Who’s The REAL You?

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So, who are we really?

We get so used to our patterns, so comfortable with our defense systems, that when a man says something, anything, that triggers our inner nasty Voice – we feel defensive, and say and do what we always do when we feel defensive.

We make a man wrong.

We try to convince him he’s wrong.

We try to get our points across, to rationally and reasonably explain why he’s wrong.

We get frustrated when he doesn’t apologize, or even just see how much pain he’s caused us by a simple, thoughtless few words or a missed phone call.

We try to explain how relationships work and why he’s doing a crappy job of it.

And – I know it’s hard to believe because it’s the exact OPPOSITE of everything you hear out there – we try to “communicate” about our feelings and the relationship.

And this is where listening to all that advice runs you into trouble:

When you try to “talk out” what it is you’re feeling about what it is he did, you are trying to CREATE A SOLUTION.

You are trying to solve the problem, determine who’s right, and RELIEVE THE STRESS you feel inside.

You are NOT truly, authentically, really expressing the way you feel.

That would look like:  “I feel hot, I feel cold, I feel sad, I feel embarrassed, I feel angry”

Here – working toward a “solution” – you’re talking from the surface.

Though it may not seem like it, you’re being driven by inner forces and feeling compelled to “make sense of things” by your old inner – mostly sub-conscious, some just habit – patterns and defenses that are GUARDING your true feelings.

You are telling a man what he did wrong and how he hurt you.

You are talking about feelings that are COVERING UP your real feelings.

Even though this feels like YOU because you’re so used to it, so comfortable with it – it’s NOT YOU!

It’s the “made-up you” that we’ve all created on top of who we really are.

Like frosting on a cake, like pancake makeup on your face, like laughing when you feel like crying – and crying when you actually feel like HITTING!

We monitor ourselves so thoroughly that we often can’t even TOUCH who we REALLY ARE inside.

And that’s why JUST THE WORDS ALONE won’t work.

Because just words don’t always express the real you.

When we talk from the surface part of our defenses that are covering up our fears, anger, guilt – all the ugly stuff we don’t want anyone to see – we basically PUSH MEN AWAY.

I know, it sounds completely weird.

It sounds like I’m crazy.

We all think we’re telling a man how we feel, but really, we’re not.

We think we’re BEING OURSELVES, but we’re not.

We’re just showing him the outer stuff we’ve always shown every man, in order to PROTECT ourselves from him REALLY SEEING who we are on the INSIDE.

So, if you’re not really the woman who wants him to “understand” what happened and apologize or somehow show he “understands” – then who are you?

And that’s the fantastic question that, once you EVEN JUST ASK it of yourself, will get your man – any man – at your doorstep, fast, trying to break down your door, trying to get into your heart.

This is the absolute truth.

And NOT KNOWING this one thing can undo all the good work you do to bring a man to you.

Not knowing that just because we’re used to doing and saying certain things when certain things happen with men doesn’t mean that’s the REAL US dooms us to repeat the same mistakes over and over again.

So, let’s ask ourselves the questions that really matter.

The ones that will make all the difference for you

Let’s call this the ASK MYSELF Tool:

The simplest and fastest way that I’ve found to help my clients change old behaviors is to take apart and rework conversations and experiences you’ve already had.

Say you just had a fight with your boyfriend, or you met a great man at the coffee shop, but he never got your number.

(One thing – this kind of Tool is only for the brave – so if you’re not willing to trade the pain of a bad relationship for a little bit of self- discovery, don’t read any further.)

In school what we’re going to do here might be called “deconstructing.”

That simply means going over something that exists – like a movie script, or a seminar, or a recipe, and figuring out how it all works together – what the pieces and the parts are, and the order in which they fit together.

So, let’s pull apart that fight or that meeting at the coffee shop that didn’t result in a date.

Try to remember everything you said, and everything he said.

To make it even more powerful for yourself, write it down.

Use the “Translations” model in my Have The Relationship You Want eBook by putting a line down the center of a piece of paper.

On the left, write down everything you said.

On the right, “translate” what you said into FEELING MESSAGES.

Just keep doing this – all day long with everyone you talk with and interact with – and see how quickly things change!

This is NOT about blaming yourself for whatever you did or said that didn’t work for you…it’s about USING everything you’ve done or said to HELP you speak and do and BE in ways that DO work.

It’s about discovering, learning and practicing.

Love, Rori

Posted in


  1.  #1Mercedes on January 10, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Wish I had more time to spend with this right now, but I don’t… 🙁

    Much Love,

  2.  #2kaitlyn on January 10, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Feeling messages don’t work on my guy. His self-esteem is so low, he still takes them as an attack. Recently, I’ve talked about the relationship too much and even went into pity-party mode, saying this is what I deserve for dating a guy so much better than me. Not sure how to reverse this.

    The next day, I tried reversing it by ignoring all his calls the next day. He freaked out when I finally returned them yesterday as I calmly talked about easy/breezy stuff like music. He asked if I was so upset with him that I was seeking other men yet. I said, “No way, babe. You’re the one. I was just really busy yesterday working then hanging out with my friends.” He seemed to feel more relaxed after that.

    The next day (yesterday), he never contacted me at all. Even when I texted him good morning.

    Not sure what to do now.

  3.  #3kaitlyn on January 10, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Leaning back by not initiating contact isn’t helping. And yes I am CD’ing. He doesn’t know I’m CD’ing, though.

  4.  #4reneej on January 10, 2011 at 11:11 am

    I learned in a communication class to say something like this:

    When you did/said _____ I thought ______ and I felt ______.

    Is it ok to bring up what the other person did/said to cause you to think and feel the way you do? If you just express a feeling, he might not know why you’re feeling that way, or what you’re talking about.

  5.  #5Eva on January 10, 2011 at 11:15 am


    I know I have posted this comment also elswhere on this blog, but as your advice is really important to me at this moment, I would be very thankful for any suggestions.

    I´ve just broken up with him – after 8,5 years !!!! I feel such a pain like I never did before. I decided to do it because last month our relationship went badly again (for at least 7th time this year) and there was no hope for it to be taken to the next level. Even if he wanted me to move into his flat I didn´t agree because to me marriage is important too and he only says that he is able to “start thinking about it only after we start living together to see if there is any future for us.” How can I agree to live with him when what he is telling me is actually – I am not sure about you, I would never feel happy living like this, it would make me only more insecure. So yesterday I explained this to him and finally broke up with him. He said it´s hard for him too but thinks he did not treat me badly and the problem is he doesn´t know what to do anymore, that there is no way he could make me happy even if he tries hard. To this I can only comment that since the time I had told him my point of view on living together without any future (marriage commitment), he has become rather distant, we had no sex, he didn´t even want to hold my hand and stay close, it was very weird. I told him it felt weird to keep such a distance and he blamed stress at work, illness (he had tonsilitis) and other things in his life he finds disappointing. But I knew there was another problem. Yesterday I finally found out that he was angry with me for my “request” (his own words) to be engaged prior to living together first and now he was not even sure if he still wanted to live with me anymore. So I told him I do not want this holding pattern of relationship to last anymore and broke up with him. For the first time that evening he had tears in his eyes and said he hoped that some day we find a way to solve this.

    But Rori, what would you do? I don´t know how to solve this? I must admit I am (wasn´t ever) CD-ing, I found your blog only this year and I never thought this could happen to me. I regarded him the love of my life. But now I feel hopeless, I felt very strange going to work with him today (I cannot completely avoid contact with him as he takes me to work by car sometimes and now I can´t afford commuting on my own). But it feels so painful to sit there talking about weather while lately there has been so much going on in this relationship.
    What should I do? I feel very lonely and inadequate – other women get married after e.g 2 years and I wasn´t able to even after 8,5 years. Is it hopeless to still have any expectations from him or should I completely move on? I fear doing so so much…..

    Thank you for your support,


  6.  #6Lucy on January 10, 2011 at 11:36 am

    Today’s Inner Journey email:

    Let go of blame

    “My days of whining and complaining about others have come to an end. Nothing is easier than fault finding.”

    — Og Mandino

    We often expect other people to meet our needs. When they don’t give us what we want, we may feel anger, resentment and even revengeful. Rather than blaming others, we could choose to get in touch with our needs and then fill them ourselves.

    “Take your life in your own hands and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame.”

    — Erica Jong

    “Life appears to me too short to be spent in nursing animosity or registering wrong.”

    — Charlotte Bronte

  7.  #7tinque on January 10, 2011 at 11:38 am

    reneej – Another person cannot cause you to feel anything either way. You feel as you feel as a result of things which lie deeply inside you.

    You can express how you feel without saying “you”. If asked why you feel this way, you can then proceed to say for example, “it feels bad when I feel ignored” or “it seems as though you are angry, and this is making me feel uneasy. I don’t want to feel this way. Can you help me with this?” or “I feel really small when it seems as though I’m being talked down to, and I don’t want to feel this way. What do you think?”

    And so on. Does this make better sense? The example you give is a standard “formula” for talking to people, but it doesn’t seem to work very well. It’s comes off as accusatory, and no one wants to feels as though guilty of something even if they know they are.

    If someone, your man, has treated you in a way that doesn’t feel good, usually he knows, and to just say you feel bad is enough. He may not apologize, for he maybe embarrassed, but then again he may.

    He may need to ponder things for awhile, and he may come back and apologize in his own way by say drawing you a bath or pouring you a glass of your favorite wine, etc.

    Sometimes there are not neat conclusions, but try noticing if his behavior changes, even in subtle ways.


  8.  #8tinque on January 10, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Eva – It may be true that some people date and marry within two years. But sometimes they don’t. I don’t know how old you are, but often men who are older and have been married before, with or without children, don’t want to go that route again. To be committed is more meaningful than a norm that has been imposed by society and the government.

    You’ve been together a long time. It sounds to me as though he’s very committed to you, yet he has some fear. Would living together be so bad? I can’t imagine not living with someone first before making any sort of commitment.

    Others may disagree with me, but I want to know what I’m dealing with beforehand. You can’t really know a person in two years, maybe in three, and you can’t really know a person unless you’ve seen them in all life’s aspects, some of which can be hidden when you are not living together.

    I don’t see him wanting a trial period of living together as settling.

    Try rethinking your ideas of what marriage is. Can you be married without the piece of paper? Can you be happy having his heart and his soul without a ceremony? How about another way of commemorating your love? A ring? A private ritual?

    He may or may not change his mind about this, but is he worth discarding over this?


  9.  #9Eva on January 10, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Additional most up-to-date info:

    Currently I am getting prepared my new flat I am moving in in 2 weeks and one of my ex-bf´s friends is helping me with that.
    Today my ex was taking me and some other people from work by car (so fortunately there was no possibility for any serious talk) but on our way back home, he suddenly told me: “Well I have talked to my friend and I am coming to your flat this afternoon to help you.” – as if nothing happened yesterday, when I broke up with him. I felt confused but realized I was receiving, I agreed. Everything went fine, he helped me fix the cupboard and then said: “Tomorrow morning I will pick you up at 6:00” to which I replied I was going by my own car this time, but that I thank him anyway.
    I asked him why he was helping me in spite of the break up and replied: “Why not? You know you can always count on me when you need my help.”

    I feel totaly, completely confused and stuck. I still love him very much, therefore on one hand I feel relieved a bit everytime he turns up, but the moment he´s gone home I feel lonely desperate and triggered. So when I am alone again I feel worse than if he hadn´t come at all.

    What do I do about it when I can´t avoid contact to 100% and how should I understand this break up-NO break up? He wants to come tomorrow again – as a friend – i.e. no kissing, no flirting with me. Or does it mean he is trying to control me in any way so that I don´t find anyone else quickly?

    The thing is I want him back – not as a friend, but fully commited to me, loving me. Should I step into my masculine energy and express regret for breaking up with him or should I just be inviting and let him ask me for a second (actually third) chance? If so, how do I handle my feelings everytime he leave me without a kiss, rather as a friend?

    Thanks so much for advice,


  10.  #10Eva on January 10, 2011 at 11:59 am


    Well, I would have been able to start living with him, had it be on plate let´s say when I finished my studies 3 years ago (I am 26 now, he is 31). Now I am older and don´t want to be assessed by him anymore. Believe me, we know each other very well – during the 8,5 years of our relationship, we spent almost all the free time together, saw each other literally every day and never got bored with each other, I get on well with his sister, nephew and mum too. They don´t understand either what´s going on with him, his sister once told me that I must be saint when I am staying with him although he is not taking it to the next level…..well, now we are apart and I feel like I shall find a new “family”….

  11.  #11tinque on January 10, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    Eva – My comment above still stands. If it feels good having him come around, let him come around. If you really want to break this off, then don’t have contact. It’s that simple, yet not.

    You say you want him back committed etc. But he is. Can you not see this?


  12.  #12tinque on January 10, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Eva – I just read your response to me. You are young, and that you’ve been with this man since you were only around 18 tells me you have little experience with men and relationships and life in general.

    Please don’t take this as me being condescending, for that is NOT where I’m coming from.

    At this point, CDing would be the best thing for you. It would allow you to experiment and expand yourself. If he comes back around, wonderful, but you may find you don’t want him so much anymore.

    Someone even better suited to you may.


  13.  #13Eva on January 10, 2011 at 12:30 pm


    You are right, I have very little experience with casual dating. He is my first relationship, yet I have never regretted giving up any freedom for him. Before we got together I had quite a lot boys wanting to date me, but I have always preferred to be free and single as a teenager until HE managed to make me his girfriend (even this took him almost 2 years). I think I am not afraid of no men wanting to date me but rather of that I will not be able to fall in love so easily. It was very hard for me even at the age of 18, when my heart was completely free…..actually, this is my first hearbreak ever.

    But OK, let´s say you are right, he acts committed… how do I fix it? At the moment he also might be unsure about what I what want so he rather acts as a friend. How do I inspire him to come closer and express his love? Or should I simply say to him: “I should not have broken up with you, I want you back?” I don´t think this would be smart – not only would he take my word too lightly in the future, what I fear more is that he will say: “OK, let start over.” yet still act cold and distant…..I don´t want this happen anymore…

  14.  #14tinque on January 10, 2011 at 12:59 pm

    Eva – The only way to “fix” this is to find who you are. You haven’t done this yet. You haven’t found yet what fills YOU up, what fulfills you what makes you feel good, hobbies or work you love, learning how to take the very best care of you, loving yourself with all your foibles and idiosyncrasies which will be endearing to the right man.

    If he “comes back” he will come back. You may not want him anymore though.

    As for falling in love easily, I wouldn’t recommend it.
    Consider yourself fortunate that you don’t, for many women do, too easily, and it ends up being illusion, imaginary and painful.

    Only someone worthy of you deserves your heart, so keep her as safe as you can until your “the one” shows up.

    This isn’t to say you won’t still get your heart broken or at least bruised along the way. Likely you will, yet it’s all part of growing and learning to be the best you possible.

    Try not to worry about him. Try not to think too much about him. Put your focus on YOU. This is YOUR time.


  15.  #15Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 1:23 pm


    I recently told a boyfriend of over 2 years that I was going to begin dating again, for the very same reasons you have broken up with your guy. I’m older than you are and didn’t want to spend any more time putting my life and desires on hold for him, though I love him with all of my heart. I just knew he was not going to propose and a legal marriage, having a home together and having a child are all very important to me. I refuse to settle for less, but even more importantly, I found myself feeling like I was auditioning for him, allowing him to go on assessing me and it eroded my self esteem, decreasing my power in my own life, let alone in the relationship. I couldn’t be my best self due to how I felt with him… always like I just didn’t quite “do it for him”.
    It took me over a year to get up the anger and courage to let him know that, while he was feeling that we might not be compatible, or get along well enough, I felt I wanted and needed to open myself to meeting other men and planned to. I told him directly that I was not breaking up with him, that he could call me if he wanted and that I would continue to date him.
    This might be an option for you to consider. You don’t have to end it and break up with him. It sounds like he’s right there, wanting to see you, help you and spend time with you. If you start dating other men as well, maybe finding men online to go out with, you’ll feel stronger and stronger as you go along. From my experience, while no one can guarantee what will happen, it sounds like your situation is a great one to try this in, because he is still seeking your company and wanting to help take care of you.
    With my guy, it’s different. He tends to retreat when he’s upset or scared and I haven’t heard from him at all. BUT I still feel better than I did being in a stalled, stalemated, holding pattern relationship and I feel amazed by that and my whole life is more enjoyable and happy, even though I miss him very, very much.

    I hope this helps you! Hang in there. It will feel better.


  16.  #16Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 1:31 pm


    Here’s a link to one of Rori’s posts you may feel like checking out:


  17.  #17LonePlum on January 10, 2011 at 1:36 pm


    If you click on the sirens names you will see their input about your very first post.



    Or may be you wish to receive an answer from Rori?
    I am under the impression she comments only the very first post of each user.
    If she missed yours, you might want to re-post with a new name?


  18.  #18Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 1:37 pm


    Here’s another. Now, I’m not saying your man is just a snack, but this post of Rori’s really helped me laugh about my relationship and feel a lot better.


  19.  #19LonePlum on January 10, 2011 at 1:39 pm


    Link 1

    If you click on the siren name you will see her input about your very first post.



  20.  #20LonePlum on January 10, 2011 at 1:40 pm


    Link 2

    If you click on the siren name you will see her input about your very first post.



  21.  #21LonePlum on January 10, 2011 at 1:42 pm


    Link 3

    If you click on the siren name you will see her input about your very first post.


    Or may be you wish to receive an answer from Rori?
    I am under the impression she comments only the very first post of each user.
    If she missed yours, you might want to re-post with a new name?


  22.  #22Eva on January 10, 2011 at 2:05 pm


    Thank you, you really describe perfectly the way I felt – as if I was auditioning for him. There´s another thing – he tends to be very judgmental of other people, so when I made some mistakes in our relationship and said things I said sometimes, he started to think I changed for good. He once told me: “Where is the carefree girl I used to know?”
    Well, I think she´s not there anymore, she´s been surpressing her negative emotions wasn´t expressing her expectations and needs for such a long time, she became resentful.
    I too lost my power, I used to go visiting him in his place whenever he called me, so finally it became an unwritten agreement that I would come in the evening – sometimes it was a bit exhausting – I came from work, went to gym, took shower at home, went to his place, spent time with him and returned home at night only to get up early in the morning. Now I decided to relax more, do less in this regard and if he comes to me, it´s OK, if not it´s OK too.

    Besides, I have been just chatting with my schoolmate from elementary school on facebook, who was into me then (LOL) and still obviously likes me, and it was really therapeutic. Though I am not interested in him, I dropped a few flirty lines and now I feel much better – that´s what CD-ing is about I guess?

  23.  #23Eva on January 10, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    And Nancy,

    How do you know your man wasn´t going to propose? Did he tell you directly? Or do you just assume this on basis of how long you are waiting for him?

  24.  #24Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 2:24 pm


    Mostly I could feel it. But I also deduced it, because he never brought it up and had a hugely negative reaction (running for the hills like a race horse) if I broached the subject. I know now that a man does what he wants and doesn’t do what he doesn’t want to do.
    He made the first move. He asked for a date. He asked for another and another and another. He initiated sex. He told me he loved me. He asked me to be exclusive. And that’s where it stopped. He never moved the relationship forward from there by wanting to spend more and more time with me, by talking about a future, by wanting to buy a home with me or move me into his, etc. If he wanted to marry me, we’d be married. He would ask. The fact that he never brought it up finally hit me like a ton of bricks and when we took our 3rd trip to Hawaii in September, I realized how sad I felt that we weren’t having a wedding there. Even sadder when I realized he wasn’t going to propose. So, when we got back, I told him I was going to start dating again.

  25.  #25Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 2:33 pm


    I also read a book called “The List: 7 Ways To Tell If He’s Going To Marry You In 30 Days Or Less” by Mary Corbett and Sheila Corbett Kihne last summer. It helped me see my situation for what it was, more than anything else I had found.
    Rori’s Blueprint program also helped a lot, as did Evan Marc Katz’s e-book, “Why He Disappeared”. I’m sure there are many other helpful books and programs. These were the 3 that helped me the most in seeing the reality of my relationship.

  26.  #26Nancy on January 10, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    And yes, flirting with your Elem School friend is what CD (Circular Dating) is all about… good job!

  27.  #27Soul Sista on January 10, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    OK…well, i won’t use this information to beat myself up! and, one of the reasons i now say i will not take advice from anyone on here besides a coach is i was given advice to break things off with the music guy but now how to express myself in feeling messages. so i blew up at him. and came up with a solution which was to end things.

    but, that’s OK.

    i need this time to myself and the mood swings around the pain of the relationship are pretty much gone. and i’m actually at this part in the ebook now (which i am finally understanding) although i’m still struggling with this…

  28.  #28Soul Sista on January 10, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    Oh great here come the tears…

  29.  #29Sweetpea on January 10, 2011 at 3:01 pm


    Thank you for this article! Just what I needed for today! You ROCK!!!

  30.  #30Josie on January 10, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    (((HUGS))) to Soul sista
    I really feel your pain honey x

  31.  #31Soul Sista on January 10, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    josie ~ thank you…it is painful sometimes because…but it is what it is and now i am working on changing my patterns so men can hear me when i need to express my painful ones. it sucks because i really love this guy and i know he loves me too i just didn’t know how to express my feelings. because of course he went on the defensive then blamed me why we weren’t together then i blamed him…it was soooo painful.

    now i’m learning. it’ll be all right.

  32.  #32Alicia on January 10, 2011 at 3:19 pm

    Good article!

    Talking in feelings actually feels akward at first. Most people think because the throw the word feel in there they talked in feelings.

    Like, I feel like when you.. or I feel like I always do everything.. (meaning they spoked in feelings)

    When actually that still isn’t a feeling statement.. I feel is ( the sensation, great, fear, sad, happy, bad) is the real feeling. It took getting use to, because that is a very vulnerable place to be.

    I remember baby stepping this on everything when I fist startes CD’ing amd I felt pretty stupid, but now I’m used to it. And I realize I dont have to say it ALL the time. It has really is amazing how much it helps.

    Once you get used to it and hear you people on tv or talking to you in a way that is kind of blaming. You really see how effective it is. Epecially when I watch reality tv.. You can see right thru what they are saying or attacking the other person with and it’s amazing they can’t just say I feel angry instead. Especially when it’s a man/ woman scenerio.

    In Modern Sirens dvd there is a great chapter on this and I watched it.. with a whoa, that’s a pretty open place to be in, and I even felt embarrased. But, it seriously works.

    Thanks Rori!

  33.  #33Senior Lady Vibe on January 10, 2011 at 3:28 pm

    @31: Alicia says:

    “…Talking in feelings actually feels akward at first. Most people think because the throw the word feel in there they talked in feelings.
    Like, I feel like when you.. or I feel like I always do everything.. (meaning they spoked in feelings)
    When actually that still isn’t a feeling statement.. I feel is ( the sensation, great, fear, sad, happy, bad) is the real feeling. It took getting use to, because that is a very vulnerable place to be…”

    Alicia, I am very impressed! …and feeling good to read your remarks.


  34.  #34Senior Lady Vibe on January 10, 2011 at 3:32 pm

    @30: Soul Sista:

    Hang in there.

    P.S. Spending some time with your mother, eating ice cream will help…

  35.  #35Soul Sista on January 10, 2011 at 3:33 pm

    SLV~ yeah we’re gonna make hot fudge sundaes when we get to AZ – we leave 1st thing in the AM

  36.  #36Josie on January 10, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    I too am struggling with speaking in feeling messages.
    I tried this weekend and it toally backfired on me and my fiance and me ended up splitting up.
    Luckily we talked the next day and worked things out but it was devastating to row when I was trying to say how I felt.
    He’d been talking to his mates at the bar for about 15 minutes which meant I was sat alone, feeling silly, unwanted, ignored & unimportant.
    I expressed myself so badly and blamed him for leaving me sat alone and ended up saying if he wanted to stand chatting to his mates then he could but he’d be single cos I wouldn’t put up with it.
    He tried to reason with me saying the ‘old me’ would have come up and slapped him on the arse and reclaimed his attention instead of behaving like a spoilt brat. He was right. I’d got to such an insecure place in my own head that the slightest perceived snub was snowballing out of control and turning into such a big deal for me.
    I’d been making him so unhappy, coming at him from a place of such insecurity and defensiveness that I was strangling the love out of him instead of relaxing and letting him give it freely.

  37.  #37Senior Lady Vibe on January 10, 2011 at 4:06 pm

    @34: Soul Sista says:
    “SLV~ yeah we’re gonna make hot fudge sundaes when we get to AZ – we leave 1st thing in the AM”

    Sounds good! 😀


  38.  #38Chrissy on January 10, 2011 at 4:13 pm

    My man is the same – he does not seem at all comfortable with feeling messages and seems to either retreat or react with defensive anger. But having read this post, maybe my feeling messages are coming across as inauthentic and that is why he reacts like that. Definitely something for me to look into further….

  39.  #39Sweetpea on January 10, 2011 at 4:16 pm

    I think I’ve become fairly adept at feeling messages. And I still don’t think they sounded at all blaming, but much like Josie, I found that they backfired on me with my last guy. I felt like I was always nit-picking about something. I’ve been struggling trying to decide if I find my own way of using feeling messages or if I just not concentrate so much on feeling messages and just concentrate on coming from a place of compassion – with or without feeling messages.

    What this article says to me and I think this is exactly what I needed, is that the feeling messages weren’t working because it was all surface stuff. I still wasn’t getting down to the nitty gritty of what the feelings are under all the surface stuff.

    This is where I’ve been:
    When you try to “talk out” what it is you’re feeling about what it is he did, you are trying to CREATE A SOLUTION.

    You are trying to solve the problem, determine who’s right, and RELIEVE THE STRESS you feel inside.

    You are NOT truly, authentically, really expressing the way you feel.

    That would look like: “I feel hot, I feel cold, I feel sad, I feel embarrassed, I feel angry” –

    Here – working toward a “solution” – you’re talking from the surface.

    Though it may not seem like it, you’re being driven by inner forces and feeling compelled to “make sense of things” by your old inner – mostly sub-conscious, some just habit – patterns and defenses that are GUARDING your true feelings.

    You are telling a man what he did wrong and how he hurt you.

    You are talking about feelings that are COVERING UP your real feelings.

    Even though this feels like YOU because you’re so used to it, so comfortable with it – it’s NOT YOU!

    It’s the “made-up you” that we’ve all created on top of who we really are.

    Like frosting on a cake, like pancake makeup on your face, like laughing when you feel like crying – and crying when you actually feel like HITTING!

    We monitor ourselves so thoroughly that we often can’t even TOUCH who we REALLY ARE inside.

    And that’s why JUST THE WORDS ALONE won’t work.

    Because just words don’t always express the real you.

    When we talk from the surface part of our defenses that are covering up our fears, anger, guilt – all the ugly stuff we don’t want anyone to see – we basically PUSH MEN AWAY.

  40.  #40Sweetpea on January 10, 2011 at 4:19 pm

    And THIS is what I’m going to do about it:
    Use the “Translations” model in my Have The Relationship You Want eBook by putting a line down the center of a piece of paper.

    On the left, write down everything you said.

    On the right, “translate” what you said into FEELING MESSAGES.

    Just keep doing this – all day long with everyone you talk with and interact with – and see how quickly things change!

    This is NOT about blaming yourself for whatever you did or said that didn’t work for you…it’s about USING everything you’ve done or said to HELP you speak and do and BE in ways that DO work.

    Thank you sooooo much Rori for making me aware of this!

  41.  #41marina on January 10, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    Nice article Rori 🙂
    I started doing this with my memories of my experiences with former BF’s and my family.

    Made me feel more powerful and relaxed and it was easier to let go of what had happened then.

    I will put my focus now more to the here and now 😉

  42.  #42Sweetpea on January 10, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    What I’m seeing as it isn’t that my feeling messages were inauthentic, nor were they blaming, but they were coming from a place of trying to create a solution and relieving the stress I felt inside, which is ok, but I was talking from the surface. Not really addressing the real issues, the real feelings that were under the surface. and I was actually still guarding myself – not making myself vulnerable which is the beauty of feeling messages. No wonder they were pushing him away, I was still guarding myself. This is a real “aha” moment. Wow!

    Now I just hope my memory is good enough to recapture those conversations so I can “translate” them.

  43.  #43Heidi on January 10, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    This is an awesome video that captures the essence of holding back. We need to put our feelings out in the open more often. It is very fun to watch!


    This is NOT spam, it is uploaded on my channel!

    Thanks, Heidi

  44.  #44Lisi on January 10, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    I studied NonViolent Communication (Compassionate Communication) for a while.

    First — ya gotta learn what your emotions ARE. I feel “like” goes into a thought, not an emotion. Feelings, emotions, are: happy, sad, turned on, angry, frustrated, etc….

    Second, you can learn to identify the NEED that exists inside you that gives rise to your emotions. Never a need for someone else to do anything — simply that need in you.

    You can find out more at http://www.cnvc.org

    It’s good stuff.

  45.  #45Daria on January 10, 2011 at 5:31 pm

    hmm… i don’t want to communicate my perceived need

    but if the emotion is HAPPY, i don’t really have a need that needs fulfilling

    i like to imagine the impact sharing a TRUE feeling in the universe…

    of feeling messages without having to Think of needs…

  46.  #46Daria on January 10, 2011 at 5:32 pm

    not really the impact but the experience, of sitting by some other being in the universe, and sharing exactly what’s true for me in the moment – my feeling

  47.  #47Daria on January 10, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    from Orna

    Love Note of the Week:

    Intimacy does not require agreement.

    “The key to intimacy is sharing your authentic experience and feelings. When the other person is able to meet you at that level of authenticity, then true magic can happen. What we all desire is to be understood and to be loved for who we are. None of this requires us to agree with each other. Seeking agreement is an ego based desire. Sharing intimacy is a soul based desire. Be willing to take the risk, be authentic and reap great rewards!”

  48.  #48Daria on January 10, 2011 at 5:38 pm




    the one i fell in love with last SPRING!!


    and… he’s been in jail for 8 months


    OMG !


  49.  #49Daria on January 10, 2011 at 5:43 pm

    he got out of jail TODAY and wrote me TODAY



    i was at one point going to write HIS MOM!!! on myspace and tell her im in love with her son and will she tell him to call me

    now it turns out he was in jail


    wow wow wow

    i guess i coulda wrote her and then i woulda known

    i had a funny feeling back then this was gonna happen too


    when was the last time i was with him?

  50.  #50Sweetpea on January 10, 2011 at 5:44 pm


    Good stuff there.

    This is huge for me: Second, you can learn to identify the NEED that exists inside you that gives rise to your emotions. Never a need for someone else to do anything — simply that need in you.

    Seems like another “aha” to identify the need before I even address the feeling. That’s what’s been niggling at my brain.

    Thank you and I’ll check out the link.

  51.  #51Lisi on January 10, 2011 at 5:59 pm

    Daria —

    It goes like this: I’m feeling happy because I have a need for connection and I’m feeling so connected to you right now. I’m loving that.

    Positive feelings are the results of needs being met.

    Negative feelings are the results of un-met needs. They direct us to do something to meet our needs. Hence, if I have a need for connection, I make sure I connect with people — not necessarily my MAN — people.

    And, when I approach him in the space that my needs are already met, because I’ve been aware what my needs are and have been authentically meeting them — that’s an elixir to him.

    He wants to be around me when my glass is full and I’m a woman who knows how to get her needs met.

    Then he wants to meet my needs, too,…..

  52.  #52life_is_too_short_to... on January 10, 2011 at 6:20 pm

    oldie but goodie

    The Invitation by Oriah

    It doesn’t interest me
    what you do for a living.
    I want to know
    what you ache for
    and if you dare to dream
    of meeting your heart’s longing.

    It doesn’t interest me
    how old you are.
    I want to know
    if you will risk
    looking like a fool
    for love
    for your dream
    for the adventure of being alive.

    It doesn’t interest me
    what planets are
    squaring your moon…
    I want to know
    if you have touched
    the centre of your own sorrow
    if you have been opened
    by life’s betrayals
    or have become shrivelled and closed
    from fear of further pain.

    I want to know
    if you can sit with pain
    mine or your own
    without moving to hide it
    or fade it
    or fix it.

    I want to know
    if you can be with joy
    mine or your own
    if you can dance with wildness
    and let the ecstasy fill you
    to the tips of your fingers and toes
    without cautioning us
    to be careful
    to be realistic
    to remember the limitations
    of being human.

    It doesn’t interest me
    if the story you are telling me
    is true.
    I want to know if you can
    disappoint another
    to be true to yourself.
    If you can bear
    the accusation of betrayal
    and not betray your own soul.
    If you can be faithless
    and therefore trustworthy.

    I want to know if you can see Beauty
    even when it is not pretty
    every day.
    And if you can source your own life
    from its presence.

    I want to know
    if you can live with failure
    yours and mine
    and still stand at the edge of the lake
    and shout to the silver of the full moon,

    It doesn’t interest me
    to know where you live
    or how much money you have.
    I want to know if you can get up
    after the night of grief and despair
    weary and bruised to the bone
    and do what needs to be done
    to feed the children.

    It doesn’t interest me
    who you know
    or how you came to be here.
    I want to know if you will stand
    in the centre of the fire
    with me
    and not shrink back.

    It doesn’t interest me
    where or what or with whom
    you have studied.
    I want to know
    what sustains you
    from the inside
    when all else falls away.

    I want to know
    if you can be alone
    with yourself
    and if you truly like
    the company you keep
    in the empty moments.

    By Oriah © Mountain Dreaming,
    from the book The Invitation
    published by HarperONE, San Francisco,
    1999 All rights reserved

  53.  #53Aradea on January 10, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    Ok, so I made the decision to ahead forward some with Iowa. We spent most of the weekend- Sat- Monday am together, including overnight. We had a talk about the exclusivity/monogamy/sex issue, and he told me he understands I am dating to learn for myself what I want. He isn’t sure yet what he wants with me, said he isn’t seeing anyone else, and is fine with me doing my “dating thing,” and being monogamous with him. So does this mean he only wants to be a lover?
    Or does he just want me to be the same happy, busy gal he started seeing without any relationship pressure?
    Or is it that he feels fairly confident I’ll realize he’s the one for me, so isn’t worried?

    Then I realize, it really doesn’t matter, in a way. I feel good about it. I feel happy I can have the option to sleep with him, and I feel I can trust him on the monogamy. He HAS stepped up, repeatedly, on many things so far. And if he’s right for me, and it works out-GREAT. And if he’s not, then I am not desperate, have lots of other interested men I’m going out with to consider….. All without feeling the sexual frustration, since I can sleep with a man I really care for, like, and trust.
    Maybe he’s NOT the one for me because he’s willing to understand my need to CD. (and doesn’t seem concerned)
    Maybe he IS the one for me because he’s willing to understand my need to CD. (and doesn’t seem concerned)
    Either way, my need is met, right? AND we are being honest and open about this, which is already a HUGE step for me. He actually offered the option to me. And I accepted! And Sunday we did the deed. And he stayed overnight again after, and helped me with some household chores to spend more time with me. Yes, he did dishes and took out the trash with me on Sunday, JUST to spend more time with me!!!

    What do you think? Did I blow a perfectly good chance to have a great love with this guy sleeping with him before any real commitment is reached? Does his response to my CD situation reveal anything?

    I wonder if my telling him I didn’t want to sleep with him if we have to be exclusive, but I want monogamy for sure, was the impetus for offering just so he could get sex. But then I figured…
    There’s one way (that I would likely enjoy) to find out pretty quickly….
    So I did what I felt, with honesty, and what I wanted, and I’m letting go to be surprised. After all, it was nice, it was sex, and I knew that if it was all he’d been after, I’d see it pretty quickly.
    Today he was sweetly disappointed that I have plans until Saturday. Said he sure hope the week goes by fast. Hmmm, so we’ll see what’s next!

  54.  #54life_is_too_short_to... on January 10, 2011 at 9:46 pm

  55.  #55Brenda on January 10, 2011 at 10:38 pm

    Sunday night Ryan texted me happy birthday! Then we had a long back and forth text conversation! I feel happy!

  56.  #56Brenda on January 10, 2011 at 11:00 pm


    RE: #50 – I love that poem! I had to read it twice! Really deep! Thank you!

  57.  #57Eva on January 11, 2011 at 2:44 am

    RE 23:


    In my case he did brought it up – many times – especially early in our relationship. He used to say I was the love of his life and that one day he would marry me – it was not a proposal, it was a statement he sometimes said when we talked with each other. But I think I had srewed it up. I was very young, too young I think about marriage, so I would roll my eyes then. Maybe I felt a little bit offended that he used to say it as a statement a not ask me if I would agree. Anyway, a lot of time passed since those blisfull days. Last year was horrible adn we were fighting a lot so I think we both lost his illusions. But I don´t know. Last time he brough up marriage himself was last autumn – in October.
    We were having a good time partying and were drunk a lot. On our way back home he told me: “I don´t want to be only your boyfriend. I want to be something more – a husband. But I am just too shy to ask.”
    I replied, I did not take it 100% seriously as we were both drunk, but he said that I should take it seriously, that he was telling me the truth. Today, I know he was lying to me – during our last fight he told me so. I again asked him how I should have understood this statement and he cynically replied: “I said what I said because you seemed eager to hear such words.” So now I understand that this was just a placating statement instead of expressing his love for me. What I don´t understand is why he said that at all because I did not push him to do so in any way, actually he said it out of the blue completelly HIMSELF. I feel sad, betrayed, rejected. I feel pain and anxiety, yet hope things might get better. At the same time I feel angry, confused and don´t know if I still want him in my life. A part of me screams:”Yes, he´s the one.” while the other one says: “What if I get him back, but will still feel fear and inner pressure to move things fast.” I really fear that a feeling of urgency will occur.

    Nancy, did you feel the same with your man? Urgency to DO something about your relationship, to know where things were going? Did you start obsessing about it? I didn´t for over 7 years until last year when we were on and off so many times. Suddenly, I became insecure. It might be as well true that during the years everythig was fine I had more attention from other guys too – one of my classmates at university fell in love with me, then I flirted with a professor 🙂 etc. Suddenly, at work it´s different. As if my playful days were gone.

  58.  #58Elenchus on January 11, 2011 at 4:03 am

    I stumbled on this blog quite by chance, and am fascinated to read and experience all the raw and communicated emotion and feeling here. It is quite something…particularly given the honesty of the communication which feels so rare in everyday life. I think it’s rather thrilling that there is this group of people out there, in contact with so many others all over the place, who are drawing from their own integrity and speaking directly, unabashedly, from the heart.

    I find it really exciting…

    With love to all,
    Elenchus x

  59.  #59Femininewoman on January 11, 2011 at 6:34 am

    RE 55

    “I don´t want to be only your boyfriend. I want to be something more – a husband. But I am just too shy to ask.”

    Eva when I hear such statements my inclination is to ask them “are you sure that is what you want? Marriage is a longterm thing that should not be played with. ” Reading your words “so I would roll my eyes then” I remember reading that eye rolling communicates contempt to the receiver. You might wish to look over those years and really go deep into your body to see what you were really feeling back then and if those feelings still exist for you. I understand that until we can really connect with ourselves and what we are really feeling we cannot really connect with someone else. ” I feel sad, betrayed, rejected. I feel pain and anxiety, yet hope things might get better.” “At the same time I feel angry, confused” Have you expressed to him that you feel angry and confused? It seems to me that exploring these feelings might be a great place to start for you because feeling angry at a loved one and expressing it will connect with them depending on what our vibe is at the time. If it is because we realize that the person is not passionate about their own life I can guarantee that the person will hear it and will want to change. I have tested that over and over again, sometimes by accident in the past but it does work. I also feel like it might help you to go back to the fond tender memories you have of the relationship rather than focussing on what is not working right now. Even if you both do not reconnect it really warms the heart to know that we all can share something special with another human being and to wish them happiness wherever they find it or whomever they find it with. That is my intention this year for my ex and if I get the opportunity I will express that to him. Just thinking about that and writing it feels attractive to me and I hope he will feel intrigued and attracted by that. What can be more powerful than wishing someone I love the greatest happiness possible even if it is not with me? My heart really feels warm just expressing and feeling that.

  60.  #60Femininewoman on January 11, 2011 at 6:38 am

    Eva I have borrowed from the library Gay Hendricks books The Big Leap, Conscious Loving, The Ten Second Miracle that have helped me tremendously. The 5 Horsemen of the Apocalypse by Dr. Gottman and the Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman might be helpful. These books have helped me to find out a lot about myself and created some really great aha moments for me.

  61.  #61LonePlum on January 11, 2011 at 7:38 am

    I feel confused

    Evan Marc Katz writes, somewhere on his site, that when he met his wife on line, he knew immediately she was the one.
    He instantly put his profile down and called off the 2 women he was regularly dating at the time.
    He focused on this new woman who blew his mind off.
    He told her she was the reason for him off the market, yet he was OK with her meeting people, he knew that the more men she would meet the better she would see he was the right one for her.
    Of course after a while she also put her profile down, stopped dating around and married him.
    I thought that was quite clever of him and a good situation for a woman to be put in by a man.
    I thought that coaches like Evan allowed Cdating to work.

    always a but

    Today’s Evan letter sounds like he is pissed off by Cdating.
    One of his female clients allowed a man (Ted) to pursue her but she did not accept to be his girl friend when he asked after only 3 dates, and she does not want to be off the market yet.

    Evan compares her to a male heartbreaker.
    And he refers to selfishness and to a lack of integrity for keeping Ted from finding a woman really into him.
    Plus he is saying she will lose Ted and not find better.

    I am going to paste Evan’s letter down below in the next post.


  62.  #62LonePlum on January 11, 2011 at 7:46 am

    **********Evan Marc Katz

    You ever go out with a guy who seems to be playing games with you?

    You had four great dates. Things got a little physical (okay, a LOT physical). He’s been really forthcoming in telling you how excited he is and how much he likes you.
    Then things start to cool off.

    He used to call and text every day; now he does it every second or third day.
    He used to make plans as soon as the date was over; now he says, “I’ll call you”.
    He used to make you feel attractive, desired and secure; now, you’re completely on edge, waiting for him to let you know where things stand.

    It’s an awful feeling, isn’t it?
    To feel like you had a connection, but to be kept at bay?
    To feel like you want to reach out, but are afraid of smothering or scaring him off?
    To feel completely out of control of your own destiny, since everything is dependent on HIM, remembering why he liked you so much in the first place.

    As you probably know, the guy who cools off on you almost NEVER turns around.
    And while you may rail against men like this – the guys who sleep with you without commitment, who text instead of call, who “see” you for months without being your boyfriend -– did you know that sometimes, you’re just like them?

    That’s right.

    For all that you can rightfully criticize men for their failure to communicate and their desire to have their cake and eat it, too, women are no different.

    And if that surprises you, you might want to check out my eBook “Why He Disappeared”, which explains the mysterious disappearing man once and for all, and allows you instantly let go of the pain and confusion in your past.

    Keep reading to see your own behavior from a man’s point of view. You may be shocked to learn that we’re all a lot more alike than you even imagined…

    This week, I was on the phone with a client who came to me eight weeks ago with no dating prospects whatsoever.
    But armed with a new perspective on dating, online dating, and understanding men (not to mention a new online ad campaign), this woman found herself in a new position: the object of desire to a thoughtful, considerate man.

    Tara, 39, went out with Ted three times. Each time, he called her in advance, made the plans, paid for her, followed up the day after, and let her know that she was a priority in his love life. Without being over-the-top smothering, Ted made it clear that he wanted to be her boyfriend.

    Yet even though Tara invested a LOT of money with me to ostensibly find herself a boyfriend, suddenly, when confronted with the prospect of focusing on one man, she found herself pulling away emotionally.
    Even though he’s a great guy. Cute, smart, successful, kind.
    Even though he’s done everything right.
    Even though she wants to be married one day and this man is on board – Tara just couldn’t help but feel that she needed more time being single.

    “More time than 39 years?” I asked.
    “It’s more that I’m not sure I’m ready to commit to HIM,” she continued. “So what I’d like to do is continue to date Ted casually for the next couple of months, put my profile up on Match.com, and see what happens from there. He IS a good guy, and I don’t want to throw things away. I just want to explore my other options right now.”


    Tara’s proclamation sounds eerily like the thoughts of the man who played with your heart at the top of the email. Like your heartbreaker, she came on strong, she made a real connection, and now she’s silently backing away… sort of.

    Because Tara – like your heartbreaker – doesn’t want to actually break up – she just wants to keep her distance and downgrade Ted from “future boyfriend” to “one of three men I’m seeing right now”.

    Which means that, whether Tara likes it or not, Ted’s going to be on pins-and-needles, wondering where the spark and momentum went.
    He’s going to be wondering what happened, what he did wrong, and how he can turn things around again.
    Essentially, Tara wants to have her cake and eat it, too.

    Not because she’s evil and malicious and doesn’t care about men, but because continuing to date Ted casually while exploring her other options maximizes her selfish desires.
    So she gets to keep the door open for Ted, experiment with some exciting, unpredictable men on Match, and make her decision down the road.

    Except that’s never how it goes.
    You know that.

    Because you’ve been in Ted’s position more times than you’d care to admit.
    And you know that the guy who is casually “seeing” you once a week for three months NEVER becomes your husband.

    How do you know this?

    Because if he wanted to be your boyfriend, he’d have tried harder from the very beginning. His very indifference and ambivalence to you – shopping around for other women while keeping you in the loop – tells the entire story.
    I don’t have to stick around to see the end.
    Neither should Ted.
    And neither should you.

    Your takeaway from this email is twofold:
    First, realize that men and women are no different. And although it’s easy to berate men for being selfish, for using you, for not telling you their true intentions, the real truth is: this isn’t a man thing, it’s a people thing.

    I just told you Tara’s story, but I literally have THREE clients right now going through the exact same thing.
    Three women with no prospects 8 weeks ago; now, all three are putting OFF having a boyfriend because they want time to date and explore and maximize.
    I would probably quibble that they should consider the devoted guy instead of looking for a more exciting, unpredictable player on the Internet, but that’s neither here nor there.

    All you need to know is that you have two choices: act with integrity and let your “Ted” go find a woman who’s into him, or give up on any sense of moral high ground that you might maintain when complaining about non-committal men.

    You can’t have it both ways.

    The second takeaway I’d like you to have is to internalize the idea that the guy who is keeping you at bay for more than 6-8 weeks is probably never going to step up to the plate to be your boyfriend.
    So dump him NOW and go out and find yourself a man who is EXCITED about you.

    Hey, I know a guy named Ted who is suddenly available. 🙂

    Hope you found this lesson valuable and that you can get instant benefits from focusing your energies on the men who are INTO you instead of the ones who aren’t.************

  63.  #63Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 8:16 am

    @58: LonePlum says:

    “…Evan compares her to a male heartbreaker.
    And he refers to selfishness and to a lack of integrity for keeping Ted from finding a woman really into him.
    Plus he is saying she will lose Ted and not find better.”


    What happened to EMK? Is he now proposing women take themselves out of circulation after THREE dates!?

    I haven’t yet read the post, or was in the newsletter? I’ll go take a look now.

    I’ve been doing some serious thinking about women being in circulation and the fine art and custom of having many suitors, gentleman callers, etc. More about that later.

    I’ve pondered over some of the recent posts and I’ve concluded that there are men who do not want to compete with other men; they’d rather compete against women, even while acknowledging that women have a disadvantage in forming sexual relationships. I’m still pondering this but delighted to be here on this blog and learning.


  64.  #64Lori on January 11, 2011 at 9:00 am

    I feel confused by this as well. Even before CDing, I wouldn’t have felt comfortable agreeing to be someone’s girlfriend after 3 dates. I personally don’t feel you possibly know enough about someone to commit to them after 3 dates. For me, 3 months feels better. You can date pretty much ANYONE for 3 months, it’s after that that people relax and true colors start showing…

  65.  #65Rori Raye on January 11, 2011 at 9:31 am

    Guys – I’m putting together a post about Circular Dating and “Ted.” CDing is way more complex and therapeutically designed than what Evan is talking about here – CD will heal your fear of INTIMACY – which is what these women Evan talks about all have in common – and something we can address…Love, Rori

  66.  #66Meemee on January 11, 2011 at 9:37 am

    Today I had to attend a meeting together with X. After the meeting when I was standing outside the office he came and mumbled something. I though he was saying something about the meeting. I asked him ” Sorry I didnt hear you. What did you say?”. He started smiling and said “I called you names!!”
    I cant tell you what I felt that moment. I think he is seriously offended that I am not contacting him. It seems like he cant accept it.
    This is the first time he is behaving in such a silly way. i feel so silly about him.
    I feel pity.

  67.  #67Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 9:57 am


    “I think he is seriously offended that I am not contacting him. It seems like he cant accept it.”

    Who gives a fig what he feels? I hope it is not you, Meemee. He can take care of himself; he always has. Move on, sweetie.


  68.  #68Laughing Goddess on January 11, 2011 at 9:58 am

    Still feeling excited about what Rori said about exclusivity. For me, it makes sense to be exclusive (with a man who is clearly into me) for a while before marriage. This is for me. By being exclusive, I feel better, safer making a commitment, because I get a chance to really get to know the man.

    Even living together is crucial (for me) before marriage because you learn so much about someone by living with them.

    I feel better when I get to have experience with someone before making a lifelong commitment of marriage.

    This is huge. (for me)

    I feel so much freedom now that Rori has cleared this up.

    I was feeling a little self-doubt because I am exclusive with LI even tho he hasn’t proposed. But I feel good because I know we are getting to know each other, and practicing intimacy, and I am learning and growing so much. Yet I always felt a little weird, wondering if I was doing cd-ing the wrong way (even though deep down I knew I was making the right decision for me).

  69.  #69Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 10:06 am

    Some words to live by… an excerpt from:

    Don’t Let Go, Don’t Resolve, Forget Closure and Stay On Your Horse


    “…I’m going to say that again. Once a man has outlived his usefulness in his concrete, human form – once his presence makes you go backwards and into your head and out of your body and feeling not good about yourself – you don’t want him around. Period. You’re done. He’s history.

    But that doesn’t mean he’s left the planet, or left your psyche.

    He might still be in your rock band, or in your theater company, or at your yoga class, or sweating next to you at your gym, or sitting next to you at your work. He might be the father of your children. He might be a superstar you see on billboards and hear about from friends and strangers every day. He could be your lawyer, or your coach, or your children’s friend’s father.

    It doesn’t mean he has nothing to offer you – even if it’s only a reminder of what you DON’T want.

    And it doesn’t mean you have to be especially nice to him, or welcoming, or reasonable.

    And it doesn’t mean you have to notice him much, or think about him, or wonder about him, or talk about him.

    It just means he’s there. He still lives and breathes…”



  70.  #70Evan Marc Katz on January 11, 2011 at 10:22 am

    Just had to pop by to try to set the record straight. Thanks to Nancy and to Rori for your kind words, as always.

    So, LonePlum, I certainly don’t mind if you don’t agree with my take on things – reasonable people can and do often agree to disagree. What I have to correct is that I’ve been completely misquoted:

    “Evan Marc Katz writes, somewhere on his site, that when he met his wife on line, he knew immediately she was the one.
    He instantly put his profile down and called off the 2 women he was regularly dating at the time….”

    No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

    The story of how I was dating two women and dropped them like a hot potato for the one I liked best is TRUE. However, that was NOT my wife. In fact, the woman whom I immediately committed to DUMPED me about 6 weeks later. Just goes to show you how blind people can be when they think they “just know”.

    No, the oft-told story of my wife is the complete OPPOSITE. I was never over-the-moon about her. I saw her once a week for about 4 weeks before stepping up and asking for a commitment. And throughout our entire 16 month courtship, I was still ambivalent because I didn’t feel what I thought I should feel. This, to me, is an important teaching tool – to use your brains as much as you use your heart. It’s great to say, “follow your heart”, but take a look at the past at all the times you followed it. Yeah. That’s what I’m talking about.

    As far as today’s newsletter, the point of it was twofold: to shine the light in the blind spot of women who complain that men are players and commitmentphobes when they do the exact same thing – and to get those women to DUMP the guy who is keeping them on ice for months at a time.

    Does this directly contradict Rori’s Circular Dating? Perhaps. But again, reasonable people can agree to disagree. I know for a fact that both Rori and I believe in female choice and empowerment and not accepting anything less than consistent effort and kindness from a man. Personally, I feel that once a guy wants to commit to you, you have two reasonable choices: commit to him and give an exclusive relationship a shot, or let him go find a woman who WILL commit to him. It’s the EXACT same thing I’d tell a man who was “using” you while “circular dating” himself – let her go!

    We can quibble about the details, but the point is to treat men the way you’d like to be treated. I can’t see how anyone can disagree with that. But I’m sure you’ll tell me how… 🙂

    Have a great day, everybody. Keep reading what Rori tells you; she knows what she’s talking about!

    Warmest wishes,

    Evan Marc Katz

  71.  #71Alicia on January 11, 2011 at 10:55 am

    I watched Modern Sirens today.. I haven’t watched it in months and months but, it was like watching a whole new DVD for the first time cause, I’m in such a different place.

    This one thing Rori said that jumped out at me.
    When you’re trying to call him, or lean forward it’s to interupt feeling your feelings.. and it sooo clicked.

    Thanks again!

    Then I filled out my dating profile to CD again.. Already feeling a little overwhelmed. But, it seemed liked there were a lot cuter guys. I’m excited!

  72.  #72Eva on January 11, 2011 at 11:04 am

    RE 59

    Dear Femininewoman – I will briefly explain – yes, marriage is what I want – but when I was writing about me rolling my eyes, I meant I had done it in past, when I was 19 – I had very little experience and marriage was the last thing on my mind then. Besides, he never noticed that – I was rather feeling like that and doing it only for myself. I regarded it as a far future. But now, I don´t roll my eyes anymore. I really changed my point of view, got older and really started to feel ready. The only thing I never ever doubted (even at the age of 19) was that he is “the one.”

  73.  #73Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 11:08 am


    I think that clears up a lot of the enigma I feel about CDing and integrity. It makes perfect sense to me. I recently told a guy who was way too into me to move on because I just couldn’t get comfortable with him. I’ve been questioning whether that was indeed the right thing to do, but it seemed like the only fair thing to do and at the end of the day, I’m the one who has to have a clear conscience to sleep at night.

    It makes sense to ME, for my dating integrity to let a guy go if he’s really into me and I’m not feeling it for him – I’ve given other guys a chance at exclusivity too, if I was interested.

    I’m sure there will be some controversy over this on the blog, butt thanks for your “two cents.”

  74.  #74Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Ladies and Rori,

    I know there are a few of you out there who are in exclusive, committed, unmarried relationships. And many of you who are struggling with CDing. To me, there are many questions that arise. I understand that CDing is designed to help us feal with our fear of intimacy and I think that for me, it has, although I certainly think I have a ways to go yet.

    I often wonder, and Rori I would love for you to do a post on this, or include it in the post you mentioned earlier, if I have a man who’s wanting me to commit to exclusivity, and I really like him and feel ok about it, would it serve me to go ahead and be exclusive so long as the relationship is moving forward? And then start CDing again only if he stalls, much like you did many years ago with your husband?

    It makes sense to me that I’d get to deal with some of my deeper intimacy issues if I was in a deeper relationship since CDing seems so much more shallow and just dealing with surface stuff.

    I can now tolerate men coming at me better than I used to and it seems that getting to the deeper emotional damage would serve me better at this point.

    Any thoughts?

  75.  #75Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 11:27 am


    Re: 71, thank you for that reminder. Again, what I needed to hear just when I needed to hear it.

  76.  #76tinque on January 11, 2011 at 11:40 am

    Sweetpea – In answer to your question, YES. On so many levels yes. If it feels right to you, if it feels good to you, and he’s committing to you, and you want to explore this exclusivity with him, then yes.

    As you said you can always resume CDing if it no longer feels right or good.

    By the way stalling is not necessarily a bad thing as long as it doesn’t continue beyond what you want to deal with.


  77.  #77Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Thanks Tinque!

    Also, for any of those interested, Rori addressed this on the previous thread, #366.

  78.  #78Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Sweetpea — “It makes sense to me that I’d get to deal with some of my deeper intimacy issues if I was in a deeper relationship since CDing seems so much more shallow and just dealing with surface stuff. I can now tolerate men coming at me better than I used to and it seems that getting to the deeper emotional damage would serve me better at this point.”

    Yes! That’s pretty much what I just wrote on the other thread!

    This topic is now divided between the two threads — Rori addressed it on this post and the previous one….

  79.  #79Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    Here’s what I wrote on the other thread:

    Wow, what synchronicity! Last night in bed I had a thought out of the blue that CDing could easily stand in the way of genuine intimacy… and in that moment I decided that regardless of what is said on the blog, there’s gonna come a time for me with the right guy when I will Not CD bc doing so would prevent us from truly deepening our intimacy…

    Turns out my thoughts were right in synch with Rori afterall!!!

    I feel happy and confident and reassured once again that I can trust myself.

  80.  #80Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    Sweetpea and others,

    This is a fantastic book that deals with the topic of deepening authentic intimacy… I’ve read it twice over the past two years and plan to read it again:


    I think Gay Hendricks wrote the Forward.

    It’s really really good.

  81.  #81Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 2:56 pm


    That sounds like a good book! I love intimacy! I’d pick cuddling and pillow talk any day over sex! 🙂 Even tho I loooove sex! Hey, I said the word “sex”! Watch Katarina materialize out of nowhere! LOL! 😆

    I had a productive, tiring day getting 80 feet of 6 foot chain link fence for my dogs! I am soooo tired!

    And I feel so at peace about Ryan as a friend! Just want you all to know that getting all the infectious pain out of my heart last week and all your wonderful support really contributed in a major way to my inner shift!

    I feel like I am out of depression now, and I have been doing lots of housework and taking care of my life. So much so that I haven’t had much time to write on the blog, and I miss it! I miss you!

  82.  #82kdr on January 11, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    This poem always makes me feel strong while at the same time bringing tears to my eyes. Go figure.

    Comes The Dawn
    Author: Veronica A. Shoffstall

    After a while you learn the subtle difference
    Between holding a hand and chaining a soul,
    And you learn that love doesn’t mean leaning
    And company doesn’t mean security,
    And you begin to learn that kisses aren’t contracts
    And presents aren’t promises,
    And you begin to accept your defeats
    With your head up and your eyes open
    With the grace of a woman, not the grief of a child,
    And you learn to build all your roads on today,
    Because tomorrow’s ground is too uncertain for plans,
    And futures have a way of falling down in mid-flight.
    After a while you learn
    That even sunshine burns if you get too much.
    So you plant your own garden and decorate your own soul,
    Instead of waiting for someone to bring you flowers.
    And you learn that you really can endure…
    That you really are strong,
    And you really do have worth.
    And you learn and learn…
    With every goodbye you learn.

  83.  #83marina on January 11, 2011 at 3:52 pm

    Hello dear Sirens!

    I am gonna catch up with all of your comments!

    I had a really nice day.
    My uncle, who has been working abroad in Africa and Asia for over 30 years (and now moved back here to stay with his family and work here) and I went to a fair on infrastructure.
    He is looking for a new job/assignment and I want to expand my network.

    It was really great! I had lots of fun!
    Learned a lot about new technologies and developments.
    Don’t you just love what beautiful solutions and inventions people can come up with?
    I will def. keep in touch, at least through LinkedIn, with some of the people I met.

    And there were many many many men to flirt with and practice some Tools on 😀
    Leaning back, the way I stand, feeling my feelings. Staying with myself, feeling somewhat relaxed and not getting swept away with my own enthusiasm and the urge to show how clever I am and instead stay within my feminine energy.

    It did help that I was wearing a pink dress, haha.

    It was fun to be talking about technologies and business and still feel feminine.

    I mean, really, if you think that there are too little men in your area, see if you can find a fair (on technology or something) where there will be lots of men around and practice those Tools!

    If you’ve had enough or are having a hard time with one of them, just go to the next guy 😉

    I also discovered I really want to improve my ‘elevator pitch’ on who I am and what kind of work I do when I meet somebody new. I really want to show them who I am. I don’t want it to be a oneway speech, don’t want it to be me asking them lots of questions without them getting to know me.
    I am sure that will come in handy.

    Also, I think I’d rather work for a commisioning authority than as a consultant…I really love to know about all these new developments and want to see them implemented, rather than work on developing them. Hmm, something to think about…

    The funny thing was, that my aunt afterwards asked me what it was like. And if my uncle did something useful, if he found himself a new job. Bc he hardly tells her anything about it. She has been pushing him for a long time to look for a new job. Actually, I wouldn’t tell her anything either if she would be pushing me like that…

    They have been living in different countries for 6 years and now she seems to expect that everything will be like before. But they are both used to live their own lifes and not take much notice of eachother…

    I don’t know what to think about it. I feel happy that I seem to get along with men kinda easy, in my work and private life. My Mum always asks me what is going on with my youngest brother, bc he never tells her anything and he does tell me.
    (Perhaps it is different bc my aunt is my uncles wife and my Mum is my brada’s mum, so they both have more interests in the relationship than I do?)

    But, perhaps I am too much like a friend (like in Rori’s latest e-letter)?
    I don’t know. I feel like in my girl energy with men, most of the time, but I can also relate to their world I suppose.
    I did a simple online test and it showed that I use both my left and right brain equally.

    How can I tell if I am too much of a men friend???

    I have more girl friends than male friends.
    (Ok, most of my girl friends are not the girly girly girls and have an adventuruous side too, but they are girls anyway 😉

    Hmm, should I look at how I feel around men and how they treat me?
    If it isn’t too much about me stepping into their world and going along with their life and hobbies and not really being in my world and doing the things I love? Do I really love those new developments in infrastructure, or do I love it bc there are many men and bc I have this love for new gadgets and new inventions…?

    Well, I sure had a fun night at the Burlesque party and just bought a ticket for a Burlesque workshop 🙂

    I was thinking about telling my aunt about this site too…
    I really think she could benefit from the wisdom here.
    But, I don’t know if I should advise her in this. Re Rori’s previous post.
    I really don’t know if I am getting triggered.
    Or if she really needs help.
    And how can I advise her? How can I tell her, hey, I really think that you should read this and start practicing those Tools…if you want to feel good again, about yourself, your husband, your relationship.


    Ciao, XXXX, Marina

  84.  #84marina on January 11, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    Ahw KDR, that is beautiful!

    Now I am crying too…

  85.  #85marina on January 11, 2011 at 4:03 pm

  86.  #86marina on January 11, 2011 at 4:05 pm

    Brenda, I feel happy reading that you are feeling much better now!
    I also want to read that book 🙂

  87.  #87Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    Anyone else notice that there are a lot of Catholics on pof? (I’m not Catholic.)

  88.  #88Daria on January 11, 2011 at 4:35 pm

    tonite’s dream, i was on some islands with a bunch of people, one of them was Brenda! …

    there were guys too, and I remember looking out at the sea, and also the beds, and switching islands and rooms…

    something about boats too when do we get to take the boats to where we wanted to go

    and taking the train too into town

    it was like we had moved there and now we had to find our own way around…

    it was like a study program

  89.  #89Daria on January 11, 2011 at 4:38 pm

    Hey Mercedes… you’ve really helped me girl!

    honestly this is the thought that ran through my mind with GRATITUDE absolutely

    as the past few days i cried and cried out some feelings from guywhohadababy and it was becuase you said that i was still stuck on him

    I could touch those feelings and know they were being healed

    and now more men are coming in, coming back!

    and i feel more at peace with the thought of THAT relationship and seeing the dynamic even more, healing up the stuff i hadn’t touched on yet

  90.  #90Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    Did anyone see the movie “Nights in Rodanthe?” I just picked up the DVD from the library.

    A funny thing…Diane Lane is in this movie. I remember her from the movie “A Little Romance.” That was such a cute little movie. If anyone hasn’t seen it, it’s worth watching! It’s fun to watch Sir Lawrence Olivier ham it up too… the old lovey…


  91.  #91Turtle Girl on January 11, 2011 at 5:26 pm

    I saw Nights in Rodanthe. The best part was the horses in the end. It was not a very good movie in my book. Sort of lame grade B. But I do love Diane Lane.

    and of course the song sung by Emmy Lou Harris, cuz she is awesome. xxoo

  92.  #92Simply Shannon on January 11, 2011 at 5:39 pm

    Lucy, reading #79, my heart lurched. Did I mess up with Mr. Manly Man about the exclusivity thing? Wow. I feel sad.

  93.  #93Sammie on January 11, 2011 at 6:05 pm

    Hi Rori,

    What is the ever elusive chemistry that a man needs to feel to have the happy after relationship? I feel a bit confused. And, is there something I’m not getting here. I have had two experiences this week on this very thing. One which was a potential new CD and the other an LI. Is there any potential with my LI?

    It’s been a week of endings for me. I guess that could also be looked at as beginnings since new beginnings come from endings.

    My LI told me this morning that he does not see a happy ever after with me. He said that he was sure that I am disappointed and that he is as well. When I asked him what he meant by being disappointed he told me that he is disappointed that he is not in love with me.

    Then he went on to say that while he cares very deeply for me and wants to stay in my life always and hopes he can always be there for me…and said it will be very painful to see me moving on but he just doesn’t see it happening for us. It seems he’d like to keep everything as is but I think he doesn’t want to feel my expectations of more.

    My newest CD told me so many very nice things about me but that he was unsure of the “ever elusive chemistry.” That Newest CD generally feels a strong spark and didn’t feel it with me. But, he couldn’t quit giving me compliments from my looks to my intelligence, humor and how much fun it is to be with me.

    He wanted to at this point develop a friendship only. I let him know two times that I am interested in dating and going out with men. And that if he didn’t see that I completely understood. I wished him all the best and told him I was looking to date men and didn’t want to start up a new friendship right now.

    What is this elusive chemistry? I want it all – great sex, great conversation, fun doing things together. Do I need to be expressing more feelings? I’ve been reading your work for awhile and trying to incorporate parts. Trying to make my life fuller an be less needy.

    Sometimes I wonder if he is a bit of an addiction for me. I have felt more worried about what he feels for me than what I feel for him.

    Would the Targeting Mr. Right be helpful for me? I don’t have a lot of consistent dating experience. In fact a lot of what I’ve learned has been with my most recent LI. And is it possible to woo back my LI?



  94.  #94Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 6:28 pm


    Happy to hear you are finding healing. Me too! Cool you had a dream with me in it!

  95.  #95Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 6:31 pm


    re: 79…I think I missed something, because I took it that Rori is recommending we CD until marriage is on the table. My last guy mentioned getting married a few times, but I wouldn’t say it “was on the table.”

    Did you understand her post differently than me, or are you talking about CDing until marriage is on the table?

  96.  #96Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 6:35 pm

    Shannon, maybe your heart knew it wasn’t the right time to be exclusive with him. Maybe there were experiences and insights and healing you both needed to have first. Maybe he will come back and your heart will tell you it’s time to give him a chance with exclusivity. I don’t believe you messed up. <3

  97.  #97Simply Shannon on January 11, 2011 at 6:42 pm

    Thank you Lucy. That felt good to read. I trust my intuition about him for now but I do miss him or at least the idea of him. Who knows.

    I get what you’re saying about CD though. The purpose is to heal myself and not feel stuck. Once I do this then anything is possible. Even exclusivity if it felt right to me.

    With Mr. Manly Man, it feels bad, like a stubborn thing. You do this my way or nothing.

    Interesting because I just chatted with a fella who was pushing me to meet him tonight, here at my house. My words were “I don’t want to feel pressured. Feels weird to hear I have to do this on certain terms.” Then he sort of acquiesced and agreed to talk on the phone first. We’ll see.

    Maybe it’s time to heal this trigger. 🙂

  98.  #98Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Sweetpea, did you read what Rori wrote on the other thread (to Jim)? It’s not black and white. I wrote some of my personal experiences on that thread too that clarify the issue for me.

  99.  #99Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 6:55 pm


    I did read what Rori wrote to Jim and assumed that’s what you were referring to as well. I’ll go read it again and see what you wrote as well.


  100.  #100Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 7:00 pm

    Shannon, can you identify the emotion that you feel when a guy pressures you to do things his way? And does it connect with an old memory or childhood experience that felt that way? Then you can feel it to heal it, and let it go and it will stop showing up in your world. Just an idea – that’s what I do with stuff like that. 🙂

  101.  #101LonePlum on January 11, 2011 at 7:02 pm

    I feel delighted to read your post, Evan, thank you so much.

    I’ve enjoyed your videos and letters and some of your articles on your blog. I have pasted the links to them quite often.
    I always put links or paste texts to make sure to not misquote
    Besides, each reader gives a different meaning to a same text, it is always better to simply paste them.

    I did think I should search your link today, with the story, but I had no more time so I wrote quick about my confusion ie the letter I did paste.

    I am sincere when I say I feel confused.
    There is no judgment, I just can’t get my finger on what it is I don’t understand.
    I really feel confused.

    I’ll try to transform , then

    You say
    ***Personally, I feel that once a guy wants to commit to you, you have two reasonable choices: commit to him and give an exclusive relationship a shot, or let him go find a woman who WILL commit to him. It’s the EXACT same thing I’d tell a man who was “using” you while “circular dating” himself – let her go!***

    yes yes yes 🙂
    We are speaking commitment.
    I have written somewhere on this blog that once I am engaged to a man I will stop dating strangers; I will keep a healthy life, meeting real friends and all, but no more online dating stuff.

    My confusion comes from commitment happening after 3 dates only, in your e letter.

    I do see and have always seen why it is the same from a man’s point of view than from a woman’s point of view when it comes to being kept handy.
    Yet, to keep Cdating after 3 dates does not feel like keeping a man handy.

    I feel destabilized
    I am now doubting myself.
    Am I abusing a man when I give him a chance to grow on me?
    Do I have to send him off after 3 dates if there is no sparkles?
    What if after a few more dates my fears or judgments vanish and I feel good with him?
    The real “feel good” type of feeling, not the sparkles type.
    What if he is a hidden gem?
    I feel confused
    Please help, whomever see what it is I don’t get.
    I don’t seem to be able to put the pieces together, today.

    OK I go on

    When a man comes on me strong, tells me he wants a relationship with me, makes me stop my dating, makes love to me, and then becomes on and off and vanishes, I feel abuse
    lol not going to happen now, but I got that one souvenir lol

    When I am not sure I am attracted to a man, yet I give us a chance as dates for a while… Does he feel used when he is not finding the door to my heart and he eventually feels he should court somebody else?

    Haaaaaaaaa there is my confusion
    I think I found it!
    It is not the same in my heart and I could not see it
    I intellectually thought it was the same.

    But no, the feeling is different

    re the date I am not sure to click with but I feel it is worth giving a chance
    He calls when he wants and because he wants
    He plans dates when he wants and if he wants
    He does what he wants I am never trying to convince him, I am not even putting in his head the need to see me, because I am not the one who invites.
    If he does not like my hesitation, he can stop seeing me; I am not trying to convince him at all, I let him do what he wants
    I don’t touch him, I don’t push us into having sex, I respect his physical boundaries I don’t play with them to arouse him.
    I do not lie to him, I do not say I want a relationship with him.
    He can leave any time
    He could court another woman
    I tell him I need time to get used to him
    I like getting to know him and I don’t know what will I feel when I know him better.
    I don’t lie, I don’t tell him I want him.
    I don’t contact him to make him mine.
    I don’t call him to make him go out of his way towards mine
    He goes the way he chooses to go
    He chooses his prey and he is doing his male job.
    He likes doing his male job, no matter the outcome.
    It is his hunt party, not mine
    If he does not catch me, he will keep healthy, and hunt another deer.

    We are dates, not lovers
    And it stops as soon as he wants it to stop. As soon as he feels he is not progressing into my heart, his hunt party gets boring, his fun is gone. He looks for a new deer.
    My integrity is intact. I was hoping he would catch me. I gave us a chance.

    Re a man who comes on me strong and catch me
    he is telling me he wants me and I believe him
    he is the one who calls and asks me to change my evenings to meet him.
    I do not take the decision from within me to have him fill my evenings and week ends
    He wants to, he plans things so he can fill them.
    He is the one who plays the music and makes me dance to the point it can become a drug if he phones every night and meet me every day or almost.
    He is the one who takes the decision for us to become sexual.
    He is the one who takes the decision to may be create a baby if there should be an accident
    I have the power to say no, or I can accept but he creates the circumstances
    I am not the one creating the relationship, I follow his rhythm
    I accept the relationship he is creating and I believe in it because he pursues me strongly.
    There is no reason I should not believe he wants me when he says he wants me, when he calls every night and goes out of his way to come towards mine.
    He is free to go and capture another deer, but he wants me.
    It is his hunt party, not mine and I get captured.

    When he vanishes I feel withdrawal symptoms from habits he created, and I feel lied to.
    He goes hunt a new deer while I am left captured but with no hunter.

    The guilt is gone again
    I am not trying to agree or not
    I would never be able to say what is best
    I felt sincerely confused by that equality thing and by that commitment after 3 dates
    After transforming, my feelings are clearer
    They might change again, but for now they are much clearer.

    Thanks a lot


  102.  #102Lisi on January 11, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    74: Sweetpea says:

    Would it serve me to go ahead and be exclusive so long as the relationship is moving forward? And then start CDing again only if he stalls, much like you did many years ago with your husband?

    It makes sense to me that I’d get to deal with some of my deeper intimacy issues if I was in a deeper relationship since CDing seems so much more shallow and just dealing with surface stuff.


    I want to answer that I think CDing is, in fact, the opposite of shallow. For the first time in my life, I’m confronting and abolishing the “not good enough” voice I’ve kept in my head. Through CD-ing, I no longer look at the potential new man with my head down and my fur flat and my tail between my legs like a lower value wolf, but stand fully erect, both physically and emotionally — alpha female.

    That is NOT surface. That is a life changer.

    I feel attractive, and it shows. I went to a restaurant with a friend recently, and had the manager hanging around our booth wanting more of my energy. She told me I needed to get his number — but I wasn’t interested. I was just enjoying the energy exchange.

    I didn’t used to have experiences like that.

    The hot/cold guy is pursuing now. Where will it go?

    Unknown. And I’m not stressing about it, or him, the way I used to.

    I keep seeing myself CROSSING THE BRIDGE. Men come, men go — but I am crossing the bridge to my forever — my happily ever after.

    And, as I do so — the groom will arrive and cross it with me. My job is to let go of the outcome with each individual relationship and allow it to occur as it naturally unfolds.

  103.  #103Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 7:08 pm

    It feels SO GOOD to be warm, dry, and comfortable at home when it’s snowing out! It took me over a year and a move in order to get comfortable with being home again. I had so many memories of Ryan at my home that when he first broke up with me I could barely stand to be home. I’m really finding a balance now.

  104.  #104Soul Sista on January 11, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    brenda HUG

  105.  #105Lisi on January 11, 2011 at 7:13 pm

    Oh, and, as for what to do about the ones we feel uncomfortable about:

    As women, we’re so used to keeping everyone happy, placating, not thinking about our needs — that we allow guys to stick around even if it makes us uncomfortable.

    We don’t want to be “mean.”

    Recently, I had a date with Hot New Age Guy. I actually like New Age thought a lot – but this guy is in a space where he’s REALLY needy and clingy.

    He was ready to commit that we’ve spent past lives together, and had a life-long connection, and would spend future lives together — all on the first date.

    He came on like a TON OF BRICKS.

    I was totally turned off. Didn’t matter how good looking, or nice or accomplished he was. I was uncomfortable and didn’t want to have anything to do with him.

    So — I didn’t. I arranged my email so that his emails go straight to junk, sent his calls straight to voice mail, and then deleted them without listening.

    I am not willing to dedicate my precious resources of time, energy and feelings to propping up whatever is the cause of his misery.

    I don’t want to have a long conversation about why I don’t want to have a long conversation.

    The old me would have tried to help him change his behavior — but I’m not his therapist. He can talk to his friends. I’m sure they can see what he’s doing. I’m not his higher power. I left him in the hands of God — without trying to intervene because, of course, no one on the planet can do it without me.

    I out-sourced him. He’ll get well. Or not.

    I guess that’s really the lesson of CD-ing. They’ll commit. Or not.

    Instead of trying to fix/change/heal Guy A — I’m delegating their spiritual process back to them. All of them.

    And the guy who sticks with me is going to be in charge of his own spiritual process — not looking for me to be his mamma.

    A rant — but — there ya go.

  106.  #106Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 7:14 pm


    RE: #101 – How powerful! That’s wonderful!

  107.  #107Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 7:17 pm


    RE: #104 – Go on, Siren! I’m taking notes! 😆

  108.  #108Katarina Phang on January 11, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    Brens, you got it. I materialized out of thin air. 🙂 You know me too damn well, girlfriend.

  109.  #109Simply Shannon on January 11, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    Plum, your posts are treasures. Truly. I feel in awe.

    Brenda, Hooray for feeling comfortable in your home! That felt really good to read.

    Lucy, you hit the nail on the head. Wow. The memory is of me and my dad. Him pushing me to do things his way. Not in an over the top pushy show but it was just known that we’d do things “his way”. Actually this brings to mind our first fight or more like the first time I ever told him what I thought. I was in high school, maybe a senior. Up until that point, I don’t think I ever stood up to him. I think we were talking about colleges. I remember crying (which happens pretty much whenever I feel angry and have to speak about it out loud). I’m pretty certain whatever I was saying was NOT my feelings. Just my attempt at coming up with a solution. Hmmm… this feels interesting. I feel better voicing my feelings and letting a man lead. I feel okay with that as long as he’s not crossing my boundaries. I trust my dad and yet I trust me too. I do feel resistance when a man pushes and pushes and pushes and doesn’t listen to my feelings. Kind of like this guy tonight. Ugh. Now I don’t want to talk to him. Maybe I won’t. Lalala.

  110.  #110Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 7:25 pm


    RE: #107 – ROFL! 😆 I was just looking at candy cane dildos and cockstar male enhancer! LOL!

  111.  #111Simply Shannon on January 11, 2011 at 7:26 pm

    Lisi, that felt wonderful to read! Yes! I did the same thing with Mr. Fab Kisser last year. Gave his spiritual journey back to him. Spent way too much of my time trying to pull him down that road.

    I love getting affirmations for CDing. The other insight is that WOMEN do the same thing when we agree to be exclusive so soon. A man should question US, wonder how safe and healthy WE are, when we’re jumping into exclusivity before we get to know them really. This was ME for most of my life.

  112.  #112Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 7:39 pm

    Lisi, I took Sweetpea’s statements to mean that the *Relationships* with CD’s are not as deep and intimate as they can be when we become exclusive. That’s the part that is somewhat surfacy – the relationships with the men. The therapeutic aspect – our relationship with Ourselves and our opening ourselves to men and healing our blocks – is the deep part of CDing.

  113.  #113Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 7:43 pm


    Happy to hear CDing is working for you. Guess maybe I’m doing it wrong because I find that I’ve experienced some minor healing, and it is, indeed helping with my confidence, but, it hasn’t gotten me to deeper healing.

  114.  #114Meemee on January 11, 2011 at 7:50 pm

    Good morning. I had a great night out with 2 of my female friends. Great company. Great food. I loved it.
    Yesterday Chocolate man invited me for a party at his house. X was also invited. I did not go. These day I see chocolate man becoming friends with X and his girl friends. He does not know what happened between me and X. Even if he knows, that should not stop him from being friends with X and co. But I feel very reserved when I talk to Chocolate man these days.
    He invited me twice. I did not know whether X will be there for the party. So I waited till I got the confirmation. Chocolate man was upset with me that I didnt go for the party after constant invitations from him.
    He hangs around a lot with X and his girlfriends these days and I feel very skeptical when he comes and spends time with me. I cant tell him the reason.
    How do I deal with it?

  115.  #115Simply Shannon on January 11, 2011 at 7:53 pm

    Meemee, Why not tell him the truth? Maybe this is your moment to end the secrecy. It might feel liberating. Scary but liberating.

  116.  #116Meemee on January 11, 2011 at 8:07 pm

    RE 114
    It feels scary. The power position X holds is huge. and he will say and do anything to save his skin. I will feel all the more hurt if he does something nasty.

  117.  #117Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 8:14 pm


    Re #111 – you’re exactly right. I feel like I was abandoned just when I was starting to make my way out into the world. I wasn’t, exactly, but that’s how it feels and thus I have pretty severe fear of abandonment. It’s one of the main things and want and need healed, but it doesn’t rear its ugly little head until I’m deeply involved enough with a man to fear the loss. CDing just isn’t getting to that for me.

    It’s easy for me to walk away from CDs or let them walk away from me, so that part at least, I’m doing right. Once I start getting more involved though, the ugly little fear of abandonment shows up and totally screws me up. I become a mess and I want that healed more than just about anything else in the world.

  118.  #118Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 9:07 pm


    RE: #113 – WHY can’t you tell Chocolate Man? Why the heck not? Will X cut you? Will he murder you? Who cares what X thinks or feels! This is about YOUR healing and wellbeing. How liberating would it be to just share his sacred secret with whoever you feel like? Quit letting that !@#$%!@#$% control you!

  119.  #119Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 9:08 pm


    Just read your exchange with Shannon. Let the chips fall where they may! You don’t work there after this month. Who cares??? Be free! The cage door is open! Fly, little pixie!

  120.  #120Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 9:10 pm


    I feel like crying when you write how much you want to be healed of your fear of abandonment. I feel your pain. How I wish I could fix it!

  121.  #121Sweetpea on January 11, 2011 at 9:26 pm


    Thank you. How I wish I knew how to heal it. I’m not sure CDing is the answer on this one, but…something’s got to be.

  122.  #122life_is_too_short_to... on January 11, 2011 at 9:28 pm

    Hi Brenda,
    I feel glad that you like the poem, and also that you are feeling happy and productive.

  123.  #123Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    Hi Life! Thanks!

  124.  #124Rori Raye on January 11, 2011 at 9:42 pm

    Sammie, welcome, and after the ebook – which is the essential basic – Targeting is the program for you right now. Chemistry is simple. It matters for him – it doesn’t matter for you. Chemistry can GROW for you – but a man won’t give that a chance. He either feels it or he doesn’t. Wooing a man is pointless most of the time. Love, Rori

  125.  #125Jim on January 11, 2011 at 9:48 pm


    Elvis has not left the building, been busy though.


    Read your post, actually the 2 with my name on them.
    I’ll get back to you. Get your guns out lady…! 🙂

    i see Mr.Katz came by for a visit,

    Before I go, ladies,
    I AM NOT A LIFE OR RELATIONSHIP COACH. Most here give advice and comment. As for the judging? Rori, you really need to be specific on that one. Maybe what your really saying is, “WE KNOW YOU JUDGE, JUST DON’T CONDEMN. We all judge, though, true, we don’t need to condemn.

    Like I said, I’ll get back to my favorite BLOG soon.

    Brenda, HI !! 🙂
    All the other ladies, SVL, Sweetpea, Shannon, Meemee, SS, Lisi, Loneplum, Lucy, Daria and anyone else I may have missed. HI, I hope your ALL having a fine day & feeling well.


  126.  #126Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    @100: LonePlum says:

    Hello, LonePlum. It’s been a long and joyous day but I finally got around to reading the EMK newsletter even though it’s midnight.

    I read it several times, then I got a coffee, knowing I won’t be able to sleep, because I was hoping the caffeine would help. I still don’t get it.

    To be sure, I’m looking at things from my perspective as they would apply to my own situation. But on the other hand is there not some
    implied universality to this “the way things should be” concept?

    This is the way you got it but LonePlum this is not working for me and I’m not even sure you “got it” either:

    “…He is free to go and capture another deer, but he wants me.
    It is his hunt party, not mine and I get captured.
    When he vanishes I feel withdrawal symptoms from habits he created,
    and I feel lied to.
    He goes hunt a new deer while I am left captured but with no hunter.
    The guilt is gone again
    I am not trying to agree or not
    I would never be able to say what is best
    I felt sincerely confused by that equality thing and by that commitment after 3 dates
    After transforming, my feelings are clearer
    They might change again, but for now they are much clearer.
    Thanks a lot


    I had to “break it down”…from my own point of view of course…and I’m hoping I won’t be attacked too badly…I’m sensitive…I’m bracing myself…

    This is what I saw, several times…and what it meant to me, just to me.

    1)Tara, 39, went out with Ted three times.
    2)Ted made it clear that he wanted to be her boyfriend.
    3)Even though she wants to be married one day and this man is on board – Tara just couldn’t help but feel that she needed more time being single.
    4) “More time than 39 years?” I asked.
    5)”Tara’s proclamation sounds eerily like the thoughts of the man who played with your heart at the top of the email….”
    6)”First, realize that men and women are no different.”
    7)”And you know that the guy who is casually “seeing” you once a week for three months NEVER becomes your husband. ”

    Thinking it over:

    1)Tara, 39, went out with Ted three times.
    First off, I’m 59 plus (and that’s being very generous with the rounding off) so I’m not in a hurry to marry and reproduce; I’ve already done that. EMK I think does not encourage “coffee” dates but I’m thinking I’d like my first date or two be just that.

    So this means that after three dates I’ve known my stranger “Ted” for about nine hours @ three hours per date, give or take some emails and an hour or so of telephone conversation. That’s no long, for me.

    2)Ted made it clear that he wanted to be her boyfriend.
    What did he mean by that? Does this mean he wanted exclusive right, after the nine hours, to socialize with me? What else is suppose to happen because I don’t know, if after only nine hours, I
    want to sleep with this “stranger” and make him the center of my social life. Do I? I mean, I know my particular pool of guys is way shallow, so then am I supposed to be grateful for the offer?

    3)Even though she wants to be married one day and this man is on board – Tara just couldn’t help but feel that she needed more time being single.
    How do I know he’s on board? Is saying he wants to be my “boyfriend” a kind of “engagement ?” Do I have to rush, rush, rush to make up my mind on the spot? This seems like some sort of “instant and imaginery relationship.” Isn’t this what guys order up from hookers, women they don’t know, the TGE “total girlfriend experience?”

    4) “More time than 39 years?” I asked.
    No, more like nine hours. I’m thinking I might be good for a few more years, even at 59 plus.

    5)“Tara’s proclamation sounds eerily like the thoughts of the man who played with your heart at the top of the email….”
    If a man declined the nine hour invitation would he be playing with a woman’s heart? I thought about that and concluded:

    If some man, say my divorced brother, told me a woman he met was demanding, after nine hours, that he must decide she was to be his next bride and he wasn’t so sure, I would not think *he* was playing with that woman’s heart if he only wanted to get to know her, take her to dinner and dancing and generally have a good time for a few months. No, I’d think he’s respectful and not out of his mind.

    6)“First, realize that men and women are no different.”
    I’m not for sure about this. I know expectations of behavior sure are. I saw EMK telling women to stand with big smiles on their faces, hold out their arms and “do nothing.” [maybe holding out arms was metaphor…but still…]

    Does this mean my man Ted is expected to “do nothing?” Call me crazy but I those are not my expectations.

    7)“And you know that the guy who is casually “seeing” you once a week for three months NEVER becomes your husband. “
    Well, maybe not but perhaps he’s no more “never becomes your husband” than the guy who is in a relationship with a woman for one, two, four, eight years, boinking her every night [after two years maybe not boinking every night…] and still doesn’t become a husband even though the woman wants him to be. There are lots of stories like that right here on the blog.

    LonePlum, if Ted the “hunter man” wanted to snatch this deer (me) up from my world, intimately inspect me until such time he was finished and then toss me back out into the forest, I’d feel, feel like I’d undergone one of those “alien abduction inspections” that happen when a UFO descends upon the unwary driving late at night on New Mexico back roads.

    LonePlum, this is not going to work for me. I’m expecting some ugly remarks are immediately going to fly my way from posters since my way of life is in disagreement with a famous man such as Evan Marc Katz.

    I’ll keep toddling along, I suppose all by my lonesome…since I do not agree. I no longer feel doomed because I’m not feminine so I think I will survive.

    P.S. I just looked at what I wrote trying hard not to leave a calamitous typo and upon rereading it, I think that “Equality” idea is bull pickles! Not that women aren’t equal to men, OK, I’ll say it: “we are superior!” However, as I posted earlier, we are at a disadvantage when forming sexual relationships.

    P.P.S Also, I didn’t post this earlier, but I also believe women are at some disadvantage within traditional dating customs. Staying in circulation for a length of time evens things out.

  127.  #127Sammie on January 11, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    Thanks for replying to my post on #93, Rori!

    I was just thinking about doing some EFT to help ease away from my LI. Again, he is happy to continue with things as is. It starts to feel like a fwb type of thing. And, I certainly don’t want that. I have been able to let some CD’s go. He however is more wrapped up in some other areas of my life. And, he wants to always stay in my life. I”m not sure how to stop hoping and let him go and whether I can still be friends.

    Any thoughts sirens?



  128.  #128Brenda on January 11, 2011 at 10:08 pm


    Are you being an instigator again? Am I going to have to spank you again??? :LOL:

  129.  #129LonePlum on January 11, 2011 at 10:22 pm



    I wonder what you read in my post as I am basically saying same thing as you

    The only thing where I differ is that I don’t think you or I will be attacked for thinking different from him or from anybody.
    I feel safe that the posters can say what they wish, and when it differs from me, I don’t feel it as an attack but as a new perspective that might help me 🙂

  130.  #130Jim on January 11, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    I was just heading to bed…

    LOL…!! You are funny! Tell you what. If you promise to spank me anyway. I won’t instigate.. 🙂

    Glad your in good spirits, read some of your writing about Ryan. Nice!! Me HAPPY 4U!

    Get your guns out and bring your sense of humor or you just might get triggered!!! 🙂


  131.  #131Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    i am triggered reading rori’s comment that chemistry matters for him but not for me. for some reason it triggers association with my ex’s so-called sex addiction. that feels awful. i feel angry. chemistry matters for me. i don’t want to be with a man i don’t feel chemistry with. i feel angry thinking about that. besides, didn’t evan say that he Did give chemistry a chance to grow with his wife – that it wasn’t strong for him at first? (i am not angry at rori)

  132.  #132Lucy on January 11, 2011 at 10:31 pm

    maybe it bothers me that it is acceptable for Men to be driven by chemistry but not for Women.

  133.  #133Evan Marc Katz on January 11, 2011 at 10:36 pm


    You’re being very literal here. The point of my post isn’t about the number of actual hours, but rather the intent of the man. If it makes you feel better, you can make it 7 dates over 5 weeks.

    It doesn’t change the fact that Tara was passing up the earnest, relationship-oriented suitor for a younger, hotter player…but still wants to keep him around just in case she changed her mind.

    It’s selfish when a guy does this to you.

    It’s selfish when you do it to him.

    So let the nice guy find the woman who wants to commit to him, and dump the guy who has been keeping you on the backburner for the past 7 weeks.

    Do we agree yet?


  134.  #134Jim on January 11, 2011 at 10:39 pm

    I’m not a scientist but aren’t we all driven by chemistry, men and women. and drive our own chemical changes by what we think at any given time.

    I really don’t know scientifically speaking, just my thoughts on the topic.

    I really have to sleep…. night all.

  135.  #135Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    @129 LonePlum

    I just put my jammies on and thought WTF (watch the fire…? 😆 ) I just spent an HOUR on that EMK thing, I don’t type all that fast, and I read the newsletter several times…

    I’m taking everyone’s point of view and using them to polish mine. I’m learning more about me, a lot of thing that is already there, tweaked with some new stuff.

    From one little deer to another little deer… good night 😀


  136.  #136Sammie on January 11, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    To add one more wrinkle to my story. The LI actually ended up telling me we have great chemistry! He cares about me greatly. He loves talking with me…he’s just not “in love” with me! Hmmmmmm


  137.  #137Sammie on January 11, 2011 at 10:44 pm


    If you have any thoughts for me I’d greatly appreciate it!


  138.  #138Leo on January 11, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    Hi there ladies!

    Hope you all have been fine and enjoying yourself.

    A friend of mine said the best sentence 2 days ago…
    Even when you need to study, or work hard – dont forget and LIVE and LOVE and LAUGH.

    I am pretty stressed out and drained and I dont know for how much more longer I will be able to “fight”. I have an fu**ing important exam on friday and I just feel so shity. Could start crying any moment.
    My man is great…stepping up big time. And me not contacting him, i might not hear as often from him, but WHEN….he calls or texts he is just so much more lovely. He takes care that even with his schedule and me being all day gone studying we get to talk at least once a day. And today… he even set his alarm clock at 6.30a.m. (when I was gonna leave the house short after) and called me, just for 5 minutes then went back to sleep. It felt so great! It still does!

    And he said so cute things while being all sleepy.
    He supported me cause I dont feel good right now and he said “You are such a strong woman…keep on fighting, Love!”

    I feel so great about him and i am looking forward to the weekend with him.
    I would much rather really enjoy the time with him than study all day and feel shity.

    Hope you are great, girls!


  139.  #139Senior Lady Vibe on January 11, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    @133: Evan Marc Katz says:

    “It doesn’t change the fact that Tara was passing up the earnest, relationship-oriented suitor for a younger, hotter player…but still wants to keep him around just in case she changed her mind. ..”

    What younger, hotter player…? I missed something here. My impression was that she was willing to continue dating but only opting out due to pressure for a very early exclusivity. I detected no deception.

    As for literal, there were rather a lot of actual numbers in your response.

    I could use a little selfish when the rules of engagement are against me but never wish to hurt anyone, or myself.

    So, sorry Evan…we don’t quite agree, close…and i love your work…but there is a space between us at the moment..

    Thanks for the newsletters and…I’m reading your book. I have great expectations for this year and next.

    All the best,


  140.  #140life_is_too_short_to... on January 11, 2011 at 10:55 pm

    EMK wrote in part:

    “The story of how I was dating two women and dropped them like a hot potato for the one I liked best is TRUE. However, that was NOT my wife. In fact, the woman whom I immediately committed to DUMPED me about 6 weeks later. Just goes to show you how blind people can be when they think they “just know”.

    No, the oft-told story of my wife is the complete OPPOSITE. I was never over-the-moon about her. I saw her once a week for about 4 weeks before stepping up and asking for a commitment. And throughout our entire 16 month courtship, I was still ambivalent because I didn’t feel what I thought I should feel. This, to me, is an important teaching tool – to use your brains as much as you use your heart. It’s great to say, “follow your heart”, but take a look at the past at all the times you followed it. Yeah. That’s what I’m talking about.”

    So cool to see EMK write on the blog!
    I love his down to earth advice, and read all his emails.

    I find what he wrote above to be so true,
    in my experience.

    The guys who I fell head over heels like a ton of bricks for, the charismatic bad boy type, were always ultimately unavailable to me, unwilling to commit, for some reason. (duh!)

    And it’s interesting that they always somehow made me feel inadequate, like I was never quite good enough. Wow, did that ever feel icky!

    The guys who were really into me, good catches, just as funny, savvy, not boring, good jobs…I wanted nothing to do with. I was thinking about them recently, in a new light, post-Rori, Evan, Bob Grant tools.

    Three of them would have married me, and two probably would have been very good stepdads too.

    I just didnt feel about them how I thought I should feel, all smitten and doe-eyed like Olive Oyl– “Oh, Popeye!”

    I chalk this disconnect up to not knowing my a^^ from my elbow after a bitter divorce ending an emotionally abusive marriage, which left me depressed and filled with anxiety and not feeling very good about myself because of course, it was all my fault,

    therefore, there was no way I wanted to belong to any club (nice guys) that would have me as a member.

    I know that just the other day on this blog I was saying how much I wanted to be adored and cherished, etc., but it finally dawned on me that I no longer have to feel the way I think I should feel,
    swooning and high, obsessed and adoring

    I realized that I actually want to be romanced less than I want a committed partner and companion with whom I share values with, someone who I know I can count on to have my back, and I theirs, and we just want to be more intimate on all levels with each other than with any other…. but I don’t need to be put on a pedestal.

    It feels great not to be run by those programs.

    I still think it is important to have a high degree of difficulty, but that just naturally comes along with a high self esteem and having good boundaries and integrity and authenticity, not to play hard to get, or be high maintenance.

    I’m finally now willing to risk being intimate while fully knowing that it may not last, because nothing in life does last forever. There is no object or experience, not even a beloved devoted loyal husband, that can provide permanent, lasting, constant happiness, nor can he complete me or make me feel whole.

    I’m continuing to see more and more that I already am whole and complete, but that a great man would be a really sublime addition in many, many ways, not just romance!

  141.  #141life_is_too_short_to... on January 11, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    125 Hey Jim,
    This is for you:

    So What? Who Cares?


    (I’m not trying to antagonize or trigger you, just kidding around).

  142.  #142Evan Marc Katz on January 11, 2011 at 11:08 pm


    She wasn’t opting out due to pressure. That’s the way you read it. He was willing to wait for her as long as it took for her to figure it out – the same way women are willing to sleep with men for six months without a commitment. Tara was USING Ted and that’s why I told her to get rid of him.

    And, since I just spoke to her yesterday, she feels great about breaking up with Ted, but not so strong about the next guy she chose – a younger, more unpredictable man who thinks texting is all it takes to stay in touch, and who only hangs out with her in groups. She will quickly see that even if Ted was the wrong guy, it’s the guys LIKE Ted that are the keepers.

    If you’re reading anything else into my email, it’s being shaded by your own personal experience. Because this Tara/Ted thing is almost as black and white as it gets. Choose the guy who wants to be your boyfriend instead of the one who doesn’t.

    How’s that for a rallying cry, Rori fans?

  143.  #143Nancy on January 11, 2011 at 11:50 pm

    @LP #101

    I love this post, LP. I had the same momentary confusion after reading Evan’s email today and wondered if I was being unfair to my CD who talked about marriage on our first date. I continue to see him, exactly as you describe, being very careful not to take advantage of or abuse him. He told me he has made a decision to utilize (not the same as use) me as someone to go to dinner with and do fun things with until something might develop, or not. It seems like he is taking care of himself and I myself and we enjoy our dates. I have no way of knowing if he will actually decide he wants to marry me. I don’t know yet if he is right for me.
    I think there is a difference between having your cake and eating it, too and sincerely wanting to follow a connection with a man to see what might develop and in order to learn about ourselves. He treats me very well. I appreciate him for it. Do I not feel a huge spark because he is different from my unhealthy patterns of the past? If so, I want to find out and make a different choice than I have in the past. How can I explore and learn this if I send him away? He says he knows he is the best, because no one will treat me better than he does. He feels confident in competing with other dates I might have.
    We CD in order to keep ourselves feeling strong and balanced. We do it in order to avoid falling into the pit of eroded self esteem and anxiety that comes with locking onto one man and waiting for him to make up his mind about us.
    If the day comes when a man I trust and want enters my life and my heart and puts marriage solidly on the table (even without a ring I will feel it) then yes, I’ll be exclusive with him. In a heart beat. But to be exclusive while I’m wondering where it’s going to go? No. Not again. Not for me.

  144.  #144Beedubya on January 12, 2011 at 1:39 am

    I haven’t been on this site for MONTHS, but just wanted to wish all of you Sirens A Very Happy New Year 2011. Hope you are all doing well and find the man of your dreams this year.

    I am moving back to England in just over 6 weeks time and I know if it wasn’t for RR and her method of getting into your FEELINGS this would have not happened for me. Obviously it’s not the reason I bought the e book or the DVD’s LOL but still and all they have had a very positive result in my life.

    Maybe my man is just waiting for me over there in lil ol’ England 🙂

    Take care ladies.

  145.  #145LonePlum on January 12, 2011 at 1:53 am

    SLV 135

    Lol I better clear my post. I think you read it the way around 🙂

    I was re taking Evan examples from his *original* e letter
    On one hand the e letter shows a woman who needs more time. Ted had done nothing yet, to win her attraction and her trust. Anybody can act a certain way during 3 dates. It is the man’s job to keep courting the woman and to make her want him before she decides anything.

    On the other hand the letter refers to the typical player who takes a woman to bed and then gives her crumbs whenever his other dates allow him some free time

    Evan compares both situations as if they were equal situations
    At first read I thought “yes we should be fair and treat others as we want to be treated”
    And I felt confused, as I said, hoping somebody would show me why.

    Then I receive Evan’s answer and still I feel confused and I don’t know why
    and I think “why not try to transform and see where it takes me?”
    So, in the second post I take experiences of my own life that correspond to both Evan’s examples and I transform

    Writing what I feel as I go through each experience I discover where the flaw is, and why I was so confused.

    The confusion comes from that two incomparable situations were compared and on top were shown as equal.

    The other point being that suddenly we are asked to commit after 3 dates and to a man who does not commit, who only says “I want to be your boy friend”
    How do we know the value of his words?
    And why does he want to be our boy friend before he even gets to know us well?
    Basically you and I agree

    The thing is you got my own examples upside down, I think lol
    I gave two examples:

    ***When a man comes on me strong, tells me he wants a relationship with me, makes me stop my dating, makes love to me, and then becomes on and off and vanishes, I feel abuse
    lol not going to happen now, but I got that one souvenir lol

    When I am not sure I am attracted to a man, yet I give us a chance as dates for a while… Does he feel used when he is not finding the door to my heart and he eventually feels he should court somebody else?***

    The man who comes on me strong in my example would be the player in Evan’s letter

    The guy I am not sure I am attracted to in my example would be Ted in Evan’s letter

    From there I transform
    First transformation is with Ted if I Cdate him

    Second transfo is with the player without Cdating
    it is the player who gets the deer and waste her, not Ted.

    And at the end of the post, it is me who does not feel guilty for Cdating Ted, because I see I am doing no harm to him at all.
    In both cases I am only the prey, I can not possibly harm any.

    Anyhow, I see that in each new post Evan gives more info about his client and Ted
    Which changes the whole story from the original e letter
    Anything I wrote is about the original content of the letter and nothing else

    Now, with the new infos about Ted, I feel desperate because she dumped Ted.
    If he was willing to woe her as long as she needed, she should have given herself the chance to Cdate him along with the younger.
    Both men would have been simple dates, taking time to get to know them.
    She might have ended liking Ted a lot and accepting his courtship and dumping the younger.
    Ted and the Lady would have BOTH felt happy in the end, and even gotten married, who knows?
    It is not a question of fairness but of happiness.

    If it was obvious that the younger was going to dump her or deceive her, why was she advised to dump the good guy?
    She paid to be advised to get her happiness, not to protect Ted.
    Or is Ted also a client?

    I feel punished
    Like if she wanted to meet a wrong guy so she was punished and forbidden to keep the good one

    She was advised to chose when the good guy himself was not asking her to chose.
    He understood her and was willing to give her time. It was nobody else’s business but hers and Ted’s.

    My romantic side wishes Ted will call her next month 😉
    I want him to have a chance to fight his own fight
    We never know…


  146.  #146Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 3:11 am


    Now that’s a good boy! 😆

    Hugs, Brenda

  147.  #147Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 3:21 am


    I was tossing and turning most of the night, and thinking a lot about your situation with X. I feel so much anger over that.

    So, since I’m learning that these things are triggers in my own life, I asked myself why…I guess it’s just a compilation of relationships I’ve had over the years where a man was not considering my feelings, just running over my heart with his combat boots only thinking about his own feelings.

    If I had to narrow it down to one situation, it’s probably how controlled I felt with my father. There was no secrecy issue, but an unspoken rule that I had no right to speak my thoughts and feelings.

    When I was working on my own inner healing in my 20s, I started stating my thoughts and feelings. I literally trembled when I did. And it led to much healing. I gradually found healing inside. And in my case, I am so thankful that I found much healing in my relationship with my Dad.

    I felt my self-worth in my RIGHT to speak my truth. I feel. I think. I know. I matter.

  148.  #148Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 3:45 am

    Thanks for sharing this.
    I remember in my Sunday church classes I was taught “truth will set you free”.
    I want to feel free.
    I am trying to be true to my emotions. But when I feel confused I lack clarity.
    For example, I feel things like a fruit salad. I cant distinguish one from the other.
    I feel anger.
    I feel bitter
    I feel resentment
    I feel sad
    I feel agitated
    I feel violated
    I feel humiliated
    I feel insulted
    I feel rejected
    I feel neglected
    I feel dismissed
    I feel cheated
    I feel many many things at the same time. I try to catch one emotion. By that time the next one comes. Then the next and the next.
    I feel confused. Because all these emotions appear the same to me. I figured out why I feel confused when I think of X. That s because when I think of him, I am full of emotions. And I try to understand those emotions not by sinking into those emotions; but by sinking into what they make me feel. I feel low. I feel restless. I feel like cracking my head. I concentrate more on the latter. This is an endless loop. I always get stuck at the “what they make me feel and do” rather than “what they authentically feel”. I seem to get stuck there.
    Am I making sense?

  149.  #149Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 3:51 am

    And I am encountering a real problem now.
    I know its over
    I am letting it go.
    But I am still making imaginary conversations with him.
    Do you know what I mean?
    There were so many things untold.
    I feel the urge to explain.
    I do not want to go to him and explain things.
    I dont want to go anywhere near to him.
    So I do this imaginary conversation in which I picture myself as verbalizing all that were denied to me.
    And I picture him as listening to me.
    At times I go crazy when I do that. But I end up doing this more than once a day.
    Sometimes I sit and work and I find myself mumbling things, talking aloud at times, and I am talking things that were not given a chance to be talked when I was with him.
    I dont know whether that will help healing or hinder it.
    Anyone done the same? or am I really going crazy?
    Healing is a difficult process. and some feelings are hard to process. 🙁 🙁

  150.  #150Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 3:53 am

    Is it normal to do so?
    Or is it indicative that I am still giving him too much importance?

  151.  #151marina on January 12, 2011 at 4:10 am

    Hi Meemee,
    Hmm,I don’t think it is crazy, I do this a lot too.
    For me it helps to write these conversations down.

    Also, when I really sink into my soup,or in your case, fruit salad of feelings and feel them all, at the same time, or one after the other, really feeling them without worrying what they do to me, I quickly feel much better and can let go of them. It is like I accepted them and myself and gave them the attention they needed and then they go away.


  152.  #152marina on January 12, 2011 at 4:13 am

    I used to get very angry and fearful and wanted to run and hide from my yucky feelings, wanted to do something about it, didn’t want them to be there, I did not accept them and my mind would go crazy.

    But I have now discovered that it works for me to just sit still and feel them all. Riffing works great for me too.

  153.  #153marina on January 12, 2011 at 4:15 am

    Meemee,I think that this is very important.

    I don’t think this is about him or about not letting him go.

    This is about you and what you want from a relationship.

  154.  #154Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 4:47 am


    That is some very deep pain you are dealing with. No, you are totally normal. You are not going crazy at all. I can relate a lot in the feelings I was processing about Ryan. I found progress and healing within a day after this post from Rosa recently:

    Brenda @110

    I understand this feeling. This was me .
    I posted a long one for you last thread , heres another.
    I feel bad that you are crying out for help and so I am offering some techniques of thinking to use on yourself. These thoughts are straight up , they are sent with love, you may not like them, but if you want change, here it is…

    This is an addiction .
    This is a habit which is harming you .
    You are addicted to feeling bad. You are a pining addict.

    Your brain is running loops that are self destructive .
    “He left me”
    ” I dont want to live without him”
    etc etc ..you will know what the thoughts are that trigger the emotion of loss, pain, hurt, fear etcc and the tears. The loop will be so habitual you will be able to state it clearly , in thoughts then emotions then actions- Here is a theoretical example.

    I think- I am alone
    I think – I am so lonely
    I think – I am lonely because he left me
    i think-I love him so much
    I think – He doesnt want me
    I think – My chest is a gaping hole


    I do- nothing (inertia)- stay in bed
    I do- go to refrigerator
    I do – grab phone and text
    I do – call and corner him

    1. make a list of your common thought triggers IN WRITING.

    2. every time you hear one in your head or see a pic of him in your head or you recall feeling sad etc.,.do the following.
    -lift your eyes up to the right.
    -see a BIG RED STOP SIGN,. hold your eyes up right and count to 5.

    3. Talk to yourself along these lines
    -its ok if a thought of ryan comes , its only a thought, it is a little loop in my brain and I have let it run too often so it is a cracked record. BUT I can just let it run. Its only a thought. i dont have to DO anything. I dont have to FEEL anyway particularly .
    I dont have to cry and I dont have to eat .

    4. If you have an urge to cry or wail or eat or pine or LOOP AROUND , remind yourself you are blocking your future good and happiness and do something else..i usually jump up and down or flap both hands wildly or yell EEEEEEEE . I DO SOMETHING ELSE.

    5. When I do something else I break up the loop.
    Note – this does NOT remove good memories or change love feelings. it stops the secondary negative looping and sadness which is now a habit.

    6. You cant let go because you dont want to . I suspect you get satisfaction from the loop running in your brain like a smoker or a junkie gets satisfaction when the “I must light up now” loop is satisfied even if its killing them .
    When you want to you will start to recognise a loop when it starts . You will say ” Hi thought!!!~ i love my ‘ I love Ryan” thought but I am busy painting my nails just now and thinking of flowers or recipes or ANYTHING ELSE .I dont wish to have a downhill feel bad spiral which will end in tears . I choose to smile and sing Yankee Doodle!

    further tricks

    1. Identify all your metaphors – the giant gaping hole in your chest one is highly toxic and could well lead to physical illness. It causes a marvelous negative feel bad feeling though , doesnt it?
    GET RID OF IT. And any others that are dark or dangerous.

    2. put bright pictures and metaphors in your words and in sounds you hear in your head,and in pictures you give yourself, eg , see a lovely bright pink heart in your chest radiating out sparkling light all around , as it radiates out it gets brighter and brighter until you giggle.. if a song in your head reminds you of R, say ” nice song’ i choose now to sing “jingle Bells”and DO IT !

    Ok This is all offering solutions which is not my role here but you wanted to know how other people have done it , so here it is with much love

  155.  #155Lorelei on January 12, 2011 at 5:50 am

    HI everyone, just dashing in and out here, but I want to tell you something about something that helps me very much at the moment.

    I wonder if it rings any bells for Brenda, Meemee and everyone else on here who is working on the different angles of letting go of an old relationships of various kinds.

    I am still working through my separation and impending divorce from a 15-year marriage, and a lot of the time it still hurts like hell. I feel lucky that I have never had the shadow of a doubt, once I had made the decision to separate (it was total agony getting there, but once I’d decided, I felt little but relief).

    And yet I’m still mourning my marriage. It is the loss of the good bits – tenderness, physical tenderness, shared jokes etc, but especially the ‘what might have been’ and the ‘what I thought I had (a reasonably happy marriage) and what I was kidding myself I had (a reasonably happy marriage.)

    I just read this:
    “We often speak of disillusionment as if it always meant disappointment. When we start a new relationship, we are enchanted – it’s as if we are literally under the spell of our new boyfriend. We don’t see faults, we see only what excites and delights us. That’s a lot of fun, but a relationship that’s built on not paying attention to the totality of a person isn’t going to survive. Becoming disenchanted can mean leaving behind the magical thinking that comes with trying to live in fantasyland. That’s not necessarily a bad thing.

    Successful dating and meaningful relationships require reality testing. We keep our eyes and hearts open for new information. We are willing to let go of illusions, including the illusion of perfection, because in the long run our happiness depends on keeping our feet on the ground.

    It’s often bittersweet to let go of illusions, and the death of some illusions may require almost as much mourning as the death of someone physically present in our lives. But an end to suffering and opening ourselves to true happiness requires us to let go of attachment to fantasy and to be willing to accept reality. ”

    John R Ballew.

    Letting go of the illusion that things were OK and could have been OK is what still tears me inside, and still hurts. And at the moment, as we start to divide up our stuff and furniture, I am often crying still I’m feeling grief for the loss of my illusions and fantasies and dreams (that he did care, might have cared, would have cared and loved and respected and even just plain liked me than he did) more than for the actual man who was my husband who hurt me repeatedly, and hurt me in ways I would never tolerate from a friend. I feel better when I read this – that is OK to still feel waves of intense grief, even while I am CDing = about which, more soon. Sorry about my haste – must dash – hope this makes sense. xx

  156.  #156marina on January 12, 2011 at 5:50 am

    LOL, Brenda, thnx for reminding, that is what I DO need to do right now.

    I am just feeling so low and do not want to go to work and loathe everything, but that is a loop and an addiction too…

    So Meemee, I hope that Brenda’s (Rosa’s) comment is helpful for you too,I saw a big shift in Brenda these last few days…:)

  157.  #157marina on January 12, 2011 at 5:59 am

    Lorelei (((Hugs)))
    what a beautiful post!

  158.  #158Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 6:23 am

    Life is to short –

    Nice poem!

  159.  #159Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 6:24 am

    Brenda – Goooood to see u! I felt a little worried you were’nt going to come back. Happy that your homeboy had a b-day text chat!

    Happy birthday!

  160.  #160Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 6:42 am

    I had a counseling session yesterday..

    I went in with the intention of forgiving my step mom. But she asked me WHY? I was thrown off.. I want to release this anger grip she has on me but, my counselor said I had alot of feelings to feel before I got there so, we are starting to naviagate them.

    Normally, I get emotional but, for some reason. As I was talking and she was asking me how I felt. After I told her I felt rejected by dad and stepmom over the holidays and got mixed messages. No contact from them but, nice gift.. very odd. It’s like I went blank. I started to question my blood sugar even. It was like I had no feeling. Then even she thought maybe I had shut down or gone numb. And then she asked me.. How this treatment from my family was different from the past. It forced me to realize it wasn’t. And I’m about to have to let them go to some degree. Becuase it’s turning into a re-victimazation situation we’re I can’t figure out what I did wrong or gain their approval. So, I’m about to have to go thru the grieving stages of these toxic relationships being over. I’m feeling nervous. But, she told me I could handle it. And then talked about the same grounding techniques Rori uses, I started having flashes of intense feelings coming up and being afraid of what it was that was going to cause those feelings to surface, So I had to re-center. I am determined to get thru this. But, it does make you feel a little tired after. Lots of emotional work.

    I know we’re starting to enter the black hole. She even commented how I normally go in looking all put together and that day I went in with no make up or hair done and work out clothes. She thought I was just being real.. And opening up. I’ve felt jump lately when I’m driving it’s the wierdest feeling but, she said that was totally normal when feelings are starting to surface.

    I really want my future to be different from my past. I want to be in a healthy relationship and not fear abandoment and be alone on Alicia Island. I just feel like being proactive about healing and changing from the inside out is the only way.

    My self esteem has improved will see what happens.

  161.  #161Jim on January 12, 2011 at 6:49 am

    140: Life_…
    If I were talking about myself and with regard to women here… I couldn’t have said this better. What a great read. Thanks for sharing.

    141: Life_…
    LOL and more LOL….!!!

    145: Brenda,
    Hugs!?!? Ok, hugs too but I still want a spanking… 🙂

    148: Meemee,
    “Anyone done the same?”
    Absolutely, me. Your not crazy, I know it feels like it at times. I thought I was when I went through it. Looking back later, I realized it was the facets and varying intensities of grief and grieving loss…

  162.  #162Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 6:52 am

    * I felt jumpey lately – not jump 🙂

  163.  #163Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 6:57 am

    Chemistry matters for women!! I believe it can grow to a degree for women. I do believe women warm up slowly.. then hot.

    But, I also believe sometimes it never gets past luke warm. I have a guy friend from the dating site.. But, he kinda seems depressed and self consious and for over a year I have always responsed to him and gone out with him and still can’t get past pecking him on the lips becuase I feel nothing more then cool with him.

    And an ex of mine.. I had chemistry with but, when it went it away there was noooooo getting it back. He could propose and I still would be turned off.

    Then there are some guys that I just say hellll no… toxic. If if I am turned on. And others that the chemistry always feels good.

  164.  #164Mercedes on January 12, 2011 at 7:18 am

    Daria: I’m very, very happy you are healing this. Really. You sound so good…and sometimes a solid cry while letting go of old feelings that are no longer of use can help with that.

    Sincerely happy for you.

    Much Love,

  165.  #165quinn99 on January 12, 2011 at 7:31 am

    Hi –
    I’m really struggling with a man that I have been dating for 3 months. I feel completely out of control – desperate – frantic and at his mercy and the mercy of my feelings. He has alot going for him career wise – he’s 51 yrs old – divorced – extremely attractive – great sense of humor – intelligent and shy. He has kept distance between us since day one. For example – we would have a great date – and he wouldn’t call for 4 or 5 days – hardly initiates us getting together and then I would. I would leave his house at 3 or 4 in the morning after a nice date – and he wouldn’t call to see that I got home ok and not call for days after. Would take me out with his friends and then really not be attentive to me so I ended up feeling hurt and alone. He really doesn’t pay for dates – speaks about having a lot of women “friends” which would make me feel worried and jealous. He resisted picking me up for dates – and I sense that he feels obligated as if he doesn’t want the responsibility for having to step up in a relationship in that way.

    Whenever we talk on the phone we almost always talk about him – what is going on is his life – his struggles. He has told me he’s depressed –and I end up feeling as if I’m taking care of him – encouraging him to find ways to feel better – propping him up. I try to talk about myself but he doesn’t seem to ask many questions but keeps the focus going back on himself.

    I have been trying to lean back – but it’s not working – he seems to distance more. A couple weeks ago we went out with his friends and he was inattentive – I felt really hurt and alone. That night I told him that I felt he ran hot and cold and he told me he was scared – and has a way of sabotaging relationships to keep himself safe and said he does not believe in soul mates. I told him that I would not be sexual without a commitment – that I am looking for a LTR. I “kind of” ended the relationships that night saying it doesn’t seem we want the same things – then called him a few days later and went back. (I was devastated – an emotional basket case – but honestly deserve an academy award for appearing non-emotional and upbeat) We have seen each other a couple times since then dancing around the topic of our relationship – and finally I brought it up again a few days ago and he told me he wants to keep things “casual” and see where it goes. He told me the things I told him the night I ended it made him want to run…

    Here is the crux of my struggle: He is shy – scared of a relationship and I am terrified too. I feel as if we have both done things (unintentionally) to sabotage our relationship out of fear. When I feel him distancing should I push past it and reach out to him? Or should I give him the distance places between us? I haven’t allowed myself to be vulnerable with him – and I put distance between us also. I fear that the more I step back – the more distance I allow to occur – the more likely our relationship will fade away. Should I be more relaxed about things – is it unreasonable for me to expect too much since we have only been dating 3 months? He is more passive and perhaps wants to be the girl in the relationship – but I want to be the girl too…

    I have been trying to date other men – but feeling appalled and hopeless. I am in love with this guy – and can’t seem to think about anything else. My self worth is in the toilet – I blame myself for sabotaging the relationship and feeling needy….At times I want to call him so bad – and sometimes I feel like to let more distance grow between us just affirms for him that I am not there – making him more scared that I will hurt him and he won’t risk anymore with me so the cycle continues….

    Seriously – I am hurting so so bad…..I have been having what I think are panic attacks from the feeling of abandonment and hopelessness….I don’t know how to cope…

    Rori – if you’re out there I could surely use your insight….

  166.  #166Mercedes on January 12, 2011 at 7:36 am

    With regard to the Tara/Ted and circular dating situation, I think it all boils down to honesty. If Ted wants more and Tara doesn’t but she’s honest with him about wanting to see other men, then he has all the information he needs to decide whether or not he’s going to keep calling and asking her out.

    If Tara is really “using” him and being “selfish” then she must not be being honest with him about her circular dating life and she clearly hasn’t given him the “no girlfriend speech” (or even the “At this point in my life I want to date lots of men” speech). Because if she told him how she feels about being exclusive with him and he keeps calling, then I think the “selfish” part is on him and the “using” part is on nobody.

    If she’s sneaking around, letting him believe he’s a boyfriend and that they have a future together…then yes, she’s selfish and using him. And yes…that’s just as wrong as when a man does it to a woman.

    If she’s saying “I don’t want a relationship and I want to date other people”…then no, that’s not selfish and its the same as when a man does it to a woman and she continues to go out with him (or sleep with him) in the hopes of changing his mind. Her own fault. Ted’s own fault.

    All boils down to honesty and those speeches if you ask me.

    Just my take on it.

    Much Love,

  167.  #167Mercedes on January 12, 2011 at 7:48 am

    Quinn99: I’m sure Rori can help too but from my perspective, when you say:

    “Should I be more relaxed about things – is it unreasonable for me to expect too much since we have only been dating 3 months? ”

    my answer is “yes”. Date other men. Lots of them. Stop being readily available and willing to hang at his place until 3 or 4 in the morning like you have no life outside of him.

    If this man wants you…if he feels the same degree of love you feel…he’ll go nuts thinking about you with other men and he will claim you.

    If he doesn’t feel this way about you…if he doesn’t care if you see other men…if he’s not in love…wouldn’t you rather find out now (after only three months) then after years of hoping he’ll step up? I know I would.

    I feel for you girl but after three months, my suggestion is to get a tighter grip on your heart. Our hearts are the greatest thing we have to offer…the greatest gift we can give someone…and this man hasn’t earned it yet. Allow him to earn it…don’t just hand it to him on a silver platter.

    Much Love,

  168.  #168Simply Shannon on January 12, 2011 at 8:12 am

    Quinn, What was your life like before you met this man? I don’t want you to feel bad. What do you think you should do?

  169.  #169Simply Shannon on January 12, 2011 at 8:19 am

    Oh wow Meemee. Yes! I do the imaginary conversation thing. A lot!! My only trick is I started taking out the particular man and using a generic person to have the conversation with. And I only allow visualizations which feel good! If they feel bad, then I switch it up and go back to good. Who wants a fantasy conversation that feels bad? 🙂

    I picture he listened and that things worked out well. Again, taking out the specific man works for me. Just changing them up and pretending it’s either a fantasy man or another man I’ve had a relationship with. I guess this makes the “man” interchangeable and makes me focus on the relationship and the feelings I want to have.

    Make sense?

    P.S. I love your fruit salad! That’s exactly what Rori describes. Soup is her word. You go from one feeling to the next. This is good! We don’t have to stay stuck on one feeling.

    I see you baby stepping through this. Brava Meemee!

  170.  #170Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 8:21 am

    I can’t help but saying this: all the signs are there, he’s not into you!

    Let go, move on… He’s not the right man for you however angle you want to look this from.

    How can you be in love with a man who’s so obviously carefree about you? I think you’re in love with the idea of being in love with him. I would suggest you work on your self-esteem, you have to be in love with yourself first before you can be in love with anyone safely and meaningfully.

  171.  #171Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 8:25 am

    And Quinn, he doesn’t pay for dates…at all? I would run…and run very fast after the first date if a guy doesn’t pay for dates. How can you last 3 months with him is beyond me. He’s saying it very loud and clear: he doesn’t want a relationship with you. Not now, not ever.

    I’m sorry for being blunt. I feel for your struggle (years ago I was in your shoes). A man knows what to do when he’s into a woman. So you are pining over him is just plain foolish. He doesn’t care!!! That actually makes me mad that women will do that to themselves.

  172.  #172Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 8:28 am

    The whole CD thing is in deed a conundrum to quite the degree. I think that many people, both men and women would love to “have their cake and eat it too”. We would all like to have the person we are dating to only be dating us and yet we would like the freedom to explore and make sure he/she is the one all the time having the security that the other is committed to us and only us. I mean such a deal!

    I agree with what Mercedes said about the whole honesty thing. The reason people are not honest about this is of course that they know in all probability if they say they are dating others, then the on in front of them will disappear. It has happened to me more than once when I give the “no girlfriend speech” or something of that nature.

    Up until about 1950 or thereabout, men still courted women. Once the sixties came round, that all went awry. Sadly, no men expect to have us without doing anything. What I call the “no commitment commitment” or the faux comittment which is what being a girlfriend is. And it’s horrible. The waiting and wondering what Mr. Man is going to do. No power and then after a while we women get all weird and icky and clingy and well, it’s just so disgusting I shudder just thinking about what that used to be like.

    This is the all wonderful “free love” the sixties brought us and it was a total lie. We see that now, the ramifications of that have so screwed up the male/female dance.

    Having said that, just because because a man will commit to you by marrying you doesn’t really mean he is a good man or one you really would want for the long haul. Women on this blog and myself included in the past have been crying over a man not willing to commit after only 3, 6, 9 months or a year. In my most humble opinion (and because I am an old broad and have lots of relationship experience) that is not near enough time. Men are different, they are slower to reveal themselves, slower to decide they can even get their heads round the whole ltr thing (this is biology ladies, not their fault) and slower period with all the relationship dynamics. Eighteen months is about the average I have seen with this give or take.

    Sadly most of the men I have seen on sites like POF and others are feminine energy men. I spend a lot of my time out-girling them. They have been so emasculated by us that they are walking on eggshells a lot of the time. Damned if they do and damned if they don’t. Hence the question-What do women want? Not putting the blame all on females, oh no there is plenty blame to go around. But just saying. Rori is trying to turn around all that behavior in women that comes across as ball busting and masculine. I totally get it and it’s a good thing and about time.

    I had a date the other evening and he sat right across from me and said “I don’t want a woman who acts like a man-at the end of the day I want someone soft and feminine.” and this was coming from a man who I had to outgirl to get him to ask me out and plan the date because he was leaving it all up to me. I think men in many ways are so frustrated with things they just give up and let women do it all. Sort of a “Screw it, I don’t know what she wants or how to act, so I give up-you do it all girly.” Of course they are angry about it, and there’s that to deal with as well.

    So we need things to get re-balanced desperately, just look at the high divorce rates and such. It did not get in such a mess overnight and it may take a few years to undo the damage. We are all just trying and muddling along the best we can. I have make lots of progress in the year I have been posting here and I have made mistakes, but that’s ok. I love my mistakes, I have learned so much.

    I love all the women here, you all have been such a lifeline when the feelings are overwhelming or so devastating that I feel no one understands what’s going on, I come to this blog. The accepted practice being what it is out there, even my girlfriends judge me for the way I date. So be it. Oh well, I have never been one to follow the herd.


  173.  #173Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 8:30 am

    I meant “Now men expect to have us without doing anything”. typo queen :o)

  174.  #174Simply Shannon on January 12, 2011 at 8:39 am

    Katarina, I don’t see that at all. What I see is a man who has never had to fight for anything in his life because he’s “extremely attractive”. This man is bored. He’s become a woman with pants on. No one expects anything more of him. No wonder he’s depressed!

    I believe Quinn can turn this around if she wants to, but it’s going to require Quinn to take care of herself and to REQUIRE any man (including this one) take care of her too!

    Helping this particular man in any way, paying, overfunctioning is EMASCULATING him. He loves the attention and ease of it all but secretly hates anyone (and himself) for treating him like a woman.

    This is exact way I hate anyone (and myself) when I’m treated like a man.

    And I KNOW any of us can change this for ourselves. Not to get the man/woman in our current relationship but to get an even better one (even if it’s the man/woman we’re with and they CHANGED).

  175.  #175Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 8:42 am


    You pretty much described to a T, my relationship with a man a while back I call Ex-toxic man. I know exactly what that kin dof relationship feels like, as do many of the women here. Run honey. As fast as you can. CD as soon as possible. He is making you miserable because you have unhealed wounds that need healing and he sounds like a narcissist. Narcissist do not get better most of the time. They are extremely charming, witty and easy to fall for.

    But you wake up one day and realize you feel like total sh*t and we are wondering what train hit you and you so wanted him to change and he isn’t going to, not now, not ever. He has his own issues and you can’t fix him. He healer types so want to-then we can avoid our own stuff. We can feel like “Oh, my loved saved him! I am giving so much-why is he not grateful?”

    Get off that horse, it’s a ride to nowhere. There are so many more men out there, better men, healthier men. It was hard. I thought I would never heal from him. I thought I could never leave him,. The pull was so strong. But I did leave and I did heal. And today I look back on that and I think – Whew, what was that? My god what was I thinking? But the lessons he gave me was so powerful I ended up here and well the rest is history. I have been cd’ing a lot and my head and my heart are in totally different spaces now than then.

    But maybe you need a guy that that to mess you around in order to see what it is you need to see about yourself. Sometimes they are a blessing in disguise, only that kind of pain can open out eyes.
    I only hope you do not have to go through what I did.

  176.  #176Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Shannon, you might be right. But he’s 51, he’s all set. Why do you want to work so hard changing a man who for whatever reason isn’t showing a relationship potential at all?

    Why does she want to set herself to huge heartache like that, wasting her time and energy on this child man?

    The easier and smarter way for a woman is to attract and go for a man who is into her and available and ready.

    It’s only 3 months and she got nothing from him so far other than frustration and heartache. The first months are supposed to be all fun and exploration!! What can she expect from him down the road? She wants a partner, for God’s sake, not a mental patient she can play therapist for.

  177.  #177Simply Shannon on January 12, 2011 at 8:46 am

    Turtle Girl, This is my personal mission! I completely agree and I will no longer contribute to the emasculation of men or the masculation (is that a word?) of myself!

  178.  #178Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 9:07 am

    Exactly right. You nailed it. When we act like men by over-functioning, paying, taking care of him like a momma, leaning forward in our behaviors, etc etc we are in fact behaving like men and therefore emasculating them. This is what I was trying to say in my earlier post. You expounded on it beautifully!

    It’s really pretty simple, when you peel back all the layers. DNA says, men hunt, provide and protect. So- court, pay and be strong in stature and character to protect us physically and emotionally (our hearts) DNA says women stay in cave, love our children and our men, respond and receive.

    None of us here have it right all the time or know everything. I do like what EMK says about women ACCEPTING bad behavior. So true. We give our hearts away to the wrong men, then complain and cry about how they broke it. Well duh. In our control all the time. We responded to the wrong men who would not protect us or provide for us. Duh.

  179.  #179RTCathy on January 12, 2011 at 9:18 am

    Thank you SLV for your post on the last thread in response to my despair about BMW man
    “wish for you health, happiness and more… excitement. Life is short. I’m betting you don’t really, really want to be bored” and also your link to Rorys post dont let go, dont resolve, stay on your horse.

    Wise words and no you are right I definetly dont want to be bored, not even with him, i would much more like to be excited.

    I can’t believe the moment I started to get on my horse and start riding off, i am suddenly bombarded with texts and emails from BMW man telling me, he missed me on our break, he wants to see me, take me to dinner, thinks I am beautiful – and I am back on the roller coaster!

    You are right, I definetly dont want to be bored – I do want excitement and it seems I am getting it! My heart leaps and I jump to it! Oh joy for the moment – addiction to the mancrack! Enjoying the roller coaster – feeling the little rickety car go higher and higher… not caring about the next plunge into the abyss but feeling happy and enjoying the thrill of this for the moment…

  180.  #180Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 9:18 am

    SS-your post 173.

    Very interesting point you bring up! He is bored! Never had to fight for anything! So true.

    Ex toxic man was that way-a bad boy who was extremely good looking, and women just flocked at his feet. He was a musician so had that too. The “fan club” aura. I think looking back on it, he needed a women who would not do anything for him, and treat him like he treated them. Casual, callous, indifferent, not really caring one way or another. He would have run to her like crazy because finally she would have presented a challenge for him. It still would not have worked as his is mentally ill. But the point is well taken.

    Men need to “hunt”. They need to court and have the challenge or else they are totally bored. Nothing worth having comes easy. If we are easy, we have no value. If we give up all the goods, our bodies, our hearts, everything without making him work for it-well, boring and less value to them. And for us, we well not valued as well. If he is NOT willing to work, then who does he love? If he is not willing to care for our hearts by cherishing our feelings and committing to us then who are we? Just another female who he had sex with among the many. so what? He doesn’t love US, it’s just the sex.

    that is why I am always wary of a man who wants to have an instant relationship before he gets to know me for me. It is insulting to me, because I know it’s not “me” he wants. It’s something else, either sex or he is insecure and desperate. This is why we women are offended when men never ask us any questions about us. We know deep down he doesn’t really give a hoot about knowing us as people.

    Ex toxic man never even called me by my name, it was always “baby”. That lovely interchangeable girl name for one and all.

  181.  #181Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 9:25 am

    Funny, TG, with a man I’m in relationship with I almost never call him by his name and usually vice versa. SG always calls me “baby, darling or sugar plum.” And I’m the same with him (baby, darling). We barely use each other’s name and I love it that way.

  182.  #182Turtle Girl on January 12, 2011 at 9:35 am

    Hey Katrina Phang-

    I get what you are saying. I really do. I have had boyfriends that called me baby and it was ok. It was sweet. In good relationships people often have pet names, nicknames, sweet terms of endearment. No problemo.

    It was in his case, he raely called me by my name, and he even told me he never even cared if he knew my real name! And it was one of many things that encompassed the whole sick relationship that made the fact that he only ever called me baby, not a term of endearment but a callous statement that I was nothing to him, just another fish on a string of fishes he was using for his own narcissistic pleasure. He never saw ME as a separate different women. All the same to him.

    That is often the trouble with blogs, it is impossible to know whole stories and sometimes things are interpreted wrong, not at all or taken out of context. I am not saying you did that. I am just saying.

    If “baby” works for you, then awesome!

  183.  #183Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 9:41 am

    TG, I know what you’re saying, it’s like male strangers call every woman they meet “Sweetie.” Very impersonal -if somewhat condescending.

  184.  #184Laughing Goddess on January 12, 2011 at 9:46 am

    Having sone more revelations about Rori’s post on the other thread clarifying cd-ing and how giving exclusivity a chance, can help us to deepen our intimacy skills.

    I’m realizing how this applies for me..

    For me, a great deal of my experience of life centers around my home. For me to know if I an really compatible with a man, I need to experience living with them. This may not be so crucial for someone else. Someone else might have different things that are important to them. But for me, my home life, my house, my living space, I feel deeply tied to.

    I feel curious why this is.

    For me, home space is so important that I even got a college degree in architecture. After graduating, I realized that I didn’t want to do that as a career. I don’t really feel inspired to design any old building. But I do care deeply and feel deeply affected by the spaces that I personally inhabit.

    My vision of the kind of man I want to be with is someone who values creating an amazing home together. Someone with whom I can coexist with in that home in a compatible, fun, and harmonious manner.

    I feel unsure of where I am going with this train of thought. 🙂
    but I feel content with just exploring it.

    I’m clarifying what is most important to me regarding what I want in a partner. Obviously, I want to be treated kindly, honored, adored. I want to man to row the boat, be faithful, honest.

    But I don’t care if he is super successful, or talented, or rich, or takes me to fancy restaurants. But compatible vision of home life, that is important to me.

    I feel happy to have this clarity about what I want!

  185.  #185Laughing Goddess on January 12, 2011 at 9:49 am

    Oh ya, so how that relates to why Rori said about cd-ing…

    So for me because home life is so important, I feel the need to live with a man before I know if he is right for me.

    Wondering is this is a truth for me or just a belief?

  186.  #186life_is_too_short_to... on January 12, 2011 at 9:52 am

    @171 Turtle Girl
    Love your post
    About CDing. I know Rori is working on a post that will no doubt blow us out of of the water, but my too cents right now is that CDing does different things for different people.

    I admit to not doing it by the book.

    I’m basically seeing one guy, but neither of us are off the dating sites. I’m still qualifying other guys, but there haven’t been any dates with any others since the end of October.

    I gave him the no girlfriend speech after the third date, and he also knows I have been out of circulation for a while. I feel well-liked and well-considered and cared about by him, but I honestly have no idea what is in his head about long term. and frankly, i don’t care. (so what? who cares? LOL) He has said he’d love to help me to “get my groove back” so he must believe that my no girlfriend speech was designed to say that I am not ready to settle down yet and want to just date OR
    he doesn’t see me as long term material.

    The thing is, I don’t know if this is because he doesn’t see me as long term committed material, or if he is responding to my attitude of non-exclusivity.

    But it doesn’t really matter to me, because I am staying open and just letting things take their natural course and enjoy our connection for what it is. I really do feel that that is the best way.

    I found out from my last relationship, even though he was EUM toxic, that the quickest way to throw water on the fire of a relationship with a guy is to start wanting to talk about where he sees it going. And it’s also true…in my opinion….if we’re focused on that then we are not really being present.

    I agree with what was said about guys taking longer about commitment. Pressure feels really bad to them.

    I am monitoring myself very closely about just enjoying myself, leaning back, not expecting, staying in touch with my feelings and not getting needy or clingy so that if things don’t work out, i wont get whiny and will just move on quickly.

    Guys who care DO know when they have made you feel bad. My CD was acting, as he later put it, “like a tool”, for about a week, and I was cooling off because of it. It came to a peak one night and I just didn’t feel like being near him, i felt this disconnect, so i said, you know, i just feel like going home now, and left.

    He contacted me later that evening by text and asked if we were over. I had gone to sleep so i didn’t respond.

    Next day, he called to apologize and explain what had been going on with him, work related, and was so sweet about it. It showed me that he really did not want to lose me. Then he paid extra attention to me, talking about future dates, and how i made him feel, etc. stuff that he had been doing all along, but which had fallen off because he was pre-occupied. But, I wasn’t having any of that, because i want to see that I am a priority, no matter what else is going on in his life.

    so anyway, back to CDing….it’s purpose in my life at this point is to keep me as the “flirty girl” that Rori talked about in her last e-letter, keeping that exciting energy around me so he feels motivated to keep pursuing me,

    and also to keep my options open in case it doesnt turn out to be a long term committed relationship and that’s pretty much it.

    what a ramble! i loved it!

    thanks again for your post, TG

  187.  #187life_is_too_short_to... on January 12, 2011 at 9:52 am

    Thanks, Jim
    stick around, the water’s fine….:-)

  188.  #188Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 9:53 am

    Turtle Girl,

    Re: 171, those are my thoughts exactly and why I’m working so hard to develop my feminine energy. The world, as far as relationships is in a mess and I think you described why in a very eloquent fashion.

    Thank you!

  189.  #189Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 9:58 am

    “Ex toxic man never even called me by my name, it was always “baby”. That lovely interchangeable girl name for one and all.”
    Same with me.
    X rarely called me by my name.
    I was a generic woman. “baby”

  190.  #190life_is_too_short_to... on January 12, 2011 at 10:04 am

    if you ain’t running game, say my name, say my name


  191.  #191Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 10:20 am

    Baby is one of those emotional words that we can use to get to a man’s heart so I am feeling a little concerned here that these callous men could leave a bitter taste on us by using the word in such a cavalier and non-chalant way. I wonder if I have done that to a man? I tend to say babe to both girls and gals. It does subliminally create an emotional connection so I believe we should keep our hearts open to it for the future. I do not need to protect myself from being called baby by even a toxic man. He can give me any amount of love he wants to I have the choice whether I want to accept it or not so I will develop my skills to check and follow my feelings.

  192.  #192life_is_too_short_to... on January 12, 2011 at 10:41 am

    @190 I share your thoughts, femininewoman.

    Also, I never call a man baby first.

    In fact, i even told CD#1 that I don’t do anything first. LOL

    Then I thought about how while I don’t want to make that a hard and fast rule, I really love feeling so comfortable just letting them initiate everything without worrying that I have to also or else they will lose interest. I believe they can always tell if you are interested or not.

    The key i think is the level of authenticity, for instance, if you really do “get” what it means to be open-hearted and vulnerable to receive, and then as you say, trust your feelings about how what they are giving makes you feel, and then they can feel your enjoyment, pleasure, gratitude by how you behave and by your energy.

    A lot of this is non-verbal, in fact, most of it is.

  193.  #193Laughing Goddess on January 12, 2011 at 10:50 am

    “I feel the need to…”
    “I feel the desire to…”

    What do you sirens think? Are these true feeling statements according to Rori, NVC, or just general common sense? I feel curious about this.

    I use these statements sometimes. I feel unsure tho’ if they are really feeling statements or in the realm of saying “I feel like” then sharing what is actually a thought.

    Feedback appreciated 🙂

    “I feel unsure”
    “I feel certain”

    I’m curious about these too. Are these feelings?

  194.  #194life_is_too_short_to... on January 12, 2011 at 11:07 am

    Hi LG,

    I’m thinking that
    “I feel the desire/need to”

    is another way of saying

    “I want or don’t want”
    and “I like/don’t like”,

    because it is talking about some action that is looking to be expressed as a result of some feeling or thought.

    for instance,

    I feel the desire for some mullein tea

    would become

    I want some mullein tea


    I feel the need for speed (that line from Top Gun came to mind, sorry)

    I want to go very fast,

    so I suppose if one wanted to excavate down to the more base feelings, and, then say I feel even deeper, to the thoughts, that caused the feelings, they can

  195.  #195Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 11:30 am

    For me I feel unsure or uncertain is the same as saying I feel shaky. I feel this a lot especially in the pit of my stomach which I believe is fear. So whenever I feel this way now I try to explore what is triggering it.

  196.  #196Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 11:32 am

    Today I was feeling very low. I had to meet X on several occasions and he purposefully came to my room to talk to my friend. I was feeling so vulnerable. I felt so helpless. I sat in my room and cried. Chocolate man came to my room then. He saw tears in my eyes and was confused. He took me out for a coffee. He constantly asked me why I was crying. That was a tough moment. I could not open up. I was beating around the bush. He said he knows I was hurt by a man. I still could not say anything. I was so tongue tied. I finished the coffee and left.

    Later he called me. I did not pick the call. I was feeling confused. He pinged me online and asked me why I am feeling so reluctant to talk. We talked for a long time and I could open up a bit. I told him what I am feeling. He listened to me. He said if I am skipping lunch and getherings becuase of one person, he will give me company during lunch and party. That was kind, but I denied the offer with respect. Then after a long chat he asked me who I was dating. I was so so reluctant to say X’s name. I know they are friends now. I was silent for a long time. He said he wants to know “the a$$hole who could not appreciate a woman and could not keep the basic dating conventions”. I still didnt say X’s name. I was feeling fear.
    Chocolate man said he will talk to me tomorrow if I am feeling pressurized.
    If this conversation comes up tomorrow, should I name X?????

  197.  #197Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 11:44 am


    I agree with Life that “I feel the need to” and “I feel desire to” can be I want/I need statements. However, and not to contradict you Life, but I feel angry can also become I’m angry, I feel love can be shortened to I love, and I believe I feel compelled to is a feeling statement of feeling a need to do something, so I don’t see why I feel the need to would not also be a feeling statement. And “I feel a strong desire to write this,” in my mind at least, is a feeling message. It’s not a thought, it’s a feeling. Need is a feeling and so is desire and expressed as a feeling is no different in my mind that saying, “I feel happy,” as opposed to “I’m happy.”

  198.  #198Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Meemee what do YOU have to lose by naming? Are YOU still in agreement wih X’s secret scheme? I say free yourself from this secret bt opening up your heart for intimacy with someone else. This is practicing for your Mr. Right as he will definitely show up now that you have opened up that space for him by releasing X. You have to keep moving forward I want to believe Chocolate Man’s message is that you can do this. We are all cheering you on Meemee. Your Mr. Right might ask you these questions also, will you push him away by keeping this toxic X’s secret?

  199.  #199Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 11:50 am

    Interesting, femininewoman! — “I feel shaky” is exactly what came to my mind too when I read LG’s “I feel unsure”….

  200.  #200Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 11:51 am

    Meemee I would aslo try to figure out what the fear is. Is it fear of being judged? You seemed to have expected a lot of negative repercussions here on the blog when you shared but I hope your memory is that did not happen. Your culture might be different but I am sure you are not the only one there with that kind of experience and I can guarantee that the more you keep the silence is the more it will be perpetuated. I say feel it deeply in your body that you will not allow that to happen to you again. If you share this experience with Chocolate Man I would say show your passion that this will never be tolerated by you again. He will get it. Are you fearful that he will treat you the same way also?

  201.  #201Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 11:53 am

    Jim, thanks. I think so too.

  202.  #202Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 11:54 am

    Feminine woman
    I have nothing to lose. But I feel some unknown fear. The newness of it. The very idea of breaking the secrecy for the first time. and the fact that they are friends and hang around these days. and the power dynamics. three of us are doing our PhDs from the same place and I have to meet these people for yet another 2 years and many more fears.

  203.  #203Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 11:57 am

    Withholding and secrets are not condusive to honesty, authenticity or intimacy. It breaks trust. Meemee you are learning, I am learning and the best way to learn is to get out of our comfort one and try on something new. Can you trust yourself to be authentic? Can you trust yourself to choose friends who will help you heal? I am talking to you Meemee while talking to myself at the same time and I am feeling the same juicy fear that you are feeling. For me it feels exciting, exhilarating and thrilling.

  204.  #204Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 11:59 am

    X is so popular. He can manipulate. I have no proof to show that I slept with X for 3 years. What if Chocolateman ask X this sometime and X manipulates?
    Will chocolate man think that I am someone who will agree to secrecy and such games?
    The fear of being judged! The fear of will I be treated like that once again?

  205.  #205Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:00 pm

    Things are not always what they seem and they always tend to work themselves out regardless of the stories we tell ourselves in our minds The Universe is cheering for you Meemee do what you think is best in honoring yourself. You might wish to consider telling him but also telling him you wnat to handle it yourself and you’re not asking him to do anything or fix it. I understand you do not want to start a cock fight. You might just need a friendly ear and a strong shoulder right now.

  206.  #206Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    Re 203 I know that fear is real to you and only you can decide how best to handle it. However you are suggesting 2 years of keeping a secret that can eventually leave you jaded and closed to real love. If not Chocolate Man then you might wish to look for someone you can openly talk to about this who can lend you some strength. You are such a blessed spirit I know the world is waiting to help you.

  207.  #207Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Chocolate man is asking me this question again and again. I dont know whether he is genuinely concerned or simply curious. He is asking me to be straightforward. He is telling me that I should stand up for myself

  208.  #208Nita on January 12, 2011 at 12:11 pm

    Hi Rori ok I have a question…I am in my late twenties and now live in NY. Im not sure if its the city (moved here last August) or whats going on but there is a consistent issue with the men here. I have met a guy at the university, met a couple of them in the social going out enviroment too, have flirted/talked to a neighbor too. In all cases there is a situation that continues to happen to me. They ask me to “hang out” with them. I am always confused about this because the guy in the university for example always wanted to “hang out.” Walk around central park, grab a coffee, etc. I always feel attraction both from me and from them, flirting, they invite/treat me. However its not established if its a date! I even question if im the only one that is attracted to them and they just see me as the cute sweet innocent girl from the south lol. I dont know i want to use feeling messages but am conflicted “wont it end up being masculine energy if im asking if its a date?” – ex. I feel confused…why? because i feel attraction between us and im not sure that this is a date…would this be the right way to go about this? what if i spill the beans and am admitting that im interested by asking…confused if this is leaning back or leaning forward let me know

  209.  #209Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:12 pm

    I am not sure you need to share that you slept with him for years. What I think is more of a burden to you is that you shared a “secret” relationship for 3 years and he broke it off because you want to end the secrecy. You want to be adored and cherished in public. You want your happily ever after and he disrespected you by shouting and breaking it off because you are no longer interested in the secret. You also wonder if he has other girlfriends in your immediate environment why he needs secrecy. I might be wrong but I see no harm in starting to share that. I also feel if Chocolate Man insists on finding out if you slept with him you could state “I feel pressured and I don’t want that”. That is actually private information that I personally would only share with my husband if he needed to know that in our relationship. If a man asked me how many men or who I have slept with in the past, if I have not commitment from him I would say “Are you sure you really want to go there, because I am sure I could never compete with you?” “Would you be willing to share such information”. I feel this is opening up to share about sex and to talk back and forth about it in a relationship as I believe this is necessary to build intimacy. However, I would only want to discuss nitty gritty details with a long term partner.

  210.  #210Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    Also, there is some level of attraction between chocolate man and me. I am afraid he will stop talking to me or will lose interest if I tell him it was X.
    I might sound very silly. But I fear that too

  211.  #211Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    Telling you to stand up for yourself is great. He is telling you that you need to establish your boundaries, love yourself and lift your self-esteem. However, is he saying standing up for yourself to him means sharing intimate details about your life with him or is he saying stand up to X?

    Another thing that just crossed my mind is that many times secrets are really open just that we don’t know. X might have already discussed you with the guys, it is a thing that men do. So for all you know Chocolate Man could already know the secret or know some on X’s secrets that would never share with the girls. I don ‘t want to alarm you but Chocolate Man might have some motivation for getting close to you. That is his business and your business is how you take care of yourself, how you interact with hi..

  212.  #212Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:21 pm

    Fear is fine in my book. You have to work through it. Also as RR teaches these interactions with men should be used to help us identify our patterns. Is your pattern a serial monogamist where you settle with the first man who comes to you? Rather than interacting with more than one to identify want you want, who you are, and if you really want this man in front of you? Can he really do the job of taking care of you and honoring your feelings? Are you turned on to him?

  213.  #213Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:25 pm

    He might also be helping you to see your pattern here. Are you a serial monogamist who settle with the available man? Is your fear really that you might end up alone the rest of your life? The fact that Chocolate Man found you so quickly is an indication that you have the magnetic attractive quality that men are looking for.

  214.  #214Meemee on January 12, 2011 at 12:37 pm

    Chocolate man says he wants to know what is bothering me. Even if I dont share it with him, i should share it with my intimate female friends, he says. However he does not give up even on several occasions I told him that I dont want to discuss this. He keeps asking. He is so persistently asking me who that person is.
    I have no idea what is on his mind.
    I am 100% certain that X will not share this with anyone.

  215.  #215Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Are you also attracting men that do not respect your boundaries? Have you checked your boundaries and do you trust them? What is Chocolate Man reflecting back to you about your boundaries? These are questions I would ask myself. Can I be 100% certain about anyone? I doubt that because I cannot be 100% certain about myself, but that is my belief and I don’t want to project that on you. I am just trying to help you explore yourself, your beliefs, your actions and your paterns It helps me a lot to work on myself and I am greatly appreciative of you sharing your experience in this space Meemee. I just caught myself saying in my mind “I don’t trust men” Now I have to explore if I atttact dishonest men because I can’t trust them.

  216.  #216Lisi on January 12, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    Thank you all for your kind comments about my posts yesterday. I feel grateful and connected.

    I have two main suitors, and several others, some in email stages, some I’ve met. Yesterday, I took to heart what Rori said about using feeling language. I didn’t get asked for my number by the guy I enjoyed so much this week end. Hmmmmm. Looking back — I didn’t use feeling language.

    With that in mind, yesterday and today, I have texted my two main guys with a feeling and a little about MY life. Both days — I’ve gotten instant responses — sounding very connected — from both guys.

    Here are my texts:

    “I’m totally excited! I have a REALLY badly behaved class @ the school. Started a behavior program today & they were great! First time I haven’t felt burned out after.”

    “I was TOTALLY having anxiety & avoiding my big taxes/paperwork project. Now I’m 1/4 way through & it’s NOT SO BAD. Why did I stress?”

    I’m going to continue connecting with them — just by putting out feeling messages. The old me would have tried to “row the boat” as Rori puts it.

    I’m going to focus on me having my experiences, and then let them in on it. Maybe that’s what’s so compelling for men — just being “in you” emotionally. Because we access feelings more easily, our open access provides them access as well….

    I’ll let you know how it goes….

  217.  #217Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 12:57 pm


    I’m wondering if you could share a little with Chocolate Man, just to open yourself a little to trusting a man again. Tell him what you’re comfortable with and then tell him you feel embarrassed, or distrustful, hesitant, whatever you’re feeling to tell him anything more.

    I am wondering if FeminineWoman isn’t on to something here with the boundary issue as well. It seems to me, from what you say that you want to share at least part of this with Chocolate Man and maybe that would be healing for you? What I’m hearing from you (and correct me if I’m wrong) is that part of you wants to share with him and the other part is distrustful and hesitant to. I’m thinking if you could partially share/partially stick to boundaries, you might get some healing on both fronts.

    What do you think?

  218.  #218Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    Nita my understanding of date is when he invites and pays. Hanging out I take it to mean as friends and not as a romantic partner, as such the guy is indicating that you should not have any expectations. That is what they experience from other women. If interested in romance I would say “I am only open to dating someone who is willing to consider a long term partnership”. I would also try to figure a way to find out that is what the person wants. I was told to just go with the flow initially with the hanging out. As time goes on they will cool off especially if you sleep with them because I am sure they have that in mind. If you agree to hang out assume it means nothing. If you want to be courted I would say don’t agree to hanging out or friendship with someone you are romantically attracted to. For me that is taking care of myself. It is hard to do but like me you might start hanging out then become clingy when you acknowledge that you want more, then the guy will pull away if he doesn’t. Hang out if you want to as it will help them to get to know you and help you to practice Rori’s tools of opening up and receiving. Just be careful of having expectations by careful guarding your mind and refusing to initiate anything with them. That is what I am practicing now as I get to know myself more intimately.

  219.  #219Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    @195: Meemee says:

    “…Then after a long chat he asked me who I was dating…If this conversation If this conversation comes up tomorrow, should I name X????? Meemee…”

    I thought you were finished with all that Mr X mistreatment. If you are there’s nothing more for you to do, no “standing up.” You are done. It’s up to you who you choose to confide in or even if you discuss your affair with all of your colleagues that’s up to you.

    However, I’ve never felt compelled to discuss previous affairs with men I am casually dating even if they are very, very curious. Really it’s none of their business. Even if, in your case Chocolate Man,
    the guy is going on a gossip jag about some previous affair of his.

    Is he doing that? Discussing other women with you? That wouldn’t feel that good to me.

    I suspect Chocolate Man already knows anyway as do any number of Mr.X’s friends. It could be arousing for him to hear the intimate details in words from you, otherwise he’d stop badgering you, asking you over and over. It’s not cool. Chocolate Man is not your therapist yet he’s all over your personal boundaries like white on rice. I read that and I have an icky feeling.


  220.  #220Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    @175: Katarina Phang says:
    “…The first months are supposed to be all fun and exploration!…”

    Yes, I think so!


  221.  #221Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 1:08 pm


    RE: #158 – Thank you! I am feeling so much more at peace!

    Even tho I didn’t respond much when I was using the walk away tool, I felt so uplifted by the many encouraging, kind posts that were left for me.

    I bared a really deep core of pain and unhealthiness, and I think that in itself was a big part of the shift, too. Along with crying and discussing it with Ryan, Rosa’s post helped me most.

  222.  #222Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 1:11 pm


    RE: #160 – Naughty, naughty boy! Spank, spank, spank! LOL! Feel better?

  223.  #223Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 1:11 pm


  224.  #224Alicia on January 12, 2011 at 1:15 pm

    RORI! Hellllllllllp

    Hi, please elaborate on CD’ing I have modern sirens.

    The problem is I can’t keep up with the messages. I feel flattered, I suppose.. But, really I feel totally overwhelmed 56 messages is 24 hours, I want to vomit. Not because of the guys but, my head is spinning and I’m responding to ever single one of them. Like you said treat them all equal. How do I have a quality convo?

  225.  #225Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    @178: RTCathy says:
    “..addiction to the mancrack! Enjoying the roller coaster – feeling the little rickety car go higher and higher… not caring about the next plunge into the abyss but feeling happy and enjoying the thrill of tis for the moment…”

    That is not the kind of excitement I was talking about. I believe it’s better for me to create my own life excitement rather than rely on man crack addiction. I believe if I am already in love with
    myself and have other things to do then I am less addicted.

    I do not wait until I am feeling “100% fine and dandy, sugar candy” in order to have something to look forward to each morning when I awaken. I can still have some unresolved sadness all the while I am doing happy things; this helps me keep things in perspective and makes it easier for me to work out the bad stuff.


  226.  #226Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    Alicia, I just respond in the moment to whatever they are saying in the present message — if I am just responding, following their lead, then it’s not my job to lead the convo at all. My responses are usually short and sweet, in-the-moment feeling messages and answers to whatever questions they ask….

    I’m curious which site you are on.

  227.  #227Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    Like TN man says, “Always leave them wanting more.” 🙂 That’s easy to do when you’re leaning back.

  228.  #228Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    Ella, yes, I am feeling better than before. Thanks for noticing. 🙂 (not sure if you wrote me on this thread or the other one….)

  229.  #229marina on January 12, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    @SLV #223
    Thanks for sharing, I really like that attitude of yours 🙂
    It rings a bell for me too 🙂

  230.  #230Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    SLV @ 217

    Chocolate Man is supposed to be Meemee’s therapist if she’s CDing him. That’s what CDing is supposed to be is free therapy. And she doesn’t have to be going on actual dates with him to be circular dating him. I believe the Universe sends who we need to help us heal and while I don’t believe she should go into it with blinders on, if he’s in her life, he’s there for a reason.

    I’m feeling triggered right now because I’m having some strong realizations in my own life that my Dad’s opinions have colored my perceptions of men I’ve dated and it hasn’t served me. I automatically think that I should be distrustful if he is, but he’s not even in the same state with me. He doesn’t even know the guy and for heaven’s sake, I’m his daughter. Of course no man is ever going to be good enough for me. If I go on letting him perceptions color my view of the guy, I’m NEVER going to meet anyone good enough.

    So please pardon me, SLV. I feel pretty strongly about this and I’m not meaning to start a fight, I’m just looking at all of this “don’t trust him” stuff and thinking, “OMGosh, Meemee! Trust yourself. If you can get some healing through this guy, do it. If you don’t feel trusting of him, by all means, don’t trust him, but don’t not trust him because people who don’t even know him are telling you not to.”

    Being distrusting of a man simply because I was told distrusting things about him has been a catastrophe in my life lately. So I’ve decided I’m not talking to my Dad about any of the guys I date anymore. Once I’m married to them, and he’ll have to accept it, THEN he can find out about them. (Well…I might invite him to the wedding. LOL!)

  231.  #231quinn99 on January 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    Hi – thanks for the responses to my post # 164. It is difficult to express fully the interior of my relationship with 51 – but alot of the feedback rang true especially the posts by SS and TG.

    It hit me like a ton of bricks that EMASCULATION is one of the problems. He has numerous “friends” who do for him – feed and gift him which he seems very proud to tell me about. He has told me he is cheap and pessimistic…I have commented to friends that he needs to “grow a set” and have been trying to lean back but still struggling and being triggered BIGTIME.

    I also have suspected possible narcissism and recently looked up the definition wondering if he is one. I have been trying to fix him – make him feel better about his life. while I get lost along the way….This plays perfectly into the “what is wrong with me – I am a worthless piece of s**t who will forever destroy all my relationships by pushing men away and/or destroying relationships and never be truly loved” syndrome. Sadly – these are really words that play in my mind over and over again….

    To him I appear strong – self sufficient – aloof and not needy but inside I’m like a little girl feeling abandoned again by my mom who died when I was a kid…Maybe I have never really healed from it….so scary to think I will keep forever keep recreating this feeling..In all honesty the feelings are so intense sometimes I think I will die from them…

    It helps to be honest about it…it helps me to say what I feel…it helps me to express what is there…I only hope I can learn how to do what I need to feel better about myself. To value myself and not continue to look “out there” for my value and validation for being worthy of love…which sets me up for the perpetual cycle of abandonment…

    I’d love some words of wisdom…Thanks

  232.  #232Luzydel on January 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    I had a weird experience yesterday, a guy who has been sort of hot and cold contacted me and I told him that since I never felt that he was serious about me, I decided to meet other men. he practically begged me to give him a chance, to let him show me he really want to be with me, but I already did twice and he has not stepped up.
    He never took me on dates, just met me at my building garden, last time he told me lets met at certain sports bar and he end up getting inside my car to kiss, but did not ask me to get out and go for a drink at least.
    He went on Vacation after than and never call until yesterday, and I told him I lost interest.
    I felt guilty though, but then I felt liberated. I don’t want him and do not want his crumbs, I am meeting very nice men and one of them is wonderfully stepping up and showing he really cares.

  233.  #233Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    @144: LonePlum

    Yes, we do indeed agree on theTara/Ted story. I reread the newsletter and EMK’s last post. I assume he and I agree to disagree. After all he’s the one getting paid for his advice; I am not. I have been enlightened by his many articles. I’m reading his book on online dating and I can recommend it.

    I am not a therapist, counselor, coach or guru. Terri Hernon MacDonald always forewarns that the only license she has is her driver’s license. I can’t even claim that as I stopped driving decades ago; however, I have a pretty good head on my shoulders and I wasn’t born yesterday.

    Long story short, I would be uncomfortable, after three meetings taking myself out of circulation for a man who fell in love at first sight, even though I thought he was cool and I felt a little bit hot.

    I’d probably be a lot hotter after seven dates and five weeks. All the more reason for me to keep my reason and perspective and not fall into a girlfriend trap. Although I’m learning things by reading and then applying them to my own life, I don’t believe I “shaded” anything or changed the details of the story. EMK mentioned a few details that I didn’t know, Ted was willing to “wait” for Tara; I didn’t see that in the newsletter.

    LonePlum, funny when I saw that EMK had made her dump the guy, the word “punitive” did come to mind! I had the idea that she was being punished by having Ted taken away when she didn’t leap to become a girlfriend right away.

    In the end, what I think only matters to me.

    EMK was very helpful in making things clear to me!!! I think you and I got the same message!!! 😀

    Thanks to EMK. I feel good about the story and how I will apply it to me which is why I’m reading posts in the first place. I got a huge chunk of “man think.”

    I’ve read everything on his blog! I’ve read much of Rori’s blog, not all. I’m going back now and reading Rori Dating Category posts.

    All of the lightning speed dating interviewing and then “pass or fail” is kind of scary for me.


  234.  #234Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 1:54 pm


    RE: #164 – I felt comparable vibes in the past. The more he distanced himself, the more I felt anxious and insecure. The more I felt anxious and insecure, the more I initiated contacting him. The more I initiated contacting him, the more he distanced himself.

    And so the unhealthy loop was complete. It is hard to do, but the best thing you can do is NOT contact him. How to do that is a whole other issue, and writing on this blog has helped me most with that.

  235.  #235Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 1:55 pm


    RE: #221 – Where is MY man??? 😆

  236.  #236Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:02 pm


    RE: #222 – Congratulations on having such a good problem! LOL! 😆

    The answer is you CAN’T have a quality conversation with all 50+ men! You have upped your degree of difficulty! You have the pick of them!

    If I were you, I’d go thru and pick the 5 or 10 who stood out to me the most, and respond to them. Then I would either hold off responding or copy and paste a message to each of the remainder, saying something like,

    “I feel happy to receive your response. I felt surprised to receive over 50 responses, and I simply am unable to interact with each man personally all at once! I will keep your name and email and may contact you in the near future.”

    What do you think?

  237.  #237Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    @224: Lucy says:
    “Alicia, …I’m curious which site you are on…”

    Me too! Curious. How delightful to have such a number of replies. Rejoice!


  238.  #238Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    Quinn, Re: 229

    To him I appear strong – self sufficient – aloof and not needy but inside I’m like a little girl feeling abandoned again by my mom who died when I was a kid…Maybe I have never really healed from it….so scary to think I will keep forever keep recreating this feeling..In all honesty the feelings are so intense sometimes I think I will die from them…

    I can totally identify with this. And I too, have felt hopeless to heal it. Thankfully I feel less aloof now and more open to a man and to my healing. Can we hope that being aware of it is the first step in healing it? I was older when I lost my mom, but had lived a very sheltered life, basically had no friends, and my entire family moved 24 hours away the year before she died. Well, except my Grandma who we were staying with and I remained very close too. I’ve lost her now too, but I have to say it seemed easier to lose a loved one when I was older and more established in my life.

    I don’t have any advice for you. For me, I would let 51 go and find a guy better equipped to take care of me. After all, that’s what we really want (and are terrified of losing), isn’t it? I don’t really want to put this out there, but I’m going to because I hope it will help. When I was telling my most recent LI goodbye, I realized that fear of abandonment was at the core of my feelings of clinginess, neediness and a desperate need to contact him. I told myself, “I don’t want to lose my heart to someone else who’s going away.” Then I realized I feel like he has my heart on a tether. It’s not mine right now and I don’t trust him with it, but I’m not losing it. It will come back to me and if I trusted him enough to give it to him, I damn well better trust him enough to keep it safe until I get it back from him. That’s the way I visualized it – and it may cause some controversy which is why I’m hesitant to share it on here. Once I visualized it that way though, I realized that I actually do trust him to not bruise my heart.

    I’m thinking you may not trust this guy to not hurt you so maybe that won’t be that helpful to you, but Girl! If you can’t trust him to treat your heart gently, then take it back from him.

  239.  #239Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:06 pm


    RE: #228 – Right on! I think we all struggle with trust. I don’t have it mastered, but I do my best to start each new man at 100% with trust. Then he can prove me right or wrong. Just cuz Chocolate Man knows X doesn’t mean anything.

  240.  #240Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    I’m noticing I feel really anxious about what I’ve posted on here today and am readying myself to run for the hills at any sign of a fight. I don’t like feeling anxious and don’t want to feel anxious to post here on this place that used to feel so safe to me.

    Maybe my feeling of “I don’t give a fig what anyone thinks of or has to say to me” is going away? That feels bad. I feel vulnerable and scared. Do I need acceptance from the group suddenly? Am I afraid of conflict? My scared of my anger and sharp tongue than anything, likely.

    Rori speaks of being afraid enough of what we could do when we’re angry as a reason to avoid it. I fear being angry and going out of control, of saying things I’ll later regret. Wow! That’s a pretty big realization. Something I’ve been aware of, yet unaware that I choose many times to not stand by my boundaries because I fear my own anger.

  241.  #241Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:13 pm


    RE: #229 – Above all, what is most important is our healing thru the dating process. I try to look at men as teachers and therapists. They are like a mirror to me of who I am inside. This broken part of us is surfacing. Even tho it is painful and difficult, this is bringing us here to Rori’s blog for healing and clarity. This is good.

    “Life is not a having and a resting, but a growing and a becoming.”

    “In acceptance lieth peace.” What is helping me is to assume that Mr. Toxic is not going to step up, and just come to a point of acceptance about that? Then if he does, I’ll be surprised. But if he doesn’t, hopefully I’ll have more peace in the process.

    When a man comes along for us who DOES step up and treat us with deep regard, we will be all the more healed, whole, and strong for him!

    What do you think/feel?

  242.  #242Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    RE: 237

    Thanks Brenda! I’m feeling hugely triggered on this today and I guess that’s what I’m here for. To heal the holes in my heart that are triggering to me. I sure am feeling vulnerable and anxious about it though.

    Here stands my guillotine. I hope no one “offs with” my head!

  243.  #243Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:20 pm


    RE: #238 – I often feel vulnerable to post here just because it’s really deep, personal stuff we sometimes air on here. What helped me the most is when Tinque told me that if I feel hurt, if someone is not treating me kindly, it is most likely their issue, not mine. I forget how she worded it.

    I still feel vulnerable often, but I have gotten so much help on here and found so many wonderful friends, like you, that I find it worth the risk! 🙂

  244.  #244Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:25 pm


    I still feel heartpoundingly anxious about it and I haven’t even touched the surface. I’ve not gotten deep and don’t think I’m brave enough to get into anything deep on here right now. When my heart is open and raw is the last time in my life I enjoy a little salt. Let it at least scab over a little before I expose it to salt air I say.

  245.  #245Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    Sweetpea, I don’t know why, but I’m feeling protective of you … and full of anticipation and wonder bc it feels like you are right on the edge of breaking through something big … I feel hopeful that we can all “hold space” for you as you work through this…


  246.  #246Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:26 pm


    Lol! I meant “sea air.” Sea air, salt air, what’s the difference? LOL

  247.  #247Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:27 pm


    RE: #195 – You asked, “Chocolate man said he will talk to me tomorrow if I am feeling pressurized.
    If this conversation comes up tomorrow, should I name X?????”

    I feel like I am watching a movie where the answer seems so obvious, so healing, so The Answer…


  248.  #248Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    Thanks Lucy! I feel tears in my eyes, quivering lipped, tentative stepping out reading your post.

    Thank you!

  249.  #249Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:30 pm


    When I had excessive bleeding, the last thing I wanted to do was spread my legs before a gynecologist.

    When I was nauseous and vomitting and feeling horrible pain, the last thing I wanted was to enter an emergency room and be told that I was going to have my gall bladder cut out.

    But I wanted to heal. So I did it. It was worth the discomfort, embarrassment, and pain…

    What do you think/feel?

  250.  #250eachdayasif on January 12, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    @Meemee, if I have understood the tools correctly, the point is that you do what feels good and right to you and live in the moment, so that you don’t try and second-guess what someone might or might not think of you for what you say or do, but respond with feeling messages to what they *actually* say and do.

    Please forgive me, I think I am now stepping into boy mode for a moment and giving advice, but can’t quite resist the temptation and I hope it might help.

    It feels to me as if Chocolate Man is giving you a gift … he is pushing against the secrecy which has brought you so much pain, and yes, almost *demanding* you give it up. I can see that it might feel v. scary, but maybe if you could shift your perception, this is an opportunity to really move past it and maybe even take back some of the power X has exerted over you with the secrecy. It also feels like CMan is very cogniscent of your pain and trying to relieve it – maybe he is pushing you hard, but he did also suggest you confide in a female friend, perhaps he sees that you feel unable to do that which is why he is so insistent. (I may be completely wrong, of course, as I don’t know him, but you do, and you are in the perfect position to decide how his behaviour feels to you, and behave accordingly)

    It feels as if you (at least a little bit) want to blurt the *entire* story out to Chocolate Man, which is scaring you. I agree with Sweetpea, choose only what you want to share, and when you’ve got to the point where you feel uncomfortable, stay boundaried, and simply tell him (as many times as is needed) that you feel uncomfortable/pressurised or whatever you are feeling. It’s completely acceptable to tell CM that you had a relationship with X which he swore you to secrecy about, and that now you feel completely vulnerable in X’s presence. You certainly don’t need to share that you slept with X if you don’t want to, that’s kind of private – but if you do want to share that, well, that’s fine too. It’s all up to you – reclaim your power. (Be all I am tiger, hear me ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR!!!!!!!!!!!!! Probably would help with the anger you have been feeling too)

    I feel hopeful that Chocolate Man will believe whatever you choose to share, but even if he doesn’t, so what? If he has pushed you to confide in him, he can hardly be surprised if you take him at his word, and it would be excellent practice of the tools for you to tell him that you feel betrayed, confused, upset or whatever, if you needed to.

    *Sigh* I feel inadequate. I wish I could be as articulate and wise as Lone Plum. But these are my thoughts, FWIW, and if even one phrase strikes a chord and helps, then I will feel happy.

    ((((((hugs))))) Meemee, I am totally confident you will be fine. Look how far you’ve come already, after all.

  251.  #251Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:33 pm


    I think at least the doctor anesthetized you before he removed your gall bladder and the gynecologist is no comparison to it at all. I don’t want to be judgmental here, but you tell me playing Russian Roulette isn’t that scary and that might be more persuasive.

  252.  #252quinn99 on January 12, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Re: 229

    Thanks Brenda and Sweetpea for responding…

    I feel vulnerable having shared something so deeply personal. I’m glad I found this blog and posted today and it makes me more sure that I will not contact 51. Not today… I am trying to have faith that if his fear and misery keep him away that I will not perpetuate it by emasculating him any further…

    Rather – I need to find ways to put the focus on how to improve my self esteem – to learn how to love myself – value myself and really be the girl….It can’t happen soon enough….


  253.  #253Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    228: Sweetpea says:
    “…Chocolate Man is supposed to be Meemee’s therapist if she’s CDing him…”

    I believe we find the message; I don’t believe every man I meet is literally my therapist in that I’m bound to discuss with each one intimate details of my life. I don’t believe it works that way.

    “I’m feeling triggered right now because I’m having some strong realizations in my own life that my Dad’s opinions have colored my perceptions of men I’ve dated and it hasn’t served me.”

    Sorry to learn that. But don’t despair; make it work for you.

    I think there is a father/men who we are attracted to kind of connection. My father and my husband were both really cool and good looking too.

    Here’s something funny, in later life when my husband was older (we were divorced by then) I noticed he looked somewhat like my father. LOL 😆 The too of them got along really well together too, even after the divorce.

    “I’m just looking at all of this “don’t trust him” stuff…”

    That’s not my stuff. I’d trust him to be who he revealed himself to be and at the moment that’s a casual date who’s grilling a woman about personal matters. That’s inappropriate in my book. I trust myself too and if I’m feeling “icky” about something, as seems to me to be the case there, I take heed.

    “So I’ve decided I’m not talking to my Dad about any of the guys I date anymore.”

    Is your father ever helpful at all? Ever like any of the guys? My father was always very helpful to me about all kinds of things. Everything! Not saying that your father has to be right about everything; mine wasn’t, but very helpful in general.

    Once my father took an instant dislike to a guy I was dating after I separated and it was based on a silly misunderstanding but I always thought he was rooting for my ex-husband to get me back. Didn’t work… LOL 😆


  254.  #254Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:36 pm


    RE: #201 – I just watched Ricky Martin on the Oprah Show. He said he feels so free and so at peace since revealing to the world he is gay.

    He said if he had known how wonderful it would feel, he would have come out 10 years ago!

    If I were you, I’d wait until X was in your room with your associates. Then when Chocolate Man asked you why you are so sad or who you are scared of, I would look X straight in the eye and say, “X has had an affair with me the past 3 years, and he refuses to treat me with respect and honor.” Or whatever fits you and the situation.

    The benefits FAR outweigh the risks of baring X’s secret.

  255.  #255Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:37 pm


    P.S. Once someone was threatening to destroy my reputation if I didn’t do what he wanted. I called his bluff and refused to let him control me. All was fine~

  256.  #256Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:38 pm


    RE: #248 – I never said it wasn’t scary and painful. And every analogy breaks down somewhere. My point was it’s worth the risk to find complete healing. I am in your corner.

  257.  #257Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 2:46 pm


    RE: #207 – When a man wants to “hang out” with me, I take it as his self-conscious way of asking me out on a date. If I am talking with a man, I am getting practice with my Siren skills.

  258.  #258Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    SLV, re: 250

    First, thank you for gentleness in responding.

    In answer to your question, when i comes to men, no. My Dad has never had a positive thing to say about any of them. The guy he wanted me to be with when I was a teenager turned out having an affair with his neighbor and being a drug addict.

    My taste in men hasn’t always been great, but I believe it’s better than my Dad’s. The guy I referred to above is the one and only guy my Dad ever approved of. I wasn’t really that interested and I still don’t understand what my Dad saw in him.

    Nope. My Dad has given me great advice in lots of areas of my life, but the one guy I dated who really was a good guy, wanted to get married and have kids, made over $100k a year consistently, had the same values and morals I did, my Dad told me I couldn’t trust him (even though he never met him) because he was in sales and you can’t trust salesmen. Also a bunch of other stuff that totally skewed me on him and I sabotaged the relationship because of it.

    My ex-fiance, my Dad was right about. He was a weasle. LOL. Sorry. Maybe not a weasle, but he wasn’t a stepping up kind of guy. He couldn’t even choose a restaurant for us to eat at. I got tired of making all the decisions. Even then, when I had quite a few more masculine qualities than I do now, I resented him for it. Grow some cajones, man! At least he actually met him before he started telling me anything negative about him though.

    The most recent guy, my Dad told was totally against because he’s slightly darker skinned than me. He told me he was just using me to get back at the white man and oh Lord. All kinds of stuff. His famous fallback is that they’re just using me for my body. Seems to always circulate around that. And I buy into it, sabotage the relationship and only recently have noticed it and said, “enough!”

    I love my Dad. I know he means well. He gives me all kinds of good advice in other areas of my life, but when it comes to love, he’s more of a hindrance than a help. I already have trust issues. I’m healing them and learning to believe that I want the best for me and being able to trust myself, but he is certainly no help.

    I realized a long time ago that I would have to heal my relationship with my Dad before I could have a good relationship, but this is one area where I’m considering him toxic and shying away from it.

    Thanks for your feedback SLV. I’m glad you had a better relationship with your Dad.

  259.  #259Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 2:56 pm


    Thank you. I will consider what you have to say. After all, if a man’s not in front of me, he doesn’t exist, so I should be talking about what I’m aware of that needs healing as opposed to the therapist who brought it to my attention anyway, right?

  260.  #260quinn99 on January 12, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    Re: 164 & 229

    Hi – I am new to Rori’s blog. I hope it is ok to ask about her products here. I recently got her ebook and have been looking at getting either the Modern Siren or Targeting Mr Right. I keep going back and forth as to which is best for me. I am currently dating (not cd yet) but struggle bigtime with self esteem issues – pushing men away – repeating old patterns – seeking outside validation – abandonment issues to name a few…

    Can anyone shed any light as to which is best? I cannot afford either but I’m desperate to feel better so I will find a way to purchase at least one…

    Thanks in advance for any insight!!

  261.  #261Daria on January 12, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    Ugh it was terrible they ask trief to step up s and they messed it up ront by bringing other women into the picture. But more are d strong up they can’t help it

  262.  #262LonePlum on January 12, 2011 at 3:19 pm


    this is all so tricky; so far away, different culture, not knowing what is really happening

    So I feel shaky here, because I don’t know what is your surrounding about women and sex;

    You posted that X mumbled to you after the meeting and you asked him what he said
    To which he said “i called you names” or something like that
    Next time tell him “Frankly, I don’t give a damn, my dear”

    The thing is that you said nothing
    You are still afraid to not be nice enough for him.
    I shivered

    Think of it
    You were good to him always
    You regularly called him to give him free sex
    He never gave you anything, yet you gave him your own home to enjoy sex his own selfish way
    He did not pleasure you
    The whole thing was about him
    It costed him no money, no trips, no conversations, no feelings, nothing
    It was totally free and all for his benefit

    He should be grateful for the 3 years. Honestly.
    Yet he calls you names as if you had done something wrong to him, like if you had stolen him or something.
    When a man insults a woman who did nothing to him and who gave him sex for years, something is building up.

    You don’t know him at all. You never saw him react as a son, as a brother, as a friend in a party, as a fiancé, you only saw him in between doors.
    You said often “X would never say the secret to anybody.”
    You don’t know that
    You don’t know him at all.
    Everybody ends up sharing secrets. Unless he is married and protects his home 100%

    I would not tell chocolate anything.
    He is asking for info, it feels wrong
    I mean he is pushing again and again.
    I would use him to practice my boundaries and my self respect.
    Practice to talk only when you want to, don’t let people make you say and do things you don’t really want
    Practice to speak your truth in the moment. With no anger, no shouting, just calmly what you know is true to you.
    So far, you either have been totally quiet with X or you shout your guts out.
    Try to speak yourself out of your world of silence. But don’t let people drag you out of it. That’s not freedom nor self respect nor feel good situation. It is rape, again.

    May be you would like to get used to tell the secret.
    Pick a person not connected to your work or family or studies
    Tell her the secret.
    Observe what you feel and what words come out of your mouth
    Observe also her reactions
    how does her reaction make you feel etc…
    Listen to her words, they should help you
    if she is the right person, you’ll see the light out of the tunnel.

    Wait some time to see how long it takes for your secret to be repeated in her world (Shared secrets are always repeated to others)
    Observe how your secret is transformed when it comes back to you and how people react
    Does it change how you feel?
    Does it change how they act with you? In which way?
    Get used to telling the secret and to receive people’s reaction.

    You will know how your secret really feel.
    It might not be such a mountain .
    You are God’s child.
    There is nothing you did that was not done by millions others before you and will be done after you.
    Keeping the secret, you keep the feeling you are not normal, you are unique in having a “problem”
    and you are unworthy
    Speak of it and you might hear of similar stories coming from all over the country. You’ll see 🙂

    When you master the “telling your secret” tool, when you don’t feel it such a big peculiar unique sin, and IF it is still necessary, you will tell it at work with no problem.


  263.  #263Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    I woke up this morning and WH came to my mind with a HUGE AND SUDDEN DROP IN MY ATTRACTION LEVEL for him.

    I feel surprised and baffled and a bit concerned.

    Why do I suddenly feel a shift in my attraction to him?

    Is it “sour grapes” setting in?

    Will I end up feeling that NO man is good enough for me?

    I feel a bit sad.

    And worried.

    And a little relieved.

  264.  #264Femininewoman on January 12, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    RE 259 love how you expressed this LONE PLUM couldn’t express it better myself

  265.  #265RTCathy on January 12, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    SLV @ 223 Yes, I want the kind of excitement that is even and not dependant on others, I aspire to developing that. I am trying to develop my love for self and start little projects for me – booking a massage, even signing up for a half marathon, going on holiday etc. I am also trying to work on my issues heal anything that might lead me to be addicted to him.

    I have fallen for BMW man and at the moment, the feeling of him wanting me back after this break made me feel so good, I had to share it. He is at hismost romantic and charming at the moment I wanted to describe that, I cherish the feeling. Although there have been lots of ups and downs with this man and even the act of acknowledging the up and idenfy it as part of an addiction can be helpful to me…

    It is better to have loved though, before I found this site I was alone for 12 years. I am learning to open my heart and not get it broken. Still got a lot to learn.

  266.  #266Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    @255: Sweetpea:
    “…Nope. My Dad has given me great advice in lots of areas of my life,…..
    Thanks for your feedback SLV. I’m glad you had a better relationship with your Dad….”

    Better relationship? Maybe. Maybe not all that different from yours. My father and I did not see eye-to-eye on many things. I just looked for the good stuff and ran with that. Mostly listened to what he had to say; it was usually good, probably like your Dad’s. But if I thought about it differently I checked it out the best I could and then did what I thought was best. Big ole smile: “Oh, Daddy, I didn’t like that.” End of story.

    Well, he bailed me out a few times… 😆 Oh, not literally. I was never in jail…. LOL Usually some money thing. Guess I was kind of spoiled.

    I bet you do that too. I don’t know your situation but I will guess it is like most of us with our parents. I know my parents did the best they could for me with what they knew and had available to them at the time. There were sometimes “fights” and pouting. LOL We all laughed about it.

    My father was usually cool about my dates except for a couple of them but when I was very young my mother only liked about half of them. On those occasions she was always polite but managed to say some negative thing…usually just one…when they were not present. Like “he’s OK, but he’s got false teeth!”

    Sweetpea, if I took everything to heart that my mother said, I would never have had any dates!!! No kidding. She was particularly fond of this one guy who was so square and nicey-nice and I swear asexual! I was in my twenties. I’m laughing now just thinking about him. I feel kind of guilty because he was a really decent guy but boring… LOL

    That’s the great thing about being grown-up you get to do what you want all the while not having to argue with your parents. I listened, and acknowledged their point of view and then did what I wanted Funny thing, they often ended up helping me do it.

    Most of the time great advice, but sometimes I tilted things my way and made a different decision. We usually weren’t too far apart but ultimately it was my call and they knew that. They were pretty wise though, I’ll give them that but they were not perfect! As I am not perfect.

    I heard all of my life, and I mean ALL, (I could stand behind where he coudn’t see me and mouth the words, I’d heard them so often) that my father wanted me to go to medical school; I think because my older brother had. Did I? No. I didn’t feel bad about it either. I got an education, of course, but I did not become a thoracic surgeon.

    But one good thing that did stick was his idea that women could do anything men could do, sometimes better he thought. hahaha. OK, that’s true.

    Don’t be too hard on yourself or put off things until every thing is absolutely “healed” in your life. Make your happiness as you go.


  267.  #267blacklily on January 12, 2011 at 3:52 pm

    Blessings beautiful Queens I’m new and I love love the energy here!

    I have been reading off and on about how to incorporate CD while still dating the man I have invested in for the past 6 months. CD is going well and I have been getting loads of attention and the ability to test my feelings and intentions out on them. Some have gone and still others have returned, but still I test my own energy, my own willingness to love… my own intentions.

    In light of my dating, here on out referenced as “truckman #2… I see that had I focused all of my energy on him without CD, I would have been drained to the point of suicide. Suicide of heart, mind, body and spirit. I gave and gave while he took and sometimes deflected my desire to love. His defense to my love always came in the form of short temperedness or jokes jokes and more jokes. He is the funniest and most light hearted man I have ever met in my life. And it felt good… until I understood the mask. The defense to my intentions.

    I finally opened up to him today. I didn’t fear the “eggshell” feeling of not wanting to share my emotions. I now see it was how I was delivering it that brought on his defenses and short tempered rebuttles. How can you say that? Didn’t I? What did I tell you before? Why are you impatient? Where is this coming from? I thought we resolved that issue? etc. etc.

    I gave him a seemingly endless stream of feeling messages today. I didn’t know if I would ever stop the fluid nature of the riff… it just went on and on and on. It poured out onto him, back onto me.. onto us.

    Yet he refused to acknowledge my feelings of sadness. He refused to acknowledge us… He combated my emotions with more jokes. Joked about my expression of wishing I could do his laundry and massage his back, but I am SAD about the IMPOSSIBILITY of it all as HE had stated in a previous mail. He chose to focus on why I couldn’t do his laundry not my feelings. He doesn’t like anyone doing his laundry. He is an ass when it comes to his laundry. A whiny B@#$* when it comes to his laundry. I never knew this about him. I see after 6 mo. I know little about him. I shared my feeling of sadness for not knowing him. Sadness that he rarely asked me questions about myself. Sad that he wanted me to wait until he grew towards love while I was trying to teleport myself there. He also said that my doing his laundry would start another tv show called “Intimacy Gone Wrong Because You F’d Up My Laundry”… the last mail followed with. I hope your at least smiling now… I told him I wasn’t.

    There was a complete disconnect of emotions. I thought that at different points in the past that he showed emotion, but now I only see it was either anger, disgust or laughter.

    My feeling messages went on for days yet he didn’t acknowledge my fear, my sadness, my numbness, my zombiedom… nothing. He loves zombies so he did acknowledge my zombiedom, but with a joke. “There is only one cure for zombiedom”? I took the bait and ask what? He said “Brains!” lol. For the first time I didn’t laugh. The joke was actually corny. I wonder how many other corny jokes he told and I laughed till my throat hurt.

    Maybe his lack of acknowledgement is due to him not having digested what I wrote. So I am leaning back and waiting on a more insightful and mature response. I am prepared that it may never come.

    I am estatic about the power I feel due to being open and ready for what comes my way. It doesn’t matter what comes. What matters is how I feel during the moment of reception. I may not want you after all….

    So who is the real me? A controlling, brat that actually fears intimacy herself. Who give’s impatient encounters of the third kind to men I find don’t move to the beat of my drum… A deaf mute who sits in a corner and pouts when she accepts text messages as a form of communication and gets mad when she doesn’t get a response she’s expecting from her marionette… trying to navigate and control outcomes when her emotions run high. This is not research… there are no control subjects and experimental subjects. Either I give them the real pill or keep faking the funk with my placebo. I need to heal this little bratty girl that only comes out when I hit a relationship brick wall. Funny, I have only hit a few brick walls in my life that have brought the real me out and my current “truckman #2” has taken me to new heights of self-destructive behavior. I am growing. He has taken my battering ram abuse and every time I run away and break things off… I come back and he is there with crumbs to feed me. I’m hungry. I’m anorexic but exceedingly hungry. Thank you for the crumbs… the “good morning” and “good night” texts and nothing in between to fill the dead space are all I need to warm my anorexic body. It doesn’t take much. The jokes that buff my kisses and deep wells of emotion. They are ok. I like jokes. Who doesn’t like a joke? Are you kidding me? Laugh to keep from crying bratty love starved anorexic little girl….

    Who I am right now? I’m a WITCH who wants him to simmer in my caldron of feeling messages. Simmer in my words and stew in my emotions. Till his own feelings and emotions fall off his bones… ohhhh the tenderness of it all. The suculant flavor of truth and authenticity. The heart and the marrow…. mmmm

    I am ready for what comes. Ready to release my fears and eat at his flesh of emotion until I am dumb, fat, happy and transformed. Yet it may never come and Anorexic girl’s perception of self is changing just by knowing this. What I saw in the mirror as fat and full of life is actually deflatted, ribs and boney knees. I’m starving and I feel full just by knowing this….

  268.  #268Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 4:10 pm


    About the secrecy, where I am coming from is having talked to many women who were sexually abused in the past. In effect, you were sexually abused.

    All of the women said that the pain and fear surrounding it was broken when they pulled the “dirty little secret” out in the light. All of them spoke of finding much freedom and joy in becoming transparent. The power X holds over you is largely in the secrecy. Do you want to be free of his power?

    Your story keeps reminding me of all the rape stories I ever heard. The victim would be asked, “Why didn’t you tell anyone?”

    She would say, “Because he said he would hurt me if I did” or “Because I was afraid no one would believe me” or “Because I was afraid of what people would think of me”.

    You could find full freedom from the pain and power of X by airing his “dirty little secret”.

    Of course it isn’t easy or carefree to do. But just think how you will feel after you have come out of the dark and into the light! Think of the freedom and release you have come to know here on the blog sharing with all your worldwide friends! 🙂

    If it’s too hard to voice it, type it, print it out, and post it all over the office.

    What do you think or feel?

  269.  #269Sweetpea on January 12, 2011 at 4:14 pm


    Re: 263 “Most of the time great advice, but sometimes I tilted things my way and made a different decision. We usually weren’t too far apart but ultimately it was my call and they knew that. They were pretty wise though, I’ll give them that but they were not perfect! As I am not perfect.”

    Funny thing is, most of my life I’ve done as I darn well please – from the time I was 3 – swear to God, but on the guy thing, I fall for his negativity every time. I take it to heart and act on it and then go, “OH. OOPS! Sorry. Listening to my Dad again.” But by the time I figure it out, things are generally completely messed up and I mess them up more in trying to fix them. I read a book recently that talks about “frenemies” i.e. Friends who are not supportive of your relationships for whatever reason – usually selfishness or jealousy. I don’t know what it is with my Dad and I don’t want to try to define it as anything other than protectiveness and wanting the best for me, but I’ve decided to treat him as a “frenemy” when it comes to relationships and just not speak to him of them. Like I said, I love him and I know as you say, he’s not perfect, but he’s pretty great! And I feel happy to say that because there were 5 years of my life that I didn’t speak to him for a variety of reasons. Now I see that he loves me unconditionally, he did the best he could and that was pretty damn good.

    You said: “But one good thing that did stick was his idea that women could do anything men could do, sometimes better he thought. hahaha. OK, that’s true.”

    My Dad did that as well. He has the ultimate faith in me, yet sometimes his example in relationship tells me that he doesn’t have a ton of respect for women in general. Maybe that’s a false belief. I that I know is I feel very confused about it.

    You said: “Don’t be too hard on yourself or put off things until every thing is absolutely “healed” in your life. Make your happiness as you go.”

    I completely agree with this and am making an effort to do just that. Just wanting this stuff to heal along the way. Some of these wounds and reactions have been a part of my life for just way too long and stand in the way of ALL my relationships – work and friendships included. I’m practicing patience with myself but sometimes it sure is hard.

    Thanks again.

  270.  #270Senior Lady Vibe on January 12, 2011 at 4:16 pm

    @262: RTCathy
    “… I am learning to open my heart and not get it broken…”

    That is excellent. I’m learning new things too and I’ve been living single for a long time.


  271.  #271Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 4:29 pm

    I have been dating a guy the last 4 months and it’s been nothing but solid stress/drama-free FUN that brings us closer and closer and wanting to be with each other each time we are apart. We have never had any tension or argument, it’s been all laughter and joy.

    The beginning of a relationship is supposed to be easy like that because you have all the help from the falling-in-love chemicals in the brain.

    It is a contrast to what I had with my estranged husband, it was painful, drama-filled, and difficult from the start but I forced myself to accept this guy knowing full well it would be a real hard journey. It didn’t last. My intuition was right.

    Your “relationship” with this guy from what you told us has been nothing but one painful experience to another. It’s a huge red flag you can’t ignore. There is no point on forcing yourself onto him (the way I was with my ex in a way) because it won’t work in the long run.

    Find a man who’s available and excited about you (my husband was but we had personality clash issues)-again, I don’t see that in this guy at all. Why do you want to work that hard even in the beginning? He’s supposed to woo and court you, none of which he’s doing. That’s why I say he’s not that into you. A guy who is into a woman would do all that to try to win you over (my new guy does). What do you think it’s gonna be like 3 years from now if by sheer miracle you end up marrying him?

  272.  #272snowqueen on January 12, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    A man who said he’d call me tonight didn’t do so. And I feel totally calm about it.

    Wow. What an amazing feeling.

  273.  #273Lisi on January 12, 2011 at 5:27 pm

    Lucy — not sure the back story on WH. I can tell you that I tend to feel a drop in my attraction level about the time the guy is really interested. It’s my fear of intimacy kicking in. Watch for that.

    So, after several intense weeks of connecting with ex-guy, he texted me out of the blue today, “I hope you find someone who deserves u L, I mean that. I enjoyed all moments with u. U brought out my best.”

    My answer was: “What the hell?” followed by “Now I’m angry, upset & confused. What is going on with you? It sounds like a good bye. Like thanks, but I’m gonna pass.”

    So he called me. Turns out that temp contract he moved away for ended and he hasn’t found anything else.

    Same story as before.

    Okay — I got to that point in my comment and he called. I am at work for another hour and a half and I told him that. I’m sure I’ll hear from him again.

    I’m a bit upset — but more all right than I might have been.

    This past couple of weeks — with him calling and texting and all the intensity — has felt really great to me. I have been feeling really sexy and attractive and I love the attention.

    How great for me!

    I cried when I was on the phone with him earlier, but it passed almost as soon as I hung up.

    I’m on the bridge. I’m headed to my happily ever after. THAT’s the goal — not THIS man.

    I’m focusing on that. I have a friend coming over tonight, and we’ll drink wine and decompress.

    I got an email today from a guy in my email queue that seems interesting. He said he “googled” me. lol He hasn’t asked me out yet, but he will.

    Tomorrow night I see bachelor #1. He’ll want sex, but I’m not sure where we’re at emotionally, so, I need to feel about it.

    Maybe sex would feel really yummy and scrumptious — as long as I don’t get caught up in needy and clingy emotions about bachelor #1.

    La la la la life goes on…..

  274.  #274Lisi on January 12, 2011 at 6:22 pm


    I had an affair with my married boss when I was in my early 20’s. When I broke it off, I went to his partner and told him what had been going on. I needed to leave and move back home (thousands of miles away) for my own reasons. He arranged payment for me to move home. He took care of all my needs and got me back on my feet.

    I didn’t tell him because I was trying to blackmail anyone. I just went to him to say this had been happening and I needed to quit and leave without the usual 2 weeks notice and this was why.

    I agree that he only has power as long as you keep his secret. And, if this is a work situation — he could try to get rid of you.

    You are probably safer by speaking up than by keeping it a secret.

  275.  #275Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 6:55 pm


    In case you missed it, Meemee is leaving at the end of the month already for her education.

  276.  #276Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 7:24 pm

    I tend to agree with Rori chemistry for a woman can grow if she’s reasonably attracted to a guy. It’s much harder for a guy to grow chemistry if he doesn’t feel it in the first few seconds.

    SG told me he knew the first few seconds he wanted me. I didn’t feel anything till after the dinner and we shared a kiss. Even after sex it was so so…not until he really wooed me the next day I fell hard for him.

  277.  #277Simply Shannon on January 12, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    Sweetpea, I haven’t read through all of your posts carefully but noticed the ones about you feeling anxious and really triggered. I couldn’t get a good grasp on what was triggering you. Is it talking “bad” about your dad? Or something else?

    I’ve done a fair amount of work at forgiving my parents. I haven’t had a discussion with my father yet but I told my mother some stuff that I’ve held in most of my life. In particular not believing my father loved me. This is a belief I still fight any time I see him.

    I forgive him and I forgive myself for not seeing that he loved me. One day my beliefs/feelings will match up with my CHOICE of forgiveness.

  278.  #278Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 7:41 pm


    It’s nice when passion juice mingles, too, huh? 😆

  279.  #279Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 8:04 pm

    I feel frustrated about the chemistry thing. Maybe “attraction” and “chemistry” and “falling for him” and all those things mean something different to me than they do other people, I don’t know. 🙁 I don’t know where the disconnect is.

    I mentioned the topic to my daughter today and she said that her marriage and family class profs (husband and wife) said that chemistry can grow for both men and women — IF there is already attraction in many other areas.

  280.  #280Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 8:06 pm

    Katarina, in your post #272, how are you defining “chemistry”?

  281.  #281Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 8:21 pm

    Brens, oh yeah! 🙂

    Lucy, chemistry is physical/sexual attraction that grows into emotional attraction in time. I was reasonably (if mildly) attracted to him the first few hours, it grew exponentially when he was really showing so much interest in me. That’s often what it takes for a woman to fall in love.

    That’s why I don’t understand why Quinn can be so attached to this carefree guy (who even refuses to pay for dates) and they haven’t even had sex yet. It’s great though that she understands that she has issues brought from childhood she needs to work on. Quinn, maybe you can illuminate us if there are things about this guy you haven’t told us. He can’t be all that bad if you’re so taken by him, can he?

  282.  #282Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    oh, I’ve gotten attached without having sex – it’s easy!

  283.  #283Daria on January 12, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    triggered that last nite the growing cd said i am sometimes a brat and spoiled

    triggreed! too cuz he decided to tell me about his plans to have sex with another woman that day sicne i havent’ had sex with him

    that felt bad and i left thrwoing up the “deuces”


    with getrright man he was being nice but my friend once she got drunk was all over him, then this morning was like oh why’d you leave – CUZ I FELT JEALOUS AND BAD!


    had a nice out the blue cd today

    and also met another guy who wanted to cd me

  284.  #284Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 8:33 pm

    i wonder if the disconnect is that other people are meaning Overpowering sexual attraction when they use the word chemistry….

  285.  #285Lucy on January 12, 2011 at 8:38 pm

    i think chemistry to me means being drawn to someone on a visceral level…

  286.  #286Katarina Phang on January 12, 2011 at 9:09 pm

    I think chemistry can also mean overall feeling about someone: his/her touch, feel of his/her skin, the way he/she moves…he/she does it for the other person.

    You can feel initial chemistry upon meeting someone but lose it in the bedroom because sexually he/she doesn’t do it in all that overall feeling.

    That’s why it’s so important to know if someone does it for you in the bedroom before you commit. Because no matter how attracted you are to him/her, if in the sex dept. there is no great chemistry, it can very much be a deal breaker.

  287.  #287Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 9:11 pm


    I am taking some down time to reread some of the posts to and/or about me last week when I was having my meltdown. I’d like to respond to something you said in the thread, “https://blog.havetherelationshipyouwant.com/dating/its-never-too-late-to-marry/”:

    Ella – #502: “I also felt anger at seeing what was happening with Brenda and felt frustrated at seeing the same situation again and again…
    Being asked for advice and then not taking it & repeating the behaviour.
    Yes, feels like unhealthy addiction to me too.
    Feels like going in circles.
    Although I have also been there so feel less angry / triggered. I don’t want Brenda to hurt but I feel f8cking mad when I give some suggestions and they get dismissed or ignored.”

    I like Rori’s approach of baby steps. I started listening to Rori’s CD seminars in April 2009. She said so many things to do or not do for success and health in a romantic relationship that I didn’t do for a very long time.

    It’s not that I was dismissing or ignoring Rori’s suggestions, or anyone else’s. It’s that this stuff is really deep, and it takes TIME and HEALING to make deep, inner shifts.

    I wanted quick fixes! I saw things going awry with Ryan in 2009 and realized that the tools Rori was giving weren’t just little catch phrases to impress a man.

    Further, when I am airing my deep, inner issues, which, by the way, feels very vulnerable, I may be getting advice from 50 different people. It feels weird to think I am expected to accept and follow the advice of 50 different people.

    I have been in and out of therapy all my adult life. All the good therapists I went to acknowledged that I am not obligated to do what they said. It is MY decision. At the end of time, I alone must give an account of my words and actions. Free will is at the base of it all. I alone am accountable.

    Even so, I have taken MUCH of what has been given me here and have been working it with a serious commitment to healing. I have neglected many of my responsibilities outside of emotional healing in favor of finding health emotionally.

    It would feel so good if I could bare my heart on Rori’s blog and feel consistently nurtured, to be able to grow at my pace, in baby steps.

    I know that I have grown tremendously, and I feel emotionally unsafe when I read your post. What do you think and/or feel?

  288.  #288Daria on January 12, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    HOw do I feeling message telly friend that I feel unvomfortable w her getting close and all over a guy I like when she’s drunk … Yet she’s otherwise trying to hook me up w him….

  289.  #289Leo on January 12, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    Hi Ladies!

    Tomorrow this whole nightmare with my university has an end for a little while. So I can finally enjoy my personal life with my Man again, who is being awesome lately.

    Though I have to admit… my understanding of how I need to change (according to Rori) and this horrible time with school, kinda came in the right moment.
    I mean… leaning back is so hard for me. But as I was so stressed out it was waaayyy easier to me to not overfunction and give my man a chance to actually miss me. I had so many things on my mind that I was able to not think of him as much as I used to.
    If he said he’d call and he doesnt – I dont bother so much any more. I dont get all pissy cause first: it doesnt happen very often, and seconds: if it happens he’s making up for it.

    So now that I see what just this leaning back and my being open can give me in my relationship – I will definitely continue doing this.

    Yesterday night, when I was laying in bed, I was thinking about how nice it would be if he’d call. I couldnt even finish my thought before my phone rang.

    And, i know, to some of you this all might look like getting crumbs, but its a lot more than that.
    And now I am actually able to truely enjoy all this and to NOT get all rapped up in my sad/missing feelings.

    I just feel so great regarding all this.

    Thanks, Rori.


  290.  #290Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 9:29 pm


    RE: #515 in https://blog.havetherelationshipyouwant.com/dating/its-never-too-late-to-marry/:

    LG: “I feel pissed and annoyed seeing sirens defending Brenda. It feels soooooo unhealthy to me. Whoops. That feels like a judgement. My judgement is, these protectors are doing Brenda a disservice…perpetuating her addiction to being a victim.”

    This felt really bad to read. I am not saying my feelings and actions surrounding Ryan were healthy. But I was airing my heart of hearts FOR THE PURPOSE OF finding healing.

    I feel the same way I did the time I went to an alcohol rehab with a past boyfriend, Christopher. It was one of six rehabs he went to in six months, desperately looking for help. When the rehab director met us in the yard, he began to yell at my man, “You are drunk! What are you doing here drunk?? Get off my property before I call the police!!”

    I felt shocked and horrible, and I said, “He is stuck in his addiction! He is here for help! Please help him!”

    The rehab director continued in anger and we left. A few months later, Christopher had died of advanced stage liver disease.

    Nobody was perpetuating my addiction. I myself was not perpetuating my addiction. They were helping me get free of it. I can only get help by letting my inner feelings and processes be known. Thank God and thank Rori and the Sirens and Heroes, I broke it, and I felt a huge inner shift over the past week or so. What do you think/feel?

  291.  #291Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 9:43 pm


    In the same past thread in #542, you asked What is love?

    God is Love. And the greatest expression of love is to lay down your life for a friend.

    Love is patient;kind; does not envy; does not boast; is not proud; does not dishonor others; is not self-seeking; is not easily angered; keeps no record of wrongs; does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth; always protects; always trusts; always hopes; always perseveres; and love never fails.

  292.  #292Darling Ella on January 12, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    #266 Blacklily:

    I felt touched by your post…I loved the metaphors u used to describe your feelings 🙂

    Welcome to the blog 🙂

    Warm hugs,

  293.  #293Rori Raye on January 12, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    Wow, Brenda – you totally rock! Love, Rori

  294.  #294Rori Raye on January 12, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Daria – I would be pissed all out if any woman – especially one who says she’s my friend did that with a man I liked. How about “I feel really pissed. I don’t want to even know you. I can’t stand being around you when that happens. What do you want to do about it? Does this end our friendship, or can I ask you to stay the crap away from him and stay my friend?” Love, Rori

  295.  #295Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 10:26 pm


    Awww, thank you! That means a lot to me coming from you. You are amazing!

    Love, Brenda

  296.  #296Darling Ella on January 12, 2011 at 10:57 pm


    What is the email address I can use to send you a message? Thank you.

    Warm hugs,

  297.  #297Brenda on January 12, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    Darling Ella,

    In the past, Rori directed us to write her at her assistant’s email: melanie@coachrori.com.

  298.  #298Darling Ella on January 12, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    Thank you Brenda.

    Happy to see you are feeling so much better 🙂

    I feel proud of you 🙂

    Happy New Year to you…:) Did u celebrate the Russian Orthodox right?

    Warm hugs,

  299.  #299Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 12:02 am

    Darling Ella,

    Thank you, and you’re welcome! I don’t know anything about the Russian Orthodox, but thank you!

  300.  #300BarbinOz on January 13, 2011 at 12:57 am



    I haven’t been on this site for MONTHS, but just wanted to wish all of you Sirens A Very Happy New Year 2011. Hope you are all doing well and find the man of your dreams this year.

    I am moving back to England in just over 6 weeks time and I know if it wasn’t for RR and her method of getting into your FEELINGS this would have not happened for me. Obviously it’s not the reason I bought the e book or the DVD’s LOL but still and all they have had a very positive result in my life.

    Maybe my man is just waiting for me over there in lil ol’ England

    Take care ladies.

  301.  #301Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 1:03 am


    I’ve been thinking about you! So glad you checked in! Congratulations on moving home to England! I hope you return here! We miss you!

  302.  #302Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 1:25 am

    Brenda.. #228

    Feeling your feelings really does ease the grip on them. Its hard not to supress them and scary to face them but, they do pass and better feeling emerge.

    Glad u feel better!

  303.  #303Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 1:45 am


    I would be pissed too, if my friend did that. I cut friends like that out of my life. Luckily my guy at the time told my friend.. It wouldnt be respectful to me and she moved on to his friend.

    Along time ago.. I asked myself is life trying to show me something? When that would happen. Did I flirt with engaged or married men?

    One time a guy told me he wasn’t engaged when he really was and I had kissed him, well, it was like the flip switched. When someone would all over my guy in front of me.

    I felt convicted and forgave myself.. I knew thats not how women should treat other women. Yet I was scared to speak up and had a feeling he was lying. Now I trust myself..

    Life is always a mirror to something. I know Rori says it’s okay even if they have a girlfriend but, I would draw the line if they are engaged or married.

    Women as a whole need to get back to respecting sister hood.

    I had a memory flash..

    Didn’t you have a neighbor or something who was married and flirty with u? Where you back? I could be wrong it was a long time ago…

    I’m sure you know what his wife would have felt like. Just because it’s behind closed doors doesnt mean the universe doesnt see it. Just sayin..

    You deserve to be respected by your friends and if your sowing those seeds in your life you will be. Or it’s just an opportunity to stand up for yourself and draw boundries. 🙂

  304.  #304Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 1:49 am

    The spiral –

    I just heard this lady on a radio show say..

    “We’re always dealing with the same issue.. it’s like a spiral. Somtimes we are just dealing with it at a higher or another level. Maybe even in a different disguise.”

    That felt true for me..

  305.  #305Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 1:54 am

    haha.. SLV – I like the WTF (watch the fire) I’m stealing it.. or sharing it with my friends.. I like sharing better. 🙂

  306.  #306Lorelei on January 13, 2011 at 1:59 am

    Barb – great to see you back here, and I feel delighted to hear you’re coming home!!! Remember the BA advert?!

    Speak more soon.

  307.  #307Lorelei on January 13, 2011 at 2:04 am


    Just want to say I have loved using your idea of sending myself congratulations cards – perhaps on a different thread, a few days ago. Thanks for suggesting it.

    Have already sent myself a happy new home card, as I am soon going to be urgently needing to find my new home. And I sent myself at card of support about letting my illusions and unrealities go (@155) as I grieve the illusions of my ending marriage. That card had a picture of a dandelion seed head (not sure what it’s called in the US?), with the new seeds flying away from the old dead seed head, to go and plant themselves somewhere else to make new flowers.

    Thanks again for such a lovely suggestions

  308.  #308Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 2:06 am

    Lucy and SLV.. I’m on POF..

    Its funny I just decided I would ping pong it. Instead of going thru each message in order and responding.

    There is more guys I find attractive this go around. Maybe I just didnt see it before and it feels more fun and less scary.

    I’m not sure I like the IM thing though. I feel distracted when I keep getting pinged and I’m trying to respond to some one else. I feel annoyed buy it. So, I hit no and they keep at it or send a note.

    I made a note in my profile that said…

    p.s.- It’s nothing personal if I say no to IM, I’m probably just busy in another convo. Just send a me a note. Thanks

    And I still get pinged. I guess I can hide my profile and take to time to respond at leisure. Once it says your online.. And you trying to return emails and new ones keep coming in.. It gets overwhelming and I feel rushed. I think hiding it well help me feel relaxed while I respond.. Then I’ll make it show once I feel caught up and relaxed. 🙂

  309.  #309Sweetpea on January 13, 2011 at 2:47 am


    You can turn off the I’m capability on your profile on pof. I thunk it’s where you specify message details.

  310.  #310Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 2:47 am


    Keep at it! And feel your feelings. My counselor held me back from just “forgiving” and wanted me to really feel my feelings. I had a right to be angry, sad. She thought it was normal and to just feel it. Peace will come up way faster!!!

    And at bedtime I get to feeling peaceful with intention by looking at pics, music, and a gratitude list. I open like 3 windows on my laptap.. and take myself there.

    It’s all that masking and stuffing that makes us feel bad or depressed. And in one session I can be feeling icky and wake up singing praises. I feel like I actually am feeling more passion in my life but, not avoiding the wave of anger or sadness.. You are well on your way! It’s just the law of least resistance to go with the flow.

    The Law of Attraction along with The Power of Intention. I realized if there is something you dont like. Instead of being afraid of or wanting to avoid it.. (Which on a vibrational scale in law of attraction states, would only magnify more events like it. The quickest way to switch the vibration of the bad feeling is to let it pass over you. Then you feel better and better things start coming in quick.

  311.  #311Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 2:47 am


    Before I go to bed I look at a vision bored on “love” and “healthy living” via my lap top. It’s simply pictures I saved in a file on my computer. I open another window and play some good music so the “feeling in my body vibrates with while I’m looking at the photo.” And it really is working. I finally get that it has to do with what you are feeling about and the vibration..

    Looking at the vision bored while I’m pissed would do nothing for attracting it.

    If you play some music and feel hopeful, good, romantic, fun you feel like these things are all what you deserve and will recieve.

    Sending card to yourself just creates the same feeling for me. And the space when you’re waiting to recieve it.. Creates anticipation.. and excitement. It’s silly but in a giggly private way. I’m thinking about buying a box of cards. And just dropping in the mail to myself when I leave a friends house, pass a post office. At work.. There all suprises, and loving yourself makes it so much easier to love others. And I start to feel worthy of recieving.

    Also, I want to buy these boxed cards and send them to all my friends on valentines and me one too. It will switch the vibration, I promise. It’s so normal to feel a little lonely on that holiday. And what a better way to show yourself some love. And remind yourself… New love is in your future 🙂 I would write that.

    So, I was reminded the other day to look at a vision bored in the morning and at night. Twice a day. It’s soooooooo way more easy to make it on your computer. Not a poster bored but, a file with photo’s. You can click thru it quick all thru out the day.

    I just googled and then clicked images on words like soulmate, love, engaged couples. And then for health I googled and clicked images on.. yoga, healthy food, fitness model, money, charity, wayne dyer anything that healthy.. including people that inspired me.

    Oh and I am using Rori’s future reverse writing tool and it’s working too!!! For real. I wanted this trainer and she is soooo busy. But, I emailed her and requested to work out. Then I sent myself a email and said dated it for the future like a week or so ahead, And said… I really enjoyed my work out with Marzia today and it felt good to be in the gym, a little sweaty but, I like it.

    Guess what.. she responded and she had one slot left.. for me! She is a fitness model super busy schedule. I would have been intimadated to even ask before. And now we really will be working out on the same day I said we would in my post dated email to myseld about it! YAYAYA.. It does work. The mind just makes it happen.

    Much happiness,

  312.  #312Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 2:52 am

    Oh and also, hhahaha.

    Watching Modern Sirens Rori mentions. If the guy was into you and something shifted the only way to get it back is to CD because it switches the “Vibration” or energy.. You can’t explain it or beg him.. It really does switch the vibration and gets him back to what he wants and that is the hunt..

    There is no other way around it, with everything else I learned on attracting and vibration energy this does work. AND FEELS SOOOO MUCH BETTER THEN LEANING FORWARD. 🙂

    Maybe not overnight, but it really does.. I am 100 percent convinced and have no desire to lean forward. It’s that mental space..


  313.  #313Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 2:58 am

    Rori – I’m adding a pic of you to my love vision bored as inspiration and a reminder. And it just feels good.


  314.  #314Sweetpea on January 13, 2011 at 2:59 am

    Simply Shannon,

    Thanks for your concern. I had a bad relationship experience, much of which is centered around my Dad’s insistence that men only want me for my body or whatever other negativity he wants to tell me about whomever. I don’t want to talk about the relationship, just the old triggers that came up in the process.

    The rest of the problem is basically fear of abandonment and I’m not quite sure how to heal that but I think I’ve made alot of progress the last few months. So I’m feeling bad about the man but fantasic about my healing process. Just feeling impatient and hopeless about some of the things that need healing.

    I recently forgave myself and all of the men I’ve had significant relationships with in my lifetime. I forgave my Dad a few years back, just find that I play into his negativity way too easily & am seeing how much it’s affected my relationships in the past. Apparently that’s the only area in my life where I’m still seeking his approval. Or maybe it’s that hearing all the negativity growing up is where I developed the triggers in the first place.

    Anyway, neither here nor there really. I just want them healed and I intend to heal them. There that feels good.

    Again, thanks for your concern. xoxo

  315.  #315Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 3:04 am

    Whoa.. This was just now in my email

    What if… ?

    “The universe is full of magical things patiently waiting for our wits to grow sharper.”

    — Eden Phillpotts

    What if you were to pretend that you were healthy, wealthy and wise? What if you were to decide to be happy, no matter what else was happening?

    Take the power of ‘what if…’ seriously, and you will grasp the power to create a world of your own design. Everything, EVERYTHING begins in the imagination. Put it to work constructively for you.

    “The greatest discovery of my generation is that a human being can alter his life by altering his attitudes.”

    — William James

    “Sometimes I’ve believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast.”

    — Lewis Carroll

    Access your own inner wisdom by tapping into your subconscious and intuition.

    from Higher Awareness

  316.  #316Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 3:04 am

    @310: Alicia says:
    “…I’m thinking about buying a box of cards. And just dropping in the mail to myself when I leave a friends house, pass a post office.
    ….Also, I want to buy these boxed cards and send them to all my friends on valentines and me one too…”

    Very cool!

    “…Looking at the vision bored while I’m pissed would do nothing for attracting it. …

    I was reading this trying to figure it out. Do you mean a thing — “vision board?”


  317.  #317Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 3:13 am

    @312: Alicia says:
    “Rori – I’m adding a pic of you to my love vision bored as inspiration and a reminder. And it just feels good. ”

    Could you give some details; I’d like to do something like this. Are you putting jpgs in file or using Animoto, something like that?


  318.  #318Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 3:46 am


    Ted and Tara revisited?

    What do you make of this from EMK’s blog post?

    “…In other words, just because your last boyfriend didn’t want to commit after six months doesn’t mean that you should extract a commitment from the new guy in the first three weeks. That’ll just scare him off…” ~ EMK

    “How Do I Remain Open To Love And Also Protect Myself Emotionally?
    Evan Marc Katz ”
    January 11?, 2011

    I don’t know…is there a sense that it’s right and normal for a guy to “extract a commitment” from a new woman after three weeks but it’s not cool for a woman to do the same…?

    I’m still pondering this. Yeah, I ponder a lot…


  319.  #319Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 4:44 am

    SLV.. Have u seen The Secret or read Think and grow rich? If you havent it’s easy…

    You just cut out pics orrrrrr I put them in a file in my lap top, One file is love and one is health.. And you put pics of what you want to create.. Some people also make videos. I play my own different music and look at it on my computer everyday..

    Here this will help. There is no wrong wau to do it. You can even put it on a poster board. I just find the computer is easiest. I flip thru pics I like.. and a lot of the I got from google images. Just pick the words.. you want to see. love, couples, money.. health


  320.  #320Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 4:48 am

    SLV.. I also suggest playing some happy feel good tunes while you do it. The Secret is a great movie, I dont think you can rent it but, you can buy it at Target or Boarders.

    I’m finally getting it has alot to do with how you feel. Easier to just watch then explain. lol

  321.  #321Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 4:51 am

    🙂 🙂 This hip hop song called Naggin by the Ying Yang twins.. Is so TRUE and amusing.. 🙂 LOL

    This is why we have to speak in “I feel!!!” lol

    And there is even a verse that says.. Here’s the thing I cant stand when a woman acts like a man.. lol


  322.  #322Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 4:52 am

    * SLV meant BORDERS book store

  323.  #323Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 4:56 am

    Actually he says. I cant stand when the woman plays the role of a man… 😉 🙂


  324.  #324Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 5:15 am

    SLV –

    Here is the first 20 minutes of The Secret.. The first 2 minutes is intense, Then it’s super cool.. So give it a few.. 🙂


  325.  #325Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 5:28 am

    Thanks for all the vids — I’ll watch them today. I’m familiar with vision boards and mind movies and have figured out that’s what you are doing but I want to know your method.

    What kind of software file are you using to display your pics? Also have you tried putting them into Animoto and using Animoto stock music tracks to make mind movie videos or are those what those YouTube links are…? — I guess I’ll soon find out… 😛

    Fun, isn’t it? 😆 I’ve done Animoto, it’s fun too.


  326.  #326Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 5:45 am

    I’ll have to try it. Amitto? I just save them to a folder on my laptop and click thru them several times a day..

    I have been inspired and watched The Secret in the past, but.. I didnt apply it everyday like I am now. And now I’m more aware of vibration and frequency in thoughts.

    Thoughts really do have frequency the proof of that is in the water molecule experiment by Dr. Emoto…

    And it can even be traced back to the bible as far as.. Fear Not and to forgive and meditate on anything good. anything just.. meditate on these…

    It all comes together.. No matter where I hear it from or in what angle.. This key.. unlocks doors.

    The water molecule experiment is a must watch it put’s everything perspective along with The Secret.

    and it’s like 2 minutes. 😉

    As far as thoughts carry frequency and vibrations..


  327.  #327Alicia on January 13, 2011 at 5:56 am

    I am a Money Magnet.. luv it- from The Secret!

    I like the line.. “”Money is being printed with my name on it everyday.”” 🙂

    (Alicia likes an abundance of 100’s dollar bills with her name on it. Thanks.).


  328.  #328archerie on January 13, 2011 at 7:01 am

    Brenda ,

    I am so glad you were helped by my “advice” under a different floral nom de plume. Very happy you have settled, and like Rori said , “YOU ROCK!”

    My post was Just mind tools really that I put together and they healed me a lot re the G-man thing.

    He is no longer in my universe. These tools, Rori’s stuff, and Richard Bandler book and hypnosis CD were all wonderful.

    I have had an unpleasant situation with 35- years -ago man though, and I need to use my own tools . He told me he has returned to his fiance and doesnt want to see me or have any contact as he couldnt be friends with me and would always be wondering and attracted etc…oh and he could feel “in his bones” that this year I would meet someone right for me..yikkky patronising sh*t…. He had me down as the fall back if he had found himself single ongoingly:)

    the eyes- up -right and count to 5, big stop sign one is helping..

    Identifying the negative secondary loops ..
    “He thought of me as a possible “other woman” “,
    “It was all about him lining me up in case it fell over with her” (he admitted that)
    “I am not even worthy of friendship”
    “I am only worthy of the crumbs”,
    ” He was using me too while I was in hospital , etc..for counselling”
    etc etc….

    and choosing to NOT repeat these loops (though I am writing them here as an example and a reminder to self how to let go now..)

    Singing Rach 2 in my head, wriggling my toes, to break the loop before it gets entrenched..this way there will be no pining, and no imaginary realtionship.

    And then the pink sparkly heart in the centre of my chest and a giggle thought…yes, just did it all in order ..and feel better.

    and every time I remember anything he said or did or even my teenage love affair with him i will be doing these tools again… uuughh

    Then there is lawyer-man…2 great dates then silence…uuughhhhhher

    Time for the tools again:)

  329.  #329Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 8:29 am


    Animoto is free to make the little half minute videos and you can use their stock photos and music for free. The paid version is $5 per month or $30 per year. There is also a commercial version if you want to use for business, $249 year.

    I haven’t made one in a couple years…but I think I’ll try it again.

    A guy made me a 30 sec one for my birthday last year. I was going to put it up but just replayed it and noticed it has my name in it so not sure I’ll do that now.

    But here is one that’s on YouTube, another guy sent it to me this (part of his Valentine’s Day 2009 mailing) and that’s how I found Animoto. He used the paid version so it’s longer.

    a mind movie made with Animoto 4:52


  330.  #330Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 8:38 am



    If you make one of the freebie half minute videos, let me know what you think of it.

    You have got me thinking about getting a paid version — maybe I’ll just try it for a month — it would be fun to make a little mind movie video about relationships etc. All of the special effects are done automatically online and a video only takes a few minutes to produce!


  331.  #331Simply Shannon on January 13, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Alicia, I’m just popping on few seconds. I’m so going to do the mind movie! Love that. I want some inspiration (having a down day today). This is perfect. Thank you!

    Couple of questions for you if you have time.
    The Secret – who is that by? I went to the used book store several months ago but found a few books and DVDs called The Secret. At the time I didn’t know the author. Do you know? I want to make sure I’m getting the right one. (And I think for whatever reason God didn’t think I was ready a few months ago. I feel ready now!)

    And were you the one who mentioned how to search the blog from Google? I asked this before (and you may have answered) but the topics have changed so quickly lately that I lost track of when I asked last. I’ll come back to this one and check. I promise! 😉

    Thank you so much!! Shannon

  332.  #332Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 9:43 am


    I have “The Power”, the sequel to “The Secret”, and it’s by Rhonda Byrne.

  333.  #333Simply Shannon on January 13, 2011 at 10:13 am

    Thank you Brenda! I just received a 20% discount coupon to the used book store I mentioned above. How’s that for synchronicity!?! 😉

  334.  #334Senior Lady Vibe on January 13, 2011 at 10:23 am


    “How A Simple Attitude Shift Can Change A Man On The Spot”
    Thursday, 13 January 2011 @ 7:28am


  335.  #335Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 10:36 am


    I love it when stuff like that happens!

    I was just noticing last night that, totally unplanned, the quilts (2!) on my bed and my carpet match, both of which I was recently given. They are both beige and light green.

  336.  #336Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 11:29 am

    Brenda: re:289

    What do I think/feel?

    I feel glad that you are feeling better.

    I also feel happy and content with myself and my intentions with what I said to you.

    I feel kind of shaky and annoyed and not desiring to be lectured to or made wrong.

    I feel misunderstood (even tho’ I’m not sure that is a feeling).

    I feel the desire to be loved and valued.

    I don’t expect you to do that for me but I will continue to do it for myself.

    And that feels good.

    So yes, to sum it up, I feel shaky and weird reading your post but I also feel a strong amount of love welling up within myself letting me know that I am absolutely cherished, and valuable, and have a right to exist in this world regardless of whether anyone else “gets” me or not.

    And that feels wonderful.

  337.  #337Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 11:32 am

    Wow! I’m also feeling great that I don’t feel the urge to defend or explain myself. I just feel content with me regardless of what you think.

    I don’t want you to feel bad but I also realize that is really out of my control.

  338.  #338Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 11:40 am

    “Love keeps no record of wrongs”

    I feel amusement and irony reading that.

  339.  #339Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 11:48 am

    Brenda: you said…

    “It would feel so good if I could bare my heart on Rori’s blog and feel consistently nurtured, to be able to grow at my pace, in baby steps.”

    For me, I take responsibility for being the one who makes myself feel consistently nurtured.

    I learned a lot about this from Margaret Paul. Rori has had her as a guest poster here. I also posted an article by her a few threads back about being an Emotional Victim.

    I also have a monthly interview from Rori about self love. That is my focus now…loving and honoring myself and not trying to make my happiness dependent of the “right” behavior from others. It feel very liberating and freeing because I know I can feel at peace within myself and with my connection to god regardless of other’s actions.

    That feels amazing!!!!!

    Sure, I have little setbacks but deep within I know I am loved loved loved beyond all reason and understanding.


  340.  #340Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 11:56 am

    Life and Sweetpea:

    Thanks so much for your input!

    I’m really trying to get clear on what my feelings are and what are thoughts or judgements disguised as feelings. I want to be really clear with what I am saying and what my intentions are when I speak.

    I have to get to work right now but I want to say thank you and I’m going to mull over what both of you said today.


  341.  #341Femininewoman on January 13, 2011 at 12:00 pm

    “I feel shaky and weird reading your post but I also feel a strong amount of love welling up within myself letting me know that I am absolutely cherished, and valuable, and have a right to exist in this world regardless of whether anyone else “gets” me or not. ” Love this will keep this in my archives.

  342.  #342Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 12:42 pm


    RE: #334 – 337

    LG: “I feel glad that you are feeling better.”

    B: Thank you!

    LG: “I also feel happy and content with myself and my intentions with what I said to you.”

    B: So even tho you stated on the spot that it’s a judgment, which Rori says to avoid, and you defined your judgment anyway, and it felt bad to me, you are still happy and content in judging?

    LG: “I feel kind of shaky and annoyed and not desiring to be lectured to or made wrong.”

    B: I gave a feeling message, not a lecture and not blaming.

    LG: “I feel misunderstood (even tho’ I’m not sure that is a feeling).”

    B: I read the rest of your post, and I also read the article on being a victim. In the rest of your post, I basically agreed with what you said, altho I do not feel like I am taking on the role of a victim. I used to, before I read, “Men Who Hate Women and the Women Who Love Them” many years ago.

    LG: “I feel the desire to be loved and valued.”

    B: I know you care, and I care about you, too. I love you and value you. Matter of fact, I think you are a wonderful person, and you are a role model to me most of the time.

    LG: “Wow! I’m also feeling great that I don’t feel the urge to defend or explain myself. I just feel content with me regardless of what you think.”

    B: I feel shut out. I feel a barrier. It would feel so good to come to a common understanding.

    LG: “Love keeps no record of wrongs”
    “I feel amusement and irony reading that.”

    B: I am not keeping a record of wrong. My purpose is not to blame. My purpose is to voice my feelings and it would feel so safe if this blog would increasingly become a safe place for Sirens to open up their deeper feelings to find healing. Few people I’ve talked to feel free to really open up here.

    “It would feel so good if I could bare my heart on Rori’s blog and feel consistently nurtured, to be able to grow at my pace, in baby steps.”

    LG: “For me, I take responsibility for being the one who makes myself feel consistently nurtured.”

    B: I take responsibility for being the one who makes myself feel consistently nurtured. My point was that Rori provided this blog as a safe island for us to come let it all hang out, an oasis from the harsh world. Many, many people I’ve discussed it with don’t feel safe to come to air their real issues, as recently as Sweetpea yesterday feeling unsafe to let her true feelings out on the blog. What do you think/feel?

  343.  #343Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    Brenda: I don’t want to continue this with you further.
    I feel content with myself and my actions. If you feel triggered, I encourage you to look within and explore that. I don’t feel triggered.

    I do feel inspired by this article tho’

    Most of us have many goals in life. These goals might have to do with work, finances, relationships and family.

    Some of the goals that many people strive for are to feel worthy, loved, and valued. Many people spend much time in their lives seeking the approval of others, believing that getting this approval will finally give them the love, safety, security, and sense of worth that they desire.

    The problem with this goal is that it is an impossible goal to achieve, because it is not others’ love, attention and approval that bring about a deep sense of self-worth.

    So, if your goal is to be loved, you might strive forever and never truly feel loved.

    But if your goal is to BE LOVING, this you can achieve! And in my view, this is the one goal truly worth spending a lifetime achieving. In fact, I believe that this is why we are here on the planet – to evolve in our ability to love ourselves and others.

    Without this as your primary goal, everything else you achieve will never fill the place in you that yearns to feel happy and fulfilled.

    The catch here is that this goal is not actually reached by focusing on being loving to others, but on first learning how to be loving to yourself. If you focus on being loving to others but ignore your own feelings and needs, you will always feel an emptiness and aloneness inside from your own self-abandonment. The path to feeling worthy, safe, loved and secure lies in learning how to take 100% responsibility for your own feelings and needs. When you learn how to do this, you will be filled inside with so much love that it will overflow and you will receive great joy in sharing it with others – giving to others for the joy of giving rather than to get their love, attention, or approval.

    Achieving this goal is entirely within your choice. It is the one goal that anyone can learn to achieve, and the one goal that is the basis of a joyful life.

    How strange that most of us do not grow up in families that stress the goal of learning to be loving to ourselves! In fact, many of us are taught that we are selfish if we attend to our own feelings and needs rather than give ourselves up for others. Yet the opposite is true: lovingly taking responsibility for our own feelings and needs enables us to not be needy of others. It is when we abandon ourselves that we are needy of others and pull on them to give us what we believe we need to feel loved and worthy. As adults, making others responsible for our feelings and needs is selfish, as is just attending to our own feelings and needs without consideration for others.

    Being loving with ourselves and others rather than trying to get love is the most profound goal that any of us can have. When we achieve this, life becomes the joy it is meant to be.

    Learning to love yourself starts with learning to be present in the moment inside your body. Just as you cannot attend to a baby if you do not hear their cry, you cannot attend to your own feelings and needs if you are unaware of what you are feeling and needing. If you are focused instead on what others think of you and how to get what you want from others, you will miss the whole point of your soul’s journey here on the planet.

    Staying present in your own body and taking responsibility for your own feelings and needs is a challenging goal, and the most worthy goal there is. Why not start practicing today?

  344.  #344Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    Whoops! I forgot to copy the title and author of the article posted above….

    Life’s One Achievable Goal
    By Dr. Margaret Paul
    May 17, 2010

    The article starts right after I say “I do feel inspired by this article tho'”

    Everything after that sentence was written by Margaret Paul.

    I want to be sure to give her credit. Those weren’t my words. I feel amazed and inspired by her perspective on life.

  345.  #345Nite on January 13, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    Feminine woman and Brenda, thanks for the response to my question (#208). Rori if you have the time please also read…
    so yeah I agree that if im attracted to the guy maybe i should take a break from “hanging out” dating is confusing enough why add to it by the bewilderment if it is even a date. because this happens so much i feel like its because im attracted to mysterious/shy guys, however i feel like i portray the same thing. I used to think it was cute when the guy from the university would ask me to meet him up and be such a gentlemen, open doors, ask me if i was cold and take me to marshalls and show me what the best coat to get was here. he was so sweet and treat me to hot chocolate etc. however, i got fed up with the shyness im shy too! i never figured him out ugh it feels so frustrating. Brenda, i think its true its a subtle way of asking me on a date but its just so annoying i feel like protecting my heart…what if i start to be attached to him/ or feel attracted and hes not even interested. I tried circular dating, and flirting with others in our class but i wasnt going about it the right way..guess it was more like a game because i knew i was doing it to make him jealous. he avoided me after that haha guess im still a beginner siren

  346.  #346Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    Brenda: I feel much better. I took some space. Took care of myself. Honored my needs. Went for a walk with my dog and now I feel more clear and able to interact with you in a solid way. I feel very proud of myself for taking care of my needs.

    To answer your question…

    I feel content with what I said to you because I dont see saying someone is being a victim as an attack. I didn’t feel attacked when I read that article about being an emotional victim. I felt …aha moment. I felt grateful to have someone showing me an unhealthy pattern I was in and offering ways to get out of it.

    I’ve had people tell me I act like a victim before. I have had feelings of anger, confusion, sadness hearing that in the past.

    Now, when I look back, I feel grateful to them for having boundaries with me. I was acting like a victim. I was making my happiness dependent on their actions. I was giving me power away. I feel so grateful to be on a path to freedom from that cycle. I’m on the path. I still go there sometimes but I am starting to recognize my patterns.

    I feel reminded of Rori’s article on embracing our inner bitch (or something like that). Is Rori calling me a bitch? No, she’s saying acknowledge that part of ourselves. Own it, embrace it. We all have our shadow.

    In the same way, we all act like a victim sometime. Like in the shadow exercise, what if we chose to acknowledge that victim part of ourselves?

    So, when I said that about you being a victim, it was coming from the perspective that we all have a part of us that does that. I was trying to help.

    If you choose to interpret that in a different way, what can I do?

  347.  #347Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 3:17 pm


    I feel unheard, judged, and I feel misunderstood.

  348.  #348Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    Brenda: Well, I feel unsure of what to say. I hear that you feel that way. I hope that you find a way to feel better.

    I was just rereading Rori’s main article on this thread and it helped me alot.

  349.  #349Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 3:49 pm

    When I feel unheard, judged, and misunderstood, I feel best when I look within. Am I in any way not hearing, judging, or misunderstanding myself? Am I in any way not hearing, judging, or misunderstanding the other person?

    I feel better when I focus on something I control, myself. I feel stuck, spiraling down into various degrees of pain and horror when I my feeling good depends on the behavior of another.

  350.  #350marina on January 13, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    Hi Brenda,

    I hear you.
    I also wish this blog to be a safe haven for all Sirens where we can let our hearts out.

    I hope you will feel secure and safe again on here.

    XX, Marina

  351.  #351Laughing Goddess on January 13, 2011 at 3:57 pm

    I feel safe because I know I will be here for myself. I don’t want my feelings of safety to be dependent of the actions of others because then I feel powerless. I am always safe because I say so, because that is my truth, because I believe the universe is a benevolent place, that good is always coming my way even if I don’t always recognize right away that it is good. I believe in my inherent safety.

    Ahhhhh, feeling safe feels good.

  352.  #352blacklily on January 13, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    @ 291: Darling Ella

    Thank you so much for the warm welcome Darling Ella. I feel like I really belong and that I am in better touch with my feelings. Although I have them, I never really let them out other than in a form of anger, concern, fear or laughter. There are so many more emotions to be acknowledged and I have so many that are interlaced that it’s hard to decipher raw emotion at times.

    Again thank you for the warm hug! I look forward to more connections.


  353.  #353Lisi on January 13, 2011 at 5:22 pm

    @303 Alicia — I see circular dating as a spiral.

    There’s the circle of spreading your affection around.

    And the spiral where your self-esteem goes up, the quality of the men you date goes up, your life goes up.

  354.  #354Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 5:31 pm

    Lisi! I LOVE the visual of CDing as a spiral! Wow, love it! Thanks. 🙂

  355.  #355Lisi on January 13, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    I like hearing what people are saying about their relationships with their dads. I’ve known for years that my father’s rejection of his 3rd daughter (born when the other two were 2 and 1) was the root of my problem. He didn’t want another kid, if he HAD to have one, wanted a son. He didn’t bond with me or want me around until I started excelling academically and winning every award available. Won state-level contests 3 times — tried to win his love.

    Hmmmm — sound like leaning forward?

    I’ve always had relationships with men who subtly reject me in one way or another. Good news is, I can see that I’m making progress. Each relationship I have now is better than the last.

    I have to keep focused on the healing process. I can use the past to help my understand — but it’s easy to get stuck in it.

  356.  #356Lisi on January 13, 2011 at 5:50 pm

    @ 346 Brenda


    I feel unheard, judged, and I feel misunderstood.


    Try changing those words into actual emotions. None of those words is a feeling. Potentially:

    I feel sad

    I feel grief

    I feel intense sorrow

    Are those the emotions behind what you said?

    Because I have a NEED to be heard, a NEED to be understood, a NEED for connection.

    I hear you communicating and being real and I feel really connected hearing you do that. I also feel empathy and a desire to help you communicate in feelings.

    I am hoping you receive this with the kindness I’m feeling as I send it — knowing that it might be hard and vulnerable for you when you read it.


  357.  #357Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 6:17 pm


    What I hear is that Sirens with imperfections are not welcome here.

    Everything is fine! I don’t have any problems!

    Aaah! I feel so much better!

  358.  #358Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 6:19 pm


    Even tho what you said is right on, apparently Sirens with needs are not welcome here.

  359.  #359Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 6:21 pm


    “What I hear is that Sirens with imperfections are not welcome here.”

    I feel sad and curious that you are hearing this in LG’s words.

    I wonder why you are hearing her words that way.

    Love and hugs,

  360.  #360Daria on January 13, 2011 at 7:02 pm

    Everything is fine! I don’t have any problems!

    Aaah! I feel so much better!

    Thursday, 13 January 2011 @ 6:17pm

    This triggers me so much!

    Is this passive aggressiveness?

    Where do I do this in my life?

    I “see” others including my “friend” doing it. But where do I do it so I can forgive myself?

    I do it with my mom!

    Yess!!!! This feels good to discover!

    I forgive myself !

    I forgive Brenda

    I still feel defensive frightened and ready to attack.


    I feel this with my mom too…

    Where do I honestly do this? I dono

    I don’t do it!!! Others do…

    I Know I must be mad at myself for doing it. I forgive myself.

    I intend to heal it


  361.  #361Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 7:56 pm


    RE: #350 – You said, “I don’t want my feelings of safety to be dependent of the actions of others because then I feel powerless. I am always safe because I say so, because that is my truth, because I believe the universe is a benevolent place, that good is always coming my way even if I don’t always recognize right away that it is good. I believe in my inherent safety.”

    There comes a point where I just can’t use feeling messages to say what I’m trying to say. I feel like I’m trying to do something with my hands tied behind my back.

    What you said here is a beautiful statement. I will speak for myself: this has NOT been my reality. If you were in prison, or if you were on a city bus, or on the street in a city, or a zillion other places I could give as examples, would you feel safe to bare your heart? NO!

    Baring my heart on a public blog, knowing anyone in the world could find what I wrote, feels really vulnerable. I have noticed that a lot of other Sirens and Heroes do NOT feel safe to bare their hearts here. It has been an ongoing concern with almost anyone here I have talked with.

    I know you personally bring a lot of warmth, goodness, and love to the blog. I don’t want to single you out. I simply was feeling unsafe with the one specific comment you made. I was hoping to come to a mutual agreement and understanding so future Sirens could feel safe here.

    I sadly resign that it’s not a safe place to find healing and sadly probably never will be.

  362.  #362Sammie on January 13, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    I applaud the idea of trying to make the blog feel as safe as possible.

    However, because this is a public forum there is no control of what everyone says. If one person does agree to only say loving things another will soon come along who says things that feel bad and trigger.

    And, I do think that may be part of LG’s point about feeling good in oneself.

    I hope all feel as safe as is needed to speak here.

  363.  #363Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 8:21 pm

    “I sadly resign that it’s not a safe place to find healing and sadly probably never will be.”

    Brenda, how about a reframe?

    I, with some sadness, accept that it’s not a Perfectly safe place to find healing and probably never will be… but it is a lot safer than many other places I have looked for healing, and I feel grateful for that.

    How does that feel, dearheart?


  364.  #364Daria on January 13, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    If you were in prison, or if you were on a city bus, or on the street in a city, or a zillion other places I could give as examples, would you feel safe to bare your heart?

    That’s what im practicing

  365.  #365Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 8:30 pm


    Only you! 🙂

  366.  #366Daria on January 13, 2011 at 8:32 pm

    Brenda – not true. As I understand it, that’s what Roris program is about practicing opening our hearts to the world.

  367.  #367Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 8:33 pm

    Good point, Daria. I bared my heart in a prison and on a city street.

  368.  #368Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 8:34 pm

    I even bared my heart to my mom and dad over Christmas in a scary situation. Yay me!

  369.  #369Lucy on January 13, 2011 at 8:36 pm

    I bared my heart to my pissed off, attacking brother, and that was VERY scary …. but it wasn’t in person, so it felt a little safer through fb msging.

    I still feel sad thinking about the awful things he said.

  370.  #370Daria on January 13, 2011 at 8:42 pm

    I’m going thru ‘family drama’ at home. Apparently my parents haven’t been sleeping well – their reason is they’re stressed because I have been going out a lot .

    I Like going out allot and want to go More.

    On the upside, I just realized I was honest with my mom that I smoked marijuana this past week. first ever.

    I had dreaded this moment but it just seemed to fold easily in the conversation. She asked me if I did other drugs like cocaine. I do not.

    Wow. This is a big huge happy moment.

    I feel sad and scared that they’re not sleeping well and have such stress over my making my own decisions for my life.

    I want this to be healing safe comfortable and lovefull.

  371.  #371Daria on January 13, 2011 at 8:44 pm

    I don’t want to hear them discussing me downstairs… It has stopped now. Yay.

    Do I want to go out? Kinda – intuition says yes.


  372.  #372Daria on January 13, 2011 at 8:56 pm

    I’m feeling blamy and victimy, I forgive myself! I forgive Brenda.

    Mmm so triggery i see I see! When something triggers me I do it and avoid looking at it!


    I feel Much better than usual in these situations tho. !!! Yay me.

    And I was able to be more honest and feelingy and open and clear!


    I feel afraid my parents will get sick and die from thus transition-healing stress.

    Wow I just had a natural flip! They might get sick and due Without thus healing, bug with it they will heal and Live! Yes! I like that! A lot!

    Thank you psyche 🙂

    I’m feeling excited and smily and relief. 🙂

  373.  #373Simply Shannon on January 13, 2011 at 9:12 pm

    This blog feels very safe to me. No one can hurt me here. Not really. If I get too pissed off or too “hurt”, I can just stop posting. Or stop writing about that particular topic. I can switch to any topic I choose. At the drop of a hat. Swoosh… there’s a shiny object. How’s the weather? I do not have to choose to carry on a conversation that feels bad. Unless I choose to…

    I’ve been inviting some of my friends here to the blog. All are welcome to read my words.

    Does it feel scary? Yep.

    Will some people be shocked to read my words based on how they perceive me in real life? Yep.

    Is it still the real me? Yep.

    Does it feel kind of exhilarating to think I might have a real life friend to discuss this stuff with? Yep.

    Will it feel weird to discuss some of the stuff I’ve written and how I really feel about things? Yep.

    Am I okay? Yep.

  374.  #374Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    Lucy and Daria,

    I feel happy that you are finding success at opening your heart in public and in different scenarios. So am I.

    I am talking on a deeper level here than what you mean, I think. I mean when we talk about emotional issues, beyond just feeling messages. The kind of thing people don’t normally open up about ever, much less in public.

  375.  #375Simply Shannon on January 13, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    Alicia, I just downloaded some pics to my very own “The Secret” file. All pics of things I want in my life which generate happy feelings. Oh my, I feel excited! Now to find some music for them. Yeah yeah yeah!

    I wonder what will show up first!!!

  376.  #376Daria on January 13, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    My mom asked me if I’d smoked marijuana in the past week and I said yes! I think so. 🙂

    Yay! It wasn’t like have u Ever… I said yes to the past week!

    This feels so much safer that now I feel much less like hiding yay!!!

  377.  #377Simply Shannon on January 13, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    Brenda, Wow. Your words reminded me of Meemee’s exact words about X and their “secret”

    I believe you just synched up the reason you were so adamant with Meemee about her sharing her secret. Because you have secrets of your own, i.e. things you wouldn’t share. Maybe go back through the posts you wrote to Meemee and consider you were writing them to yourself.

  378.  #378Daria on January 13, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    I open up to people about stuff I feel vulnerable about… I practice talking to them like my best friend. I talk to people about magic, blog, heartbreak, fears and dreams.

    I feel triggered when I read stuff that seems ‘made to impress’ and I know and noticed I do thus too. I forgive myself… And I forgive Brenda.

    Wow .

    It feels cool and alive to talk to people in a deep express not
    impress way.

    In an impress way, it feels fun and exciting and also scary in an anxiety building way.

  379.  #379Daria on January 13, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    I want to acknowledge… I’m getting what I want! I feel excited that my social life is Booming! 🙂

  380.  #380Brenda on January 13, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    I like bears.

  381.  #381life_is_too_short_to... on January 13, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    @339 LG
    “I’m really trying to get clear on what my feelings are and what are thoughts or judgements disguised as feelings. I want to be really clear with what I am saying and what my intentions are when I speak.”

    Interesting (to me) topic!

    To tell you the truth, LG, from my studies and meditations on this, there are different types of feelings that are reactions to different types of inputs.

    So, really, ALL feelings other than the most basic bodily reactions from outside stimuli originate from thoughts, emotions, judgments, perceptions, intentions, beliefs…

    In my mind, “Feel” in its purest meaning, has more to do with an immediate, more visceral reaction to a sensation, like cold, hot, dizzy, awake, sleepy, queasy, lightheaded, etc.

    Now, any of those feelings could have originated in response to an environmental cause, something ingested, a substance, but….

    they could also have been triggered by unconscious thought. For instance, I have felt like throwing up from allowing too much toxic energy to take up space in my “field”. Or a vampire energy suddenly makes me feel sleepy or like all the air has gone out of the room.

    Statements like “I feel receptive” or “I feel judged” are reactions based on any one or all of the following:

    thought/previous experiences, conditioning, programming, beliefs, perceptions, intentions, intuitive sense,

    and these words represent emotions and reactions to these things, but are not actually physically felt in a clear cut cause and effect way, like touching a hot stove, “ouch!”

    In contrast, if I am aware within myself of euphoria or agitation, or any one of thousands of thoughts and emotions and reactions, perceptions, beliefs, I might feel it in my body in many different ways.

    So, to address your statement, I don’t know if the word “disguised” really applies, because I really don’t think there are any feelings that we normally use with others that are NOT reactions to thought, etc.


  382.  #382life_is_too_short_to... on January 13, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    @339 LG
    “……I want to be really clear with what I am saying and what my intentions are when I speak.”

    Yes, when we are more aware or conscious about the thoughts, emotions, beliefs, judgments, perceptions, intentions, intuitions that drive or produce our feelings, then we can be most clear with what we are communicating.


  383.  #383Senior Lady Vibe on January 14, 2011 at 12:08 am

    @358: Lucy says:

    “I feel sad and curious that you are hearing this in LG’s words.
    I wonder why you are hearing her words that way…”

    Lucy, I might be out of line but I don’t think Brenda said this.


  384.  #384Senior Lady Vibe on January 14, 2011 at 12:10 am

    I’ve been eating a lot of pickles lately…I hope I’m not pregnant.



  385.  #385LonePlum on January 14, 2011 at 12:33 am

  386.  #386Senior Lady Vibe on January 14, 2011 at 12:35 am

    I like teddy bears but I have a confession to make.

    I bought a lot of “Build-a-Bear” stuff — I think those little bears had skateboards and other paraphernalia.. 😆 So I had a lot of points and got another bear for free.

    I went and picked out one just for me and his fur was kind of cute and his shape was kind of cute so I bought him, put in the little special cute box and brought him home. Shortly after, I was moving so he was packed up and put into storage box.

    Here’s the bad part, when I finally took him out of the cute little box, I discovered I did not like the way his eyes look. I feet really bad about this. I had the bear stuffed just for me and now I really don’t even want to look at him.

    I have some other bears and I like them but this one that I thought would be really special is “unspecial.”

    Am I being silly about this because it looks silly when i write it. I cannot throw this bear away; I could not bear to do that. I feel funny taking it back to the store too so I haven’t. I bought him over a year ago, dunno if store would even take him back or exchange.

    My usual way is to toss what I don’t want and immediately replace it. But it’s a teddy bear…I feel guilty.

    I have not mentioned this to anyone because they will laugh and think I am crazy.


  387.  #387Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 4:04 am


    Awww, I think that’s sweet that you are into Build-A-Bears! Teddy bears are the cutest! I got myself a teddy bear for Christmas! He has a red sweater that says, “Love” and his foot has a heart on it.

    If you don’t like his eyes that’s okay. Maybe you could donate him somewhere and some child will love him!

    Bears, bears, bears!

  388.  #388Senior Lady Vibe on January 14, 2011 at 6:47 am

    @386: Brenda says:
    “…Awww, I think that’s sweet that you are into Build-A-Bears! Teddy bears are the cutest! I got myself a teddy bear for Christmas!
    Bears, bears, bears!…”

    I’m glad you got a bear! I was only into the Build-a-Bear a few Christmases ago, now my grandchildren are squarely into electronics and the poor bears and their clothes are tucked away into the closets, except they bring out the little teddy bear Christmas stockings and put them up along with their own.

    When you posted “I like bears” my feelings did pop up. There is a back story here. I chose the bear in to replace one that was lost about ten years ago when I moved and for ten years I could not bear (pun not intended) to think much about it.

    I believe I mentioned that bear on the Christmas traditions thread. I was sentimental about the bear because it was handmade by a friend and given to me for my infant son but mostly I liked the bear for me, he never played with it much.

    The “fur” of the bear was from the plush furry lining of a coat I wore when my husband was courting me. I was a teenager then. The bear, wherever he is today, is over forty years old. Also along with the bear, were some other sentimental things; I’d gathered them all together.

    One was the wool jacket that my father was wearing when he entered the hospital for the last time. We kept it and never had it cleaned. I used to think I could hold it close to me and still smell him; maybe it was my imagination.

    Our siblings spread apart and younger sister got “custody” of the coat. But sent it to me when our brother, the mentally ill one, made his way to my state. The angels must have been on his side because he hitchhiked i think in winter and had lost his medication. Another story about the ensuing difficulties,,,,but a happy ending.

    Anyway, she sent me the coat so he could wear and be comforted when he got out of hospital. He was in hospital for a very long time and by that time I had moved and lost coat, teddy bear and some other memorabilia. Ugh! I still have other things though that are precious.

    I beat myself up for a while about being careless: not doing all the packing myself and personally carrying things. I did carry some smaller “priceless objects” so still have them, photos, etc.

    So I was crying a lot last night, wee hours of the morning. I cried when I opened that new teddy bear box some months ago and remembered the other one and the things that disappeared, I think tossed out!!! One of my brother’s childhood photos also lost and some other things.

    After tears again this morning I had chat with my father who had been deceased for long time. I started doing this last summer when I was sick. I know to forgive myself, he was always told us “it’s just ‘things’ ” and I do KNOW that but still have a not too good feeling in my heart. I thought bear replacement would help but in this case it did not.

    Plus, I felt really bad with that new little bear “looking” at me and I didn’t like looking back. I could not tell anyone that!! I don’t want to get rid of him either. I know…I’m acting insane… 😥

    I’ll work it out…

    Thanks for reading my story…if you haven’t left in boredom.


  389.  #389tinque on January 14, 2011 at 7:35 am

    SLV – I feel really touched by your story. Trigger memories, good feeling and bad feeling, and bittersweet feeling. Wow.

    I wonder, can you replace the eyes? Or give eyelashes or eyebrows? Anything to soften the look?


  390.  #390LonePlum on January 14, 2011 at 7:48 am

  391.  #391LonePlum on January 14, 2011 at 7:51 am

  392.  #392Mercedes on January 14, 2011 at 7:54 am

    It’s official!!!!


    “Miss Mercedes and Her Teddy Bear Rescue Mission” is open for business!

    (Please forward all creepy, scary, or otherwise not so cute teddy bears to me as quickly as possible and I will put them in the cartoon room at our house…they’ll love it there…plenty of friends to hang with)

    Much Love,

  393.  #393Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 8:30 am


    Your story is beautiful and touching. I do not think you are insane in the least. Those sentimental objects feel far more valuable than a $50,000 car, don’t they? I wore my first boyfriend’s t-shirts for years. I felt hugged by him when I did. Ryan gave me a 2 inch tall stuffed angel, and it was the only gift he ever gave me. It is one of my most valuable possessions! It has a little pocket in the back to tuck a written prayer.

    When I was little, I collected teddy bears. My main three were big bear, little bear, and mini bear, and they were the kind with bendable legs and arms. My Mom knitted them hats and scarves, and my Dad built a small wooden sleigh with painted sides for me to take my bears sledding with me the Christmas my brothers and I each got a new sled.

    I feel sad you lost these sentimental items, and, even tho it isn’t the same, I think it is really nice if you can replace them.


  394.  #394Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 8:32 am


    That’s sweet! 😆

  395.  #395Simply Shannon on January 14, 2011 at 8:41 am

    SLV, I LOVE your story. Wow. I feel charmed. Thank you for sharing your heart! And I bet BuildABear is just looking at you funny because he loves you so much! Or maybe it’s your old bear reincarnated and he’s eye balling you so that you’ll finally SEE who he really is. 🙂

    (((HUGS))) to you beautiful!

  396.  #396Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 9:06 am

    My challenge is keeping my bears and other stuffed animals away from my dogs! They think anything like that belongs to them, rightfully so, since they have a lot of stuffed animals. So I try to keep certain special ones up high for me to enjoy…and the cats knock them down! 🙂

  397.  #397Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 10:13 am


    356: Brenda says:


    What I hear is that Sirens with imperfections are not welcome here.

    Brenda, I feel confused. Are you saying that you hear that from my words? If so, I feel really really weird and uncomfortable with that because I never said or implied anything of the sort.

    Which brings the question…how could I possibly have any control over whether or not someone feels safe on the blog? I chose my words very carefully during our whole interaction yesterday, yet there was still some kind of miscommunication.

    For me, this situation feels a lot like what Rori is talking about in her main article of this thread.

    She says
    “We get so used to our patterns, so comfortable with our defense systems, that when a man says something, anything, that triggers our inner nasty Voice – we feel defensive, and say and do what we always do when we feel defensive.

    We make a man wrong.

    We try to convince him he’s wrong.

    We try to get our points across, to rationally and reasonably explain why he’s wrong.

    We get frustrated when he doesn’t apologize, or even just see how much pain he’s caused us by a simple, thoughtless few words or a missed phone call.”

  398.  #398Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 10:38 am

    Brenda: I get the sense that you feel frustrated that I won’t apologize for what I said that triggered you or promise to be different in the future? Is that what you are feeling?

  399.  #399Diana on January 14, 2011 at 1:29 pm

    Im getting closer to finding the real me.. Today I felt so angry at everyone.. When I was able to take a moment and sit with myself I felt it in my neck and shoulders.. becoming aware of it did not make it go away.. It made it more intense. I starting writing because I didnt know what to do to release it and why exacty it was coming up today.. I wrote about stuff that I already know..things I normally do.. like logically become aware of my situation. Then I was reminded of something Rori teaches about and i wrote this:

    There is a dark part inside of me that is pushy, like to be in control and challenge others. A part that wants to be perfect and has high and/or unreasonable expectations of myself and is angry because she believes she locked up and powerless.

    Immediately I felt the anger lift.. I decided I dont need to fix it or analyze it.. just see it and drop it.. so different from the other self help work that i learned which makes me aware of something.. I would get right to working on how to use that awareness to change it so i could be a better me..but this taught me how to embrace it.. the ME I am right now..

    Thanks for letting me share..

  400.  #400Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    Diana: just wanting to say that I really resonate with your post.

    On to some personal riffing…

    I feel frustration with my LI. I expressed to him that I need some mental space. We spend so much time together. My need for space and time to recharge is not being met. I know it is ultimately up to me to meet those needs. When I told him I needed a little space, he got concerned that we wouldn’t be able to spend intimate time together. The thing is, until I recharge and take care of myself, I don’t feel able to be present with him in an intimate way. I found myself wanting his approval. Wanting him to understand that I need personal space. I gave my power to him. And it felt terrible.

    It would be nice if he understood and really supported me but ultimately I am the one responsible for taking care of me.

    That is my intention. I feel bad because when he left, I was kind of cold to him.

    It feels like forgiveness is the key here. Can I forgive him? Can I forgive myself? Can I let this go? Rather than hyper-focusing on how he didn’t react exactly the way I wanted, can I stay focus on taking care of myself.

    Do I need his approval to provide myself with space to recharge? Not really.

    I feel tight and tense and stuck. I want to move forward. I want to have a good day. I’m hungry. I need food. I want to focus on meeting that need and stop thinking about our conversation.

    I feel angry with him.

    Why can’t he see my perspective. Why can’t he see how this hurts me?

    Why do I need him to see this? Why? Why am I giving my power away?

    This sucks! This feels horrible. I want to feel good. I feel tired of caring what anyone thinks about me. I feel tired of trying to get people to understand me. This is exhausting. This is draining my energy.

    I know there is a correllation between how I am feeling about LI and my interaction with Brenda.

    I want to heal this. I want to have my needs met. I don’t want to abandon myself. I don’t want to abandon myself. I don’t want to abandon myself!

  401.  #401Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    I wonder if this is what people mean by codependence. I make you feel good. You make me feel good.

    But…wait. What if you don’t know what I need to hear to feel good?

    Now I am mad at you. You don’t care about me. You are wrong because you aren’t doing the right things to make me feel good.

    Now I am dependent on you to know what I need to feel good. I am powerless until you do what I want. I can’t feel good until you do something to make me feel that way.

    Ugh! This sucks!

    I don’t want anyone or anything to have the power to ruin my day.

    I want to feel the joy of life. I am alive right now. I am alive!

    What a miracle. I am breathing and the earth is spinning and the sun is shining…even thru the clouds.

    I am alive. And all is well.

  402.  #402Daria on January 14, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    Wow diana !

  403.  #403Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    Even tho all of my outer experiences don’t match up to exactly what I want, and people in my life aren’t behaving exactly as I want, I am still alive.

    Every moment is fresh and has so much potential.

    I can enjoy this moment and appreciate it even tho everything isn’t perfect.

    I can feel gratitude for what I do have. I can feel the freshness of this moment. I can forgive.

  404.  #404Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    What does not abandoning myself look like?

    It looks like me letting go of my frustrations
    moving on
    not holding a grudge
    enjoying the beauty of this moment
    meeting my needs for food, self-care
    radical self-care

    Nasty voice telling me I’m selfish

    no! When I take care of me, then I have extra love to give

    major feeling of guilt coming up

    I don’t deserve care.
    I don’t deserve to have my needs met.
    Other people can do it for me, but I am selfish if I do it for myself

    these are my deep beliefs. Deep limiting yukko beliefs.
    No thanks!

  405.  #405Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    What if…

    I am being loving by caring for my own needs?
    What if my needs being met could heal the world?
    What if god and all that is wants me to feel good because that is my destiny.

    you must sacrifice for others
    you don’t matter
    you don’t matter
    your needs don’t matter
    your happiness isn’t important
    you must suffer

    ugh, so many nasty voices.

    They are so deep

    this feels horrible.

    You suck
    how dare you even need nourishment

    feels sad
    feels like deep stuff

    Brenda, I know you need empathy. I don’t know that I can give that to you. I can try to be kind and not attack you but I can’t make you feel totally safe. I can’t be and say exactly what you want. I am battling my own demons, my own nasty voices, my own insecurities.

    I need empathy.

    Wow LG, I feel for you. It must feel horrible having thoughts that deep down you are not worthy of being happy, of having your needs met. It must feel terrible.

    I love you and I want the very best for you. I want you to know your worth. I want you to know your value.

    Sometimes I do.
    Sometimes I don’t.

    Ok, I feel ready to move on with the day. I’m going to honor myself. Treat myself like a goddess.

    I am as important. I am valuable. My smile brightens the world. My existence is meaningful.

    What if I believed that more? That feels good.

  406.  #406Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:40 pm

    Wow! As I reread my post, I feel intigued how once I gave myself empathy, I was ready to move on!

    *btw, all of that was personal riffing to work thru some blocks…stream of conscioussness style. Not intended to imply or judge anyone.

  407.  #407Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 2:47 pm


    I am committed to giving myself empathy today.

    I feel reminded of NVC. They talk about empathy. I want to research this. I don’t have time. I will just practice it instead. This is good!

    Okay, next goal…nourish myself food wise.

  408.  #408Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 3:10 pm


    Wow LG, I feel for you. It must feel horrible having thoughts that deep down you are not worthy of being happy, of having your needs met. It must feel terrible.

    I love you and I want the very best for you. I want you to know your worth. I want you to know your value.


  409.  #409Lucy on January 14, 2011 at 3:44 pm

    LG, great description of codependence!

  410.  #410Diana on January 14, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    thank you Daria and Laughing Goddess.. this is an amazing site filled with wonderful woman.. I am grateful for you..

  411.  #411Laughing Goddess on January 14, 2011 at 8:08 pm

    Brenda, I feel for you too. And my comment about being a victim wasn’t meant to question your worth. I don’t want to contribute to any nasty voices or limiting beliefs you may have about yourself.

    I would so love for you to know your value and internal power. For me, acknowledging how I give my power away by being a victim has helped. Offending you wasn’t my intention.

    I have to go play a show tonight and I’m trying to get myself in a good space to perform. I’ve been feeling down all day. I really want to shift my energy.

  412.  #412Brenda on January 14, 2011 at 10:00 pm

    LG, Thank you!

    How’d your show go? What kind of show was it?

    Love, Brenda

  413.  #413Wonder Woman on January 15, 2011 at 9:55 am


    I just wanted to thank you for your wonderul posts.

    You come up with such inspirational ideas.

    I just finished putting together my vision board. I did on it powerpoint so I can run it as a slide show and added pictures and words and some really lovely music along with it. I just had a test run and it literally made me want to cry. It represents my dreams and hopes for the future (although not sure I can actually marry Johnny Depp but he is the physical image of my perfect man so I had to stick a picture of him in there). ha ha

    I shall be watching it as often as I can. I may even alternate some of the slides as my screen saver.

    Looking forward to some more of your inspirational ideas. 🙂

  414.  #414Patrice on January 15, 2011 at 1:21 pm

    Hey Rori,
    I am loving your ebook. On my second read thrilled. Having so much fun with men!!! I am single and have always had issues defining my boundaries – abused very young – and had stopped going out altogether for fear of my foolish often dangerous behavior. Now all I have to do is tell a guy how I feel and he turns into a knight in shining armor throwing coats over puddles to meet my desires. I cannot believe it. Then he’ll praise me for being such a lady, mysterious, rare. I never knew there are so many great men in the world. Now it is easy to sort them from the jerks (actually I don’t even see them as jerks anymore, just not responsive to my wants) whom I just leave.
    Thank you so much for this liberating experience.
    My Sirens are on the way and I cannot wait!!!!

  415.  #415Rori Raye on January 16, 2011 at 9:13 am

    yayyy Patrice! Love, Rori

  416.  #416colleene morgan on January 16, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    Colleene says:
    senior Lady Vibe 387

    this is a first ever for me to post on a blog. Rori’s site has gave me the courage to begin learning computer skills and going to the library taking a few free classes to learn how to e-mail. So now I will take this risk and finally post here to you, after being in the back ground at this sight for four months…. S.L.V Your Teddy Bear story brought me out…I’m not yet ready to c.d. As I haven’t dated for many years..yet I’m getting things in place to begin also. My oldest is 41..I was young when he was born… and I relate with the grace in which you let yourself flow and grow on here..thank you…c

  417.  #417NICKIE on January 16, 2011 at 6:59 pm

    WOW..this has helped so very much…. i know that sounds very bland….. there’s so much information…it’s very late, but I would like to post my relationship…but i’ve read so many posts, that i felt like they knew me!!! and my story!! thanks for all the insight to relationships!!!!!

  418.  #418Rori Raye on January 17, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Welcome Colleene! Love, Rori

  419.  #419T.R. on January 18, 2011 at 3:20 pm


    I have been working with your Modern Siren and Reconnect Your Relationship tools for a couple of years. I am happy to say that they have worked wonders for my self esteem. I am now engaged to be married in four months to a wonderful man. The only problem is I AM RETURNING TO MY OLD PATTERNS. Patterns of putting up walls, being frustrated and giving off a bad vibe. My fiance told me yesterday that I need to lighten up and that I didn’t used to act like this. Our conversation ended well and we laughed and talked this morning with no tension between us. But, I feel tense, to the point that I feel my heart racing. I always get like this when I am in a committed relationship (did this in my past marriage and a previous engagement). I don’t want to feel tense and am not sure what is triggering this.
    I made plans for myself and a friend tonight and I am going to start a class at the gym to increase my time. But, I know my old patterns which have resulted in broken relationships in the past are coming up again. I don’t want to lose my fiance, but I don’t know the tools to keep it together right now. Please help.