When It’s All Going Down The Tubes…

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10-6 love yourselfHere’s a letter from Eileen that came to me personally, and I wanted to answer it here:

Hi Rori…Im in such a bad way and dont know what to do.Ive been in a relationship for 3yrs he did all the running… he was married but wasnt happy he told me he loved me and that he was leaving getin his own place and wld be spending most the time with me he was lovely over xmas but then I got a txt in January out of the blue saying he had fell in love with a girl at work and has moved in with her but he came to mine and slept with me.I dont know what to do now ive got no job lost my friends cant eat or sleep he still wants to be friends please help I DONT know what to do. Thanks rori with love xx Eileen

My answer:

This is way beyond anything I can do to help – because it’s a classic dive into poor mental health.

It’s an addiction gone so bad – as if the heroin suddenly left you, and you couldn’t get anymore, but you, of course, didn’t want to quit.

It’s withdrawal NOT of your own choosing.

The addicts who get into this trouble are usually in this situation because they’ve committed a crime trying to get drugs, and end up incarcerated or in some way where they can’t get anymore.

And this is Eileen.

It starts with a simple addiction that’s common – getting involved with a married man. You KNOW he’s not available, but you somehow think he WILL be.

Whatever he says – that he loves you, that he’s leaving his wife – is like more cocaine to you. It stokes your addiction and gives you hope after hope.

Then he doesn’t leave his wife. And it drags on and on. Or he meets another woman, like Eileen’s married man. And then he wants Friends With Benefits.

And you give him the booty calls he wants.

And all this time, you believe you’re in love with him, and that somehow – all this is worth it. That, somehow HE’S worth it.

And, of course, he isn’t. Not even close. Not even in the same ballpark. The same planet of love and relationship. Not there.

But – you think he is.

You think he’s still worth it and start damaging yourself even more, punishing yourself, castigating yourself, losing all the parts of you that are important – your work, your friends, your life – to scheme, strategize, give up everything for this drug that happens to be in the form of a man.

No one around you can fathom why you would do this. They think you’re crazy, nuts.

And, are you?

Eileen, if you went to the nearest mental health clinic, you would be likely given some kind of drug. Something to calm you down, to get you thinking clearly, to relieve your anxiety.

But that wouldn’t do anything to help you understand why you’re in this pickle.

In fact – why you would WANT to be in this pickle? Because, remember, it all started with wanting a man who was not available.

It all started with a very clear picture of doom that was STILL the most attractive thing “in the room” of your life.

What needs to happen now, Eileen, is to dump this man entirely from your life. Cold turkey. Flush the drug down the toilet. Stop thinking about him, stop talking to him, never see him again.

Get professional help. Start with a mental health clinic to get some relief from your obsessive thinking about this man. Take whatever therapeutic “talk” sessions they’ll give you, or anywhere they’ll refer you.

Then, immediately look for work. Do everything you know you need to do to get some work that will give you some way to take care of yourself and rebuild some measure of self-esteem and mental stability.

I hear how fragile you’re feeling right now, Eileen.

We can help buoy you up here, to help you keep moving to learn to take care of yourself and never, never ever again even WANT a man who isn’t first – available, and second – doesn’t completely want YOU, first.

Once you learn to value yourself and treat yourself as though you value yourself (both at the same time…) – all of this will get better.

Love to you,


Posted in


  1.  #1CurvySiren10 on March 4, 2013 at 3:27 pm

    Wow…it’s so quiet here. You could hear a pin drop.

    {{{{April Rose}}}}- on previous thread. Is there anything we can do to help??

  2.  #2LoveAlways on March 4, 2013 at 3:42 pm

    Welcome Eileen:

    I once was where you are today. I really lost myself in a guy, badly. This blog will help you! Post your feelings here. Ask your questions, Vent!!! (Riffing) I started with Rori’s Ebook. It will help you get deeper into your own feelings about everything and why relationships affect you so deeply. If you buy any program I would suggest Modern Siren, and then Toxic Men. Modern siren helps you reach your inner beauty. It took me sometime, but I’m so much better now. Your healing begins now . . . you took the first step by reaching out on the blog.

  3.  #3April Rose on March 4, 2013 at 3:51 pm

    Thank you CurvySiren,

    It’s so good to know you are there, and that even tho you are far away I have a witness to my falling apart.

    For all my wisdoms and flowery stuff I write on here, in reality I hardly have a life. My self esteem is on the floor squirming.
    I will go to bed very soon, and intend a fresh view on things in the morning.

    Thank you Dominique and Femininewoman for the hugs.

  4.  #4Tam on March 4, 2013 at 4:43 pm

    Hello Ladies!
    It is quiet!! Well, I am back. I have started a little side job and am very happy with it. A sweet grumpy man needs help around his office and private life. So I am kind of a wife…haha!!
    But I feel so sad about MrP. He wrote to me again and said that he won’t share anymore dating stories with me ( I had asked him not to), but that he thinks he is doing much less of that than he is.
    And that I know well that women can bring out the dark side of him (and he put a little sad face behind it). Wow.
    I feel sad and in awe at the same time. He knows his limitations. It almost read like an apology to me.
    It’s hard.

  5.  #5Tam on March 4, 2013 at 4:44 pm

    Much less of that than I am (dating). Typo.

  6.  #6sha-sha on March 4, 2013 at 5:15 pm

    I had. A amazing weekend I feeling sohappy right now sitting on cloud 9…

  7.  #7LoveAlways on March 4, 2013 at 5:23 pm

    ((((((April Rose))))))))

  8.  #8k2012 on March 4, 2013 at 5:34 pm

    338-FW from previous thread. Thanks so much for posting that from Jonathan Ashlay. There are so many coaches that I have subscribed to. My inbox is filled with newsletters from coaches. Apart from Rori and Christian who were the first coaches I subscribed to, I am subscribed to Mike Fiore, Jonathan Aslay, James Bauer, Victoria Clark (am I mixing up her name, sometimes I get her name wrong), Dr Sheri Myers and Elaine. That’s 8 coaches. Lol. I love to read and there is nothing more exciting than when I see my emails come in and there are articles to read and newsletters. Pretty exciting.

  9.  #9k2012 on March 4, 2013 at 6:01 pm

    Some of the coaches I listed above I saw right on this blog when Rori post articles from them as guest posts. Oh how can I forget Dominique. Do u write newsletters Dominique? I will certainly subscribe to your site as well. Before I read the post written above and the responses below, I have a question for u all and in a moment u will see why I asked. Question: How is it a man can miss you and he isn’t interested in you? (Based on observations of his actions). I last heard from Overseas cd last week Monday(before today) and I have been leaning back for the longest while. Remember he told me he was out of it for about a week as he was mourning. I went on facebook yesterday and see he wrote something on his wall to his FB friends that he has been off FB for the week as he is mourning the death of his friend. Persons were offering condolences and I did as well (again) only difference this time is that it was on his wall. So I decided to message him just to see how he was doing. He responded today. Said he was out of state on Saturday and although he saw the message, he couldn’t respond. So we spoke a bit and I asked him what’s up. He said he was working hard and he missed me. This is the second time that he has told me he misses me. I didn’t answer for a long time as I was wondering how should I answer. I finally answered and said,”Hi ____oh u miss me. I didn’t know that. I am bit puzzled-How can a man who shows no interest in u, miss u? Dominique and other ladies, can u provide some insight, please? Thanks. Hearing from overseas cd is motivating me to really have other options-I notice this is the second time I am having these thoughts. So can u answer my question ladies? Thanks so much.

  10.  #10Femininewoman on March 4, 2013 at 6:04 pm

    K2012 Click on Dominique’s namE

  11.  #11Khb1870 on March 4, 2013 at 6:23 pm


    I’m so sorry you’re here right now but it will get better, I promise. I just got thru the same situation & it’s amazing how tangled up in someone else’s needs & someone else’s drama you can get because you think you love them. I’m not trying to devalue your feelings, but time will give you perspective that being with this man couldn’t. There’s a reason Rori refers to this as an Imaginary relationship.

    Please take these truths to heart:

    • If you were ever truly a priority, you would never have been asked or been “charmed” into being the “other” woman. I’m not saying that a man can’t fall out of love with his spouse, sometimes it just isn’t a good match, but REAL men, the only kind you truly want in your life, will deal with their issues
    before they get you involved.

    • Being with this man while he’s in an unhappy marriage puts you smack dab in the middle of someone else’s issues, someone else’s drama, someone else’s problems, none of which really have anything else to do with you. It’s like stepping into some stranger’s defaulted loan payments and YOUR credit score suffering for it. You should never have to serve as a man’s buffer from his responsibilities. You gave of yourself, which made him feel good about himself, you validated him and made him feel invincible. I can almost guess that, outside of the sweet words & occasional gifts, if there were any of those, he did little to boost your esteem.

    • He clearly likes having his cake & eating it too MUCH more than worrying about your feelings, your well-being.

    • Don’t let this other woman he’s “fallen” for make you feel like you were not enough for him. You were blessed with an out that you just can’t process yet. I’m guessing she will be the one who has to deal with the angry spouse or “ex”, any spousal or child support that he has to eventually pay out while move-in girl works to support him.

    • Do not think that he has forgotten about you. He will pop up again when he needs you to validate him. He may even be shocked that you aren’t willing to do that for him, as if your pain & feelings were totally unfounded. Or he may turn on the sweet talk, or just start showing up in small ways to test the waters. Just know, it is VERY likely to happen, even if it’s just to make sure that you still think well of him.

    • He will prey on your life as long as you keep any connection or contact with him. You don’t owe any explanation, but if you need closure, kept it short & simple and walk away. You don’t have to be mean or vindictive, just tell him you accept his decision not to be with you the next time he contacts you. You could say, “We were both under a lot of pressure to make an impossible situation work, and I’m thankful that the pressure is now off because it’s time I focused on what I need to move my life forward.” It’s classy, it’s not likely to stir up any further questions or a or confrontation because that’s what he wants. He wants to think of you as the one waiting on the back burner just in case this one doesn’t work. And it takes the ball off the court so that he has no further reason to contact you.

    I wish I could give you a HUG in person. It stinks. There’s a great book called Me Before We you could read that might be a help. Do whatever you need to get to the core of who you are because I swear it is the best present you can give yourself.

    Somewhere inside all this pain there is a Butterfly named Eileen that wants the best for you & will not accept less. It may not be easy, but you WILL get there.

    Much Love!!!!

  12.  #12Emerson on March 4, 2013 at 6:31 pm

    Wow This post is so powerful Rori…
    I do feel like RecycledCD was a drug to me,,,dragging things out and always dangling a carrot…only to be let down.
    I let it happen.
    I had to take a longgg deep breath and be completely on my own and when I say long breath I mean like a year!!
    I finally feel a little more like “me” and able to rebuild myself…
    And CDing…
    Funny how it is when I was involved with RecycledCD I was laid off from my job and lost my house.

    Now I’m rebuilding everything but it’s ok.
    I feel that I have not been a good friend to some of my girlfriends in the past year because I have been so focused on myself and my issues.

    It’s ok cuz they are still there and still my friends.
    I am still growing and learning.
    I feel the pain sometimes but it’s ok I know it will be ok.

    I spoke with ExoticCD today and he is sweet and charming…easygoing and nice…BUT I felt a bit turned off while speaking to him on the phone…and I will tell you why:

    He has a female friend that is a close friend and they spend time together on weekends etc…which is NONE of my business…he chats to me about it casually (ick)

    but it makes me feel weird and I wonder if they are involved…

    He told me about her on our first date and at that time, I did ask a “just curious” question if they have been or are involved physically/sexually attracted/feelings???

    And he says they are not but I still don’t trust people…it makes me wonder.

    One of my friends reminded me that men and women can be legit friends and platonic and it is indeed possible…but I feel territorial and guarded and overall TURNED OFF by it…

    It’s like I don’t want to get close and get hurt…I feel I have to compete with her….I’m already dreading meeting her if ExoticCD and I progress (I DO like him and I WANT to believe him, but I don’t want to be naiive)…

    MIND YOU we have only been on two dates…but I’m just trying to be aware of red flags…sirens your thoughts????

    I would like to switch my thinking on this subject and issue if I could, but I feel I need some help

  13.  #13k2012 on March 4, 2013 at 7:03 pm

    Eileen has been used by this married man. That is how some of these married men behave. Sounds like a player and a liar. Emerson-11, just observe a little bit more. Don’t jump to conclusions yet. Observe him further before u make a conclusion.

  14.  #14Luzydel on March 4, 2013 at 8:00 pm

    I’m entering The world of dating again slowly; mostly because I want to test my boat and see it can float without sinking.

    I am paying attention to my feelings, I see I have stronger boundaries and my standards have change…
    I am more about intelligence than about looks and or about men who seen to see my physique and refer to me as “sexy” instead, I like men who compliment my beauty and my smile etc.

    I have change inside, I feel it. I feel stronger confident. Not desperate and I catch myself when I am detouring without being mean to me. I have some prospects CD’s, noone to write about yet, but I know this time will be better, because I am better.

  15.  #15Memulo on March 4, 2013 at 8:03 pm

    My cd called and said HOW MUCH he does for me. And how well he treats me and how often. I had to use my sense of humor to hold the conversation. I didn’t – said we need to talk in person. He said – you want dinner? I said NO.

    OMG. He felt so small to me.

  16.  #16Memulo on March 4, 2013 at 8:11 pm

    But he is not a player. Or a liar. At least not with me. Still what he offers is not enough to make me happy. It’s not enough to make me respect him. WHAT does he do for me? He takes me to dinner once or twice a week. he gets to be in my bubbly company, in my pretty dress, with my little stories and then he gets to spend a night. He can always increase his income by seeing more patients. even 1 more patient a day for a week would make up for 3-4 dinners or so? What’s his problem??

  17.  #17Memulo on March 4, 2013 at 8:12 pm

    I miss to be with my equal. I miss a guy who has enough taste NOT to say: I do so much for you.

  18.  #18Memulo on March 4, 2013 at 8:17 pm

    K2012, of course you should date besides your phone conversations with this guy! No question about that 😉

    If he says he misses you tell him to come over. If you are free you may spend an evening with him;)

  19.  #19Daria on March 4, 2013 at 8:45 pm

    Wow this post feels so life-rafty swimming in the strong river

  20.  #20Daria on March 4, 2013 at 8:50 pm

    Memulo – wow that’s where I was with Nanny Cd! ‘I do so much for you’. Frequent pointing out of what he does…

    Eek that doesn’t feel good to my heart fire… I feel lonely…

    I wonder how Id express this in words…

  21.  #21Emerson on March 4, 2013 at 8:52 pm

    Thank you k2012!

    Hi luzydel!!!
    Good for you dating and paying attention to your feelings…I need that reminder.

    I’m not being authentic with exoticCD about feeling distant..and my feelings of wariness about the girl “friend” ….i feel it’s too early on to be mentioning that cuz i dont want to sound crazy but i also want to be honest and authentic….Not sure what to say. What do you ladies think!?

  22.  #22Daria on March 4, 2013 at 8:52 pm

    Love Always – ‘Modern Sirem helps you reach your inner beauty’. Thank you for these words… I get it… It does…

  23.  #23Daria on March 4, 2013 at 8:54 pm

    (((((((April Rose)))))))

  24.  #24Daria on March 4, 2013 at 8:57 pm

    Yay sha-sha 🙂 ! Tell me more…

  25.  #25Daria on March 4, 2013 at 9:07 pm

    K2012 – you rock … I really like your ‘voice’ … I can feels thrills so intensely when U were sharing abt your excitement

  26.  #26Daria on March 4, 2013 at 9:10 pm

    Tam – I freakin admire how easily and casually you’re able to ‘get a little side job’ and it be fun and sweet too… Awwww I want this skill

    Lookin up in awe w smile …

  27.  #27Daria on March 4, 2013 at 9:11 pm

    Sigh 🙂 I feel pleased and excited that I’m gonna have this skill now…

  28.  #28SoulfulGoddess on March 4, 2013 at 9:29 pm

    Such excellent advice for Eileen! Eileen, if you’re reading this, welcome and I sincerely hope you take it to heart. Life is such a blessing … every single day … and not to be wasted on those who cannot or will not care for you, or who will string you along. All the best in your journey!

  29.  #29Daria on March 4, 2013 at 9:32 pm

    I feel so in love with life !

    Mating and courtship is like a ceremony !

    And so fun!!!!!! Who will show up ???????

    Ohhhhhhhhh 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

    I love sharing wit yall my sisters 🙂 🙂 🙂

  30.  #30Emerson on March 4, 2013 at 10:42 pm

    Are all the sirens sleeping….

  31.  #31Heart on March 4, 2013 at 10:52 pm

    Ok..CudG wrote me & asked me to hang out sometime soon….he suggested dinner & watching a movie at my place or his….and asked me many questions about the relocation…

  32.  #32Heart on March 4, 2013 at 10:53 pm

    I feel ….

  33.  #33Emerson on March 4, 2013 at 11:04 pm

    Hi heart
    Wow are you surprised that cudg asked you?

  34.  #34Heart on March 4, 2013 at 11:17 pm

    Emers – I feel like ….


  35.  #35Heart on March 4, 2013 at 11:19 pm

    emotional spent….
    that’s it….
    my feeling fountain is exhausted…
    my oceans have a headache…
    I feel relieved..I feel bored…

  36.  #36Heart on March 4, 2013 at 11:55 pm

    Congratulations Tam ….Lets hope your boss doesn’t turn into a Mr. Naps….
    lol..remember him? I do ….lol!

  37.  #37Melissa on March 5, 2013 at 12:00 am

    Hi Elieen
    I am sorry that you are going through this. It can’t be easy. This is a really big learning opportunity for you. You need to work on your self esteem so that you can attract better partners and not settle for less than your worth. For starters, do not get involved with married men, nothing good will come from it.

    Check out this website http://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/
    it has helped me immensely. Start loving yourself today and cut all contact with this toxic man.

    Best of luck!

  38.  #38Heart on March 5, 2013 at 12:07 am

    My last date with him was Almost a month ago.He acted like the was no time between us…

  39.  #39Heart on March 5, 2013 at 12:13 am

    The messed up thing is…I want to see him & get my cuddle fix.

  40.  #40Heart on March 5, 2013 at 12:21 am

    I want to visit this Garden place he said he would take me too….but I don’t want to fall into masculine energy & suggest it.

    How should i communicate to him that I want to go there instead?

  41.  #41Heart on March 5, 2013 at 12:23 am

    You know I didn’t realize that, even though we didn’t have sex, staying over at his place changed everything…

    I feel as if it made him lazy.

  42.  #42Rebecca on March 5, 2013 at 1:22 am

    Morning sirens…

    I am in such a funk with my work situation. It’s like I’ve had a total meltdown. I can’t seem to concentrate on anything… or get a grip…. I just feel this extreme paranoia and fear that – it is similar to an experience I had in a job years ago…. I feel like I am being extremely picked on and I feel embarrassed to be in this situation – and I feel like no-one can/will help me.

    I feel confused?! Sorry….

  43.  #43Heart on March 5, 2013 at 1:26 am

    I knew it must have surprised him to find out I was moving…

    He asked me if I was the one who wanted to relocate of if the company was making me go…
    At any rate he took 4 days and a couple of hours to the news…

  44.  #44Indigo on March 5, 2013 at 3:20 am

    I find it so interesting that you can go through those dark times, like Rori talked about, and then one day, the sun comes out. It is shining brightly in the sky, and your heart is as light as a bird on the air.

    How can one day carry such promise and another such despair? And what distinguishes the two?

    I don’t know if it is just my journey, but some days I am just so in love with my life, my surroundings, myself, and I know everything is going to be fine come what may. And other days seem so gloomy and dark it’s hard to believe that things will be ok again.

    Is this just part of the journey? The dark days get fewer and your ability to see the light that will come gets stronger?

    What do you ladies think?

  45.  #45Indigo on March 5, 2013 at 3:26 am


    Just remember the most important thing here, is you.

    Find the courage to take the time and space for yourself that you need to do your work, and to ask for help and information from those you need it from, and to practice your calm, professional voice in communicating to your colleagues when they are speaking or behaving towards you in a way which is not working for you.

    And if these things don’t work, be really loving and gentle to yourself and tell your inner one who is distressed that you will look for another job for her.

    hugs to you

  46.  #46joan T on March 5, 2013 at 3:30 am

    Hello, I met this man in 1978, He told me we where
    10 years ago, in a three ring circus, and I stab in the
    back, which is not true. If you can help me win him
    back, I need you to coach me, Please Thank you
    God Bless you I really want him back, right in front of
    me he asked the other girl to marry him, put she told
    me she do not love him, but today they still see each
    other. Mary Chris Joan T

  47.  #47Butterfly Wings on March 5, 2013 at 3:46 am

    315: FW from previous thread – I’m using him purely as practise, and he’s not stepping up anyway – just texting regularly and saying nice things.

    He didn’t make a move all those years ago because I was with his friend. Not really appropriate! lol

    And I’m not going to fall for any of his player moves, although some players stop playing when they’ve met the right girl. My expectations that this will happen with him are however zero. I’m 100% realistic about this.

    But he is a male, and I can practise using FMs on him with absolutely nothing to lose.

  48.  #48Butterfly Wings on March 5, 2013 at 3:50 am

    Feeling a bit flat tonight after a yukky day at work.

    S hasn’t called/texted since this morning, which is VERY unlike him. But I do know he was supposed to get back today and was probably exhausted and sleeping.

    Acutally, it doesn’t matter what he was doing, because I had plans with M. It was nice with him as usual. When I was with M, my ex called to have a go at me about something. So it hasn’t helped my mood.

    I’m thinking of having an early night – I want today over… 🙁

  49.  #49Libelula on March 5, 2013 at 4:18 am

    I’ve made it through another day without contacting Mr Unavailable! This post helped me, too. Sometimes I can really see how like an addict I am to this relationship. I’ve been recalling a favorite line from the movie, Next Stop Wonderland. “With men, you always have a choice [to stay in it or to leave it].”

  50.  #50Vi on March 5, 2013 at 4:57 am

    I feel so triggered when MH asks dad for an advise re his career. I feel judgmental. What ‘s there for me? Remember myself asking for this kind of advise . I felt miserable then. Had no idea what I want and looked for ‘shoulds’. Tightness inmy chin, in my knees kinda too. Fists. Frowny brows. There is still beating up going on inside me.. I love my former me. I love my not knowing what to do. I love myfrustra

  51.  #51Heart on March 5, 2013 at 5:00 am

    Wow….since we reconnected I’ve only had 6 dates with CudG…
    we dated before but Omg…
    I lost perspective….
    Reality Check!
    That is barely anthing….

  52.  #52Vi on March 5, 2013 at 5:01 am

    tion. I feel bad he might feel the way I felt long ago. Judging it as ‘weaknes’ .. I love my own ‘weaknesses’. They make me human. I want to love every second of my past. I return my focus on me. feeling thankful for the trigger.

  53.  #53Heart on March 5, 2013 at 5:02 am

    Am I in a Imaginary relationship…?

    We started seeing each other last summer..but do those summer dates count?
    I don’t know to respond to his email.

  54.  #54Heart on March 5, 2013 at 5:47 am

    Wow I’ve asked a million & one questions….
    hehe….Somebody talk to me…

  55.  #55Tam on March 5, 2013 at 5:47 am

    34, Heart lolol..oh yes, I remember and feel amused that you do too!

  56.  #56Tam on March 5, 2013 at 5:50 am

    25 Thanks Daria..well it feels a little stressful and juggling too, but I enjoy that in a strange way, after so much slowness in my life..I am rushing around again lol

  57.  #57April Rose on March 5, 2013 at 5:54 am

    Thank you for the hugs LoveAlways and Daria

  58.  #58Tam on March 5, 2013 at 5:56 am

    I wrote back to MrP, expressing that I feel surprised he shared this stuff about women bringing out his ‘dark side’…with me. And that I feel curious as to whether he wants to stay alone…
    I don’t think he will answer that one.
    I feel kinda free now though and like ‘nothing to lose’. I do feel curious to find out how he thinks about relationships etc. And it seems he has become a bit more open. Nice experiment.

    Meanwhile Curly has been acting weird, driving all over the country to visit friends after his father passed. I dunno. I feel judgmental, like, he has a lot of stuff to sort out and is numbing reality. he sounds almost elated happy. It feels odd, like instead of numbing his reality with pot, he is numbing it with friends right now, when he has tons of other stuff to deal with and people to support. He is visiting people he hasn’t seen for 35 years and partying, and talking about going on a radio show..while his father’s funeral is organised and his estate, and there is a house and his father’s spouse to be taken care of.
    I feel bad for being so judgmental..but – I find it very weird. I wonder if he will ‘crash’ when he comes back here.

  59.  #59Elsie on March 5, 2013 at 6:41 am

    Hi all…..TODAY IS THE DAY.

    Its our anniversary today. Yesterday out of the blue he kissed me… We talked for hours. I know he is still in the place where he is dealing with stuff and so am I….and frankly, I’m *sure* he has forgotten.

    I just need all of you today – for sure. Especially you Dominique haha!

    I decided to take your advice, and not say anything. Someday if things work out we will have a real anniversary. And just because we are connected does not mean we are in a relationship (thats from Christian Carter) and so until we are there in a real relationship where we are talking about our future life together, then we have a connection – but not a girlfriend/boyfriend relationship.

    Let me get through my stuff, he can get through his stuff, and we will see where we are whenever all that dust settles.

    In the meantime – today will be HARD anyway – no matter what my head says – my heart wants flowers and a date…….



  60.  #60Memulo on March 5, 2013 at 6:51 am

    Elsie, from the point of view of a person who always ‘gave it time’ and ‘waited for the right moment’ to celebrate and acknowledge the relationship – perhaps it’s not a terrible thing to make an exception and tell him, and let him romance you. Up to you, I don’t really know your story that well. I think now that doing the right thing always is good, but you can allow some deviations;)

  61.  #61Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 7:22 am

    Regarding my post #11 I would love some feedback ….Dominique ? Fw? Sirens ? Thanks

  62.  #62April Rose on March 5, 2013 at 7:36 am


    I remember Rori talking about this in her Love Forever program.
    She said you’re either a woman who can handle a man having women friends, or you’re not. She is not.

  63.  #63Heart on March 5, 2013 at 7:36 am


  64.  #64Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 7:51 am

    62 thanks April rose
    I don’t think I am either 🙁

  65.  #65April Rose on March 5, 2013 at 7:56 am

    I’ve always been so used to people around me having friends of the opposite sex. And there isn’t any attraction, they are just friends. It was an eye-opener for me to hear of it being a deal-breaker for some women.

  66.  #66Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 8:09 am

    Emerson I know I would suspect that that is a romantic relationship because many men don’t have relationships with women without the hope of sex. I am a woman who have male friends, married and unmarried, who don’t have sex with them. Yet I can tell you that some of the men, even married ones, bring it up. Suggesting that if I was willing they would go there.

    As this is just dating with exoticCD, I would not encourage you to bring it up. You’ve only been out twice, right? I would assume that the make out session was done because it felt good to you. Projecting into the future by bringing her up is likely to raise a red flag for him. I know of guys who have had close girlfriends and voluntarily drop them when they meet “the one”. Especially when they know the girl (friend) is in love with them.

  67.  #67Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 8:19 am

    66 thanks FW that’s very helpful. I’m agreeing with what you said 100%….so I think I will remain open and date him…

    He says he really does want a relationship so why isn’t he in one with her.??.. That’s what I wonder…
    But I like what you said that guys will drop the girl “friend” when they meet the “one”… They’re pretty involved though, they share ownership of a boat and go out boating and jet ski (which is a hobby that he and I have in common too)…
    It’s just weird.

    Thanks April rose its good to hear another view.

  68.  #68Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 8:19 am

    k2012 – Thank you for subscribing to my site. And I write not so much newsletters as weekly articles which will come to you email inbox when you are subscribed. Signing up for my free ebook or purchasing my for sale ebook will automatically put you on my list.

    In answer to your question, words are simply words until there are actions to support them. I suppose it’s possible he misses bantering with you though it seems to me that would indicate interest in you.

    So I’ve not really answered your question. 🙂


  69.  #69MovingMagic on March 5, 2013 at 8:20 am

    Heart, can you reconnect with him without any expectations? If not, exactly what are your expectations/boundaries?

  70.  #70Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 8:28 am

    Memulo – 15 – Ick. xxoo


  71.  #71Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 8:31 am

    “they share ownership of a boat” – this might be for financial reasons but in the long run I know I would not be comfortable with such an arrangement. My challenge would be around trusting him to change this arrangement.

  72.  #72Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 8:35 am

    Indigo – 44 – Yes that’s how life works. And yes the more you release and let go, heal, the more the sunshiney days will glow. There are still moments, days even where you will feel cloudy, and there doesn’t have to be a reason. Sometimes it just is, and then the clouds clear.


  73.  #73Kath on March 5, 2013 at 8:41 am

    #67 Emerson,

    Men can be friends with women. I have a number of good male (straight!) friends and we’ve never been attracted to each other. The man I love and who could be my x by tomorrow night also has a number of female friends. However, his friendships are different in that he slept with all of them first and had some kind of sexual relationship before they were demoted to friend status. And I’ve just realised, guess who decided that they were better off being friends??- yup-him!!- Uhm, I should think about that, shouldn’t I?!

  74.  #74BeLoved on March 5, 2013 at 8:42 am

    Emerson – trust your gut.
    I had NO problem with T having female friends – he was a totally open book, nothing to hide.

    On the other hand, with C, before I even felt attracted to him, I noticed feeling highly triggered by him having so many female friends.

    The difference being, I think, that C can’t really say ‘no’, especially to a woman, and would be passive aggressive with his no’s, and not upfront (like – he didn’t mention to me that he had a girlfriend until after a few months of heavy flirtation and affection). C is shysty and has terrible boundaries.

    T – GOOD boundaries. Strong sense of character, who he is, and nearly always took my feelings into consideration. Once when a woman came sniffing around and felt rebuffed and rejected by him, she stirred up some stuff and was accusing me (to him!) of retaliating against her. He *handled* it. I mean, HANDLED it. Dealt with her, dealt with the drama, had community members present to witness…and he handled it so well it never ever ever touched me and after he and she had a sort of mediation about it, it was finished, done, complete, not even a whisper of it ever again. T is the kind of person who, if he tells me about a conversation he had with someone, I can trust that he is repeating nearly verbatim what he told them, with no spin. He isn’t ‘2-faced’ and I never worried he was being a different way with someone else than he was with me.

    C – who knows how he is with other women and what he tells them? Meh. No trust there.

    So..again, trust your gut!

  75.  #75Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 8:42 am

    Elsie – 59 – Today doesn’t HAVE to be hard. You can choose to not allow this. Yes I understand – easy for me to say, yet it can be EASY. You can fill your head and heart with flowers and rainbows. Conjure up anything and everything which feel really good, even if only a little bit.

    Take yourself out to lunch. But yourself a trinket or a new lipstick. New make up for most women feel really satisfying. Or a pretty scarf. Anything. It doesn’t have to cost much.

    And keep that openness and curiosity going. 🙂


  76.  #76CurvySiren10 on March 5, 2013 at 8:50 am

    I feel triggered by statements implying that all men are interested in sex with all women, even ones that they have never been sexual with and have no attraction to. My man has a good female friend and has since before we met. He’s told me blatantly that there was never an attraction on either side, but she happens to be someone he very occasionally gets together with for a meal or input on something. He rarely does this and I feel it’s no threat to us at all. I feel antsy hearing this “absolute” type of statement about men and women not being able to be just platonic friends.

  77.  #77Memulo on March 5, 2013 at 8:55 am

    It tortures me that dumbcd found someone who’s ‘better’ than me. I see even in the relationship with my cd how hard it is to find the right match even when people are willing to and I know that on so many levels I was right for dumbcd. Yet he got someone better and their relationship is progressing. I know he really liked and respected me.. yet there was someone better around.

  78.  #78Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:01 am

    Sirens thanks for all your feedback it really helps ….

    I don’t know how it’s going to play out…
    But I intend to keep an open mind.

    I just remember recycledCD telling me that when he was with his wife, he had a female friend that was very overweight and not attractive so his wife was not worried about them being any more than friends… But truth was they were having sex regulary..Ewww.

  79.  #79Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:03 am

    Movingmagic – I wondering about it….it’s weird but he’s acting like no time went by & that we’re in the exact same place we were when he stopped asking me out.

    What’s Rori’s advice for situations like this?

  80.  #80Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:04 am

    I’m reading the book called your killer Emotions and its All about controlling your feelings and not being impulsive or self destructive. Ill be honest it’s a slow/ tough read (just the way the book is formatted and the author repeats himself a lot ) but it has some good info…
    I want to control my emotions in the workplace and also when with men who I’m trying to communicate with…

  81.  #81Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 9:05 am

    I had one guy declare his love for me yesterday. He told me how attracted he is to my personality, authenticity and openness. He totally said whenever I am ready he was ready to marry me because he believes I am a prize and that any man who gets me would be getting a treasure. I watched him enter and exit a relationship 3 years ago. The woman allowed her insecurities to get the better of her and accused him of all kinds of things. He was given an ultimatum about a close girlfriend he had and he gave in dropped that friend. When he was entering the romantic relationship I was aware that he was in love with me as he told me. Later he told me that he believed I was out of his league because of the differences in our careers. The last time I brought up the friend who he had to distance himself from, he mentioned she was in another relationship with a man who he believes is not going to settle down with anyone anytime soon. He said the girl was declaring her undying love for him wantng him but he knows he has to stay away from her as he wants to get married soon.

    I am not physically attracted to him and have tried to never give him the impression that I am. Yet all these years he has tried to come close to me. Even while in the other relationship we would talk but not as frequently and he did feel that he had drifted far away a bit. When the relationship started to disintegrate he would share his battle stories, the red flags he noticed and the reasons why he decided to stall. Maybe I could say I was an anchor for him. Yet this is where I have had challenges with men. I speak so frankly that most are drawn to me because of that but as a “friend”.

  82.  #82Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:06 am

    79 heart are you CDing other men?
    CudG sounds like he feels comfortable to pick up where he left off but he seems to be going about his life and not making you a priority per se,,,whereas you seem to be directing a lot of energy at him… Which I don’t fault you for I do that too….

  83.  #83Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 9:07 am

    Emerson I don’t like the concept of controlling the emotions. For me it is easier to wrap my mind around not “acting out on my emotions”. Controlling the emotions suggests putting them under a pail and sitting on it while the emotions bounce back and forth threatening to turn the pail over. Like a volcano rumbling underground.

  84.  #84Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:10 am

    I have to say that exoticCD has been up front about her from the beginning …. I just feel bored and turned off talking about her. Can I tell him that of he keeps bringing her up???

  85.  #85Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:12 am

    83 I love your bucket analogy!!!
    Yes you’re right maybe not the best wording to control emotions but manage them…
    A lot of his book talks about problems with alcohol and not drinking and driving as in think about the consequences, etc so that part is a lil tiresome to read as I don’t drink often and I certainly don’t drink and drive.

  86.  #86Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:12 am

    Emerson – Im moving from my current abode…but Im going out this weekend…I’ll mingle & meet ppl but it’s difficult to think about dating now since I have to leave.

  87.  #87Indigo on March 5, 2013 at 9:12 am


    With all due respect, how do you know that?

    You are telling yourself stories you don’t know are true to torture yourself. I’m not sure why.

  88.  #88Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 9:14 am

    Maybe I would want to go boating with them to see what the vibe is between them.

  89.  #89Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:15 am

    I am really feeling low about myself as far as being able to manage my life sometimes… I just did my taxes and I made very little money last year omg… This year has got to be better!! I hope that I can find a new job and that is one of my goals…

  90.  #90Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:16 am

    What does Rori say to do when he comes forward ?

  91.  #91ArabianLove on March 5, 2013 at 9:16 am

    Heart – 79- Dominique wrote a comment to me stating that what feels like a whole day to a woman seems like a minute to a man … and trust me I believe that statement.

    We focus on VERY different things.

    Why don’t you just try to enjoy his company … no matter how many dates it has been.
    Honestly, I truly believe men dont think twice about the silly things we think of as being the end all of our relationship.

  92.  #92Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:17 am


  93.  #93Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:17 am

    88 FW
    I like that idea and it was brought up actually… I have a girlfriend that I Jetski with so we could all go together!

  94.  #94Olivia on March 5, 2013 at 9:18 am

    Re. the Rori article: Listening to powerful woman singers comes to mind as a way to help get up and over this situation. Aretha Franklin comes to mind…some Lauren Hill…some ladies on here like Alanis Morisette…

  95.  #95Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:19 am

    Thanks heart for the hugs…
    That’s right you’re moving…
    I feel excited for you!
    Hmm I have a good feeling about your change …

  96.  #96Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:19 am

    Arabian Love ….thanks for the feedback. Hmmmm

  97.  #97Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:29 am

    Hi Olivia
    I love Alanis morisette!

  98.  #98Heart on March 5, 2013 at 9:35 am

    I guess when we Reconnected I had expectations..but the second time around he was different…
    Last year he came at my like a guy who wanted a relationship…
    But he’s very casual now…
    oh well im leaving

  99.  #99Indigo on March 5, 2013 at 9:45 am

    Thanks Dominique 🙂 Today my heart felt like a bird on the wing.

    Even though I had a busy day at work I felt like all the joys of springtime were caught up in my soul.

    It made me think that even during my dark times I can see days like this to come.

  100.  #100Annie on March 5, 2013 at 9:46 am

    “Take whatever therapeutic “talk” sessions they’ll give you, or anywhere they’ll refer you.”

    I feel curious, wanted to know what type of talk sessions do you think are available or help?

    Something like co-dependency? for instance?
    Or something else?

  101.  #101Annie on March 5, 2013 at 9:47 am

    Welcome Eileen. Hugs. And here is to a brighter future. X

  102.  #102Indigo on March 5, 2013 at 9:52 am


    Yes, the men I have loved have always had women friends, and although this has traditionally been triggering for me, they have never been legitimate threats.

    I struggle with it until I become more secure as over time the man proves his trustworthiness. I absolutely believe that many men are honourable and perfectly able to be around other women platonically without ever overstepping or being unfaithful to the woman that they love. That said, I do think that trust needs to be “earned” in a way by consistent trustworthy behaviour.

  103.  #103ArabianLove on March 5, 2013 at 9:55 am

    Heart, what is his life like … in terms of work and all that. Sometimes we don’t realize what is happening in someone’s life and we take their issues as proof of them being uninterested.

    Most times, I believe it’s not so.

  104.  #104Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 9:57 am

    98 heart most likely he cares about you a lot but maybe he cannot “do relationship”

  105.  #105CurvySiren10 on March 5, 2013 at 9:58 am

    Indigo, thanks for those words. I agree. I am typically battling insecurity due to my history with this man (and others) but I feel none when it comes to his friendship with this woman. I feel very triggered when I hear all of these absolutes being tossed around, as if there is only one way for a man to be.

  106.  #106Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 10:00 am

    Indigo – 99 – And these are beautiful memories to call up when the darkness does descend. They may not take the clouds away, yet they may help part them some. 🙂


  107.  #107CurvySiren10 on March 5, 2013 at 10:00 am

    Memulo, you do realized you’ve made this story up entirely right? You have absolutely no knowledge of this, only speculation based on the fact that he dropped off the dating sites. There are a myriad of reasons that may have happened, including the most plausible one…that he realized he isn’t in a position to be in a relationship with anyone while sorting through his messy divorce and custody issues.

  108.  #108ArabianLove on March 5, 2013 at 10:00 am

    I am sure he cares about you a lot too Heart ;)!

  109.  #109CurvySiren10 on March 5, 2013 at 10:01 am

    Emerson, I think you’re handling all of this very well. exoticCD and all of the others. I can see how much you’ve grown! Here’s hoping for getting your professional stuff sorted as well…

  110.  #110Memulo on March 5, 2013 at 10:01 am


    Thank you but he is not back on the dating site. And I think the girl knew he was with me before because they were introduced by common friends and then he was sort of pulled in it, as if his friend organized going out, like double dates or so. Which means she really wanted him and had an insider information;)

  111.  #111Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 10:12 am

    Thanks curvy siren!

  112.  #112Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 10:28 am

    Dominique I’d love your feedback

  113.  #113Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Emerson – I have not been with a man who had female friends, and I feel fortunate that this is what I apparently manifested, for I don’t think I would feel comfortable around this, more so if my man ever went out with her without me. For me it’s kind of strange, yet I know many couples that maneuver this very, very well with no problems whatsoever.

    Yes you can certainly say something to him if he talks about her more than you feel comfortable with.

    eg. “I don’t feel comfortable hearing about …… It actually makes me feel kind of awful. Can you help me with this? Can you help me feel better around this?”


  114.  #114Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Hmm I’m realizing I don’t have confidence in maintaining attraction…although its silly cuz men are attracted to me even years later after a breakup. I wonder where this fear comes from.

  115.  #115Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 10:39 am

    Thanks Dominique

  116.  #116Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 10:44 am

    There is a new thread up.

    Dominique I feel Icky that maybe I manifested a man with other women around him… It happens to me a lot ! Help…!!!

  117.  #117Dominique on March 5, 2013 at 11:02 am

    Emerson – Maybe there is something to heal here? Trust issues as a for instance?


  118.  #118Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 11:04 am

    117 yes for sure… The question is how to heal

  119.  #119Kath on March 5, 2013 at 11:31 am

    Emerson, I am so understanding where you’re coming from!
    I don’t like one of my man’s female friends- not because she is that but because she is a leach and a parasite and I know that he has heled her out financially far more than he should. He was very protective of her but did stop seeing her when I told him how I felt about her. Recently though it caused an argument between us because he offered to give her a lift to a party at his Sister’s house 4hrs away. He said he didn’t feel he could say no, I said I’d put up with it but the closer it came to the drive the more he became agitated and then asked me for reassurance because he said he wasn;t looking forward to the drive!- God dammit!- I asked him why he was looking for reassurance from me and he said because he didn’t want to upset me by saying anything to her that I might inappropriate!- Can you imagine how many alarm bells clanged at that moment!!!!!!

  120.  #120Kath on March 5, 2013 at 11:33 am

    I meant to say might think inappropriate in the piece above-sorry!

  121.  #121Femininewoman on March 5, 2013 at 11:40 am

    OMG Kath

  122.  #122Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 12:37 pm

    Wow Kath that is a tough situation.
    I would not be thrilled at all.
    Women are territorial I don’t care what anyone says. At some point the girl “friend” becomes a point of contention.
    Not sure what to tell you except sending good thoughts your way.
    I feel threatened by another female in the picture because I feel like my man should be helping me and be there for me…. Not using “our” resources on another female…. That is if we are a true couple or married where resources are shared.

  123.  #123Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    And by resources I don’t just mean money… I also mean emotional energy, time, effort…. Etc

  124.  #124k2012 on March 5, 2013 at 2:02 pm

    Hey ladies how are u? I haven’t read all the comments above as yet. Today was pretty busy. But I have another question. Do u think that the chances of a man approaching me at the park is greater if I go alone that if I go with one of my girlfriends? Just curious Let me know please.

  125.  #125Kath on March 5, 2013 at 2:13 pm

    Emerson, yep- I’m with you all the way!
    – Whilst I have been tolerant I truly feel that my man should be focussing on me and not concedrning himself with any other female’s feelings- except his Mother’s!- and even then only to a degree!- But because my msn thinks there’s no problem with maintaining friendships with x-lovers- even though there is no reason for it!- I have very little room to say that I don’t think its right- it is wonderful to hear that there are women who agree with me!xx

  126.  #126k2012 on March 5, 2013 at 2:55 pm

    Memulo 18. He is long distance my dear. Overseas. So if he was to visit, it wouldn’t be right now. Thanks Daria.

  127.  #127Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    124 k2012
    Alone is better for me… Then I can practice my tools like I’m all that, open palms and open heart, five second smile, waterwheel, my eyes are magnets… And I can focus my energy differently… When with a friend I still can but its not the same… Experiment with both ways…

  128.  #128Emerson on March 5, 2013 at 4:00 pm

    125 Kath
    It’s so triggering for me because my ex would’ve about his friendships with women and it was always an issue. I am trying to be open but again I am territorial and I want my man to myself 🙂

  129.  #129k2012 on March 5, 2013 at 8:06 pm

    Dominique-“In answer to your question, words are simply words until there are actions to support them.” Amen. Thank u so much for reemphasizing that point Dominique. Trust me. That’s why I was puzzled. Cause I was saying how can he miss me if he is not interested. Maybe its the bantering he misses for true. When I read your response which also said that the comment indicates an interest in me, I said to myself that, that is not a serious interest though, it is a casual interest as if a man is serious about you, u will certainly know as his actions will DEFINITELY show. I have little feeling for Overseas cd and when he said he missed me, I certainly wasn’t going to respond that I missed him too. If he was to shock me and step up and show me that he is serious,my feelings would grow. But as it currently exists, his actions says it all. So when he said he misses me, I didn’t take it serious. It is the second time he saying that.

  130.  #130Kath on March 6, 2013 at 4:33 am

    128 Emerson,

    Its hard isn’t it?- you don’t want to come over as a demanding person and say no you can’t have female friends but at the same time you do need to be mindful of what the relationship is or has been. I just think its odd that anyone would want to stay friends with someone they’d had a relationship with and it didn’t work out. To my mind unless there’s children involved, there’s no need for it-they are an x for a reason!- Perhaps to reassure you it would be good to ask more questions so you know more about the friendship and what it means to him-

  131.  #131Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 5:46 am

    He told Olivia that he drank because he was unhappy in this prior relationship, and both he and his former girlfriend had turned to addictive behavior to cope with their unhappiness. The former girlfriend’s addiction eventually became a deal breaker for him, so he ended things. Now that he’s with Olivia he says he’s happy and no longer feels the need to drink. He loves her like he’s never loved before.

    I think this is SO beautiful.

    He also has told her she just needs to relax and enjoy the relationship and that whatever problems arise will be dealt with as they do.

    I think this is SO wise.


  132.  #132Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 5:50 am

    Yeah Emerson. But ExoticCD is not your man. He is a stranger, with a life before he met you. It would be more than unreasonable for him to walk away from his life before he truly knows you. Before he knows if he wants you in his life for the long haul. How long has he known this girl? How long has known you? It seems you are claiming him way ahead of him claiming you. The relationship timeline seems to be totalling off, in your mind.

  133.  #133Emerson on March 6, 2013 at 7:00 am

    Fw132 I hear what you are saying….
    I’m not claiming him, I am getting to know him and just observing that there is a strong emotional tie to another female and it’s kind of a turnoff hearing about it all the time

  134.  #134Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 7:11 am

    Emerson I believe the comment “I am trying to be open but again I am territorial and I want my man to myself” is a give away to your internal thoughts.

  135.  #135Rachel on March 6, 2013 at 9:14 am

    Hugs to everyone … I haven’t been here in awhile because things have been going pretty well!! 😉

    I just have a little snafu that I’d like some input on. The man I’m in a relationship with lives several hundred miles from me right now and so we do a lot of video chats between visits. Last week, in the middle of a chat, he hung up. Boom. Gone.

    I figured his power had gone out or something and wasn’t upset. I went to bed thinking that in the morning, I’d get a text or IM with an explanation. But there was nothing. So I wrote a note and asked what happened. He didn’t answer for almost two days.

    Long story short … after a huge fight, he completely denied having hung up. He said we had finished talking and said good night. Ummm… no! I was still in the bathtub at the time he hung up!

    We got through it … still a little raw from some of the things said. And I still don’t understand how we have two such different versions of what happened. I know he was very tired that night and I wonder if he just dozed off and thought we’d said good night.

    The actual event wasn’t a big deal. To me, it felt rude for him to not explain something the next day … although apparently he didn’t think he needed to!

    So … we moved on. And last night … the EXACT same thing happened!

    I wrote a nice note before I went to sleep .. wished him well for today and asked what had happened.

    This morning … nothing. AUGH!

    I would think that after last week, he’d feel it was important to at least take 30 seconds to say … hey … here’s what happened… I fell asleep or my laptop died or whatever.

    This feels weird to me. I know he loves me. We have a great relationship overall and I don’t want to make a big deal out of this. But it feels really rude to me – especially after last week.

    I’m not nagging or ranting or being clingy or anything. But if I abruptly ended a call with someone … literally mid-sentence, I would try to explain.

    Any thoughts??

  136.  #136Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 9:36 am

    Rachel – But it feels really rude to me – is a judgement not a feeling. It seems you are assuming that he deliberately hung up or somehow cut you off. It might be, but until you establish exactly what happened by asking, thinking this way will affect your vibe as it is blaming him and making him wrong. I would be honest with him and ask him what happened and let him know that seeing it happened more than once I find my brain making up stories about it and if there is something I need to know.

    For all you know it could even be some technical glitch on your end. I would use this as practice to not jump to conclusions. But to think about rallying together as a team seeing this as a problem that maybe both of you can solve. Until he says something to make you think otherwise.

  137.  #137Rachel on March 6, 2013 at 9:47 am

    Thank you, Femininewoman. I realize that I don’t know what happened and the actual hanging up isn’t what bothers me. I know that happens for many reason when you’re doing long distance chats.

    What I am struggling with is the “morning after” silence. I want to be able tot ell him how this feels without judging or making him “wrong.”

    I guess I think he DOES know how it makes me feel after last week’s episode and so I feel surprised and sad that he is repeating it again by offering no note or text of explanation.

  138.  #138Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 9:59 am

    But he has not indicated yet that he *knows* the call was cut short.

  139.  #139Rachel on March 6, 2013 at 10:13 am

    That is true! Although it seems rather clear when you’re talking and then suddenly aren’t!

    I guess I’ll just have to wait and see what he says

  140.  #140Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 10:22 am

    Rachel – I don’t know this man and I don’t want to create any panic for you but I want to be honest to let you know what I actually thought. You don’t know if he might be using something that causes him to drop off to sleep and forget. Yet another assumption that I could make. I believe it is just best to talk with anger or awkwardness to see if there is something you need to know. It could be anything is causing the disconnections.

  141.  #141Rachel on March 6, 2013 at 11:11 am

    I had that thought too … not so much that he’s using something but that he may be having legitimate memory issues. I’ve noticed some other times here and there where he forgets things. I haven’t made a big deal of them, but I wonder if he is either under too much stress or too distracted to really be aware of what we’re discussing or there is a mental/physical issue. Hmmm…..

  142.  #142Emerson on March 6, 2013 at 11:22 am

    134 fw what am I supposed to do with this I’m feeling confused what you’re trying to tell me

  143.  #143Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 11:31 am

    Emerson you said in 133 that you are not claiming him as your man and I was pointing to the comment where you were doing that.

  144.  #144Femininewoman on March 6, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    correction “best to talk without anger or awkwardness”. Just that you have noticed this two times and you feel curious about what might be causing it.

  145.  #145Emerson on March 6, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    132 FW I was not claiming him or any man in particular..
    I was stating as a general term when I’m with someone in a relationship, I want my man to myself, I”m territorial…most women are. I was not referring to him specifically even though I was talking about his situation. I know he’s not my man FW

  146.  #146Bijou on March 6, 2013 at 10:08 pm

    Hi I am new hear but reading this blog has helped me, I am reading the have the relationship you want book now. I want to throw out my story and see what you insightful sirens say. I met R last April and I let him pursue me, he took me out bought me little gifts we went to Vegas and
    Things were going wonderfully. Right around 6 months things changed a bit. I noticed he withdrew abit and was struggling. He stopped seeing me as often and some of the sweet texts started to not come as often. I confronted him and he said he had a gear abetting close to someone in a relationship because of his previous horribleness relationship which I was understanding about, I noticed that some depressing was entering t he pic because of his jobs and struggles his kids were having. He got worse and I mentioned help a few times. He was at the point were the relationship was too much to bear on his other issues and we talked about taking a break or splitting up, but we seemed to want to try to work through it. Anyway he did make and appt last fri and I asked how it went and it sounder pretty positive but it would take a few months to get things run really smooth. That was the last I hear from him we’d didn say should i not contact him and see if he comes around.nothing about breaking up or needed space, I am crushed and I don’t know what to do. I haven’t called or emailed him, I know his depression is a factor and I would like to offer support. I even found a good book for him to read. Can u men ever fix themselves.

  147.  #147Rori Raye on March 6, 2013 at 10:33 pm

    Bijou, So sorry, and from what you say, this is done. Please don’t think about “supporting” a man in anything at only 6 months. You start that now – that’s all it’ll be. You’ll never get what you want in love finding a man good books to read to fix himself. How about you don’t get exclusive with a man until you know what’s up. Sometimes it takes a year to really know a man. Love, Rori

  148.  #148Kath on March 7, 2013 at 3:18 am

    146 Bijou,

    Oh dear, sounds as though you have an emotionally unavailable man- that is a tough one and can hurt a lot. I know its easy to want to offer help and support to him but its really not for you to do. He needs to get to grips with what happened, come to terms with it and move on and he has to do that on his own. Whilst he is doing that you can focus on you. Rori says take time to date yourself- and its so true!- do things you like to do, get a new hairestyle, buy a new dress, anything to keep you feeling good about yourself. From bitter experience I know how horrible it feels to try and help a man in emotional turmoil only to feel nothing is working-it feels like you’ve failed when this really isn’t the case. Focus on you bijou. Take care x

  149.  #149I must date her on March 7, 2013 at 5:13 am

    Great answer !!!

  150.  #150Bijou on March 7, 2013 at 6:39 am

    Thank you Rori and Kath. I wrote my first post through tears so parts are hard to follow and my grammar is bad and the spelling, well lets just say the iPad didn’t help. He was afraid of getting close to women because of a previous marriage that was horrible. I can’t help but blame myself. One time I got angry with him over something little and he said it scared him because it reminded him of his ex. I am working on communicating with feelings now, but I guess it is too late for us. Should I feel bad about letting this go when he is down? I know I can do better. I never met his kids even though next month would be a year of dating for us. That meant I could only see him every other weekend. He used to see me during the week, but then the drive got too long and there was so much traffic. I did offer to come see him sometimes as I know we live an at least an hour apart, but I guess that was leaning forward. He has a good job but pays a lot of his money to his ex and also pays child support, so he rents a room from his best friend. I know I am stupid for longing for the man that I first met who showered me with attention and took me out and sent my loving texts every day. I keep hoping he will fix himself with the therapy he started and come back. He had one depressive episode about three years ago and he got help and I guess it worked because he was fine when I met him until his job situation got a little shaky last Nov. Does depression often resurface over and over again? Why is it so hard for me to just say that he really doesn’t have a lot going for himself and walk away? Instead I cry and I blame myself and hope he will come back. I had to have done something wrong because everything was great for the first six months. Thanks for letting me vent here. I read this blog and realize that I am not alone and while that is sad, I feel some comfort.

  151.  #151Kath on March 7, 2013 at 7:12 am


    Please take comfort in knowing that you didn’t do anything wrong. He thought he was ready for a relationship and then sounds like he realised he wasn’t. That is no way, never will be, your fault. He got scared and started retreating because he hadn’t got over his past. I have had the same experience and I know how much it hurts because you want so much to help then and show that they are great people (and great for you!) and that’s probably where we go wrong. We shouldn’t have to prod and remind the man ho great we are together or how great we are for him- he should know!!- Don’t be hard on yourself, just put it down to experience, sigh, shed a tear, take a deep breath and move on. Someone wonderful, who’s perfect for you will come along, start sending out the messages of the kind of man you want and work with Rori and you’ll be amazed at what happens. Big HugX

  152.  #152butterflies8 on March 11, 2013 at 4:09 am

    This man was confused until we met. We both realized we were protecting each other from getting hurt. we talked to each other with trust and love. We both didn’t know what we wanted. We got honest with our souls resisted people and situations that would cause harm. He had to realize that he wanted a women for once and he learned to think positive he was happy with himself me our kids and we are soul mates. It was not easy but it was worth it no one is perfect people do end friendships finalize divorce. Men can be motivated to be there best self if you don’t try to change them and if you are willing to fix areas in yourself. Timing and the one and not allowing to give yourself to someone who isn’t ready happened to me and time gave us a healthy happy future.

  153.  #153Leslie on March 12, 2013 at 3:46 pm

    A cheater is a cheater, if he cheated on his wife, he will cheat on you and everyone else. He has his own issues about women and intimacy, learn a good lesson from this which is NEVER get involved with a married man no matter what. Be strong and care about yourself enough to say no to this.

  154.  #154giftoflove on March 14, 2013 at 1:07 am

    Thank you for looking out for our and your heart. Having learned my lesson that you describe in 153.
    The only part I would like to understand is how you feel NEVER as if life, God and people cannot ever change for themselves because they have free will.

    I have been cheated on before. However I have NEVER had a man break up with me because he is afraid that he would cheat on me and he has never done this for himself or any other women.

    He love himself and me enough to not cheat and break it off. I respect him so much for Not putting himself, his kids through another failed relationship.

    Is it possible never doesn’t apply. Is it possible that time is what he needs for himself. He has never got to just circular date like Rori reccomends and more and more am I realizing the value and self respect, and honesty that I would be giving myself when I begin dating.
    With that said I almost wonder if he wants me to choose me so that I can be the women I need to be for me regardless if he is my future. And if so should I include him in the men that I circular date with. He is legally separated and he is aware that I regret him begging me to move in immediately. Saying he would get divorced and marry me that day. Yet when I did move in and helped with his house, his children it seems like I leaned forward too much. Suddenly he went from wanting to tell his exes that I am the one, his sisters and myself. To feeling Resentful for paying all the bills, food and not he didn’t feel appreciated for what he did for me and I. Do. He even painted the upstairs so we could have our room in a bigger area. I didn’t like the color so the next day he brought me up to show me that all the walls were white again. I can be a perfectionist and come off and at times I am controlling when I don’t even realize it.

    he went from looking me in the eyes telling me he lived me, another time crying because he’s never felt like this to he wanted to date around. I did tell him my only fear was that he didn’t have enough relationship experience BC of his long term relationships. And BC I had always been in long term relationships and that is why it didn’t work out for my 8yr relationship.

    He asked for time to figure out what he wants and I pushed for the relationship even though in my heart. I know that he was actually manning up by wanting me and him to both fix the problems in our lives and in our hearts. Is it possible he is inspiring me to be the women that I need to be in order to find the man that my heart longs for even if its not him. ( I feel we are soul mates and so does he. We watched videos in YouTube and were amazed at how we knew what we knew already)
    sirens I need to know if this is possible for a man to inspire you to be your best self even if at times is heartbreaking confusing, elated, but authntically finding me for me. And if so, could I inspire him to do the same or at least give him an opportunity to or should I shut the door and never look back for him.
    Rori Raye I would love to work with you on this. The blog is full of amazing people and the advice, care is in sync for many women. There is always more women and girls that can be helped. How can I find a person or people to collaborate with. I have so many ideas that could help so many people not just in live but, marketing, creatively, financially as well as advertising. I know you are beyond busy, if you can reccomend or if any one reading this wants to have something for themselves to help each other create businesses please contact me if email is allowed sselizabethss at yahoo dot com. If a moderator or Rori would like to create a new post, newsletter entry, or to edit this post please feel free. I am using a cell phone, so sorry for dealing this. I look forward to using Rori Rayes complete relationship advice and tools to discover the women I know I am becoming and so the right fish in this sea will swim to me, and to fulfill a realistic version of my happily ever after and to find and give my husband a deep feeling of respect, appreciation, trust, love and sex that satisfy the soul, and feel that he does not want to imagine life without me, to dance a dance for fun for him leaving him always wanting more, long talks, sensitive to each others heart, kind words and thoughts, assure each other if needed, honesty in our thoughts, speaking with out hurting, letting go of control, and setting up boundaries that encourage or live to how stronger and deeper, continued blessings from God, gratitude, treating our children as if they are our own, teaching them the love they can have someday, a relationship they admire and are proud of, financial stability to meet our needs, vacation and help others, when tested to sin the strength and faith that God help us realize we can choose wisely and feel good that we are doing what’s right, forgiveness from each other, ourselves and God, to listen and hear and care what each of us thinks feels and needs. Amazement that love like this is possible, that love grows stronger, to know that if at any point we don’t want to be part of the relationship the door is open so we always know we are in this because we want to, we didn’t settle this is exactly what we wanted. To be able to cool down from a fight so we dint say things we don’t mean. To know that the door is open but if you ask if you should go that means you don’t know what’s in our hearts. The heart and soul never want you to leave. But if you are thinking of going or ask if you should then your telling us that your heart is not ready because you don’t need to test a women that respects your heart and her own enough to let you walk out that door. Realize if you ask to go a real women will let you because a man that wants you doesn’t want you to ever have to tell him its okay that he leaves the man I marry walks up my stairs and would do anything to get me to open the door for him. The man I marry will talk to me and together will shut every door from the past and not let anything hurt our love. The man that wants me forever will tell me I will never leave you I don’t want you or I to ever leave each other. I mean It when I say forever and if I ever walk away its only to another room in our home because we need to talk because I will never walk out that door without saying I love you and I will be back and when I leave I will say the same. Because we both know our hearts and soul have merged as one. Even when we leave this earth we will not go to heaven unless we know that God plans to keep as one in some shape or form or however God plans to make our live infinite should he give us this blessing and it be Gods plan for us to have this love on earth and forever with Jesus that is the only way for us to join are two hearts as one. Through Gods perfect love I pray that anyone who feels that no man will care that you care that Jesus loves you completely and that when I prayer this prayer for a husband and for forgiveness for not realizing that God loves us and we need to have faith in God because when we do by Gods grace and in Gods time our prayers have been answered. Just like heaven is not something we cannot see we know it is there so is the love that’s meant for each one of us. God gives us cloudy days so we can appreciate the sunny ones. Lets all look forward to more sunny ones. So even if its cloudy its a better day because we have serenity, grace, love and each other to lean on. Thank you every women who has cared enough to open your heart on this blog you have helped each other and me in so many ways. I think we should have Rori make some new sections on the blog we could all help make a place for people that have graduated from Roris training and time on the blog that leads to a new Rori class on planning for that day. What do you think? F ********

  155.  #155Femininewoman on March 14, 2013 at 10:15 am

    I guess some men just must cheat but I believe some cheat because his woman is refusing to bond with him sexually and that is one of his needs.

  156.  #156giftoflove on March 19, 2013 at 2:07 pm


    its amazing how you know that I was holding back even when it was sexual. I was scared. Now I am ready to go out tonight and just enjoy being a women. Expecting to remain open with my ex having a smaller piece of my heart he is slowly fading away because I just have no need for anyone who does not show me and tell me they need me too. I wish him the best and I’m taking care of me and making me the happy, confident, sexy women that I am.

    loving and happy energy to all….

  157.  #157Warrior Girl on March 27, 2013 at 10:50 am

    This story is painful for me to read. My heart goes out to Eileen.

    I have experienced a lot of personal tragedy and loss in my life over the last few years, and after having a nasty miscarriage, last spring, I became very depressed and withdrawn. Into this darkness, sailed A. who I met playing an on-line game. The attraction was instant and we started to spend hours talking daily. Soon, this on-line affair ratcheted up several notches and things became pretty hot.
    I had never had a very fulfilling physical relationship with my husband and we’d grown apart over the years, whereas A. pushed all the right buttons mentally, physically, emotionally. Within weeks, I was ready to leave my husband for him. I was crazy in love.
    Slight snag though…he had a wife and children and lived on the other side of the world!
    Over the months, this long-distance affair continued. We planned to meet, but then the inevitable. Our spouses found out. I was ready to leave mine anyway, but he wasn’t. He loved his wife and couldn’t work out how he could love two women, although he said he did love me – and even admitted that to his wife.

    So we went back to being just friends and focusing on that rather than sexual/emotional aspects of our relationship.
    Before long, we slid back into the passion, skype-ing, cyber stuff etc etc. And every so often, he’d say, let’s stop this, I feel guilty etc. And we would and then we’d just keep on falling back into it like magnets. All the time, I’m hoping he’ll love me enough to be with me and me alone. He seems to have a horrible relationship with his wife (don’t they always! yeah, right!) I’m thinking about him constantly, mooning over him like a love sick child.

    Then last night we fought – it’s been getting hot again between us for the last few weeks. We’d been talking again about meeting up, so I said, well are we going to or what? Because it’s the only way we’ll ever know if what we feel is real. He’s said this himself before.

    Ok, I went on and on about it a bit much, trying to persuade him I guess, because my husband is also at the point where he says I should go so we can both move on with our lives. A.s response was classic: But I love my wife!

    So then I asked him why he’d been messing about with me for the last year in that case. He replied by saying, good point, goodbye. Just as callous as that, even though he knows what we have both been through together.

    I know he is toxic – I did the test and boy, is he high in toxicity. But it hurts still. My marriage is in tatters, my mental and physical health is wrecked over the last few months. I just spent the whole day in bed crying. We have “broken up” before, but we find our way back to each other within a short time. He has never before said goodbye with such finality.

    You might wonder why I bother with such a man. Furthermore, when I tell you that he is unemployed, overweight, with many health issues. But we connected deeply, we say things at the same time, we think the same way about so many things, we laugh and laugh for hours and we have opened up to each other deeply in a way that neither of us have to other people. There is a strong physical, emotional and spiritual attraction there, that makes all common sense seem nonsense.

    I feel so lost right now 🙁 I don’t want to lose him from my life, but I know that unless he is available and free to be with me, he’s just going to keep on hurting me over and over.

    I know I’d be best to go cold turkey, cut him off….he might have already done that….he sure sounded mad in his last message. Mad because I’d made him feel guilty. Mad because I’d insulted his marriage by questioning his love for his wife. Mad because I dared to ask for something he wasn’t prepared to give.

    I know, I’d be mad to ever talk to him again, right? But it just hurts sooooooo much 🙁

  158.  #158Rori Raye on March 27, 2013 at 3:36 pm

    Warrior Girl – I’m going to be very tough on you here, because I don’t think anyone else has. Please don’t read if you don’t want to hear it:

    I can’t imagine WHAT you’re thinking, and what you’ve BEEN thinking here. First – there is NO such thing as ANY kind of relationship, or the love you describe with a person you’ve never met. Period. It’s a crush, a fantasy, all imaginary. I don’t care if you can smell through skype, there’s absolutely nothing real about it.

    Whatever you’ve experienced in your life that could make you believe that this is not so – that this is any more than a fantasy – and that somehow it’s okay to have this kind of active and emotional fantasy with someone and still stay married to someone else, and that it’s okay for this man to do the same…that has no connection to my world, or the world I want for you.

    The only place I would suggest to start is with yourself and your marriage, and to start asking questions of yourself – and to get professional coaching help to do that if you’d like. Questions like: Why am I still married if I’m this unhappy? Why, if I want to have an affair, am I not making myself available to real men who might actually be able to touch my body? Why am i not working on my marriage to improve it? What makes me think all I deserve is this fantasy over years that has made me feel horrible and miserable? Why do I think it’s okay to get in the middle of another woman’s marriage? (I’m not talking “ethically” or “morrally” – tho those figure in.) Is it possible for me to ever begin to respect my husband? And myself?

    And more questions.

    You are focused on all the wrong things – starting with this man.

    Love, Rori

  159.  #159Rori Raye on March 27, 2013 at 3:40 pm

    Warrior Girl – Sorry – I forgot to hug you for the miscarriage and the pain and depression – which surely led to all this. Please, please get help for dealing with your grief and unhappy marriage – and forget about this man. Love, Rori

  160.  #160Warrior Girl on March 28, 2013 at 3:50 am

    Thank you Rori for taking the time to respond. And weirdly, before all this happened, I would have pretty much said the same thing to a post such as mine that you did, about it all being fantasy, what are you thinking girlfriend etc etc!

    So I don’t quite *get* how someone like me, a professional, smart woman, has gotten into this weird place. I think, like you say, the multiple close bereavements (both parents, dying quite young and in very traumatic ways), the miscarriages etc finally took their toll and unhinged my judgement a bit. He was an escape for me. I resorted to free child mode as opposed to being the together adult I was. I never wanted an affair. My marriage was, I thought, ok – not great, certainly not great physically but it was ok. I didn’t/still don’t *believe* in affairs.

    Anyway, I bought your entire catalog the other day, cos I know I need to get back to the place of being a centered woman, and think that your program will take me far beyond that and help me to deal with the missing parts of me, that must have been there all along, but that I have been squashing down and hiding well.

    I wonder whether it might be worth your while addressing this latest phenomenon of these virtual internet relationships, as I know a lot of people who have gotten into them and claim to have experienced deep emotions with another person on line. Some have subsequently met after *falling in love* this way, and have since married. Others have left partners and are still in abeyance. Either way, it is a powerful experience to have when you’re caught up in it, as you can end up baring your soul to each other and being more honest and open than you might be if that person were standing in front of you. In real life, it might take 50 dates to get around to talking about the heavy stuff, but on-line, when you’re typing, it’s so much easier to do that, which perhaps does breed a false sense of closeness. I know this is not the same as being present in the same room as a person, but the level of communication can *feel* quite deep and the emotional investment can become quite high, because you feel understood, safe, finally someone gets me type of thing.

    This whole new way people are using to try to connect with others might be worthy of exploration/addressing in some of your workshops, as I suspect it is affecting more people all the time these days.

    I will keep trying to get the grief counselling I need. the NHS is so slow here – I have been waiting 8 months to see someone. I think this needs dealing with first and then hopefully I can sort out my marriage after I cleared some of that pain up.

    Once again, that’s for responding to me and the hug 🙂
    Love, Jill

  161.  #161Roro on March 29, 2013 at 10:34 am

    I wish you the best of luck and hugs from me. I want you to know that you are not alone. I also went through something similar years ago with a guy who had a long-time girlfriend. We were just friends but I had fallen in love with him (even though i showed nothing of the sort). after months and months (nearly a year even) he told me he loved me and wanted to leave his gf. After a few weeks he leaves me and hooks up with another girl and even posts it all over facebook just like that- with the blink of an eye. Thankfully I had a wonderful and supportive family and friends who stood by me. So what I wanna say to you is even if you feel like you’ve lost your friends – stop thinking that. Make us your friends. Confide in us. Write to us whenever you’re feeling down, or even when you are feeling happy. Express yourself and see for yourself the responses that you’ll get. again big hugs to you and best of luck and I will keep you in prayers. xxx

  162.  #162Roro on March 29, 2013 at 10:54 am

    Since i’m here, ladies I would like to ask for some of your wisdom.
    I have a crush on someone I met online, but we are living in different countries. We don’t chat everyday even but I still like him. I am circular dating and living my life as normal and I’m very happy, plus been reading Rori’s E-book and will buy her full catalogue with my next payment hopefully. Anyway we are planning to meet in our (common) country of origin this summer, and he hints of something serious – although i won’t believe it until I see it.
    There is one thing that makes me uncomfortable about him – his drinking. this is something I can’t stand and he shouldn’t either (religious stuff). I don’t want to get ahead of myself but i need to know in case we ever become serious, how can i bring this up and ask him to stop it without pressuring him or making him feel bad?? Do i casually hint that i don’t like it and hope he’ll stop? or do i say that it makes me feel uncomfortable and I would appreciate it if he wouldn’t do it?? And i don’t want this advice only for his case, I would like this for any future relationship I have. Thanks in advance xxx Roro

  163.  #163Tina on April 3, 2013 at 3:39 am

    I have been with a man for a year and 4 months and for the first year it was amazing but since Christmas he has changed and hasn’t made me happy.

    To give some background, I met him and was in the process of leaving his wife and I think I was the catalyst to make that happen. The relationship had been dead for some time and she has huge alcohol issues.

    He has a very possessive mother and she took a dislike to me and this mixed with the fact he has never stood up to her being nasty to me has destroyed our relationship.

    He moved out of the marital home and has spent his time between my house and his parents (where he has his child 50% of the time). It almost feels like his mother plays the wife collecting his son from school and making his tea then my partner comes in and plays dad – bathing him etc. The marital home has remained empty and he nor his wife have lived in it – both being back at their parents.

    His divorce came through in December – it took a year. We had a few issues around Christmas with me feeling that I had supported him through so much but him not really being there for me (my mam was diagnosed with cancer in April 12). Since then I haven’t felt he has been as keen, not as gushing but saying all the right words but actions don’t match.

    We had ‘words’ the other week and I said he was full of I love you’s but when a family trip was organised and I wasn’t invited that felt like a real kick and the fact he accepted that from his mother and he didn’t question it – that really hurt me. He told me he needed more time to catch up with me as I was further on from him with being divorced for 5 years but he wanted to get there. Anyway I ended up asking him to remove all his things from my home and that it was over.

    He emailed me days later saying that he couldn’t believe that we had got to where we were and that his feelings had changed since Christmas and he was sorry that he hadn’t dealt with his mother in the right way and that he believed all the little fights and arguments were telling him something.

    We talked after that and he told me he’d had more feelings for me than his wife and that he did love me – when he saw me it made him melt but his head was telling him otherwise.

    We agreed to have a period of no contact to let him think – in the middle of this time was his birthday and he sent me an email saying i thought you would’ve at least said happy birthday – i found this strange as i had said i hoped he would have a nice day when we last spoke.

    We met on Monday – 1st April – after two weeks of no contact and he said his feeling had not changed and he felt that for the last four years he felt like he had lived in a bubble and all of a sudden he was here and he felt he had to deal with all the things he had brushed under the carpet! He said that he did have very strong feelings for me and couldn’t believe this had happened to us but he had arranged to have some counselling to try and deal with himself and within this counselling he wanted to discuss his relationship with his mother.
    He just kept looking at me – eyes full as though he wanted me to say it was ok. He just kept saying I’m sorry I’ve let you down. I said well you have. He said I was quiet and I replied saying well you have made the decision and I will just have to accept it. I said that I hoped he would be successful in the counselling and he said there is a strong possibility that he will massively regret doing this.
    He left and i haven’t heard anything else.
    I am so gutted. I feel like my worth and self esteem are rock bottom and I am struggling. Everyone tells me I am a lovely person and that I am beautiful etc but I feel like crap.
    I know you will say just let him go but I can’t believe that after this time together and the bond we had was so strong – he can just give up.

  164.  #164Kris on April 4, 2013 at 10:00 am

    I would love to hear some advice? …

  165.  #165Tina on April 5, 2013 at 2:08 pm

    Is anyone out there please.?

  166.  #166Cathy on April 5, 2013 at 3:07 pm

    Does your book come in hard copy. I’d rathe have that so I can take it with me places, or outside to read.



  167.  #167Rori Raye on April 5, 2013 at 5:02 pm

    Cathy – so sorry – the book is all digital – but you can get it on your Kindle or your phone or tablet – and take it with you that way! If you need help downloading it that way – email support@havetherelationshipyouwant.com Love, Rori

  168.  #168Chris' girl on April 11, 2013 at 8:11 am


    I have been reading my new ebook (Have the Relationship You Want) and already, just starting it I feel somewhat empowered. I wrote on another blog about what has happened to me; I am looking within myself. I want my loving man back, but now I am thinking I should read ‘Toxic Men’ and get over my beloved. He is hateful or cold almost all the time. We have a wine tasting tonight, but he’s barely spoken to me. I am pretty, accomplished, educated… I don’t understand how he justifies treating me so badly.

    We have been a couple and living together since August 2012. When I met him on a dating site, he was so sweet; he treated me like a princess. Shortly thereafter though, after doing some snooping on Facebook, I found out he was engaged. I angrily confronted him and he broke down in tears, basically telling me he was trapped with this horrible woman who controlled every breath he took, watched every move he made and he had gotten engaged to her by mistake. He said he wasn’t allowed to have friends except for her friends. I was angry that he had misrepresented himself and chastised him, but eventually came to have sympathy for this horrible situation he portrayed. He left her, stayed with friends briefly, then ended up at my door and for a while we ended up being blissfully happy. He told me all about his greedy ex-wife who’d never paid him attention and saw him as a paycheck and this horrible ex-girlfriend who’d basically controlled him to the point of taking his man-card. She did end up stealing his late mother’s jewelry and about 10K worth of household belongings he’d purchased for their home. This man makes six figures, but has nothing but a car, an old sailboat, some clothes and bad credit.

    But we were happy. He even talked about one day getting married; we went on a couple nice trips and enjoyed each other so much. He works from home and always kissed me when I got home. We shopped together, ate together, went places together, even sat in the bathtub many nights laughing and talking. Chris met my friends, my family, he fit in perfectly. Except… after a few months his drinking increased; he started staying up late, way after I went to bed, often until dawn. And every time I looked, he was chatting up some other woman online; but I got chastised for being too jealous, they were just friends. Sometimes he even emailed or chatted with my girlfriends he’d met the night before. Not sexually, not romantically but just always women. When we did fight, it was nuts. He would break things, grab all of his stuff, shove me and run out of the house and I would cry and beg him to calm down and talk; once he got in that mode, even with little to no provocation (something I’d asked or said wrong – or being too needy), there was nothing I could do. He’d be gone for a night, staying with friends.

    In the beginning, Chris was looking for his own apartment. We moved in together way too fast. But as time went on, he said he wanted to start a life with me (HE SAID THIS, not ME) and wanted to find a house together. We looked for over three months, nothing satisfied him.

    As we were looking for a house, fights occurred more often. Just before we moved, we agreed we wanted a life together and we were going to work on our relationship. Then about two weeks before we moved he told me he loved me but wasn’t sure he was in love with me anymore. During this time he had started chatting a girl in Calif (we are on East Coast), who he went to community college with but says he doesn’t remember, he’d just seen her online and started playing ‘Words with Friends’ and talking. I was very jealous and insecure, adding to our problems. He seemed to confide in her, things about me, it was just very untoward. I had arguments with this woman, who apparently has a crush on him, but she was smug and hateful and he protected her at every turn; I even contacted her husband and son asking to have her stop (I know, wrong). I don’t know what the link is there, because she is married, unattractive and far away, but he talks to her regularly and she encouraged him to ‘do what makes him feel good’ etc. He says he is in no way romantically or sexually attracted to her and I tend to believe him based on the obvious, but he is feeding her crush by confiding in and lying to her about me.

    Two weeks after we moved into a nice roomy house in a gated neighborhood, which he has decided he hates, we had a horrible fight he shoved me, locked himself in his office and said he was leaving me. I had no idea why he was pissed. Something I said, he said, prodding him; I don’t doubt I said something wrong, but his reactions were always really severe. Three days later he moved out. It was horrible. He has a habit of taking off and not contacting me or allowing contact from me but that night he was crying and said he wanted to see if we could still work it out while he lived in his own space, he needed to work on anger and I needed to work on jealousy and neediness.

    I was devastated. We have continued seeing each other a few times a week, his apartment is almost an hour away and it is usually me going there and me planning; he is very cold, though he has been romantic and sexual about once a week. The apartment is very basic, but overlooks the lake where he always wanted to be. He has an inflatable camping mattress, an old futon he got from his ex-wife’s house, four old outdoor stools he found on Craig’s list, and his cat.

    I have been beside myself ever since. We have had several fights in the little over a month he has been gone. If we go out and he has too much to drink, he locks me out of his apartment and then calls the police saying I won’t leave if I am crying! I don’t drink like he does and drink water at the end of a night, so they don’t do anything to me; but it is wild that he goes to such extremes.

    I blame myself, for ‘pushing his buttons’ as he says. In the beginning, there were semi-reasonable excuses for things; but as time went on I have not been able to ask him about anything – such as women he talks to, etc. Everything makes him mad. He has left me sad and empty in a nice home I cannot afford when I had a nice apartment on my own for my daughter and I before I met him. He has never, ever taken blame for or said he is sorry, instead everything that happens is my fault and I always accept that, thinking it will calm things down. All the while, Chris is talking to and being encouraged by this odd online woman in Calif. who knows nothing about us but the lies he makes up and tells her.

    I am certainly not blameless. My jealousy, insecurity and emotional extremes were a problem too. When we fought, I became hysterical, usually begging why?? Why?? Which of course, enraged him. I should have walked away, stopped prodding him. When he’d leave me crying, I’d text and text and text him begging him to talk to me. His favorite thing to do is to block me for long periods of time, which are wrenching to me.

    I love this man… I would do ANYTHING to have the love that we had back; but I don’t deserve this cruelty/hatefulness or the lies he tells about me to his friends. I am honest, good and loyal; I’m a decent woman. All I wanted was to love him. I am seeing a therapist about my issues – insecurity, lack of trust and confidence.

    And I am reading your book. I am trying to take care of myself. I have so many things to worry about, it is difficult. Where do I go from here, is it worth it to leave the connection there with him?

    I am feeling stronger. I am getting through each day, one day at a time. I think about him when I get groceries, pull into the garage, pick out a nice wine. I have incredibly sad moments, but I am trying to fill my time and accept that I may never get the man he was at first back. Heartbreaking.

    Sorry this was so long…

    Thank you.

  169.  #169Femininewoman on April 11, 2013 at 8:47 am

    (((((((((((((Chris Girl)))))))))))))))))))

    Sorry but I am wondering why do you want to be with this man?

  170.  #170Chris' girl on April 11, 2013 at 10:36 am

    Hey Femininewoman…

    I guess I just know how he was and how wonderful that was. I don’t know what or why he has changed; I miss him. He loved me, he was wonderful… for a while. I don’t know if he is going through a mid-life crisis or he is just a toxic person. He gives me just enough to hang on, and I grab for it. 🙁

  171.  #171Femininewoman on April 11, 2013 at 10:42 am

    I wish I could agree with you. It seems to me this is his pattern of behavior. I would wonder what happened in his past. My suspicion is that he is doing what he has always done. He likely knows what women like to hear so he uses those lines until he gets what he wants. Then he changes back to himself. Is what I am assuming here. A good man will work through challenges and negotiate terms of agreement when times get tough. He knows the tough times will come. When they do, he does not pack up and run.

  172.  #172Indigo on April 11, 2013 at 10:55 am

    Chris Girl,

    I know we are not supposed to be giving advice here, but I wish you would RUN. Run far away from this man and his anger, and his coldness and his hatefulness.

    Please really take a step back and ask yourself, regardless of how this man WAS, do you *want* what you have now for yourself? Because that is all you are getting, and that is all you will get as long as you stay. Men like this don’t appreciate the silent suffering you endure for their benefit, they have contempt for it. I am so, so sorry to be so blunt, but I feel desperate for you.

    ((((HUGEST HUGS)))) to you, girl. You have come to the right place. We are all here for you.

  173.  #173Chris' girl on April 11, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    Thank you so much. I am really giving this a lot of thought; Femininewoman is right, this running is ridiculous. I think it is childish.

    Indigo… no, this isn’t what I want. I am just so sad for losing what I thought I had found. Plus this house now, and we had bought a boat we are having fixed up… all those plans now. 🙁 I have to say he is still transferring money to me to pay my rent. Which is good; he says he will for the remainder of the lease, no matter what.

    I can’t understand why he would want to live in that empty apartment instead of a warm, loving home. He was married 18 years – right out of his house and into the air force. He says he has never been on his own and this is his time to be selfish for once. He has never had kids… My daughter 16, who once also loved him has disdain for him since he left as she sees how he is treating me.

    But a lot of people have never been on their own. Now, in his 40’s, he wants to have a dinky apartment with an air mattress to be ‘his own man’. he works from a laptop on a folding table. It is silly, he had a beautiful office with a desk.

    This woman in California is a huge catalyst and he doesn’t see it. I don’t mention her anymore. She is just… mean, and trying to destroy but he is letting her. You don’t just up and move someone and their child into a home and then say, ya know, I think I’ll go be on my own and since we fought tonight this is a good moment to do it. I have been lost and empty.

    Everyone thought we were perfect and asks where he is if I go anywhere. I thought I found ‘it’. 🙁

    I wish I could get a real hug from you guys, I am a loving, kind creature and I need hugs right now. Thanks again~

  174.  #174Femininewoman on April 11, 2013 at 12:59 pm

    Chris Girl if that is what he wants that is what he wants. You are not powerful enough to save him from himself. The woman in California is just an excuse for both of you. Until you can turn your attention away from her and towards yourself, you are only giving your power away to her.

  175.  #175Chris' girl on April 11, 2013 at 1:06 pm

    Thank you Femininewoman. I am tired, literally. I am really going to try to focus on myself and my daughter. I haven’t broken all ties to him, but I do hear you and am gathering my strength to deal with what is to come.

    I wish there was a chance for us. His love and companionship was like nothing I’d known before. Just very sad to lose.

  176.  #176Indigo on April 11, 2013 at 9:08 pm

    Chris Girl

    I understand that grief. Let yourself go through it, and experience the pain of it, and heal from it, and come out the other side. It is not love and companionship you are getting now. If you need confirmation of how badly he is really treating you, please talk to people you can trust.

    I can tell you are a loving, kind person from the way you write, and you deserve much, MUCH better than this man is dishing out, but you need to want better for yourself.


  177.  #177Tina on April 12, 2013 at 3:30 am

    I posted a few days ago and sadly didn’t get any responses! I broke up with my guy a week and a half ago and haven’t heard a word. He said he had a strong feeling he’d regret letting me go and he couldn’t believe we were in the situation but he said he feelings like the past years have caught up with him and he had been brushing things under the carpet! I’m so gutted please help me here. I don’t want to contact him but I am thinking about him all day everyday 🙁 x

  178.  #178Roro on April 12, 2013 at 4:49 am

    Chris Girl (((HUGS))) and good luck to you. I think Femininewoman and Indigo did a good job with giving u advice. (((HUGS))) ladies.

  179.  #179Indigo on April 12, 2013 at 4:50 am


    If you’d like all the Sirens to comment on your situation, the best way for that to happen is to go to the newest thread and post your post there (go to the blog home page and the newest thread will be at the top of the page).

    In the meantime, are you using this time to both feel your grief, and fill your life up with things that you love, besides him, things that feel good?

  180.  #180Roro on April 12, 2013 at 4:51 am

    You are right we didn’t answer to your problem and I apologize on behalf of everyone. [[[BIG HUGS]]] to you and I want to support you through this and tell what i feel u should do.

  181.  #181Tina on April 12, 2013 at 4:56 am

    Hi Roro – thanks so much for your response. I would absolutely love to hear from u and to give some guidance on how I can cope. It seems so silly that we’ve had so many feelings and I kno he loves / loved me 🙁

  182.  #182Roro on April 12, 2013 at 4:58 am

    First I’m going to start with what Indigo said to Chris Girl: “I understand that grief. Let yourself go through it, and experience the pain of it, and heal from it, and come out the other side.” Try Rori’s e-book as well. It’s wonderful and very empowering. You do need to let him go. Let him deal with whatever he’s “going through”. Focus on yourself, because when you do that you will be most attractive!! Let yourself feel the pain, experience it and then let it go!! Do things that make you happy or try new things and get on with your life. When he sees that his feelings might change and he might come back to you. But you have to ask yourself after you’ve transformed and taken care of yourself: DO I STILL WANT HIM?? IS THIS WHAT I WANT? and you will have your answer! Try Rori’s tools and I promise you you’re vibe will change, just like what happened with me! Don’t think about him! Think only of yourself and you WILL feel better. This might be hard to digest now but it gets better. Be strong like I’m sure you are and take care of yourself. [HUGS] xxx

  183.  #183Tina on April 12, 2013 at 5:12 am

    Hi Roro – was the last response a out Chris’s girl for me?

  184.  #184Roro on April 12, 2013 at 5:15 am

    Yes darling Tina, my last response #182 was for you. I wish you the best of luck and send you all my love.

  185.  #185Tina on April 12, 2013 at 5:35 am

    Thanks so much – any ideas on what I can do to make myself feel better? At the moment I feel so so low x

  186.  #186Roro on April 12, 2013 at 5:44 am

    Well…exercise, yoga, catching up with friends, shopping, get a new hair cut, facial, massage!! Just pamper yourself! Change your look if you want. That would change your vibe. Think of things you’ve always wanted to try and do them. Oh and be open to meeting new people even if they are men! You don’t have to get involved but meeting new people takes the pressure of thinking about your man. Don’t even have to swap numbers and all that, just casually chatting in the place you met up etc. If you want here’s my email ra_halawi@hotmail.com let me know how you are doing xxx

  187.  #187Tina on April 12, 2013 at 5:56 am

    In the meantime, are you using this time to both feel your grief, and fill your life up with things that you love, besides him, things that feel good?

  188.  #188Tina on April 12, 2013 at 6:40 am

    Thank so much! I will put a plan into place. I can’t believe he has let me go and I feel so scared of getting hurt again! 🙁

  189.  #189Femininewoman on April 12, 2013 at 6:57 am

    Chris Girl consider that if it was so good with him it is because you created it. Now you have another possibility to create greater with another man who wants to do it with you. Or him, if he chooses to upgrade himself, then want you back. You cannot go through life with his anger, volatility as it is because one day it might put your life in jeopardy. You and your child are the most important right now. If either of you did get sick believe me, your priorities would be clear.

  190.  #190Femininewoman on April 12, 2013 at 8:08 am

    Tina I read your story. It is your self esteem that you will need to work on now. You are intrinsically worthy, whether you agree or feel that does not matter. You are worthy. Look in your eyes in front of a mirror and keep saying that to yourself until you mind can wrap itself around it. “I am worthy”. It is one of my practices that have helped me.

    When it comes to men and their mothers I have promised myself never to criticize and never to get into an argument with a man about his mother. I rather express sadness through body language if a man does not stand up for me when it comes to his mother. Sad eyes that express hurt and disapointment with hand over the heart can say a lot. I believe a woman will always lose in such scenarios so taking a step back when it comes to a man’s mother is what I prefer to do. If he has to choose to defend one I believe he will choose his mother until he gets to a position where he recognizes deeply and wants to choose to defend his woman. Many men get there but arguing with him about it won’t inspire him. Maybe the fighting caused his feelings to change but only his internal compass can change it back to feeling attraction for you wanting to be with you. The break seems to be very recent so each moment can create a new possibility. Focussing on yourself right now to lift your vibe is you best option, is my humble opinion.

  191.  #191Femininewoman on April 12, 2013 at 8:13 am

    Kris maybe your comments did not come through? What do you need help with?

  192.  #192Tina on April 12, 2013 at 2:57 pm

    Thanks Roro and feminine woman – I think this hatred I have for his mother has ‘made his feelings change’ I just can’t believe he’s let me go when he said he finds me so attractive and loves me and melts when he sees me. I will focus on me but am finding it hard – I find myself obsessing over what he is doing and I hate it. I’m doing eft to help me through. I want to change things in my life as I feel in a rut with two kids which I have 13 nights out of 14. My options are limited 🙁 sorry if I sound defeatist. X

  193.  #193k2012 on April 14, 2013 at 7:36 pm

    Tina, I just so your comment about posting a few days ago and getting no response. When I checked, I saw that some ladies responded to u cause I when I saw your post, I said oh my God, let me respond. I see where u have received excellent advice. The ladies on here are very supportive and we will certainly help you through all what u are going through. How are things now?

  194.  #194Liz on April 14, 2013 at 8:55 pm

    I am wonderful:) I’m happy,honest,free, fun, confident, self aware, beautiful inside and out. I surround myself with people who love me. I let go of my past issues in all aspects in life. I’m living in the present and excited to start a career, have independence, healthy relationships spiritually, socially and relationship wise. The pain of the past is the path I had to walk. For the rest of my life I will be Thankfull for the courage and strength to love God and myself enough to have a happy, safe, healthy and loved family.

    My heart and soul are happier then ever I have received faith and blessings from God.

  195.  #195Chris' girl on April 14, 2013 at 10:09 pm

    We are done. He was supposed to be at dinner at 4. I knew he’d worked all night after we left a regatta dinner and wanted to make sure he was up so I called. No answr. Again. OMG he’s still asleep. Anyway, I finally got him and he was towing a boat. I said but it’s 330. He said call you right back. He never did, I rode out to the sail club and waited. When he finally came in, he had a woman with him. I said hi, I’m Leslie, Chris’ gf. She said whatever is going on here I’m not part of it and left.
    He told cursed me, shoved me down on the dock and took off. I got up and started walking up the docks; he started following me in the boat and yelling obscenities at me how he hated me. I said what did I DO wrong? He said ‘you were born’.

    He continued to follow me coming in the shallow area as I walked up and an off duty police officer told him to stop and called the sheriff. He’s still out on the boat.

    I don’t know if ill press charges simply because I need him to continue paying his half of the rent which he has been and even now says he will continue.

    I know I’m a fool, the nicer I got, the more I took, the meaner he became. I know it sounds crazy, but though it’s for the best, I’m still so very sad and hurt.

    Thanks everyone here. I am so glad I have the book.

    ~not Chris’ girl anymore

  196.  #196Tina on April 15, 2013 at 3:28 am

    i have received great advice. I feel very flat still, i just can’t seem to pick myself up, i’m wondering is he missing me, is he feeling sad. I haven’t heard a word from him and i know i have to move on but i am finding it so hard 🙁