Why We Overfunction for Love and How Change GETS You Love

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I recently re-read Harriet Lerner’s book The Dance of Intimacy, and got her personal permission to give you some of the passages I found to be incredibly powerful for us.

Here, Harriet is talking about overfunctioning, and she’s used several real-life situations women with their families and with the men in their relationships.

This passage starts with the heading:

“Why Change?”

From where, then, does the overfunctioner find the will to change?… change can be a profoundly difficult and anxiety-arousing business. As frequently as not, the motivation is just not there or it runs out after the initial push. And understandably so. Where will we get the courage, to say nothing of the motivation, to begin to modify our overfunctioning ways?

Why change if we are sitting at the top of the emotional seesaw, if we can avoid the full impact of our own unfinished business by focusing on the other, if we can derive that secret feeling of self-righteousness from diagnosing others and being “right,” or if we are the “insider” that the family talks to (“Let me tell you what your brother did now!”) rather than about?

It’s a real dilemma. The will not to change is often particularly powerful in chronic overfunctioners. First, we tend not to see that we have a problem: We have only tried to be helpful to that other person, and if we have distanced or cut off, it is only after being convinced that we’ve tried all possibilities…. we cannot see how we are contributing to a painfully stuck relationship pattern because we cannot imagine (and may not really want to imagine) another way of relating. We may even be convinced that the other party cannot survive without our help (“My sister wouldn’t eat if I didn’t buy her groceries”).

Second, we do not know how to modify our overfunctioning pattern. We may have no clear instructions, no well-marked roadmap, and no trained coach to guide us over the rough spots. In all probability, we may lack a realistic assessment of just how tough the going can get — if we really get going.

Finally, it is emotionally painful to modify a chronic overfunctioning pattern. As we will see, it may evoke strong feelings of depression, anxiety, and anger as our own vulnerabilities and needs come rushing to the surface — and who needs that! It’s understandably hard to tolerate short-term pain, even for the promise of a more whole and ground itself later on.

Yet some of us do find the will to change…. such change requires us to move against our wish to fix things and aour even stronger wish for distance once we find we can’t fix things. But perhaps the most difficult aspect of modifying an overfunctioning pattern is to share our vulnerability with the underfunctioning person and to relate to that person’s competence.

Here’s my two cents:

So — can you see how brave you are!

It’s not your fault that you are an overfunctioner. It’s the way you learned to cope.

The way you learned to try to get what you wanted and what you needed.

And now, the time for this is all done!

Now, we’re going to shift all of this for you by slowly letting out your vulnerability, your lovely authenticity, your lovely feelingness, your beautiful girlness – all of it.

Even the stuff you don’t think you’re going to like. And we’re going to love it all.

And so is HE!

If you do this in baby steps, the way we’re working at it here — the anxiety, the depression, all the things we fear that just the FEAR of them is holding us back from being who we really are, the things that Harriet tells us are underneath our need to overfunction — you can move through all of this so much more easily than you can imagine.

Sometimes, just “sinking in” to your feelings does the trick. Sometimes that’s scary feeling isn’t really all that terrifying! And sometimes, it is — but it doesn’t last as long as we fear it will.

Everything is “mutable.” Meaning, it can change.

It can shift. It can morph.

I believe that even bacteria inside our bodies can morph. In some later post I go into the science of this, but — briefly, “bad germs” can turn into “good germs” and back to “bad” again.

The fact that it exists does not necessarily make anything “bad.”

Sometimes, it’s the way we deal with what is that creates our experience.

I loved Harriet’s work around all of this. I found it all profound and encouraging, and the scenarios and situations and stories she tells and the healing steps she lays out are very helpful in explaining what’s going on — and how we got here.

I especially like the way she frames relating to an underfunctioning man’s competence. This is what my whole “4 Rules” crucial Tool is about – it’s a simple way to keep from relating to what we perceive as his incompetence — and stops the damage instantly.

Being willing to be vulnerable and open with a man automatically relates to his competence. It says you trust yourself in his presence.

So keep going!! Baby steps rule!!

You can read more about Harriet and her work on her site – HarrietLerner.com

Love, Rori

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  1.  #1Daria on May 21, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    yay i really like that “bad” germs can turn to “good” haha clik! i will use that for my healing

  2.  #2Daria on May 21, 2010 at 4:49 pm


    so i got a man on the phone long distance who is very spiritual according to his page profile

    i thought this was good but

    i wound up feeling judged by him a lot

    and also feeling jdugemental

    i feel worried

    he said at one point that maybe im just used to a man thinking im so attractive that they will just take on my mind and be quiet


    i feel triggered by this

    maybe on an outer level i am?

    but on an inner level i would like a man i can feel safe with

    for example we had a discussion about him talking about women wearing inappropriate clothes in public (he doesn’t like this)

    and gay children (he doesn’t belive this)

    so this feels bad

    on the other hand,

    a bunch of other stuff feels good…

    and many men DO have these kinds of judgements and beliefs, but they haven’t Really bothered me cuz it did not seem to be a problem…

    with this man however… he seems really Honest… so i feel concerned like im wanting him to be perfect or…

    i dont feel comfortable with the judgements… is it because of the Mind thing?

    seriously ive had other guys express judgements to me and my voice was like “eh they’ll get over it”

    but here its like “oh no! I don’t want this potential wonderful person to restrict and limit himself”

    and we talked about

    how i think if something feels good… then it IS good,

    and how pleasure is important

    and he thinks other stuff… like that people nowadays are “loose” and making choices that are destructive to themselves and society

    he talked about having class

    i told him im with the no class movement


    i know men are different than us and so they will have other ideas…

    they are in THOUGHTS…


    i feel lost

    what is the message?

  3.  #3Laughing goddess on May 21, 2010 at 5:15 pm

    Hey Daria!!! I feel so happy to share a siren pow-wow with you!

    Man! What’s the message?!?!

    Maybe he’s showing up to help you further clarify what you are wanting in a man…a man who is spiritual but also open-minded like you.

    Or maybe…

    Well, I read something you posted recently about how you are judging yourself to be like a jail warden sometimes. Maybe he’s a reflection of that part of yourself you see as judgemental and maybe by forgiving him and remaining open you can forgive and be open to that part of yourself that you label as being wrong.

    I dunno. Those are the first two things that came to mind. Dies any of that resonate with you?


  4.  #4Laughing goddess on May 21, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    Meant to say “does” of course

    This is exciting!

  5.  #5Daria on May 21, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    Laughing Goddess –


    Yes BOTH of those are what I thought of hehe… GRR… i was feeling slightly disappointed but now

    as im writing im feeling

    open and excited to see what happens next also!!!

  6.  #6Daria on May 21, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    Hehe! yah! Thanks for the shift LG!

  7.  #7Daria on May 21, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    I feel so surprised to have those thoughts written out… here i was feeling guilty for blaming him instead of embracing… and feeling worried that im tolerating hehe

    when in reality im being given a bouquet of messages!


    ok now i just feel like i instantly forgave him since reading you write that

    i feel a lil weird about that

    im worried if i am able to give my own self permission to forgive, or must i rely on others

    ohhh the second doesn’t feel good

    i think i’ve jsut been HELPED

    i CHOOSE to receive the HELP


    Thank you LG!

  8.  #8Laughing goddess on May 21, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    That’s so cool Daria! Sometimes it helps just to hear someone say it outloud. You’ve helped so many sirens and you deserve to receive as well. Ha ha! There’s another message… Receiving! By receiving we give someone else the joy of giving and round and round it goes.

  9.  #9Laughing goddess on May 21, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    I have one more idea about this guys message. It’s still kinda fuzzy but I’m going to try and articulate it.

    I’m wondering if there is some belief that he is mirroring regarding being with a spiritual man or a man with as sharp of a mind as you. Maybe as you are growing and evolving, you are wanting to attract a different type of man, someone who can match where you are at but maybe you have some limiting beliefs about what that would be like. Or maybe you are judging yourself for “abandoning” your old crew to “move up in life”.

    I feel worried that won’t make any sense but I hope it does.

    Anyway, does any of it feel true?

  10.  #10Lucy on May 21, 2010 at 8:38 pm

    Daria, I feel very interested in your situation.

    The man sounds like a lot of “fundamental Christians” I have experienced (and have been one in the past. Am still Christian, but no longer “fundamental”)

    I feel bad with judgmental men. I feel AMAZING with spiritual men who are NOT judgmental but very accepting of every part of me.

    “but on an inner level i would like a man i can feel safe with” — I feel this way too, SO much! I feel safe with non-judging spiritual, smart men (like Getting Closer Man).

    “i told him im with the no class movement” — made me laugh; very cute. 🙂

    I feel so glad that LG helped you!!!

    “you are wanting to attract a different type of man, someone who can match where you are” — that’s exactly what *I* want — a man who matches where I am. Yes. Not a man who I have to “get him up to speed.”

    Thank you Daria for sharing your journey with this.

  11.  #11Daria on May 21, 2010 at 10:17 pm

    I feel so good and powerful!

    I went to a Goddess meeting

    honoring Pele and Her sister Hi’iaka!

    Pele gave me a big heart its big and red!

    I feel different!!1

    I felt easy and powerful engaging people!

    I feel strong!!!

  12.  #12Daria on May 21, 2010 at 10:18 pm

    Laughing Goddess – yes that resonates, how does it relate to the man?

    I feel so much more powerful right now

    I am Pele! omg I am also Hi’iaka!

    more Pele more Hi’iaka

    I have a stronger powerful heart!

    Its big and red

    I am hot molten lava!!!

  13.  #13Daria on May 21, 2010 at 10:23 pm

    LG – i was questioning myself about “what that looks like” and whether a man that IS spiritual would agree with me, or maybe NOT – would he be totally polar opposite being a man, etc

    yes felt confused, didnt’ want to write him off

    but i know at times my feelings and BODY were feeling ANGRY!!

  14.  #14Siena on May 21, 2010 at 10:33 pm

    I’m back from another CD. I don’t know how much longer I can do this. I feel numb. I leaned back and tried to use feeling messages, but I don’t feel anything at this point. He wanted to walk on the beach and I said no, which I guess is good – because usually I would just to make him happy.

    I kept thinking that I would have rather been with an old bf who was a drug addict than with this guy. At least there was a connection with the drug addict!

    I don’t know how much longer I can do this. Rori says the guys get better, but I’m wondering if that’s truly the case? This one tonight was nice enough, but not someone I would ever consider for long term. I kept listening for his message, but really didn’t hear one.

    I miss The Man so much tonight. I walked by a couple kissing at this restaurant tonight, and it made me think of him and me. We had lots of romantic dates on the beaches of Laguna Beach. Is there anything I can do to reach out to him? I know there’s not, but I really miss him. He’s a better man than all of these CDs put together. Dammit! I just didn’t know how to be a Siren back then!

    Oh I feel so bad. I feel at rock bottom. I hope I am, because it can’t get worse than this – man, I hope it doesn’t get worse than this! I simply don’t have the energy to CD anymore! And I’ve been spending so much money to keep myself centered as I CD that I’ve run out of spending money too!

    I feel totally helpless, at the end of my rope.

    I don’t want to go on another date and listen for another message.

    I just want to fall into a man and rest there in safety.

    Is there a way to bring The Man back? I’ve tried attracting him using my Sireness – it’s been 4 months, and hardly a peep from him. He’s very stubborn, and is probably dating someone else.

    This can’t be all there is… can it?

  15.  #15Siena on May 21, 2010 at 11:00 pm

    I don’t even care if it’s a MAN I fall into for safety! I just want to escape to safety and rest for a while. But where could I go? This singleness would follow me no matter where I went. I can’t escape it no matter what I do.

  16.  #16Maria on May 22, 2010 at 3:09 am

    A little Maria progress from getting over break up. I belive i have experienced, what Rori calls- if a man treats you wrong, you loose interest.
    i have reached to a point, when l feel l wont be bothering my pretty lil head about the following-
    -thinking about him at all
    -thinking about what he said, what he possibly ment
    -thinking about what a wonderful life l have had with him, if l only acted better, difrently, cos thats an illusion.
    -thinking about maintaining his friendship. daaah…

    I saw him in his true colours. The way he treated me, betraying his indian wife, family, all that mind hassle, selfishly putting his needs there, is in his make-up, in his DNA, not because lm bad. It is the way HE IS. And seeing that, l wont miss him. I wont miss the bad qualities.
    I want to meet a man who-
    -has is act together
    -is responsible
    -is stabile
    -is his life sorted
    -is charming, kind hearted, smart and grown up.

    I belive any kind of leaning forward is a sign of possible heaviness to any goddess pretty lil head.

    I belive lm in a right track with my thinking. Of course l still have lonely feelings, thinking what will happen with my life etc, but wow, l belive l lost some of my pink glasses- l belive they are out of fashion anyway,lol.

  17.  #17Maria on May 22, 2010 at 3:30 am

    oh, and l didnt do the -closure-thing either. im just not bothered. no contact, cos lm not bothered.
    And thanks to that, l will be able to eliminate all the similar behaviour.

  18.  #18Jeannette on May 22, 2010 at 4:27 am

    Maria, I think you have arrived….when you numb out to what he’s doing, what he’s thinking…..then you’re not wasting any fuel on something that is not worth it. Anyway, I have been wondering girls if you can give me a hand here. I started dating a real sweet guy. But, he isn’t a man who has loads of money because for one he’s on disability due to an old back injury. Anyway, when it comes to paying for dinner out and such….should I let him pick up the tab or should I go in 50/50 or what? At least he has a disability check coming in. If I stopped working I wouldn’t have even that and I am trying to save for a retirement…..not easy with the economy the way it is right now. Any suggestions?

  19.  #19tallgirl10 on May 22, 2010 at 5:06 am

    Ladies, and Maria

    Your post is interesting about becoming numb.

    I have not heard from text guy, and while it makes me feel really sad, I realize this has nothing to do with me.

    He had the same freak out last time. Now he may or may not come back, but since I have not tried to control him, if he comes back, I will know it was of his own volition.

    If he does not, it is not because I am not a fun date. I know in my heart that I was the kind of date, any man would want. Kept it light, fun, teasing and flirty.

    I can’t make a man like me. But I can like myself enough to let a man who does like me step up, and one who doesn’t fade away.

    It’s just hard when you know some of it was so right.

  20.  #20Jeannette on May 22, 2010 at 5:43 am

    I think sometime we need to look at what it is we want in a man. I have dated numerous men, but they were always good looking and into themselves. Now, I have opened up my desires and am looking for someone down to earth and just plain “real.” They are deeper men with much more to offer.

  21.  #21tallgirl10 on May 22, 2010 at 6:51 am

    I am so sad. I feel useless, and unlovable.

    I am angry. How come he came on so fast? What did I do to deserve this?

  22.  #22Lizzie on May 22, 2010 at 9:00 am

    Don’t give up hope ladies – this stuff really works –
    I hadn’t had a date in ages! Oh some really mismatched expectations-coffee events…. but it is early summer and it is time to get outside so I have been going to the local public golf courses as a single (takes a bit of bravery to do that as I am not that good). The last two times out, I have been matched with some interesting men and I decided I would just do “free therapy” with them. It was a blast! Two of the guys – whom I have no interest in – were like little puppies. One of them has been trying to set up a date with me ever since. Then I went to another course and was chatting away with the Starter – again more “free therapy” – a real sweetie of a 70 year old – what a flirt! That was so much fun. Then sitting on the bench waiting for my time slot, another single guy started chatting me up. He ended up giving me his card with a website on it for me to get signed up with a gang of singles golfers and we departed with him saying he is hoping to see me and play with me!

    But about a month ago I met a terrific guy (I will call him family guy FG) – we had a meet-date; then a follow-up cofee date – and I liked him. If I hadn’t leaned back, I am sure I would have blown it already (I am a bit of an alpha female). This is what I did and it worked –
    FG had been away for a while and didn’t contact me when he returned. Naturally I was beginning to think he had lost interest. The old me would have sent him an email asking all kinds of questions about his trip and for a date. The new me, waited a week, then I sent a little email saying “crushing golf balls on a sunny day…. :-)”
    That was all. He responded right away and we had a little back and forth, and my responses were just a few words. I didn’t even ask about his trip. And because he didn’t say anything about his trip or ask for a date, I began to feel sad that I had lost the potential of him; and frustrated that I had misread the signals. Then a few days later – he sent me a flirty text! A little back and forth and what do you know – he sent me a lovely compliment. I was so taken – I sent back a simple feeling message: your message made me feel really good – thank you. And guess what? He immediately responded asking for a date! There is no doubt about it, it feels really wonderful to me to be asked for a date 5 days from now.

    That killer frustration with dating is finally turning into something a little more fun – I am really glad I found this site – thank you Rori

    Now Siena, you made mention of looking for a “message” with your date – what are you meaning by that?

  23.  #23Turtle Girl on May 22, 2010 at 9:17 am


    I am curious-what is it that you like to do when men are not involved? I mean what really makes you feel passionate about life?

    You sound to me like you are in “that spot” – where you are tired and burnt out and running ‘man scaping” issues over and over like a broken record in your head.
    Been there done that.

    Safety and rest you can do for yourself. Don’t need a guy for that. Sounds like you are focusing on your singleness in stead of focusing on something outside yourself that brings passion to your life.

    Not judging, this is just what I feel and hear in your words. My ex toxic man was a drug addict too. I still miss him. But these days, I think that most of our “connection” was made out of shifting sand. It was the brokenness in both of us that got us together. But those things are a train wreck. I mean I don’t really and truly want him back. It would be awful. Am I gonna go over to his house and smoke pot all the time? No. Is he worth giving up my own values and life for? No.

    CD’ing can burn you out, I am experiencing some of that too, but just when I decided to rest, better men staring showing up. Some are boring, but boring is an improvement to what I had. I need to look through rose glasses and I have to always remind myself that ex man was not all that. He said terrible things to me and was totally not for me. I over-functioned big time around him, which had nothing to do with him. It was all me. Had I been the woman I am today around men, we would never have even gotten off the ground. I had to be someone else to be with him. Not gonna do that anymore. The more real I get with me, the more interesting and better men are showing up that are more like me. I really believe that I will attract the right guy.

    I can feel him coming. It’s weird. It may take 500 first dates or a 100 first dates. But he is out there.
    Don’t give up. Just rest, work on you and things will be fine. Big hugs and much love. Take care of yourself.xxxooo

  24.  #24Maria on May 22, 2010 at 9:23 am

    Tallgirl, that is what l ment – it makes no difference how much you worry or not worry, you cannot analyze it, because you eventually go crazy if you analyze every single thing.
    You are definitely loveable. Big hugs to you…

  25.  #25Maria on May 22, 2010 at 9:28 am

    its not like a becoming numb just in a fingertips – but when l first saw Rori mentioning this, l didnt belive it. But it somehow works, when you seriously had enough of nad treatment and all that.
    But for me it was like : thats it- moment. I will no longer accept certain behaviours toward me and l belive, what got me into this situation was my unawareness and some missing boundaries. I will not invest into a guy and lean forward when i feel bad.

  26.  #26Maria on May 22, 2010 at 9:33 am

    *bad* treatment

  27.  #27Siena on May 22, 2010 at 9:45 am

    TG, thank you for writing to me!

    “Sounds like you are focusing on your singleness in stead of focusing on something outside yourself that brings passion to your life.”

    Yes, this is true. I am definitely doing that! I feel angry that I am at this point in my life because I haven’t found a guy who wants to stick.

    I have a lot of things in my life that I do, but they are all colored (or greyed out) by the fact that I am single. It’s really difficult for me, and I’m having a hard time shaking the anger and lonliness that comes with being single.

    I’ve been single a long time – and done some amazing things – traveled all over the world (I just got back from a trip earlier this week), I run a successful business, I take dance classes, I love to cook and take cooking classes, I’m a charcoal artist, I walk my dog everyday (many times down to the beach), I have dinner with girlfriends at least once a week, and then of course I’m doing the CDing.

    I have always filled up my life with fun things that I love to do – but it’s always been “in the meantime” while I wait for a great guy to come along. I don’t know how to change that mindset without feeling like I’ve given up. And I feel like time is running out for me. I really want to have a family, and am in my mid-30s, and I feel afraid that it (my biggest dream) won’t come true for me.

    So I feel angry, I feel tired, I feel blah.

  28.  #28dawn on May 22, 2010 at 9:51 am

    Ahh Ladies , You have in you all the power and love you need to have a very happy life . These men are messengers to show you a better way. We allow ourselves to be treated badly whether we want to admit it or not. Trust your own heart and let them look after themselves. Love yourself enough to know that you are worth more . Love yourself enough to know how very valuable your time is . Way too valuable to be spent pining for a loser.

  29.  #29dawn on May 22, 2010 at 9:59 am

    Sienna , You gotta really feel it my friend . The universe knows when you are faking it. If you just do what you THINK you should and your hearts not in it you arent being true to yourself. Im single along time too. In fact if I think about it it scares me, but my heart tells me my journey isnt over . No limits and no expectations makes a very happy and content life. Just a thought !!

  30.  #30Lucy on May 22, 2010 at 9:59 am

    Siena, I truly feel your pain.

    Even when our lives are full of fun and meaningful things, activities, and people….even when we love and care for ourselves and don’t need anyone else to validate us or make us complete or happy . . . the fact of our singleness remains and there IS something we don’t have.

    I feel it too.

    As much as we love ourselves, we still sleep alone at night.

    As happy as we are with ourselves and our lives, we still come home to an empty house.

    Maybe, Siena, just maybe, this is the darkness before the dawn. <3

  31.  #31Siena on May 22, 2010 at 10:07 am

    Lucy, thank you! “this is the darkness before the dawn.” I really really hope so. It feels very dark. And I snap myself out of it all of the time, because I don’t want to live in darkness – but deep in my heart I know that I am just distracting myself so that I don’t dwell on the singleness.

    Dawn, do you mean I have to really feel that I want to be married? Is that why it hasn’t come to me yet? I don’t know how to feel it anymore than I currently do without driving myself crazy obsessing over it… do you have any suggestions?

  32.  #32Daria on May 22, 2010 at 10:11 am

    Hello morning!

    I feel strong

    why believe I will not have the health I want?

    I WILL have the health i want

    why believe i will not have the fun I want?

    I WILL Have the fun I want

    I will have the support I want

    I will have the money I want



    the sun is out


    i love the sun

    hello morning

    i am feeling good

    i have lava flow


  33.  #33Lucy on May 22, 2010 at 10:22 am

    “I will go before you and will level the mountains… I will give you the treasures of darkness, riches stored in secret places…” (the Bible)

    Siena, let’s choose to receive treasures and riches in the darkness. <3

  34.  #34Siena on May 22, 2010 at 10:25 am

    wow, I feel chills Lucy! You got it! I’ve asked for a miracle, and this would be the perfect time to receive it – when all of the things that I know to do are exhausted and I feel helpless…

    Isaiah is my favorite book in the Bible. Thank you 🙂

  35.  #35dawn on May 22, 2010 at 10:50 am

    Sienna, Body mind and soul need to be on the same page to get what you desire. Sounds to me like your heart and mind arent in synch. Dont be so hard on yourself and let it come to you .

  36.  #36dawn on May 22, 2010 at 10:53 am

    Sienna, ” I feel helpless ” the universe sees thats what you want is helpless ! Dont let your thoughts talk your heart out of what it deserves.

  37.  #37dawn on May 22, 2010 at 10:55 am

    Daria, You can have everything you want !!!

  38.  #38mary on May 22, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    i think i made a mistake with island man.

    the mistake was in responding too soon and saying too much and revealing myself. now i feel exposed. like someone plucked all my feathers.

    on sunday, after our saturday perfect day, i emailed him to say thank you. i know! you guys told me not to! but i did it anyway. what i said was too thought out, too poetic, too this and too that… !! (i’m still such a novice.)

    he responded right back and told me he had a wonderful day, too and that he could have lain there on the grass and talked for hours.

    then on tuesday, he sent flowers (you know, on plenty of fish), and said he had been bitten by a dog. i responded too quickly with too much sentiment about the flowers and too much concern about the bites. i know! you guys told me not to! but i did it anyway.

    he didn’t make plans with me for this long, glorious weekend. i feel rejected! (it’s my first real stinger since i started dating again.) i feel left out. i feel not beautiful enough. i feel not fit enough. i feel not tan enough. i feel not anything enough.

    he is quite shy.

    but i don’t like feeling this way. his shyness does not excuse him from normal things like asking a woman out on a date.


    and i don’t have to keep feeling this way, Rori says.

    now is the hard part! how to handle these feelings now, and not crater in to them? how to stay on my horse? how to stay on my course?

    i feel blue on this beautiful day, and i just got home from a fantastic coffee date. the guy is separated, and he’s been contacting me so much that i agreed to meet him and get the meeting over. today i told him we couldn’t date until his divorce was final. and i liked him.

    i feel unable to do anything. i just want to take a nap and forget about the scenario i had created in my mind around island man.

    island man is probably not for me. he isn’t acting in a way that i want my man to act. i want my man to keep in touch with me, call me on the phone and plan dates with me. i want that soooooooo much!

    and another thing…

    (oh! it’s so good to be able to vent! thank you!)

    even though we’ve met three times now, and we’ve chatted on our real email addresses, he usually keeps in touch on the plenty of fish site, and says things about his day in flowery language that is positive and charming that i stay hooked in.

    now i’m thinking it through and i’m seeing that he’s keeping himself from getting involved with me. he’s staying at a safe distance. and i ask myself, “do i like that?”


    i do not like it.

    i would much prefer that he call me every night and talk to me in less flowery language and just say hi and talk about all the things that a normal guy who is smitten would talk about.

    i’m not gonna think that those flowers mean anything at all. maybe they were just a passing thought!


    okay, i’m feeling better now. feeling not so alone in this… thank you all!

    and i know i need to keep pressing on with this circular dating…


  39.  #39Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 1:12 pm

    Re: Daria and Lucy in #10, 12, and 14

    I feel confused about the idea of a judgemental spiritual man. That feels like an oxymoron to me because I would expect a spiritual man to be accepting. I dunno. It feels weird to “expect” anything, but for me a big part of being spiritual is understanding and accepting other’s choices and recognizing that we can really only control ourselves.

    Daria, I’m feeling a little triggered by mr judgemental and I feel curious to hear more of your interactions with him. 🙂

  40.  #40Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 1:30 pm


    Maybe he didn’t ask you out this weekend because of the dog bite?

    Maybe it has nothing to do with how pretty or tan you are. Maybe he is focused on healing.

    I feel hesitant to say that because it sounds like there are other things going on with him that may not be what you are looking for and I want you to listen to your heart about those things.

    But… What if him not asking you out is only because he is recovering.

    You know the four agreements? One is “don’t take anything personally”.

    You don’t want to spend this glorious weekend sweating something that has nothing to do with you. Don’t listen to the nasty voices. You are a siren!

  41.  #41Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 2:18 pm

    Siena, sorry you are feeling bad.

    I’m happy though to see that you received lots of great advice from the lovely sirens.

    Sending love!

  42.  #42Katie on May 22, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    Wow I feel all over the place today. I got a mutual match on a dating site in UK and the guy has a number of ‘touch’ points in his profile which I liked and he posted this poem in his profile and I want to share it here:

    Comes the Dawn

    After a while you learn the subtle difference
    between holding a hand and chaining a soul
    And you learn that love doesn’t mean leaning
    and company doesn’t always mean security.
    And you begin to learn that kisses aren’t contracts
    and presents aren’t promises
    And you begin to accept your defeats
    with your head up and your eyes ahead
    with the grace of a woman, not the grief of a child
    And you learn to build all your roads on today
    because tomorrow’s ground is too uncertain for plans
    and futures have a way of falling down in mid-flight.
    After a while you learn that even sunshine burns
    if you get too much.
    So you plant your own garden and decorate your own soul
    instead of waiting for someone to bring you flowers.
    And you learn that you really can endure
    that you really are strong
    and you really do have worth.
    And you learn and you learn
    with every goodbye you learn…

    ~~~Veronica A. Shoffstall

  43.  #43Katie on May 22, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    He lives too far away, but I may message a bit, but don’t want any long distance liaisons.

  44.  #44Katie on May 22, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    “And you learn that you really can endure
    that you really are strong
    and you really do have worth.
    And you learn and you learn
    with every goodbye you learn…”

    This is very much what we are talking about I feel.

  45.  #45Jennifer on May 22, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    mmmmmmm……….it’s warm here and a little humid. I feel languid. I like that word. Languid.
    I feel a little sad that a man liked on POF didn’t message me back when I said I’d trade the “bringing down rain” story for a latte.
    Maybe too much? Hmmm…I added a winky face after. I thought it was saucy. I like saucy. Oh well. I want a man who understands and likes my saucy side.
    It was nice to get a message from a man who LOVES nurses.

  46.  #46mary on May 22, 2010 at 3:23 pm


    i just woke up from my nap. i took the phone off the hook just to not have any disturbance.

    island man called. he’s in town. wanted to go for a walk. i would have soooooo done that if he had made plans with me.

    kinda glad i didn’t get the call until later!

    so. i think i feel mad? (why would i feel mad? but yes, i think that’s the feeling.)

    it’s the waiting.

  47.  #47mary on May 22, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    hello again…

    i still think that Old Flame is the one for me. and he’s going to be available in the next couple of months. and for the first time since 1975, when i got married, we’ll both be single and we can date, and figure things out, and wonder together.

    i really, truly think he’s the one.


    do i introduce him to my life with nothing going on socially? no dating? no going out with guys? as though i’ve been waiting for him?

    that just wouldn’t be attractive.

    i could have parties and be social without dating. would that be attractive? not sure!


    if i date guys, some of them might really go for me. i’m worried about that. really worried. i don’t want to break any hearts.

    of course…

    i might find someone i like better than Old Flame! (maybe Island Man?) my heart is already engaged with him.

    but then…

    how will i know until Old Flame makes his appearance?


    what do i tell these guys now? especially if they’re falling for me? Island Man and Music Man just told me about every ex-girlfriend they’ve ever had. i didn’t talk about my past at all.

    what to say to guys now? i’m really enjoying getting out there. and it’s helping me know what i want. and what i don’t want. (i don’t want to be waiting.)

    that is the question! what to say, what to say?

    (every man for himself? REALLY? that seems so cold.)

    (all is fair in love and war? no.)

    just realize that dating is a brutal process, and guys should be in charge of their own hearts?

    here’s my fear:

    they’re being completely honest with me. they’re open for relationship. they’re wanting to know: am i open, too? are there any other guys lurking around?

    yes. Old Flame is lurking around, and he’s about to surface.

    how for that not to be a surprise? but to keep interest, just in case it doesn’t work well with Old Flame?

  48.  #48Daria on May 22, 2010 at 6:04 pm

    hello floating journal

    im feeling a lil tight in the back of my nose!

    hi pituitary gland

    i love you!

    its ok if you feel tight

    and its ok to relax

    you are safe



    i tapped and tapped today


    and i just let my voices go

    and talking to my body


    my voices sounded like me, my godsister, and transformer man’s abusive voice!

    they kept talking and talking shit

    i noticed that i LOVE talking down to someone

    i feel so thrilled and powerful and cool

    like YESSS!!

    im finally cool!


    i love myself

    i feel a lil squeezed… the voice says this sounds weird and people will think so


    i was triggered today by some site i got to and it was talking about

    bondage sex and humiliation and something about a painful zipper

    and i felt like whoa

    i feel horrified and weird and shoked thinking about that

    and also like turned on

    and i feel confused

    i dont want to hurt myself!

    feeling humiliated feels like not feeling loved

    and i LOVE my humiliated feelings

    i also love my terror of having a zipper tear thru my pussy (or whatever that reference was about)


    i mean my nani is sensitive to like the touch of a nail

    so that felt weird

    i feel weeeeeeirrrrdddd

    and triggered thinking about this

    and i dont want to judge

    so i will stay with the feelings of weird

    i love my weird feelings

    i love all my feelings

    i love the squeezing in my right side of my lower abdomen

    and i love the squeezing in my left knee

    and on the left side of my spine

    where my kidneys are

    i feel afriad thinking kidneys

    im so used to thinking fo my kidneys as weka now


    they are probably like really strong

    and im thinking of the m as week

    i love my incongruent spelling

    i feel good, and kinda numb

    hey i can touch an object

    mmm i feel soothed and calm touching the slippery glass table


    and i feel disgusted and tense touching my face!

    i lov emy disgust and tension!

    and my soothedness and calmness

    i feel head disconnecting from body when i touch my shirt on my tummy!


    i feel surprised and

    i dont want to disconnect my head from body

    i feel big sigh and disappointment like judgement like thing

    i love my big sigh, disappointment, judgement like thingggg

    i feel my fingertips tingling

    i love my tingly finger tips

    i feel my eyes closing

    i love my closing eyes and that feels like

    a breath under my breasts and tightness in my teeth

    and i love my breath breasts and teeth and that feels like

    a lil smile

    and i love my lil smile

    and it feels like a lil bigger smile and a prik on my shin
    i love my bigger smile my prik on my shin and me leaning by head back and sighing

    i love my feelings

  49.  #49Daria on May 22, 2010 at 6:37 pm


    i feel triggered

    a friend of mine just wrote on facebook how

    some young men were trying to talk to her as she was walking… saying “hey mama” and howling and whistling…

    and she said she was “ignoring the little bastards while talking on the cell phone” and then they said to her

    Fuck you then you stuck up bitch!

    and she felt angry and said that their moms need to raise them better



    you just said you were ignoring the lil bastards

    they were basically trying to talk to you and whistling and giving her attention…


    shes like IGNORING THEM



    appreciate it?

    since when is

    hey mama – an insult

    ahhh i feel so triggered!


    I smile and even say hi, and if i don’t want to talk then i keep walking

    but i APPRECIATE male attention



    I feel like um yeah, I might have said fuck you you stuck up bitch too!!


  50.  #50Daria on May 22, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    this came up when I was in Spain when a bunch of Northern European girls were liek… omg men here are so rude they whistle and click at you!!!

    and then some southern European women were like…ummm… thats’ cuz they like you and want you to feel good! I would feel BAD if men DIDN’T pay me any attention — like what’s wrong???


    I have seen this come up again and again

    and I always feel triggered when women are like

    ohhh its so rude… he said

    HI mama to me

    or he whistled at me





    Thinking that i commented on my friend’s page somewhat in their defense

    i told her that my mom taught me that whistles are compliments

    she kinda did… at least I remember this one time… and even though it may have felt uncomfortable sometimes, it’s only because i’m a beautiful woman… i’m being told i’m noticed



  51.  #51Turtle Girl on May 22, 2010 at 6:48 pm


    I get what you are going through. That whole singles thing of “in the meantime” and feeling like you are giving up.

    I have a very deep rooted spiritual belief system. I belief that great truths of the mystery of god and whatever that entails is always a paradox of some sort.

    Like holding two opposing beliefs together at the same time and truth is in them. You said you don’t know how to do it without “giving up”. There is a very subtle difference between giving up and letting go. You must never every give up, but you must wholeheartedly let go. Faith and belief that whatever your heart desires will come about for you.
    I do not belief that God/Goddess, whatever it/she/he is wants us to be lonely. However, it always seems the more I put demands on what I want, the worse it gets.So I put my request out to the universe and let go of outcomes, and yet at the same time holding a belief that surely my love will show up for me. It is often hard to describe.

    It’s this way with all things in my life. I can be looking for something I have lost and as soon as I say – oh well, to heck with it-it will turn up – I no longer need to find it right this minute-then poof! There it is. Always when I let go of trying to find it.
    It is bizarre how this works.

    Siena-you are beautiful. And I am sure you have lots to offer the right man. Love the fact that you are feeling “in the meantime” so that you can not give up but just let go. I send you thoughts and vibes of this – I pray for your healing, for your fears of being 30 something and not having a family to heal. I have a friend who married at 42 and had a baby. I have another who did it at 50. I had my child late in life as well. My child is now grown and looking back, it turned out exactly how it was supposed to. Life is so beautiful. xxxooo

  52.  #52Daria on May 22, 2010 at 6:58 pm

    So this guy wants to meet me first date, and i know he goes to school across the bridge.

    I told him id meet him downtown.

    he texts a lot, because he’s in school

    i was at the library practicing

    i told him i dont like texting before

    he called like 3 times no message, so i called him back

    he had made a plan to meet me today at 7pm a few days ago.

    so hes still texting,

    he calls, asks me (delagating) to text him the address of where to meet . i felt ok with this and did

    then he kept texting and i was doing a project at the library

    he wrote “why don’t you like texting”

    i felt aww
    (good shift for me hehe – im like he wants to know about me haha! instead of… urggh he’s bugging me)

    anyway i didnt get a chance to answr cuz i keep forgeting cuz ive been busy

    but i did text him the address later he texted thanks


    i looked at my phone and theres a text can i meet him across the bridge instead

    um no

    so now i feel kinda disappointed

    what do you ladies think?

    text him back with no?

    or just not answer that?

    he is supposed to be meeting me RIGHT NOW if anything


    my backup plans are movie with my family! which sounds FUN!

  53.  #53Daria on May 22, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    I haven’t answered he hasn’t called.

    He rescheduled a meeting he set a couple weeks ago too.

    I feel kinda pouty.

    I like how he schedules the meetings onteh phone

    hey so when are you free. ok how about saturday at 7. does that work for you?

    i liked that and i felt excited to meet with him

    but now this stuff has me feeling like blah


    and ive been ignoring texts form all kinds of men

    im feeling drained by them

  54.  #54Siena on May 22, 2010 at 7:06 pm

    Daria, I would answer “no”. In fact, almost the same thing you describe happened to me about 2 weeks ago. I was on the fwy when I got a text asking me to come to him instead of vise versa.

    I just texted back No.

    Why not text something like, “oh bummer, I feel not impressed. No, I won’t come to you. “

  55.  #55Siena on May 22, 2010 at 7:11 pm

    Laughing Goddess, thank you! I feel much better, I took some time today and took care of myself. And re-read The Four Agreements (who mentioned that today?) It totally helped.

    Turtle Girl, I feel so grateful and humbled. Not only by you, but by all the Sirens who responded to me today. I love your last post, and need to sit with it for a while.

    Thank you! Grazie Mille!

  56.  #56Siena on May 22, 2010 at 7:13 pm

    And Dawn and Lucy – I meditated on “Don’t let your thoughts talk your heart out of what it deserves.” and the Treasure in the darkness much of today – thank you too!

    I’m surrounded by so much beauty and love. For some reason, I choose not to see that, and instead focus on what I don’t have. But it’s not even true that I don’t have what I think I don’t have. I don’t know why I continue to lie to myself! I’m working to change that…

  57.  #57Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 7:21 pm

    Daria: how bout…

    I feel so bummed b/c I thought we had planned to meet right now. I don’t feel good about going over the bridge. It would feel so much better if you came to me like a red hot night and swept me off my feet.

    Kinda sorta kidding but hey, maybe it would work.

    What did you decide to do?

  58.  #58Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 7:25 pm

    Or… (taken from what you said)

    awww, i felt so happy when you made plans and scheduled a time. I liked it and I felt so excited to see you. Now I feel bummed. It would feel so much better if we stuck with you original plan. What do you think?

  59.  #59Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 7:44 pm

    Siena! Yay! I feel so happy that you feel better. I to was amazed and humble by the support and suggestions you received. I felt really inspired and touched.

    It feels so wild to me that life is so much a matter of perspective. I love how you said you are now noticing all theses wonderful things in your life. And that what is missing in your life is really there.

    I feel reminded of how I view my universal lover. O feel a little embarrassed to say this. I dunno why, probably just my nv’s judging it as stupid. I’m not gonna listen!

    So, I have this vision or feeling of my universal lover. He is out there in the ethers connected to me always even if we are not together physically. He wants and craves me just as much as I do him. My feminine energy is magic to his soul. We are two of the most fundamental of elemental forces…masculine and feminine. Really everything in nature is a play of these energies. He is god and I am the goddess. He manifests into physical forms in myriad ways to play with me, make love to me. Sometimes he appears as the wind blowing through my hair, sometimes as the scent of a spring flower, and sometimes as a real man. But he is not limited to one man, he can manifest in many different outfits.

    This keeps me from getting attached to any one man because it’s universal lover, God, that I am really wanting and he is everywhere. And oh what a treat it is when he shows up as a strapping, masculine, giving man! Bit if that manifestation starts to fade I know he will come back around again, just maybe in a different man outfit.

    Also, before I met LI, I would get myself totally psyched out by imagining all the different ways that day I could meet a man. Imagining just how easily it could happen.

    Wow, I could bump in to him as I turn this corner. Our dogs could be playing around at the beach and I turn around and there he is. I could be in front of him in line buying coffee. Imagining these scenarios totally raised my vibe and got me excited for the day. I would get dressed up because hey, there’s a good possibility I could meet my lover today.

  60.  #60Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 7:53 pm

    I went from feeling hopelessly single to convinced that I was going to meet a man any second and when it happened, it was so synchronistic and obvious and easy.

    Of course now I have the issue of being completely overwhelmed by how quickly it’s moving. I wanted love so badly and now I am having resistance letting it in. I’m trying to really look deep and figure out where the resistance is coming from. It’s all good though. Universal lover god will always be there!

  61.  #61diamond on May 22, 2010 at 8:04 pm

    THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU Katie for that poem, I’ve had a couple lines from it for years but didn’t know who wrote them. <3

    I overfunction so much. I will get the book about intimacy, because I need to Just. Let. Go. and stop trying to do everything. I feel like a mother instead of a wife to my husband and I HATE it.

  62.  #62Apple Jacks on May 22, 2010 at 8:04 pm

    Okay I didn’t know how to channel this so I ran here, but I am feeling really triggered by the word “classy.” Audrey Hepburn (whom I like a lot) is “classy” and J-Lo is “trashy.”

    I feel sick to my stomach

    I feel nauseated. My stomach feels like it would after downing an entire glass of milk with a whole bunch of sugar in it on an empty stomach (I did this once when I was a little girl and very hungry).

    I don’t like it when the world uses sugary words to knock down people in order to raise up others.

    What is it with “classy” anyway? Devoid of any sexual enchantment, any flavor and juice? Yuck. I feel so annoyed and triggered! *GGGGGRRRRRRRR* So stupid and annoying!

    I feel hateful of this word “classy.” I feel like kicking it, and kicking it and kicking it! STUPID WORD!!!!

    I love you annoyance, I thank you trigger.

    Daria, I feel in alignment with your trigger of how women cannot take compliments just because it is not said in the way that she may percieve iit as “classy.” This is what I THINK, it’s a judgement call on my part. I love my judgmentalism.

    Siena – I feel like giving you a great big hug and saying, chin up. I can relate too in more ways you’ll know.

    *Aaahhhhh* I feel really good now. Nice. I feel like singing to the moon in the soft warm air. Sweet lol.

  63.  #63Rachel on May 22, 2010 at 8:07 pm

    Laughing Goddess,

    Your writing about the universal lover is just what I needed to fall asleep with tonight. My heart has been aching all day. Nothing really “wrong,” but just longing to be WITH my lover. And I was just pondering this very thing tonight… that somehow we are connected and he is missing me as much as I am missing him.

    Ohhh… that feels so lovely. Thank you! I think I’m going to copy your words into my journal. They are healing and hopeful.

    Thank you!! Tomorrow could be the day…!!

  64.  #64Laughing goddess on May 22, 2010 at 8:22 pm

    Yay Rachel!!! Tomorrow could be the day! Yay yay yay!

  65.  #65Alicia on May 22, 2010 at 9:08 pm

    OMG LOL!!!

    I got kinda tickeled the guy I was CDating on the regular kinda pull back for like two weeks not a huge deal.. We had only been on three dates but, talked communicated everyday which was just kinda there.. nothing amazing.. But, he hit me up when he say me on line. And I responded and said tols him what I was up to enjoying my life and said “it feels wierd to hear from you” and then hope you are doing well. Take care. haha.

    I realized later maybe he took it wrong. But, then finely forgot about it.. Today I checked my dating site.. and he responded WHY fo you feel wierd??

    haha. I just said (in different words) becuase you dropped off the planet for a second, thought felt confused like I offended you when we were joking around on text.. no biggie.. you know I say random things in person being playful..

    We’ll see.. what happens.. I feel pretty detached about it. 😉

    That’s the only thing I don’t like about text or email.. There is no tone.. And a big part of my humour is joking that sounds feels serious.. haha. How do I text that??? Like a screen play??.. ::feeling silly she says in a playful serious tone:: you can’t handle me!

  66.  #66Alicia on May 22, 2010 at 9:15 pm

    omg goodness… I hate the feeling I get when I see lot of spelling errors! lol.. We are having a party at my house and I came into the computer room to chill.. Apparently, drinking and typing is not working out for me tonight… haha. It’s my sis’s b-day and I’ve three glasses of the “secret” punch! lol..

    Is there anyway to have the blog give you time to edit.. ?????? That would feel SWEET!

    And never mind what I wrote I the previous post… haha. Basically just saying his response to me saying I feel weird hearing from you.. (since two weeks went by) felt kind of funny… Reading – “WHY do you feel wierd” and then another guy asked me how my week was and I said.. “it feels okay, just taking care of a few things” He response also suprised me.. Why do you feel just okay??

    Wow.. they shockingle get a little bent or concerned when it’s less the postive.! lol

  67.  #67Alicia on May 22, 2010 at 9:19 pm

    I’m hugging out my perfectionism……………. It’s just life.. no one get’s out alive anyways.. 🙂 Not a BIGGIE.. :0)

  68.  #68Lucy on May 22, 2010 at 9:23 pm

    “How do I text that??? Like a screen play??.. ::feeling silly she says in a playful serious tone:: you can’t handle me!”

    Haha, yeah, that’s actually exactly what I do! 🙂

  69.  #69Lucy on May 22, 2010 at 9:29 pm

    I feel FRUSTRATED!

    This really cute adorable guy who doesn’t live far from me “winked” at me a couple days ago, and I want to wink back cuz he is so cute and adorable and doesn’t live far from me 🙂 BUT he hid his profile!!! So I can’t wink at him. 🙁 I have checked it several times since he winked, and it keeps being unavailable.

    OH! “Unavailable.”

    Do I like unavailable men?

  70.  #70Daria on May 22, 2010 at 10:35 pm

    oh… I just didn’t answer! Lucy i like the red hot nite! hehe Siena I like the i feel not impressed haha.


    so guess what my SISTER is calling me now

    not cussing or attacking any more

    but saying im avoiding her calls

    im like what calls

    i sounded all cool

    thats just how it was coming out

    but i told her id call her back cuz im watchina movie and i do want to talk to her

    and i havent yet

    the movie turned out to be 3 hours

    she texted me

    “call me back when you can”

    what a change in attitude!


    thank you universe

    also her moms said shes not drinking all the time it was jsut a bday thing

    not what i had heard

    but i think her mom is conjuring it well

    yay for conjuring naturally without thinking aobut it

    go moms

    i feell triggered and learning!

    now i gotta clal her back and im not all the way ready to

    hehe i was just venting to a guy but now hes gonna call me back he says


    i feel a bit insecure to vent to him but it felt GOOD
    to vent

  71.  #71Daria on May 22, 2010 at 10:39 pm

    aack! Universal lover i love it!

    i love how you said he comes in differnt man outfits

    right now universal lover is gonna hear me vent and encourage me!

    i feel insecure and embarassed that i feel afraid of confrontation with my own sister


    i love myself and want to protect and feel awww and protective of myself

    i am moved by my vulnerability and sweetness

    i am like a cute cuddle bunny!

    wow i forget when i feel all powerful my cuddle bunny side

    i feel shocked at how RANGEFUL i am

    and how easy it is to forget how i am one way when im telling myself i am another and etc


  72.  #72Daria on May 22, 2010 at 11:19 pm


    Im feelin unloved. I think that you dont really give a fuck about me cuz you can call me names and talk about you comin to my house without trippin. I dont feel safe tellin you I feel angry… and I feel like im busy jumpin around makin sure you feel good or you feel better when u angry. and im tired. i feel like this more one sided. u aint neva come to see me or pick me up. I feel like a drain sayin this. an i still love you. and i feel hella mothafukin distant. it would feel good to feel good and close and solid again. i feel SAD!!!

    oh an u dont call to invite me over jus to kick it. AND when I DO come over u aint even come out to say hi or give me a hug! you either dont come out the room or if u did then you dont even say HI! you just look at me an turn away.. that shit feel bAD!

    i think you use to say WASSUP D! and smile and be happy to see me

    Im sobbin right now cuz i miss that. I miss feelin like u my sis an have my back. Now i feel like u jus lookin to be makin fun of me in public or ignore me and or lookin for some reason to yell at me or get into it wit me. I dont know if im causin it or what… I feel guilty like maybe im wondering if its me feelin jealous of you or wondering if i should get in a fight with you cuz i ben let u hit me before an i feel like now the bak of my mind feel intimidated an i dont like that.. so i feel like yeah i wanna fight somebody cuz i dont want nobody intimidating me but at the same i dont even wanna be in a position of bein against u .


    this so much to say an all that coem out is nothin much


    how ima get all this to you!??

  73.  #73Daria on May 22, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    I hate feelin myself in this position! I feel like this gonna keep comin up in my life if not wit you then wit my man or other people in my life!


    i feel so under pressure


    an no im suppose to call u back and

    i feel like

    I CANT

    all i can do is write these words but u not SEEIN THEM HERE!!!


  74.  #74Daria on May 22, 2010 at 11:29 pm


    I miss havin people I coudl count on to have my back!

    I have my parents but i wanted to believe that i could have MORE people in the world

    my moma said its not gonna happen its always just ur family

    and that feel so unfair

    i dont WANT to believe that



    i had some friends that were so loyal and had my back

    how did eveyrhint blow apart

    i feel so sad

    and i feel good at the same time


    this feel crazy

    i miss feelin loved

    i miss feelin BIG

    i miss feelin IMPORTANT

    I miss feelin wanted

    i miss feelin part of somethin

    i miss feelin excited to show off and make my group look good

    i miss the fearless of having people at my back

    i misss ittttttt
    i feeeeel soo sadddd

    i feel so jealous of people who have that

    especially men

    who always have someone to call

    wake up and have 4 or 5 dudes to call

    and say wassup

    was popin today

    lets get together todday

    and do it big

    lets celebtrate

    but not me

    im left out

    at home alone

    and its gona be like that fore years



    I feel so good to write this

    i feel so good to feel these hot tears sting

    i feel so good to sob

    TIP: Run loud music if you want to cry with parents at home!!!


    i feel smily

    i feel sobbing

    i love ittttttt

    im crying my heart out and smiling

    i dont know how to mothafuckin communicate my feelings

    to people i care about


    that is sof unnyyyyyyyy




  75.  #75Daria on May 22, 2010 at 11:31 pm


    IM STILL!!! scared of callin my sister


    im gonna go out to this bar tho my guy patna invited me

  76.  #76mary on May 23, 2010 at 1:38 am


    that was interesting Daria. good luck with your sister, whenever you talk with her.


    Laughing Goddess! i’ll be looking for my universal lover now in the wind, in the rain, in the beautiful smells round the lake and in all the gifts that are mine each day. in my grandson’s smiles!

    Thank you for the thoughts, Laughing Goddess.

  77.  #77mary on May 23, 2010 at 1:42 am

    and oh!

    i went out with B to mystic beach yesterday and my attraction for him waned when i was so tired from carrying all my camera equipment and he just kept talking and talking and talking. it was exhausting! and i had my tripod, too. and i was trying not to trip on all the tree roots, or twist my ankle with all the weight on my shoulders, and he kept pointing things out for me to look at. i felt irritated.

    that is so not Mary.

    i felt IRRItated.

    and when we got down to the beach, finally, i lay there on the blanket and huffed and puffed for minutes. and then, suddenly… i was okay.

    Mary was back again.

    and i felt attraction for B again.


    he kissed me once, and i just wasn’t into it. so maybe the attraction wasn’t there.

    then tonight we went to hear a band that i wanted to hear, because they’re friends of mine.

    they were great!

    he called to set it up, and we haggled over the time and exactly what was gonna happen. he’s so tentative!

    i just wanted him to say the time and i would be ready, but we had to TALK AND TALK AND TALK about it.

    and he wanted to leave after the second set. and go down to the ocean.

    my feet were bare except for my heels, and it was so cold. he wanted to snuggle under the stars and kiss, and i just didn’t want to.

    i guess i’m not into him.

    so we drove back home and he wanted to have The Talk about our friendship, or “whatever it is.”

    I told him i felt… sad that I couldn’t be more responsive.

    I felt confused about life right now.

    I felt guilty to be enjoying his company and unable to reciprocate his feelings for me.

    I told him that I didn’t want him to be hurt again. (after last fall…)

    I told him that I didn’t want to force things.

    I told him that I didn’t want to make a premature decision about the most important aspect of my well-being for the rest of my life.

    I asked him what he thought.


    He talked and talked and talked.

    And then we talked about him talking.

    And then we talked about me not talking.

    Now I’m exhausted.

    I don’t want to listen to him any more.

    I’m so tired.

    He’s not the one for me. Glad to know!


  78.  #78Daria on May 23, 2010 at 2:35 am


    i like who i am more when i have been drinking!!

    not when im overthetop drunk and can’t get it together or remember what happend

    i didnt drink tonite

    and im thinkinga bout my sister

    and when we met we both used to drink everday

    and party and celbrate

    with about 20 other people!

    oh that was fun

    and when im drunk i dont feel afraid…

    i say how i feel!

    she was always praising me because i say honest and funny shit

    and dont let people put me down!

    when im drunk!

    but when im sober

    im boring

    my thoughts hold me back

    from being that person

    and ive noticed that

    since i was 16

    and ive been “tweaking ” on it

    and i guess ive mostly gotten used to

    me not drinking



    i feel sad now

    because the truth is

    the real me comes out when im drinking


    that “shouldn’t” be that way

    but some people will tell me taht everyones like that


    wat the fuck to do?

    i dont want to drink everyday

    i want to feel at ease around people, and sharing my loving angry sad afriad feelings with people naturally

    and opening up my heart and not jduging

    and feeling fearless

    ohhhhh it feels so good to be drunk

    so fun to do wild crazy stuff and not be afraid

    so fun to yell, or run!

    instead of eat myself up inside about how to say

    some pretty damn straightforward shit to say

    if i was drunk

    i could say bitch im mad

    and bitch you dont talk to me that way

    and i could fight

    without a second thought


    i want to be that way in “real life”

    its not fair that alcohol makes us sick

    sis was more fun and lively and funny drunk too

    more happy

    and i was more happy

    ok so she was more antagonistic and jokey

    but hey

    i didnt mind

    cuz me drunk was really good at standing up for myself

    and that is why

    she fell in love with me

    she propbably thinks i suck now

    which makes sense

    and i think she sucks and is boring

    whcih makes sense

    so here we are thinking we were gonna be sisters forever

    when really we just like each other drunkness style


    now that alcholol is kickin our ass

    we don’t really connect as well

    that feels sad and blank

    how wonderful that i notice that it feels sad and blank

    but it really SHOULDNT be this way

    i SHOULD be able to be that self of me without alcohol!

    who can help me??

    i have been working hard but apparently not even full success

    who WILL help me
    fuck can


    i feel afraid of hopelessness

    wow that’s awesome that i noticed that


  79.  #79Daria on May 23, 2010 at 2:40 am

    Mary! – no cactusing!!

    next time say the equipment feels heavy and you don’t feel good carrying it all yourself!

  80.  #80Daria on May 23, 2010 at 2:42 am

    i feel grateful for the experience of having been drunk so that i know what i WANT to feel like

    and i feel frustrated and hopeless athat i’ll have that agian in a easy way

    i can perhaps use it as an EFT resource state

    but will the damn thing work?

    im feeling all disappointed and discouraged

  81.  #81dawn on May 23, 2010 at 4:49 am

    I felt sad when I drank
    long ago
    I stopped to get perspective
    perspective led me here
    long ago
    I feel satisfied
    I feel loose
    I feel free
    I feel loved
    I dont want to stuff my feelings
    with alchohol
    My drug of choice
    my enemy
    I let it rule me
    for as long as i needed
    until i could love myself
    and not hide
    ive seen the bottom of a lot of bottles
    it didnt work out for me
    I felt lonely
    I felt dirty
    i felt disgusting
    bottles are cold
    no life
    hearts are warm and inviting
    I feel balanced
    I feel sober
    sober enough to see my worth
    I feel eyes wide open
    deer in headlights
    ifeel powerful
    I feel brand new
    i feel free to fly
    no limits
    no expectations
    I feel the world is mine to enjoy
    I feel open to life
    i feel love in my heart
    I feel happy for my past
    I feel grateful for all I have
    I feel calm in my skin
    I feel my dreams coming true
    I feel safe in my world
    I feel humbled
    to have such a chance
    to start fresh everyday

    to ha

  82.  #82Bella on May 23, 2010 at 7:28 am

    Laughing Goddess,

    Thank you for #58, that was beautiful. Like so many on this thread I’ve been feeling out of sorts this weekend, and I feel much lighter after reading it.

    I love that no matter how I’m feeling I can always come here and find others who are on similar paths, and I feel encouraged and hopeful!

  83.  #83dawn on May 23, 2010 at 8:32 am

    I feel amused by his denial
    I feel honored by his attempts to dishonor me
    I feel like slappin and fuckin him at the same time
    i feel my hand rubbing his back to soothe him
    I feel him pull away
    I feel amused by our differences
    I feel safe in our similarities
    I feel love for him
    I feel amused by his excuses
    I feel heard
    I feel enlightened

  84.  #84Jeannette on May 23, 2010 at 8:49 am

    Girls, I have a question……a man I have been dating for a couple months talked about a woman he once saw. He said he saw her for such a short time because she told him before him, she was dating a married man. He said right then and there, he wrote her off his list. I did not know what to say…..I have dated a married man too! BUt, I am sorry for it. I just don’t know if I should share that information or not. I mean, I am sorry I did it so, why should I broadcast it. But, it sort of put a wedge between us when he told me.

  85.  #85tallgirl10 on May 23, 2010 at 9:26 am

    I am feeling strong.

    I arrived at my vacation destination to a text from text guy. I am so proud of my feeling statements.

    him – You would be do proud of me, I read the economist for an hour while it was raining today. How’s your saturday?

    Me – Look at your Mr. Smarty Pants – I am impressed! I arrived in XXX for vacation this morning so I am feeling super relaxed. Nap time now and going to a baseball game tonight. How is your weekend going?

    And while I have not heard back from him, I still feel like it was perfect. I don’t think the how is your weekend going was leaning forward mainly because I am on vaca, and he knows I am busy.

    Back to zen, and did use a feeling statement. Go me!

  86.  #86mary on May 23, 2010 at 9:51 am

    daria, i had a NO feeling when i read 77. people get to know you when you share your feelings. and you are witty and bright and beautiful.

    restraint and thoughtfulness add to your gracefulness and give you a feminine touch. and if i knew you in person, they would invite me back into your company.

    i don’t choose friends who are the life of the party because they swoop in and suck up all the energy. they drain the feeling flow. and they’re conversation stoppers.

    i like to spend time with people who say “some pretty damn straightforward shit.”

  87.  #87mary on May 23, 2010 at 9:52 am

    dawn, when i read 80 i felt in awe of your writing, your process and your revelations! wow.

  88.  #88Siena on May 23, 2010 at 9:57 am

    Laughing Goddess, I love your imagery of your universal lover. I’ve read books by mystics who describe the same type of thing you do there… It feels wonderful to read about it!

    I especially love the part about him revealing himself in different men, and so the men might move on, but another always comes along to take his place.

    It makes me wonder if I’m blocking out love altogether, and whether that’s my message here. I’ve been reflecting on the ways that I show other people love, and I can’t say that I came up with a very long list. I’ve been cocooned for the past few months, and behaving very selfishly in order to heal my heart. Maybe now it’s time that I figured out a way to start expressing love again… like as a volunteer or something… hmm…

  89.  #89mary on May 23, 2010 at 10:05 am


    this could seem like moralizing, but it isn’t! it’s just a comment about the change in my family. i’m so happy about this, it’s in the forefront of my mind all the time.

    that’s why i had a big NO feeling to your comment, daria.

    * * *

    my brother just got out of rehab, as i shared. and i can see a remarkable shift in his personality every time i go back home.

    it seems as though he’s finally REALLY there. in person.

    did the alcohol prevent that, even during moments when he wasn’t drinking?

    i guess so.

    i love having him back. it’s like he’s been asleep for twenty years and he’s just waking up. he’s my brother again! i want to laugh and skip and throw frisbee with him.

    i love him so much!

    i’m so happy about it.

    and because he did that, my older brother quit drinking. he saw the change and wanted it for himself!

    so now both wives have stopped drinking.

    my family is getting closer and i’m loving our time together!

    it seems so real.

    before, it was… Mary, go play the piano. and i would. and K would tell his stories. and C would do some gymnastics. and my brother C would tell jokes.

    and the sharing would be over. and they would stand around with their glasses in their hands and say the same things they said last time… (i never drank at these functions, so i remember.)

    and now we’re so interested in our conversations that there’s no time for a talent show.

    i’m loving it!

  90.  #90mary on May 23, 2010 at 10:13 am


    i’m so happy Island Man called yesterday!

    and get this: he called at 1:30 pm just after i posted #37, where i shifted my vibe, as Laughing Goddess suggested.

    in one of the last posts, Rori said not to even think about the guy too much… because he can feel it.

    so i talked myself out of Island Man and then he called.

    wow. is that ever powerful.

  91.  #91dawn on May 23, 2010 at 10:42 am

    Mary , Thanks, I feel honored by your acknowledgement !

  92.  #92dawn on May 23, 2010 at 10:55 am

    Life is to be fun
    not supposed to be so hard
    to those of us who think too much
    analyse this shit
    get over it
    they are already over it
    waste your time
    waste your mind
    never too late
    to start again
    fresh and new
    beware of doubt
    doubt hinders our ability
    to have our desires
    to feel
    to be ourselves
    love ourselves
    doubt hinder
    sour ability

  93.  #93Laughing goddess on May 23, 2010 at 11:04 am

    Siena: I just got a vision of you volunteering and meeting amazing yummy caring man. I could see it happening so clearly. It felt really beautiful.

  94.  #94Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:04 am

    I feel triggered even pre blog

    i feel misunderstood and ungot! grrrr

    but what Im concerned about is not that i want to drink lol

    but rather that i want to be that person i found myself being

    and that feels HOPELESS

    not only that, but i dont even feel that way all the way when i drink anymore

    its not about the drinking

    its about wanting to be that person

    that adventuruous fearless, friendly person

  95.  #95Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:05 am

    i feel so angry im shaking!

    i woke up trigger mode today

    I feel so angry at my body!

  96.  #96Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:08 am

    i still feel good too


    i feel mad at mary for hearing

    (i imagine)

    “i want to drink”

    when i was writing about “i want to be”

    i feel like ACK


    and now i feel worried like

    oops mention drink and the next thing u know people won’t be able to hear a thing you’re saying


    im practicing being blunt here

    im feeling all tightened up

    i feel pist at my body right now

    i feel pist at this stupid strep b or whatever bacteria that is taken over myb ody

    i feel pist that i dont know an MD i can trust


    i feel pist that i dont know what to eat to help myselfffff and i think im undereating now grrr



  97.  #97Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:12 am

    well unfortunately now that we dont drink no mroe the opposite has happend with me and my godsister

    we dont talk anymore

    before we used to talk about stuff

    im not saying i want us to drink !!! BILLBOARD!!!

    i am saying i want to BE that way

    that fun effect of drinking has pretty much wore off now and now it mostly makes me sick and definitely her


    i feel really mad!!!

    hello liver!

    you must be pist that we went out last nite and stayed up till 3 30



    for real??


  98.  #98Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:13 am

    I feel shaking in my thighs.

    i feel tightening in my s houlders!!

  99.  #99Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:13 am

    I WANT HELP!!!




  100.  #100dawn on May 23, 2010 at 11:20 am

    Daria, It doesnt matter what anyone else thinks. I feel your insecurity ! I feel you reaching out. You think I care if they think I WAS a drunk? Im not anymore and this process saved me. Id love and hear you drunk or sober !! who gives a flying fuck ! Stop judging yourself, you are too important for that , stop it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  101.  #101Lucy on May 23, 2010 at 11:23 am

    Daria, I have had a similar experience with drinking — I like that it makes me feel and “be” more free and fun —

    I was just thinking about that in church this morning — our church offers a choice of wine or grape juice for communion —

    I have to drink the grape juice because the taste of wine reminds me of how good I feel being me when I drink more —

    I have only had alcohol a few times in my life (college years) and I learned quickly that I had potential to become an alcoholic because I had trouble stopping because it was so much fun being me when I drank (until of course my friends had to rescue me from going home with a stranger a few times!)

    So now I don’t drink at all. Except I did on my second CD last fall . . . and ended up sleeping with the guy and he fell in love with me (hello, it was the DRINKING me) and I didn’t fall in love with him.

    BUT. Here’s the thing —

    Alcohol– all it does is take away our RESISTANCE to being who we really are. It relaxes our defenses.

    ***So we just need to find a natural and healthy way to get rid of our resistance to being who we really are.***

    To relax into being our true selves.

  102.  #102Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:24 am

    Aww dawn thank you!

    Actually i dont care if they think im drunk. I care about being heard because

    im sending a universal help me message to get to be that person I got a chance to be when i drank


    Her was ME!

    Me just like i want to be!! open heart, not judging people or being afraid,

    BRAVE and POWERFUL and standing up for myself WITHOUT A SECOND THOUGHT

    Adventurous , fun wild!

    this is what i want


    I dont want it to be gone forever




  103.  #103Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Lucy – thank you




  104.  #104Lucy on May 23, 2010 at 11:27 am

    Rori’s tools are a good start for this (getting rid of our resistance to being our true selves).

  105.  #105Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:29 am

    YES well as we all know i have been practicing Rori’s tools for awhile


    I MEAN!!! i already GOT there before… (with crutchy help) SO I WOULD LIKE TO BE THERE NOW


    so i can step forward and live life from THAT place in me






    theyre pisto freom going to bed late

    or are thye

    I DONO


  106.  #106Lucy on May 23, 2010 at 11:29 am

    “Me just like i want to be!! open heart, not judging people”

    Hmm, the “spiritual” guy from the other day who seemed to be judgmental….

    Maybe your “shadow”….? Or something….?

  107.  #107Lucy on May 23, 2010 at 11:36 am

    You have a crystal-clear AWARENESS of it now, Daria —

    the you you want to be…

    the crutchy crappy way of accomplishing that…

    the opening up to a new way to be that you….

    it’s like labor pains right now….

    you are birthing a new you….

    the you you want to be that doesn’t need a crutch…

    the you you already are that was just covered up by life and conditioning and fear and pain….

    and now shedding all of that…..

    ready to become that butterfly that flies free and far.

  108.  #108Daria on May 23, 2010 at 11:56 am

    awww thanks Lucy!

    i have so many beliefs id like removed


    the belief that people dont really change all the way

    or 100% get what they want



    i love my feelings

    id like these beliefs removed

    and i have a belief that no one will Truly help me


    not even angels

    hi angels

    i allow you to help me remove these beliefs

    thank u

    im feeling so alive and good today!

    my plan today is to figure out the proper nutrition to help my body kick this bacteria out!

    out of my throat tonsils lymph glands kidneys nephrons bladder urethra anus (ack i said anus) and even guts – tho i dont feel it there

    kick it out!

    i do not want my nephrons to degenerate

    i do not wnat to have chronic kidney disease cuz of this stupid boy having this stupid bacteria and my deciding to get close to him AAACK

    why is my body so sensitive!!

    i hate you body!!!

    i love my feelings



    no i will probably die


    I HATE youuuuuuu

    i love my feelings

    i love my feelings of doom

    i love my liver and spleen squeezes – are yall infected too?




    so i decided to eat only vegetables and fruit for cleansing but i think im undereating now


    i wish i had a good doctor!!!!!!

    i know i will probably kcik this disease

    but my kidneys seem to have weakend again after my sore throat and fever

    i KNOW it was this same bacteria

    Fuck uuu!!!!

    i will get uuuu bacteria

    get out of my body

    the acupuncturist i last went to gave me some antibiotics so i know i can use those i have a 4 day course

    but i just wanna be sure it will Work

    i wonder if cayenne pepper will help me distribute them well

    and what should i eat?

    all vegetables?

    or more


    im also gonna eat boiled organic eggs now and then

    and then i gotta take a probiotic

    maybe even now

    is a good idea


    GONNA buy probiotic NOW!

  109.  #109Daria on May 23, 2010 at 12:09 pm

    yay i just ordered it

    i now have the psyllium husk with lots of happy bacteria coming my way

    i guess if im gonna be eating htat psyllium husk maybe no meat…

    so ooo i don’t want to lose weight

    what do i do

    im eating one full on vegetable seaweed soup a day and some fruit lol!


    well ill keep eating a daily avocado

    and maybe taking some hemp seeds

    yo no quiero get thinny thin

    im gonna be fine

    i want my body to have enough PROTEIN

    protein for my pretty!


    chia seeds!!

    i get tired of the hemp

  110.  #110Lucy on May 23, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    What about almonds? They have lots of protein and vitamin E. Don’t know if they are good or bad for your condition though…

  111.  #111Daria on May 23, 2010 at 12:27 pm

    OOH Thanks Lucy!

    Almonds have protein yes indeedy!! yes yes1

    and i lvoe raw almonds

    Lucy thank you for remindin me

    RAW ALMONDS that I soak

    i dont have a condition. I have a bacteria hehe.

    almonds won’t feed it. yay!!!

    awesomme stuff

  112.  #112mary on May 23, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    well, hey.


    i didn’t read that it was about the drinking.

    1. i did read that it was about how you wanted to feel.

    2. how you wanted to be when you were with people.

    3. and possibly how you wanted to come across.

    and i was looking across at you (3) and just sayin’…

    the things you say (to us) and the way you present yourself (to us) are very beautiful. from my standpoint, they don’t need much improvement.

    can’t help you with 1 and 2, except to suggest david deida’s books that talk about women who GLOW. and feel open and alive…

  113.  #113Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:24 pm

    Hi mary –

    oh i didnt realize that. i just heard that you heard “NO”

    reading my post… and to me that seemed like NO to drinking…

    i felt confused a little

    thank you. i know i am very beautiful as is and in how i express myself here

    what i would like is to FEEL FREER to be ME in public

    i am practicing

    i dont believe i will ever get there <— which is a belief i would like removed

    RRRRIP im pulling it out like a cord of skin



  114.  #114Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:26 pm

    no it’s not about how i want to come across.

    i come across pretty well i think…

    OH I C

    how i come across to my sister and how she loved me me. ummm yes…



    i feel confused myself

    how i come across is an effect of how im feeling

    i care about how I FEEL

    i already come across pretty damn charming most of the time

  115.  #115Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    ack i feel triggerd
    i am Concerned with how i come across with my sister, because i want her respect

    i still havent called her lol

    im acting like a withdrawing man


    roll my eyes i feel judgemental and also loving of myself

    how about taking some shots and then calling her?


    JK!! im not drinking right now i want to kick my draining bacteria out!

  116.  #116Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    Thanks Mary !


    I am concerned with how I come across NOW

    however when im in that state of freedom, IM NOT concerned with how i come across ! and that FEELS AWESOME

    oh it feels SOOOOOO Awesome

    like my heart opened wide open and breathing in the mountain

    Spirit refreshing beyond belief to a land where i didnt think i could go really really gooo

    with drums and colors and the trees beat beat beat

    excitement and exhilaratiion feeling like a million tingles in my body


  117.  #117Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    I want this

    and saying that feels sad.

    the thought im not gonna get it popped up before the sadness

    FUCK U U FUCKIN DEMON put mE doWNER IM tired of u


    im a gemini twin do i have two personalities

    ohp just thought i should call that girl and i tihgtened up

    fuck uuuuuuuu daria

  118.  #118Daria on May 23, 2010 at 1:36 pm

    I feel stuck with Rori’s tools.

    I feel like I am plateouing

    I know there are tools imnot using 100%.

    i feel like i’ve lost motivation


    i feel stuck!

    i went to the bar last nite and practiced and practiced

    opening up my pelvis

    and heart

    omg did i feel tightened up in my neck

    and eyes

    my eyes kept wanting to blank out

    i told them tis ok to relax

    and they would! that felt great

    but it was an ongoing second by second process




    I lvoe my feelings

    i feel angry at this!!

    i feel angry at myself and the people who traumatized meeee!!

  119.  #119mary on May 23, 2010 at 2:33 pm

    sometimes i like the change in me when i’m drinking, and occasionally it’s really fun.

    if i have two drinks i can really, really dance.

    drinking makes my body feel looser. i do love that feeling, so i can relate (i think!)

    i’m not a talkative person. i’m more of a listener. i’m actually pretty quiet and reserved, and i do share more when i have a drink or two. sometimes i like that, too. if i’m really, really sad, i don’t drink.

    hmmmmmm. i feel a lil misunderstood, too. but it isn’t an anger trigger.

  120.  #120mary on May 23, 2010 at 2:39 pm

    i keep my voice mails. and i have a little phone recorder, and i record them. then sort them out so that each person has a tape of his own.

    (i used to do telephone interviews with people in my former business… i don’t record conversations, only voice messages that people know they’re recording for me.)

    i was just listening to the different guys who’ve been calling me. listening and relaxing and wondering who’s voice i most like to hear.

    R. for sure. even when he’s angry.

    Island Man. yes!

    and Music Man.

    and when i hear the voice of Old Flame, i know that he’s the one.

    i just know. i just know.

    i just know.

  121.  #121mary on May 23, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    i’m back to thinking through my plans and not worrying about men.

    thank you, laughing goddess! for helping me change my vibe.

  122.  #122mary on May 23, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    and thank you Rori! for saying that even thinking about men is sometimes felt by them.


    think about that!

    that’s awesome.

    i do worry a bit about sustainability… the old ghost that haunts me…

  123.  #123mary on May 23, 2010 at 2:45 pm

    okay, back to Relaxing and Resting this beautiful Sunday…

  124.  #124Terry on May 24, 2010 at 6:47 am

    Siena, i felt moved by your post #14. I feel the same way. I wrote about a man I’m seeing on another thread here. He has always treated me like a queen. He pursued and respected me. I opened my heart to him. I felt so safe with him. Until yesterday.

    We had a date right after church yesterday. He didn’t show. I felt anxious and confused. I texted him a little while later that I felt confused…I felt we had a date. He didn’t answer until five hours later.

    He did something else instead and said that he and I had no definite plans. I used several feeling messages. I talked “with” him like the examples Rori gives (not “to” him or “at” him.”)

    He began yelling, saying he’s sick of me always using ” feeling” statements. He said “this isn’t a business deal – knock it off!” I told him this was feeling very bad. He apologized. It didn’t feel sincere. I got off the phone. I didn’t want to talk to him anymore.

    I feel sick in my stomach. I feel numb. I feel pressure in my head from crying. I felt shocked to see that side of him. His anger. I felt speechless. I felt exhausted trying to remember what to say or do from Rori’s tools. I felt blank. I made mistakes. I wanted to yell back. I didn’t.

    I feel duped. I feel angry at myself for opening my heart to him. felt stood up. I feel dishonored and disrespected. I feel unsure if he’s toxic or if this was a case of miscommunication. I feel icky for texting him.

    I feel so sad.

    I feel scared.

    I want to feel special and safe again.

  125.  #125Siena on May 24, 2010 at 9:49 am

    Terry, hugs to you! I feel so much better than this weekend! I needed to take some time to refocus my thoughts, and now I feel good.

    Terry, if a guy I was seeing stood me up and then made an excuse for doing so (instead of apologizing), and THEN attacked me for expressing my feelings to him, I would absolutely 100% make my absence felt from him.

    I would become so busy with my life and with dating other men that he would have to work doubly hard to get me to see him. And even when he did see me, it would be on a random Tuesday or some day that is not “prime” date night (Fri or Sat).

    I would show him through my actions that I am a highly valuable, beautiful, amazing, wonderful person who does not accept disrespectful behavior from anyone – especially someone who is supposed to have my back.

    I wouldn’t be angry at him or pouting or emotional… I just wouldn’t be THERE!

    He disrespected you, and he will continue to do so until YOU stop it. He won’t stop unless you require him to.

    Your post reminded me of the same thing that happened to me years ago. I didn’t stand up for myself in the way I described above when my guy first disrespected me. The first time I remember was exactly as you described it – we had a date on a Sunday and he stood me up and denied it later. I didn’t put my foot down, and it down spiraled so badly that he completely stopped respecting me: he used to check dating sites on MY computer while he was staying with me, invited other girls on our dates, flirted shamelessly with waitresses, stood me up repeatedly.

    I feel so embarrassed to write that. Nowadays I wouldn’t EVER allow that type of treatment. But I thought I was in love and being forgiving.

    Now I know that the way to show him love is to love and respect myself first.

    Love to you! Siena

  126.  #126Siena on May 24, 2010 at 12:02 pm

    Lizzie, yay for you!

    To answer your question: Rori talks about all men we go out with as Messages or Mirrors.

    They are ‘sent’ to us either to bring us a Message about something that needs to be healed or a path for us to follow or to tell us something about ourselves that we didn’t know.

    Or, they are our Mirrors, reflecting back on ourselves things that we like or don’t like about ourselves so we can heal, change, grow, magnify, etc.

    I am dating not to find Mr. Right (although I know he’s on his way and is showing up even now!) but to listen for the Messages and look for the Mirrors so that I can become the best version of myself. Men are great for that…

    That’s what Circular Dating is all about for me. Not to date to see if they are Mr. Right, but to figure out WHY they were sent to me – what the lesson, message, or mirror they are bringing to me.

    It’s a much easier way to date. There’s no pressure on me to be “on my best behavior” or to tolerate bad stuff from him. If he’s just a messenger, I can receive his message, thank him and move on.

    It’s liberating!

  127.  #127Terry on May 24, 2010 at 12:28 pm

    Thanks, Siena. Thing is, I did speak up for myself. I just didn’t do it by yelling. I kept using feeling messages. It only made him angrier. That’s when I said this was feeling very bad and that I was hanging up now. And I did. The conversation was going nowhere and it was spiraling downward. He has never talked to me that way in three and half months.

    One of his complaints about me is that I rarely initiate calls or texts to him. He said it’s a two-way street and he needs to feel wanted, too. I told him I didn’t want to pursue him or chase him. That made him angry. Should I do it more since he asked?

    I’m starting to feel confused and foggy about these skills and if I’m using them correctly. This guy told me just a week ago that he is 100% committed to me. However, I would not agree to being his girlfriend and he has been stewing over that I think.

    When he does call again and is more calm, I plan to be very direct and state what I will and will not tolerate. This will feel tricky, because he is a very passionate person. If he begins to raise his voice, I will want to do the same. This time it will take control on my part to state my feelings without raising my voice. Or is that wrong? Is it ever ok to to sound angry when you really are feeling that way? What’s the fine line there? I don’t understand that part of feeling messages and authenticity.

    I’m getting away this weekend with some friends, so that will help my spirits. I still plan on CD, too.

    Thanks for your input, Siena. I feel glad you feel better.

  128.  #128gina on May 24, 2010 at 12:42 pm

    I took the message of this post to be about the challenge of making any kind of change. Cause I feel like I need to change. But I’m not entirely sure in what way. I was feeling good…working at a restaurant, helping with the magazine, teaching ballroom dance a few days a week, doing the true beauty workshops at least once a month, and substitute preschool teaching sometimes….and then somebody came along with an opportunity to work at a high end restaurant. I knew the training would be intense, but I understood that there would be a big payoff, so I went for it. I did well in training, but then, at the home stretch, I started to struggle with the basic execution of the job. I feel nervous dealing with expensive things ($90 steaks, $150 bottles of wine etc – on the low end, etc), the job is stressful, and i feel more prone to make small but expensive errors. I feel scared like it’s too hard and I just don’t want to do it. But then I judge myself for being a wimp. And then, in the midst of it all, I got mad at the guy from the magazine (who has made me mad all along) and we agreed that I should not be involved in the magazine for now. So now I feel just at a loss. But I guess writing this, I feel like I ought to toughen up and just take on this job at the restaurant because I need to make more money. I don’t actually care to make more, but I know that if my car was to break down, or if I got sick, I’d be screwed. Plus, I’m not building anything at this rate – can’t support a family,etc. Why don’t I care more? Why am I not more motivated?? Sometimes I get obsessed with getting things done, and I do really well, but in terms of having a successful career – I wish I cared. I wonder if this is a fundamental change I need to make in myself?? Or do I recognize that I am not going to go down that path, accept it, do what I need to do to survive (like take on this high end restaurant job), but intend to move on to something I’m better suited to ASAP…that sounds good to me. I will take on this restaurant job, and try writing children stories – maybe writing is something I’d be well suited for…I tell stories to the kids at the preschool, and they form large crowds and beg me to go on. they slap their knees and crack up – I’m sure I could create something good. But then that next step will be to make it into something commercially viable, and that’s where I get wimpy. The business part. Like with the True Beauty Workshops – I created something really good, but now that I need to make it into a steady money maker, I lose interest. Stupid, cause the money making is the process of reaching people.
    I feel exhausted. Like crying. Like hiding. like sleeping forever. what is this hang up? this resistance to success. People say they see something super special in me, that I have potential. And I believe it myself, but it’s like unless conditions are perfect – if my skin is clear and I like the people and I like the atmosphere, then I’ll shine. Otherwise, I withdraw. Or at least I have in the past.

    Urgh. with the magazine…I wish i could say for 100% sure I did the right thing. I found my boss annoying and he consistently violated boundaries.

    blaaaaaa…….grr….sleepy sleepyness.

  129.  #129Siena on May 24, 2010 at 12:42 pm

    Terry, brava to you for handling it like a pro!

    It sounds like you know what you’re doing! I don’t know what Rori would say, but if you feel angry and part of expressing that is to raise your voice without attacking him – then that feels authentic to me. It would feel less authentic to be calm and angry at the same time (unless that’s how you express anger).

    hmmm… I hear him saying to you that “he needs to feel wanted, too”. Is there a way that you could make him feel wanted without calling him, texting him, or leaning forward at all?

    In my case… hmm… (thinking…) if one of my dates said that to me and I really *did* want him (I’d have to check myself to make sure that’s the case first), then I might turn on the charm, increase the compliments, and be more and more open with my feelings, authenticity, “good vibes” and openess when he DID come around. It would still be up to him to get to me, but when he got there, I would do what I could to make him feel very very wanted (and not just sexually).

  130.  #130Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 2:00 pm

    Ok. So I’m new to this site. I posted a short blog earlier thinking that I could post something specifically to Rori, which I have now discovered I can’t. Which is perfectly fine. I will just post it and see if she responds AND what all you fine ladies have to say about it since some of you seem to be experiencing similar things.

    I met a guy online and went on a date with him. I suspected that he was emotionally immature, but that was ok because I was just putting into practice the things that I learned from Rori’s book and her e-letters.

    Last week he called me in the morning wondering if I wanted to go out that evening. I told him that I was meeting a friend for dinner, at which point he asked if it was a date. I wanted to tell him that it was just a friend and avoid any fallout, but the fact is that it was a first date with another man and I remembered Rori’s advice about being honest, so I told him “yes”. At this point, he asked me if I was having sex with anyone. So I took the opportunity to reiterate to him that I only have sex when I’m in a relationship with someone. Mind you, in the past, I would have told him it was none of his freakin’ business. But, that has not worked so well for me and nothing will ever change if I don’t change, so I chose to use it as a learning opportunity and practice being more honest and open and feeling. And it felt good to respond to him that way.

    What didn’t feel so good, was that he implied that he didn’t believe me because “you made out with me in my truck.” I asked him, “What? So that makes me a ‘ho’ or something because I made out with you in your truck? I like you, I liked kissing you. But I respect myself too much to have sex with anyone I’m not in a relationship with.” (I know, the first part was reverting back to my old ways a bit).

    He kept up along the same lines, so I finally told him, “Trying to make me feel like I don’t deserve respect is not going to change my answer. If you’re looking for casual sex, I’m sure there are other women out there who are looking for that. I’m not one of them.”

    He got very confrontational and actually went so far as to tell me that he didn’t believe that I’m not having sex. It was mind boggling. I tried to remain calm and honest and open and feel that I succeeded for the most part. I finally told him, “I’m sorry if I gave you the wrong impression. It seems that you think I’m playing some sort of game with you. I’m not. I’m very sad about the whole situation, and would like to just put it behind me. Now please stop.” I’ve not heard back from him, but this whole experience felt icky. I think I feel worse than I would have if I had slept with him. I feel like that is partially because this is a whole new way of communicating with a man. That it’s still a little foreign to me. In the past I always felt like I was at least defending my own honor. This experience has left me feeling like I’m making progress and it was good that I confirmed my feeling that he was just out for a fling, but somehow less strong. More vulnerable. I don’t like feeling like this.

    What I do like is that I remained open even though it was difficult and it makes sense to me that with the right man, it would feel very good. I don’t feel like I can pick and choose who to be open with because I have been so guarded for so long that to close up to him would feel like a step backward. I’ve worked too long and too hard to risk letting someone who has no respect for me cause me to lose any of the progress I have made.

    But I have to say it felt very, very icky.

  131.  #131Daria on May 24, 2010 at 2:08 pm

    Sweetpea I think Rori answered you Today on antoher post.

  132.  #132Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    Thanks Daria. Can you tell me how I go about finding that?

  133.  #133Daria on May 24, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    And , IT IS none of his business. I tell men I don’t feel comfortable discussing that (sex with other men or last time i had it, etc) with them.

    This man was BEHAVING VERY BADLY. and no, you would have felt MUCH WORSE having sex with him, because he still would have behaved badly.

    ACK. Get out of there and do not have anymore contact with him.

    ONE of Rori’s MAJOR TOOLS is WALK AWAY. That includes hanging up the phone (even without warning) if a man is continuing to make you feel bad after you’ve told him how you feel.

    It’s important to NOT TOLERATE anything.

    Great job communicating your feelings without attacking!

    Next time, end the icky feeling convo sooner! I am practicing with this too.

  134.  #134Daria on May 24, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Front post

    # 72 is Rori’s response, you’re on the right track, keep practicing!

  135.  #135Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    Thank you. It feels better not just knowing that I’m not the only one dealing with things like this, but having positive feedback on what felt like a very negative situation.
    He was behaving badly and I almost canceled my date because I was feeling so icky about men in general. And like it was just too much work to make all these changes only to have the new way of dealing with things make me feel so horrible.
    But I went on my date. He was very nice and I had a wonderful time, but now I feel annoyed by him, too. He keeps asking when he can see me again, but then when I give him a time, he tells me he can’t. Just that – not, “but I can this day…” I finally told him “How ’bout you figure out when you can see me and let me know.”
    Why does this feel so hard? Is it just because communicating this way is so new to me? I feel like I put up with more now than I did before. Like I said, though, what I did before didn’t work for me. Does it get easier to find a balance. To be honest without closing down completely like I used to?

  136.  #136Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    And I just read #72. It is a post by you, Daria. It made me feel sad for you. But I’m still curious about what Rori had to say.

  137.  #137Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    Ok. I found it. I thought I was on the front post. Oops. Thanks

  138.  #138Terry on May 24, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    Siena, thanks for the tips. I do try to be authentic and open. Maybe I’m not turning on the charm and compliments enough. That feels like another fine line to me – between not enough and too much. lol!

    This isn’t supposed to be hard, but for me personally, all of this does feel hard to grasp and put into practice. I also still don’t know when to walk away for good and when to give the relationship another chance. People are human and have bad days. Questions, questions. I feel like Sweetpea in that I feel as if I’m much more tolerant that I used to be.

  139.  #139Siena on May 24, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    “I also still don’t know when to walk away for good and when to give the relationship another chance.”

    Terry, I just *had* to respond one more time (hehe). This is why CD works so well for me. Because I don’t really have to make those decisions… not really. Because if he’s not cutting it, another man is. And it’s like – instead of having one relationship that fulfills me – I have several that together equal a really good relationship. And if one doesn’t cut it, he just kindof fades away. No drama, no tears (or hardly any), no *big* talks… just fade out.

    Here’s a small example that put this into perspective for me. I really like daily contact of some sort. It can be a text, an email and phone call. Doesn’t have to be deep – just SOMETHING. Well, since I’m dating more than 1 man, I find that I DO have daily contact – just from different men! So my desire for daily contact is being met, and I don’t care if date #1 calls 3 times a week or 1 time a week. I hardly even notice, because my needs are already being met.

    And then (hopefully, and I feel it will happen, no doubts about it) THE guy shows up, and he’s able to “do” a relationship that looks and feels the way I want it – and vise versa.

    I’m just sharing, btw. I think you have your stuff together, and am not trying to tell you what to do!

  140.  #140Daria on May 24, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    Hi Sweetpea if you go to the main page at


    the front post is about “what to do if he’s whining…”

    there you posted at # 62 and Rori posted a very short reply at #72

  141.  #141Daria on May 24, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    oh oops just saw you found it!

  142.  #142Sweetpea on May 24, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    Thanks anyway, Daria. I have been on here all day! I was just reading a post about you and some of the progress you’ve made.

    You go!!!

    Thanks for your help today. I really do appreciate it!

  143.  #143Terry on May 24, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    Thanks, again, Siena. It’s sweet of you to help me out so much. I still doubt myself a lot.

    Thanks for the reminders about CD. I am doing that, but this guy rose to the top and remained consistent – more than the others. He was actually doing this relationship the way I want. : )

  144.  #144Simply Shannon on May 24, 2010 at 8:54 pm

    Siena: Maybe now it’s time that I figured out a way to start expressing love again… like as a volunteer or something… hmm…

    Yes. This is where I’m at. I may say I’m not focused on meeting Mr. Right but if my actions on a day to day basis say I’m thinking about relationships with men a lot, then that’s my focus. Not sure if that makes sense. I’m trying to pull my focus off of men, off of dating, and actually having “a life”. Volunteering, becoming more involved with my friends and family, etc.

    And it’s not about being busy. It’s about taking that next step that God has in store for me. I believe Dawn said something about “letting go”. I’m really trying to surrender my need for relationship. It feels difficult though because even in my mind, I’m expecting God to give me a relationship as soon as I let go of the need for it. Like it’s an immediate one for one.

    I’m toying with dropping off of the dating websites as a way to motivate myself to get more involved with the things I actually love doing. I know I would meet people with similar interests if I was actually doing those interests more often. As opposed to putting it on my online profile as an interest. 🙂

  145.  #145Lucy on May 24, 2010 at 9:04 pm

    *Sigh* This is exactly what I’ve been struggling with too: “It feels difficult though because even in my mind, I’m expecting God to give me a relationship as soon as I let go of the need for it.”

  146.  #146mary on May 25, 2010 at 12:53 am

    hey, Simply Shannon,


    i was just thinking tonight about retiring my online profile. see what other ways i can be with people. try to forget about dating for now.


    that would be so radical.

    but i was thinking about it…

  147.  #147Daria on May 25, 2010 at 1:05 am

    Mary – you JUST STARTED dating.

    Shannon’s been practicing CD for awhile, and she was retiring her profile so she can meet more men out and about, not so she would forget dating.

    maybe a rest would feel nice. how about not answering dating notes lol without retiring the profile… then you can come back to lots of juicy ones

  148.  #148mary on May 25, 2010 at 1:55 am

    good idea.

    maybe i’ll hide it for a while…

    i’m tired!

  149.  #149Wonder Woman on May 25, 2010 at 5:17 am

    Ewwwww……I feel so annoyed with myself. I went on a second day out with EE man almost 2 months after the first day out (which wasn’t a date because his friend was there as well). The second date went well although he didn’t attempt to do much of anything. In fact at the end of the day he was dropping me off and I was kind of shocked he hadn’t tried to kiss me because we had spoke quite intimately on email and I actually joked to him “are you going to kiss me today”??…..which he then did and it was nice but left me wondering what was going on with him. I have tried not to overfunction but this guy seemed to do nothing. He practically told me he prefers a woman to make plans etc. So because of the fact he was always online before me I would initiate online conversations but I was sure to always finish them first. Anyway, on Sunday I replied to a comment his friend had wrote and when I saw asked him how he was online later he didn’t reply to me. I started to panic and tried to coax a reply but I could see I was on the verge of losing it so I stopped. He has since not been online or disappears when I go online. I don’t know what I have done. I don’t know if I am reading too much into his reaction but I just get a gut feeling he has been annoyed that I replied to his friend but he hasn’t told me anything. I don’t want to chase him but I did like him. I was supposed to be going to see him this weekend but I don’t think he is going to get in touch. I feel really confused. It has only been 2 days but I don’t know what to do. Do I ask if I have done something to upset him or just leave it??!!

  150.  #150Wonder Woman on May 25, 2010 at 5:20 am

    I should add we have spoke pretty much everyday so the fact he isn’t speaking to me now is very unusual.

  151.  #151Wonder Woman on May 25, 2010 at 5:41 am

    Ok, so here are the reasons I think he is upset…..first of all earlier that day I said Hi and asked if he had gone to York because the week before he mentioned he was going there that weekend….he replied saying “gone where??….and then told me what he had been up to and asked what had happened to me so I told him and then he told me he had to go which seemed a bit adrupt….so I wondered if he had forgot he had told me he was going to York and thought I must have been looking into his business or something….!! Anyway later I posted a note on facebook that I had got pulled over by a policeman the day before just because he thought it was unusual for a woman to be drivng a van and I thought it was funny as it wasn’t the first time this had happened for that reason and his friend said “tell the truth….what is his number, when is your date….do you like a man in uniform??…..and I replied back with “no comment – I have the right to remain silent”. So I am wondering if he thought I had another date or was upset that I had replied to his friend (who I know he thinks girls fancy a lot more than him). I feel really bad about all this. I don’t know what to do!!

  152.  #152Lizzie on May 25, 2010 at 8:47 am

    Oh Wonder Woman, I believe your chap has gone cold. Try to to just lean back, and see if he comes to you. Don’t send him any more messages – email or otherwise.

    A biggie for me is the kiss. A kiss is the greatest indicator of what will or will not happen. First, you pretty much asked him for a kiss and he obliged – hmmmm. I feel so much with a kiss; I want it from him: spontaneous; luscious; warm and wanting. It is the ultimate in him leaning into me. Then it is all about how it feels and what does it trigger with me and him. Does it take my/his breath away? Yes – then, that’s it – he is mine. If the kiss doesn’t take my breath away, then he is gone – toast – fini. My feeling from what you described, the “take my breath away” didn’t happen – for you and him.

    Then you described a rather cool (as in ice) conversation about going to York. Just how you described it triggers a “he is gone” cold feeling.

    Lean back, do nothing, don’t go looking for him. See what happens next. You never know he might just reappear in a few days. Then you would know, he is coming tooooooo you, not pushing you away.

    Date the other guy….he might be way more fun.

  153.  #153Daria on May 25, 2010 at 10:04 am

    Wonder Woman – oh nooo… thats a lot of overfunctioning! messaging him first is a no no!

    thinking about what may have happened with him – like now – is also WAY overfunctioning

    my guess is he can probably tell how much you are overfunctioning and is not feeling attracted…

    on top of that, he doesn’t sound like he’s the kind of man that can step up – he wants women to plan dates

    thats a turnoff! for YOU!

    so lean back, FORGET about him, and yes date other men, this man is NOT using his masculine energy to purusue you, so drop him until he steps up


    otherwise all your posts are going to be about us trying to make you feel better from throwing yourself off the bridge over this guy

  154.  #154mackenzie on May 25, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    Yes, Wonder Woman you are seriously leaning forward which is turning this guy off big time!!! You are doing the chasing and he doesn’t want to be chased. Guys want to do the chasing. If he doesn’t chase you forget about him; it will never work. Guts do not want to know that you are into them; if they sense that from you, they immediately lose interest and/or take you for granted. You need to get their interest by just being so fabulous you do not HAVE to be so interested in them = for real. As Rori says, it’s not a game; you just REALLY are busy with your own life and if he plays it right he can spend time with you. If not, too bad for him.

  155.  #155Sweetpea on May 25, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    Ladies – I had an epiphany – or maybe all of you already know this, but it feels important to me so I’m going to share and hopefully it will resonate with someone else who needs to hear it.
    I KNOW how to be with men. I’ve been approaching this as a complete rebuild of how I think about men and relationships, but it’s not. I’ve been feeling conflicted – what to do, what not to do, what’s the right step? It used to be if a man was treating me badly, or if he was ignoring me, I would just tell him buh-bye. The only thing I see that I really need to do differently is to use less boy energy.
    Or maybe I just need to concentrate on that one thing right now so this doesn’t feel so overwhelming. What do you think?

  156.  #156Daria on May 25, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    Sweetpea –

    the first tools to start with are to STOP OVERFUNCTIONING

    and HUGELY IMPORTANT – start using Feeling messages all the time – babysteps

    those two tools will take you all the way there

  157.  #157Brenda on May 26, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    Jeannette girl, RE: #18 – Paying when a man is on disability…I have dealt a lot with this issue, because I unwisely “dated” mostly men in prison and then two men on disability. It was partially a reflection of my poor self-esteem, but I won’t judge me if you don’t.

    Most recently was Ryan, who was one of them on disability. I paid most of the time. I let him buy us coffee now and then. I didn’t have an issue with it. Why?

    I spent one weekend, and one weekend only, with a multi-millionaire who I met online. He paid for everything, and he tried to get me to give up my present on-again-off-again inmate man, Kenny. This was before Kenny and I married in 2003.

    The multi-millionaire, Mike, was a complete you-know-what!! He was self-centered, untruthful, self-centered, homely, self-centered, too old, self-centered, and I forget if I mentioned self-centered.

    Money isn’t everything!!!!!!!!!! He tried to BUY me with his money. He commented as we walked down the street, “See that Jaguar? You’d look good driving one of those!” Slime! He made me empty promises. When I moved for him to deliver, like he was going to fund me to open a plus size clothing store, he made a million caveats and excuses. Suddenly his offer was only good if I moved to his state, gave up my pets, left my mother, and let him oversee it. It was no offer at all. He was just trying to buy me.

    He commented, “American women are so lazy! They don’t like to wax their legs.” It was all about Mike, and he had no interest whatsoever in my likes and dislikes. Before we met, he asked me what kind of perfume I like. I honestly prefer Bath & Body Works fragrances. Even tho they’re cheaper than a typical perfume, they are what I like, natural and light. Even tho I told him that, he bought me an expensive, heavy cologne, that I wore the one time I was with him, just to appease him.

    I walked away and chose a broke man in prison, and I’m sure it was like I threw dirt in his face, in his eyes! Ha!

    I already knew money was surface stuff, but this experience accentuated that truth to me. Sure, it’s nice to meet a man who can provide for a family and is a homeowner. It counts up on the list of pros. But if the sweet personality and beautiful heart aren’t there? Next!

    I trust God that if He brings a man in my life on disability, He will also provide the money we need to support ourselves and hopefully children.

    I have done a lot of dating, and I know that I know that I know that I will only feel in sync when I am with a man with a beautiful heart that beats in time to mine!!!!!!

  158.  #158Brenda on May 26, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    I really appreciate this article and Rori’s comments on overfunctioning. I am becoming more aware by the day in how many ways and how often I tend to overfunction. This really helps me understand why it’s so difficult for me to break this pattern. I am really making headway, too. I am letting Ryan go, even tho I miss him with every heart beat.

  159.  #159Jeannette on May 26, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    Brenda that was sooooo powerful!! Does anyone want to comment on my entry # 84? Just trying to do the right thing here. Thanks!

  160.  #160Wonder Woman on May 26, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    Lizzie, Daria and Mackenzie

    I only just got to read your posts but thank you so much. After I wrote on here I felt like I had released the stress within me and did exactly what you advised. I left him alone and set my mind on other things never expecting to hear from him again and totally unexpectedly he sends me an email saying he does want to meet but can’t do this week.

    Wow….I thought I had leaned back so much to how I used to be but reading my own post and yours makes me realise I have a Lonnnnnnng way to go.

    I am actually embarrassed to read my own post. The good thing is that normally I would fall apart but I have totally conditioned myself to believe things happen for a reason and last night I hugged myself…and although I totally felt like not going out tonight I did anyway and the next thing I know the email was there. I wonder if men can sense the vibe from a long way away??!!

    Anyway, I am committing to absolutely not doing the instant messaging anymore and that way I can’t be tempted to instigate the conversations. That said the whole him not being the man was driving me crazy. I think I have weak moments where I think a man who is nice is better than the men who are totally awful and therefore better than nothing. I am working on raising my bar.

    I have some other dates lined up which I keep putting off but I am going to use this as a motivation to keep going and seriously do some circular dating. I thought I was getting to grips with this but it’s harder to break old habits than I thought. Sometimes I don’t even realise what I am doing or I do but they don’t seem so extreme until I write it down or someone points it out. Thank you all so much.

  161.  #161Wonder Woman on May 26, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    You know I always find that when I don’t visit this site regularly I seem to fall back into old habits but when I read it it’s like I get empowered in a way that nothing else or nobody else can understand but the women here and I love that. It’s like I’ve found the most wonderful thing in the world because it makes me feel better about being me. This morning before I got the email or read the replies on here I got up and was feeling really bad but I had already made up my mind to use the experience for the greater good and I decided that his message was to sort out all the parts of my life that were lacking and making me feel bad….so I went to the doctor and told her I had been feeling low lately (which I had) and she gave me some tablets to make me feel better and I swore to myself I would take them. That in itself is such a different perspective to what I had before finding this site. So maybe I learn a little everyday and the rest will come in time.

    Also regarding the email I received I haven’t replied like I normally would and I realise I am not holding back because I want to play games but because I think this experience has made me rethink this guy. Like I said to my friend earlier today a guy who respects you wouldn’t leave you feeling like that over something and nothing so I kind of feel like a hypocrite to get excited and reply just because he got back to me…..well not even so much a hypocrite as annoyed…really annoyed….just who does he think he is making me feel bad….I was healing myself the Rori way and now he gets in touch after I decided to hear his message….!! Well this is great for me….it’s opened my eyes so much….as for him maybe not so good because I just arranged a date like Rori says!! I’ll sleep so good tonight…!!

  162.  #162mackenzie on May 26, 2010 at 8:35 pm

    Wonder Woman…Yayyyyy!!!! I’m so glad you liked the posts because it felt harsh to write it but I felt you really needed to hear that stuff and I said it because I care about you and your well-being. I know because I AM IN YOUR SAME SPOT. That’s why I felt so strongly. These changes are hard to make but they really do so much good. We both know only too well that our current ways of doing things are not working. And, I agree it’s weird/hard when the guy you wanted shows up because you are using the tools and now you see him differently. Again, I am in the same spot. But, I do also have a new guy that loves me to death and cares about me the way a guy should (the tools DO work). Now, I am on to a new problem as I don’t know how to handle it. But that is for a different day….

  163.  #163Brenda on May 27, 2010 at 9:10 am

    Jeannette girl, #84 & #159 – on Dating Married Men

    Are you asking if you should tell a man you dated a married man in the past? If so, I feel you have a right to privacy. You don’t HAVE to bare your soul from the door. It’s wonderful to bare your soul, as in unzip your heart. But that is something many people would judge and look down on.

    I am way too glib on this site, and I know it, since anyone could find this stuff. But I will confess anyway that, altho I didn’t date a married man, I was in love with him, and I knew the feeling was mutual. He communicated thru touch and sight. He never touched me sexually, but it was the way he touched my hands and the way he hugged me and the way he looked at me and the way he said, “Brenda, I appreciate you.” that I knew he wished he was single and that if he was, I knew that I would be his wife. He remains the man I respect and admire above all others, my role model for an ideal husband. But I left him in my past because he already had a life and already had a wife. It was heartbreaking to walk away, but I did it for his sake.

    While I was in the thick of my feelings for him, I shared with a minister, by way of asking for counsel. I got such a condemning, harsh email from him that I never associated with that minister again.

    I decided from that very hurtful experience that it’s no one’s business that I had feelings for a married man that never went anywhere. If I feel a level of EMOTIONAL SAFETY, I will share it. If I am in a relationship with a man and we are going to marry, I will share it, because I want NO secrets from my future husband.

    I believe healthy boundaries go hand-in-hand with unzipping your heart.

  164.  #164Jeannette on May 27, 2010 at 10:33 am

    Brenda, when I dated a married man he told me the divorce was imminent and in fact it happened. They weren’t together as a couple any more. Today, I would never even date a man who tells me he is going through one. For several reasons…it’s not morally sound, there is always a chance for reconciliation and a persons emotions are all over the chart at that point and they don’t know what they’re doing. To be honest, I have changed so much, I don’t know if there is ever cause to tell a future husband about it, not because I would be afraid so much as I would not want to disappoint him. People’s emotions are very tender. I am very sorry I dated a married man who was not completed with his divorce. I feel I will never make the choice to do that again. I hurt myself most of all by doing that. I don’t want to hurt anyone again including myself. Life is about choices and I want to think I am in the business of making good ones that will effect me and my children in a positive way. The one thing though….say I later hook up with this man I was telling you about as in marriage the one from entry #84. I just don’t like keeping secrets. But I know it will hurt him if I tell him because he is a very sensitive and moral man.

  165.  #165Brenda on May 27, 2010 at 10:47 am

    Jeannette, I respect and agree with your not wanting to date a married or soon-to-be-divorced man again. For me, even tho a lot of people may not understand this, it was done in innocence. He was a leader, and a lot of people, including myself, looked up to him. When he started flirting outrageously with me, I think I tried to reason it out. I reasoned that he would not do that unless he was planning to get a divorce. I added up different actions of his, such as not sitting with his wife in public; introducing me to his parents, etc, as being indicators that he was secretly in the process of a divorce. I reasoned that he would not tell anyone, not even me, because being a public figure as a leader, he wouldn’t want gossip about it until it was finalized.

    This all sounds very naive to me now, reading my own reasoning. But I was even more emotionally needy than I am now, and the attention of such a wonderful leader was a world-rocking shift to a woman who had spent her life dating inmates and people on disability. Just his esteem of me helped heal my self-image more than anything else. I suddenly saw myself in his eyes, and I realized all the naysayers my whole life had taken their toll on my self-respect.

    All that to say I was incapable of thinking much further than that, at that stage of my inner growth. I was just feeding like a starving puppy on the nurture and attention from this highly-respected man. Nothing else was in perspective.

    I want to be transparent to the man I marry. I would never want for some negative detail of my life to come out later and in some unsavory way. I’d rather he learn it from me myself, even if it were hurtful to him as a sensitive and moral man. This is vulnerability, unzipping your heart. I wouldn’t want to share something like that tho until I felt trust and a second level commitment from the current man I loved.

  166.  #166Simply Shannon on May 27, 2010 at 10:55 am

    Jeanette: I wholeheartedly agree with Brenda. She’s given some great advice. For me, I’ve worked really hard at trying to forgive myself for the things I’ve done in the past. And I don’t want to hide those things either. So you were involved with a married man. You feel bad about. You’ve accepted your part in it and created a new boundary. Any man who loves you will love all of you. If a man dumped you because you dated a married man in your past, he isn’t worth keeping anyway. Make sense? Like that would just be an excuse for why he doesn’t want to be with you. If you were actively dating a married man, that’s a whole other ball of wax.

    Truthfully though, maybe that’s his boundary (not dating a woman who would date a married man). Sometimes people just don’t match up. And that’s okay. The guy who is meant for you won’t have that hangup.

  167.  #167Brenda on May 27, 2010 at 11:04 am

    Jeannette, here’s a related example.

    Last year, I was in an exclusive relationship with Ryan. Altho he rarely discussed important things directly, indirectly, he made it very clear that he expected any woman he committed to to be totally exclusive with him and to not cheat in any way. I really respected his purity and openness in that area, because he also shared his sexual and relational history with me.

    So even tho I knew it was very important to him, I shared with him my sordid past of going to sex clubs, etc. Right about the time Ryan and I were getting very intimate and deepening our friendship, at a very delicate time, Kenny, my exhusband, was taken out of solitary confinement in prison and put in with the regular population. As he got back phone calls, he started wanting me to have phone sex, as we always had, and he wanted me to send personal pictures. He had been deprived of all this for 11 months in solitary confinement, in addition to already being deprived of a normal relationship with a woman in the free world.

    I had phone sex with Kenny once, even tho my heart wasn’t in it, just because I knew what he had just gone thru in solitary. Then he pressured me again for it next time he called. I protested, and he made me feel bad until I caved in. That time, it was 9:15 am, and I was expecting Ryan at 10 am.

    Ryan tried to call me to ask me if he could come early, but I was on the phone with Kenny, so I let it go to voicemail. I was in the thick of phone sex with Kenny when he walked in (we had already established he was welcome to walk in any time without knocking, and he even had my key). I heard him only in time to throw blankets over myself.

    Ryan layed down on the bed next to me, and my face must have been bright red. I couldn’t tell Kenny what was happening. I just did my best to put my clothes on under the blankets throughout the rest of the call. Ryan respectfully hid his eyes, even tho he had seen me naked before.

    I didn’t know what to do. So for a few days, I did nothing. Ryan tested me a few times to see how I would be with other men. Finally my conscience was bothering me so bad I called a meeting with Ryan.

    I told him what I had done and why I had done it, apologizing. Even tho it was a major issue to him, he forgave us. I believe my utter honesty won me deeper closeness and trust with Ryan.

    Just as that wound down, a few weeks later, Kenny began to pressure me for personal pictures. He didn’t believe me that Ryan knew what was going on, and he poo-phood the whole thing as trite. He became irrationally angry when I refused to send him personal pictures, telling him I was exclusive with Ryan and Ryan’s trust was more important to me than anything.

    Kenny went ballistic, even threatening Ryan. I was going on vacation for 1.5 weeks, and I thot it was only right to warn Ryan. To be forewarned is to be fore-armed.

    So the night before I left on my trip, I told Ryan gut level what was going on, that Kenny was angry that I wouldn’t send personal photos. You want to talk about vulnerable?? I was so scared I would lose Ryan. I had lost a man in the past who was intimidated that I had a friend in prison.

    But Ryan took it in stride, and again, I believe it bonded us closer in the long term. It built trust. I don’t want any secrets from my man. Secrets separate. I want utter intimacy.

  168.  #168Brenda on May 27, 2010 at 11:15 am

    Here’s another thought…Christian Carter talks about making a “second commitment”. That’s when a man is so in love with you that he stays with you even when he knows all your faults.

    I used to tell a man the worst of my worst when I first started to date him. I reasoned if he was going to reject me, I wanted him to reject me up front, before I got too emotionally invested in him.

    Later, I realized I was in error. Up front, a relationship really doesn’t exist. It’s something you build from the ground up. Up front, it’s valid and valuable to present my best self. Then little by little, as the bond of trust and love grows stronger, the relationship is strong enuff to handle the wear and tear of mistakes and shortcomings.

  169.  #169Jeannette on May 27, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    Brenda and Simply Shanon, thanks again for the input. Can I ask you a question Brenda? Can I ask you why you broke up with Ryan? I have discovered that in the many years of being in relationships, sometimes men will tell you they understand when you divulge certain things, but they don’t always feel the emotions until much later after the conversation. But I do agree, true intimacy is when you really should be able to tell all. But, how does my past relate to him? If I’ve forgiven myself, why would I want to hurt him and remind myself of hurtful things I’ve done? Shouldn’t I feel I have a clean slate? What is the point in sharing, unless like you said, something could be said later. But still, it did not involve him. Do you see what I mean?

  170.  #170Brenda on May 27, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    Hi Jeannette, I think you have a good point. You don’t NEED to tell him. If it comes up or becomes relevant, I would, if it were me. For example, when I was getting to know Ryan, he had a very pure view of romance. He told me his dating past and asked me about mine. I told him about the sex clubs cuz he asked. He didn’t ask me for fine detail, and I could tell it troubled him…he kind of looked away, cuz what I did was immoral. So I didn’t go into fine detail of every man I was with at the place and all I did. But I feel I would have been holding back intimacy if I hadn’t asked him. Ideally, I think he wanted to meet and marry a virgin. I think he decided it was all right that I wasn’t one. It did mean a lot to him when I told him I was a virgin until I was 34.

    My relationship ended with him, or started to end, when he totally led me on for a fake proposal last July. He gave me every reason to believe he was on the verge of asking me to marry him, even borrowing a ring of mine for a couple weeks, presumably to size an engagement ring.

    Then (and there is more detail I already shared elsewhere on here) he said, “It’s just a friendship. I’m not in love with you.” It was the most hurtful thing I ever went thru, because all my love, hopes, and dreams were at their height. It was like he cut my heart out.

    I don’t know what all he was thinking, but I think his purpose was to see if I was really in love with him. He was extremely distrustful and he tested me to prove everything I told him.

    I still tried to make the relationship work after that, but my trust was gone. I am still not fully recovered, but at least now I can walk around with a smile on and not feel the constant pain of dragging around a shredded heart.

    After that, at every turn, he kept hurting me. If I did or said something he didn’t like, he would punish me, apparently. For example, I told him, after being exclusive, that I was going to continue to date until I had a ring on my finger. In response, he created a beautiful, romantic evening with me. We made out on the sofa, then moved to the bed. We never had sex, but he pleasured me and stayed until I fell asleep.

    A week later, we were at the library, and he gave me every reason to believe we were going to have another romantic evening when we went home. Instead, he threw a curve at the last minute, saying he needed to go home and get to bed early cuz he had to wake up early. He left abruptly…no hug, no explanation of why he had led me on again.

    I felt angry and disappointed. I called him and expressed my feelings. He said he was sick of my issues (that he was creating, hello!!) and he needed some time away from me.

    That was the beginning of November. Since then, we have had almost nothing but contact by text. That has fizzled into nothing.

    I have a feeling he’ll be back. He’s not all bad.

  171.  #171Jeannette on May 27, 2010 at 1:15 pm

    Rori, when in your opinion is the right time to tell a man about your past? There’s so many options. I could tell him later as the relationship progresses and he could come back at me with, “How come you did not tell me sooner?” Could you tell me what is you opinion about what me and Brenda and Simply Shannon have been discussing here? Thanks Rori!

  172.  #172Jeannette on May 27, 2010 at 7:56 pm

    Guys, my guy friend came by tonight. He told me he is going to miss me this week-end because he’s going up north with some friends. I was invited but it was just 3 days ago and I made other plans. The friends place he is going to is owned by a husband, his wife and they have 2 children. My b’friend has 1 son who is going. I asked him tonight who all is going and he said just the mother and him and their 3 children. Her husband isn’t going because he has to work, he’s a doctor. He is a moral man and they are all just friends, but I am having a issue with him going up with another woman if her husband isn’t also going. I guess it’s the principle. How can I put this to him without him taking offense?

  173.  #173Rori Raye on May 28, 2010 at 9:32 am

    Hi – I want to weigh in here on the “baring your soul” conversation – actually – “baring your past.” Jumping off…Love, Rori

  174.  #174Brenda on May 28, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Rori, I’m not sure what you mean. Yes, it’s baring your past. Altho I change over time, isn’t my past a part of my identity? Are you saying it’s good or bad to bare your past? I believe what happened in the past is part of what shapes who I am. How do you feel about that?

  175.  #175Brenda on May 28, 2010 at 11:27 am

    Jeannette, RE: #172 – Maybe, “I feel weird about you going with just your friend’s wife and the kids. What do you think?” Then go from there, depending on how he responds.

  176.  #176Rori Raye on May 28, 2010 at 12:40 pm

    Brenda – no rules about what you share with a man…it’s the WHY of why you do it. Are you feeling compelled to “confess”? Or does it just feel good to get close – does the way he RESPONDS make you feel good? These are the questions to ask. Love, Rori

  177.  #177Brenda on May 28, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Rori, thank you! Your emotional vision is 20:20! That helps!

  178.  #178Jeannette on May 28, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    GIrls, where do I find what Rori is talking about in entry #173, ‘Baring Your past’?

  179.  #179Daria on May 28, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    Jeannette – Rori said she’s jumping off, meaning she’s going to write a post about it. Also, she answered to Brenda right above at 176, which may help as well.

  180.  #180Jeannette on May 28, 2010 at 7:11 pm

    Thanks Daria, I will look for the post when it comes around.

  181.  #181Jeannette on May 29, 2010 at 3:13 pm

    Rori, is ‘Your Baring the Past’ post up and where do I find it? I am still searching for answers.

  182.  #182Jeannette on May 30, 2010 at 9:32 am

    Hi guys, My ex just called, he always calls me on holiday week-ends….I sort of wish he would give it up if he does not talk about missing me or getting back together. I was not going to pick up the phone but I was on the other line with my sis so it couldn’t go into my answering machine and I wanted to hear what he had to say. Oh well….just, ‘how are you, hows your family etc. etc…..’ This would have been the week end he usually comes up to see me. He is down south. He has come up the last 2 Memorial Day weekends. I HATE NOSTALIGIA

  183.  #183Cherie on December 1, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    Aaaaarrrggghh! I had things going so well … CD has been kicking in for me and I started to feel like it really was raining men!!! I was just feeling happier in myself, thinking about other people and opportunities and not obsessing about the man I’ve been seeing the past 3 months. Then what happens, he is opening up to me, telling me how much he likes me, appreciates things I do … then saying he has been talking about me to his friends. He is using the word love … not I love you … but “I love you for the way you …. “whatever it is … or “I love that about you”. And I am just totally falling for it. But it is still on his terms, the time he spends with me. He is still caught up with ex-wife on weekends. He liked my roast lamb last week and somehow turned a visit last night into me making risotto. I love making food for him but I know this is meaning I am doing more than he is! I have to stop that. Then he said oh he could see me this weekend, but doesn’t know what he’s doing Saturday night … probably be with his daughters. Saturday nights have been my sore point with him … he rarely spends with me. He said he’d see me Friday night. Well I had made a date for Friday night … with a french man who I have not met yet, but adore his accent when he talks on phone to me. So what do I do? postponed Frenchie … by text. Dumb hey?

  184.  #184chronic overfunctioner on August 9, 2011 at 7:29 pm

    I think I did it ladies! I used the tools and found out I was better off without the relationship I was working so hard for…and then he showed up….the BETTER man. He was like a fairy tale or at least a romantic comedy movie. I had the best first date. And now I haven’t heard from him all evening. I get the feeling he doesn’t initiate conversation and is waiting on me. Would starting a conversation count as over functioning even if he is completely engaged in the conversation after I start it?

  185.  #185Femininewoman on August 9, 2011 at 7:46 pm

    RE 184 If he had a good time, he might be wary of seeming weak or too eager so he might even take up to 3 days to contact you. I would lean back. If he comes towards you, you know he wants to be there.

  186.  #186Rori Raye on August 9, 2011 at 8:49 pm

    chronic – your mind is trying to make up reasons to overfunction here. Don’t do it. See what he does. Give him a chance to show up. Love, Rori

  187.  #187Amanda S. on March 15, 2012 at 8:42 pm

    I messed up and let my date see me handle money (for a hotel room), which I’ve heard Rori say turns you into a “friend” in his mind.
    I hope this isn’t too late to remedy…been waiting for a call from him for a week and a half since, no such luck. getting anxious and lonely.
    Need to stop laser-focusing but I do it so well and it’s tough to stop. I just want to know I didn’t screw up so royally he’ll never call again….or that he’s not so put off he changed his mind….

  188.  #188Popsicletoes53 on November 1, 2012 at 7:30 am

    At one time I had a PhD in over functioning. It has gotten better over time but not till I read the e-book and became aware of what I was doing to “him” and to me.

    I have done a small postmortem on my last two relationships that fizzled out..and realized that I could have done things differently, more healthily for myself.. I don’t think it would have changed the outcome.. but my self esteem would not have been as affected.

    Now with new man I am working “the program” vigorously and am seeing positive results especially with the feeling messages and leaning back.

    But I am having a bit of a problem… I hear from him so much.. and I get mixed up sometimes and get lost in the dialogue… does that mean I am not over functioning? I just don’t want to interact with him so much with the feeling messages that I become over functioning with feeling messages..

    Anyone have this problem?

  189.  #189f on December 24, 2012 at 4:45 am

    Rori I think overfunctioning and facing the underneath emotions in this article and your hold on to your heart article on the be his heart beat article september 5 2012 are amazing – it’s just I find the holding on to my heart hard to do – not just with men but with anyone! If I directed all that energy to me I’d be the most successful person on the planet. I understand the concept but can you help with the steps?

  190.  #190Rori Raye on December 24, 2012 at 7:04 pm

    f, welcome, and thank you for your comment and your clear understanding of what this is about….how about you start just imagining literally holding onto your heart. Holding it in your hand, loving it, taking care of it. See how that feels, and then try another bit of paying attention to yourself and loving yourself – perhaps to some thoughts you have, feelings you have….Love, Rori