Why Am I Here With This Man, Thinking Something’s Wrong With ME?

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bad boyThe Question:

“Rori, I was raised to always behave. Don’t drink and drive. Don’t drive without my license. Don’t do drugs. Have a job.

My boyfriend does all of the above. Drinks and drives, drives without a license, does drugs, doesn’t have a job. and he likes to make me believe that I tripping out on him and being completely irrational when i approach him on his behavior. when I think he’s the one being irrational.

He’s very sweet and doesn’t abuse or hurt me. But part of me wants to leave because I don’t agree with his life style. I have never been a breaker upper. I have always been the one to get dumped. I have tried leaving multiple times but its so hard.

It breaks my heart and he starts “baby” and “babygirl” and “love bug” to me and I can’t leave. I feel so stuck. Should I just change the way I view things and get over it? or what?

Or if I should leave how do I push myself to finally so the impossible and break it off? I feel like i care and have feelings for him, enough to where i don’t want to leave. But at the same time the way he doesn’t listen and the way he behaves makes him un-attractive and I’m in a battle with myself. I’m stuck in the middle! Help me please.”

My Answer:

There are so many parts of ourselves we don’t like.

Parts we hide. Parts we hide from.

And then those parts show up out there. In the form of a man.

And then we fall in love with that man – instead of falling in love with those parts of OURSELVES.

If we are very careful — we want a man who’s dangerous. And since that’s most of us “good girls,” we all like a man with an “edge.” A man with danger.

Only, some of us go so far with the danger, that we actually put ourselves in real danger.

We put ourselves in danger of mistreatment. We put ourselves in danger of neglect. We put ourselves in danger physically, psychologically, emotionally…

We fill ourselves with what we see as the beauty of a man, and then discover that we actually feel empty. Then we say whatever’s “gone wrong” is our fault, and diminish our own selves.

We decide that something is wrong with us!

We find every reason imaginable to find something wrong with us.

That he doesn’t want us, or hear us, or treat us well – we make it up that it’s because of this “thing” or “things” that are “wrong” with us.

That we’re unable, no matter how hard we try, to turn him into a less dangerous man, a more civilized and sensitive man, because there’s something wrong with us.

That because we’re picking a man like this – surely there’s something wrong with us.

When actually there is absolutely nothing wrong with us.

We just like this situation.

Yes, we do.

We like it because it’s what we’re used to.

It’s what we think of as “love.”

It’s what we know.

As dangerous as it actually may be, really, we feel safe in this kind of situation.

We feel emotionally safe.

Yes, it may be very, very painful.

But to us – it’s pain were familiar with. It’s pain we know. It’s pain called love.

And it seems to come from this man. From him.

We see ourselves as the effect of something someone else did.

We see ourselves as almost incidental.

The way out of this is really simple: stop. Stop moving. Stop thinking. Sit down or stand still. Hear the voices in your hear, and give them all the love you’ve got in that moment.

Then – ask yourself: For what reason am I here?

Ask yourself not what’s wrong with mewhat’s wrong with him … what’s wrong with this? – ask: For what reason am I here?

Not why did I get here? Or how did I get here? But For what reason, for what purpose, am I here now in this very moment?

For what reason am I making this choice in this moment to be standing in this place?

The answers to that will bring up so much fear, anxiety, numbness… because it feels like an unanswerable question.

Unanswerable, because to answer it we have to make the momentous decision we believe we have to make: We believe that just by asking those questions, we have to then leave the man.

We believe we KNOW the answer, so we don’t ask.

What would work for us so much better would be for us to come from a new place. A place where all that’s necessary is for us to ask ourselves: For what reason am I standing here in this moment, saying what I’m saying to myself. And then just sit with that.

Just sit with it.

Decisions are not best made with your brain.

The decisions you made with your brain or chemical body that got you where you’re now standing, the decisions with outcomes you don’t enjoy, aren’t the ones that will get you where you want to be.

They’re not the ones that are going to change the man in front of you, or change the situation.

But asking yourself For what reason am I here in this moment, and sitting still with that will allow your deep feminine insides to come up with your next move.

And when you come up with your next move, please let me know what it is! Because I know it’ll come from your heart – and it will be the best next move you could ever make.

Love Rori

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  1.  #1Helena Hart on July 2, 2015 at 9:03 am

    “But asking yourself, For what reason am I here in this moment, and sitting still with that will allow your deep feminine insides to come up with your next move…” – SO true!!

    This reminds me of when I use my “girl” energy to intuit what would FEEL best to do in the moment, and then my “boy” energy puts in into play.

    Love, Helena

  2.  #2Indigo on July 2, 2015 at 12:02 pm

    I find it so interesting that we think we have to find reasons to change, or that we think we’re “less than” when we don’t like the way someone else behaves. Instead of accepting that person and finding someone who’s a better fit. How other people are is no reflection on us, and yet we spend our whole lives thinking that it is.

    I am striving to do that now. I will give someone the chance to love me, but if they don’t, I will accept them and float on to the next one. Nobody has to be wrong or bad or less than here.

  3.  #3Amber on July 2, 2015 at 12:58 pm

    I have been with my boyfriend for a year. I was raised as a good girl, getting good grades, behaving, and following rules. My boyfriend though is the opposite but he is trying to change he says. When I first met him he was doing drugs all the time with his friends and he was so immature. Now that we have been dating for awhile he has changed so much. He rarely does drugs, like only once in awhile now but he tells me when he does. He does not hang with any other girls. He use to be a player. I worry he will hurt me but even when I know he wont that he loves me I still worry…I go to think that maybe im just being paranoid and I feel I am pushing away because I am scared to get hurt. But I don’t want to lose him.

  4.  #4Femininewoman on July 2, 2015 at 3:36 pm

    “Parts we hide. Parts we hide from.

    And then those parts show up out there. In the form of a man.

    And then we fall in love with that man – instead of falling in love with those parts of OURSELVES.

    If we are very careful — we want a man who’s dangerous. And since that’s most of us “good girls,” we all like a man with an “edge.” A man with danger”

    Such an interesting and mind boggling concept.

  5.  #5Sassy on July 2, 2015 at 6:33 pm

    This post hits the nail on the head with me! I have been asking myself that question over and over for almost 6 years
    Off and on mind you, but, I keep wondering why we are so drawn to each other…wounded souls that we are.
    But, I must say, since we started really spending quality time (my number 1 love language, physical touch being 2) together the last several months, for the most part, it’s as if those first several painful years didn’t happen between the two people we are now. If that makes any sense?
    I will ask myself For what reason am I here in this moment, and maybe for the first time ever, I will sit still and listen to my heart. Scary concept though. He’s dangerous to the outside world, but comfortable to me. He’s a tough biker to everyone else but a soft heart to me. We both just have some deep scars that constantly have me question why I’m here and should I stay or should I go.

  6.  #6Lovergirl on July 2, 2015 at 10:03 pm

    Don’t make decisions with your brain. I like that. So many people say to follow your head and not your heart, and that has never really resonated with me. I like the idea that we can figure it all out in our own feelings.

  7.  #7Lovergirl on July 2, 2015 at 10:34 pm

    Today I had an interesting experience at work. I was working with a girl that I felt a little intimidated by. Not intimidated by her personality or ability, but her looks and attitude. She’s in her early 20’s and has that sorority girl/Barbie doll appearance and seemingly a lot of confidence.

    It was just the two of us, working together in a sales context, with a large number of people. Maybe it was silly, but beforehand I was nervous that everyone would flock to her. I was afraid I wouldn’t do as well with her working next to me.

    What was funny though, is that I seemed to end up getting even more attention than she did! I have no idea why, but one guy even tried to kiss me! Another one pointed at me in front of a group of people and said “you are really cute!” Our boss, who is a man, bought us both something to eat beforehand, and made a comment about how he knew with such attractive women working we were going to do well.

    I am often surprised that men notice me at all. I’m almost 39, and even though a lot of people say I look younger, I am no supermodel.

    Yet, for some reason they do! We were dressed conservatively for work, so its nothing like that. I just don’t know what it is but I have never seemed to lack for male attention. Getting them to want a relationship with me, well, that is another story, but the initial attraction is no problem!

    If only I knew how to KEEP them attracted, how to keep them from slipping away. If only I knew how to hold onto the man I really love. It feels so elusive to me.

  8.  #8Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 6:24 am

    Liquid L #100 from last thread…

    Interesting what your saying is sorta like
    what Rori is talking about here…
    You are asking the question
    “For what reason am I here?”

    I love your positive spin on this
    “An opportunity to examine my healing with my ex”

  9.  #9Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 6:30 am

    Sassy #4
    “Deep scars that keep me asking… should I stay or should I go?”

    How wonderful that the last few months you are able to spend quality time –healing and erasing/forgiving your past with biker man…

    I have found as long as my needs are getting met…
    AND I see progress with the relationship…
    NOT doing anything (as Rori says in this post)
    AND appreciating all that the MAN brings…
    helps MY heart heal and expand!!!

  10.  #10Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 6:40 am

    When I ask myself…
    WHAT am I doing here?

    Like Millie said…
    I so appreciate how far I have come (YAYAYA)
    in being vulnerable (only a year ago I thought it was weakness)
    being kind
    using feeling messages to express what I am feeling
    NOT chasing

    Here with my (feels like) broken heart (ohhhh… why didn’t Spirit and I work out??) I’m soo tired of dating

    Here ready to turn the corner and STOP being
    available to UNAVAILABLE men

    I WANT to be open to “Available” MEN
    I give myself permission to be loved
    I give myself permission to be loved
    I give myself permission to be loved
    I give myself permission to be loved

    I *AM* lovable!!!!!!!!!

  11.  #11Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 6:51 am

    Labbit… where are you
    lovely, warm Siren…???

    I am hoping that all is well
    and you and Tender are going
    to enjoy a Fabulous 4th of July weekend!!
    huggs and kisses

  12.  #12Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 6:57 am

    Lovegirl #6

    such a warm, soft melody you are singing today…
    self loving

    You seem to have turned another corner
    on *YOUR* happy ever after…

    and like all the Sirens here…
    you continue learning and growing
    In Self LOVE…
    What I have found…
    the more we give and receive LOVE
    from OURSELVES…
    the more we are able to accept love from others…

    Love that doesn’t have to be worked for…
    simple, warm, accepting easy LOVE!!!

  13.  #13Victoria on July 3, 2015 at 7:01 am

    I was also processing some heavy thoughts myself… I was reading old Rori’s posts, from before I found her, and endless and beautiful library.
    There was one where she said “you can choose to give up unhappiness”. This was so magical for me to read!
    Yes, I can give up unhappiness, I can give up worry, I can give up anxiety. All dear and familiar to me, but I can give them up!

  14.  #14Azure Blu on July 3, 2015 at 11:38 am

    Dauny #585 and Victoria #586… from last thread…
    I’m wondering if part of the issue of
    NOT being in love when a man finally
    does decide you are the ONE,
    Might be…
    that WE have changed
    and moved forward – grown and are
    loving ourselves MORE
    and this Man doesn’t feel good anymore,,,
    doesn’t fulfill our wants and needs
    and doesn’t fit into *OUR*
    “happy ever after”?

    Also, when we have been the one chasing,
    over giving and over functioning…
    I have found… it has made me sooo depleted and fed up with the relationship
    that nothing they can do can make it right!!!

    That could be one of the big problems when the
    chasing and overfunctioning is soooo one sided!

  15.  #15Sassy on July 3, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    Yes, Azure, we have come a long way in a few short months. I recently discovered that if I send him whiny, mushy (read over functioning/chasing) texts, I get no response. But if I literally send the very next message saying I just want us to have fun and keep making each other laugh ( we really get each other’s humor), etc., then he immediately responds and picks back up those oars!

    As for you, our resident Positive Uplifting Siren Cheerleader,
    I so wish for you to take some time out for you. You have been through a lot of heartache lately. Maybe it’s time to just rest your heart. You likely are still feeling the effects of the oxytocin that Spirit unleashed and that chemical (ie the Love Drug) is still sitting in your neural pathways. It’s been shown that the same spot in the brain lights up for both pleasure and pain! Amazing how our bodies work.

    He’s out there Azure, possibly going thru the same heartache as you. He is making his way to you,and when you do find each other…you will both appreciate what it took to get there.

  16.  #16Olivia on July 3, 2015 at 4:23 pm

    Binge watching the Bachlorette — dang this girl is good at dating multiple men!!!

  17.  #17Zia on July 3, 2015 at 5:05 pm

    Lovely siren ladies – I found out last night that I am pregnant! I feel excited and also terrified!! At least this time it was planned. It will be my second child, and my fiance’s first.

  18.  #18Zia on July 3, 2015 at 5:08 pm

    Lovergirl #6 – I like to follow my “knowing”. Sometimes even my head and my feelings can get in the way of things and make me confused, but being able to just KNOW things is very powerful 🙂

  19.  #19Sassy on July 3, 2015 at 6:29 pm

    Congratulations Zia! Best wishes for a healthy, joyful pregnancy!

  20.  #20Lovergirl on July 3, 2015 at 7:08 pm


    Congratulations!!! That is very exciting news!

    As for following my gut, my gut said S was the one. Not sure what to think or feel about that at this point. I don’t know. It’s still to be determined.

  21.  #21Dominique on July 3, 2015 at 7:15 pm

    Zia – I feel so happy and very excited for you. You’ve come so far, and I feel so proud.

    Much love to you.


  22.  #22Tereana on July 3, 2015 at 8:12 pm

    Lovergirl #7 – that last bit about keeping men, and not letting them slip away: I feel you on that, girl! I have nearly the exact same experience. And also the part about the initial attraction. I likewise feel surprised by it, because I don’t feel like I am that much more attractive than other women. Sort of average. But I do get attention. And other people have also noticed that I get attention. Anyway. Yeah. If you find out the secret, let me know : ) Haha

  23.  #23Dixie on July 3, 2015 at 8:13 pm


    I am glowing with happiness for you, your love, and this beautiful baby on its way!

    Much love and congratulations!

  24.  #24Femininewoman on July 3, 2015 at 8:19 pm

    Oh Zia. Such lovely news, exciting times. Maybe same birth month as me 🙂 Congratulations my dear.

  25.  #25Tereana on July 3, 2015 at 8:22 pm

    Ladies, I am kind of scared right now. I am feeling so, so, so bad. In some ways, I can kind of accept my situation. And yet, the depression is so strong. I haven’t felt this badly in a loooong time. I am sure that it’s also PMS related (I have the worst pms. Kind of PMDD, actually). It can make me slightly “crazy.” Or more than slightly. Or just depressed. Really, really, really depressed.

    Today I made the mistake of calling my mom. I ended up yelling at her (because of being depressed). And then I just felt bad. I felt like a stupid teenager all over again. I was back in her bedroom, at 16, calling out for help, and there she was just ignoring me and my feelings again, like I didn’t even exist. Like what I had to say about me and my own experience didn’t even matter. If it was my assessment, it didn’t count – only her opinion was relevant.

    Well, F* her. I’m sorry. I feel angry. I feel angry that, all those years ago, she ignored me and my pleas for help. I feel angry that, even today, it’s impossible to have a conversation with her, because the only point of view that matters is her own. The only thing that’s happening is what’s in her mind.

    And I am trying to live a life, and I can’t, because my wings are clipped. I clipped them myself, long ago, so that I could be acceptable in her realm. But I’m useless everywhere else. All my good skills – useless. All of my brains – worthless. My good looks – good for nothing except cheap sex and some dirty texts.

    There’s not point.

    And I’m scared because for the first time in many years I am thinking that my life is pointless and maybe I should find a way to end it. Except that there’s no way I want to actually do that. I am hoping again that some accident will befall me, and I’ll die, and then all of this will be left to the wind. I really don’t care about my life right now. I know I need help, but nobody’s ever helped me. Psychologists are selfish, too. They sit there and listen to you talk for an hour, give you props and then collect a check for all your hard-earned money. The last time I sought a therapist, I was actually wanting medication as well. Well, the medication didn’t help, and the money I paid for the therapist actually put me out of business (after paying her bills, I couldn’t pay the rent on my massage studio, and I had to leave. After that, I never recovered). So excuse me if I don’t like therapists. But everyone holds them up as the gold standard.

    There has to be another way.

    I’m depressed right now, because my friends have abandoned me. I found a person to love and he left as well. And my dream of going to school this year has crumbled under my feet. I might not be there two years from now to ever complete that dream. And I know I’m being dramatic right now, but that’s how I feel. This was my moment. This was my time. The way all these things are happening was not the way it was meant to be. I’m sad. I am just very, very, very, very sad. And there is nothing in my life to bring me joy. I have no happiness

  26.  #26Tereana on July 3, 2015 at 8:25 pm

    I like Rori’s idea that the parts of ourselves we hide from and try not to love show up in the form of a man. I definitely feel that is/has been true for me

  27.  #27Lovergirl on July 3, 2015 at 9:46 pm


    I get like that too, I wonder if I have PMDD, seriously, because its pretty bad. I often feel borderline suicidal at that time of the month, though I know I could never do that to my children. My own mother tried to kill herself, twice, and nearly succeeded the first time. The doctors said she was going to die but she didn’t. You wouldn’t believe the amount of rage I feel towards people who hurt their children/families by attempting/committing suicide. I wouldn’t do it, no matter how awful I felt. Its such an incredibly horrible, selfish act. One of my cousins shot himself to death and seeing the tremendous pain it put, and continues to put, his mother and family through, no.

    I agree that therapists are sometimes useless. Sometimes they are helpful and others they are not. In any case, sometimes you just have to bite the bullet and live minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day, trying to find joy in the small things. Eventually, it will get better. Know that life always has its ups and downs. Someone, somewhere has survived worse than you, and you can do it too.

    Sometimes, you have to sink in your feelings until you are practically drowning. Have a good cry and get it all out, just don’t ACT on those suicidal type thoughts. Remember that once you hit bottom the only way to go is up. There is ALWAYS something brighter on the other side, something to look forward to, changes in your life that are sometimes brought about by bad experiences. What doesn’t kill you makes you stronger, like they say.

  28.  #28Liquid Light on July 3, 2015 at 9:58 pm

    Tereana, Its going to get better. This is temporary. Just hang in there and know that this will pass and you’ll feel better soon, maybe not great, but better. Please just let this moment pass, make it through, and then make a decision when your mind is clearer about what you want to do to be happier. It will get better.


  29.  #29Emerson on July 3, 2015 at 10:46 pm

    Thank you for sharing how you’re feeling…I am sorry you’re feeling low ….
    I hate that feeling of spiraling ….I feel concerned for you…

    I don’t know why but I felt teary and sensitive today….probably pms but even knowing that doesn’t help me feel better automatically…
    Hang in there sweetie please

  30.  #30Indigo on July 4, 2015 at 12:06 am


    Congratulations! I also remember how far you’ve come and am so happy for you.

  31.  #31Millie on July 4, 2015 at 1:43 am

    Hi ladies,

    Congratulations Zia!!

    Yesterday was my first day of vacation alone in southern France. I spent my last night in Paris with a male friend who is traveling Europe. He and his friend were planning to be there at the same time as me but it turned out only he came… And by the sound of it, came to see me. The rumor in my family is that he’s always liked me but since he had never made a move, I didn’t beleive it. I’m not sure I wanted him to. Anyway, it was his first time in Paris so I picked the place, an authentic French restaurant and we had all the courses, up to chocolate mousse. I was surprised he paid for the whole thing. Afterwards, we went to the Eiffel and watched it sparkle. He bought me a Rose and the guy gave him one too… It felt very romantic but nothing happened. We walked around Paris until late at night and I slept two hours and hopped on a plane to come down here. In the morning he said he wished he had kissed me but he thinks he’s not forward enough for me. I’m not sure how I feel about it but it was a great and perfect night.

    Yesterday I walked all around the beach and the city, soaking in the sun. It was wonderful to be alone. But I do miss having someone to eat with and share things with. I think me time is good though… I do love being able to do what I want and only think of me. Onwards to exploring!

  32.  #32Zara on July 4, 2015 at 2:02 am

    Oooh Zia! A baby spring siren or a baby spring heroe. Just what the world needs! Thank you my dear and all my best wishes for your precious family. May you all enjoy the priviledge of caring for each others for the infinity of time.


  33.  #33Indigo on July 4, 2015 at 3:20 am


    I know it sounds like such a cliche, but what you deeply believe about yourself is what you will see reflected out there in the world around you. Start there. Take some time out to really get to know and love yourself. Maybe take a time out from dating – get to know all those little ins and outs of you and why you are the way that you are. We are fascinating, complex creatures and SO worth the time and effort to do that. I’ve found that’s made all the difference for me. I feel like I know myself quite intimately now, and you tend to love what you’ve taken the time to get to know.

    Hug to you

  34.  #34Indigo on July 4, 2015 at 3:52 am


    Update on me: I had a fabulous date last night. It was a guy who contacted me out of the blue a few days ago. We were supposed to go on a date months ago but he cancelled and then I never heard from him. Anyway following the advice of Dominique and other relationship experts about “boy time”, I wiped the slate clean and went out with him last night with no expectations.

    We had a wonderful time. We were both relaxed, the place we had drinks and ate at had a chilled vibe and great music, and conversation flowed easily. I was pleasantly surprised – he was easy to talk to, trying to impress me yet being laid back at the same time, and I felt physically attracted to him as well. He was very taken with me and kept complimenting me, and towards the end of the evening I allowed him to touch me, put his arm around me, kiss me. I think it was the very first time that I’ve kissed a man on a first date. Had a great time, lost track of time actually, as opposed to other dates where I am counting the minutes until it is polite to excuse myself.

    I have printed out a calendar for myself so I can tick off the days as they go by without me contacting D. It has helped. It seems to give my boy energy something to do, a goal to work towards.

    A guy off the dating site I was supposed to meet tomorrow night. He gave me his number, and so I responded by giving him mine, saying I’d feel more comfortable if he called me. He replied with some crack about how he supposed that meant I wasn’t ok with texting. He did call that afternoon but I was at work, and I asked if he could call back in an hour. He didn’t. I responded to his message saying he could call me any time after 4 the following day, which he didn’t and sent me a message saying he hadn’t managed to and for me to let him know another time to call. I was going to respond this morning, and next thing I saw he had either deleted his profile or blocked me. I felt bad but also slightly relieved. I’m thinking this is one to let go? Seems like a big deal being made over one phone call and coffee date.

    Next week is the work dinner cruise and I am SO looking forward to it. Can’t wait for the chance to dress up and possibly get to chat to my cute co-worker.

    My vibe felt sky-high this morning and I couldn’t help but notice so many men, young and old, turning to look at me when I went shopping this morning.

  35.  #35Femininewoman on July 4, 2015 at 4:20 am

    Yayyy Indigo 🙂

  36.  #36Femininewoman on July 4, 2015 at 4:23 am

    Millie it sounds so romantic and sensual. Like you romancing yourself

  37.  #37Femininewoman on July 4, 2015 at 4:30 am

    Oh (((((((((Tereana)))))))) I can really really feel you. Your words brought back to me the memory of feelings that a tapping video stirred up in me last year. It was a video with Louise Hay. Really deep emotional stuff.

  38.  #38Azure Blu on July 4, 2015 at 5:32 am

    Ohhhh… Your heart is calling out for LOVE and
    warm huggs… someone you can lean on…
    Someone to listen…
    We are here to listen… please continue to share
    your heart aches and burdens with us…

    I’m so glad you have shared with Us on Siren Island
    the depth of your despair…

    I’m so sorry to hear that you have not been able to find a therapist that actually was helpful…
    I have only used a actual therapist once…
    and yes, she was cold and less than helpful
    and actually made me feel worse…

    RR coaches are WONDERFUL
    at guiding you through times like these!! They have helped me catapult my life into a much better place!!

    However I have had many licensed counselors
    who have been SO very helpful
    I couldn’t have survived over the last 30 years without them!!
    I have had to change counselors once or twice because we weren’t a fit… but found a better one right away…
    so warm and helpful…
    listening and guiding me through my depression and feelings of despair!!

    Maybe you could try finding one? They are much more affordable…

    Hang in there lovely Tereanna!!! we love you!!!
    You are loved…
    YOUR mother loves you, your family loves you… they simply are human and struggle too…
    Struggle to be able to know how to show their love and support…
    oxoxo huggs and kisses

  39.  #39Zara on July 4, 2015 at 6:49 am

    Millie : *****Yesterday was my first day of vacation alone in southern France.*****

    I was not able to plan a ride to Paris before today. I guess it was not meant for us to meet just now.
    It feels so hot and the buildings are not built to protect against the heat, neither do they have air conditioning. Offices and class rooms feel like ovens with no oxygen.
    How is the heat down south?


    ****** It felt very romantic but nothing happened. We walked around Paris until late at night and I slept two hours and hopped on a plane to come down here. In the morning he said he wished he had kissed me but he thinks he’s not forward enough for me. I’m not sure how I feel about it but it was a great and perfect night. *****

    This reminds me the words of specialists who say that sometimes, the man ready and able and inspired to be the heroe for a woman does need to read a signal that says he can step into her space.

    When it is only his body that is attracted to a woman, a man won’t hesitate to step in her space and kiss her and lead her to sex. Like when you are hungry and you step towards the fridge and grab some to eat. You can’t stop yourself, hunger is a primary life drive.

    On the other hand, when all of him, including his soul, is attracted to the woman, it brings to a man’s awareness the intention to provide and protect her. “What do I do to make sure she feels safe?” “What do I do to make sure she will want me as the only man to keep her safe on this planet?”

    And for some of them, waiting for the woman’s signal before they even kiss her is their way to say :”I am not here to feed myself at your expense or to hurt you. I am here to keep you comfortable in this universe. I am here to cherish you. And I feel attracted enough to keep swirling in your orbit while you take all the time in the world before you know weither I can be your heroe. ”


    ***** it was a great and perfect night. *****

    🙂 Universe is friendly like that. It winks at me, and keeps swirling.

    Universe is playfull like that.

    Universe trusts I will finally see the gems swirling in my orbit. Universe knows I will do it when I will do it, not one second before. Universe does not mind. It has got plenty of gems swirling around. I can take all the time in the world, it keeps swirling. And sometimes it winks at me like to check where I am at.

    Universe is respectful of my pace like that. Universe does not let go off me. We keep expanding together no matter how slow my personal pace might feel to me. I am right on time.


  40.  #40Azure Blu on July 4, 2015 at 7:08 am

    Sooo lovely to read about your fun date!! you sound relaxed and just soaking it allll up!!
    Ohhh la, la!!
    kissing on the first date!! love it!!

    Hang in there with the leaning back with D!! Yes,
    I too have set up calendars and ticked off the days…
    as I worked on Concentrating on Loving ME
    and NOT contacting whomever it was I was trying to stay away from -YOU are doing fabulous!! Huggssss!

  41.  #41Azure Blu on July 4, 2015 at 7:09 am

    Zia – Congratulations – such a happy happy event!!!

  42.  #42Indigo on July 4, 2015 at 7:12 am

    Zara 39,

    This feels very true to me:

    “This reminds me the words of specialists who say that sometimes, the man ready and able and inspired to be the heroe for a woman does need to read a signal that says he can step into her space.

    When it is only his body that is attracted to a woman, a man won’t hesitate to step in her space and kiss her and lead her to sex. Like when you are hungry and you step towards the fridge and grab some to eat. You can’t stop yourself, hunger is a primary life drive.

    On the other hand, when all of him, including his soul, is attracted to the woman, it brings to a man’s awareness the intention to provide and protect her. “What do I do to make sure she feels safe?” “What do I do to make sure she will want me as the only man to keep her safe on this planet?” ”

    At work, I was hired to be in a senior position to my cute co-worker, I was hired to be something like an office manager. And I am 4 or 5 years older than he is. My instincts tell me that he likes me but would never overstep the line and ask me out without the go-ahead from me. I can respect this. I think it’s what an honourable and sensitive man does. A man who is attracted to a woman with his soul will not go in guns blazing, but will wait till she feels comfortable. I agree that men who just want sex and are there to satisfy their own selfish wants will not give this side of things too much thought.

    That is why I have gotten into the habit of taking things slower with a man. It feels much, much better to me.

  43.  #43Indigo on July 4, 2015 at 7:15 am

    Thanks FW & Azure Blu – love to you both 🙂

  44.  #44Azure Blu on July 4, 2015 at 7:16 am

    Sassy #15…
    Ahhhh… your warm words feel like a
    BIG comforting hug!! Thank you Thank you!!!

    Your words about taking some time off between heartbreak from Spirit and dating again
    did resonate…
    AND I did take a month off after not hearing from Spirit…
    But… for some reason, being on POF and talking to and interacting with these warm friendly men…
    feels good…
    It’s summertime… I feel lucky that I have this great big pool of men that I can enjoy dates with
    and who knows… ???
    meet the man of my dreams in the middle of letting go of Spirit (and the dream of hoping he was “the one”)
    THE universe has someone MUCH better for me…
    Thank you for your loving words that spoke to my heart!!!
    Happy fourth of JULY!!!

  45.  #45Millie on July 4, 2015 at 9:17 am

    Zara I loved your post to me!!! Thank you for always captivating life experiences in to such poetry!! I was thinking the same thing about CDB but didn’t know how to articulate it. In his case, I feel the opposite. In our last encounter, I didn’t feel safe, I felt like a fridge one takes food from and does not give any back. His mindset does not feel like his intent is to protect me and I feel the need to protect myself. I feel at heart he is a taker. I’m not sure if I want anything to happen with Paris guy, but we are messaging still about our travels.

    Today I was a true siren– I swam topless in the sea, let my long hair float around me. My heart pounded as I took my top off… Unsure what would happen… But no one seemed to noticed, since it is normal here.

    Zara the weather is sweltering. Thankfully the sea is there to take a dip. One thing I miss about home is ICE of all things. No drink or water ever seems to be cold enough here!

  46.  #46Zara on July 4, 2015 at 9:42 am


    My mother is selfish and controlling


  47.  #47Zara on July 4, 2015 at 9:43 am

  48.  #48Lovergirl on July 4, 2015 at 10:41 pm

    Tereana 22-

    Yes, the attention part is so easy. I feel flooded with male attention when I am out in public, especially now with my new job. It can be overwhelming. It’s not love though, just attraction. The love part feels impossible.

    Yesterday at work yet another guy asked for my number. He was probably 20 years old and I suspect just number collecting or seeing if I would give it to him. Then a man I was working near kept coming over to talk to me and was asking about my marital status and such. Today there was a man that works for another company that is associated with ours who was again trying to flirt with me. One of my female coworkers told me he was very obviously checking me out when I wasn’t looking. He said he was 35 and couldn’t believe it when I told him how old I am. :p

    Its all fine and good but its not enough. I want a man that wants ME, not just the outward appearance. I just don’t know if I will ever be able to find that.

  49.  #49Indigo on July 5, 2015 at 12:54 am

    So I had another date with the guy from Friday night last night – so that is two nights in a row. He came and picked me up and took me to a nice steak and seafood restaurant, paid for everything of course (actually I cannot remember the last time I paid for anything when I was out with a man, probably years ago), was sweet and gentlemanly. Basically didn’t put a foot wrong. He is very masculine – not only in his behaviour but in the way he looks as well. Tall with big shoulders and arms and chest, well muscled and good looking. Sorry to be so shallow but it is a turn-on.

    He took me home and we were cuddling and kissing, I was very clear with both him and myself that it was going to go no further than that. He was pretty much perfect and didn’t push for it or push me, although made me feel very wanted. He kept telling me how amazing I am and it was wonderful, yet it all felt a bit intimidating. It felt a bit overwhelming. He is obviously a bit further ahead on the relationship timeline than I am. For me, this is still extremely early days. I cannot possibly say whether I even want a relationship with him this point, but since everything is so perfect I am willing to let it continue and see.

    He is very sexy, but I worry whether he is on my level on an intellectual and sensitivity scale… Maybe that sounds superficial but I do think about these things.

    I did share with him that I have a busy week coming up and would need some time to myself, both to do what I need to do and to rest, and he respected that.

    We shall see how it goes…

  50.  #50Millie on July 5, 2015 at 1:12 am

    Lovergirl– sounds like your light is shining and rockin it!! Keep shining and as Zara so eloquently says, let the universe throw men into your orbit for your choosing 🙂

    Indigo– your first and second dates sound wonderful!! I’m so happy for you!

  51.  #51Lovergirl on July 5, 2015 at 9:28 am

    Indigo, I feel excited for you! I know what you mean about it being too soon to know if you want a relationship. I start to get claustrophobic if a guy wants that too soon. That’s why I just don’t know if marriage and seriousness is what I really want. It’s hard though, because whenever I want to just have fun and date, then guys want to be serious, when I want to be serious, they want to be casual. It’s so annoying.

  52.  #52Indigo on July 5, 2015 at 10:18 am


    I know exactly what you mean! I think he could tell by the look on my face when he was saying how amazing I was and that it felt so right and comfortable and all of that. I’m one of those people who believe that “timing is everything”. I won’t be pressured into moving too fast and I want things to move at a pace and in a way that feels comfortable to me. If he sticks around and we get to know each other more through all of that, great, but if he doesn’t that’s ok. It was rather sweet the way he was so smitten, but I also know enough about my own self-care to be careful.

    I hope I can spot the “casual” guys now and stay away from them… definitely not interested in that, no matter how great the guy is 🙂

  53.  #53Kath on July 5, 2015 at 10:36 am

    Hi Sirens,

    Its been a while-I have read the posts on this latest thread so am a bit of of touch with you all- I have been in my own little cave, licking my wounds really and needing to be myself. However, I moved house three weeks ago and I now feel at last that I am coming back into the light!

    I still feel sad that my relationship with R ended badly but he has been in contact since we broke up and offered to help me out if I ever needed anything. I thanked him, didn’t want to be mean, but felt confused about why he would offer to help me. But then he has never let go of any woman he has a relationship with, so perhaps that’s why. Apart from that I have had no contact with his children or the grandchildren and that has been the hardest part of all.

    Today I had a lovely lunch with my Mum, Sister and her partner and we got talking about the break up and my Sister in Law asked me if I would mind if she and my Sister kept friends with my X- because they both liked him and thought he was a nice man. I said of course they could do whatever they wanted but I was left feeling quite upset by it. I don’t really understand why they would want to pursue a friendship with him. Am I being irrational?

  54.  #54Dixie on July 5, 2015 at 11:16 am


    These boards are so inspiring!

    Indigo- YAY FOR YOU!
    Lovergirl – YAY FOR YOU TOO!

    I’ve been feeling so inspired by all the uncovering and processing going on here.

    Someone has come back into my life and I’m going to also, as Indigo has done, give him a chance when I return from Portugal. I actually feel pretty excited about this, just being open again to men who show up…

    D. is still there, in the background, and for the first time I can feel how much he really does love me. I am loving the new dynamic of him reaching out and being tender. All my doubts stemmed from my insecurities and honestly, feeling “not good enough”.

    What I makes me happy now is that I do not need to decide anything about him, about SteadyCD, or ReadyCD (the new one 🙂

    Last night I went to a party and felt so pretty and all lit up on the inside. It felt so easy to return the affection of my male and female friends. We were celebrating the engagement of my cousin and his partner, and honestly, being in the presence of this amazing couple made my heart jump. My cousin never wanted really to get married but here he is, with the love of his life, J., and they are so in tune, and in sync, and easy with eachother that it was really a beautiful feeling all around.

  55.  #55Dixie on July 5, 2015 at 11:18 am

    Indigo –

    “I think he could tell by the look on my face when he was saying how amazing I was and that it felt so right and comfortable and all of that. I’m one of those people who believe that “timing is everything”. I won’t be pressured into moving too fast and I want things to move at a pace and in a way that feels comfortable to me. If he sticks around and we get to know each other more through all of that, great, but if he doesn’t that’s ok”

    I loved this so much!

  56.  #56Liquid Light on July 5, 2015 at 12:16 pm

    Indigo, your date sounds fantastic! So happy for you!

    Lovergirl says ” It’s not love though, just attraction. The love part feels impossible.”

    LG, I would try not to say these types of things to yourself. They will become self-fulfilling prophecies. Just my 2 cents.

    Feeling disappointed with Tex. Our ability to communicate is awful. It may be a generational thing, he’s 20 years older, but we are very challenged in that area.

    I guess we had our first fight. I’m feeling let down and annoyed about his inability to give me the emotional support that I really need right now. Work has been incredibly stressful and challenging, and the feeling I’m getting from him is he doesn’t want to hear it. He keeps saying he wants to keep things “light and fun”. Well I’m not feeling light and fun and I need someone to be there for me that I can lean on through this difficult time. Just doesn’t work for me.

    And now we have this cruise looming ahead of us. So strange. He doesn’t think I want to go since I’ve been out of communication with him. I guess that’s somewhat true but I have been out of communication with everyone since I’ve been heads down in work and trying to keep my head above water. He doesn’t get it. And it just makes me feel like checking out. Not interested in someone who doesn’t get me or want to get me on that level about something that is such a big part of my life.


  57.  #57Femininewoman on July 5, 2015 at 4:10 pm

    Hi Kath. People do what they to do regardless.

  58.  #58Kath on July 5, 2015 at 9:53 pm

    Hi Femininewoman,

    It feels good to hear from you. Yes, I guess you’re right-it has left me with a very strange and not very good feeling though. Almost resentful because I so wanted to keep contact with the kids and I haven’t heard from them and now to know that my Sister in Law will be actively keeping contact with my X somehow feels wierd. I know I have to get over it but I suppose it still brings home to me that I am really not over him yet and after 10mths I had hoped I would be.

  59.  #59Femininewoman on July 5, 2015 at 10:00 pm

    Kath 10 months is a short time. Remember cdating helps with your vibe and moving your mind away from him.

  60.  #60Kath on July 5, 2015 at 10:11 pm

    I have signed up to a couple of online dating sites but I have to confess haven’t found the experience very positive so far. I have had quite a bit of interest from guys and I have been using Rori’s tools but most of the contact has left me feeling as though it really isn;t for me. Many of the guys seem to have a huge amount of issues or are simply looking a sexual relationship straight away and I am so not into that. In fact sex is the last thing on my mind right now.

  61.  #61Indigo on July 5, 2015 at 10:47 pm

    Millie & Liquid Light – 🙂 Thanks ladies!

  62.  #62Indigo on July 5, 2015 at 10:53 pm

    He messaged me several times yesterday – sweet really, asking what I was up to, saying he wished he was there and that he felt so comfortable with me.

    I decided to express myself, come what may. I asked him if he could hold off on the messages till about Wednesday as I would be busy. Honestly the thought of replying to, or even reading, several text messages a day on top of what I am already dealing with at work felt very overwhelming. I told him I’d like to take things at a slower pace and that daily messages was something we could build up to if we got there. I suppose I had it in my mind that if he was a masculine man he would respect that. He said “sure, no problem.”

    I haven’t “done” anything with this guy so far… all I’ve done is express my wants and don’t wants and let him take care of the action!

  63.  #63Indigo on July 5, 2015 at 11:00 pm

    Kath 53,

    This can feel very strange. I’ve had friends who stayed friends with exes of mine and it can feel weird, like you are on the outside. I think like FW said, they are going to do what they are going to do and you can’t control them. That said, I had a cousin who wanted to be friends (or something, I’m not sure what) with my ex-husband, and it felt very weird indeed. She gave him a birthday present, wrote him a letter, flirted with him. For me this was overstepping the line, but I knew it was pointless to talk to her about it. I had a chat with him though and shared how uncomfortable I felt about it and he put the brakes on the whole thing, and luckily it died a natural death.

    I’m not sure what your relationship is like with your family but if you are really uncomfortable you could try sharing your feelings with them.

  64.  #64Victoria on July 6, 2015 at 7:54 am

    Indigo, Kath,
    The worst that happened to me, is, two of my friends (a couple) who befriended my then boyfriend, and, after he broke up with me, continued to be friends with him and to entertain him together with his new girlfriend. They actually told me once that she was a really cool girl … how thick do you have to be to do this?
    Anyhow, these two (the couple) are divorced now and I am still friends with the woman. And, I love her as a friend, but a part of me still has not forgiven her.

  65.  #65Daria on July 6, 2015 at 8:51 am

    do you all know I love you ALL!!!

    even the ones i havent met yet

    SLV especially thinking of you… how is it going with the Jamaican fishermen thoughts

  66.  #66Azure Blu on July 6, 2015 at 9:36 am

    Liquid L #51
    Gee… as long as you and Tex have known each other…
    I can understand why you would want a certain level of understanding and concern…
    Even if it was just… “You can do this… I have confidence in you!”

    I feel bad things at work are feeling so stressful darling Siren!!!

    I totally agree… Yes, there are times for light and fun…
    BUT I need to be able to show my stressed and vulnerable times also!!

    I remember when you went to New Orleans one time with Tex… am I remembering right?
    Did You had a good time?

  67.  #67Azure Blu on July 6, 2015 at 10:01 am

    your second date sounded so fun and sexy!!!

    I too have had to gently push back with Pilotcd…
    third date was on Sat.
    I went to his house (he offered to pick me up… but I wanted to be able to leave when I felt like it)
    Met his friends (so fun) and saw some awesome fireworks… he kept trying to kiss and cuddle (in front of his friends)
    I finally carefully pushed him away.. he started pouting during the fireworks
    Sooo Practice sharing my feelings as they happen…
    as we were walking back to his friends house…
    I pulled him aside and said
    how nice it was that he is so affectionate and so am i
    But this is only the third date… I don’t know his friends and I am feeling a bit awkward… does that make sense?
    He said he wasn’t upset…
    I said well I was feeling like he was
    and wanted to share what I was feeling…
    A little later he said
    No man likes to be told no…
    I said: I understand…and I said women don’t like it either… smile
    and then I sat real close to him while we sat out on the deck at his friends house…
    We had lovely conversation all the way back to his house and nice warm kisses before i left…

    last week…Pilotcd had also started over texting
    and phoneing and I shared the same thing Indigo did…
    “Pilot, I appreciate your enthusiasm so much!!
    and if our relationship continues to progress
    I would want this level of connection…
    but we have known each other a short time and this level of connection is feeling overwhelming”
    He has been respectful and now skips days…
    Ahhh… this feels much better!

  68.  #68Indigo on July 6, 2015 at 10:39 am

    Azure Blu,

    Yay you!!

    My date has also respected my wishes and not contacted me today.

    It feels so much nicer to me when things progress slowly, then I can see where I am and what I feel.

  69.  #69Azure Blu on July 6, 2015 at 10:57 am

    Yay us!!
    Yes… we deserve to go at our own speed!

    Sooo nice to get all this positive, enthusiastic
    masculine attention!!!

  70.  #70Millie on July 6, 2015 at 11:31 am

    Hi Daria!! Nice to see your siren presence on the blog again!!!

    Azure–great feeling messages! I want to keep the one about over communicating in my notes!

    It’s my last night in Southern France. I’m not sure what to do…part of me wants to go out, watch the sunset and have a drink, but the other part doesn’t want to spend any more money, me feet hurt, and I don’t want to be alone. Yesterday was very wonderful. I took the train to Monaco and spent the day there overwhelmingly taking it in its beauty. At night I felt elated and took myself out to dinner. At the restaurant a group of guys asked me to join them, I hesitated for a moment, but thought what the hell–If I’m uncomfortable I can always excuse myself. They were all from other countries and spoke in choppy english but it was fun!! One kept being very forward with me, making jokes about giving me a back massage and lets just us get a drink after, before I’d even eaten my main course. Him and the other single guy at the table, who I thought was cuter, kept offering me tastes and preparing food for me. It was sweet and masculine to be cared for. Afterwards the cute one added me on FB and said if I come to back to europe again he would show me around his country. Anyway, it was nice to have company.

    I feel like Audrey Hepburn in Sabrina, when she goes off to France and rediscovers herself. She’s all hung up on David and comes back only to be wooed by Linus. I say this because I still feel hung up on M! Oh I wish I wasn’t– and I hate that my body and mind has molded these pathways around him that make me associate love with how I felt and who he is. It makes me sad to have to undo these pathways..I feel like I can’t get excited about relationships anymore. Thinking of him triggers me to cry. I don’t know how I got back here again…but as I said before, it will get better…somehow it will. CDB is getting on my nerves because he keeps “liking” all my photos but hasn’t made any real contact. He commented on one: “hi” which annoys me because I feel like its him reminded me of his existence rather him choosing to exist and actually having a conversation with me. I’ve been thinking a lot of what I will say to him if he calls:
    “CDB the reason I haven’t contacted you is because this was a vacation for me to spend time with myself. I also did not feel good after our last meeting. I expressed clearly how I felt about using condoms and I did not feel heard or respected by you. Shortly after, you tried to do it without one which did not make me feel safe or honored. I don’t want to feel disregarded by the man in my life, I want to feel safe, protected, and cherished and I will not cast aside the boundaries I’ve instilled to protect myself in order to please you or any other man.”
    It’s wordy but I don’t care. His behavior was completely unacceptable. I don’t even have the desire to sleep with him now.

    Anyway–I should go out and enjoy my last night!

  71.  #71Lovergirl on July 6, 2015 at 11:38 am

    I had another date with the guy that works in radio advertising. He was just finished coaching and took me to this Mexican restaurant near his house. We ate and had great margaritas but they closed early on Sunday and so we had to leave and ended up going back to his place. I’m not sure if he had it set up deliberately like that or not… lol

    Anyhow, we went back to his place and watched TV and of course did a little making out. He still seems nice and was talking like he is interested in a relationship, but we ALMOST ended up having sex. If I had not been on my period, we probably would have. We got…close (lol).

    I’m supposed to see him again in a couple of days. He wants to make dinner for me. I’m sure we will end up in the sack.

    I’m on the fence if I want a relationship or just sex. I don’t even know. How could anyone know this soon, when they are just starting to get to know someone? I don’t feel ready to be tied down.

    He has asked a few times about the other guy that I went out with. He wants to see if there is any competition. :p But the other guy is out of town all month except for twice during times I can’t see him.

  72.  #72Lovergirl on July 6, 2015 at 12:00 pm

    Oh and I haven’t had a chance to write about it much, but I’ve had a ton of opportunities to use feeling messages with guys I have not met yet off Tinder. Some real weirdos out there.

    Speaking of weirdos, this guy who asked for my number the other day while I was working has been texting me today. I was waiting to be asked out on a date. Instead he asked me “can I taste you?” I said I felt uncomfortable being asked that by someone I barely know. He’s like huh? What? I don’t understand, I’m confused. I said it feels weird to be asked “can I taste you”. His response was “oh, damn. I meant can I text you later sweetheart, my bad”. Yeah, right….. LOL!

  73.  #73Liquid Light on July 6, 2015 at 3:19 pm

    Thanks for your response Azure.

    Yeah, I think I’ve really rubbed him the wrong way. He won’t respond to my texts or my calls. I’m guessing the cruise if off too.

    Its too bad and makes me sad if so. On the other hand, there’s things about him that I’m just not that comfortable with – like the age difference, my lack of attraction, and his unwillingness to want to provide much emotional support when I need it most. That’s my take anyway. I often can sweep these things under the carpet but I’m just not that willing to. I think I’m so exhausted and stressed from work that I don’t have the energy for it or something.

    I’d really like to have someone ravage me though ;)…I’ve got the energy for that 🙂 And just not having to think about anything and give myself over to pure physical lust and attraction sounds great.

  74.  #74Femininewoman on July 6, 2015 at 3:57 pm

    Daria 🙂 🙂 where have you been? Brazil??

    Are you gonna share about your adventures?

    Great to see you after such a loooonnng time.

  75.  #75Azure Blu on July 6, 2015 at 4:56 pm

    Liquid L… time for the lean back…
    He for sure wants you to go on this cruise with you!!
    But What are the triggers here for you?

    What were the questions Rori said to ask in THIS post?

    “Ask yourself NOT what’s wrong with me …what’s wrong with him … what’s wrong with this?
    – ask: For what reason am I here?

    NOT why did I get here? Or how did I get here?
    But For what reason, for what purpose, am I here now in this very moment?

    For what reason am I making this choice in this moment to be standing in this place?

    Just SIT WITH IT!!!

    By asking yourself “For what reason am I here…
    in this moment,
    and sitting still with that
    will allow your deep feminine insides
    to come up with your next move.”

  76.  #76Liquid Light on July 6, 2015 at 5:14 pm

    Hi Azure, I want to go on the cruise but I don’t want to have sex with him. LOL but that’s the truth. Then I feel guilty about feeling that way. 🙁

  77.  #77Millie on July 6, 2015 at 6:15 pm

    Ugh just had an encounter that left me feeling icky. I decided to go out, alone obviously, and out on something cute and decided to walk down the pier and watch the sunset. This French guy on a bike starts peddling next to me and starts chatting with me. I didn’t get the creep vibe from him but in hindsight it was probably creepy that he slowed down his bike to talk to me. He asked if he could continue talking to me and we sat and watched the sunset until he offered for us to grab a beer. Now, I feel hesitant accepting offers from men when I’m a lone traveler, but then again I can’t say no to everything because I’m so afraid. So I said yes, if was in a high traffic area so there were many people around. After the beer we are both sweating it is so not so he suggests a swim in the sea. At this point he seems like a very normal, nice, spiritual guy so I feel ok continuing to hang out with him. Once on the beach he asks me, and remember he is French, if we can be more than friends. I said well… You live here and live miles away, so no I don’t see this going beyond friends. Then he says, no I don’t mean long distance I mean right now. He invited me to come back to his place with him and you know is saying all these flowery things about his garden and how much I’ll like it. I said– your bribing me with you garden? He kept trying and I told him his idea sounds wonderful but I do not go to a mans house who I just met, regardless of what country I’m in. Long story short, we kissed, and I let him rub my back on the beach, we did not go to house but had a second drink somewhere public. In hindsight, I should have left after saying no the first time because having the second drink just led to more convincing. Some interesting conversation in between. I felt over it and told him no. He walked me to my hotel and asked to come in. At thst point I had no patience and just told him goodbye.

    What bothered me about the whole thing was that he accused me of not being adventurous, that I need to let go and experience the moment, and let life happen. I told him as a woman I have had man experiences that lead me know which risks I’m willing to take and which ones I’m not. He was just so pushy.. And telling me how good a lover he is. Ugh I feel icky. I wish I had walked away sooner.

  78.  #78Indigo on July 6, 2015 at 10:35 pm


    I know you feel icky but Brava you!!

    Personally I feel like I start switching off when a man who is not my committed man says anything at all to try and get me to have sex with him. I’m just not in a place to be “convinced”. I’m so glad you can see that all this stuff about not being “adventurous” enough or whatever is nonsense. You get to choose what’s comfortable for you.

    I know some men used to say to me that I used to have this armour up, or that I was aloof and I used to feel so badly about it. As I’ve got to know myself though I realise it is just my natural reserve, and my inner self trying to protect me against potentially harmful situations. Now that I know that I can choose to open up, but also respect what I feel comfortable with.

  79.  #79Femininewoman on July 6, 2015 at 11:33 pm

    Millie I think you did great> Ask yourself maybe why you feel icky? Is it that you are judging yourself for being weak or that you don’t trust yourself or is it just fear? Maybe you see yourself in his place trying to convince some man to be with you? And that you get to experience it in reverse you see how it feels and might be unconsciously judging yourself?

    I’d say really sink into the experience and get a clear since of the moment you started the feel icky and see what you were maybe saying to yourself/

  80.  #80Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 12:04 am

    I have also experienced this when I was younger – when you say no to a man he would try to make you feel bad about it. Like, say that I am cold. The ice princess. Too conservative. May be I don’t like men after all. I learnt to just laugh these off (inside) while telling them, yes honey, it’s not you, it’s me.
    I went jogging this morning and this man on a bicycle tried to chat me up, I had ear-phones and just pretended I did not hear him. I have made it a rule that I NEVER talk to strangers any more. When I was younger and sort of innocent I talked to strangers a few time, invariably they were somewhat sociopathic and asking for quick s*x. I wonder if anyone gets laid this way, maybe they do, even though it sounds like a completely idiotic way to pick up a girl.

  81.  #81Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 12:46 am

    Well, as a girl you are a magnet. Men will always be attracted and try to throw darts your way. We always get these opportunities to stand in our power. We can say thanks but no thanks. Saying no has a way of making us feel good on the inside and raising our degree of difficulty.

  82.  #82Millie on July 7, 2015 at 1:53 am

    I feel icky for several reasons. One is that I allowed myself to be vulnerable and that feels scary.. And it turns into feeling icky when a man pushes against that vulnerability and tries to push me to see how far I’ll go. It’s like I open up a little and the man keeps trying to push me open. It’s not necessarily bad… I just feel icky being vulnerable I think. We talked about cultural differences and sexuality…he asked if I felt sexually confident and I didn’t really know how to answer. I told him I have had some bad experiences and right now I don’t want to open myself up that way to someone I don’t know. He wanted to know about the bad experiences, he’s very intellectual it seems, so I shared how I felt more than what was happening. And I did realize that I am very afraid of true physical intimacy and being vulnerable despite how much I thought I liked sex. Right now I don’t even want to… Because I feel like a rolly Polly who is all balled up about sex. I know part of being a siren is letting men give to you sexually, and this man did seem to have a beautiful view of sex and relationships, but there was really nothing he could do or say to change my mind or allow me to trust him further than just being in company. Maybe it is a trust issue for me. I don’t trust men anymore because I feel hurt, abandoned, misunderstood, pushed…. I don’t feel understood or respected. Actually… The guy I had dinner with in Paris makes me feel like I don’t have to protect myself against him. But most men right now I feel like I can’t allow myself to truly trust them with me. It’s years of built up sex stuff… Feeling unloved, rejected, ignored… Ultimately feelings that resulted from choices I made. So I don’t want to make these choices anymore. Sure the night with him could have been amazing, but I have always regretted hook ups. I’ve never once felt like it was a good decision. I feel horrible after. So I have work to do on this:… On receiving sexually and enjoying the moment. I just want to do that on my own pace.

  83.  #83Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 2:48 am

    Millie I believe that is great. It is you being intimate with yourself. What I got from your writing is a possibility that there is space for you to trust yourself more. Really I don’t believe it is about him. Many men are boundary pushers, that’s what they do. The thing is how comfortable you speaking your truth and standing by yourself. As Rori said, no matter what a man says you are fabulous. Do you believe you are? I really believe you dad fantastically here standing in your femininity. You paid attention to your intuition and honored yourself. It might feel scary but the more you practice this vulnerability the more the fear will diminish.

    Also remember that many women feel uncomfortable talking about sex so openly up front. This puts you light years above many. It seems to me that like it or not you are comfortable in your own skin. Maybe because of the recent experience you are not yet really ready to go there with anyone but that wall you can take down at your own pace. You still did fabulously with the conversation. Trust yourself that next time you will walk away at the moment when you feel like walking away. Remember you are doing this in baby steps. So maybe you didn’t take one of the many. Babies start at one then get up to 10. If you ask me you made it all the way to 9. Next time you will get to 10 then move on to 11.

    Inch by inch everything is a cinch,.

  84.  #84Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 3:39 am

    FW, Millie,
    I was also thinking, regarding talking about s*x with a man you just met… I would find this extremely uncomfortable, that in itself would give me the ick feeling. I can talk about s*x with female friends, and with a man I am dating, but the timing for this is very delicate, and basically, for me, it comes as a prelude to actual s*x. With a male friend I would find the extremely uncomfortable/impossible for me to handle, no matter how intellectual and enlightened he is.

  85.  #85Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 4:21 am

    Victoria I understand. For me though, the thing is why? It is just another topic and why should I assume that he wants sex from me? Even if he does I can always say no. Or tell him “go fuxkg yourself”.

    At the end of the day it really is just another topic. Also it is a bit of a judgemental attitude towards men. Maybe they do but so what? There are some who say that men think about sex every second of the day. There are some who can sexualize any conversation or topic. These days I just take it as an opportunity to flirt. For me sometimes it is even a challenge that I take to show a guy I am not scared of him. Believe it or not sometimes they end up blushing.

  86.  #86Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 5:09 am

    Wow!!! I’m so impressed..
    Reading this story, it sounds like a lovely ending to your fabulous vacation!!!

    Do you remember this post you wrote a few threads ago?
    “I started on this blog as a woman who didn’t know how to get what she wanted, who chased love up the wrong trees, who only knew fwb type situations and longed for more. I’ve graduated to knowing how to date, to knowing how to express myself, and to having men who see me as more… ”

    You totally ROCKED this!!!

    You enjoyed a man’s company, listened to what you wanted and were feeling in the moment!!!
    and held YOUR boundaries!!!
    Like FeminineW said:
    THIS is all about YOU showing strong, exquisite LOVE
    for YOU!!!

    IMHO – you should be grinning from ear to ear
    and feeling on top of YOUR world

  87.  #87Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 5:14 am

    I’m with FeminineW…
    In casual conversation or intimate conversation…
    I love to hear a man’s opinion and thoughts about sex and sexuality…
    I have noticed, I do feel uncomfortable, but try and stay in the moment and be curious…
    I feel curious and open and interested in a man’s perspective…
    especially now, after practicing many of the Rori Tools…
    Which has gotten me out of myself
    (must be my growing self love/confidence)
    and able to feel more grounded as I learn to communicate and LISTEN better and better… baby steps!!! :-))

  88.  #88Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 5:34 am

    FW, Azure,
    I totally would not be able to have a conversation around s*x with a man and not think that he is driving me towards his bed.
    And yes, I assume all men around me would like to have s*x with me, if given a chance. I am a magnet as you know :-).

  89.  #89Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 6:19 am

    Of course they would be pushing for sex!! :-))
    BUT (If they’re not a total sleeze bucket) I usually make it a light conversation, humor, flirty…
    Knowing full well (my choice) I won’t be going home with them!

  90.  #90Indigo on July 7, 2015 at 6:22 am


    I am with you. I think it’s a matter of personality and personal choice but there is no way I want to have a conversation about sex with any man but my partner, much less a stranger or a man who has openly declared he wants to hook up.

    On Saturday night even my date, who totally respected my boundaries in the end, said that “I’m a guy, I have to push the boundaries”. I feel that boundaries are yours and you get to decide where they are. Boundaries are all about what you feel comfortable with and what you feel able to handle. Other people’s thoughts and opinions don’t really come into it.

  91.  #91Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 6:54 am

    thanks a lot :-).
    I do not consider myself shy, but if a man whom I just met asks me whether I am sex*ally confident (whatever that means) I would get an immediate headache. And to ask me about my negative experiences…rrrrr…
    I totally would feel just as icky as Millie described.
    There are some questions that there is no yes/no answer to (My favorite one is “Have you stopped taking bribes?” LOL). And, when someone is asking me one of those questions, I feel like this person is agressively stepping over common courtesy.
    So if a man is to ask me “are you s*xually confident” it sounds to me like “do I stand a fleeting chance to get in your pants in the next half an hour”. Ugh.

  92.  #92Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 7:03 am

    Indigo & Victoria…
    Mmmmm… i do see what your saying here…
    I did mention… if the guy is being sleezy!! :-))
    I DONT like to continue on…
    But if I can guide the conversation into a more interesting topic… then it’s ok…

    I totally agree… I have just recently walked away from a totally disgusting dialogue that two guys started while I was at a bar with my girl friends!! We all just got up and went to another bar/restaurant…
    Disrespectful, disgusting s*x talk gets them nowhere!!

  93.  #93Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 7:07 am

    on the other hand…
    Just last night I had a very interesting
    conversation with a man about
    s*x being a part of the whole picture
    in a relationship…
    being able to talk about what kind of
    affection, pda and frequency…
    how it *IS* difficult for men and women to have these kinds of important conversations!
    Me practicing listening with an open heart…
    my baby steps!! ;_))

  94.  #94Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 7:16 am

    I guess that the curiosity and maturity to talk about s*x with a man as if it is just another subject might come to me with age, or if I deliberately try to refocus, so I really appreciate what you are saying.
    So far, picking this subject too early on has been something that makes a man sleezy to me.
    Also, from my experience, men have tried to ask me mostly what I like in bed, and this kind of goes together with what kind of se*xual experience I have and honestly these are too personal to ask, especially early on. Questions about PDA, affection – absolutely welcome. Frequency – borderline. Do I like oral? Rrrgh.

  95.  #95Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 7:19 am

    Really Victoria? Maybe I have outgrown that. I will talk about it like it is another topic of conversation. I guess part of what has changed my perspective is all the different coaches I have read. I clearly remember some, even men who says that guys don’t really expect to have sex. Like they more “expect” the woman to say no. In any event for me, even if it is to admit “I feel weird being asked that question by a stranger” or “are you flirting with me” or “oh my it’s kinda getting hot in here” or something like “oops that feels rather aggressive”, I have no issues taking on the conversation. For me it is like another way of pushing myself out of my comfort zone.

  96.  #96Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 7:22 am

    Victoria – “Do I like oral?”

    First response that popped into my head was “wouldn’t you like to know?”.

  97.  #97Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 7:37 am

    Yes… Me neither…
    When I’m having beginning conversations
    with POF guys…
    I WONT talk about s*xual preferences… Or*l, positions etc!!! WAY too early for ANY of that…
    I will end the conversation and probably won’t go out with that guy…
    Just recently, HOT young guy,
    he made it VERY clear in his profile that is All he wanted…. fun, easy… NO strings…
    He kept contacting me on POF…
    I thought I’d flirt a little… had some fun
    BUT he sent me a couple of pics of his hot upper torso —always wanted to take the conversation to a explicit level I was NOT interested in going…
    and sooooo…
    I began talking about what it is I am looking for
    a long term, rest of my life, loving relationship…
    He continued texting me and messaging me on POF
    for ONE day after that… and then…
    He has now disappeared!!!
    Ahhh… the TRUTH shall set you free!!! :-))

  98.  #98Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 7:39 am

    FeminineW #95…
    NICE!!! :-))
    Feeling messages…

  99.  #99Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 7:43 am

    Azure when I see that kind of thing in a guy’s profile and that is not what I am looking for I just don’t engage with them at all except to say no thank you if they contact me.

  100.  #100Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 7:57 am

    MOST of the time I do too…
    He was SOOOO cute and SOOOO persistent
    actually mainly fun and flirty… nothing overt…
    I didn’t get a creepy feeling from him…
    so I let it go on for a couple of days… :-))

    Lots of yummie compliments!!!
    Right now it feels good to open up and receive
    positive, masculine words and vibes
    after the let down from Spirit not working out!!

    BUT I realized I did NOT want this to go any
    I am giving myself permission to be loved and courted by
    wonderful AVAILABLE MEN…
    He is NOT one of those!!!

  101.  #101Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 8:10 am

    He sent you pictures of his torso?
    Now how strange is that?
    I am almost sorry for the poor man, having to offer himself like that!

  102.  #102Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 9:02 am

    Upper torso…

    I didn’t mind… I was just flirting…
    he was just flirting…
    I am rather playful…
    BUT, as I said, one day of it was all *I CHOSE*
    to let it go on… ;~>

    I do like to flirt!!!
    Like I said… he was NOT saying anything weird OR Creepy!!!
    I’ve had those and I report them to POF and Block them from contacting me!!

  103.  #103Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 9:06 am

    Are you telling me you ONLY do serious…???
    No fun and flirty?

    I had no intention of meeting this guy…
    He wasn’t offering himself up??!!!
    He was doing his darndest to intise me to meet him…
    Harmless and playful.
    All of which I have CONTROL OF!!!

    Maybe I’m more flirty than most?
    Never do I put myself in DANGER!!!

  104.  #104Victoria on July 7, 2015 at 9:24 am

    I totally do not mean that you have been doing anything wrong!
    I was just thinking (sorry it did not come out clear enough) that as woman it is highly unlikely that you will need to be sending out pictures of your torso (whichever part) to entice a man to have s*x with you, and that it seems to me, every once in a while, that men got the shorter straw ;-).

  105.  #105Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 9:33 am

    Thank you Siren, :-))

    I didn’t feel like I was doing anything wrong…

    I do LOVE to flirt, be playful AND silly with women (i’m not bi or gay) and men!!

    But I guess I was hoping that other
    Sirens aren’t taking CDing
    Completely serious…
    I;m sure ALLLLL the relationship coaches encourage
    Light, fun and playful
    And I know you are too, Victoria! lovely Siren!

  106.  #106Senior Lady Vibe on July 7, 2015 at 9:40 am

    @65: Daria
    “…SLV especially thinking of you… how is it going with the Jamaican fishermen thoughts…”

    No Jamaican fishermen thoughts recently; I’m thinking city guys are best for me. 🙂


  107.  #107victoria on July 7, 2015 at 10:52 am

    Last time I dated actively ( before F) I kept saying I want light and playful. But deep inside I longed to fall head over heels inlove… And when I met him this what happened almost at first site. As they say, be careful what you wish for.

  108.  #108Azure Blu on July 7, 2015 at 12:16 pm

    Yes! me too!!
    Head over heals in love!!
    That is why I only flirted with this guy for a couple of days…
    I am giving myself permission to be loved and courted by wonderful AVAILABLE MEN…!!!

    For me there MUST be Light and Playful
    ALONG with serious things are being discussed!

    So far almost everyman (at least 9 now)
    I have had serious discussions on what their idea of a good relationship… what is there religious beliefs, politics. Passions…
    They are MORE than willing to share all of that
    ALONG with light, flirty and fun!
    I am really liking the quality of men
    I am attracting this time around!!!
    Yay Rori’s Tools!

  109.  #109Millie on July 7, 2015 at 2:11 pm

    Thank you Femininewoman, azure, and Victoria! I feel joyous hearing your words of support and grinning ear to eat. I was actually laughing on the plane about the whole experience. I met a random French man, stripped on the beach at midnight, went swimming topless with him. He said I was so beautiful my pale white skin in the darkness… He was very poetic and it was hard to resist kissing him in the sea, our lips salty, my body wanted to resist because I was afraid, I’m not sure of what now. I felt like a mermaid playing, letting him swoop me up. After we sat on the rocks in our underwear, beads of water still on our skin. He gently kissed my neck, my breasts, my back… Gently caressing my shoulders. Oh it would have been easy to say yes… To venture to his garden, let him pour me a drink and pleasure me all night… Only to rush back to my hotel room to catch my flight. It would have been easy, but honestly I heard my mothers voice in my head… Warning me against the idea. I knew it was a risk and not one I wanted to take.

    I don’t mind talking about sex, in fact I like it. It’s an intricacy of human nature, one that is feel needs to be dicussed and explored. I only felt uncomfortable because he was asking me to expose myself… My inner feelings, my inner pains, towards sex that I haven’t really talked about with anyone and really just discovered even existed. It’s hard to open up. All this time I thought of myself as someone who loves sex, who usually wants it more than the man in a partnership…. But truthfully I think I chase after it because I feel something is lacking, whether in myself or in the relarionship. But I think it is such a complex subject I dont find sex taboo or a subject to be skirted around at all. I love hearing men share their views and opinions, especially when they are someone who has done a lot of “work” on himself as this man had. Men are human after all… As are we.

  110.  #110Femininewoman on July 7, 2015 at 2:49 pm

    Millie I feel so much growth, maturity and awareness in your words it seems like a totally different person who started posting about Mechanic eons ago.

    Congrats lovely siren.

  111.  #111Liquid Light on July 7, 2015 at 5:18 pm

    Wow, this is mind boggling to me that some women here encourage a man to talk about sex, or go along with it. I would never do this unless I wanted sex from the man. I think its really naive to think that a man is engaging in innocent conversation when they try to engage with you about talking about sex. The only reason a man brings this up is because he wants to have sex with you. Period.

    Men don’t think like us. They don’t engage in intellectual conversation about stuff like sex just for the fun of it. Their MO is much more tactical, they are trying to feel you out by engaging with you first by talking about it, which sounds innocent and pure but its really just a creepy maneuver to try to come across as innocent when really their intention is otherwise.

    If a man I barely know would try to talk with me about sex in any manner I would think he was creepy and try to get away from him immediately. Unless of course I wanted sex from him (which I wouldn’t because I don’t have sex with strangers) so to me it would be completely pointless to engage with someone like this. And I wouldn’t be surprised in the least if he ended up being creepy because that’s exactly the impression I would have. I believe that people show you who they are very quickly, it is up to us to recognize it and then respond accordingly.

    If a man is talking with you about sex that you barely know, he is certainly no gentleman in my book.

    And btw I certainly don’t think I’m a prude or immature because of this. I find it a bit outlandish that anyone would come to a conclusion like that!!! Wow!

  112.  #112Liquid Light on July 7, 2015 at 5:27 pm

    One more thought, I guess if its just in the name of being light and flirty then that’s fine. But, based on my experience, I would be very careful about doing this because he many interpreting it as communicating to the man that you are open to sex with him.

    I guess I like to keep my flirtations much less direct and more on the suggestive side. But maybe that’s just me.

    I don’t think they need to be hit over the head with it. Typically, I don’t think they need much encouragement – smiling, eye contact, and simple accidental touch of his arm should suffice.

  113.  #113Zara on July 7, 2015 at 6:50 pm

    Millie 82. ***** On receiving sexually and enjoying the moment. I just want to do that on my own pace. *****

    And with the man YOU CHOOSE. And when the feeling is right.


    Men try their luck the way they know, each with their own style, respectful or sick, straight forward or manipulative, and no matter their style, you get to choose to play or to leave.

    It does not matter weither the man understands your choice or not. Weither he likes it or not. Wether he approves of it or not. It is your choice and your honour yourself by sticking by your choice.


  114.  #114Zara on July 7, 2015 at 6:56 pm

    Millie 77

    You did so well! You were able to stay open and yet to honour your own “no”. Next time you will probably stop the conversation sooner.

    You don’t need to have been wounded by an ex or to feel scared of whatever in order to NOT want sex with somebody. You don’t want him because you don’t want him. It’s a good enough reason.
    Bargaining my “no” feels icky. Like, my “no” is not good enough and the guy knows he can get a better bargain, like on a garage sale.
    No, my body is not an old table I am getting rid of. I know for sure what I want for my body. And me pushing over my own boundaries by letting the bargain go on too long, makes me feel icky. Like if I needed to find all kind of excuses to tell MYSELF in order to feel justified in MYSELF that I don’t want him. Like, I believe the stranger is right, there is something wrong with me in feeling how I feel towards him and I need to talk it out with him.
    There is nothing wrong with my “no”.
    My body told me yes to kisses and that is good enough for kissing with him.
    My body tells me “no” to more and that is good enough for my mouth to say “no” to more. And for my body to walk away when my “no” is being bargained. No need to defend my “no”, no need to look for some desperate explanation for my “no”, as if “no” was not healthy.

    I am free to enjoy what I enjoy and I am free to stop when I feel like stoping. It is when I was using sex to force a relationship that I was closed off. Now I am opening up and thus I hear myself telling me what I want. I hear my “no”. I am becoming healthier.

    Millions men around. Why do I stay so long in an icky feeling comversation with this one? Probably because I am having the conversation with myself, actually. I am having this conversation because I need to have it to get clear on my boundaries. And once I feel clear with my boundaries I don’t need these conversations with pushovers anymore. I drop them like hot potatoes.



  115.  #115Zara on July 7, 2015 at 6:59 pm

    It reminds me of old times.

    I was sitting alone at a table of a night club in Acapulco. It was the end of the night and most people were gone. I was waiting for a girl friend who was sorting something out a few meters away.

    Coming from the beach, that man walks into the night club, straight to me, sit at my table and talks to me.
    After the usual bla bla, he says he feels attracted to me and would like to kiss me. I say, thank you, but no, I don’t feel like kissing him.

    He says:
    “The night is beautiful, Universe is Love (I kid you not) I am healthy and free, you are healthy and free, so why not have sex together, what is stopping us from enjoying sex together? Life is short bla bla bla. Women deserve freedom as much as men, why not feel free together tonight, such a shame to see such a gorgeous woman tied in slavery by old fashion principles”

    (I had not said a word other than “no thank you” so I don’t know where he took the idea that old principles were stopping me from ravishing him lol)

    I said:
    “”I am using my freedom to not choose you, that’s what is stopping us. I choose whom I do what with and I don’t choose you for anything… Which leaves me with a good feeling of freedom. Life is short, indeed, and I would most appreciate you leaving my table now, so I can enjoy what is left of my life doing what I freely choose to do, when I freely choose to do it, with the men I freely choose, or without men if I so choose. Thank you.”

    No feeling message in there, I was so young. It worked for me anyway. He left speechless and I felt powerfully free to be my own person.

    The taxi driver was waiting not far from me, he was pissing himself laughing.



  116.  #116Dominique on July 7, 2015 at 7:05 pm

    Zara – 115 – That was awesome. 🙂


  117.  #117Millie on July 7, 2015 at 8:22 pm

    Liquid Light 111–
    Clearly your post is directed at me, and I don’t like being referred to as “some women,” id rather you just address me.
    It’s ok to have a difference of opinion than me. It doesn’t bother me when a man is direct about sex, it bothers me when he doesn’t take no for an answer, and yes… Maybe I am naive, the rhought crossed my mind as well, but I know I am not a person who runs when sex is brought up. I think this whole experience happened for me to know myself a little better and know that next time I don’t need to stay in the situation longer. It’s all matter of figuring out what’s best for each of us. Yes this man asked me about my sexuality, yes he wanted to sleep with me, it was out in the open, and he shared with me some fears he used to have in his sexual journey also… I don’t think sex should never be discussed bluntly.

  118.  #118R on July 7, 2015 at 8:27 pm


  119.  #119Renee on July 7, 2015 at 8:29 pm

    Well I have done everything wrong. I feel hopeless.

  120.  #120Millie on July 7, 2015 at 8:34 pm

    Femininewoman– it’s funny you mention Mechanic… He has been in contact with me through my whole trip and very supportive of my traveling. He says I’m doing things that people only talk about doing, and I feel a respect coming from him. It’s nice and a relarionship I never expected to have with him.

    Zara— you rock!! I love your comeback!

  121.  #121Renee on July 7, 2015 at 8:35 pm

    well sex is always brought up. I have men wanting it on the first date. But of course I wait until I feel it’s right. And that’s what I tell them. When I’m comfortable and feel it’s right.
    However, I seem to do everything else wrong lately.

  122.  #122Indigo on July 7, 2015 at 11:06 pm


    “I am using my freedom to not choose you, that’s what is stopping us.”

    I love this!

  123.  #123Femininewoman on July 8, 2015 at 4:13 am

    Millie I guess it’s because he sees you living your dream life. Maybe even his.

  124.  #124Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 6:43 am


    My feelings are all over the place. It feels really nice to have masculine man who wants to please me and see me, and yet I find my thoughts wandering to D, wondering how he is, feeling concerned about him. Just generally feeling that pull and that concern, even though I don’t want what he’s (not) offering.

    I want male attention and affection, and at the same time I want to be left alone to feel my feelings and deal with things.

    I just feel generally conflicted.

  125.  #125Victoria on July 8, 2015 at 7:02 am

    I have a theory that you may not necessarily subscribe to, but here it goes. Your brain is missing the drugs you get from having s and affection. The craving will pass when you supply from a new source. Just my 2 cents.

  126.  #126Azure Blu on July 8, 2015 at 7:11 am

    {{{{Indigo}}}} #121
    To me is seems very natural that you would be feeling this way…

    The rage and terror of NOT getting what
    you needed and wanted
    after all the love and devotion
    you shared with D

    I would worry about you if you didn’t have these conflicting feelings…
    Still doesn’t make this less uncomfortable…

    Hang in there lovely siren, as you know…
    feel the feelings, love your darling little girl
    and give her gentle, tender loving care
    this most courageous of
    self care you are now giving to YOURSELF!!!

  127.  #127Azure Blu on July 8, 2015 at 7:14 am

    You are giving yourself
    the GIFT of realizing YOU
    and are worthy of
    a committed, loving, mutually fulfilling
    You are an amazing Siren!!!

  128.  #128Azure Blu on July 8, 2015 at 7:19 am

    Victoria #122
    Yes, I believe that is what I am sooo missing from Spirit,,,
    the lovely hugs, kisses and s*x (what little there was in the end)
    the laughter and appreciation and all the familiarity
    which I now must live without…
    BUT what I will choose next
    will be a man
    who can give me all of this AND is
    ready for commitment and CAN do

  129.  #129Victoria on July 8, 2015 at 7:28 am

    Yes dearest Azure
    We deserve a man who is crazy and enthusiastic to be with us!

  130.  #130Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 7:55 am


    I totally believe you are right in part. It may not be the whole picture in my case – D and I were bonded in a way which is difficult to explain – telepathically and in so many other ways – but it is part of it. The sorrow my soul feels that I’m pulling away from him.

    Anyway, about your theory, it is in part right. I know D and I have to go no contact in order for us to cope with this, but it is still difficult.

    About the affection and sex – my new CD (I need a name for him, I’ll have to think about it…) he is super affectionate, and really sweet. He messaged me today to say that it was so hard for him not to contact me for a few days and asking when he could see me again. He is coming over tonight. It feels good being cuddled and held by him, even though we have not had sex yet. He is easy and relaxed to be with.

  131.  #131Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 7:59 am

    Azure Blu 123, 124

    Thank you. I am giving to myself in so many ways. I had a girls night last night where I went out to dinner with a bunch of girls and got to have a good natter with one of my girlfriends and it was so enjoyable.

    My new CD who so far cherishes my feelings and is smitten with me.

    Work is going well and my boss is pleased with me.

    We are going on a lovely dinner cruise on Friday where I’ll also just get to soak up all the good things of that.

    All these lovely things I am doing for myself. And it feels weird. Like too much happiness. I’m not used to it. Something in me is like “where is all the drama and the difficult feelings and confusion?” It’s a small part of me but nevertheless.

    Does that sound weird?

  132.  #132Azure Blu on July 8, 2015 at 9:02 am

    Ahhh… all those things do sound
    so great for you!!

    No it doesn’t sound weird..
    “where is all the drama and the difficult feelings and confusion?” It’s a small part of me but nevertheless.

    I too have realized again
    What is my subconscious idea of “LOVE”
    drama, anxiety, confusion, yearning, being withheld from
    Nothing I would consciously WANT…
    BUT still… something that is hard wired
    in me
    I am working fervently
    to gently and firmly NOT invite in

  133.  #133Femininewoman on July 8, 2015 at 9:16 am

    Indigo I too would be surprised if you weren’t feeling like this. Especially seeing you are in contact with him. The best way I have come to accept is to cut contact. Even when you do that the person keeps coming up in your heart and mind. Just that the effects is a bit less as time goes by. When you keep in touch it is like prolonging torture.

  134.  #134Femininewoman on July 8, 2015 at 9:24 am

    Indigo it is not weird. Remember Rori encourages us to create and become accustomed to a new normal. You are just not accustomed to it yet. Believe in yourself you can do this.

    One meditation I have learned includes the words “I am open to receiving the energy of more and more love”. Every now again I lie down and visualize my heart opening and seeing the energy go in while I chant those words.

  135.  #135Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 9:48 am

    Feminine Woman,

    Thank you so much, and I agree with you 🙂

    Just so we’re clear, I am not in contact with him. We mutually decided it would be for the best if we didn’t contact each other.

  136.  #136Femininewoman on July 8, 2015 at 11:26 am

    Oh okay Indigo. Still the feelings and thoughts will come up. What I have found good, is to prepare some kind of action, thought or script to help/soothe yourself when it comes up. Some time ago Rori had shared a blog using a stop sign to help with these things. Since then when it happens for me I visualize the sign and tell myself stop, I will not go there, I don’t want to be pining for a man who does not want to be with me. This has helped the episodes diminish and helped me to move away from obsessive thoughts faster than I used to.

  137.  #137Lovergirl on July 8, 2015 at 6:48 pm

    Today I am feeling kind of baffled. The guy I went out with the other day, who I *almost* had sex with, but didn’t, has apparently disappeared. He texted me a lot the day after and said he wanted to have me over for dinner on Wednesday (tonight). However, yesterday and today I didn’t hear a peep out of him. Weird.

    I guess I got almost pumped and dumped. The good part is I didn’t actually have sex with him, I guess. I really don’t get it though. He acted super interested.

  138.  #138Millie on July 8, 2015 at 8:42 pm

    I’ve been trying to use the stop sign tool also. Just telling myself to stop when I start “going there”… I guess at this point it’s not about letting yourself feeling anymore, it’s about choosing what to feel and what not to feel. I watched Sabrina with Audrey Hepburn when I got home and while she was at the cooking school the Baron who was refreshing himself in soufflés told her a woman who is unhappy in love forgets to turn the oven on.. A woman happy in love burns the soufflé. Sabrina says she must “get over it,” her love for David. The Baron says that she speaks of love like a cold… And it’s nothing of the sort. I like that idea. That love isn’t something to get over.

  139.  #139Lovergirl on July 8, 2015 at 10:03 pm

    Well, I got a text from him at 11:24 pm- “I hope you had a good day. Not sure if you’re mad at me or not”

    I said “Not mad…just figured you weren’t interested, when you didn’t say anything more about meeting today or text me for awhile”

    His response was “Hell yes I am interested! I didn’t want to seem like I am pestering you!!!!!”

    Then he says that I can text him too and starts talking about how he wants to see me again soon.

    I’m thinking he must have had another date or something. Note how he conveniently doesn’t comment on how we were supposed to meet today. He also is way overusing exclamation points. I would guess to try and seem enthusiastic so I don’t get upset.

    He asked when I am free again and I said Saturday. He claimed he has a “buddy” that is coming to town then (I’m guessing another woman?) and said he could make me dinner on Sunday. I’m definitely not trusting this one…

  140.  #140Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 10:26 pm

    Feminine Woman,

    Yeah that’s great. It is kind of like a Stop sign in my head every time I remember that he doesn’t want marriage. When the thoughts and feelings come up, which they will, all I have to do is remind myself that it was going nowhere and it makes it easier to re-direct. Still confusing though :/

    Azure Blu 129,

    Yes, my subconscious idea of Love :/

  141.  #141Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 10:42 pm


    Just an observation: these were the kinds of men who showed up on my journey as I was healing things and becoming more self-aware. For me looking back, they almost showed up as a “test” to see what I would do.

    I definitely would not let this one slide if I was you. In the early stages of dating, I don’t like making a big deal or even necessarily commenting on anything, but when it comes to hinting at a date or plans or getting together which doesn’t materialise, this IS a big deal to me. For me anyway, it can set up an unhealthy pattern where he thinks it’s ok to put your plans on the backburner, and so your importance diminishes. You are looking for someone who cherishes your feelings after all.

    If it were me I would calmly offer a feeling message like, “It feels good to hear from you and to know you are interested, however I feel confused as you said something about dinner on Wednesday. I am looking for a man who loves spending time with me and lets me know about plans in advance.” If he apologises and makes it right, great, if he gets defensive, I would take it as a bad sign.

  142.  #142Indigo on July 8, 2015 at 11:01 pm

    So my CD (I’ll have to think of a name for him, BikeCD maybe?) from Friday and Saturday night came over and spent the night last night. We didn’t have sex, I told him I wasn’t ready, and although he wanted to, he respected that.

    He was saying all the right things though – unasked, unprompted by me. Saying how he can’t get enough of me, how he feels like he can be himself with me and everything is so easy, how he wants to spend time with me for a long time, continuously telling me how beautiful I was and how lucky he is. I have to say though, as much as it is all a bit much and all a bit fast, I do feel very comfortable with him too. He seems besotted, but in a way that makes me feel adored. He’s very laid back and present, yet I never feel like I have to “get” anything from him – he is so free with his affection and compliments.

    In fact, it almost has me wondering whether he’s a bit too perfect – not that he’s perfect as a person, he’s clearly got flaws – but he’s perfect in the way he is with me. Makes me wonder if there’s an ex-girlfriend lurking in the picture or something, although I have no evidence to suggest that. Maybe Azure Blu would say this is my fear of intimacy getting in the way…

  143.  #143Victoria on July 9, 2015 at 12:24 am

    Your post made me smile, because I think I was in a situation like yours, only with reversed roles, when I first started dating F.
    He has told me numerous times that we was kind of suspicious of me in the beginning, because he could not belive that such beautiful woman (blush :-)) would really like him, treat him so well, give affection and love so easily (mind you s*x did not come in the first two months!).
    I, on the other things, could see that he liked me, but it felt like he was dragging his feet. Like, taking forever to move the relationship forward.
    Looking back, I should have made it more difficult for him… but I had not heard about upping your degree of difficulty at the time.
    I think in your situation too, it would be to Bike’s advantage if he would pull back a little and allow you to miss him a little back. Isn’t it funny how it works?

  144.  #144Indigo on July 9, 2015 at 1:23 am


    Yes I can see that! BikeCD is already talking like I am his girlfriend and as if he can see a life with me. He knows he is jumping the gun a bit as he catches himself, but he can’t seem to help himself talking about what he wants to do with his business so that he can be stable and buy some land and build a house.

    I absolutely agree with you, I am the kind of girl who would start to miss him a bit if he pulled back a little! He was talking about having to go up to his friend’s farm this weekend, and then talking about maybe getting out of it, and I could already feel a little tug of indignation, lol.

  145.  #145Azure Blu on July 9, 2015 at 5:02 am

    Yummie… Bikecd sounds so lovely…
    How nice that he is so easy to be with!!!

    I’m wondering if you do have these questions about an ex girlfriend… why not ask…
    I have realized in my last 2 longer term ex’s
    I never really talked about these things (I thought Rori advised against it)
    BUT there was plenty of information that would have helped me understand them more (and know where I stood) if I had shared a little of my relationship past and asked about theirs.
    This time around I am having that discussion early…
    either on the phone before we meet or on the first date…
    It has helped me see how they perceived the brake ups, if they were angry,,, if they see their part in it…
    how long it has been — and they get to hear the same from me…
    I am liking this – and the men enjoy talking about it too… which I am finding interesting!! :+))

  146.  #146Victoria on July 9, 2015 at 5:45 am

    I have found it difficult to ask about relationship history (even though I am soooo curious) if I personally know I am still carrying pain/hurt from my previous relationship. I know that in such circumstances I would not want to appear vulnerable/overemotional because when you ask you also need to be able to tell about yourself.
    So do you tell them about Spirit? What do you say?

  147.  #147Zara on July 9, 2015 at 6:59 am

    Indigo. ***** wondering how he is, feeling concerned about him. Just generally feeling that pull and that concern, *****

    That concern appears to me as overfunctionning.
    It might be resistance to surrender.
    It might be your ego still working at keeping the control over the universal pain inherent to the human condition. Ego likes to fool us by pointing at an external chosen object, like D.


  148.  #148Indigo on July 9, 2015 at 7:53 am


    With the greatest possible respect to your words, because I hear the concern behind them, my concern comes from the fact that I am so sensitive and empathic and can feel the pain and feelings of others, more especially those I am closely bonded with. It is not something I asked or wished for, but I have always been able to tell D’s feelings at a distance, and I can FEEL he is depressed and in pain. I feel concerned because I can’t help it – it is as though it is my pain. I know it may be overfunctioning but it’s not as simple as an ego thing. I’m trying to gently redirect my thoughts and energy back to me and it’s helping little by little.

  149.  #149victoria on July 9, 2015 at 8:49 am

    I am 100% sure D. Is depressed and in pain, and I have never met him. I have male friends who have been dumped by women due to lack of commitment and each of them was in agony. And, after a while, each of them tried to get back together with the girl. They were all too late. Very sad and very predictable.

  150.  #150Azure Blu on July 9, 2015 at 9:31 am

    Victoria #143
    You are so right… IF i ask for vulnerability from them,
    I certainly have also been authentic about my feelings regarding Spirit…

    One of the things I realized about the last 2 months of being exclusive with Spirit
    I had stopped sharing important feelings…
    As I feel MORE emotional intimacy, I shut down,
    stop sharing my authentic self
    in case *HE* might not like ME!!!

    I can see, in hind sight,
    this non communication was part of the
    problem that we both built up
    in that short amount of time!!!

    Sooo having learned this…
    i am Practicing being authentic…
    When my dates and I do talk about
    recent relationships,
    I share what some of the issues were with Spirit and I –
    and say – it has been 2 months
    and I am still getting over him…
    Yes, some have chosen to NOT continue talking or dating me…
    but most of them have stayed VERY interested and have mentioned that this conversation has made them feel closer!!
    I must say… they have all enthusiastically shared their relationship stories and what might have gone wrong and how they would like to make changes going forward!!!
    I have to say, I am pleasantly surprised by all this wonderful sharing with them, and all because I am willing to share ME, who I am, opening my heart (and visualizing opening my heart also) as I talk to these men on the phone and on dates!
    I feel so good about how much I have learned from
    my practice with Spirit!!!

  151.  #151Azure Blu on July 9, 2015 at 9:39 am

    I believe that all of this big transition
    that you are in the middle of
    is profound…

    I feel happy to hear that you are
    GENTLY giving yourself permission
    to process, feel anxiety, sadness, missing
    happy to be out of it…
    sadness to be out of it…
    and sending him love and understanding…

    I had one Rori coach tell me
    Sending the ex love and compassion
    *IS* part of the healing for us!!!

    BUT also remembering
    He didn’t want to marry you,
    and all the other things that didn’t work
    to keep you leaning back, out , and away from D!!!
    We are EXACTLY where we’re supposed to be!
    love and huggs darling!!

  152.  #152Lovergirl on July 9, 2015 at 9:42 am


    If you didn’t feel at all sad right now, and weren’t thinking about D at all, you would be a sociopath. It’s not normal to cut things off from someone you have been seeing a long time and just feel wonderful. Everyone feels the pain of separation from someone they have been connected to.

  153.  #153Lovergirl on July 9, 2015 at 9:44 am

    Indigo 138-

    Yes, I think I need to call this guy out more on standing me up, because I am not feeling good about seeing him Sunday now, even though I was nice about it at first. It makes me feel untrusting and uneasy with going out with him again. What if I had slept with him and he pulled the same thing? I would have felt totally used.

  154.  #154Azure Blu on July 9, 2015 at 9:51 am

    Lovegirl #150
    YES… perfect time to practice
    Loving YOU
    By sharing your feelings
    Which, i have learned, causes greater emotional intimacy!!!
    It has always been VERY scary for me to
    do this…
    But I noticed… the more I do it
    the easier it has gotten!!
    Really, just recently, I have been able to share MUCH more … :-))
    baby steps! oxoxo

  155.  #155Lovergirl on July 9, 2015 at 12:44 pm

    Well, I told him I felt leery and untrusting and he swears up and down it was a misunderstanding and he wants to make it up to me. :p Guess we will see how it goes.

  156.  #156Lovergirl on July 9, 2015 at 12:51 pm

    Today is 2 weeks since the last text with S. I’ve mostly been feeling angry. Night before last I had a dream about him though. In my dream I was talking to his mother (who actually died 10 years ago) and she was telling me he really loved me and that I am the one for her son. I forgave him in the dream for seeing some other woman (who was totally unattractive) and his mother was really happy about it, saying it was all going to be okay with him and my kids. Kind of a mindfuck.

    I also got a call from a private number earlier in that day- it could have been anyone and was probably this other guy that I have been ignoring, but it still messed with me a bit. I did change my outgoing message the other day so its a recording of my phone number and not my voice. I also have S blocked on Facebook and the swinger site.

    I am not going to say this is easy. I feel sick to my stomach when I think about him, but I haven’t cried. People say distance makes you think of the positive things about someone but I’m not there yet and am mostly dwelling on the negative way he had been acting recently.

  157.  #157Femininewoman on July 9, 2015 at 1:59 pm

    Indigo I know what you mean about feeling the pain of others regardless of what they are saying.

  158.  #158Zara on July 9, 2015 at 4:18 pm


    I know D feels depressed, I remember the conversation you both had about where he is at in his life. And I am sure he feels sad about your common decision to cut contact. And I understand you feel his pain. ((((Indigo))))) My comment was not denying any of this.

    I am wondering if we are giving a different meaning to the word Ego, as what I understand in the word Ego, is not something I would call simple. And I feel good dropping this conversation.

    From here, you look good, riding your horse gently. I feel hopeful.


  159.  #159Liquid Light on July 9, 2015 at 4:48 pm

    I had a date last night, a first time meeting with someone. We went out to dinner. He was very cute – talk dark and handsome type. And nice, interested in getting to know me, the conversation flowed pretty easily. He seemed a bit insecure.

    Then today I got a text from him asking me if I wanted to see him again and that he wasn’t sure if he read my body language right.

    When I texted him back that I did, he said Good and that he was smiling ear to ear and that it was really hard to stop thinking about me last night. And said I looked amazing!

    Then he wanted to talk tonight. Yikes, feels a bit much.

    Awhh, he does seem kinda sweet but he seems a bit needy doesn’t he?

    It really felt good to hear him say that I looked amazing. 🙂

    So funny how guys don’t compliment women that much (at least not me) and a compliment like that really goes a long way!

    Meanwhile, Tex has evaporated. I have heard nothing from him since our little spat over the weekend. Boy, talk about communication problems, this is ridiculous. And it pisses me off. Reminds me of a little child not getting his way and then totally shutting out the other person. Ughh. I don’t like that at all. Huge red flag. Bleh.

  160.  #160Sassy on July 9, 2015 at 6:33 pm


    I have a question and I hope everyone weighs in with their opinions.

    In Steve Harvey’s book “Act Like a Lady, Think Like a Man” he says that before we get too far into the romance, we should ask the guys 5 questions and the first two are what I’m asking about:

    1.”What do you think of me?”
    2. “How do you feel about me?”

    He goes into a long description of why we should ask those two first, but I’m curious if you ladies agree these should be asked, would you ever ask and have you ever asked?
    Anddddd go!

  161.  #161Dominique on July 9, 2015 at 6:47 pm

    Sassy – I SO don’t agree with this at all. I can imagine the discomfort and pressure a man would feel with questions like these. What a man thinks of you and how he feels will unfold with time. He will show this to you. And as you become more and more open and aware, in tune with you and how you feel within yourself and with a man, you will also become more aware and in tune with what’s bs, i.e. player type behavior which can feel so sincere to the less initiated in this kind of work you’re doing, and genuine care and adoration.


  162.  #162Millie on July 9, 2015 at 7:50 pm

    Sassy– I disagree as well.
    If you want to know the answer to those questions, look to what his actions are telling you…I also think over time a man will answer those questions in his own words without prompting.

  163.  #163Lovergirl on July 9, 2015 at 7:56 pm


    I personally hate it when men ask me needy questions like that, that put me on the spot. It seems like a bad idea to ask those questions of a man. Ive only glanced at that book but wasn’t impressed. Plus, hasn’t Steve Harvey been divorced a few times? Im not sure hes really that credible. Just a typical guy trying to get women to act like men think they should.

  164.  #164Millie on July 9, 2015 at 8:00 pm

    I’m having major M missage happening. The “stop” tool just isn’t working for me. I also looked through the file I have of our pictures together and started crying. It’s so hard for me to accept that how he feels towards me must be the polar opposite of how I’m feeling. Logically, I understand that a better man for me is out there, one that can match him and how he made me feel and beyond….but right now, I miss him so much. He feels everywhere to me now that I am back home. I can’t believe he hasn’t reached out at all….I’m having such a hard time accepting reality, accepting that he isn’t coming back. I can’t wait for my feelings to change. I just wish that relationship had not ended.

    On another note, CDB asked me out for the weekend and I voiced how I felt and told him I didn’t feel good about our last night together and expressed why…that I did not feel heard or respected. He had no idea how he had made me feel and said he never intended to make me feel that way and asked if he could call me later so we could talk about it. I don’t know what I’m going to say…if I should tell him that Im not over M, or leave that out…and just see how he handles the issue we have between us and go with it. I do like that he is apologetic and is willing to discuss it on the phone– shows maturity and caring there– so maybe I shouldn’t throw this away because my heart yearns for M. But at the same time, can I have an honest relationship with someone when I’m longing for someone who doesn’t exist anymore? Can I allow myself to be vulnerable when I’m hurting? Can I have a happy relationship through this? I don’t know.
    I wish I could go back and do things differently. I feel like I lost my Love. It still feels so wrong to me….and maybe wrong is where I need to focus on…that this is so wrong that is just is WRONG. There is nothing right about it. I wish the hurt would stop, my mind would stop, my heart would stop.

  165.  #165Millie on July 9, 2015 at 8:08 pm

    On the subject of Men who want to communicate “too much”–

    I think yes it can come across as needy, but in my experience a man who is Interested will want to talk to you often. I wonder if we are put off my men who are genuinely interested in us, because perhaps we feel unsure if we are interested in them? Which I think is totally understandable, but in my life I find that I want to treat such men with respect and love, because to be besotted with me feels good and I want a man who wants to talk to me daily. I don’t remember who– maybe Indigo? had a great speak for feeling overwhelmed by too much communication too soon– and I found that really helpful! Too much is always better than not enough in my opinion– and an eager man who is genuinely interested will listen and respect our wishes…If he is truly needy, he will whine and not respect us– so there lies the test, but I am past the point of feeling like daily communication is a turn off. I like it and find that infrequent communication is a turn off for me, but that is me.

  166.  #166Indigo on July 9, 2015 at 11:55 pm

    Sorry Zara 155, I don’t think it’s a misunderstanding of the word Ego, I just think we’re talking at cross-purposes.

    But since this isn’t the place for debate, I feel fine dropping it too.

    Thank you for your kind words. x

  167.  #167Indigo on July 10, 2015 at 12:12 am

    Lovergirl 153,

    The negative feelings will clear eventually and it will feel easier. You are doing so well.

  168.  #168Indigo on July 10, 2015 at 12:26 am

    Millie 162,

    I am coming to the point where I agree with you. A little too much communication is definitely better than too little. Maybe it’s a healing that’s happening in me or just a mellowing, but I also think I’d feel turned off now by a man who’s too distant. Someone who really likes you and is excited about you is so much better, even if it feels a bit overwhelming. And you’re right, a man who cares about your feelings will tone it down a bit if you ask him to.

    Just last night I had to ask BikeCD because he sent me 3 messages in one day along the lines of how much he liked me and how happy he was to see me. What I said was “Easy tiger, all these feelings feel a bit overwhelming for me”. And he apologised and toned it down, which is a good sign I think.

  169.  #169Indigo on July 10, 2015 at 12:40 am

    Sassy 157,

    I really don’t agree with asking these things, for the same reasons the other ladies have stated. But ALSO, for me the main reason is that *I* am the prize, I am the woman, the goddess, the precious jewel… what on earth am I doing asking what he “thinks” of me, or how he feels about me? For me, I feel that it is for us women to determine if the man is what we want, it is for men to try and impress us and court us and win our favour and our hearts.

    I’ve just seen (and experienced) how as soon as you get caught up in wondering how the man feels about you or what he thinks of you, the romance dies. You can get into a man-pleasing cycle. Not good. A man who likes you WILL let you know.

  170.  #170Victoria on July 10, 2015 at 12:55 am

    Sassy, Indigo,
    I did not like Steve Harvey’s book very much. I did find his style condescending and his advice unoriginal and sometimes plain wrong.
    And, I also do not think it is necessary men to be interrogated about how they feel about you. When the man loves you or even when he just likes you a lot, he will let you know. If you have to ask him, this is a sign that he does not feel the need to communicate to you how he feels.
    What I found particularly annoying in his book is the message that men mostly are interested in s*x with the woman, and how important it is to hold off the fortress and not to appear easy. This is like my grandma’s advice, thank you very much.

  171.  #171Azure Blu on July 10, 2015 at 4:45 am

    I agree with Indigo!!! #166
    YES!!! We are the PRIZE… We are doing the choosing

    “the main reason is that *I* am the prize,
    I am the woman, the goddess, the precious jewel…
    what on earth am I doing asking
    what he “thinks” of me,
    or how he feels about me?
    For me, I feel that it is for us women to determine if the man is what we want,
    it is for men to try and impress us
    court us and win our favour and our hearts.”
    “You can get into a man-pleasing cycle.
    NOT GOOD!!!
    A man who likes you WILL let you know.”

  172.  #172Femininewoman on July 10, 2015 at 5:26 am

    Hi Sassy. When I see stuff like that I wonder about the context and the timing. While I can’t say I like or dislike Steve Harvey’s style or advice I do believe he has some experience and must have some valid reason for including such things in the box. I have read the book but don’t remember the relevance of the questions. The comment about before getting “too far into the romance” really stands out to me. I read it as “before you give your heart away, before you sleep with a guy” find out where he sees the relationship going.

  173.  #173Femininewoman on July 10, 2015 at 5:33 am

    “You can get into a man-pleasing cycle.
    NOT GOOD!!!
    A man who likes you WILL let you know.”

    Well I dunno. It depends on where the woman is coming from. Asking those questions don’t necessarily mean the woman wants to move forward. She could be questioning his intentions and feeling suspicious of why he is trying to impress her. Her tone of voice alone can communication sarcasm and aloofness when asking such questions. Assuming that the person would be looking to please the man just because she asks such questions I don’t think is a good assumption. It all depends where the woman is coming from. In any event you can’t say the wrong thing to the right man anyway. Right?

  174.  #174Mandy on July 10, 2015 at 8:26 am

    This article depicts the exact space I am in at the moment with J. I mean, exactly!

    He’s the bad-boy motorcycle riding, drinking, smoking, detached, tortured-soul, artist-type guy I have always swooned for…

    But as I’ve illustrated many a time on this blog, we’re not compatible. I’m warm and bubbly and he’s Eeyore. He’s like a little black raincloud. I’m highly driven and he’s nearly stagnant. He is actually embarrassed by my openness and honesty. That is the part I cannot live with. If someone doesn’t feel comfy around me because of their own baggage I just want to cut them off completely and not be around them at all and believe me, I know I care about J’s feelings, but I am always feeling within a millimeter of telling him to leave.

    I have been sitting here pushing myself to say something to him…it’s “over”, or “I’m not interested anymore”…all these words…images…scenarios…so scary you know…freaky…

    J told me the story of how once when he wanted to talk to his ex-girlfriend, who’d just dumped him for the same reasons I want to, he went to her apartment and asked to talk to her, and when she said no, he hit her window with his hand out of anger, and broke the window, and realized in that instant what he had done, let her call the cops on him, and sat there and waited to be arrested and then spent the night in jail. This is one reason why I’m terrified to break it off. I don’t want cops coming to my apartment, I don’t want to be abused, I don’t want him getting drunk and freaking out on me…

    To add to the anxiety, G is pressuring me to ditch J. I know he feels J is not good for me and that it needs to happen. But he is pretty darn aggressive about it, even though I like that in a man, but this is so not about G, this is about me, and about me making my own decisions as I feel are fit to make, for my own reasons, not for anyone else. I know G thinks J is a dope, but J is a human being and I still care for him as a friend, so that causes a bit of conflict inside me when G even brings J up and presses the issue. I want the situations as separate as I can get them.

    Why am I here right now? Well I know I wanted a detached man, got him, now am done with it, and now wanting out…but can’t shuffle people around. So I am here because of past wants and hurts, and you can’t force or hurry anything…


    Well, I just got back from Lake Powell. That was nice but it was with J’s family and boy was it toxic in communication issues and everything. Now I know where he got his communication issues from. He just gives up and shuts down and he’s hard-wired to do it, no one can change those spots on that leopard’s coat…

    So, I feel very conflicted anxious and confused. Can I sit with these feelings? I’m sure I can. Not forever, that’s for damn sure, but for now, maybe…

    I feel focusing on my anti-inflammatory diet and feeling good physically and continuing to make my appointments and such is good right now, maybe something to take up some of my time like a class.
    Not thinking about it all really helps…lol…

    Right now my mind is off of it, lol, because I ate a Stevia-sweetened product, and I didn’t know it, but I’m allergic to Ragweed, and Stevia is a member of the Ragweed family…darnit…so now I itch all over…time to go soak in a hot bath lol…yay for listening to one’s body!!! 🙂

    I have to go to the Endocrinologist to have my Thyroid hormone levels checked, but I think I’m going to treat myself to a pedicure after that…something like that…:)

  175.  #175Mandy on July 10, 2015 at 8:32 am

    Sassy 157 –

    The questions feel so robotic…so automated…so auto-pilot…pressuring…pop-quiz…I don’t see myself saying those questions to a man and ever feeling melty or Sireny saying them much less allowing him to feel comfy…so I disagree with asking men those questions…

    I feel a man lets you know those things if you are open and listen and let it all happen, especially if he is a good, masculine guy.

    That’s the beauty of the masculinity, it does everything for you, lol. Can’t beat that 🙂

  176.  #176Waterfall on July 10, 2015 at 8:48 am

    Sirens, I need some advice…

    D has been in contact with me again recently, and I did agree to meet up with him. He told me he was going to take me on a day out with a possible swim in the sea, and lunch at a nice restaurant. Of course I agreed to it – he made it sound so wonderful. He also kept saying to me, in such a soothing voice that we could do whatever I wanted and that he just wanted to make me happy.

    Anyway, the day started fine and he picked me up from my flat and we headed to the coast, to a pretty little cove tucked away between all the busy seaside resorts. Unfortunately it was a bit cool by the time we got there so I just waited in a bar by the sea and he went for a dip. As usual though when it came to lunchtime he said that he wasn’t hungry and had brought sandwiches instead. My heart sunk.. somethings just don’t change – and I didn’t feel like he was thinking about me at all. Just himself and his wallet!

    Anyway, I won’t bore you all with the details. I just think I feel like he manipulates me and I fall for it every time..

    Today he emailed me asking if I was around this weekend. I think though deep down he has known it is coming to an end because he hasn’t been chasing me very much like he usually does..

    Well, to cut a long story short I replied that I was busy and that as I want a proper normal relationship I feel I need to move on. I also said a bunch of other stuff but again I won’t bore you with the details! He then responded that he will gracefully backdown and he is glad that I now want a “proper relationship”.

    My head was spinning!!! What have we been doing for the past 2 years!!?? This only tells me clearly the mans immaturity and that I am well shot of him.

    I also agree with Rori that if he had wanted a proper relationship with me then I would have inspired him to do that. This man is obviously toxic!

    I feel like I want to yell at him and say something like how dare he waste my time etc…

    Sirens what do you think? Have I handled it all wrong…

    I would be so grateful for some fresh perspective on this…

  177.  #177Waterfall on July 10, 2015 at 9:17 am

    Mandy 171,

    I feel I really relate to your story, I hope you don’t mind me saying so.

    My D is very similar and it has taken me a good while to work my feelings out and there have been a lot of twists and turns along the way.

    My roller coaster ride sounds similar to yours in many ways. D is a bad boy, fly-by-night character, also eccentric. I have felt controlled by him to a certain extent as I so much have to watch my emotions around him.

    Haha I so relate to what you say about you being warm and bubbly and him being like Eeyore – that is so true to my situation too!

    I dunno, I wish I could give you some advice. Lot’s of people have tried to give me advice. I wish I knew why I was here – and can’t seem to properly move on…

    That yearning is still there… I feel like I’m grasping at straws all the time, seeing shards of light through the cracked glass…

  178.  #178Waterfall on July 10, 2015 at 9:26 am


    Do you ever have this issue…?

    Sometimes when I see a celebratory couple in the news that I feel have a real toxic relationship – it can massively trigger me…

    About a year ago I started watching Kourtney’s and Scott’s relationship on Keeping up with the Kardashians.

    Now I know that it is a made for tv, lowest common denominator trashy reality soap opera – but I can’t help but be drawn to these two characters. They are so real..

    But all the time it kept reminding me of my own relationship with D. It was like I was looking in a mirror. I kept thinking cringe, cringe cringe!!! It felt like a mass ball of hysteria in the pit of my stomach…

    Yet, I know if I mentioned this to D he would be horrified that I compared him to Scott! And he would try and soothe me of my insecurity too…

    And again I saw a film where a couple were in their 60’s and had been married for 30 years and every time they fell out he would go running after her to kiss and make up. Then one day he met another woman but yet still wanted to stay with his wife out of guilt. I cried and cried at the end because it reminded me of my relationship with D.

    Ahh… sorry to sound so miserable…
    I just needed to let it out somewhere…

  179.  #179Waterfall on July 10, 2015 at 9:36 am

    Mandy 171,

    Sorry, what I meant to say to you was that I wish I could give you some advice but you will know what to in your own sweet time, like I did.

    I think you are doing great, by the way!

    Truly awesome how positive and self aware you are, and I love that you describe yourself as bubbly. I think that that is such a beautiful way to be…

    Keep shining your light of positivity in the world and don’t let anybody put it out for you! This is such a beautiful trait you have..

  180.  #180Sassy on July 10, 2015 at 9:48 am

    Thank you all for responding to that question. I personally have never asked those questions either. I agree that actions (or the lack thereof) speak louder than words.

    As for Steve Harvey, I looked at the perspective of him speaking from his gender. I don’t focus on his personal life because what he has or has not done with respect to his marriage or marriages are none of my business. I may not agree with everything he advises, but there are some things he writes about that have definitely opened my eyes to how differently men and women think.

    And of course, we all look at advice or opinions from the lens of our own filter, where we are, have been and where we hope to be headed.

  181.  #181Dominique on July 10, 2015 at 10:23 am

    Waterfall – I’m so sorry for what’s you’ve been dealing with/going through with D, yet time with anyone is never time wasted as long as you learn and grow which I think you have been. You’ve become so much clearer on what you want and don’t want, i.e. what are deal breakers and what you can accept, what feels good and what doesn’t.

    So D has given you a gift, maybe not the kind you might have envisioned yet a gift nonetheless.

    Now what you can you do for yourself today to fill yourself up if only a little, where can you take care of you in ways which feel good.

    Love to you.


  182.  #182Mandy on July 10, 2015 at 12:02 pm


    of course I don’t mind you relating to my story 🙂

    It’s the story for so many of us. There’s a terrible attraction to the danger, the excitement, and it’s like we want a momentary weakness to be satisfied then realize… hey sometimes those bad boys are just that still after the dating period…bad boys…rebels…playing by no rules…hard-wired to be defiant…and difficult…and maybe even just negative…:P

    You see I’ve always fallen hard for the dark artistic bad-boy type, the Robert Smith from The Cure type, who is poetic and deep and passionate and not your typical man… In my experience, they are deep and romantic during the honeymoon phase of the relationship, but then when the relationship settles into a routine, their misery wants some serious company, and they want you to mother them, and I just don’t want to be a miserable or co-dependant person.

    This is my own personal Siren theory, lol, but the “little black rain clouds” are the ones we try to fix, the ones we eventually want to do something masculine, even though their feminine energy is beguiling, but some are just hard-wired to completely out-girl every woman they come across, lol.

  183.  #183Senior Lady Vibe on July 10, 2015 at 12:07 pm


    Actions speak louder than words and it’s good to have actions and words that match and also agreement on word definitions.

    To assume a man’s feelings, thoughts and intentions based only on personal perceptions of actions can lead to mistakes in judgment and unfortunate decisions.

    While I don’t know if I’d use those exact “Steve Harvey-worded questions” I’m more inclined to agree with FW’s “…it depends…”

    It depends on where and when the questions are asked. These are not questions, however worded, that I’d ask, for example, on a fifth date, as we walked into the penguin enclosure in the park.

    But if a man makes an offer such as exclusive dating, more time together, physical intimacy, traveling together, setting up household together, buying property together, marriage etc, I’d like to hear specific words from the man regarding his feelings, thoughts, plans.

    “But I thought you knew…” are words I don’t want to subsequently hear or express. 🙂


  184.  #184Senior Lady Vibe on July 10, 2015 at 12:09 pm

    Where are the coaches?

  185.  #185Femininewoman on July 10, 2015 at 1:07 pm

    Such clarity SLV!!!

  186.  #186Azure Blu on July 10, 2015 at 1:21 pm

    SLadyVibe #180
    Mmmm… I really like what you are saying here…

    I can see how it would be very good to share this information with each other… “in the right context”
    and I too hate this….
    “But I thought you knew…”

  187.  #187Waterfall on July 10, 2015 at 1:54 pm


    Thank you for your kind words!

    I should be glad to be shot of D. He is immature, childish, selfish… hopefully in time I won’t be so drawn to him. But I feel scared that my defences are weak.

    My little girl can’t cope. He beckons me forward, and then pushes me away – but I fall for it every time!

    Lol, anyway I went for a walk to the new superstore built in my area. They really are brilliant and it’s really lifted my spirits! I bought myself a beautiful pair of silver slip on shoes and some nice food and bits and pieces…

    It is lovely to watch the area changing. Hope it’s for the best!

    I also bought myself some indulgent ingredients to make a delicious lasagne with some 5 year old Madeira sherry.

    I also got a load of yummy ingredients to make some scrummy chocolate brownies and chocolate chip cookies!

    Ahhh, and tomorrow I am going on a beautiful walk in Sussex and will hopefully see a castle and some lovely country-side. Can’t wait!

    Love to you Dominique! Your words are so kind and inspirational – to me and to everybody!


  188.  #188Zara on July 10, 2015 at 2:31 pm

    Copy-pasted from a Rori Raye news letter

    Dear Zara,

    If you’re deep into that hot, juicy, scary and sometimes painful thing with a man we all call “chemistry” – but what you REALLY want is INTIMACY with him – this tip will help you:

    Chemistry is a trick.
    It fools you.
    Chemistry is about…well, chemicals.
    They hit your nose, and the cells of your body, and they remind you of things long ago and turn you on.
    They make you think you’ve hit the “one.”
    They make you want to take him home.
    They make you want to open up your heart, body and soul to him, with him.
    And it makes you want to trust your feelings that this is true.

    Intimacy, on the other hand – is slow growing.
    It makes you bump up, time and time again, against your old habits, stale patterns, your beliefs that have gotten you through life up to this point.
    Intimacy challenges your heart, mind, body and soul to rethink themselves.
    Intimacy – when you create it, and when a man can do it, and when you feel it – opens up ALL the cells of your heart, mind, body and soul to a relationship with a man.

    * Chemistry makes us want to merge with a man.
    Intimacy makes us want to share with him.

    * Chemistry makes us want to get from a man.
    Intimacy makes us want to receive from him.

    * Chemistry makes us want to give to a man to get from him.
    Intimacy makes us want to give back to him because we’re already so filled up.

    * Chemistry makes us want to make something happen with a man.
    Intimacy makes us want to create with him.

    * Chemistry makes us feel afraid.
    Intimacy makes us feel secure.

    * Chemistry makes us feel we love.
    Intimacy makes us feel loved.


    If you’re with a man – you get to practice intimacy on him, using these tools.

    And what if there IS no man right now? Then it’s all about beginning to create intimacy with every human being you meet.

    In a sense, what this tool helps you do is practice INTIMACY with everyone you meet, and – most importantly – intimacy with yourself!

    So, whether or not you’re “in” a relationship, you can be Circular Dating.
    And as you Circular Date (essentially simply practicing the tools of speaking as my Love Scripts program teaches you), you’ll begin to find that “intimacy” is about your intimacy with YOU much of the time!

    It’s the question: “How can I feel sexy, or lovely, or desirable, or “intimate” if there’s no man here to feel that with?”
    And the answer – if you really ask yourself – has to be: All this has to happen inside ME, first.

    Love has to circulate in your OWN inner system before you can fully experience it in relationship with the world – otherwise what happens is:
    We intellectually take in that there’s a man, in relationship with us.
    We think our way through it, we experience the physical aspects of it to some degree, we experience emotionality to some degree, but all the depth, all of the REAL experience just slips by us.
    We make assumptions about what’s going on. About who we are, about who he is, and about what this is supposed to look like.
    We ignore inner voices that are telling us that this is all for US to “make up” however we wish to “make it up” – and steadfastly choose to see things as we always have.
    We assume that a lack of “chemistry” at the beginning of knowing a man means “love” isn’t possible.
    We assume “true love” is what it’s like in the movies, without considering that perhaps it looks and feels completely different in OUR real life.
    We are more impressed by a feeling of yearning inside us than a feeling of contentment.
    We judge all kinds of things, and the more power we give to our image of a man, the less power we give ourselves to feel, organically, what feels right for us – instead of what we “think” is right for us.

    Intimacy is where it’s at – so how can you FEEL a sense of intimacy when there’s no man in your life at the moment, or the man in your life just doesn’t feel emotionally intimate to you?

    For me it starts with feeling intimate with ME – where I’m hearing all the voices inside me and not ignoring any of them.
    In my new program – Love Scripts – I give you the exact WAY to speak to a man. To say ANYTHING to him – no matter how delicate the subject, or how scared you feel.

    Because intimacy depends upon you sharing exactly who you are – which means sharing exactly how you feel no matter how “ugly” you believe those feelings to be. It all starts with being truthful with YOU.
    So, the scripts in Love Scripts work two ways:

    1. They give you the words and body language you need – in a really practical and doable way – to communicate who you are and how you’re feeling to a man no matter what’s going on.
    And these words and body language are scripted to bring a man CLOSER to you emotionally – and therefore create more intimacy between you.

    2. The scripts steer you inside yourself to find out more about you so you CAN share who you are with a man!
    In other words – you have to feel what you feel and know what you feel and be able to put words to what you feel in order to really talk with and be with a man in an intimate way.

    This is going to begin the process of creating intimacy for your relationship with a man – and “chemistry” too! – by creating intimacy between You and You.
    You can start watching Love Scripts right here online – whether you’re dating and looking for Mr. Right, or you’re already in a relationship. Either way, you’ll learn how to create the kind of intimacy that makes you feel safe, heard, and loved: http://www.havetherelationshipyouwant.com/lovescripts

    As you practice the tools in this letter, and the Scripts in Love Scripts, please let me know how it’s all working for you.
    Sometimes, all it takes is days for these scripts to work on the outside, in your dialogues with a man – and on the inside, in your dialogues with YOURSELF.
    Once you learn how to speak to a man in this new “language,” everything in your life will shift toward more love – and you’ll never want to go back!

    Love, Rori

  189.  #189Zara on July 10, 2015 at 2:39 pm

    Copy-pasted from a Rori Raye news letter
    If You’re Anything Like Me, You Hate To Date

    In fact, dating is often downright excruciating. You feel at the mercy of every man you’re attracted to:

    You get your hopes up with a certain guy, and you cancel all your other plans to make it really easy for him to see you.

    When you’re actually with him, you monitor every word and movement you make, trying to make sure you don’t do anything that might rock the boat. You go along with everything he says and try to appear as low maintenance as possible.

    At the end of the date, you thank him profusely for such a wonderful time. You more than hint that he should ask you out again.

    When you’re not with him, you think of a million things you could do for him: if his birthday is coming up, you scour recipes for the perfect cake. If you hear that his favorite band is coming to town, you get tickets.

    When you’re lying in bed at night (alone), you wonder why he hasn’t called you back yet. Or why he didn’t put a kiss at the end of his text.

    When you’re lying in bed next to him, you wonder if you slept with him too fast. Or not fast enough. You wonder if you were “good enough.”

    You spend most of your time in a state of mild anxiety, waiting for the other shoe to drop.

    And, eventually, your worst fear comes true – the guy you’re dating doesn’t want to date you anymore.

    Why How You’re Dating Isn’t Working

    A lot of people will try to give you advice about why you’re still single, why that guy flaked out on you, or why you should get on a certain dating site.

    But even though I don’t know you, I’m pretty certain that the reason dating isn’t working for you is because there is a fundamental mistake in how you’re dating to begin with.

    To be more specific, the way you’ve been dating ISN’T dating at all.

    Here’s what I mean:

    Meeting a guy you like and going on “dates” with him and ONLY with him – while forgetting about your own life – isn’t dating. What you’ve just done is become exclusive with him – someone you don’t even know.

    Think about it: by choosing to “date” only one guy, you’ve given him the same kinds of privileges your husband or committed partner would get. You’re seeing only him, you’re making plans only with him, you’re building your life only with him, and you’re sleeping only with him.

    Yet there’s one big exception:
    => You have zero commitment from him.

    And here’s what that does:

    #1 You become less attractive to him – because he knows you’ve already decided he’s the one (and on very little to go on)

    #2You make him less likely to commit – because he hasn’t had to do much to get you all to himself

    #3You practically eliminate your chances for meeting Mr. Right – because you’ve completely taken yourself off the market. And if the guy you’re dating IS Mr. Right, you’ve dramatically reduced his desire to secure your love (see #1 and #2.)

    Siren, you don’t have this kind of time to waste!

    Learn How To Be The Woman Who Gets To CHOOSE

    Being at the mercy of any man’s affections is one of the worst feelings.

    You’re constantly trying to show him you’re a great catch and why the two of you are so good together. You’re kind of like a lawyer arguing your case, and it’s a case you’ll lose.

    If you have to PROVE your worth to a man, you’re losing. And you’re not choosing. You’re waiting for him to pick you! It’s a recipe for misery and for remaining single.

    That’s why I created Targeting Mr. Right – so that you can turn the tables and be the chooser. And so that the men around you are bending over backwards so you will choose them.

    When you watch Targeting Mr. Right, you’ll learn “Circular Dating” – my most powerful tool that completely redefines the concept of going out on dates.

    You’ll see why it’s crucial for you to date more than one man at a time – or “date yourself” – and I’ll teach you exactly how to date multiple men without making the man you want think you’re not interested in him. In fact, you’ll automatically make yourself MORE attractive to him and trigger his desire to want you all to himself.

    Dating will no longer feel like an endless chore that you have no control over and that only brings you pain, uncertainty, and frustration. Instead, Circular Dating is a system that puts YOU in the driver’s seat and makes men practically beg to come along with you for the ride – and ride away into the sunset with you.

    Circular Dating Keeps Working For You Even When You’re Not Single

    Here’s the really cool thing about Circular Dating: you’ll be using this Tool long after you’re married or in a committed relationship.

    In fact, I use the Tool all the time with my husband, and we’ve been together for decades!

    Why? The concepts and techniques I’ll teach you in Targeting Mr. Right are the principles that keep ATTRACTION going strong in a relationship – that keep your man from taking you for granted and instead keep him working hard to keep you happy.

    Let me know how Circular Dating changes the way you relate to men (and how they experience you)!

    Love, Rori

  190.  #190Dominique on July 10, 2015 at 3:19 pm

    Waterfall – 184 – This sounds so wonderful. I wish I could join you – for all of it, lol.

    Thank you for your sweet words. It means so much.


  191.  #191Tereana on July 10, 2015 at 5:53 pm

    Indigo – I loved reading about your dates, too! It sounds lovely. And I hope it continues…

    Lovergirl – I laughed so much at your response. When you want to be serious, they want to be casual. And when you want fun a flirty, they want to be serious. For real! That is so true. And so annoying…lol

  192.  #192Tereana on July 10, 2015 at 6:08 pm

    Thank you, thank you, thank you, for all your kind and thoughtful responses. I haven’t checked in this last week because I’ve been taking a break. I took a break from drinking caffeine. I took a break from checking Facebook. And I guess I took a break from the blog.

    I had a wonderful visit with my grandparents. I saw my kitty, who is staying with my father right now. And I had a doctors appointment on Monday, followed by a brief visit with a good friend. That all helped a lot.

    You know what else helped a lot? GETTING MY PERIOD. Sheesh. When I feel this bad, without fail, it goes away wishing either minutes or max. one day after I get my period.

    I still feel a little of the sads, but NOTHING like what I felt last week. That was dicey. I was just about ready to check out. But that’s not really what I’m about. It’s not my instinct. When I see a truck coming toward me, I step aside, so I’m not even close to the street. I avoid danger and bodily harm. Putting myself in harm’s way is not my jam. But feeling hopeless and if my life means nothing – well, I guess sometimes that IS my jam. But usually temporary.

    I have a job. That’s good. I’ve done many things that I am proud of. My grandparents love me, and that’s obvious. No stretch of imagination needed. And I’ve had some time to re-frame and realign. I need more time. Summer is restful and a good time to do that.

    I also think it’s a good time to take a break from dating. Honestly, I haven’t really been dating much anyway. I considered getting back online last weekend, but then I changed my mind. I don’t want to date to fill the void. I want to date because I know who I am and I’m ready to be present to myself and my partner. I want to be really clear on what I want – what my goals and expectations are. And also what not to expect, and when and how to let go. I don’t want to control. I want to BE. And I have this opportunity to do self-care in a way I maybe haven’t done before.

    It’s all about the re-frame. It’s all about the stories we tell ourselves, and what they mean to us. It makes all the difference.

  193.  #193Lovergirl on July 10, 2015 at 10:26 pm

    Tonight I am filled with horrible thoughts. I feel so angry towards S. I feel like smashing his windows and keying his lovely Lexus. I feel almost murderous rage towards that woman he went to a party with.

    I saw tonight that she was signed up for a swinger party and noted that she is bringing a +1. I do not even know if it is S but I feel SO angry towards the both of them.

    I do not like feeling this way. I keep having to take deep breaths to calm myself. I do not plan to do anything crazy, but I FEEL like it.

    I feel horribly sick to my stomach and just furiously angry. The last time I remember feeling like this was with another man, in a similar situation a couple of years ago. Funny thing is, I saw THAT man viewing my swinger profile tonight. He does that from time to time but I havent had contact with him in over a year.

    All these bad feelings and memories resurfacing. At the same time, Tinder has stopped working on my phone. I get notifications that the guy I went on a date with, the one who works for a medical research company, is messaging me, but I cant log in to read or respond. Ive tried multiple things and sent emails to Tinder to no avail. Grrrrrr… Oh, amd my wifi stopped working tonight too, on my laptop. It only works plugged into ethernet. Computer issues get me riled up too. I hate dealing with stuff like that. Tonight is NOT my night!!!

  194.  #194IamHis on July 11, 2015 at 5:46 am

    I feel really emotionally stopped up. I have too many!!

    High School Guy liked something of mine on social media, involving the death of someone I love.

    And that’s how I still feel connected to him. Because when someone he loves dies or someone I love dies, we reconnect. But I feel tired and scared, because we’ll see each other, and we’ll talk and touch and hold each other and then I don’t see him again because he never follows through or steps up.

    & I feel angry because I still care about him. We have to have the weirdest & most underdeveloped relationship ever. We were kids together, but we’re really strangers as adults. Truly. We didn’t even know each other that well as kids. He just always had this huge crush on me and sort of figured out things about me that I didn’t even know about myself. & so I guess that’s why he means something to me.

    That, & every time I run into him, he looks at me and touches me like I’m an absolute angel that he can’t believe is real. It feels good to feel like an angel in his presence.

    But seriously, the only thing we have in common is that we care about each other.

    & I know he’s wanting my attention because today is his 30th birthday.

    Part of me feels like ignoring him, because caring about him is so exhausting.

    But part of me still cares & feels curious.

    I just don’t want to get back in our pattern of talking for a while, maybe seeing each other and that’s it.

    He never steps up & as far as I know, we still have absolutely nothing in common!

    I feel angry at myself for even typing all that out! This feels stupid!

  195.  #195IamHis on July 11, 2015 at 5:48 am

    I’m just going to let it go.

  196.  #196IamHis on July 11, 2015 at 5:51 am

    …but I’m at the point where I really want to run away from someone else. & I feel scared & a distraction in the former of another guy would feel good.

    Bleh. I feel embarrassed and pouty and five years old.

  197.  #197IamHis on July 11, 2015 at 6:13 am

    I wish I was better at talking about my feelings. I just feel so stubborn, like I want them to do it (but what masculine man is really verbal like that?)

    I always feel like I have too much power and responsibility in dating and relationships, & that I fail miserably with that responsibility & power, & get left or have assumptions made about me or I make the assumptions because I just can’t seem to open my mouth at the right time or I just get tired and frustrated and over it/them.

  198.  #198IamHis on July 11, 2015 at 6:18 am

    I was talking with this one younger guy. & he was talking about how he wanted to get fit/physically bigger, & I just found myself thinking “Oh my goodness, can’t you just accept yourself as you are?”

    Which feels extremely curious looking back…

  199.  #199Indigo on July 11, 2015 at 8:28 am

    I thought I’d let you ladies know how the work dinner cruise party went last night.

    I had a GREAT time. They’d organised for a taxi to pick us up and take us so we didn’t have to worry about drinking and driving. The boat was beautiful – big and luxurious, and we had a lovely table in the corner with a view of the lights and the water. There was live music which was really great and we had a bottle or two of wine, several drinks and a couple of rounds of shots. All in all it was just so great to see everyone unwind a little. My boss was a totally different person, SO relaxed and good company actually. After dinner one of my female co-workers and I hit the dance floor and danced up a storm. I really felt as if I warmed up and opened up completely, and had such fun.

    As for my cute co-worker, it must have taken every drop of those drinks to get him to talk to me, or that’s the impression I got anyway. He started off the evening quite quiet and reserved, I think that’s the way he is actually. But he was quite gentlemanly – there was a gangplank down to the boat and because I was in heels he offered his arm for me to hold onto as I walked down. We sat next to each other at dinner and managed a little conversation. He took my plate for me and gave it to the waitress in a way that was also quite gentlemanly and sweet.

    We could not get him or the other guys to join us on the dancefloor though, they were way too shy.

    Finally, after the boat cruise we all eventually ended up back at a pub close to home – somehow he and I ended up sitting next to each other both on the taxi back and at the pub, though I certainly did not engineer it that way. Once there he started asking me questions about myself – my birthday, my family, what I studied at university. We wound up in a long conversation for the first time ever, and he certainly seemed interested in a lot of details about me. He shared about himself too. He asked me if I was a dancer because he said I had beautiful posture and was interested by the fact that I’d done ballet for many years. At the end of the night he did buy me a final drink instead of letting me get it for myself, and he did give me a hug goodbye. It seemed like he might have been interested in me but it was hard to tell for sure because, as I’ve said, of his natural reserve.

    So I don’t know. I certainly enjoyed getting to know him a bit better!

  200.  #200Indigo on July 11, 2015 at 8:33 am

    Oh, he definitely isn’t gay, he is straight. Like I said I certainly got an interested vibe from him, but it was hard to tell for sure…

  201.  #201Millie on July 11, 2015 at 11:18 am


  202.  #202Millie on July 11, 2015 at 11:34 am

    Oh ladies…what is wrong with me….
    I’m allowing myself to throw the stop sign away, to throw myself into the heart of the shipwreck, I opened the treasure chest of photos and videos of M…allowed myself to “go there” and the pain is searing in my chest. How can I miss a person so much he doesn’t want me? Looking through our photos, videos, texts, remnants of a journey…I can’t help but want it back. I wish it never ended. I feel so wrong for this…I shouldn’t feel any desire for a man who left…oh but I do!!

    Last night I went out and I started smelling M. I had forgotten what he smelled like until I caught it in the bar. It was actually a guy friend who was wearing the same cologne…he lent me his jacket and I almost started crying in the bar….I didn’t, but for the rest of the night M was with me. I feel crazy saying that…I feel so crazy. I want to crawl out of my skin and stop feeling this energy, this desire that can’t be quenched. An appetite to know, to reach something, to reach him, this anticipation that one day it will all be as it was. I feel like a crazy person. This does not sound grounded at all.

    I let go of CDB. That was easy. Last night my guy friend and his friends got pretty drunk and were being rowdy. My guy friend can be borderline inappropriate sometimes which became contagious..and suddenly towards the end of the night I found myself to feel like their toy and was glad to leave. Perhaps I am representative of what they want but can’t have…still young and beautiful, full of vitality and freedom, who embraces desire. My friend has a gf, his brother is married, and the third guy- I don’t know his story but he kept asking me to stay longer. I was happy to leave. Then I came home to receive a late night text from Mechanic, one from this guy I’ve never met who decided to send me a video of his dick at 2:30am, (i did not respond), and another guy from pof I never met. So much male attention…but all very weird and to not be thought of.

  203.  #203Labbit on July 11, 2015 at 4:10 pm

    Hello Sirens!

    It’s been a little while, I’ve been a very busy bee, and I just wanted to pop in with an update of what’s been going on with me.

    Right now I am going through some major healing, as well as facing one trigger after another. I have a lot to share, so this is very long…

    I am feeling triggered by how busy Tender is at work right now. (And HE is triggered by our growing intimacy, which makes him want to rubberband and take space for himself so he can keep from losing himself. But this is about me, not him. 🙂 ) It’s my trigger. And because I’ve healed so much in the last year or so, in addition to making progress in healing this trigger, a bunch of other old cruft is coming up at the same time to be healed. That all this stuff is coming up at the same time, THAT’S what’s hard for me. And yet, it’s all so perfect.

    A few weeks ago I was feeling intense anxiety, and though I still feel it for an hour or so here and there, I see now that the anxiety was simply me fighting against feelings that WANTED to come up, WANTED to be felt. I finally stopped fighting with it, and spent one odd day pretty much quaking in my shoes the entire day. Yet even as I felt all this fear, and couldn’t really understand why it was happening or what it means, I was OK with it. I let it be and went on with my day, and when it took me over I let it do that without acting out. But mostly it’s anger that wanted to come up and that was what I felt next after the fear. I feel so angry right now, sometimes for hours at a time. A lot of times I THINK that I’m angry at Tender, but I’m coming to discover that while yes I am angry at him for some little things, mostly I’m angry at past boyfriends, or my parents, or friends, or myself, and often about things that have nothing to do with reality. It’s stuff I made up. They were old hurts that I created and buried deep within myself, and because I never let myself feel the hurt and anger and sadness and guilt before, they were becoming like a volcano inside of me. They wanted to come out and I was sick of pushing them down time and time again. It is time to allow myself to be angry, to be scared, and to let these old wounds heal that want to heal.

    Silly things will happen that trigger me and launch me into the anger. For example about three weeks ago Tender asked me out for drinks instead of our usual dinner date night, and this prompted feelings of RAGE in me. My trigger was that since he was asking me out for only drinks, his intent was to dump me. I wanted to call him and tell him that if he was going to dump me, there was no need to have the pretense of drinks to do it. (Yes, I can totally see how silly and ridiculous this sounds, and yet it’s the truth of where my mind has been recently. Triggered. A lot.) And then of course the reality was that he’d read about a new bar he thought I’d enjoy, and wanted to take me there as a treat. The bar ended up being a bust so he took me out to dinner at my favorite restaurant instead, which was nearby. AKA the opposite of what my trigger was telling me.

    Another example: This past week Tender had to push back the start of one of our dates because he got pulled into a late meeting at work. Just by a few hours, and if I were centered it would be no big deal. Instead, trigger activated, INTENSE RAGE felt again. Temptation to snap at him and tell him to just forget it, since he couldn’t make it on time it wasn’t worth it. Soothed myself, took a nice long shower before our date, had a wonderful and romantic time. Reality and my brain are sometimes not lining up at all while I’m working through this period of trigger healing.

    So I’m reading lots of Rori’s old posts about anger, and learning to let myself feel it, REALLY feel it, not judge it (I do better at this some times than others), and even learn to love it as me protecting myself. I am trusting myself to be angry and let that be OK, to not judge myself as bad for feeling this way sometimes. I’ve treated anger as ‘bad’ for so long that there’s a lot of it that was buried inside of me, and needs to come out in healthy ways. I am learning how to do this. And the most difficult part for me, but one that I’m becoming better and better at, is that I’m learning how to EXPRESS that anger to Tender if it rises up while I’m with him.

    Being able to express my anger is SO HUGE. My parents, their fighting style is to suppress their anger with each other until it explodes out in pointed fingers and wounding words. I don’t want to fight like that, I don’t want to fight at all really. And this is not to blame them…I’m sure their parents fought that way, and that THEIR parents fought that way, and so on back down the line. I see a chance now for me to break that useless habit, to create something better for myself and something better for me and Tender.

    Anyway, I found a great script in one of Rori’s posts on anger that I used for myself with Tender: “You know – I feel awkward talking about this, but I’m feeling angry and disappointed, and I don’t want to pretend I don’t feel that way. Can we talk about what’s going on with us?” That opened up a beautiful dialogue for us about ways we might be putting up walls with each other.

    A couple of other scripts from Rori’s blog posts that have helped me bunches recently:
    “I’m feeling angry at myself. I’m feeling angry at you. It feels like a lump in my heart and hurts right here…”

    “I’m feeling afraid. I’m afraid of my anger. I can feel myself wanting to tiptoe and walk on eggshells, and I don’t want to do that. That feels awful.”

    In these conversations, I am learning to be mindful of how I express myself. My first temptation was to blame him, even when my anger had nothing to do with him, just something he did reminded me of an old hurt. I’m learning to be mindful of not telling him he’s making me unhappy (which my brain sometimes thinks is true but my intuition knows better), or making suggestions of what I want him to do, or telling him why or how he’s doing it wrong. There is the wounded part of me that wants to tell him exactly what to do, even though I know that won’t make me happy. It is not easy for me to reframe the way my brain tells me I’m angry into what I’m feeling in my body, of hearing the protective mechanism of my thoughts but not acting from it, but I am slowly learning how to do it. Sometimes I have to say that I am feeling angry but I don’t know why, and I need to go take a walk or do something for myself. That’s hard, because it feels like putting distance between me and Tender, but I see that these are likely instances where old hurts are coming up and they want to find an exit, and I need space and time with myself to let them exit.

    Where my work is right now is learning how to move THROUGH the anger, instead of holding onto it and stewing in it. Right now when I start to feel angry it takes me over, and that feels scary and makes my gut tighten and my shoulders crunch, and it feels like my heart is seizing up and the space behind my eyes is going dark. When this happens I feel evil and ugly and unlovable, and it’s a process for me to lift myself up out of that. I am working on learning how to channel it, and how to riff it into positive things…it is slow-going. But I am happy that I don’t spew outwards in anger, or take the way I feel out on Tender. Once or twice I have spewed it out onto him in moments of extreme GRRRRRR but mostly he is very patient with all this, and seems intrigued by what’s going on with me right now. I guess I mostly just feel confused at times, like things are going well and so I don’t understand why I’m angry…? But as Dominique recommended, I’m not concerning myself with figuring out why I’m confused or why I’m angry. I’m concerning myself with feeling it without acting out from it.

    But then again, I do get why I’m angry. I’m not actually angry at all, if that makes any sense. What’s happening is that I feel ever safer and more INTIMATE with Tender, and as that’s happening all these old defenses that I don’t need anymore (like defensive anger, self-protective anxiety, extreme sadness, etc.), things that I didn’t like about myself and buried down deep inside of myself without ever dealing with them, they are all coming up now as I heal so they too can be healed. So even though it feels really bad as they come up, in the bigger picture I see this all as so beautiful, and I feel very moved by it all. I wish I could say I feel happy, and I do in many moments, but I’m not quite back there yet to feeling happiness steadily. I know it will come.

    In one of her posts Rori talks about eventually being able to shift anger quickly to being something humorous, something that I can giggle at. I very much look forward to that, and maybe it’s closer than I know! Until then I’m learning how to love all of these emotions that are rushing up inside of me at times, and doing a tremendous amount of healing, and trusting that I am exactly where I need to be and with who I need to be with at this time.

    Tender and I are sticking together through all of this. In a few short days we’re going on a two-week vacation together and I’m excited to see what a fresh location brings to my perspective. At night I keep envisioning things becoming easier and easier for us, with constant and steady happiness. We’ll see what the near future brings…

  204.  #204Labbit on July 11, 2015 at 4:12 pm

    11 Azure Blu — Thank you, lovely Siren, for inquiring after me. 🙂 At the moment I’m not reading the blog much, not because I don’t miss you all, but because I’m dealing with so many triggers and sometimes reading the blog comments further triggers me at the moment, because it stirs up something inside that I don’t feel ready to deal with yet. I am not as steady as I have been at other times, so I’m treating myself tenderly.

  205.  #205Labbit on July 11, 2015 at 4:16 pm

    Also, Rori, this post is beautiful and speaks to exactly where I am at this time. Thank you for it…for so eloquently expressing the habit I previously had to blame myself when things aren’t feeling right, to make myself wrong instead of simply asking ‘for what reason am I here?’ I’ve been using this new tool a lot this week to wonderful and positive results.

  206.  #206Labbit on July 11, 2015 at 4:32 pm

    And I guess, one last thing that comes up for me is, at the moment I don’t know what to do when I can’t focus on the good things Tender does for me…and there are oh so many. What do I do in those moments where my mind zeroes in on the little things I DON’T like about the way he treats me, when my mind starts attacking him about the little things he doesn’t do, even though the reality is that they are SO outweighed by all the wonderful things he DOES do?

  207.  #207Femininewoman on July 11, 2015 at 5:35 pm

    Oh Labbit so lovely to see you pop. Been missing you. Your updates are so intriguing.

  208.  #208Indigo on July 11, 2015 at 11:06 pm


    It’s so good to see you post. I’ve missed you.

    A note about all these feelings – this is just my theory as a sensitive person. When you’re sensitive, you feel so much all the time. Often it doesn’t have a rhyme or reason, and sometimes you’re absorbing the feelings of other people. So trying to figure out why you feel these things can be exhausting. For me, I think my happiness as a sensitive person is that I CAN feel. ALL of it. You are wonderously and vigorously alive.

    When I can’t get myself to focus on the good, I just give in to whatever I’m feeling at the time.

  209.  #209April Rose on July 11, 2015 at 11:26 pm

    Can anyone remind me of the basics please?

    I think I need to step up my circular dating. And be an example to other UK women. I really don’t think we’ve got a handle on how to date.

    ‘Seeing someone’ in Britain usually means just that. Going out with one man.

    I have fallen into this pattern again.
    Although there has been some minor progress. I told ‘the man I’m seeing’ that I need to keep my options open, and that no man is going to take me off the market until I have my happy ever after.

    Phew. That felt scary, just saying that.

    Now I have to follow through.

    Thing is, I am not sure that we are both quite happy as we are…
    He seems more than happy with having a woman in his life two or three times a week. In fact, as he is quite a cautious man, I see no reason why he would risk his heart in a marriage or committed relationship when he is getting what he wants. He is quite the batchelor really.

    I guess I need to really be sure of what I want. What is my happy ever after and what does it look like?

    Because in a way I too am quite cautious and am happy with having a man in my life two or three times a week!

  210.  #210Indigo on July 12, 2015 at 1:27 am

    April Rose,

    It is the same here in South Africa. Once you have gone out with a man a few times, kissed him, it is assumed you are exclusive. I have had several men say they don’t want a woman to be dating others while she is seeing him, and that it indicates some flaw in character in her. Of course I don’t agree, and it has taken some doing to gently let them know that, and that it is up to the man to step up if he doesn’t want to lose her. On the other hand, I certainly don’t want to hurt any man so I have kept things deliberately more casual, still going out with my friends and accepting attention from other men, until I am a bit more sure of the man in question, until I can see whether we’d make a good fit.

    In this scenario I am happy seeing a man two or three times a week, but once things get more serious that would not be enough for me!

  211.  #211Azure Blu on July 12, 2015 at 11:12 am

    Indigo and April Rose,
    I have to say… it is NOT usual in the USA either…
    Most of my friends AND Cds think it odd and a little too much like “she’s a user” or “a Player”…

    This time around online dating… I am being MORE upfront and sharing my philosophy…
    “I am a quality woman… and I am looking for a quality man who ultimately wants a committed/rest of my life/marriage relationship.”
    “BUT it starts with dating and We’re both part of an online dating site… I imagine you are dating others also.”
    It is a perfect dialog to get the men (and all of us)
    out of pretending/avoiding the fact that we are ALLL dating others working on meeting the person that is right for US.

    Because almost EVERYMAN i meet wants to be exclusive by the second date!!! (sometimes the first date)
    Sooo i am wondering if actual old fashion courtship and dating just needs to be revived and WE are
    the Sirens to promote this
    All over the world!!!

  212.  #212Liquid Light on July 12, 2015 at 12:47 pm

    OMG, what do you all make of this? I’ve had one date with this guy last week and he’s been calling me and texting me everyday since. I just got this text from him after sending him a text that I’m really stressed now from work and that I’m probably not going to be that available but if he’d like to take things slowly and get to know each other over time, I’d like that.

    This was his response…

    I’m sorry to hear worked is weighing on you so much

    No !
    I’m not in a hurry, I like the slow relaxed pace 🙂
    That’s healthy –
    But I don’t forget for moment what a beautiful lady you are, and must have dozens of men wanting to court you on the dating site….
    Soooo if I feel we aren’t moving forward, then I’m definitely moving backwards lol
    But you just cleared the air, I think talking more often, to hear each other would help –
    Your call
    I’m here

    What do you all think???

  213.  #213Azure Blu on July 13, 2015 at 12:34 am

    Labbit #203
    HUGSSSSS!!! I feel excited and happy to hear your lovely siren song again!!

    Thank you, Thank you, for sharing your journey!!!

    What really stood out for me was your sharing
    about anger…
    How it is showing up for you and how you are embracing anger… thanking anger for trying to protect you… and sitting with it… feeling
    ALLL of it!!!

    It is interesting that as you get closer to Tender
    so much of your past is showing up…
    I know your relationship with Tender is MUCH different than mine with Spirit…
    But I watched myself… as Spirit and I worked on getting closer
    I began thinking about my old relationships…
    getting angry about small things…
    and totally blaming him… when he actually was doing many things I was asking for
    and even doing things I hadn’t asked for but wanted…
    HOW hard HE WAS trying to make things work

    (I know there were basics like religion that could NEVER be resolved)
    BUT still how quickly resentment
    AND anger built up about little day to day things- and how much better to
    have shared MY feelings instead of ignoring them…
    I missed those opportunities to BUILD closeness!!

    What a TRIGGER emotional intimacy IS
    and how hard I worked to keep it from happening…
    I must have been soooo very scared!

    Labbit you must be so very scared
    AND you are being VERY brave
    as you focus on YOU
    and realize it ISN”T about Tender!!!
    YOU are doing GREAT, lovely Siren

  214.  #214Azure Blu on July 13, 2015 at 12:38 am

    Liquid L..
    Ohhh… this man sounds VERY mature…
    He’s listening to you… he heard you
    worried about YOUR stress at work!!
    He acknowledges YOUR beauty… and his competition!
    So very masculine!!!

    This all sounds fantastic to me…
    For you, was it a good first date?

  215.  #215Azure Blu on July 13, 2015 at 12:51 am

    Zara #189
    THANK YOU for posting this!! Very great reminder…

    I now have 3 quality men in my rotation…
    I can see the benefit of dating more than one at a time… I have dated 2 but never 3
    I was almost saying to myself THIS IS TOO HARD!!
    BUT then i realized… I am learning so much
    about sharing my feelings with these men…
    I can see how they LOVE that i am doing that…
    They have all told me how much they
    like the fact that I am self assured enough
    to let them know I am dating others…
    What I am looking for and
    one date does NOT a relationship make!!!
    I want to make sure I DONT share
    information about my other dates…
    and keep the focus on getting to know each one
    by listening closely and watching their actions!

  216.  #216Indigo on July 13, 2015 at 1:04 am

    Liquid Light,

    I would feel some frustration getting a message like this from a man, and yet I realise that this is at least in part my issue.

    As Millie very eloquently and helpfully put it the other day, a man who is interested WANTS to contact you every day. Isn’t this so much better than the alternative where you don’t know where you stand? There is nothing to stop you sharing when it feels a bit overwhelming for you, but I would try to remain open to him if I were you. Just try to have your heart open and keep sharing in feeling messages and receiving from him.

    Just recently I have had to do this with BikeCD. He communicates every day and would see me every day if he could, I’m quite sure. And it felt a bit overwhelming to me. So I shared this with him. BUT I realised it is because he is so smitten with me, and that is not something you want to discourage. I am trying to remain open to whatever he is giving that feels good to me, and it does feel very nice for a change to be adored.

  217.  #217Victoria on July 13, 2015 at 1:33 am

    @ Liquid Light 212
    I think the main question is whether you like him and can imagine him being your boyfriend/lover/husband – whatever you want to have.
    With some men we just know there is very little potential there (usually because of weak chemistry).
    So, he has the guts to challenge you on your “I am very busy” statement. Would this make you like him any better?

  218.  #218Azure Blu on July 13, 2015 at 6:15 am

    Indigo and Victoria,
    Gee… I can see how much I struggle with letting
    NEW men talk to me/contact me everyday…
    Yes, all three of these men want to see me and talk A LOT!!
    Rori’s idea of at least 3 in rotation does not explain
    how to keep them all statisfied with the amount of contact they are wanting…
    I can see that Pilotcd is rather whiny…
    EVERY conversation he wants to talk about the “relationship”… we have had 3 dates in less that three weeks. We missed this week because I am dating others… and very busy at work…
    He did mention, ‘I imagine you are on a date this weekend… and that’s why we couldn’t meet.”
    Shoot… I did lie and say no,,,
    Friday night i was out with friends

    But Sat. I had a Wonderful date with a new guy
    who actually talks about relationships
    AND changing YOURSELF, and being a better listener…Talking about many of the Rori tools!!!
    He knows he’s made mistakes in the past
    and if we can learn to share our feelings
    with each other (him and me) before they get to be something
    horrible it would be Great for a good relationship…
    Alll of this and so much more!!! trips to Europe, backpacking in the Appalachians (I would LOVE that)
    It was wonderful, and romantic
    out on a patio at a nice restaurant!!
    He hinted loudly for me to stop dating others…
    I shared with him “this is only our first date”
    He said…”Your right…
    Let’s go on a second date and so on and hopefully
    this could be the rest of our lives.”
    I told him how masculine that felt and that I love enthusiasm!!!
    Sooo… i was feeling more chemistry with him than the other 2…
    Soooo that is a RED FLAG for me… If I feel chemistry
    (when looking at my past bf) it usually means,
    hot and cold, unavailable, all talk, no action…
    although he said he believes
    LOVE is a verb-it is an action word!

  219.  #219Victoria on July 13, 2015 at 6:47 am

    I am so happy for you!
    Your life sounds so exciting right now.
    I also think you should not be afraid of chemistry. The ideal man has to ve very hot, doesn’t he?
    Anyhow, this new man – he will show you his true colors with time. You are a rock star, this is the most important thing!
    I have been somewhat rock-starry myself – I spent the weekend with another CD, lets call him R.
    F. made no plans for us for this weekend, and so I was “poof”. He called, and and asked about my day, and I told him I was with friends. You know, I don’t even feel bad for lying. He should have made plans for us, I am not blaming him that he did not, I am just living my life lalalala. And, this other guy, I have less chemistry with him, but he is not bad either, and is a true gentleman, and is treating me just like I would like to be treated. And, I have a date with him for tomorrow, and a date with F. for wednesday. I am a woman in high demand! Yay!

  220.  #220Azure Blu on July 13, 2015 at 7:07 am


    Ahhh!!! this sounds lovely for you Also…
    I feel happy you are liking this new guy…

    I think I need to start saying “I am out with friends, or i’m busy that night…”
    I don’t need to “beat a dead horse”
    They all know I’m dating others…
    I don’t want to talk about it anymore… :-))

    Yes, i want to remember… This *IS* VERY exciting
    to have alll this Male attention…
    when just a few months ago I was
    sooooo disappointed at the lack of attention from Spirit…
    What could be Better? Summer time… lots of yummie men to go out with!!!
    “Summer time… and the livin’ is easy…
    catfish are jumpin’ and the cotton is high”
    “Your mama’s rich and your daddy’s good lookin’
    Sooo hush little baby— don’t you cry”

  221.  #221Femininewoman on July 13, 2015 at 7:51 am

    Azure I do believe guys understand “busy”. No explanation needed.

    Regarding chemistry, did you read the repost of Rori’s blog post that Zara did on the last thread? It was regarding chemistry.

  222.  #222Zara on July 13, 2015 at 3:27 pm


    It’s here on this same thread, post 188


  223.  #223Senior Lady Vibe on July 13, 2015 at 6:42 pm

    @FW @Azure Blu

    🙂 🙂


  224.  #224Tereana on July 13, 2015 at 7:37 pm

    Lovergirl (193) – ((((hugs!!!))))

  225.  #225Joy Jean on July 30, 2015 at 5:44 pm

    Hello to all of you lovely ladies and especially to my inspiration,Rori!
    I am deeply happy being here!

    I have a question for you about the kind of men we attract: I constantly attract feminine,not driven,or withdrawy men.
    Does this mean I am very masculine although I try not to be? I have big difficulty recognizing and managing my feelings,too.
    Could my ‘core’ be masculine??
    If that’s the case,can it change,or it will only keep me angry going against it?

    Thank you,ladies

  226.  #226Rori Raye on August 2, 2015 at 10:58 am

    Lot to answer here, and welcome! We all have masculine and feminine qualities… If you are A highly accomplished woman in the world… You may attract less driven, more feminine energy men in the way they interact with the world… Which is totally fine… !The question is: are they feminine energy with you in a romantic sense!? If that’s the case… Learning to shift your entire energy into the feminine realm will help you tremendously… Love Rori

  227.  #227Joy Jean on August 7, 2015 at 7:44 am

    Once again,I admire your brilliant way of thinking.I had NEVER thought it in this way.I used to believe ‘feminine man in one thing,feminine in all’.
    I am not sure I can tell if they are feminine in a romantic sense,because they disappear or try to use me VERY quickly!
    Thank you,Rori. I really feel welcome here!

  228.  #228Maggiemay on August 20, 2015 at 4:18 pm

    I am here with this man for these reasons-

    I had been single a very long time and was very lonely.

    We are intellectually compatible and being with a man who doesn’t read or think is boring to me.

    I had little money and scared of figuring out how to get more. He makes good money.

    I wanted a partner to build a life with to live in the country and be self sufficient and he did too.

    I ignored red flags that even though we had common interests and the same political and intellectual views, he does not treat me well or meet my emotional/physical need.

    He lied before we married and he lied afterwards. I believed all the excuses and the reasons for such lies,
    and refused to see that really, the man is simply a lier.

    But because of all my fears, being alone, getting old, last change to find a partner, and that we had things in common and me “mostly” treated we well that this was enough and ok and that maybe after marriage he would stop his lying and settle down and be a good man.

    I am here to learn that he isn’t a good man for me, that I do not trust him, I do not feel safe. I do not want to be with a man who punishes me by withholding sex. I am here because maybe this is what it finally took to internalize the truth of why I keep picking unavailable men, untrustworthy men. Men who keep me anxious and off balance. It doesn’t feel good any more. I want to leave. I feel like staying with this man is suffocating me.

    When he leaves to go somewhere I feel like a weight has been lifted off me. I feel free. I feel like I am here to realize that my feelings are more important than this man or any man. To see that fear is never a good reason to be with a man. To understand and learn that being with someone who does not love, respect and cherish you is worse than being alone and poor.

    These are hard lessons and I feel I have finally learned them.

    I saw an old boyfriend a couple days ago who I broke up with 6 years ago, no contact. I was curious so I had lunch with him.

    I know I am healing from my propensity to pick dangerous men because at the time we were dating, I am absolutely obsessed with him. He was very selfish, narcissistic and the relationship was either on his terms or not at all. I knocked myself for this guy, drove to his house, worshiped him, exhausted myself over functioning. Of course it ended after only 6 months, with all sorts of drama before the end.

    But it took me a year to get over him. So when I saw him I thought I might get all nervous and squishy and scared being in his presence. He had a very powerful control over me at the time. But I didn’t. In fact what I saw before me was a broken screwed up man, who had not changed one whit.

    I felt nothing. In fact I felt repulsed at the idea of being with him. We talked about old times and then he proceeded to bring up why we broke up and how it was all my fault. I sat there listening and feeling nothing. Not even pity. Just thinking, wow did I dodge a bullet. You see because even though he messed with my mind, and even though I was attached to him, and thought I would die after losing him, I did lose him and I did get away and I did protect my girl self by doing so. I was weak and stumbling, but I got away, sometimes crawling on my hands and knees metaphorically.

    As we left the cafe, I gave him and small hug and said “Well, thanks for the lunch, take care of yourself” and turned to walk away. He was saying, send me your email and if you are ever up this way again, let’s have lunch again, blah blah blah. Nope. Not on your life.

    I was truly free from any sort of drama, feeling, insecurity at all surrounding this man.

    That is how I know in my heart I have come a long way in 6 years. Yes I picked another guy and married him and he is also dangerous, doesn’t respect me and doesn’t meet my need. However he is miles above the man I was with 6 years ago.

    I feel that the man I am currently with showed up as the final (if there ever is such a thing) experience in my life for me to heal over all my past and all the asshats I invite in. After being with him for 3 years I can see how I have once again picked the wrong man for me, and yet I don’t feel the pain of this like I did before. I feel I am here because I wasn’t done yet with the process of learning how to meet my need and vote for me as Rori so often say. I will leave this man too.

    He will not change. But I have. I guess it took what it took in emotional beatings to wake up to who I am really am and what I really need and that I deserve to be with a man who makes me feel safe, loved, respected and cared for. Nothing less will do any more.

    That is the reason I am here. I cared about myself enough to put myself in another situation to wake me up. As weird as that sounds. But I had had a paradigm shift. The thought of being without this man isn’t troubling. I feel mostly nothing for him, just like I am standing on the sidelines of a parade. And noticing how it all looks pretty but it’s temporary and has no real substance at all. The floats are cardboard, the big plastic animals are fake and would burst with one pin prick.

    There he goes, waving at the crowd, phony as hell, getting his narcissistic shot of ego reinforcement and I don’t wave back. I look at all the pretty floats go by and all the other men on them. They all pass and I realize that I used to be up on that float with him, made of cardboard; and getting off was just a small little jump. I feel relieved. I feel like I was never the kind of woman who wanted to be in a parade at all. The sidelines are safer and you can see your feet and let them carry you to a much more real place.