the universe – nope, what are you thinking? Who do you think you are expecting happiness?

    My reply is: I am absolutely perfect just the way I am!


  32.  #32Simply Shannon on March 25, 2010 at 9:45 am

    Goodheart, Circular dating is really just paying attention to and interacting with the men/people around you. It doesn’t always mean going on actual dates. Maybe online isn’t for you. I kind of feel that way too. BUT I’m really focused on getting myself involved in things that I love. That’s when quality people start showing up. It’s easy to feel discouraged by online but I don’t believe the answer is to give up on men. For me, the answer is to go do something else and stop focusing online. Men are EVERYWHERE. It feels better to go out and be a part of the world than to sit at home and complain about the men showing up there. Ya know? I did that for a long time and it just kept me feeling frustrated. Now I go to groups or out with friends and family, take classes, go to the library, go wherever feels good. It really helps me not get down in the dumps about online dating. Which is just one small slice of the pie of men!

  33.  #33Goodheart on March 25, 2010 at 9:54 am

    Shannon, I totally get that. Yes & I agree that online just doesn’t seem to be for me. I do belong to a couple of meetup groups (just started).

    Most things I do aren’t particularly conducive to meeting men & that’s why I started the online thing. Usually, I go to movies, dinner, hiking, etc. with friends. I love all that stuff, but I don’t meet men doing it.

    This weekend I’m going to plant some morning glories in my front yard. I’m going to clean the house top to bottom. I’m going shopping for new clothes & house decor.

    See what I mean? This stuff makes me happy, but I think it keeps me single too. I’ve never seemed to be one of those girls where men just drop from the sky in front of me. Well, not in quite a few years anyway. There was a time. What happened?

  34.  #34Goodheart on March 25, 2010 at 10:01 am

    And I volunteer at the animal shelter. I’m taking hula dance lessons in April.

    I do so many things that I’m interested in & enjoy.

    And the men stay away in droves.

    And I’m actually very friendly. Strangers always strike up conversations with me wherever go. All the time.

    I’m baffled.

  35.  #35Orna Walters on March 25, 2010 at 10:33 am

    I’m sharing this because I hope that my own experience supports and empowers you all.

    When I was single there was a stretch of time when I would joke that no men need to risk and ask a woman out in person because the online scene is much safer. I live in Los Angeles, and would NEVER be approached by a man for a date.

    I went on a trip to NYC with a girlfriend and it seemed like EVERYWHERE I turned there was a man chatting me up! I was truly shocked and surprised and joked with my gf that if I want to be in a relationship I may have to move.

    What I found interesting was that it was ME. I can see it clearly now looking back (20/20 hindsight), but I was really comfortable out and about in NYC and doing things on vacation that I enjoy and WHAM! Men came out of the woodwork – they seemed to be everywhere!

    I did the online dating with the intention of learning about me – not to necessarily find “the guy.” So if the online thing is not working for you, don’t invest a lot in it. Do things in your world that you enjoy. Show up in the world! As Rori says here – Circular Date the world!

    Practice is important, but the most important ingredient is how are you with YOU? If the online thing isn’t working – it doesn’t mean that you are fatally flawed, or all men are fatally flawed – perhaps its a sign to take a break and put focus elsewhere.

    You (and only YOU) have the power to CHOOSE what meaning you decide to give any experience. So make a choice that makes you feel good – and watch how the world around you steps up to make you feel good too!

    Big Hug,

  36.  #36Siena on March 25, 2010 at 11:12 am

    Earthdancer, thank you so much for your encouragement, it feels so great to receive it, thank you!

    Orna, your post flows perfectly into the lesson that I learned about myself from yesterday. I was feeling down, but a few things came together yesterday to show me the reason why these things have presented themselves at this point in my life.

    1) I’m not CDing to find a guy, but to “clear out the garage” as Earthdancer reminded me. As such, these men are messengers and ones to practice on.

    2) I watched an episode of Hoarders (about people who hoard compulsively) last night on tv. They were LITERALLY cleaning out the mess from the garage, and it was good to see, because I’m doing the same – clearing out all the old/unhealthy messages that I’ve accumulated through the years regarding relationships.

    3) THEN I watched an episode of Addicted (about a meth addict) on tv, and I saw shades of myself in the addicted person’s actions.

    The tv counselor said something REALLY interesting. She said, “you and (the other person) need to be separated from each other right now in order to get your stuff together. If you had been able to do it while you were together, you would have. But this time apart is needed so that you can both heal.”

    WoW! I knew this on some level about my own situation, but it feels good to hear it from someone else!

    I have a post-it on my computer that says, “Under stress, go to wonder, rather than fear.” In other words, ask, “I wonder why I am encountering feminine energy men online?” For me, when I asked that question, I got an answer loud and clear!

    The answer is: Because I need to practice stating my boundaries and communicating my feelings (and who better to practice on than men who I am totally not attracted to?) and because if I had been able to do it while I was encountering an awesome, masculine man, I would have.

    I feel so grateful that these answers keep showing up! Yay God!


  37.  #37Tara on March 25, 2010 at 11:34 am

    Wow — it’s been a while. I’ve been righteously busy, doing lots of new things, etc. Now I’m exhausted and overburdened, have too many commitments and can’t drop any of them. This sucks!

    Steve has been texting and calling, and is too “righteously busy” with all the extra responsibilities at work and 18 online credits — every week, he flakes on me for our pretend coffee date that never happens. He “tries” to get through all the stuff at work so he can “clear some time” in his schedule, but he always texts me that he can’t get away. We haven’t actually had the damn date in over a month.

    Yet he continues to text me, tells me he loves me, etc. The other day when he called, he told me that he’s been doing all his school assignments and reading during work because his five-month old daughter “simply won’t allow” him to get anything done at night. (His other daughter is 13). He also texted me (about a month ago) that he couldn’t meet with me on a weeknight because “his girls are very demanding.”

    (This is the guy w/the abusive wife who beat the hell out of him for 18 years. He thinks the baby isn’t his but is too scared to get a paternity test).

    I’m angry, triggered, and frustrated. I know I can’t “make” him do anything. I know this is his problem. It’s frustrating because he still says he loves me and still makes noise about the coffee date every week.

    1. I don’t know how to translate what I’m feeling into a “feeling message” without it turning into a blame-fest or attack on him or sermon about what he should be doing. I’m afraid that if I try a feeling message, I will just lose control and end up saying all the wrong things.

    2. I am full of pent-up anger and frustration, but my next two weeks are so hideously overbooked that even on five hours sleep a night I have no time for running, going to gym, etc — things that help me let go of anger.

    I’m trying to do “Out the Window” and change my focus by touching something around me, etc. but it’s NOT WORKING.

    3. If he loves me, why the hell can’t he find half an hour somewhere in a two-week span to meet me? He has turned this relationship into a fantasy abstraction where we rarely actually see each other.
    What the bloody hell?

    4. He seems absolutely willing to be the complete slave of his infant and teen (and abusive wife), but says he hates the fact they are like that. But they are getting results. When I act nice and say, “Oh, np. We can meet next week,” or “I understand. NBD,” he sends expressions of love & gratitude — and then flakes on me again next week.

    5. I really want to be a BITCH and say all kinds of nasty things to him. Writing them in a letter that I never send just doesn’t help. I’ve tried that. I’ve tried focusing on my amazing life and too many projects, shows, etc. It doesn’t help.

    6. I’m trying to ride that horse, but it’s damn hard right now. He’s sooo girly that if I just quit contacting him, he would probably just shrug his shoulders and then tell future women that I ended the relationship. He once told me that a woman he was in love with 10 years ago was ready to leave her husband for him and then changed her mind. Now I wonder why. Maybe he just roadblocked it until she gave up, then he said she ended it.

    This is messy and aggravating and driving me crazy.

    What do y’all do when you’re so pissed you can’t see straight?

  38.  #38Daria on March 25, 2010 at 11:42 am

    Tara I would tell him how i feel – no problem lets meet next wekk??? that is not a feeling message and not authentic

    how about

    i feel absolutely furious and i dont want to be treated this way

  39.  #39Daria on March 25, 2010 at 11:45 am

    im feeling bummed because the guy that was making comments and noticing me at the club that i also noticed finally came up to me and danced with me, but then he LEFT

    and i felt very icky with this

    he mighta wanted to come back but i didnt liek it that he left

    he mighta thought i didnt want to walk with him


    whatever it is its buggigme

  40.  #40Orna Walters on March 25, 2010 at 11:45 am


    Its been quite some time for me, and in the past when I’ve been that angry I do one of two things:

    1. Go down to the beach and scream at the waves at the top of my lungs.

    2. Turn up some music (so I don’t terrify the neighbors) and scream into a pillow.

    Anger is often the lid on the pot because it is often easier to feel than what is underneath it. At some point, we must lift the lid and look inside.

    It takes courage to move from the anger to what is really going on deep inside of us.

    My husband is truly a master at guiding people to re-write their story so you can not only identify your old patterns, you can break them. We’re having a free teleclass next week and we will share how to do this yourself and you can register here:

    I hope to “see” you on the call!

    Big Hug,

  41.  #41Daria on March 25, 2010 at 11:46 am

    i feel glad im attracting guys i find sexy
    i feel concerned that im not Keepign them


  42.  #42Kristine on March 25, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    Online dating didn’t work for me either. I seemed to attract guys with issues…I think the dating sites are full of guys who lack the maturity, masculinity and confidence to meet people in person. Also, the Internet makes it way too easy for them to “hook up” with girls and get attention (when in the real world no woman would give him the time of day). Its also not challenging enough and men need a challenge to feel interested. And don’t expect many phone calls, since you are on-line to begin with and that is the expected mode of communication.

    Getting out and about is the best way to meet good people. But like Orna said, and I totally agree, you have to be in the right frame of mind. Travelling does wonders for me. I feel so happy, confident and free. Its the curiousity, adventure and willingness to explore that gives off this open, receptive vibe. Its about not having any expectations. Brings people in.

    Meeting strangers and making friends with them by basic conversation is an excellent start. Just go out in the world and get to know people. If you can’t at least do that (or are scared) you need to do some work on yourself before you will meet anyone. Smile at people and the good ones will smile back and might even say hello. Be curious and ask questions. If strangers talk to you, that is a good thing. So many of us have been taught to “not talk to strangers”. That is for kids and we are not kids anymore. We can take care of ourselves and most of the world is a safe place. Start off by talking with people who seem nice and who you might like. Its a start. Even if they are just women and children. Its good practice.

    I have also been going through dry spells. But I tell myself that it doesn’t matter. Its part of the cycle of life. Just live and let be and let God or the universe figure it out. I also found it helpful to think to myself that I am going on a dating haiatus and not going to date anyone for 6 months…just making that my intention made me feel less needy and desperate, and the results were that guys started talking to me…its like when you don’t want them, they start coming around.

    I am also expanding my horizons by going to different places I haven’t been before, trying new things, like shows, events, restaurants, coffee shops, that I normally would not go to. Just anything to change it up a bit and break out of my normal routine. Its amazing what happens! Try going home a different route, visiting different stores or streets…just go exploring and be open to whatever the universe sends you…stop thinking so much about men and get curious about the sights, sounds, tastes and smells around you. It really does work! And it builds your self-esteem and confidence too.

    Also, become more discerning. Don’t go out with the first guy who asks. In fact, don’t go out with anyone without talking to them on the phone first for at least 2 weeks. That will weed the losers out quick. So if a guy asks you by email to get together for a drink, don’t immediately say “yes”…it is way too easy and makes you look desperate. Just say “lets talk on the phone first” and see if he follows up with that. Then get to know him by phone. Ask questions about him. See if he is worth your time. You should be interviewing him, not the other way around. Keep the calls short and don’t go out until you have spoken with him at least a few times and gotten him into the habit of him calling you. If you two can’t even talk on the phone (if he doesn’t call) how can you expect to ever have a real relationship??? So don’t waste your time with emails and texts. Do this right from the start, not trying to get an on-line emailer/texter to change his behaviour after you’ve been giving in to his emails/texts by responding back. It never works. Chances are he’s one of those guys just looking for attention, a registry of women he can flirt or have sex with, and not a real relationship. If you want a real relationship, it requires effort and personal contact (by voice at least). And that requires YOU to step out of your shell (house, from behind your computer) too.

    Good luck to all! : )


  43.  #43Linda on March 25, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    Tara, I have empathy for this situation you described. I feel your frustration believe me!

    The thing I notice,(because I have done it too much) is that trying to make this fit the way it is right now is not working for you. Shifting your energy on what you want, and need, and desire is what the doctor orders I think.

    I was in a situation like this, not the particular circumstances but , I just want not getting what I wanted. No matter what I tried nothing shifted. It was not until I decided, to put me first and say enough is enough and walk away from it did my energy change. I realized that no one was going to fix what was wrong for me but ME. It seems you want his time, yes you are busy, but we make time to do the things that are important to us. Make you important and what you want.

    Your anger is just built up because the longevity of this issue and its repetiviness is just not stuffable anymore. Like Orna said. lift the lid and look in the pot. Ask yourself, is this guy good for me, is he giving me what I want. You dont even have to kick him to the curb, just let him know what you want, dont tolerate the “putting you off and cancelling” Men do as little as we require of them. He just might step up and if he doesnt then if you were together and settled would he be satisfying or would the way he is just show up a different way. How awful it is to me married to someone who you feel lonely with. I am not saying that you would, but look at all the stuff in the pot. You will feel better in the long run, and maybe inspire the man you would like in your life to step up and place in the place of priority you desire.

    Life is too stinking short to keep waiting around it to get better. As you describe him, it sounds as if he has the personality type to just replace the issues he has right now with something else. I dunno just a thought.

    Give yourself a hug, get your thoughts together and take care of you.

    Hugs Linda

  44.  #44heartbeat on March 25, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    Well, this is a FASCINATING thread! And so apropos for me. I rewrote and unhid my profile on POF, but homestly, I have no energy for it. I’m getting messages, and that feels sweet – but I feel drained and bored. However I DON’T CARE. I’m leaving my profile up for now, as an experiment. I just keep responses short.

    The first evening I got a sweet message – and I felt terrified. So I wrote back ‘I feel terrified’ (NOT of him, I wrote a sentence more about hiding/unhiding, and that I got a warm feeling from something he wrote in his profile). That’s new for me – I just felt all this pressure LIFT, the pressure of being ‘upbeat’. Well after that I he sent me his number, so he could keep in contact if I decided to hide again, and that he felt a connection, he said I was a woman who looked behind ‘the shop front’.

    Otherwise I’m SO excited about new things I’m doing!!!! I’m getting myself OUT in the evenings. Saturday I’m going to this Celebration of Breath (singing, chanting, meditation) and it’s also Earth Hour, and a Mayan Gateway date, so the Deeksha energies are sky high. Deeksha is amazing, sirens – soooo healing – though I experienced a healing crisis a couple weeks after starting. But it passed quick. And Sunday I’m going to a theatre with a sort of meetup group; I’m going on my own but excited about it.

    I really resonate with the sirens who wrote about just taking the focus off finding someone, and I like what Kristine said about choosing a dating haitus – yeah, I’m enjoying getting to know ME, building a loving relationship with MYSELF.

    Gee – I’m going to be the best partner I can be, for me 🙂 Thank you to whoever mentioned the Inner Bonding site – Alicia I think? Well thank you.

    And I get down days too – and feel fearful and flat. Really CONNECTING with myself, finding my feeling and then being open about it to a friend really helps. Good practice too. e.g. ‘I feel SAD, which is a bummer cuz I’ve been feeling really up beat lately’ i.e. a not-needy vibe.

    Hmmm yeah – I was needy…. still, I went through a lot of pain which floored me… illness, bereavement… I forgive myself, I give me a HUG.

    Hugs all round xxxx

  45.  #45Linda on March 25, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    Hey another thought. You know the old saying “the squeaky wheel gets the oil”… Well maybe just maybe if you were the squeaky wheel, he will give you the attention you desire. If not then you know what is what… and where you stand.

    Just might give you some more clarity is all.


  46.  #46heartbeat on March 25, 2010 at 3:48 pm

    Well there you go – as soon as I say one thing, something else happens – lol! I just spent a happy hour chatting on POF. Wow amazing practice!!! I think I’m getting the hang of this…. and I got into REALLY INTERESTING conversations. I’d have blown these guys off before – but hey one is into eco-sytems, another told me about this lane filled with daffodils, another about music and cakes!

    And I noticed my BARRIERS coming up, and I noticed how I can just let them DROP again. Just keep the messages short. A lot of my tension is old stuff – ‘effort’ ‘got to impress’ etc. Hell THIS IS EASY!!!

    I’m enjoying myself. Instant CD. I was able to say, in response to one guy asking if we could meet ‘this feels good right now, I don’t want to decide just yet, what do you think?’ and he apologised for being pushy. I didn’t think he was being pushy, I ‘thought’ I was being difficult…. but then I said to myself ‘Heartbeat, you just gotta go slow as you want to’.

  47.  #47heartbeat on March 25, 2010 at 3:52 pm

    My barriers = fear of being overwhelmed, fear of having to say no. Fear in advance. Old programme still operating from childhood abuse. System now upgraded 🙂

  48.  #48Beth on March 25, 2010 at 4:14 pm

    I feel terrified and traumatized. . .I really don’t know what to think of my situation. Over the last six months, in addition to the man I loved, but was having an “imaginary” relationship with, I feel deeply betrayed and cast aside by other men and women who I thought were my friends.

    Seriously, I have to wonder to myself “did i do something? did I change overnight and start putting off some freaky vibe?” I’ve always had a circle of friends, and I’m always the one that everyone says they have so much fun with and laugh with, and I’m the one that everyone knows they can call and depend on. . .

    Now, I feel SO ALONE, and I’ve tried to boost my self-esteem by circular dating myself, and that has helped, and I try to practice the tools, and I’ve been feeling better, but I cannot understand why this is happening to me, and I’ve felt really sad for the
    past week or so, and I’m having trouble getting past it.
    I don’t feel that I interact in a meaninful way with anyone. . .

    I’m crying as I write this because I feel so sad and lonely. I feel like my whole personality is changing because of the back-to-back-to-back betrayals and now I don’t know who to trust, including myself. I’ve always been so easy-going and made friends easily, but I just don’t even know what to do anymore.

    I have a list of things I am planning to do, like plant flowers, start a new walking route, decorate my house, but when I do try and go meet new people, I just don’t seem to make a connection with anyone anymore, and I can’t understand why. I’m sure it has
    something to do with the fact that I was blind sided by so many betrayals in a short time period, I just wish I knew what I was supposed to learn from this.

    If feels unbearable right now.
    Maybe I was just wearing my “happy go lucky” mask for so long because that’s how I was raised that I am responsible for making everyone else happy even if it means sacrificing my own happiness, maybe because I’m realizing this now my whole mental
    process is having to reorganize?? I’m just rambling here, but I am so confused. . .

    Has anyone ever felt like this?? Like no matter what you do, you just can’t seem to bond with anyone on any level?

    Thanks for your help.

  49.  #49Turtle Girl on March 25, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    Everyone has felt like this as some time in their life. I can remember a time in my twenties when I had zero friends. None. It felt awful, but there were reasons for it, and later things changed.

    Today many years later I have very close friendships of over twenty years. So just hang in there. The sun will come out again, it always does.

  50.  #50Siena on March 25, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    Beth, hugs to you! The whole thing about losing the “happy go lucky” mask, etc…. that is my thing too!

    I think you’re asking the right questions, so you’re on the right path – stay on it! Also, are you taking care of your nutrition and getting enough sunshine!? I can usually feel a big boost when I take care of myself in that way too.

    I was in the same place about 7 months or so ago that it sounds like you are today. I had to start over, because my “friends” weren’t healthy. I had to take a step back and reassess everything. I moved, quit a lucrative job, and lost the old friends. Even planted flowers and discovered new walking routes. Now I have a lovely home with lots of flowers and I discovered a gorgeous new walking route. And my social circle is a bit smaller than it was before, but my happiness level has increased 100 fold!

    I’ve discovered that my old friends were holding me back, and that leaving them behind was a painful – but necessary – step toward finding my authentic self!

    I’m only sharing my stuff to let you know that you aren’t alone – and to hang in there – because it gets better!


  51.  #51Rori Raye on March 25, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    Kate – I thought leaving the party was perfect…and I think you need to drop this guy entirely and let some new men in…get a huge pool. You are clearly deeply, subconsciously attracted to men who lie and mean to hurt you. So – if you come against a situation where you’re feeling bad – he’s one of those. Applaud yourself for catching it…and move on. You’re going to have to date a lot to be able to tell the bad boys you’re attracted to from the good ones we are going to help you teach yourself how to be attracted to! Love, Rori

  52.  #52Beth on March 25, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    Turtle Girl and Siena,

    Thank you both so much for responding and for your encouragement!

    Siena, thank you for the hug 🙂 and for sharing your experience with friends holding you back. I am starting reassess things as well, and I’m coming to the realization that I not only attract “toxic” men, but “toxic” friends as well.

    I’ve been such a people pleaser my whole life, that I honestly don’t know who I am or what I really want. It never seemed natural or right to ask for what I wanted, or that I even deserved anything good.

    When I wear the “mask” I can hide behind it, but now I’m addressing and facing pain from my past, and trying like everyone else, to put the pieces together somehow so they make sense. I’m tired of wearing a mask!! I want the sun to shine on my face!

    Maybe the whole lonely part will disappear as I get to know myself and learn how to set healthy boundaries.

    I stay positive most of the time, but something is triggering me, and I’ve just been REALLY sad for the past week.

    Reading your words means so much!! Thank you!!

  53.  #53Rori Raye on March 25, 2010 at 6:53 pm

    Amy – Welcome, and I’m jumping off into a post with this, because it’s so serious and what I have to say is so tough…for now – back WAY OFF!! TAke GOOD care of yourself! Give me a week to post and hang in there…you’ll get some help from everyone here quickly…Love, Rori

  54.  #54Rori Raye on March 25, 2010 at 7:01 pm

    Beth – I just want to send you some love. “Betrayal” – that rings my bell. There was a time when the “betrayals” were so one after the other that’s what I thought life was. It’s the happy-go-lucky mask that’s holding you back. It’s only trying to protect you – so love that mask – but it’s time to peek out from behind it – and that’s what’s got you all thrown. When you take off the mask, stuff comes up. That’s the way it is. This is where all kinds of therapy and feeling Tools like mine help so much because they help you come out from the mask slowly, bit-by-bit, feeling it all every step, and they help you experience different ways that you actually DO feel – but are pushing aside. Sometimes we just CHOOSE unhappiness because that’s our programming. I want to tell you that you’re doing GOOD. Now, you just have to EXPERIMENT!! You’re not making a connection because you’re “In Transit” as I call it. Let it go loose, get curious about everything around you, and see how that works for you. Love, Rori

  55.  #55Melany on March 25, 2010 at 9:14 pm

    I’ve written to you before but you did not reply. I do hope you get the chance to respond to this mail.

    Since the break up with the father of my child I’m having a hard time to let a man back in my life. I have been dating but I no longer find myself comfortable around men. I now see them as failures, unfaithful and definitely not trust-worthy. This is not based on what happened to my relationship only but on other relationships I see around me. I find myself just becoming resentful towards men.

    As to the father of my child he had communicated that he rather to be alone as he is no good with relationships and people are inconsiderate to his feelings and if he is alone he would not be going through some feelings. I understands that he is seeing other women.

    He hardly ever visit the child. The other day he told me to get a helper to fill in his place which is once a week. Bear in mind that this is a man who was up for a family and welcomed the notion of a child. He gives only financial support to the child.

    I find myself despising him. I even find myself shutting out the idea of love. I hear the nasty voice in my head saying that only a few people do find love and keep love. I am not one of those persons.

    Before I met him I had dismissed the idea of a good and successful man- woman relationship. I met him, he swept me off my feet and made me felt as if yes there was hope. Now our relationship ends on a bitter note I find it more hard to give another man a chance or give me another chance as the fear of hurt is too overwhelming.

    Do you have an advice that may help me overcome these feelings because deep down I know I am wrong, I had experienced love and liked how it felt. Now I feel if I should enter a relationship is just for my self benefit and would not care for the man.
    I try thinking positive things but it just not working.

    Help me if you can please.

  56.  #56mary on March 25, 2010 at 10:57 pm

    Hello Melany,

    I’m not Rori, but your comment made me think of Evan Marc Katz’s eletter this morning. I just subscribed yesterday and then received the first one today. It’s pretty interesting.

    Here’s Evan:

    “In my 5 Massive Mistakes eBook, I let you know that the second biggest mistake that you’re making in love is “Taking Dating Personally”. I know, I know: How could that possibly be a mistake? After all, what could be MORE personal than dating? You’re putting yourself out there, making yourself vulnerable, trying to open up – and all you do is face rejection upon rejection from the men you like the most. How is that NOT personal?

    Well, as I mentioned in that free eBook, you’ve probably rejected dozens of men. Maybe it was after talking to one for a half-hour at a party. Maybe it was when that sweet, dorky guy asked you out at work. Maybe it was after a first date where there was no chemistry. Maybe it was after a few passionate weeks, where you realized he had some major issues. Maybe it was a 6 month boyfriend whom you decided just wasn’t “the one”.

    You didn’t intend to hurt any of these guys. It was just the fallout from a relationship that was not meant to be. And even if HE thought it was meant to be, it doesn’t really matter. It takes two to tango. And you ain’t tangoing. What’s a poor guy to do?

    At this point, I’d like you to step outside yourself. I don’t want you think of yourself as the woman who rejected him. I want you think of yourself as his best girl friend. And you’re listening to him tell you all about the woman who just rejected him.

    How much it hurts. How unfair it is. How he’s devastated and can never trust another woman. What do you say to console this hurt and confused man? How about: “You’re a loser.” “You probably did something wrong to annoy her.” “You should give up on dating. All women are this way.”

    Of course you don’t say that! You probably tell this guy, “I’m really sorry that happened to you. But there are lots of other fish in the sea. Get back out there and find someone who loves you just as you are. The right woman will appreciate you.” You’d probably point out to him that rejection happens ALL THE TIME…and if rejection happens ALL THE TIME, it’s probably not all that personal. Bad things happen to good people. No point in the poor guy beating himself up about it. Right?

    Alas, it’s not that simple when a guy disappears on you. After you get dumped, you start questioning everything: yourself, your judgment, the meaning of life. All because a man decided he didn’t want to spend the rest of his life with you.

    Question: How many times in your life have you been in love? Two? Three? Okay, so if love is exceedingly rare… why would you be surprised each time a relationship ends? In fact, you could probably predict with a 99% success rate that each relationship would end. If that’s the case, why take each one so personally?

    I’m not saying there aren’t real feelings and emotions that come up in a relationship. You should absolutely mourn the loss of a relationship the same way you mourn any other transition. You wallow in your sadness for a bit, and then you move on. But when you take each rejection so personally, you can’t move on. You don’t feel motivated to meet new guys. You don’t believe that any new relationship could possibly work. Worst of all, you hold onto the faulty fantasy of your ex, even though he wasn’t as great as you thought he was.

    As a result, you stay stuck. You determine that since it hurts too much to date, you’ll solve the problem by simply not dating. Brilliant! And guaranteed to keep you single forever. Women who’ve been hurt form a protective layer of pain, thereby keeping out even the most amazing men. Which is too bad.

    Because if you were to let down your guard, you might realize that there’s a man just like you, who doesn’t even know you exist. Like it or not, dating is a bit of a lottery. And since you have as little control over men as you do over winning the lottery, the wisest course of action is to not take rejection so personally.

    You don’t give up on dating after you get hurt. You just have to be a little more Zen about it. The good news is that you can be. In my upcoming eBook, Why He Disappeared, I share with you the difference between the women who men run from and the ones who get us to commit. Once you understand what’s really going on, you’ll get an answer to all the questions you had at the beginning of this email: “Why do I get so involved with emotionally unavailable men?” “How come I couldn’t see this one coming from miles away?” “Why do I seem to attract these guys over and over and over again?”

    You can get rid of that confusion. You can find clarity. You can fall in love. Anything is possible once you have the power.”

  57.  #57heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 2:45 am

    Melany – hugs to you – I feel as if I know this man who prefers not to be around people and bails etc.

    I can only say what I did that helped me heal and feel very differently – in a short time, in fact the turn around happened in days. I couldn’t help but feel my sadness and anger and helplesssness. I gave into it, cried, kicked, stayed off work for a few days. And I also felt REAL letting go into the chaos of my feelings (and I got LOADS of support on here while I was in that space too – I took my laptop to bed lol!).

    I felt better being real with myself, I started taking care of myself – and it came from a different source than telling myself to think positive, eat better etc. It came from the same REALNESS inside that I connected with in the chaos. It felt natural.

    I began to feel good again. I began to LOVE myself. I decided to make some changes – to my hair, clothes, activities etc. I began to feel more and more energised, all the while connecting inside, writing in my journal, reading, writing on here. I got CLEAR on what I want – starting with small things (not connected with men, but actually really important, like sleep, and tasty healthy food).

    Miracles started happening. I slept better, food came to me via friends (without me asking), men were different – warm, kind, interested.

    I stay focused on my relationship with ME, I throw out all the ‘shoulds’ and ‘oughts’ and find ways of being that feel good. Like I go out more now, and experiment with where feels good and how to get there easily. Enough of a challenge to be exciting but not too much.

    I’m keeping it simple and getting braver and more experimental every day. Doing things differently and changing things also helps send a clear message to ME that I’m paying attention to myself in a loving way, and signals that life is going to different now – like giving myself a Bookmark 🙂

    There’s so much support here it feels amazing – I hope you stay and post some more xx

  58.  #58Beth on March 26, 2010 at 3:50 am

    Rori, thank you for your love and support!
    “In Transit” I like that! It helps me to understand why I can be feeling so good one minute and then so scared and depressed the next. . . I’m still just peeking out from behind the mask that has protected me for so many years from others as well as myself. . .but that’s okay now that I can visualize it that way!
    I love my mask, and I see that it has done the best job it could trying to protect me, but I’m in charge now, so even though I know it’s there, I will no longer let it control me.
    I embrace all of my feelings, even the scary ones, and I choose to nurture myself and be good to myself, and experience different things as I get to know and love the real me!

    I feel good today!! Thank you!!
    Love, Beth

  59.  #59Beth on March 26, 2010 at 3:59 am

    Hi Melany,

    I’m glad you are here, and I understand so much the bitterness that you are feeling right now.
    Just keep coming back because you will get so much support and help from Rori and the other ladies here.
    Hugs to you!

  60.  #60Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 6:34 am

    Good morning…

    I am feeling frustrated. I’ve been leaning back a LOT and my man has been coming close and being very sweet and finally speaking things I’ve wanted to hear, etc. We had a beautiful time together on Monday night and now I haven’t heard from him since! Except for a silly little link he sent on Tuesday.

    I am still CD and I try to keep myself busy with other men and things I enjoy. I had been doing really well, but I guess that after he came close for several days, I relaxed and began to hope that things had changed. Sigh…

    Now my heart hurts again and I feel the sad and loneliness again from months ago when he pretty much disappeared.

    I know that he loves me… I just think that emotional intimacy scares him. He always pulls back. Less than before, but it still hurts.

    I just wish I could be stronger and not care or notice, but I really do love him so it’s hard not to miss him when he goes silent.

    Just wanted to share here so that I won’t do something stupid like contact him and say “WHERE ARE YOU?!”

  61.  #61Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 6:39 am

    The last thing he said to me on Tues morning was, “If I bought you a ring, would you wear it?” Not an engagement ring yet, but just a ring to remind me that he loves me. It felt so sweet and I said “Yes.”

    And then nothing for 3 whole long days? AUGH!

    I guess I just climb on my horse and keep riding and hope that he catches up!

    OHhh… the other day, I went for a facial and in the room, there was a beautiful picture of a woman on a horse and a man standing beside the horse and reaching up. She was very queen-like and was holding her hand down to him like she was “thinking” about helping him up! It made me smile!

    Maybe this is the picture I’ll hold in my mind today!

  62.  #62Rori Raye on March 26, 2010 at 9:10 am

    Rachel – Hang in there, and watch the situation…this guy is not an “all over you with contact” kind of guy. If you’re the kind of woman who NEEDS that – he’s not going to work for you. And ask yourself – what do you feel with “all over you” kinds of guys? Perhaps you run away from them, or are not attracted to them? Circular Date please, at least in flirting, and start watching how different men are…Love, Ror

  63.  #63Rori Raye on March 26, 2010 at 9:13 am

    Yayyy Beth!

  64.  #64Rori Raye on March 26, 2010 at 9:22 am

    Melany – If you allow yourself to see the truth of the choices you’ve made in love, the choices in men – and allow yourself to see that you knew what these men were like, even though you may not have consciously allowed yourself to see it then – you’ll get that your opinion about men is based on your old choices. It’s like shopping at a market for pears, seeing and picking only the rotting, soft ones that taste bad when you get them home, and then forming the opinion that all pears are bad. Makes no sense when you see it from that perspective. You simply haven’t been “seeing” the good men out there because you’re not attracted to good men. This is where you need to Circular Date ad start building new brain patterns about the men you practice relating with. Love, Rori

  65.  #65Siena on March 26, 2010 at 10:29 am

    Ugh, why am I feeling so triggered from the advice from men like Evan and Christian that is being posted on this site? It’s good advice, I know, but there’s something in me that is really triggered by it!

    I don’t like this feeling – it feels hopeless and heavy.

    They are good men (I’m sure, because I trust Rori) and I love men, so what is it in me that is reacting like this?

    Maybe it’s something about a man giving advice in matters of the heart?

    I don’t know… any help?


  66.  #66Orna Walters on March 26, 2010 at 10:50 am


    What Rori says here is so true – “You simply haven’t been “seeing” the good men out there because you’re not attracted to good men.”

    I was stuck in this pattern for YEARS! There was a time when I thought ALL men would cheat. I’m now married to the most wonderful man who is everything I ever wanted and dreamed of and hoped for and I have no question that he is and will be forever faithful to me.

    It takes time, dedication and persistence to break through our old patterns and ways of being, I promise you that is worth it!

    I wanted to shed a beacon of light your way to say that it can happen for You! I know this because if I could do it, anyone can, which means You can do it too! <3

    Big Hug,

  67.  #67Tara on March 26, 2010 at 10:55 am

    Thanks Orna and Linda!!!

    What I want from Steve is for him to find time in his crazy schedule to meet with me. I think the observation that he distracts himself by replacing one set of problems with another. I realize that he avoids dealing with real life and his awful home situation by staying insanely busy — I do that, too!

    He called me yesterday afternoon and we chatted for about half an hour. I was able to give him some Feeling messages about being angry and frustrated that something ALWAYS comes up when we’ve made plans – it turns out that he was feeling those same things too, but he hadn’t said them!

    We were going to meet at the gas station between our homes last night, but both of us were so tired that we each individually fell asleep (text convo this morning). LOL! Maybe what we both needed was a good night’s sleep — something neither of us ever gets.

    I am pleased that I was finally able to TALK to him and express my feelings in a calm, non-threatening way. I also told him that, to me, if we want to have any kind of relationship, we have to find a way to sneak in some face time somewhere — more often than once a month.

    It felt good to have that talk!

  68.  #68Orna Walters on March 26, 2010 at 10:56 am


    What is the trigger? Do you clearly hear what your inner dialog is?

    For example: Are you judging them? Do you question their intentions? What is going on inside of You that triggers you about their advice?

    When you know the answer, you’ll know what is going on inside of you to create whatever negative pattern you create in your relationships.

    This is a GREAT place to be for self-discovery! It may feel incredibly uncomfortable and if it does, I encourage you to stay with that. That discomfort means you are on the verge of shifting something inside of you for the better.

    My husband and I are hosting a free teleclass next week and we’ll walk everyone through a process to identify and break our old patterns in relationship. You can register here:

    Big Hug,

  69.  #69Daria on March 26, 2010 at 11:08 am

    Siena – I get triggered by it too!!

    ONE – I don’t want advice about “how I should be” from MEN! That feels bad

    TWO – often times, men, and Evan and Christian do, speak like men… using fear and black and white thinking… ie… if u do this, you will fail. This is also triggering. I’m learning to notice how men talk and chalk it up to… ‘man talk’



    and men are used to speaking in the masculine when giving advice

  70.  #70Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Rori – I feel intrigued by what you wrote to Rachel: ‘Hang in there, and watch the situation…this guy is not an “all over you with contact” kind of guy. If you’re the kind of woman who NEEDS that – he’s not going to work for you. And ask yourself – what do you feel with “all over you” kinds of guys? Perhaps you run away from them, or are not attracted to them?’

    That is EXACTLY what I find happening with me. I feel smothered by guys who are “all over me with contact” and it makes me feel annoyed and unattracted to them. I like a lot of personal space for myself.

    HOWEVER, when a guy is NOT “all over me with contact” — even though I enjoy the space and freedom — my THOUGHTS begin to tell me “he’s obviously not that into you” and “if he’s not contacting you all the time, he must not feel the same way you do about him, because YOU are thinking about HIM and if you were the guy you would be CONTACTING him to let him know that.”

    My son’s girlfriend sometimes gets upset and worried when he doesn’t contact her (they go to two different colleges) but I KNOW he is in love with her and loves her deeply and is definitely planning to marry her. It’s just that he feels like texting, email, phone, etc. is fairly meaningless to him — and when he’s with her in person he gives himself to her fully. He also sometimes gets caught up in his school work and writing music. And sometimes he feels kind of depressed and he withdraws a little. So I know that in his case lack of contact does NOT mean he’s not into her.

    So, what does this all mean? If a guy contacts me too much, I get turned off. If a guy contacts me not enough, I feel sad that he’s not that into me.

    Does this mean I’m doomed????

    I would love to hear Rori’s thoughts on this, but anyone else’s insight is much appreciated too! Thanks!


  71.  #71Simply Shannon on March 26, 2010 at 11:24 am




    Lightbulb moment. Thank you!

  72.  #72Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 11:32 am


    I have always wanted a lot of contact from a man and my longterm guy has never quite been where I’ve wanted him to be in that department. But he has been stepping up more and our times together do feel sincere.

    I am seeing another guy who IS “all over me” and it feels yucky and smothering.

    So… I’m trying to figure out if I am attracted to the less available guy simply because he’s “harder” and would feel like more of a catch? To be fair to myself, I’ve known him longer and do feel more of a heart connection with him. But I don’t like that fact that my heart aches so much when I don’t hear from him.

    The other guy is constantly telling me how beautiful I am, how much he loves me, etc…. all the things I thought I wanted to hear but they feel empty.


  73.  #73Daria on March 26, 2010 at 11:34 am

    i felt a litte spark about Rori’s comment to Rachel too.

    I understood that when she says “how do you feel about men who are all over you”

    what came for me was… if i feel turned off by men who are all over me, THEN I AM GOING TO ATTRACT a man who is NOT.

    sooo… since i want a man that I DO like to be all over me… I mean, since I’m missing him when he’s not, I DO…

    then I have to work on healing my trigger of feeling turned off to men who ARE this way…

    then when i heal that i will get to the bonus stage of getting one i DO like who is also all over me and i’ll BE ABLE TO RECEIVE THAT

    because right now i would be pushing it away by saying no to it in general with the other men

    its like… when im not attracted to good men lets say… i practice on healing this… so that i can get a man I AM attracted to who’s also good

    (please insert “gives me enuf attention for me” where “good” is)

  74.  #74Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 11:38 am

    Lori! YES!!! You describe my dilemma exactly. When I don’t hear from him, it feels like he’s not thinking about me and then my thoughts start spiraling into fear and negativity. I wish I just had a little bell that would “ding” when he thought about me so I’d feel reassured that all was well!

    Here’s what I’ve been trying today… somewhere I heard that we can choose to think whatever we want. Our minds don’t know the difference. So when I think of him today, I am choosing to think that it’s because he just thought of me and sent a little brain-wave message to me and that attracted my thought to him! And I smile and say “hello” in my mind and then go on with my work.

    It’s working .. but I’d still love a real message from him!

    Interestingly, when we were together on Monday, he said, “I’ve been thinking about you so much!”

    And I bit my tongue and smiled. But I wanted to say, “Would it be so hard to LET ME KNOW THAT?!”

    So I guess I do want more contact, but like you, I feel turned off by the guy who’s texting me every 15 mins!

    Anyone else have any thoughts or input?

  75.  #75Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 11:44 am

    I also remember Rori saying somewhere that “just because someone isn’t loving you the way you want them to, doesn’t mean they aren’t loving you with all they’ve got.”

  76.  #76heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 11:45 am

    I’m GLUED to this discussion about contact!! It’s a topic I’ve thought about, felt my way around a lot.

    I’m *thinking* it comes down to how I feel about MYSELF when I don’t hear from a man. But I have felt very unsettled and anxious when contact that has been regular suddenly changes. For example when a regular goodnight text doesn’t arrive. I don’t want to feel that way.

    And I do like spontaneous contact. And consistency. But it feels odd thinking about it outside the context of the MAN. I’d like a man I feel good with whether he texts/phones a lot or not. I’d like a man who steps up contact when stuff happens, like if I’m ill or something. Though seeing in person feels the most significant.

  77.  #77Siena on March 26, 2010 at 11:45 am

    Daria, wow, feels good to know that I’m not alone, thank you!

    Orna, thank you for your response, it means a lot to me. I am going to sign up for your teleclass!

    When I reflect on what is triggering me, here’s what comes up: I feel like the ‘failure’ these men are talking about (“why he broke up with you”, “5 massive mistakes”, etc), is me. When Evan’s article was first posted, with a bio that said something about him dating ‘hundreds’ of women before he met his wife, I immediately thought ‘well, he would have dumped me too.’

    I guess I’m taking the advice really personally, and feeling like I’m not good enough to attract a ‘good’ man like Evan or Christian, because I’ll never be able to remember all of their advice when I’m on a date with someone my heart responds to.

    And on the surface, I know the thought that I’m not good enough is ridiculous. I’m a really great catch… but the belief that I won’t be “enough” for a good man is deep within me. I’d love to get rid of it so that I can finally receive a good man and just get on with this for cryin’ out loud!


  78.  #78Daria on March 26, 2010 at 11:47 am

    Rachel – I do the same thing!! when i think of or dream of a man I know its because he’s about me! yay!

    Lori – I would tell (bravely) my CD man – “I don’t like that” simply about him withdrawing because of blah blah good sounding stuff. it can be simple. i dont like a man that is withdrawing. so i dont like it. its amazing how little statements of my feelings have completely inspired men to change course…

    (my guess on what may happen with him… she doesnt like that… oh no… this doesnt sound good…she wont like me anymore… omg … no i cant lose her… i will change this no way will i lose her… ima reassure her : OUT HIS MOUTH: oh… um well i meant that can happen but im not gonna do that this time with u because i really want u )

  79.  #79Lola on March 26, 2010 at 11:49 am

    Wow Daria
    Me too!
    I don’t open the Christian Carter emails anymore I just feel inadequate. Then I think about the great women who get the guy effortlessly and feel I’ll never have that ‘je ne sais quoi’

  80.  #80Daria on March 26, 2010 at 11:50 am

    Siena – hey i had the same “im not good enuf” thought… It’s healed! keep ur head up. we are enuf.

    Hey who wants to see if we can attract Evan to fall in love with one of us and get divorced for us?

    Jus sayin… would be fun…


    (ps this was a joke i feel teary.. but i thought of it a few days ago… im sure if Evan and his wife have a strong relationship it wouldnt work, so his wife has nothing to worry about and shes a Goddess welcome on the island)

  81.  #81Siena on March 26, 2010 at 11:51 am

    Daria, I didn’t know that


    wow, this makes a lot of sense! But – geez, now I think I’ve got the wrong idea here too!

    I’m so used to praising my men… and in this light, it sounds like praise can be emasculating.

    For example, I know I said something like, “wow, you’re a really hard worker, I admire that in you.” I’ve always thought that this was building up a man. But now that I write it, it kind of sounds like something a mother would say – not a lover, doesn’t it?

  82.  #82Daria on March 26, 2010 at 11:52 am

    Lola – join the club… i’ve just recently started re opening them sometimes

    I noticed in the past, when i was busy babystepping to Do i feel good? Do i feel bad?

    that i was feeling BAD reading the beginning of the email…

    it felt like fear based marketing

    are you failing this way, did u make that mistake, oh you must not be a natural or else u wouldnt read this…

    mm yeah no thank u that doesnt feel good…

    it speaks to a masculine side of me not the feminine side

  83.  #83heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 11:56 am

    Rachel – I LOVE this: “I am choosing to think that it’s because he just thought of me and sent a little brain-wave message to me and that attracted my thought to him! And I smile and say “hello” in my mind and then go on with my work.” xx

  84.  #84Daria on March 26, 2010 at 12:02 pm

    Siena – I think its great to appreciate men, and i think that what you said sounds wonderful. I say things like that too, I practice finding things to appreciate and making sure im saying them from an authentic place, although honestly i do find myself sometimes in my head like… strategizing… like i will compliment him now and he will like it… hehe

    AND i think its cool, because, hey, they have feminine sides too! it’s not gonna turn him feminine, unless its A LOT. Just like him challenging you… ummm is not gonna turn u masculine, unless its a lot.

    think about this. when you stand up to a masculine man… or when you set a boundary, or have him compete with other men… then that is challenging him.

    or how boys play… I bet I can do this better than you… thats building up their masculine

    umm yeah i got lost. ok here we are.

    masculine men dont need help building up their masculine. really. they get plenty challenge by us leaning back, and REQUIRING… those are challenges

    feminine men benefit from them too, because if they start taking steps to fulfillng our requirements they get more masculine

    ah the gifts of the Goddess

    its fine to praise him i think. probably not more than he praises u tho… that could be an imbalance.

    I told the man last nite… boy you are like superman to me

    later he told me that he feels like he can BE more with me. like hes a superhero. he said maybe its cuz u called me superman… hmm

    i felt pleased

  85.  #85Siena on March 26, 2010 at 12:04 pm

    Rachel – ditto Heartbeat’s comment. And I absolutely, 100% believe it’s true! And if you stay with that feeling long enough, you can actually feel the other person’s spirit, and it can be very comforting — almost the same as if you were with him physically in the same space.

  86.  #86Siena on March 26, 2010 at 12:07 pm

    Daria, ok phew, I feel better. Thank you for your explanation.

    I think I’m overthinking everything today. I need to go outside and sit in the sunshine and smell some flowers!


  87.  #87heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    I get triggered the same way – like Daria and other sirens wrote – by Christian Carter’s stuff – but not as much as I used to. I reckon I could give that dude a run for his money now… 😉

    I just don’t feel the same QUALITY and DEPTH I feel here. Rori is a healer. I don’t feel I’m *missing* some secret, I feel excited to learn a new way, to grow and feel feminine and loving and still be me.

    I don’t get at all triggered by Todd Creager. I get majorly triggered by David Wygant – I’d give him a wide berth if I met him at a bar. On the other hand…

    Oh now I feel a little excited – what challenge I may be attracting…. lol!!

  88.  #88heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Siena and Daria – WOW!! xx

  89.  #89Daria on March 26, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Daria – just wanted to pop in and say how much I appreciate you and love your posts… and how cool you are. Your willingness to let it all hang out here is more than helpful…your passion is “feelable” – and you open up a whole bunch of things for us to look at every single time…about the wrestling – I just think a man who’s a “challenge” – who can stand up to your considerable energy – is just historically exciting for you. I’d love to see you explore “boring” men for a few weeks and report on those experiences (sort of like Meryl Streep and her quiet sculptor husband, Tina Turner and her businessman husband, Barbra Streisand and her James Brolin, Julia Roberts and Danny….these women have found men who support their extraordinariness without having that same star power themselves. Think about what that would be like – a man as wondering, adoring support for you in a quiet, manly way. You get to be the star, not him…I think that’s a different idea for you? – very different from Sandra Bullock and Jesse and Jennifer Aniston and John Mayer…who are interested in men with their OWN star power and excitement…) Love, Rori

    ok this is what Rori said to me. I knew this was coming. dammit.

    my turn to complain about Circular Dating.

    I dont want to date boring men… waaah.. hehehe

    i do date boring men.

    But consider marrying them : my biggest fear.

    and yet this man i met last nite does remind me of that. i asked him what his mission in life is as a man

    (got this from another male dating coach, to aska aman what his mission in life is as a man early on… triggers that “forever vision” and makes you sound mature and serious and like you have your feet on the ground and all types of good stuff that you can think of – yes a strategy but a good one… tells a lot )

    so he said, now mind u he had already asked me what i want to do in life way before this, and i told hima whole bunch of stuff and CRIED, well he said he wants to get married and have a family… and um… well um… he doesnt know! he doesnt know yet…


    ive actually not gotten that before

    so im like okay he can be like a quiet supportive man for me

    and i was like cool but ALSO I FELT SO TRIGGERED

    cuz it reminds me of my highschool boyfriend who i felt so bored with and my body started revolting to him

    WTF ive been running from him ever since. I didnt date good men because they reminded me of him, and i think i dont date overweight men cuz they remind me of him, and ive slowly been healing

    but really RORI a man who quietly supports me and i am the star?

    i do think i would cheat on him and feel unsatisified

    i always wanted a man who is MORE than me

    or equal to me

    so we can duel it out and he’ll be the only one to defeat the Goddess with the sword

    but then they used to leave! they wont leave now right!! ? cuz i have feminine mystery now. im more than just a warrior with a sword now a woman to win who ends there

    i am the world

    so i can accept a man to support me

    yes ok. IF WHAT I HAVE TO DO TO GET THE MAN I WANT WHO IS AMAZING is heal this trigger of what i think i dont want which is boring men then i will do it.

    get it? im only gonna do it cuz ima get a non-boring man. that also feels good. ok. i will shift me. maybe i will start to like boring men. that feels scary and like betraying myself right now. but maybe it will feel good. i feel open and terrified.

    im stepping off the cliff

    i know i will fly i always do


  90.  #90Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 12:11 pm

    Siena- So you really think that whenever I think about a guy it means he is thinking about me too?

    I would love for that to be true!!!

    But it doesn’t seem like it could actually be true.

    But I want to believe it if it is.


  91.  #91heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    Siena I love that about the other person’s spirit, that feels sooo beautiful.

    Daria that’s so INTERESTING about masculine/feminine – I’m utterly engrossed here!


  92.  #92Daria on March 26, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    Siena – wow i just tried that “being with their spirit ” thing and i like it… like im receiving their mind attention…. oooh… hehhehehee…

  93.  #93Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 12:15 pm

    Daria – <3 I love this:

    "im stepping off the cliff

    i know i will fly i always do


    Love it!


  94.  #94heartbeat on March 26, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    Daria – “wondering, adoring support for you in a quiet, manly way” – I fell in love with a man like that, it felt amazing! I was dating at the time and I stepped away as we started as fwb and I didn’t want to continue that way. (he was ‘waiting’ for someone else – his down side was three-way relationships) He wasn’t the most alluring man of the bunch, and he was older, but he gave me a benchmark for future reference. I thank him for that, I still feel a great deal of affection for him. I felt so relaxed and TOTALLY myself – crazy as I was at the time, messed up but mending.

  95.  #95Daria on March 26, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    I got the masculine feminine challenge praise thing from David Deida.

    Heres a cool one for business that doesnt totally correspond with Rori’s word choice but its still something to consider


    what do u think about offering and taking.

    i know we sometimes use taking interchangably with receiving in ur tools

    however taking has some ACTION to it


    giving —–> receiving

    taking <—— offering

    offering as i see it is being an invitation. being really attractive. smiling at the man. NOT moving

    having an attractive website… with free value content

    NOT chasing down prospects

    not signing them up for a list and asking if they want something – that would be giving

    ALL of these strategies are fine i think actually

    for business

    i like offering because its liek being a flower with pollen. Bees come to u

    however in business, ive seen and heard some of the others, namely following up with people and giving value to them, working

    ive also seen receiving, like receiving money i think,

    or taking, like SCARING people and taking their comfort

    im feelin confused hehe


    runnning into one another i feel confused by the categorizing now

    i like my offering flower image


    i feel grabbed by the confusion monsters. i love you confusion monsters.

    thank u

  96.  #96Siena on March 26, 2010 at 12:22 pm


    Yes I believe it’s true, 100%! Especially if it’s ‘receiving’ a thought. Have you ever been stopped dead in your tracks by the ‘presence’ of someone you love who isn’t actually there? It’s not the feeling of projecting a thought to them, it feels like receiving the thoughts that they are sending out to you.

    I’ve found if I lean back and receive that thought – same way you would a kiss or something like that – it’s extremely comforting and energizing.

    BTW, remembering this has helped me in times that I feel alone. Or FEAR that I’m alone. Because I can remember that just because I’m physically not in the presence of someone I love, I can still be with them. And what is fear? False Evidence Appearing Real. Oh I could go on and on… but work beckons 🙂


  97.  #97Siena on March 26, 2010 at 12:27 pm


    having an attractive website… with free value content
    NOT chasing down prospects

    Like sirens! Sitting on their rocks and attracting the sailors. Sirens don’t chase, they attract!

    You know that song, “Magnet and Steel” from the 70s? Probably one of the most erotic songs EVER!
    Like that 😉 I love it!

    Thanks for being here!

  98.  #98Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 12:51 pm


    “spontaneous contact … and consistency” Yes!

    I guess what I struggle with is when I know that he has the time to write a note or call and he chooses not to. I tell myself that he’s just busy and then invariably I’ll learn that he was just “hanging out, watching a movie, etc” And then I feel so unimportant.

    I think the key is what you said… it’s how I feel about MYSELF when i don’t hear from him. I feel alone, insignificant, rejected…


    And he’s really come such a long way. Why can’t I be happy?!

  99.  #99Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    Siena – I have no trouble believing that SOMETIMES it is true that he is thinking about me when I am thinking about him, and, yes, I am very familiar with experiencing the presence of the other person when they are not “physically” there. I have had some very beautiful, magical experiences with that.

    However, it seems unlikely that EVERY time we think about a guy it means he is thinking about us.

    If that were the case, then a guy we are obsessing over, pining for, who is not contacting us at ALL, would actually be thinking about us ALL THE TIME! And if he’s thinking about us all the time, wouldn’t he be contacting us?


  100.  #100Siena on March 26, 2010 at 1:00 pm


    “cuz it reminds me of my highschool boyfriend who i felt so bored with and my body started revolting to him”

    Yep, this same thing happened to me very recently. Was with an awesomely good, steady man, and my body started pushing him away and my thoughts kept returning to the drug addicted ex who left me for another woman.

    I pushed away the good man. My sub-conscience interpreted “steady” as “boring”. I was an idiot.

    This was the wake up call that drew me to Rori and this site. I KNOW I pushed away the good guy because of my issues, and until I heal those, I will continue to push away the good ones who come my way. I really want a GOOD man as my forever guy and the father of my future children. Not a drug addicted loser.

    …so my healing continues.

    🙂 Siena

  101.  #101Siena on March 26, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    Lucy, yes – I totally agree with you about the ‘every time we think about him’ thing. That’s where the ‘receiving’ part that I wrote about comes in.

    In fact, I would say that ‘obsessing’ and ‘pining’ is leaning forward behavior, and therefore, even if he is thinking about us, he’s less likely to move on it, because we’re already there!

  102.  #102Daria on March 26, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    Siena –

    I pushed away the good man. My sub-conscience interpreted “steady” as “boring”. I was an idiot.

    Reframe: I pushed away a man that didn’t feel good to me at that time. My subconscious knows things I may not consciously know (like that that guy sucked in some way for me). I was trusting my feelings.

    I want a good man that I FEEL GOOD WITH.

    And yes I will open up to all men for practice. I will trust my feelings. And I will not throw myself in the pits.

  103.  #103Daria on March 26, 2010 at 1:33 pm

    I CHOOSE to believe that everytime I think of him he’s thinking of me. Cuz i don’t KNOW know.

    And this will feel good to me, and it will shift my vibe. Even tho it feels scary. I love my nv that says noooo its not possible.

    A part of my being already knows that although I have a doubting voice that says this isn’t possible, I no longer need to believe that it’s telling the truth.

    And that part of my being is willing to inform the rest of me now.

    It is now doing so.

    My mind body and spirit are receiving the information.

    Information transfer is now complete.

  104.  #104Siena on March 26, 2010 at 1:50 pm

    Daria, that reframe to my “idiot” comment made me cry. Thank you!

  105.  #105Rachel on March 26, 2010 at 1:52 pm

    You women are all so wise! And you’re making my work so much more enjoyable… where else can you do taxes and heal your heart at the same time?!


  106.  #106Daria on March 26, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    Yay Siena ! Yay Rachel ! I love being wise!!! I am wise and playful Goddess! woo hoo!

  107.  #107Siena on March 26, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    haha, I just came back from the market, where I was running Daria’s reframe through my mind over and over… and probably caught 5 men staring at me during my 10 minutes there! Honestly, it felt a little uncomfortable (because at heart I’m pretty shy), but here’s to positive thoughts creating beauty!

  108.  #108Tara on March 26, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    There’s a lot of dialogue today about masculine v. feminine and how men react v. women, etc.
    Are we really THAT different, or are we all humans that DO have certain common traits — like maybe we ALL want to receive praise and admiration from those we love?

    If we HAVE to be a “challenge” to a man in order for him to be attracted/love us/commit to us, what happens after the marriage, when there’s no challenge and nothing to chase? And if, as Christian Carter says, what really gets a man to commit is how he FEELS when he’s with us, which is based on EMOTIONAL CONNECTION with us, that kind of negates the “challenge” paradigm.


  109.  #109Daria on March 26, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    We are always a challenge, after marriage as well, because we require high treatment. We are a never ending mystery.

    The emotional connection is the sharing our authentic feelings part.

    the challenge part that gives him thrills is our boundaries, and requiring to be treated well and putting our feelings first.

  110.  #110Daria on March 26, 2010 at 3:58 pm

    Tara, we are the same, and yet we are different. BOTH!

    we are humans yes.

    But i have a pussy and he has a papi thing — very different right?

    and that is reflected in all and all… and all and all and everything there is

    ANd we are also some of both. theres a lil yang in the yin and a lil yin in the yang

  111.  #111Daria on March 26, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    Yay Siena! hehe… im feeling down… i think cuz im still hungry… waiting for my soup to cook

    the magic acupuncturist woman says if I’m not sure about the chicken or the meat being organic or 100 % healthy, to cook it with ginger and green onion

    i got the campbelll chicken noodle cooking with ginger slices and green onion, and sunflower sprouts waiting to be put in when its boiling

  112.  #112Daria on March 26, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    I’m now feeling icky. i feel like a know it all. i know it all. i love my knowitallness. i love my genius with a huge brain with fistsness.

    thank u

    i feel so triggered by what rori said to me. i feel triggered and afraid to be in a marriage with a man i find boring

    i feel afraid i wont “catch” a man that’s not boring

    i feel afraid that a non boring man i do catch turns boring

    i feel triggered and sad

    i love my sad feelings

    i want to heal this. thank u.

    i just mentally traced my kidney meridians — um this is amazing how it affects my FEELINGs wow.

  113.  #113Siena on March 26, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    Daria, you are amazing! You helped me today big time!

    Here’s my post-it note again: “Under stress, go to wonder rather than fear.”

    “I wonder why I would feel triggered and sad to be in a marriage with a man who is boring.”

    I need to go take my dog for a walk. He’s just a little guy, and at dusk the coyotes come out, so I have to make sure to walk him before it gets too late.

    Just finished responding to my boring CD guys’ emails. I’m not attracted at all, so am just letting it all hang out and experimenting. How much can I say/ how far can I go until they think I’m a drama queen? So far (haha) I haven’t even approached drama queen with them yet. They seem to be eating up my feeling messages.


  114.  #114Daria on March 26, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    Thanks siena…

    “I wonder why I would feel triggered and sad to be in a marriage with a man who is boring.”

    r u kidding me! i hate being bored. and if he was boring that would mean id be bored… right? maybe not

    i want a wonderful exciting romance not a boring romance

    i would feel trapped!! i would go into my story of being DUTY BOUND to stay with him, while my heart pines for joy and freedom

    ala bridges of madison county

    i would feel my life trickle away like being in prison

    i would feel like i felt with my highschool ex

    not wanting to hurt his feelings and not doing what i want


    but i could tell him how im feeling and he could fix it…

    i feel afraid of being bored

    there are so many sexy men i want to be romanced by

    i feel intrigued by this process

  115.  #115Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    Siena – let’s hear it for boring guys!! I just answered a bunch of boring emails and let it all hang out too! It was kind of fun to not care AT ALL how they react!

    Him: How are you today?
    Me: Feeling kind of glum, thanks for asking!

    I was very impressed with one guy, though. He “winked” first ( but then a couple minutes later sent an email that said, “I decided that real men don’t wink….”

  116.  #116Lucy on March 26, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Daria – I hear ya about marrying a boring guy! My ex-husband was boring. He was one like Rori said, that just wanted to support me as the shining star. He had no goals or dreams of his own, but bragged to people about MY goals, dreams, accomplishments, intellect, etc. It was flattering . . . but boring. I ran circles around him intellectually, spiritually, creatively, etc.

  117.  #117Daria on March 26, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    Lucy – yeah i dont wnat to feel bored. im going to melt this boring guy tigger, by accepting boring guys, and delving into the feelings…to actually receive an exciting guy…

    i love my bored feelings

    i lvoe my nap wanting


  118.  #118Melany on March 26, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    Thank you all for your responses. You are kind. Never really anticipate such feedback.

    But I find myself disagreeing to me not being attracted good men….Or maybe I’m in self denial.

    Where I am now is that I am not attracted to any man at all. In my headspace there is this red light that says all men are failures. I have so much love in me and I just want to share with someone who is worthy.

    I just believe that there is no man worthy. So whether the man is good or bad I am finding it real challenging to give the person the chance or rather give me the chance to find out.

    Yet apart of me still have this hope that yeah maybe, just maybe someone is out there that I can share my life with and also be a good father to my child.

    So it is battle and I think the hopeful side of me is losing and I am unsure of what to do. I date but I find myself failing the person sometimes even before the dating commence.

    I’m confuses, discourage and despondent.

  119.  #119tinque on March 29, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    Melany – these feelings will pass if you allow them. there really are good men out there. try looking at this not as a battle but as an adventure. just a small shift in perspective, yet it’s huge.

  120.  #120Kacy on March 29, 2010 at 9:53 pm

    Hi Rori, I have a question that I believe is quite pertinent for the times we’re dealing with. I am in a committed relationship with my boyfriend of 1 1/2 years. After some ups and downs he has recently been talking more seriously about marriage. How much do I share with him about the current ecomonic slowdown of my Faux Finishing business and my concerns about possibly losing my house in the next few months if my business doesn’t pick up? I have had an extremely successful business the past 8 years (booked up solid for 5 to 7 months until this recent economic crisis). I am dealing with a great deal of stress in regards to this deep slowdown in my business the past 2 months, am living off of my savings (thank goodness I managed to have savings) and am worried that I may lose my house in the next few months if business doesn’t pick up. I don’t want to give the impression to my boyfriend that I expect any help from him or am hinting at that, but obviously the stress is affecting me and will likely get worse. I don’t want to pretend that I’m not stressed about it when I am, but don’t know how to share this with him w/o saying or showing too much. He is quite wealthy, and I guess to be honest, I don’t know if it’s wrong for me to hope that he might give me a helping hand since if we do marry my home would become his as well. Or is the fact that I would even entertain that hope unhealthy, and showing a Cinderella Syndrome about myself. I am a very hard working woman and have managed to keep my business afloat throughout most of this economic crisis while many in my business have gone under. I want to remain independant and handle my own problems, but admittedly, I am scared. How do I handle this with him, how much of my stress and details do I share and what is the healthiest perspective for me to have in regards to his involvement or not?

  121.  #121Riki on March 30, 2010 at 7:43 am

    Hello all!!

    I think what you are all doing–helping and sharing–is great! Thank you so much for helping us, Rori!

    Here’s my situation. I am interested in a guy and I think he is interested in me. (Boy, did he give me signals!) Anyhow, he works at a shop in the mall. I was with a guy friend of mine at the time as well. It was obvious that my guy friend and I were not together. The store clerk (the one I’m interested in) was giving me all kinds of signals and insisting I try out different oils and things. He appied them to my hands and wrists and gently smelled to give me his input of how he thought it mixed with my chemistry. I got all good comments, btw. It was very sexy… When I was leaving he told me I had a pretty smile. His body language was saying, “I really like you.”

    Anyhow, his manager was there when me and my friend were leaving and the store clerk said, “Hold on” and hurried up to catch up to me and my friend. He handed out the store’s business cards to us. He kept eye contact on me though as he did it. I sensed that he was trying to say to call, but he didn’t want his manager to notice and so that’s why he gave us both business cards.

    What should I do? Should I call the store? I DO want to inquire about putting in an order for a specific handmade soap. Would calling the store and inquirig about the soap be too forward or make me look silly? Should I just wait until I visit the store again? It may be a while for that though… What if he doesn’t work there anymore by then? Is time of the esssence here? Would this break the “never call a guy rule?” I really want to let him know I’m interested without “leaning forward.”


  122.  #122Rori Raye on March 30, 2010 at 10:40 am

    Riki – how cool – what did your guy friend think? Okay – here’s what I would do…he was very aggressive and I can’t guess what he was thinking, so I’d call the number on the card, ask for him, and tell him the truth: “Hi, This is, Riki…I met you the other day in your store…it felt great being there the other day and trying everything, and I want to be straightforward here…I never call men, but I wasn’t sure what you wanted me to do with your card…if you’d like my number, I’m happy to give it to you, and if not, I very much would like to order the special soap anyway…” Or you can wait until you see him again – but I’d just get it over with. If he says it was just business and has a girlfriend, say, okay – now I feel really silly…” and then you know your intuition around men needs some work and to say right there, if this kind of thing happens again – “is this business or personal? Because I don’t call men, but I’d be happy to give you my number” – turn over his card and have him get a pen and write it on the card and give it back to him… Chances are he was thinking of you as a customer while his manager was watching him be a good clerk…Let’s see what happens. Love, Rori

  123.  #123Kacy on March 30, 2010 at 10:47 am

    Hi again Rori, I hope you saw my last comment posted on March 29th about how much to share with a man about economic or financial issues. If you have already addressed this somewhere, I would appreciate you sending me to those posts. As I talk with him several times a day, it’s hard for me to hide my stress. I would like some counsel about this. Thanks Rori.