When You’re His Mother, It Won’t Work

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angerHere’s a conversation with Nancy, a client who’s already gone from a total doormat to a totally toxic, mean, controlling man she’s lived with for a long time, to an emerging goddess who can stand her ground…see what’s happening in Nancy’s process:

“Dear Rori,

I’m managing to not go nuts over this one, because I’m not being faced with it head on. I have no idea what precipitated this tirade over chat…… but he’s blaming me for his crappy job, and his crappy life, and everything he has going wrong…

He’s told me he can’t take his job anymore, that he’s going to quit today. He blames me for the decision to take this job in the first place (I was already being a yes man then….. not good at pointing out the problems.) He is upset with me because I want to “recreate”… orchestra for instance. … that all I care about is my work, and my orchestra, and my family.

I said “oh, sweetheart, I would love to help you get out of that job. What can I do to help?”.

And he said, find me a job… quit wasting time in recreation… nothing but work until he gets another job, because I’ll have to support both of us until he finds one.

I said “we’ll figure it out how to make ends meet, whatever way we have to.”

And again, he blames me for his current position. He was better off before this job and being with me. He was “strong and sharp and now he can’t even walk or hold his head up anymore.” Apparently, I’m a person who took something good and turned it 2 shit.

Again I said, “sweetheart, I would love to help you get out of the crap you’re dealing with” and offered him some job listings to look at.


I replied calmly, “Sweetheart, you have every right to scream at me, and yell at me, but I don’t like it… even over a chat window.” He’s continuing to blame he, as I write this email. Screaming through the chat window. I have continued calmly… “Darling, I would love to know what triggered you today”….

His answer: don’t @#$ing worry about what happened, worry about what _is_ happening, and don’t make work for me.

Again, I’m calm “Darling, I will help you get out of there, and find somewhere else to work.”


We were… I thought,… in a good place yesterday and this morning… he was talking about getting a ring, he was thanking me for how nice I’d been to him, and everything I’d helped me with yesterday. I have absolutely no idea what happened to trigger this. and I’m just really glad I’m not facing this at home right now, because I don’t feel like I would handle it well.

I could really use some guidance here. My boy wants to take me far far far far away, cuz my girl is very confused and hurting.”

Thank you,

From Me:

Nancy – I can’t stand this man – he sounds like a very immature and ill child. Surely you can do better?

If you still want to hang in – I’d stop the conversation the moment he starts using all caps….just say “…sorry, I love you and feel awful….”

From Nancy:

“Hi Rori,

I hope you don’t mind if I keep trying to use you to maintain my calibration.

Last night, I went home, shaking. I packed a bag and put it my car, and almost took everything and left. But it didn’t feel right, so I shut myself in a room and meditated. While I was meditating he came home. I came out, to assess the situation and found him napping. So I let him be. I wrote a note saying that I needed some space, and that I didn’t want to be a punching bag, and went back into the room with the door closed. He left me alone.

When I came out a while later, to eat dinner, he finally came up to me and said very meekly… but with lots of depression and emotion, “I’m sorry”. I gave him a hug. He didn’t resist but didn’t respond… and turned and walked away. I didn’t follow, it seemed to be that he didn’t want more. But this morning he tells me that I should have come and asked him what had happened, and what was wrong. and because I didn’t, it just drove home that I’m cold and unsympathetic and don’t care. And what have I done to help him?

I asked him again today what happened yesterday, but he still hasn’t told me. Told me that sometimes I might have to “pull teeth” to get it out of him. This doesn’t feel right, and yet I still care… I keep telling him that the day I’m not affected by his anger is the day that I stop caring about him as more than just another person in the world.

He tells me that I’m not doing what he’s asked me to do… that I’m not taking ownership of tasks he’s given me. That I haven’t taken ownership of him… caring about his health and well being, whether he’s getting enough rest, getting fed properly, whether he’s happy with his work, he’s as much as admitted that he’s high-maintenance. He says he’s a lamborghini, and I’m trying to maintain him like a ford escort… so he’s breaking down, because he’s given me more than he’s received.

I feel like he needs to be swaddled, like a fussy child… but he’s a grown man, and that’s nearly impossible to do without being a momma.

Okay, so I’m talking all about him… and I want to be working on me. But when I work on me, like I have been, I drift away from him, I lose touch with him…. he wants me to calibrate to him and doesn’t want to see that his calibration is off, and everything goes to hell. I feel like if I found a groove everything would just be easy…. but I can’t seem to find the groove.


From Me:

Nancy. He’s asking you to be his mother. Is that what you want?

Here’s the crux of the issue:

…but with lots of depression and emotion, “I’m sorry.” I gave him a hug.

So – after all this, he comes to you, he says “I’m Sorry”…and YOU hug HIM?

What I want you to do is STAND THERE, smile, say “Thank you” – and see if HE moves to HUG YOU!

About all the other stuff he says – I’d just say:

“I love you, and I don’t want to be your mother. Relationship feels to me like we take care of each other, and I don’t want to be “maintaining” a man like a fine car. I need love, affection, tenderness, kindness, gentleness, and great sex. And acting like your mother, or being asked to do that just turns me off. This isn’t what I want in a relationship. I want something easier and more harmonious that feels like equality. I don’t want to take care of you the way you want. I have total faith in you as a person and as a man. Is there any way we can fix this so we can both get what we want?

It’s about being either the flower or the gardener.

Which do YOU want to be?

It will no longer do for you to try to “help” him.

No more saying “I’ll help you do this, I’ll help you fix that, we can do this together…” when he “rants.”

No more deflecting anything that smacks of you getting away from how awful it feels when you’re spoken to that way and turns you, once again, into his mother.

Love, Rori


  1.  #1R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 6:34 am

    NUmber one!..This is a first 🙂

  2.  #2Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 6:38 am

    Right behind you RN Amazing Me 🙂

  3.  #3Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 6:39 am


  4.  #4Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 6:45 am

    I feel my guts in knots reading the article. I feel so much fear around saying “I have total faith in you as a person and as a man” that I feel teary eyed.

  5.  #5R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 6:50 am

    I couldn’t even get through this story, what in the heck, so triggering to me. Wow to even think anyone could blame someone like that for his own shortcomings. Get off your butt and get your own job and own place to live and own food to eat or you will be homeless and or starve if you don’t. wow….i just feel like that is a joke I cannot even think someone would allow that kind of treatment. My heart aches for her..

  6.  #6R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 6:56 am

    Fix it!! Sorry Rori I have to disagree get out of there girl! I mean he already treats her as if she is supposed to be mothering him and that is sometimes irreversible. This sounds to me like she needs to take time for herself and give herself the love she deserves.

  7.  #7Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 6:57 am

    Good morning!
    Hi FW, how are you doing? how is everything going with your parents?

    I just popped on, I was thinking about this amazing way to shift my vibe from wanting a guy to doing something for me to just appreciating….
    it was at an ayurvedic workshop and the lecturer said that our true nature was to be love. awwww….love that.
    and that if we are thinking about what a man isn’t doing, we are feeding that.
    so to remember what it is that you love about the man or all your CD’s and to just focus on that.
    he told a great story about how a marriage got turned around by a wife remembering what she loved about her hubby and she got home from work and he had that day fixed all the fences, made dinner and cleaned the house, because she focussed on what she loved about him.
    So i thought about myself and what it is I love about the men in my life, i felt the feelings when i received from them. it felt so good.

    and i was wondering if you might like that Lizka when you wonder about modelCd or ATW or whoever, if you remember what it is you love about them, it might be fun…..

    this is not leaning forward in our thoughts, is it?
    it is more like we are leaning back and appreciating, no?

    anyway, my son is home from school and we are going to the chiropractor….so i need to pop off, I wish you all a fantastic day!

  8.  #8R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 7:04 am

    I get really angry hearing this stuff anyone else? I want to beat the crap out of this guy..lol

  9.  #9Starla on April 9, 2012 at 7:09 am


  10.  #10Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:32 am


    I wanted to say that I feel so impressed with your strength and your attitude. Your vibe feels so grounded and yet sireny.

  11.  #11Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:37 am


    Felt so nice to see your post. Congratulations on your weight loss!!! I’d love to lose a couple of pounds but it’s so hard.. Any tips except for heavy exercise?. though I feel that at this point it’s really hard to cut off on more food ;(

  12.  #12light heart on April 9, 2012 at 7:50 am

    here’s another guy trying to use a woman to 1) hurt and punish himself and 2) to get the loving and accepting that he should be learning how to give himself.

    on the cosmic level, he’s doing his best, we’re all doing our best, nothing to forgive, no one to blame.

    But….. we also get to ask our human if we want to put up with this, if we like this, if we want this in our life ?

    I want someone who feels about themselves the same way that I feel about myself, and a guy like this would not be it.

    Yes, I might have total faith in him as a person and a man, but i don’t want to make it my job (mothering him) to get him to that place. That is his responsibility.

    I do very much like the script that Rori gives ending with ‘is there any way to fix this to both get what we want’,

    because it puts it right on the line, throws the ball back in his court and it is a perfect way to segue out of there, her job is done.

    MAYBE she could try having a relationship of equality with him, IF and WHEN he were to GROW UP!

    light heart

  13.  #13Emerson on April 9, 2012 at 7:51 am

    Wow this guy has so much rage and taking it out on her. Reminds me of a couple that I know. It’s so damaging.

    I hope she can find her voice.

    I woke up today with a strange voice in my head saying “you are still alone and haven’t found the right guy to be with”….and I felt sad.

    I’m going to get up and make some coffee now. I am starting a new project this week and I want to feel happy.

  14.  #14Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:54 am


    Thank you for ‘renaming’ your CD lol. When I saw SmartCD in your post my heart jumped;)

  15.  #15R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 7:56 am

    It’s so wierd how do you go from being so dependent on having a man in your life some way to not even being bothered. What a shift for me it is scary, I feel too content like I am too ok being alone so I won’t bother even trying again.

  16.  #16Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:57 am

    The guy in the post is plain abusive. I don’t know who can have any relationship with him, either now or when he ‘grows up’. There is so much growing to do, it’s like reinventing himself almost. To allow himself to even think the way he does, not actually saying it feels so disturbing already.

  17.  #17R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:00 am

    If it is online or while I am out I just don’t want to try anymore. I smile and am flirting like usual but just feel blah about it. As I write this it doesn’t feel good…gonna go for now to get my mind off of it, Yuck

  18.  #18Hopeful on April 9, 2012 at 8:01 am

    This poor guy is depressed. Not defending his behavior, he is being a jerk. But it is so sad that when women are depressed we seek out resources and friends, but guys just go into this weird angry mode. Very sad. And poor Bethany responded like a nice girl would, but as Rori says, the guy is treating her like his mom. Very sad tale indeed.

  19.  #19Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 8:05 am

    I wonder how he found the courage to make things go well – before Nancy?

  20.  #20Jessie1000 on April 9, 2012 at 8:07 am

    I used to fight back when I got yelled at
    My counsellor told me that the second anyone ….anyone yells at you ….you walk out
    whether its your kids or ur man or ur family
    It abruptly stops you from taking in and for me internalizing the crap they are saying in the heat of the moment
    it keeps you safe cause crazy moods can make you be in danger cause fighting back escalates the problem
    Not hearing that stuff keeps you from being hurt and feeling down
    walking away shows your unwillingness to be exposed to their garbage
    Usually this act of walking out of the room, the house, the place you are in can stop the cycle
    hang up the phone
    close the computer
    take yourself away always from ugly places of emotion, anger cause when we were children we got used to listening to that crap and were powerless so we couldnt go anywhere and those patterns are learned young
    Undo the patterns
    dont talk to them again until they have negotiated a way to control themselves around you and around ur kids if you have them….
    protect your kids too, my counsellor says by getting up and taking ur kids with you too away from that garabage so that they learn young that no one should ever ever yell near them, at them or bring them down
    it is child abuse to watch parents yell at each other
    it is child abuse for one parent to yell at another parent
    i feel so strongly about this cause it created miracles in my life when I started to apply this
    and actually brings out the chance for people to change….
    I hope that no one has to go through this cause women need to value themselves as much as their children
    hearing abuse can make u believe the stuff they say

  21.  #21R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:08 am

    @16 Thank you for saying that I felt as if I were alone feeling like that! Poor guy..ha, wether he is depressed or not that is not her problem. …This is Siren Island right? TOXIC….

  22.  #22R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:12 am

    Verbal abuse is emotionally and physically draining, but you are the only person that can stop it. You have to decide that enough is enough. When you do, what a relief you would never understand how you let yourself stick around. No one deserves that, that person may or may never change but you do not have to help fix them.

  23.  #23Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 8:22 am

    I stuck around for WAY TOO LONG with an a$$hole like the above so called man, what a jerk!!!!

    My ex husband packed in his job too as he wanted to “retire” he was in his late 40’s and we still had a big mortgage!!! And like the above woman it was all my fault and I was supposed to fix it all.


  24.  #24light heart on April 9, 2012 at 8:23 am

    Agreed, RNAM, it isn’t wise at all to tolerate verbal abuse, because, like Jessie stated, hearing abuse can make you believe the stuff they say, which begins the damaging downward spiraling ‘cycle of abuse’.

    because most of us are not TOTALLY self-accepting, self-loving, self-forgiving, and non-judgmental that there is no place for their abuse and judgments to stick to.

    And even if their abuse couldn’t “get to” me, I still wouldn’t like it one bit, and wouldn’t want to be around it, or try to fix it or stick around in the hopes that maybe he will.

    light heart

  25.  #25Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 8:24 am

    #22 R.N.

    You are soooo right, I look back at my life now and wonder how I could have stayed so long? What was I (not) thinking? I was soooo scared to be on my own, and when I was, what a relief as you say, I didn’t know what peace and tranquility were until then. 🙂

  26.  #26Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 8:28 am

    #15 R.N.

    I don’t know if you saw my post a few days ago, I joined Oasis, it is a free dating site and it has a 2 minute speed dating part where it matches you with random men.

    I don’t even have a photo up yet and am just using it for the practise of leaning back, letting them do all the talking, using FM’s and being silent not trying to fill in the silent gaps.

    I think you could try this as a baby step, with no photo you feel much more anonymous and “safe” and if you did find somebody you clicked with, then you could take it from there……….

  27.  #27Jessie1000 on April 9, 2012 at 8:29 am

    My second H. pretty well ran out the door and started sleeping with someone else when I started putting the counsellors advice to work….he literally needs someone to scream, rage and vent at (his woman) or hes not happy
    Now he happily rages at his new one…they have been together like 4 years
    I have heard him on my ans. machine when he thought he had hung up screaming and smacking his new woman…who is actually very nice and good to my son
    He was calling her all the same names that he called me at the end….some in eng. some in his own language…at the top of his lungs and out side on the streeet
    He is just no good
    and she teaches him its ok cause she stays with him
    He even rages at his mom on the phone who lives in another country….
    He said hes better than his dad cause his dad used to kick his mom around like a soccer ball
    I dont think hes better….he is the same way and just has a different weapon….words
    and the wounds that name calling can give…can sit in your mind forever

  28.  #28R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:32 am

    Thanks Sm #26 I will maybe just try it out 🙂 A baby step sounds doable 🙂

  29.  #29light heart on April 9, 2012 at 8:49 am

    Jessie, I feel so sorry that your son has to witness that. I really hope he has other much better male role models in his life.

    light heart

  30.  #30Emerson on April 9, 2012 at 8:50 am

    Silver Moon…
    I’m having a brain fade moment…I don’t know if you want to answer this but were your blog name initials in the past EW? I’m getting confused with all the name changes and being away from the blog for a while I start to forget!

  31.  #31Starla on April 9, 2012 at 8:51 am

    ugh, all this abuse and toxicity in the article makes me glad for me. i am so glad and proud of myself that i didn’t set aside my own basic needs to “fix” his feeling confused. maybe it wasn’t the most graceful way to do it, but i’m glad i said ‘you don’t get to be a hard*ss like this’ in my own way

    i miss cf soooooooo much today.

    i am still doing great, though:)

  32.  #32Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 8:55 am

    YES Emerson I was English Woman before that BarbinOz, both names reflecting where I lived at the time. 🙂

    I changed to Silver Moonbeam in the New Year, fresh start with a new Sireny name lol!!

    Yes it is confusing, that’s why I like the FB page so much there is a list of who is who and you can see photo’s etc and when the Siren posts on here it sticks in your mind just who you are talking to/about. 😀

  33.  #33Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 8:57 am

    I am soooo sorry I stayed with my ex husband for so long and my “kids” got to hear far more than they should have done, but I was under the mistaken belief it was better to stay together for the kids, BIG MISTAKE

  34.  #34R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:57 am

    OK SM @26 took your advice signed up but without a photo. Taking slow I logged off cause after typing the profile I am over it for now:) TY for your advice I needed it!

  35.  #35R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:59 am

    @33 I am relating to you on this one, yes then you realize it is way better to get you and your kids outta there. My heart goes out 😉

  36.  #36Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 9:00 am

    Then one day, I looked around and my kids had grown and gone and I was left there all on my very own with “him.” But still I hung on, living in another country, mortgage, finances, etc. Fear? Familiarity? Laziness? Having somebody is better than having nobody?

    A combination of all of the above I suppose, and my self esteem was in shreds, I remember when I FINALLY got out I was 48 and I believed what my ex told me that I was old and washed up and nobody would ever want an old bag like me.

  37.  #37Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 9:05 am

    RN Amazing Me,

    Yes I only joined on Friday, and I am taking it slow too, watch out for the scammers though, I have already come across a few, usually saying they are on a peace keeping mission in Iraq or on duty in Afghanistan and they usually live in Westminster London – one of the richest places in the UK, yeah right as if!!!

    But the speed dating is good practise as you can say anything you like………..wants and don’t wants……because there is safety behind your anonymous keyboard. 😀

  38.  #38Emerson on April 9, 2012 at 9:06 am

    36 ((SilverMoonbeam))
    I’m glad you did what was best for you and his ugly words are not true.

  39.  #39siren song on April 9, 2012 at 9:12 am

    well, i broke my challenge yesterday. my guy told me i am the love of his life and he wants to marry me an have kids with me but can’t get over Cding. he says it makes him feel unromantic towards me. i guess this is what he’s been angry about.

    i think he broke up with me, told me he’s never going to contact me again.

    i don’t feel super-bad about it. i felt pretty tired of being yelled at. that felt bad.

  40.  #40Imogen on April 9, 2012 at 9:16 am

    I’ve been reading Rori’s blog for awhile and I’ve never left a comment. I’ve agreed with the majority of the advice Rori gives until I read this post. This guy is abusive. Nancy’s response to him should be “this relationship is over” fullstop. What is there to fix? Why would Nancy want to fix this relationship? Some things are just broken. |Save the feeling messages for your journal.

  41.  #41Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:20 am

    (((((((((((siren song)))))))))))))

  42.  #42Stunning love on April 9, 2012 at 9:22 am

    This is my first time to post on here but I have been reading for several weeks now. Currently I am stuck. I am needing some real advice.

    My now ex-boyfriend and I were together almost two years. In December, I broke it off because I found out he was flirting heavily with another woman. It broke my heart. I loved him completely, even on his bad days. I still do know I love him. Since then he has attempted to date the woman he was flirting with and he confessed it was horrible. She wasn’t what he thought. She was in my opinion unstable (from what he has told me). Within a few weeks, she was saying she loves him and trying to make plans to move in with him, which he claims freaked him out.

    Now I have been only recently responding to his texts now that he is single. We spent some time together this weekend, but only as friends, no sex or even kissing.

    In our relationship, there were conversations we had where he would say he knows he loves me, but not sure if he is in love with me and he wasn’t even sure he knows what that means exactly. He still says he loves me and wants the best for me because he believes I deserve to have it “all.” He even has made comments several times that this guy or that guy is such a good guy he would feel comfortable introducing me to him because he was good enough for me. This makes me crazy. I just told him I do not need his help to find the man who is right for me. He also says “you never know what the future holds for us” and he is just “lost”…
    I did ask him if that would make him happy if I had a man in my life, which he responded with honestly no, probably not.

    I am having trouble adapting Rori’s advice to my situation. I need someone to tell me cut and dry, do this, don’t do this. I am not willing to stop pursuing my dream that someone will love me completely as I will them without the confusion.

    Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

  43.  #43siren song on April 9, 2012 at 9:24 am

    thanks, starla. i feel kind of relieved. he was so freaking mad all the time. i felt bunched up into a little ball sometimes.

  44.  #44Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:26 am

    i miss cf mucho
    i bet he’s shocked i didn’t contact him at all.
    i shocked myself.
    i just wanted off the drama train. when someone says break up, i get off the train and care for myself and go my own way.
    i miss his hugs
    i miss his kisses
    i miss the way he sees the world
    i miss his voice
    i miss his dreams
    i miss his eyes

    i don’t feel angry, i just miss him.

  45.  #45siren song on April 9, 2012 at 9:28 am

    i feel inspired by you starla.

  46.  #46Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:39 am

    i think tonight i might watch the notebook and cry and eat frozen yogurt and drink water and hug myself and tell myself it’s okay. i love me, and i am here for me.

  47.  #47Hopeful on April 9, 2012 at 9:39 am

    Jessie 1000 – I agree with you that when you are getting raged at you must escape the situation.

    This actually happened to me a couple weeks ago at WORK! An insecure bully came to my work area with demands and false accusations. For a while, I tried to “discuss” the situation with her. Then she accused me of one more thing and I went into Rori Raye old fashioned assertiveness skills and told her that the conversation was just turning into a fight and I asked her to leave my cube. I had to ask her 3 times to leave – repeating myself.

    But now I am thinking that once I finally stood up to the bully, I think she will not come to my cube with demands and accusations again. And if she does, I will ask her to leave much sooner.

  48.  #48Mochaberri on April 9, 2012 at 9:40 am

    Hello Sirens!!!

    Reading this I felt a lump in my throat – it was a scream that I couldn’t get out. I have experience such a toxic man

  49.  #49Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 9:50 am

    For instance: If you think you’re just being “friendly” to a man by sending him a flirty text or baking him a birthday cake, you could be getting in the way of the kind of courtship you desire…


    When we find ourselves falling for a man, it’s normal to start feeling that if we don’t show enough interest in him he might get the wrong message and drift away. We want to make sure he knows we like him. So we might do things like:

    1. Calling him because you heard or read about something interesting, or because you knew there was a great band playing somewhere, or someone told you about some great event that you want to invite him to.

    2. Calling to ask why he hasn’t called you.

    3. E-mailing him, texting him, Facebooking him, sending him a cute card, dropping by his house, or in any way attempting to initiate some kind of contact.

    4. Asking him how he feels – especially asking him how he feels about you or the relationship.

    5. Inviting him to come and join you, or in any way acting like the social director of the relationship.

    At first glance, these actions might seem completely harmless. In fact, you may feel that he’ll just see you as being friendly and want to get closer to you.

    But it’s important to be cautious when reaching out to a potential romantic interest – especially with repeated messages.

    Many men perceive check-ins, invitations, and questions about the relationship as a kind of pressure; or a woman taking on the role of pursuer.

    Some men may back off their dating efforts when they sense you are assuming a role they view as traditionally male.

    Your desire to touch base and get greater clarity into the relationship feels normal to you, and it may usually occur as a good-hearted attempt to stay in touch with a man who has piqued your interest.

    But it’s important to understand how he might see this activity. In an online dating environment, it is perfectly acceptable for a woman to initiate contact.

    But after you’ve had a chance to meet, some men see repeated messages from you as a sign of insecurity – a sign of fear that you’ll lose him.

    He can feel smothered in a way that dampens his desire to get closer to you.


    I know how frustrating it is to sit back and let a man take the lead.

    We want a man to know we’re interested in him.

    We want to make it easy for him to ask us out again.

    We want to seem enthusiastic and easygoing. And often times this means we inadvertently chase him in the ways described above.

    It’s true that most men need validation as much as we do. But there’s a difference between letting a man know you like him and subtly chasing him.

    When you chase a man, you don’t give him the chance to show you how he really feels about you. And my experience has shown that the only way to really be sure of where his heart is at is by creating the space he needs to pursue you.


    For a man to feel like he wants to get closer to you, he needs to feel good around you. And the way he feels good around you is when he pleases you. As long as you seem happy to see him and tell him how much you enjoy his company, most man will keep coming back for more.

    Stay in your feminine energy by being receptive and open to his attention.

    When he sees that you’re a woman who’s secure in herself and doesn’t need to pursue him, he’ll be encouraged to step up his game so another man doesn’t beat him to the chase.

    Once you’re in a committed relationship with one man, letting him take the lead and continuing to be receptive to him will fuel his passion for you.

    He will adore you and appreciate you, and you will be able to relax in the knowledge that you are a desirable creature he’d be a fool to take for granted.

    The truth is – we women have pretty much been trained to not only NOT connect with a man’s heart – we’ve been trained to not connect with our OWN hearts.

    And learning how this reconnection feels and looks – and how to USE our incredible skills to “get things done” by “doing” my Tools – gets your masculine “doing” energy in gear to help you become more “feminine” and “feeling” with a man.

    It’s almost a complete turnaround from everything we women have been taught and are so used to doing.

    Reconnect Your Relationship will FIX all that confusion for you, and give you exact instructions throughout all of my 7 Steps:

    1. How to understand how a relationship really WORKS!

    2. How to undo the damage that’s been done in your love life and the old patterns that are ruining your chances for love…

    3. How to make yourself an invitation to a man so that he feels drawn to you and you don’t accidentally push him away…

    4. How to manage all the emotions that bubble up when you allow yourself to be vulnerable in love…

    5. How to love yourself with simple Tools that actually make a difference and raise your confidence and self-esteem…

    6. How to use my Circular Dating Tool to make yourself even more attractive to a man, even if you’re already in a committed relationship…

    7. How to change everything by shifting your “vibe…”

    Love Rori

  50.  #50Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:57 am

    i love my sadness

  51.  #51Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 10:06 am

    Oh this post feels awful. In the past I would have said there’s no way I would ever let myself get into a situation like that – but now I feel afraid bc even though my guy isn’t even close to as bad as the post guy, it reminds me of it… 🙁

  52.  #52R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 10:09 am

    @42 yes Starla I am right there 🙂

  53.  #53Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 10:09 am


    I love my sadness too and I don’t let it take too much space.

    It’s there but something else is keeping it in check, namely the positive thoughts I’ve been having since yesterday.

    And I’m still keeping busy even though my plans were messed up.

    I’m just doing other stuff, that’s all.

    Oh, and I got myself some Dr. Bach’s Rescue Remedy for when I feel the sinking feeling.

  54.  #54Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 10:09 am

    except I don’t mother him at all, not at all…. and i can’t even imagine him asking me to find a job for him! no, he wouldn’t expect or ask anything like that.

  55.  #55Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 10:15 am

    Rori has written that she felt bad in the beginning of her marriage – felt neglected and felt bad – and she turned it around. So feeling bad isn’t necessarily a reason to leave a relationship, right? She stayed and things changed and now she feels good (as far as I know).

  56.  #56R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 10:19 am

    Rori I believe changed things around just by changing her own behavior which in turn made hime change and built a strong foundation from there.

  57.  #57Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 10:20 am

    Thanks for reposting that. I just counted the days and it has been 14 days today that I have been leaning back.
    I feel super antsy and I want something to happen.
    I caught another mouse and it is raining and I have to bring it out to the cornfield. I decided to frost the extra birthday cake i had and my son and I ate it. No giving cake to men who have their birthdays this week.

    This day is very challenging but I am committed to not leaning forward….

    maybe i will check out that oasis site that RN put a profile up on…that might distract me….and get to work on the gluten free talk and writing a newsletter….

    hi love always, hey you should check out my website, i would love to see your blog….

    lizka if it’s ok with you, it would be fun for me to join the siren facebook….

  58.  #58Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 10:20 am

    How can we heal ourselves inside if we leave every situation that feels bad? Isn’t it blaming him for my bad feelings if I leave, because why would I leave if it isn’t his “fault”?

  59.  #59Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:35 am

    #38 Emerson

    Thank you.

    Do you know I believed them for such a LONG time, it’s taken me years to get over such hatefulness and downright abusive cruelty, mind you I gave back as much as I got at times with my quicksilver tongue. 🙁

    Now I never give the man a second thought, my “kids” have nothing to do with him either (nothing to do with me) and so he isn’t ever darkening anybody’s life anymore in my family.


  60.  #60Calypso on April 9, 2012 at 10:39 am

    Reading Nancy’s email made me feel sick – her guy sounds just like my ex-husband! We were married for 23 years and he was pitiful and made every failure my fault and my problem to fix. I don’t know where I ever got the strength to walk away after carrying that man and our relationship for so long!

  61.  #61Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:42 am

    *it’s nothing to do with me, why they want nothing to do with him I meant.

  62.  #62Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:44 am

    #58 Calypso

    I hear you loud and clear, I don’t think you have posted here before, so welcome. 🙂

  63.  #63Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 10:46 am

    @11 Memulo – my guy and I just did the “Clean” book and both lost weight even without trying. It’s a 3 week plan.

  64.  #64Starbright on April 9, 2012 at 10:48 am

    56: Lucy,

    Great questions…

    I’m working with some of the same things…

    What comes up for me when you ask this is boundaries. What are your boundaries around these situations of blame/shame? And, what is a deal breaker for you?

    It’s true that if one leaves the same “problem” may resurface with someone else.

    It can work for two people to listen to one another and feel heard even if the outcome is that both disagree.

    I go back to your post on the previous blog where he says something about it being all your stuff…

    I think one of the biggest gifts we can give others is to be willing to listen fully and just hear them without being defensive. If that is something that would feel good to you, I would ask for it.

    Are you breaking up with him because of this area that has felt bad to you? Or, are there other reasons? It could be helpful to get a third party to help with finding a way for both parties to feel heard.

    Have you considered contacting Rori for coaching on this?


  65.  #65Iamabutterfly on April 9, 2012 at 10:55 am

    Hi, Sirens. I’m back. Happy Belated Birthday to Feminine Woman! You are amazing! and big hugs to Starla.

    I just want to spam all over the place.

    Starla, reading about your heartbreak makes me feel sad for you, but also a little jealous.

    I feel nostalgic for the time right after my big heartbreak. I felt soooo unbelievably low.

    Now, I almost want to hit rock bottom again because I almost felt my best when I was just starting to crawl out of it.

    I love how sad and vulnerable and feeling I am when I’m heartbroken.

    Right now I just feel kind of numb. Numb sounds too negative though. I just don’t feel high or low, and I guess I’m just not used to not feeling either up or down.

    I feel in between and that feels strange to me?

    Jack CD has been teaching a class that I go to. I kind of feel over him, but I still feel curious for some reason. I’m honestly sick of outgirling him, but I don’t feel angry or anything, I just feel curious.

    He locked eyes with me while he was teaching class and I was doing a lot of thinking out loud and responding to things like I always do. I love how he nods his head…

    I feel really weird because he always mirrors my body language to the point where it’s uncanny. Like, I move, he moves.

    I feel like it’s supposed to be the other way around. He moves, I move. That feels way more natural to me…

    This girl, who is my friend, who he has flirted with right in front of me showed up. She was being all cute with me and I felt like she was using me to get his attention. He ignored both of us.

    It felt weird.

    I kind of felt like he was staying away from both of us for a reason. She was being kind of fake, and I wonder if he sensed that.

    I just felt grumpy, and I wonder if he sensed that.

    He usually talks to me when it’s just me there, so I feel kind of curious if he stayed away because he could tell it made me feel really jealous when he flirted with her in front of me.

    I didn’t try to hide my jealous feelings last time. I just kind of glared at him last time.

    I do feel jealous. She is so much like me, but younger and never-been-hurt, and not scared, and more naive.

    But I know I’m better. Not necessarily better, just wiser and more refined. More real. Less naive. I love that about myself.

    I almost feel turned off that he stayed away.

    I almost wanted to be like: “go ahead. Aggresively flirt with her. Date her. Get it out of your system because I know you’ll want me back once you’ve gotten to know her.”

    Maybe that sounds harsh, but I know it’s true. Maybe I just feel sick of guys coming back to me after dating “lesser-thans.” I just want to be like “hate to say I told you so.”

    Also, I just wanted to feel comfortable, so I was wearing a black oversized hooded sweatshirt with nothing underneath it and a pair of gray jeans. She was wearing this cute shirt that brought out her eyes, showed off her body, etc. and blue jeans.

    I just don’t feel like trying that hard when it comes to him anymore.

    I feel curious as to why I don’t feel the need to try that hard.

    Sometimes I feel like he’s trying to send me the message “hey, look. I am an alpha male and I can have whoever I want.”

    Like, sometimes he flirts with other girls right in front of me and then looks for my reaction?

    Sometimes, I feel jealous, but lately I just feel like rolling my eyes.

    and I want to just be like “okay. Go have whoever you want, but don’t expect me to stick around.”

    It was funny because the last time he did that, a really cute guy walked right in between him and the other girl and sat down close to me and started flirting with me.

    It was all I could do to keep from laughing at Jack CD at that point…

  66.  #66Calypso on April 9, 2012 at 11:00 am

    Hi Silver Moonbeam – I’m usually just a stalker . . . lol. I have not commented much, but I read a lot of the posts and try to learn from all of you. My situation changes so often I would not know what to say!

  67.  #67Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 11:06 am

    One guy I used to date had great potential to be an abuser. Maybe he was and I just didn’t stay long enough to see all of him. He had the verbal abuse down pretty well though. He called me a lot of names, mostly over texts. I could feel he was trying to take away my self-esteem, but I am too strong. I guess stubbornness can be good for some things. When I tried to break up with him, he would tell me things like no other man would ever want me, etc. I didn’t date for 3 years after him. I just took some time for me, which I had never done. Since age 19, I was always a serial monogamist.

    I don’t think I would put up with a man like Nancy’s husband. I would have told him exactly where he could go and I would have walked out. That is completely unacceptable behavior and I don’t care what kinds of problems he has. He needs to get help and she can’t help him. It’s scary really.

  68.  #68Rori Raye on April 9, 2012 at 11:18 am

    Stunning – The quickest help for you is in Circular Dating – and treating this man like a friend – or cutting contact off completely. “Friends With Benefits” would be the option I would NOT take. Love, Rori

  69.  #69Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Date Sat. night went really well. He came and picked me up. I walked out and he gave me a big hug, but it was a little weird cause usually I get a big kiss too, but he didn’t even try. So, I wasn’t sure how things were going to go. Then he said I was wearing his favorite shirt and I’m just trying to tease him.

    We are at the restaurant and he was telling me a couple of childhood stories about running away and after each one he said, “see I’ve never been very good with pressure”. He was referring to our fight and how he kept saying he feels stressed and pressured when I’m upset. So, I guess that’s why he shuts down for 2 weeks and avoids talking.

    We shared a few more stories and conversations and then went back to my house. We did what we do, lay on the couch and give each other simultaneous foot rubs while watching TV. We cuddled and fell asleep. He stayed over. I tried to apologize for how I handled things, but he stopped me and said, “no apologizing allowed on Easter.” I just said, I mean it and you were right, I was overanalyzing. He stopped me again, so I just let it go.

    Everything seems to be back on track. It bothers me that he still doesn’t really want to talk about it. He can talk to me about anything else and tell really long stories, but this stuff makes him uncomfortable. I do know I will ease into things in the future if I want to discuss something.

    Do you think it will just take time for him to get more comfortable?

  70.  #70Rori Raye on April 9, 2012 at 11:26 am

    Imogen – though I said much the same thing to Nancy as you just did – it’s my work as a coach to meet women “where they are” – in other words, if you’re in love with someone who’s verbally abusive (as long as he doesn’t physically frighten you or touch you – I draw the line at that) – but if it’s about words, and a woman who wants to work with me wants to work with this man – I consider it a place to “practice” – and I help you take every opportunity a man throws at you to shift your beliefs, your thinking, your words, and lift your self-esteem and confidence in the midst of this. Mostly what happens then is a woman gets bored. She loses interest. The man’s pull diminishes – and often the man changes. Completely. A new kind of communication happens. And that’s what happened for Nancy. This man shifted completely.

    The thing is – she doesn’t know if she WANTS him anymore! His abusiveness and difficulty was his glamour for her, and as she started to dismantle that need in her to be punished…everything changed. She now feels almost completely good about herself – and they’re talking like human beings a lot of the time.

    The thing is – you can’t fix a man. If he feels broken, and is doing all kinds of stupid and abusive things rather than fixing himself – if you feel good about you – you’ll walk away from him.

    And sometimes, a man can turn himself around.

    No promises – just practice. Love, Rori

  71.  #71Starla on April 9, 2012 at 11:27 am

    i feel sad i feel adrift at sea
    what now?

  72.  #72Coco Kisses on April 9, 2012 at 11:36 am

    Rori, this is sooooo on point. I pray for the day when I can truly express myself like that, naturally. Just reading it feels sooo liberating!!! You are awesome

  73.  #73Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 11:37 am

    Stunning, Welcome, I am new here too!

    I wouldn’t like that at all if my ex-bf, whom I probably still feel strongly for, suggested fixing me up with some other guy. It sounds like he needs to figure himself out.

    It’s not the same scenario, but there’s this guy I know, who I was interested in and he acted interested in me. However, he was shy and only flirted when drunk, otherwise, he would avoid me. When drunk though, he could flirt forever. Most people thought we were dating, people we didn’t know thought we were married. That was how it was with us for 2.5 years. Yes, I waited that long for him to step up, but everyone was telling me I had to because he was just too shy. He also had only had one gf and that was 12 years ago. So, I stepped up and he said, sorry if I gave you the wrong impression. But, then, would still flirt at parties when he was drunk. He even told me if both of us are still single when he’s 40, then we should have a baby. It’s amazing what alcohol can do for a person. We are still friends and have the same friends, but when I started dating my new guy, he was very put off. He works with my new guy and now he’s not so friendly to him anymore.

    The point of me telling this story is, it doesn’t matter how available you are, if they aren’t ready, it won’t happen. It doesn’t matter if they love you or not. If they can’t bring themselves to step up to the plate it won’t happen. Don’t be like me and waste so much of your time on a guy for the wrong reasons. It sounds like your ex is dangling a carrot in front of you with some of the things he says and then pulls it away. I would take Rori’s advice and get yourself out there. Date men, it doesn’t have to be serious, but don’t wait around for something that may never come to be. If he sees you’re not waiting around for him to figure things out, he may very quickly figure things out. If not, your perfect guy might just be waiting for you around the corner. I know it’s hard. Good luck.

  74.  #74Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 11:49 am

    Amazing Me: “Rori I believe changed things around just by changing her own behavior which in turn made hime change and built a strong foundation from there.”

    That’s exactly my point – She felt bad, but she didn’t leave him – she changed what she was doing instead of ending it.

  75.  #75Coco Kisses on April 9, 2012 at 11:50 am

    ……. but when someone verablly abuses u i the wasy this guy did in this letter it feels HORRIBLE

  76.  #76Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 11:54 am

    Lucy it feels bad to read “How can we heal ourselves inside if we leave every situation that feels bad?”

    It suggests to me that our ability to heal hinges on the ability to tolerate bad situations.

  77.  #77Calypso on April 9, 2012 at 11:58 am

    I am getting ready to take a 3 day trip to the beach with a man that I dated for several months last year. He decided that he was not emotionally ready for a committed relationship – too fresh out of a painful divorce, so we are trying to just be friends, but we do have deep feelings for each other. The trip to the beach will be interesting. I will have to be on my best behavior if I am going to maintain a LEAN BACK attitude! I just kep focusing on me – getting my time in at the gym so I will feel good in my clothes, tanning, planning what i am going to wear – all for me and how it will make me feel. I am just going to be a siren and if he comes closer, that’s great! If not . . . I’m going to have fun anyway.

    Just freahly out of my rebound “relationship” that I jumped into to try to stop hurting. I finally feel like I am not in a rush to be a “girlfriend”. I just want to be me and I’m tired of worrying that if I don’t act a certain way, my man will get jittery and leave me.

    My ex-husband kept threatening to kill himself if I didn’t love him enough, Beach date guy (GM) got scared because I went to a company seminar with a male co-worker and had bad cell reception (His wife cheated on him) and then rebound guy (SL) dumped me because I had a conversation (Of course he assumed we had sex, which we did not!) with GM after he was involved in a recent tornado . . . Lord above – I do NOT want to be told what to do by these men. It is my TURN . . .

  78.  #78Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    Calypso, Good for you. I hope the trip goes well and you can just do for you, without “girlfriend” being on the brain. Have fun!

  79.  #79Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    Starbright, thanks for your input – helpful questions for me.

    I am breaking up with him only for this reason – the times he gets angry and blamey and it feels so bad.

    It hadn’t happened for awhile, so I had thought we had moved past the dynamic… but when it suddenly happened again it made me feel like I can never feel that we are past it and it could happen any time, just when I least expect it.

    But I don’t know if I am just running away from dealing with it. 🙁

  80.  #80Iamabutterfly on April 9, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    @77 Calypso – Your vibe feels empowered and it feels good to read!

  81.  #81Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    I hardly believe that the man doesn’t have sex on his mind if he is participating in a 3 day beach trip/

  82.  #82Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    I did consider asking Rori about it but I know she is busy.

  83.  #83Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 12:10 pm

    Lucy how about Rori Raye Third Way? Do you really have to break up?

  84.  #84Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 12:13 pm

    I’m kind of curious if how a man’s mother was while he was growing up relates to how they are as adults. Like if the mother was over protective and babied their son, is that when men expect women to take care of them? What is the mother was not very nurturing at all? Is that when feelings get shut out?

  85.  #85Daria on April 9, 2012 at 12:14 pm

    Today is my goddaughters birthday. Happy birthday to my baby.

    I want to feel moved to call (it seems it would be my god sister who I feel angry at or her mom) and feel totally at peace doing so and happy.

    I love me 🙂

  86.  #86Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 12:17 pm

    I believe so GivingGirl. That is the reason most of us need to heal. The first lessons we learned around love was taught by people who were broken and they cannot share what they do not know or they cannot give what they don’t have. I believe we are attracted to qualities in men we saw in our fathers and vice versa with men.

  87.  #87Daria on April 9, 2012 at 12:17 pm

    Lucy – when you’re consistently leaving every situation that feels bad you will be healed. And your perspective will have shifted, your life will no longer include bad feeling situations so you’ll be looking at happiness all day, and your tolerance and interest in tolerating such sotuations or equating them w healing will have faded

  88.  #88Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 12:22 pm

    Femininewoman, I’m sorry that feels bad to you. <3

  89.  #89Iamabutterfly on April 9, 2012 at 12:22 pm

    I have a new CD. I’ve never met anyone like him and I’m pretty sure I never will again. He is just…crazy lively, artistic, dramatic, outgoing, funny, and yet laid-back. There’s something beautiful about him and we have a lot of fun and I feel completely relaxed and open with him because he seems completely relaxed and open with me. It is so nice. I don’t feel like I’m questioning anything, I feel no need to lean forward, I feel no need to “do” anything. It feels soooo nice to just be with him. Of course, I haven’t shared any of my big vulnerabilities with him, but I just feel comfortable exactly where we are. He’s just fun. It feels so easy-going and good. I don’t even know what to nick-name him. Hmm…NopressureCD? I like that…

  90.  #90Daria on April 9, 2012 at 12:23 pm

    Realizing I do t have to wade through the abuse or even put myself at a potential for it right now.

    I can write my Goddaughter a letter.

    I can mail her a present.

    I can take my own advice and consistently walk away from abuse.


    Sis mom has not been abusive to me . She called me open and friendly a few months ago – I feel guilty for not returning that call.

    It feels so triggering for me.

    What I’d I put myself first and font put myself through the discomfort ‘for the kids’


    What if they don’t give the kids my letters or my gifts?

    That feels sad and scary to think about

    I want my EFT lady!!!!

    Maybe I can ‘practice’ for the community I’m building.

    Do kids in the US have school today?

  91.  #91Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 12:27 pm

    Daria some private schools are open.

  92.  #92Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 12:29 pm

    Aw, sorry, I don’t believe in leaving every situation that feels bad. Imo, life and love just don’t work that way. As I said previously, Rori didn’t leave her marriage when it felt bad; parents don’t leave their children when they are in a situation that feels bad; etc.

    When you love people, you cannot always avoid bad-feeling situations (e.g., suppose your child is in a horrible car crash — it feels horrible to see your child suffer! — but LOVE doesn’t walk away from that, imo).

    My belief is more in keeping with Eckhart Tolle and others who teach that healing happens by shifting inside, not by changing the outside.

  93.  #93Calypso on April 9, 2012 at 12:29 pm

    FW – I know he has thought about what it will be like at the beach with me for 3 days – he invited me and is paying for the condo and the entire trip. We have known each other for over a year and have spent many nights together, but none as “friends”. I am not making any “rules” for myself or for him. I’m open to whatever happens as long as we both feel good about it and as long as it does not trigger me to feel like I need a committment from him.

    We have discussed the situation and both know it will be hard to just be friends, but he has stated quite clearly that he never wants to hurt me or take advantage of me or lead me on in any way. He does not believe he will ever be healed anough to want to be in a long-term committed relationship. Right now I am fine with that. I don’t want it right now either. I have joked that I am going to buy a chastity belt for the trip . . .

    If we sleep together and I come home feeling good about myself and my life – more power to us. I just have to guard against any confusion when I know I will feel powerful love between us when we are naked and only one of us will still feel it the next day . . .

  94.  #94Daria on April 9, 2012 at 12:30 pm

    When you act like your sisters mother it won’t work either.

    You know what we’re equals and I need and deserve love too.

    I’m upholding my part of being solid and I don’t like it being implied in anyway that I’m not trustworthy or violating family boundaries. I want to be honored for keeping it real as I am and seen for that.

  95.  #95Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 12:30 pm

    @ 86 – I guess I need to figure out what those qualities are in regards to my dad. Maybe it’s just that he was hardly ever home (mostly at work). I choose guys who aren’t there for me in a variety of ways? My dad is opinionated, he used to be calm & patient prior to his stroke, but not anymore. I have to try and remember who my dad was prior to his stroke. I don’t have very many good childhood memories and for a long time I thought I was adopted and that’s why they liked my brother so much better. I’ve never felt comfortable with my family. They don’t really even know who I am. I have my own issues.

    My guy and I, when we first started dating, kinda bonded over conversations about our families and how similar they are. We can relate to things with each other, that most people don’t understand. From the stories he tells me, his mom wasn’t very nurturing. She forced him into sports he didn’t want to be in. He literally ran away from her a few times. One time some kid knocked him over the head with a rock and he was unconscious. He made it sound like she basically stepped over him, told him to get up and didn’t even asked what happened or if he was alright. His father died when he was freshly a teenager, so I think he’s had to endure a lot too.

  96.  #96Starla on April 9, 2012 at 12:30 pm

    i am the most important person in the world
    my sad feelings are important
    i love my sad feelings.
    i deserve to feel sad if something sad happens
    i don’t have to put on a bold face for people around me to like me better.

  97.  #97light heart on April 9, 2012 at 12:36 pm

    Hi Lucy,
    Did you read Rori @70 response to Imogen, there’s quite a bit of clarity in there that might apply to your situation.

    light heart

  98.  #98Coco Kisses on April 9, 2012 at 12:39 pm

    Had lunch with a friend, and went to her spa were she gave me some carboxy body treatments…..I did have another good cry early this morning, but after getting love and support form my mom and my friend…I feel better, not 100% but better.

  99.  #99Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 12:43 pm

    I feel interested in what Rori wrote in 70 and the differences between my situation and Nancy’s.

    “His abusiveness and difficulty was his glamour for her, and as she started to dismantle that need in her to be punished…everything changed.”

    The abusive and difficult part of my guy is not at all glamorous or appealing to me — I would love for it to be gone and would so not be bored if it was. I would feel relaxed and peaceful and happy, because he has so many great qualities that I enjoy so much. I do not want or need the drama part of it.

    Maybe if I just keep walking away the *second* it starts to feel bad, then it won’t get to as bad a feeling place ever and eventually he will stop.

    “No promises – just practice.” (Rori)

    This is the same practice I have been doing with my mom over the past two years – TN man had actually helped me to start that with my mom and supported me through it — Just saying “Mom, I won’t accept blame; I won’t be the scapegoat; it stops now.”

    She was stunned the first time I said that. She got quiet and said “okay” but she was still upset. The next time it happened I said it with less feeling of being triggered, and again she stopped.

    Maybe it is now an opportunity to practice that with a man. Stay and practice so that I can completely heal this blame/shame/scapegoat thing.

  100.  #100Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    Hi Healing Waterfal!!

    For the Facebook group, you can send me an email at siren.lizka@gmail.com .

    Please include the direct link to your Facebook so it’s easier for me to find you (we had some problems with other sirens). You are then going to receive a friendship request from me and as soon as you accept, I’ll invite you to the group!!! 🙂

    “and i was wondering if you might like that Lizka when you wonder about modelCd or ATW or whoever, if you remember what it is you love about them, it might be fun…..”

    Hmm it’s true that I don’t think often about the specific things that I like about the men in my life… I just “assume” that I like them…

    What I like about ATW…

    -I like sex with him very very much

    -I like the way he hold me all night when we sleep together even if I’m hot or if I move

    -I like that he is always happy and always in a good mood. Very zen and never worried about anything.

    -I like that he is open to other cultures and other people.

    -I like that we always have something to say because he knows a lot of things


    What I like about ModelCD (list might be shorter as I know him less than ATW)

    -I like that he always plan our dates and that they are always fun

    -I love how he kisses me

    -I like his sense of humour. Always making a joke and always laughing

    -I like his life style, his sense of party

    -I like his culture (is it weird? that I like the fact that he is Russian?)

    -I like his body, yummy… and the fact that he is very tall

    -I like his style, the way he dresses


    Awww I feel smiley now and more positive. But this exercise made me miss ATW a little bit…

  101.  #101Calypso on April 9, 2012 at 12:54 pm

    My beach trip is in 17 days and I have a list of items I need (want) to purchase . . . I’m streatching it out over the days leading up to the trip, which is making it feel quite decadent…

    Today I bought a bracelet made of white leather and sterling silver with the inscription, “Dreams become reality one choice at a time”.

    Tomorrow I’m going to finish making my decision on what perfume to buy – something fresh and clean, I think I’m leaning toward Dolce & Gabbana Light Blue.

    All of this I am doing for me, although I can’t help but smile when I think of GM dealing with his choice to be “friends”.

    He is 6’5″ and has piercing blue eyes. I have to distract myself with my own sireny, feminine self so I don’t get sucked up into his energy. I practice the water wheel daily – all his energy and good thoughts & emotions can pour all over me – only then will I give back! No more sucking this siren dry!

  102.  #102Starla on April 9, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    🙁 really really miss him.
    being stuck at work is the worst for this.

  103.  #103Mel on April 9, 2012 at 1:12 pm

    (((Oh Starla)))

    I’m just catching up. I want to give you big hugs, a kiss on the forehead, and a cupcake. YOU are an amazing siren and he just got scared because of his own stuff and there’s nothing you can do about that. Just be. Cry… even if you need to sneak out on your lunch break and sit in the park. I know how it is to feel devastated and yet have to be at work. You are courageous and strong and beautiful. Chin up. The universe has her plans in the works. You are on the brink of something special.


  104.  #104Givinggirl on April 9, 2012 at 1:12 pm


  105.  #105Mel on April 9, 2012 at 1:16 pm

    I’m not sure if this is the right “advice” Starla, but I wonder if you should respond to him in some way. Even just to say “Okay… I feel heartbroken and sad, but I accept that.”

    My rationale is that you still want to remain open, no? Just ignoring him completely might give him the impression that he wouldn’t ever have a chance with you ever ever again.

    Just my 2 cents.

    love ya!

  106.  #106Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 1:25 pm

    I think Mel is right Starla, be honest and open and vulnerable this is not being a doormat, this is about being a warm loving Siren.

  107.  #107Starla on April 9, 2012 at 1:30 pm

    i will be open with him soon… it was nice to take a few days off from the drama.

    i also thought there was a good chance that he would email me today and say “oops, i overreacted, can we talk?”

  108.  #108Starla on April 9, 2012 at 1:32 pm

    thank you mel:)

  109.  #109Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 1:43 pm

    oh starla, i am sorry you miss him….it must be that kind of day….i know how you feel…

    how i am going to go through this feeling….feel it and feel empowered and full and flowing and beautiful even though i am longing for a man to fill me up….ha,ha

    i am going to say hello to my grounding to the earth and my connection to the cosmos in my crown…..i am going to say hello to the earth energy feeding me through my feet and running through my earth channels.
    I am going to say hi to my work angels and ask for inspiration today and ask that the rest of the work I do today be divinely inspired and that it be for the mutual benefit of all concerned….
    and i will go let that mouse out in the cornfield now that it has stopped raining….
    may my work on cooking a meal from scratch for my class tomorrow be totally filled with love and gratitude and ease and grace and may it also be incredibly scrumptious…
    and may my class on gluten-free on saturday be enlightening and empowering so that my students will be able to take a break from wheat and make some totally kick-a*s blueberry muffins AND may this help them to lose their muffin tops LOL

  110.  #110Daria on April 9, 2012 at 1:45 pm

    Lucy – I got more of an idea…

    After walking away, you can remain open and available and not running away by being open warm and sharibg your frelings when approached in a loving gentle way (after you’ve cared for yourself and are feeling ready to respond of course)

  111.  #111Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 1:46 pm

    i feel like you are feeling strong that you are free from the drama and i feel it might reinvite drama if you told him you were sad and heartbroken….
    just my 2 cents….

  112.  #112Coco Kisses on April 9, 2012 at 1:46 pm

    @ Starla ((((((((STARLA))))))))) I know how you feel I woke up this morning bawling to my mother…she just let me cry and listned to me. I realize that this had to happen to open up a pathway for happiness and TRUE LOVE for me. It still feels painful knowing that my husband is filing for divorce and has the divorce papers, but I know that with NO CONTACT with him, and lvoing myself, CDing, and receiving love and support from my friends, I will make it through this.

    @ Daria, You are so right when you say that “consitently walking away from situations that don’t feel good and are bad for you will heal you. This is dead on…..

    I feel bad that you may not be able to call your god daughter for her birthday, but I see that you have come up with some positive alternatives. It feels disgusting to me when people place children in the middle of grown folks business.

  113.  #113Starla on April 9, 2012 at 1:49 pm

    hw, i also think it’s on me if it becomes drama. i can walk away from something that feels bad. i can also be warm and loving.

  114.  #114Jessie1000 on April 9, 2012 at 1:50 pm

    Lightheart…I feel sorry for my son too but thankfully my third husband…the guy was my roommate who filled the house once the second left was sooo soo sweet to my son (now 14). My third husband adored kids and was so fun with them…my littlest was only 3 months old and thinks that my third was his daddy cause not only did my second dump me but he dumped his son too…hes only starting now that the littlest one is 5 to reconnnect with him…
    UNfortunately, we moved far from the third for school and he didnt or couldnt come with us here and its been very lonely without him….he was always cooking and having people in and parties and played with the kids when i was studying and always bought them ANYTHING they wanted…it was sick…once the oldest asked for a choc. bar from the store and my third brought him 10! (i was like dear god you cant give all those to him)
    Its been hard to get over him cause he picked me up big time when I was down…not just as a boyfriend but as a good person….
    I wish I could clone him lol cause he was so sweet.
    My Beau (that i just dumped) was the first guy I dated after almost a year a half cause I couldnt find anyone like my 3rd.
    Oh well….people come along sometimes at the right time when you need them….
    Kisses Lightheart for thinking about kids cause they sure need to be protected….

  115.  #115Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 2:31 pm

    So I did everything I said I was going to do today.

    And I’m still leaning back.

    Just taking care of myself.

    It feels nice.

  116.  #116Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 2:33 pm



  117.  #117Starla on April 9, 2012 at 2:40 pm

    i guess i’ll write him tonight. i’ll tell him i feel sad and that i miss him and that my feelings are true, and that i’m going to take care of myself until he’s sure about me or something

    should i mention anything about how he ignored me saying i’m open to and excited about talking about ‘wanting the same things?’ cuz he turned around and insisted i didn’t, without even talking to me about it. like a brat. lol

  118.  #118Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 2:50 pm

    Starla, the first part of your message is what you should send him, I think.

    But I would omit the “until he’s sure about me” stuff.

    And adding questions will only confuse him for now.

    Just my two cents…

  119.  #119Starla on April 9, 2012 at 2:51 pm

    daria mentioned saying “i’m going to take care of myself until you’re sure about me”

    but he makes no indication that there is a future where he will be, so i feel kind of psych0 saying that.

  120.  #120Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 3:00 pm

    11Memulo – go and check out http://bodyrock.tv for hard workouts that are also free!

    If you don’t have the equipment you can improvise like I do.

    I did one at the gym last night and I can feel it today in every muscle! I’ve also recently lost an inch and a half from my waist – and I wasn’t sure I had that much to lose!

  121.  #121Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 3:04 pm

    Thank you BW! Will check it out.

  122.  #122Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 3:05 pm

    I am missing ATW more than usual today…

    I am thinking of happy and sad moments we had together in the past…

    I thought of breaking my Challenge to send him a short text, just a “hello 🙂 ”

    That would be stupid and I would probably feel regretful…

    But I honestly think that he might think I am mad because I am not calling him… You remember when he text me in the middle of the night the other day and that I never answered and he never wrote again? He said afterward that he thought I was “f*cking mad” (that’s about the translation I can make with his own words). The guy is not very audacious. I am almost sure that if he thinks I am mad, he will not lean forward…

    I’m not trying to make excuses to lean forward… I’m just considering the fact and trying to make the good decision.

    I miss him so much and I don’t want him to never call me again just because of a misunderstood…

  123.  #123Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 3:06 pm


    I am not good at it, but I would not go back to the old argument. I would just express my feelings of love and sadness. Don’t know about ‘until you feel sure about me’

  124.  #124Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 3:06 pm

    I don’t know… I have a bad feeling…

  125.  #125Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 3:07 pm

    SmartCD did not contact me today.. does it mean he forgot to remember….. ;(

    I actually need to know when he is coming back and whether I will be able to see him right then.. because it turned out I need to go away ;( ;(

  126.  #126Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 3:09 pm

    I could send an FM, no invitation, no expectation…?

  127.  #127Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 3:09 pm


    But your last conversations were good, no? You responded, you were warm and open?

  128.  #128lk on April 9, 2012 at 3:11 pm

    ((((Starla)))) hi : )

  129.  #129Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 3:11 pm

    Daria – “Lucy – I got more of an idea…After walking away, you can remain open and available and not running away by being open warm and sharibg your frelings when approached in a loving gentle way (after you’ve cared for yourself and are feeling ready to respond of course)”

    I love this! Thank you. <3

  130.  #130Starla on April 9, 2012 at 3:14 pm

    hi lk

  131.  #131Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 3:17 pm

    In processing my feelings, I realized that the fear I feel when he is angry/blaming is fear of abandonment.

    So if I am committed to not abandoning myself, I don’t need to feel afraid. Maybe I can shift that fear.

    (I am not afraid of him physically abandoning me… I am afraid of emotional abandonment — oh my — that has been my pattern, fro childhood and in my marriage: physical presence with emotional abandonment.)

  132.  #132Senior Lady Vibe on April 9, 2012 at 3:17 pm

    Re: “When You’re His Mother, It Won’t Work”:


    Rori says:
    “…From Me:
    Nancy – I can’t stand this man – he sounds like a very immature and ill child. Surely you can do better?…”
    …From Me:
    Nancy. He’s asking you to be his mother. Is that what you want? …”

    I wouldn’t stand him either. And it’s not “mothering” he’s requiring of her it’s doormat slave and mechanic. Rori, I believe you’ve used the term “puppy doormat” in another of your posts — that seems more like what’s going on here too.

    I find it desirable to sit down with a partner and plan our lives together. That is not what’s happening here.

    He’s demanding she do the things that are his to do and he’s irrationally dumping loads of blame on her for his whole life. Ugh!

    Unless this is a one time total breakdown and he apologizes profusesly and returns to normal after being carted off by paramedics, I wouldn’t plan on spending my life with this kind of man.


  133.  #133Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 3:19 pm

    Memulo –

    Yes, but it was 1 week ago, just a few text message exchange…

    I don’t want to go in the “but he’s different” pattern, but I sincerely think that he must be expecting me to do something, after HE texted me the last 2 times to say nice things (about following my passion, and my new job)…

    I don’t know, I have a feeling that he might not know what to do with my leaning back?

  134.  #134Senior Lady Vibe on April 9, 2012 at 3:23 pm

    @18: Hopeful says:
    “…but as Rori says, the guy is treating her like his mom…”

    I strongly disagree that this is the way “moms” are to be treated. That tirade was just plain UGLY, not something that rightfully belongs to a mother/anybody else kind of relationship.

    Ewww. Do you treat your mother like this?

  135.  #135Sirenity on April 9, 2012 at 3:25 pm


    stunning love …

    DONT DO THIS !!!!

    If a man doesnt know what he wants , he doesnt want what he has.

    And if he comes back after an “experiment” elsewhere ..then beware the Call De Booty.

    If he really has decided to try and be “in love” with you then you make your Degree of Difficulty so damn High he is jumping through hoops and THEN he falls IN love …Yaay you 🙂

  136.  #136Starla on April 9, 2012 at 3:25 pm

    lizka, that is his problem if he doesn’t know. we just have to be open and give the green light when he does contact. not initiate contact
    ur doing so good, girl, don’t give up now!

  137.  #137Ella on April 9, 2012 at 3:31 pm

    I feel tired today.

    I’ve been in boy energy all day today, first at work and then this evening cooking a meal for my family.

    And I do find it tiring to be in boy energy for so long these days.

    I also think I am still recovering from the excess alcohol I had on Saturday.

    And I have been having too much sugar.

    So just feeling kinda tired and worn out tonight.

    I will take my girl off to bed soon and snuggle up.

    This week is LeanBack week for me.

    Looking forward to it.

  138.  #138Senior Lady Vibe on April 9, 2012 at 3:33 pm

    @26: Silver Moonbeam says:
    “…I don’t know if you saw my post a few days ago, I joined Oasis, it is a free dating site and it has a 2 minute speed dating part where it matches you with random men….”

    I didn’t see one about a new site just the one about displeased about guys on sites. I asked you about that as I wanted to learn from your experience. I wanted to know how you indicated interest and if you then got any initiations from them.

    Here’s what Rori said in e-mail yesterday:

    “…But it’s important to understand how he might see this activity. In an online dating environment, it is perfectly acceptable for a woman to initiate contact.

    But after you’ve had a chance to meet, some men see repeated messages from you as a sign of insecurity – a sign of fear that you’ll lose him….”

    If Oasis is in the U.S., I’ll work toward checking it out.


  139.  #139Ella on April 9, 2012 at 3:41 pm


    Yes. I agree with Daria.

    Isn’t this basically the Rori Raye 3rd way?


  140.  #140Senior Lady Vibe on April 9, 2012 at 3:43 pm

    @55: Lucy says:
    “…Rori has written that she felt bad in the beginning of her marriage – felt neglected and felt bad – and she turned it around. So feeling bad isn’t necessarily a reason to leave a relationship, right?…”

    Feeling bad from disappointment when the relationship hasn’t moved forward at our pace and we want more of a good thing is a whole lot different from feeling bad because we are receiving a boatload of grief and abuse.


  141.  #141Jessie1000 on April 9, 2012 at 3:47 pm

    My Beau wants to see me tonight…Im so scared that hes going to pop the question….HELP!
    Is there an alternative to marriage?
    Im afraid to get divorced again (not married…that part is the best party)
    What other option is out there?
    I think HE thinks that Im trying to hold out on him for marriage and thats why I dumped him
    why can i always get married but never stay happy when im married.
    Then its not sex cause u just want them, its sex cause you have to cause they are your husband and its cheating to sleep with someone else….lol
    Its forever…do u know how long 2 years are? I change a thousand times in 2 years….he might love the girl I am right now and then I change and he will dump me….
    Can you just get married for 2 years and then like a work contract –renegotiate?
    My first marriage I was 17!!!! my parents signed for me…it lasted 10 long long years
    My second was 5 years and he booked after begging and beggin for a child as soon as the baby was born.
    My third was 5 years and I think he dumped me cause I got smarter than him…lol and he couldnt live moving around to other places where academia takes you….
    For another couple?
    Dear god.
    SIRENS….I need ideas and excuses to come up with that wont hurt his feelings…
    I told him he showered too much this time when I broke up with him…
    I Cant tell him that I cant marry him cause he showers too much!
    Should I just say no?
    Should I say yes and then move?
    Should I say yes and then back out?
    Should I say absolutley yes in like 10 years when I know u aint going anywhere?
    Should I say just say nothing?
    What if the ring is big? OHH im a sucker for that
    His BF is a famous jeweler and my Beau loves jewellery and rings and chains and stuff and all his rings are like custom made and sexy….
    Help! I should not be in control of my own life!
    OK ….sirens…u decide for me what to do….
    ALL of you….if my BEAU was your friend….what should I do?
    Would you tell him to marry a divorcee of 3 times?
    Is he stupid?
    I would tell him to RUN RUN RUN~!

  142.  #142Ella on April 9, 2012 at 3:53 pm

    Starla re 119,

    I don’t know… I think you could say it and not sound psycho… just confident!

    Or you could say ‘I feel good taking care of me until a man is sure’


    ‘I feel good taking care of me unless you decide you feel sure’

    Or ‘I feel good taking some space and taking care of me until a man feels sure’

    Or something like that.

    As I keep reading your posts I feel compelled to remind you of the Rori Raye 3rd way.

    I mean I know it may feel like a break up.

    But it never really is when you are CD-ing.

    It is just a man either moving towards us or away, depending on how ready he is to step up.

    And they circle around.

    It moves.

    And we will have feelings as we respond to them moving closer of further away.

    For me since I have been working the Rori tools there have been times when I have been convinced that it has been ‘over’ with a man, and he may even has said as much.

    But because of me doing the tools, taking care of me etc, it very rarely has actually been over.

    They have always circled back.

    Totally different kettle of fish about how I feel about them when they do.

    When you are CD-ing I do not believe in breaking up per se.

    Not to make light of how you feel here though.

    What I am trying to say is even in situations that can feel hopeless, I believe we can still use the RR 3rd way.

    Hope my ramblings feel useful in some way.


  143.  #143Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 3:55 pm

    all i can say is it must be in the stars today, because we are all feeling like leaning forward…..and all relationships are give and take….but the waterwheel is about letting the masculine energy fill us up and then we give back after we receive….
    masculine energy does this, so even though we are feeling like initiating contact, we aren’t being in feminine energy? all i know is that if i initiate contact, i would feel uncertain…and i feel more certain now than if i contacted him, because i know that i am staying in my own skin….and i am thinking of those 19th century women who never chased men and just did what made them happy all day and the men showed up….so i feel like keeping to my challenge today, it has been two weeks.

    i have so much to do to take care of myself today and i want to write my talk.

    Lizka, what did you decide to do? I know what you are going through. Remember what you learned on your run….think about what you said about ATW….didn’t he text you in the middle of the night, do you think that warrants a response? he could try again, you did not tell him your feelings have changed….can you try the yes/no gauge to see if it is in your highest interest to contact him?

  144.  #144Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 3:55 pm

    I don’t know… I don’t feel convinced…

    I know I am doing well.

    I know we’re not suppose to initiate contact.

    I know I should not give up…

    But my gut is still telling me I should “let him know” I am still warm and open…

    What if he didn’t feel I was still super open last time?I just re read the short conversation we had a week ago, and I was just talking about me, kind of bragging about my new job…

  145.  #145Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 4:00 pm

    Healing Waterfall 143

    No, the time he texted me in the middle of the night was weeks ago. Over a month. I didn’t answer. And when I called him like 2 weeks later, he said he was hesitant to call me because he thought I was mad…

  146.  #146Stargirl on April 9, 2012 at 4:04 pm

    Wow, that has made me feel angry and weak and defensive reading this, but I love my defensive feelings, they’re trying to protect me. It’s scary. The unpredictability of this man is scary. How hard it must be to focus on yourself when all I can think is ‘What is going on with HIM?’ and he’s not even my man! I have so much respect for Nancy, it is hard. Especially if you have a low self-esteem, I know I do, and he’s not making it any easier on you.
    It’s so hard trying not to beat yourself up too, when that’s your natural response from years of being hard on yourself. Any tips on noticing when you’re beating yourself up, and breaking the habit to love and accept yourself more?

  147.  #147Starla on April 9, 2012 at 4:08 pm

    thank you, ella, love you.

  148.  #148Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 4:08 pm

    I wish someone knew.

    I wish someone knew what to do. I wish someone would know exactly what ATW is thinking and going to do and would tell me “ok you can lean forward, it’s a good move” or “no, he’s going to call you tomorrow,he’s just busy with work”…


  149.  #149Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 4:16 pm

    Hi Ella, thanks! <3

  150.  #150Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 4:19 pm

    Hi SLV. I was referring to after Rori was married – her unhappiness there – not the part where she was wanting to get married and he was stalling.

    And, yes, a “boatload of abuse” is different from what I am experiencing as well.


  151.  #151Starla on April 9, 2012 at 4:24 pm

    ahh, the work day is over. i made it <3 love to me.

    going to take beautiful care of me tonight:)

  152.  #152Healing Waterfall on April 9, 2012 at 4:34 pm


    Mars is stationary so it is the planet of action, so nothing is moving…..
    maybe that is why crush is not contacting me and ATW is not contacting and CF is not contacting…..and in a week, mars will go direct and then there should be some action…..

    just talked to my astrology friend

  153.  #153Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 4:36 pm

    Next week? Next week there’s gonna be some action?

  154.  #154Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 4:39 pm

    Ok no, I’m going to call him…

  155.  #155Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 4:52 pm

    I could just call and not leave a message if he doesn’t answer and then throw my phone away. Ok maybe not throw it away but leave it on silence for days…

    But what if he answers?

  156.  #156Aurora Girl on April 9, 2012 at 4:57 pm


    interesting talk about a few things…. why we crave connection……..why instead we need to be comfortable with self reflection and relationships with ourselves first…..and be comfortable with alone time….and how technology fits…..

    “The feeling that ‘no one is listening to me’ make us want to spend time with machines that seem to care about us.” (Sherry Turkle)

  157.  #157Sun Goddess on April 9, 2012 at 4:57 pm


    What would you say to me if I wanted to lean forward with musicman?

  158.  #158Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    LOL! No, Lizka! Don’t do it. You’ll probably feel bad afterwards.

  159.  #159Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    I’ll call back my girl friend who called me earlier…

    Maybe the urgency will go away…?

  160.  #160Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:02 pm

    She is not answering…

  161.  #161Francesca on April 9, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    Lizka, breathe.

    Bring it back to you.

  162.  #162Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    It is so hard. I feel torn between the urgency and knowing that I’m gonna feel sad if I break my Challenge…

    I know it’s not gonna be THAT bad if I call him. Not like he’s gonna think “oh Lizka is such a looser and she lost points because she called me”…

    It’s really about me. I am proud of my Challenge and if I call him, it’s gonna be over. I’m gonna have done 21days, and that’s it…

    But want to call him so badely. I feel it’s the right thing to do…

  163.  #163Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:13 pm

    Why is nobody giving a sh*t about me?

    I just want a man to pay attention to me.

    I have 4 d@mm CDs in my rotation right now, and none of them is calling me on a regular basis.

    What’s wroooooong???

  164.  #164Luzydel on April 9, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    This guy reminds me of some men I used to date, like it was my duty to make them well Ugh! I feel angry reading this, I don’t know How would I react now if I encounter a man like this again, Really a lamborghini? no sh*t? lol who does he think he is? That is how I feel right now, zero tolerance to being treated like crap…

  165.  #165Stunning love on April 9, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    Thank you for the great advice. This evening he and I spoke again. I told him I would never do causal sex again because that doesn’t work for me and I have more self respect than that. I also told him I would not ask him for a second try for us, because I need to be with a man who truly appreciates me for me and I will not settle for anything less. I also told him I think maybe I had him on a pedastal and I am learning he clearly makes mistakes and poor judgment and I couldn’t trust that. I told him I know there is a man looking for a woman with the standards and values I have and he shares the same. I told him I would not settle for less than that.
    This evening I am hopeful.

  166.  #166Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    Haha I just had a little fantasy in my head.

    I’m not gonna break the Challenge tonight. But when I’ll do it, I’ll do it so it worth it. When I’ll break my Challenge, I’m gonna lean forward on all my CDs and not only initiate a contact, but I’ll propose a date. Just to “boost” the things a little. But then I’ll lean back…

    Lolit feels funny to think and makes me feel smiley. I feel evil also to think I could do that.

    But it feels super dangerous. But I feel thrilled…

    Hmmmm maybe I should do it?

  167.  #167LoveAlways on April 9, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    Wow. This article makes me feel jittery and shakey. I feel he may eventually lose it. Tori, having been there done that, I don’t feel Nancy is safe with such an explosive unstable personality.

  168.  #168LoveAlways on April 9, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    Guess that triggered me

  169.  #169Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    Haha I just had a little fantasy in my head.

    I’m not gonna break the Challenge tonight. But when I’ll do it, I’ll do it so it worth it. When I’ll break my Challenge, I’m gonna lean forward on all my CDs and not only initiate a contact, but I’ll propose a date. Just to “boost” the things a little. But then I’ll lean back…

    Lol it feels funny to think and makes me feel smiley. I feel ev*l also to think I could do that.

    But it feels super dangerous. But I feel thrilled…

    Hmmmm maybe I should do it?

  170.  #170Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    Ok I’ll go smoke and if the urgency haven’t left, I’ll go sleep even if it’s early.

    This day was too hard…

  171.  #171Starla on April 9, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    lizka, i am soooo glad u chose to lean back with ATW. this is a good time to check in with what you were feeling while you urgently wanted to contact him, so you can notice the pattern more readily.

    you are doing an amazing job breaking the pattern. i feel really proud of you.

  172.  #172LoveAlways on April 9, 2012 at 5:37 pm


  173.  #173Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    Memulo, BW and SMB, thanks for commenting to me on the last post. I realized (before actually reading your posts lol) that it very well may have had nothing to do with me. I didn’t think about the how the heck did I get here or the 40th so much, but did hnk that it could have been anything with hi family, clls from work, his back hurting..lol, who knows.

    I do know he looked me up and down Saturday, (I had my hair and makeup done already for my date) and a cute outfit on, and he texted me at midnight, so… he could be little jealous, or wondering what I’m up to. But, not going to get in his head, just going to tell myself good things… and to be totally honest, I’m still doing the I love you, I’m sorry, please forgive me, thank you mantra with the gold cord visualization. I don’t do it every day, but probably a few times a week. And I’m not doing it with an angenda in mind at all, except for us to totally heal our relationship and all past wounds. We very well may not end up together, but he has been a huge part of my life, and I don’t want anger and pain to cloud any of my relationships. I want to heal all that are hurting, because they still hurt me.

    I did end up seeing him for a little while today, and I asked him if we are ok, I felt strange yesterday, and he said I shouldn’t have felt that way, there wasn’t anything wrong. I said that it seemed like he couldn’t even look at me… which he said wasn’t true. So, choosing to believe him. I can feel a wall there, but also warmth. So, who knows. I know my vibe is very different, sure he senses it.

    Funny thing is, this is the first day I haven’t heard from Ohio, and I’m feeling a little relieved. He called last night and brought up more negative stuff from his past. (seems to blame a lot on an abusive stepfather) I don’t want that to be the focus, and it’s starting to feel that way. We don’t need to talk everyday. He does have to lead and lean forward though, so no reason at all for me to lean forward and contact him. I’m appreciating the no contact today. He’s made a lot of comments about only dating one person at a time, has hidden his profile, etc. I still check my POF regularly… even responded to a few other guys, so, my vibe isn’t going down…. only up. 🙂

    Now going to read this whole blog and catch up!!! 🙂

  174.  #174Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:40 pm

    I felt so bored since I came back from the spa in the middle of this afternoon.

    I was too tired to do something creative, there was nothing on tv, almost no siren on the blog…

    Maybe this is where the urgency comes from…?

    But the thing is it might get worst in the next few days… Because I have one more week of vacation before I start working and I have absolutely no plans yet…

    Last week I had so many things to do, so many people to see… and now nothing. It’s empty…

  175.  #175Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 5:42 pm

    Lol StarlaI haven’t choose yet. I just don’t know what to so I’m not moving…

  176.  #176Sun Goddess on April 9, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    Day 2 of no leaning forward was successful!

  177.  #177Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    I was thinking to contact SmartCD today too! I feel disappointed I did not hear from him.. I know we texted last night and it was romantic, but still..

    Ok, maybe in the morning I can ask how he is managing alone with the boy with no help. I feel scared of this new situation when I need to initiate and ask questions! It feels really scary

  178.  #178Starla on April 9, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    ladies, actually, i’m not ready to email him? i am not ready to see him or anything. and i’m actually a little scared he would come right back and i’d feel really off balance because actually i’d like to get into a nice groove of not counting on him in any way before seeing him again. i think right now i would feel in limbo, and i feel so starved for his affection that i would probably binge on it when it came back.

  179.  #179Starla on April 9, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    lizka, i think you’re just experiencing growing pains. i am imagining how big and sireny you will grow when you make it through this test tonight, and just take care of yourself even better, and really feel the discomfort and the sadness and love on yourself. there is so much love and affection and choice where you are headed if you stay on this path. don’t look back now!!

    of course it is your choice, but i wouldn’t be starla if i didn’t try to give you a pep talk into leaning back and holding true to your challenge.

  180.  #180GivingGirl on April 9, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    I’m kind of disappointed I haven’t heard from him since he left yesterday morning. I thought we were back on track. He used to text me every day. I’m getting a distant vibe 🙁

  181.  #181Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 6:09 pm


    I’m still thinking analysing.

    I think I feel cold and not authentic leaning back 100% of the time…

  182.  #182Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    I love this article (the whole site is great but I have read this article 4-5 times and it really speaks to me.)


    I found it today while processing my situation with the help of all you beautiful sirens. <3

  183.  #183Starla on April 9, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    i feel stuck. like every way i move will damn me.

  184.  #184Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    “i feel stuck. like every way i move will damn me.”

    Me too Starla… me too… 🙁

  185.  #185Aurora Girl on April 9, 2012 at 6:18 pm

    182 Lucy
    yes, amazing article…..glad you posted it……..thank you so much!
    Good night Chickies….

  186.  #186Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    Ok it’s 9.25. I’m watching a show that will end at 10. After I’m going to bed.

    So there’s only 35 minutes left to lean back for today. In 35 minutes, the day is over.

    Stupid Day 21. Arrrgggggg

  187.  #187Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:34 pm

    Hi Lizka! I hope you keep leaning back with ATW.

    Just remember that he said he’d call you soon, to explain what his text about his life’s passion meant.
    Remember what it feels like when he tells you he’ll talk to you SOON, see you SOON.

    SOON SOON SOON….. must not mean the same thing to him as it means to me…

    Leaning back isn’t about any of these guys, it’s about you and what you deserve. You deserve a guy who will call and text and ask to see you and be with you. You’ve been warm and open, not demaning… and what he’s shown you so far, wouldn’t inspire me to reach forward with him. I don’t know how you could do it now without expectation, especially from this vibe.

    Hugs to you!!!!!!

  188.  #188Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:37 pm

    Starla, hugs to you too! I wish I had some magic words to take the lonliness and sadness away. I think I’d contact him too… before too much time has gone by, not to get back or to try and make something happen, but to let him know I’d heard him, how sad I felt and how disappointed I was.

  189.  #189Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:39 pm

    Hi Lucy! I’m sorry I haven’t posted sooner, I’ve mostly been checking from my phone, and it’s hard to post on it. I asked about you awhile ago, and Brenda filled me in that you were n a relationship. I’m sorry its not going well… and glad you came bck to the blog. Hugs to you!

  190.  #190Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 6:41 pm

    Thank you Turquoise. Your message to me feels so true that I feel teary…

    You know what? GoldenYouthCD (theFrench lawyer) is talking to me on FB for the second time today. 🙂

  191.  #191Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    Now, about this article…. sheesh, I am sure there is more to the story, but my goodness I can’t imagine what this woman finds attractive about this man. And calling him darling, etc. feels soooo wrong to me. Like she isn’t standing up for herself at all. I’d hate to be in this situation. I remember once when my ex was sick he got really mad at me because I hadn’t checked on him “enough”. He had a cold, wasn’t like he had pneumonia or anything…. but he really wanted me to take care of him. He liked to be waited on though, and his mom really babies him…. so there were moments like that, but not all this blame. Yuck. hope they are far past all that now if she’s still with him.

  192.  #192Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:49 pm

    Oh good Lizka. Let him distract you from ATW. Golden Youth wanted to see you and celebrate with you. Let him enjoy your time and attention. HE’s lucky you are talking to him twice today.

  193.  #193Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    But he also disappeared twice in the middle of the conversation today…

  194.  #194Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    I didn’t do anything for C this weekend either. I didn’t cook him anything, send food home with him, remind him to buy presents for the girls or help him out at all. Feels quite good to lean back that way. I didn’t even give him a birthday card or present. When I wished him a happy birthday, I also told him that he will ALWAYS be older than me. lol. Probably not the nicest, but I really wanted to say it! He loved the present from the girls though, and he knows I helped them with it a little. I wanted to get him something, but decided it’s not my place.

  195.  #195Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:00 pm

    I told the universe last night to send me a hero…. that’s my type. Ohio was being too real/serious topics/depression issues for me, not where I want to be after one date. So, put out to the universe what I want, and today I heard from two army guys on POF. Neither are a good opion for me, …. but I love asking for what I want and seeing what the universe delivers. So fun.

    In other news, my mother in law is being very nice to me. Glad because things haven’t been the best lately. Would feel good to heal that relationship, especially since she has cancer.

  196.  #196Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:05 pm


    What if you had one guy that you could lean forward with as much as you wanted, as part of your experiment. Like DJCD, not someone you might want to end up with long term, but just a go too guy when you feel like leaning forward with ATW.

    Or, go on a dating site and chat with someone there… just to get you through the tough moments. Because this will pass.

  197.  #197Starla on April 9, 2012 at 7:05 pm

    ahhhh my bones are burning with missing CF but i want some space, what’s up with that?


  198.  #198Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:07 pm


    Do you really want space? Hasn’t it been weeks since you saw him?

  199.  #199Sweet Siren on April 9, 2012 at 7:15 pm

    Hi Lizka…I love your challenge! I just wanted to share that looking back to the past, I have ruined a lot of potential relationships by leaning forward when I felt that urgent need. If I were bored I texted the 1 man I was focused on, came across as needy, called, etc. After leaning forward I always felt anxious, worried, stressed, but never better! Guys who at 1 time couldn’t believe I wanted to go out with them were all of a sudden were avoiding me. After learning some of Rori’s tools, now when I feel that urge to lean forward I browse the online profiles of men I’ve never met. Other activities (going to public places, the gym) help as well, but this really helps me to not become overly invested in 1 man, it helps me focus on me & my needs instead of a specific man & it also helps me feel open to more opportunities! Like now, I want to lean forward so I checked my mail on a dating site, and read profiles & answered an email from an interesting man. Instead of feeling anxious, worried, or stressed, i feel relaxed, more confident & intrigued. I also feel unbiased/less attached to a specific outcome. I wish someone shared this knowledge with me when I would lean forward like cr@zy!!! I wish I knew better 3 years ago! Thanks Rori!

  200.  #200Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:19 pm

    What if I send him a funny photo in the morning and ask if he is able to rest on his vacation?

  201.  #201Starla on April 9, 2012 at 7:21 pm

    Turquoise, yes, i can’t deny feeling good about having this time to myself and to think and notice how i feel. and just taking really nice care of myself.

    in addition to missing him terribly:D

  202.  #202Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:23 pm

    I have to leave prob by Thursday and I may not even see him before I go.. He doesn’t know I am going, I just found out today. It just feels so scary to ask if he can see me before thursday afternoon? I don’t want to explain all the details while he is on vacation. He is supposed to come back on Wed night, but what if he will have the child till Thursday? Then I won’t see him for sure. And I am leaving for a long time ;(

  203.  #203Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    Starla, it’s only Monday and you heard from him when, on Thursday?

  204.  #204Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:27 pm

    I am so not good at breaking bad news.. I just fix it first and then share.. or not. But this one will require my absence from home for.. oh I don’t know how long!! Maybe like a month.

  205.  #205Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:29 pm

    I’m glad you are taking such good care of yourself Starla. So glad. 🙂

  206.  #206Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:30 pm

    I will invite him to visit me.. he can do it. But I have to explain it all first, better in person and I miss him and don’t want to go without seeing him.

  207.  #207Tiffany on April 9, 2012 at 7:31 pm

    Lol. Funny how there were some comments about “mommying” a guy, or being his mommy & how it doesn’t work. And now it’s the new article. Sweet! We all must be in “the zone.” or at least, you all. I wadn’t really in that conversation 🙂

    Anyways, I’m feeling good today. It felt nice to get OM’s call on Saturday. I spoke to him briefly yesterday, and he said he’d have to call me back again. Only he “forgot” to call me last time. I mean, I believe him. I just take that to mean that it’s not important to call me. Now he’s asking me to row the boat and “remind him.” I feel like, ick. Plus, he was drunk yesterday when I called. That was unattractive. So basically, I feel totally neutral about him now. I couldn’t care less. I don’t even want him.

    I realize all those ‘minor annoyances’ from before we’re actually red flags I was ignoring. Those other girls who are friends with him & won’t date him are doing do for good reason.

    I’m in a good place. I really don’t care what happens. But the guy isn’t texting me back. Blah de blah. The magic is totally gone for me. I feel very free about this! Hooray!

  208.  #208Starla on April 9, 2012 at 7:31 pm


    tell him “oh i feel so sad, i just found out i am leaving town on Thursday for a while, i don’t want to leave without seeing you! what do you think?”


  209.  #209Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:31 pm


    Maybe you can think of this as not a bad thing. Sounds like he has a lot going on, maybe the time apart will allow him to get things more worked out, he’ll have time to really miss you too. That is always a good thing.

  210.  #210Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 7:31 pm


    Maybe you can think of this as not a bad thing. Sounds like he has a lot going on, maybe the time apart will allow him to get things more worked out, he’ll have time to really miss you too. That is always a good thing.

  211.  #211Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    Thank you Starla, it sounds so much easier put this way 😉

    But I’ll wait till I know the day for sure and get my plane ticket.

  212.  #212Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:35 pm


    Thank you, only I believe in seeing each other rather than not, this is what helps to build a bond, especially so early on in a relationship.

  213.  #213Daria on April 9, 2012 at 7:42 pm

    u know what im feelign really rageful and blaming at right now…….

    women who complain that men never call or come to see their kids

    but who arent even concerened that its their awful abusive and disrespectful attitude that keeps those men from calling or contacting more


    i feel so angry!!!!!!!!

  214.  #214Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 7:44 pm

    Lizka – if ATW wants to contact you then he will. If he doesn’t then he won’t.

    Even if he thinks you’re mad, it would make NO difference.

    Please don’t contact him or your pattern will continue. Do you really want that??


  215.  #215Sun Goddess on April 9, 2012 at 7:45 pm

    I can’t sleep. I keep thinking about the kiss that ANcd stole from me. After not seeing or hearing from him for weeks, I see him at the bar, give him a little bit of a hard time for not trying to reschedule a date or comtact me, talk to another man in front of him and then he still comes over and kisses me. And, thanks me via text afterward. I feel so weird about the whole thing even days later. I didn’t initiate it or ask for it in any way, yet I still feel like I did something wrong (when I think about what I want to build or rather rebuild with LP).

  216.  #216Starla on April 9, 2012 at 7:46 pm

    Aww, yeah Daria, i feel so sad when i witness that. it’s a toxic rabbit hole. while it’s true that these men “should” see their kids and be there more often, whether we like it or not, the women have a lot of power here. this is a great example where “no villains” can really help.

  217.  #217Daria on April 9, 2012 at 7:47 pm

    some limiting beliefs in there to shift for me

  218.  #218Daria on April 9, 2012 at 7:52 pm

    no villains thanks starla

  219.  #219Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 7:59 pm

    Hi BW,

    I watched the video, thank you! So you are doing this every day? All of these exercises? How long did it take you to lose inches in your waist if I may ask?

  220.  #220Daria on April 9, 2012 at 7:59 pm

    its my godbaby’s birthday

    i dont wanna call her all sad and messed up and weird vibed

  221.  #221Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:01 pm

    a part of me says i should push through my uncomfortable feelings and call because im a responsible adult and my feelings come second to honoring her and giving her love

    my feelings of sadneess, terror, turny tummy to call there

  222.  #222R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:01 pm

    Are u okay Daria? What is going on? I am here if u would like to talk 🙂

  223.  #223Starla on April 9, 2012 at 8:01 pm

    i talked to my father for the first time since i was a very little girl when i was 21 or 22, and he straight up said in the first 5 minutes that my mom was too much to deal with so he didn’t come around.

    somehow that didn’t make me feel any better

  224.  #224Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 8:02 pm

    Sure Memulo… seeing each other is what most eople want in a relationship, but if you have to leave town for a month, why not try to think of the good that could come from it?

  225.  #225Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:03 pm

    my godbaby wouldnt’ want me to feel bad. she would want me to know that she knows i love her.

    but a part of me says i have to prove it by calling and showing up, beign the man here

    how much do you really love me if you wont push through your discomfort and connect with me?

    you are not a good parent/mother/caretaker/adult/godmother

  226.  #226R.N.AmazingMe on April 9, 2012 at 8:04 pm

    I have been spamming on here all day!! Makes me feel safe here, I can be me without judgement.

  227.  #227Femininewoman on April 9, 2012 at 8:05 pm

    RE 196 I believe that would not be a good idea for a woman like me who spent so many years in masculine energy leaning forward. It seems to me like reinforcing a bad pattern. What I do now is call a good girlfriend when I feel the intensity.

  228.  #228Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:05 pm

    a phonecall wont really mean a lot to her, and i feel really uncomfortalbe calling over there

    i miss her

    i already just got inspired by a wonderful plan to surprise her with mailing a beautiful gift delivered and adressed to her 🙂

    now im caught in beating myself up about this

  229.  #229Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:06 pm

    Thank you Turquoise, Sweet Siren and BW…

    Turquoise – the “leaning back guy” is a good idea, but DjCD is game over now. I think he has a new gf or something cause he is acting very cold and the other day, when I said I could pass to get my necklace, he said no, that he was “with friends”. I don’t know who else it could be. Maybe the friend I was with last week, the one from the summer camp 10 years ago.. But he’s like madly in love with me and I don’t want to hurt him cause he’s a friend… Awww I feel lonely 🙁

    Sweet Siren – Thank you for sharing. I knew all that, but it’s good to have a reminder and it really boosted my energy…

    BW – No I don’t want to find back my old patterns. You are right. And yeah, I believe that if he wanted to talk to me, he would contact me… Maybe I should close the door in my mind and realise that it is over…

    Wondering if he knows how many tears I have cry for him lile this at night in the darkness of my bedroom… ;(

  230.  #230Jessie1000 on April 9, 2012 at 8:07 pm

    Lucy! I really liked your article.
    The part about breaking patterns and it can be an act of war…I have felt that!

  231.  #231Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:08 pm

    youre a great Godmother. your Godchildren know you love them and they appreciate you.

    you are honored

  232.  #232Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:09 pm


    “1) Ask yourself: what is the FEELING I am looking for
    when I keep running back to him EVEN AFTER he apologises
    and makes the same mistake again. And again. And again.

    Do you feel special, to be the one forgiving him?

    Do you feel finally acknowledged?

    Is this what LOVE looks like to you?

    Is it a rush of excitement that you get from all the drama
    and the uncertainty?

    If you can sit down with yourself in quiet and just think
    until you get to the bottom of it, you will probably find
    that inside, you don’t feel worthy enough for real love,
    and a real commitment.

    I have no judgements here. I have felt like this before.
    I just want you to aim higher than this.

    2) Once you’ve figured the answer out; find another way
    to meet your needs. The best way? Give the feeling you
    are looking for – whether it’s appreciation, praise, the
    feeling that you are special and important – give that to

    The only way to do this is to get to the bottom of it,
    take step 1 (above) first, and then reassure YOURSELF.
    Don’t wait for somebody else to do it, althought it’s
    always nice.

    When you do this, you will find that you can cradle yourself
    and take care of yourself far quicker than this man
    could, at least right now.”

  233.  #233Memulo on April 9, 2012 at 8:09 pm

    Thank you Turquoise!

    I will try 😉

  234.  #234Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 8:10 pm

    (((Hugs))) to all of you who are having a tough time right now. Just remember that these times are for growth, so things are soon to improve!

    Things are great with me. I feel really happy right now. TH has his moments and I’m learning through trial and error how to turn things around. This leaning back thing is GOLD!

    For those doubters out there, trust me – leaning back works if you have the right guy in your sights.

    If he’s not right for you then leaning back won’t draw him in. Remember that.

    If a guy wants you and to be with you, he’ll do whatever it takes to have you.

    Even if you have a guy who’s not stepping up, he might not be ready for a relationship right now. Leaning forward creates pressure through your expectations. Leaning back will give him the space he needs in case he changes his mind. Don’t scare him off!

    I know this because I’ve lived it! It was only when I let go that TH finally realised he wanted to be with me and took steps to prove it.

    We still have a way to go but it gets better every day.

    Meanwhile, an old CD emailed me today. I haven’t talked to him in almost a year!!!

  235.  #235Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:10 pm

    im ima bad Godmother… or im thought of as a bad Godmother… im not worthy

  236.  #236Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    Thank you for posting that (232) Daria… I think I can relate. It is possible that I love the thrill from the dramas with ATW even if I don’t feel ready to admit it yet.

    So for tonight let’s say that’s what it is…

  237.  #237Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 8:15 pm

    My brother is barely involved in my nieces life, and he’d say a big part of that is because of her crazy mother. Yeah, she can be a little crazy at times, when pushed there….. but it doesn’t change that he’s an alcoholic, often doesn’t work, doesn’t take care of himself to the point that his appearance is terribly embarrassing for my niece, who even without much of a father figure for her entire life, is 19 years old, a sophmore at a fabulous college on almost a full scholarship, she works on campus, wants to be a journalist/tv anchor and does that for all the sports teams and their local television station at her school…. she’s in a sorority, was just named sweetheart for 2 frats, went to a performing arts high school…. She’s amazing, because of her mother, who has worked extremely hard to provide for her, by herself.

    My brother can say his wife (who lets him live there when he has no where else to go, didn’t divorce him so he’d have health insurance, who has been a part of our family still) is why he doesn’t see his daughter….. but what’s his excuse to not see the rest of us? We barely see him, sometimes for years. He doesn’t call our parents, didn’t go to our grandmother’s funeral, barely went to our sisters. Because he’d rather be drunk in a bar. We’ve all tried to help him. He doesn’t want it.

  238.  #238Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 8:16 pm

    I don’t like it when dads blame the moms for their own choice to not see their own children. Blaming really bothers me.

  239.  #239Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 8:18 pm

    Lizka, it’s often once we close the door on them that they call – because our vibe has changed.

    The last time TH and I had issues I was totally ready for us to be over. But he had other ideas!

    So yeah I think that if he’s taking this long to contact you then assume it’s over and move on. Do you really want a guy who doesn’t think you’re important enough to contact you more often anyway?

    Even when things were awful with TH for a long time, it was rare for him NOT to contact me. We talked outside of work almost EVERY SINGLE DAY. And he almost always initiated (99.9% of the time).

  240.  #240Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:19 pm


    “Even if you have a guy who’s not stepping up, he might not be ready for a relationship right now. Leaning forward creates pressure through your expectations. Leaning back will give him the space he needs in case he changes his mind. Don’t scare him off!”

    Awwww thank you for this. This is probably THE argument that convinced me tonight of not leaning forward, at least for a little while again… Because I think ATW is in this category…

    Your story with TH is really inspiring me. I love hearing how you leaned back hold your boundaries and he came back to you and gave tou everything you want.


  241.  #241Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 8:23 pm

    Memulo – I don’t do them all but I do “something” at least 5 x per week. They’re really hard most of them but the interval timed ones are great because you get to rest!

    The last inch and a half was lost in the last month or so.

    She’s such a teeny thing too and I just love her accent!

    I don’t need to lose “weight” as such but I do need to tone. And doing these workouts as well as weights and cardio means I’ve lost weight anyway. Oh well… 😉

  242.  #242Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:23 pm


    My heart feels broken when I read your post 239. Yeah, I guess there is nothing better I can do…

    I guess I have to count him out of my CD rotation and stop thinking that he is going to come back…

    That feels so sad…

    But what if I do so and he contacts me after a few weeks? Should I be cold or should I still be warm and open?

  243.  #243Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 8:24 pm

    Lucy, that bothers me too. I feel triggered by this.

  244.  #244LoveAlways on April 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm


    Here’s a secret . . . I just started working out today because I’ve been sick for about 3 weeks!! Lost the weight just with nutrition approach thus far!

    Easiest thing during the reduction phase has been to cook my own food and take it with me to work, and always keep something in my bag to eat. Had to experiment with what I cooked though because I avoid using and eating the following things:


    I drink about 100 ounces of water a day
    and I eat about every 3 hours, no matter what.

    I also always eat a protein with a good carb (veggies).

    I know it’s rough, but worth it 🙂

  245.  #245Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm

    Hi Turquoise, thanks for the hug. <3

  246.  #246Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm

    ok i shifted some beliefs and i just TEXTED my godsis mom to tell my goddaughter happy birthday.

    And now i DONT feel good i feel all tense and afrai id of getting a call and being talked to abusively if i pick up.


    i AM healing though

    love to me

    big love to me

  247.  #247Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 8:30 pm


    My sister that passed away is my youngests’ godmother. When she passed away, I told her that she’d send her different presents now…. rainbows, butterflies, fluffy snow, starfilled skies, soft rain, singing birds…. and all the other beauty that nature can share. So, if it’s not possible for you to see her right now, maybe you can manifest all good things to appear in her life.

    I do believe my sister sends her butterflies, she loved them, and they have landed on her, followed her, danced before her, often. The day we came home from her funeral, we drove through a rainbow. It’s lovely and comforting to feel that connection, even though she’s not actually here.

  248.  #248Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:30 pm

    and weirdly enough JUST seconds later my godsis man / my godbrother texts me about his court case. Which is something very rare that he contacts me lately.

    So now im feeling all guilty like the whole guilty feeling

    liek oh you’re texting with my man and tryna tell my daughter happy birthday

    we don’t need u u nasty bit*ch

    stay out of my kids lives


    all these voices in my head

    i want to heal al this

    this will feel so good to be healed

  249.  #249Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:31 pm

    thanks Turqoise

  250.  #250Butterfly Wings on April 9, 2012 at 8:31 pm

    Always warm and open Lizka. And he WILL be back so don’t feel sad.

    And when he does come back that’s when you can tell him how good it feels to receive regular contact from a guy you’re seeing – then as soon as he’s not in front of you he no longer exists so if he doesn’t respect your needs, you’ll be off living your life as though he doesn’t exist so it won’t matter.


  251.  #251Lucy on April 9, 2012 at 8:37 pm

    I feel lonely, for the first time in almost a year… missing my guy… 🙁

  252.  #252Starla on April 9, 2012 at 8:37 pm

    well another day and night went by that i didn’t contact CF. i feel kind of sad and fatal. like i missed the boat by not contacting him tonight. like maybe to him it’ll be like i didn’t do the dance right and flunked the big audition.

    right now my heart tells me that even though i miss him, i need to love me more than i miss him. i want to spend some time here in this amazing place i discovered where i just love endlessly on myself.

    soooo much love to meeeee.

    i still feel the urgency, though. It's been 4 days since he sent me that letter, and i do feel like i'm up against some clock to prove myself. if that makes any sense…?

  253.  #253Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:38 pm

    2 and somethings weeks ago, when I got the bad news at work about the probation amd everything, I couldn’t sleep at night.

    So I turned on my back (usually never sleep like this), open my palms and face the towards the Universe. And I felt asleep repeating to the Universe that I was ready for a new professional challenge and that I deserved it and that I was ready to receive something new. Universe seems to have heard me because the next day, I got a call for an interview and a week after I quit my job and drank champagne…

    Well, tonight, instead of crying, I am going to do the same. I am going to fall asleep on my back, palms and face towards the Universe, and tell him I am so ready to receive The One (and at the same time to forget that fake love that is ATW). I think I am indeed ready. It’s been 3 weeks now that I’ve been leanin back and I have learn about myselfmore during these two weeks that I have in the last 3 years. Seriously.

    So yes, I am god d@mm ready to receive the one. 🙂

    And ATW can go to h*ll, I decided that it is over. I am no more considering that he will be back or will call. He had 3 weeks to do so (since we had our last serious discussion about us) and he hasen’t move one milimetre. So that’s it. The door is closed (in my mind).

    Bye bye ATW.

    Bye bye Day 21. How I have hated you…

  254.  #254Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:43 pm

    i told my brother i texted i felt too fuchked up to call

    he said

    gota get over that u too grown to be aceepting shit that aint your fault people gotta grow up

    aww i fell good

    i said thanks yeah im working on it im doing much better its my own boundaries i gotta heal. it will strengthen my family

  255.  #255Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:43 pm

    Thank you BW bu I don’t want to think that he will be back so I prefere ro be sad for tonight. If I think that he will be back, i will always have this hope/expectation.

    Yeah if he ever comes back, I’ll try to be warm, we’ll see in the moment… If it happens…

    But now that I think, I’ll do the “inviting the Universe to send me The One” thing tomorrow night.

    Tonight, I am mourning ATw. I feel sad and it’s ok to feel sad. Tonight I just want to cry and imagine that ATW is leaving my body and soul in these litres of tears coming out of my eyes…

  256.  #256Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:45 pm

    and now i feel guilty that i feel loved and included in family by my brother

    but this is HEALTHY and is NOT flirting or disrespect or violating or infringing on anyones romantic relationship

    so there!

    i want to declare this

    believe it

    feel it

    thank u

  257.  #257Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:45 pm

    And tomorrow, when I’ll open my eyes, he’ll be gone for good and I will be over it amd ready to move on…

  258.  #258Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:45 pm

    i want to stomp and sit on it solid!

    i can do this!

    thank you Daria

  259.  #259Sirenity on April 9, 2012 at 8:46 pm

    what you said about the ho’oponopono visualisation…
    The way it was taught to me (by a respected Huna teacher) was that the objective is to make peace with the other and to then CUT the aka cords and set them free and imagine the person floating away in peace.
    It was stressed that this was only until the next time they made contact (ie not permanently closing them off) ..but unless you do NOT set the other free and cut them loose then you are always holding on and clutching at them energetically and that means you are not at peace in yourself..lots of other stuff about this process .
    The mantra part was a more recent “invention ” i believe and has been taught as part of the process by some teachers.

    Ideally you do this process every night with every one in your family , acquaintances , friends and enemies , lovers old and new. Let them float close , make peace through the aka cord then cut it and set them free.

    I was also taught that those who really are close , eg family , can feel it , and often re-establish the energetic link very soon after , eg call you , text etc..

    Hope this helps .

  260.  #260Sirenity on April 9, 2012 at 8:47 pm

    Sorry , if you do not set them free…etc typo

  261.  #261Butterfly wings on April 9, 2012 at 8:48 pm

    (((Lizka))) he so does not deserve you. I hope when he does come back you’ll feel bored of him and will hopefully have somebody (or a few) who is much much better – and step up!!

  262.  #262Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:50 pm

    Turquose 247

    Wow. 🙂

    You’re an amazing mother!

  263.  #263Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:52 pm

    If he comes back, he better be there to stay or I’ll seriously kick his @ss. Lol

  264.  #264Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:52 pm

    im an amazing mother

  265.  #265Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:53 pm

    “The only way to do this is to get to the bottom of it,
    take step 1 (above) first, and then reassure YOURSELF.
    Don’t wait for somebody else to do it, althought it’s
    always nice.

    When you do this, you will find that you can cradle yourself
    and take care of yourself far quicker than this man
    could, at least right now.
    3) Regardless of whether you decide to stay with this man
    or not, start saying a big fat “NO”. “NO THANK YOU”.
    “THANKS. BUT NO THANKS”. And say this in response to his
    requests for threesomes.

    Or say: “No, I am not interested in a threesome. The
    idea scares me. And it would hurt me.”

    That’s the truth isn’t it? Of course it is. So, do say
    that to him.

    Why would you want to be honest?

    Because then he will see that there is actually
    something to take care of.

    Right now, he can’t see much. Because you’re pretending.
    So stop pretending.

    Be honest. You’re telling ME you don’t want to – and
    you’re dishonoring your own true heart desires just to
    feel loved.

    Little do you know the number of men out there waiting
    in line to love you in a way that will light up your

    See, this man is attracting a bunch of pushover women; women
    who don’t really care about him anyway – so it’s not good
    for HIM for you to be doing this and needless to say, it’s
    also tearing you apart.

    So stand up for yourself. I understand that standing up
    for yourself is something that is easier said than done,
    so here’s what I want you to do.

    Think back to a time when you really did stand up for
    yourself. Maybe back at school? When you were a kid?

    What did you do?

    Did you say something? Did you throw your fists in the
    air? Maybe yell at someone?

    Or perhaps if you were a very boisterous kid like me.
    When I was only 10 years old I yelled at a stranger on
    the street for insulting my mother (I’m protective of
    the ones I love).

    Perhaps you haven’t done that before, but I am CERTAIN
    you have stood up for someone you love before. Maybe
    your mother or father, or a sister or brother. Or even
    a pet.

    You need to realise that this woman I’m talking about –
    this woman who stands up for YOU – for ANGEL is there,
    inside of you right now, waiting for you to hear her
    and acknowledge her and trust her to know that there
    is better for you.

    That it will be ok, even if you do let this man go
    and even if you DO have to live through the fear that
    there may not be another man around the corner ready
    to take care of you (that’s not true but I respect
    that you might feel that it is).

    There are times in my past when I felt weak and didn’t
    stand up for myself because I felt hopeless. You
    probably already know about this. My ex boyfriend was
    cheating on me. I tried to push the relationship
    forward even after I found out.

    Just because I didn’t trust myself to find someone
    better. And most importantly, I didn’t feel I was
    a great catch (this is many years ago now).

    And I can say now, with great pride, that it’s
    a nice feeling to know I have all the options in the
    world, and so do you.

    *from that article i linked above

    im feeling really inspired by the way the writer expresses herself and feeling encouraged and opened up by her suggestions

  266.  #266Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 8:54 pm

    Thanks Sirenity. I wasn’t thinking of it as a constant connection, but rather a golden cord that came out of my heart and reached to his. Then when my visualization ended, it sort of evaporated into sparkly flakes and disappeared. I’ll add that part though, of it being letting go and setting free.

  267.  #267Lizka on April 9, 2012 at 8:54 pm

    Good night sirens. I’m goimg to bed. This day has to end asap. Horrible day.

    But tomorrow is a new day. The first without ATW…

  268.  #268Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:55 pm

    more frmo that article… the man’s advice :

    “A mentor of mine once said, see the pattern, don’t
    just hear the story. The pattern here is that he
    would probably never be exclusive with anyone;
    with the patterns he is running right now with

    His true intentions? Here it is… he wants to feel
    the attraction and desire. He intuitively knows that
    if he enters into a committed exclusive relationship,
    then attraction and desire may fade and disappear.
    That’s why he has so much resistance to commitment!

    He is a high dopamine person who gets his high from
    seeing and meeting new women. And the way he acts…
    it’s just to preserve and protect his own feelings
    of attraction.

    If you ever want him or any man for that matter to
    commit to you in an exlcusive relationship, then you
    have to work on building attraction. I know I’ve
    probably said that a billion times, but it’s the
    simple truth and dont overlook it.

    If you can make him feel deep attraction, then he
    won’t have a need to go around seeing other women.

  269.  #269Daria on April 9, 2012 at 8:57 pm

    im a high dopamine person!!

  270.  #270T-Girl on April 9, 2012 at 8:57 pm


    I believe that the ATW’s in the world are there for us to show us in comparison how great it is when a real, step-up man enters into our lives. Someone that perhaps may not have been our type but really is a step-up, relationship ready man. Someone who calls every day, can’t wait to book the next date, and genuinely wants to be with you.

    I love how you lay in your bed palms up and let the universe know what you want. It has already worked so well for you and I bet it will again. And this time you will be able to recognize him when he comes along.

  271.  #271Turquoise on April 9, 2012 at 9:04 pm

    Thank you Lizka. Sweet dreams, tomorrow will be better.

  272.  #272Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:06 pm

    i do need to respond, though…right? like a normal human being?

    i missed this chapter in life 101 and i feel mistrusting of myself.

  273.  #273Starla on April 9, 2012 at 9:08 pm

    back and forth back and forth. sorry for the spam, ladies!! i’m going to bed, sweet dreams:)

  274.  #274T-Girl on April 9, 2012 at 9:12 pm

    Starla, I believe that you definitely need to respond. Even if it is to tell him how sad and disappointed you are feeling. It seems to me that you are trying to handle it alone rather than letting yourself be vulnerable with him.

    Perhaps this is something for you to heal?

  275.  #275Tiffany on April 9, 2012 at 10:36 pm

    Speaking of being “his mother,” I realized that OM was asking me to basically “mommy” him, by checking in, to “remind” him to call me. Seriously – as if he couldn’t remember all by himself!

    So, at first, I complied. I went along with it, and I said, “okay.” In fact, I think my little “boy” got all excited, like “ooh, yippee, something to do!” But I gotta admit, the girl in me was feeling a little bit squirmy, like, ‘Hey, now, something is not right about this.”

    Tonight, all in “boy” mode, I texted him to let him know when I would be available, and did he want to talk? No response.

    I thought, for sure I would hear from him at least by the time I specified. Nada.

    Luckily, I am not even worrying or wondering about what is going on at this point. Honestly, I was feeling tired and like I didn’t even want to really bother with it. I literally did not have the *energy* to get bitter or annoyed. I just really did not care. But objectively, I decided that it felt rude of him to do that. To just not even respond when I made contact.

    So I gave it like an hour. Then I send a follow-up text:

    “I feel super weird about “reminding” you to call me. You are an adult person. I think you can take care of yourself. How about you call me back when you feel like it?”

    I know. Not super feeling-y. But I opened with a feeling. I was considering saying that I felt like his mommy, checking in, actually. But then I didn’t want to say that, and drop the idea that I even *could* be his mommy. No guy wants to see you like his mommy. That’s just not sexy. It’s what Sherry Argov calls the “Madonna/Ho” complex. Or the “Mommy/Ho” complex. Or something like that. You’re either his mom, or you’re a sex object. You can’t be both!

    So, still no word from him. But at least I feel pretty clear about how I’ve communicated, and I feel clear about how I feel – to me. I’m not expecting much, if anything. And I feel clear, because I’ve released him to make up his own mind about when and where. I’m not even giving him any parameters this time. The oars are in his hand. The tennis ball is in his court. If he wants to play this game, then he’s going to have to serve it back to me. 😉

    Until then, I’m taking a break, and staying totally relaxed, and focused on me…mm, I’m delicious and wonderful and fantastic. And it’s good to be me. 🙂

    <3 <3 <3

  276.  #276Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:45 pm

    #138 SLV

    I am now on 3 dating sites. 😀

    POF and Smooch are the 2 I experimented with by checking guys out (leaning forward) but I didn’t initiate contact with anybody by sending messages first. I checked out 3 guys of interest on each site and 1 from each responded, not very well as it turned out and both have now poofed, but as I had no investment in either I am not at all bothered.

    Oasis is the site I joined this weekend, no photo, just a decent profile. I am using the 2 minute speed dates for practise. I have had a few men befriend me but 2 turned out to be scammers, I can spot those types REALLY quickly now. 😀

  277.  #277Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:47 pm

    #138 SLV


    Here’s what Rori said in e-mail yesterday:

    “…But it’s important to understand how he might see this activity. In an online dating environment, it is perfectly acceptable for a woman to initiate contact.”

    I did see this yesterday too, but honestly I don’t have the confidence to do this, I couldn’t handle the rejection lol!!

  278.  #278Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 10:51 pm

    Oasis is definitely in the USA, I had a 2 minute speed date on my first day with Luis from South Carolina though he didn’t type very good English. 😀

  279.  #279Silver Moonbeam on April 9, 2012 at 11:13 pm

    #259 Sirenity

    I really like this visualisation, thank you.

  280.  #280Brenda on April 9, 2012 at 11:31 pm

    My phone number finally got changed, and I feel happy about it. No more Kenny.

    Ryan is still able to contact me by email, mail, or at church. But it will send him a big statement, too, that I don’t send him my new number. His birthday is coming up mid-May, so I intend to not contact him at all and then send him a nice, homemade birthday card. Rori says that is the one time when it is cool for a woman to lean forward.

  281.  #281Brenda on April 9, 2012 at 11:46 pm

    Tonight is my Mom’s second night here at my house, and we’re enjoying each other’s company. We have each had a couple of meltdowns, but all in all, we are both feeling really good about being together.

    This is sort of a test run to see if we think it will work to live together. So far, so good. I just really want her to be happy…and I feel lonely, so I love to have her here, even tho it is a lot of work with all her physical needs (wheelchair, oxygen, incontinence, etc).

    My Mom is my best friend.

  282.  #282Tiffany on April 9, 2012 at 11:47 pm



    Sun Goddess – #215 – I thought the description of how your CD “stole” a kiss from you at the bar, and then later thanked you for it, sounded kind of cool! Guys like to do things in their own way and in their own time. We can’t always decide when and how. I’ve made that mistake before – pushed a guy away because the was doing something when I “thought” it would be better to do it a different way. But then it feels like we are telling them what to do. Also, he must have seen you flirting with that other guy and wanted to do something in public to “claim” you – because he didn’t want to lose you to another dude! Do you know what that means? It means you are a rockin’ goddess and a siren to the Max!

    You go, girl!

  283.  #283Emerson on April 10, 2012 at 12:06 am

    FW thanks for posting @ 49

    Hi Brenda that’s really nice you are helping your mom out. 🙂 You are kind.

    I didn’t know Rori said we can lean forward on guys’ bdays. Hmm interesting.

    Lizka, hang in there girl, I really like reading your posts and learn a lot from you. I can relate to the wanting to lean forward feeling…and the feeling of urgency. But sounds like you got it all managed pretty well!!

  284.  #284Ella on April 10, 2012 at 1:16 am


    Am I right in thinking that you did not reply at all to his big break up type e-mail?

    I wasn’ sure?

    I know this may go against the grain a little however if it was me I would reply.

    Just something very brief like ‘I feel really sad and confused’.

    I would respond like that in order to stay open… leave the door open, without sacficing myself or leaning forward.

    But that’s just me.

    Obviously you must do what feels right for you.


  285.  #285Mona on April 10, 2012 at 1:24 am

    The love of my life and I have been in and out of each others life for many, many years. Circumstances kept us apart and now we are at a place where if we want a relationship we should be able to have it. The problem is, we are about 600 or so miles apart. So, distance could be a factor here.

    Lack of communication caused us problems in the past and appears to be rearing its ugly head again.

    He has professed his love and says he wants to be the man I want “next”. Now, he’s backed away and I’m feeling scared and confused. I don’t know what I should do to let him know my feelings.

    I need some guidance here.


  286.  #286Ella on April 10, 2012 at 1:38 am

    This is Day 1 for me.

    Of my Challenge.

    Eating like a Siren.

    Creating a Siren’s work life and

    Super Receiving Leanback Mode.

    Looking forward to it even if it might be challenging.

    Or maybe it won’t!

    We will see.

    Looking forward to getting stuck in.

  287.  #287Silver Moonbeam on April 10, 2012 at 1:45 am

    Ella tell me all about eating like a Siren. 😀

    It has been raining and grey here for the 4 day break as you know, and I have done nothing but eat chocolate and hot cross buns and other stuff I know I shouldn’t, trying to get back into it today and I ordered some weights online but they won’t be here for a few weeks so am cancelling my waste of money gym membership as I never go.

  288.  #288Sirenity on April 10, 2012 at 2:05 am

    I feel bad about this post..

    Nancy is not acting like a mother..she is acting like a victim; an over functioning , over pleasing, pacifying , fearful ,saccharine sweet victim of an abusive relationship .

    Lets hope, (as a mother of sons myself 🙂 ), that this is not about how a mother acts .

    “It wont work” because she has NO BOUNDARIES and he is abusive. It has nothing to do with Nancy being a mother….cringe…

    I am a mother of sons.
    They are responsible for themselves and their decisions, they communicate well and they are respectful and honorable young men.

    Shoot me if I ever ever ever act like Nancy..in the name of being a “mother” !!

  289.  #289Ella on April 10, 2012 at 2:11 am

    Hi Silver Moonbeam.

    Well for me it is eating mainly fresh stuff… like lots of nice, fresh (preferably organic) veggies, salads, reduced fat hummus, and plenty of nice, good quality protein like chicken, fish, eggs, beans etc…

    It is cutting out on processed bread and cutting out/back sugar.

    I will have some good quality fat each day like avacado or oilve oil or oily fish, and I allow myself a few squares of high cocoa dark chocolate each evening.

    It is cooking/preparing a fresh meal for myself each evening and making better choices at each meal, so it can take a little planning.

    It is drinking more water and herbal tea, and reducing actual tea and coffee to 2-3 cups per day.

    That is what eating like a Siren is for me.

    And luckily for me it also creates weight loss 🙂

    If you want more info from me about this you can visit my newest page on my website here:


    I agree with you about the gym membership.

    I so much favour natural feeling activities like walking, dancing, and for me Zumba and Pole Fitness.

    What do you think?

  290.  #290Silver Moonbeam on April 10, 2012 at 2:27 am

    I think it all sounds really good Ella and pretty much what I was doing before I went off track about a week ago, except for dark chocolate which I hate and red wine which I love. 🙂

    I am going to Zumba next Monday night, I have found a place near to me and I will get back into my walk/jogs and weights again.

    I WILL and I CAN.

    Just had quite a nice message from a CD on Oasis, seems quite normal too!! 🙂

  291.  #291Silver Moonbeam on April 10, 2012 at 2:29 am

    p.s. I checked out your website last week, it’s looking great!!

  292.  #292Ella on April 10, 2012 at 2:39 am

    Silver Moonbeam.

    All sounds good.

    Lets get back on track together.


  293.  #293Sun Goddess on April 10, 2012 at 2:43 am

    282 Tiffany,

    I felt like a Siren that night. Now, not so much. I feel more confused than I ever was. Maybe after Wednesday I’ll have a clearer idea.

  294.  #294Ella on April 10, 2012 at 3:05 am

    Ow, this is interesting.

    MWC and I were talking, about how I still feel scared and uncomfortable sometimes about the alcohol issues.

    And I asked him whether he is still open to getting some support if we find someone decent to help.

    And he said yes.

    And I have found someone who I think could be very good.

    And I want to meet her anyway as I am considering training as a Counsellor, in which case I need to be in counselling myself.

    So anyway she has an appointment free tomorrow morning, when I know MWC is free, and so am I.

    And I had said I would go ahead and sort an appointment.

    But now it all feels kind of full on and urgent.

    I just heard back from her that she has a spare appointment tomorrow, but I don’t want to lean forward to MWC to ask him about it… or book it without checking with him first that its still ok.

    And obviously as I am leaning back I don’t really want to contact him either…

    Esp as I have been a little leany forward/giving in the last few days.

    So I feel a bit caught…

    In between 2 priorities.

    It feels quite urgent.

    So maybe I just need to breath and lean back.

    And know that if it doesn’t happen this week we can still see her another time…

    Maybe I will e-mail her back and say that I would love to come tomorrow but need to speak to MWC 1st and so will get back to her if we can…

    And then just wait for him to contact me and ask what he thinks…

    I would like to have his input on this so it feels like something we are doing together, rather than me just trying to manage this situation, which feels masculine, mothering, and long term dampening to my attraction.

    Although I feel good that he is willing/wanting to work out this situation.

    And I feel impressed with his bravery in facing it head on.

    And I want to feel like he is taking the steps… not just me…

    Including sorting out some help.

    So I will e-mail her back and then wait to speak to him.

  295.  #295Ella on April 10, 2012 at 3:12 am

    Oh I want to say, I am also practicing the CRAFT method… for getting your loved one sober…

    Which talks about having a good counsellor ready…

    And I have been kinda doing that alongside Rori stuff… and some of it gels perfectly, like the communication stuff, and taking care of your own needs, using FMs and withdrawing when things feel bad.

    And then some of it totally conflicts, like seeking out treatement and arranging that to be ready for when the person agrees to get some help…

    Which is obviously totally lean forward, masc energy stuff.

    So this is what I feel a little stuck on as I am navigating my way…

    And trying to lean back too.


    But also feel good that I have these tools and support available to me.

    Reckon I am enough of a Siren that I can find a way to work this.

    To switch between boy and girl hats… and still be a Siren.

    And be mostly in receiving/girl with my man, even whilst still practicing CRAFT.


  296.  #296Silver Moonbeam on April 10, 2012 at 3:46 am

    What is CRAFT?

  297.  #297siren song on April 10, 2012 at 4:25 am

    My guy is back.

  298.  #298Ella on April 10, 2012 at 5:06 am

  299.  #299Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 5:07 am

    siren song, I can’t wait to be able to say that…:(

    Hopefully today.

    Feeling sad this morning but I will get back into my positive mood right now, starting with my workout, then breakfast, shower and running more errands.

    The weather has been yucky here too but I was able to keep with my healthy habits.

  300.  #300Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 5:09 am

    Got an email from a friend last night. I told her a little bit about my situation. Here’s what she replied. Sounds very sireny to me.

    “Hey..thanks for responding. I hope you don’t beat yourself up too much over anything! You know, its just as likely that he is having deep thoughts too. Isn’t that good actually? Aren’t we supposed to think about our lives, who we are and who we love? I so understand, and as I age on I realize how important, maybe even crucial it is that we strive to be happy with whatever is going on because its what we have and somewhere in it..there IS a gift! We grow. Til the very end..we need to grow and learn to love ourselves and each other!”

  301.  #301Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 5:10 am

    Ok going to HIIT it now!

  302.  #302Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 5:19 am

    Last night, I was thinking how perfect it was that he didn’t call me.

    I thought it meant that he’s still deep in reflection and that he will come around and not want to break up.

    This morning, I’m feeling confused.

    But trying hard to switch that feeling to a good one.


  303.  #303siren song on April 10, 2012 at 5:22 am

    i don’t know how i feel about this…i feel scared things are going to get intense again.

    we shall see.

  304.  #304siren song on April 10, 2012 at 5:23 am

    (lizka) (francesca) (starla)

  305.  #305siren song on April 10, 2012 at 5:23 am

    (lizka) (francesca) (starla)

  306.  #306Silver Moonbeam on April 10, 2012 at 5:29 am

    # 291 Ella

    I want to join your team!!!

  307.  #307Ella on April 10, 2012 at 5:47 am


    Yes, excellent


    What should we call it?

  308.  #308Starla on April 10, 2012 at 5:56 am

    okay i am sending the email
    everything feels so awkwardly timed to send.

    Right now I have…
    “I feel so sad… I just adore you. I am crazy about you!! and I miss you so much…”

  309.  #309Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:01 am

    (((siren song)))

  310.  #310Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:03 am

    Oh, Starla, that feels like a bit too much to me.

    Try and keep it in line with what we talked about last night.

    All these things you wrote there, you could tell him later, when you’ve talked things thru a bit more and you feel less confused.

    What do you think?

  311.  #311Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:04 am

    siren song, just sink into that feeling of fear, listen to it and then let it go.

  312.  #312Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:07 am

    It feels good to work out.

    I’m all tired and sweaty but I feel like I’ve just accomplished something important to me.

    Of course, I did!

    I want to continue taking care of myself, feeling good about myself and the way I look.

    I don’t want to feel sorry for myself.

    I’m strong.

  313.  #313Starla on April 10, 2012 at 6:09 am

    francesca, ISN’T that what we talked about last night? hehe

  314.  #314Mochaberri on April 10, 2012 at 6:09 am

    Trying to catch up

    Coco Kisses – I feel sad reading about your situation and I know that as time goes on you will heal.

  315.  #315Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 6:19 am

    siren song move slowly. I would check with him to see if he is sure this is what he wants to do. Then tell him I want to take it slow.

  316.  #316Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:23 am

    Starla, kind of, but you were also talking about how you wanted to take care of yourself.

    Last night, you wrote that, I thought it was good:

    “I will tell him that i feel sad and that i miss him and that my feelings are true, and that i’m going to take care of myself”

  317.  #317Starbright on April 10, 2012 at 6:24 am

    Maybe, take out the “I am crazy about you!!” ?? It feels just a bit over the top to me…

  318.  #318Starla on April 10, 2012 at 6:26 am

    f*ck it. everything i say makes things worse to him. everything i say i have to watch how i word it. i have to be careful not to be too this or that.

    i feel like i’m suffocating trying to type two sentences to him.

    f*ck it and f*ck him for that. for now.

  319.  #319Starla on April 10, 2012 at 6:29 am

    over the top would be “you are the most beautiful creature to have ever existed”

    which crossed my mind as i drifted off to sleep last night, lol.

    *creepy music plays*

    sigh, pout.

  320.  #320Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 6:36 am

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    Or we wish we could forgive more quickly and no
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    This doesn’t mean to necessarily leave the
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    It means you allow your man to feel and express
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    What we all want most of all is to feel heard,
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  321.  #321Starbright on April 10, 2012 at 6:40 am

    sorry, should not have commented you know best

  322.  #322Ella on April 10, 2012 at 6:41 am


    ‘I feel so sad and confused right now.’

    And then maybe later, when he has replied

    ‘I miss you and how things were’

    You are doing great hon.

    Big breaths and keep it short. VERY short.


  323.  #323Mel on April 10, 2012 at 6:42 am


    I say go for it… if that’s what you truly feel. I might add: “But I respect your decision, even if it feels terrible right now.” Or something like that. What do you think?


  324.  #324Starbright on April 10, 2012 at 6:42 am

    I should just be healing myself….four weeks of gallbladder trouble…ugh!

  325.  #325Starla on April 10, 2012 at 6:46 am


    yes to both of you. i’ll do both.

    very short is a great idea.

    the second i got into braingymnastics with him, i lost. i now learned to keep it to my feelings and keep it short.

  326.  #326Ella on April 10, 2012 at 6:47 am


    We have an appointment to see the new Counsellor tomorrow.

    Suddenly I feel SOOOO nervous.

    I feel anxious.

    What if she is rubbish and no good and can’ help at all?

    What if she makes it worse?


    Shut up NVs.

    Go away.

    I’m just gonna go along and stay open and see what happens.

    Its all experience.

    Feel fluttery tummy though.

  327.  #327Mel on April 10, 2012 at 6:48 am


    Love ya toots!

    I kinda feel good about the “respect your decision” part because the whole message says: Hey… I think you’re great, and this is not what I want… but I’m not going to convince you here or chase after you bub. LOL

  328.  #328Mel on April 10, 2012 at 6:57 am


    You are a sweet soul.

    If he’s ready, the counseling will be just what was needed. If he’s not, it won’t. You have no control. It’s all him.

    Just keep on. Just be. You are a beautiful siren.

  329.  #329Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 6:57 am

    Hello Day 22…

  330.  #330Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 6:58 am

    Sun Goddess – You feel confused why? about what?

    Is it because you haven’t heard from him since then?

    I don’t remember exactly, but I think you said there was another CD that you liked?

  331.  #331Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 7:02 am

    RE #320 –

    Reading that, I’m kinda feeling a little jealous, like, I wish I had responded to OM’s break-up email with a message like that. “I feel sad and confused,” would have been way more authentic and true to my feelings than what I actually did/said. I still haven’t *told* him that I felt sad and confused. But, well, I guess right now I am just waiting to see where the conversation goes. And knowing that he has difficulty in responding to emotions, I don’t actually know that making that statement would have made anything better. *whew* okay, I feel better now…. 🙂

  332.  #332Ella on April 10, 2012 at 7:02 am



    I think the no control bit is what is so scary!


  333.  #333Mel on April 10, 2012 at 7:02 am


    Day 22’s going to be your best yet, I think. 😉

  334.  #334Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 7:02 am

    Hello, Lizka!

  335.  #335Frances on April 10, 2012 at 7:04 am

    Oh wow, did I ever feels so triggered from a post….

    Poor Nancy.

    I realised I have been a “mother” in my last 3 relationship.

    Ex no.1 was an alcoholic
    Ex no.2 had bipolar disorder
    Ex no.3 had ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder)

    I had to “manage” the relationship. With ex no 1 x & 2, I ended up leaving.

    With ex no.3, he left me.

    I feel so sad
    I feel so much pain
    I feel remorse
    I feel angry (at myself)
    I feel I wasted so many years
    I feel resentful

    I am such a “do-er” I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to do what I’m supposed to do to have a healthy relationship!

    I grew up “brainwashed” by my parents and sibling that you had to “work/earn” love. That if you gave nothing, you would receive nothing.

    So I gave. And gave. And gave. And gave.

    Until I had no more to give.

    I’m single now & not even dating. Feel too overwhelming for me.

  336.  #336Frances on April 10, 2012 at 7:04 am

    Oh wow, did I ever feels so triggered from a post….

    Poor Nancy.

    I realised I have been a “mother” in my last 3 relationship.

    Ex no.1 was an alcoholic
    Ex no.2 had bipolar disorder
    Ex no.3 had ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder)

    I had to “manage” the relationship. With ex no 1 x & 2, I ended up leaving.

    With ex no.3, he left me.

    I feel so sad
    I feel so much pain
    I feel remorse
    I feel angry (at myself)
    I feel I wasted so many years
    I feel resentful

    I am such a “do-er” I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to do what I’m supposed to do to have a healthy relationship!

    I grew up “brainwashed” by my parents and sibling that you had to “work/earn” to get love. That if you gave nothing, you would receive nothing.

    So I gave. And gave. And gave. And gave.

    Until I had no more to give.

    I’m single now & not even dating. Feel too overwhelming for me.

  337.  #337Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:06 am

    Ella, I say trust in her and give her a try.

    An outsider voice sometimes makes us see things in a different light.

  338.  #338Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:09 am

    There are no mistakes, there are only different roads to explore.

  339.  #339Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:11 am

    Yesterday, before falling asleep, I decided to do a “closure” with ATW even if we are not suppose to.

    Some of you might not agree with it, but I really did it with no expectation and no idea of leaning forward. If I didn’t do this closure, somewhere inside me, I would always be waiting/expecting/hoping that he comes back.

    I just texted “good bye”. But in French, we have a stronger word that means “good bye, we’re not gonna see each other again” or kind of…

    I was not expecting an answer (and this is why I sent it during the night and didn’t wait in the morning, because there was less chance that he replied the next morning…

    Well at 7 this morning I had an answer…

    (haha Turquoise you will love this one I think!!)

    Two messages:

    Message 1: “No, later”

    Message 2: “Too many things happening right now in our lifes to say good bye”

    WTF seriously? What is that suppose to mean??????

    Arggg I feel mad at the no meaning messages.

  340.  #340Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:14 am

    Awww Thank you Mel.

    Hello Tiffany!!

  341.  #341Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 7:14 am

    Hi! Is CocoKisses anywhere today??

    Coco, I was reading about your husband, and I felt so sad. : ( There is probably nothing you can “do” at this point – except, like the other ladies said, do the Little Bo Peep thing. Okay, they didn’t call it that. But I’m saying it’s like, “leave them alone and they’ll come home” kind of situation. Or not. But you won’t know until you let him go do it. Divorce might not be great for him. But it may be that, for some reason, on his “hero’s journey” (a la Jonathon Aslay), he has to go out on his own for a bit. We have to do that sometimes with guys, too. Or at least I do. Anyway, ((((big hugs))))

    I wanted to ask you about something else!! Is it true that you are the stylist here on the blog? I was recently thinking to myself that maybe that is something I should get into. So I started talking to a few people, and I’m just getting a really good vibe about it, that it could be a great fit for me. I’d love to talk to a siren who is already doing it! If you want, you can email me at my siren email off-blog: sirentiffany [at] gmail. com.

    Meanwhile, I only mentioned this to someone recently, and I got all excited about it. I started to build momentum. And then I paused, and now the NVs are squeaking their way in. I think I need to continue forward, or else they are going to get louder and louder. I just need to leave them behind in the dust, with their “you’re not stylish enough,” “you don’t have money,” and “you can’t do this,” and “this isn’t really right for you” BS. Go away, NVs! You’re not helping me right now! How about you make yourselves useful and start building a scaffold for me to build this awesome building around, because that would be a LOT more useful to me. Thanks! Lol.

    Anyway, CocoKisses, hope to hear from you!! 🙂

  342.  #342Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:16 am

    Oh by the way, the Message 1was not really “No, later”.

    I can’t translate the expression he used from French to English.

    It’s like a mix of “No, later” and “No, soon”.

    Well it just means be patient, something is coming, I guess…

  343.  #343Starla on April 10, 2012 at 7:16 am

    lol lizka don’t answer him

  344.  #344Mel on April 10, 2012 at 7:23 am


    I remember with sexysarcastic, my response didn’t feel too sireny. It was like… I feel like I’m chasing you and I don’t like that feeling. If you want to go out again, I’m open to that, but it’s up to you to arrange.” And I think he got all offended and I just felt dumb.

    But he still came back 2 months later. It’s all about the energy I think. Cutting that cord. I distinctly remember at the 2-month mark, I noticed he had changed his picture on his blackberry profile, and I looked at it and thought… huh, I really don’t feel attracted to you any more. I heard from him the very next day. And there’s no way he could have known I looked at his pic. Funny how that works.

    So I don’t think it really matters how you responded to OM… as long as you just let go of the outcome and keep moving forward in your own life.

  345.  #345Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:24 am

    Lol Starla, you think?

    I know that would be the most mature thing to do, but I feel pretty childish this morning…

    I prepared two messages, I don’t know, feel like sending at least one of them.

    I don’t care. It’s like I NEED him to know why I’m walking away so IF EVER he decides to come back one day in years from now, he’ll know what doesn’t work with me…

  346.  #346Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:27 am

    Mel, I know thiswas not for me, but I’ll take “So I don’t think it really matters how you responded to OM… as long as you just let go of the outcome and keep moving forward in your own life.” as an advice for myself and I will send my two messages.

    I am not attached to the outcome, and I don’t want him in my life anymore, I want to move on and it will feel incredibly good to send them even if they’re not the most sireny in the world.

  347.  #347Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:28 am

    Lizka, I guess you wrote “adieu”?

    And he said “non, à plus tard”?

  348.  #348Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:32 am

    So my messages are:

    Message 1 (already sent it 2 seconds ago): I don’t know what you are talking about… I feel sidelined (is that the word? anyway it’s not what I used since the message was in french, just couldn’t find a translation for “tenue à l’écart”) from your life so I have no idea…

    Message 2: But no, I am feeling cold with the door opened waiting for you. So if you are not entering, I am closing the door…

  349.  #349Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:34 am

    Yes Francesca, I wrote Adieu”, and his exact words were “Non a plus”

    WTF seriously? No?

  350.  #350Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:39 am

    So that’s it. The second message is sent.

    I am NOT attached to the outcome. I am not actually expecting any outcome except maybe that he never calls me again but that is ok with me. That’s what I want and that’s what the best for me.

    Now I can get out of bed and eat a good breakfast and go run.


  351.  #351Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 7:45 am

    Good morning sirens
    Lizka hang in there, let him contact you…

    Brenda, please please tell me what Rori said about birthdays and leaning forward…..

    my crush has a birthday on thursday and i have been planning on ignoring it….

    Rori said it is cool to lean forward on a bday?

    Looking forward to your response….

    Well I have a busy day and I am going to meditate and then get ready for my cooking class…..this is day 15 of no leaning forward…..

    Hey, last night i was feeling impatient, so i watched a REALLY funny movie that i streamed on netflix and it was so great, meg ryan was in it and she was a total siren….
    it is called “my mom’s new boyfriend”
    I am reading Pema Chodron and she is a good inspiring person to read, although lately i have not wanted to meditate as much, i think all this leaning back is bringing up uncomfortable feelings.
    so she said that the uncomfortable feelings aren’t the problem, she said to lean into them, like we do with Rori’s tools and the problem is what we do to avoid the feelings….so to make friends with it, to make friends with having CD’s who don’t call and being alone with ourselves…..well, here’s to another great day alone with me!
    Love to you all
    Hi Daria! i am sure your goddaughter feels your love for her.
    Hi Turqoise, glad you got clarity on ohio cd….have fun with the new cd’s.

  352.  #352Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 7:49 am

    Siren song,
    i hope i got the right siren, but if not, i just wanted to say hi and thanks for those suggestions of what to do when i feel like leaning forward…..browsing the dating sites is a good idea….thanks…..and i also like cleaning…that makes me feel good..

    Hey does any one want to make a list of things to do when we feel like leaning forward?

    1 Call a girlfriend
    2 Breathe
    3 Self pleasure ourselves (that might make it worse)

  353.  #353Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:51 am

    Healing Waterfall –

    I haven’t read ALL of Rori’s stuff, but I really doubt that she says you can lean forward on birthdays.

    And then what? On Christmas and on Bank Holiday???

    Ask other’s opinion, but I would be really surprised…

    If he’snot contacting you, why would you want to be all nice on his birthday?

  354.  #354Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:55 am


    These works for me:

    – working out
    – cooking
    – watching funny stuff on the internet
    – coming here to read and post and learn
    – reading novels or stuff about relationships and tools to use
    – cleaning (even if I don’t really like it)

    and yes…

    – breathe

  355.  #355Jessie1000 on April 10, 2012 at 7:55 am

    I think the leaning back sometimes…deep down makes me feel like I dont deserve a guy to love me back.

    Like I didnt earn his love so he wont stay with me.

    Like I have to work at being so nice so he can care about me.

    Like I dont deserve love for just sitting back and doing nothing,

    Like I have to work at being sooo nice and then he will want to fall in love with me?

    Its a new concept to see love grow and do nothing.

    Its a new concept for me to see that love isnt work but just being.

    It makes me have bad dreams.

    It makes me think they will go out the door ungratified and find all the other girls that will text them off the hook and beg them to come over and drunk dial them and say nice stuff and make it easy for them to pick up.

    I guess overfunctioning was some way for me to try to cheat proof my relationship.

    I guess overfunctioning was some way for me to stay in control of how he thinks….how could he cheat if I was soo nice to him.

    (not that Ive ever been cheated on….i dont think)

    I guess overfunctioning was my way to create love when love cant be created….it just happens.

    WHat makes love happen?

    Who knows?

    That mystery is terrifying.

    I guess I will have to explore the unknown

  356.  #356Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:56 am

    Lizka, I think he might call you after these messages.

  357.  #357Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 7:57 am

    Jessie, that’s so profound.

    I like your post.

  358.  #358Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 7:59 am

    Healing Waterfall –

    Here is my list of things to do/think when I feel like leaning forward (my Channelling list). Maybe you’ll feel inspired to add some things on your own list.

    1. Read an article in Russian or watch a short video until I until I understand it all

    2. Looking at air plane tickets online

    3. Go see the new clothes on XY magazine’s website

    4. Watch a movie/series online

    5. Clean one jar of my walkin closet

    6. Yoga

    7. Breathing exercice

    8. Run

    9. Give love to my dog

    10. Go to the museum

    11. Read

    12. Walk on the mountain

    13. Do a vision board

    14. Cook healthy dinners and lunches

    15. Learn how to meditate

    16. Drink tea

    17. Sleep

    18. Get a new haircut

    19. Drink water

    20. Clean my closet

    21. Start writing a book

  359.  #359Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 8:00 am

    because it would be a loving thing to do?

    it would show him that i care about him?


    because i know how straight out he is on taxes……

    because i know how much he liked it last year, i was a total unsiren and i, i hate to admit this, i hung a cupcake on his door last bday…..and this was before he had even started inititaing anything between us….

    and he has contacted me, just not in a week…..

    but yes, you are right…
    it’s just i keep eating the bday cake i really secretly made for him, i made one for my son and then with the extra batter, i made two heart shaped cakes and yesterday i frosted them and my son and i almost finished it yesterday……

    i guess you are right…..
    i get it is not in my highest interest to send him a bday card or drop him off cake and that just makes me feel really sad…

  360.  #360Jessie1000 on April 10, 2012 at 8:01 am

    My Beau says he loves me.
    I didnt do anything.
    I never even showed him I cared about him other than accept his invitations and never try to make him stay if he had stuff to do.
    I cooked for him twice (in 5 months)
    I took all his gifts.
    I didnt let him talk about his exes or psychoanalyze him.
    I never bought him a present.
    I never did his laundry.
    I never asked to see him if I was lonely.
    I never let him know I wanted him.
    And he still says he loves me.
    THis is really wierd.
    I dont know if I believe it.
    Or maybe Im crazy

  361.  #361Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:01 am


    Oh no?! You think he will call me?? lol

  362.  #362Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:06 am

    Healing Waterfall

    I’m sorry if I sound harsh. I feel regretful. I didn’t want to hurt you.

    I said “don’t lean forward on birthday” like a robot…

    Not sure if all this Challenge is not making me a cold metallic robot with no heart…

    But I think it’s true that you shouldn’t lean forward. But I didn’t had to say it cold like that.

    My apologize…

  363.  #363Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 8:06 am

    Lizka, maybe I’m wrong but I have a feeling he will.

    I know it’ll be hard but try not to expect it though, ok?

  364.  #364Emerson on April 10, 2012 at 8:08 am

    My CDs have been very quiet the past couple of days. I have a lot on my plate right now, so maybe that is why. The powers that be upstairs know I cannot be distracted. However, it would feel nice to have some support right now like someone asking me how’s it going? and keep going you can do it babe!!

    I miss having a partner and a cheerleader.

  365.  #365Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:08 am

    Healing Waterfall

    I feel sad for the cake you made in secret. 🙁

    Why don’t you call a girl friend, invite her over, buy champagne, and eat the cake with her, celebrating the fact that you are just fabulous?

  366.  #366Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 8:09 am

    Francesca and Lizka
    thanks for the lists….
    now i will write them down and post them

    well, brenda, you got me all temporarilly excited that i would be able to contact him with some sweet maple cake….but as soon as Lizka gave me a reality check i tuned in and my highest interest is not to give him a bday cupcake this year….or a card….

    this is so challenging….i can’t even settle down enough to meditate and i used to meditate 2-3 hours/day…

    hey, good news, i have a job interview tomorrow….just a part time job at the doggie daycare
    down the street so i have something steady in between teaching gigs and building up my health coaching biz….
    now i want to tell him that….
    ok, hw, get off the blog and do your visualization, the topic of my meditation today is owning your own space….so here i go…

  367.  #367Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:13 am


    Deep down I hope he will call and go crazy and want to fix everything.(But I would be very surprised if that would happen)

    But honestly, I wish he won’t call so we don’t have to explain or negotiate or dramatize. I seriously think it’s time to walk away. If he doesn’t call, it makes it simple. He knows what I had to say, and I don’t have to think about what ELSE I should say. It’s gonna be easier not to change my mind if he doesn’t call.

    But yeah, I still wish he calls… but chhhhtttt it’s a secret…

  368.  #368Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 8:15 am

    I don’t think it’s being cold not wanting to lean forward on a birthday.

    I think it’s all about not worrying about the outcome.

    I think it means to stop overanalyzing everything.

    I think it means to stop overfunctioning.

    Not worrying about whether we should feel like he will forget about us if we don’t do something for him.

    I think men think about us often.

    Most of them are just not at the same place we are.

    I think we need to understand that men and women don’t move at the same pace.

    WOW! I feel like I’m learning so much these days, it’s scares me to think that I am able to do all that now.


    Before I would’ve gotten super mad and probably would’ve sent only negative energy into the universe.

    Now I feel good doing the opposite.

  369.  #369Dominique on April 10, 2012 at 8:21 am

    Starla – “i feel stuck. like every way i move will damn me.”

    Remember that there are no mistakes, only learning and growing experiences. Even if it feels like total sh*t at the time, all works out for YOUR greater good.


  370.  #370Emerson on April 10, 2012 at 8:24 am

    Sirens have a great day

  371.  #371Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 8:24 am

    Thanks Lizka
    i cried when i read that you felt sad when you read about me making a cake in secret….i also thought about freezing it for my bday cake in 10 days, but my son and i had a great time eating it….

    i feel so lucky that he is my son, he is a total joy and when he laughs, it still sounds like a running brook like it did when he was a baby…..

    and Francesca, you are right about the different timelines about men and women, and this is not the time for me to analzye his actions, during tax season, it really is good for me to work on making myself happy or at least just being comfortable in my own skin…
    so here i go, really, really, time to meditate….

    lizka, i emailed you, tell me if it was the right info…

  372.  #372Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 8:24 am

    Hi Emerson, how are you? 🙂

  373.  #373GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 8:27 am

    Good Morning Sirens,

    @353 & 358

    Jessie I feel that way too. It’s very hard to lean back and for it to feel right. I feel like I’m being cold. But, it seems to have worked for you. I will have to do a better job at leaning back.

    I thought we were back on track, but since Sunday morning, it’s just felt like a distance. I asked him a question Sunday evening and he hasn’t replied. I’m trying my best to lean back and not contact him until he contacts me. I feel sad. He used to contact me all the time. Since March, he’s slowed it down. He goes on vacation in a couple weeks. On Saturday, he told me work was not good and a lot going on, but he didn’t want to get into all of that. I don’t know, maybe he is just stressed. Not sure, but I want to see his name light up on my phone.

  374.  #374Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:27 am

    Francesca 366

    I’m feeling very proud of you. 🙂

    This is very sireny.

  375.  #375Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 8:28 am

    Lizka, I know what you mean, it’s tricky.

  376.  #376Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:30 am

    Oh Healing Waterfall,

    thank youfor letting me know that you emailed me. I don’t check these emails often.

    I just added you as a FB friend. 🙂

  377.  #377GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 8:31 am


    I wish I was where you were. I overanalyze and overthink everything. It would be nice to calm my brain down. It only causes me stress. It’s funny because I think about how men don’t do this. It’s like I plan my day around him maybe calling me to go out. If I’m sweating in the yard, I will make sure to stop what I’m doing and shower at a certain time, just in case. That really is silly. Guys don’t do that. If he calls and I’m not ready, then he would just have to wait. For some reason, I always want to be prepared. I have to let go of a lot of things. Any suggestions on how to do this?

  378.  #378Mochaberri on April 10, 2012 at 8:42 am

    @ Starla #317

    I feeling so sad to read about your situation.

    I know all to well how you are feeling – it’s like walking on eggshells darned if you say something darned if you don’t.

    A piece of advice I learned from Rori is to stop doing what you are doing – the best way to turn things around is to do nothing. And I know it’s hard to not do when you are used to doing.

    If you guys are still communicating that is a wonderful thing. How I got around no longer being frustrated was to take a moment or two out before responding – it calmed my nerves and gave me a chance to say what I needed to say and not be attached to his response if it was something he didn’t want to hear. And the beauty of it was that when I did taht he was more receptive to hearing what I had to say and I no longer felt like I was on eggshells.

    hugs and kisses to you pretty lady!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  379.  #379Starla on April 10, 2012 at 8:43 am

    I sent it. whew, finally.

  380.  #380Jessie1000 on April 10, 2012 at 8:45 am

    Giving girl…if its working…
    then why do I feel so much pain?
    I am in more pain now then I was when i was a crazy overfunctioner!
    I remember every bad thing my family did to me
    I hurt ten times more than my first heart break!
    This is why I over function
    So I dont feel this terrible pain
    Is it possible that I am allergic to real feelings?
    Are imaginary relationships just the only place I will fit?
    If this is real love then why am I soooo scared?

    I feel now like i really like him….i feel dependant

    Now that I feel dependant cause I really miss Beau and he seems so good hearted and not interested in just shagging

    Dependancy has always turned ugly for me.

    My counsellor told me once:
    My first relationships where I formed trust were unstable.
    So I will have to heal to feel happy when Im dependant on anyone.

    Great? Got a magic tonic for that one?

    Imaginary relationships are easy, cause I dont need them and they need me to give things to them….gratify them…(co dependant, unhealthy, and usually no reciprocity)

    Please let the universe give me some peace of mind

    I am in agony…Beau stayed the night–we slept at 5:00 am…he just laid on the couch and didnt make a move on me….(first time I let him stay here and didn’t kick him out)

    We drank coffee together and smoked cigarettes in my basement all night and talked about absolutely nothing.

    It was soooo fun.

    HE asked ME to give him a chance
    (Holy opposites sketch…its always me chasing and beggin my exes to give me a chance….god im so dumb…you cant imagine how awful it was before)

    I dont want to be the chaser no more….

  381.  #381Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:47 am


    It’s easy. Plus, you KNOW what you are doing wrong, and you said it yourself: “I will make sure to stop what I’m doing and shower at a certain time, just in case. That really is silly.”

    Now that you are aware of it, just STOP.

    When you stop what you are doing and go shower even if you haven’t hear from him, you are building high expectation and you have way more chance to feel disappointed after, and obviously, mad at him, mad at you, mad at the world, and send a bad vibe.

    I know this is not a super good advice, but I don’t know what else to tell you. Just STOP, since you know it’s the good thing to do…

    Hmmm and why don’t you do an agenda? You could keep every activities that you are planning to do, and keep the focus on them. That’s what I do. If my girl friend says we’re going yoga on Friday from 10 to 11.30, I write it down to my agenda and I add 1 hour to the activity (for shower, coming back home, etc.). So if a man calls me, last minute or not, when he asks if he can see me on Friday, I say “Oh that would feel good, I’m available at 12.30”. If he wants to see me before: “Oh that would feel fun to see you in the morning, but I already have plans and I am really not gonna be available before 12.30”.

    It is VERY important that you stick to your agenda. I believe it’s the base of being a siren.

  382.  #382Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 8:50 am

    Healing Waterfall I don’t have all of Rori’s programs but I certainy would not agree with her if she said the give gifts no matter what. I assume there has to be some context. I have a cd I was hung up on who never remembered my birthday. When I spoke up about it he apologized and “forgot” again the following year. As I have info from other coaches who says guys don’t expect anything for their birthdays I have never given him anything or even wished him a happy birthday, though that first year I had had plans.

    I also had another cd who I gave a gift because he is the sweetest man ever and a big giver. When he got it he suggested that I don’t have to do anything to chase men. All I have to do is be the kind of person that people want to be around. Those words have resonated with me since. He is now married but he treats me like gold. This morning he picked up my parents for doctors appointments. After he dropped them off he called and said don’t hesitate if you need any help. Last night when I asked he said yes, then “don’t worry I have it all covered”.

    If I were you I would choose not to give him anything. The only way I might consider it, is if he gave me something and then I would be giving out of obligation. Or maybe even giving to control. Control him thinking about me and maybe making him feel obligated to give me something in return. Then again why would I want that because that could turn easily into resentment. No one likes to feel obligated and I know of several guys who hate getting gifts because they end up feeling obligated to the women – even when it is their wives.

  383.  #383Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 8:51 am


    I don’t know for sure how I’m doing all this but somehow, I am.

    It’s like something clicked in me on Saturday night.

    I went from feeling heartbroken to feeling calm and relieved.

    I have no idea what triggered that but I’m glad it did.

    I don’t even want to ask myself a lot of questions about it, I just want to let it go and let it be.

    So when you feel like you have to overfunction, just remind yourself not to pay attention to the voices that say you have to be this way or that way just to suit someone.

    Gently tell yourself that you don’t have to go out of your way and be ready at all times waiting for someone who might or might not contact you.

    If they contact you, fine, just explain that you’re busy doing so and so and let them know how long it would take you to get ready if they want to see you.

    I don’t know if that makes sense.

    I feel weird trying to explain what I would be doing for myself if I were in your situation.

    It might not work for you. I hope it does, though.

  384.  #384GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 9:05 am


    Maybe you’re so scared because you’ve never had this before and you don’t know what to do, or think, or act because it’s all scary and new? Just like trying anything new, it’s nervewrecking and scary. I know it is for me.

    I’ve never really felt like I completely fit in with my family or my friends. I spent years researching my “adoptive parents”, but I’m not adopted. I grew up thinking I was though because I didn’t really feel wanted or that I belonged. I always escaped into myself & soap operas. Those characters were my friends and family. As I got older, I escaped into my bf’s who were never good for me. I couldn’t get away from my parents fast enough, so I made very poor choices. Now, I’m more stable, taking care of myself, own my own house and no longer in need of a man to help me be free. I still have issues though. I feel my guy gets me. He knows who I am and my quirks and that’s just because he paid attention. I don’t want him to go away. I finally feel like I fit in with someone.

  385.  #385GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 9:08 am

    @ Lizka,

    Yes, I do know what I do that isn’t good for me. But, I didn’t really realize it until I wrote that. I know he doesn’t make his plans around me. I will try to STOP. I know it will be good for me. This week, I’ve been thinking of other activities I could add in. I need to distract my brain. Thanks.

  386.  #386GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 9:13 am

    Thanks, Francesca. I’m going to give it a try. I don’t have any problems doing this when I’m not dating someone. I guess I just want things to work out and I go overboard.

  387.  #387Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 9:13 am

    hi fw
    i feel better eating the cake all by myself
    it is kind of fun actually,
    that is a great story about your old friend who is helping you with your parents, it is good to know that you have support right now! hope everything goes as easily and gracefully as possible now for you!

  388.  #388Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 9:16 am

    Lol. Funny how there were some comments about “mommying” a guy, or being his mommy & how it doesn’t work. And now it’s the new article. Sweet! We all must be in “the zone.” or at least, you all. I wasn’t really in on that conversation 🙂

    Anyways, I’m feeling good today. It felt nice to get OM’s call on Saturday. I spoke to him briefly yesterday, and he said he’d have to call me back again. Only he “forgot” to call me last time. I mean, I believe him. I just take that to mean that it’s not important to call me. Now he’s asking me to row the boat and “remind him.” I feel like, ick. Plus, he was drunk yesterday when I called. That was unattractive. So basically, I feel totally neutral about him now. I couldn’t care less. I don’t even want him.

    I realize all those ‘minor annoyances’ from before we’re actually red flags I was ignoring. Those other girls who are friends with him & won’t date him are doing so for good reason.

    I’m in a good place. I really don’t care what happens. But the guy isn’t texting me back. Blah de blah. The magic is totally gone for me. I feel very free about this! Hooray!

    I tried to post this once already, but not sure if it went thru, so trying again!

  389.  #389Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 9:17 am

    My boss just called me asking if I could go to a little get together for a radio contest we have been part of at the boutique.

    I will probably have to talk in front of people.

    I’ve never really done that before.

    It feels scary yet exciting.

    I think I can pull it off.

    Hmm, I guess it shows she trusts me, right?

  390.  #390Ella on April 10, 2012 at 9:18 am

    Hello again Sirens,

    I have some news.

    MWC just told me he is going to spend the next few days de-cluttering and cleaning his house.

    And when he is done he wants to offer me a set of keys.


    I am unsure about how I feel about this.

    A mixture of things really.

    Happy, excited, elated, nervous.

    And I feel unsure too because I feel worried about accepting offers which aren’t marriage.

    Because that is the offer I want from a man.

    I feel a lil triggered because with his last girlfriend they were together 7 years, and lived together, but no marriage or children.

    I know I am not her, and this relationship is not that relationship, but it still makes me feel cautious.

    He says he has fallen in love with me and he can’t remember ever feeling this way with anyone before.

    I feel flattered to be offered keys.

    And I probably will take them.

    And I also feel cautious of falling into a comfortable holding pattern, unless we are truly moving towards a ring.

    Do any Sirens have any thoughts, feelings, advice around this?

  391.  #391Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 9:18 am

    Yes, leaning back makes you feel horrible at first. Sorry to say that. It feels like you understand why….if you can hang in there, it does feel better. I am on day 15 and i have not really had a serious urge to lean forward, just little feelings here and there. It does feel better every day.

  392.  #392Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:18 am

    Ok I have to get up from that couch, go wash the dishes and run a few kilometres because if I stay here, I’ll keep unconsciously waiting for ATW to answer to me.

    I know for a fact that if I go run, I’ll not think of this for the 45 minutes I’ll be running and it’s gonna be way easier to not think of it after.

    It’s over Lizka. Get over it girl.

  393.  #393Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:20 am


    Oh wow that feels fun!!

    It’s an occasion to wear a pretty dress. Haha that is so me. 🙂

  394.  #394Brenda on April 10, 2012 at 9:28 am

    Lizka and Healing Waterfall,

    RE: #349 and 364 – yes, Rori said during the last teleseminar that a man’s birthday is the one time you get to lean forward.

  395.  #395Brenda on April 10, 2012 at 9:31 am

    Lizka and Healing Waterfall,

    I just read my notes from the class to refresh my memory. She also said no fancy birthday dinner that is expensive and no expensive gift. Just something little, preferably something with sentimental value and little if no monetary value.

  396.  #396Brenda on April 10, 2012 at 9:33 am

    More thoughts…

    On Christmas, a man can initiate, because it’s a holiday for everyone. On his birthday, it would be weird for him to initiate. I think it makes total sense.

    I’m going to make Ryan a card and possibly write him a poem, like I did for his birthday three years ago when we were dating.

  397.  #397Stunning Love on April 10, 2012 at 9:33 am

    Last night I was powerful in my decision about not feeling bad without the ex-boyfriend. This situation is complicated by us working for the same company where I see him frequently throughout my work day, followed by him being my neighbor. I wish I understood the concept of lean back. Could someone take time to give me a brief overview?

  398.  #398Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:34 am

    Arrrrrg motivation where are you???

  399.  #399Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 9:35 am

    thanks, but is this with a guy that you are already in a relationship with….

    Ella, I read about your MWC offering you keys….wow, that feels really exciting….i guess what do you want? what does that mean to you and to him?
    i would be interested to see what other sirens have to say…..

  400.  #400Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:39 am

    Stunning Love

    If I was you, I would go read Rori’s old articles. Some of them talk about leaning back. On the right of the window, you have all the articles by category, I recommend to start by the category “feminine energy” maybe?

    Also you could subscribe to the E-letter. She sends one about twice a week and often talks about leaning back and other very useful tools.

    Good luck. xoxo

  401.  #401lk on April 10, 2012 at 9:39 am

    dahhh i don’t get it. cd & i fought this morning ! & i feel so sorry for myself…. & at the same time, i see how i am not really communicating very well at all. it feels frightening : (((

    BUT again ! i know things change so fast, & i love myself & i love you….. : ) here we go again. & i do trust things to change. it just feels so bad to do them one way & think DAH i did “wrong” i did “badly”… so sad. ((((((((lk))))))))

  402.  #402Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 9:41 am

    i am feeling unmotivated too, maybe it’s Mars being all stationary or something….

    i just found out the store has cheesmaking kits so it is going to be even easier, my cooking class tonight…

    i hope i get the job being an overqualified pooper-scooper at the doggie daycare…..

    see what graduate school did for me? Ha, ha….
    then if i get that job, i can work close to home while my son is at school and have some extra cash and then not feel like a piranah if someone indicates interest in my health coaching…

  403.  #403Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:43 am

    Healing Waterfall and Brenda

    thanks, but is this with a guy that you are already in a relationship with….”

    I totally agree. Like FW said, there is a different context with every man. It could be ok to write a poem to a man you are in a relationship or seriously dating (like seeing at least every week and talking to almost every day).

    This is “giving BACK” to someone who gives you everyday.

    But in the case of Healing Waterfall, just like in mine, But I don’t think it would be sireny for me to make a cake and send a poem to ATW as he is not giving me anything.That would be “Giving first”, that would be leaning forward.

    And I think Healing Waterfall is in a similar situation with her Crush…

  404.  #404lk on April 10, 2012 at 9:43 am

    i do feel empathetic towards myself, but i’m just not sure why i keep finding myself so deep in the soup… i guess i let myself go there when i get that “doom doom” feeling…. sad lk : ((( & thinking of ht & stuff… making me wanna cry : ( like………. gah i don’t know. i just worry so much & i have so much fear that cd will be just like j & h : (((

    i intend to forgive my past & live in the present. i intend to Trust, not Test. i love myself & i love all the other humans (((((humans)))))

  405.  #405Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 9:46 am

    Ok I’m off to do my things or I’m going to become crazy on this couch.

  406.  #406Healing Waterfall on April 10, 2012 at 9:48 am


    hopefully you get to make up soon! the best part about fighting is the making up!

  407.  #407lk on April 10, 2012 at 9:54 am

    & I FELT AFRAID. i want to be so Respectful toward that feeling – even if it’s silly & wrapped up in drama from when i was 16 years old. i love myself & i love my old drama.

    when i ask for affection, & hear “no” – for whatever reason – (SO SAD that he thought he said “yes” & i HEARD “no” : (((( oh lk whyyyyy) – i want to feel safe.

    if i ask once & hear no, ok, i can handle it. twice, i feel a little salty. three times, i feel sad but then ok. four times, i don’t really want to talk about it. five times, i will never ever ask for anything from anyone ever again. (((LK)))

  408.  #408Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 9:56 am

    Ella I would take the key thing as his way of offering commitment and living it. I also think it is a man thing to offer keys, I have been offered so many times. However, you did not say he invited you to live with him and it seems you might be assuming that. He might be taking steps towards that but you don’t have to accept. I believe you can tell him that you would prefer to be in a real relationship before moving in with a man. Maybe in accepting the keys you could let him know that it kind of gives the feeling that the relationship is official however you need ___________ to feel really solid and secure. Then discuss again your timeline for having what you want. I however would feel comfortable discussing that if I could find a playful way to approach it.

  409.  #409Starla on April 10, 2012 at 10:00 am

    i sent the email. i just said that i adore him and that i feel sad and so confused.

    now i guess i just lean back and…wait? i don’t want to “wait.”

    i just want to bring all my energy back to me. send him love across the universe and bring it all back to me. i love me so much.

  410.  #410lk on April 10, 2012 at 10:00 am

    it’s like i don’t believe him totally that he wants me. like, i don’t believe that’s possible. blahhhhh soupy lk be nice to me ! am i always like this ? no, right ?? blahhhhhhhhhhhh i don’t want to go dark : ((((( sad sad sad girl who needs a million trillion hugs (((lk)))

  411.  #411Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 10:01 am

    I am asking myself why would I give a card and a poem to a man who I have decided to let go and lean away from? If I give to that person I know it would be in the hopes that I inspire to step up and towards me. I can only see myself giving a gift to a man with whom I am mutually building a relationship.

    Otherwise I would consider it a business associate that I am showing appreciation for some work done.

  412.  #412Dominique on April 10, 2012 at 10:05 am

    Healing Waterfall – Please NO gift, not in your case, no cake, no card. Maybe a message. I’ll think about this one and get back to you.


  413.  #413Francesca on April 10, 2012 at 10:06 am

    Ahah, Lizka, I don’t even own a dress.

  414.  #414Starla on April 10, 2012 at 10:07 am

    (((((((((((((((((lk))))))))))) x 1milliontrillion

  415.  #415Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:08 am

    (((((((((( lk ))))))))))))) x 1 billion time

  416.  #416Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:09 am

    Hahaha Starla we had the same idea 🙂

  417.  #417Dominique on April 10, 2012 at 10:09 am

    lk – sending love.


  418.  #418Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:10 am


    Mr. A gave me a key a couple months ago; long before he asked me to move-in. I think this was his way of saying: hey, I love having you around, I want you around as much as possible, and want you to feel welcome here any time.

    I told him it felt so good and welcoming to be offered a key and I felt so secure knowing he wants me to be close to him often, but that it would still feel best to be invited over. That I like feeling “wanted around” and for my presence to be requested. That it makes me feel happy and feminine to accept his invitations. Since then, I get a lovely invitation every morning. 🙂

  419.  #419Emerson on April 10, 2012 at 10:12 am

    394 Brenda
    I’m saying this with love….IMHO poem and card….this feels very lovey dovey like putting too much energy into Ryan when you’re trying to move on. Also he may feel pressured receiving it like he has to respond at least with a thank you.

    I’m only saying it cuz I feel like you’ve come so far….in breaking the ties…

    I know it’s hard…look at me and Recycled…I am STILL talking about him.


  420.  #420lk on April 10, 2012 at 10:12 am

    i vacillate so between not wanting to “fall prey” to any toxic men or energies, & wanting to assume the best & trust…

    this is old stuff. i can do this.

  421.  #421lk on April 10, 2012 at 10:13 am

    assuming victimhood is toxic. i’m a grown-xss siren !


    thank you, lizka & dominque & starla for hugs : ))) i feel way better : )))

  422.  #422Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:14 am

    Ok the dishes is done. Got to find my motivation.


    It is over, I am NOT expecting an answer back to my messages. I AM NOT.

    Ok of to 7K run.

  423.  #423Emerson on April 10, 2012 at 10:14 am

    Something to keep in mind….I’ve realized that guys don’t hang onto “fights” nearly as much/or long as we do….so perhaps take a deep breath and hug yourself xoxox sending hugs from Emerson too…

  424.  #424Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:18 am


    I too have felt very cuddle-needy the past couple days.

    But I’m just a girl, who for no logical reason whatsoever, feels deprived of affection, and needy of some cuddles. 🙂 I reserve the right to feel that way sometimes.

  425.  #425lk on April 10, 2012 at 10:22 am

    oooh thank you, Universe : )

    just got a sweet email…

    ” Hi Lk, I found myself smiling thinking about you jumping rope in your little dress and fancy gold shoes. x0x0x. I hope you have a nice day. I love you. ”

    aww (((cd))) thank you for taking a step toward me again… it feels good : )

    & i’m going to leave work early, get a smoothie & get my nails done : ))) then i’m going to do a big chore i’ve been putting off…. & poor cd is going to have to have sxx with me & i’m going to be a sopping, teary mess…. just because that is how it is today, it is seeming. ((((((lk))))))

  426.  #426lk on April 10, 2012 at 10:24 am

    thank you, mel : )))))) that sounds so sweet & i do wish that i had expressed myself more like that & less like a teething infant o_0 (((((lk))))) i love myself radically & unconditionally : )

  427.  #427Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:25 am

    I decided I am not going to run now. Maybe later.

    I feel tired and sad. I just want to sleep until the pain goes away.

    I feel regretful of the closure I did with ATW. I shouldn’t have. What if he’s “soon” was tomorrow?

    I was all “it’s ok I can be patient and live my life” in the last 3 weeks and yesterday I forgot it and I sent “good bye” and decided it’s over and I told him “I am closing the door”.

    Why did I do that. It’s stupid…

  428.  #428Starla on April 10, 2012 at 10:28 am

    i guess it is more important than ever now that i love on me and take care of myself really really good.


  429.  #429Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:29 am

    Awwww… lk, that’s such a sweet email! Even I’m smiling picturing you skipping in your cute dress. 🙂

  430.  #430Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:29 am


    ” Hi Lk, I found myself smiling thinking about you jumping rope in your little dress and fancy gold shoes. x0x0x. I hope you have a nice day. I love you. ”

    Wow that is so cute.

    I feel inspired to have a man who sends me sweet messages like this.

    Ah I feel teary. 🙁

  431.  #431Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:30 am

    Love to Starla… ♥

  432.  #432Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 10:30 am

    Stunning it seems you are in a situation where you would need to be a RockStar. Maybe the archives to the bottom right of your screen under Power and Self Esteem might be the group you want to review.

  433.  #433Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:33 am

    My life is a mess really.

    Why can’t I get a man to fall in love with me?


    It’s not working. Really it is not working…

  434.  #434Femininewoman on April 10, 2012 at 10:33 am

    Lizka no beating yourself up. Just notice yourself and how you behave depending on how you feel.

  435.  #435Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:35 am

    And why did I need to do a stupid closuuuure??

    Now that’s it. There’s no way back.

  436.  #436Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:37 am


    A really hard lesson for me is that you can’t get a man to do anything especially fall in love. Give up that control to the universe. Scrunch it up into little teeny tiny fairy-dust bits in your hands and blow it from your palm like dandelion seeds on the wind.

  437.  #437Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:38 am

    My vacation were so fun last week and I was so happy. And this week is a disaster. This is the 3rd day I am feeling awful and crying… Why can’t I be happy? I am trying so hard…

  438.  #438Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Mel I said “get a man to” but that’s not what I meant.

    Even the Universe seems to be against me. He not sending anyone. And I’ve been waiting and waiting and taking care of myself a lot…

    And nothing is happening…

  439.  #439Starla on April 10, 2012 at 10:42 am

    i am kind of beating myself up too… like i didn’t say enough. i didn’t try to convince him enough! i just said

    “Oh, CF… I just adore you and am absolutely crazy about you…!! I feel sad and so confused right now.”


    i feel trapped, i want to feel free. my love is big love.

  440.  #440GivingGirl on April 10, 2012 at 10:42 am

    Starla – I’m happy you responded. I think it will take a load off of you.


    Ella – I think the keys are a very nice gesture & it shows trust.

  441.  #441Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:43 am

    I am so so so bored of that. I want to see a change. NOW. I feel impatient and I am bored of being hopeful.

  442.  #442Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:46 am

    Lizka… maybe ask the girl universe. I like her better! 😉

    Sorry… just feeling a little silly today. 🙂

    Really Lizka, you’re doing great! Don’t let one small setback make you feel too discouraged. Pick yourself up, dust off those knees, and keep riding.

  443.  #443Mel on April 10, 2012 at 10:48 am

    Starla, you did good. Trust yourself.

  444.  #444Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:50 am

    Lol, Mel, the girl Universe. 🙂

    I don’t feel like I’m doing so great.

    I feel that all this work was useless. All these 3 weeks of Challenge were useless.

    I feel like there is nothing I can do to “attract” (maybe not the good word) love on me. If the Challenge didn’t work, what else can work…

  445.  #445Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:53 am

    I think I’ll be better with ATW. He’s always half there anyway, answering half of the questions, saying half of what he thinks.

    I never know where I am with him.

    I will be better without him in my life. I wish I could stop thinking about him right now. I wish he would disappear from my mind in a second and never comes back. I want to forget that he exists. How can I do that?

  446.  #446Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 10:57 am

    Will I regret it if I erase all his messages, his phone number and all the pictures of us from my phone and from Facebook?

    The messages and number I can live without… but the pictures…?

  447.  #447Starla on April 10, 2012 at 11:00 am

    thanks giving girl and mel. i feel super duper nervous. i know i have to pull it all back to myself now. honestly, going on silently felt easier! haha.

  448.  #448Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 11:05 am

    I need something good to happen to me. Please Universe, I’m gonna stop believing if nothing happens. I don’t want to stop believing…

  449.  #449lk on April 10, 2012 at 11:07 am

    hi, lizka ! hi, starla !

    you guys sound like you’re about to get hit with waves of Good-Ness : ))))

  450.  #450Starla on April 10, 2012 at 11:12 am

    i hope so. until then, i have w33d and coconut water to keep me happyish:P

  451.  #451Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 11:16 am

    Thank you lk.

  452.  #452lk on April 10, 2012 at 11:19 am

    i can feel that there is a place inside me where i feel totally at Peace & Good about everything… feels like it’s “outside this room” or something….. but i know that i’m just “knocking from the inside” LOL : )

  453.  #453Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 11:24 am

    I decided that if he doesn’t call before the end ofthis day to discuss this “good bye” message and explain what it is “in our lifes that makes that we can’t say good bye right now”, I will erase his number, his messages and all the pictures, from my phone and from facebook and I will pretend that he never existed.

    My Challenge is unfortunately over.

    I considered that the “good bye” from last night was not leaning forward, it was just a closure (yeah not really better).

    But I have leaned forward today in a very humiliating way…

    So that’s it.

    But at least when I texted him that if he wants to discuss it, he can call me tonight, but if not, I will definitely erased it from my life, he answered “It’s reassuring 🙂 I have a meeting with XY and I’ll call you after so we can meet” (I presume he meant “we can talk”, not “we can meet”…

    I know it looks like an ultimatum. Whatever.

    I want to forget. I so want to forget the last 2 years…

  454.  #454Starla on April 10, 2012 at 11:26 am


  455.  #455Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 11:30 am

    Ok I’m going for a nap now or I’m gonna feel sad for ever.

  456.  #456Turquoise on April 10, 2012 at 11:37 am

    New article up

    Lizka, I would have done the same thing.

  457.  #457Memulo on April 10, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    I am going to ask him if he thinks he can see me on Thurs morning or tomorrow night. I don’t think he has his cell on and in any case dont want to explain over text why I need to leave. Do you sirens think it’s ok?

  458.  #458Memulo on April 10, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Starla I love your response

  459.  #459Ella on April 10, 2012 at 1:21 pm

    lk re 418

    Yes I hear you with that.


  460.  #460Rori Raye on April 10, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    I LOVE Orna and Matthew, and LOVE this “Get Your Mr. Right” program (It’s SO inexpensive – and a total masterpiece in my world – I mean this sincerely) – and so I’m letting this go through (LoveRomanceRelationship are friends of mine, and I think this would be okay with them…) Love, Rori

  461.  #461Rori Raye on April 10, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    I LOVE Orna and Matthew, and LOVE this “Get Your Mr. Right” program (It’s SO inexpensive – and a total masterpiece in my world – I mean this sincerely) – and so I’m letting this go through (LoveRomanceRelationship are friends of mine, and I think this would be okay with them…) Love, Rori

  462.  #462Tiffany on April 10, 2012 at 3:21 pm

    Hm. I must say, by now, I *do* feel slightly annoyed that OM has been blowing me off. It feels rude, but moreover, it feels passive-aggressive. Like he won’t say that he’s angry at me. But he’ll do this, because really he is holding anger at me. And I want to get the anger OUT do that’s not doing this anymore. But meanwhile he is avoiding me and the whole situation so there’s no opportunity. And I know I csn’t *make* him do anything. So I have to just sit back and let him come to me. Or something. I really want to talk about this. I don’t like to have this hanging in the air….

  463.  #463LoveAlways on April 10, 2012 at 7:52 pm

    CD song asked “where is the spontaneous lady I met. Where did she go?” Didn’t know how to answer him. and I still don’t know the answer. I feel like she was more than just spontaneous . . . guess that’s the only part he really liked

  464.  #464Lizka on April 10, 2012 at 8:54 pm

    I just had an awful conversation with ATW. This guy just can’t take a decision.

    I hate him and I feel like shit. He needs to dissapear from my life. I can’t stand this anymore. I can’t live like this one more second. It’s way too hurtful.

  465.  #465Brenda on April 10, 2012 at 9:39 pm


    RE: #419 – thank you. I hear you, and I will consider it. Maybe I will just send a card and no poem. I still believe in my heart that someday he will be back in my life when the time is right. I just want him to feel unconditional love.

  466.  #466Coco Kisses on April 10, 2012 at 9:43 pm

    r e 341 Tiffany

    thank you for your kind words I am feeling much better today I just treated myself with love and I work out with a personal trainer and 8 well today that made me feel really good about myself. I am a beauty professional. I am a skin care specialist ,makeup artist ,eyebrow threader, eyelash extensions and nail tech. I love the beauty industry. if you have any questions about getting into the beauty industry, just ask I will email you.

  467.  #467Brenda on April 10, 2012 at 9:50 pm

    Lizka and Healing Waterfall,

    Even tho Ryan isn’t giving much right now, he is giving a little. We have had light contact by text. We both agree it is healthier to stay apart for now.

    The thing is, I’ve known him for 4 years and we have time in. I don’t think either of us have walked away completely. It will make a huge statement to him when he realizes that I changed my number. He will think it is because of him, because I have not given him my new number. And, it’s just a matter of time before he texts me and finds out I’m no longer there.

    I think I feel good with at least a card. If I am inspired by a simple poem, so be it. If not, that is fine. I have to be inspired to write poetry. I was also thinking I could just do something funny, like put his photos in “Face in Hole dot com”.

    But thank you for your input. We have kind of a unique situation I think. I would feel weird doing nothing at all.

  468.  #468Brenda on April 11, 2012 at 3:44 am

    I am so behind on the blog! I have been super busy helping my Mom to get situated at my house. We decided she is definitely going to live here permanently!

  469.  #469Cookie on April 11, 2012 at 5:31 am

    Hi Rori,

    I haven’t posted any comments in awhile but I’m really needing some advice and I’m hoping that maybe you can help. I’ve been listening to Reconnect, Siren, and Blueprint and just trying to let the information sink. But I’m feeling extremely devastated and I don’t know what else to do. So back when I used to come on here before, my relationship was 8 years old. We had some problems with disconnection and me not feeling secure in it etc. It started to get better. We had a child. Now, it’s 10 years old, the baby is almost 9 months and I couldn’t be more unhappy with him. I took that to mean that I was feeling some unhappiness with myself so I got rid of all table sugar in my diet, and I most recently joined a Kickboxing class. And I stopped coming towards him. Meaning I don’t initiate anything. When I’m home, I focus ALL of my attention on the baby. In my ideal world, this would have resulted in him coming towards me, giving me affection and attention. Which he does but not in a giving way, more of “why don’t you do or give” kind of way. Our sex life had already sloped downwards for years but now we don’t have sex at all (we haven’t had sex since Jan 1). I feel like I don’t want to have sex with him anymore because he won’t try to please me in the bedroom and I’m tired of being frustrated or having to satisfy myself. I don’t feel completely loved and adored by him. I don’t feel understood or cherished. I honestly don’t think I ever have really felt this way with him or anyone. But I am not in my 20’s anymore, I am 33 and I don’t feel badly about myself like I must have before. I feel ready (or almost ready) to get the kind of love that I dreamed of, a type of love that I can model for my son. I feel like I want to try other men. I have began entertaining the idea of some male friends that are interested in me but not doing enough for me to feel pursued by them. I use the interactions we have through text messages to practice feeling messages and to “CD” since it is extremely difficult to get away for dates. I speak up for my feelings better and better with them but in my house, it’s like everything I say turns to war. So I don’t speak to him about anything, I just leave the room or be quiet and take the baby and go. This doesn’t feel good, I don’t feel happy. The other day, in anger, he left me a voicemail to Fuck me, do me, that we have nothing but a child together, that i don’t do shit for him and haven’t done anything for the past 8 years, etc. I wasn’t hurt by these messages (he has been verbally explosive our whole time together). I felt numb, then angry, then free. Then he came back and it was like nothing was said. Later I did say that I don’t want a man that thinks that a women is supposed to “do” for him. I guess I could have used that space to address it and use feeling messages but I didn’t feel like getting into anything with him, and honestly I feel like I’m starting not to really care what happens to our “relationship”. I feel like I don’t want to marry him. I don’t want to live with him. I feel like I want to try my luck with someone(s) else. I don’t want to wait for love anymore. But we have a child together and now it’s complicated? I don’t know how to navigate this.
    I feel alot of anger and rage towards him, I feel completely withdrawn and shut down. I want to have the open heart and not be a Cactus but I feel like I can’t. Attitude is oozing off of me all of the time. I guess I resent that I can’t really date other people. I resent that I have to be a full time mom and work full time and he gets to go to sleep when he’s tired, go to his house and leave me with the baby, basically do what he wants to do. I resent that this relationship is not the secure loving relationship that i wanted for myself or to raise a child in. I resent that I don’t have a fulfilling sex life. I resent that I want to buy a home and I may have to do it alone. I resent that after 10 years he still hasn’t figured how to do relationship. I resent him nitpicking me and pointing out my wrongdoings every minute. I don’t know how to communicate my anger in a way that is not blaming. I don’t know how to go forward. Please Rori, help!

  470.  #470Amany on April 11, 2012 at 2:41 pm

    Hi Rori

    I met a guie and I really love him and want him but he don’t see me don’t care about me even when I leave him he don’t ask about me. from the first moment that I started to feel love him he was look at me from distance but he didnot talk to me at all
    and then I started to ignore him and felt his behavior minimally changed how can I make him notice me and fall in love with me please give me step-by-step instuctions

    Thanks in advance

  471.  #471Senior Lady Vibe on April 11, 2012 at 3:43 pm




  472.  #472Senior Lady Vibe on April 11, 2012 at 3:46 pm

    Hello everyone.

    Behind on blog, hands full at the moment.

    {{{hugs to all}}}


  473.  #473Dominique on April 11, 2012 at 4:13 pm

    Thank you SLV…it’s tomorrow, though it is today for the Ozzies among us.


  474.  #474Rori Raye on April 12, 2012 at 4:45 pm

    Amany – please leave this man alone and stop thinking about him. Golden rule: The only man who gets to spend ANY time with you is one who adores you! You don’t have to do ANYTHING. This is the wrong man. Love, Rori

  475.  #475Rori Raye on April 12, 2012 at 4:49 pm

    Christiane – email customer service – support@havetherelationshipyouwant.com – Love, Rori

  476.  #476Rori Raye on April 12, 2012 at 4:52 pm

    Cookie – This is complex – it has to do with you being warm and open to him NO MATTER WHAT. Your anger is coming from many places – and you’re going to have to get into some kind of conversation with him. if you don’t work through this with him (whatever the final outcome) – you’ll just repeat the dynamic with the next man. Get it done this time. Read and go through my programs and write some scripts and make a determination that you’ll learn to TALK together, even if it’s ugly the first few attempts. If you walk away – do it whole, not as a reaction.

  477.  #477Amany on April 12, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    Thanks Rori

    You answered me but really I love him and unfortunatily now I am 22years old and no one notice me or do anything for me so may be because wrong with me 🙁

  478.  #478Amany on April 12, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    But he tried to talk to me and was following me at the past and I didn’t take care of him at all

    Then he ignored me at once

    some times I feel he hate me because I ignored him

    please help me
    you said attract any man so why not him???

  479.  #479kayela on April 19, 2012 at 4:31 am

    i have a boyfriend and all the time he his telling me to make his plate and clean his clothes. And even make his own bed or clean his room. And when i ask him to do something for me he tells me that he is to tired to do it myself. He is appsolutly driving me crazy. What can i say or do without him getting mad or upset??? Please help me because like i said IT DRIVING ME CRAZY!!!!!

  480.  #480Radlove on April 20, 2012 at 6:04 am


    Welcome! If my man were treating me like that, I would say something like this:

    Ewww, that feels bad to hear. I don’t want to be a man’s mother.

    Then I would sit down and not cook, not clean, not make his bed, etc. Then when he yelled at me, I would say:

    I feel seriously turned off! If a mother is what you want, then I am not the woman for you.

    He will not like it, and it may get worse before it gets better. Here, we are all about being treated with respect and honor as women.

    Most of us post on the newest thread, found here:


  481.  #481Lisalisa on April 21, 2012 at 3:50 pm

    Here is a man, and I use that term lightly, who refuses to take responsibility for his own life.

    HE is responsible for his career. Why on earth does he think you should find him a job?

    Do you really want to be with someone who can’t stand on their own two feet?

  482.  #482JRC on June 16, 2012 at 12:53 am

    This is NOT normal behaviour from a man. He sounds unwell.


  483.  #483Gavilan on August 25, 2012 at 11:49 am

    Hi. I recently found out I have epilepsy and am having a hard time dealing/adjusting/finding a cure. I have a 1 yr. old son with a friend and its an akward situation. I live alone with my son and have been having a hard time with my seizures. Im feeling very scared, vulnerable, and alone. My sons father and I have started seeing each other after almost a year since I got pregnant and hes trying to wrap his head around being a father. right now we’re just “friends”(but I want more)and I’m trying to keep my issues with my epilepsy and loneliness apart from the relationship I want. I dont usually have relationship problems but I’ve realized I’m getting needy and don’t want to ruin what will hopefully be my family as it should be because I’ve pushed him away. What do I do to occupy myself and keep my needyness out of the way?

  484.  #484Rori Raye on August 25, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    Gavilan – I know this is hard – but a man wants to be needed, and your vulnerability with your illness is likely both attractive to him, and frightening. I KNOW you can handle this medically – and it’s where you need to focus right now. If you can be completely independent with working to stabilize yourself medically, and yet vulnerable when it’s all too much – this is all you need to do. Please let him move the relationship however he wants. Focus on you and your child, and be WARM to him no matter what he does. Talk to him, without being “nurturing.” Nurturing someone else when YOU’re in most need of nurturing is not natural, authentic, or realistic right now. And asking him for what you need is way different than feeling bereft without it. Love, Rori

  485.  #485Gavilan on August 26, 2012 at 12:23 pm

    So in this case, its ok to tell him I need him? Like, hey I really need a hug…?