Why Are You Still With Him?

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lightbulbHere’s a letter from Marla, that’s so universal I thought my quick answer would be helpful:

“Rori, Can you believe I’m still with the same man I’ve been with for three years? And it just never pans out to be the relationship I want.

I don’t feel capable of leaving him…I’ve cut off the relationship so many times only to go back to this guy. I don’t know what’s wrong with me! I’m so smart about other things!

Do you do private coaching?

I would really, really like to talk with you! Thanks, Marla”

My Answer:

In my experience, women stay with men they’re not happy with for a small handful of reasons – here are some basic ones:

1. Your subconscious, combined with the patterns of thinking and the beliefs you’ve been “trained” to hold for much of your life (and this is showing up in many ways in your mind, heart and body) doesn’t want you to be in a good love relationship.

Way too scary and dangerous  and unknown for it.

It much prefers what it knows – the familiar kind of relationship with pain.

It thinks it’s keeping you safe!

2. You haven’t found your feet Circular Dating – so you think there’s no other man out there for you.

3. You’re a nurturer, rescuer, tinkerer – and a wounded or guarded man is incredibly attractive to you.

This enables your subconscious to keep you safe by putting all the focus on the man and the relationship – instead of on YOU.

If you focused on YOU – you might upset the apple cart of your hidden patterns and throw your thinking mind into a frightened tizzy.

To answer your question about coaching:

There’s only one way to book a phone or Skype session with me – go to:


And – have you thought of trying Dominique? She’s a great coach… http://www.sexandheart.com

Love, Rori


  1.  #1Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 7:06 am

    women stay with men they’re not happy with for a small handful of reasons –

  2.  #2Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 7:09 am

    “If you focused on YOU – you might upset the apple cart of your hidden patterns and throw your thinking mind into a frightened tizzy.”

    I don’t mind throwing it in a tizzy.

  3.  #3Daria on June 27, 2013 at 8:20 am

    I do mind. That ish feels awful and scary just thinking about it.

    What now?

    last night i climbed on top of my cage and felt this blanket of vagueness and numbness come down over me

    I climbed back in my cage

  4.  #4Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 8:22 am


    Detachment is not about an absence of love. In fact, its the opposite. Its a radical acceptance of love in yourself and in everyone else–even those who you are having difficulties with.

    Regarding birthdays, and other holidays or important occasions–I can’t remember which book or materials I read it in, but I read a suggestion that women gently bring up these occasions in advance, sometimes more than once. Men forget because they are single focus.

  5.  #5Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 8:40 am

    From other thread:

    @Prplprsn: Two years is a long time. Here is my take on it – it could be radically different than other girls on here. First off……how long was it “good” between you? If is just recently gotten challenging thats one thing. Its a rough patch, etc.

  6.  #6Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 8:44 am

    I have a wounded man… I’m starting to realize this… he is like a turtle as soon as there is any sign of unrest he recedes and goes back in his shell… This below hit me hard… time to get back to work on myself…

    3. You’re a nurturer, rescuer, tinkerer – and a wounded or guarded man is incredibly attractive to you.

    This enables your subconscious to keep you safe by putting all the focus on the man and the relationship – instead of on YOU.

    If you focused on YOU – you might upset the apple cart of your hidden patterns and throw your thinking mind into a frightened tizzy.

    Thanks Rori! I needed to read that…

    So I need to be less of a nurturer… and was that thinker or tinkerer? What is a tinkerer?


  7.  #7Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 8:47 am


    Its interesting that you bring up co-dependency. Because the whole point of breaking the cycle of co-dependency is that you “accept the things you cannot change”. Those things you cannot change are the other person, or people, what they do or don’t do, say or don’t say. Feeling that someone is doing something to you is being in the grip of a co-dependent relationship. Your entire way of life, inside and out, revolves around another person.

    Having expectations is not unreasonable. What is unreasonable is being upset when another person does not live up to what *my* expectations are.

    Of course, we feel hurt, even victimized, when men don’t do what we want or behave how we’d like them to. And, this blog is a safe place to express that hurt and anguish to other women who are going through the same thing. But expressing “the soup” does not mean that we are actual victims, or at the mercy, of another persons actions or non-actions. It just means we are self-aware enough to recognize all the feelings inside of us and then we take the time and work to sort them out and express them, if necessary, but not make someone else responsible for our own stuff.

    And, I remind myself every. single. day. “Its NOT all about me”. My guy has his own soup (whether he is in touch with it or not), he has his own priorities, stresses, conflicts. He has a big life and I’m not privy to everything that is going on with him at all times.

    Things go much easier when I assume the best until proven otherwise.

  8.  #8Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 8:48 am

    I definitely no longer prefer that familiar feelng of pain.

    I stay away from it and move away as much as possible now. That feels awful, feels like pain, torture and hell.

    Being alone by myself actually now feels calmer, peacful and better than this.

    Just would feel good to be with and share my life with in a calmer happier more peacful way, One where someone hears me, doesn’t argue or tell me my feelings are wrong, or that I shouldn’t have them and they shouldn’t exist.
    They do exist.
    It makes me feel really unheard to be told my feelings don’t exist or are nor real. It used to make me feel like I didn’t exist then.

    This made me feel uncared for and about and deeply sad. I do not want to share my life or live with people like that anymore. It feels too painful.
    I don’t want that sort of pain any longer, so the only thing I am able to do is to move away from anyone who does this and not put myself in those painful situations.

    I feel sad i am not able to turn the clock back and get those years back that I have wasted spending time with people who did that to me.
    I Know I need to fogive myself for not knowing.
    At least I know now.
    Still not able to stay away completely though yet.

    Roris words come to mind step by step.
    One step futher away from the pain.
    Move away from unhappy moments and find something to do that makes me feel happy instead.

    I am not able to chose what other people do or say. I am able to chose to move away from them if I do not like it.

  9.  #9BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 8:48 am

    Elsie – given that you believe GS is doing something to you, and you are being victimized by what it is he is doing – like the post here is asking, why, on earth would you stay with a perpetrator?

  10.  #10Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 9:03 am

    I get what you are sayng Elsie about someone doing something to you or behaving in a way you do not like.
    And how a certain action or behavior has an effect on how you feel.

    This is difficult because we can’t expect other people to always do what we want and behave how we want to make us feel better. Especially if it goes against what they feel and want.

    For eg, I might be looking foreward to going out and have arranged to do so with someone else. They then might cancel, due to illness or something popping up. I might feel upset and disappointed. It is not up to them to take care of my feelings though, it is up to me.

  11.  #11BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 9:18 am

    and i don’t really want to say why
    i might anyway

    i feel so angry
    in my mind i see a woman standing in a bathtub
    insisting she is drowning
    and to my eyes, she’s just standing in a bathtub splashing a lot of water and making a lot of noise
    and I feel
    such a waste
    so many gifts
    so many squandered opportunities
    there are people in my city, in 3rd world countries,
    who really really need us
    to be strong
    to wake up
    to wake the f*ck up
    and stop pretending like we don’t have it so freaking good
    we have So Much Water
    So Much Food
    We are so educated
    we have most of the world’s resources at our disposal, at the turn of a knob, the click of a button
    and we
    stupidly sit and spin
    wasting wasting wasting our
    fabulous freaking creative energy
    over men who are
    Not That Special.
    I feel shaking and sorrow all through me
    I want to shake the woman
    wake the f*ck up, you aren’t drowning you are just making a lot of noise and splashing
    wake up
    the world needs you
    needs you
    needs you happy
    needs you following your BLISS
    not following rabbit trails of fear and unworthy men
    needs you in your POWER

    I feel deflated
    nothing to do but turn away and get on with my own bliss
    be in my own power
    I feel frustrated with my habit of getting hooked
    I don’t know if what I say is of any use or help at all
    am I being impatient
    impatient with myself?
    and I remember what it is I want
    it feels like ease
    it feels like grace
    it feels real, it feels true
    it feels like home
    it’s a practice, keep practicing
    every time I get back here the peace lasts longer and feels deeper and more expansive
    cultivating my center
    bathing in starlight
    feeling my heart beat
    feet on the floor
    breathing and soothing and
    remembering someone called me Queen today 🙂
    remembering D practically bowed to me today, showed so much respect, spoke to me in gentle and soft tones, expressed gratitude for such a small thing
    back to now
    back to now
    back to now

  12.  #12Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 9:22 am

    That is a good question Beloved.

    And it appears that the answers are in the above thread.
    For most I do now believe it is the first answer.
    It is what we have learned it feels familiar on a subconcious level like how love felt when we were children from our family, we are trying to heal our wounds through these new people. We keep choosing what is familiar ovr and over with different people, getting triggered by the same issues over and over. We hope for a different result.
    We will not ever get a different result, it is insanity to think we will. it is crazy.

    When we become consciously aware we can then move away from the type of people who feel familiar to us. Instead of towards them. Knowing that that familiar feeling is not good for us and choosing someone and something better.

  13.  #13Veronica on June 27, 2013 at 9:38 am

    Bumbling along with my baby shuffle. Had I not cut contact with BM I would not have been as aware of the nuances involved in inner work. He was just so shiny and beautiful and I was so oriented towards him – which is not bad if we were in a very committed relationship – but we’re not. I have noticed my sadness lingering and also my incredulity at this lingering sadness rising. Also, I posted on fb something that I was just so struck by and within minutes there was contact from two guys, one who wants to skype soon. And today another guy liked a photo that I took and that I really liked. These are very small things, I know, I’m taking it from the universe that yes I should just keep going with being and enjoying myself and perhaps not be too worried if sometimes that happens publicly. But that recognition/encouragement feels so good! Also all this contact happened when my self made this inner move to now be very aware of how I use my words. And Rori’s e-mails really help too: I was taking notes and realized that there so many things that I did wrong – I feel relieved to know. There’s still the vacuum – man is gone, empty space which triggers a lot in me, sometimes I feel like I go forward a bit and then relapse a bit, clean that up, sit with it, move a bit more forward.

  14.  #14seahorse on June 27, 2013 at 9:41 am

    Ohhhhh dear……………….. so much on here to dive into. Love and hugs and kisses on our angels. Bless us all

    Daria- I have empty bird cages in my home. I have all different species of birds all around. They sit on bookshelves on top book shelves in pics hanging from walls………….. my neighbor brought it to my attention. She said ,’ All your birds are free”…………… It still hits me in such a magical way. I started collecting bird cages about a year before I moved out of my married home. I took my bird cages with me:)

    Beloved- Thank you for putting up the ‘Halloween’ post. I LOVE HALLOWEEN! That was absolutely perfect timing. THANK YOU!

    FW- Tizzy and apple carts! Knock over
    that son of a gun apple cart and make apple sauce………… get down in that apple sauce and take a bath in it! Right?

    My Little Siren came home from vaca and did not have a ‘comfortable’ time………..she came home ‘off’. I welcomed her home and while unpacking I could feel and see her wound up so tight. So, I waited and sure enough it came out. So beautiful in her anger and pain. I told her how beautiful it was to see and hear and be witness to such feelings. Flabbergasted her for a moment and she came for hugs and kisses then, asked me to kiss her angel. So I pulled her sweaty hair from the back of neck and kissed her angel gently told it thank you for watching over her while she was gone. Little Siren does not want to go to her fathers anymore. So much poured out of her. I am feeling scared and I am feeling anger and I am feeling so freaking sad. For all involved I feel sad………………………….. I think waiting and perhaps telling him that she wants to take a break for awhile and not visit………………. I feel like anything I say isn’t going to matter……… he is going to blow and….wait………… What I think on grows. ……breathing………………………. I shall see this as going smooth………… clear skies and smooth sailing…………….. anger is just noisy energy………..

  15.  #15Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 9:44 am

    “All your birds are free”

    I absolutely love this….<3
    …and the image of bird cages all around that are open and the birds wherever they please….

  16.  #16seahorse on June 27, 2013 at 10:15 am

    Wildgeranium- Thanks! I even have a giant vulture sitting on the top shelf of a bookcase……………………… a mask of Michael the angel from Mexico, it’s his face and his wings…….. birds and wings everywhere……. and water pics. Ocean to be specific………pathways to the ocean…… Feels so good to come home:)

  17.  #17Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 10:17 am

    ok just venting here….


    so, I can’t know that is true… and I’ll do the work on it… but this type attitude is what Rori talks about conditioning from growing up.. society… that keeps us women ( me in particular) in relationships that don’t feel right/healthy…

    Part of me is screaming today…. totally angry that it is all about money! money! money! or in my case the lack of…. and his case too much attachment to ‘value” of things… he ask the jeweler yesterday when he picked up my ring and dropped off my bracelets… ( I had a gut feeling days before, when he kept asking me about my bracelets and to pick up my ring for me ) ask the jeweler if my bracelet was really ivory or just plastic…. OMG! how rude… none of his business… it was my mother’s I don’t give a #@$% what value it has to anyone else… it means something to me…

    Ok enough of the venting…. focusing on me and my child…. my mind will have to wait until later to deal with this….


  18.  #18prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 10:37 am

    Wildgeranium #4 – My birthday was brought up before he left for Florida. Nothing about any plans. Just briefly mentioned a couple times. I’m pretty sure he’s aware of it.

    Wildgeranium #7 – You said (Things go much easier when I assume the best until proven otherwise.) I need to do this. I am known for assuming the worst.

    Elsie #5 – We’ve had some previous “rough patches” but within the last 2-3 months or so he has really come forward and shown that he cares.

    I believe I just need so much work on myself yet. I’m still too afraid of a “let down”. My ex husband was very controlling and was always right. My opinions and ideas didn’t matter and were never important. My boyfriend of 10 months right before I met H used to do everything for me and was always there and told me at least once every single day that he loved me. We had even been discussing moving in with each other. Then all of a sudden one day out of the blue he comes to me and says this isn’t what he wants. My youngest daughter has ADHD and some behavioral issues and he had decided that he couldn’t handle her anymore. (By the way, my boyfriend had ADHD himself). You would think he would be understanding. And my daughter really isn’t that bad. His exact words to me were “your daughter is going to put me into an insane asylum”. Really?! So, obviously I was extremely hurt. After almost 2 yrs with H he seems to be good with her. My daughter loves him. Both of my daughters love him. So deep down I know he is an awesome guy and I think we are really good for each other. I just get scared I guess. I’m still a work in progress. Maybe part of what is going on with H right now is my vibe. I’m freaking out a little bit and he can sense that.Ugh! I don’t know. Should I reach out to him as FW and Mercedes have suggested?

  19.  #19BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 10:43 am

    zara ~ thank you for the onceafatgirl link – I’m seeing some things in myself in a whole new way, feeling some resistance dissolve, possibilities open up…feeling lighter…thank you!!! She is so articulate and transparent, she says so many things relate to but I don’t even think to say, I’m loving it!!

  20.  #20prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 10:50 am

    This is from the previous post. Don’t know if it was seen.

    @ Elsie – It will be 2 yrs in september. When I think about it I suppose it is possible I sent a bad vibe his way when I heard from him Monday night. Even tho we were texting and not talking. I was a little disappointed that he started the conversation by talking about the weather and not asking me how I was feeling (cuz of my current health issues). And he never did ask so I let the conversation drift off. I didn’t respond back.

    @ FW – I understand what your saying about noone has “done” anything to us. But that is so how it feels. Like they are being disrespectful to us. It’s hard to not feel that way.

  21.  #21Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 10:56 am

    ” My birthday was brought up before he left for Florida. Nothing about any plans. Just briefly mentioned a couple times. I’m pretty sure he’s aware of it.”

    I’m wondering if he isn’t available for your birthday but doesn’t want to say because he is afraid you’ll be upset?

  22.  #22BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 10:57 am

    Two men literally lined up to open the door for me – both of them made those bowing/sweeping gestures as I passed I felt all melty and regal, smiled, thanked them and felt like a queen, deserving and worthy.

    The tool I’ve been using the past couple of days is imagining that ticker tapes of light that say, “worthy”, “wanted”, “lovable”, “enough” run all through my DNA, and up down my spine.

    I’ve just…slightly…begun to allow myself to imagine the life I *truly* desire, not just the one I believe I should…feels scary…it’s kind of like the life of one of my friends who I used to think was soooo lazy, lol, and I feel judgy and nervous about “copying” her life…and…
    well, it’s still developing….

  23.  #23Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 11:01 am


    That is wonderful! <3

  24.  #24prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:05 am

    Wildgeranium #21 – It’s possible, but last year he purposely planned something before he left thinking that he may not be available on my actual birthday. Yet he did end up making it back in time to have the dinner with me and my family. So I’m not sure what’s up this year. And why hasn’t he contacted me to let me know he’s back?

  25.  #25sophie on June 27, 2013 at 11:08 am

    11. BELOVED – I love it x I love it for myself x I love it for all the women in the world x its a poem x it needs a copyright 🙂 I certainly want to save it for myself as a constant reminder if you’re ok with that 🙂 The world does needs us happy x and strong x and creative x and powerful x and not draining ourselves of energy over all the small things x I love it x

  26.  #26sophie on June 27, 2013 at 11:09 am

    I stay with men for all of those reasons…i’m working on it though…

  27.  #27prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:12 am

    Right now I’m not sure if I should keep leaning back and hope I hear from him soon or “assume” that he’s picked up a “bad” vibe from me and reach out to him. I know that Dominique has said that when you have been in an exclusive/committed relationship for the length of time that H and I have that it’s ok to reach out and lean a little forward now and then. Do as FW and Mercedes have said and just make it simple? “I miss you! Are you home yet?”

  28.  #28Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:22 am

    prplpsn28 If I were gonna reach out I would call not text. Unless you are okay with primarily encouraging him to communicate with you through text.

    I have seen another Siren who participates in the Love Forever class post some notes from the class. She indicated that Rori says the only time to lean forward with a man is when you are sure you have a committed man and you contact will be pleasantly welcome.

  29.  #29sophie on June 27, 2013 at 11:23 am

    doing the same thing and expecting the same results is considered insanity x i seem to fall into the same stuff/relationships/dynamics aka unavailable men but little by little by little i shift what i do, how i feel, what i know about myself…

    sometimes we just can’t see – my therapist said to me today ‘what is it you’re not seeing?’ and neither of us know the answer to that question…yet…all I feel able to do is keep inching forward and trying to do the different things

    I really want to think about whether I spend more time thinking about the men/relationships in my life than i do about me…they are definitely more important when MY sense of self or purpose is waning…

  30.  #30prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:23 am

    Part of me, and this may be wrong, but a part of me wants to wait and hear from him and see if he actually remembers my birthday on his own. If he doesn’t tho I know I am going to be SOOO upset and hurt and angry. And then it will be hard not to emit a really bad vibe to him.

  31.  #31prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:27 am

    FW 28 – I have gotten the feeling too from H by things that he’s said in the past that he may actually prefer and like it if I were to reach out to him now and then rather then him doing ALL the initiating. He may be hoping that I do now. Thoughts?

  32.  #32sophie on June 27, 2013 at 11:28 am

    @24 hey are you back? it’d feel really good to see you on my birthday if you are. what do you think?

    I dunno I just had it with a CD so its different but I felt much better for just reaching out…

  33.  #33prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:28 am

    What he’ll say to me is “where have ya been?” and “where’d ya go?” This leads me to believe that he would like me to reach out.

  34.  #34Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 11:30 am

    prplprsn: I believe this….if this man loves you and wants to be with you – a phone call or a text isnt going to drive him away. If he is already checked out of the relationship or whatever, this isnt going to change anything. If he is on the fence, well, frankly, you know the situation better than any of us. If you want to reach out to him, just do it. One text or phone call isnt going to make or break a relationship – and if it does it wasnt the one for you. Also, its not like you are badgering him. You havent talked to him in days.

    Just my opinion. 🙂

  35.  #35Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 11:31 am

    prplprsn: Whats more important? Spending time with him on your birthday? Or seeing if he remembers? (Thats a real question, not a hypothetical, I am really asking….)

  36.  #36Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:36 am

    RE 30 prplpsn28 this is totally over my head. Why are you demanding that somebody acknowledge the day you were born? What point are you trying to prove? Is it about keeping score?

  37.  #37Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:38 am

    Just this week my boss was telling me about getting a gift for his wife and didn’t get her a card. She totally focussed on the missing card and he ended up feeling like ripping up the gift and throwing it away.

  38.  #38Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:38 am

    Why are you so focussed on him celebrating your birthday?

    What did you do for his?

  39.  #39Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:39 am

    Is celebrating holidays and birthdays part of his core values? Have you ever asked him?

  40.  #40prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:42 am

    I see what your saying FW. No my intention is not to keep score.

    Elsie – I see exactly where your coming from too. I would in fact rather spend time with him.

  41.  #41prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:44 am

    FW – He does celebrate holidays and birthdays in his family. I have been to several holiday family get-togethers of his.

    I took him out for his birthday which was in December.

  42.  #42prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:45 am

    He has been to xmas gatherings with my family as well.

  43.  #43seahorse on June 27, 2013 at 11:47 am

    Beloved- ….heheheheheehe……………… I do and did that! I believe it now. It’s not even the belief it’s more…………. something. Only now, the men are noticing and coming up to talk and I get giddy and then i breathe and relax and keep my heart in my chest………………. hahahahahaha! ALL WANT SEAHORSE……………. and I think to myself… Well why in the world wouldn’t they??? I’m all that and a bag of chips!!!!!!!

  44.  #44prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:47 am

    FW #37 – H usually just gives me a card on my bday and xmas. I am perfectly ok with this. The thought and being with him and the dinner we had is what counts.

  45.  #45Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:48 am

    So he is not averse to celebrating. So he might have forgotten because he is swamped or this time he just doesn’t feel yet, like doing anything.

    Or he might be planning to surprise you.

  46.  #46Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 11:50 am

    Ok I”m so sorry but I 100% disagree with FW. 🙂

    Birthdays and anniversaries and holidays are important to some people and not others. If you are with someone, and they know that you enjoy celebrating things, then TYPICALLY if they care about you they will do something.

    Celebrating the day you were born isnt some weird out in left field thing. Its pretty normal. No one is saying you need a parade, just a dinner or whatever.

    I think that some sirens are overthinking this too much. I think its completely normal in society (ours) to celebrate – and ESPECIALLY if he has done this in the past for you.

    Prplprsn: If you want to spend time with him on your birthday, just text him and reach out. You have been dating two years, and he hasnt talked to you in over 3 days, and you don tknow where he is and your brithday is coming up.

    I would just text and be like……Hey, whats up? Where are you at?

    Spending 4 hours thinking of a three word text is what gets me in trouble. I do think we all overthink things sometimes. 🙂 Me especially. 🙂

  47.  #47Mercedes on June 27, 2013 at 11:51 am

    Elsie: From the last thread. I’m not the one who says nobody else can cause you pain. It is in my studies and I’ve living that today in my yoga. I don’t know if it is a belief of mine or not, it is something I am working with. I do a “Living Your Yoga” and meditation studies each day. Today, that is the work and I thought I would share with others here.

    Much Love,

  48.  #48prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:53 am

    Just being with H and knowing that he cares and wants to be there is enough for me. I don’t need the gifts.

  49.  #49Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 11:54 am

    RE 44 – I get the impression that it is more than that.

    Yet if quality time around these events are important I would let him know on a scale of 1-10 how important it is to me. Though I suspect that all this around the birthday is your unconscious attempt at avoiding dealing with your feelings of abandonment. As soon as he reaches out these feelings fall in the background until he pulls away again.

  50.  #50Mercedes on June 27, 2013 at 11:54 am

    My brain says “that’s not true. people can hurt you.” and the part of me that wants to change my perception and alter my way of thinking and open my mind and challenge my truths would like to experiment with this. So I am.

    Much Love,

  51.  #51prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 11:57 am

    Elsie 46 – That’s kinda how I feel. My family has always made birthdays important and special. And yes, I over think ALOT.

  52.  #52Dominique on June 27, 2013 at 12:00 pm

    Wildgeranium – 7 – YES, YES, YES!!! Beautifully said.


  53.  #53prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:03 pm

    FW – I do get what your saying. Cards, gifts would be nice. Who wouldn’t be happy to receive them? But honestly, I’m happy just being with him and it just helps in a way to know that he remembered and acknowledged it. Not a deal breaker if he doesn’t tho.

  54.  #54Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 12:04 pm

    prplpsn28 can’t you see how you would be putting pressure on him by holding him to your family’s standard without even discussing it with him to see if he is okay with it?

    He is not a mindreader is what keeps coming up for me

  55.  #55prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:06 pm

    I’ve just had some things going on lately too that have put me in hyper-sensitive mode. Trying hard to get out of it. I think I will reach out to him and see how he responds.

  56.  #56Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 12:06 pm

    “Not a deal breaker if he doesn’t tho.”

    If it is not a dealbreaker, then it tells me something else is going on with you that you are not saying. Otherwise it would be easy to move on from it and celebrate your birthday with whoever is in front of you.

  57.  #57sophie on June 27, 2013 at 12:11 pm

    veronica – i love how you explain your process i love that you saw signs of a shift in your vibe – shuffling 🙂 thats what i feel I do 🙂 but thats ok…that’s gentle…that’s progress

  58.  #58Dominique on June 27, 2013 at 12:12 pm

    Purple -27 – short and simple – I miss you.

    Maybe a smiley face after if this fits you and your personality.

    He may or may not respond. Can you be okay with however this unfolds?


  59.  #59prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    FW – re #55 There are things going on with me right now.

  60.  #60Dominique on June 27, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    Purple – 30 – Remember trust? Trust until proven otherwise? Assuming a negative is not serving you in any way at all. What ifs fall into having assumptions.


  61.  #61prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    Dominique – I love you! You always make me feel better no matter what you say. Honestly…I don’t feel like I’m in a good state right now and a non-response would probably hurt. But I do think I need to reach out cuz I feel I sent a bad vibe his way. I will just need to be ok and concentrate on my bday with my friends and family.

  62.  #62prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:22 pm

    Dominique 60 – I know! I know! I know! You have said this to me numerous times. What’s wrong with me?! I’m hyper-sensitive right now due to personal issues that have nothing to do with him. I so do not want to push him away yet I feel like I am. Ugh!

  63.  #63Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 12:25 pm

    RE 62 Nothing is wrong with you. You are sensitive. You want what you want,
    You are worth of yours desires.
    That is all okay.
    It is also okay to want to spend your special day with your special people who are dear to your heart.

  64.  #64prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    I am so thankful for everyone on here 🙂 I’m going to reach out to him. Short and simple. Then go about my day. Crying….let it out!

  65.  #65Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 12:44 pm

    Dominique – its so hard. I see prplprsn’s point of view. She is upset if she does nothing and he doesnt text. She is upset if she does text and he either answers in a light way or doesnt answer.

    So hard.

  66.  #66Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 12:49 pm

    #52- thank you Dominique! 🙂

    Prplpsn28. My style would be the I miss you with a smiley face text. But…. I would make myself swear that if I did not get a response that I would be ok with it and not go into a downward spiral over it.

    Another feeling coming up for me: you say he is at an event for his daughter (may or may not still be)…I lived with a man with a daughter for 7 years. I had to learn that if I put him in a position of having to choose between her or me– I was always second. so I tried to avoid these conflicts. And, it meant that my needs occasionally did not get met. I had to decide if that was OK for me. Sometimes it was ok, sometimes it wasn’t. But I also realized that putting him in that spot was hurtful to him. I hurt him. And it made him feel un-supported and like I didn’t have his back.

  67.  #67Erika Awakening on June 27, 2013 at 12:53 pm

    So listening to Rori’s videos, I’m seeing more and more the parallels between what Rori teaches and how I turned my business around. It was all about raising my standards and being clear about my boundaries. Not investing in people who didn’t invest in me. And using everything that triggered me to release the “stuff” that was in the way of success.

    This not investing in those who don’t invest in me was probably THE biggest thing that transformed everything. I had been giving everything away for free on my blogs, just like women give sex and attention away for free … and people were taking it for granted. When I first started asking for money, they responded the way a guy would when he’s been getting sex for free. Offended, angry, acting as if I was asking for way too much.

    Yet I stood my ground. And not only that I kept raising my rates. I lost some clients that way, who thought it had become too “expensive.” And new clients and customers always showed up because I just kept standing my ground. As I did this process day in and day out, the cash flow kept increasing and I felt so much happier because I was no longer over-functioning and giving and giving to those who weren’t giving back …

    Just like with men. Keep raising our standards and letting go of the men who don’t meet those standards.

    I’m seeing it’s really the same process. And seeing that feels very empowering.

  68.  #68Millie on June 27, 2013 at 1:06 pm

    @Beloved 11- I understand!!!

    @Lisa 17- I understand also!!

    I feel anger today too! I woke up annoyed with everything…the traffic, the fact that I live at home still, the fact that rent is so expensive, that my drive would be easier if I didn’t live there, that my mom is still mothering me at an age I don’t want to be mothered, how i have so many things I want to do this summer and wish there were men around who wanted to do them with me! Ugh! I hate when I feel that way because I step outside of myself and watch myself being a brat. My irritability just reins!

    I’m sad to hear, Zia, that the urge to chase hasn’t gone away!! I want it to go away!! This is my hurdle.. When I get the urge to text him, I ask myself Will I be ok with not hearing a response? NO. Do I even want to have a text conversation? NO. And I’m sure as hell not calling. I saw a picture of him on facebook- It looked like he had been dancing with his gf (dont know if she still is) and he was holding her hand and bowing to her. She looked like a queen. Beloved’s queenness triggered my memory of this photo. It was so beautiful. I wonder if part of my attraction is a fascination with other people’s relationships and other people’s story in general? I wonder if for me attraction is driven by curiosity rather than experiencing receiving?

  69.  #69Millie on June 27, 2013 at 1:08 pm

    I’m also feeling a bit angry and exhausted with all the energy I’ve been using thinking of this man, which is another form of chasing. I’m tired….what’s the point anyway?

  70.  #70BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 1:18 pm

    Lisa & Sophie thank you thank you 🙂 It feels so good to put something out there that is just….me…and raw…and to get positive feedback.
    Sophie – yes, please, by all means… if it inspires you, yes yes I love being an inspiration
    I think about this kind of stuff all of the time…how MUCH I really have, how much privilege I have being a middle-class (um…okay, maybe not quite middle-class..) white woman, how can I leverage that? What would a person with nothing see if they looked at my situation that I can’t see because I’m just used to it and take it for granted, and what can I create to make things better for those who are more vulnerable?

    In the morning I lie in bed and think of the feelings I want to create for the day…grace, ease, harmony, delight, surprise, love…I have a whole list.
    Then I say, “I don’t know how my day goes even better than I can imagine, I only know it does and I am fulfilled”.
    More and more…it’s working. It’s really really working.
    Today C unexpectedly came by and picked me and K up to go grab some ice cream, we were riding around and it all felt so…easy. So natural…
    I walked through a SWARM of hot, sweaty men all lined up for ice cream, I held myself like a queen, feeling soft and strong. I felt all contained in myself…”boundaries”…wow, I’m finally creating some good boundaries for myself and THAT is practically the cure for anxiety. I trust me. I will turn on my heel and walk out the door if my feelings start to get too strong, I am learning to have them serve me rather than control me.

    C and I sat around talking this morning, just chit-chatting, easy, natural – exactly what I was wanting to create with him, I didn’t want to feel all anxious and freaked out and scared and lusty and uncomfortable all of the time, I want to feel ease, comfort, to feel natural…and that is all happening. I’m not doing anything with him anymore that I feel bad or ashamed about and it feels soooo good.

    Oh, another fun thing, I was just thinking of steak, how much I looove steak, then my mom called and asked me if she and my dad could take me to a steak dinner.

  71.  #71sophie on June 27, 2013 at 1:22 pm

    68 – millie it sounds to me that the urge issss going away – the fact you know those questions and answers and then don’t act on compulsion suggests to me its going away = back in the day before I retrained myself I would have just text or I would have made a justification for texting then I really GOT that that wouldn’t give me what I wanted and I trained myself away from it and it wasn’t too hard just practice and focusing on what I wanted and remembering how horrible it felt when i didn’t get the responses i’d hoped for. Now its not very hard at all 🙂 in fact I don’t often think about it 🙂

  72.  #72BeLoved on June 27, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    Erika – 67

    “Yet I stood my ground. And not only that I kept raising my rates. I lost some clients that way, who thought it had become too “expensive.” And new clients and customers always showed up because I just kept standing my ground. As I did this process day in and day out, the cash flow kept increasing and I felt so much happier because I was no longer over-functioning and giving and giving to those who weren’t giving back …

    Just like with men. Keep raising our standards and letting go of the men who don’t meet those standards.

    I’m seeing it’s really the same process. And seeing that feels very empowering”

    I’m hearing you…yes yes…
    thank you thank you

    It was such a BIG thing for me, when T told me that he needed it to not matter to me if he called or not, to let it matter and not twist myself inside and out trying to find some way to make it not matter.
    It matters to me if a man initiates.
    It matters and I won’t pretend like it doesn’t, and won’t waste another breath trying to find some way to get a man to initiate who just doesn’t.

    It feels too bad to cling that like that, and it feels AMAZING to stay on my horse and turn to what calls my soul 🙂

  73.  #73Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 1:32 pm

    It rfrustrating to read other people write that others actions, inactions and words don’t have an effect on how we feel. We cannot control how other people chose to behave or the words that come out of their mouths

    Of course they have an effect on us. However as adults and not children they are not responsible for taking care of our feelings and pain we are.

    I want to use Roris example about the man who got irritated in a previous thread because his girlfriend spoke too quietly for him to hear and he felt frustrated and then angry.
    Of course she was the cause of this to say otherwise and deny it is to deny what was really going on for him. h
    It wasn’t his girlfreinds responsibilty to take care of his feelings and make him feel better, however she could hear him and come to a solution of texting, IM or emailing instead.

  74.  #74sophie on June 27, 2013 at 1:34 pm

    70 – yes you were my inspiration 🙂 My passion is with becoming the type of energy I would to see more of in the world – as you say grace, peace …and love of course. I can’t help and be healing to our world and community if I’m drained, angry, anxious and obsessing. its so easy for me to be all of those things but your words lifted me up (for now) reminding me again that there is a wider perspective even when we get caught up in our immediate environments (and our minds). Our energies do affect everything that happens during every day x when we smile at someone they smile at someone else and the chain goes on and on likewise a cross word can spread the crossness its nice to take some personal responsibility for that in order to grow more into the enrgy I want to be and see x

    I have a male friend in the health club I go to (he’s a very youthful 70 year old) I’m 35 – i’ve mentioned a CD I see to him. Today my friend gave me a really good massage of all the tension in my shoulders and said “look at me loosening you up for that man who’s gonna cause you all that stress that put it there in the frst place” ha ha ha. It felt good to receive just to receive. And his comment was insightful….mmmm what would it feel like to be with a man who didn’t cause me any stress 🙂

    not saying he’sdoing it to me !!! honestly!!! i take full responsibility for having him in my life 🙂

  75.  #75Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 1:35 pm

    And if she didn’t want to come to a resolution the only way for him to take care of this frustration would have been to state that he didn’t want to talk on the phone anymore as it annoying him.

  76.  #76prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 1:35 pm

    Wildgeranium 66 – Your right. I can’t expect a response or the response I want. All I can do is reach out and then let it go in whatever direction it does. It’s really hard tho. I love this man! I hope I haven’t pushed him away. As far as his daughters volleyball tournament in Florida, the tournament usually goes fri thru sun and then it’s done. Last year he did stay an extra couple days for a mini vacation. He was home by now. He has not filled me in on his exact plans this year so I really have no idea if he’s still there or home now. I do understand completely about his kids and the degree of involvement in their sporting events and I completely accept it. Even just the simple fact that he has kids and they will always come first. I totally get that. I have 2 kids too and they will always come first as well.

    Elsie 65 – Your absolutely right.

  77.  #77sophie on June 27, 2013 at 1:36 pm

    also on your steak point Beloved only yesterday I was talking about needing to do something about the stress in the shoulders and then voila my own personal massage in the health club 🙂

  78.  #78prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 1:38 pm

    There was another reason why I was iffy about reaching out to him and I went and drove my daughter over to her friends house and now I can’t remember. Ugh! I hate it when I do that. It was important too.

  79.  #79sophie on June 27, 2013 at 1:40 pm

    67 – Erika – very insightful – brilliantly explained – the hard part for me is steeling my gut whilst the falling away ones fall away – i think possibly I keep turning back at that point….curious

  80.  #80Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 1:57 pm

    prplpsn are you using medication that affects your memory?

  81.  #81Dominique on June 27, 2013 at 2:02 pm

    Purple – 62 – BREATHE my dear. It may not feel like it to you right now, yet I have seen shifts in you, significant ones. All of this stuff takes time to take root and flourish as your new norm.

    When he calls you, tell him exactly this – I’m feeling extra sensitive. (And I miss you.)

    Tell him why if he asks.


  82.  #82Erika Awakening on June 27, 2013 at 2:05 pm

    Hi Sophie,

    Yea that’s the hard part, huh? That’s where the faith comes in.

    I did the same thing Rori is demo-ing in these videos. When people would keep asking me for free without giving anything back, and meanwhile I was working my tail off at a full-time job while ALSO helping all these people who weren’t helping me … I started expressing the anger authentically.

    And a funny thing happened. My overall audience got smaller. A bunch of people “left the room.” Yet those who stayed stepped up to the plate and started paying my rates. Not only that they paid my rates and for the most part deeply appreciated what they were receiving from me. They committed, and by committing they started getting real results.

    This has been the secret for how I make so much money with such a small list. I know people who have 100,000 people on their list who make less money than I do. And it’s because they don’t have good boundaries and don’t know these secrets.

    Each time I had a business setback, it’s like a relationship setback. It feels horribly scary and tempting to go back to devaluing myself. So I take a huge deep breath, clear the fear that comes up with tapping, and start looking for the opportunity or message in the setback. Then usually comes a quantum leap. It requires a lot of faith and being centered in ourselves. NEVER dependent on any one external person or thing.

  83.  #83Erika Awakening on June 27, 2013 at 2:09 pm

    Now I just really need to apply this consistently with men. It’s the same process. Actually I am applying this. I’m in the faith part right now, where it feels scary and you keep standing your ground anyway 🙂

  84.  #84Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 3:20 pm

    Elsie I am at the point in the book where they clearly advocate cdating? Do you believe that is good advice? Do you susbcribe to that?

    I also see where they clearly say anxious should not date avoidants. Do you take issue with that? How have you allowed what you have learned to challenge what you do?

  85.  #85Heart on June 27, 2013 at 3:34 pm

    prp – can’t you just wait a few days? Gosh. Don’t do anything for 3 days…use this as an opportunity to explore you fears. It’s only 3 days and then you can write him.

  86.  #86Heart on June 27, 2013 at 3:41 pm

    I have that when I feel the strong desire to do something (with regards to a guy) that it’s best to do nothing and just feeland find way to make myself better….then come back to tthe issue a few days later….

  87.  #87prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 3:43 pm

    FW 80 – NO I’m not. Why would you ask that?

  88.  #88Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 3:48 pm

    #87. I think she might have asked because you mentioned several times that you were having health issues.

    I do that all the time– have light bulb moments and then completely forget them. Then ((bam)) they come back when I lest expect it. lol….

  89.  #89prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 3:48 pm

    Dominique 81 – I did text him. A simple “Hey. Miss you! Are you home yet?” His reply “Girls are wore out from volleyball so didn’t do great to finish up. So I hear it’s raining alot up there” He did not answer my question. I replied back asking him how many days the girls played and asked again if he was still there. No reply now. I’m sorry…but I’m going to get testy in a minute. Seems as tho he’s avoiding me. And I have no clue why. Things were good as of our text on Sunday. Don’t get it. Tired of it right now and sorry but my nasty voices are taking over.

  90.  #90prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 3:51 pm

    FW & Wildgeranium – My health issues pertain to my breathing and may be heart related. I haven’t been able to ride my bike which is a passion for me because of it. And it’s driving me crazy and worrying me.

  91.  #91Heart on June 27, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    Prp – the downward spiral begins…STOP NOW.

  92.  #92Heart on June 27, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    I feel grateful to Prp for showing me how we make ourselves feel bad by making up stories.

  93.  #93Wildgeranium on June 27, 2013 at 4:21 pm

    #89 to me this reads like you may be unconsciously picking a fight with him…. He may feel it too- men have spidey-sense for that stuff.

    You are stressed and picking a fight may actually be a way of getting some release. But, if you can recognize it then you can look for a better way to channel the stress and take care of the feelings.

    I had this with my guy every time he would leave for the drive back to his town (he lives in another state). Finally, one time he got upset and said ” stop trying to pick a fight with me!” Of course, my first reaction was… But, I’m not!! Then after a few minutes I was all…..crap! I am! Now I am aware of the pattern, I don’t have to do that. I was doing it because of my abandonment issues. Creating a self-fulfilling situation.

    Rori says: don’t ask the “innocent question”.

    You asked him once and he didn’t answer, but he said “up there”- is that his way of indicating he is still in FL?

    Some men are really awful at communicating by text. They just stop responding, forget to answer questions, don’t answer, get distracted and just leave you hanging. And none of it means anything bad necessarily. Remember they are not big hairy misbehaving women. They are men. Single focus. You have no idea what he was doing at the moment you texted.

    My own dad will just leave me hanging via text and it drives me berserk. It has zero to do with his caring for me–obviously. He is just bad at the rules– the rules that we women have determined are the courteous way to text.

    Men don’t have these problems with each other remember…..

  94.  #94Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 4:26 pm

    Prplpsn it kinda reminds me of something I experienced recently. Have you tried taking magnesium or asked your doctor about it.

    I found when I was walking especially up steps I was gasping for air. I thought it was my heart because I felt tightness in my chest. I got a slew of heart test and it turned out nothing ws wrong with my heart. He said to check a lung specialist but in the meantime I heart about how lack of magnesium can affect the body. I started taking magnesium and the symptoms went away. I am not saying it is the same with you because anxiety attacks and stress can affect the body in different ways too. All I am saying is some of this energy you are focussing on H could be used to heal yourself. Put your hand on your heart and chest and talk to them. Send healing to them.

  95.  #95Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 4:33 pm

    Prplpsn I find using text a bit avoidant so it seems he is reflecting the avoidance back. Aren’t you sensitive to inflexion in his tone of voice and what’s going on with him when you are on the phone? Also wouldn’t his voice soothe you and help you feel connected? It seems you want to connect but are avoiding it because of some fear or anger. What is your deep emotion?

  96.  #96Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 4:38 pm

    I wish I had this book b/c I don’t know if I’m anxious or not… and though “M” started out not being an avoidant… he seems to be now… but titters back and forth from wanting to talk to not wanting to talk…

    I assume this is the attachment book right?

    I’m still sitting with Rori’s last post with #3…

    lots of action on the posts… too much for me to keep up with… shew!

  97.  #97Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 4:40 pm

    I have someone who has now shown up a woman who keeps trying to initiate a friendship stating she is lonely. Who then proceds to tell me that she uses peoople. I hardly want to get involved there.
    So what is that about why has she shown up?
    My first mind does want to know.
    How did I feel? Well firs I felt curious and it felt nice to be asked for my company.
    Then after chatting a bit more and her keep giving me advice it felt a bit suffocating.
    And then her revealing how she was lonely and how she used people who were available and up for being used.
    I wanted to distance myself. I didn’t want to be used for my company just because she didn’t want to be alone and she thought i was lonely and available.
    It feels better to be by myself then to be in her company.

    So why did she show up?

  98.  #98prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 4:46 pm

    Wildgeranium 93 – I hear what you are saying and I appreciate it. It makes sense. Am really tired of the whole thing right now. Am walking away from my phone. Don’t want to talk/text to him.

    FW 94/95 – I will consider the magnesium. It was not mentioned by my doctor. And yes, stress and anxiety will bring those symptoms on. Doctor said so. Although I wasn’t this stressed and anxious when the symptoms started. H and I were actually in a very good place at the time and he was really coming forward and making me feel good. (about 2 mos ago). The texting has always been his preference. Seems to work better with his schedules. We do have very good conversations when we are together face to face. Tho he is not good at opening up about his feelings in regards to us. But…as Dominique keeps reminding me…actions speak louder then words. I’m not sure of his actions this week.

  99.  #99Syreena on June 27, 2013 at 4:47 pm

    Actually this has happened before where women have tried to friend me and I have followed what they want, been there for them in theit hours of need when asked been nice and kind. They then have only wanted me when they want something and when the tables were reversed were not available in my hour of need.
    So perhaps the lightbulb moment is for me not to go there this time and be alert and aware to the signs.

  100.  #100Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 5:33 pm


    I’ve been in the same boat with women for decades… wish I knew why… I finally just decided to step back and not be available for them but it hasn’t helped.. they would just disappear.

    I agree! beware of the signs…. at least that is what I try to do…


  101.  #101Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 5:41 pm


    I totally know that feeling too! 🙂

    today the feelings came to a head! and I just started to cry… I’m so exhausted… and have been for 25 years… I keep waiting for all my hard work.. work my butt off everyday, do the best I can, push myself, be as honest and loving, and authentic as I can… and I have nothing to show for it…

    It all came to me just sitting down and crying… I’m so tired.. sooooo tired….

    I felt free then and went on a nice slow walk with my daughter hugged a friend on the way… and watched my child be happy!

    Do I need a man NO! not tonight I don’t… my yard my house, my neighbors, my Child!!! and myself! it feeelsss sooo good! to NOT NEED a man… and if I can hold on to this feeling, it will be bliss! total bliss…

    I love being in Grace! Gratitude is amazing.. it really is total bliss..

    <3 OXOXO

  102.  #102Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 6:33 pm

    @FW – I did read the part in the book about anxious not dating avoidants. BUT….it says that those two are the most attracted to each other. Ironically, as I answered all the questions – I am clearly anxious, but GS is healthy and also part avoidant on only some things – not even a majority. But clearly on some things. I have a choice and he has a choice. He can skew normal on those with some work, or I can get more “normal” attachment and not care as much. As the book says, the more likely scenario will HAVE to be me getting more normal as avoidant parts are harder or less willing to morph. 🙂

    @Prplprsn – I”m GLAD you texted him. I think when he said that its still raining up there, he meant he was still down there in florida. Thats how I would have taken it. The fact that he didnt answer my question, would be an answer. I dont think you did anything wrong. I think that when he gets back, he will slowly come back to you – and its at THAT point that you have the conversation you need to have with him. Like Christian Carter says – happy people are patient people.

  103.  #103Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 6:37 pm

    @Lisa – I can feel your exhaustion – and empathize and sympathize. You sound amazing. And dont say you have nothing to show for it. You may not be in a relationship, but you have a daughter who is awesome, a home, and have overcome a lot to be where you are at dont forget that. 🙂

  104.  #104Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 6:45 pm

    Just an update on me.

    I got to my desk this morning after a meeting and the remote to the DVD player was on the desk. So sweet. He gave me a DVD player to match the TV he got me a few weeks ago if you guys remember.

    I called to say thank you, and then asked for him to come over and help me. He came right over, and we talked about some paperwork and I had some other personal/house type questions, and he was very helpful, and sweet.

    There wasnt any flirty coming from his side, but it was very nice. I dont know how to describe it. We ended up talking way too long LOL and then went to do our lunch thing.

    We had an awesome time at lunch. Nice.

    Then after lunch I did some work and then went over to his desk to talk to him about my workouts etc. This is a LONG story, but this man has been such a huge support for me. I have lost a LOT of weight in the last year and a half, and while this was all my hard work, he was in my corner being more than supportive. I tear up just thinking aobut how great he was. And please remember that this guy is HOT. But he was attracted to me when I was not a size 6….but rather a size 18 when I started. He has been my biggest supporter 🙂

    So – anyway – I want to make this summer really significant and I asked for his help with creating a plan for the workouts – long story – he is great at it. So we talked about doing Insanity together, etc.

    Anyway – it was a great conversation, totally laughing and everything. Then we walked out together and chatted. He asked for me to please text him tonight to remind him to bring something to work for me tomorrow so he doesnt forget.

    I am proud of myself for a few reasons. I didnt ask him to watch a show with me tonight (we watch at the same time even though we arent together.) I didnt lean forward and flirt. I sort of faked it till I made it. I felt like a “cool girl.” I was just laughing at lunch and having fun, and I think he really FELT that vibe.

    I have no idea where he is at. But at this point, I totaly believe Rori and CCarter – you cant talk someone into feeling something. So either he feels it for me or he doesnt. But talking about it isnt going to help anything right now.

    I will be easy breezy cover girl, as my friend and I say, and give off a good vibe and just enjoy our time together, and not lean forward. Then when (or if) we are together again, THEN i will bring it up when we are alone and its quiet, etc.

    I think if 2 or 3 weeks pass and he doesnt mention coming over, THEN I will talk to him about where I stand and what I need to do at that point.

    Anyway – sorry to make this so long. Sometimes I feel like this blog is sort of like a journal and it helps to get it out. Thanks.

  105.  #105Erika Awakening on June 27, 2013 at 6:53 pm


    Wow I feel excited about your weight loss. Congratulations

    For me, that feels like self-love and also feels like inviting lightness into our lives. I lost weight recently too and it feels amazing. The “few extra pounds” could never lose before because it didn’t feel safe. I was scared of being more attractive. I tapped that out. I feel more like a butterfly lightly landing on flowers and flitting to the next. I feel sexier.

    And reading your post, I feel inspired by that focus on you.

  106.  #106Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 7:00 pm

    @Erika – Thank you. 🙂 I worked really hard the last year and a half. I went from a size 18 to a size 6. 🙂 My goal is a size 4 maybe a size 2. 🙂 I cant believe I”m even writing that.

    And he has been such a HUGE supporter. For Christmas, he knew I dont have much money. He got me a gift certificate and we went to Lucy and Lululemon and he bought me a pair of yoga/running pants. They were almost $100 dollars. The best part was that he went WITH ME to the store and it was so fun. It was one of the best days ever. I cried in the fitting room, when I realized the pants were EXTRA SMALL. I cried. He was there for me. It was so sweet.

    He is a good man, and has been very good to me. He loves to sort of take care of me. But emotionally is avoidant in some areas, and I have to learn to live with that, or let him know what I truly need and see if he can step up in those areas.

    Anyway – thank you for the support on the weight loss. 🙂 it was a hard road, and I still have more to go!!!!!

  107.  #107Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 7:07 pm

    Lisa I got the book from the library

  108.  #108Zia on June 27, 2013 at 7:13 pm

    Just gonna throw in my 2cents: I LOVE my birthday. Its my favourite day of the year and I’d be really upset if the guy I’m in a relationship with didn’t spend it with me. But I wouldn’t expect him to just know that, I’d tell him that I want to spend my birthday with him 🙂

  109.  #109Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 7:19 pm

    @ Elsie

    Thanks! so much! your such a great friend… 🙂

    I do have alot to be thankful for… yes! and that is why I was feeling bliss…

    I was meaning income…

    But I’m spread so thin, I just can’t do all I need to do… like the movie Marley… where Jennifer Aniston was working at home and taking care of the kids and the dog… that’s me LOL!

    {{{Big Hugs!}}}

  110.  #110Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 7:27 pm

    @Lisa – I didnt see that movie – I heard it was a tearjerker….lol!!!!

    Yes, sometimes I feel so overwhelmed and stretched so thin. One of the reasons I really did fall in love with GS was because I feel like I could relax around him, and he would help me – it would be a team – he would take care of things.

    I guess I dont feel relaxed around him now emotionally. Man, I know if I needed help with anything (tires, doors, anything like htat) he would be totally all over it.

    I wish I felt he was there for me also emotionally LOL

    I do have a lot to be thankful for too…..:) Most of the best things in life arent about money. (But money helps a lot lol….!!!)

  111.  #111Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 7:30 pm


    Great! What book is it?



  112.  #112Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 7:34 pm


    Yes, the best things in life aren’t about money!!!

    Sad, though in this age… if you don’t may much or any… you are considered not dating material…. most all the dating coaches say it…

    I chose not to think like that… b/c I deserve to be loved just as much as anyone else… and it sure isn’t from lack of effort…


  113.  #113Elsie on June 27, 2013 at 7:53 pm

    @lisa – I’m not sure that is true. I think a man doesnt want a girl that is just there for HIS money. Which dating coaches say that?

  114.  #114Femininewoman on June 27, 2013 at 7:54 pm

    Attached by Amir Levine
    The New Science of Adult Attachment and How IT Can Help You Find and Keep Love

  115.  #115Lisa on June 27, 2013 at 8:08 pm

    @femininewoman Thanks I thought so, but wanted to make sure!

    @Elsie I mean me…

    Oh I don’t want a man for his money! No way… that makes me eeewww.. I don’t ask what “M” makes and I don’t want to know… I wanted to fall for him without any kind of hinderings.. you know… I would run from a man that is super wealthy anyways.. but I love him for him… don’t care… he could lose it all tomorrow, I’d be fine…

  116.  #116prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 9:32 pm

    H and I are communicating now. He is still in Florida and will miss my bday. It is what it is I guess. I have awesome family and friends that I will

  117.  #117prplpsn28 on June 27, 2013 at 9:34 pm

    be spending it with. At least we are talking now. (Sorry…it messed up and sent the first one before I was done…oops lol)

  118.  #118Erika Awakening on June 27, 2013 at 11:08 pm

    What if it could all be working itself out, even all the mistakes, what if the mistakes could actually be good?

    What if a wonderful miracle is right around the corner?

    What if the happy outcome is even better than we ever could have imagined?

    What if we didn’t mess anything up, and even when we broke all the “rules,” we played it all perfectly?

    What if we are powerful and perfect exactly the way we are?

    What if we could just bask in that?

    I feel happy. I slogged through every possible trigger for the past 7 years and I feel like I’ve come out into the light, and I feel happy for no reason at all 🙂

    Good night Sirens

  119.  #119Millie on June 27, 2013 at 11:30 pm

    118 Erika!!!!!
    I love love love this!
    so wrong…it’s right!

  120.  #120Xti on June 27, 2013 at 11:48 pm

    Suggestions needed!

    When a CD slows down on texting and it’s been 1-2 weeks or more since his last text, what’s a good reply when he sends one that says “you’ve been quiet” or “i havent heard from you”. I’ve got one CD that says I’m didnt answer his “last few texts” — when it was just 1 text that said “hi” on a Fri night when I was out. & I hadn’t heard from him since he dropped the text convo on Monday mid-way thru.
    I’m getting these more frequently and I’d love a sassy reply.
    So far I’ve said “oh I’ve been busy”
    I’ve also said “guess we’ve both been busy, huh?”

    I want to reply in a warm way, but not accept blame. And I don’t want to get into any finger pointing.

    Thank you!!

  121.  #121Heart on June 28, 2013 at 12:26 am

    xti – just ignore it….those people are jokers…

  122.  #122Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 1:32 am

    Xti I am in the same positiion, after 2 weeks of constant contact he fell off the face of the earth. The first day I decide to text Good morning hope the heat did not melt you. Why? I figured he had been so consistent and responsive to the FM it was okay to do so. Also I can’t say or do the wrong thing with the right person. I am not invested, I really don’t care. Still nothing after several days. He had mentioned several times about getting together this weekend, maybe that’s it or he is just busy. In any event it doesn’t matter. I won’t reach out again.

  123.  #123Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 1:35 am

    Xti maybe “I was thinking the same thing. I even wondered if you fell off the face of the earth”. I know, sarcastic.

  124.  #124Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 1:37 am

    Happy Birthday prplpsn28.

  125.  #125Veronica on June 28, 2013 at 1:42 am

    Xti – I would respond with “I don’t think I got your other texts” to the guy who only sent one text. That way I’m covered if there was some kind of glitch and lets him know that more effort needs to be forthcoming if he expects a conversation. Otherwise it doesn’t feel like to me good phone/contact etiquette on his part.

  126.  #126Veronica on June 28, 2013 at 1:48 am

    Sophie – 57 – aw thank you! Congratulations on your Masters! I’m trying to call myself out so that I don’t get stuck which I can see could possibly happen. If I don’t do the inner work nothing happens, and if BM were around, I’m afraid that I would just let him be a distraction. Progress feels quite fragile and tentative now.

  127.  #127Veronica on June 28, 2013 at 1:50 am

    Erika – 118 – I love those questions!

  128.  #128Veronica on June 28, 2013 at 1:56 am

    From the previous thread:

    Millie – 153- Oh thank you, your hug is much appreciated!

  129.  #129Veronica on June 28, 2013 at 2:01 am

    From the previous thread:

    Zara – 171 & 172 – My internet reception has not been that good and it takes forever to load the videos. I tried again just now and the youtube video said there was an error. Will try again another time.

  130.  #130Heart on June 28, 2013 at 2:09 am

    oh no ….I bought the wrong book…maybe…I bought Keys to the Kingdom..instead of Queen’s Code….
    I thought it was the same thing.

  131.  #131Heart on June 28, 2013 at 2:16 am

    oh well…I’m just going to tell myself the Universe wants me to read it…haha…

  132.  #132Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 3:32 am

    Amazing weight loss Elsie. Well done how did you it? What excercise and diet plan did you follow.

    Wanted to ask if you had any problems with lose skin?
    A couple of people I know lost a lot of weight but now have to have surgery for the lose skin. They both lost a lot of weight very quickly. Was yours slow or quick?

  133.  #133Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 3:35 am

    Ty for sharing Lisa. Yes I just hope maybe by no longer giving my time and energy and being drwan into realtionships like that with these women that something else will show up.

  134.  #134Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 3:43 am

    Erika I feel a little nervous writing this as I do not want to offend.

    You look hot in your new pic.
    I did feel shocked when I saw your new pic.
    This outward pic didn’t seem to portray how the real inner you shared in ed what you want re your sexuality. They didn’t match it was like it was two different people.

    I did feel confused and shocked by this.

  135.  #135Vi on June 28, 2013 at 4:19 am

    I am the Prize 🙂

  136.  #136Vi on June 28, 2013 at 4:22 am

    and.. I am the Air! i feel floaty…

  137.  #137Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 4:39 am

    Lisa I just read a post 339 from previous thread.

    Somethings that resonated with me. Was choosing passive agressive men and being emotionally beaten up.

    Also your man now thinking that leading means that he gets to get all his own way.

    To me it is the difference between a man being a leader and a dictator/tyrant.
    A leader takes a persons feelings wants and desires into consideration.
    A tyrant and dictator does not.
    We choose our leaders wisely
    Is he up to being a leader? can he give you what you want? Does he want to?
    Or does he want to dictate and tell you what to do all the time expecting you to blindly follow.

  138.  #138Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 4:41 am

    I feel like I cant hold this in anymore. I really want to say something to him. I just dont know what. part of me wants to say nothing, and just lean back, and let him eventually come to me. Part of me wants to just be like….dude, wtf? and part of me wants to just seriously have a talk where I tell him all my feelings.

    I feel like today is Friday and I just dont want to go the whole weekend without having this talk and telling him I really want to spend alone time with him, or at least talk at night, etc.

  139.  #139Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 4:47 am

    Elsie – 110 – Do you feel relaxed around yourself emotionally?


  140.  #140Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 5:07 am

    Elsie why are you putting your life on hold for this man?
    Why are you waiting around to see if he is available and wants to make plans at the last minute?
    Is that what you want?

  141.  #141Vi on June 28, 2013 at 5:30 am

    (((((Elsie))))) when I felt that way, nothing worked better for me than Paint yourself with love Tool… I remember doing it.. especially when I felt super obsessed and there was urgency in every cell of my being.. I don’t know… like 20, 30 times a day for almost a week I think… for the first couple of days I felt no relief but I just kept doing it, devotedly channeled my energy into doing it any time I noticed an obsessive thought or tension in my body that usually preceded the thought… a thought – I stop everything and go do this tool.. thought – tool, thought – tool… and then… one day my obsessive thoughts just stopped and I didn’t even noticed how it happened really… I just noticed that I needed the Tool less and less.. 🙂

  142.  #142prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 5:44 am

    FW – Thank You!

  143.  #143Syreena on June 28, 2013 at 5:54 am

    Something that feels goos to remember, if I want a quality man who is up for the job of leading and initiating a relationship he will initiate and pursue. I don’t need to initiate or pursue anything.

  144.  #144Lisa on June 28, 2013 at 6:09 am


    I’m wanting to find that out… my intuition tells me he is a leader… but is acting this way to protect himself…

    However, I don’t and won’t be in a imaginary relationship where I pretend that is what will happen. I’m sitting back, leaning way back to see what he does. I’m ready and willing to leave if he is a tyrant as you say.

    Your right on!!! about this… and I guess I’ll see if he can step up to the plate…

    He does give me what I want sometimes… and he does work around my needs sometimes… but he also has this side of him that just is “I’m making the decisions”… which is the side I don’t do well with…

    Thanks so much for your clarity… it is very helpful…


  145.  #145Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 6:25 am

    @Dominique – No. I dont feel relaxed. I feel anxious, tight, nervous.

    I know that due to circumstances on BOTH of our parts we werent able to get together alone for the last 3 weeks. Two out of those 3 weeks we saw each other almost every day at work. But it was just at work. The rest of the time either I couldnt make it (out of town) or he couldnt make it, etc.

    But the problem I have is that communication at night has dropped off, and the flirty vibe we used to engage in at work has also dropped off.

    Last Friday, there was some definite flirting and we were going to try to get together on Sat. if you all remember, but then he never texted me to say one way or another. I just let this go. I’m really really glad I let it go. I would have not handled it well.

    Ok- so just like the trip where I found out later he wasnt even GOING – lol……I’m so glad I had that conversation with him.

    Now, I feel like I need to say to him:

    Look, you said it yourself Im the only person in the world that gets you. But sometimes I dont get you 100% and I’m sure you have a good reason for everything you do (Queens Code) and I’m really trying to understand here. I trust everything you have said to me, and you have never lied to me, but I feel confused whether this is just our circumstances, or if you are needing your alone time like you need (which is fine) or if there is something else going on here. I feel like I get so close to you like three weeks ago, and then it feels like it gets unplugged when we dont get that alone time together even if its outside our ability to do so. It would feel really good to stay sort of plugged in with each other, and I miss you. What do you think?

    Ugh. I’ve come up with a million of these scripts, and I just cant figure out what to say to him.

    Dominique – I think I’ll answer one of your questions before you ask – 🙂 Yes, Its eating at me and I feel like I need to say something now after a week or else it will fester in me. 🙂 See? I already know what you are oging to ask. 🙂

  146.  #146Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 6:34 am

    @Prplprsn: Happy Birthday!!!! I’m glad you are communicating with him, even though he cant spend your birthday with you – what did he say about not being able to spend it with you?

    @Syreena – I worked HARD to lose weight. There is no secret. I ate between 800 and 1000 calories a day, and worked out at least 5 days a week….HARD. I lost 55 pounds, so far. It took about a year to do that if I’m being honest. I’m in a size 6, but want to lose 15-20 more so that I can be a size 2. 🙂 At the age of 41, I’m the healthiest physically I have ever been in my life. 🙂 I ran sprints yesterday and did close grip push ups. 🙂 Yah, I pretty much rock. LOL. Actually I have so much confidence because GS and I often work out together and he has been my biggest supporter, and he has been nothing short of amazing in that department. Its so much fun when we do get to work out together, which is every week. He pushes me in a fun way, and I push him back. He always says, “you can do this.” and I say….”no, I cant” but then I always prove him right and do it. I do about 100 push ups and then we do 200 squats and 100 tricep dips along with running and sprints. Man, I still cant do a pull up though. He is a guy so can do those easy….but I cant even do ONE!!!! lol. Thats my goal – to do ONE pull up in my life haha!!!

    Anyway – sorry to get on a tangent there, but its something Im SUPER proud of because I really did work hard.

    My weight loss secrets:

    1. Tons of protein – protein bars, protein shakes, yogurt, etc. because that keeps you full.

    2. No eating after 6pm. I have a deal now where I have to text him everything I eat after 6pm. I never text him anything LOL – because the sheer fear of having to text him removes my desire to eat after 6pm LOL!

    3. Tons of SLEEP. I dont know why but I feel better the next day, make great choices in food, have energy to work out, and I guess they say it helps metabolism. But the biggest thing is that you cant eat if you are sleeping, right? 🙂

    But here is my mantra….

    You want to know what I do on the days I dont want to work out?

    I work out.

    The end. I do it. I had to realize I had to stop waiting until I “felt” like working out – or it was a Monday, or it was the beginning of the month, or year. That it was some “perfect” time to start. I stopped being “perfect.” One mess up used to throw me off, set me back. But not anymore, I get right back on THAT horse, and keep going the next day.

    Its not willpower, as much as just a decision you make. For example, you HAVE to wake up and go to work in the morning. I HAVE to work out. The end. Its like eating or going to the bathroom. I just do it. I dont even think about whether I will like it or not.

    Sometimes I dont like it, but wow, the feeling of all my clothes being drenched with sweat when I put them back in my workout bag and jump in the shower, is the BEST feeling. That is literally my favorite part of the day. 🙂 Gross, I know right?

    Anyway – sorry to make that so long, but I’m really proud of myself because it took me decades to finally do it – I was always overweight. 🙂

  147.  #147ruth on June 28, 2013 at 6:41 am


    I totally get that
    I have run every single day for over seven years on the trot
    Removing the option to say no is very liberating

    And well done on your amazing achievements

  148.  #148Lisa on June 28, 2013 at 7:01 am

    @Prplprsn Happy Happy Birthday!!! <3

    I hope it will be an amazing year for you!

  149.  #149Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 7:02 am

    #130. Keys to the Kingdom is fabulous as well, my guy even read that one…lol

  150.  #150Heart on June 28, 2013 at 7:07 am

    Omg Keys to the Kingdom is an awesome book.

  151.  #151Heart on June 28, 2013 at 7:08 am

    I feel happy and loving towards men.

  152.  #152Heart on June 28, 2013 at 7:09 am

    ok maybe awesome is an overstatement….the story is a bit tedious but the insight of Keys to the kingdom is wonderful

  153.  #153Mercedes on June 28, 2013 at 7:11 am

    I am hesitant to post something like this again but I think someone might resonate so I am sharing. Again, these are not my words, they are part of my work. I am living my yoga today.

    Suffering comes from our unwillingness to be present.

    Today notice five recurring thoughts that take you away from your life as it is. Write them down. When you have a chance, burn the paper lovingly, and let those thoughts drift away with the smoke.

    Much Love,

  154.  #154ruth on June 28, 2013 at 7:12 am

    I thought Queens Code was excellent for its ideas but appallingly written

    Happy Birthday Purple

  155.  #155ruth on June 28, 2013 at 7:14 am

    Thought provoking

  156.  #156Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 7:21 am

    I feel proud of you too Elsie 🙂

    One mistake I made during my years of hard work out was not pay attention to changing my sneakers regularly. I ran, jogged, used the treadmill, stairclimber, and treadclimber. I am paying for that now with heel spurs and some other stuff.

    Does your protein bars and yogurt have sugar or high fructose corn syrup? As time go on I would keep an eye on how those affect the body.

  157.  #157ruth on June 28, 2013 at 7:22 am


    Good point FW

    I religiously change my running shoes every 500 miles

  158.  #158Lisa on June 28, 2013 at 7:23 am


    I agree I think it is poorly written

    and I haven’t even gotten to the good stuff yet… I really just wanted the meat of the tools… not a story book…too time consuming to read through it… I might have to just skip to the good stuff…


  159.  #159ruth on June 28, 2013 at 7:25 am

    Lisa yes, I got really frustrated
    We could have just done with Karens summaries

    Kimberlee annoyed the **** out of me, sorry, but she did

  160.  #160Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 7:32 am

    Elsie- I am absolutely struck by your determination, willpower, resolve and follow through in regards to your weight loss and exercise. It’s inspiring. I feel like I need to get out there and exercise and stop making excuses. I’ve always had a good diet, I just have an enormous appetite…lol
    About 8 years ago I went from size 14 to a size 2. My friends and family actually thought I didn’t look good at size 2– it was also unsustainable for me. I’m a 8/10 now but I have high blood pressure –and my doc wants me to lose 20-30 lbs. I know I can do it, I’m just resisting starting. Thank you for reminding me that I just need to start!


  161.  #161Heart on June 28, 2013 at 7:35 am

    Bloggies – I’m finding it hard to converse with ppl in real life about relationships & stuff….the entire way they view things are So Different from mine Now…that I’ve been on this road..
    They seem like from another planet and I feel brought down a little…
    I don’t know how to relate …people seem eager to convince me to settle & find a man & not believe in Fairy Tales…

    Do any of you experience this?

    I feel toxic energy coming at me sometimes and I feel judgemntal and guilty for thinking of good friends that way…

  162.  #162Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 7:37 am

    The writing in her books is atrocious…..I was annoyed at the lack of summaries. I spent a long time combing through all her materials and distiling out the concepts for myself. She wants you to take her workshops- so I think her written materials leave you wanting a little on purpose.

  163.  #163Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 7:46 am

    @Mercedes – Dont feel hesitant! I love when you post! 🙂 I am in the present right now. I dont like it LOL!!! I want to be in the past when things were gushy and lovey and wonderful haha!!!!

    @Ruth – LOVED queens code – but yes, horribly written LOL Totally cheesy. And I might need new running shoes – I have REALLY good ones, but I have not run 500 on them yet.

    @FW – I’m not sure about the high fructose corn syrup. I am convinced that causes diabetes though. My dad can eat whatever sugar he wants when he goes overseas, but when he comes back his blood sugar skyrockets.

    @Wildgeranium: Thank you! That makes me feel strong and helpful to you! I am so strong in that area of my life now – if I could be just as strong emotionally. I guess I need to work those emotional muscles too huh?

    @ Heart – Yes, I feel that way. Some of my friends were like – well, he isnt there for you – F him. Ugh. I dont talk to them about it anymore because I feel defensive like i Have to defend my beliefs about Rori etc. Its exhausting.

    OK – so back to my situation. I just saw him for a few minutes and chatted with him and a friend. I dont know – I dont know if I should say something to him or not. Ugh. Help. 🙂

  164.  #164Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 7:59 am

    Look, you said – comes across as criticizing. Also like you are trying to ACT tough. It also keep reminding me of an email from Rori where she talks about something similar and suggests that it is the most disrespectful as it is an attack DRESSED UP as if it is not. Why you would want to tell him you don’t get him is really questionable in my mind. Why would a man want to be with a woman who doesn’t get him? Even if there are doubts in his mind why would you want to reinforce them? It seems this is your “deactivating strategy” even though you claim you are craving closeness.

    Elsie I get the sense you are trying to script a powerspeech but you are criticizing and giving him directions. You are not stating what you need and frankly the speech comes across a bit AVOIDANT.

    You are not saying “I don’t want to be in a situation where my feelings are getting hurt. What do you think?”

    You are not saying “I am feeling weird and I am feeling bad. I was feeling so close to you 3 weeks ago when your energy was coming towards me. I am the kinda girl who needs quality time in a romantic relationship where my partners energy is coming towards me so we can feel an overwhelming intoxicating desire to be with each other. I feel an intense desire to be with you and I feel disappointed when that doesn’t happen. Can you help me with this?”

  165.  #165Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 8:01 am

    Elsie I ask about the HFCS because it is most yogurt with fruit on the bottom. It is one thing I have seen recommended to eliminate from your diet when you have reached a point and your weight doesn’t seem to be changing even though you are doing everything great. I might make a difference for the last few pounds

  166.  #166Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 8:06 am

    Elsie– I just wanted to thank you also for sharing all of your ups and down here so honestly.

    I want to share some honest observations with you. If that is not ok– don’t read further.

    It sounds like- at this point in time- what you have is a friendship. That isn’t necessarily bad, and in some respects (he still lives with another woman & you aren’t quite finally divorced) it may be a good thing.

    In the present moment the relationship feels “imaginary”. In the present moment.

    I think you could change that by simply changing the amount of mental energy you are devoting to him.

    The weekend is a tough place to be for you right now. If it were me, and it has been me many times, I would make plans for every single moment- especially Sunday night ( for me anyway) to take your focus off of him.

    Remember the relationship bubble? or the energy exchange? The immense amount of mental energy you are devoting to GS is consuming the entire relationship energy budget.

    Stop making excuses for him too!! The entire day you described– all of it at work– made me furious. He gets your adoration for doing absolutely nothing. Nothing!!!

    You need to quit him like you’d quit smoking or drinking.

    And steer clear of him at work. If you were an alcoholic you’d avoid the liquor aisle at the market.

    He is not available for a real relationship.

  167.  #167BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 8:09 am

    Elsie I’m feeling inspired by your posts today, just so what I’m needing to hear!

    I lost about 90lbs., size 26 to size 8. Iliked it there and didn’t want to be any thinner, I have curvacious bodacious hips and like them that way 🙂 I was totally rocking it in the gym – I could free squat 235#, leg press 500#, bench press around 130#. I would do close grip pushups on a medicine ball and a 15# plate on my back – I had a sadistic trainer (I loved it). P90X was a little too easy for me…especially on the legs 😀
    I was also a Bikram yoga hottie – ohhhh and I sooo feel you on the deliciousness of a drenched, sweaty outfit..I LOVED the feel of being totally soaked after a Bikram class. So. Good.

    People would literally stop me in public when I wore short to admire my thighs. I would lie in bed and stroke and stroke and stroke my abs.

    All of which would trigger T. If I was enjoying my body, he would be triggered and grasping and accuse me of withholding something from him…he wanted the attention I put on me, put on HIM. When I would be totally into my biceps and WOW my back was soooo cut and amazing, his eyes would glaze over. 90 lbs. gone over 4 years of us being together and not one single compliment.
    I feel aching sorrow in my belly remembering that, how lonely I felt.

    The pain of so much change in my life overwhelmed me and I gained it all back. So many times, I have felt so grateful that I gave myself such an awesome foundation to fall apart on, lol.

    So I’ve learned a lot about how it all fell apart, and how I want to put it back together again.
    I want to get back to that again…only, I don’t want friends and partners who tolerate what I want, I want to be aligned with people who support, encourage and HONOR the good things I do for myself.

    I talked to T a few days ago, and felt like…ewww..
    He’s doing the Same Exact Pattern I’ve seen him do for decades, with another woman. Meets vulnerable, directionless woman, sees business opportunity, tries to meld business/romantic relationship. There’s something sort of gross about it, like he goes around unconsciously impregnating women who are unconsciously opening their creative wombs to him.
    Not what I want.

    This morning I finally could feel the pain of feeling dismissed by M a few years ago. I wanted to see him, and he told me, “Not in October”.
    I swallowed the pain in that moment, and acted nice and understanding. Until I blew up at him a few weeks later, lol.
    It feels good to feel strong enough that the pain didn’t overwhelm me and send me spinning. It feels good knowing I am resilient, I can handle the feelings, welcome them and let them pass.

    Okay spiraling back to the focus on me…
    I even wrote a long post myself a long time ago, about how the calories, the excercise, all of it is forever. It’s not just until….when I start telling myself “I don’t need to do that” is when I probably MOST need to. I just needed to find a way that felt healthy and not obsessive. I feel like I’m finding that way…where it’s a gift for me and the controlling feels like healthy discipline and not making the fat me “wrong”.

    I lost all that weight, but was still thinking like the old, shameful fat girl me, who had to make the best of what I had and didn’t have options and if a man gave me his attention I better hang on to it for dear life because I don’t know when that might come around again.

    Now I’m at about 215#, and I feel totally sexy. I receive and can handle male attention better than ever, I can say I can’t handle something if I can’t, I feel stronger on the inside. I can totally see myself being thrown for a loop and I know I can recover. I know more and more I can recognize and say no to what doesn’t serve me.

    I feel worthy. Good enough.
    Last night I dreamed I had the Midas Touch.
    I washed my hands and the soap turned into a shower of gold glitter.
    Yes yes yes goodgoodgood yumyumyum.
    happy thank you yes yes

  168.  #168Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 8:11 am

    Hi Sirens

    I’m checking in – I’ve been having a lovely time, but honestly I feel a little lonely so I thought I’d check in with all of you.

    This country is so beautiful and amazing, and I am enjoying everything around me and everything I am seeing and experiencing. I am so blessed. Yet it is also a trigger-fest. Being away from home, away from the familiar, and particularly… away from ‘my’ people. The afternoons are the hardest in this respect. I am really glad I am doing this though, having only myself to rely on, sitting with uncomfortable feelings as they come up, being ok, and healing.

    Love to all of you

  169.  #169sophie on June 28, 2013 at 8:20 am

    hi indigo! i’d love to know where you are?

    i am loving this talk about exercising too – i feel inspired i’d love to pour alllll my energy into me and away from men for a while

  170.  #170Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 8:22 am

    Where are you vacationing Indigo?

    How can you get intouch with nature?

  171.  #171sophie on June 28, 2013 at 8:22 am

    166 Remember the relationship bubble? or the energy exchange? The immense amount of mental energy you are devoting to GS is consuming the entire relationship energy budget.

    mmmm i worry that I do this with my one main CD – its not leaving any space for the relationship I actually want…

  172.  #172sophie on June 28, 2013 at 8:24 am

    thanks veronica 🙂 !!!! it feels nice to be congratulated 🙂

  173.  #173ruth on June 28, 2013 at 8:29 am

    Oh yes yes YES!
    You can be sexy at any size
    Funnily enough, it was whan i stopped hating my body(so much) that the weight came off
    Ddidnt have to try *that* hard

    Re Queens code, i went back to try and find the five words,and GAH it took me far too long and i had to read the flipping sex chapter again;)

    I *really* didnt want to do that

  174.  #174Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 8:31 am

    “I will be easy breezy cover girl, as my friend and I say, and give off a good vibe and just enjoy our time together, and not lean forward. Then when (or if) we are together again, THEN i will bring it up when we are alone and its quiet, etc.”

    This was my face/palm moment….. So, if he finally steps up and you get alone time you are going to hit him with “the talk”?!?! NO please don’t. Men don’t want to have “the talk”. EVER.

    If he feels that the reward for stepping up is just emotional neediness and relationship talk there is nothing that will have him fleeing for the hills faster.

  175.  #175BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 8:39 am

    aww, thanks ruth!
    I feel envious that you are a runner!
    Running used to be SO difficult for me! My hips are wide, my feet are flat…I feel so much better with strength and flexibility. Agility was my weak spot.
    I feel so much comfortable with strength training and yoga 🙂
    I’m painting and bathing myself with love every day, every little ache, pain, everything that captures my attention somehow, I bathe in love.
    Now I want to go practice looking in the mirror and smiling at myself all sexy-like.
    I can do this.

  176.  #176BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 8:42 am

    and wow, it feels so good to let T drop off.
    The quality of that connection was so inconsistent, it felt like some dead weight dropped off.

    Oh, and my mother came in this morning asking how I was doing with money, she wanted to give me some.
    I told her I was doing good…
    if she asks again I think I will just tell her exactly how much money I have and let her decide if she wants to give me some anyway.

    Next on my personal self-care list – getting a dental appointment and caring for my teeth. Then it will be time for my annual well-woman exam.

    All for me me me me I love meee!!!!

  177.  #177prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 8:44 am

    Thank you for the birthday wishes! I will be going out to dinner with my family to my favorite place…Olive Garden. They have the best Moscato White Wine. Yummy!

    Elsie #146 – He didn’t really say too much about missing it. I didn’t bring up my birthday with him last night. He did wish me a happy birthday this morning tho 🙂
    Amazing to hear about your weight loss. Great job! When I got divorced (5 yrs ago) I lost 50 lbs. and got down to a size 6. It was from stress tho and I wasn’t eating. Not a good way to lose. Over the yrs I have gained back a little but I have managed to maintain my 6. Tho I would like to lose a few pounds around my middle. That seems to be the one place I gain when I do. If it wasn’t for the breathing issues I’m having at the moment I would be riding my bike every day. My goal for this season was to reach 50 miles. Last year I did 40. It makes me very sad that I can’t ride. But it’s scary when you can’t catch your breath. It sounds like your doing great! Awesome!

  178.  #178BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Elsie – something similar to the mirror exercise really helped me feel connected to myself.
    Everything I felt such a burning desire to say to M, or to T, or to C or anyone, really…I wrote in long, heartfelt emails. Then sent them to myself.

    So, I would say, write your speeches all day long, and then say them to yourself. It’s what you need to hear.
    Once you grok that, really grok it, that the “i need more time/attention/phone calls/texts/advance notice” are really for YOU to know about yourself, that FM’s are not about making him feel more like a man but for you to get to know and see what is going on with YOU better, a million little sparks will go off and you will feel so much more certain about what you need, want, deserve, and what actions to take.


  179.  #179Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 8:52 am


    “3. Put imaginary plants around your mental and emotional self

    Plants that will give you shade for your thoughts and feelings. Plants that will nurture and feed you… And most of all – plants that will invite a man to sit in the shade with you and share your bounty.

    4. Don’t ask him to “stick”

    Don’t be afraid of him going. The most attractive woman in the world is one who’s not holding on, acting like glue. The prize here is YOU – not him!

    Remember – if you’re flypaper, you’re stuck to a man, too! That means you’re stuck with the ones who aren’t filling up your needs and your heart!”

  180.  #180prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 8:55 am

    Heart 161 – I can relate. I have a couple of friends (a married couple) who drive me absolutely nuts sometimes. If they sense the slightest thing that “they” feel H hasn’t stepped up about in “their eyes” they start in with the “you should just leave him”, “you can do better”, etc. etc. etc. I feel like they just don’t understand. So now I just don’t bring relationship stuff up with them.

  181.  #181Heart on June 28, 2013 at 9:03 am

    I feel really excited about being in a relationship.

    I feel happy I am taking the time to grow, learn and practice…

    I believe Rori’s tools helps you to change your behavior…
    Just learning about things in theory doesn’t really helped..
    I feel psyched and ready to start practicing.

    I have problems listening…
    I want to practice listening..

  182.  #182Heart on June 28, 2013 at 9:04 am

    Do nothing…

    when you’re feeling emotional.
    Do nothing..

  183.  #183Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 9:07 am

    I feel like they just don’t understand – they do.

    They understand your pain. They understand your frustration. They see and feel your suffering. They want the best for you. ““you can do better” is the best way they know how to express their desire for your happily ever after to you.

    It might also be the best way they know how to help you become aware of your story. Maybe it is the only way they can encourage you to rewrite your story. To change your perspective. The way they know how to say to you “listen to yourself”.

    We run down our men with the energy of our words. Many times without even realizing what we are doing. How we are contributing to the situation. They can only see what we show them. Maybe they are saying “this is what we are hearing and the picture you are painting. Is that what you want us to see/hear?”

  184.  #184Lisa on June 28, 2013 at 9:09 am


    that script was amazing… i’m copying it…

    very powerful, vulnerable and to the point…

    I love it!


  185.  #185Mercedes on June 28, 2013 at 9:15 am

    Happy birthday prplpsn28!!!! 🙂 Have an amazing day (and extend it into the weekend and beyond)!!!!

    Elsie: Thank you. I’m not hesitant to post here, I’m hesitant to post my journey (Living my Yoga as well as my meditation journey) because the words are attributed to me when really, they are lessons from my teacher that I choose to follow and experiment with. I think sometimes those “out of the box” thoughts are attributed to ME when actually, I’m just sharing the process in case anyone can relate.

    Yesterday, I read “Mercedes says nobody can hurt you.” and that was soooo not true. My comment was a living my yoga lesson. Today, the lesson is about suffering again and about our role in that. I don’t want my learning journey to be attributed to my teaching so, I hesitate sometimes to share the steps I am taking in my own growth. Sometimes here, it is best for me to focus on what I HAVE learned vs what I am currently learning….especially if what I am currently learning is against the norm or is a controversial topic overall.

    Much Love,

  186.  #186Heart on June 28, 2013 at 9:18 am

    prp – well I’m coming from a different place & getting the Opposite advice…
    Mostly that I’m crazy for thinking I can have a great relationship…friends tell me I’m too picky etc etc

  187.  #187Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 9:35 am

    “Why Men Don’t Call: Reason #1
    Some men are too immature to be honest and straightforward with a woman.

    Sometimes men are just giving themselves ego strokes by flirting with you, even though they never really thought they’d call.

    But they get your number anyway to feel good and to have it “just in case” they get some random urge or reason to call you in the future.

    Plus, getting a woman’s number is a kind of “trophy” to show to other immature men.

    Why Men Don’t Call: Reason #2
    They were just looking for a hook-up, and you weren’t “fling” material (which is a good thing – unless that’s all you’re looking for).

    Oftentimes, men think they just want a woman to be “physical” with.

    If you’re out at a club or a bar and you meet a man, often he’ll have “hooking up” on his mind.

    If you meet a guy like this and, in his eyes, you’re the girl he’d bring home to mom, then you might not be the girl he’ll want to spend his time with… at least for the near future.

    But in spite of this, he takes your number, in case he gets the crazy foreign idea in his head that he’d actually want a great girl for a real relationship.

    And guess what? He doesn’t come to that realization for a very long time – so he doesn’t call.

    I’m not saying it makes sense, but that’s how some men operate.

    And in a strange way, men who do this are doing you a favor at that time in their life. The timing just wasn’t right.

    Why Men Don’t Call: Reason #3
    They thought they were being “polite” by getting your number, even though they never felt like calling.

    Have you ever given your number to a man who asked for it, but meanwhile you were already dreading his call and wishing inside that you had given him a fake number?


    And I know it sucks to think about this, but have you ever thought that the tables could be turned?

    See… if men enjoy their conversations with you but aren’t that interested, they sometimes feel a polite “obligation” to get your number. It’s a way to end the interaction on a positive note… even though they never really intended to call you.

    I know it stinks, but men aren’t often up front and assertive when it comes to the opposite sex.”


  188.  #188Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 9:37 am

    sophie & Feminine Woman

    I am holidaying in Ireland.

    Feminine Woman, thank you for the suggestion, and I believe I will enjoy the countryside when I get there.

    To be honest though, I am jusy missing my people, and I’m not sure that nature will help, though it might.

  189.  #189Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 9:42 am

    Indigo – Dr. Dobransky says one way to highten your feminine instinct is to visit new places. I believe it is also a Rori Raye and Pat Allen advice to be in nature to highten the feminine. I would really look for some place there where I could enjoy nature.

  190.  #190Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 9:42 am

    Feeling low right now. Miss people too much.

  191.  #191Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 9:48 am

    Thanks Feminine Woman.

    Tomorrow I am visiting a castle and viewing the coast of Ireland. It is said to be scenically very beautiful.

    There are times when being here is taking all I have though.

    I am kind of longing for the comfort of my mom, and my brother. And I wish I could have the talk with D. I’m feeling lonely and disconnected from everyone right now.

    I am proud of myself, but I’m feeling vulnerable at the moment.

  192.  #192sophie on June 28, 2013 at 9:50 am

    188 – Wow Indigo – and did you say you live in South Africa? That’s a major culture shock isn’t it – is that what you mean by missing your people? Have you travelled there before – or to Europe? I’d love to know what inspired you to go to Ireland and are you travelling around?

    Travelling alone is a strange experience (but also it makes you stretch doesn’t it? :))

    I have always stayed in touch via internet etc when i’m away alone – too much alone time is too much alone time 🙂

    You are brave 🙂

  193.  #193sophie on June 28, 2013 at 9:52 am

    191 – you might get to see Dolphins off the coast of Ireland (I find that very exciting :))

    Are you going to do something cosy to soothe yourself tonight?

  194.  #194Femininewoman on June 28, 2013 at 10:01 am

    Maybe sink into that feeling of vulnerability so you really get to know what it feels like. Maybe talk to strangers about how you feel and practice asking for help.

  195.  #195Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 10:02 am

    Hi sophie

    Yes, I live in South Africa, thanks for remembering 🙂

    And what I meant by missing my people is missing my family, and the people in my life. Ireland is so beautiful. But no, I’ve never travelled alone like this before. I’ve been to Europe many years ago, but it was with my family.

    Too much alone time is too much alone time, as you say 🙁

    I will let you know if I see dolphins tomorrow.

    I was drawn to Ireland because of the history and culture of the Celts. I adore Irish music as well. They are an exceptionally friendly, helpful and almost magical people.

  196.  #196dark horse on June 28, 2013 at 10:04 am

    hi sirens, i haven’t posted for a while but felt like joining the conversation.

    indigo, there is something about the tone of your posts that is so attractive to me! it feels really familiar to me and i think we both like horses?

    i like to be at home. i like my little cottage and all my familiar things. i’ve been fortunate enough to be able to do a lot of traveling and my experience has always been that the first day no matter where i am i always feel uncomfortable, freaked out, a ‘i want to go home’ feeling, really unpleasant almost to the point of panic. and then, if i can move through that i have wonderful experiences and feel free. i have learned to sooth myself through that – things that work for me are journalling my feelings and a visualization of being wrapped in a soft pale pale pale pink the color of a peony shawl and so safe, also i’m a meditator so meditating helps me feel calmer. i’ve learned to accept that about myself now. if i travel with lionman tho i never get those weird scared feelings.

    elsie i am SO IMPRESSED by your weight loss story. that is just amazing. i just did bootcamp this morning and it feels so good afterwards. i don’t really push myself tho. i’m lucky that i don’t have to for weight purposes but also because it feels a bit masculine for me .. just for me, not for anyone else, i’m just saying before rori raye i used to really compete and push myself, now i listen to myself and do a bit more than is easy but a bit less than feels punishing. does that make sense?

    i would love some feedback on something .. last night lionman and i are were to attend a lecture and he couldn’t come at the last minute as he had to work. the changes in me have become so engrained as i’ve really studied the rori way. i was able to say i respected how hard he works and i was sorry he couldn’t come. i felt so disappointed i cried! and then i tried to do the inner work as to what i was really disappointed about.

    for me growing up i never got to spend enough time with my dad. if we did do things together it was only things that he wanted to do or things that interested him. it unfortunately left a void that i feel very keenly still. i have lived in another country to him for 8 years now and he has still to come visit me. i don’t doubt his love for me but i don’t understand this.

    one of my love languages must be quality time and i would like to share a script with lion man. essentially i’m asking for ‘more’ which pat allen says never to do. but i would love if we could have one night a week that was just for us .. something that i could rely on …

    ‘it feels so good to look forward to spending time with you and i feel so disappointed when those plans change. i respect that you work so hard and such long hours and i wonder can we find time that’s just for us?’

    ladies what do you think? we had great success this week with lionman getting annoyed that he can never get me on the phone. i keep my phone on silent and so i often don’t hear it ring. we talked about it and i asked him to help me find a solution and asked him what he would like me to do. he said he would like me to turn the ringer on. i agreed to do that and i chose a ring tone that is charming so not urgent or jarring. we also agreed no more texting when planning is involved as its too much back and forth.

    thank you sirens!

  197.  #197sophie on June 28, 2013 at 10:20 am

    195 – I am Celt through and through (well with maybe a bit of Nordic Viking ha ha 🙂 – mostly manx (tiny island middle of the Irish sea) but some Irish also way back… yes the Irish people I have met have been lovely…I’m in England but I feel excited you are over ‘my’ way 🙂 I wish the sunshine for you though the cloud, rain and overcast has its own type of melancholic romance 🙂

    I journal a lot when too much alone time is too much alone time at least its coming out of my head and it helps me feel connected

  198.  #198Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 10:52 am

    Elsie – 145 – Then this is part of what’s going on here. He’s majorly reflecting you back to you here.

    Some of your script is good. It’s certainly on a good track. if you don’t mind, I will tweak it for you.

    “I’m feeling really confused here. I’m feeling disconnected. I don’t understand the distance I’m feeling between us. And I don’t want to feel this way with you. Can you help me understand? Is there something I need to know? Something you want to tell me? I miss you. Can you help me with this?”


  199.  #199Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 11:04 am

    dark horse,

    Thank you for saying that, it really made me smile 🙂 I feel as if I really put my heart into my words, both spoken and written. Whatever I say is me, through and through.

    And yes, I also love horses. Very much so. In large part because of their sensitivity and emotional intelligence, and their ability to hone that in us. My mare has been my biggest teacher.

  200.  #200Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 11:08 am


    I feel thrilled to hear that you are Celtic 🙂

    The weather here is between warm and cool… yet I feel as you do, that the clouds and the rain and the cool have their own charm.

    Thanks for the suggestion of journalling – I wish I could. Journalling has traditionally been something which came really easily to me and which I loved to do, yet at the moment I’m feeling a little numb.

  201.  #201Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 11:09 am

    dark horse – So lovely seeing you again. How about this?

    “I love spending time with you, and I feel so excited when we have plans together. I love that you are so dedicated, yet I also love being with you. I feel sad and miss you when we can’t see each other. What can we do here? Can you help?”


  202.  #202prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 11:30 am

    Mercedes 185 – thank you! And I plan on going out tonight with friends after I have my dinner with the family. My daughters bday is tomorrow so am going to do something special for her tomorrow.

  203.  #203prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 11:35 am

    Indigo 188 – I am so envious of you holidaying in Ireland. My grandfather was born and raised there and came to the United States as a young boy. I’ve never been there and hope I get the chance one day. It looks beautiful. Enjoy!

  204.  #204dark horse on June 28, 2013 at 11:39 am

    indigo .. i’m from ireland 😉

    and my horse is one of the greatest friends and teachers i will ever have 😉

  205.  #205dark horse on June 28, 2013 at 11:44 am

    dominique thank you for taking the time to respond. and the nice welcome back! i actually changed my name to forest siren but for some reason its gone back so i guess i’m meant to be a dark horse for now 😉

    your words feel good .. i like the dedication part as he is dedicated.

    i noticed when i was reading your script what came up for me was mild panic that i wasn’t asking specifically for what i want ie one concrete solid night per week where we do something i want ..

    i think this is me controlling the outcome and having expectations. i have really seen the benefits recently of letting go of what i think should happen or how it should look and often he offers something even better

    my default is to text or email these things to him. it would be so hard to say this .. what if he says no i’m too busy to hear you or .. my work is more important or ..

  206.  #206jammy85 on June 28, 2013 at 11:44 am

    INDIGO – have you ever experimented with Rori’s concepts between you and your mare? My mare is very tricky…we have a fabulous relationship on the ground but as soon as I get on to ride all hell breaks loose! (she’s been checked for pain by vet/saddler/physio all of which said she’s fine)…I’d really love to know what she wants to do in her life as she spent most of it having babies (she’s just 7, I’ve had her for 2 years and she had 2 foals amongst her training before that) and I get the feeling from her that being a mum is more important than being ridden.

    However, I’ve been experimenting with sending her genuine feeling messages instead of just trying to convince her with my boy energy that I am the boss (it feels so unnatural anyway) and somehow we seem even closer than before – just not when that saddle goes on!

    I’ve seen other posts whereby people have had success in using their feminine energy to relate to children but could it work with an animal? And if that animal is all about the feminine too, then how do we both get our needs met?

    Much love xx

  207.  #207prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 11:51 am

    Sophie – had no idea you were Celtic. Awesome! Obviously I am only part Celtic but it is deeply rooted in me. I am currently living in the house that my grandfather built with his own hands for himself and my grandmother. (don’t know if you saw earlier post but he came to the US from Ireland as a young boy. I think he was 14) I would so love to visit there.

  208.  #208sophie on June 28, 2013 at 11:59 am

    purple 🙂 I’ve always lived in England but my family are Manx (Isle of Man Irish Sea inbetween england and ireland Very Celtic) half of them moved to Canada and I’ve never met them 🙂 it would be lovely for you to visit – isn’t it funny how it feels literally in your bones – almost like a calling :)? I always feel like that when I visit the Isle of Man.

    Happy Birthday BTW – you me and Zia – us early Cancerians have had it hard but the astrologers say that as of now allllllllll the good stuff is coming our way 🙂 🙂 🙂

  209.  #209sophie on June 28, 2013 at 12:01 pm

    purple – wow! that’s amazing that you live in a house that he built – wow! I feel great just to have my grandmother’s things around me but the family home that’s magical

  210.  #210Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 12:02 pm

    Wow jammy85, I’m so glad you asked!

    I had problems with my mare when I first got her too. The book that turned everything around for me was ‘The Tao of Equus’ by Linda Kohanov.

    She has a very, very similar philosophy to Rori, actually, though she applies it to horses.

    There’s too much to go into here, yet I found what basically turned EVERYTHING around for me with my mare was recognising that her ‘problems’ were a reflection of what was going on inside me. I started by confessing my feelings, my state, to her as soon as I got to the stables. That helped me to become congruent. I experimented with practically every tool of relationship-building, rather than using masculine, bossy energy.

    What worked ultimately was treating her as an equal, and creating an atmosphere of utter trust, respect and love between the two of us.

    She and I have an amazing partnership these days, and amazing communication.

  211.  #211sophie on June 28, 2013 at 12:04 pm

    196 – dark horse i love your story of growth and healing x thank you for sharing x

  212.  #212Millie on June 28, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    @xti 120- I agree with Heart! Ignore…seems like they want you to chase them or to do more initiating.

  213.  #213Millie on June 28, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    @130 Heart0

    I ordered an Orgasm book that you ladies recommended to me, and it never came! Kind of ironic, I hope that wasn’t a sign from the universe!

  214.  #214Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 12:15 pm

    dark horse – 205 – This little speech opens up for a negotiation IF it’s needed. See what he comes up with. If he asks, you can then say – It would feel SO amazing seeing each other every week.


  215.  #215Millie on June 28, 2013 at 12:21 pm

    Elsie I was actually going to say something slightly similar to WildGeranium which is…maybe you should consider Friend Zoning this guy and go date other people. Have fun with him when he calls if you want, but it seems like you want so much more than he has to give. xo

  216.  #216Turquoise on June 28, 2013 at 12:26 pm

    Hi sirens! FW I agree men like to take date of and do things for women. I disagree that most men do this for their ex’s. most of my divorced friends have very strained relationships with their ex’s and they don’t want to pay extra than their support requires. And these are professional men. Regardless though, really doesn’t matter why. We are still family and I would do what I could for him too, and try to be very flexible with the schedule so he has maximum time with the girls… Do what I can to make it as easy as possible. Do I give what Zi can too. This is great practice receiving and is a reminder of what kind of man I want. Someone who does make me feel special. 🙂 so, still going well and lots to do, but we are getting there…. And when it’s all do e I will have a private oasis to relax and entertain in. 🙂

  217.  #217Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 12:26 pm

    Millie – 213 –



  218.  #218Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 12:27 pm


    May I just say, what strikes me is that you are doing amazingly.

    I am so amazed at your dedication and how much you care in apparently all areas of your life. And how much you care about this relationship seems an extension of your personality and comes shining through in what you say.

    I think this is a really good thing, and even if your process looks and feels messy to you, or maybe to some, I believe that you will get where you want to go. Sometimes, I’ve realised, we don’t have to have all the answers, we just have to have faith.

  219.  #219Dominique on June 28, 2013 at 12:27 pm

  220.  #220Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    I did it.

    We just had a three hour talk. I am *so* glad I did what I needed to do.

    It started out fine, and then I just basically said that I need his help to understand. I said everything the way that was best for me. It wasnt siren-y at all. LOL. Well, sometimes it was, but as we realy started talking – it wasnt siren-y at all.

    We ended up talking 2 hours at work. And then we left the office for an hour and talked at a park for an hour.

    He said he was very glad we were talking because he had been thinking a lot about stuff.

    As many of you know because of his situation and my situation the only way we can see each other is very late at night, last minute notice on weekends, maybe etc. Thats my situation as well as his its exactly 50/50.

    So – I said, whats up with you basically? I feel the pulling away, so wahts up. Now, as many of you know he is ISTP -and needs to be alone to recharge, etc. So we talked abut that, but basically even though that is a little bit of it – he said sometimes it gets to be late, and then he just wants to watch a movie but he feels guilty because he knows I need more connectedness….

    So, he said the biggest reason is that its so hard and exhausting, and it is – its an hour and a half round trip in the middle of the night which wrecks the entire next day for both of us.

    We talked about the fact we cant see each other on weekends except on short notice.

    So then, we talked about the future. My situation will be resolved by probably November or December. His situaiton may be a bit longer – we arent sure, because there is more fighting in his situaiton.

    So I said – ok – lets talk a year from now – whats going on? He said that yes, he ABSOUTELY wants to start dating normally – seeing each other a few times a week, but it will be easier then – we can go out whenever, etc. dinner dates, etc. He said he ABSOLUTELY sees that as part of his future.

    So, then I just asked what I’ve wanted to ask for a year now. I said “Well what about further than that? Do you see us in the same house, married, do I fit in with your life?”

    He said – “Well, I am on the fence about marriage, but I absolutely see you fitting in my life. I love you and want to be with you, and I see you fitting there easily. I dont want to date anyone else and while no one knows what will really happen in the future, I absolutely see that happening.”

    But then he said, you know maybe we should push the pause button on the next year, until we can do that, because I feel like you need more from me than I can give logistically right now.

    So at that point, we left the office to talk more privately at the park. We held hands and kissed and it was awesome. I said, well, I know you need alone time and I love that you are so independent, but I need that connection. He said that he had been doing a bit of a pull away from me at work emotionally and flirting because then he said he knows that I then crave him coming over at night and he doesnt know if he can do it logistically, so then he feels guilty. He said he has felt guilty for several weeks.

    So, I asked him, are we going to do this or not? Are we going to make this work? And he said emphtically, yes, I want to make this work with you.

    So I said, well, I dont know where we are now. Are we pushing the pause button, because I dont want to push the pause button. That will be too hard for me to just be platonic at work for a few months to a year until we can be normal and date. And he said – well, what if I cant come over at night because I’m so tired or I just cant get away, I feel guilty. So we talked about that, and I said – ok listen, if you are in this…..I mean REALLY in this, and want to make a life with me, then we have to figure this out. If we can figure this out then this will work between us. But if I give in a little and let you just be your independent self, and let you unplug sometimes, then you need to give a little and know that I need to have that connection with you.

    We decided to NOT unplug. He said he would be more emotionally available at work when we are together, and flirty, to let me know how he still feels. He said that he would TRY to come at night, but I told him, ok, if he cant he is not allowed to feel guilty.

    I felt upset at one point and was crying a little, and he said, I dont want you to ever think you are not worth me taking time out at night and coming over. He said he loves me and thinks I’m hot and obviously wants to be with me intimately. But its so hard (and it is) to get to be with me, just logistically its exahusting for him, and I understand that.

    So, at the end, I was like laughing and saying, ok I’m sorry what have we decided here, and he was laughing. I’m like, look, I dont want to pause it. If I pause it, then I dont think I can be with you. He got upset about that, but you know, thats how I feel, its my BOUNDARY (THANK YOU MERCEDES.)

    So, we ended up deciding that we would be as emotionally intimate and available as we could be at work. When he can see me, and I can see him, and he isnt exhausted, etc. then we will make that happen. And we will just try to hang on until our “normal” time comes.

    When we got back to the office, I went and sat down. He came over within 2 minutes and hugged and said, I really do love you. And he did it. He knew I needed a connection after that talk, even though we had been talking for three hours, he knew I would need something to come FROM HIM.

    And he did it.

    Again, I have no idea if this works or not in the end. I’m willing to give it this brief period of time.

    But before you jump all over me, I am actually going out to lunch with a male friend from college I ahvent seen in 20 years who I had a huge crush on. So we will see how that goes next week.

    Anyway – the point is that … well, I dont know the point. But we will see how it goes from here…..

  221.  #221Indigo on June 28, 2013 at 12:34 pm

    More and more, even as I am learning, I am letting go of having all the answers. This seems to be my lesson.

    I realise that I could come up with the most brilliant speeches and ideas of what I want from D, and what I will and won’t do, and it could still all come to nothing. I could still be floored by a trip away from home that has me crying like a little baby for my family and for what I know and love.

    And my friends don’t have the answers either.

    Maybe that’s what Rori means about being surprised. Life still wants to surprise us. And things can still take us in a direction we never intended.

  222.  #222Millie on June 28, 2013 at 12:42 pm

    I had a pretty interesting conversation with my FWB last night. I’ve mentioned him on here before…and said I was done with the whole thing. My feelings for him have changed A LOT. A big part of that is due to my crush on musician, all of a sudden I stopped desiring my old FWB, so even as he is still making references that feel good to hear of course, I’m just not that into it. I wonder if he can sense that? It is kind of incredible. I was hung up on this guy for so long- I guess I just replaced him with being hung up on another man. (But the difference is I don’t want a relationship with musician, just a fling)

    So–my Ex/FWB starts talking about us and how “we will always have unfinished business, and he doesn’t know what it is, but he will ALWAYS want me.” What?! I was actually speechless! AND the most incredible part of this is that I dont feel the same way!!!! OMG I don’t feel the same way. I won’t/don’t always want him. Such relief to feel this sirens. So i responded with “Wow, that feels so good to hear, thank you xo, I feel speechless.” Then he kind of went on in another direction about us and said “you and I are a dream.” I honesty do not know why he even started talking about US. Why bring this closed book up! I was putting an answer together and he’s like-you don’t need to retype, I don’t know if he was nervous or like watching me (iPhone) i dont know. I told him that “I’m very happy with our friendship. I’m happy with how things are and while in the past I may have wanted more, I’m happy with us now.” The best part is-every word was true! I do feel that way! He just said- oh yeah I wasn’t trippin, I loved our time together and you and I will always be good.

    This is a long post.
    There is more to the story, but i’ll share later.
    He continues to say that he will always love me, that he loves me to death. I feel like I can’t say the same…so I don’t. I like being his friend and I do want to hang out and see him. I haven’t slept with him since my feelings have changed so drastically. I’m not sure how that will feel. It could be could since I don’t feel attached in that way, or I may not be into it at all. Right now I don’t even know if I want to….but we have such a bond. Time will tell. I don’t feel anxious at all. It’s nice to feel that with him.

  223.  #223dark horse on June 28, 2013 at 1:01 pm

    @ sophie, thank you! i have been here a few years and it really did take a long time for the behaviour to change. but it has .. and i love it .. its so much more magnetic and gentle and attractive!

    @ dominique thank you. yes it would be good for me to say can you help and let him help. i don’t have to find the solution for him.

    he is not a man who makes plans so a lot of what we do is in the moment, spontaneous or even dependent on the weather! (he works outdoors) .. we don’t live together so i never know when i’ll see him! and for me the anticipation is so much part of it … looking forward to seeing him and the build up to that.

    also when i express disappointment it makes him feel so bad that he gets angry and says see this is why i don’t make plans .. 🙁

    and i’m afraid that over the years i have just gone with the flow and been flexible – all of which is good but it would be nice to have a little of the other too ..

  224.  #224Wildgeranium on June 28, 2013 at 1:15 pm


    I feel really excited for you.

    I LOL’d when I read ISTP…. That explains SO much.


  225.  #225prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 1:24 pm

    Sophie 208/209 – Thank you! I sure hope the astrologers are correct. I could use some good stuff lol.

    It is pretty cool being in this house. My grandmother passed away 2 yrs ago and last year we started fixing it up, painting etc, and moved in this past November. There’s actually still alot of my grandmothers stuff in the house and it’s interesting to look thru. Unfortunately I never had the opportunity to meet my grandfather. He passed away from a heart attach when my mom was a teenager. I’ve seen tons of pictures tho. Handsome man.

  226.  #226BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    Finished moving, wow that was easy.
    It’s 110 degrees here, I thought it was going to be tedious but once I got started it took less than an hour to finish up packing, loading and cleaning.
    Turned away from the urge to procrastinate and hang out in the coffee house til after meeting with a friend
    I feel yummy….
    also feeling satisfied.
    After all of the talk of when I was in training, remember how good that felt, how good it was to be on my own side, I hit the salad bar for the first time in a while.
    Salad and kombucha.
    I feel giddy over all of the bright colors in my container, so bright, so happy, so ALIVE!
    The only thing better than the smell of lavender, is the feeeeel of lavender in my body. I love lavender kombucha.
    I’ve also been thinking about what really really worked for me, when I was training, was having on online support group. On our thread, the focus was on what we did right. No, “Ooops!” and a bunch of enabling…all empowering, all refocusing, all cheerleading and inspiring.
    The site changed and it fell apart, we tried to re-create it elsewhere but it wasn’t the same.
    I’m wondering if I can start my own site, with a BB similar to what worked so well in the past.


  227.  #227BeLoved on June 28, 2013 at 4:25 pm

    Happy birthday prplpsn!!!

  228.  #228Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 4:36 pm

    @Wildgeranium – LOL – Yes, It explains a LOT. And the fact he is as emotionally available as he is is amazing as an ISTP. Guess what i am? Yup. ENFJ. His complete opposite. LOL. IN everything. Poltiics. Religion. Personality. Etc. Everything.

    So, it gets better. After he came over to basically connect after our talk (it was literally 2 minutes after our talk he came over) he was awesome. It was so awesome.

    So then I went over to his office, and we talked for ANOTHER hour. I told him that today was hard, but it still felt easy with him, and he agreed. He said that he was really glad that we had the talk and he had been feeling guilty for not being there enough for me, but then being emotionally and physically exhausted, and so then he didnt do anything about it, which made him feel even worse. So, I”m glad we got a lot out in the open.

    I was not siren-y at all. LOL.

    Anyway – he said that definitely wants to be there emotionally and connect with me as much as we can during work so that if we arent able to after hours that I will still be getting what I need.

    When all of this is settled, he said that he would ideally need 2 to 3 times a week to see me outside of work (dates, movie nights, etc.) I totally agree with that. That would be a great number for me.

    Then we talked about when or if we get married. He is very nervous about getting married, and I asked him to think about whether or not its the marriage or the finances, etc. He is going through such a horrible separation now, and I told him that I have thought a lot about it and I would absolutely do separate finances if that is what he wanted. He surprised me and said NO!!! I would want to combine finances with you. That totally surprised me. So I said – well if we dont have kids, and you dont have a problem with the finances, and the marriage is mostly for me because of my faith, then what is the REAL problem? He said he honestly didnt know and would need to think about it.

    I did tell him separating finances was not a dealbreaker for me, but marriage was a boundary and a dealbreaker for me. 🙂 So…we’ll see.

    Anyway – he told me how much he loves me and wants to make this work.

    So, I said, LOOK. I’m going to actually trust you and BELIEVE you if you say that you are in this. I’m going to believe you if you say you think we can make this work, and that you are going to try. I am going to believe you if you say that when all this shakes down we are going to start dating in the open like normal people. He said, you can believe that because I really mean that.

    So, I feel like he is going to use his strength to be there for his kids, and go through this separation, and thats what I’m going to do too. I told him I did not want to push the pause button, and so we discussed what that would look like, and we basically agreed and sort of met in the middle, which is what is great.

    Then, after I left work, I actually had to call him about something (a vet/dog thing) and we ended up talking about life and politics for ANOTHER hour.

    OMG. We talked all day today. Haha!!!!!!!! It was a really hard day emotionally – I”m exhausted, so I cant imagine how exhausted he is emotionally, but wow, it was a great day.

    At least I know where we stand now, stand in the near future, and the far future.

    We will see how it goes from here. But he told me that the moments that he is not next to me, I dont need to worry. His feelings never change, and he still loves me very strongly. He said to trust in that, and that when he is not near me he really does think of me all the time.

    Again, it was a good day. Not siren-y at all, but a good day. 🙂

  229.  #229Elsie on June 28, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    Sorry. Longest. Post. Ever. LOL.

  230.  #230WhatdidIdoandwhy???? on June 28, 2013 at 6:14 pm

    oh wow! where do I start ???? I know that we are perfect but I dont know why … I know that I have screwed up big time but I dont know why other than I dont get out of him what I want … I have done some stupid things… I am sure because of insecurities I have with him and in myself … We are on the brink of splitting up and all I want to do is fix it ….. We have been together 10 years and for a couple years he was completely gone mentally and emotionally or so I felt I now understand that he does love me or so I think …and that he is waking up … after I have felt so disconnected … UGH !!!! HELP!!!!!! I just want to show him that we can get through anything if we want to but I want us to be better than ever better than the first 3 years……

  231.  #231WhatdidIdoandwhy???? on June 28, 2013 at 6:15 pm

    UGH Suppose to be ARENT PERFECT !!!

  232.  #232prplpsn28 on June 28, 2013 at 6:20 pm

    BeLoved – thank you! I’m on my way out the door now to go hang out with friends and have a couple drinks. Dinner with family was great. H will be flying home on sunday and we’ve been communicating well. I will catch up on the blog tomorrow. If I have a moment lol. It’s my daughters bday. Goodnight everyone. And thanks again for your input.

  233.  #233Erika Awakening on June 28, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    I felt so much anger and grief this morning. I realized that I was feeling really angry at creepy guy, God and life because I had a hidden thought that “they are all asking me to settle, and I’m not going to settle. How dare he think he’s in my league?!? He’s not even in the ball park.” I felt FURIOUS.

    Once I got below the anger with tapping, it was just grief grief grief pouring out of me.

    Then I had a feeling message conversation with another guy. He stayed connected for the whole conversation. I broke all the rules though lol. We are not in a committed relationship, and I said I don’t want to date other men, anyway. I don’t like to coach men for free, I don’t like to work without getting paid for it. Because that’s what is true for me right now. That actually all felt really good and felt we reached a deeper level of understanding about how he doesn’t need to feel “guilty” about my loving him. Loving him feels good to me, as long as I don’t get all mixed up in other people’s “shoulds.” It just is what it is. 🙂

  234.  #234Sara on June 28, 2013 at 9:08 pm

    I’ll find it in moderation.  Love, Rori
    I feel so confused…. I am a newbie to this. I just bought your 8 program on Saturday. So far I have watched Modern Siren chap 1…. Commitment Blueprint Chap 1 through 4 and Love Scripts For Relationships. I feel so lost! Except for the part to love myself. In the most part I do… I tend to get puled off my bridge, A lot. I have stopped calling my guy but it seems like the only form of communication now is text. Does it work through text. I do have to say that we kind of had plans for Monday night and he didn’t show… I feel very up set by this. But they were not really set in stone. Do I have the right to feel this way? He ended up texting me on Tuesday night to see how I was. I answered with feelings and I felt like it worked he asked me if I was free on Wed night. Again we made um a agreement???? He said that he would call me on his way to work. Again no word! ARRRRRRR!!!! I did brake down and text him just a 12 min later he responded with ((((((( work has me running around like crazy. No I’m sorry I left you hanging again. so I text k. He with are you excited to go to the casino. Than I text I feel angry and sad and I don’t feel like texting right now. he did ask what happened. This is where I get confused. I answered that I thought I had plans tonight and I feel like I was left hanging without any regards to my time or feelings. i didn’t say you or that is what you did…. he text-ed no not at all. he really wanted to see me that he is having a rough time juggling both jobs. He text I’m sorry it’s not me. ” I would really love to hang with me tonight. Please don’t fight with me. it makes him sad. OK I now feel a little better but I STRONGLY feel like he always ” WANTS” to hang out but rarely actually makes the time. I think that I messed up again on this part I text that I’m not fighting just saying how I feel upset, hurt, sad and little anger that’s all no fighting. I not going to fight with him anymore. just to feel my feelings and calmly and comfortably deal with them. and went on to explain that I am doing a workshop ( yours Rori) but I’m not going to fight anymore. Too much right? should have just text ok???? I don’t know!!! he responded well that’s sounds healthy and I’m glad that you are learning nice ways to deal with stuff . RRRRRRR! lol What I wanted is to say I love you and want to be with you and I am sorry that he was inconsiderate! I answered ok….. I don’t know if this was right… I do feel ok but not ok with it. This is so frustrating to me. It has been this song and dance for 10 months… everything is great and he pulls away. I am very conflicted on do I say… do I go. 10 months and I’m not his girlfriend. There are crazy circumstances in this relationship. I met him because he is one of my accounts. i work in sales with 98% men. Well maybe more. there are only 2 other women that are in my sales force. So I wanted to to be kept quite. He also has a x-girlfriend that he says that he does not know what it is or what is going on with them but it’s on and off again….. I have watched and you Rori said that you got your husband to purpose by letting him to know that if he didn’t clam you that he was going to loose you. But I feel like you didn’t explain how. Is there a way or order I should be watching your programs? This is what I would like. I would like my man to realize that I am great and lucky that he is in my life; but I think that I want not is that I want all the men( co-workers and accounts) in my life to feel like that and to be able to sell what I need to them also. I know that; that is not in the relationship area. But I was really really good at selling and now I feel like I can’t sell a thing. I am currently trying to figure out my POP. But really have no clue what that should be
    Please help me. Thanks for reading my crazy rant and the story behind it.

  235.  #235Lisa on June 28, 2013 at 10:13 pm

    I have to be honest here!

    I feel sucky…

    I feel happy

    I feel frustrated

    all at the same time

    I started out using my feeling messages.. “M” ask me what I was feeling, what was on my mind… I did well until he told me he wasn’t sure he was ever ready to commit to me even after all the convincing he did to get me to commit… then I started talking and all of the sudden the crying began and the flood doors opened…. and then he shut down… and then we almost broke up… and then I told him I felt my heart was ripping out… and he hugged me… and then the turned on the lights to look into my eyes… and then he told me he was feeling defensive and not able to tell me much..

    He said he loves me… and it ended ok… since we both looked into each others eyes and then said we loved each other…

    but I’m ticked at myself…all this training all this practice and all this scripting and writing and venting on paper and on here… and I just did everything wrong… F&^*% !! I could have lost him forever… all b/c the more he said things the more I got caught up in them…

    I didn’t have the wherewithal to understand that he wasn’t really talking from his heart.. and I took it all seriously..

    Good part is… I now am very clear on how much I care for this man… it all come pouring out… deep gushing sobs… and he held me… he wasn’t and isn’t the only one that has been holding back… I was vulnerable first, and that took the guard down…

    shew! Wow, I’m exhausted…

    I love him.. I do! I really know now… how much!


  236.  #236Emerson on June 28, 2013 at 11:07 pm

    Sirens thank you for inspiring me always!!!!

  237.  #237jammy85 on June 29, 2013 at 1:19 am

    INDIGO – your reply has filled me with hope! thank you so much for the recommendation, I’ll let you know how I get on with it. A partnership is what I aspire to have with her – not just being her boss! 😀

    Thanks again! Xx

  238.  #238Heart on June 29, 2013 at 3:34 am

    Elsie – I feel a little confused….you and GS don’t go on dates? You all don’t go out in public?

    Anyway I’m glad you got some reassurance and feel better about his feelings for you.

  239.  #239Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 4:19 am

    Heart – We rarely get to go out on dates. I’m in the process of getting a divorce and its important for a lot of reasons that we keep this quiet for now. Its mutual. We have gone out on dates in the past, but its very rare. In the first year, he and I just maintained what we could at work. In the last 6 months, he would come over to my house about once every week or two weeks at night after all kids are sleeping, just for some alone time, etc.

    I did not get good sleep last night. I am thinking about so much.

    @Wildgeranium – since you know the whole ISTP thing, I’m glad I can talk to you about it. There was one point where he just said, “For right now, seeing you at work and connecting with you here is enough for me” I know he is exhasuted at night – he is in a situaiton where more is on his shoulders even than me. For an ISTP I have seen an incredible amount of emotion, but only as it relates to me, or his children.

    I do love that he saw that my needs weren’t being met, understood that and even felt guilty about it. The problem is that he didnt do anything to meet those needs (him coming over and texting at night etc.) even though he knew I needed it.

    I am in a relationship with someone who doesnt have the same need for emotional intimacy etc. as I do. I have to decide going forward if that is ok or not. If what I get out of the relationship is enough for ME.

    I do love that we had basically a 4 hour conversation at work. I do love that he kissed me when I said I needed it in the middle of this intense conversation. I literally just stopped it and said – I need you to kiss me right now – and he didnt even bat an eye. I do love that when I said – I need to get out of here, and talk openly and not in whispers at the office, that he immediately said ok and we went to the park. I love all of that. I love that he cried and told me how much he loved me and that he wants to start dating normally and sees a future with me.

    I guess in the end I have to see what happens in the next few weeks/month, etc.

    This is a man who WANTS to be in this relationship with me. But who DOESNT have the capacity to sometimes to give me what I would like.

    But the fact that he has said that he wants a future with me, and sees a life dating me and then forever with me…..that was fantastic to know because I can just take that off the “worry table.” LOL. I dont have to worry about that anymore so I can focus on right now…..what I have now, and what I need, and if what he is giving me is enough.

    I honestly dont know the answer to that. I will say this for his sake. He told me long ago – he isnt good at realtionships. I know why now. Its because basically he often puts his needs above those of the other person. I think he has found that easy to do in the past and girls that didnt like it just left him, etc. But in my case, I think that he has overwhelming guilt about it and then he is stuck with wanting his way, but then not wanting to feel guilty about it because he really does love me. I love that he is trying SO HARD with me. I think that shows he is good at relationships. At the end he said “This just feels right.” I love it when he says that. I also loved when I looked at him and said “Are we doing this?” He said “We are doing this.” with such conviction.

    Such an emotional day, and frankly, I didnt get great sleep. So much to think about.

  240.  #240Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 4:25 am

    @Lisa. Please listen to me. You can NOT say the wrong thing to the right man. If you weren’t a siren, well, thats OK.

    I was not a Rori Raye siren at ALL yesterday. I think I had two sentences in the middle of a 4 hour conversation that had “feel” in it. LOL.

    But what Rori Raye really helped me with was realizing that I shouldnt throw BLAME at him, and be defensive and make him immediately wrong. Instead focus on how I’m feeling and try to understand how HE is feeling, and then figure out how to come up with some sort of solution together.

    Thats where Rori has helped me. I just decided yesterday that I am who I am. And frankly, I will never be the person to just gently and quietly say feeling messages etc.

    But what Rori, Queens Code, CCarter, Tao of Dating, all taught me is that if you REALLY want to be in a realtionship with someone, or at least truly find out what someone is thinking, you need to put down your sword, and not lean in with accusations. you need to decide how you feel, true, but then for me, I had to express that in an authentic way.

    My authentic way is a little different than Rori’s. 🙂 But its ME. And for me it worked.

    So, Lisa……..dont worry if you werent a siren 100% of the time. You were YOU. And at the end of the day, if this man loves you and wants to be with you, then anything you say will be ok. 🙂

  241.  #241Heart on June 29, 2013 at 4:34 am

    Elsie – I am sending some love out to you whereever you are…I feel sympathy. I know it’s hard…when a man says all the right things but doesn’t do all the right things…it’s such a predicament.
    I understand his feeling tired after work…I feel a little uneasy about him not being there on weekends though.
    I don’t understand that part.
    If you feel commitment and can handle the way things are then keep at it.

    Still, I would encourage you to keep exploring and focusing on you.

  242.  #242smile on June 29, 2013 at 4:39 am

    lots of negative stories I’m trying to stop telling myself this morning 🙁
    last night we were on the lap top, I fell asleep in his arms.
    This morning all my history has been deleted?
    I wonder why he did this? what was he looking at he didn’t want me to see?

    I want to put a positive spin on it like he was researching an amazing weekend away (which I know to be untrue due to work and money, but it feels a better option to think about)

    but I’m holding back telling myself this incase I am ignoring something I shouldn’t be?

    love my negative vibes. I will see how it fits with me later to ask him.

  243.  #243smile on June 29, 2013 at 4:41 am

    In other news… its going totally fab!!! just a few little things croppin up for me.
    We did have so much fun together last night.

  244.  #244Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 5:37 am

    Heart –

    Just to clarify – we have very rarely (VERY RARELY) ever gotten together on weekends. I can count on one hand. The reason is BOTH of our parts – and child care responsibilities.

    Thats what he was saying when he said – ok, if we are at a place that is “normal” where we are both out of our current very cumbersome situations, then it will be easier, etc. logistically.

    There are TWO things that give me heartburn from yesterdays conversation that I need to take time to think about:

    1. His confusion with regards to marriage.
    2. The fact that he knows that I need something, and didnt do what he needed to do to meet that need. He felt selfish and guilty, true, but he still chose that over my need to see him.

    He goes in waves of needing affection/emotion (He is 100% ISTP WildGeranium!!!!!!) And I have accepted that and really am 100% ok with that. In a crazy way, I love that about him.

    When I need something and he can give it to me in an easy manner or with effort but not insane effort, then I always get what I want.

    But the problem I forsee is that there will be times that I really need him, and it will be really difficult for him, and it is in those moments that he may choose his needs over mine.

    Maybe that is normal? When two people have mutually exclusive needs, one has to win….thats true. But I wonder if he will always “win” when that comes up?

    I dont know. He is so willing to work with me on everything. Time will tell. I will have to see how he handles the rest of the summer and how he attempts to connect to me emotionally, etc.

  245.  #245Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 5:49 am

    @smile – well, lets say its a worst case scenario – either him looking at something, or talking to someone.

    Do you trust him? If he was looking at something, do you really care? Is that an issue for you? Is this an issue that has come up in the past between you?

  246.  #246Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 5:54 am



    I will say that one tip which worked wonders and which just kept improving things with her and allowing us to keep progressing was not ‘fighting’ her.

    Part of treating her as an equal was learning to trust that she had feelings, instincts, ideas, desires, that I maybe couldn’t understand, and working with them rather than against them. I told myself I was going to trust her judgment, and through that, she learned to trust me, knowing that I would never force her to do something she didn’t want to do. And in that, I was able to ask for the same respect from her, when I felt strongly about something, and she gave it to me.

  247.  #247Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 6:02 am

    Well, I saw the castle and the coast today. Beauty that is beyond anything that I can describe. There is something utterly magical about it.

    And still. I want to go home. At the very least I don’t want to travel around. I am very tired, and I miss my family.

    I am tired of being apart from D. Yes, he is not mine. Yes, he only said we could ‘talk’, no more. Yes, things are technically over. Yes, yes, yes, to these and a thousand more things. But I just want to talk and ‘do it’. Look in his eyes and see what he has to say, see if he can hear me. 6 weeks is too long to be apart from him. I’m tired and I’m frustrated.

    And I just want to vent here. I am tired.

  248.  #248Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 6:16 am

    @Indigo – I’m sorry you are tired and frustrated. How much longer are you away from home? How do you know things are over between you and him?

  249.  #249Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 6:17 am


    Thanks for reply! <3 Your very kind…

    It was authentic and it was ME open and vulnerable…..

    Good news is…. he acknowledged it was fear…on his part… not sure where that will lead…

    Good news is…… I looked at him right in the eyes ( as I have many other times) and something happened to me… I can't explain it… something so tender and so assuring and now all I can feel is "I WANT HIM" and I was on the fence so much before… he noticed it too… and I think he might have even been coaxing me to "KNOW" he loves me… I looked back in my minds eye and he ask me 'do I love you"… and I looked back and waited and then it just came bursting out at me… "You Do Love Me"… and he held me..tight…

    so, in some ways it was very beautiful! and other ways I can see how I just didn't use Rori's advice at all… I have no clue why I had it all written out.. practiced it…

    Thanks so much for your support!!! It means a lot to me….

    I'm keeping up with your posts… I'm totally knowing how it feels to have that kind of issues with a man….. sending you {{hugs}}

    <3 <3

  250.  #250Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 6:18 am

    @ Indigo {{{HUGS}}}

  251.  #251Heart on June 29, 2013 at 6:18 am

    Smile – I almost always delete my history when I’m done with the computer. It’s just something I do…

    Elsie – Oh. I feel very surprised to learn this….Hmmm.
    Elsie, I don’t know what to say. I feel angry.
    I feel scared.
    I feel like omg-Elsie has read all these books and done all those tools and she’s still in this kind of situation – omg what if that’s me…

    I want to tell Elsie to be a better example for me!
    I’m glad I caught this

    I’m scared to get interested in a guy…I like my sanity and clarity….I feel like all that goes out the window when you like a guy…
    everything gets murky…

    Elsie – I would really Encourage you to start focusing on yourself. Like in baby steps….
    Did u kiss & talk to the tree yet

  252.  #252Heart on June 29, 2013 at 6:23 am

    Indigo – it’s pretty normal to feel the way you’re feeling….
    You’re not doing anything wrong…and you’re not failing at anything….

    I understand the frustration and intensity.
    Just give it some time.

  253.  #253Heart on June 29, 2013 at 6:54 am

    Smile – ps why were you checking the history in the first place?

  254.  #254Zia on June 29, 2013 at 7:05 am

    smile – maybe he is on a man dating forum and didn’t want you to know 😉 if i checked this blog or a couple of my other siren-y sites on a man’s computer, i’d delete history too!!

  255.  #255Zia on June 29, 2013 at 7:05 am

    smile – i mean dating advice, not dating as in online dating!!!

  256.  #256Zia on June 29, 2013 at 7:06 am

    hmm where did my comment go? smile what i said was if i were checking this site or one of my other sites on a man’s computer, i’d probably delete my history too. maybe he has his own dating advice blog he visits 😉

  257.  #257What to do?? on June 29, 2013 at 7:18 am

    I really need some advice… I’ve been using the tools and we had great relationship and a huge chemistry between us. However I now understand that I was using the circular dating tool not in the right way.. I was literally threatening him that I’ll go out with someone else if I don’t see him often enough (and almost everytime I wasn’t happy about something I’d say OK I’ll will date others too). He was really busy, but I didn’t want to understand that and was way too needy. He always was the one talking about the future together. He is a student and now has completed his Masters degree and has to go back to his country. By his contract he has to work in his country for 5 years now. I don’t want to go to that country and he accepted that and was planing how to stay here such as applying to apply to study PhD and other ways, but now I feel I have pushed him away mostly with threatening to see others and now he thinks he can’t trust me. He says we can no longer be together. He has bought his ticket and is leaving in 3 weeks. I don’t know what to do. How can I turn this around in such a small period of time? I know he loves me. We saw each other other day and I was all in my feminine energy. And it felt great. When he held my hand he was trying hard not to cry.
    Later I texted him and asked if we’re still in a relationship together… he said I don’t know what to say.. I asked if he wanted to talk face to face. He didn’t answer anything so I said I will take it as a no, good night.
    Yesterday he texted to ask how I was, I didn’t reply, then he tried to call and I didn’t answer that either. I felt so sad and I still do. I don’t know what to do. We truly love each other but he doesn’t trust me anymore.
    Circular dating won’t help it will only make things worse. I am self-dating, but I don’t have much time. Please help

  258.  #258Femininewoman on June 29, 2013 at 8:40 am

    I always delete browsing history before I shut down the computer. Still the question is are you choosing trust in every moment?

  259.  #259Femininewoman on June 29, 2013 at 8:41 am

    How does a real relationship work Rori?

  260.  #260Rori Raye on June 29, 2013 at 8:48 am

    What, Welcome – and the questions you’re asking are what everyone here, including me, is always working on – the only way to answer is to encourage you to start with the ebook Have The Relationship You Want (click on the book in the sidebar) – and WORK with it 24/7. You’ll see results right away. Love, Rori

  261.  #261Rori Raye on June 29, 2013 at 8:51 am

    Sara – Welcome – and I want to help – and this is a process…you’ll get MUCH better results (and quicker) with all the programs if you start with the ebook (get it in the sidebar here). It will give you the BASICS to work on right now, this minute – Feeling Messages (exactly how to do them) Overfunctioning, Listening To Him – all the BIG Tools, then everything in Modern Siren and the Complete Collection will make sense to you and fit in for you. All you do is DO the Tools and let them work for you. Feeling Messages are the biggest skill to learn, so we’ll help you “Script” here…Love, Rori

  262.  #262Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Hmmm, I read through a bunch of posts here, was watching Rori’s videos yesterday, and I feel a longing to see all of the women here live … to hear your voices and see your faces. I feel intrigued by that, I didn’t have that thought before.

    This morning I woke up feeling connected and aroused and feeling a little guilty that I don’t like small cocks. I don’t want to date men who are not pretty well endowed. And I feel frustrated that I don’t know that until I’ve already invested more than I want to invest.

  263.  #263Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 9:23 am


    I hear you loud and clear… and I have dated one that wasn’t… and one that was too big…

    you need what you need, no need for guilt… I’m the same way… and after months of therapy with a sex therapist, it just is a requirement for me… otherwise I’m not going to feel satisfied…. it’s just what is…

    I’m blessed in that with “M”… he’s perfect… so I had so much fear going back into dating and that same concern… not knowing until you have invested too much…

    I just had to have faith that it would turn out ok…plus a little paying attention too 🙂


  264.  #264smile on June 29, 2013 at 9:24 am

    @elsie, It wouldn’t bother me if he was looking at stuff, its more the fear that he doesn’t want me to see what he is doing?
    I know though that there are things he might not want me to see that may have no impact on our relationship, like I wouldn’t want him to know I have been on this site.

  265.  #265smile on June 29, 2013 at 9:33 am

    Heart, we both use my laptop pretty much all the time, he’s never deleted it before? This isn’t habit for him which makes me curious? I’ve not checked the history, the type of browser I use has the sites I use regularly displayed for ease of access but this morning all my sites I like to use had gone and the history deleted.
    I’m confused because its my work laptop and so we generally don’t use it for stuff that is private for that reason. I trust he has respected that he wouldn’t use it for looking at porn or dating websites, this is not my concern or worry. I choose trust over this. so why the deleting?…hm
    well I trust that he deleted it for whatever reason. If he was doing anything that would upset or hurt me, he would have used his phone anyway for the internet. but again I trust this was not what he was using it for or that he would do that.

  266.  #266smile on June 29, 2013 at 9:35 am

    FW, yes I choose trust, this is the first thought that popped into my mind. still the nvs pop up from time to time 🙂 gotta love ’em!

  267.  #267smile on June 29, 2013 at 9:38 am

    thanks zia, he he maybe he has lol 😉
    i’m still curious,,,

  268.  #268Melanie Murphy Myer on June 29, 2013 at 9:45 am

    Lisa and Erika, one way around the problem is to go to nude beaches to meet men. I know an Australian man who meets women that way because he knows what his assets are. 🙂 Aside from that, I agree with you, Lisa, about “paying attention.”

    ~ Melanie

  269.  #269LoveAlways on June 29, 2013 at 9:46 am

    23 days no contact. While it appears it is “over” I’m still counting because I feel ‘guarded’ – that as soon as I blur my focus that is when a weak moment will happen. So I need to feel strong and see this through. Starting a body/mind/soul 40-day meditation Monday. I need to slow things down, while everything is getting done (business wise), very little ME TIME is being accomplished!!! This feels wrong. My focus is on FORGIVENESS because forgiving is something that benefits ME, not the person who caused harm. My focus is also on balancing the body with the soul and calming down my mind. TOO much thinking going on. The feeling journal will be officially starting!!! So when the 40 days of no contact is over, I’m hoping to be in a more balanced and open mood. Preparing a script for HScd so that after the no contact period, if he rubberbands back, most of any talk he gets from me will be feeling messages. I feel a need to keep a distance – a safe distance – to feel safe and secure. I feel bad saying he can’t be trusted, and I know I need to heal that, but this is what I want to say – he cannot be trusted to be near me – I am not safe. ‘Circular dating’ is moving along slowly but well. Being more diva and intuitive each day. I am enjoying the heart connection cds. Listening to love scripts for relationships is a bit triggering right now, but it is helping. I’m listening to Rori’s programs so much I’m developing my own spin-off tools, LOL. It feels great to saturate myself in such positiveness.

  270.  #270Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 9:50 am

    Thanks Lisa, it’s nice to know I’m not alone in this. I notice that I feel resentment that there is a taboo about talking about this openly with men. I mean, men are pretty “out there” talking about breast size and whether it matters to them. Maybe I will be brave and experiment with talking about this on a first date or even before a first date and see what happens … I feel irritated by the idea that I’m supposed to be silent about this. I felt really angry with the last guy because he implied that he “measured up” and nothing could be farther from the truth.

    Anyway, this morning I had a revelation with Rori’s work. Maybe it was good I stepped away for a while and came back fresh. And I’m so glad I got the videos. Especially love scripts. Those are my favorites because of all the live demos.

    What I got is the “just start where you are” piece. Forget about the past entirely. No matter how many mistakes you’ve made … and I’ve made a lot … Act as if you are already in intimacy with the guy, because in truth we are all in intimacy with everyone all the time. And just start there with how it feels in this moment, with how each thing he says feels in this moment. I did that yesterday and it felt so much better.

  271.  #271BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 9:56 am

    Sirens, I would like some suggestions and/or advice.
    So, I’m moved in with my parents.
    I have my own room, in the back, but it’s very much me living in my mom’s spare room, it’s not a guest room, it’s not “my” room, half the space is full of her stuff and antiques and is going to stay that way.

    I want to stay available to date and am wanting to determine my options, should I choose to sleep with a man. My place is out, I don’t want to get caught up in going to a man’s house, been there done that never again. I want to somehow still keep my vibe sexy and open and…
    wow geez I really would love to get laid, it’s been so long
    I hate to think maybe I need to take myself off the ‘real relationship’ market until I have my own place again, but maybe that’s what needs to happen.

    What do you think?

  272.  #272sophie on June 29, 2013 at 10:03 am

    268 – Yep I have had that fear too…the only times i’ve ever been really disappointed or turned off they’ve just kind of faded away anyway…I try to do the trusting thing anyway and I also wonder if I’d actually fallen in love with someone whether it would matter so much?….

    (((Indigo)) So lovely that you enjoyed the landscape

  273.  #273sophie on June 29, 2013 at 10:07 am

    269 – Beloved – Maybe its something for the man to solve? 🙂 I’d really like to spend some intimate time with you but I just don’t feel comfortable at my mum’s or at your’s until I know you better. It’d feel great if there was somewhere else we could go. What dya think?

    He might whisk you away 🙂

  274.  #274sophie on June 29, 2013 at 10:11 am

    Lovealways – go you! x it feels good to hear you’re investing in yourself and listening to your intuition about what is and isn’t safe for you at the moment x I feel the positive energy and momentum in your words 🙂

  275.  #275BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 10:14 am


    Hahaha yes, Sophie, thanks…perfect.
    It feels so good to remember that I don’t have to do the figuring out.

  276.  #276Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:18 am


    I am only away from home another week.

    That’s the thing. I know that they are NOT over between me and him. I can feel it, and practically speaking, he wouldn’t have suggested we speak if they were.

    But TECHNICALLY they are over, ie. we are broken up, not together. I’m not in limbo, but I feel as if I am. I miss him. I just want to hear what he has to say to me.

  277.  #277Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:19 am


    Thank you very much for the hugs 🙂

  278.  #278BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 10:20 am

    omg listening to
    dubstep yoga

    feels like liquiddrumloverhythmgasm
    like being a whale in the depths of the ocean
    oooohhh sosososo good

  279.  #279Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:21 am


    Thank you for the reassurance, I so appreciate it.

    Today I made the decision to stay (honestly speaking I looked into coming home early) but to stay where I am and not travel around. I felt like a huge weight had been lifted off me. I think that will take a lot of stress off me and it feels much better and easier to me.

  280.  #280Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:22 am


    Thanks for the hugs and thank you 🙂

    Honestly I thought of you sirens today and it helped.

  281.  #281Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:26 am


    I don’t know if this will help you in your situation, but it’s something Dominique said which snapped me out of that way of thinking and any form of snooping super-fast:

    Mistrust attracts the reasons for mistrust.

    If you mistrust him in some part of you, it compels him to act in an untrustworthy manner. It’s strange, yet that’s how it works.

    Also, remember that once you start that kind of checking, it is nearly impossible to stop. I made a decision a few weeks ago that I would never do that again. If someone is untrustworthy, it will come out all on its own.

  282.  #282Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 10:30 am

    I feel frustrated. I feel powerless. I feel as if D misunderstands things so much and won’t face his own issues and I feel powerless about this, because I am.

    I don’t want to love these feelings, but I will try.

    I just feel hot and powerless and frustrated. I know there’s a message in here for me somewhere but I feel like I’m all out of insight.

    I am going to do my best to look after myself really nicely in this coming week.

    hugs to all

  283.  #283LoveAlways on June 29, 2013 at 10:33 am

    Beloved – feel more than think. Drop those thoughts. Set your boundaries (like you did – not at mom’s house, not a guy’s house). And wait to be surprised. Feel what you feel at the moment, and like others have said, let that be the guy’s thought, not your’s just stay in your feelings, trust your boundaries, feel your feelings, speak your feelings, be surprised!

  284.  #284LoveAlways on June 29, 2013 at 10:34 am

    thanks, feels good to have support and reassurance!

  285.  #285Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 10:53 am

    I feel tired very tired
    No sleep last night… too weary…

    I feel peaceful though… cried this morning…

    Self love is moving in more…. I realize I’m totally fine no matter what…

    I realize that… all I can do is be ME… and let that me evolve and change, grow…

    I also realized my pattern with men…. and not to repeat that one this time… lean back…pay attention…wait for an answer…

    Rori’s post keeps sitting with me… how my mind needs to have things familiar, or it will go in a tizzy…

    I love being in the Now… it feels good…


  286.  #286Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 11:14 am

    More practicing …

    “I don’t want to tell you what to do. You clearly know what you’re doing. It feels more erotic for me to be the girl in this relationship. I feel turned on by that.”

  287.  #287Daria on June 29, 2013 at 11:20 am

    BeLoved – i feel really good when a man takes me to his place

    (not taking myself)

  288.  #288Millie on June 29, 2013 at 11:31 am

    @Lisa 235

    “but I’m ticked at myself…all this training all this practice and all this scripting and writing and venting on paper and on here… and I just did everything wrong… F&^*% !! I could have lost him forever… all b/c the more he said things the more I got caught up in them…

    I didn’t have the wherewithal to understand that he wasn’t really talking from his heart.. and I took it all seriously..”

    Lisa- It is not your fault. I hear the problem here to be that you feel in control of losing him or having him. It sounds like your ability to grasp and use all of the tools 100% of the time is propelled by your desire to hold on to him. I feel pressure on you in this. Getting caught up with what he said was your natural reaction. It’s ok…..not having the “wherewithal” to understand in the moment is ok…Don’t be so hard on yourself, all of that understanding sometimes comes from stepping back and giving the whole thing air. Rori sent an eletter out a while back that had this great page of affirmations she wrote and used to say to herself. I wish I could find it and post it, I’ll look. But I printed it out and used to keep it under my pillow for when I felt weak and angry at myself. It included: “I trust myself. I trust that every decision I make is right and at exactly the right time. My timing is perfect…” There was a whole page! I’ll try to find it. I’m wondering if reassuring yourself that you are doing SO WELL will help you and your relationship.

  289.  #289Daria on June 29, 2013 at 11:31 am

    I got a Life Balance 615 band after asking for help for free from a doctor I had previously bought products from

    it is so helping me! yay!

  290.  #290Femininewoman on June 29, 2013 at 11:39 am

    I know what you mean Daria. I got expensive dental work done above the amount the insurance approved. I told him I could not afford the additional out of pocket costs because I had too much going on financially. I was really surprised he offered to do it as a one time courtesy. I feel so happy I spoke up.

  291.  #291Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 12:04 pm


    that’s certainly a good point…. I’ll sit with that and see…. I might have a belief I need to hold on to him…

    Your right! Absolutely… everything decision I make is exactly the right one at the right time… yes! BK would agree with that one… it’s all perfect timing… Thanks Millie for helping me see my blind spot!

    That was wonderful! Thanks!

    and as Erica said, you can’t say the wrong thing to the right man… I need to trust things are unfolding as they should…

    <3 OXOX

  292.  #292Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    Hi ladies,

    Yip, it’s me again. I feel really lonely, and being on here is helping. Just feels like friends and companionship. I’m really just processing and thinking out loud here.

    It helps me to feel connected.

    I am proud of me. I love me.

  293.  #293Lisa on June 29, 2013 at 12:24 pm

    @ Indigo

    sending you {{{hugs}}}


  294.  #294Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    Thank you Lisa 🙂

    your posts are very inspiring

  295.  #295sophie on June 29, 2013 at 12:35 pm

    ((((INDIGO)))) no yummy Irishmen (OH that accent!) to distract yourself with? 🙂 Colin Farrell look alike umm umm

    I’m being silly x hope you don’t mind x

  296.  #296Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 12:39 pm

    sophie 😀

    My thoughts exactly! If only I could meet any?

    My vibe is pretty vulnerable right now, not super confident. But those people I have talked to have voices to die for.

  297.  #297Indigo on June 29, 2013 at 12:46 pm

    By the way, this is not something we talk about much, but do any other sirens have problems with getting addicted to a guy’s smell?

  298.  #298sophie on June 29, 2013 at 12:46 pm

    yes it feels hard when you feel vulnerable – i went to spain once (vulnerable) and spent every night sat outside a gay bar so that noone hit on me ha ha – nowhere nice you could just go and watch some music?

  299.  #299Millie on June 29, 2013 at 12:56 pm

    Feeling really good today! Feeling confident and relaxed and unattached to outcome. Musician text me about his show tonight, wondering if I’ll be there….
    It feels good that he thought of me and I’m so glad that I haven’t initiated any contact because it does feel better to receive than to take.

    I went out last night and had a great time. There were so many attractive guys and of course the lead singer of the band we saw caught my eye. Hmmm must be something about the qualities in lead singers I am attracted to. I did feel that there are so many men out there…if one doesn’t call you, there is another one out there that could be equally attractive or more! I see no reason to feel anxious anymore. It feels good to let go of my attachment to saying the right or wrong thing and the attachment to causing things to happen. Whatever happens happens! Be surprised 🙂

  300.  #300BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 12:57 pm

    I feel wowed.
    My dad bought tires for my car. Not only did he buy me tires, but after I had only mentioned it, on his own he had gone to the tire shop, worked out a deal and had it all ready for me, all I needed to do was show up.
    Then my dad asked about my spare, got a quote for a wheel for a full-size spare, and told the guy we would get that in a couple of weeks.
    So. Freaky.
    It feels so…odd…to feel worthy, deserving, to feel okay with this.
    I feel wowed that this is the same man I used feel so much hate for, to feel so terrified of and was so desperate to please.
    Wow. More wow.

    3rd pair of contacts are much much better, more comfortable.
    I’m feeling soo good about caring for myself!
    Oh, I just remembered, I want to go to the local gym and check it out today.
    Put that on the list…okay.

    I might have said this before and it bears repeating…I feel So Much Peace. Big wide silken-swathes of peace, rustling and gliding all around.

  301.  #301Mercedes on June 29, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    Feeling like I might want to read from my phone on this lazy weekend. This is me subscribing. 🙂 Hope everyone is having a great weekend!

    Much Love,

  302.  #302Veronica on June 29, 2013 at 1:09 pm

    Indigo – hugs to you!

  303.  #303BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    Just realizing.
    This. Is. So. Awesome.
    It was just a little over a year ago, that I went into some old stuck memories from childhood, and changed my memories so they weren’t stuck anymore.
    I shifted them a few times, from a memory of being punched, to acting out standing up for myself, to a whole entire new scene where Nothing Scary Happened, it was all play and sweet and love and goodness.
    Now, I have a dad in real life who is just giving me stuff, and stepping up and handling stuff for me, not like I’m a charity case or a victim but because he loves me and wants to do this for me.
    Oh, geez…yes, this, yes…
    How does it get any better than this????!!!

  304.  #304BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 1:40 pm

    Oh, geez, I remember my dad was going to pay for my college tuition and stuff…he paid for tons of my son’s day care, he used to do this kind of stuff for me all of the time, I forgot, got mixed up in my mind or something.

    It’s good though, because I feel so much more appreciation now. I really took it for granted when I was younger.

  305.  #305BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    Humility. I learned to feel humble.

  306.  #306BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 1:56 pm

    LoveAlways thank you yes yes!

    Daria, I feel scared and nervous imagining a man picking me up and taking me to his place. It feels scary to me that I might be stuck there – oh, hahaha just thought of a memory of a man taking me to his place, we were making out and snuggling, he went to the bathroom and….
    I waited
    and waited
    and waited

    I went to go find him, and could hear him snoring in the bathroom. He had passed out drunk on the floor, wouldn’t wake up, this was before cell phones and I walked through a shady neighborhood to get to a pay phone and call a friend to come get me.

    It was kind of funny, because a guy in a bicycle came up to me and said, “You want some crack? No? How about some loooove?”, rode in circles around me then rode off 🙂

    It feels so scary to trust again after I’ve allowed men to practically rape me…
    which tells me, it could be good to practice imagining sweet, loving, connected sex.

  307.  #307BeLoved on June 29, 2013 at 2:07 pm

    I feel terror thinking about having sex again.
    I’m not sure I’ve ever done it where I’ve felt vulnerable and raw, like an equal with the man.

    I’m also feeling astounded thinking of T, and how convincing he can be with his words about what he feels and thinks of me, and his actions are in near direct opposition. How many years I fell for that.

    I can trust myself to watch for actions and words to match now.
    I can trust myself to make good choices, to forgive myself and recover from lesser choices.
    (can I ?)
    I am willing to…trust myself.

    Yes yes, I’ve done it before, it’s worked out okay, this trusting myself thing.
    find my breath.
    Center in my pelvis.
    Nothing scary happening right now.

  308.  #308Zara on June 29, 2013 at 3:51 pm

    => {Tuesday, 25 June 2013 8:01pm
    from previous post 170: Zara says:


    Extracted from http://onceafatgirl.com/2012/05/05/my-place-or-yours/
    ***In order to change what I did with my food, I had to change what I did with my food. It stands to reason that in order to change what I do with my love, I will have to change what I do with my love. I don’t really know how to do that yet. There are things about my life that exist in my blind spot, and I don’t know how to see them. But I guess the first step is knowing that I have a blind spot. And that I want to look at those things I can’t see so I can create something better for myself. So I can change how I see myself, my humanity, and my love. So I can stop living like my place is small, dark, and hidden. I want to start walking in the sunshine. It’s my sun too.***


    => {Thursday, 27 June 2013 10:43am
    19: BeLoved says:

    “”zara ~ thank you for the onceafatgirl link – I’m seeing some things in myself in a whole new way, feeling some resistance dissolve, possibilities open up…feeling lighter…thank you!!! She is so articulate and transparent, she says so many things relate to but I don’t even think to say, I’m loving it!!””}

    => You are welcome Beloved. I am loving it too. It’s a gem.


  309.  #309Zara on June 29, 2013 at 3:54 pm


    Thank you for the info. It is still not working on my side.


  310.  #310Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    oh I feel aroused … and then a little scared … but not overwhelmingly scared like I used to feel … more curious scared … like I’d be willing to be a little messy this time … like it could be fun to be messy and feel everything that would come up into my body.

    I ask myself, could I really handle it, giving freedom to a man I love with all my heart so I don’t have to put him in a prison? and I feel yes it would be scary sometimes and I’m stronger in my boundaries now, and willing to go into all those feelings to have freedom and love that actually means something. my heart is beating really fast writing this lol

  311.  #311Zara on June 29, 2013 at 4:19 pm


    You both hide each other. It is mutual, as you say. You both get the darkness you both want. I don’t see that there is a problem. You both get your need for secrecy met.
    If you need more from him or any other man, you get to finish divorcing your husband first.

    GS already told you he does not like to think of marriage.
    He said nothing new today.
    He already told you he can’t do relationships until “graduation day” for both of you.
    He said nothing new.
    (Graduation day = His partner out of his home, their assets fairly divided between his partner and him, the children custody and alimony settled, plus your divorce well finished and your child custody secured.)

    He probably thought you were clear from the beginning that you could not do relationships until graduation day.
    It was supposed to keep being a school crush until graduation day.

    You went from playing at school to an evening at your place, from an evening to a whole night, from a whole night to a week. The school crush was turning into a relationship. Yet he had told you he can’t date anybody, including you, until graduation day, even less have a relationship.
    He cares about your feelings, and to stop your escalating in wanting always more, he withdrew.

    He told you this is why he was withdrawing, not calling home, not visiting your home, and trying to get back to a more school focused attitude when with you at school.
    So your intuition was right, he was withdrawing.
    You got the answer to your question.

    While answering your question, he honestly offered to stop playing at school to keep you from craving for more out of school.
    You refused.
    He honestly told you he will not give you anything out of school until graduation day.
    He honestly told you the most he can do is to keep cheating his school hours to phone you during school hours and to sneak into your class room. And to eat together at the school cafeteria.
    He won’t do the hidden visits at home anymore. He tried that and it came out too heavy. And they seem to open the door to you escalating for more, forgetting you are not graduated yet. He might drop bye someday when he has nothing else to do, but visiting your home will not be on his “to do” list.
    He won’t date you, even less be your boy friend.
    He can only play during school time.

    You accepted the deal.
    Nothing new, you had already accepted this same deal.
    You accepted to go back to where you started before your craving for more took over.
    You chose to accept the same deal that keeps you anxious.
    Only now he won’t even call you at night for fear it makes you escalate for more again. He learnt his lesson.

    Now you are back into your rut. You worry he did not care for your feelings, he did not want to fulfill your need for more. You wonder if he is a selfish boy or a wounded boy who can’t do relationships.

    He told you he can not do relationships until you both graduate.
    Either you believe him and you get to circular date to domesticate the craving and see what happens by the time you both graduate within a couple of years.
    Or you believe him and you get out of this deal anyway because your needs are not met, regardless. And you get to circular date.
    Or you don’t believe him and you get out of this deal and circular date.


  312.  #312Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 4:36 pm

    what if everything could actually work out, and happily?

  313.  #313Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 4:45 pm

    @Zara – Your post made me furious. Not because it was right, and not because it was wrong. Not because it “triggered” anything in me. Not because I dont want to see the truth or the non-truth or whatever. I’m sure the sirens on here will say all of that. Frankly, its not the actual content of what you said or didnt say. That is totally neutral in my eyes. Anyone can give any advice or opinion that they want.

    Your post made me furious because it was condescending. Treating my relationship (and yes, it is a relationship) like a school girl crush and using the metaphor of high school is condescending and frankly, rude.

  314.  #314Zia on June 29, 2013 at 4:54 pm

    LoveAlways 268: I’m actually about to embark on another 40 day practice – Christine Arylo has some great ones for women 🙂

  315.  #315Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 5:08 pm

    I feel our connection, I feel tingly, I feel a long list of appreciation, I feel pleasureful longing like the day before Christmas.

    Oooh, I felt the word “condescending” when creepy guy tried to turn the whole thing into “he was healing me.” Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. I didn’t even know where to begin with feeling messages. Ugh. Or how about when he thought I had come around because he assumed from a Facebook post that had absolutely nothing to do with him, that in spite of me telling him a dozen times “I’m not interested” I had suddenly fallen madly in love with him … and he said “what took you so long?” OMG, I still feel angry thinking about it. Time to do some tapping.

  316.  #316Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 5:13 pm

    Or how about when I had already said “I’m feeling pressure and it feels really uncomfortable,” and his response was to buy me flowers and take food I had already cooked and turn off the lights and light a candle for a forced romantic meal when I was already so busy I could barely deal. OMG, forced romance, I feel so furious. Time to tap.

  317.  #317Melanie Murphy Myer on June 29, 2013 at 5:29 pm


    I love love love your poem! (#11) I agree with the person who suggested submitting it somewhere for online publication so that more people can read it and benefit from it.

    ~ Melanie

  318.  #318Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 5:49 pm

    I tapped my anger, which part of me doesn’t want to let go, and after venting about him of course I turned it around and felt my anger with Creepy Erika lol. Now it feels a little more amusing, I see an image of Creepy Erika with really tight fists like a little baby screaming to get what she wants … lol. I feel some compassion for baby Erika whose parents left her crying all night in the crib by herself. No wonder she has some doubts about whether other people are ever going to give love in a way that feels good …

  319.  #319Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 5:50 pm

    now I feel sad

  320.  #320Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 5:54 pm

    It does not feel good to get flowers and candlelight dinner when the guy just wants something from me and has ignored everything I told him about my feelings. It feels … disgusting. I don’t like the part of me that ever does this to other people. I wonder if I could find something to love about that part of me. She really does want to believe in something … she wants happily ever after. She’s just confused. She’s just been taught all the wrong ways to get there. She just needs to find a new way.

  321.  #321Sirenity on June 29, 2013 at 5:55 pm

    Hello Sirens , back enjoying the Siren interplay here again. Nice to see some old faces and some new Siren dramas .

  322.  #322Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 6:15 pm

    now I feel fear in my kidneys. sharp pain. more tapping

  323.  #323Femininewoman on June 29, 2013 at 6:24 pm

    Sorry about that Zara

  324.  #324Jilly on June 29, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    Hi Sirens 🙂

    Beloved and Elsie…wow, I loved hearing about your weight loss stories…very inspiring!! 🙂

    Erika Awakening…your comparison of Rori’s tools combined with business really hit home. Loved it!! 🙂

  325.  #325Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 7:58 pm

    @Jilly – thank you!

    I sort of have decided to make another huge weight loss goal for myself so that by the end of summer I hit my sort of goal number. I say “sort of” because I may want to be less or more after I hit it. I have never been this small as an adult, so I have n idea what I’ll look like 19 pounds from now. (It was 21 pounds, but I lost 2 in the last few days!) haha!

    Actually I have to say that losing all of that weight is one of my proudest accomplishments in my life. I struggled with it for so long (my whole life) and I finally did it. Finally. I am really proud of myself.

    If I can work on my insides and emotions as much as I worked on the outside, I will feel as good emotionally as I do physically. Hmm…..thats something to think about. 🙂

  326.  #326prplpsn28 on June 29, 2013 at 8:04 pm

    Not gonna go into details. Just need to vent. Very disappointed and ticked off right now. Gonna go to bed and completely shut down my phone. Don’t even want to talk to him at this point. Goodnight

  327.  #327Andrea on June 29, 2013 at 8:06 pm

    I feel so empowered this week. I got a job that will boost my income and my self esteem. Hooray!! My daughters and I are surviving and making it on our own.
    I have been asked out on dates by two men I met on Match.com. One has asked me out again for next Tuesday. The other date was spectacular as well and he has called me twice and left messages that he can’t wait to see me again.
    I had some steamy tutoring sessions with my Chemistry prof and last night we had an extremely flirtatious experience at a bar. It was incredible and so fun. I even showed him pictures of the last date I went on and he flirted even more with me.
    I had a moment of weakness the other night when I found out that the man I had been in a relationship with for a year (we’ve been broken up for about a month now but can’t seem to keep away from each other) had a woman stay with him at his house for the weekend last weekend.
    It was a horrible realization that he was moving on and I called him crying and blaming and just heartbroken. (Even though, in the back of my mind, I know it is a good decision that we aren’t together. It is just so hard to get over these chemical entanglements.)
    But today I am feeling so much better, just loving myself for my drama.
    He has been texting me all day with angry spurts about how he knows that I’ve been seeing other men and how dare I call him up with accusations. I just answered, I feel sad and heartbroken but better because I was able to get all of my emotions out. I told him thank you for allowing me to be angry and crying.
    I finally told me that he is really hurt because he can’t stop thinking about me but he knows I’m dating other men.
    I don’t know where this whole connection with this man is going, but I do know that I’m feeling very confident and having so much fun with meeting new men and feeling attractive and sexy and flirtatious again. I just can’t see myself going back into an exclusive relationship with anyone right now unless they are absolutely incredible and treat me better than I’ve ever been treated.

    This moment right now feels really really good.

  328.  #328Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 8:07 pm

    @prplpsn: OH no. I’m so sorry. I can hear your anger frustration and hurt. I dont know what he said or didnt say, but I’m sorry. I hope you have a good night of sleep. If you still need to vent, I’m up and can listen. 🙂

  329.  #329Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 8:09 pm

    @Andrea – YAY YOU!!!!! 🙂 Sounds like you are in an awesome place right now.

    Can I ask you why you have no contact with this ex? I know that is soooooo hard – but maybe you just dont want to? (Which is fine with me…..LOL!)

  330.  #330prplpsn28 on June 29, 2013 at 8:11 pm

    Thanks Elsie

  331.  #331Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 8:13 pm

    @Prplpsn: I am totally curious as to what happened. I’ve been following your story so closely. I hope you are ok.

  332.  #332Andrea on June 29, 2013 at 8:43 pm

    Hi Elsie, I actually DO have contact with my ex. At least three or four times a week either he calls me or I call him. He “popped” by my work on Thursday and we couldn’t stop smiling at each other.

    We have this outrageous chemistry together… But.. when the chemistry wears off, we just don’t have anything else to hold us together. When we were together we couldn’t go one week with flying into rage filled verbal fights and breaking up with eachother.

    We would break up and he would go get more women. Then he would want me back and I would always come back to him, but there were always other women to deal with. I didn’t trust him. He says he didn’t trust me.

    Plus he is extremely wealthy and I’m not. I was catering to him, his every whim, chasing him, calling him, doting on him… until I started doing Rori’s work. Then things changed quickly and he didn’t like it.

    Anyway, so we are not compatible but we are combustible. And it has helped me so much to Circular Date and realize that other men have different qualities, that chemistry is not always what is best for me, that gentleness and kindness is doing wonders.. absolute wonders.. for my self esteem and for my wounded loving heart. Men, great men, actually like me, actually dote on me, and it feels so good. It feels good that this ex is not my only option and it is feeling better and better that I have choices.

    I’m realizing that it’s not about getting him back, or keeping him, or staying with him…. what it is all about for me finally is how good I feel about myself. How at peace I am with myself and how my life is so totally improving because I am loving myself and tending to myself. It’s just a different world, a whole different feeling.

  333.  #333Elsie on June 29, 2013 at 8:49 pm

    @Andrea – Thanks for sharing! I’m so glad that you are doing what works for you. I think that is really what Rori’s work helped me the MOST with. I dont follow her advice 100%. but it made me realize what was important for ME. I’m glad you are doing the same!!!!

    So, how did you get to the point of feeling good about yourself? How did you make it to that point and loving and tending to yourself? I need to really worry about that way more than I worry about the relationship. I’ll take any advice you have to give.

    So do you think that he will ever get it together and you guys end up together? Or no…..there is no way? It must drive him crazy to see you CD!!!

  334.  #334Andrea on June 29, 2013 at 8:54 pm

    Oh… and here is a really weird thing….

    He calls me up and really bitches and complains about how I’m dating other men. He throws temper tantrums. He accuses me of immaturity and other things. He tells me that he does not want to be with a Party Girl and a girl who just wants attention from men constantly. He says all this to me and before I used to react with justification, explanation, fighting, arguing.. etc…

    But then I realized… Wow. He keeps calling me to let me know he doesn’t like all this stuff, but then, he shows up at my work, he calls me at odd hours, he spends more time floating around on my facebook page than I ever go on his.

    It’s weird but ever since I started doing all the things he said he just doesn’t like, he can’t stop thinking about me. He can’t stop calling me. He is giving me more attention now than he ever did when we were supposedly dating.

    He had this woman stay with him for the weekend and then he called me angrily to tell me that She brought the food, She didn’t expect him to pay for everything, She didn’t ask him to pay for gas, She was accommodating and drama free.

    And I said, “Then why aren’t you calling her right now instead of me?”

    And he said, “Well, I just can’t stop thinking about you and I want to know what you’re doing tonight.”

    I told him the truth… I had a date.

    He got so mad he told me he never wants to talk to me again. But then the next day, there he was sending me streams of text messages.

    Something’s happening here. He tells me he wants one thing, but what he really wants….. is ME. And I’m just leaning way back and dating other men and letting him figure his stuff out. In the mean while, I’m realizing that maybe, just maybe, there are better men for me than him. And that’s a new discovery.

  335.  #335Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 9:07 pm

    Wow, I went super vulnerable today. I let go of all the blame. My heart was beating so fast. I felt shaky and naked. And it feels amazing, like I dumped off a load of armor and I’m just standing here wearing nothing lol. I feel soft.

  336.  #336blue rose on June 29, 2013 at 9:09 pm

    this guy, who I thought liked me, started dating another girl.

    Now they are constantly kissing and holding hands.

    And it makes me feel sad a little.

  337.  #337Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 9:13 pm

    “We have this outrageous chemistry together… But.. when the chemistry wears off, we just don’t have anything else to hold us together.”

    Andrea, I don’t know if this resonates with you … I have come to believe that a relationship without a higher purpose and a calling of its own simply cannot last now that consciousness is shifting so fast. That the couple must have a purpose beyond the relationship, and not just having kids – we see from divorce rates that’s not enough of a purpose. I’m talking about a “calling” for the relationship. A divine purpose. I won’t even date most men now because I can tell within five minutes of meeting them they won’t be able to fulfill that requirement.

  338.  #338Erika Awakening on June 29, 2013 at 11:47 pm

    Wow … something is happening.

    I did speeches today, and he wasn’t around to hear them, so mostly they were for myself.

    And what happened is the feelings of “needing” went away.

  339.  #339sophie on June 30, 2013 at 2:15 am

    My head is all scrambled and entangled

    I only have fWBCD as an actual CD (rather than me in the world CDing) and I don’t want to be attached to him…not unless he is attached to me…and if I’m honest there’s me always hoping hoping hoping…and i know i’m hoping cos he says things that dash my hopes…that don’t tie our futures together…

    And I have bursts of motivation (usually when I’ve been feeling bad for a few days) and I am sure I’m not going to see him anymore; I’m going to say no and I do say no and then he is all lovely and wants to see me and listen to me and be all deep and meaningful and we’re back to the beginning…

    And I know safer for me would be Rori Raye 3rd way but I have so much resistance which looks like…

    I feel lazy – it feels so much easier to me to have my solitude than to be out and about a lot
    I feel comfortable – it feels so much easier to have the company of fwbcd than to be always with new people
    I feel attached – I am hoping that he will ‘come around to wanting what I want’ rather than me having to put energy into being out there in the world having someone find me

    Then I feel frustrated. I don’t want to waste my time. Sometimes its easy for me to convince myself that this is enough and I would be able to do that but I want a baby….that has come up HIGH right now…and when i dont hear from him for a few days I feel FEAR that he’s with someone else…I don’t want to live in fear

    I feel I need to CD so the next time that comes around it doesn’t take me to the same place but then my introverted self takes me to the place of non-action – if the Cd’s just turned up I’d take them but they’re not (my vibe? – not being out and about enough?)

    i feel HUGE resistance against internet dating but possibly this is self-sabotage…

    i don’t fill up my social calendar because I like lots of time to chill…

  340.  #340sophie on June 30, 2013 at 2:16 am

    Scrambled sounds intense; and tension arrrggghhh – I don’t feel that – a softer word is better – I feel confused perhaps – confused and entangled – thats better

  341.  #341Zia on June 30, 2013 at 3:19 am

    I feel conflicted. I feel ok with my situation right now, but I still feel such a heaviness in my heart 🙁

    The heaviness has never completely gone until I’ve met someone else, how do I make it go away?

  342.  #342sophie on June 30, 2013 at 3:37 am

    time maybe Zia and filling it up with so many other feel good things x it does happen and one day you wake up and realise you just feel light x i love that x with not a single man worry on my mind 🙂

  343.  #343Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 3:48 am

    sophie 🙂

    I feel understood.

  344.  #344Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 3:49 am


    Thank you for the hugs 🙂

  345.  #345Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 3:58 am

    Erika Awakening 337

    I feel totally wowed by your post. I feel so similarly, and I think it doesn’t much matter what that higher purpose is, as long as it has meaning and importance to you.

    The relationship has to ‘touch the divine’ in some way I think – I am just not interested in any other kind of relationship. I can’t get my soul to go along with it, because I think then you become like two souls existing side by side, but essentially floating in different directions.

    It’s really what I cannot explain to other people about why I am drawn to D and have to see this through, I feel as if our hearts are bound together in a deep way. As if there is a harmony in our most profound journey, that I’ve never felt before. There is a deep sense of rightness, something I am more than willing to hitch my boat to, deep in my soul. I have a felt a kind of incongruency in every other relationship I’ve ever had.

  346.  #346Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 4:04 am

    I feel much better today sirens, better since last night. I had been gradually feeling better since yesterday afternoon, bit by bit. And then when I came online last night, I felt mostly ok within myself, more relaxed and calm. And then D came online to say hello to me, and I can’t tell you how reassured I felt on so many levels. He was not chatty, maybe even a little brusque, but that does not matter. It was the fact that he cared that did.

    He wished me a sweet sleep, and that was exactly what I had. And now I know exactly what I am worth, I can be miles away from home and feel about as vulnerable as it’s possible for me to feel, and still I can be ok.

  347.  #347Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 4:08 am


    For my part, I never try to banish someone from my heart that I once loved, I find it too much of a strain.

    And I don’t like to reject that part of myself that loved that person.

    I have noticed from your other posts that you seem to be trying to ‘get yourself to move on’ maybe faster than you are ready. Can you let your heart take as long as it needs? Can you let it be what is? If it feels heavy, just go with it. Just let it, until it passes. I promise it will.

  348.  #348Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 4:16 am

    Andrea it is human nature to want what you don’t have. I have heard CCarter talk about money as one of the masks men use. If this guy is angry should you go back to him in the short term this anger might be directed at. Though the anger is saying that he is emotionally hooked to you. While he is angry I believe he will be not be able to love

  349.  #349Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 4:18 am

    directed at you

  350.  #350Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 4:26 am

    sophie 339

    I believe there are many reasons for the way things are right there in your post, and that’s what I’d look at if I were you. I am also introverted, and so tons of crazy dating and going out all the time was never going to work for me.

    I would also really encourage you to look at your statement that what you are receiving from your friends with benefits is almost enough for you. Is this really true? What is missing? What do you still need? In my own life, that is where I eventually put my focus.

  351.  #351Zia on June 30, 2013 at 4:30 am

    Indigo – I know it will. It just always takes me so long. Took me two years to get over my boy’s dad and it was so painful. This recent relationship lasted 8 months and its been four so far. It’s fading… some days I can hardly remember what it was like with him but that heaviness remains.

  352.  #352Andrea on June 30, 2013 at 4:35 am

    Thank you FW and EA!! FW, what is this about: “Money is a mask that they wear?” I’ve never heard of that and it’s interesting to me because money has always been an issue between he and I.

  353.  #353BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 5:09 am

    Andrea – 334

    “He calls me up and really bitches and complains about how I’m dating other men. He throws temper tantrums. He accuses me of immaturity and other things. He tells me that he does not want to be with a Party Girl and a girl who just wants attention from men constantly. He says all this to me and before I used to react with justification, explanation, fighting, arguing.. etc…”

    Do you have any boundaries around how you are spoken to?
    You’ve mentioned how this man has said awful, awful things to you and yet you continue to engage with him.
    I feel apalled that a woman would tolerate this from *anyone*.
    What are you getting out of it?

    The day he manipulated you into meeting with him, and I expressed my feelings of distress, I wasn’t concerned with your PHYSICAL well being, I felt concern for your emotional/mental/psychological well being.

    Does this kind of attention seem normal and ok to you?
    I sense that you are getting some kind of pleasure from it…a woman with better boundaries and higher self-esteem wouldn’t feel good about this at all.
    Anyone with active addictions who cannot speak to me with respect are not allowed in my inner circle. Not no way, not no how. I cherish me way way way too much.

    How is it that Rori herself can tell you directly this man is toxic and to please eliminate him from your life asap, and you don’t see big red flashing neon red flags with flaming batons and jazz hands?

    I don’t mean to make you wrong – what I want to reflect is that from my perspective, you don’t seem to be aware of the danger you are in.
    Would you want this for your daughters? For anyone else you really love and care for?

    You’ve said you were a junkie with this guy – do you think you can moderate the drug somehow?

    I firmly believe you are in danger and putting yourself in harms way. I don’t want that for you and all I know to do about it right now is to be straight about it and invite you to PLEASE NOTICE THIS and find it in yourself and take care of you.


  354.  #354Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 5:15 am

    Andrea think of the purpose of the mask. It covers up the true person so the world sees a persona or character that wearer chooses to project.

    My understanding is that money is sometimes used by men to help them act in a way that is not their true selves. Money represents power. So they can play macho, the tough guy, the lone star superhero that needs no one, needs nothing and have the world falling at their feet. This helps them to cover their insecurities and fears. Show the world that they have it all together and have the rest of the world pandering to them. Though it might be a little tantrum throwing two-year old boy behind the mask.

  355.  #355Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 5:41 am

    Look for the patterns. Then begin to identify how those patterns have played out in your life. What were the messages you received from these various sources about how money and power were used in romantic relationships? When you have this information you will be able break the patterns that leave you confused and powerless. Little by little you will be able to begin new patterns that will help you create healthy patterns for yourself and bring those into your own romantic relationships.


  356.  #356Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 6:15 am

    What are you most fearful of? How does that fear keep you from doing things you would like to do?

  357.  #357Sara on June 30, 2013 at 6:36 am


    My guy has 2 business that has been crazy busy right now. We haven’t seen or spoke to each other on the phone in 2 weeks. I have not called him at all. He has text me almost daily. But last night he text me that he miss my teeth is that weird

    ??? Missed my Teeth??? WHAT THE FLIP! Not me? my teeth???

    I feel disappointed and yes that is weird but I don’t know what to text back…

    I was thinking something like 🙂 yes that is a little weird and I feel a little confused that its my teeth that is missed. I miss you but I understand that you are really busy. I do feel glad that I’m thought of …

    Is that too much? I have just started and not sure if this is too much or too little
    xoxox Please help

  358.  #358Zia on June 30, 2013 at 6:59 am

    Are you sure it wasn’t just a phone autocorrecting something and he didn’t notice?

    And my friends and I sometimes use the term “miss your face!” so it could just be something like that. Take a breath, relax.

  359.  #359Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:00 am

    @Sara – I literally laughed out loud at your comment. I am so sorry, but that is the strangest funniest thing I’ve ever heard. I have not ever heard of a man missing your teeth. It sounds like you probably think the same thing.

    I would totally text back something funny, and light. But that is me, and I am starting to feel like I can find my own way of interpreting Rori’s message (which is to lean back and be yourself, and not blame or chase…..)

    Lets not forget – this might be some sort of autocorrect mistake. LOL!!!

    I would text back “Its so “SWEET” that you were thinking of me. (It almost gave me a cavity). LOL. I miss you too!”

    But thats just me. I have found when I use the word “feel” too much it just sounds fake on me. I know other girls on here will disagree. I do use it, just not in every sentence. I have found that when I do that, it starts to annoy me, and then that is distracting to me. Its just my opinion. 🙂

  360.  #360Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:01 am

    @Zia – thats funny that you and I both thought it might be autocorrect. 🙂

  361.  #361Zia on June 30, 2013 at 7:01 am

    You could always turn it into something flirty… “my teeth miss nibbling on your neck!” 😉

  362.  #362Zia on June 30, 2013 at 7:03 am

    Elise – I’m the same with feeling messages… I am starting to find they’re good for me when I am working through my feelings, and also in a face to face conversation… but use sparingly via text/email etc

  363.  #363Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:17 am

    @Zia – I agree. It feels … contrived … I guess thats the word. I will tell you that in my 4 hour conversation with GS there were times that I used feeling messages but it was rare. I just want to be able to talk normally without using those contrived words. Well, they are contrived for me. But I think Rori’s message is still important. Its about how I FEEL, not about making him wrong, or the enemy etc.

    There was one point where I got all upset and was like, you said you would never hurt me!!! I later apologized for it – and he was amazed. I was like, look, I was just talking from a place of hurt, and I didnt mean it. I know you have always said you would never hurt me.

    Anyway I totally agree about the feeling messages! 🙂

  364.  #364Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:29 am

    I feel fussy. I wrote SO much and sort of bared my soul on here about what happened on Friday. Except for one person, no one has commented on it or given me advice. It was probably one of the most significant days of my relationship with him. I am super interested in hearing opinions from people about it. Good, bad, whatever. 🙂

    Anwyay – just wanted to get that out. 🙂

  365.  #365Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:30 am

    @prlprsn: Thinking of you this morning. I dont know what happened last night but I hope you are better this morning. Let us know.

  366.  #366seahorse on June 30, 2013 at 7:45 am

    Having recently gotten out of having an affair with a married man and myself going through divorce……………… Elsie, I agree with Zara. Her analogy was spot on……………… it felt like that to me now that I look back. I have a much better perspective now that I have the focus on me and not on him. I am a grown woman and have needs and wants that are valid. I didn’t want what was being offered. If I am single when he is divorced………….. maybe I’ll give it a go…………….. if it feels good and he can row the boat. I don’t know………….. I feel ………..beyond that now?????? ………………… I feel like I switched to somewhere else and it’s all new and………………… free.

    All with love Elsie, all and only with love, Seahorse

  367.  #367seahorse on June 30, 2013 at 8:01 am

    I want to lie back and let it all hang out and breatheeeeeeeeeeeee…………………….. no more of the three that Rori listed above in the post. I get the pattern and I shall paint create sculpt……………FEEL my way to a new one. It feels exciting to not know………

  368.  #368Sara on June 30, 2013 at 8:18 am

    Thank you for you input.

    But I don’t think that it was auto correct. He has said before that he loves my teeth and thinks that they are sexy… then leaned in to try to lick them. lol i LOVE YOUR reply Elsie I used it. Hope you don’t mind. I do agree I don’t really like saying or Texting I feel all the time. I am so glad that I am on this blog. Cause I do love this guy. We have a insane connection… When we are together nothing else exist. Not the world, not time. I feel like I can’t get enough of him and started to push him away with those actions…

    Also he has done some things that I would not deal with; with any other guy in my life and find myself just taking it from him. I drives me crazy that I was willing to deal with that. But I now feel comfortable that I can talk to you Siren’s and know that I am not crazy and not the only one that battles with myself and these issues. This is great!!! In the past I would just hear that I’m better than that and I should not even talk to him. But all of you understand that it’s not that simple. Thank You Thank You!!!
    xoxo Sara

    P.S Elsie I will read NOW what happened on Friday 🙂

  369.  #369Sara on June 30, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Ok read what happened Friday…. I don’t know what to say. I feel like I have to got back to hear your whole story. Like I said just new to this and started with the blog on Saturday. lol Rori emailed me to tell me that I was at the wrong blog website. I don’t know how I got there.

    But back to you. I don’t know what your situations are… but driving a hour and a half to come and see you… kind of sounds like he is moving mountains just to spend time with you. is the issue that you can’t have over nights? ( sorry that I don’t know the whole story) and I don’t know why it’s last minute plans or late at night?

    But is there anyway maybe you can plan a short get away once in a while to get the connection that you need?
    I also feel like when you have to wait for what you want ( because life AKA Situations get in the way) it make that time that you can get together that more wonderful.
    Don’t get me wrong I COMPLETELY get your feelings. And want more. I am one of woman that want what I want and I want it now. lol not patient at all.
    I think that it is great that you and talk so openly to him and he responds so openly and loving.

    I need to go back and read your post to know what is the whole story but I did want to answer you back
    xoxox Sara

  370.  #370Lisa on June 30, 2013 at 8:59 am

    @ Millie that sounds like a wonderful place to be …. yay! non-attatchment…

    Went out with “M” last night I was leaning way back, and not really on purpose…I’m noticing a eb and flow with me… leaning sometimes just happens when I’m present…

    He did something he hadn’t ever done before… stared at a young woman off and on…. I noticed I didn’t and could get out my feeling messages… he always is so respectful that way and even as permission to look once at a belly dancer… this time my withdrawing inwardly ( which I do – as a natural thing) he leaned in… I wasn’t as affectionate I noticed.. I didn’t feel like being all lovey dovey… I was soft and decided to be with ME in that time and I danced… to the music even though no one else was dancing to the band… a little child came up to join me… I was with ME totally loving on me…

    He ask me several time where I was… I finally said… I’m in my own world right now… and waved bye bye for him to go meditate… I felt saddness… and tired.. I took a nap…

    he woke me to romantic music… and wanted to make love to me right then, I said, I need time more foreplay, it’s been a week… then I said, after our intense talk last night, I need to know you love me… we talked… he said Ok yes, I understand that talk was very intense and lots of emotions… he said I know now the relationship will work… and what you did tonight made me happy, you pushed me to meditate….

    Love making was good… and I felt connected to him and he said ” now we are back in connection and it feels good”

    We danced and sang in the bed… to romantic songs he had saved every one I’ve ever said and sent him…

    Then he turned up the music in the livingroom and we danced naked …….. it was fun! then we went outside naked… in the back yard… he is very reserved and I’m more adventurous… it was fun!

    He surprised me with spending the night… he slept well in my bed he said… best ever… and thanked me for making him at home…

    I felt weird when he wanted to wake up and just dart off to home ….. but I noticed something… I felt sad.. for a bit… and then I noticed I don’t NEED him to be happy.. I went outside to the summer sun and my home and yard… and I felt alive and missing my family…

    I also noticed that even though he stepped up and did what he did last night… that it still isn’t enough for me …. I need him to make more effort to plug into my life… my interests and me as a person…

    I’m ok with that.. or not… I’m ok with it working or not… I’m happy today…. whether or not he steps up or someone else does…

    I’m not feeling needy or dependent… and I’m feeling very close to me today…


  371.  #371Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 9:08 am

    @Sara – Thank you for answering me.

    The issue bottom lined is that he and I are both in situations where getting together outside of work is very difficult. He started a few months ago coming over around 11pm. Its about an hour and 15 minutes total round trip. So, he gets home around 3am after a movie or alone time with me. Its hard on both of us.

    He is also ISTP if you know what that is, and doesnt need as much connection intimate togetherness as I do (ENFJ). So that is coming into play too. THAT is the part I find hard, because I feel rejected, and feel like I’m not worth him coming and spending time with me even though I realistically understand its hard.

    I DO LOVE that he and I can talk so openly about everything. He has never EVER shut down a conversation and has always been very honest. He has never even exaggerated, he hates lies its kindof his “thing.” Anyway – the point is that for the next few months (at least 6 to 12) he said he would do everything he could to connect with me at work. He said he felt very guilty because he knew that in the last couple of weeks I needed more of a connection from him, but he just couldnt get himself to get past the hurdle of the fact that 1. he didnt need it right now and 2. its exhausting getting to me.

    Most sirens on here I think would say to circular date until he is in a place to claim me. I am seriously considering that. He has told me that if I date other people just not to let him know because it would really really upset him.

    He told me that after BOTH of our situations are settled, he really wants to have an out in the open realtionship with me, and sees being with me forever. He said he wants to try. I told him that if he says that I”m going to believe him. And he said, please believe me because I want to make this work….we can make this work.

    So, I think we’ll just have to see how he acts next week towards me. Then I’ll have to see if that is enough. If it is not, and he is not willing to do what I need, then I may have to just circular date until we are both at a point where we can just see each other and be exclusive and start planning for the future.

    I know this man loves me down to his toes. He is not a bad man at all, or toxic. He has been nothing but honest with me about everything. (Even the things I didnt want to hear haha!)

    If it is meant to be, then I guess it will be.

  372.  #372Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 9:10 am

    @Lisa – it sounds like YOU ARE IN A WONDERFUL PLACE. With YOU!!!! I’m glad you had a connection again with him last night – that must have felt great to not only have it – but have it sort of on your terms where it was for you. I’m so glad for you that you are enjoying the day!!!

  373.  #373Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 9:12 am

    I just really noticed that I am not as anxious and can focus on the present with myself.

    I think its because the weight of the future has been taken off the table. I have NEVER EVER asked him before about what our life would be a year from now or in the far far future. The fact I was brave enough and asked that made me proud of myself. I knew that if he had answers that didnt match mine, I was ready to let him go.

    So, the fact that he and I are on the same page for the future, allows me to let go of that, and focus on the now. Focus on what I need. I dont know what I NEED. I think I will know more in a week or two what “feels” good to me, and if this is enough for me.

    Just an interesting thought……

  374.  #374sophie on June 30, 2013 at 9:30 am

    350 Thanks Indigo – No it is totally not enough – I know what I want and its so much more – I guess its just a constant tussle of I want more and this isn’t it but this is what I’m in…I haven’t lost my self completely so its just a tug of war between being with him refocusing on myself being with him refocusing on myself…it feels uncomfortable and I would like to release the tension of the situation but I am feeling somehow stuck…I guess I just keep going doing what I am doing and growing in as much love for myself as possible…

    Seahorse 365 yay to the switch to somewhere else (to knowing and honouring your own needs?) and to freedom. I like to hear that. I want that. It’s nice when I have my switches

  375.  #375BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 9:44 am

    I felt horrified at what you are willing to settle for and relieved that I don’t work with you.
    I wouldn’t want to work with two people who are cultivating their romantic relationship only at work.
    It’s uncomfortable, it feels disrespectful and feels like a violation of boundaries to me.
    I feel confused reading that marriage is a boundary for you, after you have already had sex with this man and are still married to another.
    I’m not sure what you think a boundary is.

    This man HAS hurt you and caused you pain, and you are trying to maintain your image of him as never lying with the reality that he HAS hurt you. People grounded in reality never make promises that they can never hurt other people, pain is a part of life, we can never really know what might inadvertently hurt someone else. He had no business making a promise like that. You are giving your trust to someone who hasn’t earned it and doesn’t deserve it.

    You’ve put him on a pedestal, the only way for him to look at you from there is down.

    I also feel concern for your mental health – you seem to be disconnected from reality and it reminds me so much of when I felt very very triggered by an avoidant man a few years ago. It opened up a pit of emotional pain that I had been repressing for a long time. I needed a LOT of care and attention. For me,I had to admit that I had PTSD and get the care I needed.

    I didn’t get to this much amazing love and peace in my life just using Rori’s tools or relationship advice. I had months of weekly peer counseling, I started my dream share group and formed a core of 3 women and we shared hours and hours co-counseling each other for nearly 2 years, I went through a few different therapists until I found an awesome one and had weekly therapy with her for four months, plus BK’s “The Work”, plus spiritual mindfulness practice plus The Sedona Method Supercourse and many other Sedona Method courses plus many many many other tools and practices along the way.

    Once I got strong enough to be able to feel and tolerate the feeling of heartbreak of being separated from my mother at birth and that passed through, it was like a tipping point and my overall health and wellbeing has continued to improved steadily.

    It’s okay to need so much attention, it really is.
    Whatever you need deserves much better care than it is getting from GS, or what you are giving yourself right now.

  376.  #376Sara on June 30, 2013 at 9:56 am

    I look at circular dating as something to practice the techniques with and to fill in my time. If I am going out then I’m not thinking on all of the bad things and what If’s. NOT going to lie… almost always I don’t feel like going out on other dates or leaving my house sometimes. But I have to say to myself that maybe this date will surprise me. May this date I won’t be thinking I wish it was him. But better than sitting home alone letting mind wonder.

    And lol I don’t know what ISTP means or (ENFJ).

    I do believe that if it is meant to be than it will be!!

  377.  #377Bianca on June 30, 2013 at 9:57 am

    I found out my husband is seeing a Cuban bimbo a lot lately. She is all over him I heard and also heard his brother tell his girlfriend (who confides in me) that my husband “really likes her and they are really good friends.” I now found out that he & his brother are going to buy her expensive jewelry because she is sucking up to their sick 98 year old mother in a convalescent home. She calls my husband constantly, and he tells me they are just good friends. He guards his phone. She is a gold digger trying to get back with her old boyfriend (my brother in law who is now back with my girlfriend-the one confiding in me). So This Cuban harlot is playing with my mom-in-law (who hates me and kicked me out of the family for a very stupid reason) leaving that Cuban full range to kiss up, have dinners at my husband’s family house without me there. I heard my husband and she play little cutsie games with eachother telling eachother amorous words of endearment in Spanish. Now that the men are buying her and her friend( who accompanies her to their secret get togethers with the men) both expensive jewelry, I’ve about had it. Should I leave my husband? I haveno money, no one and no where to go. I’ll have to go on welfare, and live in the projects. What do I do. We’ve been married 41 years, I’ve never 2-timed him – ever. I met him in high school at age 14. Never dated anyone but him. Virgin. Never accepted dinner or lunch invites from other men either, unlike my husband to takes all kinds of females out. I’m tired of his back stabbing. What do I do??????? Please help!

  378.  #378Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 10:06 am

    @BeLoved. LOL. Your post actually made me smile. Honestly, from the posts that you have put on here, I have noticed you and I are VERY different people. I’m not sure given that you have strangers touch you sexually (OM) whether or not you are the correct person to sort of judge what my morality level is.

    Sorry you feel “horrified”. To be honest, I had no idea you were a counselor, that sort of makes me feel really scared, maybe not horrified LOL, but scared that you would be working with people given how your current situation seems so out of control – at least that is what you have said. I’m just repeating.

    Anyway – to be honest, you are free to do whatever you like, but honestly, I feel like I can not ever take what you say seriously. At least not for my life. I’ve tried to be polite on here with you, and I hope you dont get angry or feel like I’m lashing out, its just that I really believe we are very very different people.

    And I find it jawdropping that you would somehow question my morality. Amusing.

    Anyway – thank you – I appreciate that I think you are trying to help me in your own way…..so thank you……I really do think you were trying to help me. Its just that from Byron Katie (I 100% disgree with her teachings) to other things like Orgasmic Meditation with strangers, I really feel like we are just very different people, but I wish you nothing but happiness on your path, which is just a very different one than mine.

  379.  #379Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 10:07 am

    @Sara – oh!!! You should look up personality types – its SOO interesting. Frankly, out of all the books I’ve read and websites I’ve read and therapy I’ve done LOL – its the number ONE thing that has helped me understand not only myself but other people (friends, relationships, family, etc!!!) You should TOTALLY look into it and see if it resonates with you!

    Thank you for answering me about circular dating. Its definitely something I’m thinking aobut this weekend!

  380.  #380BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:16 am

    I would also say, that by letting your anxiety and need to control lead, you possibly interrupted a process for him where he would have had to empower himself to find a way to meet your needs…do something extraordinary for him, come up with his own solution.
    By settling for this arrangement, you brought things back to your comfort level and enabled him to stay in his regular zone.

    I believe a lot of sirens are probably not saying anything because there isn’t much ‘nice’ to say about it. This arrangement looks sick and desperate from my perspective – and please hear that I don’t mean that in a derogatory way. I’ve been there. I feel compassion for you.
    My heart’s desire for you is that you snap out of this haze of illusions you’ve created and discover your inner security, power and worth.

  381.  #381Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 10:22 am


    Your post about Friday made me think about my own situation.

    It made me think that sometimes we have no real idea what is going on with a man, with the man we are relating to, and outsiders usually have even less idea. For my part, D’s words and behaviour often seem to contradict each other, so I have kind of stopped taking things so deep, or analysing it all too much.

    Sometimes all I have to go on is my intuition, and what I seem to know in my heart.

    I believe you when you say you are in a relationship with GS, and I believe you when you say you both want it to be a proper committed one one day. I believe that you trust him.

    I wish peace for you, and I wish security and solidness in your life.

  382.  #382BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:32 am

    Elsie – I’m not judging – I genuinely feel confused.
    I genuinely feel curiosity and wonder what you mean when you say boundary, because it seems you are contradicting yourself. I believe this is a big source of your pain. You have strong values that really mean something to you.
    If “sex outside of marriage” is a strong value of yours, then you have busted your own boundaries and stepped outside of those values. If you have strong Christian values, then you are technically committing adultery. That will cause you incredible pain, to step so far outside of your values. I am inviting you to clarify for YOURSELF, what is a true boundary for YOU. When you know them and stick to them and don’t cross them for anyone, you find your center and build trust in yourself.

    There is no judgment here…only an invitation to see where you might be causing yourself pain by being out of integrity with yourself. If what you believe is that sex is for marriage only, and stand by that, and know you deserve it, refuse to settle for anything else – this will build your self-esteem, integrity and inner strength, and you will HAVE that. With ease. Without all of the anxiety, pain, obsessing, uncertainty, crumbs.

    What I am inviting you to do, is be CLEAR on your values, be CLEAR in your thoughts, NOTICE where you have inner conflict, be PROUD of your values, and STAND BY THEM, stand by your truest, deepest desires.

  383.  #383BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:38 am

    “how your current situation seems so out of control – at least that is what you have said. I’m just repeating”

    Current situation? Repeating? from where? from when?

  384.  #384Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 10:39 am

    I don’t mean to invalidate what any of the sirens say on here, I LOVE the input. I am amazed at the insight and I cannot describe the growth, comfort and strength I have derived from here.

    But I did mean to comfort Elsie.

    With my ex-husband, there was over a year and a half where things did not look to anyone like they would ever become anything real. I won’t go into the details, but he was far, far away from me emotionally. He no doubt had his reasons, but suffice to say, I think pretty much everyone who cared about me thought my hope was in vain. (I’m not trying to compare my situation with yours, Elsie, just bear with my I’m trying to make a point… 🙂 )

    Anyway, in his own time he came around and whisked me away and married me very shortly after. And he was the most adoring, affectionate, devoted husband I could have wished for (I ended things with him eventually because I did not want children).

    But from where we were at one point, I don’t think anyone could have predicted that, especially if they saw how low I was during that time (again, not saying your situation is like mine, Elsie, just saying no one can ever really know)

  385.  #385BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:51 am


    “out of control”
    Is this supposed to mean something ‘bad’ or ‘wrong’?
    At this one moment in time, right here, right now, the concept of control is so meaningless to me.
    I feel SO present. SO aware. So at peace.

    for the moment, I feel deep peace.
    I feel..a charge…of possibility, a subtle excitement, I can feel my heart beat, my feet on the ground, I feel excited about
    life itself.
    From here, the idea of control…is..incomprehensible. There is no ‘situation’…I wonder what this ‘situation’ is that you see.
    I love it. I love this level of being.
    this morning I woke up and noticed my mother was still asleep – I went in to her and woke her up and asked her if she wanted me to take her to church.
    I slipped into bed next to her as she reached out for me. The sun was golden coming through the blinds, her bed lit up in a glowing peach,
    her face bleary and sleepy
    she felt so sweet and soft
    It felt…so good
    to hold and be held by my mom,
    to be there, be present with her, our shared warmth,
    I haven’t felt that way towards my mother, maybe ever.
    So. So. good.
    Yum yum yum.
    yes yesyes yes
    thank you thank you thank you.

  386.  #386Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 10:51 am


    You will get there 😉 I truly believe that.

  387.  #387BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:52 am

    Erika – I haven’t responded much to your posts and I AM LEARNING, watching, receiving, please don’t stop!!!

  388.  #388BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 10:54 am

    There was a moment yesterday, when I felt irritated that my mom asked me to help with her computer
    for a split second, then
    (I am crying as I type this)
    my heart melted, and I knew there would be a day I would give anything anything anything to hear her voice again,
    just WISHING she would be around to ask me
    to help her again
    (tears really pouring down now).
    I softened, leaned over and got it sorted out for her.

  389.  #389sophie on June 30, 2013 at 11:01 am

    382 we can’t ever know either can we and I love these stories where the man turns out to be worth it in the end – its being ok with whatever happens though I guess whilst you’re going through the stages of it maybe/maybe not getting there – just from my own perspective with my pattern of unavailable men I love to believe that he will get there in the end – now though I also know I have to listen to what they say to me and I have to bare in mind that they might never get there and i cant control what they do or do not know only continue to grow in myself separately from the situation – not give it too much power and keep asking myself why am I here? Why am I here at all? So much inner work to always be done; anxious work on anxiety; wanting to control work on letting go; tense work on relaxation; not being number one work on self worth.

  390.  #390sophie on June 30, 2013 at 11:02 am

    384 thanks Indigo! I HAVE to get there I just hope I get they without it bashing me over the head 🙂

  391.  #391Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 11:05 am


    You are so right.

    I know many sirens on here may disagree with me when I say this, but I feel I know the difference in my heart.

    I believe very strongly that my heart knows the difference between someone who loves me and someone who doesn’t. Someone who is in it, and someone who is just playing a part. I really do believe this. Also, I have no difficulty in walking away from the majority of situations with guys, yet some I just can’t. Why is that? That is the question that fascinates me.

  392.  #392Millie on June 30, 2013 at 11:14 am


    I’ve taken some time to respond to your latest development, partly because you seem so happy with the outcome of the conversation-and if you feel happy and have decided you are happy, what does my opinion matter?

    But since you asked for responses- I would feel uncomfortable agreeing to be exclusive with someone that says “Right now I can only give you what I’m giving you now, but later I can give you more, later I can give what you want.” How do you know he really can give you what you want if he is incapable of fully giving it now? I am not someone that holds onto words when there is no action to support it. Continue to see this man, see where it goes…but date other people! In my opinion, you will be so much happier not investing in this one man’s promise. Let other men show you what else is out there. This man is not the end all be all right now. He MIGHT be later, but are you really willing to cut off all your options NOW for a prospect later? He may even change his mind later. I’m wondering why aren’t you circular dating????
    Much love

  393.  #393Millie on June 30, 2013 at 11:26 am

    I had an amazing night last night! If you remember I was wondering whether to go dancing at a place Musician was playing. I planned on going with 4 friends. Musician text me early in the day about the show, wondering if I would be there…..
    My friends ended up all flaking out! But I decided to go alone anyway! Why should I stay home because of them? I had also bought a new western shirt and took the sleeves off and made it really cute, so I felt so radiant in what I was wearing. I felt nervous at first going alone, but I wasn’t lonely for long! I danced almost every dance, the ones I didn’t dance were because I needed a breather. Musician came up and talked to me for awhile, said the he had wanted to come see me but had been really busy. I like talking to him, but we got interrupted and he said he would come back and talk more, but another guy asked me to dance and I was dancing the whole night as he was performing. I stayed till the bitter end!! One of the guys I was dancing with asked for my number and wanted to go eat afterwards, but I didn’t feel interested and my feet hurt sooo bad I just wanted to go home. Another man was kind of following me around too, saying how nice it was to dance with me. I felt like I had two men trying to walk me out!! I wanted to say Bye to Musician, but I also didn’t want to seem like I was “waiting.” Waiting felt like assuming, so I left. He text me when I got home asking where I went cuz he wanted to say goodbye with a sad face. I just said I thought he would be busy after packing up with his band. I feel like he is interested in having a fling with me….so we will see how it unfolds. I don’t feel in a hurry to make anything happen though. Going alone did wonders for my confidence too, I felt like such a presence in the room, one man even asked me if I was a model, and when I said no- he said you should be! Wow…so much lovely attention. Feeling happy and relaxed and unattached to outcome 🙂

  394.  #394sophie on June 30, 2013 at 11:34 am

    389 i think that’s great you know the difference in your heart…I walk away sooner or later but often it seems to be later rather than sooner…I believe I may be driven by a belief that you have to work hard to be loved and I’m doing a lot of affirmation around that right now…i believe that the more healing I do around my own sense of loveability the more I will be loved; naturally; i will let it in. I fear the bruisings that I take from being with the wrong men but I have to trust that whatever we can only heal stronger not be made weaker (ultimately)

    MILLIE/ELSIE – your comment resonated with me Millie – I too felt that if Elsie is happy with the outcome then that is what counts; knowing what feels good to us…listening to our own hearts

  395.  #395sophie on June 30, 2013 at 11:37 am

    Great Millie 🙂 I often go out dancing alone and I too am never alone for long 🙂 The bouncers all get really protective of me too I like that 🙂 – Love that you left and then musician man text you – now that’s cool!

  396.  #396sophie on June 30, 2013 at 11:38 am

    386 – ah Beloved that’s lovely – feels like softening

  397.  #397Sara on June 30, 2013 at 11:57 am

    VERY WELL PUT!!!!! Elsie!!!!

    I have to agree with Elsie on this one. Beloved when I read your post it even stung me!!!! OUCH and it wasn’t even put towards me.

    that Said do I think that Just Rori’s programs alone is going to change the world…. NO but I do feel like she puts us on the track.

    Love yourself 1st
    Except people ( not just men) for who they are 2nd

    I try to live by HELP not HURT

  398.  #398Melanie Murphy Myer on June 30, 2013 at 12:05 pm

    FW, wow your words about money and power and insecurity in #353 are so profound!

  399.  #399Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 12:11 pm

    @Indigo – Thank you. From what you wrote it does feel like you “get” what I’m saying. Sometimes it seems like I try to explain on here the situation, and it comes across as I’m defending myself, or convincing myself or others, and its just hard for me because I’m just really trying to clarify a very complicated situation to people I’ve never met, and who dont know me or him. 🙂 So, thanks for understanding!!!

    I sincerely appreciate you writing that. It is hard to get across what you feel on here, and so its nice that you understand that. My friends in “real life” who know the whole story understand that its really complicated on BOTH sides, and there are a lot of impediments on both of our parts to getting together. They all sort of say, we’ll see what will happen in the end, but they also see how good he treats me and how he is always there for me no matter what. (Well, until this very recent conversation where basically he is saying he knows what I need but doesnt know if he can give me that now.) Anyway – the point is that my needs have always been important to him, and I just have to figure out what to do between now and the time we can just start dating normally.

    @BeLoved – My boundaries are something I’ve been thinking about a lot in the last few months. Especially since that one post of Rori’s came up from Mercedes about boundaries. I think I used to think that sort of whatever I wanted was a boundary, which is not really the case, its more of a preference vs. boundary.

    First off, I can tell you that I do not feel I am married right now. My clergyman even told me that I have a “slam dunk” case for an annulment, meaning that I was never actually married. (Yes, legally, but not in the sense that there was a sacrament….anyway) Point being, that really made me feel great because it felt like what I’ve been thinking all along and feeling wasnt insane. I have not felt “married”. So, take that however you want, I”m just explaining it. 🙂 I can tell you that of all the things I struggle with emotionally, this one is not it. I dont know why, but it doesnt even hit my radar as being wrong. Maybe it should, maybe it shouldnt. I dont know – I cant explain it. It just doesnt. I dont feel one ounce of guilt or remorse for it.

    That said, I hear what you are saying about boundaries in other areas and I’m working on those. Perhaps that is the cause of my pain. I’m not sure on that I’ll have to think about it. Thank you.

    @Millie – I totally appreciate that you would take the time to think about me. 🙂 To answer your question: do you know he really can give you what you want if he is incapable of fully giving it now? I know that because until this moment … for the last year and a half he has progressed this realtionship and been there for me every time I have truly needed him. He has always given me what I want/need. So I know that he CAN do it. Whether he WILL or not is really the question. It seems that its a lot for him right now, so I have to again decide what to do between now and the time that we can be a normal couple out in the open with more free time. I hear that you say I should date other people – I am considering that for the very first time. He has told me that I can, but just not to tell him about it becuase it would upset him greatly. I have to really think long and hard about circular dating. Its very difficult for me to do that when I love someone. It just is. 🙂

    @Sara – Thank you. 🙂 I know that BeLoved did not intend to hurt me – well, thats what I choose to believe. 🙂 But I was pretty angry when I read it because it did sound condescending for sure.

    I do think that Rori really helps you understand that this journey and your life are about YOU. And that men are not doing anyhting right or wrong, they are just doing what they need to do and you then need to figure out if that is good enough for you. Without fighting and without blame. I love that I have learned that. Without learning Rori’s teachings, Friday would have gone down VERY differently. I would have probably yelled and blamed him, etc. It would have been not a healthy conversation that probably would have ended the relationship. So, yay! Go Rori! 🙂

  400.  #400Melanie Murphy Myer on June 30, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    Elsie, I had written a positive response to your posts the other day but I am finding that for some reason when I post from my laptop they don’t go through (but they do via my phone, which I’m using now). I enjoyed reading about your experiences and felt hopeful for you in your situation.

    ~ Melanie

  401.  #401Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 12:17 pm

    @Melanie – now I’m TOTALLY curious as to what you wrote! 🙂 I’m interested to know what you think is positive about it and how you feel hopeful for me. I am genuinely interested and curious. I truly want to hear all sides. 🙂

  402.  #402Sara on June 30, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    I don’t think so either, just it could have been a little more loving and understanding…. after all they are your feelings and only you know the whole story. You don’t have to agree on how others deal with there situations but you can be supportive and loving about it. That is all. I know that this is a open forum and people can put up what ever they feel… I just wished that some of the post sound more understanding than they come across….

    I know that when we ask for help or opinions that we open ourselves up and may not like what we hear either. Just for the most part is that we all want the same goal for ourselves and everyone else on the site.

    We ask for help to see our situation in a different light as we see it in. Sometimes we only see what it right there and some times we only see what we want to see. by asking a opinion here I would like to feel like people understand and would like to help not dump all over it.

    Everyone has there breaking point…. and everyone has there enough line. Until that changes or we feel that line has been crossed…..


    Everyone gets hurt and sometimes we even do a little of that hurting. It’s what you learn from it.

    People are put in our lives for a reason; something for you to learn; something for you to teach…. for whatever reason they were put there for a reason.

    I think that you are great and know what you are willing to deal with ( for a while) because of the situation that you are dealing with. I tend to ask myself that is my situation different or am I making excuses up for my man… But that is something I have to figure out and know when enough is enough

  403.  #403BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 12:47 pm

    Sara – 396

    “I try to live by HELP not HURT”

    Have you ever had a broken bone set? Or a wound lanced? Did it hurt?

    The two are not mutually exclusive.

  404.  #404Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 12:52 pm


    I’m glad you felt supported.

    I have had such unusual experiences with love in my life that it makes me absolutely reluctant to make a pronouncement on anyone’s situation ever.

    And when I say unusual, I mean experiences which have defied any kind of logic or reasonableness or common sense.

  405.  #405Sara on June 30, 2013 at 1:02 pm


    I have to laugh…. I am sorry. I feel like your take on my help not hurt is a little literal….
    Yes they do hurt and they do hurt when fixing the “wound” but no need to pour salt in them while your fixing them….

    I know that when asking for help or opinions; you may not like what you hear… Just here (on this site) I was thinking of…. I don’t know…. a little more compassion….

    Today is my first day really on this site posting. I asked for help on a answer to give my man…. Was my answer to long; to much; how do I answer….

    Elsie had a great laugh at my situation ( which I did too… just did not know how to answer back) and she had great advice!!!! lol on teeth 😉

    I guess what I am really trying to say is that nothing is easy and we don’t have the answers; so we look to others here to help…. Help not hurt

    That is it, no wounds or broken bones

    xoxox Sara

  406.  #406Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 1:03 pm

    @Indigo – I think many of us have experienced that. So when we find ourselves in a “complicated” situation we have to figure out – is this another experience that defies logic and common sense……or am I just telling myself that because its what I WANT to hear.

    I told him on Friday, I never want to try to convince anyone to be with me. I also never want to chase. Chasing and convincing are two things I will never do. I guess those are my boundaries.

    If someone wants to be with me, are there are challenges then I will work with them as a partner in a relationship to figure out how most of our needs can be met on both sides. The question now is, what are my true boundaries, and are my needs (not preferences, but NEEDS) being met, and if they are not being met, do I want to wait for a few months to see if they will be met in the near future.

    Thank you sirens. I feel like I dont have the answers to the above questions, but at least I have the right questions to think about for MYSELF now. 🙂

  407.  #407Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    @Sara – I totally agree. I think (my opinion) that BeLoved means well, and wants to help and not hurt, but she can come across as a bit abrasive at times. It takes one to know one haha!!!! I KNOW that I can come across as being very judgmental and abrasive and maybe even condescending sometimes, so I’m not throwing any stones. 🙂

    At the same time, I did laugh at her help not hurt comment as well. I thought…..well, sure, the doctor is going to hurt you for that moment, but he isn’t going to call you names, or give you some condescending analogy as to why you are an idiot, or yell at you. LOL.

    Thats funny that we both had the same idea on that.

    And as far as teeth goes – that STILL cracks me up. If a man tried to lick my teeth, I think I would seriously laugh. I dont know what I would say to that. You must have excellent dental hygene LOL! I have never heard of a tooth fetish before. 🙂 I would just go with it and crack up because seriously what else are you going to do? And there are worse things a guy could have a fetish for, right??! 🙂 LOL

  408.  #408Indigo on June 30, 2013 at 1:10 pm


    I totally get what you are saying.

    And my take on it all is totally esoteric. I feel like I trust myself completely, or am rapidly getting there, and I just don’t really care if other people think I’m telling myself a load of crap. Sometimes I don’t really even care if I think I’m telling myself a load of crap.

    I follow my heart. I march to the beat of my own drum. And I believe it will lead me to where I need to be.

    Maybe that sounds strange to some people 😉

  409.  #409Melanie Murphy Myer on June 30, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    Elsie, I don’t remember what I wrote, but if I have time later I will reread your posts and jog my memory. What I do remember, though, was that it made me smile and it was a pleasure to read, and I felt like you arrived at a good place with it emotionally and mentally.

    I don’t know the back-story, only what you shared on this thread. It seemed like there was some sense of peace with what is unfolding moment by moment – i.e., that you are learning so much so fast from Rori about self-love, non-blame, acceptance, letting go of control, etc. You are also being gentle with yourself when you recognize that you are doing these things imperfectly and are still learning. You seem to be fairly open and relatively undefended. 🙂

    I could be wrong of course, as I don’t really know you and have only read a little bit! But that was my impression.

    ~ Melanie

  410.  #410Sara on June 30, 2013 at 1:17 pm

    lol I know right…. I am still laughing about that myself. I thank you for helping me with a witty response…. It’s funny cause he comes up with the craziest things like that he says or does to me… and I always laugh and ponder on how to answer… If you like the teeth story you should here the story about the ticket he came up with and fined me with….. lol

    Well if nothing else with my guy I can keep posting the crazy things that he comes up with to get me to talk to him or to stop me from being mad at him…. and we can all get a great laugh out of it!!!!

    OH and don’t ever feel bad for laughing cause that is usually what I do first…. then try to figure out the best way to go about it…. Thanks again for your witty response.
    I am sure he is still sleeping cause I have not heard back from him but I will be sure to keep you posted on the tooth saga!!!!

  411.  #411Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    @Melanie – Thank you . 🙂 I think I’m really open to a lot. That is really different about me from the past. I may come on here one day and be like….OMG! I’m totally wrong in my thinking! I feel really good that there is a place where I can just sort of change my mind, and have that not be a big deal because I”m in the process of learning. I am not gentle on myself though, I can tell you that – I’m really hard on myself. I need to work on that.

    @Sara – I combat EVERYTHING with humor. Its a self defense mechanism I”m sure. When we left his office to go to the park, (and you have to remember this is when it was very still up in the air and serious in the conversation….) I looked at him and cracked up and said “Cant you just be normal?” LOL. And he totally cracked up and was like “Hey I am being normal.” And we just were laughing. So, I know that isnt a siren thing to say, but its who I am. I looked at him at one point, and said, Ok I’m totally confused, are we pushing pause? Are we not pushing pause? What in H*ll are we doing? LOL.

    Then, the best was when we had talked for about 3 hours and then we came back, and within one minute of me sitting down, he came over and just hugged me and said – I love you with tears in his eyes. And I said, What are you doing? and he laughed and said, I just needed to come over and tell you that. I said thank you….and we had this “moment.” And then I said, “But the real question is……do you have any food for me because I”m STARVING after all this talking.” And he cracked up (and gave me half of his lunch) Anyway…. Its just who I am. 🙂

  412.  #412BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 2:05 pm

    Elsie and Sara,
    I feel at a loss, and I feel challenged.
    Please help me understand here –
    where did I come across as being condescending, exactly?
    Where did I come up with an analogy as to why you are an idiot?
    Where did I yell at you?

    I feel a sincere, humble desire to understand where you are coming from here.

  413.  #413BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 2:06 pm

    Sara, can you show me where you thought I was rubbing salt in the wound?

    Thank you,

  414.  #414Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 2:20 pm

    @BeLoved: Just because you are asking: You wrote in your post to me:
    You felt “horrified” at my decision. You “wouldnt want to work with me” whatever that means. You wrote that this man has made some sort of promise he will never hurt me. NO. He has said quote “I will do my best for the rest of my life to never hurt you.” There is HUGE difference. You wrote I put him on a pedastal. Ummm….what?

    You wrote that YOU feel concerned for MY mental health Umm…Ok. and that and that I’m quote “so disconnected from reality…..” etc.

    Anyway – you wanted to know. All of that is VERY condescending.

    Again, I’m sorry you are horrified. But frankly, when you talked about Orgasmic Meditation I was truly horrified that you would let a complete stranger have sexual relations with you. I didnt say ONE WORD about it on here because frankly, its none of my business, and I didnt have anything positive or helpful to say so I sort of said nothing.

    Anyway – you wanted to know, so I’ve told you. 🙂

    I also 100% disagree with Byron Katies work. I know some sirens on here love her. I dont. I think her “work” is bananas. I’ve read A LOT on her and her work because I kept thinking there is more there and maybe I just dont get it. Thats not the case. I totally get it – I just think its bonkers. (I’m being nice.) LOL.

    anyway – BeLoved, clearly you and I are very different people, and thats ok!!!! We have all different paths to follow, and I think you are truly trying to be helpful, but I think you just came off a bit rough.

    Just letting you know, but hey, I can take it. 🙂 I listen, and then either agree, disagree, and then move on. 🙂

    I know you mean no harm, and dont want to hurt anyone – that would be silly to waste so much time on a forum if you were just trying to be mean. So I know you are coming from a good place. 🙂

  415.  #415Luzydel on June 30, 2013 at 2:24 pm

    Came back from vacation! I feel so good and optimistic! yayyy me! I feel so proud of myself for pushing my own boundaries and just do something for me!

  416.  #416Sara on June 30, 2013 at 2:31 pm

    You are taking everything literally… there was no exact thing that you said that was like you literally put salt in a wound. Just I felt like it was a little abrasive to your answer. That is it. I sounded like Elsie was wrong and had no reason to be happy about the outcome that she had had in that moment. Maybe even a little judgemental… but that is just how I feel. I am happy that she is happy on how her conversation had worked out with her man. I understand that everyone has there own opinions on how and what… I look at the posts as support; venting and maybe a little of reassurance… like I said I read your post to her and it stung. It stung me. And it had nothing to do with me. But it did make me feel uneasy about posting my own situation. Maybe I am wrong… I was looking at this blog as a help me build myself up… and for help and understanding… Maybe I took your post out of context and maybe it came across the wrong way…
    I hope that this helps you understand… xoxo Sara

  417.  #417BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 2:48 pm

    Given that, even though it was invited by Elsie, my response was outside of the blog guidelines, and it’s clear that what I bring to the table isn’t wanted, respected, welcome, or taken seriously…I’d like to just drop it from here.

    Elsie, I will refrain from responding to any of your posts from here on out.

    It isn’t meant to be a place for “description, advice, opinions and reporting” per Rori’s guidelines anyway, and I feel best when I stay within those guidelines.


  418.  #418BeLoved on June 30, 2013 at 2:49 pm

    Sara – I feel so soft reading your post, thank you

  419.  #419Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 2:56 pm

    @BeLoved – I wrote a lot, but then deleted. While you and I have very different points of view and paths in life, I do not think your opinion is not wanted, respected, welcome or taken seriously. I’m sorry you feel like that.

    I may not agree with your opinion, but you are more than welcome to always chime in on my situation. Its just that your opinion came with a piercing tone that was not necessary to get your point across. I think actually you had some good points about what I need to think about and get clear on – so thank you.

    And for what its worth, its VERY hard not to give opinions on here – I know I do it all the time. We all are sort of invovled with each other here and I sincerely believe we want the best for each other – otherwise why would we spend so much time here? 🙂

  420.  #420Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 3:22 pm

    HUGE revelation. I’m reading something right now, and I’ll copy and paste it in a minute but I had a HUGE huge HUGE revelation.

    I always thought that once I lost weight, I would be happy. Silly and stupid I know. But I thought, ok, once this external factor is “solved” I will be happy. I literally thought every break up or bad thing in my life was because of my weight.

    Well, huh. Interesting. I’m a size 6 now. And I still have problems. Making me realize that looking for external validation is never enough – not from a dress size, a promotion, or another person (read: a boy.)

    It has to come from within me. Wow. I know people say that all the time, but I never really “got” that until this moment when I thought about it in terms of my weight loss.

  421.  #421Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 3:30 pm

    From Meet your Sweet:

    Do you ever catch yourself thinking that
    ‘insecurity is just a part of life’?

    Or that, on some days, you feel STRONG and
    GREAT about yourself… but that on other days, you
    don’t have a lot of control over how secure and
    strong you feel… and that you’re pretty much at
    the mercy of these powerful emotions?

    Have you ever felt yourself asking, even
    BEGGING, for ‘approval’ or praise from someone in
    your life (usually, a man) only to have it
    backfire on you?

    Maybe he becomes more distant over time…
    maybe you start to ‘drift apart’… maybe the
    ‘balance’ in the relationship shifts and he
    becomes more critical and dissatisfied for no
    apparent reason.

    This is no coincidence. When it comes to
    attracting, and sustaining, quality relationships
    into your life, a strong sense of confidence in
    yourself is not only SEXY, but it’s actually

    Without it, you begin to be motivated by things
    like INSECURITY… and you inadvertently fuel
    things like NEEDINESS… and often, this happens
    without you even realizing it.

    And for most men, ‘neediness’ and ‘insecurity’
    are the ENEMIES of attraction, and can literally
    kill a relationship.

    If you’ve ever had a man tell you he needs
    ‘space’ before, you’ll know what I’m talking

    It’s near-impossible to feel attraction for
    someone who’s bought into the habit of acting like
    a second-class citizen – i.e. someone who’s
    lacking in CERTAINTY about themselves.

    Question: did you know that, in a lot of ways,
    men and women are more alike than you may have

    Yeah, I’ll vouch for the fact that our BRAINS
    and BODIES are literally constructed differently,
    and that we have different instincts and reactions
    to many situations.

    But in other situations, we literally have
    almost the SAME THOUGHTS.

    One area that this is HUGELY TRUE of is the
    area of ATTRACTION. Men and women both tend to be
    attracted to members of the opposite sex who
    appear to be ‘high value’ on the social scale.

    In other words, who act on a consistent level
    as though they are ‘worth something’ and that they
    expect a certain level of respect and value from
    others at ALL TIMES. No exceptions.

    Unfortunately, many women are predisposed to
    feeling ‘needy’ or ‘insecure’ about themselves …
    which tends to kick any ability to act with
    confidence directly in the butt.

    I’d venture to say that most women are affected
    by a lack of self-confidence on a near-daily

    Even for the most confident woman, situations
    are still going to arise where she gets knocked
    into a situation of uncertainty or overwhelmed from
    time to time…

    …and this is when those thoughts like, ‘I
    don’t know what I’m doing, I’m not good enough,
    what do I do now’ start to surface.

    And this happens more and more frequently to
    those of us who believe, on some level, that
    self-confidence is something that just ‘happens
    naturally’ as a RESULT of the kinds of success
    that you’re enjoying in your life.

    In other words, the belief that if you are
    ‘good enough’, then you will have a REASON to feel
    self-confident, and so you will BECOME confident
    as a result of that.

    No, no, no!!

    This is NOT true – and in fact, it’s absolutely
    CRIPPLING when it comes to your own, authentic

    The fact of the matter is that the CONFIDENCE
    is what comes FIRST … and THEN you get the

    If you’re not confident about something in your
    life – perhaps you feel anxious, insecure, or
    afraid about relationships, men, your job, money –
    know this: what you feel ABOUT something is a
    reflection of how you feel about YOURSELF.

    In other words, it’s an inherent part of WHO
    YOU ARE.

    If you are feeling fearful or insecure ‘about
    something’ in your life, your mind will try to
    trick you into believing that, as soon as that
    thing or circumstance goes away, those fears and
    that insecurity will go away, too.

    But the mind-boggling truth is that they won’t.
    They will simply latch onto something ELSE. And
    thus, you’ll become trapped in an ongoing rat race
    of fear, insecurity, and mental turbulence, while
    continuing to wait for X to happen so that those
    feelings will leave you alone …


    If you are experiencing fear or insecurity,
    it’s not a reflection of your LIFE and what’s
    happening in it. It is a reflection of YOU and the
    relationship you have with yourself.

    A major cause of this ongoing ‘rat race’ of
    insecurity and doubt is doing what MOST PEOPLE on
    this planet do, and looking for ‘validation’ or
    ‘approval’ from other people.

    A.k.a., ‘proof’ that you are a
    good/attractive/smart/insert-adjective-here woman.

    Unfortunately, when you look EXTERNALLY for the
    solution, it never comes … and you simply end up
    polluting each day with needy, desperate,
    fear-motivated actions, driving great men, great
    PEOPLE, and great situations AWAY from you, and
    NEVER getting any closer to being truly confident
    and OK with who you are.

    It’s a self-perpetuating state, in other words.

    However! There is a really easy way to get in
    tune with your own strength, your OWN approval,
    and your own confidence … in such a way that
    literally ALL neediness, all clinginess, and all
    fear-based behaviors are INSTANTLY rendered null
    and void.

    Here it is.

    First of all: you’ve got to become AWARE of the
    fact that the answer does not lie ‘without’. There
    is no person and no situation anywhere on Earth
    that can fill that void within you. You are never
    going to get ‘enough’, and you are never going to
    be ‘secure’, until you recognize that the answer
    is not OUT THERE…

    …it’s inside YOU.

    And step two: you’ve got to realize that YOU
    are the one with the power here. When YOU decide
    to stop relying externally for validation and
    approval, and you decide to give it to YOURSELF,
    you literally retrain your brain into accepting
    that ‘right now’ is all there is.

    And when you connect the dots like this,
    something absolutely MAGICAL starts to happen.

    It’s like plugging up a hole where all your
    strength and irresistibility had been draining
    away. The second you realize on a gut level that
    ‘enough’ lies within YOU, and that all you have to
    do is STOP looking for it elsewhere, that thirst
    for ‘more’ just… goes away.

    When you are able to draw your strength from
    within yourself, and stop TRYING SO HARD to get it
    from other people, several extremely liberating
    and interesting things begin to happen.

    Firstly: all your mental ‘noise’ calms down and
    you instantly shed all the fear, and all the
    desperate need for control, that comes when your
    ‘sense of self’ and your ‘security’ come from
    EXTERNAL FACTORS like jobs, money, position,
    looks, and what other people say or think.

    You no longer talk and act out of a place of
    FEAR… and this happens unconsciously.
    Effortlessly. And yes, other people notice. You
    begin to ever-so-quietly assume control of your
    own life and your own irresistible, authentic
    attraction to the people and situations that you

    Secondly: you begin to exude the kind of
    natural magnetism that literally DRAWS PEOPLE (men
    AND women) to you, without even TRYING.


    Imagine, for a second, what kind of a result
    this ‘effortless magnetism’ could have on your
    love life.


    Let me ask you a question.

    Have you ever had a period in your life when
    you’ve been very hard on yourself about something?

    If so, you’ll probably have noticed that,
    around about this time, OTHER PEOPLE began to be
    quite hard on you, too.

    This is far from coincidental.

    What you feel and believe, you attract more of.
    (In this case, because you were being hard on
    yourself, you threw out the welcome mat for
    criticism and similarly harsh treatment from

    And, of course, the converse is also true. When
    you stop asking for something as basic as approval
    from other people, and start giving it to
    YOURSELF, a funny thing happens: you start to get
    more of it from other people than you would have
    previously thought possible.

    So if you DITCH all the negative, fear-based
    ‘noise’ taking place in your mind… and make a
    conscious decision to STOP TRYING SO HARD to get
    approval or validation from others … and use your
    OWN opinion and your OWN feelings as a gauge for
    how you’re doing in love and life…

    … then you will attract, EFFORTLESSLY, people
    and situations into your life that will support
    you in this new-found empowerment.

    You’ll also find that this approach to life has
    a massive effect on the level of PURE ATTRACTION.

    Most women are aware, on some level, of the
    fact that acting insecure, and begging a man to
    validate you or praise you, are ‘bad’.

    But this doesn’t leave you with a lot of scope
    for when life gets in the way and screws up all
    those ‘rules’ that you’ve got in place about how
    you ‘should’ feel or behave.

    For example: let’s say you’re feeling really
    low or really insecure about something. According
    to the ‘insecurity is bad’ rule, you’ve got two
    choices: either you can do what MOST women do, and
    give in to your feelings of insecurity, and go
    ahead and ask him in one way or another to
    validate you, praise you, or otherwise ‘rescue you
    from yourself’…

    …and then, usually, justify it to yourself
    afterwards on an emotional level because you
    didn’t know how else to make yourself feel better…

    …OR, you could simply point-blank refuse to
    seek approval or validation from anyone, but,
    without a strong backup plan, continue to FEEL

    Neither of those options is appealing.

    On the OTHER hand, when you’re able to take
    care of INSECURITY and UNCERTAINTY at the ROOT:
    meaning, that you stop asking from others what
    you’re not willing to give yourself… and you stop
    looking EXTERNALLY for ‘the answer’…

    … and you stop buying into the TRAP that, if
    you just ‘try hard enough’ or ‘wait long enough’,
    those bad feelings (and the way they make you act)
    will finally stop plaguing you…

    …THEN, you put yourself in an unassailable and
    CONSISTENT position of complete power over
    yourself and your world. (Read: you become
    IRRESISTIBLY attractive.)

    To do this, you’ve simply got to become aware
    that the only way to truly eradicate anxiety and
    insecurity, and the effects that these things have
    on your behavior and your relationships, is to
    simply STOP looking for ‘proof’ from outward
    sources, and decide to become your own ‘tower of

    YOU are now the one who will decide what is
    ‘OK’ and what is ‘not OK’. Not anybody else. You
    now come first. Period.

    And guess what? Things like insecurity and
    anxiety disappear as a NATURAL BYPRODUCT of this
    new approach – along with all the
    attraction-killing neediness, clinginess, and
    jealousy that you may have UNWITTINGLY been
    enacting up til now.

    In practical terms, this means that you will
    experience an ever-so-subtle change in your
    everyday life that really top-quality human beings
    (of both genders) will sit up and take notice of.

    This is real emotional hardball we’re talking
    about here: the ‘intangibles’ that mean SO MUCH,
    and that go such a long way, but that you can’t
    ‘fake’. It’s got to be the real deal.

    When you’re no longer operating out of a place
    of FEAR, and you’re no longer scrabbling to get
    ‘enough’ of anything, everything about the way you
    interact with your life shifts just a LITTLE BIT…

    …and you literally empower yourself to put
    your best foot forward, make decisions that are
    appropriate to you and your life, and exude an
    understated, but unmistakable, ‘real-deal’

    THIS is the kind of confidence that really
    attracts top-notch men. It’s the kind of
    confidence that’s based on a genuine acceptance of

    Question: have you ever noticed that it’s very
    difficult to make any kind of lasting change,
    unless you feel accepted in and of yourself

    Same thing goes here. Until you accept
    YOURSELF, and your own opinion of yourself, nobody
    else will either. And that’s the kind of thing
    that keeps you stuck in the same repetitive,
    destructive habits and behavior… TRYING to change
    … but not understanding why it’s not happening


    That’s OK. This is some pretty deep stuff, and
    it can take a while to get your head around. But
    here’s the basic layout:

    1. Fear and insecurity are UNATTRACTIVE. They
    convey to other people the idea that you are
    somehow ‘less than’, and encourage other people to
    treat you as if this were true.

    2. Most people live their daily lives out of
    fear and anxiety, believing that if they can just
    get X to happen (promotion, new relationship, shed
    a dress size), those negative feelings will go away
    and they’ll be ‘happy’.

    3. This is not true. Fear and anxiety, if
    you’re feeling them, are a reflection of YOURSELF
    and how you habitually deal with the world, NOT a
    reflection of what’s happening in your life.

    4. Until you change how you deal with yourself
    at a root level, you will never be able to change
    those behaviors and will continue to be at the
    mercy of insecurity and anxiety.

    5. As long as you continue to feel these
    negative emotions, you will be likely to act in a
    way that highlights that insecurity. These actions
    usually come to the forefront around men, and can
    poison your ability to create lasting, fulfilling,
    healthy relationships.

    6. When your actions are motivated by
    insecurity and/or anxiety, this shows through to
    the man (or men) in your life … usually in the
    form of VALIDATION-SEEKING, which is often
    perceived as ‘weakness’ and proof that you are
    somehow lacking on some level. Needless to say,
    this usually drives quality people AWAY from you.

    7. The only way to ensure that your behavior is
    consistently coming from a place of HIGH VALUE and
    CONFIDENCE is to deal with insecurity at the root:
    by recognizing the need to adjust your
    relationship with yourself, to stop asking others
    to give you what you won’t give yourself, and to
    look WITHIN YOURSELF instead of externally for
    security and confidence.

    8. Once this happens, all the behaviors you
    didn’t even know about that were tainted with
    anxiety, insecurity, or fear, literally VANISH.
    Instead, you exude an innate strength and
    confidence that not only draws positive situations
    and people into your life, but that men find VERY

    Make sense?


    Oh, and if you want some more practical tips on
    exactly HOW to incorporate this incredibly
    liberating approach into your own life, then you
    should check THIS out:

    How to be Supremely Self Confident

    …and I’ll write again soon!

    With love,

    Mirabelle Summers


  422.  #422prplpsn28 on June 30, 2013 at 4:15 pm

    Elsie – Thank you for being concerned 🙂 I’m happy to hear that your talk with your guy went well and that you are happy with the outcome. If you are genuinely happy then that’s what counts

    My reaction last night to my situation stemmed basically from something H “did not” say. We have been communicating again this afternoon, him initiating, and things are going well. He sent me a text to let me know that he was boarding the plane in Florida to come home and just now sent another one to let me know he has landed at the airport. So he will be home within the hour. Not sure when we will see each other. I’m sure he’s wiped out.

  423.  #423Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 5:17 pm

    @Prplprsn: well, that can be really hard to NOT hear what you want to hear. Since I’ve been following your story, I wonder if it has to do with committment etc. I know you and I are in a similar position in many ways. We both sort of have ideas about expectations etc.

    And I’m not sure that I’m super HAPPY with the outcome. I’m still trying to sort out my feelings about Friday. There are moments that I feel relaxed and happy, and then there are moments where I feel like maybe I am settling for crumbs. And then I go back to thinking – no, I saw his face, I trust him, no one on the board here could see him, feel him, touch him, know him. But then I go to the other side, and think – maybe I’m deluding myself and he will never be enough for me.

    I have emotional whiplash. LOL!!!!

  424.  #424prplpsn28 on June 30, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    Elsie – I can understand completely what your saying.

    What H didn’t say actually had to do with my health issue. He knew I was having problems fri night and he did express his concern then. But then I guess I felt uncared about when I didn’t hear from him at all on sat. I guess I felt he would check to see how I was. Maybe just my issue. I’m still a work in progress working on my own insecurities.

  425.  #425Dominique on June 30, 2013 at 5:41 pm

    Elsie – and others – here’s an old article on insecurity. it may help shed more light on this, something we all tend to share in now and then – or more often.



  426.  #426Luzydel on June 30, 2013 at 5:58 pm

    I am closer to love! dunno if a man will ever stick around longer than three months or even “forever” (I am starting to dislike “forever”) But every time I focus on me and forget about the men in my surrounding, I feel great. I do not fix myself every time a man is close by me anymore, because I do not need to impress him, I do not feel anxious about meeting him here or there! I am just enjoying myself and making things about me…

    Real self love is “selfish”! The truth is that I miss the physical connection of a man (though I can deal without it if I have to), but I will not use a man or let a man use me just because I feel h*rny!

    Living in the NOW is magical!

  427.  #427Rori Raye on June 30, 2013 at 6:15 pm

    Bianca – Welcome, and it’s hard to give you romantic advice when you have so little options money-wise. He would, I assume, have to give you some financial support, but it might not be enough. If this were me – I’d stay married, be as sweet and lovely and sexy and not angry to my husband as possible, try to find a job – part time at least. If I had some money coming in – I’d be able to choose. As it is – going on welfare sounds like the least appealing option. Love, Rori

  428.  #428Millie on June 30, 2013 at 6:16 pm

    Elsie 417 thank you for this….this is so wonderful and I’m beginning to notice what I do when I feel overwhelmed with anxiety. I do reach out…it doesn’t feel good. Even when someone attempts to help. I don’t feel better. This is such good advice! Thanks xo

  429.  #429Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 6:22 pm

    @Purple: I can totally see how you would feel like he wasnt thinking about you on Sat. A smiliar thing happened to me several weeks ago. He sat up with me on gmail talking about a horrible issue that I was going through until 1:30am in the morning. It felt wonderful that he was there for me. But then he didnt check in the next day. That felt crummy, so I understand.

    Dominique – I’m interested to hear your take on what happened Friday. You always have a soft, gentle way of putting things and somehow I always glean so much from what advice you do offer.

    i’m off to read your article right now!!!

  430.  #430Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 6:28 pm

    Luzydel welcome back. Hope you enjoyed yourself and had some new experiences.

  431.  #431Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 6:31 pm

    @Dominique – I just read your article on insecurities. I guess since I have lost so much weight I am not AS insecure when it comes to that. For my age, I dont look bad, thank you very much. 🙂

    But I’m insecure and have the nasty negative voices about who I am, what I should do, the decisions I should make, what I should settle for, what my boundaries are, whether I will find eternal love, etc.

  432.  #432Mercedes on June 30, 2013 at 6:32 pm

    Rori: I never thought I would read words indicating a woman should stay with a man for money on this blog…or any other relationship blog for that matter. And to see you tell a woman who’s husband is (probably) cheating on her to “be as sweet and lovely and sexy and not angry to my husband as possible”! Ugh! I find that absolutely horrible! I’m shocked you would even suggest it. It’s like you agree that all hope is lost. It ISN’T. And just because a woman doesn’t have her own money doesn’t mean she has to pretend it is!!

    Bianca: Do you have any friends or family who can help you out of this situation? Children or siblings? The girlfriend you speak of in your question? At the very least, I would suggest you move into a different bedroom in your home, get on the internet (and out in the world) and find your own “just friends”. Flirt. Enjoy them. Enjoy men. See what is really out there for you! This is not enough for you and I wouldn’t AT ALL recommend just staying there and being all sweet.

    Please,start doing your own thing. Loving yourself and finding a network of people who feel love for you. Sweet, lovely, sexy and not angry are good energies to direct…if it were me though…I’d direct them at someone worth my time.

    Do good things for yourself. Love yourself…please. Bubble baths, light candles, play your favorite music, give yourself a home facial with lovely natural products, get a new haircut and a new dress, take yourself out for dinner or a cup of coffee and smile at everyone you meet. Enjoy LIFE! This is it! This is YOUR life. PLEASE…do not be a victim to all this. Enchant yourself and others will be enchanted by you.

    Please take care…and as I said, at the very, very least, move into your own space…even if it is in the home you share with him.

    Much Love,

  433.  #433Sara on June 30, 2013 at 7:05 pm

    My heart go’s out to you!! 41 years wow. I know that money is a issue but there are plenty of things that you can do for you that don’t cost a thing. Take long baths… feel the water… think of it as cleansing you; your aura; soul… I think of it as washing everything bad away. Bad feelings, thoughts… whatever you want to get rid of. I usually have a good cry. Then I pull the drain and watch all the bad things drain away from me. Than I do my hair and make-up. ( I always feel better when I put a little of time into my self). Then I just go out. Doesn’t matter where but I usually walk… just walk. If there is a park walk there. In the grass take your whose off and walk. Or find a quite spot and sit… look around; really look. My mind will go crazy and think of everything that is bothering but if your really looking at the wonderful nature around you think of what what would make you truly happy… put a plan together, or just ponder over what it is what you really want. This is not going to fix your situation but at least it makes me feel better or gives me clarity on what it is that I want. I do agree to go out get out of the house. When ever you get aggravated. Just go change the environment for you.
    I truly hope that you at least try it. You may have to drag yourself out and not feel like going out in the world when you feel crummy but just try it…
    🙂 I don’t know what you believe but I will ask my angels to help guide you and give you strength.
    Please keep us posted…
    Xoxoxo Sara

  434.  #434Erika Awakening on June 30, 2013 at 7:37 pm

    oh God, I really went into the feelings and I feel exhausted … so much anger … and then the grief … I cried … now I feel limp like a rag doll limp … and still all that sadness in my heart

    I can also feel him, I feel connected

  435.  #435Zia on June 30, 2013 at 7:48 pm

    Bianca – if you have to live on welfare to start with, do it. As long as you have enough income to find somewhere to live, and pay your bills, then its a start. Don’t ever let money stop you from doing what you want to do. I’m a single mother working part time and also on a pension, and yes it is tough but I’m making it work and it is SO EMPOWERING to be living my own life and making my own decisions.

  436.  #436Zia on June 30, 2013 at 7:48 pm

    Bianca – if you have to live on welfare to start with, do it. As long as you have enough income to find somewhere to live, and pay your bills, then its a start. Don’t ever let money stop you from doing what you want to do. I’m a single mother working part time and also on a pension, and yes it is tough but I’m making it work and it is SO EMPOWERING to be living my own life and making my own decisions.

  437.  #437Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 7:58 pm

    @Mercedes – I agree with you. I felt the same thing when I read what Rori wrote. There are times where being soft, kind, gentle are just NOT what is called for. Although I understand being trapped for financial reasons, it doesnt have to be forever. The escape game plan can be part of what makes her feel good about herself that she is thinking about HER future and what she needs to do to get to where SHE needs to be.

    I love your self-esteem Mercedes. It just oozes through your posts. When I grow up I want to be you. LOL 🙂

  438.  #438Xti on June 30, 2013 at 8:01 pm

    Hi Elsie 🙂
    I rarely post but I read as many as I can, and I hope that I might say something that you find helpful.

    I met a really great guy when I was on vacation 2 years ago. I was separated, working through a bitter divorce/custody fight and I was not “looking” at all. I had actually just gone through a major let down with a man I was hoping to reconnect with from years ago, and the vacation was me sort of regrouping and figuring out what to do.

    The man I met was also separated and we met at the pool. He wasn’t “looking” either, as he was only there to care for a relative in the hospital. But we started talking… and he liked me. I wasn’t sure about him, but I was very much practicing the Rori tools and just decided to be open and leaning back.

    The short story is that he ended up flying to see me several times over 6 months and I flew back to see him (we lived 5,000 miles apart) and we had a mutually supportive and very loving relationship over the course of a year.

    He managed to file for divorce and wrap his situation up about 6 months before I did– but there were many challenges we both faced throughout the time we had together.

    Here’s what I hope to offer you: I never doubted for one second he wanted to be with me. I was secure in his feelings for me and knew he wanted me and only me. The reason? He showed me constantly.

    He even had his ex-wife living with him for a time, but he went out of his way to always make me feel like he wanted to be with me. He did loving things to demonstrate his feelings and he kept up the communication.

    He very much rowed our boat!

    All I had to do was follow my heart and trust that if we were meant to be, we would be. The more I leaned back in the relationship, the more he stepped up.

    My family and friends understood and they were all very happy for me, but there were plenty of people on the outside who didn’t see how it worked.

    Ok, that’s the happy side. On the sad side, I had so much work to do on myself that I ended up feeling like I had to break it off. He was getting in deeper and deeper and I was struggling to breathe because it felt too good.

    But! Even as I say that it didn’t end in happily ever after for us… the silver lining is that we both did an incredible amount of good for each other in the time we spent together. He has moved on and is now in a serious relationship and says he’s happy and doing well.

    I’m still single, but working on my issues and CDing when I can. Two dates set up for this coming week–woohoo!

    And I can honestly say that we are in a good place together now, even though we’re not together, because *we* both know what we went through, what we meant to each other, and how it changed us.

    It’s worth the risk if you truly follow your heart. That was the biggest and best thing I gained out of it–along with getting so much better at using the tools.

    Thanks to that great man, I have a new standard for what it means to be treated well by a guy. I’m forever grateful to him for showing me what it feels like to really be loved.

    If you are feeling anything like that with your guy, I encourage you to just keep following your heart. I believe you have the answers inside of you, and trusting yourself feels so empowering.

    🙂 Xti

  439.  #439Erika Awakening on June 30, 2013 at 8:12 pm

    Something I really notice too … I feel way more in my feelings when I’m not giving advice here … It’s a very big contrast in feeling. Even relating to other posts feels like “work” right now rather than surrender …

  440.  #440Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 8:17 pm

    Xti: THANK YOU for sharing that. I did feel EXACTLY that way about him – exactly – just until the last couple of weeks. I guess I will have to see what happens from here on out.

    I know this. No matter what happens, this man was there for me in a way that no one else on Earth has ever been in a time when I really needed it most in my life. If we dont end up working out – its not because he is a toxic horrible man. It will be just because we arent meant to be. I will never say anything to disparage what we had. It was and is still … very real and very important.

    Thank you so much for that story. It means a lot!

  441.  #441Xti on June 30, 2013 at 8:20 pm

    Elsie 🙂
    I’m so glad you could relate and it felt good for you to read my story.

    Thanks for telling me. You made me smile really big!


  442.  #442Femininewoman on June 30, 2013 at 8:26 pm

    Mercedes I wonder how it would benefit Bianca to be angry at her husband. She is already angry. Being righteously indignant might be the right thing to be. Then what? Anger only destroys the vessel that holds it. I know of a woman who died of breast cancer at 35. Angry with her husband who she told to go ahead and get sex outside because she refused to sleep with him and had a kid sleeping between them. He took her advice because he was not getting what he needed in the marriage and she ended up angry. I am sure there is more to Bianca’s story and I can’t see how being angry or righteously indignant will help her regain her relationship if that is what she wants.

  443.  #443Elsie on June 30, 2013 at 8:26 pm

    Xti – I guess I’m confused why you broke it off because it felt too good? Just curious. 🙂

  444.  #444Xti on June 30, 2013 at 8:36 pm

    Elsie – It’s a long story, but the simple version is that it was my 3rd divorce, and after moving nearer to my guy for health reasons, I couldn’t handle the closeness. He wanted to be with me as much as he could and was prepared to commit to me forever. I, on the other hand, was just starting to come up for air after nearly suffocating in a terrible marriage.

    I had done a lot of work previously after my other divorces, but it was all psychotherapy–not coaching. I was missing some critical information that I gained from working first with Rori, and it expanded with working with other coaches.

    What I started to see was that I was nowhere near being ready for a relationship with him (or anyone but myself) and it felt cruel to continue with him, once I realized it.

    I broke both our hearts when I ended it. But after a year apart, I wrote him a long letter taking responsibility for my part in every way I could and I gave him answers to his questions too. It took me that long to even see my part. He said it hurt for a long time, but he also learned a great deal. We’re on good terms now.